Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Co-Hosts (00:10):
Hi, I am Carrie, a
stroke survivor, and a member of
BIND.
Hi.
And I'm Brittany.
I'm a brain injury survivor anda member of BIND Today.
Our guest today is Dr SashaBlaskovich or Dr B as many
patients like to say.
Um, is a board certifiedchiropractic doctor who
specializes in assessing andtreating head and neck injuries.
(00:33):
After playing football for overa decade and working with
injured patients for over 20years, Dr.
Blaskovich has devoted hiscareer to helping people going
through similar problems as hehas gone through with his head
and neck and has focused hiscontinued education and injuries
for more than 20 years.
Bernard (00:55):
Opinions shared by the
guests of the show are their own
and do not necessarily representthe views of the hosts bindwaves
or the Brain Injury Network.
This podcast is forinformational purposes only, and
it's not a substitute forprofessional medical advice, the
diagnosis or treatment.
Always seek the advice of ahealthcare provider with any
(01:15):
questions you may have regardinga medical condition.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Thank you.
Co-Hosts (01:22):
So to get us started,
tell us a little bit about
yourself and how you becameinterested in being a
chiropractor and what inspiredyou to join this field?
Dr. B (01:32):
Well, initially the
reason I wanted to become a
chiropractor was because of ahip issue I was having as a
12-year-old or 9-year-oldplaying soccer for several
years.
Where my leg would go numb whenI would, um, run around.
But other than that, I was thestrongest, tallest kid on the
team.
But it was just that poundingthat would just shut something
(01:53):
down where my leg would go numb.
And so it was a chiropractorback at that time that my dad
was seeing for a herniated disc,um, who.
Offered to have a look at me,'cause my dad was telling him
about me.
And uh, he basically said, uh,you know, you've got a 19
millimeter leg lengthdifference.
Your spine is out and I need todo a few adjustments, give you a
(02:15):
heel lift.
And at that point in time I wasgoing to.
From doctor to doctor for abouttwo years, all telling my
parents that I wasn't strongenough and my body just wasn't
able to handle sports and Ishould stop playing sports.
And then this chiropractorliterally fixed me in a span of
six weeks with a heel lift and afew adjustments.
And I was sold.
I wanted to do what he did.
(02:36):
Um, he was excited about what hedid.
He loved talking about hispatient success stories.
Um, it was just, it was superexciting.
And then I had decided at theage of 12 I wanted to be a
chiropractor, not knowing thatthe reason I would be, or the,
the way I would be practicingchiropractic would've nothing to
do with, you know, hips and leglength differences, but with,
(02:58):
excuse me, misdiagnosedconcussions.
Um, or, or misdiagnosed, uh,upper cervical ligament injuries
masquerading as concussiondiagnoses.
And so that's what brings us totoday is basically, you know, I
devoted my career.
After finally figuring out whatwas wrong with me after a
football injury in university,which I never would've been
playing.
(03:19):
Um, had my parents listen tothese doctors telling them that
I shouldn't play sports anymore.
So maybe they should havelistened.
But, um, anyways, thechiropractor did, um, fix me
from that and, and, and got mein direction where I wanted to
do what he did.
Um, only lo and behold to, youknow, finish chiropractic
school, um, several years afterthis injury and, and have the,
(03:40):
the knowledge the.
The basis and the ability to goand learn, um, things about this
problem that I have, that theaverage person in the public
wouldn't know where to start.
Uh, and the average doctor insociety doesn't, can't be
bothered trying to learn aboutit because they're busy enough
and focused enough on whatthey're doing.
Uh, assuming that this is such arare and obscure thing that I
(04:01):
had.
Uh, well, it turns out that it'sactually extremely common to
some varying degree of severity,uh, where the person has
injuries or an injury that.
Results in damaged ligaments inthe upper cervical spine or
upper neck, rendering thatregion to mobile, whether it's
hypermobile or unstable, bothare different variations of too
(04:22):
much mobility.
And that excessive mobility thenputs pressure repeatedly on the
brainstem causing someone likemyself or other people.
And again, it's very, verycommon to have some level of
concussive like symptomspersistently for either many
years or the rest of their life.
That go undiagnosed and, andsometimes it's progressive.
(04:44):
And oftentimes these patients,uh, find me either by word of
mouth or online support groupsor what have you.
Um, and lo and behold, they havevery similar injuries to what I
had or what I still have.
