July 22, 2025 • 44 mins
Host Ron Klemm is joined by Danielle Feinstein, Assistant Executive Director of The Bach Society of Saint Louis, to kick off season three of Bach Talk with soprano Bethany Worrell. They talk about how teaching and performing go hand in hand and what it means to grow as both an artist and educator. Bethany shares stories from her career, reflections on choosing growth over perfection and why “being an artist is very cool.” View the Bach Talk Show Notes here. Learn more about The Bach Society of Saint Louis at bachsociety.org. Bach Talk is a Registered trademark of The Bach Society of Saint Louis.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
This is Bach Talk.
(00:25):
What I do think about is feeling whatever I have determined to be the main emotion of the piece, and breathing in that.
So the few bars before I come in, I will be breathing in this serene, calm, but hopeful feeling.
And if I breathe in that way for those bars and for my first entrance, it will be those things.
(00:51):
The audience knows to listen for auburn.
Ooh, you know, I think they'd get more out of it because I get more out of it.
Being an artist is very cool.
(01:22):
Being an artist is very cool indeed.
Who would doubt that?
Coming from someone as eloquent and sensitive, yet at the same time so vivacious and bubbly as Bethany Worrell.
That's Bethany singing the pivotal soprano solo in the Brahms' A German Requiem at a recent concert by The Bach Society of Saint Louis.
(01:45):
Hello, I'm Ron Klemm.
Welcome to Bach Talk.
Praised by Opera News for her gleaming tone, such as we're hearing right now, Bethany Worrell is equally at home on the stage, in the concert or recital hall, or in the classroom or vocal studio.
She just completed her first year as the new Director of Vocal Studies at the University of Missouri, St. Louis.
(02:13):
We locals call it UMSL.
A few weeks prior to her appearance with the Bach Society this past March, Dr. Worrell invited us over to her neck of the woods, the beautiful Two Hill Performing Arts Center at UMSL.
The Bach Society's Danielle Feinstein joined me, and we had a wonderful time talking about the Brahms Requiem, of course, but also about much more, performing in general, Bethany's approach to singing, education, even tricks of the trade.
(02:44):
It took no time at all for us to realize just how blessed we are to have Dr. Bethany Worrell in our town.
First of all, thank you for inviting us to your house.
This is really a wonderful facility here, the Two Hill Performing Arts Center.
You've performed here already, and tell us a little bit about that.
(03:06):
I started last fall at UMSL at the University of Missouri, St. Louis, and one of the first bright spots in the semester was that Dr. David Wacyk, who's our Director of Orchestras, and Dr. Jim Henry, who's our Director of Choirs, invited me to perform on the first Masterworks concert that UMSL has done since the pandemic, since 2020.
(03:32):
We performed the Poulenc Gloria, and I was the Soprano Soloist.
It was fantastic.
You're kind of the new kid on the block.
I moved here in August.
Settled in right away.
Yes.
I'm the new Director of Vocal Studies at UMSL, and I wear a lot of hats, which coming from being a performer, that's kind of the norm, so I feel very comfortable wearing lots of hats.
(03:55):
One thing I do, I run the Solo Voice Program here at the university.
I'm in charge of all the adjunct voice teachers.
They're on my team.
Our vocal collaborative pianists are on my team, and I organize all of the solo offerings.
We have a diction teacher.
We have diction that we offer.
(04:17):
I assign all of the voice students to their studios, and I teach a good number of them privately.
In addition, I teach the Singing Actors Workshop, and we have our first class of that this semester, and we're doing a musical review.
We're doing Rodgers and Hammerstein's Grand Night for Singing.
(04:41):
Cool.
Yeah, it's going to be really fun.
Tell us about your career path coming to St. Louis.
I grew up in West Central Illinois.
I grew up in Macomb, Illinois, about three hours north.
Did my undergraduate degree there.
I took a gap year, and then I got into the New England Conservatory of Music for my master's degree, and I loved Boston.
(05:06):
I went there, had a lot of success at the school, but knew I wanted to pursue a classical career, and knew I really loved Boston beauty, and a really small town girl from Illinois, and then going out to this major city, but felt really at home there.
I went to school there for two years, and then for seven years, I lived and worked and sang in Boston professionally.
(05:31):
Then I wanted a change of pace, and so I decided to move to New York City.
I sang there for two and a half years.
At that time, I always knew I wanted to go and get my doctorate so I could be a university professor, and I felt ready for that part of my career, and took auditions.
(05:52):
Miraculously, I started in fall of 2020, so I beat the pandemic.
While a lot of people were struggling, I was in school, which was helpful, and I just graduated in May of 2024 with my doctorate from University of Michigan.
Then I promptly moved to Dallas, Texas for the summer to be with my fiancee, and was singing down there.
(06:17):
I sang professionally in Boston, New York, and Dallas, and was chosen to be the new director of vocal studies, and moved here in August.
What precipitated that move?
Let me ask a sub-question.
Please.
Some people who are in cities like New York and Boston will get the sense that they're a small fish in a big pond.
(06:42):
Did you have any of that, or was it just because I want to be in the Midwest?
I'm a Midwestern girl.
Well, I took auditions at many schools.
Michigan was my dream school because it just has a fantastic vocal heritage, but also because maestro Martin Katz was there.
I worked with Martin at Songfest in 2011, right after grad school, and I found him so inspiring.
(07:15):
Ever since 2011, I knew I wanted to go to Michigan if I could get in.
That was my dream school.
I got in, and I got to work with him a lot.
He told me when I graduated, I could call him Martin and not Mr. Katz.
That's why I'm saying Martin.
Very cool.
I felt like I had arrived.
You had.
Absolutely.
But going back to the Midwest, I knew that after being for about 15 years away from home, away from, pretty far from my parents, I thought, wouldn't it be great if I could land a teaching job in the Midwest?
(07:53):
It might be helpful to go to a school in the Midwest to make connections in the Midwest.
I was open to everywhere, but I'm really happy I ended up in St. Louis.
Well, we're thrilled to have you.
Tell us about your first musical memories.
When did you start singing, and when did a light bulb go off and say, oh, wow, I really like this?
(08:16):
I started singing really early.
I did children's musicals in Macomb, actually, where I grew up.
When I was in seventh grade, my parents put me in voice lessons.
I remember it just was organic.
(08:38):
It was like drinking water.
This just made sense to be singing and taking lessons.
I've taken lessons since I was in seventh grade for a really long time of my life.
When I was in high school, I feel like for most musicians, there's a piece of music or a few pieces of music that that was the turning point.
(09:03):
I was always serious about it, but I remember we sang Morton Lordson's O Manum Mysterium.
It was just beautiful, right?
Beautiful.
I loved every minute of rehearsal.
I thought, okay, this is what I want to do.
It was a very internal feeling.
(09:24):
Yep, that was it.
It's interesting that it wasn't solo.
It was choral.
Who had the greatest impact on you?
Was there an individual or a group of people or something that really made a major impact in a turning point in your life to move into music?
Is mom listening?
(09:45):
Of course she's listening.
I have to start with my parents.
No, my parents are both avocational musicians.
There was a lot of singing in the home.
My dad played guitar, played trumpet, was a song leader at church.
My mom was also a song leader at church, played piano, played a lot of other instruments.
