April 18, 2025 • 48 mins
The first day of college can be overwhelming for anyone. Just navigating the campus is a common challenge - but what if you'd never even set foot on a high school campus before? What if you'd never experienced traditional education until today? This is what homeschoolers are faced with on their first day.
Or is it?
This week, Dr. Ross and (homeschooled) cohost Ashley Worley tackle some of the myths and misconceptions of becoming college-ready as a homeschooler. Joining them are two formerly homeschooled students with vastly different experiences: senior Economics major Sara Maldonado and freshman Music major Lucy Holden. Together, they unpack what it's like to be homeschooled, from joining co-ops and purchasing curriculum to building independence and discovering your identity. There's lots to prepare for when the college transition approaches, and the way homeschooling translates just might surprise you.
Have questions about entering college as a homeschooler? Email us at ADRquestions@gmail.com. We'd love to hear from you!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
Stay tuned to the Ask Dr Ross podcast.
It's created to give you infoto succeed at college.
Our hosts are highly qualified.
Dr Catherine Ross is a memberof the University of Texas
System's Academy ofDistinguished Teachers.
She's also a popular professorof 19th century English
literature.
Ask Dr Ross is a communityservice of the University of
(00:27):
Texas at Tyler.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
So welcome to another episode of Ask Dr Ross.
This is our second series andtoday we wanted to talk about
homeschooling.
I wanted to say a little bitabout the history of
homeschooling before weintroduce our guest.
So I thought it'd beinteresting to tell you that
homeschooling the movementstarted in the United States
about oh about the 1960s and 70s, and there were two people who
were particularly powerful ingetting it and they were
(00:53):
actually coming from totallydifferent perspectives.
There was John Holt, who was aprogressive critic of
institutional schooling, andRaymond Moore, who was a
Christian educator advocatingfor parental control.
They both promotedhomeschooling for different
reasons.
Holt emphasized child-centeredexperience and experience-based
learning, while Moore was moreinterested in instilling values
and the family experience.
(01:14):
But over the years it reallydid change, and so when I asked
Ashley, well, were you a JohnHolt or Raymond Moore
homeschooler?
She didn't even know what I wastalking about, and I'll bet
neither of you do as well.
But both of these men wrotebooks.
One of the ones that Holt wrote, he actually wrote how Children
Learn and how Children Fail inthe 1960s.
Raymond Moore wrote Better LateThan Early, 1975.
(01:37):
And both of them were trulyinterested in the child
experience.
So the critique of traditionalschooling is common to both.
The notion of unschooling cameabout, the notion that children
learn more from experiences inlife than through reading in
books and sitting still inplaces, and that there's a kind
of a sense of we can do it onour own without all this big
(02:01):
help.
There's a lot of concern thatthe study of the curriculums
that were part of the publicschool system were too narrow or
in some way problematic tothese individuals.
Now, as you probably know,public schooling didn't start in
the US until 1918.
In 1918, the whole country hadsome sort of compulsory
(02:22):
education, but prior to thattime much of education was done
in the home.
For girls, and a lot of timesboys, were sent away to boarding
schools to prepare them foruniversity.
I don't think that we need togo too much into the history now
(02:47):
, but what we want to do isintroduce both of our guests and
find out how you did this, whyyou did this, what the
experience was like.
So I've introduced you, sarah.
Would you tell us a little bitmore about yourself?
You are a student at UT Tylernow.
Speaker 3 (03:01):
Yes, I am an economics major.
I'm a junior and I'm in theHonors College, and yeah, Okay,
what about you, Ms Lucy Holden?
Speaker 4 (03:11):
I'm a freshman music major and I'm also in the Honors
College.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
And also, just to mention, our wonderful producer,
ashley Worley, is also ahomeschool person, so we've got
a homeschool roundup here.
One of the things I wanted toadd to the background is that to
do homeschooling, it's all setup so that the way you do it,
there's certain legalrequirements.
(03:35):
You have to notify the localschool district or state
education department.
You have to follow astate-specific rules regarding
curriculum, record-keeping andstandardized testing.
This should all sound veryfamiliar to you, but it might
not be known to our audience.
You have to meet any teacherqualifications, so sometimes the
teacher must have a certainlevel of education and you have
to submit annual assessments orportfolios in most regulated
(03:57):
states.
Does that sound familiar to youall that your families did all
of that?
Speaker 4 (04:01):
Somewhat.
If they did, I did not know.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Your parents were busy taking care of you and you
didn't even know it.
Huh, so you started school,Lucy, when you were four, five,
six years old I'm not reallysure.
It's all kind of vague.
Huh, it is very vague, Okay,and how about you, Sarah?
Do you remember how old youwere when you started
homeschooling?
Speaker 3 (04:22):
Yeah, probably around four, because I had an older
brother, so it was kind of justI got grouped in with him and
like we just were kind of doingsimilar stuff.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
Okay, so why don't you tell us a little bit about
the story of your experience ofwhen you started?
Did you know that there wassomething called public school
or did you just, since yourbrother was already
homeschooling, you were kind ofinto that.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
Yeah, I kind of was aware that it was slightly
non-traditional because all ofmy friends went to public school
and so I was like, oh, there issomething different.
So I knew about it, but in myhead it was never that different
.
It was more so just what myfamily did.
But because I saw all myfriends going to public school
even like sometimes I would goand meet them up there for lunch
(05:06):
, and so I was very aware of it,I just it was never any sort of
stigma associated with it forme.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Do you know what your parents reasons were for
sending you to, taking you outof the public schools or just
doing it home?
Speaker 3 (05:20):
Yeah, so my dad's a wedding photographer and so his
hours he was gone most weekendsand my family's very family
focused and they were like, well, if they're in public school,
like they'll never be able tosee dad, because the only times
that they'll be home are thetimes that he'd be at weddings,
traveling and that sort of thing.
And so that was the main reasonthat they did that, because
(05:42):
they wanted him to be in ourlife and see us and stuff.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Okay, that's really interesting.
Family planning around daddy'scareer, huh, Lucy, tell us about
.
Do you know what your parents'thinking was when they chose to
homeschool you?
Speaker 4 (05:56):
I do.
I had a very nontraditionalchildhood.
My parents worked in like amissions humanitarian
organization called Mercy Ships.
We traveled a lot as a child.
So when we first moved to Texas, my sister was in public school
.
However, she hated it and wewere always like leaving and we
couldn't leave with the schooland she was always getting sick
(06:16):
and it was really bad.
So my parents decided thatthey'd try homeschooling, since
neither of them had ever heardof it because they both came
from cultures that do nothomeschool, and so then we
started homeschooling and itmade just everything going back
and forth back to the ships andstuff way easier.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
So once again it was about family cohesion.
Following dad, or mom too, Iguess.
Huh, ashley, let's hear yourvoice too.
Do you know what your parentswere thinking when they decided
to homeschool you and yoursister?
Speaker 5 (06:48):
Yeah, it was pretty similar actually to what they've
been talking about.
We traveled a little bit for mydad's work.
He was an actor and so we livedin New York City.
They didn't think they weregoing to have kids, so we were
born and as it came time for usto get into school there's a lot
of restrictions onhomeschooling in New York and
they looked at several of theprivate public school options
(07:10):
couldn't afford it, weren'tloving the options in the
district, so we moved to LA andagain, with the moving,
homeschooling makes that so mucheasier.
Did you start homeschooling inNew York?
We were just under the agewhere we would have started
school in New York, so then whenwe get to LA, that's when we
started.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Now think about your friends in the homeschooling
environment.
Did they have the same, a lotof the same reason?
Speaker 3 (07:34):
For me.
Most of my friends, theirparents decided because of more
like distrust of the publicschool systems.
I saw that a lot more withanyone who I knew who was
homeschooled.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Okay, and I saw you nodding your head when she said
that, Lucy.
Speaker 4 (07:52):
Yeah, I think a lot of people just didn't agree with
a lot of the public schoolthings and decided that
ultimately, homeschooling wouldbe better.
So they can, you know, lay thefoundation for their own kids.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
I don't really want to criticize public schooling
because I'm a teacher at apublic university and I'm really
glad.
I think it's a fine school.
I think you all are all herebecause it is a fine school.
But yeah, of coursehistorically there have been
concerns.
Both John Holt and RaymondMoore had both issues about the
way children learn and also sortof ethical, personal family
(08:20):
values involved.
But what I'm most interested inis how did you learn in these
schools?
What was the experience like?
And you know, how did thetransition from being at home
homeschooling, where you had awhole lot of freedom to be in
the university, work for you?
So why don't we just start withyou, sarah?
Tell us a little bit about yourearliest memories of
homeschooling and how you feltabout learning and being a
(08:43):
learner.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
Yeah, so the way that most of our curriculums worked
was we had like a book or a basethat we were working through
with my mom, and so that's kindof how we did it.
And I just remember, forinstance, for math, we kept with
the same curriculum our entirelike K through 12.
It was the same guy doing it.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
And when you say the same guy doing it?
And when you say the same guydoing it, were these materials
that came from a homeschoolingpublication outlet?
Speaker 3 (09:11):
yeah, I'll be honest, I have no idea where she found
it, but it was this one specificman who was a math teacher and
we'd like watch his videos andwork through his book and stuff
and so have the fondest memoriesof him because he was like
prevalent to my childhood.
But so that's how most of itwas.
Like we'd have a history bookand work through it and it was
part my mom like going off ofthat and then part coming up
(09:34):
with like activities to enhanceit and to fit it more to us.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
My understanding that the states require certain
texts being used or a certainrange of texts being used, that
all of these materials areapproved for getting you ready
to go to college if you want todo that.
So it's not just somefly-by-the-night fellow who
thinks I know how to teach mathand so I'm going to do it.
And in fact it might be a goodidea to tell us a little bit
(09:59):
about these co-ops, because Ithink aren't the co-ops kind of
a clearinghouse for where youget your materials?
Does that sound right to you,lucy?
Speaker 4 (10:09):
Before I started a co-op, my mother would find the
materials on her own.
There's multiple curriculumsonline that you can buy and you
can research which ones you likeand stuff.
When I was in like elementary,we used this one called my
Father's World, I think was thename of it, and so it was very
like nature based or likebiblical based as well, because
my family is Christian, and sothen we would go through all of
(10:30):
these like different things andthey had different like history
section, math section, sciencesection.
So a lot of my like earlychildhood was spent like
outdoors and being able to lookat stuff.
When we did like science, we'dgo to like find stuff in the
wild.
You know, oh, that sounds likefun.
It was very fun.
But then once I got to I thinkit was fifth grade or fourth
grade my parents enrolled me ina co-op and that's where I
(10:52):
stayed until I graduated.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
Is it graded like first grade, second grade, on
the way up to 12th grade?
Yeah, okay, so you feel likeyou're moving through a
curriculum year by year.
Is there a time limit?
Feel like you're moving througha curriculum year by year.
Is there a time limit?
Do you have to finish firstgrade by the end of June or
something?
Speaker 3 (11:09):
I think that that more is how the individual
family set it up, for instance,like we often took our summers a
good bit earlier than whenevera public school got out because,
like I've lived in East Texasmy whole life, so it gets warm
down here in the summer oh yeah,get out down here in the summer
, oh yeah, get out of Texas inthe summer.
