The Mystery in the Fields: Exploring Crop Circle Phenomena

The mysterious phenomenon of crop circles has captivated our collective imagination for centuries. As we explore in this episode, these enigmatic formations aren't just modern curiosities—they have roots stretching back to ninth-century France and beyond, raising profound questions about their true origins.

From the earliest documented cases like the 1678 "Mowing Devil" pamphlet describing perfectly cut crops that "no mortal man was able to do the like," to the explosion of increasingly complex geometric patterns in modern times, crop circles have evolved from simple rings to elaborate fractals and mathematical sequences that challenge conventional explanation.

The most compelling aspect of our investigation might be the apparent "response" to humanity's first interstellar communication. When scientists led by Carl Sagan beamed the Arecibo Message toward distant star cluster M13 in 1974, they couldn't have anticipated that 27 years later, a crop formation would appear in England mimicking their binary code—but with crucial differences suggesting silicon-based life forms rather than our carbon-based biology.

While the confession of Doug Bower and Dave Chorley in 1991 that they created hundreds of formations using simple tools like planks and rope seems to solve the mystery, scientific analysis reveals characteristics difficult to attribute to human pranksters: plants gently bent rather than broken; exposure to microwave radiation causing node elongation; magnetic anomalies within the formations; and "ghost patterns" persisting for years after the original circle disappears.

Perhaps most curious is the statistical correlation—98% of unexplained formations in southern England appear over chalk aquifers, excellent conductors of electromagnetic energy. Yet alongside these serious scientific puzzles exists the delightful discovery that in Tasmania, wallabies high on opium poppies created their own crop circles while hopping in dazed patterns.

Whether you're a skeptic or a believer, the crop circle phenomenon invites us to question our assumptions about communication, consciousness, and our place in the cosmos. What messages might be hidden in these fields, and who—or what—might be trying to reach us?

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Episode Transcript

Josh (00:04):
aliens yes but maybe no.
Welcome to the show.
Welcome back.
We were doing a count.
How many episodes is this?
If I counted?

Travis (00:25):
correctly which I'm not guaranteeing this would be
episode 17.
Holy crap, yeah, we're startingto know things.

Josh (00:33):
Well, speaking on my behalf, I haven't learned shit.
Let's start over.
Welcome to the show.
Aliens, yes, but no with Joshand Travis.
I'm Travis.
Why are you talking so fast?
Because I fucked up the intro.

Travis (00:50):
Oh, who are you?
I'm Josh.

Josh (00:52):
This is another worldly podcast, as ambiguous as our
title.

Travis (00:56):
That's a wrap.

Josh (00:57):
Okay, good, we got it All right.
A wrap on the intro.
Jeez, what a rough start.

Travis (01:01):
What did we do last week ?
I?

Josh (01:03):
never know.
I always ask this questionbecause I never know.

Travis (01:05):
I know we did a quiz for this Uh-huh man.
What did we do?
It changed my life.
I know that Sky battles oh, howcould we forget sky battles?
That one was so epic.

Josh (01:16):
It was so cool we absolutely forgot it once we hit
turn off podcast.

Travis (01:22):
Well, in our times of doubt, all we had to do was say
Sky Battles, and then we'dbelieve again.
Yeah, yeah, it was fantastic.

Josh (01:27):
Yep, when I'm looking at my life and I'm just thinking, I
don't know if I can do it again, I remember that Sky Battles is
a thing that theoreticallyexisted, and then I'm like, oh,
thank God.

Travis (01:39):
Yeah, I do the same thing, and then I make up my own
sky battles too.

Josh (01:42):
Yeah, sky battles are like my lasagna.
Use a Garfield reference.

Travis (01:46):
I'd rather you not.

Josh (01:47):
Yeah, I kind of hated myself for using that as a
reference.
So yeah, we were talking aboutsky battles.
I don't remember necessarilywhere we landed on it, just the
concept of it Fucking rules.

Travis (01:56):
I think we landed on there was a lot of old
documentation and we can't proveit Right, but we can't discount
it.
I mean, for me I couldn'tdiscount it, especially with the
LA one I think you landed on itwas nerves.

Josh (02:11):
Yes, because everything was so heightened.
This was right around World WarII.

Travis (02:15):
Yeah, it was three months after.

Josh (02:17):
Pearl Harbor, and so everybody was on the look.

Travis (02:20):
They're ready.

Josh (02:21):
On the watch?
Yep, yeah, so because this isthe 17th episode Special.
I thought it would be nice toget a little bit of feedback.
And so, before the show, joshsaid oh well, guess what?
Through my editing, I foundthat we can get feedback.
It's going to be an AI doing it.

Travis (02:37):
Yeah, it's harsh, okay, but great, we're going to take
these criticisms like champions.

Josh (02:44):
I'm really scared.

Travis (02:45):
No, it's, it's good.
It is good.
I do not have a history ofdealing with criticism very well
.
Well, luckily this is not areal person criticizing you,
just uh, zeros and ones.
I first asked for some gentlecriticism cause I wasn't ready
and it was okay.
And I said, could you be alittle less gentle?
And the AI said, all right, youasked for it.

(03:07):
I don't know if I'm ready forthis.
A rambling mess.
Your conversational style isjust an excuse for aimless
rambling.
You jump from topic to topiclike a caffeinated squirrel and
it's impossible to follow.
Get a script, or at least adamn outline, and stick to it.

Josh (03:21):
We have an outline.

Travis (03:22):
We do have an outline.
We don't always stick to it.
We have an outline we do havean outline?

Josh (03:24):
we don't.
This is really it is.

Travis (03:27):
I asked for it.
And then skepticism is shield.
Your constant dismissal ofanything out there makes you
sound like a closed-mindedknow-it-all.
You're so busy trying to soundsmart that you're missing out on
the actual fun of exploringthese topics.
If you're going to be skeptical, you should change the name of
the show to things that don'texist, according to us.

Josh (03:48):
I feel like that is a personal attack on me and I'm
being read for filth here.
That is very upsetting.

Travis (03:54):
That one does seem aimed towards you.
Yes, it does.
I'm wondering if I should askit for criticisms for each of us
individually.

Josh (04:02):
Oh, so that's, you just put my name in there.

Travis (04:04):
No, no, I said it's like I really need.

Josh (04:07):
I really need something to talk to Travis about, to fill
those awkward silences that wehave before the show.
Please give me something meanto say to him.
He's always so nice to me.

Travis (04:14):
How can I get Travis to believe I have AI on my side?
We're going to get you, OK.
Well, so then it says structure.
What structure?
This podcast has less structurethan a bowl of jelly.
It's just two people talkingabout whatever pops in their
head.
It's chaotic and frustrating tolisten to Get some organization
or you'll lose any listener.
That doesn't have the attentionspan of a goldfish.

Josh (04:35):
Okay, that's good.
That's good, Good criticism.
So we're not podcasting anymore.
I don't know how to change this.

Travis (04:43):
No, I think it's fun not podcasting anymore.

Josh (04:46):
I don't know how to change this.
No, I think it's fun.
Maybe this is something that werevisit every 17 episodes.
So on the 34th episode, we'regoing to go back and see if it's
changed its criticism.
Yeah, so good, new segmentmaybe.
Maybe, hit us up in thecomments.
Yeah, let's open it up tolistener feedback, which was, I
think, another criticism.
We don't have enough listenerfeedback.

Travis (05:03):
Honestly, we don't have listener feedback yet.
We haven't received a lot ofemails because, as of now,
there's only four episodesreleased and we're on 17.
I don't know if they need toknow that, but today we're
talking about one of the bigtopics, the topics that I had
some kind of information abouteven before I delve into this

(05:26):
whole world.

Josh (05:27):
Yeah, this is something that we saw happening in real
time in our life.
Right, we saw these things playout.

