Ep. 37 - How to Handle Honest Questions from Your Team - Blue Collar Business Podcast

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hey guys, welcome to the Blue Collar Business Podcast
, where we discuss the realest,rawest, most relevant stories
and strategies behind buildingevery corner of a blue collar
business.
I'm your host, cy Kirby, and Iwant to help you in what it took
me trial and error and a wholelot of money to learn the
information that no one in thisindustry is willing to share.
Whether you're under that shadetree or have your hard hat on,

(00:30):
let's expand your toolbox.
Welcome back to another episode, guys, of the Blue Collar
Business Podcast sponsored bypodcastvideoscom.
I have been across the hall forthe last three episodes.
I'm excited to bring you guysnot just one guest, but three
guests today, personal and closeto my heart, part of my team

(00:51):
here at PsyCon, but in thisbeautiful newscast room here at
podcastvideoscom in Rogers,arkansas.
You guys know I've been rightout of year.
They just reminded me actually,I was just in here yesterday
for a meeting and been herealmost a year.
They just reminded me actually,um, I was just in here
yesterday for a meeting and beenhere almost a year, and I can't
speak more highly of thepodcast videos team and what

(01:12):
they can do for your show andput the platform um and message
out there on all platforms iswhat I was trying to say.
But today, guys, we are going tokind of change the script up
just a little bit.
I brought some of my team inhere.
I don't just sit here andpreach behind this microphone.
I tell you guys, I've learnedand failed so hard to get where

(01:36):
I'm at and these guys have beenwith me through my learning and
my failures of trying to figureout what business is and what
excavation is and pipeline andall the little things that catch
us off guard as a team, youknow.
But they brought some questionsin here for me today.
So I'm kind of excited aboutthat, probably talk a little bit

(01:58):
about the good, bad and theugly of what we love in this
industry, what we can change asa whole or what have you there,
but definitely more gearedaround the excavation and
utility side, the civil sidework.
But I have been telling youguys that I was going to bring
the team to you.
They're here now.
Thank you guys for being here.
We got Mr Wes and Zeus man hey,zeus himself.

(02:21):
And then we got Sambo Sam manthe man, jesus himself.
And then we got Sambo Sam-Manthe man, and they guys Pipe over
here was Zeus, pipe was Wes andDirt was Sam.
So there's a little bit ofbackground for you.
But, sam, how long have youbeen here?
Four years, four, yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:39):
I think, we've been four.

Speaker 1 (02:41):
You've been here four .
We're like a week apart.
And then how long have you beenhere?
Almost four, two months fromnow.
So you guys have almost beenhere 50% since the company has
been birthed.
We will start our 10th year inAugust.
That's insane for me to say.
I never even thought I'd getthis far, boys, but it's because
of fellows like you not givingup.

(03:02):
And let me tell you somethingthe audience that you guys are
talking to today, they'revulnerable.
They know I'm very honest withthem about the transitions that
we've been going through on theproject management side and how
we lost project managers.
So they're very up to speed onwhat's going on behind the
scenes Not super detailed.
If they haven't checked out ourYouTube at PsyCon, it's a

(03:32):
shameless plug.
There you can actually go seeall of these guys' work week in,
week out, but they obviouslyhave a pretty good microscope as
of the ugly, when it wasn'trunning the way it should have
been as a business as a whole.
But I've literally leaned onthese guys very heavily and, hey
, should we do this?
Here we go, let's try this,let's do that.
That's not working, okay, butit takes a two way street.
It takes a leader willing tolisten and make change and be

(03:57):
ready to make those changes eventhough they suck and they're
hard for you.
Um, it sucks just as bad forthem.
So be talking back and forthand I'm excited to have a little
insight today.
So, um, anybody want to startus off with just a random, good
soaker question?
Huh, wes has got a grin overthere.
Come on, bud.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (04:17):
Yeah, dude, let's give us the first topic of the
day um, what do you think thedifference between psycon and
other construction companies inour area?

Speaker 1 (04:35):
oh, very good question and you guys are going
to be here to agree and disagreewith me and back me up when I
don't.
This is gonna going to be soexciting.
So, um, the difference in us,straight up, is we care about
our people, um, first, andfamily first, but the way we

(04:57):
approach things, we're stilllearning.
We're nine years in.
We don't have the 40, 50 years,but then there's also companies
that you get in bed with thatshould know these things, being
in business 40, 50 years, andthen are leaning on us, as we
know, some of those companiesthat bug us every day, right?
So I had to, literally, duringthis transition, dude, like pull

(05:23):
it back a little bit and go howcan we be different?
And you know who?
Dylan says this all the time.
It's not about what they'redoing, it's about what we can be
doing.
What are we doing?
And really, my dude, he hit mehard with that About two years
ago.
We were sitting in the office.
I was just complaining, youknow, just really negative
during, during that.

(05:43):
It's about what we can do andyou're, you're right, so the
number one, without giving toomuch away of our hidden little
secrets and tricks.
But we're not mainly superconcerned with price compared to
time and deadlines.
We've had to make thattransition from the front of the

(06:04):
house.
We want to provide a price thatis fair, honest work.
We don't want to take your headoff.
We want you to come back and doanother project.
But at the same time from me tothese guys, especially during
this transition we havetransformed into production
rates, equals time schedules,driving those points home and a

(06:27):
lot of our clients and I'm soglad we get to have this
conversation because our clientsare way more concerned with the
interest burning every 30 daysthan they are having to pay an
extra 2%, 3%, 10% if they knowit's going to be done by May 8th
and they don't have to dealwith another 40, 50, 500, 600

(06:50):
thousand dollar interest payment.
Whatever the job is.
They'll avoid that and they'llsoak us up because they can go
watch our YouTube channel, watchSam how he approaches
constraints on a dirt job, orwatch how you guys would attack
a pipe job and how clean it isand how we approach shoring and
trenching and benching and andladders and OSHA safety and, and

(07:12):
it can be done and stillbroadcasted.
I get I hear that comment allthe time and this is a
compliment to you guys.
It's literally clean work.
I get on the phone with guysand they're like, hey, man, I
can't barely even put a shorttogether because I'm scared to
death.
It's going to hit the internetLike you're putting yourself out

(07:32):
there like for everybody, andI'm like, yeah, but it also
holds you guys accountablebecause you know it's going out
there.
You guys don't want to lookstupid, you know, and I never
want to shine a bad light on youand neither does will.
That's one of his main concerns.
But they get to see with us,okay, from the front end.
It's not.
Here's your two million dollarproposal, sign here, go into bed

(07:55):
with me.
It's like it's literally tryingto hand a cake to them without
them getting to slice into it.
But but the difference withCyCon is we have two and a half
years of every commercialproject that you guys have
touched is displayed for them togo.
Look at, see, view how view,and see if your faces are still

(08:15):
the same number one, how youattack the job.
Is it clean?
And that's the biggestcompliment I get is clean,
straight ditches, becauseutility work, as we know, is not
like super fashionable.
It's never clean, it's alwaysmuddy, always Dirt is too.
I mean Like yeah, oh my God,stop Rain Ditches in four weeks

(08:40):
is.
I've been complaining about iton this show.
It's got to stop raining.
But I, I truly believe West,answer your question that they
not only get to broadcast theirproject, they get to see the
behind the scenes.
We're not trying to hideanything.
We're not just trying to askfor your money and an oh,
they're going to be out therefor three months.

(09:01):
No, we're providing you aschedule.
I don't know if you guys knowthis, but from the front of the
house, dylan provides a scheduleof an appropriate time and what
we anticipate and project thatwe believe is going to take.
Now, that may be completelydifferent once you guys get out
there, as long as we havejustification hey, we didn't

(09:22):
have a geo report on this andwe're trying to lay in four foot
of groundwater Okay, well,that's obviously different than
what Dylan could see and set aproduction rate on right.
We didn't have a geo report orwhatever the case may be.
But they get to see y'all, theyget to see us what we're about
people.
You know what I mean.
We're always smiling, likeevery single time I'm I'm on.

