February 22, 2021 • 49 mins
Our God is a songwriter who inspires us to praise Him with music. Christian recording artist Jon Guerra aims to use his musical talents to inspire others to spiritual meditation. He stops by to discuss his motivations and inspirations, the story behind this podcast's theme song, and his and his wife's contributions to the films of director Terrence Malick. Also in this episode: We find out whether Chicago or Austin has better food.
Links for this episode:
Jon's official website
Twitter
Facebook
Instagram
Keeper of Days audio album
Keeper of Days visual album
A Hidden Life trailer
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jon Guerra (00:07):
[MUSIC PLAYS] I have a heart full of questions
quieting all my suggestions.
What is the meaning ofChristian in this American
life? I'm feeling awfullyfoolish spending my life on a
message. I look around and Iwonder ever if I heard it
right. [MUSIC ENDS]
Amy Mantravadi (00:28):
Welcome to the (A)Millennial podcast, where we
have theological conversationsfor today's world. I'm your
host, Amy Mantravadi, coming toyou live from Dayton, Ohio,
former home of The MidgetTheater. Yes, I know it's
impolite to use that word forthose with forms of dwarfism,
but that was the actual name ofan early movie theater in
Dayton, a true nickelodeonwhere you paid a few cents to
(00:49):
watch a film. It received itsname because the manager was a
little person by the name ofSherman Potterf. With his
average sized brother,Benjamin, Sherman leased a
building downtown and held agrand opening in 1913 for a
"home of quality photo plays."The slogan that was used in
advertisements was, "Nothingsmall about The Midget - only
(01:09):
the manager." Of course, in ourpresent era, it's hard to
imagine a little person namingtheir theater with a derogatory
slur, but in that time it wasevidently not considered
derogatory enough to botherSherman. The brothers sold
their theater business in 1917,and today the building stands
in a state of disrepair, butready for a new buyer who can
fix it up and make it a homefor a restaurant, store, or
(01:30):
artist's studio. I think it'skind of awesome that a hundred
years ago, someone who lookeddifferent was able to be the
manager of a business and alsoserve as a touring performer
for another company. If theworld looks down and you,
friends, don't let it get youdown. You can accomplish great
things. It is perhapsappropriate that I opened with
an anecdote loosely related tothe arts, because my guest
today is a talented performer: Jon Guerra. He has released (01:51):
undefined
albums individually and inconnection with his wife,
Valerie, and his work isintended to draw people into
meditation upon spiritualtruths. John's first solo
album, Little Songs, displayedhis desire to offer up little
songs to the Lord as prayers.
One of the songs off his mostrecent album, "Citizens," is
(02:13):
the theme song for thispodcast. But my connection to
this couple goes back a verylong way. Valerie and I were
friends growing up. We attendedthe same church and school. Our
families went on trips togetherand were a regular presence in
each other's lives. It's beenreally special to watch God
bring Valerie and John togetherand allow them to make
beautiful music. As you know ifyou're a regular listener, I
(02:35):
like to open each show byreading a scripture passage
that is relevant to the day'sdiscussion. Today, I'll be
reading Psalm 33 verses onethrough five. "Sing for joy in
the Lord, you righteous ones.
Praise is becoming to theupright. Give thanks to the
Lord with the lyre. Singpraises to him with a harp of
ten strings. Sing to him a newsong. Play skillfully with a
(02:57):
shout of joy, for the word ofthe Lord is right, and all his
work is done in faithfulness.
He loves righteousness andjustice. The earth is full of
the goodness of the Lord." It'sso wonderful to think that the
Lord created music and hasordained that we should use it
to praise him. Now let's headon to the interview and find
out how Jon is using hismusical talents for the glory
of God. I apologize in advancefor the poor audio on my end of
(03:21):
the conversation.
Jon Guerra (03:21):
[MUSIC PLAYS]
Amy Mantravadi (03:34):
And I'm here with Christian recording artist
Jon Guerra, whose song"Citizens" is the theme song of
this podcast. He was educatedat Moody Bible Institute for
his bachelor's degree, andafter that he formed the indie
progressive rock group Milanowith his wife, or maybe future
(03:54):
wife at the time, and a few oftheir friends. He was a member
of the Vertical Worship Band.
He's toured with Amy Grant andVince Gill's Christmas at the
Ryman in 2015 and 2016. Heformed the group Praytell with
his wife Valerie in 2017, andthey've worked on a number of
things over the years. And thetwo of them composed additional
(04:16):
music for the film A Hidden Lfethat came out just within the
past year or two here. Hisalbums include two he released
with Milano. Then in 2013, hereleased the album Hue under
the name JAGUERRA. Then he hadhis first EP, which was Glass,
(04:40):
in 2014, his full-length album,Little Songs in 2015. Also in
2015, he released It's AlmostChristmas with his wife,
Valerie. In 2017, he releasedan EP called Working Demos 2,
and he's made variouscontributions over the years to
the albums of the VerticalWorship Band. In 2018 , he and
(05:02):
Valerie, as the group Praytell,released It's Almost Christmas
Volume Two, and then last yearhe released the album Keeper of
Days. And you can find him onTwitter and Instagram
@iamjonguerra and on Facebook@jonguerramusic. Well, Jon,
it's so great to have you onthe podcast. Thanks for coming
on.
Jon Guerra (05:23):
Thanks for having me, Amy. Good to see ya.
Amy Mantravadi (05:25):
Well, I know that recently you've moved from
Chicago, where you were formany years, to Austin. So the
first question I naturally haveto ask you is, who has the
better food scene , Chicago orAustin?
Jon Guerra (05:40):
Oh man. That's a tricky one. I got to say I'm
partial to the Chicago culinaryscene. Chicago does a few
things very, very, very well.
Austin does many things prettywell. Austin has amazing tacos
(06:02):
as you would guess, being soclose to the border, but what's
cool about Austin food thatI've found to be actually quite
surprising and delightful isthere's a lot of fusion. So
there's this place that wediscovered just a couple of
weeks ago called TeaHaus 101,and it's a Korean taco place
(06:24):
and it is...kimchi and Koreanbeef mixed with really hot like
Mexican style salsas. I mean,it's just, there's really
nothing like it. But Chicago, Idon't know, maybe it's cause we
were there for 10 years and thenostalgia is just hard to get
over. Chicago is just - whetherit's deep dish, you know, the
(06:46):
kind of the people'sPortillo's, or the super kind
of nichey hipster dive cocktailbar, it just feels like - I
don't know. It's hard. It'shard for me to betray my
allegiance to Chicago food .
Amy Mantravadi (07:03):
Is it really pizza or is it a casserole?
Tell me that.
Jon Guerra (07:08):
You're right. It's a cheese casserole with a
little bit of bread.
Amy Mantravadi (07:12):
Well, it tastes pretty good, whatever you want
to call it. Getting back to themain reason you're here, the
past year or two have broughtsome big transitions for you.
As I alluded to , you andValerie became parents, you
moved from Chicago to Austin,and you released your new
album, Keeper of Days. Whatmotivated your decision to move
(07:34):
down to Texas and how have youchanged as a musician and a
person during this period?
Jon Guerra (07:41):
So we decided to move because - well, back up
now four years ago, we met adirector, a director named
Terrence Malick, who was one ofmy favorite directors, and we
met him through a really goodfriend of ours. And through the
course of a few just randomopportunities that were kind of
(08:02):
forwarded to us through thatrelationship, and really just
the kindness of God, we wereable to start working with him
for A Hidden Life - for a filmthat was released this past
year. And we were flying backand forth from Chicago to
Austin quite a bit, and whenthat movie wrapped up, we were
invited to work on his nextfilm and he's based - like I
said, he's based in Austin. Andwe thought, well, we're going
(08:24):
to have a baby. We're going tomove out of our apartment. We
felt like we were at a time inour lives where we were up for
kind of a transition. We'd beenin Chicago for so long and we
felt like some of the seasonsthat we were in, both
vocational seasons and maybeministry and some of that
stuff, was - we just felt kindof released from and felt like
(08:45):
God was gonna be closing thedoors and just ending a season
for us. And we thought, "Well,now's as good a time as ever.
Why don't we... I've got thisthing in Austin, I'm releasing
an album. I can release analbum anywhere because I'm just
going to be based wherever Iam. And then touring, why don't
we just move to Austin work onthis movie? Try to escape the
winter for the length of themovie and Winslow, our baby
(09:06):
girl ,can just be raised inTexas for a bit?" So we decided
to do it, and we got to Austin,I think about like 15 days
before the lockdown - beforeeverything shut down. So it was
perfect timing for makingfriends and getting to know a
town. We weren't able to moveinto any sort of housing
(09:29):
situation, so we actually - ourdear friend who is down here
gave us his place for as longas it took for us to find a
place, and he moved in afriend's guest room. Talk about
kindness of a friend. And yeah,because of COVID, it was a
little slow going, but we founda place that's kind of perfect
(09:51):
for us and moved in a fewmonths later. Yeah. We've been
here for about a year. How havewe changed? Oh my goodness.
Haven't we all changed thispast year? Haven't we been
affected? I think probably thebiggest thing for me has been a
little bit of a personalperspective change. I was
planning on being on the road,supporting that new album,
(10:13):
touring for at least half ofthe year, and all of that got
canceled and it was a big deal,cause you know, a lot of our
majority of our income at thetime came through touring.
While that was - it wasdefinitely like a bit of a
scramble, like, "Okay, let'sfigure some other things out."
God was insanely kind to us,and you know, we were always -
(10:34):
every month was great and hetook care of us, But also, I
can't believe how quickly Iwould have traded the first
year of Winslow's life for justa handful of shows, and I mean
that with almost like withalmost a bit of fearful
trembling, because I think ittakes us all a little bit of
(10:57):
time to adjust to the newvocation of parenthood and
being a mother or a father.