(10:07):
From as far back as I remember, there was always singing.
There's just so many people in my life, and I'm trying to think of an early person.
Actually, my third teacher, but my first teacher that I was with for a long time is named Terry Chasteen, and he is still a professor at Western Illinois University.
(10:33):
He has a glorious tenor voice.
Actually, as a young singer, he was brought up here.
He sang many seasons with St. Louis Opera Theater.
His joy for the craft and joy for music and openness to everyone who would come into the studio, no matter if they wanted to be a performer, educator, just wanted to sing for fun, that made a big impact on me.
(11:03):
Now as a performer,
it made an impact on me growing up, but now as an educator, he's one of the people that I
just find inspiration from because while we want to train up great singers that go on to sing or
are music educators or are working in the field, we also are inspiring artists that are engaging
(11:28):
in any way, and I feel like I learned that boots on the ground from him being a junior in high
school when I started working with him.
That's a really special experience that I don't think everybody has from working with somebody like that.
I'm curious, what brought you over to the stage?
(11:48):
I know you've sung quite a few roles.
Was it just a product of, I'm in this classical music program, so I have to audition for these shows, or you talked about starting this singing actor program.
It seems like you're also very passionate about the acting side of it.
What was the draw there?
What was your first role?
My first opera role, let's start with that, was at Western Illinois University.
(12:15):
I was a sophomore.
For some reason, I didn't audition my freshman year.
You can ask Mr. Chastain about that.
I don't remember.
You'll follow up.
But I auditioned.
They were doing Candide because we had this amazing tenor, this amazing baritone, and this amazing soprano who was a senior.
(12:38):
I knew that I would not be cast as Cunegonda.
I was a sophomore and I'd never been in an opera.
I knew that, but I have a lot of tenacity.
I learned Glitter and Be Gay as a sophomore for the audition, and I did it.
They cast me as Peckett.
(13:00):
That was my first role.
I was cast alongside a lot of upperclassmen, and they all just took me under their wing, and it was really fun.
But the impetus for that, I just loved singing and storytelling.
At that time, I just wanted to be singing as much as I could sing.
(13:21):
It didn't matter what I was singing.
I knew I wanted to sing mainly classical, though at that time I also was singing a lot of jazz.
They let me dabble as much as possible at WIU, which I think that's actually really helpful, and I want my students to be able to do that here.
But I just knew I wanted to be part of the show, and I wanted to challenge myself and sing harder music, I think.
(13:44):
Oh, I do want to say about a fulfilling opera role.
The last opera role I did, I got to sing Don Anna in Don Giovanni.
Earlier in life, I was a soubrette.
Now, I'm more of a lyric, and that's what...
What's a soubrette?
Is that a tiny soprano?
(14:04):
Maybe vocally speaking.
Maybe not physically speaking.
So a soubrette, it's a lighter voice, so you wouldn't necessarily be singing over a lot of tubas, because the carrying power is a little different.
But light and frothy, and a lot of times a soubrette is really fun and funny, and I enjoy being comedic.
(14:28):
But now my voice is more darker and more mature, and that happens as the voice ages, so I'm more of a lyric soprano now.
And so Don Anna is not a funny character.
She is a very serious character.
I had played Zerlina earlier in that opera, and she's a very funny character.
But Don Anna helped me figure out more of my dramatic self, and I got to prepare it with Maestro Katz conducting.
(14:54):
And it was the last opera he did at Michigan before he retired, and so that was incredible.
It was very artistically fulfilling.
So concert repertoire, I think my gateway into concert repertoire was art song.
I think if you asked me what my biggest love is, is actually doing art song and art song recitals.
(15:15):
And then there's kind of this gateway of chamber music and concert repertoire.
And there's something very satisfying with collaborating with so many people, with a conductor, but making music that, yes, it has drama.
I mean, there's definitely drama in the Brahms Requiem, right?
(15:37):
But it is also intimate like art song, I feel like, but on a very big stage.
But the feelings are intimate, and I feel like I get to bring out a lot of myself in it, maybe even more so than opera, and I really, really enjoy that.
(16:44):
The fifth movement, Ihr habt nun Traurigkeit, you now have sorrow, aber, but, but I will see you again, and your heart shall rejoice, and your joy no one will take from you.
Comforting words from a German Requiem by Johannes Brahms, sung by soprano Bethany Worrall, along with The Bach Society of Saint Louis Chorus and Orchestra, Dennis Sparger conducting.
(17:12):
The concert took place March 22, 2025.
More about that, and a bevy of other topics, with our guest today, Dr. Bethany Worrall, straight ahead.
Along with Danielle Feinstein, I'm Ron Klemm.
This is Bach Talk.
(17:34):
I want to talk about the soprano role, which is limited to the fifth movement.
After sitting there for, what, 45 minutes, better part of an hour, and then you have to come in, and your first entrance, after basically sitting around, goes up to a high A.
(17:57):
Pianissimo, right?
Okay, what's your secret?
There's several parts to the secret.
One is to be very warmed up before the concert, right?
You just, you need to be very warm, very flexible.
I work, my technique being really flexible, as I work on the piece now, several weeks before the concert, I'm working it every day to make sure it's really in my voice.
(18:26):
There's a point where you get something in your voice, and you do feel like you can kind of just get up and sing it, and that's what I'm working towards for this.
The secret, and this would be good for all students, I think, is that while you're sitting there, during loud sections, you can very quietly make noise.
(18:49):
You are revealing secrets.
Very quietly, so don't tell Maestro, but very quietly, just so I know it's out there, very quietly, just like that's it.
You're not going to take away from anything, it's during that brass or timpani, when the whole choir is singing forte, you're, and you don't, you're not taking anything away, but you can kind of just make a little sound.
(19:14):
If they allow me to have water, that's helpful, to have a little water on stage to, to be doing that.
If, if for some reason you wouldn't be allowed water, you're hydrating all day anyway, but I will also say, this is the voice teacher in me, water helps just the inside of the mouth, but it takes two hours for, when you drink water, for it to actually like hydrate your muscles, and so I'm hydrating all day.
(19:41):
You want your mouth to not be dry, but, but it really, if I've had a lot of water, I should be okay.
The other thing, and we talked about a mentality issue, is that really connecting with the text, but also I am constantly, while I'm sitting there, I'm listening to everything around me for those first 45 minutes, and I'm trying to be completely in the moment, and enjoying the music, just like the audiences, and I feel like that settles me in a way that can help the singing as well.
(20:12):
So now you have all my secrets.
So since you were talking about your tips and tricks, okay, I'm curious if you have any, what I'm going to call, whirlisms, any phrases, key ideas, tips, pieces of advice, that if we asked one of your students, they would say, oh, this, this is what she always says.
(20:35):
Oh, I wish we had them here.
There's a lot of things, I think.
The one thing that is really big that I'm trying to impress upon the whole vocal area, not just my private students, is that we're, anybody that's auditioning you, anyone that's teaching you, we are not concerned with perfection.
We are concerned with a growth mindset.
(20:56):
Several years ago, I actually came to St. Louis to do an audition boot camp at Winter Opera St. Louis, and Costis Protopappas was here, the conductor, and he worked with us, and he said, we do not care about perfection.
