December 27, 2023 • 49 mins
Embark on an exploration of Salesforce careers with our latest episode featuring Salesforce recruiter Khero Witey. He joins the podcast to share his journey from the UK to leading a Salesforce Meetup in Dallas TX. We delve into not just the evolution of Salesforce as a platform but how it serves as a springboard for personal growth and assisting new admins in forging their path.
Join us as we tackle the universal jitters of embarking on new ventures and reveal strategies that turn nervous energy into career-defining moments. We offer insights into leveraging your unique background to carve out a niche in the Salesforce universe and navigating Salesforce across industries to find your competitive edge. The conversation flows from the importance of LinkedIn networking to the art of seizing opportunities where your personal experiences shine brightest.
Finally, as the tech world braces for the wave of AI, the episode highlights not just surviving but thriving in this new landscape. We discuss the rise of 'Devmin' roles and the significance of keeping a detailed ledger of your progress as an admin. Join us as we journey through the ins and outs of building a robust Salesforce career, equipped with foresight and strategies to navigate tomorrow's tech terrain.
Khero Witey is an experienced Technology Recruiter, currently AVP at Third Republic, a leading go-to Salesforce & Engineering staffing provider. He holds 3x Salesforce Certs and during his 8-year career has placed over 500 individuals, across the world. He also Co-Organizes the North Dallas SF Meetup group, a network of close to 1,500 individuals, who meet quarterly. He has supported businesses by hiring both individuals & building teams to scale for a mixture of companies, from local Dallas-based SMBs to Global Enterprise Conglomerates. His passion is for connecting the dots between individuals seeking new opportunities and businesses hiring the very best of the best.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Good morning and good afternoon.
My name is Jacob Catalano andwelcome to another episode of
Admins of Tomorrow.
I hope everyone's having awonderful holiday season and I
really appreciate you forjoining us as we get all of our
New Year's resolutions ready for2024,.
I hope this week's episode willhelp as we discuss evolving
your career and how to findpersonal growth with Salesforce.
(00:39):
Today's episode features KiroWitte, and it was an absolute
pleasure hearing from someonewho has helped thousands of
people find Salesforce jobs.
I first met Kiro in the Dallasarea where he co-leads a
Salesforce Meetup group.
This group has been sopositively received in the local
DFW community because it's aperfect networking spot for
(00:59):
admins where we can talk shopbut also find new friends in the
ecosystem.
In this week's episode we had awonderful discussion on
overcoming challenges, embracingnew opportunities and what
should new admins value mostwhen they're getting started.
I'm really excited for everyoneto listen along and hear the
perspectives of an amazingSalesforce recruiter.
(01:19):
So, without further ado, let'smeet Kiro.
Kiro is an experiencedtechnology recruiter, currently
AVP at Third Republic, a leadinggo-to Salesforce and
engineering staffing provider.
Kiro holds three Salesforcecertifications and during his
eight year career, has placedover 500 individuals across the
world.
(01:39):
He also co-organizes the NorthDallas Salesforce Meetup Group,
with a network of close to 1500individuals who meet on a
quarterly basis.
Kiro supported businesses hireboth individuals and build teams
to scale for a mixture ofcompanies from local Dallas
based small to medium sizedbusinesses to global enterprise
(02:01):
conglomerates.
His passion is for connectingthe dots between individuals
seeking new opportunities andbusinesses hiring for the very
best of the best.
So let's not waste any moretime and dive on in Sitting down
(02:35):
to kind of talk about the ideaof growing in the ecosystem and
what that looks like when you'retrying to get your first job.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
Absolutely no, absolute pleasure.
Jacob, thank you for the inviteto join the Admin of Tomorrow
podcast.
I think it's a fantastic causethat you're putting together to
bring people and interviewdifferent perspectives and
giving that time yourself backto the ecosystem.
(03:03):
So thank you for putting ittogether.
I'm excited to discuss a littlebit further with you and, as
you said, it has been a franticend to the year, so go easy on
your questions.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
All right I will absolutely try, absolutely try.
Now I appreciate it all.
It's been a pet project of minefor a very long time.
I just want to find a way togive back to the admin as
opposed to just talking aboutthe technical of 24, seven and
kind of the journeys we all takeand the experiences we are
(03:36):
gaining throughout the journey.
So kind of the first thing todive into it and something I've
talked about with a few otherpeople and I personally love
getting people's viewpoints onis just understanding everyone's
background, how they got intothe ecosystem and then kind of
figuring out around how theywere learning.
So I guess the first questionis what is your background in
(03:59):
the ecosystem?
Give us a quick introductionabout kind of your background
inside of the Salesforceecosystem.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Yeah, it's a great starting point and I feel like
that could be a podcast sessionin itself, to be honest with you
, but I'll give you the quickversion.
So my first introduction toSalesforce for those that are
listening and can pick up on myaccent, I'm not originally from
America, so I am a Brit, and myfirst interaction with
(04:26):
Salesforce was working in the UKas a recruiter, as a broader
technology recruiter, notnecessarily specializing in
Salesforce, but more change intransformation programs, and the
area of focus for me back then,almost eight, nine years ago,
was the charity sector and I hada customer that were looking to
(04:49):
move from Microsoft Dynamicsand were pretty much given
Salesforce for free back inprobably I want to say 2016,
2017.
Yeah, yeah, so this is pre-NPSP.
That wasn't a thing.
(05:11):
It was pure sales cloud, prettymuch without the bells and
whistles, but at its core, adifferent, unique product and I
think the thing for context aswell here is Salesforce in
Europe is a couple of years, inmy opinion, behind Salesforce
America, so even more so, justto set the scene, it was kind of
(05:34):
super early days for Salesforceas a brand, as a business, in
the UK market and there weren'tnecessarily quick wins have been
able to look for talent basedon certifications, or even at
that time where they calledSalesforce admins, it was maybe
a CRM admin and you just had tokind of call through and ask hey
(05:57):
, by the way, have you heard ofSalesforce and buying chance to
get any experience with it?
I think Trailhead maybe you'llbe able to remind me, jacob, but
I think Trailhead back then wasa fraction of the platform that
it is today.
Speaker 1 (06:12):
It is fascinating when you say that, because I
mean I got started in 2012 butwithin the last probably I was
gonna say four years, but it'snow we're closer like to eight
years.
But really within the lastdecade, we've really seen
strikes and the growth of theproduct, but also the growth of
(06:32):
the education, the Trailheadplatform.
So no, you're.
It's crazy.
I think 2016 was.
I keep thinking yeah, 2016,four years ago.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
I know we're near in that seven eight time, and
things have grown dramaticallysince then.
Yeah, I mean, time flies whenyou're having fun, huh.
But yeah, no, that was my firstforay into Salesforce and the
first time I started hearingabout it.
I then had a bit of exposure tothe O'Hana the size of the
(07:02):
opportunity in Salesforce and Imet Thurberpublic, which is a
Salesforce and engineering staffand provider that I'm currently
still working with.
It's been over five and a halfyears now in the US market,
based out of Dallas, same asyourself, and pretty much
(07:23):
exclusive to just supportingcustomers identify Salesforce
talent.
So my experience is maybe alittle bit more unique than
others that might be on thisseries, in a sense that it comes
from a recruiters perspectiveand that is a perspective having
supported, I would estimate, acouple hundred different
customers across the US, placingat least 375 Salesforce
(07:46):
specific resources over a fiveand a half year period of time.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
That's crazy.
But honestly though, to yourpoint, I mean I like the idea of
having someone with thatexperience and background.
It's also just a very differentperspective of you know a lot
about the ecosystem less becauseyou are inside of the system
every single day like an admin,like a Marketer, like a
salesperson, but you still hadthe same knowledge and Kind of
(08:17):
insights to offer as any otheradmin.
So now I'm really Kind ofexcited to I didn't realize that
there was some.
You had done so much in theecosystem, even outside of third
Republic.
So I'm really really excited tokind of talk with you and your
takes on how people can orshould be growing within the
ecosystem and how they can gettheir start.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Absolutely.
Yeah, no, well, let's, let'sdive in and ask away Jacob, I'm
all yours.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
Love it.
So you and I kind of gotintroduced through the I Don't
want to say pseudo Dallas usergroup, because you and your,
your friend Rob, created a group.
It's not necessarily directlythrough the traditional
trailhead community group.
You use meetupcom, but it'ssuch an inspiring and amazing
(09:08):
group of People to come in.
You go to a local bar in theDFW area and it's just a place
for people to network, forpeople to talk.
It's less about again us talkingabout the tech, us talking
about the specifics we do whilewe're there just because we
can't help it, but it's foreveryone and for like-minded
people to just chit, chat andlearn and Just get to know each
(09:31):
other and understand thatcommunity.
So my first question for you isthat you had this community
group.
You've done amazing things withit.
How do you believe Engagementin whether it be the Salesforce
community specifically, or orthe official Salesforce
community or the unofficialSalesforce community Plays a
(09:52):
part in your role or the journeyof a new ad?
Speaker 2 (09:56):
Yeah, I am.
You know, I would love to takethe full, full praise for the
art format.
It is a little bit unique.
But but a quick confession, weactually fell into that format.
I don't know if you're at thefirst one we ever did, with
myself and Robert, but we, youknow, quite simply, the venue
couldn't accommodate the numberof people that turned up
(10:19):
Probably quadruple the amount wewere expecting.
You know, we had to scrap ourformat of kind of the
traditional Presentation, showand tell kind of format and just
say, hey look, everyone's herebecause they have a, have one
thing in common Salesforce.
So let's, let's network, let'slet's chat and share experiences
, stories, questions here's ourguest attendees.
(10:40):
And you know, I see, I seequestions don't leave anything
on the table and that you knowthe success from that and having
to kind of adapt to that formathas has seen us do another 15
over almost a two-year period.
So but, but yes, in, in answerto your question, I think, look
very simply, there are a ton ofbenefits for individuals to gain
(11:05):
from going to those types ofFormatted events, whether it's
you more traditional Laptop,spring your laptop.
