November 21, 2024 • 25 mins
"Planning isn't just about the paperwork"
In this episode of 'Advice From Your Advocates', Attorney Bob Mannor and co-host / executive producer Savannah Meksto discuss the complexities of elder law, focusing on long-term care planning, the importance of holistic approaches, and the necessity of having essential legal documents like powers of attorney. They emphasize the need for families to start planning early, the significance of building a support team for dementia care, and debunk common legal myths surrounding estate planning. The episode also highlights community resources and support groups available for families dealing with elder care issues.
Takeaways
- Planning for life is more important than planning for death.
- Holistic planning includes financial, emotional, and legal aspects.
- Powers of attorney are crucial for decision-making.
- It's essential to start planning for long-term care early.
- Dementia care requires a comprehensive support team.
- Medicaid options can help protect assets.
- It's never too late to seek legal advice.
- Community resources are vital for families in need.
- Legal documents are tools that need to be used correctly.
- Families should care about financial planning for their loved ones.
Listen to more episodes of Advice From Your Advocates wherever you get your podcasts. Learn more about Mannor Law Group: www.mannorlawgroup.com
Host: Attorney Bob Mannor, CELA with Savannah Meksto, CDP
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ABOUT US:
Mannor Law Group helps clients in all matters of estate planning and elder law including special needs planning, veterans’ benefits, Medicaid planning, estate administration, and more. We offer guidance through all stages of life.
We also help families dealing with dementia, Alzheimer’s disease, Parkinson’s disease, and other illnesses that cause memory loss. We take a comprehensive, holistic approach, called Life Care Planning. LEARN MORE...
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Savannah Meksto (00:04):
You're listening to Advice from your
Advocates, a show where weprovide elder law advice to
professionals who work with theelderly and their families.
Attorney Bob Mannor (00:11):
Welcome to Advice from your Advocates.
I'm Bob Mannor.
I'm an elder law attorney, sowe're going to focus on a lot of
legal issues, but we're reallygoing to talk about anything
that's affecting older folks asthey age and particularly making
sure that we have the best carethat we can for the rest of our
lives.
We might have a special focuson folks that have family
(00:33):
members with dementia.
It's an important issue for meand something that we really
work with our families.
Savannah Meksto (00:40):
And I'm Savannah Meksto.
I'm a certified dementiapractitioner and your co-host.
Today, we're here to break downthe complex issues around elder
care and elder planning, sothat you can protect your loved
ones and your peace of mind.
Attorney Bob Mannor (00:54):
Today's show and all the future shows
are going to be filled withvaluable insights, real stories
and practical advice.
Whether you're driving to workor just drinking your morning
coffee, stay tuned and you won'twant to miss this show.
Okay, folks, we're going todive right into a topic that is
(01:16):
really important to a lot offamilies, and that's going to be
long-term care.
So we don't really think aboutthis.
For most of us, we plan formost stages of our life and then
just imagine that we're goingto fade off into the sunset and
die with our boots on.
But the reality is most of usare going to face some period of
time before we die that we'regoing to need some help from
other people, and most familiesaren't prepared for that.
(01:36):
So it's something that I thinkwe should discuss.
We have what we call a holisticpractice, because we're not
just going to focus on dollarsor legal documents.
We're going to focus on the bigpicture of making sure that we
get quality of life and qualitycare, making sure we have
resources to pay for that care,including government benefits
that might help out with that.
Savannah Meksto (01:55):
That's right, bob.
Planning isn't just about thepaperwork and that's something
that we talk a lot about in ourfirm often and it's really just
about ensuring that your lovedones are cared for in the best
way possible, whether that'sfinancially or emotionally.
We want to help you and guideyou in that journey, and today
we're going to walk you throughhow to approach estate planning
(02:17):
from this holistic perspective.
Attorney Bob Mannor (02:20):
So let's start off with that, and one of
the things I like to focus on issomething I call planning for
life.
What do I mean by that?
Well, the thing is, a lot offolks do go when they get a will
or they get a trust, they getsome legal documents, but most
people, when they go, theirthought is I'm planning for my
death, right, I'm planning forwhat happens when I die, and
(02:44):
that, of course, is important,and that's stuff we do at Manor
Law Group also.
I think the more importantquestion is what happens if you
live, and what I mean by that is, you know, in previous
generations we'd get old, we'dget sick and we'd die.
Now, most of us are going to getold and get sick and we live,
and how do we make that timebetter?
(03:06):
How do we make sure that we'regoing to our family's, going to
know what to do and we're notgoing to be a burden and we have
resources to pay for care andthat we just have a better
quality of life?
This gets particularlydifficult when we have a loved
one with dementia.
So this is very important, andone of the things that we always
have to focus on is making surethat we don't go broke, that we
(03:28):
don't deplete our assets inpaying for care, especially for
a married couple.
We don't want to have oneperson use all the money and
then the surviving spouse endsup in poverty.
So those are things that can beavoided.
Savannah Meksto (03:40):
That's such a crucial point, bob.
Dementia, for example.
It's something that can changeeverything.
Suddenly.
You're not just dealing withfinancial issues, but now you
also have medical issues,emotional issues and even legal
challenges.
A holistic plan looks at all ofthese aspects together and how
to protect your assets yeah, ofcourse, but also how to ensure
(04:02):
that your loved one's dignityand quality life are preserved.
Attorney Bob Mannor (04:06):
Yeah, savannah, that's one of the
things that I really like.
What you said there about aholistic plan, this is something
that a lot of people don'tthink about.
Even lawyers A lot of lawyersthey are just kind of you know a
lot of great lawyers.
They're doing great legal work,but they're really focused on
legal documents, and I thinkit's really important to be
holistic and think about, okay,how are we going to use these
(04:28):
documents?
How is that going to berelevant?
So let's start at the beginning.
Let's start at what really isone of the most important things
that we start with, and thenone of the most important
documents to work with a lawyeron is not actually your will.
