Stephen Adams - Life Beyond City Hall - Sharks, Stadiums, Spryfield and Building Upward - Afternoon Pint

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Cheers.
Welcome to the Afternoon Pint.
I'm Mike Dobin, I am MattConrad, and who do we have with
us today?
Stephen Adams.

Speaker 3 (00:07):
Stephen Adams.

Speaker 1 (00:08):
Who is Stephen Adams?

Speaker 3 (00:11):
Some guy just outside there talking to people and you
guys asked me if I could talk.

Speaker 2 (00:15):
Yeah, our guest didn't show up today, so we just
saw this guy standing on thestreet now.

Speaker 3 (00:18):
And there's four other guys.
You asked and they refused, soI'm your guy.

Speaker 1 (00:25):
I think you're a pretty good catch.
So, executive director of UDI30 years, 29 years as a
counselor here in Halifax 29.
29.
And 29 years as apharmaceutical rep as well.
Is that right?
27.
, 27.

Speaker 3 (00:34):
Okay, cool.
So 22 of the years I was doingboth Okay cool.

Speaker 1 (00:40):
This is your second time on this show Technically
yeah, technically, this is yoursecond time on this show
Technically yeah, technically,but the first time you would
have only heard that if you hadthe Ideal Home Show.
So I think a lot more peopleare going to get to hear you
this time around.
So thanks for coming back.

Speaker 2 (00:49):
Sure.

Speaker 3 (00:50):
My pleasure.

Speaker 2 (00:51):
Yeah, happy to have you.
I've known Steve a long time.
Steve actually went to highschool with like half of my
family aunts and uncles and myparents.

Speaker 3 (00:59):
And I played hockey and ball with your dad and
uncles, that's right they weregood athletes.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:07):
Oh, dad and his brothers were yeah, they're
pretty good athletes, it's true.

Speaker 2 (01:11):
Steve, we know, you know you were up until just this
year.
You were still quite involvedwith the hockey community.
Well, I still am.

Speaker 3 (01:17):
Yeah, you're still involved.
I still am.

Speaker 2 (01:18):
You kind of relinquished ownership of the.

Speaker 3 (01:26):
Yeah, what I did, you know 14 years started from
scratch and this fellow wasinterested and I said you know,
14 years is a long time, so Itransferred the ownership of the
team, but I'm still involved ina managerial position and I
still love it.
Yeah, I was at the rink Sundaynight.
You had a rebrand.
That was great.
Yeah, yeah, that's right, andthat's one of the logos we had
played around with for a coupleof years just on the website,

(01:47):
right.
So the tack with the shark andDistrict 11, 11 on the tape and
11 teeth at the shark's mouth.
So it's kind of neat.
And I'm still involved.
Like I told people, you won'tknow that I'm no longer the
owner, right?

Speaker 2 (02:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:05):
And, like I told people, you won't know that I'm
no longer the owner, right yeah,and people are saying you know?
They thought I sold it.
I didn't.
I was offered three years ago.
I was offered $20,000 for theteam.

Speaker 2 (02:14):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (02:15):
And I said no Because the fellow who wanted it didn't
want it for the right reasons.
Okay, right, he had a youngfellow and a friend of his
wanted to play.
Yeah, so he wanted to buy ateam.
Yeah, they couldn't play dead,they're not good enough, right?
So I'm not going to compromisethe team.

(02:36):
No, that's fair For a couple ofdollars.

Speaker 2 (02:38):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, so I transferred it over to him.

Speaker 3 (02:41):
He's happy and done some good recruiting.
Yeah, the team will be strongerthan last year's team.
Oh good, yeah, incredible lastyear's team was 25 and three
yeah, and one of those losseswas a forfeit, so the team was
strong.
Yeah, yeah, um, just didn't doit in the playoffs yeah, that's
right, yeah, that's right, yeah,you know you go 25, you go 25-3

(03:03):
, and then you know, in theplayoffs you end up going 3-5.

Speaker 2 (03:08):
Yeah, that's tough.

Speaker 3 (03:09):
Yeah, that's bad.

Speaker 2 (03:10):
That's very Leafs energy there, oh.

Speaker 1 (03:13):
I tell you yeah, oh yeah, ouch.
Yeah, those sick burns.
You enjoy the rest of your day,guys.

Speaker 2 (03:21):
You know I like the Leafs.

Speaker 3 (03:23):
You know they talk about Marner.

Speaker 2 (03:24):
Well, you're a Rangers fan.

Speaker 3 (03:25):
Yeah, that's right, I'm a Cubs fan too.
Yeah, worse.
So they talk about Marner andMatthews and all of this stuff.
They don't show up in theplayoffs, but if you think about
it, they're the reason they getto the playoffs.
Oh, that's true, right, theyjust need a little extra.
They should have gotten Brad.
That would have been awesome.
As soon as Brad went to thePanthers I texted his brother

(03:47):
and said they will reap me.

Speaker 2 (03:48):
Yeah, oh yeah.
Well, I mean, Florida was built.
I mean they won it last year.
Anyway, they were aplayoff-built team and Brad's
exactly the type of player thatthe Leafs need.
They have all the skill and thefinesse that they need.
The goaltending's actuallypretty good.
They just needed a player likeBrad.
They need an edge.
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3 (04:06):
Love him or hate him.

Speaker 2 (04:07):
Brad's an edge.
You hate him when he's notplaying.
I remember I went to Brad's Ithink it was his dad's home or
maybe it was Brad's home, Idon't know for insurance type
stuff and I went there and I metwith his dad there.
Yeah, kevin's a great guy andhe gave me a tour of the house
and everything and they havelike this spot.

Speaker 1 (04:26):
Actually it's all by you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (04:29):
So we were out there and gave me a tour of the place
and everything.
I saw the big fire pit and theyhad Brad's chair painted with
his jersey and all that stuff.
They're going to repaint thatnow, though, but I said to Kevin
I was like I hate your sonthough, and he was like, excuse
me.
I was like I'm a Leafs fan andBoston has upset my seriously
upset my team too many times andsaid I can't like your son.

(04:50):
I'm sorry, would I like to havehim on my team though.

Speaker 3 (04:54):
Absolutely, and they got him for a song, right.

Speaker 2 (04:58):
Oh crazy, they thought it would be a rental but
fooled them, right, uh, yeah,yeah, exactly, so, yeah, so, no,
that's good.
So, yeah, so steve's a bigsports guy.
But, um, we can kind of rewinda little bit.
Uh, you know, back to, uh,where this thing all kind of
started is.
Like you, uh, you dove rightinto politics fairly early, like
you were in your, was it,mid-20s I was 30, 30, I thought

(05:21):
okay, I was 30, and what wereyou doing just before?

Speaker 1 (05:23):
politics?
But what was the jump?

Speaker 3 (05:25):
like I was in pharmaceuticals.

Speaker 1 (05:26):
I started.

Speaker 3 (05:27):
I was in pharmaceutical industry when I
was 26 years old.

Speaker 1 (05:31):
Yep, okay.

Speaker 3 (05:32):
And I started November 3rd that year and in
October that year I graduatedfrom Dow with a second degree in
commerce.
Okay so, and then you know,I'll never forget, I went to a
funeral on the weekend and afellow there, Ronnie Ryan, great

(05:54):
fellow, coached his son inhockey, Coached a lot of kids in
Spryfield, and it was in March.
And he calls me on Sundaymorning and says, Steve, we've
been, a bunch of us have beentalking and we think you should
run for alderman.
And I always said I just wantedto sign.
It sounds a little hokey, but Iwanted to sign to say it's time

(06:14):
, it was time.

Speaker 1 (06:16):
Yeah, and that's a long time holding a position 30
years.
That's a volatile positionbecause obviously there's votes,
you know I mean you get votedout at any time.
What was the secret sauce youthink that got you to stick
around all that time?

Speaker 3 (06:27):
So there's a few reasons.
One I remember the first timeat Malgamation.

Speaker 1 (06:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (06:35):
And the first door I went to was in Williamswood.
I remember walking down a laneit was probably a 50-foot lane
Walk up.
It was 1 o'clock on a Sundayafternoon knocking on the door.
Guy comes to the door and saysI said hi there, my name's
Steven Adams.
Yeah, I know who you are.
Oh boy, this is not good, yeah.
And I said look, I'd just liketo leave you a bit of

(06:57):
information if I could.
I said he says yeah, I don'tneed it, okay.
So I said well, I appreciateyour time, thank you.
And he says hang on a second,okay.
So I said what can I do for you?
He says, well, I don't likewhat's going on with the taxi
industry, I don't like what youdid with the city manager and I

(07:17):
don't like what's going on atBears Lake.
I said, well, look, I reallyappreciate you letting me know.
Yeah.
I said, well, look, I reallyappreciate you letting me know.
Yeah, and I took a step.
You can't see this on radio,but I took a step and turned to
the main road, to Old StamfordRoad, and he goes one other
thing, and I remember I put myeyes up to the sky, turned
around, said yes, sir.
He says I want the two biggestsigns you have.

(07:39):
I said pardon.
He says I want one there andone there.
He says I want one there andone there.
He says I don't always agreewith you, but I don't have to
read your mind, oh there you go,and that was important, but the
other two call people back,send them an email, at least
contact them.
Cecil Wright asked me the samequestion.
One thing I said is never holda grudge.

Speaker 2 (08:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (08:02):
Never hold a grudge and always take the high road,
because there's far less trafficthere.

Speaker 2 (08:07):
Yeah, early on you were a defender of Spryfield.
I remember you really going tobat against the media defending
Spryfield, so I'm sure that alsokind of garnered some pride,
some civic pride that's why Istarted.

