April 29, 2025 • 52 mins
This episode is sponsored by Better Help - https://betterhelp.com/askingforafriend
Your Skin's Glowing, But What About Down There? Let’s Talk.
We obsess over skincare, fitness, and aging gracefully—but when it comes to vaginal health? Total silence. Meanwhile, millions of women in perimenopause and beyond are battling dryness, painful sex, recurring UTIs, and feeling like no one warned them. It's time we change that.
In this bold and empowering episode, I sit down with Kate Wells, founder of Parlor Games, who’s on a mission to bring vaginal wellness into the spotlight. With a background in hormone science and a serious passion for women’s health, Kate is tearing down myths about estrogen, exposing the real risks of ignoring vaginal care, and revealing how simple hormone solutions can transform quality of life.
Ready to take charge of your midlife health and stop suffering in silence? Hit play—your body deserves better. 🎙️✨
You can find Kate Wells and Parlor Games at www.parlor-games.com
https://www.instagram.com/parlorgamesfun/
https://www.facebook.com/search/top?q=parlor%20games
Check out their website for amazing educational blogs and information on women's health.
This episode is sponsored by Better Help - https://betterhelp.com/askingforafriend for 10% off your first month of therapy
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mfolanfasterway@gmail.com
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Episode Transcript
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Michele Folan (00:00):
This episode of Asking for a Friend is sponsored
by BetterHelp.
Let's be honest midlife is aseason of transition, whether
it's changes in your body, yourrelationships, your career or
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(00:21):
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Visit betterhelpcom forward.
(01:01):
Slash Michele for a 10%discount off your first month
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Therapy isn't just for crisismoments.
It's for anyone who wants tofeel better, think clearer and
navigate life with moreconfidence Health, wellness,
(01:23):
fitness and everything inbetween.
We're removing the taboo fromwhat really matters in midlife.
I'm your host, Michele Folan,and this is Asking for a Friend.
Welcome to the show everyone.
Let's talk about something thatway too many of us are
(01:43):
struggling with in silence poorvaginal health.
We openly discuss skincare,workouts, the latest health
trends, but when it comes tothings like vaginal dryness,
discomfort and painful sex, theconversation suddenly goes quiet
.
And yet these issues affect somany women in perimenopause and
(02:03):
menopause, impacting not justintimacy but overall health,
confidence and quality of life.
I'm so excited to sit down withKate Wells, the founder of
Parlor Games, a company on amission to change the way we
think about vaginal care.
Kate saw a massive gap in themarket for women's intimate
(02:24):
wellness and set out to create ascience-backed, effective and
easy-to-use vaginal estrogencream that helps women feel
comfortable, vibrant andempowered in their bodies again.
In this episode, we're divinginto why vaginal health is a
non-negotiable, the sciencebehind estrogen therapy and the
risks of ignoring menopausesymptoms.
(02:46):
Plus, we'll talk about thebigger picture of menopause hot
flashes, brain fog, weight gainand the unexpected ways
declining estrogen affects ourbodies.
Kate Wells, welcome to Askingfor a Friend.
Kate Wells (03:01):
Thank you, michelle.
I am always happy if there's aday where I get to sit and talk
about hormones with someonewho's interested and can share
the message with other women.
So thank you for the invitation.
Michele Folan (03:14):
Well, happy to have you here and you know this
audience is very engaged intheir wellness and you know HRT
and hormone therapy and vaginalhealth are things that do come
up all the time.
I do want to let the audienceknow how Kate and I met.
(03:34):
So we met through DonnaCravatta.
Donna is the mastermind behindthe Real 50 Over 50.
She invited Kate and some otherpeople who are experts in the
menopause space and had me alongfor the ride on a panel
discussion.
That was incredible and thatpanel discussion came out.
(03:58):
Was it last week?
Kate Wells (04:00):
Yes, it was last week.
Michele Folan (04:01):
Okay, it was last week, so we're speaking on
March 26th, right now.
And so, anyway, long storyshort, Kate and I decided this
would be a wonderful topic forus to share with this audience.
So, again, welcome, thank you.
Yeah, so I think you've got afascinating career path.
Could you share a little bitabout your background and what
(04:24):
led you to where you are today?
Kate Wells (04:27):
Right.
It does have some twists andturns and of course you know at
age 62, when you look back andyou think, oh yes, that's what
the stepping stones were.
You know, when you're leapingfrom one to another through your
life, oftentimes it's a bit ofa blind leap.
So I began my career as ateacher.
(04:47):
I was a high school teacher inEngland and love teaching I do.
I love seeing anyone's eyes,doesn't matter what age group,
just like that dawn ofunderstanding of a concept or an
idea or something.
I love conveying information ina way that someone goes oh, I
(05:07):
get it.
And so I talked for about sixyears and I've always been
ambitious and I realized,recognized that if I was going
to have a career in teaching orin education, I would not be in
the classroom, I would not bedoing what I really enjoyed.
And so then I figured well, ifI am going to be in an
(05:29):
administrative or leadershiprole, how about business?
And I found my way into theLloyds Bank management training
program.
Lloyds Bank was one of themajor high street banks in the
UK and they had a pretty stillhave a pretty extensive
leadership training program andI got into that.
(05:49):
I was loving that, reallyenjoying discovering the process
of business.
And then my husband at the timecame along and said hey, I found
a job in Portland, Oregon.
Shall we go?
We were living in Brighton onthe south coast of England at
the time.
Brighton to Oregon that's oneheck of an Oregon trail, and so
(06:13):
long and short of that story islike heck.
Yes, let's go.
And the plan had been to behere for just a couple of years.
I would do my MBA at PortlandState and then we would go home
and start a family.
But we had so much fun inOregon.
We skied in the winter, webiked, we kayaked, we did all
the things and by the end ofthat first year it was like we
(06:37):
were going nowhere.
We had bought a house, I wasexpecting our first baby and
coming here and staying here hasjust it's been transformative
for this you know, short,slightly uptight British woman.
It's transformed me and that'sall a good thing.
And so I did my MBA and I havedone consulting work.
(07:01):
But a big portion of my workhas been in the integrative
medicine field.
I have worked in and run andled salivary hormone testing
laboratories.
I have worked as a productdevelopment specialist or
developer in a genetics testinglaboratory.
(07:23):
And you know, through all ofthis, I was the business person.
I am the business person, thebusiness person through and
through.
I love the business process.
However, I fell in love withthe biochemistry, particularly
of the endocrine system.
You know our hormone messagingsystem, and we would go to
conferences and, instead of justhanging out at the booth at the
(07:45):
table to wait for doctors toarrive, I would go in and I
would listen to all thepresentations and I would absorb
this information and, kind offrom an autodidact point of view
, taught myself filled in a lotof gaps in terms of biochemistry
and how the body works.
And through this process, Iwould then talk to, you know,
(08:06):
not the practitioners who are mycustomers, but the just
everyday people, my friends.
And I mean I can remember onetime I was at the dentist with
my daughter and we get talkingabout what I do and it's all
about saliva hormone testing andshe says, oh, oh, my breasts
are really tender.
Is that something to do with myhormones?
(08:28):
And then, before you know it,I've got six dental hygienists
sitting around me listening tome talk, while one of them is
working on my daughter's teeth,and it dawned on me that, you
know, women just don't know,they don't know what's going on
with their hormones.
And so it has been my mission,become my mission, to share
(08:50):
information in a way that makessense, that gets women to that
oh, I get it.
And once they get it, then theyfeel so much more empowered to
make some adjustments, to makesome changes, maybe to find a
practitioner or at least findsolution for some of the
symptoms.
So, you know, I worked in labs,did some more consulting work,
(09:13):
and then I, you know, I tried toretire I've actually tried to
retire twice, like that'shappened.
And then my best friend,Kirstie Hegg, who is my business
partner she and I have 50-50owners of Parlor Games she came
to me and said Kate, you know,I've got this issue with vaginal
dryness, do you know anythingabout that?
(09:33):
And I'm like oh, I am thefriend you've longed for.
And I gave her some estriolhormone cream and within a
couple of weeks transformed herbody back into its
well-functioning state.
Michele Folan (09:49):
Amazing, how that happens.
Kate Wells (09:51):
I just I mean now she's an entrepreneur, she's a
serial entrepreneur, and so wesat around, as women do,
plotting revolutions in parlors,and decided that we had to
bring this to the world.
I knew that there was such agap in knowledge and information
and there was such a gap inresources for women,
(10:14):
particularly for vaginal health,for urinary health, and she has
this direct to consumerexperience which I don't have.
Mine is all wholesale, it'sworking with practitioners, and
so we have combined ourexperience.
I have this business managementexperience and the science
knowledge, and she has themarketing and depth of
(10:38):
experience over there.
And that brought us together toform and grow Parlor Games.
And it has been a wild ride, Itell you.
Michele Folan (10:49):
So what has surprised you most about this
journey, Kate?
So?
Kate Wells (10:54):
One of the things that I found for me.
I think I have always beensomeone who made things happen.
I'm a doer in the world, I makethings happen.
I'm a doer in the world, I makethings happen.
But I found my way into Reikias a hands-on, energetic healing
modality and that allowed me tocontinue to develop my
(11:16):
spiritual side, my spiritualrelationship with the universe
and with the source, and throughthat I have learned to trust
and allow.
And now my life is less aboutmaking things happen and it's
about allowing things happen.
