The Death of Anglicanism and the Rise of Gen Z (and Dire Wolves)

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Sancte, sancte, amare morti.
Decadastros In tes per a verum.
Babies wear diapers and I'm nota baby.

(00:34):
And you're wearing a diaper.
Well, babies wear diapers andyou're wearing a diaper.
Well, I'm not a baby.
Yes, you are.
No, I'm not.
I mean that you're wearing ababy.
Yes, you are.
No, I'm not, I mean it.
You're wearing a diaper.
I'm not a baby.

(00:54):
I'm not a baby, though.
Yes, you're wearing a diaper.
Well, I'm not a baby.
I'm not.
Well, I'm not even a baby,though, but you're wearing a
diaper.

Speaker 2 (01:14):
You can't say but that's not a word, I didn't say
real, but Just because but justfor kids, dude, this freaking
video is too funny, man, itneeds to grow up live, uh, live.

(01:35):
View of dave smith talking withuh douglas murray right there
okay, yeah because, murrayprobably has to never mind got
to tweet that.

Speaker 3 (01:43):
That is a gem of a tweet.
That is a gem of a tweet.
You have to post that video andsay live video of Douglas
Murray arguing with Dave Smith.

Speaker 2 (01:53):
Yes, douglas Murray, so accurate.

Speaker 4 (01:56):
That kid could be a senator.
He's a good debater.

Speaker 3 (02:00):
It's just funny because so many people
misunderstood.
Like I said, this is everyargument between a man and a
woman for all the time, and thewomen were jumping in and they
were like, but she's right,that's not the point.
Anyway, she's the one thatliterally made the claim she

(02:20):
laid the terms.
So she says babies wear diapersand I'm not a baby, but you're
wearing a diaper.
But I'm not a baby, but you'rewearing a diaper, I'm not even a
baby.
Then she appeals to emotion.
She says you can't say body's abad word.

(02:42):
She pokes him too.
Yeah, she pokes him.
It's just every fight with awoman it's my.
Me and my wife have had fightswhere we can be arguing about an
issue and then I'm wrongbecause I said something I
shouldn't have.
Not about the issue itself.
I was right about the issue,but I said something I shouldn't
have and that now becomes theargument.

(03:02):
Yeah, you said something Ishouldn't have and that now
becomes the argument.
Yeah, you said but I didn'tmean, but that's how it'd be, oh
, women, you're so sick.
So we are, we okay.
So for anybody that is new tothe show and does not know who
Connor is, connor is a longtimefriend of the show.

(03:23):
When Rob and I started thepodcast, Connor was in a group
with us.
It was us Connor, angela,erickson and Tradman, jason and
Mark.

Speaker 2 (03:37):
That traitor, jason, tonight, can you believe him?

Speaker 3 (03:40):
Yeah, he's going on the podcast.
We asked him for a whole month.

Speaker 2 (03:43):
Can you do trivia this night, can you do?
No, I'm not available thatnight, and then suddenly he's
available on.
He's going on.
He asked me for a whole month,can you?
Can you do trivia this night?
Can you know I'm not availablethat night and then suddenly
he's available for Chriswhenever he wants.

Speaker 3 (03:50):
So he went on Crash.

Speaker 4 (03:54):
Cannon.

Speaker 5 (03:56):
What is that?

Speaker 4 (03:57):
It's a new show, I think.

Speaker 5 (03:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (03:59):
Yeah, there's a couple of like Gen Z kids that
watch our show and they'restarting podcasts.

Speaker 2 (04:06):
So we've been trying to help them out a little bit.
I think Chris is literally onlytwo years younger than me.

Speaker 5 (04:10):
That's not Gen Z, he's in his 40s.

Speaker 3 (04:13):
He's Rob's age, but I say Rob's Gen Z too.

Speaker 5 (04:20):
You're talking to two Gen Zers and you're calling Rob
one.

Speaker 3 (04:24):
Dude, my son.
Everybody's posting that videoof the kids going to see the
Pokemon.
You are such a boomer.
Yeah, minecraft.
I never played Minecraft.

Speaker 2 (04:40):
I never watched Pokemon either it came out right
when, at the age where I wastoo old for it, but I have
played it with my kids.
Dang, you are old Rob.

Speaker 5 (04:50):
I never cared for it, I never tried it.

Speaker 2 (04:53):
I saw the movie on opening night with the boys and
it was the absolute worst movieI've ever seen.
The script was written by AI,but AI from two years ago when
they wrote the script.

Speaker 1 (05:02):
So it was miserable, but you know what the boy the
like.

Speaker 2 (05:08):
The boys loved it and it wasn't woke, so whatever.

Speaker 3 (05:12):
I get Okay.
So my son goes at 10 30 atnight and the theater is loaded
with kids between like 15 and 23or 24.

Speaker 2 (05:23):
Like I was the oldest person in that movie theater,
by 10 years at least.

Speaker 3 (05:28):
He shows me videos.
Every single time Jack Blacksays a line, the theater erupts
and they repeat the line.
It is the weirdest, freakingthing I've ever seen.

Speaker 5 (05:39):
It's like the in-brain run what happened?
Don't they throw stuff too?

Speaker 4 (05:44):
Yeah, like popcorn and stuff around your ones.

Speaker 3 (05:46):
Yeah, but the police were called like screaming and
stuff like that.
Yeah, I did see like there wasvideo like somebody called the
cops and stuff like that.

Speaker 2 (05:55):
But like, yeah, the theater I went to, everyone
cheered, but that was it.

Speaker 3 (05:58):
No one threw anything well, my son said it's like it
was like the perfect nostalgiaberry.
You know it's like rememberberries, that's all.
It was like the perfectnostalgia Barry.
You know it's like rememberBarry, that's all it is.
It's just nostalgia for Gen Zkids who grew up playing
Minecraft and they get to go seethe stupid little references to
their childhood.

Speaker 2 (06:15):
It was kind of why Stranger Things worked for our
generation, at least initially.

Speaker 3 (06:20):
Stranger Things is a genuinely good show, though.

Speaker 2 (06:24):
Yes, that is true.
At least the first season was.

Speaker 3 (06:27):
I would say it's more like Sharknado oh god, not with
the nostalgia part, but it's sobad, it's good.
There's some cult classics thatare Just so horribly bad, but
you're like, this movie ruleshow the audience responds to
Jack Black as a Novus Ordopriest's dream.

Speaker 2 (06:44):
Some cult classics that are just so horribly bad.
But you're like this movierules.
You know How's the audienceresponse to Jack Black as a
Novus Ordo priest's dream.

Speaker 5 (06:52):
I'm always late to.
Whatever the thing is, you'renot missing much.
Connor, I'm always late or Inever get there, and I don't
care.

Speaker 4 (07:02):
I've always felt like the odd one out, because I grew
up watching john wayne and Istill watch john wayne.

Speaker 2 (07:07):
I'm just this old soul who has like you come on
our show with thursday and geekout about mash for exactly what
exactly?
So it's like I know whatminecraft is, my friends played
it, but I never played it.

Speaker 5 (07:20):
That's a good, good analogy yeah, yeah, I also have
watched mash.
Not all of it, but I've watcheda good amount.

Speaker 3 (07:30):
It's been a while later now, why did you watch
mash, though?
Like what, even like, so likewhen I was a kid when I was a
kid growing up.
Um, even in, like my, my myearly teen years to late teen
years, I would come home and onchannel 11, you would have
cheers, seinfeld like therewould be the Frazier and it
would be like a list of showsand then you get the honeymoon.

(07:51):
So like I've seen thehoneymooners every single
episode.
But that was because it wasjust on late night TV and I
would just be up watching it.
But, like, what made you guyswatch MASH?

Speaker 5 (08:00):
Well for me, I never had control over the remote.
I was the youngest of four, soI never had control of the
remote until high school.
So what I watched had nothingto do with me.

Speaker 4 (08:13):
Yeah, yeah, I.
It was essentially just myparents in the beginning.
My parents watched it and Ijust really enjoyed the story,
and as I got older I keptwatching it on my own, so much
so that I became such a mashnerd that for my high school
senior trip I drove up highwayone in california on the west
coast, and near the beginning ofhighway one is the original

(08:35):
mash film site on fox ranch.
So I went there for my uhgraduation trip and, uh, it was
amazing now isn't.

Speaker 3 (08:41):
Mash, doesn't take place in world war ii.
They make like naz Nazi jokesand stuff.

Speaker 5 (08:44):
The Korean War, oh the Korean War.
I never watched it.

Speaker 2 (08:48):
You're thinking of Hogan's Heroes.

Speaker 3 (08:49):
Hogan's Heroes and they make like Nazi jokes in it
and stuff.
Right, nick, who's your?

Speaker 5 (08:54):
favorite leader or superior officer.
We're not doing this.
We're not talking about MASHtonight.
I'm ending this conversationnow.
I've never seen the show.
You guys may as well bespeaking a different language.

Speaker 3 (09:11):
I have no desire to talk about match, I just want to
know one question uh, connor,um, yeah, I was gonna bring this
up let's be honest about whyyou had never had control of the
remote connor.
So well, connor, do you want toexplain, uh, that joke to
anybody that might not know?

Speaker 5 (09:26):
No, I want you to actually.

Speaker 3 (09:28):
No don't.

Speaker 6 (09:30):
I don't know the name of the condition I want to see
Anthony do it in the Chinesepriest accent Go.

Speaker 3 (09:37):
So because I've made the mistake of saying Connor has
no, but you have hands, butyour arms are right.
No, it's not, he has feet, Iknow you have feet, you.

Speaker 5 (09:47):
You are the only one who've actually met me in person
, so I'm concerned that youwould be the one not to get, not
to understand it.
That is true, I don't payattention to details.
Connor I'm a big picture guy.
You were just grumpy at me thatday.

Speaker 4 (10:04):
No, I wasn't yes, you were I'm a big picture kind of
guy.

Speaker 2 (10:10):
No, I think he was actually grumpy at margo that
day.

Speaker 5 (10:13):
That's what it was it wasn't, it was definitely
grumpy at me?

Speaker 3 (10:20):
no, I wasn't.
I was, uh, and I wasn't grumpyat Margo either.
It was just there was a lotgoing on at that conference it
was a grumpy day, but what isthe actual condition you have?

Speaker 5 (10:34):
doesn't have a name.
No, yeah, either does.
Anthony's are you going to tryand explain it more, or Rob
should really, because he's, uh,he's the one that feels
uncomfortable about it.

Speaker 2 (10:50):
I was like explain it to me because I don't know can
rob try would yeah, but youdon't have hands and you kind of
have feet kind of okay, I mean,you do have feet but they,
they're like why are you?
Doing this to me, man.

Speaker 3 (11:06):
Because it's funny.
So Connor's in a wheelchair andhe has no arms, or maybe he has
.
I thought you had short.
I have a little arm, so how doyou?
Let me ask you, though, how doyou operate your computer and
stuff?
Do you have a special way?

Speaker 2 (11:26):
Trust me, the bigger question that we all want to
know is how you operate yourcomputer and the answer is not
very well.
Oh brother.

Speaker 5 (11:37):
Well, the short answer is I have two Short.
Oh, so you use your feet forthat?
Yes, my feet act as hands okay,all right let's get off this
topic.

Speaker 3 (11:48):
Everybody's clearly uncomfortable with it.
I don't know why?

Speaker 2 (11:50):
so you never had to worry about having your elbows
on the table as a kid, huh no, Iguess not no ralph's like yeah,
I'm uncomfortable explainingthe condition, but I won't make
fun of it that's what I do.

Speaker 5 (12:03):
When I'm uncomfortable with something, I
make fun of it, okay well, eachum each or some of the elements
have names, but none of themhave names altogether.
There's no singular.
I have no.
Well, I have no geneticproblems.
My genes are perfect.

Speaker 2 (12:23):
Yeah well, well, I mean.

Speaker 3 (12:25):
Connor made the joke one time.
He said yeah, well, at leastI've never had to deal with
communion in the hand right.

Speaker 5 (12:32):
He did make that, that is.

Speaker 2 (12:35):
It's just a fact too, it's one of those things you
don't get told before the shownot to laugh loud like I
normally do because Mina'ssleeping below me.

Speaker 3 (12:45):
I'll wake her up.
I'm just telling you crying kid, you better get her out.

Speaker 5 (12:51):
Am I a Minecraft character?
What does that even mean?

Speaker 3 (12:58):
I think the funniest way to troll people is to
critique their parenting sothat's why the co-sleeping thing
got so heated is to critiquetheir parenting, so that's why
the co-sleeping thing got soheated.
So I just make I make commentsabout people that their kids cry
in church and it's amazing howpeople react when you tell them
their kid, the, the.
If your mass ain't crying, it'sdying thing.
I'm just so tired of hearing itlike I don't really care if

(13:18):
your kid's crying at mass, Idon't really disagree with it,
it just annoys you.
At this point it's just, it'sjust such a cheesy phrase.
Your man's ain't crying, he'sdying it is five years ago shut
up stupid.

Speaker 2 (13:31):
And everyone who says I think they're thinks they're
being so clever and like so it'slike it's, it's such a novus
ordo priest homily.

Speaker 3 (13:40):
Yeah, I think like while the baby's crying, don't
worry, guys, if your mass ain'tcrying is dying.
Everybody's heard it 8 000times, but yet people tweet it
like it's the first timeeverybody's ever heard it
probably another sort of context.

Speaker 2 (13:50):
It's the only baby in the church, so, yes, it's
really deafening yeah, but theboomers will still turn around
and look at you like you'vekilled their own child or
something exactly exactly so wegot a couple of things we're
going to talk about tonight.

Speaker 3 (14:03):
Connor, what have you been up to?
Are you still podcasting what'sgoing on?
You take a little break from it.

Speaker 5 (14:08):
Well, I will be.
I will be releasing podcasts,kind of as it fits into I don't
know what interests me, more sothan just kind of on a regular
basis.
So tomorrow I'm releasing anepisode with Charles Coulombe
about his new book, the CompleteMonarchist, which is a

(14:29):
collection of his essays onmonarchy over like 20 years
probably.
So a lot of it's very, you know, not much has changed, which is
kind of interesting, eventhough much has changed in the
world.
Not much has changed which iskind of interesting.
Even though much has changed inthe world.
Not much has changed for himfrom a political perspective.

(14:49):
And then I am building on mysub stack.
I am releasing articles fromtime to time on literature,
history, politics, fiction, thatsort of thing history, politics
, fiction, that sort of thing.
And then I've really the reasonI'm not podcasting on a more

(15:10):
consistent basis is because I amhave redirected my focus
towards novel writing.

