May 11, 2025 • 32 mins
Company: Faceted Media
Guests: Kimberly Hogate
Year Started: 2000
Employees: 25-50
What if losing everything was exactly what you needed to build something better? In this episode, Kimberly Hogate, founder of Faceted Media, shares the raw truth about starting over after being fired from the law firm she helped built from the ground up and how that moment became the catalyst for a 10+ year agency journey.
She opens up about the realities of burnout, boundary-setting, and building a business with emotional resilience. If you’ve ever felt stretched thin or undervalued, this conversation is for you.
Inside This Episode:
- Why being fired from her own business became the best thing for her career
- How a pineapple became the most unexpected branding story
- Simple ways to set boundaries
- Why emotional clarity is just as important as strategy
- How she created “Business Therapy” to meet a real client need
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
Welcome to An Agency Storypodcast where we share real
stories of marketing agencyowners from around the world.
From the excitement of startingup the first big sale, passion,
doubt, fear, freedom, and theemotional rollercoaster of
growth, hear it all on An AgencyStory podcast.
(00:24):
An Agency Story podcast ishosted by Russel Dubree,
successful agency owner with aneight figure exit turned
business coach.
Enjoy the next agency story.
Russel (00:41):
What if the best thing that ever happened to your
career was getting fired fromyour own company?
Welcome to an agency storypodcast.
I'm your host Russel.
In today's episode, we hear fromKimberly Holgate, founder of
Faceted Media, whoseentrepreneurial path includes
everything from paralegal work,starting a law practice to
building a business thatsurvived over a decade in the
(01:01):
ever-shifting world ofmarketing.
We dive into the emotional sideof entrepreneurship such as
burnout, boundaries, and thebravery it takes to start over.
Kimberly's story is a reminderthat resilience often begins at
rock bottom, and that claritycomes from hard earned
experience.
Plus you'll hear something asquirky as a pineapple can turn
into a brand defining metaphorand Kimberly introduces her
(01:22):
concept of business therapy aone of a kind mix of empathy,
problem solving, and hands-onmarketing support.
Enjoy the story.
Welcome to the show today,everyone.
I have Kimberly Hogate withFaceted Media with us here
today.
Thank you so much for joining uson the show today, Kimberly.
Kimberly (01:39):
Thank you so much, Russel.
It's a pleasure to be here.
Russel (01:41):
I'm excited to have you.
If you don't mind, start us off,what does Faceted Media do and
who do you do it for?
Kimberly (01:46):
The name came to me very late at night.
It clicked, Faceted Media,multifaceted without the multi,
but the idea is that weliterally do a little of
everything.
The idea came from wanting tostart my own business as well,
and knowing each of the piecesneeded to get there, knowing
that not one part is gonna leadyou with kind of little pieces
(02:06):
of the whole.
My sweet spot, the people that Ilove to work with are people who
are just starting out on theirbusiness journey, so I like to
give them everything that theyneed to succeed.
I will tell you that we've beenaround for over 10 years and a
lot of our clients are honestlyworking on their second, third,
even fourth businesses for someof them.
So it's a tried and true processand yeah, we just give'em a
(02:28):
little of everything that theywant.
Russel (02:29):
New businesses certainly need the Swiss Army knife.
That's, uh, good that you've,you're meeting the needs of your
ideal client.
I definitely wanna hear moreabout how you go about that.
But before we get there, let'sgo back in the time machine, and
I'm curious where young Kimberlythought her life was going and
how closely did we end up there?
Kimberly (02:49):
Not too far from what I thought.
It's just that, to be honest,and you might know about this,
Russel, our jobs weren't really,um, in existence.
When we were in school, whenyou're given that sheet of
paper, it's like, check the boxof, you know, what you wanna go
to school for, what do you wannabe when you grow up?
It just really wasn't a thing,you know?
Obviously print was, um, moreprominent, but also I think
(03:11):
corporate marketing was justmore of the standard.
It wasn't as possible, I think,for individuals to start their
own businesses back then.
But as far as how it all cametogether, uh, my dad was a
journalist.
I always wanted to be injournalism.
Writing, creating, puttingtogether a story completely
makes sense.
When I was a kid, I had a LittleTykes tape recorder, and I would
(03:31):
go around to my neighbors andrecorded my first podcast, you
know, before that's a thing.
I also started a newspaper in myfourth grade class.
It had a gossip column, so itwas banned after the first
episode drop, you know, issuedrop.
I got in trouble for that one.
Same thing with editing our homevideos.
Growing up, I, I kind of got thehighlight reel set up before
(03:52):
that was a thought, you know?
But I ended up going to schoolfor journalism.
I got my degree in broadcastjournalism and then I decided,
'cause still marketing, this jobreally wasn't even a thing then.
When I graduated in 2006 fromcollege, we were still just
getting smartphones andconsuming information so I
really thought, I went to schoolfor no reason.
I thought journalism was goingto be dead.
(04:13):
And so My next best choice wasactually law school.
I went to law school to try to,um, I wanted to help people.
I wanted to hear their storiesand writing was a big part of
it.
But I will tell you that I endedup going a totally different
direction and moving to Coloradoand I didn't pursue the law
degree.
I was lost for a long time, tobe honest.
But eventually I just realizedthat some of those skills from
(04:34):
way back when, when I was a kid,really were relevant now.
I just pieced it all together.
I built my first website basedon what I learned online and
everything else I just taughtmyself and put it into practice
until I was able to start my ownagency.
Russel (04:46):
You said building your own website.
Were you building your ownwebsite with the anticipation of
doing marketing services or wereyou doing that for some other
different business?
Kimberly (04:55):
Yes, when I left law school, I started law school
when I was 21, um,'cause Igraduated college a year early.
I was this go-getter, you know?
But by the time 2008 camearound, we had a recession, we
had a crash, and I really feltthat as a college, new college
graduate, it was a really toughtime to get a job.
I ended up still following thelegal path and I became a
(05:15):
paralegal.
While I was working for my boss,an attorney and financial
manager, he wanted to startdoing these lunch and learns and
get people in to update theirdocuments.
Just basically build morebusiness.
My thought was, hey, if I canget some people in can I
negotiate a commission off ofany new business that I create?
(05:36):
That involved making thewebsite, hosting these lunch and
learns, some cold calling, somewarm calling, all of that stuff.
That's where I got myconfidence.
I was like, you know, if I cando this for him I can do this
for anyone.
Russel (05:47):
Pretty savvy approach.
We're taking a paralegal job andworking it into essentially a,
a, a, really a performancemarketing role.
That's amazing.
It definitely seems like you'reon the path and should be an
entrepreneur.
So yeah, You talked about whatwas actually starting the
agency, how did you get tothere?
Kimberly (06:04):
Actually, going back to the financial attorney that I
was working with, he, he turneddown a raise after a few years
and, um, I something clicked inmy head where I was like, you
know what?
I'm done asking someone elsewhat I should get paid.
It's been said before, it's ameme I think, but entrepreneurs
are willing to work 80 hours aweek instead of someone telling
(06:25):
them when and where to work 40.
So I was definitely in thatmindset where I just wanted to
be my own boss.
I didn't care what it took.
I was just tired of thatexperience of like, here's
everything I've done.
I've done so much.
I've made you tons of extramoney.
I've done a excellent job butjust having someone decide that,
what my future was Anyway, so Iactually partnered up with
another attorney in the office.
(06:46):
Going back to the law schoolstuff, this makes me think that
no path was a failure becausehad I gotten the law degree, I
might still be in Chicago, Imight be dissatisfied with my
work, et cetera.
I did stay in the legal fieldbut this weird way.
Long story short, myself and theattorney left that office and
started our own law firm.
It was a boutique law firm in areally fancy part of town for
(07:06):
wealthy families to do trustsand estate planning.
We started together.
We left there.
We had to have a little bit ofgap in between because of
contracts and things like that.
I was working on my own,building up the business until
she was ready to join me.
Once we started the law firm, wewere there for about three
years, and then we sold the lawfirm, and it's actually still in
existence today.
But the new partner didn't haveme in the plan, so I got fired
(07:32):
from the business I started.
Russel (07:33):
That had to be tough, I imagine.
Kimberly (07:35):
I started off as a, I was a co-founder and the
director of client services, andso I think it was a financial
decision to just start oversomewhere on a lower pay for
someone fresh, you know, and newowner, et cetera.
