May 30, 2025 • 32 mins
Meadow Brook Theatre is looking to end their 2024-2025 season on a high note, with the return of a local favorite, Shear Madness! This play blends the exciting aspects of a whodunit with elements of humor, creating a unique experience for all who attend. There's nothing quite like Shear Madness currently in the local Michigan theater landscape, utilizing audiences as a part of the show, bringing Clue to life in a show that is different each time you see it. We're so excited to see this hilarious mystery return to Rochester once again, delivering that quality Meadow Brook Theatre experience that we've come to know and love. Ahead of the show's premiere, we sat down and spoke with two of its stars, Joseph Delguste and Francis Kelly, who have quite a history with this production!
In this exclusive Box Seat Babes interview, Delguste and Kelly discuss their time with Shear Madness and how it has led them to this specific regional production! Listen as they discuss what makes this whodunit such an interesting theatrical experience compared to other plays, and how involved the audience gets! How has this Meadow Brook production challenged each of them in their craft? Check out this interview to find out!
Find the video of this podcast on YouTube
For more Broadway coverage, visit Box Seat Babes
Follow us on social media @boxseatbabes or check out our Linktree!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
thank you so much you two for joining me today.
(00:02):
How are you two doing?
We're good.
Pretty good.
I mean, shouldn't speak for him, but I'm good.
I'm also good.
Okay.
We're glad to hear that.
After how many minutes of us having technical issues on both sides, I'm glad that wefinally got this figured out.
um But you're currently in rehearsal process for Shear Madness.
How has that been going so far?
How's it going, Francis?
we both like to be talking.
(00:23):
No, it's been going great.
We have natural chemistry, so that's good.
No, we...
um
We both have done the show before in fact we briefly got to do the show together in DC atthe Kennedy Center so it's uh And Joe I shouldn't speak for him, but Joe actually had
literally just left DC Yeah, it's it's been uh the show runs consistently at the KennedyCenter there And and I live you know across the river and have been working there off and
(00:49):
on for about the last five years or so um So the rehearsal process is kind of like it'syou know, it's old hat But it's like refining it with new people who bring in new energy
or new chemistry
to the show so that's always kind of fun to see how that shakes out.
and the last time I did the show was when we met in 22 so it's been a couple years for meI've been doing a couple other shows and so it's I'm revisiting which is and remembering
(01:19):
which is fun.
What would you say for the two of you would be more difficult?
Knowing this intimately you've done it so many times, Joe, or like to have a few yearsoff, Francis, and then revisiting it?
Is there like a difference to how you approach a project like this?
That is such a good question.
I feel like this show is unlike any other show I've ever done.
And so, um it's a bit of a roller coaster ride and you have to just get on and ride theride.
(01:47):
And so I feel like preparation for that is different than I would do on other shows.
You know what I mean?
I don't know that makes any sense.
um So I don't know if it would have mattered if I was in your shoes.
having just done it or because I I've had that experience of like doing it right after Ihad done it and then there being some space so Because I was actually well, we were both
(02:11):
we were both doing it in 2020 when the world shut down and So then in 2022 that was myreturn to it
So yeah, I don't know.
How do you feel about?
Yeah, well, I it's because the I mean, the show does it changes.
It changes every night because the audience participates.
And and so that is an element of the show that makes it it keeps it very fresh for me umand also, you know, keeps it from either in performance or in rehearsal, uh kind of
(02:41):
getting stale or or or becoming rote.
um And so that kind of like that change up in rhythm that you have to kind of be readyfor.
um is something that I enjoy rolling with ah in this show.
So what is Shear Madness about?
And Joe, I'll start with you.
What is this show about?
(03:02):
I know that you mentioned it changes a lot, but what's the, like the synopsis?
So the synopsis is uh a cast of six uh in a hair salon taking place today here inRochester.
um You meet them and then discover that there has been a murder.
uh As it is a whodunit, you have to discover there's a murder at some point.
(03:24):
um And then once the kind of structure of the murder mystery has taken over the play, theaudience comes in.
they try to piece apart what just happened ah and who did what and who was where uh andthen try and figure out who might have actually committed the crime.
(03:47):
ah And by the end of the night, we have a solution to that.
Yeah, that's pretty good.
And it's also funny.
It's not Agatha Christie.
Yeah, it's sort of a tribute parody to Agatha Christie murder mystery.
That's such a good way of saying it, yeah.
Because there's a bit of melodrama to it, but there's also a bit of camp to it as well.
(04:11):
It is set in...
A salon, as he said, it's my salon.
I play Tony Whitcomb and I have uh Barbara DiMarco who works for me.
And so you see the goings on in our salon.
And of course you remember that it's funny because...
I think arguably he is the most energetic character on the stage with probably the fastestjokes.
(04:39):
Right, thus the roller coaster.
We probably have two different perceptions of the show because of where it takes us andwhat we have to do, what's required of each of us.
I mean, so I love this idea of having like a whodunit because it kind of, gives me thatlike, uh I grew up playing Clue a lot, you know, and so getting to kind of solve that,
(05:02):
solve, getting to be a participant in that is such a cool concept.
You don't see that a lot in theater anymore.
Yeah, yeah, it's a rarity.
think like, it's like this show or the mystery of Edwin Drew.
Those are like the only two where I think you get to participate in the way that you do.
Although you get to participate in ours more.
(05:22):
Just saying.
That's true.
Yeah.
Without saying too much.
Absolutely.
Without saying too much.
Yeah.
Am I gonna have to get up on stage and act?
Because I have stage fright.
I can't do that.
I'm just kidding.
Listen, we can make no promises what's gonna happen on the night.
What I will say is, like I said, the cast of six, mean, unquestionably, the audience isthe seventh principal character in this show.
(05:47):
Where their role is at least as big as anyone who's on stage.
Right, right, right, right.
So Joe, who are you playing in this show and kind of how they factor into the narrative?
So I play Nick O'Brien, um who uh comes into the salon uh thinking that his day is goingto be a fairly normal one, and ends up getting blown completely out of proportion by the
(06:10):
murder.
um And so my job ends up being kind of trying to keep the whole show on the tracks whilethey're doing whatever they do.
That's true The literal and narrative straight man in in this particular comedy so yes, sonow that Now Yeah, so so, know it ends up kind of um I'm
(06:38):
one half lobbing opportunities at cast members to knock him down or I am being the heel ofthe joke when I need to be.