Every time I hear you, I want to hear you getting better, and you need to be concerned with raising your average constantly, this growth mindset.
(21:22):
And so I try to impress this upon my students, that if you're doing the work, if you're practicing every day, if you're putting in the work, and if you look back on where you were a month ago, you're probably going to be farther down the path.
It might vary from week to week, because sometimes it's two step forward, one step back, but growth mindset is the biggest thing.
I think that, I hope that they would tell you that right away.
(21:45):
Well, I'd like to get into teaching a little bit, if you don't mind.
Sure.
Because either you said this, or someone said it about you, but you talked about, or we heard about you and teaching as being kinesthetic.
What does that mean, and how does that manifest itself in your work?
(22:07):
Great.
So kinesthetic learning is body learning, basically, and so how do you connect with your body, be aware of how your body is while you're singing, because our body is our instrument.
I feel like a lot of people say that, and I try to help my students manifest that throughout all of their singing.
(22:30):
So I help them cultivate a very deep awareness.
I ask them a lot of questions, like, what does that feel like?
What does it feel like here in your body?
What does it feel like in your soft palate?
What does it feel like in your ribs?
Like, take your mind's eye and put it there, now do it, what did you notice in this area?
I use a lot of tools, so, like, I use TheraBands, they're stretchy bands, and that can help students feel what support does in the body.
(23:00):
When you stretch, actually,
from side to side, and while you're singing, the core engages, but it doesn't overly engage,
it engages, I like to call it the baby bear principle, there's not too hot, not too cold,
just right from the three bears, and so if you over engage, you're going to be locked up vocally,
if you under engage, you're not going to have any power, and it's going to sound really kind of
(23:24):
wimpy, you need the just right engagement, and using TheraBands can actually help you find it
right away.
So I use lunges, I use squats, there's lots of tools in the studio, and I also do a lot
of straw learning, to like sing through a straw, because that can help regulate how well the vocal
(23:45):
folds come together, so teaching them how their body actually is their instrument, and I guess I'll
say one more thing about that, I feel like it's unfair that a lot of singers don't understand
their instrument until they're in college, because that's maybe the first time they have private
lessons, but you know if you're in seventh grade and you take up the clarinet, your teacher
(24:11):
tells you how to clean the clarinet, put the clarinet together, you understand what a read is,
you understand the instrument, and so one of my passion projects is working with high school and
junior high choir teachers to work on how can they explain anatomy to their
students in a way that works in the corporate setting, because it's not a private lesson,
(24:33):
but how can everyone understand what their, how their ribs work, how their diaphragm works, how
breathing works, and I do believe if we dissect a frog in high school, we can understand how our
ribs work, and so kind of working with teachers to embolden them in working with groups,
(24:54):
because it is different than one-on-one.
But you don't dissect any frogs?
No dissection of humans or frogs.
Well, maybe, but what are the issues that you find most often with college-age singers?
(25:16):
What are the things that you go, ah, that's why I'm here, I'm here to correct this or that, or impress on them this or that?
What is it?
What are those things?
So I'll get to technique in a second, but taking up physical space that actually deals with technique, but also performance and also confidence.
(25:37):
If you actually take up physical space and you kind of sit in that or stand in that, you will actually feel more confident.
Is it on Grey's Anatomy where they do the hero pose?
It's that same concept, right?
And so how do you stand when you sing in a way that is not because my professor told me so, but because I want to take up space and be an artist and send this out?
(26:04):
It dovetails with technique, but it's that performance training and confidence training, because say they get a degree from here but then decide to do something completely different with their life, all of that singing and confidence training will show up very well in them for whatever they choose to do.
The other thing is how do you breathe in your body?
(26:28):
That's the main thing, and I think that's the main thing across the nation.
It's not just here, but it's really cool to see when they start to take, it also goes with taking up space in your body, and it's very cool to see when they start to do it.
And we have a weekly studio class
where I workshop with them in front of, the students in front of each other, and we do that
(26:49):
for the entire vocal area, so I work with everyone in that instance, and they, we ask them what do
you notice, what your colleague is doing, and almost all the time when somebody has changed
their breathing, they're like, oh my gosh, look at their ribs, look at the low breath, and so they're
beginning to get it.
It's really cool.
(28:20):
We never planned on a rendezvous.
It's just the way of the world.
Lauf der Welt by Edvard Grieg.
From his opus 48 set of songs, Bethany Worrell, joined by pianist Muse Yee, recorded live at Bethany's second dissertation recital at the University of Michigan's Britten Recital Hall, December 2023.
(28:45):
Just ahead, more with soprano Bethany Worrell, along with Danielle Feinstein.
Today, I'm Ron Klemm.
This is Bach Talk.
Teaching is a vocation.
Is it more than that?
(29:06):
Do you feel like it's a means to an end?
You want to do that so that you can perform, or is it some sort of obligation or responsibility?
Is it a calling?
How do you view your work?
I would say it definitely falls into the calling category.
It's interesting, ever since being an undergraduate student, I knew that I wanted to be a teacher.
(29:33):
I knew that I did not want to be a choral director.
Like, I didn't want to be with a whole group as my main thing.
I actually love working with choirs now as a clinician about how the voice works, but I wanted to work one-on-one with students.
And one thing that motivates me in that is that I see progress constantly with them, and it doesn't matter how fast it is.
(30:00):
I think that they should progress at their own pace.
I mean, I try to get them to invest, but if they're investing and they're progressing, I'm really excited for them.
And so I knew very early on I wanted to work with solo voices, and I actually gave lessons while I was an undergraduate student at WIU.
(30:21):
I'm better now.
You know, it was good.
I think I did good work, but now I know so much more, and of course I do, but learning about the voice is a journey.
I can't wait until I'm 80 and teaching voice and what I know then, right?
The calling part, like after I graduated and I went to Boston, I was teaching voice students there.
(30:45):
For me, teaching and performing, they go hand in hand.
When I, as a teacher, as I get better as a teacher, I get better as a performer and vice versa.
I can't imagine a world where I wouldn't do both.
Yeah, I love sharing music with others, and I think that that is the basis for both.
(31:07):
That's the foundation that's the same.
I recently performed a house concert, and afterwards several of the audience members came up and they said, we love the educational things you shared.
And I think that's great.
I did not realize that I was educating them.
(31:27):
I was just sharing things that I thought were really neat about the piece.
And so I think that's interesting too, that I think it's in my bones, this education, and I'm thinking maybe I can make it a little more fun next time in the house concert.
But, you know, the history of Brahms Requiem, or like what the words mean, it impacts me so much as a singer and an artist.
(31:54):
I want, if I have an opportunity to talk to an audience member, I like to tell them what this word means, because it's so profound.
Like, we don't all speak German, right?
Or all these languages.
But part of the study of the singer is to learn these things, so you can do justice to the piece, of course.
But I would say Brahms Requiem, what I'm thinking is the word aber, it is the hinge point of movement five.
(32:23):
And aber means but.
It's the connector.
Yes.
Right?
Yep.
It's the conjunction, right?
But the conjunction, but it's in real terms, in very real terms, like, but I will be with you.
Right?
Like, you do not need to be sorrowful anymore.
It completely changes what the piece is about.
