August 30, 2024 • 43 mins
In the 50th episode of the Boss Responses podcast, host Treasa Edmond celebrates the journey of starting the podcast and shares an insightful discussion with special guest, Jessica Walrack—founder of All Things Freelance Writing and a seasoned freelance finance journalist. They go deep into the importance of niching down in freelance writing and transitioning from outbound to inbound marketing.
Jessica shares her experience of navigating the freelance industry, honing her niche, and building a successful inbound client strategy. The episode also covers the impact of consistent marketing, building trust with clients, and breaking the feast and famine cycle.
If you are looking to grow and optimize your business, you'll want to join Treasa and Jessica for an episode full of practical insights.
About Our Guest
Jessica Walrack is the founder of All Things Freelance Writing—a community that helps freelance writers build their ideal businesses through its blog, weekly jobs newsletter, and other resources. She’s also a freelance finance journalist with 11 years of professional writing experience. You can find her work regularly featured in national publications including US News and World, CBS News MoneyWatch, Newsweek, and Wallstreet Journal BuySide.
Links You Might Want
Sign up for the free All Things Freelance Writing weekly jobs newsletter
Connect with Jessica on LinkedIn
Thank you for taking time out of your busy day to listen to Boss Responses. This podcast is a passion project that comes from years of helping freelancers shape a business that supports the lifestyle they want.
Have a question you'd like answered? Send it to info@bossresponses.com
If you'd like to support the podcast, click that link above. Those lattes help keep us going and are much appreciated!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Treasa Edmond (00:00):
Welcome back to the Boss Responses podcast.
As I was editing today'sepisode, I celebrated for a
couple of reasons.
The first is this is the 50thepisode of the Boss Responses
podcast.
It took me a while to even getstarted on this podcast Imposter
syndrome was smacking me upbeside the head hard but I've
(00:22):
enjoyed every single second ofrecording the podcast, of
talking to my guests, and I havesome really great episodes
already recorded that you'll belistening to in the next few
weeks.
I'm always looking for greatguests, so if you know someone
who should be on the BossResponses podcast, let me know.
Tag me on LinkedIn, send me aDM.
(00:43):
I really want to make sure thatI'm bringing the people onto
the podcast who can help yougrow your business.
Also, questions we always needmore questions to feature on the
podcast.
Second, every other sentence inthis entire episode was a
nugget of amazing information.
(01:05):
Our special guest this week isJessica Walrack.
Jessica is the founder of AllThings Freelance Writing, a
community that helps freelancewriters build their ideal
businesses through its blog,weekly jobs newsletter and other
resources.
She's also a freelance financejournalist with 11 years of
(01:25):
professional writing experience.
You can find her work regularlyfeatured in national
publications, including US Newsand World, CBS News Money Watch,
Newsweek and Wall JournalBuySide.
I've really enjoyed havingJessica on the podcast this week
and, as I mentioned close tothe end of this episode, I hope
(01:46):
we can bring her back in thefuture to talk about some of the
sales side of the business.
Today we're going to talk abouttwo topics that are vital to
freelance business owners.
The first is niching down.
Should you do it?
How should you do it?
What does that actually looklike?
There's a lot of informationout there and it's contradictory
(02:08):
.
Jessica gives some great advicethat I think you're really
going to enjoy hearing.
Our other topic is going froman outbound marketing business
to inbound clients how thatchanges your business, what that
looks like and how you can makeit happen your business, what
that looks like and how you canmake it happen.
(02:28):
Jessica is very transparent andshe shares that.
The process didn't happen forher overnight.
She worked really hard forseveral years before everything
started clicking for her.
Today she's sharing what shedid, so that maybe you can skip
a few of those steps.
It's a longer episode today, solet's not waste any more time,
because I know you're going towant to hear what Jessica has to
say.
(02:50):
If you're a freelancer, businessowner or anyone who deals with
clients, you're in the rightplace.
I'm your host, teresa Edmond.
I've been dealing with clientsand running my business for
nearly two decades and in thattime I've dealt with my share of
doubt, imposter syndrome andnot knowing what to say when a
client asked a question I wasn'tready for.
(03:10):
I created this podcast toempower you with the boss
responses you need to grow yourbusiness.
Each week, my guest co-host andI will bring you five episodes
packed with practical insights.
Monday through Thursday, weanswer your questions, and
Fridays we dive deep to explorehow our co-hosts embrace their
(03:30):
role as the boss of theirbusiness.
Welcome to Boss Responses,jessica.
Thank you so much for beinghere with us this week.
Jessica Walrack (03:42):
Yeah, it's a pleasure.
Thanks for inviting me.
Treasa Edmond (03:45):
It's been fun.
We've had a lot of this week.
Yeah, it's a pleasure.
Thanks for inviting me.
It's been fun.
We've had a lot of deepconversations.
Yeah, definitely All right.
So today we're learning moreabout you and we're actually
diving pretty deep into twodifferent topics, and we'll get
into those.
But first tell me a little bitabout you and what you do.
Jessica Walrack (03:59):
Okay, yeah, I'm a freelance finance writer and
journalist.
I specialize in covering theeconomy, banking products, loans
, budgeting, insurance, thingslike that for fintech companies,
media companies, news sites,and yeah, I've been doing that
(04:23):
for about four years and then Iwas a generalist for about seven
years before that.
And then how many years beforethat were you a generalist?
Seven, so a total of 11.
Treasa Edmond (04:31):
11 years.
That's a good long time to berunning your own business.
What did you do before youstarted as a freelancer?
Jessica Walrack (04:39):
I was in sales, so I did sales to consumers for
about five years and then B2Bsales for about two to three
years.
Treasa Edmond (04:51):
So that's a big difference.
Jessica Walrack (04:53):
Yeah, there's overlap.
I found that a lot of thethings that I learned because
they would send us to thesesales trainings and I would have
to do a lot of outbound andthings like that.
So a lot of that I found camein handy as I was crafting sales
content and putting calls toactions.
But instead of doing it inperson with another human being,
(05:15):
I'm doing it through writing.
But it helped a lot in kind ofthe client acquisition and
getting things going.
Treasa Edmond (05:22):
So that's a big perspective shift.
I know as a content strategistworking with big B2B companies,
one of the biggest kind ofbreaks I see in the content
system is the content teamscreating content that supports
the sales team and then thesales team actually utilizing
that in some way.
(05:43):
So you have had a completelydifferent perspective shift to
where now you're creating thecontent and how does that make
you see things differently fromwhere you came from?
Jessica Walrack (05:53):
I feel like, especially over the past few
years, as everything's shiftedmore online, it's kind of all
melded together.
I feel like marketing used tobe one silo and sales was
another, and now it's more ofall melded together.
I feel like marketing used tobe one silo and sales was
another, and now it's moreintertwined.
Like content as people refer toit versus the copy is often
educational.
You're raising awareness,you're bringing people into the
(06:16):
buying cycle and nurturing themthrough, and then the copy is
more of what sales was, whereyou're trying to make that hard
sale, maybe on a landing page orsomething like that or an ad in
the moment.
So I've really been able totake that experience and put it
all together, although I am moredrawn towards the educational
(06:38):
side.
So I've always really enjoyedkind of teaching I've done it in
every role I've ever had and solong form kind of content I've
leaned towards that more.
Treasa Edmond (06:49):
That's where I lean as well, but I am seeing
that breakdown in the silos andhow everything is coming more
together, and I agree with youon that.
I understand you believe in theimportance of niching down.
Can you share your journey todiscovering your niche and why
you think it's so important?
Jessica Walrack (07:05):
Yeah, like I said, I was a generalist for
seven years.
I stumbled upon freelancewriting.
I never had really heard aboutit before and my husband and I
were actually trying to start adifferent kind of business and
to get it going we had to hire awebsite copywriter and someone
to write our blogs.
And so we went through Elance,I think, at the time, and that
(07:29):
business was getting started,but it was just slow and so I
was like, in the downtime, I'mgoing to go on Elance myself and
see what I can find.
So I think I applied for 40positions before I got a chance.
But landed my first gig andmade money online for the first
time and that little light bulb.
I'm like, oh my gosh, okay,this can work.
(07:49):
And yeah, I just navigated it,kept applying, trying all sorts
of different things and slowlylearning more about what this
industry is, what the businessis, over time.
But I reached a point where Iwas just ready to take it to the
next level and I was reallystruggling to take it to the
next level and I was reallystruggling with issues like I
wasn't really getting inbounds.
(08:09):
I was putting a lot of timeinto marketing all the time.
I wasn't really happy with myclients, like they were scope
creeping, they were not payingme on time, but I didn't have
the other clients or the abilityto get them to write my other
clients off.
So it was just reallyfrustrating and I'm like, okay,
I'm at the point where I need todo something else or I need to
(08:30):
make this work, basically.
And so that's when I decided toniche down and I tried a few
different things.
I started by getting onLinkedIn, building a brand, and
that started to get sometraction, and so I thought maybe
I'll get more into the brandingside and I'll do branding
(08:52):
guides and mission and visionstatements and all the stuff to
get people set up.
I had done that for someclients in the past, but it
didn't really take off.
I got a few clients, but it wasso much work and there's so
much back and forth and so muchresearch and I was just like
spending way more time than evenbefore and making less money.
So I was like, okay, this isn'treally a good fit.
(09:13):
So I went back to the drawingboard.
I looked through all my work.
I'm like what do I like?
What's in high demand andwhat's paying?
Well, I need to do some findsomething that ticks those three
boxes, and I just realized it'sthe finance blogs.
I really enjoy these.
I hardly ever need revisions.
My clients need a lot of them.
(09:33):
They pay some of the best ofany of my projects.
Why don't I give this a go, whynot?
I already have one or twoclients in the space.
