September 24, 2025 • 29 mins
In this powerful episode of A Way Forward, host Jessica Samuels sits down with Corey Hirsch — former NHL goaltender, Stanley Cup champion, Olympic silver medalist, broadcaster, and mental health advocate.
From the outside, Corey seemed to be living the dream at the height of his hockey career. But behind the mask, he was struggling with obsessive-compulsive disorder (OCD) and suicidal thoughts that nearly cost him his life.
Corey opens up about:
-The hidden reality of living with OCD while playing in the NHL.
-Why stigma kept him silent for over 20 years.
-How sharing his 2017 Players’ Tribune article, “Dark, Dark, Dark”, changed the conversation for him and countless others.
-The importance of being “that person” someone can talk to without judgment.
-The tools he uses today to manage his mental health, from therapy and medication to exercise, meditation, and community.
This candid and inspiring conversation reminds us that talking about our struggles saves lives — and that healing begins when we break the silence.
✨ Key takeaway: Mental health is health. Be the person someone can turn to.
Resources & Links:
Dark Dark Dark - https://www.theplayerstribune.com/articles/corey-hirsch-dark-dark-dark
You are not alone - https://www.theplayerstribune.com/articles/corey-hirsch-you-are-not-alone
Canucks Hockey Talks Video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOmVmAIXX7Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOmVmAIXX7Y
Learn more about OCD at www.cmhakelowna.org
If you or someone you know is thinking about suicide, call or text 9-8-8 in Canada to connect with suicide prevention support.
🎧 A Way Forward is presented by Beem Credit Union, with deep roots in BC and a commitment to supporting strong, healthy communities.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jessica Samuels (00:00):
Hello, I'm Jessica Samuels. Welcome to A
(00:02):
Way Forward presented by BeamCredit Union. This podcast is
produced on the ancestral,traditional and unceded
territories of the OkanaganZilliqa people. My guest today
is Corey Hirsch. He's a formerNHL goaltender, a Stanley Cup
winner, an Olympic silvermedalist, and a mental health
ambassador and advocate.
(00:24):
His story is of someone who fromall outward appearances was at
the top of his game, but he wasnot. And in fact, he was
struggling so significantly withhis mental illness, he almost
didn't make it. But he did. Heasked for help. And he's here to
let anyone who's struggling knowthat it does get better.
(00:45):
Beam Credit Union is proud tosponsor today's episode. With
deep roots in BC and acommitment to your financial
journey, Beam believes wellness,mental and financial starts with
support you can count on. Cory,thank you for being here. And I
say that on two levels. Thankyou for being here on the
podcast.
And thank you for being herewith this message. It's an
(01:08):
incredible story, an importantstory to tell. And I really
appreciate you being here totell it.
Corey Hirsch (01:14):
Well, and I appreciate you being able to
allow me to tell it because ifthere's nobody to hear it, then
we have nothing. Right? So it'sa mutual respect. I appreciate
it. Thank you.
Jessica Samuels (01:25):
Very true. Thank you so much. So let's go
back to I read an article thatyou wrote in 2017 in the Players
Tribune. It's called Dark, Dark,Dark. There's actually eight
darks.
But we'll talk a little bitabout that. It was such an
(01:46):
emotional read. It took me alittle bit to get through it. I
don't mind telling people that.I can't imagine what it was like
for you to write it.
Can you tell me what brought youto the point to write that
article at that time?
Corey Hirsch (02:06):
Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of factors that I
always considered telling,obviously my story. All have a
story to tell, but with mine, Iwas going to initially write a
book is what I was thinking ofdoing and going out that route.
And it was taking a bit of timeand I hummed and hawed on it
when I met another player,another player in the National
(02:29):
Hockey League who was in arehabilitation center in Arizona
at the time where where I wasliving. And this player was an
active player at the time. I'dbeen retired for fifteen years
at this point.
I'd met him and I was through amutual friend and just thought,
I'll take him for coffee. He'sin a rehabilitation center. You
(02:49):
know, he must must need a friendor somebody just to talk to. And
so I took him to Starbucks andwe went and we sat there and I
just had never really toldanybody but close friends and
family my story. Nobody reallyknew.
And then with him, I justfigured him being in in a
treatment center, you know, foraddiction, I I figured I'll just
(03:12):
tell him because usuallyaddiction and mental health go
hand in hand. So I figured outjust maybe maybe he could find
something, some common ground init. And so I I started telling
him my story and I told him allabout it and he looked at me,
you know, dead straight in theeyes. He says, oh my god, that's
exactly what I've gone through.And his mom had to resuscitate
(03:33):
him twice from fentanyloverdoses.
So it was at that point I went,okay, you know, here's a person
that's almost died twice fromaddiction with fentanyl
overdoses, whom and who knowshow many other times. I didn't
realize that there was otherpeople out there like me at the
time. And it was that moment thelight bulb went off and it was
like, oh my God, there arethousands of more people out
(03:55):
there like me that need to hearthe story we're hiding our
mental health issues, who knowshow many were successful at
overdoses or suicides, right? Soit was at that point I just
went, okay, I gotta get my storyout there. And the wheels just
kind of got in motion.
The universe just kept puttingpeople in front of me, put a
lady named, you know, CatherineMcAuley and Lana Quinn in front
(04:18):
of me randomly. I met Lana at afuneral actually of an old coach
of mine. And it was just, it waslike a month after I had met
this player, who I won't say thename, but due to privacy, but it
was almost as if, and then theyput me in touch with the NHL,
who put me in touch with thePlayers Tribune, and the story
(04:39):
just got rolling. Lana wasalmost the same story. I was
just sitting there beside herand we were talking and I just
spewed my story to her.
I don't even know why, I justdid. And she put the wheels in
motion and the Will A PlayersTribune article came out, and
that article is still probablyis one of the most clicked on
articles in Players Tribunehistory in sports publishing.
(05:00):
That that includes Tiger Woods,Michael Jordan, you know, all
these great athletes. And here'smine, Corey Hirsch, you know,
kid from Calgary. And my articlehit just as hard.
So that's kind of the longwinded answer, but that's how it
all happened. Yeah.
Jessica Samuels (05:14):
Well, and it is a long answer, but I appreciate
it because what I notice is mostsignificant in that response and
also as part of the story isthat you talked about it. So you
told in this instance where youmet this player for coffee and
you told your story, and thenyou realized you weren't alone
and he realized he wasn't alone.And then, you know, you tell it
(05:35):
again. And I really feel likethat's at the heart of the crux
of you of you speaking andtelling your story. So now let's
go back to 1994 for people whowho don't know your story, or
maybe don't know the details ofyour story.
What was happening for you?
Corey Hirsch (05:52):
Yeah, so I have obsessive compulsive disorder.
It manifests in a lot ofdifferent ways. In 1994, was
rolling right along in life andOCD is a little bit different
than something that's traumabased or depression or anxiety.
