Saving America By Being a Christian Patriot w/ Dr. Taylor Marshall

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
And then I will excommunicate all of the public
figures that dissent from theteachings of the church, that
I'll be out.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
All right.

Speaker 1 (00:17):
So let's say you make this statement and Taylor
Marshall comes on and saysrespectfully, Holy Father, I
cannot affirm this.
What do you do?
As the Pope, I would tell himrepent, and if you don't, then I
will have to ratify thisautomatic excommunication.
You can't touch this.

Speaker 2 (00:41):
I don't know why not cast someshade against me in the past.

Speaker 3 (00:46):
Break it down.

Speaker 4 (00:57):
The anti-Catholic activist Taylor Marshall Stop.

Speaker 2 (01:00):
Hammer time Every time you see me.
The hammer's just so high.

Speaker 3 (01:05):
I'm dope on the floor and I'm magic on the mic.
Now why would?

Speaker 1 (01:10):
I ever stop doing this With others making records.
It just don't hit.

Speaker 2 (01:15):
I tour around the world from London to the Bay.
It's hammer, go hammer.
Empty hammer, yo hammer.
And the rest can't go in play,can't touch this.
No, I don't want to see yourmass fit.
No, do not want the mass fit.

Speaker 3 (01:42):
I'm going to start therapy.
That was the most epic avoidingBabylon intro we've ever had,
taffy, hands down your best workto date, taffy, I mean is Taffy

(02:04):
in the chat?

Speaker 2 (02:05):
Taffy's definitely in the best work to date.

Speaker 3 (02:07):
Taffy.
I mean, is Taffy in the chat?
Taffy's definitely in the chat.
He's got a fan.
He's definitely in here.
You know they talk a lot aboutthe Groiper curse, but I've seen
plenty of people over the yearshave something to say about Dr
Taylor Marshall and it neverends well for any of them.

Speaker 2 (02:26):
You know, you just ignore and keep.
You know, as Vanilla Ice says,did I stop?
No, I just roll by.
You just keep going.

Speaker 3 (02:33):
You've actually always handled people sniping at
you very well.
You've always just ignored it,just keep on pressing, keep
doing what you're doing and justgo along with everything.
So I respect you for that.
I don't have that kind ofself-control.
I have, uh, really have this,this.
I have this innate need to justrespond to everything.

(02:54):
So, um, how have you been?
Man like I?
We haven't spoken since, um,since the, the, the new pontiff,
um, and I know Really.
Yeah, I don't think we've Not oncamera.
Not on camera.
Yeah, and I know my initialreaction when it was all going
down.
I was like, oh my goodness,what is happening right now?

(03:16):
And I thought the end of the, Ithought it was just going to be
way worse.
And then, after thinking aboutit a bit, I was like, like you
know, it's not good for the newpope to come into this hostile
environment.
And like I and then I saw youkind of take that, that position
and I, you know it's it's beena very different mood since

(03:36):
leo's come in right well, I mean, I gotta admit that I was.

Speaker 2 (03:41):
I was dooming a little bit.
I was live chatting and youknow, I heard him announce it in
in Latin and there was crowdsand I heard the term, I heard
the word Robertus.
Oh boy, he got that.
I was like that's Robert, sarah, baby, yeah, it's Oakley just
won.
This is this, is it post thedubs?

(04:02):
And then a non-black guy walkedout.
It was another robertus, it wasrobert prevost, and I was like,
oh, I knew who he was.
I was like, oh no, but you know, honestly, I did kind of tear
up a little bit when I saw himdressed traditional.
I immediately picked up onthat's not the.

(04:22):
So I and, and then I he gave hedid the Hail Mary in Latin, and
so I logged off and, um, I justprayed about it that whole day
and took it in and I said youknow, he's 69 years old, we're
going to have this guy, unlesssomething happens, for 20 years.
So let's just pray for him,let's let's hope that the

(04:44):
charism of the papacy begins tosaturate in his soul and let's
wait and see.
We've been 90 days now, or 3months about and there's been
some good stuff.
I'm not thrilled about some ofthese appointments.
I don't think a lot of peopleare, but you know Pope Benedict

(05:05):
waited 2 years to do some morein Pontificum.
I am waiting to see and beoptimistic and pray for him and
give him a chance.
That's my position, still is.

Speaker 4 (05:17):
Pius IX was elected as a liberal and kind of reigned
as a liberal for two years,from 1846 until the right of the
revolutions in 48.

Speaker 3 (05:26):
So who knows, who knows what's going to happen
over 20 years um, do you thinkthere's any significance to
having an american pope duringthis american and trump is trump
, is just this figure in, he'sjust this historic figure like
we've never seen before.
And then you get an Americanpope seeing everything kind of

(05:49):
drum up in Israel the way it isLike I don't know man.
Do you ever get feelings ofapocalyptic mania watching all
these things unfold?

Speaker 2 (05:58):
No, I mean, I think I said over and over, I probably
said 12 times on my podcast it'snot going to be an American,
it's not going to be Burke,everybody just chill on that,
and I was completely wrong.
I honestly this is a littlecynical and I don't mean to doom
pill or anything here, but Ithink it does have to do with
money is running on deficit andthe richest segment of the

(06:29):
Catholic Church in the world isthe United States of America.
So I think that does play intoit a little bit.
Otherwise, there's no reason toelect America an American.
And you look at the history ofyou know when French popes
started being elected andusually it's been Italians.
But know it, it makes mescratch my head a little bit and
I that right there the moneyelement is is, I think, part of

(06:52):
it.

Speaker 4 (06:53):
And it, it.
It happened only a few monthsafter the uh, the U S federal
spigot was turned off with USAID.

Speaker 2 (07:02):
Yeah, it did, and I think a lot of Americans who
have been generous with PeterPence and diocesan appeals and
all that they've since COVID,have tightened their purses and
said, no, we're not giving youmore, we're unhappy.
I think this goes back to 2002,but especially the McCarrick
scandal, 2018, 19,.
All that you know that is also,I think, cause problems.

(07:26):
So, yeah, there's definitely anelement to that of having an
American Pope.

Speaker 3 (07:33):
What do you think happens with the traditionalist
movement at this point?
Like there was something aboutFrancis that you know, as rough
as it was for those 12 years,there was something exciting in
the traditional movement wherepeople were taking their faith
very seriously and they werelike, wait, we have to.
You know, we have to dosomething because things just

(07:55):
seem so rocky.
But it seems like there's alittle bit of disunity now and
like people are getting a littlelackadaisical.
I'm saying that wrong Peoplealways make fun of me.
It's lackadaisical.
I'm saying that wrong, peoplealways make fun of me as
lackadaisical, I think.
But people seem to.
You know, without all thecraziness coming out of Rome, I
feel like the whole, like the,the podcast arena is changing a

(08:16):
bit.
What do you, what do you thinkis, is, is in it, in store for
us in in traditional circles?

Speaker 2 (08:24):
I think the general consensus is what we've just
discussed and that is wait andsee, be kind, be patient.
There is a group who havealready said Pope Leo is not the

(08:47):
Pope.
This guy is Francis 2.2.0.
We need to resist them and youknow, but I think that's.
It's not at all like it was inthe traditional circles under
pope francis circa 2022, likethat's when it was insane man,
yeah, um, yeah, like you justsaid the word francis and people
are like off, yeah, yeah, andunder benedict, even like under

(09:11):
benedict, the traditionalistswere never like hostile towards
the pope.

Speaker 3 (09:16):
They it was.
They would point out all theissues with vatican ii and they
would talk about all the issuesin the novus ordo and things
like that.
But there was always a respectgiven to Benedict and even John
Paul II from even you know theguys who were doing this forever
, like Michael, matt and allthose guys.
They would never come right outand be disrespectful to the
player.
It was really Francis that kindof changed the tone of

(09:38):
everything.

Speaker 2 (09:40):
Yeah, early on when he made the breeding like
rabbits comment.
Yeah, early on when he made thebreeding like rabbits comment,

(10:07):
when Amoris Laetitia came outand Cardinal Burke and Cardinal
Brandmuller and some you know hewas the prefect of congregation
with the doctor of faith.
I think that right there openedthe floodgates.
People were already feeling it,people already had anxiety
about it and I, you know, I knowa lot of people say, oh, it's,
you know Taylor Marshall's falland these bloggers and these
podcasts and all that.
But honestly, I think if you goback and look at how the
dominoes fell, you really do seesome preeminent princes of the
church starting to square offwith Pope Francis in those years

(10:31):
and I think that in a big way,not to mention Archbishop Carlo
Maria Viganò putting out hisletter letters he kept going.
I think at that moment peoplewere willing to start talking
out loud about it.
I think that point was missedby a lot of people in the x

(10:53):
social media, youtube podcastspace.
They've kind of forgotten howthings went down back then.

Speaker 3 (11:00):
It was it was mccarrick.
Mccarrick, you know, I mean it.
Definitely the rumbling startedwith the Morris Latizia,
definitely.
There there was a lot of thingsstarting to brew up, but it was
McCarrick that.
Everybody was just like I'vehad it.
And, which is interesting,because Vigano, when Francis
visits America, vigano bringshim to meet the, that woman, who

(11:24):
, who is now bringing that caseto the Supreme Court?
What's her name?

