Ep 4. Nick Morton, Tuning Bows and Tall Tales from Tusky Trips

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 2 (00:05):
On the fourth episode of Accurate Hunts and having
that knowledge, to see theproblems and correct it yourself
, as opposed to being going.
I didn't hit the middle, don'tknow why.
I'll seek out those old boars.
They're like a ghost to find inthe first instance, very hard
to get onto, and the terrain uphere is very mountainous, a lot
of tusse gras, and I looked atthis goat coming down.
It wasn't a goat, it was a boar.

(00:25):
It was standing so high.
I just discarded it because youdo get goats up there, and I
just thought it was a black andwhite billy.
And I looked at this thing, myeyes and it fell in my head and
I was just Welcome back toanother episode.

Speaker 1 (00:44):
I am sitting in the Liverpool Rangers Hunter Valley
area with the man himself, nickMorton.
Welcome to the show.
Thank you for having me, sir.
No worries, thanks for havingme.
It's been a good few days.
I've had a goat here on yourchin, which is indicative of how
these couple of days have gone.
I've just been doing a bit ofbutchering.
Before we have we have Nowwe've picked a little windy spot
, the least windy spot.
I think the whole valley is thewindy spot today.

(01:05):
Yeah, and this is the quietestspot we could find.
So if you get some backgroundnoise, that's definitely what it
is.
But the reason we're here is toshoot some bows, and what
happened was Mel.
My lovely wife had a bow forseveral years but really wanted
to get into it recently, and forher birthday I bought her a

(01:28):
Beaux Hunter.
Beaux Hunter Learning Educationcourse.
Call it what you will, call itwhat you will, and it has been
this last few days.
So we've spent this is daythree now out here with you and
lovely Sarah.

Speaker 2 (01:40):
A couple other girls as well.

Speaker 1 (01:41):
sort of a bit of a girl it did turn into a female
trip, which has been great, andwe'll talk about that.
Talk about that probably alittle bit later, and their sort
of emotions.
And it was enjoyable for me tosee you because you and I are
probably similar and we kill afair bit of stuff, so you forget
the firsts.

Speaker 2 (01:58):
The firsts and, I think, those different
perspectives, that others coming.
We've had Susie, who's from anon-hazard hunting, before
picked up a bow, seriously aweek ago.
First harvest, first stalks,first everything.
So it's cool to see that, asopposed to what we do or what
we've been exposed to, and Meltoo, killed a few animals rifle

(02:19):
Done one with the bow prior andthen now just slayed it.
I think she got three or fourkills this weekend and all
perfect.
So a couple of billies.

Speaker 1 (02:27):
Fox.
Well, I wouldn't have been ableto do that without your help,
though.

Speaker 2 (02:32):
We started off a little bit rusty.
There was a few bow tuningissues, technical things.
I think Mel had been saying toyou that she feels she's doing
everything right and her gear'sletting her down and I think
that had a few frustrationsthere.
We soon picked up on a couplethings the bow wasn't set up
correctly, changed a few thingsout, shortened the draw length

(02:52):
and three hours later, middleevery single shot and I think
confidence has skyrocketed fromthat it did.
She wasn't happy at the start.
She didn't like the change.

Speaker 1 (03:02):
She was looking at the.

Speaker 2 (03:02):
U-Garn.
I don't like this.

Speaker 1 (03:04):
What it looked like from the outside was we
purchased.
The backstory is we purchasedMel's bow from online Just
someone was selling itsecondhand and then we took it
to a well-known archery shop inSydney you might say their name,
but it rhymes with Krabby andthey set it up inverted commas
and it was enough to get ashooting and Mel shot some

(03:25):
rabbits and things and then sheshot a goat the other week.
It was consistently hitting acube target, but it was
inconsistently it wasn'timproving and she was improving,
but all she was doing wasfighting a losing battle.
She was correcting her form inan incorrect direction to make
it shoot slightly better Correctand then, when she looked at it

(03:47):
after she shot a few, you foundsome problems.

Speaker 2 (03:50):
There's a few pretty major things wrong but very
basal to correct, and whenthat's corrected, that bow was
actually performing how itshould and tuned.
So if you're not shooting atuned area, you're going to
fight it the whole way.
Some shots might hit the middle, some won't.
You're not going to know ifyou're shooting well and you're
just going to get frustratedwith it and ultimately I see a

(04:10):
lot of people give the sport upbecause of those frustrations.
That's sad.
You could set someone up with acheap bow or top of the line
bow and if it's not tuned you'rewasting your time, because
that's the importance in itHaving a tuned arrow.
I think it's one of the sportsthat is so technical and it is
so important to get all thatfine tuning correct.
So without that knowledge orknow-how, you don't know what's

(04:33):
not working.

Speaker 1 (04:34):
You don't know what you don't know.
Yeah, it's an important thing,it's an important saying and we
have all learnt a lot this.
I say weekend, but it wasduring the midweek.
But I personally have no bowknowledge.
So she was asking me questionsand I was like I don't know
rifle sawchow and she has thehunting knowledge.
But to understand the parts ofa bow, the names of it, how to

(04:56):
sharpen a broad head arrowlength, the way to set up and
tune your bow, we've covered alot of those things.

Speaker 2 (05:02):
And I think also picking up what in her form is
letting her down.
She now knows how to do that.
She goes.
Oh, that's why that arrow wentthere, because I done X, y and Z
and having that knowledge tosee the problems and correct it
yourself, as opposed to be going.
I didn't hit the middle, don'tknow why.
So I think it's given her a lotof confidence in that now and

(05:23):
she'll want to pursue it a lotfurther as opposed to prior to
the weekend.
She's an amazing shot Hits themiddle on the target.
We're shooting 30 meters andshe's shooting a group the size
of a tennis ball.
Now, yeah, now, whereas beforeI was I hit the target at 30.
Fantastic.

Speaker 1 (05:39):
So that translated then through to some hunting
where we took out and did somepractical stuff and I just
followed behind with the cameraand I got some pretty cool stuff
on footage.
But we did you were, you know,emphasizing just to get closer,
get closer.
Try not to take longer shots.
That's big with me, yeah.

Speaker 2 (05:53):
What's your sort of average shot distance?
Sub 20.
Sub 20.
Typically my bow is not sightedin past 30 meters.
Like I'm bad for that sort ofstuff, like Granted, I probably
should have it sighted in 40, 50, 60 or not.
But to me bow hunting is aboutbeing intimate, being close, and
what really resonates with meis you.
You seek out that old.

(06:13):
This is for me personally.
I love hunting mountain boarsfor everyone home.
If you didn't know my favorite,I'll seek out those old boars.
They're like a ghost to find inthe first instance, very hard
to get onto and the terrain uphere is very mountainous, a lot
of tussig grass, so a lot of theshot, nothing flat.
Yeah, you've established thatand a lot of your shots.

(06:34):
Because of the terrain youphysically have to be so close
because you can't shoot throughtwo and a half foot high tussig
grass or whatever it is.
And on top of that the oldboars are just so tough Like you
can't hit them through one lungin the back of the liver and
expect them to run 150 and pullup and lay under a tree and then
come and finish them off.
They're just going to keepgoing Like you're not going to

(06:55):
recover those animals unless youhit them perfectly.
So your margin for area is alot smaller.
So for me I like the ultimatescenario is you stalk that
animal.
It doesn't know you're there.
You get in sub 20 yards.
You put in one perfect arrow,it'll run less than 30 and fall
over in a matter of seconds.
Ethical, clean, how it shouldbe.
It doesn't get any better forthat for me.

(07:16):
So I would rather forgo anopportunity at 30, 35, whatever
it may be.
Then chance it and get into 14,put that perfect arrow in it
and there is zero guesswork.
Obviously things do go wrongfrom time to time, but I just
like getting in close reallyintimate and your likelihood of
success just goes through theroof and it puts your confidence

(07:38):
up when that's happening everysingle time.

Speaker 1 (07:40):
It does and we saw that with Mel.
She was obviously a little bitbummed when you started tweaking
a bow and she had to learn adifferent form and then she just
shot at the target and it was.
It was consistent,Automatically more accurate and
consistent because her form wasalready consistent and good.
But now the bow was matchingthat and then she went out and
started harvesting animals andthey were all consistent shots.

Speaker 2 (08:00):
And I think one thing Mel said as well to me today
when we were off.
So Mel shot a billy.
It was about five meters.
We were sitting there on oneside of a rock face, we were on
the other and they fed aroundreally windy, so we got away
with a lot and we had to waitfor them to physically turn
because they were all facingaway.
We had a bit of a conversationthere for five minutes with
these goats at five meters.
It was nice and relaxed and shesaid I didn't realise you could

(08:22):
get this close to animals.
I thought it would be like 30meters.
And as they're looking back andshe said I didn't think we'd be
getting this close.
But it's pretty amazing whatyou can do with the right
knowledge.
And granted, we're not fivemeters off a winter, fellow buck
, that's just super switched onor whatever.
But it's the same principlesthat apply.

Speaker 1 (08:39):
Do you think goats are a good place for people to
start in the archery?

Speaker 2 (08:42):
100%.
So a couple reasons Easy tohunt, less switched on, a lot
more numbers there.
So here is a very target, richenvironment.
We've seen hundreds andhundreds of goats, stacks of
pigs, fair few bucks as wellthat we've had a couple
encounters with.
But goats are just great foryour training wheels.
So multiple numbers, they canbe switched on.

(09:03):
But also you will get away witha lot more.
They'll often come out of thatmountainous country,
particularly when it's a littlebit warmer.
They'll come down a lot lowerand also with that they're not
as tough and you can utilise allthe meat, which we've been
doing as well.
So there's a lot of positivesthere.
They typically feed a lotslower.
So the pigs have been huntingand they're very erratic.
You're chasing and you'removing and it's almost stressful

(09:23):
.
So for someone who's justbeginning hunting to have that
young nanny goat or that youngbelly goat that's just mooching
along and you can stalk in niceand slowly run through the
process and like, okay, we'regoing to come over this rise.
It'll be 15 yards.
I want you to draw back, stepout, take your time, go through
your shot sequence.
You can do that, whereas on apig it's like he's going to be

(09:44):
trotting across here.
I'm going to pull him up.
It's going to be rushed.
That's not the nicestintroduction, especially for
beginners too.
For someone totally green to itit's really nice.
And the fact that we can justsimply just do multiple stalks
even if it was like Susie, shejust had a couple of stalks and
wasn't comfortable in shootingto start with we could go
through that process, get withinbow range and just get a

(10:05):
comfortable and familiar withthat process over and over again
multiple times in one morning.

Speaker 1 (10:09):
And there's one today where she drew back and had to
let down, just didn't present.

Speaker 2 (10:12):
Yep, and that was all on her own Repetition and
learning, yeah, so it'sfantastic for that.

Speaker 1 (10:17):
And also, even if you do bump them and they spot you,
they don't run three hills away.

Speaker 2 (10:22):
Yeah, so this place is not very pressured,
particularly the goats.
They get left alone a lot.
So when the animals aren'tpressured they're not going to
go over boondi scrub.
They might pull up and youmight get that other opportunity
on them.
So it's really good for that.
It's ideal for beginnersrealistically.

Speaker 1 (10:38):
Yeah, and that's what we're here for.
It was a beginner's coursewhere three ladies come one.
No introduction to bows prior,never shot one One.
Suzie had traditional archery alittle bit and then just moved
into compounds.
She picked up a compound.