OCD for me was like something inmy brain just broke, like two
wires disconnected. I startedgetting repetitive thinking,
(06:16):
deep, dark thoughts that weren'ttrue and my rational brain, my
irrational brain were fightingeach other.
And the way OCD manifests, mostpeople think it's hand washing
and cleanliness and organizationand all that. I did everything
in my head. Everything wasmental compulsions for me, so
you couldn't see it, right? So Iwas able to hide it very easily
(06:39):
because you couldn't I didn'thave any outward outward things
where people would notice, oh,there's places or whatever,
organize or anything, any one ofthose. I did everything in my
head.
So I had a, you know, and I'mnot afraid to say this, it's so
manifest in a lot of men and alot of people with your sexual
orientation, your sexuality, itcan go after that. And mine was
(07:02):
thinking that I might possiblybe gay, which today, you know,
it's not a big deal. I don'tcare anymore. Back in 1994, that
would have, you know, thrown outmy NHL career, would have been a
big news thing, big thing. Sokind of attacked it that way.
Now the content of it istypically, it doesn't matter,
right? It's OCD attacks,whatever. But I went on to their
(07:26):
thinking, you know, givingpeople HIV to like all sorts of
different things. That's how itmanifested for me when I was
none of those things, but yourrational and irrational brain.
It's hard to describe.
It's like the best way todescribe OCD is you're driving
down the road, you get athought, two lane traffic, one's
(07:47):
coming this way, one's coming.We all get that thought, well,
what if I accidentally just mywheel into that lane? Well, it'd
be chaos, things would happen.Well, a rational normal brain
would go home and go, that was asilly thought because you would
never do it, but it's just athought. And the OCD brain like
me would go home, I would thinkabout it, I would never want
that to happen ever to the pointwhere I would just stop driving
(08:09):
my car.
Right? Like, it would get tothat point where 20 fourseven,
that's the only thought I'd beable to have. That's OCD, so
mine manifested a little bitdifferently, and there's
thousands of ways that OCD canmanifest. There's harm,
religious, sexuality,cleanliness, but people only
think that it's cleanliness.It's got a wide variety of
(08:31):
things.
The other thing about OCD that Ineed people to understand is
that people are like, Oh, it'scute. You're clean. You're that.
Most of my friends that haveobsessive compulsive disorder
before they were diagnosed havemade a suicide attempt. That's
how debilitating it is.
But the thing about OCD that Iwanna tell people out there is
that no matter what it has, italso has the best gains once you
(08:54):
do get diagnosed. So that's kindof, you know, again, another
long winded answer because therereally is no short winded way to
say any of this, but that's OCD,that's how it manifests. But to
also know that it's one of themost treatable, not curable, but
it's very treatable once you'rediagnosed.
Jessica Samuels (09:15):
Okay. So the diagnosis came later. I mean, in
these moment, in the throes of,we're talking about 1994 and you
were managing these thoughtstrying to and from what I'm
hearing from you, worried thatyou're going to embark on these
actions or have these thingsthat you won't have any control
over. How were you? How were youmanaging?
(09:37):
Mean, on one hand, you'rehoisting up the Stanley Cup. But
it's interesting. Well, andthat's the whole point that you
weren't. So you're hoisting upthe Stanley Cup, and you're
really, really, really troubled.
Corey Hirsch (09:51):
Yeah, well, let's say every time you get, and
again, it's just a thought, wehave millions a day, but when
you get hit with an OCD thought,it's like getting hit with a
taser gun of anxiety. It can becrippling, it can be
debilitating. And then yourbrain is is fighting truth
versus non truth. Right? Youknow, I was I you know, still to
(10:13):
this day, 53 years old, I'm aheterosexual man, but my brain
was trying to tell me somethingelse.
Right? And you just get into,it's called brain lock. It's
almost like you just get into afight where one side is
rational, one is irrational. Andit's, again, it's debilitating.
Anxiety, it's anxiety fueled,it's crushing.
(10:33):
And I wasn't functioning. Offthe ice, I was I was, you know,
stopped hanging out with myfriends, stopped doing, you
know, things around the rink.Really, only sanctuary I had was
on the ice. That was where, youknow, my brain was occupied and
and that's where I felt like Iwas safest. But the minute I
stepped off the ice 24 a day,seven days a week, man, I was I
(10:57):
was in torture.
Like, was that those thoughtswere just never ever leaving.
They were automatic almost.
Jessica Samuels (11:04):
And you talked about you have friends who had
have have thought about oractions, you know, thought about
committing suicide. And you areone of those people as well. In
the midst of that, you had avery significant incident where
you were going to you were goingto do
Corey Hirsch (11:21):
it. Well, yeah, absolutely. And we need to let
people know that people that arethinking suicidal thoughts.
There's nothing wrong with that.Please come forward, let us
know.
We're ashamed to tell peoplethat we're having these thoughts
and that's what we're goingthrough, but that's actually
what keeps us prisoner. What wedo is when we shame people for
(11:42):
having these thoughts, we makethem feel worse. Hey, you know
what? It's okay you're havingthese thoughts, there's a better
solution out there. There's abetter answer.
We can get you some help withthis. And to stop shaming people
for feeling this way andthinking this way. Like I say,
it's not the solution. That'snot what I'm saying here. I'm
saying that we all, from time totime, things happen.
(12:06):
We get a bit sad, but don't beafraid to tell somebody that
you're having suicidal thoughts,please. Don't be afraid to tell
somebody and reach out, look,I'm not thinking properly or
these things are going throughmy mind, and reach out for help.
There is a solution, that thereis hope, that there is help,
that it is available. If we canencourage people to come forward
(12:28):
rather than shame them forthinking these things, no matter
how, whatever it is, we can helpyou. And that's, yeah, we keep
ourselves prisoners because ofour own thoughts.
There's a
Jessica Samuels (12:41):
better way it goes back to what we were
talking about before of nottalking, right? And it's that
layered stigma. I mean, a mentalhealth issue, having a mental
illness, whatever it is, there'sstigma associated with that. And
then associated with, you know,thoughts of suicide or, or, or
having a plan. What I reallyhear from you and all the things
that you're saying is, istalking to somebody.
(13:05):
Turning to somebody and saying,Hey, this is what I'm doing. And
this is what you did.
Corey Hirsch (13:09):
Yeah, well, it's it's because we think our
thoughts someone else is goingto judge us for them or someone
else is going to but, but youknow, they are what they are,
but they also keep us trapped asa prisoner in our own brain
because we think that we can'ttalk to anybody about this.
Who's going to listen to us?Especially with OCD because some
of your thoughts out there cango right off the deep end, but
(13:33):
that's what it does. What weneed to do is encourage people
to go see their doctor, to gotalk to people because they've
seen it all, they've heard itall. Please open up to a doctor,
open up to somebody.
If somebody comes and opens upto you, the best thing you can
do is listen and not judge andlead them to a professional. You
(13:54):
might not understand as thatperson that they've opened up
to, but the greatest gift youcan give is to lead them to a
professional, right? And there'snothing to be embarrassed about.