But was I expecting that?
No, I started this thing, youknow.
Lots of tears.
I really thought that the lawfirm was gonna be my
(07:55):
entrepreneur experience.
I thought that was the end ofthe road.
I was like, oh, you know, Ididn't finish in law school.
I did all this stuff in myparalegal journey.
I've started a law firm, it'swell known, and everything was
going great, and then got fired.
So I had to go back to thebasics and I had to just to
make, make ends meet.
I had to nanny, I was aphotographer, I did blogging and
(08:19):
different things.
So It took like about six monthsor so to really get going.
But then, like I said, that wasover 10 years ago and getting
fired was the best, one of thebest things that ever happened.
Russel (08:30):
You know, it, it's funny.
I mean obviously that was a verytough situation for you, but I,
I do sometimes encourage thiswhen folks I work with that,
hey, sometimes firing someone,if, again, not saying anything
about your circumstances, but ifthey're not being successful in
your mind as an owner, thatfiring someone could set them on
a path that could be verybeneficial for their life.
But sounds like it turned outthat way in your case, but sorry
(08:52):
you had to go through that toget to where you are.
You've paid your tuition to theschool of hard knocks, it sounds
like.
Kimberly (08:57):
MRR what's saved my business.
My pitfalls were month to monthat the beginning or project
based things.
Now I'm able to interweave a lotof different services and
products and stuff.
I have a variety of offerings,but when I very first started,
my consistency, my incomeconsistency was really tough.
It was only until I starteddoing six months to start
(09:19):
retainers, um, and monthly,monthly billing monthly that I
started to really get a leg up.
It was just very up and down.
I would say that was one of thetrickiest things in the
beginning.
Client boundaries.
That one was always hard for me.
When I first, first started, Iwas in a sort of a service
mindset as well, because I was aparalegal, I was a secretary,
and that's the job.
What can I do for you?
(09:39):
And always up myself.
Having that sort of likesecretary service mindset was a
bit of a disadvantage to mebecause people took advantage of
me.
Not knowing.
I think of it like say like backin like junior high or high
school, each teacher wouldassign you homework and by the
end of the day you have likehours and hours and hours of
homework.
I think a lot of the clientswould compound on things that
(10:02):
they had already assigned me andI wasn't brave enough to say,
okay, if we wanna add this in,we have to take this off, or
this is gonna be a lowerpriority.
Is this the priority?
Because I think especially 10years ago, people thought that
it was easier to do a lot of thestuff that we do make a graphic
or something like that.
Now, thanks to Canva and thanksto a lot of DIY entrepreneurs.
(10:24):
I think everyone knows it'shard.
I think everyone knows now it'shard, but I think back then they
thought it was easy.
I don't know if that makessense, but that's how I felt.
Russel (10:32):
No, it, it makes total sense and I think one of the
hard parts of, uh, of marketingspace because one time,
sometimes it's a lot visual too,but because people are users of
the product that they maybe havea little bit higher thoughts of
themselves that they're alsoexperts in it, but, uh, not
really understanding thescience, the effort, the skill
and experience that goes behindwhat we do.
(10:54):
I think that's a really greatinsight too, that the these DIY
tools have proven that, how hardit is, at least to do a good
job, and do I wanna be doingthis myself as well?
Maybe to that end I think somepeople were afraid that these
kind of things were gonna put usout of business or lessen
business.
But maybe to your point, maybeit's expanded it.
Kimberly (11:10):
I agree.
Someone still needs to operatethe robot, you know, and there
needs to be quality control.
If you've been using AI for alittle while, you know how many
mistakes they make.
Russel (11:18):
Yeah, I always say, for smart, as smart as AI is, it's
also extremely dumb.
Kimberly (11:23):
Yes, very true.
Russel (11:25):
Like maybe a lot of tools.
Somewhere in there, and I, Idon't even know the exact
context, but I know fruit and animportant part of your shaping
your business journey.
What's the story there?
Kimberly (11:36):
Yes.
Oh my goodness.
Back to the financial attorneywho was a pivotal person, who
actually is a client still tothis day.
He kept in good contact and, uh,he would never know how
frustrated it was at thatsituation because relationships
are really important to me.
We actually kept ourrelationship for 10 years after
that, believe it or not.
Besides the fact, well, when Itold you about the raise, I
(11:58):
asked for the raise and hebasically said no.
What I did get that day was apineapple from the farmer's
market.
That's what they brought me in.
Russel (12:04):
That was like a gift?
Kimberly (12:05):
They thought about my proposal over the weekend.
On Monday they said no, and theyhad a pineapple and that was my
gift.
Russel (12:11):
That might be a little tone deaf.
Kimberly (12:12):
Oh very.
I don't know if my boss had everbeen in my position before.
I think to be an entrepreneur,you have to be a little scrappy.
We've been in situations wherewe had to make something outta
nothing and not that many peoplehave been in that situation I
think he just didn't fullyunderstand, um, what it was like
to try to get by.
It was really, really hard.
Like really hard.
But yeah, the pineapple.
(12:33):
After that, uh, when we went tostart the law firm, I think I
told you in our call, buteverything was pineapple.
Pineapple rug.
Someone brought a pineapple toour grand opening.
And to this day, I have usedthat as a story builder.
I told you before, when I did mytalks to the Denver Public
Schools, I was the pineapplelady.
I would tell all the kids thestory and just encourage them to
(12:55):
let them know that there'sactually another path then the
ones that are set out in frontof you and that's the one that
you can make yourself.
Russel (13:01):
I want to come back to that because I, I think that's a
really great part of your storythere.
I'm just curious, have youmaintained this pineapple
branding element in yourbusiness, or did that go away?
Kimberly (13:10):
It's totally a story that I use over and over again.
It's definitely relatable andactually the, the kids, uh, that
I would go speak to, theteachers would always have them
write a thank you noteafterwards and they would mail
them to me and I would get a bigpackage of the thank you notes
and on my website, um, it'scalled the Pineapple Story, at
the very end is a picture that akid drew of a pineapple and said
(13:31):
like, thank you so much.
It was really inspiring.
Russel (13:33):
Oh, that's cool.
Again, sour gifts has been veryinstrumental, pivotal and
probably inspirational to manypeople, uh, beyond even what you
were able to turn that into.
That's a wonderful story.
I wanna go back to what you werespeaking to, and I think a lot
of folks run into this eventoday.
Just as much as they were in thepast of setting boundaries.
How did you eventually overcomethat?
(13:54):
Or did you?
Kimberly (13:54):
Well.
I don't know.
I mean, I'm a human, right?
So a few times when peoplewould, I would bend over
backwards and then I'd get a,like a personal, I would give
people my personal phone.
Clients, sometimes everything'sgoing fine whatever happens in,
in their brain or whatever, likethey start thinking they can
like, text me on like Saturdaymorning and like Sunday evening
(14:15):
and like, stuff like that.
Honestly, when I first wasdealing with this, I, I would
get mad.
I would try to contain it asmuch as possible to the client,
um, but I don't think I was verygood at explaining the
boundaries.
What I had to do is actuallystart back at the beginning and
do a pre-sign document.
That has been a huge thing forme.
I just did a post about it.
It a document that's alongsideyour official contract that is
(14:38):
basically a code of conduct.
It says basic stuff for me.
It says, please don't have ameeting while you're driving in
the car.
People used to do that it's likeone, like I gotta show you some
stuff on the computer And two,I'm worried about your safety.
Maybe I should switch those.
Stuff like that.
Or, like one time I was buildinga website and without like
checking with me, the client hadheld a huge seminar to look at
(15:00):
the website, but it was notready.
I have like, text me only forgood things.
The rest please use email.
Please don't text on weekendsstuff like that.
I think that the pre-signdocument, and I call, I call it
like the golden rules of workingwith Faceted Media.
It's not when they sign, but inthe contract it set, they have
to initial that they've read it.
That also saves me liabilitywise.
(15:20):
Sort of a cover your butt, youknow, kind of thing, because
they initialed that they readit, these are the rules.
When I propose it, I usuallysay, uh, you know, here's the
contract.
Easy agreement.
Go ahead and e-sign.
Here's the pre-sign document.
It's all about mutual respect.
