February 20, 2025 • 39 mins
From transformative teen programs like RootOne to life-changing Birthright and Masa trips, studies have shown that Israel educational travel has been the most essential tool for building a lasting connection to Israel. But October 7th has presented a new set of challenges in the field.
This week on Adapting, David Bryfman talks with Anna Langer, who oversees the Israel Education Travel Alliance, a collective of over 140 organizations that facilitate Israel trips for North American participants. Their conversation—full of personal anecdotes and frontline insights from southern Israel—doesn’t shy away from how Israel educational travel is adapting to a new reality. This episode is essential listening for anyone who cares about the future of Israel engagement and Jewish identity in uncertain times.
This episode was produced by Dina Nusnbaum and Miranda Lapides. The show’s executive producers are David Bryfman, Karen Cummins, and Nessa Liben.
This episode was engineered and edited by Nathan J. Vaughan of NJV Media.
If you enjoyed the show, please leave us a 5-star rating and review, or even better, share it with a friend. Be sure to subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts and be the first to know when new episodes are released. To learn more about The Jewish Education Project visit jewishedproject.org where you can find links to our Jewish Educator Portal and learn more about our mission, history, and staff. We are a proud partner of UJA-Federation of New York.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
David Bryfman (00:00):
We are recording today's episode of adapting on
(00:02):
february 14, 2025 and I'm joinedby my colleague and friend, Anna
Langer from the Israeleducational travel Alliance. And
today's conversation is not justabout her work, but about the
emerging field of Israel,educational travel, and a recent
trip to Israel whereby peoplecame together to discuss what
the future of Israel educationaltravel looks like in a post
October 7 world. But as you'llsoon see, it's more than just
(00:23):
about Israel educational travel.
You've heard about some of theprograms, like birthright, route
one and masa, honeymoon, Israelmomentum. It's more than just
about the programs. It's aboutwhat they represent in the
ongoing chapter and evolution ofthe relationship between
Israelis and people all aroundthe world, not just Jews, which
is something which we do exploreas well, and I'm sure you will
enjoy today's episode ofadapting as much as I did, not
just for what it tells us aboutthis field, but also about the
(00:46):
issues that it shares with usand the questions that it asks
us and challenges us aboutIsrael today, in the world in
which we live, this is adaptingthe future of Jewish education,
a podcast from the Jewisheducation project, where we
Explore the big questions,challenges and successes that
define Jewish education. I'mDavid Bryant.
(01:10):
ANNA Lange is the vice presidentof North American Israel
strategy at Jewish Federationsof North America, and one of her
roles there is overseeing theIsrael educational travel
Alliance. In full disclosure, Iam also part of the Israel
educational travel Alliance asthe co chair with my colleague
from birthright Israel, Lizsikolski, but it's today that
I'm really pleased to have thisconversation with Anna, and
(01:32):
welcome her to adapting today.
Unknown (01:34):
Thank you, David. Glad to be here. Anna, can you tell
us
David Bryfman (01:38):
about your first trip to Israel, and if there's
anything specific about thatfirst trip that was particularly
meaningful to you, wow,
Unknown (01:49):
okay, my first trip to Israel was in 2008 it was two
days after I had graduated MountHolyoke College, and I showed up
on a trip that My cousin wassupposed to join me on, and
canceled at the last moment, abirthright trip meeting in JFK
with just a duffel bag and noidea of what was going to come
(02:11):
next. So first, I'll say justabout everything was a surprise
from the moment that I landed atBen Gurion airport and I
realized that Jews weren't onlydoctors, but were also air
traffic controllers and janitorsand and also that the food was
really good, and it wasn't justbagels and Chinese food, as my
aunt and uncle and grandparentshad prepared me to believe
(02:33):
Jewish cuisine was. But I'lltell you two things that struck
me the most. The first was whenI walked the streets of Israel
for the first time. I could notbelieve. I could not wrap my
head around the fact that I wasin the place that my
grandparents had dreamed ofgoing, not only that they had
(02:55):
dreamed of going, but theirparents before them and their
grandparents before them, butspecifically my grandparents,
Holocaust survivors that theyhad yearned for with every fiber
of their being, for their ownsafety and security, and that I
could actually be there walkingon those streets was a miracle
to me. And the other piece waswhile I was on my journey and
(03:18):
spending, you know, two secondstrying to catch some shut eye on
the birthright bus in betweenthe Dead Sea and Masada. It
turned out I was much lessinterested in catching those few
moments of sleep than I was inhearing about the experiences of
the Israelis who were on the buswith me. Those Israelis the same
age as myself, were in seniorpositions in the army, where
(03:41):
they were making life and deathdecisions on the day to day for
their own peers, and the levelof maturity, the level of
sophistication of the challengesahead of them, and recognizing
that if my family history hadbeen slightly different, that I
could have been in their shoes.
Blew my mind and forever placedme in the position of thinking,
(04:06):
Okay, I'm gum. Ve gum. I couldhave been them, and so I will
be. And that's actually whatdrove me to make Aliyah later in
my 20s, because I see that it'sjust sliding doors. I might have
ended up there, and I want towake up each day and think about
myself as what it would havelooked like if I were because
they are us too. And that's thething that broke me open. I'm
(04:29):
always going to be gum ve gum.
I'm never just going to be onething again. So
David Bryfman (04:35):
for those in the audience who do not know what
the ieta is, tell us what it'sall about.
Unknown (04:41):
So the ITA is the Israel educational travel
Alliance. The ita represents 140organizations who take North
Americans on trips to Israel tointroduce them to Israel, mostly
for the first time. So some ofour partners include.
Birthright. Route one, whichDavid breichman is very familiar
(05:04):
with, teen trips to Israel.
Momentum, which takes trips formothers. AIPAC eye track, taking
trips for non Jewish individualsto Israel as well. And all of
the ITA partners have a fewthings in common. The first is
that they are focused onbringing individuals to Israel
to develop a connection to andsupport for Israel among
(05:25):
participants, and for those whoare bringing Jews, sparking
Jewish identity among Jewishpopulations as well. So we're
140 organizations strong, nonprofit partners in the US, and
we also work closely with Israelbased operators of trips,
including tour operatingorganizations and tour
(05:47):
educators, who design andimplement trips directly on the
ground. So everybody
David Bryfman (05:54):
here is familiar with trips to Israel. They've
been going on for decades anddecades, and all of a sudden,
you're now talking about anorganization which brings them
all together. So why do theyneed some collective body to
help them coalesce? Well,luckily,
Unknown (06:06):
the field dreamed this up by itself, for itself. So
starting in 2020 the ITA wasactually sort of founded,
initially as a WhatsApp group,which, knowing that we're
dealing with Israel, feelsparticularly appropriate. So if
you can put yourself back in thememory of the COVID crisis of
the first few weeks of learningthat the world was shutting
(06:29):
down, a number of the leaders ofthe Israel travel organizations
that we now represent birthrighthoneymoon to Israel momentum
realized that they needed someinformation from each other
about the immediate adaptationsthat they were making to their
trips. Were they still sendingtrips? Piece number one, what
were they telling theirrecruited participants whose
(06:51):
trips might now be canceled ordelayed? How were they moving
forward with marketing? Werethey continuing to market and
recruit? It started veryorganically among these leaders
who were looking to each otherfor answers, solutions and for
peers to think these challengesthrough. And from there, the
expansion of the ieta was wasactually very fast. I've been
(07:16):
involved with ieta since thoseinitial conversations, which
expanded to include funders whowere supporting the field of
Israel educational travel, tothink about what these decisions
were other organizations whoneeded working groups to think
through the questions of gettingmoney back from airlines, for
example, things as practical asthat, as things to as
(07:38):
complicated to What would be theeducation that we would offer
instead of Israel trips, when itturned out, the trips were not
able to happen, and from there,Ita has grown in its function
and in its capacities over thepast five years, to truly be a
network space And to bestpractices sharing apparatus to
(08:01):
help to support the field ofIsrael educational travel, not
only in its continued goal tobring people to Israel to
develop that caring andconnection, but also to support
the field through many continuedcrises and adaptations from
COVID into The judicial reformsand now through the events of
(08:22):
October 7 and the war, this hasbeen a field that has
continually faced enormouschallenge and has needed each
other to adjust.
