Winemaker Interview with Daniel Brennan of Decibel Wines

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
On this episode of After Wine School, Keith sits down with Daniel Brennan—Philly native, former student, and now the winemaker behind Decibel Wines in New Zealand’s Hawke’s Bay.

(00:10):
From cheesesteaks in Hastings to pioneering organic vineyards and pushing Malbec into Kiwi consciousness, Danny’s journey is anything but ordinary.
The two dive deep into terroir, winemaking culture, and the grind of selling indie wines in America—with a healthy dose of Philly sarcasm, orca sightings, and tales of global wine hustle. 4 00:00:30,328.821 --> 00:00:30,898.821 All right. 5 00:00:30,928.821 --> 00:00:31,948.821 Hey folks. 6 00:00:31,978.821 --> 00:00:33,148.821 welcome, welcome, welcome. 7 00:00:33,148.821 --> 00:00:36,528.821 This is Keith from the after Wine School podcast. 8 00:00:36,778.821 --> 00:00:48,38.821 Today I am a very, very, very, very, very, lucky that I have Daniel Brennan of Decibel Wines, who actually, is an old friend, old student. 9 00:00:48,228.821 --> 00:00:50,58.821 an old Philly native who now is a. 10 00:00:50,473.821 --> 00:00:52,333.821 Famous winemaker in, New Zealand, man. 11 00:00:52,573.821 --> 00:00:55,43.821 So, hey, in infamous, maybe infamous, maybe not Danny. 12 00:00:55,53.821 --> 00:00:56,643.821 so I'm gonna call you Danny 'cause that's how I know you man. 13 00:00:56,643.821 --> 00:00:56,823.821 Yeah. 14 00:00:56,883.821 --> 00:00:57,393.821 Could do it. 15 00:00:57,453.821 --> 00:00:57,933.821 All right. 16 00:00:57,933.821 --> 00:00:58,453.821 So, Mr. 17 00:00:58,453.821 --> 00:01:08,713.821 We actually do a, at our tasting room in Hastings, which is right in the heart of Hawkes Bay, we do a few times a year, we do it a popup, cheese steak thing. 18 00:01:08,823.821 --> 00:01:09,963.821 And it's called Danny's. 19 00:01:10,53.821 --> 00:01:12,93.821 So you definitely can call me Danny. 20 00:01:12,93.821 --> 00:01:14,733.821 People in New Zealand joke around and call me Danny sometimes too. 21 00:01:14,803.821 --> 00:01:16,993.821 because they know that's what people in Philly would call me. 22 00:01:17,23.821 --> 00:01:18,793.821 Oh, of course, of course. 23 00:01:18,793.821 --> 00:01:19,513.821 That's awesome. 24 00:01:19,513.821 --> 00:01:20,443.821 That is awesome. 25 00:01:20,683.821 --> 00:01:24,553.821 Now, I assume, How, well, okay, first off, let's just backtrack. 26 00:01:24,553.821 --> 00:01:27,613.821 Because you may actually have, we may have some, Philly issue problems here. 27 00:01:27,613.821 --> 00:01:35,833.821 Now, how are you making cheese steaks in New Zealand? And mind you, right outside of, I'm sorry, you're like the fancy part of the country. 28 00:01:35,883.821 --> 00:01:46,13.821 I have a friend who is a very accomplished chef, like worked for Peter Gordon and Oh, I like, he's like worked for some of the best, you know, kitchens in New Zealand and wineries and stuff. 29 00:01:46,293.821 --> 00:01:48,33.821 but he's kind of gone out on his own. 30 00:01:48,33.821 --> 00:01:48,993.821 He is got four kids. 31 00:01:48,993.821 --> 00:01:50,703.821 He don't wanna be working nights, all that. 32 00:01:50,703.821 --> 00:01:52,863.821 And he's a pastry chef originally by trade. 33 00:01:52,893.821 --> 00:01:53,343.821 Oh, okay. 34 00:01:53,343.821 --> 00:01:55,233.821 So he can bake bread, like amazing. 35 00:01:55,323.821 --> 00:01:55,683.821 All right. 36 00:01:55,683.821 --> 00:01:59,93.821 And, he, he bakes the bread, but it took him four tries. 37 00:01:59,93.821 --> 00:02:00,863.821 Like, I was like, no, you still don't have it. 38 00:02:01,43.821 --> 00:02:06,623.821 You know, I was like sending him Instagram videos and because, I can't get him a sample down in New Zealand. 39 00:02:07,148.821 --> 00:02:08,918.821 So I'm like, nah, this is too sweet. 40 00:02:08,918.821 --> 00:02:10,118.821 No, this is too soft. 41 00:02:10,148.821 --> 00:02:11,198.821 No, this is too hard. 42 00:02:11,198.821 --> 00:02:12,278.821 And then he finally nailed it. 43 00:02:12,278.821 --> 00:02:13,423.821 Are we still, are we still talking about bread? Yeah. 44 00:02:14,438.821 --> 00:02:17,618.821 Yeah, because you have questions that's on this podcast. 45 00:02:17,648.821 --> 00:02:18,98.821 Alright. 46 00:02:18,368.821 --> 00:02:18,668.821 Alright. 47 00:02:18,668.821 --> 00:02:27,818.821 So, but what about the, what about the Wiz or the American cheese? Like what, I mean, what, what kinda cheese are we doing here? do, we get some, sharp provolone or provolone picante. 48 00:02:28,3.821 --> 00:02:28,303.821 All right. 49 00:02:28,388.821 --> 00:02:30,428.821 And put a little bit of that, mix that in. 50 00:02:30,428.821 --> 00:02:32,498.821 'cause I do roast pork sandwich and HOAs too. 51 00:02:32,798.821 --> 00:02:33,23.821 Oh, okay. 52 00:02:33,23.821 --> 00:02:33,143.821 Alright. 53 00:02:33,188.821 --> 00:02:34,208.821 So just three sandwiches. 54 00:02:34,208.821 --> 00:02:34,358.821 Alright. 55 00:02:34,358.821 --> 00:02:41,738.821 But we have a cheese there that's kind of a softer stringier, mild cheese called em that is perfect for cheese steaks. 56 00:02:41,738.821 --> 00:02:42,98.821 All right. 57 00:02:42,98.821 --> 00:02:42,488.821 So, okay. 58 00:02:42,538.821 --> 00:02:49,453.821 you know, and I cheat a bit too because we, my buddy owns this place called the Organic Butcher, which is like a Highend butcher shop, and he Oh, okay. 59 00:02:49,528.821 --> 00:02:53,268.821 He gets me like, you know, really thin shaved rump for the cheese steaks. 60 00:02:53,268.821 --> 00:02:53,598.821 All right. 61 00:02:53,648.821 --> 00:02:55,418.821 And so it's like, it's pretty next level. 62 00:02:55,418.821 --> 00:02:55,838.821 It's good. 63 00:02:55,838.821 --> 00:02:57,128.821 I don't make any money on this thing. 64 00:02:57,133.821 --> 00:02:57,873.821 It's just like a thing. 65 00:02:57,873.821 --> 00:02:58,702.821 This sounds very expensive. 66 00:02:58,702.821 --> 00:03:02,802.821 And also Yeah, no, I was just assuming you're importing, kangaroo from Australia. 67 00:03:02,802.821 --> 00:03:03,942.821 No, no, no. 68 00:03:03,942.821 --> 00:03:05,502.821 I mean, yeah, no, that's a good idea though. 69 00:03:05,502.821 --> 00:03:13,552.821 we don't like any much Aussie stuff in New Zealand anyway, so Yeah, it's a bit of a chip on our shoulder, you know, it's a bit of like the Canada, US thing, you know what I mean? Oh, Well, yeah. 70 00:03:13,682.821 --> 00:03:15,692.821 New Zealand is actually better than Australia. 71 00:03:15,752.821 --> 00:03:19,412.821 Well, you know, I, but the hard thing is, is that you are so much smaller. 72 00:03:19,412.821 --> 00:03:19,922.821 Exactly. 73 00:03:19,922.821 --> 00:03:22,72.821 And you also, I don't think you drink as much. 74 00:03:22,612.821 --> 00:03:22,823.821 It's Yeah. 75 00:03:22,828.821 --> 00:03:24,52.821 Trust me, it's close. 76 00:03:24,112.821 --> 00:03:26,352.821 It's definitely more Per capita than here. 77 00:03:26,432.821 --> 00:03:33,62.821 but they, but you're right in that they do own all our grocery stores and banks and things like that, so they kind of got us by the balls. 78 00:03:34,122.821 --> 00:03:41,132.821 actually, so all, No, we don't think they're smart enough to have the, those kind of conspiracies worked out, you know? is fantastic. 79 00:03:41,252.821 --> 00:03:45,122.821 I do love the fact that we are just gonna like shit on Australians for like, the next hour. 80 00:03:45,512.821 --> 00:03:46,652.821 That is fantastic. 81 00:03:46,752.821 --> 00:03:50,832.821 because, you know, fortunately we don't really have much of a, a listenership there, so, you know, we can do anything. 82 00:03:50,887.821 --> 00:03:52,117.821 I'll help bump that up for you. 83 00:03:52,117.821 --> 00:03:52,237.821 Yeah. 84 00:03:52,237.821 --> 00:03:52,717.821 You know what I mean? Yeah. 85 00:03:52,717.821 --> 00:03:53,587.821 We'll create some hype. 86 00:03:53,587.821 --> 00:03:54,787.821 Any press is good press. 87 00:03:54,787.821 --> 00:03:59,592.821 You know what I mean? Did you hear they were talking shit about us, Mike, because they asked the accent's like. 88 00:03:59,617.821 --> 00:04:01,567.821 Kiwi's are kind of, you know, it's like down here. 89 00:04:02,47.821 --> 00:04:04,867.821 The Australians are up Well, I can't believe you actually pulled that off. 90 00:04:04,897.821 --> 00:04:12,667.821 'cause I, I will never try that accent that is like, that is, but I live at every, my kids have kiwi accents, you Oh really? Of course they do. 91 00:04:12,667.821 --> 00:04:12,727.821 Yeah. 92 00:04:13,577.821 --> 00:04:16,995.821 That's, that's be, but they also speak Italian because her mother's Italian. 93 00:04:17,25.821 --> 00:04:22,635.821 So they'll go, they'll go, you know, mama, you know, they'll, let's say something in Italian and then switch back to a kiwi accent. 94 00:04:22,635.821 --> 00:04:22,670.821 Really? Oh. 95 00:04:22,690.821 --> 00:04:27,580.821 speak Italian with a Kiwi accent? My 9-year-old kind of does my, according to my wife. 96 00:04:27,590.821 --> 00:04:29,270.821 I barely know what they're saying half the time. 97 00:04:29,420.821 --> 00:04:30,620.821 Well, that's actually fantastic. 98 00:04:30,650.821 --> 00:04:31,840.821 That is actually, fascinating. 99 00:04:31,920.821 --> 00:04:41,830.821 did you meet your wife in Yeah, we met, down in, I used to throw a party every year with all the winemakers in May called Kiwi's Giving, which is kinda like a post harvest Thanksgiving meal. 100 00:04:42,430.821 --> 00:04:42,490.821 Yeah. 101 00:04:42,540.821 --> 00:04:45,210.821 Naturally all the, expats, we gravitate to each other. 102 00:04:45,210.821 --> 00:04:49,860.821 So I hanging out with a lot of Brits and French and Spaniards and South Americans and Oh yeah. 103 00:04:49,860.821 --> 00:04:57,880.821 You know, and when you invite, they're a bit like the Brazilians when you invite one person from France then like 20 show up, I invited this one girl, French wine makers. 104 00:04:57,880.821 --> 00:05:02,410.821 This other girl came, and then she texted me last minute and said, my friend Ma is coming. 105 00:05:02,410.821 --> 00:05:03,280.821 And I said, yeah, sure. 106 00:05:03,280.821 --> 00:05:04,360.821 I think that's a girl's name. 107 00:05:04,360.821 --> 00:05:07,0.821 We definitely want her to come, you know? Yeah. 108 00:05:07,0.821 --> 00:05:08,770.821 That was, that was back in 2012. 109 00:05:08,770.821 --> 00:05:10,655.821 So we, we've been together since and yeah. 110 00:05:10,655.821 --> 00:05:11,55.821 Oh yeah. 111 00:05:11,60.821 --> 00:05:13,670.821 she's from Leko, like right near Lake Como. 112 00:05:13,910.821 --> 00:05:14,450.821 Oh, wow. 113 00:05:14,450.821 --> 00:05:16,340.821 she's, as we would say the fancy Italians. 114 00:05:16,710.821 --> 00:05:19,660.821 But she's got somewhat, you know, nobody in here appreciated her. 115 00:05:19,690.821 --> 00:05:25,360.821 She's kind of got that blood, which is Southern, Southern, you know, her mother, you know, she's quite dark. 116 00:05:25,390.821 --> 00:05:25,720.821 Yep. 117 00:05:25,840.821 --> 00:05:26,110.821 Yep. 118 00:05:26,140.821 --> 00:05:30,40.821 She, her, her dad's got the blue eyes and, looks like he could be. 119 00:05:30,550.821 --> 00:05:33,130.821 French or Swiss or something up near that border. 120 00:05:33,130.821 --> 00:05:38,510.821 But her mom's side of the family's definitely got the old school, like my mother's family. 121 00:05:38,540.821 --> 00:05:47,475.821 Well, and that's what like, you know, And just as the, for everyone listening, they understand this, we actually have, this is Italy is consistent like this. 122 00:05:47,475.821 --> 00:05:50,505.821 Like they, every region hates the other regions. 123 00:05:50,535.821 --> 00:05:57,675.821 Yeah, I have, I have buddy who lives in the Piedmont and every time he had to leave, he was like, oh god damn, I gotta go to, I gotta go to Italy. 124 00:05:57,765.821 --> 00:06:06,915.821 And I'm like, and then I knew a dude from Rome and, you know, he was a student here at the wine school and he was like, and he would just talk smack about, you know, anyone below the south. 125 00:06:06,915.821 --> 00:06:07,515.821 He's like, ah. 126 00:06:07,635.821 --> 00:06:09,675.821 And every time they would say, they're like, oh, I gotta go to Rome. 127 00:06:09,735.821 --> 00:06:13,665.821 And like, why, why, why is this it? Why is call calling, you know, something either like. 128 00:06:14,70.821 --> 00:06:16,320.821 If you're in the north, you call it, oh, I gotta go to Rome. 129 00:06:16,320.821 --> 00:06:18,270.821 Or if you're in Rome, you say, I gotta go to Italy. 130 00:06:18,480.821 --> 00:06:19,680.821 It's like, it's always this. 131 00:06:19,710.821 --> 00:06:19,980.821 Yeah. 132 00:06:19,980.821 --> 00:06:20,820.821 It's always an insult. 133 00:06:20,870.821 --> 00:06:22,340.821 pretty territorial and provincial. 134 00:06:22,390.821 --> 00:06:23,665.821 So it's not surprising. 135 00:06:23,665.821 --> 00:06:26,5.821 Nobody makes the pizza the right way in that part. 136 00:06:26,35.821 --> 00:06:26,425.821 Oh yeah. 137 00:06:26,425.821 --> 00:06:32,905.821 Or just, oh, you get winemakers just complaining about each other from other Oh, it is just like constant. 138 00:06:32,945.821 --> 00:06:33,755.821 drink all their wines. 139 00:06:33,755.821 --> 00:06:34,955.821 Because I love Italian wine so much. 140 00:06:34,985.821 --> 00:06:35,405.821 man. 141 00:06:35,405.821 --> 00:06:35,795.821 I know. 142 00:06:35,825.821 --> 00:06:40,595.821 Oh, you know, I actually, it's one of the, I just love the fact that Italian wines in the US are so popular. 143 00:06:40,625.821 --> 00:06:46,775.821 'cause I get to run an advanced Italian program like every year and a half, and I just get to pull so much cool stuff. 144 00:06:46,775.821 --> 00:06:48,65.821 There's so much there too. 145 00:06:48,275.821 --> 00:06:50,465.821 And I make it part of the project. 146 00:06:50,465.821 --> 00:06:58,225.821 It's, for the advanced Mollys, they have to find one obscure wine that I didn't talk about or pour in class. 147 00:06:58,275.821 --> 00:06:59,685.821 and I am just going out and like. 148 00:06:59,960.821 --> 00:07:09,250.821 Every weird thing, every beautiful unknown, is in class and it's the hardest thing for them to find a wine I didn't talk about or pour in class. 149 00:07:09,300.821 --> 00:07:14,340.821 it usually takes those students like three to four months to actually land on wine if you're gonna do it with a country, Italy. 