So let's work through a flow,whether it's a you know, texas
Dreaming style conference or aworld tour, whether it's dream
force or whether it's just likea happy hour vibe, right, I
think you know a lot of thebarrier to entry, in particular
(11:28):
for Salesforce individuals, isIs your network.
So the emphasis on networkingand attending these events not
necessarily go with a mindsetthat hey, it's gonna get me a
job, but more of an open mindsetto networking and maybe finding
you know somebody that relatesto your story, can share, share
(11:49):
it some advice that they, theywish they knew when then, when
they were in your shoes, two,three, five, ten years ago.
You know and sharing snippetsof information, pros, you know,
professional tips, pros and consof doing XYZ.
You know the classic debatesaround what search to focus on,
what career path to go down, endcustomer versus partner, all
(12:13):
these questions that you youknow you might have Starting out
in your journey as a new admin.
You know there are people inthese environments that you know
have been in those shoes andcan add value and want to give
that value bit, like yourself,want to do something to give
back To the community and help,help others on their journey to
(12:34):
be in a successful Salesforceadmin.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
How do you recommend people get out of their comfort
zone to go to someone like this?
Because and you may agree, youmay disagree but my opinion on
the matter is, if you areseeking that event out, you are
someone to constantly grow yournetwork and you likely, or you,
have a decent sized network.
What's something you would sayto someone who's kind of on the
(12:57):
fence, feeling uncomfortableabout attending an event, like,
again, a Community meetup orjust something local?
Speaker 2 (13:04):
Yeah, yeah, and look, and and we've, we've seen
people who may be more of, let'ssay, an introvert than
extrovert.
Right, you know I'm, I'm, youknow my background.
Put me in a room with strangersand I'll walk out and make
friends with people.
It just comes natural to meright.
But I understand that's noteveryone's cup of tea.
(13:26):
So I think, look, you know it'sa small network, especially
when you look at the localmeetups and local events Reach
out to one of the user groupleaders beforehand and just be
honest and just say, look, youknow, I would love to come and
participate in this Meetup or orevent.
You know, I don't reallynecessarily know anyone that's
(13:47):
going.
Would you mind?
You know, introducing me tosome people, could I, could I
talk to you and and you helpfacilitate a couple of
introductions for me with Otherattendees?
You know I'm interested inlearning XYZ.
Who do you think who is goingwould be a useful point of
contact for me.
And then, and then you know youcan look at that person before
(14:09):
Before meeting them in person.
Hey, quick, heads up.
I saw your RSVP to the nextNorth Dallas South Cross meetup.
Would love to connect, justhave a quick couple minute
conversation beforehand.
I Saw the number of attendeesand you know I'll be honest,
it's a little bit overwhelming,would you?
Would you mind just hop on aquick call with me a couple
minutes ahead of time so I'vegot a familiar face to say hello
(14:32):
to.
Once I'm there, there is nobody, I believe if they received
that message, who wouldn't hopon a call with somebody to make
someone feel a bit morecomfortable?
That is such the Ohana spiritof this ecosystem.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
I love that tip and I can't remember if I spoke with
you about this.
I know I've spoken about at aDallas meetup, but imposter
syndrome is slowly becoming aterm that no one has heard of
into something everyone hasheard of and we all feel it to
an extent.
So don't feel like you don'tbelong at the table or don't
belong in the meetup and feelcomfortable asking those
(15:09):
questions.
It's just a really good firststep.
I love where you're going withthat.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
I mean, look, I think , whether it's a meetup or
anything in life in general,you're going to have at some
point a feeling and inklingwhere someone's going to be
better than you or moreexperienced than you at
something right.
It's just inevitable.
So there's always going to bean aspect of imposter syndrome.
(15:39):
If I'm ahead of a pitch orsomething like that and it's a
big deal, sure I still get thosebutterflies in my stomach,
right, or I'm asked the question.
I haven't been asked for a longtime.
I still feel like that, evenafter doing this job for eight,
nine years.
So I think you're always goingto have that in your career,
(16:02):
regardless, and the quicker youcan get comfortable with being
uncomfortable, the better.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
I love that you said that, because I mean I do see,
when I'm not doing Salesforcework during the day, I do
theater and performance andplays and musicals and all that
stuff on the side.
And between that and all theconferences I speak at right
before you get on stage the.
Salesforce stage, but you'vebeen also just the actual stage.
There's always that moment oflike I'm going to forget
(16:32):
everything I ever know and I'mgoing to be the dumbest person
these people I've ever seen.
Once you just put yourself outthere, take that first step, all
the anxiety flows away andyou're in the moment you.
At this point, it's too late toturn back.
So you just have to take thatfirst step and, honestly, that's
the hardest part.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Because I'm with you.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
I still get butterflies and still get
anxiety to this day.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Yeah, I mean, look, I think part of that is it comes
from a good place, right?
I want it to be the absolutebest version of you that you can
right.
So I think people deal with itin different ways.
So I still, if I, you know,every meetup, before every
meetup that we do, you know, andI feel totally comfortable in
those environments, but beforeevery, every, every meetup that
(17:15):
I do, I have a big workout.
It's always something that, youknow, I just feel like
energizes me.
I work out always around fouro'clock, you know.
I get showered, have a quickbite to eat and then I'm at the
meetup ready to set and set andthings up around 545, 6, ready
to keep things up.
So that for me is is my way ofyou know any jitters there might
(17:38):
be, are people going to turn upor, you know, is everything
going to go well, even 15, 16meetups later.
I do that religiously beforeevery, every meetup that you
know, I co-organize with Robert.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
That's amazing and I think that's so transferable to
other people, whether it's thegym or just some activity to
release the endorphins and justmake you feel more calm to then
take that step.
I think that's a wonderful kindof piece of advice for people
so pivoting a little bit off ofengaging with the Salesforce
(18:11):
community, I kind of want todive into your attending the
community, your learning aboutthe ecosystem, and that's great.
But now you need to figure,make a choice.
What do you do in the ecosystem?
So, thinking about knowing thatthere are so many career paths,
clouds to learn, there's somany options you have in this
(18:34):
big, huge, fun ecosystem, whatis your view on diversifying
your skills?
Or what is your recommendationon how people should learn and
what skills they should learninside of the ecosystem, like,
should they have a niche?
Should they learn everythingKind of what's?
What's your take?
Speaker 2 (18:53):
on it.
Yeah, that's the million dollarquestion, isn't it?
I think that, alongsidecertifications, is probably the
top two questions that Iprobably get asked and, honestly
, to this point people, there'sno quick answer to this one, but
I can break it down kind ofwhat my thoughts and insight on
(19:14):
the subject is.
So, if you are starting yourcareer and looking for that
first role, I strongly believethat you are in identifying
quick wins and also combiningthat with something that you
enjoy.
Example if you are a teacherand you taught yourself
(19:36):
Salesforce, you got ontoTrailhead, you got your admin
certification and you want atransition to be a Salesforce
admin, let's say, because you'veidentified, from that Trail mix
perhaps, that you enjoy some ofthe tasks and you've got your
certification.
My advice would be target theeducation sector, be proactive
(19:56):
in identifying all the educationcompanies, the different types
of organizations that make upthe education space, whether
it's ed tech, whether it'straditional K12, whether it's
universities and proactivelyreach out and share your story.
Hey, jacob, I used to be ateacher for 12 years.
(20:17):
I recently had this epiphany,which was XYZ, and I took it
upon myself to go and learnSalesforce.
I hopped onto Trailhead, Ispent X amount of hours and I
was able to get my Salesforceadmin certification.
Is there any opportunity for meto either volunteer or, you
(20:37):
know, potentially go into abigger role if you're hiring now
, or whether you're not just tokind of showcase what I've
learned so far and See ifthere's any value I can bring to
your Salesforce org?
And and this is all proactivethrough LinkedIn.
Linkedin's an amazing platformto get that visibility on who's
in what company do they useSalesforce.
You can quickly you know,quickly identify.
(20:58):
LinkedIn stocking is no longerShame like a shameful thing when
I meet someone, the first thingI do is I'm not checking their
Facebook, their Instagram.
I'm on LinkedIn.
That's my social talking, so youknow what do they do.
But yeah, I think you know Iwould pick the low hanging
fruits where you might be ableto stand out from your
(21:19):
competition.
You have transferable industryknowledge, whether that's you
know a pain points that thesesectors face, whether it's you
understand the regulatoryrequirements if you're in the
healthcare space, whether it'syou know you worked in
compliance or or mortgage claims, so you got knowledge that you
can add value to a bank.
(21:40):
These are the low hangingfruits from Getting your foot in
the door that I would recommendto people.
If you're starting out withwith no paid experience at all
from a Salesforce standpoint,that is what I think you have to
quickly establish and kind ofaccept internally that hey, okay
(22:00):
, I'm gonna, I'm gonna look fora quick win to get my foot in
the door and and then I can, Ican look at the bigger picture
from from then on Onwards.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
No, I love that.
The thing I would tell peopleis that you think Salesforce
doesn't touch an industry.
You're wrong, you're just wrong.
Salesforce touches everythingand anywhere, and again, the
product specific.
There are people who knoweverything, there are people who
are just getting started out,but you can take that insight.
You can take your day-to-dayjob experience of being a
(22:31):
teacher, being a nurse, being aLawyer even yeah, I mean I'm not
saying the pay is gonna bebetter, I mean a lawyer to a
Salesforce person, but I Meanone of my clients is is a law
firm.
So I mean there, there's somany things you can touch from
the Salesforce ecosystem withthe industry you are in today.
You have to use that and I lovewhere you're coming from
(22:53):
completely agree.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
I think.
I think, look, I think, whenyou break that down further, you
know, typically if I'm workingwith an SMB size business, you
know we tend to see the jack ofall trades, so you know
resources that I speak to youfrom.
You know Salesforce or to,where maybe they've got a
hundred users or less.
You know they've done a bit ofeverything self cloud, service,
cloud, experience cloud so maybethey're not as specialized
(23:17):
Versus those individuals that Iconnect with who are coming from
more than mid to enterprisecustomer base when they have the
budgets and the demand to maybego out and hire someone who
only focuses on Field service,lightning or revenue cloud or
marketing cloud, for example.