Uh, that we're undiagnosed and,and the diagnosis helps them
gain direction and gain a sortof a, a, a sense of purpose and
(05:05):
path to, to getting some benefitor some improvement to this, uh,
you know, so-called lifelongsentence.
Co-Hosts (05:12):
Okay, so now I'm gonna
ask you a que, this isn't
exactly the question I had.
We're gonna, I'm gonna come backto that one.
But, I mean, we're braininjured.
I mean, I was a stroke survivor,so obviously I didn't have.
Anything to do with that kindastuff.
I see a chiropractor for otherissues.
Um, but yeah, but so you're notsaying that necessarily, like
(05:34):
the issues that you're talkingabout, like you had, that wasn't
caused from a brain injury orwas it caused from concussions
that were just undiagnosed?
I guess that's what I'm tryingto understand
Dr. B (05:44):
That's a, yeah, that's a
very deep question because
ultimately, and, and the, the,you know, I've, I've talked
about this on many podcasts, howthe upper cervical instability,
which then results in, you know,repeated malpositioning of the
bones.
Um, and, and it's, and it's, um,persistent.
(06:05):
Causing basically in a reallysimplified fashion, the drainage
tube that's inside the spinalcord and brainstem to be
slightly kinked.
And when that brainstem drainageportion gets slightly kinked,
the amount of fluid that thebrain is making, which has to
equal the amount that isdraining through that upper
neck, is no longer equal.
(06:25):
So there's less draining at, ata, in a, in a tiny fraction then
that's being produced.
So every time that there's a, a,a drainage.
Moment, there's a little bitthat back pools.
And so that little bit, thatback pools then stays stuck
inside the brain and inside theskull eventually causing a mild
expansion, if you will, of thatfluid cavern where it's being
(06:46):
produced.
And then that does compressbrain tissue resulting in brain
related symptoms.
But the true origin of thatexpanding pressure, and it's not
always, it's not a constantthing.
It flues with relation to the.
Unstable positioning of thatupper neck, then the per person
gets diagnosed with a brainrelated, um, problem.
(07:07):
But the actual origin of thatdistension or that pressure
increase isn't actually comingfrom the brain.
It's coming because of the upperneck, having that glitch,
reducing the amount of drainage.
That then causes back pooling,and then you get brain
compression, mild compression,and it can cause, you know, tons
of things like visual changes,uh, cognition, uh, memory loss,
(07:29):
brain fog, and just a constantpressure inside the brain, just
like feeling like you'reconstantly having a mild flu.
And those are sort of thesimplest, uh, symptoms that
people generally will portrayhaving that, and unfortunately
when you, when the the MRI isdone over their brain, there
isn't a massive or a grossamount of fluid accumulation
(07:50):
that is perceived by theradiologist.
So it gets d uh, reported on asnormal or unremarkable.
But when you've seen thousandsof these scans, you can see what
a person's scan looks like ofthe brain where they don't have
that accumulation.
And then you can also see thesubtle difference with somebody
who does have that mildaccumulation, which likely has
bearing on their symptoms.
(08:10):
But you know, when I discussthat with radiologists or
neurologists or neurosurgeons,in their opinion, these are
normal variants and, andnon-entities for that person.
But I humbly disagree with that.
Co-Hosts (08:22):
Sure.
Yeah, that kind of makes sense.
So, yeah.
Um.
Happened to me.
So, yeah, because my, my braininjury was from a car accident
and so I broke, like my airbagsdidn't employed, and then I
broke my seat with my head and Iblacked out.
So it was like a really hard,and then I went to my
neurologist and he's like, okay,go home, turn off the lights.
(08:44):
So I did, I went back to school,which was two hour drive.
So, um, but at the hospitalafter accident they're like, oh,
you have her 80 this and your Cfour C five.
And so.
Then later it was like postconcussion.
So mine was a cat and mousegame, but I still have problems
like my hands go numb each time,and then I get cricks in my neck
all the time.
But yeah.
Dr. B (09:05):
Yeah.
So, and then, so the mid neck isalways the whiplash component
that is recognized, I guess.
Whereas when you get to theupper neck, the, the momentum of
the 12 pound head, you know,being decelerating or
accelerated, having, having tobe somehow decelerating or
slowed down by something.
And when the, you know, eventhappens that a person, for
(09:26):
example, isn't braced for.