Some people may be quicker.
Some people are looking forwardto it from the time they're
like 15. "I just can't wait tobe whatever." That was never me
and that was never in my wife.
And we love our baby girl somuch. For me, as just a dad, I
feel like I have been given thechance to grow into my vocation
(11:18):
of fatherhood this year in away that I would have never
been able to , just because ofthe restraints of my other
vocation, which is making artfor God and the necessary
touring that goes along withthat. So that's probably the
biggest thing for me, and it'sa daily reminder because you
can come to terms with yourvocation, both in like a
(11:39):
grateful way with a way thatkind of - you're sort of
following joy and pleasure theway you and I do with writing
or do with music. There'sobviously toil that goes along
with it, but it's like - it'skind of the Eric Lidell. Like I
feel God's pleasure when Iwrite and when I finish a song
(11:59):
and there is that certainlywith fatherhood, but then
there's also the humblysubmitting to , "Okay, it's
6:15, and she's not supposed tobe up for another hour, but
she's up, so here we go." Andthere's a holiness. I think
that comes through just like anacceptance of that as like,
"No, this is actually Godrequiring something of me now.
(12:20):
This isn't just somethingthat's interrupting my
schedule. This is actually theLord. Yeah. Calling me through
the voice of a little baby inthe other room." Yeah, I
definitely wouldn't have hadthat perspective a year ago. I
probably would've waxedeloquent about something that
had nothing to do with actualfatherhood.
Amy Mantravadi (12:38):
No, I very much understand because, as you
know, my husband and I havealso become parents in this
past year, and he was expectingthat he'd spend a couple weeks
of vacation at the beginning tobe home with me, and then he'd
have to go back to work. And asit turned out, he went back to
work for two weeks and thenhe's been working from home
(13:00):
ever since. So he's been herefor a lot of our son Thomas's
growing up over this first yearthat he just wouldn't have been
. I mean, he would have seenhim in the evenings and on the
weekends and everything, butit's different, because now
every time he goes to thebathroom, he can just pop his
head in and say hello and seewhatever is happening, and it
(13:22):
does really cause you toreflect in different ways. And
then for me becoming a mother,like you said, with the
artistic process, such as it iswith the writing, you know,
sometimes you'll put the babydown for a nap and you're like,
"Okay, maybe I'll get an hourhere...maybe." And you have
(13:42):
enough time to make yourselfsome tea and sit down and write
one page, and all of a suddenthe baby's up and - "You're not
supposed to be up for anotherhalf an hour yet!" "Oh...Too
bad!" You know?
Jon Guerra (13:53):
Yeah, exactly.
Amy Mantravadi (13:53):
And I have really had to check my attitude
a lot of times and say, "Holdon, what is the most important
here? Is it this stupid pagethat I'm writing or my son?"
Well, it's just because yourexpectation was one way and
then it got taken another way,but man, there's probably
nothing on earth that revealsyour own selfishness to you as
(14:17):
much as becoming a parent.
Becoming a wife or a husbandcertainly does that to a
certain extent, but even with awife or a husband, they're
usually respectful of some ofyour free time - giving you
time to work on your process,because if for nothing else
that they want their own freetime as well. But you know,
(14:41):
kids - when they need you, theyjust need you. So I think
certainly God has designed allthese seasons in life to teach
us so much about himself. AndI'll just say on a personal
note as well, if TerrenceMalick ever said, "Can you just
drop everything and work onthis movie with me?" I would be
very tempted to say yes aswell. It will never happen for
(15:04):
me, but it happened for you. Icould understand why that seems
like a pretty great opportunity. So you and your wife, Valerie
have worked together a lot onyour music over the years, as I
was mentioning in theintroduction. I suspect that
would be easier for somemarried couples than others. So
how did the two of you makeyour collaboration work?
Jon Guerra (15:28):
So we met collaborating. Somebody invited
us to play music together incollege and she was playing
violin. I was playing guitar.
And as the story goes, I askedher if she would like to work
on some of my songs and it waskind of a ploy to just be able
to get some alone time withher. I didn't have the courage
(15:49):
to just outright say, "Will yougo out with me?" So I had the
little sneak attack of workingon music. I also did want to
work on music, cause she'sactually an incredible musician
- still is. And so I think ourrelationship from day one was
always kind of working onthings together, and then we
were in bands and then we didlong distance, which felt like
(16:09):
a kind of collaboration ofschedules and - like right
before we got married. Andyeah, I don't know. That piece
- I'm grateful it's never beentoo difficult. I think we're
both - we both really enjoy, Iguess, projects and working on
things long-term, and we bothenjoyed being very scrappy and
(16:33):
working through the night toget something done and there's
never one pulling the otheralong and being like, "Oh, we
gotta..." You know, we're bothjust kind of - we just enjoy, I
guess, being scrappy and maybeeven a little entrepreneurial,
so that feels like a gift tous. And probably the biggest
collaboration is obviouslyWinslow our daughter at this
(16:54):
point, and it's wild how manythings carry over from -
whether collaborating on atour, on a concert, on an
album, on movie. It feels very,very sweet to feel like we have
a partner in each other.
Amy Mantravadi (17:15):
Well, I mean, I'm so glad that that's been
able to work because it'sproduced such great fruit, and
as you say, has now produced adaughter as well. But
certainly, I'm sure - I try tosay , "What would it be like if
my husband and I were doing thesame job together?" And I think
on a certain level, I'm sure wecould make it work because we
(17:37):
just know each other so well,and we know how to handle each
other's moods , but on anotherlevel I'm like, "Wow, I don't
know if we could make thatwork." But I don't know. Maybe
we'll see if God ever gives usa chance to investigate if that
works or not. I think for nowwe'll stick to our separate
spheres . Your song "Citizens,"which is the theme song of this
(18:01):
podcast, addresses the issue ofimmigration by comparing it to
the way that Christ invites usinto his kingdom and makes us
citizens of it. In addition tothis broader message, it's
clear that you're alsocommunicating something about
how Christians should engagepolitically. Could you talk
about what inspired you towrite this song and what you
(18:22):
hope to communicate through it?
Jon Guerra (18:25):
Yeah. So what inspired the song really was -
it was a feeling. So all of mysongs typically start with like
a state of mind or a state ofheart that I then try to figure
out through my songs. Very fewof them start with, "This is
what I want to communicate.
This is my thesis," and then Igo. It's very much letting the
(18:45):
song tell me what it wants tobe and sort of guiding it
through the grid of, "Does thislyric that I just wrote or does
this melody with this lyricseem, I guess, consistent with
the experience that I'm havingas a person with regards to
this issue or this experience?"With that song in particular,
it was a period of years (19:07):
I would say probably 2015 through
2017. And this had been comingto a head for awhile where it
felt as though politicalallegiance was beginning to
usurp, I guess, allegiance toChrist, or at least it seemed
to me that in our churches andI - around that time, I was
(19:32):
touring quite a bit. I'dprobably sing a hundred
evangelical churches a year ,for a couple of years at a
time. And I was noticing justsometimes, very explicitly,
like from the stage orwhatever, but mostly in
conversations with peopleeither after the concert or
before the concert or just outto eat, anytime politics would
(19:55):
come up, there was just thistinge of what seemed to me like
self-righteous vitriol or ahatred towards anybody that was
really disagreeing or anybodythat was Democrat. It felt
like, "What's going on here?"Like at first, you know, it's
kind of funny. Somebody says alittle jab comment, but after a
while , it's like, every timepolitics comes up, it's just
(20:16):
like this other thing takesover. And it's like, how do we
feel justified in having thisposture towards our - even if
these people are our enemies,let's say best case scenario,
these are our enemies. Where inthe world do we find the
backing to - self justificationto feel much less act this way
(20:42):
towards people that arepolitically different than us.
And oftentimes it was throughthe guise of, "Well, Western
civilization is at stake." Youknow, it was through the guise
of, "Well, if we don't do this,we don't make these alliances,
if we don't then the country'sgoing to hell in a hand
basket," or it was just thesevery, very lofty ideals and
(21:03):
these really - it was moral. Irealized that a lot of people
were saying this is a moralissue. Therefore, morally I'm
obligated to make theseallegiances and make and take
this kind of stance and takethis posture. You know, it got
to the point where friends -close friends, people that I
probably would have had in mywedding had I known them when I
got married, fellow worshipleaders, pastors at my church -
(21:27):
were just outright getting kindof behind what felt like a
nationalistic Christian -Christian nationalism is being
thrown around a lot right now,but the themes of that have
been growing for the pastseveral years. And I just felt
it when I felt my friends, notreally seeing or not really , I
(21:51):
guess, having any issue withthis kind of discourse or this
kind of political engagement. Ijust - I got really sad. I got
really kind of troubled andangry, but underneath that, it
was like, "I thought we wereall - we all grew up together.