And so they wanted us to like,whenever we're off of school,
(11:29):
actually be able to play and gooutside and everything, whereas
I think that public schools, Ithink it's like it's like June
yeah, and then, like even inJuly and so like you just don't
want to be outside at that time,and so I think it was more,
more to the individual familieshow the structure of when does
first grade end?
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Do you remember when you first started, what it was
like?
Were you reading books as afamily or with your mom?
Speaker 4 (11:56):
Yeah, my mom would often like read the history
books to us and we do likelittle projects and things.
When we first started, I feellike the elementary part was way
more fun than anything elsethat we ever did.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
Really.
Speaker 4 (12:07):
Yeah, that was the only time really that my mom
actually taught me.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Was your mother trained as a teacher?
No, my mother is a nurse.
She's a nurse.
And what about your mom, Sarah?
Speaker 3 (12:29):
My mom had some college for teaching.
Yes, and what about your mom?
Speaker 5 (12:35):
My mom is a speech-language pathologist, so
she worked with little kids anddid some level of learning and
activities with them, but she'snot a teacher or anything in
that vein.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
So now that you've had some university teachers
which are real different fromelementary school teachers, I
know, but you look back and yousay my mom was pretty darn good
as a teacher.
I'll look at you first, sarah.
Speaker 3 (12:59):
Yeah.
So I think that I personallyprobably would have been better
suited for a public school, notbecause of anything of her
teaching wise, just relationshipdynamic wise.
It makes it a lot easier for meknowing that this is my
professor I go to them for thisversus where my mom and
oftentimes moms are anyway.
(13:20):
But like the catch all be all.
You know what I mean.
This is my teacher, my mom, youknow, caregiver.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
Yeah, I was wondering about, as a mother, my training
as a teacher.
And I will tell you, I'm anEnglish professor at the
university but I was never apublic school teacher.
I did teach for a while 7through 12, at a very posh
private boys school and anothervery posh girls school where the
kids were highly motivated tobe there and their parents were
paying a lot of money for themto be there.
(13:46):
So I know a little bit aboutteaching that lower level.
But teaching is a complicatedjob.
It's also a job where you haveto discipline, you have to say
no, you have to give bad grades.
Sometimes you have to look at astudent and say you know this
will not do.
And so I'm'm kind of wonderingyou mentioned that you and your
mom maybe was it tough for yourrelationship sometimes?
Speaker 3 (14:10):
yeah, I think that impacted both sides of like the
mother-daughter relationship andlike the teacher-student
relationship because, like Ilove to have a coach, I love to
know this is the person incharge, I'm listening and it
really helps me to set myself upon a path for that.
And so, whenever those linesare blurred and it's just a
(14:31):
different level of and this ison me, like I don't feel like I
have to bring my best, likebecause it's just my mom, do you
know?
Because she loves you anyway,right, she loves me.
Versus whenever I go to class,I'm like okay, okay, I'm here to
work, this is what you know, itjust for me, the different
mindsets, them overlapping,didn't work as well.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
Did your dad ever act as a teacher, or was it always
your mom?
Speaker 3 (14:55):
Not really.
It was mostly my mom.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
But then did you go to a co-op where you had other
teachers.
Speaker 3 (15:01):
That's the thing.
I didn't go to a co-op.
I did a lot of dual credit inhigh school, so that was the
first time that I had a outsidethe home learning experience,
because a lot of my high schoolwas dual credit at our community
college.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
So did you attend the classes at the community
college or were they online?
A mix of both?
Yeah, so you did go to sometraditional classrooms where
freshman English or freshmanhistory.
How old were you when you weredoing that?
Speaker 3 (15:29):
Oh, my goodness, I would have been, I guess, 14, 13
, 14, yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
So you're a 14-year-old college freshman.
Speaker 3 (15:37):
Yes, and I loved it.
I just really thrive so muchmore in that environment.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
That's interesting to hear.
Now I'm looking at you, lucy,and did you say you're a music
major?
Yes, ma'am.
So we're going to want to hearabout how you got there, but I'd
like to hear a little bit moreabout how your relationship with
your mom or your teachers werewhen you were in homeschool.
Speaker 4 (15:56):
Well, unlike Sarah, I did go to a co-op, so my mom
stopped teaching me when I likebefore grades were really a
thing.
So I mean, where you got gradedwas for us sixth to twelfth
grade mostly, and so I hadteachers for every subject and
teachers for everything.
So my mom really didn't have ateacher role in my education.
So that's quite different fromSarah's, yes.
(16:18):
So I had teachers who wouldgrade me and I'd be fine with it
and would you attend classesLike would you go to somebody's
home.
No, it was in a church actually,and it was Tuesday, thursday I
would go to classes, so twice aweek.
But this church wasspecifically set up for a lot of
homeschool things, so there'slike a lab in the church and a
(16:39):
library and things.
So it was very similar to likea traditional school, with a lot
less people and a lot less likeamenities.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
Ashley, you did your homeschooling, started it in LA.
Speaker 5 (16:52):
Yes, and so that was when I was pretty little.
We went to a little privateschool for, I think, pre-k and
they realized very quickly she'snot going to do good in public
school.
And not because I wasn't likesmart or anything, because they
would be like so how's she doing?
Teachers, and they're like,well, she's such a sweet person
(17:12):
and she loves to learn and sheloves to read, but she doesn't
want to change stations whenshe's told and she can't sit
still.
Oh, okay.
And they were like is shestaying at the reading station?
They were like yeah, she'sstaying at the reading station.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
Because you love reading okay.
Speaker 5 (17:28):
And I'm also a very kinetic learner.
To this day, I can't sit withboth my feet on the ground
straight.
It just doesn't work for me.
I'm distracted, so I have tosit legs crossed or do something
with my hands.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
So what I'm hearing you say is that the public
school routine was limiting youand you couldn't hold still long
enough.
And that's actually one of thethings that John Holt talked
about is that public schools areoftentimes too routine, too
regimented for children and theyneeded greater freedom.
So you're sort of telling usthat it wasn't just because your
parents had to move around andthey wanted to be with their dad
(18:07):
during the week or when yourfamily was going off on a mercy
ship.
That was partly because of theway you were learning, and so it
was about your personallearning style.
What about your older sister?
Was there anything going onthere too?
Not necessarily.
She's very organized, so youwere the busy little kid who
couldn't sit still in school.
Your older sister was moreroutine and organized, but was
(18:31):
she already doing homeschool, orwere you the reason they
started homeschool?
Speaker 5 (18:35):
No, I think they were already thinking about
homeschooling and the privateschool we went to.
There was like a change in whowas running it, and so that's
kind of what pushed us towardsokay.
Well, maybe let's just we'll doour curriculum at home.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
So just to make it clear to me, those of you who
were not in a co-op you were inthe house but you also went
outside.
Did you go on trips?
I mean because I know part ofthe idea of homeschooling is
supposed to be very experiential.
Can you tell us, sarah, alittle bit about the
experiential part of yourhomeschooling?
Speaker 3 (19:07):
Yeah, for sure.
So I am from Palestine and like, for instance, there we have
like a big park and so anytimewe're doing anything like like
you mentioned, like science wise, we're going to that park and
we have a pretty good sizedbackyard.
So it's a lot of moving aroundin that way.
And they were also very big ontaking trips, like little trips
(19:29):
Like, for instance I can'tremember what city it was, it
must've been Houston we had apass which allowed us to go to
the zoo and the museum at anypoint, and since our dad is off
during the week, he goes with uswhenever, like.
I think back of my like schoolexperience.
I don't really think of it asmuch in the house, especially
(19:51):
because, even though it wasn'tnecessarily a co-op, we had
friends who were alsohomeschooled, and so a lot of
the times it was us going totheir house.
My mom had a friend and Ibelieve she was a high school
Spanish teacher before, and sowe would go to her house and a
couple other people would comeover and we would all do a
Spanish lesson and thenafterwards we would all go play
(20:12):
outside in their backyardbecause they have like land.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
So learning and playing was kind of the routine,
and going to different places,so it wasn't just staying in the
house.
Yeah for sure.
How about that for you, lucy?
I guess you were on ships andthings.
You were moving all around whenyou were being educated.
And was mom doing all of that,or did your dad?
Speaker 4 (20:33):
help.
My dad helped some.
It was mostly my mom, though.
My dad has a verytime-consuming job.
What's your dad do?
He's in charge of themaintenance of both of the ships
that they have right now.
Oh, wow.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
So I think he's an engineer.
Speaker 4 (20:47):
He was an engineer, yes, and now he's more like
overseeing.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
So he had a really demanding job, day in and day
out, while you were traveling.
So your mom was doing it.
Did you have siblings?
I have one sister.
She's older than me, older thanyou, so you were both doing it,
but you would have been atdifferent grade levels, right?
Yeah, she's three years olderthan me, oh wow.
So did your sister ever helpyou to study or learn, or was
she ever a part of that?
(21:12):
Oh, we just got a funny lookwhen we said that.
Not at all, huh she tried.
Speaker 4 (21:17):
She was very nice if I asked her and stuff, but
eventually, like she is amechanical engineer and you're
the musician, she's alsomusician, she's just
multi-talented.
It's crazy.
But she would be able to helpme with stuff because she's good
at everything.
But then we'd get to like maththat I don't understand.
And so my senior year of highschool she said don't take math
(21:38):
at the co-op, I'll teach you athome with this curriculum we
already have.
That I took in high school andI think we got about two weeks
in and we fought so much that Isaid I'm doing it myself and I
almost failed that class but wewere good.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
Oh, wow, okay, Okay.
So did your sister go on tocollege?
Yes, she's graduating in May.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
Is she at UT Tyler?
She's at Laterno University.
Speaker 2 (21:59):
Laterno.
Okay, and did you come in as anhonor student too?
Speaker 4 (22:04):
To UT.
Speaker 2 (22:04):
Yes, so just a little thing here.
We've got three honors studentshere and I think we better take
a moment to talk about that fora minute.
We have an honors college at UTTyler, established by one of my
colleagues, dr Paul Stroyford,and it's not real easy to become
an honors student.
Could you tell us a little bitabout why don't we start with
you, ashley how?
Honors student.
Could you tell us a little bitabout?
(22:25):
Why don't we?
Speaker 5 (22:25):
start with you, Ashley.
How did you get picked to be inthe honors college?
Do you know?
Well, the only reason.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
We even knew about it in the first place was because
Whitney got accepted before me,your older sister.
Okay, and do you know what theapplications included?
Because it's very selective tobe in the honors college.
Speaker 5 (22:40):
It is the applications start with.
I think, just like atraditional application where
you tell them a lot ofinformation about yourself.
They ask you an essay.
Then, after the essay, theycall you in for an interview.
Whitney did hers in person, Ihad mine over Zoom.
I think it's changed a littlebit.
Then they interview you andthey make selections for who's
on what scholarship and who'saccepted into the cohort.
(23:02):
Do you all?
Speaker 2 (23:03):
get grades in homeschooling?
Do you have grades?
You have a class, I mean, soyou have an A in your English
class and an A in your, and sothey could look at your grades.
Did you all also take thingslike the SAT or the ACT test?
I did not.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
I took the TSI and like that one, but I didn't take
the SAT.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
Okay, and Lucy, you nodded, you did take.
Speaker 4 (23:24):
I took the SAT and PSAT.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
And what about you, Ashley?