Then this 12 pound head has somuch momentum that can only be
slowed down because there's nobracing or no guarding, muscular
guarding by ligaments.
And those ligaments will fail tosome degree, whether they fully
tear or they just stretch abunch of fibers.
No matter how you dice it orslice it, you end up with too
(09:46):
much mobility after that.
And that too much mobility isn'tactually a good thing.
So this whole notion that a, aperson has a great range of
motion, uh, that might sometimesbe pathologic.
Co-Hosts (09:57):
Interesting.
So, um, other than likeautomobiles, else caused
whiplash?
Dr. B (10:08):
Sorry, say that.
Co-Hosts (10:10):
Um, so what, uh, what
other causes of whiplash instead
of automobiles, like is thereany other causes that
Dr. B (10:16):
Oh, absolutely.
Yeah.
Bar fights, slip and fallsskiing, horseback riding, um,
soccer, uh, any kind of contactsport.
So football is probably one ofthe most common ones.
And then, you know, soccerprobably follows that in hockey,
ice hockey.
So there's no shortage of, um,you know, examples I guess in
the, in the professional leaguesof, uh, people getting quote
(10:39):
unquote concussed.
But when you look at the gamefootage or the film footage of
that, you know, moment wherethey got.
So-called, you know, their headbashed.
There's a lot of cases wherethere isn't a massive head
impact, but there is impact thatcauses a, a forceful rotation of
the neck.
And so that, you know, rotationcomponent is what damages these
upper neck ligaments.
'cause the main rot amount ofrotation in the head or the
(11:01):
neck, sorry, comes between C oneand C two, the top two bones.
And so when you have a forcefulrotation of that area, you will
have a predisposition todamaging ligaments.
Which then puts you into thesame cascade, like I explained,
uh, of re repeated andpersistent misalignment causing
sort of the drainage channel tobe reduced, somewhat, causing
(11:22):
the back backflow into thebrain, causing then the
brain-like symptoms, which, youknow, we get labeled with, you
know, post-concussive syndrome.
Co-Hosts (11:30):
Sure.
So when you just said that in mybrain, I'm a, I'm a hockey fan,
so, um, in my brain I'm thinkingin hockey fights or like boxing.
That moment you see the, you seethe lights go out in that
person.
And you're like, oh, he wasknocked out.
You like, you know, he's knockedout.
That's that moment of whiplash.
(11:50):
I mean, maybe, maybe, can you,we all think we know what
Whiplash is.
Maybe give us the textbookdefinition of whiplash
Dr. B (11:58):
Well, whiplash.
Whiplash.
Yeah.
So whiplash is a mechanism ofmotion.
It's not an actual injury.
So to diagnose somebody with awhiplash injury, it, it's
technically incorrect.
So whiplash is an acceleration,deceleration phenomenon that,
um, is, is the motions that thehead and neck go through.
So that's, that's what whiplashactually is.
(12:18):
And then the true diagnosis, ifyou were to really dissect it.
Uh, medically and scientificallywould be, you know, the person
sustained a whiplash event andthey sustained then, uh, either
grade one, grade two, gradethree sprains of whatever
ligament you can.
Uh.
Properly name or whateverligaments you can properly name.
(12:40):
And in order to name thoseligaments, you have to do motion
x-ray or video fluoroscopy,x-ray of the person's neck in
motion so that you can see whichsegments, for example, you know,
are sliding in inappropriatelyor gapping inappropriately
compared to their neighbors.
And then by measuring thoseamounts, you can determine then
that.
(13:01):
You know, the degree of severityof the, of the damage to the
ligament, but more importantlythat the ligament is compromised
because it's supposed torestrict that motion.
And if you see an excess motion,then you can say this person had
a whiplash and they sustained aC four five anterior
longitudinal ligament sprayinggrade two.
And so what that means is thatperson is gonna have too much
(13:23):
movement at C four five in thebackwards plane.
They might have it in theforwards with the posterior
longitudinal ligament as well,in which case you can almost
guarantee, or you can guaranteethat within 7, 10, 12, 15 years,
that person will havedegenerative arthritis at C four
five and so C four five, C fivesix probably in the reverse
(13:44):
order.
So five, six, and then four fiveare by and far the most common
areas in the cervical spinewhere you see degenerative
changes in the average person.
In addition to the fact thattheir normal curvature, which is
supposed to be concave in theback, is either straightened or
reversed.
And then that causes a abnormalmechanics in that region of the
(14:05):
spine.