(09:43):
I get that comment.
A lot is huh, as you guys havewalked with me through this
personnel transition over thelast, uh, two years well, now,
major, major year about it hasbeen on and off the ship,
whatever.
And, uh, the people that arehere, man, I care and they care

(10:08):
and it shows through theiractions, and I think, not just
me, but the people that reachout to me and go hey, man, your
guys are always smiling.
It's not like I'm running upand you guys running like ants.
No, I want you guys to be thebest that you can be, and
whether that's better than me,whether it's better than what
you want to be, whatever yourdreams, goals are, I want to

(10:29):
help there, but care about yourpeople first.
We're handing out schedules.
We're caring about time, notjust price.
The cost is what the cost is.
You guys have all experiencedthrough that over the years of
us trying to figure out and weused to.
I'll be open and honest withyou guys.
We used to let the market, as Iwas learning, drive our price.

(10:51):
That's totally wrong.
I was taught that.
I mean, that's all I knew,right?
Well, I got to be cheaper thanhim, but I got to be more
expensive.
I got to get that job.
No, boys, here's the cost.
Whatever the cost is which youguys are starting to learn more
job costing, knowing your cost.
What's this cost, what's thatcost?
Where can we apply it in thejob?

(11:13):
We're doing that behind thescene more than ever.
You know what I mean to.
Hopefully you guys don't knowthis, but, like the last episode
, moving this the whole waythrough is we want to drive this
incentive program to hopefullyincentivize that time base.
So not only is the customergetting a good product, you guys

(11:35):
are incentivized to get the jobdone on time and I literally
last episode was like abasically a um, a bolt on system
that integrates with builder'strend or any of them, and it can
show you guys, um, how muchmoney you can make per project
and I'm really interested in it.
But first thing, like I've beenopen, honest with you guys and

(11:57):
the audience is inside,accounting has to be locked up.
We have fractional CFO.
I don't think you guys haveever met Miss Julie and she has
been helping Shay, drasticallyhelp her there, and things were
changing.
But anyways, that's probably alittle too my.
But, wesley, I hope that answersyour question.
It's not just everybody canpush dirt in my pipe.

(12:21):
It's how we do it and when wemake a mistake, which you guys
don't know.
I walk straight up to them andI go hey guys, I'm sorry, we
made a mistake, I didn't knowthe guys.
Should we have known?
Yeah, we should have.
And that's my fault, it's nottheir fault Psych on here and I

(12:44):
sit there, take the tonguelashing, cussing, whatever it is
.
Most of the time they'reunderstanding because I approach
it with hey look, we made amistake.
Here's the three solutions I'vegot.
This one definitely helps time,not the best on cost.
This one's probably the best oncost, but it's going to push
time out.
Which way do you want to go?

(13:05):
And I just wanted to finish thatquestion up with when we hit
mistakes.
You guys have watched me timeand time again, even when
they're real bad ones that arenot good.
There's been lots of them, butwe've learned from them together
and I've been open about them.
Yeah, the company takes a hit.
Open about them.

(13:27):
Yeah, the company takes a hit,but did we learn from it?
Do we know the next project twoweeks earlier or halfway into
that project?
Or you know, like we, wefigured out some stuff on Sam's
current dirt job and I won't gotoo far into detail, but, um,
the things that we're doingbehind the scenes within the
inside accounting man.
We caught that like during theundercut phase and I'm telling

(13:48):
you guys that's insane for theadmin in the back office to turn
around and come up and go hey,what's going on here?
Here's estimated loads.
We're almost here, guys, thisis huge, big stuff and you know
the team's thinking I'm going tobe upset because it carries a
monetary value, there's no doubt.

(14:09):
But everybody's getting to seethat monetary value now, not
just Cy and Sarah.
And so you guys wonder whywe're stressed.
Well, everybody's going tostart to see it now, but it's
out there in the open now thatwe all can attack it.
And that's where I feel likeI've kind of screwed up with you
guys kind of veering off thequestion.

(14:29):
I hope I answered that, but Ifeel like the transparency
that's coming for you guys isonly ultimately going to drive
the success where this thing istrucking.
So there's lots of differencesabout us.
We're not and I'm not trying.
There was one point 100% forfactors that the audience knows

(14:53):
that I was chasing revenue so,so hard because I didn't know
anything else.
Hell, I didn't know how toproduce profit.
I didn't know how to trackprofit.
I didn't know how to.
I thought profit was a dirtyword, right.
So now that we're getting there, man, and we've been doing what
we've been doing over the last18 months, I cannot wait.
I have never been so excited tostep into a year, and this year

(15:17):
we can talk about all thethings why this year is dragging
out work-wise, commerciallywell, tariffs, buildings, right,
development's starting to comeon and the opportunities that we
have either way is insane inthe market that we do, and I
cannot wait to give you guys therest of this work for this year

(15:38):
and let you fly with thesystems and the things that
we've been, I mean have you metwith Shalina?
Yeah, no, well, not one-on-onenone of have you, I know.
No, wesley has.
Well, and, and wesley is ismore in a transitional period
and in your role.
And I got to tell you, man, bigstep up.
And I want to tell you that onthe show zeus, over here, coming

(15:59):
out of nowhere, out of leftfield, over the last consistent
six to eight months, whereeverybody's just going, who is
is, what are these guys doing?
And then, sam man, the thingsthat we've learned.
You know the audience here knowshow you came about and you were
on a job and you saw us runningpipe and all of a sudden you
were like, hey, dude, I'll comehelp you in a machine until we

(16:20):
figure out this dirt thing.
And I said, to your mark.
And then we went and bought themachine and the machine until
we figure out this dirt thing.
And I said two year mark.
And then we went and bought themachine and the hell, I was so
scared to death going and buyyou that machine.
You have no idea I waspetrified.
And then the first job we walkedinto, them freaking developed.
You know it was the contractor,actually not the developer, but
it was a rough learning curveright off the bat and we've

(16:43):
learned since then.
But I'm telling you guys, Ican't tell you enough, thank you
in the growth that you guyshave had.
I've watched each and every oneof you individually and you've
been a part of the transitionand given the feedback.
And you know Ms Shalina workingwith these guys.
Ms Shalina will be on thepodcast, uh three to four

(17:05):
episodes, so be uh listening tothat, but she is.
We're going to talk about herprobably a couple times.

Speaker 3 (17:10):
definitely helped us in the project management game,
right I was texting her on theway over hey, is this acceptable
to ask these questions?
There was one or two.

Speaker 1 (17:20):
She was like those are more one-on-one, but fine so
I I just wanted to give her alittle shout out, um, because I
can't believe that I didn'trealize we needed something like
that and honestly, it wasn'tuntil I was sitting here.
I'll never forget it.

(17:40):
The owner of this placeactually was sitting here and
going why don't you do somethingfractionally?
I'm like what's fractional?
Like what does that mean?
Well, it's where you hire anexpert in their field and they
handle it's basically what youcall in your world a
subcontractor.
And I'm like hell, I didn'tknow that was a thing you know.

(18:03):
I mean, I had no idea and Istarted looking into it and I
dove hard and I feel like we'reon the right path.
How have you guys beenexperiencing that?

Speaker 3 (18:15):
I think it's been huge At least for organization
ways to go about thinking aboutproduction, how it kind of
transfers into you guys in theoffice, easier ways to, I guess,
translate it from, because itdoesn't always translate Because

(18:36):
we don't speak the samelanguage.
No, what we produce in thefield doesn't always translate
to something that the officeunderstands.
They see just their numbers andthey don't understand that.

Speaker 1 (18:50):
Yes, it's pretty straightforward when you look at
it like that, but it usuallytakes a little bit extra that
you don't know A hundred percentit does and it and and that's
one of the biggest struggles, Imean, for me right now I'm
wearing so many hats and I'mlooking at so many numbers is
that this has been a really hardtransition on me personally.

(19:11):
Just open and honest with youguys, because I've had to, like
I've got such a big heart andI've led with my heart for so
many years, it's hard for me torewire myself into.
Hey, now I have the informationin front of me, I can't move
differently.
That's because I mean, I toldyou guys, like um two years ago,

(19:35):
christmas party, I or yeah, Ilooked at him.
I was like all their families.
I stood there in my living roomand I said, hey, it's not about
making money, it's if we cansurvive, and if we can survive
next year, we have got thisthing made.
And, man boy, did I have anyclue of what I was actually
foreshad result for you guys?

(19:55):
Because we're doing all of thisand that's what kind of makes
me upset with some of the otherfolks that maybe didn't reach
out as much is like we'respending money here to make

(20:19):
y'all's job run easier, to getthe information out of you.
But not only that, but to getthe information to you in an
organizable spot where you don'thave to spend time on your
phone, and QR systems forinspection sheets and and really
starting to bring in this newage kind of thing is is insane.

