September 30, 2024 • 37 mins
Catherine was diagnosed with a rare childhood cancer at the tender age of 10 while also enduring an abusive home environment. Catherine shares the harrowing details of her treatments in the 1970s, the emotional isolation she faced, and how her faith became her lifeline. Catherine's journey is detailed in her book "Everyday Awakening."
Catherine Duncan is an Integrative Spiritual Consultant, Author, Holistic Healer, Inspirational Speaker, and Resilience Trainer, committed to whole-person healing with a focus on emotional and spiritual health.
We dive into the transformative journey of trading a high-flying career in advertising for spiritual fulfillment after a near-death experience. This pivotal moment led to a complete life overhaul, from pursuing a degree in theology to becoming a spiritual director and chaplain. The conversation explores the challenges of breaking away from societal and familial expectations, the pursuit of deeper meaning, and the strength gained through spirituality.
Catherine shares her transition from being a hospice chaplain to focusing on helping people live fully, inspired by her husband's near-death experience. Through her personal narrative, she offers practical advice on how morning mindfulness can set a positive tone for the day. By emphasizing self-love and the transformative power of gratitude. She provides invaluable insights into fostering a sense of peace and connection and the importance of living in the present.
Let's enjoy her story.
https://www.catherineduncan.org/aboutcatherine
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Daniela SM (00:05):
Hi, I'm Daniela.
Welcome to my podcast.
Because Everyone has a Story,the place to give ordinary
people's stories the chance tobe shared and preserved.
Our stories become the languageof connections.
Let's enjoy it, connect andrelate because everyone has a
story and relate becauseeveryone has a story.
(00:30):
Welcome, my guest is atherineDuncan.
CKatherine is an integrityspiritual consultant, author,
holistic healer, inspirationalspeaker and resilient trainer.
She focuses on the whole person, healing emotionally and
spiritually.
Her journey began at age 10when she turned to existential
books, pleading with life as shebattled a rare form of cancer.
(00:51):
In our conversation, we exploreher path from breaking social
and family expectations tobecome the spiritual consultant
and writer that she is today.
atherine also shares howmorning mindfulness helps her to
set a positive tone of the day,highlighting the power of
self-love, gratitude and livingin the present, of peace and
(01:12):
connection.
But there is way moreinformation that she's sharing
with us in this episode.
Her energy and enthusiasm,which you could hear in her
voice, automatically lift myspirit.
I was so sad that we didn't havemore time to continue the
conversation.
I could have asked thousandsmore questions, but we have
(01:34):
limited time and she's extremelybusy.
I have already ordered her book, the Everyday Awakening.
I will let you know how it goes.
Let's enjoy her story.
Welcome, katrin, to the show.
I'm excited that you're heretoday.
Great to meet you.
Thank you, yes, and you have astory, so why do you want to
share your story?
Catherine Duncan (01:53):
I now have a new book out nationwide called
Everyday Awakening, and my bookis about what does it mean to be
alive right now, and that'swhat I want to share.
How are we choosing to liveevery day to find peace and ease
and aliveness?
It's a choice we're makingevery moment of our day.
Daniela SM (02:11):
Yes, beautiful, beautiful.
I'm happy that you're here, andso when does this story start
for you?
Catherine Duncan (02:18):
My story started when I was 11 years old.
I was suddenly actually 10,turning 11, gravely ill, taken
to the hospital and this is inthe 70s.
I was diagnosed with extremelyrare form of childhood cancer.
Statistics were grim.
(02:39):
I was given a 20% chance tolive, my parents were told, and
they I started intensivetreatments and surgeries and
back then they did havecounselors and chaplains.
No one talked to me and I couldjust feel like I was walking on
a tightrope between life anddeath.
It was.
They had no anti nausea drugs.
(03:00):
They did tons of amputation.
They did nothing in theseventies at the major
university hospital to reallyhelp comfort children, and
that's out of nowhere.
When I I just I started to prayand faith had meant nothing to
me, but I just decided I want tolive.
I prayed could I please live?
Not long after this feelingcame through my whole body, that
(03:22):
just like took my breath awayand it was just annoying.
I was going to live and it wasannoying.
I wasn't alone and that's whenmy journey started.
Daniela SM (03:31):
Why do you want to leave?
What is it that motivated youat 11 year old that wanted to
continue living?
Catherine Duncan (03:37):
You know it's interesting you ask that
question as an adult.
I look back and I had a prettytough childhood.
On the outside it looked niceand glamorous and father was
successful, big family, but myfather was verbally abusive to
me and it was just a toughchildhood and I have a memory of
just feeling like I wanted todie, like I was just done, and
(04:00):
after coming face to face withdeath, I just this feeling deep
within my heart and soul, mysoul, felt this nudging like I
want to live.
That's how it felt and that'swhat I followed.
Daniela SM (04:12):
Wow.
So you'd say you were notreligious, but you kind of
started to have some kind oftrust in something because you
really wanted to live.
Catherine Duncan (04:20):
Yeah, you know, my family intermittently
would go to church Lutheranchurch and it meant nothing to
me, but I just felt this nudginglike I want to live.
I don't want to die right now.
And that was my prayer.
I just started like praying tothe universe.
I just want to live.
And I actually was lived to be20.
(04:41):
I thought if I lived to be 20,I would see the world and I just
I told no one and I prayed andprayed and prayed and prayed,
and and that's when that feelingcame through my being and it
was just like you know, and it'sbeen with me to this day.
Daniela SM (04:57):
Wow, and so you have no siblings, nobody that you
you can talk to, anybody you cantrust it.
Catherine Duncan (05:03):
Yeah, I have five older siblings.
Actually one brother has died.
Three of my older siblings arequite a bit older, I think,
because my life it felt soextreme, going through and
having really intensivechemotherapy, radiation
surgeries, it was just so much.
And back then they really likewhen I would have stays in the
hospital they wouldn't even letparents hardly come in to see
(05:25):
you.
Daniela SM (05:26):
How long were you like that?
Catherine Duncan (05:27):
A couple years, couple years of treatment
, really intensive treatments.
Daniela SM (05:32):
And you?
You did you go to school or no?
Catherine Duncan (05:35):
I did.
I would have treatment everyweek and then like chemotherapy
the next day.
That was so, so sick throughthe night.
And the next day, I remember, Iwould just lay on the couch,
lethargic, and my mom bless herheart.
I mean, she would just be busydoing stuff around the house and
I'd be by myself all day justwatching some TV, just laying on
(05:57):
the couch.
And then the next day I'd goback to school and pretend like
nothing happened.
Daniela SM (06:02):
Wow, definitely feels lonely and very difficult.
Catherine Duncan (06:06):
Yep, yep, I didn't.
I actually wasn't until my 30sthat I did super hardcore
therapy to process.
I was finally was actually notuntil my middle 20s I started
having nightmares that I wasabout.
I started sitting up in bedthinking I was about to die and
I thought, if I don't do therapyto process, my childhood is
(06:27):
going to eat me up.
So it wasn't until latetwenties that I actually started
to process what happened to me.
Daniela SM (06:33):
So, when you were ill for two years, and then you
got better, obviously, and thenyou turn to 20, which is what
your goal was and what happened?
So you, you, you did say thatyou went to therapy and you were
having actually panic attacks.
So what happened?
Catherine Duncan (06:49):
Yeah, the year I got sick this drug came
in from Turkey, thischemotherapy drug that was
randomly being given because itcould cause heart problems and
my father demanded they give methat drug.
That drug is now standardtreatment for what I had.
Survival rate was 20%.
Now it's like over 80%.
So I mean that was a piece ofit also in prayer and I led a
(07:12):
pretty normal teenage life,except for here.
I was a teenager reading somany books on why am I alive?
What am I?
You know, I was reading allthese existential books
existentialism and who is man,and philosophy and theology.
I was trying to understand whywas I here?
Why did I survive?
(07:33):
It was how interesting, I know,not surprising.
All these years later.
What do I do?
And write a book about what itmeans to be alive?
I've been reading these bookssince a teenager what it means
to be alive.
Daniela SM (07:45):
I've been reading these books since a teenager.
I'm jumping here, but do youreally feel you found the answer
, because I think it's such adifficult thing to find.
