Boundaries

Episode Transcript

Jennifer Wong (00:05):
Hello, and welcome to Our Podcast being
effing honest. I'm JenniferWong.

Charity Rodriguez (00:10):
And I'm Charity Rodrigues.

Jennifer Wong (00:12):
We invite you into our conversations about
everyday issues experienced byeveryday people. We share our
stories with honesty and humor,hoping to bring people together
in community by showing howvulnerability can deepen bonds
when done with kindness and nonjudgment. We know it's tough. So
we'll go ahead and go first.

(00:45):
Hello, charity.

Charity Rodriguez (00:47):
Hello, Jennifer. Okay. All right. So I
told you that I wanted to trysomething. So let me start it up
real quick. Here we go. Do youfind yourself not wanting to
disappoint others? Do you sayyes to everything like driving
far away to pick up specialtygrocery items, or you agree to

(01:08):
pick up complicated coffeerequests for everyone on that
team? Or you don't want to go toa movie with your friend. But
you don't want them to feel bad?
You can not bear the thought ofpeople thinking badly about you.
But where do we draw the linewith family? Friends? Lovers? is
saying yes, always in your bestinterest? Well, today, our West

(01:31):
Coast podcaster Jennifer Wong isgoing to honestly share her
lived experience, providetransparency on the hard lessons
learned and reveal what makes usvulnerable. When boundaries are
not firmly in place. Jennifer

Jennifer Wong (01:55):
you're gonna share your stories do I like it?
Okay, I

Charity Rodriguez (02:01):
was trying to be on like, you know, what is it
Barbara Walters? So littlesomething but boundaries, folks.
That's what we're talking aboutboundaries,

Jennifer Wong (02:13):
boundaries? You go. Okay. Well, this is a big
topic. I think it's a hugetopic. And it's got a lot of
facets and a lot of differentperspectives. And I think
everybody views it differently.
And it seems like a a word ofrhetoric. You know, like
everybody says, You got to haveboundaries. But what does that
really mean? You know, what doesit really mean? And the other

(02:35):
thing is, it's so easy to talkabout boundaries and know about
boundaries, but to actuallyimplement boundaries, that seems
to be an even harder part. Imean, I've talked about it and
disgusted and seen where I amnot good at boundaries and where
I might be. But still, when therubber hits the road. There's
all those old programs that justgo out, let's just do what we

(02:59):
know. Let's just do what's easy.
And then we're like five milesdeep and shit, and we can't get
our way out. And it's because wedidn't set good boundaries.
That's my experience with it.

Charity Rodriguez (03:14):
All right, but it's changed yourself. Do
you think you have changed? Haveyou implemented changed a lot?

Jennifer Wong (03:21):
Absolutely.
Absolutely. And there was a lotof things that I learned along
the way, like there is adifference between boundaries
and walls, there's a hugedifference. And once that the
difference. So like a boundaryis actually something that love
can penetrate. boundaries can beflexible. If we have enough self

(03:42):
love, and walls are completelybuilt, and they never go down.
Nothing gets through them. Andthey are solid. And when I was
trying to figure out thedifference, I mean, this is
years of looking into this likeprobably a decade and trying to
understand the difference. Andstill to this day, I put up

(04:03):
walls when I'm really in fear orreally feeling uncomfortable or
insecure. I'll put up a wallbecause it's really protection.
Whereas a boundary is usuallysomething that as I've continued
to practice them is more aboutself love. Because if you love
yourself enough, it's not hardto say no. But when we're me,
codependent meaning I wanteverybody around me to be happy,

(04:29):
comfortable, safe, happy withme, especially because that
whole codependent thing. Itisn't just for them. That's a
big lie. We're codependent sothat people will be calm so that
we can feel good. It's alwaysabout us, essentially. And so
but when I had in the past butof walls, there was no chance of

(04:52):
healing relationships. There wasno chance of opening the door to
conversation. I guess that's notentirely true, not no chance,
but it's a lot harder, a lotharder to broach that
conversation. Okay, so

Charity Rodriguez (05:11):
let's go back. When did you recognize
that? Like, not havingboundaries was not good? Like if
you're people pleasing, andyou're just, you know saying
yes, this is at what point didyou go you know what I changed

(05:32):
this or you recognize that's nothealthy?

Jennifer Wong (05:35):
Well, it wasn't on my own, I'll tell you that
for sure. It wasn't my ownthinking, that got me to
understand boundaries, it wasprobably being in community with
my friends, and also having thefellowship and the 12 step
program that I was involved. Andthey really taught me about
boundaries. And not just liketalking about it, but having to

(05:58):
implement it. And I got most ofmy practice being in a marriage,
like we mentioned in thegaslighting episode that did not
honor boundaries. And instead,when I would set a boundary, it
was shown to me how it was notgood and that I was not good,
and that I was selfish. And Iwas self serving. So boundaries

(06:22):
can definitely look like that.
But I would say it was all theyears in that fellowship and
doing the work with a sponsorand other friends that were
practicing the same thing. Istill have troubles. I mean, I'm
still rubbing up against a bitagainst it to this day, you
know, it's not easy. I'd ratherjust, Oh, I'd rather just walk
away and hope everything worksout. But sometimes what I'm also

(06:46):
learning is so self love isfound in boundaries.

Charity Rodriguez (06:54):
Yes, I agree.
I agree. But now we got to takeanother step back again, because
you've mentioned being in thesupport group. And I keep
meaning to ask you. Why were youin the support group? Because it
wasn't a a Alcoholics Anonymous,right. You said it was a support
group, for those supportingothers with other issues?

(07:18):
Correct? Yeah. So what promptedyou to go into that support
group

Jennifer Wong (07:30):
in the first place? Wow. So it's actually the
12 step group that I was a partof was Al Anon, which is for
friends and families that haveloved ones that have issues with
alcohol, alcohol, alcoholism.
And I didn't know anything aboutit. And I was actually working

(07:53):
at a drug and alcohol rehabcenter, I was living with a man
that was in AAA. And mydaughter's friend's mother, we
were just talking one day, andshe said, Oh, I think you could
really use Al Anon. And Ithought, okay, whatever. And she

(08:14):
took me to three meetings. And Iwas just interested, I, I'm
always interested, I'm alifelong learner. And I'll just,
if someone says something, andit resonates with me, I'll try
it. I'll try anything. So I did,I went. And I'd say the first
time was terrifying. The secondtime was scary. The third time
was a little easier, but it'sintimidating. You know,

(08:36):
especially as a person thatalways felt like I was not part
of the group, that I don'tbelong, that I'm weird that
there's something terminallyflawed about me that people
aren't going to want me to bepart of their group. But I just
kept coming back. They keep theysay that keep coming back. And I
just did and I don't know why. Ithis is where I think like

(08:57):
Spirit just wanted me to keepgoing, keep going. And I did and
it really saved my ass. Ilearned a lot about myself. It
was nothing. It had nothing todo about the alcoholics. It had
nothing to do about anybodyelse. They instigated triggers
in me that I got to take thereand learn how to work out and
boundaries was a big, huge pieceof it.

