September 26, 2025 • 30 mins
The growing chorus of authors reporting mysterious declines in their Kindle Unlimited page reads has sparked anxiety throughout the indie publishing community. But before you panic about your own KU numbers, this episode dives deep into what's really happening behind the scenes.
Penny and Amy explore the multifaceted reasons behind fluctuating page read counts, from seasonal shifts and algorithm changes to subscription saturation and increased competition from AI-generated content. They challenge the dangerous "set it and forget it" mentality that leaves authors vulnerable to Amazon's ever-evolving ecosystem.
What makes this conversation particularly valuable is the strategic alternatives they offer. The duo is also doing a deep dive in Amazon's recent Kindle Unlimited policy changes, which is an exciting development for authors!
Whether you're all-in on Kindle Unlimited, considering enrollment, or deliberately staying wide, this episode provides critical perspective on navigating Amazon's subscription service with eyes wide open. Subscribe to the podcast for more insider insights on book marketing strategies that actually work in today's publishing landscape.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello and welcome back to the Book Marketing Tips
and Author Success Podcast.
This is Penny Sanseviery andAmy Cornell, and we are very
excited to be back for anotherFriday show, and today we're
talking about Kindle Unlimited,which is always kind of I mean,
kindle Unlimited, I realize, iskind of a good news, bad news
(00:21):
thing for a lot of authors.
Some authors really love it.
Some authors really love it,some authors really hate it.
But it's definitely defined alot about how Amazon operates
and having your books in KindleUnlimited potentially can open
(00:43):
you up to you know a lot.
You know to a group of readersthat you may otherwise have had
a hard time reaching.
The challenge is and we sawthis, this is another idea that
actually came from Reddit thechallenge is is that a lot of
(01:03):
authors have been seeing and notit's this is not everybody all
at once, but incrementally adecline, a kind of limited page
read decline.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
And, amy, you spotted this on Reddit that a lot of
authors were kind of complainingabout this, right, yeah it
seems to be a pretty hot buttonissue on Reddit right now the
decline in page reads, page readdrop-offs.
A lot of authors are talkingabout it.
I will say that from what Iread and that's kind of why we
(01:40):
wanted to do the show is thatbased on the conversations I was
seeing them having?
Is that a lot of it centeredaround?
It came out of nowhere?
I've done the same thing sincethe beginning and that's kind of
like the tricky part rightthere, right Like I've been
doing the same thing since I putmy book into KU and all of a
sudden things are changing andthey wanted to know why.
(02:03):
They wanted to know who elsewas experiencing it, all these
other things, and so that's kindof what piqued my interest is
that, especially when people say, well, I've been doing the same
thing over and over again andnow things are changing, and
it's like that's pretty typicalin publishing.
Actually, you know, yeah, yeah,yeah, yeah.
We very much always talk aboutlike very little in authorship,
(02:27):
in author branding, in growingyour business as an author is
set it and forget it and we usethat phrase all the time when we
do shows across topics thatvery.
It's not very often that youjust get to be done with
something and you know for thoseof you listening that are going
, oh great, Sorry, Right, Nottrying to stress you out, but
the reality is you are appealingto real, everyday people with
(02:49):
changing interests, with thetrends in the industry change.
There's so much going on.
It's such a fun, interesting,dynamic industry, but to stay
competitive in it, you need toalso remain interesting and
dynamic, and so that's what kindof led to let's chat about this
and talk about ways to remaininteresting, dynamic and
(03:10):
competitive.
If you have your books in KU oryou're interested in putting
your books in KU, just so youcan be prepared.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Right, exactly, and this is you know.
And again, this is not a,because we've done a lot of
Amazon warning shows and I thinkwe did one just a couple weeks
ago.
But this is not an Amazonwarning show, this is a.
This is kind of what happenswith Kindle Unlimited.
This is the ebb and flow, shallwe say, of the Amazon ecosystem
(03:41):
and it does change Amazonecosystem and it does change.
So part of it is that.
So we had an author who saidthat who writes, this author
writes in a couple of differentgenres and on the one hand, one
(04:08):
side of her library just reallypicked up and her other side
kind of dropped off.
Seasonally this happens, right,so seasonally people become
like.
For example, starting in July,I had a lot of books presented
to me in the algorithm at Amazonthat were about Hallmark
Christmas books.
Apparently, amazon knows I'm atarget.
I don't know how they know.
They know that I'm a target forthese feel-good, like Hallmark,
(04:32):
holiday-ish type books.
So a lot of that happens.
The A10 algorithm, amy, I think, because we actually did a show
on the A10 algorithm.
The A10 algorithm really wipedout a lot of.
I mean, it changed.
I don't want to say that itwiped out a lot of books, but it
really did change visibilityfor a lot of authors.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
Right, yeah, and I think it's kind of I mean, I
know, when you and I have spokenabout other things, I've said
this before, but I really dothink it applies here as well
that it's kind of like, when yougo get blood work out of
nowhere, like unless you getblood work every month
religiously and you really trackeverything I'm one of those
people that's pretty convincedthat if you randomly go in to
(05:20):
get blood work, or even if it'sscheduled, whatever, but you
only do it a couple times a year, there's always a chance you're
going to see things that arepotentially a little concerning
or that you weren't expectingand all this stuff.
But it's like, but yeah, but ifwe check them regularly and
track things regularly, maybe wewould see these kind of ups and
downs and shifts and changes.
But if you're not doing thatand you show up one day and
(05:44):
start looking at some of yourstats or your back-end data,
you're going, oh my gosh, thislooks terrible.
You know, maybe it was terriblea few months ago too, but then
it picked up again.
Right, Maybe it's always beenterrible again, just setting
something up and assumingeverything's great until it gets
(06:06):
really bad and not actuallytracking that.
There are, as you said, prettynatural ebbs and flows to these
kind of things.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Yeah, yeah, exactly, and you know, some of it can be
so.
So I think, I think thetracking is always a good.
It doesn't necessarily meanthat you have to know, because
the page read math is.
I feel like the page read mathis a little convoluted and
oftentimes ridiculous.
(06:34):
It seems like it's aridiculously low and then you
total it up and you're like, ohokay, well, that makes a lot of
sense.