So, yeah, I updated everything,my LinkedIn, my website, went
all in on it, kept posting onLinkedIn and the leads just
really started coming in fromall these high, big brand name
(09:54):
companies, and I'm like, oh mygosh, I have been getting on
calls, struggling, sellingmyself so hard, and now this
business is just coming to me.
This is like the magic formula.
Amazing, it was the mostexciting thing ever, and so at
that point, I really understoodthe power of niching and having
a very specific offer.
And so, yeah, I've been on thattruck ever since.
Treasa Edmond (10:19):
So let's talk about impact.
How did narrowing your focusreally change your business,
both initially, obviously, youhad a lot more leads coming in
and then, in the long term, whatchanges did you see that you
had to make?
Because your client portfolio,I'm sure, just completely
changed?
Jessica Walrack (10:36):
Yeah, and it was a gradual process.
Last year was the first yearthat I was 100%.
All I wrote was financearticles, so I was still doing
other stuff, but on themarketing front, that's all I
was doing.
I still had some other clients,so it was really just a process
of removing all the bottlenecksthat I was running into.
(10:57):
So I'm getting better at thefinance writing, I'm realizing
what obstacles I run into inthis area, and so I was able to,
now that I had the lead gensorted, I could focus on the
next problem, which wasoptimizing my workflow so that I
can get through my work in thetime that I want to get through
(11:18):
it, so that I can get rid ofthese problems that are really
annoying and taking too muchtime, so I can fine-tune the
clients that I want.
All of those things became thenext focus, and so everything I
would say from that point it wasjust really fine tuning it and,
yeah, getting rid of thoseissues.
Treasa Edmond (11:38):
And I like that you solve the problems one at a
time, because I think a lot ofpeople get overwhelmed.
They're like, okay, these areall the things I don't like,
that I want to change, and thenthey have this massive list and
you just solve the big problemsand then the little problems
went away with them, which Ithink is really cool.
So, looking at your businessnow and then looking back at it
when you very first startedspecializing, like four years
(12:00):
ago, what are some of thedifferences that you see?
Jessica Walrack (12:06):
Maybe even how you feel about it.
Yeah, I love it.
I love my business, and at thattime I was just surviving and I
was unhappy.
I was ready to throw in thetowel.
So it's just night and day.
I've gotten time back.
I was able to start a secondbusiness.
I've been able to create thiswhole online community and give
back to other freelance writerswho might be struggling with
(12:29):
things that I struggled with,and I have time to do the
newsletter.
Just other passions I have timeto refinish furniture, which is
like a hobby that I never evenknew I liked, and take pottery
classes, and it just feelsactually getting your life back,
having space and time to, moretime to spend with family, more
resources, be able to do thethings that you want All those
(12:50):
things.
I just think it's priceless.
I'm really thankful that Idiscovered that change and that
it worked and that I've justbeen able to stay on that path
and then grow in other ways too,where before my business was
all consuming, it was taking allof my time to try to make it
work Right.
Treasa Edmond (13:07):
So let's move back to those years when you
were kind of a generalist.
I know a lot of people whoprefer to stay generalist, or
they want to work with a varietyof clients or they want to do
all of that.
Absolutely nothing wrong withthat.
But there is power in narrowingyour focus and working with a
specific group of clients.
One it does help you up level.
(13:28):
Because you up level yourskills, you make your business
tighter and then you do haveroom, and I think a lot of it is
creating space in your life,which is what we want our
businesses to do right.
We don't want them to consumeus.
For those people who aregeneralists, or for people who
are generalists and are ready tomake that switch, who want to
(13:48):
uplevel their skills in theirbusiness, what advice would you
give them?
Jessica Walrack (13:52):
I would say and we've kind of talked about this
before it doesn't necessarilyhave to be an industry niche.
It can be a niche in the typeof writing that you do, such as
blogs or email or ghostwriting,or any aspect of your business
that is more specific can be aniche.
So it can be any kind ofspecialist area that you do and
(14:15):
like ghostwriting Maybe youwrite emails, maybe you write
blogs.
It doesn't necessarily have tobe like finance or health or an
industry, and also it doesn'thave to be the only thing you're
doing.
It's a marketing positioningstrategy.
It's how you're presentingyourself in the market to
attract people to you.
That doesn't mean that's allyou're doing on the back end.
(14:37):
So I did a variety of thingsfor the first few years.
I just on LinkedIn, that's howI presented it and that's what I
was hoping to attract and itworked.
But that doesn't necessarilyhave to be exclusive and you can
start and try things and testit out for four to six weeks,
see how it goes and if itdoesn't, that's okay.
(14:58):
Switch to the next thing.
Like people don't remember,people don't care what you did
six months ago.
What's going to matter is theconsistent messaging that you're
sending now and what you stickwith.
So, yes, it does definitelybuild momentum if you are doing
the same thing for a long time.
Now that I've been doing it fortwo years, three years, I have
a lot more people who will saythey see a finance position come
(15:20):
up and they message me.
Hey, jess, I think this wouldbe perfect for you.
That didn't happen as much inthe first year.
So once you find your thing, itdefinitely helps to be
consistent, but I don't thinkyou have to feel so much
pressure that you're locked intothis thing forever.
You can try it out, see if it'sa good fit, and if it's not,
you can move on to somethingelse.
Marketing is really a bigexperiment.
Treasa Edmond (15:44):
Yeah, I like that you brought that up.
This doesn't have to be anentire pivot of your business
just to choose one area to focuson.
It's actually just a marketingfocus and then you see if the
marketing works and if itdoesn't, you try a different
marketing focus.
So you don't actually have tomake any back-end business
changes into what you're doingand what you're not doing until
you see whether or not themarketing works, and I think
(16:06):
that's a really good point.
So you don't have to stop doingall of the work for the other
clients.
I wouldn't recommend it.
I've seen it happen and I'vealso seen people who have been
hit by this downturn in themarket and they're like, ok,
while this is going on, I'mgoing to go ahead and pivot and
niche down and do my thing.
That's fine, but you shouldprobably still be trying to find
(16:28):
work in what you're alreadydoing while you're doing that.
It's just the freedom to trynew things.
That's the point.
Jessica Walrack (16:34):
Yeah, and I'm not saying that this is the only
way this worked for me.
This will work for everybody.
That's definitely not the case.
I know generalists who arehighly successful and they've
been that way for decades, sodifferent ways can work.
I'm just saying this is one way, and this worked for me.
Treasa Edmond (16:54):
And you have to look at why they're successful.
You can't just say, well,they're successful because
they're a generalist, or they'resuccessful because they're just
a finance writer.
You can't do that.
There are other factors that wedon't see, that are happening,
that are creating that successfor them.
Sometimes it's relationships,sometimes it's their marketing,
sometimes it's just who theyknow.
So all of that stuff comes intoplay.
(17:16):
So you cannot gauge yoursuccess in the same area based
on what you're seeing onlinefrom other people.
It's just not possible.
So give yourself grace.
What about misconceptions?
Because I'm telling you thatuntil recently, I had a lot of
misconceptions about nichingdown.
So are there any that you wouldlike to debunk particularly?
Jessica Walrack (17:37):
Yeah, I think that I see a lot of coaching
materials, I guess, like coursesand things like that, that say
you have to niche down right outof the gate If you want to
start a freelance writingbusiness.
You pick a high profitableniche and then you go to market.
Yeah, and I don't necessarilythink that's the best thing to
(17:58):
do all the time, right?
Especially if you have nosamples, no experience, no
testimonials, nothing.
It's going to be difficultbecause the people who are
looking to hire experts theywant to see proof, and that's
what you're saying.
If you're niched down, is thatyou're an expert in this thing?
Right, maybe if you're comingfrom a background of like I know
(18:20):
a lot of nurses who recentlytransitioned out of working in
hospitals into freelance writingand so they're going into the
health.
Ok, that's a little bitdifferent.
Maybe you're new to writing butyou have this subject matter
expertise in the area.
I can get that.
But if you're not reallywanting to transition from what
you were doing before and usethat, then it can make sense
(18:42):
just to come in and get yourfeet wet and try different
things and see what you like andexperiment, see where that
demand is what pays the best,where there's high demand and
base the niching decision onactual, real data and evidence
rather than just a guess orsomething you read online.
Treasa Edmond (19:00):
Yeah, I think we should all applaud that
statement.
Base your business decisions ondata and evidence.
People Do that.
I love that.
That's so true.
So when we were talking aboutdoing the podcast, you mentioned
that you'd gone from 100%outbound which a lot of us do
when we start to 90% inbound onyour client intake.
(19:20):
I'm a big believer of gettingto the point where clients come
to you or clients are referredto you.
I think that is the mark of asuccessful business or one of
the benchmarks.
So there are a lot ofbenchmarks, but I think that's
one of them.
Can you walk us through yourprocess of making that shift
from 100% outbound to the 90%inbound?
Jessica Walrack (19:39):
Yeah, like I said, I have a sales background.
I was doing a lot of coldcalling in my B2B position and
so I carried that over into thisand I started on work platforms
and I would just apply, apply,apply.
So these are already people inthe final stage of the buying
cycle.
They know that they need afreelance writer, they know
(19:59):
exactly what they need, theyhave a budget, all these things.
So it's not exactly a coldpitch.
I'm just competing against allthe other people who are trying
to get this position.
So I did that.
I would spend about an hourevery single day, sending at
least 20 applications everysingle day to try to build a
regular influence, my businessand my business flow.
So it's a lot of work and I seea lot of writers struggle with
(20:36):
this.
They're like I sent fivepitches and I haven't heard
anything back.
I don't know what to do.
I don't know what I'm doingwrong.
Oftentimes it's just a volumeissue in the beginning, because
you're new, if you don't havethat much experience, you don't
have that much proof.