I try to frame it as like, I'llrespect to you, you respect me.
When they read it, it's like,duh, because it's like when you
read someone's behavior things,it's, you know, most people are
(15:43):
reasonable.
They'll be like, oh, that makessense.
But if they don't have somethinglike that ahead of time and
they're just angry one day, youknow, it basically helps them
remember like, what we talkedabout before.
If you're mad about something,maybe there was a typo for gosh
sakes, you know, and it's Fridayor Saturday maybe wait till
Monday.
I think it just helps people,um, set their own standards when
they have to look at somethinglike that.
(16:04):
That's helped a lot.
Russel (16:05):
I think that's great insight of Just the notion we
have to train clients to how towork with us.
We can't just leave it up toserendipity of their own natural
ways.
If, and, and frame it in the wayof for their benefit.
Like You said, safety.
This isn't just things that Iwant them because the way I want
them, but here's why this ishelpful for you as having a rule
in place, or something alongthose lines.
(16:25):
And also sets the tone that thisis a partnership, not a
transactional, you know, to yourpoint, not an order taker
situation.
For us to do our best work,we've, we've gotta be in a
healthy, good place.
Don't beat us up unless wedeserve it or those sort of
things.
And Like you said too, Iimagine, right, it gives you
something to refer back to whenthey are, they're humans,
they're gonna make mistakes.
Now you have the thing to pointback to remember this thing we
(16:47):
agreed upon.
Thank you for, for sharing thatinsight.
Talk to me more about, I mean,I, I always love, I mean this is
again, why I love smallbusinesses and I think just
folks like yourself, right?
Just when you found a mechanismto give back and contribute to
others, I, I have to imaginethere's more than just speaking
at a school that you've foundsome ways to do that within your
business.
Kimberly (17:06):
Absolutely.
And to be honest, that was oneof the reasons that I got fired
from the law firm is that I wasreally passionate about
networking in the community.
And so I did a lot of communitydrives and like one of'em was a
big diaper drive and I collectedlike tons and tons and tons of
diapers and went and donated'em.
They thought that was dumb.
(17:26):
Like, But I'm leading all thesein community leaders and people
were passionate about kids andour law firm is for families.
How could this not be moreperfect?
Stuff like that actually they,they didn't like, but yeah, we
did a, um, a handbag stuffing,um, for folks.
Houseless folks.
We did, um, bag stuffing.
We did diaper drives.
We also had a big flood in 2013out here in Colorado.
(17:49):
It damaged a lot of thewaterways and different things
like that.
We did a river cleanup.
I also did Girls on the Run,that's like a coaching program
for girls to do a 5K.
We did that too.
We did Grace's Race.
We've done a lot of races andstuff like that.
But yeah, my main thing wasworking through Operation Hope
and I went and spoke to theschools in Denver for about
(18:10):
three years.
A lot of that, and actually gotcanceled, uh, because of Covid.
But it was actually a good timeto cancel for me.
It was tiring.
I don't know how teachers do it,especially the ones that teach
the same subject all day long.
'Cause I was so passionate aboutit.
I would volunteer for everyperiod.
I would be doing my pineapplelady spiel for seven hours, six,
seven hours over and over.
(18:31):
I saw the teacher had to do herthing over and over.
She has to do it five days aweek, so,'cause they were high
school kids.
But yeah, it was really cool.
From that I ended up startingthe internship program because I
had the same problem, uh, like Iwas telling you with the
recession, I didn't haveexperience.
In order to get experience, youneed the job, to get the job you
need experience.
I think the kids are misled inhigh school that like, it's just
gonna be an easy, like you, yougraduate to the next year and
(18:53):
then it's just the next year.
But when you are 18 and you goto the, it can be very shocking.
Even 18 to 25 I think is areally hard time in people's
most people's lives, especiallyones that I've had to do
everything themselves, which isme.
It was really valuableexperience, but um, yeah, it was
just, I don't know.
You never know where people'slives are gonna take them, but I
hope it was inspiring.
Russel (19:12):
I'm sure it was.
I I can't imagine anyone outthere that you know have
anything less than good thingsto say about someone that took
the time to invest in them andjust the mentality and the
thought process is amazing andimportant.
I don't know, I kind of heardmaybe a little bit there of, of
some burnout or kind of we mightcall overgiving, um, in that
(19:32):
sense, you know, have you inreflection, have you found a
happy medium there?
Or at least sometimes where thatcan feel like, I know I don't,
I'm sure there's someterminology for it, but this
idea that if you're, don'treally get fulfilled from it or,
or if we can at least marry itin some, some higher purpose and
value, then that we're gonnafeel better about that.
I don't know what the question'snetting out to, but just when
(19:52):
you reflect on that, thoseideas, what comes to mind?
Kimberly (19:55):
I think, you know, in a way you're hearing in my voice
like a bit of a feeling offailure, but I feel because, no,
but it, I think it is true thatwhen you are a speaker or a
motivational speaker or anythinglike that, um, you don't really
know who picked up somethingfrom it or where they go or
whatever.
But yeah, I did get to the endof the road realizing that I was
giving more than I was, um, likeI also needed to receive, to run
(20:18):
my business.
My goal was that I was gonna beteaching the interns, but they
would also be taking some timeoff my hands, but ended up
ballooning the time that I wasspending.
I feel good about that nowadays.
It's a lot more nos, um, in ahealthy way.
For example, like next week, Ihave completely blocked off and
it's a me week, a light me week.
I've had a few things come inwhere I thought to myself,
(20:40):
should I just take that?
Should I just add'em on there?
But I know it's gonna ruin mywhole day if I have a meeting
next week so I'm not gonna doit.
I'm going to use the time for mycreative writing.
Writing a book like I told youbefore.
Different things that are moreof a long-term goal.
If I don't stop and I'm alwaysserving others, and I literally
never stop, my purpose ofserving others is also gonna
(21:01):
stop at some point.
Because like you said, you'll beburnt out and sort of resentful
that you never have time foryou.
But the only person who's incharge of that is me.
Again, I have to check myself onthat servant mindset from being
a secretary.
Oh yeah, I can do it.
Oh, I can do that.
It's tempting sometimes to likebreak my own rules, but I'm not,
I'm, I'm not gonna do it.
I hate to say that I've likefully been like fully abused by
(21:21):
clients and fully abused my lifein the process to this point
where I realized like it's onlyme who's gonna be able to have
the, you know, schedule thesebreaks and things like that.
So yeah, I don't take meetingson Mondays or Fridays anymore.
Then once a quarter or so, Iwill book a whole week off
without any meetings, becausefor me, even if I have the full
day, but I have one thing atthree o'clock, I'm gonna stress
(21:44):
all day about it.
I'm not gonna get it done.
So I need multiple days.
You need to have thatrecuperation.
Out here in Colorado, I get to,so next week I've got like
hiking plans and a lot of naturestuff like just for me.
Some writing and you know, I'llstill be working, but I'm not
gonna be serving anyone exceptfor me.
Just for a week.
Russel (22:00):
There's a reason why on an airplane, they instruct you
to put your own mask on firstbefore you help others.
I think even stepping away from,for a minute, from running an
agency just to think back andrealize how important, and I did
not prioritize mental, my ownmental health wellbeing enough,
uh, just thought I could toughit out, rough it out, however
you wanna look at that.
(22:20):
I don't think I was my best selfdoing what's a hard thing?
Maybe like a lot of things,like, it sounds like you're
saying we gotta hit some rockbottom to, to really change our
ways and to be motivated, uh, tootherwise.
I'm glad, it sounds like you'vegot to a good place there.
Oh, I, and I remembered while wewere talking, there's a great
book that even talks about theconcept.
I'm pretty sure it's this rightbook of Give and Take by Adam
(22:40):
Grant that he talks about a lotof the people that give
endlessly and needlessly or, orjust infinitely, that they do
always become burnt out.
He's not advocating againstgiving, but the ones that are a
little more apt to givestrategically to kind of just,
that ultimately comes fullcircle back to themselves again.
Which it sounds like we're,you've got to, that's, that's
the givers that thrive.
I thought that was a reallyinteresting take that seems like
(23:02):
it applied in your own case.
Kimberly (23:03):
These days my giving is more of a, like donations if
I can.
As far as time, that's a biggift, like that's a really big
gift.
