How to Break the Cycle of Self-Loathing | Guest: Kimberly Joy

I’ve got my spiritual mama, Kimberly Joy, here to help you overcome this nasty habit of self-loathing.

If you’ve ever looked in the mirror and thought, “I don’t like who I am” -this one’s for you. And if you’re like me and it’s gone beyond dislike into detesting who you are, then this is especially for you. Kim is a full-on powerhouse: author, speaker, mom of eleven, and my personal “momtor.”

In this episode, we talk about how to break free from self-condemnation and finally walk in the way God sees us. We hit on identity, insecurity, comparison, and why trying to earn your worth will never work. The Holy Spirit led both Kim and me out of self-hatred and, I promise, He can and wants do the same for you.

Thanks for tuning in to Bible Bish!

Come for the tea, stay for the truth -you just might leave changed. 🕊️

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In the name of love, this is your Bible Bish reporting for duty. ♡

Episode Transcript

Kim (00:00):
the word condemn means punishable by death.

(00:02):
condemnation brings death.
Conviction brings life.
So the Holy Spirit willconvict you while giving
you hope for change, Yes.
Yes.
Condemnation will condemnyou, making you feel hopeless,
like you'll never change

Kayley (00:16):
Well, hello.
Welcome back to anotherepisode of Bible Bish.
My name is Kayley Bishop.
I'm so excited that you pickedthis to tune into, to listen
to, to engage in, because thereare many places you could be,
and yet you chose my littlesliver of the internet, and
so to that, I'm so thankful.
That also means that I reallywanna take care of you.

(00:37):
So what we're talking abouttoday is just for you,
especially if you're strugglingwith self-loathing, because
I think if you are living inmodern society today where
there's social media everywhere,you likely struggle with
some sort of self hatred justbecause we're exposed to so much
comparison and we all know thatcomparison is a thief of joy.

(01:01):
That being said, I'mso excited to have my
spiritual mama on the show.
Her name is Kimberly Joy.
She's full of joy, butshe's also full of Holy
Spirit fire, wisdom.
She's got testimony for days.
Y'all, she has lived life.
She has seen things that noone should see, been through

(01:23):
so much as a mother of 11.
She is a renownedauthor, speaker.
She has her own women's, uh,entrepreneurial organization.
She's a business coach.
She's a personal coach.
She's my spiritual mentor.
I call her my momtor 'causeit's like mom mixed with
mentor, you know what I mean?
And, uh, she's amazing.

(01:43):
So anyway, welcome tothe show, Kimberly Joy.

Kim (01:46):
Thank you Kayley Bish.

. Kayley (01:48):
It's like weird to use your name like that.
I know.
It's like you're just Kim to me.
Um, so I, I just,I want you to tell.
Give everybody just like aquick intro to who you are
and what God is doing rightnow with you in this season.

Kim (02:05):
Well, who I am is just a daughter of God called and
chosen to lift up and raiseup other daughters of God.
Everything that I do, uh,in my mission for women is
to empower them to live thelives they were born for.
That's really what I'm up to.
That's really what I'm about.

(02:26):
I wish we had morewomen like that.
I think, you know, one thingI've heard you say several
times is women should becompleting each other, not
competing with one another.
Yes.
And I think that's soimportant because any woman,
I think growing up with otherwomen has likely found the
competition aspect more sothan the completion aspect.
Yes.
And I think when we're reallywalking with Holy Spirit,

(02:49):
we then know who we are.
Mm-hmm.
Because our value,our gifts Yep.
Are so individualized and,and if we know who we are in
Jesus, then why would we everwant to be somebody else or
compete with somebody else?
It's like God gave us a specialcall, a special anointing
that is individual to us.

Kayley (03:06):
Yes.
And so there's, I say there'sthe three C's of insecurity.
This is how you know, you'redealing with insecurity,
whether in yourself orsomeone else comparing
Competing and criticizing.
The three C's.
If you see those three C'sand feel them know they're
there, even if people arepretending they aren't there,
but you know they're there.

(03:27):
Yeah.
'cause let's be honest,we can be good as women at
putting on the smile, butwhy don't we, why are we
getting that negative energy?
Yeah.
Smile on the face.
Energy in the face don't match.
Right?
Yeah, totally.

Kim (03:39):
And when we say, when we see the comparing, competing
and criticizing, that's anindication of insecurity.
And the message that God hasfor his daughters is none
of us need to be insecure.
No one, not a one of us.
Not over appearance.
Not over our past, notover what we lack, because
what we lack, he fills.

(04:00):
Yeah.
You know what wedid in our past?
He cleanses the, theway we look, the Bible
says, reflects his glorywe're made in his image.
Yeah.
You know, that we're, that like

Kayley (04:10):
to reflect glory, to reflect his glory.
We are just as I am,

Kim (04:14):
we were made in his image.
So even, you know, we all,I'll be honest, I'm a woman.
I have complaints aboutthings, about my body and,
and, and, and all of that.
All of us do.
But if you just set that asidefor a moment and recognize
that we were made in theimage of God, that we were
given a body, a mind, andall of its inner workings

(04:34):
to do something so much moreimportant than just looking hot

Kayley (04:41):
man.

Kim (04:42):
So much more important.

Kayley (04:43):
And uh, sorry.
Keep going.

Kim (04:45):
And I'm not saying don't, you know, put your
best appearance forward.
Don't put yourbest face forward.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
There's something aboutmaking the outer package
reflect what's inside.
Mm. And I encourage women to dothat, but it's not the greatest
thing you have to offer.
No.
It's not the bestthing on your resume.
And so if we can understandthat we have nothing to

(05:07):
be insecure about, weare who he made us to be.
We can do what hesaid that we can do.
And he is who he says he is.
More importantly.
Yeah.
And he can do whathe says he will do.
And if we have all of thatlocked and loaded in the
holster every day, we don'thave a reason to be insecure.

Kayley (05:24):
I think it's also just being heavenly minded.
Mm-hmm.
I see.
I mean, just in Nashville,Nashville has a lot
of beautiful people.
Sometimes I walkout to the grocery

Kim (05:33):
Nashville, you do's Nashville.

Kayley (05:35):
There's a lot of attractive people here.

Kim (05:37):
Beautiful people in Nashville.

Kayley (05:38):
I'm like, man, I feel like a sloth or like a, I don't
know, a pig with lipstick on it.
I don't know, man.
Like, it's, it's so hard.
You feel like you arein this place of, do I
have, how do I compete?
I don't look like that.
I can't, I don't havea body like that.
There's that C word.
Exactly.
Compete.
And, but you know, I, I knowwhen I am more heavenly minded.

(06:00):
Than earthly minded.
Yep.
When I'm thinking about thespiritual side of things and
not the natural side of things,I naturally radiate joy.
I naturally radiatethe glory of God.
Yes.
Even more so.
And people, I mean, I remembernot even too long ago, this
guy was like, you're glowing.

(06:21):
I said, man, I've justbeen touched by heaven.
Wow.
That's a, that's thebest way to look.
Good.
That's right.
Just glowing because you'vebeen touched by heaven.
Woo.

Kim (06:29):
That's right.
And the Bible talks about theinner beauty of a gentle and
quiet spirit, and that doesn'tmean we all as women have to
have the same personality.
No.
Yeah.
It doesn't say gentleand quiet personality.
Mm. Okay.
It says gentle and quiet spirit.
Mm. It it's a spirit that is atrest in who she is in Christ.

