Episode Transcript
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Thank you.
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all right good morning everybody we are back and it is the 250th episode we can still count
excited to be with everybody today so like i said this is bitcoin veteran spaces
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episode number 250 where we talk about bitcoin my name is bob van kirk i'll be your host this
morning i'm joined by captain trips uh thank you for joining us we have morning bob hey good morning
we have neil we have pubby we have texas toast it's going to be an exciting day an exciting week
lots on tap going on this week uh in fact uh captain trips and texas toast are going to be
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uh taking over for me on wednesday while i have another obligation uh so that'll be exciting and
And then on Thursday, we will actually have the Mayan Bitcoin Conference, some speakers from there to tell us all about their conference going on in Mexico on.
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Well, I don't have the dates, but it's early December.
I think it might be the 5th and the 6th.
Don't have that in front of me, but we'll find out more on Thursday.
So please join us for that.
But let's take a look real quick at the time chain.
Where are we at here?
Looks like we are at Bitcoin Blockhite.
Just found a new one, 911,641, with the Bitcoin price sitting around 111,650, which means you
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could still pick up 896 sats for each U.S. dollar.
And wanted to remind you guys here before we get started with this 250th episode that
Bitcoin Veterans is having their second annual summit on November 10th and 11th in Nashville,
Tennessee.
Come one, come all.
Should be fun. If you're looking to learn how to fire a gun, we'll be doing that safely on day two, range day.
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Day one will be the conference. You can feel free to sign up and join either one or both.
We're looking for people who want to get involved as well.
Speaker, panel topics, volunteers.
And of course, if you just want to come and hang out, we would love to have you do that too.
BitcoinVeterans.org forward slash summit 2025 to get involved and get plugged in. But guys,
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you know, numbers are just numbers, right? But it is, I think, something to be, there is something
to be said for this organization, Bitcoin Veterans. Lots of people doing a lot of great
things in the back channels for Bitcoin veterans. I just do my small part by helping do this show
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and many others contribute. And so just want to say thank you. If you've come up on stage
in the last 250 episodes, thank you so much for contributing, for giving your time, your energy.
We want to help people and hopefully this space makes people think, makes people understand Bitcoin a little bit more.
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And yeah, just a good time to be in the space and thankful for all of you guys who listen as well.
We wouldn't be doing this if people weren't here each day trying to learn, trying to get better, trying to improve their lives, their families, their communities.
and so super excited to be able to celebrate this one,
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especially on a Monday with you guys.
And so thanks again.
And sure, we're going to hop into it and have some fun this morning.
Nothing crazy planned.
It's just a number, 250, but it is something to celebrate.
So once again, thanks to everybody for being here.
And with that, want to go around the horn real quick
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and say good morning to some of the regulars
and maybe some people that are new.
Before we do that, though, guys, please do re-post the space.
And if you'd like to come up and chat with us here on the 250th episode,
please do hit that microphone button and always welcome your chats in that comment section,
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the purple pill if you have questions, comments, anything like that.
Please throw those in there.
We'll try to get to them during the show.
All right.
with that I want to say good morning I know Kyle has he's pulling dual duty here so maybe he's
around but Captain Trips if you're around say good morning otherwise we'll move on to the rest of the
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panel Neil go ahead yeah good morning Bob man you know that feeling when you're like deep down in a
rabbit hole and then you burrow a little bit laterally and you just find a whole other network
of connected rabbit holes. That's where I'm at and it feels really good.
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Nice. Yeah, maybe we can touch on some of that this morning. Pubby, how are you this morning?
Yo, good morning. Yeah, hey, Bitcoin's working as advertised. Grown men who over five years
watched Bitcoin do a 25x are now crying at 110,000.
Woe is me.
So yeah, that's Bitcoin in general.
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And the first start of Nod's versus core debate, I'm out of here.
Got enough for that over the last weekend.
Thank you, sir.
And congrats on 250.
Yeah, thank you so much.
I don't think we'll touch much on the node debate this morning, but maybe if somebody
wants to throw a monkey wrench into it.
uh texas toast often a co-host uh how are you this morning i was just just a regular plug this
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morning bob i had a great weekend the day i had a birthday for my daughter and a lot of people
showed up it was great um also somebody close you you know take a take a second neil when you get a
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minute to pop your head out of that rabbit hole, get a breath of fresh air every once
in a while.
You're going to need it.
But all good this morning.
Remember that life is fleeting, so do good work.
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Yeah, thanks for that.
And as always, thanks for being here.
Coleman, how are you, sir?
yeah either uh coleman or kyle oh i stepped on you go ahead
no go for it cop i was just saying hello i'm on uh sorry we're glad there's a
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we're working on uh the summit that's in november 10th uh with some of the vets so
just going over some of the details and speakers and
so on and so forth.
Yeah, a lot of planning going on.
And thanks for doing that in the background.
But I do have to have a chat with the board here for Bitcoin Veterans
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scheduling a conference call at the same time as our 250th episode.
Ridiculous.
Not just kidding.
The conference is important.
So thanks for doing all that there.
Coleman, how are you this morning?
hey i'm doing good good morning everybody and like bob has already said thanks everybody for
joining us and sticking with us for 250 episodes i know the the ride wasn't smooth especially in
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the beginning when uh yours truly was hosting but i am very impressed with bob what bob has
been able to do so congratulations bob well i do have to say coleman we miss you up here and um
yeah you carried the torch for a long time hoping to get you back in the mix at some point we'll
coax you up here more and more. Hopefully I know schedules don't always allow and it takes a team.
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And so I don't do this all by myself. Takes all of you guys. So really appreciate it. This is
fun. I don't want to do too much back padding here, but it's it has been fun and it has been
quite the ride. Not always smooth, but really appreciate again, all the all the support,
all the stuff you guys have been contributing to this.
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So I did want to start out this morning since we've said hi to everybody.
Actually, let's say hi to Sal real quick.
He's just joining us up on stage.
But we'll start with a little clip from CNBC this morning that people might find interesting
after we hear from Sal.
Good morning, Sal.
Thanks for joining us.
Good morning.
Just wanted to, this is not insignificant, 250 episodes.
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Just wanted to say thank you for creating this space.
huge fan that is a huge that you're hitting this milestone um a little busy today but i'll stay as
a listener but just wanted to thank every single person here this is a part of the emerging political
economy as i said last week i'm doing research on this and i mean all the um persistent consistency
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and resilience of this community so just congratulations this is a huge huge milestone
for this community. Thank you all. Yeah, thanks, Sal. And you know, it reminds me of one thing
that I think about a lot. We all may not be the best at what we do. I'm sure we all strive for
that. But sometimes we can just simply outlast everybody else who doesn't have conviction,
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who doesn't, you know, who chases rabbit holes, not to make fun of Neil here this morning,
but who chases squirrels, shiny, bright objects.
But there's one thing that's true about this community, Bitcoin.
We tend to stay pretty on the mission.
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And so thankful to be with all of you guys this morning.
And it doesn't mean you can't go down rabbit holes,
but we're not chasing the shiny new things,
the shit coins that purport to be doing something better.
We stick here and talk about Bitcoin.
every day, day in, day out, 10 a.m. Eastern. So if this is your first time, welcome. Celebrating
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250, a little bit of a milestone. Hopefully there'll be many more episodes and hopefully
you can be involved. But let's jump in. I think we have the stage pretty well set. Happy to have
other people. But I'm going to cue up a clip from Tim Draper this morning on CNBC. And maybe this
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He'll kick us off with our discussion this morning.
So give me just one second while I keep.
But Bitcoin is the hedge against bad governance, against government spending, inflation, which you heard from the last speaker.
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Bitcoin is your alternative that allows you to deal with the major changes that are happening in government policies over time.
And you're seeing it in many, many different places.
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And it's sort of Bitcoin started in places where you wouldn't expect something to start.
It started in Nigeria and in Argentina and El Salvador and Malta, right?
Places where you would think new technologies wouldn't really occur,
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except those were the places where, in the case of Malta, it was freedom.
But in the other cases, they weren't confident about currencies.
And over the long haul, we're seeing government spending just, you know, uncontrolled.
And it just keeps going.
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All right.
So I'll cut it off there.
It's about a seven-minute interview, and I just took maybe about 60 seconds there.
But we hear a lot of themes there, and we talk about them often here on this space.
But freedom, it's interesting how he's bringing up countries, you know, other than the United States.
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And maybe some people roll their eyes and say, hey, just another suit buying Bitcoin and out there.
But Tim's been in a long time. He did buy Bitcoin, I think, back.
He did that government auction.
The Silk Road auction.
Yep, exactly.
So just curious, we can go around the panel, want to hear people's thoughts.
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Is this just another suit talking and we're seeing continued adoption from Wall Street?
Or is this, yeah, is he pointing out, I think, the bigger picture, which is that this isn't just happening in the United States.
It's freedom money for those around the world.
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Go ahead, Sal.
So thanks for sharing that.
And, you know, a little bit on that context, and I can actually, you know, I'm from El Salvador, born and raised, and I took 14 years for my family to become U.S. citizens.
We're grateful for the opportunity.
And we actually came to this country, to the U.S., because my father, my mother, and I were assaulted and attacked by government death squads in El Salvador, 2001.
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So to me, self-custody for Bitcoin, it's personal, it's important.
And I know particularly in this community, there is a very strong pull to keeping the sanctity of those values, right?
Open source, the right to open source development, the right to proof of work mining, the right to self-custody.
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And, you know, like having lived sort of the first 13 years in Osalda and having gone through that state spawns for sort of oppression, right, by government debt squads.
It's, you know, guess what happens to your private property when the state is against you?
It gets taken away overnight.
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My family when my dad was released we came within 72 hours to the U And so Bitcoin you know I ended up finding Bitcoin after spending you know I studied at Georgetown have a master from there Years after I went to Cornell
I have an MBA from there. But Bitcoin was the natural progression of my quest to understand
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why did my family go through what we went through, right? And building a system of fiat
leads to a brittle foundation. So to me, every single value embraced by this community when it
comes to the fundamentals of Bitcoin is something that, while I have not served, I'm not a veteran,
but I know what it means to be impacted by government oppression. And also I know
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the privilege afforded by Bitcoin, right? It's a privilege, it's a responsibility to own Bitcoin.
So Tim is right. The email is right. What you share about him, he's right, is whether it's
Argentina or Salvador or the US, Bitcoin is for anyone. Not everybody's going to get it,
but it's for anyone. And on my particular case, the right to custody, proof of work mining,
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that can be taken away overnight. That's why I'm so interested on sort of the emerging political
economy because, you know, Bitcoin doesn't care, but policy does, right? And I think Bitcoin
veterans particularly is emerging as a powerhouse that will need to be activated for policy purposes.