(32:46):
And if the audience knows to listen for aber, ooh, you know, they'll just, I think they'd get more out of it, because I get more out of it.
But yeah, I think education and singing and performing, they just all go together.
You already talked a little bit about some of the lessons that you've learned.
What about those do you pass on?
(33:08):
That is one, you know, as you're sitting there in that studio, and you're working one-on-one, as you said, you'd love to do, working one-on-one with someone, and all of a sudden, that thing comes in the back of your mind, that thought, oh, you know, I remember when I was told that, what are some of those things?
Stand up straight is a good start.
(33:31):
That's great.
I think the thing, the thing about taking up space is a big thing.
And, and I do, I know I already shared it, but what Maestro Protopapas said about, we're concerned with your average growing, not perfection.
I think a lot of us singers, and I see this in the students today.
I'm definitely a perfectionist.
(33:52):
I'm a recovering perfectionist.
There should be a society for us all.
Do you ever fully recover, however?
I'm working on it.
But you know, the audience, while I am going to sing diamond and crystalline sounds on this, the audience, as long as you are invested, and you are completely in the moment, and you are open with your artistry, the audience doesn't know what the perfection in your head is.
(34:20):
The perfection that we think about is only in our head.
Obviously, if notes and rhythms are wrong, that's just, that's basal, right?
Like, but if I sing it, and it's beautiful, but it's 1% away from what I had in my practice, that's a perfectionism that's not helpful, right?
(34:42):
If I'm committed in the moment, and making music with the ensemble, and singing my best in that moment, that's all I can do.
And if I judge myself against some idea of what I could do, it just kind of, it makes everything crumple, because also singers were artists.
And so it's just strange, the perfectionism and the artist don't always work well together.
(35:05):
So I try to teach the students a lot about, let go of the perfection, just do the work, and trust the work, and be fully in the moment.
And that's a big thing to work on.
That's, we work on that every lesson.
Creativity is a language of vulnerability.
And I love the language of manifestation that you used.
You said, I am going to sing this crystalline.
(35:28):
Is there a single phrase, word, that you tell yourself before every performance, anything to get in the zone, or even a physical action?
Yeah, I definitely find a way to just sit, you know, alone, and sometimes I'll have my eyes closed, and think through singing.
(35:52):
I also really try to feel my weight deeper in my body.
I've been told that I rev high, which I love.
And it's because I get excited about things, which is great.
I am a soprano.
It's good.
But to be like, my energy does not need to be up here, especially for something like Brahms.
It needs to be very low.
This is more maternal.
(36:13):
This is this beautiful oration of comfort, right?
And so I need to feel that kind of thing.
What I do think about is feeling the, whatever I have determined to be the main emotion of the piece, and breathing in that.
So the few bars before I come in, I will be breathing in this serene, calm, but hopeful feeling.
(36:43):
And I work in my practice to be like, what does that feel like in my body?
And it goes back to that body connection.
And if I breathe in that way for those bars, and for my first entrance, it will be those things.
Being an artist is very cool.
Yeah!
Yeah.
You know, what I just said, it sounds so, I mean, it sounds so creative, right?
(37:06):
But at the same time, it's really real, like you can actually feel these things.
It's very exciting.
Thank you so much for spending this time with us.
This has been, this is special.
So thank you.
Thank you so much for having me.
(38:11):
Perdono, forgiveness, from Seven Songs for Soprano & String Quintet by the late 19th, early 20th century composer, Rosario Scalero.
Bethany Worrell, soprano, from a recital she gave at the University of Michigan in October of 2023.
This set of songs was never published, Scalero died in 1954, and Dr. Worrell conceived this edition of the score from the composer's handwritten parts.
(38:42):
Recording engineers for these recordings of Bethany from U of M included Nelson Walker and Nelson Gast.
The Bach Society's recording engineer is Paul Henrich.
Take a moment right now to contact us with your questions or comments.
Just go to bachsociety.org and click on Bach Talk.
(39:03):
On that page, there's a simple form that you can use to ask your question, or if you prefer, send me an email directly, bachtalk@bachsociety.org.
We look forward to hearing from you.
The associate producer of Bach Talk is Scott MacDonald.
Promotional and other assistance provided as always by Andy Murphy and Carissa Marciniak of Wright Relations.
(39:29):
Special thanks today to Danielle Feinstein for her assistance and of course to our guest, Bethany Worrell.
We leave you today on a very sad and personal note.
In its storied 85-year history, The Bach Society of Saint Louis has had fewer piano accompanists than conductors.
(39:51):
The organization's most recent accompanist began in 1993.
The pride of Ireland's County Cork, Sandra Geary, was more than a great accompanist and collaborator.
She was a beacon of light, a bright, shining personality that made all of us not only better singers, but better people.
(40:12):
Unassuming and fiercely private, we feel immensely privileged to have featured her on this podcast.
Check out episode 11 of Bach Talk from last year.
Also, go to the Bach Society's Facebook page to get just a hint of how many lives she impacted and to see the last picture of Sandra taken at last month's Bach Talk Live episode with Leonard Slatkin.
(40:39):
That's where Sandra played her final notes with the Bach Society and she played what she told me was her favorite piece by Bach.
And so to conclude today as she plays that piece recorded by our Paul Henrich, here is Sandra Geary in her own words.
(41:00):
Yeah, my role as rehearsal pianist, I guess, it's really fun for me.
I sightread really well, so sometimes I come into the rehearsal process and I get the music right there and then I do my best on the first rehearsal and then I go home and practice for the next one.
But I feel like, yes, I do read Dennis's mind on occasion.
(41:23):
Yeah, and where he wants to go back to.
And that saves a lot of time because Dennis is very time oriented, which is fabulous.
We always get out on time.
Everything is to the minute.
And so I feel like I need to really concentrate for that two and a half hour rehearsal or however long it is to be right there when he needs me and to hear what needs to be helped at a particular time.
(41:49):
If the tenors are missing a note here or there, I'll bring that out a little bit more subtly without them even knowing maybe at times.
Yeah, it's a really enjoyable time for me to rehearse.
It's really quite a different job from being a concert pianist.
Absolutely.
And when I first came over here, I thought I wanted to do that.
But then during the process of my degree at the conservatory, I got, as I call it, the accompanying bug.
(42:23):
I feel like I am a helper.
It's a responsible job.
I don't need to have the limelight.
I need to support whoever I'm playing for, whether it be a singer or an instrumentalist, even a chorus.
I don't need the glory.
I'm there to support as much as I can and be musical and inspire them to be more musical by how I play.
(42:50):
So you're not just playing the notes, you're playing really the music.
I'm singing along with them.
Yes, yeah.
It's not about the notes.
It's about making music, having something to say, which is more important.
They often say, oh, what if I make a mistake?
It doesn't matter.
Make music.
(43:12):
What are some of the memories that you hold dear?
What are some of those moments that stand out for you?
Yeah, well, one of them is, and I love the piece so much, and I'm glad we got to do it twice, the Ubi Caritas.
I just love that because I think I find something new every time.
(43:33):
I mean, it's probably selfish of me because I get to play a lot on that and the chorus doesn't have to sing too much.
It's a wonderful piece.
I mean, I love playing the Bach rep, but I don't get to play that in the orchestra.