I think we spent all our lifetrying to figure out why we're
here and who we are.
I thought that was the purposeof our life and you, however,
started since you were 11, whichusually we start later so you
(08:05):
managed to really be clear onthat.
Catherine Duncan (08:08):
Yes, I believe that and I learned this
at such a young age that we'rehere to live from our heart,
from our soul.
I mean, our journey is to livefrom the depth of our soul, and
that means not living and thisgoes back to just basics of
living in the present moment,tuning in.
Are you living your life headup?
(08:29):
Are you living your life inyour mind, or are you living
your life when you come into themoment, the preciousness of
just now?
Because when we're in our mind,we're in the past, we're in the
future, we're not even here,but we can feel into our body
through breath or just breathingmindful.
I mean, there's so manyexercises I could share and I
(08:50):
have 42 in my book about how tocome into the moment.
When you come into the moment,it's just like oh, that peace,
that ease, the spaciousness, theguidance, that deep inner
guidance within every one of usand the guidance that we receive
from the universe.
It's all there and that's it,and that's how I think we're
(09:10):
called to live our life from theinside out.
Daniela SM (09:12):
This didn't make you holistic completely.
You seem to be very balanced.
Catherine Duncan (09:17):
You know, I led a pretty normal teenage life
, Side note reading everyweekend about life and purpose
and all that.
And I went through college andthen I started out.
Just this year I started out inadvertising and I was with Time
magazine selling regional ads,making lots of money, and it was
really glamorous.
Not quite 10 years into it andmy heart was like this I was
(09:41):
feeling this nudging, like thisisn't it, this isn't what I'm
called to do.
I mean, I would go on businesstrips and bring stacks of book
on life and meaning and why arewe alive.
And my colleagues would seethis and they would just laugh
like what are you doing?
Why are you reading these books?
I knew in my heart that I knewI'd make a change and,
interestingly, my husband, who Imet we went to high school
(10:04):
didn't like each other.
We met after college and hesaid, catherine, you're going to
do something someday to helppeople.
And I remember thinking, I know, but he was right.
Actually, I had a near-deathexperience whitewater rafting on
a timing corporate trip.
That was finally like theturning point where I'm just
like I'm done.
I need to listen fully, wheream I being called?
(10:26):
And that's when, within a fewweeks after that experience
whitewater rafting I quit my jobwith Time Inc and started
praying like please, guidance,listening.
And that's what led me to thepath I'm on to this day.
Daniela SM (10:37):
Wow, wow.
You read a lot of books in the70s.
I'm sure you keep reading.
In the 70s, I'm sure you keepreading.
Would you say that there's morewonderful books?
That has come, or the basicidea really has always been
there.
Catherine Duncan (10:51):
I would say the basic idea has always been
there, even from a spiritual,religious perspective, christian
, or reading the Bhagavad orBuddhist texts.
I mean, I'll tell you, there'sa strong theme among all the
world religions and spiritualtraditions of you know how do
you live fully in this momentand how do you live from your
(11:16):
heart and soul?
It's, I think, a strong theme,regardless of any spiritual or
religious tradition.
Daniela SM (11:24):
Yes, that's what I've been learning, maybe a
little later than you, but Ifigured out that, yes, that's
the truth.
So you had this nearly deathexperience.
Would you not have changed ifthis didn't happen?
Catherine Duncan (11:37):
That's a really good question.
You wonder.
I have five older siblings.
My father was this consummatebusinessman and entrepreneur and
he's the rags to riches storysuper poor, to be very
successful, to run severalcompanies.
So all my siblings went intobusiness and so I went into
business.
And had that not happened, youwonder?
(11:58):
What I can tell you is thatafter the near-death experience
and it was crystal clear to meI'm done, I need to deeply
listen where I'm being calledand the synchronicity of, within
a few months, a girlfriend.
Late at night, my friend Connie,out of nowhere, said to me have
you ever thought of sayingtheology and spiritual direction
(12:20):
?
And I never thought of it.
No one in our family lineage,no one has that path.
And but when she said it I waslike, and when she mentioned one
school here in the twin cities,st Catherine's I got materials
and my body started physicallyshaking.
It was just a knowing this isit.
And so, going back to thefamily path, when I went out to
(12:42):
tell my father that not only Iquit time magazine but I was
going to study theology, hestarted yelling at me, screaming
at me, and at first he said youknow geology and I'm like no
theology.
And he was just like.
He couldn't take it, it wasjust like, but he ended up being
(13:04):
my biggest supporter before hedied.
But it was leaving.
The family paradigm is what itwas.
Daniela SM (13:10):
Yes, yes, wow.
Theology Tell me more aboutthat.
It seems like you have a moreholistic approach than religious
approach.
However, you wanted to know allabout it.
Catherine Duncan (13:19):
Yeah, I just started.
I have a master's in theologyand certified as a spiritual
director.
Then I got a master's indivinity and ordained and board
certified chaplain, like I justgot it all.
It took many years, butstudying theology, I just wanted
a deeper dive into faith andspiritual traditions.
(13:39):
And I'll tell you, the firstclass I had about Christian it
was mystics, theologians.
And when I started that class,when I was reading books, books
at night we had to read a bookor two every week.
I was like, oh, I found mypeople really.
Yeah, I was just like crying.
I was like my gosh, this iswhat I've been looking for since
(13:59):
a teenager oh wow.
Daniela SM (14:02):
You people criticize a lot about religion because it
separates communities at times,even though the message that is
there is about togetherness andrespect people.
It doesn't happen, so didn'tthat affect anything for you?
Catherine Duncan (14:20):
I wanted the academic training and the
knowledge, and that's why Ipursued all the degrees.
And then it was clear to me Ireally wanted to become a
chaplain and so I needed all thedegrees.
And then I it was clear to me Ireally wanted to become a
chaplain, and so I needed allthese degrees in the background
to be able to companion peoplegoing through crisis.
You know people.
My message there is be carefulwhat you pray for.
I was like whatever you want meto do, but I really I'll share
(14:45):
with you.
I really feel drawn to the wordspirituality, even though, yes,
I'm an ordained minister ofecumenical, very inclusive and
liberal.
But I like the wordspirituality for everyone, like
what gives you meaning andhelping people open into what is
that and it could be.
It could be a sense ofsomething beyond God, all of
(15:07):
Brahman.
It could be energy, true nature, it just.
I'm so inclusive in how I'veworked with thousands of people
to help them find what is thatthat gives them strength and
life.
Daniela SM (15:18):
But when you are going through these studies, are
they open for holistic lessons?
Catherine Duncan (15:24):
Absolutely yes, yep.
And when you go throughparticularly a good training
program as a chaplain I wentthrough a year residency and
then another couple of unitsthis is standard to become a
board certified chaplain.
The training is reallyinclusive and ecumenical and
(15:44):
open, because you can imagine achaplain I worked at our level
one trauma hospital and I alsoworked as a hospice chaplain.
I worked with people that werenot many atheists because they
weren't one or a chaplain, butagnostic to a faith and just a
broad breadth and of all faithbackgrounds.
So you really need steeptraining and how to meet someone
(16:06):
on their path, and it's notabout telling someone at end of
life or in crisis in any waythat this is the path.
That is not the training.
It's what can help them andgive them comfort when they're
going through some real upheavaland at end of life.
Daniela SM (16:22):
And so when you say that you're a chaplain, what is
that?
I'm sorry for my ignorance.
I don't know what it is.
Catherine Duncan (16:28):
Yeah, so a chaplain is that's a more
traditional term used whenyou're a spiritual advisor,
guide in a medical setting, soin a hospital, in a hospice
organization, or you're part ofthe medical team and you are the
one providing steeped, deep,emotional spiritual support.
(16:51):
And a chaplain like in hospiceI was with people that were
dying all day, every day.
I mean, that's just the workyou do and the family elects
having a chaplain as part of theteam and it's just trying to
provide comfort, comfort andguidance to a patient, to family
(17:12):
members, when the patient isagain going through some big
upheaval or crisis, end of life.
And it looks a little differentif you're a hospice chaplain or
a trauma chaplain, just in howsomeone comes in in those
instances.
But again, it's justcompanionship, providing love
and guidance and witness whenpeople are going through really
(17:35):
tough times.
Daniela SM (17:36):
That sounds amazing.
