March 8, 2025 • 17 mins
The Ringwald Theatre over in Ferndale, MI, has never shied away from the stories they tell, and their latest show, Cock, is no exception. An intimate look into sexuality and how attraction and love change over time, Cock shines a light on relationships of all kinds and how complicated they can be. Director Joe Bailey has created something special for The Ringwald, as this show is something unlike you've never seen before. Prior to the opening night, we spoke with one of the cast members of the show, Stebert Davenport, about his time on this production!
In this exclusive Box Seat Babes interview, Stebert Davenport talks about what drew him to Cock (because how to do you turn away a script with a title like that!), how he has built his character of John, and how his journey with sexuality has changed in reflection with his character. Listen as Brian Kitson and Davenport explore gender, sexuality, and the debate between nature and nurture in the development with the former two. Which themes from Cock resonate the most with the actor? What is he hoping audiences walk away from this production with? Listen to this thoughtful interview to hear all these answers and more about this current Ringwald Theatre show!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Thank you so much for joining me today, Stebert.
How are you doing?
I'm doing very well, Brian.
Thank you very much.
Opening night is tomorrow and we are super, super excited.
Thank you for taking the time.
How has the rehearsal process for Cock been so far?
It has been super quick, but it has come together so fast and the play moves so fast.
So there's so much energy in the room and quick and energetic.
(00:24):
And I think the play is going to reflect that.
I was going say, surprises me none at all that the Ringwald has such a quick and energeticplay.
Their plays are so fantastic and they do a lot of great work, but they are very, they keepyou on your toes.
I think so too.
think Joe Bailey and Brandy Joe do a great job of choosing plays that drive really fastand have a lot of high energy, but they somehow find plays that aren't only just high
(00:51):
energy, they also make you think a lot when you leave too.
So it's like the perfect mix.
100%.
How familiar were you with the show before being cast in it?
I wasn't too familiar with it, although I did read it once in university, in grad school,and I performed a scene from it in grad school.
And that was like, gosh, seven years ago maybe or something like that.
(01:16):
And then Joe sent me the script and I got to the scene that I was, my gosh, I think I knowthis play.
So I knew it a little bit, but not nearly in the intimacy that I've got to know it now.
Well, that's awesome that you got a little bit of familiarity with it in grad school.
And also, don't carbon date us too much here now.
(01:37):
Yeah, absolutely.
Neither one of us graduated that long ago.
So what is the story of Cock and then how does your character factor into it?
So the story of cock centers around a gentleman named John and I play John and John isexploring his identity.
(02:00):
This play is about sexual identity but it is also about relationships.
So John is both struggling to understand if this is relationship that he wants to stay inwhile also wondering if
if he's discovering a new side of himself.
So I think he's looking to explore.
(02:22):
He's looking for freedom.
I mean, that's kind of an exciting thing to probably as an actor to explore is just thisidentity of freedom in this character and finding an identity which is important for both
the character and the human playing them.
I agree and it's one of the great things where it's made me ask so many questions aboutmyself and I came out as bisexual like in my early to mid 20s and this play is even making
(02:51):
me ask new questions that I haven't asked before and wondering things about the past thatI hadn't wondered before so it's definitely making me do a little bit of introspection on
myself as well.
I love that.
Is that hard at all?
I'm a psychologist during my day job, so I just always wonder about that.
As you're developing this character and you're having those intersective questions, I'msure that helps to develop the character even more, but is that hard to have those
(03:15):
reflections on yourself?
It is because sometimes I want to have an answer for the character John, but I don't havethe answer for myself.
And so I don't really know how to fill in some of the gaps.
There are times when a character will be going through something that I have gone throughand went through and kind of know how it feels to get out on the other side.
And then there are moments in this play where John has some open-ended questions where Istill have some open-ended questions and...
(03:41):
Just as much as I want to figure it out for him on stage, I'm now wondering about myselfas I'm driving to rehearsal and driving home from rehearsal.
like, for example, I think I've been bi my whole life, but really came to terms with it,you know, in my twenties.
And then there was like a month last year where I panicked.
said, am I straight?
(04:02):
Am I straight?
And I haven't known this whole time.
Well, anyway, John is very similar.
He's had the same identity he thinks through his whole life.
And he has these moments of...
But wait, am I something different?