Speaker 2 (10:52):
I think less than a week ago.
So she picked she I mentionedthat we had a space become
available on this week.
We had another girl drop outand Suzie had come to an open
day we'd done last year Messagedher, I said, hey, we've got
this opening for you.
I think it'd be a greatopportunity.
She jumped on it and she went.
Do you think I should get intocompound or repeat the recurve
and we sort of run through thepros and cons.

(11:13):
A couple of days later she'slike okay, I'm in, Set me up a
compound.
She picked it up five or sixdays ago.
You know, like we wereliterally she'd been shooting at
target, hadn't been siding inor anything, and we've sited her
bow in here this weekend andwent through the form.
She's harvested three animals,sort of free to full of meat,
shooting accurately, has a shotsequence and has a hell of a lot

(11:34):
more confidence and know how.
Yeah, like she's literally wejust done a go and Suzie done
90% of it.
You know, got skinning.

Speaker 1 (11:42):
It was good to sit back and watch.
I actually sat back on a chairand watch Mel and Suzie do the
the gutting and the skinning, soand three days ago she'd never
even seen it.

Speaker 2 (11:51):
Yeah, so it was pretty.

Speaker 1 (11:52):
Yeah, it was great.

Speaker 2 (11:54):
And particularly for the girls, because I feel in
Australia there's not much forfemales to go out and do that.
So I think that's definitelysomething we want to explore and
get more girls into it.
I agree.

Speaker 1 (12:04):
Suzie spoke about this earlier too was that she
felt a lot more comfortabledoing it because there wasn't a
male in.
I mean, I was here, you werehere, that's fine, but it wasn't
a competition.
It was you and I were.
You were guiding, I wasbackseat, she wasn't shooting
against anyone.
Yeah, and not that we onpurposely do that, but that's
what she would have felt.

Speaker 2 (12:24):
But we can be intimidating as males for sure.

Speaker 1 (12:26):
Not on purpose, sometimes on purpose, but not on
purpose.
So she felt really comfortabledoing that with the girls and
that was she grew.
She grew a lot faster becauseof that.

Speaker 2 (12:36):
And I think with that as well, like they were high
five on each other and hadlittle girls groups.
Yeah and I think it'll createthat little, that sense of
community or culture with that,which I think is very important
to foster and grow that passionwithin the outdoors or hunting,
whatever it may be, becausethey're going to connect after
this and we'll just foster thateven further.
Stim-roll, yeah, yeah.
Otherwise it's like how doesshe connect with another chick

(12:58):
who hunts, like that's?
You know it's a little bittaboo here in Australia it's not
celebrated as much,particularly in females.
So I think having or being ableto be in those environments and
align with others who havesimilar values and want to do
what you want to do, that'spretty cool to be able to create
.

Speaker 1 (13:13):
It was cool to see, and obviously you had Sarah here
this weekend.
She's, you know, got someexperience overseas as well, in
Australia, and shot a few thingswith a bow.
Yeah, and to see her go outwith them was cool as well.
No, it was really good.
It was a very proud moment forme.

Speaker 2 (13:26):
So, like she's taken to like a fish to water with the
hunting side of things she's abetter shot with a bow than me.
But yeah, it's awesome to seeher take the girls out and be
successful.
And yes, we harvested animals.
But that's not really thesuccess of the weekend.
I think it was gaining theconfidence, learning, being
comfortable in front of animals,like I think that's the main

(13:46):
thing with the girls, everyonein particular that starts is
they get in front of that animaland the nerves just start and
you just get tunnel vision andthere's an explosion in your
brain.
So the fact that we've got themall in front, introduced them
to that feeling multiple timesto get their confidence up,
that's to me is a big success,you know.
But on top of that, everyone'sharvested multiple animals yeah,

(14:07):
even Carla, who had not shot acompound bow 72 hours ago.

Speaker 1 (14:13):
That's pretty wild.
Yeah, you know, it's atestament to your bow.
Setting up skills to me?
Oh, I'm sure yeah.

Speaker 2 (14:19):
Anyone can shoot a bow of its setup correctly and
you have your lower archcoaching.
Like.
I'm no whiz with technicaltarget archery, anything like
that.
I like to keep it very simple,get close, but the fundamentals
are all the same.

Speaker 1 (14:31):
You know, I know you like to think that you don't.

Speaker 2 (14:33):
You definitely know a lot, a little bit, not a lot.
I definitely don't know a lot,but I, what I think about and
what I've said to the girls isjust get closer.
What about if this happens?
What if it's windy?
What if I'm not confident?
Or get closer, we'll get closer, and that is what I will revert
back to.
This will be a hat slogan.
Yeah, get closer.
I will revert back to thatconstantly.

(14:54):
You know, if you're notcomfortable at 20, we'll get to
15.
And then you're likely heard ofsuccess is going to go far
higher.
So that's that's.
I try and practice what Ipreach with that.
And just, I don't think one ofthe girls of the further shot we
had this weekend was on the Foxmail, shot 22 and a half.

Speaker 1 (15:13):
That was her text.
I was not here last night, well, yeah.
Well, well.

Speaker 2 (15:18):
I was at the hospital .

Speaker 1 (15:20):
Certain reasons.
But she texted and I said, howwas the fox?
And said a highlight of thetrip.
Yeah right, so nice.
Yeah, I wasn't there for it.
So how did that play?

Speaker 2 (15:29):
Yeah, so we were driving along up the track and
cameraman here was in hospitalgetting tend to do his words.
It was probably the only reasonyou saw the animal.

Speaker 1 (15:35):
Yeah, it wasn't there to scare.

Speaker 2 (15:36):
Mel tapped me on the shoulder Fox, and I looked to my
left and as we were driving upit's a pretty steep track there
was the young dog fox justsitting there sort of looking at
us, and there was a big treejust to his right.
And so I went forward aboutanother four or five meters, put
the fox behind the tree,stopped the car, turned it off
and I didn't see the fox run offand I said, oh, that might say
that I was like just get out,real quietly.

(15:57):
I got out the driver's door andI crawled under the car so I
wouldn't be seen around thefront.
Got up in there, mel put anarrow on and this tree was about
a meter wide, maybe a bit more,so it was blocking the fox's
view of us.
I said what I want you to do isput an arrow on and then we're
going to step out.
And Mel was, she was a littlebit nervous.
She's like I can't see it.
I'm like I don't even know ifit's there still, but you're

(16:18):
going to step out and you'regoing to be full draw and when
you see that fox then you'regoing to be ready.
So she's like, okay, okay.
She stepped out and I was likecan you see it?
She's like yes.
So I let out the side and I seethe fox's foot and she's like
how far?
And I was clicking the rangefor under, and how far was it?
22 and a half meters.
So I was like, yep, 22 and ahalf.
She's like okay, okay, wentthrough a shot sequence was nice
and calm smoked it straightthrough the chest.

(16:39):
Fox, went down on the spot,shot the front door, high fives
and shows, ecstatic.
It was really cool.
So, and from seeing her to notbe confident at shooting 20, to
then 10, ring a fox at 22 and ahalf, really tough uphill shot
on a small target, so good, andshe was ecstatic.

Speaker 1 (16:58):
Yeah, and her reaction was matched up.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (17:01):
Yeah, it was great.
It was probably my highlight ofthe weekend as well, her
getting that fox, you know, justbecause it was so different as
well as it was a target speciestoo.
Yeah, it was a challenging shot, uphill how we seen it.
Yeah, everything made it prettycool.

Speaker 1 (17:13):
Suzie's taken some of the meat home too.
So if we never hear from Suzieagain, we have a cry of act fox
legs in the bag.

Speaker 2 (17:18):
I don't know how I feel about that but they're
going home.

Speaker 1 (17:21):
We'll let you know how that goes.
We've got the skin as well.
We've got a Pelt as well.
Suzie's been a good fan oftaking everything home, so
nothing really got wasted thisweekend.
I would say nothing's beenwasted this weekend Bones and
skulls and horns for dogs.

Speaker 2 (17:33):
Everything's farm has got a few carcasses as well.
Feed his dogs.

Speaker 1 (17:37):
Yeah, why pigs for you?
Obviously, we've spent most ofthis time this week chasing the
goats, but when we're out there,I can hear you like, oh, you
know, we're going to go and getsome goats.
But then there's pigs and yourvoice changes, the way you act
change, and you don't evenclarify, classify them as the
same sort of animal.
They're not.
So again, when did this start?

(17:58):
When did the pig obsessionstart?

Speaker 2 (17:59):
Honestly, from when I was young.
So I had no direct introductionto hunting.
So my father grew up huntingand fishing.
He had guns and whatnot Used togo pig shooting all the time
out west and you know that wasmore coloring of numbers and
things.
And I remember I'd look at theold photos printed out as a kid,
like when I was like three,four and I just I wanted to do
that and I think it was becausedata give his guns up, didn't

(18:23):
have the access anymore.
I really wanted to do it and Iwas so curious about it, went
fishing heaps as well.
So I was into the outdoorsmassively.
We grew up in a little bit ofproperty and I just kept
gravitating that and I juststarted doing that and because I
didn't have the opportunity,you know I wanted to do it so,
so badly.
Fast forward a few years,started by making bows as a kid
and just mucking around shootingrabbits and it just really

(18:45):
progressed from that and it justalways drew back to pig hunting
.
You know, eventually startedhunting, chop pigs, goats, blah,
blah, blah and I just keptgravitating towards boars.
They're elusive, they'recunning, they're tough, they're
pretty much the ultimate animalto bow hunting.
My opinion and it's funny,everyone would be like, oh, pigs

(19:05):
are dumb, they're this, they'rethat, they're stupid.
And it's like 90% of peoplewill not even see the boars that
are on their property and don'tknow what lives on there,
because they are so elusive.
You know those fleeting minutesof daylight.
You've got to be very specificto hunt them.
Yes, they don't have theeyesight of deer, but to me
they're far more elusive.
They get the age on them.

(19:27):
That gives you that challengeand, like I was telling you this
morning, you have to treat themor hunt them like a different
species.
There's pigs and then there'sold boars.
Like they are not the same.
You know, an old boar will notassociate with any other animals
unless there's a sow in heat,then obviously he's going to be
going there for that reason.
Typically he won't, unless it'sthe winter months and it's a

(19:49):
really cagey boar and this hasto do with hunting pressure as
well.
You won't see him in thedaylight hours.
You might see him in that graylight and he's making his way
somewhere.
They're just paranoid.
They're super tough and youhave to be really close to
shooting them and I like that.
And it's often fast paced, highpressure make or break
situations, how you're huntingthem.

(20:10):
You know all glass from oneside of a mountain to the other,
so I can see the whole face weset.
Off that face you can probablysee two and a half kilometers of
mountain and I can see everynook and cranny on that, so to
speak.
There'll be 15 minutes of lightleft and here comes Mr Boar how
did the thick scrub?
And he'll just be on a mission,going somewhere, trotting.
It's like okay, I think he'sgoing here, I've got to

(20:31):
intercept him.
I've got 15 minutes of lightleft.
Go, get your jaw gone.
Yeah, and nine times out of 10,it doesn't work.
But when it does work you'll bethere.
You're hard to be racing.
You'll get there.
You'll see him coming in and betrotting in.
He'll stop and feed, lookaround every three seconds, keep
going, keep going.
And a lot of times you'llintercept them and shoot them at
sub 15 yards.
You know that's a typicalafternoon hunt for me.