So, but tracking you know, justmaking a note and just tracking
is also really importantBecause as you continue through
your author career, you'll startto see trends Like oh yeah, you
know what In January I knowthat my book's really January is
(06:54):
not a great month, so maybe I'mgoing to pull back on the ads,
maybe that's not really myseason, but come February, march
, april, things start to reallypick up again, right.
February, march, april, thingsstart to really pick up again,
right.
So subscription saturation Imean, I think that there is
(07:17):
something to that.
So Amazon really does push theKindle Unlimited a lot, right.
Amazon likes that KindleUnlimited subscriber because
they get that monthly fee andthen these readers have access
to all these books.
But there is something to this,you know, a subscription
saturation where I don't noticenecessarily that there are so
(07:40):
many more people signing up forthis subscription, which then
you know by the same, you knowin the same vein, same vein
would say well then, you'regoing to get a lot more readers
to your you know, you're a lotmore people picking your book
out of Kindle Unlimited.
There is a saturation of titleproblem and I think a lot of
this not a lot, but some of itcould potentially go back to the
(08:04):
AI-generated books which youknow we talked about and we
refer to this person now asChatTPT guy who was going to
write 50 books nonfiction, forwhich he has no expertise, just
using ChatTPT, which makes mewant to tear my hair out, right,
right.
So to some extent those couldpotentially be factors.
(08:25):
There could be a saturation ofsimilar titles, so new releases
that just flooded themarketplace and all of a sudden
now you're seeing kind of a dropoff.
So there's a lot of differentthings that it could potentially
be before you go in and youpanic Like, oh my gosh, the
Kindle Unlimited be before yougo in and you panic like, oh my
(08:46):
gosh, the Kindle Unlimited.
But the other thing, amy, youand I talked about this too, the
green room is that you know,having all of your books at
Kindle Unlimited is not a reallysolid strategy either.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
No, I mean, it's like and I love this example it's
like keeping your entireretirement fund in one stock.
Yes, right, Exactly, you'rerelying on one element to do
essentially all of your salesfor you, which just blows my
mind, and so I think it'sdefinitely one of those
(09:21):
situations too.
Again, we get it.
We work with new authors allthe time, and so we fully
respect that.
There is a lot going on.
It takes a lot to write thebook, and then you have the
production and then it's outthere, and then it's time to
market it, which I realize isnot everybody's favorite, and it
(09:42):
just seems like there's alwayssomething to be doing, and so I
can totally understand theappeal of KU.
It's like, yes, please takethis screaming baby off my hands
and make it awesome, make sureeverybody reads it.
I love that idea, let's do that, but the reality is that is not
going to carry you forever, andit's certainly not going to
(10:04):
carry you by using that strategywith every single one of your
titles.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
Right, right, Exactly .
So I think that being you know,and here's the thing Kindle
Unlimited we actually did a showon Kindle Unlimited.
Kindle Unlimited, specificallyKindle Unlimited if used
correctly, can be a really greatway to introduce your readers
to your brand and or your series, right?
So putting the first book in aseries, for example, in Kindle
(10:31):
Unlimited, is a great way tointroduce readers to the
storyline, right To you as anauthor.
Fabulous, okay.
But I also think that it's amatter of knowing.
So Kindle Unlimited and youalluded to this in what you were
saying is Kindle Unlimited iskind of a.
It feels like it's an easy wayto get a bunch of readers.
(10:52):
Like I'm just going to put mybook in Kindle Unlimited and let
Amazon kind of figure it out,right, Right, Amazon's not going
to figure it out, Like, that'snot.
Amazon is not there to help yousell your book, they're just
there to offer you a platformthat will hopefully sell your
book, right?
So I think also knowing whetheror not your book is Kindle
(11:14):
Unlimited material is reallysmart.
And here's a tip too.
So my books are in KindleUnlimited, and that is not the
norm necessarily for nonfiction,but I have my books in Kindle
Unlimited because the readers,because of the demographic of
the reader, right so, but Idon't have them.
(11:37):
I don't have it automaticallyrenewed, so every 90 days I have
to go back in there and decideif I want to have the book in
Kindle Unlimited.
So that's.
The other thing, though, too, isthat you could dip your book in
and out of Kindle Unlimited.
Here is something that I getpushback from authors on all the
time when Amazon says that yourbook has to be exclusive with
(12:01):
Amazon in order to be in KindleUnlimited, that guidance does
not follow your print book, soyour print book can be
everywhere.
Your e-book, if you are inKindle Unlimited, should only be
on Amazon, although Amazon'smaking changes and we're going
to cover that in a minute Um,and Amazon does sell the lion's
(12:25):
share of e-books.
I want to say, depending ongenre, Amazon sells between 90
and 95 percent of all e-booksout there.
So, having it exclusive or not,Amazon's going to be your best
source, right?
But I mean, Amy, there wasanother idea too.
(12:48):
You know.
So, instead of putting yourentire backlist in Kindle
Unlimited, going wide Now.
Going wide, if you're notfamiliar with that term, means
having your book on all of theplatforms, which absolutely, you
can definitely do that and thenhaving one book in Kindle
(13:13):
Unlimited, exclusively Amazon.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Right, yeah, I mean, I think that that's just it, and
it's another one of thosethings that we wish we could
tell you that this is exactlyhow to do it and it works for
everybody every time.
Unfortunately, that's not thecase.
That's not how this works.
That's really not how thosethings that we wish we could
tell you that this is exactlyhow to do it and it works for
everybody every time.
Unfortunately, that's not thecase.
That's not how this works.
That's really not how anythingworks, right, honestly.
But that is another way toapproach this to where you are,
(13:38):
hopefully by going wide,generating a lot of additional
exposure.
Like you, are literally tappinginto every potential
opportunity to find readers ondifferent platforms, even if the
percentage of readers that usethat platform is smaller.
You know we're big on qualityover quantity, so maybe that'll
work for you, you know.
So be selective about what youdo with each book and not just
(14:01):
fall into a trap of.
This is how I do things andeverything has to be the same,
and I loved that you mentioned,penny, that you don't
auto-enroll, because I wasthinking, at minimum, yes,
assess whether or not it's stillworking for you, but at minimum
you have a built-in reminder tocheck on your data, your stats,
all that kind of stuff.
