July 15, 2025 • 35 mins
John Sacco reveals how recycled metals are the unsung heroes fueling everything from hospitals to highways, and yes—even your car.
John Sacco, owner of Sierra Machinery International, joins Paul J Daly, Kyle Mountsier, and Michael Cirillo to unpack the surprisingly central role of recycled metals in modern life. With his signature food-and-wine finesse, John dives into the art of recycling—from molten aluminum forklifts on Toyota’s factory floors to copper’s critical role in electrification—while keeping it casually riveting.
They take us behind the scenes of Repurposed Season 3, where John partners with Toyota to spotlight green manufacturing at its finest. His passion—to change the face of an industry often dismissed as “garbage”—shines when he reminds us: you can’t build a single American-made vehicle today without recycled aluminum. Expect insights on Kaizen manufacturing, international standardization, EV battery waste, and why nobody’s asking the right questions—until now.
0:00 – Why recycled metals matter more than you think
0:45 – How fine dining and recycling connect
2:18 – How to land a Toyota docuseries deal
4:05 – How Toyota makes aluminum manufacturing green
7:30 – Why Toyota standardizes cylinder heads worldwide
14:21 – Why recycled metals may be greener than EVs
16:15 – Why EVs aren’t as recyclable as you think
17:45 – How Toyota stays green without going full EV
19:34 – Why rare earths are a big problem for EVs
20:25 – How EV batteries are creating a recycling bottleneck
22:00 – Why copper demand is exploding with EV growth
23:30 – How electrification affects everything—from lawnmowers to golf courses
Connect with John Sacco at https://www.linkedin.com/in/john-sacco-8a8a1b10/
Learn more about Re:purposed at https://therepurposedseries.com/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Paul J Daly (00:00):
I have never seen a man understand what to order at
(00:03):
a restaurant, whether that wasthe meat selection or the wine
selection. More than today'sguest, John Socko.
Unknown (00:14):
This is Auto Collabs, yeah, really, the man
Paul J Daly (00:17):
knows his food. He knows his wine. When we were,
when we had he was on stage, onthe main stage at a soda con two
years ago, and we go to thesteakhouse, and he orders the
lamb chop, and he's talkingabout the wine eye. And he's
just like, way over my head. Andthen not too long, he was like,
way over like the Somme Lizahad. And I was like, This guy
(00:38):
knows we because he he's inmetal recycling. So his clients,
he makes these big, gigantic,million dollar machines that
help the metal recycles. Cyclersdo all the separation and all
that. So he's traveling aroundthe world a lot, so he's, like,
incredibly knowledgeable inculture. And then he says, Oh,
he's like, he tells me about thelamp. He's like, Yeah, I've
gotten that the last two nights.
So I can, I don't think I couldget it a third time. And I
realized this is his third timeat this restaurant during ASOTU
(01:01):
CON. Do
Michael Cirillo (01:04):
you think maybe that's why he knew so much about
it?
Paul J Daly (01:07):
No, no, no. He's a cultured man. He's a culture
he's a culture man. You know
Michael Cirillo (01:12):
what I liked about this guy, and I think
we're gonna see it today, is thelevel of passion around
something that nobody knowsanything about, like, doesn't
consider, doesn't think about, Iwant to say I interviewed him at
ASOTU CON. I did, we did apodcast together, and I walked
away from it kind of feelingdumb, because I was like, Oh,
this guy knows how the Earth iscreated,
John Sacco (01:33):
and I
Michael Cirillo (01:35):
think you're going to see that level of
passion. So hey, why don't wehop into this episode with our
pal, John Sacco.
Paul J Daly (01:46):
John, since the last time we've talked, you've
been a little bit busy. You'verecorded a whole new season of
the Docu series, repurposed thistime working with Toyota like an
OEM, which obviously, you know,we were friends before, but now
it kind of really piqued ourinterest, because when you were
at ASOTU CON, a soda con acouple years ago, you said,
yeah, people don't realize thattheir car is the most recycled
(02:07):
thing that they have. And Idon't think that's correct. I
don't think people think of itthat way. And so you're like,
watch, watch me show you. I'mgonna do something with Toyota.
John Sacco (02:18):
Well, okay, you know, first of all, gents, great
to be here again with you. Haveyou guys watched the movie
Shawshank Redemption
Kyle Mountsier (02:30):
about every time it's on any TV channel. I'm
like, let's
Paul J Daly (02:33):
make seven hours long with commercials period.
Yes. So I,
John Sacco (02:37):
I'm, uh, I'd say my top three My son just watched
it. He doesn't understand why.
But anyway, do you remember thescene where Red is up against
the parole hearing for the thirdtime, and he finally says, The
guy goes, go ahead and stamp myform, sonny. As you just wasting
my time, yep. And you'rethinking, why would you do that?
(02:58):
You're not going to get paroled.
So I got, I was I shot at Toyotato show the there's a subsidiary
of the Toyota Motor Company. AndI they go, Well, let's try again
to get you into Toyota, becausewithout filming inside a a
Toyota plant making somethingfrom recycled aluminum, there's
(03:21):
no show. Okay? So I got on thephone with him, and I finally
just said, Hey guys, you turnedme down one, so you probably
turned me down again. But who'sthe coward who, who doesn't want
to tell the green manufacturingI'm befuddled by this. I go,
it's not going to cost you anymoney. And if Madison Avenue
(03:43):
came to you and said, we'regoing to do this four part Docu
series on Toyota and making, uh,motors from recycled aluminum,
they'd have charged you $50million and you would have said,
Where do I sign? So tell me
Paul J Daly (03:59):
what pitch. It's
John Sacco (04:00):
a great pitch. Five days later, we're in,
Paul J Daly (04:05):
and they were like, Yeah, but they promised us Brad
Pitt, and we ended up with you.
Michael Cirillo (04:11):
That's gold.
That's where you went. MyItalian DNA was like, I want
names. Who's the coward?
Paul J Daly (04:19):
Can you spell that?
John Sacco (04:22):
Yeah, no, but it was really good. So they they
agreed. And what was reallyfascinating about that now is I
finally got to tell tie in thestory of how recycled aluminum
from a facility like ours inBakersfield, gets to the
smelter, and then gets to theplant right next door, and you
(04:47):
know, it's 150 yards apart, andyou see these crucibles of
molten I call them big yetis ofMolten Aluminum being driven by
a forklift over this road. Yeah,and they pour, they got 60 die
casters in this plant in Troy,Missouri. They make 10,000
cylinder heads a day. And youknow, it's not as exciting as a
(05:11):
steel mill from the big flamesthat you see when
Paul J Daly (05:15):
they're starting.
Yeah,
John Sacco (05:17):
this is pretty mundane and boring, but what's
really super cool is how Toyota,and when I say they're a green
manufacturer, think about thereduction in CO two emissions
just for the transit logisticsof receiving their raw material
to make cylinder heads comesover an electric formula,
Paul J Daly (05:44):
huh? Well, talk talk about what that would
usually entail if they weren'tall in one spot.
John Sacco (05:49):
Well, if you weren't, so for for any
logistical thing, so anymanufacturer plant receiving
whatever you have to bring inthe raw material, and when you
bring in the raw material. Beatus. Take a steel mill. Let's,
let's compare a steel millversus Toyota. A steel mill.
