Glenn Van Peski shares his journey from free-range kid to ultralight backpacking pioneer and accidental entrepreneur. His experiences include a cross-country bicycle adventure at 17, surviving an airplane incident, and founding Gossamer Gear, a multi-million dollar company, without ever taking a salary from it.
Glen, known by his trail name "Legend," is celebrated for his significant contributions to the backpacking community. A native Californian, his backpacking journey began when he led his son's Scout troop in their backpacking program.
• Growing up as a "free-range kid" in Southern California before moving to Massachusetts after parents' divorce
• Cycling 4,200 miles across America after high school graduation in 1976
• Finding civil engineering career through chance encounter
• Learning to sew from his mother as a basic life skill
• Starting Gossamer Gear by making ultralight backpacks for himself, then reluctantly for others
• Keeping his day job as a civil engineer rather than relying on his gear company for income
• Meeting Whole Foods co-founder John Mackey, who purchased majority stake in Gossamer Gear
• Writing "Take Less, Do More" after years of encouragement from Mackey
• Being influenced by his mother's generous spirit and motto "noblesse oblige"
• Practicing contentment while maintaining curiosity about new possibilities
• Donating all profits from his book to the Pacific Crest Trail Association
To connect with Glen: https://www.glenvanpeski.com/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Daniela SM (00:01):
Hi, I'm Daniela.
Welcome to my podcast, becauseEveryone has a Story, the place
to give ordinary people'sstories the chance to be shared
and preserved.
Our stories become the languageof connections.
Let's enjoy it, connect andrelate, because everyone has a
story.
Welcome.
(00:21):
My guest is Glen Van Peski, aretired civil engineer,
entrepreneur, lifelong inventorand adventurer.
From an early age, Glen hasbeen creating, exploring and
embracing new challenges.
He is also someone who deeplyvalues generosity, finding ways
to share his blessings in bothtraditional and unexpected ways.
(00:44):
His story beautifully connectsthe idea of minimalism in the
wilderness to living a moreabundant, intentional life.
In his book Take Less, do More,Glen dives into how the wisdom
of ultralight backpackingextends far beyond the outdoors.
You pack weight isn't the onlything you can lighten in life.
(01:06):
Glen's philosophy is refreshing.
Contentment and ambition cancoexist.
Generosity leads to trueabundance and curiosity doesn't
have to bring discontentment.
I recorded this conversationwhile spending seven weeks in
Malaga, which felt like perfecttiming.
With Dave and I on the road forthe past five months, Glen's
(01:29):
insights really resonated withme.
It was an absolute pleasure tohave him on the podcast and I
hope you enjoy our conversation.
Welcome, Glenn, to the podcast.
Glen Van Peski (01:40):
Thanks, Daniela, pleasure to be here.
Daniela SM (01:41):
Yes, I am super excited that you are here and
that you are a hiker, a travelerand all these things that I'm
actually looking at in yourwebsite.
Glen Van Peski (01:50):
Yeah, I was thinking of you.
Actually, last night we werewatching some dumb movie on
Netflix, someone that moves toItaly not Spain but buys a
one-euro house, and it made methink of you.
Know, you living in a what's tome a foreign country and
adventures there.
Daniela SM (02:07):
Yes, it was his father and a daughter.
Glen Van Peski (02:09):
Yes.
Daniela SM (02:10):
Great, All right.
So my first question is why doyou want to share your story?
Glen Van Peski (02:15):
I love the title of your podcast because
everyone has a story, becausethat's been my experience.
You know people sometimes say,oh, glenn, it seems like your
story is so interesting or youhave an interesting life, and it
doesn't seem that way to mebecause it's just my life.
But I find that if we take thetime which we usually don't have
(02:36):
the time to really listen, youknow, to sit down with someone
for an extended period of time,everyone has an interesting
story.
Mine might be interesting tosome people, and if some people
can learn something from that,brings them some ideas to make
their life better, well thenthat's great.
Daniela SM (02:54):
Yes, and also because you have a book.
Glen Van Peski (02:56):
Yes, I ended up writing a book, was pestered to
do it by a friend of mine.
You know, I am, as you pointedout, a backpacker.
I mean, many people have done alot more backpacking than I
have.
But to your average ordinaryperson that probably seems like
I've done a lot of backpackingbecause I'm an engineer.
I want to backpack with theleast amount possible because it
(03:18):
makes it more enjoyable whenyou're carrying less weight, and
I know you and I have talkedabout applying this to other
travel adventure travel andaround the world and I realized
that, after call it, 50 years ofworking to minimize the amount
I take, backpacking, that therewere a lot of lessons that apply
to the rest of life also, andso that's why I wrote take less,
(03:39):
do more.
Daniela SM (03:40):
Wonderful, so we will talk about that too.
And so when does your storystart?
Glen Van Peski (03:44):
Well, the story starts for me when I was born,
grew up in Southern California,was lucky enough to grow up as a
free range kid.
Before the internet wasinvented, we were just gone on
our bikes, digging, climbing,playing all day, as long as you
were home for dinner.
My parents had no idea where wewere, which was, you know, so
(04:05):
great to grow up like that.
We're just outside, beingactive and having using our
imaginations.
That kind of came to ascreeching halt when I was in
fourth grade my parentsannounced at the dinner table
they were getting a divorce kindof a shocker and we moved.
We left sunny SouthernCalifornia and moved to Western
Massachusetts in the middle ofwinter.
Daniela SM (04:24):
Oh wow, that show was shock.
Glen Van Peski (04:26):
You know, went to school there, graduated high
school and decided it would be afun adventure to ride my
bicycle across the United States.
So spent that summer in 1976,riding 4,200 miles across the
country, getting back to theWest Coast.
And then got offered a job whenI was out here and, you know,
(04:48):
kind of never left the WestCoast been up and down the West
Coast ever since.
Daniela SM (04:52):
Okay, I was reading your fun facts.
In 1976, after graduating highschool, you rode your bicycle
4,200 miles from Massachusettsto California.
Glen Van Peski (05:04):
Yeah, and people ask me like, oh, were you
always an adventurous sort?
And I really wasn't.
I was kind of a book, you know,graduated with like almost
straight A's.
I don't know, I wasn't like anadventurous person.
So I have no idea why I gotthis into my head that this
would be a good, fun thing to do, but it sure was.
(05:25):
And actually I'm in touch withthe three other guys that went
with me and we're talking aboutnext year, the 50th anniversary
of our ride, getting back on ourbicycles and riding back the
other direction.
So we'll see if that happens.
Daniela SM (05:40):
Oh wow.
So you said that you were anadventurer, but what made you
decide, okay, I'm going to ridemy bike I?
Glen Van Peski (05:44):
I enjoyed languages in high school I took
(06:13):
Latin, greek, french and,briefly, german, and so I had
some vague thought of doingsomething with languages, maybe
being an interpreter, but youknow I hadn't really done
anything on that.
And then rode the bicycleacross the United States with my
friends, ended up staying withmy dad who was still in
(06:33):
California, had remarried.
Friend of theirs who had a smallcivil engineering firm, offered
me a job and so I took that andthat set me on my 50-year
career as a civil engineer.
I know it seems strange howthings have worked out and I'm
an engineer, I'm kind of aplanner.
Yeah, you know for not reallyhaving a plan.
Things worked out pretty well.
Daniela SM (06:54):
Well, you didn't know that you were a civil
engineer and maybe you're a verywell-mixed, that you can plan
and not plan and still be anengineer.
Glen Van Peski (07:02):
I guess, yeah, plan and no plan and still be an
engineer?
I guess, yeah, and I have.
You know I have have becomemore intentional, uh, since I
was 17,.
You know about thinking aheadand thinking like, okay, uh,
yeah, I'm an engineer, but youknow I should work to develop
some other skills.
You know public speaking andwriting and, uh, leadership and
(07:27):
management.
So you know I have been moreintentional as I got older,
luckily.
But yeah, it's worked out.
Daniela SM (07:31):
There you go, well-rounded person.
I think these days people areactually thinking more of that
to be, not just to know onething, that you have to know
many things.
Especially some people havethis desire of learning.
You know curiosity in you.
This is part of your book.
You know the lessons are forgenerosity and curiosity, right?
Glen Van Peski (07:53):
yes, yeah I think it's important, curiosity
is important yeah, it's alwaysgood to, I think, be curious
about things and notice things,because that's where
opportunities lie, you know,wondering about things.
And of course, engineers, Ithink, are kind of inherently
(08:17):
probably curious, alwaysthinking like I wonder if
there's a better way to do that.
Or you know, what would I do ifI was in that situation?
But yeah, I always when I, youknow, talk at schools or
something like that toengineering students and
especially, you know, these days, with AI and having being
(08:37):
really good at one technicalskill might not be the most
stable, long-term career.
So I think it's great to kindof branch out a little and be
more well-rounded, like you said.
Daniela SM (08:49):
Yeah, I read once that curiosity is when you know
something a little bit and youwant to know more.
But if you don't know about it,if you're not curious and so
that was quite interestingbecause it's true I mean, if I
don't know that something exists, I wouldn't be curious about it
.
But then you know, when youknow a little bit, you're like
maybe curious about what is that?
How do I do this?
And I don't know if you agreewith that, because now that I'm
(09:12):
saying it, I'm not too sure ifthat is correct.