(20:39):
To be honest with you, but it'sthe little things, right.
It's like to be honest with you, but it's the little things,
right.
It's like.
I really wish I would have hadany clue.
But, guys, we're only nineyears in this and I think a lot
of people fault me for lettingit grow as fast as it did.
But everybody that carriesexpectations in the marketplace,

(21:00):
that carries expectations withemployees, it just does.
Once you get to that certainlevel, you're expected, compared
to the other people that theymay be coming from, to have this
or that and if you don't, well,you got to get it.
And so all of these gps we'rein two months, we're fitting on

(21:21):
them.
Basin rovers, boys like, like,own them.
We're fitting to own the lower,the lower too, yeah, I know,
well, that's okay.
But once, like, I'm sittinghere with a plan and a strategy
and boys, I'm so excited forwhat's coming.
But I've testing equipment,sewer testing equipment.

(21:42):
I had an insurance renewalmeeting today and we were just
going through all of our assetsabout what's insured and what's
not insured, et cetera, andsewer testing equipment that's
30 grand literally.
I'm sorry to just take this fora spin here, but he threw a

(22:05):
scenario at me.
He's like, hey, you got anenclosed trailer and she pulled
with a bunch of tools and I said, eh, we don't really do tools,
but we have our testingequipment in there a lot of
times.
And he's like, just say, theboys left it for lunch one day
and they locked it up real goodand ran down the road and
somebody grabbed that trailerand I asked him you know, for

(22:30):
this scenario is am I insuredright now?
He's like, yes, up to thisamount per this occurrence and
I'm getting the time more nowthan ever is where I was going
with this is to make sure thatwe're covered on the.
On the business stuff, well, Ihave folks like you working on
in the business.
But he was blown away to carryout what I was saying how
expensive the sewer test andequipment was.
The yellow box is like 12 or 14grand by itself, the triple

(22:53):
hose and, and we won't even getstarted in your world.
So actually we actually talkedabout your world in the
insurance for an all and I'm I'mhopefully I'm providing a
little insight to you guys withwhat I've been working on.
But we were talking about, hey,we're at rental rates and if we
run into a scenario where wehave to rent a track on a dozer

(23:16):
to complete a job because ourstuff's tied up, are we insured
and we are 100%?
But say I had an iMachine is 370000, now the same dozer run
every day, brand new for a guyto go by, um, and say we had a
210 or uh, something in betweenthere, right, 210, whatever, 240

(23:40):
, well, that's 600 000 turningthem to,000.
And that's what our limit was.
Was that $500,000.
I said I'm just playing devil'sadvocate here because all the
crazy crap that's happened inour world over the last couple
of years by the way, you twowere both some of my only
complaints of the year.
It's just funny you guys arehere.

(24:00):
I forgot about that.
I did not.
I never minded today.
But thank God you guys are bothhere and everything's okay.
But anyways, dude, gotsomething else.
Zeus, you got something.
Yeah, I already said nothingover there.

Speaker 3 (24:17):
Did you expect more?

Speaker 1 (24:18):
No, I didn't.
I'll just give you a littleQuiet person.
He really is.
He lets action speak for wordsand I will tell you this, though
, um, a little brag on you forjust a second the interpersonal
even.
I want everybody that'slistening out there don't
discount the fact if they can'tcommunicate verbally and you and

(24:40):
you feel like that's lacking,as long as the the like hey,
zeus here, email daily logs.
I never have to question it, Ihaven't ever, and so there's not
as much communication neededbecause I can go and look and
see and what.
Okay, use his logs, send it out.
Here's the email.
This is exactly what happenedand this is like across the
board for the first time ever.

(25:03):
You guys probably don't knowthis, but I'm scrolling through
builder's trend way more thanyou would ever imagine at this
point, trying to get used to it,trying to find things to tweak
and, um, try and make yoursystems run easier.
Right, and I saw both y'allschedules.
That was big and they put them.
Have you done one for Ducatiyet?
Okay, it's fine, it's fine,you've been a little tied up,

(25:24):
but either way, sam has actuallyentered into the takeoff world
and he's helping out Dylan bigtime, and Dylan's been bragging
hardcore that you just walked inthere, clicky clicky clicky.

Speaker 3 (25:34):
Well, I had a little experience coming in Right.
I'm glad we finally switchedover.
I mean, as you can tell thequantity differences, it's just
absolutely massive, but justdon't.

Speaker 1 (25:48):
We also did a personality and disc assessment
and I learned so much.
Did you do your disc assessment?
I don't think I read yours yet,but anyways, we'll skip over
that.
But I want to highlightscheduling.
Just, we can talk aboutscheduling for the next hour,
but it's literally the mostcrucial thing between us.

(26:10):
Four is scheduling and thatcommunication.
And and Jesus, yes, you'reyou're not the most vocal guy at
the company, but at the sametime, when we need an email or
we need something, we can alwayscall you and go hey man, what
are you thinking on this?
And you can spit out thatinformation accurately.
But watching you guys put thoseschedules in there, I'm telling
you I was smiling ear to ear.

(26:31):
I watched and I went in andChalina showed me how to break
it, cause she's teaching me too,guys like hardcore, what I need
to be looking for to hold thesesystems accountable, or the
next project manager, or thenext operations manager, where
those breaks are.
I'm trying to figure all ofthat out.
So that way we're not justmoving through this as we're

(26:52):
moving through this, we'rewriting new job descriptions and
standard operating proceduresfor those.
So when those do come availableand we do take that next step
in that growth.
We're going to be ready tosupport at whatever level that
is, and so, but to see thatschedule, I just wanted to
highlight kudos to both of you.
But Sam, no, you have, thankGod, we switched to playing

(27:13):
Swift and um, that's a wholedifferent topic.
But, um, scheduling, I want tohighlight that for a minute
because I want to, I want toshare, I want you guys to share
Sam, you, uh, I just want toshare, I want you guys to share
Sam.
I just want to share what hispersonality type was.
Commander Sam's usually realgood about having things in a

(27:34):
line and ducks in a row anddoesn't necessarily love when
things get outside of thoseducks in those rows.
He's real quick Get back in theline, boy.
But Zeus, you carry your ownvery unique scheduling approach
and they both work.
And Wes, dude, I got to tellyou you have been killing it

(27:57):
right off the bat and I'm lovingwhat we've got going on
currently logs, scheduling, etcetera.
But share a little Excelspreadsheet.
Excel spreadsheet, did youfirst?
Excel punch list, like that wasbig and that took it off of my
plate and we've all walked VBT,but I went out there just to

(28:17):
fill you in a little bitaudience.
I mean, it's these littlethings and you have to celebrate
these things.
This is where I also failed.
I went out to VBT, tookpictures of everything.
I personally walked it becauseI didn't want to play this back
and forth game with Anyways,that's a whole different topic
for another day as well.
I shared the pictures with Wesand again Shalina was like hey,

(28:38):
wes, you think you could help usout?
He's like well, yeah, I can try.
And so we airdropped them andhe worked his way through an
Excel punch list or built it onan Excel spreadsheet and I got
to tell you if you're an ironguy out there, a concrete guy,
or these guys are pipe layersand dirt guys, like they're so
far away from Excel.

(28:58):
But I'm so proud of you guysbecause you're going to see it.
You guys hopefully see thestepping stones that we're
taking of where we are going toget to this wonderful plateaued
landing of consistency and it'sbaby steps.
And I just want you guys toshare a little bit of insight on

(29:19):
big things in the utility world, dirt world, on scheduling, and
it's the simple things that youguys skip over, like the tab
situation, and you got it, zeus.
Kick us off with somebad-to-the-bone scheduling tips,
come on.

Speaker 4 (29:33):
I think the main setbacks on scheduling
utility-wise are usually planchanges.
Those will definitely throw youoff Bruh yeah.

Speaker 2 (29:45):
Or other contractors.

Speaker 1 (29:55):
Yeah, and how do you deal with dirt guys?