Didn't we all agree this issecondary? That this is
actually secondary to anotherkingdom - that we're on the
(22:14):
same page here. And I was goingto d church at the time, and my
pastor joined Donald Trump'sevangelical council of pastors,
so he was a pretty prominentleader at the time. He's no
longer in ministry , my formerpastor. And that was kind of
like, "Wait, what's going onhere?" Take all that and then
(22:35):
combine it with , my wife is asocial worker and we
collaborate a lot, like we justtalked about, but something
that we don't collaborate in isshe spent almost a decade
working with refugees inChicago and working with inner
city schools and starting musicgroups for refugee victims of
trauma in Chicago. And when youwork with people in that
(22:59):
socioeconomic spot in ourcountry, you get rewired a
little bit, and you can'treally tolerate the blanket
characterizations of people inthat spot in life. You can't
really tolerate that. And whenyou feel that one candidate or
(23:19):
one kind of perspectivestereotypically kind of
characterizes people in thatspot and that way, it just
becomes very distasteful. Sothat was kind of everything
that was going on around thetime, and it all kind of
bubbled up in prayer in Januaryof 2017. And my process as a
(23:40):
writer and as a songwriter, Ifeel called to make art for God
and to God . So I feel lesscalled to kind of call
Christians out or to bepreacher or shake people by the
collar. I feel more called tovicariously experience the
world and my faith, and thenbring that experience back to
God in a way that hopefullyother Christians can join in,
(24:01):
with and through. And I justcall that devotional music. I
call my songs devotional songsfor that reason. So this was
kind of like the first time I'dever brought those questions
and those feelings and thatconfusion and that anger and
that sadness, and that reallyhonest, "I'm just confused here
(24:21):
because I - Am I wrong? I'mhappy to be wrong, but just
please God, help me understandwhat's happening here when it
feels like the embassy ofheaven, which is the Church, is
somehow no longer the embassyof heaven: it feels like it's
the embassy for somethingelse." And I guess I use that
analogy because I - first ofall, that's just kind of what
(24:41):
came out naturally and I alwaystry to pay attention to what
sort of comes from thesubconscious, but I kind of
wanted it to be a little bit ofa transgressive rendering. The
parables in their own day andage in their own context were
pretty transgressive. They werepretty culturally transgressive
in terms of what Christ wasencouraging people to consider
(25:04):
both about him and about God.
And it it felt appropriate, sothat's where that song kind of
came from.
Amy Mantravadi (25:12):
Well, thanks for sharing a lot of the
background about that, and I'lljust share with you a little
bit about why I chose that songto be the theme of this
podcast, just besides the factthat I liked the idea of using
something for your music , bothbecause I know you and I really
love your music, and also justthe - even apart from the
(25:33):
words, the musical line in thatsong works so well as a little
brief snippet into the podcast,but I have been going on a
similar journey over the pastfew years. And you know, this
is called the (A)Millennialpodcast, and I think that a lot
of Christians of the millennialgeneration are going through
(25:55):
the same circumstance of beingraised in evangelicalism and a
certain culture that in manyways has also been linked to a
certain set of politicalvalues, many of which I haven't
rejected. And just for example, a lot of aspects of the
pro-life movement (26:21):
I still consider myself very much
pro-life, so because of that,there are certain elements of
the progressive politicalagenda that are just kind of
anathema to me for that reason.
But at the same time, seeingreally troubling things
(26:43):
happening in the otherdirection, and a lot of
hypocrisy, I think, is the bigthing. Seeing the way people
talked in the nineties, versushow they're talking now - the
same people - and seeing, yeah,people you grow up with, the
kinds of things they're postingon social media, crazy
(27:03):
conspiracy theories and stuffthat seems to show not a lot of
trust in God's sovereignty andseems to suggest an allegiance
more to the kingdom of thisworld than the kingdom of God.
And while not in any wayputting myself forward as a
(27:24):
supreme example ofrighteousness, because it's
possible to get veryself-righteous in the other
direction as well - You know,feeling self-righteous in
comparison to the"self-righteous people." I feel
that in general, if Christiansever start feeling too at home
in any one political locationor with any one political
(27:45):
party, something maybe is wrongbecause our ultimate longing
and desires should be for aperfect king, who is Jesus
Christ, and no human being isever gonna be able to fill
those shoes, so we should beable to pick out flaws and
places where human beings arecoming up short, and that
(28:09):
doesn't mean we're beingcynical or hypercritical . It
just means that we realize thatno human being can fill the
shoes of Jesus Christ. So weneed to be careful and remember
what the Bible says to put notour faith in princes. So I
appreciate what - your song,because it was clear that you
were wrestling with a lot ofthese things, and like you, I
(28:30):
don't have any perfect answersat this point. And yeah,
sometimes I wonder if I'm wrongor I hope that I'm wrong.
Events have not reallysuggested to me that I'm wrong
on many occasions in thisregard , especially recent
events . So I appreciate youtalking about that, and I think
it does - so many people I'vetalked to who are of this
(28:54):
generation are feeling the sameway, very confused by wanting
to carry on that way of - aChristian way of thinking about
politics, but being concernedabout maybe a wider variety of
issues, or at least not wantingto so demonize the other side
that we can't even have aconversation anymore. So yeah,
(29:16):
I really appreciate that.
Moving on , you've beeninvolved in performing music in
several different settings (29:22):
for Sunday worship gatherings and
performance with otherChristian artists, in
completely secular settings,and then recording for private
listening. How does yourmindset shift when you're
performing in those differentcircumstances, particularly
Christian versus secular orwhen you're performing actually
(29:43):
in a worship service versus ina concert or something along
those lines?
Jon Guerra (29:49):
Yeah, no, that's a good question. It shifts quite
a bit. All of those are - well,some people have two mindsets.
Some people say, "You just doyour thing. Doesn't matter
who's in the crowd." I'm alittle bit more - I guess I
feel that my job is to kind offacilitate connection, at least
generally Sunday morningworship maybe . Well, maybe
it's a version of that: facilitating a connection with (30:11):
undefined
God between all the people. Youknow, a passion of mine and
hope of mine is that my musicwould be palatable to the
degree that it makes sense tobe palatable without losing its
with its essence. It would bepalatable to people who don't
(30:33):
share my beliefs or share myfaith. And by that, I mean 0 I
guess I try to be as sincereand sincerely devoted to God in
a way without usingChristianese for instance, or
without appealing to the lowestcommon denominator ways of
(30:53):
connecting with a crowd, makingsome kind of Bible joke or some
Awana joke (30:58):
something that would be very nichey. Made that
mistake, I think a few timesearly on, and then I found out
that there was people in thecrowd that had come to our
concert from - who'd heard usfrom Praytell, which is kind of
our main, our kind of oursecular band that got us - our
non-Christian devotional music.
(31:19):
Somebody had heard us at a cluband then come and seen us at a
church because they heard wewere coming back to town and I
kind of code switched a littlebit. And they were in town and
something in my spirit feltlike, "Man, did I say something
that maybe I wouldn't have saidat a different context?" And I
(31:41):
don't think I necessarily did .
I didn't regret - I didn't sayanything that I think I need to
do feel bad about, but it wasmore like I should really just
try to find that middle groundas much as I can to try to
speak to everyone that I knowis going to be listening. But
you know, naturally thatchanges when I'm - as a worship
leader, I feel very much likemy job is to kind of bring a
(32:04):
little bit of the aesthetic,emotional timbre to the
liturgy, whatever that liturgyis. I go to a little bit more
of a liturgical church now herein Austin, a PCA church, and
everything is in service of theliturgy really, and the sermon
and it's beautiful. I reallyenjoy it. Obviously when I'm in
(32:26):
a club or a non-Christianvenue, I will try to just be in
that setting what I'm supposedto be, which is entertaining
and sincere. And people come upto me afterwards, they often do
and say, "Hey, that song yousang called 'Stained Glass
Windows,' tell me more aboutthat." And I remember chatting
(32:46):
with a girl who was very -she'd had several drinks by the
time she was talking to me inSan Francisco about 'Stained
Glass Windows' and how muchthat song meant to her, and she
didn't know why. And it wasjust - it was awesome. I felt
very much like, "This isbeautiful. This is what it's
about."
Amy Mantravadi (33:05):
Are there any Christian figures who have
particularly influenced you inyour spiritual life or books
and music that have beenespecially inspirational for
you?
Jon Guerra (33:16):
Yeah, I would say poets actually influence me
more than musicians orsongwriters. Practically, I
love old sixties folk likeDylan, Simon and Garfunkel. I
love wordy folk music, but interms of spiritual and artistic
influence, George Herbert, the17th century priest and poet
(33:38):
from England - he has a book ofpoetry called The Temple, which
I've read cover to cover atleast dozens of times. I mean,
I don't go a week withoutreading it, at least a poem,
and the style can be a hairclunky. You just kind of have
to click into that style alittle bit. He's a contemporary
(33:58):
of John Donne and it's justastounding, both ideas wise,
structurally the way he playswith the English language. But
he was a pastor and he wrotehis poems I guess when he
wasn't doing pastoral thingsand he died before any of his
poems were published, and he'sone of the most revered poets
(34:23):
in the English language now.
And something about him workingon his poems to God, this
masterwork of English poetry,in absolute obscurity and then
dying before they're publishedis a very beautiful story to
me, and then seeing thevibrancy and just absolute
(34:43):
burning with the love of God.
Yeah. It's enormouslyinspirational to me. So I had
to pick one, I would say,George Herbert.
Amy Mantravadi (34:50):
Well, thank you for that recommendation. I'm
going to have to go out andread some of his poems and
yeah, that's a good point Ithink, about - maybe even a
good American example would besomeone like Emily Dickinson
who was virtually unknownduring her life, and then
afterwards - I mean, she wasn'tmaybe as much of a strong
Christian as George Herbertwas, but it does sort of remind
(35:16):
you that we can't always knowhow the different things we do
in our life are gonna affecteternity or affect future
generations. And sometimes wethink the things we do that get
a lot of attention are theimportant things, when actually
there are things that seem moremundane to us that actually are
(35:36):
the things God's going to use alot more long-term, so thank
you. That's interesting tohear. I always like to hear how
people have been influenced bythose who have gone before,
because knowing how Ipersonally have been influenced
in much the same way by otherwriters, you learn a lot about
people when you find out whotheir influences are. We've
(35:58):
mentioned a couple of timesthat you were recently able to
contribute some music for thefilm A Hidden Life from
director Terrence Malick. Howdid you come to be involved in
that project? You talked alittle bit about it, but maybe
you can give us a bit moreexplanation and what was it
like to work on something for afilm?
