December 1, 2024 • 32 mins
In this inspiring episode of Bleeding Daylight, host Rodney Olsen sits down with Michelle Nezat, the host of the More Than a Song podcast and author of "A Seat at the Table". Michelle shares her deeply personal journey of faith, tracing the roots of her biblical knowledge back to her grandparents who instilled in her a love for Scripture from a very young age. Through her experiences with Bible quiz competitions, mentorship, and a desire to help others connect with God's word, Michelle developed a passion for revealing the deeper biblical foundations behind Christian music lyrics.
The conversation explores Michelle's unique approach to engaging with Scripture, emphasizing the importance of seeing the Bible as God's unified story rather than a self-help manual. She discusses her podcast, which has over 500 episodes exploring the biblical roots of popular Christian music, and her novel, which aims to introduce people to the God of the Bible in an accessible and compelling way. Michelle passionately advocates for developing biblical literacy, encouraging listeners to start with God, understand His holiness, and view Scripture as a revelation of who God is, rather than focusing solely on personal application.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:08):
Wherever there are shadows, there are people ready to kick at the darkness until it bleeds daylight.
This is Bleeding Daylight with your host, Rodney Olsen.
Welcome, I'm so pleased you're listening.
Bleeding Daylight is on social media platforms such as Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, Blue Sky and others.
(00:30):
Links are at bleedingdaylight.net where you'll also find dozens of other episodes.
Please leave a five-star review for Bleeding Daylight on your favourite podcast platform.
Are you a fan of music?
Do you find hope and significance in song lyrics?
(00:51):
Today's guest has delved into the deeper meaning of hundreds of songs.
Have you ever found yourself singing along to Christian music but wishing you could connect the lyrics to deeper Biblical truths?
(01:11):
Do you long to develop a more meaningful relationship with Scripture but aren't sure where to start?
Michelle Nysad is the host of the More Than a Song podcast with over 500 episodes exploring the Biblical foundations behind popular Christian music lyrics.
She's also an author and her first novel is titled A Seat at the Table.
(01:32):
Everything she does displays her desire to meet people exactly where they are in their faith journey.
I'm so pleased to have her as my guest today, Michelle.
Welcome to Bleeding Daylight.
It's a delight to be here.
Thank you for having me.
Your faith story goes back a very long way.
Tell me about the influence that your grandparents had on you in those early years.
(01:53):
Yeah, my grandparents were instrumental in my faith.
They became Christians as adults.
When my mom came up pregnant in her early 20s, they said, come, come, come, we'll help you.
So I actually lived in their home for the first few years of my life.
Some of my earliest memories would be to crawl up into bed with them, and they would read the Bible, and I'd be learning how to read.
(02:17):
And so I would learn to read by reading with them from the Bible, going to church with them, and learning the things of the Lord from them and their stories.
And I just don't ever remember a time when I didn't love Jesus, and that was because of them.
And such a rich heritage passed down to you.
I'm sure they were very pleased to see you following that way as well.
(02:38):
Yes, I believe so.
My grandfather passed before I entered my sophomore year of college, and then my grandmother just passed a couple of years ago.
And so I wish they could read the book.
I wish Papa could have heard the podcast and some of the things that have come out of that rich heritage.
But it is definitely a legacy for sure, and it all stems from a love of God's Word.
(03:00):
Brian Schneider had a big influence in your biblical knowledge too, didn't he?
Right, good old Brian.
Well, I had the opportunity, the pleasure to be a part of a church where we did Bible quiz.
In Bible quiz, you would memorize entire books of the Bible—in the King James Version, by the way—then compete by quoting it, answering questions.
(03:23):
It was a quiz setting.
You had to buzz in and try to beat your neighbor.
I did Bible quiz from year to year, and I've kind of dabbled in it.
But there was one year that I said, I'm going to really do this thing.
And because to be really, really good at Bible quiz, you just had to actually memorize everything.
You couldn't just sort of study it.
You had to really commit it to memory so that you were confident that when the question was asked, you could buzz in quickly because you knew you knew all the answers.
(03:49):
That year, I was really committed to learning.
The year was Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, and Philemon because they were all short books of the Bible.
And my ultimate goal was to beat Brian Schneider.
It was not a holy goal, I have to admit.
However, here's what happened on the other side.
I learned Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, and Philemon in the King James Version.
(04:15):
He really was better than me, but he didn't know that I knew that.
And so it was a friendly competition.
Most times, I do have this wonderful memory of my Bible quiz coach.
We had gotten into an argument, and it was literally from the Scripture that we were studying how we needed to forgive one another as Christ forgave us.
(04:36):
And she was like, what does Scripture call for?
And we forgive one another as Christ forgave us.
And it was in there, and it came out in really practical ways.
But I will tell you what, though, that laid this huge foundation.
I mean, not only did I learn how to read the Bible from birth practically, and then I had this just strong foundation of biblical knowledge.
(04:56):
My grandfather and I would have conversations.
He loved Scripture.
And so he would say, okay, you go read Acts, and I'll read Acts.
And then we'll talk about the differences between church today and the early church that we see being developed in Acts.
And so we would have these kinds of conversations.
So just a love of Scripture and then just a foundation of Scripture in my life set me up, I think, for what would end up happening.
(05:21):
I mean, I taught Sunday school and things like that, but I think everything really shifted for me when I started the podcast and then honestly shifted again kind of mid-podcast as I met different believers in my life that challenged me and caused me to go a little bit deeper.
Of course, there's a big difference between knowing about Scripture and memorizing it and knowing what's in the Bible and it becoming a part of your life and that relationship that we hear about so often with Jesus.
(05:47):
So when did that happen for you?
Was that very early on as you sat with your grandparents, or was that a little bit later that it became so real to you?
For me, it was very early on.
I have a biological father, but I did not grow up with a father.
I don't know who he is.
My grandfather was a father figure.
(06:07):
I had youth pastors throughout the years that were father figures, but I believed the Scripture when it said that he was my father.
He was at every game and every award ceremony, and he never failed me.
And so from very early on, I never really wavered from that.
I believed it.
I tried to walk it out.
Of course, you have confusion and doubts and things like that along the way, but I never doubted my faith and who I was in Christ.
(06:35):
Kind of like, what direction do I go?
Who am I in Christ?
Those kinds of questions.
There was a time, I think, when it was real popular for people with really good testimonies.
I'm using air quotes.
I know it's a podcast, but where you were just down in the dumps or in deep sin, and you come out of that.
I remember there was a time when I was a teenager thinking, I don't have a good testimony.
(06:56):
I can't remember if it was my grandfather or one of the spiritual advisors in my life at the time just said, no, no, no.
Yours is the best testimony.
It's a keeping testimony, and it reminds people around you that God is a keeping God.