Travis (05:33):
Yeah, I remember some of them.
So today we're discussing oneof the strangest mysteries of
modern times.
Are crop circles the work ofmischievous artists, a natural
phenomenon misunderstood, orcould they be evidence of
something far more extraordinary?
So for centuries these strangeformations have baffled farmers,
scientists and skeptics alike.

(05:54):
Some believe they're nothingmore than the elaborate hoaxes,
clever tricks played under thecover of darkness.
Others are convinced they'resomething else Messages from
another world, glimpses of ahidden technology, or even
result of a phenomenon beyondhuman understanding.

Josh (06:08):
Yeah, like intergalactic gas stations.
Yeah, and these are just theroad signs that direct you there
.

Travis (06:13):
It could be.
Now that you said it, I 100%believe it.
Okay, I believe everything Ihear and see.
So, crop circles they mightseem like a modern phenomenon,
but they haven't just beenrecently.
They go back for centuries,maybe longer, before anyone had
drones, gps or even electricity.
Strange formations wereappearing in the fields around
us.
From what our researcher found,one of the earliest was the

(06:37):
ninth century in France, but itwas kind of I don't know.
They talked about paganpractices and them going and
picking up seeds from a circleformation to use in a fertility
ceremony.

Josh (06:49):
But I mean Right, but that is actually a way of collecting
seeds is just by mashing plantsdown.
That was a primitive way ofcollecting seeds.

Travis (06:57):
Oh, I thought you were saying walking in circles, yeah.

Josh (06:59):
I mean, and walking in circles?
You could walk in a square tocollect seeds, it's any
geometric pattern, not thepagans, they did circles.

Travis (07:06):
They love their circles.
Yeah, 1678, there was the newspamphlet titled the Mowing Devil
and that was kind ofdiscredited a little bit.
This one was different than allthe other crop circles because
the crops were actually cut, notbent.
So it's considered an earlyexample of folklore related to
the mysterious patterns.

Josh (07:27):
Mm-hmm, how were they cut?
Would you say laser precision.

Travis (07:30):
They were saying that it was cut.
It wasn't laser precision, butit was so perfect.

Josh (07:36):
Did they have lasers back then in 1678?

Travis (07:38):
Aliens probably did.
They said it was cut so perfectthat a human wouldn't be able
to do it.
Because I mean back then whatthey were using?
Sickles, mm-hmm yeah.
So they said it was just tooperfect Scissors, shears
Possibly.

Josh (07:50):
It could be shears, yeah.

Travis (07:52):
1686, robert Plott, a professor at Oxford, writes
about and draws pictures of acircular formation appearing in
fields near his home,attributing them to flashes of
light.
He his home attributing them toflashes of light.
He also notes animals avoidingthese areas, which is
interesting, yeah.
And then 1880, john RandCaprone, an amateur scientist,

(08:13):
writes a letter to nature.

Josh (08:13):
which is funny.
He wrote a piece of paper downand then just threw it in the
woods.

Travis (08:16):
Yeah, he's throwing his letter into the ocean.
Yeah, he describes circularareas of flattened crops formed
under suspicious circumstancesafter a storm in surrey,
suggesting cyclonic wind actionas a possible cause okay.

Josh (08:30):
So what do you think about those josh after reading that?

Travis (08:33):
uh the devil.
I truly believe that satanshowed up.

Josh (08:38):
No, I well.
The story is that a guy wantedto have his.
He had like three acres of landand he wanted to cut.
He asked another farmer to cutit and there was like a bit of a
disagreement and he said he'drather have the devil do it.
And that's how this started.
And then there was a fire thathappened and then the next
morning it looked like it wascut.

Travis (09:00):
Interesting.
It's weird that people freakedout about it, so someone was
lying somewhere.

Josh (09:05):
I mean yeah, I mean it made it into the calling the
news.
Sometimes calling somethinglike the mowing devil is a
little Rumpelstiltskin-esque,where it's just like kind of a
fable that ended up gettingprinted instead of told orally.

Travis (09:17):
Yeah, that could be Like their story, or it was a slow
news day?
Yeah, it was a slow news day.
They're just like lookingaround whatever and they day
they're just like looking around, whatever, and they're like we
just we really got to printsomething yeah, a new giraffe
was born at the zoo.

Josh (09:29):
We've got the newspaper boy standing out front just
eager to deliver a paper.
We got to put something out no,I don't know.

Travis (09:34):
I mean this kind of goes back.
I mean these are so old.
It kind of reminds me of thesky battles a little bit, where
it's just I don't know how theywrote and talked.
I'm not a professor of ancientscripts, yeah, and some of these
are so old that it's kind ofhard without context of the time
.
But it does show that peopleare fascinated, even in the

(09:56):
older times, enough to keeprecord of it.

Josh (09:58):
Well, do you think this was an isolated experience?
Or they wrote about this onespecific experience because
they'd been noticing thesetrends happening?

Travis (10:05):
I think it was an isolated event.
I mean it was a pamphlet justfor that one farmer's field
about his oats being cut incircular patterns overnight.
But I mean people were spookedback then too.
They didn't really have science, so anything science or
anything out of the ordinary daywould spook people.

Josh (10:25):
So there's a transcript of this Hartfordshire woodcut
right 1678, the one we'retalking about.
The mowing devil yeah, themowing devil, or strange news
out of Hartfordshire being atrue relation of a farmer who,
bargaining with a poor mowerabout the cutting down three
half acres of oats upon themowers asking too much.
The wording on this is a littleweird.
It's antiquated.

(10:46):
The farmer swore that the devilshould mow it rather than he,
and lo, it fell out.
And that very night the crop ofoats shewed as if it had been
all of a flame but next morningappeared so neatly mowed by the
devil or some infernal spiritthat no mortal man was able to
do the like.
Also how the said oats lie nowin the field and the owner has

(11:06):
not power to fetch them away.

Travis (11:08):
So he's saying that he potentially cursed the field?
Yeah, like he summoned thedevil.

Josh (11:13):
I don't think I should do it.
The fucking devil should do itInteresting.
And then he came, and then thedevil was like you know what I
never do anything half-assed.
I'm going to make sure thislooks good.

Travis (11:21):
I've been a bad boy long enough.
I'm going to do something nice.

Josh (11:24):
Fire's kind of my thing.

Travis (11:25):
Yeah.

Josh (11:26):
So we're going to show fire, so people know it's a
devil, and then it'll beprecisely cut.
Hey, I'm all for it.
Slow day in hell, too, thedevil's just like.
You know what.
I think I really missed anopportunity Ruling over the
underworld.

Travis (11:50):
Great, very fulfilling.
Maybe not for me.
I think that I should havegotten into landscaping.
It's possible that humans todayare so disconnected from the
land and spirituality that oldentimes they were connected and
could tap into what a lot ofpeople doubt exists nowadays.

Josh (11:57):
Are you saying that the land, then, is like the phones
now?

Travis (12:00):
I'm just saying magic could have existed at one point.
We're so connected to ourphones yeah, we are.
I'm looking at one right now.
So'm just saying magic couldhave existed at one point.
We're so connected to ourphones.
Yeah, we are.

Josh (12:06):
I'm looking at one right now.

Travis (12:08):
So those are old ones, these are just examples in the
olden days that have come up ofcircles in crops, but what
really has the world enthralledis the modern day ones, because
that's where we live in themodern day.
Yeah, sometimes, sometimes I'min the future.
Do you think of?

Josh (12:25):
the past.

Travis (12:26):
I don't think about the past too much, but I think about
the future a lot, and then Ijust get sad.
I think about the past all thetime.
So in the 20th century, assightings of UFOs become more
common, reports of crop circlesexploded and what were once
simple rings in the grass becamesprawling, complex formations
of geometric shapes, spirals andfractals.
Some witnesses have evenreported seeing orbs floating

(12:48):
above fields before theappearance of crop circles.

