August 15, 2025 • 19 mins
We are all changing. Sometimes we’re doing it on purpose- setting goals that require us to think and feel and act differently, goals that require us to evolve and grow. Sometimes we’re changing in reaction to the world and the people around us. The one thing we know for sure is that change is constant… and sometimes really hard. With change often comes conflict; with ourselves and with others. Since change is guaranteed, and conflict will come with it; why not get really good at navigating our way through it? When we do, conflict becomes incredibly valuable. When we learn that we are not the hero, the good gal, the one in the right, or the virtuous one, we open a whole new capacity for calm, leadership, and love. When we realize many things are true at once, we open up rich, connecting, flourishing relationships and a world where all our ideas can become real.
That’s what today’s episode is all about.
Over the past two years I have been approached to be a conflict resolution mediator for couples, families, friends, entrepreneurs, executive teams and CEOs- each one leading to referrals for more. It’s led me to deep dive into research, and tool finding. Today I’ll share my favorite tools to help you step out of conflict and into flourishing.
What you’ll learn in this podcast:
- Tools to resolve internal conflict
- Tools to navigate and resolve external conflict
- How different ways of change create conflict and why it can be valuable
- How to make the problem the problem, instead of making the person the problem
- The five things that all conflicts are ACTUALLY about, instead of being about the person
- A three part process to preparing for conflict resolution
- A five part framework for approaching someone in your life to resolve a conflict
- Five other quick tips to adopt a mindset that will lead to connection and resolution
Referenced in this podcast:
- The space between us by Betty Pries
- Becky Kennedy
- Carmen Landsdowne
- Brene Brown
- BYM Podcast Episodes:
- Listening is sexy
- Listen to this
- Feelings are a superpower
- When It’s happening for you
- The Practice
- The tool that changed everything
- Thought trades
How to connect with Marie:
- On the Web | The Local Bloom
- Instagram: @the.bloom.coach
- All Things Marie on LinkTree
JOIN THE BLOOM ROOM!
We'll take all these ideas and apply them to our lives. Follow me on Instagram at @the.bloom.coach to learn more and snag a spot in my group coaching program!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Welcome to the Bloom your Mind Podcast, where we take
all of your ideas for what youwant and we turn them into real
things.
I'm your host, certified CoachMarie McDonald.
Let's get into it.
Well, hello everybody andwelcome to episode number 140 of
(00:32):
the Bloom your Mind podcast.
I am once again coming to youfrom the high Sierras and, if
you've listened to the lastepisode and even if you haven't,
a little update on my two-weektrip, yes, we have done amazing
kayaking, played so many cards,done lots of hiking and you know
(00:54):
like floating on lakes allkinds of good stuff.
But also I've almost finishedsix books, which is like the
most dream-come-true scenariofor me.
I never have time to read asmuch as I'd like to.
It's sort of like what I tellmyself at home.
I'm sure there are tweaks Icould make to change that, and
(01:14):
so it's been so cool to createthat time for myself.
And what I find to be even moreexcellent than that is four of
these books have been fiction.
So stoked, I have so manyfictional stories in my head
that are delighting me, and twoof them were nonfiction, and one
of them that was a nonfictionbook was so brilliant that it
(01:34):
helped me to substantiate someof the things I'll be sharing
with you today in research andin the work of a theorist.
So before I get into that, Iwill also say that every year
when we come to this cabin inthe Sierras sometimes so before
I get into that, I will also saythat every year when we come to
this cabin in the Sierras,sometimes it's for a week.
This time it was for two weeks,so fun.
We're almost at the end of ourtrip here.
My husband and I take off for aday.
(01:54):
My amazing parents take ourkids, take care of them for a
day and we go off into themountains.
Sometimes we do a 12-mile hikeup into the mountains.
Other times it's like an eightmile hike.
It's always long and we alwaystalk about you know the opposite
of our day to day conversationsat home.
We talk about things like doyou believe in God?
(02:16):
Do you want to have a third kid?
You know we actually made thedecision about whether to have a
third kid on one of these hikesbecause we have a full day,
uninterrupted, of walking sideby side or one in front of the
other and talking and talkingand just being with each other.
This year we drove up to theportal of Yosemite, parked the
truck and went on these twohikes that we did not understand
(02:39):
what we were getting ourselvesinto because they weren't fully
mapped out on the map that wehad.
First we did a hike that wasstraight uphill to a beautiful
lake and we were like, okay,that was tough and fun, we got
it.
That was great.
It was like a mile of going up.
And then we're like, let's goacross to this other hike and do
it now, which will be a loteasier is what we thought from
(03:00):
the map.
Instead, it was like threehours of going straight uphill
and the zigzags were like notzigzags, they were like fake
zigzags because they were alltotally straight up.
We did not train for this hike.
We do a lot of, you know, likePilates and strength training
and functional movement trainingat home every morning, but we
(03:23):
have not trained for big hikes.
And so we did like 2,500 feetin elevation that day and did
not have that many discussionsbecause we were breathing too
hard.
But it was delightful as wehuffed and puffed and had a
beautiful day together.
So that's fun and I highlyrecommend it.
With your partners or your bestfriends.
Hiking is so fun.
So on to our topic for today.
(03:44):
I've been doing a lot ofconflict mediation over the last
year and, interestingly, thisis a total reactive skill that
I've developed because peopleapproach me to help them with a
conflict in their lives.
This has increased over thepast year or two, actually, and
it really has increased over thepast six months because people
(04:06):
will now refer me to others orbring in a different person that
they're in conflict with intheir life, and I've been doing
more and more of this.
This is for couples, this isfor families, this is for
friends and, in business, forCEOs or entrepreneurs who either
have an issue withcommunication with someone on
their team or two people ontheir team that are really in
(04:26):
conflict with one another.
So it's interesting when peopleget into these conflict tangles
.