Speaker 4 (11:31):
Tim.

Speaker 3 (11:31):
Powers.
That's right.
So Francis comes to America andVigano introduces him to this
woman, because this woman stoodup and said I will not hand out
a marriage license for asame-sex couple.
And Francis kind of like shunsVigano and that was the
beginning of that fracturedrelationship there.

Speaker 2 (11:52):
That's right.
I mean these fractures andthese movements were already
happening in the hierarchy.
Because podcasting, I mean it'snot that new, but in the
Catholic space it's new.
That was really the first timefor people to come on and
commentate on it.
And then you have peopledrinking coffee and eating

(12:13):
donuts after mass talking aboutit.

Speaker 3 (12:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (12:16):
Right, whereas maybe 20 years ago it was only bishops
and cardinals who were aware ofsome of these, you know,
rivalries and fights and whatnot.
So I think, yeah, it's reallythe perfect storm, like when all
that cracked and happened isall snow, when all this media
stuff not just your mainstreammedia, you know, like your new
york times and your cnn, but allthese little micro voices.

Speaker 4 (12:40):
It's funny how the podcasting movement has kind of
created a more synodal church.

Speaker 3 (12:47):
That's actually funny .
No, because, look, if that hadhappened 10 years earlier, you'd
have only gotten news fromNational Catholic Register.
You'd have had the fish wrapout there.
National Catholic Reporter,they would have had their
version.
You'd have gotten three or fournews sources.
But because it happened duringthis technological boom, when

(13:07):
podcasting starts it's it'sinteresting because we used to
have we used to have like acommon pop culture where we
would have water cooler talk.
When everybody watched theSeinfeld episode you'd go and
talk about, but it becamepodcast.
So after mass we'd all begathered together and talking
about the latest Taylor Marshallepisode and can you believe

(13:28):
this latest scandal broke and itreally did change the entire
conversation in the church, Ithink.

Speaker 2 (13:35):
Yeah, and I think a lot of people want to blame me
and others for that, and that'sfine, I don't really care, but
this, this is not going away andI think it's probably.
Francis was the first pope inthe history of the Catholic
Church to walk onto that stageand unfortunately he had a lot

(14:12):
of scandalous decisions thathappened under his pontificate.
So in a way, maybe it wasprovidential.
In a way, maybe it wasprovidential, but I think when
they elected Pope Leo XIV youknow, here it is Click the link
for the PDF and then I'm talkingabout it in three or four other
podcasts.
I'm talking about that withinhours, like nine hours after it

(14:33):
breaks same day, and then, yeah,you've got people listening to
it, talking about it at coffeehour and it's really viral.
I think.
Actually, it's kind ofinteresting.
Two things went together at thattime.
You had everybody reporting onthis and then you also had a lot
of the prominent voices alsosaying and, by the way, the

(14:55):
solution is you should startgoing to traditional Latin mass
and reading the BaltimoreCatholicism and praying the
rosary and like, just entrenchin traditional Catholicism.
Like it was a perfect storm forthat and it's it's not going to
go away.
I think it's stronger than ever.
It's growing, whether or notrestricting or not, people are

(15:17):
rejecting that sort of whatBishop Barron calls beige
Catholicism Right.

Speaker 3 (15:27):
Just because that's kind of what he presents.

Speaker 2 (15:30):
Yeah, it's a different moment and I'm very
optimistic about where we'regoing to go here, and that's why
I also think it's importantthat we pause and give Pope Leo
a chance, because Pope Leo knows, and all the cardinals know,
and all the bishops know, thatif this starts going sideways

(15:51):
and there's a sense of betrayal,it's going to be a lot louder
than it was under pope francis.
Yeah, and I'm not trying to saythat like don corleone here,
right, I mean, y'all agree withme, right, a hundred percent.
It's not going to be justpeople whistling Like this is
you know, and it's twiddlingtheir thumbs.

(16:11):
It's going to be explosive.
It's the kind of moment that'scalm in the storm.
You know like let's reset thechessboard, you know what's our
opening here, but again, it's abig.

Speaker 3 (16:27):
The next three years will be a big moment so you said
it was the money and I do thinkthat was not that.
It's only that, but you like, Ido think that's a factor, but I
think the having.
I think pope leo understandsoptics, he understands american
media and I don't think thinkFrancis ever or the people
around him ever expected to getthe backlash they got, coming

(16:51):
mainly from the American media.
Like the English speaking mediais mainly in America.
There's a couple of voices inthe UK that are that are good,
but it was mainly AmericanEnglish speaking media.
That was the biggest oppositionto everything he was doing.
And I think it's interestingbecause there's not a chance

(17:11):
that pope leo doesn't know whodr taylor marshall is.
I mean every, every cleric wholived under the france, who was,
you know, in in authority underthe francis papacy, knew who
you were.

Speaker 2 (17:23):
So that has to be a bit of a trip for you, right
that the pope, not just me, buta lot of other people as well,
like, yeah, I have it on goodauthority that from two
different sources, that popefrancis did watch my videos.
He was aware.
Yes, it's up there and yeah, Imean, if you're, if you're like,
how come we're not getting thedonations we used to get from

(17:45):
the United States of America?
And what's the deal with theLatin mass and what's the deal
with Vigano?
And why is Vigano and DonaldTrump exchanging public letters
and all this stuff is going on?
You're going to start askingquestions in your meetings and
over tea in Rome what's going onin America?
And so you know they had manyyears to tap into this and I

(18:06):
think they did understand that.
I think you know Pope Leo was onTwitter.
He seems somewhat active.
I think he knows what's goingon and that's kind of what I say
Like everyone's giving him thechance.
We're praying for him.
We're praying rosaries, we'refasting, but we are like
watching.
Like praying rosaries, we'refasting, but we are like

(18:27):
watching, like it's not, likewell, that was over, that
chapter's over.
Um, this edifice is stillexists.
It's just, I think you know,being kind and being Catholic
and and and praying for the Holyfather.

Speaker 3 (18:38):
Do you think any, uh any of the relationships that
kind of got ruptured betweenCatholic media figures?
Cause under Francis it becameanybody critical of Francis
could never speak to those whowere not critical of Francis and
like, do you see any healingamongst the siblings in the
family of Christ?
Right, because that was alwayshard seeing that where it was,

(19:01):
it was like, oh well, you theguilt by association, oh, you
talked to taylor marshall.
Now I can't talk to you becauseyou, you know, and I I'm hoping
some of that can heal under leoI think it depends on the pope
and the church.

Speaker 2 (19:16):
I think it really depends because those those
fractures that happened were allbased on what is your reaction
to this situation?
And then people got intodifferent segmented groups that
didn't exist under Pope Ben the16th I was going to traditional

(19:37):
Latin mass and Pope Ben the 16thI don't remember that.
You know it was very common,like someone's a charismatic
Catholic and Nov novus, ordo andstudent bill and try and you
would pray a rosary, and therewasn't this sort of like what,
what brand are you?
That those, those labels werethere, but under francis it very
much did become what are you,even to the point of are you

(20:00):
fssp?
Are you, are you SSP, like thatkind of stuff.
Unfortunately, it really gotmagnified and so I think it
depends on Pope Leo.
If we can get back to aconsensus under what we have
with Pope Ben the 16th, I thinkwe will start seeing that
healing.
But there's people who pop offand they want to get clicks and

(20:23):
they want to get views and theywant to get popular and a great
way to do that is to infight andcreate your own little tribe.

Speaker 3 (20:38):
Yeah, yeah for sure.
What we're experiencing rightnow is that you have the where
Peter is crowd and you knowAustin, ivory, all claiming Leo
for them, and then you have thetrads kind of sitting there very
tripped it like just intrepidation, like oh, we'll see
what happens.
But but there, that that cannotcoexist for too much longer.

(21:00):
There's, there's going to bethings that happen, and I'm
pretty sure I'm thinking the endof the summer we're hoping that
we get some kind of a documenton the Latin mass, but I think
that's going to kind of you,don't think so?

