April 21, 2025 • 54 mins
Music bypasses our intellectual defenses and speaks directly to our hearts in ways that sermons and teachings rarely achieve. This profound spiritual reality was the focus of our latest conversation, where our interfaith panel explored why sacred songs become so deeply embedded in our religious experiences.
Rabbi Stuart opened with a revealing observation from his decades of service: congregants leave services humming tunes while forgetting sermon content entirely. This sparked a fascinating exploration of how melodies create attachments that make worship spaces feel like home. When familiar songs are missing, we become "strangers in our own sanctuary" – a feeling that transcends denominational boundaries.
The Passover song "Dayenu" demonstrates how music teaches theology through repetition and emotional connection. Each verse recounts another miracle during the Exodus, pausing to acknowledge that "it would have been enough for us" – cultivating a profound sense of gratitude that mere words couldn't achieve. Father Mario reflected on how "Oh Holy Night" carries a revolutionary message about human dignity through its lyric "till He appeared and the soul felt its worth," highlighting humanity's transformation from viewing life as cheap to recognizing its inherent value.
Our exploration extended to both ancient and modern expressions of faith through song. David compared Charles Wesley's 1739 Easter hymn with the contemporary "Easter Song" from 1974, demonstrating how sacred music evolves while preserving essential theological content. Rudy offered fascinating neuroscientific insights, explaining how music simultaneously activates regions of our brains responsible for language, emotional processing, and memory – creating connections that transcend time and unite believers across generations.
Whether it's ancient chants or modern worship songs, sacred music doesn't just express faith – it creates it, connecting us to something infinitely larger than ourselves. What songs have shaped your spiritual journey? We'd love to hear from you at ashowoffaith1070@gmail.com.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
There's something happening here.
What?
It is ain't exactly clear.
There's a man with a gun overthere Telling me I've got to
beware.
I think it's time we stopChildren, what's that sound?
(00:25):
Everybody, look what's goingdown.
(00:54):
Stop, everybody's wrong.
Young people speak in theirminds.
So much resistance.
Yep, wait a minute Coming uphere.
We go Almost here.
Give it a second Coming up here.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
We go almost here.
Give it a second.
Welcome to A Show of Faith onAM 1070, the Answer Professor,
priest, millennium rabbidiscussing theology, philosophy,
morality, ethics and anythingelse of interest in religion.
If you have any response to ourtopics or any comments
regarding what we say, hey, we'dlove to hear from you.
Email us at ashowoffaith1070 atgmailcom.
(01:27):
Ashowoffaith1070 at gmailcom.
You can hear our shows againand again by listening pretty
much anywhere podcasts are heard.
Our priest is Fr Mario Arroyo,retired pastor of St Cyril of
Alexandria, the 10,000 block ofWestheimer.
Hello, our professor is DavidCapes, Baptist minister and
director of academic programmingfor the Lanier Theological
(01:48):
Library.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Stuart, you are brilliant.
Speaker 4 (01:52):
I try to be.
Rudy Kong is our millennial.
He's an assistant engineer andhas his master's degree in
theology from the University ofSt Thomas.
Speaker 5 (02:04):
Howdy, howdy, Howdy howdy, howdy, howdy.
Speaker 4 (02:06):
I am Rabbi Stuart Federo, retired rabbi of
Congregation Shahar Shalom, theClear Lake area of Houston,
texas.
Miranda is our board operatorand together Miranda helps us
sound fantastic.
So welcome to A Show of Faithon AM 1070,.
The Answer All right, I am theshow director.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
So, stuart, I hope you had a happy right.
I am the show director, so yes,I did, thank you.
Speaker 4 (02:27):
I hope you all had a happy and blessed Easter.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Thank you very much.
Speaker 4 (02:33):
Okay, so tonight I am show director and, uh, let me,
let me tell you a couple ofstories real quick.
I was ordained in 82.
My first pulpit was inGreenville, mississippi, and
about that time the movement ofJudaism that I am in I guess
(02:56):
ordained from is the ReformMovement, and they came out with
a new prayer book book.
And you'd think the world had aI don't know what opened up and
swallowed people or somethinglike that.
But the reaction to the newprayer book was slow and there
(03:17):
was a group of people who wantedjust let's switch over the new
one.
It'll be the prayer book of thefuture and we should use it.
And, by the way, this was in 82, so that's 43 years ago.
Oh my God, all right.
And what I told them is thatonce a month we were going to
(03:38):
use the old prayer book becauseI did not want to make people
strangers in their own sanctuary.
Why do I tell you that Most ofthe Jewish services are sung,
most of the prayers are sung,and for any one prayer, any one
paragraph, there's probably abillion different tunes that one
could use for each one of theprayers which you'd probably
(03:58):
figure out over the last 2,000years that it would develop that
way.
But why do we have such anattachment to music?
Why is it that a song will gostraight to the soul and the
heart?
At the end of every highholiday season, before I retired
(04:22):
, I would always, you know,thank the cantor that we would
bring in.
And I would say to thecongregation, when the members
of the congregation are leavingthe sanctuary, they are humming
the tunes the cantor sang andcannot remember a word that the
rabbi said in a sermon.
And it's true.
Sermons go to our mind.
(04:43):
The music of the service goesto our hearts and soul and we
form attachments and when wehave services we don't feel like
we've been to the service,unless we hear the songs that
make the service the service.
It would be my analogy it wouldbe like going to a major league
(05:12):
baseball game and not havingthe star-spangled banner begin
the game.
You'd think that there wassomething missing, like you
weren't at a real baseball game.
Because singing thestar-spangled banner, no matter
what team you're there to rootfor, unifies the people and
makes it the American pastime.
And if you don't have that, youfeel something lacking, because
music is so vitally importantand the music goes straight to
(05:34):
the heart and soul.
And if you ask somebody whatdoes the Star Spangled Banner
say, they might even have torecite the words before they
could tell you the meaning ofthe words.
It's not going to come rollingoff their tongue what it's about
.
And so a few weeks, maybe a fewmonths ago, when it was my turn
(05:57):
to be show director, I askedeverybody to bring the text of a
song that was secular, that wefound meaningful and
inspirational or somewhatreligious in some way, shape or
form.
But tonight I asked everybodyto bring songs that were
explicit to a holiday season, aholy day season, whatever the
(06:20):
holiday was, although I wasthinking more, you know Passover
and Easter.
So tonight I asked everybody tobring the text.
We're not going to sing.
I'm sparing all of ourlisteners my singing voice.
You're welcome.
Yay, David, I knew I could relyon you to say yay, all right.
(06:41):
So all right, I guess I willstart and the— Stuart, yes.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
Stuart, yeah, let me interrupt to say I think that's
a brilliant opening.
Well thank you, because there'sso many—there's so much truth
to it.
There have been theologians ofthe past, in Christian
Protestantism in particular,that have said you know, I don't
really need to write thetheology, just let me write the
(07:11):
hymns.
Right, and the hymns are thethings that really do implant
and imprint on our theology.
But, david, why?
Why does?
Speaker 4 (07:21):
it imprint.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
Well, you know, that's the way God made us.
Let me just say that at thebeginning.
Speaker 4 (07:27):
Probably right.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
God made us in such a way that music imprints on us
in a certain way.
And I think it's very meaningful.
A lot of people know, forexample, the song Amazing Grace.
They can sing it, they've heardit in movies, that kind of
thing.
Everybody knows the meaning ofthat.
I can't tell you who wrote it,honestly, but there are a lot of
(07:49):
sermons about grace, butthere's one key song about it
and I just think that music hasthis character to it that it
does that to us, and so I thinkit's a great beginning and I'm
looking forward to learningabout Passover through the songs
(08:11):
, because I've heard yourPassover sermon and, honestly, I
couldn't remember any of it.
Speaker 4 (08:17):
Thank you, david.
You proved my point.
Smart Alec, there we go.
All right, all right, so okay.
So I'll lead off with a song.
This is just real quick.
Um, in the year 70, the templewas destroyed.
The second temple was destroyedand everything for passover
(08:38):
while the temple stood was aboutthe temple.
So the temple was destroyed in70.
Um, they had to develop ahome-centered service that
became the Passover Seder, andwith all the symbols and not
just the symbols but the songs,and over time, like 2,000 years,
give or take whatever it isfrom 70, people would add things
(09:06):
, they would subtract things,they would change this, they'd
add to that, the text would grow, the text would shrink, but it
was malleable.
I don't know what else to callit.
And what I'm going to be readingpart of is one of the songs
(09:28):
that if you went to a PassoverSeder and they did not sing it,
you'd feel really something'smissing.
Like, was this really a Seder?
Was this really?
Because it becomes so integral.
It's called Dayenu, which means, oh, I know so integral.
It's called Dayenu, which means, oh, I know that one.