Speaker 5 (23:28):
I took the SATs and I also took the TSI.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
The TSI is a set of tests that tells where you are
in your readiness for college.
So, backing up a minute, theHonors College is pretty special
too.
What do you do in the HonorsCollege?
What makes it different fromthe rest of the university, lucy
?
Speaker 4 (23:46):
Well, you get to take a world text class, a
literature class, basically foryour freshman year for two
semesters.
It's a lot of discussion andgetting to throw around ideas
that you read in these books.
The section I'm in started withGreek tragedies in the first
semester and then this semesterwe've done a lot of like Kant,
freud and Nietzsche, and so it'sbeen very interesting getting
(24:07):
to hear all the differingperspectives from all of these
kids who have very likedifferent backgrounds and, you
know, went to public school,private school, homeschool,
everyone's like kind of in there, so it's nice to be able to
discuss about it.
Speaker 2 (24:18):
I would just insert this right now my experience
with students who arehomeschooled is that they were
always really well motivated,really well prepared and engaged
in class and I felt as thoughwhoever their parents were had
done a great job.
And you know, I've worked withyou now, ashley, for a while and
I, although I haven't had youin class, my sense of you is
you're extremely responsible,resourceful, and I've heard the
(24:42):
same thing about the two of youas well, by the way, that you're
something special.
But I do know that when I'vetaught honor sections, that the
students were highly motivated.
Highly motivated students tendto be much more ready to engage.
They don't want to sit back.
Do you understand how yourhomeschooling made it possible
for you to be one of these moreactively engaged intellectual
(25:05):
students?
Speaker 4 (25:06):
I feel like homeschooling really gave me the
opportunity to like come intomy own person faster than other
people, because I've always beenme and it's so.
My parents have struggled withthat a little bit because, you
know, trying to raise a kidwho's not like you sometimes is
a little bit, hmm, but I thinkgetting to become my own person
and have my own thoughts reallyearly.
(25:26):
So, like going through my highschool years as a very confident
individual, I just lovedlearning, I loved consuming like
knowledge and I loved being inclasses and discussing and being
able to share my thoughts andlike go into places that, like
you know, you don't really getto go into when everyone around
you isn't as involved.
So I think joining the HonorsCollege and seeing other people
(25:48):
who are also really engaged andlike being engaged even if you
don't like say much in class,like you say this one comment
and like it goes 10 places andthen you know you've said one
thing in class the whole time,but you still get to sponge
everything in, I guess, and I'vereally enjoyed that for sure.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
I do think this is true.
There's something that you allhave done that has made you, I
think, lifelong learners.
What about that, Sarah?
Do you kind of understand whatI'm talking about there?
Do you feel like homeschoolingmade you a lifelong learner?
Speaker 3 (26:19):
I think that, and like what you were saying about
engaging too, in my head therewas never another option.
There was never another option.
Do you know what I mean?
Like versus, if I'm sitting ina classroom of 20 to 50 people
at the university yes, ma'am, orjust even like imagining myself
in a public school, I don'thave to be the one to raise my
(26:41):
hand to answer the question, tovolunteer my thoughts.
Whenever you're in a room witheither your siblings or by
yourself, or whenever you'retalking about those thoughts,
you have to be the one to engageand to talk about the ideas.
So it was never an option tojust like sink into the wall,
you know.
So I think that that's whatreally made it to where, when I
(27:03):
had to be engaged, whenever Ihad the option to be engaged, I
chose that because of my pastexperience with that.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
Well, and you're also with your siblings.
I mean, everybody has differentexperiences with siblings, but
I think you tend to know thatthey care about you and if they
tease you or make fun of youit's usually kindly meant.
I don't know, maybe yourbrother's a real stinker, I
don't know.
But I do know that oftentimeswe hear stories of children
being really intimidated bytheir classmates.
And I've had neighbors who I'mthinking about.
(27:32):
One daughter in particular,daughter of a friend in the
neighborhood who she started atthe local public school and she
was a little bit larger thansome of the other kids and had
been in a different schoolsystem and the kids were really
mean to her and they took herout and homeschooled her.
That worries me a lot, thatthat can happen.
(27:53):
My guess is that there'ssomething about the
homeschooling experience thatgives you a kind of intellectual
independence, a kind of naturalcuriosity that makes you an
ideal college student.
So how's college going for you,lucy, when you got here?
(28:19):
Was it any big surprise?
Any big differences?
Speaker 4 (28:22):
No, I've really just adjusted well.
It was pretty seamless for me.
I didn't feel overwhelmed oranything.
The amount of work I get herewas the same at my co-op.
Basically, I guess I have moreof a focus on music parts
because of my major, which I'vereally enjoyed, of course.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
How did you get to be a music major as a homeschool
kid?
Because usually I think ofschools as the places where they
have bands and orchestras.
So how'd that?
Speaker 4 (28:45):
work.
It was very interesting becausethe co-op I went to was very
STEM focused.
There's no arts at all, like Imean, well, ashley and I went to
the same co-op so we like therewas a journalism club and that
was about all that there was forlike arts related things,
unless you took like an artclass.
So there was no music.
Everything I've done in musichas been on my own and taking
(29:06):
lessons and stuff.
So I just so happened to takelessons with Dr Park, the
professor of voice here at UTTyler.
I took lessons with her in highschool and so then I had no idea
what I wanted to do when Igraduated.
So this was probably Februaryor January of last year and I
ran into her and she's like,come talk to me and we'll talk
about it.
And so she gave me this wholeplan of, like you know, start
(29:28):
with your BA in music so you'renot stuck in music if you want
to change.
And so then that's what I did.
I started and I'd never donechoir, never done theater or
anything.
So I was a voice major lastsemester in BA.
Then I eventually switched tothis semester.
I'm doing vocal performance asmy BM.
Speaker 2 (29:45):
So I know that you mentioned that your co-op was
pretty STEM oriented and I think, ashley, you've told me that
too, and I think you had somethoughts about that.
Speaker 5 (29:55):
You want to share those?
Yeah, lucy and I went to thesame co-op.
Actually she followed me herebut it was very STEM oriented.
Like she said, journalism onlybecame a thing when I was coming
into my freshman year in highschool and besides that, I think
they had theater, but that wasalways like a question mark
subject, because sometimes theyhad it, sometimes they didn't,
(30:16):
and it was always a very smallgroup of kids.
So it was very STEM focused andI was not a very STEM oriented
person.
Speaker 2 (30:23):
So you were an artistically inclined student,
and yet your co-op was a STEMplace.
You think about homeschoolingas being able to tailor things
to individual students' needsand interests, and so you're
telling me that maybe you felt alittle bit constrained.
Speaker 5 (30:43):
A little bit, but one thing about homeschooling is
that it teaches you.
If something is not already setup for you to go in and get
what you need, you buildsomething.
So I did not have a lot of thesame resources and having a
music class, having tons of funEnglish classes or something
like that, but that gave me moreroom to be like well, how can I
learn some of this stuff on myown?
(31:04):
And when I hit my senior yearin high school, they started
this new thing.
We were the first class to doit for the senior capstone
project, so it was completelycustomized to whatever the
student wanted to do.
They had to create a projectwith such and such criteria, but
the criteria were very broadand as long as you turned in
progress markers of your workand you would come to class and
(31:25):
share what you had.
Because of that, I got to go.
Oh well, you would come toclass and share what you had.
Because of that, I got to go.
Oh well, let me make a shortfilm, because I absolutely love
movies and I have never evencome close to knowing what's
involved in making one.
So it was a little bit of adumpster fire.
Wow, I say it was a dumpsterfire on my end, completely on my
(31:46):
end, because, like I said, I'dnever done any of this before.
But you know what?
I think I learned more fromthat project than I could have
by taking any kind of class inhow to make a movie.
Lucy came and she scored thefilm for me.
We got some art that we neededas props from a friend of mine
another one of the people, whowas my classmate, wonderful guy,
he was the main actor in it.
(32:08):
So all of this stuff I didn'thave necessarily the resources,
as in there's already a filmclass set up, there's already a
music class set up, there'salready these sorts of things
for you to go in and have theopportunity.
But homeschooling, inherentlylike, has room for you to create
your own opportunities and Ithink that's a valuable
experience of itself.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
So you all are all independent-minded people, but
are there any kids that youexperienced that you went to
homeschooling co-op with whomaybe weren't so self-motivated,
who weren't such good engagers?
Is that a problem?
Do you have some kids that justkind of sleep through it and
their parents just let?
Speaker 4 (32:46):
them.
There's a lot of kids inhomeschool who don't put in the
work needed.
So then they get to theirjunior senior year and they have
nothing that's there for themto be able to go to a good
college or anything and stuffNot a lot but a few of these
kids end up not being able tocomplete any sort of degree or
they just don't have any sort ofmeaning to their life after,
(33:09):
like, they finish theirschooling and some parents are
very enabling of allowing theirkids to just go through
homeschool and have easy school.
I guess it's not rigorous, it'sjust them getting the core
curriculum done that you need tograduate.
Sarah wants to say something.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Yeah, so I was just thinking of, like my own
experience, whereas most of theother homeschool people I had a
like knew a lot about were mybrothers, and so we are all
completely like oppositepersonalities.
And so whenever you saidparents enabling, I think that's
really what it comes down to,because I'm a very independent
(33:47):
do it myself, I'm going to putin the work, whereas my brothers
like some of them are morereserved or more like I'll kind
of like take what the world kindof gives to me, sort of things,
but we all had the same parents.
They weren't okay with that.
Do you know what I mean?
And so whenever you saidparents enabling, I think that's
when it comes down to, becausesome kids are going to go for it
(34:09):
and some are going to be muchmore like to the side, and so I
think if you are wanting tohomeschool your kids, I think
you have to be able to be thatwe're not going to let this fly.
Speaker 2 (34:24):
Yeah, it strikes me that it's incredible amount of
responsibility to be a parent,just a parent, for individual
kids especially.
Every child is different.
Every child deserves to betreated and brought up to what
their best selves are, and addinto that having to be their
teacher too.
That's a lot to put on a parent, and I'm sure that's probably
part of the reason why theseco-ops got developed, so that
(34:47):
they could kind of share it, Notonly because it's you know,
being a teacher and a parent isa hard thing.
But teaching math and music,teaching literature and biology,
you know that's a lot of thingsfor a parent to know.
What did you want to add tothat?
I think I saw you respond for aminute there, Lucy.
Speaker 4 (35:05):
Yeah, I think that a lot of just the co-op
development was definitely tocome alongside parents.
I mean, my mom's not really amath person, so her teaching me
math wouldn't have gone well,and so I think it's really cool
to have the opportunity that ifthere's a subject that you just
didn't excel in in school or youjust struggled with, always
it's like there's someone outthere who will teach your kid
(35:26):
for you and they'll get a goodeducation still.
Speaker 2 (35:40):
So what is social life like for kids in homeschool
?
Now, you were not in a co-op,right, sarah?
So did you have a social life,or was it just you and your
brothers?
Speaker 3 (35:49):
Yeah, so my house was the house that, like all my
friends, came over to.
So most of my friends I metthrough church or like my
parents' friends had kids and sowe had a good little group that
we knew, and a lot of it waspeople coming to our house and
hanging out with us.