(20:53):
Obviously there are times whenthey're relaxed and whatnot, but
I just love everything aboutthem.
They're just so cagey, so wittyand super tough.
Like if you do a marginal shoton an old boar, you're not
getting him back.
You're just not getting himback.

Speaker 1 (21:06):
It's kill shot only.

Speaker 2 (21:07):
Yeah, and they live in thicker terrain as well, so
it could be dead in a log 100meters away.
How soon They've got thatfighting pad on them.
A lot of the time there's not ablood trail.
You're not going to find them.
Whereas you see a deer, it'sgot a antler sticking out of the
grass typically, or it's abigger animal stands higher.
It's just all those factors puttogether to me.
I love hunting them.

Speaker 1 (21:28):
And you've named a few some of you are trying to
chase.
Is there any that particularlystick out?
I can think of one.
Was it the three?
Tusked one or something?
Was that the usual?

Speaker 2 (21:36):
No, that was a lamb Lamb shot there, yeah, so it had
like a tusk growing out thebottom of its mount.
I saw the skull once, yeah.

Speaker 1 (21:42):
That was pretty cool, but has there been any that you
know?
It's taken you a few years toget onto yeah.

Speaker 2 (21:45):
So there's one up the back of the mountain we call
the snowman.
He's a big spotted thing I comeacross last year.
There was a rutting mob and ithad some really handy boards in
there, nice tusky pigs, and Iwas going in on those way out
the back of the property, in theflat stuff actually in the
creek.
Mel would like it and I wasgoing in up there and there was
a.
There was a goat up to the rightand I was going in on this mob
and this goat was coming in downthe trail and I was like, oh,

(22:08):
it'll be right.
And I was stopping, waiting forthe wind, had the wind cutting
down to my left mob in front ofme late afternoon, thermals
sucking down like beauty, I'mgoing to slip in and try and
shoot one of these balls.
And this goat was coming downthis pad.
There was a gully and he was onthe other side of the gully,
coming down the pad sort oftowards me, and it was like, oh
yeah, glassed up a few pigs,picked out the one I wanted.

(22:28):
He was probably a five year oldboar, perfect, going in, now
stopped.
And I was just, I think I wasjust waiting for something,
maybe some routes to go throughsomething, and I looked at this
goat coming down.
It wasn't a goat, it was a boarand it was just.
It was standing so high.
I just discarded it, becauseyou do get goats up there, and I
just thought it was a black andwhite billy and I looked at
this thing in my eyes and hefell in my head and I fumbled

(22:49):
the binos up and I was like holydemon, what is this thing?
And he was unusually tall,unusually tall, like just a
different class of pig.
You know, he was well, well,well over that 100 kilo mark.
And for those that have seenmountain boars, they're just all
shoulders, just tanks.
Big male hawk, all shouldersinch of ivory hanging over the
top of his grinders, likeeverything I look for, like if I

(23:11):
can tick all the boxes, tickall of the boxes, exactly what I
was after.
And it's like where'd you comefrom?
How have I not seen you in thelast six months?
You know, because I've been outthere hunting a lot and it's
obviously a in season South.
Drawn him out in a daytime.
Anyway, I had him coming downthe pad at 30 yards and he was
pretty much going to walk pastabout 15, 18 meters on the pad.

(23:34):
I was just hunkered down in thetusset grass and with that
particular boar I ended upwinding more pigs down below me
but I didn't know where they'reand they blew up the creek and
took him with them.
And I've seen that boar twiceand haven't been able to see him
again in six or nine months.
So still hope.
Oh, he'll be out there.
He'll be out there, it's justhaven't had the right conditions

(23:55):
.
I didn't hunt it this winter asmuch as I typically do, but
next winter I'll probably runinto him.
But I've sort of resigned thefact that I won't see him over
the summer months.
No, those winter ball yeah, allthose like all my success.
I hunt a lot more in winter,but you get a lot more success
in winter because the conditionsbecome more favorable to us to
hunt them.

(24:15):
So the colder weather.
So your best boar hunting istypically no, this is my
favorite.
No moon, as cold as it can get.
Rain, overnight preferable.
So they're like us, they liketo be comfortable.
But those boars are reallytough.
They will be nocturnal, unlessthey have to be one.
No moon.

Speaker 1 (24:33):
So they have to come out during the day.

Speaker 2 (24:34):
Well, no moon is and this is my belief with it is
they will travel less distance.
Their visibility is lower, sotherefore their ability to
forage and feed is not at fullcapacity as if it was under a
full moon.
So they're not spending allnights snacking.
Yeah Well, they can't go andtravel as far to do that.
So therefore to get their fillthey have to come out in the day
.
So you combine that with coldweather.

(24:57):
I've found over the years thatonce you get starting below
minus two, minus three, thatreally starts making pigs bed up
in the night.
They want to be warm in theirbeds and then in the daytime
they're going to go out and feedbecause they're nice and
comfortable.
This all comes with no pressureas well, so I really try not to
pressure the animals here, sothey feel comfortable and they
don't have to stick to thatnocturnal pattern.
And then overcast weather, sono moon, and particularly if

(25:19):
it's really cold or rainsovernight, they want to be
comfortable and they want to becomfortable and those big boars
eventually will suck up, laydown, be nice and warm in their
beds overnight and they're likeI'm going to come out and feed
throughout the day.
So overcast weather pigs hate.
They're like vampires.
They will not be on themountain if there's sun on it,
like they just don't want tomention something.

Speaker 1 (25:37):
If there's not shadows on the side of the hill,
there's, don't look there.

Speaker 2 (25:40):
That's typically like like I'll bring guys here and
they'll be like, oh, when are wegoing to go for the afternoon
hunts of my favorites?
And like when that sun goesover that mountain and not a
moment sooner because we'reprobably not going to see
anything.
You'll see young pigs, for sure, but not that target, not that
older class.
But in that overcast thosewinter days I will stay out all
day behind the glass looking forboars.

(26:00):
So that's funny.
It's not like on first light.
They're going to be out justmoving around, feeding and
targeting them.
Often it's the middle of theday so they're bettered up
overnight.
They don't want to come outmiddle of.
You'll be on the glass andyou'll see other pigs out.
The roos will get up as the daywarms up and those first rays of
light or the little animals aregetting warm.
They'll all be on those Easternfacing slopes getting warm and

(26:23):
then it might be 10 o'clock inthe morning and you just look
out in the middle of a paddockand a big boar will just appear
and he will feed for 20, 30minutes and go away again and
then a couple of hours laterhe'll go out and feed again.
They sort of speed feedintermittently and very
sporadically across the mountainand you can just catch them out
in the most random spots in themiddle of the day and some of

(26:45):
my best boars in winter would beshot at one two o'clock just in
the middle of a tussle grassbench and it's like where did
you come from?
And he'll go out and feed thereand he'll just really
aggressively feed and then he'llgo back to his little bed he's
got and that for me in winter iswhy I have more success in the
winter months.

Speaker 1 (27:01):
You mentioned one particular boar that would feed
around 200 meters.

Speaker 2 (27:06):
Yeah, so that was interesting.
So a lot of the time when youtalk about boars, I'm talking
about boars that are over that,like five, six year mark.
You know those older classmature.
Your class is a differentanimal.
They're paranoid, like they'llbe totally unalert.
Nothing around them, no birdsalarming, and they're just
throwing their head up everycouple of seconds, throwing
their head up, looking around,real paranoid, particularly if

(27:29):
they come out and they're likethis is too early in the day.
A lot of the time you'll evensee them come out and go nah, go
back into cover and then halfan hour later then they'll come
out.
You see that a lot.
But there was this particularboar here a hundred, a few times
and he would feed, look aroundand then just run a hundred or
200 yards without seeing it.

Speaker 1 (27:48):
Without seeing it.
Watching this through the glass.

Speaker 2 (27:49):
I was watching him from the scope and he'd run and
then stop again and just pull upand feed, and he would do this
and it's only what I can believeis as a technique, because it's
kept him alive, you know.
So he would literally feed fora couple of minutes, he'd take
off to the next spot, get toanother point of safety, exhaust
whatever safety he thought hehad there and would move to the
next spot, and he was so hard tokill.

(28:10):
I ended up shooting him acouple of months later and it
wasn't.
I'd seen this a couple of timesuntil I picked up on.
He's not actually gettingspooked, he's just doing this as
a safety mechanism.
I haven't seen others do that,but they are very cagey in the
fact that they don't like to bein the one spot too often.
They're often on the move,unless they're very relaxed,

(28:31):
like sometimes you will get on aboar and it would just be.
He'll be comfortable, content.
He's in a nice quiet spot, outof the wind and he would just be
digging a hole, digging,digging, digging, digging,
whereas other times they're onthe move, like you'll see him,
and they're going from point Ato point B and it's like I don't
know where you're going, butI'm going to try and keep up
Over morning.
A lot of the time you're chasingpigs back to their bed, so
you're following along behindthem.

(28:52):
It's very hard to shoot them.
You're trying to shoot themwhen they quarter or you can't
pull them up a lot of the time,because a pig is not like a deer
in the fact that they'reinquisitive, they're curious.
They'll use their eyesight totheir advantage.
So a pig has poor eyesightcompared to deer.
In fact, step on a stick.
You're 80 yards off a buck.
It's going to swing its headaround and it's going to
pinpoint exactly where you areand it's going to figure you out

(29:14):
.
And you know they're going tobe looking back and forth and
they're going to really figureyou out and then go yep, there's
danger.
Then they'll go.
Step on a stick.
A boar goes.
I don't have enough eyesight totell what that is.
I'm not even going to botherturning around, I'm just going
to run away.
So that's run, and oftentimesit won't be anything.
It might be a stick full out ofa tree, something like that,
and they'll just won't even lookback to see what it was and

(29:36):
that keeps them alive.
It was super quiet, yeah, andwith those old pigs, with that
you can't pull them up sometimes, or I I don't like to,
particularly if they're veryalert.
You know you might give thelittle dropping noise like it's
another pig or something likethat.
But With a buck you can do call.
With a goat you can bleed at itand you know you're pretty

(29:56):
confident they're gonna pull upand have a bit of a look.
I've done it at times before.
Where boars are moving through,do a little, now take off, and
it's like I Made a pig noise andthey've run away, you know.
So that just adds anotherelement to it.
A lot of the times you'reshooting them on the move and
Again, like for the tusset grasswe went through, there'll be
two foot of tusset grass and youcan see the pig through it, but

(30:20):
you can't see the vitals andyour visualizing where you need
to aim, assuming, and thatbrings a lot of people unstuck,
and it's a very challengingaspect, particularly late
afternoon, when that you'reracing that light and it's
fading away.
Can you explain the?

Speaker 1 (30:31):
trick with the stick and the what people shoot.

Speaker 2 (30:35):
Oh yeah, okay so this is just something that was a
test scenario that you set up,yeah, so what I find with when
people Shoot through the grassis I'll always hit at the very
top of the grass.
They'll get scared to shootthrough that or Say you've got a
shoulder and there's a treeblocking the pigs head in front
of the shoulder.
So the vitals and the stomachare there and you might have to
shoot two inches to the right ofthe tree.

