October 9, 2024 • 30 mins
Ever wondered how a simple hobby can turn into a flourishing career? Discover the incredible journey of Sarah Fennel, the brilliant mind behind Broma Bakery, as she shares her transformation from passionate food blogger to successful cookbook author.
Sarah’s transition from blogger to cookbook author was not without its hurdles. She spent two years meticulously transforming her beloved online content and creating new recipes into a tangible book for her audience. With 100 recipes, including new creations and fan favorites, Sarah put her skills in branding, writing, and photography to work. Her commitment to understanding her audience's needs has been pivotal, guiding her choices in both her blog and book creation. This episode offers a behind-the-scenes look at the process of creating her first book, filled with memorable moments and the excitement of seeing a creative endeavor come to life.
In our conversation, Sarah also reflects on her experiences with course creation and the bittersweet decision to close her successful food photography school. She shares insights into how these experiences shaped her approach to launching her cookbook, "Sweet Tooth," and discusses influential cookbook authors who have inspired her journey. As Sarah embarks on her book tour, she invites listeners to explore her exciting new recipes. This episode is packed with inspiration and creativity, encouraging listeners to pursue their passions and embrace the delightful complexity of the baking industry.
You can pre-order the book and get information on her book tour by clicking here.
Two ways I help my students earn $2-10k monthly👇?
1.) Grow your home bakery business inside The Entrepreneur Community by clicking here
2.) Learn to sell digital products inside Digital Product Community by clicking here
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hey, sweet friends, my name is Chef Schaumburg.
I started my baking businesswith a bottle of DeSerono and
one Bundt cake pan.
Fast forward to today, fromnews to magazines, speaking on
national stages and more.
I can truly say that baking haschanged my life.
So now, as a bakery businesscoach, I get to help others have
the same success.
I've helped hundreds of mystudents across the world in my
(00:24):
global membership program createsix-figure businesses, mainly
from home.
The Baking for Business podcastis an extension of that, from
actionable tips to valuabletools and resources that can
impact you as a business owner.
I truly believe y'all.
We would never have been givena gift if we couldn't profit and
prosper from it.
So come on, darling.
What are you waiting for?
(00:45):
Hey, what's going on?
Baking friends, and welcomeback to the Baking for Business
podcast.
Thank you so much for joiningme today for another episode.
Today we have an amazing guestin the house who has been a
blogger for a while and now sheis a cookbook author.
She is Sarah Fennell, thefounder and the beautiful woman
(01:12):
behind Roma Bakery I'm sureyou're all familiar with the
brand on Instagram and here totell us all about her new book,
which features so many yummythings, as well as just her
journey within this sweet,delicious industry, is Sarah
herself.
So, sarah, welcome to theBaking for Business podcast.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Hi Amanda, hi everybody.
I'm so excited.
Literally baking and businessare my two favorite things to
talk about, so I'm very excitedabout this.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Absolutely.
That's what we're all about,and so, for those who are
unfamiliar with you, I want togo ahead and ask I know you
originally started blogging, butwhat inspired you to start your
blog and how did you get yourstart in the desserts arena?
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Yeah, so I, like many people who are in the food
industry, um, grew up lovingfood, and so I had a mom who was
very much a home baker, likeshe loved and always had cookies
or brownies or cakes on thecounter, but also like she was
(02:17):
not technical at all, likesometimes her cookies would come
out so flat, Sometimes they'dbe too puffy and overcooked.
The biggest thing, though, waslike we just had baked goods
around because she had a hugesweet tooth.
I then, like, got a huge sweettooth from her, so we really
just did it because we lovedessert.
And at the same time, when Iwas growing up, I was really
(02:40):
into photography, and so, when Iwent to college, I went to
college liberal arts school Iwent for anthropology, and I,
when I went to college, I wentto college liberal arts school,
I went for anthropology, and Ireally missed having a creative
outlet, and so I decided tobasically merge my two passions
and take photos of baked goodsthat I made, and I decided to
put it on a blog I crawled it,excuse me, I called it Broma
(03:02):
Bakery, and it really wascompletely a hobby, like I had
no intention from the beginningof turning it into a business.
It was very much a creativeoutlet.
So I did that all throughoutcollege and then I was in the
restaurant industry throughoutcollege and then, after and long
story short I got burnt out inthe restaurant industry.
(03:23):
It's like, as I'm sure so manyof your listeners know, it's so
unforgiving, it's so taxing,like on the body and the mind.
It's just like I have so muchrespect for people who work in
restaurants.
So I decided to quit my job,cold turkey, and I basically
like went home and I Googled howto make money on a blog.
(03:45):
I had no idea what I was doing,um, but I was really fortunate.
I had saved up literally $8,500.
Um, that's like how much moneyI had to my name.
And I decided to give myself twomonths and figure out if I
could turn my blog into abusiness and into my career.
And that was, oh my gosh, thatwas whoa 10 years ago.
(04:11):
So it worked out, but really itvery much started as this hobby
thing that I did just because Iloved it and I had so much
passion for what I was doing.
But I also think it differsfrom a lot of other people in
this way that I went full timebefore I had this proof of
concept and I think having thatkind of forced me to hustle
(04:34):
harder than I would have if Ihad something to fall back on.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
Yeah, absolutely.
That definitely sounds like abeautiful, humble beginning and
you said 10 years ago almost adecade of blogging and showing
up and building your audience.
It's amazing that you took thatleap of faith with just a
little bit saved up.
Did you teach yourself likewhen you initially started your
(05:01):
blog?
Were you watching all theYouTube videos, or was there any
particular course or anythingyou invested in to help you
start that blogging journey?
Speaker 2 (05:09):
So I went full-time in 2014.
So it was very much thebeginning of, like the course
era.
Like courses were not, I feel,like big until you know, 2016,
17, 18.
Um, it was.
So it was as much free contentas I could.
It was YouTubing everything,googling everything and really
(05:32):
just like bootstrapping it withwhat I could figure out.
I really tried at that time tomake a lot of connections, too,
with other people who I knewwere doing it full-time, and I
would literally email them and Iwould like ask for their advice
and really just like get theinformation that I could.
