December 6, 2022 • 30 mins
On this episode of Indiana Stories-Jeff Townsend talks to journalist Áine Cain and attorney Kevin Greenlee from the Murder Sheet Podcast. The team explains the latest updates in the Delphi Murders case. Including Richard Allen's arrest probable cause affidavit.If you know any information on this case: contact information. Thanks for listening to the podcast, listen to more episodes to hear more Indiana Stories.Indiana StoriesThe Murder Sheet PodcastDelphi IndianaSupporters of the Podcast:Theme music provided by the ElmsUse Poddin for your podcast transcript, they've got all the tools that make it easy and great!Use PodcastPage to create a professional website for your content. Use the code INDIEPODCASTER to get 15% off!Content creators, use Boomcaster-- the easiest way to record studio-quality podcasts and video interviews from anywhere! Use the code INDIEPODCASTER to save 20% off your first three months!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
This podcast is or Jeff Townsend MediaProduction. This is Jeff Townsend. Thank
you for joining us for another episodeof Indiana Stories. Jeff Townsend here,
(00:22):
Welcome back to yet another episode ofIndie Anna's Stories. The listeners, you
guys reached out to me and I'mresponding you wanted updates in the Delphi case
whenever they became available, And ofcourse there's new information release with the probable
cause AFFI David came out and there'smore details about the arrest of Richard Allen
and how they got in a positionwhere they could arrest him. In this
(00:43):
conversation I'm going to share with youtoday, I link back up with the
Murder Sheet podcast and we talk aboutthe latest information that's been released. If
you want to hear any more greatIndiana Stories, you can go to Indiana
Stories dot com. Please give ita follow on your favorite podcast listening platform
if you want to rate at fivestars, why you're there, that'd be
cool. Before we jump into thisconversation, I do need to think the
three great companies that I always do. They are great for me and all
(01:07):
the content I create. Podon dotIo the best transcription service there is,
the most accurate. You know,it's actually funny because I have a buddy
named Danny Brown who has a verystrong Scottish accent, and he's always complaining
that he could never find a transcriptionservice that could transcribe, and well,
podon dot io actually it's very accurate, so he's very impressed. So you
need to get some audio into words. There's a great option for you podcast
(01:29):
page dot io. It's what Icontrol all my websites on. If you
go to Jefftownsend dot media, you'llsee all the work that I do there
and that team is amazing. Somake sure you use podcast page dot io
if you want to create a website. Then of course what we're recording everything
on here Boomcaster. This conversation aboutto have with the murder Sheet, the
conversation I have with everybody is recordedon Boomcaster. It is like the Zoom
(01:51):
for podcasters because the audio quality isthere, it's amazing. To make sure
you go to boomcaster dot com andcheck it out. I'm not going to
waste any more of your time.We're gonna jump in and get an update
on the Delphi case. Here mygood friends, Anya Kane, Investigative journalists
and Kevin Greenley he's a lawyer,he's an attorney. They're the Murder Sheet
podcast. They are joining me again, and I appreciate you both being willing
(02:15):
to form a relationship with me andwhen I ask, you are always willing
to come on here. I knowyou have a lot of national requests and
stuff like that, but the factthat you take the time to do this
for a local guys pretty cool.Well, we always really appreciate talking to
you, Jeff. You ask greatquestions, so I feel like it's always
a really good conversation. And sowe're local guys. Are us. Local
(02:35):
guys have to stick together. Itold the listeners i'd give them update whenever
something significant came up, and that'swhat we've come across. So a lot
has happened in the Delphi case here, and I'll just go ahead and reference
your guys's latest episode as a greatthing to listen to, because, in
my opinion, when I'm listening toa lot of news channels, the last
couple I mean the last couple ofdays, they are giving just little bits
(03:00):
and pieces that or there's just otherindividuals giving opinions, which I'm okay with.
Opinions, But I want to knowthe actual information, the exact information
before somebody's forming an opinion and sharingit with me. You guys actually read
it. You have a great jobwith that. So somebody wants an actual
exact breakdown of what we're going tobe talking about, I would encourage them
(03:22):
to listen to your latest episode.I really appreciate that. Yeah, we
just tried to kind of read itout loud and kind of give our thoughts
and also make it clear where wereally don't have more information to judge things
based on, hoping to get moreexpert opinions as we go forward. And
when we were reading it, wewere actually reading it for the first time
ourselves, I can tell. Yeah, actually recording another episode. I like
(03:46):
how it ended. You're like,well, okay, then thanks for listening.
You got the episode out there andit was good. It was good.
But okay, before we get intothat, the day actually started off
with something different. There was anannouncement that the defense had filed to try
to get the case moved. Wasit within one hundred and fifty mile radius
of Delphi? Yeah, outside ofthe one hundred and fifty mile radius,
(04:08):
basically one hundred and fifty miles away. We're actually we were in the middle
of recording an episode on that whenwe got the news that the PC dropped.
I mean, it's possible the judgecan say, hey, that's not
necessary. It only needs to beone hundred miles. It could be determined
to be whatever. But if it'struly one hundred and fifty miles, that's
actually it rules out all of northernIndiana, I believe, and it would
just really put Evansville, the thirdbiggest city in Indiana would be an option,
(04:30):
and there's Jeffersonville. I think thatwould probably fall in that area as
far as Indiana goes. If theygot what they wanted, that would be
it correct. Yeah, you're absolutelyright, it would. It would I
did. I drew my little circle, you know. I went on one
of those mapped websites where you candraw circle, and I basically get Evansville
and the southernmost tip of Indiana.You can't go east, west, or
(04:51):
north. You'll just end up inanother state or in Lake Michigan. The
judge will have to rule on this, and the judge could dismiss it.
You know, the judge could say, basically, yes, but you know,
maybe one hundred miles. Yeah,so she has a lot of discussion.
They could say, hey, Bloomingtonfor all we know. I mean,
it doesn't necessarily have to be eventhough Evansville would be the place that
probably be able to handle something likethis as far as when you get down
(05:15):
there, because there's just a lotof rule indied. Like we think it's
rule here in central Indiana, youget further down south, it becomes much
more rules. So that being said, yeah, we'll see what happens there,
but Evansville would be really one ofthe very few places that would have
just going to say, the lawinfrastructure to be able to do such a
task. We have such a trial. So that broke and like you said,
you guys were in the middle ofrecording that. That was pretty big
(05:39):
news. We knew it was Weknew it was coming. They were going
to do that without a doubt becauseKevin, you're you're an attorney. It's
not going to be favorable regardless ifthey're anywhere near Carroll County. And I
think that's pretty reasonable to say,would you agree, Yeah, that's that's
pretty reasonable. Carroll County is relativelysmall, and this investigation has been going
(05:59):
on for over five years. Sothe chances are that if you live in
Carroll County, maybe you've helped ina search for the girls, Maybe you
have a friend who's helped with thesearch for the girls. Maybe you're related
to an investigator, Maybe you're relatedto one of the attorneys or a family
member. There's just so many peoplethere who have connections to the case that
(06:21):
the defense argued that you really needto just move it somewhere far away where
there's a little bit less interest anda little less personal involvement. What are
they called that attainted jury pool oris that they phrase it? Yeah,
yeah, that's really all that's goingto come out of that for now.