Glen Van Peski (09:15):
Well, to me, I think part of that is the
noticing.
To me, I because many peopleyou know, will walk by something
and not notice it, and if youdon't notice it, I think it's
the first step of noticing.
It's like I wonder how thatworks, or I wonder what that
person is doing, or you knowthat to me, then you can be
(09:38):
curious.
But if you don't notice, ifyou're too focused on I got to
get to my next appointment orI'm worried about something, or
you don't notice, and then youcan't be curious.
Daniela SM (09:48):
So you went to university in California and
graduated as a civil engineerand stayed there all your life.
You had a family.
What happened next?
Glen Van Peski (09:56):
Well, I worked for a couple of years, first in
engineering, then went to schooland graduated from California
State University, northridgewhich fun thing.
I'm going down next month givea presentation there university.
I haven't been there for 50years almost now, so that'll be
fun to see how it's changed.
Yeah, yeah, the Dean ofEngineering is a backpacker, so
he found my book, so that'll befun.
(10:18):
But yeah, I graduated, I movedto San Diego, got married, moved
to San Diego to start working,worked for other people, started
my own company, had some kids,was almost killed in a plane
crash, shut my company down,went to work for a big company
and then went to work for thecity that we lived in, you know,
(10:40):
accidentally started a gearcompany along the way and then
retired and moved up to Oregon.
So still on the West, but notCalifornia.
Daniela SM (10:56):
Another fun fact from you was that you're a pilot
.
Yeah, actually, basically noinjuries.
Glen Van Peski (11:00):
I had some scratches, but no injuries.
The pilot was killed.
And I have been thinking aboutthis because just this morning
that plane flipped upside downwhile crash landing in Toronto.
It seems like there's been alot of plane crashes recently,
so, yeah, it always makes methink about my plane crash.
When you get a pilot's license,you always have a license.
(11:22):
I'm not currently certified.
Daniela SM (11:23):
But you're still a pilot.
Glen Van Peski (11:25):
It didn't affect you, I'm not current and I
don't fly small planes.
After the crash I didn't wantthat to be my last experience in
a small plane.
So a buddy of mine fromToastmasters had his pilot's
license and I said, hey, whydon't you take me up?
So I decided you know, I had ayoung family engineering
(11:45):
business.
Like I'm probably not going tospend a lot of time flying, I
wanted to go up one more time ina small plane.
So I went up with my buddy fromToastmasters and we flew over
to the desert and had breakfastor something.
We were coming back.
The tower is sequencing him kindof behind a larger regional jet
(12:06):
.
If you're too close behindanother plane, the plane creates
turbulence which can well itcan flip you over if you're too
close.
And so they were telling him toslow down to get more distance
between this jet that waslanding, and so he was dumping
some flaps and trying to slowthe airspeed down.
He was still too close.
(12:27):
So he said, ah, we're not goingto make it.
And what he meant was, you know, he was too close and he wasn't
going to be able to land.
He was going to have to goaround in the pattern another
time.
But I said I said I'dappreciate it if you'd pick
different words, then we're notgoing to make it.
So yeah, we landed safely andthat was the my last time in a,
(12:51):
you know, really small plane.
Daniela SM (12:54):
Yes, yeah exactly.
Glen Van Peski (12:56):
I knew what he meant, but the power of words,
yeah, I mean it's more funnythan scary.
Daniela SM (13:04):
I mean I knew what he meant so, yeah, yours was
pretty scary, for sure.
Oh, you knew what he meant.
So that's another another thing.
Okay, okay, good, good, allright, and so you were in San
Diego.
Yeah, and that's something Ialways recommend to people
Toastmasters is such a greatprogram.
Glen Van Peski (13:25):
I mean, I think public speaking is something
that what's they say?
It's like people are moreafraid of public speaking than
of dying.
I mean it's like the number onefear.
But I always figured that, youknow, no matter how smart you
are, how hard you work toaccomplish really most anything
is going to involve other people, and so having that ability to
(14:00):
express your ideas andmotivation to others through
speaking and writing, I think is, you know, super important
skill that everyone should have.
Oh, I haven't done it for yearsand years, but I was in it for
probably 10 years.
Daniela SM (14:07):
How many years have you been with Toastmasters?
20 years ago, so.
When was the last time you werethere?
Okay, so then you wereToastmasters pilots when our
oldest son, brian, was oldenough.
Glen Van Peski (14:24):
he joined Boy Scouts and so then I joined as
an adult leader.
It was a very active troop, dida lot of activities summer
camps, week-long canoe on theColorado River and a lot of
backpacking, including thecapstone trip was a week in the
(14:45):
Sierra Nevada mountains ofCalifornia.
We were preparing for this andI didn't have my gear from when
I was in Boy Scouts back inMassachusetts, so we had to go
get new gear.
It was all pretty heavy Aboutthis time.
My buddy, reed Miller, who Imet through Toastmasters and
also through the civilengineering he was a land
(15:06):
developer.
He read Ray Jardine's book, thePacific Crest Trail Hiker's
Handbook, which was talkingabout ultralight backpacking,
and he had gear lists in therewhere his base weight, which is
the weight of all your gearexcept for food and water,
weighed around eight pounds.
And that was unbelievable to mebecause the backpack that I
(15:29):
just purchased at REI weighedseven and a half pounds empty
before you put anything in it.
But it got me to thinking.
Since I knew how to sew, Istarted sewing some gear, and I
had I'd actually sewn some gearway back in 1976 for that
bicycle trip.
I sewed myself a tarp, a littlemesh liner to keep the bugs out
(15:51):
.
So I'd already done some sewing.
My mom thought every kid shouldleave home knowing how to cook,
bake and sew.
She just considered those basiclife skills.
Whatever you're going to do inlife, you should know how to do
those three things.
So all three of us kids knowhow to do those three things.
So I started sewing gear.
I sewed a pack, used that andthen, being an engineer, I
(16:12):
couldn't help thinking like,well, how could this be a little
better?
So then of course, I sawanother pack and my buddy Reed
Miller started calling them, youknow, the G1, cause my name
starts with a G and the G2.
And finally the fourth pack.
I'd gotten it to where I itreally fit, where I was at that
point, my gear.
I think I think some of thosethey weighed under a pound and
(16:34):
so that was a big weight savingsright there compared to my
seven, seven pound backpack fromREI.
This was early internet days andI put the plans on the internet
so that other people could makethem.
Other people's moms hadn'ttaught them how to sew, so I
would get emails saying hey, Idon't know how to sew, can you
sell me a pack?
And at this point I'm working60, 70 hours a week doing
(16:57):
engineering.
It's like no, I can't sell me apack.
And at this point I'm working60, 70 hours a week doing
engineering.
It's like no, I can't sell youa pack.
But eventually I got enoughemails that I felt bad for these
people, that they didn't knowhow to sew, and so I was talking
to the people the sisters inFlorida that that I got
materials from, and talkingabout this problem, and they
said well, you know, there'ssomeone in Seattle that does
(17:20):
sewing, contract sewing.
And so I checked them out anddecided to.
I wanted to get 25 packs madebecause I thought then everyone
who was emailing me would have apack and I could get back to
the engineering.
So I started talking to Montyup in Seattle and he says oh,
our minimum order is a hundred.
A hundred packs, oh my gosh.
(17:40):
So we finally went back andforth and finally settled on 50.
And I thought, okay, they'll bein the garage for the next five
years, but I'll eventually getrid of them, no big deal.
So our son, brian, the oldestone, who was in scouts, then put
together a very rudimentarywebsite that would send me an
email.
People could fill out a littleorder form with their name and
(18:01):
address, and then it would sendme an email with their order,
and then they would mail a check.
That's how sophisticated wewere.
And so I'm working at my deskone day doing engineering and
then suddenly I get an email.
I go, we have an order.
I hadn't thought that far ahead, so I just grabbed a pad of
yellow paper and wrote down theorder.
I still have that yellow, thosesheets yellow lined paper with
(18:22):
those early orders.
So anyway, before I even gotthe first shipment from Monty, I
had 86 orders, more than the 50packs that I thought was going
to take me five years to get ridof.
So we had to order more fabric.
And then things kind ofsnowballed from there.
Daniela SM (18:42):
And where was your mom all this time?
Glen Van Peski (18:44):
Oh, my mom was back in Massachusetts still.
Daniela SM (18:47):
Did you call her and say thank you for teaching me
how to sew?
Glen Van Peski (18:50):
She was proud that you know my sewing skills
had launched.
You know what's now amultimillion dollar business.
Daniela SM (18:57):
Yeah, wow, it's true .
People don't know how to sewthese days.
Glen Van Peski (19:00):
Yeah.
Daniela SM (19:01):
I am glad I learned how to do it, yeah.
Glen Van Peski (19:03):
I think everyone should know how to do it.
It's just basic skills and it'sfun.
I know some people that aretrying to bring that back.
We have a lot of friends inJapan.
There's this cool place theycall it Miog make your own gear
movement and they have a placethat has all the fabric and they
have sessions where people comein after work or on the
weekends and they'll haveclasses and they start making
(19:25):
their own stuff sacks and simplestuff and people go on to make
backpacks and tents and bags fortheir bike.
