June 27, 2025 • 41 mins
Pride Month gives us the perfect opportunity to expand our understanding of the LGBTQIA+ community, especially for those of us navigating relationships with our adult children. This heartfelt conversation with Emmy-nominated Matthew Rodriguez, host and executive producer of "It's Okay to Ask Questions," offers exactly what many parents need—permission to learn without judgment.
Rodriguez creates a safe space for curiosity, admitting that even as a gay man himself, he once struggled to understand terms like "non-binary" or aspects of transgender experience. "Just because I'm gay and we're kind of on the same side of the street didn't mean I knew everything there was to know," he explains. This honest acknowledgment sets the tone for a conversation where no question feels too basic or inappropriate when asked with genuine care.
Rodriguez elaborates on how society builds these metaphorical closets brick by brick through subtle messaging about acceptable behaviors and interests until a child "can't see out of all the things they've been told they shouldn't be."
For parents whose adult child has just come out, Rodriguez offers compassionate advice: "If you need to and you can't say anything in the moment, I would hug your child, kiss them, say I love you and say I just need a moment to process this...because I want to say the right things to you."
Rodriguez's reminds us to reminder to "dream wider" for our children beyond traditional expectations. "All the ways you can grow and be in this world—there are many, and being open to that, as long as it brings love and joy and no harm, why not?"
Huge thank you to Connie Gorant Fisher, our audio engineer.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
One of the beautiful things about technology is we've
been able to hear so many morestories and it's not going
through one filter anymore,where there's three TV channels
and one newspaper.
There's a lot of ways to shareinformation and because of that,
there are so many more storiesto listen to.
So if you are a parent, I alsothink it's your responsibility
to think about all the differentways people can.
(00:22):
Your responsibility to thinkabout all the different ways
people can navigate in thisworld.
All the different interests andI'm not just talking about
sexuality they could be a TikTokstar to an electrician, to like
.
All the ways you can grow andbe in this world.
There are many, and being opento that, as long as it brings
love and joy and no harm, whynot?
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Hello everyone, welcome to Bite your Tongue the
podcast.
I'm Denise and I'm Kirsten, andwe hope you will join us as we
explore the ins and outs ofbuilding healthy relationships
with our adult children.
Together, we'll speak withexperts, share heartfelt stories
(01:02):
and get timely adviceaddressing topics that matter
most to you.
Get ready to dive deep andlearn to build and nurture deep
connections with our adultchildren and, of course, when to
bite our tongues.
So let's get started.
Hello everyone, and welcome toanother episode of Bite your
Tongue the podcast.
I'm Denise and sadly I'm nothere with my co-host, kirsten.
This was an episode she reallywanted to do, but the timing
(01:25):
just didn't work for her thistime.
I'm so sorry she's missing it.
Anyway, as many of you know,june is Pride Month and every
June we try to do an episodethat addresses the LGBTQAI plus
community.
And we are so excited fortoday's episode because we're
celebrating pride by talking tothe Emmy-nominated Matthew
(01:47):
Rodriguez.
He has hosted and produced theNBC Chicago's top-rated Chicago
Today show since 2019.
And I just learned he's in hissecond season for an amazing
show.
He's the executive producer andhost of it's Okay to Ask
Questions.
The series showcases open andhonest conversations with
(02:10):
trailblazers in the LGBTQIA pluscommunity, delivering candid
dialogue with no topic offlimits.
And for all of us parents ofadult children, with the
ever-changing queer community,it's great for us to know it's
okay to ask questions.
So welcome Matt.
(02:30):
I love, first of all, how youstart your episodes and I'd like
to steal it and start ourepisode with this.
So, listeners, this episode isopening minds and hearts with
thoughtful conversation.
Welcome Matt.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
I love that.
Thank you for noticing our open.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Well, it's so beautiful.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Yeah, you know, you record these things and you're
in a room and you record it andyou write something and you see
it a thousand times becauseyou're editing with the
producers and the editors andyou just forget what it all
means, you know, and then yourelease it and people respond
and it can be quite overwhelmingthat it's.
It's that original intentionthat you kind of forgot about
(03:13):
because you've been so caught upin the technical part of it.
I'm sure you can relate withthe podcast I can but it's so
beautiful, it's so beautiful.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
So I want to remind you, when we get started started
, that our audience is mostlyparents of adult kids.
So we're talking 55, 65, eveninto the 70s, and I think in an
interview you did with ChicagoMagazine, you said that you have
an imaginary viewer Betty Sue,yes, jesus, and all the Bobs of
(03:42):
the world struggling overunderstanding the changing face
of LGBTQIA community, and we'rereally hesitant to ask questions
.
So that's why I love the titleof your show.
So tell us a bit about yourshow, why we should watch and
how it will help us understandmore about this community and
how we should approach askingquestions.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
Well, that's so funny .
I love that you caught up onthat.
You know, my executive producerfrom the other show I host,
Chicago Today, created thisimaginary viewer and I use that
same scenario for this showbecause the Betty Sues and the
Bobs of the world that live onMain Street that's just a
generic name we created for ourviewer.
They do care and, like we weretalking before we were recording
(04:27):
here, they have that gay cousinor they have that gay nephew or
they have that friend who isidentifying as transgender now
and they can sometimes be alittle overwhelmed and not know
how to approach it.
And I myself, as a gay man,part of the LGBTQIA community,
had that same feeling.
(04:49):
I had a lot of friends coming upto me and saying can you
explain what it is to benon-binary?
Can you explain what it is whensomeone realizes they are
transgender and wants to makethat transition?
I was like I don't know.
I don't know Just because I'mgay and we're kind of on the
same side of the street didn'tmean I knew everything there was
to know, Just like they don'tknow everything about me.
(05:11):
And with that, when we weretrying to create this show, I
was kind of expressing that in ameeting and I just blurted out
I wish it was okay to askquestions and we said that's the
name of the title, becausethat's the way so many people
feel right now.
So many people.
We've created silos, whether welike it or not.
We've created boxes and wallsand all that kind of stuff for
(05:34):
many reasons, not just aboutthis subject, and I think we're
afraid to ask the questions.
We're afraid we'll offend,we're afraid we will be
misunderstood when we ask thequestion.
So I think if you go forth withintention and love in your
(05:55):
heart and joy and listen to theresponse of the question, that's
half of it.
The title is only half of it.
It's okay to ask questions, butyou've got to listen to what
they say, You've got to digestit.
Ask some more questions, maybe,step away, come back to it.
That's really at the heart ofit all, and we've done that
through these wonderfulinterviews this season.
We have Rosie O'Donnell, who Ithink a lot of your viewers,
your listeners, might know andconnect to.
(06:18):
We have Jojo Siwa, who's a muchyounger audience but still an
important voice.
We have a woman from LosAngeles.
She is a lesbian, Zoya Biglari,and she's from a Persian family
and in Iran, which is where herparents are from, if you come
out you could be killed, it ispunishable by death.
(06:39):
And for her family to come toLos Angeles and then their
daughters say I'm a lesbian,that would take them aback,
right?
And so it took some time forthe family to move through this
new revelation.
So we have many stories likethat.
I've learned so much.
I think the viewer can learn somuch.
I think we come at it with avery gentle, foundational
(07:04):
approach at making you know wedon't get too too into the weeds
Some of the some of theepisodes.
We can get deeper intodefinitions and what this means
and what that means, but I Ithink it's something that most
people can sit down with a lovedone or your family and and take
away some really easy bites ifthat makes sense.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
I agree, and I haven't watched every episode
because I only found out aboutit when I saw you on the Today
Show.
And congrats on that anyway.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
Oh, my gosh, thank you.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
And we will link how people can watch in our episode
notes, but I did watch.
There are a few episodes I wantto talk about.
The first one was season one,episode one with and again
you're right, we don't know allthese people Shea Coulee, Shea.
Speaker 1 (07:44):
Coulee, yeah, who's a very well-known drag queen.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Okay, drag race and is in the drag scene and which
is a whole other world.
That can seem scary and I'mgoing to ask you something about
that.
But what I want to ask aboutthis is and she identifies as
she, I can use the pronoun sheright, I noticed I was trying to
make sure I got my pronounsright, because this is hard for
us too.
She says and I really foundthis kids are not born in the
(08:10):
closet.
They go into the closet becausethey've been told to be ashamed
or they're ashamed Expand alittle bit on that because that
was touching to me.
She said she knew by the timeshe was four.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Wow, that makes me a little emotional because I
hadn't I haven't watched that.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
Oh, I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
No, I hadn't you know .
You record these and you.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
I sometimes.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
I forget even what was said and I I can't remember
everything, matt just hit mejust now because it's very true,
I feel like I'm hearing it forthe first time.
You're just a kid, You're justacting and reacting to the way
you see the world.
When you come out and slowly,piece by piece, you see how
someone reacts to you, see yourfamily or your parents or a
(08:57):
neighbor react to another.
I'm going to use me as anexample.
Another little boy acting alittle effeminate, and they get
a little squeamish and they geta little weird and they're like
well, why?
Speaker 2 (09:06):
why are you doing?
Speaker 1 (09:07):
that you should be out there playing with trucks,
and none of that.
And so that's one thing.
And then that little boy growsup and they want to be, you know
, they want to play piano orthey want to dance.
Why are you doing that?
