June 2, 2024 • 49 mins
Ready to unlock the secrets behind the meteoric rise of pickleball? Join us as we explore Preston Playhouse in Dallas, a facility that’s buzzing with energy thanks to its array of pickleball courts, Padel, Ping Pong, vintage video games, and a bar. You'll hear from local enthusiasts and facility operators about the challenges and triumphs of meeting the skyrocketing demand for indoor pickleball spaces, especially in hot climates. Plus, Renee Hinterlong, TCD Pickleball Director, shares the success story of their seasonal boot camps and the exciting expansion of indoor venues in Texas.
Our episode also delves into how unpredictable Texas weather has made indoor pickleball a sensation, attracting people of all ages. In this episode our guest recounts transforming from a skeptic to a pickleball advocate leading record-setting events and forming leagues that offer equal play. Schools are now incorporating this inclusive sport into their programs, providing a healthy alternative to screen time and building a vibrant pickleball community.
Take a trip down memory lane with us as we reminisce about our early pickleball days filled with makeshift courts and hilarious learning experiences. Hear about our journey from casual games to competitive matches, culminating in the launch of our apparel line, Dinkpro, featuring our fun-loving mascot, Sluggo. We also touch on the communal atmosphere that makes pickleball special, the structured boot camps that polish player skills, and the ongoing evolution of ladies and mixed leagues. Whether you’re a seasoned player or new to the game, this episode promises a deep dive into the sport’s explosive growth and the fun, inclusive community it fosters.
Looking for a fitness app specifically designed for Pickleheads? Download the Aim7 app today. Use our url to get a 25% discount and try the app for a free trial before committing. https://www.aim7.com/?via=blazing-paddles
Special thanks to Crown Pickleball for their support and sponsorship! Don't waste money on balls that break, Crown pickleballs rarely crack, are more visible and have a higher spin rate than the competitors.
Use our link to receive a discount on your next purchase! https://crownpickleball.store/blazingpaddles
Have a suggestion for a guest or topic you'd like to see us address?
Hit me up at john@dink.pro or shout out on social:
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, how you doing.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Hey, I'm just hanging out at the Preston Playhouse
hey.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Picklers.
This is a first for us, firstremote podcast, and I think it
won't be our last.
We're out here at PrestonPlayhouse in Dallas.
They've only been open sixweeks.
Can you believe it?
Speaker 2 (00:14):
I don't and I can't believe that I played here,
maybe even the first week thatthey opened, and didn't even
know that that was the case.
Oh, that's right.
It was really awesome and thisplace is pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (00:23):
I mean it looks like I'm not sure what do they have?
10 courts One, two, three, four, five I'm trying to count them
but they also have Padel, theyalso have Ping Pong, they also
have vintage video games andthey have a bar.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Oh, that's nice.
Where's the bar?
Do they have Bloody Marys?
Speaker 1 (00:40):
They sell ranch waters here.
I know they're a partner withCasa Amigos.
They said so.
That's always good to know, butthis is a fun one.
We're going to talk to variouspeople throughout the day some
of the organizers, some of theplayers, hopefully a pro or two,
because with the explosion ofthis sport, we were talking to
people last night.
There was three or fourdifferent people.
They're all opening facilities.
(01:01):
I mean, this area is apickleball, facilities are going
to be that's the thing huge andit's here with the heat and all
that did you hear what he wassaying too, about how, for every
400 people who play pickleball,you need an indoor facility
every what no 400.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
A guy last night was saying that he's having to build
another facility 10 minutesfrom one of his facilities just
to, because that's how manypeople, so they know, basically
the critical mass and that's inmaryland, yeah yeah, yeah, and I
think that one thing they'reall finding out it's it's not
like they're hiding theirsecrets or anything, they're all
openly.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Hey, good, good for you, open more facilities,
because there's plenty ofplayers and the demand is crazy.
One day we'll see if thislevels out, but it's certainly
not happening anytime soon.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
That's right.
All right, let's get some morepickleball.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Let's get remote.
Hello Picklers Blazing Paddles,episode 12, marching Forward.
Anybody who's involved inleague play is probably familiar
with an organization called TCDand it stands, ironically
enough, for Tennis Competitorsof Dallas.
And it is quite an importantorganization in the local area.
(02:19):
And we're talking to two ladieshere today, renee Hinterlong
and Lisa Ratcher.
You're going to hear Kareninterview each of them.
We were lucky enough to go tothe Preston Playhouse this last
week and observe and participatein the TCD boot camp for their
members.
Preston Playhouse, unbelievablefacility.
But this is going to be partone of a two-part episode.
(02:39):
We hope you enjoy it.
Let's take a listen.
Saddle up, you'll be glad youdid you enjoy it.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
Let's take a listen, saddle up, you'll be glad you
did.
My name is Renee Hinnerlong andI am the TCD Pickleball
Director.
I actually started the leaguein the fall of 2020 and this
particular event is the secondone we've had and it it's our
end-of-the-season kind of funlittle boot camp that we're
(03:07):
offering our membership andthat's basically what we're
doing and it was such a big hitlast year.
We had over 100 people come andplay with us at the Oasis last
year and it was a big hit.
Everybody was like we want it,keep coming, keep coming.
(03:30):
So we decided because theweather was kind of goofy last
year with this type of year, sowe decided that we were going to
do indoor locations.
It has turned out, obviously.
I thought last night I'm like,yes, make it rain.
You know, this is the reasonthat we're doing it indoor and,
(03:53):
of course, it's a beautiful dayout today, right of course,
that's the way it goes.
We find it really fun that thereare more and more indoor
facilities opening up throughoutthe Metroplex and I know and
I'm just going to name drop herePickleball Kingdom's got
several that are either underconstruction or soon will be.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Last night we were actually at a networking event
where they had, I believe, threepeople that were.
There are building indoorfacilities, so the more.
Yes, so it's coming, and youknow what it's needed, because
the weather in Texas is sounpredictable.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
Well, for one, it's so hot in the summertime and in
the spring you've got the windand the rain, and in the fall
it's hot until like November,and in the fall it's hot until
like November.
So I think this is just a plus,plus for everybody that wants
to play.
Yes, I agree.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
How many ladies?
Speaker 3 (04:57):
Well, we've got two sites and we've got 50 at each
location.
So we're playing here at thePreston Playhouse and then at
DIP, which is down the street alittle bit.
I've never been to DIP.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
I haven't either.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
actually I haven't been to very many of the indoor
facilities.
I don't get out much.
I seem to be behind my computera lot.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
Well, that's no fun.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
This is all kind of new to me too, but it's just
really exciting.
So how did you?
How did you get into?
I have been with TCD for over 30years okay so I started off in
the tennis side, obviously, andI've been on different boards
and in fact, in 2012, when I waspresiding on the tennis board,
(05:43):
my associate director came upwith this idea of playing
pickleball and I remembereverybody on the board was like
just trying to pick the nameapart.
We were like, what is this?
So we actually are in theGuinness Book of World Records
(06:04):
for having the most pickleballplayers playing at one time in
one location, and we ended uphaving this tournament.
We had like over 300 peoplethat came, players come.
We got these two pros fromCalifornia, because that was
(06:24):
really hitting big in California, and so we had these two pros
come and show us how to play andwork with everybody.
We had the Guinness Book ofWorld Records there and it was a
fabulous event.
And you know, up until like 2019, you started to hear more about
it In 2020, I went to my.
(06:45):
I was on the board and I saidall right, I think that we're
going to have a missedopportunity if TCD does not
address the pickleball phenomenathat is going on in this
country.
I mean, and so I got acommittee together.
At that time there were nofacilities.
(07:07):
There was no tennisorganization or pickleball
organization that had leagueslike what I envisioned.
So I worked with a guy.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
You're a visionary.
I'm just going to say you sawthe writing on the wall.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
And it was fun Besides that.
It was just fun.
So, long story short, I gotwith this guy in Arizona and I
talked to him and I kind ofliked his format and I said, all
right, and I got a hold of someplayers that I knew from tennis
and that were starting to play.
(07:48):
You know, back then pickleballwas just played at the
tournaments that you know, theUSA Pickleball, would you know
have?
I got a committee together andI made my team at the time go
out and I'd say, all right,today we're going to do this
format and because I'm not goingto send anybody to a match
(08:09):
unless they can get an hour anda half to two hours of play,
because no one's going to wantto do that, right, so we came up
with a format and we came, youknow, did the rules and bylaws.
You know we did all that set upthe score sheets.
You know I remember going toone of the girls that used to be
on my tennis team she's a realgood player and I said, okay,
(08:37):
ellen.
I said if you were to traveland you were to play another
team, would you like it to beset up the same way that tennis
is that we have tennis, or wouldyou prefer to do a round robin
format and play againsteverybody?
and she said you know, I thinkI'd like to play against
everybody and I said I agreewith you and the other good
thing about that is everybody onyour team really is of equal
(09:00):
talent, because you're not goingto have, like in tennis, you're
not going to have differentlevels of ability and then place
them because you're, the linesare stacked, so you've got one,
two, three.
Usually the line one player isyour are your best players,
right?
So no one wants to play downhere on three, or I guess
(09:20):
they've got four, four, uh, fourlines.
No one's going to be the onethat's at the bottom.
They're going to feel likethey're, you know, not good, you
know.
So anyway, I wanted to get ridof all that drama and so that's
kind of where we came up withthat format.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Interesting that you say the line thing, because I'm
not from tennis, so I and I, asmy captains, were talking about
okay, you're line one, line two.
I didn't ask, I just was like,oh okay.
Speaker 3 (09:48):
No, and it doesn't matter.
In pickleball, no, becauseyou're playing everybody.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Right, exactly that's what I love about it.
I do too.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Well, it makes everybody feel appreciated.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
When they say I'm line three, I'm like, all right,
they think I'm the worst andthen I go out there.
Yeah, no kidding.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
I mean, usually, if I get put on that line, I
probably have the toughest teamto play against, you know Right.
So I'm like, really so but yeah, I think it just keeps growing
and growing every year and we'rejust really excited about it.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
I just think that I mean when do you think it ends,
or where do you think it ends?
I mean now the kids are gettinginvolved.
Our courts, where we live, arejust being inundated with kids
and I love it because it'sgetting them away from their
phones, away from theircomputers, out there, you know,
in the fresh air.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
I feel that I believe my kids are grown and I've got
grandkids, so I mean I'm not inthat environment necessarily
anymore exposed to it that much.
But from what I understand,there's elementary schools and
junior high are introducing itin their gym classes, so I'm
(11:04):
very optimistic that it's justgoing to continue to grow.
I mean, the thing is, tennishas been around for a long time
and I love tennis too, but thisis just like brand new.
This is just something that'sbrand new and it's a challenge
to everybody.
You know they don't have anypreconceived whatever, it's just
fun.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
Yeah, and it seems to be like an easier access into.
For years I had friends thatwere like, oh, you should come
out and join the tennis, but Iwas so I felt like I was too old
, I didn't have the years ofexperience so I was intimidated.
And I don't feel intimidatedwith pickleball and I feel like
that's why it's like an easyaccess or way into a sport.
(11:46):
And the other thing about it isthat you know you can't judge
anyone by the way they look inthis.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Oh, you can't judge anybody by the way they look in
tennis either.