(11:37):
And 20 years ago, if I had everthought that that sentence would
come out of my mouth, Just noway.
So that I think that maturingwithin myself to know that I
have this unique experience ofliving what I am here to do in
this lifetime, I mean thatoperates at kind of a
(11:58):
vibrational level within me.
And whenever I begin to get,you know, frayed, because I'm a
little bit busy, I've got toomany things on my plate or, you
know, once again we're hiringand that just adds a load, Then
I just I take a deep breath andI calm myself and I'm like, oh
no, I remind myself you are inthe right place at the right
(12:19):
time doing the right thing andallow, just allow, and I think
that's one of the things thathas surprised me most.
Michele Folan (12:28):
Oh, can we go back to that?
Let's go back to that.
Yes, of course, Because that issomething that I want women to
understand practice, I thinkthat was a genius thing you just
said about it's not alwaysabout making things happen, it's
about letting things happen,and that we don't always have to
(12:53):
be in total control ofeverything.
Right, that was that was I.
I like that.
That was.
That was my inspiration for theday.
Thank you very much, Kate Wells.
Great Appreciate that, I'm glad.
Yeah, I kind of needed thattoday as a matter of fact.
So, thank you.
Kate Wells (13:12):
I think it takes a little courage because you are
letting go of control.
You are saying to the world Iwant to be of service, I want to
make a difference.
I have a vague idea what thiscould mean, but bring it, I am
at your service and here we arefrom my point of view.
(13:34):
But it takes the courage to nothold on so tightly to control.
Yeah.
Michele Folan (13:42):
I want to talk a little bit about the science of
things.
Vaginal health is a topic thatstill probably doesn't get
enough attention.
I mean, I hear about it justbecause of the people I follow
on Instagram and I follow you,but can you break down why
(14:04):
vaginal estrogen is so importantfor midlife women?
Kate Wells (14:08):
Yeah, absolutely I'll talk about.
I'll bring several concepts inwhich are kind of woven together
.
But one of the things I'llstart with is let's just think
about our skin barrier.
You know, we can look at theback of our hand, our arms, we
can look at our face and we seeour skin, that skin barrier, the
integrity of that, how it holdstogether, is critical for the
(14:32):
health of the whole organismthat we are, our entire body,
because the skin barrier, thisorgan, keeps pathogens out.
So we want to make sure thatour skin is healthy.
I mean, women put a lot ofmoney into making sure their
skin is healthy and supple, butwhat we don't tend to think
about is the skin layer thatlines the vagina and yet it's
(14:55):
still very much part of thiswhole skin layer system.
Now, estrogen is very importantfor the maintenance of the skin
that lines the vagina.
And as we go through menopausethat menopause transition where
our periods have all gone tohell in a handbasket and we
(15:16):
don't know what's happening thatis an indicator that estrogen
levels are beginning to drop.
And then post-menopause youknow, once we've had that period
of time of 12 months without aperiod and we are technically
post-menopause transition, ourestrogen levels really are low
at this point.
Now it can take a little whilefor this to be felt, or it can
(15:38):
be felt immediately.
But the skin cells in thevagina are sitting there saying
give me estrogen people, give meestrogen people, give me
estrogen, people.
I could be with some estrogenhere.
And when they don't have enough,the skin loses its strength.
And so then if somebody iswanting to be in an intimate
relationship with their partner,penetrative sex can be painful,
(16:02):
you know you're.
Oh, let's just be straight outabout this.
You're putting somethinghopefully hard and um uh large
in there and that's rubbingagainst that skin.
It's moving backwards andforwards a lot, yeah, and so if
we're not careful, that skin isgetting thinner and thinner, it
may tear.
And once you begin to getlittle micro tears in the skin,
(16:28):
the body's going to try andrepair that.
I mean, think about, you know,when you're a kid and you fell
off your bike and you grazedyour knee.
The first thing your immunesystem does is like, oh, quickly
, repair, repair, repair.
And it puts a little skin overthere and forms a scar and you
pick at it and your mother saysstop picking at that, just let
it heal.
Michele Folan (16:47):
Your mom too.
Kate Wells (16:49):
I mean, it's really hard to imagine the inside of
your vagina like just one longscab, but it can get to be like
that for some women who havebeen really, really starved of
estrogen and so, as the immunesystem is frantically trying to
repair that skin, it's localizedinflammation.
(17:12):
It's part of the healingprocess.
But if that doesn't happen,it's just low-grade, continuous
inflammation.
And when the body is in aninflamed state, that is the root
of many of other diseases, suchas Alzheimer's.
That is very stronglycorrelated with the state of
(17:35):
inflammation in the body.
So we want to supplement withestrogen to make sure that that
vaginal tissue has its supply tokeep that tissue strong and
supple.
And it's also important formaintaining the pH of the vagina
, and making sure that you havea low pH is critical for making
(18:00):
sure that bacteria can't get inthere and start to multiply and
cause infection.
Michele Folan (18:06):
I had a client who was talking about her mother
and her mother-in-law.
She was taking care of both ofthem.
Both of them got UTIs and theywere in their 80s, right, she
said their UTI presented likedementia, like dementia in 24
(18:27):
hours, kind of like didn't knowhow to turn a light off with the
light switch, kind of scary.
And you know they finallyfigured out oh it's a UTI.
But you know, she said had theybeen on estrogen therapy
vaginal estrogen therapy theyprobably could have done a great
(18:50):
deal to curtail these recurringUTIs in both her mom and her
mother-in-law.
Can you talk about why?
That is why there's aconnection with UTIs and vaginal
health?
Kate Wells (19:01):
Absolutely, and I too have had that experience
about a year ago I had thispersistent UTIs and vaginal
health Absolutely, and I toohave had that experience.
About a year ago I had thispersistent UTI that I could not
get rid of and I went to aconference.
I was exhibiting at aconference and I remember
clearly opening this box of allthe things I need to put on my
table and I'm just looking atthis box, going, huh, I know I'm
(19:25):
supposed to do something withthis and my daughter was helping
me and I just looked at her andsaid help, my brain could not
put it together and I've got adecent brain and for it to just
not function like that, it wasfrightening.
(19:45):
So the connection is that justas we have estrogen receptors in
the vagina, we also havereceptors little doorways to the
cell, in the urethra and thetube that goes from the bladder
to the outside world.
We have receptors for estrogenall around the bladder and in
(20:05):
the muscles that are around thebladder, neck, and so again,
with a lack of estrogen, some ofthe function of the muscles and
the bladder and the urethrawill be diminished and just as
you can get sort of microtearing in the vagina, you can
get disruptions to the skinsurface and the urethra and that
(20:30):
makes it so much moresusceptible to pathogens.
And when we think about youknow all the exits in a woman,
they are very closely located,very closely located.
It is super easy for E coli toget from the anus to the urethra
, to the vagina, and not to puttoo fine a point on it, but we
(20:51):
get wrinkly, the vulva getswrinkly, the skin is losing its
collagen and in all thosewrinkles it's so much easier for
little pathogens to be sittingin there and then transferred to
the vagina or to the urethra.
So our likelihood of getting Ecoli, in particular where it
(21:13):
shouldn't be, increases, andthen we don't have the defenses
to fight it off.
So UTIs are way more common.
But here is another conceptthat I have been doing a lot
more reading about and reallytrying to dig into, and that is
the concept of biofilm.
Now, biofilm is a kind of amucus-like film that bacteria
(21:38):
will put around them to protectthemselves from antibiotics.
And so someone has a UTI andthey get antibiotics for that,
and the antibiotics will oftenknock out 80 to 85% of those
pathogens of the bacteria.
But there is a portion of themthat may get stored in biofilm
(22:03):
on the layer inside of thebladder, and so, when
circumstances are right, theycan begin to grow again, and
then you have a repeat.
Michele Folan (22:14):
UTI, yeah, and it becomes resistant, that's right
.
Kate Wells (22:18):
Yes, so you might be able to knock out the majority
of the bacteria be able to knockout the majority of the
bacteria, but not all of them.
So there are ways to disruptthe biofilm and there are some
good nutraceutical companies outthere that make products for
that.
But this is just a, you know,it's a concept that is only just
(22:43):
beginning to have moreconversation about it.
Yeah, so, but because of theinflammation that occurs with
the UTI, it quickly can go tothe brain, where it is,
resulting in that confusion andthose dementia-like symptoms.
Michele Folan (23:04):
You know, someone close to me was having a lot of
genitourinary issues and theystarted on vaginal estrogen
therapy game changer, likelife-changing results for that
(23:31):
person.
And I talk to my friends allthe time about the importance of
vaginal health and going on.
You know vaginal estrogen and Istill get pushback.
I get, oh well, I'm not havingsex with my husband anyway, or
I'm not too worried about that,and I'm like, look, you may not
have issues right this second,but this is important for when
(23:56):
we're looking 5, 10, 15 yearsdown the road, you're going to
wish you did this and we'regoing to take a quick break,
Kate, but when we come back I dowant to talk about some of the
confusion around estrogen safety.
When I turned 60, I caughtmyself thinking is it time to
(24:16):
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Okay, we're back.
Before we took the break, Imentioned that I wanted to talk
about estrogen safety, and canyou demystify the science and
address the common concerns thatwomen have around estrogen
(25:21):
therapy?
Kate Wells (25:22):
Yes, yes, I feel this is definitely one of my
missions is to try and changethe dialogue here, not just
among individuals, among women,but among practitioners too.