And I think that all of thattogether was so helpful for me.
(05:53):
And I also think that, like notletting a lack of information
stop me from going and figuringit out on my own was also really
helpful.
So like I relied on trying tolike figure things out, but when
I couldn't figure it out, Iwould still go and try to do it
on my own.
So trying to figure out, likewhy when I was photographing
(06:15):
something, the light didn't lookright, or trying to figure out
like how to get my edit to lookjust like how I knew I wanted it
in my head, but like couldn'tfind from tutorials online and
really like a lot of like trialand error to kind of like build
up.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
Trial and error is always the greatest teacher, for
sure.
And so, as you startededucating yourself and building
and you went for the blog, howdid you specifically decide on
the baking niche?
Was it just because of thatlove, or did you try other
things savory?
Speaker 2 (06:48):
It was really because of a love of baking Like I.
I it was never even a questionif I was going to have a blog
that was savory or sweet like itwas sweet, I felt much more
comfortable with baking and Ithink in my teens and early
twenties I was just moreinterested in baking.
I am a very technical person.
(07:09):
I love when things have likethey're very defined parts, and
so baking just really appeals tome in that way.
It feels very formulaic.
It's interesting.
I've learned to cook bettersince then and I really like
cooking now, but baking has justalways.
It feels like I'm sure you feelthe same Like it just feels
(07:29):
different, like there'ssomething about baking that just
like it makes me so much moreexcited.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Absolutely.
You definitely have to do whatbrings you joy, and so, from
blogging to now focusing on abook, can you walk us through
the process of turning your blogcontent into a cookbook?
Was that always something thatyou wanted to go after, or was
the opportunity just brought toyou?
Speaker 2 (07:56):
Yeah, I actually did not want to do a cookbook for
the longest time because I hadheard from so many people that
it was so much work and I was soworried about just becoming
overwhelmed and like reallywanted to make sure I had enough
time to devote towards itwithout going crazy.
(08:17):
So for a long time I didn'twant to do a cookbook and I was
totally fine with being in theonline world.
I also think that do a cookbookand I was totally fine with
being in the online world.
I also think that people createcookbooks for so many different
reasons.
For myself and in my journey, Iknew that I didn't want to
create a cookbook until I feltso, so confident in every aspect
(08:38):
of my skills that would go intothat book.
So, feeling really confident inmy brand, feeling really
confident in the voice and sortof the writing that goes into
the book, feeling reallyconfident in my brand, feeling
really confident in the voiceand sort of the writing that
goes into the book, feelingreally confident about the
recipes themselves, feelingconfident about the photography,
feeling confident about howwell I could market it, and so
it really took me a long time tosort of feel like I had mastery
(09:01):
in all of those areas tofinally be okay with being like
okay, now let's put this pen topaper, onto something that will
exist for the rest of time andyou can't go back and edit it
Like.
That's so terrifying to me.
So, um, so yeah.
And in terms of how westructured the book with recipes
(09:23):
it's a hundred recipes, 76 ofthem are brand new, never before
seen that we developedspecifically for the book.
And then 24 are from the blog.
The ones that we picked fromthe blog we decided to do for
two reasons.
One there's some that are justlike fan favorites.
Everybody knows them, everybodyloves them.
So, like our brown butterchocolate chip cookies, they're
(09:46):
the most popular recipe on ourblog.
Like I knew I needed to includethose in my cookbook.
And then others are ones thatare really good, base recipes or
or creative recipes, butrecipes that like are our
favorites.
We have an oatmeal cream piecookie recipe in there and that
recipe is like, oh my God, it'slike one of the best recipes I
have ever like eaten, made,think about.
(10:08):
And so those recipes too, theseones that are like doing well
on the blog, but we reallywanted to highlight and bring to
a bigger audience.
That's what we chose to do too.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
I love that because too often people are always,
especially as business owners,always in the create, create,
create type space when it comesto content.
But I love the fact that yourepurpose, not in a sense of
just I'm going to add this too,but more so I want to add to the
user experience and really justbring out the things that
(10:38):
people love already.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
Absolutely, and I think that that's one thing that
I really strive for in mybusiness in general is really
making sure I'm centering mycontent around the user and
really keeping like who I'mdoing it for front and center,
because the more that I can havethat picture of who it's for,
(11:01):
the better I'm able to figureout like would that type of
person be interested in thiscontent?
Does that type of person evencare about you know this?
Would this fit into their lives?
And it's like for me, it's areally helpful way to sort of
figure out just generally whatcontent I should be producing,
because there's so many amazingrecipes out there, there's so
many ways that you can do things, and it can almost become
(11:23):
overwhelming when you're justthinking oh, just generally,
this seems good, this seems good, this seems good, and so, yeah,
I think like centering the userin that is just so, so
important.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
What are some of your favorite memories that you've
had in creating the book and,overall around, how long did it
take you to go from start tobringing it to fruition?
Speaker 2 (11:42):
Yeah, so it's been a little over a two-year process.
I started writing the proposalfor the book in June of 2022,
and the book comes out inOctober of 2024.
So it's a long process andthat's pretty standard.
Two years for a cookbook isvery standard.
Favorite memories, I would say,from the process.
(12:12):
There's the less discreetmemories, I would say, of just
like being in the writing stageand writing a head note that I'm
just like yes, oh, that's sogood, or like that's such a fun
way of getting someone excitedabout this and just getting in
those grooves.
It just felt so good.
And then I feel like I mean,turning in the manuscript was
just like it felt like such, a,such an accomplishment and
(12:34):
something I was so happy about.
I mean, I think it's like80,000 words or something, or
maybe it's, maybe it's closer to90, but like it's, it's a lot.
It's a lot of words, Um, andobviously, never having written
a book before, that just felt socool to be able to like have
this big body of work to turn in.
And then I have had so much funwith the more like salesy part
(13:00):
of it, like introducing the bookto my audience, seeing how
they're responding, responding,creating content to push
pre-orders and things like that.
It's been so fun because I feellike it's called back on like
my course days.
So I actually had a school thatwas like for food photography
(13:21):
and we had a bunch of differentcourses in it.