Let me tell you the worstplayers are coming out, the
hardest players are coming outwith all the knee braces and
yeah no, they just know where toplace the ball.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
That's.
That is one of the things, andit's interesting when I play,
you know, I'm a I'm a middle asthe riddle girl because I don't
have the angles from tennis.
I relish it when I I'm playingwith a girl who has the tennis
background, cause I know I canplay the middle safe and she can
.
You know, if I create anopportunity for a put away, they
can get those angles so well,it's really nice.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
And how long?
Speaker 2 (12:28):
have you been playing ?
Well, we were pandemic picklers.
So March of 2020, and they hadtaken down all of the nets and
we set up a pickleball net inthe parking lot of our local
park, bicentennial, bicentennial.
We even have a picture of it.
And then from there it went toplaying in the street, chalking
(12:48):
it off.
And we didn't know, any of therules.
Yeah, we would put the net up.
Car would come, we'd move thenet, put card leave, put the net
back.
We had no idea what kitchen was.
We had no idea what that youcould.
We thought you could servetwice, like in tennis.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
And you didn't even get a start about the scoring.
How long it took.
Speaker 2 (13:07):
Oh yeah, the scoring Okay okay, I agree with you.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
I'm I.
It was hilarious.
Speaker 4 (13:12):
Every time.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
I would have to go up and say the score.
I'm like I know I'm going tomess this up.
I know I am and I typically do,and everybody.
Then you get crazy.
Then you get crazy.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
Yeah.
So then we went to a camp andwe were like, oh dinking, you're
not supposed to just sit at theback and bang away.
And you know, we sustained somany injuries early on from
playing wrong.
But we were having fun, wedidn't care.
We had such a good time thatfirst year because no one was
playing.
We had the courts all toourselves and our group of
(13:43):
friends just would go out forsix and seven hours.
No one was out there, we had nocompetition.
And then more people startedplaying and John still wanted to
play for fun.
And all of a sudden I'm incompetitive mode I'm like I want
to get better.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
Well, when she says John wanted to play for fun, she
said well, you know what's funWinning, Winning is fun.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
Yeah, do you agree with me?
No, I do.
I lean that way in most parts.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Yeah, no, it's Well.
Thank you so much for invitingus out.
Thank you, francine.
Felt very highly of you.
She's a doll.
I love her.
That's the thing aboutpickleball, too is like I have
not met anyone in this sportthat I just don't love.
We all lift each other up, helpeach other out, and I think
it's because it's so early onthat, you know, everyone's
(14:32):
trying to figure this thing out.
There's room for everyone.
You're absolutely right.
I mean the podcast.
There's plenty of them outthere, and I'm sure that'll
continue to grow.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
you know we have an apparel line of pickleball
clothing and that's gonna.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
And when we started, that there was this online.
What's that address?
What uh dinkpro?
You should check us outactually I'm wearing one of them
.
That's really cool, and we?
Our tagline is live love play.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
I love that.
I actually like that.
Yeah, that's.
I was looking at that and Ithought that is such a cute
emoji.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
Isn't it?
That's our mascot, Sluggo.
The whole idea behind him ishe's got the look of
determination in his eye.
He's got a scuff on his cheekbecause when you learn this
sport, you get beat up.
But he's smiling because he'shaving fun.
What is the name of your?
Dinkpro?
Speaker 3 (15:24):
Dinkpro.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Oh, okay, I'm going to look you up.
He's copyrighted.
We started trademarking ourlogo over a year ago.
It took us about I don't know14 months, 15 months, which is a
little bit longer than itnormally takes, but I think it's
because they got inundated witha bunch of pickleball and they
needed to make sure.
But but I think it's becausethey got inundated with a bunch
(15:47):
of pickleball and they needed tomake sure, but we just got our
certification.
Now is this SPF.
Speaker 3 (15:54):
No, I'd have to check on this one, but we do have
other long-sleeve.
I wear long-sleeve because ofthe sun, but I like the SPF so
that I can be out there.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
This one's a little thick, like feel it.
It's a little thicker than so.
You probably wouldn't wear thisin the sunshine.
You'd wear it in the.
It's adorable.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
I love it.
I love your little dude, I lovethat attitude.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
Oh yeah, he's been fun, everyone loves him and
that's why we have the stickers,we have the little buttons for
the end of a paddle and buttonsfor the end of a paddle, and
he's on a lot of our clothes.
Our whole premise was to createa line of clothing that, if
you're a pickleballer, you seeme, you see this, you're gonna
go hey, do you play pickleball?
Now?
This is a unisex.
This is the idea of the stuffthat we have.
I love it.
(16:35):
I'm showing her the weathershirt which says precipitation
10 percent humidity, 39 percentwind, nine miles per hour,
chance of pickleball 100 percent.
Speaker 3 (16:45):
That is adorable and I love that color.
Yeah, this is the.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
UV.
Oh, it is UV.
Speaker 3 (16:52):
Oh, okay, that is so fun.
Is that online now?
Oh, wow, I'm going to go checkyou guys out, you should.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
Well, renee, thanks for talking to us.
We're excited to see what todayis.
Hopefully we get to interviewsome of the players.
Oh, we see there's Ann from ourSouthlake.
There you go, you got to get.
Speaker 3 (17:14):
Lisa over here.
Lisa is our past presiding.
She was the president last year, and so she's a wealth of
information and she's very fun,very bubbly.
Speaker 1 (17:31):
You know, guys, there's not much that's wrong
with pickleball, but there are afew things that can be annoying
, one of which is having ballsthat crack, and if you've been
out there lately, temperaturesdropping, balls are cracking,
they're.
Also.
If you play indoors, or ifyou're playing when the
visibility is not great, thatball gets lost pretty easily in
your eyesight, and we know thatpeople are hitting it harder and
(17:52):
harder.
So you'd like something alittle bit higher visibility.
So we are here to announce ourpartnership with Crown
Pickleball.
In our show notes you'll have alink where you can get a
discount for your first set ofCrown Pickleballs.
I can tell you that they don'tcrack.
They beat the price point ofthe competitors.
They beat the quality of thecompetitors.
So as the temperature gets cold, they beat the price point of
(18:14):
the competitors and they beatthe quality of the competitors.
So as the temperature gets cold, get you some crowns, because
otherwise you're going to have alot of cracked balls, which is
great for my wife's crafts, butnot so great for competitive
play.
Speaker 4 (18:25):
Thank you, my name is Lisa Ratcher.
I am the past presidingdirector for Tennis Competitors
of Dallas, which means last yearI was the presiding director or
the president, and now I am thepast president.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Yes, so tell us, how many years have you been doing
the bootcamp?
Well, I'm sure.
Speaker 4 (18:46):
Renee spoke about pickleball's inception to TCD
was fall of 2020.
And I became.
That was my first.
It was actually everybody'sfirst introduction to pickleball
, really on this scale.
I started a team, so I'm one ofthe original captains.
Yep.
I had a women's team.
I still do.
(19:06):
Some of my players are playingtoday.
How many?
Speaker 3 (19:09):
flights were there.
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 4 (19:11):
Very few, very few and, as a matter of fact, up
until fall of 2023, pickleballwas only being.
What do you say?
Not outshined by tennis but,for lack of better words, by one
team.
So we have six leagues withinour organization.
(19:31):
We have four tennis leagues andthe two pickleball leagues.
So, up until fall of 2023,pickleball was only being
outdone by one team, so it wasfour to two.
Right as of spring 2024,pickleball has taken the leap
and we had way more teams forthe two leagues in pickleball
(19:55):
that are new to the organizationthan we did in tennis.
So it is, if that doesn't tellyou, in and of itself, the
growth of the sport, I don'tknow what does Right.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
Well, I mean all this is pretty unbelievable, isn't
it?
Speaker 4 (20:11):
I mean, just look around these, these are popping
up everywhere and I don't knowhow you were introduced to
pickleball, but I can tell youfor myself we've moved nine
times throughout my marriage andone of the times we lived in
New Jersey and we decided wehave a RV, we decided to go to
Florida and we're at thisincredible RV park and we heard
(20:34):
the noise.
So we're walking around and itwas an RV park where you could,
you know, you had your big RVsand then you could have people
had like little bungalows, sobig retirement community.
We're walking around andthere's these people, elderly
people playing this sport.
So, as a predominant tennisplayer, I said what is this?
(20:55):
And this elderly gentleman saidthis is pickleball.
And so he took my husband and I, who's also a tennis player,
and he said grab some paddlesand let me tell you what this
sport is all about.
Let me show you nice, oh my goshso we've been here seven years,
for Prior to this we were inOhio for four years, so 11.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
So about 14 years ago ?
Wow, really I wish I would havestarted 14 years ago.
Speaker 4 (21:21):
So then we played and we thought it was so cool and
we were there for like anotherfour days and we would go and
you'd sign up.
And we did for four days, had ablast, went back to New Jersey,
told some of my people, haveyou heard of this thing called
pickleball?
And they were like what?
No, what is it?
Tried to tell them and theywere like I had.
I had a really good friend ofmine who actually I made eat
crow a couple of years agobecause she said that'll never
(21:43):
take on.
And I said I don't know, sister, you know it's going to have
something's going to pop withthis.
And sure enough it'sunbelievable, it is.
And now the growth is.
I can't tell you the last timeI actually saw somebody quote,
unquote elderly playing.
Now it's gotten a hold of young, young kids.
This is a sport that really,you know, tennis takes a lot of
(22:06):
money and time to be good.
Pick a ball.
I tell people who are lookingfor teams listen, watch a
YouTube video, get the basicsdown, go out and hit a couple of
times and you're going to beamazing.
And so, and that's that's thething I love about it is that
anybody can play anybody and begood.
Right Tennis, it does.
(22:26):
It takes money and time.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
Yes, I dabbled a little bit.
Just took a couple of lessons,my son all of a sudden decided
never played tennis and decidedin high school oh, I want to
play tennis.
And I'm like, well, you'venever done it before.
So we took a couple of lessonsover a summer and then John and
I tried it together and he gotmad because I could keep the
ball in the court and so he gavehe quit on me.
(22:52):
So when he found pickleball hesaid we got to try the sport.
It looks so fun and I'm likenot another sport that you're
going to quit on me.
Speaker 4 (23:01):
And here we are.
It's amazing.
My husband plays too.
I got my husband to play and myhusband, who is a phenomenal
tennis player he actuallyprefers pickleball over tennis.
Now, and I think that's what'sgoing to happen.
It's so much fun.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
It's like sometimes we're on our pickleball courts
that share a tennis their linefor tennis too, yeah, and we've
got two courts going and we'relaughing, cutting up and no one
looks fancy or anything you know, and then over there you'll
have the I call it like ballet.
Speaker 4 (23:29):
Very serious, very serious.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
The ball, nobody's talking.
Speaker 4 (23:32):
And you know I associate pickleball players to
surfers, Right, they're like hey, dude, come on, join in.
Yes.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
The more the merrier you got music Cool, they're like
skateboarders too.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
How about that Same vibe, right or not?
Skateboarders what do you callit?
Snowboarders?
Yeah, they're all the sameright.
Speaker 4 (23:49):
It's a different vibe .
It's more low-key, a lot moreinclusive, happy, fun.
And don't get me wrong, Tennisis phenomenal.
I love tennis, but it is aserious, very uptight kind of
sport and this vibe is not.