So there was a large-scalestudy that went underway in the
late 1990s looking at theimpacts of using hormone
(25:45):
replacement therapy and this issynthetic hormone replacement
therapy, you know based onpregnant mare's urine.
And four or five years intothis, some of the early results
suggested that there were somerisks and the early analysis of
some of the data suggested thatthis big message was really
(26:09):
important to share to the world.
Estrogen causes cancer.
Now I will just say that thatis nonsense.
If somebody does have breastcancer and it's estrogen
receptor, positive estrogen mayfeed it.
Positive estrogen may feed it,but it is highly unlikely to
cause it.
Michele Folan (26:34):
Well, and if you think about it, kate, if
estrogen caused cancer, we'dhave a bunch of 20-year-olds
with cancer.
Sorry, it doesn't work that way, and I do want to clear this up
too.
This is like PremPro andPremarin that were used in the
study.
Kate Wells (26:49):
Okay, yeah, the synthetic hormones.
So at the time, you know, thiswas massive news hit the media
and practitioners just pulledwomen off their hormone
replacement left, right andcenter, and there has been a gap
of 20 years where women havebeen very underserved because of
(27:09):
this false interpretation ofthe results.
Now those results have beenreanalyzed multiple times.
There was one arm of that studythat continued using just
estrogen, not estrogen plus theprogestin, and discovered that
actually estrogen can beprotective against breast cancer
(27:33):
in many breast cancers.
So over time that message isgradually being unwound.
However, it's not translatingyet into many medical practices
and that message is nottranslating or transmuting
through into our generalconversations.
And practitioners will stillsay to patients and we hear from
(27:54):
them a lot, from our customersthey will say, well, you know,
we'll put you on, but we want toget you off it as soon as
possible.
And that's because they'retalking about the synthetic
hormones and there are potentialrisks with these synthetic
hormones, particularly if theyare oral hormones.
(28:15):
When someone takes a hormonethrough the mouth it goes into
the stomach and then it is, youknow, shunted off to the liver
to be broken down.
That's the first thing.
That is a big, important rolethat the liver has, and studies
are beginning to indicate thatif the liver is breaking down
these oral hormones, they aremore likely to be broken into
(28:38):
metabolites that can increasethe risk for developing breast
cancer.
So it's become pretty wellestablished, certainly in
integrative medicine, functionalmedicine fields, that oral
estrogen is not the way to go.
Topical estrogen means you canuse less of a hormone because it
(29:00):
doesn't have to be first brokendown by the liver, it can just
go straight into the system andit is much safer to use than an
oral estrogen.
Michele Folan (29:10):
Oh, I was going to ask you a question, so I want
to make sure that we're goingto differentiate.
When you say topical estrogen,you're talking about one that
you would, a cream that youwould rub into your arm or a
patch, correct, because vaginalestrogen is not absorbed
systemically, correct, that'sright.
Kate Wells (29:29):
Okay, Because it's in small amounts.
You just need a small amount.
The vast majority of it will beused locally.
A little bit may pass throughinto the bloodstream, but
estriol is so protective thatit's not a problem, isn't that?
Michele Folan (29:45):
Okay, I wanted to make sure we cleared that up,
so all right, okay.
Kate Wells (29:49):
So there are a growing number of practitioners
who recognize that, ohabsolutely, women have to have
hormones.
Just because they're done withthe reproductive phase of their
life does not mean that theirbodies are finished with
hormones.
We need them for so manyfunctions throughout our body,
and so increasing numbers ofpractitioners are suggesting
(30:13):
that they use topical cream, atopical estrogen, a topical
progesterone, which delivers thehormone directly into the
system for use throughout thewhole body.
Now, some practitioners arestill not open to that, and so
women are taking things intotheir own hands and going to
(30:35):
look for solutions, and that'swhere we come in.
We really want to provide theeducation, the knowledge, share
the science, as well as haveproducts that really work.
Michele Folan (30:45):
So tell me a little bit about what you offer
and how people go about gettingyour product.
Kate Wells (30:53):
So we offer.
Our flagship product, the onewe started with Kirstie and I
started with is a vaginalestriol cream, and it's a very
small amount in there, justenough to help rebuild that
tissue.
And that, by far, is what wehear the most about from our
customers.
(31:13):
We get messages like oh, you'vesaved my life, you've saved my
marriage, I can be intimateagain, I can go outside my house
without fear of peeing again.
So you know that's what we getmost of the feedback about.
However, if someone is going tobe using estrogen even the
(31:34):
estriol in our cream, you knowit's a good idea to have some
progesterone in there as well,and progesterone is a superhuman
hormone.
It's important for men, it'simportant for women, for women,
you know, and we run out of it,we start making it, um, and you
know our adrenal glands aresupposed to be our little backup
(31:54):
system, but you know everyone'sso stressed and people's
adrenal glands are so tired thatthey're not making progesterone
.
They're struggling to makecortisol, and so the
progesterone has it's over 400functions within the body, and
so adding some of that back inis important.
And then we have a DHEA cream.
(32:15):
That's a whole other topicabout the importance of DHEA for
overall wellness.
And then we have a fun product.
It's called Chaos Calmer and itis for it's for anxiety, and
you know there's a lot of thataround, and so it's to help with
(32:36):
that.
Michele Folan (32:37):
Oh, okay.
Well then you get the anxietybecause your cortisol is, you
know, pumping out, you know,over time.
Right, it's amazing how all ofthis is so interconnected, right
?
You get the sleeplessness andthose issues that progesterone
(33:00):
will definitely help with.
You talk a little bit aboutthat, like just some of the
other things that progesteronedoes help with.
Oh, yes.
Kate Wells (33:09):
So one of the things that women experience as
they're going throughperimenopause and through
menopause is weight gain, and alot of that can be due to a
contributory fact is the factthat their progesterone levels
are dropping.
You know, progesterone isimportant for helping manage
insulin and management of bloodsugar, and if we're not able to
(33:33):
utilize food for energy, to getthe blood sugar into the cell to
burn, to create energy, then itgets shunted off and stored as
fat tissue and progesteronehelps with the management of all
of that.
So that's one thing.
Progesterone also has someinteresting relationships with
(33:54):
the neurotransmitters, theneurochemicals in our brain.
Progesterone some of it, ismetabolized into
allopregnanolone and then fromallopregnanolone that will
prompt the production of GABA.
And GABA is one of our calmingneurotransmitters.
It's the one that helps us calmdown, helps us feel relaxed,
(34:18):
and it's a counterbalance to theexcitatory neurotransmitter
glutamate.
And we do need some glutamate,but when we live stressful lives
there's a tendency to make toomuch of it and we've got to have
it balanced by GABA.
But if progesterone has dropped, that's one of our major
(34:39):
sources for making GABA or forprompting the production of GABA
.
So mood so it helps with mood,helps with weight management, um
it, uh.
Progesterone is important forcardiovascular health.
It helps um for want of abetter phrase you know, keep,
(35:00):
keep the veins and arteries,keeps them smooth and healthy so
there's less likely to be alittle rupture in there.
And, of course, once you getapture, you need to repair that
and you get a little scar andthen if there's a scar there,
then there's an increased riskof a blood clot.
So all these little steps inthe process, and then the other
(35:22):
one, of course, is memory.
Progesterone is important forthe ability to remember
information, to form newmemories, and it's not like
we're going off, you know, to goto college at age 60.
I mean, I have thought aboutthat and thought no.
Michele Folan (35:42):
Wouldn't surprise me if you did.
Kate Wells (35:47):
But we do need to remember things.
Like you know, we need to plotour ways around a town.
You know we need to map things.
You know, when we go to thegrocery store, we need to map
where we find things.
Michele Folan (35:57):
We have to be able to find our car to go back
out to the parking lot right.
Kate Wells (36:04):
So we still need our memories and we want our
memories for the you know, 35,40 years after menopause, for
heaven's sake.
Michele Folan (36:11):
So those are just some highlights there, yeah,
and so, and kind of back toestrogen too, and this is one
that we didn't talk about, butbone health, the importance of
of using estrogen for our bonehealth, I mean mean that's a
huge one, because the data outthere is not kind when it looks
(36:36):
at fracture and death rates.
I should say morbidity rates.
Death rates Right, it's alittle harsh, but morbidity
rates, so that's the other one.
So I always tell my listenerslook, if you're a candidate for
hormone therapy, find someonethat will listen to you, because
(36:56):
I think oftentimes we just thedoctor says no and we just say
okay and we don't advocate forourselves.
So, Kate, how do people goabout getting your products?
Are they prescription?
No, these are over the counter.
Kate Wells (37:12):
You know these are hormones and gosh.
I think you know products likeours have been available for,
you know, 30, 40 years.
You know demand is growing.
There are a growing number ofwomen who are not just saying to
their doctor, okay, they'resaying all right, well, I'm
(37:34):
going to sort this out on my ownIf just because you don't know
doesn't mean there isn't asolution for me.
And they are on there lookingfor products.
So you know our website,parla-gamescom.
So parla-gamescom,parlor-gamescom.
You know we've got so manyarticles in our blog section, so
(37:54):
go have a read through there.
You can read to your heart'scontent.
I think for quite some timegoing through our blogs and our
products are all listed on there.
But one of the things that wehave that I think sets Parlor
Games apart is that we have acommunity.
We have a private Facebookgroup that is just for customers
(38:15):
and in this group, customersare able to ask questions of
each other.