Most people assume that's whatthey're going to talk to their
lawyer about is to get a will.
I think the most importantdocument is your powers of
(04:49):
attorney, one for financial andone for medical, because if I'm
focusing on what happens, youknow, how do we plan for life as
opposed to planning for death.
Those are more important.
We need to have good, detailedrules in place, documents in
place to allow the people youlove and trust to be able to
(05:12):
help you if and when you needhelp, and otherwise we end up
having to go through differentprocesses, like a court process
with guardianship orconservatorship, but it's really
important that most importantfirst document that I think that
we really have to focus on isyour powers of attorney,
financial and medical.
Savannah Meksto (05:31):
And that's where working with someone who
understands the nuances comesinto place.
For instance, in dementia care,it's not just about who makes
the decisions, but what thosedecisions look like.
Do they understand theprogression of the disease?
Can they advocate for the typeof care that maintains dignity
and safety?
These are the tough questionsthat a holistic estate plan will
(05:52):
answer.
Attorney Bob Mannor (05:53):
So now I'm going to get into something a
little bit more complicated.
So you know, you've probablyheard of a power of attorney
before and again, I really wantto focus on how important that
is and that you pick the rightpeople and it's not just a
fill-in-the-blank form either.
It should be that we're reallyfocusing on what authority, what
powers do we want to givesomebody and they're not all the
(06:14):
same.
A lot of people think, oh, it'sa power of attorney, you just
put your name on it, sign it andget it notarized.
The powers of attorney we useare very different depending on
the circumstances and what theneeds are, but one of the
reasons that we have it is oneof the reasons we need that is
when we get to the point of howare we going to pay for care?
(06:36):
Now, I don't know about you,Savannah, but I'm not a
millionaire.
Savannah Meksto (06:39):
I wish I was, but no.
Attorney Bob Mannor (06:41):
Most of us are.
Most of the listeners probablyare.
And you know, if we hadunlimited money, we wouldn't
have to worry about this stuff.
Right, we just wouldn't have toworry about it.
And that's not true for most ofus.
We do worry about it andsometimes people say, oh well,
you know, we're fine, theyfigure out the math and they say
, well, I think, if you know, ifwe look at mom's savings and if
(07:02):
we had to sell mom's house orwhatever, we might be able to
pay for care for two or threeyears.
Okay, well, what happens if momlives 10 years?
This is a very serious thing anda lot of people think.
First of all, a lot of peoplehave never thought about this.
Right, it's just not somethingthat most people are going to
(07:26):
give much attention to, untiland unless it affects your
family, until it's your mom oryour spouse.
And now we really do have tothink about this.
And the good news there'sactually really good news on
this that there are benefitsthat you've paid into your
entire life that can help payfor things like home care or
assisted living or a nursinghome.
There's different programs thatwe're going to be talking about
(07:46):
through the series of this show.
It is very important that welook at ways to make sure that
you're not going to go broke ifand when it comes to be that
your loved one needs care andsome people think, oh well, I've
got Blue Cross right, I've gotHumana, whatever it is.
(08:06):
Unfortunately, Blue Cross andHumana and Medicare do not pay
for continuing care.
So they might pay for thehospital visit, they might pay
for the doctor's visit, you canhave coverage for prescriptions,
but if you need somebody tocome over every day and help you
get dressed or help you showeror just make sure that you're
(08:28):
staying safe, then we're goingto have to look to other
government benefits.
Savannah Meksto (08:32):
Bob, that is so right and so important and
something that we say a lot inthe firm that really sticks with
me is that it's never too lateand it's never too early to
start planning.
Of course, the earlier that youstart planning, the more
options that you're going tohave, which is, of course,
important, and this is why weencourage families to start
(08:52):
these conversations soonerrather than later.
But, again, it's never too lateand it's never too early to
start planning.
Attorney Bob Mannor (08:58):
That's great, savannah.
That's so true.
You know, of course it's betterto plan ahead and I know not
everybody does that right.
I prefer you to, obviously, butwe can help in a crisis too.
I'm going to be honest with you.
Probably over 50% of the folksthat I help with dementia or
long-term care issues, they cometo me in a crisis.
(09:19):
They come to me after theythink that it might be too late.
Well, honestly, like Savannahsaid, it's never too late.
We can help in a crisis.
If you're not in a crisis now,though, you might want to think
about planning ahead, becauseit's going to be easier on the
family, it's going to be lessexpensive, it's going to give
you more options.
(09:39):
So we can help in a crisis.
It's never too late.
If there's a, you know, there'sa stroke, there's a fall,
there's.
You know, we found that dad waswandering away from the house
or, you know, was driving andgot, you know, got pulled over
because the police saw that hewas confused, or something like
that.
Those are crises and we canhelp with that, but it's better
(10:05):
to get in front of it so thatwe're not.
You know that that's not theproblem.
At Mannor Law Group, we helpfamilies.
We help families with life anddeath and illness.
It is something that has beenour passion and we will help you
with basic things like willsand trusts.
(10:26):
We can help you with thingslike if there is a diagnosis, a
serious diagnosis or a dementiadiagnosis, parkinson's, anything
like that.
It is very difficult for thefamily to address that and there
are legal and financialconsiderations that we can help
with and make sure that you'regetting good care.
We provide care, navigation andhelp with finding resources to
(10:50):
pay for care, includingaccessing federal and local
benefits.
So you can reach our office inGrand Blanc at 810-694-9000.
Savannah Meksto (11:05):
So these questions that we're about to go
through have come in fromclients of the past.
We're not going to use realnames for today's questions, but
we thought that these werereally important and we get
these a lot, not just from theclients that we've had, from
just people that we meet in thecommunity.
So I'm really excited to sharesome of these with you.
The first question by Betty mymom was just diagnosed with
(11:29):
early stage Alzheimer's andwe're starting to think about
long-term care.
What should we be doing now?