I didn't know about that.
That's wonderful, but so whenyou're studying theology, there
are people that go to differentpaths, and people will go to be
minister in a church, and sothere are a lot of different
areas that you can take.
Catherine Duncan (17:53):
Yes, you can take the path with a master's in
theology and divinity.
Many, many people take the pathof becoming a pastor, minister
of a church.
The field that I'm in is calledspecialized ministry, where you
can become a chaplain, aspiritual guide, in different
settings.
Some people go through theirtraining just for their personal
(18:15):
knowledge and education.
Daniela SM (18:17):
And is there any atheist people studying this at
all?
No right.
Catherine Duncan (18:22):
I would not say theology, divinity, they
would maybe be agnostic, likehaving a wondering.
They would maybe be agnosticlike having a wondering, not
sure Atheist, probably not.
I would say atheists wouldprobably lean towards more maybe
Buddhism, where there isn't anykind of God sense or God figure
, but more focused on presentmoment, alleviating suffering.
(18:45):
So you might choose a differentfaith, background or path if
that's the case.
Daniela SM (18:56):
Wow, how interesting , how interesting.
Having this episode here isalso opened my eyes and other
people.
I'm sure that theology is notjust about Catholicism and
people are also like, oh, Idon't want to hear about that.
I actually find that you arelearning more and the more that
you know about all kinds ofreligions, religious broad
spectrum that you have, andyou're more open minded as well.
Catherine Duncan (19:14):
A hundred percent and I'll share with you
because I thought this was ahelpful framework years ago when
I studied this.
There's an author out there.
His name is Ken Wilber.
He's known big nationalspiritual author.
He talks about the four stagesof spiritual development, which
I think are helpful.
The first is where someone isnumber one egocentric it's me,
(19:37):
me, me, me, me.
They just can't see beyondthemselves.
The second is ethnocentric,where people define and live
their life by their tribe so youknow, I am a Lutheran or I am
Buddhist or I am, you know wherethe tribe defines how they live
and practice their life.
The third is world-centric,where you are attuned to the
(19:59):
whole world and the movements.
And the fourth is cosmocentric,where you're attuned to the
world and beyond and energy andspirits, and I thought that was
really helpful many years agowhen I studied that.
Daniela SM (20:12):
Yeah, I bet you have never met anybody who started
to read all these when they were11 years old.
Catherine Duncan (20:18):
I actually have not, nope, nope.
Many people, including EckhartTolle, who I love and his work
is brilliant.
Of course, it's in their 20s,their 30s, they have some
incident or like an awakening,but this awakening for me
started at 11 years old.
Daniela SM (20:36):
Yes, yes, so you're very unique and it's amazing.
So, okay, so you did all thesestudies and became, you know,
changed from marketing to beinga chaplain, and so what happened
then?
Catherine Duncan (20:50):
So I became a chaplain.
I was at our level one traumahospital and I then went to
Fairview Hospice for a number ofyears.
It was such a privilege, suchsacred work to companion people,
walk with people going throughsuch upheaval.
I could feel, honestly, aresonance just because I had
walked that line, so it felt, ina way, almost comforting and
(21:14):
natural to be able to walk withpeople going through so much
trauma.
You know going through suchupheaval, because I had in my
life it also.
Following this path has justopened me up even further.
I write about this in my book.
I'm a mystic, I'm an intuitive.
I see spirits and angels andthat's just been even more
defined in the work being withpeople in crisis and who died.
(21:37):
Many, many people, for example,in hospice within after they
died, I was with them.
Within the days to a week wouldcome back and see me and they
would just be like I would openmy eyes and there would be a
shadow of their spirit and theywould just look at me and just
kind of nodding, thank you, andthen they'd be gone.
I mean it became so commonactually I had to put up energy
(21:58):
boundaries at night.
I had to be like pray.
You cannot come within 20 feetand wake me up.
I like had to sleep.
Daniela SM (22:08):
Yes, that's funny.
I was actually going to ask youbecause I don't think that when
you study these, you expectthat you were going to be
companion people until the endof their life.
That is something reallydifficult because it is sad.
Although you know that there islife after death, how do you
work for yourself to don't letthat affect you?
Catherine Duncan (22:27):
A couple of things I'd share.
First, I learned quickly and Ibelieve this completely that
death is not an end, that ourspirit goes on.
So because of the mysticabilities, I could see and sense
spirits in the room.
When someone was passing, whenthey actually were leaving their
body, I could feel their spiritcoming up and then out in the
room.
When someone was passing, whenthey actually were leaving their
body, I could feel their spiritcoming up and then out of the
(22:50):
top of their head.
So I felt like I was birthingpeople to the other side, which
was sacred soul, sacred andmagical really.
I mean, it's not an end, so Ishare that.
But then also one of the many,many practices I share in my
book on finding peace and easeis how to work with energy.
And for 20 plus years I've beenworking, I'm certified, trained
(23:12):
in many energy modalities Reiki, healing, touch but every one
of us, we are energy.
We have an auric field aroundus and we can take in a certain
amount of energy or not.
I mean it's how do we work withenergy?
So I work with what's calledenergy boundaries Every day of
my life.
It's habit I have for 20 yearsand it's game changer.
(23:34):
I just I feel breathing room, Ifeel like I'm all here,
especially for the years I wasaround patients.
You know high trauma would comein and I would see my doctor,
colleague, nurses.
I mean it's like so much traumaas an individual witnessing it
that you can take in and I.
That's when I really fine tunedhow to work with energy
boundaries.
I'm like I want to be presentand helpful to this patient and
(23:57):
the family in the waiting roombut I need to like not take in
all this trauma because it's toomuch.
Yes, I work with energyboundaries, which I do every
single day of my life, and Ijust it's, it's life changing.
Daniela SM (24:10):
Yes, I can imagine.
How do you develop all thesespiritual power?
I hear so many people that, oh,that is natural for them.
How do you develop that?
Cause you did the divinitycourses?
Is that where you learned that?
Or you did that on your own?
Catherine Duncan (24:26):
I would say I learned this starting at 11
years old.
I learned it through prayer,meditation, being in the moment,
being present.
These are skills and what Ishare in my book.
The five practices.
These are things I've livedorganically for most of my life.
I think it starts with eacheveryone hearing this right now
what are you choosing?
(24:46):
What are you wanting?
Do you want to have more peaceand ease and a sense of
aliveness?
It's a conscious choice, it's apractice, and that was really
the impetus and nudging to writethis book, which I feel like
was a calling.
I visually saw this book 10years prior as a vision, and I'm
like, and even told my familyI'm going to write a book and
(25:08):
they thought, great, great, it'sa practice.
It's a practice we're allchoosing, and a message in my
book is you know, what are youchoosing?
You don't have to wait untilyou're in crisis or end of life
to choose, to feel and cultivate, living from your heart in that
peace, that ease.
It's a choice we're making andeven just right in this moment,
(25:29):
tuning in how much in the moment, today, this day, are you
living in your mind, for example, when we're in our thinking
mind?
That's where all the sufferinghappens.
Can you take a break?
Notice, wow, I've been thinkingfor hours, I'm feeling unrest.
Can I just put your hands onyour chest and breathe for a
minute or two to just like, oh,come into your body, feeling
(25:53):
some spaciousness, so that peace, that ease, that aliveness on
this whole spiritual path?
It's not found in our mind,it's found in our body, our
body's, in the present moment.
It's found, taking some momentsto feel it, to cultivate it, to
practice it.
These are practices breathing,meditating.
I have many different ones Icould talk about, but that are
(26:13):
ways to experience coming in andfeeling your essence, your soul
moving in your body.
Daniela SM (26:20):
Wow, wonderful.
Let's talk about your book.
You knew 10 years before thatyou wanted to have this book.
How long did it take you towrite it?
Catherine Duncan (26:27):
It took about two years to write.
I started in pandemic.
Actually we had we reallyisolated.
My husband has a rare heartcondition.
He's doing well.
I write about that in my book.
My whole practice, privatepractice, went online and so I
had time at night and I just gotthis huge again nudging to sit
down and every night I wouldpray and meditate and sit at the
(26:49):
computer and I just it justflowed through me.
It was I had to write, it waspushing like coming through me.