What I've found is it isincredibly satisfying work to
help them out of it, because atthe base of us, we do not exist
outside of relationships to oneanother, really unless we're
like off in the woods byourselves, right, we exist in
(04:50):
relationship with ourselves andin relationship with others.
So helping individuals and anykind of system, any kind of
relationship, any kind of groupto build conflict resolution
skills with one another is verysatisfying because you see so
much relief and also becausethese conflicts really build who
(05:10):
we are.
We evolve so much as we comeinto the skill of being able to
navigate conflict without makingourselves right and someone
else wrong.
It's straight up like soulevolving stuff, my friends,
because you really have to letgo of being right.
You got to let go of being thegood guy.
As I've said many times on thepodcast and in coaching all the
(05:34):
time, if we are the good guy,what does that make everybody
else?
If we are constantly right,what does that make everybody
else?
If we always reserve usuallysubconsciously, we're not
conscious of it the role of heroor right one, or the one that's
correct, the one that got itright for ourselves, we will
(05:55):
never have the flourishing,open-hearted relationships that
we truly can get to when weunderstand that two things are
true in the words of BeckyKennedy that we understand that
I am right and you are right andthere is no right.
It's all subjective, butunderstanding one another from
that deep place of sort, of theoneness of being human beings
(06:18):
that we have inside our hearts,understanding one another, that
we all are having an experience,leads to incredibly flourishing
relationships and healing.
So I love it.
And what I notice is, as youturn your ideas into real things
, as you do new things in theBloom Room, I noticed this with
folks in coaching.
(06:39):
I noticed this with all myclients.
In myself, I noticed this as weturn ideas into reality, we
have to change how we areapproaching life in order to
create different results in ourlife.
Right, no matter what that ideais that we're trying to make
real.
If we're trying to do something, that's something we've never
done before.
We have to think differently todo something different.
(07:00):
We have to feel differentlythan our habituated ways of
feeling to do somethingdifferent.
We have to feel differentlythan our habituated ways of
feeling to do somethingdifferent.
We definitely have to actdifferently in order to get
different results.
And what all that adds up tothinking, feeling and acting
differently than we have beforeadds up to change.
Change can be uncomfortable,change can be hard and change
(07:24):
can bring conflict.
Sometimes that conflict is withourselves, because we're
shifting our ways, and it's hardbecause we're changing our
self-concepts, the way we thinkabout ourselves, maybe as
someone who is we're changing,to think about ourselves as
someone who is capable of doingthe thing we're trying to do
right.
We're changing our concept ofourselves as someone who has
(07:46):
made that idea real, and theneventually we shift to actually
thinking from her perspective,the you that has already done
the thing you're trying to do,the you that has already made
your idea real.
We start to think from thatperspective and as we do this,
conflict with ourselves mightarise.
And we have lots of tools thatI have already recorded on this
(08:11):
podcast that I'll acknowledgehere before I move into conflict
with others around us.
So tools to manage that conflictwithin ourselves is thought
management, thought trades,really stepping outside of
ourselves and knowing we are notour thoughts, and slowing down
that subconscious thinking,unconscious thinking, so that we
see some of that 95% that'shappening under the surface of
(08:34):
our brains.
And next week I will record oneof my own concepts, which is
regenerative thought cycles, tohelp you a little bit more with
that.
Another thing we can do isbecome more aware of thoughts
and feelings as data.
They are not who we are,they're never shameful, and we
use what is recorded on thepodcast as the episode, the
(08:55):
Practice, to get the data andapproach our feelings with
curiosity so that the feelingspass and we feel better, but we
get the important informationthat they're trying to give us.
And then, as I said, sometimesthe conflict that arises from
these changes we're making inourselves and in the world, as
(09:17):
we turn our ideas into reality,as we do new things that we've
never done before.
Sometimes the conflict thatarises is with others around us,
things that we've never donebefore.
Sometimes the conflict thatarises is with others around us,
maybe because we are changingand we're not okay with what we
used to be okay with.
Maybe because the people aroundus are changing and we're not
changing.
Maybe because we're changing indifferent directions than the
(09:39):
people around us.
Maybe because we're changingand we're asking more of others
or different things from othersaround us.
Change can be hard anduncomfortable, but it's also the
only guaranteed thing in life.
Right, this is what the wholeconcept of Buddhist
non-attachment is about thattrue joy and freedom and release
(10:08):
, and the true joy of life comeswhen we release our attachment
to the things we most attach to.
And so, if we know that changeis constant and it will happen
and it will bring conflict, whynot get really good at it, shall
we?
So I'm going to talk about thisone component of conflict, of
change, which is managingconflict between ourselves and
others.
I'm going to share three toolsfor managing conflict from a lot
(10:28):
of research that I've done andmost recently, a book by Betty
Prize which is called the SpaceBetween Us Conversations About
Transforming Conflict.
Now, betty Prize has multiplebooks on conflict.
This is the one that wasrecently recommended to me by a
dear friend and client, carmenLansdowne, who I have led
retreats for her.
(10:49):
She's in the Bloom Room.
I've coached her in manydifferent ways over the years
and she is an incredible leaderwho leads 2,500 congregations
for the United Church of Canadaacross Canada and is also the
first indigenous person to holdthat role of moderator.
So it's really she's really abrilliant, brilliant human being
that I adore, and sherecommended this book.
(11:11):
She's so brilliant.
I always read what sherecommends and I am grateful for
this recommendation.
So today I'm going to sharethree tools for managing
conflict that came from thisbook, but many, many others as
well, many other concepts aswell, and I'll say that you know
, as is often the case, thesetools are not 100% unique to
(11:33):
this book, to this, to thisperson, this thought leader.
They are tools that I've readand concepts that I've read in
many other places as well, inmany other places as well, and
that I've talked about totherapists and psychologists.