Jon Guerra (36:16):
So, like I said , it was a connection through a
dear friend of ours and wereally had no business working
on music for a movie, but theywere looking for some very
particular type of music and wewere able to kind of deliver
that for them. And really whatwe contributed mostly was
(36:37):
reductions - what were calledshadows. So like orchestral
reductions, so like largepieces by Bruckner or Bach, or
you name it (36:46):
we would take those large scale orchestra
pieces and make them smallsingle, duo, or trio violin
pieces. And the process wasbasically - it was very
iterative and experimental andjust trying a lot of things. We
(37:06):
must have recorded two and ahalf hours of music. Obviously,
not all of it made it, but theprocess of trying it and then
seeing it behind footage andthen getting feedback from
Malick and the editors was justinsanely fun. I mean, it was so
(37:27):
different for us and we wereflying to and forth from Austin
and going in to the office tosee how the music was working,
and some of it was not workingat all, and some of it was
like, "Whoa, that really bringsit to life!" So we're doing
that same thing with this newmovie and it's just - it's
mainly very, very, very fun.
Amy Mantravadi (37:49):
Well , I've seen a few of his movies and it
was a real delight to be ableto go see that one in the
theater. And first of all, Imean, it's such an incredible
film. I'd encourage anyone whohasn't seen it, if you can sit
for three hours, it's reallyworth it. I mean, his films are
(38:09):
always so contemplative and hedoesn't rush. He lets you sit
and think about things. And itseems like particularly - I'm
thinking now about the film hehad done previously, The Tree
of Life, and then with this one- in both of those, and I'm
sure in some of his otherfilms, the pieces of music that
(38:32):
he chooses to bring in, inaddition to the score - and the
score for the film was writtenby the great film composer,
James Newton Howard - but then,you know, he always brings in
as a director, he brings inclassical pieces and other
things that - It seems like hehimself has such a great
appreciation for music and isvery particular about which
(38:55):
pieces he wants to bring in tohelp tell his story. So I just
thought it was so awesome thatyou were able to work with him
because even before seeing thatfilm, I already had some
knowledge of him as a directorand the fact of how important
music was to his films. So anyclues as to the - or do I need
(39:17):
to go to IMDb to find out whatthe next movie is about?
Jon Guerra (39:22):
Totally. So the next one - right now it's
called The Last Planet, andthis is all public knowledge.
It's a film about Christ andPeter actually, so it's a
period piece about Christthrough the eyes of Peter, and
(39:44):
it's just very, verytremendous. That's all I can
say. The main editor lives veryclose to us and is a good
friend of ours, and two nightsago we got to go over and just
see a bunch of stuff that hewas working on: him and another
person from the movie and acouple of the people from the
film. We do dinner witheverybody like every Friday
(40:07):
night, and after dinner lastFriday, we went up and got to
see some footage and it's just- it's cool. It'll be a long
time though, and it'll probablybe long.
Amy Mantravadi (40:19):
That's okay. I mean, especially if you have to
wait a long time for it, youdon't want it to be only 90
minutes long.
Jon Guerra (40:27):
Yeah, totally.
Amy Mantravadi (40:27):
So I'll be looking forward to that
whenever it's coming out.
People often look to Christianmusic artists as spiritual role
models, for better or forworse. Do you think this is
fair, and what responsibilitydo Christians in the performing
arts have in this regard?
Jon Guerra (40:46):
No , I mean, I don't think it's fair
necessarily. Fair (40:47):
that's an interesting descriptor. I think
it's like a necessary evil ofjust the - We live in a really
weird time where celebrity justpermeates everything: just that
celebrity dynamic and whetherthat's, "Oh my goodness! I saw
(41:12):
The Bachelorette at Starbucks!"and you feel whatever you feel
- it's like that is just sodumb and just has nothing to do
with the things that reallymatter in life, yet it kind of
permeates everything. I thinkprobably there's a little bit
of responsibility that comeswith just being aware of that.
(41:32):
I have a good number of peoplethat listen to my music at this
point in my career andunderstanding that and seeing
that for what it is - tryingto, I guess, dismantle or I
guess reject the sort of maybedeference that I might get in
certain situations. I activelytry to kind of fight against
(41:53):
that to the best of myknowledge, and then seeing it
as a little bit of a, forbetter or for worse - it is a
responsibility that, you know,maybe there's a 14-year-old kid
like me - like I was when I was14 and the way I looked up to
my heroes or whatever - mymusical heroes, I guess. And
seeing that as a very weightything, whether it's legitimate
(42:18):
or not. When we hear aboutpeople who fall from ministry
because of some moral thing, Imean, it has ripple effects,
whether it should or not, andrealizing that to whatever
small degree, there's probablysome stranger out there that if
I were to really betray mymessage or my perceived
(42:42):
message, it would have rippleeffects in ways that I don't
even realize. And not thatthat's why I don't do certain -
I mean, hopefully I want tolive a certain way because of
what it means for God and formy immediate family and
friends, but I do take thatseriously. I do take that -
(43:02):
just because I've been hurt inthat way from people that I've
looked up to that have thendisappointed me in pretty
serious ways. But I also thinkthat listeners need to realize
that Christian artists are andperforming artists, especially
- it's a lot of entertainersout there. It's an industry and
(43:24):
people get into it because theycan make a buck. And it's not
always bad. Some people aregood at -you know, Christians
need entertainment too, Iguess. I mean, if I had it my
way, there would probably be noChristian entertainment, but
thank goodness I'm not incharge. But just people to
realize that we are, I guess,not always as pure as we'd like
(43:50):
to be, I suppose, but I dothink there is a responsibility
whether or not it's - we allhave influence, I guess, and I
think influence is aresponsibility, however, small.
Amy Mantravadi (44:03):
Yeah. I really appreciate that answer because
I think that the issue goes twoways. There's an importance for
those who are in any kind ofposition of spiritual influence
and, for better or for worse,the Christian musician or a
Christian writer or a famouspastor - You do have some of
that influence. So there's aresponsibility to live up to
(44:25):
the values that you're pushing,but on the other side, people
also need to understand thatwe're not to put people on this
kind of pedestal where we thinkof them no longer as - well,
okay, like I was talking aboutearlier with politicians and -
no longer as fallible humanbeings, but as some kind of
superhero or something. We needto realize that. And I think
(44:50):
it's clear in a lot of yourmusic that you're a person
who's asking a lot of thesespiritual questions, just the
same as everybody else. And thepoint of the artist is not to
give people an example of howto be perfect, but maybe to
teach people how to questionwell, to invite people, to come
alongside them in the spiritualjourney, and I think that your
(45:11):
music does a really good job ofthat. But it's something that I
would be curious to ask anyChristian artists , just
because I think there is a lotof pressure from people's
expectations, and then you dosee famous - you'll hear about
some Christian artist from youryouth who now says they're not
a Christian anymore, and itreally shakes people. They're
(45:33):
like, "Oh, is any if that realif so and so..." And it's like,
"Well, what were you thinking?
I mean, this person was a20-year-old, basically a kid
when you were listening to themget up there and p lays the
drums. They never claimed to bea theologian on par with
Augustine." But I thinkpeople's expectations can be
(45:54):
kind of crazy, and like yousaid, our obsession with
celebrity probably doesn't helpat all either. So just to wrap
things up, you've shared alittle bit about what we can
expect from you in the futurewith the movie that you're
working on. Is there anythingelse that you have in the
works? What are you hoping forwhen hopefully someday COVID
will be over, or what are youhoping to do then?
Jon Guerra (46:17):
Yeah. Well, hoping to tour again. There's a
connection that happens whenyou release an album and then
you play that new album live infront of people that have been
listening to it. There's areally cool connection that
happens, and I've kind of beenmissing that. So I'm looking
forward to that, hopefullypost-COVID. And even before
that, I do foresee in the nearfuture releasing more music, so
(46:43):
that my last - Keeper of Days,there was five years in between
albums. I'm not going to takeanother five years: I know that
for sure. I might release -whether it's another album -
probably not another album, butat least another set of songs
in 2021 - this year. So I'mjust in a good rhythm here.
Writing wise, my mornings arevery sacred, I'm home, and a
(47:05):
lot that's coming out.
Amy Mantravadi (47:10):
Well, that's good. We have something to look
forward to in 2021. Anything wecan look forward to and
encourage us right now is agood thing. Well, Jon, thank
you so much for taking the timeto talk with me, and I hope our
discussion is a blessing to alot of people. Yeah, I hope so
too.
Jon Guerra (47:26):
[MUSIC PLAYS] I need to know there is justice,
that it will roll in abundance,and that you're building a city
where we arrive as immigrantsand you call us citizens and
you welcome us as childrenhome. [MUSIC ENDS]
Amy Mantravadi (47:55):
It was a real pleasure to speak with John.
His latest effort, Keeper ofDays, is available for digital
streaming of both the audio andvisual album. You can also
visit the site,jonguerramusic.com for tour
dates, merchandise, and otherinformation. Of course, we all
look forward to the end of theCOVID pandemic when we can
actually go to concerts again.
"The spirit and the bride say,'Come!' And let the one who
(48:18):
hears say, 'Come! And let onewho is thirsty, come. Let the
one who desires take the waterof life without cost. He who
testifies to these things says,'Yes, I am coming quickly.'
Amen. Come Lord Jesus. Thegrace of the Lord Jesus be with
all." Amen. Have a great week.