Hold on, oh, let's talk Carson.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
I know that you're you're going.
You took my next question fromme.
Speaker 2 (13:35):
So it was really cool to like have this sales aspect
of that and like be able to dothat in this new way.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
So yeah, and speaking of sales, one thing that people
may not know about you, besidesthe blog and besides the
cookbook, is that you actuallytook a great chunk of your time
to step in as a course creatorand help other bloggers with
(14:01):
food photography and courses andthings like that.
So did you tap into any of thatexperience and bring it over?
Speaker 2 (14:10):
Absolutely so.
It was so interesting to mebecause when you're creating
courses, you're you're somewhatfollowing this like pattern, the
sales pattern, and the biggestthing I learned from that, I
mean we probably did.
We probably did between 30 and40 launches of all of our
(14:32):
courses over the lifetime ofphotography school, which was
like six years.
Basically, I shut it downbecause I wanted to spend more
time growing my career.
Like it got to the point where,like I needed to prioritize
myself and like give myself timefor the book and things like
that.
But anyway, so we did so manylaunches and there was so much
(14:53):
invaluable information that Ilearned from doing those
launches and like understandinghow to connect with a consumer
base on a bunch of differentlevels and understanding that
you need so many touch pointsand so many like sort of points
to hit a sale.
(15:14):
Like just there's so manyfascinating parts about courses
that like I really geek out onand I directly translated that
to the cookbook in terms of ourentire sales sequence.
So that's been so fun and it'ssomething that I never would
have thought was so useful in myown career, but it's made such
(15:36):
a difference.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
How have you handled?
Because too often I meet peoplethat want to do something
different and I'm alwaysadvocating and telling people.
You know, baking is just askill.
There are many different ways,like course creation.
I know you also had amembership blogging.
So when you did decide to dothe teaching portion and then
(15:59):
you stated you recently closedit, how was it to pivot?
And how do you view your pivots?
Because I just look at them astests.
I know some people will saywell, oh, it didn't do well, or
it failed, and I'm like no,nothing fails, they're just
tests that help me bring thevision to life more.
So was it hard to close thatchapter?
Speaker 2 (16:19):
I really dragged out the clothes as long as I could.
I tried to keep it open as longas I could because I didn't
want to close it down.
It just felt like I mean, notonly did I feel like it was
impactful for the people we weredoing it for, but I also had a
(16:39):
team.
I loved being part of a team.
I was the employer for all ofthese people.
That was so important andspecial for me.
But I think ultimately, the thereason why I chose to pivot was
because I was finding that myown personal brand was often
(17:01):
taking a backseat to all of thethings I had to do for
photography school and to showup for other people.
And I think that if you'relistening to this and you create
courses or you know areinterested in creating courses,
you can absolutely do that andhave an amazing and fulfilling
(17:21):
career, and that can be yourmain thing.
I have always balanced thatwith my own career and I
ultimately just had to make adecision Do I want to have my
career be focused on helpingother people's careers or do I
want to have my career befocused on taking all my
knowledge that I do know andleveraging that for my own
(17:41):
career and for my personaljourney it just made more sense
to continue on my path andreally be able to put as much
energy and effort as I couldinto my own career.
But I don't think that's theright move for everybody at all.
It's just what it felt rightfor me.
(18:02):
I felt like I would be doing adisservice to my own career by
not giving it all of my energy.
You know.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Absolutely.
And I mean, who doesn't want toaim for the title of New York
Times bestselling author?
Speaker 2 (18:17):
right, yeah, yeah, but like that's, I think, also
what's so amazing about likebeing in the food space online
right now?
There are so many differentways that you can like reach
that top.
There's so many different waysthat you can explore and like.
Just like you're saying, likebaking is a skill and it's so
interesting you say that becauseI had this lecture that I did
(18:40):
for students at the school ofthe New York times and it was
all about how you can dowhatever you want in the food
space, but you have to make surethat you're thinking skill
first.
So, like baking's a skill,photography's a skill,
marketing's a skill, and you cantake those skills and you can
spin them in so many differentdirections, but it has to be a
skill first and foremost.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Absolutely, and it's definitely was still an amazing
thing because there are so manydifferent bloggers and bakers
who were able to learn from you.
The ones who did succeeded, andyou can definitely tell when I
scroll on someone's page.
I remember the early days ofI'm like, oh, I know where you
(19:23):
took a class at, because thatlook is just, it's nice, it's
very, very nice, absolutely.
You yourself.
Now that you're an author, doyou have any favorite cookbooks
or cookbook authors thatinspired you?
Speaker 2 (19:38):
I like literally have an entire closet of cookbooks
to my left.
I'm like I need to peek in.
Um, yeah, okay, so I think.
So I think.
In terms of vibes, I think thatMolly Baz's two books Cook this
Book and More Is More.
I think they have added so muchpersonality to the cookbook
(19:59):
space and I think she's donesuch a good job at really
pushing the boundaries of, like,how fun and how creative a
cookbook can be.
So I think that she's done sucha phenomenal job In terms of
like books that I love to bakeout of and cook out of most.
I'm absolutely obsessed withOtto Lange's books.
I go to them all the time andone thing I love about those
(20:21):
books is it really feels likeyou can create an entire meal or
an entire experience with likemultiple recipes in the book.
I love books where, like, youcan mix and match recipes
together, so like get a sidefrom this chapter and get a main
from this chapter and a dessertover here, but they still all
sort of tell a story and worktogether.
So I love that.
(20:42):
And then I also I mean I haveto like nod to Claire Saffitz.
I think that what she's donewith baking books is phenomenal.
She's just shown that there isthis really big audience out
there that wants a strictlybaking book and I I love that.
(21:02):
I think that the bakingcommunity is a little, that the
baking community is a littleunderserved in terms of
cookbooks.
There's not a ton of broadbaking books out there.
There's a lot of sort of likeniche down, single subject,
baking books.
But yeah, I think she reallyhas shown in the last few years
(21:23):
that there's such a need formore of those.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
With your book coming out, what would be the first
recipe that you would wantsomebody to dig in and try?
Speaker 2 (21:34):
Oh my God, that is such a tough question.