So it's nice for me to sit out and just listen to what we've worked on in the rehearsal process.
(44:03):
Bach Society accompanist Sandra Geary, who died last month after a brief illness.
She was 59 years young.
Bach Talk is a registered trademark of The Bach Society of Saint Louis.
I'm Ron Klemm.
This is Bach Talk.
(00:25):
What I do think about is feeling whatever I have determined to be the main emotion of the piece, and breathing in that.
So the few bars before I come in, I will be breathing in this serene, calm, but hopeful feeling.
And if I breathe in that way for those bars and for my first entrance, it will be those things.
(00:51):
The audience knows to listen for auburn.
Ooh, you know, I think they'd get more out of it because I get more out of it.
Being an artist is very cool.
(01:22):
Being an artist is very cool indeed.
Who would doubt that?
Coming from someone as eloquent and sensitive, yet at the same time so vivacious and bubbly as Bethany Worrell.
That's Bethany singing the pivotal soprano solo in the Brahms' A German Requiem at a recent concert by The Bach Society of Saint Louis.
(01:45):
Hello, I'm Ron Klemm.
Welcome to Bach Talk.
Praised by Opera News for her gleaming tone, such as we're hearing right now, Bethany Worrell is equally at home on the stage, in the concert or recital hall, or in the classroom or vocal studio.
She just completed her first year as the new Director of Vocal Studies at the University of Missouri, St. Louis.
(02:13):
We locals call it UMSL.
A few weeks prior to her appearance with the Bach Society this past March, Dr. Worrell invited us over to her neck of the woods, the beautiful Two Hill Performing Arts Center at UMSL.
The Bach Society's Danielle Feinstein joined me, and we had a wonderful time talking about the Brahms Requiem, of course, but also about much more, performing in general, Bethany's approach to singing, education, even tricks of the trade.
(02:44):
It took no time at all for us to realize just how blessed we are to have Dr. Bethany Worrell in our town.
First of all, thank you for inviting us to your house.
This is really a wonderful facility here, the Two Hill Performing Arts Center.
You've performed here already, and tell us a little bit about that.
(03:06):
I started last fall at UMSL at the University of Missouri, St. Louis, and one of the first bright spots in the semester was that Dr. David Wacyk, who's our Director of Orchestras, and Dr. Jim Henry, who's our Director of Choirs, invited me to perform on the first Masterworks concert that UMSL has done since the pandemic, since 2020.
(03:32):
We performed the Poulenc Gloria, and I was the Soprano Soloist.
It was fantastic.
You're kind of the new kid on the block.
I moved here in August.
Settled in right away.
Yes.
I'm the new Director of Vocal Studies at UMSL, and I wear a lot of hats, which coming from being a performer, that's kind of the norm, so I feel very comfortable wearing lots of hats.
(03:55):
One thing I do, I run the Solo Voice Program here at the university.
I'm in charge of all the adjunct voice teachers.
They're on my team.
Our vocal collaborative pianists are on my team, and I organize all of the solo offerings.
We have a diction teacher.
We have diction that we offer.
(04:17):
I assign all of the voice students to their studios, and I teach a good number of them privately.
In addition, I teach the Singing Actors Workshop, and we have our first class of that this semester, and we're doing a musical review.
We're doing Rodgers and Hammerstein's Grand Night for Singing.
(04:41):
Cool.
Yeah, it's going to be really fun.
Tell us about your career path coming to St. Louis.
I grew up in West Central Illinois.
I grew up in Macomb, Illinois, about three hours north.
Did my undergraduate degree there.
I took a gap year, and then I got into the New England Conservatory of Music for my master's degree, and I loved Boston.
(05:06):
I went there, had a lot of success at the school, but knew I wanted to pursue a classical career, and knew I really loved Boston beauty, and a really small town girl from Illinois, and then going out to this major city, but felt really at home there.
I went to school there for two years, and then for seven years, I lived and worked and sang in Boston professionally.
(05:31):
Then I wanted a change of pace, and so I decided to move to New York City.
I sang there for two and a half years.
At that time, I always knew I wanted to go and get my doctorate so I could be a university professor, and I felt ready for that part of my career, and took auditions.
(05:52):
Miraculously, I started in fall of 2020, so I beat the pandemic.
While a lot of people were struggling, I was in school, which was helpful, and I just graduated in May of 2024 with my doctorate from University of Michigan.
Then I promptly moved to Dallas, Texas for the summer to be with my fiancee, and was singing down there.
(06:17):
I sang professionally in Boston, New York, and Dallas, and was chosen to be the new director of vocal studies, and moved here in August.
What precipitated that move?
Let me ask a sub-question.
Please.
Some people who are in cities like New York and Boston will get the sense that they're a small fish in a big pond.
(06:42):
Did you have any of that, or was it just because I want to be in the Midwest?
I'm a Midwestern girl.
Well, I took auditions at many schools.
Michigan was my dream school because it just has a fantastic vocal heritage, but also because maestro Martin Katz was there.
I worked with Martin at Songfest in 2011, right after grad school, and I found him so inspiring.
(07:15):
Ever since 2011, I knew I wanted to go to Michigan if I could get in.
That was my dream school.
I got in, and I got to work with him a lot.
He told me when I graduated, I could call him Martin and not Mr. Katz.
That's why I'm saying Martin.
Very cool.
I felt like I had arrived.
You had.
Absolutely.
But going back to the Midwest, I knew that after being for about 15 years away from home, away from, pretty far from my parents, I thought, wouldn't it be great if I could land a teaching job in the Midwest?
(07:53):
It might be helpful to go to a school in the Midwest to make connections in the Midwest.
I was open to everywhere, but I'm really happy I ended up in St. Louis.
Well, we're thrilled to have you.
Tell us about your first musical memories.
When did you start singing, and when did a light bulb go off and say, oh, wow, I really like this?
(08:16):
I started singing really early.
I did children's musicals in Macomb, actually, where I grew up.
When I was in seventh grade, my parents put me in voice lessons.
I remember it just was organic.
(08:38):
It was like drinking water.
This just made sense to be singing and taking lessons.
I've taken lessons since I was in seventh grade for a really long time of my life.
When I was in high school, I feel like for most musicians, there's a piece of music or a few pieces of music that that was the turning point.
(09:03):
I was always serious about it, but I remember we sang Morton Lordson's O Manum Mysterium.
It was just beautiful, right?
Beautiful.
I loved every minute of rehearsal.
I thought, okay, this is what I want to do.
It was a very internal feeling.
(09:24):
Yep, that was it.
It's interesting that it wasn't solo.
It was choral.
Who had the greatest impact on you?
Was there an individual or a group of people or something that really made a major impact in a turning point in your life to move into music?
Is mom listening?
(09:45):
Of course she's listening.
I have to start with my parents.
No, my parents are both avocational musicians.
There was a lot of singing in the home.
My dad played guitar, played trumpet, was a song leader at church.
My mom was also a song leader at church, played piano, played a lot of other instruments.
(10:07):
From as far back as I remember, there was always singing.
There's just so many people in my life, and I'm trying to think of an early person.
Actually, my third teacher, but my first teacher that I was with for a long time is named Terry Chasteen, and he is still a professor at Western Illinois University.
