Shadow Work, Intrusive Thoughts & Self-Control | Safe Expression Vs. Exploitation - Beat The Mental Health Out Of It! | Dark Humor Conversations On Mental Health, Trauma & Society

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:22):
Welcome to Bottom Huey.
Welcome.
Welcome.
Now we're uh trying out some newmics.
Um courtesy of a dear friend.
And uh we're trying to make surethey're not visible on screen.

SPEAKER_02 (00:39):
Yeah, they they said they would blend on blend in.

SPEAKER_01 (00:42):
They said they blend in, but I'm not I don't see do
you see them?
I mean, I'm not really I'm notpicking up on anything.
Yeah, I'm not annoyed by theannoying.
I mean, it's not necessarily inthe way.
It's quite in a convenientposition.
Yeah.
Looks like the levels are good.

SPEAKER_02 (00:55):
Yeah, they do look good.

SPEAKER_01 (00:56):
They look good.
All right.
I think we look good.
We look great.
I'm gonna take this off.
All right, yeah, it's probablytime.
Okay.
Welcome to Badahue.
You're Badahue, your host, thedefective schizo effective.
This is Andy Pocket.
Yeah, Andy Pocket.
Right.
Tony.

SPEAKER_02 (01:14):
Just call me Tony.
Are we doing that now?
I guess.
We're on a first name basis.
We're a first name basis with atleast 70,000.

SPEAKER_01 (01:20):
Yeah.
Just hit that mark, y'all.
After Shadow Self episode, whichis surprising because that's our
most controversial yet.
But you know what?
We're about to double down onthat shit.
Oh boy.
This is Shadow Self 2.0.
Good thing I took a nap.
But we're also going to talkabout accountability in relation

(01:41):
to that.
So, recap of the Shadow Selfepisode, not that all of you
aren't religiously listening toevery word and episode we
release.
And we thank you for it.
You said religion.
Are you becoming a religiousdealer?
I've decided now.
I am my own deity.
I am.

SPEAKER_02 (02:01):
Dear dear Bottom Hui Jesus.
So now I have to stop saying, ohmy Nick.
Have you been saying that?
No.
But I think I should start.

unknown (02:10):
I like.

SPEAKER_02 (02:11):
Did you hear my reference?
I am Bottom Hooey Jesus.
Bottom Hooie Jesus.
Well, watch out.
You know how that ended.
Yeah, he I don't know.
Okay.

SPEAKER_00 (02:23):
I mean, if you're gonna be crucified, I guess if
you I was talking about, no,that's Deadpool.
Remember?

SPEAKER_01 (02:28):
Oh.

SPEAKER_00 (02:29):
I am the Messiah.
Oh.
I am Marvel Jesus.

SPEAKER_01 (02:33):
You and I saw that in the theater, bro.
Yep.
No, you're right.
Okay.
As long as that's established.
I've been to church and takennaps since then, though.

SPEAKER_02 (02:41):
Alright, guys.
So cleansed my soul.

SPEAKER_01 (02:44):
We've cleansed with DP.
Deadpool.
Wade Wilson.
Oh, wow.
I went somewhere else.
I thought you might.
Okay, so we're gonna recap thatepisode very briefly.
So the shadow self acknowledgingthe darkest side of ourselves
for ultimate growth andself-actualization growth.

(03:08):
For those of you who saw that Iknow.
You guys had to have seen thatshort.
I'm not gonna tell you too muchabout it, but you should watch
it.

SPEAKER_02 (03:14):
You should look it up.

SPEAKER_01 (03:15):
Nold uh defecto schizo effecto was getting it on
with Art the Clown.
Or to Art the Clown, and I wasinterrupted mid-climax by this
guy.
Okay.
Two thumbs and interrupts nextclimax.
Two thumbs and interrupts nextcum.
I don't know.
Oh, wow.
God, we're starting off.

SPEAKER_02 (03:34):
Yeah, we are.

SPEAKER_01 (03:35):
So back on topic.
Okay, so anyway.
Yeah.
So the last episode we dig intothe shadow self and the
importance of acknowledging thatside of ourselves and how we all
have it.
Um, and uh accepting that aboutourselves as human beings um to
deny that side of ourselves thatexists is not healthy.
It's just not.

(03:55):
Um, and that was the crux ofthat episode.
Um anything else we should go.
Okay.
No.
So you need to probably watchthat one first because we're
gonna double down on the thing Iended on.
And you know what?
I'm gonna tease it now, andwe're gonna get to it later in
this episode just to keep y'allhanging on.

(04:16):
So, the end of that episode, Isaid Just jump right in.
I'm gonna jump right in.
If you want to fuck children,dramatic pause.
Dramatic pause.
There's more to it than that.
But we're gonna get into boy,that seems like a weird place to
stop, but that's gotta keep youfuckers hanging on.
All right.

(04:36):
Or get us reported.
Or get us reported already.
We're gonna preface this and sayit numerous, numerous times.
The points we're gonna make arenot supporting doing that.
No.
So I want to preface it withthat.
We're gonna move on, and we'llget back to that later.
Wow.
I know, I'm the littlecliffhanger.
That is a rough cut.

(04:57):
I know, it's on purpose.
Okay, wow.
All right, so where do you wantto go from here?
So we're gonna start off.
We're gonna actually start offby not fucking kids, but not
fucking over our communities.
Ah, yes.

SPEAKER_02 (05:13):
There is a small side topic.

SPEAKER_01 (05:16):
Yeah, so um this whole this whole episode's
really gonna start off uh withaccountability and being
genuine.
Authenticity.
Thank you, that's it.
I couldn't think of the word.
Authenticity.
So here we go with that.
So this call this idea,honestly, I mean, it's been a
thing.

(05:36):
Obviously, we're about on beatthe mental health out of it.
I'm certainly about that in myum side content, even in my
drumming content.
Um, I I apply it to damn neareverything in my life that I
can.
Um I I believe in 100%authenticity, and that goes down
to my personal relationships.

(05:57):
Um I I don't like fake.
Um, I'd rather have truth thatis is hard to take than um than
uh anything fake.
I don't want I don't want mywife faking OGs, you know.

SPEAKER_02 (06:11):
Um There's not enough time, not enough time in
the day to have to weed throughanything that is just totally
just blue past that.

SPEAKER_01 (06:23):
Yeah, nope, I am not digging in on your wife's OGs.
No, that I'm sorry, Katie.
I'm sorry.
I'm serious though.
That's not even a personalthing.
It's it's like I don't likeingenuine in anything.
That was just a really goodexample.
Yep.
And I think that's an insecuritymany men have anyways.
But we're not getting on that.

(06:43):
That's next episode.
Oh, yeah.
We're doing an episode on menlater.
So anyway, the importance ofauthenticity and what kind of
spurred this really me, withreally me wanting to dig in so
heavy to it, is there's acontent creator that him and I
absolutely adore.

SPEAKER_02 (07:01):
Fell in love with, quite honestly, yeah, from the
inception of her channel.

SPEAKER_01 (07:05):
Yeah, and we're not gonna name drop her because it's
not really about actually, it'shonestly not about chastising
fellow mentally ill contentcreators.
Actually, I I'm a full believerthat being brave enough to put
our stories out there is kind ofa big deal.

SPEAKER_02 (07:21):
It it is encouragement with some
boundaries.

SPEAKER_01 (07:25):
This person was out there putting very vulnerable,
very honest, very genuinecontent out there, and she was
getting a ton of followers andlikes, and people were really
resonating, including us.
And extreme awareness.

SPEAKER_02 (07:39):
Extreme awareness, actually, which was the
authentic piece, and that's thepart that really resonated with,
I think, both of us.

SPEAKER_01 (07:49):
She had amazing content, and she started really
breaking down in her content.
Like clearly, something happenedin her life, and she spiraled.
It got to the point where itwasn't about supporting her
community, it got about how shewas essentially blaming her
community in many ways for notsupporting her.

(08:10):
Am I right on that?

SPEAKER_02 (08:12):
I mean, I I the I guess the part that I'm I I want
it to be less about the personand really more about the
actions that we want.
Yeah, I just don't I don't wantto keep calling it out as much.
For me, it I don't want to domore harm by using the example.

(08:37):
Um ultimately there wereattempts to you know try to lend
support, but also hey, this isthe the route at the moment, not
your best look, and probablycounterproductive to the message

(09:00):
you hooked all of thesefollowers with.
Um and I think if we can look atit in a more general sense to
bring up your topic, mentalillness itself, you know, this
is one example.
But there, I mean, ooh.
And I will say we've had our ownspiral outs over here, but we

(09:26):
but we've stepped away from themic and the camera.
That's exactly it.
And you know, it's it's okay tocome and talk about it post or
even talk about whatsymptomology there is, or even
your personal experiences in.
Right.
But when you are in the middleof an actual crisis, flare-up,

(09:48):
whatever you want to call it,the thing that you most need to
do is uh actually one of thethings that we started this
channel for.
You need to lean on yourcommunity and you need to step
away from the forefront for justa moment.
Right.
My good friend, uh Oh my Nick,is going to that was really

(10:12):
poorly done.
Yeah, that was not nearly notreally.
But you you have some thoughtson this.
That as creators with mentalhealth diagnoses, you have some
thoughts on that.
So I'm gonna turn it back overto you and and try and set us on
the back.

SPEAKER_01 (10:31):
I want to say thank you for actually commandeering
that.
And I was not trying to dawk herpersonally, no, but I'm glad you
commandeered that and put it inthe words you did because that
sounded much better.
I was coming off pretty damnintense about it, and that's not
fair.
So but it's authentic.
But it's authentic, so intense,yeah, by default.
And we're gonna get into why ina minute.

(10:53):
So I you know, I I subscribe toquite a few mental health
content, mental illness.
I want to stay, well, I want tostick mainly to mentally ill
content creators.
So those of us who are actuallymentally ill creating content, I
think that is a stark differencebetween that and just therapist

(11:13):
creating content or things likethat.
We have the experience of havingit.
So here's my thing, and I'mgonna name drop this person,
Michelle Hammer.
Had to drop the hammer, right?
Ah, that was a good one.
Um anyway.
Do it when they're not looking.
I'm just kidding.
Don't let the voices tell younot.
Okay, so anyway, one thing Ilove about what she does is she

(11:36):
will put videos of herself incrisis.
So she films her episodes ofpsychosis.
Okay.
However, she posts those andthen she dissects later, which I
love.
So smart.
She posts the episode, but she'snot trying to really talk about
it in those moments.
It's more about here's whathappened, I'm gonna show you

(11:58):
what happened.
Let me talk about it when I'm inthe right mindset.
So, unfortunately, this contentcareer we were talking about
kind of ostracized her communityand even by default severed
herself from it.
That's hard.
I mean, here's the thing um I'vedone a few videos on my TikTok
that ultimately I've pulled alot of them because I want to do
more clarity and things likethat.