But just a little bit about me, you know, and obviously really just honored to be amongst like minds when it comes to the purity of defending and protecting the rights that we need for Bitcoin.
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Yeah, I appreciate that. And you don't have to be a veteran to be in this space. It's fully open. Civilians welcome. So thanks for being here as always, Sal.
Neil, wanted to go to you. See your hands there.
Neil cricking us this morning. I think he wants the crickets.
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What do you guys think about while we, while we try to get Neil back,
what do you guys think about his comments? For a lot of people, again,
we just kind of accept it.
I think we don't even really think about it anymore,
but Tim Draper is bringing up this idea, you know,
for all of the viewers of CNBC that basically this is a check on the mismanagement of governments and monetary policy.
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Do we take that for granted?
Or do you guys think like people are paying attention to that now because it keeps getting pushed out there into the ether?
Mic check.
Hey, we got Neil. Good morning again.
Yeah, sorry about that. I don't know. The mic wasn't working.
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Yeah, I was just going to say, I think on the clip, he's like he's reaching, but it's kind of like it's more a half measure.
It's a partial truth. Like the word hedge, if he's thinking that Bitcoin is this hedge against trusting the government, it's like, OK, well, you're not understanding the whole of what's actually happening.
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You know, like if I'm going to trust you to not screw me over, that means that the possibility for that to happen exists.
And it's like the way the monetary system is set up, like there's nothing to hedge against.
It's necessarily going to expand.
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Like that's the entire system, this perpetual expansion debasement machine.
You know, like that's what's happening.
So I it's like it's kind of it's a step in the right direction if you're a no coin or if you're somebody that trusts the government fully or thinks that you're not being abused, then at least like cracking the light, you know, a little bit like, oh, maybe the government could abuse me monetarily.
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Maybe like if like that's a good step, but like just open the door, you know, like you need to get this thing in full light so you understand the reality of our economy, you know, so you can navigate through it.
You know, like you have to take the blinders off because the blind the blinders aren't keeping you focused just straight.
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They're keeping you like not looking at anything like the blinders are are full or fully over you.
So, yes, anything you can do to crack that open and start to understand or even think in terms of like, I shouldn't be trusting the government with monetary policy.
Like that is absolutely correct.
But like Bitcoin doesn't hedge against that.
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Bitcoin solves that perfectly, 100%.
Like that is like.
And we lost them.
Oh, there we go.
I don't know what's going on with that.
So, but I don't know.
If any of that came through, that's really all I had to say.
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Yeah, really good points.
Who else has some thoughts on this?
Coleman, Texas Toast.
BFP, good morning.
good morning. Um, but is it, you know, is a hedge? It's like these people,
I've noticed this over the last week with conversations with my family who, you know,
some of these guys have sat on big boards and, you know, know what they're talking about.
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They're all Warren Buffett heads. I've always been a gold bug and, uh, and then moved on to
Bitcoin and it's like you had to drag their feet. They didn't understand how valuable gold was. And
now you can kind of shove it in their face and say, hey, it's performed better than the S&P 500
since 1971. So explain that. And they can't, they like, they have to backtrack. And so now they're
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at the point where they're like, okay, we need some kind of hedge that's better than the S&P 500.
Okay, gold's here. We're going to go with gold. And it's like, dude, you're just behind the A
ball again like you're you're always 10 steps behind and it shows
yeah i like that take pubby you got your hand up go ahead sir yeah i always like that term it's a
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hedge against us for that i at this point the currency in the basement is so bad you know i
can open my pantry and the canned goods and box goods i have from two years ago are a hedge against
what we have, much more valuable than the dollar. And I look around and a lot of people, you know,
one of the things is we forget what the priceless part of Bitcoin is. And we are focused on price.
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I was joking about, you know, the 25x. The price part, of course, the closest approximation is,
you know, how many dollars is it today? The priceless part we forget about is the censorship
resistance, the hard cap supply. That is, I mean, that is the nuts and bolts of it. That is why
I mean, it is the greatest saving technology that, of course, I've ever seen.
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I know other people do.
You can call it a hedge.
I know, you know, we've got friends in Turkey that, you know, their $1,000 in savings that was at one point now worth $80.
It was in Bitcoin, of course.
Yeah, they're well ahead of the game.
So I would just say that as always, remember what the core of Bitcoin is.
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That is the core of it.
It doesn't have to do anything.
You know, just the world is just going to burn down around it.
And yeah, hang on to it.
And if you are going to use this precious asset and send it somewhere for a good or service, replace it.
Always do a buy and replace.
All right.
Keep your main stack.
Buy and replace if you want to help grow the circular economy.
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Thank you.
Yeah, I think that's a really important point, too, that too often people are looking at this as an investment and not as the tool that it is.
And so sometimes maybe the price going up so much hurts us, but I do think it helps for adoption.
But I really like that point, Chloe, that it is censorship resistant money and we should be using it in circular economies because, you know, people are providing value.
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You should be willing to give value back.
And I think we know that Bitcoin definitely does that.
BFP, see your hand, sir.
and good morning. Thanks for coming up as usual. We'd love to hear from you.
Hey, thanks for having me. I'm privileged to be a part of the veterans community in the mornings.
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I just want to say there's like a spectrum and trusting your government is, you know,
something the boomers are kind of still doing to this day. And I think the younger generations
have realized that trusting your government will lead to not so good things.
So they're, in general, not trusting the government.
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But the spectrum goes so far to the other side that, like, for instance,
American HODL and Kaysen and Walker had a podcast recently where they're talking about
We're in, you know, World War III right now, and it's a mental war.
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You don't know if you're or there's no delineation between a civilian and a military guy because it's all fought on the battlefield of the mind.
And the currencies of the world or money is paramount.
So we're living through, you know, something that most generations will be talking about in the future.
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And, you know, that's that's the other like hyperbolic spectrum.
But we're in America where we're at the tippy top of the pyramid of currencies.
We live in like whether you're low class, middle class, whatever, you're still way above everyone else.
So most of us are Americans and we don't, you know, feel what's going on as much as everyone else.
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But once you get it, you know, you get it.
Bitcoin is winning and it's going to continue to win.
Yeah, lots of good stuff there.
I was thinking about what Pubby had said in light of what you just said.
And it's like, yeah, everybody, though, can look in their pantry and or go to the grocery store and understand that their dollars are buying less.
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It's funny. I was laughing, actually, when Pubby said that his canned goods were a hedge against inflation.
Kyle, sounds like you're with us. We'd love to hear from you.
I just wanted to echo a couple of good points made written in the Nostra universe yesterday.
If you're afraid to spend your SATs, you have too much fiat.
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Go to a circular economy, yes, spend and replace.
It makes a mess at tax time on your Schedule D, but other than that, it's perfectly fine.
What last speaker was touching on with being Americans, yes, we're seeing that inflation more so in durable goods, right?
Real estate, gold, cars more so than beans.
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But of course, if you look at the price of steak and ground beef versus 2020, March 2020, it's also up 50, 40 percent like housing.
It's that exorbitant privilege having that global reserve currency, the same thing that England had with the pound, France, Spain, Portugal, you know, century by century going back the last 500 years.
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And we can export most of that inflation overseas.
Some of it comes home, but as our reserve status declines, our ability to export that inflation reduces, meaning we're actually going to see more of an effect of monetary displacement simply by less people demanding dollars, whether it's for oil or something else around the world.
One caveat on this petrodollar system we've had for 50 years is that these stablecoin like Tether like system is actually going to create some demand for U.S. treasury bonds.
(27:27):
In other words, dollars that didn't exist.
Tether has about 150 in U.S. treasury bonds, 150 billion.
They're rivaling countries like Korea.
Right. They're not at China, Japan level yet, but they're making interest on that.
And people are using Tether.
So it's almost the sense of like a last gasp for the dollar as weaker currencies will fall faster.
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But the dollar gets like this almost boost, this artificial demand like it did with oil in 1970, 71 post post gold standards.
Thanks, Bob.
Yeah, I agree with that. And I do think in the short term, I've said this many times, we will see other currencies collapse as demand.
demand and the rails open up for people to get access to dollars through stable coins.
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Correct. Avoiding banking systems.
Accessing dollars on the internet.
And really, you would think that the system so far would actually open up to more people.
But if you're doing something or you're a financial institution in another part of the world
and the U.S. doesn't like your country, your policies, your people, you're cut out of the
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system. And so you'd think that it would be, you know, with more technology, us being closer
together, connected through, you know, things like the internet, there'd be more inclusion.
And in fact, we're actually going the opposite way. So I do think that we're at this point,
maybe an inflection point where there's just this need for the U.S. to find net new buyers of their debt.
(29:09):
And maybe that brings more inclusion.
Maybe it doesn't. I'm not sure.
But I do think that when people are faced with, hey, am I going to keep earning and saving in my own local currency?
or if I can get access, even if it's, you know, $1 of tether isn't the same as $1 of regulated tether in the United States,
(29:35):
I still am getting access to that, and I'd rather be holding on to that than I would my own local currency.
So I'll pause there. I see Pubby with his hand up. Go ahead, sir.
Oh, yeah. Hey, shout out to Captain Trips there.
Not only mentioning if you're doing buy and replace about the taxes, but he even pulled out the Schedule D on that.
So you dropped about 10 IRS listeners.
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Let's say, yeah, these Bitcoin guys are all over their taxes.
And I was going to say Bob just an idea to squirrel away is Pierre Richard wife Morgan I believe the CPA But a Bitcoin in taxes show I think would be pretty interesting Hey Bob there will be extra
(30:23):
No, go ahead. I was just going to say, I do think it's an interesting topic every once in a while.
But, man, a lot of people just hate this idea of accounting taxes.
And even some people hate the idea of spending their Bitcoin.
But I think it could be helpful.
You have 10 listeners.
(30:43):
Let's just say you have 10 listeners.
Hey, Pubby, I was going to say I'm dual hatting on a team call for the vets working on this summit on November 10th.
So I will be personally speaking there like a 30-minute workshop.
And I think that's plenty of time on tax, Bitcoin, bookkeeping, entity formation.
since I work for Satoshi Patcholi part-time in there, there at the park.
(31:08):
But it's a mess, but it's something that you really don't have to think about
until March or April each year.
It buffs.
Yeah, and I do think people are looking for reliable tools, right?
Yeah, like Strike.
Exactly.
So, Cam, can you talk a little bit about that product in particular?
(31:30):
Because I've heard that there's some things that you can do
with strike in particular, where you can spend Bitcoin, but it comes out as dollars?