Kayley (06:51):
Oh, that's so good.

Kim (06:54):
Regardless of personality.
And I just wanna say, there'sso many women, I've talked
to so many women over theyears with what I do, who
say I'm different from women.
I'm not like other women.
Guess what?
Like 90% of your sisters outthere are saying the same thing.
I think that what thatmeans is we're not all
supposed to be alike andthey'll say, I'm different.

(07:15):
I'm not like other women.
And they, they think thatthat disqualifies them.
Mm. And what I hear and I seeis that actually is because
of what you were born to do.
Mm. You were made specificallyfor the assignment on your life.
And if you don't match thisand this and this, it's because
you weren't born for that.

(07:36):
You were born forsomething else.
And the joy and the journey isfinding out what that something
else is and going and doing it.

Kayley (07:44):
I just, I just see the Lord, like any time that.
I have lived in that mindset ofcompetition and criticism, you
know, full of anger at myselffor not being a certain thing.
I almost just sense like theLord being so sad about that.
Wow.
Like why are you sadabout the thing that I'm
not asking you to be?

(08:05):
Yep.
Like you're getting allof your ideas and you're
getting your call twisted.
Yep.
You're not listeningto my voice.
You couldn't be, 'cause if youwere listening to my voice,
you'd know what value you have,what gifting you have, and
you'd be hearing the step I'dbe given you to go walk in it.
That's right.
And your confidence wouldmultiply, everything

(08:28):
would shift, yourcommunity would shift.
You'd start shedding lightin areas of darkness.
Because when we're stewardingour gift, walking in our
gift, that's so individuallyours, we light up a room,
all of a sudden we'd knowwho we are more completely.
We'd find more joy in ourspecific individuality.

(08:50):
And I, I mean, I, I lookback to my younger self
struggling with confidence.
I hated myself.
And it's, it's really crazy'cause like, even after I
gave my life to the Lord andfully and completely, and
started actually having himas my Lord and Savior, I still
struggled with self hatred.
Mm-hmm.
Because now I'm tryingto perform for God.

Kim (09:11):
Wow.
And you know how short wefall trying to do that?

Kayley (09:14):
Oh, it's impossible.

Kim (09:15):
It's impossible to live up to his standard in our own
strength, in our own striving.
So, you know, it's a recipefor more self-loathing.
You're absolutely right.
So how did you, howdid that affect you?

Kayley (09:28):
Oh my gosh.
Like it was.
You know, every day I'm heapingon the self-hatred for, you
know, if you were kinder, youwould've said a better thing
to that person and you, youmight've been able to help
set them free in the Lord.
Oh, if, I mean, it's so ugly.
It's like, oh, if, if youwould've just woken up and
not slept in and had yourquiet time, you would've heard

(09:50):
from God and you would'vebeen able to go seize the
day and you're just lazy.
Whatever.
It's like, it's just so ugly.
Wow.
Like, even, even theimpression, impression of
that voice, it's so ugly.
And, and God'sjust, he's so sad.
He's like, when are you goingto stop partnering with what the
enemy is saying about you andstart walking in the abundant

(10:13):
grace that I have and I amAnd why are you walking in God
in, in his opinion of you and,and not mine, says the Lord.

Kim (10:22):
That's right.
That's absolutely right.

Kayley (10:24):
But I wanna talk to you about your self-loathing.

Kim (10:26):
Oh, great.
Yay.

Kayley (10:28):
'cause I, you know, I'm coming.
You're coming.
I'm coming out of a seasonwhere I've learned a lot
more, but it's, it's likethose neuro pathways that I've
established my whole life.
Yeah.
Still need to yank on thewheel to get off of them.
That's right.
And so I need some help.
Okay.
Mentor me.

Kim (10:46):
Well, you know, self-loathing can come from
a lot of different sources,and sometimes it's our own
voice from a young age.
Sometimes it's someone else'svoice that, you know, a
seed was just planted andthen we just put it on loop.
Mm. Um, it could have beensomething somebody said
when we were young, wecould have been bullied.

(11:06):
Um, we could havefelt, uh, unseen.
Yeah.
Uh, it could be so many things,but it really comes back
to something that happenedin our formative years.
Hmm.
So, and, and I just wannasay for, for those listeners
and viewers of yours whostruggle with self-loathing.
Don't add this to the list ofthings you blame yourself for.

(11:29):
Mm. Don't add.
Oh, oh.
In addition to everythingelse I do wrong, I also hate
myself, which is hurting myself.
So, no, that startedbefore you even had the
wherewithal to realize it.
Mm. That this, the enemyis so insidious and, and
he's actually clever.
He knows that if he can plantthese types of seeds in a young
mind that has no defenses.

(11:49):
Oh yeah.
No spiritual weapons, no wisdom.
So true.
You know, just plant the seedin those formative years.
Birth to seven, sevento 14, or 14 to 21.
And where we.
What life is is for a, achild is just an experience.
You're just literally ona ride experiencing life.
Yeah.

(12:10):
And you have learnednothing about how to
manage life and how to um,

Kayley (12:15):
navigate it.

Kim (12:16):
Navigate it.
Or even just be incharge of your own life.
Yeah.
Much less in chargeof your own thoughts.
Yeah.
So he knows that thatis the vulnerable time
and the best time.
And he also knows itcan establish a lifetime
of a stronghold in ourlife, in our mind, in our
thinking, in our acting.
So somewhere along the lines,somebody or something happens.

(12:36):
Some, someone says somethingand we realize we're bad, we're
dumb, we're less than, it'sjust a million adjectives.
Yeah.
And it becomes partof our self-talk.
Many years later, you findyourself walking with God.
This happened to me.
I'm in the closet one day, uh,getting changed after, uh, you

(12:58):
know, getting ready for the day.
And I had been to some importantevent, business related.
I wanted to, you know, crushit, wanted to sound like I
had half a clue, just a half,

Kayley (13:10):
just half of a clue.

Kim (13:11):
And, um, I didn't, I sounded like I had a, you
know, an, a molecule of a clue.
And I came home from thisthing, like really, really,
you know, just going overit and over it and over it.
And the more I went over it,the, the worse I sounded.
Mm. Like I was literallyrewriting what happened.

(13:33):
Mm. In all of my thinkingand in my emotion.
And um, and I was justgoing over that in my mind.
And this wasn't eventhe day of the event.
So this tells you howlong we can carry.
One event and just beatourselves up over it.
Wow.
And I'm in the closet andI'm getting dressed and
I'm thinking all this.
And my thoughts juststart bubbling up so much.

(13:54):
And they're so overwhelmingand all the emotion is coming
with them that I just say outloud, oh, you're such an idiot.
And I just verbalizedmy agreement with
what I was hearing andrepeating in my mind.
And no sooner did I saythat than I heard the Lord,
the Father speak to me.
And he said, Hey, don't talkabout my daughter like that.

Kayley (14:21):
He's so good.