David Bryfman (08:31):
So on one hand, this could be an episode about
the things that we picked upduring COVID and what we've
previously called COVID keepersadapting, being one of them. But
this is one of those things thatmany people in the community
have said should have existedlong before, and it took
something like COVID to bringthe field together to talk about
these issues. And then no oneexpected, like all of us, no one
(08:53):
expected the events of October 7to really formalize and
crystallize the need for thiscollective to come together. So
I want to move a bit away fromtalking about the IATA
specifically, and more about theissues that you're confronting
and what we're all dealing withas a field. And maybe let's just
start off with the hardestquestion of all of what are the
challenges now facing the Israeleducational travel field after
(09:16):
October 7?
Unknown (09:18):
Wow. First, the challenges are just as big as
the opportunities. I think thatone of the true assets of Israel
educational travel is that everychallenge presents an enormous
opportunity as well. So thefirst challenge that the field
of Israel educational travel hasis to bring Israel trips, to
(09:41):
bring our field back at scale.
Now. Why is that a challenge?
Certainly, it's a challenge forall organizations right now to
think about going back to aroutine when it comes to Israel,
but for the field of Israeleducational travel, this
challenge is uniquely important.
Important and unique in its ownright. Number one, Israel,
(10:02):
educational travel is the mostimportant tool that we know,
that we have to developconnection and caring for Israel
among Jews and non Jews alike.
Pew studies from birthright,recent studies from boundless
Israel, all point to Israeleducational travel as being one
(10:24):
of the, if not the mostimportant mechanism for
developing that caring andconnection. Why is that a
challenge today? That's, as Isaid, both an enormous
opportunity and a tremendouschallenge, because the content
that happens on trips matters sosignificantly to the the
outcomes that they produce andto developing that ongoing
(10:47):
connection and caring for Israelamong its participants, so how
to adjust the core narrative ofwhat Israel educational travel
says Israel is about in a post,10, seven or more for Israelis,
the ongoing, terrible day andnight of October 7 is an
(11:08):
enormous challenge that has yetto be answered by any one
organization or community. Howwe are sharing our story, and
what that story is, I think,really differs depending on our
audiences, on our communities,and what we want that story to
be, look significantly differenteven this year than last year.
(11:29):
So last year, we know thatIsrael educational travel trips
were mostly about solidarity,showing caring and connection
directly for the people ofIsrael and reinforcing existing
ties where we had them. Thisnext year, we are writing the
new chapter, the next chapter inthe story of the Jewish people,
(11:50):
about who we are, individuallyand as a collective. Coming in
and through this period ofchallenge and change and
solidarity is certainly anaspect of that. But how we are
integrating October 7 andOctober 8, for those of us
living in North America, intothat shared story, is the
(12:12):
challenge and the opportunity ofIsrael educational travel this
next year. So Anna,
David Bryfman (12:17):
I realized, as I asked the question, and then
certainly is you responded toit. We sort of, in some ways, we
jumped right ahead, right wejumped right ahead to what we're
doing. And I think part of thethe challenge of this
conversation is theacknowledgement that here in
North America and around theworld, we're trying to return
back to not normal, but returnback to what we know works. And
(12:39):
Israel is still in this in thisperiod where it's not fully
recovered, or not fully out ofthe aftermath of October 7. And
here we are talking, I don'twant to use the word privilege
necessarily, but we're talkingfrom this place of a different
perspective, where we're talkingabout our need to get our young
people to Israel. And then youand I both know, and we were
both there recently together,that that Israel is going
through its own its own trauma,its own recovery, and we're both
(13:01):
cognizant of that, even thoughour work mandates demand us to
try and get back to, I'm loatheto say, as normal as possible,
but are returning to the way wewant things to be. Yeah, I
Unknown (13:11):
think that hits the nail on the head. Look, Israel
travel has been anextraordinarily important aspect
of Jewish American life for over25 years now, we are now
celebrating birthrights 25thanniversary, which has been a
watershed for Jewish communityin so many ways over these past
(13:31):
25 years, myself includedIsrael, educational travel has
been foundational to How JewishAmerican North American
communities think aboutdeveloping and enhancing true
connection and caring for Israelover a generation at this point,
and our need to return to thatnot only is true at this
(13:53):
specific moment, but actuallyhas been true since the founding
of ieta. So as we were talkingabout before you know, Iita came
out of this moment in 2020 whenwe were losing access to our
most important pipeline, again,not only for developing caring
and connection for Israel, but Iused to work at Hillel
(14:13):
International. And I can tellyou that many of the Israel
leaders that I worked with atHillel International, the
student leaders, elected tobecome student leaders because
of a transformative experiencethat they had on an Israel
educational travel journey, andthat to me, when I was in those
shoes, meant I was missing thepipeline of people of next
(14:33):
generation of leadership that Ineeded for the continuity of
Jewish community and to continueto enhance and build those
connections to Israel among thenext generation so that need to
return to some version of normalon our side, I'd say, is almost
an imperative of us trying tocreate the fabric that ties our
(14:56):
community together, whilesimultaneously. Dealing with the
realities of October 8 Judaismover here, which I think is our
version of living in the longnight of October 7 is the change
to Jewish identity and how weare asked to atone for Israel,
relate to Israel, and stand upfor Israel in public settings
(15:18):
now in America as Jews becauseof the way that the war is being
put on center stage and centerplate in American discourse, in
our schools, on our socialmedia, in all aspects of Jewish
life. So
David Bryfman (15:33):
let's get down to the on the ground, because you
and I have been to Israel now afew times since October 7, and
we know from our own experiencethat every time we go, we meet
with someone or we see somethingthat I wouldn't say necessarily
shakes us to our core. But I'vehad those experiences as well.
Share with the audience someexperiences you've had recently
where even you as someoneorganizing these trips, is like,
(15:55):
come into contact with Israelisor with people in Israel and
said, Wow, that's just somethingI needed to hear directly from
them.
Unknown (16:03):
Yeah, wow, you are so right that it happens every
time, no matter how many times Igo. So one arc of our experience
comes to mind for me during ourIsrael educational travel
alliance leader summit justrecently, this January in
Israel, we spent one day wherewe took half of the group to the
(16:27):
south and half of the group tothe north to explore how to
share the stories of war. Movinginto 2025 and David, I think you
and I have probably both beendown south many, many times
since the onset of the war onOctober 7, 2023, but the thing
(16:48):
that just shook me to my corethis time was going down to the
south with a mixed group ofnonprofit leadership who build
and design Israel educationalexperiences from within the IATA
community, and those toureducators that we work so
(17:10):
closely with to implement and tosee our vision through on the
ground. And what I learned whenI went down south with that
group is that some of these toureducators who have not been
working this last year, who havebeen serving in millewee or
taking care of children whiletheir spouses are in millim or
(17:30):
unable to work in this fieldbecause of the slowdown of trips
they were going to the south Forthe first time, witnessing
Israelis react to being in thesouth for the first time. I
don't really have words todescribe it, because they also
lacked words to describe theirown experience. And what struck
(17:54):
me about that is that many NorthAmerican trips have been going
there many times over, as youand I have and so even the
experience of the story thatwe're telling of Israel today
looks so different depending onwhat experiences and access you
have been provided. And what wasreally opening to me as well was
to hear the Israeli guidesthemselves talk about how they
(18:17):
needed to be there together, toprocess, to be in community, and
wanted to be in conversationswith us about how we understood
what these sites signified toour communities and what stories
we were hoping we would be ableto share collectively.
