Ep. 3 - From Hearing Metal in Pakistan to Studying Law in the States: Music as a Trusted Co-Pilot - A Life in Six Songs

Episode Transcript
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Raza (00:00):
When the idea of immigrating to the states came
up, it was all oh, the land ofmusic.
You know it's like thepossibilities are going to be
endless.
You know it wasn't.
You know it's going to be astruggle, or the finances and
sort of the real life stuff.
It was just like great, I getto watch Night Rider all the
time.

David (00:56):
Hey everyone, welcome to A Life in Six Songs.
I'm your host, David Reese, andI'm joined by my co-host,
Carolina, who also happens to bemy wife and my childhood friend
, Raza.
For those of you new to thepodcast, each week we embark on
an epic adventure to find thesongs that are stuck to us like
audible tattoos, that tell thestory of who we are and where

(01:18):
we've been.
It's a life story told throughsix songs.
Let's go have a listen together.
So for this episode, we're inour third episode and you know
we've kicked this podcast off bylearning more about myself in
the first episode, Carolina inthe last episode, and so this

(01:38):
week we're going to round outour stories of our hosts and
we're going to tell Raza's story.
So Raza is a lawyer and veteranadvocate.
He started, he's a musician andstarted by playing drums in
high school and then switchedafter high school to guitar.

(01:58):
I wanted to write you know moremusic and be able to kind of
compose in that way, and has asolo project out there that
we'll get in and talk more about.
So lamente.
And so we're just, you know,happy to have them on today and
share this story, so yay.

Raza (02:21):
Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Carolina (02:24):
Welcome to your own show, Raza.
Welcome to your own show yes,yes, love this team.

David (02:30):
Love the team.
That's right.
Here we go, so so to kick usoff before we get into your six
songs, why don't you tell us youknow a little bit about your
earliest music memory?

Raza (02:46):
Yeah, you know, as you know, I mean I've been sort of a
lifelong fan of music ingeneral and maybe some of the
heavier stuff you know and that.
That.
That goes back to all the wayback to you know my earliest
memory, which is probably maybethree, four, five years old.
I was born in Pakistan.
I grew up in Pakistan.

(03:07):
My family was always there, wasmusic always playing in the
house.
We had sort of an appreciationfor art and music and all the
sort of you know humanities andand politics and things like
that in the house.
And yeah, my earliest memory ismy dad blasting.
You know Pink Floyd in thehouse.
You know another brick in thewall, the Star Wars soundtrack.

(03:32):
You know a lot of the localsort of folk.
You know Pakistani music aswell.
The Beatles I mean the Beatlesreferences were, were going on
all the time and then he wouldtalk about things like to this
day actually, my dad is.
I realized, you know, manyyears later they were.

(03:53):
You know there's a term forthat.
He's a, he's an audiophile.
He loved talking about musicand sort of like the engineering
and physics of the science ofmusic, how sound works and the
difference between you know monoand stereo and surround sound
and and you know when you hearcertain things in certain spaces
.
So yeah, there was anappreciation of music at a very

(04:14):
early age and yeah, and that Ithink you know I sort of learned
about, about that and became apart of me and it's been ever
since.
I mean we immigrated to theStates when I was about 10 years
old and you know my, my, mytastes in music might have
changed and shifted.
I'm much more of a filter nowand I and I still appreciate

(04:38):
music and nerd out on music andnow we can talk about, you know,
sort of technical aspects ofmusic and time signatures and
tempos and things like that.
But yeah, earliest memory isjust music in the house all the
time.

Carolina (04:51):
That's so cool.
When your childhood is filledwith with those kinds of things.
We don't realize how, how muchit leaves an impression on us
and at the time you probablydidn't know you'd be immigrating
to a whole other country andyou know like what that would
open up for you to.

Raza (05:08):
Yeah yeah.
And one of the I remember Imean probably closer to this was
like in the late 80s I wouldsay 8788 or so when the idea of
immigrating to the States cameup.
It was all oh, the land ofmusic.
You know it's like thepossibilities are going to be
endless.
You know it wasn't.
You know it's going to be astruggle, or the finances and

(05:29):
sort of the real life stuff.
It was just like great.
I get to watch Night Rider allthe time and you know all this
stuff that you see on TV thatAmerica is known for.
Mtv was big back then and yeahyeah, no, it was, it was.
It was all about theentertainment and pop culture
and getting closer to it.

David (05:49):
Nice.
Did you know that, like your,your home life had this special
quality to it of being, just,you know, surrounded by music?
Like did you did?
You know did.
Were you aware it was a thing?
Because a lot of times whenyou're young You're not aware
that your household is sort ofanything special, because you're

(06:10):
not sure exactly what goes onanother, so you just assume like
well, we do this and so yeah,doesn't everybody do it like
this.
Were you aware that this wassomething like special?

Raza (06:19):
Oh my gosh, yeah, no, such a great question that this is
stuff that I've been sort ofgrappling with actually as an
adult now, like you know, likeafter you get married and after
you have your own household andthings like that I had at the
time I thought that was the norm.
It was the norm that you livein an amazing big, you know

(06:39):
multi story house and you havepeople with multiple vehicles,
like the equivalent of beingbougie, right, that's, we
weren't sort of bougie inPakistan.
I was a city, you know.
I grew up in the city in thefirst place.
It's the second largest city inPakistan, which is figured like
Chicago, you know, like NewYork, but Chicago.

(07:00):
And and, yeah, you know, wewould sort of have intellectual
debates about everything frompolitics to to to, you know,
welfare states and socialism andcapitalism and things like that
.
And there was the 80s were big.
There's a lot of turmoil goingon in the world, obviously.
We all sorts of stuff going on,but so those types of debates I

(07:21):
thought were the norm.
I didn't realize that no, thiswe're a very, very small, small
minority of people that are that, that have.
You know that have privilege isthe right word.
We weren't like, we weren'tlike super wealthy, but you know
, we had.
We had a home and we had thebasic amenities and things like

(07:42):
that.
So, yeah, I didn't realize thateven that is an exception,
because Pakistan is a country ofabout 200 million people and
the vast majority, you know,unfortunately, are they're not
doing well.
It's an agricultural basedeconomy and there's tons of
illiteracy and tons of socialproblems and things like that

(08:03):
and we're actually very lucky.
So I realized that and then,you know, I definitely have been
grateful for that, but at thetime had no idea, had no idea
that going to polo clubs was thenorm and you know hanging out
and and you know talking shopabout, you know the various
types of teas and and the cutsof meat, you know.

(08:23):
But yeah, that's, that's that'show we grew up.
Our real struggle started whenwe came to America.
Actually, then we realized, ohcrap, well, electricity is cheap
, but you know the salami not somuch.

David (08:40):
Let's get into your, into your songs.
That very much sort of sets thestage for us.
And so you know, for for yourfirst song, we've talked about
how you know, growing up in ahouse that just so appreciates
music, and it's just, it's justthere and you can, you can put

(09:01):
yourself there.
You know, tell us, tell usabout a time and a song that you
know when you hear ittransports you instantly to a
specific time or place.

Raza (09:14):
Yeah, so you know, we, we immigrated to the states.
You know we flew into JFK andthen the year was 1990.
You know, we had our sort ofgreen cards in hand, all the
promise of America, you know,before us and from New York.
Very, very quickly after thatwe moved to South Florida and I

(09:36):
just remember it being hot andmore hot.
You know you're trying to findyour way in school and making
friends and things like that andfast forward, I would say maybe
six months or so.
Summer of 1991 Terminator 2comes out.
It's the biggest movie you knowat the time, revolutionary, all

(09:57):
kinds of great like sci fi, andyou know action and violence
and things like that.
I had no idea about the movieother than you know watching MTV
is this amazing drum fillhappens and this guy's
screeching voice you knowblaring through my TV and it's

(10:18):
guns and roses and the song isyou Could Be Mine and that is
the soundtrack of us arriving inAmerica.
As far as I'm concerned, Nice,let's take a listen.

Carolina (11:03):
Yeah.

Raza (11:11):
Yep, I hear that and I hear you know Fort Lauderdale,
florida, terminator 2.
I watched it like three or fourtimes in the theaters with my
friends and and, yeah, love thatsong and that.
That.
That that song was was sort ofthe transition into just a
lifelong love of guns and roses.

(11:32):
And the funny thing is is that Iheard heavy music, metal in in
Pakistan through some of mycousins and stuff like that.
You know some stuff you justgravitate toward and oh, the
cousins, yep, oh man, yeah, youknow, and it's like I heard run

(11:52):
the MC through them, I heardsalt and pepper through them, I
heard you know local, you knowPakistani music through them.
But then the stuff that justhappened to resonate was like
drums, guitars, bass and reallyloud, screamy vocals.
I don't know why.
That's just that's what Ireally idol I heard, you know
quite right was I heard quiteriot in 84.

(12:12):
I mean, I'm four years old.
I'm like this is amazing and sowhen we move, when we move to
the States, you know it was alllike MC Hammer and vanilla ice.
I'm just like, okay, where isthis the stuff that I remember
that I'm like, you know, I'mkind of yearning for you know
where's the guitars and drumsand all the heavy, heavy shit?