I mean it's 35,000 strong, plusnow it's a lot of women in
there and there will be posts.
Like you know, I've been inthis group for six months.
I'm very shy and they'reposting anonymously.
(38:37):
This is the first time I've hadthe courage to ask this
question, and they'll ask aquestion about their intimate
health and before they know it,they've got 80 responses, and I
love that.
Michele Folan (38:52):
It's fantastic, yeah, I mean I love the fact
that women are willing to say,oh, this is what I did, or I
hear you.
Women just want to know thatthey're not out there alone on
an island, Right, that they'rethe only ones experiencing these
issues.
(39:12):
And the other thing is, Kate isthere are so many wacky
symptoms of perimenopause andmenopause that I mean we have no
idea.
I mean I started having seriousperimenopause probably in my
40s.
I had no idea that's what itwas.
No one, I had never even heardof perimenopause.
Probably in my 40s.
I had no idea that's what itwas.
No one, I'd never even heard ofperimenopause till I was well
(39:34):
into my 50s.
So women just aren't fed thatinformation and they may be
walking around with somethingthat could be so easy to solve
with some hormone therapy.
Yeah, Right.
Kate Wells (39:48):
Well, certainly from a perimenopause point of view,
I was very fortunate to knowabout progesterone.
Progesterone starts to drop inour I would say early 40s,
because we think about how thebody works.
We get a surge of estrogen inthe first half of the month and
(40:12):
this is what is prompting thatuterine lining to grow ready to
receive an implanted egg.
Then, once the egg is releasedfrom the ovary and is beginning
to, you know, make its way alongthe fallopian tube, it has a
little sack around it and thatsack is the um, what's called
the corpus luteum, and that iswhere the progesterone is stored
(40:35):
.
Now that gives us a surge ofprogesterone in the second half
of the cycle.
It says to estrogen okay, holdit, you've grown enough.
Now we're going to stop andwe're going to, you know,
concentrate and we're going toimprove the quality of this
uterine lining.
But it's the stopping pointthat makes estrogen stop.
(40:57):
All this just like grow, grow,grow, grow, grow.
Now, as we get into our 40s,particularly if we've got a
stressful set of activitiesgoing on in our life, we begin
to miss ovulation.
We still get a period, butwe're not ovulating every month.
And when you're not ovulating,you're not making that surge of
progesterone.
In the second half You're stillmaking your estrogen, but it is
(41:21):
unbalanced by that progesteroneand that is when your symptoms
start to happen, becauseestrogen it's great, but too
much of it is not.
It can lead to bloating, it canlead to imbalances in mood, it
can lead to poor sleep becausewe don't have the chemical
(41:41):
messengers to help our braincalm down and rest for sleep.
So those early symptoms, onceyou begin to see those, a woman
can begin to start to useprogesterone.
And I was so lucky that I knewthat and could start using
progesterone in the same volumethat I used to.
And that I mean I don't.
(42:14):
This is not a brag, it's anillustration.
But I flew through thatmenopause transition because I
had adequate progesterone and myestrogen gradually dropped and
dropped and dropped andeventually caught up with, you
know, low internal production.
But because I was balanced allthe way through and I had that
(42:36):
supply of progesterone bysupplementing, I think I had
like five hot flashes and youknow, yeah, it makes a world of
difference, yeah.
Michele Folan (42:46):
I've never told my audience this story, but I
did have a hysterectomy back in2021 because I had very large
fibroids uterine fibroids andthe doctor she was wanting to do
the surgery, but she said Iwould feel more comfortable if
(43:07):
we could shrink these fibroids alittle bit.
So she put me on a course ofLupron, which, for people
listening, lupron is a drug thatwas, I believe, developed for
prostate cancer to shut offhormones hormone production in
men, to quit feeding theprostate cancer.
(43:27):
So it cut off the testosterone.
So what essentially they weretrying to do with me was shut
off all my hormones that werepossibly feeding the growth of
these fibroids.
Well, it didn't work, but theonly thing it was successful in
doing was totally shutting offevery bit of estrogen,
(43:50):
progesterone, testosterone,anything that my body was taking
.
So by the time I had thishysterectomy and everything's
gone right, I was just depleted.
There was nothing.
And I didn't realize until theyran some numbers, got all my
hormone numbers and they're likeoh, Michele, we got to get you
(44:14):
going again.
So that was vaginal estrogen, Idid oral estrogen, I did
progesterone, I did testosteroneall at once because I needed
some help, right.
So I'm a big, big fan of HRTand what it can do for women.
(44:34):
So I so appreciate the paththat you were on and getting
this message out to women, and Ilove the community, Kate, that
you've built.
Kate Wells (44:47):
Well, and that is a little bit of why we went with
Parlagate for our company name.
You know we picked Parlorbecause you know women, as I
said right at the beginning,women have gathered.
We've gathered in parlors andcups of tea, in our knitting or
sewing, and plotted revolutionsfor a long time.
(45:08):
You know, women have alwaysgathered in community and made a
difference through that,sharing ideas, helping each
other out.
It's what we do as women.
I joined the business world inthe UK, you know, in the early,
early 90s, in the in the earlyearly 90s, and I think the UK is
(45:36):
behind the US in terms ofdiversity in the workplace and I
still, and I really had thegrew up with this feeling there
that I, I had to be like a manto be successful, um, and, and
so I I'm conscious of how thatis not a collaborative
environment.
And yet when you get womentogether, they are so
collaborative.
Our company, all but one personis female and we have such a
(46:02):
collaborative environment.
It's teamwork here year, andyou know, we, we there is this
growing virtual community ofpeople like you who are engaging
women together in in a virtualway to build community, and it
it is the way we change theworld for other women and help
(46:26):
each other out.
We have done that since therehave been women and I think we
should.
You should be applauded foryour part in that, just as much
as you know for how much ParlorGames is helping women feel safe
discussing these intimateissues.
Michele Folan (46:42):
Well, thank you for that, and I sometimes having
these conversations means wehave to be a little vulnerable
ourselves.
Having these conversationsmeans we have to be a little
vulnerable ourselves and becauseI want other women to know hey,
this has been my experience,this is what's happened with me
and it's okay, you know.
It's okay to talk about it andI love it when friends will call
(47:04):
me and say, hey, I have aquestion for you, and I love
that.
I love being that friend thatpeople feel comfortable with.
So anyway, Kate, running acompany is very demanding and
stressful.
What are some of your personalself-care non-negotiables?
(47:27):
What do you do for yourself?
Kate Wells (47:29):
The first thing I do is guard my sleep.
You know, my partner and Isleep separately.
We sleep in different rooms.
He is restless, and he willoften wake in the night and want
to read in order to get back tosleep.
My legs flail around the bed asif I was playing soccer, and we
learned early on that we bothsleep and get better sleep if we
(47:53):
sleep separately, and so Iguard my sleep.
It is my space.
When it gets to nine o'clock,I'm turning the lights off.
It's like I'm not talking toanyone, my phone's turned off.
I guard that first thing.
So then exercise, exercise.
I do love to be outside.
(48:13):
It's a little harder as I getolder to be outside a lot in
winter.
I live in grand junction,colorado, where it is cold in
winter.
It is cold, but getting outsideis important, and I have found
I mean, you know, for heaven'ssake, at at this point, I know
myself I do better when I've gota goal to chase, and so you
(48:34):
know I had not been getting outto do the hiking that I want to,
and last Thursday I was outthere, beautiful day, thinking
all right, I need a goal.
I'm going to do at least 100miles by my birthday in August.
My stretch goal, 100 miles is aminimum.
This is on mountain trails 120is really the goal, 140 is a
(48:58):
stretch goal and if I get to 150miles by then, like I'm the
queen.
So I set myself goals because Iwork that way, eating right, we
eat super healthily, and then,you know, keeping that spiritual
grounding, you know, as we weretalking about earlier, not
(49:18):
allowing myself to get into atizzy about having to manage it
all, but really just allowing,allowing what is and living a
life of gratitude.
Oh my goodness, yeah, oh mygoodness, I'm so grateful.
Michele Folan (49:36):
I think all of those are terrific.
Those are great.
What is your hope for ParlorGames and its impact on women's
health in the long run?
What do you have brewing there,Kate?
What do you have brewing?
Kate Wells (49:48):
there, Kate.
Well, so this is such aninteresting question because,
you know, it is literally fiveyears ago today that Kirsten and
I sat down and had our veryfirst conversation about this.
Michele Folan (50:01):
Oh, happy anniversary, I know.
Kate Wells (50:14):
And where we two have projected, you know, looked
into the future, like fiveyears from now it's.
We could not have possibly comeup with the vision of what that
this would be.
We just knew that we wanted tohelp women, that we wanted to
have a good product.
Um, we wanted to be smart aboutit I mean, we're smart
businesswomen and so it's neverbeen about, you know,
particularly chasing somethingabout other than just continuing
(50:38):
the mission, you know, and ourmission is to save the world,
one vagina at a time.
And I think, as long as we keepdoing that and we back it up
with sound science and goodbusiness acumen and a sense of
humor and kindness andcompassion, I think that's my
(50:58):
goal, is that we keep doing that.
Yeah, you know, and who knowswhere this ends up.
But if we keep doing that, youknow we're making a difference.
And Kirstie's the same.
She thinks exactly the same.
I mean that's one of thebeauties of this experience is
that, I mean, for all that we'revery different, we share such
(51:22):
common goals, and that helps uswork together so well as
business partners.