Speaker 3 (29:56):
you know dirt guys are slow, not ours, others,
which the weather's been theworst for us, I mean, we're
already in a swamp.
You have a three foot undercutand then it rains 20 inches, and
it's every other two days,literally.
How do you get anything done?
And luckily there's been whatLast, because last week we

(30:20):
didn't really do anything.
We couldn't.
The week before we got one daywe ran drugs to 150 loads.
You know, outside of that, youjust have to do as much as you
can on the good days and tryyour hardest on the bad days to
limit how long it lasts yeah,and prepare for the bad days too

(30:42):
.

Speaker 1 (30:43):
I think we've made a more of a shift now than ever,
rather than working right up tothat rain day and then shutting
down, I feel like we've all beencommunicative and I've always
been so scared that we weren'tgoing to get enough production.
Because why?
Because I couldn't track it.
Now I can track production on atotally different report that
you guys can't see, and I cansee red flags like, hey, we're

(31:04):
getting close on this or gettingclose on whatever, and go out
there and go, hey, why did thishappen?
Not jump down the throat and Ihope you guys can attest that I
don't jump down your throats.
I really try to coach and learnand be in the moment with you.
Yeah, there's moments that Iget mad, absolutely.
I probably don't get mad enough, but I want to be able to
understand why what's happeningright now more than ever.

(31:27):
Is it a production issue?
Is it an estimation issue?
Is it an accounting issue?
Did somebody enter something inwrong?
We don't know any of thatinformation, so let's not just
rush to assume, but at least weknow.
And what I'm talking about,guys, is there was years here at
Sycon and Nick uses thisanalogy, and you guys will

(31:48):
reference this very well Saywe've got 20 mantles to do on a
project.
We've put the pipe in,everything's great, and I hope
Mr Burr is coming through to putin 20 mantles.
I'm sorry, we've got a PsyConMaybe.
Shout out to Mr Bill Come onback.
Bill's out there forming us upsome manholes and bill's pretty

(32:09):
conscious about labor.
This is nothing, no referenceto him, it was just a shout out
to him.
But in this conversation we'vegot two days of labor per
manhole.
Um, estimated in, we've got oneday a machine, or maybe two
days machine, two days there.
We got two guys in it.
Okay, there's 20 of them to do.
Um, uh, bill decided that Natewasn't busy, so he picks up Nate

(32:31):
and he's with them for four orfive days or maybe the entire
duration.
When do you know Number one,number two?
Uh, it took them four daysactually per manhole.
Well, the big question is doyou know in manhole two, do you
know manhole 10 after the job'sdone?

(32:52):
Never, that's serious and thatis where we fail as a business.
We take excavations as a wholebecause we don't even understand
that concept.
I had no idea, but when theybroke it down to me.
I'm like I got to know, like Igot to know, like I have to have

(33:14):
that power, because once I havethat power, now, if I know what
manhole two well, obviously I'mgoing to cut the labor and go
back to redirect and say, hey,we got to.
What do we need?
Maybe we need a differentmachine.
Again that approach so like, yes, the monetary is everything and
it sucks, and we have to livethrough these hits and we're not
going to make as much profit,et cetera.

(33:35):
But as long as we're learningand say, you know, we make a
mistake on the undercut, we'vegot the entire job to make it up
.
Yeah, instead of oh my God,where did this $90,000 worth of
trucking come from?
And we're all scratching ourheads.
Or whatever the case may be,why did we put in an extra 500

(33:58):
feet of pipe out of here?
Like, why do I have thisinvoice and why is it in the
ground?
When we only proposed 2,800feet, when somebody didn't have
a conversation?
When do we know that?
And that's the biggest question, and the quicker you guys get
that information into the office, where they can use that
accurate information to tell thedecision makers.

(34:20):
Hopefully, folks, we're going tobe having a PM and an ops, and
then there's even broken downmore steps and details to be
analyzing and really support youguys while you're out there, so
that you're not asking so manyquestions, because those
questions suck when you'resitting there, and I know we've
all sat there, including myselfon a project, and we're just

(34:40):
sitting there going, damn, Idon't know if we're making money
.
I really don't know if we'regoing to get this done on time.
Do we have?
Is this the right material?
Like we've.
I've done that, growing thisthing and obviously we're in a
much different spot than that.
But I know there's guys outthere wondering they've got a

(35:01):
great group of guys like you andall their crew members and
their admin staff and they'reseven, eight years in.
They got 15, 20 employees andthey still don't know if they're
making money.
They don't know why they'relosing money.
They just don't know becauseall they are is a dirt and pop
guy at the end of the day,that's all I am, that's all I
have ever known.
I didn't just wake up and be aCEO and so, anyways, I kind of

(35:25):
went off on a tangent there, butliterally the three words that
I've been hammering down tothese guys more in the admin
staff.
But it's know your cost.
Because as long as I know thecost, we know how much money we
can make on top of it.
And profit's not a dirty word.
We need profit.

(35:45):
We need indirect and overheadto be paid for annually, like
we've got to find a way to dothat.
So if we're just here's ourcost, here's 10%, sending it out
the door, we aren't makingmoney, like we're negative
margins before we even hit thejob and you can't take a bad
number out there and give it toyou guys and expect you to turn

(36:06):
it into a good job.
Well, it will not happen.
I've tried it myself.
It can't happen and it takes uphere knowing that that can't
happen and you only figure thatout by experience.

Speaker 3 (36:18):
Which I kind of touch on that.
Come on, like you know, we bidjobs for what it costs plus a
little.
How do you balance that withhey?
We had a job fall through.
We need a job, it's.
How do you balance the?
We bid this way.

(36:39):
Do you start tailoring it tohey?
You know we're close on allthese bids, but we need one just
to get us through the nextthree months.
Do you start?

Speaker 1 (36:51):
no tinkering.
So this is such a good questionbecause we are living through
it right now.
Boys, we have I just left ameeting.
We definitely have more on thebacklog than I thought for dang
sure, especially in in the pipeworld.
But before Sam, there's what Icall the hamster wheel of death

(37:11):
as an entrepreneur and it is,and you guys have watched me do
it and felt the repercussions ofit.
It is you have estimation andproduction and as an
entrepreneur, as the leader, yourun in there, estimate a bunch
of work, because you're a salesguy and hopefully you're the one
selling the work.
Whatever the case may be, yourun in there, sell a bunch of

(37:33):
work.
Well, then you got a bunch ofteam members out here that don't
have systems, they don't haveprocesses, there's no procedures
, there's no nothing.
So they're all looking at thesame guy that estimated the job
to answer all the questionsthrough the job.
So instead of him sitting inthe office, he's going to run
out there.
What's he now focused on?
Production?
Has anybody even opened up anyestimates or talked to anybody

(37:53):
or anything?
No, so we run out here, get abunch of work done and then, all
of a sudden, we open up oureyes and what are we going to do
in 30 days?
So what do I do?
Run back up here and so for thesecond year in a row, I have
not.
Well, this is the.
I got to be honest with you.
This is the first time when ourbacklog has dwindled that I

(38:16):
haven't freaked out and ran upthere.
And I'll be honest with you andthe personality tests.
You guys wouldn't think thatI've read into those as hard as
I have, but me and Shalane havebroke them down and I've really
tried to understand you guys andhow you tick and and I I've.
Dylan was the first everemployee here.
I thought I knew that guy likeback of my hand, not all the way

(38:41):
, and one of the worst thingspossible for him is in a high
stress environment Situationlike we are.
He feels it more than you guyswould ever imagine.
He cares so much right now.
He wants to give you guys theanswers.
Here's where you're going forthe next two months, three
months, eight months, whatever,and it's coming.
He has been working his tailoff, but when you start feeling
all that pressure and yousuccumb to it and then you've

(39:03):
got somebody you care about orsuperior or whatever, coming in
there and adding a little bit ofpressure, or I start taking
over and go hey, dude, just giveme that job.
Hey, just give me that job.
And I've done it before.
I did it to him last year.
Obviously he wasn't in the spotthat he's in.
He's had a full almost twoyears, three years now Long time
estimate.
He didn't have as muchexperience but I caught myself.

(39:24):
That was literally thehandcuffs.
Now we took some work last yearat the when I said after that
Christmas party was at 23 into24, when Huntsville came about
and stuff like that, it wasliterally survival work, a
hundred percent.
But if I would have been doingwhat we're doing right now, we

(39:47):
would have never been in thatposition to have to take that
work.
And I know that now.
I didn't know that then.
So now it's, we're positioningourself for the next lull.
So what am I doing right now?
Because we've did what 23, 24?
There was a bunch, bunch ofwork out there and we're in
every conversation.