Speaker 3 (08:21):
That's why I got involved Going to Dow in the
mornings.
It was an election.
I think it was 1980.
You see all the signs on theway in on the computer and I
said someday I'm gonna do this.
There's someday not today, butsomeday and then ronnie called
me and here we go yeah, becauseI didn't like the way sprafio
was portrayed in the media.
I didn't like the way we werebeing treated.
Yeah, and it was unfair and itwas all reputation, like if

(08:45):
something good happened, it wasHalifax, if something bad
happened, it was Spryfield andthe media.
And I'll tell the truth to them, they misinterpreted police
reports, shall we say.
Crime happened in Spryfieldwhen it was Cowie Hill, one of
the really bizarre ones.
I was in Toronto and I had theonline newspaper and the

(09:11):
headline was drug bust inDartmouth and Spryfield, right,
okay.
So I checked and it wasn'tSpryfield, it was in Klein
Heights or Army Hill, whatever.

Speaker 2 (09:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (09:23):
And I called the reporter and said man, you need
a map or a geography lessonbecause that's wrong, right?
So he said, well, let me check.
And he did so.
The headline next was DougRustin, dartmouth and Halifax
Right.
So just the inherent bias.
And one reporter, andrewMcDonald we've become friends

(09:43):
over this item when he praisedDavid Graham and Peter Pauly for
developing in an undesirablepart of HRM.
Well, I lost my marbles.
Yeah, called him and I said youknow, we should have a little
talk.
Yeah, sure, I admire him.
Right, because he was straightup.
So we took a drive all aroundSpryfield, yeah, every area,

(10:06):
every corner, one end to theother.
And then what I did?
I took the police reports forthe crime stats and I had six
different communities.
So there's a South End, therewas Aranco of Ketch Harbor,
there was Spryfield, fairview,dartmouth, north, and I think I

(10:29):
said South End, right, yeah,yeah, and the North End.
So I put them in front of them,covered the communities, right?
I said which community wouldyou rather live in?
And they were break-and-enters,assaults, drug, drug busts,
speeding and all those other.
There were six differentcategories.
Well, there, I said you'recertain.

(10:49):
Yeah, I said you just pickedSpryfield over the South End,
wow.
Then he said well, that'sbecause of the students and
everything I said.
I don't think we're looking atwhy.
I think we're looking at actualmeasurable facts.
Yeah, and the fact is is thatfive out of six categories it
was better in Spryfield than inthe south end of Halifax.
You know where the really niceplaces are Exactly.

Speaker 1 (11:10):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (11:11):
He couldn't believe it.
From that point on, he becameone of our biggest supporters,
one of our biggest cheerleaders.

Speaker 1 (11:16):
Coming from Dartmouth to Halifax.
It was a lot of a similarstigma.

Speaker 2 (11:25):
Like people would think Dartmouth was a terrible
place.
Well, I mean hey, hey, hey, butit does have a nice view of
Halifax.
That's important, poor Gloria,I used to tell her that, oh,
gloria, I can understand thefeeling, that sentiment.

Speaker 1 (11:33):
It's like your neighborhood is your, the people
you've grown up with, is theenvironment around them.
I mean, I've always felt safein Dartmouth, yeah.

Speaker 3 (11:39):
Right, yeah, me too, like I, me too, like I never
locked my doors, never locked myshed.
And it was funny.
There was a class from StMary's came to the Williams
Surprise Center and wanted totalk about politics and things
like that.
And you know, any opportunityto promote the community it
would be great.
And every class has one.
There's one guy, there's alwaysthat guy and we were just

(12:05):
talking again about the primestats and about things that were
going on and he said, well,it's not safe out here, it's
dangerous.
I said why do you say that?
Well, don't you read the papers?
Yeah, but why do you say that?
And he started going on abouthow bad it was and all this
other stuff.
I said, well, if you look atthe crime stats, they're lower
than most other parts of HRM notjust Halifax, but HRM.

(12:28):
He says, well, people areafraid to report crime out here.
I said, okay, right.
So I said, consider somethinglike miles per gallon.
They're never accurate but,they're relative.
And I said a lot of policeofficers live out here.
Why would they live in a badarea?
Well, they have guns, true, butwhy lot of police officers live
out here?
Why would they live in a badarea?
Well, they have guns, true, butwhy would retired police

(12:48):
officers live out here?
Yeah Right, if it's sodangerous?
Yeah yeah, and that shut themdown, right, but you know, one
person at a time to remove thestigma.
And you know, I still say wewere doing well.
It's a beautiful community.

Speaker 2 (13:08):
Well, I mean, and John Buchanan is from Spryfield
and you know he was the premierand senator and all that, like
it was.
You know it is a bizarre thing.
I mean, I think the stigma ofthe negative of Spryfield came
between.
Obviously, you know, at onepoint we had some family wars of

(13:29):
drugs and things like that atsome point in time, but the I
think that that must like if, inyour experience, that must be
where this came from.
Cause, I mean, other than that,like I've never, really I've
never experienced anything.
I mean I grew up in Heron Cove,slash, spryfield kind of thing,
right yeah, and I've neverexperienced anything like bad
really Like.
you know all the time like highschool some stuff, whatever

(13:49):
right.
But I mean I would walk inSpryfield at 2 am.

Speaker 3 (13:53):
And I wouldn't think twice.
I have.
I have no-transcript, but yeah,it's a shame that people are
still can't go past the rotaryor all these other things.
It's really ridiculous.

Speaker 2 (14:14):
Yeah, no, exactly I mean.
That being said, though, thearea's changing quite a bit.

Speaker 3 (14:18):
It's growing, it's genderfying, and things like
that, but it still has thatgreat spirit.
You know we still have dannyslade up there waving
everybody's beautiful right so,and you know.
The other thing is that ifsomeone needs help, if there's a
issue like a family's gonethrough a tragedy or something,
you know I would not, I wouldput our community against any in

(14:39):
the province.
Yeah, to help people with no,no, uh, expectation of anything
in return.

Speaker 2 (14:46):
I mean, I could be you know, someone can correct me
on this, but I believe at least.
When I was going there, I heardthat JL Ilsley was the school
that gave the highest number ofbursaries than any other high
school in the province.

Speaker 3 (14:58):
Indeed, per student.
Yeah, Like hundreds thousandsof dollars right.
And I got to tell you theybrought me back one time for the
graduation.
This is a funny story.
So I prepared a speech for thekids right, and basically said
look, you know, treat yourself,treat others with respect, but

(15:18):
treat yourself with respect.
Treat others with respect, buttreat yourself with respect.
Whatever you choose to dowhether it's, you know,
vocational school back then itwas or you want to get a job or
go to university or whatever itis do the very best you can and
if you're going to take a yearoff, make use of that year.
Do something you want to do andmay not be able to do it later

(15:40):
on in life.
So then I said I'm going to askyou guys some questions.
Don't worry, it's not a test.
I said what's the capital ofGuam?
It's Agana, right, agana.
I said how many stomachs arethere in a shark?
It was four.
And they're looking at me.
I said you know, these are thesequestions that teachers always
ask.
But what am I going to use thatfor?

(16:00):
I said what about?
You know you can't say snuck,it's sneaked.
And they nod their heads alittle 2X plus 3Y equals 15.
And they're nodding their headsup and down.
We always wonder, why were weasked this?
Why do we have to learn thisstuff?
And they're shaking their heads.
They get it right.
So I'm going to tell yousomething.
I graduated high school 20years ago.
That's the first time I everused any of that crap.

(16:23):
Mike Nee, the principal, nearlydied laughing.
And Terry Quinlan, the viceprincipal she nearly fell over.
They were mortified, but theyloved it.

Speaker 2 (16:34):
Well exactly, it's a way to just relate to the youth.
Yeah, exactly.
So, yeah, really, you've beenan ambassador for the area for a
long time, but then youactually are a representative to
City Hall, ambassador to forthe area for a long time, but
then you actually on it.
I'm not, you know,representative, uh, to city hall
.
See, we've had a lot ofpoliticians on here and I think
you're really the first likeactual city politician.

(16:54):
We've had mayors and thingslike that and we can talk about
that.
But as a counselor, like Idon't think people realize how
hard it is to actually getthings done because there's no
party affiliation, there's noteveryone votes the same.
You have to really be a masternegotiator to try to get other
people to do things.

Speaker 1 (17:14):
I find it, as a person not in politics at all, a
very puzzling way to kind ofget things done.
You have all these differentcouncillors and they're all
trying to agree on something.
You, almost by default, almostalways seem to disagree on
things.

Speaker 3 (17:25):
Well, try it.
When there's 23 counselors,that's a lot.

Speaker 2 (17:27):
Yeah.
Yeah, well, you went from 23 to16.
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (17:30):
Well, I went from 12 counselors, or all of them.

Speaker 2 (17:33):
right, yeah, yeah, yeah To 23.

Speaker 3 (17:35):
But that was 66.
Yeah, right, yeah.
And then from 66 to 23, 23 to16.
Yeah, and you remember whenthey talked about the wages and
the salaries that were too highfor counselors?

Speaker 2 (17:48):
Yes, remember that.

Speaker 3 (17:49):
And they get a 2% or 3% or 4% raise in September or
October when they cut from 23down to 16, that was probably
$700,000, $800,000 out of thebudget.

Speaker 2 (17:59):
Right, right yeah.

Speaker 3 (18:01):
We didn't get one and a half times the salary or
whatever right the salary wentup two or three percent and
people complained about that.
And you know Rick Howe, who Ihave an immense amount of
respect for.
He and I talked about that.
I said how come you didn'tmention that when we saved all
that money?
And off air he says okay, adamsis not coming on my show
anymore.

Speaker 1 (18:20):
He was a good man yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
it's good he's a legend in thisuh, these parts but, yeah, I
don't.

Speaker 2 (18:26):
I think it's funny.
I think some people don't quiteuh appreciate.
You know, they thinkpoliticians have these, you know
fat cat jobs and things likethat.
But uh, I don't think they.
I think a lot of people if let,if they were given the job for
a year, I don't know if theywould want to do it for the
salary you don't do it for thesalary.