(12:19):
I did some where I really rantedand got really heated and said
some pretty outlandish things.
I'm not proud of those videos.
Um, you know, I'm all aboutauthenticity and like, hey, this
is this side of it, this is thatside of it.
However, when we're puttingthose kind of videos out there,
I think we're tainting the verymessage we're trying to put out

(12:40):
there in many ways.
Um and if I may, go ahead, alittle caveat there.

SPEAKER_02 (12:47):
If indeed you do find yourself a creator with a
diagnosis, you put something outthere that you can't stand
behind once you have come out ofcrisis, take it down.
Well, take it down, but also thething you just did.
Accountability.

(13:07):
That's been a big thing for youall along.
Yep.
You cannot use an excuse.
Yeah, you maybe you have adiagnosis, maybe you have
situations that happen, but ownthem.
Own them and understand how notonly do they affect your life,
but the people around you, andthat ownership, quite honestly,

(13:30):
will never leave you withoutsupport.
We'll never leave you without agrowth.
And I also want to throw outthat this particular person that
we are not targeting but areusing as an example.
Know that if you were to listento this and you were to want to
speak, know that you would havetwo supporters.

SPEAKER_01 (13:52):
It is not us backing away from it in any way, shape,
or form.
No, absolutely not.
And I really feel horrible thatyou're going through what you're
going through.
I I don't know if you'rewatching this or not.
I know you were curious aboutappearing on it at one point,
and you are still very welcome.
When when your mental healthgets back to where it's
manageable for you, please joinus.
If you never want to join us,that's okay too.

(14:14):
Nobody is required to even putthis out there.
We're not talking about bottomhooy.
We're talking about you're notrequired, anybody, mentally ill
or any sort of content creator,is not required to put any part
of their life out there.
That's the segue.
So those of us who are willingto put this out there, such as
myself, Michelle Hammer, andthis other woman we're

(14:35):
mentioning, is you put this outthere, it's personal stuff, and
it's stuff that ismisunderstood.
It is things that areuncomfortable, often
controversial, and verydifficult to share.
So if you put something outthere, you're going to get a
shit ton of backlash.
You're going to get a shit tonof judgment.

(14:56):
Um, so I put a video out thereabout suicide, and somebody
literally commented, whichstarted a whole plethora of
comments.
This video has like 4,000 views,which isn't that many.
But I think 300 comments inthis.
Like, what's the percentagethere?
Pretty damn big for like aconversation.

(15:16):
I wish this blew up.
That's good engagement.
Yeah.
That's good engagement.
So what's interesting is I putthis up there, and this person
basically said, you know, well,if you did if you didn't succeed
after three times, you must nothave really wanted to die.
And I literally posted a videojust to myself laughing my ass
off at it, which was genuine,because I was like, wow, that's

(15:37):
fucking funny.
And I said, Guess I'm a moronthen.
So that was my approach tocountering this person's
comment.
So what happened is I post thatreaction video, and people start
flooding in on both sides,mostly on my side that, hey,
this is serious.
And I encourage you guys toactually watch that, snip it,

(15:58):
and then look at the comments.
There's some legit conversationsin there.
So what I'm getting at with thatis that was something very
vulnerable that I put out there.
But I'm in a mental place whereI can take people coming in and
say, well, why don't you justfinish the job and shit like
that?
Okay.
I don't care.
If I'm gonna off myself, it'ssure it's gonna be from some
asshole in the internet.
Okay.
Like it's just not gonna happen.

(16:19):
I mean, it's gonna be from myown head, if anything else.
So nobody out there is gonnaconvince me other than myself.
There's a strength in that, Iguess.
But what I'm getting at isthere's plenty of people out
there that are not in thatheadspace who haven't been
through those ideations like Ihave, that if they heard that,
that might be enough to get themto do it.
Okay.

(16:39):
So when those people made thosecomments, what I chose to do is
be very passive aggressive, butalso at the same time.

SPEAKER_00 (16:47):
What?

SPEAKER_01 (16:47):
You I was very passive aggressive, but I was
trying not to attack, and Idon't think I really did
anybody.
No.
But what I did you ended upinviting him?
That well, multiple.
But one of my favorites, becauseI do have to cite this, the guy
gets on there and he says, Gosh,my feed's been blowing up with
this damn mental illnesscontent.
I just had to comment on thisbecause I'm tired of seeing it.
That was bit that was the gistof what he said.

(17:10):
And I got on there and I said,Well, buddy, if your if your
algorithm is blowing you up withmental illness content or mental
health content, sounds likeyou're probably watching that a
lot.
And I literally just kind ofcaveated into, or whatever the
word is, I think that's it.
I don't know.
We're not bottom dictionary.
Um but I literally just wentinto from that, I'm like, hey,

(17:31):
if you're struggling, don'tjudge this shit.
Join the struggle bus.
Like that's what it's for.
We're there, it's a communityfor people to get on there and
share their experiences and talkabout it with people who are
also struggling.
So here's the thing.
That's do you have anything youwant to add to that for a segue?
Okay.
So I'm gonna segue from thatinto our struggle bus has 12

(17:54):
members beside me.
Not very many.
Um, and we went through periodsof being incredibly active.
There's also periods wherenobody's contributing at all,
which is fine.
There was a period on therewhere I was like getting pissed
off at the struggle buspassengers.
I'm like, hey, what the fuck?
Like, we're not struggle bussupposed to be talking about
talking about talking, and Iwould like post like questions

(18:16):
and like things leading on tonobody would contribute.
So there was a little hurt therefor a while, but then I realized
that's not what the struggle busis about.
It's when people need to hop onand then they can join in the
conversation when they need thesupport.
It's not really about randomconversation to me.
It can be, but the main idea ishop on the bus when you need

(18:36):
some support.
So that was my I had to adjustmy thinking on that.
Um We're all too mentallyhealthy at the moment.
We're all too fucking well off,damn it.
But what I'm gonna get at isagain, we have over now we have
over 70,000 weekly listeners, 12members of the struggle bus,
plus your captain here.

(18:57):
What is interesting about thatto me is everyone is so
comfortable, which is great.
I'm not unhappy with how manylisteners we have.
That's wonderful.
But nobody's wanting to join inon a conversation about it.
I've really been thinking aboutthat.

SPEAKER_03 (19:15):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (19:15):
There's no judgment here.
There's no like fuck you guysfor not joining in.
It's not about that.
No, I'm really thinking aboutwhy.

SPEAKER_02 (19:22):
That is the point, though.
That is, we are creating acommunity more so than just
sitting in here blabbing to eachother on a weekly basis.
The idea is to really truly openthose doors, get the
conversation started.
Uh, what is it, smash thestigma, whatever the stigma?
Whatever the taglines are, youknow.

SPEAKER_01 (19:43):
That's a pretty common one these days.

SPEAKER_02 (19:44):
We don't really give a shit about taglines, really
what we give a shit about.
And it feeds into thisauthenticity piece is that yeah,
having the struggle bus isgreat.
It's, you know, we've done somedumb shit on there.
We've talked about some reallyinteresting and deep things.

SPEAKER_01 (20:02):
Uh but it's that level range of topics.

SPEAKER_02 (20:05):
But but this whole thing, this whole podcast thing
is all well and good, and it'slovely that the people are
listening.
I'm so so excited this thingyou've created is uh turning
into the monster it needs to be.
Uh but for it to be a useful.
Monster, we need to have thatengagement.

(20:27):
Right.
The whole conversation shouldlead back to all of us, you
know, and that's on the strugglebus.
It doesn't have to be youtalking to us.
It could be you talking to afellow survivor, a you know,
somebody who can you know putsome real insight into a
conversation because they'veexperienced firsthand what
you've experienced.
Right.

(20:47):
So that's what we're hoping for.

SPEAKER_01 (20:49):
I think that's exactly some patience is and you
know what I've actually adoptedthat that's I've adopted that is
gonna be the approach.
And honestly, I'm starting toreally get pumped about doing
this podcast again to kind of goback a little bit to you know,
taking breaks.
We've taken breaks from thispodcast.
I mean, we've recorded severalin a row just so that when we

(21:11):
get our fucked up lives going,we have some backlog of things
to release.
We've gone weeks withoutrecording an episode.
So what's it been three?
Almost a month now.
About a month until you and I'vedone one.
I've done a couple interviewssince.
But like I said, I mean, we areeven like, hey, right now we're
not in the mindset to even coverthings from any sort of And

(21:33):
that's that's stepping awaypiece.

SPEAKER_02 (21:35):
If if if you are feeling stressors, if you are
starting to automate yourself,you know, you when you automate
is when you're starting to, youknow, hit hit your fight or
flight or spiral or you know,hit major symptoms.
Um it's time.
You you have to step away whenit starts feeling too automatic.

(21:58):
Right.
You really truly do need to keepyour awareness up.
I I mean, regardless of what thediagnosis is, you you do have to
have an awareness.
And and you know, we've had thatconversation about masking.
Right.
You you mask so that you fit inin public.
And yeah, we'd love to have tohave a world where no one has to

(22:18):
mask.
However, masking is actually areally good barometer of how
you're doing.
Because when you start feelingyour mask cracking, it might be
time to go home and check it forjust a second, you know?
Go get close to your supportssystem and really check in.

SPEAKER_01 (22:35):
Yes, absolutely.
Yeah, that's that's a goodthing.
Because um I went through aperiod um where, yeah, I mean,
it was like I couldn'tcontribute to this project
because I take care of myself.
You know, it was getting to thepoint where I had to focus, you
know, okay, I'm gonna be blunt.
There was a point where I waslike, fuck this podcast, fuck

(22:58):
the community, I gotta take careof myself.
And that's just being honest.
There is a point where it's justlike I can't do this for
everyone else.
I gotta take care of this guy.
And that's important.
And there's a big thing of inorder to take care of other
people or help others, you haveto start at home.
So you do this all plays intothat.
And like I said, mental illnesscontent creators have a bit of a

(23:21):
different responsibility thanothers because of that, uh, or
all of that in general.
I mean, here's the big topic,folks.
It's one of them.
But for now, let's focus on sothe the weight that uh or the
responsibility okay, weight andresponsibility that those of us
who create mental illnesscontent that are mentally ill

(23:42):
have.
So, what I like to think aboutthat is again the genuine side
of it.
As we all know, mental illness,the whole point of this podcast
and so much other content aroundthis is to educate, to show the
experience, to be vulnerable,the dark and the light sides of
it, all of it.
Again, full encompassing allthat.

SPEAKER_02 (24:00):
And who better to lead those of us who don't
experience through theexperience?

SPEAKER_01 (24:06):
Right.
And I'm this is anybody.
Yes.
So I like to be one of the oneof the contributors.
And I don't consider myself thebest or the only.
So, you know, for one thing,okay, I have to stay on this
trade for a minute.
Okay.
The reason I don't lean muchinto TikTok content isn't too
damn long-winded.
So TikTok limits your videos to15 minutes, and I'm just like, I
don't know how to cover thisdeep freaking You can barely

(24:28):
finish a sentence.
I can barely finish a sentencein 15 minutes.
Um, so it's just like that'sjust not gonna be my thing.