(40:07):
But we're in two differentpositions with development and
the commercial game.
We've not everybody you guysdon't understand has done the
commercial game Like we've donethe commercial game.
There's a lot of guys out therethat do a crap ton of
subdivisions.
That would lose their buttgoing and doing a dadgum
Starbucks.
But it's a lot easier for a guythat's astringent on the

(40:28):
commercial game to run over hereand do a subdivision.
Put us out in the fields, eh?
Boys Like, can you?
I can't wait, dude.
Honestly I can't wait.
But we're sitting in two veryunique positions.
We have all these numbers out.
We're not getting as muchfeedback back.
But that is a time for me to goall right.
Hit the CRM something totallydifferent.

(40:54):
I know every bid that's goneout the door in the last 60, 90,
80, whatever since the start ofthe year.
I can start going through.
All right, I know him.
Where's this at, where's thatat?
Hey, I picked up the phoneyesterday to a five and a half
billion dollar GC that's movingin here.
He has an office here.
They are huge.
They do more warehouse squarefootage than anybody by any
metric in the country.

(41:15):
I sat on a conversation with himfor an hour and a half because
I picked up the phone off a bidthat we already sent out.
We talked a little bit aboutthat, but he talked about two
other jobs that we're involvedwith that he's backdooring into
not backdooring, but beenapproached about, etc.
So it is very hard for me, sam,because I want to run up there
so bad and sling shit out thedoor as fast as I humanly

(41:39):
possibly can to get some ink ona piece of paper.
Why?
To make me feel better.
That's it.
Why to make me feel better?
That's it because what I'mdoing, although I'm ultimately
hey guys, we've got some work togo do have I set us up for the
best chance of successthroughout the project?
No, I haven't.
I'm just doing whatever I canto get us working.
Now, there was times we've hadto do that and I saw that time

(42:02):
coming.
But if we would have been setup differently and things didn't
go the way they did?
That's going to happen yearover year over year.
But it's all about beingprepared, having the systems and
holding each other accountableto get us there.

Speaker 3 (42:18):
And but literally, sam, I don't have a great answer
for you, but I am living byfaith, brother because, you know
, working with him the last fewdays you know I'm having a
little bit of prior experiencein estimating I was like, dude,
if someone says you're close,well call them.
Don't be afraid to call anestimator and say, hey, dude,

(42:41):
where did I go like, am I high,am I low, am I within 10k?
Yep, because we can cut 10k.
You know we just get money.
We can find 10k, like we canfind 10k on a job.
So if you can do that and youget a job, make the call, yeah,
but you got to make the call,yeah.

Speaker 1 (42:56):
You can't just be like well, I never applied to my
yeah, it is what it is, sorryno, and we had a working system
upfront with uh, heath was youknow kind of running the CRM
system back and forth and he hadDylan and and through this
transitional period, I'mstarting to find that if folks

(43:20):
have strengths, that's cool.
Don't compile what I alreadyknow their weaknesses on them
just because it's part of theirjob duty.
We're not doing that crapanymore, dude.
I mean, it's whoever's the bestof the best, to give us, the
entire company, a chance.
And we've got to look at it notfrom a Zeus's perspective or a
Wes or Sam's perspective or a meperspective.

(43:41):
It has to be this one goalmindset and understand that we
got to win each day, to make itto the end of the year in every
single direction, in everysingle department.
And that's hard, it's freakinghard.
And not make a mistake, we'reunderground guys.

Speaker 2 (43:59):
Too bad.

Speaker 1 (44:00):
You know what I mean, and there's unforeseen things
that we're going to missimmediately as soon as we step
on it.
Do copy Literally, sam, it's on.
Go check it out on the YouTube.
Oh, I probably need to Realquick, I'll pick that up.
Blue Collar PerformanceMarketing guys, I got to give a
shout out to my man, ike and histeam the value they're bringing

(44:21):
the behind the scenes of PsyCon, the marketing campaign.
Everything that they're doingis astonishing.
I love the look of our website.
Check that out PsyConEXCcom.
And while you're over theremaking peeky boos at our stuff,
you can check outbcperformancemarketingcom

(44:42):
backslash bcbpodcast.
Click the link in thedescription below and they'll
give you a free discovery call.
He will also give you a freecomp on a basically outlook
overlook of your marketingcampaign and your website.
Whether there is none, whetherthere is some or you went in the
wrong direction.
I'm telling you the valuesthere to help you and him get to

(45:05):
where you want to go.
He will help you and his team.
So shout out to Ike and theboys From there, literally the
YouTube side of things.
I know it's been.
I want to ask you guys, while Igot you in here, what's been
your thoughts on the YouTube andhaving your work displayed and
out there for everybody to see.

Speaker 2 (45:29):
My wife really enjoys it.
Okay, okay, I'll take that shegets to see what I do every day,
you know.

Speaker 1 (45:35):
Yeah, relatable right .

Speaker 2 (45:37):
Yeah, I think it'd be cool, you know, in the future
to show my son and my kids andlove that and even like my
parents, you know they live sixhours south.
They don't know what I do Yep,so they can watch it whenever.

Speaker 3 (45:52):
I love it, man, glad it's drone footage.
No audio how?

Speaker 4 (45:57):
do you like it, Zeus?
I think it's really coolbecause a lot of my family asks
me what I do for work and I'mlike, oh, I lay pipe.
What does that mean?
I bet you do I go call up theE-team and be like, oh, this is
what it means.
So I really like it.
It's really cool.

Speaker 1 (46:16):
It is.
I can't tell you the amount ofhate that we've got over it, but
we had.
I'll tell you guys this I don'teven know if you know this, but
the really large job inBentonville that we've been on
for a very long time um thatwe're fixing to wrap up, we

(46:36):
received because we had videosout and the one person had no
idea that we had the size ofmachines that we did to solve
the problem.
No idea that we had the size ofmachines that we did to solve
the problem.
We had 72 subscribers.
And we landed that phone calland I was all in and Dylan was
standing there.

(46:56):
He heard it straight from thehorse's mouth hey, what took you
so long?
Well, I had no idea.
I saw one of your videos.
I was blown away, guys.
I doubled down and I know folkshave talked crap and everything
else behind the scenes.
But the consistency to get wherewe're at it is now a weapon for

(47:22):
what we do and the people wereach.
Do you understand that?
Literally the videos, theaverage impressions of what
Saigon Excavation and Utilitiesdoes, impressions that means an
ad, I'm sorry, a video scrolledby them.
Okay, is a million a month.
A month August of last yearwhen we did some strategic stuff

(47:46):
6.4 million.
There was a little bit of adspend in there, but I'm talking.
You guys know me, I haven'tbeen pumping into that Will's
done such a great job but it'sbeen hard to cover costs there,
especially something like this.
And thank God there's sponsorslike Blue Collar Performance
Marketing and Podcast Videos andPsyCon and the other few that

(48:10):
are fixing to join the team.
And if you guys want to jointhe team, check out Blue Collar
Business Podcastcom, hit theBecome a Sponsor tab and shoot
us an email if there's a productor service that you might want
to be able to support and helpthe community.
But the new age of what we'retrying to do, guys, is so
different.

(48:31):
It's crazy to think, but in 10years the baby boomer generation
is gone out of the workforce.
Retired average age of 65,right.
So it's the tail end of it, andthere's a lot of.
If you look up statistics aboutfolks handing companies down,
et cetera, there's just not alot.
And and there's a lot of.
If you look up statistics aboutfolks handing companies down,
et cetera, there's just not alot and dang sure not a lot of
young faces hide gain whatsoever.

(48:53):
And so to have the fullunderstanding, the team that we
have and the way we approachprojects and complete them
consistently is don't get mewrong, we have our struggles, we
make mistakes.
We're not trying to hide them.
Check out the YouTube channel.
I discuss them all the time andI get people think probably I'm

(49:14):
a giant narcissist because I'mtrying to do everything that I'm
trying to do.
But I want you guys displayed.
I want what you guys do to beproud.
I'm the same boat.
Your folks live six hours away.
My dad lives 18 hours away.
I want him to see what's goingon.
Oh, what do you mean?
It drives a little bit of salesand conversion for the company.
Oh, it's now doing this.
Oh, now we're picking upemployees.
Oh, now we're getting in frontof the right people.