There's a lot of trucks that go150 180 miles, 60 miles, and
(06:12):
they're coming in rail cars. Soyou got these big, massive car,
even though rail cars reduce COtwo emissions because you got
five trucks and one rail car,but you got all this
transportation up and down ahighway. It's got a trucks got
to go dump, go back, empty, fillup, go back. So you got all this
diesel back and forth, rail carsback and forth. And right. So
(06:37):
Toyota and Troy, Missouri, withtheir partnership with their
subsidiary Toyota, Toyota twoshow 150 yards apart, so your
forklift just
Kyle Mountsier (06:50):
all day has to go between, yeah, and
John Sacco (06:55):
think about this reduction,
Kyle Mountsier (06:56):
just one part, right? Because, because it's not
just the one part. It's not justthe cylinder head. This is, like
a ton of the inner portions thebody of what makes up a
John Sacco (07:08):
toy. Oh, this is actually, this plant is just
cylinder heads. Okay, wow, here.
So in the Toyota world, they'revery proud of this every Toyota
cylinder head manufactured inthe world, from Bangkok,
Thailand to Troy, Missouri,every plant across Europe and
Japan. Doesn't matter SouthAmerica, every cylinder head is
(07:32):
identical to the model of thecar. It the tundra, the Tacoma,
the Camry, the Corolla,everyone, every motor. Cylinder
heads the same. They don't havea motor that's different in
South America, into Asia, intoEurope, into North America.
(07:55):
They're identical. So they canscale so they know, yeah, it's
interesting. It's
Paul J Daly (08:03):
interesting that you bring that up because Kyle
and I were just at this kind of,like, very closed door
consortium about China and thefuture of manufacturing and the
future power trains. And one ofthe things that one of the
analysts that came up and did apresentation was talking about
the the increasedstandardization across all OEMs
(08:24):
of certain things that make themable to manufacture so quickly
and so cheaply, you know, rightdown to like windshield wiper
blades. There's no OEM spec fora windshield wiper blade. You
want to put a windshield wiperblade on that car. Here it is.
It's made in the windshieldwiper blade factory. It fits on
the windshield wiper bladeholder. And just, it's
interesting to hear how Toyotais already deploying this in
(08:46):
something like cylinder headsacross all I would have never
thought that would be the case
John Sacco (08:52):
in no and I was shocked to hear that, because in
the end, I'm like, that is juststandardization in their
manufacturing price. So let'ssay they have increase in the
main okay, because that this iscylinders and Troy cylinder
heads in Troy, Jackson,Tennessee, is motor blocks. You
(09:18):
know, transmission housings aremade elsewhere. So you know,
they have, you know, all thesedifferent components are made
from recycled aluminum and notvirgin aluminum. I can get in
that to minute, but I'm gonnastay on the standardization. So
the unique thing is, is anywherein their manufacturing world,
let's say they have a disruptionfor natural from a hurricane or
(09:40):
a flood, or whatever, okay, youknow disruptions happen, they
can now bring the same cylinderheads, load containers of
cylinder heads from Bangkok,ship them into the US, or vice
versa, or wherever the hell theyneed to go. In other words,
their diversity of being able tosay. Well, I need to increase
(10:01):
the cylinder heads in this partof the world. They're able to do
that by saying, Okay, I needmore cylinder heads from this
place over here, and they don'thave to worry about
Michael Cirillo (10:15):
do you think that level of standardization
and efficiency tracks all theway through to the end, purchase
price of the vehicle. Meaning,here's where I'm going with
this. So I drive a Tundra. I'vehad pretty much every major
truck brand now. I've had aSierra, I've had a Silverado,
I've had an f1 50, I've had aTundra and and maybe it was
Paul J Daly (10:39):
the deal. I didn't know that about you, Michael,
you didn't know that about me. Ididn't know you've had every
truck known to man, I thoughtthis was just something you did
when you moved to Texas.
Michael Cirillo (10:47):
No, no, I started trying. You know,
Alberta, which is extremelynorthern Texas. But you know
what stood out to me is like,okay, let's say 70 grand for a
Tundra compared to one of theother makes. What impressed me
is like, my last truck was wasone of because I don't want to
(11:10):
alienate people, but it was oneof the other ones. And I'm like,
wait a minute for 70 grand in aTundra. It comes with the safety
monitoring. It comes with thisbig, beautiful screen. It comes
with the bed spray and bedliner. Already, it comes with
the footsteps already. It comeswith all these things that for
the same price. And the otherbrand, I didn't get any of those
(11:31):
things, and it came with abrand. And I wonder, does this
standardization of manufacturingtrickle down to the consumer
experience, where you just getmore value for money.
John Sacco (11:43):
Absolutely, it does.
And the thing about that is, isthe standardization in, in, in
all of that allows for, like Isaid, think of again. Think
about it. They don't have toread they're not reinventing the
wheel. They're not making amodel that has this and has this
and has this, is it, this is it.
(12:05):
And they're able to tomanufacture, on the high level,
the, you know, the all thedifferent components they need
for that particular model. Andthat's why, you know what
happens is, is, you know, wemanufacture balers, and just to
give you every pump on ourbalers, from the rev one, rep
(12:29):
two, rep two, 250 rev four, reveight, I can interchange any
pump on any machine. Somemachines have more pumps, but
doesn't matter. I did and andwhere do you learn that from? Is
really the Japanese in theToyota world is called Kaizen,
continuous improvement. How dothey continuously improve? And
(12:51):
if they're and here's the keyKaizen, I thought were big
improvements, they're littleimprovements. What can we do a
little better here? What can wedo better here? What can we do
better? You know, if you try tobe better every day, they were
telling me, Well, that's aKaizen, because not every day
you can make a major change, butif you can be just a little
better every day, that's kaizen.
And so they have taken thismodel, and you know, you know
(13:11):
the Toyota manufacturing world,they're renowned for their
consulting as well, where theywould come into planning. People
want to manufacture at a moreefficient level. They're
renowned for it because theyunderstand this. And now I don't
not a total expert on theToyota, Toyota total way of
(13:34):
thinking, but Michael, to yourpoint of standardization and
reducing the cost to theconsumer. That's why the value
if you look at what, you know, Iwas looking online, what does a
Corolla go for? What is aCameron like? I was shocked at
how economical the price tag wascompared to other brands for the
similar, yeah, you know, make,model of a vehicle. So
(13:59):
obviously, there's something toit. Because how can they produce
a vehicle? Because they have toproduce it here in America. A
lot of them made right here inAmerica. Well, how are they
producing something here inAmerica? Everybody says most
expensive place in the world tomanufacture, but yet, they can
offer something at a morecompetitive price than the GMs
and the Fords and the others.
Kyle Mountsier (14:21):
Yeah. So Michael, I want to go back to
because you you've said likethey're a green manufacturer. I
want to go back to that. Becauseright now, the geopolitical, the
political, the cultural climateis a lot around electric right?
New power train, new new way ofthinking. You know, production
(14:42):
styles, even materials beingused in the in these vehicles,
can you juxtapose for us, just alittle bit on, like when you say
a manufacturer that is, youknow, that is primarily making
gas and hybrid engines, lots ofhybrid power. Trains is you
would consider green based onthe entire vehicle process, in
(15:07):
comparison, even potentially tosome of the newer manufacturing
and power train processes.
John Sacco (15:15):
Well, okay, that's a great question. Yeah, so green.
You know, what is green? Green?
You know that? That's a hell ofa word, and a lot of green
washing goes on out there. Greenwashing is bull crap, saying
we're green when you're not. ButToyota, let's, let's look at the
there any piece of aluminum fromtheir wheels, transmission,
(15:38):
housing differentials. You know,if you get up underneath Michael
to your tundra, and you see thetundra in the drive the train,
the shaft, it's all aluminum.
Now that is 800 pounds lighterbecause of the use of aluminum.
