March 3, 2025 • 54 mins
What does it mean to pursue peace in a world shadowed by conflict?
In this episode of A Show of Faith, we tackle this complex question through insightful dialogues among our diverse panel. As we often see global tensions rise, particularly with ongoing situations like the conflict between Ukraine and Russia, our hosts reflect on the intricate relationship between war, peace, and ethical leadership.
Join us as we explore how different faiths view peace and the underlying justice that should accompany it. Rabbi Stuart provides rich insights on the Hebrew word “shalom,” emphasizing that true peace means everything being in its rightful place—not merely the absence of war. Father Mario engages with the principles of Just War Theory, stressing the moral considerations necessary to justify conflict. In between, Rudy shares the millennial perspective, reminding us of the importance of active civic engagement in a world ripe with dissonance.
By delving into these crucial themes, we stimulate awareness about our roles in perpetuating conflict or fostering peace. We invite our audience to reflect on their thoughts regarding current global issues and how dialogue shapes our understanding of complex moral dilemmas. Let's engage in this timely conversation about today's weighty matters of war and justice.
Your thoughts matter; join our community as we navigate these critical topics together. Remember to subscribe, share, and leave your review!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
There's something happening here, what it is ain't
exactly clear.
There's a man with a gun overthere Telling me I've got to
beware.
I think it's time we stopChildren.
(00:25):
What's that sound?
Everybody look what's goingdown.
There's battle lines beingdrawn.
Nobody's right if everybody'swrong.
(00:47):
Young people speak in theirminds, Getting so much
resistance from behind Everytime we stop.
Hey, what's that sound?
Everybody look what's goingdown.
What's that sound?
Everybody look what's goingdown.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Welcome to A Show of Faith where a professor, priest,
millennial and rabbi discusstheology, philosophy, morality,
ethics, anything of interest inreligion.
If you have any response to ourtopics or any comments
regarding what we say, hey, we'dlove to hear from you.
So email us at ashowoffaith1070at gmailcom.
(01:28):
That's a new email address forour email ashowoffaith1070 at
gmailcom.
You can hear our shows againand again by listening pretty
much anywhere podcasts are heard.
Our priest is Father MarioArroyo, retired pastor of St
Cyril of Alexandria, the 10,000block of Westheimer.
Hello, our professor is DavidCapes, baptist minister and
(01:50):
director of academic programmingfor the Lanier Theological
Library.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Hey, great to see you guys this evening.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Hey and Rudy Kogas, our millennial systems engineer.
Master's degree in theologyfrom University of St Thomas.
I am Rabbi Stuart Federo,retired rabbi of Congregation
Shaar HaShalom in the Clear Lakearea of Houston, texas.
Miranda's our board operator.
Yeah, and tonight Crystal, whatCrystal Krista.
Crystal Crystal is here alsohelping us and Miranda and
(02:20):
Crystal help us sound fantastic.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
We sure hope so.
Now, rudy, I just got a notefrom Rudy.
He said he's trying to call in,but take a look and see.
Okay, hey.
Rudy, try it if you can hear me, if you can hear me down there
in Guatemala.
Father Mario, you've beenthrough a rough time, have you?
Yes, you've been through arough time.
How did you know that I could?
Speaker 4 (02:42):
tell Just, you've been through a rough time.
How did you know that I couldtell Just by some things on my
face?
Just because of the stuff onyour face?
Yeah, no, I had some dentalimplants.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Dental implants.
Yeah, that's exciting.
Speaker 4 (02:54):
Yeah, that's expensive it is.
It's a full upper arch.
Speaker 3 (03:01):
Okay, wow, all the way around.
Everything on the front,everything, whoa.
Speaker 4 (03:07):
And they do it on just a one shot, In other words
not individual.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
So you get everything ready and you get it all lined
up and you just kind of go.
Speaker 4 (03:17):
There was a few teeth that needed to be pulled Right,
and then they stuck the roots.
You know for the implantsUh-huh.
And then they stuck the roots.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
You know for the implants Uh-huh, and then they
stuck the implants in and theseare Wow, wow, wow.
These are the implants and nowyou've got to eat soft food for
a while.
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (03:36):
And then I get the permanent ones in three months.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
I sure hope you like scrambled eggs.
Oh God no.
Speaker 4 (03:44):
Anyway, life goes on.
Speaker 3 (03:46):
Split pea goes on.
Huh, not how do you like?
Yeah, yeah, so hopefully rudycan can get in and get through.
Speaker 4 (03:55):
Yeah well, because of mario's mouth, he'll be able to
get into where that is easierah you know, you know, it is a
sad day when someone who hasbeen suffering something is
being made fun of in the orderof radio.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
I thought it was fun.
It is, yeah, sad day.
He has had it.
Speaker 4 (04:14):
Rudy's back.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
Rudy's on.
Oh, Rudy's on Rudy, welcomeRudester.
Hello Rudy, I don't think he'son Rudy, welcome Rudester.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
Hello Rudy.
Speaker 4 (04:29):
I don't think he's on .
Speaker 3 (04:29):
He'll be on here, there we go.
Speaker 4 (04:34):
Rudy.
Speaker 8 (04:37):
No, you guys are here .
Oh there we go.
Speaker 3 (04:39):
Okay, we got you.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Now we're stuck with him.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
Okay, yeah, we're stuck.
Hey, guys, good to be with you.
Hey, I'm show director tonight,which is good because Father
Mario is here, but you knowwe're working on helping him
feel better, right?
Yes, we're going to bless him.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Right, we will not put the burden upon him tonight.
Speaker 3 (04:59):
That's right, we'll put the burden upon somebody
else.
Hey, you know, this week therewas a very rough sort of dust up
Just a little In the OvalOffice.
Yeah, in the Oval Officebetween the President of Ukraine
and the President of the UnitedStates and the Vice President
and the Vice President as well.
Rudy, I don't know if it madenews down in your world, part of
(05:23):
the world down there.
Did you see that down here?
Speaker 8 (05:27):
Luckily for you, I've been somewhat Americanized and
I do so.
It's actually been on the newshere too.
It's kind of world famousbecause he's being at least in
the left-leaning circles.
He's kind of being portrayed assort of an anti-freedom
(05:51):
character.
Trump is right for coming downon the president of Ukraine for
this, but we can talk more aboutthat later.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
Yeah, zelensky, apparently, and you know, I
don't know the protocols ofthese kind of things, of what
you can say and what you can'tsay, and those kinds of things
when it comes to, you know, inthe Oval Office, and
particularly with the camerasrolling, right, Right,
especially with the camerasrolling.
It's one thing it's one thing,and so the two things that I I
(06:23):
understand reading the New YorkTimes is that President Trump
was hoping well, he was hopingto hear just a big, big, big
thank you for, you know, fromUkraine for all the kind of help
that the US has been giving fora time, billions and billions
of dollars.
(06:44):
That's one thing, and thesecond thing he didn't want to
hear was a plea from thepresident of Ukraine that we
would guarantee the security ofUkraine in the future if we had
some sort of a peace deal, sothat we ourselves, as a country,
(07:05):
would be the ones.
Our president was not ready tohear that at this particular
point.
So, at any rate, we'll justhave to wait and see what
happens in the time that goes on.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
As I said before we came on the air, I think it's
psychological.
I think, that the president ofthe United States knows he's
going to back out of helping theUkraine, so he's creating a
scenario to rationalize andjustify his doing that.
Okay, I think that when you getinto this tiff, or he uses an
(07:42):
excuse or a reason to get upset,kick him out, whatever that.
This is.
This is the way people reactwhen they know they're about to
do something wrong, or they wantto rationalize or justify
you're saying that of Trump.
Speaker 4 (07:55):
Yes, I am.
I am not.
I disagree with you.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
I'm sure you do.
I disagree with you, butremember it was Putin who
invaded the Ukraine.
I don't disagree with you there.
Speaker 4 (08:05):
The Russians are the I agree with you there.
But here's what.
What are you saying?
Oh, I hear myself really loud.
I can hear you too Really loud,yes, Anyway.
No see, there's a differencebetween what is called ideal
politics and real politics.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Right, okay, and real politics should never be in
public.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
No, real politique is what Trump is doing.
Trump does not want theshooting and the killing to go
on and he's also saying I don'twant to commit the United States
to defend Zelensky and Ukraineand get us into World War III
(08:52):
with the Russians, because toRussia Ukraine is an extremely
important neighbor and they seeit as a threat.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
I see it like the?
Speaker 4 (09:04):
U and mexico okay, so so all that trump is saying is
look europe, europe in nato hasnot even spent the normal part
of what they should be spendingin terms of defense.
And is that new?
No, but it shouldn't be thatway.
It shouldn't just be cause, ofcourse not.
So all that Trump is saying isI'm not going to commit to
(09:29):
defend Ukraine, which is 5,000miles away, when you Europeans
are not doing your part and youare living off of United States
largesse and you want to defend.
You put more money into yourdefense and you defend them
Right but I don't think that.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
I just think that the overzealousness of the arguing
and the you know, I think, isthe psychological part.
Speaker 4 (09:54):
No, I don't.
I disagree with you 100%.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
So you think it was set up or intellectually created
?
Speaker 4 (09:58):
No, I think Zelensky wants the guarantees the United
States would actually go to warwith.
Russia on behalf of Ukraine andI don't think.
And Trump is saying I ain'tdoing that.
And then he's saying look,europe, if you think it's that
important.
They are a heck of a lot closerto you than they are to us.
(10:22):
They're a threat more to youthan they are to us.
Step up.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
And with that I agree , because NATO has never they've
always relied on the US to payfor everything.
Speaker 4 (10:32):
But Trump has come to the point of saying enough.
And here's the next part.
That's interesting.
I'll get the commentator.
His name is on my mind, butanyway, he was saying one of the
things that has happened thatchanged the mind of everybody is
that we used to think Russiawas a really strong superpower.
(10:56):
They're not.
They're not.
They tried to invade Ukraine,and without even any soldiers
from NATO, without any soldiersfrom NATOo, without any soldiers
or nature, just arms, kept themat bay ukraine, and so they
have no ability to considerthemselves an equal superpower
to the united states.