SPEAKER_02 (24:35):
I mean, after all, it's not just him talking, so
never mind.

SPEAKER_01 (24:41):
I'm in a padded cell right now, bro.
This is all this is my fantasy.
You ever thought about that?
Oh, this is the figment offantasy.
That's always been a that'salways been a joke I've had with
like people I know.
If they're like they're talkingto me and I want to be as smart
as I'm like, Well, who are youtalking to?
Like, you're in a padded cellright now, bro.
Like, I'm a figment of yourimagination.
You are horn dog for this sortof thing.

(25:03):
This is your dream right here.
This is I don't know, it's notthat funny.
Anyway.
Mass gaslighting.

SPEAKER_02 (25:09):
I love it.

SPEAKER_01 (25:10):
Don't ever gaslight the mentally ill, Christ
almighty, because I'm serious.
We're already I'm I'm deadserious.
When I'm feeling mentallytop-notch, I can but so easily
be fucking gaslit.
Light my ass on fire that easy.
Like, don't fucking gaslightpeople who are mentally ill.

(25:31):
We're already struggling withparanoia and psychosis and
delusional bullshit.

SPEAKER_02 (25:37):
Like from your authentic self, right?
Let's bring it back to theauthentic self.
You were speaking on how whensomeone has a diagnosis and they
want to create content and theywant to bring it to the masses,
you're looking at me like, Iknow what you're doing, bro.
Yes, you do.
Because this is my job.
Um, so you were explaining thatcontent creators who have a

(25:58):
diagnosis, who really want toshed light on that diagnosis,
bear a slightly heavierresponsibility than just Joe
Schmoke content creator.
Why is that, sir?
Please help me.

SPEAKER_01 (26:12):
I was really gonna get more on gaslighting.
Oh no, I was kidding.
I said everything.
So there is a reason for thatgoing on right now.
There's probably I'm beinggaslit right now, I think.
Oh, you are okay.
I didn't know what you're doingthere.
No?
Who's gaslighting?
God damn it.

(26:33):
Jesus.

SPEAKER_00 (26:35):
Jesus Nick.
Nick cries.
Your man's planning turns me on.

SPEAKER_01 (26:41):
The reason we I think we bear a different
responsibility and weight outthere is because this is
something that is misunderstood,is judged, is discriminated, all
of the above.
Already.
Already.
And the big one is inaccurate ormanipulative, or the concept

(27:02):
that we are doing this merelyfor attention, which plays into
manipulation to me, becausethat's a big thing that's going
around right now.
Honestly, I'm gonna name dropMichelle Hammer again because
she just did a little short onTikTok about people doing that,
saying that, oh, mental illnesscontent creators are just out
there trying to get attention.
Let me tell you, that's fuckingbullshit.

(27:22):
Because this isn't this isn'tsomething I enjoy doing to an
extent.
I would love to just get on hereand call people out on bullshit,
talk about movies, and leave itkind of at that service level.
It's not like digging into thedepths of my fucking.

SPEAKER_02 (27:39):
And he would do that if I wasn't here.

SPEAKER_01 (27:40):
So I mean I'd be I serve a purpose.
I wouldn't know if he was hereor not.
I don't know if he's here now.
You guys see him?
Of your imagining.
You guys see him, right?
What if I was just talking andlike pausing and thinking that'd
always be a funny episode.
I was like talking, like, whatdo you think, Tony?
Yeah.
You see, I agree with that, andyou're just not saying a damn

(28:02):
thing.
It's gotta be a thing we do.
Yep, we should do it.
Um, but because of that, shedropped this, you know, did this
video that quit saying thatwe're out there doing it for
attention because the fact is,this is not easy to do.
It's not comfortable.
Admittedly, I think I can throwmy thing in here that I'm much
more comfortable doing this thana lot.

(28:24):
I get a catharsis out of rantingto you, people.
I get a catharsis out of holdingpeople accountable, including
myself, and trying to changethis climate that we're in when
regarding the stigma.
And you know, I we have adifferent responsibility because
of that.
Because if we misrepresent thisor we taint it or we confirm

(28:46):
what they already believe,confirm what you guys already
believe that is not true, thenwe're doing the whole community
a complete disservice.
We're we're uh contributing tothe stigma we're trying to
smash.
And what good is that doingnone?
So we do have a differentresponsibility than a lot of
others.
Content creators can influence alot, and that's one of the

(29:10):
beautiful things about TikTok.
That's also one of the worstthings.

SPEAKER_02 (29:14):
Um is that why they're called influencers?
Sorry, I couldn't stop thevoices in my head on that one.

SPEAKER_01 (29:20):
Welcome to the party.
Yeah.
So I think we have to be verycareful.
And that's why, you know, whenI've done some videos I'm not
crazy about, I do pull them.
And it might be a while beforeI'm like, okay, that needs to
come down.
But you know what?
I've also put some videos outthere that has created some
controversy.
And it's not solely aboutcreating controversy, even

(29:42):
though controversy gets youviews and all that.
It is making peopleuncomfortable with the truth.
Kind of like the shadow selfidea.
Um, there is a lot of discomfortin the honesty.
Um, being truthful is hard,period.
Um, it's so much easier to lieyour way around things, go
around and around it.

(30:02):
But I like to go through.
So not always successful, butI'm pretty good at it.
But I do think there's a powerin that, too, to be able to just
go at something, whether it'sthis content, whether it's
things in life, period.
So that's kind of theauthenticity piece of things.

SPEAKER_02 (30:19):
Anything you want to add to that before we No, I
mean, I think for the most partyou outlined it pretty well.
And it's not trying to come downon creators with the.
We're not here to come down onyou.
No.
We're here to SNL.

SPEAKER_01 (30:36):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (30:37):
Oh, I thought.
Never mind.
Thought we were soaking corks.
Um That's another SNL, by theway.
Oh, that is, yeah, I know.
Yeah, okay.
I like mine better.
Do you?
You don't like soak?
That was the Soaking Corks?

SPEAKER_01 (30:51):
That was pretty good.
I was doing the Matt Foley.
Huh?
That was the Matt Foley one.

SPEAKER_02 (30:56):
Did Matt Foley soak corks?
No.

SPEAKER_01 (30:59):
Didn't I even just say it with it?
Soak corks?
What?
Soak?
I know it's fucking great.

SPEAKER_02 (31:08):
But have have you ever planned a weekend of
soaking corks?

SPEAKER_01 (31:14):
We're not gonna do this.
Watch the damn SNL skin.
Christ almighty.
They do it better, but it'salways better.

SPEAKER_02 (31:19):
No, um, with the responsibility thing, it's
really more about hey, as acommunity, let's let's agree
that we really don't want to setourselves or anyone else back
because we're not truly seeingthat responsibility when when we
lose sight of things.

(31:40):
And I can only speculate on whathappens to people when that sort
of thing happens online.
Ms.
Hammer uh posts when she's inthose situations.
It's it's a great thing toeducate with here's what it
looks like, here's theexperience, here is and if I'll
take it all back, if if that'swhat this other creator is

(32:03):
doing, and she's gonna go, ah,gotcha bitches, on the other
side of it and say, Look, I wasshowing you what it looks like.
Very well, maybe she's veryintelligent, yeah, very on top
of what she's doing.

SPEAKER_01 (32:14):
But I And you know, we'll hold ourselves accountable
for being fucking wrong andstupid and ignorant.

SPEAKER_02 (32:19):
I'll be the first one to step up and say, haha,
you got me.
But um, if anything, brilliantcreator, nonetheless.
But that responsibility ofmaking sure it's clear to those
who don't have that diagnosis,who who haven't experienced
that, but to not characterizewhat it looks like because there

(32:41):
are people, I mean, I know mypersonal experience with BPD,
and I'm watching so much of thesame thing I experienced.
And not to, you know, I'm nottrying to sit here and say, oh,
I'm so traumatized, but itgenuinely brought up memories
for me.
Seeing, I mean, yeah, you know,you saw me.
I was there.

(33:02):
It took a year to even bounceback to be human.

SPEAKER_01 (33:04):
Yeah, it did.
And it's still many years later,still minutes of it.

SPEAKER_02 (33:09):
It it is it is an issue.
But just anyone who hasdiagnosis and you want to create
and you want to get that messageout there, we are all about
supporting you.
Absolutely.
You know what?
We should have a bunch ofcontent creators.
We should reach out and say,Hey, the struggle bus is yours.
The struggle bus is yours.

SPEAKER_01 (33:31):
Like drop it in yours.
I worked share the bus.
Yeah, let's all captains.
We'll start the bus routes.
Um but you were so good at thefreaking metaphors with the
struggle bus, like thepassengers and the bus stops.
Metaphors.

SPEAKER_02 (33:47):
But that responsibility piece, it's less
about, you know, uh, we'rewashing you, but more about,
hey, watch yourself.
Yeah.
Make sure that you don't step onyour own Your own message.
Yeah.
I like that better than the wordI had in mind.
What were you thinking?
Well, it's a it's a phrase.
Well, what is it?
It's just you know, don't stepon your dick.

SPEAKER_01 (34:08):
Never heard that one.
Really?

unknown (34:10):
No.

SPEAKER_01 (34:11):
Oh.
Is your dick big enough to stepon it?
Yours isn't?
No.
Not erect, not soft, none of it.
Maybe.

SPEAKER_02 (34:20):
Um anyway.
Call that indie indie.
You were saying go get in yourpocket.
There's a reason it's Indiepocket.
Indie pocket.
Um, yeah.
God, now I is D is in Deegenuinely sound.
D is in the pocket.
No.
Literally now my fucking onlinetag nine tagline means penis

(34:44):
sheath.
I mean, I've been on that.
I've been saying that.

SPEAKER_01 (34:48):
Not that.
Oh, not to my face.
No, not that poet.
Fucker, we can't be friends now.
Watch my content.
I've been doing videos.
Watch my content.
I've been blocking your blockingyou from those videos.
Hey, you heard this in the dickpic gang?
This in the dick pic.

SPEAKER_02 (35:00):
Anyway.
So, yes, the responsibilitypiece is really, you know, just
like don't get in your own way.
Do the best you can.
If you're gonna document it,cool.
Document it, set it to the side,and wait for yourself to get
through the flare up.
That's a good thing.

SPEAKER_01 (35:17):
So you can analyze.
The one thing I want to add tothe authenticity piece and the
content you're creating andthings like that is I saw this
um, I don't know if this is onReddit or fake.
I don't know where the hell Isaw this.
Maybe I'm imagining it because Ithink it's pretty genius, and I
came up with it.
You know what?
Okay, you know what?
That's a segue that I want.
I didn't mean to go into this,but this is what we do.
You notice how people all thetime say, like, if they have a

(35:40):
point they want to make.
It's like, well, a lot of peoplesay, no, you're the only one
saying that.
You have to validate youropinion by saying a lot of
people say that.
Do you ever do that?