You know, learned over time.
But, as is often the case, whatI find is that this author has
(11:54):
articulated them in a very clearand concise and helpful way,
and so that's why I chose herbook as the one to have some
real fundamental tools, becauseI always like to give you a book
to be able to go research andread more deeply in my concepts
on your own.
So there's so much more to sayabout conflict than what I will
(12:14):
say today, and I highlyrecommend this book because it
has layers and layers ofresearch and beautiful concepts
Again, the Space Between Us byBetty Price, and beautiful
concepts Again, the SpaceBetween Us by Betty Price.
But I'm putting what Iexperienced to be the three most
brilliant concepts,game-changing concepts, here.
Right before I do that, I wantto say on this podcast the other
(12:36):
tools you can use to prepareyourself for conflict management
and resolution with people inyour life, or episodes, and I
will say I do not have theepisode numbers because I have
no Wi-Fi right now at this cabinin the woods, so I'm just going
to tell you the titles.
You're going to have to lookthem up on your own or have AI
look them up for you.
The episode Listen to this.
The episode Listening is Sexy.
(12:57):
Those are two episodes thatgive you the fundamental tools
of active listening andpartnership with others that
take you out of your ego.
The episode, two episodes themodel and the practice.
Those are two.
One is thought management, oneis feelings tolerance.
Those can help you.
The episode feelings are asuperpower for this fundamental
sort of emotional adulthoodskill that we all practice and
(13:20):
become as we become adults.
And then the episode morerecently, and it's titled
something like it's happeningfor you and if you're interested
in that, reach out to me.
If I got the title wrong, I donot have access to it in front
of me, all right.
So top three tools here we go,all right.
The first tool is to focus onthe problem as the problem
(13:45):
that's how Betty Price says itInstead of the person as the
problem.
My mom, who practiced as atherapist for many, many for a
few decades, and I have had manyconversations about this how we
often, when we see ourselves asright, we see the other person
as the problem, see ourselves asright, we see the other person
(14:06):
as the problem.
When we want to get out ofconflict, we can take the
perspective that we are notgoing to focus on the person as
the problem neither the other orourselves but we're going to
identify what problem we'resolving together.
When we do that, in the wordsof Brene Brown, we can sit on
(14:28):
the same side of the table andfocus on solving the problem
together instead of being goodguys and bad guys, instead of
being right and wrong.
So the first tool is taking ourperspective out of that person
is the problem and into theproblem is the problem.
Now, to support that, the firsttool that I read, as I said
(14:51):
this, focusing on the problem asa problem is something that is
a concept that I've heard fordecades.
It's an incredibly helpfulconcept to shift your mindset.
Now the second tool from BettyPrice book that I thought was
just phenomenal and I haven'theard articulated in this way
before, is that all conflictsbetween people boil down in her
(15:14):
thinking to five differentthings.
So let's say maybe that's.
You got to decide where to movewith a partner, roommates, a
family, your workplace.
That's an example.
We got to decide where we'regoing to move, what we're going
to do about something.
A decision must be made.
(15:36):
The second is expectationsaround how communication should
happen.
Happen Now.
Some examples of this are youmight expect that people will
not be attached to their storyabout what's happened more than
they are attached tounderstanding the facts about
what happened.
Maybe that's one expectationyou might have.
Another expectation that youmight have is that people use I
(15:59):
statements and own their ownemotional reaction rather than
blame their emotional reactionson you.
Another expectation that youmight have is that everyone will
have a turn to talk about theirexperience and everyone will
practice listening withoutinvalidating each other.
Maybe one more is that you'llfocus on one problem at a time,
(16:21):
so when one person bringssomething up, the other won't
respond with a different topic.
You'll focus on one topic at atime.
You can tell I'm passionateabout communications because I
have like 50 examples for this.
Okay, but that's a second.
One is expectations around howcommunication should happen.
Number three maybe there's anincident that needs discussion.
Maybe someone spoke to someoneelse in a harsh way that felt
(16:46):
disrespectful and there's aconflict now that needs to be
negotiated.
The fourth is expectations aboutprocess.
So an example might be how adecision is going to be made.
Maybe everybody needs to decideabout a financial decision
within a community or apartnership and one person
thinks they're the decisionmaker and another person thinks
(17:07):
it's a democratic decision thateverybody gets to weigh in on.
That can be another form ofconflict.
And, lastly, is differences invalues.
So this one probably doesn'tfeel quite as obvious but can be
really clarifying when werealize it's not about good
person, bad person, it's aboutdifferences in values.
(17:27):
Maybe someone values freedomand someone else values communal
processes, right.
Maybe someone values opennessabout their life with the people
around them and the otherperson values privacy.
So when we put this into thecontext of a problem, oh, my
(17:49):
value is this, your value isthat there's no better or worse,
there's no disrespect here,it's just a differences in
values.
It can really open up apartnership in negotiating
whatever that conflictspecifically is All right.
So those are the five thingsspecifically is All right.
(18:09):
So those are the five things andthey were very helpful for me
to see outlined in that way andmaybe, if you'd like to, you can
run through any conflicts thatyou have had, have seen or are
experiencing right now, and myexercise for you, if you'd like
to apply this material would beto ask yourself if this isn't
about the people.
What is the problem here thatwe're trying to solve, and which
(18:29):
of the five categories does itfall into?
A decision that needs to bemade?
Expectations around howcommunication should happen, an
incident that needs discussion,expectations about process or
differences in values?
All right, so those are thefirst two of the three fabulous
conflict resolution tools, andthe last one that I'm going to
(18:52):
share is the framework thatBetty Price shared in her book
for conflict resolution.
Now, again, she's pulling fromyou know all of her studies
around conflict resolution.
So this is built off of lots ofresearch and, again, I have
seen many different conflictresolution models, many of which
(19:12):
are great.