So the whole process, writingmy book to finding a publisher,
all of that couple of years, itactually went pretty fast.
Daniela SM (27:02):
And the book is about your story and also
teaches people to do, as you say, different kind of meditations.
What else was the purpose ofthis book for you?
Catherine Duncan (27:12):
So my book.
It's called Everyday Awakeningand the subtitle Five Practices
for Living Fully, feeling,deeply Coming into your Heart
and Soul.
So the five practices I'llshare for just a minute come
back to the present moment.
The second is connect withsomething greater from you know,
broad ecumenical view.
The third is grow your trust,then embody love and hold
(27:35):
openness.
In that I share content aroundthis subject, but then I weave
in some of my experiences,client experiences, life
experiences and practices.
How do you feel into thepresent moment, how do you feel
more love?
How do you feel more flow?
So you're not just in your mind, but I give people just short
little exercises to experiencethis.
Daniela SM (27:57):
Wonderful, and do you so?
You're still working in thehospitals.
Catherine Duncan (28:01):
I do not.
I left my position as a hospicechaplain in 2018 to start my
private practice Again, feelingthis movement within me.
It was such sacred work, but Iwas starting to feel like, oh,
I'm ready to be with the living.
I'm not just people at end oflife dying every single day.
So now my practice is withpeople that are living big, full
(28:27):
lives, and many of them arelike I want more, I want more
peace, I want to feel more, Iwant to experience more.
Everything from executives anddoctors and lawyers to many
women just searching for men,searching for more.
So that is what my practice isabout.
Daniela SM (28:44):
Catherine, why the change?
You know, when you said I wantto be with the living, it sounds
like, yeah, I mean I will havesaid that before.
When you were telling me thatyou were doing that job, I'm
like, oh, that's a really hardjob, but you put it in a very
positive way.
So I wonder, why changing?
Catherine Duncan (28:58):
I think doing work like hospice chaplaincy,
working in like the emergencyroom, those kind of jobs that
are high stress, high trauma, Ithink it's a calling and I think
there's a period of time thatyou're called to that kind of
work.
For me it felt I felt so onpurpose and on track and exactly
(29:19):
where I was called to be doingthe work as a hospice chaplain
and also in our trauma hospital.
But then I just started to feellike you know, I'm ready to do
work with a broad range ofpeople, not just people at end
of life.
And I imagine because myhusband, eight years ago he was
(29:40):
completely healthy, reallyathletic and he had a really
tough experience where he ran orwas running one of our downtown
lakes in Minneapolis and thencollapsed, was in the ICU.
He flatlined, he 10 days laterwas diagnosed with a very rare
heart condition.
I'm so happy to say he is doingwell.
(30:01):
Hopefully he can live a longlife.
He's on very high level ofimmune suppressant drugs.
But I think that was also alife-changing experience of you
know here this is in my family,immediate family, and then I go
to work every day and I'm withpeople dying every day and I
just started to feel like oh, Ithink my message could be in a
(30:21):
broader capacity.
So I just think we're called tocertain parts of our work and
our career for periods of time,and it's about paying attention.
Daniela SM (30:30):
Yes.
What is the difference?
You help people transcend andnow you're helping people here,
you know, with their life.
Do you see this?
The same reward?
Catherine Duncan (30:39):
I used to help people and I still do once,
while not often, but helpingpeople leave their body and I
experienced many people within aday, days before they died,
where they would just be like,oh, this is it, this is life
they got, they awakened into thepreciousness of life and then
they died.
So I feel like it's the samekind of work, but it's with
(31:02):
people that are fully living,where they can awaken into the
moment, into their heart, intohow their soul's guiding them
into the oneness of life.
Now, in the moment, in the workwe do not just in a vertical
capacity of when people areabout to die.
Daniela SM (31:17):
But it could be a bit harder than now, because
you're so busy with work and youhave to do this and that and so
concentrating on the importantthings.
Sometimes people get deviatedfrom that.
Catherine Duncan (31:29):
And again, it's a choice.
It's a choice every one of usis making all day long.
How are you choosing to live?
Are you living from your headup?
Are you living holistically,from your heart and soul?
And I think we can livemultidimensionally.
What do I mean by that?
I think we can live anchored.
It's a lifelong practice.
I work at living anchored inthe moment, in the present
(31:50):
moment, living from that deepspaciousness.
Use our mind when we need touse our mind for work or
planning and then open into allother layers of reality.
I mean, right now I'm talkingto you, I'm anchored in the
moment, I'm using my mind totalk with you and I see spirits
floating in the room.
You know it's just like you canlive on all these levels right
(32:12):
now.
Daniela SM (32:13):
So yes, this is amazing.
You have such a wonderful story.
Catherine Duncan (32:17):
I would invite you to check out my
website, everydayawakeningcom.
My book is on Amazon, barnesand Noble.
It's all over If you like toread self-help.
This book is geared for peoplethat are starting on the path
and wanting more.
And can everyone listening, justtuning in, tuning into how is
(32:40):
your life?
Are you feeling a sense ofpeace and ease and breathing
room?
And I say that because life ismessy, it's hard.
There's right now, I do think,a lot of chaos in the world.
There's a lot going on.
So all the more reason of howcan you if this is part of what
you would like to have thatpeace, that ease, that joy,
(33:03):
living in that sense ofconnection, that oneness?
It's a daily choice and it's adaily practice and it's working
with exercises to like how can Igrow that?
The more you practice, forexample, experiencing the
present moment, if it's throughyour breath, if it's through
using your senses, if it'sthrough, like right now I'm
talking, feel what's your hands,your fingers, whatever's there
(33:27):
drops you out of your thinkingmind into the moment.
So, these little exercises tolike how does that feel and grow
that?
The more you do that, the moreyou crave that, the more like I
want to feel that more and youpractice it and it becomes.
It can become over time, theanchor of how you live.
And one takeaway also is I thinkwe're here on this earth to
(33:50):
learn to love.
How do we love?
It starts with loving ourselves.
How do we love ourselves?
The love we have is forourselves, is the love we can
give to another.
I think that's what we takewith us when we die our capacity
to love.
Daniela SM (34:06):
Yes, I believe that this is all at the end.
Everything is all about love.
Catherine Duncan (34:10):
Yes.
And we just get busy with otherthings that are not important
and the busyness like you talkabout and it is people can be,
and I get it too.
My life is very full, but againit's like okay, being mindful of
how am I going to live my life,but again it's like okay, being
mindful of how am I going tolive my life.
Yes, I have appointments and Ihave this and this, but even
small practices of starting yourday.
(34:32):
So, for example, in the morning, how do you start your day?
Do you have some moments ofjust deep presence, thankfulness
, gratitude, or do you grab yourphone and start thinking of
your day and you're in a stressresponse before you get out of
bed.
Phone and start thinking ofyour day and you're in a stress
response before you get out ofbed.
In the morning, I wake up and Ihave some minutes of gratitude
and I think about I'm here and Ithink about all the things I'm
(34:54):
grateful for and I feel it.
I feel that energy, love,gratitude, some of the highest
vibrational energy our body canhold, and I feel it and I can
feel my essence, my soul, andthen I have a few minutes of
prayer.
I do this.
It sets the tone for my day.
It's a choice, it's a practice.
Daniela SM (35:12):
Yes, and you know, everybody talks about that, but
not everybody does it.
It's the same as eating healthyor anything like that.
There is the formula,everybody's talking about it,
everybody knows what is theright thing and not everybody
does it.
Yes, and so I will puteverything in the show notes,
your book, your website, so thatpeople can reach out, and so
(35:34):
you are acting now as a coach ina way.
Catherine Duncan (35:37):
I I call myself an integrative spiritual
consultant and I have afull-time, robust practice.
I also do a lot of publicspeaking and then I'm still
doing a lot with my book andspeaking and podcasts.
Daniela SM (35:51):
Yes, great, great.
So it has been wonderful andthank you so much for sharing
this story and wish we had moretime.
I really appreciated yourbeautiful smile.
Your beautiful energy is justcompletely different than
anybody that I have met, and Iwant everybody to get your book.
Thank you for what you're doing.
You were strong and you wereresilient, and here you are
(36:13):
giving so much to the world.
Catherine Duncan (36:15):
Yeah, thank you.