(18:48):
Well, that's the thing, right, alot of people who look at it
and go like, oh, I mean now,because they're making $103,000
or something like that.
Now, so for $103,000 tobasically kind of be like a bit
of a micro celebrity, right,everyone knows your name,
everyone knows who you are, andnot only do they know who you
are, and they can be good or badthey hate you or they love you

(19:08):
or what indifferent or whateverit may be right, it's not like
working in a private sector jobwhere you just focus on your,
your job, right?
you know there may be somepeople that don't like you, but
for the most part you're justworking your job.
You don't have this fame thatyou get with being a politician
and the amount of deep hate thatpeople can have for you and

(19:32):
they may never have actuallyshaken your hand in their life,
never talked to you exactlyright, never, ever talked to you
.

Speaker 3 (19:39):
Yeah, and I got to like I had a guy call my house 2
in the morning.

Speaker 1 (19:46):
Over what.

Speaker 3 (19:47):
Well, you'll get this in a second oh yeah, 2 in the
morning.
You better have a good reason.
Oh no, no, no.

Speaker 1 (19:52):
I'm asleep.

Speaker 3 (19:53):
Yeah, and I get up and listen to the message.
I hope your house burns downand your wife and kids die in
the fire.

Speaker 1 (20:03):
Wow, gross, see, that annoyed me.

Speaker 3 (20:05):
Yeah, so I get out of bed.

Speaker 1 (20:08):
I was wild, right?
You don't say that.

Speaker 3 (20:11):
I went right to his house.

Speaker 2 (20:13):
Oh, did you.

Speaker 3 (20:13):
Oh yeah, you don't do that.
So you know who this guy was.
Yep, and I said why would yousay that he wouldn't open?
Well, I know you're not goingto lie to me.
He sat down and had some gingerale.
I said why would you say thatthat was evil, simply evil.
Yeah right and he said it wasraining and I couldn't get a cab
.

Speaker 1 (20:34):
Wow, but like what was he upset about?
Can you remember?

Speaker 2 (20:40):
He couldn't was a joke.
Oh, no, no, no, no.

Speaker 1 (20:42):
You couldn't get a cab to your house.
It could tell you off.

Speaker 3 (20:45):
No, I couldn't get a cab.

Speaker 1 (20:47):
That's bizarre, so mental health issues there
probably with that gentleman no.

Speaker 3 (20:51):
You don't think so?
No, no, just mad.
I had a lady call me at 3 inthe morning because there were
flooding problems.
Okay, and I already had sent herthe information.
Her the information, and I saidwhy are you calling me at this
hour?
Well, I thought it would be agood time to get you, okay.
So I said I'll get a wholeengineer and I'll see what I can
do for you.
Actually it was 10 after 3.

(21:11):
So I said I'll get someinformation for you.
So I called her back at 10after 3.
Figured it was a good time forher.
So never call me again.

Speaker 2 (21:22):
Obviously it takes a special person to do that, to
like handle that type of stuff,right, but how do you reconcile
with that stuff?

Speaker 3 (21:28):
Never get in your head, yeah.

Speaker 2 (21:30):
As you go through your day, you're seeing people,
you're, you know, you're atevents and there's a thousand
people there and you're sittingthere thinking like do 50% of
these people like want to smackme back of the head, kind of
thing yeah, never been smacked.

Speaker 3 (21:40):
That's good.
And you know, like I tellpeople and people have told me,
do not take it personally.
Sometimes it's hard, yeah,sometimes it's difficult, yeah,
but you know, some have, likeyou said, never shaken your hand
.
They don't even know you, Right.
But because you're a politician, yeah, it's an uphill battle

(22:01):
right from the get-go Right Forsome people For you to deal with
.
That it can be frustrating, butyou know, the funny thing is if
you have 10 angry phone calls or20 angry phone calls and one
that says, look, I reallyappreciate what you did for me,
thank you, all the other stuffgoes away.
It goes away and it's.

(22:23):
If someone would tell me that'sthe way, yeah, it goes away and
it's it's.
You know, if someone would tellme that's the way it would work
, I wouldn't believe it.
Yeah, but it's true, it justgoes away.
I can believe that.
Yeah, because you've helpedsomebody, right.
Yeah, you may have made adifference somewhere.
Yeah, exactly, and that's whatpeople they want you to.
They want you to call back,even if you can't do anything to
help them.

Speaker 1 (22:41):
they they've been heard.
So, like looking back in yearsas Councillor, what were some of
the things that you did thatyou know that you noticed had a
good impact on your district,your community?
Shoe and water and hearing coatoh yeah.

Speaker 3 (22:57):
Shoe and water and hearing coat.

Speaker 1 (22:58):
It was promised for years and years and years, and
we were finally able to deliverit Nice.

Speaker 3 (23:00):
For years and years and years and we were finally
able to deliver it Nice.
And another one which doesn'tseem significant to people, but
there was a place out inCleveland Park right that they
had.
It was a French fry plant.
They would blanch fries.
It was in between ElmdaleCrescent and the playground

(23:21):
which is there now.
Oh okay, it was 100 ClevelandDrive and it was brutal, the
smell and the waffling, it wasjust horrible and finally got it
removed.
And the late Dan Paul Iremember my first election in 91
, he gave me a check for $100.
Yeah.

(23:41):
And the second one, also withLied, was they had terrible
flooding.
The flooding was abysmal and Iremember talking to uh the
engineer, the late bill sullivan, and I used to.
I said you're, you should bedoctor.
No, because I don't even finishmy question, you say no.
He started laughing.
I said this flooding problem isup there.

(24:01):
He says no, there's not.
I said I'm telling you.
I've been in basements up to myankles.
He said a friend of mine callsme.
He says my basement's flooded.
I went up and his kids wereswimming.
They had their goggles andsnorkel on right, swimming in
the basement.
So I said that's a floodingproblem.
So finally convinced council toget a study done by an

(24:22):
engineering firm, CBCL, that 80%of the basements were wet.

Speaker 2 (24:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (24:26):
So we got the storm sewers put in and that relieved
those who hooked into them, gotsome relief.

Speaker 2 (24:31):
Wow, how do you get like?
What does it look like whenyou're trying you take a cause
to council?
Obviously it's not just infront of council.
You have to obviously kind ofschmooze a little bit amongst
your councillors to get likewhat does that look like?
How do you try to convince thepeople to vote in the favor of
the things that you need to getdone?

Speaker 3 (24:52):
Good question.
Yeah, it's a very good questionand everyone's different the
way they deal with it.
I used to just talk to counciland I said look, I've been
working on this for a while,here's what's happening, like
you do the cause and effect.
Here's what's happening andthis is the problems that it's
creating.
Can you support at leastlooking at some semblance of

(25:13):
relief, like a study or furtherinvestigation?
Like, just start the process,don't say no.
And after we get to the finalpart of it and I used to tell
them I don't give a rat'spatootie which way you vote,
what I'm concerned about is thatyou have the information you
need to make an informeddecision.

Speaker 1 (25:32):
Right.

Speaker 3 (25:32):
And then if you think that there's merit, then I'd
appreciate your support.
If not, I get it.
No hard feelings and never,ever, ever take it outside of
council.

Speaker 1 (25:43):
Ever yeah Right.
Never take it outside ofcouncil.
Ever yeah Right.

Speaker 3 (25:47):
Never take it outside of council.
No, I remember one time WayneMason and I get into it in
council.

Speaker 2 (25:50):
It was pretty bad and after it you guys seemed like
oil and water a little bit.
For your last, a tad For yourlast, like the last four years
of your political career, youguys were oil and water there.

Speaker 3 (26:02):
So it was bad right.

Speaker 2 (26:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (26:04):
And then, after I said need to drive home yeah,
I'd like that yeah, talked aboutour kids.

Speaker 2 (26:11):
Oh, there you go, there you go.
You can't, that's how you do it, you leave it inside right?

Speaker 3 (26:15):
Yeah, Because if you don't, it'll fester and you'll
hate the world.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:20):
Yeah, no, that makes sense.
Yeah, you've got to kind ofjust do it that way.
I guess that's good.
Was there anyone in your 29years that you were absolutely
like?
I cannot work with that person.
You can choose to name names ornot.

Speaker 3 (26:39):
Well, I could work with anybody.

Speaker 2 (26:41):
Yeah, but I mean, like after a couple times you
were just kind of like okay, weare not going to be on the same
page ever.
He said this about you justbefore we started.
That's true.
We did say, are you?

Speaker 3 (26:50):
sitting counselors or guys who do interviews, which
there there were a couple thatthey were Like if I said the sky
is blue, he'd say no, it'snighttime, yeah.

Speaker 2 (27:02):
No matter what.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (27:04):
It, just it wasn't going to work.
So I figured well, we've got 22others, or 21 others, I can
talk to Put your effortelsewhere.

Speaker 2 (27:11):
That's right, yeah.

Speaker 3 (27:12):
And you know if he or she will say supported emotion.
Great, it was a bonus.

Speaker 1 (27:18):
Yeah, yeah but it's not something you'd count on,
yeah.

Speaker 3 (27:20):
And generally, this individual would say well, I'll
keep an open mind.
At the hearing I said okay,you're a no yeah fair enough,
not hard to figure out, right?

Speaker 2 (27:29):
Just tell me, yeah, how important do you think?
Because at one point I knowlike I think it was either your
second last term or your lastterm At one point it seemed like
council was having a lot ofin-camera meetings and there was
a lot of criticism around that.

Speaker 3 (27:44):
So in-camera meetings are only for land, personnel or
legal Right and I can tell youthat I never, ever, ever
participated in an in-camerameeting which fell outside those
categories Okay, ever meetingwhich fell outside those
categories ever.
And the information that wasdiscussed.

(28:04):
There was a motion at the endof the meeting in public, and
the motion wasn't blatantlyobvious what it was about, but
it covered what was discussed inthe in-camera.
There were a lot of in-camerameetings, you're right.
I mean there was CommonwealthGames, there was Harbor
Solutions, sometimes the NovaCenter, there was a few things

(28:27):
and there was.
I remember a time and I don'tknow the timeline, but you're
right, there was an inordinateamount.

