God's Perfect Plan: The Redemption of a Former Criminal

In a deeply compelling episode, we witness the intersection of two lives once divided by the law, now united by faith and a shared purpose. The discussion centers around the transformative journey of Jay Jay, an ex-convict who found solace and redemption through Jesus Christ, and his reconnection with a former detective, who now plays a pivotal role in joining him with a new purpose. Their candid conversation highlights the stark realities of Jay Jay's past, but by God's powerful transformation has set him on a new trajectory. The detective’s perspective adds depth to the narrative, as he recounts his initial encounters with Jay Jay and the surprising twist of fate that brought them together again. This episode serves as a powerful reminder that no one is beyond redemption and that God’s grace can reach into the darkest corners of life, transforming hearts and lives in miraculous ways. It encourages listeners to reflect on their own journeys and consider how they, too, can be instruments of change in their communities, fostering understanding and compassion for those seeking a new path in life.

Takeaways:

• This episode illustrates the profound transformation one can undergo through faith, showcasing the power of God's grace in the life of an ex-convict.
• The reunion between the detective and the ex-convict serves as a testament to the belief that individuals can change when they accept Christ into their lives.
• Listeners are encouraged to recognize the potential for redemption in everyone, regardless of their past, as God’s love can lead to significant life changes.
• The discussion emphasizes the importance of community support in helping individuals reintegrate into society after incarceration, highlighting the role of faith-based initiatives.
• This episode reminds us that genuine connection and understanding can bridge the gaps between different walks of life, fostering healing and reconciliation.
• It illustrates the notion that God’s perfect plan involves using our past experiences, no matter how difficult, to impact others positively in their journeys of faith.

Episode Transcript

(00:03):
Welcome to the Abundant LifePodcast, bringing.
You encouragement andchallenging believers to spiritual
change and growth by applyingbiblical principles to everyday life.
And now your hosts, SassoMendez and Ben Arellano.
Welcome, everybody, to theAbundant Live Podcast.
This is episode number 69 herewith my good friend of faithful servant

(00:26):
of faith, so Mendez.
Hello.
Hello.
We got some special guestshere in the house of man with two
first name names.
He's making his second appearance.
Yeah.
Back by popular demand, wehave jj.
How you doing?
Good, good.
How you doing?
JJ brought a guest.
Did you?
My.
My good friend Scott Crossletalked about him last time on the

(00:48):
last podcast.
You did?
Yeah.
It's probably the last timeyou'll hear my first name.
Oh, from jj.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I always just refer to him as Crossle.
You know, Alex always saystoo, like, no, like, it doesn't even
feel right.
Call him Scott.
That good or bad?

(01:08):
I mean, you know, I met him asan officer.
You know, I met him as a cop.
They go by their last names.
And he wasn't my friend atthat time.
You know, like, we.
We built.
We built our relationshipafter that.
And I've always called him Crosso.

(01:28):
And then I think when he gaveme his personal number, it's when
he said, dude, you can startcalling me Scott now.
You got to next level.
Yeah.
And I was just excited to havethe number.
I was like, oh, he gave us the number.
You know, he wants us to callhim Scott Alex.

(01:48):
Like, no.
Well, it's like an adult, right?
When you're a kid and you callthem, you know, I don't think they
do that anymore because kidsdon't have that same respect.
But you would say, you know,Mr. Mendez or something, and then
you get old enough and they'relike, yeah, just.
Just call me Jim.
And you're like, I can't do it.
Yeah, I still say Mr. Man.
Yeah.
I think it's just respect, right?
Yeah, it's just that maybe thesame thing.

(02:09):
Yeah.
I don't know if it's respect.
I don't want to put words in.
Your mouth, but yeah, I mean,I definitely have a respect for him,
but it's just Crosso.
I just.
To me, that is his first name.
You know, I'll take it.
All right, well, so, so, sofor taco talk, bro, tell us about
this ramen I hear that you made.
Oh, Alex made some beia forsome friends the other day.

(02:34):
And yeah, so last night we hadleftover beia.
I hooked up a ramen noodle andthrew some beauty on there.
Made some video ramen and Iwas like, I gotta send a picture
of this to Sasso.
That sounds pretty good actually.
It looked really good too.
It was so good.
I had another bowl before Icame over here.

(02:57):
Oh, Tony would add five.
Wow.
Tony would ate the whole.
And then he still would havesmashed the whole pizza.
Yeah, that's true.
That's a big boy.
Does he have to eat more thanlike a normal person?
Yeah.
There's a note that he comeswith says feed every three to four
hours.
You know what I mean?
He's like Jurassic Park.
He's eats with a shovel.
Man, that must be expansive.

(03:18):
Yeah, I mean they bring donutsto FTL and he's like, I'll have one
box.
One box, one crate.
That's why I was so excitedwhen he got a job because I no longer
had to buy his meals.
Yeah, that was encouraging to me.
Well, what do you think would do?
He would do if you give himlike a happy meal or something.
Think he'd cry?
Probably beat me up becausethere's like four nuggets.

(03:42):
Yeah, it's pretty sad, you know.
Yeah, he'd eat the prize too.
Yeah, he wouldn't even know.
Yeah, he's big.
So Scott, what do you.
What are you into?
What type of food do you like?
Well, I'm from the Midwest, soyou could probably guess.
Where is it?
Where are we gonna go withthis steak?
Yeah, definitely potatoes,meat and potatoes, roast grass fed
beef.

(04:02):
Nothing crazy.
Right.
But I've been in Arizona forover 20 years now, so.
But I'm still kind of stuck in that.
Were you in law enforcementthere as well and.
No, I actually graduated fromhigh school, went to college for
a couple years, but joined thearmy reserves straight out of high

(04:22):
school.
Then I went to active duty inthe Army.
Spent 10 years in the Army.
When I got out in 2003, moveddown here to Arizona.
That's when I first enteredinto law enforcement.
I actually started at Maricopacounty working in the jails.

(04:44):
So I'm very familiar with theramen recipes from walking around
in there.
Did that for a year and thengot hired on by Salt River.
Worked out there for aboutfour years and then went to the agency
that I'm with now.
Okay.
So.
So question of the night.
Where, where's.
Where do you go for state herein Arizona in Phoenix?

(05:05):
You know, I. I like Firebirdsis one of my go to.
I really like Firebirds.
JJ's house over there.
Oh, you got a Firebirds P3.
We do.
And Alex's parents took usthere the day we got married.
Oh, nice.
That's the only way I know about.
It, but I actually go toFirebirds more for the deviled eggs

(05:28):
with the bacon and jalapeno in them.
Is that an appetizer?
Yeah, yeah, it's.
Well, it could be a full meal.
It's.
Yeah, it's a lot.
Alex makes some good deviled eggs.
I hear about all the goodthings she's making, but I don't
taste any of the good thingsshe's making.
We'll have to have you guys.
We got a potluck at ftl.

(05:49):
You got to come through.
Yeah, like the rest of the month.
You know what I mean?
Let us know.
Just don't.
Don't tell Tony about it.
We'll tell him.
It's at 8.
I was listening to Caleb this morning.
They were talking aboutdeviled egg.
They were talking about thedifferent, you know, foods.
They have it like.
State fairs, you know, Caleb.
F. Caleb.

(06:10):
Oh, Caleb.
Yeah, Caleb.
And.
Sorry, bro.
Okay.
And they were talking about,you know, fair food, you know.
Yeah.
And, you know, everything'susually fried, whatever, but this
lady was talking about deviledeggs with cookie dough in them.
And I'm just thinking tomyself, that just doesn't even sound

(06:32):
good.
No, deviled eggs with cookie dough.
Jj, you got.
I mean, you got a mind forsome of this stuff, bro.
What do you think?
I like cookie dough, and Ilike deviled eggs, so.
I mean, together, though, Idon't know.
I wonder.
Maybe it's just, like, thecookie dough inside the egg white.
I'm thinking, because if youput the yolk part that's kind of
good, it's.