They problem themselves to bepretty much of a paper tiger.
(11:17):
Their equipment is awful, andand, and they, they just don't
have it.
And so Trump is saying look,nato made.
Why was NATO created?
It was created to defendagainst Russia, okay, communism.
If you look at Russia right now, they are not able to even
mount without even NATOinvolvement.
(11:41):
They couldn't mount anythingagainst the Ukrainians.
And so NATO is not as criticalas it used to be.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
NATO is not as critical.
That's correct.
Speaker 4 (11:51):
It is important but not as critical as it used to be
Right.
But I think no, no, Mario holdon.
Speaker 8 (11:58):
I just need to make this very clear the reason that
NATO is critical is because ofthe weapon specifications that
come with the armament, whichare directly tied to American
and European military suppliers.
Speaker 4 (12:12):
That is correct.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
That is correct, but I think Wait, I'm not clear on
your message.
There, Rudy Say that again.
Speaker 8 (12:21):
Let's let him finish, go ahead, rudy.
Well, I don't want to getlocked to that, but I agree with
what Father Mario is saying isthat NATO has kind of lost its
sort of role and purpose, if youwill, and it's kind of boiled
down to a lot of militaryarmament specifications.
I also wanted to say I kind ofagree this is going to sound
(12:47):
crazy, father Martin, I'm sorrybut I kind of agree with the
rabbi on this one, with whathe's saying.
When I think about the outburstthat happened, I got the sense
that it was a stage right, thatit was a stage for something to
happen or to not happen in thefuture, right?
Speaker 4 (13:07):
Whether it was going to be?
I mean I disagree, but that'sokay.
I don't think that they invited.
I don't think Trump invitedZelensky to have an argument in
front of the press?
Speaker 2 (13:18):
Yeah, but I think it's egomaniacal to say you have
to thank us, you have to.
Where's the thank?
You Well they should, yes, theyshould.
Speaker 4 (13:25):
They should Right.
And not only that, they'reasking for more and they're
asking for American involvementand Trump is saying I'm not
doing that anymore and that's.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Zelensky's lack of tact.
That's correct, yeah, which?
Speaker 3 (13:39):
is too bad, I'm wondering they I mean, I'm just
thinking about the ins and outsof that Zelensky's.
Clearly English is not hisfirst language.
He struggles with it and a lotof times you miss cultural cues
when you're not a native speaker.
He would have been betterserved if he'd had an
(14:01):
interpreter in there that couldhelp him actually read what the
room was like and say thingsprobably a bit more elegantly
than he did.
Speaker 4 (14:08):
But also remember that Joe Biden has a screaming
match with Zelensky too.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
I don't remember that , yes it was Look it up.
Speaker 4 (14:18):
Oh, I will Look it up .
On the same topic On the sametopic.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
Because Zelensky thought the US should go to war
with Russia.
Speaker 4 (14:25):
Well, not necessarily go to war, but commit
themselves to the point whichthey did, but to the point of I
don't know if American arms Imean American arms, but I don't
know how far Zelensky wantedmore from Biden.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Most boots on the ground, that kind of stuff.
Ground, that kind of stuff.
I think it is true, going backto what Father Mario was saying,
that he was forcing the handsof the Europeans to say, and
they've actually come up andthey've said you know, we're
going to be doing more.
The Europeans, I think, arecoming along and I think they're
(15:04):
seeing the handwriting on thewall Because if the Ukraine
falls, they're next.
We need to go to a break.
We'll be back.
We're going to talk about warand peace Generally speaking.
Oh, the book?
Not exactly.
Speaker 4 (15:17):
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That was a good ending, good segue.
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Speaker 1 (17:37):
Say it again, yeah.
What is it good for?
Absolutely nothing.
Say it again, y'all.
I have a.
Speaker 2 (17:48):
In the 60s 70s.
When this came out, I had oneperspective.
Now I'm not so sure I agree.
Welcome back to our show offaith on the intensive of the
answer.
Speaker 3 (18:06):
Yeah, we're talking about war and peace tonight.
Given the kind of theuncomfortable exchange that took
place between PresidentZelensky and our president,
president Trump and VicePresident Vance, I thought it'd
be interesting that we spend alittle time talking about peace
and war tonight and what ourdifferent religions say about
those things.
We're going to say a lot of thesame things, I think, because
(18:28):
somewhat I mean war, you know.
Yeah, I mean, what is it goodfor?
Uh?
I think there are things thereare times, times that it is, and
that's that's part of what Iwant to discuss tonight.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
So you have to tell the ukraine they were right to
defend themselves yeah,absolutely going to war right
right.
So from their perspective, waris in this.
What's, mario's your line about?
A sad necessity or something?
Speaker 4 (18:53):
Violence, when justified, is not an option but
a sad duty.
Sad duty.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
Yeah, so sometimes war is.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
Okay, let's start with the flip side of that.
Let's talk about peace, One ofthe things I love yeah is Rabbi
sitting here doing Peace, loveand Woodstock Nation Right.
So in Hebrew there's a wordshalom.
Speaker 2 (19:17):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (19:19):
What does the word peace mean?
I mean when you say that, whenyou hear that?
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Okay, but it's conceptual, it's not just a
single word.
Okay, in English we say peace,world around reality, and it
means basically the world is notyet.
It means the absence of war.
Speaker 3 (19:36):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (19:37):
That's not what it means in the Hebrew.
In the Hebrew there's a senseof completion.
Everything is complete,everything's in its place,
everything's where it should be.
There's a calm, there's a calm.
So, for example, if God, godforbid, someone is sick, you
know, like Mario had the surgery, or whatever.
(20:00):
So we would say refuah, whichmeans that healing.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
Thank you, yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
And refuah shlema.
Shlema means complete.
So a complete healing.
May your healing be complete.
But you hear shalom in shlema,you hear the root letters.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
Oh, I see.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
So the sense of the word peace, shalom is not just
nobody's making war against eachother, but rather everything is
right with the world.
Everything's in its place,Everything's where it should be.
There's a calm.
There's a calm over everything.
Speaker 3 (20:40):
So it's a conception.
Is it philosophical, is itreligious?
What is it exactly?
Speaker 2 (20:45):
Well, every word is both religious and philosophical
.
I mean, you can, in the contextin which you're going to find
whatever word you're talkingabout.
Speaker 3 (20:52):
Right, okay, in the context in which you're going to
find whatever word you'retalking about.
Right okay, I mean as you thinkabout it from a Hebrew
standpoint.
Speaker 2 (21:04):
There's much more to the word than simply nobody at
war.
It's think of shepherds intheir fields with their flock.
Everything's peaceful.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
Rabbi.
Speaker 2 (21:13):
Rabbi.
Speaker 8 (21:16):
Yes, did you say that things?
It's a sort of state wheresomething is properly aligned to
its intent or purpose, okay, orsomething is ordered correctly,
as it was meant to be.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
Everything is in order.
Yes, Okay, Everything is in itsplace.
It's tranquil.
It is, to use fancy terminologywhich I really hate, there's no
strife.
I love that word.
Okay, it's like the word yeah,there's no strife.
(21:53):
Everything's in its place.
Everything's where it should be.
It's not merely people aren'tkilling each other.
It is much more than that.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Yeah, is there a particular teaching from your
scriptures, your Bible, that youthink about with the word peace
?
That just comes to mind.
I'll let you think about that.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
But you're asking an old man with bad memory to come
up with the verses.
Speaker 3 (22:21):
But just a general teaching, because one of the
things that we read over andagain in the New Testament is
that when Paul writes hisletters, he says Grace to you
and peace from God, our Fatherand Lord.
Speaker 2 (22:35):
Jesus Christ.
That's the typical sort ofopening, very Hebrew equivalence
.
Yeah, exactly.
People will say but shalom.
But they shouldn't.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
And in our worship services on a regular basis, we
have the passing of the peace.
We say peace, be with you.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
Peace, your most precious gift, you who have the
passing of the peace, we saypeace be with you, you who are
the eternal source of peace.
It's a line from one of theolder old Hebrew prayer books.
Old Hebrew prayer books.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
Is there a kind of a philosophy of peace, father
Mario, or ideas of peace in theCatholic Church?
Speaker 4 (23:13):
Yeah, I mean strongly Because's remember, for us as
Christians, it's when Jesus saysI do not give you peace as the
world gives peace.
I give you peace as my peace Igive you.
And so what we're dealing withis peace with justice.
(23:33):
And so what we're dealing withis peace with justice.
And it's interesting because,going back to what we were
talking about before, I seeTrump as seeking a peace that is
(23:53):
in accordance with Catholicjust war theory.
One of the things aboutCatholic just war theory is that
a war can be justified first ofall if it's a just cause, if
it's defensive, but when therealistic prospects of winning
(24:16):
do not cause more harm than good.
So when Trump is saying I'm notgoing to get into World War III
to gain a strip of Ukrainebecause that will put more
danger into the world.
I see what you're saying Okayand so, even though it is not
(24:41):
ideal politics in the sense that, yes, Russia did invade.
The Catholic understanding isthat seeking that ideal should
not bring in more catastrophe,and I think that's what Trump is
saying.
Speaker 3 (24:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (24:59):
So we need to go to a break.
Okay, this is 1070 KNTH andwe'll be right back.
Speaker 7 (25:05):
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Speaker 1 (27:10):
The Answer the Answer To everything turn, turn, turn.
(27:31):
There is a season.
Turn, turn, turn there is aseason Turn turn, turn and a
time to every purpose underheaven, a time to be born, a
time to die, a time to plant, atime to reap, a time to kill, a
(27:53):
time to heal.
A time to reap, a time to kill,a time to heal, a time to laugh
, a time to weep Welcome back toA Show of Faith.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
So Psalm 2911, the eternal will give strength to
his people.
The eternal will bless hispeople with peace.
3414,.
Depart from evil and do good.
Seek peace and pursue it.
Speaker 3 (28:19):
3711, the meek shall inherit the earth and shall
delight themselves in theabundance of peace.
It's all over, All over all.