(12:33):
And then this was it.
And then and and that was like,oh, alright, so it's called
hard rock, guns and roses.
And then, like sort of thefloodgates open at that point of
heavy music and it also it likefiltered out.
A lot of people in my life atthe time was just like, oh, if
you like guns and roses and youknow the foul mouthed axle rose

(12:53):
and all that, we want anythingto do with you.
I was like good, I don't wantanything to do with you either.
I was just about to ask how didyou view that?

David (13:01):
because it's sort of like , I think, at that age, right
when middle school, high schoolage, you're so it's this weird
combination of wanting to standout and be your own person but
also not be isolated, right?
So it's like I don't want to beyou, but I also don't want to
be just alone.
I got to find my people and Ifeel like, yeah, like you said,

(13:23):
the music we listen to, the waywe dress, helps us identify
who's our, who's our people.

Raza (13:29):
Yeah, yeah, no, totally, especially at that age, right, I
mean, I was what, 1112, when,when, when, when, when GNR was
was when when this song came, Iwas like 11 years old, late
middle school I think, and yeah,I don't know.
I think it was one of thosethings where I'm I was okay, I

(13:50):
was okay being myself in the waythat, look, if, if, if guns and
roses is wrong.
I don't want to be right.
It was kind of one of thosethings.

David (14:05):
So it's like and that's got to be on a t shirt trademark
.
That's coming to t shirt.

Raza (14:13):
Yeah, I think that you know, it was kind of a way to
filter out certain people and Inever judged other people and I
was just like you know, dude,listen to whatever you listen to
.
This is the stuff that I like,and I just happened to get in
touch with people that were alsointo that, you know, and then
you just kind of make friends.
That was some people.
Just, I knew that I wasn't anextreme either way, but it's

(14:36):
just like, dude, it's on MTV,it's like the most popular band,
it can't be that bad.
I mean, come on, you know, andthen you realize, oh, people
that have really extreme viewsabout this type of music,
whether it's the lyrics orwhatever else, or, or you know
people from my part of the world.
You realize, okay, look, ifyou're taking it, it's
entertainment.
If you're taking it thatseriously, then again it's you,

(14:58):
do you?
I'm okay enjoying the stuffthat I like enjoying.
So it made me happy.

Carolina (15:06):
Yeah, I think like such an interesting thing about
that particular time those likelate 80s, early 90s and sort of
the the advent of music videos,was this like merge between
music videos and movies that youdon't really see anymore, so
like a mute.
If if a song was on the scoreto a movie, that music video

(15:27):
would have like a ton of clipsfrom the movie.
Music videos today seem to bemore like detached from whatever
possible score and I rememberwatching the music video for
this and the CGI.
That was like coming of agewith Terminator two, you know
when, when the other robot meltsinto that like that metallic, I

(15:49):
was like what the fuck did theyjust?
How did they do that?
right, yeah a few years ago,david and I watched Terminator
one again, just for kicks, andit was hilarious, like the CGI,
like that is terrible.
But by the time Terminator twocame out like it was wicked,
impressive and then put guns androses behind it and like it was

(16:10):
just like one of those likeepic blockbuster movie type with
all the music and everythingthat comes with it.
So it's hard to hate the songand not like you know associate
it with the film that it's in.

Raza (16:23):
And that music video in particular was amazing too,
because Arnold's in the video,so it's like a storyline within
the storyline, which is that sohe shows up at a guns and roses
concert.
You know, hunting down you know, or protecting, depending on
whatever you know right rightthe role right, but he's so he's
hunting down the band.

(16:44):
Basically, you know, throughoutthe song and they've got like
concert footage likeinterspersed, and then at the
very end there's a cameo whereit's like Terminator and he
finds support.
Basically, he finds the bandand he's sort of analyzing them
and you can see like hisTerminator, I you know,
identifying Axl Rose and Slashand Matt Sorum, and there's like

(17:06):
a cheeky factor as well.
Is there's really just you know, yeah, it was a good time, the
90s were great.

Carolina (17:14):
It was a good time.
I think the kid in the moviewas roughly like our age or
older to and kind of a punkrebel and like Linda Hamilton
from a woman in moviesperspective, how like strong she
was and fit and like this likefighter it was, it was.
It was all really bad it wasepic, all of it Music included.

Raza (17:37):
My dad, so you know, speaking of music in the
households again.
So loved the movie and it'slike, dad it's, it's got
violence, like foul language andall this other stuff is like,
yeah, but the music productionwas bloody amazing.
When you hear the HarleyDavidson, it goes from the right
to the left.
It is studio for it.

(17:57):
I loved it.
I loved it, you know.

Carolina (18:01):
And he had to love it.

Raza (18:04):
Oh man, he's still to this day, you know, you know kind of
love him.
He's, he's got, he's anaudiophile he just loves.
You know the way music and Ithink it's more even not even
music but sound, how soundtravels and and you know, the
bass has its place and thetrebles have their place and the
mids have their place, and so,yeah, I definitely got a lot of

(18:24):
that super nerdy stuff from him.
So, yeah, that's awesome.

David (18:30):
When do we have in your dad on the show then?

Raza (18:33):
Oh yeah, say the word, I'll make some phone calls.

David (18:37):
That'd be awesome.

Carolina (18:38):
Yeah.

David (18:40):
All right.
So you know that that wholediscussion, just you know,
illustrates how the power ofmusic to kind of put us right
back in a place, right, justimmediately, before we even
aware of it, right, you hear thedrums kicking on that song and

(19:00):
boom, you know exactly where youare and all of that you know.
For, for this next song andquestion, you know, tell us,
tell us a story about a timewhere you know a song was just
intimately connected with achallenging time or difficult

(19:22):
situation.

Raza (19:24):
Yeah, well, you know I think I would say probably you
know the typical immigrant story, which is that you know you
come to America and then thisland of opportunity and have all
these sort of expectations andand and anyway, I mean the stuff
that you think will happen endsup not happening.

(19:46):
Or there's challenges and youknow whether this challenges
with families and things likethat, you know had family
members that passed away and youknow, you know, you know you're
not going to be able to do that.
You know we had our own sort ofinternal, you know struggles
and you know finding your placeand financial and the typical,
again, immigrant stuff.
You know working parents andand and then for me, myself and
my siblings, it's like the teenyears and you enter high school

(20:09):
and it's an awkward time.
It's you're figuring outyourself, you're figuring out
your, your sort of, you know,social group and also figuring
out that, well, you know, noteveryone likes guns and roses
and yeah so.
So around that time the chilipeppers were on their, the
breakthrough was blood sugar,sex and magic.
I purposely tried to stay awayfrom it because I knew that it

(20:33):
was really, really popular andand but.
But then, right after that,their follow up was with Dave
Navarro on guitar.
John Frichonti left or wasfired or whatever, and their
next album was called One HotMinute and, almost as an F?
You to everyone who liked thefirst album, was just like.
I'm going to really enjoy thisalbum and the song that really

(20:56):
did it for me was Aeroplane andfor some reason it's not their
biggest song.
It's definitely not one oftheir like top five, top 10,
even, but I loved it and yeah,that was a.
I always reminds me of thattime.

David (21:11):
Yeah, let's take a listen and we'll chat some more about
the difficulties on the otherside.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think thatsong works well for a potential

(21:55):
like kind of theme song, for youknow this podcast, right, music
is my aeroplane.
Right, we're talking about howI can take you somewhere, and so
where does this song take you?

Raza (22:07):
Yeah, I'm.
I'm instantly transported, youknow, to the high school years.
You know, those are, those are,they're always like sort of.
I guess that's what coming ofage is right.
It's a high school years iscoming of age.
You're in this weird spotbetween your minors.
You're not really an adult.
You're changing physically.

(22:28):
You know we change and you know, and there's there's a lot of
in our household.
I mean, you know, education wasalways that was sort of the
reason for coming to America islike you don't come here to swim
around, come here to, you know,to become something.
It's a land of opportunity andyour opportunity lies by the way

(22:51):
of you getting into a goodcollege Because you know those
types of.
I don't think we ever use theword stress in the house because
it's like what is stress?

Carolina (23:02):
Yeah.

Raza (23:03):
But yeah, it's like I'll show you real stress, you know.
But yeah, so high school wasdifficult and it was a difficult
four years and this song to mejust kind of epitomizes that.
I think I realized much laterthat, oh crap, yeah, my life is
spiked with pain and music is myairplane.
Like it's so simple.
I don't even think I put ittogether at the time, but yeah,

(23:26):
I.
This was my favorite chilipeppers album, still is, and the
song just transports me to, youknow, the 93 to 97 years.

Carolina (23:39):
Super cool.
I love the chili peppers.
It was funny you were talkingabout, like, not liking them
because they were popular or,like you know, their second
album and I remember also, youknow, coming from an immigrant
family no cursing loud at myhouse or anything but suck my
kiss off of their first album,it felt such like a greedy, like
indulgent pleasure to sing thatsong, you know, yeah, yeah,

(24:04):
yeah and I still listen to.

Raza (24:07):
so now I'm much more sort of, you know, I care less about
you know the popularity contestor whatever.
And I mean just from aproduction standpoint, not to
get super nerdy, but oh my God,rick Rubin killed it, killed it
on, on, on, on the like thedrums.
Chad Smith's drumming wouldn'tbe the same without Rick Rubin's
production Of that drumming.

(24:27):
And yeah, I mean, the band wason fire, but I just like, I'm
like I couldn't bring myself toadmit that.
I really like you know, underthe bridge and give it away and
like the video for give it awayto, oh my God, but then, yeah,
but then fast forward a coupleyears when, when one hot minute
came out, it was just, it wasslightly heavier.

