February 15, 2024 • 28 mins
The Rubin family, spanning three generations at Congregation Rodeph Sholom, open up about their pursuit of belonging, and the celebration of their roots. Throughout this episode, the stories of Gabin Rubin, Samantha Chinn and Asher Rubin, unfold as a tapestry woven with the threads of Jewish identity, family legacy, and the universal human quest for acceptance.
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Rabbi Ben Spratt (00:04):
The human story is the search for
belonging, from childhood toadulthood, in joy and in
struggle.
We all sit in questions of howto make sense of it all.
What is our place?
Why are we here?
What is our story of searching?
Join us in conversation withcommunity members each sharing
some of their own story.
(00:25):
I am Ben Spratt and this isbelonging.
It is an honor today to be inconversation with the Rubin
family.
So this is a three generationfamily here at Rodeph Sholom and
I'm getting to sit here withGabin, with Samantha and with
(00:48):
Asher.
Asher, the youngest member ofthe family here, is a sixth
grader at Rodeph Sholom Schooland we go back through Gabin
growing up here and all the wayto your parents, Marcia and
Chuck True Foundation StonesLegends here at Rodeph Sholom
and to have all three of you inconversation as we get to
(01:09):
explore your family searches forbelonging.
So, gabin, I thought we couldstart with you.
I would love to hear a bit ofyour journey and a bit of your
own search to find your place ofhome and belonging.
Gabin (01:24):
It actually began before I had a chance to even think
about that question.
My dad came from a Orthodoxbackground and when he and my
mom got married, my mom camefrom a very loosely Jewish
family.
They were culturally more thanreligiously Jewish and there had
(01:47):
to be a compromise and anunderstanding as to how they
would raise a family.
And they found Rodeph Sholomand it checked the boxes that
there was enough tradition andenough reform, and it for me, it
(02:11):
gave me a sense of belonging toa Jewish community, and it's
been something that has beenunderlying in my life since I
was about four years old.
As a result, my parents sent meto Rodeph Sholom school, so I
(02:32):
got a Jewish education as well.
At the time it was only throughsixth grade and I never thought
that my own child would be ableto go to Rodeph Sholom, and
that's been a true blessing thatI was able to continue what I
(02:57):
consider to be a Jewishcommunity, an Upper West Side
community, a faith community.
The only disappointment in ourlife cycles is that when my now
wife and I got married, it wasfirst off not legal in New York
(03:20):
yet and it was not permitted atRodeph Sholom for same sex
couples to be married on theBEMA, so we were not able to get
married at the place that Ifelt I belonged, which was
something that was difficult,because it was a place that I
(03:44):
was supposed to belong and Icouldn't even share one of the
most you know, one of thehighlights of my life and the
ability to get married, and Icouldn't do that in the place
that I found belonging.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (04:03):
And you know, years later now, it's almost
impossible for carregans toimagine that that was ever even
a concern or a consideration.
And I think it's important insome ways because it also
creates this feeling of almosterasure of your own pain that
you went through, of what it isto see a community that I think,
(04:24):
across generations has alwayssaid this is a place of
belonging, and sometimes weforget just how far we've come
in opening wider those doors,and it makes me wonder what are
the doors that are right nowclosed, that need to be opened?
And you know, 20 years from now, who's going to be talking
about the way that we've been,you know, barring and creating
(04:44):
that restriction of belonging.
So how did you come to termswith that A community that had
you'd grown up in, that you had,you know, run up and down those
BIMA steps that had said thisis your place, you're a leader
in this place, and then to feellike the door was being closed
in your face.
How did you handle thatemotionally?
Gabin (05:04):
It was tough because it wasn't just being a member of a
congregation.
My mom was very involved in thetemple.
She started a school store,then she segued into working in
the executive office as adirector for many years, until
she retired.
So this was a place that wasn'tjust a place of worship.
(05:29):
It was a place where everyoneknew me, not just because I went
to school, but because I workedat the shop and everyone knew
my mom.
So I was Marcia's daughter, mydad was Marcia's husband and we
were all members of RodephSholom as well.
Samantha (05:52):
You had said you know that it must be very painful but
in all fairness, at that pointin time that was kind of the
norm so, as it was just reality.
So even though it wasdisappointing, it wasn't as
upsetting as it is now lookingback saying I wish that would
have been part of our memory Tohave that butt.
(06:14):
We were very fortunate becauseat the time Rodeph Sholom also
had an out rabbi in CamilleAngel and we were very fortunate
to be able to pull the Rode ofcommunity, even in a limited
capacity, into our ceremony backthen by having her officiate
our wedding.
Gabin (06:33):
And, as an aside, rabbi Levine was the rabbi at the time
and, even though he couldn'tparticipate in it and he was
very supportive of our bond, hewas there as moral support.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (06:50):
I love that and I do think that it is one of
the magical elements is to seeone of those rare spaces in our
world where so many differentstories can come together to
collide.
And I will just say, on anaside maybe one of the things we
need to think about in thefuture is like a renewal of vows
ceremony or something that canbring your love into the
(07:11):
heartbeat of the synagogue.
Gabin (07:12):
For number 50, we'll do that Number 50.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (07:14):
OK, I'm going to hold that.
I'll put that on my calendar.
Ok.
So, and Samantha, I would loveto hear your own search.
Some of that search hasobviously led you to be a part
of this Rodeph Sholom family,but we'd love to hear the
broader arc of your search forbelonging.
Samantha (07:28):
My family is Jewish, much to Gabin.