So I think the reason why thatquestion so complex is it
(23:37):
completely depends on thescenario of an individual.
But, yeah, I think you know,looking at quick wins, looking
at what you enjoy, what you'repassionate about, you know if
you love to build, you look to,you know, get into the intersees
of how things work, etc.
Etc.
Then you know you might want togo down.
(23:58):
You know more of that kind ofarchitecture path, right, that
solution, design type.
You know career path if you, ifyou have high attention to
detail you like, you knowshowing others how it's done.
You know you can kind of managemultiple spinning plates etc.
Then that cut back to me,screams admin, you know, as your
(24:19):
career path.
If you're not technical but youlove what sells will still.
Then there's a whole salescareer, right, but you can tap
into.
So there are so many differentcareer options with different
types of skillset, personalities, experience levels.
You know, I think it really isan ecosystem where literally
someone can find, you know,anyone can find some kind of
(24:43):
connection between a Role andindustry and and what, what they
are, who they are, what theystand for, right, yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
It's funny too when you kind of talk about the
enterprise versus SMB and likewhether it's your first career
or your second career they're.
So often do I talk to peoplewho say, oh, I didn't go to
school for coding but I'm gonnalearn JavaScript or C++ or
Python or whatever.
But people who say I'm gonnalearn this on the side through
YouTube or whatever and I'mgonna make a lot of money, and I
(25:14):
would argue that's not a badroute to go down.
But you can do the same thingwith Salesforce.
Trailhead is such a vastKnowledge center and, to your
point earlier, there are so manydifferent Community meetups or
opportunities to network withother people comparatively to
(25:35):
any other Kind of first orsecond career path choice.
So I I love where you're goingwith that.
I do want to pivot a little bitbecause you mentioned you ask
kind of two common questions alot.
I want to dive into the secondone, which is around certain
certificates.
Certifications, so it's at theend of the day, in my opinion I
(25:56):
think are very important for thecompany work for, but I get the
worst testing anxiety thatyou've ever probably seen.
The idea of taking a test eventhough I probably know all the
subject matter Still to this daygives me the worst level of
anxiety I've experienced.
But I so that's where myOpinion about certs is very
(26:20):
biased, because I just don'tlike taking tests from someone
who's on the front lines ofrecruiting who's who are.
It was talking to new admins,admins who have been around for
a while and the company islooking for that right admin.
What is your opinion around?
the certs and how they play arole in initial and kind of
(26:43):
Within the first few years ofcareer.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
Yeah, I think, again, it's a classical debate, right,
search versus experience,experience versus search.
Which one's better?
Is one valued more than theother?
You know you speak to tendifferent people, you'll get ten
different answers, so so Ithink it's again.
These are all fantasticquestions.
(27:05):
No, no, hate to be a politicianand sit on the fence.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
There's no black and black and white right with some
of these questions, but no butyou're not.
You're not wrong is very politelike not political.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
But it's very yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Everyone's gonna have a different opinion.
Speaker 2 (27:19):
Yeah, I think controversial, right, it's one
of those controversial yeah forprovoking topics that you know
it's been rife in the industry,you know, for the last three,
four, five years and especiallynow that you know Salesforce has
ventured out the certificationprogram there's over 50 sales
for certifications out therethat they've branched out the
(27:41):
certifications to include allthe different kind of some of
those different skill sets andcareer paths that we spoke with
prior.
Look, my take on it, jacob, isis is quite simple If you are
starting out your journey intoday's market, you absolutely
have to get certified.
(28:02):
There is no excuse.
There is no excuse and I'll becompletely honest and if it
upsets a few people I'm sorry inadvance but you know I will not
speak to somebody unless theyare certified, because I know
the pressures I'm gonna facefrom our customers have been
able to justify why they shouldspend the time in tune that
resource when there are a lotmore options out there with
(28:24):
experience and withcertifications.
You know that that are equallyas keen for that opportunity,
right?
So if you are sub two years ofactual Salesforce hands-on
experience, honestly, man mightmight take and this will maybe
get some backlash but be likeAsh from Pokemon, collect them
(28:45):
all you know, get every.
Get your hands on as many asyou can, because it's the thing.
The thing is this right, if youget a you know, marketing cloud
email specialist sir, are youcapable of starting up a
marketing cloud email Instanceon your own?
No, probably not without thenecessary experience, right?
(29:07):
However, it might just get youthat opportunity with a customer
to even get that experience inthe first place to get the role
that might allow you to get morehands-on exposure to marketing
cloud right Versus someone whodoesn't have a certification.
So for me, they aredoor-openers.
They are Examples.
When you have little experienceto talk about that you can say,
(29:28):
well, look, you know, I've beenproactive, I've invested my
time, my money, I'm seriousabout you know Korean Salesforce
.
I've got five, six, seven,eight certifications and and
whilst I appreciate I'm notPolish, I'm not the finished
admin, I don't know all theanswers I Would like to bet on
myself and say you know, sixmonths guide, I didn't know
(29:51):
anything about Salesforce andthis is what I can show you that
I've, I've, I've understood andbeen able to Accomplish during
that period of time.
So, yeah, I think they're a nonNegotiable deal breaker for
individuals that are trying toget their break in the in the
ecosystem today.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
And honestly, that's part of the reason why I love.
I love that answer because it'sexactly why I've started this
podcast, because I don't agreewith that very much.
But I also lucked out and I gotmore experience beforehand.
I've been doing this since Iwas 19 years old, so I've lucked
out a little bit in that I gotmy certs just within the last
(30:34):
five years and I've been doingthis now for a very long time.
But your point is absolutelyvalid in that for people just
getting started, it's I look atit as like the whole when you're
in college and you're havingthat debate of like okay, I need
again entry level position, butagain entry level position, I
need three years of experience,well, to get three years of
(30:55):
experience, I need an entrylevel position.
It's that like weird horribleloop and the certs are kind of
being that point of giving youthe opportunity.
So you don't fall into that.
So I respect in here everythingyou're saying, but the horrible
test taker in me can't stand it.
But it's absolutely valid.
Speaker 2 (31:16):
I think it's an interesting one, right, Because
people are more maybe that's afault of the Salesforce certs,
right?
Maybe there should be a portionof the exam where it's crack
open and share a screen of asandbox org and show me how you
would do a demo of standardfunctionality, right?
Or create a flow for me, right,More like the trail head
(31:40):
exercises which are incorporatedinto a test and it's timed and
maybe that might be the answerto go versus multiple choice.
I don't know.
That's a decision above our paygrades, right.
So, maybe one day.
But look, I think I'll liken itto a lot of people went to
(32:03):
university who spent thousandsand thousands to get a degree.
Now some people are practicingin that field of study, but
there's a knot right.
But you still went touniversity, you got that degree
for a reason because that openedthe door to an opportunity, and
that's my belief, whatSalesforce certs do for someone
entering the market.
They are compared to othercertifications Scrums, project
(32:26):
management certifications, itil,et cetera.
They're pretty cheap incomparison and there is no need
in a theory, to go external andbuy courses et cetera, et cetera
.
You can get certified by justusing trail head alone.
So for me the barriers to entryis zero and I think it's a
(32:52):
great starting point to helpincrease the number of
conversations with bothrecruiters, businesses that are
hiring and just kind of give yousome immediate credibility when
you're starting out in yourcareer.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
Completely agree with that.
In that aspect and I'll say thisalso just kind of piggyback on
that I'm absolutely stealingthis opinion from someone I
can't remember who I heard fromit's probably one of my
coworkers.
But when you're first startingout, too, if you have the
ability because I know alsotimes are tough and certs do
cost money and you may not havethat being able to either
(33:31):
negotiate with your potentialfuture employer or find out an
employer who's willing to investin your growths, and like I
know the company I'm with wewill actually help pay for certs
and like as part of yourdepending on your role,
obviously.
But if you're just starting out, we know that you are good at
being a consultant and talkingwith people, but you don't have
(33:52):
the background.
We'll build it into like yourfirst three, six month plan to
like get XYZ certs to help youout so that you can, one, gain
credibility but, two, just getthe knowledge and grow quickly
in the ecosystem.
So keeping a lookout foropportunities like that I know
they're not always easilyaccessible, but it's just
(34:15):
keeping an open mind for it Ithink it's the biggest thing,
cause again, you could be astubborn person like me and just
say I'm just gonna look forjobs that don't require certs or
be flexible.
Speaker 2 (34:28):
Yeah, I mean, look, there are jobs out there where
customers are not as inclined totake certifications too hard
and there are some that I'veseen the candidates being
categorically denied becausethey need that.
They're a partner, they need aresource on that project who has
the right set of certificationsso, and they tend to be more
(34:51):
experienced resources or maybe aniche certification.
Right, that's how they won theproject in the first place.
So there are differentscenarios but we've seen both.
Likewise, we've seen on somegovernment projects if you don't
have a bachelor's degree youcan't get the job right.
So I'm not saying it's a blackand white yes or no answer, but
(35:14):
I think again in this marketwhich is a little bit more
challenging in general, I thinkyou would almost be like a
suicide mission if you weren'tto get certifications and you're
starting out, because to meit's a test of your seriousness
to a new career transition andit shows a future employer, your
(35:34):
aptitude for learning andgrowth, mindset and willingness
if they're gonna take a bet onyou with no experience.
Speaker 1 (35:40):
Very, very true.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
You know like, then why should they hire you, right?
If you're not willing to investtime yourself?
And you look at any careeroutside of technology pilots
they have to maintain X amountof hours of training and safety
protocol, et cetera, to be ableto continue flying planes, right
(36:02):
?
That's why Salesforce havemaintenance exams.
In my opinion, it's nodifferent right?
Just because your job's on acomputer and it's Salesforce
isn't any.
That's a very good call you'reabsolutely right.
Why should you not have to kindof keep your licenses fresh
right, the same way you would ifyou're flying a plane or
steering the ship of aSalesforce org.
Right?
Speaker 1 (36:22):
So yeah, Things are constantly evolving, constantly
changing.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
Yeah, exactly With Salesforce's free release
updates.
