August 14, 2025 • 37 mins
What good is 'innovation in edtech' if millions of students can't access it?
Dr. Keisha King takes us on her journey from classroom teacher to education technology leader at T-Mobile, showing how authentic educator perspectives can transform tech initiatives in schools. With a background in virtual schooling and curriculum development, Dr. King brings a uniquely grounded approach to her work in connecting millions of students to the Internet.
At the heart of Dr. King's philosophy is a powerful framework: "Curriculum is the foundation, pedagogy is the method, and technology is the support." This perspective has guided her leadership of Project 10Million, T-Mobile's $10.7 billion commitment that has connected over 6 million students across 4,000 school districts with no-cost hotspots and five years of service.
Despite that progress, Dr. King candidly acknowledges the digital divide's persistence as pandemic-era connectivity programs expire. "Under-served populations are accustomed to programs coming and going," she notes, highlighting how short-term interventions often leave students with devices that become "paperweights" without ongoing connectivity. This reality creates real challenges as schools adopt AI and other advanced technologies, potentially widening rather than narrowing opportunity gaps.
Our conversation with Dr. King offers invaluable insight for educators, technology leaders, and policymakers who are navigating the intersection of innovation and access in schools. Her approach (listening deeply to educators' needs rather than prescribing solutions) provides a powerful model for corporate-education partnerships that truly serve students and their communities.
Learn more about Dr. Kiesha King and T-Mobile's Project 10Million:
aiEDU: The AI Education Project
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (00:05):
Dr Keisha King.
You're an educator and yet youfind yourself now at, you know,
one of the largest technologycompanies in the world.
You know, doing work across thecountry Like how did you get to
where?
Yeah, what does that journeylook like for someone to be in
the classroom and working inschools?
Kiesha King (00:24):
Yeah, it's definitely so different.
I feel like just yesterday Iwas in a classroom with kiddos,
right, and it's funny, Iremember when I first got here I
used to I was still callingthem my babies.
I'm like you know, what are wegoing to do with the babies?
What happens, you know?
And I'm like, okay, there's,there's big babies and small
babies we're talking about here.
So I came from this space ofbeing a teacher, went into kind
(00:47):
of leading a virtual school froma principal perspective and
then moved into curriculum andtechnology innovation and what
that looks like from anintegrative like model within
schools, and then transitionfrom there and building virtual
schools into this idea of, well,I can build virtual schools
anywhere, but what does thatlook like from a strategic
(01:10):
perspective, designing it fromlike a county agency or a
community college or a stateeducation agency?
And so I started my own companyand started building all over
the country.
And then T-Mobile I was one ofT-Mobile's first education
customers in the school districtI was in.
We had around 70,000 kiddos,very high percentage of free and
(01:34):
reduced lunch in that district.
Which district was this?
It was Aldi and ISD out ofHouston, yeah, and so I was one
of T-Mobile's first customersthere, because for virtual
school, obviously you're goingto have gaps and access, right.
So kiddos are going home, we'rebuilding all these amazing
virtual courses, but they didn'thave devices and they didn't
(01:57):
have connectivity.
And so I worked with T-Mobileto provide that for them and
T-Mobile said hey.
A few years later, with T-Mobileto provide that for them, and
T-Mobile said hey.
A few years later, they saidhey, can you come and help us
build an education segment?
And so I came on board to startworking with what they were
just launching the EmpowerEdaward program.
So I came in and kind of workedon building up that program to
(02:19):
capacity and then I think we hadconnected maybe around 20,000
students at the time and we justknew that there was this huge
trajectory for growth in theeducation market.
Right, it was just necessary.
You know, access is somethingakin to, you know, having
electricity.
It is at the core of makingsure you have everything you
(02:41):
need.
When we talk about innovation,none of it could happen if no
one has access to the internetand tools, resources that they
need.
And so when I got to about 2.6million students connected with
the team of Wolfer GovernmentTeam, we inherited Sprint, so we
had this, you know, this greatmerging of teams coming together
(03:01):
and Sprint's education team wasalready doing the One Million
Project, which they were doingphenomenal work over there with
Dan Copps and his team, and sowe really just came together as
this unique organization withthis highly philanthropic
background, but this coreindustry driving kind of desire,
(03:24):
and brought all that togetherand launched Project 10 Million,
which was a $10.7 billioncommitment to bridge the digital
divide, and today we're over 6million kiddos connected in over
4,000 school districts.
So we've come a long way.
We still have a long way to go,I think, looking at a lot of
the investments that T-Mobilehas made in respect to the
(03:46):
network and, you know, thinkingabout all the research and
policy and all the things thathave taken place to make sure
that we're being innovative, butwe're also thinking about the
infrastructure that's requiredto support that innovation.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (04:10):
I think that part's been really
important.
So I'm proud to just be a partof a part of the conversation
and a part of, you know, thechange agent in making biggest
districts in the country.
Kiesha King (04:23):
Yeah.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (04:23):
Before.
This is way before the pandemic.
This is like.
This is literally as educationis starting to figure out.
Oh wait, we can actually doonline learning.
Kiesha King (04:32):
This is like years before, years before and I would
probably say maybe around 2008or 2009,.
You know, I just fell into thislove for technology and Sony
put PlayStation 1s for digitalliteracy in my classroom, you
know, and it just, it justspurred this spark of innovation
(04:55):
in me to say what else ispossible?
Right?
How else can I expand thislearning journey?
How how can we think outside ofthe box with education?
And I've been there ever since.
I'm still there today.
You know, I live in thisorganization from a work
perspective, but I have thisreally unique opportunity to
build strategy here, right?
(05:16):
Like, how do we think aboutleveraging 5G technologies and
within the realm of educationand government and digital
equity and all these other kindof buzzwords that we talk about
so much?
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (05:31):
Yeah, how does it feel?
I mean because this is not yourfirst rodeo and you know I was
at the ASU GSB Summit.
You've been how many times haveyou been, is it like?
Was that a number to?
Kiesha King (05:41):
you.
Yeah, I've been there a fewtimes.
I have a unique opportunity togo and speak and meet my friends
, like you, so yeah, it's been.
It's been fun.
That's just one of the forums,though, right, like there's so
many, how do you prioritize them?
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (05:56):
Well, that's, that's a yeah.
How long do you have?
Um, but but my, I guess.
I guess what I'm getting at isyou know, this year at the ACGC
summit it was, it was might aswell have been the ACGC AI
summit.
You know that AI was, yeah,almost every conversation in
some way was artificial and Imissed the AI show this year.
Kiesha King (06:16):
I really wanted to go.
I had another commitment so Icouldn't make it.
I had to get my daughter readyfor prom.
I was like, ok, I can't missdoing what has to come first.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (06:27):
Oh see, you were in San Diego last week.
Kiesha King (06:29):
No, I was supposed to be in San Diego last week.
I was in Houston and then Iended up in Boston because I was
asked to speak at Harvard attheir innovation summit.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (06:39):
Oh, that's cool.
Kiesha King (06:40):
Okay, yeah, it was nice and I flew back home.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (06:43):
That's cool .
Okay, yeah, it was nice and Iflew back home, but I'm sure
this is the I mean, I'm sure atmost of the education
conferences and summits thatyou've attended over the past
let's say, two years, it's feltlike very heavy and like bring
(07:10):
us back to sort of this momentwhere the Internet is starting
to mature, you know video andlike bandwidth is unlocking the
ability to do sort ofsynchronous video and certainly
asynchronous video.
Was there sort of a similarlevel of exuberance?
Was it sort of like everyconversation was about online
learning or the internet, or didit have that zeitgeist feeling
that, like AI has right now?
Kiesha King (07:17):
I think so, but I think that it just rapidly.
You know AI.
