From Enforcer to Defector: Marty Rathbun's Complex Journey Through Scientology - Scientology Q&A #40 - Blown for Good: Scientology Exposed

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:12):
Hey guys, welcome back to the channel.
Welcome to Blown for Good.
Today we're going to do a livewith Mike Rinder.
Hi everyone, there's Mike andClaire Headley.

Speaker 2 (00:24):
Hey, hello.

Speaker 1 (00:27):
And Christy Colmer Hi everybody.
Here, let's move, let's move us.
So there we go.
We like that better, just so wecan keep all the good stuff on
the bottom.
Thanks for joining us.
Thanks for joining us today.
Guys, this is sort of a I don'tknow what this is, just an SPTV

(00:48):
live stream.
This is not really part of anyseries or anything that I'm
doing on my channel or Mike'sdoing on his channel, but we
wanted to talk about MartyRathbun because for many, many
years he was a very trusted,very high-level executive within

(01:11):
Scientology and then he escaped.
Well, he actually escapedmultiple times, three times.
He escaped three differenttimes and each of the first two
times he was what they callrecovered and brought back.
And then that last time heescaped he sort of got way too

(01:35):
far off the reservation for themto reel him back in and he
started causing a lot ofproblems for Scientology.
Like, I'm pretty sure he wasresponsible for a great exodus
of Scientology Sea Org members,staff members and civilian

(01:59):
Scientologists that were givingmoney to Scientology because
they knew that what he wassaying about Scientology was
true, and so that's sort of, Iguess, is that a good enough
backdrop and we can kind of fillin the blanks as we go.

Speaker 4 (02:15):
Well, I think that we should spend a little time
explaining the significance ofMarty to us and to Scientology,
because he was a really big dealLike he was a really big deal

(02:38):
in Scientology, I mean, he wasbasically to all intents and
purposes.
He was basically, to allintents and purposes, david
Miscavige's right-hand man andmain enforcer for many, many
years, even you know, he blew,left the Sea Org without
authorization a couple of timesand, as Mark mentioned, he was
brought back by David Miscavigehimself, like flying to meet

(03:02):
with him in a hotel in NewOrleans or wherever it was that
Marty had happened to end up andhe came back in disgrace, as
anybody who had blown the SeaOrg was always in disgrace, but
he came back and ended up backin the same position each time.
He ended up back as theinspector general of RTC.

Speaker 2 (03:28):
After escaping Right yes, and despite the fact that
it's a disqualification forReligious Technology Center.
If you have escaped, you can nolonger hold an executive
position.
But that was waived in Marty'scase, Exactly.

Speaker 1 (03:43):
Yeah, I don't know which time it was that he
escaped, but it was.
I want to say it was the timebefore he ended up going to the
free winds with Greg Wilhair.
Was that the first or secondtime he escaped?
I think that was number two.
Okay, when he did that, I wasbeing interrogated in one of
these religious technologycenter interrogation rooms and,

(04:06):
um, the person who wasinterrogating me left like they
had to go do something, and theywere like you need to wait here
and I'll be back.
And uh, and they said I couldbe gone a half hour, go about an
hour, but you can't leave.
I was like, okay, fine.
Anyway, after they left, um,you know, boredom sets in pretty
quickly, especially when you'rein the middle of an
interrogation.
And so I went through theirshredding basket that was in the

(04:27):
room and and I read all the RTCshredding that they had, and
one of the things in there wasit said Marty Rathbun, greg
Wilhair, sabbatical.
And it was that they're goingto go on a sabbatical.
And I'm like, isn't Mark?
Didn't Marty just escaperecently and now he's going on
sabbatical.
And I'm like didn't Marty justescape recently and now he's

(04:48):
going on sabbatical and I didn'teven know what sabbatical meant
.

Speaker 2 (04:51):
I was like I had to look it up.

Speaker 1 (04:53):
They created a new term just for Marty, anyway, and
then I was like, wait a minute,he went to the free wins to go
training and get auditing afterescaping and then they brought
him back and so to me that blewmy mind.
And then when I mentioned it tosomebody they were like, oh,
that's the second time or thishappened before, and I was sort
of like what it happened duringthe IRS handling in the early

(05:19):
90s, right afterwards.

Speaker 4 (05:21):
Like immediately afterwards, maybe a week less
than a week after the exemptionwas granted.
Yeah, he just went.
Okay, I've had enough, I'm outof here.

Speaker 1 (05:31):
Yeah, he's like that was good, I did it, now I'm out
Peace.
Well, he started getting.

Speaker 4 (05:35):
I mean but look, nobody is excluded from the
insanity of Miscavage, and martytook a lot of abuse from david
muskavage was telling him thathe was a suppressive person.

Speaker 2 (05:50):
Yes, right up until the day he escaped that's at
least from what marty told methat was a huge reason for why
he escaped.
He's like well, if I'm assuppressive, then I'm out I, I,
I 100% believe that, claire.

Speaker 4 (06:05):
I mean that he did that basically to everybody.
Yeah, like and and though.
Marty was seen by a lot ofpeople within the sea organ,
within Scientology, as you know,this guy who somehow managed to
escape the wrath of Miscavige,because they didn't see that

(06:26):
part of it, they just saw himbeing the enforcer.
So he was always the bad guy intheir mind because he was
carrying out the orders ofMiscavige.
He took a lot, a lot, a lot ofshit, and I know because I was
around him.
Like Marty and I were the twopeople that were around

(06:47):
Miscavige the most.
When it came to external matters, when something was going on a
legal case, a media flap,whatever it was that was
happening, it was Marty and I,pretty typically, were the ones
who were with Miscavige andthose things that came up were

(07:12):
always priority.
They were what Miscavigefocused on.
If there was an externalsituation, that was always given
priority for him, that wasalways given priority for him.
And so I spent a lot of timewith Marty and I.
I can't say that when I was inthe Sea Org I considered him a

(07:35):
good friend.
I don't think anybody wasreally friendly with Marty.
No, he was not a friendlyperson.
No he had the uh RTC cold chromesteel thing down.

Speaker 1 (07:49):
Yeah, and he also, he and there I don't think there
was anybody at the base who waslike, oh, he's not a big deal,
like if he comes, it was a veryWherever he went wherever he
went.

Speaker 3 (08:03):
When he showed up at CCN, when he showed up at any
other org, everybody he was likeMiscavige in some ways.
You know, there was just thisgodly, it's Marty Rathbun.
Everyone treated him like hewas the second in command to
Miscavige.
All the lowly, all the lowlySea Org members worshipped him.
If he came in and he, you know,he, he carried a big stick.

(08:23):
He had a very serious face andwe were all like, okay, oh shit,
marty rathbun is here.
That's, that's who he was yeah,yeah, and and and.

Speaker 1 (08:32):
We did a.
Um, we did a thing in the, inthe shoot crew, where we we
messed up a film and when we and, and, and.
As a result of that, there wasan investigation of all of the
people in the film unit andMarty was the one running.
Yeah, he was the chiefinvestigator.

(08:53):
And there was a girl and wetold this in the Louis.
I told this story in the LouisThoreau project, my Scientology
Film or my Scientology Movieproject, my Scientology Film or
my Scientology Movie but Martywas.
There was a young woman that wasinterrogating me, giving me a
sex check, and her name wasLaura Dolan and she was sitting

(09:16):
in the counselor's seat and Iwas on the other side holding
onto the cans of the e-meter andMarty was standing behind her
in the room with us.
So if anyone in scientologyknows, when you get interrogated
it's just the counselor and you.
But, um, normally if you'rebeing interrogated by religious
technology center, they have alittle earpiece in and marty

(09:37):
would be talking to her in theearpiece.
But he decided we're gonna skipto the good part on this one
and I'm just to stand behind her.
And in the room he's like askhim again.
Ask him again.
Ask him again.
And I wouldn't admit to thething that David Miscavige sent
Marty down to make me admit tobecause I didn't do it.
And so then he goes.

(09:58):
Okay, we're going to take abreak.
And we walked out of thecounseling room to this little
back room that was right nearthere and we were standing there
and he goes.
Are you going to answer herquestion or what I said?
I've answered every single timeand just out of nowhere he cold
cocked me.
We're standing right in frontof each other.
He punched me Boom right in theface and I stood there and I
took it and I looked and I justkind of looked back up at him.

(10:19):
I said you can punch me another50 times, but I'm not going to
say things that didn't happenbecause somebody wants me to say
that, and so that was sort ofthe end of it and he was sort of
like.
But the best part was thatthere was another girl that was
standing there who was like thereport back, like go run up,
back up to David Miscavige andtell him what's happening.

(10:39):
When Marty punched me, shestarted crying Wow.
Her name was Charlotte Geisler,charlotte, whatever, helt.
When Marty punched me.
She started crying.
Wow, her name was CharlotteGeisler, charlotte, whatever,
helt.

Speaker 2 (10:49):
Charlotte Helt.

Speaker 1 (10:50):
Charlotte Helt.

Speaker 3 (10:51):
And can I just say that's a normal human reaction.
It totally is.
This isn't supposed to behappening.
People aren't supposed to bepunching each other at church,
you know what I mean.
That's a normal human reaction.
What the hell is going on?
This guy just got punched inthe face yeah, not even at
church.

Speaker 2 (11:09):
This is where everybody has given committed to
a billion years, right, likethey have no life anyway.

Speaker 1 (11:18):
This is how we treat them so that was one of my
earliest experiences with mart.
Oh, this guy is not to bemessed with.
He doesn't play around whenhe's doing an investigation,
it's going to come out the wayhe thinks it's supposed to come

(11:39):
out.
The facts are already known byDavid Miscavige.
He has already determined whatthe facts are and everybody
needs to fall into their placein the story and agree that
that's the way it went down.
And I was just like I ain'tdoing it.
I just I don't know what totell you.
You can, we can keep goingaround in circles, but that was
sort of the way Marty handledthings internally.

(12:02):
I'm not sure how he did it onthe outside, but internally that
was sort of it was aGestapo-style investigation and
handling and there was a trailof destruction when one of these
things happened, where peoplewent to the RPF and people, and
a lot of times when Marty wouldcome down and do one of these

(12:24):
investigations, in multipleoccasions that I remember,
people would escape during thisthing, Like there's so much
pressure being put on everybodythat people will pop, and then
usually the narrative wouldchange because it's like oh well
, now we know, Now we know whothe who is, Now we know what
happened and then everybody'slike, who, Like when somebody

(12:47):
escaped everything bad that hadhappened for the prior four
years or so, would get oh, thatwas the person who did this and
they did that, and you'd just belike that person didn't even
have anything to do with half ofthose things.
How did they end up being thewho or the why for that?

Speaker 4 (13:02):
Right, yeah, I remember after, after Marty and
I had left the, the story thatwent around was we were
responsible for crush redging.
Yeah, I have never gotten adollar from anybody ever in my
life in Scientology, and Ididn't think Marty had either.
Nothing, you just weren't?

Speaker 1 (13:23):
you just didn't work in that area of management in
any way, shape or form.

Speaker 4 (13:28):
No, any event.
So I was.
I was wanted to sort of set thestage, because I think
everybody who is watching thisknows that Marty, uh, you know,
turned tail and became anapologist again, or even an

(13:50):
attacker of people like usultimately.
But I want to sort of establishwhat it took to get there and
perhaps a little moreexplanation of why it might have
happened, why this might have,uh, have occurred.
Um and, and you know, Christieand I were talking about it

(14:12):
earlier and Marty is, uh, or was, a very significant person in
the story of Scientology when hewas in and then when he got out
, Because when he got out, itwas huge, that was huge.
It was nothing to begin with.

(14:33):
In fact, Scientology spread aword that Marty Rathbun had died
.

Speaker 2 (14:38):
Yes, I remember that.
In fact, when Marty called me Ithink it was 2009, I remember
his opening statement was hey,it's Marty, you may have heard.
I died and I was like what?

Speaker 1 (14:54):
We actually had a death certificate of a Mark C
Rathbun that lived in the areawhere they had said he went in
Northern California.
No kidding.

Speaker 4 (15:04):
I've never even heard that much.

Speaker 1 (15:05):
Oh no, I had it.
I tracked it down and I got anactual death certificate and it
was everything matched up,except I didn't know Marty well
enough to know when he was bornor any of that stuff.

Speaker 2 (15:15):
But I was like but I knew him well enough to know his
middle initial was C and hisname ended was Mark with a K.

Speaker 3 (15:22):
So yeah, I mean, if Marty hadn't left, hadn't left
and hadn't spoken out and donewhat he did, a lot of people
wouldn't be where they are todayand wouldn't be out.
So he was pivotal in my story.
He was pivotal in me and myex-husband, chris leaving and
Chris started speaking to Marty.
That was the first person hestarted talking to.
And then, when I was braveenough to get on the phone with

(15:46):
Marty, I knew I had crossed aline and I knew that was the end
of it for me and I you knowthat was in 2009.
And that was when a lot ofpeople were starting to talk to
Marty, read his blog, he starteda blog.
He created a huge, hugemovement honestly, and changed
the landscape of that whole timeperiod of you know, he's

(16:06):
contributed a huge amount to thepeople leaving and everything
that's happened now.
And he he went and did the um,the newspaper, what was it
called?
Mike, the the truth.
Yeah, you guys all you guys wereall involved in that, but Marty
was one of the pivotal peoplethat got it started.
He went and met with Joe Childsand Tom Tobin and started to

(16:27):
speak to them and said, hey,let's, I want to talk, I want to
speak, I'm finally ready.
And then you guys all joined inand then a whole bunch of other
people joined in and that was ahuge tipping point for this
whole entire movement Like that,that back then there was
nothing really happening, it waspretty quiet and Marty Rathbun
was kind of the, the person thatcame in and did that and it

(16:49):
dramatically affected my life.
You know, on a personal basis,like I was talking to Marty
Rathbun.
He was the person.
I wasn't talking to anyone elseand that was how I left sort of
Scientology was from mycommunication with him and how I
got declared and I'm just oneperson that and there's many
more who have that kind of storyof connecting up with Marty,

(17:10):
connecting up with his blog atthat time it was, you know, and
one of the things I want to addthat was different about him,
that made it easier for somepeople, was that he wasn't at
that time throwing out theentirety of Scientology, he was
speaking out about the church,right?
So many of us who still werefiguring ourselves out were like
, oh, okay, I can relate to that.