Josh (12:51):
So you're a math guy.
Can you explain to us what afractal is?

Travis (12:55):
Yeah, no pressure.
Is the fractal, the image that,no matter when you zoom in and
out, it is still the same image.
What's a fractal?

Josh (13:05):
It's a shape that just repeats.
So a fractal is a mathematicalshape that exhibits a repeating
pattern that appears infinitelycomplex.
Fractals are self-similaracross different scales, meaning
that any small part of thefractal resembles the whole.
Each one relates to the bigger.

Travis (13:22):
So a small piece looks like the bigger piece, but a
bunch of small pieces make thebigger piece, I think.
So that's kind of what I wassaying, like whether you zoom in
or out, it still looks the same.
I kind of feel like I was on ita little bit.

Josh (13:35):
Exactly Nailed it.

Travis (13:36):
Yeah.

Josh (13:36):
And they're created through a continuous feedback
loop that involves repeating asimple process over and over.
Fractals are often found innature, such as in trees, clouds
, mountains, rivers, coastlinesand seashells.
So think of like a conch thosehorn shells that you see.
A lot of people you know.

Travis (13:50):
Is it a conch or a?

Josh (13:52):
conch.
I don't know a conch, that'show I've heard it.

Travis (13:55):
We could both be wrong.
It could be Sanche.
Yeah, maybe it's sandwichSanche.
So there's a lot of things inmodern times, a lot of science.
I mean thousands and thousands.
So we're going to kind of justtouch on a few.

Josh (14:08):
I'd say probably like hundreds, not thousands and
thousands.

Travis (14:11):
I mean it's worldwide right and it's been going on,
for we're talking about modernday.
Yeah so.
1932, archaeologist EC Kirwanobserves dark rings in a barley
field and stoutened down, notingthe barley was lodged or beaten
down.
1937, a British science journalreports circles found in a
barley field.
Includes one of the firstphotographs of a crop circle.

(14:33):
In 1940, David Wood reportsmaking crop circles near
Gloucestershire using ropes.
What does that mean?
Using ropes, making cropcircles?

Josh (14:40):
near Gloucestershire Sure, using ropes.
What does that mean?
Using ropes, crop circles nearGloucestershire.

Travis (14:46):
I would imagine he was wrapping ropes around it and
then pulling them down.
Or maybe he was using the ropesto hold the things down in a
circular way, like stakes andropes.

Josh (14:56):
Okay, so that would explain some of the controversy
around crop circles that we'lltalk about the two British
engineers that use sticks rightor two plank.
They used a plank of wood andrope and were stepping on it and
they said it was breaking theplants.
You could see where they werebent or had snapped.
Yeah, it was breaking andbruising, so like using a rope
would probably rectify that andbe a little more gentle, which

(15:19):
we are seeing in some of theseother documentations of crop
circles right Maybe.

Travis (15:25):
Maybe, possibly.
I'm not a crop circle scientist, that's a seriologist.
Yeah, we found that out.
I was hoping you'd remember,because I did not remember A
seriologist One who studies cropcircles.

Josh (15:37):
Well, yeah, it comes from it's Greek, greek, for I believe
one of the greek gods, cirrus,maybe cereal cereal, the gods,
the god of cereal, cereal aria,but yeah, that's essentially
where we get the word cereal,from which is grain.
Yeah, the god of harvest.

Travis (15:55):
Yeah so 1945, a balloonist just a funny
profession working for the rafparachute training school, takes
a photograph of a crop circle.
1952, the us air forceinvestigates circles found in
kansas.
And then, 1963, sir patrickmoore, an astronomer,
investigates flattened circularand elliptical areas in wheat

(16:18):
fields in Sharon, noting spiralflattening.
Hugh Ernest Butler suggestslightning strikes as a possible
cause for similar craters.

Josh (16:27):
Sorry, I got lost.
I was looking up balloonistjokes.
Oh, I saw a lion get into a hotair balloon basket.
It caused quite an uproar.

Travis (16:39):
Oh, come on now you.
So another current modernsighting 1966.

Josh (16:44):
Really nailing the landing on these balloon jokes.
Oh my gosh.

Travis (16:49):
Get it, I do.
1966, a farmer named GeorgePedley you might say we're full
of hot air.
Oh, my gosh, get it, I do, Iwill get all of them.
A farmer named george pedleywas driving his tractor through
a remote field in toly,queensland.
Oh, now we're in australia.
Yeah, this one will really getyou.

(17:09):
Suddenly he saw a metallic,disc-shaped object rising from
the swamp, leaving behind aperfect circular impression in
the reeds.
This became became known as theTully UFO nest.
Scientists tried to explain itaway Some suggest whirlwinds,
other plasma vortexes, and thensome said maybe it was fish
swimming in circles soaggressively that they flattened

(17:29):
the reeds.
But in 2012, farmers inTasmania also discovered
mysterious crop circles in theiropium fields.
Turns out, circles in theiropium fields Turns out, redneck
wallabies were sneaking into thefield.

Josh (17:42):
Not to be confused with redneck Americans.

Travis (17:45):
Or blue-collared wallabies or blue-collared
wallabies or white-collaredwallabies.
Yeah, they were sneaking intothe fields, munching on the
poppies, getting stoned out oftheir minds and then hopping
around in day's circles untilthey collapsed.

Josh (18:00):
Yeah, they just had like a cool ass dance party.
They got hopped up in goofballsand just like had the time of
their life.
I love this so much.

Travis (18:10):
I think this explains all crop circles.

Josh (18:12):
I'm going to start thinking about this when I'm
feeling low.

Travis (18:15):
Yeah, this and sky battles.

Josh (18:17):
Yeah, just wallabies getting high on opium and just
just living their, their bestlife.
It's amazing oh man Wallabies.

Travis (18:25):
So here's a really great one, next to the wallabies,
which is always going to benumber one.
Nineteen seventy four, a teamof scientists led by Dr Frank
Drake and assisted by Carl SaganHeard of him, heard of him,
much Beamed a powerful radiomessage into space, known as the
Arecibo message, sent from theArecibo Observatory in Puerto

(18:45):
Rico.
It was humanity's first attemptat interstellar communication,
a binary code transmission aimedat the globular star cluster
M13, some 25,000 light yearsaway.

Josh (18:56):
You want to say globular again.

Travis (18:59):
Globular.
This message was packed withinformation Our DNA structure,
the makeup of human life, asimple diagram of our solar
system and even a pixelatedfigure of what we look like.

Josh (19:10):
So if you look this up, you can look up the Arecibo
message online or as you'relistening.
In fact, I encourage you to doit.
Yeah, it's fascinating, we'regoing to talk a little bit about
it.
It was kind of like setting upthe message so you knew how to
read it right, which isimportant.
So the top it shows our numbersystem one through 10, not in
binary, and I don't know whatstyle of code this is, but if
you look at it there's like oneand it's just basically filling

(19:30):
in squares.
So you can understand this is aone, this is a two, on up to 10
, right and, and then underneaththat was using that same
communication style or that samecode.
They communicated that we werecarbon-based, and then I can't
remember what the next couplelines are.
Then there's an image of thesatellite and then there's a

(19:52):
very pixelated.
It looks kind of like an Atarigraphic pixelated version of a
human being.

Travis (19:58):
And then it shows the DNA structure, kind of like the
helix, double helix, yeahPixelated version of a human
being.
And then it shows the DNAstructure kind of like the helix
.
Double helix?
Yeah, I don't remember whatthat green stuff was.

Josh (20:06):
Mutagen.
That's what transformed theNinja Turtles.
Could be Green goo, globulargoo Any chance now to just work
that into conversation Globular?
So it's a pretty clever way tocommunicate pretty complex
information, I think.

Travis (20:20):
Yeah, I would not have thought of this.

