June 20, 2025 • 60 mins
Ep. 90: Figuring out personal branding, unapologetic boundaries, and flexible work
Nomadic copywriter and founder of Nomad Copy Agency, Sam Burmeister, has an approach to personal branding, boundaries, and designing your life-first career that you need to hear.
If you’re trying to figure out how to talk about yourself without sounding salesy, navigate flexible work, or carve out a career that reflects your whole self, this one’s for you.
You’ll learn how to:
- Define your personal brand (without oversharing or faking it)
- Talk about yourself with confidence—online and IRL
- Reframe flexibility and set unapologetic boundaries
- Re-enter the workforce or pivot careers with clarity
Related episodes:
Ep. 61: The VA revolution: parents leaving the 9 to 5 to make more as a virtual assistant with Sasha Eburne – Spotify or Apple
Ep. 70: The power of aesthetics and your personal brand: the quickest way to create a professional resume and cover letter [Land Your Dream Job Series 5/5] – Spotify or Apple
Ep. 16: Ana Colak-Fustin, former Global 500 recruiter, on figuring out internal job changes and career growth internationally – Spotify or Apple
About the guest:
Sam Burmeister is the founder of Nomad Copy Agency, a sales copywriting expert, and a full-time digital nomad who helps service providers sell confidently online. She’s worked with hundreds of businesses worldwide and blends strategic sales messaging with a deep understanding of what makes a brand real. Sam’s personal brand philosophy? Keep it honest, strong, and yours.
Check out her free landing page GPT tool for that business you wanna pilot.
About Andrea Barr, host of All Figured Out:
Andrea Barr is a certified career and life coach who helps ambitious parents take charge of their careers and lives with strategy, intention, and freedom. She rejects the idea that success requires sacrifice—showing parents how to create more time, flexibility, and fulfillment without burnout. Through her coaching, workshops, and podcast, All Figured Out, Andrea shares the strategies and mindset shifts parents need to design careers that fit their lives—so they can thrive at work and at home.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome back to the All Figured Out Podcast.
My name is Andrea Barr. I'm your host.
Thank you for joining me again this week.
I just finished recording a really cool episode with
Samantha Burmeister. She is the founder of the Nomad
Copy Agency. She is a nomadic writer.
She travels the world constantlyand she is really obsessed with
(00:23):
helping people to just get theirstory out there.
How to really craft and hone your personal brand.
And I have to read or bio to youbecause it is probably the best
bio I have ever received. I always ask my guests, hey, can
you send me a bio? And then I like, you know, cut
and paste from it or whatever. This is her.
This is her entire bio. Sam writes really freaking good
sales copy for service providers.
(00:44):
She runs her business from all over the world so that yours can
be found from anywhere. That's it.
I mean, I love it. I think it says so much about a
person who can, you know, just keep things short and sweet.
So it might feel like a bit of afunny person to have on given
this is a parenting podcast and a lot of you are in perhaps the
(01:04):
corporate world, have a more structured 9 to five job and
maybe aren't entrepreneurs. However, I really wanted to have
Sam come on because I think there's something really special
about thinking about yourself asa personal brand, regardless of
if you're on TikTok dancing or whatever, but you yourself, you
are a brand in your career, in your life as a human being, as a
(01:26):
parent, you know all the different hats.
And Sam is such an expert in this topic on how to write and
somebody who knows how to write really good sales copy, which is
what Sam does, really knows a lot about how to get your
personal brand across. And so she comes on and we talk
about her nomadic life while hertravels from around the world,
(01:48):
her story of quitting while she was on a beach.
Yes, it's a real story. We talk about some of our
favorite books in business and for the career person, the go
getter, she shares advice on really beautiful topics actually
in the parenting space about howyou shouldn't be apologizing so
much and not apologizing for having kids.
(02:10):
Oh, we just go in so many different directions.
She's so wise. She's got such savvy
communication chops. And I think you're going to love
this episode. So without further ado, Sam
Burmeister, you're listening to the All Figured Out Podcast.
I'm your host, Andrea Barr. I'm a career coach for parents,
(02:32):
mom of two, and a self-proclaimed expert at
winging it. After 10 years in the corporate
world, two major career pivots, and navigating life with kids,
I've learned one thing. No parent has it all figured
out, and that's OK. Here, we're all about growing
personally and professionally while keeping family time
sacred. You'll get practical tips,
(02:53):
career strategies and musings onlife, plus guest experts to help
us fill in the gaps. So grab a coffee or hide in your
car for some knee time. We're about to figure out this
work, life and parenting stuff out together.
Sam Burmeister, thanks for joining me on the All Figured
Out podcast. Hi, thank you.
(03:13):
Nice to have you here. Yeah, it's good to be here.
I'm glad to talk to you again. You too.
Now it looks like you are in your California home.
Correct. Yes, that is not normal for you.
You're not normally home. Correct.
Yeah, From my understanding, Nomad and the copywriter, that's
the things to know about me. Personal professional.
(03:35):
There you go. OK.
Wait, I have to do a true or false?
The very beginning versus the very end?
OK, can you be nomadic in your work and not be a copywriter?
I just feel like all nomadic workers are copywriters.
Yes. Oh my gosh.
I know so many designers, software developers.
(03:57):
I know several nomadic podcasters.
Seriously. Love it.
What else? I'm trying to think product
designers, project managers, like people who are working full
time. There's a lot of project
managers out there and, and a lot of people that you wouldn't
expect to like I have been sitting at a cafe or recently,
(04:19):
this was last year, I was in a airport lounge in Bolivia.
And the woman next to me was a BP at Emerson Heating and
Cooling, which is one of those like biggest companies you've
never heard of kind of thing. And she gets off her call and
she had this like jacket that she would wear during calls that
was like kind of blazer, but it was actually like, if you see
(04:42):
what I'm wearing now, kind of a sweater material.
And that's like was her call thing.
And then she like pulls it off. And I was like, Oh my gosh, I
thought they were going to hear my flight being announced in the
background. And she hadn't been back to her
home base in like 3 years. That's so crazy.
OK, Now to layer on the next question that so many listeners
(05:02):
have will be can you do this with a family?
Now I know you yourself don't have children, but do you used
to come across other nomadic people who are workers who have
families? Like is that?
Is that a thing? Yes, it totally is.
And I'm forgetting the name of one of them off the top of my
head, but there is a company that specifically helps people
in families who are homeschooling or world schooling
(05:26):
or remote schooling their kids. They create these communities
where people can move. I think the minimum is for three
months, but up to a year. And you can also bounce between
different communities. So they've got one in Greece, in
Uruguay and Portugal, and these lovely, fun, professional
parents get to hang out and thenthey have these on-site
(05:49):
facilities for them to work and for the kids to do school work.
And then they also have primarily English speaking
communities all around the world.
Yeah, it's totally a thing. No, I'm so happy I asked that.
That is OK. That raised you really want to
have a conversation with my husband like ASAP.
It's a real thing. It's a real thing.
(06:10):
And there's a lot of people too,in the online business world
that I fall in who I've met themand they say, oh, my family and
I just did Italy for a year lastyear, and they'll be like, oh,
yeah, and we brought our dog. We just rented out our apartment
in Vancouver and did it. Yeah, Oh my gosh.
OK, wow. Inspired, inspired.
(06:33):
And this is even what we're hereto talk about.
Well, kind of, I mean, we're going to talk about a lot of
different things, but that is sofreaking cool.
So tell me your story. What is your I listen to the
Cubicle, the CEO podcast from our friend Ellen Yang, and she
always says, what's your cubicleto CEO story?
So what's yours? My cubicle, the CEO story.
(06:53):
So I went to traditional university.
I'm American, so I did the four years after high school kind of
classic, been there, done that story.
And it was during college that Istudied abroad.
I did a multi country study abroad program and I also did a
kind of internship work situation abroad.
(07:14):
And I realized like I can work and travel.
And this was back in 2010 to 2014 ish.
So it was before FaceTime, but after Skype existed like the
tech of where we were in the world.
And I was like, this is what I want to do is I want to be
wherever I want to be, but stillhave my cake and eat it too.
(07:37):
If I want this corporate career,I want to climb the ladder.
I want to be that girly and I want to hike in the Alps and not
have to save my meager 10 days of PTO to be able to do it.
So I got a degree in marketing and international business,
started travel blogging on the side, went into a sales career,
(07:58):
learned a ton about selling and sales and went into sales
leadership and then got really burned out and didn't want to do
it anymore. So I leveraged my experience
writing with my experience selling and in 2019, quit my
job. That's a whole other story that
we can touch on, but while on a beach in Vietnam and was like,
(08:19):
I'm not coming back. And I've been helping other
people sell using the words on the Internet ever since.
Unbelievable. Tell us the beach story.
I think that there's a lot of people listening who are
fantasizing about A not only being on a beach, but B quitting
their jobs. Well, on the beach.
So tickle our fantasy here. Absolutely.
(08:41):
So the writing was on the wall with my job, like I had been
very transparent of. This is probably my last year
here. I've had a lovely time.
I'm going to see myself out and I think a lot of people dream
of, you know, especially while they're on the beach, having the
Corona commercial life, right, of which we could just do this
(09:01):
every day of wanting to do that.But that life isn't sustainable.
I'll be very real. You can't drink on the beach
every single day. You can.
You're not going to go far. So I knew that.
But I was on the beach, I was checking into a hotel, and I
accidentally logged into my worke-mail rather than my personal
e-mail to get my reservation. And I saw that who I would call
(09:25):
my grand boss had really thrown me under the bus.
And I was like, I just had this full body like hot and cold at
the same time. Anxiety of I can't go back
there. And I was with a friend who
really talked me through it and was like, OK, but you have been
(09:45):
talking about how you want to save money so that you can quit.
And then you saved enough money and you didn't quit.
And then you wanted to wait until last year and then you
didn't quit. And now it's this year and
you're telling me at the end of the year you're going to quit
when your lease runs up. But like, that's convenient.
But what are you doing? What's the real goal here?
And so I responded, I let my boss know and she let him know.
(10:09):
And she was really happy for me.And I never, ever heard back
from the grand bus that threw meunder the bus.
So that was really affirming forme and I was on a two week
holiday in South Asia. I ended up staying for three
more months before going back and living in that apartment
that I had a lease on. Way Yeah.
(10:31):
Oh my gosh, yeah. Incredible.
And would you say that that was a real like, did you know what
the what the what was on the other side for you?
So you jumped and did you know what you were jumping into?
No, I absolutely jumped out of the airplane and built my
parachute. On the way down.
I reached out to a few people and said hey, you know me and my
(10:52):
character and I know that you own a business, so if you or any
of your business owning besties need anything, let me know.
And because I had been publishing my travel blog on the
side, every single person asked me to write something.
Most of them were websites. I had no idea what I was doing.
I was like, it's $500 a lot and it floated me along.
(11:15):
But what's funny is I had left my computer at home.
I was just traveling with like asmall backpack, like one week's
worth of laundry. So I didn't have that on me.
So thank goodness it was 2019 because Internet cafes were
still a thing. So I could go borrow a computer
and pay $2.00 an hour in Thailand to log into Google Docs
(11:40):
and write stuff for people. Which was kind of.
Crazy. That is so, so cool.
What would you say? So we're going to be talking
about a lot today. We're going to be talking about
things like personal brand, feeling salesy and that sort of
thing. But when you put yourself back
in Sam of that moment of really like jumping out and not like
(12:00):
you're like sewing the parachutetruly as you're here falling up,
I would say. What was your personal brand at
that point? How would you describe your
personal brand then? I think my personal brand was
very corporate, very buttoned up, very professional.
There was not a lot of me in that brand.
(12:21):
I was saying and doing things that I would be OK if my company
found out about, even in my sidegig, because I was still
publishing that stuff to LinkedIn.
I was just also, and that's another thing, it was LinkedIn,
not Instagram. I was very buttoned up in that
way. All of my personal accounts were
private, that brand. I remember one time going
(12:44):
surfing in Guadalupe, which is aFrench island but in the
Caribbean, and I had somebody atwork say like, oh, that you're
always going to dangerous places.
I was like, I was literally in France, like it's not dangerous.
So I think I thought I was buttoned up, but perhaps other
(13:06):
people perceived me as being like the crazy adventurous one.
But I was definitely adventurouswithin brackets.
OK. And then how would you, now that
we're kind of you're introducingus to the Sam of today, how
would you describe your personalbrand now?
Personal brand now is much more confident in that way that I am
(13:28):
not afraid to be who I am and bring those sides of me into my
business. My business is built around days
rather than weeks. So I build my business around my
life and therefore I can allow glimpses into my life through my
business because for example, like sorry, can't work those
(13:51):
days I'm camping and that's OK. But it's not a travel focused
brand anymore because I'm writing copy for service
providers and service based businesses.