Kim (14:23):
And at first I felt scolded, but then I realized.
He was protecting me from me.
Mm-hmm.
Which was really protectingme from the enemy who
wanted me to agree with him.
Yeah.
And I wasn't ready to fullygrasp the power of agreement
and how I had been agreeingwith the enemy all these years
and how it formed a strongholdin my mind and neuropathways

(14:45):
and a pattern of thinking.
But when he said, Hey,don't talk about my daughter
like that, I understoodinstantly that hurt his heart.
Yeah.
And if somebody talkedabout my daughter like that,
it would hurt my heart.
And when pe, when my daughtersstarted, when I'd hear them
talk about themselves afterthat, I'd say, Hey, don't talk

(15:05):
about my daughter like that.
Yeah.
And that's the heart of thefather when we are doing
these things and agreeingwith what the enemy says.
But even furthermore,past that date, I was, um,
doing forgiveness work.
And, um, really deepdiving into forgiveness.
I had watched, or the video, theBait of Satan by John Bevere.

(15:30):
I had read the book.
John Bevere.
Yeah.
John Bevere.
Shout out to him.
So good.
I'd read the book yearsearlier, but somebody threw
a video my way and I waslike, wow, I have some
forgiveness work to do again.
And by the way, um, forgivenessis so linked to self-loathing
and I'll, I'm gonna get tothat and, and show you the

(15:51):
power of forgiveness and, andin this whole element here.
But, um, I was, youknow, being a. Working
mom, running a business.
Lots of kids.
And I was prayingwhile on my treadmill.
Okay.
I was multitasking and Iwas, I was like, I'll warm
up with my walk and myprayer and then I'll run.
Like just, you know,trying to do everything.

(16:12):
Yes.
Just in that season of life.
And, um, I'm on thetreadmill and I begin to
pray and I, I, I start goingthrough my forgiveness.
But I had learned that wereally delude ourselves as
it relates to forgiveness,and we deceive ourselves and
we say, oh, I'm not bitter.
Mm. Oh, I don't haveanybody to forgive.
So I learned to say, Lord, whodo you think I need to forgive?

(16:35):
So good.
Yeah.
So it's not a list I make.
It's a list he makes.
The heart of men is wickedand deceitful above all else.
Who can know it?
Who can know it?
He can know it.
Yes.
So, Lord, who doI need to forgive?
So he says, you yourself.
I was like, oh, is that a thing?

(16:56):
I mean, I literally was like 43years old going, I'm supposed
to be forgiving myself.
And I walked with the Lordsince like really walked the
narrow road since I was 21,knew Jesus from a young child.
I think I was six or seven.
And I prayed the salvationprayer at least six times just
to make sure it stuck, you know?

(17:16):
And I just had, was hearingabout forgiving myself from God.
Wow.
And I was like, he AndI said, is that a thing?
And he goes, well, can youhold a grudge against yourself?
And I was like, oh yeah,that's a big yes for me.
Yeah.
I can hold a biggrudge against myself.
He said, well then youcan forgive yourself.

(17:37):
So logical.
So, okay, Lord.
So, and then I, I go toforgive myself, but I'm
like, well, what am Iexactly forgiving myself for?
Yeah.
And he said, what do you holdagainst yourself the most?
It came to me, Kayley, in alightning flash, and I said,
father, in Jesus' name, Iforgive myself for being

(17:58):
human, flawed, and imperfect.
And I just realized like thething I hated about myself
the most was my humanity.
Yeah.
I wanted to be perfectand not make mistakes.
I wanted to never miss the mark.
I wanted to always measure up.
I wanted to be perfect so thatI could feel that I had value

(18:19):
because there was no valuein imperfection in my mind.

Kayley (18:24):
Ouch.
Yeah.
I feel like that is like reallywhat I've been struggling with
and I, you know, there's anebb and flow of it, but Yeah,
I, I mean, even most recentlywriting in my journals,
like I hate my own humanity.
I hate that I'm human.
Yeah.
Why can't I just not be human?
I just, and, and I rememberGod telling me, I don't know,

(18:46):
maybe a year or two ago, like,I didn't make you super human.
I didn't make you a subhuman.
I just made you simply human.
And in your humanity, ifyou call on me, that is
where your greatness lies.
That's right.
And it's just, why can'tI just get over myself?

Kim (19:04):
I know.
Well, and I mean, infurther conversations I'd
say, Lord, I I just don'tunderstand how you're so fine
with this humanity thing.
Yeah.
And he, and he would belike, Hey, if I'm okay with
it, what's your problem?
Oh.
You know, if the God of allcreation who is perfect in every
way, sinless, blameless, andcannot be one with evil, still
loves and embraces us and diedfor us in our humanity, why

(19:28):
can't we just be okay with it?
He's okay with it.
He, he actually createdthe solution for it.
It's the cross.
Yeah.
And, and the empty tomb.
So, um, you know, I, I havethis moment and I realize,
yeah, I have held it againstmyself, my humanity and
under that umbrella are allthe mistakes I've ever made.

(19:49):
Right?
Yeah.
So it's not just, oh, I'm human.
It's I'm human.

Kayley (19:52):
And therefore

Kim (19:53):
Yes.
It's a therefore, yeah.
So, um, I pray this prayerand I'm like, wow, that
was really powerful.
Thank you, Jesus.
You know, get, get off thetreadmill or do my thing.
And then the next day I geton the treadmill and I, same
routine, and I say, Lord, whodo I need to forgive today?
And, uh, and there wereothers I needed to forgive
besides myself, but he,he led the same again.

(20:14):
He goes, you.
And I was like, oh, well didn'tI just do that yesterday?
He's like, do it again.
So I do it again.
I forgive myself again forbeing human, flawed, and
imperfect and, um, get throughmy prayer time, get through
my day, go to bed that night.
Get on the treadmill.
Day three.
Day three is a day that isseared into my, uh, memory

(20:36):
and my spiritual memory.
I got on the treadmilland I said, Lord, who do
I need to forgive today?
Really thinking I had checkedthe box of forgiving me, like
I really thought that I hadthis spiritual breakthrough.
And, um, he says, you and I say,Lord, I just did that yesterday

(20:58):
and the day before, like Ijust didn't understand it.
And he said to me so clear.
He's like.
He didn't say it.
I should, I should back upbecause I want people to
understand that he puts animpression, he puts a, a picture
in, you know, what's calledthe theater of your mind.
Your imagination is actuallya huge theater with Dolby

(21:19):
sound and technicolor andall the things on purpose.
And he puts this impression inthe theater of my mind, of me
going to bed the night before.
And I see my head hittingthe pillow and I instantly
hear all my thoughts.
You idiot, youscrewed this up today.
You botched that.
You forgot that you werelate to that meeting.

(21:39):
You went to the store forthree things and you came
out with 17 and forgot thethree you were there for.
Like this, this is, this was,this is how I'd go to bed.
This is how I went tobed that night before.
And what it wasis, was my ledger.
It was my ledger.
Now, in this day and age,nobody really keeps a
checkbook ledger anymore.

(22:00):
Mm-hmm.
But back in the day, youhad a ledger and you put
everything you spent inevery deposit you made.
Well, my ledger wasfull of withdrawals.
Mm. I didn't trackany of the deposits.
I wasn't counting anything good.
I did, I was keeping ameticulous ledger of every
way that I was human,flawed, and imperfect.
Every day conversations,I botched people I was

(22:23):
rude to or I wasn't niceenough, like you said.
Yeah.
Or I wasn't empatheticenough, or I wasn't blank
enough all throughout my day.
And I realized in that momentthat I had been doing that when
my head hit the pillow as farback as I could remember to
my childhood, I began to weepso violently, I fell off the

(22:45):
treadmill and was on the floor,on the carpet face first, face
down before God saying, Lord.
How long have you beenwaiting to show this to me?
You just revealed to me alifelong bondage, a lifelong

(23:06):
self-talk and way of thinkingthat has sabotaged me every day
as far back as I can remember.
And you've been so patientwith me that here it is, I'm
however many years old, 43years old, and you're finally
getting to reveal this to me.
Two things struck methe long suffering of Christ.