Josh (20:23):
You, Josh Snodgrass, wouldn't have thought of this.

Travis (20:25):
Yeah, I mean, I pride myself of thinking.

Josh (20:28):
Good thing we had world-renowned science fiction
writer and philosopher, carlSagan, on the case to take care
of it for us.

Travis (20:35):
Was he a science fiction writer?
Oh yeah, I thought he was ascience nonfiction writer.

Josh (20:40):
He did both.
Oh, and his son also is ascience fiction writer.
That's cool.

Travis (20:45):
So this was in 1974.
They beamed all thisinformation up into the space,
into the unknown, expecting in50,000 years that they would get
a response, maybe, hopefully.
Carl Sagan wrote Contact Whoa,I love that.

Josh (21:02):
But in August of 2001, nearly three decades later,
something did respond, but notin the way anyone expected and
definitely not as fast as theyexpected, so 2001, we got a
return answer to something thatwe sent out in 1974.

Travis (21:21):
got a return.
We got a return to somethingthat we sent out in 1974.
Yeah, because the star was 25000 light years away.
They're expecting it to take 50000 or more years to even make
it over there.
So in the field next to thechilbolton radio telescope in
england, a massive cropformation appeared overnight.
Unlike typical crop circles,this one was different because
it was an almost perfect replicaof the ericebo message, but

(21:41):
with some odd changes.

Josh (21:43):
Instead of a carbon as the building block of life, the
message indicated silicone whichis a building block that's used
in a lot of like uh, sciencefiction novels.
It's something that's like atheoretical building block of
life, because okay, I can'tremember you need like four
components to come together, andcarbon is the most common and

(22:03):
easy way here, but silicone alsorequires like four components
or something like that, and soit's theorized that, you know,
silicone could also be abuilding block.
Also boron, a version of boron.

Travis (22:17):
Huh, that's fascinating.
It goes on describing that,instead of a human figure, the
reply depicted a shorter beingwith large head and wide staring
eyes, which, basically it justlooks like an alien, your
typical alien.

Josh (22:31):
I like this response so much because this is you know,
we talked about this on earliershows like the universe is huge
and we don't know what makeslife.
We know what makes life here,but because the universe is so
big and the equation that couldcause life in another galaxy far
, far away could be somethingcompletely different and be so

(22:51):
foreign to what we know here andare familiar with.

Travis (22:55):
Yeah, we've talked about it.
It doesn't make sense.
Just because on Earth, A plus Bequals C, you know, carbon plus
all this equals life.
That's not what is happening inother places.
Yeah, I mean, who knows?

Josh (23:06):
Fascinating Right.

Travis (23:07):
In the reply, where we had listed Earth's population
around 4 billion, the newmessage showed a staggering 21
billion, which made me think, oh, is this aliens, or are these
humans from the future?

Josh (23:19):
Yeah, or maybe it's like some kind of Valerian type
situation.
You know, the city of athousand planets.
Oh, I hope like that is that'sto me.
That's so wild.
Like, do they have a mayor ofthe city that has a thousand,
josh, a thousand planets?
Think about a thousand earths.
Imagine those town halls.

Travis (23:36):
It's probably going to be like in Star Wars.
It's that big room, that bigtunnel.

Josh (23:40):
Yeah, it's like a big stadium.
Yeah, and it's just, they'reall on little platforms and you
get a xenomorph and an ET.

Travis (23:49):
Yeah they were there I love that.

Josh (23:51):
Yeah, it's funny.

Travis (23:52):
But they did send in their reply their solar system
and it looked as though, becausethe message that that we sent
it shows all of the planets andthen earth, the third one from
the sun, the little block is up,signifying that this is where
we are.
When they replied, they senttheir solar system and there was
three planets that were raisedand then another one that was

(24:16):
something else.
It was like four, basicallyfour squares, with a empty
square in the middle, signifyingmaybe a artificial structure,
or I, no one really knows whatthat is.

Josh (24:27):
So in the, in their response, there was like their
alignment within their owngalaxy.

Travis (24:32):
Yeah, in their solar system, in the, in the planets,
in the solar system that theylive in.
So the Arecibo reply, as it'sbeen called, has never been
explained and no one has everstepped forward to claim
responsibility for making it, ifit was fake, if it was a hoax.
That one was probably myfavorite one out of all of them.
I mean, there's other reallygreat ones, but this one is

(24:53):
super neat.

Josh (24:54):
Yeah, I like it.
I mean it could be faked aswell.
I mean it took 13 years beforethese two jokers admitted to
making those crop circles.
You never know.
I mean it could be otherworldly.
Yeah, because there was.
What a 26-year gap.
Yeah, it was a decent gap,27-year gap between Carl Sagan's
message and the return, theresponse yeah, that information

(25:17):
was out there, like it wasn'tput in a time capsule and buried
in the dirt yeah it was knownthat we were trying to make
contact.
I mean, this was through the 80sand 90s, you know, growing up
yeah, I learned about it as abig part of sci-fi and that we
had tried to reach out.

Travis (25:30):
Yeah, yeah, so that was the recibo in chilbolton reply.

Josh (25:34):
Yeah, so I I find this all not I wouldn't say sus, and I
know that there's reports ofcrop circles popping up all over
the place and a lot more,especially after these hoaxes in
England were brought to light,right, right.
Why, though, are they mostly inthe UK?
So the pranksters are from theUK.
The two old timey, 1686 orwhatever the year was Old timey

(25:56):
1686 or whatever the year wasand then the ninth century.
Those were in Europe, or,almost specifically, in the UK,
part of Europe.
Yeah, a lot of these that we'retalking about now, like
Chilbolton, the response to CarlSagan, that was in Europe.

Travis (26:15):
Why this part of the world?
So there's chalk quarries underthe ground in UK that are
really good conductors ofelectromagnetic frequencies.
Okay, I mean, if it's a hotspotfor something like that, if
they can use Earth to or harnessEarth to help them create some
of these messages, I mean that'sdefinitely a possibility.
But it's not just in UK, it'sall around the world.

(26:35):
It's just the ones that areabove.
The quarries have differentattributes and they last longer.

Josh (26:42):
Well, we're seeing that with the ghost formations right,
when the ones the last a littlelonger.
I was just curious why, and allof these sightings that we had
talked about here, those wereall in the UK.

Travis (26:54):
I think we mentioned one in Kansas, but I think the big
ones are in the UK, some of themore prominent ones in the realm
of crop circles.
Also, I think the UK media wasfascinated by this and with the
media, scientists in that area,they were fascinated.
I don't think the rest of theworld had the resources or the

(27:15):
intrigue to delve into it.
And the military as well.
The Royal Military RAF yeah,they were investigating.
Yeah, okay, yeah, I wouldn'tsay it's just UK, I think.

Josh (27:27):
UK is a hot spot.
No, I didn't say it was just UK.
I'm just asking why a lot ofthese?
We're talking about the onesthat are in the UK, and that
seems primarily where everybodyis focused right.
Whatever you know about cropcircles come from these recorded
instances of crop circles thatare all in the UK.

Travis (27:44):
And maybe it's because of past relationships.

Josh (27:47):
Maybe the pagans I mean, we talk about Stonehenge a lot
but there's a lot of hinges thatare out there.
Those were used and they're notreally sure.
But a hinge is just like alittle hill that has a ditch on
the inside of it and then thesestones are centered around the
top part of the hill and then itdrops down and then there's a
raised part on the inside withother stones.
There are other hinges which wecan talk about a little further

(28:11):
in the reading, but they areall throughout the uk as well
yeah, and maybe the pagans werein contact and were able to
communicate back and forththrough these signs and maybe
these extraterrestrials alienslike that.

Travis (28:23):
You're just like yeah, the pagans well, I mean, the
pagans were the ones thatcreated stonehenge and all these
other formations.
Yes, but maybe some of theseolder civilizations and older
groups were able to contact themand that's how they're still
contacting us today.