You don't have that much proof,you don't have trust,
connections, all these thingsthat make outbound easier, and
so your conversion rates aregoing to be probably around
(20:58):
three to five percent, whichmeans you need to be sending a
ton of outbound to to getresults.
So that's where I started.
It was a hustle, it was a grindfor a few years really to get
the thing going and I alsodidn't really have that much
confidence in myself and myskills and my abilities because
(21:19):
I was new and I was learning andI really didn't know what I was
doing that much.
I was kind of learning as I goand so over time, as I got more
experience and worked with allthese different types of clients
, as I got more experience andworked with all these different
types of clients, I started tobelieve more in myself and what
I delivered and the value that Idelivered to these companies.
(21:40):
And it just really helps to havepositive interactions with
clients who really appreciateyour work.
And then you say okay and Iworked with a few editors
throughout my journey too thatyou get back this document and
it's just redlined like crazyand it's so frustrating to see
that.
But those were some of mybiggest learning opportunities
(22:00):
to figure out exactly how toimprove.
So now, looking back, it's likethose were pivotal turning
points where, after I workedwith a real high caliber editor.
I could get better clientsafter that and better.
Long story short, it was justreally gaining experience,
gaining confidence, buildingrelationships, building trust
with people, and then nichingdown and building my presence
(22:24):
and aligning everything.
So all of this stuff built oneach other to the point where
then I had an online presence.
I didn't really have an onlinepresence for a long time, like
six years.
Treasa Edmond (22:34):
I was just hustling like writing, writing,
writing because you don't needit if you're in the job boards.
Jessica Walrack (22:39):
Yeah, I had my profile which had all my reviews
on it, and then once because Iwas on Elance, and then it got
bought out by Upwork and shutdown.
So that was like I lost mysource, because there was kind
of a drop-off between the two.
And so at that point I went onto LinkedIn and started
connecting with people in like2016.
But nobody was posting.
(23:00):
It was just you're connecting.
People were like messaging onthere, using it like a resume
site, but yeah, so I reallystarted seeing the switch when I
niched down, aligned my wholeprofile, put all my testimonials
together in my niche andstarted posting on LinkedIn and
Instagram and then doing SEO formy website and so creating that
(23:22):
constant presence to raiseawareness about what I did,
started to bring in optimizingmy profile for my niche, started
to bring in the inbound and,yeah, and now it's been about
three years and it's just itkeeps going and keeps on
building.
So I do still like to keep aneye out all the time.
I do the job board, so I'mseeing jobs every single week,
(23:47):
people hiring, so when I seesomething good, I'll send a
little message.
Or if I see a publication thatis like a dream publication, I
want to be, in, I'll DM theeditor and I'll just be like,
hey, I'm a freelance financewriter, would love to connect.
And a lot of times they're like, oh, we're looking for somebody
.
I count that as outbound stilland I'll do a little bit of that
(24:07):
.
But yeah, it's been.
I'm really thankful that it'sturned around and tide has
turned, but it's definitely notsomething that's just going to
happen out of the gate.
For a lot of people, right, youhave to build your skill set to
the point where people arehappy.
They're sending you glowingtestimonials that you can build
(24:28):
that proof.
And a lot of people are awareof what you do.
They're telling other peoplelike it's not just clients
coming to me, it's a lot offellow writers that I know and
if I see something that's a goodfit for them, I'm sending it to
them, I'm sending themreferrals and they do the same
to me.
So it's just this whole networkthat builds momentum.
Treasa Edmond (24:46):
It's not an overnight process, and that's
another one of those thingswe've talked about before.
You cannot gauge your successbased on someone else's, because
they may be way further intheir journey than you are, and
that's just not in anyone whopromises you a we can make you
successful overnight thing.
Jessica Walrack (25:04):
They're just lying, it's just and I say not a
single person would envy thegrinds that I went through.
Nobody would want to be doingwhat I did all those years.
I got so many no's, I got somuch rejection.
I remember applying to e-bylineto try to be a professional
(25:26):
writer 20 times of gettingrejected.
It's a grind and people oftensee the end result of that and
it's like, oh, how did you getthere?
I want to be there.
You know there's been a long,there's a lot.
It's like the iceberg thing.
There's so much that has goneinto this and it does take a lot
of persistence.
I think anybody who's reallycommitted to it and I do think
(25:48):
you can fast track the process.
There's some things that Idefinitely took longer to get to
, just because I didn't know,like in hindsight.
But yeah, it's definitely aprocess.
Treasa Edmond (25:59):
And that's something that and I know.
You have your community whereyou help people, and you have
your newsletter, and both ofthem do this thing.
So when you're looking forpeople to help move your
business forward, that's one ofthose things that you should
look for is find people who arehelping you solve individual
problems, not people who aremaking sweeping claims on how
they're going to help you buildyour business or do this thing.
(26:22):
So if you're struggling withoutbound marketing, then go to
someone like Jessica who hasperfected a process.
See if that process works foryou, try it out.
If it doesn't, go find anotherone and try it.
But don't spend all of yourtime doing that either.
You still need to be doing therest of the work and doing the
slog.
I've met a few people who havejust like golden luck and they
(26:46):
meet the people that just jumpand skip them to the front of
the line every single time.
They're rare.
The rest of us work.
We work to get there and that'simportant.
So marketing huge.
Making sure everything's dialedin on messaging huge.
You just kept trying things.
That's also huge.
I love that.
You've gotten to the point nowwhere your marketing's out there
(27:06):
doing the work for you and whenyou do outbound, it's outbound
that you really want to do, andI think that is something we
should all aspire to.
But what were some of thebiggest lessons that you learned
during that transition fromdoing the grind reaching out?
And I know one of them was whento stop and let your system
work.
But what are some of those thatreally made an impact on you
(27:29):
that you still remember and haveactually applied to your daily
processes.
Jessica Walrack (27:34):
Oh yeah, one thing is the feast and the
famine.
I would really, just when I hadno workout, panic and I would
hustle, hustle, hustle on mymarketing, and then I would get
this influx of clients, and thenI'm overwhelmed with my work
and so I stopped marketing andthen it's just like this endless
(27:56):
cycle of that and it'sfrustrating and it's so
stressful.
And so just learning whatmarketing works and how to
maintain it on a regular basiswas a turning point, just
realizing, okay, I can do 10applications a day, every day,
(28:16):
no matter what, no matter ifthings are good or bad, steady
input is going to create steadyoutput or whatever the other way
around.
And then, even still, withLinkedIn, I keep a steady
presence on there.
I have two businesses now, butthey both follow the same
principles.
Nobody else is going to be outthere keeping awareness for your
(28:40):
stuff besides you.
You have to keep that steadybase going, and it's not just
about, hey, I offer this, hey, Ioffer this, hey, I offer this.
It's like hey, this is who I am, this is what I care about,
this is what I've learned, thisis how I can help these are my
experience.
Humanizing.
Yeah, it's just really puttingyourself out there truly what
you think is funny in theindustry, what challenges you
see, what you think needs to beimproved.
(29:00):
That helps to create awarenessaround who you are, no matter
what you're doing, and then thathelps with all of your
businesses.
So, yeah, I think that and it'salso enjoyable because I get to
meet people who share the samepassions as me and care about
the same things and I feltreally true friendships and
relationships since doing this.
Treasa Edmond (29:21):
So it's enjoyable too and it helps business their
business on LinkedIn orinteracting on LinkedIn, because
they really hate social media.
But you just said you enjoy it,you found the enjoyment in it.
Have you ever had that whereyou just I'm like I can't post
another thing this week, or howdo you stay motivated?
Jessica Walrack (29:42):
to keep doing that.
Get it too.
I was never like a huge socialmedia person.
Linkedin's the first one I'veever really put true effort into
and made true relationships onit.
But I do have to be careful.
I can't.
I have burnt out from LinkedInbefore.
It's a lot to be putting ideasout there on a regular basis and
(30:04):
then, as that builds, there'scomments and there's a lot of
messages and that's just a lotof people to be responding to
and thinking about.
Like when you close the phoneyou're still thinking about it.
What did that person say?
Oh, what about this, what aboutthat?
So I definitely have had tolearn boundaries on what to do
and I'll take time off and I'lltake breaks and there'll be
(30:25):
times when I might do more orless, but I do try to keep the
presence steady at least one ortwo posts per week on an ongoing
basis.
Sometimes it will be a higher,but not forever.
I'm not the five posts per weektype of person for the whole
year because it's just, it's alot to handle and I get up and
flow.
(30:45):
Yeah, yeah, it's really an ebband flow, and I'll take time off
too, every once in a while, butI'm in a building phase right
now, so I have been more honedin on LinkedIn.
I don't know if that will lastforever, but, yeah, I definitely
can understand the strugglewith it and I think you have to
be careful.
It's easy just to get pulledinto all the conversations and
(31:07):
be on there way more than youneed to be, even, and it can eat
into your work time.
So for me it's like, okay, I'llget on, I'll do a post, I'll do
30 minutes of interacting andthen I'm done.
I got to focus on my otherstuff.
Treasa Edmond (31:19):
And if you're not careful, the negativity that is
rampant on social media canjust overwhelm you.
So you really have to gatekeepwhat you allow.
Jessica Walrack (31:27):
And you do have to pay attention to things.
Treasa Edmond (31:28):
Yeah.
Jessica Walrack (31:29):
Yeah, I've had some people most people on
LinkedIn.
I feel like it's more positivethan a lot of the other
platforms, but there's stillsome people that I've just had
to say like all their commentswould just kind of rub me the
wrong way.
It just felt like they weremaybe passive, aggressive or
coming for me for some reason,and I would find myself like how
do I respond to the?
(31:50):
Taking too much energy and timetrying to figure out how to
respond?
Block it.
Treasa Edmond (31:55):
Yeah, it's not worth it.
I'm a big believer in blocking,especially trolls or people who
just want to poke.