(23:38):
Mm. The long sufferingof Christ with us.
Yeah, because he walkedme through 1,000,001
things before that.
Wow.
And he wasn't saying, Ican't help you because you
just go to bed every nightand just undo everything I
did for you during the day.
Mm. He never said that.
He never did that.
He never said, I'mjust tired of you.

(23:59):
You're not getting it.
I felt the long sufferingand the patience of God in
that moment, like I had neverexperienced it before and I just
wept and thanked him for who hewas and for who he was for me.
And that, um, if I could beset free of something so deep
and ingrained in me that Ididn't even know it was there,

(24:20):
I thought, wow, what else?
What else is there?
What else can I get free from?
What else is God gonnado to make me into
the image of his son?
Yeah, and it was veryexciting, but it also now
had to become a discipline.
Yeah.
I had to learn where there wasthe ledger to let myself off
the hook and agree with whatGod said about me, that I was

(24:41):
here to reflect his glory, thatI could walk in my new nature.
That yes, I have a fleshand it is filled with my
humanity, but I also have aspirit that's alive to Christ.
And the Bible tells me Ican be led by the spirit
and not give into the flesh.
But if you are a prisoner toyour flesh because you hate

(25:01):
it, because the thing you hateis also something you worship.
Hate is worship.
Oof.
Hate is worship.
And the reason hate is worship.
And the reason it's worshipis because whatever you
bow to, you're worshiping.
Yeah.
And when you bow to hatred.

(25:22):
You bow to fear, you bowanything evil that you're
bowing to and agreeingwith, you're worshiping it.
Wow.
At an altar.
Wow.
So I'm worshiping at thealtar of self-hatred.
I'm like, come on in, devil.
Let's have a heyday and hate me.
Let's have a hate me party.
And he's like, okay.
And I'm bowing at that altar.
And the Lord's like, wegotta unbuild that altar.

(25:44):
And you need a new altar, analtar of worship to me, an
altar that agrees with me.
An altar that says, you are whoI say you are not who He says
you are not who She says youare not who they say you are.
Not even who you say youare who I say you are.

Kayley (26:00):
Wow.
Okay.
That was a lot.
It's so good.
I mean, I feel like thekeeping of the ledger is such a
tangible way of hating yourself,and I'm sure that there are
tons of people listeningto this that feel that way
and have experienced that.
Have you experienced self-hatredthrough a different method?

Kim (26:25):
Um, gimme an example.

Kayley (26:26):
What, so how, for instance, like how has
self-hatred manifested in yourlife throughout your years?

Kim (26:32):
Oh, okay.
So how's it manifested?
Yeah.
Um, not taking great careof myself, um, for many,
many years, it was nothaving boundaries and
putting my needs last.
Oh, and just being a doormat.
Mm. Um, just my,my worth and value.
You know, it is, it like eventhe belief falling for the

(26:53):
belief that to be a servantin the kingdom means you have
no voice, you have no needs,you, your emotions don't count.
I literally lived a season ofmy life just telling myself
over and over, your emotionsare not your God, your God.
So I would justsquelch 'em down.
Oh.
You know, because Ithought that was service.
But that self-hatred thatalready devalued me, latched

(27:16):
onto that religious dogmaand just said, yeah, your
feelings don't matter.
You don't matter.

Kayley (27:22):
Okay.
Where did that, so yousay religious dogma
kind of was the mm-hmm.
Aggressor in that?
Yeah.
Can you expand on that?
'cause I know that there area lot of women, because, you
know, for years and years andyears, women, I've been told
that we're emotional beings.
I mean, I remember myex-husband telling me like,
oh, women are emotional.
That's why they need aman to make a decision.
Totally belittling my gender.

(27:43):
Mm-hmm.
And, and who I amintrinsically, I'm like.
Oh, we got, I mean wealready had problems that
was like, you know, thenail in the coffin really.
But, um, but you know, Iwas told for so long I was
emotional and therefore Iwas incapable as a result.
Yeah.
And so, yeah, justtalk more about that.

Kim (28:01):
Well, I think what I was being taught was your
emotions are not your God.
Therefore, you know,don't lead with them.
But my tendency towardsdevaluing me latched onto
that and took it further.
Um, and, and I do think therewas a, a, a place in religion

(28:22):
for me at that point in mylife where I was secondary.
Hmm.
I was secondary towhoever I was serving.
I was secondary to the children,secondary to the husband,
you know, that, um, my needswould, should come last period
no matter what, because I'm aservant in my home and we're
all servants in the kingdom.
Yeah, but why, why was itin this particular culture,

(28:44):
only the woman's needswere last in the home?
Everybody else was first, eventhough we're all servants.

Kayley (28:50):
Yeah.
That's interesting.

Kim (28:51):
A little, a little bit of a contradiction there, but,
um, you know, I had my ownpropensity toward codependency,
toward owning more of otherpeople's problems than I should.
Yeah.
And so all that stuff, memixed together and I began
to just squelch out emotions,not talk about my feelings.
And then, you know, onceevery six months I'd have

(29:12):
this big blow up and I wouldfeel so guilty, but it would
be all this frustrationthat I wasn't communicating
about in relationship.
You know, it would be allmy feeling powerless and
all these situations whereI didn't have a voice.
Yeah.
You know, and it, it waskind of like the volcano
was always brewing becauseof the fact that I was

(29:33):
squelching out all the emotion.
Mm. You know?
Then with the self-hatred,I felt like I didn't
deserve to have a voice.
But then when I voiced it, Ivoiced it not in the right way.
And now I hate myself for that.
So here we go, backdown the cycle again.
So now Kim, you shut up.
Don't say what, don'tsay what you feel.
Don't, don't rock the boat.

(29:54):
Stir the pot, and thenboom, another blow up.
And you, you did it again.
You did it again.
And then I had actual voicesin my life saying, oh,
huh, look, listen to her.
Wow.
Yeah.
You sound like somebodywho loves Jesus, you know?

Kayley (30:06):
Okay.
How do you discern the voiceof conviction versus the
enemy's voice of condemnation?

Kim (30:13):
Okay, that's a great question.
So, um, the word condemnmeans punishable by death.
So condemnation brings death.
Conviction brings life.
Mm. It always brings life.
So the Holy Spirit willconvict you while giving
you hope for change?
Yes.
Yes.
Condemnation will condemnyou, making you feel
hopeless, like you'll neverchange you're worthless.

Kayley (30:35):
So it's more about the result.
You get the feeling, andif you wanna know what it
is, what do you feel afteryou, after you get that
conviction or condemnation?

Kim (30:42):
Well, yes.
You, you immediately feel putdown or you feel called higher.
Yeah.
That's it.
You feel beaten down oryou feel called higher.
The Holy Spirit's convictionis a call to come up higher,
but he doesn't force you.
Mm. So it's a, it's aninvitation to come up higher.
The enemy literally just hitsyou over the head with a bat.