(17:32):
I can relate to the fact thatthis is about the abuses in the
church.
I don't know yet how I feelabout L Ron Hubbard and the
technology and people who hadwins and gains and whatever,
weren't yet ready to throw awaythe entirety of Scientology, but
they were understanding andconnecting to this thing that
Marty was talking about, whichwas the abuses of the church and

(17:54):
the crush regging and thebullshit ideal orgs and all that
kind of stuff, and that waswhat he was a little bit
different than some of the pastpeople that had spoken out about
would just throw the wholething away.
He started out just talkingabout the church, so for many of
us that was something we couldgo.
Okay, I want to hear more aboutthis.
I don't want to hear about howL Ron Hubbard's bad.

(18:15):
I'm not ready for that yet, andso that was a good gradient for
a lot of people who connectedwith Marty at that time.

Speaker 2 (18:22):
Yeah, he offered a gradient Kool-Aid yeah.

Speaker 3 (18:25):
It was a watered down .
Kool-aid.
It wasn't even Kool-Aid because,well, you know, I guess in some
ways he was pushing Scientology, but he was also really
exposing the abuses and we couldall see that for what it was
and go, okay, that makes sense.
And I don't know thatpersonally, I don't know that I
would have been like connectedup with him if it was like, oh,

(18:46):
the whole thing's bad.
I was like, well, I'm not, Idon't know about that.
You know, I needed somethingthat made sense to me that I
could go, yeah, this is bad,okay, and and just peel it away
bit by bit, because sometimesyou're just not ready.
You're not ready to just throwthe whole thing away.
You need a little bit of time,you need some handholding, you
need some.
And Marty was kind of doingthat himself.
He hadn't yet thrownScientology out.

(19:08):
He he knew David Miscavige andthe church was bad, but he
didn't yet know how he feltabout Scientology, the
technology, yep.

Speaker 2 (19:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:18):
And I, and I would tell Claire and I would have
discussions about this when newpeople would come out and I
would tell them just let them dotheir thing, you know they'll.
They just need to be in theworld for a little bit, and they
need to, you guys were so goodat that.

Speaker 3 (19:31):
You guys were awesome at that Cause.
When I came out and I spoke toyou and Claire, it was like
that's exactly what you said tome and it was so nice, as
opposed to my ex-husband who waslike, yeah, come on, like get.
Husband, who was like yeah,come on, like get, like figure
it out already.

Speaker 1 (19:46):
And I was like wait.
I'm not ready yet.
I just you were more patient.
You know Well, I made up astupid thing at the time.
The time in Scientology isdirectly proportional to the
time it takes you to get out ofScientology.
And because some people were infor 40 years, it doesn't.
You can't just be like guesswhat, yeah, like, guess what.
It's bullshit, exactly't.
You can't just be like guesswhat?
Yeah, like guess what.

Speaker 3 (20:05):
It's bullshit.
Like you can't just say it'sbullshit one day You're just
like, oh, okay it's bullshit,like it took some time.
And I think that's one of thethings that a lot of people
liked about Marty was that hewas giving us little pieces and,
you know, explaining thingsthat were happening, and we were
like, okay, that makes sense,okay, this makes sense.

Speaker 4 (20:24):
Yep, and you know there was at the time this
independent Scientology movementthat had sort of grown up
around.

Speaker 3 (20:36):
Marty group to kind of join as they're leaving their
other group, like, oh okay,I've lost everything, but look
there's, here's some people whostill think like me and I can
talk to them and we can havesome something in common and we
can support each other.
And that was that was neededfor a lot of us.

(20:56):
That was helpful for a lot ofus when we left.

Speaker 4 (20:59):
Right, yeah, and, and you know, Christy and I
actually hosted the firstgathering of independent
Scientologists.
We did Like there were otherpeople who had left and become
squirrels and have been targetedby RTC you know David Mayo, but

(21:23):
now the inspector general ofRTC was one of the squirrels,
yeah, in.

Speaker 1 (21:28):
Scientology.
Anyone who leaves Scientologyofficially doesn't practice
Scientology under the directionof Scientology.
If they want to do Scientologyin the real world outside on
their own, scientology labelsthem squirrels because they're
squirreling the technology and LRon Hubbard has written

(21:51):
probably hundreds of thousandsof words about squirrels and
what they do and why they do it.

Speaker 4 (21:55):
They gather nuts around them.
That's why they're calledsquirrels, yeah.

Speaker 3 (22:01):
They alter it, they change it and they don't do it
properly.
So they're not really properScientologists because they're
not doing it with the church.

Speaker 1 (22:09):
And, at the end of the day, scientology doesn't
make any money off of thosepeople.
That is the main reason whythey're squirrels.

Speaker 4 (22:16):
Yes, okay, so just a little more backstory here.
So a part of this independentScientology movement was this
gathering that we held at ourhouse.
We were living in TarponSprings at the time and I guess
there was like 50 or 60 peoplecame to this first one.
A lot of our old friends, peoplethat we had known forever

(22:38):
Jackson and Tiziano and Jamielike there were all sorts of
people there.
Um, and Marty, uh, had hookedup with this woman when he was
in Texas, called Monique orMosey, as everybody knew her,
and he wanted to get married.
So we concocted this littleplan that I would register

(23:02):
myself as a reverend of theindependent church of
Scientology with the PinellasCounty and perform the wedding
ceremony, and that this woulddrive Miscavige and Scientology
absolutely nuts, because we werenow doing the independent

(23:25):
Scientology thing and gettingsort of credence for it.
And I went and got this licenseand told them who I was and
they were like okay, no problem.
So I performed the wedding ofMonique and Marty at our house

(23:46):
during this Independence Dayweekend in July 5th or July 4th
weekend of 2010.
I'm going to show you pull up alittle picture here.
Oh, I can't pull it up.
Which one is it?
The first one?

Speaker 1 (24:01):
With the four shot.

Speaker 4 (24:02):
Yeah, because this is actually from marty's blog.
First independent scientologistwedding.
Oh look how young I look.
Oh, my god, my, oh, my dear.
I shouldn't have.
I should have blurred this faceout oh stop.
It's our most sincere thanks tothe right reverend, michael j
rinder, and organizing wizardextraordinaire christyy

(24:24):
King-Colbran, for pulling off aspectacular first independent
Scientologist wedding.
You two are the best, and thisis on 2010.
2010.
July 5th 2010.
You can see it right up thereat the top.
And then Mark pull up the nextpicture that's me with the
two-ring ceremony.
And the next picture that's mewith the two-ring ceremony.

(24:46):
And the next one here I amgiving a little toast and we
have this banner made.
Congratulations, marty andMosey.
And this is actually taken froma video and that video is still
on Marty's blog and the video isof the whole ceremony today.
I copied this from his blogtoday.

(25:06):
The whole ceremony is on thereand I'll put a link in the in
the um, in the description, soyou can go see that video if you
want.
Um, it's.
You'll see a lot of people inthere, probably that you
recognize.
Okay, so go to the next one.
Um, there you go and look atthis.

(25:27):
July 14th 2010.
Marty is writing about theheadlies and what wonderful
people they are and I gottogether with them and their
lawsuit is complete.
Like scientology is lying andyou know it.

(25:57):
It was sort of over the top ofhow wonderful Mark and Claire
Headley are.
They brought a phony lawsuit.
They were, you know, trying tomake money out of Scientology or
whatever the line is that getsyou that he wants to use in this
post.

Speaker 1 (26:12):
He actually did a declaration for the lawsuit and
he mentions it in this.
Yeah, it's a link for affidavitin support of what we were
saying that.
Yeah, that's exactly how theydo it, right.

Speaker 2 (26:25):
And he just says we forget affidavits in support of
his lawsuit subsequently as well.

Speaker 1 (26:31):
Absolutely.
We all do so.
A lot of people may or may notknow this, but I wrote a book in
2009 called blown for goodbehind the iron curtain of
Scientology, and Marty wrote theforward to that book.
And that wasn't an accident,because at the time, mike, I
don't think you were speakingout at that time in 2008, 2009.

(26:55):
I think you were.

Speaker 4 (26:56):
It started in 2009, in June, with the truth rundown.
That's right.

Speaker 2 (27:01):
Yep, so we'd already finalized the book.

Speaker 1 (27:03):
Yeah, but regardless, marty was the only person that
was at the property for theentire time that I was at the
property, minus I think he.
He escaped maybe six monthsbefore I did Um.
He left in 2004,.
Um is when he did his finalescape and I left in 2005.

(27:24):
Um, and even in when he wrotethe foreword, because we didn't
agree, he believed that hubbardwas good and scientology, the
organization was bad, and I wasvery adamant.
The whole thing is a giant conand everybody involved uh is uh,
hubbard, muscavige, scientology, the whole thing is just a big

(27:45):
giant con.
And they're ripping off peopleand all that.
And Marty and I both escaped ona motorcycle and that's how I
got the idea to leave on themotorcycle.
I was like Marty did it andwho's going to get out of here?
That's higher than Marty.
But when he did that, he wrotethe forward and he sent it to me
and he said forward.
And he sent it to me and hesaid you, obviously you can, you

(28:06):
can edit it, because we don'tshare the same view and I kind
of mentioned that in the forwardand I was like no dude, that's
the whole reason why I'm havingyou do.
It is because we do not agree,and I think your viewpoint is
worth, is worth something, evenif we don't agree.
And and and that's sort of athing in Scientology where

(28:26):
everything has to be black oreverything has to be white.
There can never be gray, therecan never be.
We have, we, we have to pick ateam, and that's it, that's
that's, that's the way it is,and I've always been of the mind
no, that's how they get you isthey put you in teams, and then
you're kind of stuck with yourteam.
Whether you agree with your ownteam or not, you might have

(28:48):
disagreements even with yourteam.
So I'm like no, I think thereare some kind of value of not
agreeing and and you know, evento this day, scientology still
plays that game of trying toseparate everybody into
different teams.
But so even though and I toldhim, I said I'm gonna print your
forward exactly as you wrote itand I'm not modifying a single

(29:11):
letter and to him he kind of waslike what?
Like, he made a big deal aboutthat Right Saying and then when
the book ended up coming out, hesaid it, he did a whole thing
about the book.
And hey, even though we don'tagree on this mark is like yeah,
okay, fine, we don't agree, wedon't have to agree, whatever,
right.
So, um, and I, and the mainreason I did that I said because

(29:36):
marty was there, but alsobecause I knew if marty wrote
the full word, it's going tomake it a very, very tricky
thing for them to challenge thebook, because how can the number
two guy in Scientology agreewith me and everyone else in
Scientology disagrees?
That doesn't work for yourlittle narrative Right.

Speaker 2 (29:57):
Yeah no-transcript.

Speaker 4 (30:31):
It was like a lot of stuff.
We were going, uh, visitingwith the FBI in Los Angeles when
John Bruce so left, I was theone that took him to the FBI in
San Antonio.

Speaker 1 (30:43):
Had them fly out there, I mean it was like I have
to tell you one thing aboutthat real quick.
When the FBI, the FBI called uswhen we were in Burbank, when
we lived in Los Angeles, andthey said we have somebody who
just escaped and somebody who'shelping him escape and we want
to know if we can put them up atyour house in Burbank as sort
of like a safe house, and I'mlike, are we really being asked

(31:06):
by the FBI to be a safe?

Speaker 2 (31:08):
house.
Yeah, and the best part wasthey were like we think you
might know this person and we'relike who is it?
It was John Brousseau.
We're like of course we knowJohn Brousseau, we know about
John Brousseau, but we didn'tknow about Marty.

Speaker 1 (31:21):
So when john brousseau showed up, marty was
with him and I was sort of likeholy moly, you guys are the ones
the fbi is sending us to stayhere anyway, but regardless.
Um uh, marty was a major playeron the bad, on the bad team,
against on the, thescientology's enemy list at this

(31:41):
point with all this stuff,right, mart?

Speaker 4 (31:44):
Marty and Monique were harassed with fair game
tactics worse than anybody Ihave ever seen.
Yeah, I mean literally worsethan anybody.
Every single day, 24 hours aday people knocking on the door.
That goofball, john Allenderwith his stupid hat and Squirrel

(32:06):
Busters t-shirt knocking on thedoor, trying to intimidate
Mosey.
And the GoPros on all of theirheads GoPros on their heads,
driving around on golf cartsRight in like three houses on
their street that their solepurpose was to film them.

Speaker 3 (32:22):
Riding boats behind their house and the little canal
like paddle boats paddle boats.

Speaker 1 (32:31):
They even shot the squirrel busters, even shot
music videos, I know spying onmarty.
I mean it was incessant, it was, it was literally it was.
I mean it was such a big dealthat media, um, media outlets
from all over the world wereflying in to film it because it
was.
They were doing it 100%,overtly, just noisy

(32:52):
investigation, and they didn'tcare who filmed them.
They were being filmed by every, by German media, us media,
danish media, it was.
It was.
It was kind of like.
It was like SPTV was.

Speaker 3 (33:05):
They wouldn't leave him alone.
It was that then he wasspraying them with a hose from
his front yard to get them toleave his property and they
would just stay there.

Speaker 1 (33:15):
He was spraying them with a hose, and that was
another music video that Martymade.
He made a car wash at the car.
He was literally washing hiscar.
It's actually a hilarious.
To this day it stands up, he'swashing his car and these
protesters are walking aroundand in the middle of washing the
car he just squirts them in theface for a second and then goes
back to washing the car and inthe background at the car wash

(33:36):
is the song playing while he'sdoing all this.

