August 23, 2024 • 56 mins
Brian and Trey chat with award-winning stage, film, and TV actress Amy Brenneman about her most important role as a Mom and her tireless efforts to advocate for neurodivergent kids.
Amy Brenneman is an actress, producer and activist known for co-creating and starring in the hit CBS drama series Judging Amy, as well as numerous other stage, film, and television roles including NYPD Blue, Private Practice, The Leftovers, The Sound Inside, Fear, and most recently the role of Zoe McDonald on the hit FX series The Old Man with Jeff Bridges.
Brian Phelps is an American radio personality, actor, and comedian best known for co-hosting the nationally and globally syndicated Mark & Brian Morning Show in Los Angeles for 25 years. As the co-lead of his own television series, with multiple roles in movies, and a Star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame, Phelps is also an inductee in the Radio Hall of Fame.
Trey Callaway is an American film and TV writer and producer who wrote the hit movie I Still Know What You Did Last Summer, and has produced successful TV series like CSI:NY, Supernatural, Rush Hour, Revolution, The Messengers, APB, Station 19 and 9-1-1 LONE STAR. He is also a Professor at USC.
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Amy Brenneman is an actress, producer and activist known for co-creating and starring in the hit CBS drama series Judging Amy, as well as numerous other stage, film, and television roles including NYPD Blue, Private Practice, The Leftovers, The Sound Inside, Fear, and most recently the role of Zoe McDonald on the hit FX series The Old Man with Jeff Bridges.
Brian Phelps is an American radio personality, actor, and comedian best known for co-hosting the nationally and globally syndicated Mark & Brian Morning Show in Los Angeles for 25 years. As the co-lead of his own television series, with multiple roles in movies, and a Star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame, Phelps is also an inductee in the Radio Hall of Fame.
Trey Callaway is an American film and TV writer and producer who wrote the hit movie I Still Know What You Did Last Summer, and has produced successful TV series like CSI:NY, Supernatural, Rush Hour, Revolution, The Messengers, APB, Station 19 and 9-1-1 LONE STAR. He is also a Professor at USC.
___________________________________
Make sure to follow us on social media at:
begoodhumanspodcast.com
instagram.com
tiktok.com
threads.net
facebook.com
x.com
patreon.com
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I love singing about the moon and you and Springer.
I love singing about Scott so Blue and anything with
the swing, and I love you, I love wow. I
really thought you'd be uh insulting me no, and instead
of joining in, no.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
I was going with that. I've never heard of it.
I don't know what you were singing, but I liked it.
Speaker 3 (00:20):
Good humans, be good humans, Be good humans.
Speaker 4 (00:28):
Or we will think you sucked humans, or we will
thank you suck.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
I've never heard of it. I don't know what you
were singing, but I liked it.
Speaker 5 (00:43):
Oh, it's a song from my favorite cartoon of all time.
What cartoon it was, I think the thirties it was.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Didn't realize you went back then.
Speaker 5 (00:51):
It was it was called Owl Jolson.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Oh, Owl Jolson, Yes.
Speaker 5 (00:55):
Owl Jolson. There was about this little owl who was
forced to sing boring songs and his minister and the
church made him sing all these boring songs and when
they weren't looking. I love singing, very swingy, very swingy,
fairy swing. And in fact, al al Joson actually sang
that song in a movie.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Yeah, yeah, Well do you know what's.
Speaker 5 (01:16):
We're not gonna have time for the whole show.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
We're really going. I know can because I was gonna
riff on Brian, how I love you? How I love you?
I do love you, and we love you. It's nice
to be back. Welcome back to be good Humans. Dear friends.
If you're watching us before, I forget, if you're watching
this on YouTube, by the way, do us a favor
click I can subscribe. I know we're all taught as
(01:39):
children not to feed alligators, but we do need to
feed the algorithm. So like and subscribe to sing it
I like while you're at it. Also, by the way,
join us on Patreon. There is a I like the
backing music. There's a link on our website, Begod Humans
podcast dot com. Or you can get exclusive access to
(02:01):
all kinds of extra content like maybe him singing this
Adnolgium sing Okay, join us there. By the way, we've
also just dropped a couple of bonus episodes that you
can't see anywhere else, so go do that. But that's
not I don't want to talk about any of this.
I don't even want to talk about al Joelson. Can
we can we talk about parenting?
Speaker 5 (02:22):
You can talk about anything you want to talk about,
but but I just think it'd be a little opsided
since you have three amazing children and I'm not a parent.
Well well let me uh not in this state then,
I know of But yeah, we can we can talk
about parents.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
Can we please? Because I know we've done it a
little bit before. But also, you know, because for a
good reason, our parents were the og good humans in
our lives, and so I know it's clear that we
both loved our parents very much. Sadly, your folks are
no longer with us. I lost my mother a few
years ago. I'm blessed to say I still have my
(03:00):
dad around, but I would love to hear more about
what you love the most about your mom and dad,
about your mom about your dad, but also about them
as a couple.
Speaker 5 (03:11):
I think there's not a most in this what I
love the most. There are just many, many, many most
do tell. First of all, I was kind of lucky
that it was lucky for me because my parents were
very young when they got married, and that means I
kind of got to as I grew up watched them
grow up. Sure, okay, so my dad was seventeen, my
(03:32):
mom was twenty wow when they got married. In fact,
that's their wedding day.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
That's oh, of course it is twenty years old.
Speaker 5 (03:39):
And by the way, that's them in their sixties. Sky
now that I knew.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
But okay, so seven, he's seventeen, she's twenty, she's twenty.
Speaker 5 (03:46):
There is a photo there was actually statewide. This is
it came out of Key One of Illinois, the town
I was born in, basically my whole family, small small town.
But there's a photo that went statewide in all the newspapers.
Photo of my father sitting on the end of the
couch holding his first infant child, my sister, Debbie Nice.
(04:06):
Next to him is his mother, my Grandma Phelps, which
is there's a picture there too. Next to Grandma Phelps
is a picture of her mom, Grandma Miller. Next to
Grandma Miller sits her mother, Grandma Morris. Five generations. That's incredible.
(04:27):
Five generations.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
Wow, yeah, that's I mean, that's like newsworthy stuff to
have that many people together.
Speaker 5 (04:34):
And it was, yeah, it was. They were so proud
that they had made, you know, the paper statewide. But
so Dad had mom and Dad had me when Dad
was twenty two.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
I can't even imagine this.
Speaker 5 (04:44):
They had my younger brother Jeff when he was twenty four.
So three kids before the age of twenty five, Are
you kidding me? No, I can't. I can't conceive of that.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
I think they just made twenty somethings different back then. Yeah,
but that's that's a And then they were together for
many years your folks.
Speaker 5 (05:03):
Until the day. Wow, yeah, it's still They were so
much in love. They were so incredibly in love that
even you know, in their sixties and then pushed in
seventy and eight that if car still had bench seats,
Mom would be sliding over. Okay, they held hands. Dad
called her pretty lady. They were incredibly loved. This quick
(05:27):
story and I just thought of it. It wasn't in my notes.
But she had a sister. My mom had a sister,
my end Arlene, and who had lived out here with
her husband in California. And Dad said, you know, if
you want to fly out to visit your sister, I
can't get away from work, but I'll take care of
the kids and I'll do this. Oh she was so like, oh,
thank you. So she flies out. Two days go by
(05:50):
and they get on the phone just to say Hi,
how's it going, And Dad she could tell by my
dad's voice that he was sad without her, probably sad
by taking care of us two, yeah, but mainly sad
without her, he couldn't exist.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Wow.
Speaker 5 (06:04):
So she got on a plane after just two days
and flew home. Wow, happily because she was so proud,
so proud, not sweet.
Speaker 6 (06:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
How do you describe them as as just as parents
as you? I mean, I obviously you had siblings as well,
but like, what's your experience as the kid, as the kid,
but also as the adult now, like when you look
back on it, what was particularly good about their parenting? Well?
Speaker 5 (06:29):
I could go in this direction and you might have
a story about the same. But I can remember the
exact moment in my life, the exact day, the minute,
what I was looking at in my life that my
parents became not just parents that I love, that loved
me unconditionally, but they became my friends. My friends.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Tell me.
Speaker 5 (06:55):
I consciously thought, oh my god, my friends.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
All right.
Speaker 5 (07:00):
I was like ten and my sister got into a
little trouble, nothing bad, but you know, she just got
a punishable offense. So she was like early teens, maybe
just thirteen, and so they did the parent thing. They said,
we're going to ground you for two weeks. That didn't
go over well. They had an argument about it, and
(07:23):
my sister ran away. Oh wow, yeah, she ran away.
So there we all are sitting in the living room,
no TV, no rating, nothing going on, just dead silence,
and I'm looking at my parents at ten years old,
the worry, the concern, they were destroyed, and they were
just staring and I could actually see the gray hairs
(07:44):
growing out.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
This is a critical moment for you too, because you're
all eyes and these are my heroes.
Speaker 5 (07:51):
So the phone finally rings and it's Debbie and she's
crying and she said, I want to come home. I'm
so sorry, very apologetic, ready to take whatever punishment she's
going to get. They were just thrilled, they were happy
before Dad went to pick her up. Dad sat my
brother and I on the couch and he kneels down,
so now he's eye to eye with us, and he goes,
he said this, I'll never forget these words. He goes,
(08:13):
I want you to know something, your mother, and I
will never judge you for someone else's mistake. And then
he gets a smile on his face and he said,
clean slate, have a great time now. I Luckily I
was just barely old enough to comprehend what an amazing
(08:33):
moment that was that you know, he wasn't going to
be judging us as judgment free. Yeah, and become a
different parent now that they had a child that ran away.
That was a major moment for me, And that was
the day that I realized that they were my friends too.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
That's beautiful, that's beautiful.
Speaker 5 (08:51):
You know, my family made it up. But yeah, you
know it's even pretty.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
No, you know, my family did something that was certainly
important and significant at the time, but in retrospect over
the years has has taken on even greater meeting for me.
But we had a family band. Yeah, there was a
music room in our house. Nothing you know, super big
or special or fancy, because we were strictly middle class,
(09:18):
but like, we had a music room in our house,
and my parents both actively encouraged this participation in a
family band. And it was only for us, Like we
didn't play anywhere or anything. But there was a drum
kit in the corner of the room that was for
me and my sister would play keys on a little
(09:38):
of a little Hammond organ kind of thing, and then
my dad would play electric lead guitar, because you know,
he was always a musician, still is, and my mom
would play bass, big Fender concert jazz bass. These cover
songs are like, by the way, I was convinced that
(10:00):
the Beatles song Love Me Do that my parents wrote
that song. I thought, like well into my teens, that
that was their song. But we would get together a
couple of times a week and we would play music together,
and in retrospect, I think it was a super super
important series of lessons. Some of it was, of course,
about how to learn to play an instrument on your own,
(10:23):
some of it was about how to play and interact
with other people. But it was also just for me,
in retrospect, a really powerful model for the importance of
sharing joy with your family. Yeah, like just pure joy
with no other agenda other than let's learn something together
and let's enjoy the sound of our singing together in
(10:45):
harmony and playing a song. And so that really really
really stuck with me.
Speaker 5 (10:51):
And just a caveat too, when my sister ran away
at that moment when Dad said that, I thought that
they try and I never want to see I never
want to be the cause of seeing those faces that
were so concerned and so distraught, and so I became
what my mother when I grew up once said to me, because, yeah,
(11:14):
when you were a boy, you were a goodie two shoes,
and I was because I never wanted to disappoint them,
and because of that, they trusted me. I never had
a curfew, oh wow. Never I could get home whatever
time I wanted. The only thing I needed to do
was tell them I'm home. They're they're in bed already, yeah,
And they left the door open the crack. So as
(11:36):
I walk by their bedroom and then I go upstairs
to my room, I walk by, you know, I go Dad,
and he'd go, yeah, bright, sleepy, sleepy, and I go,
I'm home, okay, thank you. And that's all I had
to do. But then again one night, yeah, eleven thirty,
I'm home and walking by their door, I go, dad,
(12:00):
and this is what I hear.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
Yeah, that was lovely for anyone listening, by the.
Speaker 5 (12:07):
Way, and I'm I'm home dad, great, good you, And
I oh, I know what was going on. This was
when I was older, in the teen years.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
Great.
Speaker 5 (12:22):
See.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Here's the thing, though, you You've just helped me make
my point, which is that it's easy for us to
idolize our parents as parents, these people who just took
care of us without judgment in the in the in
the most ideal senses. But but it's also I think
you can make a pretty good argument that it's important
for you and me, and and and for all of us,
(12:44):
in our efforts to be good humans, to sort of
at a certain point start to realize and accept that
as good as our parents were and maybe still are
in my case, they were also just human beings trying
to make their way through the world.