You can talk about AI every daywithin a different framework
and still be talking about AI,right, and I think that's the
thing that's so exciting aboutit.
It feels like it's just neverending, like we will probably be
in the throes of AI for, youknow, as long as we can think.
I think at that time you knowaround.
(07:40):
You know between 2010, 2012,.
We're looking at E-rate andmodernization.
We're thinking about how do wecreate.
You know, between 2010, 2012,.
We're looking at E-rate andmodernization.
We're thinking about how do wecreate, you know, a 99.9% Wi-Fi
infrastructure across K-12school districts all over the
country, right, so theconversations were very
different, but I think, as westarted to address those things
(08:00):
and figure out exactly how right, like oh, we can't do the
access points like this weactually need to think about,
you know, how do we run fiberand what does that look like and
how do we make sure we have thebandwidth and capacity required
to manage all these kids andwhat happens on, you know,
thursdays, when they're alltesting at the same time or they
all get on teacher tube at thesame, whatever, it is right.
(08:20):
So we're kind of overcomingthose things.
And then we moved into the nextphase and I think online
learning was kind of this allthe way for a long time, but I
think it was.
So it felt so contradictory toteaching right To like,
in-person teaching.
So there was this challengeabout it that said like okay,
well, you know, if we're goingto build online learning, then
(08:41):
what does that mean for ourteachers?
Right Like, and are we tryingto replace teachers?
What does that?
You know what does that looklike?
And there's a saying I used toalways say you know, curriculum
is the foundation, pedagogy isthe method and technology is the
support.
And I would say this you know,I kind of was open with that all
the time because I never wantedteachers or people, even people
(09:04):
outside of education from aprivate-public partnership
perspective to think that therewas any confusion around
curriculum and teaching andlearning being at the core right
of how we work with our kiddos,and that was a big part of the
framework and the conversationjust continued to evolve.
Now I think we're seeing thetechnology evolve really quickly
(09:26):
, but we're seeing on a higherlevel, the conversations stay
consistent, and that's where AIhas consistently been at the
core of our conversations for anextended period of time now and
, honestly, I mean, aiedu wasone of the first conversations
that I had, one of the first,like uniform organizations, that
(09:46):
said this is what we want totalk about and this is what we
want to address, and it wasn'tpiecemeal like there was 15
different priorities.
It was this is the priority,this is the focus and this is
the conversation.
Right, yes, we're going to growwith it and evolve with it, but
this is essentially where wewant to focus and I admire that.
I mean again, you've seen itover the years.
(10:08):
I've seen it over the years,but I've also seen it
matriculate really quickly and Ithink sitting in this space is
really, really important.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (10:17):
Yeah, well, you have, I mean we, we, we
kind of did call it Um, and so,you know, you know I, I will.
I'm increasingly just sort of,you know, trying not to be sort
of like a um, you know, almostlike a passive, aggressively
humble, you know, like no, likewe, really like we, like we
(10:40):
really had, like we, we got onething really right, but I think
the other, like you, actuallyget to something that that we,
that I am obsessed with,speaking of what we're obsessed
with, um, so, at not just asv,gsv, but really like all the ai
and education summits, um, mostof the focus is on the tools,
right, like 95 of theconversations that were
(11:02):
happening in San Diego last weekwere how do we use AI to
improve teaching and learning,to help teachers, to help them
save time, support, tutoring, etcetera, et cetera, many, many
different sort of like flavorsof this.
And we don't offer a tool and Iactually had a little bit of
FOMO, I'll be honest, becauseyou know it's hard to go into
(11:23):
all these for a tool, and Iactually had a little bit of
fomo, I'll be honest, becauseyou know it's hard to go into
all these like and there waslike a few funder receptions
that are like, oh, we're, we'relaunching a new fund
specifically for people buildingai tools and I'm like, oh well,
that's really not us.
Um, yeah, so there was a littlebit of fomo there, but at the
same time, um, I, I feelconfident that we really stand
out, because our, our whole pushis that there's like two sides
(11:46):
of this equation.
There's like the technologyside, which is important, if not
critical, but the much harderwork is in the human side of the
equation.
You know, there's like there's13,000 school districts, there's
like almost 4 million teachers,50 million plus kids yeah 100
(12:07):
million parents, 50 stateagencies, and it's all
decentralized and it'sfragmented and it's not
interconnected.
There's no, uh, there's a lotless collaboration than than
what you'd you'd hope wouldexist.
And so it's we.
We have a very big, complicated, maybe one of the most
complicated human systems, uh,in the U?
(12:30):
S, maybe in the world, um, andwe are trying to help it change
and evolve at a timeline thatfeels unique.
I think, you know, the internethappened gradually enough, like
we all remember.
The first time we had dial-up,and then it was like several
years later and then you hadslightly faster internet and
then, you know, suddenly you hadcomputer labs.
(12:52):
I mean, what's happening now isyou have, you know, on a monthly
basis, you know, breakthroughdevelopments in technology,
immediate proliferation ofaccess to teachers and students,
yeah, and so there's there'sthis question of how are we
going to help this verycomplicated system adapt?
And to me, what you're sort ofgetting at is like there's the
(13:26):
big idea of how do we usetechnology to, as you say,
support the work of education,which is really a way of saying,
educators, but then how doeducators need to adapt,
teaching and learning, giventhat AI is not just going to be
used to support educators, it'sgoing to be used to support
every other domain in the, inthe economy.
Yeah, all the career pathwaysare going to start incorporating
ai and potentially shiftingquite significantly.
Like that, like people, peoplein silicon valley are just like
(13:47):
it's a it's a foregoneconclusion that ai is going to
like massively disrupt computerscience, for example.
Um, so, so yeah, I mean likedouble clicking on this idea of
how do we center teachers, um,what are some strategies?
Because you, you mean, you'veyou spent a long time, you know,
(14:08):
like at in district leadership,so you kind of know what it's
like to be on the other side ofthe equation and now you're sort
of you're not really a vendorbecause you're actually giving a
lot of resources for free toschools.
So I'm sure it's like adifferent type of meeting than
like people that are hustlingand trying to sell stuff.
But like, what does it looklike to engage educators and ed
leaders in a way that's reallyauthentic and that doesn't just
(14:31):
make them feel like you're sortof presupposing the technology
is sort of going to be thesavior for all of their problems
?
Kiesha King (14:37):
I mean, in any conversation it starts with
listening, right?
I mean we know that privatepublic partnership is at the
core of the type of growth thatwe need to see in the education
world.
It can't happen single-handedlyon either side of the house
(15:00):
else.
And so you know, just beingopen to listen to what schools
need, understanding that theyall have different needs and
different leaders have differentperspectives on how to solve
those needs.
I think from an industry, youknow framework, we have to be
open to just really sitting downwith school district leaders
and a lot of times I go in and Ijust say, well, like can we
just sit down and whiteboardthis out?
Like can we bring in yourleadership team and just talk
(15:23):
about it as a problem solutionframework or as a here's the
direction we want to go, here'sthe end goal?
Let's do some backwardsplanning and talk about what
that can look like.
Right, because in most places,99.9% of schools have like the
infrastructure on campus inorder to support.
You know Wi-Fi and those typesof things, but when you start
(15:45):
getting into e-sports, you startgetting into immersive learning
.
You know drone technology,other types of AI development
that depends on low latency.
Now you can have biggerconversations around.
Do you really have theinfrastructure that you need to
drive the innovation that you'rehoping to drive?
Some school districts that's apriority.
(16:05):
Other school districts it's notnecessarily a priority, but
they're open to the conversationto say, like, what exactly do
we need?
Is there a certain subset ofstudents that, like, deserves to
have access to this?
You know I love what youmentioned earlier because you
made me think about this exampleI use from Sir Ken Robinson
sometimes when I'm talking, andit's just this idea that you
(16:27):
know there's this time you hadto.
