July 8, 2025 • 38 mins
ASA Martial Arts Business Summit 2025
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What separates thriving martial arts schools from struggling ones? Master Lee draws from his family's 50-year legacy to reveal the powerful role culture plays in creating an exceptional martial arts business.
Ever wonder why some martial arts schools consistently grow while others plateau? The secret lies not in marketing tactics or fancy facilities, but in something far more fundamental: culture. Master Chan demonstrates how creating the right environment transforms everything from student retention to parent engagement.
Whether you run a traditional martial arts program or a modern mixed martial arts school, these cultural principles can transform your student experience. Listen now to discover the one ingredient your martial arts school can't afford to ignore. Then share your thoughts with us—what cultural elements have made the biggest difference in your school?
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
In today's episode, we will discuss the one powerful
ingredient your martial artsschools can't afford to ignore.
Welcome to Black Belt Banterthe best podcast to help your
martial arts school increase inprofits and generate substantial
revenue.
I'm Jimmy Hong and my co-hostis Master Chan Lee.
(00:23):
Master Chan has over 2,100active students with multiple
locations.
He is well-renowned and highlyrespected by his fellow peers
for his business acumen inoperating martial arts schools.
Master Chan Lee, welcome to thepodcast.
Before we start, though, beforewe start start, I know you're
(00:43):
excited about this subject.
We're talking about it on ourpre-production meeting.
Your your heart is really inthis topic and and I know you
can't wait to share, but I wantto I want to say have you been
getting a lot of feedback fromthe fellow community about the
launch of our podcast?
Because I've been gettingemails, messages.
(01:05):
I've been getting so manypositive support about how much
they're just enjoying our show.
What about you, Master Chan?
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Yeah, the feedback's been incredible and the reason
you can see our faces is thatit's been by the feedback of
everybody that came back andsaid it'd be nice to see who we
are.
But I'm gonna assume ourviewership and listenership will
decline, drop huge after youknow they they're seeing our
live faces, so 100.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
This is a one-off, we're gonna do this, and then
everybody's gonna say can we goback to just a podcast and no
video?
Speaker 2 (01:37):
only sir right, we have faces for radio, as they
say I get that all the time,yeah so but yeah, the response
has been absolutely great, thankyou.
You and I are sons ofgrandmasters in Taekwondo.
We love the martial arts and wewant to make sure we are doing
whatever we can to help schoolowners across the country,
(01:59):
because the fact still remainsless than 3% of the US
population does martial arts,and it just boggles my mind, and
we really got to do a betterjob of being able to educate
school owners on teaching whatthey're doing and helping people
be their best in the martialarts, and so forth.
So that's really the genesis ofwhat this podcast is about this
(02:30):
podcast is about.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
So what I mean and they've been just so the the,
the support and the complimentsthat we receive.
It just reaffirms of why we'redoing this, because you and I
talked about okay, what is ourend game here.
What is our goal of launching apodcast is exactly this is to
connect in a consistent way withour listeners, with the fellow
Marshall School owners withinthe industry that we are already
(02:52):
on, but this is a greatrelevant way for us to stay
connected, build a rapport andjust build an audience with our
supportive listeners.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
Absolutely, absolutely.
And we've met and I know I'vemet a lot of school owners and
fellow martial art teachersthrough the tournaments, also
met a lot of you through othermartial art events throughout
the country and so forth andafter we do these events we're
not really connected or notseeing, hearing what exactly is
going on in our industry, and Ithought this would be a good way
(03:24):
.
And then I still have the fewphone calls I make to the people
that I really respect and getfeedback from, but even then you
feel like you're not getting itthe whole story because
everybody's busy and so forth.
So I thought this would be agood way for us to connect with
our audience and let everybodyknow what's going on and so
forth.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Absolutely.
And speaking of that, let's get, just let's dive into this next
topic that you're passionateabout.
What is this topic, what isthis thing that you're just so
passionate about, master chan?
Speaker 2 (03:53):
well, I I think there's something that a lot of
people don't discuss about themartial art industry I I grew up
in a teplondo school.
My father was a grandmaster inteplondo.
We came typical story we cameas immigrants that didn't have a
lot of money.
Our first martial arts schoolwas in the inner city and not in
the best neighborhood, and thenlater on my father was able to
(04:15):
save some money and then openedanother location in the suburbs
and then that school just tookoff and everybody looks for
business practices.
I have a lot of experience as aperson that grew up in a
martial arts school and also wasa student, a part-time
instructor.
I went off to college, I wasaway from it for a little bit
and then I came back full boardto do this and build our schools
(04:38):
.
And there's one thing that Ithink a lot of people are
looking for is like what's themagic sauce?
What is like what's thebusiness principles that you
guys adhere to as you arerunning your martial arts school
?
And I think there's one reallyimportant component and this is
only from my perspective, so youdon't have to agree with me.
(04:59):
I'm just telling you what we'redoing is a culture of a martial
arts school.
What exactly is the culture ofa martial arts school?
What exactly is the culture ofa martial arts school?
And for us, we're a traditionalbased martial arts program, so
you won't see us wearing, youknow, shorts and a t-shirt in
class.
You have us wearing traditionalmartial arts uniforms.
(05:20):
We bow onto the mat, we sayKorean terminology, that's where
Taekwondo came from, andthere's just a culture that's
developed.
And then there's some likegeneral stuff.
So let me give you an exampleLike what's the friendliness of
your school?
Let's start with that.
Like when a new person comes in, how friendly is your staff and
(05:41):
the people around them?
And not only that, howwelcoming are your students of
the new student that comes in?
And that's important, that'ssuper important.
Let me just give you an example.
We had our sparring class, andby no means am I an MMA school,
but I'm just doing regularTaekwondo sparring, right, light
contact, everybody's having agood time and they're doing it.
(06:02):
I had either a parent or agrandparent I think it was a
grandparent watching classes andhe was a younger grandparent,
like late 50s, and I said, hey,you should start classes and he
was like I am completelyintimidated by this and so forth
.
But I knew from the grapevinethat this guy was like former
military, served overseas, hasbeen in some dangerous
(06:25):
situations.
And I'm sitting there like howcan you be intimidated about
coming into a taekwondo classthat's doing point?
Sparring and I use that as anexample is that everybody has a
little bit of a preconceivedidea of what a martial arts
school is like and they'refearful of like getting hurt,
being embarrassed.
Making sure that they want tobe good at it, and if they're
(06:48):
around other family members,they want to make sure that
they're not being judged.
These are all very, veryimportant things.
And just making sure everybodysays hello and one of the things
I do is that I feel like if youwalk onto my taekwondo school,
you are in a little piece ofKorea.
So I have all our staff bow toall the parents and all to the
(07:10):
kids, like I'm not going tostand there with my black belt
and waiting for me.
I'm the black belt, so you bowto me, I'm the one that bows
first and I have a making sureeverybody feels welcome.
Hello Pilsung, how you doing.
Good to see you.
Welcome to our academy.
Everybody's smiling and welcome.
Good to see you.
All right, glad you made it toclass.
Just everybody has that reallypositive vibe and sometimes we
(07:35):
kind of get away from that andjust making sure that we, you
know, we have that friendlinessfeeling.
Let me tell you something thathas stuck with me my whole life.
I'm in my 20s.
I am like I want to buy a nicecar, something to dream and
aspire by.
And I'll tell you, I walk intothe Mercedes dealership and just
(07:56):
I wasn't going to buy anythingbut I just wanted to take a look
at it and just see it and I wastreated so poorly that I would
never get a Mercedes ever.
It just stuck with me.
When we were able to afford adecent car, our first purchase
was a Lexus.
It just stuck with me.
I just can't stand to makematters worse.
(08:17):
We got a Lexus and then mymother-in-law needed a Lexus.
She ended up buying one.
I've given this guy like 12cars People from our church oh,
you got a Lexus and ended upbuying one.