Speaker 7 (12:58):
Right.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
They were still living their lives. Yeah, they're still wrestling
in the covers or whatever they grew I grew up
with them growing up. Right, So were there times when you,
as an adult, as you got older, where you suddenly
started to feel a little more clarity about your folks
as people, kind of a different kind of respect for
for what they had gone through, or or when they
(13:19):
felt maybe more humanized in a way.
Speaker 5 (13:21):
One of my favorite times, like you in the in
the family room, is they became my best friends, better
friends than you, better friends than Dan. I mean my
best best friends. And I didn't know a lot of
kids that could say that. No, But one of my
favorite times and is we would always play poker, sitting
around the table playing a poker Dealer's choice. And every holiday,
(13:44):
every family get together was just four or five of us,
whoever was together, and they would I They'd have a
cocktail or something, and I'd start asking them questions and
once they're loose, they would they would inform me. So
I didn't even know that's why that happened. Oh, when
you were dropping us off at Grandma's house every Saturday night,
(14:05):
you were Yeah, we were going to a hotel.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
That makes all the sense in the world to me,
now right, that's and so they were open about that,
sharing that kind of stuff.
Speaker 5 (14:15):
Now you being a parent though, I mean, do you
think that your your kids are the youngest Cosmo is Yeah,
he's twenty twenty. And have they reached that point yet
where they see you as not just a parent, But.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
I hope you to be. I hope so, because I've
been pretty open with them about Like my mother, for example,
an incredible woman, one of the most creative talented people
I've ever known, a brilliant writer, taught me how to
read when I was a kid. Just a very powerful
creative influence in my life. But also an alcoholic, and
and you know, thankfully she finally got sober after a
(14:51):
pretty long run of some ugliness. But then she went.
She didn't just get sober, She went back to school,
she got double master's degree, she became a Presbyterian minister.
She wound up helping thousands of people literally. And I've
always been very open with my kids about that, in
order to not only humanize a grandparent, but just humanize
myself hopefully in that process. But I'm probably not the
(15:13):
best person to speak about this. I don't know whether
they see me as a human being or not.
Speaker 5 (15:17):
What you should do sometime is maybe invite one of
your kids in I know where this is going. You
really should invite one of your kids. Oh, you know,
I love them all equally, but I guess my favorite
is because he's also a DJ in a radio station
in college, and I've seen some of his stuff. It
(15:37):
is brilliantly funny and wonderful. Cosmo. I'd love to Why
didn't you bring Cosmo? Cosmo?
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Maybe I did?
Speaker 5 (15:45):
Really Yeah, Well, we have a guest coming up, but
can we talk to him really quick?
Speaker 2 (15:49):
Can we squeeze him in? Let's do come here?
Speaker 5 (15:52):
Cosmos a gentleman Cosmo callaway.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
Look at that. Hey, guys, how's it going? Hello, Hansome?
Speaker 5 (15:57):
Is everybody in your family gorgeous model, old type, Look
at them.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
It has nothing to do with my genetics.
Speaker 5 (16:03):
This is his daughter, this is this is Clem.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
Yeah yeah, Crockets over there right behind you, the movie stars,
all of us. Cosmo's home for the summer. And uh,
and I dragged you along. Sorry you did. No, I'm
happy to be here.
Speaker 5 (16:15):
Hi guys, Hi, guys, welcome to the show. All right, Uh,
I can assume just be seeing you two together.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
I'm starting to sweat. I go ahead.
Speaker 5 (16:26):
I did have well, okay, since you said that, I
did have a question.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
It might be a little too Yeah, don't ask it,
all right, Brian asked, Okay, when you started masturbating? Oh
my god, No, okay, when.
Speaker 5 (16:43):
What technique did you do?
Speaker 2 (16:44):
That's too open?
Speaker 5 (16:45):
To hide it from them, because as kids, we all
think like, oh, I can't I'm too embarrassed. I don't
want them to know. And I came up with a.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Trick me personally, you're really not gonna let go of this.
We can always cut it out.
Speaker 6 (16:56):
Uh.
Speaker 5 (16:57):
We came up with this. I came up with this.
I thought he invented it. Apparently other kids had done
the same thing, but I called it the inverted sock method. Okay,
and I'm not gonna go any further than as don't.
But my question actually, Cosmo, when did you know that
they were more than just parents? Because I see you
two together and you guys are really truly friends. About
(17:21):
how old were you and how did it happen?
Speaker 6 (17:22):
Oh?
Speaker 5 (17:23):
God?
Speaker 8 (17:23):
Well, first off, I can't let this get to his head.
So this is just this is close your ears and
you slip me the twenty after. But no, I think
it started to happen when I started to have conversations
with my friends about what they wanted to do differently
as parents.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
I'll tell you what I.
Speaker 5 (17:41):
Mean by this.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
I think people are at least.
Speaker 8 (17:46):
My friends were all too ready to be like, oh,
I know exactly how I want to raise my kids differently. Yeah,
you know, like my parents were too helicoptery or too disconnected.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
Or whatever it is.
Speaker 8 (17:56):
Yeah, but for me it was the exact. My fear
was that, oh my god, I'm never going to be
able to recreate how this guy has done it for
my own kids.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
And I think it was.
Speaker 8 (18:10):
At that moment that I was like, oh, that probably
means I like him.
Speaker 5 (18:14):
Nice. Nice? See man, how do you feel that's sweet?
Speaker 2 (18:21):
I love you? Yeah. Look, I don't know where we
go from there other than to say it's time to
introduce our actual next guest. Can we do that?
Speaker 5 (18:31):
Yeah, I'll tell you. I think I hooked the last
one when you hooked this one. This is amazing, people.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
I'm gonna Our next guest is someone who you already
know and love from all kinds of roles. She's played
on the stage, the small the big screen, but she
has also had this unique and powerful journey not only
with her own parents, but as a parent herself. So
(18:56):
stick around and we're going to meet her right after
I give my son fifty dollars for saying such nice
things about me.
Speaker 5 (19:05):
And also once he does that, Cosmo, could you just
get out of the shot because I feel very uncomfortable
sitting next to someone so gorgeous. Great, I don't feel
bad when I'm sitting next to him and know, yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:19):
That's that's easy. Stick around. We'll be right back.
Speaker 4 (19:32):
Of a bigger kill, the bigger kill, bigger.
Speaker 6 (19:40):
We will take you.
Speaker 5 (19:41):
Suck and we're back.
Speaker 2 (19:43):
We are, Oh Trey, Yes, I would like very much
to introduce the one and only Amy Brenneman. Talk about humanizing.
She is completely and totally slumming it to join us today.
We are absolutely not worthy. Amy Brenneman, my Friends, is
(20:04):
a Harvard educated writer, director, producer, podcaster, teacher, and Emmy
Golden Globe, Sad People's Choice, TV Guide, Peabody Award nominated
actress with an astounding array of credits. We're talking about.
Speaker 5 (20:23):
Judging Amy Boom, Casper, Boom, Heat, Boom.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
It's gonna be a lot of booms. NYPD, Blue Fraser, Fear, Goliath,
Private Practice, Daylight, The Leftovers, The Jane Austen Book Club,
Tell Me Your Secrets. She's currently starring in one of
my favorite shows of all time with Jeff Bridges and
John Lethgow in The Old Man on Hulu. Amy Brenneman,
I am asking you this first because I know you
(20:52):
happen to have a degree in comparative religion, So I
need to ask you, why in God's name are you
talking to us? It makes no sense, but we're delighted
to have you here. Thank you for coming.
Speaker 6 (21:06):
Oh my goodness, I'm so happy to be here your family.
That's why we show up.
Speaker 2 (21:11):
And it's it's appropriate because we are we're talking about
parents today.
Speaker 5 (21:15):
Yeah. Before we get into that, though, I think we
should say that you and your wife Nancy have been
friends with Amy and her lovely husband Brad, who is
a very dear friend of ours as well.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
We love us some, Brad Silverling. Yeah. But yeah, Amy,
we're here with you today and we're talking about parents
and parenting and and I wonder what you would be
willing to share with us about your own parents.
Speaker 6 (21:42):
Sure. My parents were extraor no people. They both passed away. Now.
I helped them both transition, which was really an incredible honor.
My parents met at Harvard Law School. My mom was
in the first class of women there, and she went
there to find a husband, which she did so she.
(22:04):
I love the fun fact she was in the first
class of women. But they actually were the first married
couple ever at Harvard Law School, which is an even
better fact.
Speaker 5 (22:13):
Wow.
Speaker 6 (22:14):
They were madly in love and were till till for
sixty five years. My parents, So it's interesting. It's kind
of I was listening to you, Brian, it's sort of
the opposite where they didn't get married so late. I
think my mom was twenty five, my dad was twenty two.
But they went to finish law school and my dad
had to go in the army, and da da da,
(22:35):
and then and then they had a hard time getting pregnant.
So they desperately wanted kids, so that we always felt
and they were actually just about to I think there's
some crazy story they put in some papers to adopt
or like it's not going to happen, and then the
day they got there, we found you a kid. My
mother was pregnant, and so so we as I have
(22:56):
two older brothers, and we were very much wanted. You know,
it was not taken for granted that they be parents.
And I'm I got the pole position as the baby girl.
So I can honestly say from from the get that
we were desired wanted. They bait. Both came from pretty
shitty backgrounds, so they definitely were like, we gotta figure it,
(23:18):
not only do it differently, we have to figure out
like how do you do holidays? And I mean they
just were and so they really these traditions that I
thought were like generations. My brother and I were like, go,
they just made that up. Right, like you're a kid,
Like it's always this is the way we do holidays
in this family that you just.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
Went inging it from the beginning.
Speaker 6 (23:36):
They were winging it. Yeah, they were winging it. And
you know, I would say as individuals two things. I mean,
there's many things to say about them. My father sober
when I was seventeen. He was fifty one. So I
think the greatest gift was to watch somebody wake up
and become more and more and more present and have
(23:58):
a spiritual practice and have community engagement. I am also
a twelve stepper. It just became part of what you
do is look after your emotional and mental health sure
and bring that to your community. I mean, he just
did it. He went to three meetings a week till
the day week he died.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
You know, So I'm sorry. Your father was an attorney, right, right.
Speaker 6 (24:18):
So my parents was an attorney. My mother was a judge.
Speaker 2 (24:21):
Right. So you didn't you didn't get away with anything
growing up? Probably we did not.
Speaker 6 (24:25):
Get away with anything. Yeah, But although it's interesting, it's interesting, Brian.
My brother Matthew now is also an attorney. He was
he was a pretty rowdy kid and sold marijuana and
did this and that. In high school, I was I
was like you, but I wouldn't say, I wouldn't report,
like I didn't want to cause them problems in such
(24:47):
a positive way. I think it was just like, oh,
these poor schmocks, like I don't want it. So it
took me a while to be rebellious, to be a
full human. I just had to. I was just in
this good girl straight jacket a little bit.
Speaker 5 (24:57):
Were they were they strict? Were they strict parents like
that one way.
Speaker 6 (25:01):
Or the No, No, it was it was very similar
to what you're describing, because my you know, I had
an older sibling who had pushed the boundaries a little bit.
They weren't super strict. I mean they were trying to
kind of hang in. No, and I didn't have a curfew.
Same deal because they weren't strict. I just we were
just so fucking codependent together. O. I'm sorry, that's yeah,
But I mean I was. I didn't want to cause
(25:23):
them problems, but not in it, but in a way
that it didn't allow me to actually rebel and individuate
and do the things you have to do, and which
I did a little bit later.
Speaker 5 (25:32):
How did they feel about you getting into acting. Was
that something that they was completely supportive at first.
Speaker 6 (25:39):
Or well it was I broke it to them slowly,
and it broke it to myself very slowly. I mean,
I grew up in central Connecticut. I didn't know anybody
in the business. I did, However, I started doing plays
when I was eleven and was always happiest when I was.
What I love is collective art making. That's just I
love it. I love it, I love it on it.
(26:01):
So I was in place. I think if I was
just talking about this to a friend the other day,
if I it's seventeen, if I said I'm not going
to college, I'm going to New York, they would not have,
you know. But I went to college. I got a degree.
At college, we made dear friends that are still made
dear friends. We formed a theater company that we were
(26:21):
on the road for about six years, and we worked with,
you know, essentially marginalized communities creating theater projects. So and
I did do a lot of teaching. So it was
like I was kind of acting, but I was kind
of a social worker. So it's really when I was
like twenty seven or twenty eight, I was like, I'm
getting a headshot. I'm getting an agent, okay, But at
that point I was I mean, seems young now, but
(26:42):
I was old enough where I wasn't a flake, you know.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
But like you said, you slowly let them into it,
and you slowly let yourself into that.
Speaker 7 (26:50):
I didn't.