(24:48):
And then I realized that, oh,they have another guitarist,
dave Navarro, and he came from.
He came from more of a rockschool than a, than a funk, funk
background, which is ironicallythe reason why they got rid of
them.
I was like man, I like, I likethe heavier chili peppers, but
that's okay, yeah.

Carolina (25:08):
Yeah, I also remember thinking like a lot of rock
bands and you know musiciansthat you follow are cool, right,
they're famous, they do thisthing, they create music for a
living.
And I remember feeling like thechili peppers, in particular,
were just super cool, likeAnthony Kitas and the way Flea
would play like I don't think Iever thought about the bass

(25:30):
before, you know, before Iwatched somebody like him like
tear it up on stage and thenAnthony Kitas and point break
yes, not associate them.
So I just thought likeindividually too, as as as
people they were all like justsuper interesting and cool, that
West Coast thing that we don'tget in South Florida.

David (25:52):
Right, yeah, that Southern California vibe, la
vibe, for sure, for sure.

Raza (25:59):
Remember years later watching there I think it was on
VH1 that behind behind themusic, one of the documentaries
and Flea going dude, we were LAto the bone.
I'm like oh yeah, I get it.

David (26:11):
Yeah, yeah, you just kind of like.
You look at them and you'relike yep.
Yep and that is that for sure,for sure.
Yeah, I think it's sointeresting with this song and
where it, where it places youand kind of talking about the
struggles of high school and andeven with the guns and roses
side of, like you know, we usemusic and things to kind of

(26:33):
define our identity in wayswho's my group, and inevitably
that means who's not in my group, right, and that sort of
division.
And in a lot of ways, it'salmost like I feel like you know
, the kind of one of themotivations behind doing this
podcast is to kind of get awayfrom the well, if I like this,
if I like rush, like I can'ttalk to you because you like

(26:57):
Beyonce or something like that,right, and it's sort of we grow
up in that that it's like, oh,if you like that, you're somehow
, you know, different than meand it's.
It just feels so much more likethere's more in common there.
Like you may not like the gunsand roses, you may not like the
Beyonce, but again, thatexperience, right, everybody
going through high school wasexperiencing that thing of like

(27:19):
what bands do you like?
What music do you like?
Are you into music or are younot really into music?
Are you more into somethingelse, and so again, I think it's
just another one of thoseexamples where you know
adulthood is working out thingsfrom your childhood.

Carolina (27:32):
Yeah.

Raza (27:33):
You know, I don't know if it's a South Florida thing or
what, because I've I'vedefinitely had conversations
with other people and and, andyou know, when they talk about
their high school years they'relike they're exactly as you're
saying, that if you're, you know, if you're a fan of band A,
then you by default are not fansof bands.
You know, b through Z orwhatever.
The case might be right, but Ialways found that I think maybe

(27:56):
I don't know if it's SouthFlorida thing if it was our
school in particular, we went toplantation high school and we
were the marching kernels andbut.
But I always thought that Ithink that our population was
generally really forgiving andopen, because I remember I
remember being friends withpeople who really liked my kind

(28:17):
of music, but also my bestfriends were.
They appreciated what I liked,but they weren't, like you know,
as crazy about the same bands.
They weren't other than beastieboys or you know whatever else,
the hip hop and, and that wasokay and but.
But as an adult I've had thesame conversations with other
people and they described theirhigh school years kind of like

(28:38):
you were saying that no, if youweren't you know this band, then
by default you were not intothat other band that you would
get beat up or you know whatever.
So I don't know.
I think maybe shout out toSouth Florida because our it was
such a melting pot and I knowfor a fact our school was very
very diverse, yeah, and I thinklike you know from from from you

(28:59):
guys's interviews as well.
it's like you know, I mean, dave, you love, I didn't, I didn't
realize you love hip hop as muchas you did, just based on your
90s.
You know references along withRush and that's okay and and I
think that's really sort of itspeaks a lot to where we grew up
and I'm really kind of inhindsight, I'm really
appreciative of it and and andI'm glad that we were really

(29:21):
were so, because a lot of peoplehad it, you know, super worse
than they had their sort ofpigeonhole area.
Yeah, yeah I don't think we werelike that.

Carolina (29:31):
Yeah, you know what that's bringing up for me and
we've had, for some reason I'vehad a couple conversations this
week about generations.
Yeah, what generation we fallin.
You know my mom is actuallyvisiting right now.
We're explaining to her that.
You know she's a baby boomer.
You know that kind of stuff.
Our kiddos, gen Z, and I wasexplaining to some other folks

(29:51):
what a zenial is, the, the, thatlittle micro generation of what
is it?
David 1970.

David (29:57):
I think it's 1977 to 1982 .
To 1982.

Carolina (30:00):
Birth years and our specific relationship with, like
analog versus technology andthings like that, and it's
almost making me wonder if it'sa generational thing that, like
we were being introduced to allkinds of new things at that
coming of age time, grunge as anew genre of music, technology,

(30:23):
cds, like maybe we were, just asa consequence of that
environment, more open minded.

David (30:30):
I went to a.

Carolina (30:31):
Catholic high school.
So not not a large school likelike Plantation Ones.
I went to St Thomas Aquinas,but but you know, even there too
not a lot of like pigeonholingaround music.
Our parties were pretty diverse, like yeah, no, it was.
It was a little more openminded than I think.
I hear about other generations.

(30:52):
I'm wondering if it's that.

Raza (30:55):
Mm.
Hmm, we definitely have accessto more information than anybody
else Right.
Yeah, I don't know.
It's like that force gumpreference, right.
It's like I don't know if it'sif it's destiny or if it's or if

(31:15):
it's intentional, but but thenthe force comp answers that it's
a little bit of both.
It's like I don't know whyThings happen the way they do,
but you know it could be a mixof of, you know, intent and also
just completely random stuff.
Why did the feather fall righton his, on his shoe?

(31:37):
Oh my God, so many 92references.

David (31:43):
Putting us, putting us right there in in the Zennial
Zennial.

Raza (31:49):
Zennial, yeah, zennial.

David (31:52):
And then Gen X and millennial together.

Carolina (31:54):
It's the overlap.

David (31:56):
Yeah, so speaking of perspectives and different
perspectives, and accepting themand embracing them or whatnot,
you know what is?
A song that you know exposedyou to just a new perspective.

Raza (32:16):
So, from a musical perspective, when I heard, I was
always, again, I was into sortof heavyish music.
I wasn't into like the extremestuff and all that you know,
sort of church burning, satanic,satanic, whatever, but I liked
heavy music but something wasmissing.

(32:36):
And when I heard typo negative,that changed everything from a
musical nerding out perspective,because their songs were long
and they were dark, which isessential, but also they just
went places.
I understood what a musicalcomposition is.

(32:58):
It's like you start here and itgoes there and it ends
somewhere else.
And their iconic, you know,Black Number One was my
introduction to that whole world.

David (33:11):
Nice, let's listen in.

Carolina (33:42):
For which he's dressed .
A perfume smells like burningleaves.
Every day is all alone.

David (34:09):
Yeah, you just hear his voice and it's just like like I
don't know how you hear thatvoice and aren't just like whoa,
like that's something.

Raza (34:22):
Yeah, you know, again back in the days of MTV, if you
watched the video, the musicvideo for this song, it was like
, oh my, okay, whoa, whoa, liketime out, right, yeah, it was
just it was.
It was like, okay, this, thisis just something completely
different and and it's dark andit's haunting and it's the music

(34:44):
videos.
Black and white is all justlike vampire shit going on, Long
black hair on like the men andthe women and just darkness.
But then there's melody andthere's keyboards and there's
like harpsichords and there'scobwebs in the video and it just
dude, it just, you know, lifechanging.

(35:07):
I was, I was 13 at the time, soI couldn't buy the album because
it had explicit, you know,content in it, so you know.
So I somehow I got, I got acopy of it and then you realize,
oh my God, there's this thingcalled a radio edit which takes
an 11 minute song and then, youknow, you kind of summarize it

(35:28):
back down to like three and ahalf, four minutes.
So I started nerding out onthat stuff.
I'm like, wow, you're allowedto have different versions of a
song.
How is this possible?
And then I remember someonementioned, oh well, you know,
the doors.
You know, they're like my fireis like a 12 minute song and
they basically told the radiostation that if you don't play

(35:48):
the full song, I'm not going to.
You have to play the full songor nothing.
And obviously, like my fire isone of the biggest.
You know, that's one of themost popular songs ever and yeah
.
So, yeah, I just completelychanged my perspective on music.
What's what is possible in amusical composition?
And, yeah, for many, many years, I mean until you know so,

(36:09):
peter Steele, the singer, died afew years ago and that was
effectively, you know, the endof typo.
But, yeah, man, love, love whatthey did there.
And there's still, you know, Ithink people hear them now and
go, oh wow, how did I miss this?
They're really, you know,they're like an iconic band and

(36:30):
for me it just just the wholecomposition aspect, just and
that.
That that's what kind ofinspired me to start paying
attention to production andwriting and it's what wanted me
to start writing my own stuff.
I'm like, well, if they can doit, so can I At least try it,
because it's not metallic, it'snot that difficult to play their

(36:50):
stuff, but, but, but it's,there's more, there's more
atmosphere to it, so it's cool.