Attorney Bob Mannor (11:35):
So this is a great question and you know I
mentioned earlier that we havethis podcast with the same name,
advice from your Advocates, andon the podcast I recently
interviewed a guest that wastalking about all the services
that are available for familiesthat have a loved one with
dementia or Alzheimer's.
And the thing is what he wassaying was a lot of families
(12:00):
tend to sort of cocoon.
They just kind of hide in theirhouse and they don't want, you
know, they're just afraid, andso that they just make sure that
mom doesn't go out anymore ordad, you know, is kind of
confined, and that's probablynot the best answer.
In fact, what he was saying wasit probably makes it worse.
Not only does it make it worsefor their health, but it makes
(12:22):
it worse quality of life for thefamily and for the person
suffering from dementia orAlzheimer's.
And so it's really important,when we look at this, that you
want to start developing a team,a team of resources that's
going to be able to help withthis.
So many families think theyhave to deal with this on their
own.
I can't tell you how manypeople are dealing with similar
(12:46):
issues and trying to figure thisout on your own.
I just can't imagine thatyou're going to come up with the
best answers on your own.
This is not something you canGoogle and say you know what to
expect when your loved one hasdementia, so it is something
that you really need.
Some people that have beenworking in this for a long time
(13:07):
know the details of thecommunity.
Even every community is goingto be a little bit different as
far as what resources are goingto be available for somebody
with Alzheimer's or dementia.
You know I'm going to obviouslytell you that you need an elder
law attorney, somebody that'sexperienced in Medicaid,
experienced in veterans benefits, experienced with the community
, and our biggest strength atManor Law Group is our
(13:29):
relationships with the long-termcare community.
We know the folks that areinvolved in it.
We know the nuances of it, thefolks that are involved in it.
We know the nuances of it.
We know what we can demand asfar as quality of care and what
places frankly provide bettercare, and so part of that team
is going to be an experiencedelder law attorney.
(13:50):
But I also think you need tostart thinking about your
medical experts.
So maybe a gerontologist, maybea neurologist, but I actually
think the gerontologist has amore holistic view.
Sometimes they're not justlooking at the brain, and then
we really need to be thinkingabout making sure if you have a
financial person, if you have afinancial advisor, they should
(14:12):
be communicating with the lawyer.
They should be communicatingand we should start thinking
about a plan.
If we need to access resources,which accounts should we be
taking that from?
There's an answer to thatquestion.
This is not a rhetoricalquestion.
Sometimes it's better to takeit out of a savings account,
sometimes it's better to take itout of an IRA, and so those are
real questions and you'reprobably not going to find that
(14:35):
great advice unless you have ateam that's working together the
lawyer, the financial advisor,the doctor and then what are the
community resources?
You know, are there somedaycare options?
What are the options that we'dlook at for home care?
What are the options we'd lookat for care outside of the home?
So that's my advice when youhave somebody that's early stage
(14:56):
Alzheimer's, our advice isstart building a team of those
people you're going to rely on.
Savannah Meksto (15:02):
That is so important, Bob.
I really love that answer.
And this next question comes infrom a client that we are going
to call Bill, and Bill says I'mconcerned about my dad running
out of money if he needslong-term care.
How can we protect his assets?
Attorney Bob Mannor (15:18):
dad running out of money if he needs
long-term care, how can weprotect his assets?
This is a good question andthis is a question that a lot of
kids are timid to ask, and Idon't think you should be.
I wrote an article years agofor the View newspaper that you
know we see everywhere, and thearticle said why you should care
about your parents' money.
And it was a provocative titleintentionally, because a lot of
(15:39):
times we have families that comein and say well, you know, we
don't care about the money, wedon't care about mom and dad's
money, we just want to make surethat they're taken care of.
We should care about the money.
It's important to think thisthrough.
We don't want to be in a crisis.
We don't want to be in asituation where we have worse
services or have to go to thelesser places or don't have
options.
You know, the bottom line is weshould care about the money and
(16:02):
there's going to be a timeespecially if your parent or
spouse is experiencing somedementia there's going to be a
time where they're not fullycapable of making.
You know all of the financialdecisions that they used to make
.
You know all of the financialdecisions that they used to make
.
This is a difficult place for achild to be in because they're
used to, you know, mom and dadbeing the ones that tell them
(16:24):
what to do, and not us tellingmom and dad what to do, and
especially when it comes tomoney, because it almost sounds
like you're greedy and it's not.
It's not about being greedy,it's about being smart and
making sure that we're making,we're leveraging things and
making the best use of ourresources.
And it can go a long way.
You know you don't have to be amultimillionaire to be able to
(16:45):
get good quality care.
It's just if you're, we have toleverage it.
We have to look for things likeMedicaid options the PACE
program, which is called theProgram for All-Inclusive Care
for the Elderly, the my ChoiceWaiver program, which is called
the Program for All-InclusiveCare for the Elderly, the my
Choice Waiver program, whichprovides for some home care, or,
you know, medicaid, nursinghome Medicaid.
(17:07):
There's a bunch of veteransbenefits that we can we'll get
into eventually and talk aboutin future programs.
But the bottom line is the ifit's a veteran or spouse of a
veteran, widow of a veteran,there's a bunch of programs
through the VA.
Sometimes it's actually justproviding you money to pay for
care.
Sometimes it's just providingthat care.
So the key on this is you reallyshould be asking this question
(17:27):
and there are ways to protectyour assets and qualify.
A few times I've mentioned theword Medicaid.
Sometimes, when people hearthat, they think, oh, that's
only for poor people.
There's a bunch of Medicaidprograms, including some
Medicaid programs that allow usto protect assets.
We're just following theirrules and you do not have to
spend down to nothing before youqualify for these Medicaid
(17:49):
programs.
They can pay for things likein-home care or nursing home
care.
Savannah Meksto (17:55):
And remember, it's not just about the money.
Protecting assets is also aboutensuring that your dad or your
mom or your grandparent hasaccess to the best care possible
, which is why we look at thewhole picture.