(06:52):
Gonna clash with the mustard and.
Yeah.
Yeah, it's gonna.
Yeah, that doesn't sound good.
But they liked it.
I.
Well, no, I don't know.
They were just critiquingdifferent things, but they.
They thought it was kind ofsounded gross.
I don't know.
It does sound great.
That does.
Sounds terrible.
Yeah.
If you're not in jail, it'spretty gross.
Yeah.
Some of the fair food's prettygood, though, you know?

(07:12):
I mean, we've.
I would say most of it'spretty good.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Now they got some pretty good barbecue.
The big turkey legs, the.
What's the one you like?
The haystack fries.
Oh, yeah.
They're delicious.
Have you guys had the haystackfries at the fair?
I've only been in the fair once.
I have not.
I'm heading to the OrangeCounty Fair next month, though.
So see what they got there.
Yeah, okay.

(07:33):
Yeah, I know.
There's a Orange county in NewYork, I think.
Yeah.
No, California.
Some hot dogs at the fair.
Are they good?
Corn dogs?
Corn dogs.
A lot of corn dogs.
They have hot dogs this affair?
They probably do.
I think so.
We went to the Iowa State Fairone time.
It was pretty cool.
But they got a lot of corn,obviously, because everything's roasted
corn and whatever, you know.
But it was pretty good.

(07:54):
It's not elote, it's corn.
No, you know, I think they.
They did have elote.
I think, bro, they had sometaco shops there, bro.
You wouldn't think so, but we got.
Taco shops everywhere, right?
Yeah, every place has tacos.
Mexicans are gremlins.
They just spawn everything.
Got no cable, 10 kids.
It's like in Maine, bro.
Montana.
There's like a taco shop.

(08:14):
There's a taco truck somewhere.
Yeah.
Lobster taco.
When me and Alex got together,she would just give me so many faces.
I throw everything in a tortilla.
She's like, why, what are you doing?
I'm not.
I'm eating.
And, you know, I told her Ithrow everything in a tortilla.
I throw ramen noodles inthere, you know?

(08:36):
Yeah, that's a little hard for me.
That's Mexican though, apparently.
You made a tamale with.
Yeah, yeah.
Ramen noodles, some nachos.
Sauerkraut, right?
I mean, they can't.
Who eats it?
Yeah, like, it's nasty.
I mean, I don't mind.
I don't mind it.
It's different.
It's good for you.
Is it good for your gut?

(08:56):
It's good for your gut.
Yeah.
You get.
So is Robin.
Robin will clear you out.
So this alcohol, that's whatthey use for colonoscopies.
I'll just give you some.
Robin.
Oh, he'll be cleaning out.
He'll be out tomorrow, 24 hours.
He'd be good.
Good to go.
Yeah.
So what else do you likebesides firebirds?
Is there another state house?

(09:17):
No.
Well, our go to lately is justvery simple.
Cold beer and cheeseburgers.
But we go to church onSaturday nights and there's one right
outside our church, like rightdown the road on your way out of
the.
Do you go to ccv?
No, I go to Christchurch inGilbert, so that's kind of.

(09:39):
My wife and I's go to spotafter church, hang out for a little
bit.
Yeah.
Because I know there's one on67th, just north of CCV.
On.
Okay.
With Deer Valley, whichChristchurch do you go to.
It's just Christchurch.
Gilbert.
Oh, Gilbert.
Okay.
Yeah.
Did you come all the way from Gilbert?
Well, yeah.
East Valley.
Wow.

(09:59):
We're gonna have to pitch infor gas money when we're done here.
Company.
Wow.
Okay.
All right.
All right.
We don't want to go too far.
I get what you're saying.
I see what you're laying down there.
Yeah.
Okay.
I mean, somebody.
So I'm taking a couple guysfrom church to the baseball game.
He's like, I'll take youwherever you want to go eat, you

(10:20):
know?
So I try to pick, you know,Ritos, cheap place for happy hour
specials.
And he said, oh, somethinggood like steaks.
I go, let's go to steak 44.
He said, okay, wherever youwant to go.
And I'm like, I'm just kidding.
Because the most expensiverestaurant in Arizona.
Yeah.
He didn't know any better.
Like, we would never.
It's pretty good, though, man.
Yeah.
We would never talk againafter he took me there.

(10:40):
Yeah.
Full grown.
Yeah.
We took my mom to.
What was it?
Mastros.
And that's.
That's up there.
It was funny.
Yeah, it was funny.
She.
She had ordered like, what doyou want, Mom?
Like, whatever, you know, getwhatever you're gonna eat.
And I think she orderedlobster or something.

(11:04):
And they brought her meal, andit was right behind her, and she's
all like, oh, it stinks.
She's all like, smells likefish on.
Your food's here, Mom.
She's like, oh, yum.
It looks so good.
Oh, yeah, right?
Thanks.
That's what we can't have nice things.

(11:25):
I know, right?
But for the money, I thinkTexas Roadhouse, you really can't
beat that steak for the money.
You can't.
I get that military discountthere too.
Oh, nice.
Yeah, yeah.
You get those rolls with thatfake butter.
But that fake butter is prettybomb, dude.
It's still in me because it's plastic.
What do you mean, fake butter?
It's margarine.
You know what I mean?
It's not real butter.
It's not that Midwest butter.

(11:46):
It's not country Croc.
Didn't come from the croc.
It didn't come from the croc,but it didn't come from the country.
Come from the cow, bro.
You know what I mean?
But yeah, okay, so, like, steak.
I like steak, too.
And cheddar has a pretty goodsteak, man.
Is pretty good.
Have you been to cheddar before?
I have.
I don't think I've had the steak.
Is pretty good there.
I know somebody that likes therolls better at Texas Roadhouse,

(12:08):
but we're not going to saynames in this podcast, but.
Yeah, I think Cheddar's.
Is those croissants?
Yeah, those are pretty good.
That honey butter.
Is that real butter?
That's real butter.
I don't ask, bro.
I just eat it.
I think so, becauseeverything's made from scratch of
it.
So they're turning buttersomewhere, right?
Yeah.
There's a Mexican guy in the back.

(12:28):
Grind it.
There was.
Well, yeah.
He got raided.
Wow.
It's like cold barbecue.
You know what I mean?
They got rated.
Cisco told me they shut down.
Have you been a cold barbecue, Prescott?
No.
Shut down.
That's what Cisco said.
I told him, watch your mouth.
He said, no, I'm serious.
Seriously.
Broke my heart.
Oh, my.

(12:49):
It's the best barbecue.
I've had it.
Yeah, I don't know if it's thebest, but it's pretty good.
It's.
Bro.
Little Miss is pretty good,too, bro.
You think Little Miss isbetter than Colt?
I don't know.
I'd have to have him back to back.
That's the thing.
I've been wanting to go to that.
Is that good?
L miss?
Yeah, it's good.
It's really good, bro.
Have you heard of that brisket?
Amazing.

(13:10):
Get the.
Is there only one location inthe Valley?
Two.
Oh, there's two.
Tempe and right here.
Didn't realize.
Yeah.
7Th street by John C. Lincoln.
Not too far from that house.
I. I've been talking aboutthat for, like, the last two months.
I'm like, be sure and get thesmoked pecan pie.
Smoke.
Yeah, I seen that on Sundays.
I got the pork belly.
You can take some home, put itin your ramen.

(13:31):
Yeah.
Mind blown.
Yeah.
Yes, everything's good.
And put that in tortilla.
The ramen and the pork belly.
Yeah.
When I was a kid, I was so fatthat I'd put a tamale in a tortilla.
You're gonna die like it's 16.
Everything is better in a tortilla.

(13:52):
Monte.
With monte.
You know what I'm saying?
That don't equal the positive there.
That's still a negative.
So my dad.
You gota.
You got to slow down on that, son.
So do you.
Do you make your tortillas,man, or you.
You buy them or.
No, I buy them.
There's a car in Mesa that wewould stop by.
It's on Broadway.

(14:14):
In the mornings, when we'dleave work, we'd stop there and I'd
get tortillas.
There.
I don't know how they makethose tortillas, but I'm pretty sure
we had a pack that we didn'ttouch for, like, two or three months.
And I'm like, that thing'sprobably molded right now, and they
were still good.
You sure wasn't McDonald's, bro.