David Bryfman (18:32):
So it's probably true to say, at least for the
near future, that Israel tripswill now have different sites on
their radar. I think it's safeto say that very few Israel
educational trips ever went toany of the communities near the
Gaza envelope before they mayhave driven through steroto,
maybe, but now that's going tobe certainly part of the the
(18:54):
tour itinerary, and what a crassuse of frame as itinerary. But
the Nova festival site is goingto be a place where all groups
will want to, I guess, make apilgrimage to and to and to bear
witness, and to to say cutish,to say the memorial prayer there
as well. And I think it'ssomething that you and I have
discussed before, that thetendency to focus on visiting
(19:15):
the kibbutzim that were, youknow, massacred and destroyed,
and the side of the Novafestival that will be part and
parcel of what we do. But youalso had another experience
there, which I want you to tellthe tell the group about,
because I think out of all ofthe devastation of October 7
came some stories of heroism andresilience. So talk to us a bit
about one of those visits thatyou had down south this time.
Unknown (19:37):
Yeah, for sure. And before I move to that David, I
just want to note and recognizeone of the reasons why we we
went down south, is because thekibbutzim are closed for public
audiences this year, per therequest of their residents, and
understanding and designingitineraries for. 2025 needed to
(20:02):
put on the table. What are wegoing to do? Where are we going
to go? Which stories are wegoing to tell now that the
kibbutzim are not going to be apart of our itineraries, how do
we want to bear witness? Is itjust Nova? Is it Nova and
people? Is it Nova andvolunteerism, service learning,
to be able to build and servethese communities again, and to
(20:24):
give us the opportunity to trulyexplore what the value
proposition is in taking groupsdown south and to give the space
for us all to process and thinkabout educational design
together. So So you mentionedtwo incredibly unique
individuals that our trip hadthe opportunity to spend time
with. So we had a, I'm going tosay, once in a lifetime
(20:48):
opportunity to spend time with anova survivor. And as he calls
him as our Nova survivor, Shalevcalls him Eunice, his angel, his
savior. Shalev is a youngIsraeli, former IDF participant
who went away on his big tripabroad, following his army
(21:13):
service, and came back just alittle bit early to be with some
friends on holiday back inIsrael for Simchat Torah, and
ended up being invited by somefriends to go down to the Nova
Festival, where he went and washaving a absolutely fantastic
time until the beginning of themorning, when, of course, the
(21:36):
events of October 7, as we nowunderstood them, began to
unfold, and while Shalev and hisfriends were trying to escape
with their lives, they raneventually around eight
kilometers to a farm where theyfound a greenhouse, and they
started to hide in thegreenhouse until they realized
that there were people there atthe farm, and the person who was
(21:58):
there at the farm was this manwho They did not know at the
time was named Eunice, who camein and asked them what they
needed and who they were. Theywere, of course, very fearful of
him, because he was Arab inappearance. And Eunice ended up
offering them shelter, a placeto charge their phones, water, a
place to begin to heal theirtheir sore wounds, and to clean
(22:23):
up when all of a sudden, a groupof Hamas terrorists arrived at
the gate to the farm that theywere all at. And out of a
tremendous fear and lack ofknowledge of what was going to
happen, Shalev and his friendsdecided to hide, and the place
(22:43):
that they found to hide wasunderneath the greenhouse
structure that they had been inbefore, just a few short inches
off of the ground, about a footoff of the ground, they crawled
underneath this building andlaid down On the floor while
listening to the interactionbetween Yunus and the Hamas
(23:04):
terrorists at the gate, whichthey didn't understand at the
time, it was all conversant inArabic. But what they did
understand was that there was ademand for the Jews. Yehud is
what they heard over and overagain, and they had no idea what
was going to happen to them.
They thought that there was achance that this man to save
himself or his family orotherwise, might decide to give
them up. So there they lay atrisk for their lives for hours
(23:28):
until the Hamas terroristseventually left. They tried many
different times in manydifferent gates, and after the
Hamas terrorists left, theyheard that Yunus was calling for
them, but out of fear, theydidn't know if he had struck a
deal with the terrorists and wasgoing to give them up, or what
was going to happen. And itwasn't until Eunice actually
found them, stuck his faceunderneath the building and
(23:52):
found them underneath there, andhe laughed, and he said, my
friends, you are okay. Did theyrealized then that they were
okay and they were going tosurvive, a truly incredible
story in its own right. But thenfrom there, let's add the
following. It wasn't until ourgroup came to Israel and asked
(24:13):
Shalev and Eunice if they wouldspeak to us together that the
two of them reunited at Eunice'shome for the first time, and for
the first time, brought theirfamilies together to meet each
other and to give each other themuch wanted and yearned for,
(24:34):
hugs and thanks for saving eachother's lives and recognizing
that they were all part of thestory of Israel, and that
experience was life changing forso many of us who were able to
be there, that it was the firsttime that these people were able
to come together, live inperson, and bring their families
together.
(24:57):
So let's bring this
David Bryfman (24:58):
down to some basic. Which I think many of our
audience will relate to. Somany, if not most, maybe even
all, Israel trips havetraditionally had this
experience where they go andthey spend the night in a better
intent at the footsteps ofMasada, so they can wake up at
five o'clock the next morningand climb Masada. And in that
(25:19):
better intent they have. Iwouldn't call it a simulation,
because it's sort of, it's sortof real, but it's a touristy
type representation of thebetter ones. It's a bit of a
caricature, I guess, in someways, of participating in
Bedouin culture, although that'swhat tourism and educational
tourism has often been about,and now the story of October 7
sheds a whole different light onthe Bedouin community, the role
(25:42):
of the Bedouins in activelysaving so many Israelis from
Nova, the fact that Bedouinsthemselves were taken hostage
and later found to be killed onOctober 7. I'm using this as a
particular example to show howwe still might go to the Bedouin
tent. And there's still anotherpart of the story to be told.
And I guess this is part of thecomplexity now, of there's a
(26:04):
different Israel educationalexperience that's demanded of us
right now, and you're at theforefront of leading those
changes. So speak a bit aboutthat broader change here, I
guess.
Unknown (26:15):
Yeah, I think you said that beautifully, David. If I
can speak at sort of the highestlevel. I think that one of the
big and most important changesthat we're witnessing in the
Israel educational travel spaceis a shift from travel as as a
means to an end as Israel as thelandscape by which we build
(26:35):
Jewish identity and connectionand caring to Israel that's
really focused on a journey, atrip and a travel experience to
Israel, educational travel beingrich and sophisticated as
education in and of itself, andthe example that you just gave
of the difference betweenengaging with the Bedouin
(26:56):
experience as More of a surfacelevel interaction and engagement
with a different kind of cultureand a different kind of
community. Now, we have both theopportunity and the obligation
to think more about what itmeans to engage with the Bedouin
community in the story andlandscape of Israel today, and
(27:19):
that layered complexity bringson a whole nother level of
educational sophistication ofintention in design and
implementation of trips, andalso requires a different kind
of skill set from the people whoare involved, from everyone who
is thinking about the trips, toThe people who we are selecting
(27:41):
to be our speakers on thosetrips. Right? We're talking
about a kind of richness, a kindof authenticity and a kind of
vulnerability that we have seenin a post 10 seven environment
that is crucially important tothe kinds of trips that we know
we want to continue to designand develop in this year ahead.