(31:03):
Yeah.
It's very easy todiscern the two.
Once you noticethose distinctions.
Um, but yeah, that self-loathingand the way that it manifested
in putting myself last and, andI wanna just say this about your
comment about emotions and thewhole, like, you know, women are
emotional, you know, God gavehuman beings emotions, period.

(31:25):
And he gave us all emotionsbecause they indicate something.
Mm. I I say emotions arelike dashboard lights.
Yeah.
And I lived my lifeignoring the lights.
My check engine light was onall the time, and I just drove
the car till the wheels cameoff or until the engine blew.
Yeah.
And our emotions are there toindicate that something's wrong

(31:47):
or something's right and uh,or that something needs to be
inspected at the bare minimum.
Something needsto be looked into.
And, um, our emotions arenot the driver of the car.
They're the dashboard lights.
So Yes, when theemotions are driving.
It's, it's not a goodscene for anyone.

(32:08):
Male or female.
Yeah.
Wow.
And though that exhibitsdifferently, you know,
depending on who you are,your personality and your sex.
But the bottom line is ouremotions are there to indicate
something, to tell us somethingand we need to listen to them
and we need to get them out.
There was a study done ofwives that were very, very

(32:30):
unhappy in their marriage.
Very unhappy.
A whole two setsof wives miserable.
10 year study.
Okay.
One set of wives talkedopenly about how unhappy
they were, so they wereable to have conversation
with someone else and justarticulate their misery.
Mm-hmm.
Just doesn't sound very fun,but that's what they did.

(32:50):
The other group was miserableand didn't talk about it.
The group that didn't discusstheir emotions was three times
more likely to get cancer.
Wow.
Something like fourtimes more likely to get
an autoimmune disorder.
And their bodies werebeginning to break down
because of the ignored,stuffed emotion inside of them.

(33:14):
And even though both setsof wives were unhappy,
it was the ones that weresilent, that were sicker.

Kayley (33:20):
That's nuts.
It's nuts.
You know, this is actuallyreminding me of a time
where, I mean, I, I think Iwas able to be vocal about
my emotions in my marriage,but after a while, like I
was just kind of disregardedSo much was not a, like, my
opinion just didn't matter.
My feelings didn't matter.
And then I startedto feel nothing.

(33:42):
Wow.
And, and I remember beingso proud of myself, of like,
I just, I never get upset.
I don't, I never cry.
Wow.
But on the on, in the adverse,because I didn't cry for
years, but in the adverse, Inever was extremely joyful.
I never had excitement.
And I remember, you know, Ihad a lot of condemnation in my

(34:04):
marriage and I just remember myex-husband telling me one day,
like he, he had done somethingfor me that I didn't want,
and he had expected me to behappy and wanted me to, and
I didn't show any excitement.
And then I was condemned fornot showing excitement Wow.
For something I didn'twant in the first place.
But I just remember thinkinglike, yeah, you know, I'm happy.

(34:25):
I'm happy.
I was trying to express itand it was like I didn't
even know how to Wow.
Because, and, and, and obviouslylater on I realized that that
was just my defense mechanism.
It's

Kim (34:34):
It was a trauma response.

Kayley (34:35):
Yeah.
It was a trauma response.
I was like, well, okay, well,I'm not gonna feel pain.
I'm not gonna feel sad.
That way, I cannotfeel the thing at all.
That's right.
And now post, post-divorce,gosh, I cry all the time.
I have experienced explosivejoy, elation, man, I've been
high as a kite, not in thedrug way, but in the Holy

(34:56):
Spirit way where he's takenme to mountaintops and, and
it's not even circumstantial.
I've done some really coolthings in my life with the
Lord and you know, withoutthe Lord just in my career.
But nothing, nothing comparesto those quiet time moments
where it's me and God alone.
Yes.
And he reveals somethingto me that just lifts

(35:19):
my heart to the heavens.
That's right.
And I'm just like,wow, this is euphoria.
That's right.

Kim (35:37):
how that manifests.
You're gonna go throughseasons of life where you
have great victory and youbegin to agree with God about
your true identity, and youbegin to embrace yourself.
And you're not reallysuper struggling with that.
But then there'll betimes where you go through
another fiery furnace.
Yeah.
And what I've come to learnabout God is he takes us through

(35:59):
different fires to go afterthe same main stronghold in our
life at deeper, deeper level.

Kayley (36:07):
Interesting.
Wow.

Kim (36:08):
So the furnace changes, but the thing he's trying
to heal does not, what he'sdoing is, people say, I
went around this mountain.
I don't wanna go aroundthis mountain again.
So if you have the mountain ofself-loathing, listen close.
You're not going aroundthe mountain again.
You are going afterit deeper this time.
Mm. God is going after the root.

(36:30):
He knows, like he knowsthat he can't just pull that
whole thing out at once.
Like it would,

Kayley (36:36):
it would kill you.

Kim (36:37):
So much of our personhood is formed around trauma.
Yeah.
It would destroy us.
Yeah.
So he gently takes usthrough seasons of fire
to go deeper in that root.
And there's a scripture inJeremiah that says that he's the
God that, um, uproot and plants.
Mm. And um, and I personallyhave been through such a

(36:59):
season of uprooting andplanting in the last three
years and a fiery furnace.
And just a couple weeks ago,guess where I was sitting
in my, um, prayer chairlistening to John Bevere's,
Bait of Satan, again, doingforgiveness work again.
And, um, it was likethis time I, you know.
I'm not clueless about who needsto be on that list anymore.

(37:21):
Yeah.
And um, and I'm writing the listand I write a couple names and
then I put me, me, me, me, me.
I just put it onthere like six times.
'cause I knew I really needed todo some, some forgiveness
work with myself.
And, um, that morning,really early 3 or 3 30 or

(37:41):
4, the Lord had woken me upand taken me to Psalm 34.
And um, and I was like,wow, that's amazing.
It blessed my heart.
I went back to sleep inpeace and I'm doing this
forgiveness work, and the Lordsays, go back to Psalm 34.
Hmm.
So he had planted thatseed hours earlier.
For this moment, at the endof the scripture, it says,

(38:04):
um, the Lord freely pardonsthose he loves, he declares
them free and innocent.
This is the passion translation.
So I was like freely pardons,I mean freely pardons, and
then free and innocent.
And I heard him say tome, can you agree with

(38:27):
me that you are freelypardoned free and innocent?
That word innocent, that's hardbecause you, that's a word.

Kayley (38:37):
It is, it's, it's hard to adopt that

Kim (38:39):
because you know you're not Yeah.
In terms of youractual behavior record.
Yeah.
Right.
You've got a ledger.
But yes, you do have a ledger.
But Jesus said, though, you yoursins were as red, as crimson.
I have made them white as snow.
Yeah.
So you don't havea ledger with him.
If you've received Jesus.
And if you don't acceptand believe the fact that

(39:02):
you're freely pardonedfree and innocent, you're
invalidating what he didfor you on the cross.
Like yeah, it's a lose lose.
He loses.
You lose.
Yeah.
If you're like, sorry,I'm not free and innocent.
I did this and this andthis, and he's saying,
what about my blood?
What about my cross?

Kayley (39:18):
Then he did it in vain.