I've given this guy like 12cars people from our church, oh
yeah, you got a Lexus, and who'syour guy there?
And I gave him the referral.
I sold them so many cars justbecause I got a bad feeling from
the Mercedes dealership righthere here in my town, and so I
(08:38):
want to say to you just makesure your school is just overly
friendly and the people that youare there are overly friendly,
and so that's the culture that Ireally want everybody to
understand.
That's the first thing.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Well, master Chan, you have to put yourself.
Sometimes we forget at schoolbecause we've been doing this
day in, day out for years, along time.
But we forget to put ourselvesinto their shoes.
When they walk in first time Idon't know, first week, or
they're visiting a friendthere's all this shouting,
kiapping going on, there'sinstructors and masters just
(09:15):
belting out instructions andlessons and motivating, and the
environment is very loud andperceived as hostile.
So, from their point of view,they walk in, they're coming in
from an outside street, theycome in and all this noise is
going on that they're notaccustomed to.
They're not accustomed topeople shouting, even though
(09:35):
it's within that martial artsculture.
So, to your point, it is veryintimidating.
They don't want to just go upand be like oh hey, my name is
John Doe, I like to get some.
It's very intimidating.
They don't want to just go upand be like oh hey, my name is
John Doe, I like to get some.
It's very intimidating.
And if they, if your staff oryou or your students, don't
approach them first, it's highlyunlikely that they're going to
be the first to come up to theto somebody and be like oh hey,
(09:57):
nice to meet you.
So that's a very correct pointright there, master Chan.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
Thank you, and I think it's.
Sometimes we're comfortablewith our environment, but we
just don't know what outsidersthink, and then that's a really
great point.
The other thing that I do,which is very important, is that
I introduce the new student tothe whole school, the whole
(10:23):
school.
So right before we startclasses, I go hey, this is Joey.
Hi, joey, welcome to our school.
How are you?
You're six, okay, joey and Joeyand I do a little icebreaker.
Joey, what is your favoritefruit?
What is your favorite cereal?
What is your favorite show thatyou watch on YouTube?
Right, we'll say what's yourfavorite food?
(10:43):
Oh, pizza.
Oh, who likes pizza here?
Oh, great, okay, well, he's newhere today.
Kids, make sure you help Joeyout in class today and introduce
yourself.
So all throughout class, I justsee who my leaders are and
other kids will go hi, my nameis Fred Nice to meet you, and I
just want a super welcomingenvironment and everybody is
like talking to the new studentand so forth, and and everybody
(11:06):
is really really kind of keen onwhat's going on.
The other thing I do, too is,as they're doing warmups and
stretching, I'll introducemyself to the new parent,
obviously, but then I'll haveother parents.
I'll have the other parents Igo.
Oh, this is Mrs Jones, she'sbeen here for six months.
Ma'am, do you mind just tellingthem a little bit about our
school and so forth?
(11:26):
They introduce them to ourenvironment.
So the parents also feel alittle bit welcome in what's
going on.
And I think that's justcritical because there's a lot
of people that they'restandoffish and so forth.
My daughter plays lacrosse.
She's a junior and there's abunch of freshman parents that,
and the first game was just Iwas just sitting there recording
(11:46):
my daughter play and this andthat, and there was no like
cheering or chattering and soforth.
So what I decided?
I was like, okay, I'm going tosay hi to all the new freshmen
parents and hey, my name is mydaughter's number nine, and then
just get to know everybody.
And then now I have a referencepoint on who I can cheer for,
and now all the parents arecheering for each of the kids.
I became a little bit of theculture keeper for the lacrosse
(12:08):
team and I think that'simportant also, for your dojang
is just making sure it's areally friendly, nice, welcoming
culture and so forth.
You may also have to like youhave to monitor your culture
Like I don't know.
Like Wisconsin's not apro-friendly CBD weed culture,
(12:31):
Every now and then you meet aparent that just reeks of weed.
They'll just come in and I'mlike what is going on?
They toked up in the car and Ijust I wouldn't.
I don't accept that.
I'm like, hey, we have a lot ofchildren here and I believe
that's not appropriate for youto do and I want them to feel a
(12:51):
little uncomfortable and I wantthem to understand they
shouldn't they shouldn't bedoing that.
We had an uncomfortablesituation too, where a parent
reeked of alcohol and I, thestaff member, clearly said hey,
do you have someone else drivingtoday, you know?
And the parent kind of liketook notice that that we could
smell the alcohol on them andsomeone else came and drove them
home.
(13:11):
So I think it's an importantpiece that you are kind of the
culture keeper of your schooland so forth.
The also very important part tome is that I want a culture of
help, and what I mean by that isthat if you're a lower or
higher rank in my school, everynow and then I give them like
(13:32):
little mini bites of leadership.
So if it's like an orange beltor a third belt in your school
purple or whatever belt it isand there's a white belt and the
white belt needs help andthey're partnered up.
I will clearly say, hey, you'rethe higher rank, I need you to
do me a favor and hold thetarget and then just help this
person with the punch, okay, orwhatever thing that we're doing.
(13:55):
That's incredibly importantthat you're also kind of
fostering that type of idea.
And what I do then is like whenwe're putting away targets or
whatever I'll have, okay, myhigher rank students, please
pick up all the targets or theobstacle course and please put
them away for everybody andthey'll all help out and clean
out and so forth, or time to getthe paddle targets, and we're
(14:17):
going to start kicking, okay,and I will say, well, listen, I
don't like the fact that thehigher belts just ran and got
your belts and your targets andyou ran.
You guys should just stay thereand start handing out the
targets for the lower ranksbefore you guys ran out.
So, just, they understand thattype of culture of help and that
as they move up in rank, theyare the ones that are kind of
(14:39):
leading that.
And then I'll tell you you'realso doing a semiview process,
like you're looking at, like,which kid is instructor material
and you're also seeing whichchild is going to be not great
instructor material.
Maybe they they assertthemselves like a boss or
they're too bossy and you'relike, oh okay, this is a kid I'm
(15:01):
going to have to put withadults or something Just like
looking at these little socialinteractions is part of your job
.
So, remember, this is probablya different topic, but I just
want to make sure every companyhas a human resource department.
We do not.
We are a human resourcedepartment, so you've got to
always be looking for talent andhaving them help the lower
(15:24):
ranks and doing it is also agreat thing as well.
So that's just kind of myadvice in terms of the culture.
The other thing I pointed out isthat I want every parent to
feel like they are in a place of, like, martial art reverence or
martial art respect.
For example, I grew up Catholicand Christian and when you go
(15:47):
to church there's a little bitof reverence.
You're like, okay, I got tohave good thoughts and good
ideas.
I've been to synagogues, I'vebeen to temples and so forth,
and even though it's not myreligion, I'm quiet, I don't
talk in a loud voice.
You can just feel the religionand the culture of that I'm.
You can just feel the religionand the culture of that.
(16:09):
So you just want to make sureyou're respectful of that.
And so one of the things I do isthat, like there's an area of
my school that when you walkpast our front desk there's
absolutely no shoes.
So I make all the parents takeoff their shoes.
That's just my culture.
So the parents take off theirshoes, they take off their shoes
with their kids and so forth.
And I'll tell you the reasonfor that is that if I want
(16:31):
parents to eventually help outor join my class, I have to kind
of lower that barrier for themto want to like get onto the mat
.
So if their shoes are alreadyoff, I'll be like, sir, can you
come in, hold the target for me,for your child?
We just need to get extra repsin.
Their shoes are already off.
A cultural thing that we do Ithink is really important, is
that we have the kids bow totheir parents.
(16:53):
So at the end of every one ofmy classes I'll go try it face
the flags, bow to the flagsbefore I dismiss.
You.
Bow to the instructors.
Say goodbye to your instructors.
They bow to the instructors.
And the most important bow ofthe day everybody, turn around,
face your mom and dad.
Mom and dads, if you couldplease stand.