I really like this one andthat's why I chose it.
So the first thing, I'm going toshare both the overall concept
of this, and then I'm going toshare with you the actual
process and an example about it.
So, in this process, I'm goingto talk about how you or me,
(19:33):
when we're going into resolvinga conflict, can approach it, and
this is based fundamentally onthe idea that when we really
embrace full responsibility foranything that we contribute to a
situation, that's when we cansolve it.
That's when we can have freedom.
And I know how much our brainsresist that.
(19:56):
The other person did something.
The other person is wrong.
The other person needs toapologize.
I hear you, I hear you, we.
Other person is wrong, theother person needs to apologize.
I hear you, I hear you right,we've all been there.
And no matter how the otherperson has acted, when we can
find the part that wecontributed, that's where our
freedom is, that's whereforgiveness is and forgiveness
is a gift to ourselves.
That's when we can find thatlove for the other person and
(20:21):
boundaries, even if we feel likethey are not accepting
responsibility for theirs.
Really, conflict resolution canbe one person Not ideally, but
it can, all right.
So the concept here is numberone we recognize, accept, heal
or transform our own underlyingemotional process, and this is
(20:44):
straight from the book.
Okay, so we're recognizing ouremotional experience and we're
going to recognize it, accept it, heal it or transform it.
And those are all those otherepisodes that I gave you as
reference tools.
The second step is takeresponsibility for the actions
each person has done to takeharm or to create harm.
(21:05):
And again, this might just beone-sided to start.
It might just be one-sided.
In general, that can be enoughif one person can really
transform their need to be rightand really aim for the goal of
resolution and peace.
And the last thing is, once wedo those two steps, we can
(21:26):
refocus on the problem as theproblem.
Okay.
So next I'm going to give youthis five-part process that
Betty outlines in her book tosupport us in actually doing
this taking responsibility forour side and preparing ourselves
(21:47):
to approach a person or peoplethat we are in conflict with in
a way that will really minimizethe possibility that they will
take a defensive stance becausewe are owning our side of the
problem.
So this framework sounds likethis First I'm going to share an
example and then I'm going tobreak it down into the steps
that she gives, which I thinkare wonderful.
(22:08):
So when we last met, Iexperienced you as speaking in a
way that was harsh and wascriticizing my character.
I felt embarrassed and Iexperienced that as something
that was hard for me to connectwith you and I felt defensive.
I'm not saying it was yourintention to disparage my
(22:29):
character.
I'm not saying it was yourintention to speak loudly or to
make me feel defensive.
And my request, moving forward,is that when we do talk about
things that we're going through,that we really focus on our own
experience and don't makecomments about the other
person's character.
(22:49):
So that is the framework.
Let me break it down.
Step one is we're bringingwhatever happened into the
public is how Betty Price saysit which is like we're moving it
out of all the assumptionswe're all making in our head and
we're bringing it into thelight so that we can say what
(23:10):
our experience is and the otherperson can say what their
experience is.
That way, any assumptions thatanybody's making can actually be
challenged and talked throughtogether.
So first, here is theexperience that I had and I'm
bringing it into the light.
The second step is to own theimpact that the other person had
(23:32):
on us.
So we're not assuming thattheir intention was to hurt us.
We're not saying anything abouttheir intention at all.
If we own the impact that whatsomeone else did or said had on
us, we can do something aboutwhat we've experienced.
Step three we make sure we'renot blaming the other person for
(23:55):
the impact their words oractions had on us.
This can feel hard and it's thetruest thing, because we will
all have a different experienceto different things.
What might be offensive andhard for us, someone else, it
might roll off their shouldersand they might ignore it.
So we're owning.
This is what I experiencedmyself, not this is what you did
(24:18):
to me.
Now, step four if we feel safeenough, we can provide more
information or context.
This is why it felt that way.
This is maybe the history thatI have with this type of thing
that makes it feel extra hard.
But if it doesn't feel safe, wecan keep it shorter.
And number five we're specificabout the action that brought us
(24:38):
into conflict with each other.
So we're not usinggeneralizations.
We're not saying you always,we're not saying this is how you
are.
We're saying this specificmoment where the words felt to
me like they were disparagingagainst my character in this
specific conversation.
That's the problem.
(24:58):
The person isn't the problem.
That conversation and thosewords were the problem.
And person isn't the problem.
That conversation and thosewords were the problem.
And then, lastly and soimportantly, there's just a
super clear request about whatwe would like to see happen next
.
So in this one, it's like anactionable statement that says
my request is in the future,when we're in conflict.
(25:19):
We're not talking about thecharacter of one another and
using statements that aredisparaging to each other's
character.
Instead, we are talking aboutour own feelings and our own
experiences.
So that is the five-stepprocess that I have seen be so
incredibly healing forindividuals, along with active
(25:42):
listening practice.
That's the start of theconversation and then, if
possible, we get into activelistening.
All right, that's what I've gotfor you today, but I'm going to
end with five other quick tipsfor conflict resolution that I
practice and find incrediblyhelpful.
Number one we practice what'scalled unconditional positive
regard for one another.
(26:02):
You can look that up.
I won't go deeply into it, butwhat that means basically, on a
basic level, is that a humanbeing is separate from the
actions they take.
A human being is worthy andlovable, and they are a
different entity than theiractions.
Their actions are separate, andso are we, than their actions.
(26:24):
Their actions are separate, andso are we.
That allows us to practiceempathy and compassion with
ourselves and with others,because we know we are not our
actions.
Our actions are based on awhole lifetime of all different
kinds of things that maybe wechose and maybe we didn't.
Secondly, from E&M, which isthe practice of ethical
non-monogamy, we put therelationship first and we don't
do or say anything that wouldharm the relationship.
(26:45):
I love that practice.
Third, going into a conflictresolution conversation expect
less, expect less from the otherperson.