Kim (39:20):
Then he did it in vain for you.
And I can't let that be.
No.
So I'm sitting there in thatmoment going, your blood
can't be shed in vain for me.
I have to agree with you.
I want to agree with you.
But these words are like, wow.
Free and innocent.
Free of all sin.
Innocent, cleansed of all sin.
And I just said, yes, Lord,I will agree with you.
You, I will adopt whatyou say about me, even

(39:42):
though I don't feel it.
Even though it's hard todo when you see all the
mistakes you've made.
Yeah.
And even though you feellike seasons of your life
are so riddled with failure.
Mm-hmm.
Um, he's saying thatyou're free and innocent
and freely pardoned.
So I said, yes.
I agreed with him.
And then he said, now canyou give that to everyone
who's ever wronged you?

(40:05):
Oof.
I realize that one of thereasons people struggle so
much to forgive is becausethey can't forgive themselves.
You can't give away whatyou haven't received.
Wow.
You can't give away whatyou have not received

Kayley (40:18):
Well.
'cause like if you've forgivenyourself, then you know the
freedom that comes from that.
And so, and then also justletting other people off the
hook really contributes toeven more freedom for yourself.

Kim (40:29):
Well, let's, I'll say it this way.
I was like, okay, can Ideclare everyone who's
hurt me as freely pardoned?
And this is what the Lord said.
He's like, can you pardonthem in your court and let
them just be in my court?
Mm-hmm.
So it doesn't meanthey're pardoned with God.
He only is the only onewho can decide that.

Kayley (40:51):
Yeah, I was kind of struggling with some
forgiveness, I think,a couple years ago.
And I remember someoneexplaining it to me as
the transfer of debt.
Yes.
Of like, okay, well write theledger, write the ledger of
what that person owes you, andthen give it to the Lord and
say, Lord, you can have this.
Exactly.
I don't want responsibilityeven ever, you know, ever again.
And, but you know, that goesback to me to self-hatred

(41:11):
because I remember oneday the Lord showed me how
self-hatred and self-judgmentwas so full of pride.
Like why would I everassume to be judged when
he's the only judge?
That's right.
So I am now taking himoff the judgment seat and
putting myself on there.
Ooh.
And look at how I'mcondemning myself.
Wow.
Do I really wanna be onthe judgment seat or do

(41:34):
I want the good judge tobe on the judgment seat?
That's right.
That's just, I mean, there's somany facets to self-loathing,
but the prideful side ofit is like, okay, who do
you want to have justice?

Kim (41:47):
Well, anytime we disagree with what God says about us, it
is rooted in pride because we'resaying what I believe and what I
see and what I declare is truth.
Yeah.
And he's in his word saying,guess what my word is truth.
What I declare is truth.
So when we contradictthat, there's no other
source other than pride.

(42:08):
Yeah.
Now, sometimes it can be fear.
Mm-hmm.
We're afraid that we won't everbe who God says we are, but
that's when our pride steps inand protects us from the fear.
It always ends upbouncing over to pride.
Yeah.
So interesting.
You know,

Kayley (42:21):
I mean there's just never any fruit from fear ever.
No.
It's like the fruitcomes from faith.
Fruit comes from faith.
That, Lord, I believeI am who you said I am.
I am not going to mock thecross and what Jesus did and
sit here and hate and shamemyself for my own humanity
when that's how you made me.

(42:43):
And you knew that I was gonnado all the stupid crap that
I've done my whole life.
That's right.
You knew I was gonna misstepand say something stupid.
You knew that I was gonnatrip and fall and look like a
fool at, at any point in theday you knew that about me,
and yet you still called me.
You still put me in thisseat to do this podcast.
Even though sometimes Itrip over my words and I

(43:05):
have no idea what on earth.
I'm saying like, and youjust loved me through it.
Yeah.
That's just, he'stoo good to me, man.
The goodness of God.

Kim (43:17):
If we could see ourselves the way he saw
us and kind of step outsideof ourselves for a minute.
Yeah, like just get overyourself, step aside, and
just borrow his vision of you.
And if you don't knowwhat that is, ask him.
Yeah.
Lord, what do you seewhen you look at me?
Let him tell you.

(43:37):
Let him show you.
And you know, another bigrevelation I had as of
late about the self-hatredthing is, you know, we are
a spirit, soul and a body.
Mm-hmm.
Our soul is our mindwill and emotions.
And, um, when we reallysay, oh, I can't stand
myself, we are rejectingthe essence of ourself.

(43:58):
We're rejecting the uniqueness,we're rejecting, like of
all the people in all theworld, I hate me the most.
Yeah.
We are rejecting and despisingthis creation that God made
and our spirit, soul and body.
When they're disjointed anddisconnected with hatred.
Think about how manywomen hate their bodies.

Kayley (44:19):
I mean all of them.

Kim (44:21):
And you, you put hatred, which is a destructive,
dark force, and you.
Point that at your bodyand you wonder why your
body is going haywire.
Mm. Right.
And then you hate youressence and you wonder why
your spirit man isn't walkingin victory over your flesh.

(44:42):
Well, maybe it's becauseyou've rejected it.
Ooh, you've rejected it.
And I've recentlyso Lord, so good.
I repent.
I break my agreement withthe self-hatred that rejected
parts of myself or my wholeself and caused this disunity
and this being that you madethat's supposed to be unified

(45:02):
like the father, son, andHoly Spirit are in unity.
I'm not only supposed tobe in unity with them,
but unity within myself.
Yeah.
How do you live victoriouslywhen you hate parts of yourself?
I mean,

Kayley (45:14):
your whole soul's divided.

Kim (45:15):
You're divided.
A, a house divided againstitself cannot stand.
Cannot stand.
And a person who's strugglingwith self-loathing,
they are a house dividedagainst themselves.

Kayley (45:28):
Mm. And the enemy's just loving it because
he is out to steal, kill,and destroy, and destroy.
He wants to steal thedreams, steal the joy.
Kill your destiny.

Kim (45:40):
Yes.
Kill you if he could, butif he can't kill you, he's
happy to kill all the goodthings that God has for you.
Destroy everything God wants togive you and to steal whatever
he can out from under you.
And when we hate ourselvesand we welcome condemnation,
like I said, the word condemnmeans punishable by death.

(46:01):
Yeah.
We're inviting themurderer and the thief in.
We're saying, I agreethat I deserve that.
And that we wonderwhy we get it.

Kayley (46:11):
Yeah.
No, I just, I don'twanna walk that way.
Me either, man.
I mean, my favorite daysare the days that I have
just been with the Lord anddone what he said to do.
Yeah.
And listened to what he saidto me about me and believed it.

(46:33):
And I mean, the fruit that comesfrom that, the productivity that
comes from that, the joy andthe peace that comes from that.
I mean, those are myabsolute favorite days.
That's right.
Has nothing to do withlike, what I've achieved.
That's right.
Like my greatest, my greatestaccomplishment is knowing God.
Amen.
Because if I know him,then I'll, I'll hear

(46:53):
what he has to say.
I'll know his nature.
What he has to say is good.
It always makes me feellike a million bucks.
Like that's what Iwanna hear every day.
That's what I wannabelieve about myself.

Kim (47:04):
It's not because he tickles your ears.
He tells you hard things.

Kayley (47:07):
Oh, he does.

Kim (47:08):
He's not just saying, Kayley, you're the best thing
since sliced white bread.
You're my favorite.
I mean, he's tellingyou where to make
adjustments in your life.
Oh, yeah.
He's convicting you of sin, butit makes you feel like a million
bucks because he sets me free.
He's got you.
Yes.