In Korea, kids bow to theirparents as a sign of love and
(17:16):
respect.
All right, kids, this is themost important bow of the day
Attention and kyeong-hye bow.
And then they bow deeply totheir parents.
Okay, now give your parents abig hug.
That is how I end my classesand I want the parents to feel
appreciated.
I want the parents to feelrespected.
And then I want the parents tobow.
Like, I don't tell my parentsto bow, but guess what, if I'm
(17:37):
constantly bowing to them, theirparents are bowing to them.
Eventually, I see them and theycome in and they bow too.
It just they becameindoctrinated into our culture
and and I think that's importantLike and this is not just a
Taekwondo thing, let me be clear, I don't want this to say oh,
this is, this is such a Koreanthing.
All right, it's not just aKorean thing.
(17:59):
There was a show when I was akid and that show was called
leave it to beaver and it waslike a black and white show that
I watched in the 70s and 80s.
And then you watch the show andone of the kids would come over
and be like hey, how you doing,mrs Cleaver, nice to meet you,
ma'am.
Or hey, ma'am, how are you?
And there was like a certainlevel of respect in the 60s and
70s of how kids talk to adultsand so forth.
(18:20):
That was the culture, becausethere was a clear, delineated
line between seniors and juniorsand moms.
And now moms and dads are likecall me Jenny, call me Greg.
Kids, it's not Mr Jones or MrsSmith or anything like that.
There's a very, very easygoingway of kids getting confused on
(18:46):
who's the leader or where thehierarchy is.
A little bit.
I think, jimmy, you and I aregrowing up.
We would never call any of ourdad's friends by their first
names.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
Well, that goes to your point of culture, and not
just Korean culture, but Asian,japanese, korean, other Asian
cultures.
We don't shake hands as a formof greeting, we bow as a form of
greeting.
We bow as a form of greeting.
So the level of respect isalready included into all that.
Also, the way that we talk toelders, our language is
(19:19):
equivalent to, like in English,saying sir, at the end of
everything, be like oh, hellosir.
In USs we don't say hello sirto, we just say hello, and
that's just a familiar tone andfamiliar that everybody just
accepts.
But in in korea and japan andother asian cultures, that that
we don't accept, that we don't.
(19:39):
You can't just say hello to a,a elder.
You got to say hello sir, right, and you got to bow instead of
shaking hands.
You're bound.
So that's just the, the cultureof that.
And on the flip side in us,like they don't.
Parents don't want to feel old.
That's their culture.
They don't want to beassociated as their, as their
mom or their dad.
(20:00):
They don't want to be hearinglike oh, mr joan, the mr joan's
my dad, I don't want to beconsidered old, call me tom and.
And they want to feel relevant,don't want to be considered old
Call me Tom and they want tofeel relevant and they want to
feel younger and that's theculture of the U S U S culture.
So it's not right or wrong, itis like to your point, it's the
culture.
But what's refreshing is they'regetting sometimes that that
(20:23):
that tone of familiar instead ofof respect, that gets blurred
by these younger, their kids,their younger kids, and that's
where they come to and learnmartial arts, because their kids
are learning the respect ofculture which they don't enforce
in their homes.
So they come in and they'relike it's refreshing to see all
(20:43):
the students bow, showingrespect, the way they talk yes,
ma'am, no sir, yes, sir and theywant their child to be
influenced by that.
So when they come and learn,yes, kicking and punching and
physical aspects, but also thecultural respect, that's when
they're like oh wow, this isgreat.
You know what I want to becalled Mr Jones instead of
Thomas, and the reason for thatis because there should be a
(21:05):
level of respect that I want mykids to learn.
So that is that culture you'retalking about.
Absolutely, master John.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Yeah, and, like I said, it's one of these things
where, if you don't, I thinkkids get confused.
So you're really teaching andthis works for me.
I did Brazilian Jiu Jitsu andthere's a lot of informality in
Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and it worksfor them in that culture.
So I'm not saying this is theonly way, but it works for us
(21:32):
and I think in our traditionalenvironment parents appreciate
it.
That's like I don't know.
Think about this you go to aJapanese restaurant and no one
is wearing a kimono, they'rewearing t-shirts, right.
And then they come in, they'relike're like, hey, what type of
sushi roll you want?
And you'll eat it and it's goodsushi and so forth.
That that's one way of lookingat.
But like you go to anothersushi restaurant and they've got
(21:55):
the kimonos and they've got the, and they, they come in, they
say hi in japanese and you go ohman, this place is authentic.
Like you can feel theauthenticity right and and
they're not even Japanese right.
Speaker 1 (22:08):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
You know, yeah, yeah, and there are a bunch of
non-Japanese back there and anIndian guy and a Japanese guy
and a, you know, and a Koreanguy back there.
Sounds like a bad joke, butanyway.
So that's the type of feeling Iwant my my students to feel and
my customers to feel, and theculture that I'm trying to build
(22:29):
in my classroom and so forth.
And then here's anotherimportant culture, and I have
black belts that have been withus 10, 20, 30 years, that have
been with us for a very, verylong time.
I was just reminded, next year,jimmy, our organization has
(22:52):
been around 50 years.
Isn't that crazy?
Speaker 1 (22:57):
What?
50 years?
No way.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
That's crazy, and so we're going to do a big
celebration, and there are somepeople still a part of our
school from back then oddlyenough.
And I think my father createdthis, so I'm not going to take
credit for it think I helpeddevelop that, that it amplified.
The culture that he created wasthat if you're a black belt,
(23:23):
you have the duty to also giveback to the lower belts.
Just like a lower belt, a blackbelt helped you.
And so it's just a mentalitythat I have, where if you are a
black belt, please choose oneclass a week just to come in to
help out.
Don't just come in to train foryourself.
Find a training partner, findsomeone that you can inspire.
(23:45):
And so, if you're a smallerschool and remember, our family
came here in 1975 and 76.
My father didn't have a lot ofstudents but he did have a lot
of help and it was that cultureof of you help the lower belts
and you help them and developthem and so forth.
And my father quickly found outwho, who his good instructors
(24:06):
were and so forth.
So you have that.
You have that as a part of yourculture is that you get a
certain rank, have them comeback to one class that is below
them.
So that is a culture of help.
Once again, I'm not saying thisis right or wrong, but in the
culture of our school.
We really don't do privatelessons.
(24:28):
I know some people in myfriends group they charge a
pretty penny for private lessonsand they make a good income
doing that, and I'm not sayingit's wrong, it's just not our
culture.
If someone needs extra help, Iwill give set aside 20 minutes
right after class to help themout, or I'll have one of my
senior black belts do it, or myinstructors, if they have time,
they will come and do that.
(24:48):
I have blocked out times and Ishout out to Master Mertens this
is a Master Mertens idea andyou know we have booster classes
where we have a class.
We need a got to be a reason.
(25:24):
They're at your school and youneed to know what that is and
that's important Is it?
Is it because they they need toget in better shape, but they
need to be more disciplined,they need to be more focused?
You constantly have to remindthem that they did a good job of
that, and so if you're justgoing in there and just teaching
a class and everybody's smilingand you're like, okay, bye, get
(25:44):
out of here, just making surethat you guys really, really
hone that and that and that's aculture that I think is very
important because that thatthat's going to help your
retention.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
Well, I know a couple of years, a couple of years
back, there was a a friend ofmine who was operating school
and he wasn't doing very well.
He had less than 100 students,I want to say less than 60.
They were.
He had no discipline in theclass, meaning at the end of the
class the kids just leave.
Before the master leaves,before the instructor leaves.
(26:15):
There was no discipline shown.
And then he visited your school, he visited my school, he
visited my school, he visitedother schools and then he saw at
the beginning of the class howdisciplined the students were.
At the end of the class thestudents couldn't leave After
bowing to our nation's flag andthen the master instructor.
They couldn't leave until themaster instructor left or the
(26:39):
head instructor left, and thenthe students were able to walk
in a discipline line afterwards.