Shock and surprise sometimes.
Even despite the chin last name, I did have questions of
belonging early on due to nothaving a father present and
regardless of what happened withall that, it's part of who I am
.
It's definitely part of how Iam.
(07:48):
My mom met another man namedSteven Chin who she married and
he adopted us legally and hebecame our father and he came
from England.
They were much more religiousthan my family, my mom, where we
were raised with a Christmastree, christmas tree going into
churches.
We did go to temple some, butwe were not raised to be
(08:13):
religious in any way.
And then when she married himhe said he wanted us to keep our
midst, but really benign midst.
But my brother and I I had nobackground in Jewish day school,
none of that, and ended up witha private tutor for two years
who was actually a concentrationcamp survivor and I think that
(08:35):
whole experience reallyconnected with me, about
connecting me to Judaism.
For two years we underwentserious tutoring and really
learned not only how to readHebrew and do our portions but
also what it meant and theconnection between the Holocaust
and where we were today.
And because of that.
I think that's part of why itshows going to Brandeis
(08:57):
University there was thatresonance, even though there
were some aspects that werequite surprising.
Going to a very Jewish school,I learned so much more about
Judaism and our culture and ourpeople and when I met Gabin, we
laughed because Gabin was raisedto be much more religious than
(09:18):
I was.
However, I was bar but shewasn't, and we always used to
laugh about that.
I could read Hebrew, shecouldn't, but she has since
rectified right Rodeph throughSholom.
It's been really cool, but oncewe met and she brought me to
Rodeph, Rodeph became a part ofmy world and it wasn't just
(09:41):
through the relationship, it wasthrough all the different
activities getting to know therabbis, getting to know
different congregants.
I found some alums fromBrandeis who have parents in the
congregation and it was allthese little connections that
further cemented us and I wouldsay probably, Gabin, you might
(10:01):
feel the same way.
Even if it was hard not beingmarried in Rodeph, what was
amazing was actually havingAsher's baby naming on the Bema,
with all of our families, withrabbis and cantors, and having
such an incredible celebrationthat in many ways I forget about
the wedding aspect and I focusmostly on the greatest joy of
(10:25):
our lives, of our lives Asherbeing born, coming into our
family and having our babynaming there and having that
memory.
Gabin (10:33):
Don't you remember that, Asher?
No?
Samantha (10:37):
Be my baby.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (10:39):
Asher, you just got to hear a little bit of
the search for belonging ofyour parents here, but I'd love
to ask the question of you andthat might feel a little silly
for a sixth grader but I'mcurious for you where do you
find your place of belonging andwhat do you feel like you're
searching for?
Asher (10:53):
I think I find a lot of my belonging at Rodeph Sholom
too.
It feels a little bit specialbecause my family has been here
for so long and now I'm here andI'm going to be bar mitzvahed
here.
We're one of the few familiesI've actually been here for this
long, and in the lobby of theschool it shows all of the
(11:17):
people who've graduated fromRodeph Sholom since
no-transcript, whenever itstarted, and my mom's name is up
there and it's always so coolto see it up there and know that
, like she was here too.
Gabin (11:32):
Unfortunately it says the year that I was here too.
I.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (11:36):
Mean.
You know, 2012 isn't that longago.
Samantha (11:40):
But you know also, I asked her you went here from
basically preschool, yeah, andwhat was in the flake in that
building?
Do you remember what was inthere?
That you would pass all thetime and See your grandparents
names on it?
Asher (11:54):
Oh, the, the fish, it the aquarium.
Gabin (11:56):
Yeah, the aquarium.
It was donated by Mimi andPoppy.
Asher (12:00):
It's very cool and I I still remember being here when I
was a little kid, becausesometimes we come here for
basketball practices and we gointo the gym and I remember how
we used to think that it was sobig, but now it's just a tiny
little gym you know, and againto go and see how these spaces
have evolved and changed overtime.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (12:19):
You know, the fifth floor does not look
anything like it used to and yetwe have an echo of that fish
tank now at 84 streets.
I think that's also one of thethings that's amazing about
Having legacy buildings, as weget to see that these are walls
that go back generations and yetwhat we do inside them is Is
(12:40):
both a continuation and aconstant evolution.
And I feel, like Asher, you getto feel that every day here at
Vodersholm school, experiencinga very different school than the
one, gabin, that youexperienced, and yet there's
still this through line ofJewish values, the through line
of Learning and debate and whatis to be part of larger
community and so, asher, I'mcurious for you Growing up here
(13:05):
in New York City and it's aslightly different era than
growing up in, you know, inCalifornia For you, what does it
feel like to grow up here inNew York?
What's your feeling about NewYork City?
Asher (13:16):
I really it's Like it's not perfect but I find it
perfect.
There are definitely thingswrong with it, but to me I just
feel like I belong here.
Honestly to me, when, like, ifthere's just a lot of freedom
here, like I can just walkaround with my friends sometimes
and we can just like go out andget food like Some in some
(13:40):
cities, like people just can'tdo that like you can actually
walk places, you don't need todrive everywhere and and we walk
pretty fast.
Gabin (13:48):
from what I hear from out of Towners is that I was
recently asked why do NewYorkers always seem so angry?
And I said we're not angry,we're trying to get someplace.
Asher (13:58):
Yeah, and.
Gabin (14:03):
Do you feel that New York City is maybe even more special
, having had the ability to liveelsewhere during COVID?
Asher (14:11):
Yeah, definitely I.
I missed, I Missed the city.