You should go to soccer, orvice versa for a woman, or you
know, there's so many scenarios,and, bit by bit by bit, you're
putting a little piece of brickin front of them, brick by brick
(09:27):
, by brick by brick.
And then, all of a sudden, thatkid can't see anymore.
Right, that kid can't see outof all the things they've been
told they shouldn't be.
And why would we do that tosomeone?
Why would we do that to anyone?
Straight Doesn't matter yourrace your religion, like let us
live organically and free.
Shay is absolutely right, Ithink.
(09:49):
And can we fix that?
I don't know.
It's almost impossible to notput some of your thoughts and
beliefs on your children, butmake sure you listen to them,
because even if they're four to85, it doesn't matter.
People have opinions andthoughts that are organic and
(10:10):
come from it with inside, fromthe day they're born.
And if you don't believe that,I'm sorry.
It's true.
There are certain things thatare just in our souls that we
cannot hold back.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
That's beautiful.
You explained it well becausethat really touched me, because
I think we do that with lots ofpeople, not just queer people.
I hate to say this, but the waypeople look, the way oh, God.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
The way, whatever it is, if they're not athletic your
eyes are a little off your nose.
Oh, that nose, oh.
Yeah, that nose right, exactly,exactly, Quiet, down your voice
is too pitchy, your voice istoo high.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
You know mine is oh no, no, I'm thinking my sound is
bad, okay, can you imagine?
Speaker 1 (10:51):
can you imagine if I stopped the interview and said
your voice?
Speaker 2 (10:54):
well, I would have appreciated you're telling me my
sound wasn't good anyway, no,your sound okay okay all right,
so I'm going to mention twoother shows and then we're going
to get to a few questions.
I love the the interview withER Fightmaster Again.
I have seen them a hundredtimes.
Never knew their name and I'veseen them on Grey's Anatomy, but
anyway, I thought who's ERFightmaster?
(11:16):
Anyway, they explained thatthey identify as non-binary and
their pronouns were they andthem.
But you asked them how theyfelt about the new pronouns Zed
and Zay.
Is that right?
Am I saying that right, mike?
Speaker 1 (11:31):
Zed and Zay, and there's Zee and there's many
others.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
Are we expected to keep?
First tell us what they are,and how are we expected to keep
up with all this?
Speaker 1 (11:41):
Well, I mean, you know, if there's a new
restaurant in town, you learnthe name of that really quickly.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
No, no, we don't At our age we don't.
We don't that place down thereon the corner that serves Thai
food.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
Well, that's why, and so listen.
So this is what I think, and Ihope I don't.
I hope I'm not speaking out ofout of line, because I am not a
expert on all of this.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
No, no, I understand that, don't worry, we understand
that.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
But from what I took away, there is unless somebody
tells you they are, thisspecific pronoun, the Z or the
Zed, and there are I'veencountered not that many and
there might be some but for themost part again, asterisks, from
what I understand.
I have seen that most peoplejust like they or that and
(12:29):
that's quite easy.
So we have their he, him, she,her and they that.
And I know a lot of people saythe grammar.
But the grammar it's plural.
We use they and ER says thisall the time.
We use they.
You know you leave your glass.
I'm like where, where's Denise?
They left their glass here.
You know you would say they inpassing, so I would just lean on
(12:53):
the day.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
We've all gotten that and we're working on that, but
then all of a sudden all thisnew stuff comes in.
But I think being respectfuland if you're talking to someone
is the best thing to do and Ithink then people understand.
Speaker 1 (13:04):
That's it.
I forget people's names.
Every day I will meet someoneand two minutes later I forget
their name.
So I think a lot of people justneed to remember that part.
If you just think about thatalone, like I can't even
remember someone's namesometimes.
So just go in with grace, justsay, remind me again how you'd
like to be referred.
(13:24):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
Yeah, that's perfect, Because I never know whether to
say what are your pronouns orhow you like to be referred.
Sometimes I feel like I'm toowoke if I say what are your
pronouns?
Speaker 1 (13:34):
I don't think anyone's going to be offended by
you saying what are yourpronouns, Unless it's someone
who's anti any of this.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Well then, I don't really care.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Right, exactly, but anyone, anyone who's identifying
as non-binary is certainly notgoing to be offended if you ask
what their pronouns are Now, ifthey've told you their pronouns
50 times they might eventually,like if I told my name to you 50
times, you'd get a littleannoyed.
And I don't get me wrong, I'vemet people where they like we've
met before and I'm like, oh myGod, I'm embarrassed and I don't
remember the name.
But I think that's a way tothink of it.
(14:07):
I think that that's helped me.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
All right, now though this one.
I hope I pronounced this nameright, because I literally made
my husband watch this last night.
Okay, pigeon Pagonis.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
Pigeon Pagonis yes.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
I want you to tell her story.
I'm not going to tell it, okay,because I didn't understand
this at all.
And the way I want to telleveryone to watch this episode,
I think it's season one.
Is it season one?
It's all these are all seasonone.
Okay, these are all season one.
Okay, I guess I haven't gottento season two yet.
I'm sorry, I never understoodthis, so I'd love it explained
to me.
She was born intersex.
But go ahead.
Speaker 1 (14:42):
Intersex and again, I am not a scientist or a doctor
or anything but with this isthis is what's different.
Intersex is not something apigeon choked, and not that I
think someone who's gay choosesthis, but this is like, this is
when you were in intersex.
This is like you werephysically born this way.
There's no debating.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
She was told that her ovaries were removed because
she had cancer.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
Yeah, so let's back up Right.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Okay, go ahead, you do it.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
And gosh, I don't want to mess up her story
because you know what?
Speaker 2 (15:15):
They can all watch it .
So you do the best you can.
And then here's the thing.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
I won't be specific because I can't remember
everything about pigeon becauseit was a year ago and I.
But what I will say is there arepeople that are born with
genitalia and I'm just going todumb this down body parts from
the female side of the spectrumand the male side of the
spectrum.
Right, I think in certain casessomeone might have actual
(15:42):
testicles instead of ovaries,but they aren't descended, so
that means they're still like upin the body and you might have
actual testicles instead ofovaries, but they aren't
descended.
So that means they're stilllike up in the body and you
might have a, an enlargedclitoris, so, but but still an
opening that can look like avagina, but you don't actually
have a full uterus with insideof that, if that makes sense.
So it's kind of like the bodywas processing in while in the,
(16:05):
in the mother's womb, and itstopped cooking.
Right, Like the body stoppedprocessing it to stop growing
and it just reached a certainpoint.
Again, I hope people don'tbacklash on me and I would love
everyone, your audience mightremember the word hermaphrodite.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
We don't use that word anymore.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
Um, some people do, but we don't use that word
anymore.
Use intersex and pigeon storywas quite remarkable because she
was born and they thought, ohyou know, she looks more like a
girl, so we're going to lean inlike her body, her genitalia
look more like a girl, so we'regoing to lean into the fact that
(16:45):
she's a girl and they performcertain surgeries on her to make
her more of a girl, withoutever explaining it to Pigeon or
giving her the choice, until shewas older and she actually
found out by putting the piecestogether.
So her family kind of knew, butthe doctors knew, but they
never told her that they toldher she had cancer.
(17:05):
They told her that she had allthese surgeries because they
needed to prevent her from thecancer from spreading and all
these types of things.
She actually has a wonderfulbook explaining all of this.
But what had happened was shefound out all about this and
figured it out later and turnsout with certain chromosomes and
all of her DNA and I know thisis very confusing.
(17:26):
She actually would have beenbetter off leaning into being a
boy with what she had, but atthis point, when she was in
college and realized who she was, it was too late that the
surgeries had been performed.
They had done a surgery toenlarge her vagina Very, very
graphic and it might be too muchfor some people.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
No, no, it's very enlightening.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
It's very enlightening and Pridgen is so
honest and raw and and thatconversation was wonderful and
and it it's something thatpeople don't talk about and
almost 1% of the entirepopulation is intersex.
That's a lot of people,millions and millions of people
that we, you know, we might knowpeople and you would never even
(18:08):
know, because they could, theycould present one way on, you
know, on their face, but downbelow there's something else
going on and they can beembarrassed and shamed and feel
isolated.
So when I say the alphabet, thequeer alphabet, is what we call
it LGBTQIA.
The I is intersex, yes, andthere's the.
(18:28):
There's the struggle fortransgender rights.
Right, we're trying to letchildren make a decision early
on in their process.
If it's supported by the familyand supported by the doctors
and the child, if they want tomake a transition, they should
be able to do what they'd like.
Now, the opposite is true whenwe're talking about our intersex
(18:51):
family, because if they don'thave the right to make the
decision and the doctors make itfor them and it's forced upon
them, that's a really horriblesituation.
So this struggle betweenintersex rights and trans rights
can actually can pin the twoagainst each other, so
politicians can say oh well, inthis case you don't want the
(19:12):
doctors to perform anything forthese intersex kids, but for the
trans kids, all of a sudden youdo want them to do some.
So it can get very complicated.
There's a lot of shadows thereand a pigeon goes into that
conversation as well.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
It's a wonderful one and you do a great job.
The interview is so wonderfulso I really want to listen to
that.
You know Katie Couric did aNational Geographic show several
years ago I don't know ifyou've watched it called A
Gender Revolution, and Iremember she did that, yeah, and
I've always encouraged ourlisteners to watch that because
there are several and I neverknew it was intersex and I'm not
(19:46):
sure if I watched this so longago, just like you.