150 00:07:14,490.821 --> 00:07:14,730.821 Yeah. 151 00:07:14,760.821 --> 00:07:16,710.821 'cause they've got so many weird grapes and everything. 152 00:07:16,790.821 --> 00:07:17,300.821 Oh yeah. 153 00:07:17,300.821 --> 00:07:19,340.821 And the genetic diversity is just insane. 154 00:07:19,370.821 --> 00:07:24,270.821 It just fun watching it just coming from, like chemistry and science. 155 00:07:24,330.821 --> 00:07:27,60.821 It just, it's just so much fun to look, look through this stuff. 156 00:07:27,90.821 --> 00:07:27,420.821 Yeah. 157 00:07:27,870.821 --> 00:07:32,310.821 But hey, that's Italy, New Zealand, however that you know, which I hear. 158 00:07:33,55.821 --> 00:07:34,615.821 Is making some okay wines these days. 159 00:07:34,705.821 --> 00:07:36,325.821 Is that true? We're, we are doing pretty good. 160 00:07:36,325.821 --> 00:07:36,685.821 Yeah. 161 00:07:36,685.821 --> 00:07:42,595.821 I mean, everybody obviously knows the Marlboro s Blanc and, the beast and monster that it is and Oh yeah. 162 00:07:42,595.821 --> 00:07:46,645.821 Paves the road for, you know, a lot of else that goes on in the industry. 163 00:07:46,645.821 --> 00:07:57,825.821 But, I think, you know, I hope what's happening is that, you know, with the likes of myself and a few other producers, I'm seeing more bits of Hawke's Bay and North Canterbury and Otago again. 164 00:07:58,135.821 --> 00:08:00,685.821 Danny was a, I took the, core program. 165 00:08:01,195.821 --> 00:08:16,500.821 In the early parts of our lives, you know? And in fact, actually, when I actually had, now I'm the only one who teaches the foundation program, but I had someone else teaching at that time So you're like one of the few students that I know, I still know who actually I wasn't their professor. 166 00:08:16,840.821 --> 00:08:18,130.821 like it's a weird thing. 167 00:08:18,130.821 --> 00:08:19,0.821 you were around though. 168 00:08:19,30.821 --> 00:08:19,780.821 Well, I was kicking around. 169 00:08:19,780.821 --> 00:08:20,170.821 Oh yeah. 170 00:08:20,175.821 --> 00:08:22,735.821 I'm sure I was fine, Which is amazing. 171 00:08:22,735.821 --> 00:08:23,425.821 So Yeah, I know. 172 00:08:23,425.821 --> 00:08:26,785.821 And this was back in the early when we were actually in our original, school Yeah. 173 00:08:26,815.821 --> 00:08:28,285.821 Up in fair Oh yeah. 174 00:08:28,285.821 --> 00:08:30,875.821 In Fairmount and, yeah, right next to the pizza joint. 175 00:08:31,145.821 --> 00:08:31,655.821 That's right. 176 00:08:31,665.821 --> 00:08:32,415.821 Very convenient. 177 00:08:32,445.821 --> 00:08:33,105.821 I got fat. 178 00:08:33,165.821 --> 00:08:33,345.821 Yeah. 179 00:08:35,365.821 --> 00:08:37,75.821 but anyway, around that time yeah. 180 00:08:37,375.821 --> 00:08:46,965.821 Was when the sort of second wave of New Zealand wines were coming into the US and ultimately it's what drew me to New Zealand because I was just fell in love with, particularly Martin bro Pinot Noir. 181 00:08:47,295.821 --> 00:08:47,715.821 Right. 182 00:08:47,770.821 --> 00:08:48,525.821 And, and they were. 183 00:08:49,5.821 --> 00:08:53,775.821 You know, the, the Semial Blancs and a bit of Chardonnay came first and they were starting to be really successful. 184 00:08:53,775.821 --> 00:08:59,85.821 So then the next wave of wines that came were like some Otago Pinots, some Hawks Bay Reds. 185 00:08:59,595.821 --> 00:09:00,135.821 Martin Bro. 186 00:09:00,135.821 --> 00:09:07,425.821 Pinots, I'm sure, like Kumi River and some, some of the, and I was, you know, the wines were still hard to find, but you could find them particularly in New Jersey. 187 00:09:07,875.821 --> 00:09:13,845.821 But I think there was pushback at that time because of pricing where the Sauvignon Blancs were like, this is easy, we can get our head around it. 188 00:09:13,845.821 --> 00:09:16,365.821 It's obviously so distinct and it's maintained. 189 00:09:16,365.821 --> 00:09:16,605.821 yeah. 190 00:09:16,635.821 --> 00:09:22,95.821 but with, particularly with the Pinot noir, you know, they were already, you know, we're talking 20 years ago now. 191 00:09:22,95.821 --> 00:09:27,405.821 They were already in the $40 range, and people are going, what, what is this stuff? And it was very good, you know. 192 00:09:27,405.821 --> 00:09:28,395.821 Oh, obviously it drew me there. 193 00:09:28,395.821 --> 00:09:29,205.821 It's beautiful wine. 194 00:09:29,285.821 --> 00:09:30,395.821 But there was no. 195 00:09:31,145.821 --> 00:09:35,315.821 And this is what I mean in hindsight, there was no marketing push or education around that. 196 00:09:35,315.821 --> 00:09:40,385.821 Say like there was for vibrant rioja when there was all of a sudden Spanish wines everywhere. 197 00:09:40,390.821 --> 00:09:40,660.821 That's true. 198 00:09:40,690.821 --> 00:09:50,140.821 they were spending billions of euros to educate, everybody from consumers, retailers, trade people like you, you know, they would just get the ball rolling for these people. 199 00:09:50,140.821 --> 00:09:55,90.821 And New Zealand just didn't have, you know, they had great wines and they have really good producers. 200 00:09:55,90.821 --> 00:10:07,430.821 Oh, and great conscientious people, but they just didn't have the dollars behind it And I actually think we should, step back, just to point out, this is actually, and I've talked about How rose, how the sausage got made for Rose, how that became so popular in America. 201 00:10:07,970.821 --> 00:10:19,950.821 That was a massive, multi-year pr push by multiple, wine industry trade groups, spending millions of dollars and they took me out on a yacht. 202 00:10:20,10.821 --> 00:10:20,310.821 Fed me. 203 00:10:20,965.821 --> 00:10:21,955.821 Entertain me. 204 00:10:22,235.821 --> 00:10:24,425.821 there was a bunch of D-list celebrities apparently. 205 00:10:24,965.821 --> 00:10:25,685.821 I brought my wife. 206 00:10:25,685.821 --> 00:10:30,375.821 Oh, aren't you a D-list celebrity? I know, Oh, no, I'm an fless celebrity at best, but yeah. 207 00:10:30,375.821 --> 00:10:30,376.821 Yeah. 208 00:10:30,381.821 --> 00:10:33,615.821 No, and that, and, and only, only in, yeah, only two people. 209 00:10:33,705.821 --> 00:10:35,115.821 People who work in wine shops. 210 00:10:35,175.821 --> 00:10:35,355.821 Yeah. 211 00:10:35,715.821 --> 00:10:36,375.821 Oh my God. 212 00:10:36,375.821 --> 00:10:40,55.821 I gotta say, I actually recently, I got back to me that I was mean to somebody. 213 00:10:40,55.821 --> 00:10:42,695.821 I just didn't say hi to somebody in a wine shop. 214 00:10:42,915.821 --> 00:10:43,635.821 and how dare you. 215 00:10:43,695.821 --> 00:10:45,255.821 I know, but it got back to me. 216 00:10:45,255.821 --> 00:10:47,25.821 I heard back that I hurt their feelings. 217 00:10:47,55.821 --> 00:10:47,480.821 Oh, geez. 218 00:10:47,480.821 --> 00:10:49,365.821 And I'm like, oh my God, I don't know that people know me. 219 00:10:49,365.821 --> 00:10:50,655.821 I'm like, holy shit. 220 00:10:50,835.821 --> 00:10:51,135.821 Yeah. 221 00:10:51,165.821 --> 00:10:52,635.821 Like I, my, my, yes. 222 00:10:52,635.821 --> 00:10:52,995.821 Yeah. 223 00:10:52,995.821 --> 00:10:57,705.821 But also just I have, I, I, I forget, I have to be nice to everybody in wine shops. 224 00:10:57,885.821 --> 00:10:59,295.821 'cause they apparently all know me. 225 00:10:59,435.821 --> 00:11:00,765.821 they probably went to your school, Yeah. 226 00:11:00,765.821 --> 00:11:01,95.821 Oh no. 227 00:11:01,95.821 --> 00:11:02,25.821 That I would recognize. 228 00:11:02,25.821 --> 00:11:02,865.821 I would recognize that. 229 00:11:02,865.821 --> 00:11:03,825.821 No, these are just, yeah. 230 00:11:03,825.821 --> 00:11:04,65.821 No. 231 00:11:04,65.821 --> 00:11:04,805.821 But, so. 232 00:11:05,110.821 --> 00:11:05,890.821 That's it. 233 00:11:05,950.821 --> 00:11:15,460.821 So like this is a huge thing that almost every major wine that's been introduced into the United States, especially, there's been marketing money behind it. 234 00:11:15,580.821 --> 00:11:19,90.821 I mean, all the way going back to Argentian and Malbec in the early aughts. 235 00:11:19,180.821 --> 00:11:19,420.821 Yeah. 236 00:11:19,510.821 --> 00:11:29,560.821 you know, and like one of the things I'm not, you know, when I actually represented, champagne for a year, I was their main ambassador and I got paid a fortune for doing very little. 237 00:11:29,650.821 --> 00:11:29,860.821 Yeah. 238 00:11:29,990.821 --> 00:11:32,950.821 so this is, and this is, you know, many, many years ago. 239 00:11:33,30.821 --> 00:11:34,920.821 They realized that I just dropped too many F bombs. 240 00:11:34,920.821 --> 00:11:34,980.821 Yeah. 241 00:11:35,610.821 --> 00:11:37,470.821 They just realized like they did not know what to do with me. 242 00:11:37,470.821 --> 00:11:40,150.821 So they Even for the French? no, I just, know, I was just a little too, Yeah. 243 00:11:40,150.821 --> 00:11:43,270.821 Well there's probably some Brits involved if it's champagne going on here. 244 00:11:43,300.821 --> 00:11:43,960.821 Oh, exactly. 245 00:11:44,20.821 --> 00:11:46,60.821 Oh, it was a, they, that was a cluster fuck. 246 00:11:46,60.821 --> 00:11:47,230.821 But that's a whole different story. 247 00:11:47,630.821 --> 00:11:57,90.821 but it does point to, you're right though, it does point to the fact that these big PR pushes come and They're usually from countries that have super government behind them. 248 00:11:57,120.821 --> 00:11:57,480.821 Oh, yeah. 249 00:11:57,480.821 --> 00:12:03,390.821 Willing to spend, whether it's, you know, Money from Argentina, you know, and their government, backed initiatives. 250 00:12:03,440.821 --> 00:12:07,40.821 So hopefully New Zealand, there's talk of one happening soon. 251 00:12:07,40.821 --> 00:12:07,880.821 That would be great. 252 00:12:07,880.821 --> 00:12:17,410.821 You know, because we really need to, You know, I've been pounding the pavement for 15 years Out here with some years feeling like I'm by myself, with alternative varieties from New Zealand. 253 00:12:17,410.821 --> 00:12:18,460.821 Oh, that's true. 254 00:12:18,465.821 --> 00:12:20,110.821 But it is, I've, it has increased. 255 00:12:20,380.821 --> 00:12:25,390.821 And I do see now, you know, I have always saw like bitter craggy range out there and Yeah. 256 00:12:25,390.821 --> 00:12:26,380.821 Who's similar to me. 257 00:12:26,380.821 --> 00:12:28,210.821 They do Hawks Bay and Martin Borough Fruit. 258 00:12:28,330.821 --> 00:12:28,630.821 Yeah. 259 00:12:28,660.821 --> 00:12:32,720.821 I've seen some other Hawks Bay producers, like, tomato State Yes. 260 00:12:32,720.821 --> 00:12:37,40.821 And, you know, sometimes you find the weirdest wines in the weirdest states around the country now. 261 00:12:37,85.821 --> 00:12:49,125.821 Oh, I I want to get to that, but, but before we start, just one thought I, it's really impressive that New Zealand, New Zealand is the one place that hasn't really promoted themselves and yet had massive acceptance. 262 00:12:49,125.821 --> 00:12:49,635.821 Like, yeah. 263 00:12:50,55.821 --> 00:12:51,885.821 New Zealand Sauvignon Blanc, which. 264 00:12:52,535.821 --> 00:12:55,625.821 I actually use in many different ways in all my classes. 265 00:12:55,675.821 --> 00:13:05,995.821 just largely because one, you wanna show terroir, like, which is a very, you know, I don't, I don't use that lightly, but like, the level of four MMP, yeah. 266 00:13:06,355.821 --> 00:13:11,695.821 And, in which is, you know, one of those, sulfur based thiols that actually gives it that guava play. 267 00:13:11,815.821 --> 00:13:14,95.821 You can't get that almost anywhere else. 268 00:13:14,95.821 --> 00:13:17,705.821 That is very much, your south island. 269 00:13:17,765.821 --> 00:13:22,715.821 So much sunshine, just the exact right place to get those flavors and you can't get anywhere else. 270 00:13:22,835.821 --> 00:13:30,875.821 And I also think I've been there, well, like I said, 17 years now, and we talked about everybody took, oh, they got young soils and that was kind of preached to me. 271 00:13:30,875.821 --> 00:13:38,55.821 But, the more I'm there, the more I do think it is a lot more to do with the sunshine and the high, high UV levels we have there. 272 00:13:39,45.821 --> 00:13:42,405.821 Oh, it is, it always d and we, we, we sort of have to ripen by uv. 273 00:13:42,855.821 --> 00:13:48,485.821 So we opened the canopy and, I mean, all you have to do is get off the plane in New Zealand and two things. 274 00:13:48,515.821 --> 00:13:49,685.821 You gotta wear sunblock. 275 00:13:49,715.821 --> 00:13:49,955.821 Yep. 276 00:13:50,135.821 --> 00:13:53,525.821 And you, and you notice that everything around you is more vivid. 277 00:13:53,525.821 --> 00:13:55,325.821 The greens are greener, the blues are bluer. 278 00:13:55,325.821 --> 00:14:02,165.821 And you go, what the hell's going on here? And it's 'cause we're an island in the Pacific with no continental dust and really strong sunlight. 279 00:14:02,195.821 --> 00:14:04,225.821 So it's, that comes out in the wine. 280 00:14:04,225.821 --> 00:14:04,945.821 Of course it does. 281 00:14:04,945.821 --> 00:14:05,554.821 it's insane. 282 00:14:05,554.821 --> 00:14:05,764.821 Yeah. 283 00:14:05,764.821 --> 00:14:08,824.821 No, there's very few places you can point to that actually has that level. 284 00:14:08,884.821 --> 00:14:11,224.821 And usually most of 'em are, are very high elevation. 285 00:14:11,274.821 --> 00:14:16,84.821 New Zealand's one of the few that is, you know, reasonably not, below 2000 feet above sea level. 286 00:14:16,134.821 --> 00:14:17,604.821 and most of our stuff's riverbeds. 287 00:14:17,644.821 --> 00:14:19,684.821 And yet you're getting this uv It is. 288 00:14:20,389.821 --> 00:14:25,9.821 And you're a hundred percent right? At least my, from everything I now know. 289 00:14:25,549.821 --> 00:14:28,444.821 Being the, you know, mind you, no, I do teach an advanced program on tir. 290 00:14:29,344.821 --> 00:14:30,879.821 you better for, I better on this stuff. 291 00:14:30,929.821 --> 00:14:32,279.821 So, okay, so there's that. 292 00:14:32,459.821 --> 00:14:36,899.821 And I just wanted to stress so everyone listening can get a little insider baseball on that. 293 00:14:37,789.821 --> 00:14:42,89.821 now I'm gonna actually issue my, my laments about, New Zealand. 294 00:14:42,309.821 --> 00:14:43,749.821 Okay, so here's the problem. 295 00:14:44,259.821 --> 00:14:49,689.821 One Tim I love right? Their Syrahs, when I can find them amazing. 