And this is really impressive toparents at the end of the class
coming in to pick up their kids.
It's not impressive.
When oh class is over, see youguys and all the kids are like
running around, like lost ants.
They like.
That's why they brought thekids there is to learn
(27:01):
discipline.
So they like that formality ofokay.
They understand that the masterhas to leave first, the kids
are leaving in a disciplineorderly line, and that is a more
impressive thing than what hewas doing at the time.
It was just like at the end ofthe class all right, see you
guys, see you guys next class.
And that was it.
So after he saw what we weredoing, he changed that.
(27:23):
He turned us that with manyother things he changed that
school around.
He got up to like over 200 kids.
It was a discipline class, itwas a discipline school.
He understood that mentalityand that's the culture that he
instilled into that and thatculture, along with other things
that he implemented, helpedturn that school around.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
So here's a kind of a me it's.
It sounds like a really smallthing, but it makes a big
difference.
Here In my neighborhood therewas this like fledgling bar and
I know this bar because I waslooking to buy that building.
So I was kind of like waitingfor this bar to like go out of
business so I can possibly movemy school into the building and
buy it.
And it's always been under likeweird ownership and so forth.
(28:10):
It's in a hot, hot spot and oneof the patrons of the bar was a
huge fan of the show Bar Rescue.
Do you remember that show?
Speaker 1 (28:18):
Bar Rescue.
I do remember.
I haven't seen it, but I knowof it.
Yes, right, so this guy like Iforgot the guy.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
There's a guy that comes in, he looks into a
restaurant or a bar and then hegoes and fixes it or whatever.
And apparently he said everybar needs a hook or something,
right.
So their hook became free bacon.
So like you order a drink in,like popcorn or peanuts or
whatever is at a bar, they givefree bacon.
(28:46):
So there's fried bacon forpeople just munch on as they're
like drinking their drinks andso forth Right, really unique
concept.
And then they changed the signto a pig grabbing a beer and all
that stuff.
That little shift made a hugedifference in that bar.
They didn't go out of business.
So I'm like kind of pissed andI was like, oh my God, but the
place got famous.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
Not only did they not go out of business, you start
going to that bar.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
That's right, Because it was free bacon, I mean.
So what I'm trying to say isthat it's advice about culture.
You're like, oh, okay, I get it, Whatever you could change one
thing.
And all of a sudden, all theparents are watching it and
they're like, Ooh, I like this,Okay.
And and remember my previoustalks, it's that if you run a
(29:32):
traditional martial arts school,your, your student base or your
your target customer is usuallya mom right Between the ages of
what?
35 and 45, 30 to 45, somewherein that age range, and what
would they like to see theirkids do?
And at six years old.
So it's a really powerful thing, that little lineup how they
line up, how straight they stand.
(29:53):
Before you start classes, webow to the flags.
We still do a one-minutemeditation.
It sends chills up my spine.
I see the kids sit there still.
Just all these little thingsadds up.
And having the culture I haveparents come out onto my mat and
help they hold targets atcertain parts of our drills.
(30:15):
I go, hey, I need parentalvolunteers to come out to help
hold the targets for this nextdrill.
We have a tournament coming upand I partnered them up with
their kids and that's slowlybreaking that barrier down for
them to want to absolutely takeclass someday in the future.
Speaker 1 (30:30):
So you have let me get this straight you have
parents who are sitting down intheir regular clothes and you
ask them to come into the classand participate by holding
targets or whatnot.
Yes, that's, that's brilliant,because then then they'll be
like, oh hey, they'll getfamiliar with being on the mat.
They could see themselvesimagine themselves practicing
(30:53):
doing these kicks correct andthen correct, join the Be.
Like they could visualizejoining the family class with
their kids.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
A hundred percent.
A hundred percent.
That's why I do hey, I needextra parent help today.
Do you guys mind coming out onthe floor and holding for your
child?
Yeah, I always use this analogyright, and it's.
It's this I'm a girl dad, soI've got daughters and they're
older now.
And it's this I'm a girl dad,so I've got daughters and
they're older now.
But if my daughter did ballet,like if I said to you, Mr Hong,
(31:28):
and I said, Jimmy, I need you towear these pink tights and a
tutu, you'd be like get out ofhere, I'm not going to wear that
, right.
But if I was a dance instructor, I'm like, hey, Mr Hong, I
really need your help.
Your daughter needs a dancepartner and we need to get her
ready for a recital.
Can you help me out?
You're like absolutely, what doyou need me to do?
I need you to wear these tightsand a tutu, All right, and be
(31:49):
on the oh yeah, sure, that'swhat you're saying when you're
asking a parent to like wear auniform.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
You know, think of-.
Well, I wear that without beingasked anyway, so that's not an
issue.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
I know, so please don't stand up.
We'll probably see it right now.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
I'm wearing it right now, Master Cha.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
We've got cameras now , so be careful, be careful, be
careful what you wish for thecameras are a waste of.
That's right.
That's right.
We can only use ourimaginations right now.
So, anyway, my point being isthat, you know, these are just
little cultural things that Ithink are super important in
your academy, that you have aculture of respect, culture of
(32:29):
friendliness, culture of peoplewanting to help out, and that's
really important.
The last thing I want to leaveyou with is this I had a
fundraiser last night and one ofthe things that my father's
black belts did is we wereoriginally in central city
Milwaukee and that's where ourprogram started.
(32:50):
So when we moved out to theburbs, there was kind of a hole
of not having a school in thecentral part of Milwaukee and
underserved areas.
So we started in a nonprofit.
It's been going like 10, 10plus years strong and we're
teaching in schools, communitycenters.
My Black Belt's volunteered tothat and they help out.
And last night we had ourannual gala and we had over 120
(33:15):
people there and at that gala weraised over $50,000.
And our students donated thatand everybody pitched in and
helped out to help thisnonprofit teach Taekwondo.
And so what I'm saying is thisculture of help went to another
level.
Right that, hey, ourcontribution to the city of
Milwaukee is that we really feellike we brought martial arts to
(33:38):
our city to make our citystronger.
And because we're making ourcity stronger, right, we want to
make sure we help our kidsbecome stronger.
They become better citizens.
So what better way to do thatthan teach in the underserved
areas of Milwaukee?
So you know, it was awesome.
In fact, I'm going to post thatthey just did a new story on us
and so forth.
(33:59):
But that is the culture thatworks for us and that, to me, is
an important part of the reasonour school has done well in
this area is because it's notjust about having a commercial
school, it's also about givingback.
Okay, now let me say this firsttoo You've got to get to a
level where your school issustainable, that you have to be
successful yourself.
(34:20):
Like the airplane's about tocrash and the oxygen masks come
out, they go wear that maskfirst before you help your
children.
So you've got to make sure youhave a successful school before
you guys can do that, thoseother parts and other things,
and you can give back in spadesto your community and so forth.
And so I'm not telling you togo out and do a nonprofit, not
just yet, just make communityand so forth, and so I'm not
(34:41):
telling you to go out and do anonprofit, not just yet.
Just make sure you guys have asustainable model that you're
very successful at.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
That you can you can do that, so I think that's a
very important point in terms ofdeveloping the culture of your
school.
I would love to do a wholeepisode on on the process and
what you do for your yourfundraiser.
I know we could talk tons aboutit, from setup to how to make
it successful in the event, sothat's definitely in the
pipeline.
Speaker 2 (35:07):
We would love to do that, master chan yeah, I will
have our executive director whoruns it, who is a very smart
woman, has a law degree.
I I'm also very blessed to besurrounded by brilliant people,
very smart people that help usjust create some amazing
programming for our industry.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
So Awesome, master Chan.
So the answer is culture.
Culture is that one powerfulingredient your martial arts
schools can't afford to ignore?
Let's conclude here.
If you are enjoying our show,please go ahead and rate and
review our podcast or YouTubechannel.