Speaker 3 (33:39):
I mean, he was good-spirited about it in that
video, but this was wearing himdown Him and those people being
worn down.
And they weren't just at theirhouse.
Anytime mike and marty wentanywhere, they had so many pis
on them constantly, like so manyincidents.
You know there were times wherethey, their doors were slammed
and cars and all kinds of likedrama, with cars being chased

(34:02):
and being followed, and it wasincessant.
It was.
It was marty and mike and youknow our family that also had
this, but anytime those two weretogether the PIs were like hot
to trot all over.

Speaker 4 (34:14):
They were waiting for us always at the airport.
Dave LeBeau, I mean, there's avideo of us walking up and
there's Dave LeBeau sittingthere.
What are you doing here?
I'm here to follow you.
I'm going to see exactly whereyou're going.
What are you doing here tofollow you?
I'm going to see exactly whereyou're going.
What are you doing?
Yeah, and then the videos of uswith seven pi cars following us
down pacific coast highway,from jason's house and they

(34:34):
crashed into you one time.
It was an accident one time oh,that was that that was outside
of tiziano's house they ran intous, but this was.
This was the way thatScientology was trying to shut
down Marty Rathbun.
And when they started thenstretching it over into going

(34:57):
after Mosey and Mosey had neverbeen a Scientologist she was
sort of converted to you know,marty-style Scientology by Marty
.
She wasn't ever in Scientologyper se.
She met Marty and they gottogether and then he started,

(35:19):
you know, auditing her and shesort of became kind of a
Scientologist for a while whilehe was being an independent
Scientologist.
But when they started goingafter her at her work and
sending dildos to her at heroffice and like going after her
bosses and the people that sheworked with, that was when Ray

(35:55):
Jeffrey, who had represented wehad, found Ray to represent
Debbie Cook and Ray is a very,very good lawyer who is in San
Antonio and he helped Marty andMosey move to another house
where they would theoreticallyhave more privacy and
Scientology set up cameras inthe woods behind their house and
a PI in a trailer park outfitlike just 100 yards away,

(36:20):
because it was a remote location.
They decided to file a lawsuitand this is important because,
oh, I missed a photo.
Oh Look, get that one of Martywith Christy, because this is
our wedding and Marty gaveChristy away because Christy

(36:43):
there's a lot more to this part,mike, if you want me to throw.

Speaker 3 (36:47):
I mean the relationship that I had with
Marty.
So, on a personal level, when I, like I said in the beginning,
when I was leaving, marty was myfriend, he was like a friendly,
fatherly type figure for me.
I lost my family.
Marty was with me through thatentire thing, like helping me
decide what to do, like what,like I went and stayed at his

(37:09):
house.
I stayed with him and Mosey.
They took me in, they I hadalmost no friends, I had no
family.
I was me and Shane atwo-year-old, by myself and then
I would you know, then I wentthrough a divorce and throughout
all of that time period, martyand Mosey were there for me.
They were my closest, probablymy closest friends and he was a

(37:30):
really you know good friend ofmine, a really important person
in my life at that time.
And yes, we asked him to be theminister and he didn't want to
do that.
But so then I said, well, youwalk me down the aisle, and he
did, and that was actuallytowards the very end of our
friendship, was that was kind ofthe last.
I think the last time I evensaw him was that time period and

(37:54):
so anyway, so there was a lotof personal friendship between
me and Marty and Mosey that Ihad with them, and I met Marty
before I met Mike.
So you know that was a verystrong friendship.

Speaker 1 (38:06):
And then also I don't want to.
I want to make sure we don'tforget it.
But wasn't Going Clear in theresomewhere as well, or did that
happen?
I think that happened beforethe wedding.
The Going Clear movie, right?

Speaker 3 (38:18):
I don't remember when Going Clear happened in the
scheme of all that.

Speaker 2 (38:22):
I thought it was maybe 2017 or 16.

Speaker 1 (38:26):
But either way he wasn't Marty involved in the
Going Clear film and some of thestuff that was done with that.

Speaker 4 (38:35):
I don't remember.
I think he was in Going Clear,but I don't totally remember.

Speaker 1 (38:40):
But then after Going Clear we did Louis Thoreau's
movie.

Speaker 4 (38:46):
But even at Going Clear, by the time it came out,
he was already going a littlelike I'm not gonna go do promo
for it.
Yeah, he wasn't there at thepremiere.
Yeah, he was.
He was like you know thesewhatever I'm about to, we're,
we're about to sort of get intonow what happened.

(39:07):
Because I write about this inmy book, because the mystery of
Mahdi has baffled a lot ofpeople.
It baffled me, it continues tobaffle me in many respects and
I'll explain why.
But the lawsuit was filedbecause, at the time, mosey and

(39:28):
Marty were trying to adopt achild, yeah, and they were very,
very worried that Scientologywould mess with them being able
to do and carry out the adoption, that they would come up with
complaints, that they would saythat they were, you know,
whatever they would do, thatthey would mess with it.

(39:49):
And when they discovered thecameras in the trees behind the
house, they freaked out becausethey knew who the mother of the
kid that they were adopting wasand that mother and the father
of the kid had come to theirhouse.

(40:10):
She was a young girl and theyhad come to their house to meet
Marty and Mosey.
And now they freaked outbecause they found these cameras
and they were worried thatScientology would now be able to
identify these people and messit up entirely.
And so the lawsuit got filed ina hurry by Ray and he got a

(40:33):
temporary restraining orderagainst Scientology and David
Miscavige and ReligiousTechnology Center and the
private investigators to preventthem from doing anything
against Monique and Marty, andit kind of shut everything down.
It did shut everything down andthat turned into an incredible

(40:55):
battle that Mosey, who was theplaintiff in the case, with the
assistance of Ray and the otherlawyers who were working with
him, were trumping Scientology.
They were going to win.
They were getting their asseshanded to them left, right and

(41:15):
center.
It was in a little courthousein New Brunfels.

Speaker 3 (41:19):
And Mike, you were so involved.
Mike was flying back and forth.
Mike was spending hours andhours and hours of his free time
.
I mean, these are our friends,these are our closest friends.
Mike is invested with everyounce of his soul to help fight
this lawsuit and to help Martyand Mosey win.
Like when Mike does these kindsof things, he gives it

(41:39):
everything.
If you're Mike's friend andhe's helping you on your lawsuit
, you're good.
Mike is amazing and he will bethere.
And that's what he did.
He was there for them everystep of the way.
I just have to say that, mike,because you put so much into
that, you worked so hard on thatlawsuit to help them.

Speaker 4 (41:57):
Yeah, I, yes, I did.
I mean, I was basically thecontact point for rounding up
witnesses and affidavits frompeople supporting the statements
that had been made by Marty andMosey or Mosey in the lawsuit
and helping, you know, navigate,helping the lawyers navigate

(42:21):
their way through the crazypolicies and way Scientology
approaches litigation.
In any event, it was a long, along battle that was going
exceedingly well.

Speaker 1 (42:38):
I mean, they were and that's when we and that's when
we were shooting the LouisThoreau thing, exactly, exactly.
And you, if you watch that, ifyou want to get an essence of
where Marty was at during thattime, if you watched Louis
Thoreau, my Scientology movie,he's unhinged in the movie
because he was basically beingharassed.

(43:01):
The way we heard it, or the wayI was told, is they were still
trying to figure out how to makeit so they couldn't adopt that
kid all the way up until thatmovie came out.
And then, when that movie cameout, marty had already
flip-flopped to the other sideand said this was all a joke and

(43:23):
I don't support this.
And he was basically denyingeverything, denying everything
he'd said in the film that theyhad shot.

Speaker 2 (43:32):
And a few months before that I had flown to San
Antonio, texas, and shot withMarty for investigation
discovery.
They asked me to participatebecause I was Marty's direct
junior, um, and even at thattime that was like June
approximately and the LouisTheroux movie was, I think,

(43:52):
october.
But even then he was verystandoffish and a little strange
and really the only thing weconnected on was his adopted son
and because my youngest son wasnot that, not that much of a
difference in age, so we kind ofwere like oh yeah, but it was

(44:13):
very tense and unusual and youknow, obviously by that point
I'd known and worked with Bartyfor many years, so it just felt
off.

Speaker 3 (44:24):
And Mike.
You had a visit with him tooonce, right I went to austin.

Speaker 4 (44:29):
I went to austin and I called him and I said, hey,
I'm in austin, I'll drive downto san antonio and see you and
and mosey because they wereliving in a house in san antonio
at that time um, and he waslike, ah well, you know, I don't
know, and he didn't exactlyknow how to say no.
And so because I was veryinsistent, hey man, I'm, I'm,

(44:53):
I'm, I'm, you know, a hundredmiles away, I'm going to come
down and see you.
And I arrived at the house andit was like he, like a, knocked
on the door and it was like thislong delay.
And then he eventually came andopened the door Hi, come in,
not the usual greeting.

(45:14):
And then sort of I sort of satand small talked about the
weather and about their son.

Speaker 1 (45:24):
Which is not something that we do.

Speaker 3 (45:25):
Which is not something that we do, yeah, and
whereas the like.
However, many months beforethat, for New Year's Eve, we
went to their house and stayedat their house with both of our
children and were their guestsand were there for their big New
Year's Eve party and that waswhen they were still doing the
lawsuit and Ray was there andall the friends were there and

(45:46):
it was a big celebration and itwas fun and happy and we took
lots of amazing pictures.
So we were, it was like family.

Speaker 4 (45:52):
Yep.
So when, um, suddenly, one day,out of the blue, there was an
announcement that MoniqueRathbun had dismissed her
lawsuit, like it was likeliterally what yeah?

Speaker 1 (46:15):
When they were slaying it and gonna win yes.

Speaker 4 (46:19):
What, what, what, what.
And I called up Ray and it waslike I don't, you know, they
didn't talk to us, they didn'tconsult with us.
We have no idea what's going on.
This is Ray, Ray Jeffries, thelawyer, the lawyer, and he's
saying I don't know what I'mlike.

Speaker 3 (46:39):
Let me enter in one more thing before this.
So Marty and Mosey were alsohaving talks with someone, we
don't know who or what, hedidn't even tell us, but he
called us up before this, beforethis lawsuit um dismissal
announcement.
He called us and he had a phonecall with me and mike and he

(46:59):
and mosey was there in thebackground, like it was between
marty and mike talking, but meand mosey were there for the
conversation and he basicallysaid something like which sort
of implied there was talks,there was things or they were
negotiating a deal he didn'teven say that.
He just said, let's say therewas something like that.
It was kind of an implicationof if something like that was to

(47:19):
happen.
Mosey and I have talked and wejust want you to know, mike and
Christy, that no matter whathappens, no matter what, you
know, discussions, negotiationscould potentially could happen
with this lawsuit we will notabandon you, mike and Christy.
We will not, you know, walkaway from you, cause sometimes

(47:43):
the church will try to gag youor tell you you have to
disconnect from your friends.
Here's your money, all that.
And they said you know, if wedo any of those things, we may
or may not do them, right, butwe will not abandon Mike and
Christy.
And this was said to me andMike with, like the pure, you
could feel the like okay, good,we're, you're, you're part of

(48:04):
our team, we're family, we're,we were family.
That's how it felt.

Speaker 1 (48:08):
And then and then, so it was a complete Well, let me
show you one other thing too,because this was in our lawsuit.
When we ended up losing ourlawsuit, when it got dismissed
on um, and we basically had topay these legal fees,
scientology sent us a lettersaying you won't have to pay the

(48:32):
45,000 if you become a spy, ifyou turn over the rights to your
book, if you give us anycontacts.
But they only mentioned oneperson by name and that's Marty
Rathbun.
They say you have to turn overall of their contacts with Marty
Rathbun and any others engagedin disparaging CSI and RTC.

(48:55):
And when we got this, I calledMarty and I said Marty, I got
this letter.
And he was like well, you know,if you have to do, you have to
do what you have to do.
And I said no, dude, I don'thave to do anything.
I'm going to write him a check,I'm not turning over anything.

Speaker 2 (49:08):
Yeah, we were like.
No way, oh, and in nocircumstances for them.
Are you freaking, kidding me?
And also, I don't want theirblood money.

Speaker 1 (49:18):
I was sort of like you know, I get it.
If you have to settle, you haveto settle, but I don't have to
settle.
It's 45 K.
I could come up with 45 K if Ihave to.

Speaker 2 (49:28):
Not that it wasn't hard, but we'll do whatever we
have to do.
We're not, we're not going tocooperate with terrorists anyway
.

Speaker 1 (49:36):
So we both, we both sort of had this enough of a
relationship with Marty thatwe're like we're loyal, we're
not, we're not going to throwanybody as part of this
situation that we're in.
We will fight to the end and wewon't take a payout.
We won't be compromised and Idon't even care about the payout

(49:57):
.

Speaker 3 (49:57):
Take the payout.
Some people do take the payout,whatever that.
That, that bullshit.
Don't abandon your friendsbecause there are people who
have decided to settle and whohave.
Like, I'm done with this.
He went through hell.
They harassed the shit out ofMarty.
I wouldn't even like be upsetwith him if he decided to
quietly walk off into the sunsetand take the money and just be

(50:18):
quiet.
But don't backstab your friends.
Don't actually speak poorlyabout Mike Rinder after the fact
.
No, you do not have.
That is not okay.
Like that.
We are here for you, we werethere, it's it.
I mean the relationship withthem was as close as it is with
you guys.
You know what I mean.
Like, like I said, I was attheir house for New Year's Eve,

(50:41):
like that's.
So you know it was such a sucha tight relationship and for
them to then flip it, it was, ithurt, that's.
That's what it felt like.
More, than anything, it was apainful hurt.

Speaker 2 (50:55):
Yeah, and, and.
The sad part at the end of theday is really, who was destroyed
in this mess is Marty.

Speaker 4 (51:02):
Exactly, we were talking about that earlier today
, claire.
For those who don't know, whatthen subsequently happened, was
they withdrew the case or theydismissed the case?
They bought a new house andMosey started a baking company,
or baking cake baking business.

Speaker 1 (51:26):
They call it a bakery .

Speaker 4 (51:27):
Yeah, cake baking business, and they call it a
bakery.
Yeah, cake baking business,it's a cake baking business,
okay I love the therapy oflaughter.