If you will follow Him, He will keep you.
That's really been the testimony of my life.
A love of Scripture, yes, sprinkled in.
(07:16):
I will say that there was this turning point when I was a young woman.
I was married, no kids yet.
We had an older women, younger women program at church where we were paired up with some older women.
A friend of mine, Dana, and I were paired up with Tamara.
She was trying to get to know us early.
Kind of a conversation like this, tell me about your past, whatever.
She said, girls, tell me about your Bible reading and your prayer time.
(07:40):
We were like, well, we read our Bibles periodically.
Sometimes we do Bible studies, things like that.
She's like, you're telling me you don't read your Bible every day.
We said, no, ma'am.
She's like, that's non-negotiable.
We just jumped back a little bit.
I would say that that was probably one of the strongest turning points in my faith and in my dedication to God's Word.
(08:05):
Then I realized that as I was helping or working with other young women my age, they didn't really know what to do with the Bible.
They didn't know how to read the Bible.
They didn't have the foundation that I had.
They didn't have the Bible knowledge.
We could have a conversation and I would say, oh, I think it's over there in such and such a story or whatever.
They just didn't have the foundation that the Lord had blessed me with.
(08:26):
That kind of began my journey into figuring out how can I help meet people where they are so that they can step into it without feeling condemnation.
I hated the shame that you could feel around that.
Just the shame of I should know more about this and I don't.
Then I'm just not really going to engage with it at all.
I just say it's today.
I had an advisor one time say, it's today.
(08:47):
Just look forward today and let's see where we can get closer to the Lord from this moment on.
Pete And it's interesting you mention that shame of not knowing and that idea that we really should be reading the Bible every day.
That can become a very legalistic thing for some people.
They say, oh no, but I don't want it to be legalistic.
(09:09):
Yet we do know, we have seen the information that tells us that if we do engage with the scriptures, actually our spiritual life will grow.
How do we bridge that gap between this thinking, oh look, it's just a tick the box kind of thing that we must read scripture every day and to get to that place where that scripture reading actually informs and guides us in what we're doing?
(09:33):
I liken it to building a foundation.
Brick by brick, you're laying a layer of knowledge.
I think what happens sometimes is we jump straight to what does the Bible mean to me, which is a question you should never ask.
You can ask what does it mean and how can I apply it or how should I respond, but it can't mean something to you that it doesn't mean.
(09:55):
Bible knowledge, literacy, biblical literacy is a buzzword kind of in the world today.
Brick by brick, you read those stories for yourself.
You read the text for yourself and you begin to build this foundation that gives you kind of that solid standing point to then build on top of it.
What does it mean?
You can begin to explore deeper things like theology and doctrine and some of the words that, to be honest, I remember there was a time as knowledgeable as I was about the Bible that I would hear a sermon and some guy would say something about theology or doctrine.
(10:27):
I didn't know what that meant.
So it went over my head and I just let it go.
I didn't think it was very applicable to me.
I truly believe that if you will meet the Lord in His revealed word, He has revealed Himself to us.
In my novel, I really try to kind of bring out this idea through a story that the main character, Joy, has set aside reading her Bible.
(10:48):
She knew it was good and she just didn't think anything of it.
She didn't even have shame over it.
It just wasn't a part of her daily life, even though she would say, I'm a Christian.
But this idea that the Lord will meet you in there and He has revealed Himself to you.
And so she's sitting there.
I want direction.
I want guidance.
I need these things from the Lord.
The spiritual guide in the story says, so maybe you go to where He has revealed Himself.
(11:13):
So I think a lot of the things that I try to do with my listeners and then also my readers of my book is to kind of start with a different starting point.
We often start with ourselves.
How can it help me?
I encourage you to start with God.
Start with God.
It's a story about Him.
It's not a story about us.
We're in there.
We're part of His story, but it's a story about Him.
Start with God.
What do you see?
(11:34):
And then He's your creator and you are made in His image.
So the more you look at Him, the more you can see what you're supposed to look like.
And so when you see things that you see in Him, in you, that's Him.
Right?
So He is the God of love.
He's created you to be able to love when you love sincerely.
That is your creator being reflected.
(11:55):
You are reflecting your creator.
Just to kind of bring it back around, just this foundation, this knowledge.
He can meet you there when you enter into that space where He has said, this is where I've revealed myself to you.
And if it becomes a checkbox, if it becomes legalistic, then here's what you do.
You just pray, God, help me change my heart as it relates to how I relate to scripture.
(12:18):
Change my heart that I would enter it in a different mindset, in a different light.
And then of course, just change up how you interact with scripture.
If the way that you're doing it is not working, try a different way.
I talk about Bible interaction tool exercises all the time on my podcast, and I kind of tucked them into my book too.
But how do you interact with God's word that might help bring it to life?
(12:40):
Because it is the source.
That is where you meet your living hope.
I've heard of people refer to the Bible as an instruction manual or as a life guide.
And yet what you've brought out is something far more important in that that is where we meet Jesus in the pages of the scripture.
This is how God has revealed himself to us.
(13:02):
And I think that so often people miss that, that this is not just reading for the sake of reading, reading for the sake of knowledge, but it is actually where we meet God.
How important is that for people to realize?
Well, I think it's fundamentally important.
I think it changes the starting point from how you view scripture.
(13:22):
So if you're picking up a story and you're trying to figure out how it applies to your life versus you're picking up a story and you learn, can you learn from someone else's story?
Sure.
I've picked up a memoir and read someone else's story and said, wow, the thing that they learned there, I needed to know too.
And I can really learn from that.
(13:43):
But I never for once thought that that story was about me.
I don't pick up a story about someone else and say that it's about me.
Again, just a perspective shift to realize that this is God's story.
And it's a unified story, which that I really honestly never fully understood or was ever taught.
(14:04):
Probably in the last seven years, I have understood the meta-narrative, the big story that from Genesis through Revelation, there's a red thread of redemption woven throughout.
I had kind of always known that, but to realize that God was telling a story across all of history to point to our Savior, Jesus Christ.
(14:27):
Well, then you begin to read those stories differently.
We have a children's Bible, the Jesus Storybook Bible.
I highly recommend it even for adults, because one of the things that it says is every story whispers His name.
And so it tells all of
these very familiar Old Testament and New Testament Bible stories, but it reminds the reader
that every story is whispering the name of Jesus, that every account, every twist and turn is
(14:53):
pointing ultimately to Jesus Christ as our Savior who came and He lived a sinless life, and He died,
and He resurrected on the third day, and He ascended, and He is sitting next to our Father,
and He's mediating, and He will return for us.
So are we part of this story?
A hundred percent.
His story becomes our story, but it's not our story first.