Speaker 6 (15:15):
Oh cool Really.

Speaker 5 (15:17):
So my goal will be to , in the next few months,
release a novel.
I can't wait to see what thecharacter you name, anthonyony.
I can't wait to see what he'slike.
Well, the, so I'll give sort ofsome sneak preview.
Uh, the.
The story is about a pop starwhose life crashes and has to

(15:41):
deal with the consequences andby doing so falls into basically
religion and how that affectshis surrounding life and the
people around him.

Speaker 3 (15:55):
That's a good plot For plot lines especially.

Speaker 5 (15:58):
You have a title?
No, I do not.
I've only written like twochapters, so it's just a
beginning.

Speaker 3 (16:05):
Do you have the whole story kind of map that in your
head or you're kind of as you'regoing, you're generally I don't
like mapping.

Speaker 5 (16:12):
So I have a general idea I don't like mapping
because it's actually I've heardStephen King actually said has
said this is that if he writes a, if he writes an outline of his
story, he no longer isinterested anymore, because it
feels like he told it.

Speaker 4 (16:28):
Oh wow, I can feel that, as someone who does like
my own private creative writing,I can feel that so, like I
would imagine, as you're writingyou're hearing the story as you
go.

Speaker 5 (16:37):
You know it's like yeah, it does feel more like
you're.
It's just kind of happening andyour things pop into your head
and you put them down on paper.
Well, yeah computer, but uh, butyeah, so it will be interesting
.
Uh, I, I do, you know mrs csaying I wish more catholics
wrote novels.
I do feel like there's a realhole, you know, there is uh in

(17:00):
the market, and I'm not reallythinking of it necessarily from
a business perspective,necessarily because we're not
the biggest demographic, anyways, at least not of people who
actually believe in the faith,but there is a.
Okay, anyways, I don't evenknow, what to say.

(17:37):
Okay, so Let me just finish mythought.
There was a Catholic literaryrevival in the 20th century and
it seems like after roughly the70s it died and I would be
interested in driving a newCatholic literary revival.

(17:58):
There are others out there.
I'm a big fan of BillBiersack's the Father Baptist
series.
It's about a traditionalCatholic priest dealing with
mysteries, kind of like FatherBrown, but with a post-Vatican
II sort of bent.
And I mean post-Vatican II, Imean it's satirical, it's making

(18:21):
fun of the changes afterVatican II.
And then I have not read fatherelijah, but I've heard that's
very good.
And then taylor marshall hasthe uh, has his series, yeah,
but there's, you know, I thinkwe could.
You know, we're not the authors, we have no disrespect to
anybody, but we don't have asquality of writers like we don't

(18:42):
have as quality of writers,like we don't have the masters
of the past.
And I would like to help drivethe you know, me and my fellow
writers towards that pinnaclethat we could rise.

Speaker 2 (18:57):
To be fair, no one has the masters of the past,
like all modern literature istrash.

Speaker 4 (19:01):
Well, that's what.
Well, it's kind of grimy.

Speaker 5 (19:06):
Well, what I'm saying is that the we, you know, and
it's kind of interesting becausethe literary revival started,
you know, it was sort of sparkedby newman, cardinal newman, and
then, uh, chesterton belloc,but it really hit its stride
with tolkien and graham greenand evelyn waugh were sort of, I

(19:26):
would say, and FlanneryO'Connor, the four best authors
of the 20th century, and thathappened to kind of in the
middle of the century.
So my thought is, maybe thatwill, something like that might
occur, and I'd like to be a partof it, even if it's not, even
if I'm not one of, you know, thebig ones.

(19:47):
You know, if I could at leastpush people towards thinking
more about fiction, that wouldbe great yeah, let's talk to uh,
uh, what's his name um?

Speaker 2 (19:57):
jeff putnam the guy's written four books since the
first of the year really.
Really yeah, dang man, he doesmore like pop fiction, like or
no pulp fiction.

Speaker 3 (20:09):
But I just got a text from.
So while you interviewed thisis an interesting size out, but
you interviewed Gavin Ashendenbefore we did- yeah, yeah.

Speaker 5 (20:25):
I want to get the Catholic Unscripted group
together at some point on myshow.
Awkward.
Oh, they're not Awkward, Nevermind they are.
I'm not playing it, I'm notreally closing.

Speaker 3 (20:42):
You'll be able to figure out by this episode, I
don't pay that close attentionanymore to the general yeah Well
, catherine interviewed FatherMaudsley and then Gavin put out
a video the day after, kind ofrefuting everything that was in
that conversation.

Speaker 2 (21:02):
Oh yeah.
I can't wait to one day put outa video refuting everything you
said the day before on thevideo.

Speaker 6 (21:08):
I should do it just for fun.
You should do it for fun.

Speaker 3 (21:12):
I was like I'll join you, I would like to disavow
everything Anthony saidyesterday.

Speaker 5 (21:19):
At least they're experimenting.
At least they're going into new.
I don't know going into newideas.
I don't know going into newideas or just talking about them
, Even if it's contentious, Iguess.
Alright.

Speaker 3 (21:32):
So should we do the Atlantic story Rob.

Speaker 2 (21:35):
Shoot.
I gotta see if I can.

Speaker 3 (21:38):
I have the free version pulled up here.
Yeah, the Atlantic put out anarticle saying the Catholics who
have to worship somewhere else.
I have not read this articleyet, but it's about the Latin
mass.
So Jessica Harvey used toworship in a church with stained
glass and a soaring ceiling.
The Catholic parish gave Harveyand her family a sense of

(21:58):
community as they settled intotheir new hometown of Virginia,
but a year later they startedworshiping at a Catholic school
four miles away in a crampedspace that used to double as a
ballet studio and storage room.
Instead of stained glass,colored images cover the windows
.
Exposed ductwork hangs overhead.
Why the downgrade?
Harvey's parish was forced torelocate its traditional Latin

(22:20):
mass, an ancient version of theCatholic liturgy that has set
off one of the fiercestcontroversies in modern
Catholicism.
In 2021, pope Francisrestricted access to the old
rite and required that priestsget special permission to
celebrate it.
The parishes that are stillallowed to offer the mass the
traditional mass can't advertisein their bulletin, and many

(22:41):
Latin mass devotees like Harveyno longer worship in their
churches advertising theirbulletin.
And many Latin mass devotees,like Harvey, no longer worship
in their churches, which arelargely reserved for the newer,
now standard, rite.
Traditionalists have beenrelegated, in some cases, to
auditoriums and school gyms.
In an autobiography publishedearlier this year, the Pope made
his distaste clear, writingthat he deplored the ostentation

(23:01):
of priests who celebrate theold mass in fancy vestments and
lace, which can sometimesconceal mental imbalance.
Such language stands in clearcontrast to his emphasis on
mercy and pastoral flexibilitytowards groups on the margins,
such as divorced or LGBTCatholics.
This is interesting.
This guy's got to be a tradright, or is it a?

Speaker 4 (23:22):
girl, or just rational.

Speaker 5 (23:25):
Rencing it'd be a person just looking out from the
or looking in from the outside.

Speaker 3 (23:30):
So when he issued the decree, francis said he was
trying to preserve unity in thechurch, where the liturgy had
become a point of particularconflict, in his campaign to
modernize the faith.
That's interesting, uh, butwhether the pope seeks unity
through reconciliation orsuppression, he's not succeeding
.
The edict has hardened andwidened the divisions among
Catholics, alienating thechurch's small but young, ardent

(23:51):
and unyielding group of Latinmass loyalists.
For nearly 1,500 years, a largemajority of Catholics in the
Western Church attended mass inLatin.
In the Second Vatican Council,the rite changed in ways that
went well beyond translation tovernacular.
To encourage activeparticipation, the council
called for a greater layinvolvement.
During the Mass, parishionersstarted reading scripture,

(24:14):
conducting prayers andresponding to the priest, who
began facing the congregation.
In most celebrations, manychurches experimented with the
liturgy and played contemporarymusic.
Whereas the ceremonies in theold rite emphasized Christ's
sacrifice on the cross, those inthe new rite highlighted the
shared Eucharistic meal.
This guy's got to know thisstuff.
This is too in detail.

Speaker 2 (24:34):
If the guy's just non-Catholic or secular, it's
amazing how a non-Catholic orsecular person can be more
honest about what happened thanmost of Catholic media.

Speaker 4 (24:45):
What?
What's the guy's name who wrote?

Speaker 3 (24:46):
it.
Look him up, look him up,francis.

Speaker 2 (24:49):
Francis, let's early life.

Speaker 4 (24:51):
This dude I was going to say I can look him up real
quick If you want to keep it upthere.
What's his name?

Speaker 3 (24:56):
Francis Paulo Pellegrin.

Speaker 2 (24:58):
No, no, that's the picture isn't it, oh, francis
Rocha, francis.

Speaker 5 (25:03):
X Rocha, he probably is a Catholic, he's covered the
Vatican since 07, including forthe Journal.

Speaker 2 (25:11):
He currently works for the National Catholic
Register.

Speaker 3 (25:14):
Oh, so he works for NCR.
Okay, Most Catholics acceptedthe reforms which helped them
understand and engage with thecentral practice of their faith.
Oh, yeah, so much, but adedicated minority resisted and
continued celebrating the oldmass, sometimes without getting
the vaticans newly requiredpermission.
Parishes were allowed to saythe new mass, the new mass in

(25:35):
latin, but few did.
Traditionalists typicallyexplain their attachment by
emphasizing the beauty of theold latin mass, which is often
accompanied by gregorian chant,polyphony and its connection to
the church's history.
They also say the rite is morereverential.
Many cherish the long stretchesof silence when the priest's
words are inaudible.
Restrictions on the mass beganto loosen in the 80s when John

(25:56):
Paul II allowed bishops topermit the traditional rite
within their diocese, but accessremained patchy until 07, the
year Benedict XVI removedpractically all limits, a
decision that drew widespreadmedia coverage.
I mean, I want to try and getto the.
Okay, oh, here's somethinginteresting.
All right.
So today, stephen Cranny, asociologist at the Catholic

(26:16):
University of America, estimatesthat many tens of thousands, at
least occasionally, attend theOld Rite Mass in the United
States, which is believed tohave the world's largest Latin
mass community.
That's only a fraction ofAmerica's 75 million Catholics,
but they tend to be stronglycommitted to their faith.
Cranny told me the kind ofconstituency that provides high

(26:38):
octane fuel for a religiousinstitution In 2023,.
Cranny and Stephen Bullivant, asociologist of religion,
surveyed Catholics and foundthat half expressed interest in
attending the Latin Mass.
Half oh that they asked.
It doesn't say how many heasked.
The revival of the old riteseems to be part of a broader
movement in the church.
There's this desire to go backto what once was, to ground

(27:00):
oneself in a tradition amid akind of modern instability where
everything seems to get thrownup in the air.
That's a good quote An experton liturgy who teaches at the
University of Notre Dame.
He pointed to the growingnumber of Catholics who have
adopted old customs, such askneeling for communion and
wearing veils at mass.
The trend also extends to otherChristians, including
Episcopalians, who have revivedthe use of the 1928 Book of

(27:22):
Common Prayer, who have revivedthe use of the 1928 Book of
Common Prayer, perhapscounterintuitively, this return
to tradition seems to be led byyoung Catholics, who make up a
disproportionate share of Latinmass devotees.
According to a recent surveythat Cranny and Bolivin
conducted of parishes thatoffered it, 44% of Catholics who
attend the Old Rite at leastonce a month were under 45,

(27:43):
compared with only 20% of othermembers of those parishes.
Patrick Merkel, a senior atNotre Dame who attends.
This is like similar to the.
I'm wondering.

Speaker 2 (27:53):
Similar to like every article about the Latin mass.

Speaker 4 (27:58):
Their articles write themselves.
At this point I was going tosay yeah.

Speaker 3 (28:01):
Instead of seeing the Latin mass as a source of
vitality in the church, Francisdenounces it as a rallying point
of dissent.
The celebration of the old rite, he argued in a letter to
bishops that accompanied the2021 decree, is often
characterized by a rejection notonly of the liturgical reform,
but of the Vatican SecondCouncil itself.
He's right that some advocatesof the Latin Mass have been
divisive critics of modernChurch have been divisive

(28:22):
critics of modern church.
Marcel Lefebvre, an archbishopwho founded a traditionalist
group called the SSPX, objectedto key teachings from the
council, including about thechurch's openness to other
religions, particularly Judaism,and ordained four bishops
without papal approval in 1988.
John Paul II declared theordination schismatic and all
five men automatically incurredexcommunication.

(28:43):
Carlo Maria Vigano offers amore recent example of former
Vatican.
All right, let's see.
He's not even really a trad.
Lesser known agitators aboundon the internet For all their
public protestations.
To the contrary, thetraditionalists, who are
influencers on social media,communicate a radical disunity
with the church and hermagisterium.

Speaker 2 (29:00):
Oh, imagine my surprise it's a deacon Wrote
shortly after 2021.

Speaker 3 (29:05):
It oh, imagine my surprise, it's a deacon.

Speaker 5 (29:05):
Wrote shortly after 2021 degree.

Speaker 2 (29:07):
It's always a deacon.
It's a married deacon Probablysucks at being married.

Speaker 3 (29:10):
This is what I want to get into here.
So last week the killing of apriest in Kansas prompted
speculation that traditionalismmay have been associated with
something even worse than schism.
The man charged with the murderhad written critically of the
post-Vatican II church, but themotive for the shooting remains
unknown.
The Latin mass attendees Ispoke with say their
congregations have some vocalcritics of Vatican II and the
modern church, but they insistthat such people are not

(29:33):
representative.
Still, the limits that Francishas placed on the old rite seem
to have further isolated some ofits adherence to the broader
church.
Since the mass was relocated.
Jessica Harvey told me that sheand her family have had harder
times staying connected to theirparish.
We have to make an effort tomake sure that we're still part
of the larger community.

(29:53):
Some Latin mass goers haveresponded to the restrictions by
turning to liturgies offered bybreakaway groups the SSPX
website.
James Vogt liturgies offered bybreakaway.
The sspx website says thatabout 25 000 americans attend
its liturgies.
James vogel, the usspokesperson for the group, told
me that attendance hasincreased by several thousand in

(30:15):
the past few years.
Yeah, but he's biased.

Speaker 4 (30:17):
We know that, james well, the yeah, I was like the
25 numbers old, that's from 2014, that's over a decade old.
Before COVID, before all kinds.

Speaker 3 (30:26):
That's what I would like to know with COVID and
since TC.