Yeah, so they finally got bill pay, spooled up business.
So essentially, you can live on a Bitcoin standard.
I say that in air quotes, with strike.
(31:52):
What it does is they're converting to fiat rails.
So you can have your paycheck, direct deposit from your employer is in dollars.
It hits you, your strike, it's in Bitcoin.
and they take their 1% fee or whatever for the conversion.
But all you just see is stats show up.
And then your rent, your mortgage, your credit card bills,
anything that's on like an ACH, car payments, direct draft,
(32:13):
strike will pull out as stats.
Obviously, the recipient gets it in dollars.
And then your day-to-day, of course, if you're in person,
you can try to use Lightning Wallets.
And again, they do conversions.
So you could live on a Bitcoin standard,
but you are getting whacked on each side
is about 1% coming in and 1% coming out.
And they just rolled out business bill paid recently.
(32:35):
So you can pay employees too in sats more efficiently.
And then they do a good job.
Keeping it on one platform is helpful for tax time
because otherwise you're going to get all those proceeds from Strike,
but if you bought them somewhere else, like you're spending a place,
you're not going to have any cost bases reported or timestamps.
So you're going to have to say it's all zero cost bases,
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short-term ordinary income,
and then reconstructed from all these other wallets and documents and Excel spreadsheets.
So, again, it can be a mess, but if you keep it all in strike or all in river, it's pretty squared away.
Yeah, and I think that, you know, as I look at it, it makes me think, man, these are systems that could try to capture you.
(33:18):
I don't know why, but I just have this – I'm not against what they're doing.
I just have this self-custody mindset, and we talk about it all the time on the show.
So I think there's just pluses and minuses.
Oh, here's one, Bob.
I left out on strike, and it made me think because I'm Zooming with Jacob,
who is Layer Zero Propaganda on Twitter at Noster.
(33:39):
He's recently left the VA, and he's doing all his artwork and stuff.
Maybe you've seen it.
Layer Zero Propaganda.
Anyway, so in Vegas in May, before Rossi came out and Michael Saylor,
Jack Muller rolled out and he was doing his speech and they were just
introducing the strike loans.
And we've got clients asking about the loans, right?
The loan to value ratios.
And, you know,
they're asking us for financial advice,
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which is kind of like, well,
we're actually going to do tax advice, but not,
there was this almost like darkness on the stage.
It's kind of like, you know,
the way they did the lights and stuff ominous.
And yes,
they're not going to rehypothecate allegedly,
but the end of the day,
why are they rolling this out during a bull run is people will take out
loans at, you know, 50% loan to value ratio, we drop 50% and they get liquidated.
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So strike not only gets to arbitrage the interest because they're borrowing it from
some big, you know, investing hedge funds who is happy to get, you know, 5%.
Strike is lending it back out to you at 10%.
And then they get to buy the coin from you during a fair market at the most favorable
condition.
So it's again, not your key's metric coin.
Remember the lessons from four years ago.
(34:43):
Yeah, and I do tend to think that people forget.
It's only been three years since we had some catastrophic failures.
And there's a lot of new people coming into the space as well that just don't understand.
Bitcoin is a bearer asset.
(35:04):
It's kind of like holding a bearer bond or...
Cashing your mattress.
Exactly.
And so if you have it, you own it.
And if you don't, you have third party risk. And so something to consider. Now, some people would say, hey, I like the, you know, my everyday spending. It's like my checking account can go to strike. I'm not going to borrow against my Bitcoin, use the tools.
(35:29):
but as far as my savings go, I wouldn't dare keep it on a, you know, on a third party platform like
strike. So I think maybe, you know, there's a happy medium and some tools that people want to
use to be able to live on a Bitcoin standard. I don't have a problem with that, but for your
(35:49):
savings, I probably, yeah, would suggest not to put that on a third party platform. In fact, if
If you're storing it on the exchange you bought it on, you should probably learn self-custody.
And we do have tools to help you do that.
You can join spaces like this where we talk about it from time to time, but also visit BitcoinVeterans.org and plug your information in.
(36:12):
We can get you the information and resources you need to start self-custody.
Plus, there's other good resources out there, guys.
BTC Sessions, who's been on the show a couple of times.
Ben Sessions.
He's got a great channel.
So there's just all kinds of resources out there, but we can get you plugged in.
(36:33):
So let us know if we can help.
Pubby, on one screen, I see your hand up.
Is that a phantom hand?
That's a phantom hand.
All right.
Well, what other topics do we want to talk about today?
Guys, we're two-thirds of the way through the show.
We've got plenty of news over the weekend.
There was this massive whale selling off.
(36:55):
maybe we should touch on that i don't understand the thought process behind uh doing this on a uh
on a sunday where there's low liquidity especially in a week like this where uh lots of people have
taken off kind of the um ceremonial last week of summer for a lot of people especially on wall street
(37:25):
any thoughts on that guys
I saw that this morning
and I thought this
almost feels like FUD
because it said they put it into
(37:47):
Ethereum
what kind of
that doesn't even
make sense
yeah you do have to um question why people would be buying an all-time high uh of a shit coin but
(38:07):
uh it's uh whether it's true or false i i just i do wonder like why would you do that on a sunday
like there's just not as much liquidity well wouldn't you think yeah unless unless you want
to drive the price down and then buy lower or you're,
you're unraveling some kind of trade.
It's like,
to me,
it's all funny money,
(38:28):
especially during a low liquidity time.
Like we have right now on a Sunday in like the,
you know,
one of the lowest volume weeks of the year.
Historically,
it just feels like manipulation.
So this week is just kind of chill.
See what happens.
And I think we start kicking it off here in a couple of weeks.
Oh,
it seems planet or fake because you would see the Ethereum price.
(38:51):
spike and I didn't see that. So it's just doesn't seem real.
Yeah. I think that was fake. I think that was,
I wouldn't put any credence to that. I think it was just wall street,
big whale exchange games. Who knows? Who cares?
Yeah. I do think the market, despite the flash crash,
(39:13):
so to speak down to 110,200, I think it was,
which just sounds crazy to say if you've been in the space,
For any time. You know, the market has absorbed it pretty well.
I guess what I'm wondering is like, you know, on 24,000 Bitcoin, like if you guys can remember, some of you that have been around 24,000 Bitcoin being sold all at once would have been a much bigger deal a few years ago.
(39:43):
And it does seem like there's quite a bit of resilience in the market, especially with all these treasury companies coming in and scooping up any available Bitcoin.
We know that only 450 Bitcoin are being mined each day. That's the new issuance.
And we know just with all of us who are crazy stacking as much as we can as we get paid over time, we have big buyers coming in.
(40:11):
And so, I don't know, just a reminder that there's a limited supply and there's not a lot of new Bitcoin being minted every day.
Texas Toast, you had come off mute. Go ahead, sir.
Yeah, I was just saying, you know, I feel I feel personally offended.
Honestly, they think you're stupid.
(40:32):
They think, you know, they know some people have weak hands and are stupid and don't understand the asset.
And they're going to flush these people.
and then accumulate it for themselves.
So if you don't have this like adversarial mindset of
they are trying to get your Bitcoin.
We just had an 80,000 dump like, you know, what was that?
A month ago?
(40:53):
And where are we at?
I don't even know what the price was then.
Feels like it was maybe a little higher, but around the same level.
And it's like, it's just all a joke.
They want your Bitcoin.
They are going to try to manipulate the price, manipulate the narrative, all these different things so that they can accumulate on a long time frame, on like a, you know, 20 year institutional style hold.
(41:22):
So all this little short term shenanigans and then the corresponding news article that comes out is all just just pure manipulation, in my opinion.
Yeah, I agree. And it's twofold, right? It's to shake people out of their positions, whether you're a longtime holder or a newbie, somebody who's just starting to acquire and accumulate Bitcoin. But then it's also to wipe out these leverage longs and leverage short.
(41:54):
So the people who are taking on all this extra risk, piling on just leverage that they shouldn't be, and the market will come for you.
This is not very difficult to do still, despite Bitcoin being a two plus trillion dollar asset.
Did want to say good morning to Tao, listens a ton and comes up quite a bit.
(42:17):
Thanks for coming up to celebrate our 250th episode, sir.
Do you have any comments?
Hey, Bob. Good morning. And yeah, I came up because I just want to wish you guys a tremendous 250th episode.
You and Coleman and I guess the rest of the Bitcoin veterans crew along with Texas Toast.
(42:39):
I think Texas has been around and everybody else that comes up every morning.
I enjoy these spaces, has very good topics and just a good smooth vibe to it and everything.
really quick with the whole pricing situation.
It's funny, right?
Because I joke around with the pricing a lot.
(43:00):
Like, whether it goes up or whether it goes down,
I get my kicks off just joking around out there on the Bitcoin Twitter.
Let's just see and test the sentiment out there, how people are doing.
And it does feel sometimes people are genuinely concerned.
And I think when they are concerned, it's because they have this sort of short time preference where they may actually need to use their money for whatever purpose or immediately and not understanding that this is something that you have to believe in.
(43:36):
You have to understand what it is and how it's going to basically be adopted across the world in many, many decades for a very long time.
it's like a new thing and if you don't understand that that's that's what's going to happen you're
just going to be looking for hey get a quick gain and get out of there right i mean i remember going
(43:58):
through so many different deaths and and my like from the the 20k all the way down to the 3k right
back in 2017 2018 and then of course again with the 69k twice going back down to 30k and then like
to 15, 16, those sort of things.
It's like when you believe in something and you understand what it is,
(44:22):
it doesn't matter, right?
It just moves here and there.
But in general, it always goes up.
And this is one of the – people have to remember, okay,
this is one of those things that's a once-in-a-species event thing, right,
that transfer of wealth.
That's just going to happen this one moment.
And so if you don't recognize such a thing and everything that brings to the world, then you're going to miss out on that sort of opportunity.
(44:51):
I know people are going to be like, oh, no, it's too risky and this and that.
But you just have to recognize how special this is.
And so when you know that, you would huddle your stack and then you would just go about your business.
You go work, you go about your life, whatever you're going to do.
right? You still have to make a living, you still work, etc. But at least you have this
(45:13):
host that you don care about You just sit there You don even think about it I mean at least for me that what I doing Now I may not be stacking as aggressively right now you know but if it happens where there a tremendous discount in my eyes then you know that when I going to get even more
(45:35):
But for now, I'm just sitting back and just enjoying the ride.
Thanks, Mark.
Yeah, thanks for coming up.
And it does seem like there are every cycle and whether you want to call this a cycle or not, but every bull run, let's call it so far, people who are putting money in that maybe is more short term money.