Russel (23:11):
Oh, huge.
Kimberly (23:12):
But, you know, periodically we'll do events and
stuff and we'll offer, we havelike a sliding scale for some
folks and we offer, freebusiness audit for some folks.
I still have a portion of mybusiness that I have for sliding
scale people or people thatreally want something that can't
give me what I need.
I'm able to modify it to meetthem where they're at.
(23:32):
They're still a giving aspect,but it's not all this time with
sort of nothing back.
Russel (23:37):
It's boundaries.
You've created boundaries forit, which is, what we, we have
to have to set boundaries.
Glad you got there.
Another aspect I thought wasinteresting and just, uh, you
know, I think you called itbusiness therapy.
I dunno if I'm getting thatquite right, but, but you've got
a, a, a coaching practice andelement to your business, and I
found very intriguing.
How did you arrive at it?
What does that look like in yourbusiness?
Kimberly (23:56):
Oh gosh, if you're like me and I am pretty sure you
probably are, I'm sure you havelike 2, 3, 4 businesses or
business ideas in your pocket.
Business therapy is somethingthat I've thought about for a
long time.
Going back to all the, the beatdowns from the clients, to be
honest.
I wanted someone to be able tocry and talk to, and actually
there was a few coaches thatwere helpful in that way.
(24:18):
I never did coaching beforeuntil a few years ago, and,
sometimes I would just bla andbla and bla just to get a
response that said, Kimberly,you're doing the right things.
You're right where you need tobe.
That, to me, was worth payinglike the$500 for the hour or
whatever that I did at thatmoment.
'Cause it actually did change mytrajectory.
I actually wanted to offer thatback.
It's similarly priced.
It's like right now I have it onsale for 375 for 75 minutes.
(24:42):
Then they get a follow up andeverything, it's like you said,
uh, before that, we're payingfor not just the time for time
service of things, the time fortime trade.
We're paying for these 10 yearsof, sleepless nights at times.
Reading books and books andbooks and books and books.
Taking classes, classes,classes, classes.
Business therapy is like if youwanted to talk to someone to
make sure you're doing the rightthings, solve problems that are
(25:04):
stressing you out.
For example, the pre-signagreement, making sure someone's
on the same level.
I have all these ideas that canhelp people right away to fix
either like emotional pain intheir business or increase
financials.
It's a mix of that because myspecialty is lead generation,
traffic generation.
Search engine optimization, justmaking things work.
Business therapy is just one offsessions, again, to counteract
(25:28):
the anti trend against, uh, mul,uh, monthly recurring revenue as
well, so that people can have anoption to just do a one-time
thing if they want a DIY.
As much as you DIY, you stillend up with a list of like, I
don't know how to do this.
That's where we can do that andcrush it.
If I had someone that I couldcall back in the day to figure
out how to add tracking tags or,you know, just basic stuff or
(25:51):
interpret my analytics, that Icould talk to, that was a human,
I would've, I would still go forthat.
I don't know anyone, um, in myworld that does something like
that.
That's why I call it businesstherapy.
It's like a place to cry, getsupport, um, but also fix some
tech stuff and just getactionable steps.
Russel (26:09):
I love it.
I think that's intentionally, oreven accidentally, so many
agencies have had to move somedirection in this consultative
space with helping theirclients, right?
We've learned that just bringingpeople to the door does not
solve businesses challenges, sowe've gotta kinda dig deep in
there and, and uncover reallywhat's going on.
And then we all need a littletherapy.
(26:30):
Maybe we need more than wealways get.
You're really meeting a needthere of, of your clients and,
and like you said, hands on.
Awesome and, and obvious, andthen to your point of giving,
but also comes back and it'sanother revenue model for you.
I love how you structured that.
Very fascinating conversation.
I'm sure we did not get toeverything, but, uh, so goes any
(26:50):
podcast episode, so what are youthinking for the future of the
business?
What are you trying to createhere?
Kimberly (26:55):
Oh man, I've got so many ideas.
But basically it's expandingbusiness therapy.
The book that I'm writing I'mreally excited about.
It's all for anxiousentrepreneurs or the secondary
title is Confessions of a SmallBusiness Owner.
Just all the things that we gothrough that we feel not feeling
worthy enough having clientsstress us out different things.
(27:16):
It's just anxiety riddensometimes.
I'm excited about the bookcoming out.
That's probably like, hmm,probably still four, six weeks
away.
I've put a lot of love intothat.
That's coming out.
And then growing up the businesstherapy helping more people
start businesses.
I think people got, I don'tknow, people were really excited
about starting businesses afterCovid, but then I think people
like got scared, maybe.
(27:37):
I think that the influencerculture online contributed to
that fear because I think peoplethought that they had to be like
a TV show.
So now that that is kind offalling out a little bit, I
think that people are actuallycoming back to small business
ownership and I think a lot ofpeople are leaving their, the
corporate world again.
(27:57):
I'm just trying to be there tosupport people.
It's interesting how the phasesgo and yeah, just try to modify
based on what's going on, youknow?
I just wanna continue to keep mysailboat afloat and ride the
waves.
Russel (28:10):
It's funny, I think what you're speaking to, the idea of
entrepreneurship is not foreveryone, and whether it goes in
these waves of people trying it,uh, it's some people just can't
handle the lack of security,which is a, an amazing segue
into my next question for youis, are entrepreneurs born or
are they made?
Kimberly (28:27):
I think they're born, I think it's a born thing.
I think that if you ran thelemonade stands, which I was the
boss, I paid the money out to mypeople at the end of the
lemonade stand day.
I didn't even talk about that,but that was the thing.
You kind of have to be like anatural born leader.
I think that you have to be notafraid and, um, I don't know.
I think you're born, I hate tosay that.
(28:48):
But I think that if you are abusiness owner, I think you know
that there's no escaping this,this future.
Even if you tried.
I went through a slow time,honestly recently.
I even thought about applyingfor jobs again.
I just realized that that,that'll never be part of my
life.
I just, I can't.
I don't fit into that block.
I'll have better luck creating anew business to make money than
(29:11):
I would probably finding a joband being in that position.
My leadership level is too high.
I just gotta row my own boat,you know?
Russel (29:18):
Whether everyone is born or not, I do believe everything
you've shared that you are, wereborn, to be an entrepreneur.
That would only be fitting thatyou would have that be your
answer.
But all for very good reasons.
If people wanna know more aboutFaceted Media, where can they
go?
Kimberly (29:32):
Facetedmedia.com, so it's F-A-C-E-T-E-D media.com.
On Instagram it's faceted.media.
That's another cool place.
And then, um, Business Therapyon Instagram or
getbusinesstherapy.com.
Russel (29:45):
Get your business therapy folks.
Everyone needs more therapy intheir lives.
You have a very succinct, directURL for that.
That's awesome.
Thank you so much, Kimberly, fortaking the time to share your
story and the good points andthe bad points, and really just
sharing the journey of what it'slike to be an entrepreneur.
Just thank you so much forbringing that to the table
today.
Kimberly (30:06):
Thank you so much.
I appreciate you.
We hope you've enjoyed thisepisode of An Agency Story
podcast where we share realstories of marketing agency
owners from around the world.
Are you interested in being aguest on the show?
Send an email topodcast@performancefaction.com.
(30:27):
An Agency Story is brought toyou by Performance Faction.
Performance Faction offersservices to help agency owners
grow their business to 5 milliondollars and more in revenue.
To learn more, visitperformancefaction.com.
When I'm helping people with SEO, I find a lot of
(30:50):
times when they've DIYed, thatthey're coming up for results
that are completely off of whatthey sell.
Just this week I did an auditfor someone and they were
showing up for pans, likecooking pans because they, but
they're a chiropractor.
They are trying to write theirblog about their community,
who's into sustainability, whomight enjoy cooking with these
pans.
(31:11):
Little did they know, justposting that blog, those words
had totally dominated all oftheir searches.
They were coming up for pans.
Russel (31:18):
Points back to why businesses need professional
help, because, uh, uh, uh, youknow, I've certainly heard
interesting stories, but thatmight be more interesting in the
weird, random things that abusiness might rank for.
Kimberly (31:30):
I know.
It was validating too becauseshe had actually had another SEO
person audit her right beforeme, and so she was using me to
double check the first one tomake sure she got her money's
worth and the pans, they hadfound the pans as well, it was
validating for her.