Speaker 6 (26:50):
I mean, I still I have a very hand to
I mean treinos. It's like, in a second, I could
like drop out and just run a theater program for
twelve years. You know, I don't know what I think
about Hollywood except when it's fun and I've been able
to make a living, which is amazing.
Speaker 5 (27:06):
We'll sprinkle some of this in because all the projects
that Tery mentioned in your intro. But The Old Man
is something very very special, and you are amazing in it.
I can't imagine anybody else playing that role. But the
first episode I saw with that what was it twelve
(27:27):
minute fight and just kept going and going and going
and going. Were you a fan of his? And and
also I wanted to ask, did you immediately read the
script and go I've got to be part of the
show or or how did that happen?
Speaker 6 (27:45):
I was always a fan of Chef Bridges, Yeah, and
always always always in left gout but Jeff Bridges, I mean,
there are many, many movies that have tattooed in my psyche,
you know, so it's like, oh, my god, he's just
one of the greats.
Speaker 5 (27:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (27:58):
No, when I honestly, when I read the script, I
was like, oh, it's another boy thing. And I'm used
to kind of being at the center of my own
story now sure on stage and off stage. So it
took me a little bit of convincing m.
Speaker 5 (28:11):
And how do they convince you?
Speaker 6 (28:13):
Well, because John, the creators are so smart, and it's like, oh,
you're using the meta. Oh we're talking metal. I mean
quite literally. What I said is this reminds me of
a movie Heat that I did twenty five thirty years ago,
where I'm like on the outside like, oh, you're a
bad guy and oh but I love you anyway. And
I was like, I cannot do that to my psyche
or to feminism. I just can't, you know. Yeah, but
(28:35):
they said, oh no, no, no, no, we talk about
this as they literally call Zoe. My character Edie evolved,
So what if it's Edie but it's twenty five years later.
So instead of like you're a bad guy, I love you,
it's like you're a bad guy. Get out of my house,
like literally, get out of my house.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
Yeah. I've been there, done that.
Speaker 5 (28:52):
Yeah yeah, yeah, it's like.
Speaker 6 (28:53):
We're die and I am quite literally dialoguing with my
younger self and with culture from twenty five years ago.
And it's a pretty active dialogue. And then obviously anytime
I get to look into Jeff Bridges' eyes and to
feel beloved by Jeff Bridges is like really one of
the high ways.
Speaker 2 (29:10):
Yeah no, this is like me looking you in the eyes.
Speaker 5 (29:13):
It is. It's a high point for you, isn't it. Well?
Speaker 2 (29:16):
Okay, so, but it's interesting that you bring up being
at the center of your own story because I know
that a big part of your story, an enormous part
of your story off camera and off stage, is your
role of being a parent. Right, So you know, inasmuch
as you were influenced by your own parents, and then
also recognizing at a certain point that they were winging it
(29:37):
as you look back on it, you had to wing
it yourself like the rest of us, as parents do.
She's got two kids who aren't such kids anymore, brilliant,
wonderful son who's killing it in college, and also her
oldest daughter, Charlotte, who has taken you, I know, on
an extraordinary journey as a parent, and I wonder if
(29:58):
you can talk to us a little bit more about
that journey.
Speaker 6 (30:02):
Yeah, I mean first, first, I will say, and you know,
so Trey's middle son is born four days after Charlotte,
but because they already, they already had Clementine, so they
kind of knew. I mean, I cannot even tell you
how much I leaned on you and Nansen. Still, I
(30:23):
felt really clueless, and you.
Speaker 2 (30:25):
Were equally clueless.
Speaker 6 (30:27):
The least judgmental, the most available, you know, funny, I mean,
you know how I feel.
Speaker 5 (30:34):
I mean, pretty good parents to base some of your
parenting new parenting knowledge on. I mean they did, They've
done such and I'm not just saying this. They've done
an amazing job with these three, oh.
Speaker 6 (30:45):
Yeah, oh yeah. And also the complexities, you know, and
it may be different when you're a younger parent, as
you were talking about your folks. But I was a
working mom in a job that was taking eighteen hours
a day, and I never thought judging would be a
hit and I kind of hope that it wouldn't, just
because it's really tiring to start our long drama. But
(31:06):
I was thirty four and it was a hit, and
I just remember looking to Brad. I was like, oh shit.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
And emotional too. We should say like we should remind
people because I was a huge fan of that show.
But it was based on your mom and her experiences.
So when we talk about parenting and influences like.
Speaker 6 (31:21):
Right and very and I always I mean quite honestly,
so just a small anecdote, and I want to talk
more about my kids. But when I was pregnant the
second season of Judging Amy, I gave birth basically right
around that hiatus, and then I came back when she
was four months old and I was nursing and because
(31:43):
I was so stressed out, the milk dried up and
the abyss and the that, and it was I did
not want to be on a TV show. I just
wanted to be with my baby, of course. And every
day I would come home from work and I'd say
to Brad, what would happen if I blew out of
this show? And you know, he was always like, listen
to your mental health is the number one thing. You know,
you'd probably not be able to work for a while.
(32:04):
Lyness or that But then even at that time, and
I do want to say this as an artist and
as a woman who has an identity apart from being
a mother, I realized that my creative, the playful, the
person that comes up with the new ideas, My little
(32:25):
inner creative is about five years old. And I realized
with Charlotte, I was in fact having my second child,
the first one being myself. And if I just ditched
my show, that's when parenting goes sour. I mean I
had an alcoholic you know father. I mean, things can
go really wrong if we abandon ourselves entirely. That's true
(32:46):
to try to be a good parent. Now was the
balance in my life was completely whacked, and it was like,
this is not ideal, but I got I had that
wisdom of like, hold up, this is my first child.
Was judging amy basically, you know it came from my
whole psyche.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
Yeah yeah, yeah, so yeah.
Speaker 6 (33:03):
It was a crazy time. And then Charlotte, my daughter,
well from the day she was born, she had this
very rare she said, a very rare endocrine disorder, which
was like kind of like that's weird but treatable. Thank
god we have the same endocrinologist and but the but
then when she was like two, it's like she's she's
(33:24):
not walking, or she was walking, but she's not talking,
she's not doing she's delayed, she's developmentally delayed. So that
really start us on this journey of special ed and
finding the right schools and finding the right this and that,
which was an incredible down the rabbit hole of an
alice in wonderland that I did not know existed. I
(33:45):
didn't And that's when my parents, my mother in particular,
had such a long journey with Charlotte because in my family,
it wasn't about being beautiful or athletic prowless. You know,
families have different ways of gauging them. In my family,
it was really intellectual prowess. And here I got this
(34:05):
kiddo with an intellectual disability rights.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
That's tough.
Speaker 6 (34:09):
So like the agony of that for years and kind
of siding with my daughter, but sometimes siding with my
mom and she didn't even It just was such a
journey for all of us.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
It's a lot to navigate.
Speaker 6 (34:21):
Yeah, we're going to completely and also, you know what,
so Charlotte, basically the end of that story is she
has a very very very rare chromosomal abnormality, which fourteen
hundred people in the world a couple of years ago.
I'm sure there's more now, very rare, so in the world.
Speaker 5 (34:41):
Fourteen I'm sorry, fourteen in the world.
Speaker 6 (34:43):
Yeah, yeah, I mean there's gonna be a lot more,
to be honest, because folks that maybe were she's never
been in the autism club because just her disability is different.
But you know, it's all it's all because of the
genome project, right, It's just a blood draw. So there's
gonna be lots of folks that go like, oh, my gosh,
I finally have a name for this thing. But if
you go if it's called Phale McDermot syndrome, and if
(35:04):
you go on the little website, Charlotte's like a superstar.
Like it's like, oh many Fale McDermott, folks like don't
have any language, never toilet, never this that. So then
it became like, oh, as my brother put it, he's like, oh,
she's been running a marathon with one leg and we
don't know because neurobiology is so hidden, right, she has
what you call an invisible disability. So then I began
(35:26):
to parent her so much better. I stopped comparing her
to the wrong people. And so I think that's the
other thing when we talk about parenting. I parent my
children very differently. They need different things from me. So
I also think that's part of it. Sometimes people can
have a big jolly you know. I grew up with
(35:47):
like really big Catholic families because Central CONNECTICU had lots
of you know, seven kids, eight kids. Some you know,
good things about it challenging, But I think the idea
it's like, you know, I parent all my kids the same.
It's like that's not good because everybody's different.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
That's right. I mean, it is something that you don't
again when we talk about winging it, like you experienced
this in just within your own siblings and seeing the
way here's the sister who runs away, here's the way
my dad handles me and my brother, like you recognize
pretty early on. I think if you're you know, trying
to do the best job you can as a parent,
you start to recognize that, like, yeah, the same rules
(36:23):
don't necessarily apply to these very different people.
Speaker 5 (36:27):
Does that go for like the way you communicate with them,
as well well as the decisions.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
Und percent I always say, you know, Clementine and Crockett
and Cosmo all come from the same gene pool, but
they are all radically different human beings.
Speaker 5 (36:38):
And that's fun for you, isn't it. I mean, it's
once you get it.
Speaker 2 (36:41):
But it's also as as Amy is speaking to directly
with body or Charlotte, like these are two different people
and they don't. You can't. It's not one rule applies
to all you. You kind of have to figure that out
and negotiate that situation. So so once you finally were
able to understand what Charlotte was up against, like you say,
(37:02):
your brother running the one legged marathon, like, then you
were able to sort of, you think, more effectively parent
her and maybe, oh.
Speaker 6 (37:09):
Yeah, I mean then you know, I was talking to
somebody about this the other day, like, I'm just so
much happier getting older. I'm happier when my kids are
getting older. And it wasn't like and I loved when
they were babies, but I never am nostalgic for that
time because in my experience, in my family's experience, it
was there was so many unknowns, And honestly, when you
have a loved one with a disability or a kid
(37:29):
a disability, it's like how does this look like in adulthood?
You know, patriarchal capitalism is not built for people that
aren't going to make a living wage. What does it
look like? And you know, once we got the diagnosis
and we found our way to this extraordinary I mean,
first of all, I'm an art making activist, That's who
I am. So we're finding our way. She had a
(37:49):
wonderful boarding school that she went to, and then I
with some other people bought a small apartment building and
we created this support. It's what I'm built for. Quite literally,
parenting her is what I'm built or but I didn't
know it and it took me a while to realize.
Like and then also the it's funny. I just saw
a rough cut of a documentary a friend made about
the galladat university and deaf community. There's within disability. But
(38:15):
I also think this is a parenting thing at large.
It certainly is a twelve step thing at large. The
initial thing is how can I fix it and then
go back to normal? Right? And you don't go back
to what is normal again, it's usually capitalistic picture. So
then you go, oh, what is this world that we're
creating together? And usually our kids turn us onto something
(38:38):
we didn't know, or you know, it's I had an
awesome moment. Actually, I think body would be comfortable with
me sharing this. So my son finished his freshman year
of college, and you know, he was a very good student,
serious student in high school. Also COVID not a lot
of fun, right, so he kept going like member to
(38:58):
have fun. And also because in a very stem oriented,
data oriented moment in our educational history, you know, we're like,
remember art making and remember filmmaking and just self expression.
Just remember that too, you know. So so he goes
to college, not sure if he's going, but he's kind
of keeps gravitating towards like business stuff. And I'm like, okay,
(39:20):
well and then I'm like, remember getting So he got
into this wonderful filmmaking club and he did make a
couple of movies. So anyway, cut to May, we're about
to go into a movie and he said, we were
talking about his cousin. Actually he was in law school,
and they said, oh, what do people do between the
summer's first year, second year law school? We're talking about that,
And then he said something about business school in general.
(39:40):
I must have rolled my eyes because he said to me,
and this was the best. He was like, Mom, I
have to talk to you about something. I've been talking
about it a lot with Kathleen and therapy, which also
blew my mind.
Speaker 5 (39:55):
He's like, oh my.
Speaker 6 (39:55):
God, I've talked about my mother in therapy. I was like,
now I'm the mom.
Speaker 5 (39:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (40:00):
But he said, he said, I feel like you and
dad don't take my interest in business seriously, that you
want me to go into humanities and art making. And
and I was like, dang, you're right, you know. And
we laughed because it was the opposite of most families,
you know. Yeah, And then it was really cool. We
went into the movie. I considered going to a shame
(40:21):
spiral about my terrible parenting, and then I didn't. And
then we got in the car and I said, you know,
I'm not this is not defending myself, but I'm trying
to think about where that came from, you know. And
I said, I think it's because you are so practical,
and maybe it's the moment we're in because everything feels
topsy turvy. Every choice as an undergrad, it's like, I
(40:41):
want this to be practical and applicable to my career.