(46:01):
It's not savings. They're just trying to make a buck. And that definitely shakes people out.
I do think that this asset is a high conviction asset.
You have to understand it. You have to put the time in. You have to learn about it. And otherwise, it is easy to hear all of the noise that's out there and say, man, maybe I made a huge mistake. I'm down, you know, 5-10% in my position. And this was a horrible move.
(46:31):
And so I think we see that from time to time.
But I do think that there are a lot of people in this space, especially, and other friends who don't join us.
But it's a high conviction space for a lot of us.
And so if you've been around for a while, I'm counting on you to not sell at a stupid time, which would pretty much be ever.
(46:53):
Let's see.
Sal, you're back up and see your hand, sir.
Go ahead.
Sorry about that.
It kicked me out.
I'm spaced a little buggy on my phone.
what a real story here i got uh two text messages yesterday these were young folks class of 2025
freaked out and uh you know we had a conversation about i think they were kind of orange bill
(47:13):
around february but the move yesterday freaked them out and they immediately said hey you know
about bitcoin what's going on can you explain it to me should we sell and i would love to get
your feedback when i'm sure some of you get that those texts or phone calls what you know these are
people that you obviously have, you know, you support them in their learning journey, but also
(47:33):
there is a level of conviction that has to come from within. What's some of the things that work
for you when you do get those scared phone calls or texts and they just haven't been in the space,
right? And a drop of three, $4,000, it's scary to them. We'd love to get some insights on how you
guys deal with that. Yeah. And I would love to hear from others too, but there's two things I
(47:54):
always tell people and maybe we can kick it around. Number one is this is a long term
allocation. If you buy Bitcoin, you should be holding on to it for a long time. Think of it as
four or five years minimum. A decade would be better. And any money you put into it, you should
(48:15):
just think of it as gone for four to five years as you learn about Bitcoin. And that's kind of the
second thing, which is to learn how to some of these things, learn how to self-custody, like learn
how to run a node. And we're not going to go down the node argument right now with which node to
(48:39):
run, but run a node, like learning some of these technical things actually provides you with some
perspective beyond just the price. And it is a little bit technical, but there are resources out
there. And I do think that that can help people like once they see the magic or the capabilities
(49:01):
of the tools that you can use on this network with Bitcoin, with this asset, it becomes more
than just an investment where all your frame of reference is just the price and all of these
knuckleheads talking on social media. So I'll pause there. But I do think it's if you can get
people outside of just price and using the tools that are available. One, I think we see people who
(49:30):
say, man, these tools suck. I want to develop some that are better, which helps the entire space.
But two, it helps them get away from just solely being having their frame of reference for Bitcoin,
the price and again knuckleheads on on uh on x so uh i will let some other people chime in go ahead
yeah i'm just going to go back to how i got i wouldn't say orange pill but how i just came to
(49:58):
the conclusion like this is special back in 2017 when i finally understood what it was and that it
actually can work. And what it came down to was you have an asset where you can fully control
self-custody. And not only that, but it's like a kind of money that we've never had ever,
(50:24):
like in the history of humankind. We've never had this type of money where you can actually
transfer from one place to another across a space.
And I was comparing it to currently our legacy system and how that works and all the debits
and credits between the ledgers, between multiple entities and banks.
(50:47):
And I was like, those are just numbers that they're just keeping track.
But it's not like an actual asset as if like, or you can send to somebody like almost like
Imagine you wanted to give a piece of gold to somebody in a different country.
You can't do it right away, right?
You can't do it in 10 minutes.
(51:07):
But with Bitcoin, it's kind of like, well, you can do that, right?
And they actually get whatever you're giving them.
It's almost as if you're throwing a piece of gold across the ocean and they're able to catch it, right?
When I saw that sort of thing, I'm like, you know, this is special.
This is going to go somewhere.
It's going to be ubiquitous.
It's so special and it's going to be integrated.
(51:27):
The whole world runs on money, right?
Money makes the world go around.
And so when you have the best type of money that's only going to be adopted as we go further and further into the future,
why would you not want that first and foremost, right?
Using that basis along with knowing that fiat currency ultimately gets the base and ultimately it fails, right?
(51:56):
And we're just looking at history and we're looking at all the other events like the stimulus and the printing, unlimited amount of printing.
And it's an obvious choice.
Once you understand the economics and you understand how people around the world use this money or even how money is even created, and you put those major factors together, you will understand that this is only going to be going up and it's going to be super special.
(52:25):
If you don't get this, I guess that's what separates the smart people and the people who are just ignorant and don't want to look into understanding how the world operates.
And so those are my thoughts when I actually feel like, oh, price is dropping, I'm worried or something like that.
But when you put those things together and you remind yourself how special this thing is, you're going to realize, okay, yeah, you have nothing to worry about.
(52:55):
Yeah, that's a good point.
We do have AC up here and wanted to say good morning, AC.
Thanks for being with us, celebrating the 250th.
but is it the case that Sal's hand is still up?
I'm trying to see. Maybe not. Nope. Nope. I pulled it off. Sorry.
No worries. AC, any wise words of wisdom this morning?
(53:22):
He must be multitasking. I won't give him the crickets.
But as we wind down the show, I did want it to kind of go around the horn,
See if people have any last thoughts of wisdom here before we close it up.
Kyle, Neil, Coleman, Tal, anyone still with us, Sal?
(53:42):
Thanks, Bob.
Cheers to 250 hour-long conversations like this one.
Not all heroes wear capes.
Thanks, Bob.
I'm definitely not a hero, just a cog in the wheel, I think,
in this crazy monetary system that we live in and we're trying to defeat.
(54:02):
Sal, go ahead.
Yep, same here.
Just congrats to 250 more episodes.
No pressure, Bob, but it's always a pleasure to be here,
and thanks for creating this space.
So congrats to everyone again.
Yeah, do we have Neil back with us?
Neil, any final thoughts here this morning, sir?
Yeah, yeah, sorry.
Today was whatever the space is was bugging out.
(54:25):
But yeah, I mean, you just you treat Bitcoin like you would treat your spouse, you know, like versus like falling in love with someone on the Internet.
You know, like that's kind of the difference.
Like you want to hold it.
You want to have it.
You want to hold a deer in real life and not just looking at some pixels on a screen that show you some number that makes you feel happy, you know.
(54:48):
So self-custody, baby.
Yeah, I do think it's a good reminder.
I mean, a lot of people that are here with us, I think, have gone down that journey to self-custody.
But I think a lot of times we forget the importance of learning it or at least maybe convincing other people like why it is so important.
(55:12):
Unfortunately, some people initially come for number go up, but hopefully they don't stay that way.
Hopefully they start learning some of these other things.
Let's see.
Coleman, I know, had a meeting, but maybe he's still with us.
Coleman, anything to top off this 250th episode?
(55:33):
Otherwise, we'll go to Tao, and then we'll wrap it up here for this morning.
No, nothing new to add.
Again, thanks, Bob.
And that was kind of an inside joke.
I homeschool our kids.
There's always parent-teacher readings going on that are very impromptu.
well i'm just here trying to uh get the conversation uh to be smooth with all of the
(55:59):
x spaces and the uh and also being the producer which i think will change here in about a week
we'll have a producer uh once we can get him up and running so that should be great
uh but hopefully we'll make the next 250 uh even better than they have been like i said
I'm just a grunt here trying to help people and have fun hanging out with you guys discussing these topics every weekday at 10 a.m. Eastern.
(56:25):
Tao did want to go to you real quick.
Again, thanks for coming up and celebrating with us.
Any final thoughts for people here as we wrap up the show today?
No, I don't really have anything else.
Just want to say thank you for hosting these spaces.
It's very informative and I really appreciate it.
So thanks a lot.
Yeah, we're just trying to be a little bit of signal for you in the morning and hopefully, again, cause you guys to think.
(56:54):
We're not trying to be arbiters of truth or try to convince you of how to approach Bitcoin or give you financial advice.
All those things you have to make up your mind on your own.
We do push for radical responsibility, which is what Texas Toast always brings up around that self-custody topic.
(57:16):
And so I want to encourage you guys to be sovereign individuals.
And we do think that Bitcoin is a huge part of that.
But we kick around topics all around that and try to bring you some entertainment each morning a little bit.
We laugh at ourselves because, yeah, we're not the brightest.
as Coleman always says we're crayon eaters and he most certainly is I do want to give Texas Toast
(57:44):
one last shot at it here before we we close things up he just requested I think so let's
see if we can get him up here give me one second would love to hear from him here he is go ahead
Texas. Hey, yeah, 250. Show 250. We got the 250th anniversary of this great nation,
(58:06):
our country, all right, the United States of America, our people, all right, and we are going
to take this country back with Bitcoin. We are going to raise it to the next level with the most
pristine collateral and asset ever to exist in the history of the planet. So if you're not
motivated and excited about that. I don't know what to tell you. It gets me pretty pumped up and
(58:31):
I'd be in a dark place without it. I feel like I wouldn't know kind of the direction to go to. So
I love it. Love the show. Thanks for having me up, Bob. We're going to make this show amazing too.
I can't even wait for the next 250 with Bob up there just holding it down. Our yeoman
(58:52):
and just steering the ship.
But we appreciate you, Bob.
Thanks, everybody, for listening.
And get after it.
It's Monday.
Yeah, words of encouragement from our often co-host, Texas Toast.
Please, guys, don't give me too much credit.
I am just outlasting everyone else on X Spaces.
(59:16):
Just doing this every day because, well, as I say to Shane,
I like to create my own prisons. No, I'm just kidding. This is fun. We do enjoy it.
Love laughing with you guys, going over all this stuff, helping people out, informing people,
making them think. And yeah, guys, this was fun. Thanks for being with us for 250. If you're
(59:38):
listening afterwards, yeah, would love to have you on the show live if you can ever do it.
love to have new voices in the space.
But yeah,
I want to wish you guys all a wonderful Monday.
And as always remember,
do not shit coin.
(59:59):
Yeah,
don't do it,
but I'll do it.
It's like wearing cutoff jeans to a funeral.
Use
fiat
currency
as a store of value.
We call them the core.
We call them the core.
Thank you.
(00:30):
all right good morning everybody we are back and it is the 250th episode we can still count
excited to be with everybody today so like i said this is bitcoin veteran spaces
(00:50):
episode number 250 where we talk about bitcoin my name is bob van kirk i'll be your host this
morning i'm joined by captain trips uh thank you for joining us we have morning bob hey good morning
we have neil we have pubby we have texas toast it's going to be an exciting day an exciting week
lots on tap going on this week uh in fact uh captain trips and texas toast are going to be
(01:16):
uh taking over for me on wednesday while i have another obligation uh so that'll be exciting and
And then on Thursday, we will actually have the Mayan Bitcoin Conference, some speakers from there to tell us all about their conference going on in Mexico on.