(14:35):
Yeah, that's.
That's not good.
I'm like, there's no mold onit, but it's shouldn't be good still.
Oh, yeah.
Just.
Just.
Yeah.
Think the next time that Iwent there, I'm like, hey, how do
you guys make your tortillas?
And she's like.
I'm like, I had a pack for,like, three months, and they never
went bad.
Like, kind of stuff are youputting in there?

(14:57):
It's kind of scary, actually.
Yeah, I know, right?
Still in you right now, Preserved.
Right?
You got.
You got an internal tortillawith all.
Your food you eat.
That's a ramen.
Just chilling.
Good for the skin.
Like Carolinas, right?
I don't know if you've been in Carolinas.
Carolinas, Carolinas.
You know, whatever.
Anyway, they.
Their tortillas go bad, like,in a week.

(15:17):
Yeah, that's why I put them inthe fridge.
Yeah, I think that's.
That's good.
I want my food to go bad, you know?
I don't want to just sit thereand just.
Right.
You know, it's like, real foodgoes bad.
That's the thing.
There's no shelf life.
Right?
Yeah.
Like Juanitas or what?
What.
What is that?
That manudo you can buy at the store?
Is it Juanitas?
Yeah, Juanitas.

(15:37):
Yeah, Juanita.
Red manudo.
Poor man's Christmas right there.
Yeah, yeah, have a date withJuanita, but it's not how you think.
Yeah, you're taking me to dinner.
Should we hit it?
Let's hit it.
All right, guys, so justbefore we get into the content here,
I wanted to remind you guys,visit us at Abundant Life fm and
you can get all of our show notes.
You can see our last podcastwith JJ as well, and you can also

(16:02):
follow us on Instagram,Facebook, and YouTube.
And if this podcast episode isa blessing to you, would you just
do me a favor and subscribe?
Hit that, like button, andthat way you get notified when new
releases drop.
And so with that, Sasa isgoing to get into our key verse for
today, and we're going to jumpinto our.

(16:24):
I think we have an excellentstory tonight of being reunited in
a different way.
And so we're just going to gothrough with Romans 8, 28, 29.
And we know that all thingswork together for good to them that
love God, to them who are thecalled according to his purpose,
for whom he did foreknow healso be predestinated to be conformed
to the image of his son, thathe might be the firstborn among many

(16:47):
brethren.
So, jj, Last time you werehere, you were telling us that you.
You got pulled over.
I think you said you were onthe brass or close by.
And it's funny how, you know.
You know, some of my family there.
Not in a good way, like, youguys weren't praying together, but
couldn't go into all that.
But you got pulled over.
Like, you saw a car out thereand you didn't know who it was, and

(17:09):
then.
Yeah.
So, I mean, obviously, youknow, the.
The reservations don't havestores or a lot of things, so you
got to go into the cities to,you know, do your shopping or, you
know, car stuff.
Barber shop.
So I was looking for abarbershop, and I think I had to

(17:30):
be at work in a couple hours,and I was on.
On a motorcycle, and I had myphone, my waistband.
So I pulled over into whatlooked like an empty business, into
the parking lot, and to Googlethe address.
And when I went to go pullaway, there's a couple cops walking

(17:54):
up on me, and they.
They found out where I wascoming from, and they called him.
He knew that area really good.
And I think there was anotherunit that pulled up before him.
And then that.
Then he pulled up, and I waslike, oh, this is, like, feeling
like my old days.

(18:15):
And I just remember holding myphone, and I was just like, I'm just
looking for the barbershop.
And I'm just shaking.
I'm like, oh, this.
I just look guilty.
And he.
He pulled up, and he asked memy name, and I just told him, JJ
And I just.
I'll never forget.
He's like, erasmo.
And I was like, whoa, dude.
Like, how do you know my name?

(18:36):
I'm like, I've been away for14 years.
I'm like, I'm.
I'm not involved in that life.
I don't have anything to dowith that life.
I. I walked away from all of it.
I was like, I'm just lookingfor the barbershop.
I was like, I work for cbi.
Like, I'm doing good, you know?
And I think the more I talked,he was just like.

(18:59):
I remember what he said.
He said, I can't believe I'mhearing you talk the way you're Talking.
He said, you used to be crazy.
And I was like, I changed, youknow, it's not me no more.
And yeah, he asked me, they'relike, oh, you're good.

(19:20):
Like I, I felt their, their,their, their body language relax.
And I was like, okay.
I'm like, I'm not, they're notgonna sweat me over not having a
motorcycle license.
And you know, it's just myfirst encounter with them from getting
out.
And he asked if.

(19:42):
I think we talked about, Ithink I first asked if you'd be interested
in talking to kids maybe.
No, I brought that up to you.
I thought you asked, you said,you said, hey, would you mind talking
to my officers?
And you know, I'm like, youwant me to build a case on something?

(20:04):
Like, I'm not like, I don'tknow, I don't know anything.
You know, I'm like, I'm, Iwalked away from that la.
There's nothing relevant thatI can tell you.
And he was like, no, nothinglike that.
He was just like, every, everyso often we have a training, you
know, with, you know, rookieofficers that, that have an interest
in either the gang unit orthey just take this class to, they

(20:27):
take this class to I guesseducate their self on people that
look like me or gangs.
Right?
Yeah.
And I just like sort of tookit all in and I was like, man, this
is something positive.
Like if I do this, you know,this is going to be like one more

(20:49):
step away from that life, youknow, Like I'm going and I'm, I'm,
I'm like essentially likeworking with officers.
I was like, oh, this issomething good.
I was like, yeah, I'll do it.
And they called me up, I don'tknow what, a couple weeks later or
something.
Yeah, probably and had sort oflike this debriefing process, I think

(21:13):
just to just fill me out andmake sure like you know, not having
somebody that's on drugs,talking to our officers that are
training, you know.
So I went through that andwent, spoke to I think more veteran
officers the first time, right.
I think the first time youcame in and talked, it was just to

(21:35):
my unit.
Yeah.
The people that I worked withon a day to day basis.
And, and then after that Ihad, I had a, mentioned my interest
in working with kids andtrying to get kids to walk away like
before they end up like what Ihad to go through.

(21:56):
And he said, you know what,sometimes we get calls for, for that,
you know, to get, you know,the, you know, like I don't Know
if you remember dare.
Oh, yeah.
So you remember dare.
They would have officers cometo the school and, you know, they
would talk to kids about drugs.
And you know what it does?

(22:16):
Like, this is your brain.
This is your brain on drugsand all that.
And he said, you know, hearingit from an officer, because I know
for me when I was a kid and.
And their officers would cometo the school, everybody's like,
dare officers.
Like, nobody wants to hearthat, you know, but, you know, bringing

(22:40):
somebody that looks like youruncle or looks like your dad to the
school, you know, you're goingto be.
You're going to catch morekids attention.
I think that's what we wereaiming for.
Yeah, that was definitely mypurpose in it.
I can, you know, know preachto kids all day long and tell them,
hey, you know, you don't wantto walk down that road.
You don't want to go down that path.
This is what it's going tolook like.

(23:02):
But I can never provide theperspective of somebody who's actually
walked that path.
And so to have somebody thatwas so willing to do it, I just saw
a great opportunity in that.
When did you first meet JJinformally or know about jj?
So I first knew about JJ whenI was working out on Salt river,

(23:26):
so it would have been probablyaround 2007.
And what he failed to tell youguys in the last podcast was he was
literally like the most wantedguy in the valley for probably a
couple months.
And that presentation that we,that we do with kids, like there's

(23:46):
know the headline from when hegot sentenced and kind of tells the
story of that.
And so although I had nevermet him because he got taken into
custody while I wasn't atwork, but I was looking for him.
So, you know, I.
Anytime we're looking forsomebody, we.