I'm not, I wouldn't not work with travel brands, but I'm no
longer trying to make the travelblog thing a thing and I'm just
helping other people sell. So when I call myself Nomad Copy
(14:13):
Agency, it's I get to pull in these sides of me that are the
science and the art of copywriting and the adventure of
my lived experience and the reality of what people offer and
just bring all of that into one fun little rubber band ball of
an offer. That's so cool.
So it's like you've created a brand.
Like it sounds like you really wanted yourself to be seen and
(14:35):
to be seen for who you are versus wearing this corporate
mask. And some people aren't even
wearing a mask. I should just say like, we're
not shitting on this. So we are not shitting on the
corporate employee. I've been there, you've been
there. I think it is the perfect setup
for so many people. Probably majority of people, if
I'm being honest, like entrepreneurship also isn't for
everybody. But I wouldn't say majority.
(14:57):
I should just say a lot of people.
But it sounds like you were really after like, no, I just
want to, I want to be me. And it's kind of cool that
you've differentiated the fact that you are no longer writing.
It's not like you are a copywriter for the travel
industry that you're like, no, you're showing your whole self
and the fact that you live a nomadic lifestyle so that your
(15:18):
clients know that about you. And you're not like tiptoeing
around or like pretending like you're working or like you're
just, you're like, this is who Iam.
Yeah, yeah. And you're setting up my post,
my kickoff calls. And I plan my schedule around
California time, 6:00 to 8:00 AMso that when I'm in Europe, when
I'm in Asia, when I'm in Africa,I will still be awake.
(15:40):
And I don't have to change that when I'm somewhere else.
So I'm not a travel brand copywriter.
I'm a copywriter who travels andI host my meetings during those
times so that I can also meet with people who are in any of
those time zones. So it's not just about me, it's
about them as well because I cantranslate this like
(16:00):
international experience to so many different people from so
many different. Places that's really cool, so
smart. And I think there's so many
parallels like when you, we werechatting about you coming on the
podcast and it just didn't feel at first I was like, oh, is this
gonna be, you know, are there any gonna be any like parenting
related topic? It doesn't matter.
It doesn't matter that this our initial like we're not meeting
(16:22):
because we're both parents or anything.
We're meeting because we're bothhumans.
And I think everybody should learn how to tell their story
and to have a personal brand. And I think there's so many
parallels with just humans. Like it doesn't matter if you're
a parent or not, but the fact that you should be building the
life that you want. Like, that is, so build the life
that you want first and then have everything else fit around
(16:44):
it. Got him work.
Like, fit your work around the life that you want.
Yeah. And so if the life you want
involves children, then set all that up.
Decide what you really want in that first, Maybe you are a
nomadic family, and then fit thework and all that.
It's like, OK, you're a copywriter.
Does this make sense? Am I saying this correctly?
It would be like I'm a parent who works versus like I'm a
(17:07):
corporate girly who just happensto have kids.
Right. Yeah, yeah, there's a difference
between that and I think as women we absorb identities.
I heard this from a realtor one time.
It's Ford, like Henry Ford. Ford.
When you ask somebody to tell them, tell you about themselves,
they will tell you about F family occupation, R recreation
(17:31):
or D dreams. So it's OK to say I am a or.
I enjoy blank and as women, I think we have these identities
pushed on us. And there's there's, I mean,
mommy guilt is so freaking real and I don't envy it.
But how do you be an entire person when you're also a
(17:54):
parent? Sometimes it's a really tough
balance to strike. So I always encourage people to
think about it when they're telling their stories is sure,
you're a mom, a sister or a wifeor whatever, but you're also all
of these other things. You're an expert chef and you
have certifications in wine and lean 6 Sigma.
(18:16):
Like you can just be all of these amazing, brilliant things
and be a parent. I don't think that there's
always this like hierarchy or I'm a mom first or I'm a career
woman first. I think that that concept is
pushed on us and it's like you're a career woman and.
OK, I just marked that on my little recording device here
(18:37):
because I think that is so important.
I think that's such a smart way to to put it that you can be
like, there doesn't have to be ahierarchy.
Why are we doing that all the time?
Why are we constantly feeling like we have to create a
hierarchy or we have to prove what our hierarchy is like?
Oh my God, I, I was working a lot this week.
(18:57):
I've got to prove that my hierarchy is actually family 1st
and then myself at the bottom and my husband, like they can
all just live together. You and I met because I, we were
both speaking at the Multipotentialite Summit run by
Taylor Taylor Aller. And because we believe if you're
speaking on that panel with me, which you were, we believe that
(19:19):
you can be and, and, and like you can be.
I can be Andrea. I'm a career coach.
I'm a mom of two. I'm a wife.
I used to do musical theatre. I still love seeing musicals and
I dream of having an ocean view 1.
Like, you know, it's like I was trying to do the fourth thing.
Did you see that? Yeah, I love by the way, It's
(19:39):
totally it's and and you can think about it like the spokes
in a wheel, like the days that that mommy guilt is there.
It's because the spoke on your career wheel is just like really
getting some love and like the when you have these things that
feel even the spokes on your wheel, your wheel is then going
to turn really well. And that perfect balance
(20:00):
probably never happens. But you just have to follow what
feels really good for you. And you have to tell your story
in a way that feels good for youand continue to follow that
story. And it's going to melt and
change over time too. Yes.
So how as we, this is a predominantly female identifying
(20:21):
podcast, I would say moms reticular, we have some dad
listeners. So hello, this is important for
you too. But how does a person who's
listening create a personal brand that really feels
authentic versus like, again, another mask of authenticity?
Like I'm going to tell this one story because this feels
authentic. Like how do you actually create
a personal brand? You know what, Samantha, step
(20:43):
back a second. What is a personal brand?
Let's go there first and then itwill ask that question.
A personal brand is a lot of things.
Such a big question, but. I.
Always explained brand as the vibe.
What is your overall vibe? Because there's a visual brand
of written brand of this so thatit can be a lot to sit down and
think about. But what's your overall vibe?
(21:07):
Love that. What's your vibe?
What's your vibe? And I love that because then
it's like, what's your vibe whenyou walk into a party?
What's your vibe when you're one-on-one with a friend?
What's your vibe when you're sitting down with a coworker,
when you're in a big meeting, when you're presenting on stage,
when you're wearing all the differents?
What's your mom? But like, OK, do you think that
it has to be 1? Is it like one umbrella with
(21:27):
lots of like using like the spokes analogy where you can
have kind of have different vibes based on the situation or
is there like a core in that, would you say?
I love you umbrella analogy because the core centre, the
handle part of the umbrella. That's you.
That's who you know that you are, but you don't have to show
off your kids on LinkedIn to allof your colleagues.
(21:50):
So that's your career spoke of the umbrella.
That's cool. You can also be like there's
like an entire say half of it that is surrounded by your kids
because your kids are and being a parent is so much of your
identity right now. But PTO mom and wine night mom
can be two totally different things.
Hosting at soccer mom. Mom that has to go talk to the
(22:12):
principal. Those can be different brands,
but they're still always going to come back to you.
I don't think that there's ever a reason to leave yourself and
your values at the door. Absolutely not.
So that's why I love this umbrella and that people are
going to know you differently. Your kids know you very
different from your siblings know you're very different from
(22:32):
your boss know you're very different from the people who
work for you. It's so true if we think about
that. So the, the arm of the umbrella
arm, I don't know the big the thing you hold.
Yeah, Yeah. So that's like the core who you
are. If we were to treat the people
listening as brand like as little businesses themselves,
like if you're running yourself like a business, how would you
(22:53):
encourage? And if you're working with a
brand, how do you encourage themto really figure out what's in
there? What's in I'm getting really,
I'm like, if anyone's watching this on YouTube, I'm like
holding the umbrella in my hand right now.
Some of those people, that's really easy to hypnotize because
you know, the test is always youhold the balloon in a rock and
see how far. My husband says that if given
(23:15):
the opportunity, join a cult because I'm going to be so
easily like. Wait.
So yes, I would be very easily. Hypnotized your umbrella cult?
Yes. Yeah, OK.
How do you figure out who you are?
Take a step back and look at your values.
Is exactly where I would start. You can build your values from
(23:40):
what you do repeatedly. So for example, if you say I'm
really passionate about giving, giving is a core value of mine,
but you literally cannot show meanywhere in your balance sheet
or your timesheet where you're giving, then maybe that's not a
core value of you, so of yours. So this is like a really
businessy thing to do, but do a time on it and see how you're
(24:02):
spending your time. And we're spending your time
feels good, probably is really reflective of your values.
If you don't feel it's reflective of your values, then
that's why you need to think about how you spend your time.
But I think the other thing thatpeople do when trying to find
this like who am I? What is my personal brand?
Who am I authentically is they're trying to be super
(24:22):
vulnerable. We talked about authenticity and
vulnerability hand in hand and it's like, I do not need to know
what's happening under the Band-Aid.
Like please, you know, because moms, right, you're always
somebody's walking up to him being like, is this normal?
Showing you, showing you too much?
You don't need to do that. When you're figuring out how to
(24:44):
communicate who you are authentically, you don't have to
share all of your secrets. You just have to share what
feels comfortable, what feels really real to you.
So something that we see a lot with like I want to share my
authenticity. I want to share my vulnerability
is like really graphic stories, like birth stories or umm,
(25:08):
potentially like something really negative that happened in
your own childhood and that's why you're doing this thing now.
If that doesn't have anything todo with how you are helping and
supporting people in your business or in your personal
brand, you don't have to share that.
So I think there's a miscommunication going on that
to be authentic you have to overshare and that's not true.
(25:30):
We just have to come into these,what are our values?
What do I do repeatedly and thenhow do I describe that?
So I had mentioned before that sometimes your core value might
be generosity or giving. Give me that word and then give
me a definition. Are you being radically generous
with your time or are you generous in that you spend a
(25:54):
minimum of 15 hours a week volunteering at your kids
school? Is it with your time?
Is it with your funds? Is it What?
So all of that to say, find out what you're doing, what you
enjoy, define it in a single word, and then give me a
sentence to follow it up so thatI'm very clear on what that word
(26:15):
means to you. Oh, I love that so much.
Wow. I think that is the truth bomb
that could only be delivered by someone of like your confidence,
but also like grace and the way that you said like we don't need
to over sharing is not synonymous with authenticity.
Like in order to be authentic does not mean that you have to
(26:36):
have some sob story. And we've we've all got sob
stories. And it's not to like discredit
anybody's like storing where youcome from.
It's important that we like honor where we've come from.
However, I'm ah, there's such anick around that right now where
it's like a real stretch. You can like really feel that
the person was like, oh, I want to have a business.
(26:56):
OK, I'm going to make this skin care line.
OK, Now I'm going to retrofit insome story about it versus yes,
I actually was listening to a podcast where Lily Reinhardt
shoes on Riverdale was talking. I'm going to be honest, I
actually didn't think she was a great interviewee.
I wanted her to be a little bit flat.
It didn't really seem like she wanted to be there.
(27:17):
However, she got me to buy her product because she talked about
how she had horrific cystic acneand I have struggled with bouts
of acne in my like late 20s intomy 30s now and things I feel
like I've like seen the light. But she was just like, she
wasn't that like salesy. She wasn't that charismatic.
(27:41):
I'm going to be honest. However, her story was just
like, I had brutal acne and I always have to wear makeup in
this industry and my face is on camera and I was pissed off.
And you could just like hear it in her voice.
And I was like, wow, like Donna Assaria personal brand.
I guess that's her like actual brand, because her personal
brand was like, you know, not that I never.
(28:02):
Quite literally is attached to that brand.
Yes, yes, and it was fascinatingand I keep thinking about that
story for myself of just like how interesting that like it
wasn't and and people are like, oh, but I'm not like I'm not
very outgoing or when consider myself charismatic or whatever,
like the stories that people tell themselves.
But like this girl didn't reallydo it for me.
(28:22):
However, her like the story thatshe told and like why she
created this line, this product line and how everything is like,
you know, acne friendly or whatever.
I was like, I'm buying it, like I have to buy this.
And I was, and it was just such a good example versus the person
who you can just tell is like making it, not making it up, but
they're really reaching and. They're really reaching.
(28:45):
So let's say that that let's take that story and say like
what then makes it feel like they're reaching.
So let's say that she were askedon to a podcast about
specifically new moms. And you can tell when it's a
stretch of a story because let'ssay she's not a mom.
(29:07):
And then she's trying to fit this in of like, And I remember
when my sister and she was just crying in her face and it was
red and it was puffy and it was awful.