Speaker 4 (28:25):
The Hebrew Bible and Father Mario was talking about
the fact that it's peace andjustice together.
Yeah, because from ourperspective, as a Christian
perspective, you can say peaceand the Pax Romana was peace.
But the Pax Romana was peace.
Under the sword of domination,slaves could have peace as long
as they were submissive.
So it's not peace as an end initself, it's peace and justice,
(28:48):
peace and justice together.
Speaker 3 (28:49):
Rudy, what are you hearing down there?
What are your thoughts?
Living in the culture thatyou're in, though you're
Americanized still, how do yousee it?
This idea of peace, andparticularly?
Speaker 8 (29:04):
and I think this would sort of extend a lot to
the United States is most peoplehere.
They just want to be left alone.
They want to be in a countrywhere the government doesn't
(29:27):
come in, alienates them, takesaway rights, takes away property
.
They want to be in a countrythat doesn't meddle in other
things, alienates them, takesaway rights, takes away property
.
They want to be in a countrythat doesn't meddle in other
things.
I mean Central America,specifically Mexico, and even
the United States.
I mean there's so many internalthings going on.
So when we look at theseforeign wars right and Father
(29:53):
Mario made the comment I meanit's like what is our interest?
When you think about these pastwars Vietnam, right, and Korea
and these sort of drawn-out Imean Afghanistan we were in
Afghanistan for over 20 yearsbombing them and with military
presence there and to a largedegree, I think that's what
(30:14):
Trump is trying to avoid rightis dragging us into another
drawn-out conflict that's justmostly fought by.
I mean, trump isn't going to goover there and fight.
Zelensky isn't over therefighting.
You know it's not thepoliticians that go fight, it's
18-, 19 20-year-olds that areout there bleeding and dying.
(30:35):
You know it's not.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
And that's why I think you know you enter into
war very guardedly, and we'lltalk about that in a minute.
But the whole idea that peacemeans more than just the fact
that nobody's at war, but thatthings are being done in a just
way, is peace God's gift.
(31:02):
Stuart, from your idea, I meanas you were reading, it sounds
like.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
God's going to give peace to his people.
I think that the existence ofpeace is a gift from God but,
like most things, sometimes youhave to fight for peace, you
have to work for it, you have toactively pursue it.
Speaker 3 (31:20):
Yeah, I remember seeing signs in.
I think it was the George Floydtime no justice, no peace,
something like that.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
And then with K-N-O-W .
Speaker 3 (31:30):
Yeah, yeah, those kind of things.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
And I think that's true.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
Let's come to the idea now on the other side of
that war when is war?
Let's go back, maybe, to thejust war theory in a sense.
When is war?
Is war ever justified?
The song War?
What Is it Good For?
Absolutely nothing.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
Right, but sometimes it is justified.
Sometimes it is justifiedSelf-defense.
Speaker 3 (31:56):
Right, right.
So what does Judaism say aboutwar?
Speaker 2 (32:05):
Here's a place where we're going to agree, like Mario
said about violence in general,that sometimes it's a necessity
, but more than that it becomesa sad duty.
So you would say Judaismdegrades Right because there's a
just worth theory in Judaism,in the Bible.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
So what about?
Thou shalt not murder?
Go back to that.
Speaker 2 (32:25):
But it's not murder, murder is taking the life of the
innocent, the soldier, acrossthe yard from you, right, but
there's this teaching Thou shaltnot murder.
Speaker 9 (32:34):
But it's murder not killing.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
But that doesn't preclude war.
No, because there are timeslike self-defense, okay, and if
you're surrounded and they'reabout to enter your territory,
cross the border into you, youhave the right of first attack
to defend.
Speaker 7 (32:53):
Yeah you do.
Speaker 2 (32:55):
So you are starting the war.
You know it's the old kid'sline.
He started it when he hit meback.
You know there are times whereit's a sad duty.
Okay.
Speaker 4 (33:07):
I want to add one thing, because I looked up at
what I was trying to say aboutCatholic Just War Theory.
Okay, and the principles threeand four.
The first principle theprinciples three and four.
The first principle there mustbe a serious prospect of success
.
But four here's the kicker onethe use of arms must not produce
(33:30):
evils and disorders greaterthan the evil to be eliminated.
The power of modern means ofdestruction weighs very heavily
in evaluating this condition.
So you cannot.
What Trump is saying is Russiamay be weak in terms of its
(33:52):
regular military, but it is anuclear power and they're in an
existential war and Putin is not.
It won't be, won't be deterredfrom using them if need be.
Okay.
And so the use of arms must notproduce evils and disorders
graver than the evil to beeliminated.
(34:13):
What's the evil to beeliminated?
Putin going after Ukraine.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
Right and pushing back to the prior border.
Speaker 4 (34:22):
That's right To eliminate.
That you would trigger a lotmore evils.
That's what Trump is saying yes.
Speaker 2 (34:28):
Isn't it interesting that in every movie or science
fiction story of a dystopianworld it usually begins where
there has already been a nuclearwar, where human beings
basically destroy themselves.
Speaker 3 (34:42):
Yes, A lot of the dystopian yeah, exactly Right.
Yeah, exactly All right.
So you didn't mention one andtwo, In other words, just war
theory, the first idea and thesecond idea.
So the first idea was what?
Speaker 4 (35:02):
Well, okay, the first idea is the damage inflicted by
the aggressor.
Let's make it Russia this time.
The damage inflicted by theaggressor on the nation or
community of nations must belasting, grave and certain.
That's already beendemonstrated.
Number two all other means ofputting an end to it must have
(35:24):
been shown to be impractical orineffective that's already
exhausted now.
Speaker 3 (35:30):
Now, but at this point to continue the war.
That's the point.
Yeah, I mean to continue thewar.
I mean it may have been justthat they defended themselves
and thought that they had achance of success.
Going back to that thirdquality there.
Speaker 2 (35:49):
Thus, it's not righteousness, it's power, and
to the victor goes the spoils.
The justice of the situationloses out because Russia's more
powerful.
Speaker 4 (36:03):
See, I think that where Trump is, he's saying the
use of American arms willproduce evils and disorders
greater than the evil to beeliminated.
Speaker 3 (36:16):
In case there is a nuclear exchange.
Speaker 4 (36:18):
Yeah, I mean you're dealing with a nuclear power.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
Right, right and Ukraine.
Ironically, ukraine used to bea nuclear power.
Speaker 4 (36:24):
Yeah, and they gave up their nuclear because we
guaranteed that was another oneof these idiots.
Speaker 2 (36:29):
We fooled you.
You trusted us, yeah.
Speaker 3 (36:33):
Yeah, those kind of things.
Speaker 4 (36:35):
But those are the kinds of entanglements that
Trump doesn't want to get into,and I don't blame him.
I have really come to likeTrump as a human being.
I know lots of people.
I don't, I do, I do.
I think he's better than theDemocrats, but I'm not fond of
any of them.
Speaker 2 (36:54):
I think they all stink.
I don't say he's a saint.
Speaker 4 (36:57):
He's not a saint, but I've heard him talk.
You know the other day he wastalking about well, what do we
care?
It's people over there dying,it's not Americans.
And he says I don't care justabout Americans, I care about
all those Russian boys and allthose Ukrainian boys that are
dying there for nothing.
And you know that sayssomething about the man that
(37:19):
he's concerned about.
That.
Speaker 3 (37:21):
And you know he seemed to be very moved too by
the deaths of the children inIsrael at the hands of Hamas.
Speaker 7 (37:29):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (37:30):
I mean that seemed to have really hit a nerve with
him.
Speaker 4 (37:35):
He's not a perfect guy.
He's not a perfect guy, he's notyour perfect christian, but I
think the guy has a roughoutline of a good, good moral
sense now not his past, becauseevery time I hear him criticize
you know, I heard somebody onthe view going oh no, we got to
put a picture of all the theprostitutes that he's ever been
with, and all that stuff, manalive.
(37:57):
Are you ever saying the man canbe forgiven?
There's no forgiveness?
No forgiveness because all theywant to do is drag out his past
.
See, this is the kind of guy heis.
Speaker 2 (38:08):
No, you get rid of somebody because 50 years ago
they said something that's right.
Speaker 4 (38:13):
So I'm not looking at the way he did.
I've heard some of my friendsare saying but that's the kind
of man we don't want himrepresenting us, why not?
He's a forgiven sinner.
Speaker 3 (38:24):
I hope he is, he's giving me that impression, but
he seems to have, I mean, as youdescribed here, and I haven't
looked into some of the thingsthat you've been looking into
but if he's thinking that deeplyabout it, about what these
entanglements would create, andit would create a graver evil
(38:49):
just by the use of weapons thatwould unleash horror, and he
said it during the meeting withZelensky.
Speaker 4 (39:00):
He said, Zelensky, you're playing around with World
War III.
Speaker 2 (39:04):
So is he supposed to just give up his country for the
sake of?
Speaker 4 (39:07):
peace.
No, no, trump was giving him away of achieving peace and
getting American involvement,but not military involvement,
economic involvement, becausethey understand that putin would
be a lot less ready to killamericans if american companies
were there, and then the unitedstates would come in and defend
(39:27):
americans you're talking aboutthe mineral rights the mineral
rights.
That's right.
It would be.
It would be a booth companiesand it would be good for them
because it would create jobs forthem and it would create jobs
for us.
Speaker 2 (39:41):
And I see what you're saying.
I just find it very ironic thatit goes down to corporations,
business and making money.
Speaker 4 (39:50):
It's life.
That's what's called realpolitics, real politics Okay, I
mean you want the best andsometimes you've got to get your
hands a little dirty Right andwe've got to get our hands a
little dirty because if we don'tgo to a break, you talk about
money, about companies.
That's right.
Coming back to Rudy, that'sright, Rudy, we'll come back to
you.
This is 1070 KNTH and we'll beright back.
Speaker 7 (40:12):
AM 1070, the answer.
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President Trump is moving at lightning speed.
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Speaker 1 (41:49):
Group, Everybody at Salem Media Group.
Speaker 5 (41:51):
you've been incredible you really are, and
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We'd say you're pretty good company and in salem
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You have really courage,because I know it's not easy.
