October 8, 2025 • 52 mins
We asked Kylie about what Drum Corps is and why they need ATs, differences and similarities between drum corps and the traditional setting, and creating a club sports program
Timestamps
(8:40) What is Drum Corps and why do they need ATs
(15:42) Differences between Drum Corps and traditional sports
(19:35) Challenges with working in a setting not previously exposed to ATs
(22:34) How did Kylie learn about working with Drums Corps
(27:23) What advice would you give someone interested in working with Drums Corps
(36:48) Similarities and differences between club sports and traditional sports
(41:08) Game coverage and club sports
(45:28) Challenges of starting a club sports program
Action Item: What advice would you give an AT that has started to work within a drum corps and/or Club Sports?
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Music: Jahzzar (betterwithmusic.com) CC BY-SA
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-Sandy & Randy
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Hey, this is Sandy. And Randy?
And we're here on AT Corner. Being an Athi trainer comes with
ups and downs, and we're here toshowcase it all.
Join us as we share our world insports medicine.
Welcome back to another episode of AT Corner.
For this week's episode, we havean interview about a setting
(00:22):
where I think the population is often overlooked.
Very overlooked. Actually both populations on
what we kind of talked about arekind of overlooked, I'd say.
Yes. And I what I really like about
this interview is I feel like Kylie does a really great job of
talking about how similar drum core is to traditional sports
(00:46):
and the things that we kind of understand and then also even
club sports and how similar theyare.
So even though like they are different entities, they're
still a lot of the same things that we're doing.
Yeah, absolutely. And I I think the cool thing
(01:06):
with the especially with the drum core stuff, 'cause it not
being necessarily a traditional dude, I remember seeing them
when I was younger, man. They're out there in the heat,
they're out there for hours a day like the it's an active
body, like they are doing intense things.
So absolutely no, so absolutely you need an AT there.
(01:26):
So I thought it's always nice tohear that perspective and just
hear how that emerging setting it continues to grow.
Absolutely do. You want to introduce Kylie.
Yes. So our guest is Kylie Robbins.
She received her bachelor's in Exercise science and master's in
athlete training, both from Marshall University.
(01:46):
Go Herd. She's been.
One of my football players is wearing a Marshall University
sweatshirt today. And did it say go herd?
Actually it didn't, which is whyactually I don't think I would
have made the connection except that when you said go herd, the
guys were talking about it today.
I see. There you go.
And so because his his sweater was they were talking about how
(02:07):
it's like not branded, but it's like totally branded.
'Cause it's got, it's got the the green.
Like what is that thing? Well, I've seen always seen it
like the green M. No, like the mascot.
The Thundering Herd, The Buffalo, Is it a Buffalo?
Buffalo Bison. Is it a bison?
(02:28):
Maybe. Kylie, please let us know.
Obviously I'm not up to date on my Marshall University, but
yeah, that was totally a sidetrack.
For sure. Kylie has been certified for six
years. She's worked with Upstate
Orthopedics, pediatric orthopedic Unit, Mooresville
(02:48):
University, Wells College, Red Lion High School and currently
with the Blue Coats and Penn State University Club Sports.
We had so much fun with this episode and honestly, I think
there's so much to take away from it, even if you're never
going to work with drum core or club sports in your life, but it
(03:09):
gives you a new found appreciation for a lot of those
things so. Let's hear from Kylie.
You want to get started. Yeah, so kicking it off with
some nice cryo Breakers. First one is what athletic
training tool and this could be a tape brace, rehab, etcetera
that describes you as a clinician.
So I think that I would be manual therapies only because I
(03:33):
feel like as us as athletic trainers are the Swiss Army
knives of healthcare and we haveto be ready for literally
everything. And me as an athletic trainer, I
try to channel my artistic athletic trainer whenever I can,
thinking out-of-the-box, constantly working with non
traditional athletes, things of that nature.
And I feel like my brain and my hands, my brain and my elbows,
(03:55):
my brain and my, you know, knee combine.
I can be quite literally versatile for anything I want to
accomplish. So I would say manual therapy.
I I like that mind body connection exactly.
Thank you. Hands the most important tools,
some would argue correct yeah, you don't need the I mean,
granted, is it nice to have likethe expensive X5 the expensive
(04:18):
modality that like to do that one individual thing maybe a bit
faster than what your hands could do?
Sure, yes. But that doesn't mean that your
therapies and rehabs and stuff are any less important or great
when you don't have those expensive items.
So, well, I mean, that's exactlywhat you said.
You said it's a luxury. Yeah.
Yes, exactly. That's the basics.
(04:41):
So here on AT Corner, we really like to pair evidence and
experience. So if you could help us kick
this episode off with a story orexperience case study.
Something about working with drum corps or club sports.
So personally for me, I think when it comes to my non
traditional athletes versus my traditional athletes, I've been
in both realms from pediatric orthopedics to high school to
(05:04):
D3DD1D2D3. I would say that maybe this is a
little less evidence based, but I think athletic trainers would
really appreciate it. Is that my non traditional
athletes, not saying that my traditional athletes aren't
grateful. I feel like athletic training is
a very thankless job. So a lot of the times we're
doing because it's expected and it's just like, all right, Yep,
(05:25):
Kylie did that. But I would say that my non
traditional realms, my athletes aren't receiving that care
regularly nor do they really know how to use it often.
So I'm constantly having to educate, but I feel like they're
so grateful. I feel like that's one thing
that most of my athletic trainers and interns would say
was that like, wow, it was a breath of fresh air to be
(05:46):
thanked because I gave them a heat pack or like I, I gave them
AI put a Band-Aid on, I cleaned the wound and I, you know, but
it's like they said that they would never leave the training
room without being thanked for something.
And it was really refreshing forthem as interns as well.
So, like I said, not saying thatmy traditional athletes don't
(06:07):
say thank you and I'm not able to build those relationships,
but something comes along with like the brand of Kylie as an
athletic trainer and the brand of like whoever else I bring on
under me as an athletic trainer.And to be thanked for being the
Kylie athletic trainer is is really nice.
And sometimes it's followed up with someone be excited that I'm
(06:29):
doing an extra surprise leg on tour and they just like light up
like fireworks or someone writesme a note when they're in their
age out season and like brings you to tears.
You know, it's just like the stuff you the stuff you don't,
you just do because you're thereto help.
But then people realize it's like you're going above and
beyond to make sure that they'retaking care of some.
Anyways, I would say the appreciation is nice.
(06:51):
A simple thank you does go a long way sometimes.
Yeah, can make your day like that.
It's like that, like that, like good cup of coffee.
You spend that 5 or $6 like not knowing what you're going to get
and then you know what I mean? It's just like you said.
Thank you. Like, well, for them also like
that's so unexpected for them tohave that level of care even at
(07:13):
a base level of something that we think is like so like
foundational or something that we just provide is something
that's so beyond what they expect.
Yeah. Yeah, exactly.
But like making it like what? Why does why does non
traditional settings have to be an emerging setting?
(07:34):
Like, why can't it just be a setting, you know, why can't
they just have this care? And I want to normalize that for
them and I want it to be expected.
Like, no, when you hit your headwith the rifle or whatever and
you had a headache for a while and they told you that you were
being soft, that no, no, you hada, you had a headache because
(07:59):
you were injured. Like, and there's a way to take
care of this. Now, granted, are there some
like like there there's like kind of like grievances with
having to go through the concussion protocol because
that's also something that they aren't.
They're like, why can't I just go back in?
Like I don't have a headache after three days, you know, So
(08:19):
it's just the educational piece too.
But I think once they get it, they get it and it's always met
with with kindness. It's not like, what the heck,
You don't know anything. Why aren't you putting me back
in? It's OK, fair.
I get it. I now understand and I want to
take care of my body to be readyfor finals, things like that.
So tying into that, you've already kind of mentioned like
Drum Core. What is that?
(08:41):
And like you said it, it's viewed as like an emergent
setting. So why do they need a TS?
Great, yes. So Drum Core is a variety of
marching music ensembles, I would say ranging to compare to
our traditional settings like D1D2D3.
We have our umbrella, which is like our NCAA, which only
(09:02):
governs, it's called DCI. So Drum Core International is
like our NCAA umbrella. And then we have D1D2D3 open
class, world class, all age class underneath there, but
we're marching music ensembles that essentially go through a
pretty rigorous spring training where we prep for your
traditional game day. But that's our as our
performances. So we do like a six week spring
(09:24):
training kind of like your football would do to prep for
their first game, 14 hour days, various types of let's say
activity throughout the day, considering what section you're
in ultimately being treated likeyour traditional athlete.
If there's lightning, we're coming in.
If the if the wet ball globes inthe black, we're not practicing
(09:47):
outside, but then we, you know, go on a six week world tour and
then we have finals at the end of the season.
So it's like our competition season.
And anyways, that's just at least a brief descriptor.
But a lot of the things that we are doing, for example, like we
need a hand eye coordination like soccer or basketball.
We need the endurance like your long distance runner, because
we're, you know, up and down a field different paces, kind of
(10:10):
like your staggered running, like the jog, walk, run, Sprint,
you know, to stuff. So ultimately we're seeing
traditional injuries and things just happening in on traditional
ways. So why not needing an athletic
trainer? I mean, it just makes the most
sense. I mean, you kind of like put it
hand in hand in that way. I think they just see they're
(10:31):
just playing instruments moving around.
But when you pick up on the technicalities of it, I mean, I
think it makes sense. So that I think that is why we
need athletic trainers, because we're out there in the elements.
We're doing the rigorous exercise, we're compared, we're
comparing ourselves to traditional sports.
So yeah, why wouldn't we need sports medicine for sure.
(10:53):
Hey, it's a body emotion, yes? Well, also if you think about
any of the wind, I mean if you think of any, any of the
instruments, you think of the wind instruments in the lung
capacity they have to have whilethey're moving.
And then you think about like the the drums that they're
holding and like the stress on their low back or the stress on
where the harness sits. Or we could go through each one
(11:16):
probably. Well, and there's also like
those intricate things that do occur because of the apparatus
that they are carrying. Like so for example, more
specifically that I can think ofjust because it happened more
recently, but on on tour, not because they're malnourished.
They're just working out all day.