Carolina (36:59):
I think so If you haven't watched any of our other
episodes.
I'm not the heavy metal fan ofthe three of the hosts, although
I strongly think now that youtwo are going to like steer me
that direction over time.
I'm sure you do so.
In researching your episode,raza, I watched the music video

(37:23):
and I was like I was blown awayby the details of it all.
Like his voice and I think youknow first of all the band name,
right, like clear reference toblood, and then the video.
It's not like if this guy, ifthere was an audio

(37:44):
personification of, like Dracula, it is his voice.
But I was also probably likevampire victim.
I was like drawn in.
I'm like staring the sound withwhich they engineered it.
You can hear him breathing.
You can hear him like takingbreaths and opening his mouth.
Like it just feels like areally primal experience

(38:08):
listening to it and I was likefully sucked in to the whole
song.
It was really, really cool.

Raza (38:15):
Yeah, thank you, thank you , yeah, no, I appreciate that,
that you appreciate all of that.
And obviously, you know, I meanit's when you take a step back
and look at it as asentertainment.
All of that is intentional,right, I mean they were
purposely playing, playing upthat imagery, and I mean full
disclosure.
Like the guy, he was like sixfoot seven, you know, fangs and

(38:42):
and he had the voice.
But then you realize, oh God,like these, these, these are
like four, four dudes fromBrooklyn, it's, you know, it's
like I've hung out with with,with the drummer, johnny, and
I've met the keyboard player andpassing, just, you know, as a
complete fanboy to this day, Ilove this man, I love what they

(39:03):
did, yeah, yeah, and you know,yeah, but Peter, you know he's a
brilliant composer of music.
The lyrics were amazing.
I remember there was, Iremember watching an interview
with, I think it was, trentResner, and someone asked hey,
so what are your goals for thenext, for the lyrics, for the

(39:24):
next album, whichever album theywere talking about, and he goes
yeah, my goal is to, is to notstart the next song with a word
I, like I did this, I am this,I'm feeling down and I'm, you
know, whatever it is, and Idon't think any of typo's lyrics
started with the word I.
It's always either a story orit's like to put things into it,

(39:46):
it's like relatable and they,they.
There's like a scene thathappens.
There's a lot of she's sothere's a lot of songs about a
she but or several.
You know she's, but yeah, itwas just.
I love that there's a lot ofthought put into it and then
it's great to hear that you,that you, that you're able to

(40:07):
catch on to this, you know, andyou, you're watching.
You're watching the blacknumber one video, literally 30
years after it was made.
I mean, this song came out in,I think, 93 or so.
And yeah, no, these guys areepic and I missed them dearly.

Carolina (40:24):
Yeah, the video doesn't have, like it's not a
multimillion dollar productionand it's black and white, is
very, very simple.
But his voice is just like sohaunting, like it makes the the
hairs on your arms kind of.
You look like you're likewitnessing this, like vampiric,

(40:46):
predatory, like circumstance,and you're like should I be
watching?
You're drawing, I don't knowlike right, but I can't stop
watching at the same time.

David (40:57):
Yeah, no, super cool, which, like you, like you said,
carolina, it's like he.
He very much personifies whatyou think of when you think of
Dracula.
Right, every time Dracula isportrayed, it's in this enticing
way.
He's like evil or, you know,dark, whatever you, whatever
word you want to describe it,but you can't get away from him,

(41:19):
right, you're drawn into it inthis way, and so, yeah, I feel
the same way about it.
You're just like whoa.

Raza (41:27):
And the funny thing is is that you know these guys are
actually hilarious, like if you,if you listen to their
interviews, it's, it'scompletely, it's like obviously
you know it's, it's it's NewYork humor and deadpan, you know
, delivery and but completelyself deprecating, completely
normal, downplayed their ownsuccess and and honestly, like I

(41:49):
was in full, you know, likefanboy mode for many, many years
, especially like in high schooland college and stuff, but but
it was cool to see a bandoperate in that way.
So don't take yourself thatseriously, because the other
side was.
Then you had like the MarilynMansons and some of the other
folks that were that startedbelieving their own.

(42:10):
You know narrative is just likeyou know, do your job, go play
a show, do it well and then gohome and and and that's to me
that was there one of thosebands that you really just the
kind of the kept it real, likeNew York, real.

Carolina (42:27):
I love that.
So, I love that you bring uplike the fact that in you know
this is a persona, there they'reon stage sort of presence or
their musical presence, but inlike real life they're like
funny and don't each otherthemselves too seriously.
Because I could not help, whilelistening to his voice and sort
of the subject matter of themusic video and everything, to

(42:49):
think about the movie forgetting Sarah Marshall and the
the Dracula inspired rock puppetopera that Jason Segal's
character makes.
But the voice that he sings inthe rock opera is kind of like
similar and I ever meet JasonSegal.
I'd love to ask him like thatwas an inspiration for that,

(43:12):
because it was eerily.
I could like see it in the backof my mind when I was listening
to the song.

Raza (43:19):
As you're saying that I'm thinking of the Count from
Sesame Street, because Iremember you had a Sesame Street
reference I want to say yourblood One, two, three, right and
so like at the same time whileI was watching the music video.

Carolina (43:40):
But now you're telling me this is like 30 years ago.
I'm like, are you poking fun atlike the?

David (43:45):
but no, this looks like Dude what they are trying to
pair it.
Yeah, yeah.

Carolina (43:51):
I guess I would just tell people to go watch the
video.

David (43:55):
That's the OG it was an experience.
Definitely, definitely, I think.
Before we move on to our nextsong, just one final thing in
kind of you know bringing thissort of you know goth music and
then grunge and sort of you haveyou know two movies, you have
the crow and you have singlesright that come out.

(44:16):
And it's like the crow is likeyour you know Halloween kind of
you know goth, that whole.
It's dark, it rains the wholetime.
There's even a song in therethat's like it can't rain all
the time, you know, and thatvibe.
And then you have singles whichis like straight up grunge
Seattle, I mean Pearl Jam andare in it, you know, and whatnot

(44:39):
, and so it's just interesting.
I don't even have a takebecause I appreciate both of my.
I really dug both of them.
It was tough to kind of likeI'm kind of in the middle on
them, probably leaning a littlebit more to the grunge side of
things.
But I just think it's sointeresting to see we're talking
about sort of how you candefine your place in your people
and stuff.
And I feel like that's aquestion you could ask them when

(45:01):
it's like the crow or singles,which which is your, which is
your vibe, you know, orsomething like that.

Raza (45:06):
So I'm gonna crow all the way.

David (45:15):
I was just gonna say I'm like Raza, you're definitely
crowed.

Carolina (45:17):
Carolina, you're definitely singles, and I'm
right there in the middle.

David (45:19):
So we've got it all all represented.

Raza (45:22):
Well, here let's so the difference.
So, speaking of typo, aroundthat time that movie I know what
you did last summer came out.
The opening sequence opens witha typo well, a typo cover of
another song, but the voice andthe guitars and everything is
there.

(45:43):
So I definitely I want to gosee that movie just for that,
just just to enjoy.
You know their the track and Imade it have shed a little tear
like my boys made it.

Carolina (45:58):
Yeah, yeah, made it in a movie yeah, that's awesome,
that's, that's great.

David (46:03):
So you know, we talked about how music can put us to a
specific point.
It's there when we struggle, itcan give us a new perspective.
But music can also be therewhen just things are great,
right, and it's just kind ofthis soundtrack that attaches to
these, these great moments, andso, you know, tell us, tell us

(46:23):
about a song, that that is partof one of those perfect moments
for you.

Raza (46:29):
Yeah, I was trying to think you know what's I mean you
can define, you know perfectmoments, so many different ways,
but but but to me.
So there's a high school yearsas a college years, which is
basically a blur, and then, andthen I went to.
I went to law school in Houston, got engaged and I remember

(46:55):
loving it.
I remember you know my fianceat the time now my wife, been
married for Just just just shyof 17 years now.

Carolina (47:04):
But but thank you, thank you.

Raza (47:08):
But I remember being in Houston, either having just
finished law school or justbeing on the tail end of it, and
it seemed like at the time that, okay, I know exactly what's
going to happen in the next fewyears.
You know building a career anddoing this law thing and you
know starting a family etc.
Etc.
All the promise of all thosethings that you know, as an

(47:30):
immigrant, you think about.
We're like just right there atthe cusp and those Dad, yeah,
exactly.
So always kind of Are Houstonyears always remind me of that.
Everything that's possible.
The city was amazing.
It was so.
You know, you guys know so.
We grew up in South Florida,went to, went to college in a

(47:51):
small, small college town.
Houston is a proper city, Imean it is.
You know skyscrapers and andheat and wealth and crime and
everything.
You know it's, it's, it's, it'sand we made.
You know we had a, we had ablast, that we had a really good
time.
We love the city still do,actually, anyway.
So in those around that time Iwas introduced I don't know how,

(48:15):
but maybe on the radio or itmay have been through my wife,
but she she said, hey, listen tothe song this is.
It's been called maroon fiveand my first instinct was Maroon
five.

David (48:26):
What, yeah All right, let's listen in.

Raza (49:12):
Yeah, years later, I realized this is like the
ultimate fuck you song.
And and I'm like, wait as, andI'm sure I asked my wife I look
at why would you introduce me tothis?
What are you trying to say,baby?
What are you trying to say?
And I want those people, like Ialways pay attention to the

(49:32):
lyrics, but for me, the music,the vibe of this song reminds me
of just things seemingly beingperfect, and driving around
enjoying the skyline in Houston,having ridiculous you know
Curries and Thai food and andthe best tacos you know ever,
because, come on, that Houstonhas the best tacos.