SPEAKER_02 (35:51):
Well, I think you just said that I did with the
whole don't step on your dickthing, but I know it's a phrase,
but we're gonna make it a phraseif it's not true.
Well, maybe.

SPEAKER_01 (35:58):
But what I was getting at is like, I'm guilty
of that too.
And the other thing I've beenknown to do is like say, if I if
I think my point won't be validto somebody or it won't mean
something coming from me, I'llsay, oh, this person said that.

SPEAKER_02 (36:11):
But everybody thinks everybody says that.

SPEAKER_01 (36:13):
Yeah.
But it's even more than that.
It's like, I heard uh I've hearda lot of people say that lately.
It's like, why do we have to dothat?

SPEAKER_02 (36:21):
Don't feel like your argument's strong enough or
don't have enough.

SPEAKER_01 (36:25):
Or your person as a self, yeah.
It's like I've been guilty ofthat.
I don't do that near as much asI used to, but I used to that
all the time.
I mean, certain people I talk towho I very much honor and
remire, admire and respect, it'slike, ah, they don't they don't
respect me in the same way.
So I gotta say, even though it'sfully my opinion, and maybe even
something I legitimatelyobserved, but they don't

(36:47):
consider me an expert orintelligent or whatever in that
in that topic.
It's like, well, this personsaid that, and then they're
like, oh, well, if he said it orshe said it, then it must be
right, you know.
Authenticity still plays intothat.
A bit off of a segue.
Okay.
No, that's something I reallystruggle with.
I'm tired of people doing that.

(37:09):
Okay.
It's like, hey, this is what Ibelieve.
I don't care if I'm the only oneon the fucking face of the
universe that says it.
I mean your opinions are valid.
Period.

SPEAKER_02 (37:19):
Your opinion can be wrong as all hell, but still
valid.
That part's true.
Opinions are not fact.
No, they're like assholes.
Everybody's got one.
And they stink.
And they may stink.
Have you not heard of that part?
No.
You've never heard that's thepart of it.
You're making that up.

SPEAKER_01 (37:35):
No, somebody told me that.
Well, somebody did actually.
I mean, I didn't create theidea.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I mean, I wish I agreed withthat.

SPEAKER_02 (37:42):
We just finished that topic.
You can't go, you can't saythat.

SPEAKER_01 (37:46):
Never again.
You can't call it up and say,oh, well, so and so said.
I'm actually quite sure I didn'tcome up with that.
I wish I'd own it if I came upwith that.
That's the funny thing.
Anyway, I don't even rememberhow I was gonna.
Oh.
I don't know.
Oh, yeah, okay.
So since I can't chase you down,I don't know what to do.
Even I can't.
My voices are 10 feet ahead ofme.

SPEAKER_02 (38:06):
So they gotta be in stereo then, because they gotta
be 10 behind me.

SPEAKER_01 (38:10):
They totally are.
Really?
Surround sound, bro.
Noise.
Noise.
Very nice.
It's like a bow stereo system inmy fucking head.
Yeah! Woo! Oh, I did scream.
You're right.
We should have tested.
Oh no, we're good.
We already did it.
These are compression mics.
They're good.
Remember, we have to be able todo that.
They're beautiful.
Thank you.
To the benefactor who said Donot oh no, no, we're gonna do

(38:32):
the Elon thing, right?
Oh my god.

SPEAKER_02 (38:34):
Our heart goes out.

SPEAKER_01 (38:38):
Yep.

SPEAKER_02 (38:38):
I don't know why I did that.
Crass.
That's what we do, apparently.
Number 62.

SPEAKER_01 (38:46):
Oh, yeah.
I just got uh got an email todayto the company that manages our
podcast with us.
And they literally told us onApple Podcasts and Spotify, if
you search Twisted Humor andMusical Genius, we're in the
60s.
So when people search that,we're in the top 60 or in the
60s of search results in that.

(39:07):
You know what I didn't tell you?

SPEAKER_02 (39:09):
What?

SPEAKER_01 (39:09):
There's only 70 people that are included in the
70s.
We're actually non-existent inthe Iowa.
Are we still number one inFinland?
That's all I care about.
I never heard we were knockeddown to number two.
It's a heavy market.
I didn't hear that uh you knowtheir death metal contests were
killing off all of ourlisteners.

(39:31):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (39:32):
Listeners, mass suicide now.
Well, we're we love you,Finland.
Get back to us.

SPEAKER_00 (39:38):
Finland.

SPEAKER_02 (39:40):
Uh oh.

SPEAKER_01 (39:43):
I was really on to something there.
Oh backtracking tangent.
Backtrack.
Backtrack?
Backtrack my tangent because itwas going the tangent was going
somewhere.

SPEAKER_02 (39:52):
Well, it was the last thing you were really truly
talking about was how peoplearen't um secure enough in their
own statements that they feellike they have to back it up by
saying so.
That was part of the tangent.
No.

SPEAKER_01 (40:03):
But that didn't lead me back to where I was.
Fair enough, as long as I gotyou there.
But so I love getting there.
It's important that I get there.
It is.
It's not it's not as fulfillingif you don't get there.

SPEAKER_02 (40:16):
I mean, they do say it is about the journey, but
every now and then I want tofinish.

SPEAKER_01 (40:21):
I'd love to get to the destination.
Every now and then.
I mean, at least every now andthen.
Yep.
We're talking about life.
Like the song The Gambler byKenny Rogers is not about life.
It's literally about gambling.
Okay.
So that didn't make any sense.
Ruined that song for everyone.
Did you know that was aboutgambling and not life?

(40:44):
So I want to get back towhatever article I'm imagining
that I read.

unknown (40:48):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (40:48):
But it was a thing.
Somebody else said this.
God damn it.
See, this is inauthentic.
This is inauthenticity.
In this thing, they were talkingabout how this person had
committed suicide.
So now we're getting serial.
Okay.
Serial.

(41:09):
Like man bear pig.
Yep.
Being serial, no one take meserial.
No.
So someone had killedthemselves, and this person was
really insightful statement Ihadn't really thought of is, you
know, this person's self-harmed.
Now we touched on this, but I'mgoing to take it.
Yeah, we've touched on it.

unknown (41:26):
God damn it.

SPEAKER_01 (41:27):
And we're going to take it further.
So this person, you know, saidthat this person killed
themselves, but it was it wasn'tonly self-harm, it was harming
everyone around them.
So we've talked about that.

SPEAKER_02 (41:38):
And it kind of is how suicide impacts more than
just the deceased.
Yes.
Okay.
But here's the thing.
I follow.

SPEAKER_01 (41:45):
I was good.
Good.
I know that's difficult for me.
No, you're actually the onewho's on top of following me
before I get there.
Short bus, not struggle bus forme.
Short bus.
Let's get to the destination,Nick.
Too many stops.
Oh my gosh, that's a good one.
Too many stops on the strugglebus.

(42:06):
Let's fucking get there.
We got so many t-shirt ideas.
Okay.
If we can figure out how to dosome merch.
So she was saying, you know,self-harm actually is harming
everyone else.
So I kind of thought about that,really pondered that for a bit,
like five minutes tops.
And now I'm just throwing it outthere for y'all.

(42:29):
Um, no, I really pondered thatand I'm thinking, I think about
everything that is self-harmingharms others, and vice versa.

(42:52):
But what I'm thinking like isokay, so you're you're harming
yourself.
Let's not even take it as far assuicide.
You're harming yourself.
Like when I used to beat myselfin the head with baseball bats
when I was coping.
A long time ago.
Um swinging the miss.
Yes.

(43:12):
I have several concussions.
I do.
It's it's a fact.

SPEAKER_00 (43:16):
I believe it.

SPEAKER_01 (43:16):
So, you know, I used to do that, and of course, uh,
my family didn't even know I wasdoing that at the time.
What does that end up doing?
You know, and it's ends upspiraling, and it's all this
craziness.
Who that ended up hurting?
Not only myself, but literallymy family who had sacrificed so
much to make sure I was secureand safe and all that.

(43:37):
Okay.
So I think that is a case wherein that moment I felt like,
well, I'm only hurting myself.
It's not about everyone else,it's about, no, I'm I'm hurting
myself.
But it was in that mindset, itwas about taking the pain away,
because the whole point of notsupporting this, but the whole
idea of when you when you harmyourself is to distract yourself

(43:58):
from the mental pain and focuson physical pain, which is often
way easier to deal with thanmental pain.
Which is my perspective.
You got somewhere you want totake this?

SPEAKER_02 (44:10):
No, I'm trying, I'm wondering if you're going where
I'm at.
Probably not.
Well, that is how our brainswork.

SPEAKER_01 (44:16):
So with that, um, by the way, I I do want to offer
this really quick.
I did a video on this a longtime.

SPEAKER_02 (44:24):
So many stops.
So many stops.

SPEAKER_01 (44:26):
This is a legit stop.
This is a this is a stop at theat the at the at the doctor.
There's a reason to call this.
This is a doctor's stop.

SPEAKER_03 (44:34):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (44:35):
So keep your thought though.
Like you gotta write it down orsomething.
One thing I do I really like toshare is healthy ways of
distracting yourself physically.
I can see you on the camera.
I'm talking to the people andyou're looking at me.

SPEAKER_02 (44:48):
I'm trying not to say the thoughts.
No, but that's what we do.
No, you said write it.
And like keep your thoughts onthe start writing it on your
code.
Okay.
That's gross.
Moving.
On.

SPEAKER_01 (45:01):
Okay, so I was gonna get into actual there are
healthy ways of distractingyourself physically.
Have we found any yet?
Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (45:09):
Okay, good.

SPEAKER_01 (45:10):
I would say I'd know them.
Actually, shit.
Nope, no more tangents.
Fuck that.
We're gonna stay on this.
I had another one.
Fuck that.
Okay.
Sorry.
Boy, I've got so much I wannasay.
So much I want to say to thesepeople in one episode.

SPEAKER_02 (45:27):
Yelling at me and the voices.
That's a new low.

unknown (45:31):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (45:32):
Hit a new low, something ducks in a row.
Um, but there are healthy waysof distracting yourself through
physical discomfort that I'veeven discovered.
Cold showers is a good one.
Cool.
Not hot showers, because thatcan actually burn you.

(45:53):
Cold showers is actually a one.
And if you're if you're havingtroubles with a four-hour long
erection, that's also a goodremedy.
Um, hop in a cold shower.
Two birds with one stone.
Two.
Or you could just have Tonyinterrupt you while you're

(46:13):
jacking it to art the clown.
That works too.
I mean, I lost my erectionimmediately.