Charity Rodriguez (09:20):
So I'm assuming that before this, your
boundaries were very loose, andmaybe not even there. So what
were some experiences where youhad what were some examples of
things that you probably shouldhave had some boundaries with,

(09:40):
but you didn't have the skills,the experience, what not to have
in place?

Jennifer Wong (09:48):
Gosh, we are being effing honest, aren't we?

Charity Rodriguez (09:53):
Yes, that's the name of the

Jennifer Wong (09:56):
show. I mean, you asked a couple of questions
there, but I would say yes. Iobviously didn't have good
boundaries. I didn't know it. Atthe time, I thought I was doing
just fine. Wondering why Ialways felt like a victim. And
then I started understandingwhy. And I mean, there's a lot

(10:19):
of things. I mean, even raisingmy oldest daughter, I had
terrible boundaries, because Ialways felt guilty and ashamed
that I divorced her dad. Solike, for instance, oh, I need
you to do the dishes, and shewouldn't do it. So I would do
it. I didn't want to wait anylonger. So I would do it. I
mean, there's a lot of thoselittle things, right. And I

(10:41):
would say, I was really good atputting up walls, you know,
fear, forget everything and run.
And so I would put up a wall sothat I could run and especially
with my mom, that was a reallydifficult one, I would set a lot
of walls with her. And I wouldkeep coming back to try to set a

(11:01):
boundary, but she is anotherperson in my life that really
pushed my boundaries. She would.
I don't even know if she pushedany boundaries, because I didn't
have any but she really liked tohave things her way, a certain
way. And if it wasn't that way,then I would pay emotionally,

(11:22):
you know? Okay, so I didn't evenknow I was just lost. I was just
chasing my tail until I reallystarted learning about what
boundaries were for sure. Okay.
What about you charity? Like,where have you felt that you
couldn't have better boundaries?

Charity Rodriguez (11:43):
I don't know, though, was a tricky one. I
thought about that this week. Alot. And, you know, I was
reading up on on boundaries. Andyou know, what does it mean,
really. But I, I guess what Idiscovered was that I am, I have

(12:05):
a lot of walls. I did not thinkthat I had a lot of walls, but I
have a lot of walls to protectmyself. And my immediate family,
my children, my husband, I havea wall around them, keeping them
in protecting them, trying tokeep them safe from family, just

(12:33):
the outside world. But then Ihave walls with family. Because
of that gaslighting sewed thatwe were talking about. I, I know
I have to have up walls with myown family, because they can use

(12:57):
your past as a weapon. They useit to weaponize themselves
against you may not think thatthey, I recognize the ones that
it's a weapon, but they'recoming at you with love, they
feel like they're trying to helpyou and support you by pointing
out all of these flaws andexperiences that may have

(13:20):
nothing to do with who you aretoday. But that's where they're
stuck. They have these pins ofepisodes and experiences with
you that they just can't let go.
They haven't evolved or changedor matured or whatever. They
haven't walked your journey. Andso that's okay, I get it. I can

(13:40):
see that with them. So I'm not,you know, perturbed. Then
there's other ones that arelike, No, there's just a wall,
like I do not care. I don't wantto hear it. I don't need to
know, I'm not concerned aboutwhat you have going on. You
don't need to be worried aboutwhat I have going on. We're just
that that and I cannot let thatwall go down and I will not let

(14:03):
that wall go down to my dyingday. So that's just where I'm at
there. But then with people justpeople in general. Yeah, I have
a wall but for the same reasonthat you said you feel like an
outsider, you you want to belongbut you don't feel like you

(14:27):
belong and you know and orrecognize that you're different
and but I don't know if I Okay,let me take that back. I don't
know if it's a wall. It's moreof a mask. Like there's no mask
that I put on when I you knowwalk out the door. And I try to
present myself in a way that isaccepting. Knowing deep down

(14:50):
like I am not like any of thesepeople. And if they really knew
who I was, maybe they might notlike me So let me just put that
mask on because it's when youwhen I feel like oh, here's an
opportunity, I might be able toreveal my true self. And then
you get the blank stares, justkind of like Okay, nevermind,

(15:13):
it's just easier to put the maskon and just go on. And when I
come home, that's when the mass,you know, are down, I walk into
the little wall, and it's allhappy, happy time. It's all
good. So there.

Jennifer Wong (15:31):
And that's, I like that, because that reminds
me one of the things withboundaries is being authentic,
right being our true selvesanywhere. And if when I got to
the point where I, well, I'mstill working on it. But as I
got better at loving myself,accepting myself knowing my
worth it, it's challenging, butit becomes easier to be myself

(15:54):
in public. So even like dating,I have to have boundaries, I
have to be authentic. Because Idon't want people getting the
wrong impression, but I want tocome out and be exactly who I
am. And I think before I was inthe business of people pleasing,

(16:15):
I was in the business ofperception management, you know,
by me putting on a mask, I'mmanaging your perception of me.
Yes. And I just, I It'sexhausting. I mean, for me, it
was extremely exhausting. But Ididn't really know like, there
was so long where it wasn't, itwasn't as if I was thinking to
myself, whoa, I'm beinginauthentic. It just felt

(16:38):
uncomfortable. I didn't havewords for it, I couldn't explain
it. Even in my 40s. It wasn'teven a maturity thing. It was
something that was beyond myrecognition. Until, you know, I
was led to these groups wherethey would show me with love and
kindness. And basically, I wouldbe shown from their own stories,

(16:58):
where I could pick things outand, and relate to and connect
with and say, oh, and then Icould ask the questions when I
run it through my own filters,but it took a while. But I think
authenticity is a really bigpart of boundaries. And I think
that when I am more authentic,to my honest, being effing
honest with myself, which I haveto say, that is a big piece of

(17:21):
this podcast, it isn't just togo out there and be honest with
your opinions and judgments.
It's being effing honest withourselves, like, what is really
bothering me, what do I reallyvalue? What don't I value. And
when I started looking more atmy values, then again, I guess I
could set stronger boundaries,because I know those values mean
the world to me. And there'snothing I would do to like lie

(17:42):
about those. Although I thinkwe've all been in those
situations, we're in a socialsituation. And people are
talking about maybe politics ora law or you know, something
that's just outside of beingpersonal. And I might have
agreed to a couple things to fitin, even though I didn't believe

(18:02):
in it. And it felt terrible.
Like I would walk away thinking,do I have to hold that up in the
next conversation? Why did I saythat? I don't believe that. Why
don't I just keep my mouth shut?
How's that for an option? Justshut it. But I think
authenticity is a big piece ofholding boundaries. And I think
it's a practice we have to bekind to ourselves, because it's,

(18:24):
it's not easy. And it's notsomething that we're ever taught
to do. We're taught to be goodgirls, to be make everybody
happy to have manners to sayyes. When you mean no.