And I'm content with that.
No, no, it's important, you know when it comes to comedy, it's an important function andhe does it with deafness and humility.
(07:01):
My humility is marked in my health and gastric.
Like it's, I probably am humblest person that I've ever met.
Oh yeah.
What were you saying?
Back to you.
was perfect.
So it sounds like you're a little more of the straight lace character and then Francisyou're playing a little more of that energetic running around comedy style.
(07:27):
Is that correct?
absolutely.
I mean, I am running the show from the top and you know, you've entered Tony's kingdomwhen you show up at Shear Shear Madness is the name of the salon.
Shear.
Shear Madness.
(07:47):
Come on!
That's what I'm talking about.
see, that's where he was being the straight guy to my comedy weirdness.
But yeah, you get your steps in, no question.
yeah, yeah.
Probably more than anyone.
I don't really have to do cardio at the gym because of our rehearsals.
And I won't when we're doing the show, probably even more.
Because I cover a lot of ground in the salon.
(08:08):
I mean, I like that there's a variation of the comedy that you can expect because, I mean,different layers for different people, you know, and you can appreciate the physical
comedy of running around the stage, also the sounds like, I don't know what word to usehere, so correct me if I'm wrong, but Joe, sounds a little more like you're setting up
puns here, correct, with your character?
(08:30):
Yeah, mean it is kind of my job to know what the structure of the whole show is.
I don't know, this is gonna sound very noble and self-important, but I'm gonna go for it.
My job is...
(08:50):
What Joe?
My job is to make everyone else look good.
Oh, the breast.
And to give them the laughs that I will never get.
Oh jeez, come on.
I mean, you get your own, don't ya?
Occasionally.
Occasionally he gets a zinger, but it's very true.
(09:10):
is, I'm trying to think of like a comedy duo of like, cause you definitely set me up likenine times out of 10.
You know, like the idea of like the, like Who's Who and Abbott and Costello.
Habits the tall one, That makes me the chubby one.
(09:31):
Anyway, but the whole who's on, I'm the, and he's the, sets me up to be even wackier mostof the time.
That's kind of our dynamic, I would say.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Of course, every time I try and, you know, rake it back in, it just amplifies whateveryou're Yes, yes, that's true.
(09:52):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
I wish I could think of a parallel that like, there would be a good, you know, like-that's the whole thing.
That's why you're having trouble thinking of a parallel because there's nothing like it.
But, but even in like comedy duos, like, there, I feel like there's, there's a, it's anarchetypal kind of thing, what you and I bring, I feel like.
(10:14):
Except, well it's a little bit, well, it's a little bit The Bird Cage if you were RobinWilliams.
Yeah, a little bit.
But-
That's what I was getting from the comedy from here right now.
I was like, this is like the birdcage.
Maybe makes a little bit of Penn and Teller here, but like.
my god, it's so funny that you say that.
Our other castmate, we were just coming, we were in the car and I did something.
(10:36):
I couldn't get the windshield wiper to go.
And he was like, you pierced the toast.
And I was like, I pierced the toast.
And I was like, I should, yeah, I need to play that part.
It was literally just preference this morning.
ah So we kind of talked about this, what makes this show kind of super unique is thatthere is a lot of uh audience interaction.
(10:57):
What is that like for you as an actor compared to maybe like uh a traditional stage showwhere you don't have a lot of interaction with the audience?
I'll start.
I love it.
I come from a classical theater background, so I've come from Shakespeare festivals andwhat people usually think of as very serious theater.
(11:17):
But I love nothing more than when you get into a Shakespeare play and you're performing adirect address to the audience or during a monologue.
starts to get that energy and give you something back.
Whether it's something as simple as nods or just a hmmm, whatever as they start to getdrawn into the world.
(11:37):
um I really love that.
um
And one thing that is um that I'm looking forward to, think both of us are looking forwardto, because when we performed this show, uh in particular at the Kennedy Center, because
it's in the nation's capital where a lot of school groups go on their US history trips,you get a lot of school groups going through that show.
(11:59):
And when it's a bunch of middle schoolers, you perform a different show that's appropriatefor schoolers.
you pull back some of your humor to make sure that the school
board doesn't get upset.
um
And here we have a little bit more freedom to just kind of be more impulsive and a littlebit more adult with our jokes.
(12:24):
Adult, absolutely.
One might say blue.
And yeah, we literally had two different versions of the show that we would do in DC.
What do call it?
A and B?
A and B.
We had to do a B show because we're have a lot of student groups.
I didn't get...
I mean, I did.
Sometimes it would be Saturday night at nine o'clock and we would...
we get to do a more adult version of the show.
(12:46):
But to do it consistently, I think that's going to be our entire run, which will just belike for a full audience of uh adults rather than students.
I mean, my big thing is I've done some on-camera work, but I love audience response totheater.
(13:06):
Like, I love live theater.
And so I...
You know, and my background is varied in terms of, you know, actually classical musicals,comedy.
And I just feel like as I've gotten older, I've of been leaning more into the comedycomponent.
but regardless, I just think, what I think is so thrilling is at whatever level, theresponse of us all being in the room together.
(13:32):
This show takes it to another level.
Most people would be like, oh god, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh,
(14:00):
which I've done neither of.
But uh it has that exciting uh of the moment, know, Saturday night live, you know, we'relive on TV, but we're live in front of you, a moment, which I think is really fun for us
and for the audience.
(14:21):
I was gonna say that I uh was, recently, we recently saw Forbidden Broadway was here andhaving done a lot of traditional shows, like going to see a lot of traditional shows,
there was a lot more audience interaction.
I sitting there like, I don't know what I'm supposed to do here.
Like, am I supposed to be getting involved?
And so, you know, when you mentioned Francis about like that traditional relationship thatthere is some hesitation sometimes when you're used to like a traditional show to like,
(14:47):
how involved do I get here?
How much?
How excited do I get to be a part of this?
So um that has to add to that.
luckily, uh the participation is guided.
I'll say that, it's guided.
Yeah.
Without saying too much.
Sure, absolutely.
Don't we all?
(15:09):
Yeah, it's set up in the show very clearly to uh encourage the audience and to kind of, ifthere is a shell there to bring them out of, uh to get them out of that fairly quickly.