And it's just not only is it notabout her anymore, she's no
longer an authority in that space.
She kind of starts to make stuffup.
And I'm absolutely not saying this is the legal disclaimer
(29:27):
that she did any of that, but it's when it's no longer her
story to tell or it's no longer an appropriate story.
So another example of it not being appropriate is, let's say
then that she started talking about hormones and she's
selling, say hormone replacementrather than a beautiful face
cream. Like when they start to then go
(29:47):
educate people and things that they are absolutely have no
business educating people on. If she were to go on some health
and Wellness and fitness and hormones podcast and start
talking about it over there, that's where it's no longer an
authentic story. It's not her story and it's not
a story that she has any sort ofauthority in.
(30:07):
And I think that's where we start to stretch in an uncomfy
way is when we start to stretch away from an actual lived
experience that directly pertains to your audience.
Does it always have to have a personal, like, does there
always have to be a personal story for like the most
(30:29):
successful brands out there or personal brands for people who
are just like, I want to reinvigorate myself as a PR
person in the corporate world. Like, do they have to have some
like, personal connection, some personal story to PR?
She's really mean. Like what is it we have to have
in there like toolbox to create that personal brand that feels
(30:52):
authentic? Are you saying so if somebody
just decides that they want to go into.
PR say they took a 10 year career break to raise their
kids. They were in PR, they're they're
in marketing now. They want to like really nice
down. They've done PR before.
They want to get back into it and they're like, OK, I'm
refining myself in this space. But it's not like they're like,
you know, for the past 10 years,I haven't stopped thinking about
(31:12):
PR Like that's not their story. But they're like, how do I, what
is my uniqueness around this area?
I think at that point it becomesthe connection to their audience
because they have the authority,PR and marketing.
Then it's the getting on the same side of the table as the
people that they're marketing to.
Right. OK.
(31:33):
So if they wanted to mark it tooMOT like brands to do with like
parenting cool. Should they can speak to that.
They can be like, cool, I've been raising my kids for 10
years and I'm a marketer by trade.
This is my story. OK, OK.
So it's like, what are the commonalities with the audience?
Or if they're corporate, you canbe like, yeah, it was in the
corporate world. For 20 years I've been project
(31:54):
managing my home and here I come.
I don't know, that's not a good example.
But no, that's a great example because I think a lot of people
discount what they're able to dofrom working inside the home
into professional experience. And I mean, granted, are you a
like snack engineer at this point?
Does that guarantee you a careerworking at for Post Foods?
(32:17):
I don't know. But the PR that you have to do
and the communication that you have to keep with keeping
appointments and booking travel and all of that, like urine,
excellent project manager, don'tdiscount that experience.
You can do PR. You organized the PTO, your
volunteer work that you're doingon the side, Any of that is
(32:38):
incredibly valuable experience. I love that.
OK, OK, so we're going to Fast forward in the process and we're
going to say you've, you've beeninspired by Sam and you're like,
yes, I want to figure out what my personal brand is.
You're doing a bit of an audit. You're downloading my free 5
steps to Career Clarity, which is like a really helpful tool
that can help you figure out what's your next step.
(32:58):
If you're really like, whoa, I have no idea.
You're also jumping out of that plane and your parachute is not
been sewn together yet. And so you people are starting
to kind of figure it out and they're like putting it
together. They're that person who wants to
come back to their, their PR career or whatever, and they're
going to start talking about what it is that they want to be
doing. And they're starting to talk
(33:19):
about this, this new foray in their next level of their
career. How does somebody talk about
themself in this way without feeling salty?
They serve instead of cell. Write that down so we serve
instead of cell. And what I mean by that is we
(33:39):
educate people on what they are doing now and why it's not
working. We educate them on what could
work better. We educate them on what other
people like them have done to get past the spot that they're
in, and we simply guide them. There's a book that I firmly
(34:00):
believe is one of the marketing gospels.
It's called Story Brand. I recommend anybody looking to
story brand if you're wondering how to frame this up because so
often it reads problem solution here I am right?
Do you have trouble getting out of bed in the morning?
Great. I have this incredible energy
drink. DM me for more details right.
It's just problem solution here I am and it's it reads as this
(34:26):
hope it reads as salesy versus if you can get on again.
I say this get on the same side of the table as people and say
what is your ideal solution to not feeling tired in the
morning? Do you need a sleep coach?
Do you need a night time nanny? Do you need more natural energy?
(34:47):
OK, it's natural energy. Let me have this conversation
with you. Did you know that most women are
severely lacking in vitamin D? And when you pair that with
caffeine, it actually absorbs into the body better?
Again, legal disclaimer, that isnot science.
I don't know. I made that up off the top of my
head. It sounds.
Good, right? But it's this education of like,
(35:07):
oh man, then I need to find vitamin D and caffeine.
It's just giving people the bread crumbs to follow.
People love to feel heard. People love to feel smart.
So it comes down to asking engaging questions, actually
listening to the answers. And when people say my ideal
next step is blank, the ideal solution here is blank.
(35:30):
It's like, do you mind if I share how I do that?
So different, it's so different and I feel like that could be,
that's so applicable to the business owners listening.
And I think it's really applicable to the corporate
person who's coming back to work, changing jobs, you know,
making that request for the informational interview, you
(35:51):
know, Oh, Sam, I know that, you know, so and so at post foods,
like, you know, bubble blah, like how and then you get that
conversation. You're like, ah, how do I, how
do I talk about myself? I want to ask good questions and
at some point I do need to tell them a bit about myself.
But I think that's a, that's a great point.
It's like being engaging. There's a, there's a Ted Talk
(36:13):
about 1010 Ways to Have a Betterconversation by Celeste Headley.
Ever see that one? It's been awhile but I've heard
of it. Yeah, it's probably 10/10/15
years ago, I'm sure maybe when the birth of of Ted talks, but
it was she just is like be interested.
Don't try to be interesting. Like don't lead with talking
about yourself. Like be interested in what they
(36:35):
have to say. Because also how many
conversations I have done this amillion times where you're going
down a rabbit hole with somebodyand then you stop to ask them
the question and you realize whatever you were talking about
is irrelevant. Whatever.
You're like, you know, you're like teaching or telling them
something, mansplaining something.
And you're and they're like, Oh yeah, we don't even do that.
And you're like, great, really, really glad.
(36:56):
I like, you know, really glad I went down that rabbit hole with
you. Or that they already do that.
Say you're you are a project manager.
You're telling them about lean 6Sigma, whatever.
And as if like you're just goingoff without listening.
And they're like, yeah, we already do that, Scrum Master.
It's like, what a waste of time.And that's why they say that
sales is 80% listening as you'renot listening to respond, you're
(37:20):
not listening to reply, you're listening to respond so that you
give that thoughtful response. And then you can also promote
yourself really well. Because if you've ever read Dale
Carnegie's How to Win Friends and influence People, the
sweetest sound to any person's ears is the sound of their own
name. The second sweetest sound is
their own voice. People love to talk about
themselves. You mirror things back to them.
(37:43):
If they're saying lean 6 Sigma and you say wow lean 6 Sigma
just it sounds funny do but practice it on your spouse,
partner, kids. They will just keep talking
about whatever they were talkingabout when you just subtly
mirror things back to them and they feel so freaking heard.
They feel like you get them regardless of what it is that
(38:05):
you're putting in front of them,whether it's yourself as their
next employee or your offer as an entrepreneur.
I think we love the same books because I also love Story Brand.
Story Brand 2 point .0 I just listened to and he's got a whole
AI resource now that you can go on to online.
It's really cool to check out, but um, the Oh my gosh, I just
(38:26):
lost my train of thought. But anyways, there was going to
be another book that I was goingto say that also freaking love.
I lost it. Maybe I'll put it in the show,
not. So maybe it had to do with
mirroring, because there's was it, I'm gonna say Chris Rossi.
So you came back. It came back.
Chris Fosses never split the difference.
Such a good negotiating book. But I always tell people they're
(38:49):
like, oh, fun, like Whoopi and negotiating like, no, it is red.
Like, you could read all these harsh hostage scenario stories
that he tells, and that's how heteaches you about negotiation.
And he'll be like, OK, so in thecorporate world, like he tells
you this crazy story about a negotiation and like terrorists
and like guns and whatever. And he's like, OK, so if you're
in a boardroom meeting, you're like, wait, what?
(39:10):
But it's so good. It's so good.
Everybody should listen to it orread it.
Yes, yeah, that's phenomenal. He also has a master class.
If you have the master class app, he's on there.
If you're not a reader, that's athat's a good one to watch slash
listen to. Fun.
OK, so I want to talk about like, how is that people can
talk about themselves? Let's go back to the corporate
(39:31):
person only because I think thisis where there seems to be a
disconnect with people really honing their personal brand and
like who they are. They're like, Oh no, but I work
for Aritzia. I don't need a personal brand.
I already work for a brand. No, no, you yourself are the
brand. So say you're just you're
somebody who you know, you like what you do, will use this PR
person as the example good, you know, good at PR whatever.
(39:53):
And they're moving through life and they want to continue to
propel their career. So they know that they should be
out there like talking about what they do and meeting with
people like in those just like generic situations.
As it relates to continuing to be able to talk about yourself
and what you do. How what are some just good like
tips, tricks like how can peoplejust like talk about themselves
(40:13):
in real life or online, say LinkedIn articles, etcetera.
How can we do that to continue to propel a positive personal
brand? Yes, there's a lot.
Oh, there's so much here and there's so many listicles online
and they're honestly, a lot of them are really good.
As far as rather than saying in a meeting or something, I think
it just start your sentence after that, rather than I think
(40:35):
we should start putting Gatoradein the drinking fountains, just
we should start putting Gatoradein the drinking fountains.
Take away anybody else's abilityto doubt you when opening a door
and you bump into somebody. Don't say sorry, say excuse me
when you're late to something. Don't say sorry I'm late.
Say thank you for your patience.It gives you a sense of
(40:56):
authority and executive presence.
So honestly, that's a great place to start.
Search 10 ways to improve your executive presence and nine
times out of 10, they're pretty stinking good.
The other thing is, as women, weare told not to be too much.
We are told not to stand out. We are told whatever.
And then we're told later that we should have pulled our seat
(41:18):
up to the table sooner. We're told that we shouldn't
have worried about sounding bossy or bitchy or whatever,
right. So we're told throughout our
entire lives not to be too much.And I think there's a lot, a lot
of unlearning that happens here.I think some of that comes from
you can get an executive coach depending on what your company
(41:42):
offers you. If you are an entrepreneur, you
can hire a therapist. Therapy is great.
There are there are entrepreneurspecific therapists that exist
out there. There's also business coaches,
there's group programs. There is getting together with
your besties and practicing things that you want to be
better at. But how do you then self promote
(42:03):
without feeling salty, without shying away from being too much?
I think it comes down to knowing, knowing your value,
knowing that you can do something better than the other
person who's available to them. Again, this is corporate and for
entrepreneurs as well. Is that sometimes people are
(42:25):
going to choose the less expensive option.
Oftentimes they are going to choose the option that feels
most accessible to them and thatdoesn't always come down to
price. So be expensive, be worth
investing in, and that goes for your company and for you as an
entrepreneur. It's such a good point, even
(42:45):
just on that, like with regards to negotiation or how do you
value yourself, like with a price, a price or dollar,
whatever figure. And it's, it's so true.
I think when I coach people through, I do career coaching
and I, we often end up supporting them when they're
negotiating and they're talking to companies, they've got the
offer in hand and it's, you know, we're doing the back and
forth and it's, it's so true. And I've been on the other end
(43:08):
of the hiring where I'm the one hiring somebody.
And I want the person to your point, who has the least, the
path of least resistance, the person who can do the job well,
the person that I can get along with, that I can train, that
feels coachable. Like these are all things that
people are willing to pay for when it comes down to what, at
510-1520, even $1000 difference?I mean, there's pay bands often
(43:33):
and like, if you can get the person who's going to spend way
less of your time, like times money, it's a no brainer.
And so I think you're right. It's like people like, oh, but
what about the person is going to be what if the other person's
$5000 cheaper? Really.
Like are you buying a house thatway?
No. No, no.
Are you hiring your babysitter that way?
Are you hiring the timid kid who's like, I think I can change
(43:53):
a diaper? Can you just show me one more
time? Like can we do the show share,
observe framework? Or.
Are you going to pay twice as much for the person who walks
in, looks you in the eye, shakesyour hand and says absolutely?
Do we also do it after bedtime or are they good for the
evening? Yeah, that's asking those next
level questions. So you're going to hire based on
(44:16):
executive presence, even within your home.