(11:37):
So they, you know, they get kindof like that tour body, they
slim down, they get skinny, likenot because they are
malnourished. I want to very, very much like
stress that there's working out 14 hours a day and doing
nothing. But so from that, you know,
certain Bony prominences become more prominent.
So then when something is like pressed up against or rubbing
(11:57):
on, it could cause more frictionthan normal.
So for example, like 1 summer, we were having some Asis being
rubbed on the drum harness. And so we were having to manage,
you know, finding a way to tactfully clean their harness
because it doesn't come apart like or yeah, it doesn't come
(12:18):
apart like clothing, like you'd RIP out the inside and like wash
the sleeve or anything like that.
So we'd figure out how to clean that, keep their hips clean
while also not structurally moving the harness to a way that
it would like affect their drumming while also trying to
prevent lifelong scarring from happening.
You know, whether it be like just from scarring in general,
(12:40):
but like to other ethnicities that like scarring does become
relatively permanent. So anyways, I could go on and on
and on. But like, yeah, exactly that the
different harnesses and things that they carry.
Someone moves just the wrong wayin the in the formation, bonking
somebody on the back of the head.
A big gust of wind pushes through one of our big props and
(13:03):
gets somebody while they're not looking, being prepared to like
come out. Our prop crew is amazing and
making sure that like the thingsthat we use are, are smooth and
put together well structurally to hold people and be pushed.
But like, sometimes there's thatfew things that just flip
through the cracks and someone gets a, a cut on their hand, you
know, so many different variables.
(13:27):
For sure. Yeah, for something that I think
especially when I've been working in the non traditional
or more of an aesthetic, not that this is totally aesthetic,
but like aesthetic artists, people think that like it's so
controlled and so predictable that there can't be injuries
because it's not like you're having a reaction time or
(13:49):
something to that effect. Like you would it like in
soccer, for example. But there are so many elements
of it that are, or even if that when they're rehearsing or when
they're learning things or even in something that they know
what's going to happen, we stillhave to be aware of how that
movement's happening. And if someone does move a
different way, like they do haveto react to those things.
(14:11):
So there are still injuries and and things that nature, even
though we are supposed to be quote, UN quote, everything's
supposed to be predictable. Right.
I think too. If you think about it though,
like in your traditional football setting, don't they
rehearse all of their plays? You know, like, but it doesn't
go as planned every time, hence why a game occurs.
(14:33):
Like that's why it's exciting and fun.
And not saying that like we wantto live life on the edge, but
like a lot of the times things aren't fun unless there's a
little bit of danger involved. Like, you know what I mean?
So if everything was so predictable, it'd be less
entertaining. Does that make sense for humans?
Right. And there's going to be some
human error at some point, as hard as we try.
(14:56):
Exactly. You know, someone could have
just been, maybe they sustained an injury earlier on in the week
that they didn't report. And then there's, like, standing
a different way. Yeah.
So many different things, Breathes differently.
Doesn't get enough arm to lift somebody up.
So many things. Or like the stress is stress is
stress for like the ehi stuff like exertional heat illness
(15:18):
stuff, you know, like I've been drinking water.
I don't know why I'm feeling. So I'll today.
Well, like we just spent the past week in Texas where I'm
like your, your body's not acclimated to that.
So no matter how much you're drinking, like ANYWAYS, yeah, so
many things. So I really love how you
highlighted how many similarities there are with a
traditional sports medicine likemodel.
(15:41):
But could you highlight some of like the differences like maybe
things that you have to think about, like like we were talking
about maybe like lung capacity with some of the wind
instruments or like I had I, I briefly worked with a marching
band, not to any element as you did, but.
(16:02):
I haven't, yeah. Just it was, it was very small.
I mean, it was a very big company, but a trumpet that she
had to take anti inflammatories because her she was, she was, I
don't know the correct terminology for like playing, I
guess playing the trumpet so often that her lips would swell.
(16:22):
And so she was like doing anti inflammatories.
And so then we had to educate onlike you can't be taking anti
inflammatories every single day.We had to figure out some other
sort of recovery for this, but how?
How? What are some other things that
you have to do differently than a traditional sportsman?
Because I've never had to deal with that like with one of my
other athletes, football guys, yeah.
But but you never know, like maybe being out in the sun, you
(16:46):
know for a while their their lips start to swell due to like
sun exposure. You know, you could potentially
pick-n-pull some really fun things from what you've learned,
but I would say the biggest one is the encouragement like of my
team and my MSAT interns to makesure that they're stable but
mobile. Like ultimately, you know, my
(17:07):
yes. So this person has an ankle
sprain. It's on a performing arts ankle
sprain. It's an ankle sprain.
It just happened in in a non traditional way.
It happened to this person who maybe had an ankle sprain
before. Anyways, still an ankle sprain,
but I would say encouraging themto think stable but mobile.
So what's going to stabilize this and provide structural
support, but still allow them todo like a plie or a pointed toe
(17:31):
or this jump that they need to like step up and push up onto a
prop? You know, really be inquisitive
about not only the sport that they're playing, but the section
specific, the part that they play in the big picture.
So I would say stable, but mobile's like a big piece.
(17:52):
But then even things like you had said with with the lip
scenario. So providing like ice cups in
the in the freezer, not for whatyou think.
I mean, could be for muscles too, but like so my trumpets can
like ice cup massage their lips and providing them gloves.
So then they can do like vascular massages up their face
or trying to think what else, being able to be versatile and
(18:18):
kind of like set up a training room wherever you are and get
the job done. So like on tour, we have
gymnastics masks that we fold out and essentially we create a
training room outside under a pavilion and we go.
So I would say like those are the biggest pieces.
But then like I did already touch about concussion protocol
(18:40):
just because it's like so prevalent in research right now.
But like even being section specific there like the further
acclimated return to play, thereare pieces like our, sorry, our
rehearsal day is 14 hours long, but there are pieces that they
can incrementally participate inthroughout the day without fully
saying like Nope, you can only participate in 20 minutes of
(19:02):
this. And like that is it.
So there are ways for them to safely participate in portions
of the day because ultimately ifthey're missing a whole day,
it's like missing 3 days of rehearsal.
So finding ways to keep them in it with their friends, not
hitting that concussion depression.
I would say the biggest picture here is just listening to your
(19:22):
athletes and making sure that you are being athlete specific
but also section specific. Kind of along the lines of like
you kind of name those differences what has been like a
big challenge working in a setting that maybe hasn't been
exposed to a TS very often. So I would say the biggest piece
(19:46):
maybe earlier on. I am in Year 5 going on 6 now in
the drum core setting, but I am in year 1 of the club sports
setting. So ultimately I would say it's
the education piece. And like we often like obviously
the grievances of like, no, likeI do have the education to give
you a, you know, a strength, theconditioning program.
(20:08):
But like, yeah, So what I do? But also just like trying to
figure out what we do, do and then like how it fits and like,
builds everybody up from there. I've been encouraging athletic
trainers left and right recentlyafter a conversation with my
dad, who's like, who's the boss for a landscape, sorry,
(20:29):
landscaping company in LancasterCounty.
He he was saying all these things like he and like, wanted
to make sure that they're hydrated.
And I'm like, Dad, just hire an athletic trainer.
Like who I've been telling everybody like, OK, if that's
where you want to work, figure out how you apply and pitch it.
(20:50):
Like figure out how you fit and how you can build the program up
and get their buy in. So essentially that I feel like
people aren't afraid of change, they're afraid of going into it,
not having the information to beprepared for it.
And honestly, I get it. I hate going into things not
knowing all the information to be successful.
(21:11):
That's it's, it's anxiety ratingfor me.
I don't like that. So I've been trying to prepare
my staff to know what's up and know what's set in stone.
And like, honestly, this year atthe drum Corp I was at was like
the best year yet. And I can't wait to continue
making changes and like just building us up.
(21:32):
And hopefully we'll get to a point where like I'm doing the
exit interviews at the end of the year and they're like, you
know, actually I don't have any constructive criticism to give
you. So you know, you know you.
You put it really well because especially companies and people
who don't normally have an athletic trainer, especially
like what you were talking aboutin the beginning, like they just
(21:54):
don't we, we talk about this allthe time.
Like you don't know what you don't know.
So like, how would they know to hire an athletic trainer who has
all this knowledge if they don'tknow what an athletic trainer
does? So if you come in and you say,
hey, I can do this for you, I can do this for you, I can do
this for you, It's going to takeso much off of them.
But they don't even know that togo looking for that.
Sometimes you have to be the oneto take that step.
(22:17):
Yes, don't be afraid of the wordno.
Like, yeah, what what's that? Gonna No.
OK, thank you. Next opportunity.
Like, you know, just don't. I just Yeah, just don't be
afraid of it. So along those lines of kind of
like paving that path. How did you learn to work with
drumcore? I would say I wish I had this
(22:39):
like I, you know, come to Jesus moment for it, but it kind of
just fell in my lap. So in 2020, I was working for a
pediatric orthopedic unit because I was like all I could
find because 2020. And then I wanted to move on to
the college setting. I just accepted a new job and my
(23:00):
friend was interning at the drumcorps that I am now at and their
athletic trainer, their preceptor, needed to leave
suddenly for two weeks to figurethroughout life they only had
one athletic trainer at the time.
They did the whole summer, whichis a lot, but I was like, man, I
just set up my first day at the new job and I don't know.
(23:24):
Anyway, so I reached out to my new head athletic trainer and
for some reason the softball coach there knew what drum corps
was and was like, oh that drum corps, you have to let her go.
You have to let her go. I was like, is this person
anyways, so I did my two weeks that year and I've been there
ever since. So that's.
(23:45):
Awesome. And that intern now is a
certified there with me as well.Oh, how cool.
Full circle, Yeah. Yes, has been there for for
four, four years, 4 out of the five years.
So it's been pretty solid. That's really cool how just the
stars aligned to make that just that perfect.
Like, yeah, she should go. Literally.
(24:07):
I was like, I don't know how to pitch this because I had never
heard a drum corps before. I'd been in marching band, but I
was like, there's this like smashing band, I think, and they
tour. I was like, I think it's a cool
opportunity and I know we just met, but like, can I go, Dad?
Can I go? So with that, I know you said
you were in marching band, but how did you, or maybe you had a
(24:29):
little bit of background, but did you have to learn some of
the different sections or different like parts of the of
the whole organization? Yeah, I I wouldn't say maybe as
intensely as an athletic trainerwho's just never experienced
marching band before because I'dbeen around color guard and then
(24:50):
obviously with harm twirlers andthen, you know, all the horns in
front of ensemble and things like that.