It is a fun.
Let's play music, let's talk.
(24:11):
There's a lot of people goingback and forth, you know, as
tennis players it's.
You know, two people on thecourt or four people on the
court.
Nobody walk around me, Don't dothis, Don't do that.
So I do think that this is sucha more inclusive, happier vibe.
It is.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
When did you get serious about pickleball?
When did you kind of transition, or are you?
Speaker 4 (24:32):
serious.
Like I said, I really likepickleball.
I do, but I still I do playtennis.
I do play.
I have not, do you?
Speaker 2 (24:40):
have a hard time going back and forth.
Speaker 4 (24:42):
I do not.
I find that the pickleball hasmade my tennis better because
those finesse I'm a net player,so those dinking shots, those
finesse shots just make myfinesse at the net better.
Now I don't think that tennismakes pickleball better, because
tennis you want to hit the ballhard and so in this sport it's
(25:02):
a lot more finesse.
You can do hit the ball hard,but you really need to know when
to not hit the ball hard.
So for me, like I said, thishas made my tennis better.
I I love, like I just love theatmosphere, I, I I love the, the
, the amount of people, I likethe, the, the talking, and the
and the, the pace.
(25:23):
And I think the way we haveformatted our leagues with the,
with the round Robin style.
There's no hierarchy, right,there's still that hierarchy in
tennis like oh, you're, you're,you're, you know, line one,
whereas which is silly to me,because line one's two points
aren't any less significant thanline four's two points.
right, two points are two points, but in pickleball everybody
(25:45):
plays everybody.
So that's what I love aboutthat.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
I do too.
I do too.
So what are the instructorsworking on and tell us about the
?
Speaker 4 (25:54):
bootcamp.
For us this is new.
This is the third.
This is actually the secondquote unquote bootcamp.
The first time we had apickleball event and we didn't
have pros there.
Last year we did have pros andwe were at Oasis and the pros
and the pros travel to the women.
And so here at this facility,the pros are traveling to the
(26:17):
women and some courts areworking on serving, Some courts
are working on driving, Somecourts are working on blocking.
So it's a really good way forwomen to leave their facilities,
come to a different facilitiesand get trained by different
pros and open up their eyes toother possibilities to play the
(26:38):
sport.
I love it yes exactly Right,probably next year.
Our calendars are made a yearin advance and so this was on
the docket since last year.
So there will more than likelybe another one next year, and as
this league is growing, we'readding different things as well.
(26:59):
Now I don't know if Renee spokeabout we're doing an indoor
ladies pickleball summer.
Speaker 2 (27:06):
I saw that because I'm into TCD teams.
I'm on the mix.
Okay, perfect, there you go.
Speaker 4 (27:11):
So I don't know if Renee told you, but TCD
pickleball is the largestorganized competitive league
play in the United States.
I did not know that, which meansfor us like okay.
So TCD is one of the largestorganized competitive tennis
leagues in the United States aswell.
I think we're only outshined byAlta, which is in Atlanta, and
(27:35):
the only reason why Altaoutshines us is because they
have a junior league and asenior league and there's this
Monday through Friday, whereashere in Texas we compete with
USTA, and so you know we kind ofdivide up the seasons TCD has
spring and fall and USTA haspretty much summer and winter.
For us, this TCD pickleball isthe largest organized league
(28:00):
play, not tournaments, right,you can find big tournaments,
but this is league play that isorganized every week with
seasons, with traveling teams.
So that's pretty amazing in andof itself.
Speaker 2 (28:14):
It really is, and I think I find it really fun
because you're traveling alittle bit farther, so you're
getting.
You know, I'm very familiarwith all the ladies in that
right but because they're insurrounding areas and a lot of
them play at the same places.
So with TCD it's cool becausewe get to go to other facility
farther away, meet new peopleand experience different skill
(28:37):
levels.
It's interesting.
I think we're in flight threein TCD and we were flight one in
net Okay, and we just won ourTCD women's.
We came in first.
Speaker 4 (28:50):
Okay, so you got first place, so you'll be moving
up.
Yes, yes.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
Which is scary and fun all together.
Speaker 4 (28:56):
Yes, it is.
It's challenging right.
I mean that's our, it's in ourname competitors, so we.
There has been a little bit ofa growing pains when it comes to
placement because we're taking,when we, when we accept new
teams.
There's a litany of paperworkthat you have to fill out, and
so it.
you know that's very detailed.
Do you have a duper rating?
Do you have a?
Have you played in tournaments?
(29:17):
How often do you play?
Do you seek pros?
Do you do you take lessons frompros?
You know we don't havepickleball, what it's neglecting
.
So somebody out there shouldreally start almost like an
official rating, like a duper,but duper is only if you play
tournaments.
So somehow, or another duper orsomebody else needs to come up
with a concept of a USTA towhere you can get your rating
(29:41):
and it's a solid rating, so thatwhen we go to place you in a
team, we have something that'sreally concrete For us.
We're taking a mixture ofpredominant USTA right tennis.
However, we have found that ifyou're a high tennis player,
you're probably going to be ahigh pickleball player, but
that's not always the case.
So there's been some growingpains of new teams coming in and
(30:04):
being placed maybe below wherethey should, and then they start
to raise up, but it takes awhile.
And then they start to raise up, but it takes a while.
Now we're finding in the ladiesleagues of pickleball it is
starting to clean itself up andwe're getting people where they
should be and making itcompetitive, because none of us
want to show up to a match andbe blown out in five minutes or
(30:27):
10 minutes right.
I mean we play the round robinstyle, but if you've got a team
that is just so much better thanit really doesn't take, you
know, 30 minutes for them toblow you out 11-0 or 11-2 or
11-3.
So we are in.
Ladies, it is finally gettingto be your where you need to be
mixed.
We're still having a little bitof hiccups, and we still may
(30:49):
have that, because the leaguesare growing so much that we are
only able to place people basedon the information we're given.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
Yeah, and also I mean just from my experience.
I have a friend of mine whohe's like she's a good
pickleballer, he's exceptional.
So there's a huge variancebetween them, their skill levels
, but they're on the same team.
So that's where I think it'sgoing to be harder with duper.
We tried it as a club duringrec play and it was did not work
(31:21):
.
So I agree with you 100, evenfor tournaments, it's not
working.
I mean, there's so muchsandbagging.
That's why I want to dotournaments, but I'm not doing
until that gets worked out forsure, right, because it's a
waste of money.
Speaker 4 (31:33):
It can be a little humiliating, right, like you.
Somebody shows up and you're,you're, you're, you're rating a
3-0.
So you play a 3-0, but you'rereally playing a 4-5.
Who can be a 3-0?
Because the duper you know sothat it is, it can be.
It can be very demoralizing.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
Oh we, the last that John and I did, and I think it
was the Texas Open, I can'tremember, but that's the one
where it was like the writing'son the wall.
Here we were playing against alady.
She may have been a true threebetween three, five and four,
but playing in three Right.
And then she had a guy who was5-0 playing and I'm like I paid
(32:09):
all that money to play threegames and then we're out.
Speaker 4 (32:11):
And it does, like I said, it's demoralizing, right?
Like you come with really thebest of intentions and you want
to have fun and when thathappens, you're like, oh, that
wasn't really any fun and itmakes you less likely to enter
another tournament, just likeyou're saying.
You're like I'm not going to doit, I'm going to wait for a
minute.
Which is why I think TCD isphenomenal, because it gives you
that league play on a weeklybasis to satiate the need of
(32:35):
competitive fun play.
I do not play in any tournaments.
I will tell you, I did play inone and it was the same thing
and I thought why.
It was a lot of money, you know, like $150.
And it was one and done becausethe weather.
They had to change the formatbecause the weather was really
bad, and so it was a one anddone and you're like, okay, wait
a minute and then come to findout and I'm not the kind of
(32:56):
person who researches and, oh mygosh, she's really a five.
Oh, you know, I, to me, anybodycan win on any given day, right
, but when, when there's thatbig of a discrepancy, you know
Like, come on, you know.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
Are you really having fun?
That's right, you're going toenjoy your gold medal, that's
right, you know seriously, We'llget you the gold medal.
Speaker 4 (33:15):
But I mean, how great was that for you?
Speaker 2 (33:18):
No, not at all.
Yes, yes, so it'll be a while,but that's what I'm loving.
I mean, tell us about thesummer one.
Well, that's new.
Speaker 4 (33:32):
So it's, it's called, it's going to be, it's an
indoor, uh summer.
It's only five weeks.
It starts May 31st and it ends,uh, whatever, the last Friday
in June is.
You know, we, we felt that, uh,there, we, all of these
facilities, also Texas heat,right, we, we don't want these
ladies out there.
It just gets at 109 degrees.
It's crazy.
(33:52):
We've actually changed some ofour tcd rules for extreme
weather temps, how heavy we have.
So to protect the ladies andwith all, to utilize some of
these great facilities, um, we,we renee, put forth an indoor
summer league and, uh, there'sthree flights.
I think there's a flight one, aflight two and a flight three.
Uh, there's facilitiesthroughout the Metroplex.
(34:12):
I'm playing out of McKinney.
There's DIP there's.
Who else is playing?
Mckinney's got some DIP.
Speaker 2 (34:23):
What about Frisco?
Speaker 4 (34:25):
Frisco?
No, allen, I don't think any.
Of the lifetime facilities?
No, I don't think so, but it'son our website, right?
So all the information is there, the teams are formed and
they're getting ready to startin just a few weeks, exciting.
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Very exciting, yes, and what a way to beat the Texas
heat by playing indoors,absolutely Especially right now,
for whatever reason.
The last two summers, thehumidity, the dew, point is
extremely.
It's hard to breathe.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
summers, the humidity the dew point is extremely it's
hard to breathe, it is, it'skiller.
Speaker 2 (34:52):
In my match the other day I felt like I was getting
lightheaded.
I thought I was by my eighth orsixth game.
I was seeing stars.
Speaker 4 (34:59):
Well, you know, I'm a I'm a certified paramedic and I
can't tell you how many timesas not only a tennis player, but
a pickle player that I've beena pickleball player I've been
called to courts to help withheat exhaustion.
Speaker 2 (35:09):
Oh really.
Speaker 4 (35:10):
So it's a thing, and I think, having the availability
to come indoors who wouldn'twant that?
And I think, if you think abouthow awesome this could be, we
expand to winter as well, right,because people want to play
more and you're just giving themthe opportunity to do just that
.
Speaker 2 (35:28):
It is such a bummer when I get up.
I got up early yesterdaymorning.
I'm like, okay, we havepractice, ladies practice, we
practice on Mondays andThursdays, and so I get up
earlier on those days to beready and get out there and we
got two games.
We went one and a half game inand we had to vacate the courts
and that just ruins my whole daybecause that's my exercise, and
then I didn't close my rings.
(35:49):
I'm all mad, yeah, but you know, like so and I do think.
Speaker 4 (35:54):
I think, with this sport in particular, it affords
that right.
Like I don't, I don't ever seeus doing indoor tennis because
there's not enough of those.
Well, there's severalfacilities, but there's, so
there's, you know, 8,000 peopleso you can accommodate.
And, uh, I don't ever see TCDbecoming an indoor kind of a
(36:18):
league.