Kayley (47:22):
Yeah.
He says, he's like, Hey, didyou know you were carrying that?
I'm like, oh, wow.
And then I feel a thousandpounds of lighter.
Hey, did you know?
Hey, did you know he's so kind?
He always asks me questionswhenever I'm like, Hey, what do
I do about this relationship?
And he's like, well, whatdo, what do you want?

(47:44):
I'm like, what?
You're just gonnaask me what I want?
He's like, yeah, I want youto remember what you wanted.
Remember what youtold me you wanted?
And I'm like, oh, yes, Lord.
That's what I wanted.
Wow.
That's not in this relationship.
Oh my goodness.
You're right.
I'll just, I'll never forgetthat it was in regards to a
romantic relationship and hehad to, he had to bring me back
to the nucleus of my desires,and it was because I was, he

(48:08):
was showing me that I was soquickly aborting them, and
he didn't tell me what to do.
He didn't say, you need todo this and stop doing this.
He wasn't a dictator.
That's right.
He was.
So, he just asked me, whatdo you want, like, how
good of a father is that?
Mm-hmm.

Kim (48:26):
He knows how to recalibrate us and, and get us thinking all
at the same time, and then toget us to tell ourselves the
truth that we need to hear.
He is a brilliant coach.
I mean, he's great.
Coaches ask great questions.
God asks the best questions.

Kayley (48:40):
The best questions.
Agreed.
Ugh.
That's why he is my best friend,

Kim (48:45):
expert level.

Kayley (48:47):
Okay.
So, you know, we're kind ofcoming towards the end and I
just, I wanna make sure thatwe leave anybody listening to
this with pragmatic tools tohelp them squash self-loathing.
And so what would yousay to those people?

Kim (49:02):
Well, first of all, I would say you have
to forgive yourself.
You can do all the identityin Christ confessions
and affirmations tillthe cows come home.
But if you're holding agrudge against yourself,
that that bitterness in youwill cause hatred toward you.
Hmm.
So that is paramount.

(49:23):
And it's exactly sogood what I said.
It's I forgiven and, and ifthere are specific things
that you've done that youjust can't let yourself
off the hook for, then youname that thing by name.
I forgive myself for,because Jesus forgave me for.
Yeah.
And, and however, if youhave to do that every day,

(49:44):
then forgiveness is step one.
Then beyond that, you, you, uh,we all will not see ourselves
valuable until we see ourselvesthrough the eyes of God.
And the Bible has justcountless verses about who
God says we are to him.
Mm-hmm.
Um, it's called youridentity in Christ.

(50:05):
When you step into faithin Christ, you step into
Christ, into the family ofGod and into a new identity.
The, the best metaphor I havefor it is the royal family.
Yeah.
You know, Kate Middletonwas not a royal.
She was, uh, you know, a Britishcitizen and she stepped into
an entirely new identity.

(50:27):
She now carries theidentity of the Royal Family
Protocol practices habits.
The, she can't wearopen toed shoes.
Isn't that tragic?
I just read that the other day.

Kayley (50:39):
She can't?

Kim (50:40):
She cannot wear open toed shoes as a royal.
Clothes toed shoes only.
Like there, and that's notreally identity thing, but like
there's this whole thing about,

Kayley (50:49):
I just got really self-conscious
wearing open toed shoes.

Kim (50:53):
You're still royal in my book, Kayley.
So, um, you know, just theidea that she has to carry
herself a certain way, presenta certain way, she is the
gonna be the next queen consortof, of, you know, British
Britain and it, all of its,uh, you know, surrounding
nations that it owns or I don'tknow how that works anyway.

(51:15):
Um, all the countries,all the land.
Um, so, but imagine the shiftin how she had to see herself.
Yeah.
Because she had to walk inthere and assimilate a way
of doing, being and thinkingthat she never had before.
That's what we'redoing in Christ.
We are assimilating a way ofdoing, being and thinking that

(51:38):
we didn't have before Christ.
And I mean, there'sa lot of resources.
People can go to mywebsite, thefewwomen.com
and our resource page.
And I have, uh, a resourcecalled the a ABCs of
Identity in Christ.
Ooh.
And it's all the versesin the Bible from A to Z?
Yes.
Oh.
And it's seven pages long.
Oh.

(51:59):
So just to give you a littlebit of a clue of how much
God thinks of you, it's sevenpages long and it's, I mean,
the references are listed.
It says who he saysyou are in the verse.
The verses aren'tall listed out.
So if all the verses arewritten out, it would be a
lot longer than seven pages.
And that's just tells youthat God could write a book
about who you are to himand who you are in him now.

(52:22):
So forgiveness andmeditating and agreeing,
meditating on, and agreeingwith who he says you are.
That's how youovercome self-loathing.
That's how you look in themirror and say, I like me.
Yeah.
I like how you made me.
I also, um, encourage people tofind out what their gifts are,

(52:42):
like their natural giftingsand their spiritual gifts,
and you'll start to say, wow,you, you made me this way
to do these things, and Ireally have fun doing them.
You did a good job with me.
God, it, it's notpride, it's gratitude.
Like there are times whereI'm like, thank you for
the gifts that you gave me.
I really enjoy usingthem, Lord, I really do.

(53:06):
It's so fun for me to dowhat you made me to do.
Thank you.
Yeah.
That's quite a contrast fromI cannot believe you made me
and allowed me to breathe.
What were you thinking?

Kayley (53:17):
But I mean, it's so, it's so obvious, right?
It's like we get given the giftand then in its infancy the gift
needs to be honed and shaped.
Yeah.
And as we're growing inour gift, we feel totally
insecure with it becauseit's not good enough.
And so the thing that shouldbe delightful to us is now
the bane of our existence.
And we hate it.
And we're so bad.

Kim (53:38):
It's something we're trying to master, but
we fear we never will.

Kayley (53:41):
Yes.
Mm-hmm.
I mean, like the amount ofhours I've performed on stage
and all the times that I'vetotally sucked, sang the
wrong note, sang out of pitch,did the wrong thing with my
guitar, all of this stuff.
It's like at some point Istopped commentating on it.
I would in the middle ofthe error, like make a face
or be frustrated at myself.

(54:03):
And, and I don't, I mean,that ended years ago.
On stage.
On stage, you know, you'rejust mad 'cause you're like, I
have to show everybody that Iheard what I just did wrong, so
that they know I'm not stupid.
You know?
It's like, it's so silly andit's like, okay, actually
you're just drawing attentionto the flaw, so instead
of drawing attention toit, just keep singing.

(54:24):
Just keep singing and focuson the next present moment.
The next second.
I mean, this is the reasonwhy I love Aretha Franklin.
You listen to her sing and shewas not commenting on the last
note she did eight notes ago.
She was right in the centerof every single note, allowing
I believe Holy Spirit, toinform exactly what she did.

(54:47):
She was so intuitive, sopracticed, so, so stewarding of
the present moment in the music

Kim (54:54):
almost of every note, right?

Kayley (54:55):
Of every note.
She didn't get out ahead.
She wasn't planning, oh, inabout five notes, I'm gonna do
this crazy run and everybody'sgonna be so excited about it.
You know?
No, she was just living momentto moment and that's what makes
her such an excellent singer.
It was intuitive and, and,and improv, improvised,
and, uh, awesome.
And so I think about her a lotwhen I share music and I would

(55:16):
say my best moments, my bestsongs, my best performances
were where I was livingpresent moment to
moment in the song.
Love it.
Not thinking ahead.