(01:37):
Well, I don't have the dates, but it's early December.
I think it might be the 5th and the 6th.
Don't have that in front of me, but we'll find out more on Thursday.
So please join us for that.
But let's take a look real quick at the time chain.
Where are we at here?
Looks like we are at Bitcoin Blockhite.
Just found a new one, 911,641, with the Bitcoin price sitting around 111,650, which means you
(02:01):
could still pick up 896 sats for each U.S. dollar.
And wanted to remind you guys here before we get started with this 250th episode that
Bitcoin Veterans is having their second annual summit on November 10th and 11th in Nashville,
Tennessee.
Come one, come all.
Should be fun. If you're looking to learn how to fire a gun, we'll be doing that safely on day two, range day.
(02:27):
Day one will be the conference. You can feel free to sign up and join either one or both.
We're looking for people who want to get involved as well.
Speaker, panel topics, volunteers.
And of course, if you just want to come and hang out, we would love to have you do that too.
BitcoinVeterans.org forward slash summit 2025 to get involved and get plugged in. But guys,
(02:52):
you know, numbers are just numbers, right? But it is, I think, something to be, there is something
to be said for this organization, Bitcoin Veterans. Lots of people doing a lot of great
things in the back channels for Bitcoin veterans. I just do my small part by helping do this show
(03:15):
and many others contribute. And so just want to say thank you. If you've come up on stage
in the last 250 episodes, thank you so much for contributing, for giving your time, your energy.
We want to help people and hopefully this space makes people think, makes people understand Bitcoin a little bit more.
(03:41):
And yeah, just a good time to be in the space and thankful for all of you guys who listen as well.
We wouldn't be doing this if people weren't here each day trying to learn, trying to get better, trying to improve their lives, their families, their communities.
and so super excited to be able to celebrate this one,
(04:02):
especially on a Monday with you guys.
And so thanks again.
And sure, we're going to hop into it and have some fun this morning.
Nothing crazy planned.
It's just a number, 250, but it is something to celebrate.
So once again, thanks to everybody for being here.
And with that, want to go around the horn real quick
(04:24):
and say good morning to some of the regulars
and maybe some people that are new.
Before we do that, though, guys, please do re-post the space.
And if you'd like to come up and chat with us here on the 250th episode,
please do hit that microphone button and always welcome your chats in that comment section,
(04:46):
the purple pill if you have questions, comments, anything like that.
Please throw those in there.
We'll try to get to them during the show.
All right.
with that I want to say good morning I know Kyle has he's pulling dual duty here so maybe he's
around but Captain Trips if you're around say good morning otherwise we'll move on to the rest of the
(05:08):
panel Neil go ahead yeah good morning Bob man you know that feeling when you're like deep down in a
rabbit hole and then you burrow a little bit laterally and you just find a whole other network
of connected rabbit holes. That's where I'm at and it feels really good.
(05:35):
Nice. Yeah, maybe we can touch on some of that this morning. Pubby, how are you this morning?
Yo, good morning. Yeah, hey, Bitcoin's working as advertised. Grown men who over five years
watched Bitcoin do a 25x are now crying at 110,000.
Woe is me.
So yeah, that's Bitcoin in general.
(05:56):
And the first start of Nod's versus core debate, I'm out of here.
Got enough for that over the last weekend.
Thank you, sir.
And congrats on 250.
Yeah, thank you so much.
I don't think we'll touch much on the node debate this morning, but maybe if somebody
wants to throw a monkey wrench into it.
uh texas toast often a co-host uh how are you this morning i was just just a regular plug this
(06:22):
morning bob i had a great weekend the day i had a birthday for my daughter and a lot of people
showed up it was great um also somebody close you you know take a take a second neil when you get a
(06:42):
minute to pop your head out of that rabbit hole, get a breath of fresh air every once
in a while.
You're going to need it.
But all good this morning.
Remember that life is fleeting, so do good work.
(07:04):
Yeah, thanks for that.
And as always, thanks for being here.
Coleman, how are you, sir?
yeah either uh coleman or kyle oh i stepped on you go ahead
no go for it cop i was just saying hello i'm on uh sorry we're glad there's a
(07:26):
we're working on uh the summit that's in november 10th uh with some of the vets so
just going over some of the details and speakers and
so on and so forth.
Yeah, a lot of planning going on.
And thanks for doing that in the background.
But I do have to have a chat with the board here for Bitcoin Veterans
(07:50):
scheduling a conference call at the same time as our 250th episode.
Ridiculous.
Not just kidding.
The conference is important.
So thanks for doing all that there.
Coleman, how are you this morning?
hey i'm doing good good morning everybody and like bob has already said thanks everybody for
joining us and sticking with us for 250 episodes i know the the ride wasn't smooth especially in
(08:14):
the beginning when uh yours truly was hosting but i am very impressed with bob what bob has
been able to do so congratulations bob well i do have to say coleman we miss you up here and um
yeah you carried the torch for a long time hoping to get you back in the mix at some point we'll
coax you up here more and more. Hopefully I know schedules don't always allow and it takes a team.
(08:39):
And so I don't do this all by myself. Takes all of you guys. So really appreciate it. This is
fun. I don't want to do too much back padding here, but it's it has been fun and it has been
quite the ride. Not always smooth, but really appreciate again, all the all the support,
all the stuff you guys have been contributing to this.
(09:03):
So I did want to start out this morning since we've said hi to everybody.
Actually, let's say hi to Sal real quick.
He's just joining us up on stage.
But we'll start with a little clip from CNBC this morning that people might find interesting
after we hear from Sal.
Good morning, Sal.
Thanks for joining us.
Good morning.
Just wanted to, this is not insignificant, 250 episodes.
(09:26):
Just wanted to say thank you for creating this space.
huge fan that is a huge that you're hitting this milestone um a little busy today but i'll stay as
a listener but just wanted to thank every single person here this is a part of the emerging political
economy as i said last week i'm doing research on this and i mean all the um persistent consistency
(09:47):
and resilience of this community so just congratulations this is a huge huge milestone
for this community. Thank you all. Yeah, thanks, Sal. And you know, it reminds me of one thing
that I think about a lot. We all may not be the best at what we do. I'm sure we all strive for
that. But sometimes we can just simply outlast everybody else who doesn't have conviction,
(10:14):
who doesn't, you know, who chases rabbit holes, not to make fun of Neil here this morning,
but who chases squirrels, shiny, bright objects.
But there's one thing that's true about this community, Bitcoin.
We tend to stay pretty on the mission.
(10:34):
And so thankful to be with all of you guys this morning.
And it doesn't mean you can't go down rabbit holes,
but we're not chasing the shiny new things,
the shit coins that purport to be doing something better.
We stick here and talk about Bitcoin.
every day, day in, day out, 10 a.m. Eastern. So if this is your first time, welcome. Celebrating
(10:58):
250, a little bit of a milestone. Hopefully there'll be many more episodes and hopefully
you can be involved. But let's jump in. I think we have the stage pretty well set. Happy to have
other people. But I'm going to cue up a clip from Tim Draper this morning on CNBC. And maybe this
(11:18):
He'll kick us off with our discussion this morning.
So give me just one second while I keep.
But Bitcoin is the hedge against bad governance, against government spending, inflation, which you heard from the last speaker.
(11:38):
Bitcoin is your alternative that allows you to deal with the major changes that are happening in government policies over time.
And you're seeing it in many, many different places.
(11:59):
And it's sort of Bitcoin started in places where you wouldn't expect something to start.
It started in Nigeria and in Argentina and El Salvador and Malta, right?
Places where you would think new technologies wouldn't really occur,
(12:19):
except those were the places where, in the case of Malta, it was freedom.
But in the other cases, they weren't confident about currencies.
And over the long haul, we're seeing government spending just, you know, uncontrolled.
And it just keeps going.
(12:42):
All right.
So I'll cut it off there.
It's about a seven-minute interview, and I just took maybe about 60 seconds there.
But we hear a lot of themes there, and we talk about them often here on this space.
But freedom, it's interesting how he's bringing up countries, you know, other than the United States.
(13:04):
And maybe some people roll their eyes and say, hey, just another suit buying Bitcoin and out there.
But Tim's been in a long time. He did buy Bitcoin, I think, back.
He did that government auction.
The Silk Road auction.
Yep, exactly.
So just curious, we can go around the panel, want to hear people's thoughts.
(13:25):
Is this just another suit talking and we're seeing continued adoption from Wall Street?
Or is this, yeah, is he pointing out, I think, the bigger picture, which is that this isn't just happening in the United States.
It's freedom money for those around the world.
(13:50):
Go ahead, Sal.
So thanks for sharing that.
And, you know, a little bit on that context, and I can actually, you know, I'm from El Salvador, born and raised, and I took 14 years for my family to become U.S. citizens.
We're grateful for the opportunity.
And we actually came to this country, to the U.S., because my father, my mother, and I were assaulted and attacked by government death squads in El Salvador, 2001.
(14:18):
So to me, self-custody for Bitcoin, it's personal, it's important.
And I know particularly in this community, there is a very strong pull to keeping the sanctity of those values, right?
Open source, the right to open source development, the right to proof of work mining, the right to self-custody.
(14:38):
And, you know, like having lived sort of the first 13 years in Osalda and having gone through that state spawns for sort of oppression, right, by government debt squads.
It's, you know, guess what happens to your private property when the state is against you?
It gets taken away overnight.
(15:00):
My family when my dad was released we came within 72 hours to the U And so Bitcoin you know I ended up finding Bitcoin after spending you know I studied at Georgetown have a master from there Years after I went to Cornell
I have an MBA from there. But Bitcoin was the natural progression of my quest to understand
(15:20):
why did my family go through what we went through, right? And building a system of fiat
leads to a brittle foundation. So to me, every single value embraced by this community when it
comes to the fundamentals of Bitcoin is something that, while I have not served, I'm not a veteran,
but I know what it means to be impacted by government oppression. And also I know
(15:43):
the privilege afforded by Bitcoin, right? It's a privilege, it's a responsibility to own Bitcoin.
So Tim is right. The email is right. What you share about him, he's right, is whether it's
Argentina or Salvador or the US, Bitcoin is for anyone. Not everybody's going to get it,
but it's for anyone. And on my particular case, the right to custody, proof of work mining,
(16:08):
that can be taken away overnight. That's why I'm so interested on sort of the emerging political
economy because, you know, Bitcoin doesn't care, but policy does, right? And I think Bitcoin
veterans particularly is emerging as a powerhouse that will need to be activated for policy purposes.