(15:59):
Now the aluminum they use isrecycled aluminum, because it
comes with it. It's easier toalloy up to make the alloy they
need more durable. Virginaluminum is far greater and
expense, and you the additivesthat you would have to come up
with with from Virgin aluminumand the mining of it, there's no
(16:20):
way, you know, recycle aluminumsaves 95% CO two emissions, and
then remelting and 95% of energyconsumption versus virgin, okay,
so right there, and then justthe use is dramatically greener,
all right. So then you got, likebrakes. Brakes in America are
(16:42):
made from 100% recycled iron. Alot of the copper in the car is
coming from has a huge amount ofcopper, recycled copper content
in it. Now the outer shell oflot of the cars are going to be
from EA not EAS, but fromintegrated steel mills that use
iron ore. Let's, let's be honestabout that. But in our in the
(17:05):
steel making of integrated steelmills that make the the steel
for the outer, you know, thedoors, the hoods, and so there's
about 10 to 15% of recycledsteel in that so with putting
all together in some of theplastics that they're using,
they're coming from recycledplastics, the in the the in the
(17:28):
plant Troy, Missouri, this thesilicon they're using for the
molds. So you know that do theport, the they have to put these
things in there. And what itdoes is that sand is made from
100% it's reused over and overand over and over again. So even
when they have a bad motor blockor bad cylinder head that gets
recycled, goes right back to thesmelter, remelted and brought
(17:51):
back because, you know, throughthe inspection process. So when
you start seeing just the sheeramount of the circularity of
components that they're usingthat when they have scrap out of
their plant. It goes back to thealuminum smelter, or the steel
making plant for fenders andhoods. It goes back to the steel
(18:11):
mills to make new products sothey're using it's real. It's a
closed loop recycling theirwaste metal. It's not waste. I
would never call it waste.
They're residual. But they'rethey're residual, their
byproduct from manufacturing.
Call it from stampings orwhatever, go right back into
(18:33):
making the new coils, the newsteel, the new aluminum, all
that, all that stuff. So, youknow, versus the electric
vehicle that has so many rareearth minerals in it that has
the Cobalts and stuff, so youare dealing with more virgin
metals in an electric vehiclethan you are, if you will. That
Paul J Daly (18:53):
makes sense. Always new, yeah, I like that. You just
brought up the rare earthsbecause that's been a super hot
topic of conversation inautomotive China controlling his
thing, it's 90% of the magnets,or the availability to
manufacture, refine thematerials for magnets. And so we
were talking the other day, andwe did a quick search, and I was
(19:13):
like, Can you recycle magnets?
And do you have a thought orperspective on all these rare
earths, these magnets that are,you know, holding, kind of the
EV industry people, some peoplethink hostage, because now China
has secured so much of the rawmaterials. Is there going to be
a shift and a hyper focus onrecycling these and those being
available and kind of breakingdown some of that, there
John Sacco (19:34):
will be monopoly.
There will be, yeah, there'sgoing to be
Paul J Daly (19:40):
and the real question is, is John Socko about
to become the most important manin the EV conversation?
John Sacco (19:46):
No, not at Okay, and here's why I'm not, because in
the end, rare earths and all thestuff used to be making, uh,
EVs, um. Now, you know thelithium batteries, the lithium
that they use there. So what,what you have is, is, right now,
(20:07):
the EVs are not designed to berecycled yet. Ah, okay, because
the lithium battery, the thelithium batteries just in the
auto industry alone inappliances, the lithium battery
is problematic of extractinglike in a cell phone, if you
will. So EVs, you know, you havea car, it's got these big EV
(20:33):
batteries. What do you do withit? You know, you the
automobiles die. A internalcombustion engine dies by an
auto shredder. But what happenswith the lithium battery and in
those materials? And right now,the recycling of all these other
materials that are in EVs hasn'tquite caught up. There's some
(20:55):
people starting to do it, but itisn't as easy as it is a, you
know, just a regular gasolineengine, if you will, easy to
recycle, easy to process. Youknow, in when it goes to EVs,
the one thing about EVs, youknow, they're using, like Tesla,
they use a lot of recycledaluminum in their frames. So
that's the good news there. Thelightweight, the light weighting
(21:16):
in any auto manufacturer in theUnited States, is where we're
saving CO two emissions on thempg. More miles per gallon means
less CO two emissions. So that'sgood, but the electric vehicles
see now. The other issue withthe electric vehicles is the
recharging grid. The theinfrastructure to recharging
(21:38):
vehicles requires, if we went toall that reveal, we just
wouldn't have enough copper, asit is now to empower.
Paul J Daly (21:48):
You know about that? I mean, the cop, well,
they don't understand.
John Sacco (21:53):
Well, you know, copper, it's a worldwide trade
in metal. They are. They havelarge inventories of copper,
recycled copper. So that's why,you know, if you look at Copper,
it's trading over $5 a pound onthe COMEX, the shock Chicago
American, the look, copper isgoing to be in high demand as so
(22:15):
much electronic things, youknow, electronic, electric,
workless electric Austin
Kyle Mountsier (22:21):
copper is what you're trying to tell me
John Sacco (22:24):
somehow. Well, I've got to believe it's going to be
it's a commodity that's going tobe in high demand. Because if
you think about it, think aboutall the products, lawn mowers at
golf courses. Okay, take PebbleBeach, right, iconic, right.
Well, eventually that'll berobotic. EV, it'll be electric
lawn mower that'll be aI guidedto. So think about that. But
(22:50):
they're gonna have to chargethat now. They need more power
every golf course will get. I'mjust, I'm just using this as an
example, street sweepers. Well,as we see the cabs, the
driverless cabs. Well, now allthe Street Sweepers across
America could be electric AIdriven Street Sweepers. Well,
(23:14):
now they got to return home tobe charged up every day. So when
you when you have anythingthat's got to be charged up, you
need more you need more copper.
It just in destroy. Now, you lotof people use aluminum cables.
Now, there's copper cable.
There's aluminum cable also. So,so as we go to more electric,
electric, you know, your ATVswill go more electric. Think
(23:39):
about boats. I mean, there'll beelectric motors eventually. You
know, I got a boat that has a300 horsepower Mercury, two 300
horsepower Mercury's, well, oneday, somebody's gonna figure out
how to make those out ofelectric so think about all the
electrification going on. Andwhen you electrify, you need
(24:01):
one. Yeah, that's copper. So, soI'm
Michael Cirillo (24:07):
buying bricks of copper right now.
Paul J Daly (24:09):
Buying it just right now,
Kyle Mountsier (24:11):
copper bricks.
Michael froze, someone's goingto need these guys. That's wild.
Paul J Daly (24:16):
Oh, well, we have one more. We have one more
thing. We want to play. What didyou say?
John Sacco (24:24):
You all froze for a second. All three of you went,
Paul J Daly (24:28):
Oh, got it? We want to play. We want to play one
more thing for you. I think wehave a little delay. Sorry,
we'll figure it out. We want toplay one thing for you and ask
you a couple more questionsabout it. Nathan, roll roll. It
Unknown (24:44):
without the recycled metals industry. No rebar to
build the hospital's Foundation,no surgical tools. Can't even
build this Gurney without nobodyelse.
Paul J Daly (24:58):
That's amazing. All right, so the. Is obviously a
commercial to commemorate thepromote the launch of repurpose
season three. Kind of, we kindof related to that one because
we see it. And sometimes, like,we'll walk in and, you know,
we'll just be talking to, likethe hostess at the restaurant.
How about how great the carindustry is, how important it is
to the local economy, howimportant it is to leadership
development and community. And,you know, like, they smile and
(25:20):
they nod. But really, nobodyasked, Why are you so driven to
produce this Docu series into anindustry that you know, the the
pregnant lady on the gurneysaid, Nobody asks, right while
her husband's trying to tell hernone of that would be possible.
Why are you doing this?
John Sacco (25:34):
Because it's comes down to the bottom line, our
industry has a terrible image.