(30:55):
The tree is blocking the headin the front of the scapula,
where there's no vitals.
You're not gonna be aiminganyway.
You'll find that people willshoot eight inches back and
overcompensate for that.
So I set this up on the targetfor the girls yesterday.
They're all shooting in the dot.
You know like 15 meters, 20meters shooting.
They're all shooting in themiddle of the dot.
I just simply put a big stickto the right of the dot.
We're aiming at the dot anywayand this stick is an inch to the

(31:17):
right.
Everyone hit three inches tothe left.
Just because of that mentalthing obscuring.
I'm like, don't worry about thestick, but when you're aiming
you're like, oh, I better nothit that.
So you're gonna aim evenfurther away.
So I think that brings a lot ofpeople unstuck Aiming like that
a lot of the time you have toshoot through the grass, and
I'll shoot at the top of thegrass.
Often that's just through thetop of the back in no man's land

(31:40):
.
So it's very hard to do ifyou're not used to it.

Speaker 1 (31:43):
What are some other things that bring beginners
unstuck?
No, but well yeah, buying apoorly set up bugs yeah.

Speaker 2 (31:52):
No, I think the biggest thing with being a good
bow hunter is understandinganimal behavior and being calm.
When the timer rises, you knowyou've got your shot sequence,
you can shoot the target, yourgear is tuned, everything.
It's good to go, because you'rewanting that so badly, that
opportunity, and it's almostlike an intense silence.

(32:13):
You there, those nerves aregoing through.
You'll want it so badly.
People just get tunnel visionand it's that Not being focused,
going through their shotsequence and just not even
rushing.
It's.
They don't even realize they'renot doing five out of their ten
points in their checklist andgoing.
I Can't remember what happened.

Speaker 1 (32:32):
I saw that Carla came back from one of the stalks
yesterday and she pulled back onsomething which had a finger in
front of the trigger.

Speaker 2 (32:38):
Yeah, as you pull back, it goes about that far and
arrow flings off, and she'dnever done that on the target,
no, so just the emotion was aadrenaline at the time.
Hmm, I don't.
Until you get in thosesituations, as in someone who's
never hunted before, it's verydifficult to explain it to
someone to go look, this isgoing to be the most adrenaline
you've ever had searched throughyour body, it's going to be
uncontrollable.
You're gonna have the IQ of apotato and you just got to do

(33:02):
your best like.
You can't explain that to themuntil you experience it.
So I think a different feelingit is, it is, and it's very hard
to collect your thoughts and bepresent in those times.
So I think being present andconcise and making Smart
decisions, that's how peopleimprove.
But you can only improve thatby putting yourself in those
situations.
Practice.
We can all shoot the target andget that repetition.
Yes, that's very important, butI think there's more to being a

(33:24):
good hunter that's out there inthe field as opposed to getting
at the target.
And there's there's a fewtrains of thoughts with that.
Sorry for keeping you man.
Few trains of thought of a fewhills.
There's a few trains of thoughtwith that.
Like, obviously accuracy isvery important.
I would never recommend anyonegoing out and shooting past
their effective distance, butthat simple getting closer and

(33:48):
helps eliminate all of thosethings from that.
That's why I'm such a bigadvocate for it.
Like if, if the girls areshooting at 20 which everyone
was shooting really good groupsat 20 meters, I wanted everyone
sub 15, 10 meters, if we could,just so it's guaranteed you get
that first kill under your belt,confidence skyrockets.
That's what you want for peoplestarting out.
So, and that's what we got thisweekend.

Speaker 1 (34:09):
What's a long shot for you?
30?

Speaker 2 (34:11):
Yeah that's just getting there.
I've shot Buffett 40, but againa buffalo is to be a target.
The buffalo is a buffalo, it'sa pig at 10.
Yeah, I just don't like Redsdag sub to have shot reds dag at
6 and 20 and 14 meters.
A lot of my best fellow.

(34:31):
All of them have been sub 20.
I Think I have a moreaggressive.
I know I have a more aggressivehunting style, like it's make
or break and I'll get in there,but I just don't.
It's not me like just flickingan arrow at something like that.
Animals not gonna evaporate ifI don't shoot it like it's still

(34:52):
out there.
I am fortunate with this access.
I've got soul access here so ifI don't shoot this animal this
month I might be able to shootit next month or I might be able
to shoot in the right it's notlike a state for a situation,
yeah.
So I think Opportunity for mehelps with that and obviously
I've shot.
I've been very fortunate.
I've harvested a lot of animals, particularly boars.

(35:12):
Do you ever count?
No, maybe on the days, but no.

Speaker 1 (35:19):
They're a particularly good day.

Speaker 2 (35:23):
The most of boars I've ever shot in a day, like
good quality Tuskey boars wasthree in an afternoon and that
was like that's a good guy.
Yeah, like because they're notclose, no, they're big days Like
I'll do some days over 30kilometers up here, five, six,
seven hundred floors on real bigdays.
You know, like it's hard jacket, it's not easy.
But to me, like if I had aspell last winter where I went

(35:48):
seven weeks without finding ashooter boar and I was here
three days a week and I rememberwhen I finally shot, when I was
on the phone to Jack and I waslike man, I just don't know what
I'm doing wrong.
I just can't find a boar.
I'm seeing sign, I'm hearingrunning like I know they're here
, I just can't find him.
Like I was just doing all thewrong moves and it was a lot of.
It was pure luck as well, a bitsituational, and I just could

(36:09):
not find a shooter boar.
And I was it's in the middle ofwinter like prime hunting at
the hunted should be here.
I'd hunted 20 plus 25 days, youknow, and not seen a shooter
boar and this place has gotheaps and I said to him I was
going to come home he's like whythe store's all good, I got it
all covered, just stay thereuntil you shoot one.
Like you've been, you've waitedall winter to shoot one to stay

(36:31):
there, and that afternoon Ishot a really good boar, but it
was like I went seven weekswithout seeing a shooter.
But I'm also okay with that.

Speaker 1 (36:38):
You had the restraint to hold back from not shooting
the young ones.
You've got to.
You know your own personalmantra and not shooting young
boars, but I don't need to shootsomething.

Speaker 2 (36:46):
It's not about that either.
Like if I don't have the rightanimal in front of me, I don't
need to draw my baby and shootit.

Speaker 1 (36:51):
I asked you today what sort of animals you chased,
and you said I'd ratheradventure.
Yeah, it wasn't an animal.

Speaker 2 (36:55):
It was adventure, yeah, yeah.
I think the process and thepeople you deal with and the
places you go to, that to me nowlike back in the day when I
started, like you know what it'slike.
You want to get that trophyright yeah, so and like this, I
still like that.
Like if I see a big boar I getso excited, like we see one with
the girls, and I was like thegirls are trying to shoot a
little slip for me, and therewas like a eight or nine year

(37:18):
old tusky boar that literallywas missing half his fur.
He was that old and his earsflopped over his head and I was
like, oh you, sure you don'twant to shoot that one.
I can still get like that everytime I see him.
But for me like more theadventure side of it now, like
New Zealand, I really enjoy NewZealand.
Going back over to America in acouple of days five, six days,
till I fly out with Sarah I'mexcited for that.

(37:41):
Going back over to Africa withRASAP, backcountry Africa that's
always an epic time up there.
That's what excites me a lotmore.
I have started harvesting a lotmore meat and things like that
now, typically, particularly onthis property.
I never harvested deer becauseI wanted the numbers to
establish.
When I first hunted here therewas no deer.
Five years ago there was fivebucks on this property.

(38:01):
Now there might be 60.
So I'm happy to start shootingthose animals.
But it's more the adventureside of things now.
You know, like I love packingfor a trip into the unknown,
into New Zealand, or you don'tknow what's going to happen.
Things go wrong.
You fix it.
It all becomes part of thestory, like that's good for me.

Speaker 1 (38:21):
On your story.
You just mentioned Jack and theshop.
How did the shop come about andwhat led up to the, the point
where now you own a bow huntingonly shop?

Speaker 2 (38:31):
So by name and nature .
So, um, frustration led me tostarting bow hunting only so
I've had the brands.
I started Oscut Broadheads in2014.
That was my baby recently soldthat last year.
Moved on, I do have anotherbrand of broadheads coming that
you've seen.
I have Nexus Bow Hunting aswell.

(38:53):
Started that in four or so yearsago I couldn't tell you off the
top of my head and we're alwaysin that sphere.
They're always communicatingwith the community and
everything like that.
We're always happy to helppeople with their setups.
You know we sell broadheads andarrows.
That's what we've done.
We have the studio there.
But people would message us hey,what gear should I use for this
?
I'm having this issue withtuning XYZ and I was happy to

(39:16):
help out along the way whilst wewere doing the arrows and
broadheads, and I wouldcontinually recommend gear and
I'd put in a lot of work and go.
Here's a list of XYZ of what Irecommend.
This is what I use and I giveit to people and they take it to
the archery store, huntingstore, whatever, and go I need
this and that was I was happy todo it.
You know, I'd invest a week ortwo talking to all these people

(39:37):
give them all this informationand they go out and get the gear
and then they would come backand go hey, I'm still struggling
with this and there was a fewinstances when we had our first
warehouse and it wasn't reallyopen to the public or anything
but guys would be like, hey, canI pick my order up?
And it sort of turned into canyou look at this on my bow?
And it was just nightmare stuffjust like brand new bows not

(39:59):
set up correctly, peeps not tiedin, incorrect draw lengths,
incorrect arrow setups, justvery disappointing in the setup,
and people were very frustratedwith the custom service they
were getting and I got to thepoint where I was like I'm sick
of this.
I would like to start out astore with dedicated bow hunting

(40:20):
knowledge, gear and advice frompeople that do it.
You know there's a lot ofpeople that work in certain
retail outlets that don't huntbut will give hunting advice,
and to me that's quite foreign.
You don't go to a fishing shopand the guy at the counter
doesn't fish you know.

Speaker 1 (40:37):
So you don't sell target archery stuff.

Speaker 2 (40:39):
No get it hunting only.
But I think it's good, like ifyou've got guys starting out and
saying, hey, what do yourecommend for fallow, what do
you shoot bores with?
Or I'm going to the northernterritory to hunt a buffalo.
What do you use to shoot yourbuffalo?
Let's build an arrow.
Yeah, well, this is what I use.
You know you can give firsthand advice and I just think we

(41:00):
have a want to.
So just to digress a little bit, jack has been with me from
nexus and oscar from day onepretty well.
So he's jack crick.
Um, he's in bow hunting onlywith me, who both own that store
, and we're just reallypassionate about setting people
up correctly, you know, um,doing things right and making
sure they get the most out oftheir setup and they enjoy it.

(41:22):
Because, like with mel, she hada setup.
She was getting frustrated withit.
Ultimately, that lead to peopleputting down a bow and going.
I'm not going to do thisbecause she was like I said yeah
, and I could tell that she wasfrustrated.
We fixed it in three hours andthere's a renewed passion there.
She had gears working correctly.
So that's what that's what bowhunting only is about.
So that first hand knowledgeand advice, all of the gear we

(41:45):
have in I would say 95 percentof the gear we have in store
we've all personally used incombatch.
Well, we don't have the biggestrange, but I know if I hand
someone a product, I've used it,jack used it, or one of the
boys have used it, and it'ssolid and reliable.
We don't just stock productsthat we don't know about and
there's products that I won'tstock because I don't believe
they're of quality that peopleshould use, not a benefit.
Yeah, so it's going really well.