But the affordability forpickleball at the smaller sizes
and how it's, there's so manymore that are opening up, why
not?
Speaker 2 (36:25):
Let me ask you this so do you and your husband play
together?
We?
Speaker 3 (36:29):
do I love it.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
John and I are very, very few, like of the very few
couples that we find.
We call it pickle divorce.
Speaker 4 (36:36):
A lot of people you know, we've been married 34
years and have been througheverything, and so I were.
You know, I don't thinkpickleball is gonna gonna break
us, and my husband has got avery, very chill attitude.
He's like you know, although Iam more competitive, but his
thing is, you know, listen,listen, somebody's got to win
and somebody's got to lose.
I'm like you're right, but itain't going to be us, babe.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
You know that's what you and I are.
Okay, we're the same.
John wants to play for fun.
I said winning is fun.
Speaker 4 (37:04):
I don't mind losing right, as long as it's a good
match.
Speaker 3 (37:09):
If that's a competitive match, then that's
awesome.
Speaker 4 (37:12):
But again, if I'm blown out or I knew I could have
played better, or God forbidhe's off or whatever, Right, Um,
but I always said, because Ihave, I have a mixed pickleball
team and a mixed tennis team andI said if I could get up either
team with all married couples,I'd call us divorce court.
I have, I have a couple on mytennis team who God bless them
the nicest people, but she'sintense and every single match
(37:37):
that they play, as soon as theyget off the court he goes hey,
everybody, guess what?
We're still married, you know.
And uh, so there's been some,you know, some, some, some
firecrackers and I'm on my mixedteam Now I have a couple of
firecracker people to where oneof my female players has said
you know, we don't always haveto play together because you
know the ride home can be reallyhard sometimes.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
I wish John was have in on this conversation right
now, but uh, yeah, he, uh, we,we felt all those pains we
actually almost got.
Oh no, but we fought.
Oh, no, oh no, but we foughtthrough.
We gave ourselves a timeline.
It was a tournament and I thinkit was the Texas Open.
And boy I'll tell you whatAfter that defeat.
(38:22):
It was so bad and it was so hotthat day.
I remember, just coming home, Iwas just drenched and there's a
picture of me just sittingthere with my hands on my head
and and I was like gosh, if Iwas going to lose I wouldn't
want to lose with anyone but?
Speaker 4 (38:33):
him.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
And that was kind of like what the turning point was,
and it's been a long learningcurve for us to get to where you
know, saying anything doesn'tset the other person off and for
sure.
I mean, a couple of weeks ago wewere out there playing and
whatever reason.
It got a little hot and backand forth and I, I called time
(38:54):
and I walked off the court andhe's like, what are you doing?
You're embarrassing.
I'm like, we're not.
I'm not going on there until wefigure this out.
We got a timeout Cause I, we'refor sure, and I have to say I
don't know about you.
Speaker 4 (39:04):
Like you say each other.
I will say in full, you know,full transparency.
It's usually me snipping at himBecause he's like, like I said,
his attitude is just so chill,but I know, and he is the
consummate gentleman.
So we all say, listen, she's theweaker player, let's hit to her
, or I'll use the terrible wordlet's hit at her.
(39:26):
And he's like I will never hitat her.
I said, ok, let's just hit toher.
I'm not meaning to, I don'twant you to hurt her.
Yeah, I don't want you tothrottle her.
But you know like just more ofthe shots should go her way.
And it usually you know and andand and.
Sometimes it is a man who'swho's not.
You know she's the superstarand I'll be like let's, you know
, let's aim the ball at him.
(39:47):
No, he just he has the and heis from California, so we'll
give him the, the surfersnowboard attitude.
It's all cool, whatever.
And at the end you know whathe's really right.
He is right because it is justfor fun.
And at the end of the, at theend of the thing, as long as it
(40:08):
was fun and whatever I can, Ican let it go.
Speaker 2 (40:12):
And because I don't have tennis and my tennis girls
that are in my pickleballleagues help me with this.
But I don't tend to look at thepeople I'm playing against and
pick out their weaknesses, andthat's so new to me and they all
do it.
They're like, hey, this one'sstronger.
And then I'm like, but to me,and I got to get better at it.
(40:35):
But I mean, I'm trying to makethe best shot, I think for sure,
and so I don't know if I'mdoing it right or not.
I just I know that, um, I, I,if I have too much in my head, I
can't.
I think there's a lot ofthinking.
To pick a ball, it's a mentalgame, it's strategic.
Speaker 4 (40:52):
And so I think in tennis, right, and you got to
think, in tennis you have a lotmore time actually to get more
points right, like pickleball ispretty quick, so you have to
really glean a lot ofinformation pretty quickly.
And I think that the tennis hashelped because you know like I
always look okay, are theylefties?
Okay, put it where theirforehand is, are they?
(41:14):
Is their backhand weak, right,that kind of thing Are they?
Is their backhand weak, right?
That kind of thing Are they?
Do they?
Are they fast, are they?
Although that can bite you inthe, in the butt, because I
remember when my first tennismatches years and years ago, my,
my real good friend and I hadfinally been asked to be on a
team and our first matchesagainst these elderly women, and
(41:35):
I swear to you they had everybrace that you could have Wrist
brace, elbow brace, knee brace,ankle brace, I mean every brace
you could have and I thought Iwent up to my partner I said, oh
, this is a slam dunk.
We were young, I was a latetennis boomer, so I was early
40s.
I'm like we got this, we're inshape.
(41:59):
We got it those women mopped thecourt with us.
They, they had full regaliamakeup on.
One of them even stopped to putsome powder on and redo her her
lipstick.
We were drenched in sweat, wewere I mean, we were like
huffing, we could barely breathe.
These women were just, you know, put talk about strategic right
, and so then that made meappreciate listen, it's not
(42:19):
really what you look like, howold you are, whatever.
It's about how smart of aplayer you are, and that's where
the strategy comes in.
And some of those cues of youknow her backhand is worse or
you know whatever, picking up onthose Because, like I said, you
have a finite amount of time tobring in these points and you
can't, you can't go down a setand go like, okay, this, I got
(42:41):
it, all the information, it'sdone.
So I do think that that is animportant part of this game is
is is some, you know,strategizing?
Oh for sure.
Speaker 2 (42:51):
First, there were a lot of bangers for sure, for
sure.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
Tennis players absolutely.
Speaker 2 (42:54):
And now our teams are rising to a level where you're
about 60, 40 maybe, and thehigher you get in the flights,
the more the soft game comesinto play, and so that's really
what we've been working on andfinally coming together, because
John would love to just wailaway at the ball, my husband too
(43:14):
.
And I'm like the smarter shot isto drop it.
We can't ever win.
And now, playing againstbangers, we're winning because
we're taking their ability tokeep us back.
Be on the defense the wholetime.
I'm never going to haveputaways, like some of my tennis
(43:37):
, ladies that are in pickleball.
I mean just don't, I don't have.
Speaker 4 (43:40):
My, my.
I have a pretty regular partneron my ladies team and we've got
a really good marriage on thecourt.
She, she's, really, we balanceeach other out.
She is a like a gazelle, superfast, incredibly athletic, smart
player.
She likes to hit the ball hardtoo.
So I balance her out because Ican tell her, you know, like,
(44:01):
just think it right, and I can.
We're side by side and I'll,you know, and, and her first
instinct will be I'm going todrive it and then she'll hear me
and she'll, she'll slow it downand she's just she's.
She's got such an amazing courtpresence and, like I said,
she's incredibly fast and smart.
But she wants to sometimes hitit too hard too, and I've got
(44:24):
the ability to do those softerthings or to slow it down, and
then I'll tell her, I'll look ather and I'll say boom.
And she knows what that means.
It means put that ball away.
Speaker 3 (44:34):
And you know what I'm like boom and she just does it.
Speaker 4 (44:39):
That's great, that is , put that ball away and you
know, boom and she just does it.
So you know that that is a goodthing too is to have you do.
You can't have two bangers andyou can't have two people that
are sweepers or or, or soft, oryou need the, the, the mixture
of both.
You do, and then you need to beable to be a banger when you
need to be to put that ball awayand she needs to be able to
soften up, and vice versa, rightyes, yes, yes.
Speaker 2 (44:59):
I love the boom thing .
Mine is get them and I, andsometimes I say I, I say get her
and I don't mean the person.
Yes, I'm in the ball and I andI.
Speaker 4 (45:09):
When I say it, I'm like I don't mean you I don't
mean you, you know, and sheepthey know as well they do they
have.
Hopefully they know as well.
Right, I mean, or pretty soon,we'll all start wearing bubble
wrap.
Speaker 2 (45:21):
I call John the Paul, so I'm saying I'll create the
opportunity.
My philosophy is if it's flying, it's dying.
That means, if it's in the air,you better kill it.
Speaker 4 (45:32):
There you go.
That's why I say boom, and sheknows what that means.
What's your favorite shot?
There you go.
That's why I say boom, and sheknows what that means.
What's your favorite shot?
For me, my favorite shot is I'm, like I said, I'm a net player
in tennis, so to me, to being atthat kitchen line and I'm the
backhand, just that little shortshot that it just goes.
You know, like it's so angled.
(45:53):
Yeah, that it, you know.
Speaker 2 (45:57):
And it just is, it's ungettable and it's from your
backhand.
Yeah, Nice, and I'm aone-handed backhander.
Speaker 4 (46:02):
I'm in tennis and pickleball.
But my partner, my female, mylady's partner I told you she is
a two-handed backhand.
She really, for her she feelslike it's got more power and
it's got more precision.
And for me I'm so used tohaving the big stick of a tennis
racket in my hand that havingthat little paddle makes that
(46:22):
shot even more precise.
Speaker 2 (46:25):
It's weird.
I was a two-handed backhand intennis and then, for whatever
reason, I wasn't in pickleballinitially, and then all of a
sudden it's just it's evolvedinto that I feel so much more
control dinking my backhand.
Dink, when I have my, my lefthand there, it's like I have
more control, I can get thatsharper.
(46:46):
We've been working on dinking alot because that is where we
were getting beat and it's madea huge difference.
Speaker 4 (46:51):
And then when you're dinking, to have that one person
, uh know when to speed it up.
That is the precision of thatright, you've got the dinking
and it's just you've got itgoing, but then when do you
speed it up?
To pass that by that?
To me, that's what we'reworking on.
Speaker 2 (47:10):
I'm working on that too.
I'll get in a little dinkbattle sometimes and I'm like I
could have taken that one.
I could have taken that one, Icould have taken it.
But it's almost like I have tothink, because it doesn't happen
as often, If every single gamewe got into a dink match because
, like I said, we're still inthat tweener where we still have
bangers that aren't droppingand aren't getting into dink
(47:32):
battles.
They speed everything up andnow with the paddle technology.
I swear you know how they usedto say red light yellow, light
green light.
I'm like that was, that was ared light and you still got it
over.
How'd that happen?
John was so excited at our lastmatch because he was like did
you see how many dink battles Igot into?
Well, um, we're excited to behere.
I mean, this was a great invite.
We knew francine.
(47:52):
We met her from.
Uh, where did oh what?
She bought one.
So we have an apparel line.
She bought one of our shirts.
We have a milk shirt.
It says man, I Love Pickleball.
Speaker 1 (48:01):
Okay, oh, that's cool .