(35:45):
Starting today, our YouTubechannel will be visual along
with the audio only that waspreviously passed.
Whether you like it or not, ourgoal is to make our show as
successful as possible, to reachout to all the school owners,
and your review will definitelyhelp achieve that.
Have a great week listeners.
(36:06):
Fellow Marshall School owners,master Chan and I look forward
to our next episode.
In today's episode, we will discuss the one powerful
ingredient your martial artsschools can't afford to ignore.
Welcome to Black Belt Banterthe best podcast to help your
martial arts school increase inprofits and generate substantial
revenue.
I'm Jimmy Hong and my co-hostis Master Chan Lee.
(00:23):
Master Chan has over 2,100active students with multiple
locations.
He is well-renowned and highlyrespected by his fellow peers
for his business acumen inoperating martial arts schools.
Master Chan Lee, welcome to thepodcast.
Before we start, though, beforewe start start, I know you're
(00:43):
excited about this subject.
We're talking about it on ourpre-production meeting.
Your your heart is really inthis topic and and I know you
can't wait to share, but I wantto I want to say have you been
getting a lot of feedback fromthe fellow community about the
launch of our podcast?
Because I've been gettingemails, messages.
(01:05):
I've been getting so manypositive support about how much
they're just enjoying our show.
What about you, Master Chan?
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Yeah, the feedback's been incredible and the reason
you can see our faces is thatit's been by the feedback of
everybody that came back andsaid it'd be nice to see who we
are.
But I'm gonna assume ourviewership and listenership will
decline, drop huge after youknow they they're seeing our
live faces, so 100.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
This is a one-off, we're gonna do this, and then
everybody's gonna say can we goback to just a podcast and no
video?
Speaker 2 (01:37):
only sir right, we have faces for radio, as they
say I get that all the time,yeah so but yeah, the response
has been absolutely great, thankyou.
You and I are sons ofgrandmasters in Taekwondo.
We love the martial arts and wewant to make sure we are doing
whatever we can to help schoolowners across the country,
(01:59):
because the fact still remainsless than 3% of the US
population does martial arts,and it just boggles my mind, and
we really got to do a betterjob of being able to educate
school owners on teaching whatthey're doing and helping people
be their best in the martialarts, and so forth.
So that's really the genesis ofwhat this podcast is about this
(02:30):
podcast is about.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
So what I mean and they've been just so the the,
the support and the complimentsthat we receive.
It just reaffirms of why we'redoing this, because you and I
talked about okay, what is ourend game here.
What is our goal of launching apodcast is exactly this is to
connect in a consistent way withour listeners, with the fellow
Marshall School owners withinthe industry that we are already
(02:52):
on, but this is a greatrelevant way for us to stay
connected, build a rapport andjust build an audience with our
supportive listeners.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
Absolutely, absolutely.
And we've met and I know I'vemet a lot of school owners and
fellow martial art teachersthrough the tournaments, also
met a lot of you through othermartial art events throughout
the country and so forth andafter we do these events we're
not really connected or notseeing, hearing what exactly is
going on in our industry, and Ithought this would be a good way
(03:24):
.
And then I still have the fewphone calls I make to the people
that I really respect and getfeedback from, but even then you
feel like you're not getting itthe whole story because
everybody's busy and so forth.
So I thought this would be agood way for us to connect with
our audience and let everybodyknow what's going on and so
forth.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Absolutely.
And speaking of that, let's get, just let's dive into this next
topic that you're passionateabout.
What is this topic, what isthis thing that you're just so
passionate about, master chan?
Speaker 2 (03:53):
well, I I think there's something that a lot of
people don't discuss about themartial art industry I I grew up
in a teplondo school.
My father was a grandmaster inteplondo.
We came typical story we cameas immigrants that didn't have a
lot of money.
Our first martial arts schoolwas in the inner city and not in
the best neighborhood, and thenlater on my father was able to
(04:15):
save some money and then openedanother location in the suburbs
and then that school just tookoff and everybody looks for
business practices.
I have a lot of experience as aperson that grew up in a
martial arts school and also wasa student, a part-time
instructor.
I went off to college, I wasaway from it for a little bit
and then I came back full boardto do this and build our schools
(04:38):
.
And there's one thing that Ithink a lot of people are
looking for is like what's themagic sauce?
What is like what's thebusiness principles that you
guys adhere to as you arerunning your martial arts school
?
And I think there's one reallyimportant component and this is
only from my perspective, so youdon't have to agree with me.
(04:59):
I'm just telling you what we'redoing is a culture of a martial
arts school.
What exactly is the culture ofa martial arts school?
What exactly is the culture ofa martial arts school?
And for us, we're a traditionalbased martial arts program, so
you won't see us wearing, youknow, shorts and a t-shirt in
class.
You have us wearing traditionalmartial arts uniforms.
(05:20):
We bow onto the mat, we sayKorean terminology, that's where
Taekwondo came from, andthere's just a culture that's
developed.
And then there's some likegeneral stuff.
So let me give you an exampleLike what's the friendliness of
your school?
Let's start with that.
Like when a new person comes in, how friendly is your staff and
(05:41):
the people around them?
And not only that, howwelcoming are your students of
the new student that comes in?
And that's important, that'ssuper important.
Let me just give you an example.
We had our sparring class, andby no means am I an MMA school,
but I'm just doing regularTaekwondo sparring, right, light
contact, everybody's having agood time and they're doing it.
(06:02):
I had either a parent or agrandparent I think it was a
grandparent watching classes andhe was a younger grandparent,
like late 50s, and I said, hey,you should start classes and he
was like I am completelyintimidated by this and so forth
.
But I knew from the grapevinethat this guy was like former
military, served overseas, hasbeen in some dangerous
(06:25):
situations.
And I'm sitting there like howcan you be intimidated about
coming into a taekwondo classthat's doing point?
Sparring and I use that as anexample is that everybody has a
little bit of a preconceivedidea of what a martial arts
school is like and they'refearful of like getting hurt,
being embarrassed.
Making sure that they want tobe good at it, and if they're
(06:48):
around other family members,they want to make sure that
they're not being judged.
These are all very, veryimportant things.
And just making sure everybodysays hello and one of the things
I do is that I feel like if youwalk onto my taekwondo school,
you are in a little piece ofKorea.
So I have all our staff bow toall the parents and all to the
(07:10):
kids, like I'm not going tostand there with my black belt
and waiting for me.
I'm the black belt, so you bowto me, I'm the one that bows
first and I have a making sureeverybody feels welcome.
Hello Pilsung, how you doing.
Good to see you.
Welcome to our academy.
Everybody's smiling and welcome.
Good to see you.
All right, glad you made it toclass.
Just everybody has that reallypositive vibe and sometimes we
(07:35):
kind of get away from that andjust making sure that we, you
know, we have that friendlinessfeeling.
Let me tell you something thathas stuck with me my whole life.
I'm in my 20s.
I am like I want to buy a nicecar, something to dream and
aspire by.
And I'll tell you, I walk intothe Mercedes dealership and just
(07:56):
I wasn't going to buy anythingbut I just wanted to take a look
at it and just see it and I wastreated so poorly that I would
never get a Mercedes ever.
It just stuck with me.
When we were able to afford adecent car, our first purchase
was a Lexus.
It just stuck with me.
I just can't stand to makematters worse.
(08:17):
We got a Lexus and then mymother-in-law needed a Lexus.
She ended up buying one.
I've given this guy like 12cars People from our church oh,
you got a Lexus and ended upbuying one.
I've given this guy like 12cars people from our church, oh
yeah, you got a Lexus, and who'syour guy there?
And I gave him the referral.
I sold them so many cars justbecause I got a bad feeling from
the Mercedes dealership righthere here in my town, and so I
(08:38):
want to say to you just makesure your school is just overly
friendly and the people that youare there are overly friendly,
and so that's the culture that Ireally want everybody to
understand.