And we'll who knows when we hearback on that. But I wouldn't be
surprised if it wasn't moved away tosome extent. So as soon as this
(06:44):
broke, a lot of us werereading into this and doing like you just
said, you drew a circle,right, you're drawing it all out.
So then something else in this casethat I think that we knew it could
come any minute now, but wedidn't know in the form of what.
And I'll say I think in termsof this being you know, it's certainly
a huge release of the probable causeaft of David, but there could be
(07:05):
more information that comes out before themthrough hearings, through sort of the pre
trial hearings as the different sides orpresenting their information, that that could be
a place where we could glean informationand of course leaks, I would say,
so the probable cause is huge.It kind of finally gives us a
sense of why was Richard Allen arrestedin twenty twenty two after all this time?
(07:30):
And it kind of is a lookback in time because a lot of
the information included therein comes from twentyseventeen when he basically first inserted himself into
this case back, you know,by sharing his story that he was there
on the trails that day. Heshared his story with an officer who made
a note about it, and thennothing much seems to have been done until
(07:56):
roughly late September early October of thisyear. The story he told the officer
essentially was that he was there thatday, He was on the trail,
He saw some people, but hedidn't really pay much attention because he was
like looking into his phone, followa stock picker looking at the fish,
he was doing all sorts of stuffthat day. Yeah, and he acknowledged
(08:20):
that he was wearing clothes that weresimilar to what Bridge guy in the video
was wearing. Before we get tothe smoking gun, and there's no pun
intended on that. There is somewitness statements that I find extremely critical,
and they touched up on the witnessthat saw him possibly with bloody clothes and
all that, but there's a lotof other witnesses that come into that.
(08:41):
So my question before we kind ofwalk through that, because I think that's
really important because it further shows thator for a case for the prosecuting office
that he was located there. Themore witnesses you have, were all these
statements made before they released all thefootage and all that the photos of the
(09:03):
of the individual we know as aBridge guy, well, it's really not
clear. It's really not clear fromthe David itself. So I don't know
if we can That's huge though,Yeah, because if they hadn't seen that
photo, if they hadn't seen whichthat photo rolled out pretty quick. But
if the day of the finding andthey did all this and they were able
to termine that in that time period, I think that would be a lot
(09:24):
more substantial. Of course, thenhey, because you're asking somebody what they
saw after they've already had a visionof what's played out obviously going to change.
So I'm curious. My big thingwas when were these statements given.
You guys are much more You've readthis much more than I have. I
know's it kind of goes into specifics. One thing is all the witness names
are redacted, which we feel isproper. That makes a little bit harder
(09:48):
to follow because you're like, okay, yeah, yeah, is this the
same person as this person? Butbasically he's putting himself there essentially, don't
quote me on this, like onethirty or something, Yeah, yeah,
yeah, U dirty onwards. Andthat's highly significant because the girls disappear off
the bridge at like two, alittle bit after two ten. I believe
(10:09):
he's putting himself getting there at theright time. We find the witness statements
very interesting. The problem with themis that most of them, when you
read them, they don't really indicateI saw Richard Allen, or I saw
his face. It's like, yeah, he's covering his face, he's looking
away, he's making pains. Tonot really have those interactions. He's very
unfriendly when someone says hello to him, and so that's that is what it
(10:33):
is. But the fact is thathe did place himself there. So he's
doing a lot of the work,yeah, for prosecutors in this case,
because he's been you know, youknow, you could argue, well,
are you sure that was him?Right, he didn't really see his face,
but he's saying, no, thatwas I was there. I was
wearing those clothes. And one thingI found interesting was there were a number
(10:54):
of witnesses who say, yes,I saw a person who fits this description
we're off Lee in the time beforethe murders, because he got there before
they did. They got there atlike what one fifty, And he's saying,
hey, I got there at onethirty, if I believe, if
I'm remembering correctly. No one seemsto see him there actually during the murders,
(11:18):
right, And the prosecution says that'sbecause no one saw him on the
trails at that time. Was becausehe was in the woods committing this crime.
And I'll note also, I mean, and then we have the after
sighting where you know, somebody sortof covered in mud and blood and sort
of seen afterwards. But the onething that caught my attention that I thought
was very odd. At one point, one witness is talking about how she's
(11:41):
walking the trails and she looks outshe sees on the bridge, on the
first platform of the bridge this guy, this guy who appears to be bridge
guy. And that's well before thegirls even got to the bridge. That
is one thing that I didn't thinkgot mentioned enough during the media coverage last
twenty four hour. And if,like I said earlier, if that truly
(12:01):
is and happened before they released allthe footage and all that of him,
that's significant. It seems really weird. It's like he's he sculping out this
scene. I mean, I don'tknow, a lot of kind of possibilities
come to mind, but that reallystruck me because it's sort of this haunting
image of this guy on the bridge. The girls haven't even got there yet.
He's like is he waiting? Imean, and is he specifically going
(12:24):
after libbyan Abbey because he passes otherjuvenile girls on the way there. They're
in a slightly larger group than Libbyand Abbey where it's you know, three
verses two. But it just seemsodd. The whole thing is so odd.
Oh yeah, yeah, for sure. And like I said, he's
already admitted that he was there beforethem, per the timeline of the way
they've laid this crime out, sohe's got there twenty minutes before them.
(12:46):
He's saying they got dropped off rightbefore two. He got there at one
thirty. And like you said,there are more than one witness statement.
Larger groups did see him, theysaid hi to him, he wouldn't engage
with him. There's a lot ofdifferent witness statements that are, like said,
a little bit confusing, to behonest with you, But there is
what they could piece together from.Was it distant camera footage of a vehicle
(13:09):
resembling his ford focus? And Iknow that we heard a lot of different
things from the witnesses as far asvehicles on that, But did they have
camera footage of what appeared to behis vehicle? That's what it sounded like
to us, some form of camerafootage. I don't know if we can
determine whether that's a video or certainlike still shots that are taken over time.
They'd mentioned a lot of footage capturedat the Hoosier Harvest store, which
(13:33):
I guess was across from the ChildProtective Services building, so they're seeing vehicles
and they're also using that to confirmYes, these witnesses who said they were
there, we see their cars goingin and out too, so they're confirming
a lot with that, matching upthe timelines of what the people are saying,
and it sounds like they're close.They talked about a weird vehicle being
(13:54):
part strange. It's not uncommon forvehicles to park where we're talking about,
but this particular vehicle they even indicatedwas part strange, So then there's that
part of it. There was actuallyadditional information about the moments and the interaction
itself when the suspect encountered libbyan abbey. We now know which I think we
(14:18):
knew, and you guys obviously knewmore than I did or anybody else.