So you mentioned something andthis wasn't on our initial.
Let's talk about this list, butI want to take just a few
minutes.
You mentioned the feast andfamine cycle, and this is a big
deal for a lot of freelancers,even veteran freelancers who
(32:17):
have been doing this for a longtime.
How do you break that?
Jessica Walrack (32:20):
I think it's consistent marketing and then
it's increasing your amount ofinbound, because even now I
still have I don't think thesurges and the dips ever stop.
But I think you can get to apoint where your dips are not
zero.
Your dips are not.
I can't make my savings goal.
(32:42):
Your dips can get higher andhigher and your searches are
going to get higher too, but asthat whole thing lifts, then
you're never going to be in thatkind of frantic.
Oh my gosh, I have no work.
It's okay, this is my minimum.
I say keep raising that baruntil your minimum is where
you're good and your maximum iswhere you're growing and better.
Treasa Edmond (33:03):
It takes pretty consistent effort to get there.
I think you also have toseriously do some business
basics work.
You have to make sure yourrates are dialed in so that you
can meet what you need.
You have to make sure that yourcash flow system is set up and
that you have a buffer so ifsomething does happen with the
(33:24):
inbound, you're not panicked andgo out and do that reactionary
marketing.
So it's not just aforward-facing situation.
I think that you have to dosome business work on the back
end as well, and I'm sure you'vedone that, and a lot of us
forget to talk about the systems.
We just do the thing.
(33:45):
This is what we're doing inmarketing, and no, you actually
have to do all of this.
Make sure you have the rightbank accounts.
Jessica Walrack (33:48):
That's boring.
And also the repeat clients.
I'm not replacing my clientsevery month, right, all I'm
doing.
I'm looking for moreopportunities that excite me,
that I would want to integrate.
I'm not looking for my anchorclients.
I have those.
So it's like having thatrepeatable income is key because
it's not a revolving door.
(34:09):
You have that base that you canrely on.
It's just trying to fine tuneit on an ongoing basis and make
it better.
I don't think I'll ever get toa point where I'm like I'm good,
I got my roster, I'm good, I'mnot going to do any more trying.
It's a constant evolution.
Treasa Edmond (34:25):
There will always be attrition, always, and
sometimes you'll have a retainerclient or a repeat client that
you work with for years and it'sjust not working for you all of
a sudden, all of a sudden,sometimes, the attrition is on
your end and you're lettingpeople go.
I think you should be.
I think unless you have filledyour roster with absolutely
ideal clients which has anyonethen you're going to be letting
(34:47):
people go every once in a while.
And I love repeat clients andretainer clients and I have set
rules.
No one retainer client can bemore than 10% of my income,
simply because if you lose one,I don't think it should be a
crippling.
That's me.
I don't think it should be acrippling blow to my business if
I lose one client and that's abig thing.
Jessica Walrack (35:05):
I have a 20%, but 10% that's even better.
Treasa Edmond (35:10):
Yeah, and it may be.
I also supplement mine withlarger clients as well, because
I have books or a contentstrategy and you want to make
sure that you're stillmaintaining that base with the
retainer, the consistent work.
It's a tricky thing and I thinkfeast or famine breaking out of
that is going to be a littlebit different for everyone.
(35:30):
But there are certain pieces ofgroundwork that you have to lay
down and doing that marketingand getting the clients coming
to you are top of that.
Yeah definitely so, looking backon your business thus far, is
there anything you would dodifferently if you were starting
over?
Jessica Walrack (35:50):
One thing that I always think of is, for me, a
big pivoting turning point wasgetting recognizable bylines.
Like I said before, I wastrying to get into this like
program where you could getreally high ticket clients, and
at the time it was e-byline, andthey just always kept saying no
(36:13):
, because I didn't have thesenational publications.
I had tons of bylines but theydidn't know any of them, and I
had such a hard time breaking inand getting my first one and I
hear a lot of people say thistoo and so I actually ended up
getting one by accident throughClear Voice.
Have you heard of Clear Voice?
Yeah, yeah, they have a talentplatform, so I got into that and
(36:35):
then they got the client andthen offered it to me, and so
then I got three or four bylinesthrough that Finally, just like
it just happened.
But now that I know that you canpitch publications like I share
pitch calls every single weeknow and it's like Business
Insider, cnet, like all of thesewell-known companies, and they
(36:56):
just take pitches fromfreelancers.
So if you have a good story, agood angle, they'll take it.
It doesn't matter what you'vereally done before if you have a
lot of them, if you have a goodstory.
So I never knew that I wasreally only on the content
marketing side.
I wasn't aware of the wholepublication side really until
like 2020.
So I think if I was going backI would pitch those regularly
(37:19):
and I would try to get in andget a good byline earlier,
because I think that once youhave one, that's like instant
trust, you can put on it yourlogo, on your profile and all
that stuff and then more peopleare willing to trust you from
that that no like trust thing.
Treasa Edmond (37:34):
Some people diss it but it really really does
matter.
And the byline thing I haveissues with that because I'm a
ghostwriter.
I will never have a greatbyline.
I'm okay with that and itdepends.
Jessica Walrack (37:44):
It's a different audience.
Your audience doesn't want youto have those.
Treasa Edmond (37:48):
They want one behind the scenes when you're
setting that up for yourbusiness.
That's one of the things youwant to look at is where do I
want to go with this, and isthis something that I really
need to focus on?
Maybe I'll start looking forbylines now.
All right, so let's talk aboutyour all things.
Freelance writing newsletter,because it's pretty awesome.
Jessica Walrack (38:05):
Thanks.
Yeah, I started this about ayear and a half ago now.
Each week I round upopportunities that are posted on
LinkedIn, on Twitter.
Sometimes companies reach outto me and ask to have their gig
featured.
Companies reach out to me andask to have their gig featured
and they go through a vettingprocess just to check where the
rates are at if they're alegitimate company.
(38:26):
And then, yeah, I just curatethat list each Friday and send
it out to our community, andalong with that, I often
interview other experts in thefreelance writing space or
content marketing space and I'llinclude tips from them.
I'll include something from myown experience, maybe a tip and
then breaking news.
So it's just a place forfreelance writers to stay in the
(38:50):
know with what's going on, getfree leads delivered to their
inbox and just learn from othersin the industry.
And my whole thing is really Ijust I've been through the
trenches of this.
I know that it's not allrainbows and butterflies.
It takes hard work, and so Ijust really like to amplify
other voices who are coming fromthe same kind of place, who
(39:11):
have been through this.
They're not just putting outadvice, they're speaking from
experience and it's not justgoing to be like, hey, do this
and get six figures.
It's like real actionablethings that I would actually
find helpful and I think otherswould too.
Yeah, it goes out every Fridaymorning at 8 am and it's totally
free to subscribe to.
Treasa Edmond (39:31):
Even if you have a lot of newsletters that you
don't read.
Get rid of one of those andsign up for this.
Yeah, and read it and actuallyread it.
It's important.
So, jessica, how can peoplefind you online and connect with
you and sign up for yournewsletter and anything you
mentioned?
I'll make sure those links arein the show notes for the people
as well.
Jessica Walrack (39:47):
The newsletter is on Beehive and there's a link
to it.
We'll add one here and then Ihave it on my LinkedIn featured
section also.
And then, yeah, you can find meon LinkedIn, just search for
Jessica Walrack, and I like topost there pretty regularly.
I respond to all the DMs thataren't pitch slaps, I mean.
I'm sure one or a few dropthrough, slip through the cracks
(40:08):
, but I really try to.
I love to talk with others inthe freelancing community so you
can DM me there or connect, andI accept pretty much all the
connection requests.
And then, yeah, you can learnmore about All Things Freelance
Writing atallthingsfreelancerwritingcom.
We have a podcast, a blog, alot of resources on there.
Treasa Edmond (40:26):
Yeah, and, yeah, podcasts people.
We love podcasts, right, so golisten to that.
I'll make sure there's a linkto that and I'll put it in my
preferred podcast list on thelist as well.
And then one last question,jessica what advice would you
give to service providerslooking to create lasting,
successful partnerships withtheir clients?
Oh, that's a good question.
Jessica Walrack (40:48):
Big smile.
Treasa Edmond (40:48):
We have a big smile, folks.
Jessica Walrack (40:51):
For me, it just all comes down to building
trust.
As soon as I get a client, Ijust can't wait to win their
trust.
They're often kind of nervous.
At first.
They may be like, oh, make sureyou get the keywords in there,
make sure that this has headers,and I'm like, trust me, I got
this and so winning them over.
(41:13):
I just love that process andthen building that trust on an
ongoing basis.
It's meeting the deadlines,it's paying close attention.
If you run into a problem,reaching out to them and coming
up with a solution, asking themhow they might handle it.
All of that just helps to buildreally strong relationships
where they can see that youreally care, you're an expert,
you really know what you'redoing and you're putting 100%.
(41:36):
And then, on the flip side, isthat client really invested?
Are they paying close attentionand can we match in that way
where we're both really engaged?
Okay, this is match made inheaven and it can just go on and
be a really enjoyable workexperience.
Treasa Edmond (41:53):
It's finding that perfect fit and I think that's
important.
I look for that and I thinkevery other person I have talked
to who has built a trulysuccessful business, that was
one of the hallmarks for them isfinding the clients that were a
good fit and it matches anenergy and expectations and all
(42:13):
of the things have a desire towork with you.
Jessica Walrack (42:16):
Those are important and then they're your
advocate.
Then you have somebody outthere who knows you, knows you,
who trusts you, who's workedwith you for two years and you
never miss a deadline.
That's a powerful person tohave out in the world, and then
that person is going to writeyou testimonials and they're
going to recommend other peopleto you and all that stuff.
Treasa Edmond (42:34):
Jessica, we need to have you back because you
were in sales.