Josh (28:39):
Pagans like.
Their big characteristic is howtied to the earth they are.
Right, a lot of their ritualsand things are very I wouldn't
say agrarian, because that'slike more farmer, but, um, like
dirt and wood and rain andforests.

Travis (28:56):
They're like very earthy yeah, they were definitely, uh,
mother earth influenced sure.

Josh (29:02):
so, yeah, maybe, maybe they just were more attuned to
the earth because that was partof their culture.
There's another, I think it'sjust like off the coast of
Australia.
When you talk to them, theygive you directions, like you
say, how are you doing?
And they're like oh, I'm doingnorth by northwest, but they'll
give you exact coordinates ofhow they're facing and that's
how they communicate.
So they're very aware of wherethey are situated in the world.

(29:26):
And so maybe pagans were likethat, where they are situated in
the world.
And so maybe pagans were likethat, where they had just
developed a culture soearth-based, possibly.
You know, maybe they were more.
I guess sensitive is the wordI'm looking for.
They're more sensitive tothings that are happening here
on the earth, so they could.
Maybe they're more attuned tofeeling those electromagnetic
lines or impulses.
The earth is putting off wherewe might feel them if pressed.

(29:47):
But the earth is putting offwhere we might feel them if
pressed.
But it's not something that wedeal with on a day to day basis.

Travis (29:51):
Yeah, we're distracted.
Tenfold.

Josh (29:53):
I got a pocket full of electromagnetism.

Travis (29:55):
Yeah, it's possible that these pagan groups were closer
to what the aliens perceived asready to be contacted than we
are today, or even back then thepeople outside the pagan
communities were very violentand evil and so that's why they
were contacted or were able tobe talked to and they were

(30:17):
talking back, same with NativeAmericans.
They had a lot of reallyintense encounters.
They had areas marked that werepotential portals to other
galaxies for alien races.
I mean, there was a lot ofdown-to-earth earthy
civilizations that seemed to bea little more advanced in the

(30:37):
contact of alien life than thenormal Joe Schmo.
So maybe there's something toit, possibly.

Josh (30:44):
I hope we just need to get there, okay you first, you
first Get rid of your phone, noso you did mention you first Get
rid of your phone.

Travis (30:49):
No, so we you did mention Stonehenge.
Huh, 2011.
On July 13th, two crop circleformations appeared in the
fields of Wiltshire, england.
One was near Stonehenge and theother on Windmill Hill.
The Windmill Hill formationspanned over 400 feet and was
arranged in a double spiralpattern.

Josh (31:10):
That double spiral looks like you you know, in a cartoon,
when a character gets bonked onthe head and then its eyes go
into like spirals.

Travis (31:15):
Yeah, that's what this looks like I was thinking the,
uh, the hypnotizing glasses.
Yeah, yep, yeah.
So some researchers proposethat these double spirals
symbolize colliding neutronstars, a cosmic event that can
lead to the formation of amagnetar which sounds like a
Pokemon, an ultra-magnetizedneutron star.

(31:36):
Shortly after these formationsappeared, astronomers observed
the outburst of a new magnetardesignated Swift J1822.3-1606 on
July 14th 2011.
So July 13th is when thishappened.
July 14th is when they observedthis magnetar.

(31:56):
It was bonkers.

Josh (31:58):
I was just looking up a magnetar because I had no idea
what it is.
It's uh, yep, it's a Pokemon.
It's got like a little U shapeon its head.

Travis (32:08):
Is it actually a Pokemon ?

Josh (32:12):
No, nope, but it could be.
You believe me I did when Isaid it's got a little like
u-shape on its head.
Yeah, you can picture it.
Yeah, looks like a magnet.
Uh, magnetar is a type ofneutron star with an extremely
powerful magnetic field, about athousand times stronger than
normal neutron star and atrillion times stronger than
earth's yeah you want to talkabout our our guys doug and dave
chorley yeah, okay uh, so in1991 these two jokesters, doug

(32:35):
bauer, dave chorley, doug anddave, I believe they were
engineers.
they said they've been creatingcrop circles for the last 13
years, plus now the.
The origin of that date is influx, but it was sometime in the
mid to late 70s is when theystarted, and they believe that
it started as like a joke in apub.

(32:55):
Okay Right, just some goofballsgoofing around.
Just a couple of goofballs, youknow, they're well old and the
way they did it was prettyclever.
They took and we talked aboutthis at the top of the show just
a piece of board, then got arope.
They made two holes in theboard, one on either end, put a
piece of rope through that andthen they put their foot on that
board and then use the rope.

(33:16):
You know, holding onto the rope.
They would use that to smashthe wheat or the grass or
whatever, whatever medium theywere working in at the time and
you're like well, travis, that'sall great and all, but how did
you get these great circles?
And how did they get sosymmetric, symmetric, in air
quotes?
They had fixed to their hat thislittle wire with a circle and
then they would use that.
They would focus on somethingoff in the distance and just

(33:39):
keep that.
And it's not perfect, it's justlike a really easy lo-fi
workaround, but they would keepthat in that little circle and
that's how they would makestraight enough lines.
Now, because that was the waythey were doing it, their lines
weren't exactly straight andthat's why when we're looking at
other crop circles, they lookmore clean.
These early versions didn'tlook like they weren't laser cut

(34:03):
or like they were done by themowing devil so sharp and clean
lines.
But I just thought that was areally clever way to have
figured this out.
I mean, you can get in and outof a field with basically things
that you'd find around yourhouse to make these crop circles
.

Travis (34:16):
Yeah.

Josh (34:17):
And if somebody sees you walking around, you just throw a
board and a rope on the groundand nobody's going to think
twice about it, right?

Travis (34:23):
Yeah, I think the farmers thought a lot about it,
because they're ruining theircrops.

Josh (34:26):
I'm just saying, like these guys, if you saw somebody
walking around with a board, andrope, nobody's going to think
twice about what they were up toor what they were doing.

Travis (34:33):
Yeah, I would think that they were working on the farm.

Josh (34:36):
Yeah, or you know, you didn't want to be caught
carrying this thing around.
You just throw a board and ropeon the ground and it just looks
like a board and rope on theground.
That's true.
Who knows what that could beused for.
Yeah, a swing, absolutely Aswing, so it could have been
anything.
So I just think it was like areally clever way to do that and
I think, because these guyswere obviously fond of alcohol,

(34:57):
they thought of this idea andthey're engineers, so they had
good minds.
But I also think that theytalked about it Like they were
in pubs and they were talkingabout this prank, and I think
that they found some like-mindedpeople that maybe judged it up
a little bit and they were ableto get more precise circles In
some cases I'm not throwing outthat it's like an indicator or a
road sign directing aliens tofuel or food or whatever it is

(35:22):
that they're here looking for apoint of interest.
It's like, you know, whenyou're driving on the highway
and you see those signs, it'slike a historical site up ahead.
Maybe that's what this is,where the aliens are coming in
to observe a certain part ofearly human civilization.
You know, maybe that's why it'snear the hinges.

Travis (35:36):
Yeah.

Josh (35:36):
Could be right.
Or maybe they love chalk.
They eat chalk, who knows.
Whatever it is that they'rehere for, like in Carol Clowns
from Outer Space, they're juststopping by for a snack, yeah,
it could be.
Anyway, I think that that is apossible scenario that they had,
you know, gotten drunk and, asyou do, you tend to be a little
braggadocious and you talk aboutsome of the things that you've

(35:57):
been up to and you know, wordspread and maybe somebody else
heard the story, maybe a littlemore inclined, or was able to
improve upon this very simpleidea.

Travis (36:06):
Yeah, there's definitely , I believe copycats all around
the world that were copyingtheir techniques.