(24:07):
We do a lot of research intotheir background, who do they hang
out with, all that kind of stuff.
And so, so that's.
And then I have this crazything where I just remember people,
which is how 14 years laterwhen we meet on the side of the road
and he says, jj And I say, oh, Erasmo.
Yeah, Yeah.
I didn't give my, my like, youknow, government name first or like

(24:30):
I just said jj.
And he's like, ed Osmo.
And I was like, oh.
I'm like, how do you know me know?
I'm like, I've been away for along time.
But yeah, I, I was, I was onthe, the front pre.
Front page every day on thenews every day.

(24:53):
Yeah.
So they wanted you back.
Yeah.
Everywhere I'd go.
They'd were like, aj, you'reon the news.
And I turn the TV off.
I'm like, I don't listen to that.
I'm like.
And I just didn't want to.
I just didn't.
I don't think I wanted toaccept it as a.
As I re.
As a reality that I'm like, ohman, I'm about to go away for a long
time.

(25:13):
People would show menewspapers, like, dude, look.
And I'd get the newspaper andI turn it around and I'm like, I
don't believe that.
You know, like.
Well, you don't listen to yourown podcast, so that makes sense
to me.
You don't want to see yourselfon the face.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So did you finally catch himor somebody else got him?

(25:34):
No, he.
He got caught.
He did get caught out on Saltriver, but I wasn't at work when
he got caught.
Yeah, it was.
It was an experience.
Yeah.
When they finally did catch upto me, it was Salt river pd.

(25:56):
Gilbert.
Gilbert pd, Scottsdale pd.
It was like a joint effortbetween all these agencies and it
was like one o' clock in themorning and the house that they caught
me at was just lit up like itwas 12 o' clock in the afternoon.
There's a helicopter and is.

(26:17):
Yeah.
So there was taking you out.
Yeah.
You know, I try to ask fordetails and you know, he's like,
I don't know, dude.
You know, I forgot that part.
Can.
Can't tell you that kind of information.
Trump released the files.
Hi, my name is Nicole Mercado,co founder of canalooair.

(26:40):
We are a Christian familyowned H vac and plumbing contractor
specializing in residentialand light commercial services from
AC maintenance, repair andfull system replacement to duct cleanings.
We've got you covered.
Our dedication to qualityservice comes through our use of
highly skilled technicians,commitment to educate and empower
our clients to make the bestdecision for their AC needs and fair

(27:01):
and competitive pricing.
So give us a call today at602-609-3480 or visit us online at
canalawaire.com that's C-A-N IL U.com and.
And remember to stay cool with Kanaloo.
So.
So how long have you been a Christian?
And were you a Christianbefore you became a cop?
No, I actually wasn't.

(27:22):
I. I would tell you that mywhole life I believed in God.
My grandparents wereChristians, but like, you know, my
mom and dad never went to church.
I mean, maybe we went on likeEaster sometimes or Something like
that.
But so throughout my life, I.I would say I always believed in
God, but I didn't know whoChrist was.

(27:42):
And so I think that's the.
That's the distinction for me.
But always seeking God in some way.
So even when I was in thearmy, I would go to a different base
or, you know, get stationedsomewhere else, and I would go to
church for a little bit andthen not go for a long time, and
I'm constantly reading booksand so just seeking God, and.

(28:06):
And then once we moved toArizona, started going pretty regularly
to a Christian church.
But still, for me, at thatpoint, I hadn't put my faith in Christ.
So I'm just kind of sitting inchurch on Sunday checking a box,
because that's the thing Ithought I should do with the, you
know, a young family.
And so it really wasn't until.

(28:27):
For me, until I first reallystarted looking at the Bible and
understanding, like, theprophecies about Christ and.
And who he was in the OldTestament, who they were prophesying
him to be, and then connectingthat to the New Testament and then
understanding, you know, who Iwas as a sinner and that I needed

(28:48):
a savior.
Amen.
And then that actually, Imean, already a police officer at
that point, and so that kindof changed my perspective on policing
and how I dealt with people and.
And all that.
So definitely something I hadbeen seeking for a long time.
Now, when you saw JJ those 14years later or 15 years later, whatever

(29:11):
it may be, what were yourinitial thoughts?
I mean, did you.
When you first saw him, didyou think he was still up to no good,
or did you hear him out?
And I. I really didn't think,oh, he must be doing bad.
I mean, his immediate thingwas like, hey, I'm not.
I'm not in that life anymore.
I said, you know, I'm workingat cbi.

(29:33):
His name hadn't come up at all.
How long had you been out atthe time?
Had to have been at least overfour months, because for the first
four months, I was working oncars, and then I started at cbi.
So I was probably out five orsix months already.
Yeah.
So, like, you know, I was onthe gang unit at the time.

(29:55):
Time.
And so usually if people arebecoming a problem, their name will
pop up and, you know, hadn'theard anything about him.
And then just his.
His demeanor and.
And he seemed sincere.
And so, you know, I've learneda term called unconditional positive
regard.
And him.
And I had a conversation aboutthis the other day, and it's kind
of like where you see somebodyas the potential that they have as

(30:19):
opposed to the condition thatthey're in.
And I've always felt like Itry to take that approach to people
and kind of give the benefitof the doubt until they prove themselves
wrong.
And so that's kind of theapproach that I took.
And you saw a difference in JJfrom what you remember previous?
Yeah, definitely.
I mean, just the fact that hewas working full time and even just

(30:45):
having that conversation andbeing open to that conversation and
then coming in and answeringquestions for officers.
And again, you know, like,he's always made the distinction.
Like, you know, he's never,like, told on anybody or gotten anybody
in trouble with his past orwhat he knew, but just the fact that
he was willing to open himselfup so that officers could gain a

(31:10):
perspective that they mightnot be able to get just from working,
like, they.
He opened himself up to prettymuch any questions that they wanted
to ask him.
And we talked about last timethat you didn't know what the next
step that God had for you.
And I think we were trying torecognize that you were already kind
of having another.
An impact that maybe youdidn't even realize.

(31:31):
And then recently, youbrought, you know, your cousin to
freedom at last, who been outprison for maybe three and a half
weeks, kind of as an example of.
This is what I. I mean, thisis different.
Right.
You're talking to theseofficers and maybe youth in the future
about trying to bridge that gap.
Right.
And now you're trying tobridge a different gap of.
Yeah.
And I just had another cousinget out yesterday.

(31:57):
Wow.
So.
So me and Junior, we startedup a.
A family chat on.
On messenger.
So it's me, my cousin Junior,Louie, Chris Weddle, and now Frankie.
But almost every morning.

(32:18):
Not every morning, it'severybody calling and.
And just like a roll call kindof thing.
Like a roll call and justkeeping everybody, you know, accountable.
Like, hey, good day.
Everybody's at work, you know,and just pushing for each other just
to change.
And, you know, my cousin thatgot out yesterday, we were all talking

(32:42):
like, well, what do you thinkhe's gonna do?
You know, like, I'm like, oh,we're just gonna love him from a
distance on social media first.
Give him, like, a year andjust sort of fill him out, you know,
and we just added him on.
And he said he went to churchlast night.
His wife's father is a pastorat a church on 51st Ave.

(33:08):
In Glendale, I think.
So it's like I said, I don'tknow if I said it last time, but
I just feel like there's likea lot of people turning to God right
now.
A lot of people.
Well, you couldn't mentionfreedom at last.
That, you know, there's a, youknow, on the tablets that there's

(33:30):
messages coming in and evenChristian songs, Christian rap, things
like that, that, that arerelatable to the inmates.
And then he said one thingthat you had mentioned to that you
had reverberated as well, thatwhen he turned 18, his mom told him
when you get to prison, yougot to watch your mouth.
And he said that's kind of the advice.
Not go to college, but whenyou go to prison, like it was already

(33:50):
an anticipated event in your life.
Like this was the, the dreamsI have for you.
There was no positivereinforcement, enforcement, and this
is kind of the, the outcome.
Yeah, I mean, just, just alonein that chat, there's, you know,
five, six of us and everybodyon there has been to prison.
And I, I screenshot it and I,I sent it to, to Alex.