And when those moments should be it's yeah But it's funny I always you know, you'retalking about this and I always my poor sister I I was doing a production of schoolhouse
(15:33):
rock at the Fulton Opera House before it turned into the Fulton theater in LancasterPennsylvania and It was schoolhouse rock, know, like it was it was you know the songs from
Saturday mornings or whatever And I don't know why but I guess they built in like anaudience participation moment
during the locomotion, it's about the circulatory system.
(15:53):
And I went out and I got my sister and I pulled her up on stage and she was mortified.
And she was like, she was in a box seat, because it was this beautiful old like jewel boxtheater, and she was in like a box seat, and she was in a skirt.
I made her climb over the thing, and she always brings it up, and it's quite a bit, quitea years ago now.
(16:14):
But it's not gonna be that.
You're not gonna have to get on stage and do the locomotion.
I'll say that, but yeah.
I will hide my face if you come to find me.
You'd kind of mentioned that, you know, it's kind of like improv, kind of like stand up.
And I know that in the description that we were kind of given of the show, it says like upto minute spontaneous humor.
(16:38):
um Does it change on the fly?
Like, what does that mean?
uh Because to me, I thought improv.
That's like, you guys are gonna be doing a lot of improv on stage here.
So um the show itself has been running for 35 years at the Kennedy Center and in regionalproductions everywhere else.
um And so during that time, you've got certain things that have filtered out.
(17:05):
More audiences tend to follow this thread of the investigation, or more audiences tend togo here.
uh
what tends to be the important pieces that come to the surface.
um And so you can play into that.
And then of course, anytime that the show is produced, uh you go, right, where are we?
(17:25):
What are some local topics that are happening right now?
in the news, know, what pop culture icons are doing something embarrassing right now.
what's in the headlines.
Yeah, what can we throw in the show?
And sometimes that's something that we can, you when we come in as a cast to get ready todo the show, we can have a brief conversation about like, know, hey, I'd like to throw
(17:53):
this in here, you know, so let you know that that's coming at you.
And sometimes we don't get that.
someone has a place in the show where they could steer one three different directions andthey choose direction A.
And so now we know where that's going.
It is like a roller coaster because it does have rails.
(18:16):
Yes.
But we can kind of choose which track we're on and switch it on the fly in, I think, veryartful way.
Yeah.
And I think what we try to do in terms of the references...
whether it be locality or of the time, is to make it so that the audience is very awarethat we're here, we're here in the here and now, because that's such an important
(18:42):
component of the show.
And also, did you say you were a psychologist or a psychiatrist or either?
Which one?
Psychologist.
Psychologist.
Because it's kind of interesting, the...
The provenance.
Yeah, should we talk about that?
About the provenance.
I don't know if you know this.
(19:02):
You want to take it or...
Sure.
So the author of the show, Paul Portner, was a German sociologist.
uh And the show was originally written as this experiment that he was conducting.
um Which you know which tried to you know to give out these these this set of facts andsee you know how people would uh How people would react to certain things how they would
(19:30):
remember things?
You know because it because of course if you've got a certain set of events that play outbefore an audience of our theater holds up to just sort of 600 people yeah You might have
600 different remembrances of what happened
uh And so part of the show is kind of playing with that and going, okay, well, what do youremember?
(19:53):
Okay, well, but what did you see?
this person saw something totally different and so it really plays around with that, uhthat game of perception, which is cool.
Right, and the reason I was thinking to mention this to you is that when he was talkingabout the history of the show, that the show has been done uh famously for long periods of
(20:14):
time in Chicago, Boston, and DC, uh but also in other places regionally.
One of our cast members did it in Kansas City, was it Lennie or Kansas?
Somewhere in Kansas, I think Kansas City.
uh
uh the Doing this experiment ultimately.
Well, also we should say that Bruce Jordan who this adaptation is it's Paul Porter was theoriginal author but it was you know made to be funny and more entertaining uh by the
(20:41):
original creators Bruce and Marilyn and um And the people who were in the original castbut over time, you know, the experiment has been run so many times that there is now
I don't know, understanding of like how this could or would go.
but again, it depends on who's there.
And, but there's a lot of, um what would you see from a psychologist point of view?
(21:07):
There's a lot of data um that we can draw from, from previous production, know,performances slash productions that enable us to stay within the guardrails of the roller
coaster.
And get everyone back to their...
(21:27):
Yeah, yeah.
Well, and then sometimes they predict a pattern and it maybe go, you And then you dosomething else.
You never know.
You never know what to expect.
It sort of tickles the, you know, the classical theater, Funny Bone in Me, of like a veryold Italian comedia where you've got, you know, these characters where it's like everybody
(21:48):
knows who Pantalone is and what he'll do in this situation.
And so you just...
That's you.
The cloud.
And so you get this thing where you have this tremendous ability to play, you know,similar to light.
You know, you've got a coloring book and you know where the lines are, but you have a hugepalette of colors that you can use for that one picture that turns it into a different
(22:17):
piece of art every time.
Yep.
Well said.
Quote it.
I was gonna say it kind of reminds me of like when we were children and we had the, wellfor me it was Goosebumps.
It was like the choose your own ending Goosebumps.
Like no matter how you eventually got to an end by having a certain track, I kind of toldyou what to do but you still have a little bit of a choice within those tracks.
(22:37):
Yeah, yeah, or those, even before that, those choose your own adventure novels.
Yeah.
Was that what they were called?
Just choose your own adventure again?
They were, yeah.
Couldn't come up with anything shorter, I guess.
Go
It was just a tangent about Choose Your Own Adventure.
was a good sell.
Because I think Choose Your Own Adventure was like the original brand.
(22:59):
Yeah.
And like all the other books that did that style, they couldn't call it Choose Your OwnAdventure legally because it was copyrighted.
um But you still had that format.
Right.
then it was...
do this, turn to page four.
And then it was in the vernacular.
So then we think of them all as Choose Your Own Adventure, but it was actually the brandof the original.
It's like magic markers or Xerox.
Stop.
right now.
(23:21):
We're getting lessons here, life lessons.
huh, we are dropping.
um So with the tracks being what they are and you have kind of I'm assuming you probablyhave multiple endings because I know you get to kind of pick the killer how do you
approach a project where you have multiple endings and it could change every single nightlike like that does that add any like um For psychology terms does that add anxiety to the
(23:46):
show not knowing what your ending is gonna be every night?