And actually I'm going to givea talk here in Bend there's a
local used gear store that wantsto kind of start something like
that, you know, to bring backteaching people how to, how to
sew and just make basic stuff.
Daniela SM (19:45):
Yes, no, it makes sense to to be recyclable as
well, and sometimes you know itgoes according to your needs,
which, in a way, is what likereally wealthy people do.
I need this and I want it thisway, so if you can make it
yourself, then it is like madefor you exactly.
Glen Van Peski (20:00):
You can customize it and you know how it
was built.
So if you know that theshoulder straps always wear,
wear out, you can add extrastitching there.
Or if you know shoulder strapson ready-made packs are
uncomfortable for your frame,you can modify them so that it
works better for you.
So, yeah, there's so many funthings you can do when you know
(20:21):
how to sew.
Daniela SM (20:22):
Yeah, that's true.
So I'm glad that we're goingback in North America and the
West Coast.
At least people will beinterested in something like
that too, not just in Japan.
Glen Van Peski (20:30):
You know, in Japan it's important to them
because they want people to beconnected to their outdoor
adventures.
You know, if you just go buy abunch of stuff and take it
outside, it's not the same aswhen you're going with something
that you've actually made withyour own hands.
Daniela SM (20:44):
That's true.
I mean this goes toachievements too.
The things that make me thehappiest are those things that
have been difficult, that I havemanaged to fix or achieve or do
something.
You know those are the ones Iremember the most versus.
You know, something easy thatcame along, yeah, when you make
your own, that is just morespecial.
Glen Van Peski (21:05):
Yeah, you get to struggle with the.
You know what are the choices.
Do I want to make it lighter ormore durable?
Do I want to make it morecomfortable or more functional?
Or you know, you get to makeall those choices and then, when
you use it, I always tellpeople.
Sometimes I have people come upto me after talking oh you know
, I'm making my own pack.
Or I made my own pack and Isaid, well, just just know that
(21:27):
it won't be the last one.
You know, when you makesomething yourself and use it,
then you start thinking aboutwell, I could make it a little
better, a little lighter,different color, or something
like that.
Daniela SM (21:38):
So yeah, of course.
Of course, the possibilitiesare endless.
Then you start thinking moreand more Great, great, okay, so
that company is successful.
But you didn't want to dealwith that because you still
loved your job as a civilengineer.
Glen Van Peski (21:55):
Yeah, I never, never, quit my day job.
Gossamer Gear is now a hugecompany.
I never took a salary from thecompany.
That's a different story thanmost people have.
I mean, the typical story isyou know you're working, you
start your side hustle and thenit becomes big and successful
and then you do that full-time.
I've told our sons this, bothof whom have had side hustles is
(22:19):
I think there's a case to bemade for keeping the side hustle
as the side hustle.
I know people who they're ahiker.
They do a lot of hiking.
They make some of their owngear, then they start a gear
company and then all of a suddenthey're not going hiking
anymore because they're runninga company and they're hassling
(22:40):
with distributors and trying tosell stuff and have enough money
to buy supplies.
And you know, it's not the joythat it once was.
They have to worry aboutgetting health insurance and
things like that.
So I think there's certainly acase to be made and everyone has
different goals and objectivesbut of keeping the side hustle
(23:01):
as the side hustle, because it'svery freeing.
I always worked full-time as anengineer and so that paid the
mortgage, put the kids throughcollege, so I didn't need to
make money from the gearbusiness so I could make what I
wanted to make.
I didn't have to make whatpeople wanted because I didn't
care if it sold or not.
I didn't need the money.
(23:22):
So that freed me to makecreative decisions on what I
thought was important.
And so you know, if you look atlike our early, our early gear
lineup was basically the gearthat I used and I needed.
And so, as as my pack gotlighter, the packs we sold got
lighter and lighter, and peoplewould call me up and say, well,
(23:44):
you know, convince me, I shouldbuy your pack instead of someone
else's.
And I said, well, I reallydon't care because I'm not
paying myself from this anyway,so buy whatever you think is
going to work for you.
Um, I'm not going to waste mytime trying to convince you to
buy my pack, and then peoplewould call up and say, well, I
think you should make it thisway, or you should make this
product.
And I'd say, well, thank you,but that's not something I'm
(24:07):
interested in, so why don't yougo make that product?
If you think that's somethingthat's valuable, frees you up.
You don't need to worry aboutwhat people want or what people
will buy, because you don'treally care.
You're just making what youwant, and if other people think
that's great, then they can buyit, and if they don't, they can
buy something else.
Daniela SM (24:24):
I feel like if you stay in your job, it's because
you really like your job,because people usually don't
like to stay in a job that theydon't like.
So you were doing somethingthat you really enjoyed.
Glen Van Peski (24:34):
That's true.
I mean I was working as a civilengineer and I like working as
a civil engineer.
I mean it wasn't my originalplan when I was in high school
solving problems, and it's great, because every piece of land is
different, so there's differentchallenges of you know, where's
the sewer going to go, where'sthe water come from, how does
(24:55):
the rainfall drain?
Um, how do you minimize theamount of dirt you have to move
to create the project?
So I enjoyed civil engineering,working for myself, I enjoyed
working for other people, Ienjoyed working for the city, um
, you know, being on the otherside, on the permitting side.
So, and it, you know, it couldjust be.
(25:16):
I'm an agreeable kind of guy.
I could, I, I suspect I couldbe happy doing a lot of
different things.
Daniela SM (25:24):
Yeah, that was my other question, that you
probably are a contentindividual.
Glen Van Peski (25:27):
I think so, yeah , I'm, I'm pretty content.
Daniela SM (25:30):
You don't need much to be happy.
Glen Van Peski (25:32):
Exactly, and that's, and that is one of the
lessons from ultralightbackpacking is how little you
actually need to be happy.
Daniela SM (25:41):
If you're curious.
Curiosity makes you wonder more, and so sometimes it doesn't
allow you to be content, becauseyou want more.
Glen Van Peski (25:51):
I guess it depends on your curiosity.
If you were curious like, well,what would it be like if I
drove a really expensive car?
Or I'm curious what it would belike if I had a huge house, or
I'm curious what it would belike to fly first class, I guess
the curiosity could lead todiscontentment.
But I don't know, I don't knowif that hasn't been my personal
(26:14):
experience.
You could be curious aboutsomething without being obsessed
with it.
You know, you wonder, I'mcurious like what is it like to
be worth a hundred billiondollars?
But I don't, I don't, I'm notgoing to be pursuing that.
Daniela SM (26:28):
Yeah, maybe people that are doers.
They're more like doing, doing,doing all the time so you can
be content.
I have met a few people thatare content, so I don't know
what is the personality thing.
I think I guess if you're aBuddhist, that's what you're
supposed to go to.
Glen Van Peski (26:42):
Contentment yeah , and I'm not a Buddhist and I
don't have really any helpfuladvice for contentment.
I mean part of my contentmentcomes from my faith as a
Christian.
I think some of it could bepersonality, although that can
change too.
I mean part of my contentmentcomes from my faith as a
Christian.
I think some of it could bepersonality, although that can
change too.
I mean I was a very anxiouschild through junior, high and
(27:05):
high school, not very content.
It's your play betweencuriosity and contentment, and
contentment doesn't mean youdon't strive either.
I mean I'm contented, but I havea long to-do list of things I
like to do and things that Iwant to accomplish.
For a content person, I don'tsit well.
I don't just sit and be well.
(27:25):
That's something I have to workon, because I tend to always be
doing something.
Daniela SM (27:29):
You're a very interesting combination.
Glen Van Peski (27:32):
So I see your eyebrows.
It's that tension betweenalways wanting I guess always on
the go and wanting to do thingsbut being content with that
well, you liked your job andthat's the most important thing.
Daniela SM (27:46):
You have a career and you enjoy.
And then you got more ideas andbroad side hustles, but you're
also not greedy.
Generosity, isosity, is also apart of you.
Glen Van Peski (27:57):
Yeah, I mean, that was another thing actually
from my mom is the importance ofbeing generous.
You know she would always saynoblesse oblige.
You know, if you have comeswith an obligation of using that
to make other people's livesbetter, it's not there just so
you can buy a second jet andhave a bigger boat.
(28:21):
And so you know, we startedsmall and today we give away a
significant chunk of our incomejust because we have plenty.
You know, more isn't going tomake our life better.
Daniela SM (28:33):
So your mom seems to be an important person in this
whole story that she was fromSouth Africa.
Glen Van Peski (28:39):
Yeah, she was born in South Africa.
For her time women weresupposed to, you know, get
married, have kids, kind ofmanage the household staff, play
bridge and plan parties waspretty much the plan for women
in her society at that time.
And so she came over to theUnited States, to Wellesley
(29:03):
College, and after two years herdad said well, I'm not paying
for it anymore because it's awaste to educate a woman.
You're just going to come home,get married and have kids.
My mom was having none of that.
Wellesley somehow found somescholarships so she could finish
and get her degree in geography.
And then she met my dad who wasgoing to MIT he is an engineer
(29:28):
also and they got married andshe never went back to South
Africa.
I mean, she went back later fora to live for a while, but that
was long after the kids weregone.
So yeah, she was kind of a moldbreaker for her time.
For sure, she was more likelyleading a protest march or
playing her guitar at somehootenanny or something.
