June 9, 2025 • 25 mins
Text the ATB Team! We'd love to hear from you!
In this episode of At the Boundary, Dr. Nicolas Sabouret of the University of Paris-Saclay joins GNSI’s Dr. Tad Schnaufer to preview the upcoming Transatlantic Forum on Cybersecurity. Together, they explore how France and the U.S. approach cybersecurity—from technical expertise in cryptography and networks to the policy implications of securing national infrastructure. It’s a candid, international look at cybersecurity education, research, and collaboration. Whether you’re a student, policymaker, or tech enthusiast, you’ll find insights on the future of global cyber strategy.
Episode Links:
Webpage and Registration for The Transatlantic Forum on Cybersecurity
GNSI Video Series: Dr. Golfo Alexopoulos with Peter Pomerantsev
GNSI Video Series: Dr. Matthew Ford with Students from FSP
####
At the Boundary from the Global and National Security Institute at the University of South Florida, features global and national security issues we’ve found to be insightful, intriguing, fascinating, maybe controversial, but overall just worth talking about.
A "boundary" is a place, either literal or figurative, where two forces exist in close proximity to each other. Sometimes that boundary is in a state of harmony. More often than not, that boundary has a bit of chaos baked in. The Global and National Security Institute will live on the boundary of security policy and technology and that's where this podcast will focus.
The mission of GNSI is to provide actionable solutions to 21st-century security challenges for decision-makers at the local, state, national and global levels. We hope you enjoy At the Boundary.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Glenn Beckmann (00:11):
Glenn, Hi everybody. Welcome to another
episode of at the boundary, thepodcast from the global and
national security Institute atthe University of South Florida.
I'm Glenn Beckman,communications manager at GNSI,
and your host for today's at theboundary.
Tad Schnaufer (04:00):
Nick Well, thank you for that wonderful
introduction. Nicholas, welcometo the podcast.
Unknown (04:13):
Thank you. Thank you.
Nice to meet you.
Nicolas Sabouret (04:16):
I'm Nicholas Sabouret. I'm the director of
the Graduate School of ComputerScience here in Paris Saclay
University, and I'm very happyto be part of today's podcast.
Thank you, Nicholas, and we'retalking today about our current
partnership between GNSI, theUniversity of South Florida, as
well as the University of ParisSaclay and our upcoming event in
a couple of weeks. But first,why don't we talk about what the
(04:38):
overall Paris Saclay Universitylooks like, and as well as your
computer science department,science department there
Nicholas, okay, Paris circle isone of the largest university in
Europe. Well, compared to USstandards, it might look like a
regular university, but to us,it is a large university with
roughly 50,000 students, fromundergrads to.
Unknown (05:00):
Two PhD students in all fields of science with a big
focus on, you know, science andengineering and life sciences,
the computer science departmentis one of the 17 graduate
schools we have here. Just togive you an ideas in terms of
(05:23):
numbers, we have roughly 1000master students here and in
computer science, I mean, androughly 500 PhD students in our
22 research centers in Paris,actually, just to give you an
overview of the activity incomputer science, and it ranges
from low level architecturequestions in computer science to
(05:48):
high level like aI HumanComputer Interaction research,
with theoretical computerscience, with Applied Computer
Science. So we really cover allaspects of computer science in
our teaching and research,that's the goal of the
university here. Oh,
Tad Schnaufer (06:04):
excellent. So with your department, where do
many of your students end upgoing after they graduate? Like,
what's what career fields arethey focused on? Within computer
science, they work for thegovernment, the military, or
just, you know, industry,
Unknown (06:17):
okay, I would say that 80% of all students, once they
graduate their master studies,they go in the industry, most of
them, really, I would say 80% isa good number. The 20 remaining
percent, some work for thegovernment. Some prepare a PhD
to this, and once they graduatefrom the PhD, again, it's
(06:38):
roughly 50% who goes in theindustry, and only the remaining
50% who work for for labs andresearch centers in in France or
in Europe or in the US. It's
Tad Schnaufer (06:51):
interesting.
Yeah, do most your students stayin Europe?
