November 22, 2024 • 39 mins
Dr. Ralph Ford, chancellor of Penn State Behrend, talks with Vincent Intrieri, founder and CEO of VDA Capital Management and an Alumni Fellow, about the Intrieri Family Student-Managed Fund. Originally recorded on November 7, 2024.
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Ralph Ford (00:00):
I am Dr Ralph Ford, chancellor of Penn State Behrend
, and you are listening toBehrend Talks.
My guest today is a veryspecial friend, mr Vincent
Intrieri, the founder and CEO ofVDA Capital Management, and he
and his wife Joanne are thecreators of something very
important here at Penn StateBehrend, known as the.
Intrieri Student Managed Fundand we're going to talk a whole
(00:21):
lot about that.
He's also a graduate, 1984graduate of Penn State, Behrend
in accounting.
Welcome to the show, Vince.
Vincent Intrieri (00:28):
Thanks, Ralph.
I appreciate being here andhopefully we can have a great
discussion.
Ralph Ford (00:33):
We're going to have a great conversation.
I love to run through people'sbios.
You've really accomplished,you've done so much.
So, if you don't mind, I'mgoing to take a few moments to
run through your bio andhopefully it embarrasses you a
little bit i.
Your fund was created in 2012.
It's managed by students in ourBlack School of Business and,
importantly, they invest realdollars.
(00:54):
It's not mock, it's not funnymoney which raises the stakes.
The fund started with a$100,000 gift, again from you
and your wife, Joanne.
It's currently valued at thisis amazing 1.4 million dollars.
You founded VDA CapitalManagement, a private investment
firm, in 2017, but before then,you worked for many years with
(01:14):
Carl Icahn the infamous CarlIcahn legendary investor, known
for his work with TWA, marshallFields, time Warner and I know
you still work with him as wespeak and he also was an
investor in Donald Trump'scasinos in New Jersey as well.
Yes, we were distressedDistressed.
You're an expert in distressedassets.
Vincent Intrieri (01:34):
Yes, that's kind of what my original forte
into the investment world wasdistressed debt.
Ralph Ford (01:42):
Well, you serve on the boards of a number of
companies as well TransoceanHertz, global Holdings and
Navistar, to name a few and youalso still serve on our board
here for the Black School ofBusiness, and you're a very
active member of that board, forwhich we greatly appreciate.
And today is November 7th 2024,just to mark the date, let's
(02:02):
start with your trip here toBehrend.
And how did you end up at PennState Behrend?
You were a returning adultstudent, I believe.
Vincent Intrieri (02:09):
Yes, yes, interesting little journey.
And in addition to the boardsI'm on, ralph I just was named
chairman of the board ofSandridge Energy, probably about
three, four weeks ago.
Congratulations, yeah thanks.
Ralph Ford (02:26):
What do they do in the energy space?
Vincent Intrieri (02:28):
Drill in Oklahoma, the headquarter in
Oklahoma.
They have properties inOklahoma and Texas and hopefully
under the new administrationwith less controls and other
things, they'll do very well,I'm sure.
Ralph Ford (02:42):
expanding is the US is people don't know we're an
energy exporter now and we havebeen for quite some time,
actually like a decade.
Vincent Intrieri (02:50):
So the interesting story, and I'm going
to talk about this a littletonight.
For some of the students thatwe're going to talk to tonight,
I was always the smartest kid inschool, in the class, but I
don't know what it was.
I must have gotten boredbecause class was slow or what
(03:13):
have you.
And so I was very much of anunderachiever in my younger days
of academia and high school.
And you know, I went to aCatholic school for a while.
You know the nuns would alwaysbe slapping me with a you know a
ruler saying you know, come on,vince, you're the smartest kid
(03:34):
in the class, you got thehighest IQ, but you can't
perform.
And so after high school I kindof took a hiatus, was not sure
what I wanted to do, and Istarted working at General
Electric Company here in Erie inthe factory.
I was a machinist.
I went to school to learnmachining.
(03:55):
I did that for a little while.
I drove a Jitney in the stockroom.
I did that for a while.
And I remember the one thing Ialways try to impress upon
people is having a mentor inyour life and in your business,
career, et cetera, is soimportant and I've been so lucky
(04:31):
my entire life to have goodmentors all along the road, even
at GE, in you know a factorythat I was working.
You know my foreman guy namedLee Couch who, god rest his soul
is no longer with us.
You know we went out for a beerone night and and he's telling
me, you know, vince, you'resmart, you're a leader, you get
stuff done, you're hardworking,yada, yada, yada.
(04:52):
And at that point I kind of hekind of said to me, what are you
doing in a factory?
And I went home that night andthought about it.
I said to myself, what the hellam I doing in a factory?
And that led to the road.
So they said, hey, I'm going togo into school, go to pet state
(05:14):
baron.
So you know, I looked at gannon, I looked at baron and I, you
know, I like baron.
And so I came up.
Plus, it was a lot cheaper thangannon at the time.
I don't know what, what it isnow, but it was still lot
cheaper than Gannon at the time.
Ralph Ford (05:26):
I don't know what it is now, but it was Still.
Yeah, there's a difference.
Vincent Intrieri (05:28):
Privates are generally quite a bit higher,
and that started my road to theaccounting field at Behrend.
Ralph Ford (05:35):
So that's how it started and I mean so.
Our listeners know you and Ihave known each other for
probably 15 years.
We had a nice dinner last night, actually, you told us the
story.
So you're this returning adultstudent and I think you're
working at the same time whileyou're going to school.
Yes, you were working and youfound sometimes the other
students were messing around inclass.
Vincent Intrieri (05:56):
Yeah, I was telling you last night that when
I went back to school as moreof an adult student I think I
was probably 22, 23 years old Istarted in, I think, 1979, and I
graduated as a part-timestudent at night after work, and
then I matriculated tofull-time student and I think in
(06:20):
my last two or three semestersI must have took 20.
And I think in my last two orthree semesters I must have took
20.
I had to get special approvalfrom whoever the dean was at the
time Lilly, I think.
Yeah, it would have been JohnLilley.
Early on I had to get specialapproval to take 25 or more
credits because I was, you know,I wanted to finish as quickly
as possible.
I wouldn't let you do that now.
Ralph Ford (06:41):
You wouldn't Maybe if you were exceptional.
Vincent Intrieri (06:45):
I was exceptional, you were
exceptional.
But last two semesters werepretty tough and you know I was
taking a lot of credits so thatI could get done and ultimately
graduated in 84.
So even though I was goingpart-time for probably the first
two years, I finished almost ontime, starting in 79.
(07:06):
I think maybe a half a yearlate or something.
Ralph Ford (07:09):
Why accounting?
Why did you pick accounting?
Vincent Intrieri (07:13):
It's a good question.
I saw that question and Ithought about it.
Listen, I was always good inmath, and math has little did I
know at the time.
Math has nothing to do withaccounting, but it doesn't hurt
to be smart in math and be inaccounting.
I thought it was a practicalkind of major that I'd be able
(07:35):
to make money in, and so that'swhy I chose accounting.
Ralph Ford (07:39):
It's one of those things where it's always in
demand.
Vincent Intrieri (07:42):
I always figured it would be in demand.
You had a variety of kind ofvenues you could go to, tax
audit consulting, and so youknow it was.
I thought it was a good majorto take and I still believe, for
a variety of reasons, thataccounting is a absolutely great
(08:02):
major for kids because there'sso many jumping off points that
you can go to after you get yourdegree in accounting.
Ralph Ford (08:12):
Yeah, so many become CFOs and we'll talk about your
path and capital management, butyou don't see it being
overtaken by AI or anything likethis, where AI can do basic
accounting.
Vincent Intrieri (08:22):
I mean, yeah, ai might be able to do some
basic accounting.
I don't think it's going toovertake the accounting industry
.
There are so many things thathave to be, judgments that have
to be made, that personally Iwouldn't rely on a machine that
is maybe biased or not as towhat resolution should be.
Ralph Ford (08:46):
I think it can only be used as a tool, probably for
them to use.