You know what I mean.
So at minimum every 90 days youare re-evaluating how your
(14:28):
books are performing.
So, again, you have a muchbetter idea of when things do
ebb and flow and what is anormal.
You know amount of ebbing andflowing for your titles.
So you don't you know, if youshow up once a year and realize
like, oh my gosh, like the timethat you're checking, like this
isn't working, you know againthat that's not a really great,
(14:53):
that's just a very smallsnapshot, you know.
So getting that reminder every90 days about re-upping should
be a great like trigger to say,okay, I'm going to check my
numbers, I'm going to see howthings are going, and then you
have a better idea every 90 dayshow things are actually
happening.
And then you can make morestrategic, smarter decisions
about what's working and what'snot, versus having knee-jerk
(15:15):
reactions because of what thingsmay be showing you at the time
that you decided to pop in thereand check.
You know when it's notconsistent.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
Right, exactly, and I also think look, don't feed
into the panic.
So it's very and we see thispanic on social media.
We certainly.
You know some guy goes ontoReddit and posts like oh my gosh
, my Kindle Unlimited.
You know, page rates have justplummeted off a cliff, and then
everybody chimes in, and theneverybody starts to panic.
Before you panic well, maybebefore you panic you should be
(15:49):
tracking, because the trackingwill help you to not to not be
like oh, this is just, this isjust kind of a seasonal thing.
But the other thing that Ithink is and we talk about this
a lot, and I'm going to, amy andI are going to kind of fire
these ideas off at you and referback to some other shows,
because we don't want to take uptime in this particular show
(16:10):
with each of these individualthings, but we've covered these
in depth.
So relying solely on KindleUnlimited to sell books for you
not a good strategy.
Not tracking all the thingsalso not a good strategy.
A really good strategy, though,is to engage directly with
(16:30):
readers.
We did a whole show on this.
An algorithm shift can wipe outyour visibility overnight, and,
again, this is not to like sendpanic into the hearts of
everybody listening.
But sometimes it happens and itdoes come back Like it's not
you know, and Google does this.
So Amy and I have conversationsmany, many times about our
(16:53):
website and, like every timeGoogle changes an algorithm,
we're like, oh my God, where'sour site gonna come up?
One of the things that we havelearned through the years,
mostly of me panicking is thatif you do all of the right
things, if you continue to doall the right things, an
(17:14):
algorithm shift may impact youfor a little bit, but it's not
necessarily going to wipe outall your hard work.
Exactly Right, yep.
Exactly Right, yep.
(17:47):
As we love Amazon like we get it, it has offered a tremendous
opportunity to authors.
You really want to have thatdirect connection to readers.
So letter in the back of yourbook, all the things connecting
with finding ways to connectwith readers.
In fact, we did a show I thinkit dropped last week.
I get kind of confused with theway sometimes that our calendar
shifts, but where we actuallytalked about you know, ways to
(18:10):
directly connect, to betterdirectly connect with your
readers.
If we didn't do it last week,it was a couple weeks ago, but
it's definitely been this year.
We have five years worth ofshows, so definitely go back and
take a look at some of those.
Amy, sorry, what did I forget?
Speaker 2 (18:26):
Because I know I was just going to say it just makes
a big difference because it'salready come up a couple times
in the show, but it's worthreiterating Amazon lots of
opportunities, like you said,penny.
I think that was perfect.
Amazon presents a lot ofopportunities, but it can't,
it's not going to be what sellsyour book to somebody shopping,
(18:49):
oh for sure.
So all the things that you dofor your brand, you know, having
a reader magnet, reader magnet,high quality one we've talked
about that before too Bonuschapters, all the fun things,
quizzes, checklists, all theother things that show that you
are dedicated to the readerexperience, make a big
difference Because a lot ofreaders, especially when they're
(19:11):
new to an author they may havefound your book in KU.
They are going to check you out.
They're going to see if you'reon social.
They're going to see if youhave a website.
You know what I mean.
They're going to see if you'reon social.
They're going to see if youhave a website.
(19:33):
You know what I mean.
They're going to try to get afeel for what it is.
You're all about what you offer,what your other titles are,
things like that, and so thatcan does affect how much they
are going to enjoy reading thattitle and, yes, that may not be
fair, but we're all human, youknow what I mean and the entire
(19:53):
experience that they have withboth your brand and your title
matters.
So making sure that you arebacking up what you're putting
out there with a brand thatshows that you have them in mind
and that you are putting in theeffort and that you are being
thoughtful really does make ahuge difference.
Because having a great websiteor having a fun reader magnet or
(20:14):
having a really engaging socialmedia presence if you're
nonfiction, if you offer a lotof extra tips and
recommendations and things likethat when they start reading
your book, they already have anelevated opinion of who you are
as an author and what you canoffer them, and that is
priceless, you know.
Yeah, yeah, it can absolutelychange their experience with
(20:37):
that title based on all theother things that you put out
there for them to experiencethat are connected with you.
So really don't take that forgranted.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Yeah, yeah, that is very true, and I think and I
probably should have mentionedthis earlier and then we want to
get into just a change thatAmazon is making to Kindle
Unlimited.
But don't put your weakest bookin Kindle Unlimited.
I know this goes without saying, I get it.
(21:05):
But if your first book is likeoh you know, I was still
learning a lot, my first bookisn't strong enough, but as the
series goes on it gets muchbetter, here's the problem with
that your read-through is goingto be terrible.
So putting your first book inKindle Unlimited even if it's
not in a series it could just bethe first book you know that
(21:26):
you wrote under your brand.
Putting a first book in a seriesis a great way to bring readers
into your library or the series, the book series, whatever.
If the first book is theweakest of all of its little
siblings, that's going to reallywreck your brand.
So that's another thing toconsider too.
Is that— that's a—yes I lovethat.
(21:48):
Well, because you know, and ifyou're tracking, like if you're
tracking, if you're keepingtrack of—and we're not asking
you to do the math here but youwant to see what your
read-through rates are.
So are people you know readingthrough, like people reading
your first book that's in KindleUnlimited from start to finish,
and then you're seeing, youknow, spikes in sales to your
(22:10):
other books.