Speaker 4 (30:29):
TC McCarrick, all kinds of stuff.

Speaker 3 (30:32):
The renewed interest in the traditional right aligns
with what's known as the strictchurch hypothesis, which
stipulates that religious groupstend to thrive when the cost of
belonging to them increases.
If you and your fellow Latinmass devotees are exiled from a
church to a storage room, yourmembership will likely take on
greater value.
Where some Catholics seem tohave begun attending a Latin
Mass in direct response toFrancis' decree, harvey says
that her reason for going haslittle to do with church

(30:54):
politics.
It's simpler this is a placewhere we more easily meet God
man that's interesting.

Speaker 4 (31:03):
Well, there's a few interesting lines in there, for
sure.

Speaker 3 (31:08):
Go ahead, let's hear your interesting take.

Speaker 2 (31:12):
It's like every other article I've ever read on the
issue.

Speaker 3 (31:17):
More than any subscribing to access exclusive
content.
Like Anthony reading theAtlantic.

Speaker 5 (31:22):
Grover wants you to read my audiobook for me, or
read the audiobook for my book.

Speaker 4 (31:28):
This is the comment of the night.
For me, that's the comment ofthe night I mean Rob is not
wrong, or this one.

Speaker 2 (31:35):
He has a smooth vanilla voice honed through
decades of chain smoking.

Speaker 4 (31:39):
That's funny.
No, the Atlantic comment gotthe one for me.
The article is, I would say,fairly straightforward about the
Latin mass issue, but I thinkwhat it does is it reminds me of
today I was thinking about.
I'm in the process of justtrying to formulate a script for
this concept, but the video isgoing to be called something
like why the Novus Ordo Will BeDead by 2025, unless and my

(32:04):
thesis is essentially it is 2025.
Or, excuse me, 2050.
Excuse me, 2050.

Speaker 2 (32:10):
It's what happens when you don't.
Is this Nick threatening allthe Novus Ordos, or something?

Speaker 4 (32:15):
Yeah, you can clip that.
No, my thesis is essentially, Ithink, that the Novus Ordo will
be dead by 2050 because of justthe great resurgence amongst the
youth for just things that aretraditional, unless all of this
is not, if you will, coupledwith actual traditional doctrine
.
So that's my big issue, and youkind of saw this in the article,

(32:38):
where it seems that a lot ofpeople again who attend the
Latin Mass it's just for thesmells and bells as opposed for
the faith, which is the problem,because it's like again, that
kind of buzz.
I was gonna, I was gonna saythis and I'll let anthony now go
into his fit of rage, becauseanthony wants to speak on this
more than anything.
But I'll give this example,I'll have this key in for you,
anthony notice how there aremore influencers right now

(33:02):
defending a certain group ofpeople than there were
mainstream influencers defendingpeople like me who actually I
lost my cathedral and now go tomass in a hall because I'm not
allowed to by the officialprescriptions to do these things
.
And also notice how they happento label, if you will, the
founder of traditionalism asanti again, a certain group of

(33:25):
people.
It's just very, very telling.

Speaker 5 (33:27):
It's very interesting , was it heard that way prior to
this research.
This, uh, you know sort of this.
Oh, the, the archbishop, youmean yeah, did people refer to
him that way?

Speaker 4 (33:38):
uh, previously, because I never heard that, not
as dramatic not as much, but yousee people, because there is a
famous video of him.
I can send it to you three ifyou guys want.
But there's a famous video ofhim where he does talk about the
Jews being the enemies ofChrist, but in the context,
again, of religion, not of race,and he's very clear.
He says specifically how canthe Pope be praying with the

(34:01):
enemies of Christ?
They're the ones who betrayedour Lord.
How can you be praying withthese individuals?
And he's like he's not sayingthis in an angry tone, he's
saying this almost like weeping,Like how can this be the guy in
the chair Peter's doing thisLike?

Speaker 3 (34:14):
this Marcel Lefebvre guy more and more every day.

Speaker 4 (34:19):
I queued you up, anthony, now you can go.

Speaker 3 (34:21):
Now you can go off up , anthony, now you can go, now
you can go off.
I think, uh, a lot of factorscome into play if you think the
traditional mass is going to bethe dominant liturgy by 2050.
I think there's like this it'snot just doctrine and dogma, it
it does come down to just um, uh, different habits, that novice

(34:41):
or like, because we always readthose articles about like, oh,
the next generation of priestsare more conservative and things
like that, and it's like, yeah,but these guys are still in
regular seminaries and they're,and they're, they're housed with
other novus ordo priests andlike the lackadaisical habits,
like half the priests we havenow are e-priests and all the,

(35:02):
all the articles that are sayingthey're conservative.

Speaker 4 (35:04):
Think conservatism is like daily wire conservatism
you know, what I mean, like yeah, so you can't really trust it
actually actually redeemedzoomer made this exact point
about our faith.
Uh, like two weeks ago, he putup this instagram post that I I
saved because it was reallyinteresting.
He says what's cool aboutcatholicism right now is that
you do see this resurgence ofthe TLM right, because that's

(35:27):
cool.
But the issue that could ariseis you see a lot of conservative
Catholicism pairing it in withcertain elements of politics.

Speaker 3 (35:36):
I think that's a big danger too.

Speaker 4 (35:38):
Yeah, no, it's absolutely a danger and it's
clear.
I'll give this example and thenI want you to keep going,
anthony.
This last week I was at aparish mission at our local
parish right.
It was a fantastic mission.
It was by a really good Normateam priest on the subject of
forgiveness.
But on Sunday, before theparish mission started, I went
to this young adults meetingright For the first time.
I was kind of checking out thisyoung adult group and it was

(35:59):
filled with everybody who goesto the Nova Sorda.
I was the only trad that wasthere and we're going through
this lecture and it's insane.
It opens up as a what do youthink this Bible passage means?
Like group as opposed to like?
What does the church actuallyteach about this section of
scripture?
And then we got on the deathpenalty.
And this is a guy who'sprobably, maybe at most 15 years

(36:23):
older than me and gets up andhe just and he's, he's a teacher
and he just starts saying he'slike the church once taught the
death penalty, but now thechurch formally condemns the
death penalty.
We no longer believe thatanymore no, it doesn't, but
whatever.
Yeah, so we got into a debateand it's just like but here's
the problem is like, we can, asI've said before, we can get in
our trad isolated bubbles, butthen when you go out and you
start talking to people, yourealize that there is a complete

(36:44):
disconnect yeah, listen, youknow who has the take that.

Speaker 3 (36:47):
Oh, the church is getting more conservative.
It's the boomers, it's like the, it's the older catholics like
the people who think they areconservative it's, it's the,
it's the novus ordo going set ofa contest.
Who thinks francis is the?

Speaker 6 (37:02):
pope generation is based.

Speaker 3 (37:05):
It's like you guys really have no idea what you're
talking about.
Somebody said it in thecomments.

Speaker 2 (37:08):
They were like yeah right, they'll say trend horn is
a conservative yeah, it's like,oh, because they think gay sex
is wrong.

Speaker 3 (37:14):
It's like, oh, whoa.
It's like the bar we've set forconservative is so low at this
point, like what you wouldreally need is holy priests who
are praying the breviate,breviary.
And like, like you would needyou would need thousands of
father maudsleys like I don'tknow, I don't know how that

(37:35):
happens.

Speaker 4 (37:36):
You know it's like every priest to like fulfill the
standard set forth by saintalphonsus the gore in duties and
duties of the priest, whereit's like hey, priest, you
literally have to worship theGod.
You have to worship God likethe seraphim do.
You have to be that holyinstrument.
You yourself have to be anoblation for Christ.
It can't just be, yeah, sure,like you're kind of like the
community glue that fitseverybody together and you're

(37:58):
the guy that people come and cryon.

Speaker 2 (38:06):
It's like no like your job is for sacrifice.
A thousand father isaacs.
Isaacs could get pretty violent.

Speaker 3 (38:09):
The thing is.
This is why, like I, I I reallydon't see any improvement on
the in the church on the horizon.
Unless there's an act of god,like it is, too it is, it would
take so many generations itwould be an improvement, but
it's not going to be like a it'dbe kind of like.

Speaker 4 (38:30):
It'd be kind of like as an example, by, by analogy
like how trump was animprovement over biden, but yeah
, you could say that if you want, uh, which I think.
I think I would say againtrump's conservatism is better
than bush's conservatism any day, but that doesn't take hard to
beat, I don't know if it is, Iused to think that I don't know.

Speaker 2 (38:50):
Honestly.

Speaker 3 (38:51):
I see it as the same foreign policy.
Look, I was very hopeful.

Speaker 2 (38:57):
To be fair, we don't have boots on the ground yet, so
it's better so far.

Speaker 4 (39:01):
And to be fair.
Fair again, like if you justchoose to look at everything
through the prism of israel,then you'll see it's not.

Speaker 3 (39:09):
It's not just that, it's well, nick, it's kind of
hard not to when.
When, like your favoritecatholic youtuber, who you
trusted to tell the truth andwas coming back talking about
ukraine and saying how we,america, should never be in
foreign wars, then all of asudden drops a video about how
we need to go to war with iran,like tim pool, like it's like I

(39:29):
don't know, man, I don't, Idon't, I, I don't want to get
blackpilled on everything.

Speaker 4 (39:32):
I'm trying not to, but I I don't know, you seem
pretty blackpilled on everything.
I have some people who come upto me in real life.
They're like why is anthony soblackpilled on everything?

Speaker 5 (39:40):
I'm trying to make sure he's not it's weird, I
don't know it's weird when thelibertarians are at least more
useful or at least moreconsistent.

Speaker 3 (39:49):
That's one thing I like maybe that's what it is,
maybe I got too much.
Um, I just I'm so tired offoreign wars, dude, like I don't
want my son going to foreignwars.
Man, I was 40, four and a halfminutes behind while anthony was
talking, decided to speed up tothe car.
It's just, I don't knowwhatever, I don't even care
about talking about politics,but just the church itself.

(40:13):
Like I think there's so muchthat needs to be fixed and it's
not just like I mean it would beinteresting if we did get like
a super base Pope.
I just don't see that.

Speaker 4 (40:24):
I just don't think we're worthy of one because it's
you know one reason.
I've had some people reach outto me and ask, nick, why haven't
you posted that much of herlent?
And it's like, aside from justbeing busy, I've just been
focusing so much in on thespiritual life and I don't think
we're worthy of a holy pope,even like the people who call
themselves orthodox and like tryto have the right faith.
It's like I mean, just think ofit as an example.

(40:46):
It's like there are millionsupon millions of people in hell
for breaking the eighthcommandment when it comes to
speech, for not forgiving, fordetracting their neighbor, for
rash judgment, for calumny, andit's like you see that on every
Catholic social media outlet.

Speaker 3 (41:03):
I always kind of I always kind of want to push back
on this argument that, like youget the priest you deserve.
It's like yeah, because I knowpoor, like poor, poor priests
are like a judgment from God,but at the same time, like, how
are we supposed to even like?
Like, is God leaving it to allof us to go and study manuals?

(41:28):
Like I don't know.
Like, how are people supposedto like even know?

Speaker 4 (41:32):
it's just keeping his commandments.
That's the thing I mean.
You don't have to be.
You are obligated right to liveaccording to your state and
life and to study your faithaccording your state and life.
But, more important than that,you're just supposed to have
charity for God, and charity forGod is not an emotion.
Charity for God is just keepingHis commandments, and that's
the issue.
It's like so many these are thenatural laws.

(41:54):
It's like if we can't stopslandering and judging our
brothers and sisters and justusing our tongues, as St James
talks about, it's lit on fire ofhell and it causes many fires.
If we can't stop doing that,then God, who is a good father,
will chastise us, as a goodfather will, and I think that
the one way he chastises hispeople is through bad leaders,

(42:15):
just like he did with Israel.

Speaker 5 (42:17):
Wait, did you say we were that the Novus Ordo was
going to be gone by 2050 or not?

Speaker 4 (42:22):
gone.
So the title of the idea is theNovus Ordo will be gone by 2050
.
Unless and basically gettinginto the unless premise, it's
unless there's these, unlesspeople really change their ways
right when it comes to certainaspects inside of the church,
then it will continue.
But if they do change their way, then the new mass will

(42:43):
deteriorate.

Speaker 3 (42:50):
If that makes sense, you'll have to just see the.
I'll send you the video.
Um, it's like yeah, I don'tknow, I think.
I just think everything's somessy right now, I don't know.
I'm just yeah, I I'm.
What is the run?
I was literally just looking upthe rundown topic because molly
said, like I didn't, I thoughtthey I was.
No, they put out an episoderecently.
Um, the, yeah, uh, I don't knowwhere we go from here.

(43:11):
Man, like the, the, the churchis messy and I think that you
just have to kind of find yourenclave of wherever you can to
find the faith being taughtproperly.
I think everybody has to dothat in their parishes at this
point.
You have to just find a goodparish, find a good community
and kind of just hunker down.

Speaker 2 (43:30):
There's so few good parishes I know.

Speaker 4 (43:33):
Yeah Well, I agree with that.
I would say maybe where I'm alittle bit more white-pilled
about the idea is it's like Well, you make up your mind.

Speaker 5 (43:46):
White-pilled or black , like well, you make up your
mind.
Yeah, black bill, choose one,come on.

Speaker 6 (43:48):
Thank you, rob, that is what I've been thinking about
the entire time like wait who'sthe black one?

Speaker 4 (43:50):
I can't figure it out they're not, because is it what
it is is like you can rightlyrecognize evil in this world and
rightly recognize, like how badevil that truly is, but at the
same time if you recognize thatgood is greater because god is
goodness and god is on the sideof righteousness, then you have
in your corner all you need totake back society like with god,

(44:16):
if god before us.
Who is against us?

Speaker 5 (44:18):
oh yeah well, I know, I think that's going to happen
or not going to happen.

Speaker 4 (44:23):
Oh, it will, it will happen, god will win.

Speaker 5 (44:30):
I know, but are we talking about in 100?

Speaker 4 (44:32):
years, 200 years.
I'm saying like, are youoptimistic about the oh gotcha,
gotcha?
Yeah, I'm optimistic, I'moptimistic yeah.

Speaker 5 (44:37):
You just don't sound it.
Neither of you, anthony Nick,neither of you sound it.

Speaker 3 (44:42):
I'm short term pessimist, long-term optimist.

Speaker 2 (44:46):
You think the world's going to be in World War III by
2028?
.

Speaker 3 (44:51):
That's short-term pessimism.
You think the world is going toend.
What happens at the end?
What?