Attorney Bob Mannor (18:10):
You've been listening to Advice from your
Advocates and we'll be back withour legal myth busters.
Savannah Meksto (18:21):
All right, welcome back to Advice From your
Advocates.
It is time for our legal mythbusting segment.
Bob, here's a common myth Ihave a will, so I don't need
anything else.
What do you think?
Attorney Bob Mannor (18:34):
That is a good one and something I
frequently hear, or I even hearjust as often.
I have a trust and therefore Idon't need anything else.
You know a lot of people thinktrust is just sort of this
magical document that's going tosolve all our problems, or a
will is sufficient and it'sgoing to take care of things.
Frankly, that's not the finalanswer.
The document itself is just atool, like a tool in a toolbox,
(19:01):
and you know I joke with thefolks at the office at Manor Law
Group sometimes that I have alot of tools at home.
I have a really big toolbox.
I don't know how to use verymany of them and I'm just not
that great as far as aconstruction person or a
handyman, but I have the toolsand so that's one of the key
things is having a will orhaving a trust.
(19:23):
Unless we're using that toolright and actually you need more
tools than that that's just notgoing to be sufficient and
really we need to know how andwhen to use those things.
So a will.
For example, when does a willtake effect?
Savannah?
Savannah Meksto (19:37):
When you die Wrong?
Oh darn it.
Attorney Bob Mannor (19:41):
That's a trick question she knew it was a
trick question.
So it's when you die and thenwhen a judge puts it into effect
, right, a judge has to issue aletter of authority before the
will has any legal effect, sothe will doesn't work without
going to court.
So then there's a thing calleda trust, which is basically just
a contract between you and yourfamily.
Now, a trust is going to be alot more flexible than a will,
(20:01):
but it's still not going tosolve all your problems.
That's where what we talkedabout earlier is things like a
really strong power of attorney,a really strong patient
advocate in case you can't makemedical decisions for
yourselfacy waivers.
There's just a lot of differentthings.
You know HIPAA waivers, thingslike that, where you really need
to have it be more thorough andholistic.
Savannah Meksto (20:21):
Yeah, exactly, planning is about much more than
just dividing up your moneywhen you die.
It's about making sure thatyou're protected during your
lifetime, no matter what happens.
Lifetime, no matter whathappens.
(20:42):
So, before we wrap up today, Ithink that we should talk about
some fantastic local resourcesthat we have for families and
professionals that are dealingwith elder care.
Attorney Bob Mannor (20:48):
For 10 years now and this is actually
something that Savannah's beenrunning for several years.
We have something we call ElderCare Boot Camp or Elder Law
Boot Camp, and it's kind of whatwe're known for with Mannor Law
Group and in this area, andthen Flint and Grand Blanc area,
Lapeer, Shiawassee, and so wehave been training folks in the
long-term care industry.
(21:09):
So we've trained social workersand care administrators and in
the past we've done some nursingcontinuing education credits.
We've, like you said, the casemanagers and the certified
senior advisors.
Savannah Meksto (21:24):
Even financial advisors.
Attorney Bob Mannor (21:25):
Financial advisors, exactly, and other
attorneys.
One of the things I've beenable to do it's been kind of an
honor to I teach other attorneysthrough the Institute of
Continuing Legal Education, andthis is such an area of law that
a lot of attorneys never gottrained in this in law school.
This is a unique area of lawthat most lawyers at least when
(21:46):
I was in law school, they didn'teven offer this as an option.
It wasn't even an optionalclass, an optional class.
So it is something that we'veenjoyed being able to help
others and educate folks andlearn from other folks.
It'll be in May this year, maynext year, 2025.
One of the things is we learnso much and we talk about it as
(22:07):
the circle of care that we'reall working together to get the
best care we can for our folksthat need help.
And so the circle of care isvery important to us because
we're learning from you, you'relearning from us.
We're all trying to worktogether to get the best results
for folks.
Savannah Meksto (22:21):
And being a listener today, you're a part of
our circle of care too.
Attorney Bob Mannor (22:24):
Yeah, very nice.
I want to highlight somethingthat Savannah is going to give
us a little bit more informationabout, but we just started an
Alzheimer's support group at ouroffice in Grand Blanc.
We were looking to do it at asenior center, but we found that
a lot of folks were looking fora one that was not during
business hours.
They wanted it after hours, andso the senior centers weren't
(22:48):
open at that time, and so we arehosting it at our office with
our fantastic social worker,nikki Inches.
And so Savannah can give alittle bit more information
about that.
Savannah Meksto (22:59):
Yeah, absolutely so.
If you are a caregiver ofsomeone with dementia, we invite
you to come to this sessionthat we have the third Tuesday
of every month at our GrandBlanc Manor Law Group office.
We're just located in GrandBlanc on Saginaw Street, right
next to Chase Bank, if you'refamiliar with the area.
If not, call us we'll tell you,but the meeting is from 530 to
(23:21):
630.
Again, it's the third Tuesdayof the month and we would love
to see you there.
We even have cookies.
That's a good time.
Attorney Bob Mannor (23:27):
Nikki has been one of the social workers
that works with our office, andwe make a good use of social
workers in our office.
We call them care navigators.
So in one of the futureprograms we're going to talk
about care navigation, becauseit's really important.
When a family is dealing withlong-term care they're dealing
with a aging loved one they'reworried about making sure that
(23:47):
they're safe and they're gettinggood care.
It's really hard to maneuverand really figure everything out
, and so our office, in additionto providing the legal services
and getting access to benefitsthat can help pay for care, we
provide care navigators that canreally walk us through that
system.
So you've been listening toadvice from your advocates.
(24:09):
It is an exciting adventure forSavannah and I.
Savannah Meksto (24:12):
Yeah, absolutely.
And if you want more in-depthdiscussions, just like this, you
can find us wherever you listento podcasts.
And if you like video if you'drather watch us than listen you
can find us on YouTube.
Attorney Bob Mannor (24:24):
We're also on a few of the social media
things.