There was additional sound and footage onthe phone that we were not aware of.
So on an approach, he's walkingup and there was some interaction made
and a comment was made that's correct. One of the two girls mentioned something
(14:39):
about a gun, which indicates thatBridge guy had a weapon at the time.
The question was asked, how canhe control two people well, that's
one way. One of them saysgun, and then there is actually and
we can't visually see this, butfrom the way they worded it, it
sounded like they have a recording ofwhen he's actually saying guys down the hill.
(15:05):
If I remember exactly how this isworded, I can look here.
General they said a man can beseen, see if I can find it
here. I don't think we everheard that, but it seems that other
people were at least talking about it. Is that fair to say, Kevin,
Yes, and they were correct.Obviously you'd say something about a gun.
Yeah. Here this says that asthe male suspect approaches victim one and
(15:28):
victim two, one of the victimsmentions gun. Near the end of the
video, a mail is seen andheard telling the girls guys down the hill.
The girls then begin to proceed downthe hill and the video ends,
right, So that's indicating indicating thatthey have a visual component to the phrase
(15:48):
two. And that's certainly interesting,right because it indicates that there's more images
of him. Yeah. I mean, before we didn't know if this phone
was in a pocket, we'd reallydidn't know. So what it sounds like
here is there that is wording itas if it can be seen and heard
when he's having that interaction telling themwhatever it is, which I think we've
been told before. It wasn't justguys down the hill, right, Those
(16:11):
were two things possibly that were piecedtogether. Did guys necessarily have to come
right before down the hill? ThatI don't remember? No? Yeah,
yeah, I heard that that speculationtoo. Yeah, And honestly, we
don't really know much more about whatright in video, but it's a really
I didn't even catch that that theywere talking about, you know, visual
(16:33):
and audio for that, it's areally good catch. Yeah, And that
was a big thing for me.And I also didn't get it. Also,
didn't really see people talking about whenI watched a lot of stuff we
all did, and I didn't.I didn't see that. So there's going
to be a lot more footage thanwe know of right now, That's what
I'm going to say, because hey, guys didn't come right before down the
hill, so there's more interaction,and it's possible that there's a visual of
(16:53):
it to an extent the quality wedon't know and all that, but that's
much more than we've realized before.Yeah, And I think it's a really
important point too, that you know, a probably cause affidavit isn't the end
all be all of a case.Typically it's just the beginning. So I
doubt that they put all of theirevidence on this. I think that's been
(17:14):
some speculation it was this it,and I think probably not. There's probably
more, but we're definitely curious tosee, you know, what else there
is too. We'll segue to thebig thing that's being talked about the most.
That is the bullet found between thevictims. I don't remember which victim
it was closer to, I apologize, but it was only a few feet
away from her, and it wasan uns shell casing. So what that
(17:38):
means is the shot was not fired, but the bullet did not go fired
through the gun, but it wasin the gun. So I do know
some about guns. I'm not gonnalie. So an example of that would
be if I had a gun andI cocked it back and the bullet came
out. Why would somebody do that? I don't want to speculate, but
there's a lot of reasons why you'dmake sure that it was to be shot.
(18:00):
The gun could be shot, oryou would be indicating to somebody that
the gun is capable of shooting.Are a couple different ways that in my
mind, I could see that.So, knowing a little bit about it,
I can see where that would happen, because a lot of people were
just kind of like, I don'teven know how that would get there,
Like, well, if you're tinkingaround with the gun there, it would
do that if you were trying tomake sure the gun is capable of shooting.
(18:22):
And we don't know anything beyond thatif it did or not. But
that's a couple of explanations from myexperience that I know how the bullet could
be there, how they could knowit came out of that gun. It's
because a maneuver was something like thatinvolving he was manipulating the weapon. I
wanted to explain that because I hadn'theard that explained and very well either.
(18:42):
And there's always going to be anargument with this with the bullets, right,
I mean, that's been a bigthing in cases where they argue how
valid that is as far as themarkings and the imaginings of that. Yeah,
especially in a case like this wherethe bullet wasn't even fired. Even
in the David itself, the personwho made the identification conceives that that identification
(19:06):
is subjective, and subjective is apretty elastic word that I think the defense
attorneys are going to try very hardto work around that and suggest that maybe
this wasn't his gun. And ofcourse, even if it was Alan's gun,
you'd still have to prove that hewas there and ejected the shell during
(19:26):
the time of the murders. Yeah, and in a court case. I
mean, obviously, for a lotof people who are just watching along,
it's very much like, Okay,well, you know, he's placing himself
there. That's highly suspicious. He'swearing these clothes, and I think all
of that's very valid. And certainlyDanny has the kind of gun that was
at the crime scene, regardless ofif it's his gun or not. A
(19:48):
lot of people own guns. Yeah, but this is like, what are
the odds of somebody being there?You start to piece these things together.
There are things that happen, right, I mean, just coincidences. But
this guy's wearing the clothes, thisguy's there during the time period, and
this guy has the kind of gunwith the shellcasing found not even just saying
it's his there is a lot likeyou are saying that build up to this
would indicate that he which was probablymade the valid in the judge's opinion that
(20:12):
they could execute this arrest right.And one important thing to note is also
that the it seems like some ofthis probable cause was done under the previous
judge correct too, who accused himself, Judge Ben Deaner. So I think
I'm just thinking ahead at the hearingof the one of the events attorneys specifically
(20:33):
mentioned, you know, the factthat there were probably going to be suppression
hearings, meaning that they're going tomove to suppress certain evidence in this case.
So we will be very I mean, it's just a situation where everybody
wants justice for Libby an Abbey,and that means like hopefully everybody's crossing their
teas here because if the bullet seemsto be the blockbuster evidence that they have
(20:55):
in this probable cause after David,obviously it's very important for their case.
They're going to want to prosecution isgoing to want to really hang on to
that and hope that that does notget tossed out. I guess I've been
doing the majority that talking, andI apologize but it's also important to note
that we don't know what all wason the original documentation. We just this
is what's been determined that we shouldbe able to see and not jeopardize the
(21:22):
prosecution or or the case in general. Correct, Well, it's interesting.
No, Actually, the thing thatthey were adapted from this, seemingly from
what we can tell, is thewitness names, which everyone you know.
I think that's fair. Those peopledon't need to be harassed and hounded necessarily.
But I think this is it.I mean, this is I don't
think they had any big chunks oranything like that. There was a page
(21:44):
missing from the copy that we got, but I think we heard through the
grapevine that that was just like thejudge's signature, essentially the last page.