Mental health is something thataffects us all. We all get sad
from time to time.
We all get anxious from time totime. We go through struggles at
time to time. But man, when youopen up and finally let it off
(14:18):
your chest, it's like anelephant falls off your back.
Jessica Samuels (14:21):
And is that what it was like for you when
you finally opened up to theteam trainer?
Corey Hirsch (14:26):
Well, yeah. Well, what it was was I was But I got
to the point where it wassuicidal again, where, you know,
the option was I didn't reallyhave a choice, you know, but my
OCD made me, I had two choices.Well, I could either end it or I
could open up to somebody. SoOCD didn't really give me a
choice, right? And I chose toopen up to somebody because I
(14:48):
didn't wanna go the other route.
But we don't want people to getto that point, right? Early
diagnosis is the key. It's likecancer. You wanna get diagnosed
early. It's easier to treat.
It's easier to fix. Same withmental health. So don't wait,
you know, go get the help. Sothat's what I did. I ended up,
you know, opening up to atrainer and, you know, there's
(15:09):
three years of my life gonebecause I tried to hide it and I
tried to, and I stayed sick,right?
But the time that when I openedup to a trainer and got a
psychologist got diagnosed, justit meant the world. It meant to
change my life. Right.
Jessica Samuels (15:26):
And you mentioned something earlier
about how your particularthoughts manifested. And it's a
different world today. I'mwondering, the topic of mental
health and struggling and notdoing well from an NHL
perspective, or even a highperformance athlete, or even as
a male in the community where Imean, we're thinking about how
stigmas manifest around thesethings. At that time, you know,
(15:49):
we're talking 9495 here, thingswere not as far along as they
are now. You told someone yougot a diagnosis, you were still
living with this though.
How was that environment foryou? Did other people on the
team begin to know? Did youcontinue to open up?
Corey Hirsch (16:09):
No, no, I went I went to see a psychologist, got
diagnosed and I knew, but Istill didn't want anybody else
to know that I had a diagnosablemental health issue. There was
another twenty years. So I wasdiagnosed in like 'ninety seven.
2017, the article came out. Sotwenty years, I didn't tell
anybody, close family andfriends, right?
(16:31):
Why? Stigma, same thing. Yeah.Same reason, stigma. And then I
got to a point where as I gotolder, it didn't really matter
anymore, right?
So I just didn't It was nobody'sbusiness but mine until I wanted
to start really trying to helppeople and make a difference.
But yeah, twenty years from fromdiagnosis, I mean, we're just
now in the last probably tenyears where people are starting
(16:55):
to feel comfortable comingforward. If everybody felt
comfortable coming forward andit was a non issue, you and I
wouldn't be having thisconversation right now.
Jessica Samuels (17:03):
100%.
Corey Hirsch (17:04):
There's still a stigma attached to it. It's
twenty years from diagnosisbefore I felt comfortable enough
to tell my story, right?
Jessica Samuels (17:13):
And then you came out with a subsequent
article as well the next year.And so talk about kind of that
follow-up piece.
Corey Hirsch (17:20):
Yeah, was called You're Not Alone because that's
what I learned. You're notalone. It had a million hits in
under an hour, my article,right? It was like it went
viral. It just showed me thatthere are way more people out
there that struggle than don't.
If someone tells you that theydon't struggle at all or they
don't have a story, well, I'msorry, but I don't think they're
telling you the truth. We've allgot struggles. You know, we
(17:42):
don't come here to Earth to justhave an easy we're here to learn
lessons and we're here to gothrough stuff. You know, those
are my beliefs and some harderthan others, but we all got
stuff that we go through. Right?
Nobody Well, unless you're TomBrady, I mean, he's he kind of.
Jessica Samuels (17:59):
You never know.
Corey Hirsch (18:00):
Yeah. But you know, I'm wondering what kind of
deal he made because kidding.But yeah, I mean, you know, a
dog, even a man like Tom Bradydivorced. Right? Mean, we all go
through struggles.
Right? Yeah. Yeah, that's whathappened. Yeah.
Jessica Samuels (18:14):
In your position, you went on, of
course, to retire and you werein a position of being a coach.
I don't know if you were talkingabout what you were growing
through, but how did that changeyou in the way that you related
to players or your colleagues?Were you reaching out? Did you
have that capacity? Because allthis time, you're still managing
(18:35):
your OCD.
You're still managing and doingthe best you can to be your best
self.
Corey Hirsch (18:40):
Yeah. And I don't want people to think that I'm by
any means cured. Every day Iwork at it, right? Like every
day I'm doing meditations or I'mdoing whatever I need to do,
finding new ways to stay healthyand stay on top of it, right? So
that's just what it is.
It's like having diabetes. Well,guess what? You're going to have
diabetes. It's not curable, butit's treatable. You got to
(19:01):
manage it.
Mental health is very similar tothat, in some cases. It's other
cases, people go through ebbsand flows. But as far as
coaching in that, you know, Idon't think it really affected
how I was as a coach or any ofthat stuff. What I will say is
that I loved coaching, I lovedbroadcasting, I loved playing,
(19:22):
but what I do today is whatfulfills me as, you know, I'm a
keynote speaker and I I go out,I speak to corporations, kids,
high schools, whatever. Andthat's what fulfills me.
Right? And when someone comes upto me and tells me that, you
know, I may have helped them oror helped their child, that
that's bigger or better than anywin I ever got at any hockey
game I ever played. Life to meis about service, helping other
(19:45):
people. It took me a long timeto learn that, it really did,
until that article came out,that that's what you find out.
Life is about helping eachother, right?
Jessica Samuels (19:54):
Yeah, it definitely is. And I'm thinking
about you speaking tocommunities and to young people.
And you've talked a lot about itduring this interview of just
have the conversation, just tellsomebody. Like, how can we
really encourage them to dothat? Because it feels like it's
easier said than done.
I mean, and again, nocomparisons, but you were an
(20:17):
NHLer, top of your game. Andcertainly the pressures of who
you were supposed to be weresignificant. But people feel
degrees of pressure in every dayof their life. And so we have
some people listening right now,whether it's OCD or something
else, or they don't know. Theydon't know what's going on with
(20:38):
them.
How do you take that first step?How do you overcome the anxiety
of revealing and beingvulnerable and saying I need
help?
Corey Hirsch (20:50):
Yeah, that's a great question. What I've
learned on my travels andspeaking circuit and all that is
that it's just as important, ifnot more important, to be that
person that says, Hey, you cantalk to me. So it's one thing
for the person to reach out, butif they don't feel there's
someone that they can talk to,it's difficult to come forward.
(21:11):
See, and that was me. I didn'tfeel like there was anybody I
could talk to.
I wanted to, but I was like,okay, if I talk to the coach,
okay, well, that's gonna get mefired. If I talk to a teammate,
well, then my teammates aregoing to wonder if I do it.