Speaker 2 (44:58):
do you mean?

Speaker 3 (45:01):
What happens at the end?
There's a long-term optimist.
This is why.

Speaker 5 (45:04):
I don't do as much podcasting anymore.

Speaker 4 (45:08):
I don't blame you, bro, I don't blame you.

Speaker 3 (45:10):
I don't know.
I think it's exciting thatwe're alive for such crazy times
.
I'm not like blackmailed, likeoh my gosh, we're doomed.
I kind of think it's like holycrap, look at what the hell is
happening in our world right now.

Speaker 4 (45:23):
It's kind of wild.

Speaker 2 (45:24):
Yeah, no, I, I, I get that.
It's like.
It's like this weekend I get togo to a pre-55 uh palm sunday.
Well, so we're going to be downin the twin cities four hours
away, and they do have one there.
That's the upside.
The downside is I'm probablygoing to be down in the twin
cities four hours away, and theydo have one there.
That's the upside.
The downside is I'm probablygoing to be recognized at that
mass and I don't want to hope so.
I everybody, if no please go on.

(45:45):
It's why I'm not telling it, nottaking the church.

Speaker 4 (45:48):
Shave your beard.
Wear some really dark shades inthere.

Speaker 2 (45:51):
Take a photo.
I would, I know.

Speaker 4 (45:54):
No.

Speaker 2 (45:54):
Shaving my beard is a sign of despair.

Speaker 3 (45:57):
You should send your brother as a decoy.
Rob, Send my brother.

Speaker 1 (46:00):
Yeah, give my brother my brother hasn't been a mass
in a long time.

Speaker 2 (46:08):
So I'll give him my glasses and make him go to a.
How long is the pre-55?

Speaker 4 (46:11):
Palm Sunday.
It's long Two hours, yeah, it'slike two and a half, maybe
three hours.

Speaker 2 (46:15):
No, no maybe I'm not going to the usual parish I go
to down there well, Ihighlighted that comment because
I wonder if he does know who weare.

Speaker 3 (46:23):
I don't know I wonder if he knows who we are you'll
get to see him.
You'll get to see him aroundSeptember but I saw him at the
freaking CIC and he didn't.
He was so busy like I didn'treally talk to him.

Speaker 4 (46:35):
You know, yeah, he might have recognized you've
been like too busy for this guyor, and we're like three times
bigger than we were when youwere at cic that's true.
That's true because, like backthen, it was like what, like?

Speaker 3 (46:49):
5 000 subs or something no between 10 and 15
yeah, 13.

Speaker 2 (46:53):
Okay, yes, I will go to the pre-55 palm sunday as a
jew.
What could go wrong?

Speaker 3 (47:01):
that make the genuine flexion when they pray for the
jews that's good friday.

Speaker 2 (47:05):
You you have gotten this screwed up multiple times
now on air.
I'll I'll do a report.
Is the TLM really asanti-semitic as it says?

Speaker 3 (47:17):
Oh man, yeah, interesting time Alright.
Well, let's switch subjects.
I don't want to black pulleverybody.
What did you guys think of thedire wolf story?

Speaker 2 (47:27):
Wow, that was a Bad transition.

Speaker 4 (47:31):
I've not even heard of the dire wolf story.

Speaker 2 (47:32):
In all honesty, no, I've been literally just kind of
Unplugged from everything it'suh that's what I said yo crucify
just in the middle, just noteven at the part, just in the
middle of the nowhere.

Speaker 5 (47:47):
Oh, oh, we're not doing john's gospel right now,
guys, sorry, poor um thedirewolf thing is good, very
strange, and I don't really carethat much about it, to be
honest.
What the direwolf thing?
Yeah, I mean, it just seems Idon't know takes on it, so okay,

(48:10):
so nick, what are you?

Speaker 2 (48:12):
were you about to read something?

Speaker 3 (48:14):
I was going to, but go ahead well.

Speaker 2 (48:15):
So, nick, what they did is there's this company
called I forget what it's called, but they took gray wool, they
took gray wolves and they foundthat there were 14, there's 14
genetic differences, 14 genesthat are different between gray
wolves and dire wolves.
Okay, right, so they theydidn't use any dire wolf DNA,
but they made those 14 geneticchanges in the gray wolf genome

(48:39):
and then used it to implant eggsinto dogs, to carry these eggs
to term, and hence they'veso-called dire wolves were born,
but it's basically gray wolfeggs with 14 genetic changes to
make them look like dire wolves.
Yeah so, but they presented thestory like jurassic park.

Speaker 3 (49:01):
Yeah, they put the story like like jurassic park.
So the genome was reconstructedby colossal colossal from dna
found in fossils.
The fossils date back to 72 000years.
Like it's such nonsense,colossal, uh, bioscience has
said.
The moment marks not only amilestone for us as a company,
but also a leap forward forscience, conservation and
humanity.

(49:21):
From the beginning, our goalhas been clear to revolutionize
history and be the first companyto use CRISPR technology
successfully in thede-extinction of previously lost
species.
By achieving this, we continueto push forward our broader
mission on accepting humanity'sduty to restore Earth to a
healthier state.

Speaker 2 (49:40):
But it's not like we killed off the dire wolves.
We didn't.

Speaker 5 (49:44):
What did kill them off?
Aren't they like arctic?

Speaker 2 (49:47):
The megafauna, so like the giant sloths and other
larger creatures that used toinhabit North and South America.

Speaker 4 (49:55):
Anthony's family.
No, he is sick larger creaturesthat used to inhabit North and
South.

Speaker 2 (50:03):
America.

Speaker 4 (50:03):
Anthony's family.

Speaker 2 (50:03):
I saw the opportunity and I took it, so all their
prey died off, right, and that'sbasically it.
So now I mean, what, what?
What's the point of bringinghim back?

Speaker 5 (50:13):
to make George R Martin happy.
That's what I was thinking.

Speaker 4 (50:18):
No, no, he literally funded it.
Yeah, he did, oh really, he did.

Speaker 5 (50:22):
Him and Peter Jackson funded it.

Speaker 4 (50:25):
Rare Peter Jackson L.
Okay, so now.

Speaker 3 (50:29):
I know they're not real direwolves, but they're
playing around with this genometechnology right, I mean, the
question is, they might be.

Speaker 2 (50:38):
I mean, like, like, what makes a dire wolf a dire
wolf did?
Did that genetic change?
Because now they, I mean iftheir genomes now match dire
wolf genomes did that change theessence of the gray wolf into
the dark, like I mean this?
This actually gets into somepretty deep philosophy now also
are these like they're reallyattempting transubstantiation,
trans these like I mean, they'rereally attempting

(50:58):
transubstantiations, whatthey're really actually
attempting?

Speaker 5 (51:02):
Mrs Homemaker, we haven't gotten the
second-to-last GRRM book, so wecan't even get the last yet.

Speaker 2 (51:10):
A dude will do anything except write.
He'll literally create newcreatures, so he doesn't have to
write the book.

Speaker 5 (51:15):
He will participate in making new fake or whatever
creatures.

Speaker 3 (51:22):
This is where I'm worried this goes.
If they're doing this with direwolves and this is a public
company, they have to be careful.
Things like that.
Do you really think the chinesearen't experimenting with the
human genome in ways?

Speaker 2 (51:39):
like this 100, what do you think?
They have a million uyghurs incamps.
Yeah, you know what I mean.
I mean, come on, yeah china.

Speaker 4 (51:47):
China, right now, is one of the most like despicable
countries on the face of theplanet when it comes to, just
like the oppression of their ownpeople, and so they also have
the technology to play with.

Speaker 3 (51:56):
This.
Exactly, exactly and, like robsaid, like they're attempting
transubstantiation, like they'reattempting to.
They're like talk about playinggod.
Yeah, exactly what they'redoing.
They are playing god, like thiscrisper technology they're
already talking about.
Like I saw some girl posted athread the other day about how,
um, they are now gene editingbabies through ivf and like

(52:20):
they're making sure there's nogenes in there that could give
your child choosing gender andall that yeah, it's like they're
.
It is um, gattaca is whatthey're doing.
Isn't this why god flooded theearth, right?
So jonathan cajot said um, Itold you we would you we had not
seen in 10,000 years.
But it is just the beginning.
Chimera incoming, just as inthe time of Noah, and

(52:44):
everybody's like dude, it's agray wolf, it's a gray wolf.
He's like you're missing thepoint.
You're missing the point.
What this technology isessentially is them playing
around with the human genomeEventually, like that's where
this goes.
Talk about super soldiers andmixing humans with animals,

(53:07):
things like that, like we don'tknow what they're going to do
with this Cause.

Speaker 4 (53:11):
We talked about it, I think, with Joshua Charles
about like ak's plan to do sometype of genetic alterations,
where basically you coulddiscern through ai what type of
diseases a person might have andso you could develop a vaccine,
like instantaneously, thatwould be unique to them.

(53:31):
But it reminds me of I thinkit's in jurassic park 3 um, the
line where dr graham says likethey're walking through the old
laboratory where everything'sjust blown up but they're seeing
how the dinosaurs were created.
And she's like, oh, this iscrazy.
Like is this what scientists do?
And he says no, this is whathappens when you play god.
And it's like it is fortuitous,it's like that's exactly what

(53:54):
it is.
And I I like rob's question,it's like one, is this even
really like a dire world for agray wolf, depending on which
one you want to go with?
Um?
I would just want to ask thequestion like okay, these things
have souls?
Like okay, what it like?
What is this thing?

Speaker 3 (54:11):
now, okay, does it?
Is it like a liger where itcan't reproduce?
You know what I'm saying?
No, I'm saying like I don'tknow where it can't reproduce.
You know what I'm saying?
I don't know when it can'treproduce.
That's all I'm getting at.
You can mate a tiger and a lionand you'll get a liger.

Speaker 2 (54:26):
Which is why a liger isn't a species, because it's
unable to reproduce.

Speaker 3 (54:31):
It then can't reproduce.
A mule isn't a?

Speaker 2 (54:33):
separate species.

Speaker 3 (54:35):
It's a donkey and a horse mating.
Is this what happened when nerda mule right?
You live in a separate species.
It's a donkey and a horse rightmating.

Speaker 5 (54:38):
So this is the question what happened when
nerds took over the world?

Speaker 4 (54:42):
freaking nerds.
Um, but yeah, honestly, torob's point, I guess to answer
anthony's question.
So here's my question like okay, have these two wolves before
ever crossbred?
Because it's like if they have,then that would be the answer
to basically our question.
But if not, and it's animpossibility, then it's like

(55:03):
what the heck is this?
That'd be the open question.

Speaker 3 (55:08):
I guess it's a new species altogether.

Speaker 4 (55:10):
This is a mortal sin.
Go to confession right now.
Go to confession.

Speaker 3 (55:16):
I'm joking Um, joking um yeah, I don't know man, this
is just weird things we'reseeing.
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (55:24):
So they did overlap both in time and place, both
gray wolves and dire wolves, atleast according to I mean you
know they're saying it was40,000 years ago, whether that
out.

Speaker 5 (55:37):
But just fake mythology.

Speaker 4 (55:39):
It's like if they did , then that would answer our
question.
Because it's like if there isthe possibility of them being
able to be crossbred, then whilethe method is immoral, it's not
maybe as egregious.
Not saying that they're nottrying to do the egregious, I'm
just saying in the immediatecontext Well, I would imagine I
mean they have to be able tocrossbreed with gray wolves now.

Speaker 3 (56:00):
But they made.
They made two males and afemale.
They named them romulus andremus, which I think is really
freaking interesting.

Speaker 4 (56:08):
It's like kind of cool, not gonna lie just because
I'm a history, just because I'ma history nerd, but that's
literally the only reason yeah,the girl's terrible name what
was the girl's name?

Speaker 5 (56:17):
it's uh calise is named after uh, one of the
characters from so they'resaying they likely did not
interbreed.

Speaker 2 (56:28):
Um, likely could not have interbred because of their
their genetic differences.
Like, yeah, there was only 14genes they needed changing, but
it looks like they descendedfrom different lineages within
the canine family.
So, even though they weren't,there wasn't a lot of like
genetic changes they had to do.

(56:48):
It was a rather large geneticdifference and probably could
not have interbred gotcha now,what do you think of this?

Speaker 3 (56:54):
so todd says he deaths chimera, even possible,
all signs and wonders fromdemons.
But I know like it talks aboutlike god having to wipe out the
earth because humans got so outof control, like I like.
If it comes to that, wouldn'twould god wipe us out?

Speaker 4 (57:12):
well, the only other destruction of the entire earth,
according to second Peter, isthe destruction by fire.
That's, but that is after theLord returns.

Speaker 5 (57:27):
So isn't the rainbow the?

Speaker 4 (57:29):
or is it's in congruence with it.
And so, yeah, the rainbow is asign that God will never flood
the earth again, but the secondjudgment will be fire, which
sounds a lot like a Keter, right?
Yeah, it could sound a signthat God will never flood the
earth again, but the secondjudgment will be fire.
Which sounds a lot like Akita,right, yeah, it could sound like
Akita, I mean, what it is is.
2 Peter is just an amazingepistle.
People just go read it.
It's just three chapters, butthe whole premise is this is 1
Peter, excuse me, 1 Peter,chapters 4 and 5.

(57:52):
He says that the day of the Lordright, whenever it comes, the
Lord will rain fire from the sky.
The elements of the earth willmelt because of the burning heat
.
And he says if scarcely therighteous are saved, where will
the sinner get up here?
And so God is.
He says that God is loving, heis withholding his wrath, he's

(58:21):
trying to give people time torepentance, but eventually he
will come.
When you tie this in with 2Thessalonians, in the first
chapter, st Paul says that whenChrist shall come, he shall
bring the wrath of his fatherand pour it out upon all those
who did not believe in God andobey the Lord Jesus Christ.
When you tie these two thingstogether, it's like in our
context of this kind of cloning,it's clearly trying to play God
.
Although, can I let me make adevil's advocate argument,
because I'm just curious on howyou guys would respond to this?
What would you guys say to thepeople who would say something

(58:44):
like okay, I get why you'reconcerned, but, to be fair, is
this not just a naturalprogression with science?
Because when you look atsurgeries or you look at
medicines and stuff, look at allthe things that we've managed
to do today that have saved somany millions of lives, as
opposed to, for instance, whereI nerd out, in the 1860s, where
simple fractures required you toamputate.

Speaker 3 (59:06):
I would say that the church always used science, like
the world always used science,but had a firm moral foundation
in the church, like when thechurch would put forth moral
principles.
You're supposed to act withinthose guidelines and yeah
science should never violate thenatural law.
Never should violate thenatural law.