Michele Folan (51:29):
Yeah, that's great.
Hey, Kate, can you please sharewith the audience where they
can find you and Parlor Games?
Kate Wells (51:36):
So we are we're all over Facebook, we're all over
Instagram, but really you willget the best information.
Go straight to our website atwwwparlor-gamescom.
Michele Folan (51:51):
All right, all that information will be in the
show notes.
Kate Wells, thanks for beinghere today.
Kate Wells (51:57):
Michelle, it's been lovely.
Thank you so much for yourinterest and for such cool
questions.
Nicely done.
Michele Folan (52:05):
Well, thank you, I try.
This episode of Asking for a Friend is sponsored
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fitness and everything inbetween.
We're removing the taboo fromwhat really matters in midlife.
I'm your host, Michele Folan,and this is Asking for a Friend.
Welcome to the show everyone.
Let's talk about something thatway too many of us are
(01:43):
struggling with in silence poorvaginal health.
We openly discuss skincare,workouts, the latest health
trends, but when it comes tothings like vaginal dryness,
discomfort and painful sex, theconversation suddenly goes quiet
.
And yet these issues affect somany women in perimenopause and
(02:03):
menopause, impacting not justintimacy but overall health,
confidence and quality of life.
I'm so excited to sit down withKate Wells, the founder of
Parlor Games, a company on amission to change the way we
think about vaginal care.
Kate saw a massive gap in themarket for women's intimate
(02:24):
wellness and set out to create ascience-backed, effective and
easy-to-use vaginal estrogencream that helps women feel
comfortable, vibrant andempowered in their bodies again.
In this episode, we're divinginto why vaginal health is a
non-negotiable, the sciencebehind estrogen therapy and the
risks of ignoring menopausesymptoms.
(02:46):
Plus, we'll talk about thebigger picture of menopause hot
flashes, brain fog, weight gainand the unexpected ways
declining estrogen affects ourbodies.
Kate Wells, welcome to Askingfor a Friend.
Kate Wells (03:01):
Thank you, michelle.
I am always happy if there's aday where I get to sit and talk
about hormones with someonewho's interested and can share
the message with other women.
So thank you for the invitation.
Michele Folan (03:14):
Well, happy to have you here and you know this
audience is very engaged intheir wellness and you know HRT
and hormone therapy and vaginalhealth are things that do come
up all the time.
I do want to let the audienceknow how Kate and I met.
(03:34):
So we met through DonnaCravatta.
Donna is the mastermind behindthe Real 50 Over 50.
She invited Kate and some otherpeople who are experts in the
menopause space and had me alongfor the ride on a panel
discussion.
That was incredible and thatpanel discussion came out.
(03:58):
Was it last week?
Kate Wells (04:00):
Yes, it was last week.
Michele Folan (04:01):
Okay, it was last week, so we're speaking on
March 26th, right now.
And so, anyway, long storyshort, Kate and I decided this
would be a wonderful topic forus to share with this audience.
So, again, welcome, thank you.
Yeah, so I think you've got afascinating career path.
Could you share a little bitabout your background and what
(04:24):
led you to where you are today?
Kate Wells (04:27):
Right.
It does have some twists andturns and of course you know at
age 62, when you look back andyou think, oh yes, that's what
the stepping stones were.
You know, when you're leapingfrom one to another through your
life, oftentimes it's a bit ofa blind leap.
So I began my career as ateacher.
(04:47):
I was a high school teacher inEngland and love teaching I do.
I love seeing anyone's eyes,doesn't matter what age group,
just like that dawn ofunderstanding of a concept or an
idea or something.
I love conveying information ina way that someone goes oh, I
(05:07):
get it.
And so I talked for about sixyears and I've always been
ambitious and I realized,recognized that if I was going
to have a career in teaching orin education, I would not be in
the classroom, I would not bedoing what I really enjoyed.
And so then I figured well, ifI am going to be in an
(05:29):
administrative or leadershiprole, how about business?
And I found my way into theLloyds Bank management training
program.
Lloyds Bank was one of themajor high street banks in the
UK and they had a pretty stillhave a pretty extensive
leadership training program andI got into that.
(05:49):
I was loving that, reallyenjoying discovering the process
of business.
And then my husband at the timecame along and said hey, I found
a job in Portland, Oregon.
Shall we go?
We were living in Brighton onthe south coast of England at
the time.
Brighton to Oregon that's oneheck of an Oregon trail, and so
(06:13):
long and short of that story islike heck.
Yes, let's go.
And the plan had been to behere for just a couple of years.
I would do my MBA at PortlandState and then we would go home
and start a family.
But we had so much fun inOregon.
We skied in the winter, webiked, we kayaked, we did all
the things and by the end ofthat first year it was like we
(06:37):
were going nowhere.
We had bought a house, I wasexpecting our first baby and
coming here and staying here hasjust it's been transformative
for this you know, short,slightly uptight British woman.
It's transformed me and that'sall a good thing.
And so I did my MBA and I havedone consulting work.
(07:01):
But a big portion of my workhas been in the integrative
medicine field.
I have worked in and run andled salivary hormone testing
laboratories.
I have worked as a productdevelopment specialist or
developer in a genetics testinglaboratory.
(07:23):
And you know, through all ofthis, I was the business person.
I am the business person, thebusiness person through and
through.
I love the business process.
However, I fell in love withthe biochemistry, particularly
of the endocrine system.
You know our hormone messagingsystem, and we would go to
conferences and, instead of justhanging out at the booth at the
(07:45):
table to wait for doctors toarrive, I would go in and I
would listen to all thepresentations and I would absorb
this information and, kind offrom an autodidact point of view
, taught myself filled in a lotof gaps in terms of biochemistry
and how the body works.
And through this process, Iwould then talk to, you know,
(08:06):
not the practitioners who are mycustomers, but the just
everyday people, my friends.
And I mean I can remember onetime I was at the dentist with
my daughter and we get talkingabout what I do and it's all
about saliva hormone testing andshe says, oh, oh, my breasts
are really tender.
Is that something to do with myhormones?
(08:28):
And then, before you know it,I've got six dental hygienists
sitting around me listening tome talk, while one of them is
working on my daughter's teeth,and it dawned on me that, you
know, women just don't know,they don't know what's going on
with their hormones.
And so it has been my mission,become my mission, to share
(08:50):
information in a way that makessense, that gets women to that
oh, I get it.
And once they get it, then theyfeel so much more empowered to
make some adjustments, to makesome changes, maybe to find a
practitioner or at least findsolution for some of the
symptoms.
So, you know, I worked in labs,did some more consulting work,
(09:13):
and then I, you know, I tried toretire I've actually tried to
retire twice, like that'shappened.
And then my best friend,Kirstie Hegg, who is my business
partner she and I have 50-50owners of Parlor Games she came
to me and said Kate, you know,I've got this issue with vaginal
dryness, do you know anythingabout that?
(09:33):
And I'm like oh, I am thefriend you've longed for.
And I gave her some estriolhormone cream and within a
couple of weeks transformed herbody back into its
well-functioning state.
Michele Folan (09:49):
Amazing, how that happens.
Kate Wells (09:51):
I just I mean now she's an entrepreneur, she's a
serial entrepreneur, and so wesat around, as women do,
plotting revolutions in parlors,and decided that we had to
bring this to the world.
I knew that there was such agap in knowledge and information
and there was such a gap inresources for women,
(10:14):
particularly for vaginal health,for urinary health, and she has
this direct to consumerexperience which I don't have.
Mine is all wholesale, it'sworking with practitioners, and
so we have combined ourexperience.
I have this business managementexperience and the science
knowledge, and she has themarketing and depth of
(10:38):
experience over there.
And that brought us together toform and grow Parlor Games.
And it has been a wild ride, Itell you.
Michele Folan (10:49):
So what has surprised you most about this
journey, Kate?
So?
Kate Wells (10:54):
One of the things that I found for me.
I think I have always beensomeone who made things happen.
I'm a doer in the world, I makethings happen.
I'm a doer in the world, I makethings happen.
But I found my way into Reikias a hands-on, energetic healing
modality and that allowed me tocontinue to develop my
(11:16):
spiritual side, my spiritualrelationship with the universe
and with the source, and throughthat I have learned to trust
and allow.
And now my life is less aboutmaking things happen and it's
about allowing things happen.
(11:37):
And 20 years ago, if I had everthought that that sentence would
come out of my mouth, Just noway.
So that I think that maturingwithin myself to know that I
have this unique experience ofliving what I am here to do in
this lifetime, I mean thatoperates at kind of a
(11:58):
vibrational level within me.
And whenever I begin to get,you know, frayed, because I'm a
little bit busy, I've got toomany things on my plate or, you
know, once again we're hiringand that just adds a load, Then
I just I take a deep breath andI calm myself and I'm like, oh
no, I remind myself you are inthe right place at the right
(12:19):
time doing the right thing andallow, just allow, and I think
that's one of the things thathas surprised me most.
Michele Folan (12:28):
Oh, can we go back to that?
Let's go back to that.
Yes, of course, Because that issomething that I want women to
understand practice, I thinkthat was a genius thing you just
said about it's not alwaysabout making things happen, it's
about letting things happen,and that we don't always have to
(12:53):
be in total control ofeverything.
Right, that was that was I.
I like that.
That was.
That was my inspiration for theday.
Thank you very much, Kate Wells.