Speaker 2 (51:40):
Can I just say that?

Speaker 1 (51:42):
they call that a bakery here in america.

Speaker 4 (51:44):
Yeah, oh yeah, okay, the lawyers got, um, completely
iced out.
They didn't get anything.
Uh, even though they had spentuh years working on this case
and had taken it further thananybody has ever taken this sort

(52:04):
of litigation againstScientology and have been more
successful, they got zip, zero,nada, nothing.
And then Marty started doingthese crazy brown jacket videos
and they were shot by gold,clearly.

(52:25):
Uh, they were uh, uh, you knowthese scripted looked like the
pow videos that they haveeverybody else do.
You know all our family membersand you know people that used
to work in the seo that come inand say that mark licked
crackers and they're the samesort of set up videos.
And marty started reinventinghistory and claiming that you

(52:49):
know Leah Remini had offered himhuge amounts of money to do the
Aftermath show and that he youknow he had.
He wouldn't do such a thing, hehad rejected all ideas like
that.
And you know people are doingthis sort of stuff, and Mike

(53:10):
Rinder's a liar and Mark Headleyand Tom DeVocht and everybody.
We're all now suddenly bad.

Speaker 1 (53:18):
But but here's I got to say this is the most bizarre
part of or to me, was one of themost bizarre parts of this is
that these were on his blog.
They were putting.
He was putting these videos upon his blog, but the posts that
we showed you before were stillon the blog.
So you have him sayingeverything is white and

(53:39):
everything is white.
And this is why it is.
Even though David Miscavigesays it's black, we know that
it's white.
And now he's coming back on thesame exact blog where these
other things are saying and goesyou guys know that it's white.
And now he's coming back on thesame exact blog where these
other things are saying and goesyou guys know everything's
black.
These guys are saying it'swhite.
David Miscavige has always beentrue about and you're just like
dude, you still have the otherstuff up and the fact that you

(54:01):
downloaded these things of youat each other's weddings and
it's still on the blog.
You're just like how?
And so we all assumed I get it.
He can't take down the badstuff, because then that's going
to give everybody cause andmaybe the lawyers will have a
little bit more to bite into toget the.

(54:21):
You know, you guys made a dealand you left us out of the deal
and all this stuff.
But to this day, all of thegood things that he said about
us and all of the things thatare the truth are up there, but
now all of these new things thatare obviously lies that he was
exactly the polar opposite onthe stance before.

(54:43):
All of these things are in theexact same block.

Speaker 4 (54:46):
And what's so hilarious about this is
Scientology then started citingMarty Rathbun as the source of
valid information about me, orabout Leah, or about Mark or
Christy or whoever, and nobodylistens.

Speaker 3 (55:04):
Nobody listens to Marty Rathbun and nobody listens
.

Speaker 1 (55:06):
Nobody listens to Marty Rathbun, and they still
operate the Rotten Rat website,where they tell everybody that
Marty's a liar and that all theabuse came from Marty, and so
both Scientology and Marty haveboth stories up on both of their
websites.

Speaker 3 (55:22):
And that's what, to me, is what is kind of upsetting
about it.
You didn't have to do that,Marty.
You could have made some otheragreement.
You didn't have to agree toflip flop and talk shit about
all your friends and, you know,betray all your friends because
it was useless.
Nobody is going to listen,Nobody.
Nobody changed their mindbecause of the new content Marty

(55:44):
Rathbun put out.
Nobody decided oh well, nowthat Marty's saying this, I'll
go back to the church.
Or Mike and Mark and Claire andChristie are really bad.
Actually, Nobody listens to aword of it.
It's all useless, so it doesn'tmake any sense.
Like you could have made abetter group, oh, we lost you,
Christie.

Speaker 2 (56:02):
Oh, there you go, Anyway.
Oh there you go.

Speaker 3 (56:05):
Anyway, can you still hear me?
Yes, we can.

Speaker 1 (56:08):
You just got so excited that the mic was just
like.
I can't I can't Overload.

Speaker 3 (56:12):
Input overload.
It just doesn't make any senseto me.
It's just a completelyridiculous, pointless thing that
he didn't need to do.

Speaker 1 (56:28):
And in the end I think that was definitely part
of Scientology's plan is thatwe're just going to make his
opinion useless, because he saidboth sides.

Speaker 4 (56:31):
he's played both sides of this game, so now you
don't know what side is the realside Right, and he ends up
looking like a complete idiotyeah, he looks like a double

(56:55):
agent yeah everybody knows, andtruly maybe he just doesn't care
, and and if that's how he feelsabout it, uh great, but it's
just, it's not he, he clearlydoes care somewhat and that's
why that's what promptedactually us to do this tonight
was because he the only thingthat we have seen from marty for

(57:17):
some time is his brown jacketvideos.
Yeah, that's been it.
And oh, he wrote a review of mybook saying it was all
egocentric, self-centered, blah,blah, whatever.
I didn't even remember.
I read it and I was like, ohokay, it's kind of typical.
I mean, one thing about Martyis he writes in a very, very

(57:41):
obtuse manner.

Speaker 2 (57:43):
He does.

Speaker 3 (57:45):
That's putting it mildly.

Speaker 2 (57:47):
Yeah, that's gentle, gentle words, Mike.
Good job His writing.
He pontificates.

Speaker 1 (57:53):
Well, he's writing about historical things that
happened and somehow correlatingthem to Scientology, and then
quoting Nas.
And you're just like what?
Did you just quote a rapper aspart of your article?
And you're just like.
What is Marty?
What is going on over atMarty's house?

(58:14):
That he's listening to Nas andbeing inspired to write
historical articles aboutScientology.

Speaker 4 (58:21):
Right In any event so confusing he just confuses.

Speaker 3 (58:26):
You try to read it and it's just confusing.

Speaker 2 (58:28):
Yeah, you go.
What's?
What's the point of writing?
Is it to leave somebodyconfused or is it to communicate
?

Speaker 3 (58:35):
something to somebody , and not all of his writing was
like that in the beginning.
Some of it was really amazingand it was like, wow, this is so
good.

Speaker 4 (58:43):
And when Marty writes about here is what happened,
it's pretty clear.
When Marty writes about here'swhat I think about what happened
, it gets really confusing, likelike impossible to follow
usually.
So recently I got sent a ascreen cap from someone who is

(59:06):
on LinkedIn and Mark pull thatone up because I can't do it.
The first one there andactually this little thing is
from a LinkedIn page that's MarkRathman, spiritual Guidance,
and actually even has a pictureof him in.

(59:27):
I think that's one of the brownshirt.
No, actually I think that's aninterview I was gonna say that
was a tv interview.
Yeah, anderson cooper the inchwives, or whatever so, uh, and
you know, san antonio, spiritualguidance.
I'm thinking, wow, that's alittle weird, marty's offering
spiritual guidance at this point.
So then another.

(59:48):
Then he changed his page a bit,his LinkedIn page, and I got
sent another one Spiritualguidance, writing, consultation
and a little quote down hereblessed are those who have
undergone ordeals, they haveentered into life, the Gospel of
Thomas Thomas.
I don't know.

(01:00:08):
The Gospel of Thomas Thomas, Idon't know.
I guess it's a Bible.

Speaker 1 (01:00:11):
I think it's a.

Speaker 4 (01:00:13):
The Gospel of Thomas.
It must be.
It's a Bible.

Speaker 2 (01:00:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:00:18):
So he is sort of offering himself up for to help
people, and that to me, me isvery ironic.
Yeah, just a little Ironic thatsomeone who has lost his way so
terribly and has betrayed somany people and sort of all over

(01:00:45):
the map thinks he is in aposition to be offering
spiritual guidance to anybody?
Is that this one?
Yes, this is Marty Rathbun athis finest, most obtuse, absurd

(01:01:20):
writing about what God is andhow he's come to understand God
and his experiences, and I'm notgoing to read it.
We'll have it in a link andyou'll be able to see it, but it
is like crazy talk.

(01:01:41):
This is not.
This is this is sort of sad tome.
This is this is sort of sad tome.

Speaker 1 (01:01:48):
Um, and we who have known Marty very somebody just
told a dog somewhere to shut up.

Speaker 2 (01:01:58):
We don't know where that came from, but I heard it
loud.

Speaker 1 (01:02:00):
I'll tell her to Emmy Shut up, emmy, come on, take it
easy.

Speaker 4 (01:02:04):
That must've been Shane, yeah, and in any in any.

Speaker 3 (01:02:07):
I mean, emmy didn't like the the god article from
yeah yeah, yeah, not.

Speaker 2 (01:02:12):
Emmy did not approve, neither did I, by the way like,
really sorry, mike, weinterrupted.

Speaker 4 (01:02:17):
Go on, no I I didn't really have too much to say
about it other than it's kind of.
It's kind of sad he's.
He's become like a a lonelylittle hermit sitting in a room
somewhere writing about thingsthat he thinks are really,
really important and that theworld should know about, should

(01:02:40):
hear his opinion on these things, and I don't know Anybody.
You can go read it and see whatyou think.
But it's like I was going tosay, for those of us who have
known Marty closely over a longperiod of time, he has always
had a tinge of insanity.

Speaker 2 (01:03:03):
Yeah, I completely agree with that.

Speaker 4 (01:03:04):
He has always had this sort of slightly.
You're worried that maybe he'sgoing to go off the deep end.

Speaker 2 (01:03:12):
Right the amount of times that I watched him.

Speaker 1 (01:03:14):
And he did every once in a while.

Speaker 2 (01:03:16):
Yeah, the amount of times that I watched him in a
conference room at the base,granted, so you know, none of us
were in a sane, safe space butwhere he would turn purple and
just snap pencils and you know,like, just like, wow, unhinged
much.
I mean, you know, even in thatscenario where there was a lot

(01:03:37):
of unhinged things going on,still, I you know, but
nonetheless I don't wish bad forhim and I and I feel sorry for
for the misery he's brought onhimself.

Speaker 4 (01:03:48):
Frankly, yes, absolutely correct.

Speaker 2 (01:03:56):
And.

Speaker 4 (01:03:56):
I have assumed that his motivation for, and Mosey's
motivation for, dismissing theirlawsuit was in order to.
I can just imagine theconversation that went down If I
was presenting this from theScientology side, trying to

(01:04:17):
reach some sort of a deal withMarty Rathbun.
I would be saying to him Marty,you're 69 or 74 or however many
years old.
You have a six-year-old or aseven-year-old son.
You have always been concernedabout his future and being able
to provide for him.
You have nothing, you have nomoney, you don't have a house,

(01:04:42):
you don't have anything.
What if you drop dead tomorrow?
What's going to happen to yourson and to mosey?
And I believe that that wouldbe, uh, the go button for marty
and that he would take that overand above anything else and

(01:05:02):
protect his son and protect hiswife, uh, at whatever whatever
the consequences were Right.

Speaker 3 (01:05:12):
That's why he could have still done that without
screwing the consequences.

Speaker 4 (01:05:16):
Well, I understand that's.
That's where you're right.

Speaker 3 (01:05:19):
He could have, he could have he could have
protected his wife and protectedhis son and gone off peacefully
and quietly and never spoken aword again and not stabbed us in
the heart.
He could have done it that way.

Speaker 2 (01:05:32):
Though, as we all discussed earlier, scientology
pushed Marty to the breakingpoint and that was very clear to
all of us when we watched theLouis Thoreau documentary that
he was pushed to the point ofbeing unhinged was pushed to the
point of being unhinged.
Not to mention the fact that,because of the extensive
harassment of marty thatscientology carefully executed

(01:05:53):
they had plenty of documentationlike remember, didn't he get
arrested on his wedding night innew orleans?

Speaker 3 (01:05:59):
and they had his mug shot.
Oh right, right, right, right.

Speaker 1 (01:06:03):
Oh yeah, they did everything they could do well he
assaulted a police officer,except the police officer was a
horse.
So he punched a horse onBourbon Street and I don't
support any abuse of horses.

Speaker 2 (01:06:14):
Yeah, neither do I.

Speaker 1 (01:06:15):
And neither do the New Orleans Police Department.
No, so understandablyunderstandably.

Speaker 2 (01:06:21):
I'm just saying that Scientology had plenty of fodder
in their bin to use on Martyyeah plenty of fodder in their
bin to use on marty.

Speaker 3 (01:06:30):
Yeah, yeah, I mean for sure.
At the end of the day, we candefinitely put the majority of
the blame on scientology, davidmiscavige and elron hubbard for
marty's current stats yeah,let's, let's not forget, let's
not forget he's also.
He's also a person that couldhave made a better choice, but
let's not forget scientology.

Speaker 1 (01:06:46):
and David Miscavige, in particular, knew all of
Marty's problems, hisidiosyncrasies, they knew
everything.
So they played it exactly howthey should have played it to
drive him to do what he did?

Speaker 2 (01:07:04):
Yes, absolutely.
That's exactly what I was goingto say.
Yes, that's exactly rightBefore we get too much further
the gospel of Thomas is an extracanonical sayings gospel.

Speaker 1 (01:07:17):
It was discovered near Nag Hammadi, Egypt, in
December 1940, and it's 114sayings of Jesus.

Speaker 4 (01:07:23):
And Amy Scobie says that quote Thomas is is not from
the Bible.

Speaker 2 (01:07:27):
Yes, we stand corrected.

Speaker 1 (01:07:28):
I'm just saying I want to correct my part of the
Bible nonsense.
We will never profess to beexperts on the Bible.
Hey, what do I know?
I grew up in a cult.

Speaker 2 (01:07:34):
No offense intended.

Speaker 3 (01:07:35):
We don't know anything about anything
regarding that kind of stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:07:38):
We grew up in a Bible-thumping cult.

Speaker 4 (01:07:39):
we grew up in I did play Angel school.

Speaker 2 (01:07:52):
I did too.

Speaker 4 (01:07:53):
Okay, so do you want to do a few quick things and
then?

Speaker 1 (01:07:57):
I have one other blog .
I have a blog post I'm justgoing to put it up Cause I don't
know.