Hey, you know, it's probably Ipromise not to sing, but it's
(09:51):
probably somewhere on YouTubebut it's called Dayenu, which
means it would have been enoughfor us.
And the chorus is repeating theword Dayenu, da-dayenu,
da-dayenu, da-dayenu, dayenudayenu, and it means it would
have been enough for us.
It would have been enough forus.
It would have been enough forus.
(10:15):
Yeah, but the verses basicallytell the story in song form of
the exodus from Egypt.
So God has bestowed many favorsupon us.
Had God brought us out of Egyptand not executed judgment
against the Egyptians, it wouldhave been enough for us.
(10:36):
And then you sing Dayenu.
And then you take the last partof that sentence, repeat it and
add the next one had Godexecuted judgments against the
Egyptians, but not against theirgods, it would have been enough
.
Dayenu.
And then you sing Dayenu.
Had God executed judgmentsagainst their gods and not put
to death their firstborn, itwould have been enough.
(10:56):
And then you sing Dayenu.
And then had God put to deaththeir firstborn and not given us
their riches, it would havebeen enough.
Dayenu.
And every one of these lines isbased on a verse in the biblical
text of Exodus that tells thestory of coming out of slavery
in Egypt.
So I am going to read the lastparagraph, which goes over every
(11:22):
line of the song?
Okay.
How much more so, then, shouldwe be grateful to God for the
numerous favors that werebestowed upon us?
God brought us out of Egypt,punished the Egyptians, smote
their gods, slew their firstborn, gave us their wealth, split
(11:45):
the sea led for those whoactually think about lyrics.
(12:08):
If any one of those things hadnot happened, we might still be
in slavery in Egypt.
Because God, you know, smotethe Egyptian gods okay, and
brought us to the Nile okay.
(12:30):
Split the Sea of Reeds or RedSea mistranslation, but Sea of
Reeds.
Had God not split the Red Sea,then it brought us back to Egypt
.
We would have been back intoslavery.
So, every step of the way, andwhat is the purpose of that?
You know, everything we do has apurpose, not only when you're
doing it, but it also has asubtle effect on us, and I think
(12:54):
it's to teach us to be verygrateful for every little thing
that happens in our lives, verygrateful for every little thing
that happens in our lives.
That, when it happens, you know, we may take it for granted, we
may ignore it, but especiallyfor us old geezers I'm not
(13:35):
talking about me, mind you Thankyou when you look back and you
see how every step leads broughtyou to where you are and how
had one little thing changed orbeen different, you might not be
sitting here, you might not bedoing whatever you're doing, you
may not be with your boyfriendor your girlfriend or your
husband or your wife, you maynot have had the children you've
(13:56):
got, or whatever the childrenyou've got or whatever.
And a song like this that is sointegral to the Seder that if
you didn't sing it you'd feellike something was missing,
becomes so important because itteaches that lesson.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Well, that's a great word.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
Well, and there are other songs that do the same
thing.
You know, if it hadn't been forthis or or uh, what's the one
about swallowing a fly, whereevery little step um, I can't
remember it, but it, but this isthe song that we sing at the
Seder.
It's one of the many, manysongs that we sing at the Seder,
and I think it has anincredible lesson of gratitude
(14:44):
that's very much missing in ourpresent society.
All right, we are about time togo to a break, though.
Speaker 7 (14:50):
Yep, this is 1070 KNTH.
I will be right back.
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The answer.
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A time to laugh, a time to heal, a time to laugh, a
time to weep.
Speaker 4 (17:45):
Welcome back to A Show of Faith on AM 1070, the
Answer.
So we're talking aboutreligious music and how it
affects us, how it grabs a holdof us, how it touches us.
And, Mario, you want to go next?
Speaker 7 (18:01):
Yeah, when Rabbi sent this out, god, I hate this.
When Rabbi sent this out, hesaid songs that had meaning for
holy days, right, and I didn'tunderstand it.
Speaker 10 (18:20):
To be just no, no, that's fine my, my favorite holy
day song.
Speaker 7 (18:25):
Um is a christmas song, which is um, oh, holy
night, and the reason is justfor the first um, the first um
verse.
I guess you would say Okay,because it says something that
has given me a tremendous amountof insight in terms of how to
(18:51):
interpret history, and so,anyway, the way that I'm going
to do it, let me just recite thefirst verse verse of oh holy
night.
Okay, um, it goes like this okay, holy night lyrics.
Okay, right here.
(19:11):
Okay.
Oh holy night, the stars arebrightly shining.
It is the night of our dearsavior's birth.
That's just the preamble.
Here comes the next one.
This is the verse that justgets me Long.
Lay the world in sin and error,pining till he appeared and the
(19:36):
soul felt its worth.
A thrill of hope.
The weary world rejoices, foryonder breaks a new and glorious
morn Now, and then it goes,fall on your knees.
Oh, hear the angels singing.
Oh night divine.
(19:57):
Every time I pull this damnthing, it starts ringing.
Speaker 4 (20:02):
It starts ringing.
Speaker 7 (20:03):
Anyway, here's my, my point.
Oh, holy night.
Um long listen to the words,long lay the world in sin and
error pining.
Now look at the word to pinePine means to wither.
Say that again To wither,you're pining.
(20:25):
When somebody is pining forsomething, you're kind of like
withering for something orlonging for something.
Speaker 8 (20:33):
Longing okay.
Speaker 7 (20:34):
Yeah, the world in sin and error pining, because
the history of humanity is ahistory of sin and error pining.
The world was a weary world andit really is a weary world
(20:55):
rejoices, because the ancientworld was filled with violence
and human sacrifice and allkinds of weird stuff.
And so humanity now this iswhere you and I disagree.
(21:16):
We were separated from god.
We literally became separatedfrom the, the, the, the duct
that fed us the energy withwhich we are to live.
Yeah, in other words, thechannel the channel.
Yes, we are connected to god'sgrace.
And to the degree that we aredisconnected I find it very
(21:40):
interesting, because the wordreligion means to reconnect.
Really, god means reconnect,and so when that connection is
severed, you end up withering,you end up losing the very thing
that gives your life any kindof sense of meaning, which is
(22:00):
the connection with God.
And so long lay the world insin and error, pining.
And then the next sentence isTill he appeared and the soul
felt its worth.
Now, just that sentence Till heappeared and the soul felt its
worth.
What does that mean?
(22:21):
Are we talking about that?
Before then, the soul did notfeel its worth.
And when you look at thehistory of humankind, humankind,
human life, was cheap.
It was cheap until we, you Jewsand us Christians, started
(22:43):
following that every human beingis made in the image and
likeness of God, a little lowerthan the angels, that's right.
And so, till he appeared andthe soul felt its worth for the
first time.
Well, it's a continuity of theJewish Christian tradition, but
the first time, especially inthe Christian tradition, when
(23:05):
you have the incarnation, thesoul felt its worth, the fact
that God had become a human andthat the infinite worth of every
human being was for the firsttime being felt, that were not
thrown away, that a slave wasnot a slave, that a slave was
(23:26):
the dignity of a human, of a sonor daughter of god.
And then the song continuessaying a thrill of hope.
The weary world rejoices, foryonder breaks, a new and
glorious morn.
I always imagine, when you arein a situation of hopelessness
(23:49):
and you first see the glimmer ofa rescue, how that chill comes
over you, that you might beactually able to make it that
thrill of hope.
A weary world rejoices.
The world before the message ofthe gospel, and the ancient
(24:11):
world, and the Jews too.
The whole thing was weary, wewere tired, humanity had nowhere
to go.
It was a cyclical world.
It was a world in which humanbeings were not valued.
It was, I always reminder.
Remember the, the tomb of aroman soldier that I've seen
(24:31):
several times quoted, that theinscription on the tomb said I
was, I am I.
I did not exist.
I did exist, I do not exist.
Now I do not care.
Wow, that is on a Roman tune.
Speaker 10 (24:49):
Hellenism.
Speaker 7 (24:50):
Yeah.
And so you talk about theworthlessness of life, and so
for me, that song is always areminder of the worth of life,
that the fact that that, that aweary world in which the soul
was worth less, the soul feltits worth, and that, to me, is
(25:13):
what we have been living onunder since.
The fact that everybody wantsto be a victim.
In the ancient world, if youwere a victim, people would
applaud, they would want to killthe victim.
In the ancient world, if youwere a victim, people would
applaud, they would want to killthe victim.
That's why you went to thecircus for to watch the victims.
But now, the reason whyeverybody identifies with
victims is because the man onthe cross and in the crucifixion
(25:33):
scene.
It's interesting because theyall went out to see an execution
.
And what did they?
The Bible says, says they allwent away beating their breasts
after the roman soldier saidtruly, this was an innocent man,
so there was no rejoicing ingetting the, the bad guy,
getting executed.