But a couple of people thattheir sex like they were born
with both genitalia and thedoctor decided who they were.
And when they became adultsthey realized they were not a
boy, they really were a girl andpeople were criticizing them
and I thought how could you knowthis person was?
Just someone said okay, we'regoing to choose this and cut
(20:07):
everything else off.
So that really opened my eyes.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
But I didn't understand the whole intersex
thing until right now, or untilI watched pigeons and I got to
say and it makes you think like,look, if mother nature created
this, this child, right, and youcan physically see that there's
something different, right,like it's, it's not a full
vagina, it's not a full penis,whatever they're, and it's all
different.
These are just examples.
(20:31):
It may not even present in thatway.
There's many ways to beintersex, there's lots of
categories.
But if Mother Nature can dothat, why couldn't it create
other different types of peopleLike, why do we think it's one
or the other, when Mother Natureherself has created people that
(20:53):
are all in between and indifferent gray areas?
I mean, it's like a physicalpresentation right there.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
No, you're absolutely right, and when you brought up
transgender, I wasn't going toask this question.
In fact, I took the treatmentof trans students that's right
(21:21):
in their schools.
How do you feel when you hearthese stories that we're trying
to go forward and then we get 10steps back?
Speaker 1 (21:27):
You are putting these kids' lives at risk.
You are telling a communitythat they don't matter, their
thoughts don't matter, theirbeliefs don't matter, and you
are putting them at risk ofdeath.
That's the bottom line.
Children who don't have theability to transition are and I
don't have the exact statistic,but are much, much, much more
(21:51):
likely to commit suicide.
You're endangering them withthemselves and the way they feel
about how they exist in theworld.
And then you're endangeringthem by telling everyone in the
community it's okay to hate onthese people.
So I'm certainly not all right.
Speaker 2 (22:06):
Oh gosh.
Speaker 1 (22:08):
You're giving them the okay to say no, these people
aren't like us.
That's not right.
We wouldn't do that to anyone.
I don't want to do that toanyone.
I don't care what side of thepolitical spectrum you're on.
Everyone should have theirright.
But to say that these peoplecan't be who they are without it
harming or affecting you in anyway, don't tell me it does,
because it doesn't.
(22:29):
You can't tell me it does.
Give me one example.
Very good.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
Good job.
Okay, I'm going to ask a coupleof little more questions about
the show, and then I have somelistener questions.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
Great, because it's okay to ask questions right,
it's okay to ask questions, andyou know what If we're on
YouTube?
Here I just want to admit mydisgusting smoothie.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
It's just filled with vegetables and goodness, as I'm
saying, okay, okay, it lookswonderful and it's why you look
so good.
So as I was watching some ofthese, I thought to myself
you're interviewing so manycelebrities.
Have you ever thought ofinterviewing a regular Joe or
Josie?
Sometimes people watch and theysay, well, you're a celebrity,
it's easy for you to you knowwhatever.
(23:09):
How does it feel for someonewho's not a celebrity?
Right, Well, I think you know, Idon't think everyone that we've
interviewed has a householdname.
No, no, half of them aren'thousehold names, but they have a
persona.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
Right, but they have a persona and a slight following
.
In some cases, and I'd say inseason two, we even found people
with more of a quote unquotefollowing.
And when I say that maybe someof your viewers like a large
following on Instagram or TikTok, and I've said this many times
it certainly doesn't mean thattheir story is any more
important than someone next doorwhere we don't necessarily know
(23:42):
who they are.
It doesn't, and in fact thatother person might have a more
incredible story.
The reason we have leaned intosome of that now this season.
We have someone like Jojo Siwawho is insanely popular with a
younger audience.
Rosie O'Donnell really big,really well-known, with an older
audience.
We chose to have some of thosepeople because it makes people
(24:05):
watch.
And if I can put Rosie's storynext to Cody Daigle-Oriens, who
is an asexual advocate out ofCleveland Ohio, who is not as
well known but it makes someonego and watch that episode, then
certainly then I'm amplifyingnot only Rosie's story, which is
valid and important, but alsoCody's and then Zoya, from who I
(24:30):
mentioned earlier, the womanfrom Los Angeles.
I try to be very diverse whenI'm booking the show, not only
in the story being told, but whothey might be connected with.
Is it an older demographic, isit younger?
I like to represent age.
If I, if I had my way, I woulddo 15 episodes.
We could do, you know, a rangeof race, but I could only do six
(24:52):
and we had to pick and chooseand it's who says yes and who
says no and doing that wholepuzzle.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
Tell us about Rosie O'Donnell's story.
She has a transgender daughter.
Speaker 1 (25:01):
A non-binary child.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
Non-binary Okay, sorry, do you say non-binary
daughter?
How would I say?
Speaker 1 (25:06):
A non-binary child Child.
Okay, non-binary child ChildChild is a neutral.
There's no gender associated.
I like Rosie's story.
Rosie struggles with thepronouns.
Rosie has a tattoo on her arm.
It says they them like.
If Rosie, who is a lesbianknown around the world, has
trouble remembering that, herown child, my viewer, who is
(25:29):
having trouble, can relate tothat.
That's why I chose Rosie, notbecause she was the ultimate gap
, because of that reason alone,and I think that's really
important.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
All right, okay, so you've said.
When you came out to yourparents, who are old school
Catholic, your dad got upset andyour mother fell to the floor
crying.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Okay, so what advice do you have for our generation
of parents?
When their adult child comes tothem, what are some of the
things they can say that will be?
They don't want to fall to thefloor crying.
Let's put it that way.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
Yeah, you don't want to do that.
And again, I love my parentsand-.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
I know you do, and you've said that I don't want to
, and it's great that you'vebeen honest, though.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Yeah, I'm going to be honest and I've been writing a
lot about it and I've beenreflecting on that time.
So who knows what more I'lltalk about from that time.
But look, I've realized as I'vegotten older.
I might not have realized it inthe moment, but it took me a
long time to realize I was gay,right, it took years and years
and years for me to put piecestogether and come to terms with
(26:30):
that.
And when I did that, I was like, oh okay, I'm good.
So then when I told my parents,who had known me for 21 years
in a certain way and they had,regardless of the signs that
were there that might've said Iwas gay they didn't see those
and they just listened to what Isaid and I was straight, or you
know, pretending to datesomeone, or whatever, whatever
I'd say to them Ididn't really talk about dating.
(26:50):
They thought I was straight.
So obviously it took them sometime to wrap their heads around
it and their minds around it.
So I would say, if you need toand you can't say anything in
the moment, I would hug yourchild, kiss them, say I love you
and say I just need a moment toprocess this.
(27:11):
I just because I don't want tosay the wrong thing, I want to
say the right things to you Now.
That's like a last minute Ifyou can't get the words out if
you feel like you're going toblow up and you're going to
explode and cry.
That's what I would do.
I think other people might havedifferent suggestions, but I
would just hold them, say I loveyou and I just need a moment
and that's it, because I want tosay the right thing to you.
(27:33):
So I need to collect mythoughts and I think that would
be understandable.
Your child might not get it inthe moment, but I think as time
goes on they might reflect andsay oh, I'm glad my parents did
that, as opposed to dropping tothe floor crying.
It was a slow fall for my mom.
She kind of like it was like aslide off the couch onto her
(27:56):
knees and then she came kind ofyou know some of it is, and I
think it's a two sided kind ofthing.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
The child who has also decided to come out needs
to give their parents some time.
The parent has to process andI've talked to this about a lot
to a lot of my friends who'veyoung adult kids or teenagers
have come out.
When you hold your baby in yourarms when they're born, you
already are walking them downthe aisle.
I know it sounds crazy, becauseweddings aren't even like that
anymore.
Right, this vision of theirlife and all of a sudden it
(28:25):
changes.
It's not that you can't acceptthat new trajectory for them.
You have a son you might haveinstead of a daughter in law.
You're going.
You have a son you might haveinstead of a daughter-in-law.
You're going to have ason-in-law, possibly the
advancements of, I mean, theystill might have grandchildren.
You know all of that.
But you need time to processthat as a parent and I hope that
on both sides the child who'scoming out understands that the
(28:46):
parents might need a little timeto process it.
Speaker 1 (28:49):
I think some kids would.
I think some kids wouldn't.
It's going to be, it's just,it's to each each their own.
I also think as a parent andI'm not a parent you have to
make sure you're dreaming in alldifferent ways for your kids.
Right, you have to reimaginethat dream, because it's not
just the Disney snow white storyanymore, and it never was by
(29:10):
the way it's just what we weretold, and that's one of the
beautiful things abouttechnology is we've been able to
hear so many more stories andit's not going through one
filter anymore where there'sthree TV channels and one
newspaper.
There's a lot of ways to shareinformation and because of that,
there are so many more storiesto listen to.
(29:31):
So if you are a parent, I alsothink it's your responsibility
to think about all the differentways people can navigate in
this world, all the differentinterests and I'm not just
talking about sexuality theycould be a TikTok star to an
electrician, to like all theways you can grow and be in this
world.
There are many, and being opento that, as long as it brings
(29:51):
love and joy and no harm, whynot?
Speaker 2 (29:54):
You are so incredible .
That was so wonderful.
It's the first time I've heardthat and it really opened my
mind.
You're right, we need to see awider world.