If I'm expecting someone to bea perfect communicator, I'm
going to be disappointed, but ifI go in expecting less, we
actually might get somewhere.
(27:06):
Number four go in to learn, notto teach.
Go into the conversation tolearn about their experience and
everything that you can learnnot to teach them and, lastly
and most importantly, take 100%responsibility for our own
(27:27):
emotional reactions andperspective on a situation.
This is what I experienced.
This is what the impact wasthat I experienced, because we
will all experience somethingdifferent.
All right, my friends, I hopethis was helpful to you.
As always, reach out if youhave questions or if you have
experiences based on this stuffthat you wanna share.
(27:49):
I'm all ears.
That's what I've got for youthis week and I will see you
next week.
If you like what you're hearingon the podcast, you gotta come
and join us in the Bloom Room.
This is a year-round membershipwhere we take all of these
(28:15):
concepts and we apply them toreal life in a community where
we have each other's backs andwe bring out the best in each
other.
We're all there to make ourideas real, one idea at a time.
I'll see you in the Bloom Room.
Welcome to the Bloom your Mind Podcast, where we take
all of your ideas for what youwant and we turn them into real
things.
I'm your host, certified CoachMarie McDonald.
Let's get into it.
Well, hello everybody andwelcome to episode number 140 of
(00:32):
the Bloom your Mind podcast.
I am once again coming to youfrom the high Sierras and, if
you've listened to the lastepisode and even if you haven't,
a little update on my two-weektrip, yes, we have done amazing
kayaking, played so many cards,done lots of hiking and you know
(00:54):
like floating on lakes allkinds of good stuff.
But also I've almost finishedsix books, which is like the
most dream-come-true scenariofor me.
I never have time to read asmuch as I'd like to.
It's sort of like what I tellmyself at home.
I'm sure there are tweaks Icould make to change that, and
(01:14):
so it's been so cool to createthat time for myself.
And what I find to be even moreexcellent than that is four of
these books have been fiction.
So stoked, I have so manyfictional stories in my head
that are delighting me, and twoof them were nonfiction, and one
of them that was a nonfictionbook was so brilliant that it
(01:34):
helped me to substantiate someof the things I'll be sharing
with you today in research andin the work of a theorist.
So before I get into that, Iwill also say that every year
when we come to this cabin inthe Sierras sometimes so before
I get into that, I will also saythat every year when we come to
this cabin in the Sierras,sometimes it's for a week.
This time it was for two weeks,so fun.
We're almost at the end of ourtrip here.
My husband and I take off for aday.
(01:54):
My amazing parents take ourkids, take care of them for a
day and we go off into themountains.
Sometimes we do a 12-mile hikeup into the mountains.
Other times it's like an eightmile hike.
It's always long and we alwaystalk about you know the opposite
of our day to day conversationsat home.
We talk about things like doyou believe in God?
(02:16):
Do you want to have a third kid?
You know we actually made thedecision about whether to have a
third kid on one of these hikesbecause we have a full day,
uninterrupted, of walking sideby side or one in front of the
other and talking and talkingand just being with each other.
This year we drove up to theportal of Yosemite, parked the
truck and went on these twohikes that we did not understand
(02:39):
what we were getting ourselvesinto because they weren't fully
mapped out on the map that wehad.
First we did a hike that wasstraight uphill to a beautiful
lake and we were like, okay,that was tough and fun, we got
it.
That was great.
It was like a mile of going up.
And then we're like, let's goacross to this other hike and do
it now, which will be a loteasier is what we thought from
(03:00):
the map.
Instead, it was like threehours of going straight uphill
and the zigzags were like notzigzags, they were like fake
zigzags because they were alltotally straight up.
We did not train for this hike.
We do a lot of, you know, likePilates and strength training
and functional movement trainingat home every morning, but we
(03:23):
have not trained for big hikes.
And so we did like 2,500 feetin elevation that day and did
not have that many discussionsbecause we were breathing too
hard.
But it was delightful as wehuffed and puffed and had a
beautiful day together.
So that's fun and I highlyrecommend it.
With your partners or your bestfriends.
Hiking is so fun.
So on to our topic for today.
(03:44):
I've been doing a lot ofconflict mediation over the last
year and, interestingly, thisis a total reactive skill that
I've developed because peopleapproach me to help them with a
conflict in their lives.
This has increased over thepast year or two, actually, and
it really has increased over thepast six months because people
(04:06):
will now refer me to others orbring in a different person that
they're in conflict with intheir life, and I've been doing
more and more of this.
This is for couples, this isfor families, this is for
friends and, in business, forCEOs or entrepreneurs who either
have an issue withcommunication with someone on
their team or two people ontheir team that are really in
(04:26):
conflict with one another.
So it's interesting when peopleget into these conflict tangles
.
What I've found is it isincredibly satisfying work to
help them out of it, because atthe base of us, we do not exist
outside of relationships to oneanother, really unless we're
like off in the woods byourselves, right, we exist in
(04:50):
relationship with ourselves andin relationship with others.
So helping individuals and anykind of system, any kind of
relationship, any kind of groupto build conflict resolution
skills with one another is verysatisfying because you see so
much relief and also becausethese conflicts really build who
(05:10):
we are.
We evolve so much as we comeinto the skill of being able to
navigate conflict without makingourselves right and someone
else wrong.
It's straight up like soulevolving stuff, my friends,
because you really have to letgo of being right.
You got to let go of being thegood guy.
As I've said many times on thepodcast and in coaching all the
(05:34):
time, if we are the good guy,what does that make everybody
else?
If we are constantly right,what does that make everybody
else?
If we always reserve usuallysubconsciously, we're not
conscious of it the role of heroor right one, or the one that's
correct, the one that got itright for ourselves, we will
(05:55):
never have the flourishing,open-hearted relationships that
we truly can get to when weunderstand that two things are
true in the words of BeckyKennedy that we understand that
I am right and you are right andthere is no right.