Okay I saw that, Yeah,yeah, okay, yeah, We're like,
where did that go? But thisis this is it. I mean,
this is the probabill cause with thatsaid, there is a potential key
document that we've not seen yet.This was the probable cause for the arrest,
(22:06):
and some of the evidence used toget to this point was taken after
a search at Richard Allen's residence,and so that means they had to be
a search warrant for his residence,and we have not seen what the probable
cause was for them to do thesearch which ultimately led to them getting the
(22:27):
gun. And it's unfortunately it's possiblethat at some point a judge might look
at that and say, well,maybe this probable caused affidata for the search
wasn't strong enough, and if that'sthe case, then the bullet evidence could
potentially be thrown out. Yeah,we have some concerns, but we hope
that they have a lot more thanthat. I think, you know,
(22:48):
that's one thing that it is importantto remember. Probable cause is not the
end I'll be all of any case. It's it's just kind of like,
here's how we got here, andif you get other information, and I'm
sure, I'm sure they're working veryhard. Of course, at the press
conference when they announced the arrest,they made it very clear the investigation is
ongoing. They're still getting new evidence, new pieces of information, and obviously
(23:11):
that would not be reflected in thisdocument. One thing that your listeners may
be curious about is it's often beenalluded in that press conference and in the
hearing that was around this that thatbasically prosecutor McCleland was saying, we don't
want to release this as other peopleinvolved that we believe, you know,
we might need to be going after. That is not in this probable cause
(23:32):
affidavit at all. I mean theway they basically they set up this scenario
where Richard Allen basically you know,could conceivably have done this completely by himself.
In this probable cause affidavit, there'sno mention of motive or you know,
whether this was like targeted against LibyanAbbey or whether this was a random
(23:52):
So they don't really get into alot. They also don't get into how
did this crime occur, how didthe girls die? What exactly? You
know, what can we say aboutthat? It really just kind of has
him getting there, being seen bya bunch of people, his car being
possibly seen, and kidnapping the girlsoff the bridge. And so I think
that's interesting that prosecutors are saying thatlaw enforcement is saying that we're looking at
(24:18):
more people, more people may beinvolved. Everybody brings up, you know,
the tentacles that Doug Carter referenced,and I think it seems like that's
very much a valid thing that they'redoing. But it is not something that
they're putting in their probable cause atthis point, which is you know,
which is interesting and I'm just I'mnot trying to make up any theories here,
but let me just throw this outto you, guys, heart we
close this down, what else wasnot in there was any prior information that
(24:42):
would have been able to validate tomake this arrest. So let me give
you an example. People confess tobeing at crime scenes all the time.
People lie and confess at things theydidn't even do. Wherever he was employed
at, then if he was theyprobably did some more work than just saying
going off of hey, you werethere, they probably validated that with his
employee making sure he didn't work thatday. That's the case, and we
(25:03):
don't see any of that information inthere either. Typically that would be something
that would be done to cover thetracks, right, and so therefore we
don't know that what lead up tolet up to them making the connection with
Richard Allen itself. That's a reallyreally good point. Looking at work records,
you think that would be possibly inthere, and it seems like he's
been a long term CBS employee,so I would imagine that would be relatively
(25:27):
easy to check. You know,that's a big company. I'm sure they
have, you know, pretty meticulousrecords. One thing, I'll know it.
And this is a bit of asneak preview for what we're working on
right now, hopefully hoping to getit done pretty soon. But basically,
we're trying to kind of figure outwhat the delay was here, Why did
he come up in twenty seventeen andnot again until now? And you know,
(25:48):
I'm gonna I'm not gonna say becausewe don't necessarily have it ready yet,
but we're trying to kind of whatis that bridge? And I can
say that so far, we havereported that there was not a tip that
busted Rick Allen in twenty twenty two. It was not somebody close to him
turning him in. It seems tobe what we've reported and what other local
(26:08):
media have reported is that somebody waslike going through things and kind of you
know, going through old tips andsaw this, Yeah, this dude was
here. And what we're trying tofigure out is why did it take till
twenty twenty two for that to happen? And that's hopefully what we can answer
relatively soon. But we're trying.We're trying. It's it's like you know
(26:30):
you because I think it's it's asituation where we believe that the investigators who
were working on this are dedicated andprofessional and certainly trying their best. But
I think there should be an elementof public accountability when you have, you
know, a guy saying, hey, guys, I was there, and
then we don't hear about him untiltwenty twenty two five years later. Absolutely,
(26:51):
and I think all that prior stuffI just talked about that we don't
know about that will come forward toon what led to that. For sure,
my opinion, this is going tobe a timely thing. And that's
fine because there's a lot of workto be done for both sides of this
case, and then for individuals likeyourself, you will have some more time
here to look into these things thatyou're investigating. Absolutely, and everyone wants
(27:14):
justice in this case. I justhope that justice is at hand for libby
an Abbey, because goodness knows theydeserve that. And I mean, it's
just this whole thing is just ahuge tragedy, and yeah, it just
it kind of it's heartbreaking to readthis because it gives you more kind of
disturbing details on what their final momentsmight have been like. And it's it's
just a horrible This is a wretchedstory ultimately of these two young girls who
(27:37):
should have been able to go fora walk on a bridge and come back.
Yeah. Absolutely very unfortunate. Andlike I said to start, it's
this is not an ideal circumstance toform a friendship friendship with somebody, but
that's what we've we've done and I'mthankful for that. And I'll say it
again that I appreciate the work thatthe both of you put into this investigation,
this case, this storytelling that you'vebeen able to do and connect some
(27:57):
pieces to the pub so that havebeen missing for us and more or less
just bringing it this to the publiceye. No point in this case had
anybody forgot about it, you knowwhat I mean? And I think you
guys played a part of that anda lot of other people did, and
I certainly appreciate that. Do youguys have anything else to throw in here,
Well, we just want to saywe really appreciate you, Jeff and
(28:18):
what you've done to kind of raiseawareness and kind of inform your audience and
keep you know, Okay, whatare the updates? Like, let's go
like kind of keep looking back onit and asking important questions. Yeah,
I think you ask great questions today. I think we will hopefully have something
soon kind of trying to explain whatthe gap was. So well, she'll
keep you posted on we'll be talkingwith you again, something about more updates
(28:40):
and this crazy case. Yeah,it's something where like it really is NonStop,
and I just you know, we'redefinitely proceeding with caution because the trials
pending, but we're also going tocontinue where we can try to inform the
public and you know, here's here'swhat's happening essentially, I'll say it again
on a closing segment here, aclosing thought here. If you want to
hear this in detail, you cancheck out your latest episode. It is
(29:03):
you guys actually read all of it, and also it's available online. I'm
going to have all that in theshow notes for anybody interested. But I
did want to plug you guys MurderSheet podcast. You do a great job
throughout this case providing information in detailwithout bias. I highly encourage people that
want to learn more about it tocheck out the work that you've done,
and obviously they could go to MurderSheet podcast dot com and all that stuff
(29:29):
is on there. Thanks again,and I'm sure we'll be talking soon.
Yeah, definitely. Well, thankyou so much, Jack. Thank you
for listening to this episode of IndianaStories. If you like what you heard,
you can go to Indiana Stories dotcom for more episodes and other stories
related to Indiana. Also, ifyou're enjoying this podcast, there's several things
you can follow, the podcast itself, the newsletter, and various other things.