So that's my reflection.
(25:53):
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The answer Johnny Angel, johnny Angel, johnny
Angel, you're an angel to me.
Johnny Angel, how I love you,how I tingle when he passes by.
(28:20):
Every time he says hello, myheart begins to fly.
Johnny Angel, how I want him.
He's got something that I can'tresist, but he doesn't even
(28:41):
know that I exist.
I'm in heaven.
I get carried away.
I dream of him and me and howit's gonna be.
All the fellas call me up for adate, but I just sit and wait.
(29:04):
I'd rather concentrate onJohnny Angel, cause I love him
and I pray that someday he'lllove me and together we will see
how lovely heaven will be.
Speaker 4 (29:25):
And together we will see how lovely heaven will be
Welcome back to A Show of Faith.
I'm AM Ted Siver the Answer.
Speaker 7 (29:34):
I was going to just before we go on to either Rudy
or David.
Speaker 4 (29:38):
David's turn.
Speaker 7 (29:39):
Okay, that song just means a lot to me, mainly
because the more I see ofhumanity, the more I see how
little even in the ancient worldand in the present world, how
little sometimes people holdhuman life in terms of its worth
.
Speaker 4 (29:57):
Right.
Speaker 7 (29:57):
And to me, the moment I hear the soul filter, its
worth and then a thrill of hope.
Those are the two parts thatreally get to me the soul filter
, a thrill of hope.
A weary world rejoices Becausewhenever I study ancient history
I get this sense of tremendousweariness, of a cyclical nature
(30:21):
of the cosmos.
Right, and it just goes.
Speaker 4 (30:23):
Or history.
History was circular.
Speaker 7 (30:26):
Yeah, and that's why we don't see too much in terms
of histories, ancient histories,because it's kind of like
asking somebody to sit in abench and sit before a
merry-go-round and ask them towrite a history for the next
hour of what happens on themerry-go-round.
Speaker 4 (30:44):
That's a good analogy .
Speaker 7 (30:45):
You know, people get on, people get off, People get
on, people get off.
It all goes round and round andthat's it.
Speaker 4 (30:51):
And I don't think the world has changed that much in
however many thousands of years.
There are still segments of oursociety who look at life as
cheap Yep Cheap.
All right, all right, david,you are up.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
Hey, yeah, thanks.
Listen, I've got two too, andboth are Easter-related, because
I thought that was sort of morethe brief, but I really
resonate with Father Mario'schoice.
I'm going to put Miranda on atask, if she doesn't mind.
I'd like for her to find thesong and I'd love to play it in
(31:28):
the next segment.
It's called the Easter Song bya group called the Second
Chapter of Acts.
Speaker 4 (31:37):
That's the name of the group.
Speaker 2 (31:39):
That's the name of the group, the the name of the
group.
The second chapter of acts uhcalled the easter song and it's
a very famous song.
People will uh.
It's easy to find on youtube,it's easy.
So if she can conjure that up,I've got the words here and I
can go through it, but it's awhole lot better to hear than
sing it.
It's only two minutes long andwe wouldn't even have to hear
(32:02):
the whole thing, but you get asense of it.
Okay, so I've got something old, something new.
The something old is Christ,the Lord, is Risen Today.
It's a song written back in1793, excuse me, 1739, about
Charles Wesley.
Charles Wesley was the brotherof John Wesley, who started the
(32:26):
Methodist Church.
And he was a great hymn writerand I just wanted to read the
song and just made a fewcomments about it.
Now, this is not the way thesong you'd sing it.
You'd sing it a littledifferently, but this is the
poem on which it's based.
Christ the Lord.
I'm hearing some no that was me, father Mario, stop it, yep,
(32:53):
stop it.
Speaker 4 (32:54):
Mario's on the air.
Leave him alone, okay.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
Okay, christ, the Lord is risen.
Today, son of men and angels,say raise your joys and triumphs
high.
Sing ye, heavens and earth.
Reply lives again.
Our glorious king.
Where, oh, death, death is nowthy sting.
(33:18):
Once he died our souls to save.
Where thy victory, o grave Love, redeeming's work is done,
fought the fight, the battle won.
Death in vain forbids his rise.
Christ has opened paradise.
(33:40):
So are we now where Christ hasled, following our exalted head,
made like him, like him, werise ours.
The cross, the grave, the skies.
Hail the Lord of earth andheaven.
Praise to thee by both.
Be given Thee we greettriumphant now.
(34:04):
Hail the resurrection, thou,king of glory, soul of bliss,
everlasting life.
Is this Thee to know thy powerto prove Thus to sing and thus
to love.
(34:25):
Well, that's the poem on whichthe hymn is, is, and it's a
great hymn setting.
People who have been a part ofthis um would know it.
It's, it's a hymn settingcalled the christmas excuse me,
the easter hymn, I should say,and there's a number of lines
here.
They're beautiful.
Basically, it's a celebrationof easter, where of Easter,
where it's announced that Christis risen today it's announced,
(34:48):
where the men and angels sayhallelujah, praise God where
earth replies as heaven sings,where earth replies as heaven
sings.
And then there's a number ofbeautiful sort of scriptural
echoes and such, but here's theline that I want to focus on
(35:10):
where it says, soar we now whereChrist has led, following our
exalted head.
In other words, christ is thehead of us, he is leading the
way, he is pioneering the way.
We are made like Christ, andlike Christ, one day we too will
(35:31):
rise, not yet, not now, but oneday we will rise.
Ours the cross, the grave, theskies, but one day we will rise,
ours the cross, the grave, theskies.
In other words, in this life weare to take up our cross and
follow Jesus.
One day we will be laid in thegrave, but on another day that
(35:53):
is yet to come the skies will beour limit.
We will soar in the skies, asChrist has done.
So it's a beautiful hymn becauseit takes just so many elements
of it that death has tried tohold Jesus down.
But death could not hold Jesusdown.
(36:15):
Nothing could hold him down.
He rose from the grave.
The victory is now his andheaven and earth.
Rejoice and give praise, andit's just a fantastic hymn.
As I read those words, Iimagine there were a lot of
Protestants out there.
Maybe others who could humalong with it as well.
(36:37):
I wasn't going to sing andupset.
Speaker 4 (36:42):
Darrell Bock yeah, you're the one who can sing.
Speaker 2 (36:44):
I wasn't going to do that tonight, but I wanted to
read that fantastic poem uponwhich the hymn is based.
Many of our ancient hymns, orolder hymns, were based upon
poems written by greattheologians in their own right,
in their own day, who weredeeply immersed in Scripture and
(37:05):
theology.
So I don't know if Miranda canfind the other one.
Speaker 4 (37:12):
She's got it already.
She's got it.
Had it within 10 seconds.
Speaker 2 (37:17):
Let's go to Rudy before we go to break.
When he comes back, I'd love tohear that song.
Speaker 4 (37:25):
You don't want to play the song and then go to the
break.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
Well, we could do that now, but I want to give
Rudy some time we will when wecome back.
Speaker 5 (37:33):
Play the song.
Yeah, and then we'll come back.
Right, buddy, play the song.
Okay, let's play the song.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
Let's go Play the song.
Speaker 6 (37:44):
Okay, let's play the song.
Hear the bells ringing.
They're singing that we can beborn again.
I think you're going to have tosing that again.
Hear the bells ringing.
They're singing.
Christ is risen from the dead.
The angel upon the tombstonesaid he is risen, just as he
(38:12):
said.
Quickly, now go tell hisdisciples that Jesus Christ is
the Lord and joy to the world.
He is risen.
Hallelujah, he's risen.
Hallelujah, he's risen.
(38:37):
Hallelujah, hallelujah.
Hear the bells ringing.
They're singing that we can beborn again.
Hear the bells ringing.
(38:59):
They're singing.
Christ is risen from the dead.
The angel up on the tombstonehe is risen, just as he said.
Quickly, now, go tell hisdisciples that Jesus Christ is
(39:24):
no longer dead.
Joy to the world, he is risen.
Hallelujah, he's risen.
Hallelujah, he's risen.
Hallelujah, hallelujah,hallelujah.
Speaker 4 (40:00):
David, before we go to the break, that was the hymn
that was based on the poem youread.
Speaker 2 (40:08):
No, no, no, this was the newer song.
I said I had something old andsomething new.
Speaker 4 (40:16):
Okay, then when we come back, you're going to have
to help me understand the words.
I couldn't hear the lyrics.
Okay, gotcha, all right.
Speaker 7 (40:26):
Okay, this is 1070 KNTH and we shall be right back.
Speaker 8 (40:30):
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Speaker 4 (42:58):
The Answer All right, welcome back to A Show of Faith
on AM 107,.
The Answer David, just couldyou quickly go over the lyrics
or at least tell me what it was,because I really couldn't hear
them.