(29:49):
Yeah.
Daniela SM (29:50):
That's fun, that's good.
I guess it's so beautiful whenour parents teach us beautiful
things, especially generosityand gratitude, and your siblings
are similar to you.
Glen Van Peski (30:02):
No, I am kind of the black sheep of my family,
pretty much.
I'm the only one that doesn'tcurrently play a musical
instrument.
I was in the band when I was inhigh school, junior high and
high school.
Never really good at music, andthat's a big part of my
brothers and sisters lives stillWell, I guess, to them.
(30:24):
I'm living the alternativelifestyle.
I'm the only one to graduatefrom college, only one to
graduate from a traditional highschool.
So they've taken differentpaths.
My sister has a farm.
She does flower essences, sellsthem online and has a farm
where she raises sheep and goatsin Massachusetts.
(30:45):
My brother went to Wooden BoatInstitute.
He's been a builder of boatsand houses and buildings
different lives.
He lives in Maine.
Daniela SM (30:55):
Wow, yeah, oh, that's interesting.
It's always interesting howsiblings are different.
They say that, even though theyhave the same parents, they
didn't really, because they wereat different times and there
were different situations, sothey were not really the same
parents.
Glen Van Peski (31:13):
That's true, and you have to think, I don't know
, looking at our kids, there'sthings beyond just the raw
genetics and even the time andsituation of the upbringing.
I mean, there's just peoplehave certain, seem to have
certain innate bents andabilities and personalities.
Daniela SM (31:32):
Yeah, yeah, interesting.
Let's talk about your book,because I can see it on the back
there.
Glen Van Peski (31:36):
Yeah, the name is Take Less, do More.
Surprising Life Lessons inGenerosity, gratitude and
Curiosity from an UltralightBackpacker.
That's been a fun adventure.
It's been something I neverthought I would do.
And the basic premises you knowas I worked for.
And the basic premise is, youknow, as I worked for 50 years
to reduce my backpacking packweight, I realized that a lot of
(32:00):
those lessons had applicabilityto other areas of life besides
just backpacking.
So it's been interesting to megetting feedback from the book
how it goes both ways.
You know people.
Some people pick it up becausethey're backpackers and they
know me because I started goshMcGeer and they've found
(32:22):
valuable lessons for the rest oftheir life.
But some people pick it upthrough other circumstances.
They're not backpackers, um,and they enjoy the life lessons,
but it also gets them thinkingabout and they enjoy the life
lessons, but it also gets themthinking about I wonder.
I kind of want to do somebackpacking now.
So it really has been cuttingboth ways.
(32:42):
It's kind of an interestingthing to see.
Daniela SM (32:44):
And what is the difference?
I mean traveling withbackpacking or traveling.
Glen Van Peski (32:49):
On a backpacking trip per se, you have problems
to solve that you don't havewhen you're traveling.
Like you're traveling.
You're going to an Airbnb orsomething like that.
So you're not worried aboutfinding a place to set up your
tent.
You're not worried aboutcarrying your food.
You can buy something when youget there.
You can go out to a restaurant.
You don't have to figure outhow to cook something.
(33:11):
You're probably not worriedabout bears or uh, worried about
squirrels stealing your food orthings like that.
So, backpacking trip, you haveadditional problems to solve
besides just traveling.
But I think some of thebenefits of taking less accrue
either way.
You know, if you, I just abuddy of mine just got back from
(33:35):
the Himalayas but his luggageis still in India, there's some
problem there.
Well, if you get your luggagedown to where it's just carry on
, well then your luggage isalways with you, so you don't
have lost luggage.
So that's one immediate benefit.
Daniela SM (33:53):
I think that's the main one, and then the other
ones, that you don't have toworry about carrying stuff or
that it's not like a burden.
What I noticed in the last fivemonths that we've been
traveling is that, oh, we coulddo this.
And then I start thinking, ohGod, but the luggage?
Glen Van Peski (34:12):
I haven't done six months.
I've done two months in Europe.
That involved hiking.
We had to go to the opera, wewere riding bikes, paddling
canoes, and I did that in onevery small bag.
Daniela SM (34:23):
So if you're going in summer, everything is super
easy.
Everything is light, everythingis small.
Yeah, and so about your book.
How long did it take you towrite it?
Glen Van Peski (34:32):
It was about a couple of year process, about a
10 year process if you countbeing bugged about it.
So part of my story is GossamerGear.
The gear company startedgetting bigger and bigger and
bigger and it got to where I wasworking yeah, 60, 70 hours a
week on my engineering businessand another 30 hours a week on
(34:54):
the gear business with smallkids at home.
It's like okay, well, thiscan't continue, obviously, and I
was getting paid well for theengineering and it wasn't taking
any money from the gearbusiness.
So I thought, okay, I'm goingto have to close it down.
But about that time I met JohnMackey, the co-founder of Whole
Foods Market, and he bought 75%of the company and hired someone
(35:16):
to run it.
So I'm still involved in thecompany, but it wouldn't have
survived if John Mackey hadn'tstepped in at that point.
He does a lot of hiking, a lotof trips, and he likes to invite
along people that he enjoysspending time with.
And so I started doing a lot oftrips hiking with John and he
likes doing the hardcorebackpacking trips, you know, on
(35:37):
the Appalachian Trail or theContinental Divide or the
Pacific Crest Trail.
But he also likes kind of moreof a pilgrimage trip.
You know where you're walkingall day, but you're staying in a
town at night in a little hotelor in a hut, so he does both
types of trips, spent a lot oftime walking with John.
He's a big gear guy.
So we'd end up talking aboutgear and he'd say, glenn, you
(35:59):
should write a book.
I think there's plenty of booksout there.
I don't really think I need toadd my two cents.
And he says no, no, no.
He says you know, you have aunique way of looking at things.
I think you need to write abook and I'll write the forward
Next year.
I'd be on a hike with him.
He goes how's that book going?
You know, I don't think I needto write a book.
And then he started telling hisfriends, hey, yeah, glenn's
(36:19):
going to write a book.
And so I'd be walking with oneof them and say, hey, I hear
John says you're working on abook.
No, I'm not working on a book.
Daniela SM (36:28):
Anyway, I finally decided well, Good strategy.
Glen Van Peski (36:31):
John Mackey did write a very generous forward to
the book, so definitelydelivered on his end of it.
Was it difficult?
It was difficult.
You know it would have been alot shorter book.
Basically there's one chapterthat is focused on kind of how I
think about gear andbackpacking and things like that
.
That would have been the wholebook, I guess at that point if
I'd just written the book onthat.
But along the way I realizedthat, you know, I think it has
(36:54):
broader applications, some ofthe lessons I learned.
So I expanded it to otherlessons, trying to draw from the
wilderness lessons and the gearlessons and applying those
elsewhere in life.
So it was a fun process.
It was definitely.
You know you talked about.
We were talking aboutToastmasters and kind of
learning new things and goingoutside your comfort zone.
(37:16):
And this book was definitelyoutside my comfort zone and,
frankly, being on these podcastsis outside my comfort zone.
Daniela SM (37:24):
Really, I thought you were excited to be here.
Glen Van Peski (37:28):
I know, I know it's been a lot more fun than I
thought, proud of how the bookturned out, which is because of
a lot of experts involved in it.
But the most fun has been thepeople I've met along the way
and the fascinating thingsthey're doing.
You know, after our likeinitial conversation, you know,
and hearing about your travelsall over the world, I mean that
(37:49):
really got me thinking like gosh.
I wonder if that would be funto do.
Daniela SM (37:54):
I wonder if I could get a bigger suitcase.
Didn't you say that?
Glen Van Peski (37:57):
No, no, no, I don't need a bigger suitcase.
I'm convinced of that.
I'm convinced of that.
But you know, I've becomefriends with some of the people
on the at Forefront Books.
In fact, I was just talking toone the other day and she, she's
leaving in a week or two to golive in France for a year.
I thought, oh my gosh, how coolis that?
(38:18):
That's amazing.
Daniela SM (38:19):
So I inspire you a little bit.
Yeah, that's great.
Glen Van Peski (38:22):
Yeah, you do.
Daniela SM (38:24):
Yes, talking to people that are not in your
circle, necessarily, again,everybody has a story.
We don't believe that our storyis fun enough for the other
person it is, and you never knowwhat you spark on the other
person to do.
I think that it is wonderfulthat you wrote that book and
also the cover is beautiful.
Glen Van Peski (38:41):
It's a picture from you from which trip it was
actually a company retreat wewere doing in Zermatt.
They just snapped that that'slike an iPhone picture of me
hiking in front of theMatterhorn.
Daniela SM (38:53):
So it's great that you have written the book and
that you are going on podcastsand sharing your story, and your
personality is amazing.
You also are a very kind andgenerous person, so the book
matches perfectly the title thatyou put in there.
Glen Van Peski (39:05):
I am donating all profits from the book.
I'm not going to make a dimefrom the book, it's a way to
just pass it on.
Daniela SM (39:18):
Did the Pacific Crest Trail Association you know
, the Pacific Crest Trail runsthrough California, Oregon and
Washington, goes between Mexicoand Canada.
Well, Glen, thank you so muchfor your story and for your time
.
I really appreciate it and wewill put all in the show notes
how to get your book descriptionof everything.
