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Jack and Thomas Hampson delve into the troubling case of Jeffrey Epstein, exploring its implications on child exploitation, deep state corruption, and the moral crisis in society. They discuss the importance of parental rights, the accountability of government and intelligence agencies, and the need for community involvement in addressing these issues. The conversation emphasizes the power of truth and love in combating the exploitation of innocence and the necessity for individuals to take action in their communities.
As Hampson quotes, "Not to act is to act, not to speak is to speak." What will you do with the truth you now possess?
The conversation widens to connect child exploitation to broader moral issues, including recent Supreme Court decisions on parental rights and the growing movement to protect children from inappropriate sexualization in schools. As both hosts emphasize, civilization's greatest threat comes not from external forces but internal moral corruption.
Read Tom's Articles and Subscibe on Substack
Or Here at the Illinois Family Institute "The Troubling Case of Jeffrey Epstein"
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
Welcome to the Become who you Are podcast.
I'm Jack Riggert, your host.
I'm here with Tom Hampson,who's a regular guest on our
show.
Of course, Tom, you just wrotean article the Troubling Case of
Jeffrey Epstein.
You and I were going to talkabout parental rights, which is
so important to this case thatjust came down to the Supreme
Court, but there's just a lot totalk about.
(00:34):
This is on everybody's mind.
I hope you don't mind if Istart out with the Troubling
Case of Jeffrey Epstein.
Give our audience a little bitof a little background on this,
will you, when you're seeing it,look at everybody's reading all
the headlines et cetera, etcetera.
You have an interesting wayyou're looking at this case, and
you're looking at it the way Ido too.
I think you know we look atthis from a moral standpoint.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
you and I.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
And just our audience , remind our audience that you
and I do a presentation calledStolen Innocence, which is
really the moral aspect of whatwe're doing to children.
It's blatant, it's upfront andpersonal and I think, along with
parental rights that we wantedto talk about today, this
Jeffrey Epstein case falls rightinto that moral background,
(01:20):
doesn't it?
Speaker 2 (01:21):
It does, and I've been interested in the case
since 2008, when he was firstconvicted of child sex.
Well, he was convicted ofsoliciting prostitution and
soliciting for prostitution of aminor down in Florida.
The way the case was handledwas so unusual and he was such a
major figure in traffickingkids at that time that it was
(01:43):
shocking to me that thegovernment approached the case
the way they did.
So I've been looking at him foryears and he's really an
example that I see of one of theproblems with the way we deal
with child sexual abuse in thiscountry and perhaps around the
world.
You know, something thatstarted me one of the things
(02:03):
that started me being involvedin as a non to try to deal with
this child protection issue isthat I saw the government wasn't
doing what it should be doing.
They always say that they wantto, that they're increasing
taxes or they're doing thisthing or that thing for the
children.
You know, for the children.
The politicians are out thereevery time they want to get
(02:25):
money or they want to get a boat.
You hear Nancy Pelosi you know,over and over again in between
aborting kids and transing kids.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
She's there for the children, right.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Right?
Well, see to me I've known thisfor years that this is just
total BS, that they don't reallycare about the kids.
And the Epstein case, to me, isan example that proves the fact
that they don't care aboutthese kids.
Because here he was, he wasknown.
It was just well known that hehad, even in 2008, that he had
(02:56):
dozens, if not hundreds, ofvictims, and yet they basically
gave him a slap on the wrist,they essentially immunized
everybody but him who wasinvolved in it in that case,
which is unheard of.
I've never heard of anythinglike that before.
So they didn't go after anybodyother than Epstein.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
He served a little bit of time.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Well, he did.
He got a year and a half.
What was it?
A year and a half?
But he got out every day.
He was on work release, so hespent 14 hours a day out of the
jail and he basically had a jailcell that wasn't even locked.
(03:37):
It was a minimum security jail.
He was treated like a king.
It was just unheard of.
It's like something out of amovie where you see these movies
where the mobster's in prisonand he's got a big luxurious.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
It's just a facade to make it look like they did
something when you wrote thisarticle.
It's the big thing.
Is it suicide?
Is it not suicide?
The real issue is trafficking,you wrote, and the sexual
exploitation of children, andthat's really what it comes down
to.
I think in the middle of allthis and this is your point was
(04:17):
that we don't see these victims,these thousands of children
that were involved in child porn, child sex trafficking.
You know, they're on hiscomputer, you know, and things
that he produced, as well asother child porn.
I mean, this guy had a realissue and a real problem as
(04:42):
people that care about kids.
It's, you know, these highprofile people in the deep state
that you're alluding to nowthat lets these guys off or
doesn't even investigate them.
They don't care.
And if we don't stand up andtalk about it.
Nothing's going to happen.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
One of the things that I mentioned in the article
is that JPMorgan Chase was sued.
There was a lawsuit againstthem and they wound up paying
$290 million to traffickingvictims Because for 16 years
they concealed $1 billion oftransactions that they suspected
were related to sex trafficking.
(05:19):
But they hid these transactionsuntil after Epstein died and
then they reported him.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
So in essence, they had these flagged.
Right, they had these flagged.
They'll come after somebodylike me for praying outside, say
, an abortion clinic.
They're arresting people allaround the world.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
The.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
UK is a big deal on this 1,200 people a year for a
social media post.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
The UK is big deal on this 1,200 people a year for a
social media post.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
The rest of them putting them in prison, and this
they just monitor and let it goit's just amazing injustice.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
This is what I'm most concerned about is that the
magnitude of his trafficking wasso great that either we have
idiots who are in our governmentor they are totally and
thoroughly corrupt.
This you can't.
Do you realize what a billiondollars worth of trafficking of
(06:13):
kids is, or even over 16 years abillion dollars?
These people that aretrafficked don't make that much
money.
These kids aren't making money.
Epstein had somebody workingfor him who had been trafficked
from Yugoslavia when she was 14years old and then she remained
in his employ and now she's anadult and she was still working
(06:36):
for him.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Those kids, these kids Tom, as you know, being a
private investigator and beforethat working for the Illinois
Crime Division privateinvestigator and before that
working for the Illinois CrimeDivision really looking into
cases like this.
These kids are so groomed andindoctrinated in this as they
grow up into adults they don'trealize how broken they are.
And if these cases are justpushed under the rug, there's
(06:58):
going to be these thousands ofvictims that are going to carry
this baggage and this traumathrough their whole lives and we
have to expose this.
The same thing happened in thechurch when I was a young guy.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
It isn't necessarily just the trauma.
People think of trauma, thatthey have this pain all the time
.
What it does is it distortstheir life.
This distortion drives theminto a path opposite of the way
God wants them to be.
God doesn't want people to beexploited that way and they
don't want them to go out andhelp others get others to be
(07:35):
exploited either.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
I think about all these people that let this go,
tom, and they're involved inthis.
They don't think they're goingto die.
I don't think.
I think they're going to liveforever.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
I don't think they're going to die?
I don't think, you know.
I think they're going to liveforever.
I don't think they're going toface any consequences for what
they do.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
Ever, if they did, you know.
So here, getting to the crux ofthis now, with Trump coming in,
with Bondi being appointed,with Bongino, with Kash Patel,
we thought we're going to get tothe bottom of this.
I think this is really what'sdisappointing people.
You know it would surprise me.
I'd like to get your take onthis.
(08:09):
Your article is great.
We're going to link it in theshow notes.
It really goes into all of thisat a deep level and I think
people need to read this andunderstand it from the angle
that you're presenting.
But even Trump, you know, inthis last cabinet meeting, if
you saw that he really pushedback and he really didn't want
to talk about this Epstein casehe he really shut it down, tried
(08:31):
to shut it down.
And Jeff from Coffee and COVID,he's just unbelievable, Right,
I love him.
And he wrote the presidentDonald Trump picked perhaps his
biggest fight against his baseyet on Saturday.
Donald Trump picked perhaps hisbiggest fight against his base
yet on Saturday, unleashing alengthy truth social media post
demanding Republicans not wastetime and energy on Jeffrey
Epstein, somebody that nobodycares about.
(08:53):
But here's the issue.
You know I don't really careabout Jeffrey Epstein.
You know he's dead now andagain whether he committed
suicide and murder.
Okay, we'll look into that.
I guess we're trying to poo-poothat too, but at the end of the
day, we're worried about thosethousands of kids.
And when he says this, he saidwe have a perfect administration
(09:15):
.
He says the talk of the worldand selfish people are trying to
hurt it all over a guy whonever dies, jeffrey Epstein.
He wrote For years.
It's Epstein over and overagain.
And so he's right that we'renot going to let this go.
Because here's the differencethis movement that supported
Trump to a large extent areChristians, tom.
(09:38):
They actually care about thesekids and this is the big thing.
We want to know what happenedto those children and who did it
to them.
And so that's why we're notgoing to let it go.
It's, you know, people stillare there supporting Trump.
I mean, if you look at the, atwhat could have happened with
the Biden, with Biden winning,or Kamala Harris, I mean this
(10:00):
thing would have been buried sodeep we would have never saw it.
You know, now we saw this hope,and this is really what I want
to ask you about.
You know why do you think he'sdoing this, tom?
You know why do you all of asudden, boom, it's a turn, we're
going to push this out, we'regoing to move on to the next
thing.
And when he says we're the talkof the world and selfish people
are trying to hurt thismovement, and I don't really get
(10:24):
that.
I hope there's something deeperthat we're looking for here and
maybe I'm missing something.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Well, I'm going to detail that more in part two,
but I'll give you a preview ofbasically what I'm going to say.
I understand completely whythey're doing this.
They've just been so inept atit.
They're really one of thethings about talk about Trump
lying every day.
You know, he's really a verybad liar, which this is what,
which is what this pushback atthe cabinet meeting shows.
(10:53):
He's really transparent and hedoesn't want to lie the way he
is.
Dan Bongino and Kash Patel looklike they.
You know, they had a gun totheir heads when they were being
interviewed by Maria Bartiromoand they said you know, and
basically they focused on it andsays yeah, I read the file, he
committed suicide.
And Cash Patel says I've doneall these cases and I know a
(11:14):
suicide when I see it.
Well, that's beside the point,it doesn't mean anything.
What really is going on hereand this is the thing that I'm
concerned about is the deepcorruption in our government
that goes you know, anyorganization that can operate in
the shadows without anytransparency, without any light
(11:35):
being shown on it, is going tobecome corrupt.
And the CIA and theseintelligence agencies and also
the law enforcement agencieslike the FBI and the DEA.
They've all become corruptbecause they're operating in the
shadows with impunity andnobody's keeping an eye on them
the way they should be.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
To your point and in your article.
You can see how people start.
You know you start to lie right, you start these lies and you
start this process.
And you start, you start to lieright, you start these lies and
you start this process.
And you start one guy iscovering up for another guy.
The CIA was involved in some ofthis stuff.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
See, look, let me put it, having been in law
enforcement, let me explainreally simply.
When you try to get a criminalcase against somebody, generally
you'll go after the easiesttarget and then you get that
target, and then you twist themand you twist their arms, you
threaten them, you force them tocooperate with you so that they
(12:33):
become an informant, so thatthey actually begin working for
you, not just provideinformation, but begin working
for you.
So, basically, you have a gunto their head where you either
you're going to go to jail jailforever or you're going to help
us get the guys, that people isto do things that are really not
very moral, that aren't verynice, that aren't honorable, and
(13:09):
so like with, for example, inorder to get John Gotti, they
basically gave immunity to Sammythe Bull Gravano, who is his
number two.
Well, Sammy the Bull Gravanomurdered 19 people.
So you know, here you are.
You're basically getting in bedwith somebody who is a terrible
(13:32):
person in order to get somebodyelse who's a terrible person.
So where's the good in that?
And in doing so, you begin torealize, hey, it doesn't really
make any difference.
Some of them do.