Speaker 2 (48:07):
We designed it for men and then women started
buying it and we thought that'shilarious.
When I wear this shirt, you getdouble taste?
Speaker 4 (48:15):
Oh for sure, yes, yes , yes, yes, Right, People are
like wait, wait what Is shewearing?
Speaker 2 (48:19):
So Francine bought one.
It was at a Chicken and Pickleevent, a dink drinking demo
night at Chicken and Pickle, andthen from there we just kind of
connected and she came on ourpodcast.
Speaker 4 (48:30):
And I just love her.
Speaker 2 (48:37):
She's a Good spirit.
There's not anyone in.
Speaker 4 (48:38):
Pickleball that I don't love.
Come to think of it me either.
Speaker 1 (48:40):
Yeah, they are good people.
They are good people you aswell.
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (48:42):
Thanks for having us out.
Yeah, we were an HR podcastthat turned Pickleball.
Speaker 4 (48:49):
I love it.
You know what?
Find your market baby, I loveit.
That's great.
Well, thank, I love it wellthank you again.
Hey, how you doing.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Hey, I'm just hanging out at the Preston Playhouse
hey.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Picklers.
This is a first for us, firstremote podcast, and I think it
won't be our last.
We're out here at PrestonPlayhouse in Dallas.
They've only been open sixweeks.
Can you believe it?
Speaker 2 (00:14):
I don't and I can't believe that I played here,
maybe even the first week thatthey opened, and didn't even
know that that was the case.
Oh, that's right.
It was really awesome and thisplace is pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (00:23):
I mean it looks like I'm not sure what do they have?
10 courts One, two, three, four, five I'm trying to count them
but they also have Padel, theyalso have Ping Pong, they also
have vintage video games andthey have a bar.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Oh, that's nice.
Where's the bar?
Do they have Bloody Marys?
Speaker 1 (00:40):
They sell ranch waters here.
I know they're a partner withCasa Amigos.
They said so.
That's always good to know, butthis is a fun one.
We're going to talk to variouspeople throughout the day some
of the organizers, some of theplayers, hopefully a pro or two,
because with the explosion ofthis sport, we were talking to
people last night.
There was three or fourdifferent people.
They're all opening facilities.
(01:01):
I mean, this area is apickleball, facilities are going
to be that's the thing huge andit's here with the heat and all
that did you hear what he wassaying too, about how, for every
400 people who play pickleball,you need an indoor facility
every what no 400.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
A guy last night was saying that he's having to build
another facility 10 minutesfrom one of his facilities just
to, because that's how manypeople, so they know, basically
the critical mass and that's inmaryland, yeah yeah, yeah, and I
think that one thing they'reall finding out it's it's not
like they're hiding theirsecrets or anything, they're all
openly.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Hey, good, good for you, open more facilities,
because there's plenty ofplayers and the demand is crazy.
One day we'll see if thislevels out, but it's certainly
not happening anytime soon.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
That's right.
All right, let's get some morepickleball.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Let's get remote.
Hello Picklers Blazing Paddles,episode 12, marching Forward.
Anybody who's involved inleague play is probably familiar
with an organization called TCDand it stands, ironically
enough, for Tennis Competitorsof Dallas.
And it is quite an importantorganization in the local area.
(02:19):
And we're talking to two ladieshere today, renee Hinterlong
and Lisa Ratcher.
You're going to hear Kareninterview each of them.
We were lucky enough to go tothe Preston Playhouse this last
week and observe and participatein the TCD boot camp for their
members.
Preston Playhouse, unbelievablefacility.
But this is going to be partone of a two-part episode.
(02:39):
We hope you enjoy it.
Let's take a listen.
Saddle up, you'll be glad youdid you enjoy it.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
Let's take a listen, saddle up, you'll be glad you
did.
My name is Renee Hinnerlong andI am the TCD Pickleball
Director.
I actually started the leaguein the fall of 2020 and this
particular event is the secondone we've had and it it's our
end-of-the-season kind of funlittle boot camp that we're
(03:07):
offering our membership andthat's basically what we're
doing and it was such a big hitlast year.
We had over 100 people come andplay with us at the Oasis last
year and it was a big hit.
Everybody was like we want it,keep coming, keep coming.
(03:30):
So we decided because theweather was kind of goofy last
year with this type of year, sowe decided that we were going to
do indoor locations.
It has turned out, obviously.
I thought last night I'm like,yes, make it rain.
You know, this is the reasonthat we're doing it indoor and,
(03:53):
of course, it's a beautiful dayout today, right of course,
that's the way it goes.
We find it really fun that thereare more and more indoor
facilities opening up throughoutthe Metroplex and I know and
I'm just going to name drop herePickleball Kingdom's got
several that are either underconstruction or soon will be.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Last night we were actually at a networking event
where they had, I believe, threepeople that were.
There are building indoorfacilities, so the more.
Yes, so it's coming, and youknow what it's needed, because
the weather in Texas is sounpredictable.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
Well, for one, it's so hot in the summertime and in
the spring you've got the windand the rain, and in the fall
it's hot until like November,and in the fall it's hot until
like November.
So I think this is just a plus,plus for everybody that wants
to play.
Yes, I agree.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
How many ladies?
Speaker 3 (04:57):
Well, we've got two sites and we've got 50 at each
location.
So we're playing here at thePreston Playhouse and then at
DIP, which is down the street alittle bit.
I've never been to DIP.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
I haven't either.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
actually I haven't been to very many of the indoor
facilities.
I don't get out much.
I seem to be behind my computera lot.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
Well, that's no fun.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
This is all kind of new to me too, but it's just
really exciting.
So how did you?
How did you get into?
I have been with TCD for over 30years okay so I started off in
the tennis side, obviously, andI've been on different boards
and in fact, in 2012, when I waspresiding on the tennis board,
(05:43):
my associate director came upwith this idea of playing
pickleball and I remembereverybody on the board was like
just trying to pick the nameapart.
We were like, what is this?
So we actually are in theGuinness Book of World Records
(06:04):
for having the most pickleballplayers playing at one time in
one location, and we ended uphaving this tournament.
We had like over 300 peoplethat came, players come.
We got these two pros fromCalifornia, because that was
(06:24):
really hitting big in California, and so we had these two pros
come and show us how to play andwork with everybody.
We had the Guinness Book ofWorld Records there and it was a
fabulous event.
And you know, up until like 2019, you started to hear more about
it In 2020, I went to my.
(06:45):
I was on the board and I saidall right, I think that we're
going to have a missedopportunity if TCD does not
address the pickleball phenomenathat is going on in this
country.
I mean, and so I got acommittee together.
At that time there were nofacilities.
(07:07):
There was no tennisorganization or pickleball
organization that had leagueslike what I envisioned.
So I worked with a guy.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
You're a visionary.
I'm just going to say you sawthe writing on the wall.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
And it was fun Besides that.
It was just fun.
So, long story short, I gotwith this guy in Arizona and I
talked to him and I kind ofliked his format and I said, all
right, and I got a hold of someplayers that I knew from tennis
and that were starting to play.
(07:48):
You know, back then pickleballwas just played at the
tournaments that you know, theUSA Pickleball, would you know
have?
I got a committee together andI made my team at the time go
out and I'd say, all right,today we're going to do this
format and because I'm not goingto send anybody to a match
(08:09):
unless they can get an hour anda half to two hours of play,
because no one's going to wantto do that, right, so we came up
with a format and we came, youknow, did the rules and bylaws.
You know we did all that set upthe score sheets.
You know I remember going toone of the girls that used to be
on my tennis team she's a realgood player and I said, okay,
(08:37):
ellen.
I said if you were to traveland you were to play another
team, would you like it to beset up the same way that tennis
is that we have tennis, or wouldyou prefer to do a round robin
format and play againsteverybody?
and she said you know, I thinkI'd like to play against
everybody and I said I agreewith you and the other good
thing about that is everybody onyour team really is of equal
(09:00):
talent, because you're not goingto have, like in tennis, you're
not going to have differentlevels of ability and then place
them because you're, the linesare stacked, so you've got one,
two, three.
Usually the line one player isyour are your best players,
right?
So no one wants to play downhere on three, or I guess
(09:20):
they've got four, four, uh, fourlines.
No one's going to be the onethat's at the bottom.
They're going to feel likethey're, you know, not good, you
know.
So anyway, I wanted to get ridof all that drama and so that's
kind of where we came up withthat format.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Interesting that you say the line thing, because I'm
not from tennis, so I and I, asmy captains, were talking about
okay, you're line one, line two.
I didn't ask, I just was like,oh okay.
Speaker 3 (09:48):
No, and it doesn't matter.
In pickleball, no, becauseyou're playing everybody.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Right, exactly that's what I love about it.
I do too.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Well, it makes everybody feel appreciated.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
When they say I'm line three, I'm like, all right,
they think I'm the worst andthen I go out there.
Yeah, no kidding.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
I mean, usually, if I get put on that line, I
probably have the toughest teamto play against, you know Right.
So I'm like, really so but yeah, I think it just keeps growing
and growing every year and we'rejust really excited about it.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
I just think that I mean when do you think it ends,
or where do you think it ends?
I mean now the kids are gettinginvolved.
Our courts, where we live, arejust being inundated with kids
and I love it because it'sgetting them away from their
phones, away from theircomputers, out there, you know,
in the fresh air.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
I feel that I believe my kids are grown and I've got
grandkids, so I mean I'm not inthat environment necessarily
anymore exposed to it that much.
But from what I understand,there's elementary schools and
junior high are introducing itin their gym classes, so I'm
(11:04):
very optimistic that it's justgoing to continue to grow.
I mean, the thing is, tennishas been around for a long time
and I love tennis too, but thisis just like brand new.
This is just something that'sbrand new and it's a challenge
to everybody.
You know they don't have anypreconceived whatever, it's just
fun.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
Yeah, and it seems to be like an easier access into.
For years I had friends thatwere like, oh, you should come
out and join the tennis, but Iwas so I felt like I was too old
, I didn't have the years ofexperience so I was intimidated.
And I don't feel intimidatedwith pickleball and I feel like
that's why it's like an easyaccess or way into a sport.
(11:46):
And the other thing about it isthat you know you can't judge
anyone by the way they look inthis.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Oh, you can't judge anybody by the way they look in
tennis either.
Let me tell you the worstplayers are coming out, the
hardest players are coming outwith all the knee braces and
yeah no, they just know where toplace the ball.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
That's.
That is one of the things, andit's interesting when I play,
you know, I'm a I'm a middle asthe riddle girl because I don't
have the angles from tennis.
I relish it when I I'm playingwith a girl who has the tennis
background, cause I know I canplay the middle safe and she can
.
You know, if I create anopportunity for a put away, they
can get those angles so well,it's really nice.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
And how long?
Speaker 2 (12:28):
have you been playing ?
Well, we were pandemic picklers.
So March of 2020, and they hadtaken down all of the nets and
we set up a pickleball net inthe parking lot of our local
park, bicentennial, bicentennial.
We even have a picture of it.
And then from there it went toplaying in the street, chalking
(12:48):
it off.
And we didn't know, any of therules.
Yeah, we would put the net up.
Car would come, we'd move thenet, put card leave, put the net
back.
We had no idea what kitchen was.
We had no idea what that youcould.
We thought you could servetwice, like in tennis.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
And you didn't even get a start about the scoring.