Yes, no question about it.
So let's talk about the earlypart of your career.
You worked at Price Waterhouseand Arthur Anderson.
Vincent Intrieri (08:55):
Yeah, I actually started in Erie at a
place called Root, spitz, s,smiley, I think it's an
accounting firm that's stillhere.
I was down at 10th and StateStreet somewhere around that
area From Root spitz.
I was there actually working atRootspitznos in my junior and
(09:18):
senior year as a part-timer, sothat was my kind of internship.
And then I got hired full timeand I wanted to continue to grow
and I went to.
After maybe about a year, yearand a half in Erie, I got a
position at Cooper's and Lbrandin Pittsburgh.
(09:38):
So I went there.
I was in the audit departmentAgain.
I was an older staff accountantat Cooper's Kids, coming out of
school at 22, I was 26 orwhatever I was at the time.
I took things a little moreseriously.
I had grown up, so to speak.
(10:00):
So I went to Cooper's Aibrand.
I transferred with Cooper's outto Phoenix, arizona.
My brother Gene, talked me intomoving out there.
He said oh, it's so nice outhere, it's just dry heat.
Little did I know when I wentout there.
I said, gene, after I'd beenthere a little while I said you
(10:22):
know, when you go into a sauna,I think the sauna is about 110
degrees, and that's supposedly adry heat too.
But that's you know.
In Phoenix you get up to 117.
Ralph Ford (10:34):
I lived in Arizona for five years.
I told people that dry heatstuff only works to maybe 105.
Yeah right.
Vincent Intrieri (10:39):
Exactly so.
Then again I developed greatmentors at Coopers and Libran, a
guy named Dave Williams, KatieRoll.
They were instrumental inhelping me grow there.
Then Dave Williams left Coopersand went to a firm in Dallas,
(10:59):
texas Pricewaterhouse on theconsulting side.
So at this time I was still onthe audit side and Dave called
me, you know, six months later,after he had left.
He said Vince, what are youdoing?
So what do you?
What do you think I'm doing?
I'm working.
He said, you know, I got apossibility of a position here
(11:20):
in Dallas.
Would you be interested?
I said, dave, I don't know ifI'd be interested or not, but I
certainly won't say no right offthe cuff, let's explore it.
So we explored it and shortlythereafter I moved to Dallas,
texas, in what they called thebankruptcy and reorganization
group, and so that was kind ofthe start of my consulting side.
(11:46):
So I was with Pricewaterhousein Dallas.
They moved me to, you know, andI continued to move up in the
organization.
It's funny about theseorganizations that we'll talk
about a little later, about howthey don't recognize talent and
how they a lot of these firmshave a time and distance kind of
(12:09):
requirement You've got to bethere so many years to get to
this level, so many years and Iwas not as patient as they
wanted me to be and so I went upto Chicago.
I was kind of a senior leaderin the Chicago PW group and in
Dallas at PW I met a fellownamed Don Thomas who was a
(12:33):
senior partner atPricewaterhouse in the
bankruptcy and reorganizationgroup and he and I developed a
very good rapport and he wentover to Arthur Anderson and
several years later recruited meto Arthur Anderson as a partner
.
So I joined Arthur Anderson asa partner.
I was with them in Chicago,which is their headquarters,
(12:56):
arthur Anderson, probably aboutthree years and being in one of
these big firms, it just got tobe that I didn't want the
administrative headache.
I'm a doer.
A lot of these firms, as youmove up in the organization gets
to be 70% of your time is spentdealing with the bureaucracy
(13:22):
rather than doing what you kindof like.
And at that point I was workingfor great clients in the
bankruptcy field and developed avery good relationship with
some guys from an outfit calledElliott Associates, which is a
very big hedge fund out of NewYork I think they're probably up
(13:46):
over $25 billion now and Chuckand Paul Singer the kind of the
principal Paul Singer was theprincipal of Elliott developed a
good relationship and they mademe an offer to come and join
them as a portfolio manager atElliott Associates and I took
(14:06):
that opportunity and tonightI'll expand upon you know how
that all kind of came to be andthe challenges and so forth with
that.
Ralph Ford (14:18):
And just for reference for our listeners,
you're speaking on campustonight.
You're meeting with studentswhile you're here today.
It's going to be a lot ofinteractions.
I didn't mean to interrupt you.
Vincent Intrieri (14:26):
Yeah, no it's been great.
I've been to two classes thismorning, I think Finance 451 and
Finance 330 or something.
Yeah, finance 330.
Very interesting classes andmaybe we'll talk more about that
later, absolutely.
Ralph Ford (14:45):
So how did you ultimately meet Somehow?
Vincent Intrieri (14:47):
you got connected with Carl Icahn, yeah,
so when I was atPricewaterhouse can't recall
exactly what year we representedthe creditors committee of TWA
and at the time TWA was owned80% was owned by Carl Icahn and
(15:09):
my clients had bonds and TWAwent into Chapter 11.
We represented the officialcommittee and that's where I got
to know Carl.
I was an adversary to him atfirst.
I see Another interestingtidbit Not an easy place to be,
no, no.
Another interesting tidbit tothis story is that I met my wife
(15:31):
at TWA.
She was a manager of laborrelations dealing with pilots,
and that's probably one of theonly reasons why she can put up
with me.
Ralph Ford (15:42):
She dealt with tough people in the past.
Well, I know Joanne well.
You two get along well together.
Yes, we do.
But you certainly have spiritedconversations.
Yes, we do.
Vincent Intrieri (15:51):
And so Carl and I hit it off.
He Didn't necessarily like meat first but I think respected
me and over time when I got toElliott I was doing Distressed
at Elliott, carl always wasdoing Distressed and a variety
of other investment types and wewere working on a company
(16:14):
called Marvel Entertainmenttogether.
He had an investment with hisfirm and he'd get on conference
calls.
We at Elliott had an investmentand I would be on the
conference calls and wedeveloped a very good rapport,
found that we could worktogether developing strategy and
other things.
(16:35):
And at some point I think I waswith Elliot, maybe four or five
years At some point Carl cameto me and said Vince, my
distressed guy is leaving.
Do you want to come join me?
And you know, we talked andultimately the opportunity arose
that I could come join him.
Ralph Ford (16:56):
And you stayed.
You worked with him.
For how many?
Vincent Intrieri (16:58):
years, approximately 20 years.
I think it was 18 and a half,19 years, 20 years.
Ralph Ford (17:02):
I rounded to 20.
So can you explain to listeners, you know, because it's
important, but not everyonereally understands the
importance of people whospecialize in distressed assets
and what you do and what youbring to the larger world in
economy.
Vincent Intrieri (17:17):
Yeah Well, back then, distressed investing,
I think, was a lot differentthan it is now.
It was a little more of theWild West, whereas today things
have tightened up so that it'snot as free-for-all type of
situation.
(17:37):
But you go out, you analyze acompany that is in trouble,
whether they're in Chapter 11 orprior to Chapter 11.
You start buying up.
If you like the company and youthink there's opportunity to
create value in some way, youbuy up the bonds and you take it
(18:01):
from there.
And sometimes it's a kind of abuy to own strategy, sometimes
it's a buy to make moneystrategy.
And those are two differentstrategies and the way you do
those strategies is different.
The one buy to own you kind ofgot to get a really big position
(18:24):
so that you can control the endevent, whereas the latter,
which is just an investment, youkind of buy and you play in the
sandbox well, with a bunch ofother creditors to try and
create the value and get out ata substantial profit.
So they're very nuanced in thedifferences, but it's an
(18:47):
interesting business.
Ralph Ford (18:49):
And you during this time, these 20 years, you're
living in New York City, you'rein the midst of everything
that's happening in Wall Street,and you were there during the
2008 financial crisis.
Any interesting experiences orstories that you want to share
from that time?
Vincent Intrieri (19:05):
Yeah, it was.
As you guys know, it was a veryvolatile era.
Things were falling apart.
Banks were feared to be closing, going under.
I think Airstearns got gobbledup by JP Morgan for virtually
nothing.