(59:26):
Now, if you're starting to playaround with gene editing and
stuff like, I'm surprised thechurch said anything on this.

Speaker 4 (59:31):
It's against human cloning.
I don't know how much it saidabout animals, but like the
principle but just not even thatgene editing to edit app.

Speaker 2 (59:43):
Like I mean, the last time the church talked about
something like this was at thedawn of cloning, so like I don't
think they've said anything onthe subject since, like crisper
started yeah, not to myknowledge.

Speaker 3 (59:52):
If so, it's just been in passing so, um, these things
may not be possible, but wehave people with money and power
thinking they are possible, tiein their occult leanings and
explains a lot of what we areseeing.
That's a good point, yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:00:06):
Because it's like what.
Do you guys know what Satan'soriginal sin was, according to
St Thomas, besides just prideWanting?
To create right, it was exactlyhe wanted to create without the
power of god, which is the sameas uh in, uh the silmarillion
exactly more goths great sinyeah that's a good point.

Speaker 5 (01:00:28):
Yeah, so when you time actually, and he even plays
with sort of the uh.

Speaker 2 (01:00:33):
One of the angels is creation of the dwarves I mean I
was gonna say yeah, not justMorgoth.
Ale wants to create life withthe dwarves and Ilu and Luvatar
basically says no, I'll give thedwarves lives because you've
already created them, but youhave no power over them now.

Speaker 4 (01:00:54):
When you tie all those things in, it's like okay,
this could be the ultimatesatanic sin in a way, or maybe
here's the better way.
It's one of the more ultimateways in which a person could
mimic the action of Satan.
Because Satan wanted—he wasfilled with pride.

(01:01:15):
And then his action in beingfilled with pride is I want to
be like the most high god, whocreated me and everything I want
to create.
And so us, who think that we'rethe center of the universe, say
okay, we don't need god.
Let us create in our image, ifyou will, what we want um, I'm
sorry, I'm just popping into.

Speaker 3 (01:01:32):
I want to make sure I'm in the live stream because
I'm missing the comments.

Speaker 4 (01:01:37):
You could tie this in with the patriarchy and
feminism in a way, in the sensethat it's like, because God is
Father, he's the paternity, ifyou will, because he is Father,
he is the one who creates thereason we call Him Father.
There's many reasons, but thechiefest reason is that all the
Trinity Father, son, father, son, holy spirit creates.

(01:01:58):
But we, we emphasize that withgod the father, god the father
creates.
But if we have this notion ofeveryone being equal in the same
way, right, then that becomes aproblem.
This could be just a version ofthis, but applied in this
context.
That's really why tim gordonabout yeah, no, I'm not a, not,

(01:02:19):
not tim gordon guy per se.
You know every area.
I do agree with some of hisbasic theses, but I have a
little bit more nuanced alsojust to answer the uh or just
about what they're talking aboutin the chat.

Speaker 5 (01:02:32):
Uh, the movie the lord of the Rings movies are not
better than the books.

Speaker 3 (01:02:39):
Science requires imagination.
Any science conducted toeliminate the need for God is
ultimately going to produce badfruits.
Evil imagination will bringabout evil.
Yeah, I think the things thatthey're playing with are just
like, without those thoseboundaries that the church sets
and says, okay, science can't gooutside of these boundaries

(01:03:01):
like the evil mind that man hasis just gonna go off the rails
and just get out of control, inmy opinion.

Speaker 2 (01:03:09):
But yeah, I mean, just wait till they try to uh to
bring back neanderthals byimplanting them, you know, eggs
in women.

Speaker 5 (01:03:21):
Are they going to be in the new orcs?

Speaker 2 (01:03:23):
Oh my gosh, they're creating orcs Bro.

Speaker 5 (01:03:26):
Tolkien is literally a prophet Like basically where,
because when, if they have nosouls, like no immortal souls,
then they wouldn't, then they'dbe fair game.

Speaker 2 (01:03:37):
you know from a, from a that's actually a good point
that's a really good hunt, humankind kind of human sort of you
can.

Speaker 5 (01:03:45):
It would be neanderthals then.

Speaker 4 (01:03:47):
Well, actually condor .
That's a really good point.

Speaker 5 (01:03:49):
That's just interesting um that that was the
whole point of orcs.
You, basically Tolkien, wantedto have a villain that basically
wasn't a.
It wasn't man killing other men.
There wasn't concern about likeI don't know, Not killing them
basically or not.

Speaker 2 (01:04:10):
I cannot put that out .

Speaker 3 (01:04:12):
Yeah, because even in modern warfare, even under just
war, if you're killing innocentlife, the point of the orcs is
you can indiscriminately killthem without any remorse
whatsoever.
It's not human souls being lost.

Speaker 2 (01:04:26):
Whoa, whoa, whoa.
Have you watched Ring of Powers?
They have baby orcs and thosebaby orcs have dreams.
Damn it, Are you telling meyou've?

Speaker 5 (01:04:33):
watched it Rob.

Speaker 4 (01:04:35):
No, but I've seen, I've like, I've seen that I know
, I know I was just greengrabbing that I'm like if rob
had actually watched that, hewould show up on stream with a
shaved face and we would knowit's all over, yeah all right.

Speaker 3 (01:04:48):
So before we go we got, we got a good story um
catholics now outnumberanglicans in the UK.

Speaker 5 (01:04:55):
Well, so I've talked to Anglicans about this and they
think it's a little more wonkythan that.
It's more a question of I don'tknow.
I mean I disagree with him, butI just wanted to put forth the
notion that the accuracy of thatis not actually all there.

Speaker 2 (01:05:17):
Yeah, but we don't care what Anglicans think.

Speaker 4 (01:05:20):
What was the stat, Anthony?
Did he give a stat?

Speaker 2 (01:05:22):
Okay, so I'm pulling it up, connor, don't debunk what
we haven't even discussed yet.

Speaker 4 (01:05:27):
It's not from the Atlantic.

Speaker 3 (01:05:29):
Wait till we read the story dude Calm down Connor
Calm down.

Speaker 2 (01:05:35):
Anthony hasn't even said it yet.
Connor's like no, you're wrong,Shut up.

Speaker 5 (01:05:40):
Remember that time when he asked about in trivia,
like about converts or likeliterary converts.

Speaker 3 (01:05:48):
We had the whole argument over whether Tolkien
was a convert or a Well.

Speaker 5 (01:05:55):
I think Joseph Pierce would actually agree with you
basically that he's was aconvert, or or well, I think, uh
, I think joseph pierce wouldactually agree with you
basically that he's not aconvert, because he's not, uh,
he wrote a book on literaryconverts and tolkien isn't
mentioned, and then he, uh, he'sin, like another argument
argument by silence is not agood argument, connor all right,

(01:06:15):
I remember the time you kickedanthony off your own show you
guys are derailing everythinghe's hey, that was inspired by
you.
I was just being you, it wasn't.

Speaker 3 (01:06:27):
It wasn't my idea all right, here we go.
A new study from the uk hasfound that among members of gen
z in the uk, it's not allcatholics, it's gen z in the UK.
It's not all Catholics, it's GenZ Catholics in the UK,
catholics now outnumberAnglicans two to one.
Wow, part of the patternobserved across all age groups
whereby participation inCatholicism has risen in recent
years while Anglicanism hasdeclined.

(01:06:48):
A report from the Bible Society, a UK charity that translates
and distributes the Bibleworldwide, found that the
practice of Christianity ingeneral is growing in the UK
after decades of decline, drivenby growing participation of
young adults and young men inparticular.
The study, based on YouGovsurveys commissioned by the

(01:07:09):
Bible Society, also concludedthat many young people are
seeking community and belief inGod and that, in an age of poor
mental health, distraction andfragmentation brought by social
media, many are interested inprayer and in the Bible.
The results of this thoroughand robust study demonstrate
that, over the space of only sixyears, there has been a
significant growth in thenumbers of people going to

(01:07:31):
church.
Christians are practicing theirreligion more intentionally.
More young people are findingfaith.
More people are reading theBible, the reports Okay so.
Reading the Bible, the reportsOkay.
So this is actually aninteresting topic.
I don't trust the.

Speaker 5 (01:07:42):
Bible society though.

Speaker 2 (01:07:44):
That's fine.
You know why I think they'rewrong here?
Because if you count all thegays Gen Z gay people in England
, they're basically Anglicanstoo, so then you probably have
more Anglicans than.

Speaker 3 (01:07:56):
Catholics.
Well, the thing is there is amuslims.
Then you know, yeah, there iskind of this resurgence of
christianity going on right nowand a lot of it.
This is kind of like what wewere talking about with the
father mike, how he missed theball, and, on fox news, the
white pill and it's likenobody's watching fox news.

Speaker 5 (01:08:15):
That's under like 50.
No, but they had Father.

Speaker 3 (01:08:19):
Mike on to ask him why there is this resurgence of
young people Now.
My daughter texted me yesterdayand I sent it to Rob.
She goes Dad.
You guys should be puttingclips of your show on TikTok,
because you'll probably blow up.

Speaker 2 (01:08:32):
First off, which daughter was this?

Speaker 3 (01:08:34):
Sophia, the older one .

Speaker 2 (01:08:38):
Sophia, the real question is why do you not
follow your?

Speaker 3 (01:08:41):
dad's podcast on tiktok.

Speaker 2 (01:08:42):
If you did.
You would know, I do put clipson there sophia called out wow,
I said uh I said.

Speaker 3 (01:08:51):
I said we do have a tiktok rob posts as often as he
can.
I said we're keeping up with somany different things like how
the hell do you post?
Yeah, like tiktok works where,like you have to post multiple
times a day, and stuff like that, but yeah, I don't get the
reason she said it is, she goesdad.
It's the weirdest thing.
Like every single tiktok videothat goes out in the comments
will have somebody talking aboutgod, no matter what the video

(01:09:12):
topic is.
It's like christ is king or you, you read the Bible.
This that I'm like it's veryProtestant stuff.
She was sending me.
She sent me like screenshots ofall the things she's seen.
She's like it's really weird.
There's this huge surgence ofyoung people talking about God.
So I thought I was like well,are you seeing any Catholic
content?
She's like I'm not seeingcontent.
I'm seeing comments belowthings that she would just, you

(01:09:35):
know, check out on tiktok andlike it's just all about god in
the comments.
So, but there is thisresurgence of religion.
It has a lot to do with, liketom holland's book.
I think brought like a littlebit of a interest in england,
because we're talking aboutengland, so it's um tom holland.

Speaker 2 (01:09:52):
Um, I don't think zoomers are reading tom holland
I was gonna say I don't thinkthat's connected at all it's not
reading.

Speaker 3 (01:09:58):
It's that he was on, so I think it's podcasts and
stuff, but I think it.
It did.
He was on so many differentshows and then that beyond
belief podcast, like they're alltalking about this like
resurgence of christianity, andeven that arc conference that um
jordan peterson did.
They had bishop baron come andJonathan Peugeot spoke there.

(01:10:18):
Like those two talks Peugeotand Bishop Barron were the two
everybody loved the most becausethey talked about God.

Speaker 2 (01:10:24):
Yeah, but it's again not Zoomers.

Speaker 5 (01:10:26):
I think it's a completely different audience.
I mean, some of them might beZoomers, but they'd be like
connected Zoomers.

Speaker 4 (01:10:36):
I think this is a moment, especially in the report
, that it's catholicism, justlike a moment to praise god,
because it's I mean, england,especially right now, really
needs the light of christ.
I mean, you know, god alwaysworks tragedy for the ultimate
good, and so I I just pray thatthe, the mass amounts of muslims
there, come into contact withthe truth.
Therefore, I say, because I meanthat's the ultimate thing, but

(01:10:56):
I think you're I mean anthony,you're right Like the reason so
many young guys are all aroundthe world are interested just in
religion in general, butespecially Christianity, is
because, as I've been, the stuffthat we've talked about when it
comes to just like the kind ofover momming, if you will, of
society, we see so many guysstruggling with things like
depression, with insecuritiesthrough social media, which is

(01:11:19):
not knowing what masculinity is,and so they're just looking
back to saying, okay, what didour grandfathers, our great
grandfathers, what was it thatthey did that made them who they
were?
How can we be like them?
And what's cool about that isit reminds me of St James when
he says that he will turn thehearts of the sons into the
fathers, the hearts of thefathers into the sons, and I

(01:11:41):
think that what is good aboutthis is that, you know, even
though, again, the world aswe've talked about can be easy
to doom pill like this, ischrist pulling new people for
his mission into the future, andthat's the glorious and a big.

Speaker 3 (01:11:53):
A big part of it does have to do with how distorted
the anglican church presentschristian like the distortion
that like they like.
They see this disgustingdisplay presenting itself as
christianity and they're likeall right, if I'm going to have
a conversion, I'm not going togo there right.

Speaker 2 (01:12:12):
They see everything wrong with the world.
Then they go to an anglicanchurch and find out that
everything that's wrong with theworld is right there too it's
almost.

Speaker 3 (01:12:20):
It's almost like the birthing place of everything
wrong in that anglican church.
It's like isn't that true,every single thing.
They see.
The trans, the gay, the women,the everything that like is
distorted at the feminism andthings like that are all it's.
It is like the church of woke,that freaking anglican church.

(01:12:40):
I don't know how anybody staysin it, like if you have any
desire for christianity inengland you have to go catholic.
It's not like there's anorthodox presence there yeah,
well, uh guys, I gotta go.

Speaker 5 (01:12:51):
Uh, it was great talking to you guys.
It was great being on.
Um, I've got to head out.

Speaker 3 (01:12:56):
All right.

Speaker 5 (01:12:57):
You want to promote anything.
My, my sub stack is Palantir'shope and you'll be able to keep
up with my, my work there andI'll be posting stuff about
future with my, with my novels.
I've got a lot of ideas, sothere's not.
You know, there's going to beplenty of books once things flow

(01:13:20):
, stuff like that.
I'm not short of anything likethat.
But also, if you could pray formy work and pray for my novel
writing that I do it correctlyand that I do it to the best of
my ability, becauseself-publishing is a bit of a

(01:13:41):
minefield.

Speaker 4 (01:13:42):
Yeah, will do, buddy.

Speaker 3 (01:13:44):
If you post something on your sub stack, text me and
I'll tweet it out for you, bud.
Thanks guys.

Speaker 4 (01:13:49):
See you.

Speaker 2 (01:13:49):
Thanks, Connor.

Speaker 3 (01:13:51):
Yeah, like the cesspool that is Anglicanism is
just like I don't know.
That's why I'll tell you.
You want to know who probablyhas a big effect over there.
It's freaking Calvin Robinson.