But like I never got to understand them on a deeper
level other than, OK, I visuallysee what they do, but like what
do they experience? So for example, on a year to
year basis, I will have one front ensemble member, maybe 2,
(25:10):
who the, there are tops of theirhands here.
Just they, they blow up, they, they look inflamed like this.
It looks gnarly. They're like, I don't know what
I did but I've just been practicing that's all they
that's all they tell me and ultimately came to find out it's
from them. Like doing like an immense cram
sesh before before spring training and then the top of
(25:32):
their hands get inflamed from like doing all that carrying
like 3 mallets in their hands and like playing so hard.
It's so fast. Just like their extensors are
just overdone. Yes, just.
They I'm not even kidding, like a good like 2 inch and a half
two inches off the backside of their hand.
It I'm like I'm like I'm only when I wanted to 1st send it for
(25:54):
a picture, I'm like that's got you punch something like Oh my
God, that's funny. I was like don't fit to me right
now because this is serious, butsince I've adapted then like my
own way of just handling it, I'mlike, all right, random athlete,
like I'm here like, you know, solike it's like fluid movement
(26:15):
three times a day. I have them sleep with I cut non
latex gloves the fingers off andI make them wear that with an
ace bandage up their forearm while they sleep.
Sometimes even 2 like but like asize smaller than what they
would normally wear to like compress the top side And then
if they can handle it, I'll use some like.
(26:37):
I don't often like to use KT tape.
I feel like sometimes it provides like a false sense of
stability. But in this sense I'd be able to
apply it in pieces to the top portion of their hand just while
they're playing throughout the day.
It would apply some compression down on the top.
But yes. So I would say that like I knew
the general, like if it was a jawbreaker, I knew the outer
(27:00):
layer of the jawbreaker. But as the years have gone on, I
have learned each layer and it's, I think, made me a better
clinician each year. And then I just try to share
that craft with my new certifieds, my interns, and
hopefully create, encourage themto be artistic athletic trainers
even in their traditional settings, even if they don't
ever come back to drum corps. So what would you?
(27:22):
Recommend to someone who's interested in working with drum
corps. Yes.
So I think there's two scenarioshere.
There's a scenario where the sports medicine program is
already built for you and you kind of walk into a comfortable
setting. And I think that's going to be
far less than you think that like that there's going to be
(27:44):
solid structure only because ourgoverning body requires you to
have an, A healthcare professional on the entire
summer. And they've since gone on to
describe like what specific healthcare professionals that
should kind of look like now since, but it's still a wide
variety. So I, I encourage you to ask the
(28:06):
questions you're scared to ask, set yourself up for success.
So if they ask for the, the Eapsand like the protocols that are
written down so that you can either read them or in some
cases create them to make sure everybody is on the same page
before going in. And then I would encourage you
to be optimistic and like I said, be creative.
(28:30):
You may be working with less resources.
I'll tell you right now the where we are at the drum core
that I work at in comparison to the first year are like 2
separate instances. It was not all like rainbows and
roses in the beginning. It was a lot of advocacy and
trusting my craft and continuingto educate as we went from year
(28:53):
to year. What didn't work re evaluating
and making it better from year to year.
Knowing that you're just people and we are not perfect.
So I would say that advocate foryourself.
Ask the questions you're scared to ask, maybe you're not scared
to ask them. And then be an optimistic and
artistic athletic trainer as you'll be working potentially
(29:14):
with less than your D1 athletic training room.
But that doesn't make your protocols and you as a clinician
any less important or crucial tothe survival of the drum corps
to finals. So.
For sure. Can you share a little bit about
like each part of like you were talking about like the baton
twirlers or the like, I'm blanking on the name of the
(29:36):
people you were just talking about with the mallets front
ensemble and the front yeah, front ensemble.
Or like can you kind of go over like the the the people you
would see or like the positions you would see?
Yeah, so baton twirling just recently made like a lick of a
comeback in drum corps with withactually the reigning champions
(29:58):
this year, which was so cool to see.
So traditionally you wouldn't see baton twirlers are more of
like a novelty piece, but you have colour guard, which is like
the wooden rifle, the Sabre and then your flag and then also
other like novelty equipment like streamers and things of
that nature. You have your horn line, which a
(30:20):
lot of the horns look like bigger and smaller things of
each other. So like you're like, man, that's
just a bigger trumpet. Like actually it's euphonium.
So but but so you have the horns, then you have the drum
line and then you have front ensemble and then we have our
drum majors. So that's like all the different
(30:42):
sections. And then having to be able to
apply like all legs of sports medicine to such different
positions, I think has challenged my brain in ways that
have made me a better clinician outside of drunk or realm as
well. And it sounds like working
football or track where you havejust so many different position
(31:02):
groups, events all in within oneteam.
Yes, so you know, someone who was well, it's just going back
into the concussion realm again.It's just like essentially like
my drum majors, you know, peoplewere like, oh, they're just
waving their hands all day, but they have to have in like
endurance for that and like theyare out in the sun as well.
(31:22):
But just like like I said, honing in on the athlete or the
sports specific but also athletespecific items.
So for sure. Well, that's The thing is like
so I before I started working with marching band, I had I had
seen some of their instruments, but not totally familiar with
any of them. And I've never worn any like the
the drum set, like the four withthe symbol on it.
(31:45):
And I didn't know that that would create a little bit more
offset to one side. It's like returning someone who
we had to adjust, like maybe we take the symbol off or we we
change you to like a one set instead of the four drums or you
maybe in between, like as you'rewalking, maybe you can lift up
(32:05):
the drums. So because they fold.
And so like things that like some things you just have to
learn from talking to them or, or even just like learning their
equipment or their instrument because that's something like
just from the outside you, you wouldn't know.
Right, No, I agree. I think so now I think I heard
an intern recently that's been exploring non traditional
(32:28):
opportunities, performing arts, strong war, etcetera that was
told that that they need they would they would they're not
gonna have success in these non traditional internship
opportunities if they don't knowthe lingo.
But I don't think that's true. Like, we can talk the same
(32:50):
language. We're just gonna say two
different funny, fancy words. So like, did your ankle, which
we all know, go like this? Yes.
OK. Like we can get to the same
thing. And you can teach me the lingo
as we go, which is what I had tolearn.
I was in AI didn't spin flag. I I played clarinet.
(33:12):
I there's no clarinets in drum corps like, so there's things
that we can learn on the fly. Just take some optimism and some
artistic navigation within our conversations to get to the same
point. I think we can still be
successful without immediately coming in and having that
experience is what I'm trying tosay.
Yeah, Yeah, I agree. Because like kind of in a more
(33:34):
traditional setting, like working a sport like track, I
never ran track, right. But I worked, I worked it for
years and I never felt that because I didn't come from it.
I never got respect or like theyshield away from me because I
feel like if you just show a willingness to learn their
environment and what they're doing, I feel like they're all
(33:55):
in and they actually love to talk about it and like help you
out too. Well, I, I feel like that's
exactly what I was going to say is like, you have to take like
in some books, like you have to take the L, you have to be a
novice. You have to say, I don't know,
which is so scary for some people because like, otherwise
(34:17):
like, and I could say the same thing.
Like I didn't play football. Like I had no idea what I was
doing when I first stepped on the field.
But you have to learn things like when the first time my
online coach said, yeah, like a double team.
And I was like, I can you tell, can you explain to me what that
is? Because if you give, if even
(34:37):
like there's two thoughts, you could either be like, oh, I'm
coming in and I, I know all this, but or you can come in and
say, you know, I don't know, butI want to learn.
And you're going to get so much further if you don't fake it
till you make it. For sure, yes, because they'll
be able to see through it too. You know what I mean?
Like when you get that like sideeye, like, you know, it doesn't
(35:00):
just happen when they don't knowthe big medical words that
you're saying. But I think, right, I'm like,
why are you judging me right now?
Like then you lose. Trust like that's not you know,
but you gain so much more rapport if you if you're showing
them a willingness to their. Demands are, I think, also to
(35:24):
show up when you say you're going to show up.
So for example, if you don't know and you say, hey, I'm going
to look into this tonight and then reinform you tomorrow when
I have a better grasp on this. After talking with team doc and
maybe doing a little bit of research like this.
Like, for example, this year I had my first interaction with
intersection syndrome. Like, and when you close your
(35:47):
eyes and you they say like, oh, it feels like how a creaky door
sounds. I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah,
we're in school. Like, yeah, creaky door.
Like, no, when I tell you that, like, I can't.
Like, like, I can't explain it any other way.
But I was like, I was like, whatis this anyways?
But it took some like research on a nightly basis for me to
(36:08):
make sure that I was tackling itthe right way while also doing
potentially 14 hours of rehearsal in a day anyways.
But agreed. Like, so I think also showing up
when you say you're going to show up is great about building
that rapport in relationships. You can say you don't know and
you don't have to know everything, and you can still do
research and continuously be a lifelong learner, even as a
(36:30):
clinician. Yeah, OK.
You want to transition to club. Sports.
Yeah, I was going to say so along with your work with drum
corps, you also mentioned that you work club sports at a
university, which I feel like isa growing setting.
I feel like that's getting a lotmore popular.
How does that like what similarities and differences
(36:50):
does club sports have with your kind of traditional sports
setting? Yes.
So I think club sports potentially they are often
happening at higher institutionswhen they were provided athletic
trainers. So you know, you see this like
(37:11):
D1 level varsity athletics happening and they're like oh,
they're just club sports. But The thing is what's the same
there is that they're both sports.
So like, what does it matter thelevel that they're competing at?
Like they're they're both sports.
So being an just like elaborating a little bit on
(37:31):
that, being a non traditional athlete myself and actually
being in an underserved realm, Iactually find a lot of
fulfillment in serving the underserved just because, you
know, like I said, they they area bit more grateful.
It's not expected. They do seek you out, I think
(37:51):
for the right reasons once educated.
So I would say that similaritiesare that they are both sports
and often times are competing atD2 and D3 levels.