Speaker 7 (42:08):
Congratulations hey, 10, 70 and fm 103 3 the answer
(42:32):
two, one, two, three, four.
Speaker 4 (42:34):
The Answer?
All we are saying is give peacea chance.
Is that the Beatles?
Yes, yeah, that's John Lennon.
Speaker 2 (42:44):
All we are saying is give peace a chance, which was a
great idea in the period inwhich they were saying it Give
peace a chance it wasn't goingto be 70 days.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
Yeah, but you know what's happening.
He said give peace a chance,but forget about the human,
either Right?
Speaker 2 (42:59):
Everybody's going to be fine.
That's the other side of that.
That's what I was sayingearlier.
Speaker 4 (43:04):
Sometimes you have to go to war All we are saying I
know you're saying that, butyou're not saying much, give
peace a chance.
Speaker 2 (43:13):
Welcome back to A Show of Faith.
My name is Tim Simons.
Speaker 3 (43:16):
The answer All right, rudy, your turn, buddy.
We're talking about here war,avoiding war, the real politic
of war, and not necessarily whatis ideally the best for
everybody involved but sometimesyou just take what you can get
(43:39):
right.
Speaker 8 (43:39):
I thought about this verse in Matthew Blessed are the
peacemakers for they shall becalled sons of God.
And you know, I think a lotabout what's going on in Ukraine
and I think about also, forexample, what's going down in
Nicaragua, and there's a lot ofpeople suffering in Nicaragua
(44:00):
and I'm not trying to compare.
Every sort of conflict is itsown animal right, but here we
are with a country with acompletely corrupt government
system.
People are starving, the churchis being persecuted, people are
being killed.
I mean there's people arestarving, the church is being
(44:20):
persecuted, people are beingkilled.
I mean there's people.
So again going back to thepoint and to kind of bring it
back to Ukraine, would theUkrainian people have a greater
probability of life andexistence and substance if there
was an immediate peace, even atthe borders of where they were
at?
And and I know we can argue alot about sovereignty in the
(44:44):
state and the nations, and theyhave a right and absolutely they
do.
But the reality is, is Ukrainewithout Western intervention
stands absolutely no chanceright?
absolutely none and even thoughrussia is absolutely spent um,
like father mario was saying, itstill has a lot of armaments
(45:06):
and a lot of and a lot of verybig bombs superior military.
Unfortunately, it all boilsdown to, in my opinion,
resources right, and there's alot of rare earth minerals in
Ukraine, in Russia, and thisisn't the first time that Putin
invaded.
(45:26):
He invaded Crimea back when.
Obama was president.
He did it again now when Biden.
So this is the sort of Russianaggression, you know to what
point.
And I understand the fear right, because if you look back at
(45:47):
what the Nazis were doing inGermany, they first started with
a little bit then over here,then over there you know, when
do you draw the line and saythis oppressive regime can no
longer continue?
right, it's just who's going topay the price, and the price is
(46:09):
blood.
Right, that's the price in alot of it.
It's the same thing that Ithink about Sorry, to kind of
keep you out of it, but it's thesame thing I think about.
In Nicaragua and Venezuela,right, everybody speaks about
revolution and this it's likeokay, but are you willing to die
, are you willing to put up youractions for it?
(46:30):
And I'm speaking facetiouslyright, but that's what it takes
is people to stand up, and evenwithin Russia themselves?
Right, but that's what it takesis people to stand up, and even
within Russia themselves?
Right, there has to be thiscourage and this sort of
audacity to change things fromthe inside too, because without
that, okay, so we stop now, andthen what happens in four years,
(46:53):
when Trump's out of the officeand we get another silly
Democrat in office?
You know, hopefully Putin'smoved on, but not likely.
Speaker 2 (47:04):
You remind me of the also 60s, 70s, maybe the 80s
line.
What if they gave a war andnobody came?
What happens if the people ofRussia just said we're not going
to give our children?
People of Ukraine said we'renot going to give our children.
People of Ukraine said we'renot going to give our children.
They won't do that.
Nobody in the military would dothat, but still.
Speaker 3 (47:26):
Yeah, I think they would have a lot to lose if they
in some ways like that.
Speaking of which.
Speaker 2 (47:32):
Rudy, didn't Nicaragua, the president of
Nicaragua, just take for himselfdictatorial powers?
Wasn't that Nicaragua wouldjust take for himself
dictatorial powers?
Speaker 8 (47:38):
Wasn't that.
Speaker 2 (47:39):
Nicaragua.
Speaker 8 (47:40):
Yeah, he suspended, I think like two or three weeks
ago I think the guy's a littlesnippet on it but he suspended
all future elections and he cannow be president for forever.
And here's this country, rightand, and you go.
And rabbi, I was just there, um, in january in nicaragua, and
(48:05):
you go there.
Let me tell you the countryitself you're driving.
You could leave your keys inyour car, nobody's going to mug
you, it's relatively safe.
But let me tell you, when thosecops and that police is out
there doing their stops, it'sthe most scariest thing, man to
be in a country in a situationwhere the military and the
(48:28):
police I actually fear them morethan some delinquent criminal
on the street.
Speaker 2 (48:38):
Power corrupts Absolute power corrupts
absolutely.
Speaker 4 (48:41):
That's what you get when you get peace at all costs,
right Peace without justice.
Speaker 3 (48:50):
Is the old saying, all is fair.
In love and war it's not All isfair.
Speaker 2 (48:56):
All is not fair.
That's why Patton was it.
Speaker 3 (49:03):
It pat, who said war is hell.
Oh, absolutely yeah, yeah, itis so.
So can you do anything in atime of war?
No, no, I mean there there iswar going on.
So can you?
Can you deceive your enemy, canyou?
Speaker 4 (49:16):
oh yeah.
Speaker 7 (49:16):
So, can you deceive your enemy?
Speaker 3 (49:17):
You can deceive.
There are certain things.
Speaker 4 (49:20):
But you cannot go after innocents, that's murder.
Speaker 3 (49:25):
So going after innocent women and children and
older people 80-year-old folks.
Speaker 4 (49:34):
And it's interesting because the Catholic Church says
it's interesting, you hear.
The catechism concludes in thelast paragraph these are
traditional elements, enumerjudgment of those who have the
responsibility for the commongood, Meaning it's not the
(50:02):
church's responsibility to makethe ultimate decisions.
The decisions are made by thegovernment.
The churches and the religionscan educate the government, but
it's not our role to rule.
No, it's politics andgovernment.
Speaker 3 (50:18):
In other words, you can say now you have not met
this criteria.
Speaker 7 (50:21):
That's correct.
Speaker 3 (50:22):
And you better take that into consideration.
That's right, but you're notthe one making the decision
whether or not you're going towar or not going to war.
That's correct, okay.
Speaker 8 (50:34):
The way I think about it, too, though, is there's a
huge responsibility also withthe citizens, though, to make
sure that their government iseven acting in a manner that is
promoting the common good, evento begin with, right, that's
correct.
Speaker 3 (50:51):
yes, now go back and say that again.
Speaker 8 (50:56):
Well, can you say it?
Yeah, so what I was going tosay is sometimes, and a lot of
times, governments, you know,because power sometimes is
centralized, right then a fewbad apples can really kind of
take a left turn.
And what I'm saying is that,fundamentally though, as a
(51:17):
citizen of a nation, of asovereign state, it is your
responsibility to make sure andin our case, right that we're
voting for the right people,that we're pushing the right
representatives, that we aredoing our part in informing
ourselves about the people thatare leading us.
I mean, I think a lot of theissue with Russia, with the
(51:39):
United States, with really everycountry in the world, is that a
lot of people are justcomplacent, right, and they
don't want to really take activeroles in as much as we want to
march down streets and say freePalestine and all this other
kind of nonsense, right.
We've really been responsiblecitizens to promote that, that
(52:04):
elect and promote leaders forthe common good, and it starts
with the citizen, in my mind.
Speaker 2 (52:10):
It starts with the citizen, and there's an old line
that the people who do theelecting get the government they
deserve.
Speaker 4 (52:17):
And to some degree, that's what we got.
Speaker 3 (52:19):
But you think about poor folks in Nicaragua, though.
Are they getting the government?
Speaker 2 (52:25):
No, because they had no choice.
Speaker 3 (52:26):
They didn't have a vote Right, and the same thing
happened to Venezuela.
The same thing happened in.
Speaker 2 (52:31):
Cuba, every dictatorship.
Speaker 3 (52:33):
Cuba.
Is it Cuba?
Cuba, every dictatorship?
Yeah, anytime, you have thatExactly right, yeah, well, one
of the things that I appreciateabout people who have served in
the armed forces and continue toserve in the armed forces is
that they are true publicservants and they deserve honor
(52:53):
and respect for their service.
There have been times whenthey've been mistreated,
maltreated.
There have been times in theChristian tradition when to
serve in the Roman army, youknow, first was to you know you
couldn't be a Christian andactually be a soldier.
Speaker 2 (53:12):
Same thing with the Jews in Russia, even in modern
times.
Speaker 3 (53:15):
Yeah, so it was just you know.
It's one thing to say.
You know we, you are thoseservants of ours who help us
with our security and with ourfreedom, and we honor you.
And we honor you at this timeof the year, whether it's a
holiday or whether it's sayingthank you for your service in a
(53:38):
restaurant or whatever it mightbe, just recognizing that they
are serving dutifully andwonderfully for us.
I know we've got to go.
Speaker 2 (53:47):
I think Rudy's up next week.
Speaker 3 (53:49):
Rudy's up.
Speaker 4 (53:52):
You're up.
I got it Okay.
By the way, did you guys hearabout the kidnapping at school?
Speaker 3 (53:59):
No, yep, which school ?
Speaker 4 (54:03):
No, the kidnapping at school.
Speaker 3 (54:04):
Oh, oh.
Speaker 4 (54:05):
He woke up.
Speaker 3 (54:06):
Oh, no, oh, I didn't hear about that.
He woke up, he woke up, I gotit.
Kidnapping, kidnapping, I gotit.
Yes, jeez, I got it, I knew it.