Of course other people are goingto hire when somebody looks you
in the eye and says absolutely, I can do this better than
anybody else. I just love that.
OK, so on that authority piece, true or false, do people need to
be posting on LinkedIn or on some sort of social media
(44:37):
subject, whatever? Like even if they're not job
searching or hunting, is it likethis additional thing that
everybody should be doing to continue to like be top of mind
in their field? Like what is?
What are your thoughts on that? I feel like if you're sitting at
your desk scrolling on any platform, then you should be
(44:58):
replying on that platform as well so you can maintain a great
presence on those without doing a lot of extra lifting.
You don't need to sit down on the 1st of the month and plan
what you're going to say on LinkedIn if you don't want to.
If you haven't been in the past,sometimes it's weird when all of
a sudden somebody shows up. It's like, well, I don't know,
(45:21):
beige flag, green flag, red flag.
Somebody's clearly looking for ajob here.
Too. Right, like you just showed up
out of nowhere, but build your authority, bolster your boss,
bolster the people around you bysaying, Oh my gosh, I can't
believe she's hosting this master class.
I had to pay to listen to her atlast year's conference and she's
hosting this this year. Get on this.
(45:43):
When you promote other people, arising tide lifts all ships.
So when you promote other people, you look good as well.
So I would say yes and don't overthink it.
Oh my gosh, I love that example too.
About like, it doesn't always have to be about you.
You don't need to be going on LinkedIn and being like, I wrote
this like 2000 word article or like, here's an interesting
(46:04):
thought piece from Harvard Business Review that I just read
like boring. But yeah, that was the people
who share or like, you know, this person I actually shared
recently somebody I used to workwith who I didn't even work on
her team, but she was posting that she was hiring someone on
her team and I reposted it. Don't even work anymore.
But I was like, Hey, this is a great person to work for if
you're looking and this sounds good, like you should work for
(46:26):
her. There was 0 gain to that for me,
but I was like, I, I just did itcause I was like, yeah, she's a
great person. And if somebody I know had the
opportunity to work for her, that's, that's amazing.
And maybe it's more stuff like that, right?
Like I and I just, I'm not saying I'm some sort of like
Angel. I just did that the one time.
But you know. But what are those?
Examples of like example that wecan all do to and like the the
(46:50):
side effects are like other women look good.
We're all getting more publicity.
We then kind of Mary our personal brand to that person
and it can be it can be anyone right.
It can be alone. Amar, the US Olympian for, for
the rugby team, like she's posting on LinkedIn and it's
like, oh, I could kind of Co brand myself with being a
(47:12):
powerful woman who advocates forother women by posting about her
stuff. It's it's not that it's not that
complicated unless you want it to be.
But absolutely give yourself thegrace to not be writing the 2000
word think pieces twice a week. You do not do that.
The people who are doing that have teams behind them.
(47:33):
Thank you for saying that. OK, good.
Even I feel better because I'm like, there's so many platforms,
too many platforms. And hey, if you want to support
women in this show in in this episode right here, I'd
encourage you to share this episode with friend.
Put it on your LinkedIn, put it on your your twitters, your
(47:53):
exes, your threads, your Instagram, whatever.
I would we would appreciate it. That would be incredible.
OK, now we have. I would be remiss, we are
running out of time, but we needto talk about flexible working.
Yeah, absolutely. How does one create this for
themselves? And one of the reasons why I was
(48:14):
so excited to have you on the show was because so many of the
people that I work with are looking for flexible work.
They're parents. And they're like, yes, I almost
need flexible remote work as if I was in Tahiti, but I'm
actually in North Vancouver, Canada and I just want to stay
in North Vancouver, Canada, but I want to pretend like I could
(48:35):
live and work anywhere. So how do you even, how do you
go, how do you go about that? And OK, I'm going to stop there.
So many questions, so many questions.
So, um, for the business owner, I think that's an easier
example. And from those who you've seen
worked with, you know, chummed along with in the corporate
side, how do you see that working?
(48:58):
I have always admired the peoplewho do not apologize for their
kids. I'll start by saying that sorry
I can't, I have school pick up, sorry I can't.
The kids sick, whatever. I always admire when people can
just say I don't take calls until after 8:00 AM period.
(49:20):
It is OK to state your boundary and let that be your boundary
without putting it on an invisible other, right?
So and the invisible other in this situation tends to often be
kids. You know, it's kind of the
version of like my mom says, I can't even when you were like,
mom say no. That's good wine.
So just be be OK with your boundaries.
(49:43):
If somebody needs you to come inbefore 8, ask them if there's a
like flexible childcare option or if they should come in.
If you should come in at your regular time.
Your boss keeps setting meetingsfor four.
Absolutely not. If you have pick up at 4:30 and
you're leaving your kid to wait,no, no, we're all working on the
(50:05):
same time zones here. You can assert those boundaries.
I know it's difficult. It varies in difficulty based on
your industry and where your colleagues are.
So often we're working with colleagues everywhere from Dubai
to Dallas, right? Like it's all over the place,
but it's OK for your boundaries to be your own.
I'll start there. Beyond that, I think in your
(50:29):
personal brand, in what you're writing to other people and
about yourself. Again, this comes back to not
necessarily being unapologetic, but not feeling that you have to
apologize or put yourself down and also giving really realistic
deadlines for yourself. It is OK to say no, I cannot
(50:53):
have this done by 3:00 PM. I can have it done by 3:00 PM
tomorrow. Let me know if you'd like me to
proceed. Putting the ball back in other
people's courts also helps you create those time boundaries so
that it's not necessarily that you could be in Tahiti, it's
that you're not freaking out today when it comes to then all
(51:16):
of the other, like how does thatmeetings my experiences as an
entrepreneur since 2019. So I don't know everything that
has changed since 2020, but whatI do with my schedule and I am
my own boss is I open my calendar from 6:00 to 8:00 AM
Monday through Thursday Pacific Standard Time.
So I am available during most people's meeting hours.
(51:37):
I will then get on other people's calendars if they can't
fit into mine, but I still then have that control and I can
close down whenever I, I say whenever I want, you know, for
going out of town or being on a flight 1 day.
I know that not everybody in corporate has the sorry boss
just not working Tuesday, but italso allows me to do deep work
(52:01):
and my clients understand that really well that sorry, I'm not
going to meet with you after a certain time because I need to
just be in the project. And you would expect me to be in
your project if I swore I was blocking that day to work.
So, oh, so you can frame it in that way of saying, can we shift
all of these meanings to betweenMondays and Wednesday mornings
so that I can focus on Thursday and Friday of just doing insert
(52:24):
task here? Yes, I just did that with a
client, but it was a huge unlock.
We actually had a an intro session together and it was the
first thing that we like uncovered before actually
officially working together in acoaching container.
And that was it was one thing. It was like it was 1.
She was, I think I've told the story on the podcast before, but
basically she was so stressed because she was constantly
(52:47):
feeling so time time crunched based on the fact that she was
constantly in meetings. Sound familiar to anybody?
And she was like, oh, what I would give to just have more
time. I was like, what have you
created time? What have we created a time
block where you, you and your dyad partner didn't take
meetings. She tried it out.
She worked with her partner because they had kind of worked
together and it changed the gamelike this one simple thing and
(53:10):
then it condensed the meetings to be so she wasn't having to
task switch between a task and then a meeting.
Like the days were a little bit more, you know, front loaded
with the meetings, but then she had the deep work thinking time.
And something you said earlier reminded me of the fact that
it's also really important to, to create those, you know, to
have the boundaries, which womenhave a really hard time being
like boundaries. It sounds so firm.
(53:31):
It sounds so like this that it'sjust a word, right?
It's just, you're like just the just how you do things.
You can even say just how you dothings.
And as long as you're holding those boundaries for the
day-to-day stuff, for the, when the boss wants to have that
recurring meeting or for when the person's like, oh, can you
hop on a zoom and you're like, no, like, I'm, I'm going out the
door. If you maintain those
(53:52):
boundaries, then you are allowedto have the energy.
Like we always still have a bit of reserve energy, kind of like
a little bit of room left for dessert.
Then you're allowed to decide when it is that you can go above
and beyond and really step up when it really matters.
Because if you don't have the energy, because you were like
took the call from Joe who just wanted to like ask you about an
e-mail that you already sent himthat was like, such a, it wasn't
(54:16):
a good use of your time and yourenergy.
But if you saved a little bit when your boss is like, Oh, my
goodness, I'm so sorry to do this, but like, we've got to get
this report out. I'm really frazzled.
I don't have this. You can be like, Joe, I got
this, or Sam, I got this. Yeah, I shouldn't be.
I shouldn't be Using a male nameas an example.
Sure, it could be seeing your name.
You got we're we're all Aaron. Aaron could go both ways.
(54:39):
OK, Thank you for that. Thank you for that.
Yeah. So it's like, like, save the
little dessert for like when it really matters.
It's not to say that you becausethen there's something about
those people, too, who are like,I'm basically a government
worker. This is my boundary.
They're like too intense about it.
That's also like, I've had people work for me like that who
never, ever. I'm not asking, you know, for
(55:02):
them to step up above and beyondevery single day, but like they
never wanted to show that like 1% extra and it's nice to hold a
bit in reserve. I mean, and there's ways to put
the ball in somebody else's court is to make it their
decision and also make it very beneficial to them.
So hey, boss, I'm feeling reallystressed out recently.
(55:24):
I've noticed that I've gone from8:00 to 9:00 to 10 hours here
every single day. I want to make sure that I can
continue working here and not getting burned out.
Do you think it's better for me to work 7:00 to 3:00 or 9:00 to
4:00 or 9:00 to 5:00 and make ittheir decision in a way that
(55:45):
benefits them? And then that way you can do
either pick up or drop off or, you know, whatever, but you're
still then they're still choosing for you to be there.
Max of eight hours. I love that.
And it's like, and if you want me to take on this next
portfolio of work, what do you want me to release here?
Are the other things in the hopper and the priorities, What
(56:07):
of that? Do we need to shift elsewhere in
order to make this happen if this is the priority?
Yeah, that's a huge one. And then it's their decision and
you didn't drop the ball. Yes, yes.
Oh my goodness. I could talk to you forever.
And this was so incredibly valuable.
So many takeaways that are not even to do with copywriting or
even personal right. Just like life and navigating
(56:28):
work. You've definitely have those
chops in the corporate world or in work in general.
So thank you. I want to do a rapid fire with
you. I didn't even tell you we're
going to do this. OK, let's do it.
Ready. Favor country you visited.
Brazil. I want to go, OK, I have to stop
one travel experience that profoundly impacted you.
(56:50):
I booked a flight out of Beirut that didn't exist, so I was
stranded in the Beirut airport. No.
It actually turned out really well.
I ended up surfing in the Mediterranean and met friends
because then I like had to stay for an extra couple days and buy
a flight. Made some friends that I'm still
(57:11):
friends with today. So it was a girl wash your face
moment. Like, was I absolutely crying in
the airport trying to figure outif I could speak French to
somebody? Yeah, but then also it worked
out. Oh, what a good news story.
I love that top book. We've talked about a few books,
but top books That's book that has influenced your career or
(57:32):
mindset. The four hour workweek.
Ooh. Changed the game for me when I
was in college and changed the way that I saw work.
So I think I went into the corporate world knowing that
there was a way out. Tim Ferris 4 hour work week.
Love it. What is 1 non negotiable in your
daily routine regardless of yourlocation?
(57:54):
Going for walks. And why would you say sales can
actually be sexy? Because there is nothing hotter
than a woman who knows what she's worth and goes and gets
it. Hey, what a way to end it.
OK, Sam, what are you still trying to figure out?
I'm trying to figure out where Iwant to be a year from now,
(58:19):
yeah. Like country wise or like a
life? Yeah, I we're going through a
personal life change here soon and it's like, where are we
going to experience that from? So it's exciting.
Love that for you and where can everybody learn more from you,
find you online, all the things Where can they see your personal
(58:40):
brand on the Internet? Yes, that right now is most
present socially. On Instagram, at Nomad dot copy
and on LinkedIn. I'm Samantha Burmeister.
My name's hard. It'll be in the show notes.
You can find mywebsite@nomadcopyagency.com.
Amazing and you have a wonderfulgift for the audience I.
Do ahmadkapiagency.com/all figured out it'll be on the show
(59:04):
notes. I created a custom GPT to help
you create your opt in Page or landing page.
So if you have something that you offer for free or very low
dollar, this is the perfect place to write copywriter
approved copy to make sure that thing is converting.
Could they use that for like a LinkedIn bio?
I would be super curious if somebody does that and tries it,
(59:27):
message me because I would love to hear about that.