296 00:14:49,899.821 --> 00:14:51,939.821 When I can find their cabs amazing. 297 00:14:52,209.821 --> 00:14:53,169.821 When I can find their. 298 00:14:53,499.821 --> 00:14:56,379.821 The one thing I can never find anymore, and I'm gonna come to you in a second. 299 00:14:56,659.821 --> 00:14:59,579.821 is there a gamay? Like, what the fuck? Okay. 300 00:14:59,579.821 --> 00:15:01,949.821 One, I can never find your Malbec anymore. 301 00:15:01,949.821 --> 00:15:03,209.821 So now here's the thing, Danny. 302 00:15:03,629.821 --> 00:15:05,759.821 Alright, you do this insanely great mail back. 303 00:15:05,789.821 --> 00:15:08,219.821 Why? And, and you do. 304 00:15:08,519.821 --> 00:15:10,919.821 And what else are you making right now? You're not looking in the right places. 305 00:15:10,949.821 --> 00:15:14,639.821 I know right You can get my Malbec, but also I know, but I don't, I don't buy things over in Jersey. 306 00:15:14,639.821 --> 00:15:21,109.821 because, I make sure that my friends, the shops that I tend to work with, they always have your decibels, SB Sauvignon Blanc. 307 00:15:21,109.821 --> 00:15:21,309.821 Always. 308 00:15:21,469.821 --> 00:15:28,424.821 'cause we use it because it shows a very distinctly different type of Sauvignon blanc than people are used to from New Zealand. 309 00:15:28,454.821 --> 00:15:36,544.821 I'll bring you a bit of pinot, bit of Malbac, and since you know where you can find the Sauvignon Blanc, I'm gonna bring you my shein blanc, which is doing really well on this trip recently. 310 00:15:36,849.821 --> 00:15:44,49.821 And it's from this great certified organic vineyard that we work with called the Two Terraces Vineyard, which is one of the most famous vineyards now in New Zealand. 311 00:15:44,169.821 --> 00:15:48,129.821 Oh really? It's about 15 winemakers, all elbowing in for fruit from these guys. 312 00:15:48,129.821 --> 00:15:48,639.821 Oh, that's fantastic. 313 00:15:48,899.821 --> 00:15:53,349.821 and they grow Shein Albarino, which I make as well, but they have Gamay, they have Chardonnay. 314 00:15:53,349.821 --> 00:15:54,69.821 Oh, okay. 315 00:15:54,99.821 --> 00:15:54,909.821 Syrah there. 316 00:15:54,909.821 --> 00:15:56,319.821 It's a fantastic site. 317 00:15:56,559.821 --> 00:15:57,669.821 but yeah, I mean it's tough. 318 00:15:57,669.821 --> 00:16:00,309.821 It's all about distribution and demand and everything. 319 00:16:00,339.821 --> 00:16:02,559.821 So I'm not surprised that you have a tough time finding. 320 00:16:02,559.821 --> 00:16:10,569.821 know, and it's hard because we, you're talking about alternative variety is from New Zealand and how hard it is. 321 00:16:10,569.821 --> 00:16:19,574.821 Like no one's out there talking about it except for you're there and Te Mata, which I mentioned, Distri our distributor here in Pennsylvania, they're Pennsylvania and New Jersey. 322 00:16:19,644.821 --> 00:16:25,4.821 Delaware, we're in New York as well, with somebody else, but they've got. 323 00:16:25,884.821 --> 00:16:28,914.821 Both Malbecs, they've got my Nove style Malbec. 324 00:16:28,964.821 --> 00:16:31,824.821 They've got, the Shannon, they've got a chilled red I do. 325 00:16:31,824.821 --> 00:16:33,484.821 Which is pinot based Oh yeah. 326 00:16:33,514.821 --> 00:16:36,249.821 I make 17 wines You make 17 wines now? Yeah. 327 00:16:36,249.821 --> 00:16:36,649.821 Oh my God. 328 00:16:36,764.821 --> 00:16:37,64.821 Okay. 329 00:16:37,64.821 --> 00:16:40,894.821 First off, if you come into my tasting room, have 17 wines on the shelf. 330 00:16:40,999.821 --> 00:16:42,499.821 so you have your, which is awesome. 331 00:16:42,499.821 --> 00:16:49,719.821 Now where is your, tasting room? So if you bought, so I, you know, I almost cr caved and bought a little winery and vineyard in the Gilet gravels. 332 00:16:49,749.821 --> 00:16:52,829.821 And then, thank God me and the guy are better friends for it. 333 00:16:52,829.821 --> 00:16:56,849.821 We, the deal fell through kind of in the 11th hour and Right. 334 00:16:56,969.821 --> 00:16:58,169.821 That was about three years ago. 335 00:16:58,169.821 --> 00:17:04,404.821 And right after that, maybe, almost four years ago now, right after that, the space opened up in downtown Hastings, which is where, oh. 336 00:17:04,409.821 --> 00:17:06,989.821 the east block of Hastings, where there's all these great restaurants. 337 00:17:07,289.821 --> 00:17:10,139.821 Michael Henley Master Wine has his own wine bar there. 338 00:17:10,199.821 --> 00:17:10,559.821 Nice. 339 00:17:10,559.821 --> 00:17:12,929.821 It worked connected to Agenda Distillery. 340 00:17:13,619.821 --> 00:17:13,709.821 Nice. 341 00:17:13,739.821 --> 00:17:14,909.821 And it's a great place to be. 342 00:17:14,909.821 --> 00:17:16,709.821 And I realize like my role. 343 00:17:17,519.821 --> 00:17:23,819.821 Much like it is with the, with the vineyards where I kind of get people to stop weed spraying and go organic. 344 00:17:23,819.821 --> 00:17:30,334.821 And I like to be with the people, you know what I mean? So, no, because most people here the aren't listening, aren't from Philly. 345 00:17:30,334.821 --> 00:17:35,734.821 So let's just, croons is just a great local pub up in the Fairmount district. 346 00:17:35,764.821 --> 00:17:35,974.821 Yeah. 347 00:17:35,974.821 --> 00:17:37,684.821 It's busy like seven days a week. 348 00:17:37,684.821 --> 00:17:38,404.821 It's crazy. 349 00:17:38,884.821 --> 00:17:44,214.821 and we're actually in the process of working on a little tasting room upstairs there, which is gonna be really cool. 350 00:17:44,244.821 --> 00:17:44,874.821 Oh, nice. 351 00:17:44,874.821 --> 00:17:46,14.821 So keep an eye out for that. 352 00:17:46,14.821 --> 00:17:46,854.821 That'll be later this year. 353 00:17:46,854.821 --> 00:17:48,994.821 We did a little sneak peek, last week. 354 00:17:49,264.821 --> 00:17:50,284.821 Showed some people around. 355 00:17:50,284.821 --> 00:17:51,184.821 It's under construction. 356 00:17:51,189.821 --> 00:17:53,759.821 can have a actual, little anchor here in Philly. 357 00:17:53,789.821 --> 00:17:54,629.821 Little legit. 358 00:17:54,629.821 --> 00:17:55,769.821 Little spot for us here. 359 00:17:55,769.821 --> 00:17:55,859.821 Nice. 360 00:17:55,859.821 --> 00:17:58,49.821 cause we do have a lot of our wines here in Pennsylvania. 361 00:17:58,49.821 --> 00:18:01,118.821 you do it just hard? and they're all, yeah, they're all SLO except for that. 362 00:18:01,148.821 --> 00:18:01,388.821 Yeah. 363 00:18:01,628.821 --> 00:18:03,68.821 but which is jargon. 364 00:18:03,98.821 --> 00:18:04,20.821 special liquor order, special, special liquor. 365 00:18:04,443.821 --> 00:18:05,103.821 Sorry, folks. 366 00:18:05,103.821 --> 00:18:07,443.821 But it just gotta go over the bridge and you'll find it easy. 367 00:18:07,443.821 --> 00:18:07,863.821 Yeah, exactly. 368 00:18:08,283.821 --> 00:18:11,453.821 but we, yeah, so I have this downtown tasting room, and we do events. 369 00:18:11,453.821 --> 00:18:12,443.821 We have live music. 370 00:18:12,473.821 --> 00:18:15,503.821 We, you know, last night, I mean, I wasn't there, obviously I'm here. 371 00:18:15,623.821 --> 00:18:15,743.821 Yeah. 372 00:18:15,743.821 --> 00:18:23,73.821 they were doing a paint and sip night where they, you know, they, oh, bunch of mothers from Mother's Day and painting and drinking wine, you know, whatever. 373 00:18:23,73.821 --> 00:18:25,113.821 Whatever we can do to be with the people you. 374 00:18:29,58.821 --> 00:18:33,723.821 With the people that is, it sounds like you're running for get the wine to the people, you know. 375 00:18:34,503.821 --> 00:18:37,143.821 Alright, so seven, you said 17 varieties. 376 00:18:37,563.821 --> 00:18:38,883.821 Well, 17 different wines. 377 00:18:38,888.821 --> 00:18:39,58.821 Wines. 378 00:18:39,63.821 --> 00:18:41,103.821 So we, decibel is a core range of wines. 379 00:18:41,103.821 --> 00:18:46,393.821 We have, we do a couple pet mats in that, which are by the way, are super clean and really well made. 380 00:18:46,443.821 --> 00:18:49,593.821 The Decibel Sab Blanc, the Shein Blanc, A Rose. 381 00:18:50,283.821 --> 00:18:50,553.821 Yeah. 382 00:18:50,553.821 --> 00:18:53,553.821 the Malbec and of course the Martin Bro Pinot Noir, which drew me there. 383 00:18:53,633.821 --> 00:18:55,493.821 so, and that's our core range of wines. 384 00:18:55,493.821 --> 00:18:58,193.821 You know, obviously what I started, we have one of the old ones here. 385 00:18:58,193.821 --> 00:18:59,618.821 The, yeah, the old label. 386 00:18:59,618.821 --> 00:19:00,38.821 listening. 387 00:19:00,38.821 --> 00:19:02,408.821 I actually, because this is for, yeah. 388 00:19:02,568.821 --> 00:19:05,988.821 we're not gonna open this largely because this is a 2013 IGN blanc. 389 00:19:06,318.821 --> 00:19:10,818.821 That's just for display, so that my first four winemakers, students became winemakers. 390 00:19:10,818.821 --> 00:19:12,318.821 I put, I leave them up there. 391 00:19:12,538.821 --> 00:19:13,108.821 so cool. 392 00:19:13,198.821 --> 00:19:13,648.821 Oh yeah. 393 00:19:13,648.821 --> 00:19:15,868.821 It is, it was funny how quickly it happened. 394 00:19:16,18.821 --> 00:19:17,488.821 dude, I still tell the story. 395 00:19:17,878.821 --> 00:19:27,868.821 People go, how, how did you end up here? And, you know, and people ask me, how'd you get in New Zealand from Phil? I said, well, I was, you know, after being on the road with the band for a bit, I was managing a band. 396 00:19:27,868.821 --> 00:19:31,498.821 I came back to work at my family's restaurant, but I knew I, I couldn't stay there. 397 00:19:31,798.821 --> 00:19:33,448.821 And I started taking your classes. 398 00:19:33,478.821 --> 00:19:33,658.821 Yeah. 399 00:19:33,663.821 --> 00:19:36,868.821 And I was like, 'cause I didn't realize, I knew I loved wine. 400 00:19:36,868.821 --> 00:19:41,638.821 I didn't know I actually had a good palette until we were doing blind tastings in your classes. 401 00:19:41,643.821 --> 00:19:46,138.821 And I was getting like 10 outta 10, and people were giving me weird looks like, how do, and I'm like, I don't know. 402 00:19:46,768.821 --> 00:19:49,438.821 I'm just guessing, but I guess I'm guessing, right? Yeah. 403 00:19:49,438.821 --> 00:19:52,528.821 And I pulled you aside and I said, you probably don't remember this. 404 00:19:52,528.821 --> 00:19:56,68.821 And I said, because you had done some vintages and been to some places. 405 00:19:56,68.821 --> 00:19:57,808.821 You'd been to France, you'd been to California. 406 00:19:57,808.821 --> 00:20:00,448.821 And I was like, listen man, how the hell do I do this? Yeah. 407 00:20:00,448.821 --> 00:20:01,78.821 Like, I want to. 408 00:20:01,378.821 --> 00:20:02,548.821 Go do this somehow. 409 00:20:02,548.821 --> 00:20:06,58.821 and you said chemistry man, and I said, fuck. 410 00:20:07,588.821 --> 00:20:07,858.821 Exactly. 411 00:20:07,858.821 --> 00:20:08,518.821 Yeah. 412 00:20:08,518.821 --> 00:20:10,373.821 I haven't studied chemistry from, since high school. 413 00:20:10,373.821 --> 00:20:15,643.821 So I got a buddy's, who was studying, doing, you know, he is now a doctor here in Philadelphia. 414 00:20:15,643.821 --> 00:20:19,93.821 He gave me his MCAT book and I started doing like basic chemistry again. 415 00:20:19,123.821 --> 00:20:19,543.821 Oh wow. 416 00:20:19,573.821 --> 00:20:21,373.821 You know, those MCAT books are like this thick. 417 00:20:21,373.821 --> 00:20:21,583.821 Oh yeah. 418 00:20:21,583.821 --> 00:20:22,513.821 That's super thick. 419 00:20:22,653.821 --> 00:20:28,13.821 Well, I had to like, you know, I joke around people go, you know, 'cause I had had a degree. 420 00:20:28,13.821 --> 00:20:31,403.821 I always read, I was like, you know, I think, you know, I'm not a dumb guy. 421 00:20:31,403.821 --> 00:20:32,303.821 I can figure this out. 422 00:20:32,303.821 --> 00:20:35,753.821 But it's the equivalent of you're like, I jog every day. 423 00:20:35,753.821 --> 00:20:37,223.821 And then somebody goes, great, well you're in shape. 424 00:20:37,223.821 --> 00:20:38,123.821 Here's a basketball. 425 00:20:38,153.821 --> 00:20:40,913.821 You know, like it's a different muscles going on in your brain. 426 00:20:40,913.821 --> 00:20:45,743.821 So I just wanted to get the language back going again and like start looking at Oh yeah. 427 00:20:45,743.821 --> 00:20:48,203.821 Like, you know, inorganic organic chemistry. 428 00:20:48,203.821 --> 00:20:51,683.821 and just start getting the basic language down against it, at least when I got there. 429 00:20:51,733.821 --> 00:20:55,333.821 Which was still a ridiculous struggle, particularly for the first year. 430 00:20:55,333.821 --> 00:20:56,638.821 And then I caught my wind after that. 431 00:20:56,858.821 --> 00:21:03,408.821 that would be hard just because you jumped right in and which is amazing that you did, you know, and actually was your career. 432 00:21:03,438.821 --> 00:21:12,768.821 that gave me a little insight, like how to, allow students to, you know, give 'em a little bit more, understanding and knowledge and acclimation of, of what is gonna be expected. 433 00:21:12,768.821 --> 00:21:21,198.821 So before they jump in, which is why I, you know, one of the reasons why I started the Winemaking Advanced Winemaking program, but you were open to the idea that I was like, oh yeah, I wanna get out of the bar. 434 00:21:21,203.821 --> 00:21:22,613.821 And I said, I want get behind the I know. 435 00:21:22,613.821 --> 00:21:24,413.821 what I told you said you just go, yeah. 436 00:21:24,413.821 --> 00:21:25,973.821 Like go, because there was no other way. 437 00:21:25,973.821 --> 00:21:31,613.821 Like there was no, there's no, at that point in time, like there's just, you jump in or you sink or swim and. 438 00:21:31,928.821 --> 00:21:36,128.821 And the thing is, you, you, you swam, but I el and, which was amazing. 439 00:21:36,428.821 --> 00:21:38,498.821 I gave the same advice to other people and they sunk. 440 00:21:38,498.821 --> 00:21:46,328.821 So I'm like, alright, I have to like, so as for the school, I say I have to actually give students better advice because like, you know, sure. 441 00:21:46,328.821 --> 00:21:51,528.821 Danny did this awesome, amazing thing, but then I had other students who, I, you know, did it. 442 00:21:51,578.821 --> 00:22:03,588.821 But I think honestly, one of the best things is growing up in a restaurant I worked for, this guy Glen Hugo, out in Gerard one year and, and, 2012, which now they're in receivership or something. 