(19:25):
I think what was the other firm, another investment firm, was
on the verge of bankruptcy.
Cash mutual funds weredefaulting.
I mean, it was a very, verytroublesome time.
And the distressed debt marketboth distressed bank debt,
distressed bonds were reallyfalling like a rock.
(19:50):
The one thing on Wall Street isyou don't want to catch a
falling knife, but I saw andCarl saw.
I saw and Carl saw there wereopportunities here to take
advantage of, and Carl was neverone to shy away from risk and
opportunity.
And that's principally what Ilearned from Carl is you have to
(20:13):
evaluate risk and opportunity,and sometimes you're not sure of
whether the opportunity is asgood as the risk, and you have
to go with gut feel, and thatcomes with a lot of experience.
In any event, there was one dayI'll never forget it, and I
tell this story often where Iwas in my office and I had a
(20:35):
bunch of guys in the office andwe're talking about 10 different
situations that we were lookingat, and Carl comes sauntering
in from his office.
His office was kind of not toofar away from mine.
He'd come through a door intohis big office, into my little
office.
And he comes into the office.
(20:58):
He's standing there listeningand he says you know, guys, can
you leave me and Vince alonehere for a minute?
And so you know, can we havethe room?
Yeah, we had him and I in theroom.
He shuts the door, he says Vinceand I'll try not to be too
grotesque, but he says what theheck are you doing?
And I said what are you talkingabout, carl?
(21:20):
He says you're buying bondslike a drunken sailor.
And I said, carl, these are allgreat opportunities.
I said we've been through them.
You like them?
He said yeah, but I didn't knowyou were going to go crazy like
this.
And I looked at him.
I said, carl, here's what'sgoing to happen.
I'm either going to be as richas you or you're going to be as
(21:41):
rich as me.
And he looks at me trying toprocess that.
He opens his eyes and he saysyeah, that's what the hell I'm
afraid of.
Ralph Ford (21:56):
I'm going to be as rich as you.
No thanks.
Vincent Intrieri (21:58):
I think it turned out the other way.
Yeah, things turned out greatand he made billions during that
period of time.
Ralph Ford (22:03):
Well, it was very memorable for all of us who
lived through it.
Vincent Intrieri (22:07):
I mean I lived through it sitting here Scary
times Scary.
Ralph Ford (22:09):
I remember watching the TV with my wife and saying
you know, is there going to bean economy tomorrow?
Vincent Intrieri (22:14):
Will our assets all be.
I mean, people were worried, ifyou remember, people were
worried, if you remember you hadmoney in cash, money market
funds that were feared to begoing broke.
I mean, it was unbelievable.
Ralph Ford (22:29):
Well, hopefully never again, at least in our
lifetimes.
Well, let's talk a little bitKnock on wood, Knock on wood,
right?
We never, you know.
Look, every 10 years we seem tocreate some sort of financial
mess.
That's a whole different story.
But you've created your ownfinancial capital firm called
VDA Capital VDA.
Vincent Intrieri (22:46):
Capital Management yeah, it's a private
office.
So in the end of 16, I decided20 years on Wall Street,
especially with a toughtaskmaster like Carl, it's a lot
of years and I felt like I wasgetting a little burned out and
I decided I wanted to dosomething on my own.
(23:09):
I initially went out, was goingto raise money to start my own
hedge fund, and what I found outat the time is that many of the
investors and Carl was going toinvest also, but he wanted me
to go out and raise moneyseparate and apart from him, and
he'll give me the same termsthat I could raise the money on.
(23:30):
And what was happening is I hada lot of interest to raise a
substantial amount of money, butmy belief was and obviously I
had to put my money in with themand I was going to do that but
in distressed debt, my belief isthat you have to have locked up
(23:53):
money, so money that's kind ofcommitted for five years or more
, and at the time people didn'twant to do that.
They would lock up for a year,but they wanted to have the
ability to take out moneywhereby, over a one-year period,
they could take all their moneyout, and I just was not willing
to put my money side by sidewith what I considered hot money
(24:18):
, which leads to a funny storyAgain around the 2008 timeframe.
At that time, many hedge fundswere putting in place what were
called gates, and what gateswere is that it suspended the
(24:38):
ability of investors to accesstheir funds for a period of time
, and you know it could be aslong as two or three years.
But when you put up gates,that's kind of like in the
investment world a no-no, no onewill invest with you going
forward, because you're puttingyour money into a hedge fund or
(25:00):
a fund which you think is liquid, and then all of a sudden they
tell you sorry, not so liquid asyou thought, and so people
don't like that.
And so you know Carl never eventhought about putting up gates
for his fund.
And you know, at the time Ithink we're icon capital was
(25:22):
probably around 15, 10, 15, 20billion dollars and some of the
investors found out that carl'snot putting up gates.
And so you know theseaggregators I call, call them.
You know they work for othermoney people and place
investments for them, and theyfound out that we weren't.
(25:46):
So they come over and meet withCarl and Carl would tell them
say listen, I'm not putting up agate.
You can take your money out ifyou want, he said.
But I'm going to tell you.
I recommend that you don't.
You don't understand the market.
What's going on here.
We've studied it and thedislocation we're going to make
a fortune on these positionswhen, I don't know, might be six
(26:12):
months, might be a year, mightbe two years, but we're going to
make a lot of money on these.
And a lot of the firms had totake the money out because they
just needed it.
They needed it.
And the beauty of having a lotof money.
You've heard the old sayingmoney makes money.
Carl had free money of his own.
(26:33):
He put someone takes out abillion dollars.
He put a billion in so it neverhad to sell positions.
And that's what I'm talkingabout when I say you can't have
hot money, because in asituation where you don't have
the ability to refund the moneythat comes out, you're forced
(26:53):
then, in order to come up withthe cash, to sell positions and
you'd be selling them at what wethought were distressed prices.
And so it was.
It's about that long view.
It's about the long view.
And Carl again made anotherfortune on those investments.
And it wasn't like he didn'twarn people, he kept.
(27:15):
I remember being in thesemeetings so many times where
he's telling people, listen,you're making a terrible mistake
taking your money out.
You're going to make a lot ofmoney.
And he said, oh, I know, I know, but I need the money.
I got investors of my own thatI got to get back to.
So that's kind of the 2008story.
Ralph Ford (27:37):
Well, that's great.
I mean, I think our listenerswill love that part of it.
In 2012, you and your wifeJoanne made this really generous
gift to start the IntrieriStudent Managed Fund here at
Behrend.
Why don't you tell us, you know, why did you do that and what
was the need that you saw increating this student managed
fund?
Vincent Intrieri (27:53):
Yeah, that's a very interesting situation,
ralph.
I was at that time trying togive back to Penn State Behrend.
Behrend was great for me, Imean, it was turned a kid that
was, and I can say this inreality I was a middle class
(28:16):
person.
My parents weren't twoprofessors.
Little Italy here in Erie Grewup in little Italy here in Erie
and we were real middle class,if that maybe even a little
shade down from middle class.
In any event, behrend was sohelpful to me so I wanted to
(28:36):
give back.
So I was working I think at thetime I was working with Bology
Roger.
Ralph Ford (28:44):
Capaldi.
Yeah, roger Capaldi, timing'sabout right, probably between
him and John Magan.
We're both directors of theBlack School of Business.
Vincent Intrieri (28:50):
Yes, and he was telling me one day, you know
, I think, I was up here and Iwent to a couple of classes and
he was telling me one day, youknow, I think, I was up here and
I went to a couple of classesand he was telling me about this
great class that they do it's amock portfolio class.
And so Balaji and I had a longdiscussion about what I thought
(29:16):
about mock portfolio classes andwe came up with the idea and I
think Margie Taylor was involved, john was involved and Balaji
(29:43):
and we came up with this ideafor the student-managed fund
where students could actuallyget real experience managing
real money.
My view on these mock portfolioclasses was they usually have a
prize or something for who doesthe best investment returns,
and so kids go home and figureout what one, two or three high
beta portfolio stocks they couldput their money in to win the
prize, and that, to me, doesn'thelp teach them anything other
(30:06):
than I won't say it's simulated.