(29:52):
Thanks again for listening, and wewill be back with another episode and
I hope you join us for anotherIndiana Story. H evening, Henny go
back to going Back, and thequestion is do I stay here? Will
(30:27):
you be back? Are you gonnacome back? Will you be back?
Are you coming back
This podcast is or Jeff Townsend MediaProduction. This is Jeff Townsend. Thank
you for joining us for another episodeof Indiana Stories. Jeff Townsend here,
(00:22):
Welcome back to yet another episode ofIndie Anna's Stories. The listeners, you
guys reached out to me and I'mresponding you wanted updates in the Delphi case
whenever they became available, And ofcourse there's new information release with the probable
cause AFFI David came out and there'smore details about the arrest of Richard Allen
and how they got in a positionwhere they could arrest him. In this
(00:43):
conversation I'm going to share with youtoday, I link back up with the
Murder Sheet podcast and we talk aboutthe latest information that's been released. If
you want to hear any more greatIndiana Stories, you can go to Indiana
Stories dot com. Please give ita follow on your favorite podcast listening platform
if you want to rate at fivestars, why you're there, that'd be
cool. Before we jump into thisconversation, I do need to think the
three great companies that I always do. They are great for me and all
(01:07):
the content I create. Podon dotIo the best transcription service there is,
the most accurate. You know,it's actually funny because I have a buddy
named Danny Brown who has a verystrong Scottish accent, and he's always complaining
that he could never find a transcriptionservice that could transcribe, and well,
podon dot io actually it's very accurate, so he's very impressed. So you
need to get some audio into words. There's a great option for you podcast
(01:29):
page dot io. It's what Icontrol all my websites on. If you
go to Jefftownsend dot media, you'llsee all the work that I do there
and that team is amazing. Somake sure you use podcast page dot io
if you want to create a website. Then of course what we're recording everything
on here Boomcaster. This conversation aboutto have with the murder Sheet, the
conversation I have with everybody is recordedon Boomcaster. It is like the Zoom
(01:51):
for podcasters because the audio quality isthere, it's amazing. To make sure
you go to boomcaster dot com andcheck it out. I'm not going to
waste any more of your time.We're gonna jump in and get an update
on the Delphi case. Here mygood friends, Anya Kane, Investigative journalists
and Kevin Greenley he's a lawyer,he's an attorney. They're the Murder Sheet
podcast. They are joining me again, and I appreciate you both being willing
(02:15):
to form a relationship with me andwhen I ask, you are always willing
to come on here. I knowyou have a lot of national requests and
stuff like that, but the factthat you take the time to do this
for a local guys pretty cool.Well, we always really appreciate talking to
you, Jeff. You ask greatquestions, so I feel like it's always
a really good conversation. And sowe're local guys. Are us. Local
(02:35):
guys have to stick together. Itold the listeners i'd give them update whenever
something significant came up, and that'swhat we've come across. So a lot
has happened in the Delphi case here, and I'll just go ahead and reference
your guys's latest episode as a greatthing to listen to, because, in
my opinion, when I'm listening toa lot of news channels, the last
couple I mean the last couple ofdays, they are giving just little bits
(03:00):
and pieces that or there's just otherindividuals giving opinions, which I'm okay with.
Opinions, But I want to knowthe actual information, the exact information
before somebody's forming an opinion and sharingit with me. You guys actually read
it. You have a great jobwith that. So somebody wants an actual
exact breakdown of what we're going tobe talking about, I would encourage them
(03:22):
to listen to your latest episode.I really appreciate that. Yeah, we
just tried to kind of read itout loud and kind of give our thoughts
and also make it clear where wereally don't have more information to judge things
based on, hoping to get moreexpert opinions as we go forward. And
when we were reading it, wewere actually reading it for the first time
ourselves, I can tell. Yeah, actually recording another episode. I like
(03:46):
how it ended. You're like,well, okay, then thanks for listening.
You got the episode out there andit was good. It was good.
But okay, before we get intothat, the day actually started off
with something different. There was anannouncement that the defense had filed to try
to get the case moved. Wasit within one hundred and fifty mile radius
of Delphi? Yeah, outside ofthe one hundred and fifty mile radius,
(04:08):
basically one hundred and fifty miles away. We're actually we were in the middle
of recording an episode on that whenwe got the news that the PC dropped.
I mean, it's possible the judgecan say, hey, that's not
necessary. It only needs to beone hundred miles. It could be determined
to be whatever. But if it'struly one hundred and fifty miles, that's
actually it rules out all of northernIndiana, I believe, and it would
just really put Evansville, the thirdbiggest city in Indiana would be an option,
(04:30):
and there's Jeffersonville. I think thatwould probably fall in that area as
far as Indiana goes. If theygot what they wanted, that would be
it correct. Yeah, you're absolutelyright, it would. It would I
did. I drew my little circle, you know. I went on one
of those mapped websites where you candraw circle, and I basically get Evansville
and the southernmost tip of Indiana.You can't go east, west, or
(04:51):
north. You'll just end up inanother state or in Lake Michigan. The
judge will have to rule on this, and the judge could dismiss it.
You know, the judge could say, basically, yes, but you know,
maybe one hundred miles. Yeah,so she has a lot of discussion.
They could say, hey, Bloomingtonfor all we know. I mean,
it doesn't necessarily have to be eventhough Evansville would be the place that
probably be able to handle something likethis as far as when you get down
(05:15):
there, because there's just a lotof rule indied. Like we think it's
rule here in central Indiana, youget further down south, it becomes much
more rules. So that being said, yeah, we'll see what happens there,
but Evansville would be really one ofthe very few places that would have
just going to say, the lawinfrastructure to be able to do such a
task. We have such a trial. So that broke and like you said,
you guys were in the middle ofrecording that. That was pretty big
(05:39):
news. We knew it was Weknew it was coming. They were going
to do that without a doubt becauseKevin, you're you're an attorney. It's
not going to be favorable regardless ifthey're anywhere near Carroll County. And I
think that's pretty reasonable to say,would you agree, Yeah, that's that's
pretty reasonable. Carroll County is relativelysmall, and this investigation has been going
(05:59):
on for over five years. Sothe chances are that if you live in
Carroll County, maybe you've helped ina search for the girls, Maybe you
have a friend who's helped with thesearch for the girls. Maybe you're related
to an investigator, Maybe you're relatedto one of the attorneys or a family
member. There's just so many peoplethere who have connections to the case that
(06:21):
the defense argued that you really needto just move it somewhere far away where
there's a little bit less interest anda little less personal involvement. What are
they called that attainted jury pool oris that they phrase it? Yeah,
yeah, that's really all that's goingto come out of that for now.
And we'll who knows when we hearback on that. But I wouldn't be
surprised if it wasn't moved away tosome extent. So as soon as this
(06:44):
broke, a lot of us werereading into this and doing like you just
said, you drew a circle,right, you're drawing it all out.