It's all subjective, butunderstanding one another from
that deep place of sort, of theoneness of being human beings
(06:18):
that we have inside our hearts,understanding one another, that
we all are having an experience,leads to incredibly flourishing
relationships and healing.
So I love it.
And what I notice is, as youturn your ideas into real things
, as you do new things in theBloom Room, I noticed this with
folks in coaching.
(06:39):
I noticed this with all myclients.
In myself, I noticed this as weturn ideas into reality, we
have to change how we areapproaching life in order to
create different results in ourlife.
Right, no matter what that ideais that we're trying to make
real.
If we're trying to do something, that's something we've never
done before.
We have to think differently todo something different.
(07:00):
We have to feel differentlythan our habituated ways of
feeling to do somethingdifferent.
We have to feel differentlythan our habituated ways of
feeling to do somethingdifferent.
We definitely have to actdifferently in order to get
different results.
And what all that adds up tothinking, feeling and acting
differently than we have beforeadds up to change.
Change can be uncomfortable,change can be hard and change
(07:24):
can bring conflict.
Sometimes that conflict is withourselves, because we're
shifting our ways, and it's hardbecause we're changing our
self-concepts, the way we thinkabout ourselves, maybe as
someone who is we're changing,to think about ourselves as
someone who is capable of doingthe thing we're trying to do
right.
We're changing our concept ofourselves as someone who has
(07:46):
made that idea real, and theneventually we shift to actually
thinking from her perspective,the you that has already done
the thing you're trying to do,the you that has already made
your idea real.
We start to think from thatperspective and as we do this,
conflict with ourselves mightarise.
And we have lots of tools thatI have already recorded on this
(08:11):
podcast that I'll acknowledgehere before I move into conflict
with others around us.
So tools to manage that conflictwithin ourselves is thought
management, thought trades,really stepping outside of
ourselves and knowing we are notour thoughts, and slowing down
that subconscious thinking,unconscious thinking, so that we
see some of that 95% that'shappening under the surface of
(08:34):
our brains.
And next week I will record oneof my own concepts, which is
regenerative thought cycles, tohelp you a little bit more with
that.
Another thing we can do isbecome more aware of thoughts
and feelings as data.
They are not who we are,they're never shameful, and we
use what is recorded on thepodcast as the episode, the
(08:55):
Practice, to get the data andapproach our feelings with
curiosity so that the feelingspass and we feel better, but we
get the important informationthat they're trying to give us.
And then, as I said, sometimesthe conflict that arises from
these changes we're making inourselves and in the world, as
(09:17):
we turn our ideas into reality,as we do new things that we've
never done before.
Sometimes the conflict thatarises is with others around us,
things that we've never donebefore.
Sometimes the conflict thatarises is with others around us,
maybe because we are changingand we're not okay with what we
used to be okay with.
Maybe because the people aroundus are changing and we're not
changing.
Maybe because we're changing indifferent directions than the
(09:39):
people around us.
Maybe because we're changingand we're asking more of others
or different things from othersaround us.
Change can be hard anduncomfortable, but it's also the
only guaranteed thing in life.
Right, this is what the wholeconcept of Buddhist
non-attachment is about thattrue joy and freedom and release
(10:08):
, and the true joy of life comeswhen we release our attachment
to the things we most attach to.
And so, if we know that changeis constant and it will happen
and it will bring conflict, whynot get really good at it, shall
we?
So I'm going to talk about thisone component of conflict, of
change, which is managingconflict between ourselves and
others.
I'm going to share three toolsfor managing conflict from a lot
(10:28):
of research that I've done andmost recently, a book by Betty
Prize which is called the SpaceBetween Us Conversations About
Transforming Conflict.
Now, betty Prize has multiplebooks on conflict.
This is the one that wasrecently recommended to me by a
dear friend and client, carmenLansdowne, who I have led
retreats for her.
(10:49):
She's in the Bloom Room.
I've coached her in manydifferent ways over the years
and she is an incredible leaderwho leads 2,500 congregations
for the United Church of Canadaacross Canada and is also the
first indigenous person to holdthat role of moderator.
So it's really she's really abrilliant, brilliant human being
that I adore, and sherecommended this book.
(11:11):
She's so brilliant.
I always read what sherecommends and I am grateful for
this recommendation.
So today I'm going to sharethree tools for managing
conflict that came from thisbook, but many, many others as
well, many other concepts aswell, and I'll say that you know
, as is often the case, thesetools are not 100% unique to
(11:33):
this book, to this, to thisperson, this thought leader.
They are tools that I've readand concepts that I've read in
many other places as well, inmany other places as well, and
that I've talked about totherapists and psychologists.
You know, learned over time.
But, as is often the case, whatI find is that this author has
(11:54):
articulated them in a very clearand concise and helpful way,
and so that's why I chose herbook as the one to have some
real fundamental tools, becauseI always like to give you a book
to be able to go research andread more deeply in my concepts
on your own.
So there's so much more to sayabout conflict than what I will
(12:14):
say today, and I highlyrecommend this book because it
has layers and layers ofresearch and beautiful concepts
Again, the Space Between Us byBetty Price, and beautiful
concepts Again, the SpaceBetween Us by Betty Price.
But I'm putting what Iexperienced to be the three most
brilliant concepts,game-changing concepts, here.
Right before I do that, I wantto say on this podcast the other
(12:36):
tools you can use to prepareyourself for conflict management
and resolution with people inyour life, or episodes, and I
will say I do not have theepisode numbers because I have
no Wi-Fi right now at this cabinin the woods, so I'm just going
to tell you the titles.
You're going to have to lookthem up on your own or have AI
look them up for you.
The episode Listen to this.