David Bryfman (28:03):
So earlier in the conversation, you mentioned
opportunities, and I think oneof the biggest things that we've
seen in the last, you know, 15months or so since Israel,
travel has, you know, I wouldn'tsay returned, but gradually
returned to some sort of likeregularity or pattern, I guess,
is the Advent or thereinvention, or the
reincarnation of volunteerism asa key part of what these trips
(28:24):
are doing. And I want you tospeak a bit about volunteerism,
not so much in terms of peoplecoming to Israel and like doing
something, picking fruit orhelping out the community, but
what it represents for thepossibility for the changing
relationship between Israelisand diaspora Jews. Because one
of the things that has struck memost since I've been there is,
yes, it's been good for me andfor the people that we've
(28:44):
brought to Israel to get toIsrael, but the smile that we
bring to Israelis faces usshowing up has also been really
powerful. So talk a bit aboutvolunteerism and what you think
it represents. Yeah,
Unknown (28:56):
my experience has been very similar. The number of
thanks that I have received forcoming to Israel or bringing
groups to Israel has truly beenextraordinary and service
learning, I think, is atremendous example of a shift
from thinking about Israel andeach other in sort of more of a
transactional way, to thinkingabout each other As part of a
(29:20):
whole that can build and COdesign the future of the Jewish
people hand in hand, literallyand figuratively, right, going
out together into the work ofrebuilding Israel through shared
experiences and a sharedcommitment to doing that work.
So we know from it as data that75% of trips to Israel this last
(29:45):
year included service learningas a core component of them.
That's up from from very, veryfew of them before October 7. So
first thing is that this hasbeen an enormous new. Component
of Israel educational travelexperiences, and many of these
trips have actually beendesigned and focused on service
(30:07):
learning in their own right. Forexample, the onward volunteerism
experiences, which are multiweek programs focused solitarily
on service learning. What wegenerally see and understand
from these experiences is thatthey place all of us as a shared
collective in a larger pictureof the Jewish people who are
(30:30):
working together to build andrebuild Israel for the future.
And I think there are two thingsabout that that are particularly
encouraging and important aboutwhere we go from here and the
continued integration of servicelearning into Israel trips in
2025 The first is that on animpact level, we see really
(30:54):
important changes in the waythat Israel trips are impacting
and creating change in theparticipants, both the Israelis
and the North Americans, throughservice learning. So as you
said, for the Israelis, there'sa true sense of us building a
real, meaningful relationshipand having each other's best
(31:16):
interest in heart, right,joining hand in hand to build
the future of Israel together,but on the North American side,
what our data points to is thattrip participants are walking
away from these service learningexperiences with a sense of
empowerment and a true sense ofagency. And that is a tremendous
and remarkable outcome of doingthis hands on work, is a sense
(31:39):
of being an agent in the storyof the Jewish people. And my
hope is that we're going to seethat translate back into North
American context, with a senseof true ownership and agency in
this next chapter of our story.
So
David Bryfman (31:54):
in your response there, you referred to the sense
that this is a moment of Jewishpeoplehood, and when the people
are Jewish, people are comingtogether. But one of the things
which I think may surprise somelisteners as well is that the
ITA community also includes nonJewish groups that bring
participants to Israel as well,especially Christian groups,
passages being one of them, butiTRAQ also brings graduate
(32:15):
students who are not necessarilyJewish, but talk to us a bit
about the importance of the ITAcommunity also including these
non Jewish allies as part ofthis community that we're trying
to establish together.
Unknown (32:26):
So we've been really privileged to have these other
partners who work with nonJewish groups join the ieta
because they share our commongoals of building connection to
and support for Israel. And manyof these partners have been
deeply involved in thedevelopment and design of trips
even before i eta right. APAC isa part of our coalition as well,
(32:50):
and APAC, in many ways, helpedto create and design what we
think of as allyship tripitineraries and opportunities
over these past 30 plus years,the importance of having these
groups as part of ITA, I think,is twofold. It has impacts on
them and it has impacts on us.
The impact on them is that theseorganizations are committed to
(33:10):
sharing the narrative of theJewish people that we feel as a
community is reflective of whoand what we are at any point in
time, and their commitment todoing that has meant that they
have decided to show up as fulland complete members of our
community so that they can hear,reflect and absorb the stories
(33:30):
that we want told about us, byus, for us, and reflect those in
their context in ways that aremeaningful and directly in
relationship with ourcommunities, that that's piece
number one, sort of the impactthat they're able to have in
reflecting who we are. Butadditionally, these communities
represent a lot of the voicesand people who want to amplify
(33:54):
the Jewish support for theJewish community and support for
Israel back at home, and sothese communities, their
involvement in ieta is alsohelping to build the structure
and the landscape of theinterconnected and woven
communities that we're going toreturn to after our trips, and
knowing that we have peers andcolleagues and allies on the
(34:17):
Campus in our workplaces whosupport us have our back and are
members of a shared communitywith connection and support to
Israel.
David Bryfman (34:28):
Great. All right, Anna, question, without notice,
you're somebody who has workedas both an educator and you've
worked in the foundation world,and now you're working for a
Jewish communal organization.
What's the brief story of of howyou evolved and and what took
you on this journey? It's anentire episode. But what do you
enjoy most about the work you'redoing now and how it intersects
with all the things that you'vebeen doing?
Unknown (34:52):
Look, that's, that's a great question. I'm going to try
to keep it as short as possible.
Look, I got into the Jewishcommunity because. Um, as I
said, I went on a birthrighttrip, and what that showed me
was that there was an activestory of a community that was
telling me that I had somethingto do with it, right, that I
belong to it, and I've chosen afew different routes about how I
(35:14):
wanted to engage with that overtime in my professional career,
most recently being in thephilanthropic setting, and then
choosing now to come back intothe field. And what I'll share
with you was my really bigmotivation. And the difference
that I see right now is thatphilanthropy has an incredibly
important role to play incatalyzing change, supporting
(35:37):
and driving towards the nextlevel and steps that we can have
as as Jewish community, both byencouraging that change and then
and pushing slightly where it'sappropriate, and then seeing
that through with with fundingand support and guidance and
coaching. The one thing that Iknow is that at a time of
increased anti semitism and antiZionist forms of anti semitism.
(36:00):
The Jews have each other. That'swhere I started, and that's
where I'm gonna end for me as acareer and and it's my
obligation and it's my privilegeto be able to build upon that so
David Bryfman (36:13):
and a last question for you in the one
which I've asked almost all ofmy guests on adapting, who's an
educator who has inspired andmaybe even transformed you along
your journey. Oh
Unknown (36:22):
my gosh. To list them would not be fair, and I have to
tell you that it was atremendous privilege to look out
at the ITA Leaders Summitrecently and realize how many of
the educators who were in thatroom had transformed my life. So
first, I owe a debt of gratitudeto so many people who have been
with me along the way, butthere's one that I'm going to
(36:44):
shout out right now, inparticular because of the number
of ways that she impacted medirectly in my current thinking
about my work. And that is mycolleague, my friend, and my
fellow ginger Shelly kdar, headof the Connect unit at the
Jewish Agency for Israelcurrently, and my first boss at
Hillel International, whilewe're working together to found
(37:06):
the Israel department there. AndShelly taught me so many things
about Jewish leadership andabout Israel, and about how we
as a Jewish people have a storyand a history to bind us
together that can guide andreturn us to where we can be of
best service to each other intimes of challenge and crisis.
(37:29):
But there's one specific thingthat I'm going to tell you that
she has said to me that hasstuck with me every single day
since I have chosen a professionin Israel, education, and that
is a really uncomfortable,challenging place for a lot of
people. And Shelley gave me thisword of wisdom. She said to me,
(37:49):
comfort is not a Jewish value.
In fact, discomfort is a Jewishvalue, and that, to me, is our
intellectual tradition. It's ourheritage. It's how we know how
to talk to each other. Is acrossdifference and Israel. Education
is the opportunity for us to beauthentic in our Jewish skin and
to bring each other closertogether through our continued
(38:12):
learning and striving to seeeach other across our
differences.
David Bryfman (38:21):
Anna, thanks so much for joining us on adapting
today. I knew this would be aninsightful conversation, and
we'd start talking about youractual role, and then really
broker into like, the key issuesthat we're all grappling with.
And I think that that's soclearly evident, that the work
you're doing embodies so much ofyour passion, and you can feel
so drawn to as both yourpersonal and your career path
(38:44):
are seemingly intertwined. Sothank you so much for sharing
with us all today.