The cynical amongst us will sayit's a great money maker from
Salesforce.
Right, they make millions.
Let's not beat around the bushfrom the certifications.
But again, it's.
Speaker 1 (36:41):
They make a lot.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
But to that point right.
They do also do certificationdays, which again is free
five-hour sessions where you geta little bit of a discount code
at the end of it for sittingthrough those cert reminders.
So I think there areopportunities out there to take
advantage of all that freelearning and free content.
At the end of the day, youwould pay $30,000, $40,000 a
(37:03):
year for some of that stuff onTrailhead if it was at
university, right, theequivalent.
So I don't think it'sunreasonable for Salesforce to
charge a couple hundred bucksfor a test, to be honest.
Speaker 1 (37:15):
But I'm with you a thousand percent, and I love how
you brought it back to youroriginal point of the barrier to
entry isn't difficult, but it'sso easy when you find something
that you already either haveexperience on or are passionate
about.
Pivoting to the last question,though, because we are nearing
the end of our fun session, Ihave my big thing that it's kind
(37:39):
of a two-parter.
The first is around the futureof careers in the Salesforce
ecosystem.
You mentioned the AI certs andsome of the data cloud pieces.
A Thousand percent agree thatthose are the future of
Salesforce.
It's not gonna be like some ofthe other things we've seen
Salesforce put on the last fiveyears where they kind of Double
down on it at Dreamforce andthen kind of shy away.
(38:00):
I believe AI and data cloud aregoing to be big.
So, I'm curious your take, asyou're Looking at upcoming jobs
that are being posted or thingspeople are talking about from
the recruiting side, what do youthink the future of careers
will be like for Salesforce andSalesforce ecosystem?
Speaker 2 (38:19):
Wow, if I knew the answer to that, jacob, I
probably would be paying myearlier time, and I think that's
a real good one.
I Think, look, I think the thejourney for AI is very early.
You know, I think it's verydifficult to tell how that will
(38:42):
impact the traditional roles theadmin, the developer, the
project manager, the businessanalyst, the solution architect,
technical architect you knowthose traditional core roles.
I think it is difficult to.
Nobody has the answer.
So anyone who's saying you knowI'm an AI wizard or whatever,
that's not true Because it's sonew, right?
(39:04):
So I think.
I think the reality is, and Ithink what most people would
agree is AI needs to be embracedand utilized in a day-to-day
capacity, in whatever role youdo, because Over the over the
next six, nine, twelve months isgoing to be more and more a.
You don't need to know enoughto be dangerous in order to
(39:27):
Constantly meet the expectationsof a business that you're
supporting.
Right where that to help youwith speed of delivery, whether
it's to do more with less, ai isis is, you know, the catalyst
for helping, helping you getthere.
It might not get you to thedestination, but it's the car
that you need to drive right.
(39:48):
So, and, and you know, I think,the more people embrace it I
think them, you know the easierit will be.
I was a bit of a skeptic on theAI one, just because of some of
the you know other kind offailed initiatives that were
spoken about at differentdifferent events, right, but I
(40:10):
feel point, I think this is onethat will, will stick.
So I don't have the answers toit, but I don't think it's
necessarily gonna replace rolescompletely at all.
I think we're gonna see maybesome downsizing of Salesforce
resources on orcs.
So whether, let's say, you knowthey, an organization, a, might
(40:31):
have had three developers Toadmin the solution architect.
Yeah, they might condense thoseroles down and maybe Take away
some of the admin response topeople, but they incorporate
more business analysis as partof that role.
So it's like a hybrid admin BAwith Salesforce go more
click-not code.
Anyway, maybe that admin devrole becomes a bit more morphed
(40:52):
in those smaller organizations,right, as as they look to
supplement some of that easyquick win tax with AI.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
I've been here in the term admin Eleanor now for like
two years oh yeah, I canabsolutely imagine.
Oh yeah, well, not any prolinelike legitimate.
There's not like actually atitle admin Eleanor.
But I hear it used at likeSalesforce dream and events and
like the local community stuffwhere people are Toeing that
line between click not code.
So they're an admin, but they'rekind of the company they work
(41:24):
for doesn't have the finances orjust doesn't have the insight
to hire a full coding team.
So they will just kind of findsomeone who can either go with
that click not code route or whocan?
Know enough just to bedangerous and kind of be that
individual.
So you're seeing a lot more.
Yeah, I know, I am in thecommunity.
I think that's reallyinteresting.
Speaker 2 (41:45):
I'm gonna make that a little bit easier and call it a
dev min.
That means a lot more easier tosay, so let's call it I like
that way, I like that waydefinitely so.
So maybe the emergence of a newrole in the ecosystem of Devman,
you know, I think you know.
Maybe we should coin that quick, jacob, I think Remember the
(42:07):
royalties.
But but yeah, I think, jokingaside, I think you know, look, I
, I am a firm believer that AIwill Not completely replace
roles in the ecosystem.
You know, yeah, I isn't takingmy job and maybe I regret saying
that alive.
You know, in 10 years time, Idon't know.
But I think these roles Mightreduce as a result of AI.
(42:32):
But but if you're able toembrace AI and and learn AI your
own advantage, you'll be in agood position.
And that's just kind of ageneral.
Again, I'm not close enough tothe development of AI to be able
to kind of pitch in more thanthat, but that's, that's.
That's kind of my take on thesubject for now.
Speaker 1 (42:56):
No, I think that's that's a fair stance to take and
sits.
It provides an insight, whilealso saying there's so much
unknown about it, like we're notlikely to have a wide 2k
situation, but we definitelydon't know what the full extent
is gonna be.
So I'm with you on that front.
It so still too early to tell,but we definitely know there's
(43:17):
gonna be some Affect andsomething that will come a bit
positively for people absolutely.
So last question, truly lastquestion, because we are nearing
the end of time and I ask thisto everyone If you could go back
to yourself at the start ofyour Salesforce journey, or, as
you've talked to people at thevery start of this sales for
their Salesforce journey, whatis the number one piece of
(43:40):
advice you want to give them tohelp them grow?
Speaker 2 (43:43):
Yeah, this one.
Actually I Am going straightfrom the hip.
I think that's a sad Because Ijust had a light bulb moment
when you asked this question.
Probably not advice I'll givemyself, but advice I'll give.
You know, individuals that arepursuing their career in in
(44:03):
Salesforce or have a coupleyears under their belt.
Keep a record on Excel orGoogle sheets.
No, whether, however fancy youare, of a few things one, all
the companies that you supported, that, what their Salesforce
products suite included, howmany licenses, how many users,
who your manager was.
(44:25):
All that information becausewhen you're looking back, you
know five years time from nowand unless they you've done you
know you've worked at a partner.
You're maybe working on five toten different projects a year.
You know very quickly, in fiveyears you could have accumulated
maybe 50 projects that you'vesupported in some capacity.
You're not going to rememberall those different industries,
products, locations of clients,sizes of businesses, and I think
(44:49):
you know, as you develop yourcareer further, that there are.
You know there are times whenit's it's I need somebody who
has manufacturing experience andthey've rolled out an
implemented revenue cloud.
Let's say hypothetically, andsometimes, if you can pinpoint
right, I had a customer in 2021.
(45:10):
Right, it was a two month proofof concept and the Org was X
amount of users that that mightagain, might be enough to just
kind of nudge that conversationforward, put you in in
contention for that role.
So document everything and justbe like really religious around
it.
The other thing I would say isit get linked in recommendations
(45:34):
as you go, not when you'relooking for role.
Hey, I'm out of the job, canyou help me by write me a
recommendation?
Right, you know it.
That's harder to do when it wasthree years ago.
When you work with someonebecause, hey, you might have
changed completely three yearsago, I don't necessarily want to
go out and put a link inrecommendation against when I
worked three years ago.
So, as you move from project toproject, company to company, be
(45:57):
proactive and get those linkedin recommendations, because that
is all your brand andcredibility and, and, and that
is what's going to get you, youknow, more and more
opportunities is, is, is, isthat perspective.
And and the final one is justkeep on top of the search.
The biggest frustration as arecruiter and and the thing I
just don't understand is you'vedone all the hard work to get
(46:18):
the Set of certification in thefirst place, the hours and hours
of studying, the cost, etc.
Don't don't be unorganized andlet that Maintenance surpass and
, you know, have to redo thewhole thing again because I
can't imagine any Worst kind ofkicking in, kicking the stomach.
Then if I had to go out and doany of my certification exams
(46:39):
again you know I've done themonce.
I don't want to re go backthrough that studying.
So they're my three.
You only ask for one, butthey're my three bits of advice.
No, I love that.
That's.
That's great insight.
Speaker 1 (46:49):
I really appreciate you taking the time to provide
all that information for right,all that insight.
There are differentperspectives.
You don't always hear all thetime.
So Again, thank you so much fortaking an hour out of your day
to talk with us.
If you anyone has any questions, we'll make sure to link Kiro's
LinkedIn information as well asa link to the Dallas meetup if
you're a local Dallas IIT or DFWarea.
(47:14):
But again, thank you so much,kiro, really appreciate you
taking the time today.
No, the pleasure was all mine,jacob.
Speaker 2 (47:20):
Thank you, and yeah, if anyone wants to reach out,
you know hit me up on LinkedIn.
You know I will.
Um, you know I'll do my best toto to give you answers to
questions you may have, and Iwish everyone the best of luck
with their South's Forestcareers.
Speaker 1 (47:42):
Love it.
Speaker 2 (47:43):
Well, we'll be talking soon.
Speaker 1 (47:44):
Hopefully see you later.
Speaker 2 (47:45):
Bye everyone.
Speaker 1 (47:58):
And that concludes another episode of admins of
tomorrow.
A special thanks to our guestKiro, for sharing their
invaluable experiences andinsights.
If you're interested inlearning more about personal
growth and finding a careerwithin Salesforce, please feel
free to connect with Kiro onLinkedIn.
Or, if you're based in theDallas Fort Worth area, you can
search Salesforce north dallasmeetup on meetupcom.
(48:21):
We hope you found thisconversation helpful as we dive
into the new year and get 2024plans put in place.