The episode Listening is Sexy.
(12:57):
Those are two episodes thatgive you the fundamental tools
of active listening andpartnership with others that
take you out of your ego.
The episode, two episodes themodel and the practice.
Those are two.
One is thought management, oneis feelings tolerance.
Those can help you.
The episode feelings are asuperpower for this fundamental
sort of emotional adulthoodskill that we all practice and
(13:20):
become as we become adults.
And then the episode morerecently, and it's titled
something like it's happeningfor you and if you're interested
in that, reach out to me.
If I got the title wrong, I donot have access to it in front
of me, all right.
So top three tools here we go,all right.
The first tool is to focus onthe problem as the problem
(13:45):
that's how Betty Price says itInstead of the person as the
problem.
My mom, who practiced as atherapist for many, many for a
few decades, and I have had manyconversations about this how we
often, when we see ourselves asright, we see the other person
as the problem, see ourselves asright, we see the other person
(14:06):
as the problem.
When we want to get out ofconflict, we can take the
perspective that we are notgoing to focus on the person as
the problem neither the other orourselves but we're going to
identify what problem we'resolving together.
When we do that, in the wordsof Brene Brown, we can sit on
(14:28):
the same side of the table andfocus on solving the problem
together instead of being goodguys and bad guys, instead of
being right and wrong.
So the first tool is taking ourperspective out of that person
is the problem and into theproblem is the problem.
Now, to support that, the firsttool that I read, as I said
(14:51):
this, focusing on the problem asa problem is something that is
a concept that I've heard fordecades.
It's an incredibly helpfulconcept to shift your mindset.
Now the second tool from BettyPrice book that I thought was
just phenomenal and I haven'theard articulated in this way
before, is that all conflictsbetween people boil down in her
(15:14):
thinking to five differentthings.
So let's say maybe that's.
You got to decide where to movewith a partner, roommates, a
family, your workplace.
That's an example.
We got to decide where we'regoing to move, what we're going
to do about something.
A decision must be made.
(15:36):
The second is expectationsaround how communication should
happen.
Happen Now.
Some examples of this are youmight expect that people will
not be attached to their storyabout what's happened more than
they are attached tounderstanding the facts about
what happened.
Maybe that's one expectationyou might have.
Another expectation that youmight have is that people use I
(15:59):
statements and own their ownemotional reaction rather than
blame their emotional reactionson you.
Another expectation that youmight have is that everyone will
have a turn to talk about theirexperience and everyone will
practice listening withoutinvalidating each other.
Maybe one more is that you'llfocus on one problem at a time,
(16:21):
so when one person bringssomething up, the other won't
respond with a different topic.
You'll focus on one topic at atime.
You can tell I'm passionateabout communications because I
have like 50 examples for this.
Okay, but that's a second.
One is expectations around howcommunication should happen.
Number three maybe there's anincident that needs discussion.
Maybe someone spoke to someoneelse in a harsh way that felt
(16:46):
disrespectful and there's aconflict now that needs to be
negotiated.
The fourth is expectations aboutprocess.
So an example might be how adecision is going to be made.
Maybe everybody needs to decideabout a financial decision
within a community or apartnership and one person
thinks they're the decisionmaker and another person thinks
(17:07):
it's a democratic decision thateverybody gets to weigh in on.
That can be another form ofconflict.
And, lastly, is differences invalues.
So this one probably doesn'tfeel quite as obvious but can be
really clarifying when werealize it's not about good
person, bad person, it's aboutdifferences in values.
(17:27):
Maybe someone values freedomand someone else values communal
processes, right.
Maybe someone values opennessabout their life with the people
around them and the otherperson values privacy.
So when we put this into thecontext of a problem, oh, my
(17:49):
value is this, your value isthat there's no better or worse,
there's no disrespect here,it's just a differences in
values.
It can really open up apartnership in negotiating
whatever that conflictspecifically is All right.
So those are the five thingsspecifically is All right.
(18:09):
So those are the five things andthey were very helpful for me
to see outlined in that way andmaybe, if you'd like to, you can
run through any conflicts thatyou have had, have seen or are
experiencing right now, and myexercise for you, if you'd like
to apply this material would beto ask yourself if this isn't
about the people.
What is the problem here thatwe're trying to solve, and which
(18:29):
of the five categories does itfall into?
A decision that needs to bemade?
Expectations around howcommunication should happen, an
incident that needs discussion,expectations about process or
differences in values?
All right, so those are thefirst two of the three fabulous
conflict resolution tools, andthe last one that I'm going to
(18:52):
share is the framework thatBetty Price shared in her book
for conflict resolution.
Now, again, she's pulling fromyou know all of her studies
around conflict resolution.
So this is built off of lots ofresearch and, again, I have
seen many different conflictresolution models, many of which
(19:12):
are great.
I really like this one andthat's why I chose it.
So the first thing, I'm going toshare both the overall concept
of this, and then I'm going toshare with you the actual
process and an example about it.
So, in this process, I'm goingto talk about how you or me,
(19:33):
when we're going into resolvinga conflict, can approach it, and
this is based fundamentally onthe idea that when we really
embrace full responsibility foranything that we contribute to a
situation, that's when we cansolve it.
That's when we can have freedom.
And I know how much our brainsresist that.
(19:56):
The other person did something.
The other person is wrong.
The other person needs toapologize.
I hear you, I hear you, we.
Other person is wrong, theother person needs to apologize.
I hear you, I hear you right,we've all been there.
And no matter how the otherperson has acted, when we can
find the part that wecontributed, that's where our
freedom is, that's whereforgiveness is and forgiveness
is a gift to ourselves.
That's when we can find thatlove for the other person and
(20:21):
boundaries, even if we feel likethey are not accepting
responsibility for theirs.
Really, conflict resolution canbe one person Not ideally, but
it can, all right.