Speaker 2 (21:12):
I don't think so.
I think what we'll see in thefall, probably around October
this is kind of what I heardWe'll start to see different
appointments to the Vatican, tothe Roman Curia, see different
appointments to the Vatican, tothe Roman Curia, and we'll see.
You know, if the lady continuesover the dicastery for
religious life, we'll see ifFernandez, kissy, tucho

(21:32):
Fernandez, does he stay over thedicastery for doctrine, who's
going to be placed in thedicastery for sacraments and
liturgy.
If we start seeing thosechanges, that I think is going
to signal the movement forwardand I think we'll probably maybe
see that October, november.
We're not going to get adocument on the Latin mass by

(21:53):
the end of the summer.
I think it would probably beearliest one year into his
papacy.
We would see it because, leo,it's just like when Trump took
office, like, okay, who are myfriends?
Who are the everyone's?
Like, oh man, I'm your bestfriend, I got the inside scoop
for you.
You want to listen to me?
Don't listen to that guy.
He's going to betray Everyone'sjockeying for their place, and

(22:15):
it really.
I mean, trump didn't evenfigure it out in his first four
years.
He was getting betrayed leftand right.
So when you come into apowerful position, even if you
have big plans, you still needto know the landscape and who
the people are and who you cantrust, and that takes at least
one year, and so I don't.
I don't think he's going to putout any moda proprios or heavy

(22:38):
document.
If he was going to do it, hewould have done it in the first
month, like Trump's executiveorders.
He'd be like signed you know,sumorum pontificum, revised,
signed.
He would just, he would havepumped out like 12 motoproprios
and everybody would just becelebrating and awesome.
But he didn't do that.
That tells me he's going todelay, he's going to figure out

(22:59):
and then, if he does do it, Ithink it'll be at least a year
in.
So that's what, when Trads tellme like, hey, is he going to
bring back?
You know no, and it's not goingto be the end of the summer and
I would love to come back andeat a shoe on this.
He was going to do it on August30th and he did it on August
30th.

Speaker 3 (23:19):
I'm really glad you're saying this because it's
tempering expectations a bit.
And I think you're saying thisbecause it's tempering
expectations a bit and I thinkyou're 100 right now, especially
you see the way leo's doingeverything.
He's like it's been so quiet,like the the news scene out of
out of rome, so it's.
I'm kind of glad you're sayingthat.
Now, the other thing is he isexpected to put, um, uh,

(23:42):
something out, like he he'sgoing to put an encyclical or
something out.
Do you think there's going tobe anything on the podcast space
?
Because he didn't invite allthose e-girls over to Rome for
the Jubilee and made them allwalk on their.
No, I'm kidding, he didn'tinvite all of the you know the

(24:07):
what the hell?
Influencers to Rome.
Yeah, so it seems like he maybe gearing up to make a
statement on some of the modernmedia.

Speaker 2 (24:16):
Yeah, I mean, that might be a strategy.
You have to remember that theseare older gentlemen and they're
sitting around and they're likeman the podcast.
Influencer space came at uslike a tidal wave.
We can't stop it.
Maybe we can harness it, andthat might be what this
influencer meeting in rome wasall about is let's bring some

(24:37):
people in, let's get to knowthem, you know, and they might
even want to figure out how toinstitutionalize that.
Who are some people who can beofficial and they might.
I look at that and I thinkthat's kind of like your
grandparents when they found outabout email.

(24:57):
There is no stamp, and thenchain letters started.
Yeah, yeah, letter started,yeah, exactly.
Yeah, I don't.
I don't think they fullyunderstand, like, how
decentralized the moment is andthe technology is.
Yeah, so if they are trying todo that, they might very well be
trying to do that.
I don't know how effective itwould be.

(25:18):
I mean, there's obviously someclear choices of who they would
choose.

Speaker 3 (25:22):
Yeah, obviously it's kind of like the sonata way,
when they would invite certainpeople to make sure they got the
the end result they were hopingfor.
It seems like that they may becarefully choosing who they
invite to rome to make sure theend result looks the way they
want yeah, yeah, so yeah, I, Ithink they're aware of it.

Speaker 2 (25:43):
I think, look, the best thing they could do, the
best thing they could do iswithout and they're probably
worried about, you know tickingoff all the liberals in Europe.
But the best thing they could doand Pope Leo could do is just
make very firm Catholicstatements that would reassure

(26:03):
the, the base, the people whoactually go to mass, people are
actually putting money in thebasket, people who are actually
having babies and baptizingtheir babies.
Tighten up that base byaffirming catholic teaching and
I really think 60 of the angerand the contradiction, or yeah,

(26:25):
would go away if they allowedthe traditional night mass.
I do too.
It's a symbol of, well, it'sreally a symbol of the
restriction and sort of theanimosity of Pope Francis, and
that's what everybody's stillkind of injured with and wounded
and bruised, kind of injuredwith and wounded and bruised.
I think if you did, I think ifLeo did that there would just be

(26:52):
a big relief and, honestly,like the money would roll in.
Not that it's all about that,right, it's not about the money,
but they need the money and youknow, the movement of fidelity,
traditionalism, is growingRight still, even if they
restricted it Bigger than it waslast year and bigger than it
was five years ago.

Speaker 3 (27:13):
Yeah, it's funny, they always talk about how we're
only 1% of the church butthey're very worried about it
because they see that that iswhere the growth, even if it's
slow growth I'm not trying tooverplay it, it is slow but it
is where you see the vibrantyouth attracted to and it's even
even the novice ordo morenormie crowd.

(27:36):
They all want like communionrails and they want latin chant
brought to their novice ordo,like this whole experiment that
they tried putting in, which iswhy the detroit situation is so
bizarre to me, because man, thisguy, this guy, he's just like
trying, he just seems like anold man trying to hold on to

(27:58):
this revolution from the 60s.
Did you see the pictures of himon that, marching with the
immigrants and care for theenvironment?
It was just filled.
It was an entire church filledwith people over 75 years old
and there was one young familyand it was just a depressing
picture to see.

Speaker 2 (28:19):
Yeah, and if you remember, like Pope Leo, 69,
it's really that people in theirsixties and up, who are the
last group of people who whovatican ii was so cool and so
great and I remember when thepriest used to pray with his
back towards us, that rhetoricyou don't hear any, really,

(28:42):
anyone under that age sayingthat, and we have to realize
that in 20 years, that andthat's the younger group, right,
pope benedict?
I mean sorry, pope francis,he's the younger group, right,
pope Benedict.
I mean, sorry, pope Francis,he's the age group that was like
, really in the thick of it all,in Leo's, on the very, very, I

(29:02):
mean he's maybe, you know, righton the border of it.
In 20 years they're not goingto be in charge.
What's it going to look like?
You know, I think a lot ofdioceses are going to go under.
I think you're going to see alot of parishes that are like

(29:24):
the ones you were just talkingabout, where it's all about
environment and social justiceand immigration.
Those are not going to endure,they're not going to be around
and I think we might see alittle bit of a shrinkage and a
restriction.
But if you look for thevocations and you look for the
faith and the love and thegrowth and the families and I

(29:47):
would even say the charity andthe caring for the poor and the
homeless it really is intraditional communities.
Yeah, for sure.
You know we might be 1% now, butwhen you look at, what is it?
What's the number?
I always hear different numbers.
I like what percent ofCatholics in America go to mass?
Like 17%.
Yeah, I think that's the latestfigure.
Yeah, yeah, but so when youconsider that we're 1%, but

(30:09):
we're 1% of that 17%, we're now1 in 17.
Yeah, so when a bishop goes toa diocesan appeal dinner to
raise money, that means 1 in 17people that he's shaking hands
with might go to the TLN.
That's like 6 or 7%.
That's pretty sizable.
Those are active Catholics.

Speaker 3 (30:27):
Yeah, yeah, and I think there's a very sizable
portion who may go to the novusordo but want a more traditional
form of it, like the, the, the,the crazy rock band masses.
I think that I think the lifeteen stuff has played out.
I think everybody is kind ofjust done with all of that.
So, um, now what do you make oflike these, these new movements

(30:50):
you're starting to see, of likechristian nationalism and stuff
?
Is that so all right?
So taylor's got a book comingout.
Let's, let's throw the book upon screen, rob.
So, um, christian patriot, 12ways to create one nation under
god.
Like, have you seen some of the, the more protestant guys
talking I think doug wilson'soff talking about this stuff.
Like, what's your perspectiveon on, especially the youth?

(31:13):
You see, there's a massiveswell of young people who are
just like we want to make thisnation a Christian nation.
What's your take on that?

Speaker 2 (31:23):
Yeah.
So this book, christian Patriot, is a manifesto on that vision,
on that vision, but it's amanifesto from the perspective
of St Augustine, st ThomasAquinas, church fathers, natural
law, the social teaching of thechurch, the social reign of
Christ the King.

(31:43):
So I've been watching this fora few years and I've watched
Doug Wilson and many of theseChristian nationalist voices and
I generally agree.
You know they say a lot ofright things and what I like
about them is Protestants tendnot want to touch or attack the
founding fathers.
For them, they're almost likethe church fathers.

(32:04):
Yeah, they are.
And what we're seeing in theChristian nationalist movement
is they're willing to say therewere errors made in the founding
of America and that men likeThomas Jefferson, who didn't
believe in the Trinity, hedenied the resurrection of Jesus
Christ.
He even published theJeffersonian Bible, where he

(32:25):
went through and basically blackhighlight, markered out every
verse that he didn't like, thathe didn't think jesus really
said.
That's the guy telling us thatwe should have a wall of
separation between church andstate.
Thomas jefferson, if he, if helived in 2025, he'd be like

(32:46):
drinking martinis with aoc, likethat.
That is his.
He is a anti-Christian thinker.
So these guys are starting to.
You know they don't have theidea of a theology of politics
and they don't recognize thegreat synthesis of Christendom
between church and state from1500 to Constantine and 313.