Unknown (06:56):
Lots of our students do stay in Europe? Yes, we have the
chance to have a wide ecosystemof both companies and research
centers and places where you candevelop your activity, also here
in Europe, same as in the USA,actually. So it's quite easy for
people to find the job and thethemes they want to work on
(07:19):
here, but lots of our studentsalso try to go to the US for
short for short stays, or forlonger ones.
Tad Schnaufer (07:30):
Well, there is always the attraction of
computer science in the US,which is, I mean, you're a
country in which this is a very,very active field. But well, you
know how it is people like tostay where they where they were
born and was a studied. So lotsof our students stay here. No,
of course, makes perfect sense.
And so what brought about thepartnership with the University
of South Florida? Becauseobviously you came over here and
(07:52):
visited us, you know, severalmonths ago. So how'd that
partnership begin? Where did youfind out about us, and how did
that work?
Nicolas Sabouret (08:00):
That's exactly how it began. I just came to
University of South Florida tovisit you and discover your
activities. And it is true thata university such as yours has
very similar aspects compared toParis acclaim University the
goal of welcoming all studentsin the area to try to make them
(08:21):
do the best with theirpotential, and if possible, go
to the PhD. So we I found thatthere are very close
relationships that were possiblebetween between the two
universities. And when I metGNSI, it struck me that you had
this research center on globaland national security that was
something very predisciplinar,
Unknown (08:43):
with a very specific team that we were not working on
that much in Paris. Saclay. Wedo have researchers in
cybersecurity, many of them, andyou're going to meet some of
them and in a couple of weeks.
But for having this approach,which is a general approach,
combining different disciplineson security, is something that
(09:03):
we did not have in satellite,and we do not have in satellite
for now. So I thought that wecould benefit from your
experience, if we could shareand exchange our knowledge,
respective knowledge on computerscience for outside and in other
aspects of science, but for GSI.
Tad Schnaufer (09:21):
No, that's great.
And like you mentioned, do youhave any courses or anything
that focus on national securityin your department now? Or is
this kind of a new developmentas you're looking at this
broader spectrum?
Unknown (09:32):
So we don't have specific courses in computer
science about national security.
We do have two tracks and onespecific track, which is really
focused on cryptography, theother being focused on network
security in general. And theyhave a very technical approach
to these questions, and they donot take a view of national
(09:53):
security and global security,such as what you can do here at
J. Si especially, they have veryfew courses in other fields than
computer science, so they'rereally focused on the technical
aspects of cybersecurity. Andthat's why I think it is very
interesting for researchers tosee how things are going on the
other side of the Atlantic.
(10:16):
Yeah,
Tad Schnaufer (10:16):
it's a great perspective to be able to see
what our allies are doing acrossthe ocean, but as well as,
again, from our side of GNSI,and also with our partnership
with cyber Florida, a lot of thepolicy pieces, so less of the
technical piece. But what doesthat actually mean for policy
makers? I don't know. Do youhave any engagement with French
policy makers at all?
Unknown (10:37):
Okay, I personally don't have them. I mean, the
graduate school don't havespecific engagements on national
security with policy makers,although we are in relations
with them when they want toaddress the specific questions
with the universities. They, ofcourse, contact us and we try to
relay, rely, sorry, to realizeinformation in our teams here at
(10:58):
University of Paris, actually,but some of the speakers for
next week, or for the couple ofweeks, do have contacts with
policy makers and with activerepresentatives for the
government. So these questions,yes,
Tad Schnaufer (11:11):
sure, and then does the Okay. It goes beyond
that. Goes
Unknown (11:15):
way beyond the sorry for interrupting that goes
beyond sorry the attributions ofthe graduate school to have
those contacts. We really try tomake our labs, our research
centers, work with thegovernment directly, not through
us, because it's more efficienttoday. I mean, it's a part of
it,
Tad Schnaufer (11:33):
right? You guys are really focused on the
research piece and the technicalaspects Exactly, exactly. Now.
Does it also? Do you have anycourses that also talk about
when you talk aboutcybersecurity, but also like the
criminal aspect of it, orpossible the nefarious actors
aspect of computer science, orthe bad side of it, if a bad
actor was using it?
Unknown (11:54):
Well, it's not a specific course on it, but it's
true that in all different
Nicolas Sabouret (11:59):
modules, so our teachers try to give
concrete examples to thestudents, and in which of
course, they speak of allaspects of cyber security. But
we do not have specific courseswith such content. Do you have
such such content here in GNSI?