Speaker 2 (43:10):
Yeah, let me just say that there are two songs there
that I had.
The first was Something Oldfrom 1739, written by Charles
Wesley.
Speaker 4 (43:21):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (43:22):
The second one that Miranda.
Thank you, miranda, for findingthat and playing that.
The second one that she playedwas from 1974.
Okay, so it was brand new.
It was a part of the JesusMusic Movement knew it was a
(43:46):
part of the Jesus music movementback in with a group called the
second chapter of Acts.
The person who wrote it wasAnnie Herring, h-e-r-r-i-n-g,
and they made up this vocal bandthat was fantastic, called the
second chapter of Acts.
So here's the words veryquickly.
It's fantastic, paul, thesecond chapter of Acts.
So here's the words veryquickly.
Hear the bells ringing.
They're singing that you can beborn again.
(44:06):
Hear the bells ringing.
They're singing.
Christ is risen from the dead.
The angel up on the tombstonesaid he had risen, just as he
said Quickly, now go tell hisdisciples that Jesus Christ is
no longer dead.
Joy to the world.
(44:26):
He is risen, alleluia.
He is risen, alleluia.
I don't know, father Mario, inyour tradition, but in a number
of traditions when.
Easter arrives, there's a lot ofbells that are rung.
Speaker 7 (44:43):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (44:44):
I don't know if that happens in Catholic.
Speaker 7 (44:46):
It does.
Speaker 2 (44:47):
At the Easter vigil.
Speaker 7 (44:50):
No, just Easter, Sunday mostly.
Speaker 2 (44:52):
Easter Sunday.
Well, depending upon the church, sometimes at the Easter vigil
on Saturday night, these greatbells are rung, and it's
beautiful, it's noisy, it'sglorious.
And so the ringing of the bellsand announcing of the fact that
Christ has risen from the dead,that's what Easter is all about
(45:15):
, and the fact that, too, we canbe born again and that we can
be made right with God throughthat.
So it's a great song, but it'sa song that represents the
sensibilities of the 1970s,whereas the other one was
sensibilities of the 1739.
Speaker 4 (45:37):
I noticed that the second song well, there was no
music to the first one, but thesecond one was a lot more upbeat
, a lot more well, it was modern, so it sounded more modern.
Speaker 2 (45:50):
Well, yeah, because you're saying, I mean, it's the
ringing of the bells, it'srejoicing, it's announcing that
Christ is risen from the deadand that he's risen just like he
said.
That Christ is risen from thedead and that he's risen just
like he said.
And now it's up to thedisciples to get the word out
basically so it's very muchupbeat.
Speaker 4 (46:11):
I want to go to Rudy real soon.
But when you talk about thebells, are you talking about
like bells in a tower or are youtalking about like at the front
of the sanctuary?
Speaker 2 (46:27):
It could be both, oh okay, bells in the, in the, in
the, at the church, you know,because I remember bell tower,
or it can be, uh, the bells thatare like handbells.
Speaker 4 (46:33):
You know, right, that's.
I see that okay, because Iremember hearing bells in a
church tower, but I don't thinkI've heard those for a long time
anywhere.
Speaker 2 (46:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (46:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (46:45):
Hmm, Okay.
Speaker 6 (46:47):
Rudy.
Speaker 4 (46:49):
David, again I want to ask you, like I asked Mario
Did you fully explain what itmeans to you, why those two
songs were important to you?
Speaker 2 (46:59):
Yeah, I think so yeah .
Speaker 4 (47:01):
Okay.
Speaker 5 (47:01):
But also kind of the theology behind okay, all right,
rudy, you're up open, let ussing to the lord, let us make a
joyful noise to the rock of oursalvation.
That's from psalm 95, and I'mreminded of this thing that
Augustine of Hippo used to saySt Augustine, singing belongs to
(47:25):
one who loves, or singing isfor one who loves, and within
this kind of like oral traditionwe hold that he who sings while
praying is like praying twice,right, and so music is sort of a
(47:48):
especially sacred music, musikasakura, right, it's kind of you
were kind of alluding to it inthe beginning and it's
interesting, the song or the onethat you picked, because
fundamentally it's also.
It's interesting the song orthe one that you pick because,
like, fundamentally, it's alsosupposed to teach, right, it's
supposed to transmit tradition,doctrine, what we've learned,
what are what our ancestors to,to some large degree, the
(48:11):
revelation right just throughthrough song.
And so one of the songs that Ithink I also picked, also picked
two, it's this sort of oldSpanish, vilán siso.
It's called Rio Rio Chiu.
Now, rio Rio Chiu doesn'treally mean anything, it's I
(48:34):
don't know how to say this word,but it's onomatopoeic,
onomatopoeic, onomatopoeic it'skind of like when a sound
represents some words.
Speaker 4 (48:50):
It's not an actual meaning, but it's just kind of
like Like chirp-chirp for a bird.
It's spelled out the way itsounds when an animal Like
woof-woof Exactly.
Okay, it's called an on way itsounds when like an animal like
woof, woof Exactly.
Okay, it's called anonomatopoeia.
Onomatopoeia right.
Speaker 2 (49:07):
Onomatopoeia.
Speaker 5 (49:09):
Okay, onomatopoeia, you spell it.
No, that's all.
So the words go like this, andI'm not going to read the whole
thing.
But so it starts Rio Rio Chiu,and I'm of course translating
because this is kind of like oldSpanish.
This was actually written inthe 16th century and it goes Rio
(49:35):
Rio Chiu.
The riverbank protector.
God has protected our lamb fromthe wolf.
Riverbank protector god hasprotected our lamb from the wolf
.
Uh, this one who is born is thegreat monarch, christ, the
patriarch clothed in flesh,flesh.
He has redeemed us by becomingsmall.
Though he was infinite, he hasmade himself finite.
Real, real cheer.
The riverbank protector.
God protected our land from thewolf.
(49:56):
Many prophecies have foretoldit and now, in our days, we have
attained it.
We see, god made human on earthand man in heaven because he
desired it.
Um, I saw a thousand angels whowere singing, flying around,
making a thousand sounds, sayingto the shepherd glory in heaven
and peace on earth, for jesusis born, and it kind of it
(50:17):
continues, but it's a Christmassort of carol that was being
sung at that time, right.
So the words are interestingbecause it kind of captures, and
this is something that I thinkFather Mario was alluding to as
well.
It's just life, and I don'tthink we really realize how bad
(50:41):
life used to be compared to howand I'm not saying we live in a
perfect world, but sort of howsafe we are now right.
So a lot of these songs and alot of the hymns are sort of
geared towards kind of giving usthis assurance, this sort of
feeling of protection from ourcreator.
(51:04):
And this is kind of one of themain things that it's trying to
do.
And sacred music and music ingeneral, it activates what's
interesting to me.
It activates multiple sort ofparts of the brain
simultaneously those responsiblefor language, for processing
emotional response, memory, andso when we hear a familiar song
(51:29):
and Father Mario used the songoh Holy Night, literally our
brain, the way that our brainlights up is something like we
can't find really in anythingelse.
It's just the depth of thatneurological impact that it has
literally transcends acrossmemory, across time, like we're
(51:53):
quite physically and geneticallytapping into something ancient,
right, something that remindsus.
And so it kind of goes abovejust listening to something,
because really, if you thinkabout music and sacred music, it
isn't just, oh, we're gonnahear something, at least within
the Catholic tradition, to andrather, of course, within,
(52:16):
within the right there's andeven in Protestant churches, I
mean, you have this sort ofcontrol of the breath.
Right, there's a physicalresonance that happens.
Right, there's a sort of acommunal thing that's happening.
It kind of ties you in to thepeople around you.
(52:38):
There's an integration thathappens and this transmission
that occurs of these hymns.
You're tapping into somethingthat has been going on for
possibly thousands of years, andI use thousands of years
because of and, of course,within Jewish tradition.
Right, but, rabbi, the otherexample I was going to bring and
(52:58):
I know we have about a minuteleft was the Salve Regina.
The Salve Regina was written inthe 11th century and the way
that we sing it now in Latin,you can still hear it in the
same exact way as it was writtena thousand years ago.
Beautiful thing to be able tothink that man, people have been
(53:19):
participating and sitting thisin liturgy for en masse across a
thousand years.
I mean, it's something thatties you, it has roots, it kind
of gives you something to evenfeel that you belong.
Speaker 4 (53:35):
Right, right.
When everybody sings ittogether, it's unifying.
Speaker 5 (53:47):
Yeah, across time.
Except when Mario does it, thenit's just penitence.
It unifies us in penitence.
Speaker 4 (53:54):
Rudy, is there the two songs that you mentioned?
Why?
Why do they mean so much to you?
Speaker 5 (54:05):
And you've got about 30 seconds.