It adds rehearsal time.
Sure.
It does, does, because we have to be prepared for various outcomes.
um anxiety?
I couldn't think of a better word.
My mind kept going to that.
(24:07):
No, and it's a valid point, it's a valid point.
um I have certainly, yes, experienced anxiety while doing this show.
But, um for the most part...
It's why it's fun to do it because it is, you don't, as Joe I think said earlier, like youdon't get into any kind of rut.
(24:31):
Like you don't get, it's not like, oh, here we do it again.
You know what mean?
Like it's never, it's literally never the same.
You know, so you're on your toes.
It's a show that keeps you on your toes.
Both on stage and off, I'd say.
Yeah, I think so.
Although I guess the audience would be seated, but they could have their toes down, theirheels up.
(24:52):
They could.
That's an odd way to sit, but yeah, they could.
I kind of always sit that way.
Right?
Sometimes my, mean, depending on the height of the chair, sometimes my heels can't touchthe ground.
I'm diminutive compared to him.
Um
you can tell in this frame.
Yeah, you guys are the same height.
(25:13):
I don't know what you're talking about.
uh
You should see the legs.
should see the legs.
His legs are...
My tree trunks, they're twice the size of mine.
Twice the length.
Torso.
Where it might be matched in the torso area.
Nothing wrong with that.
um What has been perhaps maybe the biggest challenge on this production, the Meadow brookproduction of uh Shear Madness for you?
(25:35):
I I honestly, think it's, um the interesting thing is coming in and the, so both of ushave worked on the DC production.
um And here at Meadow brook, it's, there are literally different dimensions to the stage.
um So it's the same, it's the same shop and we're dealing with, you know, the same like,
(25:57):
Tony's barber station is here, and then here's the chair, and the sink is over here.
But it's just that little kind of uncanny valley thing where it's like, is a half stepfurther to get to this.
Or it's just a little bit uh different depth of the stage.
the...
oh
(26:18):
Or in some cases, the fact that uh in DC, the audience is fully on three sides versushere, it's more of a traditional theater where it's kind of, there's a little bit of a
curve, but it's not as profound.
More proscenium than thrust, whereas it's thrust in DC.
um So kind of just adapting um the way we interact with the shop uh is, you know,
(26:49):
And the fact that there was another show running here while we've been rehearsing so wehaven't been rehearsing on the full set.
uh You know, we're very excited to get doors.
Yes, are a huge part of the show.
It's farcical in that way, yeah, and we are on the precipice of being in our techrehearsals where we will move to the stage and then work on that component of the show.
(27:11):
ah Yeah, I think that's a really good point.
I also, you know, the other thing about this show that's so unique because ultimately it'ssuch a weird thing to think about, but because it has been running so long, it still
exists as an entity.
And so the people who created it are very...
(27:32):
um
I don't mean to use this as a bad word, but like proprietary about it.
And so as a result, they wanted to remain consistent wherever it's done.
And so they actually have people come to DC.
uh
you learn the show as it's intended so that when you do it regionally, it comes off thatway.
So our director, Travis, the artistic director here at Meadow brook, did that, I believein 2017, prior to the first time it was staged here at Meadow brook in 2017.
(28:01):
So, and now, ultimately, even though some of the members of the company are different,it's a remount of sorts.
uh
But what's I think interesting and sort of challenging about that is that there's so muchbecause it is so consistent, there's so much familiarity, you know, but then like
(28:22):
something like Joseph, like the dimensions being slightly different are like, oh, I'm notmaking it over to that chair.
I always used to make it over to that chair.
And then, or, you know, or the...
I'm not gonna say that because that might give something away, but uh there's some thingsthat like work a little differently and I'm like, oh I gotta retrain my body because
that's not exactly the same as it was in the other.
(28:44):
Not that it should be, but there's the show is definitely not reinvented.
So there is this feeling that one, when a person sees this show or I tell someone thatI've done the show and they're like, yeah, I saw that when I was a student, you know, on
my student class trip in DC.
that they're seeing the same show in an interesting way.
Because there's very, you know, they talk about long Broadway runs and there's a list ofwho's, But this is on, what's the word I wanna use?
(29:12):
unprecedented?
That's it!
Unprecedented.
I mean, it used to be the Fantastics, right?
But I think this one kicks the Fantastics ass.
it's...
Because that obviously has closed and well then tried to reopen and all that jazz.
But it's ultimately, we're kind of still doing the show that was originally created 35, 40years ago?
(29:38):
So...
40, yeah.
You know Lake George Boston was like 40, right?
Yeah, if you go back to Boston Yeah, yeah, cuz I I had a run not a run-in but like almostdoing the show I want to say in 2007 and I think that was the 25th anniversary at Lake
George Something like that which water and we're 18 years past that so gosh, that would bewhat is that?
(30:04):
That's 43.
Oh wow, so maybe even longer than that
if my math is right, if I'm saying the right date.
So it's just, uh you'd think, it'd be like, just jump into the same show, but that addscomplications too, because it's not, and much like we've talked about with the specificity
(30:27):
and the of the moment.
You know, things change.
it's not Yeah, and that's right.
Because I've rehearsed into uh Disney shows that are very set.
Yes.
When I did a contract with them.
it's like, well, you know where all the beats are, and you're blocked to go here, and yousing this song, and this is the choreography for that.
(30:48):
um And there's only so much of that that you can do.
There's only so much you can set in a show like this.
Because...
you invite all the variations from the audience.
um And I love that.
um know that there are actors I've worked with in other shows, in this show, where, likeyou were saying earlier about the anxiety of that, that it does, really kind of unsettles
(31:17):
them to not, it's like, wanna know where it's headed.
It's like just.
Go.
on the ride.
Yeah, and I thrive on that.
Me too.
What?
Get on the ride?
Yeah.
No, no, do you know that story?
Sorry, that's a whole side story.
My aunt used to say that like we were at the...
(31:37):
And I think it's a wonderful metaphor for life.
know, theater as life.
But my aunt, we were at an amusement park once.
And I forget which one of it was.
were like, I'm scared, I don't want to go on the roller coaster.
And she was like, get on the ride.
And I told that story to my friend and like he brings it up all the time.
And it's funny.
Like it was, you know, I haven't given it its full due, but in telling the anecdote.
(31:59):
the...
I just think it's
so indicative of everything.