That's where I get the messageout there that it's more
important even then for theperson to reach out to be that
(21:32):
person that says, hey, you cantell me anything. I'm not going
to judge you. Look, I'm gonnalisten and I'm gonna refer you
to somebody I know that can helpyou.
That to me is even moreimportant. And then if you don't
have that, well, first step isusually your family a doctor or
somebody along those lines, evena nurse friend. If you have a
(21:53):
friend that's a nurse, I thinkwe all have a friend that's a
nurse or somebody in the medicalfield, right? They've seen it
all. You can't even imagine whatthese people have seen, right?
That they've heard it all. Sothose are the people that are
good to open up to becausethey're also trained in that and
they're trained in where to go.So how do you get someone to
open up? Basically to let themknow that no thought or nothing
(22:18):
you're going through has notbeen seen before. Know, like
this is something that we alldeal with.
You know, there's strength innumbers. That's why me telling
my story and being able to usemy platform, people like, woah,
that's the same as me. Right?There's a common ground. There's
a familiarity.
You don't feel alone. When I wasgoing through, I remember
(22:40):
sitting there, laying theregoing, I'm the only one in the
world that's going through this.Like, I'm the only one, right?
And it's so isolating and alone.What I found out was there's
millions of people out therelike me.
So to let people know thatwhether you're thinking of
suicide, whether you're thinkingof self harm or harming others
or anything like that orwhatever, or whatever it may be,
(23:02):
please step forward, tellsomebody, because that's how
we're going to get you the help.If you don't tell anybody, we
don't know. It's not written onyour face, right? We need people
to talk. We need people to tosay something.
And that's probably the biggestthing we can tell. And then
being somebody that somebody cantalk to, man, that's a gift.
Jessica Samuels (23:24):
Oh, I wanted to ask you that if you're a coach
or a fellow player or a lovedone, whomever, how do you show
that support? Like what wasreally supportive to you as you
went along in this journey thatyou're on in managing your OCD?
Corey Hirsch (23:38):
Yeah, what's been supportive to me is just, you
know, I've learned how tocommunicate when I'm not doing
well. So if I'm having a badweek or a bad couple days, I'll
be like, hey. I'm I'm not I'mstruggling here. I I need to
just check out for a couple daysor a couple hours. Right?
And then if my buddies haven'theard from me in twenty four
hours, I have a group of peoplethat they'll be like, Hey,
(24:00):
what's going on? What are youdoing? Haven't heard from you in
a few days. You doing okay?They'll check-in.
Like, we check-in on each other,right? Buddy check. We do all
sorts of things like that,right? So I've also learned that
me communicating my strugglesreally helps a lot too, because
then people are understanding.I've had times where I've, you
know, fallen, you know, orwhatever, started to struggle a
(24:23):
little bit, didn't make an eventor a meeting and I call and I
just say, you know what, I'mstruggling a little bit with my
mental today.
I'm gonna be there. People areunderstanding when you don't
just show up, people are like,okay, what's going on? Right?
Like communication from bothsides is imperative. And one
thing too is that when I'mstruggling and I'm around my
(24:45):
friends to let them know I'm notdoing well is important because
if I don't, they'll think thatmaybe it's them.
They might've done somethingwrong or whatever. It has
nothing to do with them, right?We don't want people to feel
uncomfortable around us when ithas nothing to do with them. So
I've learned to communicate ondays that I'm not doing great.
And that's a gift too.
What you'll find is that there'smore people out there that are
(25:08):
understanding than not. Right?And it's all communication and
letting people know.
Jessica Samuels (25:15):
How does managing OCD look for you today?
You mentioned earlier, it's nota cure. It's something you
manage. You face it and dothings every day to support it.
Again, maybe with folksunderstanding exactly what it
is.
Talk a bit more about that.Yeah. About how you go through
your your days.
Corey Hirsch (25:36):
I have a therapist that when I start to struggle, I
might not have seen her in ayear, year and a half, but I'll
give her a call and make anappointment right when I need
it. I have a therapist like adoctor, you know, somebody that
when I do start to struggle.Right now I'm medication free,
but I'll get back on my meds ifI need to. I have no issues with
(25:59):
That that's something that Iknow that that I that I can and
that I need to do if I need todo if things don't well.
Exercise, you know, meditation,all those healthy things that we
talk about.
And I I know when I'm sliding isusually when I'm letting my
physical health slide too,right? They go hand in hand. The
other route, gone down thepsychedelics route a little bit,
(26:22):
and that's something still thatremains to be seen for a lot of
people. For me, it's helped me,but I'm recommending it for
anybody or I know that it'shelped me. I think it's a tool
that in the future is going tobe an outstanding tool for
mental health.
But, you know
Jessica Samuels (26:41):
Well, it's interesting that you mentioned
psychedelics because it issomething that I hope to talk
about on the podcast in thefuture. So I'd love to have you
back to talk about that assomeone who's experienced it.
And of course, obviously, sidesof it. But so that's that's you
have a myriad of things that youdo.
Corey Hirsch (26:57):
Yeah, so many.
Jessica Samuels (26:58):
And utilize all the tools in the toolkit.
Corey Hirsch (27:01):
That's and that's exactly it, right? Like with
mental health, it's not one sizefits all. There's a lot of
different things for everybody,you know? And I believe there's
a place for everything. Ibelieve there's a place for
psychedelics.
I believe there's a place fortherapy. I believe there's a
place for medications. Right? Weshouldn't pit one against the
other. Medication saved my lifeat one point, right?
(27:23):
So there is a use for it. NowI've gone and tried to go a
little bit more of a naturalroute. So it's whatever works
for you. You fight with mentalhealth with every tool you have
and the bottom line is is thatwe need people to stay here.
Right?
We need people to stay here. Weneed them to be here, not to do
things to themselves that thattake them out of the game. And
(27:46):
whatever that takes for you todo, I am all for it. And I'll
stand behind anybody that thatthat looks to get healthy and
looks to get better. And everyday, every day, I I look for a
new way or something that'sgonna help me.
Jessica Samuels (28:00):
Corey, thank you so much for your time. As we
wrap up, final thoughts, lastthings you want folks listening
to know, listening and watchingto know about you or OCD or just
mental health in general.
Corey Hirsch (28:11):
Yeah, no, just I appreciate what you guys are
doing here because that's whatit's all about is, you know,
mental health is the same asphysical health. There's no
different. I don't know why weseparate the mind and the body
or they're they're, you know, mymy brain is attached to my body
last time I checked. So it'sjust a matter of encouraging
people to get help and be thatsomebody somebody can talk to,
(28:32):
right? I mean, that's a gift.
That that's be nonjudgmental,and sometimes all you need to do
is listen and say, hey. You cantalk to me. And it's a a a
beautiful thing. But thank youfor having me. It's it's
wonderful what you're doing.