443 00:22:03,588.821 --> 00:22:05,838.821 But, I haven't talked to him in a while, but I hope he's doing okay. 444 00:22:05,838.821 --> 00:22:11,538.821 But, they, he said every year, all his first year interns are ex restaurant people. 445 00:22:11,598.821 --> 00:22:17,718.821 That when he goes around and sells the wine, he just said, Hey, you wanna come do Harvest? You know, and he and I said, yeah, that's a probably good idea. 446 00:22:18,483.821 --> 00:22:19,743.821 They're used to working on their feet. 447 00:22:19,743.821 --> 00:22:20,883.821 They're used to working long hours. 448 00:22:20,883.821 --> 00:22:23,583.821 They're used to cleaning, which is 90% of the job cleaning. 449 00:22:23,583.821 --> 00:22:23,918.821 Oh, yeah, exactly. 450 00:22:24,98.821 --> 00:22:27,573.821 You know? Oh, they're used to being in the weeds, which you constantly are in the winery. 451 00:22:27,573.821 --> 00:22:32,803.821 So, You're used to just get it done, figure it out somehow, you know, and be able to quick thinking and under pressure. 452 00:22:32,803.821 --> 00:22:33,853.821 'cause the thing is, is yeah. 453 00:22:33,853.821 --> 00:22:35,563.821 I mean, that no tank explode. 454 00:22:36,313.821 --> 00:22:37,423.821 Oh, they do? Oh, yeah. 455 00:22:37,423.821 --> 00:22:39,823.821 Things that, you know, people fall, Yeah. 456 00:22:39,823.821 --> 00:22:41,833.821 I mean, so things happen. 457 00:22:42,173.821 --> 00:22:48,883.821 The thing that the, and I've seen this, I, you know, I won't say the name, I've seen accountants come out and try to do harvest and Oh yeah. 458 00:22:49,93.821 --> 00:22:50,533.821 I'm like, you can't bean count here. 459 00:22:50,533.821 --> 00:22:52,153.821 We just gotta get it done, you know? Yeah. 460 00:22:52,153.821 --> 00:22:58,53.821 And, and so it takes us a certain kind of, Personality, wine, you know, winemakers are usually pretty interesting people. 461 00:22:58,113.821 --> 00:22:58,264.821 Oh yeah. 462 00:22:58,264.821 --> 00:22:58,578.821 A lot of my friends. 463 00:22:58,798.821 --> 00:23:03,63.821 And they're, you know, they have a diverse range of skills, you know? Yeah. 464 00:23:03,153.821 --> 00:23:03,493.821 Oh Yeah. 465 00:23:03,913.821 --> 00:23:06,463.821 Hold your own, you know, that's the hard bit. 466 00:23:06,543.821 --> 00:23:10,23.821 and one of the things when my students, in corporate, say, I want to do this. 467 00:23:10,23.821 --> 00:23:13,83.821 I'm like, well, this is hard. 468 00:23:13,133.821 --> 00:23:16,643.821 that corporate lifestyle is, the very opposite of what you need. 469 00:23:16,833.821 --> 00:23:20,73.821 Like, 'cause there's no one to call and They don't understand how deep that goes. 470 00:23:20,513.821 --> 00:23:21,233.821 and there's no money. 471 00:23:21,423.821 --> 00:23:22,103.821 Yeah, exactly. 472 00:23:22,103.821 --> 00:23:22,343.821 No. 473 00:23:22,343.821 --> 00:23:23,183.821 And there's no one to call. 474 00:23:23,233.821 --> 00:23:24,733.821 And you're responsible for everything. 475 00:23:24,733.821 --> 00:23:29,713.821 Like, and most people don't understand how that feels. 476 00:23:29,713.821 --> 00:23:32,768.821 and that's a huge weight, that most people just walk away. 477 00:23:32,828.821 --> 00:23:34,58.821 They can't understand. 478 00:23:34,778.821 --> 00:23:35,948.821 That's what you know, but. 479 00:23:36,503.821 --> 00:23:38,753.821 It is, you know, it's always, it is restaurant people. 480 00:23:38,753.821 --> 00:23:43,973.821 I mean, there's always, you know, having some restaurant industries, at least to be workers, The workers we're seller hands and stuff, you know. 481 00:23:43,988.821 --> 00:23:44,428.821 Exactly. 482 00:23:44,633.821 --> 00:23:45,383.821 You know, all the way up. 483 00:23:45,443.821 --> 00:23:48,623.821 Unless you're, the, the, you know, unless you're, unless you're the money guy. 484 00:23:48,713.821 --> 00:23:48,863.821 Mm-hmm. 485 00:23:48,863.821 --> 00:23:54,53.821 You know, like at that point it doesn't matter 'cause you're gonna hire people to do it and you're gonna lose money on this no matter what. 486 00:23:54,723.821 --> 00:23:57,993.821 but, but, so, okay, so here we are. 487 00:23:58,353.821 --> 00:24:01,473.821 I, I have a, I have, I have a couple questions. 488 00:24:01,478.821 --> 00:24:01,558.821 Okay. 489 00:24:01,863.821 --> 00:24:01,983.821 Okay. 490 00:24:02,38.821 --> 00:24:05,943.821 'cause you've been in the New Zealand now for 17 years. 491 00:24:05,943.821 --> 00:24:07,113.821 17 years plus, yeah. 492 00:24:07,113.821 --> 00:24:07,653.821 Plus, yeah. 493 00:24:07,653.821 --> 00:24:08,373.821 18 vintages. 494 00:24:08,373.821 --> 00:24:11,343.821 So, so pinot noir always beloved. 495 00:24:11,403.821 --> 00:24:15,363.821 I, I've like from the very beginning, like it, the, the pinot beyond all else. 496 00:24:15,393.821 --> 00:24:16,713.821 'cause it was always vitally correct. 497 00:24:16,713.821 --> 00:24:24,663.821 And so, so say like, up until around 20 15, 20 16, 20 maybe in 2018, it. 498 00:24:25,293.821 --> 00:24:37,253.821 You saw a very diverse range of pinot noir, you saw ones really heavily, like very lean, a lot of barnyard, some roses, and they were always like, what? I wanted to show varietal little fingerprints. 499 00:24:37,623.821 --> 00:24:38,613.821 I brought in New Zealand. 500 00:24:38,643.821 --> 00:24:55,603.821 I always knew consistently, but styles changed I've noticed a rather rapid change in New Zealand pinots where they're becoming richer, heavier, much more fruit forward, I'm not gonna sell to you by saying Mette Valley style, but have you noticed a shift? movement? I don't know. 501 00:24:55,603.821 --> 00:25:02,833.821 I don't know which wines you're drinking, so it's tough for me to say, but I would say, you know, we're pretty conscious of that. 502 00:25:02,833.821 --> 00:25:05,263.821 We're don't want to be California, Oregon Pinot. 503 00:25:05,393.821 --> 00:25:18,233.821 these past two weeks, and I kept saying, oh, these are almost like, at least stylistically and body-wise, a little bit like old board or old Burgundy, because God knows recent burgundy vintages are so concentrated. 504 00:25:18,238.821 --> 00:25:19,48.821 Oh, panic. 505 00:25:19,78.821 --> 00:25:19,438.821 Yeah. 506 00:25:19,488.821 --> 00:25:22,338.821 and it, they're, they are still pretty light on their feet. 507 00:25:22,343.821 --> 00:25:22,393.821 Yeah. 508 00:25:22,423.821 --> 00:25:22,713.821 Okay. 509 00:25:22,718.821 --> 00:25:26,58.821 Now, if you're talking about central Otago Yes. 510 00:25:26,58.821 --> 00:25:26,953.821 I'm talking about Central Otago. 511 00:25:26,953.821 --> 00:25:31,368.821 That Central Otago, I mean, that, that is, there's a couple things going on there. 512 00:25:31,368.821 --> 00:25:40,518.821 And this is why wine's interesting is one is the weather and the, you know, that they get that day or shift where they get really hot, they get the hottest days during the summer, but then the coldest nights. 513 00:25:40,578.821 --> 00:25:41,148.821 Oh, okay. 514 00:25:41,148.821 --> 00:25:43,608.821 So they get really, they get like these big fruit bombs. 515 00:25:43,608.821 --> 00:25:45,378.821 It's just gonna happen from Otago. 516 00:25:45,408.821 --> 00:25:45,648.821 Yeah. 517 00:25:45,648.821 --> 00:25:49,897.821 and I've noticed that it has been increasingly leading into that in the last decade. 518 00:25:49,897.821 --> 00:25:53,197.821 Now, much like you would say, Marlboro. 519 00:25:53,527.821 --> 00:25:58,57.821 With their Sauvignon Blanc, they say, well this works and people like it, and then we're gonna go even further. 520 00:25:58,227.821 --> 00:26:06,417.821 You know, you get all that tourism in Queenstown, you get people flying in from Asia and around the world and they go, Hey, we got these amazing expressive pinots. 521 00:26:06,417.821 --> 00:26:08,517.821 I think personally there's something to that. 522 00:26:08,667.821 --> 00:26:08,937.821 Yeah. 523 00:26:08,967.821 --> 00:26:10,317.821 Where we say Martin, bro. 524 00:26:10,377.821 --> 00:26:10,737.821 Yeah. 525 00:26:11,7.821 --> 00:26:19,47.821 Our main market is some of the old traditional markets like Australia and the uk, but Wellington, you know Wellington, yes. 526 00:26:19,47.821 --> 00:26:21,657.821 that was part of that second wave of wines that came in. 527 00:26:21,747.821 --> 00:26:22,47.821 Yes. 528 00:26:22,47.821 --> 00:26:24,87.821 It's very hard to find a Martin bro pinot in American. 529 00:26:24,87.821 --> 00:26:24,147.821 Now. 530 00:26:24,417.821 --> 00:26:28,982.821 I know this is a problem and Yeah, well it's a problem for Americans, but yeah, they sell 'em elsewhere. 531 00:26:29,737.821 --> 00:26:29,917.821 I know. 532 00:26:29,917.821 --> 00:26:38,847.821 Oh, that's clearly, and, and, and I think it, again, it was like pushback to price and everything, and we don't get the volumes that a lot of the OTA and the yields that a lot of the Otago producers get. 533 00:26:39,87.821 --> 00:26:42,567.821 You could look at the same exact clone on very similar soils. 534 00:26:43,92.821 --> 00:26:49,272.821 In Martin Borough versus Otago and the bunches will look way bigger in, in Otago, well in Martin Borough. 535 00:26:49,272.821 --> 00:26:53,602.821 'cause we get those real windy spring days in, in, in, in Martin Borough. 536 00:26:54,22.821 --> 00:26:56,962.821 So we get thicker skins and smaller concentrated bunches. 537 00:26:56,962.821 --> 00:26:57,292.821 Yeah. 538 00:26:57,352.821 --> 00:26:57,712.821 Alright. 539 00:26:57,742.821 --> 00:26:58,12.821 Okay. 540 00:26:58,12.821 --> 00:27:01,372.821 Which makes, but we get like more savory character there. 541 00:27:01,712.821 --> 00:27:07,982.821 now as I'm seeing Vine age in Otago and there, you know, there's great producers like Felton Road and Ali and Oh yeah. 542 00:27:08,72.821 --> 00:27:12,402.821 And, they're two of my favorites, where, you know, those wines are getting crazy good. 543 00:27:12,402.821 --> 00:27:15,222.821 Like they're just amazing and great winemakers and everything. 544 00:27:15,622.821 --> 00:27:17,242.821 so I think Vine age too helps. 545 00:27:17,272.821 --> 00:27:17,332.821 Yeah. 546 00:27:17,332.821 --> 00:27:17,362.821 Okay. 547 00:27:17,362.821 --> 00:27:23,482.821 You know, with like complexity and, you know, the young, usually the younger the vine, the more fruit forward it's gonna be in the beginning. 548 00:27:23,482.821 --> 00:27:28,62.821 So, I mean it's just all so new down there at the end, end of the day, you know? Yeah. 549 00:27:28,62.821 --> 00:27:30,492.821 it's really interesting and I actually, I do love that. 550 00:27:31,152.821 --> 00:27:47,352.821 It's just something I always preach to students is that they're very like, look who the market is and you could, 'cause you know, you'll see where the style is, why the style is there, and that makes sense that you have a a, I mean, that Otago there's more of a Yeah, yeah. 551 00:27:47,442.821 --> 00:27:53,142.821 There's outside influences that are really, contributing to the, like bigger, richer, you know? Yeah. 552 00:27:53,142.821 --> 00:27:54,222.821 that makes a lot of sense. 553 00:27:54,252.821 --> 00:27:57,492.821 And to be honest, like there can be pushback with that too. 554 00:27:57,492.821 --> 00:28:05,712.821 And you could pay 80 bucks for a Pinot and go like, what the hell did I just drink? I didn't, you know, it was light and fruity and it was pretty good and maybe there was a bit of oak there. 555 00:28:06,57.821 --> 00:28:14,467.821 and you know, there's some people, as we say, taking the piss, but you know, But they can, because they get tourist dollars that come through and they get these junks and so good on 'em. 556 00:28:14,467.821 --> 00:28:23,527.821 I mean, we don't have a lot, you know, Hawkes Bay, we're pretty secluded, you know, Martin, bro, you got Wellington there, but you know, only the knowledgeable tourist is gonna go over to Martin, bro. 557 00:28:23,527.821 --> 00:28:24,527.821 You know All right. 558 00:28:24,587.821 --> 00:28:31,317.821 And then Marlboro, Marlboro makes some good pinot producers there, but some of the bigger guys who make Pinot, it's like, oh yeah, here's our Pinot too. 559 00:28:31,322.821 --> 00:28:35,852.821 Because we make a million liters of Sauvignon Blanc and those wines are their own thing. 560 00:28:35,882.821 --> 00:28:40,607.821 They can be kind of, to me, they're always a bit sort of edgy and smoky and they can be really good. 561 00:28:40,607.821 --> 00:28:41,267.821 They're interesting. 562 00:28:41,457.821 --> 00:28:44,667.821 And then there's North Canterbury as well, which makes some pretty serious Pinots. 563 00:28:44,697.821 --> 00:28:50,747.821 That's like basically near Christchurch the business of wine and the reason why you're here, like of course you are affiliate native. 564 00:28:50,797.821 --> 00:28:55,937.821 that's why, you know, but you've really had a focus on the East coast, with your wines. 565 00:28:56,147.821 --> 00:28:57,617.821 You, make sure they're here. 566 00:28:58,7.821 --> 00:29:08,27.821 But one of the things is, but why do you have to, like, people don't understand like how the wine industry works. 567 00:29:08,27.821 --> 00:29:12,527.821 So why is it that you're here, like you're here almost every year? Yeah, sometimes. 568 00:29:12,647.821 --> 00:29:13,157.821 A lot of times. 569 00:29:13,157.821 --> 00:29:14,87.821 Twice a year. 570 00:29:14,87.821 --> 00:29:14,90.821 Twice a year. 571 00:29:14,95.821 --> 00:29:14,297.821 Yeah. 572 00:29:14,327.821 --> 00:29:16,757.821 I mean, first of all, the US is a very big place. 573 00:29:16,757.821 --> 00:29:16,847.821 Mm-hmm. 574 00:29:17,87.821 --> 00:29:17,297.821 Yes. 575 00:29:17,297.821 --> 00:29:17,837.821 And so it's. 576 00:29:18,137.821 --> 00:29:20,537.821 Honestly, 50 markets, you know? Yeah. 577 00:29:20,537.821 --> 00:29:27,227.821 Most states in the US have way more people than there is in all of New Zealand, and New Zealand's a good, you know, wine market for us. 578 00:29:27,257.821 --> 00:29:27,527.821 Yeah. 579 00:29:27,797.821 --> 00:29:32,917.821 but you know, we sell more wine in Kansas than we do in New Zealand, probably, you know? Wow. 580 00:29:33,187.821 --> 00:29:33,547.821 Okay. 581 00:29:34,357.821 --> 00:29:35,408.821 In certain months, I would say. 582 00:29:35,413.821 --> 00:29:35,822.821 Yeah, exactly. 