That's the thing I love about gender and sexuality, which is one of my specialties intherapy, is that it does change all the time.
(04:22):
There's never a right answer, and it truly is a spectrum.
You can reflect when you're 20, when you're 30, when you're 40, and it can changedepending on what your life situation is.
So can I, have you seen the play before?
Okay, okay, there are just moments they have these really interesting discussions.
(04:43):
John is making the case and I think as well, you know, we all can change over time,preferences, our feelings, our whatnot, where we feel comfortable, who we feel comfortable
around.
But then how much does that butt up against who we are born as?
How much are we made up by who we are when we arrive and then who we become as we grow?
They say 50-50 nature and nurture, right?
(05:03):
But sometimes it feels, it, do we shift one way or the other?
The thing I love about nature and nurture is that it can change and flow differentlydepending on the situations and what we're exposed to.
As we know, society at one point was pretty socialized to be heteronormative with itsrelationships.
(05:28):
so people thought that's what they had to do.
so that's what I like about this is that it depends.
The answer is that there's not a right answer.
There's not a solid answer to that.
I wish I had a better answer.
I'm sorry.
No, that is the right answer.
We're all different.
And I think there are characters in this play trying to make that case, and there areother characters making the case.
We are what we are always.
(05:49):
I think a lot of people feel pride in that.
That is something that you can feel pride in, or you can feel trapped by it, I think.
Right.
kind of going back to what you said about freedom is there is freedom in both having youridentity, but also letting it go and letting it change, know, and having that difference.
Well, it's also like labels too.
(06:10):
On one hand, when a label arrives that feels like it describes you, you suddenly can feelseen and you might meet other people who describe themselves under that same label.
And then you feel like you have this community.
And then some mornings you wake up and you go, I think this label constricts me.
I don't want a label today.
And the only label I want today is my name and nothing else.
(06:31):
I want to be a free agent today.
Maybe I want to, I don't know.
No, I told, as you know, both as a psychologist and as a person, I mean, I was firmlylike, I am a gay man from like when I came out of my twenties and I got to be my thirties,
I was like, you know what, maybe there's more to this and maybe a label isn't asdescriptive as I thought it was, you know, maybe it's restrictive in that aspect.
(06:52):
Yeah, I think it can be.
Even there's a new term, new terms pop up, even one like demisexual.
There are people who have come to feel that they are demisexual, but, you know, don't loveto have to be labeled as demisexual.
But I think everyone who has a label might feel that to some degree.
For sure, absolutely.
So what was it that drew you to this project?
You were given that script.
What was like, you were like, I have to do this.
(07:13):
Well, you get an email with all capital letters, the word cock.
You're not going to say no to it, right?
No.
first, first, Joe Bailey.
If Joe Bailey asked me to do something, I always want to try and say yes.
I am Brandy Joe.
They're excellent.
They are so excellent and also because they're so keen on doing plays about queer identityand I don't often get to do that.
(07:39):
I'm actually really into classical theater and do a lot of Shakespeare theater.
So like getting to do something that is modern and about queer identity is so opposite ofkings and queens from the 1500s and getting to play a character who was exploring
bisexuality is the first time that I think I played a character who was that close to me.
So that was really appealing because I figured I would learn a little bit about myself.
(08:00):
I didn't know I would have so many questions about myself.
You're like, thanks, I'm sending you guys my therapy bill.
Yeah, when we talk next time when you're in a session with you, I will bill them, yes.
Perfect.
But no, that has to, like you said though, granted there is some theories of sexuality andgender in Shakespeare, but like it's not quite so blatantly as like something like Cock.
(08:26):
No, and what's so funny is like in a lot of Shakespeare comedies, all the ruckus is causedbecause people are just cross-dressing.
That's mostly what the big ruckus is in a Shakespeare play where in this one, it's notjust putting on someone else's clothes.
It goes so much deeper in, I think I might actually want to step out of this life I havebeen living for maybe decades and I'm going to wear a completely new identity and almost
(08:52):
start my life anew.
And the play is such a good exercise for actors because it goes so quick.
I think it just flies at you.
And you can see John, think, wanting to find that opening where he can break away.
You know, speaking of identity too, when I was doing my research for this play, I noticedthat John's the only one that actually like has a name.
(09:12):
Everybody else just has like a letter, which kind of takes away their identity as well.