It's been an absolute pleasurebeing your host and working with
our guests to highlight theiramazing journeys.
It's been a wonderful month ofDecember to share these admin
stories with everyone and Iabsolutely cannot wait for what
2024 has in store.
So thank you again for takingthe time to listen and support
(48:44):
our podcast.
If you have any feedback,questions or topic suggestions,
we'd love to hear from you.
So don't hesitate to connectwith us on LinkedIn, twitter or
email us at info at admins oftomorrowcom.
If you enjoyed this episode,don't forget to subscribe, leave
a review and share it with yourfellow trailblazers.
Once again, I'm Jacob Catalano,your host, signing off.
(49:07):
Have a wonderful holiday seasonand a happy new year.
We appreciate you for listeningto admins of tomorrow
trailblazing the next generation.
Good morning and good afternoon.
My name is Jacob Catalano andwelcome to another episode of
Admins of Tomorrow.
I hope everyone's having awonderful holiday season and I
really appreciate you forjoining us as we get all of our
New Year's resolutions ready for2024,.
I hope this week's episode willhelp as we discuss evolving
your career and how to findpersonal growth with Salesforce.
(00:39):
Today's episode features KiroWitte, and it was an absolute
pleasure hearing from someonewho has helped thousands of
people find Salesforce jobs.
I first met Kiro in the Dallasarea where he co-leads a
Salesforce Meetup group.
This group has been sopositively received in the local
DFW community because it's aperfect networking spot for
(00:59):
admins where we can talk shopbut also find new friends in the
ecosystem.
In this week's episode we had awonderful discussion on
overcoming challenges, embracingnew opportunities and what
should new admins value mostwhen they're getting started.
I'm really excited for everyoneto listen along and hear the
perspectives of an amazingSalesforce recruiter.
(01:19):
So, without further ado, let'smeet Kiro.
Kiro is an experiencedtechnology recruiter, currently
AVP at Third Republic, a leadinggo-to Salesforce and
engineering staffing provider.
Kiro holds three Salesforcecertifications and during his
eight year career, has placedover 500 individuals across the
world.
(01:39):
He also co-organizes the NorthDallas Salesforce Meetup Group,
with a network of close to 1500individuals who meet on a
quarterly basis.
Kiro supported businesses hireboth individuals and build teams
to scale for a mixture ofcompanies from local Dallas
based small to medium sizedbusinesses to global enterprise
(02:01):
conglomerates.
His passion is for connectingthe dots between individuals
seeking new opportunities andbusinesses hiring for the very
best of the best.
So let's not waste any moretime and dive on in Sitting down
(02:35):
to kind of talk about the ideaof growing in the ecosystem and
what that looks like when you'retrying to get your first job.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
Absolutely no, absolute pleasure.
Jacob, thank you for the inviteto join the Admin of Tomorrow
podcast.
I think it's a fantastic causethat you're putting together to
bring people and interviewdifferent perspectives and
giving that time yourself backto the ecosystem.
(03:03):
So thank you for putting ittogether.
I'm excited to discuss a littlebit further with you and, as
you said, it has been a franticend to the year, so go easy on
your questions.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
All right I will absolutely try, absolutely try.
Now I appreciate it all.
It's been a pet project of minefor a very long time.
I just want to find a way togive back to the admin as
opposed to just talking aboutthe technical of 24, seven and
kind of the journeys we all takeand the experiences we are
(03:36):
gaining throughout the journey.
So kind of the first thing todive into it and something I've
talked about with a few otherpeople and I personally love
getting people's viewpoints onis just understanding everyone's
background, how they got intothe ecosystem and then kind of
figuring out around how theywere learning.
So I guess the first questionis what is your background in
(03:59):
the ecosystem?
Give us a quick introductionabout kind of your background
inside of the Salesforceecosystem.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Yeah, it's a great starting point and I feel like
that could be a podcast sessionin itself, to be honest with you
, but I'll give you the quickversion.
So my first introduction toSalesforce for those that are
listening and can pick up on myaccent, I'm not originally from
America, so I am a Brit, and myfirst interaction with
(04:26):
Salesforce was working in the UKas a recruiter, as a broader
technology recruiter, notnecessarily specializing in
Salesforce, but more change intransformation programs, and the
area of focus for me back then,almost eight, nine years ago,
was the charity sector and I hada customer that were looking to
(04:49):
move from Microsoft Dynamicsand were pretty much given
Salesforce for free back inprobably I want to say 2016,
2017.
Yeah, yeah, so this is pre-NPSP.
That wasn't a thing.
(05:11):
It was pure sales cloud, prettymuch without the bells and
whistles, but at its core, adifferent, unique product and I
think the thing for context aswell here is Salesforce in
Europe is a couple of years, inmy opinion, behind Salesforce
America, so even more so, justto set the scene, it was kind of
(05:34):
super early days for Salesforceas a brand, as a business, in
the UK market and there weren'tnecessarily quick wins have been
able to look for talent basedon certifications, or even at
that time where they calledSalesforce admins, it was maybe
a CRM admin and you just had tokind of call through and ask hey
(05:57):
, by the way, have you heard ofSalesforce and buying chance to
get any experience with it?
I think Trailhead maybe you'llbe able to remind me, jacob, but
I think Trailhead back then wasa fraction of the platform that
it is today.
Speaker 1 (06:12):
It is fascinating when you say that, because I
mean I got started in 2012 butwithin the last probably I was
gonna say four years, but it'snow we're closer like to eight
years.
But really within the lastdecade, we've really seen
strikes and the growth of theproduct, but also the growth of
(06:32):
the education, the Trailheadplatform.
So no, you're.
It's crazy.
I think 2016 was.
I keep thinking yeah, 2016,four years ago.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
I know we're near in that seven eight time, and
things have grown dramaticallysince then.
Yeah, I mean, time flies whenyou're having fun, huh.
But yeah, no, that was my firstforay into Salesforce and the
first time I started hearingabout it.
I then had a bit of exposure tothe O'Hana the size of the
(07:02):
opportunity in Salesforce and Imet Thurberpublic, which is a
Salesforce and engineering staffand provider that I'm currently
still working with.
It's been over five and a halfyears now in the US market,
based out of Dallas, same asyourself, and pretty much
(07:23):
exclusive to just supportingcustomers identify Salesforce
talent.
So my experience is maybe alittle bit more unique than
others that might be on thisseries, in a sense that it comes
from a recruiters perspectiveand that is a perspective having
supported, I would estimate, acouple hundred different
customers across the US, placingat least 375 Salesforce
(07:46):
specific resources over a fiveand a half year period of time.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
That's crazy.
But honestly though, to yourpoint, I mean I like the idea of
having someone with thatexperience and background.
It's also just a very differentperspective of you know a lot
about the ecosystem less becauseyou are inside of the system
every single day like an admin,like a Marketer, like a
salesperson, but you still hadthe same knowledge and Kind of
(08:17):
insights to offer as any otheradmin.
So now I'm really Kind ofexcited to I didn't realize that
there was some.
You had done so much in theecosystem, even outside of third
Republic.
So I'm really really excited tokind of talk with you and your
takes on how people can orshould be growing within the
ecosystem and how they can gettheir start.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Absolutely.
Yeah, no, well, let's, let'sdive in and ask away Jacob, I'm
all yours.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
Love it.
So you and I kind of gotintroduced through the I Don't
want to say pseudo Dallas usergroup, because you and your,
your friend Rob, created a group.
It's not necessarily directlythrough the traditional
trailhead community group.
You use meetupcom, but it'ssuch an inspiring and amazing
(09:08):
group of People to come in.
You go to a local bar in theDFW area and it's just a place
for people to network, forpeople to talk.
It's less about again us talkingabout the tech, us talking
about the specifics we do whilewe're there just because we
can't help it, but it's foreveryone and for like-minded
people to just chit, chat andlearn and Just get to know each
(09:31):
other and understand thatcommunity.
So my first question for you isthat you had this community
group.
You've done amazing things withit.
How do you believe Engagementin whether it be the Salesforce
community specifically, or orthe official Salesforce
community or the unofficialSalesforce community Plays a
(09:52):
part in your role or the journeyof a new ad?
Speaker 2 (09:56):
Yeah, I am.
You know, I would love to takethe full, full praise for the
art format.
It is a little bit unique.
But but a quick confession, weactually fell into that format.
I don't know if you're at thefirst one we ever did, with
myself and Robert, but we, youknow, quite simply, the venue
couldn't accommodate the numberof people that turned up
(10:19):
Probably quadruple the amount wewere expecting.
You know, we had to scrap ourformat of kind of the
traditional Presentation, showand tell kind of format and just
say, hey look, everyone's herebecause they have a, have one
thing in common Salesforce.
So let's, let's network, let'slet's chat and share experiences
, stories, questions here's ourguest attendees.
(10:40):
And you know, I see, I seequestions don't leave anything
on the table and that you knowthe success from that and having
to kind of adapt to that formathas has seen us do another 15
over almost a two-year period.
So but, but yes, in, in answerto your question, I think, look
very simply, there are a ton ofbenefits for individuals to gain
(11:05):
from going to those types ofFormatted events, whether it's
you more traditional Laptop,spring your laptop.
So let's work through a flow,whether it's a you know, texas
Dreaming style conference or aworld tour, whether it's dream
force or whether it's just likea happy hour vibe, right, I
think you know a lot of thebarrier to entry, in particular
(11:28):
for Salesforce individuals, isIs your network.
So the emphasis on networkingand attending these events not
necessarily go with a mindsetthat hey, it's gonna get me a
job, but more of an open mindsetto networking and maybe finding
you know somebody that relatesto your story, can share, share
(11:49):
it some advice that they, theywish they knew when then, when
they were in your shoes, two,three, five, ten years ago.
You know and sharing snippetsof information, pros, you know,
professional tips, pros and consof doing XYZ.
You know the classic debatesaround what search to focus on,
what career path to go down, endcustomer versus partner, all
(12:13):
these questions that you youknow you might have Starting out
in your journey as a new admin.