583 00:29:35,827.821 --> 00:29:36,67.821 yeah. 584 00:29:36,117.821 --> 00:29:42,547.821 And so, but the reason why you're here is, man, we move, you know, when I come, the sales go out. 585 00:29:42,547.821 --> 00:29:46,397.821 It's just very simple and that's because, you know, I go out with. 586 00:29:46,617.821 --> 00:29:50,397.821 it's very easy to get appointments for the sales team when they say there's a winemaker in town. 587 00:29:50,497.821 --> 00:29:51,427.821 So we can go around. 588 00:29:51,427.821 --> 00:29:57,277.821 We do events, you know, I did a country club event in Akron, Ohio last night, and we sold 135 bottles of wine. 589 00:29:57,347.821 --> 00:29:57,737.821 Yeah. 590 00:29:57,827.821 --> 00:29:59,507.821 Hey, and my distributor loves that. 591 00:29:59,507.821 --> 00:30:05,987.821 And then, you know, the other thing, and I say this when I go, you know, you're sitting in a car with a salesperson for the day, basically. 592 00:30:06,37.821 --> 00:30:14,197.821 Part of it is them hearing you say the same thing to five or six accounts during the day and understand the, the story behind the wine and that there's a person behind the wine. 593 00:30:14,197.821 --> 00:30:16,297.821 That that's a big deal for a lot of retailers. 594 00:30:16,357.821 --> 00:30:16,627.821 Oh yeah. 595 00:30:16,627.821 --> 00:30:17,707.821 Especially where I'm in. 596 00:30:17,707.821 --> 00:30:19,627.821 I'm, you know, I'm not a giant producer or anything. 597 00:30:19,627.821 --> 00:30:19,687.821 Yeah. 598 00:30:19,687.821 --> 00:30:21,37.821 They wanna go, Hey, I met that guy. 599 00:30:21,37.821 --> 00:30:22,807.821 There's a real person who makes that wine. 600 00:30:22,897.821 --> 00:30:27,187.821 Right? It's not some, you know, constellation brand or Pinot Ricard or something. 601 00:30:27,187.821 --> 00:30:27,247.821 Yeah. 602 00:30:27,277.821 --> 00:30:28,987.821 There's a big corporation behind it. 603 00:30:29,407.821 --> 00:30:33,977.821 So, that really helps drive the sale and then it continues on after that. 604 00:30:34,7.821 --> 00:30:34,67.821 Yeah. 605 00:30:34,67.821 --> 00:30:38,477.821 'cause they go, yeah, I like Decibel, I like Dan, I like those wines. 606 00:30:38,507.821 --> 00:30:47,447.821 And hey, you know, then they can go out for the next few weeks and then until maybe the, you know, some markets I might only get to once every two or three years, but Yeah. 607 00:30:47,477.821 --> 00:31:02,947.821 But Philly, Jersey, New York, I try to get to, you know, at least one of those on every trip because we know, you know, I can come see some family, I can stay for free, I can borrow some cars, I can, get some free meals, you know, so that's a, that, that's a big. 608 00:31:03,222.821 --> 00:31:06,282.821 Advantage I have over a lot of New Zealand producers, you know? Yeah. 609 00:31:06,342.821 --> 00:31:06,912.821 That is. 610 00:31:07,232.821 --> 00:31:10,862.821 and so are you distributed in all, in all, like all 50 states? No. 611 00:31:10,862.821 --> 00:31:14,652.821 So, but we're a lot more, probably like 25 now. 612 00:31:14,652.821 --> 00:31:14,712.821 Wow. 613 00:31:14,797.821 --> 00:31:15,37.821 Or something. 614 00:31:15,37.821 --> 00:31:21,207.821 Oh, that's so, California, Oregon, Washington, Kansas, Texas, Oklahoma, Arizona. 615 00:31:21,687.821 --> 00:31:26,667.821 just left Illinois, but going back in soon because somebody went bankrupt, but we're going back in. 616 00:31:26,757.821 --> 00:31:26,847.821 Yeah. 617 00:31:26,847.821 --> 00:31:27,112.821 Good, good. 618 00:31:27,117.821 --> 00:31:34,947.821 Ohio, Michigan, Pennsylvania, New York, Massachusetts, North Carolina, South Carolina, Florida. 619 00:31:35,772.821 --> 00:31:37,542.821 Yeah, we were in Louisiana. 620 00:31:37,542.821 --> 00:31:40,192.821 I don't think we are now, but some good states in there. 621 00:31:40,192.821 --> 00:31:40,612.821 Michigan. 622 00:31:40,612.821 --> 00:31:43,292.821 Michigan's a great wine, And I'm glad you have Texas. 623 00:31:43,292.821 --> 00:31:44,702.821 Texas usually is pretty big. 624 00:31:45,142.821 --> 00:31:48,952.821 The wine industry is like, you know, so we have one agent. 625 00:31:48,952.821 --> 00:31:50,452.821 It's a bit like Pennsylvania in a way. 626 00:31:50,722.821 --> 00:31:54,802.821 'cause we have like the PLCB, some of the specialty stores have our Sauvignon Blanc. 627 00:31:54,832.821 --> 00:31:55,222.821 Yes. 628 00:31:55,222.821 --> 00:31:55,282.821 Yeah. 629 00:31:55,312.821 --> 00:32:00,492.821 Well, you're not really selling a lot of wine in Texas unless you're with the specs and the supermarkets there. 630 00:32:00,582.821 --> 00:32:00,762.821 Yes. 631 00:32:00,812.821 --> 00:32:02,922.821 They actually have amazing wine Collections. 632 00:32:02,922.821 --> 00:32:04,902.821 It's not like, oh, this is just supermarket wine. 633 00:32:04,912.821 --> 00:32:06,682.821 they're the big retailers there. 634 00:32:07,72.821 --> 00:32:07,942.821 So we have one. 635 00:32:08,317.821 --> 00:32:10,207.821 outfit that just sells to them. 636 00:32:10,207.821 --> 00:32:10,267.821 Yeah. 637 00:32:10,357.821 --> 00:32:19,312.821 And then we actually have a guy who I met up with on my trip in Houston, two weeks ago, who does all our other wines and he does all small retailers and restaurants. 638 00:32:19,317.821 --> 00:32:19,377.821 Oh. 639 00:32:19,377.821 --> 00:32:23,332.821 And so he is focusing on the Shena Blanc and the Malbac and the Pinot and stuff like that. 640 00:32:23,362.821 --> 00:32:23,877.821 Oh, that's, yeah. 641 00:32:23,937.821 --> 00:32:26,397.821 and there's scenarios like that all over. 642 00:32:26,397.821 --> 00:32:29,37.821 And, you know, we again, get the wine to the people. 643 00:32:29,182.821 --> 00:32:29,542.821 Yeah. 644 00:32:29,542.821 --> 00:32:29,962.821 It's hard. 645 00:32:29,962.821 --> 00:32:30,262.821 yeah. 646 00:32:30,262.821 --> 00:32:37,312.821 And it's the part of the job that people don't realize that if you are the wine maker, you're the owner, you move they to talk to me, they want talk to me. 647 00:32:37,312.821 --> 00:32:37,372.821 Yeah. 648 00:32:37,427.821 --> 00:32:40,642.821 And, and that's everybody across the of the United States. 649 00:32:41,692.821 --> 00:32:45,22.821 And you have 50 different markets with all, every, that has their own laws. 650 00:32:45,352.821 --> 00:32:48,262.821 So it's not like you can just make one deal across the country. 651 00:32:48,502.821 --> 00:32:54,872.821 No, it's 50 markets, it's 50 countries, occasionally we have distributors in two states, and you can bounce around a little bit. 652 00:32:54,872.821 --> 00:33:00,411.821 But again, America's very big, if you say, I'm in Charlotte and I'm in, I don't know, Myrtle Beach, two different states. 653 00:33:00,411.821 --> 00:33:01,371.821 that's a long drive. 654 00:33:01,371.821 --> 00:33:02,421.821 No, yeah. 655 00:33:02,421.821 --> 00:33:04,311.821 And there's to fly is not worth it. 656 00:33:04,646.821 --> 00:33:06,471.821 Yeah, yeah. 657 00:33:06,471.821 --> 00:33:07,791.821 That you just eat up everything. 658 00:33:07,821.821 --> 00:33:08,91.821 Yeah. 659 00:33:08,91.821 --> 00:33:08,611.821 And, yeah. 660 00:33:08,911.821 --> 00:33:11,971.821 That is, and this is, it's the beautiful part. 661 00:33:12,181.821 --> 00:33:17,791.821 It's also allows a very small operation to succeed too, and. 662 00:33:18,76.821 --> 00:33:19,966.821 Which is one of the funny parts about America. 663 00:33:19,966.821 --> 00:33:23,566.821 Like since we, you know, it's the one piece of our Yeah, sure. 664 00:33:23,566.821 --> 00:33:25,936.821 Interstate commerce except for alcohol. 665 00:33:26,146.821 --> 00:33:26,356.821 Yeah. 666 00:33:26,356.821 --> 00:33:40,36.821 So except for wine, you know, like this one caveat that's cut out from prohibition, but it does allow us, because to be honest, I don't think either you or I would exist if it was one large market. 667 00:33:40,66.821 --> 00:33:44,146.821 Like no, we would have to, we would have to be competing against, it would be too corporate. 668 00:33:44,146.821 --> 00:33:44,836.821 The gallows. 669 00:33:44,836.821 --> 00:33:44,956.821 Yeah. 670 00:33:44,956.821 --> 00:33:45,796.821 And it would just be, yeah. 671 00:33:45,796.821 --> 00:33:55,816.821 And we would just be a little and we'd, you know, just take, we'd be sitting there, but you know, I, you're successful 'cause you're good and you're willing to work hard and you're willing to actually really it do what you need to do. 672 00:33:56,86.821 --> 00:34:08,66.821 And how much of your time, like you think every year is done building markets, servicing markets rather than just wine making, you know? Just how much? 20%, 30% of year? Probably. 673 00:34:08,306.821 --> 00:34:09,356.821 Definitely over 30. 674 00:34:09,386.821 --> 00:34:09,806.821 Yeah. 675 00:34:09,866.821 --> 00:34:10,106.821 Wow. 676 00:34:10,106.821 --> 00:34:10,346.821 Yeah. 677 00:34:10,446.821 --> 00:34:17,106.821 you know, thankfully I work with growers and I had worked on a lot of vineyards the first sort of half dozen years there. 678 00:34:17,166.821 --> 00:34:23,76.821 And, I've done my time pruning and things like that, so I'm not going back to pruning or anything, it was very good. 679 00:34:23,76.821 --> 00:34:28,566.821 Like, I always kind of had a vision in my head that I, honestly, I'd never thought I'd go to New Zealand and become a winemaker. 680 00:34:28,566.821 --> 00:34:30,396.821 That sounded like I'd be an astronaut, you know? Right. 681 00:34:30,396.821 --> 00:34:30,736.821 Oh, yeah. 682 00:34:30,736.821 --> 00:34:36,441.821 But I thought I'll go there and learn about it, and then when I talk to winemakers, they won't be able to pull the wool over my eyes, you know? Right. 683 00:34:36,441.821 --> 00:34:36,981.821 So, yeah. 684 00:34:37,201.821 --> 00:34:43,411.821 but it, it, to an extent, the vineyard side of the business is that way, and that they know, I know what I'm talking about. 685 00:34:43,421.821 --> 00:34:44,861.821 They know I've worked in vineyards. 686 00:34:44,891.821 --> 00:34:47,561.821 They know that, I've done it and I can relate. 687 00:34:47,561.821 --> 00:34:51,371.821 And also I'm empathetic with their problems and what it costs to do. 688 00:34:51,401.821 --> 00:34:52,391.821 and how hard it is. 689 00:34:52,441.821 --> 00:35:01,551.821 I'm trying to get people to transition to organic growing and that's usually a three year hit, at least the first two years where your crop goes down a little bit and then it comes back. 690 00:35:01,551.821 --> 00:35:02,601.821 Much more resilient. 691 00:35:02,641.821 --> 00:35:08,901.821 Thicker skins more resilient to inclement weather, which is, you know, with climate change, is one of our bigger issues in New Zealand. 692 00:35:09,411.821 --> 00:35:20,281.821 so, but you know, going back to what you said about the, you know, I mentioned all that stuff about, the work you put in to get your wine out in the market, it still goes back to. 693 00:35:20,941.821 --> 00:35:28,1.821 the idea that wine is such a unique product, such a unique thing in that, it's a vintage, And then we can look back. 694 00:35:28,361.821 --> 00:35:31,151.821 Is there anything else? I'm sure you must talk about this in your classes. 695 00:35:31,151.821 --> 00:35:43,481.821 Is there anything else that is in the world that we can look back and go, what was it like 20 years ago? What was it like 10 years ago? Maybe a literature or a song or something, but not, no, nothing like a physical thing that you can taste and feel and everything. 696 00:35:43,481.821 --> 00:36:00,831.821 So the idea that this product can travel from New Zealand to the other side of the world, and somebody in Chicago can pour a glass of my wine and maybe they were lucky enough to come to New Zealand and they can smell that wine and go, fuck, I love New Zealand. 697 00:36:00,831.821 --> 00:36:01,71.821 You know? Yeah. 698 00:36:01,101.821 --> 00:36:06,441.821 I remember when I was there in 2010 and this da da da and, and there's really nothing else like that. 699 00:36:06,441.821 --> 00:36:06,921.821 I don't know. 700 00:36:06,951.821 --> 00:36:08,31.821 You know, there is nothing. 701 00:36:08,31.821 --> 00:36:12,871.821 And, you know, and outside of the technology of us talking, On a podcast. 702 00:36:13,21.821 --> 00:36:15,481.821 They're the same conversations happening for 4,000 years. 703 00:36:15,561.821 --> 00:36:28,431.821 And that's the weird, like in the same effect, the Canaanites were shipping their awesome wines from Asia and the Middle East, taking it to what now is Italy, and people having the conversation about how awesome it is. 704 00:36:28,431.821 --> 00:36:31,221.821 Like, we have all this, we do know this. 705 00:36:31,271.821 --> 00:36:41,136.821 it travels, the alcohol preserves it, and it's always been this thing that's absolutely below it's a, and there's, the argument is, is that in fact, actually it existed before we were modern humans. 706 00:36:41,456.821 --> 00:36:44,36.821 I mean, even, even monkeys love booze. 707 00:36:44,246.821 --> 00:36:44,306.821 Yeah. 708 00:36:44,396.821 --> 00:36:44,966.821 They do. 709 00:36:45,146.821 --> 00:36:46,46.821 They can seek it out. 710 00:36:46,46.821 --> 00:36:46,676.821 They find it. 711 00:36:46,676.821 --> 00:36:46,976.821 Yeah. 712 00:36:46,976.821 --> 00:36:50,516.821 I, you know, the, yeah, of course it's all carbonic because it's all fermented inside. 713 00:36:50,516.821 --> 00:36:50,816.821 It is. 714 00:36:50,816.821 --> 00:36:52,226.821 'cause it buries us how they ferment. 715 00:36:52,256.821 --> 00:36:52,526.821 Yeah. 716 00:36:52,616.821 --> 00:36:53,456.821 You know, even before. 717 00:36:53,756.821 --> 00:36:55,726.821 And even up to the moment where, Oh yeah. 718 00:36:55,726.821 --> 00:37:06,16.821 'cause again, I do teach advanced, I tell you, I have, along with the TIR program, I teach a ancient wine program, which is just, I taught it just largely 'cause I wanted to know more. 719 00:37:06,146.821 --> 00:37:06,915.821 Oh, it's amazing. 720 00:37:06,945.821 --> 00:37:07,425.821 No, it is. 721 00:37:07,425.821 --> 00:37:09,165.821 But the thing you're talking about here Yeah. 722 00:37:09,165.821 --> 00:37:19,575.821 Is just that making something here, and it is just this thing that, you know, that story, that story of it is a very, very old story and people worry that, oh, like Gen Z isn't drinking as much. 723 00:37:19,575.821 --> 00:37:20,925.821 It's like, wait till they hear the story. 