Unknown (38:49):
Thank you, David, it's been a privilege. Today's
episode
David Bryfman (38:52):
of adapting was produced by Dina nussenbaum and
Miranda Lapides. The show'sexecutive producers are myself,
Karen Cummins and Essen lieben.
Our show is engineered andedited, as always, by Nathan J
Bourne of njv media. If youenjoyed today's episode of
adapting, please leave us a fivestar rating on Apple podcast.
Leave us a comment, and evenbetter still, share it with a
friend to learn more about theJewish education project. Visit
us at jewished project.org,there you can see and learn
(39:14):
about our mission history andstaff. And as always, we are a
proud partner PGA Federation ofNew York, thank you as always,
for listening today. You.
We are recording today's episode of adapting on
(00:02):
february 14, 2025 and I'm joinedby my colleague and friend, Anna
Langer from the Israeleducational travel Alliance. And
today's conversation is not justabout her work, but about the
emerging field of Israel,educational travel, and a recent
trip to Israel whereby peoplecame together to discuss what
the future of Israel educationaltravel looks like in a post
October 7 world. But as you'llsoon see, it's more than just
(00:23):
about Israel educational travel.
You've heard about some of theprograms, like birthright, route
one and masa, honeymoon, Israelmomentum. It's more than just
about the programs. It's aboutwhat they represent in the
ongoing chapter and evolution ofthe relationship between
Israelis and people all aroundthe world, not just Jews, which
is something which we do exploreas well, and I'm sure you will
enjoy today's episode ofadapting as much as I did, not
just for what it tells us aboutthis field, but also about the
(00:46):
issues that it shares with usand the questions that it asks
us and challenges us aboutIsrael today, in the world in
which we live, this is adaptingthe future of Jewish education,
a podcast from the Jewisheducation project, where we
Explore the big questions,challenges and successes that
define Jewish education. I'mDavid Bryant.
(01:10):
ANNA Lange is the vice presidentof North American Israel
strategy at Jewish Federationsof North America, and one of her
roles there is overseeing theIsrael educational travel
Alliance. In full disclosure, Iam also part of the Israel
educational travel Alliance asthe co chair with my colleague
from birthright Israel, Lizsikolski, but it's today that
I'm really pleased to have thisconversation with Anna, and
(01:32):
welcome her to adapting today.
Unknown (01:34):
Thank you, David. Glad to be here. Anna, can you tell
us
David Bryfman (01:38):
about your first trip to Israel, and if there's
anything specific about thatfirst trip that was particularly
meaningful to you, wow,
Unknown (01:49):
okay, my first trip to Israel was in 2008 it was two
days after I had graduated MountHolyoke College, and I showed up
on a trip that My cousin wassupposed to join me on, and
canceled at the last moment, abirthright trip meeting in JFK
with just a duffel bag and noidea of what was going to come
(02:11):
next. So first, I'll say justabout everything was a surprise
from the moment that I landed atBen Gurion airport and I
realized that Jews weren't onlydoctors, but were also air
traffic controllers and janitorsand and also that the food was
really good, and it wasn't justbagels and Chinese food, as my
aunt and uncle and grandparentshad prepared me to believe
(02:33):
Jewish cuisine was. But I'lltell you two things that struck
me the most. The first was whenI walked the streets of Israel
for the first time. I could notbelieve. I could not wrap my
head around the fact that I wasin the place that my
grandparents had dreamed ofgoing, not only that they had
(02:55):
dreamed of going, but theirparents before them and their
grandparents before them, butspecifically my grandparents,
Holocaust survivors that theyhad yearned for with every fiber
of their being, for their ownsafety and security, and that I
could actually be there walkingon those streets was a miracle
to me. And the other piece waswhile I was on my journey and
(03:18):
spending, you know, two secondstrying to catch some shut eye on
the birthright bus in betweenthe Dead Sea and Masada. It
turned out I was much lessinterested in catching those few
moments of sleep than I was inhearing about the experiences of
the Israelis who were on the buswith me. Those Israelis the same
age as myself, were in seniorpositions in the army, where
(03:41):
they were making life and deathdecisions on the day to day for
their own peers, and the levelof maturity, the level of
sophistication of the challengesahead of them, and recognizing
that if my family history hadbeen slightly different, that I
could have been in their shoes.
Blew my mind and forever placedme in the position of thinking,
(04:06):
Okay, I'm gum. Ve gum. I couldhave been them, and so I will
be. And that's actually whatdrove me to make Aliyah later in
my 20s, because I see that it'sjust sliding doors. I might have
ended up there, and I want towake up each day and think about
myself as what it would havelooked like if I were because
they are us too. And that's thething that broke me open. I'm
(04:29):
always going to be gum ve gum.
I'm never just going to be onething again. So
David Bryfman (04:35):
for those in the audience who do not know what
the ieta is, tell us what it'sall about.
Unknown (04:41):
So the ITA is the Israel educational travel
Alliance. The ita represents 140organizations who take North
Americans on trips to Israel tointroduce them to Israel, mostly
for the first time. So some ofour partners include.
Birthright. Route one, whichDavid breichman is very familiar
(05:04):
with, teen trips to Israel.
Momentum, which takes trips formothers. AIPAC eye track, taking
trips for non Jewish individualsto Israel as well. And all of
the ITA partners have a fewthings in common. The first is
that they are focused onbringing individuals to Israel
to develop a connection to andsupport for Israel among
(05:25):
participants, and for those whoare bringing Jews, sparking
Jewish identity among Jewishpopulations as well. So we're
140 organizations strong, nonprofit partners in the US, and
we also work closely with Israelbased operators of trips,
including tour operatingorganizations and tour
(05:47):
educators, who design andimplement trips directly on the
ground. So everybody
David Bryfman (05:54):
here is familiar with trips to Israel. They've
been going on for decades anddecades, and all of a sudden,
you're now talking about anorganization which brings them
all together. So why do theyneed some collective body to
help them coalesce? Well,luckily,
Unknown (06:06):
the field dreamed this up by itself, for itself. So
starting in 2020 the ITA wasactually sort of founded,
initially as a WhatsApp group,which, knowing that we're
dealing with Israel, feelsparticularly appropriate. So if
you can put yourself back in thememory of the COVID crisis of
the first few weeks of learningthat the world was shutting
(06:29):
down, a number of the leaders ofthe Israel travel organizations
that we now represent birthrighthoneymoon to Israel momentum
realized that they needed someinformation from each other
about the immediate adaptationsthat they were making to their
trips. Were they still sendingtrips? Piece number one, what
were they telling theirrecruited participants whose
(06:51):
trips might now be canceled ordelayed? How were they moving
forward with marketing? Werethey continuing to market and
recruit? It started veryorganically among these leaders
who were looking to each otherfor answers, solutions and for
peers to think these challengesthrough. And from there, the
expansion of the ieta was wasactually very fast. I've been
(07:16):
involved with ieta since thoseinitial conversations, which
expanded to include funders whowere supporting the field of
Israel educational travel, tothink about what these decisions
were other organizations whoneeded working groups to think
through the questions of gettingmoney back from airlines, for
example, things as practical asthat, as things to as
(07:38):
complicated to What would be theeducation that we would offer
instead of Israel trips, when itturned out, the trips were not
able to happen, and from there,Ita has grown in its function
and in its capacities over thepast five years, to truly be a
network space And to bestpractices sharing apparatus to
(08:01):
help to support the field ofIsrael educational travel, not
only in its continued goal tobring people to Israel to
develop that caring andconnection, but also to support
the field through many continuedcrises and adaptations from
COVID into The judicial reformsand now through the events of
(08:22):
October 7 and the war, this hasbeen a field that has
continually faced enormouschallenge and has needed each
other to adjust.