(34:15):
I was like, ah, we got anotherone on the chat, you know, and she's,
that's so crazy that all youguys are out at the same time right
now.
I'm like, there's stillanother handful that are still serving
time, you know, and you know,talking to, to Alex, it's, you know,
everybody on her side of thefamily, it's, you know, so and so

(34:36):
went off to college, so and sowent off to the military, so and
so went and had got marriedand has a family.
And you know, for my familyit's, you know, so and so got a 20
year sentence, so and so gottried as an adult.
And, and just like you said,like my, my cousin said, his mom

(34:59):
telling them, when you turn 18and you go to prison, you're going
to have to watch your mouth.
You know, those, that's how Igrew up.
And now a lot of those familymembers though, they're all turning
to God.
It's just different.
Do you see any change outthere on the street of people perhaps
wanting to change their lifearound or have things gotten worse

(35:22):
since when you started?
I mean, I, I think just inlooking at culture in general, I'm
seeing more of a shift, Ithink towards God.
And I think it's just becausethings became like people just didn't
have answers for anything.
Like even the most basicthings, we, a lot of people couldn't
even answer basic questionsabout human beings or whatever the

(35:43):
case may be.
And now people are saying, youKnow what?
Maybe this really doesn't makesense, but there's got to be something
out there that does make sense.
You know, I watched a showrecently where, you know, one of
the, one of the guys that wastalking, was talking actually how,
you know, even where, youknow, a lot of churches were just

(36:04):
like very seeker friendly and,and almost more for the outside person
than actually for the Christian.
And they'd done away with alot of tradition and things like
that.
He said, you know, I'm talkingto a lot of younger people who are
really looking for tradition,which is a complete shift, I think,
from the last, I don't know,10, 15 years where things got really

(36:24):
seeker sensitive.
And now it seems to be kind ofthe pendulum is shifting back to
traditional type of churches.
I think even on the streets.
Right.
Being real is respected,whoever you are.
And I think the secretsensitive, they realize at some point
it may not be real.
Like you can live whatever youwant and come on church on Sunday

(36:46):
and, But not change your life.
Yeah.
And I think last time that wemet up, we were talking about how
now there's like a, a youngcrowd, like teenagers that are actively
seeking God or going to church.
And, and, and it wasn't likethat before.

(37:08):
I think Pastor Shaw hit onthat probably like a month ago or
something or somebody that wasspeaking was saying how there's a
younger crowd now coming in.
And I think there's just a lotof things going on in the world world
right now that are.
People are just like you said,see, looking for answers.

(37:29):
Yeah.
And I've seen a, I saw like a,a documentary.
It's been a while ago, but wasthis guy from Dade County, Florida.
He was pretty bad dude and youknow, gangs and all of that, but
he was kind of like, you know,most wanted type of deal over there.
And yeah, I mean he was crazy,like getting gunfights, bare knuckle

(37:55):
fights and like just crazy.
A lot of the things that he did.
And then he gave his life to Christ.
I don't know if it was.
I can't remember if it was inprison, but he gave his life to Christ
and now he's like a street preacher.
Now he's just going aroundpreaching Christ like strong.
And it's, it's like you, youknow, he, people see him and you
know he's not.
Doesn't have the appearance of you.

(38:17):
And it has an effect though,because people will pay attention
along the streets.
They pay attention becauseit's like that dude's already been
there and done that Right.
And they are seeking, I think,but it's really neat to see that,
that it kind of comes fullcircle around, you know.
You know, I think other placesI've seen it is even like, you know,

(38:38):
I'm.
I'm pretty big fan of the ufc,and I can remember watching some
fights a couple weeks ago, andalmost every person that won, as
soon as they started theirinterview was, I want to give thanks
to my Lord and savior, Jesus Christ.
And I told my wife, I waslike, wow, this is amazing.
Like, I think every personthat's come up here tonight, and
then even, you know, you lookat big podcasts like Joe Rogan, where

(39:00):
he was completely anti, anti,and now, you know, I don't know if
you guys are familiar withWesley Huff, but he had Wesley Huff,
who's a Christian historian,on there recently, and just very
open to things that he wouldnot have been open to just a few
years ago.
So I think he's even beengoing to church.
I did hear that.
Joe Rogan.
Yeah, Joe Rogan's beenattending church.

(39:22):
Yeah.
I mean, I don't know that he'sa believer, but I know that I've
heard.
But I think he's seeking, he'slooking, and I. I respect him.
You know, he has a lot ofprofanity in his shows, but he's
open, like, open minded to newideas, new thoughts.
Well, I think.
I think what's happening islike, he's looking at what's happening
out in the world, and then youkind of see what's in the Bible and
it's like, man, that's truth.
Like, it matches what's goingon out there.

(39:44):
I mean, you know, the waythings are, the evil that's out there,
I mean, it's.
It's all written.
It's.
It's there.
The truth is there.
I think for a non believer to.
To be able to open up theBible and start connecting the dots,
like, oh, this is real.
I think it's probably a scaryfeeling for them, like, oh, should

(40:06):
I.
Should I be getting into thisright now?
You know, like, have I beensleeping on this this whole time?
And, yeah, I think.
I didn't know Joe Rogan was.
Was going to church and stuff, though.
But you seen that withathletes and stuff.
I mean, I know you sent me aclip of Diamondbacks player, and
he's.

(40:27):
Yeah.
And he's playing the, youknow, Christian song as he goes up
to the play.
Right.
Or something like that.
That was the catcher, McCann.
He's playing jolly Roll.
Yeah.
Hard Fought Hallelujah.
Yeah, yeah.
Pretty popular song, but it'sout right now.
But you're seeing a lot ofthat, right?
I mean, a lot of.
A lot of pro players, andthey're just coming out and I can't
remember.
There was another one that you.

(40:47):
The video you showed me, thatwas the other guy, right?
I can't remember.
He showed me the video at FTLthe other night.
I think Rebecca had sent it to you.
And so when the.
Gustavo was like, this guysounds fake, whatever, but, I mean,
it's just.
You're seeing that it's more prevalent.
Like you said, the cultureseems like there's a shift.
It's like maybe thatpendulum's coming back the other
way.
I don't know, because I was atUFC last.

(41:08):
The last headliner when theyhad Olivares, he had lost, and everybody
had said, yeah, I wanted.
First of all, I just want togive thanks.
And some of them kind of,like, swore and things like that
after they did kind of messedit up.
But there were some of themthat were legitly just giving God.
Kayla Harrison, I mean, she.
She comes up right away.
She prays for the other personwhen she's done fighting.
Like, it's pretty wild.

(41:28):
I didn't.
I. I haven't seen it, but Ithink that's.
That goes with, you know, howyou say, you know, some of them,
you know, gave.
Gave praise to Jesus and allthat, and then, you know, profanity
came out their mouth.
But I think it's like how youwere saying you.
You always were seeking God,or you would always say, like, yeah,
yeah, I believe God.

(41:50):
For a lot of people, it'slike, it is that.
And the stuff that comes outof their mouth, it's not Christian,
right?
It's.
It's like listening to yournana or like when they drive by a
church and, you know, forCatholics, you know, I grew up Mexican,
they all, you know, do thecross and all that.

(42:12):
But I think it's just.
You grew up knowing that andhearing it, but you weren't actually,
like, diving into it and savedand a believer, Right.
And it could be, too, thatthey are saved, and it's just they're
being sanctified.
I mean, they're, you know, the Tony.
Think about Tony.
Yeah, The HR Night.
The HR nightmare, right?
HR nightmare.
Yeah.
It's growing.
It's growing Tony's money.

(42:33):
Just the maturity of a newbeliever and.
Yeah, yeah.
And for me and Crossle, whenwe met, I didn't know.
I didn't know his background,he's an.
He's a detective.
But you also going to school for.
What were you going to school for?
Yeah, I got my bachelor'sdegree in Christian ministry and

(42:56):
been working on my master's degree.
Originally it was inchaplaincy, and I just switched to
pastoral counseling.
So the, the way ourrelationship started growing more
from just going and doingtalks to, to officers, and then we'd
go do talks to at risk youthand you know, talk to them about

(43:17):
gang life in prison and tryto, you know, you know, push the
conversation away from like,dude, you don't want to go in there.
You know, Me and Alex, we weregonna get married in Italy and I
was like, oh, it'd be prettycool if, if Crosswell could marry
us over there, you know, like,officiate the wedding.

