February 21, 2024 • 51 mins
This week, we sit down with Pato Sapir, a Salesforce MVP and marketing aficionado, who shares his story in moving from website developer to Data Cloud expert in our latest conversation. Pato's leap from developer to project manager to Data Cloud admin exemplifies that the path to mastery is inspirational. His insights are a beacon for new admins navigating the Salesforce ecosystem, showcasing how a blend of emotional intelligence, communication, and technical skills can pave the way to success.
Pato's narrative is a captivating one, tracing his roots from working at a telecommunications company in Bueno Aires, Argentina to pioneering in the CRM and email marketing space. Through the fusion of ExactTarget and Salesforce, he reveals the profound opportunities that emerged in his career. It's a story that champions curiosity and inventive data use to create personalized customer journeys. For those looking to dive deeper into Data Cloud capabilities, Pato discusses the scarcity of written resources, the richness of video content available, and why a solid grasp of basic database design is critical for admins.
We wrap up with a forward-looking discussion on the evolving role of full-stack admins. In a world where Data Cloud and AI are becoming ever more entwined in our CRM strategies, Pato stresses the importance of emotional intelligence and the art of clear communication within our data-driven industries. His recommendations for continuous learning and staying abreast of industry shifts are not to be missed by anyone aiming to maximize their potential in the Salesforce arena. Join us for this treasure trove of insights, where Pato's shared experiences lay the groundwork for your own professional evolution.
Pato Sapir is the Founder and Sr. Solutions Consultant at Devs United, a Salesforce Partner specializing in providing digital marketing solutions powered by Salesforce. Pato started his career in software development more than 15 years ago in Buenos Aires, Argentina, and moved to Cleveland Ohio in 2009. His journey with Salesforce started in 2012 as a Technical Architect working with Exact Target (Now known as Salesforce Marketing Cloud Engagement) and in 2015 Pato decided to start his own business. Pato’s passion is to help his team and clients solve impossible challenges and to share his experience with the Marketing Cloud community.
linkedin.com/in/patosapir/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:16):
Good morning and good afternoon.
My name is Jacob Catalano andwelcome to another episode of
Admins of Tomorrow.
For new admins joining theSalesforce ecosystem, there is a
ton to learn and just as muchto really be proficient in so
that you can be successful andhave a long, lasting career.
For these new admins, we seethe terms AI plus data plus CRM
(00:40):
on Salesforce commercials and inother mediums.
Well, we've already, in thelast few episodes, talked about
AI and how new admins should bethinking about using AI, whether
you're an admin, a developer ora marketer, and we've already
talked a lot about justgenerally being an admin for the
core sales cloud.
But what we haven't really dovetoo much in is the layer that's
(01:01):
probably the most importantpiece to connect all of this
together data.
So that's why this week, wewant to talk about de-misdefying
data cloud, finding ways forthe new admin to feel more
comfortable, one talking aboutthis subject, but also finding
ways outside of Trailhead tobecome wildly successful.
So that's why this week, we'vebrought in Salesforce MVP and
(01:23):
marketing champion, pato Sapir.
I've had the pleasure ofknowing Pato for quite some time
now and being able to see himspeak on marketing cloud and
data cloud, and the one thingthat I've loved hearing him talk
the most about is how he gotstarted.
It's so fascinating to hear thestory about someone goes from
developer to project manager, todata cloud admin and also start
(01:47):
his own business.
I'm really excited to have ustake the time today and talk
through Pato's story.
So, without further ado, let'smeet Pato.
So, without further ado, let'smeet Pato.
Pato Sapir is the founder andsenior solutions consultant at
Debs United, a Salesforcepartner specialized in providing
(02:08):
digital marketing solutionspowered by Salesforce.
Pato started his career insoftware development more than
15 years ago in Buenos Aires,argentina, and moved to
Cleveland, ohio, in 2009.
His journey with Salesforcestarted in 2012 as a technical
architect working with ExactTarget, now known as Salesforce
(02:28):
Marketing Cloud Engagement, andin 2015, pato decided to start
his own business.
Pato's passion is to help histeam and clients to solve
impossible challenges and toshare his experiences with the
marketing cloud community.
So let's not waste any moretime and dive on in.
Well, I really appreciate you,though, for taking the time.
(03:04):
Everyone's schedules at thestart of the year are absolutely
insane, and so just taking anhour, hour and a half out of
your day to sit down and talkthrough this very complex topic
is much appreciated.
So today I want to dive into alittle bit of the title of the
episode.
There's no spoilers here aDemystifying Data Cloud.
(03:25):
When we think of this system,when we think of.
AI and all the systems that kindof are hot topics for the
ecosystem right now.
There's a lot of kind of thisis too complex for me, I'm not
going to learn it.
Or if I am going to learn it,I'm going to need hundreds of
dollars worth of training andcertifications and so on and so
(03:45):
forth.
And, having now had thepleasure of sitting down with a
few advocates in the ecosystemto learn more about the AI Cloud
, it's so not as complex andscary as we give it the credit
for.
So, before we dive into thattopic, I'd love for you to be
able to give a quickintroduction of yourself, kind
of start off the episode, likeall of our others, where we get
(04:06):
to hear about you, what's yourjourney in the ecosystem and
where you got, how you got towhere you are today.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Awesome.
Well, first of all, jacob,thanks so much for having me on
your podcast.
I think what you're doing isawesome, especially like such a
unique focus on the admincommunity, which is a very
critical part of a success ofany organization that uses
(04:36):
Salesforce, you know, so I thinkit's really cool what you're
doing.
I'm going to try my best tokeep up with all the quality
guests that you've been having,you know so.
So, yeah, I mean a little bitabout my journey.
So I started getting intoprogramming and computers at an
(05:02):
early age and probably like alot of millennials, I will say,
or people my age and 42 now, but, when I was like 12, you know I
will go to my cousins house I'moriginally from Buenos Aires,
Argentina, and I will be in mycousins house and we will play
(05:23):
graphic adventures.
You know in the, in the PC.
So we'll play Maniac, mansion,monkey Island, indiana Jones and
all the Lucas arts.
You know like graphicadventures.
You know and spend hours andpull on night or just just
playing.
You know those games to thepoint where you know you go to
(05:44):
sleep at night and then you willcome in the middle of an ice
and I think I know where to putthe key.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
You know to the safe or whatever.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
And I think, from from that moment on, like, I
always had an interest in like,oh, I want to learn how to make
these games, you know.
And so in the first few classesthat I took off of programming
when I was I don't know 15 orsomething, were like trying to
make games, you know.
And then, you know, my firstjob was when I started college,
(06:17):
I was 18.
And I did two things.
One was teaching classes at akind of like a Institute or a
new, that teach people how to,you know, use Microsoft products
.
You know how to use war, how touse power and things like that.
So I will teach like kind oflike, I would say, the elderly
(06:40):
you know, community or how touse this kind of like, how to
use a computer, and then I willdo a couple of programming
lessons to people.
And then I took a job at thesame time to work in a software
factory programming mobile appsfor like airports and and and
(07:03):
other companies, and that's whyI started to like get really
into programming at the time.
And then, a few years after,later, I started getting more
into like web development, youknow, and working more on like
the agency side, you know.
Like working.
I started working at a digitalagency in Buenos Aires just
(07:24):
building websites.
You know, like buildingwebsites for different brands
and building also kind of likeyeah, custom solutions.
What at the time were like wedidn't have as many UI
frameworks or already like putto our solutions.
So a lot was like, you know,like doing everything by hand,
which which took a lot of time.
(07:45):
I wish I had chat GPT back then.
That would be don't we?
We didn't even have like what'sit called stack exchange, you
know at the time, or or you knowstuff like that.
So I, I don't know it was.
It was a great learningexperience, but, you know, I
would appreciate a little morehelp from the former community.
(08:06):
You know, and maybe that'sthat's part the way I think
about it.
Maybe that's that's why IContribute so much to a
community now that I think aboutit.
It's just the fact that when Iwas like starting my career, I
didn't really have a lot ofcommunity you know to to rely on
.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Well, I mean at that point you, I mean 20, we're
talking 20 years ago.
I mean, yeah, you didn't havenearly as much resources.
There weren't YouTube videos,at least in the plethora that
they're available nowadays.
Github was not nearly aspopular as it is now.
So I mean, I can only imaginetrying to learn a very complex
(08:44):
type of Knowledge set with sofew resources at your disposal.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
I think that's where I had a lot of value of
Certifications, like because Iwill learn from from books.
You know I'm getting certifiedman like you really had to study
books and you know, followingbest practices he will follow
from, like reading softwaredevelopment Books, you know.
So I remember the head.
(09:12):
You know there was a seriescalled headfirst JavaScript
development, headfirst C, sharpdevelopment, that there were
really cool books to learn.
You're almost in a trade headtype format, you know.
But but yeah, I have somefriends that are like old school
and they're like oh, we, youknow, we, we learn so much from
(09:33):
not having these resources.
But I'm more like yes, but atthe same time we, you know I
wish we had a little more.
You know, like resources, theone job, one job I had that I I
was there for like less than amonth.
I remember they didn't allowyou to have internet either, so
like you had to be in the on thejob without internet.
You know we had an internet.
(09:56):
You know we had like that, thethe company network where
everything work, you know,because we were working for a
telecommunications company butthey didn't have access to the
outside world.
So if, if I wanted to Googlesomething to like look for an
answer.
I it was blocked, I couldn't.
So, you know, like three weeksafter that I got like I don't
have the tools to, like, me know, do my job right, and also I
(10:20):
was super bored.
But but that drove me to thejob, which is like getting more
into like the digital agencyworld and working more with like
web development and websites.
And then I had an opportunityTo, so I went from like being a
developer Then I was a tech lead, then I go into like kind of
(10:41):
like operations and projectmanagement, just trying to help
teams, you know, with roadblocksthat they have on projects and
you know one note.