But I feel like it was nice tohave a little bit of a break
With without like all the noiseand stuff.
But sometimes there's so quietthere that it would like creep
me out at night.
I was just like why is it soquiet Instead of there being
(14:34):
like honking and sirens andeverything.
But I feel like it was kind ofnice to have a little bit of a
break from the city.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (14:42):
So I'm curious , because one of the things that
made me fall in love with NewYork City Is that every day I
can encounter so many differentlayers of humanity, so many
different kinds of people, somany different backgrounds and
languages and smells and flavorsand Personality types and some
people that's reallyoverwhelming.
But for those of us who lovethat, there's nothing quite so
(15:05):
dazzling.
So I'm curious for you, asherwhat do you find about a city
that's a mixed multitude of somany different threads and
stories and backgrounds?
Asher (15:18):
Um, I feel like there's a very big homeless community
here and even just giving adollar to someone Could like
make their day and really helpthem, and I really like that
feeling of like helping someone.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (15:35):
You know, and I think you know asher in that
is, you know you're growing up,getting to experience, for
example, people without homes,and start to see that they are a
part of your life in yourneighborhood, and the reality is
that this is also means youhave to keep your eyes open to
see Both what are the thingsthat others lack and also what
are the blessings that you havethat come with responsibility.
(15:56):
I love this idea that you'rethinking okay, what are the ways
that I would appreciate helpand times of need, and therefore
, when I see another personthat's in need where I can Do
something, I'm obligated to it.
It's a very different mentalitythan kind of the one I grew up
in, where we were kind of taughtyou have to go and beat saviors
of the world and you'reactually lifting up, I think, a
much healthier ethic, which is,ultimately, this is about saying
(16:19):
we're knitted together, we'rebonded together and you know, if
I'm going to ever Hope thatsomebody will be there for me, I
better start by living by beingthere for other people.
So I'm curious how you feelthat in other ways in life.
Samantha (16:32):
How do?
Rabbi Ben Spratt (16:32):
you kind of feel that ethic of being there
for other people and havingother people there for you.
Are there other settings whereyou feel that?
See that I.
Asher (16:41):
Feel like at school, like everyone's always there for
each other, no matter whathappens at Rodeph Sholom,
there's very little bullyinglike pretty much none and people
are always here for each other.
Like if somebody falls down thestairs, people offer to take
them to the nurse and help.
(17:02):
If somebody gets hurt at recess, they offer for help and they
help them up, and I feel thatthat's really great.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (17:11):
Say Ashlee, you've grown up with the
blessing of the most amazingparents in the world.
Right yeah, absolutely,absolutely 100%.
And you've grown up with a clearsense of home, of belonging, of
so many blessings, and I thinksometimes it's easy for people
to go in and look at all of thatblessing and assume that
(17:32):
everything is perfect.
Listen, Ashlee, you're a personthat I see walking around at
school with such confidence,such poise, a person who knows
who he is and knows his place inthis world.
It's really remarkable.
Very much the exact opposite ofmy experience at middle school.
I was the most insecure personprobably that's ever lived and I
look at that and I wonder doyou think that everyone really
(17:56):
knows what's going on up in hereand here?
Because I also know that someof that poise comes also from
having experienced struggle andI'm wondering if you'd be
willing to share a little withthat.
Asher (18:06):
Like during COVID, I really did feel like not
included with my friends and Ifeel, after all the online
classes, something that reallyhelps me find my belonging is
music, like finish my homeworkand play video games while I
listen to the music.
(18:26):
I like to listen to a lot ofrap and I feel like, again, it
would just clear my mind awayfrom thinking about how, like I
wasn't near any of my friendsand they were all hanging out,
but I wasn't, and it reallyhelps just like clear my mind
and get everything away, andthen I'm just like carefree.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (18:51):
As you probably know, in the kind of
like arc and history of hip hopand rap, one of the things
that's been interesting is thisongoing tension of to what
degree is it a medium of showingstrength and to what degree is
a medium of actually showingreal vulnerability, and that's
part of what has made itactually a form of music that
has brought such connection andeven community out into the
(19:13):
world.
And for you to actually be ableto feel that and channel that
yourself, I think is reallyimportant, asher.
So I'm wondering, you know,obviously every parent has a
different philosophy of how toface the struggles of the world
and how to help support our kids, and I'm curious for you both,
since you've watched your ownjourney.
You both have experienced yourown challenges in life.
(19:34):
You now get to have thepleasure of watching Asher grow
up in a probably even morevolatile and maybe even more
uncertain world.
How do you navigate this as afamily?
Gabin (19:45):
Day by day.
That's the first thing, and thesayings that you hear are very
true that there is no perfectand you sort of plug along, sort
of like a pinball, hoping tofind the solution.
(20:05):
And it's hard.
It's a much faster worldtechnology-wise, and kids learn
things much earlier in life thanwe did.
And it makes it very difficultas a parent because you feel
like when you put out one fire,another fire is right there
(20:29):
coming up, and music issomething that has done that as
well.
And now he listens to adifferent type of hip hop that,
while I don't personally approveof, nor does Samantha we
believe that it must give himsomething that we either aren't
(20:53):
at that moment or can't.
So we are more open maybe thanother parents to him listening
to that type of music.
Samantha (21:03):
So there are always going to be fires.
There's changes at every stage.
You think you've just gotteneverything under control and
something else happens.
But it's the same as when wewere kids, it's just different
challenges.
I think Gabin and I we have aphilosophy, number one, totally
embedded in a loving andsupported environment.
