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September 18, 2025 6 mins

When Jesus spoke of earthly things you and I can see and verify, and He was wrong, how on earth can we believe Him about spiritual things? Either Jesus was correct about everything He spoke on or nothing.

More information about Beyond the Walls, including additional resources can be found at www.beyondthewalls-ministry.com 

This series included graphics to illustrate what is being taught, if you would like to watch the teachings you can do so on Rumble (https://rumble.com/user/SpokaneBibleChurch) or on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLtV_KhFVZ_waBcnuywiRKIyEcDkiujRqP).

Jeremy Thomas is the pastor at Spokane Bible Church in Spokane, Washington and a professor at Chafer Theological Seminary. He has been teaching the Bible for over 20 years, always seeking to present its truths in a clear and understandable manner. 

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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Beyond the Walls with Jeremy Thomas and
our series on the New TestamentFramework.
Today a smaller, bite-sizedpiece from the larger lesson.
We hope you enjoy it.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
What's he doing?
He's making the split, right.
He's splitting between issuesof faith and morals and issues
of historical and scientificdetail.
And he's saying, ah, it's notat all the purpose of the Bible,
see, to provide any kind ofknowledge that might relate to
science.
It's just a book that's relatedto salvation and spiritual

(00:32):
issues.
So if Jesus erred on scientificdetails, for Burkhardt, see,
that's no big deal.
He thinks he can hold on to aJesus who provides salvation for
the world on one hand but errsin technical details of science
and history, see, but he's gotto do that to keep his academic

(00:52):
status.
Or he thinks he does.
What do we do with some claimslike Jesus made in John 3.12?
Let's look at John 3.12.
All this time I've beenbasically just trying to bring
you into the discussion oninfallibility and help us have a
good understanding of it.
In John 3.12, in the discoursewith Nicodemus, right, he tells

(01:18):
Nicodemus in verse 12, if I toldyou earthly things and you do
not believe, how will youbelieve?
If I told you earthly thingsand you do not believe, how will
you believe if I tell youheavenly things?
This has always been one of myfavorite verses because my
background was science, rightBiology and chemistry mainly,
but some physics and whateverelse thrown in.
If I tell you of earthly thingsand you don't believe, how will

(01:41):
you believe me when I tell youabout heavenly things?
In other words, if I tell youdetails about things that you
can investigate, they're onearth.
You can, you know, check themout?
We would say, and you can'tbelieve me about what I say
about that, how are you evergoing to believe me about things
in heaven, like things like ifyou believe in me you're

(02:02):
forgiven Anybody got a rocket?
You're going to go to heavenand check to make sure that in
heaven you're forgiven Anyone?
How can you know that's true Ifyou don't even believe the
things that he tells us thatrelate to this earth?
It can actually be investigated.
See for Jesus, like these twothings were tied together

(02:26):
Earthly and heavenly things.
Whatever he said is true, right.
It wasn't a split between faithand morals, the spiritual
things and, over here,scientific and historic details.
Jesus wouldn't be willing tomake that split.

(02:49):
Let's go on to Colossians 2.8.
To one of the warnings thatwere given by the Apostle Paul
Galatians, ephesians,philippians and then Colossians,
colossians 2.8.
Colossians 2.8.
He says See to it that no onetakes you captive through

(03:14):
philosophy and empty deception,according to the tradition of
men, according to the elementaryprinciples of the world, rather
than according to Christ, whichhe goes on then to describe in
hypostatic union in verse 9.
The fullness of deity in bodilyform in verse 9.
The fullness of deity in bodilyform.

(03:36):
How or has the church been takencaptive by human philosophy by
allowing this concept of erringon scientific and historical
details to creep in?
I'm bringing this up becausethis is exactly what has
happened.
Human philosophy, as I'm aboutto show you, crept in, it got

(03:59):
its foot in the door, so tospeak, and now we're in a load
of trouble where we are today inthe church.
What are the 11 most attackedchapters in the Bible?
Genesis 1 through 11, right, weall know the whole evolutionary

(04:23):
creationist discussion that'stranspired now over 240 years.
Why do we have a divide inevangelicalism?
Because of Colossians 2.8.
If you allow human philosophyto come in, as I've been
demonstrating, it has, so thatnow what we're doing with the

(04:45):
Bibles, we're saying, yeah, it'strue in the spiritual things,
over here the heavenly things,but over here in the earthly
things, technical errors, thingslike that, we can allow that
After a while if you realizewhat you're saying, that the
Bible does have errors over here, why believe any of it at all?

(05:06):
I remember my mentor, charlieClough, became a believer.
He grew up in the Bronx,brilliant mind.
He went to MIT.
He got a degree in mathematicsKind of smart guy.
He became a believer when hewas on campus there.
But when he became a believerhe was in considering it,

(05:27):
considering becoming a Christian.
He was like.
He came to this very logicalconclusion.
He said well, I mean, if thisreally is God's word, there
can't be any errors in itbecause God doesn't err.
So this is all true or none ofit's true, and don't mess with
it, it's a waste of time.
That's what he meant.

(05:47):
And of course he becameconvinced that the whole thing
is true.
And that's the way it is.
You can't split and say well,the things it says about science
and history when it touches onthat, that's false.
But the rest of the spiritualthings are true.
That dog won't hunt, as StanleyToussaint used to say, that dog

(06:10):
won't hunt.

Speaker 1 (06:13):
Thank you for joining us on Beyond the Walls with
Jeremy Thomas.
If you would like to see thevisuals that went along with
today's sermon, you can findthose on Rumble and on YouTube
under Spokane Bible Church.
That is where Jeremy is thepastor and teacher.
We hope you found today'slesson productive and useful in
growing closer to God andwalking more obediently with Him

(06:36):
.
If you found this podcast to beuseful and helpful, then please
consider rating us in yourfavorite podcast app, and until
next time, we hope you have ablessed and wonderful day.
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