Glen Van Peski (39:28):
Great Well, thanks so much for having me.
It's fun to be inspired bysomeone living a life of
adventure.
Daniela SM (39:34):
Thank you.
I hope you enjoyed today'sepisode.
I am Daniela and you arelistening to, because Everyone
has a Story.
Please take five seconds rightnow and think of somebody in
your life that may enjoy whatyou just heard, or someone that
has a story to be shared andpreserved.
When you think of that person,shoot them a text with the link
(39:56):
of this podcast.
This will allow the ordinarymagic to go further.
Join me next time for anotherstory conversation.
Thank you for listening.
Hasta pronto.
Hi, I'm Daniela.
Welcome to my podcast, becauseEveryone has a Story, the place
to give ordinary people'sstories the chance to be shared
and preserved.
Our stories become the languageof connections.
Let's enjoy it, connect andrelate, because everyone has a
story.
Welcome.
(00:21):
My guest is Glen Van Peski, aretired civil engineer,
entrepreneur, lifelong inventorand adventurer.
From an early age, Glen hasbeen creating, exploring and
embracing new challenges.
He is also someone who deeplyvalues generosity, finding ways
to share his blessings in bothtraditional and unexpected ways.
(00:44):
His story beautifully connectsthe idea of minimalism in the
wilderness to living a moreabundant, intentional life.
In his book Take Less, do More,Glen dives into how the wisdom
of ultralight backpackingextends far beyond the outdoors.
You pack weight isn't the onlything you can lighten in life.
(01:06):
Glen's philosophy is refreshing.
Contentment and ambition cancoexist.
Generosity leads to trueabundance and curiosity doesn't
have to bring discontentment.
I recorded this conversationwhile spending seven weeks in
Malaga, which felt like perfecttiming.
With Dave and I on the road forthe past five months, Glen's
(01:29):
insights really resonated withme.
It was an absolute pleasure tohave him on the podcast and I
hope you enjoy our conversation.
Welcome, Glenn, to the podcast.
Glen Van Peski (01:40):
Thanks, Daniela, pleasure to be here.
Daniela SM (01:41):
Yes, I am super excited that you are here and
that you are a hiker, a travelerand all these things that I'm
actually looking at in yourwebsite.
Glen Van Peski (01:50):
Yeah, I was thinking of you.
Actually, last night we werewatching some dumb movie on
Netflix, someone that moves toItaly not Spain but buys a
one-euro house, and it made methink of you.
Know, you living in a what's tome a foreign country and
adventures there.
Daniela SM (02:07):
Yes, it was his father and a daughter.
Glen Van Peski (02:09):
Yes.
Daniela SM (02:10):
Great, All right.
So my first question is why doyou want to share your story?
Glen Van Peski (02:15):
I love the title of your podcast because
everyone has a story, becausethat's been my experience.
You know people sometimes say,oh, glenn, it seems like your
story is so interesting or youhave an interesting life, and it
doesn't seem that way to mebecause it's just my life.
But I find that if we take thetime which we usually don't have
(02:36):
the time to really listen, youknow, to sit down with someone
for an extended period of time,everyone has an interesting
story.
Mine might be interesting tosome people, and if some people
can learn something from that,brings them some ideas to make
their life better, well thenthat's great.
Daniela SM (02:54):
Yes, and also because you have a book.
Glen Van Peski (02:56):
Yes, I ended up writing a book, was pestered to
do it by a friend of mine.
You know, I am, as you pointedout, a backpacker.
I mean, many people have done alot more backpacking than I
have.
But to your average ordinaryperson that probably seems like
I've done a lot of backpackingbecause I'm an engineer.
I want to backpack with theleast amount possible because it
(03:18):
makes it more enjoyable whenyou're carrying less weight, and
I know you and I have talkedabout applying this to other
travel adventure travel andaround the world and I realized
that, after call it, 50 years ofworking to minimize the amount
I take, backpacking, that therewere a lot of lessons that apply
to the rest of life also, andso that's why I wrote take less,
(03:39):
do more.
Daniela SM (03:40):
Wonderful, so we will talk about that too.
And so when does your storystart?
Glen Van Peski (03:44):
Well, the story starts for me when I was born,
grew up in Southern California,was lucky enough to grow up as a
free range kid.
Before the internet wasinvented, we were just gone on
our bikes, digging, climbing,playing all day, as long as you
were home for dinner.
My parents had no idea where wewere, which was, you know, so
(04:05):
great to grow up like that.
We're just outside, beingactive and having using our
imaginations.
That kind of came to ascreeching halt when I was in
fourth grade my parentsannounced at the dinner table
they were getting a divorce kindof a shocker and we moved.
We left sunny SouthernCalifornia and moved to Western
Massachusetts in the middle ofwinter.
Daniela SM (04:24):
Oh wow, that show was shock.
Glen Van Peski (04:26):
You know, went to school there, graduated high
school and decided it would be afun adventure to ride my
bicycle across the United States.
So spent that summer in 1976,riding 4,200 miles across the
country, getting back to theWest Coast.
And then got offered a job whenI was out here and, you know,
(04:48):
kind of never left the WestCoast been up and down the West
Coast ever since.
Daniela SM (04:52):
Okay, I was reading your fun facts.
In 1976, after graduating highschool, you rode your bicycle
4,200 miles from Massachusettsto California.
Glen Van Peski (05:04):
Yeah, and people ask me like, oh, were you
always an adventurous sort?
And I really wasn't.
I was kind of a book, you know,graduated with like almost
straight A's.
I don't know, I wasn't like anadventurous person.
So I have no idea why I gotthis into my head that this
would be a good, fun thing to do, but it sure was.
(05:25):
And actually I'm in touch withthe three other guys that went
with me and we're talking aboutnext year, the 50th anniversary
of our ride, getting back on ourbicycles and riding back the
other direction.
So we'll see if that happens.
Daniela SM (05:40):
Oh wow.
So you said that you were anadventurer, but what made you
decide, okay, I'm going to ridemy bike I?
Glen Van Peski (05:44):
I enjoyed languages in high school I took
(06:13):
Latin, greek, french and,briefly, german, and so I had
some vague thought of doingsomething with languages, maybe
being an interpreter, but youknow I hadn't really done
anything on that.
And then rode the bicycleacross the United States with my
friends, ended up staying withmy dad who was still in
(06:33):
California, had remarried.
Friend of theirs who had a smallcivil engineering firm, offered
me a job and so I took that andthat set me on my 50-year
career as a civil engineer.
I know it seems strange howthings have worked out and I'm
an engineer, I'm kind of aplanner.
Yeah, you know for not reallyhaving a plan.
Things worked out pretty well.
Daniela SM (06:54):
Well, you didn't know that you were a civil
engineer and maybe you're a verywell-mixed, that you can plan
and not plan and still be anengineer.
Glen Van Peski (07:02):
I guess, yeah, plan and no plan and still be an
engineer?
I guess, yeah, and I have.
You know I have have becomemore intentional, uh, since I
was 17,.
You know about thinking aheadand thinking like, okay, uh,
yeah, I'm an engineer, but youknow I should work to develop
some other skills.
You know public speaking andwriting and, uh, leadership and
(07:27):
management.
So you know I have been moreintentional as I got older,
luckily.
But yeah, it's worked out.
Daniela SM (07:31):
There you go, well-rounded person.
I think these days people areactually thinking more of that
to be, not just to know onething, that you have to know
many things.
Especially some people havethis desire of learning.
You know curiosity in you.
This is part of your book.
You know the lessons are forgenerosity and curiosity, right?
Glen Van Peski (07:53):
yes, yeah I think it's important, curiosity
is important yeah, it's alwaysgood to, I think, be curious
about things and notice things,because that's where
opportunities lie, you know,wondering about things.
And of course, engineers, Ithink, are kind of inherently
(08:17):
probably curious, alwaysthinking like I wonder if
there's a better way to do that.
Or you know, what would I do ifI was in that situation?
But yeah, I always when I, youknow, talk at schools or
something like that toengineering students and
especially, you know, these days, with AI and having being
(08:37):
really good at one technicalskill might not be the most
stable, long-term career.
So I think it's great to kindof branch out a little and be
more well-rounded, like you said.
Daniela SM (08:49):
Yeah, I read once that curiosity is when you know
something a little bit and youwant to know more.
But if you don't know about it,if you're not curious and so
that was quite interestingbecause it's true I mean, if I
don't know that something exists, I wouldn't be curious about it
.
But then you know, when youknow a little bit, you're like
maybe curious about what is that?
How do I do this?
And I don't know if you agreewith that, because now that I'm
(09:12):
saying it, I'm not too sure ifthat is correct.
Glen Van Peski (09:15):
Well, to me, I think part of that is the
noticing.
To me, I because many peopleyou know, will walk by something
and not notice it, and if youdon't notice it, I think it's
the first step of noticing.
It's like I wonder how thatworks, or I wonder what that
person is doing, or you knowthat to me, then you can be
(09:38):
curious.
But if you don't notice, ifyou're too focused on I got to
get to my next appointment orI'm worried about something, or
you don't notice, and then youcan't be curious.
Daniela SM (09:48):
So you went to university in California and
graduated as a civil engineerand stayed there all your life.
You had a family.
What happened next?