Is that, do you feel like that's intentional to like the script and the work?
That's a really interesting question.
We've talked about as a group.
I don't know.
I think on one hand, they're all labeled.
So there's John.
(09:34):
There's his boyfriend M.
The woman he encounters W and then there's a father F.
And I think you're making such a good point because all three of those characters are sostrong in their identity.
So M.
male, W, woman, F, father.
(09:55):
Those three are who they are and John just wants to be John.
Yeah.
And there's a beauty to that.
reflected.
So how has this role as John challenged you as an actor?
It would be really easy because this play has so much energy.
(10:18):
think it would be really easy to do this play from a heady space and just show up and saythe lines and there are funny lines.
And if you were just high energy, you could put on a really good play.
think the challenging part of this is to try and search from where all this stuff iscoming from in John deeper.
(10:38):
Like where is it coming from, from the center of the earth?
And it's challenged me to really try and understand what John wants.
And at times in my life, when I have desperately wanted freedom, enough that I would tellpeople that I love, I think I have to break away.
And I know in my cases, in my life, the desire has been so strong to have my own selfidentity that now I'm researching for that.
(11:07):
And I felt that in my twenties when I was...
coming out and now thinking about another character who, when we do the play, today is theday that he's thinking things are gonna change.
And so it's trying to reignite what that major desire is.
Sure, So Mike Bartlett's play is kind of self-described as a drama, but it kind of isdescribed also described having a lot of levity.
(11:33):
It's very hilarious.
So how do you feel like cock kind of balances those tones?
it balances it so perfectly.
It has all these big, heavy kind of questions about identity.
And I think you can see the characters struggling with those, but the way they interactwith one another is so silly and so funny sometimes.
The dynamics that end up forming between John and the three people that he has nowgravitated into the situation.
(11:58):
A lot, a lot of humor comes out of how the characters are playing.
While underneath you have that whole current of how are these people gonna figure thisout?
Sure, absolutely.
And what the other people are doing are so funny.
you see Miles and Grace and Lindel, sometimes I just wanna stop talking on stage and justlisten.
That has happened a lot.
I've missed more than a few lines because I've just started watching them.
(12:21):
Well, that's high praise for them on stage.
So when it comes to your interpretation of the character, as an actor, I know you haveyour script.
You're reading it.
You want to interpret it.
So how do you make John your own while also staying true to what's on the page?
I think that part is the process.
You just start doing it in rehearsal.
(12:42):
And one day you come into rehearsal and you play John for an hour and he's sort of alighthearted guy and he kind of wants this.
And then you get off stage and you go, I don't think that felt right.
And then you come back the next day and you try John in a place where maybe he's reallystruggling and he needs to get out of it.
And so you kind of just, every day that you're working with your partners, lines juststart to click.
(13:03):
And then when the lines start to click, it informs you a little bit about the person thatyou're playing.
So.
Honestly, it's a lot of trial and error.
Try things about John that don't feel right and you go, good, I know that's not where heis.
And then one day something comes out and you surprise yourself and you go, he said thatbecause he's thinking this.
You just hope, you hope all those things come to you before opening night.
Of course they don't.
(13:23):
You realize some of those things in the third or fourth week, you know?
I mean, and that's the beauty of theater, right?
Do you have to do anything specific to get into the mindset of your character?
I've been thinking that I don't have my pre show routine down just yet.
Actually the main thing that I'm thinking about John because John and his boyfriend in theplay have been together for so long.
(13:47):
I think the best thing that I can do pre show is really warm up with Miles and just getour relationship into that warm place.
Cause Miles is such a wonderful person and partner.
And I think the more that he and I can carry the warmness in our relationship on stage,the more that
we can start the show with that existing relationship between our two characters.
(14:07):
Sometimes I want to just think about myself, but sometimes I want to get the focus off meand thinking about Miles makes me feel a lot more comforted.
So what themes of cock resonate the most with you?
the exploration of identity and the fluidity of identity.
Because when I was 14 and started to worry that I was bi, I didn't want to be.
(14:34):
24 and I was finally ready to say, for sure I am bi.
And when I was 24, I thought, I will feel that way for the rest of my life.
And then I get to, know, later on and I'm just surprised that there's still so muchfluidity.
Maybe then...
Honestly, maybe there are some people, what fascinates me, there are probably some peoplewho watch the play and go, I've never felt different.