It's like picking a baby.
I know it is like picking ababy, okay.
Okay.
So maybe we'll do like sort ofa quick and easy recipe and then
a more like fun takes yourentire afternoon recipe.
Um quick and easy recipe.
(21:55):
Okay, I might go with one ofthe single serve recipes.
The single serve doublechocolate cookie that's on the
front of the book is absolutelyincredible.
It creates two giant cookies.
It is so good I make itprobably like once every two
weeks whenever I want, just likea little cookie at the end of
the night.
So that is so, so good and it'sjust so easy.
(22:16):
If you're looking for like afull afternoon bake, the Nutella
Smith Island cake is insane.
It's basically it's nine layersof vanilla cake.
Really like this very, veryeggy, delicious, like yellow
cake batter.
And then the layers in themiddle are this like Nutella
(22:37):
ganache.
That is just so good.
You know it has a little bit ofa salty note, a little bit of
like a umami note from the nutsin it.
It is like it's absolutelyinsane.
It's such a good cake.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
That sounds so delicious, and I'm seeing so
many more people enjoy ganachenow, aside from just regular
buttercream, so that sounds likea wonderful twist to a classic.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
Yeah, and it was really hard to get the texture
right, because with ganacheyou're obviously working with
two or one thing that's a liquid, like a cream, and one thing
that's a solid chocolate, andwith this you're kind of working
with a liquid and and like a, aspread, and so like with the
nutella, and so getting thatthat consistency right was was
(23:25):
really tough, but I think we didgood.
I you know whoever's listeningto this, get back to me, let me
know all right and I'm sure ittastes phenomenal.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
I've been able to sneak and look at it so I saw
the picture of it.
It is stunning.
And lastly, before I let you go, do you have any plans for the
book?
Will you do a book tour or anyparticular fun lives or anything
you have scheduled?
Speaker 2 (23:55):
yes, so we're doing a book tour.
It's going to be in the monthof October, I think.
It's nine cities, it might be10, something around there, but
we're doing like a full countrybook tour.
So there's information for thaton my website.
It's all it's bromanbakerycomslash cookbook.
It's all there.
I'm so excited for that becausesomething that I have loved
(24:18):
about this process is going frombeing online to like in real
life.
And there's the online to reallife of having a physical book
instead of, you know, a blogpost and pages.
But then there's the real lifelike meeting all these people
who have, like, pretty muchgiven me my career, like to be
(24:38):
able to actually meet the peoplewho follow me, bake from my
site, like buy the products thatI recommend.
All that Like.
I am just so, so excited tomeet people Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
And what advice would you give to anyone who's a
baker, who maybe wants to getstarted blogging and and do as
you and just start their ownblog?
What advice or tips would youhave?
Speaker 2 (25:05):
Um, oh my God, so many tips Okay.
So, first of all, we talkedabout skills-based, so I think
like, without a doubt, work onthose skills and baking and make
sure they're really the bestthey can be.
But but also, on that note, um,if you're talking about going
into the online space, visualsare still so, so important.
So signing up for a course thatinvolves photography, even if
(25:25):
it's just iPhone photography, isgoing to be so helpful, even if
you are planning to mostly dovideos, like creating reels and
Tik TOKs.
I use so much compositionalknowledge every single time I go
to shoot a video, so I thinkhaving that background is going
to help to make your bakes,which you're spending so much
time on and are, you know,beautiful, I'm sure, in front of
(25:48):
you.
It's going to make thattranslate to the screen, because
without that, it's like you'rejust shooting yourself in the
foot if it can't look as prettyas it does in front of your eyes
.
And then I would also say that,unfortunately for some, content
is like the biggest way toreally boost your career right
(26:10):
now.
So being really really involvedon social media and I say
unfortunately because it reallydoes mean that you have to be
creating content every singleday in order to see that growth
on social media, and sometimesthat can just mean doing stories
.
Sometimes it doesn't have to belike a full-on post, but
showing up on social media everysingle day is just going to be
(26:31):
so, so helpful, not only forboosting your chances of success
in the algorithms, but also forgiving you those little
analytical moments of thisdidn't work.
This did work.
Ooh, people really responded tothis.
Ooh, no, they don't like this,and it's like this teaching
moment every single day thatyou're just gathering data on.
So just showing up online evenwhen you don't feel like it.
Speaker 1 (26:54):
I love that.
Those are all wonderful tips,sarah.
From the bottom of my littleSouthern heart, thank you so
much for coming by today fortelling us all about your new
book.
I'll have all the links to thebook, the book tour, sarah's
website, in the show notes.
And before I let you go, sarah,are you ready for a game of
lightning round?
I'm so ready.
(27:15):
All right, what is a dessert?
You cannot live withoutChocolate chip cookies.
What is your favorite color?
Speaker 2 (27:26):
I don't know.
I want to say beige.
I love neutrals.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
That's new.
I like that one.
All right, who is yourcelebrity crush?
Oh, ryan Reynolds.
Wonderful choice.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
We meant like real celebrity crush, right, yeah,
okay, cool, oh my God, no wait,I mean Ryan Gosling.
Ryan Gosling, sorry, not RyanReynolds, ryan Gosling.
Okay, there we go.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
Okay, that's a good one too.
What is your favorite kitchenutensil?
A whisk A whisk that soundsawesome.
And then the last one, which wewill have you skip, which is
usually what is one of yourfavorite books, and, because
you're here with us today, wewill recommend that all of our
users be sure to pre-order or goout and get your new book,
(28:18):
sweet Tooth, which is amazing.
Sarah, thank you so much forhanging out with us today.
It really is a blast justhearing from all your expertise,
and I know so many people aredying to get the book, so we
really do appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (28:32):
Thank you so much.
Such a blast to talk to you too.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
How amazing was listening to Sarah's journey
within this baking industry.
You know her online school wasreally she's being so humble,
but it was really one of the topplaces that bloggers went in
order to elevate theirphotography and things on their
blog, and so to see her pivot toa cookbook and focusing on her.
(28:59):
I love to hear that.