That's the first thing.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Well, master Chan, you have to put yourself.
Sometimes we forget at schoolbecause we've been doing this
day in, day out for years, along time.
But we forget to put ourselvesinto their shoes.
When they walk in first time Idon't know, first week, or
they're visiting a friendthere's all this shouting,
kiapping going on, there'sinstructors and masters just
(09:15):
belting out instructions andlessons and motivating, and the
environment is very loud andperceived as hostile.
So, from their point of view,they walk in, they're coming in
from an outside street, theycome in and all this noise is
going on that they're notaccustomed to.
They're not accustomed topeople shouting, even though
(09:35):
it's within that martial artsculture.
So, to your point, it is veryintimidating.
They don't want to just go upand be like oh hey, my name is
John Doe, I like to get some.
It's very intimidating.
They don't want to just go upand be like oh hey, my name is
John Doe, I like to get some.
It's very intimidating.
And if they, if your staff oryou or your students, don't
approach them first, it's highlyunlikely that they're going to
be the first to come up to theto somebody and be like oh hey,
(09:57):
nice to meet you.
So that's a very correct pointright there, master Chan.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
Thank you, and I think it's.
Sometimes we're comfortablewith our environment, but we
just don't know what outsidersthink, and then that's a really
great point.
The other thing that I do,which is very important, is that
I introduce the new student tothe whole school, the whole
(10:23):
school.
So right before we startclasses, I go hey, this is Joey.
Hi, joey, welcome to our school.
How are you?
You're six, okay, joey and Joeyand I do a little icebreaker.
Joey, what is your favoritefruit?
What is your favorite cereal?
What is your favorite show thatyou watch on YouTube?
Right, we'll say what's yourfavorite food?
(10:43):
Oh, pizza.
Oh, who likes pizza here?
Oh, great, okay, well, he's newhere today.
Kids, make sure you help Joeyout in class today and introduce
yourself.
So all throughout class, I justsee who my leaders are and
other kids will go hi, my nameis Fred Nice to meet you, and I
just want a super welcomingenvironment and everybody is
like talking to the new studentand so forth, and and everybody
(11:06):
is really really kind of keen onwhat's going on.
The other thing I do, too is,as they're doing warmups and
stretching, I'll introducemyself to the new parent,
obviously, but then I'll haveother parents.
I'll have the other parents Igo.
Oh, this is Mrs Jones, she'sbeen here for six months.
Ma'am, do you mind just tellingthem a little bit about our
school and so forth?
(11:26):
They introduce them to ourenvironment.
So the parents also feel alittle bit welcome in what's
going on.
And I think that's justcritical because there's a lot
of people that they'restandoffish and so forth.
My daughter plays lacrosse.
She's a junior and there's abunch of freshman parents that,
and the first game was just Iwas just sitting there recording
(11:46):
my daughter play and this andthat, and there was no like
cheering or chattering and soforth.
So what I decided?
I was like, okay, I'm going tosay hi to all the new freshmen
parents and hey, my name is mydaughter's number nine, and then
just get to know everybody.
And then now I have a referencepoint on who I can cheer for,
and now all the parents arecheering for each of the kids.
I became a little bit of theculture keeper for the lacrosse
(12:08):
team and I think that'simportant also, for your dojang
is just making sure it's areally friendly, nice, welcoming
culture and so forth.
You may also have to like youhave to monitor your culture
Like I don't know.
Like Wisconsin's not apro-friendly CBD weed culture,
(12:31):
Every now and then you meet aparent that just reeks of weed.
They'll just come in and I'mlike what is going on?
They toked up in the car and Ijust I wouldn't.
I don't accept that.
I'm like, hey, we have a lot ofchildren here and I believe
that's not appropriate for youto do and I want them to feel a
(12:51):
little uncomfortable and I wantthem to understand they
shouldn't they shouldn't bedoing that.
We had an uncomfortablesituation too, where a parent
reeked of alcohol and I, thestaff member, clearly said hey,
do you have someone else drivingtoday, you know?
And the parent kind of liketook notice that that we could
smell the alcohol on them andsomeone else came and drove them
home.
(13:11):
So I think it's an importantpiece that you are kind of the
culture keeper of your schooland so forth.
The also very important part tome is that I want a culture of
help, and what I mean by that isthat if you're a lower or
higher rank in my school, everynow and then I give them like
(13:32):
little mini bites of leadership.
So if it's like an orange beltor a third belt in your school
purple or whatever belt it isand there's a white belt and the
white belt needs help andthey're partnered up.
I will clearly say, hey, you'rethe higher rank, I need you to
do me a favor and hold thetarget and then just help this
person with the punch, okay, orwhatever thing that we're doing.
(13:55):
That's incredibly importantthat you're also kind of
fostering that type of idea.
And what I do then is like whenwe're putting away targets or
whatever I'll have, okay, myhigher rank students, please
pick up all the targets or theobstacle course and please put
them away for everybody andthey'll all help out and clean
out and so forth, or time to getthe paddle targets, and we're
(14:17):
going to start kicking, okay,and I will say, well, listen, I
don't like the fact that thehigher belts just ran and got
your belts and your targets andyou ran.
You guys should just stay thereand start handing out the
targets for the lower ranksbefore you guys ran out.
So, just, they understand thattype of culture of help and that
as they move up in rank, theyare the ones that are kind of
(14:39):
leading that.
And then I'll tell you you'realso doing a semiview process,
like you're looking at, like,which kid is instructor material
and you're also seeing whichchild is going to be not great
instructor material.
Maybe they they assertthemselves like a boss or
they're too bossy and you'relike, oh okay, this is a kid I'm
(15:01):
going to have to put withadults or something Just like
looking at these little socialinteractions is part of your job
.
So, remember, this is probablya different topic, but I just
want to make sure every companyhas a human resource department.
We do not.
We are a human resourcedepartment, so you've got to
always be looking for talent andhaving them help the lower
(15:24):
ranks and doing it is also agreat thing as well.
So that's just kind of myadvice in terms of the culture.
The other thing I pointed out isthat I want every parent to
feel like they are in a place of, like, martial art reverence or
martial art respect.
For example, I grew up Catholicand Christian and when you go
(15:47):
to church there's a little bitof reverence.
You're like, okay, I got tohave good thoughts and good
ideas.
I've been to synagogues, I'vebeen to temples and so forth,
and even though it's not myreligion, I'm quiet, I don't
talk in a loud voice.
You can just feel the religionand the culture of that I'm.
You can just feel the religionand the culture of that.
(16:09):
So you just want to make sureyou're respectful of that.
And so one of the things I do isthat, like there's an area of
my school that when you walkpast our front desk there's
absolutely no shoes.
So I make all the parents takeoff their shoes.
That's just my culture.
So the parents take off theirshoes, they take off their shoes
with their kids and so forth.
And I'll tell you the reasonfor that is that if I want
(16:31):
parents to eventually help outor join my class, I have to kind
of lower that barrier for themto want to like get onto the mat
.
So if their shoes are alreadyoff, I'll be like, sir, can you
come in, hold the target for me,for your child?
We just need to get extra repsin.
Their shoes are already off.
A cultural thing that we do Ithink is really important, is
that we have the kids bow totheir parents.
(16:53):
So at the end of every one ofmy classes I'll go try it face
the flags, bow to the flagsbefore I dismiss.
You.
Bow to the instructors.
Say goodbye to your instructors.
They bow to the instructors.
And the most important bow ofthe day everybody, turn around,
face your mom and dad.
Mom and dads, if you couldplease stand.
In Korea, kids bow to theirparents as a sign of love and
(17:16):
respect.
All right, kids, this is themost important bow of the day
Attention and kyeong-hye bow.
And then they bow deeply totheir parents.
Okay, now give your parents abig hug.
That is how I end my classesand I want the parents to feel
appreciated.
I want the parents to feelrespected.
And then I want the parents tobow.