Glen Van Peski (09:56):
Well, I worked for a couple of years, first in
engineering, then went to schooland graduated from California
State University, northridgewhich fun thing.
I'm going down next month givea presentation there university.
I haven't been there for 50years almost now, so that'll be
fun to see how it's changed.
Yeah, yeah, the Dean ofEngineering is a backpacker, so
he found my book, so that'll befun.
(10:18):
But yeah, I graduated, I movedto San Diego, got married, moved
to San Diego to start working,worked for other people, started
my own company, had some kids,was almost killed in a plane
crash, shut my company down,went to work for a big company
and then went to work for thecity that we lived in, you know,
(10:40):
accidentally started a gearcompany along the way and then
retired and moved up to Oregon.
So still on the West, but notCalifornia.
Daniela SM (10:56):
Another fun fact from you was that you're a pilot
.
Yeah, actually, basically noinjuries.
Glen Van Peski (11:00):
I had some scratches, but no injuries.
The pilot was killed.
And I have been thinking aboutthis because just this morning
that plane flipped upside downwhile crash landing in Toronto.
It seems like there's been alot of plane crashes recently,
so, yeah, it always makes methink about my plane crash.
When you get a pilot's license,you always have a license.
(11:22):
I'm not currently certified.
Daniela SM (11:23):
But you're still a pilot.
Glen Van Peski (11:25):
It didn't affect you, I'm not current and I
don't fly small planes.
After the crash I didn't wantthat to be my last experience in
a small plane.
So a buddy of mine fromToastmasters had his pilot's
license and I said, hey, whydon't you take me up?
So I decided you know, I had ayoung family engineering
(11:45):
business.
Like I'm probably not going tospend a lot of time flying, I
wanted to go up one more time ina small plane.
So I went up with my buddy fromToastmasters and we flew over
to the desert and had breakfastor something.
We were coming back.
The tower is sequencing him kindof behind a larger regional jet
(12:06):
.
If you're too close behindanother plane, the plane creates
turbulence which can well itcan flip you over if you're too
close.
And so they were telling him toslow down to get more distance
between this jet that waslanding, and so he was dumping
some flaps and trying to slowthe airspeed down.
He was still too close.
(12:27):
So he said, ah, we're not goingto make it.
And what he meant was, you know, he was too close and he wasn't
going to be able to land.
He was going to have to goaround in the pattern another
time.
But I said I said I'dappreciate it if you'd pick
different words, then we're notgoing to make it.
So yeah, we landed safely andthat was the my last time in a,
(12:51):
you know, really small plane.
Daniela SM (12:54):
Yes, yeah exactly.
Glen Van Peski (12:56):
I knew what he meant, but the power of words,
yeah, I mean it's more funnythan scary.
Daniela SM (13:04):
I mean I knew what he meant so, yeah, yours was
pretty scary, for sure.
Oh, you knew what he meant.
So that's another another thing.
Okay, okay, good, good, allright, and so you were in San
Diego.
Yeah, and that's something Ialways recommend to people
Toastmasters is such a greatprogram.
Glen Van Peski (13:25):
I mean, I think public speaking is something
that what's they say?
It's like people are moreafraid of public speaking than
of dying.
I mean it's like the number onefear.
But I always figured that, youknow, no matter how smart you
are, how hard you work toaccomplish really most anything
is going to involve other people, and so having that ability to
(14:00):
express your ideas andmotivation to others through
speaking and writing, I think is, you know, super important
skill that everyone should have.
Oh, I haven't done it for yearsand years, but I was in it for
probably 10 years.
Daniela SM (14:07):
How many years have you been with Toastmasters?
20 years ago, so.
When was the last time you werethere?
Okay, so then you wereToastmasters pilots when our
oldest son, brian, was oldenough.
Glen Van Peski (14:24):
he joined Boy Scouts and so then I joined as
an adult leader.
It was a very active troop, dida lot of activities summer
camps, week-long canoe on theColorado River and a lot of
backpacking, including thecapstone trip was a week in the
(14:45):
Sierra Nevada mountains ofCalifornia.
We were preparing for this andI didn't have my gear from when
I was in Boy Scouts back inMassachusetts, so we had to go
get new gear.
It was all pretty heavy Aboutthis time.
My buddy, reed Miller, who Imet through Toastmasters and
also through the civilengineering he was a land
(15:06):
developer.
He read Ray Jardine's book, thePacific Crest Trail Hiker's
Handbook, which was talkingabout ultralight backpacking,
and he had gear lists in therewhere his base weight, which is
the weight of all your gearexcept for food and water,
weighed around eight pounds.
And that was unbelievable to mebecause the backpack that I
(15:29):
just purchased at REI weighedseven and a half pounds empty
before you put anything in it.
But it got me to thinking.
Since I knew how to sew, Istarted sewing some gear, and I
had I'd actually sewn some gearway back in 1976 for that
bicycle trip.
I sewed myself a tarp, a littlemesh liner to keep the bugs out
(15:51):
.
So I'd already done some sewing.
My mom thought every kid shouldleave home knowing how to cook,
bake and sew.
She just considered those basiclife skills.
Whatever you're going to do inlife, you should know how to do
those three things.
So all three of us kids knowhow to do those three things.
So I started sewing gear.
I sewed a pack, used that andthen, being an engineer, I
(16:12):
couldn't help thinking like,well, how could this be a little
better?
So then of course, I sawanother pack and my buddy Reed
Miller started calling them, youknow, the G1, cause my name
starts with a G and the G2.
And finally the fourth pack.
I'd gotten it to where I itreally fit, where I was at that
point, my gear.
I think I think some of thosethey weighed under a pound and
(16:34):
so that was a big weight savingsright there compared to my
seven, seven pound backpack fromREI.
This was early internet days andI put the plans on the internet
so that other people could makethem.
Other people's moms hadn'ttaught them how to sew, so I
would get emails saying hey, Idon't know how to sew, can you
sell me a pack?
And at this point I'm working60, 70 hours a week doing
(16:57):
engineering.
It's like no, I can't sell me apack.
And at this point I'm working60, 70 hours a week doing
engineering.
It's like no, I can't sell youa pack.
But eventually I got enoughemails that I felt bad for these
people, that they didn't knowhow to sew, and so I was talking
to the people the sisters inFlorida that that I got
materials from, and talkingabout this problem, and they
said well, you know, there'ssomeone in Seattle that does
(17:20):
sewing, contract sewing.
And so I checked them out anddecided to.
I wanted to get 25 packs madebecause I thought then everyone
who was emailing me would have apack and I could get back to
the engineering.
So I started talking to Montyup in Seattle and he says oh,
our minimum order is a hundred.
A hundred packs, oh my gosh.
(17:40):
So we finally went back andforth and finally settled on 50.
And I thought, okay, they'll bein the garage for the next five
years, but I'll eventually getrid of them, no big deal.
So our son, brian, the oldestone, who was in scouts, then put
together a very rudimentarywebsite that would send me an
email.
People could fill out a littleorder form with their name and
(18:01):
address, and then it would sendme an email with their order,
and then they would mail a check.
That's how sophisticated wewere.
And so I'm working at my deskone day doing engineering and
then suddenly I get an email.
I go, we have an order.
I hadn't thought that far ahead, so I just grabbed a pad of
yellow paper and wrote down theorder.
I still have that yellow, thosesheets yellow lined paper with
(18:22):
those early orders.
So anyway, before I even gotthe first shipment from Monty, I
had 86 orders, more than the 50packs that I thought was going
to take me five years to get ridof.
So we had to order more fabric.
And then things kind ofsnowballed from there.
Daniela SM (18:42):
And where was your mom all this time?
Glen Van Peski (18:44):
Oh, my mom was back in Massachusetts still.
Daniela SM (18:47):
Did you call her and say thank you for teaching me
how to sew?
Glen Van Peski (18:50):
She was proud that you know my sewing skills
had launched.
You know what's now amultimillion dollar business.
Daniela SM (18:57):
Yeah, wow, it's true .
People don't know how to sewthese days.
Glen Van Peski (19:00):
Yeah.
Daniela SM (19:01):
I am glad I learned how to do it, yeah.
Glen Van Peski (19:03):
I think everyone should know how to do it.
It's just basic skills and it'sfun.
I know some people that aretrying to bring that back.
We have a lot of friends inJapan.
There's this cool place theycall it Miog make your own gear
movement and they have a placethat has all the fabric and they
have sessions where people comein after work or on the
weekends and they'll haveclasses and they start making
(19:25):
their own stuff sacks and simplestuff and people go on to make
backpacks and tents and bags fortheir bike.
And actually I'm going to givea talk here in Bend there's a
local used gear store that wantsto kind of start something like
that, you know, to bring backteaching people how to, how to
sew and just make basic stuff.
Daniela SM (19:45):
Yes, no, it makes sense to to be recyclable as
well, and sometimes you know itgoes according to your needs,
which, in a way, is what likereally wealthy people do.
I need this and I want it thisway, so if you can make it
yourself, then it is like madefor you exactly.
Glen Van Peski (20:00):
You can customize it and you know how it
was built.
So if you know that theshoulder straps always wear,
wear out, you can add extrastitching there.
Or if you know shoulder strapson ready-made packs are
uncomfortable for your frame,you can modify them so that it
works better for you.