One of the things I love themost is honestly, when people
are just honest about why theychange, because you hear me say
it on here on social media allthe time, like we have multiple
gifts, we can do multiple things, and although niching down is
great, if you find thatsomething no longer works for
you, that it doesn't bring youjoy.
(29:20):
I always think it's amazing tochange and to do something else,
and so it's not really that bigof a change for her, because
recipes have always been thecenter of her business and her
brand, but it's nice to see hernow step into the realm of being
an author.
She's actually currently onbook tour and I have all that
information below, as well asher website and how you can get
(29:43):
your hands on a copy of her newbook, sweet Tooth.
I pray that this episodeinspired you, motivated you and
encouraged you and please do mea favor, tag me on social media
as you listen, I would love toshout you out and share you.
Thanks so much for tuning in.
Have a great day and bye fornow.
Hey, sweet friends, my name is Chef Schaumburg.
I started my baking businesswith a bottle of DeSerono and
one Bundt cake pan.
Fast forward to today, fromnews to magazines, speaking on
national stages and more.
I can truly say that baking haschanged my life.
So now, as a bakery businesscoach, I get to help others have
the same success.
I've helped hundreds of mystudents across the world in my
(00:24):
global membership program createsix-figure businesses, mainly
from home.
The Baking for Business podcastis an extension of that, from
actionable tips to valuabletools and resources that can
impact you as a business owner.
I truly believe y'all.
We would never have been givena gift if we couldn't profit and
prosper from it.
So come on, darling.
What are you waiting for?
(00:45):
Hey, what's going on?
Baking friends, and welcomeback to the Baking for Business
podcast.
Thank you so much for joiningme today for another episode.
Today we have an amazing guestin the house who has been a
blogger for a while and now sheis a cookbook author.
She is Sarah Fennell, thefounder and the beautiful woman
(01:12):
behind Roma Bakery I'm sureyou're all familiar with the
brand on Instagram and here totell us all about her new book,
which features so many yummythings, as well as just her
journey within this sweet,delicious industry, is Sarah
herself.
So, sarah, welcome to theBaking for Business podcast.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Hi Amanda, hi everybody.
I'm so excited.
Literally baking and businessare my two favorite things to
talk about, so I'm very excitedabout this.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Absolutely.
That's what we're all about,and so, for those who are
unfamiliar with you, I want togo ahead and ask I know you
originally started blogging, butwhat inspired you to start your
blog and how did you get yourstart in the desserts arena?
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Yeah, so I, like many people who are in the food
industry, um, grew up lovingfood, and so I had a mom who was
very much a home baker, likeshe loved and always had cookies
or brownies or cakes on thecounter, but also like she was
(02:17):
not technical at all, likesometimes her cookies would come
out so flat, Sometimes they'dbe too puffy and overcooked.
The biggest thing, though, waslike we just had baked goods
around because she had a hugesweet tooth.
I then, like, got a huge sweettooth from her, so we really
just did it because we lovedessert.
And at the same time, when Iwas growing up, I was really
(02:40):
into photography, and so, when Iwent to college, I went to
college liberal arts school Iwent for anthropology, and I,
when I went to college, I wentto college liberal arts school,
I went for anthropology, and Ireally missed having a creative
outlet, and so I decided tobasically merge my two passions
and take photos of baked goodsthat I made, and I decided to
put it on a blog I crawled it,excuse me, I called it Broma
(03:02):
Bakery, and it really wascompletely a hobby, like I had
no intention from the beginningof turning it into a business.
It was very much a creativeoutlet.
So I did that all throughoutcollege and then I was in the
restaurant industry throughoutcollege and then, after and long
story short I got burnt out inthe restaurant industry.
(03:23):
It's like, as I'm sure so manyof your listeners know, it's so
unforgiving, it's so taxing,like on the body and the mind.
It's just like I have so muchrespect for people who work in
restaurants.
So I decided to quit my job,cold turkey, and I basically
like went home and I Googled howto make money on a blog.
(03:45):
I had no idea what I was doing,um, but I was really fortunate.
I had saved up literally $8,500.
Um, that's like how much moneyI had to my name.
And I decided to give myself twomonths and figure out if I
could turn my blog into abusiness and into my career.
And that was, oh my gosh, thatwas whoa 10 years ago.
(04:11):
So it worked out, but really itvery much started as this hobby
thing that I did just because Iloved it and I had so much
passion for what I was doing.
But I also think it differsfrom a lot of other people in
this way that I went full timebefore I had this proof of
concept and I think having thatkind of forced me to hustle
(04:34):
harder than I would have if Ihad something to fall back on.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
Yeah, absolutely.
That definitely sounds like abeautiful, humble beginning and
you said 10 years ago almost adecade of blogging and showing
up and building your audience.
It's amazing that you took thatleap of faith with just a
little bit saved up.
Did you teach yourself likewhen you initially started your
(05:01):
blog?
Were you watching all theYouTube videos, or was there any
particular course or anythingyou invested in to help you
start that blogging journey?
Speaker 2 (05:09):
So I went full-time in 2014.
So it was very much thebeginning of, like the course
era.
Like courses were not, I feel,like big until you know, 2016,
17, 18.
Um, it was.
So it was as much free contentas I could.
It was YouTubing everything,googling everything and really
(05:32):
just like bootstrapping it withwhat I could figure out.
I really tried at that time tomake a lot of connections, too,
with other people who I knewwere doing it full-time, and I
would literally email them and Iwould like ask for their advice
and really just like get theinformation that I could.
And I think that all of thattogether was so helpful for me.
(05:53):
And I also think that, like notletting a lack of information
stop me from going and figuringit out on my own was also really
helpful.
So like I relied on trying tolike figure things out, but when
I couldn't figure it out, Iwould still go and try to do it
on my own.
So trying to figure out, likewhy when I was photographing
(06:15):
something, the light didn't lookright, or trying to figure out
like how to get my edit to lookjust like how I knew I wanted it
in my head, but like couldn'tfind from tutorials online and
really like a lot of like trialand error to kind of like build
up.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
Trial and error is always the greatest teacher, for
sure.
And so, as you startededucating yourself and building
and you went for the blog, howdid you specifically decide on
the baking niche?