(33:09):
They don't have that really.
But they're kind of starting torealize that you know there's
too many miles on this and it'sit's running out.
You know it hadn't had an oilchange, it's just got a faulty
system in it.
And they're willing to look atoptions and willing to rethink
what is America, or rethink, asI say in the book, any nation,

(33:30):
not just America, any nation,and can it be a Christian nation
?
And what would that look likeand how would you achieve that?
And so they're doing a goodthing.
But unfortunately they don'thave, they're not really
appealing to St Augustine, whotalks a lot about this, or the
Constantinian synthesis, or theCharlemagne synthesis, or the

(33:53):
King Louis IX synthesis, orThomas Aquinas, or any of the
great thinkers who spent a lotof time preaching and thinking
and writing about therelationship between church and
state.
So the book Christian Patriot Inamed it Christian Patriot
because I want the movement toget off the term Christian

(34:13):
nationalism and the reason Iwant us to get off of Christian
nationalism.
And I think if Catholics comeinto the conversation, this is
going to help.
The reason I don't like theterm Christian nationalism is,
first off, nationalism relatesto the word natus, which is
Latin.
Nationalism relates to the wordnatus, which is Latin born,
being born, birth.
So you're rooting yourpolitical identity ultimately in

(34:38):
nationalism.
I see someone in the live chatsaid Catholic nationalism.
We could do that, but I thinkthe better term is patriotism.
And here's why Thomas Aquinas,in the Summa Theologiae, he
explains that patriotism is oneof the virtues and it's one of
the sub-virtues under the virtueof justice.
Justice is rendering due to asuperior.

(35:04):
It's just to worship God.
It's right and just to worshipGod because he's our superior.
And we must also honor ourparents, honor your father and
mother.
That also falls under justice.
So patriotism, according to StThomas Aquinas, is loving your
patria, and patria is Latin forfatherland.

(35:28):
So now what we're doing is,instead of rooting our politics
in being born, now we're rootingour politics of myself in
relation to my patria, myfatherland.
It's rooted in patriarchy.
Ultimately, it goes back to God, the father.
It brings in the spiritualfatherhood of the clergy.

(35:49):
It brings in the fatherhood ofyour father and your
great-grandfather and hisgreat-grandfather all the way
back to Christendom.
And we're talking aboutpatriotism as a virtue, as
something you do, a habit, thatis in your life, a character,
quality, as opposed to beingborn, which is pretty passive.

(36:09):
So I think nationalism is thewrong.
And the second reason isnationalism as a term becomes
popular in European languages atthe time of the French
Revolution.
I don't like that.
I'd rather use terms that comefrom scholastic Catholicism, not
French Revolution.
And then probably a thirdreason why I think Christian or

(36:32):
Catholic nationalism is a badterm People on the left
associate nationalism with Nazi.
Yeah, of course.
So you know, we can justsidestep that whole conversation
and say, no, we're patriots, welove, and I like the idea.
I want America not to just be anation.
I want America, or everycountry, to be a patria, a

(36:56):
fatherland.
I mean, isn't that better?
This is my fatherland.

Speaker 3 (37:03):
Do you think the fact that we don't have a united
cultist in this country Because,like it's such a strange time
for us I mean even talkingbefore about how we used to have
a united pop culture we don'teven have that anymore, right?
It's almost like nothing unitesus to our neighbor anymore.
People kind of go about theirlives, the suburbs you barely

(37:25):
even know who's next door to you.
I mean the more ruralcommunities.
That's not how I grew up, yeah,so the fact that we don't I grew
up, yeah so like the fact thatwe don't like we, you know we
all.

Speaker 2 (37:34):
We went to the same schools, same neighborhoods,
played on the same sports teams.
We all watched, like you said,seinfeld or cosby, and the next
day we talked.
We all watched the same showand the next day we talked about
it, um, and then, you know,generally everyone was christian
, um, and generally, you know,people were integrated

(37:55):
culturally with one another.
Now that's been fractured.
But what's cool is catholicism,unlike the protestant groups,
we actually have to physicallygo to a place for our worship
because we have the universe Ihave.
I know protestant people and Ithey've said to me like I
haven't been to my church inlike seven months and I'm like
what, I just watch it on TV.

Speaker 3 (38:19):
Well, it makes sense with their theology, right, but
that's kind of what?
Really, the only faith thatcould integrate everything is
Catholicism, because the wholepurpose of Catholicism and even
when Paul talks about neitherGreek nor Jew and all that stuff
is because, like, when theSpanish conquistadors come into

(38:39):
Mexico, they're able tointermarry with the locals there
, because once they're united atthe same altar, there's no more
division between them, right?
So in a way, america wasfounded on like disunity and and
revolting against your previousgeneration.
So to get back to a patria andto a love of your fathers and a

(39:03):
love of your fatherland, it'salmost counterintuitive to the
american mindset of of revoltand stuff.

Speaker 4 (39:09):
So I think catholicism is the only cure for
that it's often been describedthat the american revolution was
really a continuation of theenglish civil war.
You know the in that the um,the american founders were
basically just wigs who wererevolting against, you know,
almost like not quite the jacob,but but you know the, the

(39:33):
traditional political system.
So, yeah, I think you're right.
I think like from the verybeginning, even before I mean
even even if you don't want tolook at it like us revolting
against a separate country, likeit the founders really were
revolting against same politicalsystem that the wigs were

(39:53):
revolting against in the englishcivil war.
So it's like baked in from thebeginning almost, and you in and
you, you hit there, you hitaround the head there, rob.

Speaker 2 (40:02):
And to magnify things and make it even worse is
protestantism, because it's notcatholic.
Catholic means Kathaholos.
According to the wholeuniversal, protestantism always
was a parasite on the state italways relied on.
It's actually a new thing inthe 1900s where the mainline
Protestant denominations are notconnected to a country, because

(40:24):
the Lutherans right awayintegrated into Germanic states.
The Anglicans were already, youknow, know, basically an arm or
a cabinet of the englishmonarchy.
Yeah, of course and so on and soforth.
In same in scotland with thepresbyterians.
And the problem with that is isyou're never going to have any

(40:46):
sort of look.
We, as catholics, actually wantthere to be a global consensus.
Yeah, the global consensus isjesus christ, and if your
religion is always an umbrellaunder the state or a cabinet
part of the state, you're nevergoing to actually achieve that.
And and we were actuallyachieving that, you know, moving

(41:09):
into the 1200s and the 1300sand unfortunately, you know, the
Protestant Reformation happened.
So, yeah, I mean, we need auniversal state, we need a
fatherland.
It's great to be that's theother thing Thomas Aquinas says,
being patriotic and this kindof gets us, you know, into the
debate of Ordo Amoris.

(41:30):
But being patriotic and lovingyour fatherland over another
fatherland is a virtue.
Yeah, you know, like I, I wantto love all people.
Christ commands me to loveeveryone, love my enemies, but I
have a special love for my wifeand my children and that's
actually virtuous.

(41:50):
It's good.
This is one reason why we havepriestly celibacy, as we know,
if you're gonna serve thecongregation, the parish,
equally and justly, it's goodthat you know 10 of those people
in the parish aren't yourchildren or your wife.

Speaker 3 (42:07):
Yeah, yeah, it's interesting because, like,
especially with these guys likedoug wilson and the and the
protestants who are talkingabout this stuff, these guys do
have a like a very strong lovefor jesus christ.
They have a very strong moralcompass, right like they don't
want to play games with themoral law and things like that.

(42:28):
But, man, they're just missingthe bigger picture of things and
they're missing the fact thathere's what they're missing and
I don't go directly into this inthe book, but here's what
they're missing.

Speaker 2 (42:41):
Okay, doug Wilson is a Reformed Presbyterian.
His theology is Presbyterian.
I was reading Doug Wilson longbefore I was a Catholic.
I used to subscribe to hismagazine when I was in college.
That's interesting.
Doug Wilson, are you reallytelling me that you're going to
integrate the United States ofAmerica or the state of Idaho

(43:03):
with the local session of eldersat the Presbyterian church?
How is that going to?
How are you going to getsessions of elders in your
Presbyterian polity, of how yourun the church, and you're going
to somehow integrate that withthe United States of America or
the Kingdom of France?
That doesn't work right.

(43:24):
Early on, we see that whenConstantine begins his
conversion, you see that thehierarchy of the church, which
was already in existence, rightwhen you have bishops and you
have archbishops and you havepatriarchs and you have a pope
and all these things, thatintegrates with the state.
Yeah, how is the SouthernBaptist Convention going to

(43:50):
integrate with the United Statesof America?
Like who's their head honcho?
Like do they have a Cardinal?
Do they have an Archbishop?
You know, like the guy whomakes the most money, he like
the richest Southern Baptist.
I mean who, who, who are theprinces of the church?
That that not only create theintegration of church and state,

(44:11):
maintain it, but also, withreal heavenly power, discipline
the kings and the princes andthe politicians when they get
sideways and against the church?
You have to have the papacy,you have to have the hierarchy.
It's the only way it's going towork.