Speaker 3 (01:08:02):
Oh yeah, that was us.

Speaker 1 (01:08:03):
I can't.
This screen is so tiny on my Iknow.

Speaker 3 (01:08:09):
I just want to say one other thing which is goes
along with what Claire said, andit I mean truly.
I don't wish Marty any ill will.
I don't, and I don't think anyof us do we.
I wish him peace and happinessand joy with his wife and his
child, because he did a lot ofreally good things too.
Um, you know and I again, we'rehurt.
I was hurt by his betrayal, butI don't.

(01:08:29):
You know, he, he was a goodfriend, he really was for me and
Mike.
We were very close with Martyand Mosey.
So I want him to, I want him tobe happy and be at peace and
you know, I don't think he is,but I I hope that he will be at
some point.

Speaker 1 (01:08:45):
Yeah, the one thing that Scientology always tries to
do is they.
They cannot have connections.
So if if SPs are talking toother SPs, they will do
everything they can to try anddisconnect them from each other,
even if they're not connectedto Scientologists.
They don't even want them to beconnected to each other because

(01:09:05):
that's how they can sort ofcollaborate and do what they're
doing.
And when Scientology goes afterone of these people, this is
the kind of stuff that they do.
We don't usually talk about thisstuff on the channel because
we're not trying to bringattention to what's being done

(01:09:26):
to us.
We're trying to expose whatScientology is doing.
So when Scientology and they'vebeen doing this since the early
days of the internet where theyget trolls or they get plants
and they get them to infiltratethe group, and then what they do
is they start to causeinfighting and they spread
rumors.
And in Scientology they have athing called the third party law

(01:09:49):
or the third party rule, and ifthere is a quarrel, there is
always a third individual whosaid something to either one or
both of these people, kind ofgave them a little bit of gossip
or a lie to each of them thatthe other one said and they
create conflict.

Speaker 2 (01:10:07):
Intentionally so.

Speaker 1 (01:10:08):
Yeah, and Scientology flips that around like oh, this
is how you discover if there'sa conflict, this is how you do
it.
Well, they turn it around theother way and they go this is
how to create conflict.
So whenever I'm trying to bevery, I'm being be very, choose
my words.

(01:10:28):
When, whenever there's dramawithin the Scientology exposed
kind of community and SPTV, orwhether it's on the internet or
if it's on YouTube or onFacebook, scientology is always
there trying to stir the pot andtrying to cause trouble and we

(01:10:49):
try to, as best as we can,ignore the drama because it's
just a distraction.
It's meant as a distraction forus and it's meant to divide and
put everybody onto one side andthat sort of thing.
But the one thing it tells usis when there is high drama and
it's going on like this, thatwe're doing something right
because Scientology are goingnuts trying to stop us.

(01:11:13):
So if you I know YouTube issort of the way that YouTube
works is some channels like thedrama, because it creates more
viewers and it creates moresubscribers, and so YouTube
channels sort of just channelsabout comedy and comedians.
I watch these things and I seethe drama.

(01:11:33):
We try not to embrace the dramabecause that's not the goal.
It's like we're at a game andwe're on the field playing the
game and some dude just took adump on someone's car out in the
parking lot.
That has nothing to do withwhat we're doing here.
Just because Scientology istaking dumps out in the parking
lot, that has nothing to do withwhat we're doing here.
Just because Scientology istaking dumps out in the parking
lot, we're not going to coverthat because we don't care about
that.
We're trying to expose them andplay the game right here in

(01:11:56):
front of us.
So, if you are wondering why wedon't talk about those things
whenever they come.
This has been going on for 20,we've been doing this since 2006
.
Claire and I we've seen this ahundred times in a hundred
different uh variations and um,so we're sort of numb to it.
But some of maybe some of these-well, but either way, some of

(01:12:17):
these new creators that arecoming in like, oh, I'm gonna
tell my story and then you'relike, whoa, I wasn't expecting
this.
You're like, yeah, this, thisis, this is for realsies.
We play for keeps on this inthis game and um and the.
And the last thing I wanted tosay was the people that
sometimes the people that cave,they don't.

(01:12:37):
They didn't sign up for theirentire personal life to be aired
out on the internet and becomeall this thing.
Well, unfortunately, when weleft, that was just flushed down
the toilet, so that was takenoff the table right off the bat.

(01:13:11):
For us.
So we're kind of like at thepoint where, like, we got
nothing left to lose, but someother, some people aren't like
that.
So if you see people come andgo and kind of disappear from
the scene, they might havegotten in a little over their
head to what they thought thiswas going to be like, and so and
, and I don't want to, I don'twant to, I don't want to, I

(01:13:35):
don't want to put those peopledown for deciding to bow out
because, that's their choice.
Nobody has to do this.

Speaker 3 (01:13:46):
And there have been people that walked away and and
walked away and just quietly didtheir thing, which is a little
different than what Marty did,and and, but yeah, you're right,
it's very different.
Very different.

Speaker 2 (01:13:58):
But you know, each person has to walk their path
and we're not we're.
It's not any of our roles, norour intention to judge anybody
for their choices, because thefact of the matter is that any
day of the week, exposing abillion dollar cult is not for
the faint of heart and and martyrathbun, for all the bad, did

(01:14:18):
so much good like on this side,on our side, he really did
change a lot and that stuff I'mstill grateful for.
Yep I agree okay find love, nothate yeah I love, you love

(01:14:39):
festival.

Speaker 1 (01:14:41):
Okay, um, okay, oh, before I'm gonna hide this.

Speaker 4 (01:14:45):
Wait, wait, wait, wait.
But before we go we have to,Did you copy.

Speaker 1 (01:14:52):
I did that's.
That's exactly what I'm sayingI'm going to do before we do
that.

Speaker 2 (01:14:56):
We have some follow up.

Speaker 1 (01:14:57):
We had a live stream yesterday, and right before the
stream some comments popped upand we had already ended the
stream by the time they showedup on our end and guess what I'm
going to show them.
So this is one.
It says it was from Mrs T Roosh.
Is it Rush?
I?

Speaker 2 (01:15:16):
think it's, rush, rush.
We all think it's.

Speaker 3 (01:15:18):
Rush.

Speaker 2 (01:15:18):
No.

Speaker 1 (01:15:19):
I asked about little man syndrome and corrected the
pronunciation of my name.
Did anyone do a deep dive onDave's Napoleon complex?
I don't think anybody's done adeep dive, um, but I do know.
Um, I did find out recentlythat Napoleon was taller than
David Miscavige.
So I mean, that's gotta be,that's gotta have something to

(01:15:42):
do with something, um, okay, thenext one is I went to William
and Mary oh, this is the person.
I can't read it because it'sgot the forward on it but I went
to Williams and Mary.
So you loved Williamsburg.
Mike, still celebrating thegood news about your health.
God bless you and you both.
Okay, good, nice.
Thank you, christy Lee Wilson.
Did Rosemary have to pay thecredit card debt that Osa

(01:16:04):
charged to her account?
She did right.

Speaker 2 (01:16:07):
She paid off all those cards.

Speaker 1 (01:16:09):
Yes, she paid them all off.
Yeah, so they stole the moneyand then she paid off the cards,
and then they paid her back andthen they direct deposited all
that money back into her accountbefore um the uh feds could
bust down their door.
Eight points of art out ourfactor.
Having an aussie as a bff, youshould know better.
Temperature and uv rays don'thave a relationship yeah, that

(01:16:31):
was for you about the.

Speaker 2 (01:16:32):
Yeah, because look at your bright, shiny forehead in
that picture.

Speaker 4 (01:16:35):
I know it was really.

Speaker 1 (01:16:37):
I ever got was skiing in colorado, that's true, I
remember, uh, you saying thatwhen you but you know, but today
I look a million times better.
It was really.
I mean, I just got off theriver and came and did the live,
you were still overeated.

Speaker 2 (01:16:51):
Can I just say my favorite moment of yesterday was
when Mark called bighorn sheepbullhorn sheep.
It was amazing.

Speaker 1 (01:17:01):
I'm glad you were amused.
I'm glad you were amused.
My brain was on overdrive, okay, Overtime overdrive, Okay.
So we did show your super chatsfrom yesterday.

Speaker 3 (01:17:12):
And she just commented that it's Rush.

Speaker 1 (01:17:14):
Rush.

Speaker 3 (01:17:15):
It's Rush.

Speaker 2 (01:17:17):
R-U-S-H.

Speaker 4 (01:17:18):
I saw that yesterday.
I know R period.

Speaker 1 (01:17:20):
U period S.
Period H there's some words Ijust always want to say a
certain way.

Speaker 4 (01:17:24):
It doesn't matter how many times I tell them.

Speaker 1 (01:17:28):
Okay, here now to start off today, mrs t rush rush
, I would be wrong, but I'vealways thought marty is a
sociopath.
He enjoys being the enforcer.
What do you think?
Yeah, he didn't not like it.
I'll tell you that it didn'tseem to not like it.

Speaker 2 (01:17:45):
Yeah, I would agree with that hey, by the way folks
segue, I thought of a, a newname for this show, right here
oh yeah mc squared, get it yeah,mc mnc and mnc mark.

Speaker 1 (01:17:59):
I know I thought of it, the other day, but I wasn't
going to tell anybody oh, it'sso good, my brain recovered and
was like yeah, don't say thosewords out loud um, that's a good
one Claire, Good job.

Speaker 4 (01:18:09):
Thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:18:10):
Dastardly saboteur.
Was he ever assigned to the RPF?
No, I don't think so.

Speaker 2 (01:18:15):
No, no, he was not.
Are we talking about Marty?
But?

Speaker 1 (01:18:18):
even in the seventies , and all that stuff.

Speaker 4 (01:18:20):
No, never.

Speaker 1 (01:18:22):
You know Matt.
You know another person whoknows a lot about Marty is Matt
P.
You know another person whoknows a lot about Marty is Matt
Pash, because he and Martyjoined the Sea Work at the same
time back in the 70s.

Speaker 4 (01:18:33):
Right, and I think Matt was the first person that
Marty reached out to.

Speaker 2 (01:18:37):
Yes, I saw Amy Scobie commented about that.

Speaker 3 (01:18:40):
Amy and Matt helped to get Marty to actually start
speaking out.
They were the ones.
They went there and startedtalking to him about the
disconnection and then he gotreally upset.
He was all quiet, not doinganything, and he got all worked
up and was like I got to dosomething and yeah, so yeah, all
of us.

Speaker 1 (01:18:56):
you know, you guys think this happened by accident.
All of the people that you see,you know Matt and Amy and Mike.
We we've been doing this for along time before.
Before we were on YouTube, wewere still doing this, just not
with 2,000 people watching live.
Noel Goldberg watched videoupdate on Mike's health.

(01:19:18):
Who knew that the best possiblenews would be that Mike is a
mutant who has lost his innerglow?
Lol.

Speaker 3 (01:19:24):
Mike is a mutant, I tell you.

Speaker 2 (01:19:26):
BTs activate baby.

Speaker 3 (01:19:33):
BTs activate Okay.

Speaker 4 (01:19:34):
Boom, lol, bts activate, baby bts activate,
okay, boom.
We need like a teenage mutantninja turtle name for you now,
mike yeah, yeah, mike the mutantof scientology is gonna do.

Speaker 1 (01:19:39):
They got a website cooking up right now yeah, we'll
just call you magic mikesuppressive pup says question
Was there ever any writings fromLRH about dealing with people
with violence?
Oh, absolutely.

Speaker 4 (01:19:53):
There is a.
There is a pretty famous,infamous advice, which is a
Hubbard writing that was neverpublished as a policy letter but
is to be treated the same wayto David Miscavige about a down
dog and every now and then youhave to beat people in order to

(01:20:14):
get them to be obedient andteach them a lesson.
Miscavige used that routinelyto justify what he did.

Speaker 1 (01:20:22):
Yeah, and when somebody might say like if he
would see somebody like goinglike Ooh, I don't know about
that, he'd be like hey, listen,LRH said you got to do this.
This is the way.
This is why I'm not doing this,because I'm a meanie.
I'm doing this because Hubbardsaid you got to do it every once
in a while.

Speaker 3 (01:20:38):
And then there was a flag order too, about when the
ship's about to hit the rocks.
It's okay for officers to yell.
It doesn't talk about physicalviolence, but it talks about
yelling Well the knowledgereport says take the person in a
dark alley and do whatever yougot to do.

Speaker 4 (01:20:54):
If you come out when he's got a black eye, then you
know, everybody knows so even inaddition go ahead that SEARC
members coming to physicalaltercation is not actionable

(01:21:17):
other than if it damages someone, so they can't do their job.

Speaker 1 (01:21:21):
Yeah, so you could rough somebody up.
As long as they can work, we'regood, yep.

Speaker 3 (01:21:26):
So that's numerous policies right there.
There you go, mark Fisher.

Speaker 1 (01:21:31):
Mark Fisher's Las Vegas travel and more.

Speaker 4 (01:21:34):
He's got a new blog, a new YouTube channel.

Speaker 1 (01:21:37):
I'm sorry, okay, he said a word here.
I'm just going to read the gangand then it rhymes with gang
but it starts with a, b.
Sex checks were started by DMat ASI, completely so just
started by David Miscavige atAuthor Services Incorporated.

Speaker 3 (01:21:52):
Right, Completely crazy.
Is that a word we're notallowed to say on YouTube?

Speaker 1 (01:21:55):
I'm going to err on the side of not you know,
because you know we're not doinga video about that and if you
but that was a term used in theSea Org If there are multiple
people interrogating you.
That's what it was calledwithin the Sea Organization and
it was a known thing, I thinkthat and then that got.

Speaker 4 (01:22:30):
I'm not sure Mark whether that began before or
after, but the first widespreadimplementation of that
particular technique was at theSan Francisco Mission mission
holders convention, yeah, wherethey just lined them up, yep,
and it was yeah two, yeah three,four people at once, and that
was definitely, I'm gonna saywithout a doubt that was during
muscavige's era, not duringhubbard's era.