Was it just because of thatlove, or did you try other
things savory?
Speaker 2 (06:48):
It was really because of a love of baking Like I.
I it was never even a questionif I was going to have a blog
that was savory or sweet like itwas sweet, I felt much more
comfortable with baking and Ithink in my teens and early
twenties I was just moreinterested in baking.
I am a very technical person.
(07:09):
I love when things have likethey're very defined parts, and
so baking just really appeals tome in that way.
It feels very formulaic.
It's interesting.
I've learned to cook bettersince then and I really like
cooking now, but baking has justalways.
It feels like I'm sure you feelthe same Like it just feels
(07:29):
different, like there'ssomething about baking that just
like it makes me so much moreexcited.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Absolutely.
You definitely have to do whatbrings you joy, and so, from
blogging to now focusing on abook, can you walk us through
the process of turning your blogcontent into a cookbook?
Was that always something thatyou wanted to go after, or was
the opportunity just brought toyou?
Speaker 2 (07:56):
Yeah, I actually did not want to do a cookbook for
the longest time because I hadheard from so many people that
it was so much work and I was soworried about just becoming
overwhelmed and like reallywanted to make sure I had enough
time to devote towards itwithout going crazy.
(08:17):
So for a long time I didn'twant to do a cookbook and I was
totally fine with being in theonline world.
I also think that do a cookbookand I was totally fine with
being in the online world.
I also think that people createcookbooks for so many different
reasons.
For myself and in my journey, Iknew that I didn't want to
create a cookbook until I feltso, so confident in every aspect
(08:38):
of my skills that would go intothat book.
So, feeling really confident inmy brand, feeling really
confident in the voice and sortof the writing that goes into
the book, feeling reallyconfident in my brand, feeling
really confident in the voiceand sort of the writing that
goes into the book, feelingreally confident about the
recipes themselves, feelingconfident about the photography,
feeling confident about howwell I could market it, and so
it really took me a long time tosort of feel like I had mastery
(09:01):
in all of those areas tofinally be okay with being like
okay, now let's put this pen topaper, onto something that will
exist for the rest of time andyou can't go back and edit it
Like.
That's so terrifying to me.
So, um, so yeah.
And in terms of how westructured the book with recipes
(09:23):
it's a hundred recipes, 76 ofthem are brand new, never before
seen that we developedspecifically for the book.
And then 24 are from the blog.
The ones that we picked fromthe blog we decided to do for
two reasons.
One there's some that are justlike fan favorites.
Everybody knows them, everybodyloves them.
So, like our brown butterchocolate chip cookies, they're
(09:46):
the most popular recipe on ourblog.
Like I knew I needed to includethose in my cookbook.
And then others are ones thatare really good, base recipes or
or creative recipes, butrecipes that like are our
favorites.
We have an oatmeal cream piecookie recipe in there and that
recipe is like, oh my God, it'slike one of the best recipes I
have ever like eaten, made,think about.
(10:08):
And so those recipes too, theseones that are like doing well
on the blog, but we reallywanted to highlight and bring to
a bigger audience.
That's what we chose to do too.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
I love that because too often people are always,
especially as business owners,always in the create, create,
create type space when it comesto content.
But I love the fact that yourepurpose, not in a sense of
just I'm going to add this too,but more so I want to add to the
user experience and really justbring out the things that
(10:38):
people love already.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
Absolutely, and I think that that's one thing that
I really strive for in mybusiness in general is really
making sure I'm centering mycontent around the user and
really keeping like who I'mdoing it for front and center,
because the more that I can havethat picture of who it's for,
(11:01):
the better I'm able to figureout like would that type of
person be interested in thiscontent?
Does that type of person evencare about you know this?
Would this fit into their lives?
And it's like for me, it's areally helpful way to sort of
figure out just generally whatcontent I should be producing,
because there's so many amazingrecipes out there, there's so
many ways that you can do things, and it can almost become
(11:23):
overwhelming when you're justthinking oh, just generally,
this seems good, this seems good, this seems good, and so, yeah,
I think like centering the userin that is just so, so
important.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
What are some of your favorite memories that you've
had in creating the book and,overall around, how long did it
take you to go from start tobringing it to fruition?
Speaker 2 (11:42):
Yeah, so it's been a little over a two-year process.
I started writing the proposalfor the book in June of 2022,
and the book comes out inOctober of 2024.
So it's a long process andthat's pretty standard.
Two years for a cookbook isvery standard.
Favorite memories, I would say,from the process.
(12:12):
There's the less discreetmemories, I would say, of just
like being in the writing stageand writing a head note that I'm
just like yes, oh, that's sogood, or like that's such a fun
way of getting someone excitedabout this and just getting in
those grooves.
It just felt so good.
And then I feel like I mean,turning in the manuscript was
just like it felt like such, a,such an accomplishment and
(12:34):
something I was so happy about.
I mean, I think it's like80,000 words or something, or
maybe it's, maybe it's closer to90, but like it's, it's a lot.
It's a lot of words, Um, andobviously, never having written
a book before, that just felt socool to be able to like have
this big body of work to turn in.
And then I have had so much funwith the more like salesy part
(13:00):
of it, like introducing the bookto my audience, seeing how
they're responding, responding,creating content to push
pre-orders and things like that.
It's been so fun because I feellike it's called back on like
my course days.
So I actually had a school thatwas like for food photography
(13:21):
and we had a bunch of differentcourses in it.
Hold on, oh, let's talk Carson.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
I know that you're you're going.
You took my next question fromme.
Speaker 2 (13:35):
So it was really cool to like have this sales aspect
of that and like be able to dothat in this new way.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
So yeah, and speaking of sales, one thing that people
may not know about you, besidesthe blog and besides the
cookbook, is that you actuallytook a great chunk of your time
to step in as a course creatorand help other bloggers with
(14:01):
food photography and courses andthings like that.
So did you tap into any of thatexperience and bring it over?
Speaker 2 (14:10):
Absolutely so.
It was so interesting to mebecause when you're creating
courses, you're you're somewhatfollowing this like pattern, the
sales pattern, and the biggestthing I learned from that, I
mean we probably did.