It's kind of funny that we'veactually gone viral a few times
on TikTok If you ever look atthe TikTok.
Savannah Meksto (24:34):
Yeah, the TikTok.
Yes, you can tell how old I amwhen I call it the TikTok.
Attorney Bob Mannor (24:40):
So, yeah, we have fun with it and we
actually were just recently.
The thing we went viral on iswe were promoting that anybody
that's 18 years or older shouldstart with some basic legal
documents like a power ofattorney.
So that is something that wewere promoting on TikTok and I
think we got like 1.5 millionviews.
Savannah Meksto (24:57):
Yeah, we did.
Yep, it was amazing.
Thanks for tuning in to Advicefrom your Advocates and remember
you're not alone in thisjourney.
We're here to help you everystep of the way.
Thanks for listening.
To learn more, visitMannorLawGroup.
com.
You're listening to Advice from your
Advocates, a show where weprovide elder law advice to
professionals who work with theelderly and their families.
Attorney Bob Mannor (00:11):
Welcome to Advice from your Advocates.
I'm Bob Mannor.
I'm an elder law attorney, sowe're going to focus on a lot of
legal issues, but we're reallygoing to talk about anything
that's affecting older folks asthey age and particularly making
sure that we have the best carethat we can for the rest of our
lives.
We might have a special focuson folks that have family
(00:33):
members with dementia.
It's an important issue for meand something that we really
work with our families.
Savannah Meksto (00:40):
And I'm Savannah Meksto.
I'm a certified dementiapractitioner and your co-host.
Today, we're here to break downthe complex issues around elder
care and elder planning, sothat you can protect your loved
ones and your peace of mind.
Attorney Bob Mannor (00:54):
Today's show and all the future shows
are going to be filled withvaluable insights, real stories
and practical advice.
Whether you're driving to workor just drinking your morning
coffee, stay tuned and you won'twant to miss this show.
Okay, folks, we're going todive right into a topic that is
(01:16):
really important to a lot offamilies, and that's going to be
long-term care.
So we don't really think aboutthis.
For most of us, we plan formost stages of our life and then
just imagine that we're goingto fade off into the sunset and
die with our boots on.
But the reality is most of usare going to face some period of
time before we die that we'regoing to need some help from
other people, and most familiesaren't prepared for that.
(01:36):
So it's something that I thinkwe should discuss.
We have what we call a holisticpractice, because we're not
just going to focus on dollarsor legal documents.
We're going to focus on the bigpicture of making sure that we
get quality of life and qualitycare, making sure we have
resources to pay for that care,including government benefits
that might help out with that.
Savannah Meksto (01:55):
That's right, bob.
Planning isn't just about thepaperwork and that's something
that we talk a lot about in ourfirm often and it's really just
about ensuring that your lovedones are cared for in the best
way possible, whether that'sfinancially or emotionally.
We want to help you and guideyou in that journey, and today
we're going to walk you throughhow to approach estate planning
(02:17):
from this holistic perspective.
Attorney Bob Mannor (02:20):
So let's start off with that, and one of
the things I like to focus on issomething I call planning for
life.
What do I mean by that?
Well, the thing is, a lot offolks do go when they get a will
or they get a trust, they getsome legal documents, but most
people, when they go, theirthought is I'm planning for my
death, right, I'm planning forwhat happens when I die, and
(02:44):
that, of course, is important,and that's stuff we do at Manor
Law Group also.
I think the more importantquestion is what happens if you
live, and what I mean by that is, you know, in previous
generations we'd get old, we'dget sick and we'd die.
Now, most of us are going to getold and get sick and we live,
and how do we make that timebetter?
(03:06):
How do we make sure that we'regoing to our family's, going to
know what to do and we're notgoing to be a burden and we have
resources to pay for care andthat we just have a better
quality of life?
This gets particularlydifficult when we have a loved
one with dementia.
So this is very important, andone of the things that we always
have to focus on is making surethat we don't go broke, that we
(03:28):
don't deplete our assets inpaying for care, especially for
a married couple.
We don't want to have oneperson use all the money and
then the surviving spouse endsup in poverty.
So those are things that can beavoided.
Savannah Meksto (03:40):
That's such a crucial point, bob.
Dementia, for example.
It's something that can changeeverything.
Suddenly.
You're not just dealing withfinancial issues, but now you
also have medical issues,emotional issues and even legal
challenges.
A holistic plan looks at all ofthese aspects together and how
to protect your assets yeah, ofcourse, but also how to ensure
(04:02):
that your loved one's dignityand quality life are preserved.
Attorney Bob Mannor (04:06):
Yeah, savannah, that's one of the
things that I really like.
What you said there about aholistic plan, this is something
that a lot of people don'tthink about.
Even lawyers A lot of lawyersthey are just kind of you know a
lot of great lawyers.
They're doing great legal work,but they're really focused on
legal documents, and I thinkit's really important to be
holistic and think about, okay,how are we going to use these
(04:28):
documents?
How is that going to berelevant?
So let's start at the beginning.
Let's start at what really isone of the most important things
that we start with, and thenone of the most important
documents to work with a lawyeron is not actually your will.
Most people assume that's whatthey're going to talk to their
lawyer about is to get a will.
I think the most importantdocument is your powers of
(04:49):
attorney, one for financial andone for medical, because if I'm
focusing on what happens, youknow, how do we plan for life as
opposed to planning for death.
Those are more important.
We need to have good, detailedrules in place, documents in
place to allow the people youlove and trust to be able to
(05:12):
help you if and when you needhelp, and otherwise we end up
having to go through differentprocesses, like a court process
with guardianship orconservatorship, but it's really
important that most importantfirst document that I think that
we really have to focus on isyour powers of attorney,
financial and medical.
Savannah Meksto (05:31):
And that's where working with someone who
understands the nuances comesinto place.
For instance, in dementia care,it's not just about who makes
the decisions, but what thosedecisions look like.
Do they understand theprogression of the disease?