Life's a ride, right?
And so I would prefer to do a show like this where it's like, get on the ride, becausethat's what we're doing every day.
We're just making it up as we go along.
You know what mean?
Get on the ride.
Get on the ride.
Anyway, I just blew his mind.
(32:21):
It sounds like cast, crew, audiences are all gonna be on a ride when it comes to Meadowbrook's Shear Madness, so we're really excited for it.
We're excited to bring it to you.
Yes, we are.
Shear Madness runs at Meadow brook Theatre on May 28th through June 22nd so get yourtickets now and we'll see you there.
thank you so much you two for joining me today.
(00:02):
How are you two doing?
We're good.
Pretty good.
I mean, shouldn't speak for him, but I'm good.
I'm also good.
Okay.
We're glad to hear that.
After how many minutes of us having technical issues on both sides, I'm glad that wefinally got this figured out.
um But you're currently in rehearsal process for Shear Madness.
How has that been going so far?
How's it going, Francis?
we both like to be talking.
(00:23):
No, it's been going great.
We have natural chemistry, so that's good.
No, we...
um
We both have done the show before in fact we briefly got to do the show together in DC atthe Kennedy Center so it's uh And Joe I shouldn't speak for him, but Joe actually had
literally just left DC Yeah, it's it's been uh the show runs consistently at the KennedyCenter there And and I live you know across the river and have been working there off and
(00:49):
on for about the last five years or so um So the rehearsal process is kind of like it'syou know, it's old hat But it's like refining it with new people who bring in new energy
or new chemistry
to the show so that's always kind of fun to see how that shakes out.
and the last time I did the show was when we met in 22 so it's been a couple years for meI've been doing a couple other shows and so it's I'm revisiting which is and remembering
(01:19):
which is fun.
What would you say for the two of you would be more difficult?
Knowing this intimately you've done it so many times, Joe, or like to have a few yearsoff, Francis, and then revisiting it?
Is there like a difference to how you approach a project like this?
That is such a good question.
I feel like this show is unlike any other show I've ever done.
And so, um it's a bit of a roller coaster ride and you have to just get on and ride theride.
(01:47):
And so I feel like preparation for that is different than I would do on other shows.
You know what I mean?
I don't know that makes any sense.
um So I don't know if it would have mattered if I was in your shoes.
having just done it or because I I've had that experience of like doing it right after Ihad done it and then there being some space so Because I was actually well, we were both
(02:11):
we were both doing it in 2020 when the world shut down and So then in 2022 that was myreturn to it
So yeah, I don't know.
How do you feel about?
Yeah, well, I it's because the I mean, the show does it changes.
It changes every night because the audience participates.
And and so that is an element of the show that makes it it keeps it very fresh for me umand also, you know, keeps it from either in performance or in rehearsal, uh kind of
(02:41):
getting stale or or or becoming rote.
um And so that kind of like that change up in rhythm that you have to kind of be readyfor.
um is something that I enjoy rolling with ah in this show.
So what is Shear Madness about?
And Joe, I'll start with you.
What is this show about?
(03:02):
I know that you mentioned it changes a lot, but what's the, like the synopsis?
So the synopsis is uh a cast of six uh in a hair salon taking place today here inRochester.
um You meet them and then discover that there has been a murder.
uh As it is a whodunit, you have to discover there's a murder at some point.
(03:24):
um And then once the kind of structure of the murder mystery has taken over the play, theaudience comes in.
they try to piece apart what just happened ah and who did what and who was where uh andthen try and figure out who might have actually committed the crime.
(03:47):
ah And by the end of the night, we have a solution to that.
Yeah, that's pretty good.
And it's also funny.
It's not Agatha Christie.
Yeah, it's sort of a tribute parody to Agatha Christie murder mystery.
That's such a good way of saying it, yeah.
Because there's a bit of melodrama to it, but there's also a bit of camp to it as well.
(04:11):
It is set in...
A salon, as he said, it's my salon.
I play Tony Whitcomb and I have uh Barbara DiMarco who works for me.
And so you see the goings on in our salon.
And of course you remember that it's funny because...
I think arguably he is the most energetic character on the stage with probably the fastestjokes.
(04:39):
Right, thus the roller coaster.
We probably have two different perceptions of the show because of where it takes us andwhat we have to do, what's required of each of us.
I mean, so I love this idea of having like a whodunit because it kind of, gives me thatlike, uh I grew up playing Clue a lot, you know, and so getting to kind of solve that,
(05:02):
solve, getting to be a participant in that is such a cool concept.
You don't see that a lot in theater anymore.
Yeah, yeah, it's a rarity.
think like, it's like this show or the mystery of Edwin Drew.
Those are like the only two where I think you get to participate in the way that you do.
Although you get to participate in ours more.
(05:22):
Just saying.
That's true.
Yeah.
Without saying too much.
Absolutely.
Without saying too much.
Yeah.
Am I gonna have to get up on stage and act?
Because I have stage fright.
I can't do that.
I'm just kidding.
Listen, we can make no promises what's gonna happen on the night.
What I will say is, like I said, the cast of six, mean, unquestionably, the audience isthe seventh principal character in this show.
(05:47):
Where their role is at least as big as anyone who's on stage.
Right, right, right, right.
So Joe, who are you playing in this show and kind of how they factor into the narrative?
So I play Nick O'Brien, um who uh comes into the salon uh thinking that his day is goingto be a fairly normal one, and ends up getting blown completely out of proportion by the
(06:10):
murder.
um And so my job ends up being kind of trying to keep the whole show on the tracks whilethey're doing whatever they do.
That's true The literal and narrative straight man in in this particular comedy so yes, sonow that Now Yeah, so so, know it ends up kind of um I'm
(06:38):
one half lobbing opportunities at cast members to knock him down or I am being the heel ofthe joke when I need to be.
And I'm content with that.
No, no, it's important, you know when it comes to comedy, it's an important function andhe does it with deafness and humility.
(07:01):
My humility is marked in my health and gastric.
Like it's, I probably am humblest person that I've ever met.
Oh yeah.
What were you saying?
Back to you.
was perfect.
So it sounds like you're a little more of the straight lace character and then Francisyou're playing a little more of that energetic running around comedy style.
(07:27):
Is that correct?
absolutely.
I mean, I am running the show from the top and you know, you've entered Tony's kingdomwhen you show up at Shear Shear Madness is the name of the salon.