(15:15):
If you're reading every story in the Bible looking for Jesus, instead of reading every story in the Bible looking for how you can apply it to your life, I guarantee you that if you do that today, your perspective, your experience with God's Word will change even just today.
There does seem to be a trend in a lot of churches where they are pointing towards what's in it for me.
(15:38):
They are pointing towards this is a book about you and how your life could be better.
We miss so much when we do that and miss the majesty of God, don't we?
When we try to make it about ourselves, we can so often come up thinking it's not quite meeting the need.
Yet when we see that it's about this God who loves us, this God who held nothing back for us, that's so much more satisfying than when we've gone to look for a story about ourselves, isn't it?
(16:09):
There's a psalm that says, I am beautifully and wonderfully made, and I can't run from you, and all this other stuff.
In my novel, there's a scene where Joy's main character is meeting with her friend Beth, who's a strong Christian.
She had gone to a church, like you just mentioned, that was really kind of like a TED Talk sermon.
It's all about you.
Take charge of your life.
You are powerful, all this kind of stuff.
(16:31):
She's bubbly and talking about the sermon and what she learned and all this other stuff.
Beth goes, Yeah, I kind of always thought that was a psalm about God.
Joy doesn't get it, but I hope the reader does and goes and pulls out that psalm and re-reads it to realize it's a God who makes us.
We are wonderfully made because He is wonderful.
(16:53):
His creation is good because He is good.
We've made ourselves the hero of the story.
Even in David and Goliath, are we the David?
Are we the ones flinging the stones?
No, we're the crazy, scared Israelites hiding in the tents and afraid.
What is the story really about?
(17:13):
God, who's bigger than the giant, bigger than the evil that is in the world.
Because another thing that you're going to see in the Word of God is that He is holy.
The more you look at His holiness, the more you see your own sin.
Because you realize the more you look and gaze at the holiness of God, then you realize how sinful you really are.
(17:35):
I'm going to bring this before you, Lord.
I'm going to bring you my offering and you realize why it's called Filthy Rags because He is so holy.
Does that bring shame?
No, because that holy God has invited us to be cleansed by Him, washed in the water of the Word, so to speak, cleansed by Him, to be beautified by Him, to be declared not guilty, to be declared righteous because of the righteousness of His Son.
(18:00):
All of these things are still true.
All of these TED Talk people that really just want to point to you and talk about you and see how great you are.
It's so interesting because when you gaze at the Lord, you get both.
You get Him and a right view of who He is.
Then you get a right view of yourself.
When that happens, He gets even bigger and the grace becomes even more profound.
(18:27):
Then you can walk in obedience to Him.
Then my question, how can you say that the Bible is God's Word, but you don't read it?
I want to hear from God.
He's written something down for me to reveal Himself, but I'm not going to read it.
I'm going to be a Christ follower, but I don't really know Christ in the way that God has chosen to reveal Him, which is to preserve all of His revelation in the pages of the Bible and preserved it, recorded it and preserved it.
(18:57):
If you could start with God, you don't lose out on anything.
You just gain everything.
You gain Him.
I want to ask as well about a couple of the words that you've mentioned a few times, and that is theology and doctrine.
So many people's eyes just glaze over as soon as you mention those words, and yet they're important.
(19:18):
There's this sense that they're dry, that this idea of theology and doctrine is beyond most people's understanding, and yet it's really just an understanding of who God is and what we believe about Him, isn't it?
100%.
You've nailed it.
That's what it is.
Theology is a study of who God is, and doctrine is what we believe about all of that and how we live our lives.
(19:39):
There are some concepts within that.
For example, I had, as I wrote my novel, the theology or the doctrine of the authority of Scripture in my mind as I wrote the novel.
I could write a book about the authority of Scripture, and the person that I really want to reach is never going to pick that up and read it.
But what if I could write a story about a character that lives her life and walks a journey, a parable, like my Savior did.
(20:06):
He would tell stories to try to access the hearts of people and include those things about authority of Scripture.
What do I mean by that when I say that?
Well, there's aspects of it, like God's word is inspired, meaning the words of God that He inspired physical authors to record, but they were His words.
(20:26):
They were inspired by God.
God breathed is what it says in Timothy.
God's word is sufficient.
We don't need church tradition.
We don't need outside sources to know about God and to learn about Him.
We just need His word.
It's sufficient.
It's eternal.
It lasts beyond you.
It lasts beyond me.
(20:47):
It's going to last forever.
His word is eternal because He is eternal, and it does not change, and it's inerrant, meaning it's without error.
So these are some things that if I were to ask, do you believe that the Bible is God's word?
Yes.
Do you believe that it is without error?
Yes.
That's why I read it.
I can trust it because it's without error, and it's without error because God, who is faithful and trustworthy and true, is without error.
(21:14):
Do you believe that it's going to last?
Yes.
I mean, it's lasted this long, it's going to last into eternity.
Do you believe that it's sufficient?
These are the doctrines.
This is what we believe about God's word, and therefore, and I love that the word authority of scripture is in there, therefore, it should have influence and authority over our lives.
In the book, I talk about a biblical worldview so that when you see tragedy, when you see death, when you see birth, when you see unforgiveness, and when you see reconciliation, how you decipher what all of that means is the lens that you look through the world.
(21:51):
Now, some of that's going to, of course, be influenced by your upbringing.
You and I are going to see the world a little bit differently, but what we really want is for that strongest prescription to be the biblical worldview, the biblical lens, so that I can say, how does God see this situation?
I can only have that when I know what the Bible says.
(22:16):
This biblical worldview, again, theology, doctrine, forget those words, put on those glasses that say, how would God see this situation, and therefore, how should I respond based on this truth and this knowledge?
Tell me a little about your podcast and how that began.
Again, I had this Bible quiz background, and so I had all of this biblical knowledge memorization, and I became a mom of two young girls, and I wanted them to know the Bible like I knew the Bible, but I didn't have Bible quiz in the area.
(22:47):
I thought, well, one of the things I did in summer camp, we learned a song, 1 John 4, 7, and 8.
I won't sing it, but I can.
I can still sing it because music is that powerful.
I was thinking, okay, I can put scripture to songs and teach my kids.
There are amazing organizations that have done this well.
I did not do it well.
(23:09):
Everything I tried just sounded really kind of lame.
I prayed about it, and I was over the years trying to figure out, all the while doing the thing, like I said to you, where I would meet with other young moms who wanted to teach their kids scripture too, but they felt inadequate because they didn't understand scripture.
So then they weren't going to teach their kids scripture because they felt like they didn't know enough.
I mean, it was just the shame cycle that the enemy keeps us in.
(23:30):
I was meeting with some new believers on Friday night.
Two single women on Friday nights would we would sit around and talk about the Bible.