You know, light a match andlight something to make the
lights come on Right, and thenyou get to this point where you
got to flip a switch and now youwalk in the room and the lights
just know you're there, right,and that's what's happening with
this world of AI.
We're sitting and we'repreparing and try and think
about how we create thestructures and I had a word for
(17:04):
it before and I was talkingabout it when I was on stage at
South by Southwest EDU.
But it's what does a structurelook like for education?
How do we create the same waythat we sit down and we do our
curriculum writing in summer andwe do all the alignments and we
think about how we want tointegrate this into, you know,
(17:25):
the world of our kids and getthem test ready, right, like in
world ready and workforce ready.
How do we do that same type ofthing with AI in a way that
creates structure that caneliminate some of the fear?
Right, and that's anothercomponent of this that I think
AIEDU really like hits the nailon the head with.
(17:45):
And you've been kind of openingthe doors to that for so long
and saying, right, like, yes,all these technologies are
amazing and the direction of AIand the growth it's going to
happen, whether we want it tohappen or not, right.
But how do we align that from apolicy perspective?
How do we create some structuresand standards right for this
new technology that allows us tointegrate it in a way that's
(18:06):
safe, that protects our kiddos'privacy, that, you know, makes
sure that they have the literacythe AI literacy needed in order
to use the technology?
You know, that's really been alot of the focus for me right in
this transition Like how can I,when I'm sitting across from
(18:26):
school district leaders, reallylisten intently in a way that
says, right, I understand whatit is you know, and there's a
baseline there.
I want to contribute what Iknow and create a joint baseline
.
And then how do we now go builda priority structure that can
(18:46):
allow your kiddos to experiencethe best, brightest future
that's available to them andyour teachers?
Right, I love your point.
And like how do you enableteachers Because you know you
can put the devices and thetechnology and the resources
there all day long but unlessyou create again the standards
and framework for therequirement for use and the
(19:06):
requirement for integration andmake sure that they're
upskilling in a way that letsthem do that, you're going to be
in a difficult position, right?
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (19:15):
So yeah, that's a really great question
but I mean, I mean what I'mhearing.
Is this, this idea that you'renot entering the conversations,
um, with this assumption that,like you know what's best,
you're really engaging thesystem leaders to like, like,
like they need to chart thestrategy you um have a vested
(19:36):
interest in their success.
But you also recognize thatthere's like super
multidimensional and there's alot of different interconnected
pieces that you're notnecessarily going to be able to
help them with.
But part of it is, I thinkthere is value in sort of like
sketching it out, because allthe things that you just
described you basicallydescribed the um you know core
(19:59):
components of an ai readinessstrategy.
Right, it's like, yeah, um,it's not just about what tool,
it's like what tool that fitswithin your procurement
guidelines.
And if you don't haveguidelines, well, you need to
have a plan to deal with thefact that there are no
guidelines and you need to havealignment with your goals on,
(20:21):
and requirements on, privacy andstudent safety.
And.
But I wonder if you have one ofthe easier jobs in this space,
because the necessary conditionto all of that is access to the
Internet.
Kiesha King (20:36):
Yeah.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (20:37):
Right and so yeah, for sure.
And can you tell me about?
I mean, I sometimes I worrythat there's all this exuberance
about AI and coming out ofCOVID, there's now this
assumption that we've solved theproblem of of access, of
broadband access.
And I'm curious for your takeon that, like how, how close are
we and how far are we?
Kiesha King (20:59):
We're far.
I mean we still have a long wayto go.
You know, we have millions andmillions of folks all over the
country that still lack um thatcore internet access right.
We, uh, we saw the end of theum ACP.
We saw the end of the uh, theaffordable connectivity plan.
Got it Right.
(21:19):
So that was, you know, amultimillion dollar project to
provide connectivity to familiesand communities that had the
need.
We saw the end of that lastspring.
We saw the end of the emergencyconnectivity plan Right, that
was, you know, billions ofdollars set aside to make sure
that kiddos had connectivityoutside of the traditional
(21:39):
school day.
That was initiated through thepandemic.
We saw NTIA come in and say youknow what, we are going to
dedicate one point two, fivebillion dollars for this
competitive digital equity grantand all these other things.
Some of those things are, youknow, paused now until, you know
, we sort through some thingsfrom a policy perspective.
We saw, you know, we see allthese government programs kind
(22:04):
of come and go, and I thinkwe've seen this over time, right
, we've seen this over the years.
These different programs and Ithink, unfortunately,
underserved populations areaccustomed to programs coming
and going.
Right, you know, for a year wehave this and then we don't have
it anymore, and a year we havethat eligible student households
to qualify for a no-costhotspot and five years of
(22:25):
connectivity previously 100 gigsper year and now 200 gigs per
(22:50):
year as of this last year, and Ithink it's exciting to see,
timo will not only continue thatcommitment into its fifth year
now, but also double down right.
And that's been really exciting, particularly where it comes in
and says this is going to bedirectly to the consumer and the
family, right?
So the family can just go tothe website, put in their
information, without the creditchecks and the hassles and all
that, and it's just shippeddirectly to the home.
(23:11):
That's a really specialsituation that you know.
A lot of times you're havingthis conversation and you're
saying I know, for me, I talkwith other vendors, I talk with
private entities, I talk withall types of folks, even
conferences, and I say is thereany way you can tell the people
coming to your conference aboutProject 10 Million?
(23:32):
And a lot of times you know,the response that I get is well,
can you pay us for us to tellthem about this?
Right, like.
And I totally understand that.
But I think there is an elementthat says right for the folks
that I'm hoping to serve.
I want to make sure they havethe absolute best value for what
(23:53):
I'm providing for them, and apart of that value is for me to
put every program and resourcein front of them that's going to
come in and do great work.
Yes, it is a K-12 program, butguess what?
If they're a senior in highschool, that's still five years
of connectivity that can supporttheir post-secondary education.
Like you know, to me I thinkit's a no-brainer.
(24:16):
You know, johnny, sitting atthe front of you, front of his
mom's job, waiting for her toget off work, can now continue
searching or can Google a randomthought about how to fix his
bike.
Those are the things that makekiddos smarter, right, and it's
something that for me, it justmeans so much.
It just means so much, and Ithink we miss the mark on
(25:00):
opportunities to continue toshare.
When an organization decides todo something this big, it's
massive.
Right, there's no red tape,there's nothing else involved,
it's just a massive commitmentand it was a massive undertaking
to build.
But I think me, leading thispart of T-Mobile's work allows
me to sit in spaces with youknow, it almost feels like no
skin in the game, other thansaying I want us all to do
really, really good work, right,like what incentivizes you, and
let's figure out how we buildaround that.
And I can do it purely, and Ican do it from a framework of
(25:21):
the expertise that I built overthe last two decades and I'm
excited to keep doing it, alex,like I really am.
I think there's an element ofhumility that has to come in
when you are sitting across fromsomeone and you say I just want
to hear you, right, like I'mdoing this big stuff and we got
these things going on, but maybethat's not really the answer to
(25:44):
what like, to what you actuallyneed.
Maybe it's a mindset, maybeit's a maybe.
Maybe you don't know how toconnect the dots between this
great offer and the next stepsthat you're hoping to go, like,
how do we figure that part out?
Right, and so that's the pieceI think that I'm going to
continue to really just hone inon.
(26:05):
Are we exacerbating some of ourproblems because we're afraid
that there's no structure aroundwhat's new and what's
innovative?
I wonder that, right, I knowthat there's fear because AI is
there.
You know, I think there was aGallup poll that found that
maybe 28% of students reportedthat their schools allowed AI
(26:28):
use.
Now, obviously, this is forstudents, right?