724 00:37:20,980.821 --> 00:37:24,70.821 The actual story, not the bullshit that they hear. 725 00:37:24,460.821 --> 00:37:39,120.821 but the actual authentic story that we are involved in, I, I think that, you know, everybody's in a little bit of a panic in the industry right now, and I think it's because the industry got a little fat and a little bit oversupplied and a little bit like, we're gonna take advantage and we're just gonna mass produce certain things Yeah. 726 00:37:39,120.821 --> 00:37:39,300.821 and the. 727 00:37:39,590.821 --> 00:37:41,870.821 generation, whatever, one or two behind me. 728 00:37:42,260.821 --> 00:37:56,830.821 I think they just want to hear those stories and they wanna meet the person and when that happens, we sell plenty of wine, but going back to what you said about like that kind of old thinking, I had a, just reminded me, I was, believe it or not, with two brain surgeons the other night after this tasting. 729 00:37:56,830.821 --> 00:38:00,100.821 And we were sitting around and he's just fascinated by wine. 730 00:38:00,130.821 --> 00:38:12,350.821 It was a, and so is the woman who was a colleague of his, she joined us a little later, but he said something really cool, that wine is something that really separates us from the rest of the animals in the plant. 731 00:38:12,350.821 --> 00:38:15,840.821 And I said, what do you mean? He goes, well, listen, there's three things that give us humanity. 732 00:38:15,840.821 --> 00:38:18,540.821 And I said, what's that? And he goes, we make wine. 733 00:38:18,590.821 --> 00:38:21,830.821 We bake bread and we drill holes in people's skulls. 734 00:38:23,390.821 --> 00:38:26,770.821 cause there's no other animals And he said, and you can go back for thousands of years. 735 00:38:26,770.821 --> 00:38:28,600.821 And people were drilling holes in people's heads. 736 00:38:28,605.821 --> 00:38:28,926.821 They were, yeah. 737 00:38:28,926.821 --> 00:38:30,275.821 But the Romans were, and pretty effectively too. 738 00:38:30,275.821 --> 00:38:33,455.821 and in South America they were doing the Incas and Miles. 739 00:38:33,455.821 --> 00:38:34,535.821 drilling holes, you know. 740 00:38:34,565.821 --> 00:38:38,615.821 That's hilarious because I thought you were gonna say language like, nah, Uhuh not anymore. 741 00:38:39,5.821 --> 00:38:39,215.821 No. 742 00:38:39,215.821 --> 00:38:40,235.821 There's plenty of language coming on. 743 00:38:40,235.821 --> 00:38:40,715.821 Oh my God. 744 00:38:40,715.821 --> 00:38:41,405.821 That is hilarious. 745 00:38:41,435.821 --> 00:38:42,35.821 I love that. 746 00:38:42,35.821 --> 00:38:43,535.821 I love that definition of humanity. 747 00:38:43,540.821 --> 00:38:45,155.821 That's a yeah, that's a very new one. 748 00:38:45,275.821 --> 00:38:46,865.821 yeah, no, yeah, yeah. 749 00:38:47,525.821 --> 00:38:48,305.821 That, yeah. 750 00:38:48,515.821 --> 00:38:52,455.821 We're not gonna be seeing any, whales, any or orcas, drilling holes in heads. 751 00:38:52,455.821 --> 00:38:52,755.821 No. 752 00:38:52,785.821 --> 00:38:54,430.821 Although I think the orcas would do it if they could. 753 00:38:54,430.821 --> 00:38:55,120.821 They're pretty smart. 754 00:38:55,125.821 --> 00:38:55,565.821 Yeah, they're smart. 755 00:38:55,660.821 --> 00:38:55,780.821 Yeah. 756 00:38:55,780.821 --> 00:38:56,470.821 And they're mean too. 757 00:38:56,470.821 --> 00:38:58,270.821 We get them around, Hawks Bay actually. 758 00:38:58,360.821 --> 00:38:59,320.821 Oh my God. 759 00:38:59,320.821 --> 00:39:00,850.821 get pods of orcas come through. 760 00:39:00,850.821 --> 00:39:04,270.821 My wife and daughter saw 'em, you know, six months ago come through. 761 00:39:04,310.821 --> 00:39:05,270.821 Do you like just get like. 762 00:39:05,585.821 --> 00:39:12,365.821 Get some like, like some, that'd be fun to have like a OrCAD watching trip and just like, you know, throw baby seals into the water. 763 00:39:12,365.821 --> 00:39:13,130.821 Think to watch you get eaten. 764 00:39:14,195.821 --> 00:39:15,875.821 They do that at South Island. 765 00:39:15,925.821 --> 00:39:16,765.821 they have whale. 766 00:39:17,215.821 --> 00:39:20,245.821 I've never been on one, but they do those boats that go out and you can see whales. 767 00:39:20,275.821 --> 00:39:21,800.821 Yes, I've seen a whale out at Cape. 768 00:39:21,800.821 --> 00:39:22,40.821 Oh yeah. 769 00:39:22,195.821 --> 00:39:23,305.821 Cape Rangi top. 770 00:39:23,335.821 --> 00:39:28,980.821 You can see whales like more and more these days, but, orcas I think are a little less predictable, but unless you got some seals in the water. 771 00:39:29,10.821 --> 00:39:29,655.821 Yeah, I know, right. 772 00:39:29,655.821 --> 00:39:30,195.821 Exactly. 773 00:39:30,195.821 --> 00:39:30,645.821 Yeah. 774 00:39:30,645.821 --> 00:39:33,395.821 You know, there's plenty of seals on the south island of New Zealand particularly. 775 00:39:33,395.821 --> 00:39:34,745.821 I mentioned Christchurch earlier. 776 00:39:35,165.821 --> 00:39:35,495.821 Yes. 777 00:39:35,605.821 --> 00:39:37,925.821 the coast down there above Christchurch. 778 00:39:37,925.821 --> 00:39:40,835.821 There's all these seals and you, there'll be some work not too far away. 779 00:39:40,840.821 --> 00:39:40,970.821 Oh yeah. 780 00:39:40,970.821 --> 00:39:41,210.821 Oh yeah. 781 00:39:41,210.821 --> 00:39:41,810.821 They get hungry. 782 00:39:42,150.821 --> 00:39:42,570.821 Oh yeah. 783 00:39:42,725.821 --> 00:39:49,395.821 Like, the National Wine School, main studios are in, Midcoast, Maine and they're there because part of my contract was 'cause the. 784 00:39:49,950.821 --> 00:39:51,420.821 The, school's headquarters in Vermont. 785 00:39:51,420.821 --> 00:39:53,100.821 I'm like, ah, now I much prefer the water. 786 00:39:53,340.821 --> 00:40:03,660.821 So we, they actually built our studio and a house on the property which is awesome, but when you go to the nearby beach, you do have to like, 'cause when their seals are around, the great whites are out. 787 00:40:03,660.821 --> 00:40:05,390.821 Oh, so you have to like tread lightly. 788 00:40:05,390.821 --> 00:40:06,140.821 Tread lightly. 789 00:40:06,140.821 --> 00:40:06,320.821 Yeah. 790 00:40:06,320.821 --> 00:40:08,990.821 Go in with a friend, someone smaller, someone more tasty. 791 00:40:08,990.821 --> 00:40:12,850.821 You know, I always bring my wife out with me, which is probably, she thinks it's a couple thing. 792 00:40:12,850.821 --> 00:40:14,230.821 I'm like, no, they're gonna eat you first, honey. 793 00:40:17,890.821 --> 00:40:18,610.821 That's cold. 794 00:40:18,760.821 --> 00:40:20,50.821 It is, it is. 795 00:40:20,50.821 --> 00:40:21,130.821 It's self preservation. 796 00:40:21,130.821 --> 00:40:21,580.821 I know. 797 00:40:21,790.821 --> 00:40:25,60.821 Or when I have my dog out with me out swimming and I'm like, don't get eaten. 798 00:40:25,800.821 --> 00:40:26,970.821 however dark. 799 00:40:27,120.821 --> 00:40:27,690.821 so. 800 00:40:28,455.821 --> 00:40:30,45.821 Seals watching. 801 00:40:30,45.821 --> 00:40:34,135.821 I think it would be a great business opportunity for anyone in New Zealand to actually have Orca watching. 802 00:40:34,705.821 --> 00:40:38,15.821 But this is like true, like who we are, the, the, being. 803 00:40:38,15.821 --> 00:40:43,315.821 It's funny how to make a transition from, truly holes in heads and, you know, and, and orcas eating baby, seals. 804 00:40:43,315.821 --> 00:40:43,465.821 Yeah. 805 00:40:43,825.821 --> 00:40:51,755.821 but, I do, I am curious though, like finishing, you know, like you did mention global warming and heat indexes. 806 00:40:51,755.821 --> 00:40:54,935.821 I assume our heat is rising because we're having issues. 807 00:40:54,935.821 --> 00:41:01,100.821 Some places in the United States, like Balmouth Valley, it's heat in the excess has actually keeps going up and up. 808 00:41:01,475.821 --> 00:41:01,805.821 Yeah. 809 00:41:01,885.821 --> 00:41:15,485.821 parts of California are not, some are like Napa is, but then like Washington State, Columbia Valley is not like we're, we're, we're seeing resilience in some places and real impacts in others and really don't know why yet. 810 00:41:15,515.821 --> 00:41:23,825.821 So what's going on? Like, are you seeing this happen happening? I think, First of all, Hawks Bay going back for, I don't know how many 30, 40 years could rip in Cabernet. 811 00:41:23,825.821 --> 00:41:25,565.821 10 outta 10 years, we don't have an issue. 812 00:41:25,595.821 --> 00:41:25,925.821 Right. 813 00:41:25,955.821 --> 00:41:37,680.821 with a great long dry growing season, but with the caveat Is that, now we are seeing a little bit more weather incidents, so if we get easterlies or if the ocean temperature's warm. 814 00:41:37,730.821 --> 00:41:40,40.821 we got a huge cyclone in 2023. 815 00:41:40,90.821 --> 00:41:41,650.821 Now that was supposed to be a one in. 816 00:41:42,220.821 --> 00:41:50,970.821 100 year storm and it's turned out to be a one and 50 year storm now, It's not happening overnight, but that knocked out a lot of vineyards and, caused a lot of issues. 817 00:41:51,400.821 --> 00:41:54,190.821 some were fine because they were later ripening and everything. 818 00:41:54,530.821 --> 00:42:00,80.821 We always do seem to get a little bit of rain in March that forces our hand with picking some of the whites and things. 819 00:42:00,320.821 --> 00:42:01,220.821 Oh, that would be. 820 00:42:01,360.821 --> 00:42:04,450.821 and so people understand we're inverse of, of here. 821 00:42:04,990.821 --> 00:42:06,10.821 That's anti is welcome. 822 00:42:06,230.821 --> 00:42:07,280.821 So this is like harvest. 823 00:42:07,280.821 --> 00:42:08,270.821 north is warmer. 824 00:42:08,300.821 --> 00:42:08,600.821 Yeah. 825 00:42:09,440.821 --> 00:42:13,580.821 and cyclones go in the opposite direction of hurricanes, but they're the same thing. 826 00:42:14,540.821 --> 00:42:15,650.821 Oh, I did not know that. 827 00:42:15,650.821 --> 00:42:15,651.821 Yeah. 828 00:42:15,656.821 --> 00:42:15,710.821 Yeah. 829 00:42:15,710.821 --> 00:42:16,70.821 Look at that. 830 00:42:16,70.821 --> 00:42:17,30.821 You learned some trivia. 831 00:42:17,120.821 --> 00:42:17,630.821 Oh wow. 832 00:42:17,690.821 --> 00:42:18,290.821 That's not trivia. 833 00:42:18,290.821 --> 00:42:18,830.821 That's important. 834 00:42:18,830.821 --> 00:42:21,320.821 I'm like, how do I not know this? This is bad. 835 00:42:21,320.821 --> 00:42:21,560.821 Okay. 836 00:42:21,560.821 --> 00:42:21,710.821 All right. 837 00:42:21,760.821 --> 00:42:30,250.821 and so yeah, we see some more weather incidents, but to me that is all the more reason and, and, and why a lot more people are going. 838 00:42:30,575.821 --> 00:42:38,105.821 to organic wine growing because having a floor of grass under the vines mops up a lot of water. 839 00:42:38,135.821 --> 00:42:38,765.821 Yes, it does. 840 00:42:38,825.821 --> 00:42:50,75.821 And if we need to make premium wines, like, it's getting to the stage, not quite there, but it is going there where if you're a mid-size, certainly a, you know, or smaller producing, you say I'm a premium. 841 00:42:50,555.821 --> 00:42:53,495.821 If you're not organic, people are starting to go. 842 00:42:53,495.821 --> 00:42:56,555.821 Why not? You know, because, it just means you're not spending the money. 843 00:42:56,555.821 --> 00:42:59,45.821 Craigie range is in a big conversion right now. 844 00:42:59,45.821 --> 00:43:03,525.821 they're gonna, you know, the one when they flipped a few years back, I was working for them. 845 00:43:03,775.821 --> 00:43:09,655.821 All of a sudden out another winery up the road went Alpha Domus and that, and they start going, oh shit, you know, we better do this too. 846 00:43:09,715.821 --> 00:43:11,305.821 Oh, alpha Dous went organic. 847 00:43:11,355.821 --> 00:43:11,975.821 Oh wow. 848 00:43:11,975.821 --> 00:43:12,520.821 Oh yeah. 849 00:43:12,580.821 --> 00:43:16,150.821 So, so all of a sudden they start going, Hmm, we better too. 850 00:43:16,180.821 --> 00:43:18,910.821 You know, we kinda always wanted to, we know it's the right thing to do. 851 00:43:18,940.821 --> 00:43:19,210.821 Yeah. 852 00:43:19,450.821 --> 00:43:28,280.821 And, but it's for a few reasons is, you know, you talked to old George Fisch from, Villa Maria, and he would always say Our most resilient vineyards are the certified organic ones. 853 00:43:28,280.821 --> 00:43:32,800.821 It's, you know, you get, you definitely get spon or, or, more elasticity in the skins. 854 00:43:33,190.821 --> 00:43:33,310.821 Yes. 855 00:43:33,310.821 --> 00:43:38,740.821 The Raku, which is like the little bit of stem that attaches to the berry Yes. 856 00:43:38,800.821 --> 00:43:44,20.821 That gets a little bit more elongated and so the berries are more open and you get more airflow. 857 00:43:44,50.821 --> 00:43:44,350.821 Yeah. 858 00:43:44,560.821 --> 00:43:47,740.821 That's through like foliar sprays and nutrients through there. 859 00:43:47,770.821 --> 00:43:49,870.821 Instead of just the old whack it with weed spray. 860 00:43:49,870.821 --> 00:43:56,440.821 And nowadays New Zealand, some of my friends will knock, sustainable wine growing New Zealand 'cause they say it's not quite enough. 861 00:43:56,470.821 --> 00:43:57,220.821 And, they're right. 862 00:43:57,220.821 --> 00:44:08,620.821 But I think what New Zealand Wine Growers has done a good job by instilling that whatever it was 20 years ago, is it gave everybody a really good sort of first step in that direction. 863 00:44:08,620.821 --> 00:44:13,420.821 And they really kept a keen eye on a lot of the sprays out there. 864 00:44:13,670.821 --> 00:44:17,690.821 they basically had withholding limits on a lot of the pesticides and herbicides. 865 00:44:17,720.821 --> 00:44:19,370.821 So that you just couldn't use 'em anyway. 866 00:44:19,370.821 --> 00:44:27,670.821 They didn't make sense to use 'em because if you, you know, say like a, like an herbicide or a pesticide because, your fruit's getting a little ripe. 867 00:44:27,720.821 --> 00:44:34,850.821 And, there's some fungus going on Well, if you can't pick the wine for another 45 days, that's gonna throw you out the window anyway. 868 00:44:34,880.821 --> 00:44:36,500.821 You wouldn't wanna spray it in January. 869 00:44:36,500.821 --> 00:44:37,520.821 It doesn't make any sense. 870 00:44:37,790.821 --> 00:44:38,90.821 Yeah. 871 00:44:38,90.821 --> 00:44:38,210.821 You, yeah. 872 00:44:38,215.821 --> 00:44:41,90.821 So all, all right, well, I guess we gotta find other solutions. 873 00:44:41,90.821 --> 00:44:47,840.821 So then we find these soaps in bio things and different, you know, and so that's how technology Yes. 874 00:44:47,840.821 --> 00:44:49,400.821 Catches up by demand, you know? Yeah. 875 00:44:49,405.821 --> 00:44:49,415.821 Absolute. 