Because that would be cool. Because it's like it's the same
thing kind. Well, no, it's not the same
thing, not at all. But it would be interesting to
just see what if you were like acorporate girlie and you wanna
like throw yourself in the cheapGT and see if you can like use
something from it for your LinkedIn.
That might be. If you can, do it, but also if
you're the one hosting meetings at work, if you are the one
(59:49):
organizing the luncheon learns like that would be a great use
case for that too. OK, love that.
Thank you for that. That's so generous and it's so
excited to use it myself. I signed up before this.
Yes. OK, Sam, I will let you go.
I really appreciate your time. Thank you so much for man
everything. My mind is blown.
I'm really excited to share thiswith everybody.
(01:00:09):
Awesome, stay in touch. Thank you so much for listening
and since you made it this far, please share this episode with a
fellow parent who you love, respect, and want to support.
And while you're at it, hit me up on Instagram at All Figured
Out. Andrea, I would love to meet you
and hear what you are trying to figure out these days.
Welcome back to the All Figured Out Podcast.
My name is Andrea Barr. I'm your host.
Thank you for joining me again this week.
I just finished recording a really cool episode with
Samantha Burmeister. She is the founder of the Nomad
Copy Agency. She is a nomadic writer.
She travels the world constantlyand she is really obsessed with
(00:23):
helping people to just get theirstory out there.
How to really craft and hone your personal brand.
And I have to read or bio to youbecause it is probably the best
bio I have ever received. I always ask my guests, hey, can
you send me a bio? And then I like, you know, cut
and paste from it or whatever. This is her.
This is her entire bio. Sam writes really freaking good
sales copy for service providers.
(00:44):
She runs her business from all over the world so that yours can
be found from anywhere. That's it.
I mean, I love it. I think it says so much about a
person who can, you know, just keep things short and sweet.
So it might feel like a bit of afunny person to have on given
this is a parenting podcast and a lot of you are in perhaps the
(01:04):
corporate world, have a more structured 9 to five job and
maybe aren't entrepreneurs. However, I really wanted to have
Sam come on because I think there's something really special
about thinking about yourself asa personal brand, regardless of
if you're on TikTok dancing or whatever, but you yourself, you
are a brand in your career, in your life as a human being, as a
(01:26):
parent, you know all the different hats.
And Sam is such an expert in this topic on how to write and
somebody who knows how to write really good sales copy, which is
what Sam does, really knows a lot about how to get your
personal brand across. And so she comes on and we talk
about her nomadic life while hertravels from around the world,
(01:48):
her story of quitting while she was on a beach.
Yes, it's a real story. We talk about some of our
favorite books in business and for the career person, the go
getter, she shares advice on really beautiful topics actually
in the parenting space about howyou shouldn't be apologizing so
much and not apologizing for having kids.
(02:10):
Oh, we just go in so many different directions.
She's so wise. She's got such savvy
communication chops. And I think you're going to love
this episode. So without further ado, Sam
Burmeister, you're listening to the All Figured Out Podcast.
I'm your host, Andrea Barr. I'm a career coach for parents,
(02:32):
mom of two, and a self-proclaimed expert at
winging it. After 10 years in the corporate
world, two major career pivots, and navigating life with kids,
I've learned one thing. No parent has it all figured
out, and that's OK. Here, we're all about growing
personally and professionally while keeping family time
sacred. You'll get practical tips,
(02:53):
career strategies and musings onlife, plus guest experts to help
us fill in the gaps. So grab a coffee or hide in your
car for some knee time. We're about to figure out this
work, life and parenting stuff out together.
Sam Burmeister, thanks for joining me on the All Figured
Out podcast. Hi, thank you.
(03:13):
Nice to have you here. Yeah, it's good to be here.
I'm glad to talk to you again. You too.
Now it looks like you are in your California home.
Correct. Yes, that is not normal for you.
You're not normally home. Correct.
Yeah, From my understanding, Nomad and the copywriter, that's
the things to know about me. Personal professional.
(03:35):
There you go. OK.
Wait, I have to do a true or false?
The very beginning versus the very end?
OK, can you be nomadic in your work and not be a copywriter?
I just feel like all nomadic workers are copywriters.
Yes. Oh my gosh.
I know so many designers, software developers.
(03:57):
I know several nomadic podcasters.
Seriously. Love it.
What else? I'm trying to think product
designers, project managers, like people who are working full
time. There's a lot of project
managers out there and, and a lot of people that you wouldn't
expect to like I have been sitting at a cafe or recently,
(04:19):
this was last year, I was in a airport lounge in Bolivia.
And the woman next to me was a BP at Emerson Heating and
Cooling, which is one of those like biggest companies you've
never heard of kind of thing. And she gets off her call and
she had this like jacket that she would wear during calls that
was like kind of blazer, but it was actually like, if you see
(04:42):
what I'm wearing now, kind of a sweater material.
And that's like was her call thing.
And then she like pulls it off. And I was like, Oh my gosh, I
thought they were going to hear my flight being announced in the
background. And she hadn't been back to her
home base in like 3 years. That's so crazy.
OK, Now to layer on the next question that so many listeners
(05:02):
have will be can you do this with a family?
Now I know you yourself don't have children, but do you used
to come across other nomadic people who are workers who have
families? Like is that?
Is that a thing? Yes, it totally is.
And I'm forgetting the name of one of them off the top of my
head, but there is a company that specifically helps people
in families who are homeschooling or world schooling
(05:26):
or remote schooling their kids. They create these communities
where people can move. I think the minimum is for three
months, but up to a year. And you can also bounce between
different communities. So they've got one in Greece, in
Uruguay and Portugal, and these lovely, fun, professional
parents get to hang out and thenthey have these on-site
(05:49):
facilities for them to work and for the kids to do school work.
And then they also have primarily English speaking
communities all around the world.
Yeah, it's totally a thing. No, I'm so happy I asked that.
That is OK. That raised you really want to
have a conversation with my husband like ASAP.
It's a real thing. It's a real thing.
(06:10):
And there's a lot of people too,in the online business world
that I fall in who I've met themand they say, oh, my family and
I just did Italy for a year lastyear, and they'll be like, oh,
yeah, and we brought our dog. We just rented out our apartment
in Vancouver and did it. Yeah, Oh my gosh.
OK, wow. Inspired, inspired.
(06:33):
And this is even what we're hereto talk about.
Well, kind of, I mean, we're going to talk about a lot of
different things, but that is sofreaking cool.
So tell me your story. What is your I listen to the
Cubicle, the CEO podcast from our friend Ellen Yang, and she
always says, what's your cubicleto CEO story?
So what's yours? My cubicle, the CEO story.
(06:53):
So I went to traditional university.
I'm American, so I did the four years after high school kind of
classic, been there, done that story.
And it was during college that Istudied abroad.
I did a multi country study abroad program and I also did a
kind of internship work situation abroad.
(07:14):
And I realized like I can work and travel.
And this was back in 2010 to 2014 ish.
So it was before FaceTime, but after Skype existed like the
tech of where we were in the world.
And I was like, this is what I want to do is I want to be
wherever I want to be, but stillhave my cake and eat it too.
(07:37):
If I want this corporate career,I want to climb the ladder.
I want to be that girly and I want to hike in the Alps and not
have to save my meager 10 days of PTO to be able to do it.
So I got a degree in marketing and international business,
started travel blogging on the side, went into a sales career,
(07:58):
learned a ton about selling and sales and went into sales
leadership and then got really burned out and didn't want to do
it anymore. So I leveraged my experience
writing with my experience selling and in 2019, quit my
job. That's a whole other story that
we can touch on, but while on a beach in Vietnam and was like,
(08:19):
I'm not coming back. And I've been helping other
people sell using the words on the Internet ever since.
Unbelievable. Tell us the beach story.
I think that there's a lot of people listening who are
fantasizing about A not only being on a beach, but B quitting
their jobs. Well, on the beach.
So tickle our fantasy here. Absolutely.
(08:41):
So the writing was on the wall with my job, like I had been
very transparent of. This is probably my last year
here. I've had a lovely time.
I'm going to see myself out and I think a lot of people dream
of, you know, especially while they're on the beach, having the
Corona commercial life, right, of which we could just do this
(09:01):
every day of wanting to do that.But that life isn't sustainable.
I'll be very real. You can't drink on the beach
every single day. You can.
You're not going to go far. So I knew that.
But I was on the beach, I was checking into a hotel, and I
accidentally logged into my worke-mail rather than my personal
e-mail to get my reservation. And I saw that who I would call
(09:25):
my grand boss had really thrown me under the bus.
And I was like, I just had this full body like hot and cold at
the same time. Anxiety of I can't go back
there. And I was with a friend who
really talked me through it and was like, OK, but you have been
(09:45):
talking about how you want to save money so that you can quit.
And then you saved enough money and you didn't quit.
And then you wanted to wait until last year and then you
didn't quit. And now it's this year and
you're telling me at the end of the year you're going to quit
when your lease runs up. But like, that's convenient.
But what are you doing? What's the real goal here?
And so I responded, I let my boss know and she let him know.
(10:09):
And she was really happy for me.And I never, ever heard back
from the grand bus that threw meunder the bus.
So that was really affirming forme and I was on a two week
holiday in South Asia. I ended up staying for three
more months before going back and living in that apartment
that I had a lease on. Way Yeah.
(10:31):
Oh my gosh, yeah. Incredible.
And would you say that that was a real like, did you know what
the what the what was on the other side for you?
So you jumped and did you know what you were jumping into?
No, I absolutely jumped out of the airplane and built my
parachute. On the way down.
I reached out to a few people and said hey, you know me and my
(10:52):
character and I know that you own a business, so if you or any
of your business owning besties need anything, let me know.
And because I had been publishing my travel blog on the
side, every single person asked me to write something.
Most of them were websites. I had no idea what I was doing.
I was like, it's $500 a lot and it floated me along.
(11:15):
But what's funny is I had left my computer at home.
I was just traveling with like asmall backpack, like one week's
worth of laundry. So I didn't have that on me.
So thank goodness it was 2019 because Internet cafes were
still a thing. So I could go borrow a computer
and pay $2.00 an hour in Thailand to log into Google Docs
(11:40):
and write stuff for people. Which was kind of.
Crazy. That is so, so cool.
What would you say? So we're going to be talking
about a lot today. We're going to be talking about
things like personal brand, feeling salesy and that sort of
thing. But when you put yourself back
in Sam of that moment of really like jumping out and not like
(12:00):
you're like sewing the parachutetruly as you're here falling up,
I would say. What was your personal brand at
that point? How would you describe your
personal brand then? I think my personal brand was
very corporate, very buttoned up, very professional.
There was not a lot of me in that brand.
(12:21):
I was saying and doing things that I would be OK if my company
found out about, even in my sidegig, because I was still
publishing that stuff to LinkedIn.
I was just also, and that's another thing, it was LinkedIn,
not Instagram. I was very buttoned up in that
way. All of my personal accounts were
private, that brand. I remember one time going
(12:44):
surfing in Guadalupe, which is aFrench island but in the
Caribbean, and I had somebody atwork say like, oh, that you're
always going to dangerous places.
I was like, I was literally in France, like it's not dangerous.
So I think I thought I was buttoned up, but perhaps other
(13:06):
people perceived me as being like the crazy adventurous one.
But I was definitely adventurouswithin brackets.
OK. And then how would you, now that
we're kind of you're introducingus to the Sam of today, how
would you describe your personalbrand now?
Personal brand now is much more confident in that way that I am
(13:28):
not afraid to be who I am and bring those sides of me into my
business. My business is built around days
rather than weeks. So I build my business around my
life and therefore I can allow glimpses into my life through my
business because for example, like sorry, can't work those
(13:51):
days I'm camping and that's OK. But it's not a travel focused
brand anymore because I'm writing copy for service
providers and service based businesses.
I'm not, I wouldn't not work with travel brands, but I'm no
longer trying to make the travelblog thing a thing and I'm just
helping other people sell. So when I call myself Nomad Copy
(14:13):
Agency, it's I get to pull in these sides of me that are the
science and the art of copywriting and the adventure of
my lived experience and the reality of what people offer and
just bring all of that into one fun little rubber band ball of
an offer. That's so cool.
So it's like you've created a brand.
Like it sounds like you really wanted yourself to be seen and
(14:35):
to be seen for who you are versus wearing this corporate
mask. And some people aren't even
wearing a mask. I should just say like, we're
not shitting on this. So we are not shitting on the
corporate employee. I've been there, you've been
there. I think it is the perfect setup
for so many people. Probably majority of people, if
I'm being honest, like entrepreneurship also isn't for
everybody. But I wouldn't say majority.