But why the fear?
Right and most of the time.
If I were to ask you right now,alex, if you had access to all
the information in the world,all the information.
You could ask any question youwant.
What would you do with it?
You could do one thing.
What would you do?
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (26:51):
Hmm, that's a good question.
Um, I mean, I think I'd do whatI have been doing, which is
learning about.
I mean, I've had theopportunity through and this is
I specifically credit YouTubefor this.
You know I can now go and beteleported into classrooms at
(27:11):
Stanford and MIT, hear from theworld's leading astrophysicists.
You know I'm not a STEM person,but I was always interested in
space and you know I wouldn'thave made it would be.
It was really inaccessible forme to go to, like the you know,
the physics building at OSU.
I don't have to deal with anyof that.
(27:32):
Um, I totally, I totally seewhere you're going with this in
terms of the this.
This has the opportunity to besuch a gift.
It does the students and, but,but it's it, yeah, I for its
(27:57):
worth.
I credit to you, um, becausewhile you were one of the first
people to take a meeting with meand like I just want to, it was
, you know, like, like now Ifeel like I'm constantly, you
know, on the other side of itwhere I have to feel really bad
about not having time to takeall the meetings that I really
would love to take I get a lotof flat because I have that
personality.
By the way, I take meetings withstudents everybody but you, you
(28:26):
took a meeting with me beforemost people really were, I mean,
for most people.
I think the AI educationproject just might as well have
been like the crypto educationproject or the metaverse
education project.
It was sort of just, you know,another hype technology.
You know there's not substancehere.
So you saw it, you, you, I meanyou and I immediately connected
(28:50):
and I understand why.
Right, because you have thisunique vantage point of, like
the past technology revolution,the most recent one, right in
terms of, like, mobile andinternet, um, but the other
thing I'll credit you for is,even though we told, I mean, I
think we really connected andyou know, you were always super
responsive and we had lots ofcalls, lots and lots of calls
(29:10):
and at the end of the day, youknow, you didn't give us a grant
and it wasn't because you were,you believed that what we were
doing was important.
But you, you were like we'rereally focused, like, we're
really focused on this, like onaccess and, and I remember
saying like, oh, but this couldbe a way to like, promote and
raise awareness.
And you know, I think it's hardto sometimes acknowledge that,
(29:35):
like, you know, when, whenfunders are not, when you don't
perfectly align with the fundersparty, but I also have like
respect, because on thecorporate side it's, you know,
like sometimes philanthropy isseen as just a you know a
marketing strategy, and when youwere talking about those sort
of being, those communities, Ithink I'm sure it takes a lot of
(29:56):
time to build the trust thatyou're not just coming in to
like do a press release andcapture some videos that
T-Mobile is going to post onTwitter and disappear.
Yeah.
Kiesha King (30:07):
And disappear.
Yeah, you're so right.
You know the hotspots couldhave been done in a way where
they just became a paperweight.
You know all that funding, allthe things that were canceled, I
mean the equipment's still outthere.
It's still out there.
It's still sitting, you know,on that kiddo's dresser with no
connectivity to it.
If they were a part of theemergency connectivity project
(30:29):
or potentially a part of ACP,right, those things are still
there.
I want to go back to thequestion I asked you because
there's a way that you didn'tanswer.
You didn't say right, if youhad access to all the technology
in the world, you wouldplagiarize, right?
And when we think about thefear that's happening in the
(30:53):
K-12 world and just in educationin general, I think the fear is
around this idea of justcopywriting.
Now, of course, there's someprivacy and some other.
You know things that are there,but it's really not.
It's really not understandingthe expansive opportunity to
unlock the minds of people whoare leveraging these new
(31:16):
technologies.
It's really just a lack of coreunderstanding and literacy
around the exponential potentialof having access to all the
information in the world.
Right, because it's a veryminor way to think to say, oh
(31:37):
well, you know.
I just don't want them to cheaton their paper.
I don't want them to.
You know, go and writesomething that they didn't write
.
I don't want to right.
There's so much opportunity increating a broader perspective
around AI and immersivetechnology that I think we miss
because of the fear.
And that's why, in my opinion,the work that AIEDU is so
(31:59):
critically important, because ifyou can create some standards
and you can influence policy andyou can create some
infrastructure around these newtechnologies, you start to break
away at the fear that keepsthem from infiltrating the areas
where they actually need to go,places that kiddos do not have
the opportunity to see orleverage these technologies at
(32:20):
all.
Right, and that's what's sospecial about the work that you
do and so many others at all.
Right, and that's what's sospecial about the work that you
do and so many others.
I'm going to tell you it wasn'teasy for me having all these
amazing ideas come forward andsay, you know, well, well, dr
King, is there a sponsorship?
Is there some opportunity tofund this?
Can you do these things?
And knowing that, as anorganization, there's this laser
(32:43):
focus on $10.7 billion offunding going into access and
equity Right, but knowing thatmade it a lot easier.
Knowing that told me no matterwhat we're doing, we're going to
influence your program and yoursuccess Right Because we're
providing the access and that'sbeen a really beautiful journey
(33:05):
for over six million studentsand counting.
It's been a beautiful journeythey're not dumb.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (33:26):
It's not that they just don't get it,
it's that well, there is thatthey don't get it.
But it's not that they don'tunderstand what their kids
should or shouldn't be doing.
It's, I think, it's two things.
One, the teachers are right,are correct in feeling like
their kids are way ahead, liketheir students, are a lot more
effective at using languagemodels than teachers are.
And so you know, teachers, likethere is, there is scope for
(33:49):
students using shortcuts and notnecessarily using ai, in a way
that's, like you know,generating productive struggle
and building the sort ofknowledge and and competencies
that they need.
Um, but the solution,unfortunately, is not to ban it,
because you can't ban it.
Yeah, um, or the yeah, orthat's not the only solution.
Maybe that's like a temporarything, maybe you have to do that
(34:10):
.
It's a longer conversation.
The solution is the teacherneeds to figure out how language
models work and then start toadapt their learning.
And it's just like you know, Iwas just looking at research on
before and after the computer.
Students used to write onaverage, I think, think like
half a page, like a like longform writing per week and then,
after the computer, that's up to, like, you know, three to five
(34:31):
pages.
Yeah, it's like three, three tofive x growth, so not quite like
two to two to four pages.
Let's say, um, so you know,with ai it could just be that
the, the, maybe the volume andthe sophistication of what
they're working on increases, itbecomes more engaging.
So, um, I love that, that's,that's the, that's what you're
(34:52):
getting at.
Right is like this, like the,the opportunity for this
technology to be, um, likenurtured so that students can be
empowered by it.
But the other piece that I thinkand not all teachers are
necessarily thinking about this,but I think a lot of them are
especially teachers that work incommunities where there's sort
of like a big disparity between,you know, like schools that are
sort of on the fringe of youknow, urban and suburban parts
(35:15):
of their community and what theysee is that not all the
students are going home andgetting access to the AI tools
or have parents that are showingthem.
And if you start to adapt yourassignments to be designed to
work in concert with AI, you'resort of assuming that all the
(35:36):
students have access.
And that kind of brings me backto.
I know we're at time.
I'd love to find more time withyou.
Kiesha King (35:43):
Dr King, I know I see exactly where you're going,
because it was.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (35:46):
Does that make sense?
It's like that's where, likethat's, you need to be there.
Kiesha King (35:50):
Yeah, it's like we're repeating this cycle again
.
It's the same thing withbuilding virtual school.
It's the same thing withbuilding up online classes.
It's a well, if you build it,they will come.
Maybe, maybe, right, maybe theywill.
If you build a capacity withinthe teachers, like from a
training perspective, is itactually going to be something
that is will be impactful towhat school districts actually
(36:14):
are measuring from an attendance, motivation, engagement,
student achievement perspective?