Charity Rodriguez (18:40):
Yes, we are taught that is exactly what we
are taught. And I feel like frommy own experience in a Latin
household, there was a lot ofcontradictions with my parent,
like you, you know, be nice andkind and gracious, and you know,

(19:02):
always thankful and whatnot. Butmy parents were awful, like, but
you are an independent woman,you be strong and do you don't
have to rely on anybody else.
But then at the same time,they're telling you no, oh, no,
no, no, just be quiet. Don'tdisagree. Just say yes. And just
Okay, thank you. And I'm like,wait, but how how, you know,

(19:25):
when am I supposed to do what? Isay? No, I don't want that. Or
when do I say you know, okay,sure. That's fine. I found
myself in a few situations whereI didn't know what to say
because and this was when I wasyounger, when I had just moved

(19:46):
out to Los Angeles. And I wasvery naive and I didn't know
anything. I didn't have a lot ofexperience with men and people
and their say saying things tome. And I'm just like, oh, yeah,
sure, yeah. And you know thatbut somewhere like I would let
it get too far along before Irealized things didn't sound

(20:09):
right did not go with I don'tthink they're really telling you
what you think they're tellingyou. This isn't just a nice
friendly conversation. I thinkthere's something else going on
here. I don't know what thatsomething else is. But I think
there are something else. Godwalked away, you know, and it
would get to the I don't want tolie. I hate lying. But I I'm

(20:32):
trying to get out of asituation. And you know, later
in hindsight, when you'retalking with friends or
whatever, and they're just like,Oh, why didn't you just say you
need to go bathroom? Like, why?
And then just leave? Becausethat's lie. I don't want to do
like, I can't just leave the guylike he was talking to. I was

(20:53):
like, ah, yeah, ding dong. Butyou know, so

Jennifer Wong (20:58):
funny. It's like, that's lying. But it's also
lying, staying there acting likeyou get it. You know? Constant
lies.

Charity Rodriguez (21:06):
But we are that was the whole Yes, you be
this, but you also have to bethis. Oh, that's hard. That is
very hard. Yeah. Thank goodness,my daughter is not that way. She
didn't pick up that skill. Shewas very blunt. And to the point
and no, it just wants you tocare about your feelings. Take

(21:28):
care of your lip. They're gradedupon Oh, she's just like, that
was weird. Or, you know, Ididn't like that and just walked
away. And I'm like, Okay. Andthen I'm running back going,
like, I'm so sorry. She was sorude to you. But it runs off,
right? I'm apologizing for her.
But I'm just again, I want it tobe that way. But then just like,
oh, I don't want them to feelbad.

Jennifer Wong (21:52):
I know, we grew up with this whole thing about
people pleasing. It's prettybad. We can't hurt anybody's
feelings. But it's lying. Like,someone brought that to my
attention. And then you're justlying. I'm like, Oh, I don't
want to be a liar. That doesn'tsit well either.

Charity Rodriguez (22:08):
That's true.
But what about with friends?
With your friends, like I wastalking about, like, you know,
just outside people that like,whatever. But now, when are you?
When does it feel like a lie toa friend? Or when does it feel
like nobody really just want todo this? Like I just, it took,

(22:28):
you know, like, sure. I'll goahead and pick that up for you.
Sure. Let's go ahead and do youknow, whatever you want to do?
Like, where's that? Where's theintuition? Or what's the you
know, Spidey sense for thattelling you or, you know,

Jennifer Wong (22:42):
I think it's the same thing. You know, if we're
checking in and we know whereour energy is at that day. We
don't overbook overbooking is abig, bad thing that I used to do
with no boundaries. I would justI'd overbooked things because I
had no boundaries. It was like,Oh, yes, yes, I'll do this. Yes.
And then I'm like, I can't be inthree places at the same time.
So I think it's really is aboutwhen I would go inward? And say,

(23:06):
is this something that I can doand I just sit with it and ask
myself, sometimes I'll hear acall for action from my friends
where I could be helpful. And Idon't say anything. This is one
thing I learned is just don'tsay anything, give myself a few
minutes, maybe a day to thinkabout it, sit with it, and then

(23:28):
reach out and offer something.
You know, if someone asks meright on the fly, this is the
other thing I learned when I waslearning about boundaries, I can
say, Let me think about that.
And then the second part thatI'm learning is when do you need
to know by? Because sometimes Iwould just think about it, and
it might take me too long,because I'm busy. And then I

(23:49):
miss a deadline that they mightneed it. So I always say let me
think about that. When do youneed to know by those who have
become really good boundariedresponses instead of Yes, I'll
do it or Nope. And then later,I'm like, I could have done it.
So it's really those or I justneed time, I need time and space
to look at my calendar to touchget in touch with how I'm

(24:13):
feeling. And then I can make adecision. I used to just feel
like everything that was askingme I needed to know the answer
right away. And it better beright. And if it isn't, you
already said it. Now you'regonna have to kill yourself to
make sure that you meet thatobligation. And then I'm living
a life of obligations. Don'twant to do that.

Charity Rodriguez (24:34):
Okay, I hear you. And I am still in the I
need to respond immediately. AndI probably should say, Let me
think about that. I have foundmyself in a few situations where
I did say something where I waslike, oh, you know what, in
hindsight, I didn't need to dothat or I could do something

(24:57):
else or whatever. But I like Ilike to if someone asks me a
question, I like to replyimmediately or get back to them
immediately and tell them yes,no, maybe. So whatever. Just to
acknowledge, I feel like I needto acknowledge the person and
their question. And I know,that's because when I ask

(25:19):
questions, I want someone toreply or acknowledge that at
least I am there. So I like yourresponse of let me think about
it. Because yeah, that lets youhave acknowledged, I heard you,
and I would think about it. Ijust don't know what the answer
is right now. Or I don't have ananswer for you at this very

(25:40):
moment. But I heard you, so goaway.

Jennifer Wong (25:44):
And I think it's fair. I mean, we can't possibly
have answers for everythingright away. We just can't.

Charity Rodriguez (25:50):
I know, I know. But

Jennifer Wong (25:53):
with my boundaries. The other thing is,
if I need something, I kind oftry to plan ahead, because I
know people need time to thinkabout it and check their
schedules. So if I do dropsomething, that's last minute, I
have to be okay, with notgetting help. You know, if I'm
asking for help, because I knownow, now that I give myself the

(26:13):
space, I can give other peoplespace. And it's making me be
more organized in my own life,you know, boundaries are really
about me. You know, I'm, I thinkone of the things also I learned
about boundaries was, Do I keepcommitments to myself, like,
that was a big piece. If I saythat I want to, like I love my

(26:37):
writing. And if I say I'm gonnawrite this piece by a certain
day, do I make the time formyself to do it? Or do I just
say, Oh, I had to do this. And Ihad to do that. And I don't even
have boundaries for myself. Thatwas a big piece that I started
recognizing. Don't get mestarted. It's

Charity Rodriguez (26:54):
harder. That was harder for people to do. I
agree. We do need it. But I knowthat that would be the first
thing people drop is somethingfor themselves. You know, and
they're long list of things todo. You should do you don't have
a lot of I mean, we think, Idon't know, we don't have a lot

(27:17):
of grace with ourselves. We'rejust kind of like, Oh, we don't
really need that anyway, you canjust talk yourself out of it. I
didn't really need that. I coulddo that later, is not a big
deal. Right, right. That's whatyou tell yourself. So

Jennifer Wong (27:30):
but and that's about whole self love right
there.