Speaker 1 (01:22:45):
That was a muscavige-esque, or the people
that were working with him atthe time, kind of thing.

Speaker 4 (01:22:51):
Well, don't get too certain about that, because that
transcript of that whole thingwas sent to Hubbard.

Speaker 1 (01:23:00):
Well, no, but I'm saying he wasn't the one Hubbard
.
I don't know of any instancesof Hubbard partaking in that.
Yeah okay.
Yeah Okay, not that he didn'tknow of any instances of Hubbard
partaking in that, yeah, okay.

Speaker 4 (01:23:08):
Yeah, okay, but I don't know, not that he didn't
know about it.

Speaker 2 (01:23:10):
We're not defending Hubbard.
Yeah, you know what.

Speaker 1 (01:23:14):
I was thinking the other day, bts have gotten a
little one.
No, listen to me, if your namewas, if your nickname when you
were a kid was Laffey, you mighthave been a little bit unhinged
too.
Hubbard's first name everybodycalls him l ron hubbard.

(01:23:35):
His first name is lafayette.

Speaker 4 (01:23:36):
Okay, if there are any bullies around.
When he was a kid they were onduty for that.

Speaker 1 (01:23:37):
It was, and he jumped on them from a 10-foot fence.
Yeah he beat them up I thinkthere's stories about that
colonel snake thompson that wedon't know about as well, an
older military gentleman on aboat hanging out with a little
kid yeah, that liked to have acat in his cabin, and LR Hubbard
was hanging out with him fulltime.
There's untold stories on thisHubbard childhood.

Speaker 3 (01:24:03):
Thank you for that, Mark.

Speaker 1 (01:24:04):
Fisher, Mitch Brisker .
Thank you for being in the chat, Mitch.
After he blew, Miscavige wasfond of saying.
Marty's mom receivedelectroshock therapy when Marty
was in the womb.
Marty and Dave were bottomlesspits of evil.

Speaker 2 (01:24:18):
Okay, David Miscavige said that many times before
Marty blew too.

Speaker 4 (01:24:23):
Yes.

Speaker 3 (01:24:25):
That's the kind of thing you don't say, you don't
tell people that Like if that'strue or not true.
That's personal informationRight.

Speaker 1 (01:24:34):
David Miscavige one time told me that my mom was the
stupidest Sea Org member thathe had ever encountered and that
when he met her on the RPF heleft her on the RPF because she
was so stupid that she deservedthe RPF for being that stupid
and then didn't know, becauseshe had a different last name,
that that was my mom.
Mountaindew X97,.

(01:24:56):
Mike, read your book and wasshocked to find out that you
were out here in the Buffaloarea.
Have you by chance heard ofEllie Perkins and her passing?
Absolutely.

Speaker 4 (01:25:07):
Yeah, I'm pretty sure everybody in Scientology has
heard about that one.
Yeah, we watched the show.
Spoke to various relatives, yes.

Speaker 2 (01:25:17):
Yeah, jeremy Perkins has done a number of interviews
on YouTube.

Speaker 1 (01:25:23):
Yeah, Sarah Blodgett, I remember that Marty had a
brother who was mentally ill.
Do you think some of Marty'sactions reflect some mental
instability?
Well, that's kind of his MartyRathbun's origin story.
Thank you for that, sarah, verygenerous.
There was a fight, a bar fight,that Marty was involved in and

(01:25:47):
his brother came to stick up forhim and, you know, settle it
and his brother was stabbed andpassed away in that scenario.
And then very shortly afterthat, in the very early years of
Marty's Sea Org career, he wasassigned to watch a woman whose
husband had threatened to endher with a firearm.

Speaker 2 (01:26:13):
And this was at the big blue buildings in Los
Angeles in the late 70s.

Speaker 1 (01:26:17):
Yeah, and Marty was put in charge of watching that
woman so that she wouldn't beharmed by the husband, and the
husband showed up at the complexand the husband ended her with
just like he said he would.
And that was on Marty too.

Speaker 2 (01:26:30):
So isn't it true that Marty Rathbun and Ken Hoden
both were temporarily arrestedwhen that happened because they
were both at the scene of thecrime?
That's, that's at least whatMarty told me.

Speaker 4 (01:26:44):
That meant.
I don't know about that, claire, but I know that he was
literally in the line of fire.
Yes, like he wasn't, likewatching from 100 yards down the
street and this whole thingabout Marty's family his brother

(01:27:04):
, his mother, his mother had allsorts of problems.
His brother, his mother, hismother had all sorts of problems
.
Genes and how the environmentin which they were raised

(01:27:28):
affects their, the way that theyapproach life then you would
absolutely conclude that thishad a big impact on marty.

Speaker 2 (01:27:38):
yeah, yeah, and and again, I don't know any of the
facts, but I recall marty sayingthat when he was approximately
six is when his mother endedherself.
So all of that is you know.
Always I looked at marty as atraumatized person before and

(01:28:00):
not ending with his involvementin yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:28:05):
Okay, okay, good.
And then Jolene Harris.
Behind the Bastards is apodcast that has comedians on to
tell the stories of the worstpeople in history.
Mark should reach out to do aDM episodes.
Okay, I'll check it out.
Thank, we'd be both.
We'd be a double feature,exactly.

Speaker 4 (01:28:28):
Miscavige.

Speaker 1 (01:28:29):
Marty, everybody, jay Beans, was it hard to forgive
each other for the effed upS-C-O-S-M-A-G-E-D-U to each
other?
I'm a never am but a traumasurvivor and that would be near
impossible.
Fortunately for us.
I think for the most part, eventhough Mike is, he's sort of in

(01:28:50):
, he's written.
He writes some of the spy filesthat I cover in my thing.
I was already gone by that partand I already wrote.
I was already.
I knew he was up, I knew he wasdoing that.
So it was sort of like it waslike that was his part and I had
my part.
So it was sort of like I'm notgoing to blame Mike for the part
he was there to play.
But but when we were there andI think we've covered this

(01:29:13):
before I don't think we really,mike and I, we worked together a
lot and we were pretty muchboth like we're doing our job
and we're doing our thing and noreason to really be evil to
this guy for any particularreason, because he doesn't seem
to be, you know, a guy that Iwould do that with, but I wasn't
.
I mean, anybody who was at theend base can comment.
I was sort of like I wasn'tthere for the politics and all

(01:29:34):
that.
I was just trying to get my jobdone and I was however, I could
do that If you didn't help meget my job done.
I really just didn't have anydealings with you at all.

Speaker 4 (01:29:43):
I think that the people who have been through it
um forgive easier than thepeople who have not I generally
find that anybody who I had had,you know, interactions with
when I was in the seer or inscientology, um, they're very,
very, very forgiving, becausethey look at themselves and they

(01:30:07):
go yeah, and I did stuff thatI'm not proud of either, and I
wasn't who I really am, yeah, um, and there are some people who
are outside of that circle whoseem to constantly bring up are
you talking to this?
Why haven't you done that?
Why You're just like where'tyou done this?

Speaker 1 (01:30:28):
Why haven't you done that?
You're just like where do youcome from?
How do you?
Why do you even have a say inany of this?
Yes, I know what you're talkingabout and that was another
thing I was thinking about whenwe were talking about Marty and
all talking about the fair gamestuff that they do to us.
We work with David Miscavigedirectly for decades.
He the fair game stuff they doon the internet is almost like

(01:30:50):
just another Sea Org memberwriting dribble on the internet.
So all the horrible things theysay about us, those things were
said directly to our face foryears and years and years.
So it's sort of like we've beeninoculated, we're not we're
We've had our vaccinations.
Yeah, david Miscavigeinoculated us before we even
left.
So the fact that they kind oftook everything that we had to

(01:31:15):
lose, they took that away.
Afterwards it was just like,okay, you did this, you did this
.
Farty Bath Bomb.
Farty Bath Bomb.

Speaker 2 (01:31:24):
Oh, michelle Carpenter, Hello.

Speaker 1 (01:31:27):
Not sure if that means something.
Maybe that's when you get an FBout of the Sea Org, you get a
Farty.

Speaker 3 (01:31:32):
Bath Bomb.
It's her nickname for MartyRathbun Farty Bath.

Speaker 2 (01:31:36):
Bomb oh, that's great , farty, bath.

Speaker 1 (01:31:37):
Bomb.
Wow, how did I not see that one?
Mark Rosalind C, is it weird toaudit a spouse?
Yes, completely.

Speaker 2 (01:31:47):
It is.
Marty should not have auditedMosey.
That is against.

Speaker 1 (01:31:51):
Yeah, we're still all here.
This is inside voice.

Speaker 3 (01:31:54):
I feel like auditing any family member is weird.
My mom audited me when I was achild and it's just weird.
You're it's like you don't wantto be audited by family members
.
It's like having your mom beyour therapist.
No, that's not how it works.
You don't want your husband tobe your therapist.
We don't therapize each other.

Speaker 2 (01:32:14):
Yes, but especially when there's a romantic element,
it's actually firmly forbidden.
It's supposed to be forbidden,so it's wrong.
But, christy, I shared yourexperience.
My mom was trying to audit mewhen I was six.
Yeah, I was like I don't wantauditing, I'm fine.
And then that's when I learnedthat if you refuse auditing,
that makes you a bad person,right?

Speaker 1 (01:32:37):
That's one of the traits of a suppressive person
is that they refuse Scientologyauditing.
That is an actualcharacteristic of a suppressor.

Speaker 3 (01:32:44):
It's very weird to be audited by your mom.
I had a lot of auditing from mymom.

Speaker 1 (01:32:48):
It was weird.

Speaker 3 (01:32:49):
It makes your brain and you think all these weird
things and you feel like, oh,she think it, just, she knows
this.
What about that?

Speaker 1 (01:32:56):
It messes up your relationship.
Are you ready for this, christy?
Yeah, I would like toacknowledge that that was
bypassed and that it was weirdbeing audited by your mother.

Speaker 2 (01:33:06):
Don't make it weird honey.

Speaker 1 (01:33:08):
Don't make it weird, honey.
Don't make it weird.
A true man of God will ask forforgiveness from the people he
has wronged.
I know you will give it to himand you will all find peace.
Yeah, that's.
That's kind of what we're Imean.
That's kind of.
The silly part of this is we'venever, ever talked about this
in a video and and meanwhileMarty's been doing videos and
posts and and we're sort of justlike, whatever it sucks, come

(01:33:30):
on.
So finally, now that he'sgotten a new job, he's moved on
to spiritual guidance.
We're like, okay, good, let'stell, let's talk about the other
chapter that marty did, andthis is what, where we get up to
speed and and so now inperpetuity.

Speaker 2 (01:33:45):
Anytime anyone asks what about Marty Rathbun, we're
going to refer them to this.

Speaker 4 (01:33:50):
Watch the video, because it comes up all the time
.

Speaker 2 (01:33:54):
We forgive Marty.
I do not wish Marty ill.
Nope, we forgive him.
It saddens me to see what he'sbeen pushed to.
Yeah exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:34:03):
We missed the friendship we had, a friendship
he was so, yeah, we wish him thebest miss the friendship we had
.

Speaker 1 (01:34:09):
A friendship he was.
So, yeah, we wish him the best.
Now Jolene said behind thebastards did a great four-parter
on LRH.
Oh, wow yeah, they've alreadybeen there on that one.
Okay, oh yeah, but we couldtell we could do a four-parter
on Dave, no worries.
Rural SD lawyer.
Wow, hey, rural SD lawyer, Ihaven't seen you in here in a
while.
Always interesting, alwaysentertaining, always educational

(01:34:30):
.
You are doing the greatestpublic service in the entire
world by bringing light to evil.
Why, thank you?
That was a very, very kind,very generous Thank you for that
.

Speaker 2 (01:34:38):
Thank you, rural SD lawyer, always great to see you,
mrs.

Speaker 1 (01:34:42):
Mrs Rush is back.
Colts make people do crazythings.
It's easy to forgive when youboth know the truth because you
know the gaslighting that wenton.

Speaker 4 (01:34:49):
That's exactly right.

Speaker 1 (01:34:51):
That's exactly right and that's why when people oh
sorry, is somebody in therewho's touching stuff?
Hands off computers.
Tamara says so glad to see Mikedoing good, glad to see you all
tonight.
Thank you for that.
Thank you, tamara tomorrowthank you um I don't know.
I was mind wiped.

Speaker 2 (01:35:10):
I was mind wiped you had tomorrow's comment up yeah,
um oh here we go get tomorrowwow, mrs rush again.

Speaker 1 (01:35:18):
Thanks, mrs rush.
I'm glad I showed your yourchats from last night.
Now how many who reach ot3realize that their whole belief
system is based on one ofHubbard's sci-fi stories?
Very few, yeah, it's not a lotof people.
That's the silliest thing.
When you talk about spacealiens to Scientologists, they
genuinely have no idea whatyou're talking about.

(01:35:40):
It's literally the internetdoesn't know, and that's another
thing.
If you say body Thetan,scientologists goes, oh, they
don't know what they're talkingabout, because in Scientology we
just call that a Thetan.
And so in all the lower levelsof Scientology you hear Thetan
all the time.
And that's your Thetan, yourown Thetan.
And it's when you get to OT3,you find out about these other

(01:36:01):
guys, these space cooties.

Speaker 4 (01:36:02):
But I have explained many times that when you get to
OT three and you read thosematerials in Hubbard's scrap
like scrolling handwriting andif you go well, this is weird,
this is just really weird thestandard response is well, you

(01:36:25):
don't have to believe it.
What does the E meter say?
And if it reads on the E meter,then it's going to.
You don't have to believe it.
What does the e-meter say?
And if it reads on the e-meterthen it's going to.
You get the certainty that,well, maybe there's something
here and that I don't reallyunderstand and that the great
man had insights that I didn'thave and couldn't possibly have.

(01:36:45):
So there is not a lot of peoplethat just literally walk away
from Scientology when they getexposed to OT3, because that
material and the answers to theincredulous looks and thoughts
of people is well-grooved in.