Josh (36:12):
once these guys came forward, but they found a
different way, like this was avery rudimentary way to do this,
and somebody was, like you know, told their mom and dad, I want
to grow up to be a seriologistand make crop circles, and then
they got laughed out of theirhouse.
And then suddenly their parentsare watching nightly news and
they're seeing these cropcircles and they're like, oh my

(36:32):
God, he finally did it.
He actually pulled it off Adad's nod of approval.
Yeah, all right, all right, allright, atta boy, you did it.
We said you couldn't do it, butyou did it.
It's kind of like our parentswith us starting a podcast.

Travis (36:44):
Yeah, you're right.
They're like what, I'm sodisappointed.
Yeah, I remember seeing this inthe news.
It was in the 90s.

Josh (36:53):
Yeah, 91.

Travis (36:54):
Yeah.

Josh (36:54):
But I mean like the crop circles they were part of like
international news in the 80s.

Travis (36:59):
Oh, yeah, it was huge.

Josh (37:00):
People couldn't wrap their head around it, and so these
two guys claimed to have madeover 200 of these things.

Travis (37:13):
Yeah, which is a shit ton, and they had you know
little diagrams that they'd use.

Josh (37:15):
So they draw it out, these little patterns, and there's
still today groups andorganizations that make these.
They use it for likeadvertising, like Mountain Dew
has a crop, had a crop circle.

Travis (37:19):
And well, those are tractors.

Josh (37:21):
just like how they make the mazes, I know, but I mean
like just saying that thisspurred that, like they think
that the reason that they cameforward is because there were
other copycats and othercopycats were getting approached
by advertisers or whatever, andthen they were getting paid to
go out and do these crop circles.
And so these guys were likewait, we invented this kind of,
in a way, not invented it, butmade it more popular.

(37:44):
Yeah, we're not getting paid,so there's also some controversy
there that that's why they mayhave come out when they did A
little bit of professionaljealousy.

Travis (37:52):
There is some problems with their claims, though.
I mean, obviously they tookcredit for a whole bunch of
these.
A whole bunch of them were fake, but there's a big difference
between the fake ones and thereal ones.
What do you mean fake?

Josh (38:03):
They're all crop circles.

Travis (38:04):
Well, there's fake ones that these guys made.
Those are real crop circles.
But the real crop circles thatare unexplained have some.

Josh (38:12):
I don't Okay, I don't like that term where real and fake,
because they're all crop circles.
I think you can say human andthen maybe otherworldly, but
they're all crop circles,they're not real or fake ones.

Travis (38:23):
Well, they were imitating.

Josh (38:24):
These guys weren't imitating.
These guys were just doing thiswhole cloth I.
These guys weren't imitating.
These guys were just doing thiswhole cloth.
I don't think crop circles werea known phenomena, like they
are now.

Travis (38:31):
I mean, there was prior reports.

Josh (38:33):
Right, but I don't think these guys had access to these
prior reports.
This was like well beforeinternet.
I mean, you'd have to be like ahistorian, and these guys
weren't historians, they wereengineers.

Travis (38:42):
So the extraterrestrial or otherworldly crop circles.
They had very strange thingsthat were not just bent plants
from a plank, they did not snap,they actually were just gently
slanted over all the way downand they would still grow and
then they would also have kindof small mutations, the plants

(39:05):
where scientists found out thatonly way that could happen was
because of radiation likemicrowave radiation, where some
of the little nodes on the stemsof the plant would expand, very
similar to how popcorn expandsin the microwave, how it just
kind of eventually pops, butthese would just kind of
elongate and expand.
Also, the patterns got reallycomplicated and it wasn't just a

(39:27):
simple piece of wood orstepping on these plants.
They said it kind of it moves,kind of like water, where it
just kind of flows and sometimesthey cross over or hatch.

Josh (39:36):
Sure like a lattice.

Travis (39:37):
Yeah.

Josh (39:38):
Or it'll look woven instead of smashed.

Travis (39:40):
So they definitely did contribute to the crop circle
phenomenon.
But attributing all theformations to their activities
is it just isn't possible,because ridiculous amount of
these crop circles haveattributes that can't be done by
a human, especially withprimitive tools that they were
using.
Also, some more scientificstuff they had magnetic glaze.

(40:01):
So when you look at it througha microscope you can see spheres
of magnetized meteorite andiron in some of the formations,
suggesting that the fields wereexposed to high temperature
events, fire, devil, maybe A lotof electromagnetic effects that
we talked about before, withthe chalk quarries underneath.
Those are good conductors tohelp with that.

(40:21):
People who have medical devicesinside of them or who are
pregnant, they have to kind ofavoid those areas because the
electromagnetic effects canalter them.
Even one example where awoman's thyroid that was too big
, she went and sat in a field ina crop circle for a couple
hours or a few hours.

Josh (40:39):
I know that sounds so woo to me, though I don't know that
I believe that at all.

Travis (40:45):
We don't have to believe it, but it's documented and
they had doctors there observingher and watching it.
Another one that you mentionedearlier the ghost formations the
persistence of the crop circlepatterns in the soil.
Even after plowing it it'sstill there, sometimes for
multiple seasons, so you canstill just you can constantly
keep seeing the crop circles upto a couple of years.

(41:05):
And then the locationcorrelation a study showed 98%
of non-man-made formations inSouth England were over the
chalk aquifers.
There's also mathematicalmessages.
What they're saying is that allof these non-man-made crop
circles, they're usually encodedwith messages.
So the Arecibo reply, like wetalked about, was in binary code

(41:28):
, communicating to us.
And then the Julia setresembles precise and complex
mathematical fractal patterns.
And then there was one in 2008with a pi formation and it kind
of showed in a circular kind ofrecord style way the first 10
digits of pi, which is prettycool.
So in conclusion, we'veexplored the history of strange

(41:51):
formations stretching backcenturies.
Are crop circles an evolvingform of man-made art, a message
from an unknown intelligence orsimply a naturally occurring
formation?
And it sounds like it could beall of it.

Josh (42:03):
It's definitely yes, I believe it could be all.
Yeah, it's definitely not noneRight.

Travis (42:10):
I'm with you on that.
Where you know, there is alittle bit of everything for
sure.
So when it comes to aliens, yes, no, or maybe I'm a yes-man on
the alien aspect, some wereman-made, we know that, but some
have phenomenal proof that itwas not man-made and it's not
natural, especially withcommunicating some of these

(42:32):
images and messages.
I mean, nature can'tcommunicate and respond back
yeah, you know.
So I would say aliens,absolutely.
For me, I think the proof isthere.
What about you?
What do you think?

Josh (42:45):
I think it's a maybe.
I don't think that there'senough proof that it's aliens.
I would like to believe,because this is like a kind of
clever way to communicate.
I just think that it's of allthe mediums you could choose to
communicate to us information.
Like they said, one of thesecrop circles was made and it

(43:07):
looked like a non-symmetricshape and they couldn't figure
it out until they put it in likea 3d generator.
Yeah, and they were able to lookat it and I think that that is
clever and I think they wereable to make like after they put
it in this generator.
They were able to makesomething that didn't work, but
that doesn't necessarily meanthat that information wasn't
communicated correctly.
That could have just been humanerror yeah, if that's if that's

(43:27):
the case or we don't have theright things.
But I I don't think there'senough definitive proof for
myself to say that this is 100yes, aliens did this.
Because then, like, there is ahuman element to this right,
there are people that weremaking crop circles and there is
a way to do this and there hasbeen ways to do this by man.
So to say that it's aliens, yesor no, I don't think is.

(43:49):
I don't think that does thistopic justice, right?
But in the context of the show,we have our arbitrary ruling at
the end yes, no, or maybe I'mgonna say maybe okay, I think it
backs up a galactic federation,because why would you
communicate in that style?