Shear.
Shear Madness.
(07:47):
Come on!
That's what I'm talking about.
see, that's where he was being the straight guy to my comedy weirdness.
But yeah, you get your steps in, no question.
yeah, yeah.
Probably more than anyone.
I don't really have to do cardio at the gym because of our rehearsals.
And I won't when we're doing the show, probably even more.
Because I cover a lot of ground in the salon.
(08:08):
I mean, I like that there's a variation of the comedy that you can expect because, I mean,different layers for different people, you know, and you can appreciate the physical
comedy of running around the stage, also the sounds like, I don't know what word to usehere, so correct me if I'm wrong, but Joe, sounds a little more like you're setting up
puns here, correct, with your character?
(08:30):
Yeah, mean it is kind of my job to know what the structure of the whole show is.
I don't know, this is gonna sound very noble and self-important, but I'm gonna go for it.
My job is...
(08:50):
What Joe?
My job is to make everyone else look good.
Oh, the breast.
And to give them the laughs that I will never get.
Oh jeez, come on.
I mean, you get your own, don't ya?
Occasionally.
Occasionally he gets a zinger, but it's very true.
(09:10):
is, I'm trying to think of like a comedy duo of like, cause you definitely set me up likenine times out of 10.
You know, like the idea of like the, like Who's Who and Abbott and Costello.
Habits the tall one, That makes me the chubby one.
(09:31):
Anyway, but the whole who's on, I'm the, and he's the, sets me up to be even wackier mostof the time.
That's kind of our dynamic, I would say.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Of course, every time I try and, you know, rake it back in, it just amplifies whateveryou're Yes, yes, that's true.
(09:52):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
I wish I could think of a parallel that like, there would be a good, you know, like-that's the whole thing.
That's why you're having trouble thinking of a parallel because there's nothing like it.
But, but even in like comedy duos, like, there, I feel like there's, there's a, it's anarchetypal kind of thing, what you and I bring, I feel like.
(10:14):
Except, well it's a little bit, well, it's a little bit The Bird Cage if you were RobinWilliams.
Yeah, a little bit.
But-
That's what I was getting from the comedy from here right now.
I was like, this is like the birdcage.
Maybe makes a little bit of Penn and Teller here, but like.
my god, it's so funny that you say that.
Our other castmate, we were just coming, we were in the car and I did something.
(10:36):
I couldn't get the windshield wiper to go.
And he was like, you pierced the toast.
And I was like, I pierced the toast.
And I was like, I should, yeah, I need to play that part.
It was literally just preference this morning.
ah So we kind of talked about this, what makes this show kind of super unique is thatthere is a lot of uh audience interaction.
(10:57):
What is that like for you as an actor compared to maybe like uh a traditional stage showwhere you don't have a lot of interaction with the audience?
I'll start.
I love it.
I come from a classical theater background, so I've come from Shakespeare festivals andwhat people usually think of as very serious theater.
(11:17):
But I love nothing more than when you get into a Shakespeare play and you're performing adirect address to the audience or during a monologue.
starts to get that energy and give you something back.
Whether it's something as simple as nods or just a hmmm, whatever as they start to getdrawn into the world.
(11:37):
um I really love that.
um
And one thing that is um that I'm looking forward to, think both of us are looking forwardto, because when we performed this show, uh in particular at the Kennedy Center, because
it's in the nation's capital where a lot of school groups go on their US history trips,you get a lot of school groups going through that show.
(11:59):
And when it's a bunch of middle schoolers, you perform a different show that's appropriatefor schoolers.
you pull back some of your humor to make sure that the school
board doesn't get upset.
um
And here we have a little bit more freedom to just kind of be more impulsive and a littlebit more adult with our jokes.
(12:24):
Adult, absolutely.
One might say blue.
And yeah, we literally had two different versions of the show that we would do in DC.
What do call it?
A and B?
A and B.
We had to do a B show because we're have a lot of student groups.
I didn't get...
I mean, I did.
Sometimes it would be Saturday night at nine o'clock and we would...
we get to do a more adult version of the show.
(12:46):
But to do it consistently, I think that's going to be our entire run, which will just belike for a full audience of uh adults rather than students.
I mean, my big thing is I've done some on-camera work, but I love audience response totheater.
(13:06):
Like, I love live theater.
And so I...
You know, and my background is varied in terms of, you know, actually classical musicals,comedy.
And I just feel like as I've gotten older, I've of been leaning more into the comedycomponent.
but regardless, I just think, what I think is so thrilling is at whatever level, theresponse of us all being in the room together.
(13:32):
This show takes it to another level.
Most people would be like, oh god, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh,
(14:00):
which I've done neither of.
But uh it has that exciting uh of the moment, know, Saturday night live, you know, we'relive on TV, but we're live in front of you, a moment, which I think is really fun for us
and for the audience.
(14:21):
I was gonna say that I uh was, recently, we recently saw Forbidden Broadway was here andhaving done a lot of traditional shows, like going to see a lot of traditional shows,
there was a lot more audience interaction.
I sitting there like, I don't know what I'm supposed to do here.
Like, am I supposed to be getting involved?
And so, you know, when you mentioned Francis about like that traditional relationship thatthere is some hesitation sometimes when you're used to like a traditional show to like,
(14:47):
how involved do I get here?
How much?
How excited do I get to be a part of this?
So um that has to add to that.
luckily, uh the participation is guided.
I'll say that, it's guided.
Yeah.
Without saying too much.
Sure, absolutely.
Don't we all?
(15:09):
Yeah, it's set up in the show very clearly to uh encourage the audience and to kind of, ifthere is a shell there to bring them out of, uh to get them out of that fairly quickly.
And when those moments should be it's yeah But it's funny I always you know, you'retalking about this and I always my poor sister I I was doing a production of schoolhouse
(15:33):
rock at the Fulton Opera House before it turned into the Fulton theater in LancasterPennsylvania and It was schoolhouse rock, know, like it was it was you know the songs from
Saturday mornings or whatever And I don't know why but I guess they built in like anaudience participation moment
during the locomotion, it's about the circulatory system.
(15:53):
And I went out and I got my sister and I pulled her up on stage and she was mortified.
And she was like, she was in a box seat, because it was this beautiful old like jewel boxtheater, and she was in like a box seat, and she was in a skirt.