Right, how does it align tothose things?
Will it drive the outcomes thatyou need?
So, how do you encourage thecapacity building?
Right?
I hear you loud and clear.
I mean I, yeah, it is, we are.
You know, it's a differenttechnology, it's a different
(36:36):
conversation, but it's the sameconversation.
That part is interesting.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (36:43):
And we've got work to do.
Yeah, we do dr keisha king,it's been a pleasure.
Kiesha King (36:51):
I uh, I will track you down for for some more time
yeah hopefully we intersect atone of the many spaces that
we're both going to be in yeah,if not, you know, there's always
an opportunity to intentionallyintersect and I'm happy to do
that also.
Dr Keisha King.
You're an educator and yet youfind yourself now at, you know,
one of the largest technologycompanies in the world.
You know, doing work across thecountry Like how did you get to
where?
Yeah, what does that journeylook like for someone to be in
the classroom and working inschools?
Kiesha King (00:24):
Yeah, it's definitely so different.
I feel like just yesterday Iwas in a classroom with kiddos,
right, and it's funny, Iremember when I first got here I
used to I was still callingthem my babies.
I'm like you know, what are wegoing to do with the babies?
What happens, you know?
And I'm like, okay, there's,there's big babies and small
babies we're talking about here.
So I came from this space ofbeing a teacher, went into kind
(00:47):
of leading a virtual school froma principal perspective and
then moved into curriculum andtechnology innovation and what
that looks like from anintegrative like model within
schools, and then transitionfrom there and building virtual
schools into this idea of, well,I can build virtual schools
anywhere, but what does thatlook like from a strategic
(01:10):
perspective, designing it fromlike a county agency or a
community college or a stateeducation agency?
And so I started my own companyand started building all over
the country.
And then T-Mobile I was one ofT-Mobile's first education
customers in the school districtI was in.
We had around 70,000 kiddos,very high percentage of free and
(01:34):
reduced lunch in that district.
Which district was this?
It was Aldi and ISD out ofHouston, yeah, and so I was one
of T-Mobile's first customersthere, because for virtual
school, obviously you're goingto have gaps and access, right.
So kiddos are going home, we'rebuilding all these amazing
virtual courses, but they didn'thave devices and they didn't
(01:57):
have connectivity.
And so I worked with T-Mobileto provide that for them and
T-Mobile said hey.
A few years later, with T-Mobileto provide that for them, and
T-Mobile said hey.
A few years later, they saidhey, can you come and help us
build an education segment?
And so I came on board to startworking with what they were
just launching the EmpowerEdaward program.
So I came in and kind of workedon building up that program to
(02:19):
capacity and then I think we hadconnected maybe around 20,000
students at the time and we justknew that there was this huge
trajectory for growth in theeducation market.
Right, it was just necessary.
You know, access is somethingakin to, you know, having
electricity.
It is at the core of makingsure you have everything you
(02:41):
need.
When we talk about innovation,none of it could happen if no
one has access to the internetand tools, resources that they
need.
And so when I got to about 2.6million students connected with
the team of Wolfer GovernmentTeam, we inherited Sprint, so we
had this, you know, this greatmerging of teams coming together
(03:01):
and Sprint's education team wasalready doing the One Million
Project, which they were doingphenomenal work over there with
Dan Copps and his team, and sowe really just came together as
this unique organization withthis highly philanthropic
background, but this coreindustry driving kind of desire,
(03:24):
and brought all that togetherand launched Project 10 Million,
which was a $10.7 billioncommitment to bridge the digital
divide, and today we're over 6million kiddos connected in over
4,000 school districts.
So we've come a long way.
We still have a long way to go,I think, looking at a lot of
the investments that T-Mobilehas made in respect to the
(03:46):
network and, you know, thinkingabout all the research and
policy and all the things thathave taken place to make sure
that we're being innovative, butwe're also thinking about the
infrastructure that's requiredto support that innovation.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (04:10):
I think that part's been really
important.
So I'm proud to just be a partof a part of the conversation
and a part of, you know, thechange agent in making biggest
districts in the country.
Kiesha King (04:23):
Yeah.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (04:23):
Before.
This is way before the pandemic.
This is like.
This is literally as educationis starting to figure out.
Oh wait, we can actually doonline learning.
Kiesha King (04:32):
This is like years before, years before and I would
probably say maybe around 2008or 2009,.
You know, I just fell into thislove for technology and Sony
put PlayStation 1s for digitalliteracy in my classroom, you
know, and it just, it justspurred this spark of innovation
(04:55):
in me to say what else ispossible?
Right?
How else can I expand thislearning journey?
How how can we think outside ofthe box with education?
And I've been there ever since.
I'm still there today.
You know, I live in thisorganization from a work
perspective, but I have thisreally unique opportunity to
build strategy here, right?
(05:16):
Like, how do we think aboutleveraging 5G technologies and
within the realm of educationand government and digital
equity and all these other kindof buzzwords that we talk about
so much?
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (05:31):
Yeah, how does it feel?
I mean because this is not yourfirst rodeo and you know I was
at the ASU GSB Summit.
You've been how many times haveyou been, is it like?
Was that a number to?
Kiesha King (05:41):
you.
Yeah, I've been there a fewtimes.
I have a unique opportunity togo and speak and meet my friends
, like you, so yeah, it's been.
It's been fun.
That's just one of the forums,though, right, like there's so
many, how do you prioritize them?
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (05:56):
Well, that's, that's a yeah.
How long do you have?
Um, but but my, I guess.
I guess what I'm getting at isyou know, this year at the ACGC
summit it was, it was might aswell have been the ACGC AI
summit.
You know that AI was, yeah,almost every conversation in
some way was artificial and Imissed the AI show this year.
Kiesha King (06:16):
I really wanted to go.
I had another commitment so Icouldn't make it.
I had to get my daughter readyfor prom.
I was like, ok, I can't missdoing what has to come first.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (06:27):
Oh see, you were in San Diego last week.
Kiesha King (06:29):
No, I was supposed to be in San Diego last week.
I was in Houston and then Iended up in Boston because I was
asked to speak at Harvard attheir innovation summit.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (06:39):
Oh, that's cool.
Kiesha King (06:40):
Okay, yeah, it was nice and I flew back home.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (06:43):
That's cool .
Okay, yeah, it was nice and Iflew back home, but I'm sure
this is the I mean, I'm sure atmost of the education
conferences and summits thatyou've attended over the past
let's say, two years, it's feltlike very heavy and like bring
(07:10):
us back to sort of this momentwhere the Internet is starting
to mature, you know video andlike bandwidth is unlocking the
ability to do sort ofsynchronous video and certainly
asynchronous video.
Was there sort of a similarlevel of exuberance?
Was it sort of like everyconversation was about online
learning or the internet, or didit have that zeitgeist feeling
that, like AI has right now?
Kiesha King (07:17):
I think so, but I think that it just rapidly.
You know AI.
You can talk about AI every daywithin a different framework
and still be talking about AI,right, and I think that's the
thing that's so exciting aboutit.
It feels like it's just neverending, like we will probably be
in the throes of AI for, youknow, as long as we can think.
I think at that time you knowaround.
(07:40):
You know between 2010, 2012,.
We're looking at E-rate andmodernization.
We're thinking about how do wecreate.
You know, between 2010, 2012,.
We're looking at E-rate andmodernization.
We're thinking about how do wecreate, you know, a 99.9% Wi-Fi
infrastructure across K-12school districts all over the
country, right, so theconversations were very
different, but I think, as westarted to address those things
(08:00):
and figure out exactly how right, like oh, we can't do the
access points like this weactually need to think about,
you know, how do we run fiberand what does that look like and
how do we make sure we have thebandwidth and capacity required
to manage all these kids andwhat happens on, you know,
thursdays, when they're alltesting at the same time or they
all get on teacher tube at thesame, whatever, it is right.