Whenever I think about mychildhood, I don't just think
(36:10):
about my brothers and I in aroom.
There were always lots ofpeople around and friends.
Speaker 2 (36:13):
Do you think your parents intentionally encouraged
that because you all werehomeschooled, or was it just the
way your parents were?
They were just the family inthe neighborhood everybody loved
.
Speaker 3 (36:22):
A little bit of both, I would say for sure.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
And this is out in Palestine, which is a little
town.
Speaker 3 (36:28):
Yeah, it's small and so I think that they are very
intentional people in that way.
So they saw, we don't want themto be in a corner just knowing
each other, like we want them togrow and like talk to people
and be social, but then in theother way, that's just who they
are as people.
Ashley, what was your?
Speaker 2 (36:47):
social life like.
Speaker 5 (36:48):
I'd say it's pretty normal Co-ops have that a little
bit built into them.
But I think maybe a commonthing that I've heard from other
homeschoolers, regardless ofhow they set up homeschooling,
was that you don't have a groupthat's already inbuilt for you
to belong in.
So you end up kind of talkingto a lot of different types of
people and talking to everybody.
(37:09):
So we not necessarily in LA wehad a co-op in LA that we would
go take field trips with, knowthese other kids through, but
here especially we would joinlike homeschool sports groups.
Speaker 2 (37:22):
That's what I was going to ask about if you have
sports and musical performances.
Speaker 5 (37:27):
Oh yeah, I don't know about the music side of it, but
definitely there were sports.
My parents were coaches for themiddle school girls basketball
team.
They got it started and now Ithink they're fairly competitive
.
So there's other things thatyou get involved in, kind of
because you have to.
That's the other thing abouthomeschooling is that it really
takes the engagement of theparent because, like you said,
(37:49):
they're having to do all ofthese different things.
So if you're not engaged, ifyou're wanting to treat it like
maybe a public school, wherewell, we'll send our kids one
day a week and they'll do allthe stuff, but you're not
helping them to learn their owntime management and say, hey,
did you do your homework?
Sit around the dinner tablewith them and ask them how
things are going and talk aboutthings, then I don't think
(38:12):
homeschooling necessarily isgoing to work.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
Well, if we think about public school, we think,
okay, kids go to school.
Classes start probably at 7.30,8 o'clock in the morning.
They do stuff in the morning,they go to a big lunch cafeteria
and have lunch and they go dosome sports.
Or maybe they have class in theafternoon and they have some
sports and they go home by threeo'clock and maybe they have the
boys basketball team and thegirls basketball team.
We had a choir and all thosesorts of things, and so things
(38:36):
are kind of done for you and forparents.
The parents don't have to domuch but, as you said, send them
off, although I think a lot ofparents are involved in things
like the Parent TeacherAssociation and sometimes
parents are coaches and things.
But what I'm wondering about isdo you have a school day?
I know you said Tuesdays andThursdays you would go to the
co-op, but Monday, wednesday,friday, what'd you do?
Speaker 4 (38:59):
I did homework because they would send us home
with homework for the week.
So how it would work is youwould go to your class on
Tuesday and then they give youlike a week's worth of work that
you would turn in the nextTuesday or Thursday or whenever.
So that's a lot of timemanagement, isn't it?
Yeah, it is, isn't it Becauseyou don't have anyone over your
shoulder, like being like am Igetting it done Because we have
class that ends in like 15minutes Right?
Speaker 2 (39:20):
and you don't have a study hall where they say, okay,
do your homework.
Speaker 4 (39:22):
now there's no study hall, and so it was just up to
me to get it done.
Granted, I mean, I didn'talways do the best job of not
procrastinating until like theday before, but I would try to
get it done over like the fiveday period.
Speaker 2 (39:36):
Do you feel as though what you learned about how to
do that in homeschoolingenvironment has served you well
in college?
Are you just as good at timemanagement, or maybe you're just
so used to it?
Speaker 4 (39:46):
Yeah, it felt very natural coming in.
You know, there's some weekswhere I don't do as well as
other weeks, of course, but,like you know, just depends on
like the workload, practice andthings, and so it's been pretty
good.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
So it's about time to pull this thing together, and I
was wondering what was thebiggest challenge for you, Sarah
, coming to college from ahomeschool background.
Speaker 3 (40:17):
I think that for me, my biggest challenge didn't lie
in anything related to my actualeducation or time management.
I think that it was aboutfinding my support system and
finding my team here, whereas Iwas literally born into my team
and support system before, andso I know that this can be like
(40:40):
the way, obviously, with publicschool students as well.
But I think that they've kindof had that experience of like,
okay, this is the teacher I cango to for this.
You know, they've had to findthat a little bit more, whereas
I always knew who it was, and socoming to college, I'm like
okay, who can I go to for this?
Who's your family?
Yeah, who's my family here,since before my family covered
(41:04):
everything.
My family was my teachers, myfamily was everything in that
way.
So having to find my familycovered everything.
My family was my teachers, myfamily was everything in that
way.
So having to find my family incollege was a whole new learning
experience.
Speaker 2 (41:14):
Well, and you know, of course, one of the big
developmental shifts forcollege-age students is to find
a certain amount of autonomy sothat they stand alone without
their family.
Not that you ever, you know,not have your family, but you've
got to go on out in the worldone day without mom and dad, and
so has that been a challengefor you too no, I came out of
(41:34):
the womb wanting to go off on myown, so not really in that way
no.
Would you say the same thingfor your brothers?
Speaker 3 (41:42):
um, so actually one of them he had same experience.
He's kind of like quietindependent, I'm loud
independent.
But there's two more on the way.
One is starting school actuallythis coming fall, so I'm
curious to see how it looks forthem, because they're so
opposite of us and so what willbe their experience in that way?
Speaker 2 (42:03):
So, lucy, when you think about it, has there been
any particular challenge asyou've entered the college,
experience that you feel likeyour homeschool either really
helped you with or maybe didn'thelp you with as much?
Speaker 4 (42:16):
Not particularly.
I mean, I was lucky to comeinto the music program, where
it's very small and it's reallyeasy to connect with people.
So I have really good friendsand I get to be with them a lot,
because we have classes everyday for two semesters until like
the end of our sophomore yearwe're going to be together, so
Well and plus you had your musicteacher from when you were in
(42:36):
school before you came here, andI would say that that gives you
a certain continuity.
Yes, I was very set up before Igot here.
It was very nice.
I mean, I guess something likeI wasn't used to is like being
around so many people all thetime.
Well, to a certain extent I was, because living on the ships
you're around a lot of people,but we haven't lived there in a
(42:57):
little while.
So I've been at home, you know,and getting to stay home and
only go to school twice a week.
But now you know I have todrive in every day, like
commuting and stuff.
You have an hour every day.
It depends on the traffic, butit can be anywhere from 40
minutes to an hour.
But I have music.
We're good guys.
Speaker 2 (43:13):
Oh well, you're the music girl.
There you go, Okay.
So, ashley, can you answer thesame question?
Is there something that youwere either especially well
prepared for, maybe not as wellprepared for because of the
homeschooling as you came intothe university environment?
Speaker 5 (43:27):
I think one of the things that I felt really
prepared for, kind of like whatthey were talking about, is time
management skills, because youhave to do all of your stuff,
like when I was in kindergartenthrough elementary, when we were
in LA and it was just us athome, our mom, she bought us the
curriculums.
She'd leave a list for each ofus on the table, had our little
(43:47):
name on top of it and it was thelist of the stuff that we
needed to do homework wise.
Like chores like you know, feedthe dog, fold the laundry, do
the math, yeah, so there wasthat element of it where this is
what you have to do and there'slike our dad is working.
He worked from home, but he'sworking and so we have to do it
(44:09):
and like, if you don't do it,mom's going to come home and be
like why didn't you do your workyou had all this time.
It was empty space, literally.
What were you doing?
No-transcript.
(44:38):
Same way.
Speaker 2 (44:39):
Exactly.
I don't think you could havegotten away with that in a
public school, could you no?
So I guess we ought to kind ofwrap up there.
Is there anything that you allwanted to say about being a
homeschool student, or are theremisconceptions about homeschool
?
Are there things that you wantto?
I saw some nods there.
Speaker 4 (44:58):
I don't know.
I mean there's obviouslymisconceptions about like
they're all like not socialized.
I get called homeschool junglefreak like the Mean Girls movie
a lot.
Homeschool jungle freak yeah,in the movie because the get
called homeschool jungle freaklike the Mean Girls movie a lot.
Homeschool jungle freak, yeah,in the movie because the girl
was homeschooled in Africa.
That's what happened to me too,so we have to get the nickname,
I guess.
But like that's like one of thestereotypes is that you know,
(45:21):
they're all kind of just likegeeks, are like really like
conservative scary people, arelike really cult type person,
and so I think a lot of peopledo have that mindset.
Me and Ashley were talking tosomeone the other day who went
to a private school and he waslike yeah, y'all are just like
the most normal homeschoolersI've ever met.
Like who have you been meeting?
But I like to think that mosthomeschoolers are pretty normal,
(45:43):
at least the ones I hang outwith, do you?
Speaker 2 (45:46):
ever have to worry about a stereotype there, normal
at least the ones I hang outwith.
Speaker 3 (45:50):
Do you ever have to worry about a stereotype there,
sarah?
Yeah, I think that my biggestmisconception.
I think that it's everyhomeschool experience is quite
similar, whereas, like even likehere, y'all are a bit more
similar because y'all had thesame co-op, but we have very
different experiences and whatour homeschool community life
day-to-day looked like, and so Ithink that whenever someone's
(46:12):
like they either knew someonewho was homeschooled growing up,
they kind of assume that it's acopy and paste, very similar to
everyone's experiences, whereasI think that maybe even more
than public school, it's very,very different experiences.
Speaker 2 (46:29):
Yeah, I certainly gathered that from you all is
that it allowed you to be anindependent individual person.
There was freedom for you todevelop who you needed to be and
if you wanted to read on yourstomach all day long, and that
was fine.
You know, none of you seem tobe sociopaths or have bad habits
, and you know your grammar'sgood and your hygiene's good.
(46:50):
I'm teasing you, but I'm alsosaying that the thing I have
loved the most about myhomeschooled students is what
we've been talking about here,which is that you really do
engage and you seem to be livelylearners, and to me, that is
the biggest thing about collegeis that we want to keep you
learning, opening up the worldto you, and if you're already a
(47:10):
lively learner, if you'realready knowing how to engage
and you have time management,then you are on the road, and so
I hope that this is aninteresting program for people
who have been thinking about it.
There's a lot of information outthere if you want to look into
it for your children.
There's important stateregulations and rules and
standards.
If a parent is really motivatedto be both a parent and a
(47:34):
teacher and feel that they havethe skill, it does sound to me
like your parents are all prettyamazing, and I think oftentimes
amazing parents make amazingstudents, whether they're
homeschooled or not.
So I'm just real glad to havegotten to talk to you all today.
I guess that's a way to wrap itup, huh, Ashley, Do you want to
add anything or conclude of anyother thing?
Speaker 5 (47:55):
No, I don't think so, but if you're a homeschooler
and you have specific questionsabout coming to college,
definitely send us an email.
Our email is adrquestions atgmailcom and you can ask us
anything.
You could leave a comment underthe YouTube video if you're
listening to this on YouTube,and, yeah, we'll answer your
questions for you.