One of the ladies had just gotten saved a couple of weeks before.
One of the things that she had done first was to change the music that she was listening to on the radio.
Country music is real big around where we are.
So she stopped listening to country music and she started listening to Christian music.
(23:52):
We were on our way to vacation and this song comes on, Every Good Thing by The Afters.
I thought to myself, oh, I wish my friend Stacy knew that that lyric came straight from James.
If she knew that, then maybe she could remember some of the other things that are taught in James.
Some of the other truths that are there.
My favorite is be quick to hear, slow to speak, and slow to become angry because man's anger does not bring about the righteous life that God desires.
(24:18):
That was an internalized one because I needed it because I was quick to speak and slow to hear and I would fly off the handle a little bit.
So I just wish she knew that.
So every good and perfect gift comes from the Father with who there is no shifting shadows.
Oh, I wish she knew that.
The Holy Spirit just said, the music has already been written.
Oh my goodness, you're right.
There's these great spiritual truths in all the Christian lyrics that are out in the world today.
(24:41):
I didn't know what to do with that.
Do I write a blog?
Do I write a Bible study?
What do you do with the music and how it's copyrighted and all this other stuff?
And I went to a marketing conference in November and one of the speakers was talking about podcasts and he's like, building a platform is like finding a needle in a haystack.
The blogging haystack is just, it's massive, but the podcasting haystack is smaller.
(25:02):
So just pick a smaller haystack to be found in.
And I just knew right then, and I spoke with some of the other professionals in the room, just some really amazing godly people who already had podcasts.
This was in 2013.
This was early on in the podcasting world and got some advice, nailed down just kind of what my mission, my goal was and recorded three podcasts and released it in February of 2014.
(25:27):
And I've been doing weekly podcasts up till I started really working on this book and so I went to bi-weekly.
I just needed the time to be able to do both.
I take the music that's playing on the radio and I point people back to scripture.
It's not like super heavy theology.
Do you know what I'm saying?
It's just a Christian song.
I'm wondering if over the more than 500 episodes you've released, as you've talked about different songs, have any of the artists who have released those songs, to your knowledge, heard the episodes and been in touch with you?
(25:59):
Oh, that's such a good question.
I know of one and it makes me kind of tear up to think about it.
It was Mandisa.
Wow.
I can remember the day that she tweeted and she shared it on her Facebook and I ran into the kitchen and I shoved my phone into my daughter's face.
She was a teenager at the time and I was like, oh, Mandisa's on my podcast.
(26:23):
She actually commented, I don't know why I didn't see this because I tagged the artist on everything and I guess she just listened to it and she was like, this is my jam.
Christian music and then pointing people back to God's Word.
Also, Lauren Daigle is actually from the area that I live in, in Louisiana, and she attended the Christian school that I was an administrator at for a while.
(26:47):
I was not the administrator while she lived there, but we have connections and we've got mutual friends and things like that.
I don't know that she's ever heard the podcast per se, but she and I talked about the idea behind it because I said, what if you could harness the power of the song playing on the radio to remind you what you've studied, inspire you to study it, and then every time you hear that song, you remember this deep dive study that you did over here.
(27:09):
She and I talked about it.
She said that she'd read a study one time that said in retirement homes and nursing homes, people with Alzheimer's and memory dementia issues, she said one of the last things to lose is rhythm and rhyme.
They might forget your name, they might forget people around them, but they could sing the lyrics to a song.
(27:30):
I was like, oh my goodness, just this idea, the power of that rhythm and rhyme.
Like I said to you, I can still sing 1 John 4, 7, and 8 from camp and it's been a minute since I've been to camp.
So yes, Mandisa for sure has heard it.
And then I've been able to do a couple of interviews with some of the artists and stuff.
That's been kind of fun.
But I honestly don't know if they listen to the podcast.
(27:52):
I think they just came on to promote their stuff, which is totally fine.
I want to meet people where they are and they're listening to the radio.
They're going through stuff and they just might need the inspiration, just the nudge to go read the Bible for themselves.
I'm hoping that's what I do.
As I said, right at the outset, you find various ways to connect people with reading the scripture and introducing them to how powerful that is.
(28:17):
And we have touched on the fact that you've written this novel and what that's about, A Seat at the Table.
When that book was finally finished and you sent it off to the publisher, it must have been pretty exciting.
But what about on release day, getting it out there so that people can read it?
What sort of excitement is there around that?
It's a little bit nerve wracking.
(28:38):
I wrote a book that's a little bit different.
I remember when I first started out writing it, I had read some business books that were half and half, half story and half teaching.
I always thought that was so fascinating.
I talked to an agent about it and she goes, Yeah, you're going to have to pick a lane.
There's no shelf in the Christian bookstore that says half and half.
It's either fiction or it's nonfiction.
You can't have both.
(28:59):
That was kind of a punch in the gut.
But on the flip side, it really did force me.
One of the things I wanted to do was write a really good story.
I hired a book coach and I hired a developmental editor and all of those things.
But even so, I really wanted to incorporate these ideas.
Again, with the idea of authority of scripture, how do I show that in a story?
(29:20):
But I still wanted to show it.
I didn't want just some random plot out there.
I want the story to be entertaining.
Don't get me wrong.
But if it's entertaining enough, maybe it'll stick with you so that you can remember the truth stuff that I wanted to teach you too.
I had one of my friends, who is a dear friend, but is an honest friend, said, I canceled everything.
I couldn't stop reading.
(29:41):
It was really good.
And so that was kind of like the emotional boost that I needed to kind of get through it.
A friend texted me and just said, I'm going to pray differently.
I've been praying with the wrong heart and I want to pray differently.
I'm inspired to pray differently.
Ronnie, that's crazy.
It's a novel.
I had another who said, I'm going to pick up my Bible and start reading again.
(30:02):
I realized that I've set it aside.
My uncle who came to my release party and he was almost in tears and he just said, Michelle, you sucked me into this story.
You reminded me of things I knew.
You taught me things I didn't know and you did it without preaching at me.
You did a really good job.
That's been a little bit euphoric also.
I am one that likes those words of affirmation.
(30:24):
Don't get me wrong.
But in the end, I want to introduce people to the God of the Bible by them reading the Bible.
That's always been my goal.
I've been laser focused both in the podcast and in this novel.
Michelle, I want to thank you for the way that you continually point people to the Lord in such a variety of different ways.
If people want to get in touch with you, find out more about you, find the book, where's the easiest place to find you?
(30:49):
Yeah, well, I just want to thank you for creating a platform that believers can come and share their testimony of what God has done.
Being a witness, I want to make sure that your listeners have a little gift from me.
I've got a couple of bonuses you can unlock by going to michellekneesat.com forward slash unlock.
I know you'll probably put the link in the show notes and things like that, but that's probably the best place.