Yeah, that's it 100% right,that was so good.
Okay, so, wrote her gay sonthinks gays feel inherently
(30:15):
flawed and have emotionalbaggage.
This is not my opinion and Ithink he's being too hard on
himself and the gay community.
How should I respond when heexpresses that to me?
Speaker 1 (30:29):
I.
That's a hard one, cause I knowthat kid.
I know like I felt that way.
You know.
I think when you first come outthere can be some self-hating
that even if you've come out,you know I'd come out and I had
lived out of the closet foryears.
Oh my God, it was 10 years.
I'd come out and I joined theSan Francisco gay men's chorus.
(30:52):
It's amazing organization.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
Oh, I know everything about that Okay.
Oh, you do Okay, and we have agay men's course in Denver too.
Speaker 1 (30:59):
There's many across the country.
Beautiful but anyway.
So I had joined this and I wassurrounded by 300 men that 300
gay men of all shapes and sizesand beliefs and diversity, and
some living very out and proud,and I was so uncomfortable I
wanted to quit.
I wanted any excuse to get outof this chorus because it made
(31:23):
me feel so uncomfortable.
And I realized week by weekthat I was uncomfortable with
how open and honest and and trueto themselves, my fellow chorus
mates were and I, even though Iwas out in Los Angeles I had
lived in Los Angeles beforemoving to San Francisco even
(31:45):
though I was out, I was stillvery much in a straight world.
I was with my straight friends,I did straight things, which I
love.
There's nothing wrong with that.
But I hadn't, but I hadn't beenaround as many gay people.
I had kind of isolated myselfand I realized it was because I
was kind of hating that side ofme deep down subconsciously.
(32:05):
And when I was with my gaybrothers of the San Francisco
Gay Men's Chorus they were kindof like cracking me open to
another side of me, like a more,maybe a little bit more, of a
flamboyant side, maybe a littlebit more a side that wanted to
be a little bit more free aboutmy sexuality, that I always felt
shame from that.
(32:26):
I always felt like I needed tohide.
I don't want to make peoplethink like they were shoving
this down my throats.
It was just an honest,beautiful way of living where
they were proud who they wereand and so that took time and I
and I don't know this, thisgentleman or this person's story
, but you know, maybe they needto experience more.
(32:48):
Maybe they need to find theircommunity so that they see that
there are many, many, many queerpeople who don't feel any sense
of pain or sadness.
I think oftentimes the onlystories we hear about the LGBT
community are negative ones andmy struggle coming out and my
struggle finding out I wastransgender.
(33:09):
But many times there's noproblem at all and they have a
beautiful story and they livetheir life with joy and freedom
and they're okay.
So I would try and help himfind those stories and that
might take a little work andfind that community.
Depending on where they live,may take a vacation, but that
takes time.
(33:30):
It takes time.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
So you brought up this whole idea of flamboyant
and someone did write.
You know I have no problem withthe gay community.
Why the flamboyance?
What is important about theflamboyance to the gay community
?
Speaker 1 (33:44):
Number one.
It's not everybody, it's not.
Speaker 2 (33:46):
No, no, no, that's right.
Speaker 1 (33:47):
I don't think you're saying that, but I mean it's
look at your friends, look atyour straight group of friends.
Are they all different?
Is one loud, is one quiet, isone more dramatic?
That is who we are, and whywould we be any different just
because it's some rainbow fabric, and that's not always what it
(34:08):
is.
It's just expression, and whenyou really, if you can just take
a minute, Okay.
To think about sometimes whatflamboyant means and it
sometimes it means makeup and adress on it.
Speaker 2 (34:22):
I'm referring to like a gay guy which is what I think
you're.
That's what I'm referring totoo.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
A gay guy wearing makeup and a wig and stuff.
It is just.
It is a made up thing.
Makeup is not a real.
It doesn't come from any place,but a human made it up and said
we're going to put it on thegirl instead of the guy.
These are all made up thingsthat humans have created and
someone just said no, thatbelongs on a girl and a guy.
(34:47):
If you believe in God and youthink God is taking the time to
worry about who's wearingmascara and who isn't, I'm sorry
.
Speaker 2 (34:55):
There are some figures.
You just made that so clear.
Right, that's my style.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
It's not your style and it's their style.
That's it.
It just happens to be somethingthat was labeled as feminine.
That's all it is.
And that's made up.
And, just like women, you'retold to shave your legs.
And that's made up.
And just like women, you'retold to shave your legs.
Who, what?
What is that?
I mean, you know, do what youwant, but, like your whole life,
(35:21):
you've had to shave your legsbecause some company came up
with an idea to create razorsand sell them to you.
If you don't think it's becausesomeone's making money off of
telling you to shave your legs,I'm not telling you not to, I'm
just saying it's all about my.
All of these products are madeup.
It's not real.
We weren't born that way.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
They're all just things.
Speaker 1 (35:40):
I think, if you can think of it that way, you
wouldn't care if a woman's in atie and a man's wearing
stilettos.
Speaker 2 (35:47):
No, you see a woman in a tie, it doesn't bother.
I wouldn't say bother you.
You're not as shocked when yousee someone that's you know,
whatever.
But you would also be shockedif a woman, a regular, straight
woman, walked into a roomcompletely flamboyant color and
life and love and living outloud.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
And I will say, when I was in the course I felt the
same way.
I was like why are these guysso flamboyant?
Why are they so out?
And I just realized it wasbecause it made me uncomfortable
with, like, the issues I had.
It was bubbling up things inmyself because I felt shame if I
were to do that.
Maybe deep down inside I was alittle jealous that they were
having that fun and I don't wearwigs and mascara and makeup all
(36:27):
the time, but if I want to tryit, well, I should be able to.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
And it's been fun, but I don't do it all the time
You're right, I am so glad I'vehad this opportunity to talk to
you.
Okay, this is my last questionand then I'm going to go back to
the show real quickly.
But one parent said what do yousay to parents who are afraid
for their children I mean, wehad the bombing in Colorado
Springs they're afraid ofbullying.
(36:54):
They're afraid, possibly, ofbeing not getting the job they
want because someone doesn'twant a gay person working at
their whatever being hurt.
How can we help parents feel?
I guess anytime your kid is ina marginalized community you
worry about that.
I know lots of parents thatworry about it.
Speaker 1 (37:09):
And my parents were the same way and that's where a
lot of their concern came fromwas they were afraid that I was
going to live this awful life.
Now, slowly, as they becamemore educated and watched me
navigate through the world,they're like oh well, in fact
he's living a world right.
There's risks, there's a lot ofviolence and it's not just gay
(37:34):
and straight.
I would say what you can do tohelp them feel more safe and be
more safe is be vocal, stand upfor, for your gay son your son's
dead or daughter.
be an ally, because that is whatopens minds and hearts.
You having this podcast andbringing me to viewers that
might not have ever heard mystory or heard about my show,
(37:56):
that is a step in the rightdirection.
I got this beautiful email.
And if you want to cut it out,but I just got this beautiful
email this morning from a man inKentucky and he says and if you
want, I'll read it, no, read it.
Speaker 2 (38:10):
Please read it.
Speaker 1 (38:12):
He said I'm a cisgender, which means, just for
anyone who doesn't know, itjust means they identify as a
man.
Like they were born male.
They are male.
They're straight, cisgender,straight white male.
I have every privilege that canbe bestowed upon a child at
birth in this country, exceptthe wealthy part, which I
(38:32):
thought was funny.
After seeing you on the KellyClarkson show, I decided to
binge.
It's Okay to Ask Questions.
I've always considered myself anally but, living in rural
Kentucky, I don't have manyqueer friends to dive into
discussion with.
So your show was an eye-opener.
Hearing Rosie O'Donnellmislabel her daughter let me
(38:53):
know that it's okay for theirparents to make a mistake.
It's okay for me to do so aswell, so long as we're genuine
in trying to learn.
After watching 11 episodes ofyour show, I decided to take
action.
Today, a small group ofopen-minded people tough to find
out in the country met for thefirst time as a team to discuss
(39:14):
bringing a pride festival to oursmall town next June.
I just want to thank you foryour motivation, the education
and for giving queer educators aplatform to teach.
If that email doesn't sum upwhat we're trying to do with
this show and what thisconversation is about, Did that
bring you to tears?
(39:34):
Yeah, it did.
Rural Kentucky, did you sayRural Kentucky?
And I don't know this man andjust I found that he got my
email some way and reached out,and if that is the one thing
that comes out of this show,that is huge.
I said to him I want to comelike let me know when you do
this pride, I'll show up.
All right, Like, let me knowwhen you do this pride, I'll
show up.
Speaker 2 (39:52):
All right.
Well, I was going to ask youthe last question what do you
want people to get from yourshow?
But I think that email wrappedit up.
So, that's a perfect way to endand I just can't thank you
enough for joining us.
It was really great.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
Oh my gosh.
Thank you, and just thank youfor wanting to learn and be open
to this conversation.
That's all we can all do, right?
Speaker 2 (40:13):
That's it Right, exactly Thank you.
Well, that's a wrap.
I just love Matt Rodriguez.
That's all I'm going to say.
I hope that everyone listeningwill tune in to his show.
It's okay to ask questions.
It's on Peacock.
I'll put a link in the episodenotes on how to watch it.
(40:34):
You can also watch all ofseason one on YouTube At least I
found it on there.