So actually if you look up club basketball, my organization is
deemed one of one of the best out there competing at like that
(38:12):
D2 level. So my ice hockey team is
competing against D1 level and they actually have been required
to get physicals for the past several years because they've
been competing against D1 level athletes from other D1
institutions. So anyways, I would say
similarities, yes. Or that they are just all
sports, so why don't they deserve care?
(38:34):
Actually, that's a really. Good point.
I guess I'd never really thoughtabout it because I don't.
We have one technically club sport at our my college where I
work, but we do have them do allthe same medical eligibility as
the rest of sports. But it without.
I mean, do you guys have a governing body or something that
says like everyone needs a certain medical eligibility?
(38:57):
So that's a really great question.
And as I started the program, I'd reached out to several other
club sports programs with athletic trainers, some from
1:00 and just starting to othersthat are getting their third
athletic trainer for club sports.
Crazy. So great for them though, but
they're they're doing amazing. But the one thing that I did
(39:19):
gather was from club sport program to club sport program,
everything was immensely different in the things that
they were able to accomplish because there isn't a governing
body over like us specifically. Now each club sport does have an
organization that they compete under, but it's like for their
own sport. So they have requirements like
(39:44):
boxing's required to get A to get physicals, hockey's required
to get physicals. But like my table tennis group,
like, you know, maybe not, they're not required.
But like with me being added into the mix and there being so
many athletes to take care of, Ihave established that baseline
that physicals are required. And that was a new piece.
(40:05):
I was new this year, but that was also like a big new piece
but. Yeah.
So we don't have a governing body, which makes it difficult
as we form this. I've been trying to base
everything off of NATA gold standard items and how all
traditional practice is held in comparing our athletes to D2 and
D3 level athletes and the thingsthat they're required to do.
(40:29):
But doing something like a simple change like, OK, well,
I'm going to require them to geta physical, but I'm not.
We're going to require them to get their sickle cell tests
done, but I am going to have them report on the physical on
the self reported questionnaire,whether or not they know that
they have it or not. I need that baseline for when
they're walking into my room andthey're one of 2000 athletes and
I'm one Kylie, to know what I can and can't do, maybe what to
(40:52):
provide in the Med kits or not things of that nature.
But blessing listening in disguise maybe because it allows
me to be the artistic athletic trainer that I want to be in
really create this program to bebeneficial to them.
So so then what does game coverage look like for you?
Like, because I'm assuming they have like home games or
something that would be on campus.
Do you cover those? Yes, another really great
(41:15):
question because that was a big question for me when I was
exploring this opportunity. 50 teams, 1 Kylie, it was 55 and we
added three. So that's Oh my God.
So I guess the, the so I wanna start with at the D1 level,
there is varsity athletics, which is your D1 sports.
(41:37):
You have your team sports, whichis like dance, cheer, and in
this case rugby. Then you have your club sports,
which is me. And then you have your IM
sports, intramural sports, whichanybody can join.
Club sports is still somewhat funded by the university.
Team sports is kind of like a varsity athletics with just some
(41:57):
slight variations and varsity athletics obviously gets like
the whole spiel. So with that at the club sport
level, they are deemed in 1-2 and three on risk level.
So comparative of like sorry that's created by our risk
management team, they deem like,so they take into consideration
like injuries, contacts, impactsand a variety of other things to
(42:22):
put them in these this variety of risk levels risk, our highest
risk level is required to have EMT and or athletic trainer
coverage. Our second risk level is
required to have EMT coverage and then our lowest risk level
just has to have like like a first aider, which is often one
of the safety officers or one ofour professional staff or one of
(42:45):
the student staff. But with that, sorry, getting to
your question, my specific role is to do mainly clinic coverage
with like a sprinkle of game coverage here and there for some
built in rapport, which I've kind of established.
I said I wanted to do this even those may be adding some hours
onto my schedule that week. I wanted to be able to build
(43:08):
relationships, find rapport, youknow, as we're continuously
building the program. But with that you're like, oh,
well then how do the other teamsget covered that are required to
have EMT and or ATC coverage? So in years past they've been
using GOAT for Ellis. I've since reformed this and was
like we need continuity of care.Our athletes deserve continuous
(43:32):
conversations, clear instructions.
So why don't we hire a group of PRN athletic trainers who are
hired to the university that we then supply at one solid price
per hour to the teams when thesethings do happen.
So find some people that can like work those.
So that is where we are. The teams are required to find
(43:54):
their own EMT coverage, which isessentially usually just through
University Health services, which is pretty easy for them.
But when it comes to the athletic trainer, we are trying
to push towards this PRN, which just went live for anyone
looking for some PRN opportunity.
(44:15):
But yeah, go for Ellis in the past.
But I feel like there's just we,we could be, we could have a
more clear line of care, continuity of care, if we had
our own group and team that could like function within the
EMR system, apply a sway baseline or a sway test if
someone were to have a concussion, things of that
nature. So.
(44:37):
So yeah, it sounds very institutional based, which is
like a blessing and a curse. Yes, yes, because I would say
that even some of the teams thatare in the risk level too, I've
seen some higher risk injuries happening and I'm surprised that
(44:57):
they weren't the higher risk level, but ultimately allowing
me to function in this way. For example, I was allowed to
say who is receiving the Sway baseline testing.
So like, this is this is a team that I've I've seen concussions
with in the past that could be pretty gnarly.
So I was like, OK, I want to baseline test them.
And they said, OK, so pulls and pulls and pushes, you know, like
(45:22):
just hills and valleys. Yeah.
Along those lines of the the hills and the valleys.
What was that experience of creating a club sports program?
So I will say just right off thebat is that it definitely being
a part of this program is scratching an itch that is
enticing to me and exciting. Getting to create custom tables
(45:46):
and custom wall art, which is like that like true artist in me
and then be able to combine thatwith traditional athletic
training has been really fun. And then also creating in AD,
one environment where football is, is the thing like creating
my club sport, athletes place where they can be excited to
(46:07):
come and can brag about is really exciting for me.
So sorry, just elaborating on like the hills and valleys.
So that's definitely scratching an itch.
But obviously with anything new and change, people have
questions. Things arise that may slow you
down a bit, but that doesn't mean that it's like the end of
(46:27):
the world, you know? It just kind of slows you down a
little bit. Like the water in the river
isn't like moving in One Direction at a fast pace.
You hit like a rivet where it's kind of like cross section and
you kind of have to like trudge through it, right?
Like just kind of working together and collaboratively, as
a lot of the people around me don't know the realm of athletic
training. And knowing that and meeting
(46:49):
them where they're at has made this process not be detrimental
when something like that pops up.
You know what I mean? Like, no, not.
And knowing when they have a question, they've often explored
things to try and figure it out themselves.
And they've come to me as the professional.
I should be grateful that they're asking me that question,
(47:10):
if you know what I mean. So yeah.
So just knowing that when in thecreation of anything, literally
anything, not even an athletic training program, there will be
hills and valleys. But like, the valleys don't have
to be the end of the world. Just be optimistic and be
excited about the little victories and then the big
victory doesn't seem so far awayand just kind of keeps you
(47:30):
excited and going and ready for the next couple of days so.
Sweet. Yeah, that's awesome.
You ready for our action item right now?
Go for it. OK, so here on AT Corner we also
like to finish off with an action item that is just
something that athletic trainerscan take away to their practice
today. So if there was someone who
(47:52):
would want to start to work withdrumcore or start creating a
program for a club sports program, how would you
recommend? Like what would you, what advice
would you give them or what recommendations would you give
them? I think we touched on it a
little bit throughout, you know,in bits and pieces.
(48:13):
It's you're you're entering uncharted territory.
You know, this is a new realm where not everybody's just going
to get it. And it's not just is what it is,
you know, so being optimistic and channelling that artistic
athletic trainer, not being afraid of the word no finding
where you fit and like lift the program up and really taking
(48:37):
that to the the moon and comparing it to your traditional
settings. That's how I literally get
anywhere. Is the research done on
traditional settings and comparing it to our non
traditional, our non traditionalsettings, our emerging settings.
So the biggest thesis is optimism.
Channeling your artistic athletic trainer, not being
afraid of the word no, finding how you fit and pitch, pitch,
(48:59):
pitch, you know, sell that and ask the questions that you know
you may otherwise be afraid of because ultimately they're not
thinking about them, not becausethey don't care.
It's because they don't know. So you're the one who knows.
So what's your craft? Awesome, sweet.
Thank you so much for this. Yeah, Thank you guys so much for
(49:21):
having me. It's been really, really fun
talking with you guys. I've been really excited for
this, so thank you. I think the one thing that
really jumps out at this interview is the energy and
excitement and passion that Kylie brings to developing her
practice with with like marchingband and just what she brings to
(49:44):
the club sport atmosphere. Seems like she's really created
a thriving practice in both settings.
And how you can do that with anything that you're passionate
about. So even like she was talking
about the landscaping company, if you can pitch it to someone
who's going to take it. I mean, that's what I did with
(50:05):
the dance company I'm working with.
So, you know, you just have to show that you're you have value
and there you go. See, like you said this, you can
take something away even if you're not in those settings or
interested in those settings. That's something that I love
about this is going to be a total sidetrack, but I feel like
that's something that I love about this podcast because I
(50:27):
feel like we have talked to people I probably would have
never talked to before. And I think there's something
you can learn from every person,even if you don't like them.
Like, I think there's something you can learn from everyone and
differing perspectives and differing views and different
differing settings and differingideas and differing backgrounds,
and there's just so much. There's so much you don't know,
(50:49):
and you don't know how much you don't know.
For sure, 100%. So click on that podcast episode
that you weren't going to listento, although if you made it to
the end here, I'm pretty sure you're locked in.
But anyway, if you're new here, we do lots of different
episodes. We don't just do interviews.
We do education episodes where we take actually they're they're
(51:12):
good for CUS. Randy takes a bunch of research
articles that he reads, synthesize them.
We talk about them conversationally.
They're good for CUS thanks to our partner clinically pressed
and our partner athletic training chat.
It's been really awesome workingwith them.
So we're, we're appreciative to have those back.
Category A. We also have story episodes
(51:34):
where we have stories from real life athletic trainers about
various topics and we kind of bring those together and talk
about again, those differing opinions, differing views,
differing ways to manage things,situations that different people
have had. Those are really fun.
We do some BOC episodes that arejust basically like topics of
something you might see on an exam and talk about them in real
(51:58):
life and how they present and how they're different from the
textbook, how they're the same. There's a lot we've been doing
this for. This is our sixth year now.