That's a great sign.
But if your book in KindleUnlimited is not helping your
other books, that's a problem.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
Right, and, penny, we .
So I'm glad you mentioned that,because now I'm going to say
something that's going to make afew people fall off their
chairs.
But it's true, if you arewriting in a genre that is
really primed for KindleUnlimited that you know has a
track record of being popular inKindle Unlimited, but you're
just not seeing things cometogether it might be worth and
(22:48):
to Penny's point about having areally stellar book for them to
engage with you with initiallyin Kindle Unlimited, if you
write a series or anything likethat, it might be worth
revisiting does that first book.
Because, again, if you've beenwriting for a while it could be
a few years since you wrote that, it could be a decade, you know
what I mean it might be worthrevisiting that book and jazzing
it up a little bit.
And we've worked with clientsthat have done that, yeah, that
have gone back through and giventheir first book some love.
(23:11):
Because, again, you are adifferent person, you evolve as
an author.
I think most authors, as theycontinue to write, also become
more engaged fans of their genretoo, penny.
So they may not have started offthat way, but those that are
really dedicated really do startto better understand how
readers respond, what they'relooking for, all those things,
and that could absolutely play arole in making some key updates
(23:34):
to that original title, to thatfirst book in a series or that
one book that you know is yourbest option to get people
engaged with you.
It might be worth consideringgoing back and seeing if there's
something you can do,especially at the beginning.
Like you said, penny, if youreally don't catch their
interest at the onset, you'regoing to lose them, right?
So maybe it's just a matter ofreworking the first part of the
(23:56):
book or something, but truly Iknow that sounds like a huge
project.
But again, if you are writingit for in a genre that is really
primed for Kindle Unlimited youhave a lot of potential
opportunity there Then it mightabsolutely be worth revisiting
if you can make any tweaks tothat book to better engage
people and get them moreinterested in what you have to
offer from the onset with just afew simple tweaks.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Yeah, I agree with that, and that's you know, and
I'll tell you something as anauthor myself, that's a really
hard conversation to have withyourself.
It's like, oh, this book failedand why did it fail, or why did
it?
You know, it doesn't have to bean outright failure, it could
just be.
It just didn't, you know, matchthe expectations of maybe other
books that you have out there.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
Asking yourself those solid, not easy questions is a
really great way to besuccessful, frankly right,
absolutely Any author that we,like you know household name has
had to have that conversation.
For sure, nobody is immune tothat.
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Yeah, we have an author who revised all of her
covers because she, you know,looked at them and she's like
you know what, these reallyaren't strong enough for this
particular genre.
You know, those conversationsare not easy to have with
yourself, like I failed thefirst time, but I think that
it's kind of like failing upright, so you figure out what
(25:19):
went wrong.
We always learn as we go.
Was my book, my first book 25years ago?
Whatever as good as a book thatI write now 10,000%?
It's not right, because welearn as we go.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
And also.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
You know things older books, things change, language
changes, topics, you know, morphand grow, and so sometimes it's
a really good idea just to takea look and see what can be.
You know what can be fixed.
Now Kindle Unlimited and thisis a change, and y'all may have
already heard about this, butKindle Unlimited is now allowing
(25:55):
you to have your books servedin libraries, so it's no longer
saying your e-book has to beexclusive just to us.
We have all rights technicallyselling rights to the book.
(26:15):
Now it's allowing you can havethe book stocked in libraries,
which is great news.
I know that's crazy cool.
You can have the book stockedin libraries, which is great
news.
I know that's crazy cool.
It's very, very cool.
I also think, though, that itis a sign of changes to come.
Kinlow Limited has and notwithout, you know, it's not
(26:35):
without merit Kinlow Limited hasfaced a lot of backlash in the
publishing industry because ofthe exclusivity that Amazon
demands for the e-book, so Ithink that this is a.
I think this is a really goodstep in the right direction.
I'd like to see more Like.
I don't think that, givenAmazon's dominance in e-books, I
just really do not see whyAmazon is not allowing you to
(27:02):
sell your e-book everywhere, andI feel like that's going to be
next.
Maybe not this year, but I feellike that's going to be next.
Amazon, if you're listening, youdominate the e-book industry.
What are you so afraid of?
I mean literally, because Ithink that would you know,
because the conversations, whenI have conversations with
authors about Kindle Unlimited,they're like well, I don't want
(27:22):
my book to be exclusive toAmazon because I want to be able
to sell my e-book everywhere,and that's fair.
And even if you, even if I tossout the numbers and the sales
that Amazon does, you know, withyour, with you know the
majority of e-books that aresold through Amazon, they're
like nope, I still want to sellmy e-book everywhere, that's
fair.
I think Amazon needs to justbow to that and be like you know
(27:45):
what?
We're still dominant, whatever,mm-hmm, you know.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
Yep, no, I think this is good.
I think we've done a few showsthis year that show promise that
Amazon is finally starting toput more effort into giving
their authors some additionalopportunities.
You know they're trying toshake things up.
It was getting stale for alittle bit, but between you know
Goodreads and this, and youknow there's a few other things
going on, I think I'm going tostay positive.
Speaker 1 (28:13):
Yeah, I agree with you.
I think that you know we'vegiven it.
We have not been very kind toAmazon always on these calls,
only because we feel likesometimes they treat authors
like these little unwantedstepchildren, which is unfair,
because, you know, 25-plus yearsago, amazon built their
(28:34):
foundation on authors becausethat's the first thing they
offered was books.
So it's time.
It's time to make some reallypositive changes and as these
changes start to evolve think inpositive, maybe even this year
or in 2026, we will be here toreport on them.
Thank you so much.
By the way, we want to mentionthat we are going to be doing
(28:57):
very, very soon.
There's going to be anopportunity to text us.
I'm really excited about this.
Amy has been developing this.
She's so smart and we areworking with the provider to
give you the opportunity to textus, either show feedback or a
(29:17):
question, and it's going to besuper easy to do and the
information will all be on theplatform.
So we're very excited aboutthat.
Hopefully, in the next fewweeks we'll have that rolled out
, but I'm really, reallythrilled about that.