Can they advocate for the typeof care that maintains dignity
and safety?
These are the tough questionsthat a holistic estate plan will
(05:52):
answer.
Attorney Bob Mannor (05:53):
So now I'm going to get into something a
little bit more complicated.
So you know, you've probablyheard of a power of attorney
before and again, I really wantto focus on how important that
is and that you pick the rightpeople and it's not just a
fill-in-the-blank form either.
It should be that we're reallyfocusing on what authority, what
powers do we want to givesomebody and they're not all the
(06:14):
same.
A lot of people think, oh, it'sa power of attorney, you just
put your name on it, sign it andget it notarized.
The powers of attorney we useare very different depending on
the circumstances and what theneeds are, but one of the
reasons that we have it is oneof the reasons we need that is
when we get to the point of howare we going to pay for care?
(06:36):
Now, I don't know about you,Savannah, but I'm not a
millionaire.
Savannah Meksto (06:39):
I wish I was, but no.
Attorney Bob Mannor (06:41):
Most of us are.
Most of the listeners probablyare.
And you know, if we hadunlimited money, we wouldn't
have to worry about this stuff.
Right, we just wouldn't have toworry about it.
And that's not true for most ofus.
We do worry about it andsometimes people say, oh well,
you know, we're fine, theyfigure out the math and they say
, well, I think, if you know, ifwe look at mom's savings and if
(07:02):
we had to sell mom's house orwhatever, we might be able to
pay for care for two or threeyears.
Okay, well, what happens if momlives 10 years?
This is a very serious thing anda lot of people think.
First of all, a lot of peoplehave never thought about this.
Right, it's just not somethingthat most people are going to
(07:26):
give much attention to, untiland unless it affects your
family, until it's your mom oryour spouse.
And now we really do have tothink about this.
And the good news there'sactually really good news on
this that there are benefitsthat you've paid into your
entire life that can help payfor things like home care or
assisted living or a nursinghome.
There's different programs thatwe're going to be talking about
(07:46):
through the series of this show.
It is very important that welook at ways to make sure that
you're not going to go broke ifand when it comes to be that
your loved one needs care andsome people think, oh well, I've
got Blue Cross right, I've gotHumana, whatever it is.
(08:06):
Unfortunately, Blue Cross andHumana and Medicare do not pay
for continuing care.
So they might pay for thehospital visit, they might pay
for the doctor's visit, you canhave coverage for prescriptions,
but if you need somebody tocome over every day and help you
get dressed or help you showeror just make sure that you're
(08:28):
staying safe, then we're goingto have to look to other
government benefits.
Savannah Meksto (08:32):
Bob, that is so right and so important and
something that we say a lot inthe firm that really sticks with
me is that it's never too lateand it's never too early to
start planning.
Of course, the earlier that youstart planning, the more
options that you're going tohave, which is, of course,
important, and this is why weencourage families to start
(08:52):
these conversations soonerrather than later.
But, again, it's never too lateand it's never too early to
start planning.
Attorney Bob Mannor (08:58):
That's great, savannah.
That's so true.
You know, of course it's betterto plan ahead and I know not
everybody does that right.
I prefer you to, obviously, butwe can help in a crisis too.
I'm going to be honest with you.
Probably over 50% of the folksthat I help with dementia or
long-term care issues, they cometo me in a crisis.
(09:19):
They come to me after theythink that it might be too late.
Well, honestly, like Savannahsaid, it's never too late.
We can help in a crisis.
If you're not in a crisis now,though, you might want to think
about planning ahead, becauseit's going to be easier on the
family, it's going to be lessexpensive, it's going to give
you more options.
(09:39):
So we can help in a crisis.
It's never too late.
If there's a, you know, there'sa stroke, there's a fall,
there's.
You know, we found that dad waswandering away from the house
or, you know, was driving andgot, you know, got pulled over
because the police saw that hewas confused, or something like
that.
Those are crises and we canhelp with that, but it's better
(10:05):
to get in front of it so thatwe're not.
You know that that's not theproblem.
At Mannor Law Group, we helpfamilies.
We help families with life anddeath and illness.
It is something that has beenour passion and we will help you
with basic things like willsand trusts.
(10:26):
We can help you with thingslike if there is a diagnosis, a
serious diagnosis or a dementiadiagnosis, parkinson's, anything
like that.
It is very difficult for thefamily to address that and there
are legal and financialconsiderations that we can help
with and make sure that you'regetting good care.
We provide care, navigation andhelp with finding resources to
(10:50):
pay for care, includingaccessing federal and local
benefits.
So you can reach our office inGrand Blanc at 810-694-9000.
Savannah Meksto (11:05):
So these questions that we're about to go
through have come in fromclients of the past.
We're not going to use realnames for today's questions, but
we thought that these werereally important and we get
these a lot, not just from theclients that we've had, from
just people that we meet in thecommunity.
So I'm really excited to sharesome of these with you.
The first question by Betty mymom was just diagnosed with
(11:29):
early stage Alzheimer's andwe're starting to think about
long-term care.
What should we be doing now?
Attorney Bob Mannor (11:35):
So this is a great question and you know I
mentioned earlier that we havethis podcast with the same name,
advice from your Advocates, andon the podcast I recently
interviewed a guest that wastalking about all the services
that are available for familiesthat have a loved one with
dementia or Alzheimer's.
And the thing is what he wassaying was a lot of families
(12:00):
tend to sort of cocoon.
They just kind of hide in theirhouse and they don't want, you
know, they're just afraid, andso that they just make sure that
mom doesn't go out anymore ordad, you know, is kind of
confined, and that's probablynot the best answer.
In fact, what he was saying wasit probably makes it worse.
Not only does it make it worsefor their health, but it makes
(12:22):
it worse quality of life for thefamily and for the person
suffering from dementia orAlzheimer's.
And so it's really important,when we look at this, that you
want to start developing a team,a team of resources that's
going to be able to help withthis.
So many families think theyhave to deal with this on their
own.