And I said, you know, honey, we really do believe
in a liberal arts education. What that means to us is,
this is the four years where you get to bump
into a poetry cloud. You don't have to be so
responsible all the time, you know. And also I believe
self expression just like going to the gym, eating healthy,
it's part of being a human being. So I just
(41:02):
whether it's a guitar lesson or water color, I do
want to say that as your mama, that's part of
being well balanced. But I did say I stand corrected
nice and I said, here's the difference between me and
my mom. I nailed my moms on some stuff and
she could hear it. Sometimes she could not make She
just didn't have self awareness. She could not actually make
(41:24):
the change so that the comments would still come. And
I said, I heard you, and I will make that change.
And I did.
Speaker 5 (41:30):
What's great about this, and for a lot of us,
is you know your parents are doing what they're doing,
even though it's maybe not what you want or you
want so many different they're doing it. If you have
the wherewithal to understand this, they're doing it because they
think they want what's right for you, obviously, and they
love you, and they want to send you in the
right direction, do the best job they can, and you
(41:52):
confronting them, you know, kind of that's a lot of
people should should do that.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
Well, yeah, I was just going to say the high point.
My takeaway from that is parent to parent, like you
clearly fostered an environment where your kid feels comfortable communicating
with you about his feelings, and that's that's key. But
I also think it's part and parcel of being such
an effective communicator as you are being an artist. And
this is what I want to talk about next, because
(42:20):
you know, in addition to all of Amy's accolades on
TV and in the movies, she's also been quite accomplished
on the stage, right Yeah, in Pulitzer Prize nominated plays
like Rapture, Blister Burne or Power Power of Sale with
Brian Cranston, which is written by my friend Paul gretlong
amazing show. She also recently completely blew my mind in
the Sound Inside at Pacady A Playhouse.
Speaker 5 (42:43):
But she's got a project or had a project out.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
That's it probably most relevant to what we're talking about
right now. Amy just recently co wrote and starred in
a powerfully autobiographical play called Overcome that just had a
sold out run at the at the Kotuit Center for
the Arts in Cape cod Amy. Will you tell us
more about because this is sort of the merging of
(43:05):
your roles as parent and artist, tell us more about
what made that show so particularly special for you as
both a parent and a performer.
Speaker 6 (43:15):
Yeah, well, you know, I think that I do use
autobiographical material. I had an illness fifteen years ago. I wrote,
I need to get it up and out, I went,
especially when things are so overwhelming, because I work in
as you do Trey, like script's beginning of middle and end.
I think a big breakthrough was my collaborator Sabrina. I
(43:36):
kept saying, like, just write bits and bogs. Think like
a script songwriter or a poet. I think like a poet. Yeah,
and just sort of like, Okay, if it's sticking to me,
it might be an interesting thing. Overcome started out as
something called Threshold in twenty sixteen, which was quite literally
about me being between my mother and my daughter, and
then in twenty nineteen it's still called Threshold, I think,
(43:59):
but I sort of took my mom out because I
was feeling sort of guilty that I was trashing here
I produced here on Martha's Vineyard three thousand miles away,
and I was like, I feel bad about that. But
also I put what her she was saying into a
character I literally call dominant culture, and I don't I
talked to dominant culture. I'm like, hey, why do you know?
Because there are these it's the air that we breathe,
this ableism situation, you know, just like racism and patriarchy.
(44:23):
We got to keep going, like why do I think
this way?
Speaker 2 (44:26):
Right? Right?
Speaker 6 (44:27):
So overcome? So we did it here on Martha's Vineyard
in twenty nineteen. Charlotte appears with me at the very
very end in a very organic happened very organically. My
collaborator Serena kept saying, like we should put more Charlotte
story in it. I was like, she gets to write
her own story. This is the story of the Ally
(44:47):
than the Bad Alley, because I do not want to
get into telling stories about closely disabilities. I will be lurried.
And she gets to write her own story, you know.
So when so she comes out with me at the end,
and then right after twenty nineteen, I really wanted a
full production, which I got at South Coast rep in California.
I was scheduled anyway than COVID. You know, off we go.
(45:10):
So I just did it because Charlotte's wonderful school, the
Riverview School, which is on the Cave, does something called
Transition Weekend in the spring of every year and it's
really for parents and families and what does adulthood look like?
You know, if you're lucky enough to find a good school,
it's like, oh, thank god, we're here, but like, what
does it look like? And it's you know, so I
thought like I would like to do this play because
(45:34):
ultimately what happens is, you know, you think you're psychological.
It's like, oh, here's my family situation. It's a much
bigger story, of course. And honestly, what I think back
now and again, I try not to go into the
shame spy world. But it's as if I had a
kid that was gay and I didn't know it and
I was trying to jam her into the straight world.
(45:55):
It's as fundamental as that I did not know about
neurodiversity and about what I the assumptions that I was
making of, like I just want you to fit into
the world as it is. Well, guess what the world is.
It is isn't so good, and so we need to
break open this whole thing. So it became a I
mean not only parenting and art making, but the activism peace.
(46:19):
It's like, holy to Moly, this is what I've been
thinking about all my life. Right, So it was kind
of an amazing experience. And and and I forgot Actually
we did a dress rehearsal. People come up to me,
but they really come up to Charlotte with tears in
their eyes. They need to hugger they, you know, so
I said you after that treshearsal, I was like, honey,
I kind of forgot how emotional people are after this.
(46:42):
And if it gets too much, if you don't want
to be in the lobby, you know, there's other private
places at the theater you can hang out. I mean, Trey,
you would not like Charlotte because Arlotte can get sensory
stuff overwhelmed. She literally is. She knows. It's like a politician.
People thank you for coming. I'm so like it. There's
like she knew. She intuited that her presence was an
(47:04):
important part of this experience.
Speaker 5 (47:08):
Did she enjoyed the being on stage part?
Speaker 6 (47:10):
She comes on stage at the very end and literally,
and it's a little the reason it's so powerful, And again,
it was very organic when it happened. But you know,
when you watch it and this happens all the time,
You're watching somebody do a stand up routine and they're
like trashing on their wife or something, and you're kind
of like, this is funny, But is she cool with it?
You know, by Charlotte, because I've basically been talking about Charlotte,
(47:32):
not always in derogatory ways, but sometimes I mean, by
the end of the play, I have a different point
of view on it. But when she comes out, it's
just breath takingly beautiful and it blesses the whole thing.
Like it's sort of this, uh, there's kind of a
bookend to the whole show, and it's a talent show
that I found myself in a couple of years ago,
(47:54):
where people who are actually much more impacted than she was. Right,
but there's moaning and there's like to read, so I'm like,
how did I get here? And so the beginning of it,
it's sort of like it's like a bad, weird dream.
It's like I'm in this room and there's weird stuff happening,
and oh of that. So then you go on this
journey and then I come at the end and I
(48:16):
was like, and now we're back in the basement, and
I see it really differently, and I see the vastness
of human diversity, and I hear the deep need for
human expression. And then I see my daughter and then
she comes out.
Speaker 5 (48:28):
Was this cathartic for sure?
Speaker 6 (48:32):
Yeah? Oh yeah. I mean there's a moment. So I
have people sometimes think it's like, oh, it's a one
woman show. I was like, no, there's two dancers, there's
six actors, we have a drummer. But there are these
two dancers who actually have known Charlotte for a long time,
who sort of embody her energy. I didn't want anybody
(48:55):
playing Charlotte. I didn't want her. I didn't want to
play Charlotte. But it's sort of this abstract but very
visceral experience of what it was like, you know, and
Trey was around, like when it would just go haywire.
So there's a terrible moment that's sort of a rock
bottom moment where it's like Thanksgiving dinner and my mom
saying what's wrong with her? And she can't sit and
(49:17):
she's tantruming and then I and then I scream, and
I and I you know, I mean, I say like
why because we didn't have a diagnosis, So it's like,
why can't you sit at the table? Why can't you
do what other people are doing? What the fuck is
wrong with you? And right before we were rehearsing that
back in twenty nineteen, and Charlotte was just poking around.
She hadn't gone to campiyat. She loves a rehearsal room.
(49:38):
And Sabria said, you talk to Charlotte about the scene
that's coming up. And I was like, and I turned
to my beautiful eighteen year old I was like, this
is yeah, this is a scene about when you didn't
have a lot of words and I didn't really know
how to help you, and we were both really frustrated.
Speaker 2 (49:55):
And she was like, yeah, this is a hallmark of
good parenting. Is this kind of communication, regardless of how
your kids communicate, well.
Speaker 6 (50:03):
Not to shy away from it, you know, it's like,
y'all live through that, and we are not there now,
you know. And so I think the Catharsis is like,
you know, there's a thing that we were non non
neurodiverse kids use it too. It's a great parent here's
a great parenting tool. I will say to your audience.
(50:24):
It's called social stories. Right, so let's say you have
like a really shitty day or you know, more specifically,
like you know, somebody has a meltdown at six Flags
right when you go home and with terrible Trey could
do this better because he's a better artist than I.
But what stick figures. I would say, like, here's Charlotte.
You know, she got hot, you know, mom said it
(50:45):
was time to go. She fell apart. It's like and
then it's the most magical thing. It's the power of
storytelling because then it's not me. Also, she's really good
at eye contact. But it's a very confrontational thing, like
let's talk about it, right, But if you're looking at this,
oh that was a really intense day, look at this story.
But I feel like my original work is social stories
(51:06):
for myself. It's like this happened, and if it stays
in my body, I don't understand it. I can't work
with it. And then the icing on the cake is
if it's helpful to others or if it, you know,
creates some interesting piece of art.
Speaker 5 (51:19):
Do you plan to do another staging of this play
because you mentioned that briefly, the other cast members, that
the dancers, that the characters, and it just seems I've
got to see this, and I'm I'm not just trying
to hook it for you, but I mean, I really
would love to see this. It was enthralling when I
(51:39):
read about it in the and the reviews and your
description of it.
Speaker 6 (51:44):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, we do need to figure out
how to slim it down. Oh but yes we what
what it? What? It? What?
Speaker 2 (51:52):
It made me?
Speaker 6 (51:53):
I mean, not to shoot our own horns, but like
when we did it in March, I was like, oh,
this works, It's sturdy. We keep returning to it. It worked,
you know what I mean. It's like a song. It's like,
oh that works again, you know. Yeah, And something about
the abstraction. You know, I'm such a language based creator,
but really, Sabrina. I've known Sabrina since I was eighteen,
and she's a choreographer, and there's something about things going abstract,
(52:16):
which is also something you can do a little bit
more seamlessly on stage. You can do it on film
and television, but it tends to be a little bit
more literal. But like that thing when the feeling gets
too big and it needs to go abstract or you
go off language, that's a moment that's really interesting to me.
Speaker 2 (52:32):
Well, listen of You know this, but I'm going to
say it anyway because it bears repeating. You're an extraordinary woman, Amy.
I am proud to call you a friend, but I'm
also proud as a parent to have been at least
a part of your journey, but to hear you speak
(52:53):
about it in such open and giving terms, to recognize
the the effort that you have put into communicating with
your kids in very different ways, taking the lessons you
learn from your parents and applying them to your own
efforts of winging it as a parent, as we all do.
(53:14):
All of these things are for us, I know, clear
examples of what make you such a good human, and
we are deeply appreciative that you have taken the time
to share any or all of these things with us.
I also know that you're a passionate supporter of many causes,
but specifically as the parent of a newer, divergent daughter,
(53:38):
I know that there's especially on the heels of overcome
that this Cotuit Center for the Arts is something that
is near and dear to your heart and it is
truly an amazing nonprofit. It runs an incredible and also
fully inclusive art making group, which I know is your jam. Amy.
(54:00):
So if you're listening to us or you're watching us
and you would like to know how you could be
supportive of the Kotuit Center for the Arts, go to
Artsothecape dot org, which is a great way to support
their work. We're also going to post the link on
our website be Good Humans podcast dot com. Help them
out if you can, but also please join us in
(54:22):
thanking the amazing Amy Brenneman for taking the time to
be with us today. We love you.
Speaker 5 (54:28):
We love you too.
Speaker 6 (54:29):
I love you. Thank you for doing this and for
like skeewing to a positive route to a moment where
people are more interested in Nativity.
Speaker 5 (54:38):
And thank you. But also I want to tell everyone
go make sure today go today. Quit don't quit, but
just take the day off if you're at work listening
and go home and watch the old man you are.
It's different, it's a step above. It's great, and again
Amy is is wonderful in it.
Speaker 2 (54:58):
Yeah, thank you for being such a Good Mom Season
two on September twelfth.
Speaker 6 (55:02):
We just got the twelve season two.
Speaker 5 (55:05):
Am I in it or no?
Speaker 6 (55:07):
No?
Speaker 2 (55:09):
There's always hope for season three.
Speaker 7 (55:10):
Man, Thank you very much, Amy, thank you.
Speaker 4 (55:25):
We will take you suck.
Speaker 5 (55:27):
Hey, everybody, if you haven't already, go to Be Good
Humans podcast dot com. There's going to be a little
place there for you to make your suggestions. If you
have good humans in your life, people you think we
might want to talk to you on the show.