Tad Schnaufer (12:16):
So GNSI ourselves, we don't host
courses, but through ourpartnership with the cyber
Florida, as well as the Schoolof Information here at USF, we
do have some courses on that.
Our criminology departmentactually has some cybersecurity
courses that look at thecriminal aspect of online
security, so making sure youhave strong passwords, those
type of things, but also whatthey can do to hack whether if
(12:37):
it's a banking website or agovernment website, and then our
College of Engineering and ournew college, the Bellini College
of AI, will also have someaspects of the computer science
security piece. So we actually,yeah, so we have a very
expansive technical piece,
Nicolas Sabouret (12:53):
yeah, that is very interesting, and that's the
sort of thing I would love todevelop here at basically
interdisciplinary approach tosecurity, yeah. So we have it
across the disciplines here. Andagain, it's a and it's great to
also have it have that otherinternational perspective as
well. That's the great thingabout the this partnership.
Tad Schnaufer (13:12):
In addition, as we start looking at our event in
a couple weeks, what are some ofthe big things you think will
take away from that? So when wetalk in two weeks or so, from my
side, what I really expect totake away from from this meeting
is new look, new approaches tosecurity that is less technical.
(13:32):
I mean, technique centered
Unknown (13:56):
different researchers in different disciplines that
are not taught in our mastershere, so that's what I hope my
colleagues in security here willbe able to take away from this
meeting.
Tad Schnaufer (14:10):
That's also what I hope our students will see,
that they will be able todiscover that beyond what they
were taught in their courses,there is an approach to security
that is wider than just acomputer science approach that
they know of because we seewithin security, computer
science is becoming almostomnipresent. It's everywhere. So
(14:33):
whether you're talking aboutenergy, energy infrastructure,
trade, I mean, there's obviouslycomputers involved in all of
that, but if you're able tosomehow attack a computer
system, you can really shut downa lot of a nation's operations,
whether if it's infrastructureor trade.
Nicolas Sabouret (14:48):
Yes, I agree, and that's why I hope the people
on your side will maybetake awayfrom the discussions that there
is an expertise also here inEurope, in.
Tad Schnaufer (14:59):
In cyber security, with with the, as you
say, the broad approach to cybersecurity, which means that any
computer system needs to beprotected and in some way that
maybe might, might be useful interms of exchange of practices
between the two countries, whichI'm sure are different
approaches to cyber security,absolutely, we're definitely
(15:21):
looking to see about thatdifferent approaches. And again,
Mary marrying up our technicalexperts here at the University
of South Florida, as well as the
Unknown (15:53):
If you could, Nicholas, would you highlight a couple of
the speakers that we have comingin from Paris to clay in a
couple weeks? Just any the fewthat you'd like to highlight, we
have, obviously, a number ofgreat speakers, but I don't know
if there's one or two you'd liketo highlight.
Nicolas Sabouret (16:06):
From Paris a clay I would like to highlight
at least one speaker who is
Unknown (17:30):
to propose dependability methods that can
be used for security and cybersecurity in the police systems.
So I think that's veryinteresting in terms of
experience for for the approachwe have on global and national
security here.
Oh,
Tad Schnaufer (17:47):
Oh, that's going to be an excellent contribution
to the discussion, undoubtedly.
So let's just talk briefly abouteach of the panels, what they're
going to what the topics, ingeneral, they're going to talk
about, letting our audience knowso they can, you know, again,
get a little bit of a insight onwhat we can expect in a couple
weeks. So panel one is going totalk about formal models, formal
computer security models. Sowhat's that going to discussion
going to look like?
(18:10):
Well,
Nicolas Sabouret (18:10):
Well, when you design a computer system,
(18:43):
conditional expressions thatneed to be checked. And then we
use automatic methods to provethat the system will reach a
stable state and will not failin face of such an attack. So
for that, we use formal method,and that's that's why the first
panel is about formal methodsfor security.
Tad Schnaufer (19:02):
Well, that sounds awesome, and it kind of builds
out to the next panel, which ison network security, because you
talk about the formal methodswithin the computer system, but
then you also have the networksthat connects all these
different systems, right? Sowhat's that
Unknown (19:12):
second panel looking at?