I always appreciate what youguys are doing, and, you know,
it's a beautiful thing. And howmany people you help is amazing.
Jessica Samuels (28:53):
Well, many people you're helping is thank
you for what you're doing. And Ilove that be that someone that
someone can talk to. Thank youso much for your time.
Corey Hirsch (29:01):
Thank you so much. Appreciate it.
Jessica Samuels (29:02):
If you'd like to have a look at the articles
that Corey and I were talkingabout, you can do so at the A
Way Forward podcast page atcmhaclona.org. And if you have
any questions about thisinterview or other topics we may
be covering, you can alwaysemail me at
awayforwardcmhacolona dot org.Until that time, please do take
(29:23):
good care. This episode issupported by Beam Credit Union.
With deep roots in BC and acommitment to your financial
journey, Bean proudly backsmental health conversations that
help build stronger, healthiercommunities.
Hello, I'm Jessica Samuels. Welcome to A
(00:02):
Way Forward presented by BeamCredit Union. This podcast is
produced on the ancestral,traditional and unceded
territories of the OkanaganZilliqa people. My guest today
is Corey Hirsch. He's a formerNHL goaltender, a Stanley Cup
winner, an Olympic silvermedalist, and a mental health
ambassador and advocate.
(00:24):
His story is of someone who fromall outward appearances was at
the top of his game, but he wasnot. And in fact, he was
struggling so significantly withhis mental illness, he almost
didn't make it. But he did. Heasked for help. And he's here to
let anyone who's struggling knowthat it does get better.
(00:45):
Beam Credit Union is proud tosponsor today's episode. With
deep roots in BC and acommitment to your financial
journey, Beam believes wellness,mental and financial starts with
support you can count on. Cory,thank you for being here. And I
say that on two levels. Thankyou for being here on the
podcast.
And thank you for being herewith this message. It's an
(01:08):
incredible story, an importantstory to tell. And I really
appreciate you being here totell it.
Corey Hirsch (01:14):
Well, and I appreciate you being able to
allow me to tell it because ifthere's nobody to hear it, then
we have nothing. Right? So it'sa mutual respect. I appreciate
it. Thank you.
Jessica Samuels (01:25):
Very true. Thank you so much. So let's go
back to I read an article thatyou wrote in 2017 in the Players
Tribune. It's called Dark, Dark,Dark. There's actually eight
darks.
But we'll talk a little bitabout that. It was such an
(01:46):
emotional read. It took me alittle bit to get through it. I
don't mind telling people that.I can't imagine what it was like
for you to write it.
Can you tell me what brought youto the point to write that
article at that time?
Corey Hirsch (02:06):
Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of factors that I
always considered telling,obviously my story. All have a
story to tell, but with mine, Iwas going to initially write a
book is what I was thinking ofdoing and going out that route.
And it was taking a bit of timeand I hummed and hawed on it
when I met another player,another player in the National
(02:29):
Hockey League who was in arehabilitation center in Arizona
at the time where where I wasliving. And this player was an
active player at the time. I'dbeen retired for fifteen years
at this point.
I'd met him and I was through amutual friend and just thought,
I'll take him for coffee. He'sin a rehabilitation center. You
(02:49):
know, he must must need a friendor somebody just to talk to. And
so I took him to Starbucks andwe went and we sat there and I
just had never really toldanybody but close friends and
family my story. Nobody reallyknew.
And then with him, I justfigured him being in in a
treatment center, you know, foraddiction, I I figured I'll just
(03:12):
tell him because usuallyaddiction and mental health go
hand in hand. So I figured outjust maybe maybe he could find
something, some common ground init. And so I I started telling
him my story and I told him allabout it and he looked at me,
you know, dead straight in theeyes. He says, oh my god, that's
exactly what I've gone through.And his mom had to resuscitate
(03:33):
him twice from fentanyloverdoses.
So it was at that point I went,okay, you know, here's a person
that's almost died twice fromaddiction with fentanyl
overdoses, whom and who knowshow many other times. I didn't
realize that there was otherpeople out there like me at the
time. And it was that moment thelight bulb went off and it was
like, oh my God, there arethousands of more people out
(03:55):
there like me that need to hearthe story we're hiding our
mental health issues, who knowshow many were successful at
overdoses or suicides, right? Soit was at that point I just
went, okay, I gotta get my storyout there. And the wheels just
kind of got in motion.
The universe just kept puttingpeople in front of me, put a
lady named, you know, CatherineMcAuley and Lana Quinn in front
(04:18):
of me randomly. I met Lana at afuneral actually of an old coach
of mine. And it was just, it waslike a month after I had met
this player, who I won't say thename, but due to privacy, but it
was almost as if, and then theyput me in touch with the NHL,
who put me in touch with thePlayers Tribune, and the story
(04:39):
just got rolling. Lana wasalmost the same story. I was
just sitting there beside herand we were talking and I just
spewed my story to her.
I don't even know why, I justdid. And she put the wheels in
motion and the Will A PlayersTribune article came out, and
that article is still probablyis one of the most clicked on
articles in Players Tribunehistory in sports publishing.
(05:00):
That that includes Tiger Woods,Michael Jordan, you know, all
these great athletes. And here'smine, Corey Hirsch, you know,
kid from Calgary. And my articlehit just as hard.
So that's kind of the longwinded answer, but that's how it
all happened. Yeah.
Jessica Samuels (05:14):
Well, and it is a long answer, but I appreciate
it because what I notice is mostsignificant in that response and
also as part of the story isthat you talked about it. So you
told in this instance where youmet this player for coffee and
you told your story, and thenyou realized you weren't alone
and he realized he wasn't alone.And then, you know, you tell it
(05:35):
again. And I really feel likethat's at the heart of the crux
of you of you speaking andtelling your story. So now let's
go back to 1994 for people whowho don't know your story, or
maybe don't know the details ofyour story.
What was happening for you?
Corey Hirsch (05:52):
Yeah, so I have obsessive compulsive disorder.
It manifests in a lot ofdifferent ways. In 1994, was
rolling right along in life andOCD is a little bit different
than something that's traumabased or depression or anxiety.
OCD for me was like something inmy brain just broke, like two
wires disconnected. I startedgetting repetitive thinking,
(06:16):
deep, dark thoughts that weren'ttrue and my rational brain, my
irrational brain were fightingeach other.
And the way OCD manifests, mostpeople think it's hand washing
and cleanliness and organizationand all that. I did everything
in my head. Everything wasmental compulsions for me, so
you couldn't see it, right? So Iwas able to hide it very easily
(06:39):
because you couldn't I didn'thave any outward outward things
where people would notice, oh,there's places or whatever,
organize or anything, any one ofthose. I did everything in my
head.
So I had a, you know, and I'mnot afraid to say this, it's so
manifest in a lot of men and alot of people with your sexual
orientation, your sexuality, itcan go after that. And mine was
(07:02):
thinking that I might possiblybe gay, which today, you know,
it's not a big deal. I don'tcare anymore. Back in 1994, that
would have, you know, thrown outmy NHL career, would have been a
big news thing, big thing. Sokind of attacked it that way.