Everything he said is not justabout Pride Month or the gay and
lesbian community, the queercommunity as they say now, but
about all people.
What a warm, wonderfulpersonality and something we all
can learn from.
Tune in.
It's okay to ask questions withMatt Rodriguez.
(40:56):
Thank you to Connie Gorn Fisher, our audio engineer.
Please send us your questionsat biteyourtonguepodcast at
gmailcom and log on to ourwebsite,
biteyourtonguepodcastcom.
Feel free to buy us a virtualcup of coffee.
It's only $5.
It helps us continue to do ourwork.
Thanks everyone, and remember,unless you're asking questions
(41:20):
because it's okay to askquestions remember sometimes you
have to bite your tongue.
You.
One of the beautiful things about technology is we've
been able to hear so many morestories and it's not going
through one filter anymore,where there's three TV channels
and one newspaper.
There's a lot of ways to shareinformation and because of that,
there are so many more storiesto listen to.
So if you are a parent, I alsothink it's your responsibility
to think about all the differentways people can.
(00:22):
Your responsibility to thinkabout all the different ways
people can navigate in thisworld.
All the different interests andI'm not just talking about
sexuality they could be a TikTokstar to an electrician, to like
.
All the ways you can grow andbe in this world.
There are many, and being opento that, as long as it brings
love and joy and no harm, whynot?
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Hello everyone, welcome to Bite your Tongue the
podcast.
I'm Denise and I'm Kirsten, andwe hope you will join us as we
explore the ins and outs ofbuilding healthy relationships
with our adult children.
Together, we'll speak withexperts, share heartfelt stories
(01:02):
and get timely adviceaddressing topics that matter
most to you.
Get ready to dive deep andlearn to build and nurture deep
connections with our adultchildren and, of course, when to
bite our tongues.
So let's get started.
Hello everyone, and welcome toanother episode of Bite your
Tongue the podcast.
I'm Denise and sadly I'm nothere with my co-host, kirsten.
This was an episode she reallywanted to do, but the timing
(01:25):
just didn't work for her thistime.
I'm so sorry she's missing it.
Anyway, as many of you know,june is Pride Month and every
June we try to do an episodethat addresses the LGBTQAI plus
community.
And we are so excited fortoday's episode because we're
celebrating pride by talking tothe Emmy-nominated Matthew
(01:47):
Rodriguez.
He has hosted and produced theNBC Chicago's top-rated Chicago
Today show since 2019.
And I just learned he's in hissecond season for an amazing
show.
He's the executive producer andhost of it's Okay to Ask
Questions.
The series showcases open andhonest conversations with
(02:10):
trailblazers in the LGBTQIA pluscommunity, delivering candid
dialogue with no topic offlimits.
And for all of us parents ofadult children, with the
ever-changing queer community,it's great for us to know it's
okay to ask questions.
So welcome Matt.
(02:30):
I love, first of all, how youstart your episodes and I'd like
to steal it and start ourepisode with this.
So, listeners, this episode isopening minds and hearts with
thoughtful conversation.
Welcome Matt.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
I love that.
Thank you for noticing our open.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Well, it's so beautiful.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Yeah, you know, you record these things and you're
in a room and you record it andyou write something and you see
it a thousand times becauseyou're editing with the
producers and the editors andyou just forget what it all
means, you know, and then yourelease it and people respond
and it can be quite overwhelmingthat it's.
It's that original intentionthat you kind of forgot about
(03:13):
because you've been so caught upin the technical part of it.
I'm sure you can relate withthe podcast I can but it's so
beautiful, it's so beautiful.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
So I want to remind you, when we get started started
, that our audience is mostlyparents of adult kids.
So we're talking 55, 65, eveninto the 70s, and I think in an
interview you did with ChicagoMagazine, you said that you have
an imaginary viewer Betty Sue,yes, jesus, and all the Bobs of
(03:42):
the world struggling overunderstanding the changing face
of LGBTQIA community, and we'rereally hesitant to ask questions
.
So that's why I love the titleof your show.
So tell us a bit about yourshow, why we should watch and
how it will help us understandmore about this community and
how we should approach askingquestions.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
Well, that's so funny .
I love that you caught up onthat.
You know, my executive producerfrom the other show I host,
Chicago Today, created thisimaginary viewer and I use that
same scenario for this showbecause the Betty Sues and the
Bobs of the world that live onMain Street that's just a
generic name we created for ourviewer.
They do care and, like we weretalking before we were recording
(04:27):
here, they have that gay cousinor they have that gay nephew or
they have that friend who isidentifying as transgender now
and they can sometimes be alittle overwhelmed and not know
how to approach it.
And I myself, as a gay man,part of the LGBTQIA community,
had that same feeling.
(04:49):
I had a lot of friends coming upto me and saying can you
explain what it is to benon-binary?
Can you explain what it is whensomeone realizes they are
transgender and wants to makethat transition?
I was like I don't know.
I don't know Just because I'mgay and we're kind of on the
same side of the street didn'tmean I knew everything there was
to know, Just like they don'tknow everything about me.
(05:11):
And with that, when we weretrying to create this show, I
was kind of expressing that in ameeting and I just blurted out
I wish it was okay to askquestions and we said that's the
name of the title, becausethat's the way so many people
feel right now.
So many people.
We've created silos, whether welike it or not.
We've created boxes and wallsand all that kind of stuff for
(05:34):
many reasons, not just aboutthis subject, and I think we're
afraid to ask the questions.
We're afraid we'll offend,we're afraid we will be
misunderstood when we ask thequestion.
So I think if you go forth withintention and love in your
(05:55):
heart and joy and listen to theresponse of the question, that's
half of it.
The title is only half of it.
It's okay to ask questions, butyou've got to listen to what
they say, You've got to digestit.
Ask some more questions, maybe,step away, come back to it.
That's really at the heart ofit all, and we've done that
through these wonderfulinterviews this season.
We have Rosie O'Donnell, who Ithink a lot of your viewers,
your listeners, might know andconnect to.
(06:18):
We have Jojo Siwa, who's a muchyounger audience but still an
important voice.
We have a woman from LosAngeles.
She is a lesbian, Zoya Biglari,and she's from a Persian family
and in Iran, which is where herparents are from, if you come
out you could be killed, it ispunishable by death.
(06:39):
And for her family to come toLos Angeles and then their
daughters say I'm a lesbian,that would take them aback,
right?
And so it took some time forthe family to move through this
new revelation.
So we have many stories likethat.
I've learned so much.
I think the viewer can learn somuch.
I think we come at it with avery gentle, foundational
(07:04):
approach at making you know wedon't get too too into the weeds
Some of the some of theepisodes.
We can get deeper intodefinitions and what this means
and what that means, but I Ithink it's something that most
people can sit down with a lovedone or your family and and take
away some really easy bites ifthat makes sense.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
I agree, and I haven't watched every episode
because I only found out aboutit when I saw you on the Today
Show.
And congrats on that anyway.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
Oh, my gosh, thank you.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
And we will link how people can watch in our episode
notes, but I did watch.
There are a few episodes I wantto talk about.
The first one was season one,episode one with and again
you're right, we don't know allthese people Shea Coulee, Shea.
Speaker 1 (07:44):
Coulee, yeah, who's a very well-known drag queen.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Okay, drag race and is in the drag scene and which
is a whole other world.
That can seem scary and I'mgoing to ask you something about
that.
But what I want to ask aboutthis is and she identifies as
she, I can use the pronoun sheright, I noticed I was trying to
make sure I got my pronounsright, because this is hard for
us too.
She says and I really foundthis kids are not born in the
(08:10):
closet.
They go into the closet becausethey've been told to be ashamed
or they're ashamed Expand alittle bit on that because that
was touching to me.
She said she knew by the timeshe was four.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Wow, that makes me a little emotional because I
hadn't I haven't watched that.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
Oh, I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
No, I hadn't you know .
You record these and you.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
I sometimes.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
I forget even what was said and I I can't remember
everything, matt just hit mejust now because it's very true,
I feel like I'm hearing it forthe first time.
You're just a kid, You're justacting and reacting to the way
you see the world.
When you come out and slowly,piece by piece, you see how
someone reacts to you, see yourfamily or your parents or a
(08:57):
neighbor react to another.
I'm going to use me as anexample.
Another little boy acting alittle effeminate, and they get
a little squeamish and they geta little weird and they're like
well, why?
Speaker 2 (09:06):
why are you doing?
Speaker 1 (09:07):
that you should be out there playing with trucks,
and none of that.
And so that's one thing.
And then that little boy growsup and they want to be, you know
, they want to play piano orthey want to dance.
Why are you doing that?
You should go to soccer, orvice versa for a woman, or you
know, there's so many scenarios,and, bit by bit by bit, you're
putting a little piece of brickin front of them, brick by brick
(09:27):
, by brick by brick.
And then, all of a sudden, thatkid can't see anymore.
Right, that kid can't see outof all the things they've been
told they shouldn't be.
And why would we do that tosomeone?
Why would we do that to anyone?
Straight Doesn't matter yourrace your religion, like let us
live organically and free.
Shay is absolutely right, Ithink.
(09:49):
And can we fix that?
I don't know.
It's almost impossible to notput some of your thoughts and
beliefs on your children, butmake sure you listen to them,
because even if they're four to85, it doesn't matter.
People have opinions andthoughts that are organic and
(10:10):
come from it with inside, fromthe day they're born.