And then, and then I had anopportunity to go more into the
sales, kind of like sell supportside for the agency, but do it
(11:03):
from the, from the office in inCleveland, ohio.
And it was a cool opportunitybecause, you know, I was kind of
like the bridge between the,the people that was selling
Website projects here in the US,and the delivery team in Buenos
Aires.
I was a person in the mediathat was trying to, you know,
help translate, you know therequirements and the estimates
(11:25):
and make sure that thetransition was as smooth as
possible with the delivery team,you know.
So I thought that was a coolchallenge.
So I work there from 2007 intoI move.
I moved to the States in 2009 ToCleveland.
I have family in Florida.
(11:46):
My sister and my mom live inFlorida, but that's all that.
The rest of my family is in inBuenos Aires, so I Move here.
I had, luckily, I have a goodgroup of friends and people I
knew here in Cleveland, so I was.
It was a good welcome.
I think I had a good supportsystem and and in 2012 you know
(12:13):
the company that I was workingfor, what was acquired and I was
kind of looking for attention.
Who might?
The person who today is my wife.
We were dating at the time shestarted a job at a part at a
company that was doing Inprojects with exact target.
So she started a job as asolutions architect, doing
projects with exact target, andshe said, hey, we're looking for
(12:36):
a technical architect.
I think you will like this,this job, because it's kind of
like you have to be creative andif you have web development
experience, I think you're gonnalike it.
So I I took the chance and Istarted working and with exact
target as a technical architect,which he was a little.
It was a little bit of a stepback of my career, but I didn't
(13:00):
mind.
I kind of like I always like toput my hands on the keyboard
anyways.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
You had mentioned, you went from again growing up
wanting to understand thetechnical around computers, how
to create, how to develop, howto, in a sense, think
strategically with the solutionsyou're making.
So how was it going from beingvery tech oriented into the
(13:27):
project management side?
I hear a lot of developers andI'm speaking broadly at this
point because you're notnecessarily in Salesforce yet
but so many developers I knowhate the people aspect of the
job and figuring out how to,especially with potentially a
language barrier as well.
(13:48):
How are you, how is thatprocess for you going from
coding, building, designing,into the more sales support, the
more?
Hey, I have to make sure allthe pieces are in place to
successfully get you what you'reasking for, Because that
doesn't seem like a very normalstep from developer to kind of
(14:10):
people management.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Yeah, yeah, and also point out I think I was always
curious about how teams work.
I think I am a big soccer fanor football.
I love sports, I play sports,many sports growing up and I
(14:34):
think, always was interested inunderstanding what's behind the
technical aspect of the sportand what's behind the technical
aspect of the work.
So I was always curious too andI always had an interest in
understanding how we can workbetter as a team.
(14:56):
So I don't know, I think it wasjust that, just curiosity, and
just always like trying to workin teams and how we can improve
each other.
And then when I started in 2012,to your point, like I was a
(15:17):
developer, very, very technicaloriented, and then when I
started with Exact Target, I sawthis thing and that's where I
started learning about CRM.
I had no idea what CRM meant.
You know, an email, marketingand all that, especially coming
from another country.
Like email in Argentina wasnon-existent.
Like commercial email wasnon-existent, even to say like
(15:43):
the biggest channel right nowthat drives like engagement.
I would not probably know email.
It's like WhatsApp or socialmedia, or email is used for
transactional purposes, really alot.
So yeah, I guess, to answer yourquestion, it was just curiosity
.
And then when I started gettinginto Exact Target, the same, it
(16:05):
was like, oh look, this is kindof like a CMS, but for email.
And then I started seeing, ohwow, I was like a customer like
everything was I had to doeverything custom right.
So I was like, oh look, I canwrite arms, I'm customizing
stuff.
So my solutions sometimes werelike very creative because I was
like, oh no, we, you know thefirst custom preference centers
(16:28):
that I built for clients youknow.
Oh no, we have these books.
And I was like, no, we canbuild it with.
Speaker 1 (16:32):
HTML.
I was like you need so muchmore.
So many developers who I talkto, who want to get into a more
kind of marketing sales space, Ialways say, hey, go marketing
cloud, because you can take somuch of the cool design
development knowledge you haveand you can now be like a
champion for the championless.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Yeah, exactly.
So then, yeah, I mean I startedthere.
And yeah, Salesforce purchaseExact Target, and so what then?
Speaker 1 (17:00):
brought you from marketing cloud into kind of
thinking more around, taking itforward a little bit to kind of
present day.
What's gotten you to say, okay,I've could.
You could have easily justrested on your laurels and said,
hey, I'm going to be the bestdang marketing cloud developer
and kind of leader I could be.
(17:21):
What made you say let's, let'sbranch out into what was then
genie, now data cloud.
Let's start figuring out how toconnect the systems dots.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
Yeah, so fast forward .
Like you know, like I don'tknow how many years there's
since 2012 until 2016,.
I start my own company.
You know that's United.
So I can never rest on like Ihave.
Like I'm always, like you know,even when I take vacation, you
(17:54):
know I'm gonna rest.
I'm like never resting.
It's like my wife.
My wife is like a saint and andI think you know I always
thought that United division ofmy company is a digital
marketing power by Salesforce.
You know how can we help?
(18:16):
You know, be in theintersection of marketing and IT
, but always marketing marketingcloud was, was a person.
You know, we did a little bitof a kind of engagement, not a
lot.
And then the next evolution ofthat was, okay, marketing cloud
intelligence, marketing cloudpersonalization.
And then what was the next stepfor us?
(18:39):
To evolve as a digitalmarketing agency, power by
Salesforce, and it made a lot ofsense to to do it with, with
Salesforce data cloud or or Gini, or CDP, or customer 360,
whatever, whatever name we wantto you want to give it, you know
that is interesting, that Imean talk a little bit about,
kind of for the folks who wantto go from date, even even
(19:03):
outside of developer, like datamanagers and data architects,
into the world of Salesforce.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
why is going into the marketing space so like
lucrative right now, or not evenlucrative from a financial
stance, just from a from aknowledge and learning and
growing standpoint?
Speaker 2 (19:22):
I guess what is marketing right?
There's some.
There's a point whereeverything gets so blurred, you
know, and I think, at the end ofthe day, I think it's all about
how can we make brands orcompanies connect with their
customers and make thatconnection a value exchange.
(19:46):
You know, it really depends onyour role, you know, if you are
a data architect, you know Ithink I think you got to look at
it as I can use something likethat, that Salesforce data cloud
, to uncover insights about thedata that I have all my
customers, you know and describethem with the data that I have
(20:12):
about them.
If I, if you can describe yourcustomers with the data that
you're collecting about them,then you can communicate with
them in a in a more impactfulway, you know, and make it
relevant, I think.
I think there is this conceptof like true to TRU, which is,
like, every experience has to betrue, relevant and relevant and
(20:34):
unique, you know.
So, probably, data cloud allowsyou to kind of like, describe
your customer and all theattributes about them and then,
if you have that analyst, youcan, you can uncover insights
and and massage the data to thenlet the marketing team activate
on it.
You know, I think if you are anadmin, there is so much that you
(20:54):
have to do in terms of bringingdata in data cloud, managing
data use, usage, managing usersin data cloud.
I mean, at the end of the day,also, like you know, that data
cloud is, is is part of the coreplatform in a way.
(21:15):
So a lot of, I think, a lot ofskills that you learn as an
admin, you can apply them todata cloud, you know.
So I think it really depends onon, on yeah, it's like building
a team.
You know that that's gonnamanage your data cloud instance.
You're probably gonna need,like an admin for sure, a data
(21:35):
analyst, and a new major mightnot need a developer, maybe in
the initial stages, but not notafterwards, you know.
But I see more and more adminstaking on the challenge of
learning data cloud because evenif you do a initial
implementation, someone needs tomaintain.
You know you need to bring newdata sources or you need to
(21:56):
modify the data source, the datasources or whatnot, and the two
levels is evolving so fast thatyou need to be learning it at
all times, you know.
Speaker 1 (22:08):
So I like that segue because that's a perfect kind of
intro into for a new admin, oreven admins who have been in the
ecosystem who want to getstarted learning data cloud With
the exception of Trailhead,because that's always going to
be your kind of first go to tolearn something new.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
What are some of?
Speaker 1 (22:28):
the places people should go to learn more about
data cloud, as well as wheresome of the kinds of skills that
admin should focus onharnessing to dive into the work
of either being a data manageror a data analyst.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
So, yeah, definitely, I mean Trailhead honestly, like
has has a lot of content thatwe as partners used to study,
like you know, partners, how wehave our own like partner portal
where we have material to studyfor certification, but they
have actually moved a lot of ourmaterial into Trailhead and I
think it's really great.
I'm going to preface this bysaying that there's not a lot
(23:14):
outside of Trehe and theofficial documentation, but I
know, like, like, for example,one of the things I'm trying to
do I run the Cleveland marketergroup, so I'm trying.
I did this series of data cloudfor marketers, you know, which
is, I, covers kind of like thesum of the basics of how you can
start using data cloud ifyou're a marketer, you know, and
(23:35):
I try to put those videos on myYouTube channel.
I know JB, who is a mark, she'sa marketing champion.
She has a whole like she'sdoing like I don't know if she
finished it or not, but she hasa whole like bootcamp, data
cloud bootcamp on YouTube, thatthat she's a blur in as part of
her channel MC learning camp.
(23:56):
So I think I've seen a lot oflike video content lately, not
so much written content, youknow.
So I mean, yeah, I, there is alot of actually room for content
creators, you know, for datacloud, because, again, the
product is if there are in somany features to a product so
(24:18):
fast that people are still likelearning them themselves,
implementing them, and then theydon't even have to say, oh, now
I have experience to write anarticle about it, you know.