(08:20):
So we're kind of overcomingthose things.
And then we moved into the nextphase and I think online
learning was kind of this allthe way for a long time, but I
think it was.
So it felt so contradictory toteaching right To like,
in-person teaching.
So there was this challengeabout it that said like okay,
well, you know, if we're goingto build online learning, then
(08:41):
what does that mean for ourteachers?
Right Like, and are we tryingto replace teachers?
What does that?
You know what does that looklike?
And there's a saying I used toalways say you know, curriculum
is the foundation, pedagogy isthe method and technology is the
support.
And I would say this you know,I kind of was open with that all
the time because I never wantedteachers or people, even people
(09:04):
outside of education from aprivate-public partnership
perspective to think that therewas any confusion around
curriculum and teaching andlearning being at the core right
of how we work with our kiddos,and that was a big part of the
framework and the conversationjust continued to evolve.
Now I think we're seeing thetechnology evolve really quickly
(09:26):
, but we're seeing on a higherlevel, the conversations stay
consistent, and that's where AIhas consistently been at the
core of our conversations for anextended period of time now and
, honestly, I mean, aiedu wasone of the first conversations
that I had, one of the first,like uniform organizations, that
(09:46):
said this is what we want totalk about and this is what we
want to address, and it wasn'tpiecemeal like there was 15
different priorities.
It was this is the priority,this is the focus and this is
the conversation.
Right, yes, we're going to growwith it and evolve with it, but
this is essentially where wewant to focus and I admire that.
I mean again, you've seen itover the years.
(10:08):
I've seen it over the years,but I've also seen it
matriculate really quickly and Ithink sitting in this space is
really, really important.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (10:17):
Yeah, well, you have, I mean we, we, we
kind of did call it Um, and so,you know, you know I, I will.
I'm increasingly just sort of,you know, trying not to be sort
of like a um, you know, almostlike a passive, aggressively
humble, you know, like no, likewe, really like we, like we
(10:40):
really had, like we, we got onething really right, but I think
the other, like you, actuallyget to something that that we,
that I am obsessed with,speaking of what we're obsessed
with, um, so, at not just asv,gsv, but really like all the ai
and education summits, um, mostof the focus is on the tools,
right, like 95 of theconversations that were
(11:02):
happening in San Diego last weekwere how do we use AI to
improve teaching and learning,to help teachers, to help them
save time, support, tutoring, etcetera, et cetera, many, many
different sort of like flavorsof this.
And we don't offer a tool and Iactually had a little bit of
FOMO, I'll be honest, becauseyou know it's hard to go into
(11:23):
all these for a tool, and Iactually had a little bit of
fomo, I'll be honest, becauseyou know it's hard to go into
all these like and there waslike a few funder receptions
that are like, oh, we're, we'relaunching a new fund
specifically for people buildingai tools and I'm like, oh well,
that's really not us.
Um, yeah, so there was a littlebit of fomo there, but at the
same time, um, I, I feelconfident that we really stand
out, because our, our whole pushis that there's like two sides
(11:46):
of this equation.
There's like the technologyside, which is important, if not
critical, but the much harderwork is in the human side of the
equation.
You know, there's like there's13,000 school districts, there's
like almost 4 million teachers,50 million plus kids yeah 100
(12:07):
million parents, 50 stateagencies, and it's all
decentralized and it'sfragmented and it's not
interconnected.
There's no, uh, there's a lotless collaboration than than
what you'd you'd hope wouldexist.
And so it's we.
We have a very big, complicated, maybe one of the most
complicated human systems, uh,in the U?
(12:30):
S, maybe in the world, um, andwe are trying to help it change
and evolve at a timeline thatfeels unique.
I think, you know, the internethappened gradually enough, like
we all remember.
The first time we had dial-up,and then it was like several
years later and then you hadslightly faster internet and
then, you know, suddenly you hadcomputer labs.
(12:52):
I mean, what's happening now isyou have, you know, on a monthly
basis, you know, breakthroughdevelopments in technology,
immediate proliferation ofaccess to teachers and students,
yeah, and so there's there'sthis question of how are we
going to help this verycomplicated system adapt?
And to me, what you're sort ofgetting at is like there's the
(13:26):
big idea of how do we usetechnology to, as you say,
support the work of education,which is really a way of saying,
educators, but then how doeducators need to adapt,
teaching and learning, giventhat AI is not just going to be
used to support educators, it'sgoing to be used to support
every other domain in the, inthe economy.
Yeah, all the career pathwaysare going to start incorporating
ai and potentially shiftingquite significantly.
Like that, like people, peoplein silicon valley are just like
(13:47):
it's a it's a foregoneconclusion that ai is going to
like massively disrupt computerscience, for example.
Um, so, so yeah, I mean likedouble clicking on this idea of
how do we center teachers, um,what are some strategies?
Because you, you mean, you'veyou spent a long time, you know,
(14:08):
like at in district leadership,so you kind of know what it's
like to be on the other side ofthe equation and now you're sort
of you're not really a vendorbecause you're actually giving a
lot of resources for free toschools.
So I'm sure it's like adifferent type of meeting than
like people that are hustlingand trying to sell stuff.
But like, what does it looklike to engage educators and ed
leaders in a way that's reallyauthentic and that doesn't just
(14:31):
make them feel like you're sortof presupposing the technology
is sort of going to be thesavior for all of their problems
?
Kiesha King (14:37):
I mean, in any conversation it starts with
listening, right?
I mean we know that privatepublic partnership is at the
core of the type of growth thatwe need to see in the education
world.
It can't happen single-handedlyon either side of the house
(15:00):
else.
And so you know, just beingopen to listen to what schools
need, understanding that theyall have different needs and
different leaders have differentperspectives on how to solve
those needs.
I think from an industry, youknow framework, we have to be
open to just really sitting downwith school district leaders
and a lot of times I go in and Ijust say, well, like can we
just sit down and whiteboardthis out?
Like can we bring in yourleadership team and just talk
(15:23):
about it as a problem solutionframework or as a here's the
direction we want to go, here'sthe end goal?
Let's do some backwardsplanning and talk about what
that can look like.
Right, because in most places,99.9% of schools have like the
infrastructure on campus inorder to support.
You know Wi-Fi and those typesof things, but when you start
(15:45):
getting into e-sports, you startgetting into immersive learning
.
You know drone technology,other types of AI development
that depends on low latency.
Now you can have biggerconversations around.
Do you really have theinfrastructure that you need to
drive the innovation that you'rehoping to drive?
Some school districts that's apriority.
(16:05):
Other school districts it's notnecessarily a priority, but
they're open to the conversationto say, like, what exactly do
we need?
Is there a certain subset ofstudents that, like, deserves to
have access to this?
You know I love what youmentioned earlier because you
made me think about this exampleI use from Sir Ken Robinson
sometimes when I'm talking, andit's just this idea that you
(16:27):
know there's this time you hadto.
You know, light a match andlight something to make the
lights come on Right, and thenyou get to this point where you
got to flip a switch and now youwalk in the room and the lights
just know you're there, right,and that's what's happening with
this world of AI.
We're sitting and we'repreparing and try and think
about how we create thestructures and I had a word for
(17:04):
it before and I was talkingabout it when I was on stage at
South by Southwest EDU.
But it's what does a structurelook like for education?
How do we create the same waythat we sit down and we do our
curriculum writing in summer andwe do all the alignments and we
think about how we want tointegrate this into, you know,
(17:25):
the world of our kids and getthem test ready, right, like in
world ready and workforce ready.