Now, one of the things that Idid when I was with the state is
I tried to get information onpeople using informants who were
what I considered to be truebelievers, somebody that did it
(13:53):
for a cause, that they had areason to go after, somebody.
It wasn't something that Itried to corrupt them in some
way, that I tried to getsomething on them in order to
force them to do something.
I wanted them to do itwillingly, and I was very
successful at doing that.
Speaker 1 (14:08):
Do you think that they do this, tom, because they
don't want to take the time tolook into those people, or they
want to get the cases over with,or I look at.
I know that the the evil is outthere and there's just probably
so much on their plates.
Could they, could they, youknow, you know, in a timely
fashion.
Is that why they do this?
Because they think they got toget this thing?
Speaker 2 (14:29):
finished.
Here's what Epstein was doing.
He was in order to facilitatehis business operation.
He developed relationships withvery powerful people, with
people that were influential allover the world, in order to get
those people to do things thathe wanted.
He got them to do things likehave sex with kids and he filmed
(14:55):
them.
There were cameras in all ofhis properties, including in all
the bedrooms, so he would hookpeople up.
He would get something on them,and even get something on them
like have sex with an underagegirl, because you know, if you
have sex with an underage girlor underage boy, that's a lot of
leverage.
That gives you a lot ofleverage.
(15:16):
So let's say that the CIA andthe Mossad and all these other
intelligence agencies figuredout this is what he was doing
and he was breaking laws allover the world.
Okay, so now they say this issomebody we can use, because now
we got this on him.
So then they tell him he sayswe want to get something on you
know, bill Jones, or something,and so you invite him to your
(15:38):
place and and uh and compromisehim and then give us the
information.
This is how.
This is what they were doing.
They were, they were using himfor his contacts and for his
ability to corrupt people.
It wasn't like the, it wasn'tlike the CIA or the Mossad was
providing these girls, but theywere facilitating his whole
criminal operation that he wasinvolved in because it benefited
(16:00):
them.
So they're propping him up.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
They're protecting him in essence so that they can
get these other things done, andthen they build up this monster
.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
Right, well, let me get.
I don't know if Epstein hadanything to do with it, but this
is a similar kind of thing.
There was an engineer that hadaccess to the Iranian Iranian
nuclear development.
So he lived in Abu Dhabi withan Iranian wife, but he was used
(16:32):
and he had access to Natanz,which is one of the facilities
that they use to enrich uranium,and so he had access to these
things, of these things.
The Israelis and the Americanswanted to get the Stuxnet virus
into the system there in Natanzso they could destroy the
operation.
They could make destruction ofthe operation the.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
Israelis this is a computer virus that you're
talking about.
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Yeah, it was a computer virus that they put
into the network.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
With all the viruses going on, I just want to make
sure-.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
Yeah, that it was air gap.
They couldn't hack into itbecause it wasn't connected to
the outside world.
They need somebody to go inthere with a flash drive and
insert it into the system.
And so this engineer, the USand Israelis targeted him over a
period of a couple of years andthey wanted they didn't have
any way to contact this guy, orthey didn't have any reason to
(17:21):
contact this engineer, this guy,or they didn't have any reason
to contact this engineer.
So they went to the Dutchintelligence to get them to
compromise the guy.
Well, in some way theycompromised him and forced him
to work for them and that's howhe got the Stuxnet virus into
(17:42):
the Iranian system back, youknow, a number of years ago,
which really set back theirnuclear program many years.
It was a brilliant.
It was a brilliant operation.
But we still don't know exactlywhat they did to compromise that
engineer.
He didn't do it because he wasa true believer.
He did it because they hadsomething on him and that
something could have been thatthey compromised him with a girl
(18:03):
or with a young girl, withanything, but they forced him to
cooperate with them in some way.
And this is what intelligenceagencies do.
This is what law enforcementagencies do.
Somehow we've lost the abilityto regulate this immorality that
is part of our whole governmentsystem.
We need to do something torealign what we do.
(18:26):
The Epstein case shows anexample of how we facilitated in
a monumental way the abuse andthe exploitation of minors.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
And Tom.
It's amazing the network, howbig this gets.
I mean, he was involved inHarvard, you know, and you know
with this organization.
This PDF Program forEvolutionary Dynamics.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
Right.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
You know he gave money to Harvard.
He had an office at Harvard.
He had this.
This is how crazy this getswhen you start going down these
rabbit holes and you start tofollow them.
It was basically a eugenicsexperiment.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
Yes, he was doing eugenics experiments.
He wanted to do that out inZorro Ranch.
It was really an island of DrMoreau kind of imaginings that
he had.
He was not only an evil man, hewas crazy, and maybe the evil
drove him crazy, I don't know.
But the thing that made Epsteinso valuable to so many
(19:35):
organizations was that he was amaster of developing these
high-level, highly connectednetworks of people.
He could manipulate thesenetworks to his own financial
gain and he was reallyremarkably good at it.
Speaker 1 (19:51):
So when it comes down , tom, you know the use of
prostitutes against our ownpoliticians I mean this is well
known in the halls of Congress.
You know you get that power,money, lust, selfishness, I mean
it all gets into it.
And then all of a sudden theystart to vote and they change
and you realize somebody's gotsomething on them, on them right
(20:12):
With the girl, et cetera.
Now, when you're talking aboutminors, you're you're at another
level where it's not only candestroy your marriage and your
career, this will take you downand put you in prison for a long
time.
So you've really got somethingon people and those films.
This is the bottom line.
This is what we want exposed.
I mean, is there a chance thatsomebody actually has these
(20:39):
videos now of these people andthis list?
Because I just heard Dershowitzthe attorney.
He said that he's seen thislist and he's seen these names
on the list and there are otherpeople that did.
What's her first name,maxwell's first name?
Is it galene galene?
Speaker 2 (20:56):
galene maxwell.
That's, that's.
He's a.
She's a daughter of robertmaxwell yeah, so.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
So now look at how she got involved now.
Why is she stepping forward now?
Why?
Why do you think you knowwhat's behind her?
She's still in prison right now, right?
Speaker 2 (21:10):
She probably wants to get out.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
You think that's what it is.
Speaker 2 (21:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
Yeah, all right.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
So the thing look, based on what I've seen in all
the records, if somebodyactually was interested in
telling a story telling thewhole story about Epstein the
information is already availablewhen you say the information is
available?
Speaker 1 (21:32):
are you say the information is available?
Are you talking about peoplenow on?
And again, I think it's a if it, if it's already available,
where, where?
Speaker 2 (21:41):
well, there's still some million dollar question
where is it?
well, well, I'm writing some ofit okay all right, but uh, the
the real question is who in thegovernment is behind this
corruption?
Well, who in the governmentchose to overlook all these
things that Epstein had?
Like, if I had an informantwith my agency and somebody
(22:06):
looks in the file and sees thatthere was some information that
they needed and they want to topursue it a little bit more and
they needed that informant, theywould have to come to me and
then I would have to contact, Iwould have to get with my
informant to get thatinformation.
It's not like, oh, you got thisguy's name and anybody in the
CIA or the Mossad or somebodycan call him up.
(22:27):
No, there's a handler, there'ssomebody that operated Epstein,
and when that handler retired,he turned him over to somebody
else.
Who were those people and who?
And why aren't they being heldaccountable for the, for
overlooking all this, all thisdepravity that was going on?
It's not like this.
It's not like this you knowthis nameless government?
(22:50):
Oh, the government, the CIA,the Mossad or who you know, the
Saudi intelligence or whoeverwas.
No, there is a person who ishis handler and that handler had
a boss who knew about it, andthat boss knew about it too.
It was so such high levelintelligence that there would be
people all the way up the chainwho were, who are involved and
(23:11):
who knew exactly what was goingon.
And this is why it's not comingout, because you can't put this
in open court.
You just couldn't put this.
This is national security stuff.
This is like top secretinformation.
But I don't have confidence,the way they're handling this,
that these people that werewithin the government, that were
facilitating this kind ofoperation, are being put in
(23:35):
check now because they're comingout and saying, oh, it doesn't
exist, there's nothing to seehere.
If they came out and said, yeah, this is what was going on, we
can't tell you the details of itbecause it would jeopardize
national security, but we'regoing to put a stop to it right
now.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
So, tom, I just had brought up Maxwell and I suppose
she could expose a lot right,what's the danger to her if she
starts this thing?
I mean it could be crazy.
Speaker 2 (24:02):
You know, the thing is that she has some really
damaging information aboutpeople who are very rich.
They could try to go after her.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
You think I mean, look, we've done just about
everything else.
If Dan Bongino and Kash Pateland even Trump's trying to put
this down, pam Bondi, for somereason, if and I was I brought
up, telsey Gabbard was, you know.
She was just on turning pointand she said that I feel this
(24:32):
frustration too.
She goes to the audience.
I know you're frustrated thatwe're not moving fast enough.
She goes, I feel thatfrustration and she deliberately
called out the deep state thatwe're talking about here and the
corruption and the deep state,and so these people are battling
, but it seems like it's so deep, tom, so entrenched that you
know, just like you and I alwaystalk about the public school
(24:54):
system you almost have to throwthe whole thing out.
It's so deep and so entrenched.
It seems like our government isthe same.
You know you put good people inplace, but they can't do much.
It's really a mystery in manyways how deep this runs.
Nobody can really defineexactly what that deep state is.
It's just corruption at so manylevels, I believe.
Speaker 2 (25:16):
Well, I think there is a lot you can do about it,
and I've been in government so Iam fairly certain.
I've been in the Air Force soI've got experience with
national defense issues, andI've also been in the state, so
I'm familiar with how lawenforcement operates, how it
could operate.
The problem is too manyagencies want to do the
(25:37):
expedient thing, which isusually the wrong way to do it.
So the thing that bothers me isthat there's no assurance from
the way the Trump administrationis handling this.
There's no assurance thatpeople those handlers and the
people in that system are beingcontrolled to do the right thing
rather than to allow thefacilitation of this sexual
(25:58):
exploitation of children tocontinue.
It wasn't just.
Epstein isn't the only one.
Epstein was a part owner in amodeling agency modeling that
service, john Luke Brunel.
He had contacts all over theworld.
He supplied models to companies, to private parties, to public
(26:20):
parties.
He would supply models forpeople that would go to
conventions or something, andthey had booths, and so he'd
have models, the booths, themodels would go there to, you
know, to attract customers.
He did all that kind of stuffall over the world.
Okay, well, he wasn't the onlymodeling agency.
He's not the only modelingagency like that.
He's not the only modelingagency that's involved in
(26:43):
prostitution.
Who else are these guys usingin the intelligence services?
Using to compromise people?
One of the easiest ways tocompromise some guy out on a
business trip is to supply himwith a girl.
It's an easy thing to do.
Speaker 1 (26:58):
Yeah, and people fall for that all the time, right,
all the time.
You have a few cocktails, youhave a few drinks.
It's not just criminals that doit.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Our own government is doing it.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
You know, this kind of stuff should stop.
Speaker 1 (27:11):
But you know, when you get nefarious to the point
where you're not only sendingmodels, tom, we're sending
underage models, right, and thisis where Epstein I'm sure
Epstein got into this role andthen he gets the connections
right, he meets these models andthen away you go, you know go.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
You know.
At this point, though, this iswhat I see.
It creates an environment wherewe're looking at children as
being fair game.
In Illinois, the age of consentis 17, which means that if
you're underage, only if you're16 or below.
Well, that's ridiculous.
There's a movement to try tolower the age of consent even
lower.
In most places in Europe it's16, the age of consent.
(27:58):
And they want to eliminate theage of consent.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Isn't Illinois?
You don't even need theparental right for an abortion
now for a young girl, isn't it13 years old?
Speaker 2 (28:10):
They only have to notify them even.