I can't tell you how manypeople are dealing with similar
(12:46):
issues and trying to figure thisout on your own.
I just can't imagine thatyou're going to come up with the
best answers on your own.
This is not something you canGoogle and say you know what to
expect when your loved one hasdementia, so it is something
that you really need.
Some people that have beenworking in this for a long time
(13:07):
know the details of thecommunity.
Even every community is goingto be a little bit different as
far as what resources are goingto be available for somebody
with Alzheimer's or dementia.
You know I'm going to obviouslytell you that you need an elder
law attorney, somebody that'sexperienced in Medicaid,
experienced in veterans benefits, experienced with the community
, and our biggest strength atManor Law Group is our
(13:29):
relationships with the long-termcare community.
We know the folks that areinvolved in it.
We know the nuances of it, thefolks that are involved in it.
We know the nuances of it.
We know what we can demand asfar as quality of care and what
places frankly provide bettercare, and so part of that team
is going to be an experiencedelder law attorney.
(13:50):
But I also think you need tostart thinking about your
medical experts.
So maybe a gerontologist, maybea neurologist, but I actually
think the gerontologist has amore holistic view.
Sometimes they're not justlooking at the brain, and then
we really need to be thinkingabout making sure if you have a
financial person, if you have afinancial advisor, they should
(14:12):
be communicating with the lawyer.
They should be communicatingand we should start thinking
about a plan.
If we need to access resources,which accounts should we be
taking that from?
There's an answer to thatquestion.
This is not a rhetoricalquestion.
Sometimes it's better to takeit out of a savings account,
sometimes it's better to take itout of an IRA, and so those are
real questions and you'reprobably not going to find that
(14:35):
great advice unless you have ateam that's working together the
lawyer, the financial advisor,the doctor and then what are the
community resources?
You know, are there somedaycare options?
What are the options that we'dlook at for home care?
What are the options we'd lookat for care outside of the home?
So that's my advice when youhave somebody that's early stage
(14:56):
Alzheimer's, our advice isstart building a team of those
people you're going to rely on.
Savannah Meksto (15:02):
That is so important, Bob.
I really love that answer.
And this next question comes infrom a client that we are going
to call Bill, and Bill says I'mconcerned about my dad running
out of money if he needslong-term care.
How can we protect his assets?
Attorney Bob Mannor (15:18):
dad running out of money if he needs
long-term care, how can weprotect his assets?
This is a good question andthis is a question that a lot of
kids are timid to ask, and Idon't think you should be.
I wrote an article years agofor the View newspaper that you
know we see everywhere, and thearticle said why you should care
about your parents' money.
And it was a provocative titleintentionally, because a lot of
(15:39):
times we have families that comein and say well, you know, we
don't care about the money, wedon't care about mom and dad's
money, we just want to make surethat they're taken care of.
We should care about the money.
It's important to think thisthrough.
We don't want to be in a crisis.
We don't want to be in asituation where we have worse
services or have to go to thelesser places or don't have
options.
You know, the bottom line is weshould care about the money and
(16:02):
there's going to be a timeespecially if your parent or
spouse is experiencing somedementia there's going to be a
time where they're not fullycapable of making.
You know all of the financialdecisions that they used to make
.
You know all of the financialdecisions that they used to make
.
This is a difficult place for achild to be in because they're
used to, you know, mom and dadbeing the ones that tell them
(16:24):
what to do, and not us tellingmom and dad what to do, and
especially when it comes tomoney, because it almost sounds
like you're greedy and it's not.
It's not about being greedy,it's about being smart and
making sure that we're making,we're leveraging things and
making the best use of ourresources.
And it can go a long way.
You know you don't have to be amultimillionaire to be able to
(16:45):
get good quality care.
It's just if you're, we have toleverage it.
We have to look for things likeMedicaid options the PACE
program, which is called theProgram for All-Inclusive Care
for the Elderly, the my ChoiceWaiver program, which is called
the Program for All-InclusiveCare for the Elderly, the my
Choice Waiver program, whichprovides for some home care, or,
you know, medicaid, nursinghome Medicaid.
(17:07):
There's a bunch of veteransbenefits that we can we'll get
into eventually and talk aboutin future programs.
But the bottom line is the ifit's a veteran or spouse of a
veteran, widow of a veteran,there's a bunch of programs
through the VA.
Sometimes it's actually justproviding you money to pay for
care.
Sometimes it's just providingthat care.
So the key on this is you reallyshould be asking this question
(17:27):
and there are ways to protectyour assets and qualify.
A few times I've mentioned theword Medicaid.
Sometimes, when people hearthat, they think, oh, that's
only for poor people.
There's a bunch of Medicaidprograms, including some
Medicaid programs that allow usto protect assets.
We're just following theirrules and you do not have to
spend down to nothing before youqualify for these Medicaid
(17:49):
programs.
They can pay for things likein-home care or nursing home
care.
Savannah Meksto (17:55):
And remember, it's not just about the money.
Protecting assets is also aboutensuring that your dad or your
mom or your grandparent hasaccess to the best care possible
, which is why we look at thewhole picture.
Attorney Bob Mannor (18:10):
You've been listening to Advice from your
Advocates and we'll be back withour legal myth busters.
Savannah Meksto (18:21):
All right, welcome back to Advice From your
Advocates.
It is time for our legal mythbusting segment.
Bob, here's a common myth Ihave a will, so I don't need
anything else.
What do you think?
Attorney Bob Mannor (18:34):
That is a good one and something I
frequently hear, or I even hearjust as often.
I have a trust and therefore Idon't need anything else.
You know a lot of people thinktrust is just sort of this
magical document that's going tosolve all our problems, or a
will is sufficient and it'sgoing to take care of things.
Frankly, that's not the finalanswer.
The document itself is just atool, like a tool in a toolbox,
(19:01):
and you know I joke with thefolks at the office at Manor Law
Group sometimes that I have alot of tools at home.
I have a really big toolbox.