And the other thing thatnotices this happened a lot with
marketing cloud engagement isthe documentation wasn't a very,
you know, robust, but the datacloud documentation is a very,
(24:41):
very robust.
There is another one is datacloud decoded.
It's like a playlist fromSalesforce developers.
That's really cool.
I will check.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
I will check that one out, you know thinking less
about the technical, the moreabout kind of.
If I'm a new admin, I'm gettingstarted learning, it is going
to be something we're all gonnahave to get into from the
technical.
Are there any kind of softskills or anything that you
would recommend?
So to say, I'm an admin, Ispecialize in XYZ, or I'm an
(25:13):
admin who is just gettingstarted, but I come from a kind
of project management backgroundor a technical SaaS background,
are there any kind of skills orreal world trainings that you
think could be really beneficialto help someone more quickly
learn up on the technicalknow-how around it?
(25:36):
Yeah, I think.
Speaker 2 (25:40):
I can point to specific resources, but I could
tell you I think having a goodlike doing a class or a I don't
know like a Udemy course orsomething on, even if it's a
basic database design, I thinkis for data cloud and for sales
(26:03):
cloud, I mean for an admin ingeneral, like for me, when I saw
the first but the first time Igot introduced to Salesforce
sales cloud, I was like, oh,this is like a relational
database with a really nice UI,you know, and that's how I oh no
, so my advantage was I knowinghow data relationships works,
gave me a good advantage to likelearn how to configure a tool
(26:25):
you know.
And I think, like, if you're anadmin that wants to, the new
admin that wants to get intodata cloud, learning like the
basics of how to make like anentity relation relationship
model.
You know what is a one-to-manyrelationship, what is a
one-to-one relationship, what isa primary key, what is a
foreign key.
(26:46):
Just learning that is gonnagive you so much advantage when
you go into, maintain orimplement data cloud, because
one of the biggest things ondata cloud is the underlying
data model, that you know that,that everything is normalized on
.
So if you understand what arethe entities and how they relate
(27:08):
to each other.
That's like, honestly, that'slike 50% of implementing.
It's like understanding themodel.
You know, I think like 50% ofany implementation is discovery,
so I'm gonna go with like 50%of that is understanding the
model.
The second one is knowing how torun discovery around use cases.
(27:36):
You know, truly understandinghow, how you can sit down with
it and marketing us.
Okay, let's, let's talk abouthow you're gonna use this tool.
You know, and that's somethingthat I think is missing a lot
right now is customers even getthe free version now of data
cloud, and so I just want aunified data.
(27:58):
You know, and and data cloud isis.
It can be so much more thanthat, you know.
So if you're an admin and Ithink I will I will take a look
at the, probably the, the trialhead.
That covers the businessanalyst certification.
I think it talks a little bitabout how to uncover
requirements and use cases andand time to value, and I think I
(28:21):
think that's very importantbecause you as an admin need to
sometimes get answers out ofpeople, get requirements and
sometimes, sometimes peopledon't know what they don't know
you know.
So having those skills couldreally help you.
But I will say learning justyeah, like a basic how to be
linear D and database, that'sgonna give you so much, so much
(28:45):
already.
Speaker 1 (28:46):
I really, really like that call out to take, take the
class around.
What does this mean?
And understand requirementdiscoveries, because one of the
next questions I had, which kindof falls in line with this, is
around the integrations andoptimizations.
So, to your point, aroundrequirements discussions, what
are some of the things thatadmins and data managers should
(29:09):
be doing to better integrate thesystems into data cloud, into
Salesforce?
What's just a couple quickthings to the admin should be
thinking about when trying tointegrate in these third-party
non-sales for systems yeah, Iwill.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
I will say to that know that data cloud is not
going to be the system of record, but it's going to be a system
of reference.
What I mean by that is that noteverything has to actually go
into data cloud for them to like, speed out like a like data
into like like analytics.
(29:46):
Someone knows, you know, it'sactually like you you could
bring engagement data from fromyour website and from your own
and from marketing cloud andthen you know, massage of all
that data and then made thatdata available in something like
that long, for example.
You know, but if you alreadyhave like a like, a like a data
(30:09):
reporting solution that isalready consuming all those data
sources, maybe think about howyou can aggregate data from from
information that you have indata cloud, you know.
So I think you know that thefirst thing is, I kind of to try
to understand what is your techstack that you have and what is
(30:32):
the responsibilities for eachof the components, because a lot
of times, I think what youuncover when you have marketing
and IT in the same room is thatno, no, we're going to use data
cloud to bring everything in andwe're going to do all our ETL
operations in here, and then ITwill say, no, no, we have this
other tool to do ETLs.
You know we have.
I know we have MUSE, we havewhatever to do all the ETLs.
(30:55):
What are you talking about?
So I think, like agreeing onwhat are we going to use, and
also marketing cloud, right,like this.
This one is a classic.
It's like we're going to do allour segments in marketing cloud
and then marketing says, or ITsays, no, but we just purchased
data cloud, why aren't we doingthe segments in data cloud?
So then you, you have to as anadmin, right, or for as a data
(31:17):
manager, you're going to say,okay, let's start with, like,
what are we going to use each ofthese things for Once?
We agree into that.
Then you start saying, okay,what data do I need to bring in?
You know.
But if you don't start withthose like top level, like use
cases, like what is it that wewant to accomplish and what are
our value drivers?
What is it that is going to trythe difference?
(31:37):
You got to start there Thenyou're going to, okay, what is
my map?
You know what are the tools andhow are we going to use them,
and then you start seeing whatyou're going to integrate.
You know there.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
That makes sense, Taking it a step further?
I think at least a step further.
Keep me honest I'm not the I'mnot the data cloud guru in this
room, but I talked to a fewfolks.
We had an episode a coupleweeks back around AI and we were
talking a lot about the privacyand security around AI and,
(32:09):
like make sure you don't inputin very important, secure, like
PII data into your AI to spitout types of content, because
that could be, you know, not thesmartest thing to do.
I'm curious if this opinion andthis kind of suggestion changes
as we move from AI to datacloud and kind of what your
opinions are, what you areseeing around data security and
(32:33):
compliance and how admins shouldthink about bringing in
sensitive information into thedata cloud and what you can do
with it once it's in data cloud.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
Yeah, like what a touchy subject, I know, but I
think the value, like thequality of your output, is
directly proportional to thequality of your input.
That's my take on it.
(33:08):
So, honestly, I thinkSalesforce has put a ton of
energy into making the trustlayer of AI very secure.
You know and I think there'snot a lot of concerns with you
know security aspects of it, butit's more about when it comes
(33:30):
to, you know, data cloud is moreabout segment generation, you
know.
So being able to say, I want asegment, you know, that has
these attributes, et cetera.
Now in the spring release,you're going to be able to do
that and generate segments touse the marketing cloud Is that
amazing?
Yeah, it's great.
But if you don't have averification step to say, is
(33:51):
this an actual representation ofwhat I'm looking to do, if you
don't verify those steps, thenit's very.
I think it's very dangerous,because I think these tools or
these machines are still kind oflearning and always is very,
very important to verify when itcomes to content.
It's like super, super, hypercritical.
(34:11):
But because we're talking aboutdata cloud, I think verifying
the results of these generatedsegments and also verifying that
they're inclusive, you knowthat you are including the
universe of diverse individualsin your segment.
You know when those getgenerated.
So I think verification ofthose results is very critical.
(34:36):
I'm not that concerned about thewhat happens in the background
in terms of security, but I amconcerned also about that.
If the quality of the data thatyou put is poor or is bad, then
your output is going to be bad.
You know.
It's the same as prompting.
You know if your prompting isnot non inclusive, the output is
(34:59):
probably going to be noninclusive.
You know when it generates animage or a piece of content.
You know.
So that's kind of like my takeon this whole AI thing.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
That's absolutely fair and that's similar to what
we had heard from our fun folkswho are on the AI episode.
But I like the kind of call outaround the security.
It's like, hey, yes, you needto still follow best practices.
Obviously, that's not ainvitation to throw caution in
the wind and input whatever datayou want into the system, but
(35:32):
you do need to be strategic,because wherever you get out is
what you put in.
Pivoting, though to thecompliance side of it, I always
say, when it comes to datacompliance, same thing like what
you said earlier you get whatyou put in.
If you aren't just notfollowing like GDPR rules or
just general compliance aroundhow you are inputting people's
(35:54):
information into your system,then obviously, yeah, you're
breaking rules, and that's lessabout the system and more about
how you operate with the data.
But I'm curious and who knows, Imay cut this if I don't like
the answer, but I do want to askthe question, though around is
there anything within Data Cloudthat helps make compliance
(36:16):
easier or following complianceeasier, or is it still just kind
of a?
You have to know it and it's acrapshoot.
Speaker 2 (36:23):
Interesting question.
So I heard one of the directorsof Data Cloud a couple weeks
ago say Data Cloud is not aconsent management platform.
Don't use Data Cloud forconsent management, and I think
(36:43):
there is somewhat truth about it.
I always think, like my answeris always it really depends.
So, first of all, consentmanagement.
I think again, data cloudshouldn't be this the source of
truth.
This, the source of truth orsystem of reference should be,
for example, cells cloud, right?
So if you're using cells cloud,you have an option to turn on
(37:05):
the consent management model incells cloud and it creates all
these objects you know yourparty consent objects and it
creates a individual objectswith all the you know the
channels Associates to them andeverything.
It is like a little nice objectData model for consent and you
can also install, like theconsent management app in the
(37:26):
app exchange as free, so you canactually record consent at the
CRM level.
You know which fun fact therecords that get generated about
consent don't count towardsyour storage quota for objects.
But maybe you know your use case, you.
You know you you're required touse like a consent management
(37:48):
tool, like one trust orsomething is enough, but you
know you can do it.
So then what you have in datacloud is a very similar entities
for consent.