But just a little bit about me, you know, and obviously really just honored to be amongst like minds when it comes to the purity of defending and protecting the rights that we need for Bitcoin.
(16:40):
Yeah, I appreciate that. And you don't have to be a veteran to be in this space. It's fully open. Civilians welcome. So thanks for being here as always, Sal.
Neil, wanted to go to you. See your hands there.
Neil cricking us this morning. I think he wants the crickets.
(17:06):
What do you guys think about while we, while we try to get Neil back,
what do you guys think about his comments? For a lot of people, again,
we just kind of accept it.
I think we don't even really think about it anymore,
but Tim Draper is bringing up this idea, you know,
for all of the viewers of CNBC that basically this is a check on the mismanagement of governments and monetary policy.
(17:36):
Do we take that for granted?
Or do you guys think like people are paying attention to that now because it keeps getting pushed out there into the ether?
Mic check.
Hey, we got Neil. Good morning again.
Yeah, sorry about that. I don't know. The mic wasn't working.
(17:57):
Yeah, I was just going to say, I think on the clip, he's like he's reaching, but it's kind of like it's more a half measure.
It's a partial truth. Like the word hedge, if he's thinking that Bitcoin is this hedge against trusting the government, it's like, OK, well, you're not understanding the whole of what's actually happening.
(18:20):
You know, like if I'm going to trust you to not screw me over, that means that the possibility for that to happen exists.
And it's like the way the monetary system is set up, like there's nothing to hedge against.
It's necessarily going to expand.
(18:41):
Like that's the entire system, this perpetual expansion debasement machine.
You know, like that's what's happening.
So I it's like it's kind of it's a step in the right direction if you're a no coin or if you're somebody that trusts the government fully or thinks that you're not being abused, then at least like cracking the light, you know, a little bit like, oh, maybe the government could abuse me monetarily.
(19:08):
Maybe like if like that's a good step, but like just open the door, you know, like you need to get this thing in full light so you understand the reality of our economy, you know, so you can navigate through it.
You know, like you have to take the blinders off because the blind the blinders aren't keeping you focused just straight.
(19:31):
They're keeping you like not looking at anything like the blinders are are full or fully over you.
So, yes, anything you can do to crack that open and start to understand or even think in terms of like, I shouldn't be trusting the government with monetary policy.
Like that is absolutely correct.
But like Bitcoin doesn't hedge against that.
(19:53):
Bitcoin solves that perfectly, 100%.
Like that is like.
And we lost them.
Oh, there we go.
I don't know what's going on with that.
So, but I don't know.
If any of that came through, that's really all I had to say.
(20:16):
Yeah, really good points.
Who else has some thoughts on this?
Coleman, Texas Toast.
BFP, good morning.
good morning. Um, but is it, you know, is a hedge? It's like these people,
I've noticed this over the last week with conversations with my family who, you know,
some of these guys have sat on big boards and, you know, know what they're talking about.
(20:42):
They're all Warren Buffett heads. I've always been a gold bug and, uh, and then moved on to
Bitcoin and it's like you had to drag their feet. They didn't understand how valuable gold was. And
now you can kind of shove it in their face and say, hey, it's performed better than the S&P 500
since 1971. So explain that. And they can't, they like, they have to backtrack. And so now they're
(21:05):
at the point where they're like, okay, we need some kind of hedge that's better than the S&P 500.
Okay, gold's here. We're going to go with gold. And it's like, dude, you're just behind the A
ball again like you're you're always 10 steps behind and it shows
yeah i like that take pubby you got your hand up go ahead sir yeah i always like that term it's a
(21:28):
hedge against us for that i at this point the currency in the basement is so bad you know i
can open my pantry and the canned goods and box goods i have from two years ago are a hedge against
what we have, much more valuable than the dollar. And I look around and a lot of people, you know,
one of the things is we forget what the priceless part of Bitcoin is. And we are focused on price.
(21:50):
I was joking about, you know, the 25x. The price part, of course, the closest approximation is,
you know, how many dollars is it today? The priceless part we forget about is the censorship
resistance, the hard cap supply. That is, I mean, that is the nuts and bolts of it. That is why
I mean, it is the greatest saving technology that, of course, I've ever seen.
(22:14):
I know other people do.
You can call it a hedge.
I know, you know, we've got friends in Turkey that, you know, their $1,000 in savings that was at one point now worth $80.
It was in Bitcoin, of course.
Yeah, they're well ahead of the game.
So I would just say that as always, remember what the core of Bitcoin is.
(22:34):
That is the core of it.
It doesn't have to do anything.
You know, just the world is just going to burn down around it.
And yeah, hang on to it.
And if you are going to use this precious asset and send it somewhere for a good or service, replace it.
Always do a buy and replace.
All right.
Keep your main stack.
Buy and replace if you want to help grow the circular economy.
(22:54):
Thank you.
Yeah, I think that's a really important point, too, that too often people are looking at this as an investment and not as the tool that it is.
And so sometimes maybe the price going up so much hurts us, but I do think it helps for adoption.
But I really like that point, Chloe, that it is censorship resistant money and we should be using it in circular economies because, you know, people are providing value.
(23:26):
You should be willing to give value back.
And I think we know that Bitcoin definitely does that.
BFP, see your hand, sir.
and good morning. Thanks for coming up as usual. We'd love to hear from you.
Hey, thanks for having me. I'm privileged to be a part of the veterans community in the mornings.
(23:47):
I just want to say there's like a spectrum and trusting your government is, you know,
something the boomers are kind of still doing to this day. And I think the younger generations
have realized that trusting your government will lead to not so good things.
So they're, in general, not trusting the government.
(24:10):
But the spectrum goes so far to the other side that, like, for instance,
American HODL and Kaysen and Walker had a podcast recently where they're talking about
We're in, you know, World War III right now, and it's a mental war.
(24:31):
You don't know if you're or there's no delineation between a civilian and a military guy because it's all fought on the battlefield of the mind.
And the currencies of the world or money is paramount.
So we're living through, you know, something that most generations will be talking about in the future.
(24:59):
And, you know, that's that's the other like hyperbolic spectrum.
But we're in America where we're at the tippy top of the pyramid of currencies.
We live in like whether you're low class, middle class, whatever, you're still way above everyone else.
So most of us are Americans and we don't, you know, feel what's going on as much as everyone else.
(25:25):
But once you get it, you know, you get it.
Bitcoin is winning and it's going to continue to win.
Yeah, lots of good stuff there.
I was thinking about what Pubby had said in light of what you just said.
And it's like, yeah, everybody, though, can look in their pantry and or go to the grocery store and understand that their dollars are buying less.
(25:50):
It's funny. I was laughing, actually, when Pubby said that his canned goods were a hedge against inflation.
Kyle, sounds like you're with us. We'd love to hear from you.
I just wanted to echo a couple of good points made written in the Nostra universe yesterday.
If you're afraid to spend your SATs, you have too much fiat.
(26:13):
Go to a circular economy, yes, spend and replace.
It makes a mess at tax time on your Schedule D, but other than that, it's perfectly fine.
What last speaker was touching on with being Americans, yes, we're seeing that inflation more so in durable goods, right?
Real estate, gold, cars more so than beans.
(26:33):
But of course, if you look at the price of steak and ground beef versus 2020, March 2020, it's also up 50, 40 percent like housing.
It's that exorbitant privilege having that global reserve currency, the same thing that England had with the pound, France, Spain, Portugal, you know, century by century going back the last 500 years.
(26:53):
And we can export most of that inflation overseas.
Some of it comes home, but as our reserve status declines, our ability to export that inflation reduces, meaning we're actually going to see more of an effect of monetary displacement simply by less people demanding dollars, whether it's for oil or something else around the world.
One caveat on this petrodollar system we've had for 50 years is that these stablecoin like Tether like system is actually going to create some demand for U.S. treasury bonds.
(27:27):
In other words, dollars that didn't exist.
Tether has about 150 in U.S. treasury bonds, 150 billion.
They're rivaling countries like Korea.
Right. They're not at China, Japan level yet, but they're making interest on that.
And people are using Tether.
So it's almost the sense of like a last gasp for the dollar as weaker currencies will fall faster.
(27:48):
But the dollar gets like this almost boost, this artificial demand like it did with oil in 1970, 71 post post gold standards.
Thanks, Bob.
Yeah, I agree with that. And I do think in the short term, I've said this many times, we will see other currencies collapse as demand.
demand and the rails open up for people to get access to dollars through stable coins.
(28:13):
Correct. Avoiding banking systems.
Accessing dollars on the internet.
And really, you would think that the system so far would actually open up to more people.
But if you're doing something or you're a financial institution in another part of the world
and the U.S. doesn't like your country, your policies, your people, you're cut out of the
(28:40):
system. And so you'd think that it would be, you know, with more technology, us being closer
together, connected through, you know, things like the internet, there'd be more inclusion.
And in fact, we're actually going the opposite way. So I do think that we're at this point,
maybe an inflection point where there's just this need for the U.S. to find net new buyers of their debt.
(29:09):
And maybe that brings more inclusion.
Maybe it doesn't. I'm not sure.
But I do think that when people are faced with, hey, am I going to keep earning and saving in my own local currency?
or if I can get access, even if it's, you know, $1 of tether isn't the same as $1 of regulated tether in the United States,
(29:35):
I still am getting access to that, and I'd rather be holding on to that than I would my own local currency.
So I'll pause there. I see Pubby with his hand up. Go ahead, sir.
Oh, yeah. Hey, shout out to Captain Trips there.
Not only mentioning if you're doing buy and replace about the taxes, but he even pulled out the Schedule D on that.
So you dropped about 10 IRS listeners.
(29:57):
Let's say, yeah, these Bitcoin guys are all over their taxes.
And I was going to say Bob just an idea to squirrel away is Pierre Richard wife Morgan I believe the CPA But a Bitcoin in taxes show I think would be pretty interesting Hey Bob there will be extra
(30:23):
No, go ahead. I was just going to say, I do think it's an interesting topic every once in a while.
But, man, a lot of people just hate this idea of accounting taxes.
And even some people hate the idea of spending their Bitcoin.
But I think it could be helpful.
You have 10 listeners.
(30:43):
Let's just say you have 10 listeners.
Hey, Pubby, I was going to say I'm dual hatting on a team call for the vets working on this summit on November 10th.
So I will be personally speaking there like a 30-minute workshop.
And I think that's plenty of time on tax, Bitcoin, bookkeeping, entity formation.
since I work for Satoshi Patcholi part-time in there, there at the park.