Speaker 2 (55:39):
If you are watching us on YouTube, do us a
big favor please click like and subscribe. That would be
very helpful to us. Also follow us on the socials
if you don't already at Facebook and Instagram and threads
and TikTok and x and all that stuff. And then
if you feel like being an a specially good human,
join us on Patreon. You're going to get all kinds
of fun extra stuff, bonus material didn't make it into
the show, some exclusive video and posts, super cool, exclusive
(56:02):
access to special stuff that you cannot get for free
on the podcast or through our social media accounts.
Speaker 5 (56:06):
Thank you for joining us, and to you all, be
good humans.
Speaker 3 (56:12):
Be good humans, Be good humans, Be good humans, or
we will Thank You.
Speaker 8 (56:21):
Suck to Be Good Humans is executive produced by Brian Phelps,
Trey Callaway, and Grant Anderson, with the associate producers Sean Fitzgerald
and Clementine Callaway and partnership with straw Hut Media. Please like, follow,
and subscribe, and remember be Good Humans.
I love singing about the moon and you and Springer.
I love singing about Scott so Blue and anything with
the swing, and I love you, I love wow. I
really thought you'd be uh insulting me no, and instead
of joining in, no.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
I was going with that. I've never heard of it.
I don't know what you were singing, but I liked it.
Speaker 3 (00:20):
Good humans, be good humans, Be good humans.
Speaker 4 (00:28):
Or we will think you sucked humans, or we will
thank you suck.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
I've never heard of it. I don't know what you
were singing, but I liked it.
Speaker 5 (00:43):
Oh, it's a song from my favorite cartoon of all time.
What cartoon it was, I think the thirties it was.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Didn't realize you went back then.
Speaker 5 (00:51):
It was it was called Owl Jolson.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Oh, Owl Jolson, Yes.
Speaker 5 (00:55):
Owl Jolson. There was about this little owl who was
forced to sing boring songs and his minister and the
church made him sing all these boring songs and when
they weren't looking. I love singing, very swingy, very swingy,
fairy swing. And in fact, al al Joson actually sang
that song in a movie.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Yeah, yeah, Well do you know what's.
Speaker 5 (01:16):
We're not gonna have time for the whole show.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
We're really going. I know can because I was gonna
riff on Brian, how I love you? How I love you?
I do love you, and we love you. It's nice
to be back. Welcome back to be good Humans. Dear friends.
If you're watching us before, I forget, if you're watching
this on YouTube, by the way, do us a favor
click I can subscribe. I know we're all taught as
(01:39):
children not to feed alligators, but we do need to
feed the algorithm. So like and subscribe to sing it
I like while you're at it. Also, by the way,
join us on Patreon. There is a I like the
backing music. There's a link on our website, Begod Humans
podcast dot com. Or you can get exclusive access to
(02:01):
all kinds of extra content like maybe him singing this
Adnolgium sing Okay, join us there. By the way, we've
also just dropped a couple of bonus episodes that you
can't see anywhere else, so go do that. But that's
not I don't want to talk about any of this.
I don't even want to talk about al Joelson. Can
we can we talk about parenting?
Speaker 5 (02:22):
You can talk about anything you want to talk about,
but but I just think it'd be a little opsided
since you have three amazing children and I'm not a parent.
Well well let me uh not in this state then,
I know of But yeah, we can we can talk
about parents.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
Can we please? Because I know we've done it a
little bit before. But also, you know, because for a
good reason, our parents were the og good humans in
our lives, and so I know it's clear that we
both loved our parents very much. Sadly, your folks are
no longer with us. I lost my mother a few
years ago. I'm blessed to say I still have my
(03:00):
dad around, but I would love to hear more about
what you love the most about your mom and dad,
about your mom about your dad, but also about them
as a couple.
Speaker 5 (03:11):
I think there's not a most in this what I
love the most. There are just many, many, many most
do tell. First of all, I was kind of lucky
that it was lucky for me because my parents were
very young when they got married, and that means I
kind of got to as I grew up watched them
grow up. Sure, okay, so my dad was seventeen, my
(03:32):
mom was twenty wow when they got married. In fact,
that's their wedding day.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
That's oh, of course it is twenty years old.
Speaker 5 (03:39):
And by the way, that's them in their sixties. Sky
now that I knew.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
But okay, so seven, he's seventeen, she's twenty, she's twenty.
Speaker 5 (03:46):
There is a photo there was actually statewide. This is
it came out of Key One of Illinois, the town
I was born in, basically my whole family, small small town.
But there's a photo that went statewide in all the newspapers.
Photo of my father sitting on the end of the
couch holding his first infant child, my sister, Debbie Nice.
(04:06):
Next to him is his mother, my Grandma Phelps, which
is there's a picture there too. Next to Grandma Phelps
is a picture of her mom, Grandma Miller. Next to
Grandma Miller sits her mother, Grandma Morris. Five generations. That's incredible.
(04:27):
Five generations.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
Wow, yeah, that's I mean, that's like newsworthy stuff to
have that many people together.
Speaker 5 (04:34):
And it was, yeah, it was. They were so proud
that they had made, you know, the paper statewide. But
so Dad had mom and Dad had me when Dad
was twenty two.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
I can't even imagine this.
Speaker 5 (04:44):
They had my younger brother Jeff when he was twenty four.
So three kids before the age of twenty five, Are
you kidding me? No, I can't. I can't conceive of that.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
I think they just made twenty somethings different back then. Yeah,
but that's that's a And then they were together for
many years your folks.
Speaker 5 (05:03):
Until the day. Wow, yeah, it's still They were so
much in love. They were so incredibly in love that
even you know, in their sixties and then pushed in
seventy and eight that if car still had bench seats,
Mom would be sliding over. Okay, they held hands. Dad
called her pretty lady. They were incredibly loved. This quick
(05:27):
story and I just thought of it. It wasn't in my notes.
But she had a sister. My mom had a sister,
my end Arlene, and who had lived out here with
her husband in California. And Dad said, you know, if
you want to fly out to visit your sister, I
can't get away from work, but I'll take care of
the kids and I'll do this. Oh she was so like, oh,
thank you. So she flies out. Two days go by
(05:50):
and they get on the phone just to say Hi,
how's it going, And Dad she could tell by my
dad's voice that he was sad without her, probably sad
by taking care of us two, yeah, but mainly sad
without her, he couldn't exist.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Wow.
Speaker 5 (06:04):
So she got on a plane after just two days
and flew home. Wow, happily because she was so proud,
so proud, not sweet.
Speaker 6 (06:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
How do you describe them as as just as parents
as you? I mean, I obviously you had siblings as well,
but like, what's your experience as the kid, as the kid,
but also as the adult now, like when you look
back on it, what was particularly good about their parenting? Well?
Speaker 5 (06:29):
I could go in this direction and you might have
a story about the same. But I can remember the
exact moment in my life, the exact day, the minute,
what I was looking at in my life that my
parents became not just parents that I love, that loved
me unconditionally, but they became my friends. My friends.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Tell me.
Speaker 5 (06:55):
I consciously thought, oh my god, my friends.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
All right.
Speaker 5 (07:00):
I was like ten and my sister got into a
little trouble, nothing bad, but you know, she just got
a punishable offense. So she was like early teens, maybe
just thirteen, and so they did the parent thing. They said,
we're going to ground you for two weeks. That didn't
go over well. They had an argument about it, and
(07:23):
my sister ran away. Oh wow, yeah, she ran away.
So there we all are sitting in the living room,
no TV, no rating, nothing going on, just dead silence,
and I'm looking at my parents at ten years old,
the worry, the concern, they were destroyed, and they were
just staring and I could actually see the gray hairs
(07:44):
growing out.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
This is a critical moment for you too, because you're
all eyes and these are my heroes.
Speaker 5 (07:51):
So the phone finally rings and it's Debbie and she's
crying and she said, I want to come home. I'm
so sorry, very apologetic, ready to take whatever punishment she's
going to get. They were just thrilled, they were happy
before Dad went to pick her up. Dad sat my
brother and I on the couch and he kneels down,
so now he's eye to eye with us, and he goes,
he said this, I'll never forget these words. He goes,
(08:13):
I want you to know something, your mother, and I
will never judge you for someone else's mistake. And then
he gets a smile on his face and he said,
clean slate, have a great time now. I Luckily I
was just barely old enough to comprehend what an amazing
(08:33):
moment that was that you know, he wasn't going to
be judging us as judgment free. Yeah, and become a
different parent now that they had a child that ran away.
That was a major moment for me, And that was
the day that I realized that they were my friends too.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
That's beautiful, that's beautiful.
Speaker 5 (08:51):
You know, my family made it up. But yeah, you
know it's even pretty.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
No, you know, my family did something that was certainly
important and significant at the time, but in retrospect over
the years has has taken on even greater meeting for me.
But we had a family band. Yeah, there was a
music room in our house. Nothing you know, super big
or special or fancy, because we were strictly middle class,
(09:18):
but like, we had a music room in our house,
and my parents both actively encouraged this participation in a
family band. And it was only for us, Like we
didn't play anywhere or anything. But there was a drum
kit in the corner of the room that was for
me and my sister would play keys on a little
(09:38):
of a little Hammond organ kind of thing, and then
my dad would play electric lead guitar, because you know,
he was always a musician, still is, and my mom
would play bass, big Fender concert jazz bass. These cover
songs are like, by the way, I was convinced that
(10:00):
the Beatles song Love Me Do that my parents wrote
that song. I thought, like well into my teens, that
that was their song. But we would get together a
couple of times a week and we would play music together,
and in retrospect, I think it was a super super
important series of lessons. Some of it was, of course,
about how to learn to play an instrument on your own,
(10:23):
some of it was about how to play and interact
with other people. But it was also just for me,
in retrospect, a really powerful model for the importance of
sharing joy with your family. Yeah, like just pure joy
with no other agenda other than let's learn something together
and let's enjoy the sound of our singing together in
(10:45):
harmony and playing a song. And so that really really
really stuck with me.
Speaker 5 (10:51):
And just a caveat too, when my sister ran away
at that moment when Dad said that, I thought that
they try and I never want to see I never
want to be the cause of seeing those faces that
were so concerned and so distraught, and so I became
what my mother when I grew up once said to me, because, yeah,
(11:14):
when you were a boy, you were a goodie two shoes,
and I was because I never wanted to disappoint them,
and because of that, they trusted me. I never had
a curfew, oh wow. Never I could get home whatever
time I wanted. The only thing I needed to do
was tell them I'm home. They're they're in bed already, yeah,
And they left the door open the crack. So as
(11:36):
I walk by their bedroom and then I go upstairs
to my room, I walk by, you know, I go Dad,
and he'd go, yeah, bright, sleepy, sleepy, and I go,
I'm home, okay, thank you. And that's all I had
to do. But then again one night, yeah, eleven thirty,
I'm home and walking by their door, I go, dad,
(12:00):
and this is what I hear.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
Yeah, that was lovely for anyone listening, by the.
Speaker 5 (12:07):
Way, and I'm I'm home dad, great, good you, And
I oh, I know what was going on. This was
when I was older, in the teen years.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
Great.
Speaker 5 (12:22):
See.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Here's the thing, though, you You've just helped me make
my point, which is that it's easy for us to
idolize our parents as parents, these people who just took
care of us without judgment in the in the in
the most ideal senses. But but it's also I think
you can make a pretty good argument that it's important
for you and me, and and and for all of us,
(12:44):
in our efforts to be good humans, to sort of
at a certain point start to realize and accept that
as good as our parents were and maybe still are
in my case, they were also just human beings trying
to make their way through the world.
Speaker 7 (12:58):
Right.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
They were still living their lives. Yeah, they're still wrestling
in the covers or whatever they grew I grew up
with them growing up. Right, So were there times when you,
as an adult, as you got older, where you suddenly
started to feel a little more clarity about your folks
as people, kind of a different kind of respect for
for what they had gone through, or or when they
(13:19):
felt maybe more humanized in a way.
Speaker 5 (13:21):
One of my favorite times, like you in the in
the family room, is they became my best friends, better
friends than you, better friends than Dan. I mean my
best best friends. And I didn't know a lot of
kids that could say that. No, But one of my
favorite times and is we would always play poker, sitting
around the table playing a poker Dealer's choice. And every holiday,
(13:44):
every family get together was just four or five of us,
whoever was together, and they would I They'd have a
cocktail or something, and I'd start asking them questions and
once they're loose, they would they would inform me. So
I didn't even know that's why that happened. Oh, when
you were dropping us off at Grandma's house every Saturday night,
(14:05):
you were Yeah, we were going to a hotel.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
That makes all the sense in the world to me,
now right, that's and so they were open about that,
sharing that kind of stuff.