The other thing that I want tosay is thank you to you those of
you who are listening.
That's about the reviews.
We are at 98 ratings andreviews.
So, so close.
(29:37):
I know know we're so close, soget us over the top of the end
of the year, guys.
We're really, really, reallyexcited.
Thank you all so much forlistening.
We appreciate you.
We appreciate your ideas andyour show feedback.
Pretty soon you're going tohave a much easier way to
deliver those to us.
Thank you so much for tuning in.
We'll see you next Friday.
(30:06):
Bye-bye.
Hello and welcome back to the Book Marketing Tips
and Author Success Podcast.
This is Penny Sanseviery andAmy Cornell, and we are very
excited to be back for anotherFriday show, and today we're
talking about Kindle Unlimited,which is always kind of I mean,
kindle Unlimited, I realize, iskind of a good news, bad news
(00:21):
thing for a lot of authors.
Some authors really love it.
Some authors really love it,some authors really hate it.
But it's definitely defined alot about how Amazon operates
and having your books in KindleUnlimited potentially can open
(00:43):
you up to you know a lot.
You know to a group of readersthat you may otherwise have had
a hard time reaching.
The challenge is and we sawthis, this is another idea that
actually came from Reddit thechallenge is is that a lot of
(01:03):
authors have been seeing and notit's this is not everybody all
at once, but incrementally adecline, a kind of limited page
read decline.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
And, amy, you spotted this on Reddit that a lot of
authors were kind of complainingabout this, right, yeah it
seems to be a pretty hot buttonissue on Reddit right now the
decline in page reads, page readdrop-offs.
A lot of authors are talkingabout it.
I will say that from what Iread and that's kind of why we
(01:40):
wanted to do the show is thatbased on the conversations I was
seeing them having?
Is that a lot of it centeredaround?
It came out of nowhere?
I've done the same thing sincethe beginning and that's kind of
like the tricky part rightthere, right Like I've been
doing the same thing since I putmy book into KU and all of a
sudden things are changing andthey wanted to know why.
(02:03):
They wanted to know who elsewas experiencing it, all these
other things, and so that's kindof what piqued my interest is
that, especially when people say, well, I've been doing the same
thing over and over again andnow things are changing, and
it's like that's pretty typicalin publishing.
Actually, you know, yeah, yeah,yeah, yeah.
We very much always talk aboutlike very little in authorship,
(02:27):
in author branding, in growingyour business as an author is
set it and forget it and we usethat phrase all the time when we
do shows across topics thatvery.
It's not very often that youjust get to be done with
something and you know for thoseof you listening that are going
, oh great, Sorry, Right, Nottrying to stress you out, but
the reality is you are appealingto real, everyday people with
(02:49):
changing interests, with thetrends in the industry change.
There's so much going on.
It's such a fun, interesting,dynamic industry, but to stay
competitive in it, you need toalso remain interesting and
dynamic, and so that's what kindof led to let's chat about this
and talk about ways to remaininteresting, dynamic and
(03:10):
competitive.
If you have your books in KU oryou're interested in putting
your books in KU, just so youcan be prepared.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Right, exactly, and this is you know.
And again, this is not a,because we've done a lot of
Amazon warning shows and I thinkwe did one just a couple weeks
ago.
But this is not an Amazonwarning show, this is a.
This is kind of what happenswith Kindle Unlimited.
This is the ebb and flow, shallwe say, of the Amazon ecosystem
(03:41):
and it does change Amazonecosystem and it does change.
So part of it is that.
So we had an author who saidthat who writes, this author
writes in a couple of differentgenres and on the one hand, one
(04:08):
side of her library just reallypicked up and her other side
kind of dropped off.
Seasonally this happens, right,so seasonally people become
like.
For example, starting in July,I had a lot of books presented
to me in the algorithm at Amazonthat were about Hallmark
Christmas books.
Apparently, amazon knows I'm atarget.
I don't know how they know.
They know that I'm a target forthese feel-good, like Hallmark,
(04:32):
holiday-ish type books.
So a lot of that happens.
The A10 algorithm, amy, I think, because we actually did a show
on the A10 algorithm.
The A10 algorithm really wipedout a lot of.
I mean, it changed.
I don't want to say that itwiped out a lot of books, but it
really did change visibilityfor a lot of authors.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
Right, yeah, and I think it's kind of I mean, I
know, when you and I have spokenabout other things, I've said
this before, but I really dothink it applies here as well
that it's kind of like, when yougo get blood work out of
nowhere, like unless you getblood work every month
religiously and you really trackeverything I'm one of those
people that's pretty convincedthat if you randomly go in to
(05:20):
get blood work, or even if it'sscheduled, whatever, but you
only do it a couple times a year, there's always a chance you're
going to see things that arepotentially a little concerning
or that you weren't expectingand all this stuff.
But it's like, but yeah, but ifwe check them regularly and
track things regularly, maybe wewould see these kind of ups and
downs and shifts and changes.
But if you're not doing thatand you show up one day and
(05:44):
start looking at some of yourstats or your back-end data,
you're going, oh my gosh, thislooks terrible.
You know, maybe it was terriblea few months ago too, but then
it picked up again.
Right, Maybe it's always beenterrible again, just setting
something up and assumingeverything's great until it gets
(06:06):
really bad and not actuallytracking that.
There are, as you said, prettynatural ebbs and flows to these
kind of things.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Yeah, yeah, exactly, and you know, some of it can be
so.
So I think, I think thetracking is always a good.
It doesn't necessarily meanthat you have to know, because
the page read math is.
I feel like the page read mathis a little convoluted and
oftentimes ridiculous.
(06:34):
It seems like it's aridiculously low and then you
total it up and you're like, ohokay, well, that makes a lot of
sense.
So, but tracking you know, justmaking a note and just tracking
is also really importantBecause as you continue through
your author career, you'll startto see trends Like oh yeah, you
know what In January I knowthat my book's really January is
(06:54):
not a great month, so maybe I'mgoing to pull back on the ads,
maybe that's not really myseason, but come February, march
, april, things start to reallypick up again, right.
February, march, april, thingsstart to really pick up again,
right.
So subscription saturation Imean, I think that there is
(07:17):
something to that.