You had great questions.
There were some good ones.
I'm like this is good, thankyou.
Thank you, a delight to talk toyou.
Daniela SM (36:24):
Lovely.
Yes, it was lovely.
Thank you so much.
I hope you enjoyed today'sepisode.
I am Daniela and you arelistening to, because Everyone
has a Story.
Please take five seconds rightnow and think of somebody in
your life that may enjoy whatyou just heard, or someone that
has a story to be shared andpreserved.
When you think of that person,shoot them a text with the link
(36:47):
of this podcast.
This will allow the ordinarymagic to go further.
Join me next time for anotherstory conversation.
Thank you for listening.
Hasta pronto.
Hi, I'm Daniela.
Welcome to my podcast.
Because Everyone has a Story,the place to give ordinary
people's stories the chance tobe shared and preserved.
Our stories become the languageof connections.
Let's enjoy it, connect andrelate because everyone has a
story and relate becauseeveryone has a story.
(00:30):
Welcome, my guest is atherineDuncan.
CKatherine is an integrityspiritual consultant, author,
holistic healer, inspirationalspeaker and resilient trainer.
She focuses on the whole person, healing emotionally and
spiritually.
Her journey began at age 10when she turned to existential
books, pleading with life as shebattled a rare form of cancer.
(00:51):
In our conversation, we exploreher path from breaking social
and family expectations tobecome the spiritual consultant
and writer that she is today.
atherine also shares howmorning mindfulness helps her to
set a positive tone of the day,highlighting the power of
self-love, gratitude and livingin the present, of peace and
(01:12):
connection.
But there is way moreinformation that she's sharing
with us in this episode.
Her energy and enthusiasm,which you could hear in her
voice, automatically lift myspirit.
I was so sad that we didn't havemore time to continue the
conversation.
I could have asked thousandsmore questions, but we have
(01:34):
limited time and she's extremelybusy.
I have already ordered her book, the Everyday Awakening.
I will let you know how it goes.
Let's enjoy her story.
Welcome, katrin, to the show.
I'm excited that you're heretoday.
Great to meet you.
Thank you, yes, and you have astory, so why do you want to
share your story?
Catherine Duncan (01:53):
I now have a new book out nationwide called
Everyday Awakening, and my bookis about what does it mean to be
alive right now, and that'swhat I want to share.
How are we choosing to liveevery day to find peace and ease
and aliveness?
It's a choice we're makingevery moment of our day.
Daniela SM (02:11):
Yes, beautiful, beautiful.
I'm happy that you're here, andso when does this story start
for you?
Catherine Duncan (02:18):
My story started when I was 11 years old.
I was suddenly actually 10,turning 11, gravely ill, taken
to the hospital and this is inthe 70s.
I was diagnosed with extremelyrare form of childhood cancer.
Statistics were grim.
(02:39):
I was given a 20% chance tolive, my parents were told, and
they I started intensivetreatments and surgeries and
back then they did havecounselors and chaplains.
No one talked to me and I couldjust feel like I was walking on
a tightrope between life anddeath.
It was.
They had no anti nausea drugs.
(03:00):
They did tons of amputation.
They did nothing in theseventies at the major
university hospital to reallyhelp comfort children, and
that's out of nowhere.
When I I just I started to prayand faith had meant nothing to
me, but I just decided I want tolive.
I prayed could I please live?
Not long after this feelingcame through my whole body, that
(03:22):
just like took my breath awayand it was just annoying.
I was going to live and it wasannoying.
I wasn't alone and that's whenmy journey started.
Daniela SM (03:31):
Why do you want to leave?
What is it that motivated youat 11 year old that wanted to
continue living?
Catherine Duncan (03:37):
You know it's interesting you ask that
question as an adult.
I look back and I had a prettytough childhood.
On the outside it looked niceand glamorous and father was
successful, big family, but myfather was verbally abusive to
me and it was just a toughchildhood and I have a memory of
just feeling like I wanted todie, like I was just done, and
(04:00):
after coming face to face withdeath, I just this feeling deep
within my heart and soul, mysoul, felt this nudging like I
want to live.
That's how it felt and that'swhat I followed.
Daniela SM (04:12):
Wow.
So you'd say you were notreligious, but you kind of
started to have some kind oftrust in something because you
really wanted to live.
Catherine Duncan (04:20):
Yeah, you know, my family intermittently
would go to church Lutheranchurch and it meant nothing to
me, but I just felt this nudginglike I want to live.
I don't want to die right now.
And that was my prayer.
I just started like praying tothe universe.
I just want to live.
And I actually was lived to be20.
(04:41):
I thought if I lived to be 20,I would see the world and I just
I told no one and I prayed andprayed and prayed and prayed,
and and that's when that feelingcame through my being and it
was just like you know, and it'sbeen with me to this day.
Daniela SM (04:57):
Wow, and so you have no siblings, nobody that you
you can talk to, anybody you cantrust it.
Catherine Duncan (05:03):
Yeah, I have five older siblings.
Actually one brother has died.
Three of my older siblings arequite a bit older, I think,
because my life it felt soextreme, going through and
having really intensivechemotherapy, radiation
surgeries, it was just so much.
And back then they really likewhen I would have stays in the
hospital they wouldn't even letparents hardly come in to see
(05:25):
you.
Daniela SM (05:26):
How long were you like that?
Catherine Duncan (05:27):
A couple years, couple years of treatment
, really intensive treatments.
Daniela SM (05:32):
And you?
You did you go to school or no?
Catherine Duncan (05:35):
I did.
I would have treatment everyweek and then like chemotherapy
the next day.
That was so, so sick throughthe night.
And the next day, I remember, Iwould just lay on the couch,
lethargic, and my mom bless herheart.
I mean, she would just be busydoing stuff around the house and
I'd be by myself all day justwatching some TV, just laying on
(05:57):
the couch.
And then the next day I'd goback to school and pretend like
nothing happened.
Daniela SM (06:02):
Wow, definitely feels lonely and very difficult.
Catherine Duncan (06:06):
Yep, yep, I didn't.
I actually wasn't until my 30sthat I did super hardcore
therapy to process.
I was finally was actually notuntil my middle 20s I started
having nightmares that I wasabout.
I started sitting up in bedthinking I was about to die and
I thought, if I don't do therapyto process, my childhood is
(06:27):
going to eat me up.
So it wasn't until latetwenties that I actually started
to process what happened to me.
Daniela SM (06:33):
So, when you were ill for two years, and then you
got better, obviously, and thenyou turn to 20, which is what
your goal was and what happened?
So you, you, you did say thatyou went to therapy and you were
having actually panic attacks.
So what happened?
Catherine Duncan (06:49):
Yeah, the year I got sick this drug came
in from Turkey, thischemotherapy drug that was
randomly being given because itcould cause heart problems and
my father demanded they give methat drug.
That drug is now standardtreatment for what I had.
Survival rate was 20%.
Now it's like over 80%.
So I mean that was a piece ofit also in prayer and I led a
(07:12):
pretty normal teenage life,except for here.
I was a teenager reading somany books on why am I alive?
What am I?
You know, I was reading allthese existential books
existentialism and who is man,and philosophy and theology.
I was trying to understand whywas I here?
Why did I survive?
(07:33):
It was how interesting, I know,not surprising.
All these years later.
What do I do?
And write a book about what itmeans to be alive?
I've been reading these bookssince a teenager what it means
to be alive.
Daniela SM (07:45):
I've been reading these books since a teenager.
I'm jumping here, but do youreally feel you found the answer
, because I think it's such adifficult thing to find.
I think we spent all our lifetrying to figure out why we're
here and who we are.
I thought that was the purposeof our life and you, however,
started since you were 11, whichusually we start later so you
(08:05):
managed to really be clear onthat.
Catherine Duncan (08:08):
Yes, I believe that and I learned this
at such a young age that we'rehere to live from our heart,
from our soul.
I mean, our journey is to livefrom the depth of our soul, and
that means not living and thisgoes back to just basics of
living in the present moment,tuning in.
Are you living your life headup?
(08:29):
Are you living your life inyour mind, or are you living
your life when you come into themoment, the preciousness of
just now?
Because when we're in our mind,we're in the past, we're in the
future, we're not even here,but we can feel into our body
through breath or just breathingmindful.