Well, the first song I actuallyheard it sang by the Monkees.
You guys know who the Monkeesare.
I mean, you guys are a bunch ofold guys.
Speaker 4 (54:12):
Yeah, thanks.
Speaker 5 (54:13):
Okay, so I just heard it, and it's a great rhythm.
The first thing that capturedme is the rhythm, and then it
was the message of the Redemptorand Jesus.
Speaker 4 (54:27):
You're up five seconds.
Speaker 5 (54:28):
Taking on the flesh.
Yeah, go ahead, rabbi, it'sokay All right, yeah, we are
there.
Speaker 7 (54:34):
Well, thank you for listening to the Show of Faith.
Please, during this week, keepus in your prayer, because
you're going to be in ours.
Keep singing.
Speaker 8 (54:42):
Find us at am1070theanswercom.
Download our apps.
Stream us 24-7.
K-n-t-h and K-2-77-D-E-F-MHouston.
There's something happening here.
What?
It is ain't exactly clear.
There's a man with a gun overthere Telling me I've got to
beware.
I think it's time we stopChildren, what's that sound?
(00:25):
Everybody, look what's goingdown.
(00:54):
Stop, everybody's wrong.
Young people speak in theirminds.
So much resistance.
Yep, wait a minute Coming uphere.
We go Almost here.
Give it a second Coming up here.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
We go almost here.
Give it a second.
Welcome to A Show of Faith onAM 1070, the Answer Professor,
priest, millennium rabbidiscussing theology, philosophy,
morality, ethics and anythingelse of interest in religion.
If you have any response to ourtopics or any comments
regarding what we say, hey, we'dlove to hear from you.
Email us at ashowoffaith1070 atgmailcom.
(01:27):
Ashowoffaith1070 at gmailcom.
You can hear our shows againand again by listening pretty
much anywhere podcasts are heard.
Our priest is Fr Mario Arroyo,retired pastor of St Cyril of
Alexandria, the 10,000 block ofWestheimer.
Hello, our professor is DavidCapes, Baptist minister and
director of academic programmingfor the Lanier Theological
(01:48):
Library.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Stuart, you are brilliant.
Speaker 4 (01:52):
I try to be.
Rudy Kong is our millennial.
He's an assistant engineer andhas his master's degree in
theology from the University ofSt Thomas.
Speaker 5 (02:04):
Howdy, howdy, Howdy howdy, howdy, howdy.
Speaker 4 (02:06):
I am Rabbi Stuart Federo, retired rabbi of
Congregation Shahar Shalom, theClear Lake area of Houston,
texas.
Miranda is our board operatorand together Miranda helps us
sound fantastic.
So welcome to A Show of Faithon AM 1070,.
The Answer All right, I am theshow director.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
So, stuart, I hope you had a happy right.
I am the show director, so yes,I did, thank you.
Speaker 4 (02:27):
I hope you all had a happy and blessed Easter.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Thank you very much.
Speaker 4 (02:33):
Okay, so tonight I am show director and, uh, let me,
let me tell you a couple ofstories real quick.
I was ordained in 82.
My first pulpit was inGreenville, mississippi, and
about that time the movement ofJudaism that I am in I guess
(02:56):
ordained from is the ReformMovement, and they came out with
a new prayer book book.
And you'd think the world had aI don't know what opened up and
swallowed people or somethinglike that.
But the reaction to the newprayer book was slow and there
(03:17):
was a group of people who wantedjust let's switch over the new
one.
It'll be the prayer book of thefuture and we should use it.
And, by the way, this was in 82, so that's 43 years ago.
Oh my God, all right.
And what I told them is thatonce a month we were going to
(03:38):
use the old prayer book becauseI did not want to make people
strangers in their own sanctuary.
Why do I tell you that Most ofthe Jewish services are sung,
most of the prayers are sung,and for any one prayer, any one
paragraph, there's probably abillion different tunes that one
could use for each one of theprayers which you'd probably
(03:58):
figure out over the last 2,000years that it would develop that
way.
But why do we have such anattachment to music?
Why is it that a song will gostraight to the soul and the
heart?
At the end of every highholiday season, before I retired
(04:22):
, I would always, you know,thank the cantor that we would
bring in.
And I would say to thecongregation, when the members
of the congregation are leavingthe sanctuary, they are humming
the tunes the cantor sang andcannot remember a word that the
rabbi said in a sermon.
And it's true.
Sermons go to our mind.
(04:43):
The music of the service goesto our hearts and soul and we
form attachments and when wehave services we don't feel like
we've been to the service,unless we hear the songs that
make the service the service.
It would be my analogy it wouldbe like going to a major league
(05:12):
baseball game and not havingthe star-spangled banner begin
the game.
You'd think that there wassomething missing, like you
weren't at a real baseball game.
Because singing thestar-spangled banner, no matter
what team you're there to rootfor, unifies the people and
makes it the American pastime.
And if you don't have that, youfeel something lacking, because
music is so vitally importantand the music goes straight to
(05:34):
the heart and soul.
And if you ask somebody whatdoes the Star Spangled Banner
say, they might even have torecite the words before they
could tell you the meaning ofthe words.
It's not going to come rollingoff their tongue what it's about
.
And so a few weeks, maybe a fewmonths ago, when it was my turn
(05:57):
to be show director, I askedeverybody to bring the text of a
song that was secular, that wefound meaningful and
inspirational or somewhatreligious in some way, shape or
form.
But tonight I asked everybodyto bring songs that were
explicit to a holiday season, aholy day season, whatever the
(06:20):
holiday was, although I wasthinking more, you know Passover
and Easter.
So tonight I asked everybody tobring the text.
We're not going to sing.
I'm sparing all of ourlisteners my singing voice.
You're welcome.
Yay, David, I knew I could relyon you to say yay, all right.
(06:41):
So all right, I guess I willstart and the— Stuart, yes.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
Stuart, yeah, let me interrupt to say I think that's
a brilliant opening.
Well thank you, because there'sso many—there's so much truth
to it.
There have been theologians ofthe past, in Christian
Protestantism in particular,that have said you know, I don't
really need to write thetheology, just let me write the
(07:11):
hymns.
Right, and the hymns are thethings that really do implant
and imprint on our theology.
But, david, why?
Why does?
Speaker 4 (07:21):
it imprint.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
Well, you know, that's the way God made us.
Let me just say that at thebeginning.
Speaker 4 (07:27):
Probably right.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
God made us in such a way that music imprints on us
in a certain way.
And I think it's very meaningful.
A lot of people know, forexample, the song Amazing Grace.
They can sing it, they've heardit in movies, that kind of
thing.
Everybody knows the meaning ofthat.
I can't tell you who wrote it,honestly, but there are a lot of
(07:49):
sermons about grace, butthere's one key song about it
and I just think that music hasthis character to it that it
does that to us, and so I thinkit's a great beginning and I'm
looking forward to learningabout Passover through the songs
(08:11):
, because I've heard yourPassover sermon and, honestly, I
couldn't remember any of it.
Speaker 4 (08:17):
Thank you, david.
You proved my point.
Smart Alec, there we go.
All right, all right, so okay.
So I'll lead off with a song.
This is just real quick.
Um, in the year 70, the templewas destroyed.
The second temple was destroyedand everything for passover
(08:38):
while the temple stood was aboutthe temple.
So the temple was destroyed in70.
Um, they had to develop ahome-centered service that
became the Passover Seder, andwith all the symbols and not
just the symbols but the songs,and over time, like 2,000 years,
give or take whatever it isfrom 70, people would add things
(09:06):
, they would subtract things,they would change this, they'd
add to that, the text would grow, the text would shrink, but it
was malleable.
I don't know what else to callit.
And what I'm going to be readingpart of is one of the songs
(09:28):
that if you went to a PassoverSeder and they did not sing it,
you'd feel really something'smissing.
Like, was this really a Seder?
Was this really?
Because it becomes so integral.
It's called Dayenu, which means, oh, I know so integral.
It's called Dayenu, which means, oh, I know that one.
Hey, you know, it's probably Ipromise not to sing, but it's
(09:51):
probably somewhere on YouTubebut it's called Dayenu, which
means it would have been enoughfor us.
And the chorus is repeating theword Dayenu, da-dayenu,
da-dayenu, da-dayenu, dayenudayenu, and it means it would
have been enough for us.
It would have been enough forus.
It would have been enough forus.
(10:15):
Yeah, but the verses basicallytell the story in song form of
the exodus from Egypt.
So God has bestowed many favorsupon us.
Had God brought us out of Egyptand not executed judgment
against the Egyptians, it wouldhave been enough for us.
(10:36):
And then you sing Dayenu.
And then you take the last partof that sentence, repeat it and
add the next one had Godexecuted judgments against the
Egyptians, but not against theirgods, it would have been enough
.