How do we do that same type ofthing with AI in a way that
creates structure that caneliminate some of the fear?
Right, and that's anothercomponent of this that I think
AIEDU really like hits the nailon the head with.
(17:45):
And you've been kind of openingthe doors to that for so long
and saying, right, like, yes,all these technologies are
amazing and the direction of AIand the growth it's going to
happen, whether we want it tohappen or not, right.
But how do we align that from apolicy perspective?
How do we create some structuresand standards right for this
new technology that allows us tointegrate it in a way that's
(18:06):
safe, that protects our kiddos'privacy, that, you know, makes
sure that they have the literacythe AI literacy needed in order
to use the technology?
You know, that's really been alot of the focus for me right in
this transition Like how can I,when I'm sitting across from
(18:26):
school district leaders, reallylisten intently in a way that
says, right, I understand whatit is you know, and there's a
baseline there.
I want to contribute what Iknow and create a joint baseline
.
And then how do we now go builda priority structure that can
(18:46):
allow your kiddos to experiencethe best, brightest future
that's available to them andyour teachers?
Right, I love your point.
And like how do you enableteachers Because you know you
can put the devices and thetechnology and the resources
there all day long but unlessyou create again the standards
and framework for therequirement for use and the
(19:06):
requirement for integration andmake sure that they're
upskilling in a way that letsthem do that, you're going to be
in a difficult position, right?
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (19:15):
So yeah, that's a really great question
but I mean, I mean what I'mhearing.
Is this, this idea that you'renot entering the conversations,
um, with this assumption that,like you know what's best,
you're really engaging thesystem leaders to like, like,
like they need to chart thestrategy you um have a vested
(19:36):
interest in their success.
But you also recognize thatthere's like super
multidimensional and there's alot of different interconnected
pieces that you're notnecessarily going to be able to
help them with.
But part of it is, I thinkthere is value in sort of like
sketching it out, because allthe things that you just
described you basicallydescribed the um you know core
(19:59):
components of an ai readinessstrategy.
Right, it's like, yeah, um,it's not just about what tool,
it's like what tool that fitswithin your procurement
guidelines.
And if you don't haveguidelines, well, you need to
have a plan to deal with thefact that there are no
guidelines and you need to havealignment with your goals on,
(20:21):
and requirements on, privacy andstudent safety.
And.
But I wonder if you have one ofthe easier jobs in this space,
because the necessary conditionto all of that is access to the
Internet.
Kiesha King (20:36):
Yeah.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (20:37):
Right and so yeah, for sure.
And can you tell me about?
I mean, I sometimes I worrythat there's all this exuberance
about AI and coming out ofCOVID, there's now this
assumption that we've solved theproblem of of access, of
broadband access.
And I'm curious for your takeon that, like how, how close are
we and how far are we?
Kiesha King (20:59):
We're far.
I mean we still have a long wayto go.
You know, we have millions andmillions of folks all over the
country that still lack um thatcore internet access right.
We, uh, we saw the end of theum ACP.
We saw the end of the uh, theaffordable connectivity plan.
Got it Right.
(21:19):
So that was, you know, amultimillion dollar project to
provide connectivity to familiesand communities that had the
need.
We saw the end of that lastspring.
We saw the end of the emergencyconnectivity plan Right, that
was, you know, billions ofdollars set aside to make sure
that kiddos had connectivityoutside of the traditional
(21:39):
school day.
That was initiated through thepandemic.
We saw NTIA come in and say youknow what, we are going to
dedicate one point two, fivebillion dollars for this
competitive digital equity grantand all these other things.
Some of those things are, youknow, paused now until, you know
, we sort through some thingsfrom a policy perspective.
We saw, you know, we see allthese government programs kind
(22:04):
of come and go, and I thinkwe've seen this over time, right
, we've seen this over the years.
These different programs and Ithink, unfortunately,
underserved populations areaccustomed to programs coming
and going.
Right, you know, for a year wehave this and then we don't have
it anymore, and a year we havethat eligible student households
to qualify for a no-costhotspot and five years of
(22:25):
connectivity previously 100 gigsper year and now 200 gigs per
(22:50):
year as of this last year, and Ithink it's exciting to see,
timo will not only continue thatcommitment into its fifth year
now, but also double down right.
And that's been really exciting, particularly where it comes in
and says this is going to bedirectly to the consumer and the
family, right?
So the family can just go tothe website, put in their
information, without the creditchecks and the hassles and all
that, and it's just shippeddirectly to the home.
(23:11):
That's a really specialsituation that you know.
A lot of times you're havingthis conversation and you're
saying I know, for me, I talkwith other vendors, I talk with
private entities, I talk withall types of folks, even
conferences, and I say is thereany way you can tell the people
coming to your conference aboutProject 10 Million?
(23:32):
And a lot of times you know,the response that I get is well,
can you pay us for us to tellthem about this?
Right, like.
And I totally understand that.
But I think there is an elementthat says right for the folks
that I'm hoping to serve.
I want to make sure they havethe absolute best value for what
(23:53):
I'm providing for them, and apart of that value is for me to
put every program and resourcein front of them that's going to
come in and do great work.
Yes, it is a K-12 program, butguess what?
If they're a senior in highschool, that's still five years
of connectivity that can supporttheir post-secondary education.
Like you know, to me I thinkit's a no-brainer.
(24:16):
You know, johnny, sitting atthe front of you, front of his
mom's job, waiting for her toget off work, can now continue
searching or can Google a randomthought about how to fix his
bike.
Those are the things that makekiddos smarter, right, and it's
something that for me, it justmeans so much.
It just means so much, and Ithink we miss the mark on
(25:00):
opportunities to continue toshare.
When an organization decides todo something this big, it's
massive.
Right, there's no red tape,there's nothing else involved,
it's just a massive commitmentand it was a massive undertaking
to build.
But I think me, leading thispart of T-Mobile's work allows
me to sit in spaces with youknow, it almost feels like no
skin in the game, other thansaying I want us all to do
really, really good work, right,like what incentivizes you, and
let's figure out how we buildaround that.
And I can do it purely, and Ican do it from a framework of
(25:21):
the expertise that I built overthe last two decades and I'm
excited to keep doing it, alex,like I really am.
I think there's an element ofhumility that has to come in
when you are sitting across fromsomeone and you say I just want
to hear you, right, like I'mdoing this big stuff and we got
these things going on, but maybethat's not really the answer to
(25:44):
what like, to what you actuallyneed.
Maybe it's a mindset, maybeit's a maybe.
Maybe you don't know how toconnect the dots between this
great offer and the next stepsthat you're hoping to go, like,
how do we figure that part out?
Right, and so that's the pieceI think that I'm going to
continue to really just hone inon.
(26:05):
Are we exacerbating some of ourproblems because we're afraid
that there's no structure aroundwhat's new and what's
innovative?
I wonder that, right, I knowthat there's fear because AI is
there.
You know, I think there was aGallup poll that found that
maybe 28% of students reportedthat their schools allowed AI
(26:28):
use.
Now, obviously, this is forstudents, right?
But why the fear?
Right and most of the time.
If I were to ask you right now,alex, if you had access to all
the information in the world,all the information.
You could ask any question youwant.
What would you do with it?
You could do one thing.
What would you do?
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (26:51):
Hmm, that's a good question.
Um, I mean, I think I'd do whatI have been doing, which is
learning about.
I mean, I've had theopportunity through and this is
I specifically credit YouTubefor this.
You know I can now go and beteleported into classrooms at
(27:11):
Stanford and MIT, hear from theworld's leading astrophysicists.
You know I'm not a STEM person,but I was always interested in
space and you know I wouldn'thave made it would be.
It was really inaccessible forme to go to, like the you know,
the physics building at OSU.
I don't have to deal with anyof that.