Great Appreciate that, I'm glad.
Yeah, I kind of needed thattoday as a matter of fact.
So, thank you.
Kate Wells (13:12):
I think it takes a little courage because you are
letting go of control.
You are saying to the world Iwant to be of service, I want to
make a difference.
I have a vague idea what thiscould mean, but bring it, I am
at your service and here we arefrom my point of view.
(13:34):
But it takes the courage to nothold on so tightly to control.
Yeah.
Michele Folan (13:42):
I want to talk a little bit about the science of
things.
Vaginal health is a topic thatstill probably doesn't get
enough attention.
I mean, I hear about it justbecause of the people I follow
on Instagram and I follow you,but can you break down why
(14:04):
vaginal estrogen is so importantfor midlife women?
Kate Wells (14:08):
Yeah, absolutely I'll talk about.
I'll bring several concepts inwhich are kind of woven together
.
But one of the things I'llstart with is let's just think
about our skin barrier.
You know, we can look at theback of our hand, our arms, we
can look at our face and we seeour skin, that skin barrier, the
integrity of that, how it holdstogether, is critical for the
(14:32):
health of the whole organismthat we are, our entire body,
because the skin barrier, thisorgan, keeps pathogens out.
So we want to make sure thatour skin is healthy.
I mean, women put a lot ofmoney into making sure their
skin is healthy and supple, butwhat we don't tend to think
about is the skin layer thatlines the vagina and yet it's
(14:55):
still very much part of thiswhole skin layer system.
Now, estrogen is very importantfor the maintenance of the skin
that lines the vagina.
And as we go through menopausethat menopause transition where
our periods have all gone tohell in a handbasket and we
(15:16):
don't know what's happening thatis an indicator that estrogen
levels are beginning to drop.
And then post-menopause youknow, once we've had that period
of time of 12 months without aperiod and we are technically
post-menopause transition, ourestrogen levels really are low
at this point.
Now it can take a little whilefor this to be felt, or it can
(15:38):
be felt immediately.
But the skin cells in thevagina are sitting there saying
give me estrogen people, give meestrogen people, give me
estrogen, people.
I could be with some estrogenhere.
And when they don't have enough,the skin loses its strength.
And so then if somebody iswanting to be in an intimate
relationship with their partner,penetrative sex can be painful,
(16:02):
you know you're.
Oh, let's just be straight outabout this.
You're putting somethinghopefully hard and um uh large
in there and that's rubbingagainst that skin.
It's moving backwards andforwards a lot, yeah, and so if
we're not careful, that skin isgetting thinner and thinner, it
may tear.
And once you begin to getlittle micro tears in the skin,
(16:28):
the body's going to try andrepair that.
I mean, think about, you know,when you're a kid and you fell
off your bike and you grazedyour knee.
The first thing your immunesystem does is like, oh, quickly
, repair, repair, repair.
And it puts a little skin overthere and forms a scar and you
pick at it and your mother saysstop picking at that, just let
it heal.
Michele Folan (16:47):
Your mom too.
Kate Wells (16:49):
I mean, it's really hard to imagine the inside of
your vagina like just one longscab, but it can get to be like
that for some women who havebeen really, really starved of
estrogen and so, as the immunesystem is frantically trying to
repair that skin, it's localizedinflammation.
(17:12):
It's part of the healingprocess.
But if that doesn't happen,it's just low-grade, continuous
inflammation.
And when the body is in aninflamed state, that is the root
of many of other diseases, suchas Alzheimer's.
That is very stronglycorrelated with the state of
(17:35):
inflammation in the body.
So we want to supplement withestrogen to make sure that that
vaginal tissue has its supply tokeep that tissue strong and
supple.
And it's also important formaintaining the pH of the vagina
, and making sure that you havea low pH is critical for making
(18:00):
sure that bacteria can't get inthere and start to multiply and
cause infection.
Michele Folan (18:06):
I had a client who was talking about her mother
and her mother-in-law.
She was taking care of both ofthem.
Both of them got UTIs and theywere in their 80s, right, she
said their UTI presented likedementia, like dementia in 24
(18:27):
hours, kind of like didn't knowhow to turn a light off with the
light switch, kind of scary.
And you know they finallyfigured out oh it's a UTI.
But you know, she said had theybeen on estrogen therapy
vaginal estrogen therapy theyprobably could have done a great
(18:50):
deal to curtail these recurringUTIs in both her mom and her
mother-in-law.
Can you talk about why?
That is why there's aconnection with UTIs and vaginal
health?
Kate Wells (19:01):
Absolutely, and I too have had that experience
about a year ago I had thispersistent UTIs and vaginal
health Absolutely, and I toohave had that experience.
About a year ago I had thispersistent UTI that I could not
get rid of and I went to aconference.
I was exhibiting at aconference and I remember
clearly opening this box of allthe things I need to put on my
table and I'm just looking atthis box, going, huh, I know I'm
(19:25):
supposed to do something withthis and my daughter was helping
me and I just looked at her andsaid help, my brain could not
put it together and I've got adecent brain and for it to just
not function like that, it wasfrightening.
(19:45):
So the connection is that justas we have estrogen receptors in
the vagina, we also havereceptors little doorways to the
cell, in the urethra and thetube that goes from the bladder
to the outside world.
We have receptors for estrogenall around the bladder and in
(20:05):
the muscles that are around thebladder, neck, and so again,
with a lack of estrogen, some ofthe function of the muscles and
the bladder and the urethrawill be diminished and just as
you can get sort of microtearing in the vagina, you can
get disruptions to the skinsurface and the urethra and that
(20:30):
makes it so much moresusceptible to pathogens.
And when we think about youknow all the exits in a woman,
they are very closely located,very closely located.
It is super easy for E coli toget from the anus to the urethra
, to the vagina, and not to puttoo fine a point on it, but we
(20:51):
get wrinkly, the vulva getswrinkly, the skin is losing its
collagen and in all thosewrinkles it's so much easier for
little pathogens to be sittingin there and then transferred to
the vagina or to the urethra.
So our likelihood of getting Ecoli, in particular where it
(21:13):
shouldn't be, increases, andthen we don't have the defenses
to fight it off.
So UTIs are way more common.
But here is another conceptthat I have been doing a lot
more reading about and reallytrying to dig into, and that is
the concept of biofilm.
Now, biofilm is a kind of amucus-like film that bacteria
(21:38):
will put around them to protectthemselves from antibiotics.
And so someone has a UTI andthey get antibiotics for that,
and the antibiotics will oftenknock out 80 to 85% of those
pathogens of the bacteria.
But there is a portion of themthat may get stored in biofilm
(22:03):
on the layer inside of thebladder, and so, when
circumstances are right, theycan begin to grow again, and
then you have a repeat.
Michele Folan (22:14):
UTI, yeah, and it becomes resistant, that's right
.
Kate Wells (22:18):
Yes, so you might be able to knock out the majority
of the bacteria be able to knockout the majority of the
bacteria, but not all of them.
So there are ways to disruptthe biofilm and there are some
good nutraceutical companies outthere that make products for
that.
But this is just a, you know,it's a concept that is only just
(22:43):
beginning to have moreconversation about it.
Yeah, so, but because of theinflammation that occurs with
the UTI, it quickly can go tothe brain, where it is,
resulting in that confusion andthose dementia-like symptoms.
Michele Folan (23:04):
You know, someone close to me was having a lot of
genitourinary issues and theystarted on vaginal estrogen
therapy game changer, likelife-changing results for that
(23:31):
person.
And I talk to my friends allthe time about the importance of
vaginal health and going on.
You know vaginal estrogen and Istill get pushback.
I get, oh well, I'm not havingsex with my husband anyway, or
I'm not too worried about that,and I'm like, look, you may not
have issues right this second,but this is important for when
(23:56):
we're looking 5, 10, 15 yearsdown the road, you're going to
wish you did this and we'regoing to take a quick break,
Kate, but when we come back I dowant to talk about some of the
confusion around estrogen safety.
When I turned 60, I caughtmyself thinking is it time to
(24:16):
head to the dermatologist?
My skin had lost its glow, myneck and jawline were changing
and fillers just didn't feellike the right move for me too
expensive, kind of risky and notreally me.
That's when I found RIMAN,Korea's number one skincare line
.
I started with the expertexperience kit and within weeks
(24:38):
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(24:59):
Want to fall back in love withyour skin?
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I'd love to help you getstarted.
Okay, we're back.
Before we took the break, Imentioned that I wanted to talk
about estrogen safety, and canyou demystify the science and
address the common concerns thatwomen have around estrogen
(25:21):
therapy?
Kate Wells (25:22):
Yes, yes, I feel this is definitely one of my
missions is to try and changethe dialogue here, not just
among individuals, among women,but among practitioners too.
So there was a large-scalestudy that went underway in the
late 1990s looking at theimpacts of using hormone
(25:45):
replacement therapy and this issynthetic hormone replacement
therapy, you know based onpregnant mare's urine.
And four or five years intothis, some of the early results
suggested that there were somerisks and the early analysis of
some of the data suggested thatthis big message was really
(26:09):
important to share to the world.
Estrogen causes cancer.
Now I will just say that thatis nonsense.
If somebody does have breastcancer and it's estrogen
receptor, positive estrogen mayfeed it.
Positive estrogen may feed it,but it is highly unlikely to
cause it.