Like, I don't tell my parentsto bow, but guess what, if I'm
(17:37):
constantly bowing to them, theirparents are bowing to them.
Eventually, I see them and theycome in and they bow too.
It just they becameindoctrinated into our culture
and and I think that's importantLike and this is not just a
Taekwondo thing, let me be clear, I don't want this to say oh,
this is, this is such a Koreanthing.
All right, it's not just aKorean thing.
(17:59):
There was a show when I was akid and that show was called
leave it to beaver and it waslike a black and white show that
I watched in the 70s and 80s.
And then you watch the show andone of the kids would come over
and be like hey, how you doing,mrs Cleaver, nice to meet you,
ma'am.
Or hey, ma'am, how are you?
And there was like a certainlevel of respect in the 60s and
70s of how kids talk to adultsand so forth.
(18:20):
That was the culture, becausethere was a clear, delineated
line between seniors and juniorsand moms.
And now moms and dads are likecall me Jenny, call me Greg.
Kids, it's not Mr Jones or MrsSmith or anything like that.
There's a very, very easygoingway of kids getting confused on
(18:46):
who's the leader or where thehierarchy is.
A little bit.
I think, jimmy, you and I aregrowing up.
We would never call any of ourdad's friends by their first
names.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
Well, that goes to your point of culture, and not
just Korean culture, but Asian,japanese, korean, other Asian
cultures.
We don't shake hands as a formof greeting, we bow as a form of
greeting.
We bow as a form of greeting.
So the level of respect isalready included into all that.
Also, the way that we talk toelders, our language is
(19:19):
equivalent to, like in English,saying sir, at the end of
everything, be like oh, hellosir.
In USs we don't say hello sirto, we just say hello, and
that's just a familiar tone andfamiliar that everybody just
accepts.
But in in korea and japan andother asian cultures, that that
we don't accept, that we don't.
(19:39):
You can't just say hello to a,a elder.
You got to say hello sir, right, and you got to bow instead of
shaking hands.
You're bound.
So that's just the, the cultureof that.
And on the flip side in us,like they don't.
Parents don't want to feel old.
That's their culture.
They don't want to beassociated as their, as their
mom or their dad.
(20:00):
They don't want to be hearinglike oh, mr joan, the mr joan's
my dad, I don't want to beconsidered old, call me tom and.
And they want to feel relevant,don't want to be considered old
Call me Tom and they want tofeel relevant and they want to
feel younger and that's theculture of the U S U S culture.
So it's not right or wrong, itis like to your point, it's the
culture.
But what's refreshing is they'regetting sometimes that that
(20:23):
that tone of familiar instead ofof respect, that gets blurred
by these younger, their kids,their younger kids, and that's
where they come to and learnmartial arts, because their kids
are learning the respect ofculture which they don't enforce
in their homes.
So they come in and they'relike it's refreshing to see all
(20:43):
the students bow, showingrespect, the way they talk yes,
ma'am, no sir, yes, sir and theywant their child to be
influenced by that.
So when they come and learn,yes, kicking and punching and
physical aspects, but also thecultural respect, that's when
they're like oh wow, this isgreat.
You know what I want to becalled Mr Jones instead of
Thomas, and the reason for thatis because there should be a
(21:05):
level of respect that I want mykids to learn.
So that is that culture you'retalking about.
Absolutely, master John.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Yeah, and, like I said, it's one of these things
where, if you don't, I thinkkids get confused.
So you're really teaching andthis works for me.
I did Brazilian Jiu Jitsu andthere's a lot of informality in
Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and it worksfor them in that culture.
So I'm not saying this is theonly way, but it works for us
(21:32):
and I think in our traditionalenvironment parents appreciate
it.
That's like I don't know.
Think about this you go to aJapanese restaurant and no one
is wearing a kimono, they'rewearing t-shirts, right.
And then they come in, they'relike're like, hey, what type of
sushi roll you want?
And you'll eat it and it's goodsushi and so forth.
That that's one way of lookingat.
But like you go to anothersushi restaurant and they've got
(21:55):
the kimonos and they've got the, and they, they come in, they
say hi in japanese and you go ohman, this place is authentic.
Like you can feel theauthenticity right and and
they're not even Japanese right.
Speaker 1 (22:08):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
You know, yeah, yeah, and there are a bunch of
non-Japanese back there and anIndian guy and a Japanese guy
and a, you know, and a Koreanguy back there.
Sounds like a bad joke, butanyway.
So that's the type of feeling Iwant my my students to feel and
my customers to feel, and theculture that I'm trying to build
(22:29):
in my classroom and so forth.
And then here's anotherimportant culture, and I have
black belts that have been withus 10, 20, 30 years, that have
been with us for a very, verylong time.
I was just reminded, next year,jimmy, our organization has
(22:52):
been around 50 years.
Isn't that crazy?
Speaker 1 (22:57):
What?
50 years?
No way.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
That's crazy, and so we're going to do a big
celebration, and there are somepeople still a part of our
school from back then oddlyenough.
And I think my father createdthis, so I'm not going to take
credit for it think I helpeddevelop that, that it amplified.
The culture that he created wasthat if you're a black belt,
(23:23):
you have the duty to also giveback to the lower belts.
Just like a lower belt, a blackbelt helped you.
And so it's just a mentalitythat I have, where if you are a
black belt, please choose oneclass a week just to come in to
help out.
Don't just come in to train foryourself.
Find a training partner, findsomeone that you can inspire.
(23:45):
And so, if you're a smallerschool and remember, our family
came here in 1975 and 76.
My father didn't have a lot ofstudents but he did have a lot
of help and it was that cultureof of you help the lower belts
and you help them and developthem and so forth.
And my father quickly found outwho, who his good instructors
(24:06):
were and so forth.
So you have that.
You have that as a part of yourculture is that you get a
certain rank, have them comeback to one class that is below
them.
So that is a culture of help.
Once again, I'm not saying thisis right or wrong, but in the
culture of our school.
We really don't do privatelessons.
(24:28):
I know some people in myfriends group they charge a
pretty penny for private lessonsand they make a good income
doing that, and I'm not sayingit's wrong, it's just not our
culture.
If someone needs extra help, Iwill give set aside 20 minutes
right after class to help themout, or I'll have one of my
senior black belts do it, or myinstructors, if they have time,
they will come and do that.
(24:48):
I have blocked out times and Ishout out to Master Mertens this
is a Master Mertens idea andyou know we have booster classes
where we have a class.
We need a got to be a reason.
(25:24):
They're at your school and youneed to know what that is and
that's important Is it?
Is it because they they need toget in better shape, but they
need to be more disciplined,they need to be more focused?
You constantly have to remindthem that they did a good job of
that, and so if you're justgoing in there and just teaching
a class and everybody's smilingand you're like, okay, bye, get
(25:44):
out of here, just making surethat you guys really, really
hone that and that and that's aculture that I think is very
important because that thatthat's going to help your
retention.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
Well, I know a couple of years, a couple of years
back, there was a a friend ofmine who was operating school
and he wasn't doing very well.
He had less than 100 students,I want to say less than 60.
They were.
He had no discipline in theclass, meaning at the end of the
class the kids just leave.
Before the master leaves,before the instructor leaves.
(26:15):
There was no discipline shown.
And then he visited your school, he visited my school, he
visited my school, he visitedother schools and then he saw at
the beginning of the class howdisciplined the students were.
At the end of the class thestudents couldn't leave After
bowing to our nation's flag andthen the master instructor.
They couldn't leave until themaster instructor left or the
(26:39):
head instructor left, and thenthe students were able to walk
in a discipline line afterwards.
And this is really impressive toparents at the end of the class
coming in to pick up their kids.
It's not impressive.
When oh class is over, see youguys and all the kids are like
running around, like lost ants.
They like.
That's why they brought thekids there is to learn
(27:01):
discipline.
So they like that formality ofokay.