Charity Rodriguez (27:35):
But, but again, that's something that
we're taught, right? It's beabout everybody else, you put
yourself last in a situation.
But how do you do? What are yourthoughts about having boundaries
within a relationship with yourhusband, boyfriend, girlfriend,

(27:57):
lover? Whatever?

Jennifer Wong (28:01):
How about I'm still working on that. Two
failed marriages. I'm stillworking on that. That might be
my lifelong learning. But Iwould say that the same would
apply. I mean, I haven't been ina relationship in three years.
Because I've been working on allthis stuff. You know, I don't

(28:23):
want to go back and do any ofthat again. But I think that
that the same thing is apply.
And I will say through thedating, I have done so much
better. I have been so much moreclear, so much more upfront, so
much more authentic. And evenwhen I have to, like, Tell tell
somebody, I I don't think thisis a good match for me, which I

(28:45):
hate to do. It's probably thehardest thing. I know, there's
no way I'm not going to do it.
Because my last marriage, thatwas my biggest boundary failure.
I had said I do not want to getmarried again. I know I'm
pregnant, but I really wouldrather not get married. And then

(29:07):
it was I just got beat down,beat down, beat down. I got worn
down. And finally I said yes. Sothat was probably my biggest
boundary flounder of my life. Ihad said no, no, no, no, no. And
then I said, Okay. Okay, I won'tdo that again. I won't do that
again. I was so afraid of whatit would mean to say no, I was

(29:30):
so afraid of what it would do toour unborn child because I was
getting all kinds of storiesabout how it was going to be so
awful for the baby if we weren'tmarried. And I knew in my heart
that wasn't true, but I

Charity Rodriguez (29:44):
wasn't going to be awful for the baby. If you
were not married. What would bemarried? Do he there was a lot
of things baby.

Jennifer Wong (29:56):
There was a lot of things he brought in his His
religion he brought in the wordbastard. I'm like, we haven't
used that word to just grab achild in a long time. That's
fine. Middle Ages stuff, so.
Okay, so it was little thingslike that. And I don't think it

(30:18):
was those kind of arguments thatchanged my mind. I think I just
wanted peace. You know, thething that people without
boundaries, I want everybodyaround me to be happy so that I
can feel happy. Because ifnobody's upset with me, then I'm
happy. It's like the smallestform of existence. Yeah, I don't

(30:40):
do anything because I want to Idon't do anything because it
feels right for me. I doeverything so that everybody
around me is comfortable, happyand safe. And then I can finally
feel safe. When a martyr when avictim, get off the cross, we
need the would I even want to dothat ever again. That is never

(31:03):
going to happen. And as hard asit is, I like pinch myself until
I do it. I'm just like, you arenever going to do that again. So
yeah, so I have made bigchanges. I have had very hard
conversations with people andthey probably weren't done very
well. Because when I'memotionally triggered, I lose my
train of thought, I lose mywords. Yeah. And, and that would

(31:26):
happen a lot, especially beingin a gas lighting situation,
then I just say, okay, you know,because I can't even think about
what I would try to say anymore.
But I've really learned to goslow. Speak slowly. There's no
hurry. Breathe. I don't set Idon't care how I sound. I just

(31:51):
want the words to come out.
Right? No, is a completesentence?

Charity Rodriguez (31:59):
No, is a complete sentence. I like that.
Yeah, I don't know. I feel likeI say yes to a lot of things.
But my world, my social circle,or whatever is it's fairly
small. So it's either just like,I'm interacting with my
immediate family, my husband, mykids, that's it. Then there's,

(32:23):
you know, the next circle,right? It's just like, your work
people or whatever you have todeal with? Or family, like your
family, your extended family,right? And then after that the
next circle would be your peers.
But like people that I don'tknow, I don't are asking, you're
requesting something of me. Idon't know who you are, what is

(32:48):
going on? That sounds like it'ssomething urgent. I don't have
anything urgent going on rightnow. So if this will help you be
on your merry way and get yougoing then fine. I don't care. I
mean, that's kind of how I, I'mnot invested in the
relationship. But I am veryweary of allowing other people's

(33:12):
drama to become my drama. I justknow, I remember in my 20s, I
worked at Hewlett Packard, andthere's this woman, I really
admired her because she was sobold, and we worked well
together. But she was reallybold. And I remember there was a
chaos going on in the office.
And she came over to me and shewas like, You know what, that

(33:36):
lady, and she's yelling at me.
And she wanted this, that andwhatever. And I just had to stop
and look at her and say, No,that's your crazy. That's not
mine. I'm not gonna let yourcrazy become my crease. She just
walked away from the lady. And Iwas like, Oh, you said that. But
I thought about that, that haslike stuck with me all the time.

(33:58):
Don't let other people's crazybecome your crazy. I always like
no. And I always have to look atthings through, you know, with
those lenses on is this niceproblem? Or is this your
problem? And if it's problem,you know, and I can't the
minimum that I could do to helpyou, that's fine, but you're not

(34:20):
going to pull me in, you're notgoing to suck me in. Like it's
just your problem, and you haveto deal with it. And if it's
just you need a listening ear,Okay, listen, hopefully, you
know it's cathartic for you andyou get your situation off your
chest or whatever and maybe youjust felt better I can go now
and clear thinking and go on mymerry way. That's fine. But if

(34:43):
it's now charity, we need to goand take actions Oh, noon. No,
we don't. Because I'm fine.
Right? We're on that and youhave a whirlwind of chaos going
around you and I don't likechaos like I really I really
don't like drama. I'm not onethat watches all of these

(35:05):
dramatic shows on TV that peopleget so absorbed into. I cannot
go down that rabbit hole withyou. I don't like that. That
leaves me feeling anxious aboutpeople. I don't know. Like, it's
a made up story. It's somethingthat is on TV. And people are
talking about, it's still like,what do you think they're going
to do? I don't know. But I can'tlet that take up space in my

(35:30):
brain. Because I have realpeople in front of me that I
have to deal with. I have realproblems that I have to try to
figure out. And I'm not at ascape this, right, like, go and
they watch the shows. Andbecause it helps take their
minds off of their own problems.
When there's a problem in mylife. I'm like, right on it.
Like, okay, we're gonna dealwith this right now. Let's go.