She learned a lot.
Russel (31:49):
I think if you're having to pay a company to double check
another company, you're, you'vehired the wrong company.
Kimberly (31:54):
I know, well I gave that for free.
That was one of my gives that Iwas, that I was giving.
Russel (31:59):
Karma points or otherwise, I hope it came back
to you.
Welcome to An Agency Storypodcast where we share real
stories of marketing agencyowners from around the world.
From the excitement of startingup the first big sale, passion,
doubt, fear, freedom, and theemotional rollercoaster of
growth, hear it all on An AgencyStory podcast.
(00:24):
An Agency Story podcast ishosted by Russel Dubree,
successful agency owner with aneight figure exit turned
business coach.
Enjoy the next agency story.
Russel (00:41):
What if the best thing that ever happened to your
career was getting fired fromyour own company?
Welcome to an agency storypodcast.
I'm your host Russel.
In today's episode, we hear fromKimberly Holgate, founder of
Faceted Media, whoseentrepreneurial path includes
everything from paralegal work,starting a law practice to
building a business thatsurvived over a decade in the
(01:01):
ever-shifting world ofmarketing.
We dive into the emotional sideof entrepreneurship such as
burnout, boundaries, and thebravery it takes to start over.
Kimberly's story is a reminderthat resilience often begins at
rock bottom, and that claritycomes from hard earned
experience.
Plus you'll hear something asquirky as a pineapple can turn
into a brand defining metaphorand Kimberly introduces her
(01:22):
concept of business therapy aone of a kind mix of empathy,
problem solving, and hands-onmarketing support.
Enjoy the story.
Welcome to the show today,everyone.
I have Kimberly Hogate withFaceted Media with us here
today.
Thank you so much for joining uson the show today, Kimberly.
Kimberly (01:39):
Thank you so much, Russel.
It's a pleasure to be here.
Russel (01:41):
I'm excited to have you.
If you don't mind, start us off,what does Faceted Media do and
who do you do it for?
Kimberly (01:46):
The name came to me very late at night.
It clicked, Faceted Media,multifaceted without the multi,
but the idea is that weliterally do a little of
everything.
The idea came from wanting tostart my own business as well,
and knowing each of the piecesneeded to get there, knowing
that not one part is gonna leadyou with kind of little pieces
(02:06):
of the whole.
My sweet spot, the people that Ilove to work with are people who
are just starting out on theirbusiness journey, so I like to
give them everything that theyneed to succeed.
I will tell you that we've beenaround for over 10 years and a
lot of our clients are honestlyworking on their second, third,
even fourth businesses for someof them.
So it's a tried and true processand yeah, we just give'em a
(02:28):
little of everything that theywant.
Russel (02:29):
New businesses certainly need the Swiss Army knife.
That's, uh, good that you've,you're meeting the needs of your
ideal client.
I definitely wanna hear moreabout how you go about that.
But before we get there, let'sgo back in the time machine, and
I'm curious where young Kimberlythought her life was going and
how closely did we end up there?
Kimberly (02:49):
Not too far from what I thought.
It's just that, to be honest,and you might know about this,
Russel, our jobs weren't really,um, in existence.
When we were in school, whenyou're given that sheet of
paper, it's like, check the boxof, you know, what you wanna go
to school for, what do you wannabe when you grow up?
It just really wasn't a thing,you know?
Obviously print was, um, moreprominent, but also I think
(03:11):
corporate marketing was justmore of the standard.
It wasn't as possible, I think,for individuals to start their
own businesses back then.
But as far as how it all cametogether, uh, my dad was a
journalist.
I always wanted to be injournalism.
Writing, creating, puttingtogether a story completely
makes sense.
When I was a kid, I had a LittleTykes tape recorder, and I would
(03:31):
go around to my neighbors andrecorded my first podcast, you
know, before that's a thing.
I also started a newspaper in myfourth grade class.
It had a gossip column, so itwas banned after the first
episode drop, you know, issuedrop.
I got in trouble for that one.
Same thing with editing our homevideos.
Growing up, I, I kind of got thehighlight reel set up before
(03:52):
that was a thought, you know?
But I ended up going to schoolfor journalism.
I got my degree in broadcastjournalism and then I decided,
'cause still marketing, this jobreally wasn't even a thing then.
When I graduated in 2006 fromcollege, we were still just
getting smartphones andconsuming information so I
really thought, I went to schoolfor no reason.
I thought journalism was goingto be dead.
(04:13):
And so My next best choice wasactually law school.
I went to law school to try to,um, I wanted to help people.
I wanted to hear their storiesand writing was a big part of
it.
But I will tell you that I endedup going a totally different
direction and moving to Coloradoand I didn't pursue the law
degree.
I was lost for a long time, tobe honest.
But eventually I just realizedthat some of those skills from
(04:34):
way back when, when I was a kid,really were relevant now.
I just pieced it all together.
I built my first website basedon what I learned online and
everything else I just taughtmyself and put it into practice
until I was able to start my ownagency.
Russel (04:46):
You said building your own website.
Were you building your ownwebsite with the anticipation of
doing marketing services or wereyou doing that for some other
different business?
Kimberly (04:55):
Yes, when I left law school, I started law school
when I was 21, um,'cause Igraduated college a year early.
I was this go-getter, you know?
But by the time 2008 camearound, we had a recession, we
had a crash, and I really feltthat as a college, new college
graduate, it was a really toughtime to get a job.
I ended up still following thelegal path and I became a
(05:15):
paralegal.
While I was working for my boss,an attorney and financial
manager, he wanted to startdoing these lunch and learns and
get people in to update theirdocuments.
Just basically build morebusiness.
My thought was, hey, if I canget some people in can I
negotiate a commission off ofany new business that I create?
(05:36):
That involved making thewebsite, hosting these lunch and
learns, some cold calling, somewarm calling, all of that stuff.
That's where I got myconfidence.
I was like, you know, if I cando this for him I can do this
for anyone.
Russel (05:47):
Pretty savvy approach.
We're taking a paralegal job andworking it into essentially a,
a, a, really a performancemarketing role.
That's amazing.
It definitely seems like you'reon the path and should be an
entrepreneur.
So yeah, You talked about whatwas actually starting the
agency, how did you get tothere?
Kimberly (06:04):
Actually, going back to the financial attorney that I
was working with, he, he turneddown a raise after a few years
and, um, I something clicked inmy head where I was like, you
know what?
I'm done asking someone elsewhat I should get paid.
It's been said before, it's ameme I think, but entrepreneurs
are willing to work 80 hours aweek instead of someone telling
(06:25):
them when and where to work 40.
So I was definitely in thatmindset where I just wanted to
be my own boss.
I didn't care what it took.
I was just tired of thatexperience of like, here's
everything I've done.
I've done so much.
I've made you tons of extramoney.
I've done a excellent job butjust having someone decide that,
what my future was Anyway, so Iactually partnered up with
another attorney in the office.
(06:46):
Going back to the law schoolstuff, this makes me think that
no path was a failure becausehad I gotten the law degree, I
might still be in Chicago, Imight be dissatisfied with my
work, et cetera.
I did stay in the legal fieldbut this weird way.
Long story short, myself and theattorney left that office and
started our own law firm.
It was a boutique law firm in areally fancy part of town for
(07:06):
wealthy families to do trustsand estate planning.
We started together.
We left there.
We had to have a little bit ofgap in between because of
contracts and things like that.
I was working on my own,building up the business until
she was ready to join me.
Once we started the law firm, wewere there for about three
years, and then we sold the lawfirm, and it's actually still in
existence today.
But the new partner didn't haveme in the plan, so I got fired
(07:32):
from the business I started.
Russel (07:33):
That had to be tough, I imagine.
Kimberly (07:35):
I started off as a, I was a co-founder and the
director of client services, andso I think it was a financial
decision to just start oversomewhere on a lower pay for
someone fresh, you know, and newowner, et cetera.
But was I expecting that?
No, I started this thing, youknow.
Lots of tears.
I really thought that the lawfirm was gonna be my
(07:55):
entrepreneur experience.
I thought that was the end ofthe road.
I was like, oh, you know, Ididn't finish in law school.
I did all this stuff in myparalegal journey.