I mean, there's so manyexercises I could share and I
(08:50):
have 42 in my book about how tocome into the moment.
When you come into the moment,it's just like oh, that peace,
that ease, the spaciousness, theguidance, that deep inner
guidance within every one of usand the guidance that we receive
from the universe.
It's all there and that's it,and that's how I think we're
(09:10):
called to live our life from theinside out.
Daniela SM (09:12):
This didn't make you holistic completely.
You seem to be very balanced.
Catherine Duncan (09:17):
You know, I led a pretty normal teenage life
, Side note reading everyweekend about life and purpose
and all that.
And I went through college andthen I started out.
Just this year I started out inadvertising and I was with Time
magazine selling regional ads,making lots of money, and it was
really glamorous.
Not quite 10 years into it andmy heart was like this I was
(09:41):
feeling this nudging, like thisisn't it, this isn't what I'm
called to do.
I mean, I would go on businesstrips and bring stacks of book
on life and meaning and why arewe alive.
And my colleagues would seethis and they would just laugh
like what are you doing?
Why are you reading these books?
I knew in my heart that I knewI'd make a change and,
interestingly, my husband, who Imet we went to high school
(10:04):
didn't like each other.
We met after college and hesaid, catherine, you're going to
do something someday to helppeople.
And I remember thinking, I know, but he was right.
Actually, I had a near-deathexperience whitewater rafting on
a timing corporate trip.
That was finally like theturning point where I'm just
like I'm done.
I need to listen fully, wheream I being called?
(10:26):
And that's when, within a fewweeks after that experience
whitewater rafting I quit my jobwith Time Inc and started
praying like please, guidance,listening.
And that's what led me to thepath I'm on to this day.
Daniela SM (10:37):
Wow, wow.
You read a lot of books in the70s.
I'm sure you keep reading.
In the 70s, I'm sure you keepreading.
Would you say that there's morewonderful books?
That has come, or the basicidea really has always been
there.
Catherine Duncan (10:51):
I would say the basic idea has always been
there, even from a spiritual,religious perspective, christian
, or reading the Bhagavad orBuddhist texts.
I mean, I'll tell you, there'sa strong theme among all the
world religions and spiritualtraditions of you know how do
you live fully in this momentand how do you live from your
(11:16):
heart and soul?
It's, I think, a strong theme,regardless of any spiritual or
religious tradition.
Daniela SM (11:24):
Yes, that's what I've been learning, maybe a
little later than you, but Ifigured out that, yes, that's
the truth.
So you had this nearly deathexperience.
Would you not have changed ifthis didn't happen?
Catherine Duncan (11:37):
That's a really good question.
You wonder.
I have five older siblings.
My father was this consummatebusinessman and entrepreneur and
he's the rags to riches storysuper poor, to be very
successful, to run severalcompanies.
So all my siblings went intobusiness and so I went into
business.
And had that not happened, youwonder?
(11:58):
What I can tell you is thatafter the near-death experience
and it was crystal clear to meI'm done, I need to deeply
listen where I'm being calledand the synchronicity of, within
a few months, a girlfriend.
Late at night, my friend Connie,out of nowhere, said to me have
you ever thought of sayingtheology and spiritual direction
(12:20):
?
And I never thought of it.
No one in our family lineage,no one has that path.
And but when she said it I waslike, and when she mentioned one
school here in the twin cities,st Catherine's I got materials
and my body started physicallyshaking.
It was just a knowing this isit.
And so, going back to thefamily path, when I went out to
(12:42):
tell my father that not only Iquit time magazine but I was
going to study theology, hestarted yelling at me, screaming
at me, and at first he said youknow geology and I'm like no
theology.
And he was just like.
He couldn't take it, it wasjust like, but he ended up being
(13:04):
my biggest supporter before hedied.
But it was leaving.
The family paradigm is what itwas.
Daniela SM (13:10):
Yes, yes, wow.
Theology Tell me more aboutthat.
It seems like you have a moreholistic approach than religious
approach.
However, you wanted to know allabout it.
Catherine Duncan (13:19):
Yeah, I just started.
I have a master's in theologyand certified as a spiritual
director.
Then I got a master's indivinity and ordained and board
certified chaplain, like I justgot it all.
It took many years, butstudying theology, I just wanted
a deeper dive into faith andspiritual traditions.
(13:39):
And I'll tell you, the firstclass I had about Christian it
was mystics, theologians.
And when I started that class,when I was reading books, books
at night we had to read a bookor two every week.
I was like, oh, I found mypeople really.
Yeah, I was just like crying.
I was like my gosh, this iswhat I've been looking for since
(13:59):
a teenager oh wow.
Daniela SM (14:02):
You people criticize a lot about religion because it
separates communities at times,even though the message that is
there is about togetherness andrespect people.
It doesn't happen, so didn'tthat affect anything for you?
Catherine Duncan (14:20):
I wanted the academic training and the
knowledge, and that's why Ipursued all the degrees.
And then it was clear to me Ireally wanted to become a
chaplain and so I needed all thedegrees.
And then I it was clear to me Ireally wanted to become a
chaplain, and so I needed allthese degrees in the background
to be able to companion peoplegoing through crisis.
You know people.
My message there is be carefulwhat you pray for.
I was like whatever you want meto do, but I really I'll share
(14:45):
with you.
I really feel drawn to the wordspirituality, even though, yes,
I'm an ordained minister ofecumenical, very inclusive and
liberal.
But I like the wordspirituality for everyone, like
what gives you meaning andhelping people open into what is
that and it could be.
It could be a sense ofsomething beyond God, all of
(15:07):
Brahman.
It could be energy, true nature, it just.
I'm so inclusive in how I'veworked with thousands of people
to help them find what is thatthat gives them strength and
life.
Daniela SM (15:18):
But when you are going through these studies, are
they open for holistic lessons?
Catherine Duncan (15:24):
Absolutely yes, yep.
And when you go throughparticularly a good training
program as a chaplain I wentthrough a year residency and
then another couple of unitsthis is standard to become a
board certified chaplain.
The training is reallyinclusive and ecumenical and
(15:44):
open, because you can imagine achaplain I worked at our level
one trauma hospital and I alsoworked as a hospice chaplain.
I worked with people that werenot many atheists because they
weren't one or a chaplain, butagnostic to a faith and just a
broad breadth and of all faithbackgrounds.
So you really need steeptraining and how to meet someone
(16:06):
on their path, and it's notabout telling someone at end of
life or in crisis in any waythat this is the path.
That is not the training.
It's what can help them andgive them comfort when they're
going through some real upheavaland at end of life.
Daniela SM (16:22):
And so when you say that you're a chaplain, what is
that?
I'm sorry for my ignorance.
I don't know what it is.
Catherine Duncan (16:28):
Yeah, so a chaplain is that's a more
traditional term used whenyou're a spiritual advisor,
guide in a medical setting, soin a hospital, in a hospice
organization, or you're part ofthe medical team and you are the
one providing steeped, deep,emotional spiritual support.
(16:51):
And a chaplain like in hospiceI was with people that were
dying all day, every day.
I mean, that's just the workyou do and the family elects
having a chaplain as part of theteam and it's just trying to
provide comfort, comfort andguidance to a patient, to family
(17:12):
members, when the patient isagain going through some big
upheaval or crisis, end of life.
And it looks a little differentif you're a hospice chaplain or
a trauma chaplain, just in howsomeone comes in in those
instances.
But again, it's justcompanionship, providing love
and guidance and witness whenpeople are going through really
(17:35):
tough times.
Daniela SM (17:36):
That sounds amazing.
I didn't know about that.
That's wonderful, but so whenyou're studying theology, there
are people that go to differentpaths, and people will go to be
minister in a church, and sothere are a lot of different
areas that you can take.
Catherine Duncan (17:53):
Yes, you can take the path with a master's in
theology and divinity.
Many, many people take the pathof becoming a pastor, minister
of a church.
The field that I'm in is calledspecialized ministry, where you
can become a chaplain, aspiritual guide, in different
settings.
Some people go through theirtraining just for their personal
(18:15):
knowledge and education.
Daniela SM (18:17):
And is there any atheist people studying this at
all?
No right.