So you have the, the, the onlyConsent by channel and by
category and the reasons of aconsent and you can pull like if
(38:09):
it's for GDPR or you know, etc.
Etc.
So you can actually build youremail.
But the idea is that you arereading from something, so
you're eating reading from your,your system of truth, like CRM,
or you are reading from like aone trust where you record all
the concern, requests and whyyou need to send that to that a
(38:29):
cloud, because when you'reactivating you need to check if
the person has consent toreceive, you know, an email or
an SMS or whatever right.
So that a cloud has a nicelittle model for consent
management.
But you need to use it In inconjunction with another system
and it gets really trickyactually when you start talking
(38:49):
about all but I have preference,a preference and the marketing
cloud, and then I have like thisor and then it's are getting
really, really complicated.
So if you have you knowwebsites or marketing
communications, you're trackingpeople on media, you're using
like marketing cloudpersonalization, all that, maybe
your best bet is to have Like aone trust on one unified way to
(39:12):
like control that consent andthen you send that data to data
cloud.
If your scenario is more simple, maybe you're okay with just
turning consent in CRM and thensending that data to data cloud.
You know it's a very delicatesubject but at the end of the
day I think the go-to the bestpractice in my mind like
approach should be that you aremanaging consent somewhere else
(39:37):
and you're using data cloud toyou know to map those consent
objects and then filtering theconsent when you're activating.
You know.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
I Think that makes a lot of sense.
I like that call out of you.
It's a reference, it's not thebe all, end all and yeah,
especially once you start addingin other Mediums, if you're
getting stuff from events.
But I mean having those mediumsoutside of, just like your
websites, one trust and beingable to say, cool, we're gonna
(40:08):
put this data in Salesforce,it's gonna flow into data cloud,
but then having like a oneplace that houses all of the
information I think to yourearlier point from what the
director of data cloud said,like it's not the be all, end
all solution, but I mean it canhelp visualize it so much better
and I think that's gonna help alot when it comes to compliance
(40:31):
, especially as GDPR rules getmore strict and other countries,
like the US, in Time willlikely have their own Privacy
laws that are enhanced andwhatnot, to mimic that of GDPR
Having that place to house allthe information.
So it's just a one-stop shop ofcool.
(40:51):
This is where it is.
These are all the places it'slocated.
Someone said delete.
Now you got a delete.
Speaker 2 (40:59):
Right yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
So we're nearing the end of our time.
We've had a really goodconversation.
Love hearing your background,loves hearing your insights
around dating data cloud formarketers and just data cloud in
the ecosystem.
I'm curious.
I want kind of dive into one ofthe last questions around just
kind of what you think thefuture is for admins.
(41:22):
So I asked this question inthat We've seen data cloud of,
especially in the last year,year and a half between, not
just from a naming side ofthings, but just from the
product itself.
We've seen data cloud growSignificantly and become this
amazing tool that can do so muchmore than it could Three, four
(41:44):
years ago.
With that being said, is thereany addition and any kind of
insight for that you would giveto admins around why this is a
product people should be jumpingon to learn more quickly than,
say, marketing GPT or Any of theother new products that are out
(42:07):
there right now?
Speaker 2 (42:09):
So, you know, since I I would say Dreamforce 2022
everything that we've beenhearing was data, ai and CRM.
You know anything?
Surfers continues to invest indata and CRM more from more and
more functionality.
It's been ported into datacloud.
I could see in the future thatmarketing functionality is gonna
(42:31):
start living in the data cloudenvironment.
You know, functionality thattoday exists in marketing
optimization Hopefully Exists inin data cloud.
It's the fastest growingproduct.
It's a product that was builtUsing the core technologies of
Salesforce, so it's not goinganywhere.
(42:54):
You know, and I think I thinkself forces heavily investing in
the product constantly and thatmakes it hard for us because
we're catching up constantly.
You know and then, but we areasked also to be the ones that
knows the most about theplatform, but we haven't even
caught up.
That's, that's an opportunity,yeah, right.
So I think that I Could see thelines blurring a lot more.
(43:20):
You know more than ever and ifyou're an admin and only working
on CRM, but you start, you knowyour organization's probably at
some point evaluate data cloud.
You know they're gonna use it,even if it's a free.
So no, no in these tools anduses is only gonna give you an
advantage.
You know, it's all.
It's also the same as we aretalking about chat GPT.
(43:42):
You know like people say no,resistant, no, no, no.
If you're a developer, knowinghow to GPT makes you faster, you
know it's not replacing you.
And this is the same like ifyou I'm gonna coin a term, I
don't know if it exists or not,but if it doesn't exist, let's
try market Full stack admin.
You know, I think there's gonnabe something called full stack
(44:04):
admin.
You know that is like.
You know you are not mean forlike, for like sales cloud, for
like marketing cloud.
You know, yeah, yep.
Speaker 1 (44:13):
So as we get into the last, last question of the show
, I Always ask this question.
I try to branch out with a few,but I really like this one in
the end, when you're thinkingthrough your journey and you've
now had a wonderful Journey fromnon sales force into the last,
(44:33):
probably 10, 15 years being moreinside of this ecosystem, what
would you say?
Your one regret is that youwish you could go back in time
and tell your former self manyou really should have put more
effort into XYZ.
Speaker 2 (44:46):
What would that one regret be.
Wow, oh, I don't know if Ithink I have regrets, you know.
So that's so I'm gonna.
Speaker 1 (44:56):
I've had a few people on the show.
Guys say something to thatextent Like I don't have regrets
and that's absolutely fine.
I just like to think of it asfor a new admin coming into the
ecosystem.
They Maybe making some of thesemistakes and obviously it's
great to learn from yourmistakes.
But if you can listen to thepodcast and be like, oh, this
person who's a marketingchampion, who has their own
(45:17):
company, who is very successfulin the Ecosystem, says they
should have done somethingdifferently, maybe I should take
a play out of their book.
Speaker 2 (45:25):
Yeah, so read the book emotional intelligence 2.0.
That will be my, my suggestion.
So learning about Emotionalintelligence at an earlier stage
(45:45):
, when you are working withother people and we, when, as an
admin, you have to likeinteract with a lot of team
members, it's gonna only giveyou a lot.
It's gonna give you tools thatyou can use to Put yourself in
the shoes of the other person,to Be more self-aware of how
(46:12):
you're interacting with otherpeople and, ultimately, focus,
focus on what you think isreally important for your
success.
I know it sounds kind of likeweird because it's always not
about learn technical skills,but no, it's.
For me.
One of my regrets is, I know,having it's not a regret, but if
I, if I could, you know, changesomething a little bit on my
(46:32):
journey will be like focusing alot more on like the Human
aspects of working with teamsare at least station my career
without giving me a Lot lessstress.
For me and I could see that ifyou're an admin, you're probably
dealing with a lot of stressbecause a lot of the
(46:53):
frustrations and energy thatpeople you know you absorb it
from people and also, like you,would I give me focus to say,
okay, I need to.
This is my, my career, and so Iwould read.
I would read emotionInternational stupid, no.
And I would read an or bookthat is called getting things
done, which I remember theauthor.
(47:13):
But I would read those twobooks and you are said then.
Then you are said you are readyto conquer the world.
Speaker 1 (47:19):
You know, I Love that and it's one of those.
I'm not gonna beat a dead horsebecause I say it all the time
on the show.
It's.
It's exactly what you said Goto YouTube, go wherever, but
read a couple books on likeleadership, read a couple books
on how to effectivelycommunicate.
There's a going, there's.
(47:39):
I mean there's so many greatYouTube videos on it.
There's so many great books onit.
So I mean I'm with you, the Ilove.
That's why I also started thispodcast.
I mean I started this because Ilove hearing stories, I love
learning from other people'slife experiences.
It's where that's three podcast, medium, book, medium.
I mean I've Grown so much justin the month and a half that
(48:00):
I've had this podcast around tobe able to learn from so many
other people.
So Love that answer.
I think a lot of admins cangrow and develop from that.
So, before you wrap up, isthere anything you want to
highlight, any topic you want togive a shout out to, anything
you want to plug?
Speaker 2 (48:20):
No, no, no, just love what you're doing.
I Agree with you.
It's kind of like you know thatyou do it also for you to learn
from our people.
I think it's a really cool wayto learn.
But also like I love thatyou're giving this.
I you're giving people a voiceto, to share their experience,
and I think that is a reallycool thing that you know.
Speaker 1 (48:45):
Well, I appreciate that very much.
We will definitely be chattingmore in the near future and
hopefully I will see you at oneof the upcoming.
There's a lot of upcomingevents, so hopefully I'll see
one of them.
But I really do appreciate youtaking the time out of your very
busy day to meet with me.
So have a wonderful rest ofyour day and we'll be chatting
more soon.
Speaker 2 (49:04):
Yeah, awesome Jacob.
Thank you so much for theopportunity and, yeah, we'll be
talking soon.
Speaker 1 (49:21):
And that concludes another episode of admins of
tomorrow.
A special thanks to our guestPato, for sharing their journey
and getting started as aSalesforce admin and how they
became a Salesforce marketingchampion, mvp and data cloud
expert.
It was an absolute blast totalk through ways new admins can
learn data cloud and, for mepersonally, coming from a space
of being inside of marketingcloud, account engagement and
(49:45):
sales cloud and serum analytics,I truly felt validated hearing
that, yes, you can learntrailhead, but there's some
other soft skills and things tolearn around data cloud and
around being a data manager anddata analyst.
There are crucial and those arethings that you might get with
trailhead, but you can also getthrough a lot of other different
(50:06):
mediums.
So thank you, pato, very, verymuch for sharing your stories
and your journey.
If you'd like to learn moreabout data cloud or becoming a
Salesforce developer, there'sstill time to register for
trailblazer DX.