(42:06):
We've got an awesome communitythere.
I believe we do a good job,offer a lot of value.
We've run a few events andwe're looking at doing a lot
more sort of open days andcommunity things down the track
that we can.
So I think it's been a net winfor the Australian bow hunting
community yeah, well, I've seenthat on the public side of.

Speaker 1 (42:22):
We see them in the forums and the facebook pages.
People are starting to mentionit more often.
And where do you get that from?
Oh, up at.
This is place at Newcastle.

Speaker 2 (42:29):
Yeah, where are you?
Actually based Thornton justoutside of Newcastle.
Yeah, in between Sydney andNewcastle, so it's pretty good
locality just close off thehighway.

Speaker 1 (42:36):
Yeah, yeah, it's great.
Yeah, so I haven't had a chanceto get up there and have a look
yet, but I'm looking forward toMonday, soon one of your events
up there we've done somethingpretty cool.
Anyway, we did some more cool.
This is probably more cool thanhanging around the shop,
definitely, but this coursewe're on now.
Is it something you're lookingat doing a few more definitely
so.

Speaker 2 (42:52):
We chatted a little bit about this.
I've offered guided hunts onand off.
Like I get hit up a lot aboutit, like I have guys going hey,
I want to shoot a big TuskeyMountain boar and I'll do a
handful of hunts every year, twoor three at the most, typically
on this place, mainly through.
That's me not wanting to managemy numbers.
I don't just want to go shootall my boars, you know, and now
your?

Speaker 1 (43:11):
boars yeah, like you've said, soul access, and if
you've also told me somestories about people wounding
stuff, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (43:18):
So that's part of it, though so that's mainly out of
a management reason.
But we get a lot of people andparticularly when we've had to
store, a lot of people wantingto get into it, not having the
opportunities, the access, theknow-how or what to do.
Going where do I start?
And I've really enjoyed, Ireally enjoy beginners and

(43:39):
teaching their ropes, seeingthem start from zero experience
to going home Seeing that thisweek.
Yeah, exactly what this weekendis Going home successful, met in
the freezer, big, deep dive,immersive event with a lot of
confidence that they're going tobe able to take and use and be
more successful in their futureendeavors hunting, you know.
So I definitely want to do alot more of the beginner stuff.

(44:01):
I think this place is perfectto do it because of the game
rich environment that we have.
It's big enough to do so.
We've got accommodation,everything's there, the right
recipes for it, and I really geta kick out of doing it and,
like Sarah, doing it with thegirls here as well.
I think that's another avenuethat we can sort of bring out,
like I've already.
I was checking my messages whenwe had service before.

(44:23):
I had a few people messagingsaying, hey, my partner would be
super interested in this.
Are you going to do more ofthese for the girls events?
Blah, blah, blah.
I've got a few more beginners.
I want to get into it.
How can I do this, you know?
So it's definitely somethingI'm going to pursue a lot
further and I think I can bringvalue to people that way and I
enjoy it and sort of brought abit of passion back to it
Because, like I've been sort ofin the archery hunting sphere

(44:46):
now for close to 10 years.
So and obviously passions comeand go and, you know, get a
little bit burnt out, which Idid over the last 18 months and
I've sort of used that time toreset and whatnot, started bow
hunting.
Only that took a big chunk ofenergy, but I think that's
definitely an avenue that willincorporate with the store.
You know those beginnerstailored packages to do that.

Speaker 1 (45:09):
We can see it Like.
We can see your passion bothyou and Sarah very different
people in the way that you guideand hunt.
Yeah, she's very calculated andmethodical and you'll just run
I'm a Nick and then we have tokeep up.
But it's resolved, you knowwe've got results.
And there's more than I might aswell.
Definitely I'm not sayingdefinitely not a bad thing, but
we can appreciate the skill setthat both of you have bought to

(45:31):
this week you with your definitepassion and knowledge and her
with her calm, understanding andskills and spending extra time
with the girls and being quietand methodical and also being an
amazing chef.

Speaker 2 (45:43):
Yeah, that's helped.

Speaker 1 (45:44):
Amazing, because I do enjoy feed.
Yeah, she does.
She does cook a mean meal.
The food here has beenimpeccable.

Speaker 2 (45:50):
I think we'll just go back to your point there.
I think having another femalewith the girls is very important
because we're two separatecreatures.
The first thing with Mel.
We had an opportunity.
14 seconds in we were drivingthe car along like billies, got
out of the car and the billyliterally crested the rise.

(46:10):
We're going for another one.
A billy crested the rise and theshot was just there and I was
like nine meters, let it rip.
And Mel was like, wow, I'm notready for this right now.
I drew back and we had a miss,just missed, just missed, you
know.
Thankfully it was a clean missand she's like, she sort of
spoke to me, she's like I needmore time than that.
And it's like I understand thatbecause their thought process

(46:33):
is a lot different.
They like to be slower, morecalculated, and I'm like, and
Sarah's like, yeah, yeah, youcan't like push it like that.
In my mind it's like that's anopportunity.
We were just nine meters, butit's like, no, that was the most
stressful thing in the world.
So it's like having thatdifferent perspective to, I
guess, teach and lead andnurture them that way is very
important as well, becauseguiding guys and girls, two

(46:55):
different methodologies, youknow.

Speaker 1 (46:57):
And I can really see you enjoying the beginner thing
and the new people thing, andI'm a little bit the same where
you know we mentioned before weboth killed some stuff, yeah,
and it gets to a point where youneed a different high, you need
a different hit and it's notalways doing yourself, but
seeing and helping and investingin someone else and then
watching them flourish from that, to watch them smile and

(47:17):
receive that high five for them,instead of them being there to
watch you get one.
It's, it's a whole man.
And then even to me, to see itas a husband, like to see my
wife achieve that yeah, that was, that was massive and it's
something that and you saw a bighunting background with it.
You're a guide, yeah but, likeI've only been at 10 or so years
, like yourself, but, and youknow, she's been shooting for a
long time, but with rifles.

(47:37):
So this is something new forboth of us to really I'm not a
bow hunter, but it means, like Itold you, I'm a bow shooter.
Yeah, I'll hopefully carry therifle over the other shoulder,
but to see her just get suchenjoyment out of this this week
has been a really enjoyablething for me, and I appreciate
your passion and time too.

Speaker 2 (47:54):
Yeah, and it's been awesome Like I've.
It's funny Like we're shootinglittle billy goats right and I'm
I'm nervous because I'm soexcited for them.
I know what it means and I getmore excited than the girls
sometimes over this course thisweekend because I know what it
means to them, you know, andlike that's awesome for me

(48:15):
Because it's like I know theposition that they're in.
Oh, that was me 15 years ago.

Speaker 1 (48:19):
Yeah, I forget those.
I forget those first moments.
It's hard to recreate.
You can't get your first back.
Yeah, so to watch a, you know,yeah, first Fox, like I wasn't
there for this but I have toshoot another one.
Yeah, but you know, firstBilly's and, and then just to
watch him cut it up too andenjoy and take that home.
Yeah, yeah, it'll be cool tosee.
Yeah, so we'll talk about this.
On the cutting up part,obviously I did something a

(48:41):
little bit silly, but I wasusing a knife that I should know
how to use better and shout outEagle Hawk.
Shout out to Braden at EagleHawk.
He already knows about it.
I sent him a photo.
But we're out here, not so muchin the middle of nowhere, but
we're an hour and 40 or so fromthe nearest hospital, the
regional which regional?
Which I visited last night.
A little bit disappointedHospital slash vet Got a little

(49:03):
bit disappointed in the carethat was provided.
But it got got nasty prettyquick and I put a scalpel blade.
I was cutting some, cutting theneck off the goat, and it just
went straight in, straight out.
But the moment I did that therewas more blood on the ground
from me than there was Arterialspray, proper arterial spray.
It was a goodie.

(49:23):
It was a goodie.
We'll put a photo up.
But then we, you know, wepatched it up a little bit and
it seemed good.
It was good enough that nightand then I had to share and took
the bandage off, washed it upand it was clean.
The next day we bandaged upagain and went hunting.
And then I fell over yeah itjust happens and just had both
hands down on the ground.
And as soon as I did it Ilooked down and this hand was
just red instantly.

Speaker 2 (49:43):
And I feel that it was fine.

Speaker 1 (49:45):
And you copped a fair spray.

Speaker 2 (49:46):
So I still remember you had the gauze pad over it
and I was like, how bad is it?
And you were.
I opened it and it sprayed outabout a foot.
It's just pure arterial spray.
And I was like that's not good.
No, and I think you realizethat as well at the time.

Speaker 1 (50:00):
No, it's not good.
And yeah, look that was.
I do carry a fair first aid kitbut, like you said, being a
guide, you sort of build upthese little things and prior to
that I probably wouldn't have.
But each trip I go away I learnsomething new and put something
else in there, and this one Ilearned was it pepper, cayenne,
pepper, cayenne, pepper, mac andpepper Is, yeah, put in there
as a coagulate.

Speaker 2 (50:18):
Yeah, so that'll if you have pepper.
So we've learned, if you put itin there, that'll help congeal
that blood.
And so it wound up.

Speaker 1 (50:23):
Yeah, it doesn't do anything for the antibacterial
stuff, but one person told me itstings really bad.
The other person tells me itdoesn't, but I don't care yeah.

Speaker 2 (50:30):
As long as it fixes you.

Speaker 1 (50:31):
Yeah, it's going to stop blood, so I took a bit of
time out last night to go andget that.
The only thing that we probablydidn't have, that we should
have was a bit of glue to superglue that up which I have in my
bird's eye table.

Speaker 2 (50:38):
Yeah, yeah so but apart from that it's
surprisingly okay consideringwhat it could have been.

Speaker 1 (50:45):
No pain.
I'm concerned about what'shappening underneath the skin.
Yeah, because it was midprocessing a goat Cross that.
Yeah.
Yeah, the knife had some stuffon it.
Hmm, yeah, it did.
I don't see what I'm talkingabout.
What's the next part?

Speaker 2 (50:58):
How have you enjoyed it this weekend?

Speaker 1 (50:59):
Well, I've had a great time because I haven't
done anything.

Speaker 2 (51:03):
I haven't done any hunting.
You shot a bow this weekend.
I did.
Did you bow?

Speaker 1 (51:05):
set up.
I did.
Yeah, that's what we should do.
We got a bow set up, nickNoreen.
Nick Noreen did a thing Meet,meet Noreen.
So we'll get well.
Okay, I'm not a bow shooter,I'm not a bow hunter.
I'm a bow shooter, yeah.
So Nick and I have been yeah,yes, speaking for a few months
about different things, and thiswas one of them, and what is
created here for me is a new toythat's going to cost me more

(51:29):
time and money than I'veprobably got at the moment.
But what have we done?
What have we got?

Speaker 2 (51:34):
So basically we've set you up top of the line
aluminium riser, hoy bows, thisis a VTM 34.
It's actually the same colorconfiguration as me, so matchy,
matchy, yeah, yeah, um, we'vetracked the quiverlizer on that,
which is what I hunt with.
And then we've put just a bombproof five pin fixed pin side on
there, sort of no frills set up, bomb proof.
It's going to last Got that alltuned up and got a few arrows

(51:57):
put through it and this thingwill kill any animal in the
country or the world.
It's a six, it's a 70 pound setup 29 inch draw.
It's acting at the most on themost efficient point on that can
and it shoots like a dream?