(43:39):
And she said, yeah, you.
You think he would do it?
I'm like, I don't know.
That was pretty long shot, youknow, and so we, we had came up with
the, like the, the weddinginvitations and everything.
And I had asked, I had askedhim and he said, yeah, dude, it'd
be an honor to go and do that,you know, And I was like, how do

(44:02):
we get the wedding invitationsto him?
And I'm like, it's gonna beweird for me to ask him for his address.
I'm like, maybe I should justset up like a breakfast and just
like, oh, here, dude.
Just.
And we, we didn't have ananswer for it.
We're just like, just go for it.
Just ask him.

(44:23):
And that's when I was tellingyou guys last time that he gave me
the address, and I was like, oh.
I was like, I got his address.
You know, the golden ticket.
I know, it's just.
It was for me, it was a hugemilestone in, in our friendship,
you know, and, and everythinghas just progressed from there.

(44:45):
And when I got baptized lastyear, I.
And I told him about.
He's.
Oh, yeah, I won't miss it forthe world, you know, like, that's
cool.
I'm Rebecca Mendez withLamplight Ministries, where I serve
the Lord by loving others.
Through biblical counselingand workshops.
Every day we're reminded ofour fallen world.
Through disappointment, grief,fear, despair.

(45:08):
We need a savior.
And in Jesus Christ, we havethat Savior.
He came to rescue us, offering his.
Spirit to guide us and his word.
To comfort, correct and lead us.
If you're a follower ofChrist, eager.
To grow in him, I'd be honored.
To walk this journey with you through.
One on one biblical counseling.

(45:29):
Together we'll explore God'sword, find encouragement.
And pursue faithful obedienceto our Savior.
Please Visit me atlamplightministries.com to book your
appointment today.
How was it seeing JJ getting baptized?
It was fantastic.
Like, it was amazing.
But I knew.
I knew that he was heading inthat direction, and so I wasn't surprised,

(45:54):
you know, when he told me.
Obviously he lives way outhere, so we don't.
We would mostly see each other.
Like, we'd get together forbreakfast or something.
I'd meet up with him and Alexbecause they were working over in
the evening, East Valley.
But, yeah, when he told me hewas getting baptized, I wasn't surprised.
I think I had already gone tochurch with them once before, Just

(46:16):
wanted to check it out.
So I came out here, went tochurch with them, and then it was.
I don't even know how muchlonger longer.
It was probably like sixmonths later.
Six months?
Yeah.
When he told me he was gettingbaptized, so I was like, yeah, I'll
be there for that.
So cool.
In your experience, how manypeople do you see, like J.J. that
maybe had experience in doingcriminal activity, you know, come

(46:40):
to change their lives?
I imagine it's not common.
It's definitely not common.
And when I think about it, Iprobably don't.
It probably happens more thanI assume, but I don't see it.
And it's just because him andI had that early contact when he
got out and we started doingthe talks together and kind of building

(47:05):
that relationship where westayed in touch.
Whereas had I not run into himthat day, he'd still probably, I'm
sure, be doing the same stuffhe's doing now.
I just wouldn't know about it.
You know, I mean, there's oneother guy that I talk to on a semi
regular basis who's also, youknow, done up some time in prison

(47:26):
and gotten out.
Him and I'll chat with eachother, and he's a Christian, and
so really there's probablylike two people that in.
You know, I've been a cop for.
21 years, and I think that'sjust, you know, the Lord working
in.
In both of our lives.

(47:48):
I think I talked about it lasttime, like, for me to pull into that
parking lot, you know, wealways talk about it.
For me to pull into thatabandoned parking lot on that day
to look for the barber shopthat was right across the street.
And, you know, I didn't knowhe was a Christian then.

(48:09):
And it was just, you know, meand an officer and, yeah, just for
everything that's happened,you know, he does some.
He does another program nowthat, that he teaches.
But it'll be interesting justto see what.

(48:29):
What the future holds, youknow, or, you know, if.
If God uses us together as atool to go and.
And reach out to people or not.
You know, you just never knowor where he wants you at, you know,
but our talks have usuallybeen, you know, about gangs and trying

(48:52):
to get, you know, people tostep away from that life.
Just me speaking fromexperience, like, that's not where
you want to be.
It's not a cool place.
It's not something glorifying.
But to do it from.
From a Christian standpointand, and talk to people about what
God has done for both of usand how he's brought us together.

(49:16):
And I think that'll beinteresting, you know?
Yeah.
Do you have visions of that or.
Yeah, I. I would love to seewhat the future holds, you know,
I. I definitely place all ofthis in God's hands and recognize

(49:37):
God's timing.
Exactly what he.
JJ was just talking about, youknow, that we were working a special
detail that day.
It's not a day that I normally work.
It was my sergeant that firstcontacted him, and he just called
me on the phone.
He's like, hey, this dude justpulled up on a motorcycle he saw
tatted up.
He's like, can you head my way?
And I was like, yeah, for sure.

(49:59):
And then again, we're talkingabout 14, 15 years later and just.
You can't like deny those kindof connections in your life.
God sovereignty.
Yeah, for sure.
So do you have plans for.
I mean, you said you're goingto or you did school, or you're going
to school for pastoral counseling.

(50:19):
Is that kind of like afterlife, after police, or is that.
Is you just trying to maybe dosomething while now or what's your
plan?
Yeah, I think originally my plan.
So I was trying to be achaplain on our department.
We don't have any swornofficer chaplains.
So I was trying to work it outwith my department to be a chaplain,

(50:42):
which is why I was pursuingthe chaplaincy side of things.
But I've been to a ton ofchaplains training.
I've actually.
I took a break from school fora year because I realized my.
My faith had almost kind ofbecome this academic pursuit.
And so I was like, I need tostep back and read my Bible just
to read my Bible, not becauseit's what I got to do for my homework

(51:03):
this week.
Right.
So I took a break.
I'm actually just in my firstclass back.
But when I went back.
I decided I was going tochange from a chaplaincy cohort to.
To pastoral counseling.
Not with necessarily anyintentions of being a pastor, but
just to see where it takes me.
I mean, when I got mybachelor's degree in Christian ministry,

(51:24):
it was, I need to do my.
I want to get a bachelor's degree.
I really didn't need to.
And this would be a good routeto go, and so I did it.
So that's kind of the sameavenue that I'm taking with my.
My master's degree.
I don't need a master'sdegree, but let's see where.
Let's see where it'll take me.

(51:45):
That's pretty cool.
Yeah.
I just think of the impact youhave out there, too, if, you know,
you run into somebody andmaybe they are.
They messed up, but then inthe end they're seeking, like, help
beyond just positivity, but,you know, seeking God in a different
way.
And you have those tools toreach them and to show them the light.

(52:07):
Because I think a lot ofpeople out there are just looking
and lost.
Yeah, Just lost.
Just doing dumb stuff becausethey have no.
No other thing to do, orthey're bored and they've come too
far and they're like, youknow, I don't.
I don't want to live this life anymore.
I'm done with it.
For me, it's always been drugaddiction seems to be the thing that.

(52:30):
That keeps people, like, eventhe people with the best intentions.
It's once they get sucked backinto that.
That addiction that you seethem kind of veer back off of the
path of.
Of doing good, you know,because, like, you were asking, how
many people do you actuallysee who do it?
I hear it all the time.
I hear people say, this is,you know, when I worked at county
jail.
All right, you ain't nevergoing to see me again.