Jon Guerra (48:39):
[MUSIC PLAYS] Is there a way to live always
living in enemy hallways? Don'tknow my foes from my friends
and don't know my friendsanymore. Power has several
prizes. Handcuffs can come inall sizes. Love has a million
disguises, but winning issimply not one . [MUSIC ENDS]
[MUSIC PLAYS] I have a heart full of questions
quieting all my suggestions.
What is the meaning ofChristian in this American
life? I'm feeling awfullyfoolish spending my life on a
message. I look around and Iwonder ever if I heard it
right. [MUSIC ENDS]
Amy Mantravadi (00:28):
Welcome to the (A)Millennial podcast, where we
have theological conversationsfor today's world. I'm your
host, Amy Mantravadi, coming toyou live from Dayton, Ohio,
former home of The MidgetTheater. Yes, I know it's
impolite to use that word forthose with forms of dwarfism,
but that was the actual name ofan early movie theater in
Dayton, a true nickelodeonwhere you paid a few cents to
(00:49):
watch a film. It received itsname because the manager was a
little person by the name ofSherman Potterf. With his
average sized brother,Benjamin, Sherman leased a
building downtown and held agrand opening in 1913 for a
"home of quality photo plays."The slogan that was used in
advertisements was, "Nothingsmall about The Midget - only
(01:09):
the manager." Of course, in ourpresent era, it's hard to
imagine a little person namingtheir theater with a derogatory
slur, but in that time it wasevidently not considered
derogatory enough to botherSherman. The brothers sold
their theater business in 1917,and today the building stands
in a state of disrepair, butready for a new buyer who can
fix it up and make it a homefor a restaurant, store, or
(01:30):
artist's studio. I think it'skind of awesome that a hundred
years ago, someone who lookeddifferent was able to be the
manager of a business and alsoserve as a touring performer
for another company. If theworld looks down and you,
friends, don't let it get youdown. You can accomplish great
things. It is perhapsappropriate that I opened with
an anecdote loosely related tothe arts, because my guest
today is a talented performer: Jon Guerra. He has released (01:51):
undefined
albums individually and inconnection with his wife,
Valerie, and his work isintended to draw people into
meditation upon spiritualtruths. John's first solo
album, Little Songs, displayedhis desire to offer up little
songs to the Lord as prayers.
One of the songs off his mostrecent album, "Citizens," is
(02:13):
the theme song for thispodcast. But my connection to
this couple goes back a verylong way. Valerie and I were
friends growing up. We attendedthe same church and school. Our
families went on trips togetherand were a regular presence in
each other's lives. It's beenreally special to watch God
bring Valerie and John togetherand allow them to make
beautiful music. As you know ifyou're a regular listener, I
(02:35):
like to open each show byreading a scripture passage
that is relevant to the day'sdiscussion. Today, I'll be
reading Psalm 33 verses onethrough five. "Sing for joy in
the Lord, you righteous ones.
Praise is becoming to theupright. Give thanks to the
Lord with the lyre. Singpraises to him with a harp of
ten strings. Sing to him a newsong. Play skillfully with a
(02:57):
shout of joy, for the word ofthe Lord is right, and all his
work is done in faithfulness.
He loves righteousness andjustice. The earth is full of
the goodness of the Lord." It'sso wonderful to think that the
Lord created music and hasordained that we should use it
to praise him. Now let's headon to the interview and find
out how Jon is using hismusical talents for the glory
of God. I apologize in advancefor the poor audio on my end of
(03:21):
the conversation.
Jon Guerra (03:21):
[MUSIC PLAYS]
Amy Mantravadi (03:34):
And I'm here with Christian recording artist
Jon Guerra, whose song"Citizens" is the theme song of
this podcast. He was educatedat Moody Bible Institute for
his bachelor's degree, andafter that he formed the indie
progressive rock group Milanowith his wife, or maybe future
(03:54):
wife at the time, and a few oftheir friends. He was a member
of the Vertical Worship Band.
He's toured with Amy Grant andVince Gill's Christmas at the
Ryman in 2015 and 2016. Heformed the group Praytell with
his wife Valerie in 2017, andthey've worked on a number of
things over the years. And thetwo of them composed additional
(04:16):
music for the film A Hidden Lfethat came out just within the
past year or two here. Hisalbums include two he released
with Milano. Then in 2013, hereleased the album Hue under
the name JAGUERRA. Then he hadhis first EP, which was Glass,
(04:40):
in 2014, his full-length album,Little Songs in 2015. Also in
2015, he released It's AlmostChristmas with his wife,
Valerie. In 2017, he releasedan EP called Working Demos 2,
and he's made variouscontributions over the years to
the albums of the VerticalWorship Band. In 2018 , he and
(05:02):
Valerie, as the group Praytell,released It's Almost Christmas
Volume Two, and then last yearhe released the album Keeper of
Days. And you can find him onTwitter and Instagram
@iamjonguerra and on Facebook@jonguerramusic. Well, Jon,
it's so great to have you onthe podcast. Thanks for coming
on.
Jon Guerra (05:23):
Thanks for having me, Amy. Good to see ya.
Amy Mantravadi (05:25):
Well, I know that recently you've moved from
Chicago, where you were formany years, to Austin. So the
first question I naturally haveto ask you is, who has the
better food scene , Chicago orAustin?
Jon Guerra (05:40):
Oh man. That's a tricky one. I got to say I'm
partial to the Chicago culinaryscene. Chicago does a few
things very, very, very well.
Austin does many things prettywell. Austin has amazing tacos
(06:02):
as you would guess, being soclose to the border, but what's
cool about Austin food thatI've found to be actually quite
surprising and delightful isthere's a lot of fusion. So
there's this place that wediscovered just a couple of
weeks ago called TeaHaus 101,and it's a Korean taco place
(06:24):
and it is...kimchi and Koreanbeef mixed with really hot like
Mexican style salsas. I mean,it's just, there's really
nothing like it. But Chicago, Idon't know, maybe it's cause we
were there for 10 years and thenostalgia is just hard to get
over. Chicago is just - whetherit's deep dish, you know, the
(06:46):
kind of the people'sPortillo's, or the super kind
of nichey hipster dive cocktailbar, it just feels like - I
don't know. It's hard. It'shard for me to betray my
allegiance to Chicago food .
Amy Mantravadi (07:03):
Is it really pizza or is it a casserole?
Tell me that.
Jon Guerra (07:08):
You're right. It's a cheese casserole with a
little bit of bread.
Amy Mantravadi (07:12):
Well, it tastes pretty good, whatever you want
to call it. Getting back to themain reason you're here, the
past year or two have broughtsome big transitions for you.
As I alluded to , you andValerie became parents, you
moved from Chicago to Austin,and you released your new
album, Keeper of Days. Whatmotivated your decision to move
(07:34):
down to Texas and how have youchanged as a musician and a
person during this period?
Jon Guerra (07:41):
So we decided to move because - well, back up
now four years ago, we met adirector, a director named
Terrence Malick, who was one ofmy favorite directors, and we
met him through a really goodfriend of ours. And through the
course of a few just randomopportunities that were kind of
(08:02):
forwarded to us through thatrelationship, and really just
the kindness of God, we wereable to start working with him
for A Hidden Life - for a filmthat was released this past
year. And we were flying backand forth from Chicago to
Austin quite a bit, and whenthat movie wrapped up, we were
invited to work on his nextfilm and he's based - like I
said, he's based in Austin. Andwe thought, well, we're going
(08:24):
to have a baby. We're going tomove out of our apartment. We
felt like we were at a time inour lives where we were up for
kind of a transition. We'd beenin Chicago for so long and we
felt like some of the seasonsthat we were in, both
vocational seasons and maybeministry and some of that
stuff, was - we just felt kindof released from and felt like
(08:45):
God was gonna be closing thedoors and just ending a season
for us. And we thought, "Well,now's as good a time as ever.
Why don't we... I've got thisthing in Austin, I'm releasing
an album. I can release analbum anywhere because I'm just
going to be based wherever Iam. And then touring, why don't
we just move to Austin work onthis movie? Try to escape the
winter for the length of themovie and Winslow, our baby
(09:06):
girl ,can just be raised inTexas for a bit?" So we decided
to do it, and we got to Austin,I think about like 15 days
before the lockdown - beforeeverything shut down. So it was
perfect timing for makingfriends and getting to know a
town. We weren't able to moveinto any sort of housing
(09:29):
situation, so we actually - ourdear friend who is down here
gave us his place for as longas it took for us to find a
place, and he moved in afriend's guest room. Talk about
kindness of a friend. And yeah,because of COVID, it was a
little slow going, but we founda place that's kind of perfect
(09:51):
for us and moved in a fewmonths later. Yeah. We've been
here for about a year. How havewe changed? Oh my goodness.
Haven't we all changed thispast year? Haven't we been
affected? I think probably thebiggest thing for me has been a
little bit of a personalperspective change. I was
planning on being on the road,supporting that new album,
(10:13):
touring for at least half ofthe year, and all of that got
canceled and it was a big deal,cause you know, a lot of our
majority of our income at thetime came through touring.
While that was - it wasdefinitely like a bit of a
scramble, like, "Okay, let'sfigure some other things out."
God was insanely kind to us,and you know, we were always -
(10:34):
every month was great and hetook care of us, But also, I
can't believe how quickly Iwould have traded the first
year of Winslow's life for justa handful of shows, and I mean
that with almost like withalmost a bit of fearful
trembling, because I think ittakes us all a little bit of
(10:57):
time to adjust to the newvocation of parenthood and
being a mother or a father.
Some people may be quicker.
Some people are looking forwardto it from the time they're
like 15. "I just can't wait tobe whatever." That was never me
and that was never in my wife.