(31:13):
I've got a couple of links to my book and all my socials and my podcast and all that would be on that page.
So, michellekneesat.com forward slash unlock.
I'll certainly put links in the show notes at bleedingdaylight.net, so that people can find you easily.
But it's been a wonderful conversation.
Thanks for what you're doing and thanks for your time today.
Thanks, Rodney.
I really appreciate it.
(31:34):
Thank you for listening to Bleeding Daylight.
Please help us to shine more light into the darkness by sharing this episode with others.
For further details and more episodes, please visit bleedingdaylight.net.
Wherever there are shadows, there are people ready to kick at the darkness until it bleeds daylight.
This is Bleeding Daylight with your host, Rodney Olsen.
Welcome, I'm so pleased you're listening.
Bleeding Daylight is on social media platforms such as Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, Blue Sky and others.
(00:30):
Links are at bleedingdaylight.net where you'll also find dozens of other episodes.
Please leave a five-star review for Bleeding Daylight on your favourite podcast platform.
Are you a fan of music?
Do you find hope and significance in song lyrics?
(00:51):
Today's guest has delved into the deeper meaning of hundreds of songs.
Have you ever found yourself singing along to Christian music but wishing you could connect the lyrics to deeper Biblical truths?
(01:11):
Do you long to develop a more meaningful relationship with Scripture but aren't sure where to start?
Michelle Nysad is the host of the More Than a Song podcast with over 500 episodes exploring the Biblical foundations behind popular Christian music lyrics.
She's also an author and her first novel is titled A Seat at the Table.
(01:32):
Everything she does displays her desire to meet people exactly where they are in their faith journey.
I'm so pleased to have her as my guest today, Michelle.
Welcome to Bleeding Daylight.
It's a delight to be here.
Thank you for having me.
Your faith story goes back a very long way.
Tell me about the influence that your grandparents had on you in those early years.
(01:53):
Yeah, my grandparents were instrumental in my faith.
They became Christians as adults.
When my mom came up pregnant in her early 20s, they said, come, come, come, we'll help you.
So I actually lived in their home for the first few years of my life.
Some of my earliest memories would be to crawl up into bed with them, and they would read the Bible, and I'd be learning how to read.
(02:17):
And so I would learn to read by reading with them from the Bible, going to church with them, and learning the things of the Lord from them and their stories.
And I just don't ever remember a time when I didn't love Jesus, and that was because of them.
And such a rich heritage passed down to you.
I'm sure they were very pleased to see you following that way as well.
(02:38):
Yes, I believe so.
My grandfather passed before I entered my sophomore year of college, and then my grandmother just passed a couple of years ago.
And so I wish they could read the book.
I wish Papa could have heard the podcast and some of the things that have come out of that rich heritage.
But it is definitely a legacy for sure, and it all stems from a love of God's Word.
(03:00):
Brian Schneider had a big influence in your biblical knowledge too, didn't he?
Right, good old Brian.
Well, I had the opportunity, the pleasure to be a part of a church where we did Bible quiz.
In Bible quiz, you would memorize entire books of the Bible—in the King James Version, by the way—then compete by quoting it, answering questions.
(03:23):
It was a quiz setting.
You had to buzz in and try to beat your neighbor.
I did Bible quiz from year to year, and I've kind of dabbled in it.
But there was one year that I said, I'm going to really do this thing.
And because to be really, really good at Bible quiz, you just had to actually memorize everything.
You couldn't just sort of study it.
You had to really commit it to memory so that you were confident that when the question was asked, you could buzz in quickly because you knew you knew all the answers.
(03:49):
That year, I was really committed to learning.
The year was Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, and Philemon because they were all short books of the Bible.
And my ultimate goal was to beat Brian Schneider.
It was not a holy goal, I have to admit.
However, here's what happened on the other side.
I learned Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, and Philemon in the King James Version.
(04:15):
He really was better than me, but he didn't know that I knew that.
And so it was a friendly competition.
Most times, I do have this wonderful memory of my Bible quiz coach.
We had gotten into an argument, and it was literally from the Scripture that we were studying how we needed to forgive one another as Christ forgave us.
(04:36):
And she was like, what does Scripture call for?
And we forgive one another as Christ forgave us.
And it was in there, and it came out in really practical ways.
But I will tell you what, though, that laid this huge foundation.
I mean, not only did I learn how to read the Bible from birth practically, and then I had this just strong foundation of biblical knowledge.
(04:56):
My grandfather and I would have conversations.
He loved Scripture.
And so he would say, okay, you go read Acts, and I'll read Acts.
And then we'll talk about the differences between church today and the early church that we see being developed in Acts.
And so we would have these kinds of conversations.
So just a love of Scripture and then just a foundation of Scripture in my life set me up, I think, for what would end up happening.
(05:21):
I mean, I taught Sunday school and things like that, but I think everything really shifted for me when I started the podcast and then honestly shifted again kind of mid-podcast as I met different believers in my life that challenged me and caused me to go a little bit deeper.
Of course, there's a big difference between knowing about Scripture and memorizing it and knowing what's in the Bible and it becoming a part of your life and that relationship that we hear about so often with Jesus.
(05:47):
So when did that happen for you?
Was that very early on as you sat with your grandparents, or was that a little bit later that it became so real to you?
For me, it was very early on.
I have a biological father, but I did not grow up with a father.
I don't know who he is.
My grandfather was a father figure.
(06:07):
I had youth pastors throughout the years that were father figures, but I believed the Scripture when it said that he was my father.
He was at every game and every award ceremony, and he never failed me.
And so from very early on, I never really wavered from that.
I believed it.
I tried to walk it out.
Of course, you have confusion and doubts and things like that along the way, but I never doubted my faith and who I was in Christ.
(06:35):
Kind of like, what direction do I go?
Who am I in Christ?
Those kinds of questions.
There was a time, I think, when it was real popular for people with really good testimonies.
I'm using air quotes.
I know it's a podcast, but where you were just down in the dumps or in deep sin, and you come out of that.
I remember there was a time when I was a teenager thinking, I don't have a good testimony.
(06:56):
I can't remember if it was my grandfather or one of the spiritual advisors in my life at the time just said, no, no, no.
Yours is the best testimony.
It's a keeping testimony, and it reminds people around you that God is a keeping God.
If you will follow Him, He will keep you.
That's really been the testimony of my life.
A love of Scripture, yes, sprinkled in.
(07:16):
I will say that there was this turning point when I was a young woman.
I was married, no kids yet.
We had an older women, younger women program at church where we were paired up with some older women.
A friend of mine, Dana, and I were paired up with Tamara.
She was trying to get to know us early.
Kind of a conversation like this, tell me about your past, whatever.