We're looked at as dirty, dirtywaste, trash, garbage, junk. All
of those are absolutely not whatwe do. And if we don't change
the image, if we don't changehow we talk about what we do,
(25:54):
and like the blue states acrossAmerica, don't like our
industry, okay? They think we'rebad, yet they don't understand
without us, they don't livetheir lives. Health care gets
all of that, and that's why Iwas saying nobody asked. Nobody
asked, because I can tell youand I when season one came out,
Democratic Majority Leader inthe Senate was Mr. Schumer. The
(26:17):
Speaker of the House was KevinMcCarthy, Republican, Democrat.
They watched a couple episodes,and they said the same thing,
wow. I had no idea what yourindustry does. Wow, because we
don't ever teach our kids this.
So when, when I say, Nobodyasked, well, nobody asked, well,
(26:38):
how's our car made? Whatmaterials? Where does it come
from? How about that highwaythat has been constructed that
slows traffic down? But where'sthat steel come here? Because
nobody asked, because nobodyasked. In World War Two, our
industry, we were slaughteredfor our efforts, because our
(27:01):
cans are your our bullets. Wewere fighting tyranny with the
stuff we recycled. World WarTwo, there was posters, recycle.
You know your your metal is ourcannons, your metals are ships.
Yeah, right, because we arefighting tyranny. We went from
the heroes to persona no gratain a couple decades,
Kyle Mountsier (27:22):
wow, yeah, and it's like, but we still produce,
yeah,
Paul J Daly (27:28):
yeah, but you're just as important. Say again,
but you're just as importantstill, but you're just as
important. I
John Sacco (27:36):
would argue we're the most vital industry in
America, because without us,there is no health care, there
is no farming, there is no autoindustry in receipt. In re
season three, they flat out tellyou you cannot make one
automobile today in Americawithout recycled aluminum. And
that's all manufacturers. Wow.
Kyle Mountsier (27:56):
Sounds so familiar. I feel it
John Sacco (28:02):
not one. So why am I running with this? Because
nobody's asking the question. Igot a fun one with a guy on an
airplane. I got it starting tocome out now,
Paul J Daly (28:13):
with a guy on an airplane.
John Sacco (28:16):
No, there's a guy on a flight. Oh, he it's another
one like that, where the guystalking to this lady, you know,
without recycled metals, thealuminum for this aircraft
wouldn't be made, and for thewithout copper, there won't be
the electronics around thisaircraft. And for that matter,
no rebar for the runway we'regoing to land on, or to steal
for the jetways and theairports. She looks at him,
nobody asked.
Kyle Mountsier (28:40):
That's the problem. Nobody's asking. We
wouldn't be in a steel canflying across the world without
the without that industry.
That's wild. That's wild. Thinkabout this.
John Sacco (28:51):
Every kid who takes chemistry, this is important to
me. Every kid who takeschemistry in high school always
says the same doggone thing.
What do they say? When will Iever need this, right? Well, if
you get a job in the aluminumsmelting industry, the steel
industry, the copper industry,you got to know your periodic
tables, because you got to seewhen you're doing the metallurgy
(29:12):
in a steel mill and aluminumfoundry and copyright, you're
saying, Okay, well, I got Xamount, 00, 0.1% Molly in this
okay, that's acceptable. So nowyou got to know, so if, if our
educators would teach our kids,hey, let's build a bridge. We
need steel. Let's go to steel,and let's look at the periodic
table. Here's all the elementsthat go into making steel. What
(29:34):
kids
Kyle Mountsier (29:36):
goes how we actually use that? Yeah, yep,
your
John Sacco (29:40):
car that you drove to school and seeing. That's
what my point is. Nobody asked.
You think a kid gives a flyingrats ass that the hospital they
were born in? It starts withrecycled steel with rebar. Did
they? Did they even Okay? Nobodyasked. Nobody tells Yeah. So
that's why I'm doing it.
Kyle Mountsier (29:59):
Well. It's,
John Sacco (30:02):
I get, you know, you guys hit a button.
Kyle Mountsier (30:06):
Hey, I love it.
I love the passion, like cameright through at the end and and
the fact that you're doing thewhole series, you're you, you
know that funding it changes,changes in industry, but also
the way that you're going aboutit is amazing. I'm glad we got
to chat, talk through the autoindustry, talk through steel. We
went. We went a milliondifferent directions. John, it's
always a pleasure hanging outwith
John Sacco (30:29):
you. It's a pleasure to be with you guys. But you
know, let's, let's get, let's,let's settle on one message.
Without recycled aluminum, youcannot build one automobile in
America today, not GM, Ford,Toyota, you name it. You can't
build one without recycledaluminum.
Paul J Daly (30:47):
That's right, and that. Go learn all about it.
Repurposed season three,available now on Amazon Prime,
yeah,
John Sacco (30:55):
not yet, not yet, not quite yet. On Brian when
YouTube, it'll be probably acouple, three weeks trust. But
here, here's the boy. Here's thetagline, recycling aluminum,
driving the US auto industry.
Let's
Kyle Mountsier (31:11):
go. Let's go.
Let's go. Awesome. Thanks, John,
John Sacco (31:16):
gentlemen, it's a pleasure to be here with you.
You keep doing what you'redoing. I love what you guys do.
Keep playing those guitars andhave a little fun. All right,
will do?
Kyle Mountsier (31:30):
All right. Look, if you weren't watching that
podcast, take your stuff thetime. Go near the end, about
five minutes to the end, weplayed a video. It says nobody
asked. You have to watch itbecause it's one of these
things, is clearly AI generated,right? I
Paul J Daly (31:47):
don't think it's clearly AI generated. You don't
think so. No, I think that if,for us, you didn't say that, I
think if you didn't say that, noone, well, no one
Kyle Mountsier (31:56):
would have known. Okay, so is AI generated.
But the level of thought behindputting together a campaign like
that. And I think that that thereason why we love talking to
John is because we there's somuch similarity in what Auto is,
the the connective tissue toeverything that happens in our
country, the level of GDPassociated with selling and
(32:20):
servicing a car like those twopieces and the spider web of it
going out, similar to the steelindustry, the recycled metals
industry, so intense and like tohear his passion cut ramp after
that was insane.
Michael Cirillo (32:33):
You know, you know what frightened me a little
bit. Actually, in his passion,he revealed, tell me if i I
heard this, I wrote this downthat he a knows, it seems quite
well legislators on CapitolHill, I think he does Yes, and
revealed that they have no clue.
Paul J Daly (32:56):
Listen of that, that that practice doesn't
surprise me at all. We weretalking to we were talking to
me. I said it frightened
Michael Cirillo (33:05):
me. Okay, that's fair making laws and
regulations who have not evenasked the most basic question
about the thing that they'relegislating.
Paul J Daly (33:13):
Well, I think that's that's one of the reasons
that nada works so hard to be onthe hill, and why it's so
important that auto dealers getinvolved with the legislators.
Because oftentimes you have alegislator who is, you know,
when you have an industryspecific topic like automotive,
instance, there is, there is anaide who is advising the
legislator on the topics, on theissues. And that aid,
(33:38):
oftentimes, in Washington, DC,is like, Oh yeah, I've never
actually bought a car. Thatactually happened to us, and we
were talking to somebody like,yeah? Like, being honest, I've
never bought it. Never bought acar. Yeah, you're advising
policy. It's like, who's yourfavorites? Like, I
Michael Cirillo (33:55):
don't know. I like carva. They were like,
there aren't any, there aren'teven any EV chargers at the
Paul J Daly (34:01):
Capitol. It's like the same people that say we
should outlaw 18 wheelers. Weshould outlaw these things. It's
like, well, you realize that ifwe did, that's how you get your
groceries, we would have any ofthe stuff that you have right
now,
Kyle Mountsier (34:15):
it's amazing.