Now the content of it istypically, it doesn't matter,
right? It's OCD attacks,whatever. But I went on to their
(07:26):
thinking, you know, givingpeople HIV to like all sorts of
different things. That's how itmanifested for me when I was
none of those things, but yourrational and irrational brain.
It's hard to describe.
It's like the best way todescribe OCD is you're driving
down the road, you get athought, two lane traffic, one's
(07:47):
coming this way, one's coming.We all get that thought, well,
what if I accidentally just mywheel into that lane? Well, it'd
be chaos, things would happen.Well, a rational normal brain
would go home and go, that was asilly thought because you would
never do it, but it's just athought. And the OCD brain like
me would go home, I would thinkabout it, I would never want
that to happen ever to the pointwhere I would just stop driving
(08:09):
my car.
Right? Like, it would get tothat point where 20 fourseven,
that's the only thought I'd beable to have. That's OCD, so
mine manifested a little bitdifferently, and there's
thousands of ways that OCD canmanifest. There's harm,
religious, sexuality,cleanliness, but people only
think that it's cleanliness.It's got a wide variety of
(08:31):
things.
The other thing about OCD that Ineed people to understand is
that people are like, Oh, it'scute. You're clean. You're that.
Most of my friends that haveobsessive compulsive disorder
before they were diagnosed havemade a suicide attempt. That's
how debilitating it is.
But the thing about OCD that Iwanna tell people out there is
that no matter what it has, italso has the best gains once you
(08:54):
do get diagnosed. So that's kindof, you know, again, another
long winded answer because therereally is no short winded way to
say any of this, but that's OCD,that's how it manifests. But to
also know that it's one of themost treatable, not curable, but
it's very treatable once you'rediagnosed.
Jessica Samuels (09:15):
Okay. So the diagnosis came later. I mean, in
these moment, in the throes of,we're talking about 1994 and you
were managing these thoughtstrying to and from what I'm
hearing from you, worried thatyou're going to embark on these
actions or have these thingsthat you won't have any control
over. How were you? How were youmanaging?
(09:37):
Mean, on one hand, you'rehoisting up the Stanley Cup. But
it's interesting. Well, andthat's the whole point that you
weren't. So you're hoisting upthe Stanley Cup, and you're
really, really, really troubled.
Corey Hirsch (09:51):
Yeah, well, let's say every time you get, and
again, it's just a thought, wehave millions a day, but when
you get hit with an OCD thought,it's like getting hit with a
taser gun of anxiety. It can becrippling, it can be
debilitating. And then yourbrain is is fighting truth
versus non truth. Right? Youknow, I was I you know, still to
(10:13):
this day, 53 years old, I'm aheterosexual man, but my brain
was trying to tell me somethingelse.
Right? And you just get into,it's called brain lock. It's
almost like you just get into afight where one side is
rational, one is irrational. Andit's, again, it's debilitating.
Anxiety, it's anxiety fueled,it's crushing.
(10:33):
And I wasn't functioning. Offthe ice, I was I was, you know,
stopped hanging out with myfriends, stopped doing, you
know, things around the rink.Really, only sanctuary I had was
on the ice. That was where, youknow, my brain was occupied and
and that's where I felt like Iwas safest. But the minute I
stepped off the ice 24 a day,seven days a week, man, I was I
(10:57):
was in torture.
Like, was that those thoughtswere just never ever leaving.
They were automatic almost.
Jessica Samuels (11:04):
And you talked about you have friends who had
have have thought about oractions, you know, thought about
committing suicide. And you areone of those people as well. In
the midst of that, you had avery significant incident where
you were going to you were goingto do
Corey Hirsch (11:21):
it. Well, yeah, absolutely. And we need to let
people know that people that arethinking suicidal thoughts.
There's nothing wrong with that.Please come forward, let us
know.
We're ashamed to tell peoplethat we're having these thoughts
and that's what we're goingthrough, but that's actually
what keeps us prisoner. What wedo is when we shame people for
(11:42):
having these thoughts, we makethem feel worse. Hey, you know
what? It's okay you're havingthese thoughts, there's a better
solution out there. There's abetter answer.
We can get you some help withthis. And to stop shaming people
for feeling this way andthinking this way. Like I say,
it's not the solution. That'snot what I'm saying here. I'm
saying that we all, from time totime, things happen.
(12:06):
We get a bit sad, but don't beafraid to tell somebody that
you're having suicidal thoughts,please. Don't be afraid to tell
somebody and reach out, look,I'm not thinking properly or
these things are going throughmy mind, and reach out for help.
There is a solution, that thereis hope, that there is help,
that it is available. If we canencourage people to come forward
(12:28):
rather than shame them forthinking these things, no matter
how, whatever it is, we can helpyou. And that's, yeah, we keep
ourselves prisoners because ofour own thoughts.
There's a
Jessica Samuels (12:41):
better way it goes back to what we were
talking about before of nottalking, right? And it's that
layered stigma. I mean, a mentalhealth issue, having a mental
illness, whatever it is, there'sstigma associated with that. And
then associated with, you know,thoughts of suicide or, or, or
having a plan. What I reallyhear from you and all the things
that you're saying is, istalking to somebody.
(13:05):
Turning to somebody and saying,Hey, this is what I'm doing. And
this is what you did.
Corey Hirsch (13:09):
Yeah, well, it's it's because we think our
thoughts someone else is goingto judge us for them or someone
else is going to but, but youknow, they are what they are,
but they also keep us trapped asa prisoner in our own brain
because we think that we can'ttalk to anybody about this.
Who's going to listen to us?Especially with OCD because some
of your thoughts out there cango right off the deep end, but
(13:33):
that's what it does. What weneed to do is encourage people
to go see their doctor, to gotalk to people because they've
seen it all, they've heard itall. Please open up to a doctor,
open up to somebody.
If somebody comes and opens upto you, the best thing you can
do is listen and not judge andlead them to a professional. You
(13:54):
might not understand as thatperson that they've opened up
to, but the greatest gift youcan give is to lead them to a
professional, right? And there'snothing to be embarrassed about.
Mental health is something thataffects us all. We all get sad
from time to time.
We all get anxious from time totime. We go through struggles at
time to time. But man, when youopen up and finally let it off
(14:18):
your chest, it's like anelephant falls off your back.
Jessica Samuels (14:21):
And is that what it was like for you when
you finally opened up to theteam trainer?
Corey Hirsch (14:26):
Well, yeah. Well, what it was was I was But I got
to the point where it wassuicidal again, where, you know,
the option was I didn't reallyhave a choice, you know, but my
OCD made me, I had two choices.Well, I could either end it or I
could open up to somebody. SoOCD didn't really give me a
choice, right? And I chose toopen up to somebody because I
(14:48):
didn't wanna go the other route.