And if you don't believe that,I'm sorry.
It's true.
There are certain things thatare just in our souls that we
cannot hold back.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
That's beautiful.
You explained it well becausethat really touched me, because
I think we do that with lots ofpeople, not just queer people.
I hate to say this, but the waypeople look, the way oh, God.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
The way, whatever it is, if they're not athletic your
eyes are a little off your nose.
Oh, that nose, oh.
Yeah, that nose right, exactly,exactly, Quiet, down your voice
is too pitchy, your voice istoo high.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
You know mine is oh no, no, I'm thinking my sound is
bad, okay, can you imagine?
Speaker 1 (10:51):
can you imagine if I stopped the interview and said
your voice?
Speaker 2 (10:54):
well, I would have appreciated you're telling me my
sound wasn't good anyway, no,your sound okay okay all right,
so I'm going to mention twoother shows and then we're going
to get to a few questions.
I love the the interview withER Fightmaster Again.
I have seen them a hundredtimes.
Never knew their name and I'veseen them on Grey's Anatomy, but
anyway, I thought who's ERFightmaster?
(11:16):
Anyway, they explained thatthey identify as non-binary and
their pronouns were they andthem.
But you asked them how theyfelt about the new pronouns Zed
and Zay.
Is that right?
Am I saying that right, mike?
Speaker 1 (11:31):
Zed and Zay, and there's Zee and there's many
others.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
Are we expected to keep?
First tell us what they are,and how are we expected to keep
up with all this?
Speaker 1 (11:41):
Well, I mean, you know, if there's a new
restaurant in town, you learnthe name of that really quickly.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
No, no, we don't At our age we don't.
We don't that place down thereon the corner that serves Thai
food.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
Well, that's why, and so listen.
So this is what I think, and Ihope I don't.
I hope I'm not speaking out ofout of line, because I am not a
expert on all of this.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
No, no, I understand that, don't worry, we understand
that.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
But from what I took away, there is unless somebody
tells you they are, thisspecific pronoun, the Z or the
Zed, and there are I'veencountered not that many and
there might be some but for themost part again, asterisks, from
what I understand.
I have seen that most peoplejust like they or that and
(12:29):
that's quite easy.
So we have their he, him, she,her and they that.
And I know a lot of people saythe grammar.
But the grammar it's plural.
We use they and ER says thisall the time.
We use they.
You know you leave your glass.
I'm like where, where's Denise?
They left their glass here.
You know you would say they inpassing, so I would just lean on
(12:53):
the day.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
We've all gotten that and we're working on that, but
then all of a sudden all thisnew stuff comes in.
But I think being respectfuland if you're talking to someone
is the best thing to do and Ithink then people understand.
Speaker 1 (13:04):
That's it.
I forget people's names.
Every day I will meet someoneand two minutes later I forget
their name.
So I think a lot of people justneed to remember that part.
If you just think about thatalone, like I can't even
remember someone's namesometimes.
So just go in with grace, justsay, remind me again how you'd
like to be referred.
(13:24):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
Yeah, that's perfect, Because I never know whether to
say what are your pronouns orhow you like to be referred.
Sometimes I feel like I'm toowoke if I say what are your
pronouns?
Speaker 1 (13:34):
I don't think anyone's going to be offended by
you saying what are yourpronouns, Unless it's someone
who's anti any of this.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Well then, I don't really care.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Right, exactly, but anyone, anyone who's identifying
as non-binary is certainly notgoing to be offended if you ask
what their pronouns are Now, ifthey've told you their pronouns
50 times they might eventually,like if I told my name to you 50
times, you'd get a littleannoyed.
And I don't get me wrong, I'vemet people where they like we've
met before and I'm like, oh myGod, I'm embarrassed and I don't
remember the name.
But I think that's a way tothink of it.
(14:07):
I think that that's helped me.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
All right, now though this one.
I hope I pronounced this nameright, because I literally made
my husband watch this last night.
Okay, pigeon Pagonis.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
Pigeon Pagonis yes.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
I want you to tell her story.
I'm not going to tell it, okay,because I didn't understand
this at all.
And the way I want to telleveryone to watch this episode,
I think it's season one.
Is it season one?
It's all these are all seasonone.
Okay, these are all season one.
Okay, I guess I haven't gottento season two yet.
I'm sorry, I never understoodthis, so I'd love it explained
to me.
She was born intersex.
But go ahead.
Speaker 1 (14:42):
Intersex and again, I am not a scientist or a doctor
or anything but with this isthis is what's different.
Intersex is not something apigeon choked, and not that I
think someone who's gay choosesthis, but this is like, this is
when you were in intersex.
This is like you werephysically born this way.
There's no debating.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
She was told that her ovaries were removed because
she had cancer.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
Yeah, so let's back up Right.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Okay, go ahead, you do it.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
And gosh, I don't want to mess up her story
because you know what?
Speaker 2 (15:15):
They can all watch it .
So you do the best you can.
And then here's the thing.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
I won't be specific because I can't remember
everything about pigeon becauseit was a year ago and I.
But what I will say is there arepeople that are born with
genitalia and I'm just going todumb this down body parts from
the female side of the spectrumand the male side of the
spectrum.
Right, I think in certain casessomeone might have actual
(15:42):
testicles instead of ovaries,but they aren't descended, so
that means they're still like upin the body and you might have
actual testicles instead ofovaries, but they aren't
descended.
So that means they're stilllike up in the body and you
might have a, an enlargedclitoris, so, but but still an
opening that can look like avagina, but you don't actually
have a full uterus with insideof that, if that makes sense.
So it's kind of like the bodywas processing in while in the,
(16:05):
in the mother's womb, and itstopped cooking.
Right, Like the body stoppedprocessing it to stop growing
and it just reached a certainpoint.
Again, I hope people don'tbacklash on me and I would love
everyone, your audience mightremember the word hermaphrodite.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
We don't use that word anymore.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
Um, some people do, but we don't use that word
anymore.
Use intersex and pigeon storywas quite remarkable because she
was born and they thought, ohyou know, she looks more like a
girl, so we're going to lean inlike her body, her genitalia
look more like a girl, so we'regoing to lean into the fact that
(16:45):
she's a girl and they performcertain surgeries on her to make
her more of a girl, withoutever explaining it to Pigeon or
giving her the choice, until shewas older and she actually
found out by putting the piecestogether.
So her family kind of knew, butthe doctors knew, but they
never told her that they toldher she had cancer.
(17:05):
They told her that she had allthese surgeries because they
needed to prevent her from thecancer from spreading and all
these types of things.
She actually has a wonderfulbook explaining all of this.
But what had happened was shefound out all about this and
figured it out later and turnsout with certain chromosomes and
all of her DNA and I know thisis very confusing.
(17:26):
She actually would have beenbetter off leaning into being a
boy with what she had, but atthis point, when she was in
college and realized who she was, it was too late that the
surgeries had been performed.
They had done a surgery toenlarge her vagina Very, very
graphic and it might be too muchfor some people.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
No, no, it's very enlightening.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
It's very enlightening and Pridgen is so
honest and raw and and thatconversation was wonderful and
and it it's something thatpeople don't talk about and
almost 1% of the entirepopulation is intersex.
That's a lot of people,millions and millions of people
that we, you know, we might knowpeople and you would never even
(18:08):
know, because they could, theycould present one way on, you
know, on their face, but downbelow there's something else
going on and they can beembarrassed and shamed and feel
isolated.
So when I say the alphabet, thequeer alphabet, is what we call
it LGBTQIA.
The I is intersex, yes, andthere's the.
(18:28):
There's the struggle fortransgender rights.
Right, we're trying to letchildren make a decision early
on in their process.
If it's supported by the familyand supported by the doctors
and the child, if they want tomake a transition, they should
be able to do what they'd like.
Now, the opposite is true whenwe're talking about our intersex
(18:51):
family, because if they don'thave the right to make the
decision and the doctors make itfor them and it's forced upon
them, that's a really horriblesituation.
So this struggle betweenintersex rights and trans rights
can actually can pin the twoagainst each other, so
politicians can say oh well, inthis case you don't want the
(19:12):
doctors to perform anything forthese intersex kids, but for the
trans kids, all of a sudden youdo want them to do some.
So it can get very complicated.
There's a lot of shadows thereand a pigeon goes into that
conversation as well.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
It's a wonderful one and you do a great job.
The interview is so wonderfulso I really want to listen to
that.
You know Katie Couric did aNational Geographic show several
years ago I don't know ifyou've watched it called A
Gender Revolution, and Iremember she did that, yeah, and
I've always encouraged ourlisteners to watch that because
there are several and I neverknew it was intersex and I'm not
(19:46):
sure if I watched this so longago, just like you.
But a couple of people thattheir sex like they were born
with both genitalia and thedoctor decided who they were.
And when they became adultsthey realized they were not a
boy, they really were a girl andpeople were criticizing them
and I thought how could you knowthis person was?
Just someone said okay, we'regoing to choose this and cut
(20:07):
everything else off.
So that really opened my eyes.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
But I didn't understand the whole intersex
thing until right now, or untilI watched pigeons and I got to
say and it makes you think like,look, if mother nature created
this, this child, right, and youcan physically see that there's
something different, right,like it's, it's not a full
vagina, it's not a full penis,whatever they're, and it's all
different.
These are just examples.