Plus to add fuel to the fire,you have excessive motion,
excessive friction, andexcessive wearing down or
breaking down of the disc or thecartilage in between.
And then, like I said, 7, 10, 12years later, you do an x-ray and
you're like, oh, this the personhas degenerative arthritis.
Well, I've even seen thatdegenerative arthritis in
somebody who's 23 years old whosustained one of these injuries
(14:27):
when they were 12.
Co-Hosts (14:29):
Sure.
Dr. B (14:29):
A 23-year-old shouldn't
have degenerative arthritis at C
five six.
That's something you technicallyexpect to see in somebody who's
55, 65, 70 years old due tonormal wear and tear, which I
don't believe exists.
But seeing it in somebody youngand then listening to their
history or or dissecting theirhistory, there is an event that
led to that.
(14:50):
Like I said, it takes, you know,7, 10, 12, 15 years to finally
develop into degenerativearthritis, which is visible in
an x-ray, but it absolutely islinked to that event.
Co-Hosts (15:00):
Okay.
And, um, that all makes sense.
So, but just because you haveone of these cervical spine
injuries or, or even a whiplash.
Event we'll just say, um,doesn't necessarily, I mean, I
am, you know, I'm not a doctor.
I just pretend to know what I'msaying.
Dr. B (15:19):
Uh.
Co-Hosts (15:20):
I know.
No, no, you haven't.
It, it's good.
That's the whole point.
We do This is so that we canbetter understand, but you can
have this cervical damage thatdoesn't necessarily mean you
ended up with a brain injury.
I mean, now we know, we do knowconcussion equals brain injury
or some, most likely, some level
Dr. B (15:38):
It, it influences the
brain.
Yeah, so I think a, a, a strongdelineation between a true brain
injury, which you can actuallythen see on scans, and there are
scans that can highlight or, ormake hotspots on, on the brain
tissue to say that there's ametabolic change and therefore
the brain was injured.
But when that's all done and youdon't see anything, then the
influence that is beingperceived as brain-like related.
(16:01):
Has to be coming from somewhereelse.
And so this subtle accumulationof increased fluid causing
increased intracranial pressure,um, resulting in compressive
forces on brain tissue andneurons, which will then start
either glitching or hyper firingor doing something that they're
not supposed to is happening.
So it's not directly a braininjury, but it's an injury to
(16:22):
that region that has aninfluence or an impact on the
brain Mechanically.
Co-Hosts (16:27):
Okay, and
Dr. B (16:28):
And I do believe long
term with people that are like
that or that have that scenario,and again, depending on the
severity of that scenario,likely leads to some form of
chronic prog, chronicdegenerative disorder that we've
given names to, such asdementia, Alzheimer's, A LS, ms,
Parkinson's.
I believe those are all somehowdirectly linked to this
(16:51):
phenomenon long term.
So if someone's had this fordecades and it's been
undiagnosed.
And potentially they've beendoing all the wrong treatments
for it, sort of perpetuating theinstability, if you will.
Um, they're predisposed to, uh,acquiring one of those
conditions later on.
Co-Hosts (17:07):
Okay.
All right.
Brittany (17:09):
So we also talked
about like the conditions and
your brain being heard alsocause brain fog.
So how does the cervical spineplay a role the occurrence of
brain fog?
like headaches and dizziness,and what exactly is brain fog?
Dr. B (17:25):
I think brain fog is just
a term that people have given to
just not feeling clear in theirdecision making, in their
perceiving, in their vision, intheir hearing, uh, just in how
they feel balance andcoordination wise.
That there's just somethingthat's sluggish and not sort of
clear and, and firing on allcylinders, uh, as, as they
(17:47):
perceive that it should or asthey recall that it used to
before they had these injuries.
Where they could just, you know,without any effort, have things
fall into place and be able tomultitask and be able to
concentrate on a task and beable to, you know, be distracted
from that task and then quicklyget back to it and not, you
know, lose their train ofthought.
Um, those are basically sort ofthe phenomena that would be
(18:10):
diagnosed or defined by peopleas brain fog, um, and the
cervical spine.
So that back pooling literally.
I tie back to that would beprobably the main caus ator.
And then when you talk aboutheadaches, that increased
pressure is a version or a a, ameans by which the increased
pressure can be perceived aspain by somebody.
(18:31):
So AKA headache, but moreimportantly, the little
intrinsic muscles or the deepestmuscles in the upper neck.