Ralph Ford (30:10):
There's no risk, no skin in the game.
Vincent Intrieri (30:12):
There's no skin in the game In any event.
So we came up with this planand we put the plan into process
.
Took a while to get it rolling.
University Park put up a lot ofimpediments, shall I say.
Ralph Ford (30:31):
I think I lived through some of those too.
Vincent Intrieri (30:33):
But we got through it and ultimately the
fund started.
It started at $100,000.
And then over time we weredoing little fundraisers where I
think Kevin had come on to rundevelopment for Penn State
Behrend and it wasn't working.
(30:55):
I would match whoever put moneyin and you'd get I don't know a
thousand bucks here and there,nothing significant, because the
goal always was to get the fundup to a million dollars and
then be able to use the excessover a million to give
scholarships to kids here atBehrend.
And so one day I was talking toPat Black and Pat Black was
(31:22):
instrumental in my view ofgetting this fund to being a
working fund.
Pat challenged me.
He says I'll tell you whatVince I'll put in 150 if you put
in 150.
I said, okay, done, deal, andwe did.
It grew the fund to over a halfa million and the kids took it
(31:43):
from there and I'll tell you,these kids in the student
managed fund they worked theirtails off.
This is a lot of work.
I don't think I don't thinkeven you realize, ralph, the
work it takes.
They don't even get credit forit.
They don't get course credit.
Ralph Ford (31:57):
I know Well they get a little bit now.
Vincent Intrieri (31:59):
They do get a little now.
At the time they weren'tgetting any credit for course
credits.
They were doing it just tolearn.
The work it takes to do thisstuff is unbelievable, and so I
commend all of the students whohave come through the program.
Over the years I've met quite afew of them.
(32:21):
They're all hard-charging,hard-working students who have
done a great job, and the fundis now at, I think, $1.4 million
and we've been giving out, Ithink, something like $30,000 to
$50,000 worth of scholarshipsover the last couple of years.
Ralph Ford (32:39):
It's a great story, and let's talk a little bit,
though.
I've seen a lot of theirpresentations.
They have these algorithms,they have their own proprietary
approach.
I believe they actually makethe trades themselves.
I mean, the faculty advisoractually puts them in.
Vincent Intrieri (32:53):
Tim Krause has done an outstanding job, too,
with helping the kids manage themoney.
I mean he's done a great job.
Ralph Ford (33:01):
And Tim.
We can go on there.
He worked in, I think, theChicago market and he's had a
lot of experience.
But can you talk about are theybeating the market?
If you look at it with yourhard-eyed investor, how are they
doing?
Vincent Intrieri (33:14):
I think they're doing pretty well.
I mean sometimes they're doingpretty well.
I mean, you know, sometimesthey're below what they call
their benchmark, but I thinkoverall, you know they're.
I think I looked at the numbersyesterday.
I think it's probably over time, like 13, 14% annualized return
, which is pretty gosh darn good.
Ralph Ford (33:33):
I think a lot of years they beat the benchmark.
Vincent Intrieri (33:35):
Yeah.
Ralph Ford (33:35):
It may not be by a tremendous amount, but they're
able to do that.
Yeah, they've done anoutstanding job.
Vincent Intrieri (33:41):
And they've learned it all through.
Listen, I don't stick my nosein.
Yeah, I feel like Tim iscapable and competent to oversee
this and he's done a great job.
And to have someone like me,who's a pain in the butt,
(34:01):
looking over your shoulder, Ijust think it would be
counterproductive.
So I don't.
I watch it.
If I have questions, I'll giveTim a call and say hey, what are
we doing with this?
That the other thing.
But he's done a fabulous job,so there's no reason for me to
stick my two cents in but you'vealso.
Ralph Ford (34:19):
We've been at it long enough to you.
Like you said earlier, you'vegot to see these students.
I I've seen some.
They're out there in wallstreet.
They've gone on to do greatthings yeah and I'm not sure we
were placing as many students inthese high financial positions
15 years ago.
Vincent Intrieri (34:33):
I personally think that and I'm not super
familiar with the way theUniversity Park fund works they
have a big fund also, but myunderstanding is that who gets
to be involved in that atUniversity Park is more the
master's MBA program people andthe undergrads.
(34:55):
I don't think get as muchexposure as the Penn State
Behrend people get, and so Ithink that's invaluable from a
Penn State Behrend perspectiveand should be a huge selling
point for the business schoolhere at Penn State Behrend.
Ralph Ford (35:12):
It is.
We talk about it all the timeto incoming students, this idea
of this open, open lab modelwhere we want students solving
real problems, not mock problems.
As you pointed out, there's ahuge difference.
Vincent Intrieri (35:24):
So huge is the difference because these kids
take this seriously.
They know they don't want toscrew things up so that future
generations don't have thismodel available for them to use.
So they take serious theirresponsibilities to make sure
they're doing the work andcoming up with sound, logical
(35:48):
investment decisions.
So I'm very proud of Tim andall the kids who have been
involved in this, and it's agreat thing for Penn State,
Behrend.
Ralph Ford (35:58):
Well, without your vision and generosity, we
wouldn't have it.
Vincent Intrieri (36:02):
Let me ask you this I'll give Margie a little
credit.
She's a pistol boy.
She was there pushing, pushing,pushing when we first started
talking about it, paul G and Iand John, and she's good, she's
good.
Ralph Ford (36:17):
Margie was great.
I learned so much from her andshe still keeps in touch with us
to this day.
Yeah, no, she's great.
Talk about persistence.
Margie had yes, she does.
Margie Taylor, we're talkingabout our former director of
development, so let me ask youthis what do you see?
You know what sets Penn StateBehrend apart and our graduates
that you see?
Vincent Intrieri (36:34):
Well, as you and I have spoken about many
times, ralph, coming from PennState Behrend, I'm sure an eerie
, top-notch reputation, rightEerie.
Everyone respects and knowswhat kind of students and what
kind of work ethic comes out ofthis place.
(36:56):
But go to Wall Street or youknow somewhere else in the
United States they look at, theyget a resume.
You know where to go Penn StateBehrend, file number nine.
So you guys, I think what comesout of that is the students
(37:20):
here know they have to work twotimes as hard as anyone else.
Number one and number two theycome out with a chip on their
shoulder that my degree fromPenn State Behrend is just as
good as your degree from Harvardand I personally have proven
that many times over the yearsbeing on Wall Street and hedge
funds.
That's what I dealt with.
(37:40):
And Carl had an affinity forIvy League graduates and I can't
tell you how many of those IvyLeague graduates crashed and
burned.
So I think those are the twothings I think.
Number one they get a greateducation here small group of
faculty, faculty to studentratio, so they get firsthand
(38:03):
knowledge from the professors.
Number one so they get a greateducation here and the ability
to leave here with a Penn Statedegree in my opinion is huge.
Ralph Ford (38:17):
I think really well said, and there's so much that
our public universities do, andyou just stated it really well.
Well, we're coming to the endof the program.
Anything you want to add, I'llgive you the floor.
Vincent Intrieri (38:28):
No, it's been a pleasure being affiliated with
you, Ralph.
You're always so helpful andthe school has been great to me,
like I said, both from aneducational perspective and from
the perspective of trying togive back to the Erie community.
I no longer live in Erie, I nolonger have any family in Erie,
(38:50):
but it's always a pleasure tocome back to visit with you guys
up here at Penn State Barrett.
Ralph Ford (38:57):
Well, vince, as I said, we've known each other for
a while and you and Joanne arereally committed to Behrend and
Erie, even though you're livingin Miami Miami Florida that's
great.
I love visiting you there.
But likewise it's a real honorand privilege to be able to work
with smart people like you, andso we appreciate you being on
the show.
I'll just finish with you knowyou are listening to Behrend
(39:18):
Talks.
I am Dr Ralph Ford, chancellorof Penn State Behrend, and my
guest today is Vincent Trieri.