Catherine Duncan (18:22):
I would not say theology, divinity, they
would maybe be agnostic, likehaving a wondering.
They would maybe be agnosticlike having a wondering, not
sure Atheist, probably not.
I would say atheists wouldprobably lean towards more maybe
Buddhism, where there isn't anykind of God sense or God figure
, but more focused on presentmoment, alleviating suffering.
(18:45):
So you might choose a differentfaith, background or path if
that's the case.
Daniela SM (18:56):
Wow, how interesting , how interesting.
Having this episode here isalso opened my eyes and other
people.
I'm sure that theology is notjust about Catholicism and
people are also like, oh, Idon't want to hear about that.
I actually find that you arelearning more and the more that
you know about all kinds ofreligions, religious broad
spectrum that you have, andyou're more open minded as well.
Catherine Duncan (19:14):
A hundred percent and I'll share with you
because I thought this was ahelpful framework years ago when
I studied this.
There's an author out there.
His name is Ken Wilber.
He's known big nationalspiritual author.
He talks about the four stagesof spiritual development, which
I think are helpful.
The first is where someone isnumber one egocentric it's me,
(19:37):
me, me, me, me.
They just can't see beyondthemselves.
The second is ethnocentric,where people define and live
their life by their tribe so youknow, I am a Lutheran or I am
Buddhist or I am, you know wherethe tribe defines how they live
and practice their life.
The third is world-centric,where you are attuned to the
(19:59):
whole world and the movements.
And the fourth is cosmocentric,where you're attuned to the
world and beyond and energy andspirits, and I thought that was
really helpful many years agowhen I studied that.
Daniela SM (20:12):
Yeah, I bet you have never met anybody who started
to read all these when they were11 years old.
Catherine Duncan (20:18):
I actually have not, nope, nope.
Many people, including EckhartTolle, who I love and his work
is brilliant.
Of course, it's in their 20s,their 30s, they have some
incident or like an awakening,but this awakening for me
started at 11 years old.
Daniela SM (20:36):
Yes, yes, so you're very unique and it's amazing.
So, okay, so you did all thesestudies and became, you know,
changed from marketing to beinga chaplain, and so what happened
then?
Catherine Duncan (20:50):
So I became a chaplain.
I was at our level one traumahospital and I then went to
Fairview Hospice for a number ofyears.
It was such a privilege, suchsacred work to companion people,
walk with people going throughsuch upheaval.
I could feel, honestly, aresonance just because I had
walked that line, so it felt, ina way, almost comforting and
(21:14):
natural to be able to walk withpeople going through so much
trauma.
You know going through suchupheaval, because I had in my
life it also.
Following this path has justopened me up even further.
I write about this in my book.
I'm a mystic, I'm an intuitive.
I see spirits and angels andthat's just been even more
defined in the work being withpeople in crisis and who died.
(21:37):
Many, many people, for example,in hospice within after they
died, I was with them.
Within the days to a week wouldcome back and see me and they
would just be like I would openmy eyes and there would be a
shadow of their spirit and theywould just look at me and just
kind of nodding, thank you, andthen they'd be gone.
I mean it became so commonactually I had to put up energy
(21:58):
boundaries at night.
I had to be like pray.
You cannot come within 20 feetand wake me up.
I like had to sleep.
Daniela SM (22:08):
Yes, that's funny.
I was actually going to ask youbecause I don't think that when
you study these, you expectthat you were going to be
companion people until the endof their life.
That is something reallydifficult because it is sad.
Although you know that there islife after death, how do you
work for yourself to don't letthat affect you?
Catherine Duncan (22:27):
A couple of things I'd share.
First, I learned quickly and Ibelieve this completely that
death is not an end, that ourspirit goes on.
So because of the mysticabilities, I could see and sense
spirits in the room.
When someone was passing, whenthey actually were leaving their
body, I could feel their spiritcoming up and then out in the
room.
When someone was passing, whenthey actually were leaving their
body, I could feel their spiritcoming up and then out of the
(22:50):
top of their head.
So I felt like I was birthingpeople to the other side, which
was sacred soul, sacred andmagical really.
I mean, it's not an end, so Ishare that.
But then also one of the many,many practices I share in my
book on finding peace and easeis how to work with energy.
And for 20 plus years I've beenworking, I'm certified, trained
(23:12):
in many energy modalities Reiki, healing, touch but every one
of us, we are energy.
We have an auric field aroundus and we can take in a certain
amount of energy or not.
I mean it's how do we work withenergy?
So I work with what's calledenergy boundaries Every day of
my life.
It's habit I have for 20 yearsand it's game changer.
(23:34):
I just I feel breathing room, Ifeel like I'm all here,
especially for the years I wasaround patients.
You know high trauma would comein and I would see my doctor,
colleague, nurses.
I mean it's like so much traumaas an individual witnessing it
that you can take in and I.
That's when I really fine tunedhow to work with energy
boundaries.
I'm like I want to be presentand helpful to this patient and
(23:57):
the family in the waiting roombut I need to like not take in
all this trauma because it's toomuch.
Yes, I work with energyboundaries, which I do every
single day of my life, and Ijust it's, it's life changing.
Daniela SM (24:10):
Yes, I can imagine.
How do you develop all thesespiritual power?
I hear so many people that, oh,that is natural for them.
How do you develop that?
Cause you did the divinitycourses?
Is that where you learned that?
Or you did that on your own?
Catherine Duncan (24:26):
I would say I learned this starting at 11
years old.
I learned it through prayer,meditation, being in the moment,
being present.
These are skills and what Ishare in my book.
The five practices.
These are things I've livedorganically for most of my life.
I think it starts with eacheveryone hearing this right now
what are you choosing?
(24:46):
What are you wanting?
Do you want to have more peaceand ease and a sense of
aliveness?
It's a conscious choice, it's apractice, and that was really
the impetus and nudging to writethis book, which I feel like
was a calling.
I visually saw this book 10years prior as a vision, and I'm
like, and even told my familyI'm going to write a book and
(25:08):
they thought, great, great, it'sa practice.
It's a practice we're allchoosing, and a message in my
book is you know, what are youchoosing?
You don't have to wait untilyou're in crisis or end of life
to choose, to feel and cultivate, living from your heart in that
peace, that ease.
It's a choice we're making andeven just right in this moment,
(25:29):
tuning in how much in the moment, today, this day, are you
living in your mind, for example, when we're in our thinking
mind?
That's where all the sufferinghappens.
Can you take a break?
Notice, wow, I've been thinkingfor hours, I'm feeling unrest.
Can I just put your hands onyour chest and breathe for a
minute or two to just like, oh,come into your body, feeling
(25:53):
some spaciousness, so that peace, that ease, that aliveness on
this whole spiritual path?
It's not found in our mind,it's found in our body, our
body's, in the present moment.
It's found, taking some momentsto feel it, to cultivate it, to
practice it.
These are practices breathing,meditating.
I have many different ones Icould talk about, but that are
(26:13):
ways to experience coming in andfeeling your essence, your soul
moving in your body.
Daniela SM (26:20):
Wow, wonderful.
Let's talk about your book.
You knew 10 years before thatyou wanted to have this book.
How long did it take you towrite it?
Catherine Duncan (26:27):
It took about two years to write.
I started in pandemic.
Actually we had we reallyisolated.
My husband has a rare heartcondition.
He's doing well.
I write about that in my book.
My whole practice, privatepractice, went online and so I
had time at night and I just gotthis huge again nudging to sit
down and every night I wouldpray and meditate and sit at the
(26:49):
computer and I just it justflowed through me.
It was I had to write, it waspushing like coming through me.
So the whole process, writingmy book to finding a publisher,
all of that couple of years, itactually went pretty fast.
Daniela SM (27:02):
And the book is about your story and also
teaches people to do, as you say, different kind of meditations.
What else was the purpose ofthis book for you?
Catherine Duncan (27:12):
So my book.
It's called Everyday Awakeningand the subtitle Five Practices
for Living Fully, feeling,deeply Coming into your Heart
and Soul.
So the five practices I'llshare for just a minute come
back to the present moment.
The second is connect withsomething greater from you know,
broad ecumenical view.
The third is grow your trust,then embody love and hold
(27:35):
openness.