You know there are people inthese environments that you know
have been in those shoes andcan add value and want to give
that value bit, like yourself,want to do something to give
back To the community and help,help others on their journey to
(12:34):
be in a successful Salesforceadmin.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
How do you recommend people get out of their comfort
zone to go to someone like this?
Because and you may agree, youmay disagree but my opinion on
the matter is, if you areseeking that event out, you are
someone to constantly grow yournetwork and you likely, or you,
have a decent sized network.
What's something you would sayto someone who's kind of on the
(12:57):
fence, feeling uncomfortableabout attending an event, like,
again, a Community meetup orjust something local?
Speaker 2 (13:04):
Yeah, yeah, and look, and and we've, we've seen
people who may be more of, let'ssay, an introvert than
extrovert.
Right, you know I'm, I'm, youknow my background.
Put me in a room with strangersand I'll walk out and make
friends with people.
It just comes natural to meright.
But I understand that's noteveryone's cup of tea.
(13:26):
So I think, look, you know it'sa small network, especially
when you look at the localmeetups and local events Reach
out to one of the user groupleaders beforehand and just be
honest and just say, look, youknow, I would love to come and
participate in this Meetup or orevent.
You know, I don't reallynecessarily know anyone that's
(13:47):
going.
Would you mind?
You know, introducing me tosome people, could I, could I
talk to you and and you helpfacilitate a couple of
introductions for me with Otherattendees?
You know I'm interested inlearning XYZ.
Who do you think who is goingwould be a useful point of
contact for me.
And then, and then you know youcan look at that person before
(14:09):
Before meeting them in person.
Hey, quick, heads up.
I saw your RSVP to the nextNorth Dallas South Cross meetup.
Would love to connect, justhave a quick couple minute
conversation beforehand.
I Saw the number of attendeesand you know I'll be honest,
it's a little bit overwhelming,would you?
Would you mind just hop on aquick call with me a couple
minutes ahead of time so I'vegot a familiar face to say hello
(14:32):
to.
Once I'm there, there is nobody, I believe if they received
that message, who wouldn't hopon a call with somebody to make
someone feel a bit morecomfortable?
That is such the Ohana spiritof this ecosystem.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
I love that tip and I can't remember if I spoke with
you about this.
I know I've spoken about at aDallas meetup, but imposter
syndrome is slowly becoming aterm that no one has heard of
into something everyone hasheard of and we all feel it to
an extent.
So don't feel like you don'tbelong at the table or don't
belong in the meetup and feelcomfortable asking those
(15:09):
questions.
It's just a really good firststep.
I love where you're going withthat.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
I mean, look, I think , whether it's a meetup or
anything in life in general,you're going to have at some
point a feeling and inklingwhere someone's going to be
better than you or moreexperienced than you at
something right.
It's just inevitable.
So there's always going to bean aspect of imposter syndrome.
(15:39):
If I'm ahead of a pitch orsomething like that and it's a
big deal, sure I still get thosebutterflies in my stomach,
right, or I'm asked the question.
I haven't been asked for a longtime.
I still feel like that, evenafter doing this job for eight,
nine years.
So I think you're always goingto have that in your career,
(16:02):
regardless, and the quicker youcan get comfortable with being
uncomfortable, the better.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
I love that you said that, because I mean I do see,
when I'm not doing Salesforcework during the day, I do
theater and performance andplays and musicals and all that
stuff on the side.
And between that and all theconferences I speak at right
before you get on stage the.
Salesforce stage, but you'vebeen also just the actual stage.
There's always that moment oflike I'm going to forget
(16:32):
everything I ever know and I'mgoing to be the dumbest person
these people I've ever seen.
Once you just put yourself outthere, take that first step, all
the anxiety flows away andyou're in the moment you.
At this point, it's too late toturn back.
So you just have to take thatfirst step and, honestly, that's
the hardest part.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Because I'm with you.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
I still get butterflies and still get
anxiety to this day.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Yeah, I mean, look, I think part of that is it comes
from a good place, right?
I want it to be the absolutebest version of you that you can
right.
So I think people deal with itin different ways.
So I still, if I, you know,every meetup, before every
meetup that we do, you know, andI feel totally comfortable in
those environments, but beforeevery, every, every meetup that
(17:15):
I do, I have a big workout.
It's always something that, youknow, I just feel like
energizes me.
I work out always around fouro'clock, you know.
I get showered, have a quickbite to eat and then I'm at the
meetup ready to set and set andthings up around 545, 6, ready
to keep things up.
So that for me is is my way ofyou know any jitters there might
(17:38):
be, are people going to turn upor, you know, is everything
going to go well, even 15, 16meetups later.
I do that religiously beforeevery, every meetup that you
know, I co-organize with Robert.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
That's amazing and I think that's so transferable to
other people, whether it's thegym or just some activity to
release the endorphins and justmake you feel more calm to then
take that step.
I think that's a wonderful kindof piece of advice for people
so pivoting a little bit off ofengaging with the Salesforce
(18:11):
community, I kind of want todive into your attending the
community, your learning aboutthe ecosystem, and that's great.
But now you need to figure,make a choice.
What do you do in the ecosystem?
So, thinking about knowing thatthere are so many career paths,
clouds to learn, there's somany options you have in this
(18:34):
big, huge, fun ecosystem, whatis your view on diversifying
your skills?
Or what is your recommendationon how people should learn and
what skills they should learninside of the ecosystem, like,
should they have a niche?
Should they learn everythingKind of what's?
What's your take?
Speaker 2 (18:53):
on it.
Yeah, that's the million dollarquestion, isn't it?
I think that, alongsidecertifications, is probably the
top two questions that Iprobably get asked and, honestly
, to this point people, there'sno quick answer to this one, but
I can break it down kind ofwhat my thoughts and insight on
(19:14):
the subject is.
So, if you are starting yourcareer and looking for that
first role, I strongly believethat you are in identifying
quick wins and also combiningthat with something that you
enjoy.
Example if you are a teacherand you taught yourself
(19:36):
Salesforce, you got ontoTrailhead, you got your admin
certification and you want atransition to be a Salesforce
admin, let's say, because you'veidentified, from that Trail mix
perhaps, that you enjoy some ofthe tasks and you've got your
certification.
My advice would be target theeducation sector, be proactive
(19:56):
in identifying all the educationcompanies, the different types
of organizations that make upthe education space, whether
it's ed tech, whether it'straditional K12, whether it's
universities and proactivelyreach out and share your story.
Hey, jacob, I used to be ateacher for 12 years.
(20:17):
I recently had this epiphany,which was XYZ, and I took it
upon myself to go and learnSalesforce.
I hopped onto Trailhead, Ispent X amount of hours and I
was able to get my Salesforceadmin certification.
Is there any opportunity for meto either volunteer or, you
(20:37):
know, potentially go into abigger role if you're hiring now
, or whether you're not just tokind of showcase what I've
learned so far and See ifthere's any value I can bring to
your Salesforce org?
And and this is all proactivethrough LinkedIn.
Linkedin's an amazing platformto get that visibility on who's
in what company do they useSalesforce.
You can quickly you know,quickly identify.
(20:58):
LinkedIn stocking is no longerShame like a shameful thing when
I meet someone, the first thingI do is I'm not checking their
Facebook, their Instagram.
I'm on LinkedIn.
That's my social talking, so youknow what do they do.
But yeah, I think you know Iwould pick the low hanging
fruits where you might be ableto stand out from your
(21:19):
competition.
You have transferable industryknowledge, whether that's you
know a pain points that thesesectors face, whether it's you
understand the regulatoryrequirements if you're in the
healthcare space, whether it'syou know you worked in
compliance or or mortgage claims, so you got knowledge that you
can add value to a bank.
(21:40):
These are the low hangingfruits from Getting your foot in
the door that I would recommendto people.
If you're starting out withwith no paid experience at all
from a Salesforce standpoint,that is what I think you have to
quickly establish and kind ofaccept internally that hey, okay
(22:00):
, I'm gonna, I'm gonna look fora quick win to get my foot in
the door and and then I can, Ican look at the bigger picture
from from then on Onwards.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
No, I love that.
The thing I would tell peopleis that you think Salesforce
doesn't touch an industry.
You're wrong, you're just wrong.
Salesforce touches everythingand anywhere, and again, the
product specific.
There are people who knoweverything, there are people who
are just getting started out,but you can take that insight.
You can take your day-to-dayjob experience of being a
(22:31):
teacher, being a nurse, being aLawyer even yeah, I mean I'm not
saying the pay is gonna bebetter, I mean a lawyer to a
Salesforce person, but I Meanone of my clients is is a law
firm.
So I mean there, there's somany things you can touch from
the Salesforce ecosystem withthe industry you are in today.
You have to use that and I lovewhere you're coming from
(22:53):
completely agree.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
I think.
I think, look, I think, whenyou break that down further, you
know, typically if I'm workingwith an SMB size business, you
know we tend to see the jack ofall trades, so you know
resources that I speak to youfrom.
You know Salesforce or to,where maybe they've got a
hundred users or less.
You know they've done a bit ofeverything self cloud, service,
cloud, experience cloud so maybethey're not as specialized
(23:17):
Versus those individuals that Iconnect with who are coming from
more than mid to enterprisecustomer base when they have the
budgets and the demand to maybego out and hire someone who
only focuses on Field service,lightning or revenue cloud or
marketing cloud, for example.
So I think the reason why thatquestion so complex is it
(23:37):
completely depends on thescenario of an individual.
But, yeah, I think you know,looking at quick wins, looking
at what you enjoy, what you'repassionate about, you know if
you love to build, you look to,you know, get into the intersees
of how things work, etc.
Etc.
Then you know you might want togo down.
(23:58):
You know more of that kind ofarchitecture path, right, that
solution, design type.
You know career path if you, ifyou have high attention to
detail you like, you knowshowing others how it's done.
You know you can kind of managemultiple spinning plates etc.
Then that cut back to me,screams admin, you know, as your
(24:19):
career path.
If you're not technical but youlove what sells will still.
Then there's a whole salescareer, right, but you can tap
into.
So there are so many differentcareer options with different
types of skillset, personalities, experience levels.