Yeah. There's something for everyone.
And if there's anything you everwant to listen to, just send it.
Shoot us an e-mail or send us Adm on Instagram, and we'll try
to get back to that, try to cover that.
(52:19):
So I think that's all I have. Thank you for opening a showcase
Athlete training behind the tape.
Bye.
Hey, this is Sandy. And Randy?
And we're here on AT Corner. Being an Athi trainer comes with
ups and downs, and we're here toshowcase it all.
Join us as we share our world insports medicine.
Welcome back to another episode of AT Corner.
For this week's episode, we havean interview about a setting
(00:22):
where I think the population is often overlooked.
Very overlooked. Actually both populations on
what we kind of talked about arekind of overlooked, I'd say.
Yes. And I what I really like about
this interview is I feel like Kylie does a really great job of
talking about how similar drum core is to traditional sports
(00:46):
and the things that we kind of understand and then also even
club sports and how similar theyare.
So even though like they are different entities, they're
still a lot of the same things that we're doing.
Yeah, absolutely. And I I think the cool thing
(01:06):
with the especially with the drum core stuff, 'cause it not
being necessarily a traditional dude, I remember seeing them
when I was younger, man. They're out there in the heat,
they're out there for hours a day like the it's an active
body, like they are doing intense things.
So absolutely no, so absolutely you need an AT there.
(01:26):
So I thought it's always nice tohear that perspective and just
hear how that emerging setting it continues to grow.
Absolutely do. You want to introduce Kylie.
Yes. So our guest is Kylie Robbins.
She received her bachelor's in Exercise science and master's in
athlete training, both from Marshall University.
(01:46):
Go Herd. She's been.
One of my football players is wearing a Marshall University
sweatshirt today. And did it say go herd?
Actually it didn't, which is whyactually I don't think I would
have made the connection except that when you said go herd, the
guys were talking about it today.
I see. There you go.
And so because his his sweater was they were talking about how
(02:07):
it's like not branded, but it's like totally branded.
'Cause it's got, it's got the the green.
Like what is that thing? Well, I've seen always seen it
like the green M. No, like the mascot.
The Thundering Herd, The Buffalo, Is it a Buffalo?
Buffalo Bison. Is it a bison?
(02:28):
Maybe. Kylie, please let us know.
Obviously I'm not up to date on my Marshall University, but
yeah, that was totally a sidetrack.
For sure. Kylie has been certified for six
years. She's worked with Upstate
Orthopedics, pediatric orthopedic Unit, Mooresville
(02:48):
University, Wells College, Red Lion High School and currently
with the Blue Coats and Penn State University Club Sports.
We had so much fun with this episode and honestly, I think
there's so much to take away from it, even if you're never
going to work with drum core or club sports in your life, but it
(03:09):
gives you a new found appreciation for a lot of those
things so. Let's hear from Kylie.
You want to get started. Yeah, so kicking it off with
some nice cryo Breakers. First one is what athletic
training tool and this could be a tape brace, rehab, etcetera
that describes you as a clinician.
So I think that I would be manual therapies only because I
(03:33):
feel like as us as athletic trainers are the Swiss Army
knives of healthcare and we haveto be ready for literally
everything. And me as an athletic trainer, I
try to channel my artistic athletic trainer whenever I can,
thinking out-of-the-box, constantly working with non
traditional athletes, things of that nature.
And I feel like my brain and my hands, my brain and my elbows,
(03:55):
my brain and my, you know, knee combine.
I can be quite literally versatile for anything I want to
accomplish. So I would say manual therapy.
I I like that mind body connection exactly.
Thank you. Hands the most important tools,
some would argue correct yeah, you don't need the I mean,
granted, is it nice to have likethe expensive X5 the expensive
(04:18):
modality that like to do that one individual thing maybe a bit
faster than what your hands could do?
Sure, yes. But that doesn't mean that your
therapies and rehabs and stuff are any less important or great
when you don't have those expensive items.
So, well, I mean, that's exactlywhat you said.
You said it's a luxury. Yeah.
Yes, exactly. That's the basics.
(04:41):
So here on AT Corner, we really like to pair evidence and
experience. So if you could help us kick
this episode off with a story orexperience case study.
Something about working with drum corps or club sports.
So personally for me, I think when it comes to my non
traditional athletes versus my traditional athletes, I've been
in both realms from pediatric orthopedics to high school to
(05:04):
D3DD1D2D3. I would say that maybe this is a
little less evidence based, but I think athletic trainers would
really appreciate it. Is that my non traditional
athletes, not saying that my traditional athletes aren't
grateful. I feel like athletic training is
a very thankless job. So a lot of the times we're
doing because it's expected and it's just like, all right, Yep,
(05:25):
Kylie did that. But I would say that my non
traditional realms, my athletes aren't receiving that care
regularly nor do they really know how to use it often.
So I'm constantly having to educate, but I feel like they're
so grateful. I feel like that's one thing
that most of my athletic trainers and interns would say
was that like, wow, it was a breath of fresh air to be
(05:46):
thanked because I gave them a heat pack or like I, I gave them
AI put a Band-Aid on, I cleaned the wound and I, you know, but
it's like they said that they would never leave the training
room without being thanked for something.
And it was really refreshing forthem as interns as well.
So, like I said, not saying thatmy traditional athletes don't
(06:07):
say thank you and I'm not able to build those relationships,
but something comes along with like the brand of Kylie as an
athletic trainer and the brand of like whoever else I bring on
under me as an athletic trainer.And to be thanked for being the
Kylie athletic trainer is is really nice.
And sometimes it's followed up with someone be excited that I'm
(06:29):
doing an extra surprise leg on tour and they just like light up
like fireworks or someone writesme a note when they're in their
age out season and like brings you to tears.
You know, it's just like the stuff you the stuff you don't,
you just do because you're thereto help.
But then people realize it's like you're going above and
beyond to make sure that they'retaking care of some.
Anyways, I would say the appreciation is nice.
(06:51):
A simple thank you does go a long way sometimes.
Yeah, can make your day like that.
It's like that, like that, like good cup of coffee.
You spend that 5 or $6 like not knowing what you're going to get
and then you know what I mean? It's just like you said.
Thank you. Like, well, for them also like
that's so unexpected for them tohave that level of care even at
(07:13):
a base level of something that we think is like so like
foundational or something that we just provide is something
that's so beyond what they expect.
Yeah. Yeah, exactly.
But like making it like what? Why does why does non
traditional settings have to be an emerging setting?
(07:34):
Like, why can't it just be a setting, you know, why can't
they just have this care? And I want to normalize that for
them and I want it to be expected.
Like, no, when you hit your headwith the rifle or whatever and
you had a headache for a while and they told you that you were
being soft, that no, no, you hada, you had a headache because
(07:59):
you were injured. Like, and there's a way to take
care of this. Now, granted, are there some
like like there there's like kind of like grievances with
having to go through the concussion protocol because
that's also something that they aren't.
They're like, why can't I just go back in?
Like I don't have a headache after three days, you know, So
(08:19):
it's just the educational piece too.
But I think once they get it, they get it and it's always met
with with kindness. It's not like, what the heck,
You don't know anything. Why aren't you putting me back
in? It's OK, fair.
I get it. I now understand and I want to
take care of my body to be readyfor finals, things like that.
So tying into that, you've already kind of mentioned like
Drum Core. What is that?
(08:41):
And like you said it, it's viewed as like an emergent
setting. So why do they need a TS?
Great, yes. So Drum Core is a variety of
marching music ensembles, I would say ranging to compare to
our traditional settings like D1D2D3.
We have our umbrella, which is like our NCAA, which only
(09:02):
governs, it's called DCI. So Drum Core International is
like our NCAA umbrella. And then we have D1D2D3 open
class, world class, all age class underneath there, but
we're marching music ensembles that essentially go through a
pretty rigorous spring training where we prep for your
traditional game day. But that's our as our
performances. So we do like a six week spring
(09:24):
training kind of like your football would do to prep for
their first game, 14 hour days, various types of let's say
activity throughout the day, considering what section you're
in ultimately being treated likeyour traditional athlete.
If there's lightning, we're coming in.
If the if the wet ball globes inthe black, we're not practicing
(09:47):
outside, but then we, you know, go on a six week world tour and
then we have finals at the end of the season.
So it's like our competition season.
And anyways, that's just at least a brief descriptor.
But a lot of the things that we are doing, for example, like we
need a hand eye coordination like soccer or basketball.
We need the endurance like your long distance runner, because
we're, you know, up and down a field different paces, kind of
(10:10):
like your staggered running, like the jog, walk, run, Sprint,
you know, to stuff. So ultimately we're seeing
traditional injuries and things just happening in on traditional
ways. So why not needing an athletic
trainer? I mean, it just makes the most
sense. I mean, you kind of like put it
hand in hand in that way. I think they just see they're
(10:31):
just playing instruments moving around.
But when you pick up on the technicalities of it, I mean, I
think it makes sense. So that I think that is why we
need athletic trainers, because we're out there in the elements.
We're doing the rigorous exercise, we're compared, we're
comparing ourselves to traditional sports.
So yeah, why wouldn't we need sports medicine for sure.
(10:53):
Hey, it's a body emotion, yes? Well, also if you think about
any of the wind, I mean if you think of any, any of the
instruments, you think of the wind instruments in the lung
capacity they have to have whilethey're moving.
And then you think about like the the drums that they're
holding and like the stress on their low back or the stress on
where the harness sits. Or we could go through each one
(11:16):
probably. Well, and there's also like
those intricate things that do occur because of the apparatus
that they are carrying. Like so for example, more
specifically that I can think ofjust because it happened more
recently, but on on tour, not because they're malnourished.
They're just working out all day.
(11:37):
So they, you know, they get kindof like that tour body, they
slim down, they get skinny, likenot because they are
malnourished. I want to very, very much like
stress that there's working out 14 hours a day and doing
nothing. But so from that, you know,
certain Bony prominences become more prominent.
So then when something is like pressed up against or rubbing
(11:57):
on, it could cause more frictionthan normal.
So for example, like 1 summer, we were having some Asis being
rubbed on the drum harness. And so we were having to manage,
you know, finding a way to tactfully clean their harness
because it doesn't come apart like or yeah, it doesn't come
(12:18):
apart like clothing, like you'd RIP out the inside and like wash
the sleeve or anything like that.