Speaker 1 (52:09):
It definitely does, and it's not a light.
It's not a light set up, butit's very evenly.
Evenly distributed with thequiverlizer on the front.

Speaker 2 (52:17):
Yep, so Hoyt do a carbon riser bow in the top of
the line bows and an aluminiumriser.
So this is an aluminium riserwith their HPX pro cams.
The cams are the same differentrisers and then you'll have
differing brace heights and afew little differing specs on
them.
This is the exact bow that Iuse, absolutely love it and it's
just a no frills performancebow.
Like I'm a Hoyt man, there areother fantastic bows out there,

(52:41):
but for me, hoyt is the mostreliable bow you can have.
That's not going to let youdown.

Speaker 1 (52:46):
And how like is this something you would sell a
beginner as a package?

Speaker 2 (52:50):
If they wanted to spend the money.
So this is getting towards theupper end of what you're going
to spend.
Dollar wise Might take this bowaway from that.
And if you put in a bow calleda Hoyt Torex XT or a Hoyt Torex
that's their entry level bowYou're saving several hundred
bucks and getting 90% of thefeatures of that bow in an entry
level package.
So those components,particularly the quiverlizer,

(53:11):
just whack it over yourshoulders.
You don't have to carry the bow.
Drop away arrow rest.
That's very common with what wesell.
You know I like to sell thingsto people that I know are
reliable, I know will work.
So that's.

Speaker 1 (53:24):
we sell a lot of the same sort of stuff because of
that and now, so I don't do alot of shooting of it.
What are some sort oftechniques and practices that we
could do at home that wouldhelp build, because it is
different muscle groups that youuse?
It is, yes, it's not for you,because it's something you've
grown up shooting, right to behonest, I don't shoot my bow.

Speaker 2 (53:40):
I don't shoot my bow nowhere near as much as I should
.
I would call myself a goodhunter, average archer.
Okay, technical side of thingsI know a lot and, like Jack, is
way better at coaching peoplethan me and all those little
subtle things with form.
But the most important thing isto control your shot and being
consistent.
And if that is shooting atarget at two meters away, with

(54:01):
your eyes closed, going throughyour form, going through your
release, then so be it.
It's all about being in controlof the shot sequence.

Speaker 1 (54:07):
With a bow, you did some interesting stuff with the
girls and the targets.
You weren't just shooting it 20meters or 10 meters, you had
them kneeling bending down, thenyou put it behind the brush.

Speaker 2 (54:18):
Yeah, so a lot of things like everyone shoots,
we've got a camera guy.
Yeah what.
Everyone will shoot a bow,standing up dead, broadside,
flat ground, no obstruction,shoot it.
And they're like, yeah, this isgreat, you go hunting.
Then you'll be all bent overand contorted, half leaning,
shooting through a gap with alittle shooting lane and it just
it throws everyone, you know.
So the girls were strugglingwith kneeling shots and things

(54:41):
like that.
So I was like, okay, kneelingshots, it is all morning and I
was making them draw back, letdown, kneel, stand up a little
bit, wait, wait, okay, now shoot.
Because that's so typical of ahunting situation.
And to start with they weren'tliking it.
They're like this is reallyhard.
I'm like well, this is whatyou'll be subjected to when
you're hunting.
Because there's an animalmoving, you might have to go up
down, stop, go to let down.
Then you get that opportunityagain.

(55:02):
That's never juststraightforward.
And then when they went hunting.

Speaker 1 (55:05):
They got to put those in practice.
Yeah, and they were fine.

Speaker 2 (55:08):
Kneeling shots and uphill stuff and a lot of as
well.
I was having them shoot withtheir backpack on or their binae
harness, because when you'rehunting you've got your binae
harness on, you got yourbackpack on.
That's real world situations asopposed to just target shooting
and bit of foam.
So the biggest thing I wouldsay to people is to be yes,
shoot your bow.
Yes, be accurate.
Yes, have your gear dialed in.

(55:29):
But don't think that justbecause you hit the middle on
the target means you're going togo and harvest an animal,
because that is the furthestthing.
There's so many more steps inbetween that have got to happen
in a line for you to besuccessful.
I think that's a big thing thatpeople get overconfident with.
If I hear so often come intocamp, I'm good to 70, then we'll

(55:49):
miss at 20, because of nerves,adrenaline, whatever.
So I think the realization thatthat is a very important
component of it, but it's notthe be all and end all.
There is more to getting readyfor a hunt than simply putting
arrows into a target.

Speaker 1 (56:03):
After this trip, Mel asked you what are some things I
could probably do in the future, and you mentioned paper tuning
.
Can you explain?

Speaker 2 (56:08):
one what it does and how to manage that.
So paper tuning is basicallyshooting at six, seven feet from
a sheet of paper and your arrowflight.
It will show the arrow flight.
So if your arrow is coming outof the bow dead straight, it
will simply be a board hole withthe three fletch markings on
there through the tear.
So this is a piece of paperstretched out across the thing
and then you shoot into a target.

(56:29):
So it shows you how the arrowis coming out of the bow.
If, say, you have a right tear,that will be the arrow coming
out with the Fletcher's to theright and coming out on the side
.
So therefore that arrow isn'tcoming out dead straight, it's
not going to be flyingefficiently and it's going to
take a lot more to straighten upand it's not a correctly tuned
arrow.
So basically, we can shoot thatbow through paper, as we say,

(56:50):
and see if that bow is tuned ornot.
If it's the right tear up ordown, we might have to remove
the rest, up or down, we mighthave to shim the cams, we might
have to do something to get allthat in alignment and get that
nice little board hole.
So you know your arrow iscoming out perfectly.
It's transferring all thatenergy efficiently.
You're going to get the mostpenetration and your bow is
going to work efficiently.

Speaker 1 (57:09):
I wanted to talk about that, the transfer of
energy, and you're explaining ifan arrow is tail-whipping or
whatnot, and differentbroadheads too, and how that
transfers to a rib shot or.

Speaker 2 (57:20):
Yep, so how they can?
Yeah, so basically, like,ultimately for a hunting arrow
and this is me there's a fewtrends of thoughts on this.
I want an absolute directtransfer of energy going forward
.
So the arrow is coming in and Iwant it to hit dead straight
because it's driving that energyexactly where you hit.
You want it to keep travelingforward in that direction.
If you have an arrow coming offto the side, it's going to hit,
you're going to lose energy,it's not going to penetrate as

(57:42):
far and it can also become proneto deflecting when it's not
traveling straight.
So deflections, you'll get acouple of things.
So the approach angle of yourbroadhead, whether it's acute or
obtuse.
So if you've got a broadheadlike that versus a narrower
angle, if you look at that on acurve, that transfer of energy
is going to be very sudden.
It's going to be wanting todeflect.
It's going to want to go theeasiest route when, as you've

(58:03):
got more of a needle point likean acute head, it's going to
want to dig in and keep trackingstraight.
So if you've got that arrowdriving that in like that nice
and straight, that arrow isgoing to keep tracking on that
path, because when you'reshooting an animal, you're going
to hit mad.
You're going to hit fightingpad on a ball, you're going to
hit bone.
There's all these things that Iwant to just throw everything
everywhere and you want yourarrow to keep tracking dead
straight.
So if that arrow is, by default, dead straight, you're going to

(58:26):
have the greatest chance ofthat happening.
Because if it's coming out likethis, and a lot of the times
you'll see shots on an angle andit'll track down a ribcage and
won't actually go in there, eventhough it's hit on this angle,
it's going to change 30 degreesand skate down ribs.
Whatever Wins.

Speaker 1 (58:41):
Pretty bad it is picking up a little bit On the
broadhead topping, broadheadselection, two blades, three
blades, and then we spoke aboutpoundage and how maybe a two
blade might work better for thegirls.

Speaker 2 (58:52):
Yep, yeah, so a lot of personal preference in this
and expandables touch on thattoo.

Speaker 1 (58:57):
Yeah, we don't use them.

Speaker 2 (58:59):
Not a fan of expandables at all.
I'm a fan of good shotplacement.
But a lot of it is down topersonal preference.
But you have to understand whatthe broadhead's going to do.
A two blade is going to giveyou superior penetration, but
it's going to cut less.
A three blade is going to cut alittle bit more.
It's going to open up the wormchannel a little bit more, but
it's going to penetrate less.
A four blade, so on and so on.

(59:19):
It will repeat like that.
So you got to look at whatspecies am I hunting?
Are they heavily armored or arethey thin skinned?
What's my poundage?
What's my effective range?
Xyz.
You know, like if it wassomeone like myself and I was
just shooting deer, I'm gettingpassers with a three blade
anyway.
So for me, if it was a thinskinned deer, I personally

(59:39):
wouldn't use a two blade becauseI'm blowing an arrow straight
through them anyway.
Yes, you don't need morepenetration, I don't need more
penetration.
So it's like I can get awaywith a little bit more cut.
You know, and you look at likethe kaiyugas, they've got the
four blade option, so a lot ofguys might hunt their pigs with.
So, with the little blackbleeders Got the bleeders on
there so they might hunt, say,the hunting buffalo or pigs.
They might use the two bladeoption a bit of a hunting like a

(01:00:01):
fallow or light skinned animal.
You're going to get that extrapenetration anyway.
So we might put the bleeders onand shoot that buck with it and
create that bigger woundchannel and probably still get a
pass through anyway.
That's the same as my thinkingwith the three blade.
I use three blades foreverything myself.
I particularly like them onboars because they're fighting
pad.
You put a two blade through itto slit like that A lot of the

(01:00:22):
time.
When it's really thick it canclose up and it makes it
difficult for a blood trail,whereas a three blade will open
it up a little bit more and thatblood can escape.
And obviously it's got aslightly larger cutting area.
So you're cutting more arteries.
Yes, the bigger broadheads andthree blades will help on
marginal shots.
So at the back of the lungs,liver, you've got that extra 20
to 30% of cut there.

(01:00:43):
That does help.
But that's not really mylikening for that.
I'll always be an advocate forgood shot placement over a
bigger cutting diameter.
So the cutting diameter is Ipersonally have in my three
blades is one inch.
That's smaller than theindustry standard by a fair bit,
but with that comes increasedpenetration.
So I can have more penetrationand still use a three blade.

(01:01:04):
Yes, and that's a mean.
I'm cutting the width to becutting along the distance.
Yeah, so that to me is a goodtrade off between two blade and
a three blade.
It's penetrating more like atwo blade as opposed to a
conventional three blade whichmight not penetrate as far.
But personal preference with alot of that stuff.
But the main thing is shotplacement, shot placement and
sharp broadhead.
So that's the things to reallyfocus on and what sort of

(01:01:26):
poundage.

Speaker 1 (01:01:27):
I know the girls here are shooting 40, some 50 sort
of poundage.
I think that's our legalminimum in your stuff.
I think it's 40 pounds.
Don't quote me 40 or 45, maybefor fallow, but it's a
recommended minimum anyway.
Yes, but you were talking abouta female is coming up to shoot
a buffalo and she's got a 45pound bow or 47.
I think you said yeah, so itcan be done.

(01:01:48):
Can be done Shot placement andarrow set up.