She said, girls, tell me about your Bible reading and your prayer time.
(07:40):
We were like, well, we read our Bibles periodically.
Sometimes we do Bible studies, things like that.
She's like, you're telling me you don't read your Bible every day.
We said, no, ma'am.
She's like, that's non-negotiable.
We just jumped back a little bit.
I would say that that was probably one of the strongest turning points in my faith and in my dedication to God's Word.
(08:05):
Then I realized that as I was helping or working with other young women my age, they didn't really know what to do with the Bible.
They didn't know how to read the Bible.
They didn't have the foundation that I had.
They didn't have the Bible knowledge.
We could have a conversation and I would say, oh, I think it's over there in such and such a story or whatever.
They just didn't have the foundation that the Lord had blessed me with.
(08:26):
That kind of began my journey into figuring out how can I help meet people where they are so that they can step into it without feeling condemnation.
I hated the shame that you could feel around that.
Just the shame of I should know more about this and I don't.
Then I'm just not really going to engage with it at all.
I just say it's today.
I had an advisor one time say, it's today.
(08:47):
Just look forward today and let's see where we can get closer to the Lord from this moment on.
Pete And it's interesting you mention that shame of not knowing and that idea that we really should be reading the Bible every day.
That can become a very legalistic thing for some people.
They say, oh no, but I don't want it to be legalistic.
(09:09):
Yet we do know, we have seen the information that tells us that if we do engage with the scriptures, actually our spiritual life will grow.
How do we bridge that gap between this thinking, oh look, it's just a tick the box kind of thing that we must read scripture every day and to get to that place where that scripture reading actually informs and guides us in what we're doing?
(09:33):
I liken it to building a foundation.
Brick by brick, you're laying a layer of knowledge.
I think what happens sometimes is we jump straight to what does the Bible mean to me, which is a question you should never ask.
You can ask what does it mean and how can I apply it or how should I respond, but it can't mean something to you that it doesn't mean.
(09:55):
Bible knowledge, literacy, biblical literacy is a buzzword kind of in the world today.
Brick by brick, you read those stories for yourself.
You read the text for yourself and you begin to build this foundation that gives you kind of that solid standing point to then build on top of it.
What does it mean?
You can begin to explore deeper things like theology and doctrine and some of the words that, to be honest, I remember there was a time as knowledgeable as I was about the Bible that I would hear a sermon and some guy would say something about theology or doctrine.
(10:27):
I didn't know what that meant.
So it went over my head and I just let it go.
I didn't think it was very applicable to me.
I truly believe that if you will meet the Lord in His revealed word, He has revealed Himself to us.
In my novel, I really try to kind of bring out this idea through a story that the main character, Joy, has set aside reading her Bible.
(10:48):
She knew it was good and she just didn't think anything of it.
She didn't even have shame over it.
It just wasn't a part of her daily life, even though she would say, I'm a Christian.
But this idea that the Lord will meet you in there and He has revealed Himself to you.
And so she's sitting there.
I want direction.
I want guidance.
I need these things from the Lord.
The spiritual guide in the story says, so maybe you go to where He has revealed Himself.
(11:13):
So I think a lot of the things that I try to do with my listeners and then also my readers of my book is to kind of start with a different starting point.
We often start with ourselves.
How can it help me?
I encourage you to start with God.
Start with God.
It's a story about Him.
It's not a story about us.
We're in there.
We're part of His story, but it's a story about Him.
Start with God.
What do you see?
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And then He's your creator and you are made in His image.
So the more you look at Him, the more you can see what you're supposed to look like.
And so when you see things that you see in Him, in you, that's Him.
Right?
So He is the God of love.
He's created you to be able to love when you love sincerely.
That is your creator being reflected.
(11:55):
You are reflecting your creator.
Just to kind of bring it back around, just this foundation, this knowledge.
He can meet you there when you enter into that space where He has said, this is where I've revealed myself to you.
And if it becomes a checkbox, if it becomes legalistic, then here's what you do.
You just pray, God, help me change my heart as it relates to how I relate to scripture.
(12:18):
Change my heart that I would enter it in a different mindset, in a different light.
And then of course, just change up how you interact with scripture.
If the way that you're doing it is not working, try a different way.
I talk about Bible interaction tool exercises all the time on my podcast, and I kind of tucked them into my book too.
But how do you interact with God's word that might help bring it to life?
(12:40):
Because it is the source.
That is where you meet your living hope.
I've heard of people refer to the Bible as an instruction manual or as a life guide.
And yet what you've brought out is something far more important in that that is where we meet Jesus in the pages of the scripture.
This is how God has revealed himself to us.
(13:02):
And I think that so often people miss that, that this is not just reading for the sake of reading, reading for the sake of knowledge, but it is actually where we meet God.
How important is that for people to realize?
Well, I think it's fundamentally important.
I think it changes the starting point from how you view scripture.
(13:22):
So if you're picking up a story and you're trying to figure out how it applies to your life versus you're picking up a story and you learn, can you learn from someone else's story?
Sure.
I've picked up a memoir and read someone else's story and said, wow, the thing that they learned there, I needed to know too.
And I can really learn from that.
(13:43):
But I never for once thought that that story was about me.
I don't pick up a story about someone else and say that it's about me.
Again, just a perspective shift to realize that this is God's story.
And it's a unified story, which that I really honestly never fully understood or was ever taught.
(14:04):
Probably in the last seven years, I have understood the meta-narrative, the big story that from Genesis through Revelation, there's a red thread of redemption woven throughout.
I had kind of always known that, but to realize that God was telling a story across all of history to point to our Savior, Jesus Christ.
(14:27):
Well, then you begin to read those stories differently.
We have a children's Bible, the Jesus Storybook Bible.
I highly recommend it even for adults, because one of the things that it says is every story whispers His name.
And so it tells all of
these very familiar Old Testament and New Testament Bible stories, but it reminds the reader
that every story is whispering the name of Jesus, that every account, every twist and turn is
(14:53):
pointing ultimately to Jesus Christ as our Savior who came and He lived a sinless life, and He died,
and He resurrected on the third day, and He ascended, and He is sitting next to our Father,
and He's mediating, and He will return for us.
So are we part of this story?
A hundred percent.
His story becomes our story, but it's not our story first.
(15:15):
If you're reading every story in the Bible looking for Jesus, instead of reading every story in the Bible looking for how you can apply it to your life, I guarantee you that if you do that today, your perspective, your experience with God's Word will change even just today.
There does seem to be a trend in a lot of churches where they are pointing towards what's in it for me.
(15:38):
They are pointing towards this is a book about you and how your life could be better.
We miss so much when we do that and miss the majesty of God, don't we?
When we try to make it about ourselves, we can so often come up thinking it's not quite meeting the need.