Nicolas Sabouret (19:14):
Yes, the second panel is about network
security. So it is a well knownfact that the security and one
of the main security failure insystems is not the system
itself, but the communicationbetween the different systems
that is an entry point for forhikers or para and so it is very
(19:37):
important that the networksystem also is secure, that the
communication remains privateand cannot be altered and cannot
be entered through, can be usedas an entry point to the system.
So all these questions of makingthe system communicate properly
and still being secured andsound and safe.
Tad Schnaufer (20:00):
That's part of the network security that is one
of our theme for theconference. Does this include a
zero trust architecture?
Nicolas Sabouret (20:12):
I'm not sure it's going to be discussed at
the panel, but it could include,yes, those situations, yeah,
okay, because we see a lot ofthat in the security sphere
about being able to build outthat type of network or
architecture. And then lastly,oh, go ahead. Oh, sorry, sorry,
it is very important thatnetwork security becomes
accessible to people who have noexperience in computer
(20:35):
programming itself. So that'swhy this. Such approaches are
very important.
Tad Schnaufer (20:40):
Now, yes, absolutely, I'm sure. I'm sure
it will come up in some in someaspects. And then lastly, our
third panel, as you had alreadymentioned, is going to touch on.
Okay, so we have these greattechnical discussions. So how do
you actually implement those andactually have policy, have that
policy implemented. So what canwe look at for that third panel?
Unknown (20:57):
Well, I think what we should expect from the sub panel
is interesting experience frompeople who went from the
technical aspects to the policymakers and tried to have the
theoretical computer sciencemodels be actually implemented
in practices, in systems and inreal situations, and Then you
(21:19):
face a difficulty that is oftenunexpected by researchers and
engineers in engineeringsciences, which is that you can
see you designed a very, veryprecise model that should work
in all situations, and then theusers arrive, and then it
doesn't work as it was supposedto so that's the confrontation
(21:42):
betweenall things that we teach in our
courses and all the practicaltools that people design, and
how it comes to reality when youtry to have it work in real
situations. And that's going tobe a very good experience, I
think, to to hear off, sure. Andalso this technology is
expanding and developing sorapidly, it's almost hard to
(22:03):
keep pace. You develop aprogram, you implement it. By
the time you implement it,there's already a new level of
coding or technology that'salready come out.
Tad Schnaufer (22:12):
So how do you get ahead of it?
Nicolas Sabouret (22:14):
I think you don't. I think you keep running
after the brain, which is goingfaster and faster.
(22:50):
and people are running afterthat. And the next step, I don't
know which one it will be, butit's sure there will be a next
step in a few, in a couple ofyears.
Tad Schnaufer (22:58):
Well, undoubtedly, computer science is
certainly not a boring subject.
There's constant evolutions. Idon't know if you have any other
comments you'd like to mentionbefore we sign off here today.
Nicolas Sabouret (23:07):
No, I'm very happy that you invited me, and
I'm very happy that you helpedus organize this great event,
and I invite everybody toparticipate and listen to the
very interesting discussionsthat will be
Unknown (23:19):
on June the 23rd if I'm correct, that's correct, yeah.
Tad Schnaufer (23:22):
So we're looking forward to having everyone tune
into that conference, ourVirtual Conference, the Trans
Atlantic forum on cybersecurity.
So looking forward to it. Thankyou so much. Nicholas.
Glenn Beckmann (23:42):
You What a great discussion today between Dr
Nicholas sabaray, the directorof the Graduate School of
Computer Science at theUniversity of Paris at clay, and
Dr Tad schnaufer, strategy andresearch manager here at GNSI,
we're working with Dr sabaresteam, along with our colleagues
at cyber Florida, to present theTrans Atlantic forum on
(24:02):
cybersecurity on June 23registration is open for the
live stream event, so check itout on next week's episode of at
the boundary, our guest will beDr Mark Luther, an associate
professor of physicaloceanography here at the USF
College of Marine Science, wherehe's The director of the ocean
monitoring and prediction lab.