Speaker 3 (44:30):
It's such an interesting thing because we're
in a time where the nations thisis why the social kingship of
Christ is so important and it'snot just that Jesus Christ is
king of your heart, right, it'sthat the nations have to bow to
Christ the king, because we'rein a time where all the nations
of the world are now making lawsthat are going against the

(44:54):
natural law right.
So they're basically saying weknow there's a God, we don't
care, we're going to make ourlaws the way we want to, and
once you do that, you start tosee the disintegration of
society just happen.
It's amazing it's taken so longto descend.
I can't believe we're stillintact as a nation, being that
the laws have been the way theyhave since.

(45:15):
I mean, really, they startedgoing off the rails around the
time of the sexual revolution,but it's almost like a mercy of
god that this country hasn'tdevolved into chaos yet yeah,
but don't you feel that we'rewe're losing it a hundred
percent?

Speaker 2 (45:29):
and I think that's the whole thing about christian
nationalism and all these youngmen who are disaffected, you
know, like the groiper crew andall that?
They feel that it's been takenaway.
It's been taken away the, thedecency, the wholesomeness, the
american dream, um, what itmeans to fall in love with a

(45:53):
young beautiful lady and getmarried in a church and have a
family and buy a home and buy astation wagon.
All that's been taken away.
And so in the book, christianPatriot, the first half is a
crash course in the theology ofChristian politics, and I wrote
this book for a general audience.
I want, like the people whowatch Tucker Carlson and you

(46:18):
know that that crowd to read it.
So in the book this is thefirst book I've ever written
where I'm not just like, by theway, I'm a Catholic, I'm a
Catholic tuned into a Catholic.

Speaker 3 (46:28):
I think the title is brilliant Christian.

Speaker 2 (46:30):
I'm going.
I'm going for the wideraudience, and here's the
audience People who realize thatMAGA is just about done.
In 10 years no one's going tobe talking about MAGA and no
one's going to be talking aboutDonald Trump.
Probably in five years no one'sgoing to be talking about MAGA
or Donald Trump.
So what does the conservativemovement look like and what are

(46:54):
we conserving?
Are we conserving Israel?
Are we conserving tax policies?
Are we conserving wars, or dowe want the conservative
movement to become Christ-likewholesome?
No more degeneracy, no more ofthis nastiness.
And so the rest this really 60%of the book is 12 steps to

(47:14):
create one nation under God.
And those 12 steps I give thatyou can implement yourself, to
begin to change the culture inyour own life, the culture in
your home, culture in yourcommunity and hopefully, over
time, to snowball that into theculture of your people.
And so the book is educationalin the first half, but then the

(47:38):
rest of the book is extremelypractical.
So there's a chapter on abortion, there's a chapter on
pornography.
There's a chapter on usury anddebts and finances.
There's a chapter on marriage,the definition of marriage from
a natural law point of view,christian point of view.
There's a chapter on just war.

(48:03):
Like you can't just declare waron people, like we Christians
actually have a theology of howyou declare war and there are
conditions that Augustine and StAugustine list in obvious
detail.
And we need to live in acountry where, when there is a
conflict, the people who areChristians hold up the list of
Augustine and Thomas Aquinas andsay, if it doesn't meet all of

(48:26):
these, we're not doing war,we're not going to war.
And so there's a chapter onthat.
So basically, 12 areas in ourown lives, in our family lives,
in the national life, how we cantransform.
And of course it begins withourselves and our conversion,
our love for Jesus Christ, ourrepentance for our sins, but how
we begin to transform thosethings.

(48:48):
So I think this book will makea big splash.
I think it's going to educate alot of Catholics, but also a
lot of Protestants and maybejust your general conservative
MAGA person who knows thereneeds to be something more fiery
within the heart of theconservative and that fire has
to be the Holy Ghost.

Speaker 3 (49:08):
Yeah, it's interesting, especially with the
MAGA movement, right, I thinksome of we I mean I was like
really swept up in it beforethis election and then, man I,
as time goes on, I'm just moreand more just like, like he came
.
He came in telling us we weregoing to end the war in Ukraine.
He told us we were going to endthe far away.
And I'm watching the MiddleEast blowing up and I'm watching

(49:31):
Ukraine and Russia still goingout.
I mean he's talking with putinnow, but it just all of it just
seems like there's no, there'sno purpose behind what they're
doing.
I thought bringing doge in wasgoing to really get the spending
under control, but they arespending money.
It's insane, the things thatwe're allowing to to go out our
money go to, and there's not areal movement to actually fix

(49:55):
the mess that we're in right now.
It seems like they're puttingsome band-aids on it and slowing
.
You know it was.
It was in free fall under Bidenand them, but I really don't
see it like any real attempt tofix this stuff.
So I I think it does have tostart in in the home and then
building in your, in yourcommunity, and it has to.

(50:16):
It's going to take some time toto to fix this stuff.

Speaker 4 (50:22):
I guess my question is do you, do you think there's
time for us to to do thissnowball under, like our current
society and in government or inthe book.

Speaker 2 (50:35):
I explain why.
In christian patriot I explainwhy we do and the reason for
that is I think we still do havea global critical mass and I
think christianity is verystrong in the world.
I think we're on our back heelin the United States of America.
I think we maybe have 30 yearsto implement this and if we

(51:01):
don't, then yeah, we're donehere in the United States.
Canada is a little furtherahead of us as well, but I think
we do.
I honestly have an optimismabout that and a big part of
that.
You know.
There's a whole chapter in thebook on demographics and birth
rates and I think and I talked alot with PBD about this I'm
glad PBD wanted to go therebecause if you just look at

(51:23):
birth rates, my demographics aredestiny.
Math does not lie.
If women are having 1.4children per woman, you have to
have 2.1 to stay Just tomaintain Right.
And then you start doing themath and the projections.
Even if you get under down to1.4, the amount of babies you

(51:44):
have to start having just to getback to 2.1, it starts grinding
.
It's kind of like compoundinginterest, like it gets really,
really hard when you startlooking at the math and when I
was on pbd we were talking about, okay, how many, how many?
You know, there's the muslimbirth rate and the mormon birth
rate and the protestant birthrate and all that, and we were

(52:04):
putting them up on the screentalking about and I said, hold
up, put traditional catholic onthere.
And so they ran.
The AI.
Traditional Catholic is aboutfour kids per woman.
We win, it's over.
We win.
You just extrapolate that outabout 120 years if we keep those
numbers and it's like acomplete global takeover.
We keep our kids in mass.

(52:26):
Keep our kids going.
Yeah, and that's just a fact.
That's just mathematics.
Right now, if the Muslims start, I think they're at three
something, three, four, three,six If they do that, and then we
back off and our women's are,you know, snapping their.
I'm not having no babies, andall this.
I'm a strong, independente-girl.
Well, we're done, yeah.

(52:49):
Dependent e girl Well, we'redone.
Yeah, um, somebody's asking uh,demographics and birth rates is
other than personal conversionand keeping your family
conformed to Jesus Christ and inthe teaching of the church.
You know of the 12 chapters inChristian Patriot, that's
probably the most indicative ofwhere you're going to go is

(53:10):
birth rates and I think inprobably by the time we start
dying, um, you're going to startseeing large communities of
muslims, catholics, mormons andeven the.
The amish have a great birthrate as well.
These liberals who are sort of,you know, driving on the fumes

(53:33):
of the boomer success, they'renot even having one child per
woman, like it's.

Speaker 4 (53:40):
Demographics aside, they're going to go away.
The Muslim birth rate isfalling too.
It is.

Speaker 2 (53:46):
And I looked it up.
Islam teaches that you canabort up into the first
trimester.
Abortion allowed in the firsttrimester and they allow coitus
interruptus.

Speaker 3 (53:59):
Yeah, yeah.
Well, this is especially whenthey come to America.
Right, they come to America,they start getting into the
American lifestyle and they justkind of become part of the
American culture, to theAmerican lifestyle, and they
just kind of become part of theAmerican culture.

Speaker 4 (54:09):
The religion allows it, they can do whatever they
want, as long as it's to gainpower in the end.
So if they feel they have toabort and contracept to become
American to gain power, islamallows it.

Speaker 2 (54:21):
Well, it's interesting Turkey and United
Arab Emirates they already havea sub-two birth rate, so you can
see an entire Islamic cultureand nation can go under two
births per woman, and so Ireally, I really think that's
probably our grandchildren orgreat grandchildren is is

(54:41):
watching the birth rates andseeing the collapse in Islam.

Speaker 3 (54:46):
Yeah, yeah, but it's interesting.
We're talking about America,right, Like because America is a
different animal than thanEurope and Canada, specifically
because, as as much as we thinkthere's, you know, Christianity
is is on on the decline.
In America it's.
We still are a Christian nationto a degree, you know, a

(55:08):
Protestant nation to a degree,and Catholicism has a pretty
significant presence here, where, I think in the UK and in
France, there's almost arevulsion to Christianity, and
especially in Canada.
Man, I wonder what the heck isgoing on up in Canada with their
, with their maid program, theirmedical assistant.

Speaker 4 (55:28):
I think they said five percent of deaths in canada
right now or from assistedsuicide it's, it's heartbreaking
because canada was so catholic,it was french catholic and it's
just so.