SPEAKER_02 (46:17):
I'm good for that.
You know how many times I'veheard that in my life.
Just kidding.
I'm so sorry.
Masturbating in a mirror once,and I lost my own erection.

SPEAKER_01 (46:30):
That's why I avoid mirrors.
Yeah.
Automatic turnoff or something.

SPEAKER_02 (46:34):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (46:35):
So it can be a healthy way of causing yourself
physical discomfort.
Of course, you know the otherbig one is exercise.
I mean, if you you do that, Iknow that's been a big one for
you.
You lift weights till you'refucking burning.
You run till you're burning.
The I'm telling you, when I usedto run back in the day, uh, that

(46:57):
gets so damn uncomfortable,you're not thinking about a lot
of your mental struggles.
Plus, you get the endorphinsreleased from exercising and
things like that.
Saves you so much money ontherapy.
Yeah, don't even go to therapy.
Just go run a mile.

SPEAKER_02 (47:10):
Not what we're saying.

SPEAKER_01 (47:11):
Oh, I'm sorry.
Okay.
I'm so sorry.
Yeah.
Okay, obviously it's not whatwe're saying.
I'm clearly not running 10 milesa day.
I'm going to therapy weekly.
Fuck running.
There are people who run andthere are people who sit in a
therapist's office.
It's black and white like that.
Absolutely.
One or the other.
One or the other.
You either run or you sit onyour ass and talk to people.

(47:34):
There should be running therapy.
That is a thing, isn't it?
Like running and creep.

SPEAKER_02 (47:39):
Recreational therapy.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (47:43):
Anyway.

SPEAKER_02 (47:44):
You were one.

SPEAKER_01 (47:44):
Those are a couple of healthy ways of causing
yourself physical pain.

SPEAKER_02 (47:49):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (47:50):
That do not actually hurt you.

SPEAKER_02 (47:53):
Where are you gonna take this?
I was actually just gonna say itmight be a really healthy thing
for some people to chew on thisparticular nugget.
I like some nuggies.
Yeah, right.
Dippin' sauce.
It's all comes down to dippingsauce.
Um so you were saying somethingabout hitting yourself with a

(48:14):
bat, right?
Yeah.
Okay.
So you said that that actuallyhelped you manage the pain.
It alleviated the pain, sent itaway.
The mental pain.
Right.
But that was it away is thestrong way.
But that was the bigger of thetwo.

unknown (48:30):
Right.

SPEAKER_02 (48:30):
Yeah, oh yeah.
So the mental pain was thebigger.
Always has been for me.

SPEAKER_01 (48:34):
For me.

SPEAKER_02 (48:36):
Where did it go?

SPEAKER_01 (48:38):
Nowhere.
Didn't it?
Okay, I'm not falling, but I'mexcited to see where you're
going.
Rock hard right now.
You your skull or somethingelse?
Well, not my skull, because it'sfilled with fractures and
concussions.

unknown (48:57):
Okay.

SPEAKER_02 (48:58):
So no.
You're knocking that pain out ofyour head and it's landing
square on your family.
So much I guess I think I thinkI think it could be, you know,
the whole thing about energynever dissipates.
Right.
It only transfers and changesform, right?

(49:20):
Same thing with pain, I think.

SPEAKER_00 (49:22):
God, thank you for bringing it back.

SPEAKER_01 (49:24):
I forgot where the hell I was going.
I'm all over the place today.
So you said the pain that I feellike I'm causing only myself is
transferring elsewhere.
That's actually where I wasgoing with that.
So you got these people who werein so much pain, mass shootings
and stuff.
That person is in so much painthat they're alleviating it by

(49:46):
taking it out on the world.
Again, your pain, if you don'tmanage it and seek help from
others, you're going to hurtyourself and by proxy those
around you.
Whether you're simply cuttingyourself, whether it's banging
yourself in the head withbaseball bats, whether it's
planning in your basement how togo pull off a fucking whatever.

(50:06):
Those are not helpful situationsto anybody, including yourself.
When you're harming yourselfmentally, physically, you're
ultimately gonna harm thosearound you.
Is that insightful?
That's good.
That's a wrap, everybody.
Okay, let's really get down towhat you've all been.
You know what's funny isnobody's been listening to a

(50:28):
damn thing of any of that.
Probably not.
It's like, alright, get to thethat part.
Okay.
That part.
Okay, so this all don't let metalk the whole damn time.
It's gonna come out wrong.
Oliver.

SPEAKER_02 (50:45):
Okay.
Who's Oliver?
Is that our new post?

SPEAKER_01 (50:52):
We know Carl's doing things with Oliver.
Little Oliver.

SPEAKER_02 (50:58):
Oh, so it is kid fucking.

unknown (51:00):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (51:00):
Alright.
That's why we had to let Carlgo.
Segway.
That was a horrible segue.
I'm not proud of that.
Horrible.
Okay.
I think we should cut it inpost.

SPEAKER_01 (51:08):
Oliver! Carl, get Oliver's dick out of your mouth.
Oh, Jesus Christ.
Or vice versa, actually.
It'd be the other way.
Or maybe they like to switch.

SPEAKER_02 (51:18):
Nick Christ.
Nope.
Doesn't work.
Swallow.

SPEAKER_00 (51:28):
I didn't even mean that.
Damn it.
Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01 (51:33):
I wasn't even trying that.
Jeez.
It's like it's now it's there.
Subconsciously, I can't.
What is it, baby?
Spits of swallows.
Um Spitters are quick.
We really want to handle thisvery Jesus Christ.

(51:54):
Okay.
We're putting it off.
Yeah, we are.
And even I am now that it'sgetting to crunch time.
Okay.

unknown (52:00):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (52:01):
So we want to first preface this with saying we're
not encouraging anyone to go outthere and fuck children.
Don't even touch them.
Okay?
Don't do it at all.
So here's a concept that I cameup with, and Tony's helped me
honing it a lot to prepare foryou fine people.
I fleshed it out.

(52:23):
So I kind of came up with thisidea of the three E's.
Which one's right?
Oh, that one.
Right.
E.
East Side, West Side, GW side.
So that's a Frank Alley notejoke.
Okay.
So the three E's.
We have expression, exploration,and those two are together.

(52:46):
And then you have the separatethird E, which you don't want to
ever get to, which isexploitation.
Okay.
Follow me here.
If you've made it to that E,turn around and go back.
If you made it to the third E,you've gone too far.
You never, ever, ever hit thatthird E.
The third E in this example isfucking children.

(53:08):
Okay?
And it's a very, very boldexample.
And it's meant to be becauseit's meant to make you really
think.
And yeah, this is gonna bereally uncomfortable.
Honestly.
It's gonna be a mental curbstore.
It's a mental, yes, it is.
American History X.
We are gonna curb stores.
We're gonna bite the fuckingcurb.
Yep.
Here you go.
Okay.

(53:29):
And so here's the thing.
We all know pedophilia is a bigthing out there.
And I don't really want togenderize this, but a lot of
people have that desire.
That is part of the shadow self.
There is a good thing to simplyacknowledge that.
Okay.
Like we said in the episodebefore, acknowledge that side of

(53:52):
yourself.
Denying it's not healthy,exploiting it, that third E is
not, that is the end all be all,never get to.
But then you have the expressionand exploration side.
So I'm not also not saying youget out there on social media or
go to the fucking top of abuilding or a rally and say you

(54:14):
want to fuck kids.
You don't have to throw outthere on a megaphone what your
shadow self is.
Not what this is about.
This is self-acknowledgement.
Okay?
Shadow self is more aboutself-integration.
Integration, not about gettingthe message out.
You don't have to do that.
It can totally stay silentwithin you.
And you know what?
That's fine.

(54:34):
That is really what you need todo with it.
But where our our kind of ideacomes from healthy ways of
exploring the deepest sides ofyour shadow.

SPEAKER_02 (54:44):
Yep, and you're gonna go to the Mariana Trench
of uh shadows and discuss howyou feel like someone could use
your three E's concept withpedophilia.

SPEAKER_01 (55:00):
Okay.
Now, now that we've outlinedthat, this is the most
controversial yet common one Icould think of.
That's why I brought it up, andthis is gonna make a bunch of
you uncomfortable.
I might y'all might have y'allmight have shut it off at this
point.
But I hope you guys stuck aroundfor what we're trying to say.
There's a valuable statement.
So I think it's a prettypowerful one.

(55:20):
So with that desire, it is outthere, people have it.
And that's something worth justaccepting in yourself.
The other side of acceptancewith the shadow self, the idea
that you don't have to be okaywith someone else's things that
they're accepting in theirshadow.
You don't have to be okay withthat.
If you obviously, there's afundamental problem with

(55:43):
pedophilia.
And honestly, people whoprobably have that desire know
there's something wrong aboutit.
But it's a human side thatpeople do have that.
But you don't have to be okaywith other people's shadow self.
You don't have to be friendswith those people, but you can
just accept that they're humanon that level and that every
human has that shadow side.

(56:05):
There's other things that peoplehave in their shadows that
you're gonna be like, you don'thave to know that they do.
But it's like, oh, you knowwhat?
I feel that because I have thattoo.
You don't necessarily have toknow that, but just be aware
that we all have fucked updesires in the shadows.
Just accept that we all havesomething in there that's going
to make everyone elseuncomfortable.
And it might be a fundamentalthing that someone else couldn't

(56:26):
accept or understand or be okaywith.
It all comes down to acceptanceof being human.
The whole idea of how you wouldsafely explore pedophilia, and
this is hypothetical, this isuncomfortable.
I don't mind saying that.
So this is awkward for me, too.

SPEAKER_02 (56:43):
This is a very well, and and uh an exploration of
your shadow self should beuncomfortable within yourself.
Oh, absolutely as well, becauseyou're not being honest with
yourself if it's not right.
Here's my thoughts.
So this is simply an example,and he picked the most
outrageous, controversial,disgusting example so that it

(57:09):
would be to get your attention,and it'd be fucking clear
because it's honestly I thinkit's an easy one to see the
clarity of it.

SPEAKER_01 (57:16):
So we had a friend who's not getting a lot sexually
in their life, and they arereally into petite women.
So there's a big thing out therewith torsos, pocket pussy
torsos, love dolls, love dolls,okay.
Six dollars.
So, you know, and there was nopedophilia in mind here.

(57:38):
I'm gonna absolutely say that.
This person wasn't out therelooking for what they found.

SPEAKER_02 (57:43):
These are two separate situations, these are
completely two separate things,but when connecting these two
ideas, it fit his model.

SPEAKER_01 (57:51):
So stay with him.
So he went out looking, hesearched uh flat-chested sex
dolls and brought him to somesites, and he shared these sites
with me because it's veryuncomfortable.
These sites that haveflat-chested sex dolls, they're
not adult females with flatchests, they are children,

(58:13):
they're absolutely children.
You've also looked at it becauseI shared it with you.
Very uncomfortable.
These sex dolls are posed inlike children positions, they're
even like the size of them islike three or four feet.
If you look at like life-sizesex dolls, they're life size.
Okay, these are marketed as lifesize.