And we love our baby girl somuch. For me, as just a dad, I
feel like I have been given thechance to grow into my vocation
(11:18):
of fatherhood this year in away that I would have never
been able to , just because ofthe restraints of my other
vocation, which is making artfor God and the necessary
touring that goes along withthat. So that's probably the
biggest thing for me, and it'sa daily reminder because you
can come to terms with yourvocation, both in like a
(11:39):
grateful way with a way thatkind of - you're sort of
following joy and pleasure theway you and I do with writing
or do with music. There'sobviously toil that goes along
with it, but it's like - it'skind of the Eric Lidell. Like I
feel God's pleasure when Iwrite and when I finish a song
(11:59):
and there is that certainlywith fatherhood, but then
there's also the humblysubmitting to , "Okay, it's
6:15, and she's not supposed tobe up for another hour, but
she's up, so here we go." Andthere's a holiness. I think
that comes through just like anacceptance of that as like,
"No, this is actually Godrequiring something of me now.
(12:20):
This isn't just somethingthat's interrupting my
schedule. This is actually theLord. Yeah. Calling me through
the voice of a little baby inthe other room." Yeah, I
definitely wouldn't have hadthat perspective a year ago. I
probably would've waxedeloquent about something that
had nothing to do with actualfatherhood.
Amy Mantravadi (12:38):
No, I very much understand because, as you
know, my husband and I havealso become parents in this
past year, and he was expectingthat he'd spend a couple weeks
of vacation at the beginning tobe home with me, and then he'd
have to go back to work. And asit turned out, he went back to
work for two weeks and thenhe's been working from home
(13:00):
ever since. So he's been herefor a lot of our son Thomas's
growing up over this first yearthat he just wouldn't have been
. I mean, he would have seenhim in the evenings and on the
weekends and everything, butit's different, because now
every time he goes to thebathroom, he can just pop his
head in and say hello and seewhatever is happening, and it
(13:22):
does really cause you toreflect in different ways. And
then for me becoming a mother,like you said, with the
artistic process, such as it iswith the writing, you know,
sometimes you'll put the babydown for a nap and you're like,
"Okay, maybe I'll get an hourhere...maybe." And you have
(13:42):
enough time to make yourselfsome tea and sit down and write
one page, and all of a suddenthe baby's up and - "You're not
supposed to be up for anotherhalf an hour yet!" "Oh...Too
bad!" You know?
Jon Guerra (13:53):
Yeah, exactly.
Amy Mantravadi (13:53):
And I have really had to check my attitude
a lot of times and say, "Holdon, what is the most important
here? Is it this stupid pagethat I'm writing or my son?"
Well, it's just because yourexpectation was one way and
then it got taken another way,but man, there's probably
nothing on earth that revealsyour own selfishness to you as
(14:17):
much as becoming a parent.
Becoming a wife or a husbandcertainly does that to a
certain extent, but even with awife or a husband, they're
usually respectful of some ofyour free time - giving you
time to work on your process,because if for nothing else
that they want their own freetime as well. But you know,
(14:41):
kids - when they need you, theyjust need you. So I think
certainly God has designed allthese seasons in life to teach
us so much about himself. AndI'll just say on a personal
note as well, if TerrenceMalick ever said, "Can you just
drop everything and work onthis movie with me?" I would be
very tempted to say yes aswell. It will never happen for
(15:04):
me, but it happened for you. Icould understand why that seems
like a pretty great opportunity. So you and your wife, Valerie
have worked together a lot onyour music over the years, as I
was mentioning in theintroduction. I suspect that
would be easier for somemarried couples than others. So
how did the two of you makeyour collaboration work?
Jon Guerra (15:28):
So we met collaborating. Somebody invited
us to play music together incollege and she was playing
violin. I was playing guitar.
And as the story goes, I askedher if she would like to work
on some of my songs and it waskind of a ploy to just be able
to get some alone time withher. I didn't have the courage
(15:49):
to just outright say, "Will yougo out with me?" So I had the
little sneak attack of workingon music. I also did want to
work on music, cause she'sactually an incredible musician
- still is. And so I think ourrelationship from day one was
always kind of working onthings together, and then we
were in bands and then we didlong distance, which felt like
(16:09):
a kind of collaboration ofschedules and - like right
before we got married. Andyeah, I don't know. That piece
- I'm grateful it's never beentoo difficult. I think we're
both - we both really enjoy, Iguess, projects and working on
things long-term, and we bothenjoyed being very scrappy and
(16:33):
working through the night toget something done and there's
never one pulling the otheralong and being like, "Oh, we
gotta..." You know, we're bothjust kind of - we just enjoy, I
guess, being scrappy and maybeeven a little entrepreneurial,
so that feels like a gift tous. And probably the biggest
collaboration is obviouslyWinslow our daughter at this
(16:54):
point, and it's wild how manythings carry over from -
whether collaborating on atour, on a concert, on an
album, on movie. It feels very,very sweet to feel like we have
a partner in each other.
Amy Mantravadi (17:15):
Well, I mean, I'm so glad that that's been
able to work because it'sproduced such great fruit, and
as you say, has now produced adaughter as well. But
certainly, I'm sure - I try tosay , "What would it be like if
my husband and I were doing thesame job together?" And I think
on a certain level, I'm sure wecould make it work because we
(17:37):
just know each other so well,and we know how to handle each
other's moods , but on anotherlevel I'm like, "Wow, I don't
know if we could make thatwork." But I don't know. Maybe
we'll see if God ever gives usa chance to investigate if that
works or not. I think for nowwe'll stick to our separate
spheres . Your song "Citizens,"which is the theme song of this
(18:01):
podcast, addresses the issue ofimmigration by comparing it to
the way that Christ invites usinto his kingdom and makes us
citizens of it. In addition tothis broader message, it's
clear that you're alsocommunicating something about
how Christians should engagepolitically. Could you talk
about what inspired you towrite this song and what you
(18:22):
hope to communicate through it?
Jon Guerra (18:25):
Yeah. So what inspired the song really was -
it was a feeling. So all of mysongs typically start with like
a state of mind or a state ofheart that I then try to figure
out through my songs. Very fewof them start with, "This is
what I want to communicate.
This is my thesis," and then Igo. It's very much letting the
(18:45):
song tell me what it wants tobe and sort of guiding it
through the grid of, "Does thislyric that I just wrote or does
this melody with this lyricseem, I guess, consistent with
the experience that I'm havingas a person with regards to
this issue or this experience?"With that song in particular,
it was a period of years (19:07):
I would say probably 2015 through
2017. And this had been comingto a head for awhile where it
felt as though politicalallegiance was beginning to
usurp, I guess, allegiance toChrist, or at least it seemed
to me that in our churches andI - around that time, I was
(19:32):
touring quite a bit. I'dprobably sing a hundred
evangelical churches a year ,for a couple of years at a
time. And I was noticing justsometimes, very explicitly,
like from the stage orwhatever, but mostly in
conversations with peopleeither after the concert or
before the concert or just outto eat, anytime politics would
(19:55):
come up, there was just thistinge of what seemed to me like
self-righteous vitriol or ahatred towards anybody that was
really disagreeing or anybodythat was Democrat. It felt
like, "What's going on here?"Like at first, you know, it's
kind of funny. Somebody says alittle jab comment, but after a
while , it's like, every timepolitics comes up, it's just
(20:16):
like this other thing takesover. And it's like, how do we
feel justified in having thisposture towards our - even if
these people are our enemies,let's say best case scenario,
these are our enemies. Where inthe world do we find the
backing to - self justificationto feel much less act this way
(20:42):
towards people that arepolitically different than us.
And oftentimes it was throughthe guise of, "Well, Western
civilization is at stake." Youknow, it was through the guise
of, "Well, if we don't do this,we don't make these alliances,
if we don't then the country'sgoing to hell in a hand
basket," or it was just thesevery, very lofty ideals and
(21:03):
these really - it was moral. Irealized that a lot of people
were saying this is a moralissue. Therefore, morally I'm
obligated to make theseallegiances and make and take
this kind of stance and takethis posture. You know, it got
to the point where friends -close friends, people that I
probably would have had in mywedding had I known them when I
got married, fellow worshipleaders, pastors at my church -
(21:27):
were just outright getting kindof behind what felt like a
nationalistic Christian -Christian nationalism is being
thrown around a lot right now,but the themes of that have
been growing for the pastseveral years. And I just felt
it when I felt my friends, notreally seeing or not really , I
(21:51):
guess, having any issue withthis kind of discourse or this
kind of political engagement. Ijust - I got really sad. I got
really kind of troubled andangry, but underneath that, it
was like, "I thought we wereall - we all grew up together.