Speaker 2 (28:33):
There was.
I can't remember was yoursecond last time, or your?

Speaker 3 (28:35):
last time Probably the second last.
Yeah, that sounds like it mighthave been yeah to anyone who's
listening maybe explain like whythey're important.
So let's take, for example,there's a land negotiation,
right, and there's, you know,the city needs.
Uh, well, we bought a lot ofland for the harry cove road
widening, right.
So let's say, for example,you're negotiating with people,
you have a property, and youhave a property and others have

(28:58):
properties.
If you do that in the open,well, he got $150,000 for his, I
get $175,000 for mine, and then$200,000, and the prices start
escalating.
So if you do all of thenegotiations at the same time
with the homeowners and thenbring it all to council at once,

(29:18):
you discuss it and then youhave the package together and
then you approve it, because ifyou do it piecemeal, then your
price is going to go up.

Speaker 1 (29:28):
You just rise the price up house over house.

Speaker 3 (29:30):
Exactly Makes sense, yeah and it costs the city more
and that's never a good thing.
No Personnel if someone hasdone something they shouldn't,
or reprimanded like.
Sometimes there are complaintsagainst coun, against counselors
, and had to deal with thosebecause they fall under the
personnel category Right, soyou've got to deal with that.
And legal I don't recallsomething specific for the legal

(29:51):
issues, but they weren't likesomeone on council did something
they shouldn't, but generally alot of it was around land or
contract negotiations and otherones.
So you didn't want to do thatin the open.
Nothing good comes from it.
Fair enough, but I can tell you,as I'm sitting here, that there

(30:11):
were no discussions in camerathat were outside of those
categories.

Speaker 2 (30:17):
Yeah, I just remember it just seemed like the media
blew it up for a while thereEverything's in secret,
everything's in secret,everything's in secret, yeah.

Speaker 3 (30:25):
Well, those are the key words.
I know what's in secret, orthey're a big cloak of darkness,
and all the journalism 101 mustbe all theatrical and
everything and have nofoundation or substance to what
we're saying.

Speaker 1 (30:38):
But it sure reads well or substance to what we're
saying, but it sure reads.
Well, I want to ask you aquestion going back to
pharmaceutical sales and reallythe transferable skills.
What do you think?
As a pharmaceutical rep, youwere out of university doing
this for a few years right, fiveyears, yeah, five years and
what skills did you learn inthat field that kind of helped
you transfer, maybe to thepolitical realm or in the

(30:59):
council realm, communication,talking with people, maybe to
the political realm or in thecouncil, realm Communication,
talking with people, and youknow if you can speak to
somebody, get your point acrossand not fumble and mumble and
all that you'll do.

Speaker 3 (31:15):
Well, right, proper grammar, people laugh, but it's
important, it really isimportant, and you know when
you're talking.
You talked earlier aboutgetting your colleagues on side.
Well, in sales, same thing,right, you're selling yourself
or selling your idea, and youfind out what are the underlying

(31:37):
issues.
Sometimes they may not like me.
Okay, that's your underlyingissue, then we move along.
But if you find out what theunderlying issues, sometimes
they may not like me.
Okay, that's your underlyingissue, then we move along.
Right, but if you find out whatthe underlying issues are, then
you help resolve them.
If you can resolve those, thenyou get to I agree with you
reasonably quickly.
But if you can't resolve it,then you're not going to be
successful.

Speaker 1 (31:57):
But you can't be successful every time.
Yeah, I certainly do try too.
Yeah, yeah, yeah with that,yeah for sure yeah, well, we're
looking back on there.

Speaker 2 (32:05):
Is there anything that you're sitting there
thinking like I wish I could getthat done?

Speaker 3 (32:10):
the last phase of herring cove sewer water.
Yeah, right.

Speaker 1 (32:14):
Were you going to get out to catch harbour by chance?
Will it get out to catchharbour?
Where are you?
Where are you aiming to?
That's where I live now.
So we're aiming to get out toKetch Harbour.
No, where are you aiming?

Speaker 3 (32:23):
to get out.

Speaker 1 (32:23):
That's where I live now, so are you aiming to get
out to Ketch Harbour?

Speaker 3 (32:25):
Guaranteed?
Not no, it could have gottendown past the gas station.
Steve Murphy's right yeah,Because there was plenty of
development, but the staffwouldn't hear of it and there
just wasn't enough money to getit done.
Right.
There just wasn't enough moneyto get it done.
There just wasn't, and that wasone of the problems.
There was money in there for atower and I moved that money

(32:48):
from the tower to the top ofOcean Breeze and, instead of
doing that, did more likeVillage Road and John Brackett
Drive.

Speaker 1 (32:56):
Yeah, I always wondered, though there's so many
freshwater lakes out there inSan Bro too, like you know,
there's an opportunity, butmaybe it's just too expensive.

Speaker 3 (33:04):
Yeah but it gets expensive and there was one time
I took a lot of criticism.
There wasn't enough money to dothe next phase.
We were told we were going toget $19 million, get something
like three or four.
So you know what are you goingto do.
You're going to service five orsix houses and they pay $70,000
each, when everybody else paid$12,500.

Speaker 1 (33:26):
So that's not good.

Speaker 3 (33:27):
So there were two options Try to get that through
and make people mortgage theirhouses to pay for this, which
really isn't good, or transferthe money.
And I was criticized heavilyfor it by people who knew better
but didn't fit their narrative.
And I was criticized heavilyfor it by people who knew better
but didn't fit their narrativeand I said, well, move it up to

(33:49):
Fall River.
They can use that and apply ittowards their contribution for
the entire community, because ifit didn't get allocated, it
just disappeared and gonenowhere.
So you can put this forward andhave someone get some benefit,
or you can be stubborn and say,yeah, we're going to stay here

(34:11):
with it and we're going to tryand fight and lose it all.
It's just dumb.

Speaker 2 (34:16):
Yeah, water is always a big issue.
I mean obviously out inHeronsfield that was a big issue
, right with the water stuff outin Heronsfield it was a big
issue, I mean like, obviouslyout in Harrodsfield, that was a
big issue, right With the water.
Stuff out in Harrodsfield wasalways a big issue.
It was a big issue when I ran.
Still an issue today.
Still an issue today, yeah soHarrodsfield.

Speaker 1 (34:29):
Like I don't really understand the issue as well,
even though I live on the otherside of the loop.

Speaker 2 (34:40):
I've never educated myself on it.

Speaker 3 (34:41):
Well, a lot of people don't understand.
No, no, there's been issues.
I've just seen the signs upevery once in a while.

Speaker 1 (34:47):
So I don't really understand it.
What would you say?

Speaker 3 (34:48):
There were issues there since the 80s.
It's in the land use bylaw thehigher arsenic and uranium
levels, right, they were in thebylaw and they were a problem,
so won't get into names.
But what had happened?
Rdm came about and people don'trealize how it came about.

(35:09):
There was Nicholson's AutoSalvage and that was.
You know, you go in to get aradiator, you bring your WD-40
and your wrench and you take itout of the car and cut the hose
and stuff drains into the groundand away we go right.
Everyone's happy, Good old days.

Speaker 2 (35:24):
Good old days.

Speaker 3 (35:25):
You know.
So what happened is that and Ihad no idea, this was a
discussion with staff and theproponent at the time where, you
know, nicholson's Auto Salvagerecycled, repurposed, sold car
parts, which recycled,repurposed, sold car parts.
So RDM came in and they hadbuilding materials and they

(35:51):
ground up a lot of stuff andsome of it went out to the
landfill for cover.
Well, the planner of the daysaid well, you are recycling and
reselling building materials.
Well, they might have done alittle bit right, but that's how
they put the use as similar toNicholson's, and that's how they

(36:14):
got the license to operate outof there.
Okay, so what happened is theygot the permits and again, this
is not a council decision butthen you see mounds of chiprock,
chiprock everywhere.
And that was when I said look,this is wrong, this stuff is

(36:35):
going to leach into thegroundwater.
It's going to leach everywhere.
You've got to find a way todeal with it.
So, through a huge fight, I'lladmit that um, we got them the
ability, the zoning, to allowfor, uh, burial right which
would protect it from theenvironment, would protect
everything.
Yeah, and that, uh, you know, Iknow people were upset, but you

(36:58):
know, if you have somethingexposed.
It's going to be really bad,right.
So then they applied for theirpermit to bury from the city.
The city gave the permit andthen they had to go to the
province.
Province says nope, not doingit, we're not going to allow you
to bury.
That's not good yeah and I havethe minister at the time.

(37:20):
I could tell you.
It was quarter after four on aFriday afternoon.
I was on the Cornwall Road andhe called me.
I pulled over.
I said, with due respect youhave no clue what you're doing.

Speaker 1 (37:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (37:31):
Right to a minister.
Anyway, the city didn't bother,giving them a permit to bury
Right Didn't bother because theyknew the province would say no.
The same minister, a year later, gave them a permit to bury
120,000 tons.
Oh, bypass the city, bypass thecity processes.

Speaker 2 (37:50):
Oh, wow, okay.

Speaker 3 (37:51):
So that's the story.
Yeah, that's the story.
Now, people may or may notbelieve it.
I don't care, because those arethe facts.

Speaker 2 (38:00):
And.
I do remember because we'lleventually talk about your
decision to retire from politics.
But I do remember in your lastterm, because you and I had
discussed this a lot, becauseyou knew I was going to run.

Speaker 1 (38:13):
Were you going to replace him?
Was that the deal?
Yeah, yeah, oh, wow, I ran forhis seat.
Oh my gosh, okay cool.

Speaker 2 (38:19):
Listen when I ran.
This is why I have a ton ofrespect for Steve, not that I
didn't beforehand, but when Iran for about a solid six months
he gave me a lot of his time Iprobably spoke to you what every
second day for six months.
Amazing, you were probably theperson I spoke to the most
outside of my wife.