Speaker 5 (14:15):
Now you being a parent though, I mean, do you
think that your your kids are the youngest Cosmo is Yeah,
he's twenty twenty. And have they reached that point yet
where they see you as not just a parent, But.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
I hope you to be. I hope so, because I've
been pretty open with them about Like my mother, for example,
an incredible woman, one of the most creative talented people
I've ever known, a brilliant writer, taught me how to
read when I was a kid. Just a very powerful
creative influence in my life. But also an alcoholic, and
and you know, thankfully she finally got sober after a
(14:51):
pretty long run of some ugliness. But then she went.
She didn't just get sober, She went back to school,
she got double master's degree, she became a Presbyterian minister.
She wound up helping thousands of people literally. And I've
always been very open with my kids about that, in
order to not only humanize a grandparent, but just humanize
myself hopefully in that process. But I'm probably not the
(15:13):
best person to speak about this. I don't know whether
they see me as a human being or not.
Speaker 5 (15:17):
What you should do sometime is maybe invite one of
your kids in I know where this is going. You
really should invite one of your kids. Oh, you know,
I love them all equally, but I guess my favorite
is because he's also a DJ in a radio station
in college, and I've seen some of his stuff. It
(15:37):
is brilliantly funny and wonderful. Cosmo. I'd love to Why
didn't you bring Cosmo? Cosmo?
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Maybe I did?
Speaker 5 (15:45):
Really Yeah, Well, we have a guest coming up, but
can we talk to him really quick?
Speaker 2 (15:49):
Can we squeeze him in? Let's do come here?
Speaker 5 (15:52):
Cosmos a gentleman Cosmo callaway.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
Look at that. Hey, guys, how's it going? Hello, Hansome?
Speaker 5 (15:57):
Is everybody in your family gorgeous model, old type, Look
at them.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
It has nothing to do with my genetics.
Speaker 5 (16:03):
This is his daughter, this is this is Clem.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
Yeah yeah, Crockets over there right behind you, the movie stars,
all of us. Cosmo's home for the summer. And uh,
and I dragged you along. Sorry you did. No, I'm
happy to be here.
Speaker 5 (16:15):
Hi guys, Hi, guys, welcome to the show. All right, Uh,
I can assume just be seeing you two together.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
I'm starting to sweat. I go ahead.
Speaker 5 (16:26):
I did have well, okay, since you said that, I
did have a question.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
It might be a little too Yeah, don't ask it,
all right, Brian asked, Okay, when you started masturbating? Oh
my god, No, okay, when.
Speaker 5 (16:43):
What technique did you do?
Speaker 2 (16:44):
That's too open?
Speaker 5 (16:45):
To hide it from them, because as kids, we all
think like, oh, I can't I'm too embarrassed. I don't
want them to know. And I came up with a.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Trick me personally, you're really not gonna let go of this.
We can always cut it out.
Speaker 6 (16:56):
Uh.
Speaker 5 (16:57):
We came up with this. I came up with this.
I thought he invented it. Apparently other kids had done
the same thing, but I called it the inverted sock method. Okay,
and I'm not gonna go any further than as don't.
But my question actually, Cosmo, when did you know that
they were more than just parents? Because I see you
two together and you guys are really truly friends. About
(17:21):
how old were you and how did it happen?
Speaker 6 (17:22):
Oh?
Speaker 5 (17:23):
God?
Speaker 8 (17:23):
Well, first off, I can't let this get to his head.
So this is just this is close your ears and
you slip me the twenty after. But no, I think
it started to happen when I started to have conversations
with my friends about what they wanted to do differently
as parents.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
I'll tell you what I.
Speaker 5 (17:41):
Mean by this.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
I think people are at least.
Speaker 8 (17:46):
My friends were all too ready to be like, oh,
I know exactly how I want to raise my kids differently. Yeah,
you know, like my parents were too helicoptery or too disconnected.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
Or whatever it is.
Speaker 8 (17:56):
Yeah, but for me it was the exact. My fear
was that, oh my god, I'm never going to be
able to recreate how this guy has done it for
my own kids.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
And I think it was.
Speaker 8 (18:10):
At that moment that I was like, oh, that probably
means I like him.
Speaker 5 (18:14):
Nice. Nice? See man, how do you feel that's sweet?
Speaker 2 (18:21):
I love you? Yeah. Look, I don't know where we
go from there other than to say it's time to
introduce our actual next guest. Can we do that?
Speaker 5 (18:31):
Yeah, I'll tell you. I think I hooked the last
one when you hooked this one. This is amazing, people.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
I'm gonna Our next guest is someone who you already
know and love from all kinds of roles. She's played
on the stage, the small the big screen, but she
has also had this unique and powerful journey not only
with her own parents, but as a parent herself. So
(18:56):
stick around and we're going to meet her right after
I give my son fifty dollars for saying such nice
things about me.
Speaker 5 (19:05):
And also once he does that, Cosmo, could you just
get out of the shot because I feel very uncomfortable
sitting next to someone so gorgeous. Great, I don't feel
bad when I'm sitting next to him and know, yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:19):
That's that's easy. Stick around. We'll be right back.
Speaker 4 (19:32):
Of a bigger kill, the bigger kill, bigger.
Speaker 6 (19:40):
We will take you.
Speaker 5 (19:41):
Suck and we're back.
Speaker 2 (19:43):
We are, Oh Trey, Yes, I would like very much
to introduce the one and only Amy Brenneman. Talk about humanizing.
She is completely and totally slumming it to join us today.
We are absolutely not worthy. Amy Brenneman, my Friends, is
(20:04):
a Harvard educated writer, director, producer, podcaster, teacher, and Emmy
Golden Globe, Sad People's Choice, TV Guide, Peabody Award nominated
actress with an astounding array of credits. We're talking about.
Speaker 5 (20:23):
Judging Amy Boom, Casper, Boom, Heat, Boom.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
It's gonna be a lot of booms. NYPD, Blue Fraser, Fear, Goliath,
Private Practice, Daylight, The Leftovers, The Jane Austen Book Club,
Tell Me Your Secrets. She's currently starring in one of
my favorite shows of all time with Jeff Bridges and
John Lethgow in The Old Man on Hulu. Amy Brenneman,
I am asking you this first because I know you
(20:52):
happen to have a degree in comparative religion, So I
need to ask you, why in God's name are you
talking to us? It makes no sense, but we're delighted
to have you here. Thank you for coming.
Speaker 6 (21:06):
Oh my goodness, I'm so happy to be here your family.
That's why we show up.
Speaker 2 (21:11):
And it's it's appropriate because we are we're talking about
parents today.
Speaker 5 (21:15):
Yeah. Before we get into that, though, I think we
should say that you and your wife Nancy have been
friends with Amy and her lovely husband Brad, who is
a very dear friend of ours as well.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
We love us some, Brad Silverling. Yeah. But yeah, Amy,
we're here with you today and we're talking about parents
and parenting and and I wonder what you would be
willing to share with us about your own parents.
Speaker 6 (21:42):
Sure. My parents were extraor no people. They both passed away. Now.
I helped them both transition, which was really an incredible honor.
My parents met at Harvard Law School. My mom was
in the first class of women there, and she went
there to find a husband, which she did so she.
(22:04):
I love the fun fact she was in the first
class of women. But they actually were the first married
couple ever at Harvard Law School, which is an even
better fact.
Speaker 5 (22:13):
Wow.
Speaker 6 (22:14):
They were madly in love and were till till for
sixty five years. My parents, So it's interesting. It's kind
of I was listening to you, Brian, it's sort of
the opposite where they didn't get married so late. I
think my mom was twenty five, my dad was twenty two.
But they went to finish law school and my dad
had to go in the army, and da da da,
(22:35):
and then and then they had a hard time getting pregnant.
So they desperately wanted kids, so that we always felt
and they were actually just about to I think there's
some crazy story they put in some papers to adopt
or like it's not going to happen, and then the
day they got there, we found you a kid. My
mother was pregnant, and so so we as I have
(22:56):
two older brothers, and we were very much wanted. You know,
it was not taken for granted that they be parents.
And I'm I got the pole position as the baby girl.
So I can honestly say from from the get that
we were desired wanted. They bait. Both came from pretty
shitty backgrounds, so they definitely were like, we gotta figure it,
(23:18):
not only do it differently, we have to figure out
like how do you do holidays? And I mean they
just were and so they really these traditions that I
thought were like generations. My brother and I were like, go,
they just made that up. Right, like you're a kid,
Like it's always this is the way we do holidays
in this family that you just.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
Went inging it from the beginning.
Speaker 6 (23:36):
They were winging it. Yeah, they were winging it. And
you know, I would say as individuals two things. I mean,
there's many things to say about them. My father sober
when I was seventeen. He was fifty one. So I
think the greatest gift was to watch somebody wake up
and become more and more and more present and have
(23:58):
a spiritual practice and have community engagement. I am also
a twelve stepper. It just became part of what you
do is look after your emotional and mental health sure
and bring that to your community. I mean, he just
did it. He went to three meetings a week till
the day week he died.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
You know, So I'm sorry. Your father was an attorney, right, right.
Speaker 6 (24:18):
So my parents was an attorney. My mother was a judge.
Speaker 2 (24:21):
Right. So you didn't you didn't get away with anything
growing up? Probably we did not.
Speaker 6 (24:25):
Get away with anything. Yeah, But although it's interesting, it's interesting, Brian.
My brother Matthew now is also an attorney. He was
he was a pretty rowdy kid and sold marijuana and
did this and that. In high school, I was I
was like you, but I wouldn't say, I wouldn't report,
like I didn't want to cause them problems in such
(24:47):
a positive way. I think it was just like, oh,
these poor schmocks, like I don't want it. So it
took me a while to be rebellious, to be a
full human. I just had to. I was just in
this good girl straight jacket a little bit.
Speaker 5 (24:57):
Were they were they strict? Were they strict parents like
that one way.
Speaker 6 (25:01):
Or the No, No, it was it was very similar
to what you're describing, because my you know, I had
an older sibling who had pushed the boundaries a little bit.
They weren't super strict. I mean they were trying to
kind of hang in. No, and I didn't have a curfew.
Same deal because they weren't strict. I just we were
just so fucking codependent together. O. I'm sorry, that's yeah,
But I mean I was. I didn't want to cause
(25:23):
them problems, but not in it, but in a way
that it didn't allow me to actually rebel and individuate
and do the things you have to do, and which
I did a little bit later.
Speaker 5 (25:32):
How did they feel about you getting into acting. Was
that something that they was completely supportive at first.
Speaker 6 (25:39):
Or well it was I broke it to them slowly,
and it broke it to myself very slowly. I mean,
I grew up in central Connecticut. I didn't know anybody
in the business. I did, However, I started doing plays
when I was eleven and was always happiest when I was.
What I love is collective art making. That's just I
love it. I love it, I love it on it.
(26:01):
So I was in place. I think if I was
just talking about this to a friend the other day,
if I it's seventeen, if I said I'm not going
to college, I'm going to New York, they would not have,
you know. But I went to college. I got a degree.
At college, we made dear friends that are still made
dear friends. We formed a theater company that we were
(26:21):
on the road for about six years, and we worked with,
you know, essentially marginalized communities creating theater projects. So and
I did do a lot of teaching. So it was
like I was kind of acting, but I was kind
of a social worker. So it's really when I was
like twenty seven or twenty eight, I was like, I'm
getting a headshot. I'm getting an agent, okay, But at
that point I was I mean, seems young now, but
(26:42):
I was old enough where I wasn't a flake, you know.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
But like you said, you slowly let them into it,
and you slowly let yourself into that.
Speaker 7 (26:50):
I didn't.
Speaker 6 (26:50):
I mean, I still I have a very hand to
I mean treinos. It's like, in a second, I could
like drop out and just run a theater program for
twelve years. You know, I don't know what I think
about Hollywood except when it's fun and I've been able
to make a living, which is amazing.
Speaker 5 (27:06):
We'll sprinkle some of this in because all the projects
that Tery mentioned in your intro. But The Old Man
is something very very special, and you are amazing in it.
I can't imagine anybody else playing that role. But the
first episode I saw with that what was it twelve
(27:27):
minute fight and just kept going and going and going
and going. Were you a fan of his? And and
also I wanted to ask, did you immediately read the
script and go I've got to be part of the
show or or how did that happen?
Speaker 6 (27:45):
I was always a fan of Chef Bridges, Yeah, and
always always always in left gout but Jeff Bridges, I mean,
there are many, many movies that have tattooed in my psyche,
you know, so it's like, oh, my god, he's just
one of the greats.
Speaker 5 (27:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (27:58):
No, when I honestly, when I read the script, I
was like, oh, it's another boy thing. And I'm used
to kind of being at the center of my own
story now sure on stage and off stage. So it
took me a little bit of convincing m.
Speaker 5 (28:11):
And how do they convince you?