Vince is the CEO of VDA Capitaland we're very proud of him as
a distinguished Behrend graduate, 1984 accounting.
Thanks again, vince.
I am Dr Ralph Ford, chancellor of Penn State Behrend
, and you are listening toBehrend Talks.
My guest today is a veryspecial friend, mr Vincent
Intrieri, the founder and CEO ofVDA Capital Management, and he
and his wife Joanne are thecreators of something very
important here at Penn StateBehrend, known as the.
Intrieri Student Managed Fundand we're going to talk a whole
(00:21):
lot about that.
He's also a graduate, 1984graduate of Penn State, Behrend
in accounting.
Welcome to the show, Vince.
Vincent Intrieri (00:28):
Thanks, Ralph.
I appreciate being here andhopefully we can have a great
discussion.
Ralph Ford (00:33):
We're going to have a great conversation.
I love to run through people'sbios.
You've really accomplished,you've done so much.
So, if you don't mind, I'mgoing to take a few moments to
run through your bio andhopefully it embarrasses you a
little bit i.
Your fund was created in 2012.
It's managed by students in ourBlack School of Business and,
importantly, they invest realdollars.
(00:54):
It's not mock, it's not funnymoney which raises the stakes.
The fund started with a$100,000 gift, again from you
and your wife, Joanne.
It's currently valued at thisis amazing 1.4 million dollars.
You founded VDA CapitalManagement, a private investment
firm, in 2017, but before then,you worked for many years with
(01:14):
Carl Icahn the infamous CarlIcahn legendary investor, known
for his work with TWA, marshallFields, time Warner and I know
you still work with him as wespeak and he also was an
investor in Donald Trump'scasinos in New Jersey as well.
Yes, we were distressedDistressed.
You're an expert in distressedassets.
Vincent Intrieri (01:34):
Yes, that's kind of what my original forte
into the investment world wasdistressed debt.
Ralph Ford (01:42):
Well, you serve on the boards of a number of
companies as well TransoceanHertz, global Holdings and
Navistar, to name a few and youalso still serve on our board
here for the Black School ofBusiness, and you're a very
active member of that board, forwhich we greatly appreciate.
And today is November 7th 2024,just to mark the date, let's
(02:02):
start with your trip here toBehrend.
And how did you end up at PennState Behrend?
You were a returning adultstudent, I believe.
Vincent Intrieri (02:09):
Yes, yes, interesting little journey.
And in addition to the boardsI'm on, ralph I just was named
chairman of the board ofSandridge Energy, probably about
three, four weeks ago.
Congratulations, yeah thanks.
Ralph Ford (02:26):
What do they do in the energy space?
Vincent Intrieri (02:28):
Drill in Oklahoma, the headquarter in
Oklahoma.
They have properties inOklahoma and Texas and hopefully
under the new administrationwith less controls and other
things, they'll do very well,I'm sure.
Ralph Ford (02:42):
expanding is the US is people don't know we're an
energy exporter now and we havebeen for quite some time,
actually like a decade.
Vincent Intrieri (02:50):
So the interesting story, and I'm going
to talk about this a littletonight.
For some of the students thatwe're going to talk to tonight,
I was always the smartest kid inschool, in the class, but I
don't know what it was.
I must have gotten boredbecause class was slow or what
(03:13):
have you.
And so I was very much of anunderachiever in my younger days
of academia and high school.
And you know, I went to aCatholic school for a while.
You know the nuns would alwaysbe slapping me with a you know a
ruler saying you know, come on,vince, you're the smartest kid
(03:34):
in the class, you got thehighest IQ, but you can't
perform.
And so after high school I kindof took a hiatus, was not sure
what I wanted to do, and Istarted working at General
Electric Company here in Erie inthe factory.
I was a machinist.
I went to school to learnmachining.
(03:55):
I did that for a little while.
I drove a Jitney in the stockroom.
I did that for a while.
And I remember the one thing Ialways try to impress upon
people is having a mentor inyour life and in your business,
career, et cetera, is soimportant and I've been so lucky
(04:31):
my entire life to have goodmentors all along the road, even
at GE, in you know a factorythat I was working.
You know my foreman guy namedLee Couch who, god rest his soul
is no longer with us.
You know we went out for a beerone night and and he's telling
me, you know, vince, you'resmart, you're a leader, you get
stuff done, you're hardworking,yada, yada, yada.
(04:52):
And at that point I kind of hekind of said to me, what are you
doing in a factory?
And I went home that night andthought about it.
I said to myself, what the hellam I doing in a factory?
And that led to the road.
So they said, hey, I'm going togo into school, go to pet state
(05:14):
baron.
So you know, I looked at gannon, I looked at baron and I, you
know, I like baron.
And so I came up.
Plus, it was a lot cheaper thangannon at the time.
I don't know what, what it isnow, but it was still lot
cheaper than Gannon at the time.
Ralph Ford (05:26):
I don't know what it is now, but it was Still.
Yeah, there's a difference.
Vincent Intrieri (05:28):
Privates are generally quite a bit higher,
and that started my road to theaccounting field at Behrend.
Ralph Ford (05:35):
So that's how it started and I mean so.
Our listeners know you and Ihave known each other for
probably 15 years.
We had a nice dinner last night, actually, you told us the
story.
So you're this returning adultstudent and I think you're
working at the same time whileyou're going to school.
Yes, you were working and youfound sometimes the other
students were messing around inclass.
Vincent Intrieri (05:56):
Yeah, I was telling you last night that when
I went back to school as moreof an adult student I think I
was probably 22, 23 years old Istarted in, I think, 1979, and I
graduated as a part-timestudent at night after work, and
then I matriculated tofull-time student and I think in
(06:20):
my last two or three semestersI must have took 20.
And I think in my last two orthree semesters I must have took
20.
I had to get special approvalfrom whoever the dean was at the
time Lilly, I think.
Yeah, it would have been JohnLilley.
Early on I had to get specialapproval to take 25 or more
credits because I was, you know,I wanted to finish as quickly
as possible.
I wouldn't let you do that now.
Ralph Ford (06:41):
You wouldn't Maybe if you were exceptional.
Vincent Intrieri (06:45):
I was exceptional, you were
exceptional.
But last two semesters werepretty tough and you know I was
taking a lot of credits so thatI could get done and ultimately
graduated in 84.
So even though I was goingpart-time for probably the first
two years, I finished almost ontime, starting in 79.
(07:06):
I think maybe a half a yearlate or something.
Ralph Ford (07:09):
Why accounting?
Why did you pick accounting?
Vincent Intrieri (07:13):
It's a good question.
I saw that question and Ithought about it.
Listen, I was always good inmath, and math has little did I
know at the time.
Math has nothing to do withaccounting, but it doesn't hurt
to be smart in math and be inaccounting.
I thought it was a practicalkind of major that I'd be able
(07:35):
to make money in, and so that'swhy I chose accounting.
Ralph Ford (07:39):
It's one of those things where it's always in
demand.
Vincent Intrieri (07:42):
I always figured it would be in demand.
You had a variety of kind ofvenues you could go to, tax
audit consulting, and so youknow it was.
I thought it was a good majorto take and I still believe, for
a variety of reasons, thataccounting is a absolutely great
(08:02):
major for kids because there'sso many jumping off points that
you can go to after you get yourdegree in accounting.
Ralph Ford (08:12):
Yeah, so many become CFOs and we'll talk about your
path and capital management, butyou don't see it being
overtaken by AI or anything likethis, where AI can do basic
accounting.
Vincent Intrieri (08:22):
I mean, yeah, ai might be able to do some
basic accounting.
I don't think it's going toovertake the accounting industry
.
There are so many things thathave to be, judgments that have
to be made, that personally Iwouldn't rely on a machine that
is maybe biased or not as towhat resolution should be.
Ralph Ford (08:46):
I think it can only be used as a tool, probably for
them to use.
Yes, no question about it.
So let's talk about the earlypart of your career.
You worked at Price Waterhouseand Arthur Anderson.