(27:32):
Um, I totally, I totally seewhere you're going with this in
terms of the this.
This has the opportunity to besuch a gift.
It does the students and, but,but it's it, yeah, I for its
(27:57):
worth.
I credit to you, um, becausewhile you were one of the first
people to take a meeting with meand like I just want to, it was
, you know, like, like now Ifeel like I'm constantly, you
know, on the other side of itwhere I have to feel really bad
about not having time to takeall the meetings that I really
would love to take I get a lotof flat because I have that
personality.
By the way, I take meetings withstudents everybody but you, you
(28:26):
took a meeting with me beforemost people really were, I mean,
for most people.
I think the AI educationproject just might as well have
been like the crypto educationproject or the metaverse
education project.
It was sort of just, you know,another hype technology.
You know there's not substancehere.
So you saw it, you, you, I meanyou and I immediately connected
(28:50):
and I understand why.
Right, because you have thisunique vantage point of, like
the past technology revolution,the most recent one, right in
terms of, like, mobile andinternet, um, but the other
thing I'll credit you for is,even though we told, I mean, I
think we really connected andyou know, you were always super
responsive and we had lots ofcalls, lots and lots of calls
(29:10):
and at the end of the day, youknow, you didn't give us a grant
and it wasn't because you were,you believed that what we were
doing was important.
But you, you were like we'rereally focused, like, we're
really focused on this, like onaccess and, and I remember
saying like, oh, but this couldbe a way to like, promote and
raise awareness.
And you know, I think it's hardto sometimes acknowledge that,
(29:35):
like, you know, when, whenfunders are not, when you don't
perfectly align with the fundersparty, but I also have like
respect, because on thecorporate side it's, you know,
like sometimes philanthropy isseen as just a you know a
marketing strategy, and when youwere talking about those sort
of being, those communities, Ithink I'm sure it takes a lot of
(29:56):
time to build the trust thatyou're not just coming in to
like do a press release andcapture some videos that
T-Mobile is going to post onTwitter and disappear.
Yeah.
Kiesha King (30:07):
And disappear.
Yeah, you're so right.
You know the hotspots couldhave been done in a way where
they just became a paperweight.
You know all that funding, allthe things that were canceled, I
mean the equipment's still outthere.
It's still out there.
It's still sitting, you know,on that kiddo's dresser with no
connectivity to it.
If they were a part of theemergency connectivity project
(30:29):
or potentially a part of ACP,right, those things are still
there.
I want to go back to thequestion I asked you because
there's a way that you didn'tanswer.
You didn't say right, if youhad access to all the technology
in the world, you wouldplagiarize, right?
And when we think about thefear that's happening in the
(30:53):
K-12 world and just in educationin general, I think the fear is
around this idea of justcopywriting.
Now, of course, there's someprivacy and some other.
You know things that are there,but it's really not.
It's really not understandingthe expansive opportunity to
unlock the minds of people whoare leveraging these new
(31:16):
technologies.
It's really just a lack of coreunderstanding and literacy
around the exponential potentialof having access to all the
information in the world.
Right, because it's a veryminor way to think to say, oh
(31:37):
well, you know.
I just don't want them to cheaton their paper.
I don't want them to.
You know, go and writesomething that they didn't write
.
I don't want to right.
There's so much opportunity increating a broader perspective
around AI and immersivetechnology that I think we miss
because of the fear.
And that's why, in my opinion,the work that AIEDU is so
(31:59):
critically important, because ifyou can create some standards
and you can influence policy andyou can create some
infrastructure around these newtechnologies, you start to break
away at the fear that keepsthem from infiltrating the areas
where they actually need to go,places that kiddos do not have
the opportunity to see orleverage these technologies at
(32:20):
all.
Right, and that's what's sospecial about the work that you
do and so many others at all.
Right, and that's what's sospecial about the work that you
do and so many others.
I'm going to tell you it wasn'teasy for me having all these
amazing ideas come forward andsay, you know, well, well, dr
King, is there a sponsorship?
Is there some opportunity tofund this?
Can you do these things?
And knowing that, as anorganization, there's this laser
(32:43):
focus on $10.7 billion offunding going into access and
equity Right, but knowing thatmade it a lot easier.
Knowing that told me no matterwhat we're doing, we're going to
influence your program and yoursuccess Right Because we're
providing the access and that'sbeen a really beautiful journey
(33:05):
for over six million studentsand counting.
It's been a beautiful journeythey're not dumb.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (33:26):
It's not that they just don't get it,
it's that well, there is thatthey don't get it.
But it's not that they don'tunderstand what their kids
should or shouldn't be doing.
It's, I think, it's two things.
One, the teachers are right,are correct in feeling like
their kids are way ahead, liketheir students, are a lot more
effective at using languagemodels than teachers are.
And so you know, teachers, likethere is, there is scope for
(33:49):
students using shortcuts and notnecessarily using ai, in a way
that's, like you know,generating productive struggle
and building the sort ofknowledge and and competencies
that they need.
Um, but the solution,unfortunately, is not to ban it,
because you can't ban it.
Yeah, um, or the yeah, orthat's not the only solution.
Maybe that's like a temporarything, maybe you have to do that
(34:10):
.
It's a longer conversation.
The solution is the teacherneeds to figure out how language
models work and then start toadapt their learning.
And it's just like you know, Iwas just looking at research on
before and after the computer.
Students used to write onaverage, I think, think like
half a page, like a like longform writing per week and then,
after the computer, that's up to, like, you know, three to five
(34:31):
pages.
Yeah, it's like three, three tofive x growth, so not quite like
two to two to four pages.
Let's say, um, so you know,with ai it could just be that
the, the, maybe the volume andthe sophistication of what
they're working on increases, itbecomes more engaging.
So, um, I love that, that's,that's the, that's what you're
(34:52):
getting at.
Right is like this, like the,the opportunity for this
technology to be, um, likenurtured so that students can be
empowered by it.
But the other piece that I thinkand not all teachers are
necessarily thinking about this,but I think a lot of them are
especially teachers that work incommunities where there's sort
of like a big disparity between,you know, like schools that are
sort of on the fringe of youknow, urban and suburban parts
(35:15):
of their community and what theysee is that not all the
students are going home andgetting access to the AI tools
or have parents that are showingthem.
And if you start to adapt yourassignments to be designed to
work in concert with AI, you'resort of assuming that all the
(35:36):
students have access.
And that kind of brings me backto.
I know we're at time.
I'd love to find more time withyou.
Kiesha King (35:43):
Dr King, I know I see exactly where you're going,
because it was.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (35:46):
Does that make sense?
It's like that's where, likethat's, you need to be there.
Kiesha King (35:50):
Yeah, it's like we're repeating this cycle again
.
It's the same thing withbuilding virtual school.
It's the same thing withbuilding up online classes.
It's a well, if you build it,they will come.
Maybe, maybe, right, maybe theywill.
If you build a capacity withinthe teachers, like from a
training perspective, is itactually going to be something
that is will be impactful towhat school districts actually
(36:14):
are measuring from an attendance, motivation, engagement,
student achievement perspective?
Right, how does it align tothose things?
Will it drive the outcomes thatyou need?
So, how do you encourage thecapacity building?
Right?
I hear you loud and clear.
I mean I, yeah, it is, we are.
You know, it's a differenttechnology, it's a different
(36:36):
conversation, but it's the sameconversation.
That part is interesting.
Alex Kotran (aiEDU) (36:43):
And we've got work to do.
Yeah, we do dr keisha king,it's been a pleasure.
Kiesha King (36:51):
I uh, I will track you down for for some more time
yeah hopefully we intersect atone of the many spaces that
we're both going to be in yeah,if not, you know, there's always
an opportunity to intentionallyintersect and I'm happy to do
that also.
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