Speaker 3 (55:40):
I do think, because I you know, you talk to guys like
calvin robinson and they'relike no, no, america is the last
hole.
It's like the you guys are thelast, stand for everything.
Because it's over in europe,like the, the battle is lost.
Islam has completely moved.
They're basically just waitingin europe for there to be a, an

(56:00):
islamic revolution over there Ithink it.

Speaker 4 (56:04):
I think it's gonna be the opposite.
I think europe is is almostdone.
You're right, there's not a lotof hope left.
But when they realize that,when your average German
realizes that, I think thingsare going to get ugly and it's
going to be an uprising of youraverage European and

(56:25):
historically that turns out tobe pretty violent in Europe.

Speaker 2 (56:27):
You've got a point, Rob historically, that turns out
to be pretty violent in europe.
When you got a point, rob, Imean europeans, aka white people
pretty tolerant and prettychill, but when their backs up
against the wall, they're prettymuch the most savage warriors
and it's kind of scary ascatholics because we want them

(56:48):
obviously to save their nations,but there are costs that are
too high, you know, at leastfrom a Catholic perspective,
when it comes to just war andthings like that.

Speaker 4 (56:57):
So it's scary even from that perspective.

Speaker 2 (57:01):
Yeah, I don't know.
I'm a little bit morepessimistic about Europe.
I was in Italy.

Speaker 3 (57:12):
Oh, I want to ask you about that.

Speaker 2 (57:12):
Yeah, I mean it's.
I would say five years ago,when I was in rome, every single
waiter I had was a young,energetic italian guy, like a
likable guy.
I'm gonna tip this guy big.
You know good italian guys thatare funny and speak broken
Italian, but you know they'retrying really hard and hustling.
I'll tell you what man in 20,in the big two five 2025, I

(57:36):
think nine out of 10 of mywaiters.
I don't know what ethnicitythey were, but they were Brown,
yeah, and they were speakingItalian broken Italian, but it
wasn't.
It was like I don't know indianor I don't know what these guys
were.
I didn't ask, but I was likeit's so weird that all of these
amazing italian restaurants thatI've been going to for years,
these are not young italian menworking here anymore, like what

(57:58):
the hell just happened in rome.
That's rome, that's not paris.

Speaker 3 (58:03):
I'm telling you, I went.
I went in december and I wasinundated.
When you're in rome with themselling you the stupid phone
chargers, that's been happeningfor like 10 years.

Speaker 2 (58:17):
But yeah, that probably wasn't there 15 or 20
years ago, but that's been therefor like 10 years.
But that's like street vendorsand gypsies.
They're working in goodrestaurants.

Speaker 3 (58:26):
Is that like the stands at the mall?
Like the stands at the mall?
Yeah, they're just.
I just couldn't believe how,how few italians I was seeing.
It was interesting, but it wasmy first time going to italy, so
I had nothing to compare it to.
But, um, how well, uh, was thisyour, your kids, first time
going, or you, because you tookyour whole family this time?

(58:46):
Right, we took the whole family.

Speaker 2 (58:49):
We, I took the whole family.
We led a pilgrimage in 2016.
I took, and the whole familywas that time.
That time too.
So I've been a number, I'vebeen tons, but yeah, this was a
family pilgrimage.
My we, we kind of stopped.
We would go to rome like everyyear or two, and then, you know,

(59:12):
when pope francis, after like2017, 8 I guess the last time we
went was 2019 we were like Ijust don't want to go to
audiences like that's a coolpart of going to rome.
You know, like it's going to thepapal events and we just didn't
want to go.
So like as soon as leo waselected, like within weeks, my
wife's like we've got to go torome, we're done.
I don't know, I don't know.

(59:33):
And she's like let's booktickets.
And I'm like all right, bookthe tickets, let's go so what's
so funny is I?

Speaker 3 (59:39):
because I went to my first papal audience but it was
under francis and I was.
It was empty.
When I tell you empty, it wasnobody there.
Okay, I'm front row and I'mfive feet from the Pope and I'm
like, had to be this Pope man.
It was just such a letdown.

Speaker 2 (59:55):
Let me tell you, under Leo it is so crowded.
I've been to papal audiencesunder Benedict Francis and Leo
and this is the biggest I'veever seen man.
Oh really Massive, insane,super Bowl levels, biggest I've
ever seen man.
Oh, really massive, like, yeah,insane, like super bowl levels.

(01:00:16):
So there's a lot of hype andyou know what's amazing is, I
would say, so many people I met.
These people audiences wereeuropeans.

Speaker 3 (01:00:19):
Yeah, they wanted to come down to rome and see the
new pope yeah, let's hope thenew pope, you know, because
we're talking about the latinmass and all that stuff.
But man, the, to me there'snothing more.
There's no more cripplingmessage that francis delivered
than open borders stuff, becauseit's it's basically allowing

(01:00:45):
your christian nation to betaken over by invaders, right,
right, and you're like whateverremnants of Christendom could
have been left and helped.
And he took this, this messageof being merciful to to the
stranger and stuff like that,but without even a thought of
the consequence or it was acompletely intentional thought
of the consequences, but it was.

Speaker 4 (01:01:07):
It's the thing that is going to undo whatever
christian it would have beenlike pies, the fifth letting in
the turkish fleet you know wellthat's the thing is.

Speaker 2 (01:01:16):
We've had so many popes preach against that, yeah,
and so for francis to preach infavor of it is a scandal yeah,
I think it's a demographicreplacement.
I know we're not supposed tosay that, but it's a demographic
replacement of europe but it itunder look.

Speaker 3 (01:01:34):
So I think one time when you came out you've been on
several times now, but one ofthe times we were talking about
just because when I came tounderstand the importance of the
liturgical changes.
Right, like all of Christian,europe is built upon the mass,
and the mass is this thing thatactually builds the civilization

(01:01:55):
up.
So, like when they have theseliturgical changes, that's one
thing that uproots the entireCatholic culture.
It gets rid of people's senseof a Catholic identity.
We lose all of our traditionsand devotions that we had.
So then, to, on top of that,open your borders up to these
foreigners that come in likewhatever remnants of a culture

(01:02:16):
that we had as Catholics tocontinue to form our children in
the next generation, I thinkit's the worst crime of the
Francis Papacy.
It's worse than any of therestrictions and any of the
appointments.
It was this idea that it's,that your identity as a Catholic
isn't big enough of a deal tomake sure you preserve it and

(01:02:37):
pass it on.

Speaker 2 (01:02:39):
Yeah, it's just to use the analogy.
It's just like if, uh, you know, you just allow people to come
into your house and start takingit over.

Speaker 3 (01:02:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:02:50):
And you're like.
Well, we have to do that.

Speaker 3 (01:02:54):
It's the Christian way.
Oh man, Taylor, you got anotherlike 20, 20, 25 minutes to hang
.
I want to go over to locals andtalk Israel.

Speaker 2 (01:03:02):
If you don't mind.
Okay, before I do that,christianpatriotbookcom.
That's the pre-order.
I want everybody to order it.
Order three copies.
We want to hit the new yorktimes bestseller list.
I really want to move theoverton window to change the
discussion out.
You know, when maga fizzles outand trump is gone, our

(01:03:23):
conservative movement needs tobe based on patria, patriotism,
christianity, the fatherland.
We have to understand thattheology and then we have to
implement that theology, and Iknow of no other book that does
that.
This is the book christianpatriot 12 ways to create one
nation under god.
Pre-order it.
There's signed copies.

(01:03:43):
Um, there's going to be alimited run.
Harrison butker wrote theforeword and there's a very cool
we're going to have.
Um, I'm going to sign them andHarrison are going to sign them.
So if you want to learn moreabout that, go to
ChristianPatriotBookcom.
And we just want to make a bigsplash the week of September 2nd
and get this book into thehands of Tucker Carlson.

Speaker 3 (01:04:07):
That's what I was going to say I would love to see
you Because've seen a couple ofcatholics go on tucker carlson.
We just saw a guy go on there,a protestant go on there to talk
about the straddle.
We saw bishop baron on there.
I would love to see a dr taylormarshall on there.
Man, there's one.
There's one thing, oh, and bythe way, somebody just asked if,
uh, locals will be free fortaylor marshall mods, mods.

(01:04:27):
We'll leave the entire localsfree today.
So anybody that wants to watchthe after show, we won't put it
behind a paywall.
Just go, just join our localsand you'll see.

Speaker 2 (01:04:37):
You do have to buy the book you do have to buy the
book.