He's also heavily involvedaround the world in research
(24:24):
involving deep sea mining anddeep sea critical minerals and
resources, and that's what we'llbe talking with him about next
week. Thanks for listeningtoday. If you like the podcast,
please subscribe and let yourfriends and colleagues know
about it. If you're listeningand watching this on our YouTube
channel, and we know some of youare, we invite you to try us out
(24:45):
on your favorite podcastplatform. We're on Apple
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Officials. We're currently onLinkedIn, X and YouTube. We'd
appreciate a like, follow orsubscribe while you're there.
(25:11):
That's going to wrap up thisepisode of at the boundary. Each
new episode will feature globaland national security issues we
found to be worthy of attentionand discussion. I'm Glenn
Beckman, thanks for listeningtoday. We'll see you next week
at the boundary. You.
Glenn, Hi everybody. Welcome to another
episode of at the boundary, thepodcast from the global and
national security Institute atthe University of South Florida.
I'm Glenn Beckman,communications manager at GNSI,
and your host for today's at theboundary.
Tad Schnaufer (04:00):
Nick Well, thank you for that wonderful
introduction. Nicholas, welcometo the podcast.
Unknown (04:13):
Thank you. Thank you.
Nice to meet you.
Nicolas Sabouret (04:16):
I'm Nicholas Sabouret. I'm the director of
the Graduate School of ComputerScience here in Paris Saclay
University, and I'm very happyto be part of today's podcast.
Thank you, Nicholas, and we'retalking today about our current
partnership between GNSI, theUniversity of South Florida, as
well as the University of ParisSaclay and our upcoming event in
a couple of weeks. But first,why don't we talk about what the
(04:38):
overall Paris Saclay Universitylooks like, and as well as your
computer science department,science department there
Nicholas, okay, Paris circle isone of the largest university in
Europe. Well, compared to USstandards, it might look like a
regular university, but to us,it is a large university with
roughly 50,000 students, fromundergrads to.
Unknown (05:00):
Two PhD students in all fields of science with a big
focus on, you know, science andengineering and life sciences,
the computer science departmentis one of the 17 graduate
schools we have here. Just togive you an ideas in terms of
(05:23):
numbers, we have roughly 1000master students here and in
computer science, I mean, androughly 500 PhD students in our
22 research centers in Paris,actually, just to give you an
overview of the activity incomputer science, and it ranges
from low level architecturequestions in computer science to
(05:48):
high level like aI HumanComputer Interaction research,
with theoretical computerscience, with Applied Computer
Science. So we really cover allaspects of computer science in
our teaching and research,that's the goal of the
university here. Oh,
Tad Schnaufer (06:04):
excellent. So with your department, where do
many of your students end upgoing after they graduate? Like,
what's what career fields arethey focused on? Within computer
science, they work for thegovernment, the military, or
just, you know, industry,
Unknown (06:17):
okay, I would say that 80% of all students, once they
graduate their master studies,they go in the industry, most of
them, really, I would say 80% isa good number. The 20 remaining
percent, some work for thegovernment. Some prepare a PhD
to this, and once they graduatefrom the PhD, again, it's
(06:38):
roughly 50% who goes in theindustry, and only the remaining
50% who work for for labs andresearch centers in in France or
in Europe or in the US. It's
Tad Schnaufer (06:51):
interesting.
Yeah, do most your students stayin Europe?
Unknown (06:56):
Lots of our students do stay in Europe? Yes, we have the
chance to have a wide ecosystemof both companies and research
centers and places where you candevelop your activity, also here
in Europe, same as in the USA,actually. So it's quite easy for
people to find the job and thethemes they want to work on
(07:19):
here, but lots of our studentsalso try to go to the US for
short for short stays, or forlonger ones.
Tad Schnaufer (07:30):
Well, there is always the attraction of
computer science in the US,which is, I mean, you're a
country in which this is a very,very active field. But well, you
know how it is people like tostay where they where they were
born and was a studied. So lotsof our students stay here. No,
of course, makes perfect sense.
And so what brought about thepartnership with the University
of South Florida? Becauseobviously you came over here and
(07:52):
visited us, you know, severalmonths ago. So how'd that
partnership begin? Where did youfind out about us, and how did
that work?