(35:53):
What's the problem? I'm takingnotes. Okay. Yeah. Did we try
this? Do we try that? And thatis a problem, right? I'm trying
to always solve everything. AndI can always let things go. And
that is something I'm workingon. But the honest, D for me is
acknowledging the elephant inthe room. There's an elephant in

(36:13):
this room? How are we going todeal with this situation? I may
not have the answer. But I'mgoing to how are we going to
deal with this? Like, this hasto be dealt with? You know, I
don't know, I don't know whatthat says about me. That's a
problem that I can't just letthings go that I can't just give
it a date. And you know, we'llleave the elephant in the room,
like, what's the big deal? It'snot bothering anybody? Why do we

(36:36):
have to? But it bothers me thatthere's an elephant in the room,
and I'm thinking the elephantneeds to be upset, or somewhere
else? Not in my

Jennifer Wong (36:47):
room? And sometimes it does, right? And
then in the end, sometimes thereare something you there's
something you could do about it.
And other times there justisn't. And it's a matter of
removing yourself. I mean, butwe use that space to make that
decision to make that, todecipher that for ourselves. Is
this something I tried to fix?
Or is it something I let go,someone once told me that when

(37:09):
you are trying to controlthings, you have no control over
you make yourself a victim? Soone of my ways of working with
my boundaries is can I make adifference? Or is this something
I can't possibly fix, change,manipulate, you know, manage? Is

(37:30):
this beyond my realm. And themore I, the older I get, and the
more I look at all this, theonly things that are in my realm
of control are is how I thinkhow I behave and how I feel. And
even those, I think, sometimesare not in my control, either. I
get feelings that I wasn'tplanning on that. I didn't

(37:51):
control that feeling. But reallyanything outside of me. I don't
know how the outcome is going tobe. Just because I behave a
certain way, I have no idea howthat outcome is going to be. But
did the way I behave? Sit Well,in my heart? Did it make sense
to me did it? Did it align withmy values? Did it align with the

(38:13):
things that I believe to be truein my life? Other than that, I
don't think I really have muchcontrol. Even when I do things
outside of me, I don't know whatthe ripple effect is, couldn't
possibly know. I have intentionsand hope that I don't know how
it's going to be perceived. Andthat was the other thing. It's
not my job to maintain how whatI do is perceived. And that's

(38:40):
another way for me to setboundaries. If I'm not worried
about the results of my actions,then it's easier for me to say
no, it's easier for me to sayYes, even I mean boundaries have
given me so much more energy andtime in my life, that now I say
yes to things that I love, likethis podcast. I wouldn't have
been able to do this three yearsago. Where was I going to carve

(39:03):
in extra time as a single momworking 40 to 4050 hours a week?
How was I going to do that? Butnow that I know what I love, and
I know what I want to do, and Ihave my intention about why I'm
on this planet. I make time forit. You know, I make enough time
for it is total full time now.
You know, but I do have time formy writing the same thing. I

(39:24):
wouldn't use I wouldn't havedone that five years ago.
There's no time for that. I'vegot kids, I've got work and oh
yeah, I can work extra Oh yeah,I can do that extra I can do
this. I can do that. Until I'mso burned out that the free time
is just spent on my back staringat the TV. Because I have
nothing left. I'm a completelyempty shell. And I don't want to

(39:46):
do that anymore. A lot moreenergy by having boundaries for
sure.

Charity Rodriguez (39:56):
That's a tough one. That's a tough That's
not easy for people to. Well,you had said it earlier, you
have to be honest with yourself.
And people are not honest withthemselves. But how do you
convince people to be honestwith themselves?

Unknown (40:19):
Well, I guess they're scared of the

Charity Rodriguez (40:21):
answer.
Right? Maybe they they thinkdeep down know that there's
something that they have toface, but they're scared to face
that. Sure.

Jennifer Wong (40:32):
Absolutely. But I don't think we can convince
people to be honest withthemselves either. You know, but

Charity Rodriguez (40:39):
okay, yes, you're right. We cannot convince
others. We have no control overthem. But what do you do with a
friend that comes to you? Andyou know what the situation is,
you know what their story is.
And yet they keep stepping backinto that same situation.

Jennifer Wong (41:04):
I just listed until they asked me for my
input. I don't give adviceunless I'm asked. I mean, I do
it. God knows I'm human. But Itry not to. I try to just
listen, I'm waiting for an ask.
I wait for an ask how I thinkabout it. Charity. How many
times have you jumped in beforeyou were asked? Some people
don't want our opinion or ourhelp? Yeah. Yeah. So now I wait

(41:28):
till I'm asked, or I offer Can Ihelp you with this? Or do you
want my opinion? Do you want myfeedback? And sometimes I like
to help. My friends were closeenough. They'll be like, No, I
just want to I just need tovent. Okay, cool. No, I don't
need to say anything. It's justmy opinion.

Charity Rodriguez (41:51):
I don't offer opinions to friends. I just
listen. Because I don't that's Idon't know, fully their story.
Right? I'm just hearing one sideof a story. So if there's a
complaint about a, you know,significant other, I'm just
hearing that person's throat I'mnot hearing like, well, what

(42:12):
they know, it takes two totango, right? And so that's
always in the back of my mind.
So I'll listen to what thisperson is saying. But I don't
offer any advice, because thatcan come back to bite you in the
butt. With family, I, I've, I'velearned I cannot offer advice. I
think I'm being helpful. Ithink, well, this clearly is

(42:33):
what you need to be doing. Butsometimes they just like being
where they're at doing whatthey're doing. They're
comfortable with that, how fastor how slow their treadmill is
going. So, you know, I may havemy point where I'm comfortable,
and it's fine for me. It's justnot fine for them. And that's

(42:53):
okay. But I yeah, I can't, youknow, especially if my family,
especially my family, I cannotoffer any advice. It always
comes back. Like I think I'mbeing helpful. And it will just
turn right around. And I'll beshocked. Like, what do you mean,

(43:13):
I was just trying to hope thatyou said that this was going on.
And then you get into anargument about what your what
you said versus but there's thisother situation going on here.
Like there's a dude over there,you know, stabbing your puppy,
like, are you getting mad at me?

(43:33):
Because there's a dude overthere. Like, we should be
talking about the puppy, like,you know, and they lose sight of
everything. So but I guess, youknow, I'm listening to you. And
I'm like, okay, maybe that's aprotection that I have put in
place for myself. And that'sjust how I have to deal with it.

(43:57):
But I'm fine with it. Like, do Ineed to change that? Do I need
to go talk to someone aboutthat? I'm like, good. I don't
know that it would changeanything for me. Now, I am aware
of the whole boundary thing andI'm aware of my mass. But now I

(44:19):
in at this point in my life. Idon't care so much about what
other people do. I think I weara mask less as I go out and
about my life. And I don't Idon't know. I don't know I'm I'm
still thinking do I care whatother people think. I don't care

(44:41):
what other people I don't know.
Think. Let me think about thatone with my friends. You keep
going?

Jennifer Wong (44:48):
And I think it's I think I don't know if it's
always straight across theboard. I think it's situation
specific. And for me, it's moodspecific. Some days I'm feeling
great. I'm in touch with myself.
And nothing bothers me. Andother days I wake up tired, feel
like a bad mom feel like aterrible employee and everything
bothers me. So I, it's notsomething that's always straight

(45:11):
across, and I definitely don'tdo it right all the time. That's
for damn sure. And the otherthing when I had said, When do
we jump in, when we're notasked, and my biggest thing is
with my children, and whoever myromantic partner is my two worst
places for me to set boundaries.

(45:36):
The worst, it's hard for you,everybody else is fine. Like I
Oh, you know, I can be there Ican listen, I can process with
you, I can do whatever you want.
You know, I love you no matterwhat. But for whatever reason,
the people in my house in myspace, not so much. I have a
harder time just being who youknow, I'm just here to listen.