Speaker 2 (48:15):
Yeah, we're real eager to have our listening
audience to call in and talk tous about just about anything
that confuses them or intereststhem, and if I can't answer it
and Ashley can't answer it,we'll get Sarah and Lucy.
Ut Tyler is eager for thecommunity to know what a great
resource we are, and we'rereally happy to be here.
(48:36):
So I think that's a wrap, thankyou.
Stay tuned to the Ask Dr Ross podcast.
It's created to give you infoto succeed at college.
Our hosts are highly qualified.
Dr Catherine Ross is a memberof the University of Texas
System's Academy ofDistinguished Teachers.
She's also a popular professorof 19th century English
literature.
Ask Dr Ross is a communityservice of the University of
(00:27):
Texas at Tyler.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
So welcome to another episode of Ask Dr Ross.
This is our second series andtoday we wanted to talk about
homeschooling.
I wanted to say a little bitabout the history of
homeschooling before weintroduce our guest.
So I thought it'd beinteresting to tell you that
homeschooling the movementstarted in the United States
about oh about the 1960s and 70s, and there were two people who
were particularly powerful ingetting it and they were
(00:53):
actually coming from totallydifferent perspectives.
There was John Holt, who was aprogressive critic of
institutional schooling, andRaymond Moore, who was a
Christian educator advocatingfor parental control.
They both promotedhomeschooling for different
reasons.
Holt emphasized child-centeredexperience and experience-based
learning, while Moore was moreinterested in instilling values
and the family experience.
(01:14):
But over the years it reallydid change, and so when I asked
Ashley, well, were you a JohnHolt or Raymond Moore
homeschooler?
She didn't even know what I wastalking about, and I'll bet
neither of you do as well.
But both of these men wrotebooks.
One of the ones that Holt wrote, he actually wrote how Children
Learn and how Children Fail inthe 1960s.
Raymond Moore wrote Better LateThan Early, 1975.
(01:37):
And both of them were trulyinterested in the child
experience.
So the critique of traditionalschooling is common to both.
The notion of unschooling cameabout, the notion that children
learn more from experiences inlife than through reading in
books and sitting still inplaces, and that there's a kind
of a sense of we can do it onour own without all this big
(02:01):
help.
There's a lot of concern thatthe study of the curriculums
that were part of the publicschool system were too narrow or
in some way problematic tothese individuals.
Now, as you probably know,public schooling didn't start in
the US until 1918.
In 1918, the whole country hadsome sort of compulsory
(02:22):
education, but prior to thattime much of education was done
in the home.
For girls, and a lot of timesboys, were sent away to boarding
schools to prepare them foruniversity.
I don't think that we need togo too much into the history now
(02:47):
, but what we want to do isintroduce both of our guests and
find out how you did this, whyyou did this, what the
experience was like.
So I've introduced you, sarah.
Would you tell us a little bitmore about yourself?
You are a student at UT Tylernow.
Speaker 3 (03:01):
Yes, I am an economics major.
I'm a junior and I'm in theHonors College, and yeah, Okay,
what about you, Ms Lucy Holden?
Speaker 4 (03:11):
I'm a freshman music major and I'm also in the Honors
College.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
And also, just to mention, our wonderful producer,
ashley Worley, is also ahomeschool person, so we've got
a homeschool roundup here.
One of the things I wanted toadd to the background is that to
do homeschooling, it's all setup so that the way you do it,
there's certain legalrequirements.
(03:35):
You have to notify the localschool district or state
education department.
You have to follow astate-specific rules regarding
curriculum, record-keeping andstandardized testing.
This should all sound veryfamiliar to you, but it might
not be known to our audience.
You have to meet any teacherqualifications, so sometimes the
teacher must have a certainlevel of education and you have
to submit annual assessments orportfolios in most regulated
(03:57):
states.
Does that sound familiar to youall that your families did all
of that?
Speaker 4 (04:01):
Somewhat.
If they did, I did not know.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Your parents were busy taking care of you and you
didn't even know it.
Huh, so you started school,Lucy, when you were four, five,
six years old I'm not reallysure.
It's all kind of vague.
Huh, it is very vague, Okay,and how about you, Sarah?
Do you remember how old youwere when you started
homeschooling?
Speaker 3 (04:22):
Yeah, probably around four, because I had an older
brother, so it was kind of justI got grouped in with him and
like we just were kind of doingsimilar stuff.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
Okay, so why don't you tell us a little bit about
the story of your experience ofwhen you started?
Did you know that there wassomething called public school
or did you just, since yourbrother was already
homeschooling, you were kind ofinto that.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
Yeah, I kind of was aware that it was slightly
non-traditional because all ofmy friends went to public school
and so I was like, oh, there issomething different.
So I knew about it, but in myhead it was never that different
.
It was more so just what myfamily did.
But because I saw all myfriends going to public school
even like sometimes I would goand meet them up there for lunch
(05:06):
, and so I was very aware of it,I just it was never any sort of
stigma associated with it forme.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Do you know what your parents reasons were for
sending you to, taking you outof the public schools or just
doing it home?
Speaker 3 (05:20):
Yeah, so my dad's a wedding photographer and so his
hours he was gone most weekendsand my family's very family
focused and they were like, well, if they're in public school,
like they'll never be able tosee dad, because the only times
that they'll be home are thetimes that he'd be at weddings,
traveling and that sort of thing.
And so that was the main reasonthat they did that, because
(05:42):
they wanted him to be in ourlife and see us and stuff.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Okay, that's really interesting.
Family planning around daddy'scareer, huh, Lucy, tell us about
.
Do you know what your parents'thinking was when they chose to
homeschool you?
Speaker 4 (05:56):
I do.
I had a very nontraditionalchildhood.
My parents worked in like amissions humanitarian
organization called Mercy Ships.
We traveled a lot as a child.
So when we first moved to Texas, my sister was in public school
.
However, she hated it and wewere always like leaving and we
couldn't leave with the schooland she was always getting sick
(06:16):
and it was really bad.
So my parents decided thatthey'd try homeschooling, since
neither of them had ever heardof it because they both came
from cultures that do nothomeschool, and so then we
started homeschooling and itmade just everything going back
and forth back to the ships andstuff way easier.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
So once again it was about family cohesion.
Following dad, or mom too, Iguess.
Huh, ashley, let's hear yourvoice too.
Do you know what your parentswere thinking when they decided
to homeschool you and yoursister?
Speaker 5 (06:48):
Yeah, it was pretty similar actually to what they've
been talking about.
We traveled a little bit for mydad's work.
He was an actor and so we livedin New York City.
They didn't think they weregoing to have kids, so we were
born and as it came time for usto get into school there's a lot
of restrictions onhomeschooling in New York and
they looked at several of theprivate public school options
(07:10):
couldn't afford it, weren'tloving the options in the
district, so we moved to LA andagain, with the moving,
homeschooling makes that so mucheasier.
Did you start homeschooling inNew York?
We were just under the agewhere we would have started
school in New York, so then whenwe get to LA, that's when we
started.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Now think about your friends in the homeschooling
environment.
Did they have the same, a lotof the same reason?
Speaker 3 (07:34):
For me.
Most of my friends, theirparents decided because of more
like distrust of the publicschool systems.
I saw that a lot more withanyone who I knew who was
homeschooled.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Okay, and I saw you nodding your head when she said
that, Lucy.
Speaker 4 (07:52):
Yeah, I think a lot of people just didn't agree with
a lot of the public schoolthings and decided that
ultimately, homeschooling wouldbe better.
So they can, you know, lay thefoundation for their own kids.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
I don't really want to criticize public schooling
because I'm a teacher at apublic university and I'm really
glad.
I think it's a fine school.
I think you all are all herebecause it is a fine school.
But yeah, of coursehistorically there have been
concerns.
Both John Holt and RaymondMoore had both issues about the
way children learn and also sortof ethical, personal family
(08:20):
values involved.
But what I'm most interested inis how did you learn in these
schools?
What was the experience like?
And you know, how did thetransition from being at home
homeschooling, where you had awhole lot of freedom to be in
the university, work for you?
So why don't we just start withyou, sarah?
Tell us a little bit about yourearliest memories of
homeschooling and how you feltabout learning and being a
(08:43):
learner.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
Yeah, so the way that most of our curriculums worked
was we had like a book or a basethat we were working through
with my mom, and so that's kindof how we did it.
And I just remember, forinstance, for math, we kept with
the same curriculum our entirelike K through 12.
It was the same guy doing it.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
And when you say the same guy doing it?
And when you say the same guydoing it, were these materials
that came from a homeschoolingpublication outlet?
Speaker 3 (09:11):
yeah, I'll be honest, I have no idea where she found
it, but it was this one specificman who was a math teacher and
we'd like watch his videos andwork through his book and stuff
and so have the fondest memoriesof him because he was like
prevalent to my childhood.
But so that's how most of itwas.
Like we'd have a history bookand work through it and it was
part my mom like going off ofthat and then part coming up
(09:34):
with like activities to enhanceit and to fit it more to us.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
My understanding that the states require certain
texts being used or a certainrange of texts being used, that
all of these materials areapproved for getting you ready
to go to college if you want todo that.
So it's not just somefly-by-the-night fellow who
thinks I know how to teach mathand so I'm going to do it.
And in fact it might be a goodidea to tell us a little bit
(09:59):
about these co-ops, because Ithink aren't the co-ops kind of
a clearinghouse for where youget your materials?
Does that sound right to you,lucy?
Speaker 4 (10:09):
Before I started a co-op, my mother would find the
materials on her own.
There's multiple curriculumsonline that you can buy and you
can research which ones you likeand stuff.
When I was in like elementary,we used this one called my
Father's World, I think was thename of it, and so it was very
like nature based or likebiblical based as well, because
my family is Christian, and sothen we would go through all of
(10:30):
these like different things andthey had different like history
section, math section, sciencesection.
So a lot of my like earlychildhood was spent like
outdoors and being able to lookat stuff.
When we did like science, we'dgo to like find stuff in the
wild.
You know, oh, that sounds likefun.
It was very fun.
But then once I got to I thinkit was fifth grade or fourth
grade my parents enrolled me ina co-op and that's where I
(10:52):
stayed until I graduated.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
Is it graded like first grade, second grade, on
the way up to 12th grade?
Yeah, okay, so you feel likeyou're moving through a
curriculum year by year.
Is there a time limit?
Feel like you're moving througha curriculum year by year.
Is there a time limit?
Do you have to finish firstgrade by the end of June or
something?
Speaker 3 (11:09):
I think that that more is how the individual
family set it up, for instance,like we often took our summers a
good bit earlier than whenevera public school got out because,
like I've lived in East Texasmy whole life, so it gets warm
down here in the summer oh yeah,get out down here in the summer
, oh yeah, get out of Texas inthe summer.
And so they wanted us to like,whenever we're off of school,
(11:29):
actually be able to play and gooutside and everything, whereas
I think that public schools, Ithink it's like it's like June
yeah, and then, like even inJuly and so like you just don't
want to be outside at that time,and so I think it was more,
more to the individual familieshow the structure of when does
first grade end?
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Do you remember when you first started, what it was
like?
Were you reading books as afamily or with your mom?
Speaker 4 (11:56):
Yeah, my mom would often like read the history
books to us and we do likelittle projects and things.