(49:53):
What are you talking about?
Yeah, just things seem to beperfect, and this song to me
encapsulates that.

Carolina (50:01):
That time, so fun, like maroon five is just fun,
and I think I think it's funnythe way you kind of teed it up
but like it was like presentedto you and you're like, come on,
like not maroon five.
You know if you, I think, as alover of music and you know we
just came off of like typonegative right, so like dark,

(50:23):
deep, introspective, like youknow, all this kind of music and
then you find yourself likebopping to.
Maroon five reminds me of Idon't know if you can help me
David was.
It was an episode of the officewhen the the character Angela,
who's just like a curmudgeon,like hates, everything, were
they, and there was like somesort of party that she did not

(50:44):
want to go to.
But she ended up digging themusic and they, the camera pans
down to her foot and she's kindof like she's have.

David (50:50):
She's actually I think that was the Cafe disco episode
after Michael Scott papercompany fails and they have the
thing down there and she's kindof sitting there and she wants
to clean up and Michael Scott'slike, no, no, no, this is a
party, you gotta have fun.
She's like why wouldn't you letme have any fun?
That's what you want to do.
But yeah, then she's sittingthere and she starts, you know,

(51:11):
foot starts going.

Carolina (51:12):
Yeah, yeah, that's what I basically think about
like this, like reluctance,reluctance to the music, but
then you're like Damn it, it'scatchy, like I'm enjoying myself
.

Raza (51:22):
Yeah, yeah, no, it was, the music definitely got me.
I love and I still, to this day, like again, you know, I'm
transported back to the drumbeat, the.
You know you're four on thefloor and yeah, yeah, we ended
up seeing maroon five actually.
So every year Houston has therodeo, the Houston rodeo, but

(51:47):
it's not just a rodeo, it's likeit's, it's like, I think, like
a week-long festival and theyhave, you know, like, beyonce's
played the rodeo and and AliciaKeys has played the rodeo and
it's a massive like festivalmusic.
You know food, All things, youknow Texan and Houston and
everything, and so any anyways,around that year, I'm sure

(52:08):
because of the song, we ended upgoing to the Houston rodeo and
I loved it.
We had such a good time andmaroon five was the main act.
And I'll never forget AdamLevine.
He's like, well, y'all, youknow, obviously he's from
California, he does not have aTexan accent, texas accent.

Carolina (52:24):
Oh, like y'all, y'all, I.

Raza (52:26):
Even got me a belt buckle and he did like this weird, like
shimmy thing with his beltbuckle.
I was like, oh fucking hatemaroon five.
But damn it, that's so is great.
But yeah, totally, I Think it'slike.

David (52:41):
I think there's a lot of music out there for folks that
have this quality to it whereyou secretly like it but you
don't want to admit to peopleyou like it.
It's kind of like what they sayabout riding a scooter you know
there are a lot of fun, but youdon't want, you don't want your
friends to see you on it.
You know, Like I'm gonna jamout to this but I don't want
anybody to know and and I thinkit's I Think that's a disservice

(53:04):
because it's again going tothat thing of like being genuine
and being real and just tryingto like set up who we are.
And it's like you know, yeah,like you said, the nickel back,
hatred and stuff.
That's just like that's becomean identity.
Right to like.
If you somehow hate on nickelback, that makes you like some
you know Music guru or somethinglike that.

(53:25):
And it's like no, no, becauselike you can like music for
different reasons.
Right, music can servedifferent Parts of you, like I
am.
You know I'm a drummer, I careabout rhythm and stuff.
I'm into rush and tool anddream theater and these bands
that, like you know every other.

(53:45):
You know Moment the time,signatures changing and things.
But I can also Jam out to a youknow four four pop song and
just be like this is great.
Lmfao is a great example ofthat.
Love the group right, Cuz it'sjust, it's just fun, it's just
party fun, yeah, yeah.

Raza (54:04):
I was actually one of the.
One of the great advantages ofthings like Apple music and
Spotify is that they have thelyrics and the lyrics actually
they're like connected to thesong so they they'll move as
almost like a tip, like a, likea right, like karaoke, yeah,
like a teleprompter type thing.
And anyway, many years later, Iwas that song was playing and

(54:30):
and I'm like, let me just listento the, you know, check out the
lyrics and stuff.
I'm like I mean the lyrics arebrilliant, like you, it's
undeniable.
I'm like, okay, it makes sensethat so many people like like
them and likes the band and andI don't like dislike them.
And I was actually like kickingmyself because I was just like
like the shit is really likeit's brilliant, it's brilliant

(54:53):
writing and and Just becauseit's not heavy doesn't mean that
it can't be good and likeartistic.
It really is that there'sreally good artistic value to
the song and the lyrics and IDon't see myself being like a
lifelong maroon 5 fan, but I getit, I do, I understand it and I
get it.
I mean I appreciate it.
So, yeah, I can say that now,as you know, as someone in there

(55:16):
, you know mid 40s, right, right.

Carolina (55:20):
Yeah, I mean I think so much of the time period
you've discussed this, likeadolescence and even like early
adulthood, you're trying to likeI Don't know position yourself
in the world, how you'reperceived, and it can feel like
when you know You're stilldeveloping that like every
little thing you do is gonnalike weigh heavily on how people

(55:42):
perceive you.
And I think as we get older andthey say you know you start to
give less fucks about things.
Right, you realize that like Ineed to be more silly, I need to
just like things becausethey're fun.
Doesn't mean anything about me.
But you know, I often say we're, we're just taller children.
Right, we're all still likethat kid in middle school

(56:04):
looking for that you know placeto sit and lunch with other
people and make friends and weend up taking a lot of it too
seriously.

David (56:13):
Yeah, yeah for sure.
Yeah, all right, moving on songfive.
So you know, sometimes musiccan be so powerful that it
reminds us of something and westruggle with it.
So you know, tell us about asong that you know brings up,

(56:38):
you know, difficult memories, oryou know you may have to turn
off when you listen to it.

Raza (56:45):
Yeah.
So you know, if it, if Maroonfive represents all, the, the
promise and the, the potential.
You know the next songrepresents basically that
everything is fucked.
And yeah, fast forward a coupleyears later.
Basically, you know, from acareer perspective I was, it was

(57:07):
in the toilet Things were goingpretty bad.
We had moved around a bit, had afew struggles, had some amazing
I mean our kids were born andbut you know, it wasn't, it
wasn't easy.
That it, thankfully, likehealth and everything was fine.
But yeah, just one preferprofessional standpoint was it
was a very difficult time and,figuring out your stuff, the

(57:30):
economy had collapsed around2008, nine or so, and you guys
all know that.
I mean, you know the legalprofession was basically
destroyed at that point andthere was no jobs or anything
like that.
So you know all of the struggleof Trying to become something
and Trying to become someone.
That payoff basically wasn'thappening and it was just a very

(57:52):
, very difficult time.
So, anyway, around that time wemoved to DC area, virginia, and
it was around 2013 and thissong represents that.
You know all that, the sort ofthe, the best of times and also
the worst of times.

David (58:09):
So yeah, you, I I'm yes, that was a foster.

(59:07):
The people, huh, helena beat,lena beat, yeah.
Yeah, this is one of thosesongs, like I'm.
I'm so appreciative for, youknow, being able to do this
podcast and have theseconversations because, you know,
I know the song right, like thesecond I hear it.
I'm like, oh yeah, I heard thatsong a bunch times, you know
know it, but I've never paidattention to it right.

(59:28):
And so, for you know, beingthat it was, you know, one of
your songs, I you know, andloading it up, getting ready, I
paid attention to the lyrics,right, and I was like, so just
I'll say surprise, but butPleasantly like, oh, my god,
this song there's like, becauseit's got this kind of like happy
feel to it, right, and so it's,it's a little bit of prejudice

(59:50):
on my side.
It's like, oh, that must justbe about, you know, bubble,
bubble gum and lollipops orsomething like that, you know,
and it's like, no, it's, it'sabout Like the line like I don't
even want to get out of bedthose days.
You don't want to get out of bed, yeah so yeah, I appreciate it
for that, just being able to,you know, learn a song a little
deeper.
Yeah.

Raza (01:00:11):
Yeah, for me.
I mean, I think one of thethings we talked about was you
know, what song do you have ahard time getting through, and
and that this is, this iscertainly you know, one of those
songs which is which is Again,thankfully there's, there's.
There's never been Healthrelated things, knock on wood,

(01:00:31):
but yeah, it was just a very,very difficult time it was.
It was like things wereeverything was available to you
because it's you know, we're init, we moved, like I said, we
moved to just outside of DC andthere's all of this sort of
knowledge and academic Influenceand just influence in general.
Like it's, it's amazing, youmeet, you meet amazing people

(01:00:52):
doing amazing things and yourealize how hard people work to
Become someone and and yourealize how, like what it takes.
And then you also realize, atleast at the time it was, it's
no, it's it's, it's not possible.
It's Like DC is great, but thisis not the right moment for me.