Speaker 1 (28:12):
It's unbelievable right, and so usually not always
, of course, but usually, youknow this girl is in that place
at 13, 14 years old, becauseshe's a victim of somebody, and
so we're covering up this evenin our own beautiful state of
Illinois here, aren't we?
(28:32):
You?
Know by allowing them to abortchildren from children and just
wipe it under the rug.
You know.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
Right, they're not Now even 13 years old.
It's illegal for them to havesex with anybody, so but they're
not even investigating it tofind out who exploited them.
Yeah, yeah, this guy.
There's a Brian Crowder.
He's on trial.
I don't know what happened tothe trial, but he was accused of
getting a girl pregnant twiceand having her when she was
(29:00):
underage and she was a studentand taking her in for an
abortion, claiming that he washer father.
He was the only one toimpregnate her.
Speaker 1 (29:08):
You know, I remember in high school you know as I
look back now there were acouple of teachers in high
school and they used to beflirting good-looking young
teachers flirting with thesegirls in our school and then we
found out later on they werehaving affairs and stuff, and so
this goes back many, many years.
(29:29):
So at the end of the day,something like you know,
something like Cash Patel, danBongino, I had this feeling and
I still had this feeling thatthese guys would like to do the
right thing.
You know, telsey Gabbard'sfrustrated Pam Bondi seems like
someone that would want to dothe right thing, but it seemed
like they all pivoted here.
Is there something underneaththat happened that?
Speaker 2 (29:52):
just stopped this process, of course, because it's
still being used.
That's why and what they'reafraid, if they come out with it
, that there'll be a demand thatthere be prosecutions and they
can't prosecute because it'snational defense information.
Or somebody will come out andsay well, you, if you try to
(30:14):
blow the whistle on me, I'mgoing to tell all about what,
what we're up to, I'm going torelease all this information, so
they're in a position wherethey can't, they can't, they
can't say anything because wehave a corrupt national defense
system.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
So, in other words, is it they're just, hands are
tied, they just see that, wow,this is just too big.
It's just still there's somemissing part here, that I it
doesn't?
Speaker 2 (30:40):
it's?
Barry seals was, uh, wasrunning drugs for the dea, you
know, as part of some deaoperation.
But do you think the cia hasbrought in?
Brought in heroin from thegolden triangle?
Speaker 1 (30:56):
so like cash patel again, dan bongino, bonnie, but
they must know this ahead oftime, because they were all
talking about exposing this.
They they must have had some.
They're not.
They're intelligent people thathave some decent backgrounds,
do you think?
Think, though, tom, when theyfinally just come right up to
the point where they really feelthat they need to do something,
(31:17):
and then come across whatyou're saying right now and just
go, guys, we're not going to beable to do anything.
It's just too much.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
I don't think, you know, I don't know.
Pam Bondi wouldn't knowanything about it.
She was an attorney general inFlorida.
I don't think she ever workedfor the government other than
you know and she might've knownsomething about law enforcement
activities, but she wouldn'tknow anything about these
nefarious national defenseoperations unless she did a lot
of reading.
I've been, you know, since I'vebeen in the field, I read about
(31:46):
these things all the time.
I keep up on it, but mostpeople they could care less.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
So that's my question Do you think that they, just
when they see the stark realityon how big and evil this is,
that they just see?
This is what I'm questioning.
It's like you come up andthey're just hitting a wall and
saying we're going to have toback off of this.
Right now, we're not going touse the time and the energy this
(32:12):
would take our whole governmentto investigate and, who knows,
with the deep state, it couldtake us all down, or you know?
I mean, is this a reality thatwe're facing now, with such a
big evil that we just back off.
Is this what Trump is seeingright now?
Speaker 2 (32:25):
I think Trump is looking at it from the
standpoint of we have moreimportant things to do, because
really the United States is.
When he came in it was inpretty sad shape, so
economically, militarily, from anational defense standpoint,
he's doing just remarkablethings to reestablish the United
(32:46):
States.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
So that's my question then Do you think it just says,
hey, we can't deal witheverything, we're going to deal
with just this.
But I would think as agovernment, as the president, I
just says, hey, we can't dealwith everything, we're going to
deal with just this.
But I would think as agovernment, as the president,
I'd say, hey look, I'm not goingto deal with this anymore, I
can't take this, but I'm goingto put somebody on it, a special
prosecutor.
It would have sounded a lotbetter at the cabinet meeting.
I'm going to put this team onit and they're going to continue
(33:09):
to grind away at this thing.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
I mean, at least from a PR standpoint.
Don't you think, if you werethe president, that, instead of
pushing it under the rug andsaying there's nothing here
anymore?
Well, I know that at least twointelligence agencies were
involved with Epstein theIsraelis and the US the CIA we
may be able to control the US,we can't do anything about the
Israelis.
And the US, the CIA we may beable to control the US, we can't
do anything about the Israelis.
And who knows what otherintelligence agencies were
involved in this.
Remember, epstein wascompromising people all over the
(33:43):
world, and so he was apotential asset for every
intelligence agency in the world, not just ours.
And Epstein had no moralcompass, so there was no reason
for him to say well, I'm notgoing to cooperate with you
because I'm an American.
Now you give me the money.
Depending on what you can giveto me, I'll help you out.
(34:06):
So who knows what threats havebeen issued against the United
States by other intelligenceagencies?
Speaker 1 (34:13):
We don't have a lot of time, but I would like to at
least touch on because I thinkthey're related.
You wrote an article rightbefore this, one called
Reaffirming Parental Rights, andthe reason I bring it up with
only a little time left isbecause people that are
listening to this show arefrustrated about things.
They can't do things.
People that are listening tothis show or frustrated about
(34:35):
things, they can do things.
And I think, no matter whathappens here, you know, as we
see this play out you and I workon Stolen Innocence, so we work
for kids that it's going totake millions of people that are
going to at least step forwardand try to do something and you
can at the local level, andwe're seeing parents all over
the United States standing up,but it's still the minority.
Most people still don't standup and do anything, but we are
(34:57):
changing the people that dostand up.
You know there's somethingabout truth and goodness, the
beauty of love, and beingconcerned about all of these
victims.
Well, these victims arehappening into our schools all
over our country, in myneighborhood, in your
neighborhood, in everybody'sneighborhood, and we have to be
(35:17):
cognizant of this.
That's why I think thisreaffirming parental rights that
you wrote about, and again,I'll link this letter.
I think it's very, veryimportant.
I just sent it out on mySubstack, tom, to push it out to
our audience here to make surethat they didn't miss this
letter that you wrote onSubstack, and so let's just go
over it just briefly and we'lltouch on it again.
(35:39):
Is it Mahmoud versus Taylor,and you say in your article?
It has broader implicationsthan you might think.
On the surface, it may seem toapply only to the assignment of
reading materials in theclassroom, but it's way more
than that.
You and I are very familiarwith this.
Our audience that's beenlistening to us for a while is
familiar with this pushing theLGBTQ plus stories and books,
(36:01):
which is really pornography.
Again, I'm getting back to thechild pornography.
Whatever happens in this Epsteincase, we still, as just people
that are concerned about kids,need to start to stand up and at
least go to these school boardmeetings, run for election, get
these books and this groomingout of the schools.
(36:23):
But anyways, at least we hadsome positive and this is
probably what we should focus on.
Something positive came out ofthe Supreme Court.
Maybe you can outline somethingRight.
Speaker 2 (36:32):
Well it gives.
It really reestablishes parentsas having control over what
their kids are exposed to inschool, that they can opt their
kids out of things that arecontrary to what their religious
beliefs are.
But it's also important forparents to stand up and assert
those rights and to do the rightthing, not only only for
themselves but for theirchildren and for their family.
(36:54):
And this is the thing thatevery person can do.
If they have a, whateveropportunity appears to them,
whatever opportunity God givesto them, they can choose to do
the right thing or the wrongthing.
They have that choicethroughout every day.
And here's the take it a littlebit back to, you know, to the
(37:16):
Epstein case.
I had a case when I was withthe state where I went out and
developed an informant becauseeverybody said, oh, you can't
develop true believer informants, they're not reliable, you
can't do anything with them, andso you got to get by and bust,
get them.
You know, you got to getleverage on them, you got to be
able to do this.
I went out and developed aninformant for the gang's
(37:36):
investigation, kenny Morrow.
He had formerly been a memberof the Alrucan Street Gang and
he drifted away from them,started trying to live a
honorable life.
I approached him and gave himan opportunity to redeem himself
and also to get revenge for hisbrother's death.
At the same time, I convincedhim to work for me.
(37:59):
I didn't have anything on him,I convinced him to work for me.
He went back in, reacquaintedhimself with the Elrukans, got
involved in that organizationand destroyed the organization.
His information took down thatorganization the entire one of
the biggest street gangs ever inChicago, the most, one of the
(38:21):
most dangerous street gangs everin Chicago.
And so you don't have to, youdon't have to use these evil
methods to to attack evil.
You can.
You can do it the right way andunfortunately that model has
not been picked up by otherpeople.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
Yeah, yeah, whatever you know, whatever happened to
him, Kenny Moore.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
He died, he was he actually.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Was he killed?
Speaker 2 (38:52):
No, he was put in witness protection program and
he was relocated to Arizona.
He went out and got drunk onenight and he crawled into a.
He had an argument with hisgirlfriend.
He crawled into a metal quonsethut and went to sleep on a
Friday night, early Saturdaymorning and of course in Arizona
it's a lot hotter than it is uphere early Saturday morning and
(39:13):
of course in Arizona it's a lothotter than it is up here and
the sun came up, got about 120to 150 degrees inside the
Quonset hut and he died ofexposure.
They found him dead on Mondaymorning.
Speaker 1 (39:23):
Unbelievable, so when at least the Supreme Court is
backing us up.
What we're going to find,though and again I think that
your article is really goodbecause it's a comprehensive
article kind of takes us throughsome of the things that you and
I talk about all the time,because what we find is, with
the education system, now theLBGTQ again.
Think about it.
(39:44):
I think of it as porn, really.
You know, grooming and pornthat's, you know, going to take
these young kids again.
It really steals theirinnocence and and, and it
obliterates their moralimaginations, they start to look
at each other.
And so so what we're doing iswe're bringing up all of these
kids that have no moral basis,no moral foundation, tom, and
(40:08):
here's the concern, right.
So we have these, this deepstate that's corrupt, and now we
are corrupted, the schools andthe kids beneath, unless parents
stand up and protect their kidsof nothing else and don't fall
for this book banning bullshityou know, because, at the end of
the day, parents have the rightto say I'm not trying to ban a
(40:29):
book, I'm trying to use mycommon sense, moral decency, to
say nobody has the right tosexualize our kids.
And that's what we've beentalking about here with the
Epstein.
You cannot just sexualizechildren.
They're sexualizing our ownchildren and our own
grandchildren, right beneath ournoses, tom, and this is
something we can do somethingabout and we need to do
(40:50):
something about To your pointand this will be my last thing
I'll throw back to you is thattruth and goodness, when you
walk into that arena this is thepoint you just made there's a
power to that.
There's a power to truth.
When you speak the truth.
There's a power there becauseyou're not alone anymore.
You walk with God when you dothat and to do the right thing.
(41:11):
Look, we're all getting older,we're all going to die.
Tom, let's do something goodwith our lives before we're out
of here.
And we got to get out of thisselfish mentality that just says
hey, the government, they're socorrupt, forget about it,
because they're raising ourtaxes.
These poor young people can'tafford homes anymore.
We're corrupting everything andnobody seems to care, except
(41:34):
for a handful of people that youand I are working with.
You've got some wonderfulpeople exposing this on the
Internet and stuff and you knowthey are rising up.
They are rising up but we needmore people.
Speaker 2 (41:47):
You know, most people mistake pornography as being
something that's just visual,that it's a picture or a video
or something.
Pornography is written too.