(45:56):
But I'm, I'm getting better,especially with my older
daughter, she is really leavingthe nest. The apron strings are
cut, we are really separating.
And it's very hard for mebecause we were very, very close
for a really long time. And nowat 21. She's She's flying away,

(46:17):
you know, in all met physically,mentally, emotionally,
spiritually. She's on her ownpath. And it's hard. But it is.
But I get to practice this withher now. So when she does take
the time to involve me in herlife, I'm just really careful
not to start offering solutions,and to just listen until she

(46:40):
asks, and then if I seesomething come up, I'll ask
like, Do you want any my inputon this? Or? And if not, I'm
happy to just listen, I justwant to know what you need for
me. In this conversation?

Charity Rodriguez (46:55):
Do you feel that your bond is strong enough
that she may just be flying thecoop for a little bit, but it'll
you know, come back around?

Jennifer Wong (47:07):
I don't know. You know, because I can't guarantee
anything. I mean, I'm hopeful. Isee that that's probably likely.
But there's a piece of me for myown protection that I have to be
prepared that she won't. And Istill need to live my life and I
still need to love myself and Istill need to do the things I
want to do. That's kind of wheremy self talk is. Like, yeah, I

(47:29):
would hope that and I'm Yes. Andif there is a small chance that
I'm wrong, and this is thebeginning of a big separation. I
have to be okay with that too. Ihave to

Charity Rodriguez (47:44):
when you went away to college, I imagine you
you left home or whatever. Andyou were in your college face.
Whether you were there part timeor full time or whatever. When
college was over, did you comeback around to home or were you
still on your I need to get evenfurther away from home. Whatever

(48:08):
that may have looked like

Jennifer Wong (48:12):
my situation was dramatically different. My
relationship to my mom was like180 degrees different than my
relationship to my olderdaughter. So I just always
wanted to leave. I couldn't begone long enough far enough. But
I, I really felt very connectedto my extended family. I loved
them. So I mean, you know,you've been at our gatherings. I

(48:36):
loved I would do my damnedest tomake sure to be at every
gathering in every event. But,you know, inside my home, it was
it was violent. It was crazy. Itwasn't terrible, but it must
have been enough to make me wantto leave. You know, I thought I

(48:59):
could do anything I could dowhatever it takes to get out of
here. i As soon as I could getmy license, I was like, oh, and
once I got a car, I was gone. Iwas gone. Gone, Gone. Gone. Gone
as much as I possibly could.
Yeah. And then coming back, Iwould come back for the extended
family gatherings. I didn'treally look forward to hanging
out with my nuclear family.

(49:19):
Although my parents weredivorced by then. So it was kind
of just Yeah. I was in no hurryto come back. Okay. What about
you

Charity Rodriguez (49:36):
know, when I was a teen, and I was going off
to college, I was just like,yes. Reedham I had so many. I
had a lot of responsibilities,and I had a lot of boundaries
that I had to stay with them. SoI I couldn't date not that I was

(49:58):
trying to date again. Nobody wasasking Y'all are nothing but
good. I couldn't date I couldn'tgo far I couldn't be out of the
house late. Like it literallywas like, go to school, come
home, go to school go home. Thenwhen I went off to college, I
went to school, but on after,you know, on the breaks, I come
home and I'd just be home.
Everyone else is like, on theirbreaks meeting up with their old

(50:20):
friends and their pals. And youknow, whatever. And I had
reverted back to my 16 year oldself before I went off to
college. Okay, I'm just here athome. Yes, mommy, no, Papi, what
do you need me to do? Like, wewere just doing our chores and
responsibility. I wasn'tsuddenly like, I can drive and
I'm taking off to go there. Iwasn't going anywhere. Like I

(50:43):
was just at home. Like, okay, sowhen I left college was like
this out, like, what? I'm reallyout of here. And then I left.
So, but then I was talking withmy younger sister. And she was

(51:03):
like, she was at college orsomething by that point. And
she's talking about how she wastalking to my mom. And I was
like, you talked to my momcalled you? And she's like, No,
I called her I was like you did?
Like, would you do that for you?
Like, just touch base and seehow they're doing to see what's
going on? And I was like, Oh, Inever occurred. Like, just call

(51:25):
it like, Hey, Mom, what's goingon? So I, that's when I was
like, I should call home. Okay,just let them know. I'm okay,
and what's going on? So that waslike four or five, six years
before I was like, Hey, Mom,how's it going? What are y'all

(51:46):
doing what's going on at home?
And it took, you know, a whileto get comfortable with me
calling and talking to my mom.
Because up until that point, Iwasn't sharing anything with my
mom. My mom didn't knowanything. Not that nothing. No
way. No. How about who I was,what I was doing or not doing?
She didn't know anything. Likethe only time I ever called when

(52:09):
I was at school was there's abreak. I'm coming home, I have
to come home. Okay, how are yougoing to get home? Well, okay,
I'll try to see if somebody cancan give me a ride to the
meeting point there was ameeting place. Okay, they didn't
know this was before cell phonesand all that stuff. So it was

(52:30):
just like, Okay, I'm going to beat the meeting place. They said
that we should be there by likefive o'clock, that somebody's
going to be there. Okay. We'llsee. How was it? It wasn't like,
yes, your father's going tobecause my mom wouldn't drive
that distance to go get us. Itwould have to be my father. So
it was like, I my friend, wejust dropped me off in this
empty parking lot. And I'd belike, Okay, bye. They're like,

(52:51):
yeah, yeah, don't worry aboutit. Yeah, they're on their way.
There'll be here any minute. Iwould be there for like an hour,
two hours. Now you have a cellphone. I was just like waiting,
hoping somebody would show up.
They did come and pick me up.
But it was that kind ofsituation. I'm like, okay. Oh,
thanks. You know, that there wasno, sorry, you're sorry, I'm

(53:14):
late. You know, it was justlike, okay, and get in the car
and then just go home. So yeah,I was like, I have a car, I
could go do things. I havepeople that, you know, I'm I was
setting up how I wanted to haverelationships and communications
with people. Like, if I say, I'mgoing to be somewhere at five

(53:35):
o'clock, you're going to bethere at five o'clock, you know,
to pick me up and not just like,somebody will be there. We'll
figure it out. Don't worry aboutit. So, yeah, it didn't, it
didn't occur to me, but mysister, my younger sister had a
different relationship with my,my mom, like we all had
different relationships with,you know, my mom, they're all in

(53:56):
different places, in time, with,you know, all the children with
their financial situation withwhatever. So, by the time my
younger sister was going off toschool, my parents were retired.
And, you know, they were justlike, oh, Florida retirement,
okay, you know, so they havemore time to talk to her get

(54:17):
more engaged with her. But whenI was you know, growing up and
doing my thing, it there wasn'tany everybody was working. And
it was just go, go, go, go, go,go, go, go go. So, yeah, but I
did circle back around. I can'tI came back I called I started
calling and I and then I loved Imean, it took a few years but I

(54:40):
miss those conversations. I lovecalling and Hey, Mom, what's
going on and how you doing? Andshe didn't offer a lot of
advice. She just my mom was agossip. Gossip. It was just
like, Oh, what do you have goingon? So she didn't want to do
that tell you you tell herstory. She wanted you to
entertain her with whatever wasgoing on in your life. And so I

(55:02):
had to be a little careful withthat, because she did not. Like
I could say, Don't tell anybody.
Okay. And then I show up a weeklater to a roomful of people
talking about my business. Like,why did you know that what the
only person I told was mom, andI didn't go and tell my mom. I

(55:26):
told you not to tell anybody. Ididn't tell anybody. Or anyone,
I don't know. Maybe you tellsomebody else. So there, there's
I guess where my boundary, I seta boundary? Like, this is what
you need to know. Everybody inmy family was on a need to know

(55:48):
basis. Yeah. And I had to testthem out. Like I really did. I
want to give them some fakeinformation and be like, Okay,
let's see. I told you one thing.
I told you one thing. Let's seewhat comes back. Who it comes
back from? Yeah. And then nowNo, right. For the kind of game
that I had to be playing tofigure out like, what should I

(56:10):
say? What can I say? What can Inot say? Yeah. No, I'm thinking
about that. Like, oh, my god,that is a that is not good. But
that's what I needed to do.