You know, I think it really isan ecosystem where literally
someone can find, you know,anyone can find some kind of
(24:43):
connection between a Role andindustry and and what, what they
are, who they are, what theystand for, right, yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
It's funny too when you kind of talk about the
enterprise versus SMB and likewhether it's your first career
or your second career they're.
So often do I talk to peoplewho say, oh, I didn't go to
school for coding but I'm gonnalearn JavaScript or C++ or
Python or whatever.
But people who say I'm gonnalearn this on the side through
YouTube or whatever and I'mgonna make a lot of money, and I
(25:14):
would argue that's not a badroute to go down.
But you can do the same thingwith Salesforce.
Trailhead is such a vastKnowledge center and, to your
point earlier, there are so manydifferent Community meetups or
opportunities to network withother people comparatively to
(25:35):
any other Kind of first orsecond career path choice.
So I I love where you're goingwith that.
I do want to pivot a little bitbecause you mentioned you ask
kind of two common questions alot.
I want to dive into the secondone, which is around certain
certificates.
Certifications, so it's at theend of the day, in my opinion I
(25:56):
think are very important for thecompany work for, but I get the
worst testing anxiety thatyou've ever probably seen.
The idea of taking a test eventhough I probably know all the
subject matter Still to this daygives me the worst level of
anxiety I've experienced.
But I so that's where myOpinion about certs is very
(26:20):
biased, because I just don'tlike taking tests from someone
who's on the front lines ofrecruiting who's who are.
It was talking to new admins,admins who have been around for
a while and the company islooking for that right admin.
What is your opinion around?
the certs and how they play arole in initial and kind of
(26:43):
Within the first few years ofcareer.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
Yeah, I think, again, it's a classical debate, right,
search versus experience,experience versus search.
Which one's better?
Is one valued more than theother?
You know you speak to tendifferent people, you'll get ten
different answers, so so Ithink it's again.
These are all fantasticquestions.
(27:05):
No, no, hate to be a politicianand sit on the fence.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
There's no black and black and white right with some
of these questions, but no butyou're not.
You're not wrong is very politelike not political.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
But it's very yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Everyone's gonna have a different opinion.
Speaker 2 (27:19):
Yeah, I think controversial, right, it's one
of those controversial yeah forprovoking topics that you know
it's been rife in the industry,you know, for the last three,
four, five years and especiallynow that you know Salesforce has
ventured out the certificationprogram there's over 50 sales
for certifications out therethat they've branched out the
(27:41):
certifications to include allthe different kind of some of
those different skill sets andcareer paths that we spoke with
prior.
Look, my take on it, jacob, isis is quite simple If you are
starting out your journey intoday's market, you absolutely
have to get certified.
(28:02):
There is no excuse.
There is no excuse and I'll becompletely honest and if it
upsets a few people I'm sorry inadvance but you know I will not
speak to somebody unless theyare certified, because I know
the pressures I'm gonna facefrom our customers have been
able to justify why they shouldspend the time in tune that
resource when there are a lotmore options out there with
(28:24):
experience and withcertifications.
You know that that are equallyas keen for that opportunity,
right?
So if you are sub two years ofactual Salesforce hands-on
experience, honestly, man mightmight take and this will maybe
get some backlash but be likeAsh from Pokemon, collect them
(28:45):
all you know, get every.
Get your hands on as many asyou can, because it's the thing.
The thing is this right, if youget a you know, marketing cloud
email specialist sir, are youcapable of starting up a
marketing cloud email Instanceon your own?
No, probably not without thenecessary experience, right?
(29:07):
However, it might just get youthat opportunity with a customer
to even get that experience inthe first place to get the role
that might allow you to get morehands-on exposure to marketing
cloud right Versus someone whodoesn't have a certification.
So for me, they aredoor-openers.
They are Examples.
When you have little experienceto talk about that you can say,
(29:28):
well, look, you know, I've beenproactive, I've invested my
time, my money, I'm seriousabout you know Korean Salesforce
.
I've got five, six, seven,eight certifications and and
whilst I appreciate I'm notPolish, I'm not the finished
admin, I don't know all theanswers I Would like to bet on
myself and say you know, sixmonths guide, I didn't know
(29:51):
anything about Salesforce andthis is what I can show you that
I've, I've, I've understood andbeen able to Accomplish during
that period of time.
So, yeah, I think they're a nonNegotiable deal breaker for
individuals that are trying toget their break in the in the
ecosystem today.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
And honestly, that's part of the reason why I love.
I love that answer because it'sexactly why I've started this
podcast, because I don't agreewith that very much.
But I also lucked out and I gotmore experience beforehand.
I've been doing this since Iwas 19 years old, so I've lucked
out a little bit in that I gotmy certs just within the last
(30:34):
five years and I've been doingthis now for a very long time.
But your point is absolutelyvalid in that for people just
getting started, it's I look atit as like the whole when you're
in college and you're havingthat debate of like okay, I need
again entry level position, butagain entry level position, I
need three years of experience,well, to get three years of
(30:55):
experience, I need an entrylevel position.
It's that like weird horribleloop and the certs are kind of
being that point of giving youthe opportunity.
So you don't fall into that.
So I respect in here everythingyou're saying, but the horrible
test taker in me can't stand it.
But it's absolutely valid.
Speaker 2 (31:16):
I think it's an interesting one, right, Because
people are more maybe that's afault of the Salesforce certs,
right?
Maybe there should be a portionof the exam where it's crack
open and share a screen of asandbox org and show me how you
would do a demo of standardfunctionality, right?
Or create a flow for me, right,More like the trail head
(31:40):
exercises which are incorporatedinto a test and it's timed and
maybe that might be the answerto go versus multiple choice.
I don't know.
That's a decision above our paygrades, right.
So, maybe one day.
But look, I think I'll liken itto a lot of people went to
(32:03):
university who spent thousandsand thousands to get a degree.
Now some people are practicingin that field of study, but
there's a knot right.
But you still went touniversity, you got that degree
for a reason because that openedthe door to an opportunity, and
that's my belief, whatSalesforce certs do for someone
entering the market.
They are compared to othercertifications Scrums, project
(32:26):
management certifications, itil,et cetera.
They're pretty cheap incomparison and there is no need
in a theory, to go external andbuy courses et cetera, et cetera
.
You can get certified by justusing trail head alone.
So for me the barriers to entryis zero and I think it's a
(32:52):
great starting point to helpincrease the number of
conversations with bothrecruiters, businesses that are
hiring and just kind of give yousome immediate credibility when
you're starting out in yourcareer.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
Completely agree with that.
In that aspect and I'll say thisalso just kind of piggyback on
that I'm absolutely stealingthis opinion from someone I
can't remember who I heard fromit's probably one of my
coworkers.
But when you're first startingout, too, if you have the
ability because I know alsotimes are tough and certs do
cost money and you may not havethat being able to either
(33:31):
negotiate with your potentialfuture employer or find out an
employer who's willing to investin your growths, and like I
know the company I'm with wewill actually help pay for certs
and like as part of yourdepending on your role,
obviously.
But if you're just starting out, we know that you are good at
being a consultant and talkingwith people, but you don't have
(33:52):
the background.
We'll build it into like yourfirst three, six month plan to
like get XYZ certs to help youout so that you can, one, gain
credibility but, two, just getthe knowledge and grow quickly
in the ecosystem.
So keeping a lookout foropportunities like that I know
they're not always easilyaccessible, but it's just
(34:15):
keeping an open mind for it Ithink it's the biggest thing,
cause again, you could be astubborn person like me and just
say I'm just gonna look forjobs that don't require certs or
be flexible.
Speaker 2 (34:28):
Yeah, I mean, look, there are jobs out there where
customers are not as inclined totake certifications too hard
and there are some that I'veseen the candidates being
categorically denied becausethey need that.
They're a partner, they need aresource on that project who has
the right set of certificationsso, and they tend to be more
(34:51):
experienced resources or maybe aniche certification.
Right, that's how they won theproject in the first place.
So there are differentscenarios but we've seen both.
Likewise, we've seen on somegovernment projects if you don't
have a bachelor's degree youcan't get the job right.
So I'm not saying it's a blackand white yes or no answer, but
(35:14):
I think again in this marketwhich is a little bit more
challenging in general, I thinkyou would almost be like a
suicide mission if you weren'tto get certifications and you're
starting out, because to meit's a test of your seriousness
to a new career transition andit shows a future employer, your
(35:34):
aptitude for learning andgrowth, mindset and willingness
if they're gonna take a bet onyou with no experience.
Speaker 1 (35:40):
Very, very true.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
You know like, then why should they hire you, right?
If you're not willing to investtime yourself?
And you look at any careeroutside of technology pilots
they have to maintain X amountof hours of training and safety
protocol, et cetera, to be ableto continue flying planes, right
(36:02):
?
That's why Salesforce havemaintenance exams.
In my opinion, it's nodifferent right?
Just because your job's on acomputer and it's Salesforce
isn't any.
That's a very good call you'reabsolutely right.
Why should you not have to kindof keep your licenses fresh
right, the same way you would ifyou're flying a plane or
steering the ship of aSalesforce org.
Right?
Speaker 1 (36:22):
So yeah, Things are constantly evolving, constantly
changing.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
Yeah, exactly With Salesforce's free release
updates.
The cynical amongst us will sayit's a great money maker from
Salesforce.
Right, they make millions.
Let's not beat around the bushfrom the certifications.
But again, it's.
Speaker 1 (36:41):
They make a lot.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
But to that point right.
They do also do certificationdays, which again is free
five-hour sessions where you geta little bit of a discount code
at the end of it for sittingthrough those cert reminders.
So I think there areopportunities out there to take
advantage of all that freelearning and free content.
At the end of the day, youwould pay $30,000, $40,000 a
(37:03):
year for some of that stuff onTrailhead if it was at
university, right, theequivalent.
So I don't think it'sunreasonable for Salesforce to
charge a couple hundred bucksfor a test, to be honest.
Speaker 1 (37:15):
But I'm with you a thousand percent, and I love how
you brought it back to youroriginal point of the barrier to
entry isn't difficult, but it'sso easy when you find something
that you already either haveexperience on or are passionate
about.