There's written material thatdescribes things that is even
more pornographic than pictures.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
Yeah, it is.
Speaker 2 (42:02):
And they actually have these kinds of books that
they're giving to children whoare very young, and it sets
their mind in a direction of theworld rather than a direction
that God wants them to go in.
And so you can't.
It's like I said, this one girlthat was working for Epstein.
She was trafficked to theUnited States, to Epstein from
Yugoslavia where she had sexualrelationships with Epstein and
(42:25):
then she continued in hisemployee and now she's an adult
and was still working for him.
This became the norm for her.
How many times?
I mean there's been many caseswhen I've interviewed kids who
have been sexually abused, wherethey don't see it as abuse,
they see it as the norm.
It's not an abuse, this is justthe way things are.
(42:46):
So their whole outlook oneverything gets twisted.
And that's what we're doing toour children.
We're we're we're steeping themin this immoral atmosphere, not
just sexual, but but in eventhings like well, it's okay to
use somebody for your ownpurposes, it's okay to get
leverage on them, it's okay towe start to look at people
(43:09):
exactly like Epstein and thesepeople we're talking about,
including the rich, the elitethat use these kids for sex we
start to see them as objects.
Speaker 1 (43:19):
We no longer see them as persons.
When we do that, we're in badshape just from a moral
standpoint.
Our civilization will declinejust because of this.
I mean.
Bishop Sheen wrote this backwhen I was in high school.
He said of the 22 majorcivilizations all through
history, 19 of them came downand were destroyed not by an
(43:42):
outside force, but from moralcorruption from the inside.
And that's what we're seeinghere.
Nobody could take the UnitedStates down from an exterior
force, but we are rotting fromthe inside, and so this is
really the danger that's outthere today, and we have a
responsibility.
Look, we can't change the wholeworld, we know that but we can
(44:05):
change what's right around us,and it starts with our own heart
.
We got to start walking intothe truth and certainly protect
the kids and the people rightaround us, and it starts with
our own heart.
We got to start walking intothe truth and certainly protect
the kids and the people rightaround us.
Speaker 2 (44:14):
Well, that's what I ended the article on Epstein
with not to act is to act, notto speak is to speak, attributed
to Dietrich Bonhoeffer.
And that's exactly what theproblem is we're not acting,
we're not speaking, which speaksvolumes.
Speaker 1 (44:32):
Because here's what the court said and this is in
your article.
The Supreme Court now rejectedthe notion that the book simply
exposed students to differingideas, because this is the story
, right?
We always hear Tom when we'reat school board meetings.
no, we're just exposing them.
Everybody has a right to beexposed to this, and the court
said this.
No, that's not what you'redoing.
(44:54):
The majority determined, six tothree here that the storybooks
that we're talking about hereclearly advanced specific
viewpoint, and kids werepunished in all different ways,
ostracized in a lot of times, ifthey didn't go along with this,
and so the pressure on theseyoung people to go along with
these ideologies is tough.
Speaker 2 (45:15):
you know when you're a young child.
If it's okay to use peoplesexually for your own purposes,
then it's okay to use people inany other way for your own
purposes as well, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (45:26):
Isn't that what?
Speaker 2 (45:26):
they're being taught.
Speaker 1 (45:28):
You know that last part that you said you closed
the article with.
Can you state that again,because it reminds me?
Speaker 2 (45:34):
of something.
Yeah, that was in the Epsteinarticle.
It says not to act is to act,not to speak is to speak.
Speaker 1 (45:40):
So here?
This reminded me when I readthat.
So yesterday, as we'rerecording this it won't go out
until later on in the week, butwe're recording this on a Monday
Yesterday, sunday, I was atMass and the readings were
really interesting.
You know the first reading fromMoses and it says this it's
(46:01):
talking about these things andit said if you would only heed
the voice of the Lord this isfrom Deuteronomy, chapter 30,
keep his commandments andstatutes that are written in
this book of the law when youreturn to the Lord with all your
heart and with all your soul.
He says, for this is thecommand.
He said.
This is very interesting, forthis command, which I enjoy on
(46:22):
you today, is not too mysteriousand remote for you.
It's not up in the sky.
This is Moses speaking that youshould say I have to go up in
the sky and get it so I can tellyou what it is.
Nor is it across the sea.
Who will cross the sea and getit for us and tell us of it that
we may carry it out?
No, moses said it's somethingvery near to you, ready in your
(46:45):
mouths and in your hearts, toyour point, tom.
He ends you have to go out andcarry it out.
You have to carry it out.
And so Moses said we alreadyknow this, we know what to do.
Now you have to go and carry itout.
So this is not pie in the sky.
This is his point the gospelreading was from and it would be
(47:06):
the same kind of thing.
The gospel was from Luke and itwas.
This lawyer goes up to Jesus andsays teacher, what must I do to
inherit eternal life?
And he says well, what'swritten in the law?
And he goes it's all thecommandments and all this stuff.
And he says well, how do youinterpret that?
How do you read it?
And then this lawyer replies toJesus you shall love your Lord,
(47:30):
your God, with all your heart,with all your God, with all your
heart, with all your soul, withall your strength, with all
your mind and your neighbor asyourself.
And then he takes them into theGood Samaritan right.
He says you know, this guy wasbeaten by these robbers.
He's laying on the side of theroad dying.
The priest walks to the otherside, doesn't want anything to
do with it.
The Levite walks to the otherside and it's the Samaritan, the
(47:54):
good Samaritan, who.
The Samaritans were enemies ofIsrael.
And Jesus says he's the oneright that stopped by, picked
him up, brought him to the innand took care of him.
And he said this is yourneighbor.
He says which one is yourneighbor.
He says which one is yourneighbor, this is your neighbor.
That we have to watch out forone another, regardless of of uh
(48:16):
, of who they are.
These are people and we have tohelp pick them up.
And this is what you know.
This is the essence of what itcomes down to.
We could all do it in our ownlittle ways, can't we?
Speaker 2 (48:26):
yeah, that's, and we're not doing it no no, and
we're not doing it.
No, no, and we're going to paythe price, Thomas Tick-tock, you
know they have all this stuff.
You know, you go on thesemission trips and all this kind
of stuff.
They're just nothing butglorified vacations and yet we
just turn a blind eye to thethings that our government is
doing that are clearly wrong.
(48:48):
And a lot of these people workin government and they're
turning a blind eye to it.
They're not doing anythingabout it.
You know, if I had been in thegovernment and saw how they were
complicit in the sexualexploitation of children, I
would have said something.
Where are the people sayingsomething?
Speaker 1 (49:05):
You think they have to be there.
Speaker 2 (49:07):
That's why.
Speaker 1 (49:10):
I was so excited about, again about these people
that I mentioned over and overagain Kash Patel, dan Bongino,
et cetera because I thought thatthat would rally the troops,
that these good people wouldstart to surface and expose this
.
Sometimes they're just waitingfor a good shepherd, a good
leader, to come so they canstart, because they don't want
(49:32):
to get fired.
They got their money, they gottheir family, they got in and
I'm sure people have been firedover this.
Speaker 2 (49:40):
Just look at Cash Patel and Dan Bongino.
Look at their body language andthey are being interviewed by
Maria Bartiromo on May 10th.
They literally look likesomebody was in the on the wings
pointing a gun at them.
Okay, it was so stiff, it wasunbelievable.
Speaker 1 (49:56):
These are not cowards .
That's why there's a link therethat they're coming up against
some kind of wall that they'resensing.
I hope they have anotherstrategy.
Tom Trump too.
Speaker 2 (50:09):
I mean, he's talking about being open and transparent
.
And then all of a sudden atthat cabinet meeting it was like
holy smokes.
The guy asked a question andit's like, hey, he might as well
have told the Secret Service toshoot this guy.
Speaker 1 (50:22):
Unbelievable.
Well, you know, speaking ofthat, we start to talk about how
you can go down these rabbit,these rabbit holes, you know,
and when you start to do smallthings wrong and it gets bigger
and bigger and bigger.
So here's the, here's this guy,donald trump.
When, when donald trump sosunday marked the first
anniversary of the shootingright of donald trump, right.
(50:43):
So you know, everybodyremembers, you know where we
were when it happened.
The president is fortunate thatthe 2024 second, unless Hero
attempted on his life, remember,they saw this guy.
I think he was on a golf rangeor something, getting ready to
shoot right.
And so listen to this.
So he's in prison now.
(51:04):
And so, had it not been for theeye of a few keen eye of a few
secret service agents, suspectedwannabe assassinated Ryan Ruth
could have abruptly endedTrump's life less than two
months before Election Day.
Can you imagine how the countrywould have reacted?
Now that he's locked up, ruth isless than thrilled by the
prospect of remaining in a cellfor decades, until his
(51:28):
unceremonious death.
Cell for decades until hisunceremonious death.
Based on a bizarre letter hepenned in June, he said he'd
likely prefer a quick execution.
I'd rather be dead, he said.
Why is the death penalty notallowed?
He wrote.
Now here's the point At nearly60, he says a life of
(51:53):
nothingness without love.
What's the point?
Can you imagine?
This is what he writes now.
He was there getting ready toassassinate donald trump, and
then he's sitting in jail, goingyou might as well kill me
because at 60, a life ofnothingness without love.
What's the point?
And so he gets the point.
He just doesn't make aconnection, tom, that we are
people of love.
(52:13):
That's what we're called out todo, even love your enemies,
right.
Which is?
That doesn't mean I got to likethem.
That doesn't mean I don't doanything against them.
That doesn't mean I don't standup at school board meetings,
but hatred has got to stop, youknow, and this is what Jesus
said all the time.
And here's a guy saying a lifeof nothingness without love.
(52:34):
And yet he was living this out.
See, this is that disconnection, tom.
We just don't make thatconnection that we are these
people of love.
You can't go shooting people.
You can't be sexualizing youngpeople in school systems, you
can't be exploiting young girlsand trying to have sex with them
and becoming people of love.
You sit in prison, you go, youmight as well.
kill me now, because my life isnothingness.
(52:56):
What was it before, dude, whenyou didn't do anything?
You know craziness, man, youcan't make this stuff up right.
And one more point here thatIsraeli settlers beat American
citizen to death.
They thought he was, I guess,hamas or something.
He was visiting Israel on theWest Bank and a mob of settlers
(53:18):
Israeli settlers beat the20-year-old American to death on
Friday, brutally killing theFlorida man Mousselet and
23-year-old Mohammed Shabibi,before reportedly blocking an
ambulance from helping thesuffering victims for three
hours, and then he died.
And so here again, you knowyou're going to kill an innocent
(53:39):
man walking down the streetbecause of your hatred.
And you know this hatred, tom,will go on and on and on.
These wars will not stop unlessthe human hearts get turned,
and this is a battle of thehuman heart, my friend John Paul
.
II would say it always starts onthe battlefield of the
individual heart between goodand evil, between love and
(54:01):
lusting and taking right.
And unless we're all willing tofight that battle and then
stand up, like Moses said, andgo out and act, there's not much
hope.
But the good news is, tom, eachone of us can do this.
Each one of us can do this.
We fight that battlefield, onthe battlefield of the heart,
and we become persons that careabout other people, love God, be
(54:23):
filled with divine life andlove and then go out and love
your neighbor.
It's simple.
It's not easy.
Look at it.
You have to remember to loveyour wife and your kids and the
people right around you.
But that's where it starts.
That's where it starts, lastwords.
Speaker 2 (54:37):
Yeah, no, I have too many.
Speaker 1 (54:40):
All right, well, let's end it there.
Speaker 2 (54:42):
All right.
Speaker 1 (54:42):
We look forward to part two.
When's it going to come out?
Speaker 2 (54:46):
I'm hoping I'll have it out next week.
It's a lot more complicatedthan part one, because I've got
to explain why all this, whythey're acting like they've got
guns to their head.