Yet when we see that it's about this God who loves us, this God who held nothing back for us, that's so much more satisfying than when we've gone to look for a story about ourselves, isn't it?
(16:09):
There's a psalm that says, I am beautifully and wonderfully made, and I can't run from you, and all this other stuff.
In my novel, there's a scene where Joy's main character is meeting with her friend Beth, who's a strong Christian.
She had gone to a church, like you just mentioned, that was really kind of like a TED Talk sermon.
It's all about you.
Take charge of your life.
You are powerful, all this kind of stuff.
(16:31):
She's bubbly and talking about the sermon and what she learned and all this other stuff.
Beth goes, Yeah, I kind of always thought that was a psalm about God.
Joy doesn't get it, but I hope the reader does and goes and pulls out that psalm and re-reads it to realize it's a God who makes us.
We are wonderfully made because He is wonderful.
(16:53):
His creation is good because He is good.
We've made ourselves the hero of the story.
Even in David and Goliath, are we the David?
Are we the ones flinging the stones?
No, we're the crazy, scared Israelites hiding in the tents and afraid.
What is the story really about?
(17:13):
God, who's bigger than the giant, bigger than the evil that is in the world.
Because another thing that you're going to see in the Word of God is that He is holy.
The more you look at His holiness, the more you see your own sin.
Because you realize the more you look and gaze at the holiness of God, then you realize how sinful you really are.
(17:35):
I'm going to bring this before you, Lord.
I'm going to bring you my offering and you realize why it's called Filthy Rags because He is so holy.
Does that bring shame?
No, because that holy God has invited us to be cleansed by Him, washed in the water of the Word, so to speak, cleansed by Him, to be beautified by Him, to be declared not guilty, to be declared righteous because of the righteousness of His Son.
(18:00):
All of these things are still true.
All of these TED Talk people that really just want to point to you and talk about you and see how great you are.
It's so interesting because when you gaze at the Lord, you get both.
You get Him and a right view of who He is.
Then you get a right view of yourself.
When that happens, He gets even bigger and the grace becomes even more profound.
(18:27):
Then you can walk in obedience to Him.
Then my question, how can you say that the Bible is God's Word, but you don't read it?
I want to hear from God.
He's written something down for me to reveal Himself, but I'm not going to read it.
I'm going to be a Christ follower, but I don't really know Christ in the way that God has chosen to reveal Him, which is to preserve all of His revelation in the pages of the Bible and preserved it, recorded it and preserved it.
(18:57):
If you could start with God, you don't lose out on anything.
You just gain everything.
You gain Him.
I want to ask as well about a couple of the words that you've mentioned a few times, and that is theology and doctrine.
So many people's eyes just glaze over as soon as you mention those words, and yet they're important.
(19:18):
There's this sense that they're dry, that this idea of theology and doctrine is beyond most people's understanding, and yet it's really just an understanding of who God is and what we believe about Him, isn't it?
100%.
You've nailed it.
That's what it is.
Theology is a study of who God is, and doctrine is what we believe about all of that and how we live our lives.
(19:39):
There are some concepts within that.
For example, I had, as I wrote my novel, the theology or the doctrine of the authority of Scripture in my mind as I wrote the novel.
I could write a book about the authority of Scripture, and the person that I really want to reach is never going to pick that up and read it.
But what if I could write a story about a character that lives her life and walks a journey, a parable, like my Savior did.
(20:06):
He would tell stories to try to access the hearts of people and include those things about authority of Scripture.
What do I mean by that when I say that?
Well, there's aspects of it, like God's word is inspired, meaning the words of God that He inspired physical authors to record, but they were His words.
(20:26):
They were inspired by God.
God breathed is what it says in Timothy.
God's word is sufficient.
We don't need church tradition.
We don't need outside sources to know about God and to learn about Him.
We just need His word.
It's sufficient.
It's eternal.
It lasts beyond you.
It lasts beyond me.
(20:47):
It's going to last forever.
His word is eternal because He is eternal, and it does not change, and it's inerrant, meaning it's without error.
So these are some things that if I were to ask, do you believe that the Bible is God's word?
Yes.
Do you believe that it is without error?
Yes.
That's why I read it.
I can trust it because it's without error, and it's without error because God, who is faithful and trustworthy and true, is without error.
(21:14):
Do you believe that it's going to last?
Yes.
I mean, it's lasted this long, it's going to last into eternity.
Do you believe that it's sufficient?
These are the doctrines.
This is what we believe about God's word, and therefore, and I love that the word authority of scripture is in there, therefore, it should have influence and authority over our lives.
In the book, I talk about a biblical worldview so that when you see tragedy, when you see death, when you see birth, when you see unforgiveness, and when you see reconciliation, how you decipher what all of that means is the lens that you look through the world.
(21:51):
Now, some of that's going to, of course, be influenced by your upbringing.
You and I are going to see the world a little bit differently, but what we really want is for that strongest prescription to be the biblical worldview, the biblical lens, so that I can say, how does God see this situation?
I can only have that when I know what the Bible says.
(22:16):
This biblical worldview, again, theology, doctrine, forget those words, put on those glasses that say, how would God see this situation, and therefore, how should I respond based on this truth and this knowledge?
Tell me a little about your podcast and how that began.
Again, I had this Bible quiz background, and so I had all of this biblical knowledge memorization, and I became a mom of two young girls, and I wanted them to know the Bible like I knew the Bible, but I didn't have Bible quiz in the area.
(22:47):
I thought, well, one of the things I did in summer camp, we learned a song, 1 John 4, 7, and 8.
I won't sing it, but I can.
I can still sing it because music is that powerful.
I was thinking, okay, I can put scripture to songs and teach my kids.
There are amazing organizations that have done this well.
I did not do it well.
(23:09):
Everything I tried just sounded really kind of lame.
I prayed about it, and I was over the years trying to figure out, all the while doing the thing, like I said to you, where I would meet with other young moms who wanted to teach their kids scripture too, but they felt inadequate because they didn't understand scripture.
So then they weren't going to teach their kids scripture because they felt like they didn't know enough.
I mean, it was just the shame cycle that the enemy keeps us in.
(23:30):
I was meeting with some new believers on Friday night.
Two single women on Friday nights would we would sit around and talk about the Bible.
One of the ladies had just gotten saved a couple of weeks before.
One of the things that she had done first was to change the music that she was listening to on the radio.
Country music is real big around where we are.
So she stopped listening to country music and she started listening to Christian music.
(23:52):
We were on our way to vacation and this song comes on, Every Good Thing by The Afters.
I thought to myself, oh, I wish my friend Stacy knew that that lyric came straight from James.
If she knew that, then maybe she could remember some of the other things that are taught in James.
Some of the other truths that are there.