Jennifer Wong (56:31):
All right, and we do the best we can. I mean,
we're doing what we need to do.
But the other thing that Ilearned about boundaries is I
don't have to tell everybody,everything I'm feeling all the
time. Oh, yeah. I don't Ithought I had to be so honest.

Charity Rodriguez (56:45):
Yes. No, that's,

Jennifer Wong (56:47):
I don't, I don't need to tell everybody
everything all the time. I don'tneed to do that. And my life got
so much easier, because then.
And I think that was also partof, I think, in within the
boundaries realm is this thingof building trust, right, we
need to know who to trust overtime, you know, and like you
tested it out. So you knew whonot to trust right there you

(57:10):
test. I think Brene Brown talksabout the marble jar about, you
know, when you have a friendshipevery time you share a little
more and get a little morevulnerable. And you find that
that person doesn't use itagainst you or sandbag you, the
marble in the jar. And thenevery time they do they put a
marble in the jar and you buildthe jar full of marbles. And

(57:30):
then when it gets high enoughthat you start to trust it. And
then there's more of a freereport, vulnerability, sharing,
you know, but you have to buildit up, it isn't something that
happens. I know. I would like dotrauma bonding. So I would find
somebody that maybe had asimilar trauma in their life,
and we'd share and share andshare and I'd be all open. And

(57:52):
then I would feel likeexhausted. And that person may
not ever talk to me again,because I just shared too much.
And it was really embarrassing.
And I couldn't figure it out.
Because in my mind, I thoughtWhoo, we really shared about
deep, dark things. I was sovulnerable, and they seem to be
vulnerable with me, how comewe're not still talking. And

(58:13):
that wasn't good, either. Idon't need to tell everybody
everything all the time. I needto be more discerning and more
focused on what is important tome, you know, and so sometimes
even now I have the challenge ofam I being authentic and
vulnerable? If I'm not sayingthese things, am I withholding?

(58:34):
Now? It's always tricky, Ithink. I think it's tricky.
Depends on the day and theperson and my mood and how
checked in Am I on myself today?
Or am I just checking in oneverything outside of myself?

Charity Rodriguez (58:54):
But okay, I like that about checking in on
yourself, or are you checking inon everything else outside
because yeah, I have a lot ofdays like that, where it's all
about everything else, but meand it really needs to be about
the self that day. But okay,with communicating and talking
and sharing with people. That'sa hard one because I feel as as

(59:19):
human beings, we want to connectwith others. We want to share
and try to form some kind ofbond or just just connect. And
that connection may be thatyou're spelling out your guts,
because you haven't had anyoneelse to spill your guts to, you

(59:41):
know, and it's just like the potis overflowing and it's just now
at the boiling point and it'sjust going to all move. Come
out. And that one's hard becauseI don't I don't want now I'm
thinking about it. And I don'twant someone now To share
something with me because, likeif they need to get something

(01:00:04):
off their chest, I mean, I'd beable to help them. I mean, I
have the answer. But if theyreally just in that moment need
to just get something off theirchest. That's okay. No, is that
not?

Jennifer Wong (01:00:16):
I think so. I mean, I think so. I mean, it's
so specific to each individualbecause we're so unique. Right?
And it depends. It just depends.
And I, and I'm not. And I don'tknow, for me, I feel it. I know
when I'm just blue. Because I'mnot connected to myself. I'm not
being mindful. I'm not consciousof where I'm at. Versus when I
am conscious, which I hope it'swhen I do these podcasts that I

(01:00:40):
am saying something vulnerable.
That is that is safe, that isauthentic, that is real, that is
appropriate for the moment,right. Yeah, I don't know. I
think, for me, I had to gothrough a lot of error, trial
and error, trial and error,trial and error and forgive

(01:01:01):
myself for the errors becauseI'd feel this deep shame.
Sometimes it's like, oh, I stillfeel that sometimes when I have
to say, No, I feel like I walkaway. Like, I'm all puckered up
and just know. But then Irealized, no, that was what I
needed to do. And usually, it'sall fine. Like, usually, it's

(01:01:21):
all fine. My head mate, makes mebelieve that 90% of the time,
it's not going to be fine. Butit's actually the other way
around. When I test it.

Charity Rodriguez (01:01:31):
Tested. Do you think that's an anxiety
thing?

Jennifer Wong (01:01:36):
I think anxiety comes along with it, for sure.
Absolutely. Anxiety is what mademe say yes to everything.

Charity Rodriguez (01:01:42):
Yeah, yeah, no, yeah. Because I

Jennifer Wong (01:01:45):
want to belong. I want people to like me, because
I have this intrinsic need tobelong. I think Brene Brown says
that too. There's two thingsthat all humans intrinsically
need. love and belonging. So howmuch are we being inauthentic to
get people to love us and let usbelong

Charity Rodriguez (01:02:06):
to the post, but I think that when I hit 50,
that's where I stopped. Thinkingabout other people, like I had
to reevaluate myself reevaluatewhere I was in life. And I. And
I don't want to say, I have allthe love I need. I just I have

(01:02:27):
love. I do have love right now.
And me constantly thinking aboutother people and what they think
about me, and will they love meor not love me when I wasn't
like I was more invested in whatthey were thinking about me than
they were with me. Like, that'swhen I realized. And I read
this, you know, that I wasgiving away my power to them for

(01:02:49):
whatever. Well, the reason wasthat I wanted to be light,
right? I wanted people to likeme. And I, I didn't, I was
talking about that for thelongest time. Like I just, I
wanted my friends, I wanted myfriends, I wanted my friend. And
I wanted people to like me. ButI realized every time I do
things, to be out there to beengaged to do all these things.