Speaker 1 (54:57):
I can't believe that you're taking out an article
like that.
That's got to be just sotime-consuming that doesn't just
roll off the list.
Speaker 2 (55:03):
Does it no?
It doesn't no, no, hey, Godbless you.
Speaker 1 (55:07):
Thanks, tom, thanks for joining us.
Thanks everybody, thanks forjoining us today.
Talk to you again soon.
Bye-bye.
Speaker 2 (55:20):
Bye.
Welcome to the Become who you Are podcast.
I'm Jack Riggert, your host.
I'm here with Tom Hampson,who's a regular guest on our
show.
Of course, Tom, you just wrotean article the Troubling Case of
Jeffrey Epstein.
You and I were going to talkabout parental rights, which is
so important to this case thatjust came down to the Supreme
Court, but there's just a lot totalk about.
(00:34):
This is on everybody's mind.
I hope you don't mind if Istart out with the Troubling
Case of Jeffrey Epstein.
Give our audience a little bitof a little background on this,
will you, when you're seeing it,look at everybody's reading all
the headlines et cetera, etcetera.
You have an interesting wayyou're looking at this case, and
you're looking at it the way Ido too.
I think you know we look atthis from a moral standpoint.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
you and I.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
And just our audience , remind our audience that you
and I do a presentation calledStolen Innocence, which is
really the moral aspect of whatwe're doing to children.
It's blatant, it's upfront andpersonal and I think, along with
parental rights that we wantedto talk about today, this
Jeffrey Epstein case falls rightinto that moral background,
(01:20):
doesn't it?
Speaker 2 (01:21):
It does, and I've been interested in the case
since 2008, when he was firstconvicted of child sex.
Well, he was convicted ofsoliciting prostitution and
soliciting for prostitution of aminor down in Florida.
The way the case was handledwas so unusual and he was such a
major figure in traffickingkids at that time that it was
(01:43):
shocking to me that thegovernment approached the case
the way they did.
So I've been looking at him foryears and he's really an
example that I see of one of theproblems with the way we deal
with child sexual abuse in thiscountry and perhaps around the
world.
You know, something thatstarted me one of the things
(02:03):
that started me being involvedin as a non to try to deal with
this child protection issue isthat I saw the government wasn't
doing what it should be doing.
They always say that they wantto, that they're increasing
taxes or they're doing thisthing or that thing for the
children.
You know, for the children.
The politicians are out thereevery time they want to get
(02:25):
money or they want to get a boat.
You hear Nancy Pelosi you know,over and over again in between
aborting kids and transing kids.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
She's there for the children, right.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Right?
Well, see to me I've known thisfor years that this is just
total BS, that they don't reallycare about the kids.
And the Epstein case, to me, isan example that proves the fact
that they don't care aboutthese kids.
Because here he was, he wasknown.
It was just well known that hehad, even in 2008, that he had
(02:56):
dozens, if not hundreds, ofvictims, and yet they basically
gave him a slap on the wrist,they essentially immunized
everybody but him who wasinvolved in it in that case,
which is unheard of.
I've never heard of anythinglike that before.
So they didn't go after anybodyother than Epstein.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
He served a little bit of time.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Well, he did.
He got a year and a half.
What was it?
A year and a half?
But he got out every day.
He was on work release, so hespent 14 hours a day out of the
jail and he basically had a jailcell that wasn't even locked.
(03:37):
It was a minimum security jail.
He was treated like a king.
It was just unheard of.
It's like something out of amovie where you see these movies
where the mobster's in prisonand he's got a big luxurious.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
It's just a facade to make it look like they did
something when you wrote thisarticle.
It's the big thing.
Is it suicide?
Is it not suicide?
The real issue is trafficking,you wrote, and the sexual
exploitation of children, andthat's really what it comes down
to.
I think in the middle of allthis and this is your point was
(04:17):
that we don't see these victims,these thousands of children
that were involved in child porn, child sex trafficking.
You know, they're on hiscomputer, you know, and things
that he produced, as well asother child porn.
I mean, this guy had a realissue and a real problem as
(04:42):
people that care about kids.
It's, you know, these highprofile people in the deep state
that you're alluding to nowthat lets these guys off or
doesn't even investigate them.
They don't care.
And if we don't stand up andtalk about it.
Nothing's going to happen.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
One of the things that I mentioned in the article
is that JPMorgan Chase was sued.
There was a lawsuit againstthem and they wound up paying
$290 million to traffickingvictims Because for 16 years
they concealed $1 billion oftransactions that they suspected
were related to sex trafficking.
(05:19):
But they hid these transactionsuntil after Epstein died and
then they reported him.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
So in essence, they had these flagged.
Right, they had these flagged.
They'll come after somebodylike me for praying outside, say
, an abortion clinic.
They're arresting people allaround the world.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
The.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
UK is a big deal on this 1,200 people a year for a
social media post.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
The UK is big deal on this 1,200 people a year for a
social media post.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
The rest of them putting them in prison, and this
they just monitor and let it goit's just amazing injustice.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
This is what I'm most concerned about is that the
magnitude of his trafficking wasso great that either we have
idiots who are in our governmentor they are totally and
thoroughly corrupt.
This you can't.
Do you realize what a billiondollars worth of trafficking of
(06:13):
kids is, or even over 16 years abillion dollars?
These people that aretrafficked don't make that much
money.
These kids aren't making money.
Epstein had somebody workingfor him who had been trafficked
from Yugoslavia when she was 14years old and then she remained
in his employ and now she's anadult and she was still working
(06:36):
for him.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Those kids, these kids Tom, as you know, being a
private investigator and beforethat working for the Illinois
Crime Division privateinvestigator and before that
working for the Illinois CrimeDivision really looking into
cases like this.
These kids are so groomed andindoctrinated in this as they
grow up into adults they don'trealize how broken they are.
And if these cases are justpushed under the rug, there's
(06:58):
going to be these thousands ofvictims that are going to carry
this baggage and this traumathrough their whole lives and we
have to expose this.
The same thing happened in thechurch when I was a young guy.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
It isn't necessarily just the trauma.
People think of trauma, thatthey have this pain all the time
.
What it does is it distortstheir life.
This distortion drives theminto a path opposite of the way
God wants them to be.
God doesn't want people to beexploited that way and they
don't want them to go out andhelp others get others to be
(07:35):
exploited either.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
I think about all these people that let this go,
tom, and they're involved inthis.
They don't think they're goingto die.
I don't think.
I think they're going to liveforever.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
I don't think they're going to die?
I don't think, you know.
I think they're going to liveforever.
I don't think they're going toface any consequences for what
they do.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
Ever, if they did, you know.
So here, getting to the crux ofthis now, with Trump coming in,
with Bondi being appointed,with Bongino, with Kash Patel,
we thought we're going to get tothe bottom of this.
I think this is really what'sdisappointing people.
You know it would surprise me.
I'd like to get your take onthis.
(08:09):
Your article is great.
We're going to link it in theshow notes.
It really goes into all of thisat a deep level and I think
people need to read this andunderstand it from the angle
that you're presenting.
But even Trump, you know, inthis last cabinet meeting, if
you saw that he really pushedback and he really didn't want
to talk about this Epstein casehe he really shut it down, tried
(08:31):
to shut it down.
And Jeff from Coffee and COVID,he's just unbelievable, Right,
I love him.
And he wrote the presidentDonald Trump picked perhaps his
biggest fight against his baseyet on Saturday.
Donald Trump picked perhaps hisbiggest fight against his base
yet on Saturday, unleashing alengthy truth social media post
demanding Republicans not wastetime and energy on Jeffrey
Epstein, somebody that nobodycares about.
(08:53):
But here's the issue.
You know I don't really careabout Jeffrey Epstein.
You know he's dead now andagain whether he committed
suicide and murder.
Okay, we'll look into that.
I guess we're trying to poo-poothat too, but at the end of the
day, we're worried about thosethousands of kids.
And when he says this, he saidwe have a perfect administration
(09:15):
.
He says the talk of the worldand selfish people are trying to
hurt it all over a guy whonever dies, jeffrey Epstein.
He wrote For years.
It's Epstein over and overagain.
And so he's right that we'renot going to let this go.
Because here's the differencethis movement that supported
Trump to a large extent areChristians, tom.
(09:38):
They actually care about thesekids and this is the big thing.
We want to know what happenedto those children and who did it
to them.
And so that's why we're notgoing to let it go.
It's, you know, people stillare there supporting Trump.
I mean, if you look at the, atwhat could have happened with
the Biden, with Biden winning,or Kamala Harris, I mean this
(10:00):
thing would have been buried sodeep we would have never saw it.
You know, now we saw this hope,and this is really what I want
to ask you about.
You know why do you think he'sdoing this, tom?
You know why do you all of asudden, boom, it's a turn, we're
going to push this out, we'regoing to move on to the next
thing.
And when he says we're the talkof the world and selfish people
are trying to hurt thismovement, and I don't really get
(10:24):
that.
I hope there's something deeperthat we're looking for here and
maybe I'm missing something.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Well, I'm going to detail that more in part two,
but I'll give you a preview ofbasically what I'm going to say.
I understand completely whythey're doing this.
They've just been so inept atit.
They're really one of thethings about talk about Trump
lying every day.
You know, he's really a verybad liar, which this is what,
which is what this pushback atthe cabinet meeting shows.
(10:53):
He's really transparent and hedoesn't want to lie the way he
is.
Dan Bongino and Kash Patel looklike they.
You know, they had a gun totheir heads when they were being
interviewed by Maria Bartiromoand they said you know, and
basically they focused on it andsays yeah, I read the file, he
committed suicide.
And Cash Patel says I've doneall these cases and I know a
(11:14):
suicide when I see it.
Well, that's beside the point,it doesn't mean anything.
What really is going on hereand this is the thing that I'm
concerned about is the deepcorruption in our government
that goes you know, anyorganization that can operate in
the shadows without anytransparency, without any light
(11:35):
being shown on it, is going tobecome corrupt.
And the CIA and theseintelligence agencies and also
the law enforcement agencieslike the FBI and the DEA.
They've all become corruptbecause they're operating in the
shadows with impunity andnobody's keeping an eye on them
the way they should be.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
To your point and in your article.
You can see how people start.
You know you start to lie right, you start these lies and you
start this process.
And you start, you start to lieright, you start these lies and
you start this process.
And you start one guy iscovering up for another guy.
The CIA was involved in some ofthis stuff.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
See, look, let me put it, having been in law
enforcement, let me explainreally simply.
When you try to get a criminalcase against somebody, generally
you'll go after the easiesttarget and then you get that
target, and then you twist themand you twist their arms, you
threaten them, you force them tocooperate with you so that they
(12:33):
become an informant, so thatthey actually begin working for
you, not just provideinformation, but begin working
for you.
So, basically, you have a gunto their head where you either
you're going to go to jail jailforever or you're going to help
us get the guys, that people isto do things that are really not
very moral, that aren't verynice, that aren't honorable, and
(13:09):
so like with, for example, inorder to get John Gotti, they
basically gave immunity to Sammythe Bull Gravano, who is his
number two.
Well, Sammy the Bull Gravanomurdered 19 people.
So you know, here you are.
You're basically getting in bedwith somebody who is a terrible
(13:32):
person in order to get somebodyelse who's a terrible person.
So where's the good in that?
And in doing so, you begin torealize, hey, it doesn't really
make any difference.
Some of them do.
Now, one of the things that Idid when I was with the state is
I tried to get information onpeople using informants who were
what I considered to be truebelievers, somebody that did it
(13:53):
for a cause, that they had areason to go after, somebody.
It wasn't something that Itried to corrupt them in some
way, that I tried to getsomething on them in order to
force them to do something.
I wanted them to do itwillingly, and I was very
successful at doing that.
Speaker 1 (14:08):
Do you think that they do this, tom, because they
don't want to take the time tolook into those people, or they
want to get the cases over with,or I look at.