(14:57):
I should just say a lot of people.
But it sounds like you were really after like, no, I just
want to, I want to be me. And it's kind of cool that
you've differentiated the fact that you are no longer writing.
It's not like you are a copywriter for the travel
industry that you're like, no, you're showing your whole self
and the fact that you live a nomadic lifestyle so that your
(15:18):
clients know that about you. And you're not like tiptoeing
around or like pretending like you're working or like you're
just, you're like, this is who Iam.
Yeah, yeah. And you're setting up my post,
my kickoff calls. And I plan my schedule around
California time, 6:00 to 8:00 AMso that when I'm in Europe, when
I'm in Asia, when I'm in Africa,I will still be awake.
(15:40):
And I don't have to change that when I'm somewhere else.
So I'm not a travel brand copywriter.
I'm a copywriter who travels andI host my meetings during those
times so that I can also meet with people who are in any of
those time zones. So it's not just about me, it's
about them as well because I cantranslate this like
(16:00):
international experience to so many different people from so
many different. Places that's really cool, so
smart. And I think there's so many
parallels like when you, we werechatting about you coming on the
podcast and it just didn't feel at first I was like, oh, is this
gonna be, you know, are there any gonna be any like parenting
related topic? It doesn't matter.
It doesn't matter that this our initial like we're not meeting
(16:22):
because we're both parents or anything.
We're meeting because we're bothhumans.
And I think everybody should learn how to tell their story
and to have a personal brand. And I think there's so many
parallels with just humans. Like it doesn't matter if you're
a parent or not, but the fact that you should be building the
life that you want. Like, that is, so build the life
that you want first and then have everything else fit around
(16:44):
it. Got him work.
Like, fit your work around the life that you want.
Yeah. And so if the life you want
involves children, then set all that up.
Decide what you really want in that first, Maybe you are a
nomadic family, and then fit thework and all that.
It's like, OK, you're a copywriter.
Does this make sense? Am I saying this correctly?
It would be like I'm a parent who works versus like I'm a
(17:07):
corporate girly who just happensto have kids.
Right. Yeah, yeah, there's a difference
between that and I think as women we absorb identities.
I heard this from a realtor one time.
It's Ford, like Henry Ford. Ford.
When you ask somebody to tell them, tell you about themselves,
they will tell you about F family occupation, R recreation
(17:31):
or D dreams. So it's OK to say I am a or.
I enjoy blank and as women, I think we have these identities
pushed on us. And there's there's, I mean,
mommy guilt is so freaking real and I don't envy it.
But how do you be an entire person when you're also a
(17:54):
parent? Sometimes it's a really tough
balance to strike. So I always encourage people to
think about it when they're telling their stories is sure,
you're a mom, a sister or a wifeor whatever, but you're also all
of these other things. You're an expert chef and you
have certifications in wine and lean 6 Sigma.
(18:16):
Like you can just be all of these amazing, brilliant things
and be a parent. I don't think that there's
always this like hierarchy or I'm a mom first or I'm a career
woman first. I think that that concept is
pushed on us and it's like you're a career woman and.
OK, I just marked that on my little recording device here
(18:37):
because I think that is so important.
I think that's such a smart way to to put it that you can be
like, there doesn't have to be ahierarchy.
Why are we doing that all the time?
Why are we constantly feeling like we have to create a
hierarchy or we have to prove what our hierarchy is like?
Oh my God, I, I was working a lot this week.
(18:57):
I've got to prove that my hierarchy is actually family 1st
and then myself at the bottom and my husband, like they can
all just live together. You and I met because I, we were
both speaking at the Multipotentialite Summit run by
Taylor Taylor Aller. And because we believe if you're
speaking on that panel with me, which you were, we believe that
(19:19):
you can be and, and, and like you can be.
I can be Andrea. I'm a career coach.
I'm a mom of two. I'm a wife.
I used to do musical theatre. I still love seeing musicals and
I dream of having an ocean view 1.
Like, you know, it's like I was trying to do the fourth thing.
Did you see that? Yeah, I love by the way, It's
(19:39):
totally it's and and you can think about it like the spokes
in a wheel, like the days that that mommy guilt is there.
It's because the spoke on your career wheel is just like really
getting some love and like the when you have these things that
feel even the spokes on your wheel, your wheel is then going
to turn really well. And that perfect balance
(20:00):
probably never happens. But you just have to follow what
feels really good for you. And you have to tell your story
in a way that feels good for youand continue to follow that
story. And it's going to melt and
change over time too. Yes.
So how as we, this is a predominantly female identifying
(20:21):
podcast, I would say moms reticular, we have some dad
listeners. So hello, this is important for
you too. But how does a person who's
listening create a personal brand that really feels
authentic versus like, again, another mask of authenticity?
Like I'm going to tell this one story because this feels
authentic. Like how do you actually create
a personal brand? You know what, Samantha, step
(20:43):
back a second. What is a personal brand?
Let's go there first and then itwill ask that question.
A personal brand is a lot of things.
Such a big question, but. I.
Always explained brand as the vibe.
What is your overall vibe? Because there's a visual brand
of written brand of this so thatit can be a lot to sit down and
think about. But what's your overall vibe?
(21:07):
Love that. What's your vibe?
What's your vibe? And I love that because then
it's like, what's your vibe whenyou walk into a party?
What's your vibe when you're one-on-one with a friend?
What's your vibe when you're sitting down with a coworker,
when you're in a big meeting, when you're presenting on stage,
when you're wearing all the differents?
What's your mom? But like, OK, do you think that
it has to be 1? Is it like one umbrella with
(21:27):
lots of like using like the spokes analogy where you can
have kind of have different vibes based on the situation or
is there like a core in that, would you say?
I love you umbrella analogy because the core centre, the
handle part of the umbrella. That's you.
That's who you know that you are, but you don't have to show
off your kids on LinkedIn to allof your colleagues.
(21:50):
So that's your career spoke of the umbrella.
That's cool. You can also be like there's
like an entire say half of it that is surrounded by your kids
because your kids are and being a parent is so much of your
identity right now. But PTO mom and wine night mom
can be two totally different things.
Hosting at soccer mom. Mom that has to go talk to the
(22:12):
principal. Those can be different brands,
but they're still always going to come back to you.
I don't think that there's ever a reason to leave yourself and
your values at the door. Absolutely not.
So that's why I love this umbrella and that people are
going to know you differently. Your kids know you very
different from your siblings know you're very different from
(22:32):
your boss know you're very different from the people who
work for you. It's so true if we think about
that. So the, the arm of the umbrella
arm, I don't know the big the thing you hold.
Yeah, Yeah. So that's like the core who you
are. If we were to treat the people
listening as brand like as little businesses themselves,
like if you're running yourself like a business, how would you
(22:53):
encourage? And if you're working with a
brand, how do you encourage themto really figure out what's in
there? What's in I'm getting really,
I'm like, if anyone's watching this on YouTube, I'm like
holding the umbrella in my hand right now.
Some of those people, that's really easy to hypnotize because
you know, the test is always youhold the balloon in a rock and
see how far. My husband says that if given
(23:15):
the opportunity, join a cult because I'm going to be so
easily like. Wait.
So yes, I would be very easily. Hypnotized your umbrella cult?
Yes. Yeah, OK.
How do you figure out who you are?
Take a step back and look at your values.
Is exactly where I would start. You can build your values from
(23:40):
what you do repeatedly. So for example, if you say I'm
really passionate about giving, giving is a core value of mine,
but you literally cannot show meanywhere in your balance sheet
or your timesheet where you're giving, then maybe that's not a
core value of you, so of yours. So this is like a really
businessy thing to do, but do a time on it and see how you're
(24:02):
spending your time. And we're spending your time
feels good, probably is really reflective of your values.
If you don't feel it's reflective of your values, then
that's why you need to think about how you spend your time.
But I think the other thing thatpeople do when trying to find
this like who am I? What is my personal brand?
Who am I authentically is they're trying to be super
(24:22):
vulnerable. We talked about authenticity and
vulnerability hand in hand and it's like, I do not need to know
what's happening under the Band-Aid.
Like please, you know, because moms, right, you're always
somebody's walking up to him being like, is this normal?
Showing you, showing you too much?
You don't need to do that. When you're figuring out how to
(24:44):
communicate who you are authentically, you don't have to
share all of your secrets. You just have to share what
feels comfortable, what feels really real to you.
So something that we see a lot with like I want to share my
authenticity. I want to share my vulnerability
is like really graphic stories, like birth stories or umm,
(25:08):
potentially like something really negative that happened in
your own childhood and that's why you're doing this thing now.
If that doesn't have anything todo with how you are helping and
supporting people in your business or in your personal
brand, you don't have to share that.
So I think there's a miscommunication going on that
to be authentic you have to overshare and that's not true.
(25:30):
We just have to come into these,what are our values?
What do I do repeatedly and thenhow do I describe that?
So I had mentioned before that sometimes your core value might
be generosity or giving. Give me that word and then give
me a definition. Are you being radically generous
with your time or are you generous in that you spend a
(25:54):
minimum of 15 hours a week volunteering at your kids
school? Is it with your time?
Is it with your funds? Is it What?
So all of that to say, find out what you're doing, what you
enjoy, define it in a single word, and then give me a
sentence to follow it up so thatI'm very clear on what that word
(26:15):
means to you. Oh, I love that so much.
Wow. I think that is the truth bomb
that could only be delivered by someone of like your confidence,
but also like grace and the way that you said like we don't need
to over sharing is not synonymous with authenticity.
Like in order to be authentic does not mean that you have to
(26:36):
have some sob story. And we've we've all got sob
stories. And it's not to like discredit
anybody's like storing where youcome from.
It's important that we like honor where we've come from.
However, I'm ah, there's such anick around that right now where
it's like a real stretch. You can like really feel that
the person was like, oh, I want to have a business.
(26:56):
OK, I'm going to make this skin care line.
OK, Now I'm going to retrofit insome story about it versus yes,
I actually was listening to a podcast where Lily Reinhardt
shoes on Riverdale was talking. I'm going to be honest, I
actually didn't think she was a great interviewee.
I wanted her to be a little bit flat.
It didn't really seem like she wanted to be there.
(27:17):
However, she got me to buy her product because she talked about
how she had horrific cystic acneand I have struggled with bouts
of acne in my like late 20s intomy 30s now and things I feel
like I've like seen the light. But she was just like, she
wasn't that like salesy. She wasn't that charismatic.
(27:41):
I'm going to be honest. However, her story was just
like, I had brutal acne and I always have to wear makeup in
this industry and my face is on camera and I was pissed off.
And you could just like hear it in her voice.
And I was like, wow, like Donna Assaria personal brand.
I guess that's her like actual brand, because her personal
brand was like, you know, not that I never.
(28:02):
Quite literally is attached to that brand.
Yes, yes, and it was fascinatingand I keep thinking about that
story for myself of just like how interesting that like it
wasn't and and people are like, oh, but I'm not like I'm not
very outgoing or when consider myself charismatic or whatever,
like the stories that people tell themselves.
But like this girl didn't reallydo it for me.
(28:22):
However, her like the story thatshe told and like why she
created this line, this product line and how everything is like,
you know, acne friendly or whatever.
I was like, I'm buying it, like I have to buy this.
And I was, and it was just such a good example versus the person
who you can just tell is like making it, not making it up, but
they're really reaching and. They're really reaching.
(28:45):
So let's say that that let's take that story and say like
what then makes it feel like they're reaching.
So let's say that she were askedon to a podcast about
specifically new moms. And you can tell when it's a
stretch of a story because let'ssay she's not a mom.
(29:07):
And then she's trying to fit this in of like, And I remember
when my sister and she was just crying in her face and it was
red and it was puffy and it was awful.
And it's just not only is it notabout her anymore, she's no
longer an authority in that space.
She kind of starts to make stuffup.
And I'm absolutely not saying this is the legal disclaimer
(29:27):
that she did any of that, but it's when it's no longer her
story to tell or it's no longer an appropriate story.
So another example of it not being appropriate is, let's say
then that she started talking about hormones and she's
selling, say hormone replacementrather than a beautiful face
cream. Like when they start to then go
(29:47):
educate people and things that they are absolutely have no
business educating people on. If she were to go on some health
and Wellness and fitness and hormones podcast and start
talking about it over there, that's where it's no longer an
authentic story. It's not her story and it's not
a story that she has any sort ofauthority in.
(30:07):
And I think that's where we start to stretch in an uncomfy
way is when we start to stretch away from an actual lived
experience that directly pertains to your audience.