Speaker 6 (28:13):
Well, because John, the creators are so smart, and it's like, oh,
you're using the meta. Oh we're talking metal. I mean
quite literally. What I said is this reminds me of
a movie Heat that I did twenty five thirty years ago,
where I'm like on the outside like, oh, you're a
bad guy and oh but I love you anyway. And
I was like, I cannot do that to my psyche
or to feminism. I just can't, you know. Yeah, but
(28:35):
they said, oh no, no, no, no, we talk about
this as they literally call Zoe. My character Edie evolved,
So what if it's Edie but it's twenty five years later.
So instead of like you're a bad guy, I love you,
it's like you're a bad guy. Get out of my house,
like literally, get out of my house.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
Yeah. I've been there, done that.
Speaker 5 (28:52):
Yeah yeah, yeah, it's like.
Speaker 6 (28:53):
We're die and I am quite literally dialoguing with my
younger self and with culture from twenty five years ago.
And it's a pretty active dialogue. And then obviously anytime
I get to look into Jeff Bridges' eyes and to
feel beloved by Jeff Bridges is like really one of
the high ways.
Speaker 2 (29:10):
Yeah no, this is like me looking you in the eyes.
Speaker 5 (29:13):
It is. It's a high point for you, isn't it. Well?
Speaker 2 (29:16):
Okay, so, but it's interesting that you bring up being
at the center of your own story because I know
that a big part of your story, an enormous part
of your story off camera and off stage, is your
role of being a parent. Right, So you know, inasmuch
as you were influenced by your own parents, and then
also recognizing at a certain point that they were winging it
(29:37):
as you look back on it, you had to wing
it yourself like the rest of us, as parents do.
She's got two kids who aren't such kids anymore, brilliant,
wonderful son who's killing it in college, and also her
oldest daughter, Charlotte, who has taken you, I know, on
an extraordinary journey as a parent, and I wonder if
(29:58):
you can talk to us a little bit more about
that journey.
Speaker 6 (30:02):
Yeah, I mean first, first, I will say, and you know,
so Trey's middle son is born four days after Charlotte,
but because they already, they already had Clementine, so they
kind of knew. I mean, I cannot even tell you
how much I leaned on you and Nansen. Still, I
(30:23):
felt really clueless, and you.
Speaker 2 (30:25):
Were equally clueless.
Speaker 6 (30:27):
The least judgmental, the most available, you know, funny, I mean,
you know how I feel.
Speaker 5 (30:34):
I mean, pretty good parents to base some of your
parenting new parenting knowledge on. I mean they did, They've
done such and I'm not just saying this. They've done
an amazing job with these three, oh.
Speaker 6 (30:45):
Yeah, oh yeah. And also the complexities, you know, and
it may be different when you're a younger parent, as
you were talking about your folks. But I was a
working mom in a job that was taking eighteen hours
a day, and I never thought judging would be a
hit and I kind of hope that it wouldn't, just
because it's really tiring to start our long drama. But
(31:06):
I was thirty four and it was a hit, and
I just remember looking to Brad. I was like, oh shit.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
And emotional too. We should say like we should remind
people because I was a huge fan of that show.
But it was based on your mom and her experiences.
So when we talk about parenting and influences like.
Speaker 6 (31:21):
Right and very and I always I mean quite honestly,
so just a small anecdote, and I want to talk
more about my kids. But when I was pregnant the
second season of Judging Amy, I gave birth basically right
around that hiatus, and then I came back when she
was four months old and I was nursing and because
(31:43):
I was so stressed out, the milk dried up and
the abyss and the that, and it was I did
not want to be on a TV show. I just
wanted to be with my baby, of course. And every
day I would come home from work and I'd say
to Brad, what would happen if I blew out of
this show? And you know, he was always like, listen
to your mental health is the number one thing. You know,
you'd probably not be able to work for a while.
(32:04):
Lyness or that But then even at that time, and
I do want to say this as an artist and
as a woman who has an identity apart from being
a mother, I realized that my creative, the playful, the
person that comes up with the new ideas, My little
(32:25):
inner creative is about five years old. And I realized
with Charlotte, I was in fact having my second child,
the first one being myself. And if I just ditched
my show, that's when parenting goes sour. I mean I
had an alcoholic you know father. I mean, things can
go really wrong if we abandon ourselves entirely. That's true
(32:46):
to try to be a good parent. Now was the
balance in my life was completely whacked, and it was like,
this is not ideal, but I got I had that
wisdom of like, hold up, this is my first child.
Was judging amy basically, you know it came from my
whole psyche.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
Yeah yeah, yeah, so yeah.
Speaker 6 (33:03):
It was a crazy time. And then Charlotte, my daughter,
well from the day she was born, she had this
very rare she said, a very rare endocrine disorder, which
was like kind of like that's weird but treatable. Thank
god we have the same endocrinologist and but the but
then when she was like two, it's like she's she's
(33:24):
not walking, or she was walking, but she's not talking,
she's not doing she's delayed, she's developmentally delayed. So that
really start us on this journey of special ed and
finding the right schools and finding the right this and that,
which was an incredible down the rabbit hole of an
alice in wonderland that I did not know existed. I
(33:45):
didn't And that's when my parents, my mother in particular,
had such a long journey with Charlotte because in my family,
it wasn't about being beautiful or athletic prowless. You know,
families have different ways of gauging them. In my family,
it was really intellectual prowess. And here I got this
(34:05):
kiddo with an intellectual disability rights.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
That's tough.
Speaker 6 (34:09):
So like the agony of that for years and kind
of siding with my daughter, but sometimes siding with my
mom and she didn't even It just was such a
journey for all of us.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
It's a lot to navigate.
Speaker 6 (34:21):
Yeah, we're going to completely and also, you know what,
so Charlotte, basically the end of that story is she
has a very very very rare chromosomal abnormality, which fourteen
hundred people in the world a couple of years ago.
I'm sure there's more now, very rare, so in the world.
Speaker 5 (34:41):
Fourteen I'm sorry, fourteen in the world.
Speaker 6 (34:43):
Yeah, yeah, I mean there's gonna be a lot more,
to be honest, because folks that maybe were she's never
been in the autism club because just her disability is different.
But you know, it's all it's all because of the
genome project, right, It's just a blood draw. So there's
gonna be lots of folks that go like, oh, my gosh,
I finally have a name for this thing. But if
you go if it's called Phale McDermot syndrome, and if
(35:04):
you go on the little website, Charlotte's like a superstar.
Like it's like, oh many Fale McDermott, folks like don't
have any language, never toilet, never this that. So then
it became like, oh, as my brother put it, he's like, oh,
she's been running a marathon with one leg and we
don't know because neurobiology is so hidden, right, she has
what you call an invisible disability. So then I began
(35:26):
to parent her so much better. I stopped comparing her
to the wrong people. And so I think that's the
other thing when we talk about parenting. I parent my
children very differently. They need different things from me. So
I also think that's part of it. Sometimes people can
have a big jolly you know. I grew up with
(35:47):
like really big Catholic families because Central CONNECTICU had lots
of you know, seven kids, eight kids. Some you know,
good things about it challenging, But I think the idea
it's like, you know, I parent all my kids the same.
It's like that's not good because everybody's different.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
That's right. I mean, it is something that you don't
again when we talk about winging it, like you experienced
this in just within your own siblings and seeing the
way here's the sister who runs away, here's the way
my dad handles me and my brother, like you recognize
pretty early on. I think if you're you know, trying
to do the best job you can as a parent,
you start to recognize that, like, yeah, the same rules
(36:23):
don't necessarily apply to these very different people.
Speaker 5 (36:27):
Does that go for like the way you communicate with them,
as well well as the decisions.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
Und percent I always say, you know, Clementine and Crockett
and Cosmo all come from the same gene pool, but
they are all radically different human beings.
Speaker 5 (36:38):
And that's fun for you, isn't it. I mean, it's
once you get it.
Speaker 2 (36:41):
But it's also as as Amy is speaking to directly
with body or Charlotte, like these are two different people
and they don't. You can't. It's not one rule applies
to all you. You kind of have to figure that out
and negotiate that situation. So so once you finally were
able to understand what Charlotte was up against, like you say,
(37:02):
your brother running the one legged marathon, like, then you
were able to sort of, you think, more effectively parent
her and maybe, oh.
Speaker 6 (37:09):
Yeah, I mean then you know, I was talking to
somebody about this the other day, like, I'm just so
much happier getting older. I'm happier when my kids are
getting older. And it wasn't like and I loved when
they were babies, but I never am nostalgic for that
time because in my experience, in my family's experience, it
was there was so many unknowns, And honestly, when you
have a loved one with a disability or a kid
(37:29):
a disability, it's like how does this look like in adulthood?
You know, patriarchal capitalism is not built for people that
aren't going to make a living wage. What does it
look like? And you know, once we got the diagnosis
and we found our way to this extraordinary I mean,
first of all, I'm an art making activist, That's who
I am. So we're finding our way. She had a
(37:49):
wonderful boarding school that she went to, and then I
with some other people bought a small apartment building and
we created this support. It's what I'm built for. Quite literally,
parenting her is what I'm built or but I didn't
know it and it took me a while to realize.
Like and then also the it's funny. I just saw
a rough cut of a documentary a friend made about
the galladat university and deaf community. There's within disability. But
(38:15):
I also think this is a parenting thing at large.
It certainly is a twelve step thing at large. The
initial thing is how can I fix it and then
go back to normal? Right? And you don't go back
to what is normal again, it's usually capitalistic picture. So
then you go, oh, what is this world that we're
creating together? And usually our kids turn us onto something
(38:38):
we didn't know, or you know, it's I had an
awesome moment. Actually, I think body would be comfortable with
me sharing this. So my son finished his freshman year
of college, and you know, he was a very good student,
serious student in high school. Also COVID not a lot
of fun, right, so he kept going like member to
(38:58):
have fun. And also because in a very stem oriented,
data oriented moment in our educational history, you know, we're like,
remember art making and remember filmmaking and just self expression.
Just remember that too, you know. So so he goes
to college, not sure if he's going, but he's kind
of keeps gravitating towards like business stuff. And I'm like, okay,
(39:20):
well and then I'm like, remember getting So he got
into this wonderful filmmaking club and he did make a
couple of movies. So anyway, cut to May, we're about
to go into a movie and he said, we were
talking about his cousin. Actually he was in law school,
and they said, oh, what do people do between the
summer's first year, second year law school? We're talking about that,
And then he said something about business school in general.
(39:40):
I must have rolled my eyes because he said to me,
and this was the best. He was like, Mom, I
have to talk to you about something. I've been talking
about it a lot with Kathleen and therapy, which also
blew my mind.
Speaker 5 (39:55):
He's like, oh my.
Speaker 6 (39:55):
God, I've talked about my mother in therapy. I was like,
now I'm the mom.
Speaker 5 (39:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (40:00):
But he said, he said, I feel like you and
dad don't take my interest in business seriously, that you
want me to go into humanities and art making. And
and I was like, dang, you're right, you know. And
we laughed because it was the opposite of most families,
you know. Yeah, And then it was really cool. We
went into the movie. I considered going to a shame
(40:21):
spiral about my terrible parenting, and then I didn't. And
then we got in the car and I said, you know,
I'm not this is not defending myself, but I'm trying
to think about where that came from, you know. And
I said, I think it's because you are so practical,
and maybe it's the moment we're in because everything feels
topsy turvy. Every choice as an undergrad, it's like, I
(40:41):
want this to be practical and applicable to my career.
And I said, you know, honey, we really do believe
in a liberal arts education. What that means to us is,
this is the four years where you get to bump
into a poetry cloud. You don't have to be so
responsible all the time, you know. And also I believe
self expression just like going to the gym, eating healthy,
it's part of being a human being. So I just
(41:02):
whether it's a guitar lesson or water color, I do
want to say that as your mama, that's part of
being well balanced. But I did say I stand corrected
nice and I said, here's the difference between me and
my mom. I nailed my moms on some stuff and
she could hear it. Sometimes she could not make She
just didn't have self awareness. She could not actually make
(41:24):
the change so that the comments would still come. And
I said, I heard you, and I will make that change.
And I did.
Speaker 5 (41:30):
What's great about this, and for a lot of us,
is you know your parents are doing what they're doing,
even though it's maybe not what you want or you
want so many different they're doing it. If you have
the wherewithal to understand this, they're doing it because they
think they want what's right for you, obviously, and they
love you, and they want to send you in the
right direction, do the best job they can, and you
(41:52):
confronting them, you know, kind of that's a lot of
people should should do that.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
Well, yeah, I was just going to say the high point.