Didn't we all agree this issecondary? That this is
actually secondary to anotherkingdom - that we're on the
(22:14):
same page here. And I was goingto d church at the time, and my
pastor joined Donald Trump'sevangelical council of pastors,
so he was a pretty prominentleader at the time. He's no
longer in ministry , my formerpastor. And that was kind of
like, "Wait, what's going onhere?" Take all that and then
(22:35):
combine it with , my wife is asocial worker and we
collaborate a lot, like we justtalked about, but something
that we don't collaborate in isshe spent almost a decade
working with refugees inChicago and working with inner
city schools and starting musicgroups for refugee victims of
trauma in Chicago. And when youwork with people in that
(22:59):
socioeconomic spot in ourcountry, you get rewired a
little bit, and you can'treally tolerate the blanket
characterizations of people inthat spot in life. You can't
really tolerate that. And whenyou feel that one candidate or
(23:19):
one kind of perspectivestereotypically kind of
characterizes people in thatspot and that way, it just
becomes very distasteful. Sothat was kind of everything
that was going on around thetime, and it all kind of
bubbled up in prayer in Januaryof 2017. And my process as a
(23:40):
writer and as a songwriter, Ifeel called to make art for God
and to God . So I feel lesscalled to kind of call
Christians out or to bepreacher or shake people by the
collar. I feel more called tovicariously experience the
world and my faith, and thenbring that experience back to
God in a way that hopefullyother Christians can join in,
(24:01):
with and through. And I justcall that devotional music. I
call my songs devotional songsfor that reason. So this was
kind of like the first time I'dever brought those questions
and those feelings and thatconfusion and that anger and
that sadness, and that reallyhonest, "I'm just confused here
(24:21):
because I - Am I wrong? I'mhappy to be wrong, but just
please God, help me understandwhat's happening here when it
feels like the embassy ofheaven, which is the Church, is
somehow no longer the embassyof heaven: it feels like it's
the embassy for somethingelse." And I guess I use that
analogy because I - first ofall, that's just kind of what
(24:41):
came out naturally and I alwaystry to pay attention to what
sort of comes from thesubconscious, but I kind of
wanted it to be a little bit ofa transgressive rendering. The
parables in their own day andage in their own context were
pretty transgressive. They werepretty culturally transgressive
in terms of what Christ wasencouraging people to consider
(25:04):
both about him and about God.
And it it felt appropriate, sothat's where that song kind of
came from.
Amy Mantravadi (25:12):
Well, thanks for sharing a lot of the
background about that, and I'lljust share with you a little
bit about why I chose that songto be the theme of this
podcast, just besides the factthat I liked the idea of using
something for your music , bothbecause I know you and I really
love your music, and also justthe - even apart from the
(25:33):
words, the musical line in thatsong works so well as a little
brief snippet into the podcast,but I have been going on a
similar journey over the pastfew years. And you know, this
is called the (A)Millennialpodcast, and I think that a lot
of Christians of the millennialgeneration are going through
(25:55):
the same circumstance of beingraised in evangelicalism and a
certain culture that in manyways has also been linked to a
certain set of politicalvalues, many of which I haven't
rejected. And just for example, a lot of aspects of the
pro-life movement (26:21):
I still consider myself very much
pro-life, so because of that,there are certain elements of
the progressive politicalagenda that are just kind of
anathema to me for that reason.
But at the same time, seeingreally troubling things
(26:43):
happening in the otherdirection, and a lot of
hypocrisy, I think, is the bigthing. Seeing the way people
talked in the nineties, versushow they're talking now - the
same people - and seeing, yeah,people you grow up with, the
kinds of things they're postingon social media, crazy
(27:03):
conspiracy theories and stuffthat seems to show not a lot of
trust in God's sovereignty andseems to suggest an allegiance
more to the kingdom of thisworld than the kingdom of God.
And while not in any wayputting myself forward as a
(27:24):
supreme example ofrighteousness, because it's
possible to get veryself-righteous in the other
direction as well - You know,feeling self-righteous in
comparison to the"self-righteous people." I feel
that in general, if Christiansever start feeling too at home
in any one political locationor with any one political
(27:45):
party, something maybe is wrongbecause our ultimate longing
and desires should be for aperfect king, who is Jesus
Christ, and no human being isever gonna be able to fill
those shoes, so we should beable to pick out flaws and
places where human beings arecoming up short, and that
(28:09):
doesn't mean we're beingcynical or hypercritical . It
just means that we realize thatno human being can fill the
shoes of Jesus Christ. So weneed to be careful and remember
what the Bible says to put notour faith in princes. So I
appreciate what - your song,because it was clear that you
were wrestling with a lot ofthese things, and like you, I
(28:30):
don't have any perfect answersat this point. And yeah,
sometimes I wonder if I'm wrongor I hope that I'm wrong.
Events have not reallysuggested to me that I'm wrong
on many occasions in thisregard , especially recent
events . So I appreciate youtalking about that, and I think
it does - so many people I'vetalked to who are of this
(28:54):
generation are feeling the sameway, very confused by wanting
to carry on that way of - aChristian way of thinking about
politics, but being concernedabout maybe a wider variety of
issues, or at least not wantingto so demonize the other side
that we can't even have aconversation anymore. So yeah,
(29:16):
I really appreciate that.
Moving on , you've beeninvolved in performing music in
several different settings (29:22):
for Sunday worship gatherings and
performance with otherChristian artists, in
completely secular settings,and then recording for private
listening. How does yourmindset shift when you're
performing in those differentcircumstances, particularly
Christian versus secular orwhen you're performing actually
(29:43):
in a worship service versus ina concert or something along
those lines?
Jon Guerra (29:49):
Yeah, no, that's a good question. It shifts quite
a bit. All of those are - well,some people have two mindsets.
Some people say, "You just doyour thing. Doesn't matter
who's in the crowd." I'm alittle bit more - I guess I
feel that my job is to kind offacilitate connection, at least
generally Sunday morningworship maybe . Well, maybe
it's a version of that: facilitating a connection with (30:11):
undefined
God between all the people. Youknow, a passion of mine and
hope of mine is that my musicwould be palatable to the
degree that it makes sense tobe palatable without losing its
with its essence. It would bepalatable to people who don't
(30:33):
share my beliefs or share myfaith. And by that, I mean 0 I
guess I try to be as sincereand sincerely devoted to God in
a way without usingChristianese for instance, or
without appealing to the lowestcommon denominator ways of
(30:53):
connecting with a crowd, makingsome kind of Bible joke or some
Awana joke (30:58):
something that would be very nichey. Made that
mistake, I think a few timesearly on, and then I found out
that there was people in thecrowd that had come to our
concert from - who'd heard usfrom Praytell, which is kind of
our main, our kind of oursecular band that got us - our
non-Christian devotional music.
(31:19):
Somebody had heard us at a cluband then come and seen us at a
church because they heard wewere coming back to town and I
kind of code switched a littlebit. And they were in town and
something in my spirit feltlike, "Man, did I say something
that maybe I wouldn't have saidat a different context?" And I
(31:41):
don't think I necessarily did .
I didn't regret - I didn't sayanything that I think I need to
do feel bad about, but it wasmore like I should really just
try to find that middle groundas much as I can to try to
speak to everyone that I knowis going to be listening. But
you know, naturally thatchanges when I'm - as a worship
leader, I feel very much likemy job is to kind of bring a
(32:04):
little bit of the aesthetic,emotional timbre to the
liturgy, whatever that liturgyis. I go to a little bit more
of a liturgical church now herein Austin, a PCA church, and
everything is in service of theliturgy really, and the sermon
and it's beautiful. I reallyenjoy it. Obviously when I'm in
(32:26):
a club or a non-Christianvenue, I will try to just be in
that setting what I'm supposedto be, which is entertaining
and sincere. And people come upto me afterwards, they often do
and say, "Hey, that song yousang called 'Stained Glass
Windows,' tell me more aboutthat." And I remember chatting
(32:46):
with a girl who was very -she'd had several drinks by the
time she was talking to me inSan Francisco about 'Stained
Glass Windows' and how muchthat song meant to her, and she
didn't know why. And it wasjust - it was awesome. I felt
very much like, "This isbeautiful. This is what it's
about."
Amy Mantravadi (33:05):
Are there any Christian figures who have
particularly influenced you inyour spiritual life or books
and music that have beenespecially inspirational for
you?
Jon Guerra (33:16):
Yeah, I would say poets actually influence me
more than musicians orsongwriters. Practically, I
love old sixties folk likeDylan, Simon and Garfunkel. I
love wordy folk music, but interms of spiritual and artistic
influence, George Herbert, the17th century priest and poet
(33:38):
from England - he has a book ofpoetry called The Temple, which
I've read cover to cover atleast dozens of times. I mean,
I don't go a week withoutreading it, at least a poem,
and the style can be a hairclunky. You just kind of have
to click into that style alittle bit. He's a contemporary
(33:58):
of John Donne and it's justastounding, both ideas wise,
structurally the way he playswith the English language. But
he was a pastor and he wrotehis poems I guess when he
wasn't doing pastoral thingsand he died before any of his
poems were published, and he'sone of the most revered poets
(34:23):
in the English language now.
And something about him workingon his poems to God, this
masterwork of English poetry,in absolute obscurity and then
dying before they're publishedis a very beautiful story to
me, and then seeing thevibrancy and just absolute
(34:43):
burning with the love of God.
Yeah. It's enormouslyinspirational to me. So I had
to pick one, I would say,George Herbert.
Amy Mantravadi (34:50):
Well, thank you for that recommendation. I'm
going to have to go out andread some of his poems and
yeah, that's a good point Ithink, about - maybe even a
good American example would besomeone like Emily Dickinson
who was virtually unknownduring her life, and then
afterwards - I mean, she wasn'tmaybe as much of a strong
Christian as George Herbertwas, but it does sort of remind
(35:16):
you that we can't always knowhow the different things we do
in our life are gonna affecteternity or affect future
generations. And sometimes wethink the things we do that get
a lot of attention are theimportant things, when actually
there are things that seem moremundane to us that actually are
(35:36):
the things God's going to use alot more long-term, so thank
you. That's interesting tohear. I always like to hear how
people have been influenced bythose who have gone before,
because knowing how Ipersonally have been influenced
in much the same way by otherwriters, you learn a lot about
people when you find out whotheir influences are. We've
(35:58):
mentioned a couple of timesthat you were recently able to
contribute some music for thefilm A Hidden Life from
director Terrence Malick. Howdid you come to be involved in
that project? You talked alittle bit about it, but maybe
you can give us a bit moreexplanation and what was it
like to work on something for afilm?