(10:33):
He has a glorious tenor voice.
Actually, as a young singer, he was brought up here.
He sang many seasons with St. Louis Opera Theater.
His joy for the craft and joy for music and openness to everyone who would come into the studio, no matter if they wanted to be a performer, educator, just wanted to sing for fun, that made a big impact on me.
(11:03):
Now as a performer,
it made an impact on me growing up, but now as an educator, he's one of the people that I
just find inspiration from because while we want to train up great singers that go on to sing or
are music educators or are working in the field, we also are inspiring artists that are engaging
(11:28):
in any way, and I feel like I learned that boots on the ground from him being a junior in high
school when I started working with him.
That's a really special experience that I don't think everybody has from working with somebody like that.
I'm curious, what brought you over to the stage?
(11:48):
I know you've sung quite a few roles.
Was it just a product of, I'm in this classical music program, so I have to audition for these shows, or you talked about starting this singing actor program.
It seems like you're also very passionate about the acting side of it.
What was the draw there?
What was your first role?
My first opera role, let's start with that, was at Western Illinois University.
(12:15):
I was a sophomore.
For some reason, I didn't audition my freshman year.
You can ask Mr. Chastain about that.
I don't remember.
You'll follow up.
But I auditioned.
They were doing Candide because we had this amazing tenor, this amazing baritone, and this amazing soprano who was a senior.
(12:38):
I knew that I would not be cast as Cunegonda.
I was a sophomore and I'd never been in an opera.
I knew that, but I have a lot of tenacity.
I learned Glitter and Be Gay as a sophomore for the audition, and I did it.
They cast me as Peckett.
(13:00):
That was my first role.
I was cast alongside a lot of upperclassmen, and they all just took me under their wing, and it was really fun.
But the impetus for that, I just loved singing and storytelling.
At that time, I just wanted to be singing as much as I could sing.
(13:21):
It didn't matter what I was singing.
I knew I wanted to sing mainly classical, though at that time I also was singing a lot of jazz.
They let me dabble as much as possible at WIU, which I think that's actually really helpful, and I want my students to be able to do that here.
But I just knew I wanted to be part of the show, and I wanted to challenge myself and sing harder music, I think.
(13:44):
Oh, I do want to say about a fulfilling opera role.
The last opera role I did, I got to sing Don Anna in Don Giovanni.
Earlier in life, I was a soubrette.
Now, I'm more of a lyric, and that's what...
What's a soubrette?
Is that a tiny soprano?
(14:04):
Maybe vocally speaking.
Maybe not physically speaking.
So a soubrette, it's a lighter voice, so you wouldn't necessarily be singing over a lot of tubas, because the carrying power is a little different.
But light and frothy, and a lot of times a soubrette is really fun and funny, and I enjoy being comedic.
(14:28):
But now my voice is more darker and more mature, and that happens as the voice ages, so I'm more of a lyric soprano now.
And so Don Anna is not a funny character.
She is a very serious character.
I had played Zerlina earlier in that opera, and she's a very funny character.
But Don Anna helped me figure out more of my dramatic self, and I got to prepare it with Maestro Katz conducting.
(14:54):
And it was the last opera he did at Michigan before he retired, and so that was incredible.
It was very artistically fulfilling.
So concert repertoire, I think my gateway into concert repertoire was art song.
I think if you asked me what my biggest love is, is actually doing art song and art song recitals.
(15:15):
And then there's kind of this gateway of chamber music and concert repertoire.
And there's something very satisfying with collaborating with so many people, with a conductor, but making music that, yes, it has drama.
I mean, there's definitely drama in the Brahms Requiem, right?
(15:37):
But it is also intimate like art song, I feel like, but on a very big stage.
But the feelings are intimate, and I feel like I get to bring out a lot of myself in it, maybe even more so than opera, and I really, really enjoy that.
(16:44):
The fifth movement, Ihr habt nun Traurigkeit, you now have sorrow, aber, but, but I will see you again, and your heart shall rejoice, and your joy no one will take from you.
Comforting words from a German Requiem by Johannes Brahms, sung by soprano Bethany Worrall, along with The Bach Society of Saint Louis Chorus and Orchestra, Dennis Sparger conducting.
(17:12):
The concert took place March 22, 2025.
More about that, and a bevy of other topics, with our guest today, Dr. Bethany Worrall, straight ahead.
Along with Danielle Feinstein, I'm Ron Klemm.
This is Bach Talk.
(17:34):
I want to talk about the soprano role, which is limited to the fifth movement.
After sitting there for, what, 45 minutes, better part of an hour, and then you have to come in, and your first entrance, after basically sitting around, goes up to a high A.
(17:57):
Pianissimo, right?
Okay, what's your secret?
There's several parts to the secret.
One is to be very warmed up before the concert, right?
You just, you need to be very warm, very flexible.
I work, my technique being really flexible, as I work on the piece now, several weeks before the concert, I'm working it every day to make sure it's really in my voice.
(18:26):
There's a point where you get something in your voice, and you do feel like you can kind of just get up and sing it, and that's what I'm working towards for this.
The secret, and this would be good for all students, I think, is that while you're sitting there, during loud sections, you can very quietly make noise.
(18:49):
You are revealing secrets.
Very quietly, so don't tell Maestro, but very quietly, just so I know it's out there, very quietly, just like that's it.
You're not going to take away from anything, it's during that brass or timpani, when the whole choir is singing forte, you're, and you don't, you're not taking anything away, but you can kind of just make a little sound.
(19:14):
If they allow me to have water, that's helpful, to have a little water on stage to, to be doing that.
If, if for some reason you wouldn't be allowed water, you're hydrating all day anyway, but I will also say, this is the voice teacher in me, water helps just the inside of the mouth, but it takes two hours for, when you drink water, for it to actually like hydrate your muscles, and so I'm hydrating all day.
(19:41):
You want your mouth to not be dry, but, but it really, if I've had a lot of water, I should be okay.
The other thing, and we talked about a mentality issue, is that really connecting with the text, but also I am constantly, while I'm sitting there, I'm listening to everything around me for those first 45 minutes, and I'm trying to be completely in the moment, and enjoying the music, just like the audiences, and I feel like that settles me in a way that can help the singing as well.
(20:12):
So now you have all my secrets.
So since you were talking about your tips and tricks, okay, I'm curious if you have any, what I'm going to call, whirlisms, any phrases, key ideas, tips, pieces of advice, that if we asked one of your students, they would say, oh, this, this is what she always says.
(20:35):
Oh, I wish we had them here.
There's a lot of things, I think.
The one thing that is really big that I'm trying to impress upon the whole vocal area, not just my private students, is that we're, anybody that's auditioning you, anyone that's teaching you, we are not concerned with perfection.
We are concerned with a growth mindset.
(20:56):
Several years ago, I actually came to St. Louis to do an audition boot camp at Winter Opera St. Louis, and Costis Protopappas was here, the conductor, and he worked with us, and he said, we do not care about perfection.
Every time I hear you, I want to hear you getting better, and you need to be concerned with raising your average constantly, this growth mindset.
(21:22):
And so I try to impress this upon my students, that if you're doing the work, if you're practicing every day, if you're putting in the work, and if you look back on where you were a month ago, you're probably going to be farther down the path.