I don't know how to use verymany of them and I'm just not
that great as far as aconstruction person or a
handyman, but I have the toolsand so that's one of the key
things is having a will orhaving a trust.
(19:23):
Unless we're using that toolright and actually you need more
tools than that that's just notgoing to be sufficient and
really we need to know how andwhen to use those things.
So a will.
For example, when does a willtake effect?
Savannah?
Savannah Meksto (19:37):
When you die Wrong?
Oh darn it.
Attorney Bob Mannor (19:41):
That's a trick question she knew it was a
trick question.
So it's when you die and thenwhen a judge puts it into effect
, right, a judge has to issue aletter of authority before the
will has any legal effect, sothe will doesn't work without
going to court.
So then there's a thing calleda trust, which is basically just
a contract between you and yourfamily.
Now, a trust is going to be alot more flexible than a will,
(20:01):
but it's still not going tosolve all your problems.
That's where what we talkedabout earlier is things like a
really strong power of attorney,a really strong patient
advocate in case you can't makemedical decisions for
yourselfacy waivers.
There's just a lot of differentthings.
You know HIPAA waivers, thingslike that, where you really need
to have it be more thorough andholistic.
Savannah Meksto (20:21):
Yeah, exactly, planning is about much more than
just dividing up your moneywhen you die.
It's about making sure thatyou're protected during your
lifetime, no matter what happens.
Lifetime, no matter whathappens.
(20:42):
So, before we wrap up today, Ithink that we should talk about
some fantastic local resourcesthat we have for families and
professionals that are dealingwith elder care.
Attorney Bob Mannor (20:48):
For 10 years now and this is actually
something that Savannah's beenrunning for several years.
We have something we call ElderCare Boot Camp or Elder Law
Boot Camp, and it's kind of whatwe're known for with Mannor Law
Group and in this area, andthen Flint and Grand Blanc area,
Lapeer, Shiawassee, and so wehave been training folks in the
long-term care industry.
(21:09):
So we've trained social workersand care administrators and in
the past we've done some nursingcontinuing education credits.
We've, like you said, the casemanagers and the certified
senior advisors.
Savannah Meksto (21:24):
Even financial advisors.
Attorney Bob Mannor (21:25):
Financial advisors, exactly, and other
attorneys.
One of the things I've beenable to do it's been kind of an
honor to I teach other attorneysthrough the Institute of
Continuing Legal Education, andthis is such an area of law that
a lot of attorneys never gottrained in this in law school.
This is a unique area of lawthat most lawyers at least when
(21:46):
I was in law school, they didn'teven offer this as an option.
It wasn't even an optionalclass, an optional class.
So it is something that we'veenjoyed being able to help
others and educate folks andlearn from other folks.
It'll be in May this year, maynext year, 2025.
One of the things is we learnso much and we talk about it as
(22:07):
the circle of care that we'reall working together to get the
best care we can for our folksthat need help.
And so the circle of care isvery important to us because
we're learning from you, you'relearning from us.
We're all trying to worktogether to get the best results
for folks.
Savannah Meksto (22:21):
And being a listener today, you're a part of
our circle of care too.
Attorney Bob Mannor (22:24):
Yeah, very nice.
I want to highlight somethingthat Savannah is going to give
us a little bit more informationabout, but we just started an
Alzheimer's support group at ouroffice in Grand Blanc.
We were looking to do it at asenior center, but we found that
a lot of folks were looking fora one that was not during
business hours.
They wanted it after hours, andso the senior centers weren't
(22:48):
open at that time, and so we arehosting it at our office with
our fantastic social worker,nikki Inches.
And so Savannah can give alittle bit more information
about that.
Savannah Meksto (22:59):
Yeah, absolutely so.
If you are a caregiver ofsomeone with dementia, we invite
you to come to this sessionthat we have the third Tuesday
of every month at our GrandBlanc Manor Law Group office.
We're just located in GrandBlanc on Saginaw Street, right
next to Chase Bank, if you'refamiliar with the area.
If not, call us we'll tell you,but the meeting is from 530 to
(23:21):
630.
Again, it's the third Tuesdayof the month and we would love
to see you there.
We even have cookies.
That's a good time.
Attorney Bob Mannor (23:27):
Nikki has been one of the social workers
that works with our office, andwe make a good use of social
workers in our office.
We call them care navigators.
So in one of the futureprograms we're going to talk
about care navigation, becauseit's really important.
When a family is dealing withlong-term care they're dealing
with a aging loved one they'reworried about making sure that
(23:47):
they're safe and they're gettinggood care.
It's really hard to maneuverand really figure everything out
, and so our office, in additionto providing the legal services
and getting access to benefitsthat can help pay for care, we
provide care navigators that canreally walk us through that
system.
So you've been listening toadvice from your advocates.
(24:09):
It is an exciting adventure forSavannah and I.
Savannah Meksto (24:12):
Yeah, absolutely.
And if you want more in-depthdiscussions, just like this, you
can find us wherever you listento podcasts.
And if you like video if you'drather watch us than listen you
can find us on YouTube.
Attorney Bob Mannor (24:24):
We're also on a few of the social media
things.
It's kind of funny that we'veactually gone viral a few times
on TikTok If you ever look atthe TikTok.
Savannah Meksto (24:34):
Yeah, the TikTok.
Yes, you can tell how old I amwhen I call it the TikTok.
Attorney Bob Mannor (24:40):
So, yeah, we have fun with it and we
actually were just recently.
The thing we went viral on iswe were promoting that anybody
that's 18 years or older shouldstart with some basic legal
documents like a power ofattorney.
So that is something that wewere promoting on TikTok and I
think we got like 1.5 millionviews.
Savannah Meksto (24:57):
Yeah, we did.
Yep, it was amazing.
Thanks for tuning in to Advicefrom your Advocates and remember
you're not alone in thisjourney.
We're here to help you everystep of the way.
Thanks for listening.
To learn more, visitMannorLawGroup.
com.
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