So, yeah, there's so many funthings you can do when you know
(20:21):
how to sew.
Daniela SM (20:22):
Yeah, that's true.
So I'm glad that we're goingback in North America and the
West Coast.
At least people will beinterested in something like
that too, not just in Japan.
Glen Van Peski (20:30):
You know, in Japan it's important to them
because they want people to beconnected to their outdoor
adventures.
You know, if you just go buy abunch of stuff and take it
outside, it's not the same aswhen you're going with something
that you've actually made withyour own hands.
Daniela SM (20:44):
That's true.
I mean this goes toachievements too.
The things that make me thehappiest are those things that
have been difficult, that I havemanaged to fix or achieve or do
something.
You know those are the ones Iremember the most versus.
You know, something easy thatcame along, yeah, when you make
your own, that is just morespecial.
Glen Van Peski (21:05):
Yeah, you get to struggle with the.
You know what are the choices.
Do I want to make it lighter ormore durable?
Do I want to make it morecomfortable or more functional?
Or you know, you get to makeall those choices and then, when
you use it, I always tellpeople.
Sometimes I have people come upto me after talking oh you know
, I'm making my own pack.
Or I made my own pack and Isaid, well, just just know that
(21:27):
it won't be the last one.
You know, when you makesomething yourself and use it,
then you start thinking aboutwell, I could make it a little
better, a little lighter,different color, or something
like that.
Daniela SM (21:38):
So yeah, of course.
Of course, the possibilitiesare endless.
Then you start thinking moreand more Great, great, okay, so
that company is successful.
But you didn't want to dealwith that because you still
loved your job as a civilengineer.
Glen Van Peski (21:55):
Yeah, I never, never, quit my day job.
Gossamer Gear is now a hugecompany.
I never took a salary from thecompany.
That's a different story thanmost people have.
I mean, the typical story isyou know you're working, you
start your side hustle and thenit becomes big and successful
and then you do that full-time.
I've told our sons this, bothof whom have had side hustles is
(22:19):
I think there's a case to bemade for keeping the side hustle
as the side hustle.
I know people who they're ahiker.
They do a lot of hiking.
They make some of their owngear, then they start a gear
company and then all of a suddenthey're not going hiking
anymore because they're runninga company and they're hassling
(22:40):
with distributors and trying tosell stuff and have enough money
to buy supplies.
And you know, it's not the joythat it once was.
They have to worry aboutgetting health insurance and
things like that.
So I think there's certainly acase to be made and everyone has
different goals and objectivesbut of keeping the side hustle
(23:01):
as the side hustle, because it'svery freeing.
I always worked full-time as anengineer and so that paid the
mortgage, put the kids throughcollege, so I didn't need to
make money from the gearbusiness so I could make what I
wanted to make.
I didn't have to make whatpeople wanted because I didn't
care if it sold or not.
I didn't need the money.
(23:22):
So that freed me to makecreative decisions on what I
thought was important.
And so you know, if you look atlike our early, our early gear
lineup was basically the gearthat I used and I needed.
And so, as as my pack gotlighter, the packs we sold got
lighter and lighter, and peoplewould call me up and say, well,
(23:44):
you know, convince me, I shouldbuy your pack instead of someone
else's.
And I said, well, I reallydon't care because I'm not
paying myself from this anyway,so buy whatever you think is
going to work for you.
Um, I'm not going to waste mytime trying to convince you to
buy my pack, and then peoplewould call up and say, well, I
think you should make it thisway, or you should make this
product.
And I'd say, well, thank you,but that's not something I'm
(24:07):
interested in, so why don't yougo make that product?
If you think that's somethingthat's valuable, frees you up.
You don't need to worry aboutwhat people want or what people
will buy, because you don'treally care.
You're just making what youwant, and if other people think
that's great, then they can buyit, and if they don't, they can
buy something else.
Daniela SM (24:24):
I feel like if you stay in your job, it's because
you really like your job,because people usually don't
like to stay in a job that theydon't like.
So you were doing somethingthat you really enjoyed.
Glen Van Peski (24:34):
That's true.
I mean I was working as a civilengineer and I like working as
a civil engineer.
I mean it wasn't my originalplan when I was in high school
solving problems, and it's great, because every piece of land is
different, so there's differentchallenges of you know, where's
the sewer going to go, where'sthe water come from, how does
(24:55):
the rainfall drain?
Um, how do you minimize theamount of dirt you have to move
to create the project?
So I enjoyed civil engineering,working for myself, I enjoyed
working for other people, Ienjoyed working for the city, um
, you know, being on the otherside, on the permitting side.
So, and it, you know, it couldjust be.
(25:16):
I'm an agreeable kind of guy.
I could, I, I suspect I couldbe happy doing a lot of
different things.
Daniela SM (25:24):
Yeah, that was my other question, that you
probably are a contentindividual.
Glen Van Peski (25:27):
I think so, yeah , I'm, I'm pretty content.
Daniela SM (25:30):
You don't need much to be happy.
Glen Van Peski (25:32):
Exactly, and that's, and that is one of the
lessons from ultralightbackpacking is how little you
actually need to be happy.
Daniela SM (25:41):
If you're curious.
Curiosity makes you wonder more, and so sometimes it doesn't
allow you to be content, becauseyou want more.
Glen Van Peski (25:51):
I guess it depends on your curiosity.
If you were curious like, well,what would it be like if I
drove a really expensive car?
Or I'm curious what it would belike if I had a huge house, or
I'm curious what it would belike to fly first class, I guess
the curiosity could lead todiscontentment.
But I don't know, I don't knowif that hasn't been my personal
(26:14):
experience.
You could be curious aboutsomething without being obsessed
with it.
You know, you wonder, I'mcurious like what is it like to
be worth a hundred billiondollars?
But I don't, I don't, I'm notgoing to be pursuing that.
Daniela SM (26:28):
Yeah, maybe people that are doers.
They're more like doing, doing,doing all the time so you can
be content.
I have met a few people thatare content, so I don't know
what is the personality thing.
I think I guess if you're aBuddhist, that's what you're
supposed to go to.
Glen Van Peski (26:42):
Contentment yeah , and I'm not a Buddhist and I
don't have really any helpfuladvice for contentment.
I mean part of my contentmentcomes from my faith as a
Christian.
I think some of it could bepersonality, although that can
change too.
I mean part of my contentmentcomes from my faith as a
Christian.
I think some of it could bepersonality, although that can
change too.
I mean I was a very anxiouschild through junior, high and
(27:05):
high school, not very content.
It's your play betweencuriosity and contentment, and
contentment doesn't mean youdon't strive either.
I mean I'm contented, but I havea long to-do list of things I
like to do and things that Iwant to accomplish.
For a content person, I don'tsit well.
I don't just sit and be well.
(27:25):
That's something I have to workon, because I tend to always be
doing something.
Daniela SM (27:29):
You're a very interesting combination.
Glen Van Peski (27:32):
So I see your eyebrows.
It's that tension betweenalways wanting I guess always on
the go and wanting to do thingsbut being content with that
well, you liked your job andthat's the most important thing.
Daniela SM (27:46):
You have a career and you enjoy.
And then you got more ideas andbroad side hustles, but you're
also not greedy.
Generosity, isosity, is also apart of you.
Glen Van Peski (27:57):
Yeah, I mean, that was another thing actually
from my mom is the importance ofbeing generous.
You know she would always saynoblesse oblige.
You know, if you have comeswith an obligation of using that
to make other people's livesbetter, it's not there just so
you can buy a second jet andhave a bigger boat.
(28:21):
And so you know, we startedsmall and today we give away a
significant chunk of our incomejust because we have plenty.
You know, more isn't going tomake our life better.
Daniela SM (28:33):
So your mom seems to be an important person in this
whole story that she was fromSouth Africa.
Glen Van Peski (28:39):
Yeah, she was born in South Africa.
For her time women weresupposed to, you know, get
married, have kids, kind ofmanage the household staff, play
bridge and plan parties waspretty much the plan for women
in her society at that time.
And so she came over to theUnited States, to Wellesley
(29:03):
College, and after two years herdad said well, I'm not paying
for it anymore because it's awaste to educate a woman.
You're just going to come home,get married and have kids.
My mom was having none of that.
Wellesley somehow found somescholarships so she could finish
and get her degree in geography.
And then she met my dad who wasgoing to MIT he is an engineer
(29:28):
also and they got married andshe never went back to South
Africa.
I mean, she went back later fora to live for a while, but that
was long after the kids weregone.
So yeah, she was kind of a moldbreaker for her time.
For sure, she was more likelyleading a protest march or
playing her guitar at somehootenanny or something.
(29:49):
Yeah.
Daniela SM (29:50):
That's fun, that's good.
I guess it's so beautiful whenour parents teach us beautiful
things, especially generosityand gratitude, and your siblings
are similar to you.
Glen Van Peski (30:02):
No, I am kind of the black sheep of my family,
pretty much.
I'm the only one that doesn'tcurrently play a musical
instrument.
I was in the band when I was inhigh school, junior high and
high school.
Never really good at music, andthat's a big part of my
brothers and sisters lives stillWell, I guess, to them.
(30:24):
I'm living the alternativelifestyle.
I'm the only one to graduatefrom college, only one to
graduate from a traditional highschool.