Speaker 2 (01:01:51):
Yeah, shot placement arrow set up and then extremely
sharp, broadhead, super critical, and again, with that, get
close.
You have to be close for that.
That's when it's 15 meters andunder, typically, that we're
going to have to do that, whichis still only getting this sort
of penetration.
Yeah, and obviously not spookthe buff after and because they
can thunder off and all thosevariables.
But when it comes down to it,you have to put that arrow in

(01:02:13):
the right spot for it to beeffective.
That is the number one thing.
You don't do that.
What's the point of having allthe poundage all the way down?
All the poundage or the gear orthe whatever Extra blade is not
going to help you.
Yeah, you should somethingthrough the guts.

Speaker 1 (01:02:25):
It's not good.
No, what about sharpening thebroadheads?
You said they're an extra sharp, but do they need to be razor
sharp shaving hair for?

Speaker 2 (01:02:34):
So they need to be as sharp as you can get them.
Shaving hair is very preferable, but if you can get them as
close to that point as you cannot everyone has that ability to
do that- yes.
Broadheads will come out of thepack shaving sharp.
Give them a touch up Becauseyou can get them that little bit
sharper.
It's like if you shoot anartery there.
If it's sharp it's going to cutthe full width of that blade.

(01:02:55):
So it's an inch and an eighth.
You're going to get an inch andan eighth of cut of arteries.
If it's dull, like I've done,they might stretch over and you
might only cut half an inch.
So it is very important you canshoot into rubber bands and
things like that and we'll showyou when it's really sharp We'll
cut all those bands.
When it's dull it'll cut athird of those bands and that's
like arteries, you know.
So razor sharp, broadhead veryimportant.

Speaker 1 (01:03:16):
Have you had some I want to say not major failures,
but like I've had a shot twobuff.
The first one penetrated aboutthat far because it hit the
shoulder bone, yep, and justwent and this thing ran away.
Yeah, it was a shot placementissue.
And the second one was front onand just went straight through
there and was dead on impact.
But have you seen some poor,poor shots like yeah, equipment

(01:03:42):
failure, equipment failure.

Speaker 2 (01:03:43):
Yeah, so that's what made me start.
I was cut back in the day.
I remember I shot.
I had a really good bore.
This is exceptional bore,except particularly for how long
ago it was my bow huntingcareer.
He come in and I put a good shoton him at about 14 meters,
right on last light and he wasbasically brought to a head in

(01:04:03):
square on in the pad and thebroadhead broke on the pad Like
bent like a banana on the pad.
In the hour I fell out and Idone everything right.
It hit a bit of mud fightingpad and a rib and the broadhead
literally bent in half and Ifound it when he hit the fence
and it ripped the arrow out likehit and turned and I found it
and I just was at a loss ofwords because I've done

(01:04:23):
everything right and my gearjust let me down on the best
animal I'd ever been faced with.
And I done, I put the perfectshot on him and it broke and I
just went.
This is ridiculous and I went.
I can make something betterthan this, surely?
And that's what spurred it on.
So, yeah, that was my firsttaste of equipment failure.

Speaker 1 (01:04:40):
Well, it's burnt on the holes, sort of things.

Speaker 2 (01:04:42):
Yeah, it did Like literally, that moment is what
changed everything for me.
But you hear a lot of storiesabout equipment failure,
particularly on expandables, onbig animals.
Yeah, they work a lot of thetime, but when they fail, they
fail in an epic way.
Whether the blades don't open,they just they penetrate an inch
and we'll just flop around justunder the skin.
I'm just not a fan of that sortof stuff myself and again, that

(01:05:04):
comes with my get closephilosophy.

Speaker 1 (01:05:06):
And equipment, phase broadheads, things like that we
can't really fix in the field.
What are some things on it?
You carry Allen keys in yourpocket pretty much everywhere
you go.
What are some things that youcan keep when you're out bow
hunting to try and like a set ofAllen keys, a good multi tool
and a knife.

Speaker 2 (01:05:22):
Some spare deep, spared deep material is almost a
must.
So it does pop off, does it?
So last last week, when we'reguiding here, I had one of the
guys I called in a bore out of arutting mob.
He went to drawback six yards,bang, pop, loop snapped, had to
change that loop out in thefield and I had just have
something by buying a harness.
So I'll try and just have somebasic little bit of serving D
loop and all that so I can getmyself going in the field.

(01:05:44):
So it'd be like a peep D loopmaterial, a bit of serving a
lighter knife, and that'stypically what I'll carry in my
bino harness, just in the field.
But if it's more than that it'sa bit of a serious fix.
Didn't have a bro bow press uphere at this time and we had a
bow derail and I basically justput paracord around each end of
the axle, joined it togetherwith a ratchet strap and I

(01:06:04):
ratcheted, strap the limbstogether and put a string back
on this week.
So it's more it's more than knowhow and knowing what to fix as
opposed to the gear you've got.
That can get you out of trouble.
So there's a heap of ways youcan do it, but you need to
understand what is wrong to beable to fix it.
So having basal knowledge ofyour gear will allow you to do
that in the field, and I thinkeven Mel like if something goes

(01:06:27):
wrong with a bow or she has abit more of an understanding now
, so maybe get herself out oftrouble.
So I think having the knowledgeof what's wrong will allow you
to to jimmy up some sort ofsolution to fix it in the field.

Speaker 1 (01:06:39):
Yeah, I've seen some dodgy fixes.

Speaker 2 (01:06:40):
Yeah, yeah, and we had some dodgy fixes here this
weekend, but we're not here at ashop.
We don't want to drive a couplehours home, so it's consistent
of me holding them.
Yeah, that quarter draw, just soyou can get the screw in the
right spot.
Yeah, to change the modules out.
So basically, for those whounderstand, the module on Mel's
bow was on, say, a 24 inchdrawing.
Then the draw stop was on a 27inch draw length, which

(01:07:02):
basically is a sponge at fulldraw, just no valley, no wall
and just yuck.
So we fixed that out and it wasa bit how you going to do it.
It did need a press to do it,but Dodd was half drawing it.
Take out the little bolts, putthem in the right spot, and we
got it done so yeah, yeah, itgot a work and that was the
major change on her bow.

Speaker 1 (01:07:20):
It was, yeah, it was the most important change we
done.
So something you asked mebefore and I've been thinking
about it.
It's hard to be doing theseinterviews because you're on a
well, no, I'm trying to alwaysformulate the next question, but
also listen at the same time,and I want to go back to it.
You ask something.
You know, what have I learnedor have I enjoyed?
And Something I really pickedup on and I haven't spent much

(01:07:40):
time on myself learning is wind.
Yeah, okay, and you likened itto war.
Yes, can you explain that?
Because that was a like, it wasjust a.
You're an idiot.
Why have you never thoughtabout that?
Yeah, and to give a bit of anidea, I'm looking at this sort
of property now, where we are,and you've got a basic ridge
line across the top and thenthese fingers that run Down, the
drop down, and each one runsdown and drops down, and you're

(01:08:01):
explaining how.
You know how the wind worksDifferent times a day.
Can you explain that and howthat impacts?

Speaker 2 (01:08:08):
As a rifle hunter Wind is not an issue.
You shoot further back.
Yeah, so basically, the wind iswhat will do you in as a bow
hunter 99% of the time.
You know, particularly in thismountain country, it's very
fickle, it's very hard to read,so you might have basic ridge
running along with all itslittle fingers and gullies in
between.
Thermals at the start of theday and the beginning at the end

(01:08:30):
of the day will affect you.
So basically, heat rises.
Okay.
So in the first hour or two ofthe day it's nice and cool.
In the valley, the shade on themountain, that's nice and cool.
Everything's going to bewanting to suck down.
So if you look at these fingerridges, it'll be sucking down
and there'll be a valley wind,whether it's going northly or
subtly, you know.
So would you be hunting at thebottom?
No, sorry.

Speaker 1 (01:08:49):
Yes, I would be early morning.

Speaker 2 (01:08:50):
Early morning I would be below the animals because
that wind is sucking down, youknow, because it's nice and cool
.
It's coming into that valleyfloor and along the valley and
along the valley, whether it'snorth or south, you know it's
going to have a bit of thatorientation.
Fast forward an hour and a half.
Raise of light are starting tohit the mountain there.
Top of the mountains, in theSun bottom mountain is in the
shadows.
We get heat up here, cool downhere.

(01:09:11):
So in the bottom of the valleyit's going to be wanting to suck
in there still, but at the topit's going to be wanting to go
up.
Those thermals gonna run it up.
So you have this realintermittent zone where it will
just go back and forth and bevery swirly, unpredictable.
You can't read it.
So that period for like an hourand a half after the Sun comes
up up until that heatestablishes itself in the day,
very, very hard to bow on.

(01:09:33):
As the day goes on your Sunstarts to set, the shadows get
longer and that Sun goes awayfrom the mountain.
It will then begin sucking down.
That's my favorite time to huntbecause you know If you're
glancing something from theother side of the mountain I
could come in from below it andthose wind, those thermals are
going to be sucking down.
And as the day goes on the windwill become more and more
Consistent because it's gettingcooler and cooler and that wind

(01:09:53):
is going to be sucking down.
But what I like into water andthis is just something I try and
think of myself is, say, I'vegot a bench like this and it
rolls down like that.
If you poured water on that,it's going to roll down like
that.
So that's what I think Down inthe gut.
It's going to suck down intothe gullies really easy.
But up on top of those benchesa lot of time the wind will
swirl around everything.
It doesn't really have adirection it can get pulled.
I Try and think of it like that.

(01:10:14):
It still is unpredictable attimes, but the more knowledge
you have around wind andthermals and what it's going to
do in those little gullies, itmight be going one direction
where you are, but where theanimal is you have to approach
from the opposite side andknowing that, having that
knowledge before you get inthere, we'll often put that
stalk in your success, in yourfavor.
So you might have to get on thetotal opposite side.

(01:10:36):
It might be sucking.
Left on the side you're on, butright on the side it's on and
you just have to trust yourknowledge and you get there and
go oh, the wind is actuallygoing this way, whereas if you
went with, just it's blowingthis way here, it'll be blowing
this way there.

Speaker 1 (01:10:49):
Sometimes it won't work and you carry a wind
decatur with you.
This is a wind puffer full ofcornflower.

Speaker 2 (01:10:53):
Yeah, cornflower friends, that's the trick.
Yeah, and just like, obviously,learning your property, you'll
know what, what it will do.
I like I'll be showing you here.
I'm like we'll get here.
The wind will suck down, itwill go this direction, but on
this, from experience, yeah,from experience and learning,
that helps.
But different weather conditionswill change everything.
So A lot of the time you mightbe on a face and it'll be in

(01:11:14):
shadows.
Right then, when it be suckingdown, sucking down and the
clouds will go away and you'llget a bit of sun on that hill
for five minutes, it'll totallychange away, the winds going
because the sun's on it andyou'll see that in stalks You'd
be like I've got five minutesleft of cloud cover till that
sun comes out and it might startjust Intimately sucking back
and forth and I've had stalksblow because of that, you know.

(01:11:34):
But it's again, having thatknowledge and know why it's
going to do that, that willallow you to put yourself in a
different position or just justbe more successful, really and
the third like in the morning,can you feel the thermals like,
you feel wind like, or theysometimes so subtle?

Speaker 1 (01:11:50):
I think it's just subtle, you know.
Yeah, so it's more of anassumption.
Yeah, you're puff and you cansee your puff float away, and
you can feel it when we've gone.