Speaker 3 (01:04:39):
Yes, there was such an interesting moment when
Bryson Gray, you and him had aconversation and it was right
after Barron was on with BenShapiro, and Barron was talking
about the you know, the VaticanSecond Vatican Council talks
about Catholicism being theprivileged way, or Jesus being

(01:05:00):
the privileged way, and it waslike such a watering down of
beige Catholicism that Barronwas presenting.
And you went on and had aconversation with Bryson Gray
and he asked you very difficultquestions.
You were just like, yeah,there's no salvation outside the
church.
It was such a breath of freshair to watch that conversation.
Man, all right, so go buyChristian Patriot Taylor

(01:05:25):
Marshall's book.
I know there's not a singleperson that subscribes to us
that doesn't already subscribeto Taylor's YouTube channel, but
go check out the new St ThomasInstitute.
Um, that's also an awesomeresource.
Um, yeah, marshall and Roganwould be pretty awesome too.
Um, is it?
And uh, yeah, just go buy hisbook.
We always got to support our,our, our, our fellow travelers

(01:05:46):
in this arena.
It's not just I don't.

Speaker 2 (01:05:48):
I don't necessarily need the support.
I want our culture to change.
I don't want to generosity, Idon't want to trans, I don't
want people chopping off theirgenitals.
I want our kids, you know, tolive in a culture that's
beautiful and true and wholesome, and and we have to do
something like it's faith andworks.
At this point, we gotta, wegotta do the works.

(01:06:09):
So I think that's why it'sreally important, like it's a
critical time, and we need amovement of people who you know
the next movement might?
It's not going to be MAGA,let's make it, christ, you know
like yeah, yeah, yeah.
We need the Protestants to be onboard, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:06:25):
Yeah, it's fertile ground.
It's funny they were bleedingCatholics out of the church for
so long, but I think they're alittle worried that we're
starting to pull them back intoour scene.
So I think the internet had abig part in that.
So, all right, I want to askTaylor about our older brothers.

Speaker 2 (01:06:44):
Israel 1948.
Israel at Locals Now let's doit.

Speaker 3 (01:06:48):
Yeah, all right, so we'll add on over there.
It will be free.
So if anybody wants to check itout, you just.
You don't have to pay for it.
It won't be behind a paywall.
We're going to head over there.
I think it's over, rob.

Speaker 4 (01:06:58):
I'm doing right now, almost done.
Okay, all right, all, right,okay, all right, okay, all right
.

Speaker 3 (01:07:11):
so, man, there's been such a change in the
conversation around this topic,especially over the last couple
of years, right, and one of mybiggest disappointments in trump
has been seeing him just kindof bend over backwards to
appease Israel.
And I mean, I've heard youspeak a bunch about

(01:07:33):
dispensationalism and stuff likethat, but do you see anything
apocalyptic about them evenbeing allowed to gather back as
a people in this land after God?
I mean, he allows the temple tobe destroyed.
He disperses them throughoutthe nation.
Even the fact that they comeback there, isn't that like a
very significant event?

Speaker 2 (01:07:54):
It's prophetic, but it's bad prophetic, like that's
where we disagree with thedispensationalists.
The dispensationalists are likeoh, they're coming back, like
this is so amazing.
Give them money.
And, from the Catholic point ofview, I wrote a book a couple
of years ago called Antichristand Apocalypse.
That's a sign of the Antichrist.

Speaker 3 (01:08:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:08:12):
The red heifer building the temple, world
jewelry, all of that I mean.
The church fathers say that theend times religion enforced by
the Antichrist is Judaism and hewill require Saturday Sabbath
keeping.
He will get rid of all the godsof the nations A lot of people

(01:08:33):
think the the antichrist isgoing to have like this
ecumenical powwow where there'slike Shiva and Allah and Jesus
and like all these differentpantheon of gods.
The church fathers, based on aprophecy in Daniel, say that he
will get rid of all idols, allgods, and he is going to impose
a form of global jewelry andhe's going to also get rid of

(01:08:56):
baptism and the mass and thepriesthood and all that.
Because why he says he is theMessiah, antichrist means,
instead of the Messiah, he isgoing to say I am the Messiah, I
am the king, I am God.
Worship me in the temple here,I I fulfill everything moses and
the prophets said, and he willdeceive people.
Yeah, and this is whydispensationalism is so

(01:09:19):
dangerous, as they're tellingpeople to prepare for this as if
it's good yeah, it's.

Speaker 3 (01:09:25):
There's something happening right now where I kind
of see America as the new Rome,with its tentacles throughout
the world and doing all thesethings, and it just looks like
Israel is the whore riding thebeast and it's like I'm like
it's the only image I can seethat that makes sense of

(01:09:48):
everything.
I can see that that makes senseof everything and it's like the
they, because everybody keepsthe way this conversation seems
to be happening Isn't reallytheological.
I see everybody talking aboutall the Jews and they're talking
about it Usually and they'retalking and it's like, yeah, I
get all that stuff, but I'mlooking at it on a story level
of Christianity and when I readthe apocalypse and I see the

(01:10:09):
persecution of the saints in theend, I feel like that
persecution is going to comefrom the, the jews, and and it
seems like this is what ishappening, like they're getting
geared up for this yeah, I meanthe epoch.

Speaker 2 (01:10:23):
The book of revelation talks about the
synagogue of satan and if youread the description of the
whore of Babylon in the book ofRevelation, it's based on the
description, sometimes word forword, of the description of
Jerusalem as a whore and as aharlot.
Jerusalem Jerusalem, isdescribed as the whore.

(01:10:45):
Why?
Because Jerusalem was the wifeand the bride and the consort of
Yahweh and he was married toher in a covenant and he gave
her a home called the promisedland, just like we do for our
wives.
And it says that she lustedafter the genitals of the other
nations this is very graphiclanguage in the Old Testament

(01:11:07):
and that she slept with himunder every tree and she acted
like a whore.
But she was such a whore shedidn't even take money because
she enjoyed it.
All of this is in the oldTestament.
Yeah Right, very graphic.
Of the of the, the whore wife,the, the adulterous wife of
Yahweh, is re described in thebook of Revelation.
So when people say, oh, the isre-described in the book of

(01:11:28):
Revelation.
So when people say, oh, theCatholic church is the whore of
Babylon, no, no, no.
The whore of Babylon isapostate Jerusalem.

Speaker 1 (01:11:35):
Yeah but I also One more thing, one more thing, yeah
, yeah, for sure.

Speaker 2 (01:11:39):
When Christ, our Lord and Savior, is standing before
the Sanhedrin and the highpriest and they're interrogating
him and he says I tell you, youshall see the son of man riding
upon the clouds.
Right, the high priest tearshis vestments, which moses says
you're not allowed to tearvestments, it's a sin.
He tears his vestments and theysay we have no king but caesar.

(01:12:02):
That's like your wife saying Ihave no husband but my boss at
work.
Yeah, they denied theirmarriage to Yahweh, to God, and
they instead said our king is aRoman, idol-worshiping,
debauched Roman emperor, andthey walked out of the house of

(01:12:27):
their husband.
And so if you understand theold Testament and you read
Isaiah, jeremiah and Ezekiel theminor prophets as well and
Daniel, you read those fourbooks and then you read the book
of revelation.
It is scandalous because youunderstand everything being told
in the book of revelation.

Speaker 3 (01:12:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:12:46):
And.

Speaker 3 (01:12:47):
John is telling us right that this beast will rise
again, right?
So there's this period wherethe devil is restrained and the
kingdom spreads throughout theearth, but that beast is going
to rise again.
And I can't help but think,especially when you see the
things that were going on withUSAID and us using like America,

(01:13:08):
going into overturnedgovernments and foment
revolution.
It's like America's got itstenets.
It's worse than the RomanEmpire ever could have been.
It's more evil than anything.
And then you just see it.
You see Israel like colludingwith America.
And then you see the figuresfrom the church even getting

(01:13:29):
involved with it, because I dothink there will.
I don't think the church couldever be the whore of Babylon.
I'm saying there's going to beelements of collusion, just like
the high priest and theSanhedrin colluding with maybe
Judas Iscariot working.
Yeah, yeah, yeah it's so wildthat people could could leave
the faith when they see thisstuff.

(01:13:50):
Because to me, I'm just likethis is we are watching the
story unfold before our eyesright now and, if anything, it
should increase your faithBecause, man, it's so wild how
this is actually playing outbefore us right now and I don't
know what that means.
I don't know if this is ahundred year process and I do
especially like what you'resaying like um, with even um

(01:14:14):
building something that comesafter, like this could be a, a
type of of the end, and thenthere's something that comes
after that could be the reign ofour lady, the reign of the
immaculate heart of mary couldcome.
So there's several differentthings that could happen, but I
do see the story playing out infront of us right now.

Speaker 2 (01:14:31):
Yeah, we could.
This could be a minortribulation that leads to the
reign of our lady, or this isthe end.
I'm open.
I've talked to father Ripperabout this and you know, I think
he leans a little bit moretowards this could be the minor
tribulation, but he's also likethis could be it as well.

(01:14:53):
But here's the thing Even if itis the end, we still have to
live our faith the same way.
We still have to love ourenemies.
We have to love our enemies.
We have to love those who hateJesus Christ and those who hate
us.
But we still have to buildcultures and we still have to
build our family to whatever wecan.
You know.

(01:15:14):
But if you know, this reallygood looking, persuasive guy
gets elected after Netanyahu andthey start building the temple
and he starts like enthroninghimself in there and all that.
I'm moving out to the farm andI'm not coming back.
Man, you're not going to see meever again.