(14:56):
From the very moment until now, I've never felt different.
And maybe there will be people like me who are surprised that it is still as fluid as itis.
There's a lot of that in the play.
And then also I'm fascinated by relationship dynamics and why people choose who theychoose and why they might stay in a relationship they stay in.
And there's a lot of that happening in this play.
(15:17):
And again,
I've reflected about why I've stayed in the ones that didn't work, but also why I've saidno to ones that might have been good for me.
Sure, absolutely.
Final question for you is what do you hope audiences walk away from this show with?
Two things.
I hope when the lights come down, I hope number one, they've had a good time at thetheater.
(15:40):
That's always the goal.
Whatever the play is, I hope people go, I'm so glad I came out and had a good time.
And then when they get in their car.
I think that there are more than a few things that you could spend 30 to an hour talkingto a really good friend about.
One, I hope it's a good time, but number two, I really think if you're curious about thesethings, curious about yourself and curious about identity, there are a lot of questions to
(16:08):
ask and the answers just aren't so clear, but that's definitely the beautiful part aboutit.
It should be fun and it should definitely
that.
Thank you so much, Steve-R, for your time.
I really appreciate you being here today with me.
you, Brian.
I feel like I have so much to learn from you.
I'm hoping there's another time where you'll get to reverse and you get to tell me allthat you know, because I bet you have met so many people who've asked the kind of
(16:34):
questions that John has, I would assume.
Yeah, so 100%.
I specialize in gender and sexuality, but I also am a relationship counselor.
So I've seen it all.
Are you Mike Bartlett?
Did you write this play?
Yes, that's the trick here.
I'm just testing to see how well you know the material.
I'm sorry, you don't have to answer if you don't want to, but do you get people across thewhole spectrum of age or is it a lot of younger people or people who are older and are
(17:03):
curious for the first time?
lots of different ages and stages.
So I cover pretty much everything and people are always questioning and always exploring.
it's material like this is that I think you're right, that's gonna start a lot ofconversations and a lot of exploration for a lot of people.
Yeah, and there people I know who I think would like to explore in life, and maybe theyjust need a little jumping off point to feel a little confident that it's okay to maybe
(17:31):
say the first few words, you know?
100%.
So I hope that this show is that starting point for a lot of people.
Thank you, Brian.
I hope so too.
And I think it's going to be a lot of fun.
I'm just so thankful to be a part of it.
know, working at the Ringwald is just a joy.
And so, Cock arrives at the Ringwald Theater on March 7th and runs through the 31st.
So get your tickets now and we'll see you there.
(17:53):
Thanks everyone, see ya.
Thank you so much for joining me today, Stebert.
How are you doing?
I'm doing very well, Brian.
Thank you very much.
Opening night is tomorrow and we are super, super excited.
Thank you for taking the time.
How has the rehearsal process for Cock been so far?
It has been super quick, but it has come together so fast and the play moves so fast.
So there's so much energy in the room and quick and energetic.
(00:24):
And I think the play is going to reflect that.
I was going say, surprises me none at all that the Ringwald has such a quick and energeticplay.
Their plays are so fantastic and they do a lot of great work, but they are very, they keepyou on your toes.
I think so too.
think Joe Bailey and Brandy Joe do a great job of choosing plays that drive really fastand have a lot of high energy, but they somehow find plays that aren't only just high
(00:51):
energy, they also make you think a lot when you leave too.
So it's like the perfect mix.
100%.
How familiar were you with the show before being cast in it?
I wasn't too familiar with it, although I did read it once in university, in grad school,and I performed a scene from it in grad school.
And that was like, gosh, seven years ago maybe or something like that.
(01:16):
And then Joe sent me the script and I got to the scene that I was, my gosh, I think I knowthis play.
So I knew it a little bit, but not nearly in the intimacy that I've got to know it now.
Well, that's awesome that you got a little bit of familiarity with it in grad school.
And also, don't carbon date us too much here now.
(01:37):
Yeah, absolutely.
Neither one of us graduated that long ago.
So what is the story of Cock and then how does your character factor into it?
So the story of cock centers around a gentleman named John and I play John and John isexploring his identity.
(02:00):
This play is about sexual identity but it is also about relationships.