(31:08):
But it's a mess, but it's something that you really don't have to think about
until March or April each year.
It buffs.
Yeah, and I do think people are looking for reliable tools, right?
Yeah, like Strike.
Exactly.
So, Cam, can you talk a little bit about that product in particular?
(31:30):
Because I've heard that there's some things that you can do
with strike in particular, where you can spend Bitcoin, but it comes out as dollars?
Yeah, so they finally got bill pay, spooled up business.
So essentially, you can live on a Bitcoin standard.
I say that in air quotes, with strike.
(31:52):
What it does is they're converting to fiat rails.
So you can have your paycheck, direct deposit from your employer is in dollars.
It hits you, your strike, it's in Bitcoin.
and they take their 1% fee or whatever for the conversion.
But all you just see is stats show up.
And then your rent, your mortgage, your credit card bills,
anything that's on like an ACH, car payments, direct draft,
(32:13):
strike will pull out as stats.
Obviously, the recipient gets it in dollars.
And then your day-to-day, of course, if you're in person,
you can try to use Lightning Wallets.
And again, they do conversions.
So you could live on a Bitcoin standard,
but you are getting whacked on each side
is about 1% coming in and 1% coming out.
And they just rolled out business bill paid recently.
(32:35):
So you can pay employees too in sats more efficiently.
And then they do a good job.
Keeping it on one platform is helpful for tax time
because otherwise you're going to get all those proceeds from Strike,
but if you bought them somewhere else, like you're spending a place,
you're not going to have any cost bases reported or timestamps.
So you're going to have to say it's all zero cost bases,
(32:57):
short-term ordinary income,
and then reconstructed from all these other wallets and documents and Excel spreadsheets.
So, again, it can be a mess, but if you keep it all in strike or all in river, it's pretty squared away.
Yeah, and I think that, you know, as I look at it, it makes me think, man, these are systems that could try to capture you.
(33:18):
I don't know why, but I just have this – I'm not against what they're doing.
I just have this self-custody mindset, and we talk about it all the time on the show.
So I think there's just pluses and minuses.
Oh, here's one, Bob.
I left out on strike, and it made me think because I'm Zooming with Jacob,
who is Layer Zero Propaganda on Twitter at Noster.
(33:39):
He's recently left the VA, and he's doing all his artwork and stuff.
Maybe you've seen it.
Layer Zero Propaganda.
Anyway, so in Vegas in May, before Rossi came out and Michael Saylor,
Jack Muller rolled out and he was doing his speech and they were just
introducing the strike loans.
And we've got clients asking about the loans, right?
The loan to value ratios.
And, you know,
they're asking us for financial advice,
(33:59):
which is kind of like, well,
we're actually going to do tax advice, but not,
there was this almost like darkness on the stage.
It's kind of like, you know,
the way they did the lights and stuff ominous.
And yes,
they're not going to rehypothecate allegedly,
but the end of the day,
why are they rolling this out during a bull run is people will take out
loans at, you know, 50% loan to value ratio, we drop 50% and they get liquidated.
(34:22):
So strike not only gets to arbitrage the interest because they're borrowing it from
some big, you know, investing hedge funds who is happy to get, you know, 5%.
Strike is lending it back out to you at 10%.
And then they get to buy the coin from you during a fair market at the most favorable
condition.
So it's again, not your key's metric coin.
Remember the lessons from four years ago.
(34:43):
Yeah, and I do tend to think that people forget.
It's only been three years since we had some catastrophic failures.
And there's a lot of new people coming into the space as well that just don't understand.
Bitcoin is a bearer asset.
(35:04):
It's kind of like holding a bearer bond or...
Cashing your mattress.
Exactly.
And so if you have it, you own it.
And if you don't, you have third party risk. And so something to consider. Now, some people would say, hey, I like the, you know, my everyday spending. It's like my checking account can go to strike. I'm not going to borrow against my Bitcoin, use the tools.
(35:29):
but as far as my savings go, I wouldn't dare keep it on a, you know, on a third party platform like
strike. So I think maybe, you know, there's a happy medium and some tools that people want to
use to be able to live on a Bitcoin standard. I don't have a problem with that, but for your
(35:49):
savings, I probably, yeah, would suggest not to put that on a third party platform. In fact, if
If you're storing it on the exchange you bought it on, you should probably learn self-custody.
And we do have tools to help you do that.
You can join spaces like this where we talk about it from time to time, but also visit BitcoinVeterans.org and plug your information in.
(36:12):
We can get you the information and resources you need to start self-custody.
Plus, there's other good resources out there, guys.
BTC Sessions, who's been on the show a couple of times.
Ben Sessions.
He's got a great channel.
So there's just all kinds of resources out there, but we can get you plugged in.
(36:33):
So let us know if we can help.
Pubby, on one screen, I see your hand up.
Is that a phantom hand?
That's a phantom hand.
All right.
Well, what other topics do we want to talk about today?
Guys, we're two-thirds of the way through the show.
We've got plenty of news over the weekend.
There was this massive whale selling off.
(36:55):
maybe we should touch on that i don't understand the thought process behind uh doing this on a uh
on a sunday where there's low liquidity especially in a week like this where uh lots of people have
taken off kind of the um ceremonial last week of summer for a lot of people especially on wall street
(37:25):
any thoughts on that guys
I saw that this morning
and I thought this
almost feels like FUD
because it said they put it into
(37:47):
Ethereum
what kind of
that doesn't even
make sense
yeah you do have to um question why people would be buying an all-time high uh of a shit coin but
(38:07):
uh it's uh whether it's true or false i i just i do wonder like why would you do that on a sunday
like there's just not as much liquidity well wouldn't you think yeah unless unless you want
to drive the price down and then buy lower or you're,
you're unraveling some kind of trade.
It's like,
to me,
it's all funny money,
(38:28):
especially during a low liquidity time.
Like we have right now on a Sunday in like the,
you know,
one of the lowest volume weeks of the year.
Historically,
it just feels like manipulation.
So this week is just kind of chill.
See what happens.
And I think we start kicking it off here in a couple of weeks.
Oh,
it seems planet or fake because you would see the Ethereum price.
(38:51):
spike and I didn't see that. So it's just doesn't seem real.
Yeah. I think that was fake. I think that was,
I wouldn't put any credence to that. I think it was just wall street,
big whale exchange games. Who knows? Who cares?
Yeah. I do think the market, despite the flash crash,
(39:13):
so to speak down to 110,200, I think it was,
which just sounds crazy to say if you've been in the space,
For any time. You know, the market has absorbed it pretty well.
I guess what I'm wondering is like, you know, on 24,000 Bitcoin, like if you guys can remember, some of you that have been around 24,000 Bitcoin being sold all at once would have been a much bigger deal a few years ago.
(39:43):
And it does seem like there's quite a bit of resilience in the market, especially with all these treasury companies coming in and scooping up any available Bitcoin.
We know that only 450 Bitcoin are being mined each day. That's the new issuance.
And we know just with all of us who are crazy stacking as much as we can as we get paid over time, we have big buyers coming in.
(40:11):
And so, I don't know, just a reminder that there's a limited supply and there's not a lot of new Bitcoin being minted every day.
Texas Toast, you had come off mute. Go ahead, sir.
Yeah, I was just saying, you know, I feel I feel personally offended.
Honestly, they think you're stupid.
(40:32):
They think, you know, they know some people have weak hands and are stupid and don't understand the asset.
And they're going to flush these people.
and then accumulate it for themselves.
So if you don't have this like adversarial mindset of
they are trying to get your Bitcoin.
We just had an 80,000 dump like, you know, what was that?
A month ago?
(40:53):
And where are we at?
I don't even know what the price was then.
Feels like it was maybe a little higher, but around the same level.
And it's like, it's just all a joke.
They want your Bitcoin.
They are going to try to manipulate the price, manipulate the narrative, all these different things so that they can accumulate on a long time frame, on like a, you know, 20 year institutional style hold.
(41:22):
So all this little short term shenanigans and then the corresponding news article that comes out is all just just pure manipulation, in my opinion.
Yeah, I agree. And it's twofold, right? It's to shake people out of their positions, whether you're a longtime holder or a newbie, somebody who's just starting to acquire and accumulate Bitcoin. But then it's also to wipe out these leverage longs and leverage short.
(41:54):
So the people who are taking on all this extra risk, piling on just leverage that they shouldn't be, and the market will come for you.
This is not very difficult to do still, despite Bitcoin being a two plus trillion dollar asset.
Did want to say good morning to Tao, listens a ton and comes up quite a bit.
(42:17):
Thanks for coming up to celebrate our 250th episode, sir.
Do you have any comments?
Hey, Bob. Good morning. And yeah, I came up because I just want to wish you guys a tremendous 250th episode.
You and Coleman and I guess the rest of the Bitcoin veterans crew along with Texas Toast.
(42:39):
I think Texas has been around and everybody else that comes up every morning.
I enjoy these spaces, has very good topics and just a good smooth vibe to it and everything.
really quick with the whole pricing situation.
It's funny, right?
Because I joke around with the pricing a lot.
(43:00):
Like, whether it goes up or whether it goes down,
I get my kicks off just joking around out there on the Bitcoin Twitter.
Let's just see and test the sentiment out there, how people are doing.
And it does feel sometimes people are genuinely concerned.
And I think when they are concerned, it's because they have this sort of short time preference where they may actually need to use their money for whatever purpose or immediately and not understanding that this is something that you have to believe in.
(43:36):
You have to understand what it is and how it's going to basically be adopted across the world in many, many decades for a very long time.
it's like a new thing and if you don't understand that that's that's what's going to happen you're
just going to be looking for hey get a quick gain and get out of there right i mean i remember going
(43:58):
through so many different deaths and and my like from the the 20k all the way down to the 3k right
back in 2017 2018 and then of course again with the 69k twice going back down to 30k and then like
to 15, 16, those sort of things.
It's like when you believe in something and you understand what it is,
(44:22):
it doesn't matter, right?
It just moves here and there.
But in general, it always goes up.
And this is one of the – people have to remember, okay,
this is one of those things that's a once-in-a-species event thing, right,
that transfer of wealth.
That's just going to happen this one moment.
And so if you don't recognize such a thing and everything that brings to the world, then you're going to miss out on that sort of opportunity.
(44:51):
I know people are going to be like, oh, no, it's too risky and this and that.
But you just have to recognize how special this is.
And so when you know that, you would huddle your stack and then you would just go about your business.