Speaker 2 (54:15):
I knew it, it's late at night I know.
Speaker 3 (54:18):
Gosh Well you can help us, but you can only take
us so far.
Speaker 4 (54:23):
Yes, why did the egg have a day off?
Because it's Friday.
Friday.
Okay, folks, this is 1070 KNTH.
Please listen to us next week.
At the same time, keep us inyour prayers, because you are
(54:44):
going to be in ours.
Speaker 7 (54:45):
Find us at am1070theanswercom.
Download our app.
There's something happening here, what it is ain't
exactly clear.
There's a man with a gun overthere Telling me I've got to
beware.
I think it's time we stopChildren.
(00:25):
What's that sound?
Everybody look what's goingdown.
There's battle lines beingdrawn.
Nobody's right if everybody'swrong.
(00:47):
Young people speak in theirminds, Getting so much
resistance from behind Everytime we stop.
Hey, what's that sound?
Everybody look what's goingdown.
What's that sound?
Everybody look what's goingdown.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Welcome to A Show of Faith where a professor, priest,
millennial and rabbi discusstheology, philosophy, morality,
ethics, anything of interest inreligion.
If you have any response to ourtopics or any comments
regarding what we say, hey, we'dlove to hear from you.
So email us at ashowoffaith1070at gmailcom.
(01:28):
That's a new email address forour email ashowoffaith1070 at
gmailcom.
You can hear our shows againand again by listening pretty
much anywhere podcasts are heard.
Our priest is Father MarioArroyo, retired pastor of St
Cyril of Alexandria, the 10,000block of Westheimer.
Hello, our professor is DavidCapes, baptist minister and
(01:50):
director of academic programmingfor the Lanier Theological
Library.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Hey, great to see you guys this evening.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Hey and Rudy Kogas, our millennial systems engineer.
Master's degree in theologyfrom University of St Thomas.
I am Rabbi Stuart Federo,retired rabbi of Congregation
Shaar HaShalom in the Clear Lakearea of Houston, texas.
Miranda's our board operator.
Yeah, and tonight Crystal, whatCrystal Krista.
Crystal Crystal is here alsohelping us and Miranda and
(02:20):
Crystal help us sound fantastic.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
We sure hope so.
Now, rudy, I just got a notefrom Rudy.
He said he's trying to call in,but take a look and see.
Okay, hey.
Rudy, try it if you can hear me, if you can hear me down there
in Guatemala.
Father Mario, you've beenthrough a rough time, have you?
Yes, you've been through arough time.
How did you know that I could?
Speaker 4 (02:42):
tell Just, you've been through a rough time.
How did you know that I couldtell Just by some things on my
face?
Just because of the stuff onyour face?
Yeah, no, I had some dentalimplants.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Dental implants.
Yeah, that's exciting.
Speaker 4 (02:54):
Yeah, that's expensive it is.
It's a full upper arch.
Speaker 3 (03:01):
Okay, wow, all the way around.
Everything on the front,everything, whoa.
Speaker 4 (03:07):
And they do it on just a one shot, In other words
not individual.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
So you get everything ready and you get it all lined
up and you just kind of go.
Speaker 4 (03:17):
There was a few teeth that needed to be pulled Right,
and then they stuck the roots.
You know for the implantsUh-huh.
And then they stuck the roots.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
You know for the implants Uh-huh, and then they
stuck the implants in and theseare Wow, wow, wow.
These are the implants and nowyou've got to eat soft food for
a while.
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (03:36):
And then I get the permanent ones in three months.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
I sure hope you like scrambled eggs.
Oh God no.
Speaker 4 (03:44):
Anyway, life goes on.
Speaker 3 (03:46):
Split pea goes on.
Huh, not how do you like?
Yeah, yeah, so hopefully rudycan can get in and get through.
Speaker 4 (03:55):
Yeah well, because of mario's mouth, he'll be able to
get into where that is easierah you know, you know, it is a
sad day when someone who hasbeen suffering something is
being made fun of in the orderof radio.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
I thought it was fun.
It is, yeah, sad day.
He has had it.
Speaker 4 (04:14):
Rudy's back.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
Rudy's on.
Oh, Rudy's on Rudy, welcomeRudester.
Hello Rudy, I don't think he'son Rudy, welcome Rudester.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
Hello Rudy.
Speaker 4 (04:29):
I don't think he's on .
Speaker 3 (04:29):
He'll be on here, there we go.
Speaker 4 (04:34):
Rudy.
Speaker 8 (04:37):
No, you guys are here .
Oh there we go.
Speaker 3 (04:39):
Okay, we got you.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Now we're stuck with him.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
Okay, yeah, we're stuck.
Hey, guys, good to be with you.
Hey, I'm show director tonight,which is good because Father
Mario is here, but you knowwe're working on helping him
feel better, right?
Yes, we're going to bless him.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Right, we will not put the burden upon him tonight.
Speaker 3 (04:59):
That's right, we'll put the burden upon somebody
else.
Hey, you know, this week therewas a very rough sort of dust up
Just a little In the OvalOffice.
Yeah, in the Oval Officebetween the President of Ukraine
and the President of the UnitedStates and the Vice President
and the Vice President as well.
Rudy, I don't know if it madenews down in your world, part of
(05:23):
the world down there.
Did you see that down here?
Speaker 8 (05:27):
Luckily for you, I've been somewhat Americanized and
I do so.
It's actually been on the newshere too.
It's kind of world famousbecause he's being at least in
the left-leaning circles.
He's kind of being portrayed assort of an anti-freedom
(05:51):
character.
Trump is right for coming downon the president of Ukraine for
this, but we can talk more aboutthat later.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
Yeah, zelensky, apparently, and you know, I
don't know the protocols ofthese kind of things, of what
you can say and what you can'tsay, and those kinds of things
when it comes to, you know, inthe Oval Office, and
particularly with the camerasrolling, right, Right,
especially with the camerasrolling.
It's one thing it's one thing,and so the two things that I I
(06:23):
understand reading the New YorkTimes is that President Trump
was hoping well, he was hopingto hear just a big, big, big
thank you for, you know, fromUkraine for all the kind of help
that the US has been giving fora time, billions and billions
of dollars.
(06:44):
That's one thing, and thesecond thing he didn't want to
hear was a plea from thepresident of Ukraine that we
would guarantee the security ofUkraine in the future if we had
some sort of a peace deal, sothat we ourselves, as a country,
(07:05):
would be the ones.
Our president was not ready tohear that at this particular
point.
So, at any rate, we'll justhave to wait and see what
happens in the time that goes on.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
As I said before we came on the air, I think it's
psychological.
I think, that the president ofthe United States knows he's
going to back out of helping theUkraine, so he's creating a
scenario to rationalize andjustify his doing that.
Okay, I think that when you getinto this tiff, or he uses an
(07:42):
excuse or a reason to get upset,kick him out, whatever that.
This is.
This is the way people reactwhen they know they're about to
do something wrong, or they wantto rationalize or justify
you're saying that of Trump.
Speaker 4 (07:55):
Yes, I am.
I am not.
I disagree with you.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
I'm sure you do.
I disagree with you, butremember it was Putin who
invaded the Ukraine.
I don't disagree with you there.
Speaker 4 (08:05):
The Russians are the I agree with you there.
But here's what.
What are you saying?
Oh, I hear myself really loud.
I can hear you too Really loud,yes, Anyway.
No see, there's a differencebetween what is called ideal
politics and real politics.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Right, okay, and real politics should never be in
public.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
No, real politique is what Trump is doing.
Trump does not want theshooting and the killing to go
on and he's also saying I don'twant to commit the United States
to defend Zelensky and Ukraineand get us into World War III
(08:52):
with the Russians, because toRussia Ukraine is an extremely
important neighbor and they seeit as a threat.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
I see it like the?
Speaker 4 (09:04):
U and mexico okay, so so all that trump is saying is
look europe, europe in nato hasnot even spent the normal part
of what they should be spendingin terms of defense.
And is that new?
No, but it shouldn't be thatway.
It shouldn't just be cause, ofcourse not.
So all that Trump is saying isI'm not going to commit to
(09:29):
defend Ukraine, which is 5,000miles away, when you Europeans
are not doing your part and youare living off of United States
largesse and you want to defend.
You put more money into yourdefense and you defend them
Right but I don't think that.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
I just think that the overzealousness of the arguing
and the you know, I think, isthe psychological part.
Speaker 4 (09:54):
No, I don't.
I disagree with you 100%.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
So you think it was set up or intellectually created
?
Speaker 4 (09:58):
No, I think Zelensky wants the guarantees the United
States would actually go to warwith.
Russia on behalf of Ukraine andI don't think.
And Trump is saying I ain'tdoing that.
And then he's saying look,europe, if you think it's that
important.
They are a heck of a lot closerto you than they are to us.
(10:22):
They're a threat more to youthan they are to us.
Step up.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
And with that I agree , because NATO has never they've
always relied on the US to payfor everything.
Speaker 4 (10:32):
But Trump has come to the point of saying enough.
And here's the next part.
That's interesting.
I'll get the commentator.
His name is on my mind, butanyway, he was saying one of the
things that has happened thatchanged the mind of everybody is
that we used to think Russiawas a really strong superpower.
(10:56):
They're not.
They're not.
They tried to invade Ukraine,and without even any soldiers
from NATO, without any soldiersfrom NATOo, without any soldiers
or nature, just arms, kept themat bay ukraine, and so they
have no ability to considerthemselves an equal superpower
to the united states.
They problem themselves to bepretty much of a paper tiger.
(11:17):
Their equipment is awful, andand, and they, they just don't
have it.
And so Trump is saying look,nato made.
Why was NATO created?
It was created to defendagainst Russia, okay, communism.
If you look at Russia right now, they are not able to even
mount without even NATOinvolvement.
(11:41):
They couldn't mount anythingagainst the Ukrainians.
And so NATO is not as criticalas it used to be.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
NATO is not as critical.
That's correct.
Speaker 4 (11:51):
It is important but not as critical as it used to be
Right.
But I think no, no, Mario holdon.