We need to have you back in thefuture and have a chat about
the buyer's journey and how thatrelates to freelancers, because
you just mentioned advocatesand that is the stage of the
buyer's journey that a lot ofbig businesses even forget about
.
For freelancers especially, Ithink it's absolutely vital
because that's where yourreferrals come from.
(42:54):
So, yes, that's a future topic.
We won't go into it today.
Thank you so much for beinghere with us, jessica.
We've really enjoyed it andjust absolute phenomenal advice.
I've enjoyed it.
Jessica Walrack (43:05):
Thank you so much for having me.
It's always fun to talk shopwith other people who have been
in this business for a long timeand we can just really get into
the nitty gritty corners of it.
All right, thank you so much.
Thank you.
Treasa Edmond (43:19):
Bye.
Welcome back to the Boss Responses podcast.
As I was editing today'sepisode, I celebrated for a
couple of reasons.
The first is this is the 50thepisode of the Boss Responses
podcast.
It took me a while to even getstarted on this podcast Imposter
syndrome was smacking me upbeside the head hard but I've
(00:22):
enjoyed every single second ofrecording the podcast, of
talking to my guests, and I havesome really great episodes
already recorded that you'll belistening to in the next few
weeks.
I'm always looking for greatguests, so if you know someone
who should be on the BossResponses podcast, let me know.
Tag me on LinkedIn, send me aDM.
(00:43):
I really want to make sure thatI'm bringing the people onto
the podcast who can help yougrow your business.
Also, questions we always needmore questions to feature on the
podcast.
Second, every other sentence inthis entire episode was a
nugget of amazing information.
(01:05):
Our special guest this week isJessica Walrack.
Jessica is the founder of AllThings Freelance Writing, a
community that helps freelancewriters build their ideal
businesses through its blog,weekly jobs newsletter and other
resources.
She's also a freelance financejournalist with 11 years of
(01:25):
professional writing experience.
You can find her work regularlyfeatured in national
publications, including US Newsand World, CBS News Money Watch,
Newsweek and Wall JournalBuySide.
I've really enjoyed havingJessica on the podcast this week
and, as I mentioned close tothe end of this episode, I hope
(01:46):
we can bring her back in thefuture to talk about some of the
sales side of the business.
Today we're going to talk abouttwo topics that are vital to
freelance business owners.
The first is niching down.
Should you do it?
How should you do it?
What does that actually looklike?
There's a lot of informationout there and it's contradictory
(02:08):
.
Jessica gives some great advicethat I think you're really
going to enjoy hearing.
Our other topic is going froman outbound marketing business
to inbound clients how thatchanges your business, what that
looks like and how you can makeit happen your business, what
that looks like and how you canmake it happen.
(02:28):
Jessica is very transparent andshe shares that.
The process didn't happen forher overnight.
She worked really hard forseveral years before everything
started clicking for her.
Today she's sharing what shedid, so that maybe you can skip
a few of those steps.
It's a longer episode today, solet's not waste any more time,
because I know you're going towant to hear what Jessica has to
say.
(02:50):
If you're a freelancer, businessowner or anyone who deals with
clients, you're in the rightplace.
I'm your host, teresa Edmond.
I've been dealing with clientsand running my business for
nearly two decades and in thattime I've dealt with my share of
doubt, imposter syndrome andnot knowing what to say when a
client asked a question I wasn'tready for.
(03:10):
I created this podcast toempower you with the boss
responses you need to grow yourbusiness.
Each week, my guest co-host andI will bring you five episodes
packed with practical insights.
Monday through Thursday, weanswer your questions, and
Fridays we dive deep to explorehow our co-hosts embrace their
(03:30):
role as the boss of theirbusiness.
Welcome to Boss Responses,jessica.
Thank you so much for beinghere with us this week.
Jessica Walrack (03:42):
Yeah, it's a pleasure.
Thanks for inviting me.
Treasa Edmond (03:45):
It's been fun.
We've had a lot of this week.
Yeah, it's a pleasure.
Thanks for inviting me.
It's been fun.
We've had a lot of deepconversations.
Yeah, definitely All right.
So today we're learning moreabout you and we're actually
diving pretty deep into twodifferent topics, and we'll get
into those.
But first tell me a little bitabout you and what you do.
Jessica Walrack (03:59):
Okay, yeah, I'm a freelance finance writer and
journalist.
I specialize in covering theeconomy, banking products, loans
, budgeting, insurance, thingslike that for fintech companies,
media companies, news sites,and yeah, I've been doing that
(04:23):
for about four years and then Iwas a generalist for about seven
years before that.
And then how many years beforethat were you a generalist?
Seven, so a total of 11.
Treasa Edmond (04:31):
11 years.
That's a good long time to berunning your own business.
What did you do before youstarted as a freelancer?
Jessica Walrack (04:39):
I was in sales, so I did sales to consumers for
about five years and then B2Bsales for about two to three
years.
Treasa Edmond (04:51):
So that's a big difference.
Jessica Walrack (04:53):
Yeah, there's overlap.
I found that a lot of thethings that I learned because
they would send us to thesesales trainings and I would have
to do a lot of outbound andthings like that.
So a lot of that I found camein handy as I was crafting sales
content and putting calls toactions.
But instead of doing it inperson with another human being,
(05:15):
I'm doing it through writing.
But it helped a lot in kind ofthe client acquisition and
getting things going.
Treasa Edmond (05:22):
So that's a big perspective shift.
I know as a content strategistworking with big B2B companies,
one of the biggest kind ofbreaks I see in the content
system is the content teamscreating content that supports
the sales team and then thesales team actually utilizing
that in some way.
(05:43):
So you have had a completelydifferent perspective shift to
where now you're creating thecontent and how does that make
you see things differently fromwhere you came from?
Jessica Walrack (05:53):
I feel like, especially over the past few
years, as everything's shiftedmore online, it's kind of all
melded together.
I feel like marketing used tobe one silo and sales was
another, and now it's more ofall melded together.
I feel like marketing used tobe one silo and sales was
another, and now it's moreintertwined.
Like content as people refer toit versus the copy is often
educational.
You're raising awareness,you're bringing people into the
(06:16):
buying cycle and nurturing themthrough, and then the copy is
more of what sales was, whereyou're trying to make that hard
sale, maybe on a landing page orsomething like that or an ad in
the moment.
So I've really been able totake that experience and put it
all together, although I am moredrawn towards the educational
(06:38):
side.
So I've always really enjoyedkind of teaching I've done it in
every role I've ever had and solong form kind of content I've
leaned towards that more.
Treasa Edmond (06:49):
That's where I lean as well, but I am seeing
that breakdown in the silos andhow everything is coming more
together, and I agree with youon that.
I understand you believe in theimportance of niching down.
Can you share your journey todiscovering your niche and why
you think it's so important?
Jessica Walrack (07:05):
Yeah, like I said, I was a generalist for
seven years.
I stumbled upon freelancewriting.
I never had really heard aboutit before and my husband and I
were actually trying to start adifferent kind of business and
to get it going we had to hire awebsite copywriter and someone
to write our blogs.
And so we went through Elance,I think, at the time, and that
(07:29):
business was getting started,but it was just slow and so I
was like, in the downtime, I'mgoing to go on Elance myself and
see what I can find.
So I think I applied for 40positions before I got a chance.
But landed my first gig andmade money online for the first
time and that little light bulb.
I'm like, oh my gosh, okay,this can work.
(07:49):
And yeah, I just navigated it,kept applying, trying all sorts
of different things and slowlylearning more about what this
industry is, what the businessis, over time.
But I reached a point where Iwas just ready to take it to the
next level and I was reallystruggling to take it to the
next level and I was reallystruggling with issues like I
wasn't really getting inbounds.
(08:09):
I was putting a lot of timeinto marketing all the time.
I wasn't really happy with myclients, like they were scope
creeping, they were not payingme on time, but I didn't have
the other clients or the abilityto get them to write my other
clients off.
So it was just reallyfrustrating and I'm like, okay,
I'm at the point where I need todo something else or I need to
(08:30):
make this work, basically.
And so that's when I decided toniche down and I tried a few
different things.
I started by getting onLinkedIn, building a brand, and
that started to get sometraction, and so I thought maybe
I'll get more into the brandingside and I'll do branding
(08:52):
guides and mission and visionstatements and all the stuff to
get people set up.
I had done that for someclients in the past, but it
didn't really take off.
I got a few clients, but it wasso much work and there's so
much back and forth and so muchresearch and I was just like
spending way more time than evenbefore and making less money.
So I was like, okay, this isn'treally a good fit.
(09:13):
So I went back to the drawingboard.
I looked through all my work.
I'm like what do I like?
What's in high demand andwhat's paying?
Well, I need to do some findsomething that ticks those three
boxes, and I just realized it'sthe finance blogs.
I really enjoy these.
I hardly ever need revisions.
My clients need a lot of them.
(09:33):
They pay some of the best ofany of my projects.
Why don't I give this a go, whynot?
I already have one or twoclients in the space.
So, yeah, I updated everything,my LinkedIn, my website, went
all in on it, kept posting onLinkedIn and the leads just
really started coming in fromall these high, big brand name
(09:54):
companies, and I'm like, oh mygosh, I have been getting on
calls, struggling, sellingmyself so hard, and now this
business is just coming to me.
This is like the magic formula.
Amazing, it was the mostexciting thing ever, and so at
that point, I really understoodthe power of niching and having
a very specific offer.
And so, yeah, I've been on thattruck ever since.
Treasa Edmond (10:19):
So let's talk about impact.
How did narrowing your focusreally change your business,
both initially, obviously, youhad a lot more leads coming in
and then, in the long term, whatchanges did you see that you
had to make?
Because your client portfolio,I'm sure, just completely
changed?
Jessica Walrack (10:36):
Yeah, and it was a gradual process.