It might vary from week to week, because sometimes it's two step forward, one step back, but growth mindset is the biggest thing.
I think that, I hope that they would tell you that right away.
(21:45):
Well, I'd like to get into teaching a little bit, if you don't mind.
Sure.
Because either you said this, or someone said it about you, but you talked about, or we heard about you and teaching as being kinesthetic.
What does that mean, and how does that manifest itself in your work?
(22:07):
Great.
So kinesthetic learning is body learning, basically, and so how do you connect with your body, be aware of how your body is while you're singing, because our body is our instrument.
I feel like a lot of people say that, and I try to help my students manifest that throughout all of their singing.
(22:30):
So I help them cultivate a very deep awareness.
I ask them a lot of questions, like, what does that feel like?
What does it feel like here in your body?
What does it feel like in your soft palate?
What does it feel like in your ribs?
Like, take your mind's eye and put it there, now do it, what did you notice in this area?
I use a lot of tools, so, like, I use TheraBands, they're stretchy bands, and that can help students feel what support does in the body.
(23:00):
When you stretch, actually,
from side to side, and while you're singing, the core engages, but it doesn't overly engage,
it engages, I like to call it the baby bear principle, there's not too hot, not too cold,
just right from the three bears, and so if you over engage, you're going to be locked up vocally,
if you under engage, you're not going to have any power, and it's going to sound really kind of
(23:24):
wimpy, you need the just right engagement, and using TheraBands can actually help you find it
right away.
So I use lunges, I use squats, there's lots of tools in the studio, and I also do a lot
of straw learning, to like sing through a straw, because that can help regulate how well the vocal
(23:45):
folds come together, so teaching them how their body actually is their instrument, and I guess I'll
say one more thing about that, I feel like it's unfair that a lot of singers don't understand
their instrument until they're in college, because that's maybe the first time they have private
lessons, but you know if you're in seventh grade and you take up the clarinet, your teacher
(24:11):
tells you how to clean the clarinet, put the clarinet together, you understand what a read is,
you understand the instrument, and so one of my passion projects is working with high school and
junior high choir teachers to work on how can they explain anatomy to their
students in a way that works in the corporate setting, because it's not a private lesson,
(24:33):
but how can everyone understand what their, how their ribs work, how their diaphragm works, how
breathing works, and I do believe if we dissect a frog in high school, we can understand how our
ribs work, and so kind of working with teachers to embolden them in working with groups,
(24:54):
because it is different than one-on-one.
But you don't dissect any frogs?
No dissection of humans or frogs.
Well, maybe, but what are the issues that you find most often with college-age singers?
(25:16):
What are the things that you go, ah, that's why I'm here, I'm here to correct this or that, or impress on them this or that?
What is it?
What are those things?
So I'll get to technique in a second, but taking up physical space that actually deals with technique, but also performance and also confidence.
(25:37):
If you actually take up physical space and you kind of sit in that or stand in that, you will actually feel more confident.
Is it on Grey's Anatomy where they do the hero pose?
It's that same concept, right?
And so how do you stand when you sing in a way that is not because my professor told me so, but because I want to take up space and be an artist and send this out?
(26:04):
It dovetails with technique, but it's that performance training and confidence training, because say they get a degree from here but then decide to do something completely different with their life, all of that singing and confidence training will show up very well in them for whatever they choose to do.
The other thing is how do you breathe in your body?
(26:28):
That's the main thing, and I think that's the main thing across the nation.
It's not just here, but it's really cool to see when they start to take, it also goes with taking up space in your body, and it's very cool to see when they start to do it.
And we have a weekly studio class
where I workshop with them in front of, the students in front of each other, and we do that
(26:49):
for the entire vocal area, so I work with everyone in that instance, and they, we ask them what do
you notice, what your colleague is doing, and almost all the time when somebody has changed
their breathing, they're like, oh my gosh, look at their ribs, look at the low breath, and so they're
beginning to get it.
It's really cool.
(28:20):
We never planned on a rendezvous.
It's just the way of the world.
Lauf der Welt by Edvard Grieg.
From his opus 48 set of songs, Bethany Worrell, joined by pianist Muse Yee, recorded live at Bethany's second dissertation recital at the University of Michigan's Britten Recital Hall, December 2023.
(28:45):
Just ahead, more with soprano Bethany Worrell, along with Danielle Feinstein.
Today, I'm Ron Klemm.
This is Bach Talk.
Teaching is a vocation.
Is it more than that?
(29:06):
Do you feel like it's a means to an end?
You want to do that so that you can perform, or is it some sort of obligation or responsibility?
Is it a calling?
How do you view your work?
I would say it definitely falls into the calling category.
It's interesting, ever since being an undergraduate student, I knew that I wanted to be a teacher.
(29:33):
I knew that I did not want to be a choral director.
Like, I didn't want to be with a whole group as my main thing.
I actually love working with choirs now as a clinician about how the voice works, but I wanted to work one-on-one with students.
And one thing that motivates me in that is that I see progress constantly with them, and it doesn't matter how fast it is.
(30:00):
I think that they should progress at their own pace.
I mean, I try to get them to invest, but if they're investing and they're progressing, I'm really excited for them.
And so I knew very early on I wanted to work with solo voices, and I actually gave lessons while I was an undergraduate student at WIU.
(30:21):
I'm better now.
You know, it was good.
I think I did good work, but now I know so much more, and of course I do, but learning about the voice is a journey.
I can't wait until I'm 80 and teaching voice and what I know then, right?
The calling part, like after I graduated and I went to Boston, I was teaching voice students there.
(30:45):
For me, teaching and performing, they go hand in hand.
When I, as a teacher, as I get better as a teacher, I get better as a performer and vice versa.
I can't imagine a world where I wouldn't do both.
Yeah, I love sharing music with others, and I think that that is the basis for both.
(31:07):
That's the foundation that's the same.
I recently performed a house concert, and afterwards several of the audience members came up and they said, we love the educational things you shared.
And I think that's great.
I did not realize that I was educating them.
(31:27):
I was just sharing things that I thought were really neat about the piece.
And so I think that's interesting too, that I think it's in my bones, this education, and I'm thinking maybe I can make it a little more fun next time in the house concert.
But, you know, the history of Brahms Requiem, or like what the words mean, it impacts me so much as a singer and an artist.
(31:54):
I want, if I have an opportunity to talk to an audience member, I like to tell them what this word means, because it's so profound.
Like, we don't all speak German, right?
Or all these languages.
But part of the study of the singer is to learn these things, so you can do justice to the piece, of course.
But I would say Brahms Requiem, what I'm thinking is the word aber, it is the hinge point of movement five.
(32:23):
And aber means but.
It's the connector.
Yes.
Right?
Yep.
It's the conjunction, right?
But the conjunction, but it's in real terms, in very real terms, like, but I will be with you.
Right?
Like, you do not need to be sorrowful anymore.
It completely changes what the piece is about.
(32:46):
And if the audience knows to listen for aber, ooh, you know, they'll just, I think they'd get more out of it, because I get more out of it.
But yeah, I think education and singing and performing, they just all go together.
You already talked a little bit about some of the lessons that you've learned.
What about those do you pass on?