Kim (55:26):
I love it when you talk about Aretha,
you get so excited.

Kayley (55:30):
Well, I mean, she's, you know, she's a great one.
She's a great one to emulate.
But

Kim (55:34):
chasing Aretha Cha,

Kayley (55:35):
just chasing her down.
I'm just chasing her, you know?
But, um, no, this is so good.
And I, you know, I like all theyears that I've struggled with
self hatred, the seasons, I'vestruggled with self-hatred.
And, and I mean, even justlast year you looked at me
and you're like, Kayley, like,I'm, I'm worried for you.
Because I was so, sodeep in the trenches of

(55:56):
it not knowing who I am.
It's because I had allowedthe enemy's voice to rule me.
I was so steeped in what hethought of me that I totally
forgot what God thought of me.
In fact, I disbelievedwhat God thought of me.
I, I believed that Goddidn't wanna talk to me.
I believed thateverything I heard him

(56:17):
say, I had heard wrong.
I was rewriting history Wow.
Of my revelation from God basedon the fact of what the enemy
was saying to me in that season.
And man, I was struggling.
I was a mess.
I was not walking withlight, I don't think.
I mean, and you just,I'll just never forget

(56:38):
how you looked at me.
You're just like, I'm worriedfor you and you've never been
worried for me like that.
And it took, allit took was crazy.
I, it wasn't like I, I hada great impactful feeling
of, oh, I feel the cloudsparting and the shi the
chills and the shivers downmy spine of a breakthrough.
I just remember I stepped outinto the hall and I said, Lord.

(57:01):
You do speak to me, and Iclaim that in Jesus' name.
I break off in Jesus' name everylie that I agreed with the enemy
about me hearing your voice.
Wow.
I know.
I hear your voice.
I have a beautiful historyand record of hearing your
voice, of hearing the beautifulrevelation you've given to
me that has shaped my life,shaped other people's lives.

(57:22):
And I claim it once again.
And I rebuke thelies of the enemy.
Amen.
And I didn't feel any different,but I knew that the authority
came back immediately.
Wow.
Because that'sreally all it takes.

Kim (57:33):
So good.
So good.
Kayley.
And that was such a signof your growth, of anyone's
growth to be like, oh.
I slid down into the pit again.
And then to be ableto course correct.
Yeah.
By going, wait.
Okay.
See it for what it is.
Yes.
I'm using my authority.
I don't care how I feel.
I'm agreeing with God.

(57:53):
I'm not waiting for the emotion.
I'm not waitingfor an encounter.
I'm not waiting foran angel sighting.
No.
I'm just gonna use myauthority and get outta
this pit right now.
Yeah.
That's so powerful

Kayley (58:04):
for, I did not give you a spirit of fear,
but a spirit of love andpower and self-control.
Yes.
It's like that is whatwe have within us.
When we partner with HolySpirit, when we invite
Holy Spirit to dwell withinus, we have his authority.
Even though I'm human, simplyhuman full of flaws, I can
walk with the authority ofthe creator of the world.

(58:25):
Yes.
Like that's crazy thatI could behold that.

Kim (58:28):
Wow.
I love that.

Kayley (58:30):
It's so good.
jammies and talk about Jesusand people and problems and
victory and kingdom things,

Kim (58:50):
dreams.
We're having dreamslike interpreting
dreams and or dreams.
We're dreaming like with God.

Kayley (58:56):
Or the revelation we recently had.
It's everybody needsa spiritual mom.
Um, if she had the abilityto have you as a spiritual
child, I'm sure she would.

Kim (59:06):
Apparently.
I like the whole children thing.

Kayley (59:08):
I know, but I claim her and God knew that I claim her.
She's 11 kids, but I'm her 12.
It's fine.
It's fine, it's fine.
Um, uh, but anyway, to thatregard, if you don't have a
mother figure in your life,one that's counseling you and
mentoring you, why don't youjust pray and ask the Lord?
Yes.
Because he's got one for you.
Yeah.

(59:28):
He's got a spiritualfather for you.
Yes.
He has those roles foryou, and he's wanting
you to ask him for that.
He wants to know that you'reinterested in talking with him
and asking him, it says in.
Psalm 34.
Those who look to the Lordwill be radiant with joy.
And that means to turnyour gaze upon him.

(59:50):
It's actually not justturning your vision.
It's turning your soul.
Wow.
To turn upon the Lord.
It's to turn your whole soulto him and ask for help.
And it says You'llbe radiant with joy.
You will glow.
Don't you wanna be radiant?
I wanna be radiant.
I do.
It's so good.

Kim (01:00:08):
I wanna be radiant with his joy.

Kayley (01:00:10):
Yeah.
You might freak people outa little bit 'cause you'll
be glowing everywhere.
And people arelike, what is that?

Kim (01:00:14):
I mean, I think about that.
Moses came down from themountain and says, radiant.
He was glowing.

Kayley (01:00:18):
People were freaked out.

Kim (01:00:19):
They were scared.
They were scared becauseit was supernatural.

Kayley (01:00:22):
They don't know what to do with it.
How do you behold it?

Kim (01:00:25):
This world needs supernatural radiance.
Supernatural.
A lot of things right now.
It's only gonna happen when wepartner and agree with God and
we let him use us to do it.

Kayley (01:00:36):
Yes.
Amen to that.
So everybody, I hope youenjoyed this episode.
Please go on mywebsite, biblebish.com.
If there was somethingthat shook you to your
core, please tell me.
There's a testimonialpage on there.
I want you to justtell me your testimony.
I wanna celebrate it.
I wanna be able topray for you and.
I, I love you.

(01:00:56):
I'm so glad that Kim wasable to join me in this.
I had no idea what we were gonnatalk about until it slapped
me in the face and I realizedself-loathing was the thing.
And so I hope you'reable to take these tools
that it blesses you.
And I just wanna, Ijust wanna pray for
them actually right now.
And Jesus' name.
Lord, I just pray thatanybody listening to this,
that if they are strugglingwith self condemnation,

(01:01:17):
self-loathing, God, I praythat you redirect their ears.
Mm-hmm.
Redirect their hearing sothat they're actually hearing
you and not the enemy.
Help them discern the differencebetween that conviction and that
life, death condemning thereLord, that the enemy is bringing
into their ears, into theirhearts and souls and minds.

(01:01:38):
And so, God, I just praythat you anoint their
heads, anoint their hearts.
Let them be deliveredfrom the forgiveness.
The forgiveness thatthey need to, to take
a hold for themselves.
Lord, guide them into thatconversation with themselves.
And even if it's hard, evenif they're doing it kicking
and screaming, Lord, showthem what it really looks like

(01:01:58):
to, for to forgive becauseyou're the ultimate forgiver.
Lord, if we need to learnhow to forgive, we just
gotta look to you, Lord.
And so God, I just pray thatyou set them free right now
in Jesus' name, from anyself harboring of hatred and
loathing, God in Jesus' name.
That is not your story for us.
That is not what you'rewriting for us, that

(01:02:20):
you've got freedom for usavailable to us right now.
In Jesus name.
Amen.
Amen.
Y'all be good.
This is your Bible Bishreporting for duty.
I hope you were changed today.
That is all.