Speaker 2 (01:37:05):
Yep.
And that indoctrination inregards to what the e-meter says
is from the moment you walk inthe door with the pinch test and
recall the moment of the pinchand you watch the needle fall,
and that, literally from, isreinforced over and over, and
over and over, probably millionsof times by the time you reach

(01:37:25):
that point.

Speaker 1 (01:37:26):
Right yeah.
April in Amsterdam says didMitch make any of the Marty
videos?
That's a good question.
I didn't ask him.

Speaker 4 (01:37:33):
Ask him next time.

Speaker 1 (01:37:34):
I don't think so, but I don't know he might know
about him at least I meansomebody shot him.

Speaker 4 (01:37:40):
He will know.
You know, Rachel knew, Rachelknew that they were shot by SMP.
Oh, she did.
Yes, oh, she did.

Speaker 1 (01:37:48):
Yes, oh, okay.
Well, there you go.
I mean, I never talked toanybody, she wasn't involved.
When they came out, we werejust like oh yeah, that's a gold
video.
I was like I even recognizedone of those props.

Speaker 4 (01:38:00):
That lamp was in the background of one of the POW
videos.

Speaker 1 (01:38:04):
I was like whoever dressed this messed up, those
are not supposed to be there.

Speaker 2 (01:38:07):
I just like your BSM label Brown Suit Marty.

Speaker 1 (01:38:11):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:38:13):
Brown Jacket Marty Brown.

Speaker 2 (01:38:14):
Jacket Marty BJM.
Yes, right Kisha says.

Speaker 1 (01:38:18):
Kish like fish.
Oh yeah, there you go, and Iwas going to say Keisha and I
said Kish, so I lucked out onthis one.
Wonder if Marty left blog up asa slap in the face to COS
thoughts?
I think the blog had to be leftup, otherwise the lawyers might
have come circling pretty good,because he left it up.

Speaker 2 (01:38:36):
Yeah, leaving it up means that Marty has destroyed
himself.
He has both sides of theargument, so he has complete.
By leaving it up, he is 100percent nullified as a player on
the chessboard.

Speaker 4 (01:38:52):
Right, but there was a second reason he left it up
because he never admitted thathe settled with Scientology.
Yeah, he has walked this weirdline of I'm not commenting,
you're all speculating but youdon't know what really happened,
but never actually denying thathe took any money or any money,

(01:39:15):
right, no money went to MartyRathbun.
I guarantee you that it was putinto a trust for their son and
this and that, and it's paid outover X number of years if
there's any money involved.

Speaker 1 (01:39:28):
But I was going to say the way they do this.
It's all time released.
So, they say you're going to getI'm just using a generic thing
you're going to get $10 million.
You're going to get $500,000for every year for X amount of
years, as long as you play yourpart of the bargain, and if you
don't, it all disappears and youdon't get that the second you

(01:39:51):
break the rules, then that'swhen we're done.
You don't get any more payments, and they've done this with L
Ron Hubbard's family and this isa normal thing.
Scientology knows how to playthis game when it comes to
paying people to be quiet.

Speaker 3 (01:40:05):
And keep them under control.
Yep.

Speaker 1 (01:40:08):
Robert Watson says the generic term for auditing
your spouse is called divorce.

Speaker 2 (01:40:12):
Spot on.
Yes, love it Love it.
Completely.

Speaker 1 (01:40:18):
Salty Beach Girl Lori says you four are amazing.
Mc squared BTs activate.
Yay, okay, thank you for that.
Salty Beach Girl Lori, do youknow how Monique and Son are now
?
We saw Claire and I saw Moniqueon a baking show on like HGTV
or something.
We were watching it.
It was like and next we'regoing to go to Monique on Team 7

(01:40:41):
.
And we're like is that Moniquebaking a cake on a dessert?

Speaker 3 (01:40:45):
challenge.
I hope they're doing well, I dotoo that little boy was super
cute I hope they're having fun Ihope

Speaker 4 (01:40:52):
he's doing well.
Mosey had cancer.
You know that no, we did hearthat from somebody yes, recently
, yes, recently, and I thinkthat she is okay.
I think it was breast cancerand I think she is okay.
Yeah, wow that's good.

Speaker 2 (01:41:07):
I mean we visited mosey and marty in texas, um in
2012.
I want to say we stayed withthem.

Speaker 1 (01:41:14):
Our kids were, I think, four and two we fished
off the back of their yard andwe pointed out to them where I
did the videos.

Speaker 2 (01:41:23):
Yeah, we pointed out to them, the houses that had pi
cameras.

Speaker 1 (01:41:26):
That was the also that was also, the weirdest
thing that I think I everexperienced with Marty is he was
this guy, doctor enforcer, osa.
He knew how all those thingswas.
And we walked to the beach andI'm like, marty, what's going on
over here?
And he's like what do you mean?
And I go, this guy that's anOSA camera house.
And he was like what?
And I was like dude, are you soout of it that you don't even

(01:41:49):
know that that house is?
Set up with cameras, nothinghappens to me.

Speaker 3 (01:41:55):
Nobody does it except for me.
Only Hedley is the special guy.

Speaker 1 (01:41:59):
Don't mess with me, anyway.
But yeah, when that happened,we did a road trip and we
stopped off at them and I toldClaire I was like something's
wrong with Marty.
I don't know how he doesn'tknow that that house you could
see the camera lens and thefreaking blinds.
I was like dude, you got toreevaluate what's going on here

(01:42:20):
because you're not playing thegame.

Speaker 4 (01:42:21):
You got to wake up and smell the coffee.

Speaker 2 (01:42:24):
Yes, exactly.

Speaker 1 (01:42:25):
Eight points of our factor Out our factor.
Out R factor.
Out R factor.
I'm an LRH era ERA recoveringkiddo.
He always wrote in infinityeight read on from there Whoa, I
don't know what that means.
I think that Madi wrote that,you think so.
I have no idea.

(01:42:45):
Sorry, eight points of out Rfactor.
You are dropping too muchinformation in such a small
super chat, but I appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (01:42:52):
We were missing the eight points of our factor there
.

Speaker 3 (01:42:54):
Maybe there's another super chat coming from him.
Read on it's okay, we reallytried.

Speaker 1 (01:42:58):
Scientology not supposed to go past a
misunderstood word and I don'tknow what the eight points of
out our factor are, so that sortof blanks out on everything
else.
After that, dr x in the house,quick clap to team mc square
rushing off to teach lecture ontargeted drug delivery systems
for cancer and stroke treatment.
Treating students to cake andum, I don't look.

(01:43:19):
Soda, soda, soda for the lastof the year, sending you all
virtual cake, beer, wine,cocktails and prep for IES
fundraiser.
Thank you?

Speaker 4 (01:43:29):
I don't know.
She said virtual.

Speaker 1 (01:43:31):
She said virtual.
I was like I don't know,because this could go either way
.

Speaker 4 (01:43:36):
Well, she also sent me funds to provide two signed
books for the IES fundraiser.

Speaker 2 (01:43:46):
Oh, yes, and she sent us funds for a whole list of
giveaways for the IES fundraiser.
Oh yes, and she sent us a wholefunds for a whole list of
giveaways for the IES fundraiser.
So we have.
We'll have some Davy dolls,some bobbleheads, some SP
bracelets all kinds of goodgiveaways yes.

Speaker 1 (01:44:00):
No, marty R is running for city council man in
Clearwater on Chad's channel.
That's okay, that's aClearwater Chad being cheeky.
Vanessa Winberry, hi guys,fellow SP here Loving all the
SPTV channels I've found andwhat you all are doing.
Mark, I love your book.
Mike, yours is in the mail,can't wait to read yours.
Claire, love all Thanks foreverything you do.

(01:44:22):
Thank you, vanessa.
That was very substantial interms of like hitting everybody
and taking it all of us.
Thank you, vanessa sarah s leahsaid cos had evidence of him
abusing his son before theadoption was finalized and
that's why they were able to gethim to do what he did kid, okay
, yeah, no, I think it was thathe there.

(01:44:42):
There was a possibility thatthat could happen because he had
been arrested for the punch ofthe horse, scientology was
saying that's not what leah said.

Speaker 4 (01:44:52):
Yeah, I promise you, leah has never said that.
Yeah so.

Speaker 1 (01:44:56):
so I think that was that was their um, that that was
their planned and stated attackmethod.
And, and, martin, they toldmarty this.
It wasn't like they said you'regoing to do this or we're going
to do this, and he was like,okay, we don't know what the
this is and the that's were, butthat's about what we know.

(01:45:18):
Okay, amy, that quote Thomas isnot from the Bible.

Speaker 2 (01:45:22):
I know, I'm sorry, we've been educated, thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:45:26):
Matt was the first person Marty reached out to in
2008.
We wish him well.
There you go.
See, we're not trying.
That's another thing.
Sometimes people are like youguys should protest the
Scientology, you should do this,or you should yell out at the
staff victim boat as the peoplethat pay money to Scientology

(01:45:50):
they're all just being used andwhen they're done with them they
just throw them away like trash.
So we want to reach out likethese channels, and we've been,
michael attested this as well.
We're now getting contacted byfamily members of Sea Org
members so that they can figureout a very calm and peaceful way
to speak with these people sothat they can kind of know that

(01:46:11):
there's a place for them to beand stuff like that.
I think we have to err on theside of compassion with these
people instead of anger.
And in Scientology, whensomeone attacks you, like if
that's a suppressive, youimmediately are supposed to
block everything they say.

Speaker 2 (01:46:29):
Let me just share an amazing story.
So at the spshopcom we haveshirts fashioned somewhat after
the whole Curious promo fromScientology where we have
Curious, and on the back we havethis amazing SP logo designed
by Mike Brown and a QR code forthe foundation website.

(01:46:50):
Well, a woman wore one of theseshirts to Disney World a few
days ago and somebody scannedthe QR code and came up to her
and asked her, and it turned outthe person asking the questions
has a brother who's been in thesea organization for 10 years,
who is utterly miserable, and soshe said just contact the

(01:47:11):
aftermath foundation.
So I'm just saying you neverknow who our message is reaching
.
We, we are here for whoeverwants to get out of Scientology.
We're here to help, and that'sjust an amazing um indicator to
me of the reach that SPTV ishaving.

Speaker 1 (01:47:29):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (01:47:30):
Awesome.

Speaker 1 (01:47:31):
Awesome.
Donna Rose says when might wesee the next Aftermath story?
Well, you know we help peopleall the time and the ones that
are willing to tell their storyor have their story told, then
we'll tell it, and so we areworking on one of those right
now, and as many people that wehelp that want to tell their

(01:47:52):
story, we'll help also tell thestory, but that's not a
requirement or a condition ofthe aftermath helping somebody
that they have to tell theirstory.
We can help them.
They can get out of Scientology, they can start a new life, and
no one will ever know if theydon't want them to know, and
that's's fine with us as well.
We don't we.
We actually started theaftermath years and years before

(01:48:12):
any of the any of us had weredoing anything like this on
youtube.
So, yeah, it's just a.
It's just a weird byproductthat's sort of come out of it
that people want us, want them,want people to know how they
were helped.
Andrea bear says being anspiritual, isn't that a problem
for Scientology?
I don't think.
I think that's how.

(01:48:33):
Whatever he's doing isobviously not part of the deal
that they made, so he's sort ofdoing whatever he can do.
I think he just misses thecommunity and he misses being
able to uh, to talk to peopleand help people, and that part
of him, um, needs to do that.
That's what I personally think.

Speaker 2 (01:48:50):
He wants to be a guru .

Speaker 1 (01:48:52):
Lathanda Groklinga, sending love to you all.
It is horrible to lose a dearfriend like that.
Such a loss and betrayal hurts,no matter how the loss came
about.

Speaker 2 (01:49:00):
Thank you for that.

Speaker 1 (01:49:01):
Lathanda, that's very accurate.
Oh, Maria de Jesus Gutierrezsays Thomas in the Bible, aka
Doubting Thomas, who had tostick his fingers into the wound
that killed Jesus because hedidn't believe Christ.
After his return, after he wascrucified.
Significant, yeah, I guess thatis why.

(01:49:21):
Maybe that's why Marty pickedthat as one of the things I
don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:49:26):
I'll bow out on that one.

Speaker 1 (01:49:30):
Not an expert on that one.
I'm just gonna say I'm not surewhy marty was quoting thomas
jefferson and naz in the samearticle on his blog either, but
I'm sure he had some method tohis madness.
Yeah, um, mrs t rush, it'spronounced rush.

Speaker 2 (01:49:43):
Thanks all right, okay, thank you, mrs t rush, ms
pillow.

Speaker 1 (01:49:48):
If cos, ms Pillow, if COS is being driven by nuts, oh
, if COS is being driven by nuts, yeah, they both work.

Speaker 2 (01:49:58):
Nuts by.

Speaker 1 (01:49:59):
SPTV.
Let's be honest, that's not avery long drive.
Thank you, ms Pillow.
We've we've mentioned thisbefore too.
If you're watching this andyou're new to all this, there is
about 50 channels doingscientology content right now.
I'm I'm pretty sure you couldjust watch sp tv all day, every

(01:50:20):
day, if you started right now,and you might go to the end of
the year and not run out ofvideos.
I mean, you still have hundredsand hundreds of hours of video.
So yeah, scientology is nothaving fun with this whole thing
.
Michelle Carpenter, eminentTrouble Source.
This is a quest to see Mike andChristy on a game of werewolves
.
Again, claire can't apologizefor killing you.

(01:50:41):
We played a game.
You want to look at that?
It's a game we played on KellyCopter's channel.
It was fun.

Speaker 2 (01:50:47):
It was fun, it's a game we played on Kelly copters
channel, where it was fun.
It was fun.

Speaker 1 (01:50:49):
It's like a Halloween kind of thing.

Speaker 2 (01:50:51):
So so you get assigned a role of you're either
a citizen there's twowerewolves, there's a medium and
a doctor, and nobody thewerewolves know who they are,
but nobody else knows who theyare and knows who the werewolves
are.
Yeah, so I called Mitch.
Mitch rolled in and he had ananti-werewolf light behind him,

(01:51:12):
which he proudly announced.
So I I first said, well, likeanyone who shows up.