That would be trying to thenstabilize the unstable upper
spine when the ligaments havebeen damaged.
So they all have an intricateconnection to the brainstem and
brain coverings.
The spinal cord coverings calledthe dura matter, so that's the
(18:52):
outermost covering of the spinalcord, brainstem and brain.
And these muscles actually havemyo dural bridges, which are
basically muscle to duraconnections that are intended to
actually be there to make surethat the dura never folds back
in against the brainstem orspinal cord.
But it's always kept.
It's clear of contacting thebrainstem and spinal cord,
(19:16):
excuse me.
But when these muscles getreally, really tight while
they're trying to fight andhold, uh, this instability
together, those, uh, myo duralbridges get more tension put on
them.
So you'll get a dural headache.
Because of the Myo Duro bridgebeing hypertense.
And then by releasing themuscles with just acupressure,
(19:36):
you can release the tension onthe muscle.
Release the tension on the MyoDuro bridge.
Release the tension on the dura,and reduce the headache.
And the key feature or factorthere is when you're pressing on
those muscles, they shouldtrigger a referral into the
headache spot.
Like say a person's feeling, aforehead, headache, or headache
behind their eyes, or a templeheadache.
When you press on these musclesup here, there will likely be a
(19:58):
trigger point referral, eithergoing to the forehead, going in
the behind the eyes, or to thetemple actually making that
headache that they're alreadyperceiving feel worse.
And when you then release thatmuscle.
That trigger point and it easesoff.
Then the actual backgroundheadache is less so they will
actually have a reduction in theheadache.
But initially to treat it, youfind the trigger point in the
(20:19):
neck that refers to theirheadache spot and you pulverize
it basically causing during thetreatment sort of an
accentuation of the headache.
But then after you're done, thebaseline headache will drop.
Co-Hosts (20:31):
Okay.
Dr. B (20:31):
probably the most common,
whether we call that a muscle
tension headache or acervicogenic headache or a, or a
dural headache.
Um, they all are basically onein the same and they all also
resemble migraines with, youknow, flashes before your eyes,
dark spots.
So people often get diagnosedwith migraines and all sorts of
migraine type protocols are, youknow, initiated sometimes with
(20:52):
success.
But I would say more often thannot, with no success.
And that's because they'retreating they're, it's not a
vascular headache.
It's an actual mechanical muscleand MyoD dural bridge and dural
headache.
Carrie (21:04):
Okay, so what, what
would you say maybe are like
some more common symptoms forsomeone to look at?
Because like we know if you geta splitting headache like you've
never gotten before, that aboutto come to end.
That it could very well be ananeurysm about to burst and it's
get to the hospital, you know,oh, I just have, I have constant
(21:24):
headaches or.
maybe is that one symptom thatyou would say, okay, this is
where you need to say, I need tomaybe take a different look and
see if it's something with myalignment as opposed to.
You know, I've been there, I'vegotten an MR.
I am not, I don't have ananeurysm, I don't have this, but
in migraines, you know, it's notreally a migraine, but it's
(21:46):
definitely kind of concerning.
I keep having a headache.
Dr. B (21:49):
Yep.
Co-Hosts (21:50):
kind of symptoms would
you look for or say, or you
would know to go, okay, maybe Ishould go ask a chiropractor
about this?
Dr. B (21:57):
Yeah, and I would say not
every chiropractor is proficient
in this.
Um, I would seek out a uppercervical chiropractor
personally, uh, who focuses onthe Atlas region, um, but just
headaches alone.
Are rare in this patientdemographic.
So maybe with a, a brain injury,it is just a headache.
(22:19):
But the patients that I see inmyself included the, the flux of
symptoms usually includes eitherblurry vision, double vision,
ringing in the ears, fullness inthe ears, uh, like a constant
sinus pressure or postnasaldrip, sorry, hoarseness of the
voice.
Um, heart palpitations, likethe, basically the heart racing,
(22:40):
breathing difficulties, urinaryurgency, constipation, diarrhea,
uh, balancing, coordinationissues, fine motor, like they
feel like they're kind ofvibrating a little bit.
So those are all brainstemrelated components that if a
person is experiencing those.
Not just a headache but aheadache as well potentially.
(23:01):
Then the likelihood that theupper neck is involved in
everything that they'reexperiencing is really high.
Really, really high.