(52:51):
This is the last time.
And I'm handing them theirproperty on Saturday as they're leaving
out the jail, and then onMonday, they're putting their property
back in a locker because theygot arrested already again, you know,
and so that's the thing isfinding that way to be consistent
with what you really want to do.
And it's.
It seems to always be anaddiction that pulls people back

(53:14):
in.
Yeah.
And we have ftl.
We do that every Friday night.
And we see that as well.
You know, had a friend passaway, just couldn't kick the habit.
Drug overdose.
Yeah.
But in reality, I believe hewas saved.
He was.
And we've talked about It.
Before he was convicted, hewould come and he would cry and he

(53:37):
would, you know, he was convicted.
I mean, the spirit wasworking, but he just had that physical
addiction.
Just couldn't kick it, and ittook him.
Y. FTL is addiction ministry.
Yes, sir.
Freedom.
That last that we have at thechurch every Friday.
And it's different than church.
You know, I tell people, like,do I have to dress up?

(53:58):
I'm like, no, it's not.
It's pretty informal.
And you can share your storyand share as much as you want and.
Come as you are.
Come as you are.
I think of it as a littlechurch service, though, you know,
because we.
We, you know, we do praises,we do sing some songs.
We have a small group.
We pray, and then we have a.
A chat challenge, a message.

(54:19):
And then we, you know, have food.
And fellowship and no ramenand video, but we do have food.
We could.
We could.
JJ's cooking the next one.
I don't know how they wouldfeel about take the.
Bringing ramen into the church.
Take air out of Denise's tiresand, like, hey, I don't know what
happened.
Take her place and make the ramen.
Yeah.
You know, but the interestingthing when you guys are talking about,

(54:40):
it's just, you know, it'splanting seeds with people, right?
Like, it's.
You don't know when thatseed's gonna stick, you know, to
listen to JJ's story and thepeople that he has in his life that
he knew prior to going to prison.
And, you know, Dino, that.
That picked him up from prisonand put him to work the first day
out, like, that was a seedthat was planted years and years

(55:01):
and years ago.
So, yeah, my brother Dino, he.
He.
When I was a troubled kid, 17years old, years old, on probation,
they had given me a jobcoordinator to.
To show me how to conductmyself in an interview.

(55:21):
In a job interview.
They took me to the store andgot me, like, you know, dress clothes
because, you know, I'm from.
I'm from the hood, you know, Ihad Dickies and muscle shirts, you
know, and.
No Ben Davis.
Yeah, some Ben Davis and Frisco.
And.
And I met my.
You know, he's my brother now, Dino.

(55:44):
It was like, everything that Iwant to do, I want to.
I was like, they're like, whatdo you want to do?
I was like, I want to hook upcar stereos.
You know, I was a kid.
They're like, all right.
Every place that we went to,they're like, you got any experience?
I'm like, no, they're like,yeah, you're not gonna touch our
stuff.
You know, like, we work withsome pretty expensive stuff.
And we had hit up I don't knowhow many places, but we're coming

(56:06):
down Mill Ave. And there'slike this store and it had like all
these bright letters andeverything on there.
And they're like, it was aArizona tent and.
Arizona tent, car stereos and alarms.
And my job coordinators wantto stop by, check this place out.
And I was like, sure.
And I met Dino and, and, andhis wife Tammy, my sister Tammy.

(56:33):
They always talk about it.
They said, yeah, when we metJose, they call me Jose.
I said, when we met Jose, youknow, he was just really, you know,
standing straight up and just,you know, serious look on his face.
And Dino said, want to learnhow to tint windows?
And I was like, yeah, sure,you know, and he taught me how to

(56:53):
tint windows and, and hook upcar stereos, alarms, all that.
And he's the one that pickedme up from prison, but he used to
try to take me to church too,when I was younger.
And for him to pick me up wasjust like, just like a lifesaver.

(57:15):
They picked me up from prisonand he put me to work that same day
in his garage.
He wires hot rods and everything.
I think we were working on a razor.
But he put me to work thatsame day.
He said, I'm going to need youthe next, you know, tomorrow.
I'm like, all right.
So every day we just go.
And it was just, just Godworking in my life.

(57:39):
You know, even, even I didn'tsee it then, you know, just he, he's
putting all these people in my life.
And Dino was there as wellwhen I got baptized.
Dino, Sister Tammy Crosso.
But yeah, these are all, youknow, influences that, that I've

(58:01):
had since I've been out.
Been out five years now.
That sounds like you can youhave that opportunity now.
And you, you talked about thischat that you have with your, with
your family and friends andyou're the guy now maybe you, you're
that guy.
That's the Dino.
You know what I mean?
So, so yeah, so I, I reach outto like, or sometimes I have people

(58:23):
that.
Cuz, you know, prison was abig part of my life for all my life.
And sometimes I have these,these guys that get out and they'll
reach out to me on socialmedia and.
I.
Always tell all of them, youknow, I'm.
I'll love you from a distance.
I'll wait to see, like, get afeel for you, you know, I'm not just

(58:44):
going to show up to your houseand you're doing some bad stuff that
I don't want to be around.
But Cross was like, makes mesort of nervous, you know, you talking
to some of these people sometimes.
And Alex is the same way.
Alex is like, yeah, you know,but like I said, I all, you know,

(59:06):
I have, you know, my friend Thumper.
I've been trying to help himout since he got out, just being
there for him.
I brought him to church onetime, but he's doing good.
He gets a CDL on on the 1st,but he'll call me and chat, you know,
sometimes, and he's just like,man, I'm just really grateful for

(59:29):
you, and you're an inspirationto me, and I'm happy to see you doing
good.
And for me, it's just like,how can I give back?
You know, how can I pleaseGod, he's been so good to me and,
you know, everything that Ihave right now, you know, I have
a. I have a wife.
I have, you know, a family, kids.

(59:53):
I have, you know, good friendsin my life that, you know, I just.
I'm.
I'm grateful, you know, forthis friendship, you know, for.
For you guys.
God put.
God gave that to me, you know,And I don't think he just set me
up just so I can just, youknow, live a lavish life and just,

(01:00:13):
you know, sit at home and eatb ramen.
You know, it's like, okay,dude, like, you.
You got to get to worksometime, you know, and trying to
figure out, you know, what itis that I need to do.
You know, I'm like, maybe Ineed to reach out to people.
Maybe, you know, my story willhelp out some people, you know, hopefully,

(01:00:36):
you know, they get saved.
That.
That's the goal, right?
But if not, you know, at leastmaybe I could just, you know, be
that influence to tell youjust get a job and just.
Just work and just pay billsand be normal, you know.
So I think it's a little bitof both, right?

(01:00:57):
I mean, you.
You can.
You can love on these peopleand show the love of Christ and,
you know, maybe working themat that, from that angle, you know,
you're helping them get a jobor whatever, but at the same time
time, they're watching you andhow you live and conduct your life.
It's like you said, plant that seed.
You know, and you're.
You're shining that light ofJesus and.

(01:01:19):
And so, you know, invite himto church.
Just little, little things,you Know, or, hey, pray before your
meal or whatever.
And just these little seedsthat you're planning and you're showing
them, just drawing them in,you know, but building that relationship.
And you never know, man.
You might lead somebody toChrist, and that's the ultimate goal.
Yeah, I think.
Yeah.
For me, I always remember whenI was in juvenile in Adobe Mountain,

(01:01:45):
I always remember there wasthis guy that was all tatted up.
I think he was from California.
He came to talk to us atchurch one time.
And I always remember hisstory was just captivating.
His testimony was captivatingto me.
You know, I'm like, oh, man,he looks like all my.
My family and, you know, buthe's been saved.

(01:02:08):
And he.
He.
He had this saying.
What did he say?
He said, man, I was beat upfrom the feet up.
I was tore up from the floor up.
I needed a checkup from theneck up, you know, And I was just
like, oh, this dude, he knowshow to rhyme.
But yeah, you know, he's.
He sort of planted a seedthen, you know, and sometimes you're

(01:02:34):
going to plant seedseverywhere and you're not going to
stick around to see thatblossom into anything.
You know, you'll probablynever see it again, but hopefully,
you know, somewhere yearslater, they're telling.
Telling that story, you know,eternity only knows.
Right.
When you get to heaven.
And you may hear stories ofpeople, people that you had an influence

(01:02:55):
on.
Yeah.
Or you might get to.
You might not be the oneplanting the seed.
You might get the opportunityto pull that little harvest right
there.
Yeah.
You know what I mean?
Because other people have beenplanting, and.
Then you're the one that'sjust right.
You know what I mean?
You never know.
I mean, you never know whatpart of the.
The story you're gonna processand the process.
Right.
You know, God can use you inall kind of different ways, man.
Yeah, I think he already isusing you.