So John is both struggling to understand if this is relationship that he wants to stay inwhile also wondering if
if he's discovering a new side of himself.
So I think he's looking to explore.
(02:22):
He's looking for freedom.
I mean, that's kind of an exciting thing to probably as an actor to explore is just thisidentity of freedom in this character and finding an identity which is important for both
the character and the human playing them.
I agree and it's one of the great things where it's made me ask so many questions aboutmyself and I came out as bisexual like in my early to mid 20s and this play is even making
(02:51):
me ask new questions that I haven't asked before and wondering things about the past thatI hadn't wondered before so it's definitely making me do a little bit of introspection on
myself as well.
I love that.
Is that hard at all?
I'm a psychologist during my day job, so I just always wonder about that.
As you're developing this character and you're having those intersective questions, I'msure that helps to develop the character even more, but is that hard to have those
(03:15):
reflections on yourself?
It is because sometimes I want to have an answer for the character John, but I don't havethe answer for myself.
And so I don't really know how to fill in some of the gaps.
There are times when a character will be going through something that I have gone throughand went through and kind of know how it feels to get out on the other side.
And then there are moments in this play where John has some open-ended questions where Istill have some open-ended questions and...
(03:41):
Just as much as I want to figure it out for him on stage, I'm now wondering about myselfas I'm driving to rehearsal and driving home from rehearsal.
like, for example, I think I've been bi my whole life, but really came to terms with it,you know, in my twenties.
And then there was like a month last year where I panicked.
said, am I straight?
(04:02):
Am I straight?
And I haven't known this whole time.
Well, anyway, John is very similar.
He's had the same identity he thinks through his whole life.
And he has these moments of...
But wait, am I something different?
That's the thing I love about gender and sexuality, which is one of my specialties intherapy, is that it does change all the time.
(04:22):
There's never a right answer, and it truly is a spectrum.
You can reflect when you're 20, when you're 30, when you're 40, and it can changedepending on what your life situation is.
So can I, have you seen the play before?
Okay, okay, there are just moments they have these really interesting discussions.
(04:43):
John is making the case and I think as well, you know, we all can change over time,preferences, our feelings, our whatnot, where we feel comfortable, who we feel comfortable
around.
But then how much does that butt up against who we are born as?
How much are we made up by who we are when we arrive and then who we become as we grow?
They say 50-50 nature and nurture, right?
(05:03):
But sometimes it feels, it, do we shift one way or the other?
The thing I love about nature and nurture is that it can change and flow differentlydepending on the situations and what we're exposed to.
As we know, society at one point was pretty socialized to be heteronormative with itsrelationships.
(05:28):
so people thought that's what they had to do.
so that's what I like about this is that it depends.
The answer is that there's not a right answer.
There's not a solid answer to that.
I wish I had a better answer.
I'm sorry.
No, that is the right answer.
We're all different.
And I think there are characters in this play trying to make that case, and there areother characters making the case.
We are what we are always.
(05:49):
I think a lot of people feel pride in that.
That is something that you can feel pride in, or you can feel trapped by it, I think.
Right.
kind of going back to what you said about freedom is there is freedom in both having youridentity, but also letting it go and letting it change, know, and having that difference.
Well, it's also like labels too.
(06:10):
On one hand, when a label arrives that feels like it describes you, you suddenly can feelseen and you might meet other people who describe themselves under that same label.
And then you feel like you have this community.
And then some mornings you wake up and you go, I think this label constricts me.
I don't want a label today.
And the only label I want today is my name and nothing else.
(06:31):
I want to be a free agent today.
Maybe I want to, I don't know.
No, I told, as you know, both as a psychologist and as a person, I mean, I was firmlylike, I am a gay man from like when I came out of my twenties and I got to be my thirties,
I was like, you know what, maybe there's more to this and maybe a label isn't asdescriptive as I thought it was, you know, maybe it's restrictive in that aspect.
(06:52):
Yeah, I think it can be.
Even there's a new term, new terms pop up, even one like demisexual.
There are people who have come to feel that they are demisexual, but, you know, don't loveto have to be labeled as demisexual.
But I think everyone who has a label might feel that to some degree.
For sure, absolutely.
So what was it that drew you to this project?
You were given that script.
What was like, you were like, I have to do this.
(07:13):
Well, you get an email with all capital letters, the word cock.
You're not going to say no to it, right?