Speaker 4 (01:14:05):
Yeah, he had a huge effect.
It was a huge effect.

Speaker 3 (01:14:08):
People were exuberant by him speaking out.
He was like that whole thingwhere he spoke out.
I forgot what the setting was,but like he had a huge part in
like people even discussing thatstuff again and he was doing it
in front of the Anglican church, which was crazy.

Speaker 4 (01:14:26):
Yeah, do you know?
You know what I think?
One of the reasons why?
It's because Calvin Robinson isauthentic, like without opening
up this door.
I'm just using by this as ananalogy.
It's like when voters werepolled, one of the reasons that
they voted both for aoc and fortrump was because they saw them
as authentic.
Calvin robertson same thing.
It's like you see a guy who'syoung, he gets up in front of

(01:14:48):
all of oxford right, including alot of his bishops on the other
side, and he says you're wrong.
Like god has made marriagebetween one man, one woman for
life.
That's what people are wanting.
That's what young people want,because to think about this, if
you're, you don't have to beyoung to see this.
But if you're young and you'relooking up at your elders and
you're like, okay, this elderclaims that he's part of the one

(01:15:10):
true religion, if you will.
But yet at the same time, heviolates every single precept of
the.
And it's not that he's just asinner trying better, it's that
he openly mocks those things.
Why should I have any part withthat?
But then also, at the samething, you don't want to go
where the millennials went.
The millennials dove into thethird wave atheism, new atheism,
right, the Dawkins world.

(01:15:31):
So you look at that and you'relike, okay, that doesn't really
answer the problems.
Like if you say to me thingslike racism is immoral, but you
can't tell me where moralitycomes from, then what the heck
is the purpose?

Speaker 3 (01:15:41):
yeah, I think you're right.
I think I think the collapse ofthe new atheism has a big part
in this as well.
Like because dawkins likespearheaded that whole movement,
right, so that whole thing,especially because what that
showcased was you get rid of Godand then the new religion
consumes the new atheistmovement, like the woke stuff

(01:16:04):
consumed the new atheistmovement.
So it's like, oh, you got ridof the Christian God and then
all of a sudden, this new Godcomes in.
Like religion is inevitable.
It just is, and I think that'sa big part of this, right, so
religion is inevitable, and Ithink everyone is seeing that
now.
So you get rid of one religionand something else comes up in
its place.
And I think it's kind ofimpossible after the woke stuff

(01:16:27):
to deny that, like people sawreligious imagery in everything
those people were doing.
It was a religious cult peoplewere doing.
It was a religious cult.
Even what is it that I just sawrecently?
Like um, even um.

(01:16:48):
Like I saw something in secularsociety acting as indulgences.
It was like it was in inpolitics too.
It was like, oh, oh, like eventhe, even the like the carbon
carb, like when you could buyoffset your carbon footprint.
Yeah, yeah, yeah like that'slike buying an indulgence for

(01:17:09):
your sin, like if you're intothe green movement, right like
dude religion like.

Speaker 2 (01:17:13):
donations to blm is is reparations is.
Donations to BLM is Reparationsis basically.

Speaker 3 (01:17:17):
Reparations is.
Everywhere you look, you seethe Catholic religion, and you
didn't tweet about it.

Speaker 2 (01:17:27):
Brutal.

Speaker 3 (01:17:28):
Alright, I suck.
What do you guys want from me?
Yeah, it's just.
Everywhere you look, you seethe Catholic faith.
It's so interesting how theCatholic faith incorporated all
these things because they'reactually fundamental to humanity
.
And then you get Protestantswill say things like indulgences
.
But they have their own form ofindulgences.

(01:17:50):
They still.
Their tithing becomesindulgences for them.
Right, Like they have to tithe,Like they don't believe in
works, but they have to tithe,so much so that they're passing
credit card readers around attheir church.
Like that's how bizarre it isin Protestant churches now they
pass around a scanner and youliterally hold your freaking,
your card reader up to it andyou give your donation.

Speaker 4 (01:18:10):
Did you guys see that video?
It was on all social media,like last week, where there was
this black pastor who was likeI've told the ushers, we're
locking the doors.
This is like a mega churchwe're locking the doors until we
get the like amount of moneythat we need oh my gosh, he was
passing around I wish I couldlock everyone's computer and
phone.

Speaker 2 (01:18:30):
Watching this right now be like you're stuck on this
channel until you give us themoney.

Speaker 3 (01:18:35):
Yeah, we can't do it on a member show.
That's a good point.
These poor people are alreadypaying for this trash.
Yeah, I just see Catholicismeverywhere I look, no matter
what I mean.
I've talked about this beforebut even the end of the world

(01:18:58):
because of climate change isjust their apocalypse story.
It's like they have a religion.

Speaker 4 (01:19:03):
You know it's just Banning guns is their version of
the forbidden index, all kindsof stuff.

Speaker 3 (01:19:10):
Yeah, there's all sorts of ways that man has to
account for his sin.
Now, in the secular religionthey don't account for moral sin
the way we would.

Speaker 2 (01:19:20):
Grover, there's not enough money in the world bud.
Yeah, grover, you're afirebrand dude, everyone is on
the lookout for you in thetelegram at all times, ready to
kill you.

Speaker 3 (01:19:30):
No matter how many times you change your name.

Speaker 2 (01:19:33):
People have literally been kicked out because they
thought they might be grover?

Speaker 4 (01:19:37):
that might be grover, let's just be safe and bad um,
but it would make sense why allthese young guys are leaving
that world.
Because it's like I I justthink of two things that were
just so off the wall.
I remember like three or fouryears ago, when the trans stuff
really started to be kicking off.
They were saying things like ifyou're a biological male and

(01:19:58):
you're not willing to date atransgendered man, like
transgendered female, then youare officially transphobic.
So it like got to this pointwhere it's like oh, you're
straight, but yet you don't wantto be with a guy who thinks
he's a woman hater.
Okay, it's like what?
How are most young guyssupposed to react to that?

Speaker 3 (01:20:20):
yeah, it's, it's.
It's well.
What's interesting about thatnick?
You remember how they weresaying uh, if you won't date a
trans person, you're homophobic.
Yeah, there is this thing wheremegan kelly came out and she's
like why don't young men want todate feminist women?
Young men that don't want todate feminist women are wrong.
And it's like this is the sameargument you're making.

(01:20:42):
It's like no, I don't want todate a girl who acts like a boy,
like I don't have any desire tobe with a girl who thinks she's
like everybody.
Look, I was trolling a bit withthat, like I do that a lot with
the when I see girls doing armystuff and I'm like if you're
attracted to this, you're ahomosexual.
But I am trolling.

Speaker 4 (01:21:03):
I got to get on Twitter more.

Speaker 2 (01:21:04):
I am, but I'm not.
You were supposed to preventhim from doing stuff like this
during Lent.

Speaker 4 (01:21:11):
I was going to, but then he had this great
resolution, this look in his eye.

Speaker 3 (01:21:15):
Molly said it.
Molly was like let's place betson when Anthony goes fullback.

Speaker 4 (01:21:21):
It lasted for a solid 14 minutes and then it was.

Speaker 3 (01:21:24):
I was like no, I did good, I did good for the first
two weeks, maybe three, and thenthe past eight days I just gave
up.
I was like ah, whatever, I'mjust going back to tweeting.
But I've been doing good ineverything else, like really
good in everything else, it'sjust the tweeting.
Just the thing you had the mostissues with yes, all right, I'm
a weak man.

(01:21:44):
What do you offer me?
Twitter is my thing.
The Lord has much work to do inyour brother, anthony, guys, I
don't know what to tell you.
So yeah, anthony guys, I don'tknow what to tell you.
So yeah, so, even with thatvideo though I'm kind of half
kidding, but it's if you, when Isee girls doing things to look
bad at like somebody, was like,oh, you don't like physically

(01:22:05):
fit, not about physically fit.
I think all women shouldexercise and be physically fit.

Speaker 2 (01:22:10):
Anthony's just jealous.

Speaker 3 (01:22:11):
He can't play with guns she's just, it wasn't guns,
she was just running themilitary race and all the men
were around her counting herpush.
I was like you look like a dudeto me.
I can't understand how anybodyand so many of it that reacted
to me and like well, like dude,it was men who were in the
military, who were wives ormarines or things like it's like

(01:22:32):
like you're supposed to be,like alpha male guy.
Why are you picking a chicklike you're supposed to get like
alpha male guy?
Why are you picking a chickLike you're supposed to get the
most feminine chick?

Speaker 2 (01:22:39):
Yeah, he was probably in the Navy, so that makes
sense.

Speaker 4 (01:22:42):
Well, would he be really married to a lady though?
Then, rob, that's the question.

Speaker 3 (01:22:47):
Look a lot of people may not like this, but I'm
telling you Andrew Wilson hasdone things in the conversation
that he's he, he's so I'vealways picked up on this but
he's showing people that theconservative girls are the real
feminists, that they're theactual subversive ones, and it's
not the liberal women you haveto worry about.

(01:23:09):
It's the conservative feministsthat the oxymoron like.
It's a contradiction in termsconservative feminists.
They are the most dangerouswomen at the same time.

Speaker 2 (01:23:19):
He can't like, he doesn't live.
What he, what he preaches.

Speaker 3 (01:23:23):
He lets his wife go off and mouth off on twitter all
the time yeah, I mean he should, he should get that in check,
uh, but he's still pointing outthe problem correctly.
It's these, it's these womenwho think, because they voted
for trump, that they'reconservative and they're not.
It's just look.

(01:23:44):
Also the other thing, like Iknow we have like a no girls
rule on this show, but I'minterviewing, uh, katherine
bennett you say that, like I'mnot gonna be involved uh, well,
I, I'm setting it up on there,so I'm just telling you and yes,
yes, I, I have that.
That's like 50 of it, yeah yeah,all right, I'm all right with

(01:24:05):
that, though I expect that ofyou good um.
I'm glad we have our lane setlook, that's kind of well, even
with the math father chironthing, like when father chiron
talks about ukraine.
I kind of set that aside and I,I I'm like okay, but he's, he's
got family in ukraine, likehe's ukrainian I kind of give

(01:24:26):
him.
I'm gonna let him be wrong aboutthis yeah, no, I do, because
he's too close to the situationto you know what I mean.
So it's like I have to allowhim because I love father chiron
.
I think he's when he's talkingtheology and things like that.

Speaker 2 (01:24:38):
He's you, you love him because of the lofton thing
no, no, I liked him before.

Speaker 3 (01:24:43):
That I really did like when he's discussing
something like because I have anaffinity for east you guys know
that I'm not actually, but like, I do, like I, I do like some
of the the whatever.
Well, I'm not getting into that, but I do like Father Sharon.
But if he goes off the railswith Israel in this show talking

(01:25:03):
about the woke right, I'm goingto have to have, I'm going to
have an opinion on it.
It's just impossible to not.
Yeah, as long as he doesn'ttalk about Ukraine, I like him,
you know so.
But Catherine Bennett I have toto talk to because of the
blowback she's receiving fromhaving to be fair, she's only
receiving blowback from like oneperson no, let's, I'm not gonna

(01:25:27):
.
Yeah, I mean I.
It's not that we we knowanything, we just see the public
.
Yeah, like he put a video outthe next day.
I I'm guessing there's clearlytension behind the scenes there,
but I do want to speak with herand ask her what made her start
to feel that she needed tospeak out on this issue, because
for me, it's been a progressiontoo.

(01:25:49):
I never wanted to touch thisissue, I hated this issue, and
now I have this thing on myconscience where I'm like I kind
of think I have to talk aboutthis.
I don't know what to do.
So we're going to talk toCatherine Bennett, but I do have
one more spicy segment for youguys.
I'm saving the best for last.
Did you send it to me?
I'm sending it to you right now.

(01:26:10):
Oh, you mean I didn't even get awarning.
I didn't even give you guys awarning on this one, and Nick
you're going to be in troublewhen we talk about this boy.
Oh, you're going to be introuble when we talk about this
Nick.
We will not release thissegment publicly.
Okay, I'll give you that Famouslast words.

(01:26:35):
I mean, it's going to gonna bea good segment.
So Ruslan Decided to talk.
Oh, no, no no, we're going totalk about this.
He decided to talk about therace question.
Oh, okay, he decided to diveinto the Controversy that Matt
Fradd Not Matt Fradd, matt WalshDiscussed with two teenagers.
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, the blackteenager that stabbed the white

(01:26:59):
teenager at the track meet.
So the clip is sending.
It's just taking a minute.
Hang on, wait, it didn't gothrough.
I don't know why.

Speaker 2 (01:27:10):
Molly, at this point, you still don't know who Ruslan
is.
Why is this not going through?

Speaker 4 (01:27:17):
Don't worry, molly, it's okay, I give you grace.
People need to be off theinternet way more these days.
I think In for no Goodclarification, tommy.
Good clarification.

Speaker 3 (01:27:35):
So, ruslan, this really isn't going to go public
because I don't, but whathappened was I.
Matt Walsh wrote his tweetabout black men being quick to
violence, and Ruslan respondedto Matt Walsh and said you know

(01:27:56):
you can't lump all black peopletogether.
What if we said I don't knowwhy this direct message is not
rob, I can't send it there forsome reason.
Can I text it to you?
Maybe not, if you want it on?
the screen which would be no.
Well, maybe you could send itsomewhere.
Is what I'm saying, becausemaybe it's my internet
connection.
I can't figure out why it's notworking then text isn't gonna

(01:28:18):
work you can't send it from yourtext to the dm?

Speaker 2 (01:28:22):
but if it's your internet connection, text isn't
gonna work let's see if that'swhat it is.

Speaker 4 (01:28:26):
I don't know what it is the most spicy clip, best for
last, talking about internetproviders um, let me know if you
get it if it's so good, anthony, I can always.
I mean, I'll stick around forthis conversation because I
think it's interesting, but ifit's like so good you want to
put it public, I can dip rightnow if you want.

Speaker 3 (01:28:44):
No I'll keep it private because I don't want to.
I don't want to, I don't wantto.
Um well, let's see how it goes.

Speaker 4 (01:28:50):
If you're comfortable with it, we'll put it the topic
in and of itself is not, and Ido believe in being authentic.