Well, hey, we hope you enjoyedthat conversation. We certainly
did. You can hear the passionbehind John. Go check out
repurposed on YouTube right now.
You can find it on if you'relistening to this a couple of
weeks later, you can probablyfind it on Amazon Prime video,
where you can find it more thancars our Docu series as well.
Nice on behalf of Paul J DalyKyle, mouse here and Michael
(34:38):
Cirillo, I'm leaving him lastbecause he's amazing. Thanks for
joining us on Auto Collabs.
Unknown (34:43):
Sign up for our free and fun to read daily email for
a free shot of relevant news andautomotive retail media and pop
culture. You can get itnow@asotu.com that's asotu.com
if you love this podcast, pleaseleave us a review and. Share it
with a friend. Thanks again forlistening. We'll see you next
time.
(35:15):
Welcome to Annika labs. You.
I have never seen a man understand what to order at
(00:03):
a restaurant, whether that wasthe meat selection or the wine
selection. More than today'sguest, John Socko.
Unknown (00:14):
This is Auto Collabs, yeah, really, the man
Paul J Daly (00:17):
knows his food. He knows his wine. When we were,
when we had he was on stage, onthe main stage at a soda con two
years ago, and we go to thesteakhouse, and he orders the
lamb chop, and he's talkingabout the wine eye. And he's
just like, way over my head. Andthen not too long, he was like,
way over like the Somme Lizahad. And I was like, This guy
(00:38):
knows we because he he's inmetal recycling. So his clients,
he makes these big, gigantic,million dollar machines that
help the metal recycles. Cyclersdo all the separation and all
that. So he's traveling aroundthe world a lot, so he's, like,
incredibly knowledgeable inculture. And then he says, Oh,
he's like, he tells me about thelamp. He's like, Yeah, I've
gotten that the last two nights.
So I can, I don't think I couldget it a third time. And I
realized this is his third timeat this restaurant during ASOTU
(01:01):
CON. Do
Michael Cirillo (01:04):
you think maybe that's why he knew so much about
it?
Paul J Daly (01:07):
No, no, no. He's a cultured man. He's a culture
he's a culture man. You know
Michael Cirillo (01:12):
what I liked about this guy, and I think
we're gonna see it today, is thelevel of passion around
something that nobody knowsanything about, like, doesn't
consider, doesn't think about, Iwant to say I interviewed him at
ASOTU CON. I did, we did apodcast together, and I walked
away from it kind of feelingdumb, because I was like, Oh,
this guy knows how the Earth iscreated,
John Sacco (01:33):
and I
Michael Cirillo (01:35):
think you're going to see that level of
passion. So hey, why don't wehop into this episode with our
pal, John Sacco.
Paul J Daly (01:46):
John, since the last time we've talked, you've
been a little bit busy. You'verecorded a whole new season of
the Docu series, repurposed thistime working with Toyota like an
OEM, which obviously, you know,we were friends before, but now
it kind of really piqued ourinterest, because when you were
at ASOTU CON, a soda con acouple years ago, you said,
yeah, people don't realize thattheir car is the most recycled
(02:07):
thing that they have. And Idon't think that's correct. I
don't think people think of itthat way. And so you're like,
watch, watch me show you. I'mgonna do something with Toyota.
John Sacco (02:18):
Well, okay, you know, first of all, gents, great
to be here again with you. Haveyou guys watched the movie
Shawshank Redemption
Kyle Mountsier (02:30):
about every time it's on any TV channel. I'm
like, let's
Paul J Daly (02:33):
make seven hours long with commercials period.
Yes. So I,
John Sacco (02:37):
I'm, uh, I'd say my top three My son just watched
it. He doesn't understand why.
But anyway, do you remember thescene where Red is up against
the parole hearing for the thirdtime, and he finally says, The
guy goes, go ahead and stamp myform, sonny. As you just wasting
my time, yep. And you'rethinking, why would you do that?
(02:58):
You're not going to get paroled.
So I got, I was I shot at Toyotato show the there's a subsidiary
of the Toyota Motor Company. AndI they go, Well, let's try again
to get you into Toyota, becausewithout filming inside a a
Toyota plant making somethingfrom recycled aluminum, there's
(03:21):
no show. Okay? So I got on thephone with him, and I finally
just said, Hey guys, you turnedme down one, so you probably
turned me down again. But who'sthe coward who, who doesn't want
to tell the green manufacturingI'm befuddled by this. I go,
it's not going to cost you anymoney. And if Madison Avenue
(03:43):
came to you and said, we'regoing to do this four part Docu
series on Toyota and making, uh,motors from recycled aluminum,
they'd have charged you $50million and you would have said,
Where do I sign? So tell me
Paul J Daly (03:59):
what pitch. It's
John Sacco (04:00):
a great pitch. Five days later, we're in,
Paul J Daly (04:05):
and they were like, Yeah, but they promised us Brad
Pitt, and we ended up with you.
Michael Cirillo (04:11):
That's gold.
That's where you went. MyItalian DNA was like, I want
names. Who's the coward?
Paul J Daly (04:19):
Can you spell that?
John Sacco (04:22):
Yeah, no, but it was really good. So they they
agreed. And what was reallyfascinating about that now is I
finally got to tell tie in thestory of how recycled aluminum
from a facility like ours inBakersfield, gets to the
smelter, and then gets to theplant right next door, and you
(04:47):
know, it's 150 yards apart, andyou see these crucibles of
molten I call them big yetis ofMolten Aluminum being driven by
a forklift over this road. Yeah,and they pour, they got 60 die
casters in this plant in Troy,Missouri. They make 10,000
cylinder heads a day. And youknow, it's not as exciting as a
(05:11):
steel mill from the big flamesthat you see when
Paul J Daly (05:15):
they're starting.
Yeah,
John Sacco (05:17):
this is pretty mundane and boring, but what's
really super cool is how Toyota,and when I say they're a green
manufacturer, think about thereduction in CO two emissions
just for the transit logisticsof receiving their raw material
to make cylinder heads comesover an electric formula,
Paul J Daly (05:44):
huh? Well, talk talk about what that would
usually entail if they weren'tall in one spot.
John Sacco (05:49):
Well, if you weren't, so for for any
logistical thing, so anymanufacturer plant receiving
whatever you have to bring inthe raw material, and when you
bring in the raw material. Beatus. Take a steel mill. Let's,
let's compare a steel millversus Toyota. A steel mill.
There's a lot of trucks that go150 180 miles, 60 miles, and
(06:12):
they're coming in rail cars. Soyou got these big, massive car,
even though rail cars reduce COtwo emissions because you got
five trucks and one rail car,but you got all this
transportation up and down ahighway. It's got a trucks got
to go dump, go back, empty, fillup, go back. So you got all this
diesel back and forth, rail carsback and forth. And right. So
(06:37):
Toyota and Troy, Missouri, withtheir partnership with their
subsidiary Toyota, Toyota twoshow 150 yards apart, so your
forklift just
Kyle Mountsier (06:50):
all day has to go between, yeah, and
John Sacco (06:55):
think about this reduction,
Kyle Mountsier (06:56):
just one part, right? Because, because it's not
just the one part. It's not justthe cylinder head. This is, like
a ton of the inner portions thebody of what makes up a
John Sacco (07:08):
toy. Oh, this is actually, this plant is just
cylinder heads. Okay, wow, here.
So in the Toyota world, they'revery proud of this every Toyota
cylinder head manufactured inthe world, from Bangkok,
Thailand to Troy, Missouri,every plant across Europe and
Japan. Doesn't matter SouthAmerica, every cylinder head is
(07:32):
identical to the model of thecar. It the tundra, the Tacoma,
the Camry, the Corolla,everyone, every motor. Cylinder
heads the same. They don't havea motor that's different in
South America, into Asia, intoEurope, into North America.