You go work, you go about your life, whatever you're going to do.
right? You still have to make a living, you still work, etc. But at least you have this
(45:13):
host that you don care about You just sit there You don even think about it I mean at least for me that what I doing Now I may not be stacking as aggressively right now you know but if it happens where there a tremendous discount in my eyes then you know that when I going to get even more
(45:35):
But for now, I'm just sitting back and just enjoying the ride.
Thanks, Mark.
Yeah, thanks for coming up.
And it does seem like there are every cycle and whether you want to call this a cycle or not, but every bull run, let's call it so far, people who are putting money in that maybe is more short term money.
(46:01):
It's not savings. They're just trying to make a buck. And that definitely shakes people out.
I do think that this asset is a high conviction asset.
You have to understand it. You have to put the time in. You have to learn about it. And otherwise, it is easy to hear all of the noise that's out there and say, man, maybe I made a huge mistake. I'm down, you know, 5-10% in my position. And this was a horrible move.
(46:31):
And so I think we see that from time to time.
But I do think that there are a lot of people in this space, especially, and other friends who don't join us.
But it's a high conviction space for a lot of us.
And so if you've been around for a while, I'm counting on you to not sell at a stupid time, which would pretty much be ever.
(46:53):
Let's see.
Sal, you're back up and see your hand, sir.
Go ahead.
Sorry about that.
It kicked me out.
I'm spaced a little buggy on my phone.
what a real story here i got uh two text messages yesterday these were young folks class of 2025
freaked out and uh you know we had a conversation about i think they were kind of orange bill
(47:13):
around february but the move yesterday freaked them out and they immediately said hey you know
about bitcoin what's going on can you explain it to me should we sell and i would love to get
your feedback when i'm sure some of you get that those texts or phone calls what you know these are
people that you obviously have, you know, you support them in their learning journey, but also
(47:33):
there is a level of conviction that has to come from within. What's some of the things that work
for you when you do get those scared phone calls or texts and they just haven't been in the space,
right? And a drop of three, $4,000, it's scary to them. We'd love to get some insights on how you
guys deal with that. Yeah. And I would love to hear from others too, but there's two things I
(47:54):
always tell people and maybe we can kick it around. Number one is this is a long term
allocation. If you buy Bitcoin, you should be holding on to it for a long time. Think of it as
four or five years minimum. A decade would be better. And any money you put into it, you should
(48:15):
just think of it as gone for four to five years as you learn about Bitcoin. And that's kind of the
second thing, which is to learn how to some of these things, learn how to self-custody, like learn
how to run a node. And we're not going to go down the node argument right now with which node to
(48:39):
run, but run a node, like learning some of these technical things actually provides you with some
perspective beyond just the price. And it is a little bit technical, but there are resources out
there. And I do think that that can help people like once they see the magic or the capabilities
(49:01):
of the tools that you can use on this network with Bitcoin, with this asset, it becomes more
than just an investment where all your frame of reference is just the price and all of these
knuckleheads talking on social media. So I'll pause there. But I do think it's if you can get
people outside of just price and using the tools that are available. One, I think we see people who
(49:30):
say, man, these tools suck. I want to develop some that are better, which helps the entire space.
But two, it helps them get away from just solely being having their frame of reference for Bitcoin,
the price and again knuckleheads on on uh on x so uh i will let some other people chime in go ahead
yeah i'm just going to go back to how i got i wouldn't say orange pill but how i just came to
(49:58):
the conclusion like this is special back in 2017 when i finally understood what it was and that it
actually can work. And what it came down to was you have an asset where you can fully control
self-custody. And not only that, but it's like a kind of money that we've never had ever,
(50:24):
like in the history of humankind. We've never had this type of money where you can actually
transfer from one place to another across a space.
And I was comparing it to currently our legacy system and how that works and all the debits
and credits between the ledgers, between multiple entities and banks.
(50:47):
And I was like, those are just numbers that they're just keeping track.
But it's not like an actual asset as if like, or you can send to somebody like almost like
Imagine you wanted to give a piece of gold to somebody in a different country.
You can't do it right away, right?
You can't do it in 10 minutes.
(51:07):
But with Bitcoin, it's kind of like, well, you can do that, right?
And they actually get whatever you're giving them.
It's almost as if you're throwing a piece of gold across the ocean and they're able to catch it, right?
When I saw that sort of thing, I'm like, you know, this is special.
This is going to go somewhere.
It's going to be ubiquitous.
It's so special and it's going to be integrated.
(51:27):
The whole world runs on money, right?
Money makes the world go around.
And so when you have the best type of money that's only going to be adopted as we go further and further into the future,
why would you not want that first and foremost, right?
Using that basis along with knowing that fiat currency ultimately gets the base and ultimately it fails, right?
(51:56):
And we're just looking at history and we're looking at all the other events like the stimulus and the printing, unlimited amount of printing.
And it's an obvious choice.
Once you understand the economics and you understand how people around the world use this money or even how money is even created, and you put those major factors together, you will understand that this is only going to be going up and it's going to be super special.
(52:25):
If you don't get this, I guess that's what separates the smart people and the people who are just ignorant and don't want to look into understanding how the world operates.
And so those are my thoughts when I actually feel like, oh, price is dropping, I'm worried or something like that.
But when you put those things together and you remind yourself how special this thing is, you're going to realize, okay, yeah, you have nothing to worry about.
(52:55):
Yeah, that's a good point.
We do have AC up here and wanted to say good morning, AC.
Thanks for being with us, celebrating the 250th.
but is it the case that Sal's hand is still up?
I'm trying to see. Maybe not. Nope. Nope. I pulled it off. Sorry.
No worries. AC, any wise words of wisdom this morning?
(53:22):
He must be multitasking. I won't give him the crickets.
But as we wind down the show, I did want it to kind of go around the horn,
See if people have any last thoughts of wisdom here before we close it up.
Kyle, Neil, Coleman, Tal, anyone still with us, Sal?
(53:42):
Thanks, Bob.
Cheers to 250 hour-long conversations like this one.
Not all heroes wear capes.
Thanks, Bob.
I'm definitely not a hero, just a cog in the wheel, I think,
in this crazy monetary system that we live in and we're trying to defeat.
(54:02):
Sal, go ahead.
Yep, same here.
Just congrats to 250 more episodes.
No pressure, Bob, but it's always a pleasure to be here,
and thanks for creating this space.
So congrats to everyone again.
Yeah, do we have Neil back with us?
Neil, any final thoughts here this morning, sir?
Yeah, yeah, sorry.
Today was whatever the space is was bugging out.
(54:25):
But yeah, I mean, you just you treat Bitcoin like you would treat your spouse, you know, like versus like falling in love with someone on the Internet.
You know, like that's kind of the difference.
Like you want to hold it.
You want to have it.
You want to hold a deer in real life and not just looking at some pixels on a screen that show you some number that makes you feel happy, you know.
(54:48):
So self-custody, baby.
Yeah, I do think it's a good reminder.
I mean, a lot of people that are here with us, I think, have gone down that journey to self-custody.
But I think a lot of times we forget the importance of learning it or at least maybe convincing other people like why it is so important.
(55:12):
Unfortunately, some people initially come for number go up, but hopefully they don't stay that way.
Hopefully they start learning some of these other things.
Let's see.
Coleman, I know, had a meeting, but maybe he's still with us.
Coleman, anything to top off this 250th episode?
(55:33):
Otherwise, we'll go to Tao, and then we'll wrap it up here for this morning.
No, nothing new to add.
Again, thanks, Bob.
And that was kind of an inside joke.
I homeschool our kids.
There's always parent-teacher readings going on that are very impromptu.
well i'm just here trying to uh get the conversation uh to be smooth with all of the
(55:59):
x spaces and the uh and also being the producer which i think will change here in about a week
we'll have a producer uh once we can get him up and running so that should be great
uh but hopefully we'll make the next 250 uh even better than they have been like i said
I'm just a grunt here trying to help people and have fun hanging out with you guys discussing these topics every weekday at 10 a.m. Eastern.
(56:25):
Tao did want to go to you real quick.
Again, thanks for coming up and celebrating with us.
Any final thoughts for people here as we wrap up the show today?
No, I don't really have anything else.
Just want to say thank you for hosting these spaces.
It's very informative and I really appreciate it.
So thanks a lot.
Yeah, we're just trying to be a little bit of signal for you in the morning and hopefully, again, cause you guys to think.
(56:54):
We're not trying to be arbiters of truth or try to convince you of how to approach Bitcoin or give you financial advice.
All those things you have to make up your mind on your own.
We do push for radical responsibility, which is what Texas Toast always brings up around that self-custody topic.
(57:16):
And so I want to encourage you guys to be sovereign individuals.
And we do think that Bitcoin is a huge part of that.
But we kick around topics all around that and try to bring you some entertainment each morning a little bit.
We laugh at ourselves because, yeah, we're not the brightest.
as Coleman always says we're crayon eaters and he most certainly is I do want to give Texas Toast
(57:44):
one last shot at it here before we we close things up he just requested I think so let's
see if we can get him up here give me one second would love to hear from him here he is go ahead
Texas. Hey, yeah, 250. Show 250. We got the 250th anniversary of this great nation,
(58:06):
our country, all right, the United States of America, our people, all right, and we are going
to take this country back with Bitcoin. We are going to raise it to the next level with the most
pristine collateral and asset ever to exist in the history of the planet. So if you're not
motivated and excited about that. I don't know what to tell you. It gets me pretty pumped up and
(58:31):
I'd be in a dark place without it. I feel like I wouldn't know kind of the direction to go to. So
I love it. Love the show. Thanks for having me up, Bob. We're going to make this show amazing too.
I can't even wait for the next 250 with Bob up there just holding it down. Our yeoman
(58:52):
and just steering the ship.
But we appreciate you, Bob.
Thanks, everybody, for listening.
And get after it.
It's Monday.
Yeah, words of encouragement from our often co-host, Texas Toast.
Please, guys, don't give me too much credit.
I am just outlasting everyone else on X Spaces.
(59:16):
Just doing this every day because, well, as I say to Shane,
I like to create my own prisons. No, I'm just kidding. This is fun. We do enjoy it.
Love laughing with you guys, going over all this stuff, helping people out, informing people,
making them think. And yeah, guys, this was fun. Thanks for being with us for 250. If you're
(59:38):
listening afterwards, yeah, would love to have you on the show live if you can ever do it.
love to have new voices in the space.
But yeah,
I want to wish you guys all a wonderful Monday.
And as always remember,
do not shit coin.
(59:59):
Yeah,
don't do it,
but I'll do it.
It's like wearing cutoff jeans to a funeral.
Use
fiat
currency
as a store of value.
We call them the core.
We call them the core.
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