In that I share content aroundthis subject, but then I weave
in some of my experiences,client experiences, life
experiences and practices.
How do you feel into thepresent moment, how do you feel
more love?
How do you feel more flow?
So you're not just in your mind, but I give people just short
little exercises to experiencethis.
Daniela SM (27:57):
Wonderful, and do you so?
You're still working in thehospitals.
Catherine Duncan (28:01):
I do not.
I left my position as a hospicechaplain in 2018 to start my
private practice Again, feelingthis movement within me.
It was such sacred work, but Iwas starting to feel like, oh,
I'm ready to be with the living.
I'm not just people at end oflife dying every single day.
So now my practice is withpeople that are living big, full
(28:27):
lives, and many of them arelike I want more, I want more
peace, I want to feel more, Iwant to experience more.
Everything from executives anddoctors and lawyers to many
women just searching for men,searching for more.
So that is what my practice isabout.
Daniela SM (28:44):
Catherine, why the change?
You know, when you said I wantto be with the living, it sounds
like, yeah, I mean I will havesaid that before.
When you were telling me thatyou were doing that job, I'm
like, oh, that's a really hardjob, but you put it in a very
positive way.
So I wonder, why changing?
Catherine Duncan (28:58):
I think doing work like hospice chaplaincy,
working in like the emergencyroom, those kind of jobs that
are high stress, high trauma, Ithink it's a calling and I think
there's a period of time thatyou're called to that kind of
work.
For me it felt I felt so onpurpose and on track and exactly
(29:19):
where I was called to be doingthe work as a hospice chaplain
and also in our trauma hospital.
But then I just started to feellike you know, I'm ready to do
work with a broad range ofpeople, not just people at end
of life.
And I imagine because myhusband, eight years ago he was
(29:40):
completely healthy, reallyathletic and he had a really
tough experience where he ran orwas running one of our downtown
lakes in Minneapolis and thencollapsed, was in the ICU.
He flatlined, he 10 days laterwas diagnosed with a very rare
heart condition.
I'm so happy to say he is doingwell.
(30:01):
Hopefully he can live a longlife.
He's on very high level ofimmune suppressant drugs.
But I think that was also alife-changing experience of you
know here this is in my family,immediate family, and then I go
to work every day and I'm withpeople dying every day and I
just started to feel like oh, Ithink my message could be in a
(30:21):
broader capacity.
So I just think we're called tocertain parts of our work and
our career for periods of time,and it's about paying attention.
Daniela SM (30:30):
Yes.
What is the difference?
You help people transcend andnow you're helping people here,
you know, with their life.
Do you see this?
The same reward?
Catherine Duncan (30:39):
I used to help people and I still do once,
while not often, but helpingpeople leave their body and I
experienced many people within aday, days before they died,
where they would just be like,oh, this is it, this is life
they got, they awakened into thepreciousness of life and then
they died.
So I feel like it's the samekind of work, but it's with
(31:02):
people that are fully living,where they can awaken into the
moment, into their heart, intohow their soul's guiding them
into the oneness of life.
Now, in the moment, in the workwe do not just in a vertical
capacity of when people areabout to die.
Daniela SM (31:17):
But it could be a bit harder than now, because
you're so busy with work and youhave to do this and that and so
concentrating on the importantthings.
Sometimes people get deviatedfrom that.
Catherine Duncan (31:29):
And again, it's a choice.
It's a choice every one of usis making all day long.
How are you choosing to live?
Are you living from your headup?
Are you living holistically,from your heart and soul?
And I think we can livemultidimensionally.
What do I mean by that?
I think we can live anchored.
It's a lifelong practice.
I work at living anchored inthe moment, in the present
(31:50):
moment, living from that deepspaciousness.
Use our mind when we need touse our mind for work or
planning and then open into allother layers of reality.
I mean, right now I'm talkingto you, I'm anchored in the
moment, I'm using my mind totalk with you and I see spirits
floating in the room.
You know it's just like you canlive on all these levels right
(32:12):
now.
Daniela SM (32:13):
So yes, this is amazing.
You have such a wonderful story.
Catherine Duncan (32:17):
I would invite you to check out my
website, everydayawakeningcom.
My book is on Amazon, barnesand Noble.
It's all over If you like toread self-help.
This book is geared for peoplethat are starting on the path
and wanting more.
And can everyone listening, justtuning in, tuning into how is
(32:40):
your life?
Are you feeling a sense ofpeace and ease and breathing
room?
And I say that because life ismessy, it's hard.
There's right now, I do think,a lot of chaos in the world.
There's a lot going on.
So all the more reason of howcan you if this is part of what
you would like to have thatpeace, that ease, that joy,
(33:03):
living in that sense ofconnection, that oneness?
It's a daily choice and it's adaily practice and it's working
with exercises to like how can Igrow that?
The more you practice, forexample, experiencing the
present moment, if it's throughyour breath, if it's through
using your senses, if it'sthrough, like right now I'm
talking, feel what's your hands,your fingers, whatever's there
(33:27):
drops you out of your thinkingmind into the moment.
So, these little exercises tolike how does that feel and grow
that?
The more you do that, the moreyou crave that, the more like I
want to feel that more and youpractice it and it becomes.
It can become over time, theanchor of how you live.
And one takeaway also is I thinkwe're here on this earth to
(33:50):
learn to love.
How do we love?
It starts with loving ourselves.
How do we love ourselves?
The love we have is forourselves, is the love we can
give to another.
I think that's what we takewith us when we die our capacity
to love.
Daniela SM (34:06):
Yes, I believe that this is all at the end.
Everything is all about love.
Catherine Duncan (34:10):
Yes.
And we just get busy with otherthings that are not important
and the busyness like you talkabout and it is people can be,
and I get it too.
My life is very full, but againit's like okay, being mindful of
how am I going to live my life,but again it's like okay, being
mindful of how am I going tolive my life.
Yes, I have appointments and Ihave this and this, but even
small practices of starting yourday.
(34:32):
So, for example, in the morning, how do you start your day?
Do you have some moments ofjust deep presence, thankfulness
, gratitude, or do you grab yourphone and start thinking of
your day and you're in a stressresponse before you get out of
bed.
Phone and start thinking ofyour day and you're in a stress
response before you get out ofbed.
In the morning, I wake up and Ihave some minutes of gratitude
and I think about I'm here and Ithink about all the things I'm
(34:54):
grateful for and I feel it.
I feel that energy, love,gratitude, some of the highest
vibrational energy our body canhold, and I feel it and I can
feel my essence, my soul, andthen I have a few minutes of
prayer.
I do this.
It sets the tone for my day.
It's a choice, it's a practice.
Daniela SM (35:12):
Yes, and you know, everybody talks about that, but
not everybody does it.
It's the same as eating healthyor anything like that.
There is the formula,everybody's talking about it,
everybody knows what is theright thing and not everybody
does it.
Yes, and so I will puteverything in the show notes,
your book, your website, so thatpeople can reach out, and so
(35:34):
you are acting now as a coach ina way.
Catherine Duncan (35:37):
I I call myself an integrative spiritual
consultant and I have afull-time, robust practice.
I also do a lot of publicspeaking and then I'm still
doing a lot with my book andspeaking and podcasts.
Daniela SM (35:51):
Yes, great, great.
So it has been wonderful andthank you so much for sharing
this story and wish we had moretime.
I really appreciated yourbeautiful smile.
Your beautiful energy is justcompletely different than
anybody that I have met, and Iwant everybody to get your book.
Thank you for what you're doing.
You were strong and you wereresilient, and here you are
(36:13):
giving so much to the world.
Catherine Duncan (36:15):
Yeah, thank you.
You had great questions.
There were some good ones.
I'm like this is good, thankyou.
Thank you, a delight to talk toyou.
Daniela SM (36:24):
Lovely.
Yes, it was lovely.
Thank you so much.
I hope you enjoyed today'sepisode.
I am Daniela and you arelistening to, because Everyone
has a Story.
Please take five seconds rightnow and think of somebody in
your life that may enjoy whatyou just heard, or someone that
has a story to be shared andpreserved.
When you think of that person,shoot them a text with the link
(36:47):
of this podcast.
This will allow the ordinarymagic to go further.
Join me next time for anotherstory conversation.
Thank you for listening.
Hasta pronto.
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