(07:55):
They're identical. So they canscale so they know, yeah, it's
interesting. It's
Paul J Daly (08:03):
interesting that you bring that up because Kyle
and I were just at this kind of,like, very closed door
consortium about China and thefuture of manufacturing and the
future power trains. And one ofthe things that one of the
analysts that came up and did apresentation was talking about
the the increasedstandardization across all OEMs
(08:24):
of certain things that make themable to manufacture so quickly
and so cheaply, you know, rightdown to like windshield wiper
blades. There's no OEM spec fora windshield wiper blade. You
want to put a windshield wiperblade on that car. Here it is.
It's made in the windshieldwiper blade factory. It fits on
the windshield wiper bladeholder. And just, it's
interesting to hear how Toyotais already deploying this in
(08:46):
something like cylinder headsacross all I would have never
thought that would be the case
John Sacco (08:52):
in no and I was shocked to hear that, because in
the end, I'm like, that is juststandardization in their
manufacturing price. So let'ssay they have increase in the
main okay, because that this iscylinders and Troy cylinder
heads in Troy, Jackson,Tennessee, is motor blocks. You
(09:18):
know, transmission housings aremade elsewhere. So you know,
they have, you know, all thesedifferent components are made
from recycled aluminum and notvirgin aluminum. I can get in
that to minute, but I'm gonnastay on the standardization. So
the unique thing is, is anywherein their manufacturing world,
let's say they have a disruptionfor natural from a hurricane or
(09:40):
a flood, or whatever, okay, youknow disruptions happen, they
can now bring the same cylinderheads, load containers of
cylinder heads from Bangkok,ship them into the US, or vice
versa, or wherever the hell theyneed to go. In other words,
their diversity of being able tosay. Well, I need to increase
(10:01):
the cylinder heads in this partof the world. They're able to do
that by saying, Okay, I needmore cylinder heads from this
place over here, and they don'thave to worry about
Michael Cirillo (10:15):
do you think that level of standardization
and efficiency tracks all theway through to the end, purchase
price of the vehicle. Meaning,here's where I'm going with
this. So I drive a Tundra. I'vehad pretty much every major
truck brand now. I've had aSierra, I've had a Silverado,
I've had an f1 50, I've had aTundra and and maybe it was
Paul J Daly (10:39):
the deal. I didn't know that about you, Michael,
you didn't know that about me. Ididn't know you've had every
truck known to man, I thoughtthis was just something you did
when you moved to Texas.
Michael Cirillo (10:47):
No, no, I started trying. You know,
Alberta, which is extremelynorthern Texas. But you know
what stood out to me is like,okay, let's say 70 grand for a
Tundra compared to one of theother makes. What impressed me
is like, my last truck was wasone of because I don't want to
(11:10):
alienate people, but it was oneof the other ones. And I'm like,
wait a minute for 70 grand in aTundra. It comes with the safety
monitoring. It comes with thisbig, beautiful screen. It comes
with the bed spray and bedliner. Already, it comes with
the footsteps already. It comeswith all these things that for
the same price. And the otherbrand, I didn't get any of those
(11:31):
things, and it came with abrand. And I wonder, does this
standardization of manufacturingtrickle down to the consumer
experience, where you just getmore value for money.
John Sacco (11:43):
Absolutely, it does.
And the thing about that is, isthe standardization in, in, in
all of that allows for, like Isaid, think of again. Think
about it. They don't have toread they're not reinventing the
wheel. They're not making amodel that has this and has this
and has this, is it, this is it.
(12:05):
And they're able to tomanufacture, on the high level,
the, you know, the all thedifferent components they need
for that particular model. Andthat's why, you know what
happens is, is, you know, wemanufacture balers, and just to
give you every pump on ourbalers, from the rev one, rep
(12:29):
two, rep two, 250 rev four, reveight, I can interchange any
pump on any machine. Somemachines have more pumps, but
doesn't matter. I did and andwhere do you learn that from? Is
really the Japanese in theToyota world is called Kaizen,
continuous improvement. How dothey continuously improve? And
(12:51):
if they're and here's the keyKaizen, I thought were big
improvements, they're littleimprovements. What can we do a
little better here? What can wedo better here? What can we do
better? You know, if you try tobe better every day, they were
telling me, Well, that's aKaizen, because not every day
you can make a major change, butif you can be just a little
better every day, that's kaizen.
And so they have taken thismodel, and you know, you know
(13:11):
the Toyota manufacturing world,they're renowned for their
consulting as well, where theywould come into planning. People
want to manufacture at a moreefficient level. They're
renowned for it because theyunderstand this. And now I don't
not a total expert on theToyota, Toyota total way of
(13:34):
thinking, but Michael, to yourpoint of standardization and
reducing the cost to theconsumer. That's why the value
if you look at what, you know, Iwas looking online, what does a
Corolla go for? What is aCameron like? I was shocked at
how economical the price tag wascompared to other brands for the
similar, yeah, you know, make,model of a vehicle. So
(13:59):
obviously, there's something toit. Because how can they produce
a vehicle? Because they have toproduce it here in America. A
lot of them made right here inAmerica. Well, how are they
producing something here inAmerica? Everybody says most
expensive place in the world tomanufacture, but yet, they can
offer something at a morecompetitive price than the GMs
and the Fords and the others.
Kyle Mountsier (14:21):
Yeah. So Michael, I want to go back to
because you you've said likethey're a green manufacturer. I
want to go back to that. Becauseright now, the geopolitical, the
political, the cultural climateis a lot around electric right?
New power train, new new way ofthinking. You know, production
(14:42):
styles, even materials beingused in the in these vehicles,
can you juxtapose for us, just alittle bit on, like when you say
a manufacturer that is, youknow, that is primarily making
gas and hybrid engines, lots ofhybrid power. Trains is you
would consider green based onthe entire vehicle process, in
(15:07):
comparison, even potentially tosome of the newer manufacturing
and power train processes.
John Sacco (15:15):
Well, okay, that's a great question. Yeah, so green.
You know, what is green? Green?
You know that? That's a hell ofa word, and a lot of green
washing goes on out there. Greenwashing is bull crap, saying
we're green when you're not. ButToyota, let's, let's look at the
there any piece of aluminum fromtheir wheels, transmission,
(15:38):
housing differentials. You know,if you get up underneath Michael
to your tundra, and you see thetundra in the drive the train,
the shaft, it's all aluminum.
Now that is 800 pounds lighterbecause of the use of aluminum.
(15:59):
Now the aluminum they use isrecycled aluminum, because it
comes with it. It's easier toalloy up to make the alloy they
need more durable. Virginaluminum is far greater and
expense, and you the additivesthat you would have to come up
with with from Virgin aluminumand the mining of it, there's no
(16:20):
way, you know, recycle aluminumsaves 95% CO two emissions, and
then remelting and 95% of energyconsumption versus virgin, okay,
so right there, and then justthe use is dramatically greener,
all right. So then you got, likebrakes. Brakes in America are
(16:42):
made from 100% recycled iron. Alot of the copper in the car is
coming from has a huge amount ofcopper, recycled copper content
in it. Now the outer shell oflot of the cars are going to be
from EA not EAS, but fromintegrated steel mills that use
iron ore. Let's, let's be honestabout that. But in our in the
(17:05):
steel making of integrated steelmills that make the the steel
for the outer, you know, thedoors, the hoods, and so there's
about 10 to 15% of recycledsteel in that so with putting
all together in some of theplastics that they're using,
they're coming from recycledplastics, the in the the in the
(17:28):
plant Troy, Missouri, this thesilicon they're using for the
molds. So you know that do theport, the they have to put these
things in there. And what itdoes is that sand is made from
100% it's reused over and overand over and over again. So even
when they have a bad motor blockor bad cylinder head that gets
recycled, goes right back to thesmelter, remelted and brought
(17:51):
back because, you know, throughthe inspection process. So when
you start seeing just the sheeramount of the circularity of
components that they're usingthat when they have scrap out of
their plant. It goes back to thealuminum smelter, or the steel
making plant for fenders andhoods. It goes back to the steel
(18:11):
mills to make new products sothey're using it's real. It's a
closed loop recycling theirwaste metal. It's not waste. I
would never call it waste.