Speaker 8 (11:58):
I just need to make this very clear the reason that
NATO is critical is because ofthe weapon specifications that
come with the armament, whichare directly tied to American
and European military suppliers.
Speaker 4 (12:12):
That is correct.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
That is correct, but I think Wait, I'm not clear on
your message.
There, Rudy Say that again.
Speaker 8 (12:21):
Let's let him finish, go ahead, rudy.
Well, I don't want to getlocked to that, but I agree with
what Father Mario is saying isthat NATO has kind of lost its
sort of role and purpose, if youwill, and it's kind of boiled
down to a lot of militaryarmament specifications.
I also wanted to say I kind ofagree this is going to sound
(12:47):
crazy, father Martin, I'm sorrybut I kind of agree with the
rabbi on this one, with whathe's saying.
When I think about the outburstthat happened, I got the sense
that it was a stage right, thatit was a stage for something to
happen or to not happen in thefuture, right?
Speaker 4 (13:07):
Whether it was going to be?
I mean I disagree, but that'sokay.
I don't think that they invited.
I don't think Trump invitedZelensky to have an argument in
front of the press?
Speaker 2 (13:18):
Yeah, but I think it's egomaniacal to say you have
to thank us, you have to.
Where's the thank?
You Well they should, yes, theyshould.
Speaker 4 (13:25):
They should Right.
And not only that, they'reasking for more and they're
asking for American involvementand Trump is saying I'm not
doing that anymore and that's.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Zelensky's lack of tact.
That's correct, yeah, which?
Speaker 3 (13:39):
is too bad, I'm wondering they I mean, I'm just
thinking about the ins and outsof that Zelensky's.
Clearly English is not hisfirst language.
He struggles with it and a lotof times you miss cultural cues
when you're not a native speaker.
He would have been betterserved if he'd had an
(14:01):
interpreter in there that couldhelp him actually read what the
room was like and say thingsprobably a bit more elegantly
than he did.
Speaker 4 (14:08):
But also remember that Joe Biden has a screaming
match with Zelensky too.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
I don't remember that , yes it was Look it up.
Speaker 4 (14:18):
Oh, I will Look it up .
On the same topic On the sametopic.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
Because Zelensky thought the US should go to war
with Russia.
Speaker 4 (14:25):
Well, not necessarily go to war, but commit
themselves to the point whichthey did, but to the point of I
don't know if American arms Imean American arms, but I don't
know how far Zelensky wantedmore from Biden.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Most boots on the ground, that kind of stuff.
Ground, that kind of stuff.
I think it is true, going backto what Father Mario was saying,
that he was forcing the handsof the Europeans to say, and
they've actually come up andthey've said you know, we're
going to be doing more.
The Europeans, I think, arecoming along and I think they're
(15:04):
seeing the handwriting on thewall Because if the Ukraine
falls, they're next.
We need to go to a break.
We'll be back.
We're going to talk about warand peace Generally speaking.
Oh, the book?
Not exactly.
Speaker 4 (15:17):
This is 1070 KNTH.
Come back to us so you can hearhow right I am.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
That was a good ending, good segue.
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Let me tell you I have found this and the
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Speaker 1 (17:37):
Say it again, yeah.
What is it good for?
Absolutely nothing.
Say it again, y'all.
I have a.
Speaker 2 (17:48):
In the 60s 70s.
When this came out, I had oneperspective.
Now I'm not so sure I agree.
Welcome back to our show offaith on the intensive of the
answer.
Speaker 3 (18:06):
Yeah, we're talking about war and peace tonight.
Given the kind of theuncomfortable exchange that took
place between PresidentZelensky and our president,
president Trump and VicePresident Vance, I thought it'd
be interesting that we spend alittle time talking about peace
and war tonight and what ourdifferent religions say about
those things.
We're going to say a lot of thesame things, I think, because
(18:28):
somewhat I mean war, you know.
Yeah, I mean, what is it goodfor?
Uh?
I think there are things thereare times, times that it is, and
that's that's part of what Iwant to discuss tonight.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
So you have to tell the ukraine they were right to
defend themselves yeah,absolutely going to war right
right.
So from their perspective, waris in this.
What's, mario's your line about?
A sad necessity or something?
Speaker 4 (18:53):
Violence, when justified, is not an option but
a sad duty.
Sad duty.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
Yeah, so sometimes war is.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
Okay, let's start with the flip side of that.
Let's talk about peace, One ofthe things I love yeah is Rabbi
sitting here doing Peace, loveand Woodstock Nation Right.
So in Hebrew there's a wordshalom.
Speaker 2 (19:17):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (19:19):
What does the word peace mean?
I mean when you say that, whenyou hear that?
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Okay, but it's conceptual, it's not just a
single word.
Okay, in English we say peace,world around reality, and it
means basically the world is notyet.
It means the absence of war.
Speaker 3 (19:36):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (19:37):
That's not what it means in the Hebrew.
In the Hebrew there's a senseof completion.
Everything is complete,everything's in its place,
everything's where it should be.
There's a calm, there's a calm.
So, for example, if God, godforbid, someone is sick, you
know, like Mario had the surgery, or whatever.
(20:00):
So we would say refuah, whichmeans that healing.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
Thank you, yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
And refuah shlema.
Shlema means complete.
So a complete healing.
May your healing be complete.
But you hear shalom in shlema,you hear the root letters.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
Oh, I see.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
So the sense of the word peace, shalom is not just
nobody's making war against eachother, but rather everything is
right with the world.
Everything's in its place,Everything's where it should be.
There's a calm.
There's a calm over everything.
Speaker 3 (20:40):
So it's a conception.
Is it philosophical, is itreligious?
What is it exactly?
Speaker 2 (20:45):
Well, every word is both religious and philosophical
.
I mean, you can, in the contextin which you're going to find
whatever word you're talkingabout.
Speaker 3 (20:52):
Right, okay, in the context in which you're going to
find whatever word you'retalking about.
Right okay, I mean as you thinkabout it from a Hebrew
standpoint.
Speaker 2 (21:04):
There's much more to the word than simply nobody at
war.
It's think of shepherds intheir fields with their flock.
Everything's peaceful.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
Rabbi.
Speaker 2 (21:13):
Rabbi.
Speaker 8 (21:16):
Yes, did you say that things?
It's a sort of state wheresomething is properly aligned to
its intent or purpose, okay, orsomething is ordered correctly,
as it was meant to be.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
Everything is in order.
Yes, Okay, Everything is in itsplace.
It's tranquil.
It is, to use fancy terminologywhich I really hate, there's no
strife.
I love that word.
Okay, it's like the word yeah,there's no strife.
(21:53):
Everything's in its place.
Everything's where it should be.
It's not merely people aren'tkilling each other.
It is much more than that.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Yeah, is there a particular teaching from your
scriptures, your Bible, that youthink about with the word peace
?
That just comes to mind.
I'll let you think about that.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
But you're asking an old man with bad memory to come
up with the verses.
Speaker 3 (22:21):
But just a general teaching, because one of the
things that we read over andagain in the New Testament is
that when Paul writes hisletters, he says Grace to you
and peace from God, our Fatherand Lord.
Speaker 2 (22:35):
Jesus Christ.
That's the typical sort ofopening, very Hebrew equivalence
.
Yeah, exactly.
People will say but shalom.
But they shouldn't.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
And in our worship services on a regular basis, we
have the passing of the peace.
We say peace, be with you.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
Peace, your most precious gift, you who have the
passing of the peace, we saypeace be with you, you who are
the eternal source of peace.
It's a line from one of theolder old Hebrew prayer books.
Old Hebrew prayer books.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
Is there a kind of a philosophy of peace, father
Mario, or ideas of peace in theCatholic Church?
Speaker 4 (23:13):
Yeah, I mean strongly Because's remember, for us as
Christians, it's when Jesus saysI do not give you peace as the
world gives peace.
I give you peace as my peace Igive you.
And so what we're dealing withis peace with justice.
(23:33):
And so what we're dealing withis peace with justice.
And it's interesting because,going back to what we were
talking about before, I seeTrump as seeking a peace that is
(23:53):
in accordance with Catholicjust war theory.
One of the things aboutCatholic just war theory is that
a war can be justified first ofall if it's a just cause, if
it's defensive, but when therealistic prospects of winning
(24:16):
do not cause more harm than good.
So when Trump is saying I'm notgoing to get into World War III
to gain a strip of Ukrainebecause that will put more
danger into the world.
I see what you're saying Okayand so, even though it is not
(24:41):
ideal politics in the sense that, yes, Russia did invade.
The Catholic understanding isthat seeking that ideal should
not bring in more catastrophe,and I think that's what Trump is
saying.
Speaker 3 (24:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (24:59):
So we need to go to a break.
Okay, this is 1070 KNTH andwe'll be right back.
Speaker 7 (25:05):
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Speaker 1 (27:10):
The Answer the Answer To everything turn, turn, turn.
(27:31):
There is a season.
Turn, turn, turn there is aseason Turn turn, turn and a
time to every purpose underheaven, a time to be born, a
time to die, a time to plant, atime to reap, a time to kill, a
(27:53):
time to heal.
A time to reap, a time to kill,a time to heal, a time to laugh
, a time to weep Welcome back toA Show of Faith.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
So Psalm 2911, the eternal will give strength to
his people.
The eternal will bless hispeople with peace.
3414,.
Depart from evil and do good.
Seek peace and pursue it.
Speaker 3 (28:19):
3711, the meek shall inherit the earth and shall
delight themselves in theabundance of peace.
It's all over, All over all.
Speaker 4 (28:25):
The Hebrew Bible and Father Mario was talking about
the fact that it's peace andjustice together.
Yeah, because from ourperspective, as a Christian
perspective, you can say peaceand the Pax Romana was peace.
But the Pax Romana was peace.
Under the sword of domination,slaves could have peace as long
as they were submissive.
So it's not peace as an end initself, it's peace and justice,
(28:48):
peace and justice together.
Speaker 3 (28:49):
Rudy, what are you hearing down there?
What are your thoughts?
Living in the culture thatyou're in, though you're
Americanized still, how do yousee it?
This idea of peace, andparticularly?