When we first started, I feellike the elementary part was way
more fun than anything elsethat we ever did.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
Really.
Speaker 4 (12:07):
Yeah, that was the only time really that my mom
actually taught me.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Was your mother trained as a teacher?
No, my mother is a nurse.
She's a nurse.
And what about your mom, Sarah?
Speaker 3 (12:29):
My mom had some college for teaching.
Yes, and what about your mom?
Speaker 5 (12:35):
My mom is a speech-language pathologist, so
she worked with little kids anddid some level of learning and
activities with them, but she'snot a teacher or anything in
that vein.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
So now that you've had some university teachers
which are real different fromelementary school teachers, I
know, but you look back and yousay my mom was pretty darn good
as a teacher.
I'll look at you first, sarah.
Speaker 3 (12:59):
Yeah.
So I think that I personallyprobably would have been better
suited for a public school, notbecause of anything of her
teaching wise, just relationshipdynamic wise.
It makes it a lot easier for meknowing that this is my
professor I go to them for thisversus where my mom and
oftentimes moms are anyway.
(13:20):
But like the catch all be all.
You know what I mean.
This is my teacher, my mom, youknow, caregiver.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
Yeah, I was wondering about, as a mother, my training
as a teacher.
And I will tell you, I'm anEnglish professor at the
university but I was never apublic school teacher.
I did teach for a while 7through 12, at a very posh
private boys school and anothervery posh girls school where the
kids were highly motivated tobe there and their parents were
paying a lot of money for themto be there.
(13:46):
So I know a little bit aboutteaching that lower level.
But teaching is a complicatedjob.
It's also a job where you haveto discipline, you have to say
no, you have to give bad grades.
Sometimes you have to look at astudent and say you know this
will not do.
And so I'm'm kind of wonderingyou mentioned that you and your
mom maybe was it tough for yourrelationship sometimes?
Speaker 3 (14:10):
yeah, I think that impacted both sides of like the
mother-daughter relationship andlike the teacher-student
relationship because, like Ilove to have a coach, I love to
know this is the person incharge, I'm listening and it
really helps me to set myself upon a path for that.
And so, whenever those linesare blurred and it's just a
(14:31):
different level of and this ison me, like I don't feel like I
have to bring my best, likebecause it's just my mom, do you
know?
Because she loves you anyway,right, she loves me.
Versus whenever I go to class,I'm like okay, okay, I'm here to
work, this is what you know, itjust for me, the different
mindsets, them overlapping,didn't work as well.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
Did your dad ever act as a teacher, or was it always
your mom?
Speaker 3 (14:55):
Not really.
It was mostly my mom.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
But then did you go to a co-op where you had other
teachers.
Speaker 3 (15:01):
That's the thing.
I didn't go to a co-op.
I did a lot of dual credit inhigh school, so that was the
first time that I had a outsidethe home learning experience,
because a lot of my high schoolwas dual credit at our community
college.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
So did you attend the classes at the community
college or were they online?
A mix of both?
Yeah, so you did go to sometraditional classrooms where
freshman English or freshmanhistory.
How old were you when you weredoing that?
Speaker 3 (15:29):
Oh, my goodness, I would have been, I guess, 14, 13
, 14, yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
So you're a 14-year-old college freshman.
Speaker 3 (15:37):
Yes, and I loved it.
I just really thrive so muchmore in that environment.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
That's interesting to hear.
Now I'm looking at you, lucy,and did you say you're a music
major?
Yes, ma'am.
So we're going to want to hearabout how you got there, but I'd
like to hear a little bit moreabout how your relationship with
your mom or your teachers werewhen you were in homeschool.
Speaker 4 (15:56):
Well, unlike Sarah, I did go to a co-op, so my mom
stopped teaching me when I likebefore grades were really a
thing.
So I mean, where you got gradedwas for us sixth to twelfth
grade mostly, and so I hadteachers for every subject and
teachers for everything.
So my mom really didn't have ateacher role in my education.
So that's quite different fromSarah's, yes.
(16:18):
So I had teachers who wouldgrade me and I'd be fine with it
and would you attend classesLike would you go to somebody's
home.
No, it was in a church actually,and it was Tuesday, thursday I
would go to classes, so twice aweek.
But this church wasspecifically set up for a lot of
homeschool things, so there'slike a lab in the church and a
(16:39):
library and things.
So it was very similar to likea traditional school, with a lot
less people and a lot less likeamenities.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
Ashley, you did your homeschooling, started it in LA.
Speaker 5 (16:52):
Yes, and so that was when I was pretty little.
We went to a little privateschool for, I think, pre-k and
they realized very quickly she'snot going to do good in public
school.
And not because I wasn't likesmart or anything, because they
would be like so how's she doing?
Teachers, and they're like,well, she's such a sweet person
(17:12):
and she loves to learn and sheloves to read, but she doesn't
want to change stations whenshe's told and she can't sit
still.
Oh, okay.
And they were like is shestaying at the reading station?
They were like yeah, she'sstaying at the reading station.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
Because you love reading okay.
Speaker 5 (17:28):
And I'm also a very kinetic learner.
To this day, I can't sit withboth my feet on the ground
straight.
It just doesn't work for me.
I'm distracted, so I have tosit legs crossed or do something
with my hands.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
So what I'm hearing you say is that the public
school routine was limiting youand you couldn't hold still long
enough.
And that's actually one of thethings that John Holt talked
about is that public schools areoftentimes too routine, too
regimented for children and theyneeded greater freedom.
So you're sort of telling usthat it wasn't just because your
parents had to move around andthey wanted to be with their dad
(18:07):
during the week or when yourfamily was going off on a mercy
ship.
That was partly because of theway you were learning, and so it
was about your personallearning style.
What about your older sister?
Was there anything going onthere too?
Not necessarily.
She's very organized, so youwere the busy little kid who
couldn't sit still in school.
Your older sister was moreroutine and organized, but was
(18:31):
she already doing homeschool, orwere you the reason they
started homeschool?
Speaker 5 (18:35):
No, I think they were already thinking about
homeschooling and the privateschool we went to.
There was like a change in whowas running it, and so that's
kind of what pushed us towardsokay.
Well, maybe let's just we'll doour curriculum at home.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
So just to make it clear to me, those of you who
were not in a co-op you were inthe house but you also went
outside.
Did you go on trips?
I mean because I know part ofthe idea of homeschooling is
supposed to be very experiential.
Can you tell us, sarah, alittle bit about the
experiential part of yourhomeschooling?
Speaker 3 (19:07):
Yeah, for sure.
So I am from Palestine and like, for instance, there we have
like a big park and so anytimewe're doing anything like like
you mentioned, like science wise, we're going to that park and
we have a pretty good sizedbackyard.
So it's a lot of moving aroundin that way.
And they were also very big ontaking trips, like little trips
(19:29):
Like, for instance I can'tremember what city it was, it
must've been Houston we had apass which allowed us to go to
the zoo and the museum at anypoint, and since our dad is off
during the week, he goes with uswhenever, like.
I think back of my like schoolexperience.
I don't really think of it asmuch in the house, especially
(19:51):
because, even though it wasn'tnecessarily a co-op, we had
friends who were alsohomeschooled, and so a lot of
the times it was us going totheir house.
My mom had a friend and Ibelieve she was a high school
Spanish teacher before, and sowe would go to her house and a
couple other people would comeover and we would all do a
Spanish lesson and thenafterwards we would all go play
(20:12):
outside in their backyardbecause they have like land.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
So learning and playing was kind of the routine,
and going to different places,so it wasn't just staying in the
house.
Yeah for sure.
How about that for you, lucy?
I guess you were on ships andthings.
You were moving all around whenyou were being educated.
And was mom doing all of that,or did your dad?
Speaker 4 (20:33):
help.
My dad helped some.
It was mostly my mom, though.
My dad has a verytime-consuming job.
What's your dad do?
He's in charge of themaintenance of both of the ships
that they have right now.
Oh, wow.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
So I think he's an engineer.
Speaker 4 (20:47):
He was an engineer, yes, and now he's more like
overseeing.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
So he had a really demanding job, day in and day
out, while you were traveling.
So your mom was doing it.
Did you have siblings?
I have one sister.
She's older than me, older thanyou, so you were both doing it,
but you would have been atdifferent grade levels, right?
Yeah, she's three years olderthan me, oh wow.
So did your sister ever helpyou to study or learn, or was
she ever a part of that?
(21:12):
Oh, we just got a funny lookwhen we said that.
Not at all, huh she tried.
Speaker 4 (21:17):
She was very nice if I asked her and stuff, but
eventually, like she is amechanical engineer and you're
the musician, she's alsomusician, she's just
multi-talented.
It's crazy.
But she would be able to helpme with stuff because she's good
at everything.
But then we'd get to like maththat I don't understand.
And so my senior year of highschool she said don't take math
(21:38):
at the co-op, I'll teach you athome with this curriculum we
already have.
That I took in high school andI think we got about two weeks
in and we fought so much that Isaid I'm doing it myself and I
almost failed that class but wewere good.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
Oh, wow, okay, Okay.
So did your sister go on tocollege?
Yes, she's graduating in May.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
Is she at UT Tyler?
She's at Laterno University.
Speaker 2 (21:59):
Laterno.
Okay, and did you come in as anhonor student too?
Speaker 4 (22:04):
To UT.
Speaker 2 (22:04):
Yes, so just a little thing here.
We've got three honors studentshere and I think we better take
a moment to talk about that fora minute.
We have an honors college at UTTyler, established by one of my
colleagues, dr Paul Stroyford,and it's not real easy to become
an honors student.
Could you tell us a little bitabout why don't we start with
you, ashley how?
Honors student.
Could you tell us a little bitabout?
(22:25):
Why don't we?
Speaker 5 (22:25):
start with you, Ashley.
How did you get picked to be inthe honors college?
Do you know?
Well, the only reason.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
We even knew about it in the first place was because
Whitney got accepted before me,your older sister.
Okay, and do you know what theapplications included?
Because it's very selective tobe in the honors college.
Speaker 5 (22:40):
It is the applications start with.
I think, just like atraditional application where
you tell them a lot ofinformation about yourself.
They ask you an essay.
Then, after the essay, theycall you in for an interview.
Whitney did hers in person, Ihad mine over Zoom.
I think it's changed a littlebit.
Then they interview you andthey make selections for who's
on what scholarship and who'saccepted into the cohort.
(23:02):
Do you all?
Speaker 2 (23:03):
get grades in homeschooling?
Do you have grades?
You have a class, I mean, soyou have an A in your English
class and an A in your, and sothey could look at your grades.
Did you all also take thingslike the SAT or the ACT test?
I did not.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
I took the TSI and like that one, but I didn't take
the SAT.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
Okay, and Lucy, you nodded, you did take.
Speaker 4 (23:24):
I took the SAT and PSAT.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
And what about you, Ashley?
Speaker 5 (23:28):
I took the SATs and I also took the TSI.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
The TSI is a set of tests that tells where you are
in your readiness for college.
So, backing up a minute, theHonors College is pretty special
too.
What do you do in the HonorsCollege?
What makes it different fromthe rest of the university, lucy
?
Speaker 4 (23:46):
Well, you get to take a world text class, a
literature class, basically foryour freshman year for two
semesters.