(49:36):
Oh, now we're like, literallythere's I was expressing this at
the Trebo Expo that you guysdon't even know this.
We have a project coming that'scompletely under-negotiated with
one of the major namedevelopers in town and it is a
prime location, unbelievable,and we have been brought in as

(49:56):
consultants and he's beenwatching you guys in town for
six months.
Um, because he watches thevideos.
He's a sill fence and go see,oh see, how this is going.
He knew your name.
He would be weird.
Yeah, sam, on that note, likethe least I know, but anyhow,
it's putting us in a unique spot.

(50:17):
I know people are very onetrack minded in our world, in
our industry and in general, andI'm trying to do something
different and I reallyappreciate you guys
understanding, you know, takinga risk.
Eat a fish heads man.

Speaker 3 (50:33):
I just gonna hate Eat a fish head man, I ain't just
going to hate.

Speaker 1 (50:37):
You ain't lying buddy , but what else you got?
What other questions you got?
You got any other?

Speaker 2 (50:45):
burners.
Yeah, I know you do.
You've got one.
This is from the office, ladies.

Speaker 1 (50:50):
Oh, okay.

Speaker 2 (50:53):
Let's see.

Speaker 3 (50:56):
While he's searching which one he wants to talk about
, I do have one.
What's the hardest part oftrying to keep a cushion, with
GCs just taking their sweet timeto pay?
Oh my God, buddy, that is sucha 90 days plus Yep, our average.

Speaker 1 (51:13):
How do you even try and Our average day to pay in
2024 was over 100 days.

Speaker 3 (51:20):
Which is insane To us .

Speaker 1 (51:21):
Receivables.
You could only imagine on thepayables, which you guys felt
that and I'm very open andhonest about you know, not 24,
23, I'm sorry and we were rightat our peak of our growth and
then like everything justknocked out from underneath us
All this work that was coming,but um man, because a lot of

(51:42):
people don't think about that,bro.

Speaker 3 (51:44):
You know they think.
Well, you have a contract.
Their contract says you'regoing to be paid on the the
first in the 20th of every month.
Well, that's not always thecase and there's nothing we can
really do about it.

Speaker 1 (51:58):
There is three words cash flow management and hell, I
didn't know what cash flow wasuntil I've always heard the word
, but hell, I never had any cash, you know.
So that's kind of what Ithought, but that was my
ignorance and me educatingmyself and what you guys don't
know.
Over the last year and a half,every single week, myself, sarah

(52:20):
and Shea have sat down andliterally gone week for week.
What's coming out of the bank?
Here's going this and made thismassive change up to okay,
we're going to be I can't tellyou how many conversations
they've come to me and we'resitting in there hey, we're 200
grand short next month.
What are we going to do?
Well, we're going to move thisand shuffle this.
And hey, we're 100 grand shortnext month.

(52:41):
What are you going to do?
Well, we're going to do thisand we're going to do this, but
the numbers are starting todwindle and we're hey, we're all
right for a week or two.
And I'm like, what'd you justsay?
But we've had a bunch ofcompounded problems and me and
Sarah myself, more or less thananybody, I was always trying to
find that one solution.

(53:01):
And I'm coming back to yourcashflow, I promise.
But I was trying to find thisone solution.
Oh man, compounded problemsneed compounded solutions.
But it didn't.
It didn't just happen overnight.
We were doing great, great,great, great great.
It's not like we just fell offa cliff.

(53:24):
It started.
It's just a roller coaster,guys.
But it's what you do in thosedownturns to learn about the
next upturn, to recoup for thenext downturn, because it's
coming.
You can't just act like you'regoing up and staying up.
I would love to stay at thatplateau and hopefully nobody
feels anything.
But it's from cashflowmanagement.
There is no cushion in ourworld.
We didn't start with money.
I started with a whole lot lessmoney.

(53:48):
And it just left every monthand I had a very negative
cashflow for the first couple ofyears in this business and I've
shared with you guys where thatcame from.
But at the same time, it takeslooking at the whole ball of wax
and not going oh well, 200knext month, no, hey, we're short

(54:11):
$200,000 next month.
What are we going to do?
And that's the accounting.
Looking at productionProduction.
Talking to accountingProduction guy goes back to
production team and goes heyguys, vbt, we got to be done by
the 20th because accounting isdriving that.
But for years, okay around here, production just did production

(54:34):
things.
Accounting wasn't drivingproduction.
Accounting needs to drivewhatever opportunity she has to
capture money.
We have to go and execute toget that cash flow, to ensure
that those bills get paid onthat cash flow.
But if we don't hit those dates, then that cash flow doesn't

(54:55):
hit.
That whole plan that we justmade for the entire week's got
blown up in flames.
When you can't get any tractionmoving forward and you're
really watching it, that close,something's got to change and
pressure started and schedules,and that's where all of this
started coming from.
Ultimately, sarah and Chase satdown one day and made this

(55:17):
entire year spreadsheet, ourentire year, every single bill,
that is.
I'm so glad I get to share allthis with you guys because this
has been a little bit of time toshare some insight of literally
oh my God, I had no idea butthe entire year from January to

(55:38):
December.
Every single fixed bill, everysingle variable bill, every
single average is in there andit's budgeted and forecasted out
.
So we know how much revenue bythe end of the year.
We know how much overhead weneed to capture by the end of
the year.
Like, those are things that wehad no clue.
Why are we just oh, whatever weget, go run.

(55:58):
Well, I didn't know anydifferent, neither did you guys,
and nobody suggested anythingduring that time.
But at the same time, we'vepositioned ourselves to let
accounting tell us hey, what'sgoing on with this job?
If we can finish this up andknock these punch list items up,
there's 20, 30, 80 grand therewe can capture this month to

(56:22):
divvy up this hole, or whateverthe case may be.
So, cashflow management, youhave to do it, and if you don't
do it, find a system that works.
Ask ChatGPT.
I don't care what you do, butI'm telling you, if you're out
there and you don't know, weekfor week, month for month, when

(56:42):
things are hidden, like we haveour payables, I'm sorry, our
receivables which is moneycoming in, we may be short there
.
So we're always preparing 45,60, 80, 90 days ahead of time.
We were never doing that forthe first five, six years, and

(57:04):
now that we've had that system,what I'm trying to tell you is
to get to the problem.
It all stacked and it took timeto get to the solutions.
It stacks and it takes time,and we're feeling the little
wins.
We're wrong.
Things happen, oh, setback.
Okay, it's a setback, but whatare we doing about the setback

(57:25):
now compared to what we used todo about it?
Okay, this happened on this job, let's talk about it.
We're going to talk aboutwhatever comes this year,
whatever hit we take as acompany.
We're going to do these postanalysis Now that we're giving
you enough information on thefront of the job.
Now, once the job's completeand behind, I'm going to pull
you in there and we're going totalk about with the estimator,
you and me, and sit there and go.
What went good, can we repeatit?

(57:46):
Was it profitable?
What went bad?
Let's talk about it and we'regoing to find out what went bad
where it happened.
And luckily, I keep coming backto the dirt Cause it's just
sorry, it's just new.
It's new right now and and atthe same time, we already know
what caused this problem writtendocumentation, training called

(58:08):
a whole nine and it's I alreadyknow guys.

Speaker 3 (58:11):
So um but in this instance it's when it's not us,
when it's just someone just notpaying their bill.
You know, recently we had thisissue Lean them up, dude you
just straight to the lean youhave.

Speaker 1 (58:27):
I mean, that's the easiest You've got lawyers, you
have to have a good lawyer, cpaand a banker them three.
And if you do utilities, publicinfrastructure, you need a good
bonding and insurance guy.
And they all need to talk toeach other and have to know each
other.
They don't need to all hateeach other.
That makes your life hell, butliterally, man, I used to take

(58:51):
folks' word a lot more than I do.
Now I don't care anymore.
It is your 75 days.
If you hit that 90 mark at 75days, our admin team is shooting
down to the legal team hey,look, this might be coming just
like we're forecasting.
Right, we're already probablysent eight or nine emails back

(59:14):
and forth, not really gettinganywhere.
It's just kicking the can,kicking the can, kicking the can
.
And it will matter.
On volume.
I'll be fair, because ifthere's a job that we have a
bunch of hard costs in, that wehaven't recouped a bunch of
money on yet, like that firstpay app, yeah, we're going to
tiptoe that line, get that costcovered and then from there

(59:38):
we're going to be much morecareful about that job.
But if we have to get to that75 day mark, it is a lean
conversation.
But the only time I stepoutside of that now is hey,
we've got 150, 200 grand hardcost in this thing and this
dude's paid us like 20 grand.
Like we have got to get to thatpayout.
I'll tiptoe for sure.
But in the state of Arkansasthe last working day.