(20:31):
It may not even present in thatway.
There's many ways to beintersex, there's lots of
categories.
But if Mother Nature can dothat, why couldn't it create
other different types of peopleLike, why do we think it's one
or the other, when Mother Natureherself has created people that
(20:53):
are all in between and indifferent gray areas?
I mean, it's like a physicalpresentation right there.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
No, you're absolutely right, and when you brought up
transgender, I wasn't going toask this question.
In fact, I took the treatmentof trans students that's right
(21:21):
in their schools.
How do you feel when you hearthese stories that we're trying
to go forward and then we get 10steps back?
Speaker 1 (21:27):
You are putting these kids' lives at risk.
You are telling a communitythat they don't matter, their
thoughts don't matter, theirbeliefs don't matter, and you
are putting them at risk ofdeath.
That's the bottom line.
Children who don't have theability to transition are and I
don't have the exact statistic,but are much, much, much more
(21:51):
likely to commit suicide.
You're endangering them withthemselves and the way they feel
about how they exist in theworld.
And then you're endangeringthem by telling everyone in the
community it's okay to hate onthese people.
So I'm certainly not all right.
Speaker 2 (22:06):
Oh gosh.
Speaker 1 (22:08):
You're giving them the okay to say no, these people
aren't like us.
That's not right.
We wouldn't do that to anyone.
I don't want to do that toanyone.
I don't care what side of thepolitical spectrum you're on.
Everyone should have theirright.
But to say that these peoplecan't be who they are without it
harming or affecting you in anyway, don't tell me it does,
because it doesn't.
(22:29):
You can't tell me it does.
Give me one example.
Very good.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
Good job.
Okay, I'm going to ask a coupleof little more questions about
the show, and then I have somelistener questions.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
Great, because it's okay to ask questions right,
it's okay to ask questions, andyou know what If we're on
YouTube?
Here I just want to admit mydisgusting smoothie.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
It's just filled with vegetables and goodness, as I'm
saying, okay, okay, it lookswonderful and it's why you look
so good.
So as I was watching some ofthese, I thought to myself
you're interviewing so manycelebrities.
Have you ever thought ofinterviewing a regular Joe or
Josie?
Sometimes people watch and theysay, well, you're a celebrity,
it's easy for you to you knowwhatever.
(23:09):
How does it feel for someonewho's not a celebrity?
Right, Well, I think you know, Idon't think everyone that we've
interviewed has a householdname.
No, no, half of them aren'thousehold names, but they have a
persona.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
Right, but they have a persona and a slight following
.
In some cases, and I'd say inseason two, we even found people
with more of a quote unquotefollowing.
And when I say that maybe someof your viewers like a large
following on Instagram or TikTok, and I've said this many times
it certainly doesn't mean thattheir story is any more
important than someone next doorwhere we don't necessarily know
(23:42):
who they are.
It doesn't, and in fact thatother person might have a more
incredible story.
The reason we have leaned intosome of that now this season.
We have someone like Jojo Siwawho is insanely popular with a
younger audience.
Rosie O'Donnell really big,really well-known, with an older
audience.
We chose to have some of thosepeople because it makes people
(24:05):
watch.
And if I can put Rosie's storynext to Cody Daigle-Oriens, who
is an asexual advocate out ofCleveland Ohio, who is not as
well known but it makes someonego and watch that episode, then
certainly then I'm amplifyingnot only Rosie's story, which is
valid and important, but alsoCody's and then Zoya, from who I
(24:30):
mentioned earlier, the womanfrom Los Angeles.
I try to be very diverse whenI'm booking the show, not only
in the story being told, but whothey might be connected with.
Is it an older demographic, isit younger?
I like to represent age.
If I, if I had my way, I woulddo 15 episodes.
We could do, you know, a rangeof race, but I could only do six
(24:52):
and we had to pick and chooseand it's who says yes and who
says no and doing that wholepuzzle.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
Tell us about Rosie O'Donnell's story.
She has a transgender daughter.
Speaker 1 (25:01):
A non-binary child.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
Non-binary Okay, sorry, do you say non-binary
daughter?
How would I say?
Speaker 1 (25:06):
A non-binary child Child.
Okay, non-binary child ChildChild is a neutral.
There's no gender associated.
I like Rosie's story.
Rosie struggles with thepronouns.
Rosie has a tattoo on her arm.
It says they them like.
If Rosie, who is a lesbianknown around the world, has
trouble remembering that, herown child, my viewer, who is
(25:29):
having trouble, can relate tothat.
That's why I chose Rosie, notbecause she was the ultimate gap
, because of that reason alone,and I think that's really
important.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
All right, okay, so you've said.
When you came out to yourparents, who are old school
Catholic, your dad got upset andyour mother fell to the floor
crying.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Okay, so what advice do you have for our generation
of parents?
When their adult child comes tothem, what are some of the
things they can say that will be?
They don't want to fall to thefloor crying.
Let's put it that way.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
Yeah, you don't want to do that.
And again, I love my parentsand-.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
I know you do, and you've said that I don't want to
, and it's great that you'vebeen honest, though.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Yeah, I'm going to be honest and I've been writing a
lot about it and I've beenreflecting on that time.
So who knows what more I'lltalk about from that time.
But look, I've realized as I'vegotten older.
I might not have realized it inthe moment, but it took me a
long time to realize I was gay,right, it took years and years
and years for me to put piecestogether and come to terms with
(26:30):
that.
And when I did that, I was like, oh okay, I'm good.
So then when I told my parents,who had known me for 21 years
in a certain way and they had,regardless of the signs that
were there that might've said Iwas gay they didn't see those
and they just listened to what Isaid and I was straight, or you
know, pretending to datesomeone, or whatever, whatever
I'd say to them Ididn't really talk about dating.
(26:50):
They thought I was straight.
So obviously it took them sometime to wrap their heads around
it and their minds around it.
So I would say, if you need toand you can't say anything in
the moment, I would hug yourchild, kiss them, say I love you
and say I just need a moment toprocess this.
(27:11):
I just because I don't want tosay the wrong thing, I want to
say the right things to you Now.
That's like a last minute Ifyou can't get the words out if
you feel like you're going toblow up and you're going to
explode and cry.
That's what I would do.
I think other people might havedifferent suggestions, but I
would just hold them, say I loveyou and I just need a moment
and that's it, because I want tosay the right thing to you.
(27:33):
So I need to collect mythoughts and I think that would
be understandable.
Your child might not get it inthe moment, but I think as time
goes on they might reflect andsay oh, I'm glad my parents did
that, as opposed to dropping tothe floor crying.
It was a slow fall for my mom.
She kind of like it was like aslide off the couch onto her
(27:56):
knees and then she came kind ofyou know some of it is, and I
think it's a two sided kind ofthing.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
The child who has also decided to come out needs
to give their parents some time.
The parent has to process andI've talked to this about a lot
to a lot of my friends who'veyoung adult kids or teenagers
have come out.
When you hold your baby in yourarms when they're born, you
already are walking them downthe aisle.
I know it sounds crazy, becauseweddings aren't even like that
anymore.
Right, this vision of theirlife and all of a sudden it
(28:25):
changes.
It's not that you can't acceptthat new trajectory for them.
You have a son you might haveinstead of a daughter in law.
You're going.
You have a son you might haveinstead of a daughter-in-law.
You're going to have ason-in-law, possibly the
advancements of, I mean, theystill might have grandchildren.
You know all of that.
But you need time to processthat as a parent and I hope that
on both sides the child who'scoming out understands that the
(28:46):
parents might need a little timeto process it.
Speaker 1 (28:49):
I think some kids would.
I think some kids wouldn't.
It's going to be, it's just,it's to each each their own.
I also think as a parent andI'm not a parent you have to
make sure you're dreaming in alldifferent ways for your kids.
Right, you have to reimaginethat dream, because it's not
just the Disney snow white storyanymore, and it never was by
(29:10):
the way it's just what we weretold, and that's one of the
beautiful things abouttechnology is we've been able to
hear so many more stories andit's not going through one
filter anymore where there'sthree TV channels and one
newspaper.
There's a lot of ways to shareinformation and because of that,
there are so many more storiesto listen to.
(29:31):
So if you are a parent, I alsothink it's your responsibility
to think about all the differentways people can navigate in
this world, all the differentinterests and I'm not just
talking about sexuality theycould be a TikTok star to an
electrician, to like all theways you can grow and be in this
world.
There are many, and being opento that, as long as it brings
(29:51):
love and joy and no harm, whynot?
Speaker 2 (29:54):
You are so incredible .
That was so wonderful.
It's the first time I've heardthat and it really opened my
mind.
You're right, we need to see awider world.
Yeah, that's it 100% right,that was so good.
Okay, so, wrote her gay sonthinks gays feel inherently
(30:15):
flawed and have emotionalbaggage.
This is not my opinion and Ithink he's being too hard on
himself and the gay community.
How should I respond when heexpresses that to me?
Speaker 1 (30:29):
I.
That's a hard one, cause I knowthat kid.
I know like I felt that way.
You know.
I think when you first come outthere can be some self-hating
that even if you've come out,you know I'd come out and I had
lived out of the closet foryears.
Oh my God, it was 10 years.
I'd come out and I joined theSan Francisco gay men's chorus.
(30:52):
It's amazing organization.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
Oh, I know everything about that Okay.