Speaker 3 (38:36):
It's funny because I told all the candidates right,
I'll meet with you, we can talkwhatever you want.
No one will ever know.
We spoke, I promise you, andMatt and I spoke more than
anyone that was after.
He talks a lot, oh my heavenSomeone should tell him you have

(38:58):
two ears and one mouth tolisten to twice as much, as you
say.
But I enjoyed it I did.
And sometimes it was like 10,10.30 at night.

Speaker 2 (39:06):
It was, yeah, sometimes it was late at night
because I was knocking on doors,right.

Speaker 3 (39:09):
And I was getting home, it was fine, yeah, and
there were other candidates thatnot as frequently.

Speaker 1 (39:17):
Let's give Matt some advice real quick.
Do you think just because?

Speaker 3 (39:21):
he lost once he shouldn't run again.

Speaker 1 (39:22):
That's up to him.
That's up to him.
It's a personal choice, apersonal decision.
It's a lot.

Speaker 3 (39:30):
It is, and actually winning an election is sometimes
more difficult than the job.

Speaker 1 (39:37):
Yeah, well, you were close and I was there that night
with you, holy smokes.
Yeah, you were close, it was ashitty night, but you know.

Speaker 3 (39:44):
Yeah, crappy night.
But, it's you know.
I mean I wouldn't trade 29years for the world.

Speaker 1 (39:50):
Yeah, well, you know you do a lot of good right, you
know you see, I like to thinkyou have a lot of challenges and
stuff, perceptions of you, andthey can sometimes run away, I'm
sure, and sometimes they'reprobably.
Maybe it might be truesometimes too right.

Speaker 3 (40:04):
I'll never run away.

Speaker 1 (40:05):
But you can get to kind of look back and say, hey,
I did a few things for mycommunity at least I can stand
behind A lot of the ones thatare yappy and everything, little
chihuahuas, right?

Speaker 3 (40:15):
Yeah, you look at them and they run, yeah, and you
can't respect that.
I would rather someone come upto me and tell you I think you
are more and I think you're this, I think you're that yeah okay,
that's cool yeah, well sothat's it.

Speaker 1 (40:30):
They don't know.
So then you decide to retire.
What made you retire?
Yeah, I want to ask you aboutretirement.

Speaker 3 (40:33):
Yeah, yeah 29 years next.
It's a long time, right?

Speaker 2 (40:37):
you could have you probably I mean, I no doubt my
mind you could have Went thereuntil you chose not, to which
obviously you did, but you couldhave probably won another
election.

Speaker 3 (40:45):
Perhaps Was it twice.

Speaker 2 (40:47):
You were just acclaimed.

Speaker 3 (40:48):
Acclaimed twice.
Yeah, and the last two, likeeveryone, made a big deal of me
moving to Bedford.

Speaker 2 (40:53):
That's right, yes, right.

Speaker 3 (40:55):
So the 2004 election simply said I fell in love with
a woman from Bedford who has twokids.
I fell in love with a woman fromBedford who has two kids, and
there's no way I would takethose children out of their
community, out of their home,out of their schools and away
from their friends for politicalpurposes.
I just wouldn't.

(41:15):
And if I lose an election on it, so be it, that's fine, that's
fine.
So I remember a debate at theWilliams Spry and they were
bringing this up and you kind ofget tired of it, right, but it
is what it is.
So I remember saying that look,with due respect to my fellow

(41:39):
candidates here, I've lived herelonger than you have.

Speaker 2 (41:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (41:44):
And you know I've forgotten more about Spryfield
and the surrounding communitiesthan you have.
And you know I've forgottenmore about Spryfield and the
surrounding communities thanyou'll ever know.
And I said if you worry aboutwhere your head, where someone
lays your head at night, thenokay, vote for them.
But if you want to know what'smore important having something
in your head I'm your guy.
And there was a guy I said AlanMarriott.

Speaker 1 (42:02):
I said see where I'm sitting.

Speaker 3 (42:05):
That was my grade four seat because it was at GK
Butler, which was the WilliamSpry and the funniest one.
There was a debate.
It was in 2012 when ProspectRoad came into it and there were
three candidates myself andthree others and I said the same
thing about fell in love and,speaking of that, we had our
18th anniversary yesterday.
Three others and I said thesame thing about you know, you

(42:25):
know, fell in love and you know,and, speaking of that, we had
our our 18th anniversaryyesterday.

Speaker 2 (42:30):
Oh congratulations.

Speaker 3 (42:32):
Thank you, yeah, and love is, as I've always been in,
more so every day.
So it was, it's beautiful.

Speaker 2 (42:40):
So I get up and and I she's retired now too, so I get
up and she's retired now too,isn't she?
That's right, yeah, yeah, yeah,just recently, right, just
loving it.

Speaker 3 (42:47):
And I'm a grandfather now too.

Speaker 2 (42:48):
Oh yeah.

Speaker 3 (42:49):
Yeah, yeah, Life is really good.
That's awesome.
So I said you know, I fell inlove and here we are and
apparently these guys arescratching at all kinds of stuff
they had.
So then at the end of it, I wasthe last one to speak.
It worked out perfectly I wasthe first one to speak and then
the last one as well to sum itup, I said before we go further,

(43:17):
I just want to thank mycandidate colleagues here for
offering and for your service.
So it was a firefighter and aretired military fellow and a
retired police officer.
I said all I need is a whitehard hat and we could be the
village people.
And that lightened everythingup.

Speaker 2 (43:29):
Yeah, right, I mean, I can understand that some
people might, when they say like, oh, we want someone from the
area.
I can understand what they meanby that, but I think in the end
, what they're saying is we wantsomeone who understands our
problems.
And in the end I think you did,because you were born and
raised most of your life there.

(43:50):
I mean even still to this day.
As you said, you just handedoff the ownership of the
Spryfield Junior C team.
So even still after retirement.
You're still very much deeproots in the community.

Speaker 3 (44:01):
Well, look at Nick Marr, right, who served on
council for the city for 33years.
Okay, lived on Randolph Street,represented Quimple Road.
Yeah, yeah, right, gloriaMcCluskey yeah, doesn't live in
the area.
Tony Mancini, robert ChisholmNow there's a story.
Yeah, yeah, robert Chisholm,when John Buchanan left right.

(44:25):
So there was Robert Chisholm,judy Hartling and Rennie Quigley
right, judy Hartling, sorry.
And Robert came from the Valley, lived on the other side of the
road.
He saw up off Dutch VillageRoad, yep, and no one really
knew who he was.
And, sorry, randy Ball was theother candidate, well-known,

(44:46):
well-respected county councillor.
And who's Robert?
No one really knew him.
An NDP candidate, respectfully,that's not what Spryfield was
about at the time because, Johnbecame an PC, so I've got to
correct this.
It was Robert Randy and JudyHarrell.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:04):
So I've got to correct this.

Speaker 3 (45:06):
It was Robert Randy and Judy Harrell.
Yeah, so Robert worked andworked and worked and worked and
he won.
He won right.
Yeah, didn't live in the areanever wasn't born there, had no
ties.
And then he won again.
So it's you know, people wantsomeone who's going to represent
them and do the best they canfor those people right Right.

(45:30):
That's what it comes down to.

Speaker 1 (45:34):
Yeah, before we move on, I want to ask about UDI.
You moved over to be theexecutive director of Urban
Development Institute, yep, andthat's stationed in Spryfield,
isn't it?

Speaker 3 (45:44):
No, sorry, no, it's, our office is Duke Tower.

Speaker 1 (45:48):
Oh, duke Tower Okay sorry.

Speaker 2 (45:50):
Yeah, close enough.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
Okay, he still overlooks his old job, he
overlooks City Hall.

Speaker 2 (45:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (45:55):
City Hall.
I can see it Right from myoffice.
I can see City Hall, okay, verygood.
Yeah, how did you role and andwhy are you doing it?
So, uh, it was september of2020 and there was a uh, I got a
phone call.
I'm at home, I get a phone calland he starts with before you

(46:16):
interview with anyone or sign acontractor, you you've got to
talk to me.
Okay, what's it's about?
Can't tell you.
I said, well, geez man.
He said no, it's okay.
He says it's a job.
I said okay, what does thisentail?
I can't tell you.
I said oh, man, can you be alittle more vague?
So he did tell me it wasdevelopment related.

(46:39):
So I spoke to John Traves, citysolicitor.
I said I've been approachedabout a job in development.
I don't know anything else.
He says okay.
He says well, you don't haveany more council meetings,
there's no influence you couldhave.
So, yeah, go ahead.
So after my last Rick Howe show, I went down and met this fella
, told me about the job and theywanted me to work for them.

(47:05):
So you know, over the nextmonth to a couple months, we
went through some things andcame up with a contract and
January 4th 2021, which was my60th birthday, I get hired.

Speaker 1 (47:19):
Cool.

Speaker 3 (47:22):
I told them I'd give them three years, and now it's
four and a half so far.

Speaker 2 (47:25):
And for anyone listening, what does UDI do?

Speaker 3 (47:27):
So the Urban Development Institute, we work
with the provincial governmentand the federal government and
sometimes we lobby, sometimes welook at bylaws, look at things
that may or may not seem right.
Yeah, seem right.
And you look at, for example,there was a they wanted to do a

(47:51):
vacant lot tax.
The city did right.
I'm thinking, no, that doesn'tmake any sense, because for
every charge that is put on aproperty, by whomever
recommended by council staff,whatever the case may be, every
charge gets back to the renteror the buyer or the leaser,
whoever leases right.
So if you add $10,000 or$100,000 to a property, that

(48:14):
money gets spread amongst allthe people renting.
So, instead of jumping up anddown and going to the media and
press release, we just I got ameeting with the planning staff
and I said what does thisactually mean?
Like why they had no ideabecause it was brand new, right?
So, look, we're not gonna goput all kinds of press releases

(48:35):
out, but just bear in mind that,no matter what you do, if you
add money, it just goes back tothe people who are renting,
right, true enough.
So something like that.
And we've been criticizedbecause of our members.
Well, the people are sayingthat out of ignorance.
They just don't have a clue,right?
Yeah, so we representdevelopers and builders.