David Bryfman (08:31):
So on one hand, this could be an episode about
the things that we picked upduring COVID and what we've
previously called COVID keepersadapting, being one of them. But
this is one of those things thatmany people in the community
have said should have existedlong before, and it took
something like COVID to bringthe field together to talk about
these issues. And then no oneexpected, like all of us, no one
(08:53):
expected the events of October 7to really formalize and
crystallize the need for thiscollective to come together. So
I want to move a bit away fromtalking about the IATA
specifically, and more about theissues that you're confronting
and what we're all dealing withas a field. And maybe let's just
start off with the hardestquestion of all of what are the
challenges now facing the Israeleducational travel field after
(09:16):
October 7?
Unknown (09:18):
Wow. First, the challenges are just as big as
the opportunities. I think thatone of the true assets of Israel
educational travel is that everychallenge presents an enormous
opportunity as well. So thefirst challenge that the field
of Israel educational travel hasis to bring Israel trips, to
(09:41):
bring our field back at scale.
Now. Why is that a challenge?
Certainly, it's a challenge forall organizations right now to
think about going back to aroutine when it comes to Israel,
but for the field of Israeleducational travel, this
challenge is uniquely important.
Important and unique in its ownright. Number one, Israel,
(10:02):
educational travel is the mostimportant tool that we know,
that we have to developconnection and caring for Israel
among Jews and non Jews alike.
Pew studies from birthright,recent studies from boundless
Israel, all point to Israeleducational travel as being one
(10:24):
of the, if not the mostimportant mechanism for
developing that caring andconnection. Why is that a
challenge today? That's, as Isaid, both an enormous
opportunity and a tremendouschallenge, because the content
that happens on trips matters sosignificantly to the the
outcomes that they produce andto developing that ongoing
(10:47):
connection and caring for Israelamong its participants, so how
to adjust the core narrative ofwhat Israel educational travel
says Israel is about in a post,10, seven or more for Israelis,
the ongoing, terrible day andnight of October 7 is an
(11:08):
enormous challenge that has yetto be answered by any one
organization or community. Howwe are sharing our story, and
what that story is, I think,really differs depending on our
audiences, on our communities,and what we want that story to
be, look significantly differenteven this year than last year.
(11:29):
So last year, we know thatIsrael educational travel trips
were mostly about solidarity,showing caring and connection
directly for the people ofIsrael and reinforcing existing
ties where we had them. Thisnext year, we are writing the
new chapter, the next chapter inthe story of the Jewish people,
(11:50):
about who we are, individuallyand as a collective. Coming in
and through this period ofchallenge and change and
solidarity is certainly anaspect of that. But how we are
integrating October 7 andOctober 8, for those of us
living in North America, intothat shared story, is the
(12:12):
challenge and the opportunity ofIsrael educational travel this
next year. So Anna,
David Bryfman (12:17):
I realized, as I asked the question, and then
certainly is you responded toit. We sort of, in some ways, we
jumped right ahead, right wejumped right ahead to what we're
doing. And I think part of thethe challenge of this
conversation is theacknowledgement that here in
North America and around theworld, we're trying to return
back to not normal, but returnback to what we know works. And
(12:39):
Israel is still in this in thisperiod where it's not fully
recovered, or not fully out ofthe aftermath of October 7. And
here we are talking, I don'twant to use the word privilege
necessarily, but we're talkingfrom this place of a different
perspective, where we're talkingabout our need to get our young
people to Israel. And then youand I both know, and we were
both there recently together,that that Israel is going
through its own its own trauma,its own recovery, and we're both
(13:01):
cognizant of that, even thoughour work mandates demand us to
try and get back to, I'm loatheto say, as normal as possible,
but are returning to the way wewant things to be. Yeah, I
Unknown (13:11):
think that hits the nail on the head. Look, Israel
travel has been anextraordinarily important aspect
of Jewish American life for over25 years now, we are now
celebrating birthrights 25thanniversary, which has been a
watershed for Jewish communityin so many ways over these past
(13:31):
25 years, myself includedIsrael, educational travel has
been foundational to How JewishAmerican North American
communities think aboutdeveloping and enhancing true
connection and caring for Israelover a generation at this point,
and our need to return to thatnot only is true at this
(13:53):
specific moment, but actuallyhas been true since the founding
of ieta. So as we were talkingabout before you know, Iita came
out of this moment in 2020 whenwe were losing access to our
most important pipeline, again,not only for developing caring
and connection for Israel, but Iused to work at Hillel
(14:13):
International. And I can tellyou that many of the Israel
leaders that I worked with atHillel International, the
student leaders, elected tobecome student leaders because
of a transformative experiencethat they had on an Israel
educational travel journey, andthat to me, when I was in those
shoes, meant I was missing thepipeline of people of next
(14:33):
generation of leadership that Ineeded for the continuity of
Jewish community and to continueto enhance and build those
connections to Israel among thenext generation so that need to
return to some version of normalon our side, I'd say, is almost
an imperative of us trying tocreate the fabric that ties our
(14:56):
community together, whilesimultaneously. Dealing with the
realities of October 8 Judaismover here, which I think is our
version of living in the longnight of October 7 is the change
to Jewish identity and how weare asked to atone for Israel,
relate to Israel, and stand upfor Israel in public settings
(15:18):
now in America as Jews becauseof the way that the war is being
put on center stage and centerplate in American discourse, in
our schools, on our socialmedia, in all aspects of Jewish
life. So
David Bryfman (15:33):
let's get down to the on the ground, because you
and I have been to Israel now afew times since October 7, and
we know from our own experiencethat every time we go, we meet
with someone or we see somethingthat I wouldn't say necessarily
shakes us to our core. But I'vehad those experiences as well.
Share with the audience someexperiences you've had recently
where even you as someoneorganizing these trips, is like,
(15:55):
come into contact with Israelisor with people in Israel and
said, Wow, that's just somethingI needed to hear directly from
them.
Unknown (16:03):
Yeah, wow, you are so right that it happens every
time, no matter how many times Igo. So one arc of our experience
comes to mind for me during ourIsrael educational travel
alliance leader summit justrecently, this January in
Israel, we spent one day wherewe took half of the group to the
(16:27):
south and half of the group tothe north to explore how to
share the stories of war. Movinginto 2025 and David, I think you
and I have probably both beendown south many, many times
since the onset of the war onOctober 7, 2023, but the thing
(16:48):
that just shook me to my corethis time was going down to the
south with a mixed group ofnonprofit leadership who build
and design Israel educationalexperiences from within the IATA
community, and those toureducators that we work so
(17:10):
closely with to implement and tosee our vision through on the
ground. And what I learned whenI went down south with that
group is that some of these toureducators who have not been
working this last year, who havebeen serving in millewee or
taking care of children whiletheir spouses are in millim or
(17:30):
unable to work in this fieldbecause of the slowdown of trips
they were going to the south Forthe first time, witnessing
Israelis react to being in thesouth for the first time. I
don't really have words todescribe it, because they also
lacked words to describe theirown experience. And what struck
(17:54):
me about that is that many NorthAmerican trips have been going
there many times over, as youand I have and so even the
experience of the story thatwe're telling of Israel today
looks so different depending onwhat experiences and access you
have been provided. And what wasreally opening to me as well was
to hear the Israeli guidesthemselves talk about how they
(18:17):
needed to be there together, toprocess, to be in community, and
wanted to be in conversationswith us about how we understood
what these sites signified toour communities and what stories
we were hoping we would be ableto share collectively.
David Bryfman (18:32):
So it's probably true to say, at least for the
near future, that Israel tripswill now have different sites on
their radar. I think it's safeto say that very few Israel
educational trips ever went toany of the communities near the
Gaza envelope before they mayhave driven through steroto,
maybe, but now that's going tobe certainly part of the the
(18:54):
tour itinerary, and what a crassuse of frame as itinerary. But
the Nova festival site is goingto be a place where all groups
will want to, I guess, make apilgrimage to and to and to bear
witness, and to to say cutish,to say the memorial prayer there
as well. And I think it'ssomething that you and I have
discussed before, that thetendency to focus on visiting
(19:15):
the kibbutzim that were, youknow, massacred and destroyed,
and the side of the Novafestival that will be part and
parcel of what we do. But youalso had another experience
there, which I want you to tellthe tell the group about,
because I think out of all ofthe devastation of October 7
came some stories of heroism andresilience. So talk to us a bit
about one of those visits thatyou had down south this time.