We both are people who are veryclose to our families.
(21:26):
It was very important to us tomaintain family from traditions.
Like we have Sunday night callsevery week with our family we
did through Zoom.
Before that it was in-personmeals.
Gabin's family lives across thestreet from us, so definitely
enmeshed in each other's livesto a certain degree.
(21:46):
So we knew family was key.
I think with raising Asher, wecare very much about being there
, no matter what the issue is.
Our approach is every day is afresh start, a new day.
If yesterday wasn't so great,today's a chance for it to be
better.
But making sure that, as Asherhas issues, as we have issues
(22:10):
talking about it as family.
Sometimes my mom will say Idon't know how you had that
conversation about drugs,breakups, problems, death,
relationships, friends not beingthere for you.
We made sure to talk thatthrough and figure out just
(22:32):
first emotions but then a plan,if there could be a plan, are
just being there to hear.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (22:38):
And I do really want to affirm that kind
of philosophy that you bring asparents, because fundamentally,
our kids, yes, are experiencingthings and having access to
things at an early age than mostof us did growing up.
But even beyond that, kids, intheir own ways, are tapped into
the very same emotions that weexperience as adults and we
(22:58):
often don't give them credit forthat.
They are experiencing loss andpain.
They are experiencing fear anduncertainty, and when we don't
create the environment wherethey can feel those feelings are
validated and put into acontext that is relatable, then
we miss this opportunity forthem to feel anchored,
especially in the moments whenthey need it most.
And I think about COVID, whichcertainly for some came with
(23:21):
some blessings, and I love thatyou as a family can both name
the blessings alongside the veryreal challenges that it posed.
And, asher, watching my own kidsthrough COVID, also separated
from their friends, they foundtheir own coping mechanisms, but
there was a loss that's almostimmeasurable and it's amazing to
see how quickly now, in aslightly different world, they
(23:44):
kind of bounce back intofriendship and relationship.
But nonetheless it means theyalready know the seeds of what
it feels like to really be alone, what it is to wonder, am I
going to ever really feel thatsense of belonging again?
And I wonder and I think maybethat's a little bit of what I
can see in you is, watching theway you kind of go through
school, I feel like you'reattuned to this idea that there
(24:07):
are people that might not walkin with the joy that you do.
And I think about again in someof those advisory conversations
the way that I think youactually know what it is to
bring people in, make sure thatpeople aren't left out, and I
think that's for me, I think oneof the most important ways of
responding to our life story iswhen we've experienced pain,
that that means that we want tobe more attuned to the pain of
(24:29):
others.
So, going back to you both fora moment as parents, what do you
feel like has been one of themost important things that you
have stumbled into learning asparents, things that maybe you
never imagined having to kind ofsit in and discover.
I'm curious.
Gabin (24:48):
I wish I was more like Asher at times.
There are times that I wish hewas more like me.
I think most parents feel thatway.
What I've always noticed is,since he was a little boy, he
would go into a room as if hewas already friends with the
(25:09):
people he was interacting with,and I have always been
uncomfortable first meetingpeople and I would usually try
to avoid those situations.
Asher's always been that personthat doesn't have fear like
that, and I think that says alot to why the last three years
(25:30):
at school, they've asked Asherto be the ambassador, if you
will, the welcoming committeefor the new kids joining the
school.
I think that they tapped intosomething that I'm talking about
is that you feel comfortable inwhat would normally be
uncomfortable situations.
Samantha (25:54):
I, by the way, I've always loved that too about him.
He is, he beats, he marches tothe beat of his own drummer and
he's that interestingcombination of confident and
strong but also kind, Like he'sinclusive, brings other kids in
to the point about being theambassador.
But a boy who has two moms,right, didn't have a dad, and
(26:17):
those questions would come upfrom the time he was young and
he handled it.
Gabin (26:21):
They still come up.
Samantha (26:22):
They still come up and you've always handled it really
beautifully and it's just oneof those things I think you
asked about.
What is one of the biggestthings learned as a parent?
I think it's realizing that ourjob and it's such a strange way
of thinking about it whenthey're young, they are your,
(26:43):
you are there everything andthey are your everything and
your whole job is to help themgrow up into these people.
Give them the gifts that theycan about who they are, the
confidence, the foundation fortheir values and their beliefs
and their way of going throughlife.
And then, basically, at acertain point, it's all about
(27:05):
letting go incrementally whilethey find themselves and we're,
I wanna say, left behind but toa certain extent, left to watch
them and revel in them.
But you are not that person inthe same way, and it's such a
humbling honor and experience todo that.
(27:27):
It's we're figuring that out.
It makes me a little teary, butrealizing like everything is
about them and yet it's not allabout them, because they can't
be that center, because it's toomuch for them.
They're part of the whole, buttheir whole story is ahead of
them and you're now watchingthem and helping them lift their
(27:48):
wings.
It's kinda cool.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (27:51):
Beautiful Samantha.
I think this is great.
Okay, we had a greatconversation.
Asher, this is a very weirdthing.
I'm just getting into thismyself, okay, so very weird
thing, but I wanna offer yougratitude, because it takes a
lot of courage to dive intotrying something new for the
first time, and I really wannaoffer gratitude to the two of
(28:12):
you for whatever crazygymnastics you did in your
schedule to make this work, andso grateful.
This was just fantastic, so,and thank you, jess, for making
it all possible.
Samantha (28:21):
Thank you, thank you.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (28:25):
Thank you for joining us and listening to this
story of belonging.