They're residual. But they'rethey're residual, their
byproduct from manufacturing.
Call it from stampings orwhatever, go right back into
(18:33):
making the new coils, the newsteel, the new aluminum, all
that, all that stuff. So, youknow, versus the electric
vehicle that has so many rareearth minerals in it that has
the Cobalts and stuff, so youare dealing with more virgin
metals in an electric vehiclethan you are, if you will. That
Paul J Daly (18:53):
makes sense. Always new, yeah, I like that. You just
brought up the rare earthsbecause that's been a super hot
topic of conversation inautomotive China controlling his
thing, it's 90% of the magnets,or the availability to
manufacture, refine thematerials for magnets. And so we
were talking the other day, andwe did a quick search, and I was
(19:13):
like, Can you recycle magnets?
And do you have a thought orperspective on all these rare
earths, these magnets that are,you know, holding, kind of the
EV industry people, some peoplethink hostage, because now China
has secured so much of the rawmaterials. Is there going to be
a shift and a hyper focus onrecycling these and those being
available and kind of breakingdown some of that, there
John Sacco (19:34):
will be monopoly.
There will be, yeah, there'sgoing to be
Paul J Daly (19:40):
and the real question is, is John Socko about
to become the most important manin the EV conversation?
John Sacco (19:46):
No, not at Okay, and here's why I'm not, because in
the end, rare earths and all thestuff used to be making, uh,
EVs, um. Now, you know thelithium batteries, the lithium
that they use there. So what,what you have is, is, right now,
(20:07):
the EVs are not designed to berecycled yet. Ah, okay, because
the lithium battery, the thelithium batteries just in the
auto industry alone inappliances, the lithium battery
is problematic of extractinglike in a cell phone, if you
will. So EVs, you know, you havea car, it's got these big EV
(20:33):
batteries. What do you do withit? You know, you the
automobiles die. A internalcombustion engine dies by an
auto shredder. But what happenswith the lithium battery and in
those materials? And right now,the recycling of all these other
materials that are in EVs hasn'tquite caught up. There's some
(20:55):
people starting to do it, but itisn't as easy as it is a, you
know, just a regular gasolineengine, if you will, easy to
recycle, easy to process. Youknow, in when it goes to EVs,
the one thing about EVs, youknow, they're using, like Tesla,
they use a lot of recycledaluminum in their frames. So
that's the good news there. Thelightweight, the light weighting
(21:16):
in any auto manufacturer in theUnited States, is where we're
saving CO two emissions on thempg. More miles per gallon means
less CO two emissions. So that'sgood, but the electric vehicles
see now. The other issue withthe electric vehicles is the
recharging grid. The theinfrastructure to recharging
(21:38):
vehicles requires, if we went toall that reveal, we just
wouldn't have enough copper, asit is now to empower.
Paul J Daly (21:48):
You know about that? I mean, the cop, well,
they don't understand.
John Sacco (21:53):
Well, you know, copper, it's a worldwide trade
in metal. They are. They havelarge inventories of copper,
recycled copper. So that's why,you know, if you look at Copper,
it's trading over $5 a pound onthe COMEX, the shock Chicago
American, the look, copper isgoing to be in high demand as so
(22:15):
much electronic things, youknow, electronic, electric,
workless electric Austin
Kyle Mountsier (22:21):
copper is what you're trying to tell me
John Sacco (22:24):
somehow. Well, I've got to believe it's going to be
it's a commodity that's going tobe in high demand. Because if
you think about it, think aboutall the products, lawn mowers at
golf courses. Okay, take PebbleBeach, right, iconic, right.
Well, eventually that'll berobotic. EV, it'll be electric
lawn mower that'll be aI guidedto. So think about that. But
(22:50):
they're gonna have to chargethat now. They need more power
every golf course will get. I'mjust, I'm just using this as an
example, street sweepers. Well,as we see the cabs, the
driverless cabs. Well, now allthe Street Sweepers across
America could be electric AIdriven Street Sweepers. Well,
(23:14):
now they got to return home tobe charged up every day. So when
you when you have anythingthat's got to be charged up, you
need more you need more copper.
It just in destroy. Now, you lotof people use aluminum cables.
Now, there's copper cable.
There's aluminum cable also. So,so as we go to more electric,
electric, you know, your ATVswill go more electric. Think
(23:39):
about boats. I mean, there'll beelectric motors eventually. You
know, I got a boat that has a300 horsepower Mercury, two 300
horsepower Mercury's, well, oneday, somebody's gonna figure out
how to make those out ofelectric so think about all the
electrification going on. Andwhen you electrify, you need
(24:01):
one. Yeah, that's copper. So, soI'm
Michael Cirillo (24:07):
buying bricks of copper right now.
Paul J Daly (24:09):
Buying it just right now,
Kyle Mountsier (24:11):
copper bricks.
Michael froze, someone's goingto need these guys. That's wild.
Paul J Daly (24:16):
Oh, well, we have one more. We have one more
thing. We want to play. What didyou say?
John Sacco (24:24):
You all froze for a second. All three of you went,
Paul J Daly (24:28):
Oh, got it? We want to play. We want to play one
more thing for you. I think wehave a little delay. Sorry,
we'll figure it out. We want toplay one thing for you and ask
you a couple more questionsabout it. Nathan, roll roll. It
Unknown (24:44):
without the recycled metals industry. No rebar to
build the hospital's Foundation,no surgical tools. Can't even
build this Gurney without nobodyelse.
Paul J Daly (24:58):
That's amazing. All right, so the. Is obviously a
commercial to commemorate thepromote the launch of repurpose
season three. Kind of, we kindof related to that one because
we see it. And sometimes, like,we'll walk in and, you know,
we'll just be talking to, likethe hostess at the restaurant.
How about how great the carindustry is, how important it is
to the local economy, howimportant it is to leadership
development and community. And,you know, like, they smile and
(25:20):
they nod. But really, nobodyasked, Why are you so driven to
produce this Docu series into anindustry that you know, the the
pregnant lady on the gurneysaid, Nobody asks, right while
her husband's trying to tell hernone of that would be possible.
Why are you doing this?
John Sacco (25:34):
Because it's comes down to the bottom line, our
industry has a terrible image.
We're looked at as dirty, dirtywaste, trash, garbage, junk. All
of those are absolutely not whatwe do. And if we don't change
the image, if we don't changehow we talk about what we do,
(25:54):
and like the blue states acrossAmerica, don't like our
industry, okay? They think we'rebad, yet they don't understand
without us, they don't livetheir lives. Health care gets
all of that, and that's why Iwas saying nobody asked. Nobody
asked, because I can tell youand I when season one came out,
Democratic Majority Leader inthe Senate was Mr. Schumer. The
(26:17):
Speaker of the House was KevinMcCarthy, Republican, Democrat.
They watched a couple episodes,and they said the same thing,
wow. I had no idea what yourindustry does. Wow, because we
don't ever teach our kids this.