Does it always have to have a personal, like, does there
always have to be a personal story for like the most
(30:29):
successful brands out there or personal brands for people who
are just like, I want to reinvigorate myself as a PR
person in the corporate world. Like, do they have to have some
like, personal connection, some personal story to PR?
She's really mean. Like what is it we have to have
in there like toolbox to create that personal brand that feels
(30:52):
authentic? Are you saying so if somebody
just decides that they want to go into.
PR say they took a 10 year career break to raise their
kids. They were in PR, they're they're
in marketing now. They want to like really nice
down. They've done PR before.
They want to get back into it and they're like, OK, I'm
refining myself in this space. But it's not like they're like,
you know, for the past 10 years,I haven't stopped thinking about
(31:12):
PR Like that's not their story. But they're like, how do I, what
is my uniqueness around this area?
I think at that point it becomesthe connection to their audience
because they have the authority,PR and marketing.
Then it's the getting on the same side of the table as the
people that they're marketing to.
Right. OK.
(31:33):
So if they wanted to mark it tooMOT like brands to do with like
parenting cool. Should they can speak to that.
They can be like, cool, I've been raising my kids for 10
years and I'm a marketer by trade.
This is my story. OK, OK.
So it's like, what are the commonalities with the audience?
Or if they're corporate, you canbe like, yeah, it was in the
corporate world. For 20 years I've been project
(31:54):
managing my home and here I come.
I don't know, that's not a good example.
But no, that's a great example because I think a lot of people
discount what they're able to dofrom working inside the home
into professional experience. And I mean, granted, are you a
like snack engineer at this point?
Does that guarantee you a careerworking at for Post Foods?
(32:17):
I don't know. But the PR that you have to do
and the communication that you have to keep with keeping
appointments and booking travel and all of that, like urine,
excellent project manager, don'tdiscount that experience.
You can do PR. You organized the PTO, your
volunteer work that you're doingon the side, Any of that is
(32:38):
incredibly valuable experience. I love that.
OK, OK, so we're going to Fast forward in the process and we're
going to say you've, you've beeninspired by Sam and you're like,
yes, I want to figure out what my personal brand is.
You're doing a bit of an audit. You're downloading my free 5
steps to Career Clarity, which is like a really helpful tool
that can help you figure out what's your next step.
(32:58):
If you're really like, whoa, I have no idea.
You're also jumping out of that plane and your parachute is not
been sewn together yet. And so you people are starting
to kind of figure it out and they're like putting it
together. They're that person who wants to
come back to their, their PR career or whatever, and they're
going to start talking about what it is that they want to be
doing. And they're starting to talk
(33:19):
about this, this new foray in their next level of their
career. How does somebody talk about
themself in this way without feeling salty?
They serve instead of cell. Write that down so we serve
instead of cell. And what I mean by that is we
(33:39):
educate people on what they are doing now and why it's not
working. We educate them on what could
work better. We educate them on what other
people like them have done to get past the spot that they're
in, and we simply guide them. There's a book that I firmly
(34:00):
believe is one of the marketing gospels.
It's called Story Brand. I recommend anybody looking to
story brand if you're wondering how to frame this up because so
often it reads problem solution here I am right?
Do you have trouble getting out of bed in the morning?
Great. I have this incredible energy
drink. DM me for more details right.
It's just problem solution here I am and it's it reads as this
(34:26):
hope it reads as salesy versus if you can get on again.
I say this get on the same side of the table as people and say
what is your ideal solution to not feeling tired in the
morning? Do you need a sleep coach?
Do you need a night time nanny? Do you need more natural energy?
(34:47):
OK, it's natural energy. Let me have this conversation
with you. Did you know that most women are
severely lacking in vitamin D? And when you pair that with
caffeine, it actually absorbs into the body better?
Again, legal disclaimer, that isnot science.
I don't know. I made that up off the top of my
head. It sounds.
Good, right? But it's this education of like,
(35:07):
oh man, then I need to find vitamin D and caffeine.
It's just giving people the bread crumbs to follow.
People love to feel heard. People love to feel smart.
So it comes down to asking engaging questions, actually
listening to the answers. And when people say my ideal
next step is blank, the ideal solution here is blank.
(35:30):
It's like, do you mind if I share how I do that?
So different, it's so different and I feel like that could be,
that's so applicable to the business owners listening.
And I think it's really applicable to the corporate
person who's coming back to work, changing jobs, you know,
making that request for the informational interview, you
(35:51):
know, Oh, Sam, I know that, you know, so and so at post foods,
like, you know, bubble blah, like how and then you get that
conversation. You're like, ah, how do I, how
do I talk about myself? I want to ask good questions and
at some point I do need to tell them a bit about myself.
But I think that's a, that's a great point.
It's like being engaging. There's a, there's a Ted Talk
(36:13):
about 1010 Ways to Have a Betterconversation by Celeste Headley.
Ever see that one? It's been awhile but I've heard
of it. Yeah, it's probably 10/10/15
years ago, I'm sure maybe when the birth of of Ted talks, but
it was she just is like be interested.
Don't try to be interesting. Like don't lead with talking
about yourself. Like be interested in what they
(36:35):
have to say. Because also how many
conversations I have done this amillion times where you're going
down a rabbit hole with somebodyand then you stop to ask them
the question and you realize whatever you were talking about
is irrelevant. Whatever.
You're like, you know, you're like teaching or telling them
something, mansplaining something.
And you're and they're like, Oh yeah, we don't even do that.
And you're like, great, really, really glad.
(36:56):
I like, you know, really glad I went down that rabbit hole with
you. Or that they already do that.
Say you're you are a project manager.
You're telling them about lean 6Sigma, whatever.
And as if like you're just goingoff without listening.
And they're like, yeah, we already do that, Scrum Master.
It's like, what a waste of time.And that's why they say that
sales is 80% listening as you'renot listening to respond, you're
(37:20):
not listening to reply, you're listening to respond so that you
give that thoughtful response. And then you can also promote
yourself really well. Because if you've ever read Dale
Carnegie's How to Win Friends and influence People, the
sweetest sound to any person's ears is the sound of their own
name. The second sweetest sound is
their own voice. People love to talk about
themselves. You mirror things back to them.
(37:43):
If they're saying lean 6 Sigma and you say wow lean 6 Sigma
just it sounds funny do but practice it on your spouse,
partner, kids. They will just keep talking
about whatever they were talkingabout when you just subtly
mirror things back to them and they feel so freaking heard.
They feel like you get them regardless of what it is that
(38:05):
you're putting in front of them,whether it's yourself as their
next employee or your offer as an entrepreneur.
I think we love the same books because I also love Story Brand.
Story Brand 2 point .0 I just listened to and he's got a whole
AI resource now that you can go on to online.
It's really cool to check out, but um, the Oh my gosh, I just
(38:26):
lost my train of thought. But anyways, there was going to
be another book that I was goingto say that also freaking love.
I lost it. Maybe I'll put it in the show,
not. So maybe it had to do with
mirroring, because there's was it, I'm gonna say Chris Rossi.
So you came back. It came back.
Chris Fosses never split the difference.
Such a good negotiating book. But I always tell people they're
(38:49):
like, oh, fun, like Whoopi and negotiating like, no, it is red.
Like, you could read all these harsh hostage scenario stories
that he tells, and that's how heteaches you about negotiation.
And he'll be like, OK, so in thecorporate world, like he tells
you this crazy story about a negotiation and like terrorists
and like guns and whatever. And he's like, OK, so if you're
in a boardroom meeting, you're like, wait, what?
(39:10):
But it's so good. It's so good.
Everybody should listen to it orread it.
Yes, yeah, that's phenomenal. He also has a master class.
If you have the master class app, he's on there.
If you're not a reader, that's athat's a good one to watch slash
listen to. Fun.
OK, so I want to talk about like, how is that people can
talk about themselves? Let's go back to the corporate
(39:31):
person only because I think thisis where there seems to be a
disconnect with people really honing their personal brand and
like who they are. They're like, Oh no, but I work
for Aritzia. I don't need a personal brand.
I already work for a brand. No, no, you yourself are the
brand. So say you're just you're
somebody who you know, you like what you do, will use this PR
person as the example good, you know, good at PR whatever.
(39:53):
And they're moving through life and they want to continue to
propel their career. So they know that they should be
out there like talking about what they do and meeting with
people like in those just like generic situations.
As it relates to continuing to be able to talk about yourself
and what you do. How what are some just good like
tips, tricks like how can peoplejust like talk about themselves
(40:13):
in real life or online, say LinkedIn articles, etcetera.
How can we do that to continue to propel a positive personal
brand? Yes, there's a lot.
Oh, there's so much here and there's so many listicles online
and they're honestly, a lot of them are really good.
As far as rather than saying in a meeting or something, I think
it just start your sentence after that, rather than I think
(40:35):
we should start putting Gatoradein the drinking fountains, just
we should start putting Gatoradein the drinking fountains.
Take away anybody else's abilityto doubt you when opening a door
and you bump into somebody. Don't say sorry, say excuse me
when you're late to something. Don't say sorry I'm late.
Say thank you for your patience.It gives you a sense of
(40:56):
authority and executive presence.
So honestly, that's a great place to start.
Search 10 ways to improve your executive presence and nine
times out of 10, they're pretty stinking good.
The other thing is, as women, weare told not to be too much.
We are told not to stand out. We are told whatever.
And then we're told later that we should have pulled our seat
(41:18):
up to the table sooner. We're told that we shouldn't
have worried about sounding bossy or bitchy or whatever,
right. So we're told throughout our
entire lives not to be too much.And I think there's a lot, a lot
of unlearning that happens here.I think some of that comes from
you can get an executive coach depending on what your company
(41:42):
offers you. If you are an entrepreneur, you
can hire a therapist. Therapy is great.
There are there are entrepreneurspecific therapists that exist
out there. There's also business coaches,
there's group programs. There is getting together with
your besties and practicing things that you want to be
better at. But how do you then self promote
(42:03):
without feeling salty, without shying away from being too much?
I think it comes down to knowing, knowing your value,
knowing that you can do something better than the other
person who's available to them. Again, this is corporate and for
entrepreneurs as well. Is that sometimes people are
(42:25):
going to choose the less expensive option.
Oftentimes they are going to choose the option that feels
most accessible to them and thatdoesn't always come down to
price. So be expensive, be worth
investing in, and that goes for your company and for you as an
entrepreneur. It's such a good point, even
(42:45):
just on that, like with regards to negotiation or how do you
value yourself, like with a price, a price or dollar,
whatever figure. And it's, it's so true.
I think when I coach people through, I do career coaching
and I, we often end up supporting them when they're
negotiating and they're talking to companies, they've got the
offer in hand and it's, you know, we're doing the back and
forth and it's, it's so true. And I've been on the other end
(43:08):
of the hiring where I'm the one hiring somebody.
And I want the person to your point, who has the least, the
path of least resistance, the person who can do the job well,
the person that I can get along with, that I can train, that
feels coachable. Like these are all things that
people are willing to pay for when it comes down to what, at
510-1520, even $1000 difference?I mean, there's pay bands often
(43:33):
and like, if you can get the person who's going to spend way
less of your time, like times money, it's a no brainer.
And so I think you're right. It's like people like, oh, but
what about the person is going to be what if the other person's
$5000 cheaper? Really.
Like are you buying a house thatway?
No. No, no.
Are you hiring your babysitter that way?
Are you hiring the timid kid who's like, I think I can change
(43:53):
a diaper? Can you just show me one more
time? Like can we do the show share,
observe framework? Or.
Are you going to pay twice as much for the person who walks
in, looks you in the eye, shakesyour hand and says absolutely?
Do we also do it after bedtime or are they good for the
evening? Yeah, that's asking those next
level questions. So you're going to hire based on
(44:16):
executive presence, even within your home.
Of course other people are goingto hire when somebody looks you
in the eye and says absolutely, I can do this better than
anybody else. I just love that.
OK, so on that authority piece, true or false, do people need to
be posting on LinkedIn or on some sort of social media
(44:37):
subject, whatever? Like even if they're not job
searching or hunting, is it likethis additional thing that
everybody should be doing to continue to like be top of mind
in their field? Like what is?
What are your thoughts on that? I feel like if you're sitting at
your desk scrolling on any platform, then you should be
(44:58):
replying on that platform as well so you can maintain a great
presence on those without doing a lot of extra lifting.
You don't need to sit down on the 1st of the month and plan
what you're going to say on LinkedIn if you don't want to.
If you haven't been in the past,sometimes it's weird when all of
a sudden somebody shows up. It's like, well, I don't know,
(45:21):
beige flag, green flag, red flag.
Somebody's clearly looking for ajob here.