Go to salesforcecom forwardslash trailblazer DX to register
now or sign up to watch onSalesforce plus.
Thank you all again for takingthe time to listen and support
(50:28):
the podcast.
If you have any feedback,questions or topic suggestions,
as always, we'd love to hearfrom you so don't hesitate to
connect with us on LinkedIn,twitter or email us at info at
adminsoftomorrowcom.
Again, if you or someone youknow would like to be on the
show or would like to givesomeone a shout out, please go
to our website,adminsoftomorrowcom, forward
slash, share your thoughts andfill out our form to be on the
(50:50):
show.
And finally, if you enjoyedthis episode, please don't
forget to subscribe and leave areview.
Every review and every listenmeans the absolute world to us
and helps us continue to growand build out the show for a
wider audience.
So please share with yourfellow trailblazers and listen
to us on Apple podcasts, spotifyor wherever you listen to
podcasts.
Once again, I'm Jacob Catalano,your host, signing off.
(51:14):
We appreciate you for listeningto admins of tomorrow,
trailblazing the next generation.
Good morning and good afternoon.
My name is Jacob Catalano andwelcome to another episode of
Admins of Tomorrow.
For new admins joining theSalesforce ecosystem, there is a
ton to learn and just as muchto really be proficient in so
that you can be successful andhave a long, lasting career.
For these new admins, we seethe terms AI plus data plus CRM
(00:40):
on Salesforce commercials and inother mediums.
Well, we've already, in thelast few episodes, talked about
AI and how new admins should bethinking about using AI, whether
you're an admin, a developer ora marketer, and we've already
talked a lot about justgenerally being an admin for the
core sales cloud.
But what we haven't really dovetoo much in is the layer that's
(01:01):
probably the most importantpiece to connect all of this
together data.
So that's why this week, wewant to talk about de-misdefying
data cloud, finding ways forthe new admin to feel more
comfortable, one talking aboutthis subject, but also finding
ways outside of Trailhead tobecome wildly successful.
So that's why this week, we'vebrought in Salesforce MVP and
(01:23):
marketing champion, pato Sapir.
I've had the pleasure ofknowing Pato for quite some time
now and being able to see himspeak on marketing cloud and
data cloud, and the one thingthat I've loved hearing him talk
the most about is how he gotstarted.
It's so fascinating to hear thestory about someone goes from
developer to project manager, todata cloud admin and also start
(01:47):
his own business.
I'm really excited to have ustake the time today and talk
through Pato's story.
So, without further ado, let'smeet Pato.
So, without further ado, let'smeet Pato.
Pato Sapir is the founder andsenior solutions consultant at
Debs United, a Salesforcepartner specialized in providing
(02:08):
digital marketing solutionspowered by Salesforce.
Pato started his career insoftware development more than
15 years ago in Buenos Aires,argentina, and moved to
Cleveland, ohio, in 2009.
His journey with Salesforcestarted in 2012 as a technical
architect working with ExactTarget, now known as Salesforce
(02:28):
Marketing Cloud Engagement, andin 2015, pato decided to start
his own business.
Pato's passion is to help histeam and clients to solve
impossible challenges and toshare his experiences with the
marketing cloud community.
So let's not waste any moretime and dive on in.
Well, I really appreciate you,though, for taking the time.
(03:04):
Everyone's schedules at thestart of the year are absolutely
insane, and so just taking anhour, hour and a half out of
your day to sit down and talkthrough this very complex topic
is much appreciated.
So today I want to dive into alittle bit of the title of the
episode.
There's no spoilers here aDemystifying Data Cloud.
(03:25):
When we think of this system,when we think of.
AI and all the systems that kindof are hot topics for the
ecosystem right now.
There's a lot of kind of thisis too complex for me, I'm not
going to learn it.
Or if I am going to learn it,I'm going to need hundreds of
dollars worth of training andcertifications and so on and so
(03:45):
forth.
And, having now had thepleasure of sitting down with a
few advocates in the ecosystemto learn more about the AI Cloud
, it's so not as complex andscary as we give it the credit
for.
So, before we dive into thattopic, I'd love for you to be
able to give a quickintroduction of yourself, kind
of start off the episode, likeall of our others, where we get
(04:06):
to hear about you, what's yourjourney in the ecosystem and
where you got, how you got towhere you are today.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Awesome.
Well, first of all, jacob,thanks so much for having me on
your podcast.
I think what you're doing isawesome, especially like such a
unique focus on the admincommunity, which is a very
critical part of a success ofany organization that uses
(04:36):
Salesforce, you know, so I thinkit's really cool what you're
doing.
I'm going to try my best tokeep up with all the quality
guests that you've been having,you know so.
So, yeah, I mean a little bitabout my journey.
So I started getting intoprogramming and computers at an
(05:02):
early age and probably like alot of millennials, I will say,
or people my age and 42 now, but, when I was like 12, you know I
will go to my cousins house I'moriginally from Buenos Aires,
Argentina, and I will be in mycousins house and we will play
(05:23):
graphic adventures.
You know in the, in the PC.
So we'll play Maniac, mansion,monkey Island, indiana Jones and
all the Lucas arts.
You know like graphicadventures.
You know and spend hours andpull on night or just just
playing.
You know those games to thepoint where you know you go to
(05:44):
sleep at night and then you willcome in the middle of an ice
and I think I know where to putthe key.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
You know to the safe or whatever.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
And I think, from from that moment on, like, I
always had an interest in like,oh, I want to learn how to make
these games, you know.
And so in the first few classesthat I took off of programming
when I was I don't know 15 orsomething, were like trying to
make games, you know.
And then, you know, my firstjob was when I started college,
(06:17):
I was 18.
And I did two things.
One was teaching classes at akind of like a Institute or a
new, that teach people how to,you know, use Microsoft products
.
You know how to use war, how touse power and things like that.
So I will teach like kind oflike, I would say, the elderly
(06:40):
you know, community or how touse this kind of like, how to
use a computer, and then I willdo a couple of programming
lessons to people.
And then I took a job at thesame time to work in a software
factory programming mobile appsfor like airports and and and
(07:03):
other companies, and that's whyI started to like get really
into programming at the time.
And then, a few years after,later, I started getting more
into like web development, youknow, and working more on like
the agency side, you know.
Like working.
I started working at a digitalagency in Buenos Aires just
(07:24):
building websites.
You know, like buildingwebsites for different brands
and building also kind of likeyeah, custom solutions.
What at the time were like wedidn't have as many UI
frameworks or already like putto our solutions.
So a lot was like, you know,like doing everything by hand,
which which took a lot of time.
(07:45):
I wish I had chat GPT back then.
That would be don't we?
We didn't even have like what'sit called stack exchange, you
know at the time, or or you knowstuff like that.
So I, I don't know it was.
It was a great learningexperience, but, you know, I
would appreciate a little morehelp from the former community.
(08:06):
You know, and maybe that'sthat's part the way I think
about it.
Maybe that's that's why IContribute so much to a
community now that I think aboutit.
It's just the fact that when Iwas like starting my career, I
didn't really have a lot ofcommunity you know to to rely on
.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Well, I mean at that point you, I mean 20, we're
talking 20 years ago.
I mean, yeah, you didn't havenearly as much resources.
There weren't YouTube videos,at least in the plethora that
they're available nowadays.
Github was not nearly aspopular as it is now.
So I mean, I can only imaginetrying to learn a very complex
(08:44):
type of Knowledge set with sofew resources at your disposal.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
I think that's where I had a lot of value of
Certifications, like because Iwill learn from from books.
You know I'm getting certifiedman like you really had to study
books and you know, followingbest practices he will follow
from, like reading softwaredevelopment Books, you know.
So I remember the head.
(09:12):
You know there was a seriescalled headfirst JavaScript
development, headfirst C, sharpdevelopment, that there were
really cool books to learn.
You're almost in a trade headtype format, you know.
But but yeah, I have somefriends that are like old school
and they're like oh, we, youknow, we, we learn so much from
(09:33):
not having these resources.
But I'm more like yes, but atthe same time we, you know I
wish we had a little more.
You know, like resources, theone job, one job I had that I I
was there for like less than amonth.
I remember they didn't allowyou to have internet either, so
like you had to be in the on thejob without internet.
You know we had an internet.
(09:56):
You know we had like that, thethe company network where
everything work, you know,because we were working for a
telecommunications company butthey didn't have access to the
outside world.
So if, if I wanted to Googlesomething to like look for an
answer.
I it was blocked, I couldn't.
So, you know, like three weeksafter that I got like I don't
have the tools to, like, me know, do my job right, and also I
(10:20):
was super bored.
But but that drove me to thejob, which is like getting more
into like the digital agencyworld and working more with like
web development and websites.
And then I had an opportunityTo, so I went from like being a
developer Then I was a tech lead, then I go into like kind of
(10:41):
like operations and projectmanagement, just trying to help
teams, you know, with roadblocksthat they have on projects and
you know one note.
And then, and then I had anopportunity to go more into the
sales, kind of like sell supportside for the agency, but do it
(11:03):
from the, from the office in inCleveland, ohio.
And it was a cool opportunitybecause, you know, I was kind of
like the bridge between the,the people that was selling
Website projects here in the US,and the delivery team in Buenos
Aires.
I was a person in the mediathat was trying to, you know,
help translate, you know therequirements and the estimates
(11:25):
and make sure that thetransition was as smooth as
possible with the delivery team,you know.
So I thought that was a coolchallenge.
So I work there from 2007 intoI move.
I moved to the States in 2009 ToCleveland.
I have family in Florida.
(11:46):
My sister and my mom live inFlorida, but that's all that.
The rest of my family is in inBuenos Aires, so I Move here.
I had, luckily, I have a goodgroup of friends and people I
knew here in Cleveland, so I was.
It was a good welcome.
I think I had a good supportsystem and and in 2012 you know
(12:13):
the company that I was workingfor, what was acquired and I was
kind of looking for attention.