So we'd figure out how to clean that, keep their hips clean
while also not structurally moving the harness to a way that
it would like affect their drumming while also trying to
prevent lifelong scarring from happening.
You know, whether it be like just from scarring in general,
(12:40):
but like to other ethnicities that like scarring does become
relatively permanent. So anyways, I could go on and on
and on. But like, yeah, exactly that the
different harnesses and things that they carry.
Someone moves just the wrong wayin the in the formation, bonking
somebody on the back of the head.
A big gust of wind pushes through one of our big props and
(13:03):
gets somebody while they're not looking, being prepared to like
come out. Our prop crew is amazing and
making sure that like the thingsthat we use are, are smooth and
put together well structurally to hold people and be pushed.
But like, sometimes there's thatfew things that just flip
through the cracks and someone gets a, a cut on their hand, you
know, so many different variables.
(13:27):
For sure. Yeah, for something that I think
especially when I've been working in the non traditional
or more of an aesthetic, not that this is totally aesthetic,
but like aesthetic artists, people think that like it's so
controlled and so predictable that there can't be injuries
because it's not like you're having a reaction time or
(13:49):
something to that effect. Like you would it like in
soccer, for example. But there are so many elements
of it that are, or even if that when they're rehearsing or when
they're learning things or even in something that they know
what's going to happen, we stillhave to be aware of how that
movement's happening. And if someone does move a
different way, like they do haveto react to those things.
(14:11):
So there are still injuries and and things that nature, even
though we are supposed to be quote, UN quote, everything's
supposed to be predictable. Right.
I think too. If you think about it though,
like in your traditional football setting, don't they
rehearse all of their plays? You know, like, but it doesn't
go as planned every time, hence why a game occurs.
(14:33):
Like that's why it's exciting and fun.
And not saying that like we wantto live life on the edge, but
like a lot of the times things aren't fun unless there's a
little bit of danger involved. Like, you know what I mean?
So if everything was so predictable, it'd be less
entertaining. Does that make sense for humans?
Right. And there's going to be some
human error at some point, as hard as we try.
(14:56):
Exactly. You know, someone could have
just been, maybe they sustained an injury earlier on in the week
that they didn't report. And then there's, like, standing
a different way. Yeah.
So many different things, Breathes differently.
Doesn't get enough arm to lift somebody up.
So many things. Or like the stress is stress is
stress for like the ehi stuff like exertional heat illness
(15:18):
stuff, you know, like I've been drinking water.
I don't know why I'm feeling. So I'll today.
Well, like we just spent the past week in Texas where I'm
like your, your body's not acclimated to that.
So no matter how much you're drinking, like ANYWAYS, yeah, so
many things. So I really love how you
highlighted how many similarities there are with a
traditional sports medicine likemodel.
(15:41):
But could you highlight some of like the differences like maybe
things that you have to think about, like like we were talking
about maybe like lung capacity with some of the wind
instruments or like I had I, I briefly worked with a marching
band, not to any element as you did, but.
(16:02):
I haven't, yeah. Just it was, it was very small.
I mean, it was a very big company, but a trumpet that she
had to take anti inflammatories because her she was, she was, I
don't know the correct terminology for like playing, I
guess playing the trumpet so often that her lips would swell.
(16:22):
And so she was like doing anti inflammatories.
And so then we had to educate onlike you can't be taking anti
inflammatories every single day.We had to figure out some other
sort of recovery for this, but how?
How? What are some other things that
you have to do differently than a traditional sportsman?
Because I've never had to deal with that like with one of my
other athletes, football guys, yeah.
But but you never know, like maybe being out in the sun, you
(16:46):
know for a while their their lips start to swell due to like
sun exposure. You know, you could potentially
pick-n-pull some really fun things from what you've learned,
but I would say the biggest one is the encouragement like of my
team and my MSAT interns to makesure that they're stable but
mobile. Like ultimately, you know, my
(17:07):
yes. So this person has an ankle
sprain. It's on a performing arts ankle
sprain. It's an ankle sprain.
It just happened in in a non traditional way.
It happened to this person who maybe had an ankle sprain
before. Anyways, still an ankle sprain,
but I would say encouraging themto think stable but mobile.
So what's going to stabilize this and provide structural
support, but still allow them todo like a plie or a pointed toe
(17:31):
or this jump that they need to like step up and push up onto a
prop? You know, really be inquisitive
about not only the sport that they're playing, but the section
specific, the part that they play in the big picture.
So I would say stable, but mobile's like a big piece.
(17:52):
But then even things like you had said with with the lip
scenario. So providing like ice cups in
the in the freezer, not for whatyou think.
I mean, could be for muscles too, but like so my trumpets can
like ice cup massage their lips and providing them gloves.
So then they can do like vascular massages up their face
or trying to think what else, being able to be versatile and
(18:18):
kind of like set up a training room wherever you are and get
the job done. So like on tour, we have
gymnastics masks that we fold out and essentially we create a
training room outside under a pavilion and we go.
So I would say like those are the biggest pieces.
But then like I did already touch about concussion protocol
(18:40):
just because it's like so prevalent in research right now.
But like even being section specific there like the further
acclimated return to play, thereare pieces like our, sorry, our
rehearsal day is 14 hours long, but there are pieces that they
can incrementally participate inthroughout the day without fully
saying like Nope, you can only participate in 20 minutes of
(19:02):
this. And like that is it.
So there are ways for them to safely participate in portions
of the day because ultimately ifthey're missing a whole day,
it's like missing 3 days of rehearsal.
So finding ways to keep them in it with their friends, not
hitting that concussion depression.
I would say the biggest picture here is just listening to your
(19:22):
athletes and making sure that you are being athlete specific
but also section specific. Kind of along the lines of like
you kind of name those differences what has been like a
big challenge working in a setting that maybe hasn't been
exposed to a TS very often. So I would say the biggest piece
(19:46):
maybe earlier on. I am in Year 5 going on 6 now in
the drum core setting, but I am in year 1 of the club sports
setting. So ultimately I would say it's
the education piece. And like we often like obviously
the grievances of like, no, likeI do have the education to give
you a, you know, a strength, theconditioning program.
(20:08):
But like, yeah, So what I do? But also just like trying to
figure out what we do, do and then like how it fits and like,
builds everybody up from there. I've been encouraging athletic
trainers left and right recentlyafter a conversation with my
dad, who's like, who's the boss for a landscape, sorry,
(20:29):
landscaping company in LancasterCounty.
He he was saying all these things like he and like, wanted
to make sure that they're hydrated.
And I'm like, Dad, just hire an athletic trainer.
Like who I've been telling everybody like, OK, if that's
where you want to work, figure out how you apply and pitch it.
(20:50):
Like figure out how you fit and how you can build the program up
and get their buy in. So essentially that I feel like
people aren't afraid of change, they're afraid of going into it,
not having the information to beprepared for it.
And honestly, I get it. I hate going into things not
knowing all the information to be successful.
(21:11):
That's it's, it's anxiety ratingfor me.
I don't like that. So I've been trying to prepare
my staff to know what's up and know what's set in stone.
And like, honestly, this year atthe drum Corp I was at was like
the best year yet. And I can't wait to continue
making changes and like just building us up.
(21:32):
And hopefully we'll get to a point where like I'm doing the
exit interviews at the end of the year and they're like, you
know, actually I don't have any constructive criticism to give
you. So you know, you know you.
You put it really well because especially companies and people
who don't normally have an athletic trainer, especially
like what you were talking aboutin the beginning, like they just
(21:54):
don't we, we talk about this allthe time.
Like you don't know what you don't know.
So like, how would they know to hire an athletic trainer who has
all this knowledge if they don'tknow what an athletic trainer
does? So if you come in and you say,
hey, I can do this for you, I can do this for you, I can do
this for you, It's going to takeso much off of them.
But they don't even know that togo looking for that.
Sometimes you have to be the oneto take that step.
(22:17):
Yes, don't be afraid of the wordno.
Like, yeah, what what's that? Gonna No.
OK, thank you. Next opportunity.
Like, you know, just don't. I just Yeah, just don't be
afraid of it. So along those lines of kind of
like paving that path. How did you learn to work with
drumcore? I would say I wish I had this
(22:39):
like I, you know, come to Jesus moment for it, but it kind of
just fell in my lap. So in 2020, I was working for a
pediatric orthopedic unit because I was like all I could
find because 2020. And then I wanted to move on to
the college setting. I just accepted a new job and my
(23:00):
friend was interning at the drumcorps that I am now at and their
athletic trainer, their preceptor, needed to leave
suddenly for two weeks to figurethroughout life they only had
one athletic trainer at the time.
They did the whole summer, whichis a lot, but I was like, man, I
just set up my first day at the new job and I don't know.
(23:24):
Anyway, so I reached out to my new head athletic trainer and
for some reason the softball coach there knew what drum corps
was and was like, oh that drum corps, you have to let her go.
You have to let her go. I was like, is this person
anyways, so I did my two weeks that year and I've been there
ever since. So that's.
(23:45):
Awesome. And that intern now is a
certified there with me as well.Oh, how cool.
Full circle, Yeah. Yes, has been there for for
four, four years, 4 out of the five years.
So it's been pretty solid. That's really cool how just the
stars aligned to make that just that perfect.
Like, yeah, she should go. Literally.
(24:07):
I was like, I don't know how to pitch this because I had never
heard a drum corps before. I'd been in marching band, but I
was like, there's this like smashing band, I think, and they
tour. I was like, I think it's a cool
opportunity and I know we just met, but like, can I go, Dad?
Can I go? So with that, I know you said
you were in marching band, but how did you, or maybe you had a
(24:29):
little bit of background, but did you have to learn some of
the different sections or different like parts of the of
the whole organization? Yeah, I I wouldn't say maybe as
intensely as an athletic trainerwho's just never experienced
marching band before because I'dbeen around color guard and then
(24:50):
obviously with harm twirlers andthen, you know, all the horns in
front of ensemble and things like that.
But like I never got to understand them on a deeper
level other than, OK, I visuallysee what they do, but like what
do they experience? So for example, on a year to
year basis, I will have one front ensemble member, maybe 2,
(25:10):
who the, there are tops of theirhands here.