Vincent Intrieri (08:55):
Yeah, I actually started in Erie at a
place called Root, spitz, s,smiley, I think it's an
accounting firm that's stillhere.
I was down at 10th and StateStreet somewhere around that
area From Root spitz.
I was there actually working atRootspitznos in my junior and
(09:18):
senior year as a part-timer, sothat was my kind of internship.
And then I got hired full timeand I wanted to continue to grow
and I went to.
After maybe about a year, yearand a half in Erie, I got a
position at Cooper's and Lbrandin Pittsburgh.
(09:38):
So I went there.
I was in the audit departmentAgain.
I was an older staff accountantat Cooper's Kids, coming out of
school at 22, I was 26 orwhatever I was at the time.
I took things a little moreseriously.
I had grown up, so to speak.
(10:00):
So I went to Cooper's Aibrand.
I transferred with Cooper's outto Phoenix, arizona.
My brother Gene, talked me intomoving out there.
He said oh, it's so nice outhere, it's just dry heat.
Little did I know when I wentout there.
I said, gene, after I'd beenthere a little while I said you
(10:22):
know, when you go into a sauna,I think the sauna is about 110
degrees, and that's supposedly adry heat too.
But that's you know.
In Phoenix you get up to 117.
Ralph Ford (10:34):
I lived in Arizona for five years.
I told people that dry heatstuff only works to maybe 105.
Yeah right.
Vincent Intrieri (10:39):
Exactly so.
Then again I developed greatmentors at Coopers and Libran, a
guy named Dave Williams, KatieRoll.
They were instrumental inhelping me grow there.
Then Dave Williams left Coopersand went to a firm in Dallas,
(10:59):
texas Pricewaterhouse on theconsulting side.
So at this time I was still onthe audit side and Dave called
me, you know, six months later,after he had left.
He said Vince, what are youdoing?
So what do you?
What do you think I'm doing?
I'm working.
He said, you know, I got apossibility of a position here
(11:20):
in Dallas.
Would you be interested?
I said, dave, I don't know ifI'd be interested or not, but I
certainly won't say no right offthe cuff, let's explore it.
So we explored it and shortlythereafter I moved to Dallas,
texas, in what they called thebankruptcy and reorganization
group, and so that was kind ofthe start of my consulting side.
(11:46):
So I was with Pricewaterhousein Dallas.
They moved me to, you know, andI continued to move up in the
organization.
It's funny about theseorganizations that we'll talk
about a little later, about howthey don't recognize talent and
how they a lot of these firmshave a time and distance kind of
(12:09):
requirement You've got to bethere so many years to get to
this level, so many years and Iwas not as patient as they
wanted me to be and so I went upto Chicago.
I was kind of a senior leaderin the Chicago PW group and in
Dallas at PW I met a fellownamed Don Thomas who was a
(12:33):
senior partner atPricewaterhouse in the
bankruptcy and reorganizationgroup and he and I developed a
very good rapport and he wentover to Arthur Anderson and
several years later recruited meto Arthur Anderson as a partner
.
So I joined Arthur Anderson asa partner.
I was with them in Chicago,which is their headquarters,
(12:56):
arthur Anderson, probably aboutthree years and being in one of
these big firms, it just got tobe that I didn't want the
administrative headache.
I'm a doer.
A lot of these firms, as youmove up in the organization gets
to be 70% of your time is spentdealing with the bureaucracy
(13:22):
rather than doing what you kindof like.
And at that point I was workingfor great clients in the
bankruptcy field and developed avery good relationship with
some guys from an outfit calledElliott Associates, which is a
very big hedge fund out of NewYork I think they're probably up
(13:46):
over $25 billion now and Chuckand Paul Singer the kind of the
principal Paul Singer was theprincipal of Elliott developed a
good relationship and they mademe an offer to come and join
them as a portfolio manager atElliott Associates and I took
(14:06):
that opportunity and tonightI'll expand upon you know how
that all kind of came to be andthe challenges and so forth with
that.
Ralph Ford (14:18):
And just for reference for our listeners,
you're speaking on campustonight.
You're meeting with studentswhile you're here today.
It's going to be a lot ofinteractions.
I didn't mean to interrupt you.
Vincent Intrieri (14:26):
Yeah, no it's been great.
I've been to two classes thismorning, I think Finance 451 and
Finance 330 or something.
Yeah, finance 330.
Very interesting classes andmaybe we'll talk more about that
later, absolutely.
Ralph Ford (14:45):
So how did you ultimately meet Somehow?
Vincent Intrieri (14:47):
you got connected with Carl Icahn, yeah,
so when I was atPricewaterhouse can't recall
exactly what year we representedthe creditors committee of TWA
and at the time TWA was owned80% was owned by Carl Icahn and
(15:09):
my clients had bonds and TWAwent into Chapter 11.
We represented the officialcommittee and that's where I got
to know Carl.
I was an adversary to him atfirst.
I see Another interestingtidbit Not an easy place to be,
no, no.
Another interesting tidbit tothis story is that I met my wife
(15:31):
at TWA.
She was a manager of laborrelations dealing with pilots,
and that's probably one of theonly reasons why she can put up
with me.
Ralph Ford (15:42):
She dealt with tough people in the past.
Well, I know Joanne well.
You two get along well together.
Yes, we do.
But you certainly have spiritedconversations.
Yes, we do.
Vincent Intrieri (15:51):
And so Carl and I hit it off.
He Didn't necessarily like meat first but I think respected
me and over time when I got toElliott I was doing Distressed
at Elliott, carl always wasdoing Distressed and a variety
of other investment types and wewere working on a company
(16:14):
called Marvel Entertainmenttogether.
He had an investment with hisfirm and he'd get on conference
calls.
We at Elliott had an investmentand I would be on the
conference calls and wedeveloped a very good rapport,
found that we could worktogether developing strategy and
other things.
(16:35):
And at some point I think I waswith Elliot, maybe four or five
years At some point Carl cameto me and said Vince, my
distressed guy is leaving.
Do you want to come join me?
And you know, we talked andultimately the opportunity arose
that I could come join him.
Ralph Ford (16:56):
And you stayed.
You worked with him.
For how many?
Vincent Intrieri (16:58):
years, approximately 20 years.
I think it was 18 and a half,19 years, 20 years.
Ralph Ford (17:02):
I rounded to 20.
So can you explain to listeners, you know, because it's
important, but not everyonereally understands the
importance of people whospecialize in distressed assets
and what you do and what youbring to the larger world in
economy.
Vincent Intrieri (17:17):
Yeah Well, back then, distressed investing,
I think, was a lot differentthan it is now.
It was a little more of theWild West, whereas today things
have tightened up so that it'snot as free-for-all type of
situation.
(17:37):
But you go out, you analyze acompany that is in trouble,
whether they're in Chapter 11 orprior to Chapter 11.
You start buying up.
If you like the company and youthink there's opportunity to
create value in some way, youbuy up the bonds and you take it
(18:01):
from there.
And sometimes it's a kind of abuy to own strategy, sometimes
it's a buy to make moneystrategy.
And those are two differentstrategies and the way you do
those strategies is different.
The one buy to own you kind ofgot to get a really big position
(18:24):
so that you can control the endevent, whereas the latter,
which is just an investment, youkind of buy and you play in the
sandbox well, with a bunch ofother creditors to try and
create the value and get out ata substantial profit.
So they're very nuanced in thedifferences, but it's an
(18:47):
interesting business.
Ralph Ford (18:49):
And you during this time, these 20 years, you're
living in New York City, you'rein the midst of everything
that's happening in Wall Street,and you were there during the
2008 financial crisis.
Any interesting experiences orstories that you want to share
from that time?
Vincent Intrieri (19:05):
Yeah, it was.
As you guys know, it was a veryvolatile era.
Things were falling apart.
Banks were feared to be closing, going under.
I think Airstearns got gobbledup by JP Morgan for virtually
nothing.
(19:25):
I think what was the other firm, another investment firm, was
on the verge of bankruptcy.
Cash mutual funds weredefaulting.