Nicolas Sabouret (08:00):
That's exactly how it began. I just came to
University of South Florida tovisit you and discover your
activities. And it is true thata university such as yours has
very similar aspects compared toParis acclaim University the
goal of welcoming all studentsin the area to try to make them
(08:21):
do the best with theirpotential, and if possible, go
to the PhD. So we I found thatthere are very close
relationships that were possiblebetween between the two
universities. And when I metGNSI, it struck me that you had
this research center on globaland national security that was
something very predisciplinar,
Unknown (08:43):
with a very specific team that we were not working on
that much in Paris. Saclay. Wedo have researchers in
cybersecurity, many of them, andyou're going to meet some of
them and in a couple of weeks.
But for having this approach,which is a general approach,
combining different disciplineson security, is something that
(09:03):
we did not have in satellite,and we do not have in satellite
for now. So I thought that wecould benefit from your
experience, if we could shareand exchange our knowledge,
respective knowledge on computerscience for outside and in other
aspects of science, but for GSI.
Tad Schnaufer (09:21):
No, that's great.
And like you mentioned, do youhave any courses or anything
that focus on national securityin your department now? Or is
this kind of a new developmentas you're looking at this
broader spectrum?
Unknown (09:32):
So we don't have specific courses in computer
science about national security.
We do have two tracks and onespecific track, which is really
focused on cryptography, theother being focused on network
security in general. And theyhave a very technical approach
to these questions, and they donot take a view of national
(09:53):
security and global security,such as what you can do here at
J. Si especially, they have veryfew courses in other fields than
computer science, so they'rereally focused on the technical
aspects of cybersecurity. Andthat's why I think it is very
interesting for researchers tosee how things are going on the
other side of the Atlantic.
(10:16):
Yeah,
Tad Schnaufer (10:16):
it's a great perspective to be able to see
what our allies are doing acrossthe ocean, but as well as,
again, from our side of GNSI,and also with our partnership
with cyber Florida, a lot of thepolicy pieces, so less of the
technical piece. But what doesthat actually mean for policy
makers? I don't know. Do youhave any engagement with French
policy makers at all?
Unknown (10:37):
Okay, I personally don't have them. I mean, the
graduate school don't havespecific engagements on national
security with policy makers,although we are in relations
with them when they want toaddress the specific questions
with the universities. They, ofcourse, contact us and we try to
relay, rely, sorry, to realizeinformation in our teams here at
(10:58):
University of Paris, actually,but some of the speakers for
next week, or for the couple ofweeks, do have contacts with
policy makers and with activerepresentatives for the
government. So these questions,yes,
Tad Schnaufer (11:11):
sure, and then does the Okay. It goes beyond
that. Goes
Unknown (11:15):
way beyond the sorry for interrupting that goes
beyond sorry the attributions ofthe graduate school to have
those contacts. We really try tomake our labs, our research
centers, work with thegovernment directly, not through
us, because it's more efficienttoday. I mean, it's a part of
it,
Tad Schnaufer (11:33):
right? You guys are really focused on the
research piece and the technicalaspects Exactly, exactly. Now.
Does it also? Do you have anycourses that also talk about
when you talk aboutcybersecurity, but also like the
criminal aspect of it, orpossible the nefarious actors
aspect of computer science, orthe bad side of it, if a bad
actor was using it?
Unknown (11:54):
Well, it's not a specific course on it, but it's
true that in all different
Nicolas Sabouret (11:59):
modules, so our teachers try to give
concrete examples to thestudents, and in which of
course, they speak of allaspects of cyber security. But
we do not have specific courseswith such content. Do you have
such such content here in GNSI?
Tad Schnaufer (12:16):
So GNSI ourselves, we don't host
courses, but through ourpartnership with the cyber
Florida, as well as the Schoolof Information here at USF, we
do have some courses on that.
Our criminology departmentactually has some cybersecurity
courses that look at thecriminal aspect of online
security, so making sure youhave strong passwords, those
type of things, but also whatthey can do to hack whether if
(12:37):
it's a banking website or agovernment website, and then our
College of Engineering and ournew college, the Bellini College
of AI, will also have someaspects of the computer science
security piece. So we actually,yeah, so we have a very
expansive technical piece,
Nicolas Sabouret (12:53):
yeah, that is very interesting, and that's the
sort of thing I would love todevelop here at basically
interdisciplinary approach tosecurity, yeah. So we have it
across the disciplines here. Andagain, it's a and it's great to
also have it have that otherinternational perspective as
well. That's the great thingabout the this partnership.