So they've taken differentpaths.
My sister has a farm.
She does flower essences, sellsthem online and has a farm
where she raises sheep and goatsin Massachusetts.
(30:45):
My brother went to Wooden BoatInstitute.
He's been a builder of boatsand houses and buildings
different lives.
He lives in Maine.
Daniela SM (30:55):
Wow, yeah, oh, that's interesting.
It's always interesting howsiblings are different.
They say that, even though theyhave the same parents, they
didn't really, because they wereat different times and there
were different situations, sothey were not really the same
parents.
Glen Van Peski (31:13):
That's true, and you have to think, I don't know
, looking at our kids, there'sthings beyond just the raw
genetics and even the time andsituation of the upbringing.
I mean, there's just peoplehave certain, seem to have
certain innate bents andabilities and personalities.
Daniela SM (31:32):
Yeah, yeah, interesting.
Let's talk about your book,because I can see it on the back
there.
Glen Van Peski (31:36):
Yeah, the name is Take Less, do More.
Surprising Life Lessons inGenerosity, gratitude and
Curiosity from an UltralightBackpacker.
That's been a fun adventure.
It's been something I neverthought I would do.
And the basic premises you knowas I worked for.
And the basic premise is, youknow, as I worked for 50 years
to reduce my backpacking packweight, I realized that a lot of
(32:00):
those lessons had applicabilityto other areas of life besides
just backpacking.
So it's been interesting to megetting feedback from the book
how it goes both ways.
You know people.
Some people pick it up becausethey're backpackers and they
know me because I started goshMcGeer and they've found
(32:22):
valuable lessons for the rest oftheir life.
But some people pick it upthrough other circumstances.
They're not backpackers, um,and they enjoy the life lessons,
but it also gets them thinkingabout and they enjoy the life
lessons, but it also gets themthinking about I wonder.
I kind of want to do somebackpacking now.
So it really has been cuttingboth ways.
(32:42):
It's kind of an interestingthing to see.
Daniela SM (32:44):
And what is the difference?
I mean traveling withbackpacking or traveling.
Glen Van Peski (32:49):
On a backpacking trip per se, you have problems
to solve that you don't havewhen you're traveling.
Like you're traveling.
You're going to an Airbnb orsomething like that.
So you're not worried aboutfinding a place to set up your
tent.
You're not worried aboutcarrying your food.
You can buy something when youget there.
You can go out to a restaurant.
You don't have to figure outhow to cook something.
(33:11):
You're probably not worriedabout bears or uh, worried about
squirrels stealing your food orthings like that.
So, backpacking trip, you haveadditional problems to solve
besides just traveling.
But I think some of thebenefits of taking less accrue
either way.
You know, if you, I just abuddy of mine just got back from
(33:35):
the Himalayas but his luggageis still in India, there's some
problem there.
Well, if you get your luggagedown to where it's just carry on
, well then your luggage isalways with you, so you don't
have lost luggage.
So that's one immediate benefit.
Daniela SM (33:53):
I think that's the main one, and then the other
ones, that you don't have toworry about carrying stuff or
that it's not like a burden.
What I noticed in the last fivemonths that we've been
traveling is that, oh, we coulddo this.
And then I start thinking, ohGod, but the luggage?
Glen Van Peski (34:12):
I haven't done six months.
I've done two months in Europe.
That involved hiking.
We had to go to the opera, wewere riding bikes, paddling
canoes, and I did that in onevery small bag.
Daniela SM (34:23):
So if you're going in summer, everything is super
easy.
Everything is light, everythingis small.
Yeah, and so about your book.
How long did it take you towrite it?
Glen Van Peski (34:32):
It was about a couple of year process, about a
10 year process if you countbeing bugged about it.
So part of my story is GossamerGear.
The gear company startedgetting bigger and bigger and
bigger and it got to where I wasworking yeah, 60, 70 hours a
week on my engineering businessand another 30 hours a week on
(34:54):
the gear business with smallkids at home.
It's like okay, well, thiscan't continue, obviously, and I
was getting paid well for theengineering and it wasn't taking
any money from the gearbusiness.
So I thought, okay, I'm goingto have to close it down.
But about that time I met JohnMackey, the co-founder of Whole
Foods Market, and he bought 75%of the company and hired someone
(35:16):
to run it.
So I'm still involved in thecompany, but it wouldn't have
survived if John Mackey hadn'tstepped in at that point.
He does a lot of hiking, a lotof trips, and he likes to invite
along people that he enjoysspending time with.
And so I started doing a lot oftrips hiking with John and he
likes doing the hardcorebackpacking trips, you know, on
(35:37):
the Appalachian Trail or theContinental Divide or the
Pacific Crest Trail.
But he also likes kind of moreof a pilgrimage trip.
You know where you're walkingall day, but you're staying in a
town at night in a little hotelor in a hut, so he does both
types of trips, spent a lot oftime walking with John.
He's a big gear guy.
So we'd end up talking aboutgear and he'd say, glenn, you
(35:59):
should write a book.
I think there's plenty of booksout there.
I don't really think I need toadd my two cents.
And he says no, no, no.
He says you know, you have aunique way of looking at things.
I think you need to write abook and I'll write the forward
Next year.
I'd be on a hike with him.
He goes how's that book going?
You know, I don't think I needto write a book.
And then he started telling hisfriends, hey, yeah, glenn's
(36:19):
going to write a book.
And so I'd be walking with oneof them and say, hey, I hear
John says you're working on abook.
No, I'm not working on a book.
Daniela SM (36:28):
Anyway, I finally decided well, Good strategy.
Glen Van Peski (36:31):
John Mackey did write a very generous forward to
the book, so definitelydelivered on his end of it.
Was it difficult?
It was difficult.
You know it would have been alot shorter book.
Basically there's one chapterthat is focused on kind of how I
think about gear andbackpacking and things like that
.
That would have been the wholebook, I guess at that point if
I'd just written the book onthat.
But along the way I realizedthat, you know, I think it has
(36:54):
broader applications, some ofthe lessons I learned.
So I expanded it to otherlessons, trying to draw from the
wilderness lessons and the gearlessons and applying those
elsewhere in life.
So it was a fun process.
It was definitely.
You know you talked about.
We were talking aboutToastmasters and kind of
learning new things and goingoutside your comfort zone.
(37:16):
And this book was definitelyoutside my comfort zone and,
frankly, being on these podcastsis outside my comfort zone.
Daniela SM (37:24):
Really, I thought you were excited to be here.
Glen Van Peski (37:28):
I know, I know it's been a lot more fun than I
thought, proud of how the bookturned out, which is because of
a lot of experts involved in it.
But the most fun has been thepeople I've met along the way
and the fascinating thingsthey're doing.
You know, after our likeinitial conversation, you know,
and hearing about your travelsall over the world, I mean that
(37:49):
really got me thinking like gosh.
I wonder if that would be funto do.
Daniela SM (37:54):
I wonder if I could get a bigger suitcase.
Didn't you say that?
Glen Van Peski (37:57):
No, no, no, I don't need a bigger suitcase.
I'm convinced of that.
I'm convinced of that.
But you know, I've becomefriends with some of the people
on the at Forefront Books.
In fact, I was just talking toone the other day and she, she's
leaving in a week or two to golive in France for a year.
I thought, oh my gosh, how coolis that?
(38:18):
That's amazing.
Daniela SM (38:19):
So I inspire you a little bit.
Yeah, that's great.
Glen Van Peski (38:22):
Yeah, you do.
Daniela SM (38:24):
Yes, talking to people that are not in your
circle, necessarily, again,everybody has a story.
We don't believe that our storyis fun enough for the other
person it is, and you never knowwhat you spark on the other
person to do.
I think that it is wonderfulthat you wrote that book and
also the cover is beautiful.
Glen Van Peski (38:41):
It's a picture from you from which trip it was
actually a company retreat wewere doing in Zermatt.
They just snapped that that'slike an iPhone picture of me
hiking in front of theMatterhorn.
Daniela SM (38:53):
So it's great that you have written the book and
that you are going on podcastsand sharing your story, and your
personality is amazing.
You also are a very kind andgenerous person, so the book
matches perfectly the title thatyou put in there.
Glen Van Peski (39:05):
I am donating all profits from the book.
I'm not going to make a dimefrom the book, it's a way to
just pass it on.
Daniela SM (39:18):
Did the Pacific Crest Trail Association you know
, the Pacific Crest Trail runsthrough California, Oregon and
Washington, goes between Mexicoand Canada.
Well, Glen, thank you so muchfor your story and for your time
.
I really appreciate it and wewill put all in the show notes
how to get your book descriptionof everything.
Glen Van Peski (39:28):
Great Well, thanks so much for having me.
It's fun to be inspired bysomeone living a life of
adventure.
Daniela SM (39:34):
Thank you.
I hope you enjoyed today'sepisode.
I am Daniela and you arelistening to, because Everyone
has a Story.
Please take five seconds rightnow and think of somebody in
your life that may enjoy whatyou just heard, or someone that
has a story to be shared andpreserved.
When you think of that person,shoot them a text with the link
(39:56):
of this podcast.
This will allow the ordinarymagic to go further.
Join me next time for anotherstory conversation.
Thank you for listening.
Hasta pronto.
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