Speaker 1 (01:51:18):
There's a video you guys can watch.
Otherwise, claire's just goingto tell the entire video.

Speaker 2 (01:51:24):
I'm almost done, I'm almost done.
Anyway, michelle killed me atthe last round, which meant the
werewolves won.

Speaker 1 (01:51:30):
Yes.

Speaker 2 (01:51:30):
So it's all good.
It was a great experience.
Thank you for the invitation.
Yes, it would be very fun.

Speaker 1 (01:51:36):
Metalhead?
Why was LRH or DM sending spiesand not simply exteriorized
Thetans?
Also, if anyone actual powers,he would be well known.
That would be a big deal.
How can you believe insupernatural stuff?
Well, I'm telling you, if yougrew, we all every single one of
the people in this video grewup inside Scientology, so we

(01:51:57):
didn't know anything different.
We didn't know what everybodyelse was being taught because we
weren't there.
So we know what Scientologistkids were being taught and even
then I was just working.
I didn't give a toot-toot aboutany of that space aliens or any
of that and I didn't even knowabout it.
There was a contractor thatasked me you guys are believing
about space aliens.

(01:52:18):
I was like dude, what are youtalking?
I literally laughed in his face.
I was like what are you talkingabout, dude?
I was like I don't know anyspace aliens and I don't know
any space aliens and I don'tthink any of the other people
that work here are space aliensso I'm not sure what's going on.

Speaker 2 (01:52:30):
Yeah, when I broke my leg and I was getting physical
therapy out in town in Hemet onetime the physical therapist was
like is it true that you guyshave machine guns in the golf
course?
I'm like, not that I know ofDoris Azevedo super sticker.

Speaker 1 (01:52:54):
Thank you for that, doris, I appreciate it.
Thank you, doris Azevedo supersticker.
Thank you for that, doris, Iappreciate you.
Doris, um, oh, here we go.
Jolene Harris Xenu is my furbaby showing off the new kitty.
Nice, awesome, there you go.

Speaker 2 (01:53:00):
Um, ella always wrote infinity eight, but but
infinity sideways yep okay yeahyeah, that's true, I do know
that oh wait, 880, that was abig, that's a whole story that
jeff hawkins could tell.

Speaker 1 (01:53:18):
But every single scientology book had a very
specific cover and each one ofthose covers is one of the
pictures that you would getshown by lord zu and his
henchmen when you would go tothe relearning place to get
reprogrammed and hypnotizedabout Christ and the trains and
the space people and all thisstuff.
So if you want to know what thepictures are that you got shown

(01:53:42):
, just look on the Internet andlook at all the different
Scientology book covers.
Look at the old covers, the oldcovers, but the new covers
still also have some of thatstuff.

Speaker 4 (01:53:51):
They have a bit, but not as much as the old ones.

Speaker 1 (01:53:53):
But the old covers.

Speaker 4 (01:53:54):
Snakes and guys in space, helmets and locomotives
and the guy eating the drumstick, the gorilla eating the
drumstick and all that stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:54:04):
Yeah, l Ron Hubbard very, very specifically said
exactly what each picture was tobe, because he knew what the
pictures was.
They show at the programmingthe machine, at the drive-in, at
the Xenu drive-in.

Speaker 2 (01:54:16):
At the Xenu drive-in.

Speaker 4 (01:54:18):
Oh, that's a great merchant.

Speaker 1 (01:54:19):
Hold on, I've got to write that one down the implant
station.
Xenu implant station drive-inOkay.

Speaker 3 (01:54:31):
Me and Mark.
We didn't do any OT levels inScientology, so we never heard
about any of this stuff untilafter we left.
Like I never heard a singlepeep about aliens or any of this
, I never knew anything.

Speaker 1 (01:54:39):
And if they would have told me, I'm pretty sure I
would have came up with the sameBTs activate idea, because that
I'm all about that.

Speaker 3 (01:54:46):
But the thing is, is not every Scientologist knows
about this?
Because they don't get to thoselevels, and so when they so a
majority don't right, themajority don't.

Speaker 1 (01:54:54):
So all the media and the whole wide world that knows
about that knows way more thanthe scientologists right yes
michael mills super chat thankyou for that, or super sticker,
whatever they call it um, amyscobie said, and my book.
Giveaways too.
Yes, we're gonna have some amyscobie said, and my book
giveaways too.
Yes, we're going to have someAmy Scobie abuse at the top
books to give away as well.
We're almost down to the lastones here.
In an effort to keep LouisFarrakhan involved with our

(01:55:16):
church, I'm going to add bowties to the Sea Org uniforms.
Well, that's a good idea, david.
Right in with the bellhop.
Yeah, that'll work.
You know, david Miscavige hasbeen super chatting in every
video we're doing these days, soyou know we may turn this thing
around, guys, if he's sendingus $4.99 in the super chat.

Speaker 4 (01:55:31):
You know he's on the horizon.
You know Dave is very involvedwith those uniforms.

Speaker 1 (01:55:37):
He really is.
He does know, I mean, oh mygoodness, I'm not even going to
go there.
I can't even start a whole newone.
Salty Beach Girl, you have suchloving, forgiving hearts.
Love you all.
Well, thank you, we try.
We're just humans.
We screw up sometimes and dosilly things, but we try.
Brett Grace, while you guyswere in COS, did anyone try and
get you out?

Speaker 2 (01:55:59):
I wish I used to hope and pray that someone would
come pick me up some long lostfamily member.

Speaker 1 (01:56:05):
I don't think anybody tried to get me out my dad.
My dad did let me know on aregular basis that I ever needed
anything and he also he had a1-800 number and so that I could
always call him toll free, nomatter where I was or where, and
it was also kind of you couldcall a 1-800 number on the
property.
Sometimes there was a periodwhere you didn't need to get

(01:56:27):
okay because it was no toll andonly told calls had to go
through reception so I couldactually call them and talk to
them on the phone.
And then they found out andthey were like yeah, you can't
do that, no more.

Speaker 2 (01:56:37):
But didn't you call that 1-800 number when you
escaped?

Speaker 1 (01:56:41):
I did yeah.
Because it's the only number Iknew and I was like oh, I know
it's the only phone number Iknew besides my own.
You know Nextel radio phonethat I had and 1-800-I-WANT-HELP
, the Scientology-based hotline.
If you need to get DP Neverin,just searched behind the
bastards.
They did a two-series onHubbard, a three-parter in 2018

(01:57:03):
and a two-parter in 2019 abouthis last days.
Wow that is amazing.
Yeah, behind the bastards we got, I didn't.
I've never even heard of thisMe either.
That's amazing.
Okay, well, we did it guys.
We got to the end.
I'm going to make.
I'm just going to go throughhere and make sure I didn't miss
anybody and let's do, while wedo that, let's do.

(01:57:25):
We showed this yesterday.
I just want to kind of pump upthe jam on this
MarkBunker2024.com.
Mark Bunker is running forClearwater, running for
re-election in the ClearwaterCity Council, and the fact that
he is there is Clearwater's onlychance to get free of
Scientology eventually, and sowe want to make sure that he

(01:57:48):
gets reelected and you cansupport that effort by going to
markbunker2024.com.
And I think we should talk to,we should reach out to Mark
Clarency if he wants to do avideo and we can talk about when
he edited the Jason Begay videoat my, on my editing system at
Burbank and at my shop, and wecan go into all kinds of crazy

(01:58:08):
behind the scenes stories.
Um, and then um.
If you haven't subscribed toeither of our channels, please.
If you're watching on Mike'schannel, um, like and subscribe.
That would be amazing.
And if you're watching on theblown for good channel, please
like and subscribe.
Um, we're not.
Uh, per YouTube, 80% of thepeople that watch these videos
are not subscribed to thesevideos and I don't know what it

(01:58:29):
is.
Believe it or not.
Is it on your channel like thattoo, mike?
Yeah yeah, 86% not subscribed.
I'm not even sure how thatworks exactly, but either way,
For OSA and all youScientologists out there.

Speaker 2 (01:58:40):
We do not share our mailing list.
There's no cost to subscribe.

Speaker 1 (01:58:45):
You'll just get notifications YouTube.
There's no exposure.

Speaker 2 (01:58:47):
Yes, yes, exactly so don't be scared.
You too can subscribe andbecome more educated, and we can
help you get out.

Speaker 4 (01:58:55):
I thought you were going to say to Osa and all
those who are being forced towatch this as part of your job
To get sock accounts.
You can reach out to theAftermath Foundation and we will
help you.

Speaker 2 (01:59:07):
Yes, that too, that too, we would love will help you
.
Yes, yeah, we would love tohelp you, please, yes.

Speaker 1 (01:59:11):
And you don't even have to tell your story by
making us help you escape.
That would well we might as wellbe more thrilling we might as
well, put this up, because youcan support the aftermath
foundation by going to theaftermath foundationorg and you
can sign up to be a volunteer.
You can find out, you can signup to be a volunteer.
You can sign up to get on ourmailing list so when a new

(01:59:31):
series or a new program comesout on somebody that we've
helped, you'll get notified.
If we have new merch or newproducts that support the
foundation, you'll know aboutthat.
And then also bobbleheads andSP bracelets can be gotten from
the spshopcom and the SP shop.
All of the things that we sellin the SP shop are go to support
the Aftermath Foundation.
So all these things, you know,it's all.

(01:59:53):
We were trying to make this allwork together and make
everything make sense.
But I think that's good.

Speaker 3 (01:59:59):
I think we did it.
Mark, you are a scientist.

Speaker 1 (02:00:03):
I am not a scientist.

Speaker 3 (02:00:04):
You are a scientist.
Look at what you just did.
You put all that stuff up onthe screen.
I just clicked some buttons.
I mean come on.

Speaker 1 (02:00:11):
Let's not pretend that I did fix your microphone
before the stream.
I will take credit for that.
Um, anyway, remotely, um anyway, thank you everybody who joined
us today.
Um, we, claire and I, are goingto do a special video um coming
soon.
I'm not exactly sure when, butwe are going to tell of the very
first person that we broke outof the international

(02:00:34):
headquarters and how we did itand how the whole thing happened
Blow by blow.
No one has ever we've neveractually done a video where we
tell the entire story of howthis happened and nobody had
ever done that before eitherfolks happened and nobody had
ever done that before eitherfolks.

Speaker 2 (02:00:51):
Yeah, so it was groundbreaking.

Speaker 1 (02:00:51):
Yes, yes, a good story.
So we're gonna, uh, keep clickyour bell notification if you
want to find out when that'sgonna hit the streets and then
otherwise, um, yeah, I thinkwe're good, we did it, we got
every.
Thank you, everybody whocommented.

Speaker 2 (02:01:02):
Thank you for everybody who joined we always
go twice as long as we plan toexactly okay, that's just
because we love you guys so, somuch, and it's always a pleasure
hanging with you and the restof you, 2000 people out there.
We love you too.

Speaker 1 (02:01:15):
And somebody was commenting when I put up my end
video, there's just those whiteboxes there.
That's because we're doing thislive and I have to put those
videos in on YouTube after thevideo goes live.
But because we're doing a livestream with us, we're going to
play our special friendly outro.

Speaker 2 (02:01:33):
And we're in our final two minutes here, folks,
just as a reminder.

Speaker 1 (02:01:36):
And I do have to duck out because I got to get ready
for the next stream with Mitch,so I'm going to let you guys
wrap this one up.
Claire, make sure to play theoutro and do all the stuff that
I normally do.
Don't be a barbarian.

Speaker 2 (02:01:51):
Thank the outro and do all the stuff that I normally
do.
Don't be a barbarian.
Thank you, bye.
Have I ever been a barbarian?
Oh my gosh, come on.

Speaker 4 (02:01:54):
No, you're the least barbarian person I know,
honestly.

Speaker 2 (02:02:00):
About now, so awesome .
See you later, guys.
Thanks again for doing thiswith us we appreciate it.
Bye, bye, and give me a minutehere, barbarian, I'm so fired.

Speaker 1 (02:02:12):
Oh my gosh.

Speaker 2 (02:02:15):
I'm freaking out here .

Speaker 1 (02:02:20):
The videos are on the brand.
The videos should be on thebrand.

Speaker 2 (02:02:23):
I'm looking for the outro.
I don't have it.
There's no outro.

Speaker 4 (02:02:27):
It's okay, claire, the only person in the whole
world that cares about this.

Speaker 2 (02:02:29):
I'm looking for the outro I don't have it.

Speaker 4 (02:02:30):
There's no outro.
It's okay, Claire.
The only person in the wholeworld that cares about this is
Mark.

Speaker 2 (02:02:34):
I know we won't tell him.

Speaker 4 (02:02:36):
We won't tell him and he'll never go back and watch
it.

Speaker 2 (02:02:39):
It's our little secret, amazing Guys.
I'll hit end stream.
Thank you so much.
Talk to you soon.
Bye-bye, our little secret.

Speaker 1 (02:02:48):
Thanks for watching.
If you'd like to help supportthe channel, feel free to check
out the merch store link in thedescription.
We have Hail Xenu Xenu is myHomeboy and BFG-branded mouse
pads, shirts, mugs, all sorts ofother stuff in there that helps
us to bring you new content ona regular basis there.

(02:03:09):
That helps us to bring you newcontent on a regular basis.
You can also pick up a copy ofmy book Blown for Good Behind
the Iron Curtain of Scientologyin hardback, kindle and audible
versions as well.
There's also a link to ourpodcast and you can get that on
Apple, spotify or wherever youlisten to podcasts.
And if you'd like to watchanother video, you can click on
this link right here, or you canclick on this one here, or you

(02:03:32):
can click on the subscribebutton right here.
Thanks a lot, until next time.

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From Enforcer to Defector: Marty Rathbun's Complex Journey Through Scientology - Scientology Q&A #40

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}From Enforcer to Defector: Marty Rathbun's Complex Journey Through Scientology - Scientology Q&A #40