(01:01:17):
You know, in that space, likeit's like that old saying, if
you can have everything, but youcan't have everything all at
once, and so kind of goingthrough the, the struggles of
that and and and realizing thatyou know what this is.
Just it's, some things are justnot possible.
They might, they might happenat another time, but right now

(01:01:37):
is not the time.
And and then you're kind offaced with it.
You, you, you, you, you have toprocess it, you have to
struggle with it, you have tosort of, you know, beat yourself
up over it and cry over it, andthen you but you also have to,
you know, get your shit togetherand and come up with whatever
the next plan is To to surviveand kind of, you know, get out
of that struggle.
But yeah, but this, the.

(01:01:59):
So there's a time period around20, 2013, 2014 where it where
things were, you meet reallyreally great people and you see
what all is possible, and thenyou also realize what's just not
possible.
And yeah, so the song kind ofrepresents that and yeah, and

(01:02:23):
sometimes you just have to hitskip, go on to the next song
100%.

Carolina (01:02:29):
Um, I Also was not aware of the lyrics to the song.
I got have a the, the melody,like their voice it's, it's hard
to figure out what, what wordsthey're saying.
So I tend to just kind of likedance to the song, like it's
like a good upbeat, you knowrhythm or whatever.
But yeah, it's pretty heavy thelyrics, but like really hard

(01:02:50):
time and how to like Keep thatforward momentum.
You know when life like knocksyou down.
I know for us we were in the DCarea too and it does feel like
there's there's a lot of promise.
There's so many people movingand shaking and doing and like

(01:03:10):
you feel like you've got put onlike the super fast conveyor
belt and you got to keep up.
And I think similarly for us,we felt it was really hard.
And then you get to like thosetimes in your life where you're
trying to do something foryourself and all that stuff.
But you're also like a parentand you start to lose community
and friendships because you'rein that grind.

(01:03:31):
There's like these years ofyour life where you're just in
this grind all the time.

Raza (01:03:37):
It feels like yeah, the grind is real, man, especially
in DC.
The struggle is real, and Imean so obviously, you know,
fast forward, 10 years later,I'm back in DC and you know,
squarely a part of the grind andalso doing really, really fun
things, like this podcast, andyeah, it's, it's.

(01:04:05):
Dc is one of those places whereanything is possible, but it's
also one of those places where,if you fall, like it's, you know
it will, it will test you andit will, it will knock you down
and and it's one of those placeswhere, where you can you really
start to figure out you knowwhat.

(01:04:27):
What's important but also forme, like survival skills, like
people, like people that dosurvive in DC, and I think
that's true of me.
You know, any DC happens to bemy sort of big big city, you
know example, but it's true of,I think, new York, LA, any of
these bigger cities.
But if you can survive, I canguarantee you that there's a lot

(01:04:48):
of hard lessons that peoplehave gone through in order to
survive, because you realizethat you know what the people
that have made it on the otherside of a struggle, like the
shit that they went through.
It could be anything.
It's a lot, there's, there's,there's a lot of, you know, hard
work, a lot of luck, a lot ofopportunity, a lot of

(01:05:09):
preparation, and sometimes youdo have to take a step back and
kind of, you know, regroup,recollect, plan out your stuff.
I was never a planner.
I became one after in the last10 years, since this song, and
yeah.
So there's, there's, there's alot, there's a there's a lot

(01:05:29):
going on, there's a lot ofthings that are possible, and I
guess sometimes you have to justkind of step back, go back to
Florida and then figure out yourshit and then come back to DC.

So yeah, because I think so much of when we talk
about like career and successand even survival.
There's a lot of this like gritto like suck it up and keep
going.
And you know, and we don'toften talk about like survival
is also knowing when to let goand when to take that step back,
like you're saying, and regroupand say this is not for me in

(01:06:05):
this moment.
There's season of my life.
So yeah, and like every song onthis podcast, the fact that
this puts you right back thereis always super interesting that
a song can do that.

Raza (01:06:21):
Yeah well, I don't think any song can top your example,
Carolina.

David (01:06:25):
so I mean you know, and if you want to hear that song,
go check out episode two of ourpodcast and Carolina songs.

I think the connecting tie there can be can be grief,
right, and grief comes from froma lot of different losses.
It can be physical death andillness and all kinds of things,
but it can also be the griefand loss of the life you were
planning for or aspiring to.
Or, you know, we, we dig ourheels into the plans we have for
life and then you know lifesays hold my beer, let me throw

(01:06:59):
you a shit ton of curveballsright.
And then you're like, oh God, Igotta, like you know, figure
this out now.

David (01:07:08):
Yeah, yeah.
So I really appreciate thephrase you said of you can have
everything but you can haveeverything all at once, because
it just so, when you said it, itjust I knew exactly what you
meant, having gone throughsimilar things of like
committing to something.
In that case it was, you know,a PhD and you know Professor
Land and that and you know youcan have sort whatever you want

(01:07:35):
kind of things, but there'sgoing to be certain things you
have to sacrifice and it's kindof like, are you willing to
sacrifice those things?
And I think for a lot of us, we, we realize at some point of,
no, I'm not willing to sacrificefamily, my health, whatever it
is, for this, for this thingI've committed to.
And yeah, like Carolina, likeyou said, there's definitely a

(01:07:58):
grieving process when thathappens.
Right of like, where I wascommitted for, where I thought I
was going to life I thought Iwas going to have, where you
know the specific way it wasgoing to work, is not the case
and I've got to rethink what I'mdoing.
Yeah, yeah, for sure.

Raza (01:08:18):
And I don't think people realize.
I mean, you know it's to eachtheir own, but I think, at least
for the three of us, it seemslike it's kind of.
The whole premise of thispodcast is that you know
significant events in your life,whether they're happy or sad or
kind of in this case sort of agrieving process it's.

(01:08:40):
It's attached to music and it'sattached to a song or a few
songs or whatever.
And I mean, in my case, youknow like we mentioned chili
peppers a little while ago thatit's when you have these moments
of wow, other people felt thesame way and other people feel
the same way and they're able to, in a, in a sort of, in a nice,

(01:09:03):
you know, package known as asong, put those sort of feelings
and things together and put itout there in the universe and
you realize that, oh, wow, thereare other people that feel the
same way.
It's such a on the surface it'ssuch a sort of mundane sounding
phrase, but it really does help, you know yeah.

(01:09:24):
And and yeah, for a lot ofpeople music is the thing that
that saves them, gets them outof that moment and say, you know
what, it'll be okay and that'snothing to take away from from.
You know sort of mental healthstruggles and things like that
completely as a sidestep butjust for your little pitfalls

(01:09:45):
and things like that sometimesyou know, just a good song just
kind of makes it.
It's like a warm hug, justmakes it better.

David (01:09:52):
I would even.
I would even say with themental health, like a song might
not be able to to heal you fromit in time.
You might heal you from itentirely.
Right, you might need therapy,medication, whatever it might be
.
But even with mental health,hearing a song that is talking
about the struggles of any typeof mental health struggle,
whether it's depression, anxiety, ptsd or something like that

(01:10:13):
that helps too, in that way ofjust like, oh wow, I'm not the
only one going through this,like just knowing the song
doesn't fix it.
But again, that that feelinglike you're not the only one
going through it.
Right, and that's really whatit's.
You know, art makes lifebearable, really.
Right, because it's like we'rein this existence.

(01:10:34):
That makes no sense.
Right, we're electricityrunning through fucking meat
suits that we're walking aroundin.
Everything we do is abouttrying to keep ourselves alive.
Right, we eat, we do all thesethings to keep ourselves alive,
but at the end it's a failed.
It's a failed attempt.
Right, we, at the end we willall fail at it.

(01:10:56):
Right, and so that's scary asshit.
Right, and so like having music, kind of.
Okay, I'm at least not alone inthis.
I'm not alone in these fears,these anxieties, these sadness,
this break up, this struggle.
It just takes away a little bitof that that suffer yeah it

(01:11:19):
almost sounds like you know.

Raza (01:11:20):
When people's I hate to.
I might have to edit this out,but I'm just gonna say it for
right now.
You know people attempt suicide.
What's almost your examplesounds like attempt life, give
it a shot.
Yeah right, yeah, yeah, whatyou're doing is, you know,
you're doing things to attemptto keep yourself alive.

Yeah yeah like tie you back or ground you back.
I think, for you know, for meone of the things that comes up
that that music is so helpfulwith when it comes to grief and
loss and and all of that is whenyou can't find the words.
You know we think about, likethe struggles you go through, an
adolescence or even childhood,lot around you know, depression

(01:12:09):
and PTSD, and even like LGBTQyouth and stuff who are
struggling to like put two words, the angst or the pain or
whatever it is they're feeling,and then to have somebody do
that in this creative way, oneexactly rather feels like a hug.
Singing to things can almostfeel like I don't know, like a

(01:12:30):
cathartic alternative to crying.
You know, when you sing and itjust helps like paint that story
that you couldn't like put, putup, put a word to.

Raza (01:12:45):
Yeah, it's a connection we're looking for connection and
and it's funny how it sometimesit's completely random, like a
song on the radio, completelyrandom and my heavy yeah song
found you in this weird way yeah.