(01:00:02):
That's why it's so important tolog.
Even if you're there for 10minutes, it can change my lien
rights, the whole company's lienrights.
So if you're the job, job'sbeen done since December.
But you were out there handlingpunch list items in February
29th you just gained 60 days.
So from the last point when youguys were there from then to

(01:00:24):
day 75, that's the window I'vegot to pre-lean and start the
lean notice.
So if I get outside those termsin the state of Arkansas,
you're pretty much hoes.
So if you're not having thatconversation, you literally let
your lean rights go.
Done that.
It's not a fun conversation.
You don't have no leverage.
So sorry, we put the cost inthe ground.

(01:00:47):
The boys worked the freakingballs off.
We especially.
If we hit a time crunch or aschedule, I give them zero.
Hey look, contract says 45 days.
45 days means 45 days.
Hey, uh, okay, gc's gonna payus in 10 days.
Hey, man, okay, cool, we'lldeal with that like I'm not
going to be up on you about 45if you're communicating, hey

(01:01:09):
looks, take a little bit.
We move a lot of money, like inthis game, like it takes a lot
of money to pay a lot of money,and I I understand that and as
long as they're communicatingwith me.
But there comes a point where Ihave to look at it from a legal
perspective and go, hmm, are wereally, do we trust this guy
enough?
How much is this money?
Is this two grand or is this200,000?

(01:01:31):
Is this 20 grand?
I don't care if it's 10 grandor above, I'm going to, I'm
going to lean you up.
That's our money, we worked forit.
And why are we waiting 90 to100 days in the first place?
But I need you guys to knowthis.
So if it's 20 grand, it costsus $3,000 to $4,000 to fully
lean a project.
So that goes lawyer fee or justlean fee itself.

(01:01:54):
All inclusive, all inclusive.
We pay them, them, they takecare of all the all county state
, all that.
But I mean, it's done and youpay for that speed as well.
And then within a couple ofdays they are blowing your phone
up, going.
What is this letter?
My owner's pissed off.
Well, you know what.
Have you not had a conversationwith your owner?
That's your freaking fault.

(01:02:16):
Gc man or developer man, ordon't put me in that spot I've
got.
Did you tell him I got threehundred thousand dollars for the
pipe and everything else in theground out there?
What do you mean?
You ain't freaking told him, orwhatever the case may be.
Um, that first job you were onthere p ridge, that was that.
Was that case?
Is that a bad contractor didn't, although we were doing.

(01:02:36):
Everything we were supposed todo was in the parameters that we
were told.
We notified who we weresupposed to notify, but they
didn't notify the owner and man,that was the ugly of the
industry.
Right there, it's people, gcs,literally.
I cannot express this to youguys enough, especially as we're
first walking the commercialgame.
If they can find a way to takeadvantage of you, oh, dude, they

(01:03:00):
sick on you like dogs onfreaking, like leftovers, dude,
like scraps, and they just useand abuse you.
I just had Trent Harris on herewith Blue Collar Contractors.
He did some seven brews, didsome grade for the concrete guys
.
He found out what a back chargeis because he thought he was
just and we've.
We found that out over theyears.
I did personally millwood,millwood church parking lot and

(01:03:23):
we thought we're just going todo the parking lot and, as sam,
you have very good at bluetopping with a dozer and a
roller, like there's a processto get that and that's ass grade
.
You got to come down to thislevel and start thinking at this
level, to this level to makesure when you compact it down to
this much, it's there and likethere's no holes right totally

(01:03:44):
different thing I want.
I want a freaking blade one ofthese days.
Well, it's coming anyways.
But especially, we starteddoing a bunch more subdivisions.
Yeah, that I come home, I'm abig old monsoon, all right.
So so what else you guys got?
Yeah, you had one.
You were looking up I didn'tknow it came from the girls.
So, yeah, sorry, that's how Iwork here, guys.

(01:04:07):
You guys should know thatbetter.

Speaker 3 (01:04:09):
These guys hate when they're like hey, boss, we got a
question about this and itshould be just a very easy,
direct answer, and sometimes Igive the 25 minute squirrel
airplane which is funny becausein the way shaylene is like you
should ask him what is big outof the box, uh ideas, and I was
like no, that's like a three-dayconversation, we don't need

(01:04:31):
that.

Speaker 1 (01:04:32):
My big out of the box idea.
Well see, you See, you'realready coming.
You go, hit me, hit me, hit me,hit me hit me Ready, you sure,
yep.

Speaker 2 (01:04:46):
What do you think about the idea of supers being
more aware of financial costsand being more responsible for
keeping the profit margin?
Love this.
In doing that, do you think itwill help us be more able to
track the project and lead thecrews?

Speaker 1 (01:04:56):
Completely agree.
This was me and Sarah learningbusiness.
We didn't know any better.
We figured transparency isn'twhat you.
Now I'm sitting here, I can'tbelieve I'm saying this, but the
least transparency as possiblehow you thought we did business,
like you keep things personaland you keep things quiet, like

(01:05:17):
and everything.
But transparency is the biggeststruggle for guys in the three
to five years because they wantto shoulder everything.
But that they want to bitchabout shouldering everything and
it's like you're not even.
You're not even giving them achance.
Number one like pre-cons,internal pre-cons we talked
about that didn't really evermaterialize.
And then we finally like, okay,we have got to do this with

(01:05:39):
production rates.
But transparency building youguys, the trans.
The thing I was afraid of to getto this point and it takes time
to get here is working on thatinside accounting and going from
where we were taught.
And then our new lady is sowonderful.
Shout out to Ms Julieie.
She just gave the girls a hugecompliment.

(01:05:59):
Look, girls, you did greatabout job costing and knowing
everything at the end of theyear, but they didn't know where
to put it.
There's such a fine it is 100and um, but literally job
costing is the way to buildprofit and if you don't let the

(01:06:21):
guys that are doing the dangwork know the job costing, how
in the hell do you ever stand achance at succeeding or making a
little extra on the job?
And so, literally I had aJanuary.
First week of January I wentdown to our big CPA lawyer man
and I said, hey, my number onegoal this year is accounting.

(01:06:43):
I'm kind of getting thisproduction thing figured out,
working together Estimation.
We're really I felt really goodset in stone.
Heath helped there with Dylan.
Dylan man shout out to Dylandude, he is cranking it, he
really is.
But I felt good about both ofthose.
My main number one goal wasaccounting.
We had to figure that piece out.

(01:07:04):
Is that Sarah?
Because give me a little bit ofgrace here, which I don't think
a lot of people are realizing Iwas trying to plan and forecast
like, hey, what are we going todo when, when you guys go on
maternity leave here?
Like I lost Shay for two to 10weeks, eight to 10 weeks, I
don't know exactly and then Ilost.
We had four days and then Sarahwas gone.

(01:07:25):
Yeah, so for five months lastyear I was obviously within a
two ladies system and we'refixing to do another support
role.
But like trying to navigatesystem and we're fixing to do
another support role, but liketrying to navigate, pushing this
new system, trying to figurethis all out with who, who's
going to be doing it.
I don't want to train the wrongperson, is this?

(01:07:46):
Hey, I had to look at Sarah andgo, hey, you, you really want
to be the in the business personand I need her up here working
with me on the business bad, herup here working with me on the
business bad.
And so, and shay is, as youguys know, more than capable and
what a godsend she's been andempowering her, just like we're

(01:08:06):
empowering you guys with chalene.
We've got her miss julie liketotally outside force, bringing
her up that ladder.
And that's what miss mr richardtold me down there in the first
week of January.
He said, hey, look, that's fine, but this is these steps that
you have got to do, becauseliterally, I was looking at him
and how do we get from here toan incentive-based structure?