It's a lot of discussion andgetting to throw around ideas
that you read in these books.
The section I'm in started withGreek tragedies in the first
semester and then this semesterwe've done a lot of like Kant,
freud and Nietzsche, and so it'sbeen very interesting getting
(24:07):
to hear all the differingperspectives from all of these
kids who have very likedifferent backgrounds and, you
know, went to public school,private school, homeschool,
everyone's like kind of in there, so it's nice to be able to
discuss about it.
Speaker 2 (24:18):
I would just insert this right now my experience
with students who arehomeschooled is that they were
always really well motivated,really well prepared and engaged
in class and I felt as thoughwhoever their parents were had
done a great job.
And you know, I've worked withyou now, ashley, for a while and
I, although I haven't had youin class, my sense of you is
you're extremely responsible,resourceful, and I've heard the
(24:42):
same thing about the two of youas well, by the way, that you're
something special.
But I do know that when I'vetaught honor sections, that the
students were highly motivated.
Highly motivated students tendto be much more ready to engage.
They don't want to sit back.
Do you understand how yourhomeschooling made it possible
for you to be one of these moreactively engaged intellectual
(25:05):
students?
Speaker 4 (25:06):
I feel like homeschooling really gave me the
opportunity to like come intomy own person faster than other
people, because I've always beenme and it's so.
My parents have struggled withthat a little bit because, you
know, trying to raise a kidwho's not like you sometimes is
a little bit, hmm, but I thinkgetting to become my own person
and have my own thoughts reallyearly.
(25:26):
So, like going through my highschool years as a very confident
individual, I just lovedlearning, I loved consuming like
knowledge and I loved being inclasses and discussing and being
able to share my thoughts andlike go into places that, like
you know, you don't really getto go into when everyone around
you isn't as involved.
So I think joining the HonorsCollege and seeing other people
(25:48):
who are also really engaged andlike being engaged even if you
don't like say much in class,like you say this one comment
and like it goes 10 places andthen you know you've said one
thing in class the whole time,but you still get to sponge
everything in, I guess, and I'vereally enjoyed that for sure.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
I do think this is true.
There's something that you allhave done that has made you, I
think, lifelong learners.
What about that, Sarah?
Do you kind of understand whatI'm talking about there?
Do you feel like homeschoolingmade you a lifelong learner?
Speaker 3 (26:19):
I think that, and like what you were saying about
engaging too, in my head therewas never another option.
There was never another option.
Do you know what I mean?
Like versus, if I'm sitting ina classroom of 20 to 50 people
at the university yes, ma'am, orjust even like imagining myself
in a public school, I don'thave to be the one to raise my
(26:41):
hand to answer the question, tovolunteer my thoughts.
Whenever you're in a room witheither your siblings or by
yourself, or whenever you'retalking about those thoughts,
you have to be the one to engageand to talk about the ideas.
So it was never an option tojust like sink into the wall,
you know.
So I think that that's whatreally made it to where, when I
(27:03):
had to be engaged, whenever Ihad the option to be engaged, I
chose that because of my pastexperience with that.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
Well, and you're also with your siblings.
I mean, everybody has differentexperiences with siblings, but
I think you tend to know thatthey care about you and if they
tease you or make fun of youit's usually kindly meant.
I don't know, maybe yourbrother's a real stinker, I
don't know.
But I do know that oftentimeswe hear stories of children
being really intimidated bytheir classmates.
And I've had neighbors who I'mthinking about.
(27:32):
One daughter in particular,daughter of a friend in the
neighborhood who she started atthe local public school and she
was a little bit larger thansome of the other kids and had
been in a different schoolsystem and the kids were really
mean to her and they took herout and homeschooled her.
That worries me a lot, thatthat can happen.
(27:53):
My guess is that there'ssomething about the
homeschooling experience thatgives you a kind of intellectual
independence, a kind of naturalcuriosity that makes you an
ideal college student.
So how's college going for you,lucy, when you got here?
(28:19):
Was it any big surprise?
Any big differences?
Speaker 4 (28:22):
No, I've really just adjusted well.
It was pretty seamless for me.
I didn't feel overwhelmed oranything.
The amount of work I get herewas the same at my co-op.
Basically, I guess I have moreof a focus on music parts
because of my major, which I'vereally enjoyed, of course.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
How did you get to be a music major as a homeschool
kid?
Because usually I think ofschools as the places where they
have bands and orchestras.
So how'd that?
Speaker 4 (28:45):
work.
It was very interesting becausethe co-op I went to was very
STEM focused.
There's no arts at all, like Imean, well, ashley and I went to
the same co-op so we like therewas a journalism club and that
was about all that there was forlike arts related things,
unless you took like an artclass.
So there was no music.
Everything I've done in musichas been on my own and taking
(29:06):
lessons and stuff.
So I just so happened to takelessons with Dr Park, the
professor of voice here at UTTyler.
I took lessons with her in highschool and so then I had no idea
what I wanted to do when Igraduated.
So this was probably Februaryor January of last year and I
ran into her and she's like,come talk to me and we'll talk
about it.
And so she gave me this wholeplan of, like you know, start
(29:28):
with your BA in music so you'renot stuck in music if you want
to change.
And so then that's what I did.
I started and I'd never donechoir, never done theater or
anything.
So I was a voice major lastsemester in BA.
Then I eventually switched tothis semester.
I'm doing vocal performance asmy BM.
Speaker 2 (29:45):
So I know that you mentioned that your co-op was
pretty STEM oriented and I think, ashley, you've told me that
too, and I think you had somethoughts about that.
Speaker 5 (29:55):
You want to share those?
Yeah, lucy and I went to thesame co-op.
Actually she followed me herebut it was very STEM oriented.
Like she said, journalism onlybecame a thing when I was coming
into my freshman year in highschool and besides that, I think
they had theater, but that wasalways like a question mark
subject, because sometimes theyhad it, sometimes they didn't,
(30:16):
and it was always a very smallgroup of kids.
So it was very STEM focused andI was not a very STEM oriented
person.
Speaker 2 (30:23):
So you were an artistically inclined student,
and yet your co-op was a STEMplace.
You think about homeschoolingas being able to tailor things
to individual students' needsand interests, and so you're
telling me that maybe you felt alittle bit constrained.
Speaker 5 (30:43):
A little bit, but one thing about homeschooling is
that it teaches you.
If something is not already setup for you to go in and get
what you need, you buildsomething.
So I did not have a lot of thesame resources and having a
music class, having tons of funEnglish classes or something
like that, but that gave me moreroom to be like well, how can I
learn some of this stuff on myown?
(31:04):
And when I hit my senior yearin high school, they started
this new thing.
We were the first class to doit for the senior capstone
project, so it was completelycustomized to whatever the
student wanted to do.
They had to create a projectwith such and such criteria, but
the criteria were very broadand as long as you turned in
progress markers of your workand you would come to class and
(31:25):
share what you had.
Because of that, I got to go.
Oh well, you would come toclass and share what you had.
Because of that, I got to go.
Oh well, let me make a shortfilm, because I absolutely love
movies and I have never evencome close to knowing what's
involved in making one.
So it was a little bit of adumpster fire.
Wow, I say it was a dumpsterfire on my end, completely on my
(31:46):
end, because, like I said, I'dnever done any of this before.
But you know what?
I think I learned more fromthat project than I could have
by taking any kind of class inhow to make a movie.
Lucy came and she scored thefilm for me.
We got some art that we neededas props from a friend of mine
another one of the people, whowas my classmate, wonderful guy,
he was the main actor in it.
(32:08):
So all of this stuff I didn'thave necessarily the resources,
as in there's already a filmclass set up, there's already a
music class set up, there'salready these sorts of things
for you to go in and have theopportunity.
But homeschooling, inherentlylike, has room for you to create
your own opportunities and Ithink that's a valuable
experience of itself.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
So you all are all independent-minded people, but
are there any kids that youexperienced that you went to
homeschooling co-op with whomaybe weren't so self-motivated,
who weren't such good engagers?
Is that a problem?
Do you have some kids that justkind of sleep through it and
their parents just let?
Speaker 4 (32:46):
them.
There's a lot of kids inhomeschool who don't put in the
work needed.
So then they get to theirjunior senior year and they have
nothing that's there for themto be able to go to a good
college or anything and stuffNot a lot but a few of these
kids end up not being able tocomplete any sort of degree or
they just don't have any sort ofmeaning to their life after,
(33:09):
like, they finish theirschooling and some parents are
very enabling of allowing theirkids to just go through
homeschool and have easy school.
I guess it's not rigorous, it'sjust them getting the core
curriculum done that you need tograduate.
Sarah wants to say something.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Yeah, so I was just thinking of, like my own
experience, whereas most of theother homeschool people I had a
like knew a lot about were mybrothers, and so we are all
completely like oppositepersonalities.
And so whenever you saidparents enabling, I think that's
really what it comes down to,because I'm a very independent
(33:47):
do it myself, I'm going to putin the work, whereas my brothers
like some of them are morereserved or more like I'll kind
of like take what the world kindof gives to me, sort of things,
but we all had the same parents.
They weren't okay with that.
Do you know what I mean?
And so whenever you saidparents enabling, I think that's
when it comes down to, becausesome kids are going to go for it
(34:09):
and some are going to be muchmore like to the side, and so I
think if you are wanting tohomeschool your kids, I think
you have to be able to be thatwe're not going to let this fly.
Speaker 2 (34:24):
Yeah, it strikes me that it's incredible amount of
responsibility to be a parent,just a parent, for individual
kids especially.
Every child is different.
Every child deserves to betreated and brought up to what
their best selves are, and addinto that having to be their
teacher too.
That's a lot to put on a parent, and I'm sure that's probably
part of the reason why theseco-ops got developed, so that
(34:47):
they could kind of share it, Notonly because it's you know,
being a teacher and a parent isa hard thing.
But teaching math and music,teaching literature and biology,
you know that's a lot of thingsfor a parent to know.
What did you want to add tothat?
I think I saw you respond for aminute there, Lucy.
Speaker 4 (35:05):
Yeah, I think that a lot of just the co-op
development was definitely tocome alongside parents.
I mean, my mom's not really amath person, so her teaching me
math wouldn't have gone well,and so I think it's really cool
to have the opportunity that ifthere's a subject that you just
didn't excel in in school or youjust struggled with, always
it's like there's someone outthere who will teach your kid
(35:26):
for you and they'll get a goodeducation still.
Speaker 2 (35:40):
So what is social life like for kids in homeschool
?
Now, you were not in a co-op,right, sarah?
So did you have a social life,or was it just you and your
brothers?
Speaker 3 (35:49):
Yeah, so my house was the house that, like all my
friends, came over to.
So most of my friends I metthrough church or like my
parents' friends had kids and sowe had a good little group that
we knew, and a lot of it waspeople coming to our house and
hanging out with us.
Whenever I think about mychildhood, I don't just think
(36:10):
about my brothers and I in aroom.
There were always lots ofpeople around and friends.
Speaker 2 (36:13):
Do you think your parents intentionally encouraged
that because you all werehomeschooled, or was it just the
way your parents were?
They were just the family inthe neighborhood everybody loved
.
Speaker 3 (36:22):
A little bit of both, I would say for sure.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
And this is out in Palestine, which is a little
town.