Dayenu.
And then you sing Dayenu.
Had God executed judgmentsagainst their gods and not put
to death their firstborn, itwould have been enough.
(10:56):
And then you sing Dayenu.
And then had God put to deaththeir firstborn and not given us
their riches, it would havebeen enough.
Dayenu.
And every one of these lines isbased on a verse in the biblical
text of Exodus that tells thestory of coming out of slavery
in Egypt.
So I am going to read the lastparagraph, which goes over every
(11:22):
line of the song?
Okay.
How much more so, then, shouldwe be grateful to God for the
numerous favors that werebestowed upon us?
God brought us out of Egypt,punished the Egyptians, smote
their gods, slew their firstborn, gave us their wealth, split
(11:45):
the sea led for those whoactually think about lyrics.
(12:08):
If any one of those things hadnot happened, we might still be
in slavery in Egypt.
Because God, you know, smotethe Egyptian gods okay, and
brought us to the Nile okay.
(12:30):
Split the Sea of Reeds or RedSea mistranslation, but Sea of
Reeds.
Had God not split the Red Sea,then it brought us back to Egypt
.
We would have been back intoslavery.
So, every step of the way, andwhat is the purpose of that?
You know, everything we do has apurpose, not only when you're
doing it, but it also has asubtle effect on us, and I think
(12:54):
it's to teach us to be verygrateful for every little thing
that happens in our lives, verygrateful for every little thing
that happens in our lives.
That, when it happens, you know, we may take it for granted, we
may ignore it, but especiallyfor us old geezers I'm not
(13:35):
talking about me, mind you Thankyou when you look back and you
see how every step leads broughtyou to where you are and how
had one little thing changed orbeen different, you might not be
sitting here, you might not bedoing whatever you're doing, you
may not be with your boyfriendor your girlfriend or your
husband or your wife, you maynot have had the children you've
(13:56):
got, or whatever the childrenyou've got or whatever.
And a song like this that is sointegral to the Seder that if
you didn't sing it you'd feellike something was missing,
becomes so important because itteaches that lesson.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Well, that's a great word.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
Well, and there are other songs that do the same
thing.
You know, if it hadn't been forthis or or uh, what's the one
about swallowing a fly, whereevery little step um, I can't
remember it, but it, but this isthe song that we sing at the
Seder.
It's one of the many, manysongs that we sing at the Seder,
and I think it has anincredible lesson of gratitude
(14:44):
that's very much missing in ourpresent society.
All right, we are about time togo to a break, though.
Speaker 7 (14:50):
Yep, this is 1070 KNTH.
I will be right back.
Speaker 8 (14:54):
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The answer.
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And a time to every purpose under heaven.
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A time to laugh, a time to heal, a time to laugh, a
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Speaker 4 (17:45):
Welcome back to A Show of Faith on AM 1070, the
Answer.
So we're talking aboutreligious music and how it
affects us, how it grabs a holdof us, how it touches us.
And, Mario, you want to go next?
Speaker 7 (18:01):
Yeah, when Rabbi sent this out, god, I hate this.
When Rabbi sent this out, hesaid songs that had meaning for
holy days, right, and I didn'tunderstand it.
Speaker 10 (18:20):
To be just no, no, that's fine my, my favorite holy
day song.
Speaker 7 (18:25):
Um is a christmas song, which is um, oh, holy
night, and the reason is justfor the first um, the first um
verse.
I guess you would say Okay,because it says something that
has given me a tremendous amountof insight in terms of how to
(18:51):
interpret history, and so,anyway, the way that I'm going
to do it, let me just recite thefirst verse verse of oh holy
night.
Okay, um, it goes like this okay, holy night lyrics.
Okay, right here.
(19:11):
Okay.
Oh holy night, the stars arebrightly shining.
It is the night of our dearsavior's birth.
That's just the preamble.
Here comes the next one.
This is the verse that justgets me Long.
Lay the world in sin and error,pining till he appeared and the
(19:36):
soul felt its worth.
A thrill of hope.
The weary world rejoices, foryonder breaks a new and glorious
morn Now, and then it goes,fall on your knees.
Oh, hear the angels singing.
Oh night divine.
(19:57):
Every time I pull this damnthing, it starts ringing.
Speaker 4 (20:02):
It starts ringing.
Speaker 7 (20:03):
Anyway, here's my, my point.
Oh, holy night.
Um long listen to the words,long lay the world in sin and
error pining.
Now look at the word to pinePine means to wither.
Say that again To wither,you're pining.
(20:25):
When somebody is pining forsomething, you're kind of like
withering for something orlonging for something.
Speaker 8 (20:33):
Longing okay.
Speaker 7 (20:34):
Yeah, the world in sin and error pining, because
the history of humanity is ahistory of sin and error pining.
The world was a weary world andit really is a weary world
(20:55):
rejoices, because the ancientworld was filled with violence
and human sacrifice and allkinds of weird stuff.
And so humanity now this iswhere you and I disagree.
(21:16):
We were separated from god.
We literally became separatedfrom the, the, the, the duct
that fed us the energy withwhich we are to live.
Yeah, in other words, thechannel the channel.
Yes, we are connected to god'sgrace.
And to the degree that we aredisconnected I find it very
(21:40):
interesting, because the wordreligion means to reconnect.
Really, god means reconnect,and so when that connection is
severed, you end up withering,you end up losing the very thing
that gives your life any kindof sense of meaning, which is
(22:00):
the connection with God.
And so long lay the world insin and error, pining.
And then the next sentence isTill he appeared and the soul
felt its worth.
Now, just that sentence Till heappeared and the soul felt its
worth.
What does that mean?
(22:21):
Are we talking about that?
Before then, the soul did notfeel its worth.
And when you look at thehistory of humankind, humankind,
human life, was cheap.
It was cheap until we, you Jewsand us Christians, started
(22:43):
following that every human beingis made in the image and
likeness of God, a little lowerthan the angels, that's right.
And so, till he appeared andthe soul felt its worth for the
first time.
Well, it's a continuity of theJewish Christian tradition, but
the first time, especially inthe Christian tradition, when
(23:05):
you have the incarnation, thesoul felt its worth, the fact
that God had become a human andthat the infinite worth of every
human being was for the firsttime being felt, that were not
thrown away, that a slave wasnot a slave, that a slave was
(23:26):
the dignity of a human, of a sonor daughter of god.
And then the song continuessaying a thrill of hope.
The weary world rejoices, foryonder breaks, a new and
glorious morn.
I always imagine, when you arein a situation of hopelessness
(23:49):
and you first see the glimmer ofa rescue, how that chill comes
over you, that you might beactually able to make it that
thrill of hope.
A weary world rejoices.
The world before the message ofthe gospel, and the ancient
(24:11):
world, and the Jews too.
The whole thing was weary, wewere tired, humanity had nowhere
to go.
It was a cyclical world.
It was a world in which humanbeings were not valued.
It was, I always reminder.
Remember the, the tomb of aroman soldier that I've seen
(24:31):
several times quoted, that theinscription on the tomb said I
was, I am I.
I did not exist.
I did exist, I do not exist.
Now I do not care.
Wow, that is on a Roman tune.
Speaker 10 (24:49):
Hellenism.
Speaker 7 (24:50):
Yeah.
And so you talk about theworthlessness of life, and so
for me, that song is always areminder of the worth of life,
that the fact that that, that aweary world in which the soul
was worth less, the soul feltits worth, and that, to me, is
(25:13):
what we have been living onunder since.
The fact that everybody wantsto be a victim.
In the ancient world, if youwere a victim, people would
applaud, they would want to killthe victim.
In the ancient world, if youwere a victim, people would
applaud, they would want to killthe victim.
That's why you went to thecircus for to watch the victims.
But now, the reason whyeverybody identifies with
victims is because the man onthe cross and in the crucifixion
(25:33):
scene.
It's interesting because theyall went out to see an execution
.
And what did they?
The Bible says, says they allwent away beating their breasts
after the roman soldier saidtruly, this was an innocent man,
so there was no rejoicing ingetting the, the bad guy,
getting executed.
So that's my reflection.
(25:53):
All right, we have to go to abreak.
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The answer Johnny Angel, johnny Angel, johnny
Angel, you're an angel to me.
Johnny Angel, how I love you,how I tingle when he passes by.
(28:20):
Every time he says hello, myheart begins to fly.
Johnny Angel, how I want him.
He's got something that I can'tresist, but he doesn't even
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know that I exist.
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I'd rather concentrate onJohnny Angel, cause I love him
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Speaker 4 (29:25):
And together we will see how lovely heaven will be
Welcome back to A Show of Faith.
I'm AM Ted Siver the Answer.
Speaker 7 (29:34):
I was going to just before we go on to either Rudy
or David.