We probably did between 30 and40 launches of all of our
(14:32):
courses over the lifetime ofphotography school, which was
like six years.
Basically, I shut it downbecause I wanted to spend more
time growing my career.
Like it got to the point where,like I needed to prioritize
myself and like give myself timefor the book and things like
that.
But anyway, so we did so manylaunches and there was so much
(14:53):
invaluable information that Ilearned from doing those
launches and like understandinghow to connect with a consumer
base on a bunch of differentlevels and understanding that
you need so many touch pointsand so many like sort of points
to hit a sale.
(15:14):
Like just there's so manyfascinating parts about courses
that like I really geek out onand I directly translated that
to the cookbook in terms of ourentire sales sequence.
So that's been so fun and it'ssomething that I never would
have thought was so useful in myown career, but it's made such
(15:36):
a difference.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
How have you handled?
Because too often I meet peoplethat want to do something
different and I'm alwaysadvocating and telling people.
You know, baking is just askill.
There are many different ways,like course creation.
I know you also had amembership blogging.
So when you did decide to dothe teaching portion and then
(15:59):
you stated you recently closedit, how was it to pivot?
And how do you view your pivots?
Because I just look at them astests.
I know some people will saywell, oh, it didn't do well, or
it failed, and I'm like no,nothing fails, they're just
tests that help me bring thevision to life more.
So was it hard to close thatchapter?
Speaker 2 (16:19):
I really dragged out the clothes as long as I could.
I tried to keep it open as longas I could because I didn't
want to close it down.
It just felt like I mean, notonly did I feel like it was
impactful for the people we weredoing it for, but I also had a
(16:39):
team.
I loved being part of a team.
I was the employer for all ofthese people.
That was so important andspecial for me.
But I think ultimately, the thereason why I chose to pivot was
because I was finding that myown personal brand was often
(17:01):
taking a backseat to all of thethings I had to do for
photography school and to showup for other people.
And I think that if you'relistening to this and you create
courses or you know areinterested in creating courses,
you can absolutely do that andhave an amazing and fulfilling
(17:21):
career, and that can be yourmain thing.
I have always balanced thatwith my own career and I
ultimately just had to make adecision Do I want to have my
career be focused on helpingother people's careers or do I
want to have my career befocused on taking all my
knowledge that I do know andleveraging that for my own
(17:41):
career and for my personaljourney it just made more sense
to continue on my path andreally be able to put as much
energy and effort as I couldinto my own career.
But I don't think that's theright move for everybody at all.
It's just what it felt rightfor me.
(18:02):
I felt like I would be doing adisservice to my own career by
not giving it all of my energy.
You know.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Absolutely.
And I mean, who doesn't want toaim for the title of New York
Times bestselling author?
Speaker 2 (18:17):
right, yeah, yeah, but like that's, I think, also
what's so amazing about likebeing in the food space online
right now?
There are so many differentways that you can like reach
that top.
There's so many different waysthat you can explore and like.
Just like you're saying, likebaking is a skill and it's so
interesting you say that becauseI had this lecture that I did
(18:40):
for students at the school ofthe New York times and it was
all about how you can dowhatever you want in the food
space, but you have to make surethat you're thinking skill
first.
So, like baking's a skill,photography's a skill,
marketing's a skill, and you cantake those skills and you can
spin them in so many differentdirections, but it has to be a
skill first and foremost.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Absolutely, and it's definitely was still an amazing
thing because there are so manydifferent bloggers and bakers
who were able to learn from you.
The ones who did succeeded, andyou can definitely tell when I
scroll on someone's page.
I remember the early days ofI'm like, oh, I know where you
(19:23):
took a class at, because thatlook is just, it's nice, it's
very, very nice, absolutely.
You yourself.
Now that you're an author, doyou have any favorite cookbooks
or cookbook authors thatinspired you?
Speaker 2 (19:38):
I like literally have an entire closet of cookbooks
to my left.
I'm like I need to peek in.
Um, yeah, okay, so I think.
So I think.
In terms of vibes, I think thatMolly Baz's two books Cook this
Book and More Is More.
I think they have added so muchpersonality to the cookbook
(19:59):
space and I think she's donesuch a good job at really
pushing the boundaries of, like,how fun and how creative a
cookbook can be.
So I think that she's done sucha phenomenal job In terms of
like books that I love to bakeout of and cook out of most.
I'm absolutely obsessed withOtto Lange's books.
I go to them all the time andone thing I love about those
(20:21):
books is it really feels likeyou can create an entire meal or
an entire experience with likemultiple recipes in the book.
I love books where, like, youcan mix and match recipes
together, so like get a sidefrom this chapter and get a main
from this chapter and a dessertover here, but they still all
sort of tell a story and worktogether.
So I love that.
(20:42):
And then I also I mean I haveto like nod to Claire Saffitz.
I think that what she's donewith baking books is phenomenal.
She's just shown that there isthis really big audience out
there that wants a strictlybaking book and I I love that.
(21:02):
I think that the bakingcommunity is a little, that the
baking community is a littleunderserved in terms of
cookbooks.
There's not a ton of broadbaking books out there.
There's a lot of sort of likeniche down, single subject,
baking books.
But yeah, I think she reallyhas shown in the last few years
(21:23):
that there's such a need formore of those.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
With your book coming out, what would be the first
recipe that you would wantsomebody to dig in and try?
Speaker 2 (21:34):
Oh my God, that is such a tough question.
It's like picking a baby.
I know it is like picking ababy, okay.
Okay.
So maybe we'll do like sort ofa quick and easy recipe and then
a more like fun takes yourentire afternoon recipe.
Um quick and easy recipe.
(21:55):
Okay, I might go with one ofthe single serve recipes.
The single serve doublechocolate cookie that's on the
front of the book is absolutelyincredible.
It creates two giant cookies.
It is so good I make itprobably like once every two
weeks whenever I want, just likea little cookie at the end of
the night.
So that is so, so good and it'sjust so easy.
(22:16):
If you're looking for like afull afternoon bake, the Nutella
Smith Island cake is insane.
It's basically it's nine layersof vanilla cake.