Last year was the first yearthat I was 100%.
All I wrote was financearticles, so I was still doing
other stuff, but on themarketing front, that's all I
was doing.
I still had some other clients,so it was really just a process
of removing all the bottlenecksthat I was running into.
(10:57):
So I'm getting better at thefinance writing, I'm realizing
what obstacles I run into inthis area, and so I was able to,
now that I had the lead gensorted, I could focus on the
next problem, which wasoptimizing my workflow so that I
can get through my work in thetime that I want to get through
(11:18):
it, so that I can get rid ofthese problems that are really
annoying and taking too muchtime, so I can fine-tune the
clients that I want.
All of those things became thenext focus, and so everything I
would say from that point it wasjust really fine tuning it and,
yeah, getting rid of thoseissues.
Treasa Edmond (11:38):
And I like that you solve the problems one at a
time, because I think a lot ofpeople get overwhelmed.
They're like, okay, these areall the things I don't like,
that I want to change, and thenthey have this massive list and
you just solve the big problemsand then the little problems
went away with them, which Ithink is really cool.
So, looking at your businessnow and then looking back at it
when you very first startedspecializing, like four years
(12:00):
ago, what are some of thedifferences that you see?
Jessica Walrack (12:06):
Maybe even how you feel about it.
Yeah, I love it.
I love my business, and at thattime I was just surviving and I
was unhappy.
I was ready to throw in thetowel.
So it's just night and day.
I've gotten time back.
I was able to start a secondbusiness.
I've been able to create thiswhole online community and give
back to other freelance writerswho might be struggling with
(12:29):
things that I struggled with,and I have time to do the
newsletter.
Just other passions I have timeto refinish furniture, which is
like a hobby that I never evenknew I liked, and take pottery
classes, and it just feelsactually getting your life back,
having space and time to, moretime to spend with family, more
resources, be able to do thethings that you want All those
(12:50):
things.
I just think it's priceless.
I'm really thankful that Idiscovered that change and that
it worked and that I've justbeen able to stay on that path
and then grow in other ways too,where before my business was
all consuming, it was taking allof my time to try to make it
work Right.
Treasa Edmond (13:07):
So let's move back to those years when you
were kind of a generalist.
I know a lot of people whoprefer to stay generalist, or
they want to work with a varietyof clients or they want to do
all of that.
Absolutely nothing wrong withthat.
But there is power in narrowingyour focus and working with a
specific group of clients.
One it does help you up level.
(13:28):
Because you up level yourskills, you make your business
tighter and then you do haveroom, and I think a lot of it is
creating space in your life,which is what we want our
businesses to do right.
We don't want them to consumeus.
For those people who aregeneralists, or for people who
are generalists and are ready tomake that switch, who want to
(13:48):
uplevel their skills in theirbusiness, what advice would you
give them?
Jessica Walrack (13:52):
I would say and we've kind of talked about this
before it doesn't necessarilyhave to be an industry niche.
It can be a niche in the typeof writing that you do, such as
blogs or email or ghostwriting,or any aspect of your business
that is more specific can be aniche.
So it can be any kind ofspecialist area that you do and
(14:15):
like ghostwriting Maybe youwrite emails, maybe you write
blogs.
It doesn't necessarily have tobe like finance or health or an
industry, and also it doesn'thave to be the only thing you're
doing.
It's a marketing positioningstrategy.
It's how you're presentingyourself in the market to
attract people to you.
That doesn't mean that's allyou're doing on the back end.
(14:37):
So I did a variety of thingsfor the first few years.
I just on LinkedIn, that's howI presented it and that's what I
was hoping to attract and itworked.
But that doesn't necessarilyhave to be exclusive and you can
start and try things and testit out for four to six weeks,
see how it goes and if itdoesn't, that's okay.
(14:58):
Switch to the next thing.
Like people don't remember,people don't care what you did
six months ago.
What's going to matter is theconsistent messaging that you're
sending now and what you stickwith.
So, yes, it does definitelybuild momentum if you are doing
the same thing for a long time.
Now that I've been doing it fortwo years, three years, I have
a lot more people who will saythey see a finance position come
(15:20):
up and they message me.
Hey, jess, I think this wouldbe perfect for you.
That didn't happen as much inthe first year.
So once you find your thing, itdefinitely helps to be
consistent, but I don't thinkyou have to feel so much
pressure that you're locked intothis thing forever.
You can try it out, see if it'sa good fit, and if it's not,
you can move on to somethingelse.
Marketing is really a bigexperiment.
Treasa Edmond (15:44):
Yeah, I like that you brought that up.
This doesn't have to be anentire pivot of your business
just to choose one area to focuson.
It's actually just a marketingfocus and then you see if the
marketing works and if itdoesn't, you try a different
marketing focus.
So you don't actually have tomake any back-end business
changes into what you're doingand what you're not doing until
you see whether or not themarketing works, and I think
(16:06):
that's a really good point.
So you don't have to stop doingall of the work for the other
clients.
I wouldn't recommend it.
I've seen it happen and I'vealso seen people who have been
hit by this downturn in themarket and they're like, ok,
while this is going on, I'mgoing to go ahead and pivot and
niche down and do my thing.
That's fine, but you shouldprobably still be trying to find
(16:28):
work in what you're alreadydoing while you're doing that.
It's just the freedom to trynew things.
That's the point.
Jessica Walrack (16:34):
Yeah, and I'm not saying that this is the only
way this worked for me.
This will work for everybody.
That's definitely not the case.
I know generalists who arehighly successful and they've
been that way for decades, sodifferent ways can work.
I'm just saying this is one way, and this worked for me.
Treasa Edmond (16:54):
And you have to look at why they're successful.
You can't just say, well,they're successful because
they're a generalist, or they'resuccessful because they're just
a finance writer.
You can't do that.
There are other factors that wedon't see, that are happening,
that are creating that successfor them.
Sometimes it's relationships,sometimes it's their marketing,
sometimes it's just who theyknow.
So all of that stuff comes intoplay.
(17:16):
So you cannot gauge yoursuccess in the same area based
on what you're seeing onlinefrom other people.
It's just not possible.
So give yourself grace.
What about misconceptions?
Because I'm telling you thatuntil recently, I had a lot of
misconceptions about nichingdown.
So are there any that you wouldlike to debunk particularly?
Jessica Walrack (17:37):
Yeah, I think that I see a lot of coaching
materials, I guess, like coursesand things like that, that say
you have to niche down right outof the gate If you want to
start a freelance writingbusiness.
You pick a high profitableniche and then you go to market.
Yeah, and I don't necessarilythink that's the best thing to
(17:58):
do all the time, right?
Especially if you have nosamples, no experience, no
testimonials, nothing.
It's going to be difficultbecause the people who are
looking to hire experts theywant to see proof, and that's
what you're saying.
If you're niched down, is thatyou're an expert in this thing?
Right, maybe if you're comingfrom a background of like I know
(18:20):
a lot of nurses who recentlytransitioned out of working in
hospitals into freelance writingand so they're going into the
health.
Ok, that's a little bitdifferent.
Maybe you're new to writing butyou have this subject matter
expertise in the area.
I can get that.
But if you're not reallywanting to transition from what
you were doing before and usethat, then it can make sense
(18:42):
just to come in and get yourfeet wet and try different
things and see what you like andexperiment, see where that
demand is what pays the best,where there's high demand and
base the niching decision onactual, real data and evidence
rather than just a guess orsomething you read online.
Treasa Edmond (19:00):
Yeah, I think we should all applaud that
statement.
Base your business decisions ondata and evidence.
People Do that.
I love that.
That's so true.
So when we were talking aboutdoing the podcast, you mentioned
that you'd gone from 100%outbound which a lot of us do
when we start to 90% inbound onyour client intake.
(19:20):
I'm a big believer of gettingto the point where clients come
to you or clients are referredto you.
I think that is the mark of asuccessful business or one of
the benchmarks.
So there are a lot ofbenchmarks, but I think that's
one of them.
Can you walk us through yourprocess of making that shift
from 100% outbound to the 90%inbound?
Jessica Walrack (19:39):
Yeah, like I said, I have a sales background.
I was doing a lot of coldcalling in my B2B position and
so I carried that over into thisand I started on work platforms
and I would just apply, apply,apply.
So these are already people inthe final stage of the buying
cycle.
They know that they need afreelance writer, they know
(19:59):
exactly what they need, theyhave a budget, all these things.
So it's not exactly a coldpitch.
I'm just competing against allthe other people who are trying
to get this position.
So I did that.
I would spend about an hourevery single day, sending at
least 20 applications everysingle day to try to build a
regular influence, my businessand my business flow.
So it's a lot of work and I seea lot of writers struggle with
(20:36):
this.
They're like I sent fivepitches and I haven't heard
anything back.
I don't know what to do.
I don't know what I'm doingwrong.
Oftentimes it's just a volumeissue in the beginning, because
you're new, if you don't havethat much experience, you don't
have that much proof.
You don't have that much proof,you don't have trust,
connections, all these thingsthat make outbound easier, and
so your conversion rates aregoing to be probably around
(20:58):
three to five percent, whichmeans you need to be sending a
ton of outbound to to getresults.
So that's where I started.
It was a hustle, it was a grindfor a few years really to get
the thing going and I alsodidn't really have that much
confidence in myself and myskills and my abilities because
(21:19):
I was new and I was learning andI really didn't know what I was
doing that much.
I was kind of learning as I goand so over time, as I got more
experience and worked with allthese different types of clients
, as I got more experience andworked with all these different
types of clients, I started tobelieve more in myself and what
I delivered and the value that Idelivered to these companies.
(21:40):
And it just really helps to havepositive interactions with
clients who really appreciateyour work.
And then you say okay and Iworked with a few editors
throughout my journey too thatyou get back this document and
it's just redlined like crazyand it's so frustrating to see
that.