Tad Schnaufer (13:12):
In addition, as we start looking at our event in
a couple weeks, what are some ofthe big things you think will
take away from that? So when wetalk in two weeks or so, from my
side, what I really expect totake away from from this meeting
is new look, new approaches tosecurity that is less technical.
(13:32):
I mean, technique centered
Unknown (13:56):
different researchers in different disciplines that
are not taught in our mastershere, so that's what I hope my
colleagues in security here willbe able to take away from this
meeting.
Tad Schnaufer (14:10):
That's also what I hope our students will see,
that they will be able todiscover that beyond what they
were taught in their courses,there is an approach to security
that is wider than just acomputer science approach that
they know of because we seewithin security, computer
science is becoming almostomnipresent. It's everywhere. So
(14:33):
whether you're talking aboutenergy, energy infrastructure,
trade, I mean, there's obviouslycomputers involved in all of
that, but if you're able tosomehow attack a computer
system, you can really shut downa lot of a nation's operations,
whether if it's infrastructureor trade.
Nicolas Sabouret (14:48):
Yes, I agree, and that's why I hope the people
on your side will maybetake awayfrom the discussions that there
is an expertise also here inEurope, in.
Tad Schnaufer (14:59):
In cyber security, with with the, as you
say, the broad approach to cybersecurity, which means that any
computer system needs to beprotected and in some way that
maybe might, might be useful interms of exchange of practices
between the two countries, whichI'm sure are different
approaches to cyber security,absolutely, we're definitely
(15:21):
looking to see about thatdifferent approaches. And again,
Mary marrying up our technicalexperts here at the University
of South Florida, as well as the
Unknown (15:53):
If you could, Nicholas, would you highlight a couple of
the speakers that we have comingin from Paris to clay in a
couple weeks? Just any the fewthat you'd like to highlight, we
have, obviously, a number ofgreat speakers, but I don't know
if there's one or two you'd liketo highlight.
Nicolas Sabouret (16:06):
From Paris a clay I would like to highlight
at least one speaker who is
Unknown (17:30):
to propose dependability methods that can
be used for security and cybersecurity in the police systems.
So I think that's veryinteresting in terms of
experience for for the approachwe have on global and national
security here.
Oh,
Tad Schnaufer (17:47):
Oh, that's going to be an excellent contribution
to the discussion, undoubtedly.
So let's just talk briefly abouteach of the panels, what they're
going to what the topics, ingeneral, they're going to talk
about, letting our audience knowso they can, you know, again,
get a little bit of a insight onwhat we can expect in a couple
weeks. So panel one is going totalk about formal models, formal
computer security models. Sowhat's that going to discussion
going to look like?
(18:10):
Well,
Nicolas Sabouret (18:10):
Well, when you design a computer system,
(18:43):
conditional expressions thatneed to be checked. And then we
use automatic methods to provethat the system will reach a
stable state and will not failin face of such an attack. So
for that, we use formal method,and that's that's why the first
panel is about formal methodsfor security.
Tad Schnaufer (19:02):
Well, that sounds awesome, and it kind of builds
out to the next panel, which ison network security, because you
talk about the formal methodswithin the computer system, but
then you also have the networksthat connects all these
different systems, right? Sowhat's that
Unknown (19:12):
second panel looking at?
Nicolas Sabouret (19:14):
Yes, the second panel is about network
security. So it is a well knownfact that the security and one
of the main security failure insystems is not the system
itself, but the communicationbetween the different systems
that is an entry point for forhikers or para and so it is very
(19:37):
important that the networksystem also is secure, that the
communication remains privateand cannot be altered and cannot
be entered through, can be usedas an entry point to the system.
So all these questions of makingthe system communicate properly
and still being secured andsound and safe.
Tad Schnaufer (20:00):
That's part of the network security that is one
of our theme for theconference. Does this include a
zero trust architecture?