David (01:13:05):
I like the phrase of attempt life Trademark in that
sense of like, yeah, trademark.
Because in that way of just,you know, as someone who, from
PTSD and things, has struggledwith the suicidal thoughts and
things like that and kind of,you know, understanding it more

(01:13:27):
personally that way, and nowsort of healing from it and in
some ways getting better, itfeels exactly what I'm doing
right now in there, like eventhe podcast and trying to get
out there and doing these things.
It feels like I'm attemptinglife again, like I was in this
mode where I was Not so, youknow, excited about life and all

(01:13:53):
these, all of that, and it justfelt like this struggle all the
time, years, like I don't wantto do this anymore.
And now it feels like, yeah,it's like let's go attempt some
life, just go do it.
You know we're going to be goneanyways.
So, just like we said at the lotof times, just have fun, have
some fun with it.
Who cares?
Yeah, alright, moving, movingalong our last song, and so you

(01:14:19):
know we talked about that, youknow everything's perfect, this
is a great on the precipice ofall these amazing things, and
then like, okay, life, lifedealt the blow and it was a
struggle.
And so with this last song, youknow, tell us about a song or a

(01:14:40):
piece of music that that youknow is part of a weighty
transition for you, when therewas a before time and then and
an after time.

Raza (01:14:49):
Yeah, yeah, there's definitely been lots of, you
know, transitions in in in mylife, but I think the most, the
most significant one is becomingapparent and you know, I'm
eternally grateful for our twoawesome kids who are both, you

(01:15:10):
know, in their.
They're both in their teens now, but we are anyway.
So this is going to be a littlebit of a shameless plug, but
you guys mentioned thisSolomante project in my, in my
intro, and I thought that Iwould kind of Shamelessly plug

(01:15:33):
my favorite track off of that,off of one of the albums and it
basically so it's called theoffspring and it's about my kids
and I guess we'll talk about iton the on the other side.

David (01:15:46):
Talk about the flip side, and if you can't plug your own
music on your own podcast, Iknow Well, I mean it was driven
to create music as the storylike.

Well, power to you.
That's amazing.

David (01:16:01):
I appreciate it, I appreciate it All right, let's
take a listen.
Solomante the offspring.

Raza (01:16:48):
Yeah, I was Love it.
I was kind of proud of mypadded myself on the back a
little bit, like when I waswriting the words for this.
I had no idea.
I mean like I wrote all themusic and stuff way you know,
way before the lyrics.
Actually, once pandemichappened that we had all this
time and I was like you knowwhat?

(01:17:08):
The one thing I want to do isput out my, my it's actually my
second album and and, yeah, forsome reason some of the words
seem to resonate and then itjust the lyrical content like
morphed into this thing aboutjust kids and I was like you
know what I'm just going to?
I have a Voice, might as welluse it like the way you know,

(01:17:29):
tobias Forge from from ghostsaid once and something about it
just kind of just seemed likeit's it?
The words seem to start, thewords that I was putting
together, like that's the themethat just came out and I think
the part you guys heard thereabout you know, if you're, if

(01:17:51):
you feel like nothing's right,I'll be there for you.
If you just want to run andhide, I'll be right there with
you.
I was like you know what?
I'm just going to expand onthat.
So basically, out of thatlittle course light the whole
thing, I played the song forsomeone once a day like man.
I have no idea what this thingis about.
I'm like the title is theoffspring, I know.
It's like like some scientificproject gone bad.

(01:18:12):
I'm like dude, it's about mykids.
I just wanted to leave themlike a note when I'm gone.
There's maybe one, one thingthat they'll know how I feel
about them and, like you know,being responsible as a parent
and a dad you know things likethat, so yeah, I love that so
much.
Thank you.

I mean so much of like the lyrics of music can be
about, you know, love orstruggle or war or political
topics, or you know personalstruggles, addiction, like all
these kinds of things.
Right, I don't feel like I hearas much about parenting, which

(01:18:55):
is like I mean talk about aweighty transition that nobody
prepares you for.

David (01:19:03):
Yeah.

The most epic responsibility of like trying to
create a good human, umintergenerational things that
you have to come to terms withabout like your own childhood,
what kind of parent you want tobe, how you want to be like man
that's parenthood is one of themost ultimate life struggles,

(01:19:29):
and like challenges andadventures that one embarks upon
Um to one.
I love that the song, and Iguess the album as a whole, is
like a dedication to that.
That journey, um, it's really,really cool.

Raza (01:19:43):
Thank you, yeah, yeah, again, it was the funny part for
me was right, like again I, alot of most of the music was
done, um, and I, I hear this ishow the pros do it as well,
which is, you know, you write,the band gets together and
writes all the music and stuffand then, you know, at the very

(01:20:04):
end, the singer comes in and,kind of you know, puts a pen to
paper and so, yes, I had no idea.
You know, some, some people haveasked me hey, you know, did you
write a song about your kids?
I'm like, no, I mean, the musicwas there, um, but the lyrics
were, I think, a creation of thepandemic and what we're going
through, and you know the impactof the pandemic on our kids,

(01:20:26):
and at this time, everyone was,you know, kids were going to
school online and laptops andthings like that.
So it was just, it was a topicthat was going around and for
some reason, it just seemed tomake sense.
So, yeah, yeah, it was fun, itwas fun to write it and then it
was fun to write the lyrics andyeah, it's kind of a note to
motherhood too, by the way,speaking to another mom here,

(01:20:50):
which was, I think the firstline is something like an act of
love brought you two into thisworld and it's just like, no,
like the act of giving birth isthe ultimate act of love, um,
and, and you know we're not,we're not the other act of love,
um, but but but, but but yeah,it's just like.

David (01:21:14):
Let me tell you about the night we made juice.

I don't know if I want to hear that song.

David (01:21:21):
No kid wants to hear that story.

Well, there's plenty.
I think there's plenty writtenon that.

Raza (01:21:27):
All right, yeah, neil Peart has his most epic solo Um.
But yeah yeah, it's, it's um.
Yeah, it's, it's fun to be adad.
It's uh, it's uh, you know it'sa gift and I think it's, it's,
it's the ultimate gift from,from, from the mother as well,
mothers as well.
So yeah, we covered all thebases, basically.

David (01:21:49):
Yeah, no, I love, I love um that that you know you
selected this song to put outthere.
You call it a shameless plug.
I think it's.
You know, it's exactly what wewant to hear, right, if we
didn't have this song on here, apiece of you and your story and
your life is missing, right,and so I I very much appreciate

(01:22:14):
having this on here and, andreally, you know, we focused on
how the the transition isbecoming a parent and the focus
on your children.
But, you know, based on theprevious couple of songs we've
done and sort of following thisstory, um, you know, I also,
like, am happy to have this asour, our last song in this way,
because it also shows, um, your,uh, you know, for lack of a

(01:22:41):
better word actualization, right, you, you are, hey, I was doing
this thing.
I'm uh, uh, you know, uh, uh,trying to succeed for my family
and we moved here to succeed,and I'm trying to do this, and
then it, it, it's struggling, itdoesn't work and I'm not sure,
in all these ups and downs, andthen here's this part of like,
well, I know, no matter whatelse I'm doing, this is

(01:23:03):
something that's in me that Iwant to get out, right, and so I
think, all too often, so manyof us have those things and we
just tell ourselves, no, I don'thave the time, I don't have the
this, I don't have the whatever, no one's going to listen, no
one's going to care, everyone'sgoing to laugh at me, whatever
it might be, and you put it outthere.
You went and made it and put itout there and you know that's

(01:23:27):
just so, so great and it's justso inspiring to hear in in a
most basic sense of just no,make stuff.
If you have it in there, put itout there, do it.
The world, society andeverything is going to try and
take us out, take that away fromus, right, and just make us,
you know, work the job and andserve our purpose in that way.
And yeah, we got to, we got tomake, we got to make beautiful

(01:23:51):
things.
So thank you for this beautifulthing.

Raza (01:23:54):
And no, thank you guys.
I mean thanks for thanks forletting me, uh me, share this.
And uh, yeah, no, it's uh, it'sgreat, I really appreciate it.
I appreciate sharing this withyou guys.
I mean, you know this is uh andnow everybody knows.

David (01:24:11):
That's right, and you can find links to Solamente
Solamente music in the shownotes.

Um, yeah, yeah, I think definitely check it out.
I love that this is the lastsong too.
Like in talking about just thethe ups and downs and roller
coasters of of life, it um thefact that it ends with something
you created makes me think ofthat, um that Jurassic Park
quote right, like life finds away um and to create right as

(01:24:38):
humans.
You know, I'm a former artteacher as well and I firmly
believe that, like humans aredrawn to instinctively create
art and things.
Those are the stories we leavebehind and I'm not going to cry,
but the idea that your kidshave a song or an album that you
wrote for them long after youknow we're all gone.
Like not going to cry, wrap itup, davis, thank you.

Raza (01:25:04):
Yeah, we think, thank you, that's I've.
Uh, yeah, I appreciate that, Iappreciate, I appreciate that
that it, like it, hit you theway that it did and I, you know.
So, yeah, from one parent toanother, you know yeah.

David (01:25:24):
And so in wrapping up, we're sort of already starting
to do a, but we normally, youknow, um uh, wrap it up by
saying, okay, you've, we'velistened to these six songs,
you've told these stories.
You know how does it feel nowlooking back on everything and
thinking of where you're goingforward.
You know how does it feel tohear all these songs.

Raza (01:25:45):
Yeah, yeah, no, it's um, I feel good, I feel, um, I feel
like I'm not someone who sharesthings very easily and I feel
like I've, I've, you know I'm,I've put a lot of things out
there into the universe and someof it might be a little

(01:26:06):
unnerving, um, some of it is.
It's like do people really wantto know about me?
It's like you always have thatone thing thought.