(01:03:14):
It's me doing all this stuff,not everybody else. Like it
wouldn't be like a one timething. We'd get together, we
talk we chat. And then I wouldsay like, Let's get together
again. Let's do this again. Thatwas so much fun. Okay, yeah,
sure. And then you never hearfrom people again. And then I
back in the day would be the onecalling and organizing. And

(01:03:37):
let's get together. And let's dothis. And let's go here. And
sure enough, people would showup. But when I didn't do that,
right, nobody picked up thephone to do anything. And it
just took me all those years torealize, okay, you know what,
enough is enough. I don't wantto do that anymore. I'm tired of

(01:03:58):
doing that. I really like if itbut we've moved around a lot
like my family has moved arounda lot. So I understand. It's
really hard to keep friendshipsand whatnot from long distance.
So I had to just let that go. Icouldn't be angry and upset with
people. You know, because ofthat. We're going to continue
moving around and going on, youknow, with life. So I can't say

(01:04:21):
that it's gonna get easier tomake friends be like, not like,
I don't care anymore about that,like wherever we go next. It's
just about learning about theplace that I'm at, enjoying the
great outdoors and the locationand whatever it has to offer.

(01:04:43):
But I'm, I'm good. So I'm justlike, I just need to go out and
see the world. I just want tosee and hear people's stories
because there's so many things.
I mean, I get listed fairlysheltered and sort of insular
life. And I just want to seenow, I want to hear.

Jennifer Wong (01:05:08):
And that's beautiful. That's like a nice
example of wisdom. I mean, we'vebeen five decades on this
planet, God, hope we got somewisdom going on here. And I feel
the same way. And it's so funnybecause I've been fine kind of
doing my things on my own. I'm,I have no problem, like going to

(01:05:28):
a movie by myself or eating at arestaurant by myself. But as
I've gotten older, I've seen therichness of sharing it with
somebody that I have created afriendship with, or a connection
with. I really enjoy that now.
And I don't have a ton offriends. And I'm the same way. I
think somebody called me Cindy,the cruise director, member from

(01:05:50):
The Love Boat. Yeah, always theone that was like, Hey, let's do
this. And hey, let's do that.
And, and in the beginning, I wasalways afraid, because people
wouldn't say yes, or and I tookit so personal. But I just kept
doing it. And the other thing,what I realized, when I started
getting more friends on boardwas, the more I was vulnerable

(01:06:14):
with them. Because I did aftermy little trauma, bonding
things, I thought, I'm nevergonna say anything to people.
And then I closed up like aclam, and then I couldn't get
into community. And I keptwondering why. And then finally,
I started being more vulnerableand sharing a little bit more
about my about what's not good,because it's so easy to show up,
and everything's great. Andyou're the silver lining person

(01:06:36):
in your life is good. And you'rejust talking about gratitudes.
That's easy. But then whenthere's an opening, and there's
an opportunity to say, you know,this is what's going on, and it
kind of sucks. And you give theCliff's Notes version, people
kind of go Oh, yeah, you know,and someone had I, in my
relationships, I had to openthat door, I had to become

(01:07:00):
slightly vulnerable. And thenthere was reciprocity. And like,
even still, some people itdidn't work some people did.
It's just I feel like I'm aconstant experiment in my life.
So just see what works. Whatdoesn't

Charity Rodriguez (01:07:15):
like that constant experiment in life. I
did not, I guess I have a fearof rejection. I do not open up
as much to people. Because I'vehad a few experiences where I'd
like talking to people or youknow, I'm, I'm exposing myself,
I'm being vulnerable. And thereaction was not what I wanted,

(01:07:40):
or I expected. So I yeah, I justdon't and, and it's not like
fear rejection, but it's the Ireally need you right now. Like,
I have something I don't ask fora lot of things. I've done
someone that asked for a lot ofhelp. Yeah, I don't ask for a

(01:08:01):
lot of help. I tried to solveeverything myself or fix it, or
just figure it out on my own.
Because that's just what I'mused to doing. But I feel like
when I do ask for help, it'slike, you should know like, oh,
yeah, you know what, charitydoesn't ask up a lot. And here
she is asking for help. Thismust be really serious, like,
how can I help you? But I'vedone that, right. That's me

(01:08:24):
thinking for other people.
That's me projecting my ownthoughts until other people
that's know how people are goingabout their life and what
they're doing and what'shappening. So I recognize that
now. But in the few instanceswhere I have reached out for
some help, and I didn't get thatresponse, or that what I needed

(01:08:45):
it, that's hurt. That's reallyhurt. So I try, I know that I
try not to set myself up to bein that situation again. So I I
can't, I mean, I that's how I'mlike, I could have been walking
down the street, impaled bysomething. And I will not be

(01:09:09):
yelling out help. I'll just belike, well, I guess I gotta just
get myself to the hospital. SoI'll speed up by walking, get to
the car and just drive myselfthere because I like what's the
weight? And so that I dorecognize that I am honest with
myself that I know that I dothat. I don't know at this late
day and age, like, Is theregonna change? Do I need to

(01:09:30):
change them? Maybe yes, maybe?
No, I don't know. I'm doingokay. Yeah.

Jennifer Wong (01:09:39):
Yeah. That's great. And I think maybe
situations do different thingsas a single mom, I I needed a
community. You know, it's takenme years, though it's taken a
decade to really have acommunity because I was
thinking, the ultimate test forme I have to get a colonoscopy

(01:10:01):
coming up here and put it offforever. And I think I need a
ride. My daughter's gone tocollege, I don't have a husband,
I don't have a boyfriend. Whowould I asked to pick me up. And
I thought, God, maybe there'snobody I'll have to Uber. But
that's not true. I probably havefive or six people I could ask.
And I thought, all right. Allright. That's cool. I was super

(01:10:25):
grateful. I was like, that'sawesome. I actually have
probably five people I couldcall men and women was pretty
awesome. But I was out a lot tothat support group to it helped
me. But speaking of boundaries,we are over the one hour mark.
So we probably wrap this babyup. Okay.

Charity Rodriguez (01:10:45):
Yes, we are done. I think, how do you want
to sum it up? How do you want tosum up today?

Jennifer Wong (01:10:56):
I guess it would be where I mean for myself, I
continue to ask, you know, howdo I hold my boundaries? What do
I hold boundaries on? And Ithink the implementation is
probably the hardest part forme. Using the words to say no,
in a way where it's still kindand loving. But I know that I

(01:11:18):
have to put myself first withoutfeeling guilty.

Charity Rodriguez (01:11:20):
Yes. And make sure that when you're giving you
know you're giving up your timegiving up your resources, giving
your attention the emotions thatyou're also giving to yourself.
Right? Yes. Be giving toyourself. Be kind and have grace

(01:11:42):
with yourself. Try not to takethings personally.

Jennifer Wong (01:11:49):
Absolutely.

Charity Rodriguez (01:11:53):
And I heard this one. Don't confuse being
nice with letting people useyou. Yes. Huge. That's a big
one.

Jennifer Wong (01:12:03):
Huge, huge and don't compare your insides with
other people's outsides. See,no. No is a complete sentence.
Yes, I'm not and it's a sign ofself love.

Charity Rodriguez (01:12:20):
There you go.
All right, people. Thank youvery much for joining us.

Jennifer Wong (01:12:26):
Yes, thank you keep being effing honest.

Charity Rodriguez (01:12:31):
Yay. Thank you for listening to being
effing honest with your hosts,Jennifer Wong and charity
Rodriguez. Subscribe to our showwherever you listen to podcasts.
And if you have a suggestion,question or topic you want us to
talk about, connect with us atwww being effing honest.com And
until next time, we hope you'realways being effing honest