They understand that the masterhas to leave first, the kids
are leaving in a disciplineorderly line, and that is a more
impressive thing than what hewas doing at the time.
It was just like at the end ofthe class all right, see you
guys, see you guys next class.
And that was it.
So after he saw what we weredoing, he changed that.
(27:23):
He turned us that with manyother things he changed that
school around.
He got up to like over 200 kids.
It was a discipline class, itwas a discipline school.
He understood that mentalityand that's the culture that he
instilled into that and thatculture, along with other things
that he implemented, helpedturn that school around.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
So here's a kind of a me it's.
It sounds like a really smallthing, but it makes a big
difference.
Here In my neighborhood therewas this like fledgling bar and
I know this bar because I waslooking to buy that building.
So I was kind of like waitingfor this bar to like go out of
business so I can possibly movemy school into the building and
buy it.
And it's always been under likeweird ownership and so forth.
(28:10):
It's in a hot, hot spot and oneof the patrons of the bar was a
huge fan of the show Bar Rescue.
Do you remember that show?
Speaker 1 (28:18):
Bar Rescue.
I do remember.
I haven't seen it, but I knowof it.
Yes, right, so this guy like Iforgot the guy.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
There's a guy that comes in, he looks into a
restaurant or a bar and then hegoes and fixes it or whatever.
And apparently he said everybar needs a hook or something,
right.
So their hook became free bacon.
So like you order a drink in,like popcorn or peanuts or
whatever is at a bar, they givefree bacon.
(28:46):
So there's fried bacon forpeople just munch on as they're
like drinking their drinks andso forth Right, really unique
concept.
And then they changed the signto a pig grabbing a beer and all
that stuff.
That little shift made a hugedifference in that bar.
They didn't go out of business.
So I'm like kind of pissed andI was like, oh my God, but the
place got famous.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
Not only did they not go out of business, you start
going to that bar.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
That's right, Because it was free bacon, I mean.
So what I'm trying to say isthat it's advice about culture.
You're like, oh, okay, I get it, Whatever you could change one
thing.
And all of a sudden, all theparents are watching it and
they're like, Ooh, I like this,Okay.
And and remember my previoustalks, it's that if you run a
(29:32):
traditional martial arts school,your, your student base or your
your target customer is usuallya mom right Between the ages of
what?
35 and 45, 30 to 45, somewherein that age range, and what
would they like to see theirkids do?
And at six years old.
So it's a really powerful thing, that little lineup how they
line up, how straight they stand.
(29:53):
Before you start classes, webow to the flags.
We still do a one-minutemeditation.
It sends chills up my spine.
I see the kids sit there still.
Just all these little thingsadds up.
And having the culture I haveparents come out onto my mat and
help they hold targets atcertain parts of our drills.
(30:15):
I go, hey, I need parentalvolunteers to come out to help
hold the targets for this nextdrill.
We have a tournament coming upand I partnered them up with
their kids and that's slowlybreaking that barrier down for
them to want to absolutely takeclass someday in the future.
Speaker 1 (30:30):
So you have let me get this straight you have
parents who are sitting down intheir regular clothes and you
ask them to come into the classand participate by holding
targets or whatnot.
Yes, that's, that's brilliant,because then then they'll be
like, oh hey, they'll getfamiliar with being on the mat.
They could see themselvesimagine themselves practicing
(30:53):
doing these kicks correct andthen correct, join the Be.
Like they could visualizejoining the family class with
their kids.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
A hundred percent.
A hundred percent.
That's why I do hey, I needextra parent help today.
Do you guys mind coming out onthe floor and holding for your
child?
Yeah, I always use this analogyright, and it's.
It's this I'm a girl dad, soI've got daughters and they're
older now.
And it's this I'm a girl dad,so I've got daughters and
they're older now.
But if my daughter did ballet,like if I said to you, Mr Hong,
(31:28):
and I said, Jimmy, I need you towear these pink tights and a
tutu, you'd be like get out ofhere, I'm not going to wear that
, right.
But if I was a dance instructor, I'm like, hey, Mr Hong, I
really need your help.
Your daughter needs a dancepartner and we need to get her
ready for a recital.
Can you help me out?
You're like absolutely, what doyou need me to do?
I need you to wear these tightsand a tutu, All right, and be
(31:49):
on the oh yeah, sure, that'swhat you're saying when you're
asking a parent to like wear auniform.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
You know, think of-.
Well, I wear that without beingasked anyway, so that's not an
issue.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
I know, so please don't stand up.
We'll probably see it right now.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
I'm wearing it right now, Master Cha.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
We've got cameras now , so be careful, be careful, be
careful what you wish for thecameras are a waste of.
That's right.
That's right.
We can only use ourimaginations right now.
So, anyway, my point being isthat, you know, these are just
little cultural things that Ithink are super important in
your academy, that you have aculture of respect, culture of
(32:29):
friendliness, culture of peoplewanting to help out, and that's
really important.
The last thing I want to leaveyou with is this I had a
fundraiser last night and one ofthe things that my father's
black belts did is we wereoriginally in central city
Milwaukee and that's where ourprogram started.
(32:50):
So when we moved out to theburbs, there was kind of a hole
of not having a school in thecentral part of Milwaukee and
underserved areas.
So we started in a nonprofit.
It's been going like 10, 10plus years strong and we're
teaching in schools, communitycenters.
My Black Belt's volunteered tothat and they help out.
And last night we had ourannual gala and we had over 120
(33:15):
people there and at that gala weraised over $50,000.
And our students donated thatand everybody pitched in and
helped out to help thisnonprofit teach Taekwondo.
And so what I'm saying is thisculture of help went to another
level.
Right that, hey, ourcontribution to the city of
Milwaukee is that we really feellike we brought martial arts to
(33:38):
our city to make our citystronger.
And because we're making ourcity stronger, right, we want to
make sure we help our kidsbecome stronger.
They become better citizens.
So what better way to do thatthan teach in the underserved
areas of Milwaukee?
So you know, it was awesome.
In fact, I'm going to post thatthey just did a new story on us
and so forth.
(33:59):
But that is the culture thatworks for us and that, to me, is
an important part of the reasonour school has done well in
this area is because it's notjust about having a commercial
school, it's also about givingback.
Okay, now let me say this firsttoo You've got to get to a
level where your school issustainable, that you have to be
successful yourself.
(34:20):
Like the airplane's about tocrash and the oxygen masks come
out, they go wear that maskfirst before you help your
children.
So you've got to make sure youhave a successful school before
you guys can do that, thoseother parts and other things,
and you can give back in spadesto your community and so forth.
And so I'm not telling you togo out and do a nonprofit, not
just yet, just make communityand so forth, and so I'm not
(34:41):
telling you to go out and do anonprofit, not just yet.
Just make sure you guys have asustainable model that you're
very successful at.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
That you can you can do that, so I think that's a
very important point in terms ofdeveloping the culture of your
school.
I would love to do a wholeepisode on on the process and
what you do for your yourfundraiser.
I know we could talk tons aboutit, from setup to how to make
it successful in the event, sothat's definitely in the
pipeline.
Speaker 2 (35:07):
We would love to do that, master chan yeah, I will
have our executive director whoruns it, who is a very smart
woman, has a law degree.
I I'm also very blessed to besurrounded by brilliant people,
very smart people that help usjust create some amazing
programming for our industry.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
So Awesome, master Chan.
So the answer is culture.
Culture is that one powerfulingredient your martial arts
schools can't afford to ignore?
Let's conclude here.
If you are enjoying our show,please go ahead and rate and
review our podcast or YouTubechannel.
(35:45):
Starting today, our YouTubechannel will be visual along
with the audio only that waspreviously passed.
Whether you like it or not, ourgoal is to make our show as
successful as possible, to reachout to all the school owners,
and your review will definitelyhelp achieve that.
Have a great week listeners.
(36:06):
Fellow Marshall School owners,master Chan and I look forward
to our next episode.
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