So then something else in this casethat I think that we knew it could
come any minute now, but wedidn't know in the form of what.
And I'll say I think in termsof this being you know, it's certainly
a huge release of the probable causeaft of David, but there could be
(07:05):
more information that comes out before themthrough hearings, through sort of the pre
trial hearings as the different sides orpresenting their information, that that could be
a place where we could glean informationand of course leaks, I would say,
so the probable cause is huge.It kind of finally gives us a
sense of why was Richard Allen arrestedin twenty twenty two after all this time?
(07:30):
And it kind of is a lookback in time because a lot of
the information included therein comes from twentyseventeen when he basically first inserted himself into
this case back, you know,by sharing his story that he was there
on the trails that day. Heshared his story with an officer who made
a note about it, and thennothing much seems to have been done until
(07:56):
roughly late September early October of thisyear. The story he told the officer
essentially was that he was there thatday, He was on the trail,
He saw some people, but hedidn't really pay much attention because he was
like looking into his phone, followa stock picker looking at the fish,
he was doing all sorts of stuffthat day. Yeah, and he acknowledged
(08:20):
that he was wearing clothes that weresimilar to what Bridge guy in the video
was wearing. Before we get tothe smoking gun, and there's no pun
intended on that. There is somewitness statements that I find extremely critical,
and they touched up on the witnessthat saw him possibly with bloody clothes and
all that, but there's a lotof other witnesses that come into that.
(08:41):
So my question before we kind ofwalk through that, because I think that's
really important because it further shows thator for a case for the prosecuting office
that he was located there. Themore witnesses you have, were all these
statements made before they released all thefootage and all that the photos of the
(09:03):
of the individual we know as aBridge guy, well, it's really not
clear. It's really not clear fromthe David itself. So I don't know
if we can That's huge though,Yeah, because if they hadn't seen that
photo, if they hadn't seen whichthat photo rolled out pretty quick. But
if the day of the finding andthey did all this and they were able
to termine that in that time period, I think that would be a lot
(09:24):
more substantial. Of course, thenhey, because you're asking somebody what they
saw after they've already had a visionof what's played out obviously going to change.
So I'm curious. My big thingwas when were these statements given.
You guys are much more You've readthis much more than I have. I
know's it kind of goes into specifics. One thing is all the witness names
are redacted, which we feel isproper. That makes a little bit harder
(09:48):
to follow because you're like, okay, yeah, yeah, is this the
same person as this person? Butbasically he's putting himself there essentially, don't
quote me on this, like onethirty or something, Yeah, yeah,
yeah, U dirty onwards. Andthat's highly significant because the girls disappear off
the bridge at like two, alittle bit after two ten. I believe
(10:09):
he's putting himself getting there at theright time. We find the witness statements
very interesting. The problem with themis that most of them, when you
read them, they don't really indicateI saw Richard Allen, or I saw
his face. It's like, yeah, he's covering his face, he's looking
away, he's making pains. Tonot really have those interactions. He's very
unfriendly when someone says hello to him, and so that's that is what it
(10:33):
is. But the fact is thathe did place himself there. So he's
doing a lot of the work,yeah, for prosecutors in this case,
because he's been you know, youknow, you could argue, well,
are you sure that was him?Right, he didn't really see his face,
but he's saying, no, thatwas I was there. I was
wearing those clothes. And one thingI found interesting was there were a number
(10:54):
of witnesses who say, yes,I saw a person who fits this description
we're off Lee in the time beforethe murders, because he got there before
they did. They got there atlike what one fifty, And he's saying,
hey, I got there at onethirty, if I believe, if
I'm remembering correctly. No one seemsto see him there actually during the murders,
(11:18):
right, And the prosecution says that'sbecause no one saw him on the
trails at that time. Was becausehe was in the woods committing this crime.
And I'll note also, I mean, and then we have the after
sighting where you know, somebody sortof covered in mud and blood and sort
of seen afterwards. But the onething that caught my attention that I thought
was very odd. At one point, one witness is talking about how she's
(11:41):
walking the trails and she looks outshe sees on the bridge, on the
first platform of the bridge this guy, this guy who appears to be bridge
guy. And that's well before thegirls even got to the bridge. That
is one thing that I didn't thinkgot mentioned enough during the media coverage last
twenty four hour. And if,like I said earlier, if that truly
(12:01):
is and happened before they released allthe footage and all that of him,
that's significant. It seems really weird. It's like he's he sculping out this
scene. I mean, I don'tknow, a lot of kind of possibilities
come to mind, but that reallystruck me because it's sort of this haunting
image of this guy on the bridge. The girls haven't even got there yet.
He's like is he waiting? Imean, and is he specifically going
(12:24):
after libbyan Abbey because he passes otherjuvenile girls on the way there. They're
in a slightly larger group than Libbyand Abbey where it's you know, three
verses two. But it just seemsodd. The whole thing is so odd.
Oh yeah, yeah, for sure. And like I said, he's
already admitted that he was there beforethem, per the timeline of the way
they've laid this crime out, sohe's got there twenty minutes before them.
(12:46):
He's saying they got dropped off rightbefore two. He got there at one
thirty. And like you said,there are more than one witness statement.
Larger groups did see him, theysaid hi to him, he wouldn't engage
with him. There's a lot ofdifferent witness statements that are, like said,
a little bit confusing, to behonest with you, But there is
what they could piece together from.Was it distant camera footage of a vehicle
(13:09):
resembling his ford focus? And Iknow that we heard a lot of different
things from the witnesses as far asvehicles on that, But did they have
camera footage of what appeared to behis vehicle? That's what it sounded like
to us, some form of camerafootage. I don't know if we can
determine whether that's a video or certainlike still shots that are taken over time.
They'd mentioned a lot of footage capturedat the Hoosier Harvest store, which
(13:33):
I guess was across from the ChildProtective Services building, so they're seeing vehicles
and they're also using that to confirmYes, these witnesses who said they were
there, we see their cars goingin and out too, so they're confirming
a lot with that, matching upthe timelines of what the people are saying,
and it sounds like they're close.They talked about a weird vehicle being
(13:54):
part strange. It's not uncommon forvehicles to park where we're talking about,
but this particular vehicle they even indicatedwas part strange, So then there's that
part of it. There was actuallyadditional information about the moments and the interaction
itself when the suspect encountered libbyan abbey. We now know which I think we
(14:18):
knew, and you guys obviously knewmore than I did or anybody else.
There was additional sound and footage onthe phone that we were not aware of.
So on an approach, he's walkingup and there was some interaction made
and a comment was made that's correct. One of the two girls mentioned something
(14:39):
about a gun, which indicates thatBridge guy had a weapon at the time.
The question was asked, how canhe control two people well, that's
one way. One of them saysgun, and then there is actually and
we can't visually see this, butfrom the way they worded it, it
sounded like they have a recording ofwhen he's actually saying guys down the hill.
(15:05):
If I remember exactly how this isworded, I can look here.