Stay connected with us onFacebook and Instagram.
You can find me on Twitter atBenHSpratt.
For more information about CRS,visit us online at rodephsholom
.
org.
The human story is the search for
belonging, from childhood toadulthood, in joy and in
struggle.
We all sit in questions of howto make sense of it all.
What is our place?
Why are we here?
What is our story of searching?
Join us in conversation withcommunity members each sharing
some of their own story.
(00:25):
I am Ben Spratt and this isbelonging.
It is an honor today to be inconversation with the Rubin
family.
So this is a three generationfamily here at Rodeph Sholom and
I'm getting to sit here withGabin, with Samantha and with
(00:48):
Asher.
Asher, the youngest member ofthe family here, is a sixth
grader at Rodeph Sholom Schooland we go back through Gabin
growing up here and all the wayto your parents, Marcia and
Chuck True Foundation StonesLegends here at Rodeph Sholom
and to have all three of you inconversation as we get to
(01:09):
explore your family searches forbelonging.
So, gabin, I thought we couldstart with you.
I would love to hear a bit ofyour journey and a bit of your
own search to find your place ofhome and belonging.
Gabin (01:24):
It actually began before I had a chance to even think
about that question.
My dad came from a Orthodoxbackground and when he and my
mom got married, my mom camefrom a very loosely Jewish
family.
They were culturally more thanreligiously Jewish and there had
(01:47):
to be a compromise and anunderstanding as to how they
would raise a family.
And they found Rodeph Sholomand it checked the boxes that
there was enough tradition andenough reform, and it for me, it
(02:11):
gave me a sense of belonging toa Jewish community, and it's
been something that has beenunderlying in my life since I
was about four years old.
As a result, my parents sent meto Rodeph Sholom school, so I
(02:32):
got a Jewish education as well.
At the time it was only throughsixth grade and I never thought
that my own child would be ableto go to Rodeph Sholom, and
that's been a true blessing thatI was able to continue what I
(02:57):
consider to be a Jewishcommunity, an Upper West Side
community, a faith community.
The only disappointment in ourlife cycles is that when my now
wife and I got married, it wasfirst off not legal in New York
(03:20):
yet and it was not permitted atRodeph Sholom for same sex
couples to be married on theBEMA, so we were not able to get
married at the place that Ifelt I belonged, which was
something that was difficult,because it was a place that I
(03:44):
was supposed to belong and Icouldn't even share one of the
most you know, one of thehighlights of my life and the
ability to get married, and Icouldn't do that in the place
that I found belonging.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (04:03):
And you know, years later now, it's almost
impossible for carregans toimagine that that was ever even
a concern or a consideration.
And I think it's important insome ways because it also
creates this feeling of almosterasure of your own pain that
you went through, of what it isto see a community that I think,
(04:24):
across generations has alwayssaid this is a place of
belonging, and sometimes weforget just how far we've come
in opening wider those doors,and it makes me wonder what are
the doors that are right nowclosed, that need to be opened?
And you know, 20 years from now, who's going to be talking
about the way that we've been,you know, barring and creating
(04:44):
that restriction of belonging.
So how did you come to termswith that A community that had
you'd grown up in, that you had,you know, run up and down those
BIMA steps that had said thisis your place, you're a leader
in this place, and then to feellike the door was being closed
in your face.
How did you handle thatemotionally?
Gabin (05:04):
It was tough because it wasn't just being a member of a
congregation.
My mom was very involved in thetemple.
She started a school store,then she segued into working in
the executive office as adirector for many years, until
she retired.
So this was a place that wasn'tjust a place of worship.
(05:29):
It was a place where everyoneknew me, not just because I went
to school, but because I workedat the shop and everyone knew
my mom.
So I was Marcia's daughter, mydad was Marcia's husband and we
were all members of RodephSholom as well.
Samantha (05:52):
You had said you know that it must be very painful but
in all fairness, at that pointin time that was kind of the
norm so, as it was just reality.
So even though it wasdisappointing, it wasn't as
upsetting as it is now lookingback saying I wish that would
have been part of our memory Tohave that butt.
(06:14):
We were very fortunate becauseat the time Rodeph Sholom also
had an out rabbi in CamilleAngel and we were very fortunate
to be able to pull the Rode ofcommunity, even in a limited
capacity, into our ceremony backthen by having her officiate
our wedding.
Gabin (06:33):
And, as an aside, rabbi Levine was the rabbi at the time
and, even though he couldn'tparticipate in it and he was
very supportive of our bond, hewas there as moral support.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (06:50):
I love that and I do think that it is one of
the magical elements is to seeone of those rare spaces in our
world where so many differentstories can come together to
collide.
And I will just say, on anaside maybe one of the things we
need to think about in thefuture is like a renewal of vows
ceremony or something that canbring your love into the
(07:11):
heartbeat of the synagogue.
Gabin (07:12):
For number 50, we'll do that Number 50.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (07:14):
OK, I'm going to hold that.
I'll put that on my calendar.
Ok.
So, and Samantha, I would loveto hear your own search.
Some of that search hasobviously led you to be a part
of this Rodeph Sholom family,but we'd love to hear the
broader arc of your search forbelonging.
Samantha (07:28):
My family is Jewish, much to Gabin.
Shock and surprise sometimes.
Even despite the chin last name, I did have questions of
belonging early on due to nothaving a father present and
regardless of what happened withall that, it's part of who I am
.
It's definitely part of how Iam.