Pivoting to the last question,though, because we are nearing
the end of our fun session, Ihave my big thing that it's kind
(37:39):
of a two-parter.
The first is around the futureof careers in the Salesforce
ecosystem.
You mentioned the AI certs andsome of the data cloud pieces.
A Thousand percent agree thatthose are the future of
Salesforce.
It's not gonna be like some ofthe other things we've seen
Salesforce put on the last fiveyears where they kind of Double
down on it at Dreamforce andthen kind of shy away.
(38:00):
I believe AI and data cloud aregoing to be big.
So, I'm curious your take, asyou're Looking at upcoming jobs
that are being posted or thingspeople are talking about from
the recruiting side, what do youthink the future of careers
will be like for Salesforce andSalesforce ecosystem?
Speaker 2 (38:19):
Wow, if I knew the answer to that, jacob, I
probably would be paying myearlier time, and I think that's
a real good one.
I Think, look, I think the thejourney for AI is very early.
You know, I think it's verydifficult to tell how that will
(38:42):
impact the traditional roles theadmin, the developer, the
project manager, the businessanalyst, the solution architect,
technical architect you knowthose traditional core roles.
I think it is difficult to.
Nobody has the answer.
So anyone who's saying you knowI'm an AI wizard or whatever,
that's not true Because it's sonew, right?
(39:04):
So I think.
I think the reality is, and Ithink what most people would
agree is AI needs to be embracedand utilized in a day-to-day
capacity, in whatever role youdo, because Over the over the
next six, nine, twelve months isgoing to be more and more a.
You don't need to know enoughto be dangerous in order to
(39:27):
Constantly meet the expectationsof a business that you're
supporting.
Right where that to help youwith speed of delivery, whether
it's to do more with less, ai isis is, you know, the catalyst
for helping, helping you getthere.
It might not get you to thedestination, but it's the car
that you need to drive right.
(39:48):
So, and, and you know, I think,the more people embrace it I
think them, you know the easierit will be.
I was a bit of a skeptic on theAI one, just because of some of
the you know other kind offailed initiatives that were
spoken about at differentdifferent events, right, but I
(40:10):
feel point, I think this is onethat will, will stick.
So I don't have the answers toit, but I don't think it's
necessarily gonna replace rolescompletely at all.
I think we're gonna see maybesome downsizing of Salesforce
resources on orcs.
So whether, let's say, you knowthey, an organization, a, might
(40:31):
have had three developers Toadmin the solution architect.
Yeah, they might condense thoseroles down and maybe Take away
some of the admin response topeople, but they incorporate
more business analysis as partof that role.
So it's like a hybrid admin BAwith Salesforce go more
click-not code.
Anyway, maybe that admin devrole becomes a bit more morphed
(40:52):
in those smaller organizations,right, as as they look to
supplement some of that easyquick win tax with AI.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
I've been here in the term admin Eleanor now for like
two years oh yeah, I canabsolutely imagine.
Oh yeah, well, not any prolinelike legitimate.
There's not like actually atitle admin Eleanor.
But I hear it used at likeSalesforce dream and events and
like the local community stuffwhere people are Toeing that
line between click not code.
So they're an admin, but they'rekind of the company they work
(41:24):
for doesn't have the finances orjust doesn't have the insight
to hire a full coding team.
So they will just kind of findsomeone who can either go with
that click not code route or whocan?
Know enough just to bedangerous and kind of be that
individual.
So you're seeing a lot more.
Yeah, I know, I am in thecommunity.
I think that's reallyinteresting.
Speaker 2 (41:45):
I'm gonna make that a little bit easier and call it a
dev min.
That means a lot more easier tosay, so let's call it I like
that way, I like that waydefinitely so.
So maybe the emergence of a newrole in the ecosystem of Devman,
you know, I think you know.
Maybe we should coin that quick, jacob, I think Remember the
(42:07):
royalties.
But but yeah, I think, jokingaside, I think you know, look, I
, I am a firm believer that AIwill Not completely replace
roles in the ecosystem.
You know, yeah, I isn't takingmy job and maybe I regret saying
that alive.
You know, in 10 years time, Idon't know.
But I think these roles Mightreduce as a result of AI.
(42:32):
But but if you're able toembrace AI and and learn AI your
own advantage, you'll be in agood position.
And that's just kind of ageneral.
Again, I'm not close enough tothe development of AI to be able
to kind of pitch in more thanthat, but that's, that's.
That's kind of my take on thesubject for now.
Speaker 1 (42:56):
No, I think that's that's a fair stance to take and
sits.
It provides an insight, whilealso saying there's so much
unknown about it, like we're notlikely to have a wide 2k
situation, but we definitelydon't know what the full extent
is gonna be.
So I'm with you on that front.
It so still too early to tell,but we definitely know there's
(43:17):
gonna be some Affect andsomething that will come a bit
positively for people absolutely.
So last question, truly lastquestion, because we are nearing
the end of time and I ask thisto everyone If you could go back
to yourself at the start ofyour Salesforce journey, or, as
you've talked to people at thevery start of this sales for
their Salesforce journey, whatis the number one piece of
(43:40):
advice you want to give them tohelp them grow?
Speaker 2 (43:43):
Yeah, this one.
Actually I Am going straightfrom the hip.
I think that's a sad Because Ijust had a light bulb moment
when you asked this question.
Probably not advice I'll givemyself, but advice I'll give.
You know, individuals that arepursuing their career in in
(44:03):
Salesforce or have a coupleyears under their belt.
Keep a record on Excel orGoogle sheets.
No, whether, however fancy youare, of a few things one, all
the companies that you supported, that, what their Salesforce
products suite included, howmany licenses, how many users,
who your manager was.
(44:25):
All that information becausewhen you're looking back, you
know five years time from nowand unless they you've done you
know you've worked at a partner.
You're maybe working on five toten different projects a year.
You know very quickly, in fiveyears you could have accumulated
maybe 50 projects that you'vesupported in some capacity.
You're not going to rememberall those different industries,
products, locations of clients,sizes of businesses, and I think
(44:49):
you know, as you develop yourcareer further, that there are.
You know there are times whenit's it's I need somebody who
has manufacturing experience andthey've rolled out an
implemented revenue cloud.
Let's say hypothetically, andsometimes, if you can pinpoint
right, I had a customer in 2021.
(45:10):
Right, it was a two month proofof concept and the Org was X
amount of users that that mightagain, might be enough to just
kind of nudge that conversationforward, put you in in
contention for that role.
So document everything and justbe like really religious around
it.
The other thing I would say isit get linked in recommendations
(45:34):
as you go, not when you'relooking for role.
Hey, I'm out of the job, canyou help me by write me a
recommendation?
Right, you know it.
That's harder to do when it wasthree years ago.
When you work with someonebecause, hey, you might have
changed completely three yearsago, I don't necessarily want to
go out and put a link inrecommendation against when I
worked three years ago.
So, as you move from project toproject, company to company, be
(45:57):
proactive and get those linkedin recommendations, because that
is all your brand andcredibility and, and, and that
is what's going to get you, youknow, more and more
opportunities is, is, is, isthat perspective.
And and the final one is justkeep on top of the search.
The biggest frustration as arecruiter and and the thing I
just don't understand is you'vedone all the hard work to get
(46:18):
the Set of certification in thefirst place, the hours and hours
of studying, the cost, etc.
Don't don't be unorganized andlet that Maintenance surpass and
, you know, have to redo thewhole thing again because I
can't imagine any Worst kind ofkicking in, kicking the stomach.
Then if I had to go out and doany of my certification exams
(46:39):
again you know I've done themonce.
I don't want to re go backthrough that studying.
So they're my three.
You only ask for one, butthey're my three bits of advice.
No, I love that.
That's.
That's great insight.
Speaker 1 (46:49):
I really appreciate you taking the time to provide
all that information for right,all that insight.
There are differentperspectives.
You don't always hear all thetime.
So Again, thank you so much fortaking an hour out of your day
to talk with us.
If you anyone has any questions, we'll make sure to link Kiro's
LinkedIn information as well asa link to the Dallas meetup if
you're a local Dallas IIT or DFWarea.
(47:14):
But again, thank you so much,kiro, really appreciate you
taking the time today.
No, the pleasure was all mine,jacob.
Speaker 2 (47:20):
Thank you, and yeah, if anyone wants to reach out,
you know hit me up on LinkedIn.
You know I will.
Um, you know I'll do my best toto to give you answers to
questions you may have, and Iwish everyone the best of luck
with their South's Forestcareers.
Speaker 1 (47:42):
Love it.
Speaker 2 (47:43):
Well, we'll be talking soon.
Speaker 1 (47:44):
Hopefully see you later.
Speaker 2 (47:45):
Bye everyone.
Speaker 1 (47:58):
And that concludes another episode of admins of
tomorrow.
A special thanks to our guestKiro, for sharing their
invaluable experiences andinsights.
If you're interested inlearning more about personal
growth and finding a careerwithin Salesforce, please feel
free to connect with Kiro onLinkedIn.
Or, if you're based in theDallas Fort Worth area, you can
search Salesforce north dallasmeetup on meetupcom.
(48:21):
We hope you found thisconversation helpful as we dive
into the new year and get 2024plans put in place.
It's been an absolute pleasurebeing your host and working with
our guests to highlight theiramazing journeys.
It's been a wonderful month ofDecember to share these admin
stories with everyone and Iabsolutely cannot wait for what
2024 has in store.
So thank you again for takingthe time to listen and support
(48:44):
our podcast.
If you have any feedback,questions or topic suggestions,
we'd love to hear from you.
So don't hesitate to connectwith us on LinkedIn, twitter or
email us at info at admins oftomorrowcom.
If you enjoyed this episode,don't forget to subscribe, leave
a review and share it with yourfellow trailblazers.
Once again, I'm Jacob Catalano,your host, signing off.
(49:07):
Have a wonderful holiday seasonand a happy new year.
We appreciate you for listeningto admins of tomorrow
trailblazing the next generation.
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