General they said a man can beseen, see if I can find it
here. I don't think we everheard that, but it seems that other
people were at least talking about it. Is that fair to say, Kevin,
Yes, and they were correct.Obviously you'd say something about a gun.
Yeah. Here this says that asthe male suspect approaches victim one and
(15:28):
victim two, one of the victimsmentions gun. Near the end of the
video, a mail is seen andheard telling the girls guys down the hill.
The girls then begin to proceed downthe hill and the video ends,
right, So that's indicating indicating thatthey have a visual component to the phrase
(15:48):
two. And that's certainly interesting,right because it indicates that there's more images
of him. Yeah. I mean, before we didn't know if this phone
was in a pocket, we'd reallydidn't know. So what it sounds like
here is there that is wording itas if it can be seen and heard
when he's having that interaction telling themwhatever it is, which I think we've
been told before. It wasn't justguys down the hill, right, Those
(16:11):
were two things possibly that were piecedtogether. Did guys necessarily have to come
right before down the hill? ThatI don't remember? No? Yeah,
yeah, I heard that that speculationtoo. Yeah, And honestly, we
don't really know much more about whatright in video, but it's a really
I didn't even catch that that theywere talking about, you know, visual
(16:33):
and audio for that, it's areally good catch. Yeah, And that
was a big thing for me.And I also didn't get it. Also,
didn't really see people talking about whenI watched a lot of stuff we
all did, and I didn't.I didn't see that. So there's going
to be a lot more footage thanwe know of right now, That's what
I'm going to say, because hey, guys didn't come right before down the
hill, so there's more interaction,and it's possible that there's a visual of
(16:53):
it to an extent the quality wedon't know and all that, but that's
much more than we've realized before.Yeah, And I think it's a really
important point too, that you know, a probably cause affidavit isn't the end
all be all of a case.Typically it's just the beginning. So I
doubt that they put all of theirevidence on this. I think that's been
(17:14):
some speculation it was this it,and I think probably not. There's probably
more, but we're definitely curious tosee, you know, what else there
is too. We'll segue to thebig thing that's being talked about the most.
That is the bullet found between thevictims. I don't remember which victim
it was closer to, I apologize, but it was only a few feet
away from her, and it wasan uns shell casing. So what that
(17:38):
means is the shot was not fired, but the bullet did not go fired
through the gun, but it wasin the gun. So I do know
some about guns. I'm not gonnalie. So an example of that would
be if I had a gun andI cocked it back and the bullet came
out. Why would somebody do that? I don't want to speculate, but
there's a lot of reasons why you'dmake sure that it was to be shot.
(18:00):
The gun could be shot, oryou would be indicating to somebody that
the gun is capable of shooting.Are a couple different ways that in my
mind, I could see that.So, knowing a little bit about it,
I can see where that would happen, because a lot of people were
just kind of like, I don'teven know how that would get there,
Like, well, if you're tinkingaround with the gun there, it would
do that if you were trying tomake sure the gun is capable of shooting.
(18:22):
And we don't know anything beyond thatif it did or not. But
that's a couple of explanations from myexperience that I know how the bullet could
be there, how they could knowit came out of that gun. It's
because a maneuver was something like thatinvolving he was manipulating the weapon. I
wanted to explain that because I hadn'theard that explained and very well either.
(18:42):
And there's always going to be anargument with this with the bullets, right,
I mean, that's been a bigthing in cases where they argue how
valid that is as far as themarkings and the imaginings of that. Yeah,
especially in a case like this wherethe bullet wasn't even fired. Even
in the David itself, the personwho made the identification conceives that that identification
(19:06):
is subjective, and subjective is apretty elastic word that I think the defense
attorneys are going to try very hardto work around that and suggest that maybe
this wasn't his gun. And ofcourse, even if it was Alan's gun,
you'd still have to prove that hewas there and ejected the shell during
(19:26):
the time of the murders. Yeah, and in a court case. I
mean, obviously, for a lotof people who are just watching along,
it's very much like, Okay,well, you know, he's placing himself
there. That's highly suspicious. He'swearing these clothes, and I think all
of that's very valid. And certainlyDanny has the kind of gun that was
at the crime scene, regardless ofif it's his gun or not. A
(19:48):
lot of people own guns. Yeah, but this is like, what are
the odds of somebody being there?You start to piece these things together.
There are things that happen, right, I mean, just coincidences. But
this guy's wearing the clothes, thisguy's there during the time period, and
this guy has the kind of gunwith the shellcasing found not even just saying
it's his there is a lot likeyou are saying that build up to this
would indicate that he which was probablymade the valid in the judge's opinion that
(20:12):
they could execute this arrest right.And one important thing to note is also
that the it seems like some ofthis probable cause was done under the previous
judge correct too, who accused himself, Judge Ben Deaner. So I think
I'm just thinking ahead at the hearingof the one of the events attorneys specifically
(20:33):
mentioned, you know, the factthat there were probably going to be suppression
hearings, meaning that they're going tomove to suppress certain evidence in this case.
So we will be very I mean, it's just a situation where everybody
wants justice for Libby an Abbey,and that means like hopefully everybody's crossing their
teas here because if the bullet seemsto be the blockbuster evidence that they have
(20:55):
in this probable cause after David,obviously it's very important for their case.
They're going to want to prosecution isgoing to want to really hang on to
that and hope that that does notget tossed out. I guess I've been
doing the majority that talking, andI apologize but it's also important to note
that we don't know what all wason the original documentation. We just this
is what's been determined that we shouldbe able to see and not jeopardize the
(21:22):
prosecution or or the case in general. Correct, Well, it's interesting.
No, Actually, the thing thatthey were adapted from this, seemingly from
what we can tell, is thewitness names, which everyone you know.
I think that's fair. Those peopledon't need to be harassed and hounded necessarily.
But I think this is it.I mean, this is I don't
think they had any big chunks oranything like that. There was a page
(21:44):
missing from the copy that we got, but I think we heard through the
grapevine that that was just like thejudge's signature, essentially the last page.
Okay I saw that, Yeah,yeah, okay, yeah, We're like,
where did that go? But thisis this is it. I mean,
this is the probabill cause with thatsaid, there is a potential key
document that we've not seen yet.This was the probable cause for the arrest,
(22:06):
and some of the evidence used toget to this point was taken after
a search at Richard Allen's residence,and so that means they had to be
a search warrant for his residence,and we have not seen what the probable
cause was for them to do thesearch which ultimately led to them getting the
(22:27):
gun. And it's unfortunately it's possiblethat at some point a judge might look
at that and say, well,maybe this probable caused affidata for the search
wasn't strong enough, and if that'sthe case, then the bullet evidence could
potentially be thrown out. Yeah,we have some concerns, but we hope
that they have a lot more thanthat. I think, you know,
(22:48):
that's one thing that it is importantto remember. Probable cause is not the
end I'll be all of any case. It's it's just kind of like,
here's how we got here, andif you get other information, and I'm
sure, I'm sure they're working veryhard. Of course, at the press
conference when they announced the arrest,they made it very clear the investigation is
ongoing. They're still getting new evidence, new pieces of information, and obviously
(23:11):
that would not be reflected in thisdocument. One thing that your listeners may
be curious about is it's often beenalluded in that press conference and in the
hearing that was around this that thatbasically prosecutor McCleland was saying, we don't
want to release this as other peopleinvolved that we believe, you know,
we might need to be going after. That is not in this probable cause
(23:32):
affidavit at all. I mean theway they basically they set up this scenario
where Richard Allen basically you know,could conceivably have done this completely by himself.