Just they, they blow up, they, they look inflamed like this.
It looks gnarly. They're like, I don't know what
I did but I've just been practicing that's all they
that's all they tell me and ultimately came to find out it's
from them. Like doing like an immense cram
sesh before before spring training and then the top of
(25:32):
their hands get inflamed from like doing all that carrying
like 3 mallets in their hands and like playing so hard.
It's so fast. Just like their extensors are
just overdone. Yes, just.
They I'm not even kidding, like a good like 2 inch and a half
two inches off the backside of their hand.
It I'm like I'm like I'm only when I wanted to 1st send it for
(25:54):
a picture, I'm like that's got you punch something like Oh my
God, that's funny. I was like don't fit to me right
now because this is serious, butsince I've adapted then like my
own way of just handling it, I'mlike, all right, random athlete,
like I'm here like, you know, solike it's like fluid movement
(26:15):
three times a day. I have them sleep with I cut non
latex gloves the fingers off andI make them wear that with an
ace bandage up their forearm while they sleep.
Sometimes even 2 like but like asize smaller than what they
would normally wear to like compress the top side And then
if they can handle it, I'll use some like.
(26:37):
I don't often like to use KT tape.
I feel like sometimes it provides like a false sense of
stability. But in this sense I'd be able to
apply it in pieces to the top portion of their hand just while
they're playing throughout the day.
It would apply some compression down on the top.
But yes. So I would say that like I knew
the general, like if it was a jawbreaker, I knew the outer
(27:00):
layer of the jawbreaker. But as the years have gone on, I
have learned each layer and it's, I think, made me a better
clinician each year. And then I just try to share
that craft with my new certifieds, my interns, and
hopefully create, encourage themto be artistic athletic trainers
even in their traditional settings, even if they don't
ever come back to drum corps. So what would you?
(27:22):
Recommend to someone who's interested in working with drum
corps. Yes.
So I think there's two scenarioshere.
There's a scenario where the sports medicine program is
already built for you and you kind of walk into a comfortable
setting. And I think that's going to be
far less than you think that like that there's going to be
(27:44):
solid structure only because ourgoverning body requires you to
have an, A healthcare professional on the entire
summer. And they've since gone on to
describe like what specific healthcare professionals that
should kind of look like now since, but it's still a wide
variety. So I, I encourage you to ask the
(28:06):
questions you're scared to ask, set yourself up for success.
So if they ask for the, the Eapsand like the protocols that are
written down so that you can either read them or in some
cases create them to make sure everybody is on the same page
before going in. And then I would encourage you
to be optimistic and like I said, be creative.
(28:30):
You may be working with less resources.
I'll tell you right now the where we are at the drum core
that I work at in comparison to the first year are like 2
separate instances. It was not all like rainbows and
roses in the beginning. It was a lot of advocacy and
trusting my craft and continuingto educate as we went from year
(28:53):
to year. What didn't work re evaluating
and making it better from year to year.
Knowing that you're just people and we are not perfect.
So I would say that advocate foryourself.
Ask the questions you're scared to ask, maybe you're not scared
to ask them. And then be an optimistic and
artistic athletic trainer as you'll be working potentially
(29:14):
with less than your D1 athletic training room.
But that doesn't make your protocols and you as a clinician
any less important or crucial tothe survival of the drum corps
to finals. So.
For sure. Can you share a little bit about
like each part of like you were talking about like the baton
twirlers or the like, I'm blanking on the name of the
(29:36):
people you were just talking about with the mallets front
ensemble and the front yeah, front ensemble.
Or like can you kind of go over like the the the people you
would see or like the positions you would see?
Yeah, so baton twirling just recently made like a lick of a
comeback in drum corps with withactually the reigning champions
(29:58):
this year, which was so cool to see.
So traditionally you wouldn't see baton twirlers are more of
like a novelty piece, but you have colour guard, which is like
the wooden rifle, the Sabre and then your flag and then also
other like novelty equipment like streamers and things of
that nature. You have your horn line, which a
(30:20):
lot of the horns look like bigger and smaller things of
each other. So like you're like, man, that's
just a bigger trumpet. Like actually it's euphonium.
So but but so you have the horns, then you have the drum
line and then you have front ensemble and then we have our
drum majors. So that's like all the different
(30:42):
sections. And then having to be able to
apply like all legs of sports medicine to such different
positions, I think has challenged my brain in ways that
have made me a better clinician outside of drunk or realm as
well. And it sounds like working
football or track where you havejust so many different position
(31:02):
groups, events all in within oneteam.
Yes, so you know, someone who was well, it's just going back
into the concussion realm again.It's just like essentially like
my drum majors, you know, peoplewere like, oh, they're just
waving their hands all day, but they have to have in like
endurance for that and like theyare out in the sun as well.
(31:22):
But just like like I said, honing in on the athlete or the
sports specific but also athletespecific items.
So for sure. Well, that's The thing is like
so I before I started working with marching band, I had I had
seen some of their instruments, but not totally familiar with
any of them. And I've never worn any like the
the drum set, like the four withthe symbol on it.
(31:45):
And I didn't know that that would create a little bit more
offset to one side. It's like returning someone who
we had to adjust, like maybe we take the symbol off or we we
change you to like a one set instead of the four drums or you
maybe in between, like as you'rewalking, maybe you can lift up
(32:05):
the drums. So because they fold.
And so like things that like some things you just have to
learn from talking to them or, or even just like learning their
equipment or their instrument because that's something like
just from the outside you, you wouldn't know.
Right, No, I agree. I think so now I think I heard
an intern recently that's been exploring non traditional
(32:28):
opportunities, performing arts, strong war, etcetera that was
told that that they need they would they would they're not
gonna have success in these non traditional internship
opportunities if they don't knowthe lingo.
But I don't think that's true. Like, we can talk the same
(32:50):
language. We're just gonna say two
different funny, fancy words. So like, did your ankle, which
we all know, go like this? Yes.
OK. Like we can get to the same
thing. And you can teach me the lingo
as we go, which is what I had tolearn.
I was in AI didn't spin flag. I I played clarinet.
(33:12):
I there's no clarinets in drum corps like, so there's things
that we can learn on the fly. Just take some optimism and some
artistic navigation within our conversations to get to the same
point. I think we can still be
successful without immediately coming in and having that
experience is what I'm trying tosay.
Yeah, Yeah, I agree. Because like kind of in a more
(33:34):
traditional setting, like working a sport like track, I
never ran track, right. But I worked, I worked it for
years and I never felt that because I didn't come from it.
I never got respect or like theyshield away from me because I
feel like if you just show a willingness to learn their
environment and what they're doing, I feel like they're all
(33:55):
in and they actually love to talk about it and like help you
out too. Well, I, I feel like that's
exactly what I was going to say is like, you have to take like
in some books, like you have to take the L, you have to be a
novice. You have to say, I don't know,
which is so scary for some people because like, otherwise
(34:17):
like, and I could say the same thing.
Like I didn't play football. Like I had no idea what I was
doing when I first stepped on the field.
But you have to learn things like when the first time my
online coach said, yeah, like a double team.
And I was like, I can you tell, can you explain to me what that
is? Because if you give, if even
(34:37):
like there's two thoughts, you could either be like, oh, I'm
coming in and I, I know all this, but or you can come in and
say, you know, I don't know, butI want to learn.
And you're going to get so much further if you don't fake it
till you make it. For sure, yes, because they'll
be able to see through it too. You know what I mean?
Like when you get that like sideeye, like, you know, it doesn't
(35:00):
just happen when they don't knowthe big medical words that
you're saying. But I think, right, I'm like,
why are you judging me right now?
Like then you lose. Trust like that's not you know,
but you gain so much more rapport if you if you're showing
them a willingness to their. Demands are, I think, also to
(35:24):
show up when you say you're going to show up.
So for example, if you don't know and you say, hey, I'm going
to look into this tonight and then reinform you tomorrow when
I have a better grasp on this. After talking with team doc and
maybe doing a little bit of research like this.
Like, for example, this year I had my first interaction with
intersection syndrome. Like, and when you close your
(35:47):
eyes and you they say like, oh, it feels like how a creaky door
sounds. I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah,
we're in school. Like, yeah, creaky door.
Like, no, when I tell you that, like, I can't.
Like, like, I can't explain it any other way.
But I was like, I was like, whatis this anyways?
But it took some like research on a nightly basis for me to
(36:08):
make sure that I was tackling itthe right way while also doing
potentially 14 hours of rehearsal in a day anyways.
But agreed. Like, so I think also showing up
when you say you're going to show up is great about building
that rapport in relationships. You can say you don't know and
you don't have to know everything, and you can still do
research and continuously be a lifelong learner, even as a
(36:30):
clinician. Yeah, OK.
You want to transition to club. Sports.
Yeah, I was going to say so along with your work with drum
corps, you also mentioned that you work club sports at a
university, which I feel like isa growing setting.
I feel like that's getting a lotmore popular.
How does that like what similarities and differences
(36:50):
does club sports have with your kind of traditional sports
setting? Yes.
So I think club sports potentially they are often
happening at higher institutionswhen they were provided athletic
trainers. So you know, you see this like
(37:11):
D1 level varsity athletics happening and they're like oh,
they're just club sports. But The thing is what's the same
there is that they're both sports.
So like, what does it matter thelevel that they're competing at?
Like they're they're both sports.
So being an just like elaborating a little bit on
(37:31):
that, being a non traditional athlete myself and actually
being in an underserved realm, Iactually find a lot of
fulfillment in serving the underserved just because, you
know, like I said, they they area bit more grateful.
It's not expected. They do seek you out, I think
(37:51):
for the right reasons once educated.
So I would say that similaritiesare that they are both sports
and often times are competing atD2 and D3 levels.
So actually if you look up club basketball, my organization is
deemed one of one of the best out there competing at like that
(38:12):
D2 level. So my ice hockey team is
competing against D1 level and they actually have been required
to get physicals for the past several years because they've
been competing against D1 level athletes from other D1
institutions. So anyways, I would say
similarities, yes. Or that they are just all
sports, so why don't they deserve care?
(38:34):
Actually, that's a really. Good point.
I guess I'd never really thoughtabout it because I don't.
We have one technically club sport at our my college where I
work, but we do have them do allthe same medical eligibility as
the rest of sports. But it without.