My takeaway from that is parent to parent, like you
clearly fostered an environment where your kid feels comfortable communicating
with you about his feelings, and that's that's key. But
I also think it's part and parcel of being such
an effective communicator as you are being an artist. And
this is what I want to talk about next, because
(42:20):
you know, in addition to all of Amy's accolades on
TV and in the movies, she's also been quite accomplished
on the stage, right Yeah, in Pulitzer Prize nominated plays
like Rapture, Blister Burne or Power Power of Sale with
Brian Cranston, which is written by my friend Paul gretlong
amazing show. She also recently completely blew my mind in
the Sound Inside at Pacady A Playhouse.
Speaker 5 (42:43):
But she's got a project or had a project out.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
That's it probably most relevant to what we're talking about
right now. Amy just recently co wrote and starred in
a powerfully autobiographical play called Overcome that just had a
sold out run at the at the Kotuit Center for
the Arts in Cape cod Amy. Will you tell us
more about because this is sort of the merging of
(43:05):
your roles as parent and artist, tell us more about
what made that show so particularly special for you as
both a parent and a performer.
Speaker 6 (43:15):
Yeah, well, you know, I think that I do use
autobiographical material. I had an illness fifteen years ago. I wrote,
I need to get it up and out, I went,
especially when things are so overwhelming, because I work in
as you do Trey, like script's beginning of middle and end.
I think a big breakthrough was my collaborator Sabrina. I
(43:36):
kept saying, like, just write bits and bogs. Think like
a script songwriter or a poet. I think like a poet. Yeah,
and just sort of like, Okay, if it's sticking to me,
it might be an interesting thing. Overcome started out as
something called Threshold in twenty sixteen, which was quite literally
about me being between my mother and my daughter, and
then in twenty nineteen it's still called Threshold, I think,
(43:59):
but I sort of took my mom out because I
was feeling sort of guilty that I was trashing here
I produced here on Martha's Vineyard three thousand miles away,
and I was like, I feel bad about that. But
also I put what her she was saying into a
character I literally call dominant culture, and I don't I
talked to dominant culture. I'm like, hey, why do you know?
Because there are these it's the air that we breathe,
this ableism situation, you know, just like racism and patriarchy.
(44:23):
We got to keep going, like why do I think
this way?
Speaker 2 (44:26):
Right? Right?
Speaker 6 (44:27):
So overcome? So we did it here on Martha's Vineyard
in twenty nineteen. Charlotte appears with me at the very
very end in a very organic happened very organically. My
collaborator Serena kept saying, like we should put more Charlotte
story in it. I was like, she gets to write
her own story. This is the story of the Ally
(44:47):
than the Bad Alley, because I do not want to
get into telling stories about closely disabilities. I will be lurried.
And she gets to write her own story, you know.
So when so she comes out with me at the end,
and then right after twenty nineteen, I really wanted a
full production, which I got at South Coast rep in California.
I was scheduled anyway than COVID. You know, off we go.
(45:10):
So I just did it because Charlotte's wonderful school, the
Riverview School, which is on the Cave, does something called
Transition Weekend in the spring of every year and it's
really for parents and families and what does adulthood look like?
You know, if you're lucky enough to find a good school,
it's like, oh, thank god, we're here, but like, what
does it look like? And it's you know, so I
thought like I would like to do this play because
(45:34):
ultimately what happens is, you know, you think you're psychological.
It's like, oh, here's my family situation. It's a much
bigger story, of course. And honestly, what I think back
now and again, I try not to go into the
shame spy world. But it's as if I had a
kid that was gay and I didn't know it and
I was trying to jam her into the straight world.
(45:55):
It's as fundamental as that I did not know about
neurodiversity and about what I the assumptions that I was
making of, like I just want you to fit into
the world as it is. Well, guess what the world is.
It is isn't so good, and so we need to
break open this whole thing. So it became a I
mean not only parenting and art making, but the activism peace.
(46:19):
It's like, holy to Moly, this is what I've been
thinking about all my life. Right, So it was kind
of an amazing experience. And and and I forgot Actually
we did a dress rehearsal. People come up to me,
but they really come up to Charlotte with tears in
their eyes. They need to hugger they, you know, so
I said you after that treshearsal, I was like, honey,
I kind of forgot how emotional people are after this.
(46:42):
And if it gets too much, if you don't want
to be in the lobby, you know, there's other private
places at the theater you can hang out. I mean, Trey,
you would not like Charlotte because Arlotte can get sensory
stuff overwhelmed. She literally is. She knows. It's like a politician.
People thank you for coming. I'm so like it. There's
like she knew. She intuited that her presence was an
(47:04):
important part of this experience.
Speaker 5 (47:08):
Did she enjoyed the being on stage part?
Speaker 6 (47:10):
She comes on stage at the very end and literally,
and it's a little the reason it's so powerful, And again,
it was very organic when it happened. But you know,
when you watch it and this happens all the time,
You're watching somebody do a stand up routine and they're
like trashing on their wife or something, and you're kind
of like, this is funny, But is she cool with it?
You know, by Charlotte, because I've basically been talking about Charlotte,
(47:32):
not always in derogatory ways, but sometimes I mean, by
the end of the play, I have a different point
of view on it. But when she comes out, it's
just breath takingly beautiful and it blesses the whole thing.
Like it's sort of this, uh, there's kind of a
bookend to the whole show, and it's a talent show
that I found myself in a couple of years ago,
(47:54):
where people who are actually much more impacted than she was. Right,
but there's moaning and there's like to read, so I'm like,
how did I get here? And so the beginning of it,
it's sort of like it's like a bad, weird dream.
It's like I'm in this room and there's weird stuff happening,
and oh of that. So then you go on this
journey and then I come at the end and I
(48:16):
was like, and now we're back in the basement, and
I see it really differently, and I see the vastness
of human diversity, and I hear the deep need for
human expression. And then I see my daughter and then
she comes out.
Speaker 5 (48:28):
Was this cathartic for sure?
Speaker 6 (48:32):
Yeah? Oh yeah. I mean there's a moment. So I
have people sometimes think it's like, oh, it's a one
woman show. I was like, no, there's two dancers, there's
six actors, we have a drummer. But there are these
two dancers who actually have known Charlotte for a long time,
who sort of embody her energy. I didn't want anybody
(48:55):
playing Charlotte. I didn't want her. I didn't want to
play Charlotte. But it's sort of this abstract but very
visceral experience of what it was like, you know, and
Trey was around, like when it would just go haywire.
So there's a terrible moment that's sort of a rock
bottom moment where it's like Thanksgiving dinner and my mom
saying what's wrong with her? And she can't sit and
(49:17):
she's tantruming and then I and then I scream, and
I and I you know, I mean, I say like
why because we didn't have a diagnosis, So it's like,
why can't you sit at the table? Why can't you
do what other people are doing? What the fuck is
wrong with you? And right before we were rehearsing that
back in twenty nineteen, and Charlotte was just poking around.
She hadn't gone to campiyat. She loves a rehearsal room.
(49:38):
And Sabria said, you talk to Charlotte about the scene
that's coming up. And I was like, and I turned
to my beautiful eighteen year old I was like, this
is yeah, this is a scene about when you didn't
have a lot of words and I didn't really know
how to help you, and we were both really frustrated.
Speaker 2 (49:55):
And she was like, yeah, this is a hallmark of
good parenting. Is this kind of communication, regardless of how
your kids communicate, well.
Speaker 6 (50:03):
Not to shy away from it, you know, it's like,
y'all live through that, and we are not there now,
you know. And so I think the Catharsis is like,
you know, there's a thing that we were non non
neurodiverse kids use it too. It's a great parent here's
a great parenting tool. I will say to your audience.
(50:24):
It's called social stories. Right, so let's say you have
like a really shitty day or you know, more specifically,
like you know, somebody has a meltdown at six Flags
right when you go home and with terrible Trey could
do this better because he's a better artist than I.
But what stick figures. I would say, like, here's Charlotte.
You know, she got hot, you know, mom said it
(50:45):
was time to go. She fell apart. It's like and
then it's the most magical thing. It's the power of
storytelling because then it's not me. Also, she's really good
at eye contact. But it's a very confrontational thing, like
let's talk about it, right, But if you're looking at this,
oh that was a really intense day, look at this story.
But I feel like my original work is social stories
(51:06):
for myself. It's like this happened, and if it stays
in my body, I don't understand it. I can't work
with it. And then the icing on the cake is
if it's helpful to others or if it, you know,
creates some interesting piece of art.
Speaker 5 (51:19):
Do you plan to do another staging of this play
because you mentioned that briefly, the other cast members, that
the dancers, that the characters, and it just seems I've
got to see this, and I'm I'm not just trying
to hook it for you, but I mean, I really
would love to see this. It was enthralling when I
(51:39):
read about it in the and the reviews and your
description of it.
Speaker 6 (51:44):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, we do need to figure out
how to slim it down. Oh but yes we what
what it? What? It? What?
Speaker 2 (51:52):
It made me?
Speaker 6 (51:53):
I mean, not to shoot our own horns, but like
when we did it in March, I was like, oh,
this works, It's sturdy. We keep returning to it. It worked,
you know what I mean. It's like a song. It's like,
oh that works again, you know. Yeah, And something about
the abstraction. You know, I'm such a language based creator,
but really, Sabrina. I've known Sabrina since I was eighteen,
and she's a choreographer, and there's something about things going abstract,
(52:16):
which is also something you can do a little bit
more seamlessly on stage. You can do it on film
and television, but it tends to be a little bit
more literal. But like that thing when the feeling gets
too big and it needs to go abstract or you
go off language, that's a moment that's really interesting to me.
Speaker 2 (52:32):
Well, listen of You know this, but I'm going to
say it anyway because it bears repeating. You're an extraordinary woman, Amy.
I am proud to call you a friend, but I'm
also proud as a parent to have been at least
a part of your journey, but to hear you speak
(52:53):
about it in such open and giving terms, to recognize
the the effort that you have put into communicating with
your kids in very different ways, taking the lessons you
learn from your parents and applying them to your own
efforts of winging it as a parent, as we all do.
(53:14):
All of these things are for us, I know, clear
examples of what make you such a good human, and
we are deeply appreciative that you have taken the time
to share any or all of these things with us.
I also know that you're a passionate supporter of many causes,
but specifically as the parent of a newer, divergent daughter,
(53:38):
I know that there's especially on the heels of overcome
that this Cotuit Center for the Arts is something that
is near and dear to your heart and it is
truly an amazing nonprofit. It runs an incredible and also
fully inclusive art making group, which I know is your jam. Amy.
(54:00):
So if you're listening to us or you're watching us
and you would like to know how you could be
supportive of the Kotuit Center for the Arts, go to
Artsothecape dot org, which is a great way to support
their work. We're also going to post the link on
our website be Good Humans podcast dot com. Help them
out if you can, but also please join us in
(54:22):
thanking the amazing Amy Brenneman for taking the time to
be with us today. We love you.
Speaker 5 (54:28):
We love you too.
Speaker 6 (54:29):
I love you. Thank you for doing this and for
like skeewing to a positive route to a moment where
people are more interested in Nativity.
Speaker 5 (54:38):
And thank you. But also I want to tell everyone
go make sure today go today. Quit don't quit, but
just take the day off if you're at work listening
and go home and watch the old man you are.
It's different, it's a step above. It's great, and again
Amy is is wonderful in it.
Speaker 2 (54:58):
Yeah, thank you for being such a Good Mom Season
two on September twelfth.
Speaker 6 (55:02):
We just got the twelve season two.
Speaker 5 (55:05):
Am I in it or no?
Speaker 6 (55:07):
No?
Speaker 2 (55:09):
There's always hope for season three.
Speaker 7 (55:10):
Man, Thank you very much, Amy, thank you.
Speaker 4 (55:25):
We will take you suck.
Speaker 5 (55:27):
Hey, everybody, if you haven't already, go to Be Good
Humans podcast dot com. There's going to be a little
place there for you to make your suggestions. If you
have good humans in your life, people you think we
might want to talk to you on the show.
Speaker 2 (55:39):
If you are watching us on YouTube, do us a
big favor please click like and subscribe. That would be
very helpful to us. Also follow us on the socials
if you don't already at Facebook and Instagram and threads
and TikTok and x and all that stuff. And then
if you feel like being an a specially good human,
join us on Patreon. You're going to get all kinds
of fun extra stuff, bonus material didn't make it into
the show, some exclusive video and posts, super cool, exclusive
(56:02):
access to special stuff that you cannot get for free
on the podcast or through our social media accounts.
Speaker 5 (56:06):
Thank you for joining us, and to you all, be
good humans.
Speaker 3 (56:12):
Be good humans, Be good humans, Be good humans, or
we will Thank You.
Speaker 8 (56:21):
Suck to Be Good Humans is executive produced by Brian Phelps,
Trey Callaway, and Grant Anderson, with the associate producers Sean Fitzgerald
and Clementine Callaway and partnership with straw Hut Media. Please like, follow,
and subscribe, and remember be Good Humans.
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