How long it took.
Speaker 2 (13:07):
Oh yeah, the scoring Okay okay, I agree with you.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
I'm I.
It was hilarious.
Speaker 4 (13:12):
Every time.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
I would have to go up and say the score.
I'm like I know I'm going tomess this up.
I know I am and I typically do,and everybody.
Then you get crazy.
Then you get crazy.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
Yeah.
So then we went to a camp andwe were like, oh dinking, you're
not supposed to just sit at theback and bang away.
And you know, we sustained somany injuries early on from
playing wrong.
But we were having fun, wedidn't care.
We had such a good time thatfirst year because no one was
playing.
We had the courts all toourselves and our group of
(13:43):
friends just would go out forsix and seven hours.
No one was out there, we had nocompetition.
And then more people startedplaying and John still wanted to
play for fun.
And all of a sudden I'm incompetitive mode I'm like I want
to get better.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
Well, when she says John wanted to play for fun, she
said well, you know what's funWinning, Winning is fun.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
Yeah, do you agree with me?
No, I do.
I lean that way in most parts.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Yeah, no, it's Well.
Thank you so much for invitingus out.
Thank you, francine.
Felt very highly of you.
She's a doll.
I love her.
That's the thing aboutpickleball, too is like I have
not met anyone in this sportthat I just don't love.
We all lift each other up, helpeach other out, and I think
it's because it's so early onthat, you know, everyone's
(14:32):
trying to figure this thing out.
There's room for everyone.
You're absolutely right.
I mean the podcast.
There's plenty of them outthere, and I'm sure that'll
continue to grow.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
you know we have an apparel line of pickleball
clothing and that's gonna.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
And when we started, that there was this online.
What's that address?
What uh dinkpro?
You should check us outactually I'm wearing one of them
.
That's really cool, and we?
Our tagline is live love play.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
I love that.
I actually like that.
Yeah, that's.
I was looking at that and Ithought that is such a cute
emoji.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
Isn't it?
That's our mascot, Sluggo.
The whole idea behind him ishe's got the look of
determination in his eye.
He's got a scuff on his cheekbecause when you learn this
sport, you get beat up.
But he's smiling because he'shaving fun.
What is the name of your?
Dinkpro?
Speaker 3 (15:24):
Dinkpro.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Oh, okay, I'm going to look you up.
He's copyrighted.
We started trademarking ourlogo over a year ago.
It took us about I don't know14 months, 15 months, which is a
little bit longer than itnormally takes, but I think it's
because they got inundated witha bunch of pickleball and they
needed to make sure.
But but I think it's becausethey got inundated with a bunch
(15:47):
of pickleball and they needed tomake sure, but we just got our
certification.
Now is this SPF.
Speaker 3 (15:54):
No, I'd have to check on this one, but we do have
other long-sleeve.
I wear long-sleeve because ofthe sun, but I like the SPF so
that I can be out there.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
This one's a little thick, like feel it.
It's a little thicker than so.
You probably wouldn't wear thisin the sunshine.
You'd wear it in the.
It's adorable.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
I love it.
I love your little dude, I lovethat attitude.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
Oh yeah, he's been fun, everyone loves him and
that's why we have the stickers,we have the little buttons for
the end of a paddle and buttonsfor the end of a paddle, and
he's on a lot of our clothes.
Our whole premise was to createa line of clothing that, if
you're a pickleballer, you seeme, you see this, you're gonna
go hey, do you play pickleball?
Now?
This is a unisex.
This is the idea of the stuffthat we have.
I love it.
(16:35):
I'm showing her the weathershirt which says precipitation
10 percent humidity, 39 percentwind, nine miles per hour,
chance of pickleball 100 percent.
Speaker 3 (16:45):
That is adorable and I love that color.
Yeah, this is the.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
UV.
Oh, it is UV.
Speaker 3 (16:52):
Oh, okay, that is so fun.
Is that online now?
Oh, wow, I'm going to go checkyou guys out, you should.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
Well, renee, thanks for talking to us.
We're excited to see what todayis.
Hopefully we get to interviewsome of the players.
Oh, we see there's Ann from ourSouthlake.
There you go, you got to get.
Speaker 3 (17:14):
Lisa over here.
Lisa is our past presiding.
She was the president last year, and so she's a wealth of
information and she's very fun,very bubbly.
Speaker 1 (17:31):
You know, guys, there's not much that's wrong
with pickleball, but there are afew things that can be annoying
, one of which is having ballsthat crack, and if you've been
out there lately, temperaturesdropping, balls are cracking,
they're.
Also.
If you play indoors, or ifyou're playing when the
visibility is not great, thatball gets lost pretty easily in
your eyesight, and we know thatpeople are hitting it harder and
(17:52):
harder.
So you'd like something alittle bit higher visibility.
So we are here to announce ourpartnership with Crown
Pickleball.
In our show notes you'll have alink where you can get a
discount for your first set ofCrown Pickleballs.
I can tell you that they don'tcrack.
They beat the price point ofthe competitors.
They beat the quality of thecompetitors.
So as the temperature gets cold, they beat the price point of
(18:14):
the competitors and they beatthe quality of the competitors.
So as the temperature gets cold, get you some crowns, because
otherwise you're going to have alot of cracked balls, which is
great for my wife's crafts, butnot so great for competitive
play.
Speaker 4 (18:25):
Thank you, my name is Lisa Ratcher.
I am the past presidingdirector for Tennis Competitors
of Dallas, which means last yearI was the presiding director or
the president, and now I am thepast president.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Yes, so tell us, how many years have you been doing
the bootcamp?
Well, I'm sure.
Speaker 4 (18:46):
Renee spoke about pickleball's inception to TCD
was fall of 2020.
And I became.
That was my first.
It was actually everybody'sfirst introduction to pickleball
, really on this scale.
I started a team, so I'm one ofthe original captains.
Yep.
I had a women's team.
I still do.
(19:06):
Some of my players are playingtoday.
How many?
Speaker 3 (19:09):
flights were there.
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 4 (19:11):
Very few, very few and, as a matter of fact, up
until fall of 2023, pickleballwas only being.
What do you say?
Not outshined by tennis but,for lack of better words, by one
team.
So we have six leagues withinour organization.
(19:31):
We have four tennis leagues andthe two pickleball leagues.
So, up until fall of 2023,pickleball was only being
outdone by one team, so it wasfour to two.
Right as of spring 2024,pickleball has taken the leap
and we had way more teams forthe two leagues in pickleball
(19:55):
that are new to the organizationthan we did in tennis.
So it is, if that doesn't tellyou, in and of itself, the
growth of the sport, I don'tknow what does Right.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
Well, I mean all this is pretty unbelievable, isn't
it?
Speaker 4 (20:11):
I mean, just look around these, these are popping
up everywhere and I don't knowhow you were introduced to
pickleball, but I can tell youfor myself we've moved nine
times throughout my marriage andone of the times we lived in
New Jersey and we decided wehave a RV, we decided to go to
Florida and we're at thisincredible RV park and we heard
(20:34):
the noise.
So we're walking around and itwas an RV park where you could,
you know, you had your big RVsand then you could have people
had like little bungalows, sobig retirement community.
We're walking around andthere's these people, elderly
people playing this sport.
So, as a predominant tennisplayer, I said what is this?
(20:55):
And this elderly gentleman saidthis is pickleball.
And so he took my husband and I, who's also a tennis player,
and he said grab some paddlesand let me tell you what this
sport is all about.
Let me show you nice, oh my goshso we've been here seven years,
for Prior to this we were inOhio for four years, so 11.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
So about 14 years ago ?
Wow, really I wish I would havestarted 14 years ago.
Speaker 4 (21:21):
So then we played and we thought it was so cool and
we were there for like anotherfour days and we would go and
you'd sign up.
And we did for four days, had ablast, went back to New Jersey,
told some of my people, haveyou heard of this thing called
pickleball?
And they were like what?
No, what is it?
Tried to tell them and theywere like I had.
I had a really good friend ofmine who actually I made eat
crow a couple of years agobecause she said that'll never
(21:43):
take on.
And I said I don't know, sister, you know it's going to have
something's going to pop withthis.
And sure enough it'sunbelievable, it is.
And now the growth is.
I can't tell you the last timeI actually saw somebody quote,
unquote elderly playing.
Now it's gotten a hold of young, young kids.
This is a sport that really,you know, tennis takes a lot of
(22:06):
money and time to be good.
Pick a ball.
I tell people who are lookingfor teams listen, watch a
YouTube video, get the basicsdown, go out and hit a couple of
times and you're going to beamazing.
And so, and that's that's thething I love about it is that
anybody can play anybody and begood.
Right Tennis, it does.
(22:26):
It takes money and time.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
Yes, I dabbled a little bit.
Just took a couple of lessons,my son all of a sudden decided
never played tennis and decidedin high school oh, I want to
play tennis.
And I'm like, well, you'venever done it before.
So we took a couple of lessonsover a summer and then John and
I tried it together and he gotmad because I could keep the
ball in the court and so he gavehe quit on me.
(22:52):
So when he found pickleball hesaid we got to try the sport.
It looks so fun and I'm likenot another sport that you're
going to quit on me.
Speaker 4 (23:01):
And here we are.
It's amazing.
My husband plays too.
I got my husband to play and myhusband, who is a phenomenal
tennis player he actuallyprefers pickleball over tennis.
Now, and I think that's what'sgoing to happen.
It's so much fun.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
It's like sometimes we're on our pickleball courts
that share a tennis their linefor tennis too, yeah, and we've
got two courts going and we'relaughing, cutting up and no one
looks fancy or anything you know, and then over there you'll
have the I call it like ballet.
Speaker 4 (23:29):
Very serious, very serious.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
The ball, nobody's talking.
Speaker 4 (23:32):
And you know I associate pickleball players to
surfers, Right, they're like hey, dude, come on, join in.
Yes.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
The more the merrier you got music Cool, they're like
skateboarders too.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
How about that Same vibe, right or not?
Skateboarders what do you callit?
Snowboarders?
Yeah, they're all the sameright.
Speaker 4 (23:49):
It's a different vibe .
It's more low-key, a lot moreinclusive, happy, fun.
And don't get me wrong, Tennisis phenomenal.
I love tennis, but it is aserious, very uptight kind of
sport and this vibe is not.
It is a fun.
Let's play music, let's talk.
(24:11):
There's a lot of people goingback and forth, you know, as
tennis players it's.
You know, two people on thecourt or four people on the
court.
Nobody walk around me, Don't dothis, Don't do that.
So I do think that this is sucha more inclusive, happier vibe.
It is.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
When did you get serious about pickleball?
When did you kind of transition, or are you?
Speaker 4 (24:32):
serious.
Like I said, I really likepickleball.
I do, but I still I do playtennis.
I do play.
I have not, do you?
Speaker 2 (24:40):
have a hard time going back and forth.
Speaker 4 (24:42):
I do not.
I find that the pickleball hasmade my tennis better because
those finesse I'm a net player,so those dinking shots, those
finesse shots just make myfinesse at the net better.
Now I don't think that tennismakes pickleball better, because
tennis you want to hit the ballhard and so in this sport it's
(25:02):
a lot more finesse.
You can do hit the ball hard,but you really need to know when
to not hit the ball hard.