But we don't want people to getto that point, right? Early
diagnosis is the key. It's likecancer. You wanna get diagnosed
early. It's easier to treat.
It's easier to fix. Same withmental health. So don't wait,
you know, go get the help. Sothat's what I did. I ended up,
you know, opening up to atrainer and, you know, there's
(15:09):
three years of my life gonebecause I tried to hide it and I
tried to, and I stayed sick,right?
But the time that when I openedup to a trainer and got a
psychologist got diagnosed, justit meant the world. It meant to
change my life. Right.
Jessica Samuels (15:26):
And you mentioned something earlier
about how your particularthoughts manifested. And it's a
different world today. I'mwondering, the topic of mental
health and struggling and notdoing well from an NHL
perspective, or even a highperformance athlete, or even as
a male in the community where Imean, we're thinking about how
stigmas manifest around thesethings. At that time, you know,
(15:49):
we're talking 9495 here, thingswere not as far along as they
are now. You told someone yougot a diagnosis, you were still
living with this though.
How was that environment foryou? Did other people on the
team begin to know? Did youcontinue to open up?
Corey Hirsch (16:09):
No, no, I went I went to see a psychologist, got
diagnosed and I knew, but Istill didn't want anybody else
to know that I had a diagnosablemental health issue. There was
another twenty years. So I wasdiagnosed in like 'ninety seven.
2017, the article came out. Sotwenty years, I didn't tell
anybody, close family andfriends, right?
(16:31):
Why? Stigma, same thing. Yeah.Same reason, stigma. And then I
got to a point where as I gotolder, it didn't really matter
anymore, right?
So I just didn't It was nobody'sbusiness but mine until I wanted
to start really trying to helppeople and make a difference.
But yeah, twenty years from fromdiagnosis, I mean, we're just
now in the last probably tenyears where people are starting
(16:55):
to feel comfortable comingforward. If everybody felt
comfortable coming forward andit was a non issue, you and I
wouldn't be having thisconversation right now.
Jessica Samuels (17:03):
100%.
Corey Hirsch (17:04):
There's still a stigma attached to it. It's
twenty years from diagnosisbefore I felt comfortable enough
to tell my story, right?
Jessica Samuels (17:13):
And then you came out with a subsequent
article as well the next year.And so talk about kind of that
follow-up piece.
Corey Hirsch (17:20):
Yeah, was called You're Not Alone because that's
what I learned. You're notalone. It had a million hits in
under an hour, my article,right? It was like it went
viral. It just showed me thatthere are way more people out
there that struggle than don't.
If someone tells you that theydon't struggle at all or they
don't have a story, well, I'msorry, but I don't think they're
telling you the truth. We've allgot struggles. You know, we
(17:42):
don't come here to Earth to justhave an easy we're here to learn
lessons and we're here to gothrough stuff. You know, those
are my beliefs and some harderthan others, but we all got
stuff that we go through. Right?
Nobody Well, unless you're TomBrady, I mean, he's he kind of.
Jessica Samuels (17:59):
You never know.
Corey Hirsch (18:00):
Yeah. But you know, I'm wondering what kind of
deal he made because kidding.But yeah, I mean, you know, a
dog, even a man like Tom Bradydivorced. Right? Mean, we all go
through struggles.
Right? Yeah. Yeah, that's whathappened. Yeah.
Jessica Samuels (18:14):
In your position, you went on, of
course, to retire and you werein a position of being a coach.
I don't know if you were talkingabout what you were growing
through, but how did that changeyou in the way that you related
to players or your colleagues?Were you reaching out? Did you
have that capacity? Because allthis time, you're still managing
(18:35):
your OCD.
You're still managing and doingthe best you can to be your best
self.
Corey Hirsch (18:40):
Yeah. And I don't want people to think that I'm by
any means cured. Every day Iwork at it, right? Like every
day I'm doing meditations or I'mdoing whatever I need to do,
finding new ways to stay healthyand stay on top of it, right? So
that's just what it is.
It's like having diabetes. Well,guess what? You're going to have
diabetes. It's not curable, butit's treatable. You got to
(19:01):
manage it.
Mental health is very similar tothat, in some cases. It's other
cases, people go through ebbsand flows. But as far as
coaching in that, you know, Idon't think it really affected
how I was as a coach or any ofthat stuff. What I will say is
that I loved coaching, I lovedbroadcasting, I loved playing,
(19:22):
but what I do today is whatfulfills me as, you know, I'm a
keynote speaker and I I go out,I speak to corporations, kids,
high schools, whatever. Andthat's what fulfills me.
Right? And when someone comes upto me and tells me that, you
know, I may have helped them oror helped their child, that
that's bigger or better than anywin I ever got at any hockey
game I ever played. Life to meis about service, helping other
(19:45):
people. It took me a long timeto learn that, it really did,
until that article came out,that that's what you find out.
Life is about helping eachother, right?
Jessica Samuels (19:54):
Yeah, it definitely is. And I'm thinking
about you speaking tocommunities and to young people.
And you've talked a lot about itduring this interview of just
have the conversation, just tellsomebody. Like, how can we
really encourage them to dothat? Because it feels like it's
easier said than done.
I mean, and again, nocomparisons, but you were an
(20:17):
NHLer, top of your game. Andcertainly the pressures of who
you were supposed to be weresignificant. But people feel
degrees of pressure in every dayof their life. And so we have
some people listening right now,whether it's OCD or something
else, or they don't know. Theydon't know what's going on with
(20:38):
them.
How do you take that first step?How do you overcome the anxiety
of revealing and beingvulnerable and saying I need
help?
Corey Hirsch (20:50):
Yeah, that's a great question. What I've
learned on my travels andspeaking circuit and all that is
that it's just as important, ifnot more important, to be that
person that says, Hey, you cantalk to me. So it's one thing
for the person to reach out, butif they don't feel there's
someone that they can talk to,it's difficult to come forward.
(21:11):
See, and that was me. I didn'tfeel like there was anybody I
could talk to.
I wanted to, but I was like,okay, if I talk to the coach,
okay, well, that's gonna get mefired. If I talk to a teammate,
well, then my teammates aregoing to wonder if I do it.
That's where I get the messageout there that it's more
important even then for theperson to reach out to be that
(21:32):
person that says, hey, you cantell me anything. I'm not going
to judge you. Look, I'm gonnalisten and I'm gonna refer you
to somebody I know that can helpyou.
That to me is even moreimportant. And then if you don't
have that, well, first step isusually your family a doctor or
somebody along those lines, evena nurse friend. If you have a
(21:53):
friend that's a nurse, I thinkwe all have a friend that's a
nurse or somebody in the medicalfield, right? They've seen it
all. You can't even imagine whatthese people have seen, right?
That they've heard it all. Sothose are the people that are
good to open up to becausethey're also trained in that and
they're trained in where to go.So how do you get someone to
open up? Basically to let themknow that no thought or nothing
(22:18):
you're going through has notbeen seen before. Know, like
this is something that we alldeal with.