Who might?
The person who today is my wife.
We were dating at the time shestarted a job at a part at a
company that was doing Inprojects with exact target.
So she started a job as asolutions architect, doing
projects with exact target, andshe said, hey, we're looking for
(12:36):
a technical architect.
I think you will like this,this job, because it's kind of
like you have to be creative andif you have web development
experience, I think you're gonnalike it.
So I I took the chance and Istarted working and with exact
target as a technical architect,which he was a little.
It was a little bit of a stepback of my career, but I didn't
(13:00):
mind.
I kind of like I always like toput my hands on the keyboard
anyways.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
You had mentioned, you went from again growing up
wanting to understand thetechnical around computers, how
to create, how to develop, howto, in a sense, think
strategically with the solutionsyou're making.
So how was it going from beingvery tech oriented into the
(13:27):
project management side?
I hear a lot of developers andI'm speaking broadly at this
point because you're notnecessarily in Salesforce yet
but so many developers I knowhate the people aspect of the
job and figuring out how to,especially with potentially a
language barrier as well.
(13:48):
How are you, how is thatprocess for you going from
coding, building, designing,into the more sales support, the
more?
Hey, I have to make sure allthe pieces are in place to
successfully get you what you'reasking for, Because that
doesn't seem like a very normalstep from developer to kind of
(14:10):
people management.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Yeah, yeah, and also point out I think I was always
curious about how teams work.
I think I am a big soccer fanor football.
I love sports, I play sports,many sports growing up and I
(14:34):
think, always was interested inunderstanding what's behind the
technical aspect of the sportand what's behind the technical
aspect of the work.
So I was always curious too andI always had an interest in
understanding how we can workbetter as a team.
(14:56):
So I don't know, I think it wasjust that, just curiosity, and
just always like trying to workin teams and how we can improve
each other.
And then when I started in 2012,to your point, like I was a
(15:17):
developer, very, very technicaloriented, and then when I
started with Exact Target, I sawthis thing and that's where I
started learning about CRM.
I had no idea what CRM meant.
You know, an email, marketingand all that, especially coming
from another country.
Like email in Argentina wasnon-existent.
Like commercial email wasnon-existent, even to say like
(15:43):
the biggest channel right nowthat drives like engagement.
I would not probably know email.
It's like WhatsApp or socialmedia, or email is used for
transactional purposes, really alot.
So yeah, I guess, to answer yourquestion, it was just curiosity
.
And then when I started gettinginto Exact Target, the same, it
(16:05):
was like, oh look, this is kindof like a CMS, but for email.
And then I started seeing, ohwow, I was like a customer like
everything was I had to doeverything custom right.
So I was like, oh look, I canwrite arms, I'm customizing
stuff.
So my solutions sometimes werelike very creative because I was
like, oh no, we, you know thefirst custom preference centers
(16:28):
that I built for clients youknow.
Oh no, we have these books.
And I was like, no, we canbuild it with.
Speaker 1 (16:32):
HTML.
I was like you need so muchmore.
So many developers who I talkto, who want to get into a more
kind of marketing sales space, Ialways say, hey, go marketing
cloud, because you can take somuch of the cool design
development knowledge you haveand you can now be like a
champion for the championless.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Yeah, exactly.
So then, yeah, I mean I startedthere.
And yeah, Salesforce purchaseExact Target, and so what then?
Speaker 1 (17:00):
brought you from marketing cloud into kind of
thinking more around, taking itforward a little bit to kind of
present day.
What's gotten you to say, okay,I've could.
You could have easily justrested on your laurels and said,
hey, I'm going to be the bestdang marketing cloud developer
and kind of leader I could be.
(17:21):
What made you say let's, let'sbranch out into what was then
genie, now data cloud.
Let's start figuring out how toconnect the systems dots.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
Yeah, so fast forward .
Like you know, like I don'tknow how many years there's
since 2012 until 2016,.
I start my own company.
You know that's United.
So I can never rest on like Ihave.
Like I'm always, like you know,even when I take vacation, you
(17:54):
know I'm gonna rest.
I'm like never resting.
It's like my wife.
My wife is like a saint and andI think you know I always
thought that United division ofmy company is a digital
marketing power by Salesforce.
You know how can we help?
(18:16):
You know, be in theintersection of marketing and IT
, but always marketing marketingcloud was, was a person.
You know, we did a little bitof a kind of engagement, not a
lot.
And then the next evolution ofthat was, okay, marketing cloud
intelligence, marketing cloudpersonalization.
And then what was the next stepfor us?
(18:39):
To evolve as a digitalmarketing agency, power by
Salesforce, and it made a lot ofsense to to do it with, with
Salesforce data cloud or or Gini, or CDP, or customer 360,
whatever, whatever name we wantto you want to give it, you know
that is interesting, that Imean talk a little bit about,
kind of for the folks who wantto go from date, even even
(19:03):
outside of developer, like datamanagers and data architects,
into the world of Salesforce.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
why is going into the marketing space so like
lucrative right now, or not evenlucrative from a financial
stance, just from a from aknowledge and learning and
growing standpoint?
Speaker 2 (19:22):
I guess what is marketing right?
There's some.
There's a point whereeverything gets so blurred, you
know, and I think, at the end ofthe day, I think it's all about
how can we make brands orcompanies connect with their
customers and make thatconnection a value exchange.
(19:46):
You know, it really depends onyour role, you know, if you are
a data architect, you know Ithink I think you got to look at
it as I can use something likethat, that Salesforce data cloud
, to uncover insights about thedata that I have all my
customers, you know and describethem with the data that I have
(20:12):
about them.
If I, if you can describe yourcustomers with the data that
you're collecting about them,then you can communicate with
them in a in a more impactfulway, you know, and make it
relevant, I think.
I think there is this conceptof like true to TRU, which is,
like, every experience has to betrue, relevant and relevant and
(20:34):
unique, you know.
So, probably, data cloud allowsyou to kind of like, describe
your customer and all theattributes about them and then,
if you have that analyst, youcan, you can uncover insights
and and massage the data to thenlet the marketing team activate
on it.
You know, I think if you are anadmin, there is so much that you
(20:54):
have to do in terms of bringingdata in data cloud, managing
data use, usage, managing usersin data cloud.
I mean, at the end of the day,also, like you know, that data
cloud is, is is part of the coreplatform in a way.
(21:15):
So a lot of, I think, a lot ofskills that you learn as an
admin, you can apply them todata cloud, you know.
So I think it really depends onon, on yeah, it's like building
a team.
You know that that's gonnamanage your data cloud instance.
You're probably gonna need,like an admin for sure, a data
(21:35):
analyst, and a new major mightnot need a developer, maybe in
the initial stages, but not notafterwards, you know.
But I see more and more adminstaking on the challenge of
learning data cloud because evenif you do a initial
implementation, someone needs tomaintain.
You know you need to bring newdata sources or you need to
(21:56):
modify the data source, the datasources or whatnot, and the two
levels is evolving so fast thatyou need to be learning it at
all times, you know.
Speaker 1 (22:08):
So I like that segue because that's a perfect kind of
intro into for a new admin, oreven admins who have been in the
ecosystem who want to getstarted learning data cloud With
the exception of Trailhead,because that's always going to
be your kind of first go to tolearn something new.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
What are some of?
Speaker 1 (22:28):
the places people should go to learn more about
data cloud, as well as wheresome of the kinds of skills that
admin should focus onharnessing to dive into the work
of either being a data manageror a data analyst.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
So, yeah, definitely, I mean Trailhead honestly, like
has has a lot of content thatwe as partners used to study,
like you know, partners, how wehave our own like partner portal
where we have material to studyfor certification, but they
have actually moved a lot of ourmaterial into Trailhead and I
think it's really great.
I'm going to preface this bysaying that there's not a lot
(23:14):
outside of Trehe and theofficial documentation, but I
know, like, like, for example,one of the things I'm trying to
do I run the Cleveland marketergroup, so I'm trying.
I did this series of data cloudfor marketers, you know, which
is, I, covers kind of like thesum of the basics of how you can
start using data cloud ifyou're a marketer, you know, and
(23:35):
I try to put those videos on myYouTube channel.
I know JB, who is a mark, she'sa marketing champion.
She has a whole like she'sdoing like I don't know if she
finished it or not, but she hasa whole like bootcamp, data
cloud bootcamp on YouTube, thatthat she's a blur in as part of
her channel MC learning camp.
(23:56):
So I think I've seen a lot oflike video content lately, not
so much written content, youknow.
So I mean, yeah, I, there is alot of actually room for content
creators, you know, for datacloud, because, again, the
product is if there are in somany features to a product so
(24:18):
fast that people are still likelearning them themselves,
implementing them, and then theydon't even have to say, oh, now
I have experience to write anarticle about it, you know.
And the other thing thatnotices this happened a lot with
marketing cloud engagement isthe documentation wasn't a very,
you know, robust, but the datacloud documentation is a very,
(24:41):
very robust.
There is another one is datacloud decoded.
It's like a playlist fromSalesforce developers.
That's really cool.
I will check.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
I will check that one out, you know thinking less
about the technical, the moreabout kind of.
If I'm a new admin, I'm gettingstarted learning, it is going
to be something we're all gonnahave to get into from the
technical.
Are there any kind of softskills or anything that you
would recommend?
So to say, I'm an admin, Ispecialize in XYZ, or I'm an
(25:13):
admin who is just gettingstarted, but I come from a kind
of project management backgroundor a technical SaaS background,
are there any kind of skills orreal world trainings that you
think could be really beneficialto help someone more quickly
learn up on the technicalknow-how around it?
(25:36):
Yeah, I think.