David (01:26:14):
But, on the other hand, it's like we're going to care
about this, exactly, exactly,and you know what it's.

Raza (01:26:19):
I know that it was good.
It was good that I feel goodabout it.
I feel good that I'm able toshare it, even if it's just with
, with the between the three ofus.
Um, if some other you knowpeople get some joy out of it,
that's even better.
But I think I'm content in thatit's it's, it's out there Like
I've done my part.
Um, I'm super excited to hearother people's stories as well.

(01:26:40):
Um, and, and you know, again, I, I've, I've, I've, I've been Um
this, the idea of this podcasthas inspired me.
And again, your tagline of youknow what, we're not going to
make our, our um guests doanything that we're ourselves
not doing.
So I'm like you know what, I'mdoing it for the for, for the

(01:27:03):
good of things, for the good ofour guests, for the good of the
podcast.
I'm a team player and you knowwhat Any any little bit of
nervousness on my part oranxiety is.
Like you know what, let's,let's do it, let me attempt it,
and and let's see what happens.
So I'm glad to put it out there.
I'm glad you guys, you know, um, some of this stuff resonated

(01:27:24):
with you guys.
I'd really enjoyed hearing yourum, your, your takeaways as
well.

David (01:27:29):
Um and yeah, yeah, super excited.
Yeah, I appreciate that.
Yeah, I think it's one of thosethings, like we talked about
these songs that spoke to you insome way, right, we talked
about that, that power of music,and that way to like, oh I'm
not alone, right, and this getsme and, and you know, uh, I
think that's kind of you knowwhat we're doing here.

(01:27:51):
In that sense, you can't knowwho it might affect, but someone
might hear something and itspeaks to them, right, and they
don't feel alone, and so, um,yeah, yeah, so come on the
podcast, if we, if we invite you, come on.
It's an experience for sure,for sure.

Raza (01:28:11):
Um, and I think, going back to, that's right, judge,
judge, we're not.

David (01:28:16):
We're not talking about no, let me tell you why such and
such band is better than gunsand roses.
That's not what we're trying todo here, and I think, kind of
like you know, I appreciate whatyou just said too about, like,
um, you know, uh, I actuallyenjoyed the process of telling
my story and whatever anxiety,or you know, uh, who wants to

(01:28:36):
hear this and stuff, um, youknow, I think that's maybe one
of the reasons why, yeah,conversations about music and
stuff normally fall down to thateasier.
Let me tell you why your bandisn't as good as my band.
Right, because that's safer.
Yeah, right, you're not openingup.
I don't have to tell you whyRush speaks to me, or I don't

(01:28:57):
have to tell you about why typonegative changed my life.
I don't have to tell you abouthow Alicia Keys, just, you know,
wrecks me, um, and so, yeah,but we know that that
conversation isn't isn't great,it isolates us, if you know, and
stuff, and so I appreciate thatin that way of sort of like we

(01:29:17):
said we're, we're leading fromthe front, not asking our guests
to do anything we wouldn't do.
Yeah, um, it's that way ofchanging the conversation to say
like no, let's.
Let's kind of try and have moreof these conversations, let's
be a little bit more vulnerable,let's open up a little bit with
each other.

Yeah, well, and I think, um, you know we're
getting at life stories, butthrough music, right, and I
think if, if you were to have aconversation with somebody and
you were like tell me your lifestory, like I think it'd be a
way different story than the sixsongs I shared told.
It's just a completely differentperspective and angle to your
life story.
Um, you know mine has a lot notreflected in those six songs,

(01:29:58):
but the the six songs give you,like the ups and downs and the
nuances and like I think, moreof me and my soul and who I am
than a chronological order oflike I was born here.
Then we did this then thathappened then you know those
kinds of things, and so, um, assomebody who who just did this
right and in our second episode,like I was nervous too, but

(01:30:20):
like what a cool way to share mystory that wasn't in in what
you would think a traditionalway would be.

David (01:30:26):
Nice, all right, all right.
So, uh, before we jump off realquick lightning round, uh,
what's your first, your last andyour best concert?

Raza (01:30:38):
Okay, so my first uh, I'm going to take you guys all the
way back to 1989.
This is this was in Pakistanand there was a band called
vital signs.
Anyone who's of Pakistanidescent, who lived, I know my,
my, my family, will know thisreference right off the bat.

(01:30:58):
But, yeah, uh, vital signsthere were.
There were a uh, there were aPakistani uh pop band, um, and
they put on a show.
One of my uncles and aunties, um, took me and my sister.
We sat up front row.
They had no drummer, they had adrum machine keyboards.
It was very synthy poppy, butthey had a live guitarist and I

(01:31:19):
sat like directly square infront of him and during one of
his guitar solos he like winkedat me because it was like me and
my, my cuddly little sistersitting there.
He's like ah, I see you guys,you know, uh, yeah, so that was,
that was my first Um.
It was great Uh.
Last concert uh was a bandcalled ale storm.

(01:31:41):
There, I kid you not, they're asort of a pirate metal band.
I I consider myself like aconnoisseur of metal.
I have never heard of theseguys before, but the show was
ridiculous, oh my God.
Um wait, like pirate, like ouryeah, yeah, yeah, and there's
songs about how you get drunk onthe drum and yo ho ho mateys,

(01:32:02):
wow, and then really fast drumsand yeah, it's crazy, so like.

David (01:32:06):
Viking metal, but pirate metal pirate metal yes.
So we're not.
We're not singing about Vikingsand gods and everything we're
pirates.

Raza (01:32:14):
We're pirates.
Yeah, we're invading, you know,the Caribbean islands and we're
finding, you know, puttna liketreasure chests and and and
getting pissed drunk on rum anduh, you know, and one-eyed
parrots and all this stuff.
Yes, pirate metal.

What's the name of this band?

Raza (01:32:29):
Ale storm, yeah, like, like you know like, like, yeah,
like leader, yeah.
And it was for one of mybuddies.

Right now for later.

Raza (01:32:39):
Uh, um, thank you, ben, and um, it was, it was, yeah, it
was insanity, but but it was.
It was a great time, really afantastic drummer, by the way,
like you know blast beats andshit.
I'm like what, what is what'sgoing on?
Um, and then best concert was,uh, typo negative, and I'll

(01:33:00):
never forget the date because itwas on my 17th birthday in Fort
Lauderdale, like a month beforehigh school graduation, and
typo was at their peak.
This was the October Russ tour.
Uh, uh, the theater in FortLauderdale, florida.
I went with my sister and acouple of other friends and,

(01:33:21):
yeah, best concert and probablybest concert, uh, you know,
forever, ever and never intoperpetuity.
So, yeah, those are my threebest concert for all time, all
time.
Cause typo's gone, dude, likeit's been there, right, there's
no the final nail in the coffin.
So, yeah, yeah, yeah.

David (01:33:42):
Yeah, all right.
Well, raza, thank you foropening up to us and our, our
audience.
Um, you know, like we said,we've, we've, we've tried to
lead from the front with thisand so, uh, you know, thank you
for for that.
Um, you know, in, in justwrapping up in the few minutes

(01:34:04):
we we have left, um, you know,tell us, uh, what you've got
going on that people might beinterested in, or how they can
connect with you, or, you know,whatever you want to share with
folks.

Raza (01:34:16):
Oh yeah, well, again, thank thank you guys.
Right, I mean again, this is,this was sort of an experiment
that I had never imagined myselfdoing ever, and it's like it's
such a cool idea.
So, yeah, love doing it.
Uh, really looking forward tohow this thing plays out.
Um, yeah, I'm on, I'm on insta,I'm on threads.

(01:34:36):
Um, it's uh, uh, raza is myname, um other than that.

David (01:34:42):
As far as uh, yeah, Um Raza is my name, podcasting is
my game.

Raza (01:34:50):
You can subscribe here, here, here and right there.
Yeah, yeah, as I have a day job, um, and and I have a, uh, I
have album number three fromSolomon day, which is probably
going to drop at some point bythe end of the year, I'm hoping,
um, that's Solomon dayband oninsta, and, other than that, I

(01:35:12):
have this podcast that I amsuper excited and, frankly,
honored to be a part of.
Um, I'm, um, and everyone knowshow to get in touch with us
here and uh, that's me in anutshell.

All right.

David (01:35:26):
Thank you.
All right, everyone.
Uh, make sure you know a lifein six songs, like and subscribe
were.
Anywhere you find your podcast,we're there, you know.
If you want to watch us, um, we, we, we've got a YouTube
channel, a life in six songs.
Just search that, you can watchit, or you can just listen to
the audio.
If that's how you like to getyour podcasts, find them

(01:35:48):
anywhere.
You can reach out to us at alife in six songs podcast at
gmailcom.
Um, so, yeah, definitely, like,subscribe, follow us.
Uh, go back, listen to thefirst couple of episodes, learn
who your hosts are and then,from here on out, going forward,
it's going to be, you know, thethree of us with another guest
and stuff, and so we're going tohear some more songs and some

(01:36:10):
more life stories and we arevery much excited and so, um,
that has been a life in sixsongs.

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Ep. 3 - From Hearing Metal in Pakistan to Studying Law in the States: Music as a Trusted Co-Pilot

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Ep. 3 - From Hearing Metal in Pakistan to Studying Law in the States: Music as a Trusted Co-Pilot