You know, there's strength innumbers. That's why me telling
my story and being able to usemy platform, people like, woah,
that's the same as me. Right?There's a common ground. There's
a familiarity.
You don't feel alone. When I wasgoing through, I remember
(22:40):
sitting there, laying theregoing, I'm the only one in the
world that's going through this.Like, I'm the only one, right?
And it's so isolating and alone.What I found out was there's
millions of people out therelike me.
So to let people know thatwhether you're thinking of
suicide, whether you're thinkingof self harm or harming others
or anything like that orwhatever, or whatever it may be,
(23:02):
please step forward, tellsomebody, because that's how
we're going to get you the help.If you don't tell anybody, we
don't know. It's not written onyour face, right? We need people
to talk. We need people to tosay something.
And that's probably the biggestthing we can tell. And then
being somebody that somebody cantalk to, man, that's a gift.
Jessica Samuels (23:24):
Oh, I wanted to ask you that if you're a coach
or a fellow player or a lovedone, whomever, how do you show
that support? Like what wasreally supportive to you as you
went along in this journey thatyou're on in managing your OCD?
Corey Hirsch (23:38):
Yeah, what's been supportive to me is just, you
know, I've learned how tocommunicate when I'm not doing
well. So if I'm having a badweek or a bad couple days, I'll
be like, hey. I'm I'm not I'mstruggling here. I I need to
just check out for a couple daysor a couple hours. Right?
And then if my buddies haven'theard from me in twenty four
hours, I have a group of peoplethat they'll be like, Hey,
(24:00):
what's going on? What are youdoing? Haven't heard from you in
a few days. You doing okay?They'll check-in.
Like, we check-in on each other,right? Buddy check. We do all
sorts of things like that,right? So I've also learned that
me communicating my strugglesreally helps a lot too, because
then people are understanding.I've had times where I've, you
know, fallen, you know, orwhatever, started to struggle a
(24:23):
little bit, didn't make an eventor a meeting and I call and I
just say, you know what, I'mstruggling a little bit with my
mental today.
I'm gonna be there. People areunderstanding when you don't
just show up, people are like,okay, what's going on? Right?
Like communication from bothsides is imperative. And one
thing too is that when I'mstruggling and I'm around my
(24:45):
friends to let them know I'm notdoing well is important because
if I don't, they'll think thatmaybe it's them.
They might've done somethingwrong or whatever. It has
nothing to do with them, right?We don't want people to feel
uncomfortable around us when ithas nothing to do with them. So
I've learned to communicate ondays that I'm not doing great.
And that's a gift too.
What you'll find is that there'smore people out there that are
(25:08):
understanding than not. Right?And it's all communication and
letting people know.
Jessica Samuels (25:15):
How does managing OCD look for you today?
You mentioned earlier, it's nota cure. It's something you
manage. You face it and dothings every day to support it.
Again, maybe with folksunderstanding exactly what it
is.
Talk a bit more about that.Yeah. About how you go through
your your days.
Corey Hirsch (25:36):
I have a therapist that when I start to struggle, I
might not have seen her in ayear, year and a half, but I'll
give her a call and make anappointment right when I need
it. I have a therapist like adoctor, you know, somebody that
when I do start to struggle.Right now I'm medication free,
but I'll get back on my meds ifI need to. I have no issues with
(25:59):
That that's something that Iknow that that I that I can and
that I need to do if I need todo if things don't well.
Exercise, you know, meditation,all those healthy things that we
talk about.
And I I know when I'm sliding isusually when I'm letting my
physical health slide too,right? They go hand in hand. The
other route, gone down thepsychedelics route a little bit,
(26:22):
and that's something still thatremains to be seen for a lot of
people. For me, it's helped me,but I'm recommending it for
anybody or I know that it'shelped me. I think it's a tool
that in the future is going tobe an outstanding tool for
mental health.
But, you know
Jessica Samuels (26:41):
Well, it's interesting that you mentioned
psychedelics because it issomething that I hope to talk
about on the podcast in thefuture. So I'd love to have you
back to talk about that assomeone who's experienced it.
And of course, obviously, sidesof it. But so that's that's you
have a myriad of things that youdo.
Corey Hirsch (26:57):
Yeah, so many.
Jessica Samuels (26:58):
And utilize all the tools in the toolkit.
Corey Hirsch (27:01):
That's and that's exactly it, right? Like with
mental health, it's not one sizefits all. There's a lot of
different things for everybody,you know? And I believe there's
a place for everything. Ibelieve there's a place for
psychedelics.
I believe there's a place fortherapy. I believe there's a
place for medications. Right? Weshouldn't pit one against the
other. Medication saved my lifeat one point, right?
(27:23):
So there is a use for it. NowI've gone and tried to go a
little bit more of a naturalroute. So it's whatever works
for you. You fight with mentalhealth with every tool you have
and the bottom line is is thatwe need people to stay here.
Right?
We need people to stay here. Weneed them to be here, not to do
things to themselves that thattake them out of the game. And
(27:46):
whatever that takes for you todo, I am all for it. And I'll
stand behind anybody that thatthat looks to get healthy and
looks to get better. And everyday, every day, I I look for a
new way or something that'sgonna help me.
Jessica Samuels (28:00):
Corey, thank you so much for your time. As we
wrap up, final thoughts, lastthings you want folks listening
to know, listening and watchingto know about you or OCD or just
mental health in general.
Corey Hirsch (28:11):
Yeah, no, just I appreciate what you guys are
doing here because that's whatit's all about is, you know,
mental health is the same asphysical health. There's no
different. I don't know why weseparate the mind and the body
or they're they're, you know, mymy brain is attached to my body
last time I checked. So it'sjust a matter of encouraging
people to get help and be thatsomebody somebody can talk to,
(28:32):
right? I mean, that's a gift.
That that's be nonjudgmental,and sometimes all you need to do
is listen and say, hey. You cantalk to me. And it's a a a
beautiful thing. But thank youfor having me. It's it's
wonderful what you're doing.
I always appreciate what youguys are doing, and, you know,
it's a beautiful thing. And howmany people you help is amazing.
Jessica Samuels (28:53):
Well, many people you're helping is thank
you for what you're doing. And Ilove that be that someone that
someone can talk to. Thank youso much for your time.
Corey Hirsch (29:01):
Thank you so much. Appreciate it.
Jessica Samuels (29:02):
If you'd like to have a look at the articles
that Corey and I were talkingabout, you can do so at the A
Way Forward podcast page atcmhaclona.org. And if you have
any questions about thisinterview or other topics we may
be covering, you can alwaysemail me at
awayforwardcmhacolona dot org.Until that time, please do take
(29:23):
good care. This episode issupported by Beam Credit Union.
With deep roots in BC and acommitment to your financial
journey, Bean proudly backsmental health conversations that
help build stronger, healthiercommunities.
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