(58:35):
Okay, so clearly, like, we knowwhat this company is doing.
When he found that, was evendesperate to like, okay, let's
find like an adult version ofthis.
What'd he find one?
If that, and that wasquestionable.
Yeah.
I mean, we talked about thisforever, like the three of us
were shocked by this.

(58:55):
So it's just like, fuck.
Okay, so that spurred this idea.
Now, this is where I think thecontroversy hopefully gets
settled a little bit.
I hope.

SPEAKER_02 (59:06):
I hope so too.

SPEAKER_01 (59:08):
Again, we are not encouraging people to go out
there and actually fuck kids.
This is actually to helphopefully satisfy that fucked up
shadow side need.

SPEAKER_02 (59:17):
This is an example of how you might go about
getting that piece of yourselfmet if you feel like it is
something you cannot keepinside.

SPEAKER_01 (59:29):
So there's something too, there's a shadow side of
ourselves that we canacknowledge is there and be
like, okay, I acknowledge thatthat thought or that feeling or
that desire is there.
There's a difference when thatthought or feeling or desire is
so strong you have to exploreit.
Where it becomes that's where itbecomes a compulsion.

SPEAKER_02 (59:49):
You're right.

SPEAKER_01 (59:50):
So where it becomes something, okay, I have to do
this or it's gonna turn intoexploitation.
So that's what we're getting atwith this.
So if you struggle withpedophilia, my idea is get
yourself one of these sex dollsthat looks like a child.
Okay?
I know this is gonna be weirdhere, but here's my thought.

(01:00:11):
If you can fuck a sex doll thatlooks like a child, you're not
out there fucking a real child.
It expresses it expresses andsimulates, it allows you to
explore.
Safely.

SPEAKER_02 (01:00:24):
And you never get to exploit.

SPEAKER_01 (01:00:27):
Ever.
That's with any of thesecompulsive needs that are in
that shadow.
Okay.
It's just like you hear of GrandTheft Auto is not a bad example.
It's probably not quite ascontroversial, but things like
that.
But that was the whole point.
So Right.
That's the thing, is it canapply to a lot of things.

(01:00:47):
There is catharsis andexperiencing, and VR is becoming
a big thing.
I mean, oh, there's sex VR nowtoo.
So there are fantasies.
What?
What?
Oh, yeah.
I didn't know about that.
You didn't know about that.
No.
But that's the thing.
There are ways of exploringfantasies.
And some of these sexual VRs getvery kinky and very dark.

Here's the thing (01:01:07):
there are safe ways of exploring these
compulsive thoughts and I anddesires.
There are.

SPEAKER_03 (01:01:14):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:01:14):
So do that.
Rather than let the judgment ofnot being able to accept it
within yourself and the judgmentof safely exploring it fuck
everyone's judgment on that.
You feel how you feel you haveyour need.
Obviously, if you put out thereto anybody that, hey, I want to
fuck kids, nobody's going to belike, oh, that's alright.

(01:01:37):
We're good with that.
As long as you fuck a sex doll.
No, it's not about that.
You know what you feel.
You know what the compulsiveneed is.
That's a safe outlet.
So I know that's a really roughtopic.
And that's why I picked thatone.
Um, and I cleared this by himand even my wife to kind of get

(01:01:59):
a real clarity on how toapproach this.
It's meant to be uncomfortable.
It's meant to be uncomfortable,but the shadow self is
uncomfortable.
Right.
And this is obviouslypedophilia's out there.
It's a big thing that's outthere, and it's not going
anywhere.
So if we can safely get the needmet on an inanimate object that

(01:02:21):
is representing that, that's somuch better than going out there
and actually doing it.
Yep.

SPEAKER_02 (01:02:29):
So sorry to not have anything more cerebral than that
to say on it, but yeah.
I want to say it was a coupledays ago and it was on TikTok.
Some I think she's a teacher.
Why is it always the teacher?
But she was having relationswith some kid and got caught, I

(01:02:50):
guess.
But it's it's the idea that it'snot a gender thing.
It it is not a gender issue.
So shadow self is everyone.
Uh whether you see binary genderor whether you see a spectrum.
Leave gender out of it.
It's human.
Little, yes.
It's human.
Um it it could be something assmall as you know, you and and

(01:03:15):
I'll tie it to eroticism becausethat's the thing most people
feel shame.

SPEAKER_01 (01:03:20):
Some people um I was hoping you were gonna take it
there because we talked aboutthat.
What?
Bringing it to eroticism.

SPEAKER_02 (01:03:26):
Oh.
Well, I mean, some people canactually get turned on being
violent.
Yeah.
Great.
Go to a rec room, break TV sets,put holes in walls, get all of
that energy out, and then godate your girlfriend or
whatever.
You know what I mean?
Like find ways to bleed thatpressure if indeed your shadow

(01:03:52):
self leads you to feel like youhave to in some way express the
um, well, that's the first E,right?
Express.
Express.
If you've got to express it, ifit needs to come out, find a
safe way to explore it so thatyou never get to exploit.
Because Shadow Self should neverbe about exploiting anyone.

(01:04:12):
Shadow Self isn't about that.
It is about finding balance inyourself and grace for yourself.
Shadow self is all aboutbalance.

SPEAKER_01 (01:04:22):
It it really absolutely is.
I mean, Carl Jung, it's CarlJung's theory.

SPEAKER_02 (01:04:26):
I think the original idea itself was really just to
do the work internally.
Obviously, some people don'thave that kind of self-control.
So that's exactly what we'regetting at.
And and really trying to addressthat, because if we're talking
uh in the mental healthcommunity, there are plenty of I
mean, honestly, uh the You andI've seen it.

(01:04:47):
The behavior support plans Iused to do, the box I would
check most often, probably rightbehind suicide, was impulsivity.
And and having that inability tocontrol things that are probably
not socially acceptable, mightbe harming you, might be harming
someone else.

(01:05:07):
Yeah.
That impulsive peace is, Ithink, unfortunately, gone
beyond even just mental illness.
No, it is with the advent ofFacebook fuck you, because I
never have to face you face toface.
So now everybody feelsempowered.
Um which there's no empowermentto that.
No, it's just screaming into theWell, it's that's gonna be my

(01:05:30):
new handle.

SPEAKER_01 (01:05:30):
It's the screaming into the void.
Yeah, it's not there's no powerto that.
It's actually opposite becauseyou're hiding behind a screen.
Yeah.
All right, so but anyway, I I Iknow that's a that's a rough
take.
And I I hope this goes as wellas I would like it to.
Um, this is by far the mostcontroversial thing we've ever

(01:05:53):
tackled.

SPEAKER_02 (01:05:54):
Well, I would pedophilia and I mean crying out
loud.
I swear to God, if you do themetrics on our show, and next
week we get we come up numberone as the podcast that said
fucking children the most, I amgonna be distraught.

SPEAKER_01 (01:06:12):
Well, we probably get a lot of listens.
But who are the people who arelistening?
It's not the same thing.
Who are the people who aresearching?
It's not the audience.
I actually think about that.
I know.
No, no, no.
If they if we're getting thataudience, it's like we can turn
it.
We can be like, hey.
Turn them from the dark side toa different dark side.
A different, a safe dark side.

SPEAKER_02 (01:06:31):
There's a slightly more rubbery silicone dark side
for you.

SPEAKER_01 (01:06:36):
But that's the that is the thing, is that there are
compulsions that are that peoplementally ill or not, but it is
very common in mental illness.
I've seen it too.
I've worked in mental mentalhealth facilities.
I've seen it a lot.
And admittedly, sexualcompulsions, not necessarily
just pedophilia.

(01:06:56):
Sexual compulsions are a prettycommon thing, and the mentally
ill in that state that don'taren't armed with the
medication, with the experience,with the support, don't know
how.
They don't know how to channelthat other than to exploit it.
Right.
But this doesn't just apply tothe mentally ill.

(01:07:17):
It's just most people who aren'tmentally ill can control that
compulsion.
Um not all thing, yeah, fairenough, but not all things that
are in the shadow side of thingshave to not be explored either.
Okay.

SPEAKER_02 (01:07:34):
So I'm following you.
You're a good American for goinginto this, thank you.
I salute your efforts, sir.
Probably gonna get shot.

SPEAKER_00 (01:07:48):
Like, what's this?
What's this schizoff crazy sockoass out here talking about
fucking children?

SPEAKER_02 (01:07:55):
Alright, where are you going?
No.
Let's get away from the fuckingchildren for a while.

SPEAKER_01 (01:07:59):
So, like I said, there are things that are that
are considered taboo orconsidered not great.
God, I hate to always go back tothe sexual thing, but it's such
a common one.

SPEAKER_02 (01:08:11):
And honestly, we all have most people are gonna carry
some sort of taboo within themthat they're uncomfortable with
about themselves.

SPEAKER_01 (01:08:20):
And sexuality is something that we all
experience.
Even asexuals have a sexuality.
Sexuality is something ashumans, again, whether we all
have that core need to have thatidentity, whatever that is.
Homosexuality, transsexuality,we all, asexuality, any of it.
It is important to have thatpiece of identity kind of rock

(01:08:43):
solid, excuse the pun, in whoyou are.
That is part of accepting yourhuman self.
And and without that beingidentified, there's a lot of
uncertainty and anxiety.
Uh that's such a core thing justto be human to know about
yourself.
So leading from that, obviously,there's there's sexual desires a

(01:09:06):
lot of people have that seem toomuch, or I don't know, you're
the sex guy.
Um you're the sex fella.
But there are there arefantasies and desires that both
men and women have that peoplemight look from the outside and
be like, that's fucked up,that's whatever.
Um there are communities forthat sort of thing.

(01:09:29):
There are arrangements for thatsort of thing.
Field and Tinder.
I got friends who have donethose.
Those things exist.
Okay.
So that's one thing that there'sa lot, actually, a lot of
like-minded people for theboomers, those are online dating
sites for sex.
I mean, Tinder's not just that.

(01:09:50):
But it it often is.
But like with that, that issomething that a lot of us do
have fantasies and desires thatwe're not exactly comfortable
throwing out there either.
But there are absolutely, andthat's becoming a much more
acceptable thing to explore themore the more time passes and

(01:10:11):
the more these communitiesdevelop.
I mean, there's Facebook pageson this stuff.
So it is a thing, and that issafe to explore as long as
consent and boundaries and safewords and all that stuff.
But those are things I'm soproud of you.

SPEAKER_02 (01:10:24):
For what?
Because you knew it all.
Good job.
You're welcome.

SPEAKER_01 (01:10:30):
I'm welcome.
Um, but seriously, like thoseare things that a lot of people
don't feel comfortable sharing.
You don't have to.
Find your community for that.
And that's, I guess, what I'mgetting at is there are
communities for a lot of the no,not pedophilia.
I hope there's not a pedophiliacommunity.
I'm serious though.
I kind of Nambla.
What's the South Park thing?
National Association for Man BoyRelationship.