Michele Folan (26:34):
Well, and if you think about it, kate, if
estrogen caused cancer, we'dhave a bunch of 20-year-olds
with cancer.
Sorry, it doesn't work that way, and I do want to clear this up
too.
This is like PremPro andPremarin that were used in the
study.
Kate Wells (26:49):
Okay, yeah, the synthetic hormones.
So at the time, you know, thiswas massive news hit the media
and practitioners just pulledwomen off their hormone
replacement left, right andcenter, and there has been a gap
of 20 years where women havebeen very underserved because of
(27:09):
this false interpretation ofthe results.
Now those results have beenreanalyzed multiple times.
There was one arm of that studythat continued using just
estrogen, not estrogen plus theprogestin, and discovered that
actually estrogen can beprotective against breast cancer
(27:33):
in many breast cancers.
So over time that message isgradually being unwound.
However, it's not translatingyet into many medical practices
and that message is nottranslating or transmuting
through into our generalconversations.
And practitioners will stillsay to patients and we hear from
(27:54):
them a lot, from our customersthey will say, well, you know,
we'll put you on, but we want toget you off it as soon as
possible.
And that's because they'retalking about the synthetic
hormones and there are potentialrisks with these synthetic
hormones, particularly if theyare oral hormones.
(28:15):
When someone takes a hormonethrough the mouth it goes into
the stomach and then it is, youknow, shunted off to the liver
to be broken down.
That's the first thing.
That is a big, important rolethat the liver has, and studies
are beginning to indicate thatif the liver is breaking down
these oral hormones, they aremore likely to be broken into
(28:38):
metabolites that can increasethe risk for developing breast
cancer.
So it's become pretty wellestablished, certainly in
integrative medicine, functionalmedicine fields, that oral
estrogen is not the way to go.
Topical estrogen means you canuse less of a hormone because it
(29:00):
doesn't have to be first brokendown by the liver, it can just
go straight into the system andit is much safer to use than an
oral estrogen.
Michele Folan (29:10):
Oh, I was going to ask you a question, so I want
to make sure that we're goingto differentiate.
When you say topical estrogen,you're talking about one that
you would, a cream that youwould rub into your arm or a
patch, correct, because vaginalestrogen is not absorbed
systemically, correct, that'sright.
Kate Wells (29:29):
Okay, Because it's in small amounts.
You just need a small amount.
The vast majority of it will beused locally.
A little bit may pass throughinto the bloodstream, but
estriol is so protective thatit's not a problem, isn't that?
Michele Folan (29:45):
Okay, I wanted to make sure we cleared that up,
so all right, okay.
Kate Wells (29:49):
So there are a growing number of practitioners
who recognize that, ohabsolutely, women have to have
hormones.
Just because they're done withthe reproductive phase of their
life does not mean that theirbodies are finished with
hormones.
We need them for so manyfunctions throughout our body,
and so increasing numbers ofpractitioners are suggesting
(30:13):
that they use topical cream, atopical estrogen, a topical
progesterone, which delivers thehormone directly into the
system for use throughout thewhole body.
Now, some practitioners arestill not open to that, and so
women are taking things intotheir own hands and going to
(30:35):
look for solutions, and that'swhere we come in.
We really want to provide theeducation, the knowledge, share
the science, as well as haveproducts that really work.
Michele Folan (30:45):
So tell me a little bit about what you offer
and how people go about gettingyour product.
Kate Wells (30:53):
So we offer.
Our flagship product, the onewe started with Kirstie and I
started with is a vaginalestriol cream, and it's a very
small amount in there, justenough to help rebuild that
tissue.
And that, by far, is what wehear the most about from our
customers.
(31:13):
We get messages like oh, you'vesaved my life, you've saved my
marriage, I can be intimateagain, I can go outside my house
without fear of peeing again.
So you know that's what we getmost of the feedback about.
However, if someone is going tobe using estrogen even the
(31:34):
estriol in our cream, you knowit's a good idea to have some
progesterone in there as well,and progesterone is a superhuman
hormone.
It's important for men, it'simportant for women, for women,
you know, and we run out of it,we start making it, um, and you
know our adrenal glands aresupposed to be our little backup
(31:54):
system, but you know everyone'sso stressed and people's
adrenal glands are so tired thatthey're not making progesterone
.
They're struggling to makecortisol, and so the
progesterone has it's over 400functions within the body, and
so adding some of that back inis important.
And then we have a DHEA cream.
(32:15):
That's a whole other topicabout the importance of DHEA for
overall wellness.
And then we have a fun product.
It's called Chaos Calmer and itis for it's for anxiety, and
you know there's a lot of thataround, and so it's to help with
(32:36):
that.
Michele Folan (32:37):
Oh, okay.
Well then you get the anxietybecause your cortisol is, you
know, pumping out, you know,over time.
Right, it's amazing how all ofthis is so interconnected, right
?
You get the sleeplessness andthose issues that progesterone
(33:00):
will definitely help with.
You talk a little bit aboutthat, like just some of the
other things that progesteronedoes help with.
Oh, yes.
Kate Wells (33:09):
So one of the things that women experience as
they're going throughperimenopause and through
menopause is weight gain, and alot of that can be due to a
contributory fact is the factthat their progesterone levels
are dropping.
You know, progesterone isimportant for helping manage
insulin and management of bloodsugar, and if we're not able to
(33:33):
utilize food for energy, to getthe blood sugar into the cell to
burn, to create energy, then itgets shunted off and stored as
fat tissue and progesteronehelps with the management of all
of that.
So that's one thing.
Progesterone also has someinteresting relationships with
(33:54):
the neurotransmitters, theneurochemicals in our brain.
Progesterone some of it, ismetabolized into
allopregnanolone and then fromallopregnanolone that will
prompt the production of GABA.
And GABA is one of our calmingneurotransmitters.
It's the one that helps us calmdown, helps us feel relaxed,
(34:18):
and it's a counterbalance to theexcitatory neurotransmitter
glutamate.
And we do need some glutamate,but when we live stressful lives
there's a tendency to make toomuch of it and we've got to have
it balanced by GABA.
But if progesterone has dropped, that's one of our major
(34:39):
sources for making GABA or forprompting the production of GABA
.
So mood so it helps with mood,helps with weight management, um
it, uh.
Progesterone is important forcardiovascular health.
It helps um for want of abetter phrase you know, keep,
(35:00):
keep the veins and arteries,keeps them smooth and healthy so
there's less likely to be alittle rupture in there.
And, of course, once you getapture, you need to repair that
and you get a little scar andthen if there's a scar there,
then there's an increased riskof a blood clot.
So all these little steps inthe process, and then the other
(35:22):
one, of course, is memory.
Progesterone is important forthe ability to remember
information, to form newmemories, and it's not like
we're going off, you know, to goto college at age 60.
I mean, I have thought aboutthat and thought no.
Michele Folan (35:42):
Wouldn't surprise me if you did.
Kate Wells (35:47):
But we do need to remember things.
Like you know, we need to plotour ways around a town.
You know we need to map things.
You know, when we go to thegrocery store, we need to map
where we find things.
Michele Folan (35:57):
We have to be able to find our car to go back
out to the parking lot right.
Kate Wells (36:04):
So we still need our memories and we want our
memories for the you know, 35,40 years after menopause, for
heaven's sake.
Michele Folan (36:11):
So those are just some highlights there, yeah,
and so, and kind of back toestrogen too, and this is one
that we didn't talk about, butbone health, the importance of
of using estrogen for our bonehealth, I mean mean that's a
huge one, because the data outthere is not kind when it looks
(36:36):
at fracture and death rates.
I should say morbidity rates.
Death rates Right, it's alittle harsh, but morbidity
rates, so that's the other one.
So I always tell my listenerslook, if you're a candidate for
hormone therapy, find someonethat will listen to you, because
(36:56):
I think oftentimes we just thedoctor says no and we just say
okay and we don't advocate forourselves.
So, Kate, how do people goabout getting your products?
Are they prescription?
No, these are over the counter.
Kate Wells (37:12):
You know these are hormones and gosh.
I think you know products likeours have been available for,
you know, 30, 40 years.
You know demand is growing.
There are a growing number ofwomen who are not just saying to
their doctor, okay, they'resaying all right, well, I'm
(37:34):
going to sort this out on my ownIf just because you don't know
doesn't mean there isn't asolution for me.
And they are on there lookingfor products.
So you know our website,parla-gamescom.
So parla-gamescom,parlor-gamescom.
You know we've got so manyarticles in our blog section, so
(37:54):
go have a read through there.
You can read to your heart'scontent.
I think for quite some timegoing through our blogs and our
products are all listed on there.
But one of the things that wehave that I think sets Parlor
Games apart is that we have acommunity.
We have a private Facebookgroup that is just for customers
(38:15):
and in this group, customersare able to ask questions of
each other.
I mean it's 35,000 strong, plusnow it's a lot of women in
there and there will be posts.
Like you know, I've been inthis group for six months.
I'm very shy and they'reposting anonymously.
(38:37):
This is the first time I've hadthe courage to ask this
question, and they'll ask aquestion about their intimate
health and before they know it,they've got 80 responses, and I
love that.
Michele Folan (38:52):
It's fantastic, yeah, I mean I love the fact
that women are willing to say,oh, this is what I did, or I
hear you.
Women just want to know thatthey're not out there alone on
an island, Right, that they'rethe only ones experiencing these
issues.
(39:12):
And the other thing is, Kate isthere are so many wacky
symptoms of perimenopause andmenopause that I mean we have no
idea.