I made her climb over the thing, and she always brings it up, and it's quite a bit, quitea years ago now.
(16:14):
But it's not gonna be that.
You're not gonna have to get on stage and do the locomotion.
I'll say that, but yeah.
I will hide my face if you come to find me.
You'd kind of mentioned that, you know, it's kind of like improv, kind of like stand up.
And I know that in the description that we were kind of given of the show, it says like upto minute spontaneous humor.
(16:38):
um Does it change on the fly?
Like, what does that mean?
uh Because to me, I thought improv.
That's like, you guys are gonna be doing a lot of improv on stage here.
So um the show itself has been running for 35 years at the Kennedy Center and in regionalproductions everywhere else.
um And so during that time, you've got certain things that have filtered out.
(17:05):
More audiences tend to follow this thread of the investigation, or more audiences tend togo here.
uh
what tends to be the important pieces that come to the surface.
um And so you can play into that.
And then of course, anytime that the show is produced, uh you go, right, where are we?
(17:25):
What are some local topics that are happening right now?
in the news, know, what pop culture icons are doing something embarrassing right now.
what's in the headlines.
Yeah, what can we throw in the show?
And sometimes that's something that we can, you when we come in as a cast to get ready todo the show, we can have a brief conversation about like, know, hey, I'd like to throw
(17:53):
this in here, you know, so let you know that that's coming at you.
And sometimes we don't get that.
someone has a place in the show where they could steer one three different directions andthey choose direction A.
And so now we know where that's going.
It is like a roller coaster because it does have rails.
(18:16):
Yes.
But we can kind of choose which track we're on and switch it on the fly in, I think, veryartful way.
Yeah.
And I think what we try to do in terms of the references...
whether it be locality or of the time, is to make it so that the audience is very awarethat we're here, we're here in the here and now, because that's such an important
(18:42):
component of the show.
And also, did you say you were a psychologist or a psychiatrist or either?
Which one?
Psychologist.
Psychologist.
Because it's kind of interesting, the...
The provenance.
Yeah, should we talk about that?
About the provenance.
I don't know if you know this.
(19:02):
You want to take it or...
Sure.
So the author of the show, Paul Portner, was a German sociologist.
uh And the show was originally written as this experiment that he was conducting.
um Which you know which tried to you know to give out these these this set of facts andsee you know how people would uh How people would react to certain things how they would
(19:30):
remember things?
You know because it because of course if you've got a certain set of events that play outbefore an audience of our theater holds up to just sort of 600 people yeah You might have
600 different remembrances of what happened
uh And so part of the show is kind of playing with that and going, okay, well, what do youremember?
(19:53):
Okay, well, but what did you see?
this person saw something totally different and so it really plays around with that, uhthat game of perception, which is cool.
Right, and the reason I was thinking to mention this to you is that when he was talkingabout the history of the show, that the show has been done uh famously for long periods of
(20:14):
time in Chicago, Boston, and DC, uh but also in other places regionally.
One of our cast members did it in Kansas City, was it Lennie or Kansas?
Somewhere in Kansas, I think Kansas City.
uh
uh the Doing this experiment ultimately.
Well, also we should say that Bruce Jordan who this adaptation is it's Paul Porter was theoriginal author but it was you know made to be funny and more entertaining uh by the
(20:41):
original creators Bruce and Marilyn and um And the people who were in the original castbut over time, you know, the experiment has been run so many times that there is now
I don't know, understanding of like how this could or would go.
but again, it depends on who's there.
And, but there's a lot of, um what would you see from a psychologist point of view?
(21:07):
There's a lot of data um that we can draw from, from previous production, know,performances slash productions that enable us to stay within the guardrails of the roller
coaster.
And get everyone back to their...
(21:27):
Yeah, yeah.
Well, and then sometimes they predict a pattern and it maybe go, you And then you dosomething else.
You never know.
You never know what to expect.
It sort of tickles the, you know, the classical theater, Funny Bone in Me, of like a veryold Italian comedia where you've got, you know, these characters where it's like everybody
(21:48):
knows who Pantalone is and what he'll do in this situation.
And so you just...
That's you.
The cloud.
And so you get this thing where you have this tremendous ability to play, you know,similar to light.
You know, you've got a coloring book and you know where the lines are, but you have a hugepalette of colors that you can use for that one picture that turns it into a different
(22:17):
piece of art every time.
Yep.
Well said.
Quote it.
I was gonna say it kind of reminds me of like when we were children and we had the, wellfor me it was Goosebumps.
It was like the choose your own ending Goosebumps.
Like no matter how you eventually got to an end by having a certain track, I kind of toldyou what to do but you still have a little bit of a choice within those tracks.
(22:37):
Yeah, yeah, or those, even before that, those choose your own adventure novels.
Yeah.
Was that what they were called?
Just choose your own adventure again?
They were, yeah.
Couldn't come up with anything shorter, I guess.
Go
It was just a tangent about Choose Your Own Adventure.
was a good sell.
Because I think Choose Your Own Adventure was like the original brand.
(22:59):
Yeah.
And like all the other books that did that style, they couldn't call it Choose Your OwnAdventure legally because it was copyrighted.
um But you still had that format.
Right.
then it was...
do this, turn to page four.
And then it was in the vernacular.
So then we think of them all as Choose Your Own Adventure, but it was actually the brandof the original.
It's like magic markers or Xerox.
Stop.
right now.
(23:21):
We're getting lessons here, life lessons.
huh, we are dropping.
um So with the tracks being what they are and you have kind of I'm assuming you probablyhave multiple endings because I know you get to kind of pick the killer how do you
approach a project where you have multiple endings and it could change every single nightlike like that does that add any like um For psychology terms does that add anxiety to the
(23:46):
show not knowing what your ending is gonna be every night?
It adds rehearsal time.
Sure.
It does, does, because we have to be prepared for various outcomes.
um anxiety?
I couldn't think of a better word.
My mind kept going to that.
(24:07):
No, and it's a valid point, it's a valid point.
um I have certainly, yes, experienced anxiety while doing this show.
But, um for the most part...
It's why it's fun to do it because it is, you don't, as Joe I think said earlier, like youdon't get into any kind of rut.
(24:31):
Like you don't get, it's not like, oh, here we do it again.
You know what mean?
Like it's never, it's literally never the same.