(07:48):
My mom met another man namedSteven Chin who she married and
he adopted us legally and hebecame our father and he came
from England.
They were much more religiousthan my family, my mom, where we
were raised with a Christmastree, christmas tree going into
churches.
We did go to temple some, butwe were not raised to be
(08:13):
religious in any way.
And then when she married himhe said he wanted us to keep our
midst, but really benign midst.
But my brother and I I had nobackground in Jewish day school,
none of that, and ended up witha private tutor for two years
who was actually a concentrationcamp survivor and I think that
(08:35):
whole experience reallyconnected with me, about
connecting me to Judaism.
For two years we underwentserious tutoring and really
learned not only how to readHebrew and do our portions but
also what it meant and theconnection between the Holocaust
and where we were today.
And because of that.
I think that's part of why itshows going to Brandeis
(08:57):
University there was thatresonance, even though there
were some aspects that werequite surprising.
Going to a very Jewish school,I learned so much more about
Judaism and our culture and ourpeople and when I met Gabin, we
laughed because Gabin was raisedto be much more religious than
(09:18):
I was.
However, I was bar but shewasn't, and we always used to
laugh about that.
I could read Hebrew, shecouldn't, but she has since
rectified right Rodeph throughSholom.
It's been really cool, but oncewe met and she brought me to
Rodeph, Rodeph became a part ofmy world and it wasn't just
(09:41):
through the relationship, it wasthrough all the different
activities getting to know therabbis, getting to know
different congregants.
I found some alums fromBrandeis who have parents in the
congregation and it was allthese little connections that
further cemented us and I wouldsay probably, Gabin, you might
(10:01):
feel the same way.
Even if it was hard not beingmarried in Rodeph, what was
amazing was actually havingAsher's baby naming on the Bema,
with all of our families, withrabbis and cantors, and having
such an incredible celebrationthat in many ways I forget about
the wedding aspect and I focusmostly on the greatest joy of
(10:25):
our lives, of our lives Asherbeing born, coming into our
family and having our babynaming there and having that
memory.
Gabin (10:33):
Don't you remember that, Asher?
No?
Samantha (10:37):
Be my baby.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (10:39):
Asher, you just got to hear a little bit of
the search for belonging ofyour parents here, but I'd love
to ask the question of you andthat might feel a little silly
for a sixth grader but I'mcurious for you where do you
find your place of belonging andwhat do you feel like you're
searching for?
Asher (10:53):
I think I find a lot of my belonging at Rodeph Sholom
too.
It feels a little bit specialbecause my family has been here
for so long and now I'm here andI'm going to be bar mitzvahed
here.
We're one of the few familiesI've actually been here for this
long, and in the lobby of theschool it shows all of the
(11:17):
people who've graduated fromRodeph Sholom since
no-transcript, whenever itstarted, and my mom's name is up
there and it's always so coolto see it up there and know that
, like she was here too.
Gabin (11:32):
Unfortunately it says the year that I was here too.
I.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (11:36):
Mean.
You know, 2012 isn't that longago.
Samantha (11:40):
But you know also, I asked her you went here from
basically preschool, yeah, andwhat was in the flake in that
building?
Do you remember what was inthere?
That you would pass all thetime and See your grandparents
names on it?
Asher (11:54):
Oh, the, the fish, it the aquarium.
Gabin (11:56):
Yeah, the aquarium.
It was donated by Mimi andPoppy.
Asher (12:00):
It's very cool and I I still remember being here when I
was a little kid, becausesometimes we come here for
basketball practices and we gointo the gym and I remember how
we used to think that it was sobig, but now it's just a tiny
little gym you know, and againto go and see how these spaces
have evolved and changed overtime.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (12:19):
You know, the fifth floor does not look
anything like it used to and yetwe have an echo of that fish
tank now at 84 streets.
I think that's also one of thethings that's amazing about
Having legacy buildings, as weget to see that these are walls
that go back generations and yetwhat we do inside them is Is
(12:40):
both a continuation and aconstant evolution.
And I feel, like Asher, you getto feel that every day here at
Vodersholm school, experiencinga very different school than the
one, gabin, that youexperienced, and yet there's
still this through line ofJewish values, the through line
of Learning and debate and whatis to be part of larger
community and so, asher, I'mcurious for you Growing up here
(13:05):
in New York City and it's aslightly different era than
growing up in, you know, inCalifornia For you, what does it
feel like to grow up here inNew York?
What's your feeling about NewYork City?
Asher (13:16):
I really it's Like it's not perfect but I find it
perfect.
There are definitely thingswrong with it, but to me I just
feel like I belong here.
Honestly to me, when, like, ifthere's just a lot of freedom
here, like I can just walkaround with my friends sometimes
and we can just like go out andget food like Some in some
(13:40):
cities, like people just can'tdo that like you can actually
walk places, you don't need todrive everywhere and and we walk
pretty fast.
Gabin (13:48):
from what I hear from out of Towners is that I was
recently asked why do NewYorkers always seem so angry?
And I said we're not angry,we're trying to get someplace.
Asher (13:58):
Yeah, and.
Gabin (14:03):
Do you feel that New York City is maybe even more special
, having had the ability to liveelsewhere during COVID?
Asher (14:11):
Yeah, definitely I.
I missed, I Missed the city.
But I feel like it was nice tohave a little bit of a break
With without like all the noiseand stuff.
But sometimes there's so quietthere that it would like creep
me out at night.
I was just like why is it soquiet Instead of there being
(14:34):
like honking and sirens andeverything.