So for me, like I said, thishas made my tennis better.
I I love, like I just love theatmosphere, I, I I love the, the
, the amount of people, I likethe, the, the talking, and the
and the, the pace.
(25:23):
And I think the way we haveformatted our leagues with the,
with the round Robin style.
There's no hierarchy, right,there's still that hierarchy in
tennis like oh, you're, you're,you're, you know, line one,
whereas which is silly to me,because line one's two points
aren't any less significant thanline four's two points.
right, two points are two points, but in pickleball everybody
(25:45):
plays everybody.
So that's what I love aboutthat.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
I do too.
I do too.
So what are the instructorsworking on and tell us about the
?
Speaker 4 (25:54):
bootcamp.
For us this is new.
This is the third.
This is actually the secondquote unquote bootcamp.
The first time we had apickleball event and we didn't
have pros there.
Last year we did have pros andwe were at Oasis and the pros
and the pros travel to the women.
And so here at this facility,the pros are traveling to the
(26:17):
women and some courts areworking on serving, Some courts
are working on driving, Somecourts are working on blocking.
So it's a really good way forwomen to leave their facilities,
come to a different facilitiesand get trained by different
pros and open up their eyes toother possibilities to play the
(26:38):
sport.
I love it yes exactly Right,probably next year.
Our calendars are made a yearin advance and so this was on
the docket since last year.
So there will more than likelybe another one next year, and as
this league is growing, we'readding different things as well.
(26:59):
Now I don't know if Renee spokeabout we're doing an indoor
ladies pickleball summer.
Speaker 2 (27:06):
I saw that because I'm into TCD teams.
I'm on the mix.
Okay, perfect, there you go.
Speaker 4 (27:11):
So I don't know if Renee told you, but TCD
pickleball is the largestorganized competitive league
play in the United States.
I did not know that, which meansfor us like okay.
So TCD is one of the largestorganized competitive tennis
leagues in the United States aswell.
I think we're only outshined byAlta, which is in Atlanta, and
(27:35):
the only reason why Altaoutshines us is because they
have a junior league and asenior league and there's this
Monday through Friday, whereashere in Texas we compete with
USTA, and so you know we kind ofdivide up the seasons TCD has
spring and fall and USTA haspretty much summer and winter.
For us, this TCD pickleball isthe largest organized league
(28:00):
play, not tournaments, right,you can find big tournaments,
but this is league play that isorganized every week with
seasons, with traveling teams.
So that's pretty amazing in andof itself.
Speaker 2 (28:14):
It really is, and I think I find it really fun
because you're traveling alittle bit farther, so you're
getting.
You know, I'm very familiarwith all the ladies in that
right but because they're insurrounding areas and a lot of
them play at the same places.
So with TCD it's cool becausewe get to go to other facility
farther away, meet new peopleand experience different skill
(28:37):
levels.
It's interesting.
I think we're in flight threein TCD and we were flight one in
net Okay, and we just won ourTCD women's.
We came in first.
Speaker 4 (28:50):
Okay, so you got first place, so you'll be moving
up.
Yes, yes.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
Which is scary and fun all together.
Speaker 4 (28:56):
Yes, it is.
It's challenging right.
I mean that's our, it's in ourname competitors, so we.
There has been a little bit ofa growing pains when it comes to
placement because we're taking,when we, when we accept new
teams.
There's a litany of paperworkthat you have to fill out, and
so it.
you know that's very detailed.
Do you have a duper rating?
Do you have a?
Have you played in tournaments?
(29:17):
How often do you play?
Do you seek pros?
Do you do you take lessons frompros?
You know we don't havepickleball, what it's neglecting
.
So somebody out there shouldreally start almost like an
official rating, like a duper,but duper is only if you play
tournaments.
So somehow, or another duper orsomebody else needs to come up
with a concept of a USTA towhere you can get your rating
(29:41):
and it's a solid rating, so thatwhen we go to place you in a
team, we have something that'sreally concrete For us.
We're taking a mixture ofpredominant USTA right tennis.
However, we have found that ifyou're a high tennis player,
you're probably going to be ahigh pickleball player, but
that's not always the case.
So there's been some growingpains of new teams coming in and
(30:04):
being placed maybe below wherethey should, and then they start
to raise up, but it takes awhile.
And then they start to raise up, but it takes a while.
Now we're finding in the ladiesleagues of pickleball it is
starting to clean itself up andwe're getting people where they
should be and making itcompetitive, because none of us
want to show up to a match andbe blown out in five minutes or
(30:27):
10 minutes right.
I mean we play the round robinstyle, but if you've got a team
that is just so much better thanit really doesn't take, you
know, 30 minutes for them toblow you out 11-0 or 11-2 or
11-3.
So we are in.
Ladies, it is finally gettingto be your where you need to be
mixed.
We're still having a little bitof hiccups, and we still may
(30:49):
have that, because the leaguesare growing so much that we are
only able to place people basedon the information we're given.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
Yeah, and also I mean just from my experience.
I have a friend of mine whohe's like she's a good
pickleballer, he's exceptional.
So there's a huge variancebetween them, their skill levels
, but they're on the same team.
So that's where I think it'sgoing to be harder with duper.
We tried it as a club duringrec play and it was did not work
(31:21):
.
So I agree with you 100, evenfor tournaments, it's not
working.
I mean, there's so muchsandbagging.
That's why I want to dotournaments, but I'm not doing
until that gets worked out forsure, right, because it's a
waste of money.
Speaker 4 (31:33):
It can be a little humiliating, right, like you.
Somebody shows up and you're,you're, you're, you're rating a
3-0.
So you play a 3-0, but you'rereally playing a 4-5.
Who can be a 3-0?
Because the duper you know sothat it is, it can be.
It can be very demoralizing.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
Oh we, the last that John and I did, and I think it
was the Texas Open, I can'tremember, but that's the one
where it was like the writing'son the wall.
Here we were playing against alady.
She may have been a true threebetween three, five and four,
but playing in three Right.
And then she had a guy who was5-0 playing and I'm like I paid
(32:09):
all that money to play threegames and then we're out.
Speaker 4 (32:11):
And it does, like I said, it's demoralizing, right?
Like you come with really thebest of intentions and you want
to have fun and when thathappens, you're like, oh, that
wasn't really any fun and itmakes you less likely to enter
another tournament, just likeyou're saying.
You're like I'm not going to doit, I'm going to wait for a
minute.
Which is why I think TCD isphenomenal, because it gives you
that league play on a weeklybasis to satiate the need of
(32:35):
competitive fun play.
I do not play in any tournaments.
I will tell you, I did play inone and it was the same thing
and I thought why.
It was a lot of money, you know, like $150.
And it was one and done becausethe weather.
They had to change the formatbecause the weather was really
bad, and so it was a one anddone and you're like, okay, wait
a minute and then come to findout and I'm not the kind of
(32:56):
person who researches and, oh mygosh, she's really a five.
Oh, you know, I, to me, anybodycan win on any given day, right
, but when, when there's thatbig of a discrepancy, you know
Like, come on, you know.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
Are you really having fun?
That's right, you're going toenjoy your gold medal, that's
right, you know seriously, We'llget you the gold medal.
Speaker 4 (33:15):
But I mean, how great was that for you?
Speaker 2 (33:18):
No, not at all.
Yes, yes, so it'll be a while,but that's what I'm loving.
I mean, tell us about thesummer one.
Well, that's new.
Speaker 4 (33:32):
So it's, it's called, it's going to be, it's an
indoor, uh summer.
It's only five weeks.
It starts May 31st and it ends,uh, whatever, the last Friday
in June is.
You know, we, we felt that, uh,there, we, all of these
facilities, also Texas heat,right, we, we don't want these
ladies out there.
It just gets at 109 degrees.
It's crazy.
(33:52):
We've actually changed some ofour tcd rules for extreme
weather temps, how heavy we have.
So to protect the ladies andwith all, to utilize some of
these great facilities, um, we,we renee, put forth an indoor
summer league and, uh, there'sthree flights.
I think there's a flight one, aflight two and a flight three.
Uh, there's facilitiesthroughout the Metroplex.
(34:12):
I'm playing out of McKinney.
There's DIP there's.
Who else is playing?
Mckinney's got some DIP.
Speaker 2 (34:23):
What about Frisco?
Speaker 4 (34:25):
Frisco?
No, allen, I don't think any.
Of the lifetime facilities?
No, I don't think so, but it'son our website, right?
So all the information is there, the teams are formed and
they're getting ready to startin just a few weeks, exciting.
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Very exciting, yes, and what a way to beat the Texas
heat by playing indoors,absolutely Especially right now,
for whatever reason.
The last two summers, thehumidity, the dew, point is
extremely.
It's hard to breathe.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
summers, the humidity the dew point is extremely it's
hard to breathe, it is, it'skiller.
Speaker 2 (34:52):
In my match the other day I felt like I was getting
lightheaded.
I thought I was by my eighth orsixth game.
I was seeing stars.
Speaker 4 (34:59):
Well, you know, I'm a I'm a certified paramedic and I
can't tell you how many timesas not only a tennis player, but
a pickle player that I've beena pickleball player I've been
called to courts to help withheat exhaustion.
Speaker 2 (35:09):
Oh really.
Speaker 4 (35:10):
So it's a thing, and I think, having the availability
to come indoors who wouldn'twant that?
And I think, if you think abouthow awesome this could be, we
expand to winter as well, right,because people want to play
more and you're just giving themthe opportunity to do just that
.
Speaker 2 (35:28):
It is such a bummer when I get up.
I got up early yesterdaymorning.
I'm like, okay, we havepractice, ladies practice, we
practice on Mondays andThursdays, and so I get up
earlier on those days to beready and get out there and we
got two games.
We went one and a half game inand we had to vacate the courts
and that just ruins my whole daybecause that's my exercise, and
then I didn't close my rings.
(35:49):
I'm all mad, yeah, but you know, like so and I do think.
Speaker 4 (35:54):
I think, with this sport in particular, it affords
that right.
Like I don't, I don't ever seeus doing indoor tennis because
there's not enough of those.
Well, there's severalfacilities, but there's, so
there's, you know, 8,000 peopleso you can accommodate.
And, uh, I don't ever see TCDbecoming an indoor kind of a
(36:18):
league.
But the affordability forpickleball at the smaller sizes
and how it's, there's so manymore that are opening up, why
not?
Speaker 2 (36:25):
Let me ask you this so do you and your husband play
together?
We?
Speaker 3 (36:29):
do I love it.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
John and I are very, very few, like of the very few
couples that we find.
We call it pickle divorce.
Speaker 4 (36:36):
A lot of people you know, we've been married 34
years and have been througheverything, and so I were.
You know, I don't thinkpickleball is gonna gonna break
us, and my husband has got avery, very chill attitude.
He's like you know, although Iam more competitive, but his
thing is, you know, listen,listen, somebody's got to win
and somebody's got to lose.
I'm like you're right, but itain't going to be us, babe.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
You know that's what you and I are.
Okay, we're the same.
John wants to play for fun.
I said winning is fun.
Speaker 4 (37:04):
I don't mind losing right, as long as it's a good
match.
Speaker 3 (37:09):
If that's a competitive match, then that's
awesome.