(48:58):
Yeah, consultants, engineers,architects We've got several
not-for-profits on UDL.

Speaker 1 (49:06):
I saw that.
Yeah, I saw that.

Speaker 3 (49:07):
So I figured you know , and the memberships are pricey
for the builders and developers, but I asked our board and they
approved it to allow thenot-for-profits to come in for
$150.
There you go.

Speaker 1 (49:22):
Right.

Speaker 3 (49:39):
And HST.
There you go.
Conclusions here.
There's nothing in it for ourmembers.
There's just not right.
But it's a way to shareinformation, to help people get
where they want to get, andwe've had some pretty decent
success in helping them becausethey had no idea.

Speaker 2 (49:55):
That's not different than any other professional
association.

Speaker 3 (49:58):
No, we're an offer-profit association, that's
right.

Speaker 2 (50:02):
There's lots of different professions that have
associations so they can benefitand together they're stronger
type of thing yeah exactly, andwe can learn the challenges that
the not-for-profits face andhelp them overcome them.

Speaker 3 (50:14):
Even on my first conference call with them, they
were trying to figure out if wehave a piece of land, we want to
know what we can do with it.
And I said you and I will talkafter this meeting and I'll save
you months of work, right,right?
And I told them exactly what todo.
Yeah, and they got their answerwithin three days of what they
could and could not do.

Speaker 1 (50:34):
So can Matt and I talk to you when we want to.
You know, put an afternoon bitepub and some business offices
there you go.
Of course you can, yeah.

Speaker 3 (50:41):
But you know, the thing is that you know you get
people who they sometimes drawconclusions that aren't there,
okay, and then you knowdevelopers are the worst guys in
the world, Like developers arehuman beings.

Speaker 2 (50:54):
Yeah, they're people.

Speaker 3 (50:55):
They are, and they're decent people.
They work hard, they take allthe risks.
People criticize them, but youknow most of the people who do
the criticism they live in ahouse or an apartment.

Speaker 1 (51:06):
We're in need for homes, we're in need for places
for people to live.
We're in need for economicgrowth.
These are no brainers.
I don't care what side you'reon right now.
I kind of agree on those twothings.
So I can see the value ofhaving these types of
organizations.

Speaker 3 (51:22):
And we have a conference every year in
November.
And we have a conference everyyear in November.
And last year I figured itwould be a good idea to talk to
other municipalities, so we hada municipal panel from West
Hance, the Valley so that wasthe head of planning and
Lunarburg County.
Okay, and one of the thingsthat was brought up by Wolfville
was we had a need for 1800units and we have no idea how

(51:45):
we're going to get them and weonly have 10 years to do it.
Well, you're in the rightaudience, man.

Speaker 1 (51:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (51:50):
I mean, these are guys that put together, you know
, like you know, 400 unitbuildings and how to do it and
do it right.

Speaker 2 (51:57):
In your expertise.
Obviously, like you know you're, you're really I'm really an
ideal person to ask thisquestion to, because you were
obviously three decades inpolitics and now obviously
working in the DevelopmentInstitute.
Given the fact that we need todo such rapid building in order
to fulfill a need and to get toa point where maybe rent can

(52:19):
even start coming down at somepoint, if you had the magic wand
and can do it, what would yousuggest we do right away?

Speaker 3 (52:26):
Well, the Housing Accelerator Fund was an
excellent, excellent start.
Okay, Excellent because itincreased height in certain
areas.
Take, for example, down thesouth end.

Speaker 2 (52:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (52:39):
Right Now I'm dealing with a project now in the south
end which is quite close to thehospital, and there's been some
roadblocks thrown at us Right.
Why would you do that?
You know, if you can providehousing for medical
professionals right that arenext to the hospital, like if
you need something you know fordoctors on call or whatever.

Speaker 1 (53:00):
Right On a bus route.

Speaker 3 (53:01):
That's the perfect definition of where the Housing
salary fund works.
Same with the universities.
You've got properties therethat can be developed and let
the private sector come in.
The students will decide ifthey can afford it or not.
But you're right, we need morehousing stock or not.

(53:22):
But you're right, we need morehousing stock.
So an issue I'm dealing withnow is after the regional plan
was approved.
It brought my attention thatevery space for a multi-unit
building had to have an EV-readycharging stall.
Okay, five to $10,000 per stall, that's what it would cost, not

(53:45):
including the charger.
That is costly, it is, butthat's only part of it.
Yeah, you know, if you have a400-unit building, then you have
to upgrade, like thetransformers.
You have to upgrade the panels,like you increase the amperage
in your services, all kinds ofother costs.

Speaker 1 (54:02):
Yeah, can you get money from the government from
that.

Speaker 3 (54:05):
Nothing that I'm aware of.

Speaker 1 (54:07):
Are the government to mandate the EVs?

Speaker 3 (54:09):
Not aware of right now.
Okay, not for EVs.

Speaker 2 (54:12):
You can get government funding if you want
to put like HVACs or heat pumps.

Speaker 3 (54:16):
Solar panels, stuff like that.
Solar panels, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (54:18):
Like to make your home more efficient.
That's just scary.

Speaker 3 (54:20):
But the city doesn't put gas pumps in every space.
Why an EV charging station?
It doesn't make sense and we'renot against, like UDI is not
opposed to having EV-readystalls.

Speaker 1 (54:33):
Not at all.

Speaker 3 (54:35):
But allow the market.
Like if I have an electricvehicle, I am not going to rent
in a building that doesn't havea charging stall.

Speaker 2 (54:42):
Just simple.

Speaker 3 (54:43):
So the good ones, the good developers, the smart ones
that are forward thinking, ifthey have 100 spaces, maybe
they'll make 20 or 30, 20, 25spaces, with a conduit, at least
for the EVs.

Speaker 1 (54:57):
Yeah 100%.

Speaker 3 (54:59):
And then piece of cake, we just fire the wires
through and away we go.
We're good, but to mandateevery single unit and that's
what we're talking about now wehad a good meeting with the city
last week.

Speaker 1 (55:10):
So they want to mandate the units, every single
unit, because of their mandateto have all electric vehicles in
the future.

Speaker 3 (55:18):
No, Okay, and you know if you follow the news,
electric vehicle sales are goingdown.

Speaker 1 (55:24):
Yeah, they are declining right now.
Yeah, it's a weird year forthat stuff.
Well, there's just a lot oftariffs yeah tariffs and a lot
of economic uncertainty.
Tariffs are some of it.

Speaker 2 (55:33):
Also, I think the number one electric vehicle is
Tesla and people kind of have ahate on Elon right now.

Speaker 3 (55:38):
So that's going to be a driving factor too.

Speaker 2 (55:40):
It's a couple different things.

Speaker 1 (55:42):
I love the concept of hybrid.
I mean, I think that's myfavorite concept when you're
talking EVs because you get thebest of both worlds right Better
fuel economy and Get everythingyeah.
Yeah, you're still drasticallyreducing carbon emissions, but
you're not making it such adesperate attempt for people to
have charged all the time, right, which is going to be
geographically.
It's going to be a problem forCanada for a long time.

(56:03):
Oh my heavens.
Yes, right, because you know,think of how we're laid out.
We're not the same as a bigcity Like we're just very
different.

Speaker 3 (56:09):
We're not Europe.
Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.
Size of Europe and not thedensity.

Speaker 1 (56:14):
Yeah, exactly, we're pretty sparse.

Speaker 2 (56:19):
We're sparse.

Speaker 3 (56:20):
And 300-kilometer-an-hour trains in
Italy.
I love that.
Yeah, yeah, that's cool.
That's great too.
That's cool, you can also drive.

Speaker 2 (56:27):
If your car can get it in Germany, you can get 300
kilometers on the highway too.

Speaker 3 (56:31):
Yeah, that's right.

Speaker 2 (56:33):
But, yeah, I didn't get 300, but I got 224.

Speaker 1 (56:36):
Yeah Cool.

Speaker 2 (56:37):
That was good, right on, it was fun, but it was fun,
but yeah, so I mean that's it.
So, yeah, what are some otherthings?
Because I know this is a hottopic for people right now.
I know you and I had a lot ofdiscussions about housing at the
time.
And this is five years ago,Before we were, I would say, we
were even really in a housingcrisis Because prior to COVID we

(57:02):
didn't have the flock of peoplethat moved here.
We were still having normalrental situations and housing
stuff like that.
And then COVID hit and a bunchof people moved here and people
stopped building.
As you probably knew, peopleweren't building that much
during the first two years ofCOVID kind of thing.
A lot of that halted.

Speaker 3 (57:19):
Well, there were some developers this was recently,
it was a year and a half, twoyears ago that were right on the
edge.
Should I build or park my moneyin a 5% GIC Right?
There were several like that.
Yeah, I bet that's scary, yeah,so nothing's getting built, and
sometimes the process can belong as well.

Speaker 2 (57:39):
Right, right.

Speaker 3 (57:40):
It can be long, it can be cumbersome, yeah, but you
know there was the new it'scalled Posse system for
permitting.
We had quite a few problemswith it.
So instead of complaining aboutit, I got you know four HRM
staff people who deal with thesethings and brought some of the
real experts from UDI and we hada four-hour workshop and said

(58:03):
here's where we need help,here's where we think it works
well.

Speaker 2 (58:06):
And it worked.
Why are we not building likegiant buildings in Halifax,
though?

Speaker 3 (58:10):
People are allergic to height.
Here they are.
I don't know why.

Speaker 1 (58:13):
Is that the fire thing?
Like I saw something the otherweek.

Speaker 2 (58:16):
There is some stuff recently.
Firefighting Firefighting inHalifax was saying they weren't
prepared to fight fires.

Speaker 1 (58:21):
Yeah, I saw something about that.