But those were some of mybiggest learning opportunities
(22:00):
to figure out exactly how toimprove.
So now, looking back, it's likethose were pivotal turning
points where, after I workedwith a real high caliber editor.
I could get better clientsafter that and better.
Long story short, it was justreally gaining experience,
gaining confidence, buildingrelationships, building trust
with people, and then nichingdown and building my presence
(22:24):
and aligning everything.
So all of this stuff built oneach other to the point where
then I had an online presence.
I didn't really have an onlinepresence for a long time, like
six years.
Treasa Edmond (22:34):
I was just hustling like writing, writing,
writing because you don't needit if you're in the job boards.
Jessica Walrack (22:39):
Yeah, I had my profile which had all my reviews
on it, and then once because Iwas on Elance, and then it got
bought out by Upwork and shutdown.
So that was like I lost mysource, because there was kind
of a drop-off between the two.
And so at that point I went onto LinkedIn and started
connecting with people in like2016.
But nobody was posting.
(23:00):
It was just you're connecting.
People were like messaging onthere, using it like a resume
site, but yeah, so I reallystarted seeing the switch when I
niched down, aligned my wholeprofile, put all my testimonials
together in my niche andstarted posting on LinkedIn and
Instagram and then doing SEO formy website and so creating that
(23:22):
constant presence to raiseawareness about what I did,
started to bring in optimizingmy profile for my niche, started
to bring in the inbound and,yeah, and now it's been about
three years and it's just itkeeps going and keeps on
building.
So I do still like to keep aneye out all the time.
I do the job board, so I'mseeing jobs every single week,
(23:47):
people hiring, so when I seesomething good, I'll send a
little message.
Or if I see a publication thatis like a dream publication, I
want to be, in, I'll DM theeditor and I'll just be like,
hey, I'm a freelance financewriter, would love to connect.
And a lot of times they're like, oh, we're looking for somebody
.
I count that as outbound stilland I'll do a little bit of that
(24:07):
.
But yeah, it's been.
I'm really thankful that it'sturned around and tide has
turned, but it's definitely notsomething that's just going to
happen out of the gate.
For a lot of people, right, youhave to build your skill set to
the point where people arehappy.
They're sending you glowingtestimonials that you can build
(24:28):
that proof.
And a lot of people are awareof what you do.
They're telling other peoplelike it's not just clients
coming to me, it's a lot offellow writers that I know and
if I see something that's a goodfit for them, I'm sending it to
them, I'm sending themreferrals and they do the same
to me.
So it's just this whole networkthat builds momentum.
Treasa Edmond (24:46):
It's not an overnight process, and that's
another one of those thingswe've talked about before.
You cannot gauge your successbased on someone else's, because
they may be way further intheir journey than you are, and
that's just not in anyone whopromises you a we can make you
successful overnight thing.
Jessica Walrack (25:04):
They're just lying, it's just and I say not a
single person would envy thegrinds that I went through.
Nobody would want to be doingwhat I did all those years.
I got so many no's, I got somuch rejection.
I remember applying to e-bylineto try to be a professional
(25:26):
writer 20 times of gettingrejected.
It's a grind and people oftensee the end result of that and
it's like, oh, how did you getthere?
I want to be there.
You know there's been a long,there's a lot.
It's like the iceberg thing.
There's so much that has goneinto this and it does take a lot
of persistence.
I think anybody who's reallycommitted to it and I do think
(25:48):
you can fast track the process.
There's some things that Idefinitely took longer to get to
, just because I didn't know,like in hindsight.
But yeah, it's definitely aprocess.
Treasa Edmond (25:59):
And that's something that and I know.
You have your community whereyou help people, and you have
your newsletter, and both ofthem do this thing.
So when you're looking forpeople to help move your
business forward, that's one ofthose things that you should
look for is find people who arehelping you solve individual
problems, not people who aremaking sweeping claims on how
they're going to help you buildyour business or do this thing.
(26:22):
So if you're struggling withoutbound marketing, then go to
someone like Jessica who hasperfected a process.
See if that process works foryou, try it out.
If it doesn't, go find anotherone and try it.
But don't spend all of yourtime doing that either.
You still need to be doing therest of the work and doing the
slog.
I've met a few people who havejust like golden luck and they
(26:46):
meet the people that just jumpand skip them to the front of
the line every single time.
They're rare.
The rest of us work.
We work to get there and that'simportant.
So marketing huge.
Making sure everything's dialedin on messaging huge.
You just kept trying things.
That's also huge.
I love that.
You've gotten to the point nowwhere your marketing's out there
(27:06):
doing the work for you and whenyou do outbound, it's outbound
that you really want to do, andI think that is something we
should all aspire to.
But what were some of thebiggest lessons that you learned
during that transition fromdoing the grind reaching out?
And I know one of them was whento stop and let your system
work.
But what are some of those thatreally made an impact on you
(27:29):
that you still remember and haveactually applied to your daily
processes.
Jessica Walrack (27:34):
Oh yeah, one thing is the feast and the
famine.
I would really, just when I hadno workout, panic and I would
hustle, hustle, hustle on mymarketing, and then I would get
this influx of clients, and thenI'm overwhelmed with my work
and so I stopped marketing andthen it's just like this endless
(27:56):
cycle of that and it'sfrustrating and it's so
stressful.
And so just learning whatmarketing works and how to
maintain it on a regular basiswas a turning point, just
realizing, okay, I can do 10applications a day, every day,
(28:16):
no matter what, no matter ifthings are good or bad, steady
input is going to create steadyoutput or whatever the other way
around.
And then, even still, withLinkedIn, I keep a steady
presence on there.
I have two businesses now, butthey both follow the same
principles.
Nobody else is going to be outthere keeping awareness for your
(28:40):
stuff besides you.
You have to keep that steadybase going, and it's not just
about, hey, I offer this, hey, Ioffer this, hey, I offer this.
It's like hey, this is who I am, this is what I care about,
this is what I've learned, thisis how I can help these are my
experience.
Humanizing.
Yeah, it's just really puttingyourself out there truly what
you think is funny in theindustry, what challenges you
see, what you think needs to beimproved.
(29:00):
That helps to create awarenessaround who you are, no matter
what you're doing, and then thathelps with all of your
businesses.
So, yeah, I think that and it'salso enjoyable because I get to
meet people who share the samepassions as me and care about
the same things and I feltreally true friendships and
relationships since doing this.
Treasa Edmond (29:21):
So it's enjoyable too and it helps business their
business on LinkedIn orinteracting on LinkedIn, because
they really hate social media.
But you just said you enjoy it,you found the enjoyment in it.
Have you ever had that whereyou just I'm like I can't post
another thing this week, or howdo you stay motivated?
Jessica Walrack (29:42):
to keep doing that.
Get it too.
I was never like a huge socialmedia person.
Linkedin's the first one I'veever really put true effort into
and made true relationships onit.
But I do have to be careful.
I can't.
I have burnt out from LinkedInbefore.
It's a lot to be putting ideasout there on a regular basis and
(30:04):
then, as that builds, there'scomments and there's a lot of
messages and that's just a lotof people to be responding to
and thinking about.
Like when you close the phoneyou're still thinking about it.
What did that person say?
Oh, what about this, what aboutthat?
So I definitely have had tolearn boundaries on what to do
and I'll take time off and I'lltake breaks and there'll be
(30:25):
times when I might do more orless, but I do try to keep the
presence steady at least one ortwo posts per week on an ongoing
basis.
Sometimes it will be a higher,but not forever.
I'm not the five posts per weektype of person for the whole
year because it's just, it's alot to handle and I get up and
flow.
(30:45):
Yeah, yeah, it's really an ebband flow, and I'll take time off
too, every once in a while, butI'm in a building phase right
now, so I have been more honedin on LinkedIn.
I don't know if that will lastforever, but, yeah, I definitely
can understand the strugglewith it and I think you have to
be careful.
It's easy just to get pulledinto all the conversations and
(31:07):
be on there way more than youneed to be, even, and it can eat
into your work time.
So for me it's like, okay, I'llget on, I'll do a post, I'll do
30 minutes of interacting andthen I'm done.
I got to focus on my otherstuff.
Treasa Edmond (31:19):
And if you're not careful, the negativity that is
rampant on social media canjust overwhelm you.
So you really have to gatekeepwhat you allow.
Jessica Walrack (31:27):
And you do have to pay attention to things.
Treasa Edmond (31:28):
Yeah.
Jessica Walrack (31:29):
Yeah, I've had some people most people on
LinkedIn.
I feel like it's more positivethan a lot of the other
platforms, but there's stillsome people that I've just had
to say like all their commentswould just kind of rub me the
wrong way.
It just felt like they weremaybe passive, aggressive or
coming for me for some reason,and I would find myself like how
do I respond to the?
(31:50):
Taking too much energy and timetrying to figure out how to
respond?
Block it.
Treasa Edmond (31:55):
Yeah, it's not worth it.
I'm a big believer in blocking,especially trolls or people who
just want to poke.
So you mentioned something andthis wasn't on our initial.
Let's talk about this list, butI want to take just a few
minutes.
You mentioned the feast andfamine cycle, and this is a big
deal for a lot of freelancers,even veteran freelancers who
(32:17):
have been doing this for a longtime.
How do you break that?
Jessica Walrack (32:20):
I think it's consistent marketing and then
it's increasing your amount ofinbound, because even now I
still have I don't think thesurges and the dips ever stop.
But I think you can get to apoint where your dips are not
zero.
Your dips are not.
I can't make my savings goal.
(32:42):
Your dips can get higher andhigher and your searches are
going to get higher too, but asthat whole thing lifts, then
you're never going to be in thatkind of frantic.
Oh my gosh, I have no work.
It's okay, this is my minimum.