So Amazon really does push theKindle Unlimited a lot, right.
Amazon likes that KindleUnlimited subscriber because
they get that monthly fee andthen these readers have access
to all these books.
But there is something to this,you know, a subscription
saturation where I don't noticenecessarily that there are so
(07:40):
many more people signing up forthis subscription, which then
you know by the same, you knowin the same vein, same vein
would say well then, you'regoing to get a lot more readers
to your you know, you're a lotmore people picking your book
out of Kindle Unlimited.
There is a saturation of titleproblem and I think a lot of
this not a lot, but some of itcould potentially go back to the
(08:04):
AI-generated books which youknow we talked about and we
refer to this person now asChatTPT guy who was going to
write 50 books nonfiction, forwhich he has no expertise, just
using ChatTPT, which makes mewant to tear my hair out, right,
right.
So to some extent those couldpotentially be factors.
(08:25):
There could be a saturation ofsimilar titles, so new releases
that just flooded themarketplace and all of a sudden
now you're seeing kind of a dropoff.
So there's a lot of differentthings that it could potentially
be before you go in and youpanic Like, oh my gosh, the
Kindle Unlimited be before yougo in and you panic like, oh my
(08:46):
gosh, the Kindle Unlimited.
But the other thing, amy, youand I talked about this too, the
green room is that you know,having all of your books at
Kindle Unlimited is not a reallysolid strategy either.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
No, I mean, it's like and I love this example it's
like keeping your entireretirement fund in one stock.
Yes, right, Exactly, you'rerelying on one element to do
essentially all of your salesfor you, which just blows my
mind, and so I think it'sdefinitely one of those
(09:21):
situations too.
Again, we get it.
We work with new authors allthe time, and so we fully
respect that.
There is a lot going on.
It takes a lot to write thebook, and then you have the
production and then it's outthere, and then it's time to
market it, which I realize isnot everybody's favorite, and it
(09:42):
just seems like there's alwayssomething to be doing, and so I
can totally understand theappeal of KU.
It's like, yes, please takethis screaming baby off my hands
and make it awesome, make sureeverybody reads it.
I love that idea, let's do that, but the reality is that is not
going to carry you forever, andit's certainly not going to
(10:04):
carry you by using that strategywith every single one of your
titles.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
Right, right, Exactly .
So I think that being you know,and here's the thing Kindle
Unlimited we actually did a showon Kindle Unlimited.
Kindle Unlimited, specificallyKindle Unlimited if used
correctly, can be a really greatway to introduce your readers
to your brand and or your series, right?
So putting the first book in aseries, for example, in Kindle
(10:31):
Unlimited, is a great way tointroduce readers to the
storyline, right To you as anauthor.
Fabulous, okay.
But I also think that it's amatter of knowing.
So Kindle Unlimited and youalluded to this in what you were
saying is Kindle Unlimited iskind of a.
It feels like it's an easy wayto get a bunch of readers.
(10:52):
Like I'm just going to put mybook in Kindle Unlimited and let
Amazon kind of figure it out,right, Right, Amazon's not going
to figure it out, Like, that'snot.
Amazon is not there to help yousell your book, they're just
there to offer you a platformthat will hopefully sell your
book, right?
So I think also knowing whetheror not your book is Kindle
(11:14):
Unlimited material is reallysmart.
And here's a tip too.
So my books are in KindleUnlimited, and that is not the
norm necessarily for nonfiction,but I have my books in Kindle
Unlimited because the readers,because of the demographic of
the reader, right so, but Idon't have them.
(11:37):
I don't have it automaticallyrenewed, so every 90 days I have
to go back in there and decideif I want to have the book in
Kindle Unlimited.
So that's.
The other thing, though, too, isthat you could dip your book in
and out of Kindle Unlimited.
Here is something that I getpushback from authors on all the
time when Amazon says that yourbook has to be exclusive with
(12:01):
Amazon in order to be in KindleUnlimited, that guidance does
not follow your print book, soyour print book can be
everywhere.
Your e-book, if you are inKindle Unlimited, should only be
on Amazon, although Amazon'smaking changes and we're going
to cover that in a minute Um,and Amazon does sell the lion's
(12:25):
share of e-books.
I want to say, depending ongenre, Amazon sells between 90
and 95 percent of all e-booksout there.
So, having it exclusive or not,Amazon's going to be your best
source, right?
But I mean, Amy, there wasanother idea too.
(12:48):
You know.
So, instead of putting yourentire backlist in Kindle
Unlimited, going wide Now.
Going wide, if you're notfamiliar with that term, means
having your book on all of theplatforms, which absolutely, you
can definitely do that and thenhaving one book in Kindle
(13:13):
Unlimited, exclusively Amazon.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Right, yeah, I mean, I think that that's just it, and
it's another one of thosethings that we wish we could
tell you that this is exactlyhow to do it and it works for
everybody every time.
Unfortunately, that's not thecase.
That's not how this works.
That's really not how thosethings that we wish we could
tell you that this is exactlyhow to do it and it works for
everybody every time.
Unfortunately, that's not thecase.
That's not how this works.
That's really not how anythingworks, right, honestly.
But that is another way toapproach this to where you are,
(13:38):
hopefully by going wide,generating a lot of additional
exposure.
Like you, are literally tappinginto every potential
opportunity to find readers ondifferent platforms, even if the
percentage of readers that usethat platform is smaller.
You know we're big on qualityover quantity, so maybe that'll
work for you, you know.
So be selective about what youdo with each book and not just
(14:01):
fall into a trap of.
This is how I do things andeverything has to be the same,
and I loved that you mentioned,penny, that you don't
auto-enroll, because I wasthinking, at minimum, yes,
assess whether or not it's stillworking for you, but at minimum
you have a built-in reminder tocheck on your data, your stats,
all that kind of stuff.
You know what I mean.
So at minimum every 90 days youare re-evaluating how your
(14:28):
books are performing.
So, again, you have a muchbetter idea of when things do
ebb and flow and what is anormal.
You know amount of ebbing andflowing for your titles.
So you don't you know, if youshow up once a year and realize
like, oh my gosh, like the timethat you're checking, like this
isn't working, you know againthat that's not a really great,
(14:53):
that's just a very smallsnapshot, you know.