I mean, it was a very, verytroublesome time.
And the distressed debt marketboth distressed bank debt,
distressed bonds were reallyfalling like a rock.
(19:50):
The one thing on Wall Street isyou don't want to catch a
falling knife, but I saw andCarl saw.
I saw and Carl saw there wereopportunities here to take
advantage of, and Carl was neverone to shy away from risk and
opportunity.
And that's principally what Ilearned from Carl is you have to
(20:13):
evaluate risk and opportunity,and sometimes you're not sure of
whether the opportunity is asgood as the risk, and you have
to go with gut feel, and thatcomes with a lot of experience.
In any event, there was one dayI'll never forget it, and I
tell this story often where Iwas in my office and I had a
(20:35):
bunch of guys in the office andwe're talking about 10 different
situations that we were lookingat, and Carl comes sauntering
in from his office.
His office was kind of not toofar away from mine.
He'd come through a door intohis big office, into my little
office.
And he comes into the office.
(20:58):
He's standing there listeningand he says you know, guys, can
you leave me and Vince alonehere for a minute?
And so you know, can we havethe room?
Yeah, we had him and I in theroom.
He shuts the door, he says Vinceand I'll try not to be too
grotesque, but he says what theheck are you doing?
And I said what are you talkingabout, carl?
(21:20):
He says you're buying bondslike a drunken sailor.
And I said, carl, these are allgreat opportunities.
I said we've been through them.
You like them?
He said yeah, but I didn't knowyou were going to go crazy like
this.
And I looked at him.
I said, carl, here's what'sgoing to happen.
I'm either going to be as richas you or you're going to be as
(21:41):
rich as me.
And he looks at me trying toprocess that.
He opens his eyes and he saysyeah, that's what the hell I'm
afraid of.
Ralph Ford (21:56):
I'm going to be as rich as you.
No thanks.
Vincent Intrieri (21:58):
I think it turned out the other way.
Yeah, things turned out greatand he made billions during that
period of time.
Ralph Ford (22:03):
Well, it was very memorable for all of us who
lived through it.
Vincent Intrieri (22:07):
I mean I lived through it sitting here Scary
times Scary.
Ralph Ford (22:09):
I remember watching the TV with my wife and saying
you know, is there going to bean economy tomorrow?
Vincent Intrieri (22:14):
Will our assets all be.
I mean, people were worried, ifyou remember, people were
worried, if you remember you hadmoney in cash, money market
funds that were feared to begoing broke.
I mean, it was unbelievable.
Ralph Ford (22:29):
Well, hopefully never again, at least in our
lifetimes.
Well, let's talk a little bitKnock on wood, Knock on wood,
right?
We never, you know.
Look, every 10 years we seem tocreate some sort of financial
mess.
That's a whole different story.
But you've created your ownfinancial capital firm called
VDA Capital VDA.
Vincent Intrieri (22:46):
Capital Management yeah, it's a private
office.
So in the end of 16, I decided20 years on Wall Street,
especially with a toughtaskmaster like Carl, it's a lot
of years and I felt like I wasgetting a little burned out and
I decided I wanted to dosomething on my own.
(23:09):
I initially went out, was goingto raise money to start my own
hedge fund, and what I found outat the time is that many of the
investors and Carl was going toinvest also, but he wanted me
to go out and raise moneyseparate and apart from him, and
he'll give me the same termsthat I could raise the money on.
(23:30):
And what was happening is I hada lot of interest to raise a
substantial amount of money, butmy belief was and obviously I
had to put my money in with themand I was going to do that but
in distressed debt, my belief isthat you have to have locked up
(23:53):
money, so money that's kind ofcommitted for five years or more
, and at the time people didn'twant to do that.
They would lock up for a year,but they wanted to have the
ability to take out moneywhereby, over a one-year period,
they could take all their moneyout, and I just was not willing
to put my money side by sidewith what I considered hot money
(24:18):
, which leads to a funny storyAgain around the 2008 timeframe.
At that time, many hedge fundswere putting in place what were
called gates, and what gateswere is that it suspended the
(24:38):
ability of investors to accesstheir funds for a period of time
, and you know it could be aslong as two or three years.
But when you put up gates,that's kind of like in the
investment world a no-no, no onewill invest with you going
forward, because you're puttingyour money into a hedge fund or
(25:00):
a fund which you think is liquid, and then all of a sudden they
tell you sorry, not so liquid asyou thought, and so people
don't like that.
And so you know Carl never eventhought about putting up gates
for his fund.
And you know, at the time Ithink we're icon capital was
(25:22):
probably around 15, 10, 15, 20billion dollars and some of the
investors found out that carl'snot putting up gates.
And so you know theseaggregators I call, call them.
You know they work for othermoney people and place
investments for them, and theyfound out that we weren't.
(25:46):
So they come over and meet withCarl and Carl would tell them
say listen, I'm not putting up agate.
You can take your money out ifyou want, he said.
But I'm going to tell you.
I recommend that you don't.
You don't understand the market.
What's going on here.
We've studied it and thedislocation we're going to make
a fortune on these positionswhen, I don't know, might be six
(26:12):
months, might be a year, mightbe two years, but we're going to
make a lot of money on these.
And a lot of the firms had totake the money out because they
just needed it.
They needed it.
And the beauty of having a lotof money.
You've heard the old sayingmoney makes money.
Carl had free money of his own.
(26:33):
He put someone takes out abillion dollars.
He put a billion in so it neverhad to sell positions.
And that's what I'm talkingabout when I say you can't have
hot money, because in asituation where you don't have
the ability to refund the moneythat comes out, you're forced
(26:53):
then, in order to come up withthe cash, to sell positions and
you'd be selling them at what wethought were distressed prices.
And so it was.
It's about that long view.
It's about the long view.
And Carl again made anotherfortune on those investments.
And it wasn't like he didn'twarn people, he kept.
(27:15):
I remember being in thesemeetings so many times where
he's telling people, listen,you're making a terrible mistake
taking your money out.
You're going to make a lot ofmoney.
And he said, oh, I know, I know, but I need the money.
I got investors of my own thatI got to get back to.
So that's kind of the 2008story.
Ralph Ford (27:37):
Well, that's great.
I mean, I think our listenerswill love that part of it.
In 2012, you and your wifeJoanne made this really generous
gift to start the IntrieriStudent Managed Fund here at
Behrend.
Why don't you tell us, you know, why did you do that and what
was the need that you saw increating this student managed
fund?
Vincent Intrieri (27:53):
Yeah, that's a very interesting situation,
ralph.
I was at that time trying togive back to Penn State Behrend.
Behrend was great for me, Imean, it was turned a kid that
was, and I can say this inreality I was a middle class
(28:16):
person.
My parents weren't twoprofessors.
Little Italy here in Erie Grewup in little Italy here in Erie
and we were real middle class,if that maybe even a little
shade down from middle class.
In any event, behrend was sohelpful to me so I wanted to
(28:36):
give back.
So I was working I think at thetime I was working with Bology
Roger.
Ralph Ford (28:44):
Capaldi.
Yeah, roger Capaldi, timing'sabout right, probably between
him and John Magan.
We're both directors of theBlack School of Business.
Vincent Intrieri (28:50):
Yes, and he was telling me one day, you know
, I think, I was up here and Iwent to a couple of classes and
he was telling me one day, youknow, I think, I was up here and
I went to a couple of classesand he was telling me about this
great class that they do it's amock portfolio class.
And so Balaji and I had a longdiscussion about what I thought
(29:16):
about mock portfolio classes andwe came up with the idea and I
think Margie Taylor was involved, john was involved and Balaji
(29:43):
and we came up with this ideafor the student-managed fund
where students could actuallyget real experience managing
real money.
My view on these mock portfolioclasses was they usually have a
prize or something for who doesthe best investment returns,
and so kids go home and figureout what one, two or three high
beta portfolio stocks they couldput their money in to win the
prize, and that, to me, doesn'thelp teach them anything other
(30:06):
than I won't say it's simulated.