Speaker 8 (29:04):
and I think this would sort of extend a lot to
the United States is most peoplehere.
They just want to be left alone.
They want to be in a countrywhere the government doesn't
(29:27):
come in, alienates them, takesaway rights, takes away property
.
They want to be in a countrythat doesn't meddle in other
things, alienates them, takesaway rights, takes away property
.
They want to be in a countrythat doesn't meddle in other
things.
I mean Central America,specifically Mexico, and even
the United States.
I mean there's so many internalthings going on.
So when we look at theseforeign wars right and Father
(29:53):
Mario made the comment I meanit's like what is our interest?
When you think about these pastwars Vietnam, right, and Korea
and these sort of drawn-out Imean Afghanistan we were in
Afghanistan for over 20 yearsbombing them and with military
presence there and to a largedegree, I think that's what
(30:14):
Trump is trying to avoid rightis dragging us into another
drawn-out conflict that's justmostly fought by.
I mean, trump isn't going to goover there and fight.
Zelensky isn't over therefighting.
You know it's not thepoliticians that go fight, it's
18-, 19 20-year-olds that areout there bleeding and dying.
(30:35):
You know it's not.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
And that's why I think you know you enter into
war very guardedly, and we'lltalk about that in a minute.
But the whole idea that peacemeans more than just the fact
that nobody's at war, but thatthings are being done in a just
way, is peace God's gift.
(31:02):
Stuart, from your idea, I meanas you were reading, it sounds
like.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
God's going to give peace to his people.
I think that the existence ofpeace is a gift from God but,
like most things, sometimes youhave to fight for peace, you
have to work for it, you have toactively pursue it.
Speaker 3 (31:20):
Yeah, I remember seeing signs in.
I think it was the George Floydtime no justice, no peace,
something like that.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
And then with K-N-O-W .
Speaker 3 (31:30):
Yeah, yeah, those kind of things.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
And I think that's true.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
Let's come to the idea now on the other side of
that war when is war?
Let's go back, maybe, to thejust war theory in a sense.
When is war?
Is war ever justified?
The song War?
What Is it Good For?
Absolutely nothing.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
Right, but sometimes it is justified.
Sometimes it is justifiedSelf-defense.
Speaker 3 (31:56):
Right, right.
So what does Judaism say aboutwar?
Speaker 2 (32:05):
Here's a place where we're going to agree, like Mario
said about violence in general,that sometimes it's a necessity
, but more than that it becomesa sad duty.
So you would say Judaismdegrades Right because there's a
just worth theory in Judaism,in the Bible.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
So what about?
Thou shalt not murder?
Go back to that.
Speaker 2 (32:25):
But it's not murder, murder is taking the life of the
innocent, the soldier, acrossthe yard from you, right, but
there's this teaching Thou shaltnot murder.
Speaker 9 (32:34):
But it's murder not killing.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
But that doesn't preclude war.
No, because there are timeslike self-defense, okay, and if
you're surrounded and they'reabout to enter your territory,
cross the border into you, youhave the right of first attack
to defend.
Speaker 7 (32:53):
Yeah you do.
Speaker 2 (32:55):
So you are starting the war.
You know it's the old kid'sline.
He started it when he hit meback.
You know there are times whereit's a sad duty.
Okay.
Speaker 4 (33:07):
I want to add one thing, because I looked up at
what I was trying to say aboutCatholic Just War Theory.
Okay, and the principles threeand four.
The first principle theprinciples three and four.
The first principle there mustbe a serious prospect of success
.
But four here's the kicker onethe use of arms must not produce
(33:30):
evils and disorders greaterthan the evil to be eliminated.
The power of modern means ofdestruction weighs very heavily
in evaluating this condition.
So you cannot.
What Trump is saying is Russiamay be weak in terms of its
(33:52):
regular military, but it is anuclear power and they're in an
existential war and Putin is not.
It won't be, won't be deterredfrom using them if need be.
Okay.
And so the use of arms must notproduce evils and disorders
graver than the evil to beeliminated.
(34:13):
What's the evil to beeliminated?
Putin going after Ukraine.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
Right and pushing back to the prior border.
Speaker 4 (34:22):
That's right To eliminate.
That you would trigger a lotmore evils.
That's what Trump is saying yes.
Speaker 2 (34:28):
Isn't it interesting that in every movie or science
fiction story of a dystopianworld it usually begins where
there has already been a nuclearwar, where human beings
basically destroy themselves.
Speaker 3 (34:42):
Yes, A lot of the dystopian yeah, exactly Right.
Yeah, exactly All right.
So you didn't mention one andtwo, In other words, just war
theory, the first idea and thesecond idea.
So the first idea was what?
Speaker 4 (35:02):
Well, okay, the first idea is the damage inflicted by
the aggressor.
Let's make it Russia this time.
The damage inflicted by theaggressor on the nation or
community of nations must belasting, grave and certain.
That's already beendemonstrated.
Number two all other means ofputting an end to it must have
(35:24):
been shown to be impractical orineffective that's already
exhausted now.
Speaker 3 (35:30):
Now, but at this point to continue the war.
That's the point.
Yeah, I mean to continue thewar.
I mean it may have been justthat they defended themselves
and thought that they had achance of success.
Going back to that thirdquality there.
Speaker 2 (35:49):
Thus, it's not righteousness, it's power, and
to the victor goes the spoils.
The justice of the situationloses out because Russia's more
powerful.
Speaker 4 (36:03):
See, I think that where Trump is, he's saying the
use of American arms willproduce evils and disorders
greater than the evil to beeliminated.
Speaker 3 (36:16):
In case there is a nuclear exchange.
Speaker 4 (36:18):
Yeah, I mean you're dealing with a nuclear power.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
Right, right and Ukraine.
Ironically, ukraine used to bea nuclear power.
Speaker 4 (36:24):
Yeah, and they gave up their nuclear because we
guaranteed that was another oneof these idiots.
Speaker 2 (36:29):
We fooled you.
You trusted us, yeah.
Speaker 3 (36:33):
Yeah, those kind of things.
Speaker 4 (36:35):
But those are the kinds of entanglements that
Trump doesn't want to get into,and I don't blame him.
I have really come to likeTrump as a human being.
I know lots of people.
I don't, I do, I do.
I think he's better than theDemocrats, but I'm not fond of
any of them.
Speaker 2 (36:54):
I think they all stink.
I don't say he's a saint.
Speaker 4 (36:57):
He's not a saint, but I've heard him talk.
You know the other day he wastalking about well, what do we
care?
It's people over there dying,it's not Americans.
And he says I don't care justabout Americans, I care about
all those Russian boys and allthose Ukrainian boys that are
dying there for nothing.
And you know that sayssomething about the man that
(37:19):
he's concerned about.
That.
Speaker 3 (37:21):
And you know he seemed to be very moved too by
the deaths of the children inIsrael at the hands of Hamas.
Speaker 7 (37:29):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (37:30):
I mean that seemed to have really hit a nerve with
him.
Speaker 4 (37:35):
He's not a perfect guy.
He's not a perfect guy, he's notyour perfect christian, but I
think the guy has a roughoutline of a good, good moral
sense now not his past, becauseevery time I hear him criticize
you know, I heard somebody onthe view going oh no, we got to
put a picture of all the theprostitutes that he's ever been
with, and all that stuff, manalive.
(37:57):
Are you ever saying the man canbe forgiven?
There's no forgiveness?
No forgiveness because all theywant to do is drag out his past
.
See, this is the kind of guy heis.
Speaker 2 (38:08):
No, you get rid of somebody because 50 years ago
they said something that's right.
Speaker 4 (38:13):
So I'm not looking at the way he did.
I've heard some of my friendsare saying but that's the kind
of man we don't want himrepresenting us, why not?
He's a forgiven sinner.
Speaker 3 (38:24):
I hope he is, he's giving me that impression, but
he seems to have, I mean, as youdescribed here, and I haven't
looked into some of the thingsthat you've been looking into
but if he's thinking that deeplyabout it, about what these
entanglements would create, andit would create a graver evil
(38:49):
just by the use of weapons thatwould unleash horror, and he
said it during the meeting withZelensky.
Speaker 4 (39:00):
He said, Zelensky, you're playing around with World
War III.
Speaker 2 (39:04):
So is he supposed to just give up his country for the
sake of?
Speaker 4 (39:07):
peace.
No, no, trump was giving him away of achieving peace and
getting American involvement,but not military involvement,
economic involvement, becausethey understand that putin would
be a lot less ready to killamericans if american companies
were there, and then the unitedstates would come in and defend
(39:27):
americans you're talking aboutthe mineral rights the mineral
rights.
That's right.
It would be.
It would be a booth companiesand it would be good for them
because it would create jobs forthem and it would create jobs
for us.
Speaker 2 (39:41):
And I see what you're saying.
I just find it very ironic thatit goes down to corporations,
business and making money.
Speaker 4 (39:50):
It's life.
That's what's called realpolitics, real politics Okay, I
mean you want the best andsometimes you've got to get your
hands a little dirty Right andwe've got to get our hands a
little dirty because if we don'tgo to a break, you talk about
money, about companies.
That's right.
Coming back to Rudy, that'sright, Rudy, we'll come back to
you.
This is 1070 KNTH and we'll beright back.
Speaker 7 (40:12):
AM 1070, the answer.
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Hctra is committed to maintainsafety on our roads through a
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It's hard to keep up until now.
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(41:40):
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Speaker 1 (41:49):
Group, Everybody at Salem Media Group.
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you've been incredible you really are, and
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We'd say you're pretty good company and in salem
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I'm telling you, salem hasreally done a fantastic job.
I just want to thank you.
You have courage.
You have really courage,because I know it's not easy.
Speaker 7 (42:08):
Congratulations hey, 10, 70 and fm 103 3 the answer
(42:32):
two, one, two, three, four.
Speaker 4 (42:34):
The Answer?
All we are saying is give peacea chance.
Is that the Beatles?
Yes, yeah, that's John Lennon.
Speaker 2 (42:44):
All we are saying is give peace a chance, which was a
great idea in the period inwhich they were saying it Give
peace a chance it wasn't goingto be 70 days.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
Yeah, but you know what's happening.