(01:03:17):
Only time will tell, right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, I saw it when we weregoing out and talking to kids and
stuff.
Just even some of the crazyconnections that he had with kids.
Like, he's like, oh, yeah, Iknow your dad.
And I'm like, how do you knowtheir dad?
Like, we're in Pinal countyright now and.
Oh, yeah, that's Pinal County.
Then when we went to the.

(01:03:37):
To the school, too, when.
When Alex came along, we didlike, those four classes.
I knew that kids.
He was from my neighborhood.
He.
He's like, oh, you know, soI'm like, yeah.
I'm like, you're Talking aboutPepe, which is funny, because Pepe
had.
Got out after that, and I gothim a job at cbi.

(01:03:58):
And I'm like, I seen one ofyour nephews at school.
I'm like, you're a littleknucklehead, man.
Like, went over there to talkto him about.
You know, we always talk about this.
Like, you go talk to thesekids, and, you know, they're.
They're at risk.
They're, like, already in thatlife or drawn to that life, and you

(01:04:19):
go and talk to them and try tosteer them away from it.
Like, hey, I've been down that road.
Like, this is what you got tolook forward to, you know?
And there's always that onethat's just seems more intrigued
about that life, like, askingyou all the.
The wrong question, you know?
So when you were there, didyou do this or did you have that?
And it's like, all right,dude, like, gotta go somewhere else.

(01:04:42):
Yeah, yeah.
And even Frankie at ourchurch, you know, Tony's friend that
he was in the sober living house.
Oh, right.
You knew kind of where he wasfrom, too.
Yeah.
Tony brought somebody tochurch one time, but he was all tatted
up.
Like, me, too.
You know, I was like, who'sthat guy over there?
You know, introduced myself.

(01:05:03):
Like, oh, so and so, like,where are you from?
He's a Guadalupe.
I'm like, where all myfamily's from, you know, it's me,
J.J. you know, we just knewall the same people.
But, yeah, I mean, when youtalk about, like, all the bad neighborhoods
and everything in Arizona.

(01:05:25):
Yeah, I'll know somebody from there.
Just from the prison system or something.
You know, same thing, likewhere I used to work at at cbi.
Like, I was good at my jobbecause we'd have a.
A lot of people from theprison culture that would go in,
and I would be able to relateto them because they're like, oh,

(01:05:48):
you don't know I'm from.
So and so.
I'm like, oh.
Like, oh, you know, sasso.
Like, yeah, how do you knowthat's my good friend?
Like, oh.
You know, and then sort of de.
Escalates people.
But, yeah, well, I thinkthat's kind of the.
The.
The powerful thing about it.
Right.
Because all these people knewyou as an old James.
Right, Right.

(01:06:08):
And now when they see you,it's the.
It's the new creature, the newJJ and they.
It's like, what's different?
Like, I want that.
How did that happen?
You know?
And that's where the power ofthis Comes in.
This power of this story comesin, man.
The changed life, the power of God.
It's amazing, bro.
Yeah, that's what I was sayingSasa last time, like next time you

(01:06:29):
guys go out, you know, withfreedom that last, I'd like to go
along, just help out whereverI can.
You know, it's funny becausewe were passing out the bag to the
homeless and Tony recognized adude that we passed a bag out from
being rehab.
He's like, yeah, I was inrehab with that guy.
Right.
Like I think the second orthird time.
Right.

(01:06:49):
And it's, he said in the, youknow, criminality, it's really a
small world.
Yeah, people.
Yeah.
Really small.
Yeah.
If you're going to give anyparting words or just anything about
your story and you want ourlisteners to know about you or your
story about anything, but youknow, what would you have to say?
I think the biggest thing forme, and especially as it relates

(01:07:12):
to JJ is it just really showsI've seen people with a Christian
heart, just how they've hadthat effect on his life, whether
it's his father in law,whether it's the church that you
guys go to, because let's behonest, there's a lot of places that
he could have walked into withthe tattoos all over his head and

(01:07:33):
over his arms and could say,yeah, we're a church, but my might
not have been so kind to him.
Right.
And so, you know, I thinkthat's my, my biggest thing is like
if we're going to say we'reChristians, we have to really act
like that.
And you know, we talked alittle bit earlier about, you know,

(01:07:57):
where I, I, from a policeofficer perspective, I could see
where people who I know areChristians, but you almost try to
wear two different hats.
Like, well, I have to wearthis police officer hat, but I'm
a Christian.
And it's like we actually didan exercise in one of my classes
and my professor said, hey,what are the roles in your life?
And it was like, well, I'm a,I'm a father and I'm a husband and

(01:08:20):
I'm a Christian and I'm apolice officer.
And you know, you lay, you layout all these roles and everybody
did the same thing.
And he said, no, you guys allgot it wrong.
And so he pulls Christian outof everybody's list and, and then
he kind of draws a line overthe top of everything and then writes
Christian.
And so it's like, you're aChristian father, you're a Christian
police officer, you're AChristian husband.

(01:08:41):
And so when you take thatperspective into your life, and I
think that's the perspectivethat allowed me to even be open to
that first conversation withJJ is like, hey, I'm, I want people
to turn to Christ.
I want, you know, that for people.
But if we're going to shutpeople out, how do we ever get that?

(01:09:02):
How do we ever get to that spot?
And so I think that's thebiggest thing is like, if you say
you are a Christian, live itout, like be open to people, give
people grace.
And a lot of times, like Isaid, I think a lot of people would
just look at JJ and go, ah,not that guy.
Yeah, you know, and so we haveto really be careful with that.

(01:09:26):
Well, and I think that's,that's the model of Jesus.
Right?
I mean he sat with publicansand sinners and prostitutes and people
that maybe look like J.J. or,or whatever.
And, and he loved on them.
He didn't, he didn't cast them out.
They were the cast outs.
And he drew them in to hisfear of, to his, to his, you know,
his circle.
And, and he loved on them andused them.

(01:09:48):
And the powerful thing is helooks on the horror heart.
Right.
He's not.
Right.
He doesn't care about your appearance.
What appearance?
He cares about your heart, thankfully.
Yeah.
Amen.
He redeems.
Amen.
Amen.
Well, it's been a good episodeguys and appreciate you coming on
the show.
Scott, it's good to meet you.
Jj, welcome back.
Glad to have you.
And maybe another episode inthe future, or maybe we'll outdo.

(01:10:12):
I have to surprise.
Rebecca's the third.
Rebecca's like four, I thinkthree, three or four times, something
like that.
She might be.
She don't even listen to thepodcast, so we can't have her on.
But JJ doesn't either, so hedon't listen to himself.
Yeah, maybe I'll listen tothis one.
There you go.
You gotta listen to that.
Part one, part two, you cansee the improvement.
And, and then Tony, if I doone with Tony, we, I'll definitely

(01:10:33):
listen to that one.
Just listening to Tony ingeneral is just.
We gotta have Diane with themute button, you know what I mean?
Ready to get Tony.
It's gonna be the littlebuzzer and then it's be gonna to
blur these.
Words, pixelate his mouth, youknow what I mean?
Put it on a delay.
Yeah, we need a delay for sure.
Love you, Tony.
Love you, Tony.
Shout out to Tony.

(01:10:56):
Oh, man.
Well, thanks guys.
I really do appreciate it.
And thank you all forlistening to this episode of the
podcast.
Remember to subscribe and ifthis episode's been a blessing to
you, please give us a thumbsup and we will see you in the next
episode.
Bye for 70.
Bye.
Bye for now.
Thank you for listening to theAbundant Life podcast.

(01:11:18):
We pray you were blessed bytoday's episode.
Please visit us online atAbundant Life fm.
Until next time.
May God bless you.
Sa.