Speaker 3 (01:28:58):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, see if you can send it to the DM.
So Matt Walsh wrote his tweettalking about how Black men are
quick to violence and Ruslanresponded by saying this is
unfair, to say that Black men ingeneral are, or this is like

(01:29:20):
because the conversation came upabout black culture, Okay, and
he's like you can't just sayblack culture glorifies this,
it's not black culture, thingslike that.
And I responded he said so whatif you look down, break down
the stats and you see that allschool shooters are white and
you break down the stats and yousee that all the funny thing is

(01:29:42):
the majority of school shootersare black.
Are black because he's talkingabout the standard school
shooting.

Speaker 2 (01:29:48):
Well, yeah, he's talking about the ones he wants
to pick out.

Speaker 3 (01:29:50):
Right.
And also he said most serialkillers are white.
He said most pedophiles arewhite.
Now okay fine.

Speaker 2 (01:29:58):
Actually, per capita, blacks are more likely to be
serial killers.
Once again, every stat he comesup with is wrong.

Speaker 3 (01:30:05):
So even if he's right , though, the amount these
things are happening do notcompare to what we're like.
We see videos every single dayof black people being violent,
and in groups a lot of times.
I mean anytime you have agathering of black people, you

(01:30:26):
see violence.
So my point was, I said, ruslan, this is actually a very naive
argument.
Ruslan, this is actually a verynaive argument.
The fact is, everything aboutblack culture glorifies violence
, degenerate behavior.
It's even in their language,the way they speak, like their,

(01:30:47):
their slang, like everythingabout American black culture
glorify.
It's not just hip hop.
So Nick Fuentes is kind ofgoing going off and saying this
is genetic.
I don't, I don't know, I don'tthink, I don't care, it's not
about that.
Regardless of any of that, it'snot race.
This isn't a race issue.

(01:31:07):
It is a culture issue, becausewhen everything in your culture
glorifies gang violence,stealing, like, I've seen things
working in the city.

Speaker 2 (01:31:21):
So when I said that, privately, so he I'm putting
this up here just so Anthonycan't use this as a clip just to
show Ruslan.

Speaker 3 (01:31:28):
So he messaged me privately and he goes hey man,
do you think this is a raceissue, Like do you think
fundamentally, black people arepredisposed to violence?
And I said, no, I think it's aculture issue.
I think it's a culture issue.

Speaker 2 (01:31:41):
Well, culture can predispose them to violence.

Speaker 3 (01:31:44):
Okay, that's fine, but I think it's a culture issue
.
Like I don't even want to diveinto the genetics thing, I just
even if that is the casegenetics thing.
I I just even even if that isthe case, what is the culture is
part of race.
Yeah, well the okay.
So what I see in the city isstarting from when black
children are young.

(01:32:05):
They're in single motherhouseholds and if you guys ever
saw the way black women treattheir children, you'd be
appalled.
The way they speak to them, thequickness to violence with
young black boys is like you'dbe shocked the way the things
that I see.
I've had black guys jump on theside of my truck and attack me

(01:32:29):
through the truck because theythought I cut them off in
traffic.
Like the quickness to violenceis a very real thing.
You see, anytime something evengets heated, it's like this
quickness to violence, not evenlike it's this incident that
started this conversation.

Speaker 2 (01:32:48):
It does not seem to really have been heated at all,
like you know the guy touchedhis bag and the kids snapped up.

Speaker 3 (01:32:54):
So play the play the roussillon clip because I want
to talk about like what he kindof takes out of.
I only clipped a minute of it,but he does like a whole segment
talking about this.
You can't stand this guy like abudget center.

Speaker 2 (01:33:06):
Exit every mother okay.

Speaker 6 (01:33:10):
So what I'm saying is .
What I'm saying is the there'smultiple crimes I could point to
that are disproportionatelywhite men.
I'm not going to say that thisis an issue with white culture.
If we look at the people whoconsumed Howard Stern in the
late 90s, in the early 2000swhere there was where there was
him talking about finding 13year olds hot, when there was

(01:33:31):
all kinds of weird stuff thatHoward Stern was saying and the
vast majority of that audiencewas white men a disproportionate
number of that audience andentertaining that sort of stuff
was white men, just straight,weird old behavior.
I'm not gonna say that that is,then, indicative of all white
men or most white men.
Why?
Because there's a small numberof white men that commit a large

(01:33:52):
number of the beast cases, roadrage cases, the school cases.
Is he really?

Speaker 2 (01:33:57):
comparing road rage to one in 20 black men
committing murder in their lives.

Speaker 3 (01:34:02):
Not just that, he's talking about one shock jock of
one show and the men who wedon't have an entire culture.

Speaker 4 (01:34:11):
Yeah, it's a horror.

Speaker 3 (01:34:12):
That's actually I mean I would it's the worst
straw man argument I think I'veever heard.
It's very.
We are talking about the musicalone.
When you get, if you've everread cardi b lyrics or heard
Cardi B lyrics, they are themost vile, disgusting words

(01:34:35):
you'll ever hear in your life.
Like I've been in places whereI mean I'm in the city and you
hear people blasting this music,you cannot imagine the things
that they're talking about.
They all just the idea ofhaving several baby mamas, the
idea of having several babydaddies, is totally normal and

(01:34:57):
accepted, and just this is what.
This is what black culture inAmerica has become, and I'm not
saying it's not been purposelyinfluenced this way and I'm not
saying that there isn't, youknow, certain segments that are
maybe pushing this music onthese people but I'm curious to,
I'm curious to learn whatsegment you think is pushing
this on people.

(01:35:18):
But the point is when you havean entire Because look what we
don't grasp as white culture,like as whites, however you want
to put that Like I'm ItalianNick's yeah, you're not white,
whatever you are.
I'm kidding.
I'm American, that's you areI'm kidding, I'm american, but
what we don't?
Because you'd be more spanishthan mexican.

(01:35:40):
I'm just kidding um what, whatwe look.
So white kids will hear blackmusic and it's not the same
thing as black culture.
Like their whole culture isrevolved around this music.
This music is their church, itis their religion.
Like they, you identity.
It is their identity.
Rap music Like you, you don'tknow how important it is to

(01:36:05):
black culture.
It is everything Like it isthere.
It is there Gregorian chant andwhen that is all that's being
pumped into you and every singlesong is about robbing people,
killing people, being a you know, standing up and not taking
crap from anybody.
It has such an effect on youand it does affect white culture
.
There are subsets of whiteculture who are affected by this

(01:36:26):
music and you get wiggers andyou get white kids trying to act
like that and they go aroundbeing violent too, you know, but
not at the same rate no, not atthe same.
I'm talking.
So I said subsets of whiteculture.

Speaker 2 (01:36:38):
I know, but I'm saying even those subsets do not
commit violence.

Speaker 3 (01:36:41):
At the same, rate no, and not, not killing.
They don't have a blatantdisregard for human life.

Speaker 4 (01:36:46):
He's just saying the.
He's just saying the.

Speaker 2 (01:36:47):
Uh, the elements of the culture bled into right,
they have, even when I was a kid, but clearly they can't explain
at all yeah, exactly no, I'mjust trying to make a point
about the music itself.

Speaker 3 (01:36:58):
When I was a kid like me, and my friends were wiggers
, bro, like, wore the clotheslike that we called each other.
The n word like this is this ishow I grew up in suburban long
island and we would get infights all the time because
you're just italian no, itwasn't an italian thing.

(01:37:19):
It was like my subset of friendsgrowing up from like 15 to 19,
like that whole period of timewhen I was getting in trouble
doing all that bad stuff, likethe music had such a big part of
it.
It just did.
No, I'm not saying the music isthe only factor.
It's not even close to the onlyfactor.
It's the entire culture that isdegenerate.

(01:37:40):
It's just degenerate, itglorifies degeneracy.

Speaker 4 (01:37:45):
Yeah, I mean ultimately.
I mean what's so sad about this?
I've seen some people say it inthe chat, but I mean at its
core.
So much of it goes back down tojust the loss of the father
being in the household, yeah,and then and then just the loss
of, I mean, I mean I'm notsaying that's the only thing
it's not.

Speaker 3 (01:38:01):
I'm just saying it's because even when the fathers
were in the home, the fathersglorified this culture too,
around the kids like it's it's,it's so much, it is a very big
factor.
But you can't just put blackfathers in the home and think
this is not the only issue.

Speaker 4 (01:38:17):
That's what I'm saying like.
But if you look at the history,what I'm saying is that when you
look at particularly the 40s,50s, you don't see this insane
amount of crime rates, becausewhat you do see is, for instance
, where does gang culture comefrom?
Gang culture comes from the?
Uh, typically oftentimes blackkids in large cities not being
allowed to join things like theBoy Scouts, and so they went and

(01:38:37):
formed their own groups, and sothat's how the Bloods and the
Crips started.
It was two groups of kids thatweren't allowed to join.
They kind of formed their owngangs and then eventually the
whole war took off and that'show you saw the rise of rap
culture and stuff.
But during that whole time yousaw massive amounts of fathers
leave, single motherhood ratesskyrocket, abortion skyrocket,

(01:38:57):
and so around this you have, asyou've said, anthony, a culture
of degeneracy which has formed,which glorifies, uh, degenerate
behavior, glorifies murder andthings along that sort, and so
what ends up happening is thatwhen you have this poor boy who
gets stabbed, what I thinkquestionably makes me even more
mad is not even just the boybeing stabbed, but the amount of

(01:39:18):
people defending the stabbing,like we've seen it out now with
this case.

Speaker 6 (01:39:21):
There's so many people who are defending him.

Speaker 4 (01:39:23):
Yeah, it's the same and ironically, it's the same
people who are also praising theshooter of the health care CEO.
But it's like I mean, they'reglorifying this behavior, but
these again, it shouldn'tsurprise us.
This is the same group ofpeople that, back in 2020, were
rioting around the place right,burning buildings and all kinds
of stuff, and it goes to thecores of communities when I was

(01:39:45):
a Protestant right In the earlyportion of 2020.
And that was when I wasconverting right to the Catholic
church.
But one of the last times thatI went to our Protestant
charismatic service was right asthat old stuff was happening
and what took place was insane.
This pastor gets up, right,white pastor, young guy probably
in his mid thirties.
He gets up and he tells theentire audience.

(01:40:07):
We, as white people, need tocheck our privilege and we need
to listen to the grievances ofour black brothers and sisters,
because this was a hate crime.
And I was the only guy.
It was filled with collegestudents, all these college
students.
They're all like yeah, yeah,absolutely, pastor, absolutely.
I was the only guy who said inthe meeting do we even know that

(01:40:27):
this was a hate crime?
Because last time I checked,the cop is married to an asian
lady, not really a greatdefender of the Aryan race.
If you had to go down thatstick.

Speaker 3 (01:40:36):
Yeah, their definition of a hate crime is so
bizarre at this point, so broad.

Speaker 2 (01:40:40):
So for me, though, the thing that makes this a hard
discussion, makes it almost apointless discussion, is no one
ever talks about like what do wedo?

Speaker 4 (01:40:51):
Exactly.

Speaker 2 (01:40:51):
Right, like, what do we do exactly?
Right, we're all so busy we'reworrying about what caused it,
or because you know some peopleare racist but and some people
really don't want to seem racist, so they're not.
So, but like, who cares, whatdo we do about it?

Speaker 4 (01:41:03):
I agree, I fully agree.
What I think needs to be doneand I'm not trying to blow my
own trumpet here, but it's likeone of the things I've dreamed
about if I am to get intopolitics is one of the big
things I want to push iseducation reform in this
particular area of promotingvirtue again in schools.
In up until the 1950s weactually taught virtues in

(01:41:24):
schools right and it waspromoted and there was a sense
of dignity and honor that was atleast cultural they don't go to
school not, but my whole pointis just, this whole discussion
we're having is just one elementof a larger societal collapse
of us, just as a culturerejecting God, and so I think
that all of these areas,ultimately the answer to all of

(01:41:46):
these areas is the gospel right.
That's the ultimate answer toall of these things.
How that practically falls out,I think is a lot of times just
through education and throughpeople actually going out of
their way and saying like, do wementor people?
Do we build up mentorshipprograms where we get these
people?

Speaker 3 (01:42:01):
well, rob, you're asking like, what do we do about
it?

Speaker 2 (01:42:04):
I think the first thing is we stop being afraid to
have the conversation right,like that's step one, like you
stop, obviously, ultimately wethey, you know they need
conversion.
I get that like that's theultimate goal.
How do I protect my family inthe meantime without being
declared a racist for saying Idon't want to interact with
certain groups of people becauseone in 20 of them is gonna kill

(01:42:25):
someone in their life?

Speaker 3 (01:42:26):
okay.
So I think what matt walsh didthe other day is actually huge
because he had a very blatant,bold conversation.
He's pretty mainstream.
So when you get to the pointwhere somebody that mainstream
just gets up and says we're sickof this, like something needs
to be done because this issuehas been coddled for so long,

(01:42:50):
that you're it's just beencoddled for so long and it's
like we're afraid to even saylike this culture is vicious man
.
It is scary, like when you seethe kind of stuff that's
happening in interstate anddon't tell me it's because of
poverty, because it's not,because when you look at poor
white neighborhoods they're notkilling like that.

Speaker 2 (01:43:09):
Right you go to the middle of appalachia, which is
the the poorest, most you knowdrug riddled area in the in
white america, and the peoplethere are generally pretty good
people there's drugs there andthings like that, but they're
not going to kill you go to goto mississippi because it's like
mississippi, you have whitesand blacks in the same states,

(01:43:31):
the poorest state in the union,even though it's politically one
of the bases.

Speaker 4 (01:43:35):
Uh, and you have the same issue, right?
Why is it that one community isgoing about committing these
acts of violence and then theirneighbors in two, two
neighborhoods, over sameeconomic status or not?

Speaker 3 (01:43:48):
there's.
There's something that, likethis, has to be able to be
talked about, and it's notbecause we dislike the people,
it's not because we're judgingindividuals.
It's because there is thisglorification of sexual
degeneracy and violence on alevel that's incomprehensible.
I mean there's, there's, no,there's no, there's not even

(01:44:10):
like black leaders talking aboutthis.
Anyway, there used to be, thereused to be black leaders who
would speak out and say youshouldn't be letting them listen
to rap music and we should letyou, don't hear that anymore.
It completely flipped, like you,if you listen to Don Lemon from
20, 20 years ago, he wastalking about fatherlessness and
he was talking about all theseissues that we knew were going
to lead to mayhem, and noweverybody's afraid to even

(01:44:41):
mention it because you can'ttalk about race, and it's just
gotten to the point where I meanthey're heroes like this is.
This is actually a beautifulexample of why we have the
saints right, because the saintsare what we're supposed to be
looking to.
To exemplify what they have aregangster rappers and basketball
players who all end up in jailfor beating their wives or
stealing or selling drugs.
Like these are their rolemodels.
These are their saints.