You know, so you're on your toes.
It's a show that keeps you on your toes.
Both on stage and off, I'd say.
Yeah, I think so.
Although I guess the audience would be seated, but they could have their toes down, theirheels up.
(24:52):
They could.
That's an odd way to sit, but yeah, they could.
I kind of always sit that way.
Right?
Sometimes my, mean, depending on the height of the chair, sometimes my heels can't touchthe ground.
I'm diminutive compared to him.
Um
you can tell in this frame.
Yeah, you guys are the same height.
(25:13):
I don't know what you're talking about.
uh
You should see the legs.
should see the legs.
His legs are...
My tree trunks, they're twice the size of mine.
Twice the length.
Torso.
Where it might be matched in the torso area.
Nothing wrong with that.
um What has been perhaps maybe the biggest challenge on this production, the Meadow brookproduction of uh Shear Madness for you?
(25:35):
I I honestly, think it's, um the interesting thing is coming in and the, so both of ushave worked on the DC production.
um And here at Meadow brook, it's, there are literally different dimensions to the stage.
um So it's the same, it's the same shop and we're dealing with, you know, the same like,
(25:57):
Tony's barber station is here, and then here's the chair, and the sink is over here.
But it's just that little kind of uncanny valley thing where it's like, is a half stepfurther to get to this.
Or it's just a little bit uh different depth of the stage.
the...
oh
(26:18):
Or in some cases, the fact that uh in DC, the audience is fully on three sides versushere, it's more of a traditional theater where it's kind of, there's a little bit of a
curve, but it's not as profound.
More proscenium than thrust, whereas it's thrust in DC.
um So kind of just adapting um the way we interact with the shop uh is, you know,
(26:49):
And the fact that there was another show running here while we've been rehearsing so wehaven't been rehearsing on the full set.
uh You know, we're very excited to get doors.
Yes, are a huge part of the show.
It's farcical in that way, yeah, and we are on the precipice of being in our techrehearsals where we will move to the stage and then work on that component of the show.
(27:11):
ah Yeah, I think that's a really good point.
I also, you know, the other thing about this show that's so unique because ultimately it'ssuch a weird thing to think about, but because it has been running so long, it still
exists as an entity.
And so the people who created it are very...
(27:32):
um
I don't mean to use this as a bad word, but like proprietary about it.
And so as a result, they wanted to remain consistent wherever it's done.
And so they actually have people come to DC.
uh
you learn the show as it's intended so that when you do it regionally, it comes off thatway.
So our director, Travis, the artistic director here at Meadow brook, did that, I believein 2017, prior to the first time it was staged here at Meadow brook in 2017.
(28:01):
So, and now, ultimately, even though some of the members of the company are different,it's a remount of sorts.
uh
But what's I think interesting and sort of challenging about that is that there's so muchbecause it is so consistent, there's so much familiarity, you know, but then like
(28:22):
something like Joseph, like the dimensions being slightly different are like, oh, I'm notmaking it over to that chair.
I always used to make it over to that chair.
And then, or, you know, or the...
I'm not gonna say that because that might give something away, but uh there's some thingsthat like work a little differently and I'm like, oh I gotta retrain my body because
that's not exactly the same as it was in the other.
(28:44):
Not that it should be, but there's the show is definitely not reinvented.
So there is this feeling that one, when a person sees this show or I tell someone thatI've done the show and they're like, yeah, I saw that when I was a student, you know, on
my student class trip in DC.
that they're seeing the same show in an interesting way.
Because there's very, you know, they talk about long Broadway runs and there's a list ofwho's, But this is on, what's the word I wanna use?
(29:12):
unprecedented?
That's it!
Unprecedented.
I mean, it used to be the Fantastics, right?
But I think this one kicks the Fantastics ass.
it's...
Because that obviously has closed and well then tried to reopen and all that jazz.
But it's ultimately, we're kind of still doing the show that was originally created 35, 40years ago?
(29:38):
So...
40, yeah.
You know Lake George Boston was like 40, right?
Yeah, if you go back to Boston Yeah, yeah, cuz I I had a run not a run-in but like almostdoing the show I want to say in 2007 and I think that was the 25th anniversary at Lake
George Something like that which water and we're 18 years past that so gosh, that would bewhat is that?
(30:04):
That's 43.
Oh wow, so maybe even longer than that
if my math is right, if I'm saying the right date.
So it's just, uh you'd think, it'd be like, just jump into the same show, but that addscomplications too, because it's not, and much like we've talked about with the specificity
(30:27):
and the of the moment.
You know, things change.
it's not Yeah, and that's right.
Because I've rehearsed into uh Disney shows that are very set.
Yes.
When I did a contract with them.
it's like, well, you know where all the beats are, and you're blocked to go here, and yousing this song, and this is the choreography for that.
(30:48):
um And there's only so much of that that you can do.
There's only so much you can set in a show like this.
Because...
you invite all the variations from the audience.
um And I love that.
um know that there are actors I've worked with in other shows, in this show, where, likeyou were saying earlier about the anxiety of that, that it does, really kind of unsettles
(31:17):
them to not, it's like, wanna know where it's headed.
It's like just.
Go.
on the ride.
Yeah, and I thrive on that.
Me too.
What?
Get on the ride?
Yeah.
No, no, do you know that story?
Sorry, that's a whole side story.
My aunt used to say that like we were at the...
(31:37):
And I think it's a wonderful metaphor for life.
know, theater as life.
But my aunt, we were at an amusement park once.
And I forget which one of it was.
were like, I'm scared, I don't want to go on the roller coaster.
And she was like, get on the ride.
And I told that story to my friend and like he brings it up all the time.
And it's funny.
Like it was, you know, I haven't given it its full due, but in telling the anecdote.
(31:59):
the...
I just think it's
so indicative of everything.
Life's a ride, right?
And so I would prefer to do a show like this where it's like, get on the ride, becausethat's what we're doing every day.
We're just making it up as we go along.
You know what mean?
Get on the ride.
Get on the ride.
Anyway, I just blew his mind.
(32:21):
It sounds like cast, crew, audiences are all gonna be on a ride when it comes to Meadowbrook's Shear Madness, so we're really excited for it.
We're excited to bring it to you.
Yes, we are.
Shear Madness runs at Meadow brook Theatre on May 28th through June 22nd so get yourtickets now and we'll see you there.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.