I know that the the evil is outthere and there's just probably
so much on their plates.
Could they, could they, youknow, you know, in a timely
fashion.
Is that why they do this?
Because they think they got toget this thing?
Speaker 2 (14:29):
finished.
Here's what Epstein was doing.
He was in order to facilitatehis business operation.
He developed relationships withvery powerful people, with
people that were influential allover the world, in order to get
those people to do things thathe wanted.
He got them to do things likehave sex with kids and he filmed
(14:55):
them.
There were cameras in all ofhis properties, including in all
the bedrooms, so he would hookpeople up.
He would get something on them,and even get something on them
like have sex with an underagegirl, because you know, if you
have sex with an underage girlor underage boy, that's a lot of
leverage.
That gives you a lot ofleverage.
(15:16):
So let's say that the CIA andthe Mossad and all these other
intelligence agencies figuredout this is what he was doing
and he was breaking laws allover the world.
Okay, so now they say this issomebody we can use, because now
we got this on him.
So then they tell him he sayswe want to get something on you
know, bill Jones, or something,and so you invite him to your
(15:38):
place and and uh and compromisehim and then give us the
information.
This is how.
This is what they were doing.
They were, they were using himfor his contacts and for his
ability to corrupt people.
It wasn't like the, it wasn'tlike the CIA or the Mossad was
providing these girls, but theywere facilitating his whole
criminal operation that he wasinvolved in because it benefited
(16:00):
them.
So they're propping him up.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
They're protecting him in essence so that they can
get these other things done, andthen they build up this monster
.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
Right, well, let me get.
I don't know if Epstein hadanything to do with it, but this
is a similar kind of thing.
There was an engineer that hadaccess to the Iranian Iranian
nuclear development.
So he lived in Abu Dhabi withan Iranian wife, but he was used
(16:32):
and he had access to Natanz,which is one of the facilities
that they use to enrich uranium,and so he had access to these
things, of these things.
The Israelis and the Americanswanted to get the Stuxnet virus
into the system there in Natanzso they could destroy the
operation.
They could make destruction ofthe operation the.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
Israelis this is a computer virus that you're
talking about.
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Yeah, it was a computer virus that they put
into the network.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
With all the viruses going on, I just want to make
sure-.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
Yeah, that it was air gap.
They couldn't hack into itbecause it wasn't connected to
the outside world.
They need somebody to go inthere with a flash drive and
insert it into the system.
And so this engineer, the USand Israelis targeted him over a
period of a couple of years andthey wanted they didn't have
any way to contact this guy, orthey didn't have any reason to
(17:21):
contact this engineer, this guy,or they didn't have any reason
to contact this engineer.
So they went to the Dutchintelligence to get them to
compromise the guy.
Well, in some way theycompromised him and forced him
to work for them and that's howhe got the Stuxnet virus into
(17:42):
the Iranian system back, youknow, a number of years ago,
which really set back theirnuclear program many years.
It was a brilliant.
It was a brilliant operation.
But we still don't know exactlywhat they did to compromise that
engineer.
He didn't do it because he wasa true believer.
He did it because they hadsomething on him and that
something could have been thatthey compromised him with a girl
(18:03):
or with a young girl, withanything, but they forced him to
cooperate with them in some way.
And this is what intelligenceagencies do.
This is what law enforcementagencies do.
Somehow we've lost the abilityto regulate this immorality that
is part of our whole governmentsystem.
We need to do something torealign what we do.
(18:26):
The Epstein case shows anexample of how we facilitated in
a monumental way the abuse andthe exploitation of minors.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
And Tom.
It's amazing the network, howbig this gets.
I mean, he was involved inHarvard, you know, and you know
with this organization.
This PDF Program forEvolutionary Dynamics.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
Right.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
You know he gave money to Harvard.
He had an office at Harvard.
He had this.
This is how crazy this getswhen you start going down these
rabbit holes and you start tofollow them.
It was basically a eugenicsexperiment.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
Yes, he was doing eugenics experiments.
He wanted to do that out inZorro Ranch.
It was really an island of DrMoreau kind of imaginings that
he had.
He was not only an evil man, hewas crazy, and maybe the evil
drove him crazy, I don't know.
But the thing that made Epsteinso valuable to so many
(19:35):
organizations was that he was amaster of developing these
high-level, highly connectednetworks of people.
He could manipulate thesenetworks to his own financial
gain and he was reallyremarkably good at it.
Speaker 1 (19:51):
So when it comes down , tom, you know the use of
prostitutes against our ownpoliticians I mean this is well
known in the halls of Congress.
You know you get that power,money, lust, selfishness, I mean
it all gets into it.
And then all of a sudden theystart to vote and they change
and you realize somebody's gotsomething on them, on them right
(20:12):
With the girl, et cetera.
Now, when you're talking aboutminors, you're you're at another
level where it's not only candestroy your marriage and your
career, this will take you downand put you in prison for a long
time.
So you've really got somethingon people and those films.
This is the bottom line.
This is what we want exposed.
I mean, is there a chance thatsomebody actually has these
(20:39):
videos now of these people andthis list?
Because I just heard Dershowitzthe attorney.
He said that he's seen thislist and he's seen these names
on the list and there are otherpeople that did.
What's her first name,maxwell's first name?
Is it galene galene?
Speaker 2 (20:56):
galene maxwell.
That's, that's.
He's a.
She's a daughter of robertmaxwell yeah, so.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
So now look at how she got involved now.
Why is she stepping forward now?
Why?
Why do you think you knowwhat's behind her?
She's still in prison right now, right?
Speaker 2 (21:10):
She probably wants to get out.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
You think that's what it is.
Speaker 2 (21:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
Yeah, all right.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
So the thing look, based on what I've seen in all
the records, if somebodyactually was interested in
telling a story telling thewhole story about Epstein the
information is already availablewhen you say the information is
available?
Speaker 1 (21:32):
are you say the information is available?
Are you talking about peoplenow on?
And again, I think it's a if it, if it's already available,
where, where?
Speaker 2 (21:41):
well, there's still some million dollar question
where is it?
well, well, I'm writing some ofit okay all right, but uh, the
the real question is who in thegovernment is behind this
corruption?
Well, who in the governmentchose to overlook all these
things that Epstein had?
Like, if I had an informantwith my agency and somebody
(22:06):
looks in the file and sees thatthere was some information that
they needed and they want to topursue it a little bit more and
they needed that informant, theywould have to come to me and
then I would have to contact, Iwould have to get with my
informant to get thatinformation.
It's not like, oh, you got thisguy's name and anybody in the
CIA or the Mossad or somebodycan call him up.
(22:27):
No, there's a handler, there'ssomebody that operated Epstein,
and when that handler retired,he turned him over to somebody
else.
Who were those people and who?
And why aren't they being heldaccountable for the, for
overlooking all this, all thisdepravity that was going on?
It's not like this.
It's not like this you knowthis nameless government?
(22:50):
Oh, the government, the CIA,the Mossad or who you know, the
Saudi intelligence or whoeverwas.
No, there is a person who ishis handler and that handler had
a boss who knew about it, andthat boss knew about it too.
It was so such high levelintelligence that there would be
people all the way up the chainwho were, who are involved and
(23:11):
who knew exactly what was goingon.
And this is why it's not comingout, because you can't put this
in open court.
You just couldn't put this.
This is national security stuff.
This is like top secretinformation.
But I don't have confidence,the way they're handling this,
that these people that werewithin the government, that were
facilitating this kind ofoperation, are being put in
(23:35):
check now because they're comingout and saying, oh, it doesn't
exist, there's nothing to seehere.
If they came out and said, yeah, this is what was going on, we
can't tell you the details of itbecause it would jeopardize
national security, but we'regoing to put a stop to it right
now.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
So, tom, I just had brought up Maxwell and I suppose
she could expose a lot right,what's the danger to her if she
starts this thing?
I mean it could be crazy.
Speaker 2 (24:02):
You know, the thing is that she has some really
damaging information aboutpeople who are very rich.
They could try to go after her.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
You think I mean, look, we've done just about
everything else.
If Dan Bongino and Kash Pateland even Trump's trying to put
this down, pam Bondi, for somereason, if and I was I brought
up, telsey Gabbard was, you know.
She was just on turning pointand she said that I feel this
(24:32):
frustration too.
She goes to the audience.
I know you're frustrated thatwe're not moving fast enough.
She goes, I feel thatfrustration and she deliberately
called out the deep state thatwe're talking about here and the
corruption and the deep state,and so these people are battling
, but it seems like it's so deep, tom, so entrenched that you
know, just like you and I alwaystalk about the public school
(24:54):
system you almost have to throwthe whole thing out.
It's so deep and so entrenched.
It seems like our government isthe same.
You know you put good people inplace, but they can't do much.
It's really a mystery in manyways how deep this runs.
Nobody can really defineexactly what that deep state is.
It's just corruption at so manylevels, I believe.
Speaker 2 (25:16):
Well, I think there is a lot you can do about it,
and I've been in government so Iam fairly certain.
I've been in the Air Force soI've got experience with
national defense issues, andI've also been in the state, so
I'm familiar with how lawenforcement operates, how it
could operate.
The problem is too manyagencies want to do the
(25:37):
expedient thing, which isusually the wrong way to do it.
So the thing that bothers me isthat there's no assurance from
the way the Trump administrationis handling this.
There's no assurance thatpeople those handlers and the
people in that system are beingcontrolled to do the right thing
rather than to allow thefacilitation of this sexual
(25:58):
exploitation of children tocontinue.
It wasn't just.
Epstein isn't the only one.
Epstein was a part owner in amodeling agency modeling that
service, john Luke Brunel.
He had contacts all over theworld.
He supplied models to companies, to private parties, to public
(26:20):
parties.
He would supply models forpeople that would go to
conventions or something, andthey had booths, and so he'd
have models, the booths, themodels would go there to, you
know, to attract customers.
He did all that kind of stuffall over the world.
Okay, well, he wasn't the onlymodeling agency.
He's not the only modelingagency like that.
He's not the only modelingagency that's involved in
(26:43):
prostitution.
Who else are these guys usingin the intelligence services?
Using to compromise people?
One of the easiest ways tocompromise some guy out on a
business trip is to supply himwith a girl.
It's an easy thing to do.
Speaker 1 (26:58):
Yeah, and people fall for that all the time, right,
all the time.
You have a few cocktails, youhave a few drinks.
It's not just criminals that doit.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Our own government is doing it.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
You know, this kind of stuff should stop.
Speaker 1 (27:11):
But you know, when you get nefarious to the point
where you're not only sendingmodels, tom, we're sending
underage models, right, and thisis where Epstein I'm sure
Epstein got into this role andthen he gets the connections
right, he meets these models andthen away you go, you know go.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
You know.
At this point, though, this iswhat I see.
It creates an environment wherewe're looking at children as
being fair game.
In Illinois, the age of consentis 17, which means that if
you're underage, only if you're16 or below.
Well, that's ridiculous.
There's a movement to try tolower the age of consent even
lower.
In most places in Europe it's16, the age of consent.
(27:58):
And they want to eliminate theage of consent.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Isn't Illinois?
You don't even need theparental right for an abortion
now for a young girl, isn't it13 years old?
Speaker 2 (28:10):
They only have to notify them even.
Speaker 1 (28:12):
It's unbelievable right, and so usually not always
, of course, but usually, youknow this girl is in that place
at 13, 14 years old, becauseshe's a victim of somebody, and
so we're covering up this evenin our own beautiful state of
Illinois here, aren't we?
(28:32):
You?
Know by allowing them to abortchildren from children and just
wipe it under the rug.
You know.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
Right, they're not Now even 13 years old.
It's illegal for them to havesex with anybody, so but they're
not even investigating it tofind out who exploited them.
Yeah, yeah, this guy.