Speaker 3 (01:15:35):
It's like look, the Antichrist will be the Jewish
Messiah, and so much of theconversation I'm seeing is like
getting into the minutia of how.
Look, there's this enmity thathas been built up over 2000
years.
It's played out in the OldTestament through every story,
from Jacob and Esau to Cain andAbel, and it's always this

(01:15:58):
description of the birthrightsupposed to go to the older
brother and it ends up going tothe younger brother.
And that's what actuallyhappens where Israel is God's
firstborn son and the covenantgoes to the Gentiles and to the
nations.
And there's this enmity that'sbuilt up over the course of 2000
years because everywhere theJews go, they wind up butting
heads with the Catholics andthey have to get thrown out of

(01:16:21):
the nation.
They in history because theyare gathered back into the land
of Israel and I just think Goddestroys the temple and, as a
judgment upon them, dispersesthem from the Holy Land.

(01:16:43):
So for them to be allowed toingather back in there seems
like a very significant part ofthe story.
To ingather back in there seemslike a very significant part of
the story.
And I think people and when yousee the christians the freaking
zionist christians aren't,they're the scariest people on
it.
They scare me more than anybodybecause they misunderstand the
story so much that they thinkthis is a fulfillment in a

(01:17:06):
positive way, and these peopleare absolutely out of their
minds.

Speaker 2 (01:17:10):
Yeah, you nailed it.
I mean, that is the problemright there and it's a
theological problem.
Yeah, ted Cruz says these kindof things, or Lindsey Graham or
any of these people.
It's a theological problem andI honestly believe if that's
your theology, you will bedeceived and you will follow the

(01:17:31):
Antichrist.

Speaker 3 (01:17:33):
Yeah, it's like the Antichrist will be greeted by
throngs of heretics and you justsee all of those heretics being
formed right now.
They're all like, oh, let'sbuild that.
I see videos every day of youjust had.
This whole group of of likeAmerican politicians went to

(01:17:53):
Israel and they sat there andthey talked about building a
third temple and I'm just likethese people are completely out
of their freaking minds and Idon't know.
To me, I sit back and when Iwatch these conversations it's
like it should never lead tohatred of a people.
It should just make you kind ofreflect on the story a bit and

(01:18:14):
say, man, this is a verysignificant thing that's
happening right now.

Speaker 2 (01:18:18):
Yeah, and I want to touch on a lot of people say
well, how do you know that theAntichrist can be Jewish?
People don't like that.
They want the Antichrist to beBarack Obama or Donald Trump.
Yeah A, all the church fatherssay the Antichrist to be Barack
Obama or Donald Trump.
Yeah, Um, a, all the churchfathers say the Antichrist can
be Jewish.
In my book Antichrist andBacchus, I chronicle every
single one of the footnotes, Ifyou want to see it there it is.
But also I think you said it,Anthony do you think that the

(01:18:42):
Jewish people on earth are goingto Christ means Messiah?
They're going to accept asMessiah a Chinaman or a Muslim,
Half white, half black.
Barack Obama oh, he's theJewish Messiah.
No, they're only going toaccept a Jewish Messiah.
Like the Antichrist, has to beJewish.

Speaker 3 (01:19:04):
Yeah, and their idea of it's the same reason they
didn't accept christ.
It's because, as soon as jesusgoes and starts talking to the
gentiles, they're they'recompletely scandalized by it.
Right, the?
The idea that the covenant canbe shared with the gentiles is
so scandalous to them.
They don't want a covenant withthe gentiles, they want to rule

(01:19:28):
the world in the name of Israel.
They want Israel to rule theworld.
And I'm sorry, but they doBecause, look, I work around a
lot of different types of peoplein New York City, right, so
I'll work in black areas, I'llwork in Spanish areas, but when
I work in Jewish areas, I feeltheir hatred.

(01:19:49):
They hate you.
if you are not one of them, I'llwork in Spanish areas but when
I work in Jewish areas, I feeltheir hatred Like they hate you
if you are not one of them andit's probably seen you online,
so it might be because I'mItalian, but no, it's like if
you're not one of them, there'sthis hatred built in them.
So, just seeing how theirvision of a messiah is a

(01:20:09):
conquering messiah, they, theydon't want a a.
They don't want what god had instore for us, which was, you
know, the lion will lay downwith the lamb.
It's just, it's not what theywanted.

Speaker 2 (01:20:22):
So and we do have a conquering messiah, but he
conquers in a different way.
He conquers through love,forgiveness and martyrdom.
Yes, that's how we conquer ascatholics, and um, we have to be
that people, even if theypersecute us that's gonna that's

(01:20:43):
gonna be the tricky part um,seeing as where many of the
early zionists?

Speaker 4 (01:20:55):
Yeah, seeing as where many of the early Zionists
originate geographically.

Speaker 2 (01:20:57):
Do you think it can be said that Zionism is one of
the errors of Russia?
Yes, yeah, oh, that'sinteresting.
We can't get too far into that,but definitely the overthrow of
the Russian monarchy had a verylarge Jewish contingent to it
had a very large jewishcontingent to it.

Speaker 3 (01:21:13):
So I never even thought of thought of it from
that angle.
But, um, yeah, I just man, Idon't know.
These are very interestingtimes we're living in and, you
know, for those of us who havechildren, like you, I want to
always remain hopeful for mychildren and for the future.
So I'm glad you wrote this book.
Like what?
What is your thought processwhen you write?
Because the last couple of likeyou wrote this book.
Like what?
What is your thought processwhen you write?
Because the last couple of likeyou wrote infiltration and then

(01:21:33):
I was waiting for like aninfiltration part two or
something it's like.
And then you know you wrotesomething on the apocalypse and
then you decided, no, I'm gonnawrite something on christian
patriot.
Like what's your thoughtprocess when you go into book
mode?

Speaker 2 (01:21:45):
I honestly just I'm like I'm writing two books right
now.
I just write, write what I like, just write what I like.
You know, and that's how you,if you're going to write a lot
of books, you have to do it thatway, cause it's such a I mean
it is.
It is laborious and it's hardand your eyes hurt and you get
headaches, and you know it's.
It is a hard thing to do, butit's so.
If you don't like it, you'renot going to do it.

Speaker 3 (01:22:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:22:07):
And in a way I kind of jokingly tell people they're
like why didn't you ever write asequel to Infiltration?
I'm like I did.
It's called Antichrist andApocalypse.

Speaker 3 (01:22:17):
That's the sequel.

Speaker 2 (01:22:18):
Oh man.

Speaker 3 (01:22:21):
Yeah, look, we're in some very interesting times,
Taylor.
I'm always grateful when yougive us time to come and hang
with us, man.

Speaker 2 (01:22:28):
Absolutely.
I love your show.
You guys are blowing up man.
You got on X and here, man, youguys are putting out good stuff
.

Speaker 3 (01:22:36):
I'm very, very grateful that you'd say that.
Man, Honestly, somebody madethe comment, like when they
blame you for everything andthey were like, hey, taylor
Marshall's called AvoidingBabylonics.
There's a very big degree towhich that's true, because
watching your show made me wantto do it.
You know like it was.
It was watching your podcast.

(01:22:57):
I was like, oh man, I want toget into that, I wanted to be a
part of the conversation.
So then to actually what?
Like when it came full circleand I got you on, it was a
really, really you wanted to bepart of the company.
You really you of all people ohman, it's always fun talking
with you, dr taylor marshall.

Speaker 2 (01:23:14):
Thank you rob anthony , keep up the great work.
Hey, thanks for that.
That fun intro too.

Speaker 3 (01:23:20):
Shout out to taffy, that was fun I'm so glad you,
because I I did send it to himbefore the show.
I was like are you okay withthis?
I wasn't sure.
And wait, I have to saysomething.
We're on Locals.
Every so often you guys willsee a tweet from me that may

(01:23:42):
come from Taylor.
I'm not saying which tweets,but maybe there are times where
Taylor might want to saysomething I don't think I can
get this out.
He'll slip into me, knowing Ican't help myself, and I'll fire
him up.

Speaker 4 (01:23:57):
But for the record everyone, it is not.
They're definitely notAnthony's worst tweets.
Those are all.

Speaker 2 (01:24:03):
Anthony, if they're real bad, those aren't.

Speaker 3 (01:24:08):
They're always funny, funny, but they're always just
like, yeah, he doesn't want toget caught up in the riffraff so
much so but he knows, if heslips it my way, I just can't
help myself and I'll throw itout there.

Speaker 4 (01:24:17):
So um, my favorite is when you ask him if you can use
something and then two secondslater you text back ah, too late
, I just did it anyways I justlike making people laugh man.

Speaker 3 (01:24:30):
Honestly, I think a big part of what's lacking in
Catholicism today is people haveto lighten up a little bit.
We've got to laugh about stuff.
It is part of my job to try tobring some humor to the arena.
We'll let you go, Taylor.

Speaker 2 (01:24:48):
Thank you so much for coming on, man.
Thank you very much.
God bless Godspeed.
Keep it up.
Take us out, Rob.

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