876 00:44:49,435.821 --> 00:44:49,815.821 Oh, absolutely. 877 00:44:49,815.821 --> 00:44:55,70.821 So these companies go, okay, well you can't use that anymore, so we're gonna come in with this, these bio sprays and things like that. 878 00:44:55,70.821 --> 00:44:58,320.821 and which are way better for the environment and way better for people. 879 00:44:58,440.821 --> 00:44:58,680.821 Oh yeah. 880 00:44:58,710.821 --> 00:45:00,900.821 And the other thing is like, if you're. 881 00:45:01,380.821 --> 00:45:13,970.821 trying to make premium wine, yeah, there is, you know, you will crop lower if you're organic, but you will crop better and you'll get more concentration, you'll get better fruit, you know, and, you know, that's, the name of the game is not, it's no longer volume. 882 00:45:14,0.821 --> 00:45:14,240.821 Mm-hmm. 883 00:45:14,300.821 --> 00:45:17,930.821 It can't be, I think right now, the market right now is teaching us that, you know? Yeah. 884 00:45:18,80.821 --> 00:45:19,40.821 Oh yeah. 885 00:45:19,140.821 --> 00:45:23,180.821 and this was, coming for a long time 'cause it was pretty obvious 'cause beer got hit first. 886 00:45:23,230.821 --> 00:45:34,720.821 And, you know, I would watch, and I've been watching 'cause one of the things I always do is the smartest people in the wine industry, the people who actually, or in the beer and in the liquor biz. 887 00:45:35,680.821 --> 00:45:36,640.821 They know what sells. 888 00:45:36,640.821 --> 00:45:42,730.821 It's the wine shop, like the little shop owners, even the little bodegas, like you walk into a bodega, they know what sells. 889 00:45:42,980.821 --> 00:45:44,510.821 and so they're gonna give more shelf space to it. 890 00:45:44,510.821 --> 00:45:51,290.821 So I would roll into like the local bodegas and see how much, you know, they always had the great beer selection, tiny wine selection. 891 00:45:51,650.821 --> 00:45:56,990.821 But then all of a sudden you start seeing the wine staying static, but the beer slowly disappearing. 892 00:45:57,230.821 --> 00:46:00,470.821 And what's there instead? those, seltzers. 893 00:46:00,500.821 --> 00:46:00,950.821 RTDs. 894 00:46:00,950.821 --> 00:46:01,820.821 Exactly. 895 00:46:02,120.821 --> 00:46:03,20.821 ready to drinks. 896 00:46:03,50.821 --> 00:46:08,380.821 and that as I saw that going over the years, I'm like, oh, beer is dead. 897 00:46:08,470.821 --> 00:46:09,670.821 and that was scary to watch it. 898 00:46:09,670.821 --> 00:46:13,30.821 And, because in fact, I run the Philly Beer School too, and we saw that. 899 00:46:13,35.821 --> 00:46:17,110.821 I was like, okay, we we're gonna have to, supplant a lot of our beer producing classes. 900 00:46:17,110.821 --> 00:46:19,900.821 We, because there's not gonna be anyone down the pike in five years. 901 00:46:19,900.821 --> 00:46:21,460.821 Like there's, nobody's gonna be wanting to make. 902 00:46:21,775.821 --> 00:46:22,495.821 Making beer. 903 00:46:22,495.821 --> 00:46:25,945.821 It's like, it's gonna be dead for, and there's something weird about beer. 904 00:46:25,945.821 --> 00:46:26,965.821 It's, it's very cyclical. 905 00:46:26,965.821 --> 00:46:33,715.821 But so you saw that and you saw like, all right, yeah, the lower end, like Yeah, people have choices and Yeah. 906 00:46:33,715.821 --> 00:46:38,465.821 If you're making a generic product, basically, largely, whatever's the best generic product is gonna win. 907 00:46:38,495.821 --> 00:46:44,15.821 And it just happens to be right now, is those, you know, the modern day zeuss, because I, I grew up with Zema. 908 00:46:44,420.821 --> 00:46:48,485.821 oh my God was gonna say, you've been around long enough like me, where you've seen these things. 909 00:46:48,485.821 --> 00:46:55,145.821 I mean, yeah, think about what beers were around, you know, even when Crossings reopened in the nineties. 910 00:46:55,195.821 --> 00:47:00,925.821 it was rare for us to have Sierra Nevada and Heineken, the people would come to us just because we Oh, because of that. 911 00:47:00,925.821 --> 00:47:09,415.821 I remember when Sam Adams, because it became like, first was released and it was like, it was a revelation, like, oh, this is Oh, beer. 912 00:47:09,475.821 --> 00:47:10,20.821 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 913 00:47:10,315.821 --> 00:47:15,755.821 Oh, I mean, I grew up, I mean, it was, you know, it was, you know, like if you ordered, No import. 914 00:47:15,755.821 --> 00:47:17,765.821 It was, yeah, it was at best Heineken. 915 00:47:17,855.821 --> 00:47:18,95.821 Yeah. 916 00:47:18,100.821 --> 00:47:19,510.821 But everything was Budweiser. 917 00:47:19,510.821 --> 00:47:20,530.821 Like, it was nothing. 918 00:47:20,530.821 --> 00:47:22,590.821 But, it was a, yeah, it came a long way. 919 00:47:22,590.821 --> 00:47:25,470.821 I mean, think about it that way as like, oh, insanely great. 920 00:47:25,470.821 --> 00:47:25,530.821 Yeah. 921 00:47:25,590.821 --> 00:47:34,320.821 And, but it does happen to go through these boom bust cycles because of, you know, 'cause you, you are hitting a, younger clientele, and they are because it's a lower price point. 922 00:47:34,320.821 --> 00:47:38,220.821 And so therefore you are getting, and that is, that, that's, that's very moveable. 923 00:47:38,220.821 --> 00:47:42,600.821 This is the first time in our lifetimes that we saw wine being supplanted by something now. 924 00:47:42,990.821 --> 00:47:44,70.821 And that's scary everyone. 925 00:47:44,340.821 --> 00:47:52,110.821 But I'm, you know, I have to do a lot of research and they say the American wine population, drinking for fine wine isn't changing. 926 00:47:52,170.821 --> 00:47:54,630.821 Definitely not with millennials like they are. 927 00:47:54,840.821 --> 00:47:56,100.821 They just have to make a little bit of money. 928 00:47:56,100.821 --> 00:47:57,810.821 great research has been shown that they just. 929 00:47:58,485.821 --> 00:48:03,505.821 They're spending the same amount of money, per by percentage of their income on fine wine. 930 00:48:03,865.821 --> 00:48:09,535.821 It's just that they're right now not making as much as Gen X or the boomers before them at this time of their life. 931 00:48:09,595.821 --> 00:48:09,745.821 Yeah. 932 00:48:09,985.821 --> 00:48:11,5.821 But they're scaling up. 933 00:48:11,35.821 --> 00:48:12,745.821 They're gonna be there, they're fine. 934 00:48:12,895.821 --> 00:48:13,915.821 They boomers are dying. 935 00:48:13,945.821 --> 00:48:15,476.821 They're gonna get all that money, you know? Yeah. 936 00:48:15,481.821 --> 00:48:16,15.821 They're just, yeah. 937 00:48:16,45.821 --> 00:48:17,185.821 Oh, they're, they're gonna be fine. 938 00:48:17,785.821 --> 00:48:27,865.821 Gen Z I've had a lot of conversations in the wine industry, and winemakers, and they're not worried like, fine wine producers are like, no, they're gonna be here like they are. 939 00:48:27,895.821 --> 00:48:28,910.821 It's just, I agree. 940 00:48:28,910.821 --> 00:48:29,35.821 I agree. 941 00:48:29,65.821 --> 00:48:40,135.821 Right now, like they're at most 27 and honestly, in our classes here, one of the reasons why we run public classes is to see who's showing up for like a food and wine class. 942 00:48:40,135.821 --> 00:48:44,975.821 Like last night one of my instructors did a, a wine and cheese pairing class. 943 00:48:45,365.821 --> 00:48:47,375.821 Now that usually trends older, but. 944 00:48:48,230.821 --> 00:48:50,720.821 It wasn't, it was everyone was in their twenties. 945 00:48:50,900.821 --> 00:48:51,290.821 Oh, that's cool. 946 00:48:51,470.821 --> 00:48:52,820.821 Mid to late twenties. 947 00:48:53,330.821 --> 00:48:54,140.821 And yeah. 948 00:48:54,140.821 --> 00:48:55,940.821 And that's just, it's great market research. 949 00:48:55,940.821 --> 00:49:00,590.821 It's like, oh, the people who are really interested in wine right now are not who you expect. 950 00:49:01,70.821 --> 00:49:06,920.821 And I think, I'm pretty sure it was you that said to me years ago that this school is an affordable luxury. 951 00:49:06,920.821 --> 00:49:08,150.821 I believe you said that. 952 00:49:08,200.821 --> 00:49:09,400.821 I'm wise beyond my ears. 953 00:49:09,405.821 --> 00:49:09,505.821 Yeah. 954 00:49:09,510.821 --> 00:49:12,860.821 that's a really good point Your class is, you know, especially a one off like that. 955 00:49:12,860.821 --> 00:49:16,505.821 It's, you know, so affordable and fun to do and like a great thing to do on a given night. 956 00:49:16,595.821 --> 00:49:17,105.821 Oh yeah. 957 00:49:17,120.821 --> 00:49:17,420.821 Oh yeah. 958 00:49:17,420.821 --> 00:49:20,935.821 And people wanna learn that, so it should kind of skew towards, younger people. 959 00:49:20,935.821 --> 00:49:24,905.821 It's like a fun night out, you know? Oh, and I know, I, I, I love scaring people in the beginning. 960 00:49:24,935.821 --> 00:49:28,85.821 'cause I always know that I'll, they'll love me by the end and I just, I have that. 961 00:49:28,385.821 --> 00:49:32,855.821 No, I just, you know, I, because I just, I just, I have, I have resting wasp face, I call it. 962 00:49:32,855.821 --> 00:49:35,945.821 Like, I just, like, people look at me like, oh, that man is mean. 963 00:49:35,945.821 --> 00:49:37,145.821 And he probably hates me. 964 00:49:37,355.821 --> 00:49:39,65.821 And then he, then I just like start talking. 965 00:49:39,65.821 --> 00:49:40,685.821 He is like, oh, he's just weird. 966 00:49:40,895.821 --> 00:49:41,15.821 Yeah. 967 00:49:44,285.821 --> 00:49:45,305.821 I just thought of something. 968 00:49:45,305.821 --> 00:49:50,545.821 We did a dinner, over somewhere in Fairmont with, some pairing dinner with you. 969 00:49:50,600.821 --> 00:49:50,690.821 Yes. 970 00:49:50,690.821 --> 00:49:52,520.821 And, yeah, it was a, I think it was a SmackDown. 971 00:49:52,580.821 --> 00:49:54,170.821 Yeah, it was a SmackDown, that's right. 972 00:49:54,170.821 --> 00:49:54,535.821 A small SmackDown. 973 00:49:54,585.821 --> 00:49:57,900.821 and I think I had two wines at the time or something, maybe three. 974 00:49:58,290.821 --> 00:50:04,470.821 You ran across the street in the middle of the dinner and went into your school and he came back and he goes, listen, everybody, listen up. 975 00:50:04,710.821 --> 00:50:10,650.821 I just pulled Dan's exam from his last test he took in my school. 976 00:50:10,890.821 --> 00:50:14,220.821 He got every blind wine, right? Nine outta 10. 977 00:50:14,220.821 --> 00:50:16,620.821 You know the one he got wrong, Marlboro? Seven. 978 00:50:16,675.821 --> 00:50:17,245.821 Oh, that's hilarious. 979 00:50:17,305.821 --> 00:50:17,995.821 Oh, that's evil. 980 00:50:18,25.821 --> 00:50:18,740.821 Oh, that's so evil. 981 00:50:19,220.821 --> 00:50:20,155.821 I was like, thanks Keith. 982 00:50:20,425.821 --> 00:50:20,815.821 Thanks buddy. 983 00:50:20,815.821 --> 00:50:20,995.821 Yep. 984 00:50:21,25.821 --> 00:50:21,415.821 Yep. 985 00:50:21,505.821 --> 00:50:21,895.821 That's it. 986 00:50:21,985.821 --> 00:50:22,345.821 That's it. 987 00:50:22,345.821 --> 00:50:23,65.821 That's the only one. 988 00:50:23,65.821 --> 00:50:24,505.821 And here he is trying to like, yeah. 989 00:50:24,565.821 --> 00:50:24,895.821 Nope. 990 00:50:24,955.821 --> 00:50:25,225.821 Nope. 991 00:50:25,255.821 --> 00:50:25,675.821 That's it. 992 00:50:25,705.821 --> 00:50:26,425.821 That's awesome. 993 00:50:26,695.821 --> 00:50:27,415.821 That is awesome. 994 00:50:27,445.821 --> 00:50:34,115.821 That is, that is, that is, yeah, that, yeah, that tracks all too well. 995 00:50:34,145.821 --> 00:50:34,325.821 Yeah. 996 00:50:34,325.821 --> 00:50:34,895.821 That was awesome. 997 00:50:34,925.821 --> 00:50:35,855.821 I, yeah, I do. 998 00:50:36,185.821 --> 00:50:37,565.821 Fairmont was such a great neighborhood. 999 00:50:37,645.821 --> 00:50:40,315.821 so this is fantastic. 1000 00:50:40,315.821 --> 00:50:48,695.821 one thing I just wanna double back just so people understand one thing about, organic Because organic is this big, messy thing in the US there's a big difference between. 1001 00:50:49,10.821 --> 00:50:53,810.821 Wine that is made fermented organically, and then it's grown organically. 1002 00:50:53,810.821 --> 00:50:54,320.821 Exactly. 1003 00:50:54,430.821 --> 00:50:57,610.821 when you're just talking about growing organically, what are you talking about? Yeah. 1004 00:50:57,610.821 --> 00:50:58,210.821 So there are. 1005 00:50:58,555.821 --> 00:50:59,395.821 two different things. 1006 00:50:59,395.821 --> 00:51:02,565.821 And to me, the wine making side is a lot simpler. 1007 00:51:02,565.821 --> 00:51:05,85.821 We just, you know, there's certain products we don't use. 1008 00:51:05,95.821 --> 00:51:06,445.821 I wouldn't use 'em anyway. 1009 00:51:06,495.821 --> 00:51:11,525.821 Most of this stuff, the sulfur levels that, you know, you're under a bit of restriction from. 1010 00:51:11,525.821 --> 00:51:17,45.821 But the weird thing is, in the US you're still not allowed to use potassium out by sulfate and call it organic. 1011 00:51:17,75.821 --> 00:51:20,435.821 but you're allowed to use sulfur gas, which is so dangerous. 1012 00:51:21,515.821 --> 00:51:21,605.821 Yes. 1013 00:51:21,605.821 --> 00:51:22,355.821 It's, oh, it's insane. 1014 00:51:22,595.821 --> 00:51:23,675.821 It's absolutely insane. 1015 00:51:23,735.821 --> 00:51:30,55.821 So that's why I wanna stress this 'cause, and 'cause our, the US laws are so weird when it comes to, SO two use. 1016 00:51:30,115.821 --> 00:51:32,905.821 So, but anyway, go back to the vineyard growing. 1017 00:51:32,905.821 --> 00:51:38,755.821 back to the vineyard, what that means is you can't use weed sprays, you can't use any herbicides or pesticides. 1018 00:51:38,755.821 --> 00:51:40,345.821 I mean, that's the simplest way to put it. 1019 00:51:40,345.821 --> 00:51:40,465.821 Yeah. 1020 00:51:40,805.821 --> 00:51:44,165.821 and it doesn't mean we don't do other things to mitigate weed growth. 1021 00:51:44,165.821 --> 00:51:45,365.821 We do ine mowing. 1022 00:51:45,365.821 --> 00:51:45,815.821 We have. 1023 00:51:45,820.821 --> 00:51:55,690.821 You know, people do they, you know, there typically not much spraying, but we do other things to, you know, they do cultivation or they'll, you know, they do other things to, because Exactly. 1024 00:51:55,690.821 --> 00:51:55,840.821 Yeah. 1025 00:51:55,840.821 --> 00:51:59,500.821 You can't have too much competition around the base of the vine. 1026 00:51:59,620.821 --> 00:51:59,920.821 Right. 