Speaker 4 (29:38):
David's turn.
Speaker 7 (29:39):
Okay, that song just means a lot to me, mainly
because the more I see ofhumanity, the more I see how
little even in the ancient worldand in the present world, how
little sometimes people holdhuman life in terms of its worth
.
Speaker 4 (29:57):
Right.
Speaker 7 (29:57):
And to me, the moment I hear the soul filter, its
worth and then a thrill of hope.
Those are the two parts thatreally get to me the soul filter
, a thrill of hope.
A weary world rejoices Becausewhenever I study ancient history
I get this sense of tremendousweariness, of a cyclical nature
(30:21):
of the cosmos.
Right, and it just goes.
Speaker 4 (30:23):
Or history.
History was circular.
Speaker 7 (30:26):
Yeah, and that's why we don't see too much in terms
of histories, ancient histories,because it's kind of like
asking somebody to sit in abench and sit before a
merry-go-round and ask them towrite a history for the next
hour of what happens on themerry-go-round.
Speaker 4 (30:44):
That's a good analogy .
Speaker 7 (30:45):
You know, people get on, people get off, People get
on, people get off.
It all goes round and round andthat's it.
Speaker 4 (30:51):
And I don't think the world has changed that much in
however many thousands of years.
There are still segments of oursociety who look at life as
cheap Yep Cheap.
All right, all right, david,you are up.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
Hey, yeah, thanks.
Listen, I've got two too, andboth are Easter-related, because
I thought that was sort of morethe brief, but I really
resonate with Father Mario'schoice.
I'm going to put Miranda on atask, if she doesn't mind.
I'd like for her to find thesong and I'd love to play it in
(31:28):
the next segment.
It's called the Easter Song bya group called the Second
Chapter of Acts.
Speaker 4 (31:37):
That's the name of the group.
Speaker 2 (31:39):
That's the name of the group, the the name of the
group.
The second chapter of acts uhcalled the easter song and it's
a very famous song.
People will uh.
It's easy to find on youtube,it's easy.
So if she can conjure that up,I've got the words here and I
can go through it, but it's awhole lot better to hear than
sing it.
It's only two minutes long andwe wouldn't even have to hear
(32:02):
the whole thing, but you get asense of it.
Okay, so I've got something old, something new.
The something old is Christ,the Lord, is Risen Today.
It's a song written back in1793, excuse me, 1739, about
Charles Wesley.
Charles Wesley was the brotherof John Wesley, who started the
(32:26):
Methodist Church.
And he was a great hymn writerand I just wanted to read the
song and just made a fewcomments about it.
Now, this is not the way thesong you'd sing it.
You'd sing it a littledifferently, but this is the
poem on which it's based.
Christ the Lord.
I'm hearing some no that was me, father Mario, stop it, yep,
(32:53):
stop it.
Speaker 4 (32:54):
Mario's on the air.
Leave him alone, okay.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
Okay, christ, the Lord is risen.
Today, son of men and angels,say raise your joys and triumphs
high.
Sing ye, heavens and earth.
Reply lives again.
Our glorious king.
Where, oh, death, death is nowthy sting.
(33:18):
Once he died our souls to save.
Where thy victory, o grave Love, redeeming's work is done,
fought the fight, the battle won.
Death in vain forbids his rise.
Christ has opened paradise.
(33:40):
So are we now where Christ hasled, following our exalted head,
made like him, like him, werise ours.
The cross, the grave, the skies.
Hail the Lord of earth andheaven.
Praise to thee by both.
Be given Thee we greettriumphant now.
(34:04):
Hail the resurrection, thou,king of glory, soul of bliss,
everlasting life.
Is this Thee to know thy powerto prove Thus to sing and thus
to love.
(34:25):
Well, that's the poem on whichthe hymn is, is, and it's a
great hymn setting.
People who have been a part ofthis um would know it.
It's, it's a hymn settingcalled the christmas excuse me,
the easter hymn, I should say,and there's a number of lines
here.
They're beautiful.
Basically, it's a celebrationof easter, where of Easter,
where it's announced that Christis risen today it's announced,
(34:48):
where the men and angels sayhallelujah, praise God where
earth replies as heaven sings,where earth replies as heaven
sings.
And then there's a number ofbeautiful sort of scriptural
echoes and such, but here's theline that I want to focus on
(35:10):
where it says, soar we now whereChrist has led, following our
exalted head.
In other words, christ is thehead of us, he is leading the
way, he is pioneering the way.
We are made like Christ, andlike Christ, one day we too will
(35:31):
rise, not yet, not now, but oneday we will rise.
Ours the cross, the grave, theskies, but one day we will rise,
ours the cross, the grave, theskies.
In other words, in this life weare to take up our cross and
follow Jesus.
One day we will be laid in thegrave, but on another day that
(35:53):
is yet to come the skies will beour limit.
We will soar in the skies, asChrist has done.
So it's a beautiful hymn becauseit takes just so many elements
of it that death has tried tohold Jesus down.
But death could not hold Jesusdown.
(36:15):
Nothing could hold him down.
He rose from the grave.
The victory is now his andheaven and earth.
Rejoice and give praise, andit's just a fantastic hymn.
As I read those words, Iimagine there were a lot of
Protestants out there.
Maybe others who could humalong with it as well.
(36:37):
I wasn't going to sing andupset.
Speaker 4 (36:42):
Darrell Bock yeah, you're the one who can sing.
Speaker 2 (36:44):
I wasn't going to do that tonight, but I wanted to
read that fantastic poem uponwhich the hymn is based.
Many of our ancient hymns, orolder hymns, were based upon
poems written by greattheologians in their own right,
in their own day, who weredeeply immersed in Scripture and
(37:05):
theology.
So I don't know if Miranda canfind the other one.
Speaker 4 (37:12):
She's got it already.
She's got it.
Had it within 10 seconds.
Speaker 2 (37:17):
Let's go to Rudy before we go to break.
When he comes back, I'd love tohear that song.
Speaker 4 (37:25):
You don't want to play the song and then go to the
break.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
Well, we could do that now, but I want to give
Rudy some time we will when wecome back.
Speaker 5 (37:33):
Play the song.
Yeah, and then we'll come back.
Right, buddy, play the song.
Okay, let's play the song.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
Let's go Play the song.
Speaker 6 (37:44):
Okay, let's play the song.
Hear the bells ringing.
They're singing that we can beborn again.
I think you're going to have tosing that again.
Hear the bells ringing.
They're singing.
Christ is risen from the dead.
The angel upon the tombstonesaid he is risen, just as he
(38:12):
said.
Quickly, now go tell hisdisciples that Jesus Christ is
the Lord and joy to the world.
He is risen.
Hallelujah, he's risen.
Hallelujah, he's risen.
(38:37):
Hallelujah, hallelujah.
Hear the bells ringing.
They're singing that we can beborn again.
Hear the bells ringing.
(38:59):
They're singing.
Christ is risen from the dead.
The angel up on the tombstonehe is risen, just as he said.
Quickly, now, go tell hisdisciples that Jesus Christ is
(39:24):
no longer dead.
Joy to the world, he is risen.
Hallelujah, he's risen.
Hallelujah, he's risen.
Hallelujah, hallelujah,hallelujah.
Speaker 4 (40:00):
David, before we go to the break, that was the hymn
that was based on the poem youread.
Speaker 2 (40:08):
No, no, no, this was the newer song.
I said I had something old andsomething new.
Speaker 4 (40:16):
Okay, then when we come back, you're going to have
to help me understand the words.
I couldn't hear the lyrics.
Okay, gotcha, all right.
Speaker 7 (40:26):
Okay, this is 1070 KNTH and we shall be right back.
Speaker 8 (40:30):
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Speaker 4 (42:58):
The Answer All right, welcome back to A Show of Faith
on AM 107,.
The Answer David, just couldyou quickly go over the lyrics
or at least tell me what it was,because I really couldn't hear
them.
Speaker 2 (43:10):
Yeah, let me just say that there are two songs there
that I had.
The first was Something Oldfrom 1739, written by Charles
Wesley.
Speaker 4 (43:21):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (43:22):
The second one that Miranda.
Thank you, miranda, for findingthat and playing that.
The second one that she playedwas from 1974.
Okay, so it was brand new.
It was a part of the JesusMusic Movement knew it was a
(43:46):
part of the Jesus music movementback in with a group called the
second chapter of Acts.
The person who wrote it wasAnnie Herring, h-e-r-r-i-n-g,
and they made up this vocal bandthat was fantastic, called the
second chapter of Acts.
So here's the words veryquickly.
It's fantastic, paul, thesecond chapter of Acts.
So here's the words veryquickly.
Hear the bells ringing.
They're singing that you can beborn again.
(44:06):
Hear the bells ringing.
They're singing.
Christ is risen from the dead.