But I feel like it was kind ofnice to have a little bit of a
break from the city.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (14:42):
So I'm curious , because one of the things that
made me fall in love with NewYork City Is that every day I
can encounter so many differentlayers of humanity, so many
different kinds of people, somany different backgrounds and
languages and smells and flavorsand Personality types and some
people that's reallyoverwhelming.
But for those of us who lovethat, there's nothing quite so
(15:05):
dazzling.
So I'm curious for you, asherwhat do you find about a city
that's a mixed multitude of somany different threads and
stories and backgrounds?
Asher (15:18):
Um, I feel like there's a very big homeless community
here and even just giving adollar to someone Could like
make their day and really helpthem, and I really like that
feeling of like helping someone.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (15:35):
You know, and I think you know asher in that
is, you know you're growing up,getting to experience, for
example, people without homes,and start to see that they are a
part of your life in yourneighborhood, and the reality is
that this is also means youhave to keep your eyes open to
see Both what are the thingsthat others lack and also what
are the blessings that you havethat come with responsibility.
(15:56):
I love this idea that you'rethinking okay, what are the ways
that I would appreciate helpand times of need, and therefore
, when I see another personthat's in need where I can Do
something, I'm obligated to it.
It's a very different mentalitythan kind of the one I grew up
in, where we were kind of taughtyou have to go and beat saviors
of the world and you'reactually lifting up, I think, a
much healthier ethic, which is,ultimately, this is about saying
(16:19):
we're knitted together, we'rebonded together and you know, if
I'm going to ever Hope thatsomebody will be there for me, I
better start by living by beingthere for other people.
So I'm curious how you feelthat in other ways in life.
Samantha (16:32):
How do?
Rabbi Ben Spratt (16:32):
you kind of feel that ethic of being there
for other people and havingother people there for you.
Are there other settings whereyou feel that?
See that I.
Asher (16:41):
Feel like at school, like everyone's always there for
each other, no matter whathappens at Rodeph Sholom,
there's very little bullyinglike pretty much none and people
are always here for each other.
Like if somebody falls down thestairs, people offer to take
them to the nurse and help.
(17:02):
If somebody gets hurt at recess, they offer for help and they
help them up, and I feel thatthat's really great.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (17:11):
Say Ashlee, you've grown up with the
blessing of the most amazingparents in the world.
Right yeah, absolutely,absolutely 100%.
And you've grown up with a clearsense of home, of belonging, of
so many blessings, and I thinksometimes it's easy for people
to go in and look at all of thatblessing and assume that
(17:32):
everything is perfect.
Listen, Ashlee, you're a personthat I see walking around at
school with such confidence,such poise, a person who knows
who he is and knows his place inthis world.
It's really remarkable.
Very much the exact opposite ofmy experience at middle school.
I was the most insecure personprobably that's ever lived and I
look at that and I wonder doyou think that everyone really
(17:56):
knows what's going on up in hereand here?
Because I also know that someof that poise comes also from
having experienced struggle andI'm wondering if you'd be
willing to share a little withthat.
Asher (18:06):
Like during COVID, I really did feel like not
included with my friends and Ifeel, after all the online
classes, something that reallyhelps me find my belonging is
music, like finish my homeworkand play video games while I
listen to the music.
(18:26):
I like to listen to a lot ofrap and I feel like, again, it
would just clear my mind awayfrom thinking about how, like I
wasn't near any of my friendsand they were all hanging out,
but I wasn't, and it reallyhelps just like clear my mind
and get everything away, andthen I'm just like carefree.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (18:51):
As you probably know, in the kind of
like arc and history of hip hopand rap, one of the things
that's been interesting is thisongoing tension of to what
degree is it a medium of showingstrength and to what degree is
a medium of actually showingreal vulnerability, and that's
part of what has made itactually a form of music that
has brought such connection andeven community out into the
(19:13):
world.
And for you to actually be ableto feel that and channel that
yourself, I think is reallyimportant, asher.
So I'm wondering, you know,obviously every parent has a
different philosophy of how toface the struggles of the world
and how to help support our kids, and I'm curious for you both,
since you've watched your ownjourney.
You both have experienced yourown challenges in life.
(19:34):
You now get to have thepleasure of watching Asher grow
up in a probably even morevolatile and maybe even more
uncertain world.
How do you navigate this as afamily?
Gabin (19:45):
Day by day.
That's the first thing, and thesayings that you hear are very
true that there is no perfectand you sort of plug along, sort
of like a pinball, hoping tofind the solution.
(20:05):
And it's hard.
It's a much faster worldtechnology-wise, and kids learn
things much earlier in life thanwe did.
And it makes it very difficultas a parent because you feel
like when you put out one fire,another fire is right there
(20:29):
coming up, and music issomething that has done that as
well.
And now he listens to adifferent type of hip hop that,
while I don't personally approveof, nor does Samantha we
believe that it must give himsomething that we either aren't
(20:53):
at that moment or can't.
So we are more open maybe thanother parents to him listening
to that type of music.
Samantha (21:03):
So there are always going to be fires.
There's changes at every stage.
You think you've just gotteneverything under control and
something else happens.
But it's the same as when wewere kids, it's just different
challenges.
I think Gabin and I we have aphilosophy, number one, totally
embedded in a loving andsupported environment.
We both are people who are veryclose to our families.
(21:26):
It was very important to us tomaintain family from traditions.
Like we have Sunday night callsevery week with our family we
did through Zoom.