So the concept here is numberone we recognize, accept, heal
or transform our own underlyingemotional process, and this is
(20:44):
straight from the book.
Okay, so we're recognizing ouremotional experience and we're
going to recognize it, accept it, heal it or transform it.
And those are all those otherepisodes that I gave you as
reference tools.
The second step is takeresponsibility for the actions
each person has done to takeharm or to create harm.
(21:05):
And again, this might just beone-sided to start.
It might just be one-sided.
In general, that can be enoughif one person can really
transform their need to be rightand really aim for the goal of
resolution and peace.
And the last thing is, once wedo those two steps, we can
(21:26):
refocus on the problem as theproblem.
Okay.
So next I'm going to give youthis five-part process that
Betty outlines in her book tosupport us in actually doing
this taking responsibility forour side and preparing ourselves
(21:47):
to approach a person or peoplethat we are in conflict with in
a way that will really minimizethe possibility that they will
take a defensive stance becausewe are owning our side of the
problem.
So this framework sounds likethis First I'm going to share an
example and then I'm going tobreak it down into the steps
that she gives, which I thinkare wonderful.
(22:08):
So when we last met, Iexperienced you as speaking in a
way that was harsh and wascriticizing my character.
I felt embarrassed and Iexperienced that as something
that was hard for me to connectwith you and I felt defensive.
I'm not saying it was yourintention to disparage my
(22:29):
character.
I'm not saying it was yourintention to speak loudly or to
make me feel defensive.
And my request, moving forward,is that when we do talk about
things that we're going through,that we really focus on our own
experience and don't makecomments about the other
person's character.
(22:49):
So that is the framework.
Let me break it down.
Step one is we're bringingwhatever happened into the
public is how Betty Price saysit which is like we're moving it
out of all the assumptionswe're all making in our head and
we're bringing it into thelight so that we can say what
(23:10):
our experience is and the otherperson can say what their
experience is.
That way, any assumptions thatanybody's making can actually be
challenged and talked throughtogether.
So first, here is theexperience that I had and I'm
bringing it into the light.
The second step is to own theimpact that the other person had
(23:32):
on us.
So we're not assuming thattheir intention was to hurt us.
We're not saying anything abouttheir intention at all.
If we own the impact that whatsomeone else did or said had on
us, we can do something aboutwhat we've experienced.
Step three we make sure we'renot blaming the other person for
(23:55):
the impact their words oractions had on us.
This can feel hard and it's thetruest thing, because we will
all have a different experienceto different things.
What might be offensive andhard for us, someone else, it
might roll off their shouldersand they might ignore it.
So we're owning.
This is what I experiencedmyself, not this is what you did
(24:18):
to me.
Now, step four if we feel safeenough, we can provide more
information or context.
This is why it felt that way.
This is maybe the history thatI have with this type of thing
that makes it feel extra hard.
But if it doesn't feel safe, wecan keep it shorter.
And number five we're specificabout the action that brought us
(24:38):
into conflict with each other.
So we're not usinggeneralizations.
We're not saying you always,we're not saying this is how you
are.
We're saying this specificmoment where the words felt to
me like they were disparagingagainst my character in this
specific conversation.
That's the problem.
(24:58):
The person isn't the problem.
That conversation and thosewords were the problem.
And person isn't the problem.
That conversation and thosewords were the problem.
And then, lastly and soimportantly, there's just a
super clear request about whatwe would like to see happen next
.
So in this one, it's like anactionable statement that says
my request is in the future,when we're in conflict.
(25:19):
We're not talking about thecharacter of one another and
using statements that aredisparaging to each other's
character.
Instead, we are talking aboutour own feelings and our own
experiences.
So that is the five-stepprocess that I have seen be so
incredibly healing forindividuals, along with active
(25:42):
listening practice.
That's the start of theconversation and then, if
possible, we get into activelistening.
All right, that's what I've gotfor you today, but I'm going to
end with five other quick tipsfor conflict resolution that I
practice and find incrediblyhelpful.
Number one we practice what'scalled unconditional positive
regard for one another.
(26:02):
You can look that up.
I won't go deeply into it, butwhat that means basically, on a
basic level, is that a humanbeing is separate from the
actions they take.
A human being is worthy andlovable, and they are a
different entity than theiractions.
Their actions are separate, andso are we, than their actions.
(26:24):
Their actions are separate, andso are we.
That allows us to practiceempathy and compassion with
ourselves and with others,because we know we are not our
actions.
Our actions are based on awhole lifetime of all different
kinds of things that maybe wechose and maybe we didn't.
Secondly, from E&M, which isthe practice of ethical
non-monogamy, we put therelationship first and we don't
do or say anything that wouldharm the relationship.
(26:45):
I love that practice.
Third, going into a conflictresolution conversation expect
less, expect less from the otherperson.
If I'm expecting someone to bea perfect communicator, I'm
going to be disappointed, but ifI go in expecting less, we
actually might get somewhere.
(27:06):
Number four go in to learn, notto teach.
Go into the conversation tolearn about their experience and
everything that you can learnnot to teach them and, lastly
and most importantly, take 100%responsibility for our own
(27:27):
emotional reactions andperspective on a situation.
This is what I experienced.
This is what the impact wasthat I experienced, because we
will all experience somethingdifferent.
All right, my friends, I hopethis was helpful to you.
As always, reach out if youhave questions or if you have
experiences based on this stuffthat you wanna share.
(27:49):
I'm all ears.
That's what I've got for youthis week and I will see you
next week.
If you like what you're hearingon the podcast, you gotta come
and join us in the Bloom Room.
This is a year-round membershipwhere we take all of these
(28:15):
concepts and we apply them toreal life in a community where
we have each other's backs andwe bring out the best in each
other.
We're all there to make ourideas real, one idea at a time.
I'll see you in the Bloom Room.
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