The angel up on the tombstonesaid he had risen, just as he
said Quickly, now go tell hisdisciples that Jesus Christ is
no longer dead.
Joy to the world.
(44:26):
He is risen, alleluia.
He is risen, alleluia.
I don't know, father Mario, inyour tradition, but in a number
of traditions when.
Easter arrives, there's a lot ofbells that are rung.
Speaker 7 (44:43):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (44:44):
I don't know if that happens in Catholic.
Speaker 7 (44:46):
It does.
Speaker 2 (44:47):
At the Easter vigil.
Speaker 7 (44:50):
No, just Easter, Sunday mostly.
Speaker 2 (44:52):
Easter Sunday.
Well, depending upon the church, sometimes at the Easter vigil
on Saturday night, these greatbells are rung, and it's
beautiful, it's noisy, it'sglorious.
And so the ringing of the bellsand announcing of the fact that
Christ has risen from the dead,that's what Easter is all about
(45:15):
, and the fact that, too, we canbe born again and that we can
be made right with God throughthat.
So it's a great song, but it'sa song that represents the
sensibilities of the 1970s,whereas the other one was
sensibilities of the 1739.
Speaker 4 (45:37):
I noticed that the second song well, there was no
music to the first one, but thesecond one was a lot more upbeat
, a lot more well, it was modern, so it sounded more modern.
Speaker 2 (45:50):
Well, yeah, because you're saying, I mean, it's the
ringing of the bells, it'srejoicing, it's announcing that
Christ is risen from the deadand that he's risen just like he
said.
That Christ is risen from thedead and that he's risen just
like he said.
And now it's up to thedisciples to get the word out
basically so it's very muchupbeat.
Speaker 4 (46:11):
I want to go to Rudy real soon.
But when you talk about thebells, are you talking about
like bells in a tower or are youtalking about like at the front
of the sanctuary?
Speaker 2 (46:27):
It could be both, oh okay, bells in the, in the, in
the, at the church, you know,because I remember bell tower,
or it can be, uh, the bells thatare like handbells.
Speaker 4 (46:33):
You know, right, that's.
I see that okay, because Iremember hearing bells in a
church tower, but I don't thinkI've heard those for a long time
anywhere.
Speaker 2 (46:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (46:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (46:45):
Hmm, Okay.
Speaker 6 (46:47):
Rudy.
Speaker 4 (46:49):
David, again I want to ask you, like I asked Mario
Did you fully explain what itmeans to you, why those two
songs were important to you?
Speaker 2 (46:59):
Yeah, I think so yeah .
Speaker 4 (47:01):
Okay.
Speaker 5 (47:01):
But also kind of the theology behind okay, all right,
rudy, you're up open, let ussing to the lord, let us make a
joyful noise to the rock of oursalvation.
That's from psalm 95, and I'mreminded of this thing that
Augustine of Hippo used to saySt Augustine, singing belongs to
(47:25):
one who loves, or singing isfor one who loves, and within
this kind of like oral traditionwe hold that he who sings while
praying is like praying twice,right, and so music is sort of a
(47:48):
especially sacred music, musikasakura, right, it's kind of you
were kind of alluding to it inthe beginning and it's
interesting, the song or the onethat you picked, because
fundamentally it's also.
It's interesting the song orthe one that you pick because,
like, fundamentally, it's alsosupposed to teach, right, it's
supposed to transmit tradition,doctrine, what we've learned,
what are what our ancestors to,to some large degree, the
(48:11):
revelation right just throughthrough song.
And so one of the songs that Ithink I also picked, also picked
two, it's this sort of oldSpanish, vilán siso.
It's called Rio Rio Chiu.
Now, rio Rio Chiu doesn'treally mean anything, it's I
(48:34):
don't know how to say this word,but it's onomatopoeic,
onomatopoeic, onomatopoeic it'skind of like when a sound
represents some words.
Speaker 4 (48:50):
It's not an actual meaning, but it's just kind of
like Like chirp-chirp for a bird.
It's spelled out the way itsounds when an animal Like
woof-woof Exactly.
Okay, it's called an on way itsounds when like an animal like
woof, woof Exactly.
Okay, it's called anonomatopoeia.
Onomatopoeia right.
Speaker 2 (49:07):
Onomatopoeia.
Speaker 5 (49:09):
Okay, onomatopoeia, you spell it.
No, that's all.
So the words go like this, andI'm not going to read the whole
thing.
But so it starts Rio Rio Chiu,and I'm of course translating
because this is kind of like oldSpanish.
This was actually written inthe 16th century and it goes Rio
(49:35):
Rio Chiu.
The riverbank protector.
God has protected our lamb fromthe wolf.
Riverbank protector god hasprotected our lamb from the wolf
.
Uh, this one who is born is thegreat monarch, christ, the
patriarch clothed in flesh,flesh.
He has redeemed us by becomingsmall.
Though he was infinite, he hasmade himself finite.
Real, real cheer.
The riverbank protector.
God protected our land from thewolf.
(49:56):
Many prophecies have foretoldit and now, in our days, we have
attained it.
We see, god made human on earthand man in heaven because he
desired it.
Um, I saw a thousand angels whowere singing, flying around,
making a thousand sounds, sayingto the shepherd glory in heaven
and peace on earth, for jesusis born, and it kind of it
(50:17):
continues, but it's a Christmassort of carol that was being
sung at that time, right.
So the words are interestingbecause it kind of captures, and
this is something that I thinkFather Mario was alluding to as
well.
It's just life, and I don'tthink we really realize how bad
(50:41):
life used to be compared to howand I'm not saying we live in a
perfect world, but sort of howsafe we are now right.
So a lot of these songs and alot of the hymns are sort of
geared towards kind of giving usthis assurance, this sort of
feeling of protection from ourcreator.
(51:04):
And this is kind of one of themain things that it's trying to
do.
And sacred music and music ingeneral, it activates what's
interesting to me.
It activates multiple sort ofparts of the brain
simultaneously those responsiblefor language, for processing
emotional response, memory, andso when we hear a familiar song
(51:29):
and Father Mario used the songoh Holy Night, literally our
brain, the way that our brainlights up is something like we
can't find really in anythingelse.
It's just the depth of thatneurological impact that it has
literally transcends acrossmemory, across time, like we're
(51:53):
quite physically and geneticallytapping into something ancient,
right, something that remindsus.
And so it kind of goes abovejust listening to something,
because really, if you thinkabout music and sacred music, it
isn't just, oh, we're gonnahear something, at least within
the Catholic tradition, to andrather, of course, within,
(52:16):
within the right there's andeven in Protestant churches, I
mean, you have this sort ofcontrol of the breath.
Right, there's a physicalresonance that happens.
Right, there's a sort of acommunal thing that's happening.
It kind of ties you in to thepeople around you.
(52:38):
There's an integration thathappens and this transmission
that occurs of these hymns.
You're tapping into somethingthat has been going on for
possibly thousands of years, andI use thousands of years
because of and, of course,within Jewish tradition.
Right, but, rabbi, the otherexample I was going to bring and
(52:58):
I know we have about a minuteleft was the Salve Regina.
The Salve Regina was written inthe 11th century and the way
that we sing it now in Latin,you can still hear it in the
same exact way as it was writtena thousand years ago.
Beautiful thing to be able tothink that man, people have been
(53:19):
participating and sitting thisin liturgy for en masse across a
thousand years.
I mean, it's something thatties you, it has roots, it kind
of gives you something to evenfeel that you belong.
Speaker 4 (53:35):
Right, right.
When everybody sings ittogether, it's unifying.
Speaker 5 (53:47):
Yeah, across time.
Except when Mario does it, thenit's just penitence.
It unifies us in penitence.
Speaker 4 (53:54):
Rudy, is there the two songs that you mentioned?
Why?
Why do they mean so much to you?
Speaker 5 (54:05):
And you've got about 30 seconds.
Well, the first song I actuallyheard it sang by the Monkees.
You guys know who the Monkeesare.
I mean, you guys are a bunch ofold guys.
Speaker 4 (54:12):
Yeah, thanks.
Speaker 5 (54:13):
Okay, so I just heard it, and it's a great rhythm.
The first thing that capturedme is the rhythm, and then it
was the message of the Redemptorand Jesus.
Speaker 4 (54:27):
You're up five seconds.
Speaker 5 (54:28):
Taking on the flesh.
Yeah, go ahead, rabbi, it'sokay All right, yeah, we are
there.
Speaker 7 (54:34):
Well, thank you for listening to the Show of Faith.
Please, during this week, keepus in your prayer, because
you're going to be in ours.
Keep singing.
Speaker 8 (54:42):
Find us at am1070theanswercom.
Download our apps.
Stream us 24-7.
K-n-t-h and K-2-77-D-E-F-MHouston.
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