1027 00:52:00,100.821 --> 00:52:01,480.821 but some competition is good. 1028 00:52:01,510.821 --> 00:52:01,780.821 Yeah. 1029 00:52:02,60.821 --> 00:52:02,960.821 you know, vines are funny. 1030 00:52:02,960.821 --> 00:52:08,472.821 They like to be just on the edge of being happy and stressed or like raising a kid, you know what I mean? thank you, thank you. 1031 00:52:08,680.821 --> 00:52:15,120.821 That's how I always say, people always get offended when I say that, you know, you wanna like to can't hungry, give a kid everything he wants, or they get spoiled, you know? yeah. 1032 00:52:15,180.821 --> 00:52:16,620.821 No, they'll just be, you know. 1033 00:52:17,280.821 --> 00:52:17,490.821 Yeah. 1034 00:52:17,520.821 --> 00:52:28,840.821 So, there're, there's that and, you know, there's basically, I think that's the simplest way to put it, that is, is organic growing, is no pesticides, no herbicides. 1035 00:52:29,110.821 --> 00:52:33,610.821 The big one is the big hurdle for a lot of people around the world is the weed sprays under the vine. 1036 00:52:33,610.821 --> 00:52:52,370.821 That's why I keep going back to The base because, that is also Kind of the most important thing as well because, there is A kingdom below our feet of microbes and baby things that can contribute to, these amazing symbiotic relationships under your feet in the soil that, can give, vine strength but it's not developed overnight. 1037 00:52:52,370.821 --> 00:52:55,610.821 It takes years and years for your soil health and soil development. 1038 00:52:56,0.821 --> 00:53:06,80.821 There's under vine plantings, we do fix trying to fix nitrogen with clover in between the vines and all these kind of things we do, to help with. 1039 00:53:06,80.821 --> 00:53:12,580.821 It could be, you know, this flower brings these type of, bugs in that fight, these other kind of bugs, you know? Exactly. 1040 00:53:12,580.821 --> 00:53:13,420.821 Yes, exactly. 1041 00:53:13,420.821 --> 00:53:13,630.821 Yeah. 1042 00:53:13,630.821 --> 00:53:16,630.821 Because this is like, this is key to everywhere. 1043 00:53:16,730.821 --> 00:53:17,210.821 and what people. 1044 00:53:17,765.821 --> 00:53:18,635.821 Everything's underground. 1045 00:53:18,635.821 --> 00:53:21,305.821 Like everything that matters is underground. 1046 00:53:21,305.821 --> 00:53:27,600.821 Like, you know, the systems that are playing when people want to talk about te it's like, well, it's also, yeah. 1047 00:53:27,630.821 --> 00:53:38,735.821 No, it's, it's, it is your vine health requires healthy soils that are vibrant and alive, which something we didn't used to do, used to be we, you basically, it's big kill, big change and incorporate, incorporate. 1048 00:53:38,735.821 --> 00:53:45,215.821 Man, man, over nature, we're gonna, you know, but no, we realize we do absolutely need to have those, and yeah. 1049 00:53:45,215.821 --> 00:53:54,355.821 What, what are you like here in California? Be, well, not, not right now in California, but like the glassy wing, sharp shooters are such a problem because of the bacteria that they spread. 1050 00:53:54,715.821 --> 00:53:58,425.821 Well, you know, how do you deal with that? instead of, you can't kill them. 1051 00:53:58,425.821 --> 00:54:03,405.821 So what you do is you create environments for them away from the vineyards, surrounding the vineyards. 1052 00:54:03,585.821 --> 00:54:03,915.821 Exactly. 1053 00:54:03,915.821 --> 00:54:09,325.821 For them to actually, get the plants, the sweet grasses that they want to thrive in. 1054 00:54:09,325.821 --> 00:54:10,375.821 Let them thrive there. 1055 00:54:10,465.821 --> 00:54:10,705.821 Mm-hmm. 1056 00:54:11,245.821 --> 00:54:17,975.821 even to animals, like, how are you gonna deal with unwanted vermin? Well, Raptor Nest are fun and wonderful. 1057 00:54:17,975.821 --> 00:54:20,525.821 I used to, you know, when in Cali, I at least love building those things. 1058 00:54:20,525.821 --> 00:54:29,95.821 You know, you can, like, there's all kinds of ways, no matter what, the systems you're trying there's always a way to actually think about how to build it. 1059 00:54:29,125.821 --> 00:54:38,225.821 Like, even in our, offices in Maine, I built, around our facility, a dead hedge largely because we needed a way so that. 1060 00:54:38,765.821 --> 00:54:42,755.821 Animals aren't coming really close to our studios 'cause they're making a lot of noise. 1061 00:54:43,35.821 --> 00:54:48,165.821 even with the soundproof, you could still hear the animals outside and our dogs, freaking out because there's animals. 1062 00:54:48,165.821 --> 00:54:56,675.821 So you build out a dead hedge and allow you to actually feed that with, give the mice things to eat so that they can actually naturally stop the tick population. 1063 00:54:56,730.821 --> 00:55:02,880.821 if you think about how to build out the systems and help it, you can create incredibly great environments. 1064 00:55:02,910.821 --> 00:55:04,395.821 It just takes a lot of thinking and a lot of work. 1065 00:55:04,395.821 --> 00:55:05,484.821 lot of thinking, a lot of work. 1066 00:55:05,484.821 --> 00:55:06,504.821 Sometimes it's really hard. 1067 00:55:06,504.821 --> 00:55:10,94.821 And, you know, you mentioned the Gibbick gravels earlier where, a lot of my Malbec comes from. 1068 00:55:10,434.821 --> 00:55:13,674.821 it was a river until 1863 and there was an earthquake. 1069 00:55:13,724.821 --> 00:55:17,114.821 The river took a shorter path to the ocean, left all these rocky soils behind. 1070 00:55:17,114.821 --> 00:55:26,544.821 Few Viticulturists, in Hawkes Bay fought the council 'cause they wanted to quarry the whole thing because Old River Stone makes great concrete, Fast forward, now it's like the most expensive land in the country. 1071 00:55:26,544.821 --> 00:55:30,854.821 And there's, every winery around New Zealand wants to have a plot of Gibble gravels. 1072 00:55:30,914.821 --> 00:55:31,214.821 Oh yeah. 1073 00:55:31,244.821 --> 00:55:33,194.821 Because it's really interesting terre wall and everything. 1074 00:55:33,194.821 --> 00:55:40,854.821 But when I first arrived in New Zealand, they were having major virus issues there, with leaf roll, leaf roll three virus. 1075 00:55:40,914.821 --> 00:55:41,34.821 Oh God. 1076 00:55:41,104.821 --> 00:55:44,874.821 there's, planting food research in New Zealand and a couple other outfits. 1077 00:55:44,874.821 --> 00:55:46,614.821 Some of the wineries all got together. 1078 00:55:46,974.821 --> 00:55:53,914.821 And what they were realizing is there was this, what is it called again? these little mites, basically, coming out of the. 1079 00:55:54,289.821 --> 00:55:59,954.821 Ground because there was nothing for them to feed on in the soil because it's all rocky soil. 1080 00:55:59,984.821 --> 00:56:00,194.821 Yeah. 1081 00:56:00,194.821 --> 00:56:03,504.821 They try to come up and and it was a particular problem in the gravels. 1082 00:56:03,504.821 --> 00:56:05,244.821 It was a little bit of an issue in some other areas. 1083 00:56:05,274.821 --> 00:56:07,549.821 And they had to rogue vines and replant and everything. 1084 00:56:07,879.821 --> 00:56:13,159.821 But what they realized is, they need to give them something reason to stay down in the, the ground down. 1085 00:56:13,159.821 --> 00:56:13,519.821 Yeah. 1086 00:56:13,579.821 --> 00:56:16,279.821 Because they were the actual vector of the virus. 1087 00:56:16,329.821 --> 00:56:18,129.821 So they were going up in Yep, yep. 1088 00:56:18,129.821 --> 00:56:26,919.821 And then, so not only that, if you have one vine in the middle of a row that used to know has the virus, you have to rogue the one across from it, the other side and the two next to it as well. 1089 00:56:26,919.821 --> 00:56:27,39.821 Oh god. 1090 00:56:27,129.821 --> 00:56:27,579.821 That's right. 1091 00:56:27,579.821 --> 00:56:34,889.821 So it was big project and it was a really interesting one, where they had GPS tracking on and everything, and they've pretty much got it under control now. 1092 00:56:34,889.821 --> 00:56:38,919.821 But, they really had to watch these little mites that would get up into the Oh wow. 1093 00:56:38,924.821 --> 00:56:40,299.821 And so it was all kind of re and, you know, you. 1094 00:56:40,689.821 --> 00:56:44,619.821 You go up to a vine and you peel back a little, the bark, and you go, there's one right there. 1095 00:56:44,619.821 --> 00:56:45,489.821 That one's got a virus. 1096 00:56:45,489.821 --> 00:56:46,689.821 You know? Oh God. 1097 00:56:46,749.821 --> 00:56:49,209.821 And so that is like a perfect kind of project without like. 1098 00:56:50,34.821 --> 00:56:58,204.821 You know, I'm, I, I don't know this for a fact or where it happened, but I know that there would've been some, like, pretty systematic sprays going on. 1099 00:56:58,234.821 --> 00:57:00,904.821 Oh, let's just nuke 'em, you know? Exactly. 1100 00:57:00,974.821 --> 00:57:02,91.821 and then what happens a year later? It's worse. 1101 00:57:02,474.821 --> 00:57:02,804.821 Yeah. 1102 00:57:03,104.821 --> 00:57:03,584.821 Oh, yeah. 1103 00:57:03,584.821 --> 00:57:07,214.821 now, now they're resistant and now they're like three times the size and they're angry. 1104 00:57:07,244.821 --> 00:57:12,674.821 So then that's where you get inter, inter row plantings and things like that, that they're, they're trying to mitigate in other ways. 1105 00:57:12,984.821 --> 00:57:15,24.821 but so there's, and there's always issues. 1106 00:57:15,24.821 --> 00:57:16,284.821 Every year things change. 1107 00:57:16,284.821 --> 00:57:18,324.821 You know, birds are a big thing for us in New Zealand. 1108 00:57:18,324.821 --> 00:57:19,674.821 We have so many birds in New Zealand. 1109 00:57:19,674.821 --> 00:57:21,534.821 they'll just decimate an entire vineyard. 1110 00:57:21,594.821 --> 00:57:23,334.821 so we net everything. 1111 00:57:23,409.821 --> 00:57:31,769.821 and then the latest technology in the last probably only five years, well, maybe seven years, is fricking lasers. 1112 00:57:32,129.821 --> 00:57:32,849.821 Really? Yeah. 1113 00:57:32,849.821 --> 00:57:36,779.821 So we have these harm, they're very, they don't hurt anybody or anything. 1114 00:57:36,779.821 --> 00:57:36,839.821 Yeah. 1115 00:57:36,839.821 --> 00:57:39,719.821 And they sit at a, light spectrum that we can't really see. 1116 00:57:39,779.821 --> 00:57:40,19.821 Oh. 1117 00:57:40,49.821 --> 00:57:41,399.821 Unless it actually hits the ground. 1118 00:57:41,399.821 --> 00:57:42,509.821 Then you see where it's pointed to. 1119 00:57:42,509.821 --> 00:57:42,899.821 Yeah. 1120 00:57:43,209.821 --> 00:57:44,139.821 but the birds hate 'em. 1121 00:57:44,469.821 --> 00:57:45,544.821 Oh, this is fantastic. 1122 00:57:45,549.821 --> 00:57:50,219.821 And they go random patterns and everything, and now everybody's putting 'em up in the vineyards oh my God. 1123 00:57:50,219.821 --> 00:57:51,689.821 Laser light shows for birds. 1124 00:57:51,689.821 --> 00:57:52,709.821 I mean, come on. 1125 00:57:52,709.821 --> 00:57:53,429.821 This is awesome. 1126 00:57:53,459.821 --> 00:58:02,609.821 No, I lived on a vineyard when they first came out and I was on, lived on one of the first vineyards that had it, and, I was in my kitchen and I saw, you know, a light shine into my kitchen window. 1127 00:58:02,639.821 --> 00:58:04,234.821 What the fuck was that? You're like, scared me. 1128 00:58:04,354.821 --> 00:58:09,144.821 Is this black hawk down? What's going on here? the next day I went out and I was watching it The birds. 1129 00:58:09,144.821 --> 00:58:14,324.821 I swear they were all like huddled behind the headland going what the hell is that? let's get the hell outta here. 1130 00:58:14,374.821 --> 00:58:19,249.821 they're so smart and instinctive that like, if it was a normal pattern, they would pick it up and know it. 1131 00:58:19,309.821 --> 00:58:25,414.821 Oh, really? So it goes on all random patterns and Oh, you have to keep moving it with the ripening of the fruit, God and everything. 1132 00:58:25,414.821 --> 00:58:27,844.821 Well, on that note, this was awesome, man. 1133 00:58:27,844.821 --> 00:58:29,494.821 This was so great to see you again. 1134 00:58:29,494.821 --> 00:58:30,544.821 It's been so long. 1135 00:58:30,854.821 --> 00:58:35,274.821 and I'm sure we went way longer than we thought we would check us out@decibelwines.com. 1136 00:58:35,334.821 --> 00:58:39,654.821 I'm, at Decibel Wines on Instagram and at Decibel. 1137 00:58:39,654.821 --> 00:58:46,674.821 Dan, if you wanna see some more random content, I'm now at Decibel, Dan Zand, on Instagram. 1138 00:58:46,674.821 --> 00:58:50,94.821 And That's more personal stuff, but, drop me a line if you're coming to New Zealand. 1139 00:58:50,144.821 --> 00:58:51,104.821 we love visitors. 1140 00:58:51,104.821 --> 00:58:56,294.821 I know some people, it's like a once in a lifetime trip and I know how long of a trip it is. 1141 00:58:56,294.821 --> 00:59:06,864.821 So I really like to take care of people when they come that far and, figure out what you like to do, whether it's just drink wine the whole time, or you want to go hiking or jump off a cliff or go golfing or surfing. 1142 00:59:06,864.821 --> 00:59:12,144.821 We have amazing surfing there All where all the good restaurants are in, in any given city and place there. 1143 00:59:12,144.821 --> 00:59:14,904.821 So, yeah, feel free to reach out and let's talk. 1144 00:59:14,964.821 --> 00:59:16,14.821 Well, that's perfect, man. 1145 00:59:16,14.821 --> 00:59:16,854.821 Well, on that note. 1146 00:59:16,854.821 --> 00:59:18,774.821 I'm gonna definitely have to come and hang out with you. 1147 00:59:18,954.821 --> 00:59:22,44.821 You gotta take a few weeks off and you don't even have to go to Australia. 1148 00:59:22,44.821 --> 00:59:23,244.821 Just hang in New Zealand though. 1149 00:59:23,304.821 --> 00:59:24,54.821 Thank you so much, man. 1150 00:59:24,54.821 --> 00:59:24,834.821 It was great having you. 1151 00:59:24,839.821 --> 00:59:25,159.821 Awesome. 1152 00:59:25,159.821 --> 00:59:25,559.821 Good to have you. 1153 00:59:27,104.821 --> 00:59:28,834.821 Thanks for listening to After Wine School. 1154 00:59:28,834.821 --> 00:59:34,164.821 If you enjoyed this episode, do us a favor—share it with a friend, leave a review, or post about it. 1155 00:59:34,864.821 --> 00:59:37,984.821 That stuff really helps us keep the corks popping and the mics rolling.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Winemaker Interview with Daniel Brennan of Decibel Wines

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