I've started a law firm, it'swell known, and everything was
going great, and then got fired.
So I had to go back to thebasics and I had to just to
make, make ends meet.
I had to nanny, I was aphotographer, I did blogging and
(08:19):
different things.
So It took like about six monthsor so to really get going.
But then, like I said, that wasover 10 years ago and getting
fired was the best, one of thebest things that ever happened.
Russel (08:30):
You know, it, it's funny.
I mean obviously that was a verytough situation for you, but I,
I do sometimes encourage thiswhen folks I work with that,
hey, sometimes firing someone,if, again, not saying anything
about your circumstances, but ifthey're not being successful in
your mind as an owner, thatfiring someone could set them on
a path that could be verybeneficial for their life.
But sounds like it turned outthat way in your case, but sorry
(08:52):
you had to go through that toget to where you are.
You've paid your tuition to theschool of hard knocks, it sounds
like.
Kimberly (08:57):
MRR what's saved my business.
My pitfalls were month to monthat the beginning or project
based things.
Now I'm able to interweave a lotof different services and
products and stuff.
I have a variety of offerings,but when I very first started,
my consistency, my incomeconsistency was really tough.
It was only until I starteddoing six months to start
(09:19):
retainers, um, and monthly,monthly billing monthly that I
started to really get a leg up.
It was just very up and down.
I would say that was one of thetrickiest things in the
beginning.
Client boundaries.
That one was always hard for me.
When I first, first started, Iwas in a sort of a service
mindset as well, because I was aparalegal, I was a secretary,
and that's the job.
What can I do for you?
(09:39):
And always up myself.
Having that sort of likesecretary service mindset was a
bit of a disadvantage to mebecause people took advantage of
me.
Not knowing.
I think of it like say like backin like junior high or high
school, each teacher wouldassign you homework and by the
end of the day you have likehours and hours and hours of
homework.
I think a lot of the clientswould compound on things that
(10:02):
they had already assigned me andI wasn't brave enough to say,
okay, if we wanna add this in,we have to take this off, or
this is gonna be a lowerpriority.
Is this the priority?
Because I think especially 10years ago, people thought that
it was easier to do a lot of thestuff that we do make a graphic
or something like that.
Now, thanks to Canva and thanksto a lot of DIY entrepreneurs.
(10:24):
I think everyone knows it'shard.
I think everyone knows now it'shard, but I think back then they
thought it was easy.
I don't know if that makessense, but that's how I felt.
Russel (10:32):
No, it, it makes total sense and I think one of the
hard parts of, uh, of marketingspace because one time,
sometimes it's a lot visual too,but because people are users of
the product that they maybe havea little bit higher thoughts of
themselves that they're alsoexperts in it, but, uh, not
really understanding thescience, the effort, the skill
and experience that goes behindwhat we do.
(10:54):
I think that's a really greatinsight too, that the these DIY
tools have proven that, how hardit is, at least to do a good
job, and do I wanna be doingthis myself as well?
Maybe to that end I think somepeople were afraid that these
kind of things were gonna put usout of business or lessen
business.
But maybe to your point, maybeit's expanded it.
Kimberly (11:10):
I agree.
Someone still needs to operatethe robot, you know, and there
needs to be quality control.
If you've been using AI for alittle while, you know how many
mistakes they make.
Russel (11:18):
Yeah, I always say, for smart, as smart as AI is, it's
also extremely dumb.
Kimberly (11:23):
Yes, very true.
Russel (11:25):
Like maybe a lot of tools.
Somewhere in there, and I, Idon't even know the exact
context, but I know fruit and animportant part of your shaping
your business journey.
What's the story there?
Kimberly (11:36):
Yes.
Oh my goodness.
Back to the financial attorneywho was a pivotal person, who
actually is a client still tothis day.
He kept in good contact and, uh,he would never know how
frustrated it was at thatsituation because relationships
are really important to me.
We actually kept ourrelationship for 10 years after
that, believe it or not.
Besides the fact, well, when Itold you about the raise, I
(11:58):
asked for the raise and hebasically said no.
What I did get that day was apineapple from the farmer's
market.
That's what they brought me in.
Russel (12:04):
That was like a gift?
Kimberly (12:05):
They thought about my proposal over the weekend.
On Monday they said no, and theyhad a pineapple and that was my
gift.
Russel (12:11):
That might be a little tone deaf.
Kimberly (12:12):
Oh very.
I don't know if my boss had everbeen in my position before.
I think to be an entrepreneur,you have to be a little scrappy.
We've been in situations wherewe had to make something outta
nothing and not that many peoplehave been in that situation I
think he just didn't fullyunderstand, um, what it was like
to try to get by.
It was really, really hard.
Like really hard.
But yeah, the pineapple.
(12:33):
After that, uh, when we went tostart the law firm, I think I
told you in our call, buteverything was pineapple.
Pineapple rug.
Someone brought a pineapple toour grand opening.
And to this day, I have usedthat as a story builder.
I told you before, when I did mytalks to the Denver Public
Schools, I was the pineapplelady.
I would tell all the kids thestory and just encourage them to
(12:55):
let them know that there'sactually another path then the
ones that are set out in frontof you and that's the one that
you can make yourself.
Russel (13:01):
I want to come back to that because I, I think that's a
really great part of your storythere.
I'm just curious, have youmaintained this pineapple
branding element in yourbusiness, or did that go away?
Kimberly (13:10):
It's totally a story that I use over and over again.
It's definitely relatable andactually the, the kids, uh, that
I would go speak to, theteachers would always have them
write a thank you noteafterwards and they would mail
them to me and I would get a bigpackage of the thank you notes
and on my website, um, it'scalled the Pineapple Story, at
the very end is a picture that akid drew of a pineapple and said
(13:31):
like, thank you so much.
It was really inspiring.
Russel (13:33):
Oh, that's cool.
Again, sour gifts has been veryinstrumental, pivotal and
probably inspirational to manypeople, uh, beyond even what you
were able to turn that into.
That's a wonderful story.
I wanna go back to what you werespeaking to, and I think a lot
of folks run into this eventoday.
Just as much as they were in thepast of setting boundaries.
How did you eventually overcomethat?
(13:54):
Or did you?
Kimberly (13:54):
Well.
I don't know.
I mean, I'm a human, right?
So a few times when peoplewould, I would bend over
backwards and then I'd get a,like a personal, I would give
people my personal phone.
Clients, sometimes everything'sgoing fine whatever happens in,
in their brain or whatever, likethey start thinking they can
like, text me on like Saturdaymorning and like Sunday evening
(14:15):
and like, stuff like that.
Honestly, when I first wasdealing with this, I, I would
get mad.
I would try to contain it asmuch as possible to the client,
um, but I don't think I was verygood at explaining the
boundaries.
What I had to do is actuallystart back at the beginning and
do a pre-sign document.
That has been a huge thing forme.
I just did a post about it.
It a document that's alongsideyour official contract that is
(14:38):
basically a code of conduct.
It says basic stuff for me.
It says, please don't have ameeting while you're driving in
the car.
People used to do that it's likeone, like I gotta show you some
stuff on the computer And two,I'm worried about your safety.
Maybe I should switch those.
Stuff like that.
Or, like one time I was buildinga website and without like
checking with me, the client hadheld a huge seminar to look at
(15:00):
the website, but it was notready.
I have like, text me only forgood things.
The rest please use email.
Please don't text on weekendsstuff like that.
I think that the pre-signdocument, and I call, I call it
like the golden rules of workingwith Faceted Media.
It's not when they sign, but inthe contract it set, they have
to initial that they've read it.
That also saves me liabilitywise.
(15:20):
Sort of a cover your butt, youknow, kind of thing, because
they initialed that they readit, these are the rules.
When I propose it, I usuallysay, uh, you know, here's the
contract.
Easy agreement.
Go ahead and e-sign.
Here's the pre-sign document.
It's all about mutual respect.
I try to frame it as like, I'llrespect to you, you respect me.
When they read it, it's like,duh, because it's like when you
read someone's behavior things,it's, you know, most people are
(15:43):
reasonable.
They'll be like, oh, that makessense.
But if they don't have somethinglike that ahead of time and
they're just angry one day, youknow, it basically helps them
remember like, what we talkedabout before.