Unknown (19:37):
Yeah, for sure. And before I move to that David, I
just want to note and recognizeone of the reasons why we we
went down south, is because thekibbutzim are closed for public
audiences this year, per therequest of their residents, and
understanding and designingitineraries for. 2025 needed to
(20:02):
put on the table. What are wegoing to do? Where are we going
to go? Which stories are wegoing to tell now that the
kibbutzim are not going to be apart of our itineraries, how do
we want to bear witness? Is itjust Nova? Is it Nova and
people? Is it Nova andvolunteerism, service learning,
to be able to build and servethese communities again, and to
(20:24):
give us the opportunity to trulyexplore what the value
proposition is in taking groupsdown south and to give the space
for us all to process and thinkabout educational design
together. So So you mentionedtwo incredibly unique
individuals that our trip hadthe opportunity to spend time
with. So we had a, I'm going tosay, once in a lifetime
(20:48):
opportunity to spend time with anova survivor. And as he calls
him as our Nova survivor, Shalevcalls him Eunice, his angel, his
savior. Shalev is a youngIsraeli, former IDF participant
who went away on his big tripabroad, following his army
(21:13):
service, and came back just alittle bit early to be with some
friends on holiday back inIsrael for Simchat Torah, and
ended up being invited by somefriends to go down to the Nova
Festival, where he went and washaving a absolutely fantastic
time until the beginning of themorning, when, of course, the
(21:36):
events of October 7, as we nowunderstood them, began to
unfold, and while Shalev and hisfriends were trying to escape
with their lives, they raneventually around eight
kilometers to a farm where theyfound a greenhouse, and they
started to hide in thegreenhouse until they realized
that there were people there atthe farm, and the person who was
(21:58):
there at the farm was this manwho They did not know at the
time was named Eunice, who camein and asked them what they
needed and who they were. Theywere, of course, very fearful of
him, because he was Arab inappearance. And Eunice ended up
offering them shelter, a placeto charge their phones, water, a
place to begin to heal theirtheir sore wounds, and to clean
(22:23):
up when all of a sudden, a groupof Hamas terrorists arrived at
the gate to the farm that theywere all at. And out of a
tremendous fear and lack ofknowledge of what was going to
happen, Shalev and his friendsdecided to hide, and the place
(22:43):
that they found to hide wasunderneath the greenhouse
structure that they had been inbefore, just a few short inches
off of the ground, about a footoff of the ground, they crawled
underneath this building andlaid down On the floor while
listening to the interactionbetween Yunus and the Hamas
(23:04):
terrorists at the gate, whichthey didn't understand at the
time, it was all conversant inArabic. But what they did
understand was that there was ademand for the Jews. Yehud is
what they heard over and overagain, and they had no idea what
was going to happen to them.
They thought that there was achance that this man to save
himself or his family orotherwise, might decide to give
them up. So there they lay atrisk for their lives for hours
(23:28):
until the Hamas terroristseventually left. They tried many
different times in manydifferent gates, and after the
Hamas terrorists left, theyheard that Yunus was calling for
them, but out of fear, theydidn't know if he had struck a
deal with the terrorists and wasgoing to give them up, or what
was going to happen. And itwasn't until Eunice actually
found them, stuck his faceunderneath the building and
(23:52):
found them underneath there, andhe laughed, and he said, my
friends, you are okay. Did theyrealized then that they were
okay and they were going tosurvive, a truly incredible
story in its own right. But thenfrom there, let's add the
following. It wasn't until ourgroup came to Israel and asked
(24:13):
Shalev and Eunice if they wouldspeak to us together that the
two of them reunited at Eunice'shome for the first time, and for
the first time, brought theirfamilies together to meet each
other and to give each other themuch wanted and yearned for,
(24:34):
hugs and thanks for saving eachother's lives and recognizing
that they were all part of thestory of Israel, and that
experience was life changing forso many of us who were able to
be there, that it was the firsttime that these people were able
to come together, live inperson, and bring their families
together.
(24:57):
So let's bring this
David Bryfman (24:58):
down to some basic. Which I think many of our
audience will relate to. Somany, if not most, maybe even
all, Israel trips havetraditionally had this
experience where they go andthey spend the night in a better
intent at the footsteps ofMasada, so they can wake up at
five o'clock the next morningand climb Masada. And in that
(25:19):
better intent they have. Iwouldn't call it a simulation,
because it's sort of, it's sortof real, but it's a touristy
type representation of thebetter ones. It's a bit of a
caricature, I guess, in someways, of participating in
Bedouin culture, although that'swhat tourism and educational
tourism has often been about,and now the story of October 7
sheds a whole different light onthe Bedouin community, the role
(25:42):
of the Bedouins in activelysaving so many Israelis from
Nova, the fact that Bedouinsthemselves were taken hostage
and later found to be killed onOctober 7. I'm using this as a
particular example to show howwe still might go to the Bedouin
tent. And there's still anotherpart of the story to be told.
And I guess this is part of thecomplexity now, of there's a
(26:04):
different Israel educationalexperience that's demanded of us
right now, and you're at theforefront of leading those
changes. So speak a bit aboutthat broader change here, I
guess.
Unknown (26:15):
Yeah, I think you said that beautifully, David. If I
can speak at sort of the highestlevel. I think that one of the
big and most important changesthat we're witnessing in the
Israel educational travel spaceis a shift from travel as as a
means to an end as Israel as thelandscape by which we build
(26:35):
Jewish identity and connectionand caring to Israel that's
really focused on a journey, atrip and a travel experience to
Israel, educational travel beingrich and sophisticated as
education in and of itself, andthe example that you just gave
of the difference betweenengaging with the Bedouin
(26:56):
experience as More of a surfacelevel interaction and engagement
with a different kind of cultureand a different kind of
community. Now, we have both theopportunity and the obligation
to think more about what itmeans to engage with the Bedouin
community in the story andlandscape of Israel today, and
(27:19):
that layered complexity bringson a whole nother level of
educational sophistication ofintention in design and
implementation of trips, andalso requires a different kind
of skill set from the people whoare involved, from everyone who
is thinking about the trips, toThe people who we are selecting
(27:41):
to be our speakers on thosetrips. Right? We're talking
about a kind of richness, a kindof authenticity and a kind of
vulnerability that we have seenin a post 10 seven environment
that is crucially important tothe kinds of trips that we know
we want to continue to designand develop in this year ahead.
David Bryfman (28:03):
So earlier in the conversation, you mentioned
opportunities, and I think oneof the biggest things that we've
seen in the last, you know, 15months or so since Israel,
travel has, you know, I wouldn'tsay returned, but gradually
returned to some sort of likeregularity or pattern, I guess,
is the Advent or thereinvention, or the
reincarnation of volunteerism asa key part of what these trips
(28:24):
are doing. And I want you tospeak a bit about volunteerism,
not so much in terms of peoplecoming to Israel and like doing
something, picking fruit orhelping out the community, but
what it represents for thepossibility for the changing
relationship between Israelisand diaspora Jews. Because one
of the things that has struck memost since I've been there is,
yes, it's been good for me andfor the people that we've
(28:44):
brought to Israel to get toIsrael, but the smile that we
bring to Israelis faces usshowing up has also been really
powerful. So talk a bit aboutvolunteerism and what you think
it represents. Yeah,
Unknown (28:56):
my experience has been very similar. The number of
thanks that I have received forcoming to Israel or bringing
groups to Israel has truly beenextraordinary and service
learning, I think, is atremendous example of a shift
from thinking about Israel andeach other in sort of more of a
transactional way, to thinkingabout each other As part of a
(29:20):
whole that can build and COdesign the future of the Jewish
people hand in hand, literallyand figuratively, right, going
out together into the work ofrebuilding Israel through shared
experiences and a sharedcommitment to doing that work.