So getting that reminder every90 days about re-upping should
be a great like trigger to say,okay, I'm going to check my
numbers, I'm going to see howthings are going, and then you
have a better idea every 90 dayshow things are actually
happening.
And then you can make morestrategic, smarter decisions
about what's working and what'snot, versus having knee-jerk
(15:15):
reactions because of what thingsmay be showing you at the time
that you decided to pop in thereand check.
You know when it's notconsistent.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
Right, exactly, and I also think look, don't feed
into the panic.
So it's very and we see thispanic on social media.
We certainly.
You know some guy goes ontoReddit and posts like oh my gosh
, my Kindle Unlimited.
You know, page rates have justplummeted off a cliff, and then
everybody chimes in, and theneverybody starts to panic.
Before you panic well, maybebefore you panic you should be
(15:49):
tracking, because the trackingwill help you to not to not be
like oh, this is just, this isjust kind of a seasonal thing.
But the other thing that Ithink is and we talk about this
a lot, and I'm going to, amy andI are going to kind of fire
these ideas off at you and referback to some other shows,
because we don't want to take uptime in this particular show
(16:10):
with each of these individualthings, but we've covered these
in depth.
So relying solely on KindleUnlimited to sell books for you
not a good strategy.
Not tracking all the thingsalso not a good strategy.
A really good strategy, though,is to engage directly with
(16:30):
readers.
We did a whole show on this.
An algorithm shift can wipe outyour visibility overnight, and,
again, this is not to like sendpanic into the hearts of
everybody listening.
But sometimes it happens and itdoes come back Like it's not
you know, and Google does this.
So Amy and I have conversationsmany, many times about our
(16:53):
website and, like every timeGoogle changes an algorithm,
we're like, oh my God, where'sour site gonna come up?
One of the things that we havelearned through the years,
mostly of me panicking is thatif you do all of the right
things, if you continue to doall the right things, an
(17:14):
algorithm shift may impact youfor a little bit, but it's not
necessarily going to wipe outall your hard work.
Exactly Right, yep.
Exactly Right, yep.
(17:47):
As we love Amazon like we get it, it has offered a tremendous
opportunity to authors.
You really want to have thatdirect connection to readers.
So letter in the back of yourbook, all the things connecting
with finding ways to connectwith readers.
In fact, we did a show I thinkit dropped last week.
I get kind of confused with theway sometimes that our calendar
shifts, but where we actuallytalked about you know, ways to
(18:10):
directly connect, to betterdirectly connect with your
readers.
If we didn't do it last week,it was a couple weeks ago, but
it's definitely been this year.
We have five years worth ofshows, so definitely go back and
take a look at some of those.
Amy, sorry, what did I forget?
Speaker 2 (18:26):
Because I know I was just going to say it just makes
a big difference because it'salready come up a couple times
in the show, but it's worthreiterating Amazon lots of
opportunities, like you said,penny.
I think that was perfect.
Amazon presents a lot ofopportunities, but it can't,
it's not going to be what sellsyour book to somebody shopping,
(18:49):
oh for sure.
So all the things that you dofor your brand, you know, having
a reader magnet, reader magnet,high quality one we've talked
about that before too Bonuschapters, all the fun things,
quizzes, checklists, all theother things that show that you
are dedicated to the readerexperience, make a big
difference Because a lot ofreaders, especially when they're
(19:11):
new to an author they may havefound your book in KU.
They are going to check you out.
They're going to see if you'reon social.
They're going to see if youhave a website.
You know what I mean.
They're going to see if you'reon social.
They're going to see if youhave a website.
(19:33):
You know what I mean.
They're going to try to get afeel for what it is.
You're all about what you offer,what your other titles are,
things like that, and so thatcan does affect how much they
are going to enjoy reading thattitle and, yes, that may not be
fair, but we're all human, youknow what I mean and the entire
(19:53):
experience that they have withboth your brand and your title
matters.
So making sure that you arebacking up what you're putting
out there with a brand thatshows that you have them in mind
and that you are putting in theeffort and that you are being
thoughtful really does make ahuge difference.
Because having a great websiteor having a fun reader magnet or
(20:14):
having a really engaging socialmedia presence if you're
nonfiction, if you offer a lotof extra tips and
recommendations and things likethat when they start reading
your book, they already have anelevated opinion of who you are
as an author and what you canoffer them, and that is
priceless, you know.
Yeah, yeah, it can absolutelychange their experience with
(20:37):
that title based on all theother things that you put out
there for them to experiencethat are connected with you.
So really don't take that forgranted.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Yeah, yeah, that is very true, and I think and I
probably should have mentionedthis earlier and then we want to
get into just a change thatAmazon is making to Kindle
Unlimited.
But don't put your weakest bookin Kindle Unlimited.
I know this goes without saying, I get it.
(21:05):
But if your first book is likeoh you know, I was still
learning a lot, my first bookisn't strong enough, but as the
series goes on it gets muchbetter, here's the problem with
that your read-through is goingto be terrible.
So putting your first book inKindle Unlimited even if it's
not in a series it could just bethe first book you know that
(21:26):
you wrote under your brand.
Putting a first book in a seriesis a great way to bring readers
into your library or the series, the book series, whatever.
If the first book is theweakest of all of its little
siblings, that's going to reallywreck your brand.
So that's another thing toconsider too.
Is that— that's a—yes I lovethat.
(21:48):
Well, because you know, and ifyou're tracking, like if you're
tracking, if you're keepingtrack of—and we're not asking
you to do the math here but youwant to see what your
read-through rates are.
So are people you know readingthrough, like people reading
your first book that's in KindleUnlimited from start to finish,
and then you're seeing, youknow, spikes in sales to your
(22:10):
other books.
That's a great sign.
But if your book in KindleUnlimited is not helping your
other books, that's a problem.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
Right, and, penny, we .
So I'm glad you mentioned that,because now I'm going to say
something that's going to make afew people fall off their
chairs.
But it's true, if you arewriting in a genre that is
really primed for KindleUnlimited that you know has a
track record of being popular inKindle Unlimited, but you're
just not seeing things cometogether it might be worth and
(22:48):
to Penny's point about having areally stellar book for them to
engage with you with initiallyin Kindle Unlimited, if you
write a series or anything likethat, it might be worth
revisiting does that first book.