Speaker 3 (58:22):
Well, maybe with the Halifax or the Housing
Accelerator Fund, they couldtake some of their money and get
some things.
Or, you know, sprinkler, whereNew York can do it, most other
places can do it.
Look at the building right downby the rotary.

Speaker 1 (58:35):
You know, that's a good point where you just said
most other places can do it, wecan do it Right there.

Speaker 2 (58:41):
That has to be a mentality that's embraced a
little more sometimes it canhappen it happens in Toronto and
things like that butpreparation for it is good as
well.
The problem with it is theright funding is not going to
the.
As Steve said, there's a littlebit of an allergic reaction to
height.
For the longest time it's likeyou can't.
You've got to see the harborfrom Citadel Hill, which was

(59:05):
dumb because it's like we're notin wartimes, we have radio and
stuff.
We Citadel Hill, which was dumbbecause it's like we're not in
wartimes, we have radio andstuff.
We didn't need flags tocommunicate with each other
anymore, but there's thatBecause we're not building big
buildings.
Therefore, it's like a catch-22.
The city's not putting fundinginto the fire department to

(59:25):
properly equip them with thethings they need to do this,
because there's like, oh, it'snot really a need, we don't
really go super high anyway.
It's like, well, that's thething we need to start building
them, and then the firedepartment all equally needs the
funding to be able to keep up.
And then there's training on topof it, and training on top of
it, and training on top of it.

Speaker 3 (59:46):
So the other thing, too, is you could go to a public
hearing and there's a proposalfor a 10-story building.
Okay, Some people think that'sthe end of the world, so they
come in too high.
Mass scale wind shadows.
Mass scale wind shadows.

(01:00:06):
There's a checklist of thingsthat people are going to say are
being opposed to this.
Sure, yeah, Right, Too muchtraffic, not enough parking, all
these other things, Right.
And some people say what aboutthe schools?
Well, okay, so if someone whohas children in school goes
somewhere else, they can movesomewhere else.
They don't have to go there.
There's school.

(01:00:26):
Go somewhere else, they canmove somewhere else, they don't
have to go there.
There's options, right, Right,but it's the people who already
have a home and are comfortablethat are, you know, a few times,
are the ones that arecomplaining about things right.

Speaker 1 (01:00:37):
I guess I can empathize with that.
I understand that.
Yeah, yeah, I get that.
But then you've got to kind ofsee how we're gonna.

Speaker 2 (01:00:43):
We gotta figure this stuff out eventually well in
your time in politics you wouldhave dealt a lot with, like the
nimbies as the term goes rightnow.
I didn't even know what a nimbyis?
Oh, it's not in my backyard ohgosh, okay.

Speaker 1 (01:00:55):
Yeah, I've heard that before.

Speaker 3 (01:00:57):
Yeah, okay yeah, so yeah the nimbies of the should
have probably wrote that,written that down and asked
instead of telling everybody.

Speaker 2 (01:01:04):
So that's the thing is like the.
You know there's everyone.
You hear it so much online onFacebook.
So they're like we need housing, we need housing.
And then all of a sudden it'slike okay, great, well, we're
going to put like a 20-storybuilding in your neighborhood,
whoa well.

Speaker 1 (01:01:19):
Not there.

Speaker 2 (01:01:20):
We need housing, just not here.

Speaker 3 (01:01:30):
My favorite is I'm not against development.
But if I had a dollar, If I hada dollar for every time I heard
that, yeah, fair enough, andthey actually believe they're
not against development, butthey are.

Speaker 1 (01:01:39):
Maybe that's what we'll title this episode.
I'm not against development,but I mean there's certainly I
agree with this.

Speaker 2 (01:01:46):
There's some concerns , like I you know there's
infrastructure and legitimateconcerns there's infrastructure
things we need to get done.
I understand, like you know,along the Herring Cove Road
there's going to be somethinglike what is it Like?
Close to 2,800.
I think it's 2,800 units thatare getting built in there, and
so that means there's a lot ofpeople that are going to be put
in there.
And yes, herring Cove Road iscrazy as it is, you travel it

(01:02:07):
all the time.
So Herring Cove Road can getbacked up.
Do we need better roadinfrastructure to get those
people out?

Speaker 3 (01:02:16):
Yeah, we do.
You raised a good point aboutthe 2,800 and people are saying,
well, steve Adams approved allthose.
Well, here are the facts right.
So, greenacres, briarwood right, there was a lot of that was as
of bright, and I remember in2019, 2020, we approved, we

(01:02:37):
changed the zoning to allow somesemis Right.
So that's what I worked toapprove.

Speaker 1 (01:02:46):
The 383 Herring Cove Road?
Are you saying you're not thereason why I drive slower in the
city?
Because none of the stuff I'vebuilt yet?

Speaker 3 (01:02:54):
A thousand comedians at work and you're trying to be
funny.

Speaker 2 (01:02:58):
But 383 Herring Cove.

Speaker 3 (01:02:59):
Road right, which they could have had the standard
four-story block, but instead a60-unit building with
affordable units, and thosestarted at $1,400 for a single
one-bedroom, one-bathroom, withquartz countertops and stainless
appliances.

Speaker 1 (01:03:15):
Right.

Speaker 3 (01:03:17):
And the end of Lynette Road.
Yeah, the other one is, youknow, 43 or 46 units there.

Speaker 2 (01:03:23):
It's a nice building, though the one rated.
It's beautiful Right behind youknow 43 or 46 units there.
That's a nice building, thoughthe one right behind the mall.

Speaker 3 (01:03:27):
There, like you said, it's beautiful and the bonus
there it's underground parkingand the fellow Fulton Scrozer he
built my house for me but hedug everything out put a million
dollars in remediation to thatsite because it was a former
Shell gas station.

Speaker 2 (01:03:40):
That's right.
That's right.
I remember the gas station.

Speaker 3 (01:03:42):
So that remediation in the other way wouldn't have
been, it would have been serviceparking.

Speaker 2 (01:03:47):
I mean some of the developers in the area have been
pretty generous.
I mean Peter Pauly.

Speaker 3 (01:03:51):
I'll say that Wonderful guy.

Speaker 2 (01:03:53):
I was on the board when we got Long Lake working.
I mean, you sat in all themeetings too.
But yeah, I was on the board.
And the amount of money thatPeter put into Long Lake, he
donated all the gravel that goesto the trails six kilometers of
trails, Okay, he bulldozed thetrails, Wow, and he I mean it
was a win-win situation.

(01:04:14):
Spryfield and the surroundingareas got a really great park.
Beautiful park and in return,peter Pauly, who was building a
community across the street, gotto say my community that I'm
building, that I want to sellhouses to, is right across from
a really nice provincial park.
It's a win-win, but there'snothing wrong with that and for
the people mostly.

Speaker 1 (01:04:31):
They're the ones who benefit the most.
We've got to get into our 10questions, Matt.
So sorry we went over time, butthat's great.
That's a good thing aboutpodcasts you can do these as
long as you want.

Speaker 3 (01:04:42):
Whatever you want, right, there's no one really
telling us to stop, except formy kid.
I probably have to stop atsunup.

Speaker 1 (01:04:50):
I'm supposed to be at an ice cream social here at 630
.
So we've got to wrap it up, ohand catch Harbor.

Speaker 2 (01:04:54):
Yeah, that's right there you go.

Speaker 1 (01:04:58):
That's good too.
There you go.
Okay, so this is Well.
I thought that was a fun part.

Speaker 2 (01:05:01):
Well, it's all fun this is the lightning round.

Speaker 1 (01:05:04):
They're dumb questions, silly questions.
Some of them are smart, but youknow, just want to get a quick
answer from your lightning round.
Yeah, so I'll start.
If you want, go for it.
Is that cool?
Yep, okay.
In the recent events on MorrisStreet in Halifax, bike lanes,
or is that lane?

Speaker 3 (01:05:21):
Is what?
What do you think?

Speaker 1 (01:05:21):
about bike lanes on Morris Street, the one way.
Did you hear about this?

Speaker 3 (01:05:25):
I heard about it and I know that the port was opposed
to it.
I tell you I don't pay muchattention to that kind of stuff
anymore, right, and I don't havethe information that council
has to make that decision right.

Speaker 1 (01:05:37):
Yeah, that's a safe answer, true, okay, good, okay,
next question, matt.

Speaker 2 (01:05:43):
All right.
Should HRM taxpayers contributeto a stadium?

Speaker 3 (01:05:47):
Yes, I like that answer and I'll tell you why.
No.
The same night that they saidno to the $25 million CFL
stadium, which I told theLeBlanc guy don't call it that.
Yes, it's a stadium.
Yeah, council approved $16million for the Commons waiting
pool, which is used six monthsof the year and never for the

(01:06:09):
rest of it.
But a stadium could be usedyear-round, that's right.
Don't call it a CFL stadium,because what's that?
Eight to ten games?
Yeah, or ten games, but whatabout the universities for
soccer and football?
What about high school?

Speaker 2 (01:06:21):
Taylor Swift.

Speaker 1 (01:06:22):
There, you go, let me get her on the line.

Speaker 3 (01:06:25):
I'll get her to play For concerts.
There's all kinds of eventsthat could have occurred there.
They say that the stadiumwouldn't generate any income or
anything.
Well, I'll tell you, until theystart charging those children
to go to the pool, they're notgoing to generate any income
either.

Speaker 1 (01:06:41):
No, that's fair.
Yeah, and the culture haschanged here.
It's so much more different, soyou don't just have to think of
what we would be accused of.
There's so many other uses fora stadium.

Speaker 3 (01:06:49):
Well, it was framed incorrectly, because, oh yeah,
you've got millionaires gettingtheir free stadium.
I don't think you combine all12 players on the field.
They don't make a million bucks.

Speaker 1 (01:07:06):
Not in CFL.
No.
So much for one word answer.
That's all good.
My turn, yeah.
Your turn Okay.
One regret or thing you wouldhave done differently in life if
given a second chance, so youcan pull this from anywhere,
just say one regret you have orone thing you said ah geez, I
would have done that differentlyif you reframed it.