Travis (44:07):
you know?
Why wouldn't you just come downand communicate with us?
Yeah?

Josh (44:10):
Maybe they have Like that's oh yeah, we talked about
this before Like alien language.
Could be something as subtle asleaves blowing across the
ground.
It could be something ascomplicated as the way you know
a quarry is formed or whatever.
It could be any number ofthings.

Travis (44:28):
Or the governments are hiding that they have made
contact.

Josh (44:31):
Well, I'm not that's not what I'm interested in.
I don't well, I am.
I know we're talking aboutcommunication, the way they are
trying to communicate to us.
If that is indeed what this is.
Um, it's novel, it's just weird.
Why is it centered aroundagrarian places?
Like this is not done just likeout in the wilds of africa.

(44:52):
This is done on farms, soagrarian.
This is where a civilizationand maybe that's because this is
the highest likelihood thatwe'll see, we'll see it they put
it next to roads.
More often than not, that alsoleads itself to being a hoax,
like.
If you are a human being, whereare you gonna want to go?
You're gonna want to gosomewhere where you're not going
to have to travel a thousandmiles and you're going to want

(45:12):
to be able to have people see it.

Travis (45:15):
Well, what if in this galactic federation they're not?

Josh (45:18):
what's this galactic federation you're talking about?
I thought it was a joke.
Is this serious?

Travis (45:21):
No, no.
What if they're not allowed tocontact earth?
And these are some of the rebelspecies.

Josh (45:30):
Maybe that's okay.
This is the first time I'veheard this Galactic Federation
talk.

Travis (45:35):
Yeah, no, it's just an idea people have had that.
You know there's differentpossibilities of aliens out
there.
You know there's a theory thatthere is a federation out there
of tons of different alienspecies and we're not ready to
join it and they're not allowedto contact us because we're
primitive and potentiallydangerous Cruel.

(45:56):
Yeah, so if there's somespecies out there that are doing
tests like abductions, that'slike honey badger territory.

Josh (46:03):
It's earth they're like.
Well, we don't go to that sideof the mountain.
That's where the honey badgeris.

Travis (46:07):
Yeah, I think there's a handful of species out there of
alien that are pushing past thelines of intergalactic law.
Oh, my God pushing past thelines of intergalactic law.

Josh (46:15):
Oh my God.
Okay, we're getting a littleout in the weeds here.

Travis (46:17):
We are.
But you know, that's where weget the messages right.
Yeah, in the weeds, In theweeds.

Josh (46:22):
Yeah, way to tie it back.

Travis (46:23):
Yeah, thanks.
Thank you for listening.
This is very fun for us and wedefinitely want to keep doing
this for you, but we need yoursupport, or else.

Josh (46:36):
Yeah, need your support.
Or else, yeah, listen to thispodcast, or else we kill this
dog.
Oh my gosh, that was a madmagazine cover.
Oh really, yeah.
I was like yeah, buy thismagazine or this dog dies leave
it to mad.

Travis (46:43):
No, we do appreciate you listening and taking time out
of your days to sure, really.

Josh (46:47):
What is it to you, though?
Like you're gonna be listeningto a podcast anyway no, not
necessarily I mean people thatdon't listen to podcasts are not
gonna.
Let's just listen to a podcast.
You podcast listeners, though,you know they know.

Travis (47:00):
But yeah, subscribe to us, follow us.
That way you can get updateswhen we have episodes coming out
every other week.
Leave comments and reviews.
Uh, get a hold of us if youthink we're full of shit or you
enjoy us.
We'd like to hear both.

Josh (47:15):
Yeah, either way, so we can talk about it on our 34th
episode, where we rehash some ofthe negative criticisms from
real life people.
Maybe this time, instead ofmean AI, yeah.

Travis (47:27):
We don't want to have to get all our criticism from AI.
We want the real deal.

Josh (47:31):
Yeah, yeah, we do.
We want the real deal.

Travis (47:33):
That leads us to our teaser for the next episode.
So it is the baseline quiz time.
Oh, my goodness, what the fuckis this Project Stargate?
I have no idea.
Next episode we are going totalk about Project Stargate and
I know nothing.

(47:54):
Maybe the TV show this has?

Josh (47:54):
MacGyver in it.
Was he in Stargate episode?
We are going to talk aboutproject stargate and I know
nothing.

Travis (47:55):
Maybe this has a tv show .
This has macgyver in it.
Was he in stargate?
So we're going to be talkingabout macgyver and stargate and
the portal to go to other earths.
Yeah, maybe no project, so it'sprobably a government project
and they always name them reallycool, like the immaculate
Conflation.

Josh (48:11):
I think this was named after the movie.

Travis (48:14):
Maybe.
Well, let's find out.
So first question what wasProject Stargate?
A A classified mission totraverse a wormhole in Utah.
B A failed NASA experiment toteach chimpanzees to pilot
spacecraft.
C A top-secret program toresearch psychic viewing.
Or D, A secret project to builda portal based on Egyptian

(48:36):
hieroglyphs.

Josh (48:37):
That's the movie or the show.
Whatever I'm going to say, Ithink it's wormhole related.

Travis (48:46):
OK, I mean, that is from my viewing of the show and
movie.
It would probably be wormhole.

Josh (48:54):
So that's what I'm going to say.
I'm going to say classifiedmission to traverse a wormhole
in Utah.
Okay, I don't know.
I don't know shit about theactual project Stargate, though
these are 100% guesses and I100% did not cheat.

Travis (49:07):
I or did.
I Just recently saw somethingabout psychic viewing, but I
don't know if this was part ofthat project.
But I'm gonna say see psychictop secret program to research
psychic viewing.

Josh (49:21):
Just based on hope, because I, I like I, because you
don't want to answer the sameas me, because I historically
get these wrong and you're likeperfect.
You just narrowed my choicesdown from four, from four to
three.
That's a little easier choice.

Travis (49:36):
I didn't read much about the psychic viewing, but from
what I saw it was just like what.
So I'm I'm hoping that this iswhat it is Okay.
So next question why did thegovernment invest millions in
this project?
A, the Soviets were trying thesame thing, so they wanted to
beat them to it.

Josh (49:55):
Okay, so that phrasing right there.
Okay, well, let's get throughit and then I'll work my way
through the answers.
Go ahead.

Travis (50:01):
B a congressman had a dream about it and convinced his
colleagues to move forward.
C an independent test subjectin Cuba successfully predicted
the future.
Or D the project was inspiredby a president's secret meeting
with aliens.

Josh (50:16):
Oh my gosh, okay, so that first one.
Uh, the soviets.
That definitely puts it in the80s, the soviet union is not
around anymore.
And that first question doesn'tsay when.
No, it was a what when projectstargate started, so I guess I
can't rule that out.
Congress wanted to dream aboutit and convince his colleagues
to move forward.
I hate that answer.

Travis (50:38):
I really hate that answer.
Yeah, that made me mad.

Josh (50:40):
Yeah.

Travis (50:41):
Because if it was true, which I mean, things like that
have probably happened.
That's bleh.

Josh (50:46):
I hate it.

Travis (50:47):
I'm going to go.
Which lines up with the psychicviewing was the future one.
An independent test subject inCuba successfully predicted the
future.

Josh (50:58):
Okay, future one an independent test subject in cuba
successfully predicted thefuture.
Um, okay, I'm struggling withthis one because I don't like
how reactionary stargate soundsif you know the soviets were
doing it and we're just like,well, but I guess that's kind of
how our entire space programstarted, so maybe I?
I also don't really likepresident having a secret
meeting with aliens.
I just think that's wild.

(51:19):
I'm gonna do the soviets.
They were trying the same thing.
Okay, same thing being, whoknows, a wormhole maybe maybe
next question.