Speaker 2 (01:11:56):
Now you can feel it with the temperature, like we're
in gale force winds now.
You know that's a pressuresystem doing it as opposed to
thermals, but you can feel it asthat temperature changes you
know that that wind's gonnastart sucking up, you know, and
it's just very intermittent andfickle and Mid-morning is the
worst time to bow hunt becauseof that wind and, like I said
you, it's all, particularly forboars.

(01:12:17):
It's all late afternoon stuff.
As the day goes on, that windjust gets more and more
consistent because it getscooler and cooler.

Speaker 1 (01:12:22):
Was that mid-morning rest time?
Is that like when you had thenap today?

Speaker 2 (01:12:26):
Is that I may have rested my eyes so five to 15
minutes.

Speaker 1 (01:12:30):
Mid-mid TV show yeah, Lord of the Rings.

Speaker 2 (01:12:33):
That's right.
That's right, it's standard uphere.
I've watched each episode aboutthe six thousand times.

Speaker 1 (01:12:38):
Yeah, who knows them?
Word for word.
It was dreaming and quoting itOn your search for adventure.
Yes, you meant to ride at thestart.
You're going back to the States, mm-hmm.
What's in it for you this time?
Where are you?

Speaker 2 (01:12:50):
headed Hi.
To be honest, I'm so not readynor prepared for this.
I've come back from theterritory Four weeks of guiding
up there.
I've spent I'll do nine daysguiding here.
I have two days off at home andjet off.
So essentially I have a MontanaBig game combo tag which is an
Elkin Mule deer tag.
I Know the area and unit I wantto go and I've hunted that

(01:13:14):
before and then I also have aColorado tag.
But my main focus.
So the plan is go Montana,harvest an elk in the unit that
I know.
I believe I'll be successfulthere.
I know a good spot to go in.
It's a big trek in.
That's why it is a good spot.
But the harder job will bepacking an animal out if I do

(01:13:34):
get it done in there.
So basically, go to Montana,hopefully kill an elk as quick
as I can.
If it's not happening in there,go to Colorado and we're gonna
get an over counter tag forSarah and that'll be my focus to
try and get her her first ball.

Speaker 1 (01:13:47):
So that will mean more to her than me shooting a
ball, and that's something shecan do because she's a resident.

Speaker 2 (01:13:52):
Yeah, I'll, colorado over the counter.
Yeah, anyone can.
Yeah, so we'll just be huntingthose pure general DIY units
with everyone else.
But I think with a bit of hardwork and just persistence,
hopefully we can get it done.
But that's more my focus.
Hopefully, go and get myself aball.
I'm actually love to do that.
Go out there, do that and thenhop over to Colorado and then

(01:14:12):
hopefully get cerebral and, ifshe's successful, and then we'll
go into those units that I'vegot there.
So I've got time here for achange on you know.
So I'm on a tight time frame.
I'm going flying straight backinto Darwin, then I've got
another five weeks in theterritory, maybe six, and then
it's Christmas.

Speaker 1 (01:14:27):
Is it?

Speaker 2 (01:14:27):
time, yeah, so I'm excited, though, yeah, big
couple of months.

Speaker 1 (01:14:31):
For me it is, and I know in the past you've been
overseas several times todifferent places.
He said we've been Argentinared state, that was Africa.
Yeah, so I've done it twice.

Speaker 2 (01:14:43):
Yeah, so Nibbibia, zambia, zimbabwe Love every
minute of my time over there.
I'm head actually heading backthere when I get back from, so
we'll go to the states it's gotabout that.
Yeah, I forgot about thatstates back guiding the
Australian hunting safaris inthe territory and then ducking
back over to Zambia.
November, november, yeah, soit'll be mid November.

(01:15:04):
I'll be over there.
So it's currently 7th ofSeptember or something like that
, is that right?
Yep, yeah, so, yeah, so prettymuch up until December I'm
hunting pretty much every day.

Speaker 1 (01:15:16):
Exciting it's hard life.

Speaker 2 (01:15:17):
What are you chasing Adventure?
Honestly, I don't really havehit list animals as such.
Russ is really good mate ofmine.
I'm excited to catch up withhim over there with back country
Africa.
It's just so awesome You'regoing in Africa.
For those who haven't beenthere, there's just so many
different species.
You're like what's that?
What's that thing?

(01:15:37):
What's that?
Like you know, I would like abush buck is probably on the
list or an island, but I'mreally not fast, you know not so
that kudo situation.

Speaker 1 (01:15:47):
They didn't believe you.

Speaker 2 (01:15:49):
Oh yeah.
So Myself and Liam Woods wewent over to Namibia and this is
four or five years ago it wouldhave been pretty covered
pre-COVID, when the world wasgood.
We went over there and we'redoing a bit of a promo for the
outfitter, the somba Nord I knowI didn't say that correctly,
but Went over there and we shota bunch of animals out of the
tree stands and blinds andeverything got a heap of footage

(01:16:09):
and we're like can we go stalksome animals now?
And he's like, oh, it's, youwon't be able to shoot it.
He was like, oh, can we justtry?
He's like, go for it.
Anyway, we in the end we sort ofhe trusted us and he gives the
vehicles and we go out andpretty certain we weren't
allowed to do that with a pH,but anyway, went out and we're
gonna be back for lunch at, say,10 and we're actually in a tree

(01:16:31):
stand trying to shoot a heartof beast and we spotted herd of
kudo come through, a bunch ofcows and a nice bull at the back
and we thought they were gonnacome in but they just kept
feeding through.
So I was like, well, down thetree we go.
And and Liam was up and I waslike I'll film you and yeah,
liam, and up getting it done.
It was crazy footage I got.
He was a full draw and I waszoomed in from behind him,

(01:16:53):
probably 80 yards back, jammedup in this lawn, bush, and he
crawled, crawled in on this herdand the bull must have heard a
bit of a noise I think he's bowCreek 20, drew back and the bull
come out and looked and in thefootage Liam is here and the
bull is there and it looks likeit's about 20 yards away and
just looks out.
I think he's a full draw forover three minutes because if he
let down, that bull just wouldhave picked him and I was

(01:17:14):
looking over and past him and hewas jammed up in some bushes.
Bull end up turning away, putan arrow in, killed it with one
arrow, got all on film,everything like that.
And we're like, okay, right,we've got it.
We're like we'll go back andget everyone, get all the boys
and get proper photos, take thewhole animal out and everything.
And we got back to lunch.
He's like, oh, where have you'sbeen?

(01:17:35):
Like we'll get a bit worriedabout you.
We're like, oh, we shot a kudu.
And he's like, oh, ha ha, like,come on lunches ready.
Well, no, no, no, we've got togo and get it.
He's like where'd you shoot itfrom?
Like, oh, we stalked it andsuch and such things.
He's like no, you didn't.
I said no, I really we did.
He's a bullshit, you didn't.
Anyway, went out there and,yeah, showed him and he was
blown away with it.
You know.
He's like oh, this is the firsttime that's ever happened here,

(01:17:57):
with a spot and stalk, with abow and arrow, like he's.
They've had guys do it off thevehicle or follow him up with a
rifle, but he was just blownaway.
That you could do it with thebow and arrow.
Like we did get lucky, butobviously there was a lot of
skill there from Liam to make ithappen and it was yeah, it was
one of the coolest hunts I'veseen.
So I think.

Speaker 1 (01:18:14):
Definitely confirmed something I thought for.
Wilder Australians aregenerally pretty good hunters in
comparison to otherinternational hunters.

Speaker 2 (01:18:21):
Definitely.
I think we have.
Look at the opportunities we'vegot and how much we can do it
all year round.
I this is one thing I trulybelieve is true.
So, sarah, being an American,americans are better archers
than us.
Like, they shoot the shit outof me on a target, but we are
better hunters because they have340 days of the year to shoot a
target, whereas, like I'm justgonna go for a hunt every week.

(01:18:43):
You know, as opposed toprobably should shoot the target
more, but it's very hard to dothat when you could just go
hunting.
You know and we're in.
We don't have quotas, we don'thave tags as such, we don't have
seasons.
We're very lucky.
Hmm, it's, and it's the only wayto practice to be a better
hunter is by hunting.
In my opinion, if I'm, if I'mgearing up for a big trip, I'll

(01:19:06):
go and shoot goats.
I'll just get your eye in there.
Yeah, yeah, I like.
That's my mind.
So, whether people think that'sgood, bad or indifferent,
putting an arrow through ananimal is the best way to
practice to put an arrow throughanother animal, in my opinion.
There's a lot of people outthere.

Speaker 1 (01:19:20):
They don't have the access?

Speaker 2 (01:19:21):
Yeah, of course.
Yeah, I'm very fortunate.

Speaker 1 (01:19:24):
Yeah, and there is other options though that you
can do 3d comp and things.
Definitely, which is probablyclosest you can get, it's like a
mixture between hunting andtarget Practice, and a lot of
local archery clubs around thecountry host those regularly,
and if you've ever tried one ornot, I have back in the day yeah
.
Yeah, how was it?
Yeah, I forgot it.

Speaker 2 (01:19:41):
It's different, it's.
It's challenging.
You've got a guess or can't userange fire.
I'm not too sure now.
I think they're letting you nowand I think you can just go and
shoot non-competitively, whichwhich I would do.

Speaker 1 (01:19:53):
Um, what we're talking about is life-size.
Viceraptors, all sorts ofrandom animals, but you also
will have boars and deer andyeah, at random distances.
They might have something up ina tree, something in the middle
of a dam or right on the waterin a wallow or cross a gully
Shadows across the more lifelikesituations.
It's not shooting the test youa bit a nine cube target yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:20:12):
I hate shooting targets with faces.
So I I the Reinhardt targets.
For those that don't know, it'sa black target with about 36
bright green and yellow dots onit.
Yeah, I hate it, absolutelyhate it because it just is
target panic inducing.
I'd rather just shoot a blacktarget with one little spot to
aim at.
That's just a personal thing ofmine.
I know a lot of people will gettheir Reinhardt and just spray

(01:20:34):
paint it Right.
Yeah, doesn't end up with onebig hole in the middle.
Yeah, you just paint anotherone on there.

Speaker 1 (01:20:37):
So yeah, that's a good tip, Right?
Well, we're running to the endof our time, but thanks for
sitting down and having a chatWe've got lots of flies buzzing
around.

Speaker 2 (01:20:45):
This is the, the meat processing area, and we're in
the wind as well, and we madethe best we could.

Speaker 1 (01:20:50):
We made the best do we could, but the focus of this
week was Mel and her bow andgetting her some experience, and
you've definitely assisted withthat.

Speaker 2 (01:20:58):
So I appreciate that?

Speaker 1 (01:20:59):
How do you if people want to get in touch or find
more about the shop?

Speaker 2 (01:21:02):
I just bow hunting only on Instagram, or the web,
obviously, or myself throughInstagram, which is just Nick
Morton.
So reach out, say hi, don't bea stranger, I fringe, that's
right.
Thank you, man.
Thanks for joining us.

Speaker 1 (01:21:15):
On the fifth episode, back here at Hunts, currently
out of the United States, we'vegot Robbie Kroger from Blood
Origins.
Welcome to the show.
Actually didn't start as bloodorigins.

Speaker 2 (01:21:28):
Started.
The name actually was in theblood.

Speaker 1 (01:21:31):
I hunt Because the reason I'm hunting is because I
want to.
This may be controversial, sohold on to your seeds, but
because I intend to killsomething.

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Ep 4. Nick Morton, Tuning Bows and Tall Tales from Tusky Trips

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