Jon Guerra (36:16):
So, like I said , it was a connection through a
dear friend of ours and wereally had no business working
on music for a movie, but theywere looking for some very
particular type of music and wewere able to kind of deliver
that for them. And really whatwe contributed mostly was
(36:37):
reductions - what were calledshadows. So like orchestral
reductions, so like largepieces by Bruckner or Bach, or
you name it (36:46):
we would take those large scale orchestra
pieces and make them smallsingle, duo, or trio violin
pieces. And the process wasbasically - it was very
iterative and experimental andjust trying a lot of things. We
(37:06):
must have recorded two and ahalf hours of music. Obviously,
not all of it made it, but theprocess of trying it and then
seeing it behind footage andthen getting feedback from
Malick and the editors was justinsanely fun. I mean, it was so
(37:27):
different for us and we wereflying to and forth from Austin
and going in to the office tosee how the music was working,
and some of it was not workingat all, and some of it was
like, "Whoa, that really bringsit to life!" So we're doing
that same thing with this newmovie and it's just - it's
mainly very, very, very fun.
Amy Mantravadi (37:49):
Well , I've seen a few of his movies and it
was a real delight to be ableto go see that one in the
theater. And first of all, Imean, it's such an incredible
film. I'd encourage anyone whohasn't seen it, if you can sit
for three hours, it's reallyworth it. I mean, his films are
(38:09):
always so contemplative and hedoesn't rush. He lets you sit
and think about things. And itseems like particularly - I'm
thinking now about the film hehad done previously, The Tree
of Life, and then with this one- in both of those, and I'm
sure in some of his otherfilms, the pieces of music that
(38:32):
he chooses to bring in, inaddition to the score - and the
score for the film was writtenby the great film composer,
James Newton Howard - but then,you know, he always brings in
as a director, he brings inclassical pieces and other
things that - It seems like hehimself has such a great
appreciation for music and isvery particular about which
(38:55):
pieces he wants to bring in tohelp tell his story. So I just
thought it was so awesome thatyou were able to work with him
because even before seeing thatfilm, I already had some
knowledge of him as a directorand the fact of how important
music was to his films. So anyclues as to the - or do I need
(39:17):
to go to IMDb to find out whatthe next movie is about?
Jon Guerra (39:22):
Totally. So the next one - right now it's
called The Last Planet, andthis is all public knowledge.
It's a film about Christ andPeter actually, so it's a
period piece about Christthrough the eyes of Peter, and
(39:44):
it's just very, verytremendous. That's all I can
say. The main editor lives veryclose to us and is a good
friend of ours, and two nightsago we got to go over and just
see a bunch of stuff that hewas working on: him and another
person from the movie and acouple of the people from the
film. We do dinner witheverybody like every Friday
(40:07):
night, and after dinner lastFriday, we went up and got to
see some footage and it's just- it's cool. It'll be a long
time though, and it'll probablybe long.
Amy Mantravadi (40:19):
That's okay. I mean, especially if you have to
wait a long time for it, youdon't want it to be only 90
minutes long.
Jon Guerra (40:27):
Yeah, totally.
Amy Mantravadi (40:27):
So I'll be looking forward to that
whenever it's coming out.
People often look to Christianmusic artists as spiritual role
models, for better or forworse. Do you think this is
fair, and what responsibilitydo Christians in the performing
arts have in this regard?
Jon Guerra (40:46):
No , I mean, I don't think it's fair
necessarily. Fair (40:47):
that's an interesting descriptor. I think
it's like a necessary evil ofjust the - We live in a really
weird time where celebrity justpermeates everything: just that
celebrity dynamic and whetherthat's, "Oh my goodness! I saw
(41:12):
The Bachelorette at Starbucks!"and you feel whatever you feel
- it's like that is just sodumb and just has nothing to do
with the things that reallymatter in life, yet it kind of
permeates everything. I thinkprobably there's a little bit
of responsibility that comeswith just being aware of that.
(41:32):
I have a good number of peoplethat listen to my music at this
point in my career andunderstanding that and seeing
that for what it is - tryingto, I guess, dismantle or I
guess reject the sort of maybedeference that I might get in
certain situations. I activelytry to kind of fight against
(41:53):
that to the best of myknowledge, and then seeing it
as a little bit of a, forbetter or for worse - it is a
responsibility that, you know,maybe there's a 14-year-old kid
like me - like I was when I was14 and the way I looked up to
my heroes or whatever - mymusical heroes, I guess. And
seeing that as a very weightything, whether it's legitimate
(42:18):
or not. When we hear aboutpeople who fall from ministry
because of some moral thing, Imean, it has ripple effects,
whether it should or not, andrealizing that to whatever
small degree, there's probablysome stranger out there that if
I were to really betray mymessage or my perceived
(42:42):
message, it would have rippleeffects in ways that I don't
even realize. And not thatthat's why I don't do certain -
I mean, hopefully I want tolive a certain way because of
what it means for God and formy immediate family and
friends, but I do take thatseriously. I do take that -
(43:02):
just because I've been hurt inthat way from people that I've
looked up to that have thendisappointed me in pretty
serious ways. But I also thinkthat listeners need to realize
that Christian artists are andperforming artists, especially
- it's a lot of entertainersout there. It's an industry and
(43:24):
people get into it because theycan make a buck. And it's not
always bad. Some people aregood at -you know, Christians
need entertainment too, Iguess. I mean, if I had it my
way, there would probably be noChristian entertainment, but
thank goodness I'm not incharge. But just people to
realize that we are, I guess,not always as pure as we'd like
(43:50):
to be, I suppose, but I dothink there is a responsibility
whether or not it's - we allhave influence, I guess, and I
think influence is aresponsibility, however, small.
Amy Mantravadi (44:03):
Yeah. I really appreciate that answer because
I think that the issue goes twoways. There's an importance for
those who are in any kind ofposition of spiritual influence
and, for better or for worse,the Christian musician or a
Christian writer or a famouspastor - You do have some of
that influence. So there's aresponsibility to live up to
(44:25):
the values that you're pushing,but on the other side, people
also need to understand thatwe're not to put people on this
kind of pedestal where we thinkof them no longer as - well,
okay, like I was talking aboutearlier with politicians and -
no longer as fallible humanbeings, but as some kind of
superhero or something. We needto realize that. And I think
(44:50):
it's clear in a lot of yourmusic that you're a person
who's asking a lot of thesespiritual questions, just the
same as everybody else. And thepoint of the artist is not to
give people an example of howto be perfect, but maybe to
teach people how to questionwell, to invite people, to come
alongside them in the spiritualjourney, and I think that your
(45:11):
music does a really good job ofthat. But it's something that I
would be curious to ask anyChristian artists , just
because I think there is a lotof pressure from people's
expectations, and then you dosee famous - you'll hear about
some Christian artist from youryouth who now says they're not
a Christian anymore, and itreally shakes people. They're
(45:33):
like, "Oh, is any if that realif so and so..." And it's like,
"Well, what were you thinking?
I mean, this person was a20-year-old, basically a kid
when you were listening to themget up there and p lays the
drums. They never claimed to bea theologian on par with
Augustine." But I thinkpeople's expectations can be
(45:54):
kind of crazy, and like yousaid, our obsession with
celebrity probably doesn't helpat all either. So just to wrap
things up, you've shared alittle bit about what we can
expect from you in the futurewith the movie that you're
working on. Is there anythingelse that you have in the
works? What are you hoping forwhen hopefully someday COVID
will be over, or what are youhoping to do then?
Jon Guerra (46:17):
Yeah. Well, hoping to tour again. There's a
connection that happens whenyou release an album and then
you play that new album live infront of people that have been
listening to it. There's areally cool connection that
happens, and I've kind of beenmissing that. So I'm looking
forward to that, hopefullypost-COVID. And even before
that, I do foresee in the nearfuture releasing more music, so
(46:43):
that my last - Keeper of Days,there was five years in between
albums. I'm not going to takeanother five years: I know that
for sure. I might release -whether it's another album -
probably not another album, butat least another set of songs
in 2021 - this year. So I'mjust in a good rhythm here.
Writing wise, my mornings arevery sacred, I'm home, and a
(47:05):
lot that's coming out.
Amy Mantravadi (47:10):
Well, that's good. We have something to look
forward to in 2021. Anything wecan look forward to and
encourage us right now is agood thing. Well, Jon, thank
you so much for taking the timeto talk with me, and I hope our
discussion is a blessing to alot of people. Yeah, I hope so
too.
Jon Guerra (47:26):
[MUSIC PLAYS] I need to know there is justice,
that it will roll in abundance,and that you're building a city
where we arrive as immigrantsand you call us citizens and
you welcome us as childrenhome. [MUSIC ENDS]
Amy Mantravadi (47:55):
It was a real pleasure to speak with John.
His latest effort, Keeper ofDays, is available for digital
streaming of both the audio andvisual album. You can also
visit the site,jonguerramusic.com for tour
dates, merchandise, and otherinformation. Of course, we all
look forward to the end of theCOVID pandemic when we can
actually go to concerts again.
"The spirit and the bride say,'Come!' And let the one who
(48:18):
hears say, 'Come! And let onewho is thirsty, come. Let the
one who desires take the waterof life without cost. He who
testifies to these things says,'Yes, I am coming quickly.'
Amen. Come Lord Jesus. Thegrace of the Lord Jesus be with
all." Amen. Have a great week.
Jon Guerra (48:39):
[MUSIC PLAYS] Is there a way to live always
living in enemy hallways? Don'tknow my foes from my friends
and don't know my friendsanymore. Power has several
prizes. Handcuffs can come inall sizes. Love has a million
disguises, but winning issimply not one . [MUSIC ENDS]
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