Speaker 2 (25:40):
I can point to specific resources, but I could
tell you I think having a goodlike doing a class or a I don't
know like a Udemy course orsomething on, even if it's a
basic database design, I thinkis for data cloud and for sales
(26:03):
cloud, I mean for an admin ingeneral, like for me, when I saw
the first but the first time Igot introduced to Salesforce
sales cloud, I was like, oh,this is like a relational
database with a really nice UI,you know, and that's how I oh no
, so my advantage was I knowinghow data relationships works,
gave me a good advantage to likelearn how to configure a tool
(26:25):
you know.
And I think, like, if you're anadmin that wants to, the new
admin that wants to get intodata cloud, learning like the
basics of how to make like anentity relation relationship
model.
You know what is a one-to-manyrelationship, what is a
one-to-one relationship, what isa primary key, what is a
foreign key.
(26:46):
Just learning that is gonnagive you so much advantage when
you go into, maintain orimplement data cloud, because
one of the biggest things ondata cloud is the underlying
data model, that you know that,that everything is normalized on
.
So if you understand what arethe entities and how they relate
(27:08):
to each other.
That's like, honestly, that'slike 50% of implementing.
It's like understanding themodel.
You know, I think like 50% ofany implementation is discovery,
so I'm gonna go with like 50%of that is understanding the
model.
The second one is knowing how torun discovery around use cases.
(27:36):
You know, truly understandinghow, how you can sit down with
it and marketing us.
Okay, let's, let's talk abouthow you're gonna use this tool.
You know, and that's somethingthat I think is missing a lot
right now is customers even getthe free version now of data
cloud, and so I just want aunified data.
(27:58):
You know, and and data cloud isis.
It can be so much more thanthat, you know.
So if you're an admin and Ithink I will I will take a look
at the, probably the, the trialhead.
That covers the businessanalyst certification.
I think it talks a little bitabout how to uncover
requirements and use cases andand time to value, and I think I
(28:21):
think that's very importantbecause you as an admin need to
sometimes get answers out ofpeople, get requirements and
sometimes, sometimes peopledon't know what they don't know
you know.
So having those skills couldreally help you.
But I will say learning justyeah, like a basic how to be
linear D and database, that'sgonna give you so much, so much
(28:45):
already.
Speaker 1 (28:46):
I really, really like that call out to take, take the
class around.
What does this mean?
And understand requirementdiscoveries, because one of the
next questions I had, which kindof falls in line with this, is
around the integrations andoptimizations.
So, to your point, aroundrequirements discussions, what
are some of the things thatadmins and data managers should
(29:09):
be doing to better integrate thesystems into data cloud, into
Salesforce?
What's just a couple quickthings to the admin should be
thinking about when trying tointegrate in these third-party
non-sales for systems yeah, Iwill.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
I will say to that know that data cloud is not
going to be the system of record, but it's going to be a system
of reference.
What I mean by that is that noteverything has to actually go
into data cloud for them to like, speed out like a like data
into like like analytics.
(29:46):
Someone knows, you know, it'sactually like you you could
bring engagement data from fromyour website and from your own
and from marketing cloud andthen you know, massage of all
that data and then made thatdata available in something like
that long, for example.
You know, but if you alreadyhave like a like, a like a data
(30:09):
reporting solution that isalready consuming all those data
sources, maybe think about howyou can aggregate data from from
information that you have indata cloud, you know.
So I think you know that thefirst thing is, I kind of to try
to understand what is your techstack that you have and what is
(30:32):
the responsibilities for eachof the components, because a lot
of times, I think what youuncover when you have marketing
and IT in the same room is thatno, no, we're going to use data
cloud to bring everything in andwe're going to do all our ETL
operations in here, and then ITwill say, no, no, we have this
other tool to do ETLs.
You know we have.
I know we have MUSE, we havewhatever to do all the ETLs.
(30:55):
What are you talking about?
So I think, like agreeing onwhat are we going to use, and
also marketing cloud, right,like this.
This one is a classic.
It's like we're going to do allour segments in marketing cloud
and then marketing says, or ITsays, no, but we just purchased
data cloud, why aren't we doingthe segments in data cloud?
So then you, you have to as anadmin, right, or for as a data
(31:17):
manager, you're going to say,okay, let's start with, like,
what are we going to use each ofthese things for Once?
We agree into that.
Then you start saying, okay,what data do I need to bring in?
You know.
But if you don't start withthose like top level, like use
cases, like what is it that wewant to accomplish and what are
our value drivers?
What is it that is going to trythe difference?
(31:37):
You got to start there Thenyou're going to, okay, what is
my map?
You know what are the tools andhow are we going to use them,
and then you start seeing whatyou're going to integrate.
You know there.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
That makes sense, Taking it a step further?
I think at least a step further.
Keep me honest I'm not the I'mnot the data cloud guru in this
room, but I talked to a fewfolks.
We had an episode a coupleweeks back around AI and we were
talking a lot about the privacyand security around AI and,
(32:09):
like make sure you don't inputin very important, secure, like
PII data into your AI to spitout types of content, because
that could be, you know, not thesmartest thing to do.
I'm curious if this opinion andthis kind of suggestion changes
as we move from AI to datacloud and kind of what your
opinions are, what you areseeing around data security and
(32:33):
compliance and how admins shouldthink about bringing in
sensitive information into thedata cloud and what you can do
with it once it's in data cloud.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
Yeah, like what a touchy subject, I know, but I
think the value, like thequality of your output, is
directly proportional to thequality of your input.
That's my take on it.
(33:08):
So, honestly, I thinkSalesforce has put a ton of
energy into making the trustlayer of AI very secure.
You know and I think there'snot a lot of concerns with you
know security aspects of it, butit's more about when it comes
(33:30):
to, you know, data cloud is moreabout segment generation, you
know.
So being able to say, I want asegment, you know, that has
these attributes, et cetera.
Now in the spring release,you're going to be able to do
that and generate segments touse the marketing cloud Is that
amazing?
Yeah, it's great.
But if you don't have averification step to say, is
(33:51):
this an actual representation ofwhat I'm looking to do, if you
don't verify those steps, thenit's very.
I think it's very dangerous,because I think these tools or
these machines are still kind oflearning and always is very,
very important to verify when itcomes to content.
It's like super, super, hypercritical.
(34:11):
But because we're talking aboutdata cloud, I think verifying
the results of these generatedsegments and also verifying that
they're inclusive, you knowthat you are including the
universe of diverse individualsin your segment.
You know when those getgenerated.
So I think verification ofthose results is very critical.
(34:36):
I'm not that concerned about thewhat happens in the background
in terms of security, but I amconcerned also about that.
If the quality of the data thatyou put is poor or is bad, then
your output is going to be bad.
You know.
It's the same as prompting.
You know if your prompting isnot non inclusive, the output is
(34:59):
probably going to be noninclusive.
You know when it generates animage or a piece of content.
You know.
So that's kind of like my takeon this whole AI thing.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
That's absolutely fair and that's similar to what
we had heard from our fun folkswho are on the AI episode.
But I like the kind of call outaround the security.
It's like, hey, yes, you needto still follow best practices.
Obviously, that's not ainvitation to throw caution in
the wind and input whatever datayou want into the system, but
(35:32):
you do need to be strategic,because wherever you get out is
what you put in.
Pivoting, though to thecompliance side of it, I always
say, when it comes to datacompliance, same thing like what
you said earlier you get whatyou put in.
If you aren't just notfollowing like GDPR rules or
just general compliance aroundhow you are inputting people's
(35:54):
information into your system,then obviously, yeah, you're
breaking rules, and that's lessabout the system and more about
how you operate with the data.
But I'm curious and who knows, Imay cut this if I don't like
the answer, but I do want to askthe question, though around is
there anything within Data Cloudthat helps make compliance
(36:16):
easier or following complianceeasier, or is it still just kind
of a?
You have to know it and it's acrapshoot.
Speaker 2 (36:23):
Interesting question.
So I heard one of the directorsof Data Cloud a couple weeks
ago say Data Cloud is not aconsent management platform.
Don't use Data Cloud forconsent management, and I think
(36:43):
there is somewhat truth about it.
I always think, like my answeris always it really depends.
So, first of all, consentmanagement.
I think again, data cloudshouldn't be this the source of
truth.
This, the source of truth orsystem of reference should be,
for example, cells cloud, right?
So if you're using cells cloud,you have an option to turn on
(37:05):
the consent management model incells cloud and it creates all
these objects you know yourparty consent objects and it
creates a individual objectswith all the you know the
channels Associates to them andeverything.
It is like a little nice objectData model for consent and you
can also install, like theconsent management app in the
(37:26):
app exchange as free, so you canactually record consent at the
CRM level.
You know which fun fact therecords that get generated about
consent don't count towardsyour storage quota for objects.
But maybe you know your use case, you.
You know you you're required touse like a consent management
(37:48):
tool, like one trust orsomething is enough, but you
know you can do it.
So then what you have in datacloud is a very similar entities
for consent.
So you have the, the, the onlyConsent by channel and by
category and the reasons of aconsent and you can pull like if
(38:09):
it's for GDPR or you know, etc.
Etc.
So you can actually build youremail.
But the idea is that you arereading from something, so
you're eating reading from your,your system of truth, like CRM,
or you are reading from like aone trust where you record all
the concern, requests and whyyou need to send that to that a
(38:29):
cloud, because when you'reactivating you need to check if
the person has consent toreceive, you know, an email or
an SMS or whatever right.
So that a cloud has a nicelittle model for consent
management.
But you need to use it In inconjunction with another system
and it gets really trickyactually when you start talking
(38:49):
about all but I have preference,a preference and the marketing
cloud, and then I have like thisor and then it's are getting
really, really complicated.
So if you have you knowwebsites or marketing
communications, you're trackingpeople on media, you're using
like marketing cloudpersonalization, all that, maybe
your best bet is to have Like aone trust on one unified way to
(39:12):
like control that consent andthen you send that data to data
cloud.