Before that it was in-personmeals.
Gabin's family lives across thestreet from us, so definitely
enmeshed in each other's livesto a certain degree.
(21:46):
So we knew family was key.
I think with raising Asher, wecare very much about being there
, no matter what the issue is.
Our approach is every day is afresh start, a new day.
If yesterday wasn't so great,today's a chance for it to be
better.
But making sure that, as Asherhas issues, as we have issues
(22:10):
talking about it as family.
Sometimes my mom will say Idon't know how you had that
conversation about drugs,breakups, problems, death,
relationships, friends not beingthere for you.
We made sure to talk thatthrough and figure out just
(22:32):
first emotions but then a plan,if there could be a plan, are
just being there to hear.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (22:38):
And I do really want to affirm that kind
of philosophy that you bring asparents, because fundamentally,
our kids, yes, are experiencingthings and having access to
things at an early age than mostof us did growing up.
But even beyond that, kids, intheir own ways, are tapped into
the very same emotions that weexperience as adults and we
(22:58):
often don't give them credit forthat.
They are experiencing loss andpain.
They are experiencing fear anduncertainty, and when we don't
create the environment wherethey can feel those feelings are
validated and put into acontext that is relatable, then
we miss this opportunity forthem to feel anchored,
especially in the moments whenthey need it most.
And I think about COVID, whichcertainly for some came with
(23:21):
some blessings, and I love thatyou as a family can both name
the blessings alongside the veryreal challenges that it posed.
And, asher, watching my own kidsthrough COVID, also separated
from their friends, they foundtheir own coping mechanisms, but
there was a loss that's almostimmeasurable and it's amazing to
see how quickly now, in aslightly different world, they
(23:44):
kind of bounce back intofriendship and relationship.
But nonetheless it means theyalready know the seeds of what
it feels like to really be alone, what it is to wonder, am I
going to ever really feel thatsense of belonging again?
And I wonder and I think maybethat's a little bit of what I
can see in you is, watching theway you kind of go through
school, I feel like you'reattuned to this idea that there
(24:07):
are people that might not walkin with the joy that you do.
And I think about again in someof those advisory conversations
the way that I think youactually know what it is to
bring people in, make sure thatpeople aren't left out, and I
think that's for me, I think oneof the most important ways of
responding to our life story iswhen we've experienced pain,
that that means that we want tobe more attuned to the pain of
(24:29):
others.
So, going back to you both fora moment as parents, what do you
feel like has been one of themost important things that you
have stumbled into learning asparents, things that maybe you
never imagined having to kind ofsit in and discover.
I'm curious.
Gabin (24:48):
I wish I was more like Asher at times.
There are times that I wish hewas more like me.
I think most parents feel thatway.
What I've always noticed is,since he was a little boy, he
would go into a room as if hewas already friends with the
(25:09):
people he was interacting with,and I have always been
uncomfortable first meetingpeople and I would usually try
to avoid those situations.
Asher's always been that personthat doesn't have fear like
that, and I think that says alot to why the last three years
(25:30):
at school, they've asked Asherto be the ambassador, if you
will, the welcoming committeefor the new kids joining the
school.
I think that they tapped intosomething that I'm talking about
is that you feel comfortable inwhat would normally be
uncomfortable situations.
Samantha (25:54):
I, by the way, I've always loved that too about him.
He is, he beats, he marches tothe beat of his own drummer and
he's that interestingcombination of confident and
strong but also kind, Like he'sinclusive, brings other kids in
to the point about being theambassador.
But a boy who has two moms,right, didn't have a dad, and
(26:17):
those questions would come upfrom the time he was young and
he handled it.
Gabin (26:21):
They still come up.
Samantha (26:22):
They still come up and you've always handled it really
beautifully and it's just oneof those things I think you
asked about.
What is one of the biggestthings learned as a parent?
I think it's realizing that ourjob and it's such a strange way
of thinking about it whenthey're young, they are your,
(26:43):
you are there everything andthey are your everything and
your whole job is to help themgrow up into these people.
Give them the gifts that theycan about who they are, the
confidence, the foundation fortheir values and their beliefs
and their way of going throughlife.
And then, basically, at acertain point, it's all about
(27:05):
letting go incrementally whilethey find themselves and we're,
I wanna say, left behind but toa certain extent, left to watch
them and revel in them.
But you are not that person inthe same way, and it's such a
humbling honor and experience todo that.
(27:27):
It's we're figuring that out.
It makes me a little teary, butrealizing like everything is
about them and yet it's not allabout them, because they can't
be that center, because it's toomuch for them.
They're part of the whole, buttheir whole story is ahead of
them and you're now watchingthem and helping them lift their
(27:48):
wings.
It's kinda cool.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (27:51):
Beautiful Samantha.
I think this is great.
Okay, we had a greatconversation.
Asher, this is a very weirdthing.
I'm just getting into thismyself, okay, so very weird
thing, but I wanna offer yougratitude, because it takes a
lot of courage to dive intotrying something new for the
first time, and I really wannaoffer gratitude to the two of
(28:12):
you for whatever crazygymnastics you did in your
schedule to make this work, andso grateful.
This was just fantastic, so,and thank you, jess, for making
it all possible.
Samantha (28:21):
Thank you, thank you.
Rabbi Ben Spratt (28:25):
Thank you for joining us and listening to this
story of belonging.
Stay connected with us onFacebook and Instagram.
You can find me on Twitter atBenHSpratt.
For more information about CRS,visit us online at rodephsholom
.
org.
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