Really like this very, veryeggy, delicious, like yellow
cake batter.
And then the layers in themiddle are this like Nutella
(22:37):
ganache.
That is just so good.
You know it has a little bit ofa salty note, a little bit of
like a umami note from the nutsin it.
It is like it's absolutelyinsane.
It's such a good cake.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
That sounds so delicious, and I'm seeing so
many more people enjoy ganachenow, aside from just regular
buttercream, so that sounds likea wonderful twist to a classic.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
Yeah, and it was really hard to get the texture
right, because with ganacheyou're obviously working with
two or one thing that's a liquid, like a cream, and one thing
that's a solid chocolate, andwith this you're kind of working
with a liquid and and like a, aspread, and so like with the
nutella, and so getting thatthat consistency right was was
(23:25):
really tough, but I think we didgood.
I you know whoever's listeningto this, get back to me, let me
know all right and I'm sure ittastes phenomenal.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
I've been able to sneak and look at it so I saw
the picture of it.
It is stunning.
And lastly, before I let you go, do you have any plans for the
book?
Will you do a book tour or anyparticular fun lives or anything
you have scheduled?
Speaker 2 (23:55):
yes, so we're doing a book tour.
It's going to be in the monthof October, I think.
It's nine cities, it might be10, something around there, but
we're doing like a full countrybook tour.
So there's information for thaton my website.
It's all it's bromanbakerycomslash cookbook.
It's all there.
I'm so excited for that becausesomething that I have loved
(24:18):
about this process is going frombeing online to like in real
life.
And there's the online to reallife of having a physical book
instead of, you know, a blogpost and pages.
But then there's the real lifelike meeting all these people
who have, like, pretty muchgiven me my career, like to be
(24:38):
able to actually meet the peoplewho follow me, bake from my
site, like buy the products thatI recommend.
All that Like.
I am just so, so excited tomeet people Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
And what advice would you give to anyone who's a
baker, who maybe wants to getstarted blogging and and do as
you and just start their ownblog?
What advice or tips would youhave?
Speaker 2 (25:05):
Um, oh my God, so many tips Okay.
So, first of all, we talkedabout skills-based, so I think
like, without a doubt, work onthose skills and baking and make
sure they're really the bestthey can be.
But but also, on that note, um,if you're talking about going
into the online space, visualsare still so, so important.
So signing up for a course thatinvolves photography, even if
(25:25):
it's just iPhone photography, isgoing to be so helpful, even if
you are planning to mostly dovideos, like creating reels and
Tik TOKs.
I use so much compositionalknowledge every single time I go
to shoot a video, so I thinkhaving that background is going
to help to make your bakes,which you're spending so much
time on and are, you know,beautiful, I'm sure, in front of
(25:48):
you.
It's going to make thattranslate to the screen, because
without that, it's like you'rejust shooting yourself in the
foot if it can't look as prettyas it does in front of your eyes
.
And then I would also say that,unfortunately for some, content
is like the biggest way toreally boost your career right
(26:10):
now.
So being really really involvedon social media and I say
unfortunately because it reallydoes mean that you have to be
creating content every singleday in order to see that growth
on social media, and sometimesthat can just mean doing stories
.
Sometimes it doesn't have to belike a full-on post, but
showing up on social media everysingle day is just going to be
(26:31):
so, so helpful, not only forboosting your chances of success
in the algorithms, but also forgiving you those little
analytical moments of thisdidn't work.
This did work.
Ooh, people really responded tothis.
Ooh, no, they don't like this,and it's like this teaching
moment every single day thatyou're just gathering data on.
So just showing up online evenwhen you don't feel like it.
Speaker 1 (26:54):
I love that.
Those are all wonderful tips,sarah.
From the bottom of my littleSouthern heart, thank you so
much for coming by today fortelling us all about your new
book.
I'll have all the links to thebook, the book tour, sarah's
website, in the show notes.
And before I let you go, sarah,are you ready for a game of
lightning round?
I'm so ready.
(27:15):
All right, what is a dessert?
You cannot live withoutChocolate chip cookies.
What is your favorite color?
Speaker 2 (27:26):
I don't know.
I want to say beige.
I love neutrals.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
That's new.
I like that one.
All right, who is yourcelebrity crush?
Oh, ryan Reynolds.
Wonderful choice.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
We meant like real celebrity crush, right, yeah,
okay, cool, oh my God, no wait,I mean Ryan Gosling.
Ryan Gosling, sorry, not RyanReynolds, ryan Gosling.
Okay, there we go.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
Okay, that's a good one too.
What is your favorite kitchenutensil?
A whisk A whisk that soundsawesome.
And then the last one, which wewill have you skip, which is
usually what is one of yourfavorite books, and, because
you're here with us today, wewill recommend that all of our
users be sure to pre-order or goout and get your new book,
(28:18):
sweet Tooth, which is amazing.
Sarah, thank you so much forhanging out with us today.
It really is a blast justhearing from all your expertise,
and I know so many people aredying to get the book, so we
really do appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (28:32):
Thank you so much.
Such a blast to talk to you too.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
How amazing was listening to Sarah's journey
within this baking industry.
You know her online school wasreally she's being so humble,
but it was really one of the topplaces that bloggers went in
order to elevate theirphotography and things on their
blog, and so to see her pivot toa cookbook and focusing on her.
(28:59):
I love to hear that.
One of the things I love themost is honestly, when people
are just honest about why theychange, because you hear me say
it on here on social media allthe time, like we have multiple
gifts, we can do multiple things, and although niching down is
great, if you find thatsomething no longer works for
you, that it doesn't bring youjoy.
(29:20):
I always think it's amazing tochange and to do something else,
and so it's not really that bigof a change for her, because
recipes have always been thecenter of her business and her
brand, but it's nice to see hernow step into the realm of being
an author.
She's actually currently onbook tour and I have all that
information below, as well asher website and how you can get
(29:43):
your hands on a copy of her newbook, sweet Tooth.
I pray that this episodeinspired you, motivated you and
encouraged you and please do mea favor, tag me on social media
as you listen, I would love toshout you out and share you.
Thanks so much for tuning in.
Have a great day and bye fornow.
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