Ralph Ford (30:10):
There's no risk, no skin in the game.
Vincent Intrieri (30:12):
There's no skin in the game In any event.
So we came up with this planand we put the plan into process
.
Took a while to get it rolling.
University Park put up a lot ofimpediments, shall I say.
Ralph Ford (30:31):
I think I lived through some of those too.
Vincent Intrieri (30:33):
But we got through it and ultimately the
fund started.
It started at $100,000.
And then over time we weredoing little fundraisers where I
think Kevin had come on to rundevelopment for Penn State
Behrend and it wasn't working.
(30:55):
I would match whoever put moneyin and you'd get I don't know a
thousand bucks here and there,nothing significant, because the
goal always was to get the fundup to a million dollars and
then be able to use the excessover a million to give
scholarships to kids here atBehrend.
And so one day I was talking toPat Black and Pat Black was
(31:22):
instrumental in my view ofgetting this fund to being a
working fund.
Pat challenged me.
He says I'll tell you whatVince I'll put in 150 if you put
in 150.
I said, okay, done, deal, andwe did.
It grew the fund to over a halfa million and the kids took it
(31:43):
from there and I'll tell you,these kids in the student
managed fund they worked theirtails off.
This is a lot of work.
I don't think I don't thinkeven you realize, ralph, the
work it takes.
They don't even get credit forit.
They don't get course credit.
Ralph Ford (31:57):
I know Well they get a little bit now.
Vincent Intrieri (31:59):
They do get a little now.
At the time they weren'tgetting any credit for course
credits.
They were doing it just tolearn.
The work it takes to do thisstuff is unbelievable, and so I
commend all of the students whohave come through the program.
Over the years I've met quite afew of them.
(32:21):
They're all hard-charging,hard-working students who have
done a great job, and the fundis now at, I think, $1.4 million
and we've been giving out, Ithink, something like $30,000 to
$50,000 worth of scholarshipsover the last couple of years.
Ralph Ford (32:39):
It's a great story, and let's talk a little bit,
though.
I've seen a lot of theirpresentations.
They have these algorithms,they have their own proprietary
approach.
I believe they actually makethe trades themselves.
I mean, the faculty advisoractually puts them in.
Vincent Intrieri (32:53):
Tim Krause has done an outstanding job, too,
with helping the kids manage themoney.
I mean he's done a great job.
Ralph Ford (33:01):
And Tim.
We can go on there.
He worked in, I think, theChicago market and he's had a
lot of experience.
But can you talk about are theybeating the market?
If you look at it with yourhard-eyed investor, how are they
doing?
Vincent Intrieri (33:14):
I think they're doing pretty well.
I mean sometimes they're doingpretty well.
I mean, you know, sometimesthey're below what they call
their benchmark, but I thinkoverall, you know they're.
I think I looked at the numbersyesterday.
I think it's probably over time, like 13, 14% annualized return
, which is pretty gosh darn good.
Ralph Ford (33:33):
I think a lot of years they beat the benchmark.
Vincent Intrieri (33:35):
Yeah.
Ralph Ford (33:35):
It may not be by a tremendous amount, but they're
able to do that.
Yeah, they've done anoutstanding job.
Vincent Intrieri (33:41):
And they've learned it all through.
Listen, I don't stick my nosein.
Yeah, I feel like Tim iscapable and competent to oversee
this and he's done a great job.
And to have someone like me,who's a pain in the butt,
(34:01):
looking over your shoulder, Ijust think it would be
counterproductive.
So I don't.
I watch it.
If I have questions, I'll giveTim a call and say hey, what are
we doing with this?
That the other thing.
But he's done a fabulous job,so there's no reason for me to
stick my two cents in but you'vealso.
Ralph Ford (34:19):
We've been at it long enough to you.
Like you said earlier, you'vegot to see these students.
I I've seen some.
They're out there in wallstreet.
They've gone on to do greatthings yeah and I'm not sure we
were placing as many students inthese high financial positions
15 years ago.
Vincent Intrieri (34:33):
I personally think that and I'm not super
familiar with the way theUniversity Park fund works they
have a big fund also, but myunderstanding is that who gets
to be involved in that atUniversity Park is more the
master's MBA program people andthe undergrads.
(34:55):
I don't think get as muchexposure as the Penn State
Behrend people get, and so Ithink that's invaluable from a
Penn State Behrend perspectiveand should be a huge selling
point for the business schoolhere at Penn State Behrend.
Ralph Ford (35:12):
It is.
We talk about it all the timeto incoming students, this idea
of this open, open lab modelwhere we want students solving
real problems, not mock problems.
As you pointed out, there's ahuge difference.
Vincent Intrieri (35:24):
So huge is the difference because these kids
take this seriously.
They know they don't want toscrew things up so that future
generations don't have thismodel available for them to use.
So they take serious theirresponsibilities to make sure
they're doing the work andcoming up with sound, logical
(35:48):
investment decisions.
So I'm very proud of Tim andall the kids who have been
involved in this, and it's agreat thing for Penn State,
Behrend.
Ralph Ford (35:58):
Well, without your vision and generosity, we
wouldn't have it.
Vincent Intrieri (36:02):
Let me ask you this I'll give Margie a little
credit.
She's a pistol boy.
She was there pushing, pushing,pushing when we first started
talking about it, paul G and Iand John, and she's good, she's
good.
Ralph Ford (36:17):
Margie was great.
I learned so much from her andshe still keeps in touch with us
to this day.
Yeah, no, she's great.
Talk about persistence.
Margie had yes, she does.
Margie Taylor, we're talkingabout our former director of
development, so let me ask youthis what do you see?
You know what sets Penn StateBehrend apart and our graduates
that you see?
Vincent Intrieri (36:34):
Well, as you and I have spoken about many
times, ralph, coming from PennState Behrend, I'm sure an eerie
, top-notch reputation, rightEerie.
Everyone respects and knowswhat kind of students and what
kind of work ethic comes out ofthis place.
(36:56):
But go to Wall Street or youknow somewhere else in the
United States they look at, theyget a resume.
You know where to go Penn StateBehrend, file number nine.
So you guys, I think what comesout of that is the students
(37:20):
here know they have to work twotimes as hard as anyone else.
Number one and number two theycome out with a chip on their
shoulder that my degree fromPenn State Behrend is just as
good as your degree from Harvardand I personally have proven
that many times over the yearsbeing on Wall Street and hedge
funds.
That's what I dealt with.
(37:40):
And Carl had an affinity forIvy League graduates and I can't
tell you how many of those IvyLeague graduates crashed and
burned.
So I think those are the twothings I think.
Number one they get a greateducation here small group of
faculty, faculty to studentratio, so they get firsthand
(38:03):
knowledge from the professors.
Number one so they get a greateducation here and the ability
to leave here with a Penn Statedegree in my opinion is huge.
Ralph Ford (38:17):
I think really well said, and there's so much that
our public universities do, andyou just stated it really well.
Well, we're coming to the endof the program.
Anything you want to add, I'llgive you the floor.
Vincent Intrieri (38:28):
No, it's been a pleasure being affiliated with
you, Ralph.
You're always so helpful andthe school has been great to me,
like I said, both from aneducational perspective and from
the perspective of trying togive back to the Erie community.
I no longer live in Erie, I nolonger have any family in Erie,
(38:50):
but it's always a pleasure tocome back to visit with you guys
up here at Penn State Barrett.
Ralph Ford (38:57):
Well, vince, as I said, we've known each other for
a while and you and Joanne arereally committed to Behrend and
Erie, even though you're livingin Miami Miami Florida that's
great.
I love visiting you there.
But likewise it's a real honorand privilege to be able to work
with smart people like you, andso we appreciate you being on
the show.
I'll just finish with you knowyou are listening to Behrend
(39:18):
Talks.
I am Dr Ralph Ford, chancellorof Penn State Behrend, and my
guest today is Vincent Trieri.
Vince is the CEO of VDA Capitaland we're very proud of him as
a distinguished Behrend graduate, 1984 accounting.
Thanks again, vince.
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