He said give peace a chance,but forget about the human,
either Right?
Speaker 2 (42:59):
Everybody's going to be fine.
That's the other side of that.
That's what I was sayingearlier.
Speaker 4 (43:04):
Sometimes you have to go to war All we are saying I
know you're saying that, butyou're not saying much, give
peace a chance.
Speaker 2 (43:13):
Welcome back to A Show of Faith.
My name is Tim Simons.
Speaker 3 (43:16):
The answer All right, rudy, your turn, buddy.
We're talking about here war,avoiding war, the real politic
of war, and not necessarily whatis ideally the best for
everybody involved but sometimesyou just take what you can get
(43:39):
right.
Speaker 8 (43:39):
I thought about this verse in Matthew Blessed are the
peacemakers for they shall becalled sons of God.
And you know, I think a lotabout what's going on in Ukraine
and I think about also, forexample, what's going down in
Nicaragua, and there's a lot ofpeople suffering in Nicaragua
(44:00):
and I'm not trying to compare.
Every sort of conflict is itsown animal right, but here we
are with a country with acompletely corrupt government
system.
People are starving, the churchis being persecuted, people are
being killed.
I mean there's people arestarving, the church is being
(44:20):
persecuted, people are beingkilled.
I mean there's people.
So again going back to thepoint and to kind of bring it
back to Ukraine, would theUkrainian people have a greater
probability of life andexistence and substance if there
was an immediate peace, even atthe borders of where they were
at?
And and I know we can argue alot about sovereignty in the
(44:44):
state and the nations, and theyhave a right and absolutely they
do.
But the reality is, is Ukrainewithout Western intervention
stands absolutely no chanceright?
absolutely none and even thoughrussia is absolutely spent um,
like father mario was saying, itstill has a lot of armaments
(45:06):
and a lot of and a lot of verybig bombs superior military.
Unfortunately, it all boilsdown to, in my opinion,
resources right, and there's alot of rare earth minerals in
Ukraine, in Russia, and thisisn't the first time that Putin
invaded.
(45:26):
He invaded Crimea back when.
Obama was president.
He did it again now when Biden.
So this is the sort of Russianaggression, you know to what
point.
And I understand the fear right, because if you look back at
(45:47):
what the Nazis were doing inGermany, they first started with
a little bit then over here,then over there you know, when
do you draw the line and saythis oppressive regime can no
longer continue?
right, it's just who's going topay the price, and the price is
(46:09):
blood.
Right, that's the price in alot of it.
It's the same thing that Ithink about Sorry, to kind of
keep you out of it, but it's thesame thing I think about.
In Nicaragua and Venezuela,right, everybody speaks about
revolution and this it's likeokay, but are you willing to die
, are you willing to put up youractions for it?
(46:30):
And I'm speaking facetiouslyright, but that's what it takes
is people to stand up, and evenwithin Russia themselves?
Right, but that's what it takesis people to stand up, and even
within Russia themselves?
Right, there has to be thiscourage and this sort of
audacity to change things fromthe inside too, because without
that, okay, so we stop now, andthen what happens in four years,
(46:53):
when Trump's out of the officeand we get another silly
Democrat in office?
You know, hopefully Putin'smoved on, but not likely.
Speaker 2 (47:04):
You remind me of the also 60s, 70s, maybe the 80s
line.
What if they gave a war andnobody came?
What happens if the people ofRussia just said we're not going
to give our children?
People of Ukraine said we'renot going to give our children.
People of Ukraine said we'renot going to give our children.
They won't do that.
Nobody in the military would dothat, but still.
Speaker 3 (47:26):
Yeah, I think they would have a lot to lose if they
in some ways like that.
Speaking of which.
Speaker 2 (47:32):
Rudy, didn't Nicaragua, the president of
Nicaragua, just take for himselfdictatorial powers?
Wasn't that Nicaragua wouldjust take for himself
dictatorial powers?
Speaker 8 (47:38):
Wasn't that.
Speaker 2 (47:39):
Nicaragua.
Speaker 8 (47:40):
Yeah, he suspended, I think like two or three weeks
ago I think the guy's a littlesnippet on it but he suspended
all future elections and he cannow be president for forever.
And here's this country, rightand, and you go.
And rabbi, I was just there, um, in january in nicaragua, and
(48:05):
you go there.
Let me tell you the countryitself you're driving.
You could leave your keys inyour car, nobody's going to mug
you, it's relatively safe.
But let me tell you, when thosecops and that police is out
there doing their stops, it'sthe most scariest thing, man to
be in a country in a situationwhere the military and the
(48:28):
police I actually fear them morethan some delinquent criminal
on the street.
Speaker 2 (48:38):
Power corrupts Absolute power corrupts
absolutely.
Speaker 4 (48:41):
That's what you get when you get peace at all costs,
right Peace without justice.
Speaker 3 (48:50):
Is the old saying, all is fair.
In love and war it's not All isfair.
Speaker 2 (48:56):
All is not fair.
That's why Patton was it.
Speaker 3 (49:03):
It pat, who said war is hell.
Oh, absolutely yeah, yeah, itis so.
So can you do anything in atime of war?
No, no, I mean there there iswar going on.
So can you?
Can you deceive your enemy, canyou?
Speaker 4 (49:16):
oh yeah.
Speaker 7 (49:16):
So, can you deceive your enemy?
Speaker 3 (49:17):
You can deceive.
There are certain things.
Speaker 4 (49:20):
But you cannot go after innocents, that's murder.
Speaker 3 (49:25):
So going after innocent women and children and
older people 80-year-old folks.
Speaker 4 (49:34):
And it's interesting because the Catholic Church says
it's interesting, you hear.
The catechism concludes in thelast paragraph these are
traditional elements, enumerjudgment of those who have the
responsibility for the commongood, Meaning it's not the
(50:02):
church's responsibility to makethe ultimate decisions.
The decisions are made by thegovernment.
The churches and the religionscan educate the government, but
it's not our role to rule.
No, it's politics andgovernment.
Speaker 3 (50:18):
In other words, you can say now you have not met
this criteria.
Speaker 7 (50:21):
That's correct.
Speaker 3 (50:22):
And you better take that into consideration.
That's right, but you're notthe one making the decision
whether or not you're going towar or not going to war.
That's correct, okay.
Speaker 8 (50:34):
The way I think about it, too, though, is there's a
huge responsibility also withthe citizens, though, to make
sure that their government iseven acting in a manner that is
promoting the common good, evento begin with, right, that's
correct.
Speaker 3 (50:51):
yes, now go back and say that again.
Speaker 8 (50:56):
Well, can you say it?
Yeah, so what I was going tosay is sometimes, and a lot of
times, governments, you know,because power sometimes is
centralized, right then a fewbad apples can really kind of
take a left turn.
And what I'm saying is that,fundamentally though, as a
(51:17):
citizen of a nation, of asovereign state, it is your
responsibility to make sure andin our case, right that we're
voting for the right people,that we're pushing the right
representatives, that we aredoing our part in informing
ourselves about the people thatare leading us.
I mean, I think a lot of theissue with Russia, with the
(51:39):
United States, with really everycountry in the world, is that a
lot of people are justcomplacent, right, and they
don't want to really take activeroles in as much as we want to
march down streets and say freePalestine and all this other
kind of nonsense, right.
We've really been responsiblecitizens to promote that, that
(52:04):
elect and promote leaders forthe common good, and it starts
with the citizen, in my mind.
Speaker 2 (52:10):
It starts with the citizen, and there's an old line
that the people who do theelecting get the government they
deserve.
Speaker 4 (52:17):
And to some degree, that's what we got.
Speaker 3 (52:19):
But you think about poor folks in Nicaragua, though.
Are they getting the government?
Speaker 2 (52:25):
No, because they had no choice.
Speaker 3 (52:26):
They didn't have a vote Right, and the same thing
happened to Venezuela.
The same thing happened in.
Speaker 2 (52:31):
Cuba, every dictatorship.
Speaker 3 (52:33):
Cuba.
Is it Cuba?
Cuba, every dictatorship?
Yeah, anytime, you have thatExactly right, yeah, well, one
of the things that I appreciateabout people who have served in
the armed forces and continue toserve in the armed forces is
that they are true publicservants and they deserve honor
(52:53):
and respect for their service.
There have been times whenthey've been mistreated,
maltreated.
There have been times in theChristian tradition when to
serve in the Roman army, youknow, first was to you know you
couldn't be a Christian andactually be a soldier.
Speaker 2 (53:12):
Same thing with the Jews in Russia, even in modern
times.
Speaker 3 (53:15):
Yeah, so it was just you know.
It's one thing to say.
You know we, you are thoseservants of ours who help us
with our security and with ourfreedom, and we honor you.
And we honor you at this timeof the year, whether it's a
holiday or whether it's sayingthank you for your service in a
(53:38):
restaurant or whatever it mightbe, just recognizing that they
are serving dutifully andwonderfully for us.
I know we've got to go.
Speaker 2 (53:47):
I think Rudy's up next week.
Speaker 3 (53:49):
Rudy's up.
Speaker 4 (53:52):
You're up.
I got it Okay.
By the way, did you guys hearabout the kidnapping at school?
Speaker 3 (53:59):
No, yep, which school ?
Speaker 4 (54:03):
No, the kidnapping at school.
Speaker 3 (54:04):
Oh, oh.
Speaker 4 (54:05):
He woke up.
Speaker 3 (54:06):
Oh, no, oh, I didn't hear about that.
He woke up, he woke up, I gotit.
Kidnapping, kidnapping, I gotit.
Yes, jeez, I got it, I knew it.
Speaker 2 (54:15):
I knew it, it's late at night I know.
Speaker 3 (54:18):
Gosh Well you can help us, but you can only take
us so far.
Speaker 4 (54:23):
Yes, why did the egg have a day off?
Because it's Friday.
Friday.
Okay, folks, this is 1070 KNTH.
Please listen to us next week.
At the same time, keep us inyour prayers, because you are
(54:44):
going to be in ours.
Speaker 7 (54:45):
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