Speaker 4 (01:45:02):
Yeah well, I think here's a good question for you.
Do you think walsh is comingout having this conversation
because he realizes that, inparticular, my generation is
already having this conversation?

Speaker 3 (01:45:14):
that's the thing he's trying to have it in a more
reasonable way, right even fiveyears ago when, when the zoomers
weren't influential at all itwould have never.

Speaker 4 (01:45:24):
It would never cross his mind yeah, because it's like
, like my generation, I can sitdown at any restaurant with the
friends after mass, I can go onyoutube, I can go on twitter
wherever and can go on Twitterwherever, and people are openly
saying two things.
They're having conversationsabout ethnicity and then they're
also saying why is it that we,as people of European descent,
have been so maligned for solong?

(01:45:46):
It's the same mentality thatwhy you're seeing a lot of
people go to the church.
It's basically, you see thislike leftist pagan starving
culture over here that'sbelittled people for so long
nick, oh am I no, anthony wasyou're good now

Speaker 2 (01:46:03):
okay we think it was you.

Speaker 3 (01:46:04):
Yeah, it's oh, it was okay, um, you're good so the
thing is, you're kind of look,you guys say what you want about
Fuentes.
The kid sets conversations.
Oh yeah, no.

Speaker 4 (01:46:19):
I don't deny that the kid is fearless.

Speaker 3 (01:46:21):
He's like I mean the things he's saying.
He's like white people breaktheir ass, go to work and drive
two hours to go to work, all sothat they don't have to live
around this.
That's literally what I do,dude.
I drive.
It's like two hours homesometimes because my I have to
commute from the city because Iwant to.

(01:46:43):
I don't want my family anywherenear that culture yeah, the.

Speaker 2 (01:46:47):
It's like that tweet.
I saw the.
Basically, the story of thereal estate market in the second
half of the 20th century waswhere can I live?
That is away from these people.
That isn't a four-hour drive towork that's it, that is the.

Speaker 3 (01:47:00):
That is the.

Speaker 2 (01:47:01):
It's like okay, how can I get away from this dude
like so my I literally, if I hadit moved four hours away from
my home in 2019, my wife, whowould have been pregnant at the
time, would have been driving onthose freeways where they were
riding and shutting down thefreeways in 2020.
Can you imagine that?

Speaker 3 (01:47:22):
dude, my, when we go to the city, even when we go to
holy innocence, to go to mass,like I have a conversation with
my family, like, if you like, ifyou see somebody that looks
unwell, whether it's a homelessperson or something, like you
have to like, don't, do not everhave an altercation with
anybody in the city.
Like don't you, it'll, it won'tgo well.

(01:47:44):
Do not ever have an altercation, I don't care what happens.
Turn, turn the other cheek andwalk away like it's just not
worth it.
I never have road rage in thecity because you never know who
the hell's pulling up on you.

Speaker 2 (01:47:58):
You, you can't even touch it.
You can't touch someone else'sbackpack now without getting
stabbed in the heart.

Speaker 3 (01:48:02):
It's crazy man.

Speaker 4 (01:48:03):
I'm telling you like this, this, this is just
hopefully this case is just arallying cry, because again it's
like our society needs majorhealing and just saying, let's
not talk.

Speaker 2 (01:48:16):
The problem is, I think this case could be the
opposite.

Speaker 4 (01:48:20):
No, exactly, I unfortunately think that, well,
here's what I think it could be,as you're saying, like a big
divider, but maybe even out ofthat great divide can at least
come awareness from just evenjust like white people, just
kind of like being like okay,yeah, this, this stuff needs to
be talked about.
I'm just saying that maybe itwill at least move the ball to

(01:48:40):
where we can actually have moreconversations about it.
Yeah, because the past.

Speaker 3 (01:48:43):
The past 15 years have been oh my gosh, I can't
touch this subject, I'm gonnaget canceled, but cancel culture
seems to be over now and it'slike like you would have been
canceled for that conversationmatt walsh had five years ago
four years ago, you know, youcouldn't even have that during
blm and stuff like that likeit's it's cancel.
Culture seems to be over and itseems like it's okay to have at

(01:49:04):
least rational discussions, butI mean you can't say this stuff
went as is saying on youtube,but you can start to talk about
some of the difficulties of.
I mean, this is what happenswhen you allow your borders to
open up and you allow othercultures to come in.
It's like what is going tounite us as a people?
I don't know.
And the thing is there issomething to guys.

(01:49:29):
You need Lila Rose on here tohelp you understand the George
Floyd movement.
Look, there is something to meand Bobby were talking about
this today.
All right, so I hate the termwoke, right, I really do.
I hate that.
James Lindsay came up with that.
I hate his premise, everything.
But there is a group of youngwhite men who are like oh, you

(01:49:51):
guys want to play the woke gameidentity politics.
We're going to play it andwe're going to win.
And they're now identifying aswhite males and going.
You've been telling us for howlong that we are the?
L, we are the ills of societyand we're the problem with
everything.
Well, now, guess what?
We're going to stand up for usthe problem was never identity
politics.

Speaker 2 (01:50:11):
People have identities, right, you have your
culture, you have your nation,you have your people.
You have identities.
The problem was making upidentities and then playing
politics according to that.
You know what I mean.
The problem wasn't identitypolitics it was their identities
.

Speaker 3 (01:50:30):
I don't think there's ever been a white identity in
America, though the question isshould there even really been a
white identity in america,though?

Speaker 2 (01:50:36):
like well, you have some questions like should there
even really be a white?

Speaker 3 (01:50:38):
I shouldn't like I think you have.
You should have a, like youhave an attack, like it used to
be, like, especially in new york.
That's really all I know.
But you'd have, like the whatthe italian neighborhood, you'd
have the polish neighborhood andlike they may all be white, but
there's different cultureswithin that that.

Speaker 2 (01:50:52):
I would say the white identity has been forced.
It's been forced to be createdbecause of all the opposition to
white people.

Speaker 4 (01:51:03):
I would say that and I'd add one factor, which would
be I think that historically,the United States saw its
identity as white European.
Because when you go back to theoriginal like, I think it's
like 1789 or 1790 statute on whois an american, you know, is
the famous, you're a white malewho owns property, and that

(01:51:23):
stays the same all the way until, essentially, the civil war.
And then, even until then, like, like, asians weren't allowed
to become citizens of the unitedstates until the 50s.
You know, it's like that wasn'teven that long ago.
And so point is, it's just, Ipersonally think again, and I'm
trying to not make this a raceissue because, again, like, to
me, races don't exist,ethnicities, but like a species,

(01:51:44):
doesn't exist.
But I just don't know how youcan have a zillion and one
different cultures in the samecountry.
Like we know, this doesn't work, because, look, when you shove
the native american tribestogether and say, get along, it
doesn't work.
When you shove the africantribes together into countries,
it doesn't work.
When you shove the iraqistogether after they did world
war one, it doesn't work.
We're having the same problemnow.
I, I do think there is anamerican.

Speaker 3 (01:52:06):
White people are getting along, the white
europeans are getting along,just no, exactly there's no
division.

Speaker 4 (01:52:11):
Only after world war ii only after world war ii,
because there's a lot, there's alot of marxism that that's tied
into this overarching story ofbeing going into schools, going
into colleges and being like youguys have been the oppressors,
so now you need to basicallyflagellate yourself, you're
right?

Speaker 3 (01:52:27):
because there used to be like real enmity between the
italians and the irish Polishand like you couldn't go into
their neighborhoods in New Yorkif you weren't one of them Like
and it wasn't just white black,it was very distinctly your
ethnicity.
They would, they would like theGermans live with the Germans
and the.

Speaker 2 (01:52:47):
So, like in my town growing up, you know town of
20,000, not so not a big city,but not a super small town, but
it was a town of mostlyimmigrants who were working the
stockyards that were there, andyou had your bosnian hall, your
croatian hall, your polishnational, you know allegiance
hall, all these different littleethnic halls that everyone
would go hang out at because you, you, you weren't going to hang

(01:53:10):
out at the other.
You know the other group'splace.

Speaker 3 (01:53:15):
Oh, he sends a bunch of Yankees trying to solve a
problem they created.

Speaker 6 (01:53:17):
Of course, the issue then said what?

Speaker 3 (01:53:19):
happened.

Speaker 4 (01:53:20):
Are you calling me a Yankee?
Do you want to see what'sbehind my head right now?

Speaker 6 (01:53:25):
You're talking about me.
Okay, I was about to be like.

Speaker 3 (01:53:29):
The English aren't in charge of it anymore.

Speaker 4 (01:53:33):
Calling me a Yankeees fighting words man.

Speaker 3 (01:53:36):
Honestly, this was the best segment of the show.
We should have started withthis.
What did you want to do withthe Connor?
Oh man, all right, we're goingto wrap this one.
Get some sleep tonight, but allright.
So Tuesday All right, nick, wetalked to Nick behind the scenes
, so here's the deal.
So Tuesday all right, nick, wetalked to Nick behind the scenes
, so here's the deal.
Nick is going to probably justcome on these members shows and
when we have good segments,we're like we're going to

(01:53:57):
release the segment of theAnglican, catholic Anglican
thing.
That'll be a segment and maybewe'll do the Atlantic article or
something like that, maybe justthe Anglican one.

Speaker 2 (01:54:06):
That's probably the best the Atlantic one sucked
yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:54:10):
The entire one.

Speaker 2 (01:54:10):
The Dire Wolves.
One was kind of funny, though,honestly.

Speaker 4 (01:54:14):
What was the funniest thing was Anthony and you
trying to figure out what theheck Connor had and like going
on for 15 minutes of awkwardLike speculation.

Speaker 3 (01:54:24):
He really made that awkward though.

Speaker 2 (01:54:27):
I'm not trying to, but it was funny.

Speaker 3 (01:54:30):
You need to release that he kind of made that a
little awkward.
I'm not taking blame for thatone, Greg.
I have to get up in the morningfor work.
Nick's going to join us for themember shows because, especially
this Tuesday coming up, I'mgoing to, I'm guessing, have

(01:54:50):
clips of Matt Fratt and FatherChiron.
We're going to have to talkabout the jq again because
everywhere I look, you gotdouglas murray and dave smith
talking about it, you gotcatholic unscripted talking
about you.
I mean, it's just everywhere Ifreaking look this thing.
So I guys I'm sorry I know thistopic gets tiresome, but it's
gonna wish a major war wouldbreak up before tuesday, so we

(01:55:13):
could talk about that, orsomething.
It's gonna be a theme for acouple of weeks.

Speaker 4 (01:55:15):
That's all I'm saying I'll, when everything quads
down, I'll say, I'll definitelypop in on a tuesday or two if
there's just like good averageyeah, well, this coming tuesday
is gonna be gonna be.

Speaker 3 (01:55:25):
This coming tuesday is gonna be a little bit of an
issue for you, so I don't thinkyou should go on that one.

Speaker 4 (01:55:29):
Well, you know, the thing is is it's like the.
The cool thing is is, if thisconversation continues to be
pushed forward which it is thenit's like I don't have to worry
because it's like you know me,it's like I actually don't mind
having.
You're not bringing fatheraltman on now for our sanity, we
will not, so but uh, yeah, no,this was uh, this was fun I.
I just want to say I'm, Imissed you too.

Speaker 3 (01:55:50):
Like yeah, me too man that's why because you couldn't
make it Tuesday, or even Ithink you, it's been like two
episodes.

Speaker 4 (01:55:56):
It was three.
First one I was ill with justthese allergies in Texas.
Second one was you guys weredoing trivia and I was just like
I just can't do that.
And then third one, I was justit's, it's been finals.

Speaker 2 (01:56:08):
You should have come on and just destroyed those
other Zoomers.

Speaker 4 (01:56:12):
Was it a fun show at least.

Speaker 2 (01:56:13):
They sucked, I mean, at trivia.
They're good guys, they're goodguys, but they were so bad at
trivia.
You guys are starting Catholicpodcasts and you don't know any
of these answers.

Speaker 4 (01:56:26):
Oh, brother, you'll have to send me the link.
We do love those guys, but yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:56:32):
Yeah, we do.
They need to study theircatechism.
Oh oh, you should have beenhaving trivia.

Speaker 4 (01:56:38):
It was so boring I could have been lived it up a
bit.
I guess, rob, what you need todo is you need to make amends
with the pipe cottage guy, and Iwant to have him on because I
I've been reading shelby foot.
I want to talk about the civilwar.

Speaker 3 (01:56:56):
That's my mind all, all his novus auto principle
goes out the window of his civilwar talk.
That's what I've learned.

Speaker 2 (01:57:02):
Yeah right, I'm not even like the ssbx supremacist
over here, I'm like I don't wantto talk to that modernist
that's so funny no um, we shouldtry, jeb smith modernist.

Speaker 3 (01:57:16):
That's so funny.
No, um, we should try jeb smith, it's an author.
Um, steve, it's the agony inthe garden.
Todd, knock it off.
Yeah, that's right, they didn'tknow the first sorrowful
mystery nick.

Speaker 2 (01:57:21):
No, they didn't know the first station.

Speaker 3 (01:57:23):
Oh no, first station I was texting you and todd and I
go isn't it the same as the?
As, that's right, it's.
It's Jesus.
The first station is Jesuscondemned and the first
sorrowful mystery is Jesus inthe garden.
But I got I got like confusedin the text message.

Speaker 2 (01:57:39):
Yeah, yeah.
Afterwards I can't believe theydidn't know that it's just the
first sorrowful mystery.
And.
Todd and I are like no it's not, I'm sorry, it's the second
sorrowful mystery.

Speaker 3 (01:57:55):
All.
It's the second.
All right, so we're gonna wrapthis up.
We will see you guys on Tuesdayand get ready for more JQ talk.
We'll see you guys.

Speaker 2 (01:57:59):
Francis, please come out with another terrible
document we can talk aboutinstead we're gonna have fun
talking about.

Speaker 3 (01:58:06):
Maybe we'll see if I can get a guest for that one.

Speaker 2 (01:58:08):
We'll see a guest for the maybe Bobby will come on
for the JQ.
Yeah, I'm sure the Maybe Bobbywill come on.

Speaker 3 (01:58:16):
Yeah, I'm sure the literal Talk about the.

Speaker 2 (01:58:17):
Byzantine priest.

Speaker 3 (01:58:18):
Come on, bobby.
Come on and talk about theByzantine priest with us.
That'll get you in good withhim.
Alright, guys, we will see youguys on Tuesday.
Thank you.

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