Nicolas Sabouret (20:12):
I'm not sure it's going to be discussed at
the panel, but it could include,yes, those situations, yeah,
okay, because we see a lot ofthat in the security sphere
about being able to build outthat type of network or
architecture. And then lastly,oh, go ahead. Oh, sorry, sorry,
it is very important thatnetwork security becomes
accessible to people who have noexperience in computer
(20:35):
programming itself. So that'swhy this. Such approaches are
very important.
Tad Schnaufer (20:40):
Now, yes, absolutely, I'm sure. I'm sure
it will come up in some in someaspects. And then lastly, our
third panel, as you had alreadymentioned, is going to touch on.
Okay, so we have these greattechnical discussions. So how do
you actually implement those andactually have policy, have that
policy implemented. So what canwe look at for that third panel?
Unknown (20:57):
Well, I think what we should expect from the sub panel
is interesting experience frompeople who went from the
technical aspects to the policymakers and tried to have the
theoretical computer sciencemodels be actually implemented
in practices, in systems and inreal situations, and Then you
(21:19):
face a difficulty that is oftenunexpected by researchers and
engineers in engineeringsciences, which is that you can
see you designed a very, veryprecise model that should work
in all situations, and then theusers arrive, and then it
doesn't work as it was supposedto so that's the confrontation
(21:42):
betweenall things that we teach in our
courses and all the practicaltools that people design, and
how it comes to reality when youtry to have it work in real
situations. And that's going tobe a very good experience, I
think, to to hear off, sure. Andalso this technology is
expanding and developing sorapidly, it's almost hard to
(22:03):
keep pace. You develop aprogram, you implement it. By
the time you implement it,there's already a new level of
coding or technology that'salready come out.
Tad Schnaufer (22:12):
So how do you get ahead of it?
Nicolas Sabouret (22:14):
I think you don't. I think you keep running
after the brain, which is goingfaster and faster.
(22:50):
and people are running afterthat. And the next step, I don't
know which one it will be, butit's sure there will be a next
step in a few, in a couple ofyears.
Tad Schnaufer (22:58):
Well, undoubtedly, computer science is
certainly not a boring subject.
There's constant evolutions. Idon't know if you have any other
comments you'd like to mentionbefore we sign off here today.
Nicolas Sabouret (23:07):
No, I'm very happy that you invited me, and
I'm very happy that you helpedus organize this great event,
and I invite everybody toparticipate and listen to the
very interesting discussionsthat will be
Unknown (23:19):
on June the 23rd if I'm correct, that's correct, yeah.
Tad Schnaufer (23:22):
So we're looking forward to having everyone tune
into that conference, ourVirtual Conference, the Trans
Atlantic forum on cybersecurity.
So looking forward to it. Thankyou so much. Nicholas.
Glenn Beckmann (23:42):
You What a great discussion today between Dr
Nicholas sabaray, the directorof the Graduate School of
Computer Science at theUniversity of Paris at clay, and
Dr Tad schnaufer, strategy andresearch manager here at GNSI,
we're working with Dr sabaresteam, along with our colleagues
at cyber Florida, to present theTrans Atlantic forum on
(24:02):
cybersecurity on June 23registration is open for the
live stream event, so check itout on next week's episode of at
the boundary, our guest will beDr Mark Luther, an associate
professor of physicaloceanography here at the USF
College of Marine Science, wherehe's The director of the ocean
monitoring and prediction lab.
He's also heavily involvedaround the world in research
(24:24):
involving deep sea mining anddeep sea critical minerals and
resources, and that's what we'llbe talking with him about next
week. Thanks for listeningtoday. If you like the podcast,
please subscribe and let yourfriends and colleagues know
about it. If you're listeningand watching this on our YouTube
channel, and we know some of youare, we invite you to try us out
(24:45):
on your favorite podcastplatform. We're on Apple
podcast, Spotify, overcast, allthe major players. That way you
can take at the boundary withyou all the time. Also be sure
to check us out on our social.
Officials. We're currently onLinkedIn, X and YouTube. We'd
appreciate a like, follow orsubscribe while you're there.
(25:11):
That's going to wrap up thisepisode of at the boundary. Each
new episode will feature globaland national security issues we
found to be worthy of attentionand discussion. I'm Glenn
Beckman, thanks for listeningtoday. We'll see you next week
at the boundary. You.
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