Too. Right, like you just showed up
out of nowhere, but build your authority, bolster your boss,
bolster the people around you bysaying, Oh my gosh, I can't
believe she's hosting this master class.
I had to pay to listen to her atlast year's conference and she's
hosting this this year. Get on this.
(45:43):
When you promote other people, arising tide lifts all ships.
So when you promote other people, you look good as well.
So I would say yes and don't overthink it.
Oh my gosh, I love that example too.
About like, it doesn't always have to be about you.
You don't need to be going on LinkedIn and being like, I wrote
this like 2000 word article or like, here's an interesting
(46:04):
thought piece from Harvard Business Review that I just read
like boring. But yeah, that was the people
who share or like, you know, this person I actually shared
recently somebody I used to workwith who I didn't even work on
her team, but she was posting that she was hiring someone on
her team and I reposted it. Don't even work anymore.
But I was like, Hey, this is a great person to work for if
you're looking and this sounds good, like you should work for
(46:26):
her. There was 0 gain to that for me,
but I was like, I, I just did itcause I was like, yeah, she's a
great person. And if somebody I know had the
opportunity to work for her, that's, that's amazing.
And maybe it's more stuff like that, right?
Like I and I just, I'm not saying I'm some sort of like
Angel. I just did that the one time.
But you know. But what are those?
Examples of like example that wecan all do to and like the the
(46:50):
side effects are like other women look good.
We're all getting more publicity.
We then kind of Mary our personal brand to that person
and it can be it can be anyone right.
It can be alone. Amar, the US Olympian for, for
the rugby team, like she's posting on LinkedIn and it's
like, oh, I could kind of Co brand myself with being a
(47:12):
powerful woman who advocates forother women by posting about her
stuff. It's it's not that it's not that
complicated unless you want it to be.
But absolutely give yourself thegrace to not be writing the 2000
word think pieces twice a week. You do not do that.
The people who are doing that have teams behind them.
(47:33):
Thank you for saying that. OK, good.
Even I feel better because I'm like, there's so many platforms,
too many platforms. And hey, if you want to support
women in this show in in this episode right here, I'd
encourage you to share this episode with friend.
Put it on your LinkedIn, put it on your your twitters, your
(47:53):
exes, your threads, your Instagram, whatever.
I would we would appreciate it. That would be incredible.
OK, now we have. I would be remiss, we are
running out of time, but we needto talk about flexible working.
Yeah, absolutely. How does one create this for
themselves? And one of the reasons why I was
(48:14):
so excited to have you on the show was because so many of the
people that I work with are looking for flexible work.
They're parents. And they're like, yes, I almost
need flexible remote work as if I was in Tahiti, but I'm
actually in North Vancouver, Canada and I just want to stay
in North Vancouver, Canada, but I want to pretend like I could
(48:35):
live and work anywhere. So how do you even, how do you
go, how do you go about that? And OK, I'm going to stop there.
So many questions, so many questions.
So, um, for the business owner, I think that's an easier
example. And from those who you've seen
worked with, you know, chummed along with in the corporate
side, how do you see that working?
(48:58):
I have always admired the peoplewho do not apologize for their
kids. I'll start by saying that sorry
I can't, I have school pick up, sorry I can't.
The kids sick, whatever. I always admire when people can
just say I don't take calls until after 8:00 AM period.
(49:20):
It is OK to state your boundary and let that be your boundary
without putting it on an invisible other, right?
So and the invisible other in this situation tends to often be
kids. You know, it's kind of the
version of like my mom says, I can't even when you were like,
mom say no. That's good wine.
So just be be OK with your boundaries.
(49:43):
If somebody needs you to come inbefore 8, ask them if there's a
like flexible childcare option or if they should come in.
If you should come in at your regular time.
Your boss keeps setting meetingsfor four.
Absolutely not. If you have pick up at 4:30 and
you're leaving your kid to wait,no, no, we're all working on the
(50:05):
same time zones here. You can assert those boundaries.
I know it's difficult. It varies in difficulty based on
your industry and where your colleagues are.
So often we're working with colleagues everywhere from Dubai
to Dallas, right? Like it's all over the place,
but it's OK for your boundaries to be your own.
I'll start there. Beyond that, I think in your
(50:29):
personal brand, in what you're writing to other people and
about yourself. Again, this comes back to not
necessarily being unapologetic, but not feeling that you have to
apologize or put yourself down and also giving really realistic
deadlines for yourself. It is OK to say no, I cannot
(50:53):
have this done by 3:00 PM. I can have it done by 3:00 PM
tomorrow. Let me know if you'd like me to
proceed. Putting the ball back in other
people's courts also helps you create those time boundaries so
that it's not necessarily that you could be in Tahiti, it's
that you're not freaking out today when it comes to then all
(51:16):
of the other, like how does thatmeetings my experiences as an
entrepreneur since 2019. So I don't know everything that
has changed since 2020, but whatI do with my schedule and I am
my own boss is I open my calendar from 6:00 to 8:00 AM
Monday through Thursday Pacific Standard Time.
So I am available during most people's meeting hours.
(51:37):
I will then get on other people's calendars if they can't
fit into mine, but I still then have that control and I can
close down whenever I, I say whenever I want, you know, for
going out of town or being on a flight 1 day.
I know that not everybody in corporate has the sorry boss
just not working Tuesday, but italso allows me to do deep work
(52:01):
and my clients understand that really well that sorry, I'm not
going to meet with you after a certain time because I need to
just be in the project. And you would expect me to be in
your project if I swore I was blocking that day to work.
So, oh, so you can frame it in that way of saying, can we shift
all of these meanings to betweenMondays and Wednesday mornings
so that I can focus on Thursday and Friday of just doing insert
(52:24):
task here? Yes, I just did that with a
client, but it was a huge unlock.
We actually had a an intro session together and it was the
first thing that we like uncovered before actually
officially working together in acoaching container.
And that was it was one thing. It was like it was 1.
She was, I think I've told the story on the podcast before, but
basically she was so stressed because she was constantly
(52:47):
feeling so time time crunched based on the fact that she was
constantly in meetings. Sound familiar to anybody?
And she was like, oh, what I would give to just have more
time. I was like, what have you
created time? What have we created a time
block where you, you and your dyad partner didn't take
meetings. She tried it out.
She worked with her partner because they had kind of worked
together and it changed the gamelike this one simple thing and
(53:10):
then it condensed the meetings to be so she wasn't having to
task switch between a task and then a meeting.
Like the days were a little bit more, you know, front loaded
with the meetings, but then she had the deep work thinking time.
And something you said earlier reminded me of the fact that
it's also really important to, to create those, you know, to
have the boundaries, which womenhave a really hard time being
like boundaries. It sounds so firm.
(53:31):
It sounds so like this that it'sjust a word, right?
It's just, you're like just the just how you do things.
You can even say just how you dothings.
And as long as you're holding those boundaries for the
day-to-day stuff, for the, when the boss wants to have that
recurring meeting or for when the person's like, oh, can you
hop on a zoom and you're like, no, like, I'm, I'm going out the
door. If you maintain those
(53:52):
boundaries, then you are allowedto have the energy.
Like we always still have a bit of reserve energy, kind of like
a little bit of room left for dessert.
Then you're allowed to decide when it is that you can go above
and beyond and really step up when it really matters.
Because if you don't have the energy, because you were like
took the call from Joe who just wanted to like ask you about an
e-mail that you already sent himthat was like, such a, it wasn't
(54:16):
a good use of your time and yourenergy.
But if you saved a little bit when your boss is like, Oh, my
goodness, I'm so sorry to do this, but like, we've got to get
this report out. I'm really frazzled.
I don't have this. You can be like, Joe, I got
this, or Sam, I got this. Yeah, I shouldn't be.
I shouldn't be Using a male nameas an example.
Sure, it could be seeing your name.
You got we're we're all Aaron. Aaron could go both ways.
(54:39):
OK, Thank you for that. Thank you for that.
Yeah. So it's like, like, save the
little dessert for like when it really matters.
It's not to say that you becausethen there's something about
those people, too, who are like,I'm basically a government
worker. This is my boundary.
They're like too intense about it.
That's also like, I've had people work for me like that who
never, ever. I'm not asking, you know, for
(55:02):
them to step up above and beyondevery single day, but like they
never wanted to show that like 1% extra and it's nice to hold a
bit in reserve. I mean, and there's ways to put
the ball in somebody else's court is to make it their
decision and also make it very beneficial to them.
So hey, boss, I'm feeling reallystressed out recently.
(55:24):
I've noticed that I've gone from8:00 to 9:00 to 10 hours here
every single day. I want to make sure that I can
continue working here and not getting burned out.
Do you think it's better for me to work 7:00 to 3:00 or 9:00 to
4:00 or 9:00 to 5:00 and make ittheir decision in a way that
(55:45):
benefits them? And then that way you can do
either pick up or drop off or, you know, whatever, but you're
still then they're still choosing for you to be there.
Max of eight hours. I love that.
And it's like, and if you want me to take on this next
portfolio of work, what do you want me to release here?
Are the other things in the hopper and the priorities, What
(56:07):
of that? Do we need to shift elsewhere in
order to make this happen if this is the priority?
Yeah, that's a huge one. And then it's their decision and
you didn't drop the ball. Yes, yes.
Oh my goodness. I could talk to you forever.
And this was so incredibly valuable.
So many takeaways that are not even to do with copywriting or
even personal right. Just like life and navigating
(56:28):
work. You've definitely have those
chops in the corporate world or in work in general.
So thank you. I want to do a rapid fire with
you. I didn't even tell you we're
going to do this. OK, let's do it.
Ready. Favor country you visited.
Brazil. I want to go, OK, I have to stop
one travel experience that profoundly impacted you.
(56:50):
I booked a flight out of Beirut that didn't exist, so I was
stranded in the Beirut airport. No.
It actually turned out really well.
I ended up surfing in the Mediterranean and met friends
because then I like had to stay for an extra couple days and buy
a flight. Made some friends that I'm still
(57:11):
friends with today. So it was a girl wash your face
moment. Like, was I absolutely crying in
the airport trying to figure outif I could speak French to
somebody? Yeah, but then also it worked
out. Oh, what a good news story.
I love that top book. We've talked about a few books,
but top books That's book that has influenced your career or
(57:32):
mindset. The four hour workweek.
Ooh. Changed the game for me when I
was in college and changed the way that I saw work.
So I think I went into the corporate world knowing that
there was a way out. Tim Ferris 4 hour work week.
Love it. What is 1 non negotiable in your
daily routine regardless of yourlocation?
(57:54):
Going for walks. And why would you say sales can
actually be sexy? Because there is nothing hotter
than a woman who knows what she's worth and goes and gets
it. Hey, what a way to end it.
OK, Sam, what are you still trying to figure out?
I'm trying to figure out where Iwant to be a year from now,
(58:19):
yeah. Like country wise or like a
life? Yeah, I we're going through a
personal life change here soon and it's like, where are we
going to experience that from? So it's exciting.
Love that for you and where can everybody learn more from you,
find you online, all the things Where can they see your personal
(58:40):
brand on the Internet? Yes, that right now is most
present socially. On Instagram, at Nomad dot copy
and on LinkedIn. I'm Samantha Burmeister.
My name's hard. It'll be in the show notes.
You can find mywebsite@nomadcopyagency.com.
Amazing and you have a wonderfulgift for the audience I.
Do ahmadkapiagency.com/all figured out it'll be on the show
(59:04):
notes. I created a custom GPT to help
you create your opt in Page or landing page.
So if you have something that you offer for free or very low
dollar, this is the perfect place to write copywriter
approved copy to make sure that thing is converting.
Could they use that for like a LinkedIn bio?
I would be super curious if somebody does that and tries it,
(59:27):
message me because I would love to hear about that.
Because that would be cool. Because it's like it's the same
thing kind. Well, no, it's not the same
thing, not at all. But it would be interesting to
just see what if you were like acorporate girlie and you wanna
like throw yourself in the cheapGT and see if you can like use
something from it for your LinkedIn.
That might be. If you can, do it, but also if
you're the one hosting meetings at work, if you are the one
(59:49):
organizing the luncheon learns like that would be a great use
case for that too. OK, love that.
Thank you for that. That's so generous and it's so
excited to use it myself. I signed up before this.
Yes. OK, Sam, I will let you go.
I really appreciate your time. Thank you so much for man
everything. My mind is blown.
I'm really excited to share thiswith everybody.
(01:00:09):
Awesome, stay in touch. Thank you so much for listening
and since you made it this far, please share this episode with a
fellow parent who you love, respect, and want to support.
And while you're at it, hit me up on Instagram at All Figured
Out. Andrea, I would love to meet you
and hear what you are trying to figure out these days.
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