Speaker 4 (37:12):
But again, if I'm blown out or I knew I could have
played better, or God forbidhe's off or whatever, Right, Um,
but I always said, because Ihave, I have a mixed pickleball
team and a mixed tennis team andI said if I could get up either
team with all married couples,I'd call us divorce court.
I have, I have a couple on mytennis team who God bless them
the nicest people, but she'sintense and every single match
(37:37):
that they play, as soon as theyget off the court he goes hey,
everybody, guess what?
We're still married, you know.
And uh, so there's been some,you know, some, some, some
firecrackers and I'm on my mixedteam Now I have a couple of
firecracker people to where oneof my female players has said
you know, we don't always haveto play together because you
know the ride home can be reallyhard sometimes.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
I wish John was have in on this conversation right
now, but uh, yeah, he, uh, we,we felt all those pains we
actually almost got.
Oh no, but we fought.
Oh, no, oh no, but we foughtthrough.
We gave ourselves a timeline.
It was a tournament and I thinkit was the Texas Open.
And boy I'll tell you whatAfter that defeat.
(38:22):
It was so bad and it was so hotthat day.
I remember, just coming home, Iwas just drenched and there's a
picture of me just sittingthere with my hands on my head
and and I was like gosh, if Iwas going to lose I wouldn't
want to lose with anyone but?
Speaker 4 (38:33):
him.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
And that was kind of like what the turning point was,
and it's been a long learningcurve for us to get to where you
know, saying anything doesn'tset the other person off and for
sure.
I mean, a couple of weeks ago wewere out there playing and
whatever reason.
It got a little hot and backand forth and I, I called time
(38:54):
and I walked off the court andhe's like, what are you doing?
You're embarrassing.
I'm like, we're not.
I'm not going on there until wefigure this out.
We got a timeout Cause I, we'refor sure, and I have to say I
don't know about you.
Speaker 4 (39:04):
Like you say each other.
I will say in full, you know,full transparency.
It's usually me snipping at himBecause he's like, like I said,
his attitude is just so chill,but I know, and he is the
consummate gentleman.
So we all say, listen, she's theweaker player, let's hit to her
, or I'll use the terrible wordlet's hit at her.
(39:26):
And he's like I will never hitat her.
I said, ok, let's just hit toher.
I'm not meaning to, I don'twant you to hurt her.
Yeah, I don't want you tothrottle her.
But you know like just more ofthe shots should go her way.
And it usually you know and andand and.
Sometimes it is a man who'swho's not.
You know she's the superstarand I'll be like let's, you know
, let's aim the ball at him.
(39:47):
No, he just he has the and heis from California, so we'll
give him the, the surfersnowboard attitude.
It's all cool, whatever.
And at the end you know whathe's really right.
He is right because it is justfor fun.
And at the end of the, at theend of the thing, as long as it
(40:08):
was fun and whatever I can, Ican let it go.
Speaker 2 (40:12):
And because I don't have tennis and my tennis girls
that are in my pickleballleagues help me with this.
But I don't tend to look at thepeople I'm playing against and
pick out their weaknesses, andthat's so new to me and they all
do it.
They're like, hey, this one'sstronger.
And then I'm like, but to me,and I got to get better at it.
(40:35):
But I mean, I'm trying to makethe best shot, I think for sure,
and so I don't know if I'mdoing it right or not.
I just I know that, um, I, I,if I have too much in my head, I
can't.
I think there's a lot ofthinking.
To pick a ball, it's a mentalgame, it's strategic.
Speaker 4 (40:52):
And so I think in tennis, right, and you got to
think, in tennis you have a lotmore time actually to get more
points right, like pickleball ispretty quick, so you have to
really glean a lot ofinformation pretty quickly.
And I think that the tennis hashelped because you know like I
always look okay, are theylefties?
Okay, put it where theirforehand is, are they?
(41:14):
Is their backhand weak, right,that kind of thing Are they?
Is their backhand weak, right?
That kind of thing Are they?
Do they?
Are they fast, are they?
Although that can bite you inthe, in the butt, because I
remember when my first tennismatches years and years ago, my,
my real good friend and I hadfinally been asked to be on a
team and our first matchesagainst these elderly women, and
(41:35):
I swear to you they had everybrace that you could have Wrist
brace, elbow brace, knee brace,ankle brace, I mean every brace
you could have and I thought Iwent up to my partner I said, oh
, this is a slam dunk.
We were young, I was a latetennis boomer, so I was early
40s.
I'm like we got this, we're inshape.
(41:59):
We got it those women mopped thecourt with us.
They, they had full regaliamakeup on.
One of them even stopped to putsome powder on and redo her her
lipstick.
We were drenched in sweat, wewere I mean, we were like
huffing, we could barely breathe.
These women were just, you know, put talk about strategic right
, and so then that made meappreciate listen, it's not
(42:19):
really what you look like, howold you are, whatever.
It's about how smart of aplayer you are, and that's where
the strategy comes in.
And some of those cues of youknow her backhand is worse or
you know whatever, picking up onthose Because, like I said, you
have a finite amount of time tobring in these points and you
can't, you can't go down a setand go like, okay, this, I got
(42:41):
it, all the information, it'sdone.
So I do think that that is animportant part of this game is
is is some, you know,strategizing?
Oh for sure.
Speaker 2 (42:51):
First, there were a lot of bangers for sure, for
sure.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
Tennis players absolutely.
Speaker 2 (42:54):
And now our teams are rising to a level where you're
about 60, 40 maybe, and thehigher you get in the flights,
the more the soft game comesinto play, and so that's really
what we've been working on andfinally coming together, because
John would love to just wailaway at the ball, my husband too
(43:14):
.
And I'm like the smarter shot isto drop it.
We can't ever win.
And now, playing againstbangers, we're winning because
we're taking their ability tokeep us back.
Be on the defense the wholetime.
I'm never going to haveputaways, like some of my tennis
(43:37):
, ladies that are in pickleball.
I mean just don't, I don't have.
Speaker 4 (43:40):
My, my.
I have a pretty regular partneron my ladies team and we've got
a really good marriage on thecourt.
She, she's, really, we balanceeach other out.
She is a like a gazelle, superfast, incredibly athletic, smart
player.
She likes to hit the ball hardtoo.
So I balance her out because Ican tell her, you know, like,
(44:01):
just think it right, and I can.
We're side by side and I'll,you know, and, and her first
instinct will be I'm going todrive it and then she'll hear me
and she'll, she'll slow it downand she's just she's.
She's got such an amazing courtpresence and, like I said,
she's incredibly fast and smart.
But she wants to sometimes hitit too hard too, and I've got
(44:24):
the ability to do those softerthings or to slow it down, and
then I'll tell her, I'll look ather and I'll say boom.
And she knows what that means.
It means put that ball away.
Speaker 3 (44:34):
And you know what I'm like boom and she just does it.
Speaker 4 (44:39):
That's great, that is , put that ball away and you
know, boom and she just does it.
So you know that that is a goodthing too is to have you do.
You can't have two bangers andyou can't have two people that
are sweepers or or, or soft, oryou need the, the, the mixture
of both.
You do, and then you need to beable to be a banger when you
need to be to put that ball awayand she needs to be able to
soften up, and vice versa, rightyes, yes, yes.
Speaker 2 (44:59):
I love the boom thing .
Mine is get them and I, andsometimes I say I, I say get her
and I don't mean the person.
Yes, I'm in the ball and I andI.
Speaker 4 (45:09):
When I say it, I'm like I don't mean you I don't
mean you, you know, and sheepthey know as well they do they
have.
Hopefully they know as well.
Right, I mean, or pretty soon,we'll all start wearing bubble
wrap.
Speaker 2 (45:21):
I call John the Paul, so I'm saying I'll create the
opportunity.
My philosophy is if it's flying, it's dying.
That means, if it's in the air,you better kill it.
Speaker 4 (45:32):
There you go.
That's why I say boom, and sheknows what that means.
What's your favorite shot?
There you go.
That's why I say boom, and sheknows what that means.
What's your favorite shot?
For me, my favorite shot is I'm, like I said, I'm a net player
in tennis, so to me, to being atthat kitchen line and I'm the
backhand, just that little shortshot that it just goes.
You know, like it's so angled.
(45:53):
Yeah, that it, you know.
Speaker 2 (45:57):
And it just is, it's ungettable and it's from your
backhand.
Yeah, Nice, and I'm aone-handed backhander.
Speaker 4 (46:02):
I'm in tennis and pickleball.
But my partner, my female, mylady's partner I told you she is
a two-handed backhand.
She really, for her she feelslike it's got more power and
it's got more precision.
And for me I'm so used tohaving the big stick of a tennis
racket in my hand that havingthat little paddle makes that
(46:22):
shot even more precise.
Speaker 2 (46:25):
It's weird.
I was a two-handed backhand intennis and then, for whatever
reason, I wasn't in pickleballinitially, and then all of a
sudden it's just it's evolvedinto that I feel so much more
control dinking my backhand.
Dink, when I have my, my lefthand there, it's like I have
more control, I can get thatsharper.
(46:46):
We've been working on dinking alot because that is where we
were getting beat and it's madea huge difference.
Speaker 4 (46:51):
And then when you're dinking, to have that one person
, uh know when to speed it up.
That is the precision of thatright, you've got the dinking
and it's just you've got itgoing, but then when do you
speed it up?
To pass that by that?
To me, that's what we'reworking on.
Speaker 2 (47:10):
I'm working on that too.
I'll get in a little dinkbattle sometimes and I'm like I
could have taken that one.
I could have taken that one, Icould have taken it.
But it's almost like I have tothink, because it doesn't happen
as often, If every single gamewe got into a dink match because
, like I said, we're still inthat tweener where we still have
bangers that aren't droppingand aren't getting into dink
(47:32):
battles.
They speed everything up andnow with the paddle technology.
I swear you know how they usedto say red light yellow, light
green light.
I'm like that was, that was ared light and you still got it
over.
How'd that happen?
John was so excited at our lastmatch because he was like did
you see how many dink battles Igot into?
Well, um, we're excited to behere.
I mean, this was a great invite.
We knew francine.
(47:52):
We met her from.
Uh, where did oh what?
She bought one.
So we have an apparel line.
She bought one of our shirts.
We have a milk shirt.
It says man, I Love Pickleball.
Speaker 1 (48:01):
Okay, oh, that's cool .
Speaker 2 (48:07):
We designed it for men and then women started
buying it and we thought that'shilarious.
When I wear this shirt, you getdouble taste?
Speaker 4 (48:15):
Oh for sure, yes, yes , yes, yes, Right, People are
like wait, wait what Is shewearing?
Speaker 2 (48:19):
So Francine bought one.
It was at a Chicken and Pickleevent, a dink drinking demo
night at Chicken and Pickle, andthen from there we just kind of
connected and she came on ourpodcast.
Speaker 4 (48:30):
And I just love her.
Speaker 2 (48:37):
She's a Good spirit.
There's not anyone in.
Speaker 4 (48:38):
Pickleball that I don't love.
Come to think of it me either.
Speaker 1 (48:40):
Yeah, they are good people.
They are good people you aswell.
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (48:42):
Thanks for having us out.
Yeah, we were an HR podcastthat turned Pickleball.
Speaker 4 (48:49):
I love it.
You know what?
Find your market baby, I loveit.
That's great.
Well, thank, I love it wellthank you again.
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If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.