I say keep raising that baruntil your minimum is where
you're good and your maximum iswhere you're growing and better.
Treasa Edmond (33:03):
It takes pretty consistent effort to get there.
I think you also have toseriously do some business
basics work.
You have to make sure yourrates are dialed in so that you
can meet what you need.
You have to make sure that yourcash flow system is set up and
that you have a buffer so ifsomething does happen with the
(33:24):
inbound, you're not panicked andgo out and do that reactionary
marketing.
So it's not just aforward-facing situation.
I think that you have to dosome business work on the back
end as well, and I'm sure you'vedone that, and a lot of us
forget to talk about the systems.
We just do the thing.
(33:45):
This is what we're doing inmarketing, and no, you actually
have to do all of this.
Make sure you have the rightbank accounts.
Jessica Walrack (33:48):
That's boring.
And also the repeat clients.
I'm not replacing my clientsevery month, right, all I'm
doing.
I'm looking for moreopportunities that excite me,
that I would want to integrate.
I'm not looking for my anchorclients.
I have those.
So it's like having thatrepeatable income is key because
it's not a revolving door.
(34:09):
You have that base that you canrely on.
It's just trying to fine tuneit on an ongoing basis and make
it better.
I don't think I'll ever get toa point where I'm like I'm good,
I got my roster, I'm good, I'mnot going to do any more trying.
It's a constant evolution.
Treasa Edmond (34:25):
There will always be attrition, always, and
sometimes you'll have a retainerclient or a repeat client that
you work with for years and it'sjust not working for you all of
a sudden, all of a sudden,sometimes, the attrition is on
your end and you're lettingpeople go.
I think you should be.
I think unless you have filledyour roster with absolutely
ideal clients which has anyonethen you're going to be letting
(34:47):
people go every once in a while.
And I love repeat clients andretainer clients and I have set
rules.
No one retainer client can bemore than 10% of my income,
simply because if you lose one,I don't think it should be a
crippling.
That's me.
I don't think it should be acrippling blow to my business if
I lose one client and that's abig thing.
Jessica Walrack (35:05):
I have a 20%, but 10% that's even better.
Treasa Edmond (35:10):
Yeah, and it may be.
I also supplement mine withlarger clients as well, because
I have books or a contentstrategy and you want to make
sure that you're stillmaintaining that base with the
retainer, the consistent work.
It's a tricky thing and I thinkfeast or famine breaking out of
that is going to be a littlebit different for everyone.
(35:30):
But there are certain pieces ofgroundwork that you have to lay
down and doing that marketingand getting the clients coming
to you are top of that.
Yeah definitely so, looking backon your business thus far, is
there anything you would dodifferently if you were starting
over?
Jessica Walrack (35:50):
One thing that I always think of is, for me, a
big pivoting turning point wasgetting recognizable bylines.
Like I said before, I wastrying to get into this like
program where you could getreally high ticket clients, and
at the time it was e-byline, andthey just always kept saying no
(36:13):
, because I didn't have thesenational publications.
I had tons of bylines but theydidn't know any of them, and I
had such a hard time breaking inand getting my first one and I
hear a lot of people say thistoo and so I actually ended up
getting one by accident throughClear Voice.
Have you heard of Clear Voice?
Yeah, yeah, they have a talentplatform, so I got into that and
(36:35):
then they got the client andthen offered it to me, and so
then I got three or four bylinesthrough that Finally, just like
it just happened.
But now that I know that you canpitch publications like I share
pitch calls every single weeknow and it's like Business
Insider, cnet, like all of thesewell-known companies, and they
(36:56):
just take pitches fromfreelancers.
So if you have a good story, agood angle, they'll take it.
It doesn't matter what you'vereally done before if you have a
lot of them, if you have a goodstory.
So I never knew that I wasreally only on the content
marketing side.
I wasn't aware of the wholepublication side really until
like 2020.
So I think if I was going backI would pitch those regularly
(37:19):
and I would try to get in andget a good byline earlier,
because I think that once youhave one, that's like instant
trust, you can put on it yourlogo, on your profile and all
that stuff and then more peopleare willing to trust you from
that that no like trust thing.
Treasa Edmond (37:34):
Some people diss it but it really really does
matter.
And the byline thing I haveissues with that because I'm a
ghostwriter.
I will never have a greatbyline.
I'm okay with that and itdepends.
Jessica Walrack (37:44):
It's a different audience.
Your audience doesn't want youto have those.
Treasa Edmond (37:48):
They want one behind the scenes when you're
setting that up for yourbusiness.
That's one of the things youwant to look at is where do I
want to go with this, and isthis something that I really
need to focus on?
Maybe I'll start looking forbylines now.
All right, so let's talk aboutyour all things.
Freelance writing newsletter,because it's pretty awesome.
Jessica Walrack (38:05):
Thanks.
Yeah, I started this about ayear and a half ago now.
Each week I round upopportunities that are posted on
LinkedIn, on Twitter.
Sometimes companies reach outto me and ask to have their gig
featured.
Companies reach out to me andask to have their gig featured
and they go through a vettingprocess just to check where the
rates are at if they're alegitimate company.
(38:26):
And then, yeah, I just curatethat list each Friday and send
it out to our community, andalong with that, I often
interview other experts in thefreelance writing space or
content marketing space and I'llinclude tips from them.
I'll include something from myown experience, maybe a tip and
then breaking news.
So it's just a place forfreelance writers to stay in the
(38:50):
know with what's going on, getfree leads delivered to their
inbox and just learn from othersin the industry.
And my whole thing is really Ijust I've been through the
trenches of this.
I know that it's not allrainbows and butterflies.
It takes hard work, and so Ijust really like to amplify
other voices who are coming fromthe same kind of place, who
(39:11):
have been through this.
They're not just putting outadvice, they're speaking from
experience and it's not justgoing to be like, hey, do this
and get six figures.
It's like real actionablethings that I would actually
find helpful and I think otherswould too.
Yeah, it goes out every Fridaymorning at 8 am and it's totally
free to subscribe to.
Treasa Edmond (39:31):
Even if you have a lot of newsletters that you
don't read.
Get rid of one of those andsign up for this.
Yeah, and read it and actuallyread it.
It's important.
So, jessica, how can peoplefind you online and connect with
you and sign up for yournewsletter and anything you
mentioned?
I'll make sure those links arein the show notes for the people
as well.
Jessica Walrack (39:47):
The newsletter is on Beehive and there's a link
to it.
We'll add one here and then Ihave it on my LinkedIn featured
section also.
And then, yeah, you can find meon LinkedIn, just search for
Jessica Walrack, and I like topost there pretty regularly.
I respond to all the DMs thataren't pitch slaps, I mean.
I'm sure one or a few dropthrough, slip through the cracks
(40:08):
, but I really try to.
I love to talk with others inthe freelancing community so you
can DM me there or connect, andI accept pretty much all the
connection requests.
And then, yeah, you can learnmore about All Things Freelance
Writing atallthingsfreelancerwritingcom.
We have a podcast, a blog, alot of resources on there.
Treasa Edmond (40:26):
Yeah, and, yeah, podcasts people.
We love podcasts, right, so golisten to that.
I'll make sure there's a linkto that and I'll put it in my
preferred podcast list on thelist as well.
And then one last question,jessica what advice would you
give to service providerslooking to create lasting,
successful partnerships withtheir clients?
Oh, that's a good question.
Jessica Walrack (40:48):
Big smile.
Treasa Edmond (40:48):
We have a big smile, folks.
Jessica Walrack (40:51):
For me, it just all comes down to building
trust.
As soon as I get a client, Ijust can't wait to win their
trust.
They're often kind of nervous.
At first.
They may be like, oh, make sureyou get the keywords in there,
make sure that this has headers,and I'm like, trust me, I got
this and so winning them over.
(41:13):
I just love that process andthen building that trust on an
ongoing basis.
It's meeting the deadlines,it's paying close attention.
If you run into a problem,reaching out to them and coming
up with a solution, asking themhow they might handle it.
All of that just helps to buildreally strong relationships
where they can see that youreally care, you're an expert,
you really know what you'redoing and you're putting 100%.
(41:36):
And then, on the flip side, isthat client really invested?
Are they paying close attentionand can we match in that way
where we're both really engaged?
Okay, this is match made inheaven and it can just go on and
be a really enjoyable workexperience.
Treasa Edmond (41:53):
It's finding that perfect fit and I think that's
important.
I look for that and I thinkevery other person I have talked
to who has built a trulysuccessful business, that was
one of the hallmarks for them isfinding the clients that were a
good fit and it matches anenergy and expectations and all
(42:13):
of the things have a desire towork with you.
Jessica Walrack (42:16):
Those are important and then they're your
advocate.
Then you have somebody outthere who knows you, knows you,
who trusts you, who's workedwith you for two years and you
never miss a deadline.
That's a powerful person tohave out in the world, and then
that person is going to writeyou testimonials and they're
going to recommend other peopleto you and all that stuff.
Treasa Edmond (42:34):
Jessica, we need to have you back because you
were in sales.
We need to have you back in thefuture and have a chat about
the buyer's journey and how thatrelates to freelancers, because
you just mentioned advocatesand that is the stage of the
buyer's journey that a lot ofbig businesses even forget about
.
For freelancers especially, Ithink it's absolutely vital
because that's where yourreferrals come from.
(42:54):
So, yes, that's a future topic.
We won't go into it today.
Thank you so much for beinghere with us, jessica.
We've really enjoyed it andjust absolute phenomenal advice.
I've enjoyed it.
Jessica Walrack (43:05):
Thank you so much for having me.
It's always fun to talk shopwith other people who have been
in this business for a long timeand we can just really get into
the nitty gritty corners of it.
All right, thank you so much.
Thank you.
Treasa Edmond (43:19):
Bye.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.