(01:10:53):
Wait.
National Association.
I don't care.
No, it was funny.
No, I don't care.
Nambla.
National Association of MarlonBrando lookalikes was what the
company was supposed to be.
I thought it was.
And then there was a Nambla BoyLove Association.
That's it.
National Association for ManBoy, yeah, whatever.

SPEAKER_02 (01:11:11):
Or something stupid like that.

SPEAKER_01 (01:11:12):
Anyway.
Yeah.
Hilarious.
Anyway.
Okay, what's our fucking motto?

SPEAKER_02 (01:11:18):
I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 (01:11:19):
It's if you don't laugh.
Well, no, wait, that's that'swhat everybody says.
What's my version of that?
Laughter is the best medication,so take your fucking pills.
Right, gotcha.
We can make fun of this stuff.
Yes.
We have to.
Yes.
Doesn't and one thing, okay.
Uh-huh.
Here's a tangent, but a shortone.
Okay.
This what's funny is you're notgoing to believe where this came

(01:11:40):
from, but it sparked anothergenius idea from yours, truly.
It's kind of related to this.
Maybe not.
I play a game called MarvelRifles.
No, no, no, no, no.
You're not going to believewhere this came from.
Okay.
Because it's actually reallyinsightful.
Is if you play as Tony Stark,Iron Man, one of the lines he
says a lot is he says, if I'mnot joking about it, you know

(01:12:03):
I'm not taking it seriously.
Okay.
What do you not get the there'sprofoundness in that?

SPEAKER_02 (01:12:11):
Profoundness, yes.
You were talking about itspurred something genius.

SPEAKER_01 (01:12:14):
That was what it spurred.
Is I think that's a pretty Ithink that's actually something
you could take deeper than justthat surface level.
Yes.
It's like we process throughhumor a lot.

SPEAKER_02 (01:12:24):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:12:26):
So I like to repeat on this show obsessively the
idea that it is okay to laugh attragedy, there's processing
through humor, there's healingthrough humor.
I'm gonna go on this fuckingtrain again because I'm still
tired of seeing this out in thisworld.
Is if you like a certain humor,and let's let's even take it

(01:12:46):
beyond humor.
If you like a certain style ofcontent, we can go into super
pornography.
I don't give a shit.
Whatever you're into, like Saulmovies, that's not for
everybody.
Uh freaking slipknot, that's notfor everybody.
Mortal Kombat, that's GrandTheft Auto, you know, those are
all extremes that some peoplemight look at and judge those
people and be like, oh, those,you know, whatever, judge those

(01:13:07):
products or ideas or whatever.
That goes with certaincomedians, Louis C.K., Dave
Chappelle, all these people outthere who feel uncomfortable
with that, you know, are judgingall these people or trying to
cancel them or ban them orwhatever the fuck they're trying
to do.
Here's the thing both sides ofthis, by the way, those of us
who are into that more extremestuff, accept that those people

(01:13:30):
aren't and don't necessarilyjudge them for not wanting to
explore those things and they'renot comfortable with it.
Okay, that's fine too.
However, and I'm calling theother side out, unfortunately,
because that's the community I'mnot crazy about, and that is the
community I think that iscausing a lot of the struggle.
And the problem is because ifyou try to cancel things or ban

(01:13:53):
things that aren't reallyhurting anybody, that are
therapeutic, that helps certainpeople explore those extremes,
and I'm talking more media andthings like that.
You are just gonna anger thosepeople even more.
You're not solving anything, youare actually contributing to the
problem, in my opinion.
But so, like just or you are theproblem.

(01:14:13):
Or you are the problem.
Thank you.
That was even more bold.
Thank you.
Not that we haven't gone boldenough on this.

SPEAKER_02 (01:14:20):
No, but you're you're literally talking about
capacity.
Right.
And Raquel, Rachel, whateveryour name.
I don't know how to pronounce.
Maybe it's I think it's Rachel.
Rachel.
What the fuck are you talkingabout?
Rachel Capacity Expert.
She's on TikTok.
Oh, her.
Yeah, I'm sorry, yeah.
No, she's on to something.
And I hope therapy makes a hard180 and heads back the other

(01:14:44):
direction.
But you want to get into that?
Based on well, no, not deeply,but let's soften that.

SPEAKER_01 (01:14:49):
I mean, we went from No.

SPEAKER_02 (01:14:51):
Well, you know where we went.
Let's solve that.
It's really more a you problem.
You're offended by something,you're upset with it.
It's something inside of you,yet you have to externalize it.
And unfortunately, when youexternalize it, you've explored
it thoroughly, you end upexploiting those other people
who enjoy that kind of humorthere.

(01:15:14):
Because it is therapeutic, it'scathartic, it helps them get it
out.
But no, you're the weenesswithout any kind of capacity.
You you walk around thinkingeverything needs to be bubble
wrapped for you.
Well, why don't you just bubblewrap yourself in some therapy?
Oh, and actually figured out youprobably need to build you up

(01:15:38):
before you even bother with anyof the problems in the world.
Um I think this last election,which who knows whether it
worked out or not, not to getpolitical.
No, it's not really about thepull out, but the idea that
there was there was there was asnapback.
There there needed to besomething riding the ship

(01:15:58):
because we were going too far inthe wrong directions.
And I think that's been thecase, honestly, for a while.
For several decades now.

SPEAKER_01 (01:16:07):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (01:16:08):
And there are some corrections that are starting to
happen.
Well, yeah.
And I think it's a good thing.

SPEAKER_01 (01:16:13):
What's crazy is the the the acceptance or like the
Yeah.
The more exploration we did intodifferent kinds of humor and
different types of, you know,there's a lot of the elderly,
even in my family, I don't mindsaying, they're like, oh, well,
when I was a kid, we nevertalked back to our parents and
we were home by blah, and yeah.
It's like there's something tothat, but that's also so

(01:16:34):
restrictive on growth, onbecoming your own person.
Now, again, where I'm getting atwith that, we've gone too far
the other way.

SPEAKER_02 (01:16:41):
A little bit.

SPEAKER_01 (01:16:42):
Whether it's letting your children do anything, and
this is period, letting yourchildren do anything, or it's
like bubble wrap them fromeverything.
They're everything's extremesthese days, for one thing.
Even the flavor-blastedgoldfish.

SPEAKER_02 (01:16:56):
Those are really good.
But they're extreme.

SPEAKER_01 (01:17:00):
Are they really that much different than just regular
channels?
I don't know.
We get those for Max, andthey're they're considerably
better.
They could be cheesier.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:17:12):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (01:17:14):
So, again.
We're exhausted by thisconversation.
This is an exhausting one.
We're not gonna do anotherepisode for six years.
We're probably not gonna be ableto because they're gonna come
arrest us.
But probably.
But here's the thing with likethe whole me, I guess.
He did it.
He was me.

SPEAKER_00 (01:17:29):
Uh 2319.

SPEAKER_01 (01:17:32):
No, monsters when.
You remember that?
Monsters Inc.
when.

SPEAKER_02 (01:17:35):
No.
I d I don't remember every movieline.
I'm really bad at that.
You're the best at it.

SPEAKER_01 (01:17:40):
So you guys will remember it.

SPEAKER_02 (01:17:42):
Uh get you in touch with Nate, my bass player.
He's got them all.
Idetic memory.
That's what he told me the othernight.
Just the movies.

SPEAKER_01 (01:17:50):
I don't just at movies, that's it.

SPEAKER_02 (01:17:51):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:17:52):
I don't know anything else.

SPEAKER_02 (01:17:53):
He knows them all.

SPEAKER_01 (01:17:54):
Um, but the side that is being more safe, there's
also something to just notliking certain humor.
There are some things you justas a person objectively don't
find funny.
And there might be certainthings that go dark with certain
subjects, you're like, okay,that's funny.
And there might be certainthings that go dark, you're
like, I don't find that funny.

(01:18:15):
Or just nothing you like to godark.
One thing I I struggle with withokay, here we go on this train.
Christianity.
But it's not about that.
That's the one thing you can'tmake fun of.
You know, several Christians inmy life, that's the one thing
you don't make fun of.
What are you doing?
You're contributing to peoplebeing angry that that's

(01:18:37):
something that can't be touched.
If you're if shut up.
Priests touching pedophilia.
Bringing it back around.
Bringing it back to theexploitation.
But what I'm saying with that isthat if you're trying to make
things so safe that it can't bejoked about, or even deeper,
just talked about, you're gonnapiss people the fuck off to the

(01:18:58):
point where no, we're gonna gothe other way.
It's like exploit your desires,exploit your feelings, take it
out on others, your frustrationthat you're not able to express
it or enjoy certain outlets thatare safe to do that with.
You're absolutely fucking up thewhole thing.
So again, if you're those peoplewho are not comfortable with
certain things, avoid it.

(01:19:18):
It's not hurting you, it's nothurting others.
Fucking stay away from it.

SPEAKER_02 (01:19:21):
Also, go do some shadow work.

SPEAKER_01 (01:19:23):
Go do some shadow work.
Thank you.
Because I was just about to geton that.
It's like, just like you said,people who are really insecure
about that, and honestly, Ithink religion's one of them
too.
Faith is a difficult thing.
Even the most Christian peoplein my life have struggled at
times with like, gosh, do Ireally feel like I can go into
this?
Again, it's like explore everyaspect, and goddamn, it's

(01:19:44):
uncomfortable.
It's therapy is not easy, andI'm gonna get on this real
quick.
Therapy is not meant to be afriend talking to you, it's not
meant to be it is work.
It's work.
You know, digging into yourselfand figuring out what is wrong
with you on a on a core level isabsolute work.

(01:20:07):
That's the fucking problem withbetter help.
I don't mind ripping them a newasshole at this point.
And what I love is on Facebook,when they're doing their ads, I
love that I'm starting to seepeople say they have bad
experiences with them.
No kidding.
I'm fucking loving it.
Because

SPEAKER_02 (01:20:22):
Do I get to air my story on Better Help?

SPEAKER_01 (01:20:25):
Do you want to?
I mean, might as well.
I mean, I I can I air mine justreal quick.
Yeah, go ahead.
I had a person in my life whowas in therapy with BetterHelp.
They went through just twotherapists.
Their first one demonized everyperson in their life and said
they were the only person thatwas in the right and everyone
else was the problem and allthat.

(01:20:47):
Fuck that shit.
The second therapist this personhad was actually helpful on a
level because they they weretalking about things.
They weren't exploring the depthor the um genesis.
They weren't exploring the coreof it.
It was like we're talking aboutthe subject, but we're kind of
talking around it.
And one thing that drives menuts is people who go to
therapy, they do their session,and then they don't do any work

(01:21:10):
in between sessions.
It's like the session's like,oh, it's deep and profound and
work.
Therapy is not about the fuckingthrow up and then you don't do
it again.
It's not how therapy works.
It is consistent, consistent,consistent.
And eventually you hit thoseprofound revelations that, oh my
God, that's progress.
Now I can work on that and yougrow.
It's all about growth.