No.
first, first, Joe Bailey.
If Joe Bailey asked me to do something, I always want to try and say yes.
I am Brandy Joe.
They're excellent.
They are so excellent and also because they're so keen on doing plays about queer identityand I don't often get to do that.
(07:39):
I'm actually really into classical theater and do a lot of Shakespeare theater.
So like getting to do something that is modern and about queer identity is so opposite ofkings and queens from the 1500s and getting to play a character who was exploring
bisexuality is the first time that I think I played a character who was that close to me.
So that was really appealing because I figured I would learn a little bit about myself.
(08:00):
I didn't know I would have so many questions about myself.
You're like, thanks, I'm sending you guys my therapy bill.
Yeah, when we talk next time when you're in a session with you, I will bill them, yes.
Perfect.
But no, that has to, like you said though, granted there is some theories of sexuality andgender in Shakespeare, but like it's not quite so blatantly as like something like Cock.
(08:26):
No, and what's so funny is like in a lot of Shakespeare comedies, all the ruckus is causedbecause people are just cross-dressing.
That's mostly what the big ruckus is in a Shakespeare play where in this one, it's notjust putting on someone else's clothes.
It goes so much deeper in, I think I might actually want to step out of this life I havebeen living for maybe decades and I'm going to wear a completely new identity and almost
(08:52):
start my life anew.
And the play is such a good exercise for actors because it goes so quick.
I think it just flies at you.
And you can see John, think, wanting to find that opening where he can break away.
You know, speaking of identity too, when I was doing my research for this play, I noticedthat John's the only one that actually like has a name.
(09:12):
Everybody else just has like a letter, which kind of takes away their identity as well.
Is that, do you feel like that's intentional to like the script and the work?
That's a really interesting question.
We've talked about as a group.
I don't know.
I think on one hand, they're all labeled.
So there's John.
(09:34):
There's his boyfriend M.
The woman he encounters W and then there's a father F.
And I think you're making such a good point because all three of those characters are sostrong in their identity.
So M.
male, W, woman, F, father.
(09:55):
Those three are who they are and John just wants to be John.
Yeah.
And there's a beauty to that.
reflected.
So how has this role as John challenged you as an actor?
It would be really easy because this play has so much energy.
(10:18):
think it would be really easy to do this play from a heady space and just show up and saythe lines and there are funny lines.
And if you were just high energy, you could put on a really good play.
think the challenging part of this is to try and search from where all this stuff iscoming from in John deeper.
(10:38):
Like where is it coming from, from the center of the earth?
And it's challenged me to really try and understand what John wants.
And at times in my life, when I have desperately wanted freedom, enough that I would tellpeople that I love, I think I have to break away.
And I know in my cases, in my life, the desire has been so strong to have my own selfidentity that now I'm researching for that.
(11:07):
And I felt that in my twenties when I was...
coming out and now thinking about another character who, when we do the play, today is theday that he's thinking things are gonna change.
And so it's trying to reignite what that major desire is.
Sure, So Mike Bartlett's play is kind of self-described as a drama, but it kind of isdescribed also described having a lot of levity.
(11:33):
It's very hilarious.
So how do you feel like cock kind of balances those tones?
it balances it so perfectly.
It has all these big, heavy kind of questions about identity.
And I think you can see the characters struggling with those, but the way they interactwith one another is so silly and so funny sometimes.
The dynamics that end up forming between John and the three people that he has nowgravitated into the situation.
(11:58):
A lot, a lot of humor comes out of how the characters are playing.
While underneath you have that whole current of how are these people gonna figure thisout?
Sure, absolutely.
And what the other people are doing are so funny.
you see Miles and Grace and Lindel, sometimes I just wanna stop talking on stage and justlisten.
That has happened a lot.
I've missed more than a few lines because I've just started watching them.
(12:21):
Well, that's high praise for them on stage.
So when it comes to your interpretation of the character, as an actor, I know you haveyour script.
You're reading it.
You want to interpret it.
So how do you make John your own while also staying true to what's on the page?
I think that part is the process.
You just start doing it in rehearsal.
(12:42):
And one day you come into rehearsal and you play John for an hour and he's sort of alighthearted guy and he kind of wants this.
And then you get off stage and you go, I don't think that felt right.
And then you come back the next day and you try John in a place where maybe he's reallystruggling and he needs to get out of it.