There's a Brian Crowder.
He's on trial.
I don't know what happened tothe trial, but he was accused of
getting a girl pregnant twiceand having her when she was
(29:00):
underage and she was a studentand taking her in for an
abortion, claiming that he washer father.
He was the only one toimpregnate her.
Speaker 1 (29:08):
You know, I remember in high school you know as I
look back now there were acouple of teachers in high
school and they used to beflirting good-looking young
teachers flirting with thesegirls in our school and then we
found out later on they werehaving affairs and stuff, and so
this goes back many, many years.
(29:29):
So at the end of the day,something like you know,
something like Cash Patel, danBongino, I had this feeling and
I still had this feeling thatthese guys would like to do the
right thing.
You know, telsey Gabbard'sfrustrated Pam Bondi seems like
someone that would want to dothe right thing, but it seemed
like they all pivoted here.
Is there something underneaththat happened that?
Speaker 2 (29:52):
just stopped this process, of course, because it's
still being used.
That's why and what they'reafraid, if they come out with it
, that there'll be a demand thatthere be prosecutions and they
can't prosecute because it'snational defense information.
Or somebody will come out andsay well, you, if you try to
(30:14):
blow the whistle on me, I'mgoing to tell all about what,
what we're up to, I'm going torelease all this information, so
they're in a position wherethey can't, they can't, they
can't say anything because wehave a corrupt national defense
system.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
So, in other words, is it they're just, hands are
tied, they just see that, wow,this is just too big.
It's just still there's somemissing part here, that I it
doesn't?
Speaker 2 (30:40):
it's?
Barry seals was, uh, wasrunning drugs for the dea, you
know, as part of some deaoperation.
But do you think the cia hasbrought in?
Brought in heroin from thegolden triangle?
Speaker 1 (30:56):
so like cash patel again, dan bongino, bonnie, but
they must know this ahead oftime, because they were all
talking about exposing this.
They they must have had some.
They're not.
They're intelligent people thathave some decent backgrounds,
do you think?
Think, though, tom, when theyfinally just come right up to
the point where they really feelthat they need to do something,
(31:17):
and then come across whatyou're saying right now and just
go, guys, we're not going to beable to do anything.
It's just too much.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
I don't think, you know, I don't know.
Pam Bondi wouldn't knowanything about it.
She was an attorney general inFlorida.
I don't think she ever workedfor the government other than
you know and she might've knownsomething about law enforcement
activities, but she wouldn'tknow anything about these
nefarious national defenseoperations unless she did a lot
of reading.
I've been, you know, since I'vebeen in the field, I read about
(31:46):
these things all the time.
I keep up on it, but mostpeople they could care less.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
So that's my question Do you think that they, just
when they see the stark realityon how big and evil this is,
that they just see?
This is what I'm questioning.
It's like you come up andthey're just hitting a wall and
saying we're going to have toback off of this.
Right now, we're not going touse the time and the energy this
(32:12):
would take our whole governmentto investigate and, who knows,
with the deep state, it couldtake us all down, or you know?
I mean, is this a reality thatwe're facing now, with such a
big evil that we just back off.
Is this what Trump is seeingright now?
Speaker 2 (32:25):
I think Trump is looking at it from the
standpoint of we have moreimportant things to do, because
really the United States is.
When he came in it was inpretty sad shape, so
economically, militarily, from anational defense standpoint,
he's doing just remarkablethings to reestablish the United
(32:46):
States.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
So that's my question then Do you think it just says,
hey, we can't deal witheverything, we're going to deal
with just this.
But I would think as agovernment, as the president, I
just says, hey, we can't dealwith everything, we're going to
deal with just this.
But I would think as agovernment, as the president,
I'd say, hey look, I'm not goingto deal with this anymore, I
can't take this, but I'm goingto put somebody on it, a special
prosecutor.
It would have sounded a lotbetter at the cabinet meeting.
I'm going to put this team onit and they're going to continue
(33:09):
to grind away at this thing.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
I mean, at least from a PR standpoint.
Don't you think, if you werethe president, that, instead of
pushing it under the rug andsaying there's nothing here
anymore?
Well, I know that at least twointelligence agencies were
involved with Epstein theIsraelis and the US the CIA we
may be able to control the US,we can't do anything about the
Israelis.
And the US, the CIA we may beable to control the US, we can't
do anything about the Israelis.
And who knows what otherintelligence agencies were
involved in this.
Remember, epstein wascompromising people all over the
(33:43):
world, and so he was apotential asset for every
intelligence agency in the world, not just ours.
And Epstein had no moralcompass, so there was no reason
for him to say well, I'm notgoing to cooperate with you
because I'm an American.
Now you give me the money.
Depending on what you can giveto me, I'll help you out.
(34:06):
So who knows what threats havebeen issued against the United
States by other intelligenceagencies?
Speaker 1 (34:13):
We don't have a lot of time, but I would like to at
least touch on because I thinkthey're related.
You wrote an article rightbefore this, one called
Reaffirming Parental Rights, andthe reason I bring it up with
only a little time left isbecause people that are
listening to this show arefrustrated about things.
They can't do things.
People that are listening tothis show or frustrated about
(34:35):
things, they can do things.
And I think, no matter whathappens here, you know, as we
see this play out you and I workon Stolen Innocence, so we work
for kids that it's going totake millions of people that are
going to at least step forwardand try to do something and you
can at the local level, andwe're seeing parents all over
the United States standing up,but it's still the minority.
Most people still don't standup and do anything, but we are
(34:57):
changing the people that dostand up.
You know there's somethingabout truth and goodness, the
beauty of love, and beingconcerned about all of these
victims.
Well, these victims arehappening into our schools all
over our country, in myneighborhood, in your
neighborhood, in everybody'sneighborhood, and we have to be
(35:17):
cognizant of this.
That's why I think thisreaffirming parental rights that
you wrote about, and again,I'll link this letter.
I think it's very, veryimportant.
I just sent it out on mySubstack, tom, to push it out to
our audience here to make surethat they didn't miss this
letter that you wrote onSubstack, and so let's just go
over it just briefly and we'lltouch on it again.
(35:39):
Is it Mahmoud versus Taylor,and you say in your article?
It has broader implicationsthan you might think.
On the surface, it may seem toapply only to the assignment of
reading materials in theclassroom, but it's way more
than that.
You and I are very familiarwith this.
Our audience that's beenlistening to us for a while is
familiar with this pushing theLGBTQ plus stories and books,
(36:01):
which is really pornography.
Again, I'm getting back to thechild pornography.
Whatever happens in this Epsteincase, we still, as just people
that are concerned about kids,need to start to stand up and at
least go to these school boardmeetings, run for election, get
these books and this groomingout of the schools.
(36:23):
But anyways, at least we hadsome positive and this is
probably what we should focus on.
Something positive came out ofthe Supreme Court.
Maybe you can outline somethingRight.
Speaker 2 (36:32):
Well it gives.
It really reestablishes parentsas having control over what
their kids are exposed to inschool, that they can opt their
kids out of things that arecontrary to what their religious
beliefs are.
But it's also important forparents to stand up and assert
those rights and to do the rightthing, not only only for
themselves but for theirchildren and for their family.
(36:54):
And this is the thing thatevery person can do.
If they have a, whateveropportunity appears to them,
whatever opportunity God givesto them, they can choose to do
the right thing or the wrongthing.
They have that choicethroughout every day.
And here's the take it a littlebit back to, you know, to the
(37:16):
Epstein case.
I had a case when I was withthe state where I went out and
developed an informant becauseeverybody said, oh, you can't
develop true believer informants, they're not reliable, you
can't do anything with them, andso you got to get by and bust,
get them.
You know, you got to getleverage on them, you got to be
able to do this.
I went out and developed aninformant for the gang's
(37:36):
investigation, kenny Morrow.
He had formerly been a memberof the Alrucan Street Gang and
he drifted away from them,started trying to live a
honorable life.
I approached him and gave himan opportunity to redeem himself
and also to get revenge for hisbrother's death.
At the same time, I convincedhim to work for me.
(37:59):
I didn't have anything on him,I convinced him to work for me.
He went back in, reacquaintedhimself with the Elrukans, got
involved in that organizationand destroyed the organization.
His information took down thatorganization the entire one of
the biggest street gangs ever inChicago, the most, one of the
(38:21):
most dangerous street gangs everin Chicago.
And so you don't have to, youdon't have to use these evil
methods to to attack evil.
You can.
You can do it the right way andunfortunately that model has
not been picked up by otherpeople.
Speaker 1 (38:40):
Yeah, yeah, whatever you know, whatever happened to
him, Kenny Moore.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
He died, he was he actually.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Was he killed?
Speaker 2 (38:52):
No, he was put in witness protection program and
he was relocated to Arizona.
He went out and got drunk onenight and he crawled into a.
He had an argument with hisgirlfriend.
He crawled into a metal quonsethut and went to sleep on a
Friday night, early Saturdaymorning and of course in Arizona
it's a lot hotter than it is uphere early Saturday morning and
(39:13):
of course in Arizona it's a lothotter than it is up here and
the sun came up, got about 120to 150 degrees inside the
Quonset hut and he died ofexposure.
They found him dead on Mondaymorning.
Speaker 1 (39:23):
Unbelievable, so when at least the Supreme Court is
backing us up.
What we're going to find,though and again I think that
your article is really goodbecause it's a comprehensive
article kind of takes us throughsome of the things that you and
I talk about all the time,because what we find is, with
the education system, now theLBGTQ again.
Think about it.
(39:44):
I think of it as porn, really.
You know, grooming and pornthat's, you know, going to take
these young kids again.
It really steals theirinnocence and and, and it
obliterates their moralimaginations, they start to look
at each other.
And so so what we're doing iswe're bringing up all of these
kids that have no moral basis,no moral foundation, tom, and
(40:08):
here's the concern, right.
So we have these, this deepstate that's corrupt, and now we
are corrupted, the schools andthe kids beneath, unless parents
stand up and protect their kidsof nothing else and don't fall
for this book banning bullshityou know, because, at the end of
the day, parents have the rightto say I'm not trying to ban a
(40:29):
book, I'm trying to use mycommon sense, moral decency, to
say nobody has the right tosexualize our kids.
And that's what we've beentalking about here with the
Epstein.
You cannot just sexualizechildren.
They're sexualizing our ownchildren and our own
grandchildren, right beneath ournoses, tom, and this is
something we can do somethingabout and we need to do
(40:50):
something about To your pointand this will be my last thing
I'll throw back to you is thattruth and goodness, when you
walk into that arena this is thepoint you just made there's a
power to that.
There's a power to truth.
When you speak the truth.
There's a power there becauseyou're not alone anymore.
You walk with God when you dothat and to do the right thing.
(41:11):
Look, we're all getting older,we're all going to die.
Tom, let's do something goodwith our lives before we're out
of here.
And we got to get out of thisselfish mentality that just says
hey, the government, they're socorrupt, forget about it,
because they're raising ourtaxes.
These poor young people can'tafford homes anymore.
We're corrupting everything andnobody seems to care, except
(41:34):
for a handful of people that youand I are working with.
You've got some wonderfulpeople exposing this on the
Internet and stuff and you knowthey are rising up.
They are rising up but we needmore people.
Speaker 2 (41:47):
You know, most people mistake pornography as being
something that's just visual,that it's a picture or a video
or something.
Pornography is written too.
There's written material thatdescribes things that is even
more pornographic than pictures.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
Yeah, it is.
Speaker 2 (42:02):
And they actually have these kinds of books that
they're giving to children whoare very young, and it sets
their mind in a direction of theworld rather than a direction
that God wants them to go in.
And so you can't.
It's like I said, this one girlthat was working for Epstein.
She was trafficked to theUnited States, to Epstein from
Yugoslavia where she had sexualrelationships with Epstein and
(42:25):
then she continued in hisemployee and now she's an adult
and was still working for him.