Oh, you do Okay, and we have agay men's course in Denver too.
Speaker 1 (30:59):
There's many across the country.
Beautiful but anyway.
So I had joined this and I wassurrounded by 300 men that 300
gay men of all shapes and sizesand beliefs and diversity, and
some living very out and proud,and I was so uncomfortable I
wanted to quit.
I wanted any excuse to get outof this chorus because it made
(31:23):
me feel so uncomfortable.
And I realized week by weekthat I was uncomfortable with
how open and honest and and trueto themselves, my fellow chorus
mates were and I, even though Iwas out in Los Angeles I had
lived in Los Angeles beforemoving to San Francisco even
(31:45):
though I was out, I was stillvery much in a straight world.
I was with my straight friends,I did straight things, which I
love.
There's nothing wrong with that.
But I hadn't, but I hadn't beenaround as many gay people.
I had kind of isolated myselfand I realized it was because I
was kind of hating that side ofme deep down subconsciously.
(32:05):
And when I was with my gaybrothers of the San Francisco
Gay Men's Chorus they were kindof like cracking me open to
another side of me, like a more,maybe a little bit more, of a
flamboyant side, maybe a littlebit more a side that wanted to
be a little bit more free aboutmy sexuality, that I always felt
shame from that.
(32:26):
I always felt like I needed tohide.
I don't want to make peoplethink like they were shoving
this down my throats.
It was just an honest,beautiful way of living where
they were proud who they wereand and so that took time and I
and I don't know this, thisgentleman or this person's story
, but you know, maybe they needto experience more.
(32:48):
Maybe they need to find theircommunity so that they see that
there are many, many, many queerpeople who don't feel any sense
of pain or sadness.
I think oftentimes the onlystories we hear about the LGBT
community are negative ones andmy struggle coming out and my
struggle finding out I wastransgender.
(33:09):
But many times there's noproblem at all and they have a
beautiful story and they livetheir life with joy and freedom
and they're okay.
So I would try and help himfind those stories and that
might take a little work andfind that community.
Depending on where they live,may take a vacation, but that
takes time.
(33:30):
It takes time.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
So you brought up this whole idea of flamboyant
and someone did write.
You know I have no problem withthe gay community.
Why the flamboyance?
What is important about theflamboyance to the gay community
?
Speaker 1 (33:44):
Number one.
It's not everybody, it's not.
Speaker 2 (33:46):
No, no, no, that's right.
Speaker 1 (33:47):
I don't think you're saying that, but I mean it's
look at your friends, look atyour straight group of friends.
Are they all different?
Is one loud, is one quiet, isone more dramatic?
That is who we are, and whywould we be any different just
because it's some rainbow fabric, and that's not always what it
(34:08):
is.
It's just expression, and whenyou really, if you can just take
a minute, Okay.
To think about sometimes whatflamboyant means and it
sometimes it means makeup and adress on it.
Speaker 2 (34:22):
I'm referring to like a gay guy which is what I think
you're.
That's what I'm referring totoo.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
A gay guy wearing makeup and a wig and stuff.
It is just.
It is a made up thing.
Makeup is not a real.
It doesn't come from any place,but a human made it up and said
we're going to put it on thegirl instead of the guy.
These are all made up thingsthat humans have created and
someone just said no, thatbelongs on a girl and a guy.
(34:47):
If you believe in God and youthink God is taking the time to
worry about who's wearingmascara and who isn't, I'm sorry
.
Speaker 2 (34:55):
There are some figures.
You just made that so clear.
Right, that's my style.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
It's not your style and it's their style.
That's it.
It just happens to be somethingthat was labeled as feminine.
That's all it is.
And that's made up.
And, just like women, you'retold to shave your legs.
And that's made up.
And just like women, you'retold to shave your legs.
Who, what?
What is that?
I mean, you know, do what youwant, but, like your whole life,
(35:21):
you've had to shave your legsbecause some company came up
with an idea to create razorsand sell them to you.
If you don't think it's becausesomeone's making money off of
telling you to shave your legs,I'm not telling you not to, I'm
just saying it's all about my.
All of these products are madeup.
It's not real.
We weren't born that way.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
They're all just things.
Speaker 1 (35:40):
I think, if you can think of it that way, you
wouldn't care if a woman's in atie and a man's wearing
stilettos.
Speaker 2 (35:47):
No, you see a woman in a tie, it doesn't bother.
I wouldn't say bother you.
You're not as shocked when yousee someone that's you know,
whatever.
But you would also be shockedif a woman, a regular, straight
woman, walked into a roomcompletely flamboyant color and
life and love and living outloud.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
And I will say, when I was in the course I felt the
same way.
I was like why are these guysso flamboyant?
Why are they so out?
And I just realized it wasbecause it made me uncomfortable
with, like, the issues I had.
It was bubbling up things inmyself because I felt shame if I
were to do that.
Maybe deep down inside I was alittle jealous that they were
having that fun and I don't wearwigs and mascara and makeup all
(36:27):
the time, but if I want to tryit, well, I should be able to.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
And it's been fun, but I don't do it all the time
You're right, I am so glad I'vehad this opportunity to talk to
you.
Okay, this is my last questionand then I'm going to go back to
the show real quickly.
But one parent said what do yousay to parents who are afraid
for their children I mean, wehad the bombing in Colorado
Springs they're afraid ofbullying.
(36:54):
They're afraid, possibly, ofbeing not getting the job they
want because someone doesn'twant a gay person working at
their whatever being hurt.
How can we help parents feel?
I guess anytime your kid is ina marginalized community you
worry about that.
I know lots of parents thatworry about it.
Speaker 1 (37:09):
And my parents were the same way and that's where a
lot of their concern came fromwas they were afraid that I was
going to live this awful life.
Now, slowly, as they becamemore educated and watched me
navigate through the world,they're like oh well, in fact
he's living a world right.
There's risks, there's a lot ofviolence and it's not just gay
(37:34):
and straight.
I would say what you can do tohelp them feel more safe and be
more safe is be vocal, stand upfor, for your gay son your son's
dead or daughter.
be an ally, because that is whatopens minds and hearts.
You having this podcast andbringing me to viewers that
might not have ever heard mystory or heard about my show,
(37:56):
that is a step in the rightdirection.
I got this beautiful email.
And if you want to cut it out,but I just got this beautiful
email this morning from a man inKentucky and he says and if you
want, I'll read it, no, read it.
Speaker 2 (38:10):
Please read it.
Speaker 1 (38:12):
He said I'm a cisgender, which means, just for
anyone who doesn't know, itjust means they identify as a
man.
Like they were born male.
They are male.
They're straight, cisgender,straight white male.
I have every privilege that canbe bestowed upon a child at
birth in this country, exceptthe wealthy part, which I
(38:32):
thought was funny.
After seeing you on the KellyClarkson show, I decided to
binge.
It's Okay to Ask Questions.
I've always considered myself anally but, living in rural
Kentucky, I don't have manyqueer friends to dive into
discussion with.
So your show was an eye-opener.
Hearing Rosie O'Donnellmislabel her daughter let me
(38:53):
know that it's okay for theirparents to make a mistake.
It's okay for me to do so aswell, so long as we're genuine
in trying to learn.
After watching 11 episodes ofyour show, I decided to take
action.
Today, a small group ofopen-minded people tough to find
out in the country met for thefirst time as a team to discuss
(39:14):
bringing a pride festival to oursmall town next June.
I just want to thank you foryour motivation, the education
and for giving queer educators aplatform to teach.
If that email doesn't sum upwhat we're trying to do with
this show and what thisconversation is about, Did that
bring you to tears?
(39:34):
Yeah, it did.
Rural Kentucky, did you sayRural Kentucky?
And I don't know this man andjust I found that he got my
email some way and reached out,and if that is the one thing
that comes out of this show,that is huge.
I said to him I want to comelike let me know when you do
this pride, I'll show up.
All right, Like, let me knowwhen you do this pride, I'll
show up.
Speaker 2 (39:52):
All right.
Well, I was going to ask youthe last question what do you
want people to get from yourshow?
But I think that email wrappedit up.
So, that's a perfect way to endand I just can't thank you
enough for joining us.
It was really great.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
Oh my gosh.
Thank you, and just thank youfor wanting to learn and be open
to this conversation.
That's all we can all do, right?
Speaker 2 (40:13):
That's it Right, exactly Thank you.
Well, that's a wrap.
I just love Matt Rodriguez.
That's all I'm going to say.
I hope that everyone listeningwill tune in to his show.
It's okay to ask questions.
It's on Peacock.
I'll put a link in the episodenotes on how to watch it.
(40:34):
You can also watch all ofseason one on YouTube At least I
found it on there.
Everything he said is not justabout Pride Month or the gay and
lesbian community, the queercommunity as they say now, but
about all people.
What a warm, wonderfulpersonality and something we all
can learn from.
Tune in.
It's okay to ask questions withMatt Rodriguez.
(40:56):
Thank you to Connie Gorn Fisher, our audio engineer.
Please send us your questionsat biteyourtonguepodcast at
gmailcom and log on to ourwebsite,
biteyourtonguepodcastcom.
Feel free to buy us a virtualcup of coffee.
It's only $5.
It helps us continue to do ourwork.
Thanks everyone, and remember,unless you're asking questions
(41:20):
because it's okay to askquestions remember sometimes you
have to bite your tongue.
You.
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