If you're mad about something,maybe there was a typo for gosh
sakes, you know, and it's Fridayor Saturday maybe wait till
Monday.
I think it just helps people,um, set their own standards when
they have to look at somethinglike that.
(16:04):
That's helped a lot.
Russel (16:05):
I think that's great insight of Just the notion we
have to train clients to how towork with us.
We can't just leave it up toserendipity of their own natural
ways.
If, and, and frame it in the wayof for their benefit.
Like You said, safety.
This isn't just things that Iwant them because the way I want
them, but here's why this ishelpful for you as having a rule
in place, or something alongthose lines.
(16:25):
And also sets the tone that thisis a partnership, not a
transactional, you know, to yourpoint, not an order taker
situation.
For us to do our best work,we've, we've gotta be in a
healthy, good place.
Don't beat us up unless wedeserve it or those sort of
things.
And Like you said too, Iimagine, right, it gives you
something to refer back to whenthey are, they're humans,
they're gonna make mistakes.
Now you have the thing to pointback to remember this thing we
(16:47):
agreed upon.
Thank you for, for sharing thatinsight.
Talk to me more about, I mean,I, I always love, I mean this is
again, why I love smallbusinesses and I think just
folks like yourself, right?
Just when you found a mechanismto give back and contribute to
others, I, I have to imaginethere's more than just speaking
at a school that you've foundsome ways to do that within your
business.
Kimberly (17:06):
Absolutely.
And to be honest, that was oneof the reasons that I got fired
from the law firm is that I wasreally passionate about
networking in the community.
And so I did a lot of communitydrives and like one of'em was a
big diaper drive and I collectedlike tons and tons and tons of
diapers and went and donated'em.
They thought that was dumb.
(17:26):
Like, But I'm leading all thesein community leaders and people
were passionate about kids andour law firm is for families.
How could this not be moreperfect?
Stuff like that actually they,they didn't like, but yeah, we
did a, um, a handbag stuffing,um, for folks.
Houseless folks.
We did, um, bag stuffing.
We did diaper drives.
We also had a big flood in 2013out here in Colorado.
(17:49):
It damaged a lot of thewaterways and different things
like that.
We did a river cleanup.
I also did Girls on the Run,that's like a coaching program
for girls to do a 5K.
We did that too.
We did Grace's Race.
We've done a lot of races andstuff like that.
But yeah, my main thing wasworking through Operation Hope
and I went and spoke to theschools in Denver for about
(18:10):
three years.
A lot of that, and actually gotcanceled, uh, because of Covid.
But it was actually a good timeto cancel for me.
It was tiring.
I don't know how teachers do it,especially the ones that teach
the same subject all day long.
'Cause I was so passionate aboutit.
I would volunteer for everyperiod.
I would be doing my pineapplelady spiel for seven hours, six,
seven hours over and over.
(18:31):
I saw the teacher had to do herthing over and over.
She has to do it five days aweek, so,'cause they were high
school kids.
But yeah, it was really cool.
From that I ended up startingthe internship program because I
had the same problem, uh, like Iwas telling you with the
recession, I didn't haveexperience.
In order to get experience, youneed the job, to get the job you
need experience.
I think the kids are misled inhigh school that like, it's just
gonna be an easy, like you, yougraduate to the next year and
(18:53):
then it's just the next year.
But when you are 18 and you goto the, it can be very shocking.
Even 18 to 25 I think is areally hard time in people's
most people's lives, especiallyones that I've had to do
everything themselves, which isme.
It was really valuableexperience, but um, yeah, it was
just, I don't know.
You never know where people'slives are gonna take them, but I
hope it was inspiring.
Russel (19:12):
I'm sure it was.
I I can't imagine anyone outthere that you know have
anything less than good thingsto say about someone that took
the time to invest in them andjust the mentality and the
thought process is amazing andimportant.
I don't know, I kind of heardmaybe a little bit there of, of
some burnout or kind of we mightcall overgiving, um, in that
(19:32):
sense, you know, have you inreflection, have you found a
happy medium there?
Or at least sometimes where thatcan feel like, I know I don't,
I'm sure there's someterminology for it, but this
idea that if you're, don'treally get fulfilled from it or,
or if we can at least marry itin some, some higher purpose and
value, then that we're gonnafeel better about that.
I don't know what the question'snetting out to, but just when
(19:52):
you reflect on that, thoseideas, what comes to mind?
Kimberly (19:55):
I think, you know, in a way you're hearing in my voice
like a bit of a feeling offailure, but I feel because, no,
but it, I think it is true thatwhen you are a speaker or a
motivational speaker or anythinglike that, um, you don't really
know who picked up somethingfrom it or where they go or
whatever.
But yeah, I did get to the endof the road realizing that I was
giving more than I was, um, likeI also needed to receive, to run
(20:18):
my business.
My goal was that I was gonna beteaching the interns, but they
would also be taking some timeoff my hands, but ended up
ballooning the time that I wasspending.
I feel good about that nowadays.
It's a lot more nos, um, in ahealthy way.
For example, like next week, Ihave completely blocked off and
it's a me week, a light me week.
I've had a few things come inwhere I thought to myself,
(20:40):
should I just take that?
Should I just add'em on there?
But I know it's gonna ruin mywhole day if I have a meeting
next week so I'm not gonna doit.
I'm going to use the time for mycreative writing.
Writing a book like I told youbefore.
Different things that are moreof a long-term goal.
If I don't stop and I'm alwaysserving others, and I literally
never stop, my purpose ofserving others is also gonna
(21:01):
stop at some point.
Because like you said, you'll beburnt out and sort of resentful
that you never have time foryou.
But the only person who's incharge of that is me.
Again, I have to check myself onthat servant mindset from being
a secretary.
Oh yeah, I can do it.
Oh, I can do that.
It's tempting sometimes to likebreak my own rules, but I'm not,
I'm, I'm not gonna do it.
I hate to say that I've likefully been like fully abused by
(21:21):
clients and fully abused my lifein the process to this point
where I realized like it's onlyme who's gonna be able to have
the, you know, schedule thesebreaks and things like that.
So yeah, I don't take meetingson Mondays or Fridays anymore.
Then once a quarter or so, Iwill book a whole week off
without any meetings, becausefor me, even if I have the full
day, but I have one thing atthree o'clock, I'm gonna stress
(21:44):
all day about it.
I'm not gonna get it done.
So I need multiple days.
You need to have thatrecuperation.
Out here in Colorado, I get to,so next week I've got like
hiking plans and a lot of naturestuff like just for me.
Some writing and you know, I'llstill be working, but I'm not
gonna be serving anyone exceptfor me.
Just for a week.
Russel (22:00):
There's a reason why on an airplane, they instruct you
to put your own mask on firstbefore you help others.
I think even stepping away from,for a minute, from running an
agency just to think back andrealize how important, and I did
not prioritize mental, my ownmental health wellbeing enough,
uh, just thought I could toughit out, rough it out, however
you wanna look at that.
(22:20):
I don't think I was my best selfdoing what's a hard thing?
Maybe like a lot of things,like, it sounds like you're
saying we gotta hit some rockbottom to, to really change our
ways and to be motivated, uh, tootherwise.
I'm glad, it sounds like you'vegot to a good place there.
Oh, I, and I remembered while wewere talking, there's a great
book that even talks about theconcept.
I'm pretty sure it's this rightbook of Give and Take by Adam
(22:40):
Grant that he talks about a lotof the people that give
endlessly and needlessly or, orjust infinitely, that they do
always become burnt out.
He's not advocating againstgiving, but the ones that are a
little more apt to givestrategically to kind of just,
that ultimately comes fullcircle back to themselves again.
Which it sounds like we're,you've got to, that's, that's
the givers that thrive.
I thought that was a reallyinteresting take that seems like
(23:02):
it applied in your own case.
Kimberly (23:03):
These days my giving is more of a, like donations if
I can.
As far as time, that's a biggift, like that's a really big
gift.
Russel (23:11):
Oh, huge.
Kimberly (23:12):
But, you know, periodically we'll do events and
stuff and we'll offer, we havelike a sliding scale for some
folks and we offer, freebusiness audit for some folks.
I still have a portion of mybusiness that I have for sliding
scale people or people thatreally want something that can't
give me what I need.
I'm able to modify it to meetthem where they're at.