This became the norm for her.
How many times?
I mean there's been many caseswhen I've interviewed kids who
have been sexually abused, wherethey don't see it as abuse,
they see it as the norm.
It's not an abuse, this is justthe way things are.
(42:46):
So their whole outlook oneverything gets twisted.
And that's what we're doing toour children.
We're we're we're steeping themin this immoral atmosphere, not
just sexual, but but in eventhings like well, it's okay to
use somebody for your ownpurposes, it's okay to get
leverage on them, it's okay towe start to look at people
(43:09):
exactly like Epstein and thesepeople we're talking about,
including the rich, the elitethat use these kids for sex we
start to see them as objects.
Speaker 1 (43:19):
We no longer see them as persons.
When we do that, we're in badshape just from a moral
standpoint.
Our civilization will declinejust because of this.
I mean.
Bishop Sheen wrote this backwhen I was in high school.
He said of the 22 majorcivilizations all through
history, 19 of them came downand were destroyed not by an
(43:42):
outside force, but from moralcorruption from the inside.
And that's what we're seeinghere.
Nobody could take the UnitedStates down from an exterior
force, but we are rotting fromthe inside, and so this is
really the danger that's outthere today, and we have a
responsibility.
Look, we can't change the wholeworld, we know that but we can
(44:05):
change what's right around us,and it starts with our own heart
.
We got to start walking intothe truth and certainly protect
the kids and the people rightaround us, and it starts with
our own heart.
We got to start walking intothe truth and certainly protect
the kids and the people rightaround us.
Speaker 2 (44:14):
Well, that's what I ended the article on Epstein
with not to act is to act, notto speak is to speak, attributed
to Dietrich Bonhoeffer.
And that's exactly what theproblem is we're not acting,
we're not speaking, which speaksvolumes.
Speaker 1 (44:32):
Because here's what the court said and this is in
your article.
The Supreme Court now rejectedthe notion that the book simply
exposed students to differingideas, because this is the story
, right?
We always hear Tom when we'reat school board meetings.
no, we're just exposing them.
Everybody has a right to beexposed to this, and the court
said this.
No, that's not what you'redoing.
(44:54):
The majority determined, six tothree here that the storybooks
that we're talking about hereclearly advanced specific
viewpoint, and kids werepunished in all different ways,
ostracized in a lot of times, ifthey didn't go along with this,
and so the pressure on theseyoung people to go along with
these ideologies is tough.
Speaker 2 (45:15):
you know when you're a young child.
If it's okay to use peoplesexually for your own purposes,
then it's okay to use people inany other way for your own
purposes as well, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (45:26):
Isn't that what?
Speaker 2 (45:26):
they're being taught.
Speaker 1 (45:28):
You know that last part that you said you closed
the article with.
Can you state that again,because it reminds me?
Speaker 2 (45:34):
of something.
Yeah, that was in the Epsteinarticle.
It says not to act is to act,not to speak is to speak.
Speaker 1 (45:40):
So here?
This reminded me when I readthat.
So yesterday, as we'rerecording this it won't go out
until later on in the week, butwe're recording this on a Monday
Yesterday, sunday, I was atMass and the readings were
really interesting.
You know the first reading fromMoses and it says this it's
(46:01):
talking about these things andit said if you would only heed
the voice of the Lord this isfrom Deuteronomy, chapter 30,
keep his commandments andstatutes that are written in
this book of the law when youreturn to the Lord with all your
heart and with all your soul.
He says, for this is thecommand.
He said.
This is very interesting, forthis command, which I enjoy on
(46:22):
you today, is not too mysteriousand remote for you.
It's not up in the sky.
This is Moses speaking that youshould say I have to go up in
the sky and get it so I can tellyou what it is.
Nor is it across the sea.
Who will cross the sea and getit for us and tell us of it that
we may carry it out?
No, moses said it's somethingvery near to you, ready in your
(46:45):
mouths and in your hearts, toyour point, tom.
He ends you have to go out andcarry it out.
You have to carry it out.
And so Moses said we alreadyknow this, we know what to do.
Now you have to go and carry itout.
So this is not pie in the sky.
This is his point the gospelreading was from and it would be
(47:06):
the same kind of thing.
The gospel was from Luke and itwas.
This lawyer goes up to Jesus andsays teacher, what must I do to
inherit eternal life?
And he says well, what'swritten in the law?
And he goes it's all thecommandments and all this stuff.
And he says well, how do youinterpret that?
How do you read it?
And then this lawyer replies toJesus you shall love your Lord,
(47:30):
your God, with all your heart,with all your God, with all your
heart, with all your soul, withall your strength, with all
your mind and your neighbor asyourself.
And then he takes them into theGood Samaritan right.
He says you know, this guy wasbeaten by these robbers.
He's laying on the side of theroad dying.
The priest walks to the otherside, doesn't want anything to
do with it.
The Levite walks to the otherside and it's the Samaritan, the
(47:54):
good Samaritan, who.
The Samaritans were enemies ofIsrael.
And Jesus says he's the oneright that stopped by, picked
him up, brought him to the innand took care of him.
And he said this is yourneighbor.
He says which one is yourneighbor.
He says which one is yourneighbor, this is your neighbor.
That we have to watch out forone another, regardless of of uh
(48:16):
, of who they are.
These are people and we have tohelp pick them up.
And this is what you know.
This is the essence of what itcomes down to.
We could all do it in our ownlittle ways, can't we?
Speaker 2 (48:26):
yeah, that's, and we're not doing it no no, and
we're not doing it.
No, no, and we're going to paythe price, Thomas Tick-tock, you
know they have all this stuff.
You know, you go on thesemission trips and all this kind
of stuff.
They're just nothing butglorified vacations and yet we
just turn a blind eye to thethings that our government is
doing that are clearly wrong.
(48:48):
And a lot of these people workin government and they're
turning a blind eye to it.
They're not doing anythingabout it.
You know, if I had been in thegovernment and saw how they were
complicit in the sexualexploitation of children, I
would have said something.
Where are the people sayingsomething?
Speaker 1 (49:05):
You think they have to be there.
Speaker 2 (49:07):
That's why.
Speaker 1 (49:10):
I was so excited about, again about these people
that I mentioned over and overagain Kash Patel, dan Bongino,
et cetera because I thought thatthat would rally the troops,
that these good people wouldstart to surface and expose this
.
Sometimes they're just waitingfor a good shepherd, a good
leader, to come so they canstart, because they don't want
(49:32):
to get fired.
They got their money, they gottheir family, they got in and
I'm sure people have been firedover this.
Speaker 2 (49:40):
Just look at Cash Patel and Dan Bongino.
Look at their body language andthey are being interviewed by
Maria Bartiromo on May 10th.
They literally look likesomebody was in the on the wings
pointing a gun at them.
Okay, it was so stiff, it wasunbelievable.
Speaker 1 (49:56):
These are not cowards .
That's why there's a link therethat they're coming up against
some kind of wall that they'resensing.
I hope they have anotherstrategy.
Tom Trump too.
Speaker 2 (50:09):
I mean, he's talking about being open and transparent
.
And then all of a sudden atthat cabinet meeting it was like
holy smokes.
The guy asked a question andit's like, hey, he might as well
have told the Secret Service toshoot this guy.
Speaker 1 (50:22):
Unbelievable.
Well, you know, speaking ofthat, we start to talk about how
you can go down these rabbit,these rabbit holes, you know,
and when you start to do smallthings wrong and it gets bigger
and bigger and bigger.
So here's the, here's this guy,donald trump.
When, when donald trump sosunday marked the first
anniversary of the shootingright of donald trump, right.
(50:43):
So you know, everybodyremembers, you know where we
were when it happened.
The president is fortunate thatthe 2024 second, unless Hero
attempted on his life, remember,they saw this guy.
I think he was on a golf rangeor something, getting ready to
shoot right.
And so listen to this.
So he's in prison now.
(51:04):
And so, had it not been for theeye of a few keen eye of a few
secret service agents, suspectedwannabe assassinated Ryan Ruth
could have abruptly endedTrump's life less than two
months before Election Day.
Can you imagine how the countrywould have reacted?
Now that he's locked up, ruth isless than thrilled by the
prospect of remaining in a cellfor decades, until his
(51:28):
unceremonious death.
Cell for decades until hisunceremonious death.
Based on a bizarre letter hepenned in June, he said he'd
likely prefer a quick execution.
I'd rather be dead, he said.
Why is the death penalty notallowed?
He wrote.
Now here's the point At nearly60, he says a life of
(51:53):
nothingness without love.
What's the point?
Can you imagine?
This is what he writes now.
He was there getting ready toassassinate donald trump, and
then he's sitting in jail, goingyou might as well kill me
because at 60, a life ofnothingness without love.
What's the point?
And so he gets the point.
He just doesn't make aconnection, tom, that we are
people of love.
(52:13):
That's what we're called out todo, even love your enemies,
right.
Which is?
That doesn't mean I got to likethem.
That doesn't mean I don't doanything against them.
That doesn't mean I don't standup at school board meetings,
but hatred has got to stop, youknow, and this is what Jesus
said all the time.
And here's a guy saying a lifeof nothingness without love.
(52:34):
And yet he was living this out.
See, this is that disconnection, tom.
We just don't make thatconnection that we are these
people of love.
You can't go shooting people.
You can't be sexualizing youngpeople in school systems, you
can't be exploiting young girlsand trying to have sex with them
and becoming people of love.
You sit in prison, you go, youmight as well.
kill me now, because my life isnothingness.
(52:56):
What was it before, dude, whenyou didn't do anything?
You know craziness, man, youcan't make this stuff up right.
And one more point here thatIsraeli settlers beat American
citizen to death.
They thought he was, I guess,hamas or something.
He was visiting Israel on theWest Bank and a mob of settlers
(53:18):
Israeli settlers beat the20-year-old American to death on
Friday, brutally killing theFlorida man Mousselet and
23-year-old Mohammed Shabibi,before reportedly blocking an
ambulance from helping thesuffering victims for three
hours, and then he died.
And so here again, you knowyou're going to kill an innocent
(53:39):
man walking down the streetbecause of your hatred.
And you know this hatred, tom,will go on and on and on.
These wars will not stop unlessthe human hearts get turned,
and this is a battle of thehuman heart, my friend John Paul
.
II would say it always starts onthe battlefield of the
individual heart between goodand evil, between love and
(54:01):
lusting and taking right.
And unless we're all willing tofight that battle and then
stand up, like Moses said, andgo out and act, there's not much
hope.
But the good news is, tom, eachone of us can do this.
Each one of us can do this.
We fight that battlefield, onthe battlefield of the heart,
and we become persons that careabout other people, love God, be
(54:23):
filled with divine life andlove and then go out and love
your neighbor.
It's simple.
It's not easy.
Look at it.
You have to remember to loveyour wife and your kids and the
people right around you.
But that's where it starts.
That's where it starts, lastwords.
Speaker 2 (54:37):
Yeah, no, I have too many.
Speaker 1 (54:40):
All right, well, let's end it there.
Speaker 2 (54:42):
All right.
Speaker 1 (54:42):
We look forward to part two.
When's it going to come out?
Speaker 2 (54:46):
I'm hoping I'll have it out next week.
It's a lot more complicatedthan part one, because I've got
to explain why all this, whythey're acting like they've got
guns to their head.
Speaker 1 (54:57):
I can't believe that you're taking out an article
like that.
That's got to be just sotime-consuming that doesn't just
roll off the list.
Speaker 2 (55:03):
Does it no?
It doesn't no, no, hey, Godbless you.
Speaker 1 (55:07):
Thanks, tom, thanks for joining us.
Thanks everybody, thanks forjoining us today.
Talk to you again soon.
Bye-bye.
Speaker 2 (55:20):
Bye.
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