So when, when I say, Nobodyasked, well, nobody asked, well,
(26:38):
how's our car made? Whatmaterials? Where does it come
from? How about that highwaythat has been constructed that
slows traffic down? But where'sthat steel come here? Because
nobody asked, because nobodyasked. In World War Two, our
industry, we were slaughteredfor our efforts, because our
(27:01):
cans are your our bullets. Wewere fighting tyranny with the
stuff we recycled. World WarTwo, there was posters, recycle.
You know your your metal is ourcannons, your metals are ships.
Yeah, right, because we arefighting tyranny. We went from
the heroes to persona no gratain a couple decades,
Kyle Mountsier (27:22):
wow, yeah, and it's like, but we still produce,
yeah,
Paul J Daly (27:28):
yeah, but you're just as important. Say again,
but you're just as importantstill, but you're just as
important. I
John Sacco (27:36):
would argue we're the most vital industry in
America, because without us,there is no health care, there
is no farming, there is no autoindustry in receipt. In re
season three, they flat out tellyou you cannot make one
automobile today in Americawithout recycled aluminum. And
that's all manufacturers. Wow.
Kyle Mountsier (27:56):
Sounds so familiar. I feel it
John Sacco (28:02):
not one. So why am I running with this? Because
nobody's asking the question. Igot a fun one with a guy on an
airplane. I got it starting tocome out now,
Paul J Daly (28:13):
with a guy on an airplane.
John Sacco (28:16):
No, there's a guy on a flight. Oh, he it's another
one like that, where the guystalking to this lady, you know,
without recycled metals, thealuminum for this aircraft
wouldn't be made, and for thewithout copper, there won't be
the electronics around thisaircraft. And for that matter,
no rebar for the runway we'regoing to land on, or to steal
for the jetways and theairports. She looks at him,
nobody asked.
Kyle Mountsier (28:40):
That's the problem. Nobody's asking. We
wouldn't be in a steel canflying across the world without
the without that industry.
That's wild. That's wild. Thinkabout this.
John Sacco (28:51):
Every kid who takes chemistry, this is important to
me. Every kid who takeschemistry in high school always
says the same doggone thing.
What do they say? When will Iever need this, right? Well, if
you get a job in the aluminumsmelting industry, the steel
industry, the copper industry,you got to know your periodic
tables, because you got to seewhen you're doing the metallurgy
(29:12):
in a steel mill and aluminumfoundry and copyright, you're
saying, Okay, well, I got Xamount, 00, 0.1% Molly in this
okay, that's acceptable. So nowyou got to know, so if, if our
educators would teach our kids,hey, let's build a bridge. We
need steel. Let's go to steel,and let's look at the periodic
table. Here's all the elementsthat go into making steel. What
(29:34):
kids
Kyle Mountsier (29:36):
goes how we actually use that? Yeah, yep,
your
John Sacco (29:40):
car that you drove to school and seeing. That's
what my point is. Nobody asked.
You think a kid gives a flyingrats ass that the hospital they
were born in? It starts withrecycled steel with rebar. Did
they? Did they even Okay? Nobodyasked. Nobody tells Yeah. So
that's why I'm doing it.
Kyle Mountsier (29:59):
Well. It's,
John Sacco (30:02):
I get, you know, you guys hit a button.
Kyle Mountsier (30:06):
Hey, I love it.
I love the passion, like cameright through at the end and and
the fact that you're doing thewhole series, you're you, you
know that funding it changes,changes in industry, but also
the way that you're going aboutit is amazing. I'm glad we got
to chat, talk through the autoindustry, talk through steel. We
went. We went a milliondifferent directions. John, it's
always a pleasure hanging outwith
John Sacco (30:29):
you. It's a pleasure to be with you guys. But you
know, let's, let's get, let's,let's settle on one message.
Without recycled aluminum, youcannot build one automobile in
America today, not GM, Ford,Toyota, you name it. You can't
build one without recycledaluminum.
Paul J Daly (30:47):
That's right, and that. Go learn all about it.
Repurposed season three,available now on Amazon Prime,
yeah,
John Sacco (30:55):
not yet, not yet, not quite yet. On Brian when
YouTube, it'll be probably acouple, three weeks trust. But
here, here's the boy. Here's thetagline, recycling aluminum,
driving the US auto industry.
Let's
Kyle Mountsier (31:11):
go. Let's go.
Let's go. Awesome. Thanks, John,
John Sacco (31:16):
gentlemen, it's a pleasure to be here with you.
You keep doing what you'redoing. I love what you guys do.
Keep playing those guitars andhave a little fun. All right,
will do?
Kyle Mountsier (31:30):
All right. Look, if you weren't watching that
podcast, take your stuff thetime. Go near the end, about
five minutes to the end, weplayed a video. It says nobody
asked. You have to watch itbecause it's one of these
things, is clearly AI generated,right? I
Paul J Daly (31:47):
don't think it's clearly AI generated. You don't
think so. No, I think that if,for us, you didn't say that, I
think if you didn't say that, noone, well, no one
Kyle Mountsier (31:56):
would have known. Okay, so is AI generated.
But the level of thought behindputting together a campaign like
that. And I think that that thereason why we love talking to
John is because we there's somuch similarity in what Auto is,
the the connective tissue toeverything that happens in our
country, the level of GDPassociated with selling and
(32:20):
servicing a car like those twopieces and the spider web of it
going out, similar to the steelindustry, the recycled metals
industry, so intense and like tohear his passion cut ramp after
that was insane.
Michael Cirillo (32:33):
You know, you know what frightened me a little
bit. Actually, in his passion,he revealed, tell me if i I
heard this, I wrote this downthat he a knows, it seems quite
well legislators on CapitolHill, I think he does Yes, and
revealed that they have no clue.
Paul J Daly (32:56):
Listen of that, that that practice doesn't
surprise me at all. We weretalking to we were talking to
me. I said it frightened
Michael Cirillo (33:05):
me. Okay, that's fair making laws and
regulations who have not evenasked the most basic question
about the thing that they'relegislating.
Paul J Daly (33:13):
Well, I think that's that's one of the reasons
that nada works so hard to be onthe hill, and why it's so
important that auto dealers getinvolved with the legislators.
Because oftentimes you have alegislator who is, you know,
when you have an industryspecific topic like automotive,
instance, there is, there is anaide who is advising the
legislator on the topics, on theissues. And that aid,
(33:38):
oftentimes, in Washington, DC,is like, Oh yeah, I've never
actually bought a car. Thatactually happened to us, and we
were talking to somebody like,yeah? Like, being honest, I've
never bought it. Never bought acar. Yeah, you're advising
policy. It's like, who's yourfavorites? Like, I
Michael Cirillo (33:55):
don't know. I like carva. They were like,
there aren't any, there aren'teven any EV chargers at the
Paul J Daly (34:01):
Capitol. It's like the same people that say we
should outlaw 18 wheelers. Weshould outlaw these things. It's
like, well, you realize that ifwe did, that's how you get your
groceries, we would have any ofthe stuff that you have right
now,
Kyle Mountsier (34:15):
it's amazing.
Well, hey, we hope you enjoyedthat conversation. We certainly
did. You can hear the passionbehind John. Go check out
repurposed on YouTube right now.
You can find it on if you'relistening to this a couple of
weeks later, you can probablyfind it on Amazon Prime video,
where you can find it more thancars our Docu series as well.
Nice on behalf of Paul J DalyKyle, mouse here and Michael
(34:38):
Cirillo, I'm leaving him lastbecause he's amazing. Thanks for
joining us on Auto Collabs.
Unknown (34:43):
Sign up for our free and fun to read daily email for
a free shot of relevant news andautomotive retail media and pop
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if you love this podcast, pleaseleave us a review and. Share it
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time.
(35:15):
Welcome to Annika labs. You.
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