Speaker 3 (01:07:16):
August of 1978, August 3rd, 10 to 4.
What Sorry.
1978, August 3rd, 10 to 4.
10 to 4.
I was on my motorbike going outto and Matt would know, you
would know this too Sure, thefour-way stop at Rocking Stone
Road and Old Sanford Road.

Speaker 1 (01:07:36):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:07:37):
I went out there.
I was going to go up there andthen around, leave and drive,
come back home, and a Mack truckcame around the corner, bolted
his fellow up and hit me.

Speaker 2 (01:07:45):
Oh wow, I didn't know that.

Speaker 3 (01:07:48):
Now I could have taken him two out of three, but
it ruined my knee.
I had three surgeries since, ohwell, and I had a chance to be
on the Nova Scotia games soccerteam and called my coach in
tears.
I couldn't play.

Speaker 1 (01:08:05):
Changed your life.
Jeez, wow it did.
But you know something?

Speaker 3 (01:08:09):
That.
Maybe that accident changedsomething else that could have
been worse.

Speaker 1 (01:08:15):
Oh, the Naples and other stuff too.
Yeah yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:08:18):
Cool, all right.
Next question for here.

Speaker 3 (01:08:20):
I'll be a little more specific next time.

Speaker 2 (01:08:23):
Should the mayor have superpowers?

Speaker 3 (01:08:25):
I have no idea, because I don't know what they
are.
I don't know what they are.
I don't know what he can andcannot do.
I think there's an argument tobe made.
If these were to be considered,he could have done it before
the election, fair enough.
But I don't know what theyentail.
I hear that you can fire andhire senior staff, but not fire

(01:08:48):
and police.

Speaker 1 (01:08:49):
I don't know the ramifications of it, right, I
don't know we might have to gethim on to see what the
frustrations are.
That's what's going to happen.
How are you All right?
Silly question here now.
If you had to eat steak dinneror lobster dinner for one full
week, which would you choose?
Steak, steak, steak man.

Speaker 3 (01:09:10):
And if you had a third option cod I'd take cod
instead of all two of them.

Speaker 1 (01:09:14):
Cod over lunch In a New York minute done properly
with scrunchins oh there you go.

Speaker 3 (01:09:19):
Scrunchins.

Speaker 1 (01:09:20):
A little brewis on the side.
No, no, no brewis, but you knowthey call them brewies in
Newfoundland.

Speaker 3 (01:09:27):
There's a place in Newfoundland Bay, roberts
Donner's Country Kitchen and the.
Silverwood Inn Motel.

Speaker 2 (01:09:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:09:32):
And I used to go there.
It was a beautiful piece ofpan-fried cod.
It was hanging over the edgewith fresh-cut fries, steamed
vegetables, butterscotchcheesecake and a glass of ginger
ale.
For twenty dollars, and it wasa meal made for a king amazing I
take that over a steak and uhor lobster any day all right,

(01:09:52):
all right.

Speaker 2 (01:09:53):
Here's an easy, fun question.
They're all easy and fun, yeah,non-political though.
I know you're a sports guy, sotell me, in your opinion, who is
the goat of each of the majorfour?
So, hockey, baseball, football,basketball.
Who's the goat of each of themajor four?
So hockey, baseball, football,basketball.
Who's?

Speaker 3 (01:10:09):
the goat in each of them.
Michael Jordan, wayne GretzkyBaseball's a tough one yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:10:24):
Hmm.

Speaker 3 (01:10:29):
I would say Ken Griffey Jr.
That's a good pick, ken GriffeyJr, he could hit, he could
field, he could run.
He never got in trouble, that'strue.

Speaker 1 (01:10:41):
Never got in trouble, Never thought about that In
football there's, I know yourguy.

Speaker 3 (01:10:44):
I know your guy Never thought about that.
And in football, there's I knowyour guy.
Yeah, yeah, I know your guy,it's the guy.

Speaker 2 (01:10:50):
Well, there you go.

Speaker 3 (01:10:52):
Let's try not to influence this.
I still think it's more relatedto the era, because with Brady,
I mean he was drafted by theMontreal Expos, right, that's
right.
Yeah, he was a catcher, so he,you know, in his era best ever.
Yeah, but Joe Montana in hisera right.

Speaker 2 (01:11:11):
Yeah, Best ever.
Montana was the best ever.
Yeah, Now in the 70s.

Speaker 3 (01:11:14):
Like I mean Terry Bradshaw, I'll say his team,
unfortunately.
Yes, he was all right, but hewas not the best quarterback of
that era.
Yeah, no, that's true, but youremember back then see some of
the like Jack Lambert's, myfavorite professional athlete of
all time.

Speaker 2 (01:11:28):
I know you're a Lynn Swan guy too.
I thought you talked about thatbefore.
No, I didn't mind him right.

Speaker 3 (01:11:34):
He said how come you're so fast?
He says, well, I had to leavepractice early 15 minutes to
learn to run fast.
But, like you, look at whatJack Lambert, Dick Butkus, those
guys did, Guys coming acrossforearms and everything, Powell
driving guys, right, the 80s hasslacked up a bit and then you

(01:11:54):
know, I mean they protect thequarterbacks now, so much.
It's a different game.
It's a different game.
So I'd say Brady and thenMontana, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:12:07):
All right Over to you All right.
So I saw in 2016,.
Jacob Boom from the coast atthat time asked you 15 questions
that were quite similar to whatwe're doing right now, and I
just I like doing a littleresearch just before we got into
this.
So my favorite answer was whatyou said about bureaucracy and
HRM.
You said, regardless of theissue, waiting two to three
years for an answer is notacceptable.
What are your thoughts on theissues that Halifax Regional

(01:12:29):
Municipality face today?

Speaker 3 (01:12:34):
The development processes have gotten better,
right, but they can alwaysimprove right, and I know some
people if they get somethingdone in six months then they
want four.
But I think you know with theprocesses and Amherst has a
really good model Right now withthe city you would have a.
You know, you put your, getyour proposal, submit it to
staff and then they set it up tocouncil for initiation and then

(01:12:58):
they'd start the process InAmherst.
What they do is they do thesame process, except the first
time it comes before anygoverning body it goes to the
PAC and a public informationmeeting.
So you find out what's going onat the beginning, what people
like, what they don't like.

(01:13:19):
I have a proposal on the booksup there now.
It started off with sevenmultis, now it's four.
It's got some buffering for theexisting homes, buffering for
the swampland, and now they'reworking on a model that
everybody is basically on sidewith or at least the majority of
people are Instead of gettingto your public information

(01:13:40):
meeting a year and a half downthe road and waiting eight more
months to get the results ofthat tabulated.

Speaker 1 (01:13:46):
Right, so they're automating the process to make
it faster.

Speaker 3 (01:13:48):
Yeah, it makes a ton of sense and I find, look, you
know, I've always been asupporter of HRM staff, but
they've got to learn to make amistake and not be worried about
making.
Make a mistake Right, dosomething that is outside, Feel
uncomfortable about it, becausean answer that's wrong can be
fixed.
No answer, there's no hope.

(01:14:09):
Yeah, Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:14:13):
I think this is our last question.
No, okay, let's be number nine.
Then, yeah, you go ahead.

Speaker 2 (01:14:18):
So, because you've been through all of this
hindsight, 2020, wasamalgamation the best one for
HRM.

Speaker 3 (01:14:26):
There's a multifaceted answer there.
So, put in perspective, halifaxwas on schedule to be debt-free
in 1999.
Right, 250th anniversary.
Dartmouth had a $110 milliondeficit.
Dartmouth had a $110 milliondeficit and I think their

(01:14:47):
current $100 million deficit intheir current budget is $130
million, right, right and inline for a huge increase because
they had Lake Major that theyhad to bring in Bedford.
Bedford had a similar percapita cost, as did Dartmouth,

(01:15:09):
and the county was in for apretty big increase in
assessment.
Big thing like that, like a bigarea, is difficult.

Speaker 2 (01:15:14):
Right.

Speaker 3 (01:15:15):
So, and I've got that's going to be part of my
book, I've got, I'm going to getan account to look at the
financial statements at 1996,April 1stst or March 31st
That'll tell the tale.

Speaker 2 (01:15:28):
Or at least part of it.
Yeah, exactly, halifax Council,hra Council is not allowed to
have a deficit like they're notallowed unless the province
grants it.

Speaker 3 (01:15:37):
Yeah, but they're not going to run any deficits.

Speaker 2 (01:15:42):
No, exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:15:43):
And raise taxes right .

Speaker 2 (01:15:45):
Yeah, that's a whole other issue.
Yeah, All right, last question,Last question Stephen.

Speaker 1 (01:15:49):
So we ask every guest this one what's one piece of
advice you were given in yourlifetime that you'd like to pass
down?
It could be given to you fromanybody.

Speaker 3 (01:15:58):
My dad said if you're going to help somebody, help
them with no expectation ofanything in return.
Perfect the Spryfield way Righton.

Speaker 1 (01:16:08):
There you go.
Very good, gentlemen, all right.
Well, one last cheers.
Did Mike last go?
Yeah, she took it, but anywaycheers.

Speaker 3 (01:16:15):
They can't see that.

Speaker 2 (01:16:18):
And just as a shout-out, a thank you very much
to the Clayton Park Bar andGrill, that's right they hosted
us here.
So very much to the ClaytonPark Bar and Grill.
That's right, they hosted ushere, so very much.
Appreciate them allowing us torecord another session here.
So thank you very much.

Speaker 1 (01:16:31):
Thanks Dan All right.

Speaker 2 (01:16:32):
Take care, gentlemen, cheers.

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Stephen Adams - Life Beyond City Hall - Sharks, Stadiums, Spryfield and Building Upward

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Stephen Adams - Life Beyond City Hall - Sharks, Stadiums, Spryfield and Building Upward