(33:08):
That is one, you know, as you're sitting there in that studio, and you're working one-on-one, as you said, you'd love to do, working one-on-one with someone, and all of a sudden, that thing comes in the back of your mind, that thought, oh, you know, I remember when I was told that, what are some of those things?
Stand up straight is a good start.
(33:31):
That's great.
I think the thing, the thing about taking up space is a big thing.
And, and I do, I know I already shared it, but what Maestro Protopapas said about, we're concerned with your average growing, not perfection.
I think a lot of us singers, and I see this in the students today.
I'm definitely a perfectionist.
(33:52):
I'm a recovering perfectionist.
There should be a society for us all.
Do you ever fully recover, however?
I'm working on it.
But you know, the audience, while I am going to sing diamond and crystalline sounds on this, the audience, as long as you are invested, and you are completely in the moment, and you are open with your artistry, the audience doesn't know what the perfection in your head is.
(34:20):
The perfection that we think about is only in our head.
Obviously, if notes and rhythms are wrong, that's just, that's basal, right?
Like, but if I sing it, and it's beautiful, but it's 1% away from what I had in my practice, that's a perfectionism that's not helpful, right?
(34:42):
If I'm committed in the moment, and making music with the ensemble, and singing my best in that moment, that's all I can do.
And if I judge myself against some idea of what I could do, it just kind of, it makes everything crumple, because also singers were artists.
And so it's just strange, the perfectionism and the artist don't always work well together.
(35:05):
So I try to teach the students a lot about, let go of the perfection, just do the work, and trust the work, and be fully in the moment.
And that's a big thing to work on.
That's, we work on that every lesson.
Creativity is a language of vulnerability.
And I love the language of manifestation that you used.
You said, I am going to sing this crystalline.
(35:28):
Is there a single phrase, word, that you tell yourself before every performance, anything to get in the zone, or even a physical action?
Yeah, I definitely find a way to just sit, you know, alone, and sometimes I'll have my eyes closed, and think through singing.
(35:52):
I also really try to feel my weight deeper in my body.
I've been told that I rev high, which I love.
And it's because I get excited about things, which is great.
I am a soprano.
It's good.
But to be like, my energy does not need to be up here, especially for something like Brahms.
It needs to be very low.
This is more maternal.
(36:13):
This is this beautiful oration of comfort, right?
And so I need to feel that kind of thing.
What I do think about is feeling the, whatever I have determined to be the main emotion of the piece, and breathing in that.
So the few bars before I come in, I will be breathing in this serene, calm, but hopeful feeling.
(36:43):
And I work in my practice to be like, what does that feel like in my body?
And it goes back to that body connection.
And if I breathe in that way for those bars, and for my first entrance, it will be those things.
Being an artist is very cool.
Yeah!
Yeah.
You know, what I just said, it sounds so, I mean, it sounds so creative, right?
(37:06):
But at the same time, it's really real, like you can actually feel these things.
It's very exciting.
Thank you so much for spending this time with us.
This has been, this is special.
So thank you.
Thank you so much for having me.
(38:11):
Perdono, forgiveness, from Seven Songs for Soprano & String Quintet by the late 19th, early 20th century composer, Rosario Scalero.
Bethany Worrell, soprano, from a recital she gave at the University of Michigan in October of 2023.
This set of songs was never published, Scalero died in 1954, and Dr. Worrell conceived this edition of the score from the composer's handwritten parts.
(38:42):
Recording engineers for these recordings of Bethany from U of M included Nelson Walker and Nelson Gast.
The Bach Society's recording engineer is Paul Henrich.
Take a moment right now to contact us with your questions or comments.
Just go to bachsociety.org and click on Bach Talk.
(39:03):
On that page, there's a simple form that you can use to ask your question, or if you prefer, send me an email directly, bachtalk@bachsociety.org.
We look forward to hearing from you.
The associate producer of Bach Talk is Scott MacDonald.
Promotional and other assistance provided as always by Andy Murphy and Carissa Marciniak of Wright Relations.
(39:29):
Special thanks today to Danielle Feinstein for her assistance and of course to our guest, Bethany Worrell.
We leave you today on a very sad and personal note.
In its storied 85-year history, The Bach Society of Saint Louis has had fewer piano accompanists than conductors.
(39:51):
The organization's most recent accompanist began in 1993.
The pride of Ireland's County Cork, Sandra Geary, was more than a great accompanist and collaborator.
She was a beacon of light, a bright, shining personality that made all of us not only better singers, but better people.
(40:12):
Unassuming and fiercely private, we feel immensely privileged to have featured her on this podcast.
Check out episode 11 of Bach Talk from last year.
Also, go to the Bach Society's Facebook page to get just a hint of how many lives she impacted and to see the last picture of Sandra taken at last month's Bach Talk Live episode with Leonard Slatkin.
(40:39):
That's where Sandra played her final notes with the Bach Society and she played what she told me was her favorite piece by Bach.
And so to conclude today as she plays that piece recorded by our Paul Henrich, here is Sandra Geary in her own words.
(41:00):
Yeah, my role as rehearsal pianist, I guess, it's really fun for me.
I sightread really well, so sometimes I come into the rehearsal process and I get the music right there and then I do my best on the first rehearsal and then I go home and practice for the next one.
But I feel like, yes, I do read Dennis's mind on occasion.
(41:23):
Yeah, and where he wants to go back to.
And that saves a lot of time because Dennis is very time oriented, which is fabulous.
We always get out on time.
Everything is to the minute.
And so I feel like I need to really concentrate for that two and a half hour rehearsal or however long it is to be right there when he needs me and to hear what needs to be helped at a particular time.
(41:49):
If the tenors are missing a note here or there, I'll bring that out a little bit more subtly without them even knowing maybe at times.
Yeah, it's a really enjoyable time for me to rehearse.
It's really quite a different job from being a concert pianist.
Absolutely.
And when I first came over here, I thought I wanted to do that.
But then during the process of my degree at the conservatory, I got, as I call it, the accompanying bug.
(42:23):
I feel like I am a helper.
It's a responsible job.
I don't need to have the limelight.
I need to support whoever I'm playing for, whether it be a singer or an instrumentalist, even a chorus.
I don't need the glory.
I'm there to support as much as I can and be musical and inspire them to be more musical by how I play.
(42:50):
So you're not just playing the notes, you're playing really the music.
I'm singing along with them.
Yes, yeah.
It's not about the notes.
It's about making music, having something to say, which is more important.
They often say, oh, what if I make a mistake?
It doesn't matter.
Make music.
(43:12):
What are some of the memories that you hold dear?
What are some of those moments that stand out for you?
Yeah, well, one of them is, and I love the piece so much, and I'm glad we got to do it twice, the Ubi Caritas.
I just love that because I think I find something new every time.
(43:33):
I mean, it's probably selfish of me because I get to play a lot on that and the chorus doesn't have to sing too much.
It's a wonderful piece.
I mean, I love playing the Bach rep, but I don't get to play that in the orchestra.
So it's nice for me to sit out and just listen to what we've worked on in the rehearsal process.
(44:03):
Bach Society accompanist Sandra Geary, who died last month after a brief illness.
She was 59 years young.
Bach Talk is a registered trademark of The Bach Society of Saint Louis.
I'm Ron Klemm.
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