I mean, do you guys have a governing body or something that
says like everyone needs a certain medical eligibility?
(38:57):
So that's a really great question.
And as I started the program, I'd reached out to several other
club sports programs with athletic trainers, some from
1:00 and just starting to othersthat are getting their third
athletic trainer for club sports.
Crazy. So great for them though, but
they're they're doing amazing. But the one thing that I did
(39:19):
gather was from club sport program to club sport program,
everything was immensely different in the things that
they were able to accomplish because there isn't a governing
body over like us specifically. Now each club sport does have an
organization that they compete under, but it's like for their
own sport. So they have requirements like
(39:44):
boxing's required to get A to get physicals, hockey's required
to get physicals. But like my table tennis group,
like, you know, maybe not, they're not required.
But like with me being added into the mix and there being so
many athletes to take care of, Ihave established that baseline
that physicals are required. And that was a new piece.
(40:05):
I was new this year, but that was also like a big new piece
but. Yeah.
So we don't have a governing body, which makes it difficult
as we form this. I've been trying to base
everything off of NATA gold standard items and how all
traditional practice is held in comparing our athletes to D2 and
D3 level athletes and the thingsthat they're required to do.
(40:29):
But doing something like a simple change like, OK, well,
I'm going to require them to geta physical, but I'm not.
We're going to require them to get their sickle cell tests
done, but I am going to have them report on the physical on
the self reported questionnaire,whether or not they know that
they have it or not. I need that baseline for when
they're walking into my room andthey're one of 2000 athletes and
I'm one Kylie, to know what I can and can't do, maybe what to
(40:52):
provide in the Med kits or not things of that nature.
But blessing listening in disguise maybe because it allows
me to be the artistic athletic trainer that I want to be in
really create this program to bebeneficial to them.
So so then what does game coverage look like for you?
Like, because I'm assuming they have like home games or
something that would be on campus.
Do you cover those? Yes, another really great
(41:15):
question because that was a big question for me when I was
exploring this opportunity. 50 teams, 1 Kylie, it was 55 and we
added three. So that's Oh my God.
So I guess the, the so I wanna start with at the D1 level,
there is varsity athletics, which is your D1 sports.
(41:37):
You have your team sports, whichis like dance, cheer, and in
this case rugby. Then you have your club sports,
which is me. And then you have your IM
sports, intramural sports, whichanybody can join.
Club sports is still somewhat funded by the university.
Team sports is kind of like a varsity athletics with just some
(41:57):
slight variations and varsity athletics obviously gets like
the whole spiel. So with that at the club sport
level, they are deemed in 1-2 and three on risk level.
So comparative of like sorry that's created by our risk
management team, they deem like,so they take into consideration
like injuries, contacts, impactsand a variety of other things to
(42:22):
put them in these this variety of risk levels risk, our highest
risk level is required to have EMT and or athletic trainer
coverage. Our second risk level is
required to have EMT coverage and then our lowest risk level
just has to have like like a first aider, which is often one
of the safety officers or one ofour professional staff or one of
(42:45):
the student staff. But with that, sorry, getting to
your question, my specific role is to do mainly clinic coverage
with like a sprinkle of game coverage here and there for some
built in rapport, which I've kind of established.
I said I wanted to do this even those may be adding some hours
onto my schedule that week. I wanted to be able to build
(43:08):
relationships, find rapport, youknow, as we're continuously
building the program. But with that you're like, oh,
well then how do the other teamsget covered that are required to
have EMT and or ATC coverage? So in years past they've been
using GOAT for Ellis. I've since reformed this and was
like we need continuity of care.Our athletes deserve continuous
(43:32):
conversations, clear instructions.
So why don't we hire a group of PRN athletic trainers who are
hired to the university that we then supply at one solid price
per hour to the teams when thesethings do happen.
So find some people that can like work those.
So that is where we are. The teams are required to find
(43:54):
their own EMT coverage, which isessentially usually just through
University Health services, which is pretty easy for them.
But when it comes to the athletic trainer, we are trying
to push towards this PRN, which just went live for anyone
looking for some PRN opportunity.
(44:15):
But yeah, go for Ellis in the past.
But I feel like there's just we,we could be, we could have a
more clear line of care, continuity of care, if we had
our own group and team that could like function within the
EMR system, apply a sway baseline or a sway test if
someone were to have a concussion, things of that
nature. So.
(44:37):
So yeah, it sounds very institutional based, which is
like a blessing and a curse. Yes, yes, because I would say
that even some of the teams thatare in the risk level too, I've
seen some higher risk injuries happening and I'm surprised that
(44:57):
they weren't the higher risk level, but ultimately allowing
me to function in this way. For example, I was allowed to
say who is receiving the Sway baseline testing.
So like, this is this is a team that I've I've seen concussions
with in the past that could be pretty gnarly.
So I was like, OK, I want to baseline test them.
And they said, OK, so pulls and pulls and pushes, you know, like
(45:22):
just hills and valleys. Yeah.
Along those lines of the the hills and the valleys.
What was that experience of creating a club sports program?
So I will say just right off thebat is that it definitely being
a part of this program is scratching an itch that is
enticing to me and exciting. Getting to create custom tables
(45:46):
and custom wall art, which is like that like true artist in me
and then be able to combine thatwith traditional athletic
training has been really fun. And then also creating in AD,
one environment where football is, is the thing like creating
my club sport, athletes place where they can be excited to
(46:07):
come and can brag about is really exciting for me.
So sorry, just elaborating on like the hills and valleys.
So that's definitely scratching an itch.
But obviously with anything new and change, people have
questions. Things arise that may slow you
down a bit, but that doesn't mean that it's like the end of
(46:27):
the world, you know? It just kind of slows you down a
little bit. Like the water in the river
isn't like moving in One Direction at a fast pace.
You hit like a rivet where it's kind of like cross section and
you kind of have to like trudge through it, right?
Like just kind of working together and collaboratively, as
a lot of the people around me don't know the realm of athletic
training. And knowing that and meeting
(46:49):
them where they're at has made this process not be detrimental
when something like that pops up.
You know what I mean? Like, no, not.
And knowing when they have a question, they've often explored
things to try and figure it out themselves.
And they've come to me as the professional.
I should be grateful that they're asking me that question,
(47:10):
if you know what I mean. So yeah.
So just knowing that when in thecreation of anything, literally
anything, not even an athletic training program, there will be
hills and valleys. But like, the valleys don't have
to be the end of the world. Just be optimistic and be
excited about the little victories and then the big
victory doesn't seem so far awayand just kind of keeps you
(47:30):
excited and going and ready for the next couple of days so.
Sweet. Yeah, that's awesome.
You ready for our action item right now?
Go for it. OK, so here on AT Corner we also
like to finish off with an action item that is just
something that athletic trainerscan take away to their practice
today. So if there was someone who
(47:52):
would want to start to work withdrumcore or start creating a
program for a club sports program, how would you
recommend? Like what would you, what advice
would you give them or what recommendations would you give
them? I think we touched on it a
little bit throughout, you know,in bits and pieces.
(48:13):
It's you're you're entering uncharted territory.
You know, this is a new realm where not everybody's just going
to get it. And it's not just is what it is,
you know, so being optimistic and channelling that artistic
athletic trainer, not being afraid of the word no finding
where you fit and like lift the program up and really taking
(48:37):
that to the the moon and comparing it to your traditional
settings. That's how I literally get
anywhere. Is the research done on
traditional settings and comparing it to our non
traditional, our non traditionalsettings, our emerging settings.
So the biggest thesis is optimism.
Channeling your artistic athletic trainer, not being
afraid of the word no, finding how you fit and pitch, pitch,
(48:59):
pitch, you know, sell that and ask the questions that you know
you may otherwise be afraid of because ultimately they're not
thinking about them, not becausethey don't care.
It's because they don't know. So you're the one who knows.
So what's your craft? Awesome, sweet.
Thank you so much for this. Yeah, Thank you guys so much for
(49:21):
having me. It's been really, really fun
talking with you guys. I've been really excited for
this, so thank you. I think the one thing that
really jumps out at this interview is the energy and
excitement and passion that Kylie brings to developing her
practice with with like marchingband and just what she brings to
(49:44):
the club sport atmosphere. Seems like she's really created
a thriving practice in both settings.
And how you can do that with anything that you're passionate
about. So even like she was talking
about the landscaping company, if you can pitch it to someone
who's going to take it. I mean, that's what I did with
(50:05):
the dance company I'm working with.
So, you know, you just have to show that you're you have value
and there you go. See, like you said this, you can
take something away even if you're not in those settings or
interested in those settings. That's something that I love
about this is going to be a total sidetrack, but I feel like
that's something that I love about this podcast because I
(50:27):
feel like we have talked to people I probably would have
never talked to before. And I think there's something
you can learn from every person,even if you don't like them.
Like, I think there's something you can learn from everyone and
differing perspectives and differing views and different
differing settings and differingideas and differing backgrounds,
and there's just so much. There's so much you don't know,
(50:49):
and you don't know how much you don't know.
For sure, 100%. So click on that podcast episode
that you weren't going to listento, although if you made it to
the end here, I'm pretty sure you're locked in.
But anyway, if you're new here, we do lots of different
episodes. We don't just do interviews.
We do education episodes where we take actually they're they're
(51:12):
good for CUS. Randy takes a bunch of research
articles that he reads, synthesize them.
We talk about them conversationally.
They're good for CUS thanks to our partner clinically pressed
and our partner athletic training chat.
It's been really awesome workingwith them.
So we're, we're appreciative to have those back.
Category A. We also have story episodes
(51:34):
where we have stories from real life athletic trainers about
various topics and we kind of bring those together and talk
about again, those differing opinions, differing views,
differing ways to manage things,situations that different people
have had. Those are really fun.
We do some BOC episodes that arejust basically like topics of
something you might see on an exam and talk about them in real
(51:58):
life and how they present and how they're different from the
textbook, how they're the same. There's a lot we've been doing
this for. This is our sixth year now.
Yeah. There's something for everyone.
And if there's anything you everwant to listen to, just send it.
Shoot us an e-mail or send us Adm on Instagram, and we'll try
to get back to that, try to cover that.
(52:19):
So I think that's all I have. Thank you for opening a showcase
Athlete training behind the tape.
Bye.
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