And then, like I said, seekingout an upper cervical
chiropractor who can possiblytriangulate by x-ray to say,
okay, you're C1 one ismalpositioned in so many degrees
tilt and so many degreesrotation, and we're gonna make
(23:21):
an attempt at aligning that, um,is absolutely, you know A very
critical thing to try.
And in the cases where a patienthas done that and repeatedly
that is done and potentiallygives them some short-lived
benefit, but very quicklyrecurs, in which case, you know,
the chiropractor would say this,you know, your adjustments are
not holding.
(23:43):
Then my suspicion would stronglyrise to say, okay, there's
possibly ligament damage upthere, which would be a, a
logical reason as to why it'snot holding, and that, that that
person should then logicallyundergo a motion x-ray to see if
they indeed do have an unstableupper cervical spine, which will
then explain everything.
(24:04):
And there are very few motionx-rays out there to diagnose
this, but it is the goldstandard for diagnosing excess
motion in the cervical spine
Brittany (24:15):
Okay.
So what form of treatment, um,have you pursued?
Dr. B (24:20):
Myself?
Brittany (24:22):
Um, just in general
for the symptoms that you see in
patients
Dr. B (24:26):
like for the, for the
upper cervical instability?
Co-Hosts (24:29):
Yes.
Mm-hmm.
Dr. B (24:30):
Yeah, so there are are
three basic sort of categories,
least invasive to most invasive.
So the least invasive would bebasically the, the ischemic
compression or the acupressureor the sustained pressure on the
selective muscles in the uppercervical spine, and sometimes
the jaw or the, the chewingmuscles or the, the, the
clenching muscles.
(24:50):
And then if, and that'sbasically gonna give a temporary
reset to those muscles and makethem functional for a period of
time, they will tighten up againbecause the actual, they're not
the problem, they're respondingto the problem.
'cause the problem is damagedligaments resulting in excessive
movement of the bones, whichthose muscles then try to
mitigate.
So releasing those musclesrepeatedly, which is basically
what I've been doing for thelast 24 years, is very
(25:12):
effective.
But the, the repeated repetitivenature of having to do that is
not something that everybody iswilling to grasp or accept.
And so the next step beyond thatwould be some kind of a
regenerative therapy, whichwould be interventional
medicine.
So either platelet rich plasmaor stem cell injections, which
(25:33):
then always require the motionX-ray as evidentiary diagnostic
modality to show where there isexcessive motion so that the
doctors that inject the plateletrich plasma or the stem cells
know exactly where to go, sothey're not blindly just doing
it everywhere and hoping for thebest.
And then if that is notsuccessful enough for the
individual who's dealing withthese problems, then the last
(25:55):
ditch effort is basically fusionsurgery.
Where the C one and C two arebasically, excuse me, fused
together surgically, in whichcase the instability becomes
completely immobile, which meansthere's no longer any brain stem
irritation by C one and C two.
And I guess there is a fourthoption is just to, you know.
Learn to live with it and, and,and accept the fact that you're
(26:18):
gonna repeatedly have that,which is unfortunately what most
people, uh, are in, whoeventually discover then this,
this acupressure or the stemcells and PRP or the surgical
options.
But sometimes they're searchingfor, you know, decades before
they get to that point.
And thankfully with theinternet, people are in chat
groups and support groups wherethey're exposed to these, these
(26:38):
concepts.
And I think that expeditestheir, you know, getting to that
point much faster than hopingthat their medical doctors.
Or neurologists or whateverdoctor they're seeing is gonna
guide them in that direction'cause they won't.
Carrie (26:51):
No, I think that's
great.
I'm so glad that we had you ontoday, Dr.
B, because this, I mean, again,like you said, this is not the
normal information that peopleseek out when they go to a
chiropractor, but it definitelymakes lot of sense to me what
you're saying.
And so I'm glad that we had youon we appreciate you taking the
time out and hope you have asafe drive the rest of the way
to Seattle today.
(27:12):
Thanks for coming on.
Appreciate it.
Brittany (27:15):
Until next time.
Until next time.
Rick (27:19):
We hope you've enjoyed
listening to bindwaves and
continue to support Brain InjuryNetwork in our nonprofit
mission, we support brain injurysurvivors as they reconnect into
life, the community, and theworkplace.
And we couldn't do that withoutgreat listeners like you.
We appreciate each and every oneof you.
(27:40):
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(28:09):
Please continue watching.
Until next time.