And so you kind of just, every day that you're working with your partners, lines juststart to click.
(13:03):
And then when the lines start to click, it informs you a little bit about the person thatyou're playing.
So.
Honestly, it's a lot of trial and error.
Try things about John that don't feel right and you go, good, I know that's not where heis.
And then one day something comes out and you surprise yourself and you go, he said thatbecause he's thinking this.
You just hope, you hope all those things come to you before opening night.
Of course they don't.
(13:23):
You realize some of those things in the third or fourth week, you know?
I mean, and that's the beauty of theater, right?
Do you have to do anything specific to get into the mindset of your character?
I've been thinking that I don't have my pre show routine down just yet.
Actually the main thing that I'm thinking about John because John and his boyfriend in theplay have been together for so long.
(13:47):
I think the best thing that I can do pre show is really warm up with Miles and just getour relationship into that warm place.
Cause Miles is such a wonderful person and partner.
And I think the more that he and I can carry the warmness in our relationship on stage,the more that
we can start the show with that existing relationship between our two characters.
(14:07):
Sometimes I want to just think about myself, but sometimes I want to get the focus off meand thinking about Miles makes me feel a lot more comforted.
So what themes of cock resonate the most with you?
the exploration of identity and the fluidity of identity.
Because when I was 14 and started to worry that I was bi, I didn't want to be.
(14:34):
24 and I was finally ready to say, for sure I am bi.
And when I was 24, I thought, I will feel that way for the rest of my life.
And then I get to, know, later on and I'm just surprised that there's still so muchfluidity.
Maybe then...
Honestly, maybe there are some people, what fascinates me, there are probably some peoplewho watch the play and go, I've never felt different.
(14:56):
From the very moment until now, I've never felt different.
And maybe there will be people like me who are surprised that it is still as fluid as itis.
There's a lot of that in the play.
And then also I'm fascinated by relationship dynamics and why people choose who theychoose and why they might stay in a relationship they stay in.
And there's a lot of that happening in this play.
(15:17):
And again,
I've reflected about why I've stayed in the ones that didn't work, but also why I've saidno to ones that might have been good for me.
Sure, absolutely.
Final question for you is what do you hope audiences walk away from this show with?
Two things.
I hope when the lights come down, I hope number one, they've had a good time at thetheater.
(15:40):
That's always the goal.
Whatever the play is, I hope people go, I'm so glad I came out and had a good time.
And then when they get in their car.
I think that there are more than a few things that you could spend 30 to an hour talkingto a really good friend about.
One, I hope it's a good time, but number two, I really think if you're curious about thesethings, curious about yourself and curious about identity, there are a lot of questions to
(16:08):
ask and the answers just aren't so clear, but that's definitely the beautiful part aboutit.
It should be fun and it should definitely
that.
Thank you so much, Steve-R, for your time.
I really appreciate you being here today with me.
you, Brian.
I feel like I have so much to learn from you.
I'm hoping there's another time where you'll get to reverse and you get to tell me allthat you know, because I bet you have met so many people who've asked the kind of
(16:34):
questions that John has, I would assume.
Yeah, so 100%.
I specialize in gender and sexuality, but I also am a relationship counselor.
So I've seen it all.
Are you Mike Bartlett?
Did you write this play?
Yes, that's the trick here.
I'm just testing to see how well you know the material.
I'm sorry, you don't have to answer if you don't want to, but do you get people across thewhole spectrum of age or is it a lot of younger people or people who are older and are
(17:03):
curious for the first time?
lots of different ages and stages.
So I cover pretty much everything and people are always questioning and always exploring.
it's material like this is that I think you're right, that's gonna start a lot ofconversations and a lot of exploration for a lot of people.
Yeah, and there people I know who I think would like to explore in life, and maybe theyjust need a little jumping off point to feel a little confident that it's okay to maybe
(17:31):
say the first few words, you know?
100%.
So I hope that this show is that starting point for a lot of people.
Thank you, Brian.
I hope so too.
And I think it's going to be a lot of fun.
I'm just so thankful to be a part of it.
know, working at the Ringwald is just a joy.
And so, Cock arrives at the Ringwald Theater on March 7th and runs through the 31st.
So get your tickets now and we'll see you there.
(17:53):
Thanks everyone, see ya.
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