If your scenario is more simple, maybe you're okay with just
turning consent in CRM and thensending that data to data cloud.
You know it's a very delicatesubject but at the end of the
day I think the go-to the bestpractice in my mind like
approach should be that you aremanaging consent somewhere else
(39:37):
and you're using data cloud toyou know to map those consent
objects and then filtering theconsent when you're activating.
You know.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
I Think that makes a lot of sense.
I like that call out of you.
It's a reference, it's not thebe all, end all and yeah,
especially once you start addingin other Mediums, if you're
getting stuff from events.
But I mean having those mediumsoutside of, just like your
websites, one trust and beingable to say, cool, we're gonna
(40:08):
put this data in Salesforce,it's gonna flow into data cloud,
but then having like a oneplace that houses all of the
information I think to yourearlier point from what the
director of data cloud said,like it's not the be all, end
all solution, but I mean it canhelp visualize it so much better
and I think that's gonna help alot when it comes to compliance
(40:31):
, especially as GDPR rules getmore strict and other countries,
like the US, in Time willlikely have their own Privacy
laws that are enhanced andwhatnot, to mimic that of GDPR
Having that place to house allthe information.
So it's just a one-stop shop ofcool.
(40:51):
This is where it is.
These are all the places it'slocated.
Someone said delete.
Now you got a delete.
Speaker 2 (40:59):
Right yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
So we're nearing the end of our time.
We've had a really goodconversation.
Love hearing your background,loves hearing your insights
around dating data cloud formarketers and just data cloud in
the ecosystem.
I'm curious.
I want kind of dive into one ofthe last questions around just
kind of what you think thefuture is for admins.
(41:22):
So I asked this question inthat We've seen data cloud of,
especially in the last year,year and a half between, not
just from a naming side ofthings, but just from the
product itself.
We've seen data cloud growSignificantly and become this
amazing tool that can do so muchmore than it could Three, four
(41:44):
years ago.
With that being said, is thereany addition and any kind of
insight for that you would giveto admins around why this is a
product people should be jumpingon to learn more quickly than,
say, marketing GPT or Any of theother new products that are out
(42:07):
there right now?
Speaker 2 (42:09):
So, you know, since I I would say Dreamforce 2022
everything that we've beenhearing was data, ai and CRM.
You know anything?
Surfers continues to invest indata and CRM more from more and
more functionality.
It's been ported into datacloud.
I could see in the future thatmarketing functionality is gonna
(42:31):
start living in the data cloudenvironment.
You know, functionality thattoday exists in marketing
optimization Hopefully Exists inin data cloud.
It's the fastest growingproduct.
It's a product that was builtUsing the core technologies of
Salesforce, so it's not goinganywhere.
(42:54):
You know, and I think I thinkself forces heavily investing in
the product constantly and thatmakes it hard for us because
we're catching up constantly.
You know and then, but we areasked also to be the ones that
knows the most about theplatform, but we haven't even
caught up.
That's, that's an opportunity,yeah, right.
So I think that I Could see thelines blurring a lot more.
(43:20):
You know more than ever and ifyou're an admin and only working
on CRM, but you start, you knowyour organization's probably at
some point evaluate data cloud.
You know they're gonna use it,even if it's a free.
So no, no in these tools anduses is only gonna give you an
advantage.
You know, it's all.
It's also the same as we aretalking about chat GPT.
(43:42):
You know like people say no,resistant, no, no, no.
If you're a developer, knowinghow to GPT makes you faster, you
know it's not replacing you.
And this is the same like ifyou I'm gonna coin a term, I
don't know if it exists or not,but if it doesn't exist, let's
try market Full stack admin.
You know, I think there's gonnabe something called full stack
(44:04):
admin.
You know that is like.
You know you are not mean forlike, for like sales cloud, for
like marketing cloud.
You know, yeah, yep.
Speaker 1 (44:13):
So as we get into the last, last question of the show
, I Always ask this question.
I try to branch out with a few,but I really like this one in
the end, when you're thinkingthrough your journey and you've
now had a wonderful Journey fromnon sales force into the last,
(44:33):
probably 10, 15 years being moreinside of this ecosystem, what
would you say?
Your one regret is that youwish you could go back in time
and tell your former self manyou really should have put more
effort into XYZ.
Speaker 2 (44:46):
What would that one regret be.
Wow, oh, I don't know if Ithink I have regrets, you know.
So that's so I'm gonna.
Speaker 1 (44:56):
I've had a few people on the show.
Guys say something to thatextent Like I don't have regrets
and that's absolutely fine.
I just like to think of it asfor a new admin coming into the
ecosystem.
They Maybe making some of thesemistakes and obviously it's
great to learn from yourmistakes.
But if you can listen to thepodcast and be like, oh, this
person who's a marketingchampion, who has their own
(45:17):
company, who is very successfulin the Ecosystem, says they
should have done somethingdifferently, maybe I should take
a play out of their book.
Speaker 2 (45:25):
Yeah, so read the book emotional intelligence 2.0.
That will be my, my suggestion.
So learning about Emotionalintelligence at an earlier stage
(45:45):
, when you are working withother people and we, when, as an
admin, you have to likeinteract with a lot of team
members, it's gonna only giveyou a lot.
It's gonna give you tools thatyou can use to Put yourself in
the shoes of the other person,to Be more self-aware of how
(46:12):
you're interacting with otherpeople and, ultimately, focus,
focus on what you think isreally important for your
success.
I know it sounds kind of likeweird because it's always not
about learn technical skills,but no, it's.
For me.
One of my regrets is, I know,having it's not a regret, but if
I, if I could, you know, changesomething a little bit on my
(46:32):
journey will be like focusing alot more on like the Human
aspects of working with teamsare at least station my career
without giving me a Lot lessstress.
For me and I could see that ifyou're an admin, you're probably
dealing with a lot of stressbecause a lot of the
(46:53):
frustrations and energy thatpeople you know you absorb it
from people and also, like you,would I give me focus to say,
okay, I need to.
This is my, my career, and so Iwould read.
I would read emotionInternational stupid, no.
And I would read an or bookthat is called getting things
done, which I remember theauthor.
(47:13):
But I would read those twobooks and you are said then.
Then you are said you are readyto conquer the world.
Speaker 1 (47:19):
You know, I Love that and it's one of those.
I'm not gonna beat a dead horsebecause I say it all the time
on the show.
It's.
It's exactly what you said Goto YouTube, go wherever, but
read a couple books on likeleadership, read a couple books
on how to effectivelycommunicate.
There's a going, there's.
(47:39):
I mean there's so many greatYouTube videos on it.
There's so many great books onit.
So I mean I'm with you, the Ilove.
That's why I also started thispodcast.
I mean I started this because Ilove hearing stories, I love
learning from other people'slife experiences.
It's where that's three podcast, medium, book, medium.
I mean I've Grown so much justin the month and a half that
(48:00):
I've had this podcast around tobe able to learn from so many
other people.
So Love that answer.
I think a lot of admins cangrow and develop from that.
So, before you wrap up, isthere anything you want to
highlight, any topic you want togive a shout out to, anything
you want to plug?
Speaker 2 (48:20):
No, no, no, just love what you're doing.
I Agree with you.
It's kind of like you know thatyou do it also for you to learn
from our people.
I think it's a really cool wayto learn.
But also like I love thatyou're giving this.
I you're giving people a voiceto, to share their experience,
and I think that is a reallycool thing that you know.
Speaker 1 (48:45):
Well, I appreciate that very much.
We will definitely be chattingmore in the near future and
hopefully I will see you at oneof the upcoming.
There's a lot of upcomingevents, so hopefully I'll see
one of them.
But I really do appreciate youtaking the time out of your very
busy day to meet with me.
So have a wonderful rest ofyour day and we'll be chatting
more soon.
Speaker 2 (49:04):
Yeah, awesome Jacob.
Thank you so much for theopportunity and, yeah, we'll be
talking soon.
Speaker 1 (49:21):
And that concludes another episode of admins of
tomorrow.
A special thanks to our guestPato, for sharing their journey
and getting started as aSalesforce admin and how they
became a Salesforce marketingchampion, mvp and data cloud
expert.
It was an absolute blast totalk through ways new admins can
learn data cloud and, for mepersonally, coming from a space
of being inside of marketingcloud, account engagement and
(49:45):
sales cloud and serum analytics,I truly felt validated hearing
that, yes, you can learntrailhead, but there's some
other soft skills and things tolearn around data cloud and
around being a data manager anddata analyst.
There are crucial and those arethings that you might get with
trailhead, but you can also getthrough a lot of other different
(50:06):
mediums.
So thank you, pato, very, verymuch for sharing your stories
and your journey.
If you'd like to learn moreabout data cloud or becoming a
Salesforce developer, there'sstill time to register for
trailblazer DX.
Go to salesforcecom forwardslash trailblazer DX to register
now or sign up to watch onSalesforce plus.
Thank you all again for takingthe time to listen and support
(50:28):
the podcast.
If you have any feedback,questions or topic suggestions,
as always, we'd love to hearfrom you so don't hesitate to
connect with us on LinkedIn,twitter or email us at info at
adminsoftomorrowcom.
Again, if you or someone youknow would like to be on the
show or would like to givesomeone a shout out, please go
to our website,adminsoftomorrowcom, forward
slash, share your thoughts andfill out our form to be on the
(50:50):
show.
And finally, if you enjoyedthis episode, please don't
forget to subscribe and leave areview.
Every review and every listenmeans the absolute world to us
and helps us continue to growand build out the show for a
wider audience.
So please share with yourfellow trailblazers and listen
to us on Apple podcasts, spotifyor wherever you listen to
podcasts.
Once again, I'm Jacob Catalano,your host, signing off.
(51:14):
We appreciate you for listeningto admins of tomorrow,
trailblazing the next generation.
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