(01:08:28):
How do we do that?
Mr Richard, I have no clue.
Well, number one you clean upinside accounting and you get to
this point.
Then we look at this and thenwe look at this and then, once
we have a couple of quarters ofconsistency that we can analyze
and make sure everything's goingin the right buckets and it's
getting paid and everything'sgoing, then we can roll out the
incentive-based structureprogram, because we should have

(01:08:50):
a foundational base Afterlooking at accounting and
bookkeeping.
It may take a year or two.
I'm hoping, truly hoping,through this navigation of the
financial world through the endof this year, that next year
we're rolling out some type ofeven small incentives.
Whatever we got to do, itdoesn't matter.

(01:09:11):
But to Wesley's point andthrough the last podcast I was
literally talking.
I think it's pro-tive and I'msorry that I can't quite
remember, but it's pro-tive andyou guys will be able to see
from day one how you can swingthe job and it's broken out.
The entire costs are there andit can bolt on to any program

(01:09:33):
that we choose.
It's basically an Excelspreadsheet and it's all legal.
Beagle, even in California.
Shout out which when I say thatit's extreme labor laws over
there and it's really stringentand it's union.
So I know it's working forsomebody else and it changes the
game.
You know what he said to me guys.
He said how do you expect, froman owner standpoint, to sit

(01:09:56):
here and base everything aroundtime but then pay your guys on
time, and I was like I get that,but I don't know any other way.
Yeah Right, you don't know what, you don't know Exactly and,
dude, I can't tell you theamount of hours I've spent at
this desk and across the halllearning.
I have been doing this for us,for me to learn, sharpen me so I

(01:10:19):
can be a better leader, andwhile putting it on display for
everybody else to come alongwith us, and hopefully there's
some guys out there that I canhelp along the way.
You know, but I number one.
I can't tell you guys how muchI appreciate you just coming in
here and talking on a rainy day.
But, um, I've got one, one lastquestion for you guys and I hope

(01:10:41):
you guys all have some insight,and if you've listened to the
show so many times, I know Ihave so much freaking.
Yeah, that's right.
Uh, what's a takeaway, I ask?
I ask this to every singleperson on the show and I have
almost.
We are now this will be episode37 or 38.
It's kind of crazy.
Yeah, a plethora.
So check that out atbluecollarbusinesspodcastcom or

(01:11:04):
any of your streaming platformsand here at the end of the show,
make sure and grab us a ratingand a follow, please.
But, guys, the takeaway for youknow, the the you guys that are
out there that maybe doesn'thave a resource like this, maybe
listening the first time what'sthe takeaway for him when he's
just stuck in the mud?
And, as we know, we can usethat as a physical sense, but I

(01:11:26):
mean that more in a mental andemotional and, as we've gone
through what we've gone throughas a company, as this structure,
think about those days thatwere hard and what'd you do on
those days?
Though that's what I'm looking.

Speaker 3 (01:11:44):
She got for me the 2d just keep digging dude just do
yeah yeah, I mean, I think itkind of comes down to what your
vision is, as in thesuperintendent, like do you see
it getting to that point?
Because you have to have faithin it too.

(01:12:04):
Like you have to have thatbelief or you don't have that
drive.
That's right.
You don't have that motivationto wake up every day, knowing
it's going to be a crappy day,tough one, just coming in and
saying you know what.
But I can see what thepotential is and I know that
hard work can get it there.
But I've got to show up everyday to even have the chance it

(01:12:26):
shows character.

Speaker 1 (01:12:28):
Yeah, a percent of it does.
It's the one day at a time Ican't tell you guys how many
times I've said that to myselfin the last couple of years Like
one day at a time You've got towin the damn day, that's all it
is, and then string a couple ofthem together.

Speaker 4 (01:12:48):
You got any advice for them?
Just show up, put in the effort, find the work.
You'll get to where you want togo.

Speaker 1 (01:12:55):
Literally, it's that simple, though.
There's no some big show up.
Put in the work and you'll getto where you want to go, like
Zeus.
That was the most propheticthing you said all night.
I really appreciate yourinsight today.
No, I do, it's just steppingout of the shell for all three

(01:13:17):
of these guys.
But I'll show you the responsesthat this episode comes from
and you'll realize why I do.
What I do here is to help thisguy at the end of this podcast
where he's just like bro, am Ireally got to do another day of
hanging steel?
You're talking to concrete guys, plumbers, electricians, not
just popping dirt guys.
Obviously it's relatable to us.

(01:13:38):
But you're talking toentrepreneurs that are listening
to you that hoping they theycan just have three guys, let
alone superintendents or aleadership or whatever you know,
and it it's.
It's so easy to not win the day.
It's so easy to make it looklike you got it all together.

(01:13:59):
It's.
It is hard, it's not easy.
Like I don't want any to paintthat picture for anybody.
It's not easy, it's.
It's not easy to be, it's.
I'm sorry, it's not as easy aseverybody just talks about.
Well, you just got.
It's a mindset thing, dude,you've got to click it up here.
Hey look, today's going to suck, but it could suck a little

(01:14:23):
less, because we're going to dothis and this plan, whatever.

Speaker 3 (01:14:27):
But mindset is everything guys show up put in
the word and just got to keep itmanaged, like the emotional
mindset and the mindset you'vegot to keep it managed.
Try and keep it managed likethe emotional mindset and the
minds that you've gotta keep itmanaged.
Try and keep it even keel.
You know, for the longest timepeople said speak it into
existence.
And I was like man, that's whatyou can tell me, that that is a

(01:14:53):
pile of diamonds.
But if it's a pile of shit,it's still a pile of diamonds.
But if it's a pile of shit,it's still a pile of shit.
Honestly, the more you speakpositively to yourself, that may
be the only positive thing youhear all day is what you tell
yourself.
That's right.
But as long as you keep tellingyourself, hey, dude, you know,

(01:15:15):
today wasn't the best, we didn'tdo near what we need to do, but
we still progressed, that's howyou, the little wins, stack
into big wins.

Speaker 1 (01:15:23):
That's right, just got to keep stacking and
everybody you know, within thecompany has to stack individual
wins to compound into companywin, to compound into wins upon
wins, upon months, upon quarters, upon years.
And then, all of a sudden, youwake up and you're like, oh my
God, we're doing this thing andI can't tell you the amount of
wins.
We don't celebrate them nearoften enough because we're so

(01:15:45):
concentrated on getting to thenext one, especially myself.
But, man, the wins are stacking, it's compounding, and so
scared to let you guys down, andI know you guys are scared to
let you guys down, and I knowyou guys are scared to let the
company down, myself down, andbut uh, truly, I can't wait to
see.
I hope we get to sit here in acouple of years, or maybe in a

(01:16:07):
different studio shout outpodcastvideoscom, though, but
who knows where we'll be in twoyears?
And, uh, sitting in our shopand being glassed.

Speaker 4 (01:16:16):
You never know I'm just kidding, Be down in Bama
dude.

Speaker 3 (01:16:20):
Be on the beach.
Oh man Podcasting lawn chairs,let's go, Dude let's do it Bet.
I'm down.

Speaker 1 (01:16:28):
There is a mobile kid here that podcastvideoscom
offers.
Come on, man.
Guys, I really appreciate youtuning in today.
I really hope the insight and alittle bit of credibility to
what I'm sitting here trying totell you.
Guys, I am not sitting heretelling you plan, strategize,
budget forecast for any reasonother than I didn't do it.

(01:16:50):
Now we're doing it.
I see the reasons why you do itand I'm trying to make sure you
don't make the mistakes that wemade along the way.
And if you're blessed enough tohave individuals that stick it
out with you to see the otherside of it, kudos to them and
make sure you let them know.
Thank you, you're proud of them.

(01:17:10):
I see the transition, I see thechange.
I try to be conscious aboutthat.
When I see it, I call it out,whether it's in front of anybody
or whether it's individually,and try and celebrate that win.
But, guys, I really appreciateit.
Check outbluecollarbusinesspodcastcom.
Watch or listen straight fromthere, totally subscription free
.
But if you've got asubscription, give us a rating

(01:17:31):
and follow on there.
And I appreciate you guys somuch and until next time, y'all
be safe, be kind and be humble.
Bye-bye.
If you've enjoyed this episode,be sure to give it a like.
Share it with the fellers.
Check out our website to sendus any questions and comments
about your experience in theblue collar business.
Who do you want to hear from?
Send them our way and we'll doour best to answer any questions

(01:17:54):
you may have.
Till next time, guys.

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Ep. 37 - How to Handle Honest Questions from Your Team

Episode Transcript

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Ep. 37 - How to Handle Honest Questions from Your Team