In this probable cause affidavit, there'sno mention of motive or you know,
whether this was like targeted against LibyanAbbey or whether this was a random
(23:52):
So they don't really get into alot. They also don't get into how
did this crime occur, how didthe girls die? What exactly? You
know, what can we say aboutthat? It really just kind of has
him getting there, being seen bya bunch of people, his car being
possibly seen, and kidnapping the girlsoff the bridge. And so I think
that's interesting that prosecutors are saying thatlaw enforcement is saying that we're looking at
(24:18):
more people, more people may beinvolved. Everybody brings up, you know,
the tentacles that Doug Carter referenced,and I think it seems like that's
very much a valid thing that they'redoing. But it is not something that
they're putting in their probable cause atthis point, which is you know,
which is interesting and I'm just I'mnot trying to make up any theories here,
but let me just throw this outto you, guys, heart we
close this down, what else wasnot in there was any prior information that
(24:42):
would have been able to validate tomake this arrest. So let me give
you an example. People confess tobeing at crime scenes all the time.
People lie and confess at things theydidn't even do. Wherever he was employed
at, then if he was theyprobably did some more work than just saying
going off of hey, you werethere, they probably validated that with his
employee making sure he didn't work thatday. That's the case, and we
(25:03):
don't see any of that information inthere either. Typically that would be something
that would be done to cover thetracks, right, and so therefore we
don't know that what lead up tolet up to them making the connection with
Richard Allen itself. That's a reallyreally good point. Looking at work records,
you think that would be possibly inthere, and it seems like he's
been a long term CBS employee,so I would imagine that would be relatively
(25:27):
easy to check. You know,that's a big company. I'm sure they
have, you know, pretty meticulousrecords. One thing, I'll know it.
And this is a bit of asneak preview for what we're working on
right now, hopefully hoping to getit done pretty soon. But basically,
we're trying to kind of figure outwhat the delay was here, Why did
he come up in twenty seventeen andnot again until now? And you know,
(25:48):
I'm gonna I'm not gonna say becausewe don't necessarily have it ready yet,
but we're trying to kind of whatis that bridge? And I can
say that so far, we havereported that there was not a tip that
busted Rick Allen in twenty twenty two. It was not somebody close to him
turning him in. It seems tobe what we've reported and what other local
(26:08):
media have reported is that somebody waslike going through things and kind of you
know, going through old tips andsaw this, Yeah, this dude was
here. And what we're trying tofigure out is why did it take till
twenty twenty two for that to happen? And that's hopefully what we can answer
relatively soon. But we're trying.We're trying. It's it's like you know
(26:30):
you because I think it's it's asituation where we believe that the investigators who
were working on this are dedicated andprofessional and certainly trying their best. But
I think there should be an elementof public accountability when you have, you
know, a guy saying, hey, guys, I was there, and
then we don't hear about him untiltwenty twenty two five years later. Absolutely,
(26:51):
and I think all that prior stuffI just talked about that we don't
know about that will come forward toon what led to that. For sure,
my opinion, this is going tobe a timely thing. And that's
fine because there's a lot of workto be done for both sides of this
case, and then for individuals likeyourself, you will have some more time
here to look into these things thatyou're investigating. Absolutely, and everyone wants
(27:14):
justice in this case. I justhope that justice is at hand for libby
an Abbey, because goodness knows theydeserve that. And I mean, it's
just this whole thing is just ahuge tragedy, and yeah, it just
it kind of it's heartbreaking to readthis because it gives you more kind of
disturbing details on what their final momentsmight have been like. And it's it's
just a horrible This is a wretchedstory ultimately of these two young girls who
(27:37):
should have been able to go fora walk on a bridge and come back.
Yeah. Absolutely very unfortunate. Andlike I said to start, it's
this is not an ideal circumstance toform a friendship friendship with somebody, but
that's what we've we've done and I'mthankful for that. And I'll say it
again that I appreciate the work thatthe both of you put into this investigation,
this case, this storytelling that you'vebeen able to do and connect some
(27:57):
pieces to the pub so that havebeen missing for us and more or less
just bringing it this to the publiceye. No point in this case had
anybody forgot about it, you knowwhat I mean? And I think you
guys played a part of that anda lot of other people did, and
I certainly appreciate that. Do youguys have anything else to throw in here,
Well, we just want to saywe really appreciate you, Jeff and
(28:18):
what you've done to kind of raiseawareness and kind of inform your audience and
keep you know, Okay, whatare the updates? Like, let's go
like kind of keep looking back onit and asking important questions. Yeah,
I think you ask great questions today. I think we will hopefully have something
soon kind of trying to explain whatthe gap was. So well, she'll
keep you posted on we'll be talkingwith you again, something about more updates
(28:40):
and this crazy case. Yeah,it's something where like it really is NonStop,
and I just you know, we'redefinitely proceeding with caution because the trials
pending, but we're also going tocontinue where we can try to inform the
public and you know, here's here'swhat's happening essentially, I'll say it again
on a closing segment here, aclosing thought here. If you want to
hear this in detail, you cancheck out your latest episode. It is
(29:03):
you guys actually read all of it, and also it's available online. I'm
going to have all that in theshow notes for anybody interested. But I
did want to plug you guys MurderSheet podcast. You do a great job
throughout this case providing information in detailwithout bias. I highly encourage people that
want to learn more about it tocheck out the work that you've done,
and obviously they could go to MurderSheet podcast dot com and all that stuff
(29:29):
is on there. Thanks again,and I'm sure we'll be talking soon.
Yeah, definitely. Well, thankyou so much, Jack. Thank you
for listening to this episode of IndianaStories. If you like what you heard,
you can go to Indiana Stories dotcom for more episodes and other stories
related to Indiana. Also, ifyou're enjoying this podcast, there's several things
you can follow, the podcast itself, the newsletter, and various other things.
(29:52):
Thanks again for listening, and wewill be back with another episode and
I hope you join us for anotherIndiana Story. H evening, Henny go
back to going Back, and thequestion is do I stay here? Will
(30:27):
you be back? Are you gonnacome back? Will you be back?
Are you coming back
Popular Podcasts
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show
The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show. Clay Travis and Buck Sexton tackle the biggest stories in news, politics and current events with intelligence and humor. From the border crisis, to the madness of cancel culture and far-left missteps, Clay and Buck guide listeners through the latest headlines and hot topics with fun and entertaining conversations and opinions.