Travis (51:27):
One declassified idea for using remote viewing in
combat was does that mean I wason the right?
Train predicting enemymovements by reading chicken
bones.
B using mind bullets toincapacitate enemies.
C teleporting military unitsvia telekinesis or.

(51:49):
D staring at goats until theydie.
That's really funny.
There is a movie men who stareat goats until they die.

Josh (51:52):
That's really funny.
There is a movie Men who Stareat Goats.
That's really funny.
It's about psyops, which isthat that was a real thing.
I'm going to do that.

Travis (52:01):
The goats.

Josh (52:02):
Yeah, okay, I like mind bullets too though.

Travis (52:05):
Mind bullets.
Yeah, the chicken bone oneseems a little.
I'm going to go with goats too.
I mean they're all weird.
I mean they're all weird.

Josh (52:12):
They're weird, they're all weird.
I mean we're getting into someweird ass shit here.

Travis (52:15):
Yeah.

Josh (52:16):
This is fun.
This is going to be a fun one.

Travis (52:17):
Yeah, okay.
Next question when did famousremote viewer Joe McMoneagle
physically travel to?
A the Palace of Versailles in1793.
B the Lost City of Atlantis.
C ancient, once inhabited Mars,or D the center of the earth?
I know this answer.

Josh (52:35):
Do you?
Yeah, do you want me to answerfirst?
Then yeah, lost city ofAtlantis.

Travis (52:39):
Okay, I am going to say ancient, once inhabited Mars.

Josh (52:45):
Okay, that was the like the two paragraph thing I read
about this Looks here Uh, asthough I said ancient, once
inhabited Mars too.

Travis (52:53):
Oh how convenient, All right.
Next question, though I saidancient, once inhabited mars too
.
Oh how convenient, all right.
Next question which of thefollowing remote viewing
operations actually worked alocating a downed soviet bomber
in africa.
B predicting the fall of theberlin wall.
C finding saddam hussein'shiding place or d identifying
the location of missing ciaagents?
I, I'm blown away that one ofthese worked, or any of these.

(53:19):
So I'm going to say,identifying the location of
missing CIA agents.
I'm going to say that.

Josh (53:25):
Okay, I'm going to say finding Saddam Hussein's hiding
place.

Travis (53:29):
Seriously, I mean yeah, I mean it could, if it's real.

Josh (53:33):
He was just in a hole.
I'm serious, he was in in ahole, I'm serious.
He was in a hole in the middleof the desert, so people knew he
was there and I feel like Iread that somewhere.
At least they got him.
They got them close, yeah.

Travis (53:48):
Interesting.
I do not know All right.
Last question how manydifferent names and iterations
did the US government's remoteviewing program go through?
A one Project Stargate was theonly official program.
B three it changed a few timesbut was mostly consistent.
C five different agencies keptrenaming and restructuring it.

(54:09):
Or D more than 10, it wentthrough so many names it was
hard to keep track.

Josh (54:14):
I think I'm going to go with one, because Project
Stargate sounds fucking rad.
It does, and I think they'relike one and done.

Travis (54:21):
Can't change it.
My nephew came up with thisname, yeah.

Josh (54:25):
Roland Ebrick movie.

Travis (54:26):
I'm going to say more than 10.
Okay, because that way it wouldbe messy and hard to track.
Okay, all right, it would bemessy and hard to track.
Okay, all right, let's view ouraccuracy.

Josh (54:37):
Damn Yep.
Obviously I was wrong, becauseall other questions were about
remote viewing.

Travis (54:43):
What was Project Stargate?
It was a top secret program toresearch psychic viewing.

Josh (54:49):
I wanted it to be about wormholes.
God damn it.
Yeah, maybe a future episode.

Travis (54:55):
Why did the government invest millions in this project?
You were right the soviets weretrying the same thing, so they
wanted to beat them to it.

Josh (55:04):
Of course.
Never, josh, never outrulespite that's true.

Travis (55:09):
Yeah, I said it was.
The test subject in cubasuccessfully predicted the
future.
I was.
We just wanted to beat theSoviets.

Josh (55:17):
Next one.
I knew it, I knew it, I knew it, I was right, I knew it.
It's the funniest one, and itwas right.

Travis (55:24):
One declassified idea for using remote viewing.
Combat was staring at goatsuntil they died.

Josh (55:29):
That is insane.
That was an actual program andthey made a movie out of it
called the Manuscript Ghosts.
It starred George Clooney.
Wow.

Travis (55:37):
That's okay, I don't understand it, but I'll take it.

Josh (55:42):
Don't make any sense.
It was a wild ass movie.
I remember it was a lot of funto watch.

Travis (55:46):
You'll have to watch it.
Next question when did famousremote viewer Joe McMonagle
physically travel to?

Josh (55:53):
Ancient, once inhabited Mars.

Travis (55:57):
That's what I got, and it's right.
Oh man, you are on itunprompted.
Wow, yep, this guy, remote,viewed into the past at a once
inhabited mars.
Prove it.

Josh (56:07):
I just did no, with my words.
That guy needs to prove it,prove that he did it well, we'll
do the research.

Travis (56:13):
We'll figure it out which of the following remote
viewing operations actuallyworked.
I said identifying a missing cagent.
You said saddam hussein.
The answer was locating adowned soviet bomber in africa.
Last question how manydifferent names and iterations
did the us government remoteviewing program go through?
The answer was more than 10probably for that reason I was

(56:36):
saying they just want to make itmessy and confusing.
Which checks out?
That's what they do to thefinances as well.
Let's make it real messy okay.

Josh (56:45):
Well, this is going to be a blast I'm going to start doing
that to our pets.
Just rename them every day,just to make it confusing for
everybody they just stopresponding to you just gaslight
everybody in my house, yeah, uh,and the dogs well, I'm stoked.

Travis (57:01):
This was my hope at the very beginning of the quiz that
we would talk about this.
I don't know really anything.
I literally read two paragraphsand I was like what the fuck is
this?
So I'm really excited.
I want to know everything thereis to this.
I'm gonna do a lot of researchand you're going to be a
believer.

Josh (57:17):
I will push back on that a little bit.
I don't want this anybody outthere, or you even, josh, I
don't want this to seem like acombative podcast.
I don't want you to feel likeyou have to convince me and I
have to be skeptical ofeverything you say, because
that's not how I'm approachingthis.
Podcast, yeah, podcast, yeah.
I am trying to be open-minded.

Travis (57:36):
There is just a lot of things that I'm going to push
back on and I appreciate it.

Josh (57:38):
I do believe in aliens.
We've talked about this a lot.
Yeah, there's just a lot ofthings out there that I have a
hard time wrapping my headaround and I'm not a 100%
believer like you are.

Travis (57:47):
No, I appreciate it, because it actually opens my
mind up to.

Josh (57:51):
That's what I want from you, Josh.
I just want you to think aboutthings a little more critically
yeah, and, and I have been, andI appreciate it.

Travis (57:59):
It's expanding my mind we're both growing.

Josh (58:02):
Yeah, well, thank you for listening and have a great oh,
do you want to thank jordan, ouruh researcher, for?

Travis (58:10):
music and oh yeah, and we want to thank jordan, our
researcher for music, and ohyeah, and we want to thank
jordan, our researcher for music.
And you rule, and yeah, you dorule everything you do well.

Josh (58:26):
I was saying to you, josh, but yes, jordan, you rule too
oh, thank you.

Travis (58:30):
Yeah, yeah, we wouldn't be where we are without you.
So, thank you very much, and,travis, you rule, thank you.
I was trying to figure out whatwas going on.
Oh man, man, this guy'scoughing in the mic a lot.

Josh (58:46):
Yeah, I was clearing my throat.

Travis (58:48):
Yeah, editing really hard To get attention.
Yeah, you're just trying to getme here.
I am derailing the podcast yetagain, right at the end, as
we're trying to say goodbye,okay, bye.