Because, again, if you've beenwriting for a while it could be
a few years since you wrote that, it could be a decade, you know
what I mean it might be worthrevisiting that book and jazzing
it up a little bit.
And we've worked with clientsthat have done that, yeah, that
have gone back through and giventheir first book some love.
(23:11):
Because, again, you are adifferent person, you evolve as
an author.
I think most authors, as theycontinue to write, also become
more engaged fans of their genretoo, penny.
So they may not have started offthat way, but those that are
really dedicated really do startto better understand how
readers respond, what they'relooking for, all those things,
and that could absolutely play arole in making some key updates
(23:34):
to that original title, to thatfirst book in a series or that
one book that you know is yourbest option to get people
engaged with you.
It might be worth consideringgoing back and seeing if there's
something you can do,especially at the beginning.
Like you said, penny, if youreally don't catch their
interest at the onset, you'regoing to lose them, right?
So maybe it's just a matter ofreworking the first part of the
(23:56):
book or something, but truly Iknow that sounds like a huge
project.
But again, if you are writingit for in a genre that is really
primed for Kindle Unlimited youhave a lot of potential
opportunity there Then it mightabsolutely be worth revisiting
if you can make any tweaks tothat book to better engage
people and get them moreinterested in what you have to
offer from the onset with just afew simple tweaks.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Yeah, I agree with that, and that's you know, and
I'll tell you something as anauthor myself, that's a really
hard conversation to have withyourself.
It's like, oh, this book failedand why did it fail, or why did
it?
You know, it doesn't have to bean outright failure, it could
just be.
It just didn't, you know, matchthe expectations of maybe other
books that you have out there.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
Asking yourself those solid, not easy questions is a
really great way to besuccessful, frankly right,
absolutely Any author that we,like you know household name has
had to have that conversation.
For sure, nobody is immune tothat.
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Yeah, we have an author who revised all of her
covers because she, you know,looked at them and she's like
you know what, these reallyaren't strong enough for this
particular genre.
You know, those conversationsare not easy to have with
yourself, like I failed thefirst time, but I think that
it's kind of like failing upright, so you figure out what
(25:19):
went wrong.
We always learn as we go.
Was my book, my first book 25years ago?
Whatever as good as a book thatI write now 10,000%?
It's not right, because welearn as we go.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
And also.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
You know things older books, things change, language
changes, topics, you know, morphand grow, and so sometimes it's
a really good idea just to takea look and see what can be.
You know what can be fixed.
Now Kindle Unlimited and thisis a change, and y'all may have
already heard about this, butKindle Unlimited is now allowing
(25:55):
you to have your books servedin libraries, so it's no longer
saying your e-book has to beexclusive just to us.
We have all rights technicallyselling rights to the book.
(26:15):
Now it's allowing you can havethe book stocked in libraries,
which is great news.
I know that's crazy cool.
You can have the book stockedin libraries, which is great
news.
I know that's crazy cool.
It's very, very cool.
I also think, though, that itis a sign of changes to come.
Kinlow Limited has and notwithout, you know, it's not
(26:35):
without merit Kinlow Limited hasfaced a lot of backlash in the
publishing industry because ofthe exclusivity that Amazon
demands for the e-book, so Ithink that this is a.
I think this is a really goodstep in the right direction.
I'd like to see more Like.
I don't think that, givenAmazon's dominance in e-books, I
just really do not see whyAmazon is not allowing you to
(27:02):
sell your e-book everywhere, andI feel like that's going to be
next.
Maybe not this year, but I feellike that's going to be next.
Amazon, if you're listening, youdominate the e-book industry.
What are you so afraid of?
I mean literally, because Ithink that would you know,
because the conversations, whenI have conversations with
authors about Kindle Unlimited,they're like well, I don't want
(27:22):
my book to be exclusive toAmazon because I want to be able
to sell my e-book everywhere,and that's fair.
And even if you, even if I tossout the numbers and the sales
that Amazon does, you know, withyour, with you know the
majority of e-books that aresold through Amazon, they're
like nope, I still want to sellmy e-book everywhere, that's
fair.
I think Amazon needs to justbow to that and be like you know
(27:45):
what?
We're still dominant, whatever,mm-hmm, you know.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
Yep, no, I think this is good.
I think we've done a few showsthis year that show promise that
Amazon is finally starting toput more effort into giving
their authors some additionalopportunities.
You know they're trying toshake things up.
It was getting stale for alittle bit, but between you know
Goodreads and this, and youknow there's a few other things
going on, I think I'm going tostay positive.
Speaker 1 (28:13):
Yeah, I agree with you.
I think that you know we'vegiven it.
We have not been very kind toAmazon always on these calls,
only because we feel likesometimes they treat authors
like these little unwantedstepchildren, which is unfair,
because, you know, 25-plus yearsago, amazon built their
(28:34):
foundation on authors becausethat's the first thing they
offered was books.
So it's time.
It's time to make some reallypositive changes and as these
changes start to evolve think inpositive, maybe even this year
or in 2026, we will be here toreport on them.
Thank you so much.
By the way, we want to mentionthat we are going to be doing
(28:57):
very, very soon.
There's going to be anopportunity to text us.
I'm really excited about this.
Amy has been developing this.
She's so smart and we areworking with the provider to
give you the opportunity to textus, either show feedback or a
(29:17):
question, and it's going to besuper easy to do and the
information will all be on theplatform.
So we're very excited aboutthat.
Hopefully, in the next fewweeks we'll have that rolled out
, but I'm really, reallythrilled about that.
The other thing that I want tosay is thank you to you those of
you who are listening.
That's about the reviews.
We are at 98 ratings andreviews.
So, so close.
(29:37):
I know know we're so close, soget us over the top of the end
of the year, guys.
We're really, really, reallyexcited.
Thank you all so much forlistening.
We appreciate you.
We appreciate your ideas andyour show feedback.
Pretty soon you're going tohave a much easier way to
deliver those to us.
Thank you so much for tuning in.
We'll see you next Friday.
(30:06):
Bye-bye.
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