So we know from it as data that75% of trips to Israel this last
(29:45):
year included service learningas a core component of them.
That's up from from very, veryfew of them before October 7. So
first thing is that this hasbeen an enormous new. Component
of Israel educational travelexperiences, and many of these
trips have actually beendesigned and focused on service
(30:07):
learning in their own right. Forexample, the onward volunteerism
experiences, which are multiweek programs focused solitarily
on service learning. What wegenerally see and understand
from these experiences is thatthey place all of us as a shared
collective in a larger pictureof the Jewish people who are
(30:30):
working together to build andrebuild Israel for the future.
And I think there are two thingsabout that that are particularly
encouraging and important aboutwhere we go from here and the
continued integration of servicelearning into Israel trips in
2025 The first is that on animpact level, we see really
(30:54):
important changes in the waythat Israel trips are impacting
and creating change in theparticipants, both the Israelis
and the North Americans, throughservice learning. So as you
said, for the Israelis, there'sa true sense of us building a
real, meaningful relationshipand having each other's best
(31:16):
interest in heart, right,joining hand in hand to build
the future of Israel together,but on the North American side,
what our data points to is thattrip participants are walking
away from these service learningexperiences with a sense of
empowerment and a true sense ofagency. And that is a tremendous
and remarkable outcome of doingthis hands on work, is a sense
(31:39):
of being an agent in the storyof the Jewish people. And my
hope is that we're going to seethat translate back into North
American context, with a senseof true ownership and agency in
this next chapter of our story.
So
David Bryfman (31:54):
in your response there, you referred to the sense
that this is a moment of Jewishpeoplehood, and when the people
are Jewish, people are comingtogether. But one of the things
which I think may surprise somelisteners as well is that the
ITA community also includes nonJewish groups that bring
participants to Israel as well,especially Christian groups,
passages being one of them, butiTRAQ also brings graduate
(32:15):
students who are not necessarilyJewish, but talk to us a bit
about the importance of the ITAcommunity also including these
non Jewish allies as part ofthis community that we're trying
to establish together.
Unknown (32:26):
So we've been really privileged to have these other
partners who work with nonJewish groups join the ieta
because they share our commongoals of building connection to
and support for Israel. And manyof these partners have been
deeply involved in thedevelopment and design of trips
even before i eta right. APAC isa part of our coalition as well,
(32:50):
and APAC, in many ways, helpedto create and design what we
think of as allyship tripitineraries and opportunities
over these past 30 plus years,the importance of having these
groups as part of ITA, I think,is twofold. It has impacts on
them and it has impacts on us.
The impact on them is that theseorganizations are committed to
(33:10):
sharing the narrative of theJewish people that we feel as a
community is reflective of whoand what we are at any point in
time, and their commitment todoing that has meant that they
have decided to show up as fulland complete members of our
community so that they can hear,reflect and absorb the stories
(33:30):
that we want told about us, byus, for us, and reflect those in
their context in ways that aremeaningful and directly in
relationship with ourcommunities, that that's piece
number one, sort of the impactthat they're able to have in
reflecting who we are. Butadditionally, these communities
represent a lot of the voicesand people who want to amplify
(33:54):
the Jewish support for theJewish community and support for
Israel back at home, and sothese communities, their
involvement in ieta is alsohelping to build the structure
and the landscape of theinterconnected and woven
communities that we're going toreturn to after our trips, and
knowing that we have peers andcolleagues and allies on the
(34:17):
Campus in our workplaces whosupport us have our back and are
members of a shared communitywith connection and support to
Israel.
David Bryfman (34:28):
Great. All right, Anna, question, without notice,
you're somebody who has workedas both an educator and you've
worked in the foundation world,and now you're working for a
Jewish communal organization.
What's the brief story of of howyou evolved and and what took
you on this journey? It's anentire episode. But what do you
enjoy most about the work you'redoing now and how it intersects
with all the things that you'vebeen doing?
Unknown (34:52):
Look, that's, that's a great question. I'm going to try
to keep it as short as possible.
Look, I got into the Jewishcommunity because. Um, as I
said, I went on a birthrighttrip, and what that showed me
was that there was an activestory of a community that was
telling me that I had somethingto do with it, right, that I
belong to it, and I've chosen afew different routes about how I
(35:14):
wanted to engage with that overtime in my professional career,
most recently being in thephilanthropic setting, and then
choosing now to come back intothe field. And what I'll share
with you was my really bigmotivation. And the difference
that I see right now is thatphilanthropy has an incredibly
important role to play incatalyzing change, supporting
(35:37):
and driving towards the nextlevel and steps that we can have
as as Jewish community, both byencouraging that change and then
and pushing slightly where it'sappropriate, and then seeing
that through with with fundingand support and guidance and
coaching. The one thing that Iknow is that at a time of
increased anti semitism and antiZionist forms of anti semitism.
(36:00):
The Jews have each other. That'swhere I started, and that's
where I'm gonna end for me as acareer and and it's my
obligation and it's my privilegeto be able to build upon that so
David Bryfman (36:13):
and a last question for you in the one
which I've asked almost all ofmy guests on adapting, who's an
educator who has inspired andmaybe even transformed you along
your journey. Oh
Unknown (36:22):
my gosh. To list them would not be fair, and I have to
tell you that it was atremendous privilege to look out
at the ITA Leaders Summitrecently and realize how many of
the educators who were in thatroom had transformed my life. So
first, I owe a debt of gratitudeto so many people who have been
with me along the way, butthere's one that I'm going to
(36:44):
shout out right now, inparticular because of the number
of ways that she impacted medirectly in my current thinking
about my work. And that is mycolleague, my friend, and my
fellow ginger Shelly kdar, headof the Connect unit at the
Jewish Agency for Israelcurrently, and my first boss at
Hillel International, whilewe're working together to found
(37:06):
the Israel department there. AndShelly taught me so many things
about Jewish leadership andabout Israel, and about how we
as a Jewish people have a storyand a history to bind us
together that can guide andreturn us to where we can be of
best service to each other intimes of challenge and crisis.
(37:29):
But there's one specific thingthat I'm going to tell you that
she has said to me that hasstuck with me every single day
since I have chosen a professionin Israel, education, and that
is a really uncomfortable,challenging place for a lot of
people. And Shelley gave me thisword of wisdom. She said to me,
(37:49):
comfort is not a Jewish value.
In fact, discomfort is a Jewishvalue, and that, to me, is our
intellectual tradition. It's ourheritage. It's how we know how
to talk to each other. Is acrossdifference and Israel. Education
is the opportunity for us to beauthentic in our Jewish skin and
to bring each other closertogether through our continued
(38:12):
learning and striving to seeeach other across our
differences.
David Bryfman (38:21):
Anna, thanks so much for joining us on adapting
today. I knew this would be aninsightful conversation, and
we'd start talking about youractual role, and then really
broker into like, the key issuesthat we're all grappling with.
And I think that that's soclearly evident, that the work
you're doing embodies so much ofyour passion, and you can feel
so drawn to as both yourpersonal and your career path
(38:44):
are seemingly intertwined. Sothank you so much for sharing
with us all today.
Unknown (38:49):
Thank you, David, it's been a privilege. Today's
episode
David Bryfman (38:52):
of adapting was produced by Dina nussenbaum and
Miranda Lapides. The show'sexecutive producers are myself,
Karen Cummins and Essen lieben.
Our show is engineered andedited, as always, by Nathan J
Bourne of njv media. If youenjoyed today's episode of
adapting, please leave us a fivestar rating on Apple podcast.
Leave us a comment, and evenbetter still, share it with a
friend to learn more about theJewish education project. Visit
us at jewished project.org,there you can see and learn
(39:14):
about our mission history andstaff. And as always, we are a
proud partner PGA Federation ofNew York, thank you as always,
for listening today. You.
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