I mean I started having seriousperimenopause probably in my
40s.
I had no idea that's what itwas.
No one, I had never even heardof perimenopause.
Probably in my 40s.
I had no idea that's what itwas.
No one, I'd never even heard ofperimenopause till I was well
(39:34):
into my 50s.
So women just aren't fed thatinformation and they may be
walking around with somethingthat could be so easy to solve
with some hormone therapy.
Yeah, Right.
Kate Wells (39:48):
Well, certainly from a perimenopause point of view,
I was very fortunate to knowabout progesterone.
Progesterone starts to drop inour I would say early 40s,
because we think about how thebody works.
We get a surge of estrogen inthe first half of the month and
(40:12):
this is what is prompting thatuterine lining to grow ready to
receive an implanted egg.
Then, once the egg is releasedfrom the ovary and is beginning
to, you know, make its way alongthe fallopian tube, it has a
little sack around it and thatsack is the um, what's called
the corpus luteum, and that iswhere the progesterone is stored
(40:35):
.
Now that gives us a surge ofprogesterone in the second half
of the cycle.
It says to estrogen okay, holdit, you've grown enough.
Now we're going to stop andwe're going to, you know,
concentrate and we're going toimprove the quality of this
uterine lining.
But it's the stopping pointthat makes estrogen stop.
(40:57):
All this just like grow, grow,grow, grow, grow.
Now, as we get into our 40s,particularly if we've got a
stressful set of activitiesgoing on in our life, we begin
to miss ovulation.
We still get a period, butwe're not ovulating every month.
And when you're not ovulating,you're not making that surge of
progesterone.
In the second half You're stillmaking your estrogen, but it is
(41:21):
unbalanced by that progesteroneand that is when your symptoms
start to happen, becauseestrogen it's great, but too
much of it is not.
It can lead to bloating, it canlead to imbalances in mood, it
can lead to poor sleep becausewe don't have the chemical
(41:41):
messengers to help our braincalm down and rest for sleep.
So those early symptoms, onceyou begin to see those, a woman
can begin to start to useprogesterone.
And I was so lucky that I knewthat and could start using
progesterone in the same volumethat I used to.
And that I mean I don't.
(42:14):
This is not a brag, it's anillustration.
But I flew through thatmenopause transition because I
had adequate progesterone and myestrogen gradually dropped and
dropped and dropped andeventually caught up with, you
know, low internal production.
But because I was balanced allthe way through and I had that
(42:36):
supply of progesterone bysupplementing, I think I had
like five hot flashes and youknow, yeah, it makes a world of
difference, yeah.
Michele Folan (42:46):
I've never told my audience this story, but I
did have a hysterectomy back in2021 because I had very large
fibroids uterine fibroids andthe doctor she was wanting to do
the surgery, but she said Iwould feel more comfortable if
(43:07):
we could shrink these fibroids alittle bit.
So she put me on a course ofLupron, which, for people
listening, lupron is a drug thatwas, I believe, developed for
prostate cancer to shut offhormones hormone production in
men, to quit feeding theprostate cancer.
(43:27):
So it cut off the testosterone.
So what essentially they weretrying to do with me was shut
off all my hormones that werepossibly feeding the growth of
these fibroids.
Well, it didn't work, but theonly thing it was successful in
doing was totally shutting offevery bit of estrogen,
(43:50):
progesterone, testosterone,anything that my body was taking
.
So by the time I had thishysterectomy and everything's
gone right, I was just depleted.
There was nothing.
And I didn't realize until theyran some numbers, got all my
hormone numbers and they're likeoh, Michele, we got to get you
(44:14):
going again.
So that was vaginal estrogen, Idid oral estrogen, I did
progesterone, I did testosteroneall at once because I needed
some help, right.
So I'm a big, big fan of HRTand what it can do for women.
(44:34):
So I so appreciate the paththat you were on and getting
this message out to women, and Ilove the community, Kate, that
you've built.
Kate Wells (44:47):
Well, and that is a little bit of why we went with
Parlagate for our company name.
You know we picked Parlorbecause you know women, as I
said right at the beginning,women have gathered.
We've gathered in parlors andcups of tea, in our knitting or
sewing, and plotted revolutionsfor a long time.
(45:08):
You know, women have alwaysgathered in community and made a
difference through that,sharing ideas, helping each
other out.
It's what we do as women.
I joined the business world inthe UK, you know, in the early,
early 90s, in the in the earlyearly 90s, and I think the UK is
(45:36):
behind the US in terms ofdiversity in the workplace and I
still, and I really had thegrew up with this feeling there
that I, I had to be like a manto be successful, um, and, and
so I I'm conscious of how thatis not a collaborative
environment.
And yet when you get womentogether, they are so
collaborative.
Our company, all but one personis female and we have such a
(46:02):
collaborative environment.
It's teamwork here year, andyou know, we, we there is this
growing virtual community ofpeople like you who are engaging
women together in in a virtualway to build community, and it
it is the way we change theworld for other women and help
(46:26):
each other out.
We have done that since therehave been women and I think we
should.
You should be applauded foryour part in that, just as much
as you know for how much ParlorGames is helping women feel safe
discussing these intimateissues.
Michele Folan (46:42):
Well, thank you for that, and I sometimes having
these conversations means wehave to be a little vulnerable
ourselves.
Having these conversationsmeans we have to be a little
vulnerable ourselves and becauseI want other women to know hey,
this has been my experience,this is what's happened with me
and it's okay, you know.
It's okay to talk about it andI love it when friends will call
(47:04):
me and say, hey, I have aquestion for you, and I love
that.
I love being that friend thatpeople feel comfortable with.
So anyway, Kate, running acompany is very demanding and
stressful.
What are some of your personalself-care non-negotiables?
(47:27):
What do you do for yourself?
Kate Wells (47:29):
The first thing I do is guard my sleep.
You know, my partner and Isleep separately.
We sleep in different rooms.
He is restless, and he willoften wake in the night and want
to read in order to get back tosleep.
My legs flail around the bed asif I was playing soccer, and we
learned early on that we bothsleep and get better sleep if we
(47:53):
sleep separately, and so Iguard my sleep.
It is my space.
When it gets to nine o'clock,I'm turning the lights off.
It's like I'm not talking toanyone, my phone's turned off.
I guard that first thing.
So then exercise, exercise.
I do love to be outside.
(48:13):
It's a little harder as I getolder to be outside a lot in
winter.
I live in grand junction,colorado, where it is cold in
winter.
It is cold, but getting outsideis important, and I have found
I mean, you know, for heaven'ssake, at at this point, I know
myself I do better when I've gota goal to chase, and so you
(48:34):
know I had not been getting outto do the hiking that I want to,
and last Thursday I was outthere, beautiful day, thinking
all right, I need a goal.
I'm going to do at least 100miles by my birthday in August.
My stretch goal, 100 miles is aminimum.
This is on mountain trails 120is really the goal, 140 is a
(48:58):
stretch goal and if I get to 150miles by then, like I'm the
queen.
So I set myself goals because Iwork that way, eating right, we
eat super healthily, and then,you know, keeping that spiritual
grounding, you know, as we weretalking about earlier, not
(49:18):
allowing myself to get into atizzy about having to manage it
all, but really just allowing,allowing what is and living a
life of gratitude.
Oh my goodness, yeah, oh mygoodness, I'm so grateful.
Michele Folan (49:36):
I think all of those are terrific.
Those are great.
What is your hope for ParlorGames and its impact on women's
health in the long run?
What do you have brewing there,Kate?
What do you have brewing?
Kate Wells (49:48):
there, Kate.
Well, so this is such aninteresting question because,
you know, it is literally fiveyears ago today that Kirsten and
I sat down and had our veryfirst conversation about this.
Michele Folan (50:01):
Oh, happy anniversary, I know.
Kate Wells (50:14):
And where we two have projected, you know, looked
into the future, like fiveyears from now it's.
We could not have possibly comeup with the vision of what that
this would be.
We just knew that we wanted tohelp women, that we wanted to
have a good product.
Um, we wanted to be smart aboutit I mean, we're smart
businesswomen and so it's neverbeen about, you know,
particularly chasing somethingabout other than just continuing
(50:38):
the mission, you know, and ourmission is to save the world,
one vagina at a time.
And I think, as long as we keepdoing that and we back it up
with sound science and goodbusiness acumen and a sense of
humor and kindness andcompassion, I think that's my
(50:58):
goal, is that we keep doing that.
Yeah, you know, and who knowswhere this ends up.
But if we keep doing that, youknow we're making a difference.
And Kirstie's the same.
She thinks exactly the same.
I mean that's one of thebeauties of this experience is
that, I mean, for all that we'revery different, we share such
(51:22):
common goals, and that helps uswork together so well as
business partners.
Michele Folan (51:29):
Yeah, that's great.
Hey, Kate, can you please sharewith the audience where they
can find you and Parlor Games?
Kate Wells (51:36):
So we are we're all over Facebook, we're all over
Instagram, but really you willget the best information.
Go straight to our website atwwwparlor-gamescom.
Michele Folan (51:51):
All right, all that information will be in the
show notes.
Kate Wells, thanks for beinghere today.
Kate Wells (51:57):
Michelle, it's been lovely.
Thank you so much for yourinterest and for such cool
questions.
Nicely done.
Michele Folan (52:05):
Well, thank you, I try.
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