Speaker 3 (36:28):
Yeah, it's small and so I think that they are very
intentional people in that way.
So they saw, we don't want themto be in a corner just knowing
each other, like we want them togrow and like talk to people
and be social, but then in theother way, that's just who they
are as people.
Ashley, what was your?
Speaker 2 (36:47):
social life like.
Speaker 5 (36:48):
I'd say it's pretty normal Co-ops have that a little
bit built into them.
But I think maybe a commonthing that I've heard from other
homeschoolers, regardless ofhow they set up homeschooling,
was that you don't have a groupthat's already inbuilt for you
to belong in.
So you end up kind of talkingto a lot of different types of
people and talking to everybody.
(37:09):
So we not necessarily in LA wehad a co-op in LA that we would
go take field trips with, knowthese other kids through, but
here especially we would joinlike homeschool sports groups.
Speaker 2 (37:22):
That's what I was going to ask about if you have
sports and musical performances.
Speaker 5 (37:27):
Oh yeah, I don't know about the music side of it, but
definitely there were sports.
My parents were coaches for themiddle school girls basketball
team.
They got it started and now Ithink they're fairly competitive
.
So there's other things thatyou get involved in, kind of
because you have to.
That's the other thing abouthomeschooling is that it really
takes the engagement of theparent because, like you said,
(37:49):
they're having to do all ofthese different things.
So if you're not engaged, ifyou're wanting to treat it like
maybe a public school, wherewell, we'll send our kids one
day a week and they'll do allthe stuff, but you're not
helping them to learn their owntime management and say, hey,
did you do your homework?
Sit around the dinner tablewith them and ask them how
things are going and talk aboutthings, then I don't think
(38:12):
homeschooling necessarily isgoing to work.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
Well, if we think about public school, we think,
okay, kids go to school.
Classes start probably at 7.30,8 o'clock in the morning.
They do stuff in the morning,they go to a big lunch cafeteria
and have lunch and they go dosome sports.
Or maybe they have class in theafternoon and they have some
sports and they go home by threeo'clock and maybe they have the
boys basketball team and thegirls basketball team.
We had a choir and all thosesorts of things, and so things
(38:36):
are kind of done for you and forparents.
The parents don't have to domuch but, as you said, send them
off, although I think a lot ofparents are involved in things
like the Parent TeacherAssociation and sometimes
parents are coaches and things.
But what I'm wondering about isdo you have a school day?
I know you said Tuesdays andThursdays you would go to the
co-op, but Monday, wednesday,friday, what'd you do?
Speaker 4 (38:59):
I did homework because they would send us home
with homework for the week.
So how it would work is youwould go to your class on
Tuesday and then they give youlike a week's worth of work that
you would turn in the nextTuesday or Thursday or whenever.
So that's a lot of timemanagement, isn't it?
Yeah, it is, isn't it Becauseyou don't have anyone over your
shoulder, like being like am Igetting it done Because we have
class that ends in like 15minutes Right?
Speaker 2 (39:20):
and you don't have a study hall where they say, okay,
do your homework.
Speaker 4 (39:22):
now there's no study hall, and so it was just up to
me to get it done.
Granted, I mean, I didn'talways do the best job of not
procrastinating until like theday before, but I would try to
get it done over like the fiveday period.
Speaker 2 (39:36):
Do you feel as though what you learned about how to
do that in homeschoolingenvironment has served you well
in college?
Are you just as good at timemanagement, or maybe you're just
so used to it?
Speaker 4 (39:46):
Yeah, it felt very natural coming in.
You know, there's some weekswhere I don't do as well as
other weeks, of course, but,like you know, just depends on
like the workload, practice andthings, and so it's been pretty
good.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
So it's about time to pull this thing together, and I
was wondering what was thebiggest challenge for you, Sarah
, coming to college from ahomeschool background.
Speaker 3 (40:17):
I think that for me, my biggest challenge didn't lie
in anything related to my actualeducation or time management.
I think that it was aboutfinding my support system and
finding my team here, whereas Iwas literally born into my team
and support system before, andso I know that this can be like
(40:40):
the way, obviously, with publicschool students as well.
But I think that they've kindof had that experience of like,
okay, this is the teacher I cango to for this.
You know, they've had to findthat a little bit more, whereas
I always knew who it was, and socoming to college, I'm like
okay, who can I go to for this?
Who's your family?
Yeah, who's my family here,since before my family covered
(41:04):
everything.
My family was my teachers, myfamily was everything in that
way.
So having to find my familycovered everything.
My family was my teachers, myfamily was everything in that
way.
So having to find my family incollege was a whole new learning
experience.
Speaker 2 (41:14):
Well, and you know, of course, one of the big
developmental shifts forcollege-age students is to find
a certain amount of autonomy sothat they stand alone without
their family.
Not that you ever, you know,not have your family, but you've
got to go on out in the worldone day without mom and dad, and
so has that been a challengefor you too no, I came out of
(41:34):
the womb wanting to go off on myown, so not really in that way
no.
Would you say the same thingfor your brothers?
Speaker 3 (41:42):
um, so actually one of them he had same experience.
He's kind of like quietindependent, I'm loud
independent.
But there's two more on the way.
One is starting school actuallythis coming fall, so I'm
curious to see how it looks forthem, because they're so
opposite of us and so what willbe their experience in that way?
Speaker 2 (42:03):
So, lucy, when you think about it, has there been
any particular challenge asyou've entered the college,
experience that you feel likeyour homeschool either really
helped you with or maybe didn'thelp you with as much?
Speaker 4 (42:16):
Not particularly.
I mean, I was lucky to comeinto the music program, where
it's very small and it's reallyeasy to connect with people.
So I have really good friendsand I get to be with them a lot,
because we have classes everyday for two semesters until like
the end of our sophomore yearwe're going to be together, so
Well and plus you had your musicteacher from when you were in
(42:36):
school before you came here, andI would say that that gives you
a certain continuity.
Yes, I was very set up before Igot here.
It was very nice.
I mean, I guess something likeI wasn't used to is like being
around so many people all thetime.
Well, to a certain extent I was, because living on the ships
you're around a lot of people,but we haven't lived there in a
(42:57):
little while.
So I've been at home, you know,and getting to stay home and
only go to school twice a week.
But now you know I have todrive in every day, like
commuting and stuff.
You have an hour every day.
It depends on the traffic, butit can be anywhere from 40
minutes to an hour.
But I have music.
We're good guys.
Speaker 2 (43:13):
Oh well, you're the music girl.
There you go, Okay.
So, ashley, can you answer thesame question?
Is there something that youwere either especially well
prepared for, maybe not as wellprepared for because of the
homeschooling as you came intothe university environment?
Speaker 5 (43:27):
I think one of the things that I felt really
prepared for, kind of like whatthey were talking about, is time
management skills, because youhave to do all of your stuff,
like when I was in kindergartenthrough elementary, when we were
in LA and it was just us athome, our mom, she bought us the
curriculums.
She'd leave a list for each ofus on the table, had our little
(43:47):
name on top of it and it was thelist of the stuff that we
needed to do homework wise.
Like chores like you know, feedthe dog, fold the laundry, do
the math, yeah, so there wasthat element of it where this is
what you have to do and there'slike our dad is working.
He worked from home, but he'sworking and so we have to do it
(44:09):
and like, if you don't do it,mom's going to come home and be
like why didn't you do your workyou had all this time.
It was empty space, literally.
What were you doing?
No-transcript.
(44:38):
Same way.
Speaker 2 (44:39):
Exactly.
I don't think you could havegotten away with that in a
public school, could you no?
So I guess we ought to kind ofwrap up there.
Is there anything that you allwanted to say about being a
homeschool student, or are theremisconceptions about homeschool
?
Are there things that you wantto?
I saw some nods there.
Speaker 4 (44:58):
I don't know.
I mean there's obviouslymisconceptions about like
they're all like not socialized.
I get called homeschool junglefreak like the Mean Girls movie
a lot.
Homeschool jungle freak yeah,in the movie because the get
called homeschool jungle freaklike the Mean Girls movie a lot.
Homeschool jungle freak, yeah,in the movie because the girl
was homeschooled in Africa.
That's what happened to me too,so we have to get the nickname,
I guess.
But like that's like one of thestereotypes is that you know,
(45:21):
they're all kind of just likegeeks, are like really like
conservative scary people, arelike really cult type person,
and so I think a lot of peopledo have that mindset.
Me and Ashley were talking tosomeone the other day who went
to a private school and he waslike yeah, y'all are just like
the most normal homeschoolersI've ever met.
Like who have you been meeting?
But I like to think that mosthomeschoolers are pretty normal,
(45:43):
at least the ones I hang outwith, do you?
Speaker 2 (45:46):
ever have to worry about a stereotype there, normal
at least the ones I hang outwith.
Speaker 3 (45:50):
Do you ever have to worry about a stereotype there,
sarah?
Yeah, I think that my biggestmisconception.
I think that it's everyhomeschool experience is quite
similar, whereas, like even likehere, y'all are a bit more
similar because y'all had thesame co-op, but we have very
different experiences and whatour homeschool community life
day-to-day looked like, and so Ithink that whenever someone's
(46:12):
like they either knew someonewho was homeschooled growing up,
they kind of assume that it's acopy and paste, very similar to
everyone's experiences, whereasI think that maybe even more
than public school, it's very,very different experiences.
Speaker 2 (46:29):
Yeah, I certainly gathered that from you all is
that it allowed you to be anindependent individual person.
There was freedom for you todevelop who you needed to be and
if you wanted to read on yourstomach all day long, and that
was fine.
You know, none of you seem tobe sociopaths or have bad habits
, and you know your grammar'sgood and your hygiene's good.
(46:50):
I'm teasing you, but I'm alsosaying that the thing I have
loved the most about myhomeschooled students is what
we've been talking about here,which is that you really do
engage and you seem to be livelylearners, and to me, that is
the biggest thing about collegeis that we want to keep you
learning, opening up the worldto you, and if you're already a
(47:10):
lively learner, if you'realready knowing how to engage
and you have time management,then you are on the road, and so
I hope that this is aninteresting program for people
who have been thinking about it.
There's a lot of information outthere if you want to look into
it for your children.
There's important stateregulations and rules and
standards.
If a parent is really motivatedto be both a parent and a
(47:34):
teacher and feel that they havethe skill, it does sound to me
like your parents are all prettyamazing, and I think oftentimes
amazing parents make amazingstudents, whether they're
homeschooled or not.
So I'm just real glad to havegotten to talk to you all today.
I guess that's a way to wrap itup, huh, Ashley, Do you want to
add anything or conclude of anyother thing?
Speaker 5 (47:55):
No, I don't think so, but if you're a homeschooler
and you have specific questionsabout coming to college,
definitely send us an email.
Our email is adrquestions atgmailcom and you can ask us
anything.
You could leave a comment underthe YouTube video if you're
listening to this on YouTube,and, yeah, we'll answer your
questions for you.
Speaker 2 (48:15):
Yeah, we're real eager to have our listening
audience to call in and talk tous about just about anything
that confuses them or intereststhem, and if I can't answer it
and Ashley can't answer it,we'll get Sarah and Lucy.
Ut Tyler is eager for thecommunity to know what a great
resource we are, and we'rereally happy to be here.
(48:36):
So I think that's a wrap, thankyou.
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