(23:32):
They're still a giving aspect,but it's not all this time with
sort of nothing back.
Russel (23:37):
It's boundaries.
You've created boundaries forit, which is, what we, we have
to have to set boundaries.
Glad you got there.
Another aspect I thought wasinteresting and just, uh, you
know, I think you called itbusiness therapy.
I dunno if I'm getting thatquite right, but, but you've got
a, a, a coaching practice andelement to your business, and I
found very intriguing.
How did you arrive at it?
What does that look like in yourbusiness?
Kimberly (23:56):
Oh gosh, if you're like me and I am pretty sure you
probably are, I'm sure you havelike 2, 3, 4 businesses or
business ideas in your pocket.
Business therapy is somethingthat I've thought about for a
long time.
Going back to all the, the beatdowns from the clients, to be
honest.
I wanted someone to be able tocry and talk to, and actually
there was a few coaches thatwere helpful in that way.
(24:18):
I never did coaching beforeuntil a few years ago, and,
sometimes I would just bla andbla and bla just to get a
response that said, Kimberly,you're doing the right things.
You're right where you need tobe.
That, to me, was worth payinglike the$500 for the hour or
whatever that I did at thatmoment.
'Cause it actually did change mytrajectory.
I actually wanted to offer thatback.
It's similarly priced.
It's like right now I have it onsale for 375 for 75 minutes.
(24:42):
Then they get a follow up andeverything, it's like you said,
uh, before that, we're payingfor not just the time for time
service of things, the time fortime trade.
We're paying for these 10 yearsof, sleepless nights at times.
Reading books and books andbooks and books and books.
Taking classes, classes,classes, classes.
Business therapy is like if youwanted to talk to someone to
make sure you're doing the rightthings, solve problems that are
(25:04):
stressing you out.
For example, the pre-signagreement, making sure someone's
on the same level.
I have all these ideas that canhelp people right away to fix
either like emotional pain intheir business or increase
financials.
It's a mix of that because myspecialty is lead generation,
traffic generation.
Search engine optimization, justmaking things work.
Business therapy is just one offsessions, again, to counteract
(25:28):
the anti trend against, uh, mul,uh, monthly recurring revenue as
well, so that people can have anoption to just do a one-time
thing if they want a DIY.
As much as you DIY, you stillend up with a list of like, I
don't know how to do this.
That's where we can do that andcrush it.
If I had someone that I couldcall back in the day to figure
out how to add tracking tags or,you know, just basic stuff or
(25:51):
interpret my analytics, that Icould talk to, that was a human,
I would've, I would still go forthat.
I don't know anyone, um, in myworld that does something like
that.
That's why I call it businesstherapy.
It's like a place to cry, getsupport, um, but also fix some
tech stuff and just getactionable steps.
Russel (26:09):
I love it.
I think that's intentionally, oreven accidentally, so many
agencies have had to move somedirection in this consultative
space with helping theirclients, right?
We've learned that just bringingpeople to the door does not
solve businesses challenges, sowe've gotta kinda dig deep in
there and, and uncover reallywhat's going on.
And then we all need a littletherapy.
(26:30):
Maybe we need more than wealways get.
You're really meeting a needthere of, of your clients and,
and like you said, hands on.
Awesome and, and obvious, andthen to your point of giving,
but also comes back and it'sanother revenue model for you.
I love how you structured that.
Very fascinating conversation.
I'm sure we did not get toeverything, but, uh, so goes any
(26:50):
podcast episode, so what are youthinking for the future of the
business?
What are you trying to createhere?
Kimberly (26:55):
Oh man, I've got so many ideas.
But basically it's expandingbusiness therapy.
The book that I'm writing I'mreally excited about.
It's all for anxiousentrepreneurs or the secondary
title is Confessions of a SmallBusiness Owner.
Just all the things that we gothrough that we feel not feeling
worthy enough having clientsstress us out different things.
(27:16):
It's just anxiety riddensometimes.
I'm excited about the bookcoming out.
That's probably like, hmm,probably still four, six weeks
away.
I've put a lot of love intothat.
That's coming out.
And then growing up the businesstherapy helping more people
start businesses.
I think people got, I don'tknow, people were really excited
about starting businesses afterCovid, but then I think people
like got scared, maybe.
(27:37):
I think that the influencerculture online contributed to
that fear because I think peoplethought that they had to be like
a TV show.
So now that that is kind offalling out a little bit, I
think that people are actuallycoming back to small business
ownership and I think a lot ofpeople are leaving their, the
corporate world again.
(27:57):
I'm just trying to be there tosupport people.
It's interesting how the phasesgo and yeah, just try to modify
based on what's going on, youknow?
I just wanna continue to keep mysailboat afloat and ride the
waves.
Russel (28:10):
It's funny, I think what you're speaking to, the idea of
entrepreneurship is not foreveryone, and whether it goes in
these waves of people trying it,uh, it's some people just can't
handle the lack of security,which is a, an amazing segue
into my next question for youis, are entrepreneurs born or
are they made?
Kimberly (28:27):
I think they're born, I think it's a born thing.
I think that if you ran thelemonade stands, which I was the
boss, I paid the money out to mypeople at the end of the
lemonade stand day.
I didn't even talk about that,but that was the thing.
You kind of have to be like anatural born leader.
I think that you have to be notafraid and, um, I don't know.
I think you're born, I hate tosay that.
(28:48):
But I think that if you are abusiness owner, I think you know
that there's no escaping this,this future.
Even if you tried.
I went through a slow time,honestly recently.
I even thought about applyingfor jobs again.
I just realized that that,that'll never be part of my
life.
I just, I can't.
I don't fit into that block.
I'll have better luck creating anew business to make money than
(29:11):
I would probably finding a joband being in that position.
My leadership level is too high.
I just gotta row my own boat,you know?
Russel (29:18):
Whether everyone is born or not, I do believe everything
you've shared that you are, wereborn, to be an entrepreneur.
That would only be fitting thatyou would have that be your
answer.
But all for very good reasons.
If people wanna know more aboutFaceted Media, where can they
go?
Kimberly (29:32):
Facetedmedia.com, so it's F-A-C-E-T-E-D media.com.
On Instagram it's faceted.media.
That's another cool place.
And then, um, Business Therapyon Instagram or
getbusinesstherapy.com.
Russel (29:45):
Get your business therapy folks.
Everyone needs more therapy intheir lives.
You have a very succinct, directURL for that.
That's awesome.
Thank you so much, Kimberly, fortaking the time to share your
story and the good points andthe bad points, and really just
sharing the journey of what it'slike to be an entrepreneur.
Just thank you so much forbringing that to the table
today.
Kimberly (30:06):
Thank you so much.
I appreciate you.
We hope you've enjoyed thisepisode of An Agency Story
podcast where we share realstories of marketing agency
owners from around the world.
Are you interested in being aguest on the show?
Send an email topodcast@performancefaction.com.
(30:27):
An Agency Story is brought toyou by Performance Faction.
Performance Faction offersservices to help agency owners
grow their business to 5 milliondollars and more in revenue.
To learn more, visitperformancefaction.com.
When I'm helping people with SEO, I find a lot of
(30:50):
times when they've DIYed, thatthey're coming up for results
that are completely off of whatthey sell.
Just this week I did an auditfor someone and they were
showing up for pans, likecooking pans because they, but
they're a chiropractor.
They are trying to write theirblog about their community,
who's into sustainability, whomight enjoy cooking with these
pans.
(31:11):
Little did they know, justposting that blog, those words
had totally dominated all oftheir searches.
They were coming up for pans.
Russel (31:18):
Points back to why businesses need professional
help, because, uh, uh, uh, youknow, I've certainly heard
interesting stories, but thatmight be more interesting in the
weird, random things that abusiness might rank for.
Kimberly (31:30):
I know.
It was validating too becauseshe had actually had another SEO
person audit her right beforeme, and so she was using me to
double check the first one tomake sure she got her money's
worth and the pans, they hadfound the pans as well, it was
validating for her.
She learned a lot.
Russel (31:49):
I think if you're having to pay a company to double check
another company, you're, you'vehired the wrong company.
Kimberly (31:54):
I know, well I gave that for free.
That was one of my gives that Iwas, that I was giving.
Russel (31:59):
Karma points or otherwise, I hope it came back
to you.
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