My favorite is be quick to hear, slow to speak, and slow to become angry because man's anger does not bring about the righteous life that God desires.
(24:18):
That was an internalized one because I needed it because I was quick to speak and slow to hear and I would fly off the handle a little bit.
So I just wish she knew that.
So every good and perfect gift comes from the Father with who there is no shifting shadows.
Oh, I wish she knew that.
The Holy Spirit just said, the music has already been written.
Oh my goodness, you're right.
There's these great spiritual truths in all the Christian lyrics that are out in the world today.
(24:41):
I didn't know what to do with that.
Do I write a blog?
Do I write a Bible study?
What do you do with the music and how it's copyrighted and all this other stuff?
And I went to a marketing conference in November and one of the speakers was talking about podcasts and he's like, building a platform is like finding a needle in a haystack.
The blogging haystack is just, it's massive, but the podcasting haystack is smaller.
(25:02):
So just pick a smaller haystack to be found in.
And I just knew right then, and I spoke with some of the other professionals in the room, just some really amazing godly people who already had podcasts.
This was in 2013.
This was early on in the podcasting world and got some advice, nailed down just kind of what my mission, my goal was and recorded three podcasts and released it in February of 2014.
(25:27):
And I've been doing weekly podcasts up till I started really working on this book and so I went to bi-weekly.
I just needed the time to be able to do both.
I take the music that's playing on the radio and I point people back to scripture.
It's not like super heavy theology.
Do you know what I'm saying?
It's just a Christian song.
I'm wondering if over the more than 500 episodes you've released, as you've talked about different songs, have any of the artists who have released those songs, to your knowledge, heard the episodes and been in touch with you?
(25:59):
Oh, that's such a good question.
I know of one and it makes me kind of tear up to think about it.
It was Mandisa.
Wow.
I can remember the day that she tweeted and she shared it on her Facebook and I ran into the kitchen and I shoved my phone into my daughter's face.
She was a teenager at the time and I was like, oh, Mandisa's on my podcast.
(26:23):
She actually commented, I don't know why I didn't see this because I tagged the artist on everything and I guess she just listened to it and she was like, this is my jam.
Christian music and then pointing people back to God's Word.
Also, Lauren Daigle is actually from the area that I live in, in Louisiana, and she attended the Christian school that I was an administrator at for a while.
(26:47):
I was not the administrator while she lived there, but we have connections and we've got mutual friends and things like that.
I don't know that she's ever heard the podcast per se, but she and I talked about the idea behind it because I said, what if you could harness the power of the song playing on the radio to remind you what you've studied, inspire you to study it, and then every time you hear that song, you remember this deep dive study that you did over here.
(27:09):
She and I talked about it.
She said that she'd read a study one time that said in retirement homes and nursing homes, people with Alzheimer's and memory dementia issues, she said one of the last things to lose is rhythm and rhyme.
They might forget your name, they might forget people around them, but they could sing the lyrics to a song.
(27:30):
I was like, oh my goodness, just this idea, the power of that rhythm and rhyme.
Like I said to you, I can still sing 1 John 4, 7, and 8 from camp and it's been a minute since I've been to camp.
So yes, Mandisa for sure has heard it.
And then I've been able to do a couple of interviews with some of the artists and stuff.
That's been kind of fun.
But I honestly don't know if they listen to the podcast.
(27:52):
I think they just came on to promote their stuff, which is totally fine.
I want to meet people where they are and they're listening to the radio.
They're going through stuff and they just might need the inspiration, just the nudge to go read the Bible for themselves.
I'm hoping that's what I do.
As I said, right at the outset, you find various ways to connect people with reading the scripture and introducing them to how powerful that is.
(28:17):
And we have touched on the fact that you've written this novel and what that's about, A Seat at the Table.
When that book was finally finished and you sent it off to the publisher, it must have been pretty exciting.
But what about on release day, getting it out there so that people can read it?
What sort of excitement is there around that?
It's a little bit nerve wracking.
(28:38):
I wrote a book that's a little bit different.
I remember when I first started out writing it, I had read some business books that were half and half, half story and half teaching.
I always thought that was so fascinating.
I talked to an agent about it and she goes, Yeah, you're going to have to pick a lane.
There's no shelf in the Christian bookstore that says half and half.
It's either fiction or it's nonfiction.
You can't have both.
(28:59):
That was kind of a punch in the gut.
But on the flip side, it really did force me.
One of the things I wanted to do was write a really good story.
I hired a book coach and I hired a developmental editor and all of those things.
But even so, I really wanted to incorporate these ideas.
Again, with the idea of authority of scripture, how do I show that in a story?
(29:20):
But I still wanted to show it.
I didn't want just some random plot out there.
I want the story to be entertaining.
Don't get me wrong.
But if it's entertaining enough, maybe it'll stick with you so that you can remember the truth stuff that I wanted to teach you too.
I had one of my friends, who is a dear friend, but is an honest friend, said, I canceled everything.
I couldn't stop reading.
(29:41):
It was really good.
And so that was kind of like the emotional boost that I needed to kind of get through it.
A friend texted me and just said, I'm going to pray differently.
I've been praying with the wrong heart and I want to pray differently.
I'm inspired to pray differently.
Ronnie, that's crazy.
It's a novel.
I had another who said, I'm going to pick up my Bible and start reading again.
(30:02):
I realized that I've set it aside.
My uncle who came to my release party and he was almost in tears and he just said, Michelle, you sucked me into this story.
You reminded me of things I knew.
You taught me things I didn't know and you did it without preaching at me.
You did a really good job.
That's been a little bit euphoric also.
I am one that likes those words of affirmation.
(30:24):
Don't get me wrong.
But in the end, I want to introduce people to the God of the Bible by them reading the Bible.
That's always been my goal.
I've been laser focused both in the podcast and in this novel.
Michelle, I want to thank you for the way that you continually point people to the Lord in such a variety of different ways.
If people want to get in touch with you, find out more about you, find the book, where's the easiest place to find you?
(30:49):
Yeah, well, I just want to thank you for creating a platform that believers can come and share their testimony of what God has done.
Being a witness, I want to make sure that your listeners have a little gift from me.
I've got a couple of bonuses you can unlock by going to michellekneesat.com forward slash unlock.
I know you'll probably put the link in the show notes and things like that, but that's probably the best place.
(31:13):
I've got a couple of links to my book and all my socials and my podcast and all that would be on that page.
So, michellekneesat.com forward slash unlock.
I'll certainly put links in the show notes at bleedingdaylight.net, so that people can find you easily.
But it's been a wonderful conversation.
Thanks for what you're doing and thanks for your time today.
Thanks, Rodney.
I really appreciate it.
(31:34):
Thank you for listening to Bleeding Daylight.
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