(01:21:30):
Shadow Cell, about growth.
Growth.
Okay.
Now that's my Better Help score.

SPEAKER_02 (01:21:38):
Oh, BetterHelp.
Yeah.
So I work in mental health andwas dating someone who was a
therapist on BetterHelp.
And you would think that theseare top-notch therapists.
They're not.
They're anybody who wants alittle side work, they can do

(01:21:59):
your session in their bathroom.
They can do it in front of theirboyfriend.

SPEAKER_01 (01:22:06):
Oh.
Did that happen?
Uh yeah.
Yeah, there is the whole vithere's no uh privacy.
There's supposed to be.

SPEAKER_02 (01:22:14):
You you do not have privacy guaranteed.
And that is the biggest issue Itake with that whole thing, is
that if you are going tooutsource to all these different
therapists that you do not seeon daily and have well, weekly,
bro.
You know, well you seetherapists?
She was doing no.

(01:22:34):
I'm saying if you are betterhelp and you don't you haven't
even met some of yourtherapists.
Oh, okay.
Most of your therapists.
It's a worldwide thing.
You don't know what those peopleare when they're doing their
session, who's there.
They may sign stuff, but I'msorry.

SPEAKER_01 (01:22:52):
Nope.
Yeah, and nope.
I also don't.
It's one of those things that tosee it just purely black and
white isn't fair either.
There are probably legitimatetherapists on there.
I'm not gonna say that, butunfortunately, I think what I've
understood is you even getlegitimate therapists on there.
They're not paid very well.
They're not really theirexpectations.

(01:23:12):
I don't think they take thatmany notes.
You know, you're just anotheryou're just another file in in
their in their uh and and I willsay the the therapist was good.

SPEAKER_02 (01:23:24):
She's great, she's awesome.
Yeah, I know.
But hot too.
Irrelevant, but is it though?
A very talented therapist.

SPEAKER_01 (01:23:34):
I actually had a therapist I was really attracted
to, and it absolutely distractedfrom the therapy.
I was the first therapist I everhad.

SPEAKER_02 (01:23:42):
Remember, we were talking about impulse and
impulse control?
No, this is funny.
Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_01 (01:23:48):
I'm done then.
Go ahead.
Oh, were you?
I'm sorry, were you?
No, go ahead.
Oh, I think it's not thatimportant.

SPEAKER_02 (01:23:53):
No.
I mean, I'm fine.
You just came in with thatpiece.
I just wanted to make sure thatit's not even the therapist,
it's the process that's wrong.
Zig high there.

SPEAKER_01 (01:24:08):
I'm sorry.
I know.
Really impulsive tonight.
Not do as I do, not as I do as Isay, not as I do.
Yeah.
Anyway, I had a therapist I wasreally attracted to.
It was my first therapist ever.
And I didn't get a damn bit oftherapy out of that.
Except right after the session.
Sexual healing.

(01:24:30):
I knew exactly where we weregoing.
Thank you.
We're talking about teenage you,right?
Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (01:24:36):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (01:24:36):
I was 13.
It was right after I attemptedsuicide.
She made me not want to do itanymore.
She's like, no, Nick.
She's like, don't do it.
I said, what I said, I said,well, what are you gonna do to
make me not do it?
She said, whatever you want.
And I said, and I said, time fora new therapist.

(01:24:58):
That's not how that went.
I was really attracted to herand it distracted from the
therapy.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 (01:25:03):
I have never had an attractive therapist that was my
therapist.

SPEAKER_01 (01:25:07):
So that was your therapist.
That was my therapist.
But your your friend was she'sum she's a nice lady.
You're okay.
I gotta rip on better help alittle more.
No, I love doing that.
I was wondering how we'regetting it.
I love fucking love ripping.
Okay.
Because it's a fucking epidemic.
It's a problem.
Um you notice when you watchdamn near okay, you get on

(01:25:28):
Rogan's podcast, Theo fuckingVaughn.
Um, you you watch I love TheoVaughn.

SPEAKER_02 (01:25:35):
How funny.
He's hilarious.
But I just don't watch him.
I'm not offended by him.

SPEAKER_01 (01:25:40):
See, that's the thing, right there.
That's how you do it.
Right.
I'm offended, you don't likehim.
Don't look at me.
But it's so hard not to.
I know, right?

SPEAKER_00 (01:25:51):
So beautiful.
It's like the car crash.
Oh, I went the other way.
Oh, it's like a car crash.
Okay, fine.
See, I'm gonna go back to thecity.
Continue.
You were saying complimentary.

SPEAKER_01 (01:26:00):
I'm saying you're beautiful.
You're so sweet.
Not ugly the hey.
All right.

SPEAKER_02 (01:26:08):
Okay.
Um it still makes me laugh everytime.
It's such a great short.
Um you guys are missing out.

SPEAKER_01 (01:26:16):
But better help.
So you get on like YouTube, youget on podcasts.
What are they constantlyadvertising?
I got this great there,bullshit.
Bullshit.
I want a purple dildo.
Purple?

SPEAKER_00 (01:26:31):
Purple shh purple purple Pete homes.
Pete Holmes.

SPEAKER_01 (01:26:37):
That see, they're not gonna remotely get that.
Please, Pete.
Please, Pete, come on thispodcast and be the pills for
everyone.
Bring your Peter on the show,Pete.
Ooh, Pete's Peter.
Yeah.
Hey, I'm gonna reach out to him.
I've got his, I've got his info.
I had Bill Burr's info.

SPEAKER_02 (01:26:55):
He would be there.
He'd be even better.
I feel like those two episodeswould exhaust us and we would
need to take a break.
Minecraft.

SPEAKER_01 (01:27:06):
We're done.
Probably should be.
We are done.
Lar short of it, recap.
I have to do this.
Pedophilia.
Well, it's it's umaccountability, safe ways of
expression and explorationwithout ever getting to

(01:27:26):
exploitation.
Not fucking children.
I'm gonna say again.
Never, ever, ever acceptable.
And don't even diddle them.
Why'd you do that?
I was really trying to sum it upin a in like a legit, holistic
fucking.

SPEAKER_02 (01:27:44):
I have to stay with our twisted teeth.

SPEAKER_01 (01:27:45):
Did it did it, did it, did it, did it, did it.
Good old Diddy.

SPEAKER_00 (01:27:48):
Yeah, we actually posted that under us.
Put some baby oil on it.

SPEAKER_02 (01:27:52):
Okay, Steve Harvey.

SPEAKER_00 (01:27:54):
Pizza! I eat that shit on pizza.
Oh my god.

unknown (01:27:57):
Oh my god.

SPEAKER_02 (01:27:58):
There really is a nightmare out there right now.
And thy name is Harvey.

unknown (01:28:05):
Oh.

SPEAKER_01 (01:28:06):
Harvey.
Diddy.
Diddy.
Um anyway, so those points.
And I wasn't referencing eitherone of them.

SPEAKER_02 (01:28:14):
I was just saying.
Oh, there's a darkness out therethat And people are exploiting
it.

SPEAKER_01 (01:28:20):
People like Diddy and Epstein and Trump and other
people are absolutely out thereexploiting these shadow selves
rather than exploring it.
And you know what?
They got the fucking money wherethey probably could legitimately
safely explore these thingsinstead of using their powers
for evil.

SPEAKER_00 (01:28:38):
Evil.

SPEAKER_02 (01:28:41):
That's us.
Instead, they use the money tocover it up.
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (01:28:46):
But uh so we have accountability and authenticity.
We have the two E's and one E.
Two to one.
Two to one E.
Stay with the two.
Find yourself in the one.
Get the hell out of there.

unknown (01:29:01):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:29:02):
Yeah.
This is the don't cancel me out.
This is literally gonna becalled that.

SPEAKER_02 (01:29:05):
This one was a rough one for me.
There's a lot of anxiety in thisone.

SPEAKER_01 (01:29:11):
Alright.
Uh Jesus.
Um I think we need one of thosethings.
Um anyway.
I'm exhausted after that one.
Um, right?
I feel I feel like a weight hasbeen lifted.

SPEAKER_02 (01:29:28):
Oh.

SPEAKER_01 (01:29:29):
And I I think I might have lost my co-host.
It might just be the defectiveschizo effective live from
Indianapolis CorrectionalFacility.
Doing podcasts with doingpodcasts with convicted felons.
Those would be good episodes.

SPEAKER_02 (01:29:47):
Yeah, sure.
Anyway.
Building silicone dolls inthere.

SPEAKER_01 (01:29:51):
And sending them to people who want to explore
bacon.
Yeah.
Now we're getting high.
Oh my lord.
Don't get high in your ownsupply.

SPEAKER_00 (01:30:01):
Um don't look to the bottle of eye for the good.

SPEAKER_01 (01:30:07):
Yeah, we need to.
Hopefully these mics gave outhalfway in this episode.
Yeah, probably.
But they didn't.

SPEAKER_02 (01:30:13):
Um they're amazing.

SPEAKER_01 (01:30:15):
Anyway, uh Can they hear us?
I'm sure they can't.
They can hear.
I can see.
Um, yeah.
So this was this was this wascontroversy in in its at its
best.
At its greatest.
Um a lot of this wasn't for thepoint of controversy in itself.

(01:30:40):
No, it's a smart conversation.
With controversy.
Okay.
Wrap it up.
Uh okay.
Laughter is the best medication.
Take your goddamn fucking pillsand quit being such little
bitches.
Take the meds.
Take the meds.

(01:31:01):
Yeah.
Laughter is free.
It's easy if you let yourself.
And fuck big pharma.
Now we're definitely gettingcancer.

SPEAKER_02 (01:31:12):
Wow, we really lit into some fun stuff.

SPEAKER_01 (01:31:15):
Fuck better help and fuck better pharma.
They're only here to take yourmoney.
Anyway.
Stay tuned.
Bye.
Bye forever, because we're gonnabe in prison.
No.
I'll be in a mental health wardand he'll be for sure.

(01:31:36):
He'll be uh I'll be in a mentalhealth facility and he'll he'll
be uh why do I always get closeat the end?

SPEAKER_02 (01:31:44):
I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 (01:31:45):
Memorize these faces because you'll they still out
there?

SPEAKER_02 (01:31:47):
Did they stop listening?
I don't I don't see any of thethings.
I am not symptom now that therethey are.
I might have some dementia.
But not but we're done.
Goodbye.
Goodbye forever.
We will see you next time.
Maybe.
Maybe not.

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Shadow Work, Intrusive Thoughts & Self-Control | Safe Expression Vs. Exploitation

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Shadow Work, Intrusive Thoughts & Self-Control | Safe Expression Vs. Exploitation